From ccuff@in4web.com Mon Sep 23 13:40:43 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_3); 23 Sep 2002 20:40:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 97962 invoked from network); 23 Sep 2002 20:40:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Sep 2002 20:40:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Sep 2002 20:40:41 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.98]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Mon, 23 Sep 2002 16:37:55 -0400 Message-ID: <001101c26341$514cb1c0$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: Subject: Sony SRFA300 Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2002 16:32:30 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 Playing with a Sony SRFA300, I have come to the conclusion that these were (still are, for now) one of the best radios Sony made. To those that wondered, it IS a forced stereo radio in AM, but it has a stereo/mono switch. The bandwidth is pleasing, but not bright. The sound is very reminiscent of a 60's tube radio. It is much thicker than the A100,so the bass is nice, without being "shoe boxy". Now, I did mess with the FM Osc coil, which is labled on the board- as stock, these only cover from 76 to 90 mhz, but I bent 2 turns of the osc coil down flat, and got it to tune to 99.3, so for me, it is fine, as in my area nothing is listenable above 99 anyway. Never mind the dial scale anymore.... AM DXing is a REAL treat! absolutely grand. A built in green LED backlit dial, and built in AC cord make it very nice. (100 volt transformer, so don't leave it on AC for long periods, altho' I have had no burnouts in many Japanese radios, even after 5 years of continuous use) As for a stereo indicator, typical Sony- None. a tuning LED, as the norm. Chris From ccuff@in4web.com Mon Sep 23 13:40:45 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_3); 23 Sep 2002 20:40:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 811 invoked from network); 23 Sep 2002 20:40:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Sep 2002 20:40:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Sep 2002 20:40:45 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.98]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Mon, 23 Sep 2002 16:37:56 -0400 Message-ID: <001201c26341$51fc2ba0$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: Subject: car radios Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2002 16:35:52 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 Jeff, or Johnny, anyone?- Has anyone done any more experimenting with car radios? My findings have been quite bad. I can convert some, and with somewhat OK results, but the lack of intelligent design in the front ends, they are all plagued with overload problems in high RF areas. We gotta come up with "something" for the automotive market. Need ideas! CC From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Mon Sep 23 13:58:22 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_3); 23 Sep 2002 20:58:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 21553 invoked from network); 23 Sep 2002 20:58:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Sep 2002 20:58:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14207.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.173.71) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Sep 2002 20:58:21 -0000 Message-ID: <20020923205821.54850.qmail@web14207.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.45.202.244] by web14207.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 23 Sep 2002 13:58:21 PDT Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2002 13:58:21 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Bag of Chips? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: John Pavlica X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio Who's selling DIP C-Quam chips? __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? New DSL Internet Access from SBC & Yahoo! http://sbc.yahoo.com From ccuff@in4web.com Mon Sep 23 14:10:07 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_3); 23 Sep 2002 21:10:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 92024 invoked from network); 23 Sep 2002 21:10:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Sep 2002 21:10:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Sep 2002 21:10:06 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.98]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Mon, 23 Sep 2002 17:07:20 -0400 Message-ID: <00b701c26345$6d355460$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: <20020923205821.54850.qmail@web14207.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Bag of Chips? Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2002 17:08:54 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 Jeff deck sent a post that he had some MC13028's in DIP- I got a ton of useless MC13020 DIPs, (well, they are not useless, but I will never use them as long as I can get the 13028's and the TA8124's Which I also have in DIP package as well. CC ----- Original Message ----- From: John Pavlica To: Sent: Monday, September 23, 2002 4:58 PM Subject: {AMSF} Bag of Chips? > Who's selling DIP C-Quam chips? From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Sep 23 14:28:29 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_3); 23 Sep 2002 21:28:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 59908 invoked from network); 23 Sep 2002 21:28:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Sep 2002 21:28:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Sep 2002 21:28:24 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.133] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 23 Sep 2002 21:28:24 -0000 Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2002 21:28:23 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Sony SRFA300 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <001101c26341$514cb1c0$0101a8c0@pavilion> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 994 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.69.11 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > 100 volt transformer, so don't leave it on AC for long periods, > altho' I have had no burnouts in many Japanese radios, even after 5 > years of continuous use You could do the old trick of adding in a wire-wound resistor to drop down the incoming line voltage. Decades ago, some American radios were retrofitted to run on European 220-240V power simply by using "ballast" resistors to burn up the extra voltage as heat. And I have a GE clock radio from the early '80s that still does this trick! It has the 12V radio circuit board and an electric clock motor wired in series with a large ceramic resistor to add up to the 115V line voltage. No AC transformer! However, the case and knobs are all plastic, so there is no risk of getting a shock from a "hot chassis" design. Unfortunately, it's not the "Rolodex" style clock radio with the flip-over printed numbers serving as the "digital" display... for some reason, LED-style clock radios just aren't as cool to look at! From jeffdeck@aol.com Mon Sep 23 15:07:14 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jeffdeck@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_3); 23 Sep 2002 22:07:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 98611 invoked from network); 23 Sep 2002 22:07:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Sep 2002 22:07:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.90) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Sep 2002 22:07:13 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.150] by n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 23 Sep 2002 22:07:13 -0000 Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2002 22:07:13 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Bag of Chips? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <00b701c26345$6d355460$0101a8c0@pavilion> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 488 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jeffdeck2001" X-Originating-IP: 152.163.189.99 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=4430287 X-Yahoo-Profile: jeffdeck2001 Thanks Chris. John, I have a few Motorola MC13028A in new condition, unused, with 1998 date code in DIP form. Cost is $5 each (plus shipping). 73, Jeff In a message dated 9/23/2002 5:28:22 PM Eastern Daylight Time, Chris writes: >Jeff deck sent a post that he had some MC13028's in DIP- I got a ton >of useless MC13020 DIPs, (well, they are not useless, but I will >never use them as long as I can get the 13028's and the TA8124's >Which I also have in DIP package as well. >CC From jeffdeck@aol.com Mon Sep 23 15:19:32 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jeffdeck@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_3); 23 Sep 2002 22:19:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 57256 invoked from network); 23 Sep 2002 22:19:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Sep 2002 22:19:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Sep 2002 22:19:30 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.148] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 23 Sep 2002 22:19:30 -0000 Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2002 22:19:30 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: car radios Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <001201c26341$51fc2ba0$0101a8c0@pavilion> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1229 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jeffdeck2001" X-Originating-IP: 152.163.189.99 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=4430287 X-Yahoo-Profile: jeffdeck2001 I purchased one 2002 Buick Rendezvous CD/FM stereo/AM with the Theftlock feature and FM RDS from eBay. It uses one Philips IC with Delphi house number in the front end. And this front end is substantially smaller in real estate than older Delco receivers. There is a muRata 450H ceramic filter, so I am home free when I determine the AM audio feed location. Yes, there are fewer tuned circuits and increased consolidation. We could wire tuned AM antenna circuit (Terk AM Advantage of sorts). FYI - VIN needs to be programmed into the radio using a serial 2 device, as virtually everything is connected to the electronic control modules in these new vehicles. Door chimes come through the radio speakers, and you lose it if you install an aftermarket radio. In a message dated 9/23/2002 5:07:41 PM Eastern Daylight Time, Chris writes: >Jeff, or Johnny, anyone?- Has anyone done any more experimenting >with car radios? >My findings have been quite bad. I can convert some, and with >somewhat OK results, but the lack of intelligent design in the front >ends, they are all plagued with overload problems in high RF areas. >We gotta come up with "something" for the automotive market. >Need ideas! >CC From ccuff@in4web.com Mon Sep 23 15:26:53 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_3); 23 Sep 2002 22:26:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 84079 invoked from network); 23 Sep 2002 22:26:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Sep 2002 22:26:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Sep 2002 22:26:52 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.86]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Mon, 23 Sep 2002 18:24:07 -0400 Message-ID: <006001c26350$26e3ec00$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: car radios Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2002 18:25:41 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 That is why I haven't tried my radio in my 2002 Malibu- I was told that if I un plug it, it will have to go back to the dealer to be reset. And it SUCKS as it is. Pure mud on am. I cannot understand even speech. Yet the FM and CD are fine. Frustrating as hell. I might just let it hang out the dash and leave it connected, and try experimenting live. CC ----- Original Message ----- From: jeffdeck2001 To: Sent: Monday, September 23, 2002 6:19 PM Subject: {AMSF} Re: car radios > I purchased one 2002 Buick Rendezvous CD/FM stereo/AM with the > Theftlock feature and FM RDS from eBay. From ccuff@in4web.com Mon Sep 23 15:29:37 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_3); 23 Sep 2002 22:29:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 37671 invoked from network); 23 Sep 2002 22:29:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Sep 2002 22:29:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Sep 2002 22:29:35 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.86]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Mon, 23 Sep 2002 18:26:50 -0400 Message-ID: <006801c26350$8851f040$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Sony SRFA300 Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2002 18:28:24 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 Those old "tumble card" clock radios were cool. I have a Sony with a black light in it- from 1972.... cool stuff cc ----- Original Message ----- From: Kevin T. From stodd@sherbtel.net Mon Sep 23 17:40:20 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_3); 24 Sep 2002 00:40:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 12660 invoked from network); 24 Sep 2002 00:40:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Sep 2002 00:40:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Sep 2002 00:40:19 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-89-164.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.164]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g8O0ZRQX026816 for ; Mon, 23 Sep 2002 19:35:43 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <004301c26363$30a188c0$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: <001201c26341$51fc2ba0$0101a8c0@pavilion> Subject: Re: {AMSF} car radios Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2002 19:41:41 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude I've suggested things like this before, but we find a great radio from a few years ago and see if the front end module is still available, or contract to have more made, and use those. Certainly those used in the Chrysler Infinity series of the mid-90s would be worth using. Just use commonly available building blocks so we don't have to reinvent the wheel. This philosophy is just as applicable to the home and portable markets as well. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Christopher Cuff" > We gotta come up with "something" for the automotive market. > Need ideas! > CC From stodd@sherbtel.net Mon Sep 23 17:48:40 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_3); 24 Sep 2002 00:48:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 43320 invoked from network); 24 Sep 2002 00:48:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Sep 2002 00:48:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Sep 2002 00:48:39 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-89-164.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.164]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g8O0i2QX028735 for ; Mon, 23 Sep 2002 19:44:03 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <004701c26364$5ae79100$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: <006001c26350$26e3ec00$0101a8c0@pavilion> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: car radios Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2002 19:50:16 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude I hope you've complained to both the dealer and Delphi- the latter especially needs to be done the lick it and stick it regular letter way. Most people would just put up with it and say nothing, though by doing so they allow others to modify their behavior by ceasing to listen to AM. They'll never get the hint until we fight back and hit them over the head with our negative opinions of their products. I also hope the leads are long enough to let you do work on the radio. Somehow I doubt they will be. It may be a long shot, but try asking for a schematic while you're at it. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Christopher Cuff" > That is why I haven't tried my radio in my 2002 Malibu- I was told that if I > un plug it, it will have to go back to the dealer to be reset. > And it SUCKS as it is. Pure mud on am. I cannot understand even speech. Yet > the FM and CD are fine. Frustrating as hell. I might just let it hang out > the dash and leave it connected, and try experimenting live. > CC From stodd@sherbtel.net Mon Sep 23 17:50:07 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_3); 24 Sep 2002 00:50:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 47330 invoked from network); 24 Sep 2002 00:50:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Sep 2002 00:50:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Sep 2002 00:50:06 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-89-164.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.164]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g8O0jTQX029058 for ; Mon, 23 Sep 2002 19:45:30 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <004f01c26364$8ecbde40$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Motorola C-QUAM AM Exciter-Transmitter Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2002 19:51:43 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Brad, Have you asked around as to why AMS has been turned off at so many of your stations? Scott Todd ----- Original Message ----- From: "bradleyj923" > PS - If anyone is in Indiana, or has a chance to dx 1390, WZZB, they > are a GREAT sounding AMS station...AC format. As far as I know, the > only one we (Susquehanna) own that is still AMS. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Sep 23 20:07:12 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_3); 24 Sep 2002 03:07:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 51026 invoked from network); 24 Sep 2002 03:07:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Sep 2002 03:07:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Sep 2002 03:07:11 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.128] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 24 Sep 2002 03:07:11 -0000 Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 03:07:09 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: car radios Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <001201c26341$51fc2ba0$0101a8c0@pavilion> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3297 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.69.11 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > We gotta come up with "something" for the automotive market. > Need ideas! I frankly don't find anything of merit in today's aftermarket car radios. There are basically three categories: most of them which are styled to look like a video game, and are targeted at the "booming bass" crowd which couldn't care less about the radio as long as their CDs sound good. Then there are the "cheap" brands (Audiovox, Jensen, Craig, etc.) that may actually have simple and easily operable buttons and displays, but can be outperformed by a $5 Flavoradio duct-taped to your dashboard. Then there are the rare high-end models, from brands like Becker, Denon, and McIntosh, that might actually be well-designed and offer good performance on AM, but are prohibitively expensive and/or hard to find. What we are left with are "OEM", factory-installed car radios. These are the last bastion for clearly marked controls, simple legible displays, and an attention to quality on the AM & FM tuner. I know Chris has had good luck with the base-model radio-only GM/Delco radios, but most non-domestic cars don't have the extra-height dashboard space to fit these radios. However, there are still some good "single DIN" size OEM car radios, including some that provide good results when converted to AM Stereo. One known-good conversion is the VW "Heidelberg", made by Matsushita (Panasonic) in Japan: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1382367993 I've used one, and the AM bandwidth is actually wide enough that you can hear the 10 kHz carrier whistle at night. Sensitivity and selectivity are also above average, and Chris converted one with good results. FM and audio amplifier quality are fine as well. The only catch is that this is an older model, so it only tunes 530-1620 kHz on AM. Fortunately, VW has offered a newer model of the same radio (their "Premium Audio" model), which does offer full Expanded Band coverage (520-1710 kHz) and has the same nice crisp bandwidth: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1862926746 However, having used two of these radios, I've discovered that VW had some made in Japan by Matsushita, and some made in Mexico by another manufacturer... and the Mexican-made ones are actually superior in all aspects -- quality of construction, FM and AM reception and audio quality, amplifier power and bass response, etc.! There is a way to distinguish the two from the front panel -- the better Mexican-made ones have a protruding "tab" on the cassette door just to the left of the Dolby symbol, while the cheaper Japanese-made ones do not. Of course, there are other good OEM radios besides VW's, but these are just some examples. If we could obtain a batch of "known-good" models and have them converted to AM Stereo, that would be even better for our cause than finding suitable aftermarket radios, since who wouldn't appreciate better quality and a simpler control layout? And as long as they're the standard Single DIN size and the appropriate wiring connections are provided, there is no reason the OEM radio from one brand of car can't be used in any other make of car. (Unless, of course, you don't want to besmirch the reputation of your Porsche by having a Hyundai radio in it!) From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Sep 23 20:23:29 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_3); 24 Sep 2002 03:23:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 48694 invoked from network); 24 Sep 2002 03:23:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Sep 2002 03:23:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Sep 2002 03:23:28 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.180] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 24 Sep 2002 03:23:28 -0000 Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 03:23:26 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Sony SRFA300 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <006801c26350$8851f040$0101a8c0@pavilion> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1211 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.69.11 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Those old "tumble card" clock radios were cool. I have a Sony with > a black light in it- from 1972.... cool stuff Heh... how about a Heathkit "binary clock"? I'm sure it's fun to wake up in the middle of the night, and squint as you count the dots and do the math in your head just to find out what time it is! And I still see cartoons showing an artist's rendition of a Philco Predicta as some "futuristic" TV set, even though this design dates back to 1958!.... http://www.mztv.com/predicta.html This web site makes reference to a "stereophonic" version, which I assume simply had two speakers, as true Stereo sound had yet to come to any broadcasting medium back then. And speaking of which, nowadays Philips is selling a 20" model with so-called "Dual Speaker TV Sound"... it turns out that it has Stereo Left and Right inputs for a VCR/DVD/video game, etc., but the actual TV tuner does not have MTS Stereo/SAP reception! On the other hand, I've noticed that my new 27" Sony TV set actually has a red Stereo indicator on the front panel -- the only indicator aside from the on-screen displays -- but it seems to stay on all the time unless a mono TV station is specifically tuned in. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Sep 23 20:44:16 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_3); 24 Sep 2002 03:44:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 69257 invoked from network); 24 Sep 2002 03:44:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Sep 2002 03:44:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.68) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Sep 2002 03:44:14 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.190] by n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 24 Sep 2002 03:44:10 -0000 Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 03:44:09 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: CHUM? Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 614 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.69.11 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics Any news on 1050 CHUM -- are they back in Stereo yet? I can only get spotty reception of them here in NJ at night, due to stupid WEVD's "ESPN Radio" being in the way. Meanwhile, I can't hear 790 CIGM at all anymore, since they actually started using their *real* nighttime signal pattern... but as usual, 740 CHWO is really booming in with a great signal and great music... they actually have a live DJ during the evening hours, and he mentioned getting a DX report from Kentucky. We should keep pestering them to upgrade to Stereo -- this is one station that is truly worthy of being heard in Stereo! From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Mon Sep 23 21:03:44 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_3); 24 Sep 2002 04:03:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 9292 invoked from network); 24 Sep 2002 04:03:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Sep 2002 04:03:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14205.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.151) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Sep 2002 04:03:44 -0000 Message-ID: <20020924040344.51657.qmail@web14205.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.127.54.199] by web14205.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 23 Sep 2002 21:03:44 PDT Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2002 21:03:44 -0700 (PDT) Subject: We need this guy on our list To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: John Pavlica X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio "Shulz, Warren G." To: "'radio-tech@broadcast.net'" Subject: RE: [RT] Radios are still out there You are right about AM 1300 Chicago Disney. We are sending in AM C-QUAM with original Motorola gear and a 9100 Orban. AM stereo forever! Warren Chicago Radio Disney __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? New DSL Internet Access from SBC & Yahoo! http://sbc.yahoo.com From KC4QLP@aol.com Mon Sep 23 21:16:32 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_3); 24 Sep 2002 04:16:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 69503 invoked from network); 24 Sep 2002 04:16:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Sep 2002 04:16:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r04.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.100) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Sep 2002 04:16:32 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.10.) id r.c9.28cfec46 (1320) for ; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 00:16:28 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 00:16:28 EDT Subject: Re: {AMSF} We need this guy on our list To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Consider it taken care of...I just sent an invite . We'll see what happens. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5..., Ray Communications Radio Network Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:MidAtlanticEngineeringService@yahoo.com http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereoradio-subcribe@topica.com amstereo-subcribe@topica.com amstereoradio-subscribe@yahoogroups.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ WARNING TO UNSOLICITED SPAMMERS !!! Pursuant to U.S. Code, title 47, Chapter 5, Subchapter II, "Any and all nonsolicited E-mail (SPAM) sent to this address is subject to a download and archival fee of 500 U.S."!! E-mailing denotes acceptance of these terms." Your message (if actually mailed) is in violation of the Federal Telephone Consumer Protection Act of 1991, and Collateral Code of Federal Regulations (47 CFR 64.1200). The TCPA allows a private right of action against the sender of unsolicited advertising. The recipient can sue for $500, or actualdamages (whichever is greater). ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------- Osama bin Laden can kiss my royal white American behind! From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Sep 23 21:48:04 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_3); 24 Sep 2002 04:48:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 6193 invoked from network); 24 Sep 2002 04:48:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Sep 2002 04:48:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.88) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Sep 2002 04:48:02 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.174] by n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 24 Sep 2002 04:48:02 -0000 Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 04:48:01 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: OT: Not your average radios... Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 813 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.69.11 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics Although not necessarily relevant to AM Stereo, this is one of the strangest radios I've seen in a long time: http://pocketcalculatorshow.com/boombox/graphics/casio-ck200.jpg At first glance, it's a typical '80s boombox, but look closer: it offers Shortwave coverage as well as AM and FM, and yes, that is a piano-type keyboard on top! The web site I got this pic from says it's from around 1985, and obviously Casio didn't make too many of them. Now you can play along and finally find out what key your favorite Shortwave "interval signals" are in, add electronic rhythm maker effects, and record the whole musical production to cassette! Perhaps the only thing stranger is the Oreck vacuum cleaner with a built-in radio... unfortunately, it is FM only: http://www.comforthouse.com/oreck.html From jsgil@hal-pc.org Tue Sep 24 00:24:33 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_3); 24 Sep 2002 07:24:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 71794 invoked from network); 24 Sep 2002 07:24:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Sep 2002 07:24:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.87) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Sep 2002 07:24:32 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.173] by n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 24 Sep 2002 07:24:31 -0000 Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 07:24:31 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Bag of Chips? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <00b701c26345$6d355460$0101a8c0@pavilion> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 720 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.156 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Christopher Cuff" wrote: > I got a ton of useless MC13020 DIPs, (well, they are not useless, > but I will never use them as long as I can get the 13028's and the > TA8124's Which I also have in DIP package as well. > CC For all the flaws the MC13020 chip has it is the only one that can be used for pure synchronous detection and have the Cos Err amp completely disabled with a large cap (100uf) on Pin 5. Full synchronous mode can be easily done by buffering the output of the I Det pin and use it to drive the Env Det pin. The big drawback is the parts count is high for this chip as the newer chips have alot of built in features like AGC and better pilot detectors. JSG From philipr@irac.pe.ca Tue Sep 24 04:39:27 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_3); 24 Sep 2002 11:39:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 62902 invoked from network); 24 Sep 2002 11:39:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Sep 2002 11:39:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.67) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Sep 2002 11:39:26 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.182] by n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 24 Sep 2002 11:39:25 -0000 Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 11:39:23 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Sony SRFA300 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <001101c26341$514cb1c0$0101a8c0@pavilion> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2367 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking Earlier Chris wrote concerning the Sony SRFA300 - (100 volt transformer, so > don't leave it on AC for long periods, altho' I have had no burnouts in many > Japanese radios, even after 5 years of continuous use) Here is a trick worth trying for members of the list, especially if you need an isolation transformer as well: take 2 RS 120 to 25.2 volt 2 amp transformers and wire them back to back. I added a fuse and a GFCI outlet for further protection - the GFCI outlet before the first transformer. This homebrewed isolation transformer provides a lot of protection when working on old ac/dc radios. And, for other stuff, at least you have the benefit of the GFCI! All mounted on a strip of plywood. However, I noticed that some of my old tube radios were not as loud, one wouldn't even work. I measured the voltage - it was about 100 volts instead of the usual 120. I also found that power line related noise on AM was dramatically reduced. Even solid state gear with a built in transformer - like a GE SR III - was as quiet as when run on batteries when used through this little contraption. Light dimmers upstairs cease to bother the SR III when used with this device. I have also used this to provide a soft start for old tube gear - so long as the rated power consumption is 50 watts or less. Not as great as a varac, but a help nonetheless. It would certainly be easier on any rig that is designed for only 100 volts - and it has the added benefit of improving s/n on dx. Theoretically, the two back to back transformers should function as a true isolation transformer, and not increase or decrease the voltage. In practice, I got a decrease. Maybe if I reversed them, I'd get an increase instead! Perhaps there is a bit of a variance between these two apparently identical transformers. So, have your voltmeter handy, and be prepared to switch transformers. Its also considerably cheaper than any isolation transformer I've seen advertised. Of course it should go without saying, but I'll add it for liability reasons as well - Carefully insulate all connections. After soldering each connection, I used electrical tape and shrink tubing - remember to slip the tubing on before you make the splice. The SRFA300 sounds like an interesting rig... hmm, time to start saving those loonies and toonies! Phil From amfmdx@fastq.com Tue Sep 24 07:34:39 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_3); 24 Sep 2002 14:34:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 98250 invoked from network); 24 Sep 2002 14:34:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Sep 2002 14:34:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Sep 2002 14:34:38 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt (d141-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.173]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id g8OEYbh72068 for ; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 07:34:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <041a01c263d7$05d10ca0$d8f9bed8@kredding430cdt> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Sony SRFA300 Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 07:31:06 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > Here is a trick worth trying for members of the list, especially if > you need an isolation transformer as well: take 2 RS 120 to 25.2 > volt 2 amp transformers and wire them back to back. When you are talking about this, you seem to be talking about a power isolation transformer here. > Even solid state gear with a built in > transformer - like a GE SR III - was as quiet as when run on > batteries when used through this little contraption. But here, it seems you are talking about using it as an RF receive isolation transformer since you are talking about using it with the radio on batteries. Which is it? I am interested in this device either way. I have BAD line noise and BAD noise coming from the powerlines and phone lines in the area since they are spewing large amounts of digital hash. Draw it up or take a picture. Let us see this thing. Kevin From narkspud@hotmail.com Tue Sep 24 08:08:43 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: narkspud@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_3); 24 Sep 2002 15:08:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 99794 invoked from network); 24 Sep 2002 15:08:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Sep 2002 15:08:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.17.18) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Sep 2002 15:08:28 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 08:08:27 -0700 Received: from 67.89.146.146 by lw11fd.law11.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 15:08:27 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Losing KDIS? Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 08:08:27 -0700 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 24 Sep 2002 15:08:27.0998 (UTC) FILETIME=[3C926FE0:01C263DC] From: ". Narkspud" X-Originating-IP: [67.89.146.146] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=81956306 X-Yahoo-Profile: narkspud An ominous portent for one of our "true" AM Stereo outlets in the LA market--the one that plays the music. It appears that KDIS 710 (Radio Disney) and KSPN 1110 (ESPN Radio) are trading frequencies to give more coverage to the Anaheim Angels games. Will AM Stereo survive the switch? We find out January 1. http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/news/archive/2002/09/23/sports1929EDT0165.DTL _________________________________________________________________ Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com From michaelj@vcn.com Tue Sep 24 09:27:52 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_3); 24 Sep 2002 16:27:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 78137 invoked from network); 24 Sep 2002 16:27:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Sep 2002 16:27:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m1-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Sep 2002 16:27:50 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m1-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 10:27:49 -0600 Message-ID: <003001c263e7$48b03d60$0701010a@keva> To: References: Subject: TV Stereo (OT?) Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 10:27:32 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit On the topic of MTS stereo......I've always wondered something. When the days of stereo tuners started.....as in stereo VCR's.....why the hell don't hasn't anyone ever included the stereo circuitry into the modulator which "broadcasts" the VCR's output onto channel 3 or 4??? That is so stupid I've always though. You have NO idea how many people I have run into and seen using a STEREO vcr with their STEREO TV, and they're using Channel 3 or 4 on the TV to view movies or whatever from the VCR. Most of them not even realizing it's MONO. I have YET to see a stereo VCR that actually modulates the stereo pilot and stereo information on its channel 3 or 4 output. Isn't that dumb??? You would think they should have done that many years ago when stereo VCR's were first invented. Most people will not go through the trouble to hook up the A/V cables and use the A/V input on their stereo television. MJR n WYO ----- Original Message ----- From: Kevin T. To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, September 23, 2002 9:23 PM Subject: {AMSF} Re: Sony SRFA300 And speaking of which, nowadays Philips is selling a 20" model with so-called "Dual Speaker TV Sound"... it turns out that it has Stereo Left and Right inputs for a VCR/DVD/video game, etc., but the actual TV tuner does not have MTS Stereo/SAP reception! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From michaelj@vcn.com Tue Sep 24 09:38:13 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_3); 24 Sep 2002 16:38:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 18784 invoked from network); 24 Sep 2002 16:38:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Sep 2002 16:38:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m1-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.31) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Sep 2002 16:38:12 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m1-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 10:38:11 -0600 Message-ID: <003701c263e8$bb201680$0701010a@keva> To: References: <003001c263e7$48b03d60$0701010a@keva> Subject: questions -- Help! Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 10:37:53 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Questions for all the techs (responses? I didn't hear from anyone on my other questions :( ) On my car stereo.....a Mitsubishi unit from about a 97 Montero or eclipse....nice little unit...the FM doesn't hardly pick up at all. I have 3 or 4 of these and the FM reception is usually VERY nice! But on this particular one, it doesn't hardly pickup at all. If I'm in a large market (IE Salt Lake, Denver) and it's being hammered with a 100,000 watt signal, it'll do okay but still fade and ffffff around a corner of a hill or something. Yet AM reception on this unit is fantastic. I even went as far as taking the FM section from another unit and putting it in this one. Went through the trouble to unsolder this little circuit board....all 20 pins or so.....and take one from another exact unit and put it in this one. Same thing. FM reception is crap, AM is great. ANY IDEAS?? What would cause the FM reception to be so bad? Can anyone at least give me a starting point? I'm about to just go on EBay and just get another one and put my decoder in it. I've done about 3 or 4 of these now. I can find them on EBay anytime and they're usually about $20 or so. I have to have this radio because I have the add-on CD unit that goes with it. 2nd question.....Chris....how simple is it to put some sort of "brick-wall" filter together to get rid of the 10Khz carrier whistle? Ever thought about integrating that into your decoder? I love my conversion and it sounds great, but it even almost gives ME a headache at night because of that whistle. Just needs to be some sort of "Brick wall" filter that drops things off sharply at 9.5 Khz or something like that. Similar to what all of us radio stations have to use I guess. MJR n WYO ----- Original Message ----- From: Michael J. Richard To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, September 24, 2002 10:27 AM Subject: {AMSF} TV Stereo (OT?) On the topic of MTS stereo......I've always wondered something. When the days of stereo tuners started.....as in stereo VCR's.....why the hell don't hasn't anyone ever included the stereo circuitry into the modulator which "broadcasts" the VCR's output onto channel 3 or 4??? That is so stupid I've always though. You have NO idea how many people I have run into and seen using a STEREO vcr with their STEREO TV, and they're using Channel 3 or 4 on the TV to view movies or whatever from the VCR. Most of them not even realizing it's MONO. I have YET to see a stereo VCR that actually modulates the stereo pilot and stereo information on its channel 3 or 4 output. Isn't that dumb??? You would think they should have done that many years ago when stereo VCR's were first invented. Most people will not go through the trouble to hook up the A/V cables and use the A/V input on their stereo television. MJR n WYO ----- Original Message ----- From: Kevin T. To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, September 23, 2002 9:23 PM Subject: {AMSF} Re: Sony SRFA300 And speaking of which, nowadays Philips is selling a 20" model with so-called "Dual Speaker TV Sound"... it turns out that it has Stereo Left and Right inputs for a VCR/DVD/video game, etc., but the actual TV tuner does not have MTS Stereo/SAP reception! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ADVERTISEMENT I'm a Woman Man seeking a Man Woman Enter city or ZIP Age: to Show only ads with photos Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From philipr@irac.pe.ca Tue Sep 24 10:20:49 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_3); 24 Sep 2002 17:20:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 42023 invoked from network); 24 Sep 2002 17:20:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Sep 2002 17:20:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Sep 2002 17:20:07 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.147] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 24 Sep 2002 17:20:07 -0000 Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 17:20:07 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: Sony SRFA300 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <041a01c263d7$05d10ca0$d8f9bed8@kredding430cdt> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2528 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking This serves as a power isolation transformer. The reference to batteries was a bit confusing. Taking an SR III as an example, what I find is that using this device makes line cord operation as quiet as pulling the plug and using 6 D cells instead. I will try to see if I can take a picture with the digital cam at work - I have no cam or scanner at home. For now, it is a very simple set-up. Primary of Transformer #1 to AC line, secondary of #1 to secondary of #2, primary of #2 to an AC socket and plug er in! In my application, I just insulated and ignored the centre taps on the two secondaries, rather than connecting them. A fuse was placed in series with primary #2 to AC output - just so if someone plugged a power amp or other power hungry device, it would pop the fuse, rather than one or both transformers. There is no real magic to the voltages - just keep them the same. For example, 2 back to back 12.6 volt transformers would work well too - you'd just need more amps to get similar watts! Either way, the theory is simple - stepping the voltage down, then stepping it back up by an identical ratio. Its the isolation, or in this case, double isolation, which does the trick, both from a safety point of view, and apparently noise as well. While it does nothing to help reduce the noise from the light dimmers in the next room, it really eliminates noise from the upstairs light dimmers. I guess that the ones in the next room are close enough to radiate through the air to the antenna. --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" wrote: > > Here is a trick worth trying for members of the list, especially if > > you need an isolation transformer as well: take 2 RS 120 to 25.2 > > volt 2 amp transformers and wire them back to back. > > When you are talking about this, you seem to be talking about a power > isolation transformer here. > > > Even solid state gear with a built in > > transformer - like a GE SR III - was as quiet as when run on > > batteries when used through this little contraption. > > But here, it seems you are talking about using it as an RF receive isolation > transformer since you are talking about using it with the radio on > batteries. Which is it? > > I am interested in this device either way. I have BAD line noise and BAD > noise coming from the powerlines and phone lines in the area since they are > spewing large amounts of digital hash. > > Draw it up or take a picture. Let us see this thing. > > Kevin From philipr@irac.pe.ca Tue Sep 24 10:33:22 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_3); 24 Sep 2002 17:33:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 81679 invoked from network); 24 Sep 2002 17:33:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Sep 2002 17:33:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.78) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Sep 2002 17:33:20 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.164] by n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 24 Sep 2002 17:33:20 -0000 Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 17:33:19 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: questions -- Help! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <003701c263e8$bb201680$0701010a@keva> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 5284 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking I'm no techie, just a hobbyist, but could it be antenna problems? Would seem strange though, since the AM is fine. Unless there was a problem with the coax [moisture? pinched coax?] or the motorola plug or socket that affected VHF level frequencies only? It does seem bizarre! perhaps if the capacitance of the coax was really thrown off, it would really attenuate 88 to 108 while leaving .53 to 1.71 unscathed? While the peak limiting function is very hard sounding and crude, would it be possible to modify the Ramsey STC-1 so instead of a 15 khz brick wall, it would be a 9 khz brickwall - perhaps using a different xtal? While it would be too big for internal mounting, it could make a good external - e.g. tuner to amp rig. Whether home or in car. Or output of radio, tuner, receiver etc. to tape deck or other recording device. The STC-1 uses line level inputs and outputs and its stereo. Just don't drive it hard enough to activate that nasty limiter. An external whistle filter, if you will. Although it would cut off frequencies above the desired frequency as well, so its not a true whistle filter, but a low pass filter. --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Michael J. Richard" wrote: > Questions for all the techs > (responses? I didn't hear from anyone on my other questions :( ) > > On my car stereo.....a Mitsubishi unit from about a 97 Montero or eclipse....nice little unit...the FM doesn't hardly pick up at all. I have 3 or 4 of these and the FM reception is usually VERY nice! But on this particular one, it doesn't hardly pickup at all. If I'm in a large market (IE Salt Lake, Denver) and it's being hammered with a 100,000 watt signal, it'll do okay but still fade and ffffff around a corner of a hill or something. Yet AM reception on this unit is fantastic. I even went as far as taking the FM section from another unit and putting it in this one. Went through the trouble to unsolder this little circuit board....all 20 pins or so.....and take one from another exact unit and put it in this one. Same thing. FM reception is crap, AM is great. ANY IDEAS?? What would cause the FM reception to be so bad? Can anyone at least give me a starting point? I'm about to just go on EBay and just get another one and put my decoder in it. I've done about 3 or 4 of these now. I can find them on EBay anytime and they're usually about $20 or so. I have to have this radio because I have the add-on CD unit that goes with it. > > 2nd question.....Chris....how simple is it to put some sort of "brick-wall" filter together to get rid of the 10Khz carrier whistle? Ever thought about integrating that into your decoder? I love my conversion and it sounds great, but it even almost gives ME a headache at night because of that whistle. Just needs to be some sort of "Brick wall" filter that drops things off sharply at 9.5 Khz or something like that. Similar to what all of us radio stations have to use I guess. > > MJR n WYO > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Michael J. Richard > To: amstereoforum@y... > Sent: Tuesday, September 24, 2002 10:27 AM > Subject: {AMSF} TV Stereo (OT?) > > > On the topic of MTS stereo......I've always wondered something. When the days of stereo tuners started.....as in stereo VCR's.....why the hell don't hasn't anyone ever included the stereo circuitry into the modulator which "broadcasts" the VCR's output onto channel 3 or 4??? > That is so stupid I've always though. You have NO idea how many people I have run into and seen using a STEREO vcr with their STEREO TV, and they're using Channel 3 or 4 on the TV to view movies or whatever from the VCR. Most of them not even realizing it's MONO. I have YET to see a stereo VCR that actually modulates the stereo pilot and stereo information on its channel 3 or 4 output. Isn't that dumb??? You would think they should have done that many years ago when stereo VCR's were first invented. Most people will not go through the trouble to hook up the A/V cables and use the A/V input on their stereo television. > > MJR n WYO > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Kevin T. > To: amstereoforum@y... > Sent: Monday, September 23, 2002 9:23 PM > Subject: {AMSF} Re: Sony SRFA300 > > > And speaking of which, nowadays Philips is selling a 20" model with > so-called "Dual Speaker TV Sound"... it turns out that it has Stereo > Left and Right inputs for a VCR/DVD/video game, etc., but the actual > TV tuner does not have MTS Stereo/SAP reception! > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor > ADVERTISEMENT > > > > I'm a Woman Man seeking a Man Woman > Enter city or ZIP > Age: to > Show only ads with photos > > > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From philipr@irac.pe.ca Tue Sep 24 11:28:46 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_3); 24 Sep 2002 18:28:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 66714 invoked from network); 24 Sep 2002 18:28:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Sep 2002 18:28:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Sep 2002 18:28:45 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.167] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 24 Sep 2002 18:28:45 -0000 Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 18:28:43 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: Sony SRFA300 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <041a01c263d7$05d10ca0$d8f9bed8@kredding430cdt> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 433 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking > I am interested in this device either way. I have BAD line noise and BAD > noise coming from the powerlines and phone lines in the area since they are > spewing large amounts of digital hash. > > Draw it up or take a picture. Let us see this thing. > > Kevin Kevin, I posted a crude hand drawn by yours truly schematic of this thing. Check under photos. Transformers should be available at Radio Shack or elsewhere. Phil From michaelj@vcn.com Tue Sep 24 12:32:02 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_3); 24 Sep 2002 19:32:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 23591 invoked from network); 24 Sep 2002 19:32:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Sep 2002 19:32:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m1-cluster2.vcn.com) (209.193.72.40) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Sep 2002 19:32:01 -0000 Received: from michael (vcn53.usrtc-1.evan.wy.vcn.com [209.193.86.57]) by m1-cluster2.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 13:32:00 -0600 To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} Re: questions -- Help! Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 13:31:59 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Ooops...sorry guys Sorry about that long message on my "questions" I had replied to my own other email to get the "to" address to pop in and didn't trim anything off. Yikes! TRIM YOUR MESSAGES MIKE!!! :) Thanks for the thoughts Phil. Don't think it's anything with the antenna. Like I said...I've got 3 or 4 other exact same radios and same antenna and all and the FM works fine. It's something in the radio. Wondering if there's a capacitor or something that the antenna signal goes through before it gets to the FM section. Thinking maybe that cap is shorted or something. MJR [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From jsgil@hal-pc.org Tue Sep 24 13:41:28 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_3); 24 Sep 2002 20:41:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 48406 invoked from network); 24 Sep 2002 20:41:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Sep 2002 20:41:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.89) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Sep 2002 20:41:26 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.139] by n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 24 Sep 2002 20:41:26 -0000 Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 20:41:24 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: questions -- Help! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <003701c263e8$bb201680$0701010a@keva> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2708 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.213 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Michael J. Richard" wrote: > Questions for all the techs > (responses? I didn't hear from anyone on my other questions :( ) > how simple is it to put some sort of "brick-wall" filter together to get rid of the 10Khz carrier whistle? Ever thought about integrating that into your decoder? I love my conversion and it sounds great, but it even almost gives ME a headache at night because of that whistle. Just needs to be some sort of "Brick wall" filter that drops things off sharply at 9.5 Khz or something like that. Similar to what all of us radio stations have to use I guess. > I have done something similar but used a Twin-T notch filter that is bootstrapped to its output. This provides a very sharp notch with a Q=~50. A second order lowpass filter @ 9.5KHz will help to create a brick wall. This lowpass filter can be tuned to provide a boost of ~9-12db at its cutoff frequency to help compensate for filter attenuation. This filtering works well with one of those ceramic IF filters found in the headset of those 50MHz cordless phones. You also need to provide NRSC de-emphasis. I have drawned up a decoder board that has this post detection filtering. If you want to check out the filter section download it a my website: http://www.hal-pc.org/~jsgil/AM-Stereo/MC13028-Decoder.zip > On the topic of MTS stereo......I've always wondered something. When the days of stereo tuners started.....as in stereo VCR's.....why the hell don't hasn't anyone ever included the stereo circuitry into the modulator which "broadcasts" the VCR's output onto channel 3 or 4??? > That is so stupid I've always though. You have NO idea how many people I have run into and seen using a STEREO vcr with their STEREO TV, and they're using Channel 3 or 4 on the TV to view movies or whatever from the VCR. Most of them not even realizing it's MONO. I have YET to see a stereo VCR that actually modulates the stereo pilot and stereo information on its channel 3 or 4 output. Isn't that dumb??? You would think they should have done that many years ago when stereo VCR's were first invented. Most people will not go through the trouble to hook up the A/V cables and use the A/V input on their stereo television. The MTS decoder also contains a dbx wideband and spectral expander for L-R besides the regular stereo decoder found in most FMS. This expander is complex and would raise the cost of the VCR. The separation after compansion is not that good and in some cases is worse than AMS. An encoder would have to rematrix the 2 channels and compress the L-R. My feeling on this is that after all this procesing the separation would be poor. JSG From ccuff@in4web.com Tue Sep 24 14:54:02 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_3); 24 Sep 2002 21:54:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 40645 invoked from network); 24 Sep 2002 21:53:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Sep 2002 21:53:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Sep 2002 21:53:59 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.56]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 17:51:08 -0400 Message-ID: <002701c26414$b8db52a0$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: <003001c263e7$48b03d60$0701010a@keva> <003701c263e8$bb201680$0701010a@keva> Subject: Re: {AMSF} questions -- Help! Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 17:52:47 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 Hi Michael As far as a filter, that costs money- people balk at $25.00 for a complete decoder, and I am not about to add more cost to it.. :-) Frankly, it has not been a problem. I have found that the decoder is a pass-thru for the existing signal, so if the filter is below 10K, it is not a problem. If you take off the signal BEFORE the filter, then you get "barn door" bandwidth, and whistles. CC ----- Original Message ----- From: Michael J. Richard To: Sent: Tuesday, September 24, 2002 12:37 PM Subject: {AMSF} questions -- Help! From rwagoner@cox.net Tue Sep 24 15:56:46 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner@cox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_3); 24 Sep 2002 22:56:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 18213 invoked from network); 24 Sep 2002 22:56:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Sep 2002 22:56:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.84) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Sep 2002 22:56:45 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.183] by n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 24 Sep 2002 22:56:44 -0000 Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 22:56:40 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Losing KDIS? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1353 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Richard Wagoner" X-Originating-IP: 68.4.33.253 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=96123889 X-Yahoo-Profile: richardalanwagoner --- In amstereoforum@y..., ". Narkspud" wrote: > An ominous portent for one of our "true" AM Stereo outlets in the LA > market--the one that plays the music. It appears that KDIS 710 (Radio > Disney) and KSPN 1110 (ESPN Radio) are trading frequencies to give more > coverage to the Anaheim Angels games. Will AM Stereo survive the switch? > We find out January 1. > > http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/news/archive/2002/09/23/sports1929EDT0165.DTL > > It looks like no, it will not survive. Read this reply I received from ABC LA press relations. Yes; it is Mono & will remain that way, as far as we know. -----Original Message----- From: Richard Wagoner Sent: Monday, September 23, 2002 11:39 PM To: Bernson, Linda Subject: Re: For Immediate Release Linda: Can you check with your engineering staff to see if Radio Disney will remain in stereo when it moves to 1110 AM? Currently, 710 and 790 broadcast in stereo, while 1110 is mono. Not many people have decent AM radios, let alone stereo, but those of us who do appreciate when the audio chain is clean and the station broadcasts in stereo. Back when 1110 was KRLA, they too were in stereo and sounded quite good. KDIS sounds quite good in stereo also, as does KABC. Hopefully all three will be stereo after the switch. Thanks, Richard Wagoner From stodd@sherbtel.net Tue Sep 24 17:32:41 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_3); 25 Sep 2002 00:32:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 36236 invoked from network); 25 Sep 2002 00:32:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Sep 2002 00:32:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Sep 2002 00:32:39 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-88-159.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.159]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g8P0S0QX006994 for ; Tue, 24 Sep 2002 19:28:01 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <003a01c2642b$4ae3a740$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: questions -- Help! Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2002 19:34:19 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Or something to do with the FM IF section in that radio. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael J. Richard" > It's something in the radio. Wondering if there's a capacitor or something > that the antenna signal goes through before it gets to the FM section. From bjackson@indyradio.com Tue Sep 24 19:44:36 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_3); 25 Sep 2002 02:44:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 90532 invoked from network); 25 Sep 2002 02:43:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Sep 2002 02:43:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Sep 2002 02:43:52 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.161] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 25 Sep 2002 02:43:45 -0000 Date: Wed, 25 Sep 2002 02:43:45 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Motorola C-QUAM AM Exciter-Transmitter Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <004f01c26364$8ecbde40$d3a9fea9@me> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1707 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923" X-Originating-IP: 172.171.232.205 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 Yes...2 words. 1) Susquehanna 2) IBOC I've talked to our engineers here in Indy, and they've pretty much given up on music and analog stereo on AM. In fact, the only reason we even own WZZB in Seymour, IN is because we needed the FM (93.7) to help us increase power on our Indianapolis 93.9. Being from southern Indiana, however, I turn on 1390...There's a plus to having such an old (88) car...The great Delco AMS radio! Also, when I worked at WTTS/WGCL in Bloomington (Go IU!), I asked the same questions there...Why wasn't WGCL (1370) stereo anymore...Get this...They still do all production in stereo. They have a CRL am stereo matrix processor, and 2 Marti STL's. However, on the air you can only hear half of a spot if stereo effects were used because only 1 STL unit radiates...The other is un-plugged at the studio and the xmter site has the L&R just wired together. I was told there that talk radio didn't need to be in stereo. I even took the CE out to my car and had him listen how stereo opened up the audio (thanks WLS!). No help. I guess that's probably the same reason why WIBC and WXNT (WMYS) here in Indy turned the lights off, too. Thanks a lot IBOC!!! -Brad Jackson -Susquehanna Indianapolis -WGRL/WGLD/WFMS --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Scott Todd" wrote: > Brad, > > Have you asked around as to why AMS has been turned off at so many of your > stations? > > Scott Todd > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "bradleyj923" > > > PS - If anyone is in Indiana, or has a chance to dx 1390, WZZB, they > > are a GREAT sounding AMS station...AC format. As far as I know, the > > only one we (Susquehanna) own that is still AMS. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Sep 24 20:02:21 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_3); 25 Sep 2002 03:02:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 30757 invoked from network); 25 Sep 2002 03:02:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Sep 2002 03:02:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Sep 2002 03:02:20 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.168] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 25 Sep 2002 03:02:20 -0000 Date: Wed, 25 Sep 2002 03:02:18 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: questions -- Help! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <002701c26414$b8db52a0$0101a8c0@pavilion> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1356 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.95.24 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > I have found that the decoder is a pass-thru for the existing > signal, so if the filter is below 10K, it is not a problem. If you > take off the signal BEFORE the filter, then you get "barn door" > bandwidth, and whistles. That is true, but at least out of the radios that are truly worthy of conversion to AM Stereo, it is rare to find one with a bandwidth narrow enough to cut out the 10 kHz whistle completely, especially at night. For example, the Realistic TM-152 uses a "4.5 kHz" filter, yet its actual bandwidth is wide enough that the whistle can get quite loud and annoying. This is also true for radios which just use IF coils to determine the bandwidth, such as Philips-Magnavox radios with the "ECO 5" digital tuner board. I also recently bought a Radio Shack DX-397 shortwave radio (made by Sangean), and its bandwidth is surprisingly wide -- on the AM band it's nearly AMAX quality, and on shortwave I have the pleasure of hearing both 5 and 10 kHz carrier whistles! This radio does convert to AM Stereo successfully, but it has an aggressive AGC which tends to make it pop out of Stereo mode more often. With the help of a schematic it probably wouldn't be hard to modify its AGC to be more relaxed, without compromising sensitivity. And for its size and price it does have very good reception on AM and Shortwave! From rob.j.davies@philips.com Wed Sep 25 08:07:04 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: rob.j.davies@philips.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_3); 25 Sep 2002 15:07:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 63878 invoked from network); 25 Sep 2002 15:07:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Sep 2002 15:07:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO gw-nl4.philips.com) (212.153.190.6) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Sep 2002 15:07:01 -0000 Received: from smtpscan-nl1.philips.com (smtpscan-nl1.philips.com [130.139.36.21]) by gw-nl4.philips.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 00EEC457C1 for ; Wed, 25 Sep 2002 17:07:00 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from smtprelay-nl1.philips.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by smtpscan-nl1.philips.com (8.9.3/8.8.5-1.2.2m-19990317) with ESMTP id RAA02982 for ; Wed, 25 Sep 2002 17:06:58 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from hbg001soh.diamond.philips.com (e1soh01.diamond.philips.com [130.143.165.45]) by smtprelay-nl1.philips.com (8.9.3/8.8.5-1.2.2m-19990317) with ESMTP id RAA21619 for ; Wed, 25 Sep 2002 17:06:55 +0200 (MET DST) Subject: Re: {AMSF} Digest Number 382 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 5.0.5 September 22, 2000 Message-ID: Date: Wed, 25 Sep 2002 16:05:19 +0100 X-MIMETrack: Serialize by Router on hbg001soh/H/SERVER/PHILIPS(Release 5.0.9a |January 7, 2002) at 25/09/2002 17:07:54 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: rob.j.davies@philips.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=49921925 X-Yahoo-Profile: rjd34uk From: "Charles Penry" Subject: RE: Re: Sony ICF-SW7600GR > For the ICF-201 conversion to AM Stereo go to: > http://users.hfx.eastlink.ca/~amstereo/sony2010.htm > Perhaps the ICF-SW7600FR would be similar. I don't have the circuit for the 7600gr but the 7600g definitely uses a different AM/FM IF chip. The 2010 mod, if I remember rightly, works by tapping both LSB and USB outputs simultaneously (so works more like Kahn than CQuam). This isn't possible with the 7600g circuit. Rob From narkspud@hotmail.com Wed Sep 25 08:08:48 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: narkspud@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_3); 25 Sep 2002 15:08:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 38239 invoked from network); 25 Sep 2002 15:08:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Sep 2002 15:08:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.17.192) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Sep 2002 15:08:48 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 25 Sep 2002 08:08:48 -0700 Received: from 67.89.146.146 by lw11fd.law11.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Wed, 25 Sep 2002 15:08:48 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Losing KDIS? Date: Wed, 25 Sep 2002 08:08:48 -0700 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 25 Sep 2002 15:08:48.0335 (UTC) FILETIME=[731B5DF0:01C264A5] From: ". Narkspud" X-Originating-IP: [67.89.146.146] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=81956306 X-Yahoo-Profile: narkspud >It looks like no, it will not survive. Read this reply I received from >ABC LA press relations. > >Yes; it is Mono & will remain that way, as far as we know. Since the question was "will Radio Disney remain stereo," I think there's basis to hope that this reply represents cluelessness and not actual information. The only station of the three that's currently mono is ESPN Radio. I'm guessing it'll be up to the engineering staff, and perhaps a few accountaineers, what we eventually get. narkspud (expecting pilot-only on 710 and mono on 1110, but still hoping) _________________________________________________________________ Join the world’s largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. http://www.hotmail.com From mychucky@funport.net Wed Sep 25 12:21:47 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: mychucky@funport.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_3); 25 Sep 2002 19:21:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 72493 invoked from network); 25 Sep 2002 19:21:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Sep 2002 19:21:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.funport.com) (216.199.19.6) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Sep 2002 19:21:44 -0000 Received: from FatMusic2000 ([]) by mail.funport.com (Merak 5.1.2) with SMTP id JFB36580 for ; Wed, 25 Sep 2002 15:16:59 -0400 Message-ID: <003301c264c8$c96e21b0$1400a8c0@FatMusic2000> To: References: <003001c263e7$48b03d60$0701010a@keva> Subject: Re: {AMSF} TV Stereo (OT?) Date: Wed, 25 Sep 2002 15:21:44 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=85836819 X-Yahoo-Profile: mychucky1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I'ts a little late to grip about this, you won't find this on the new DVD Recorders eather so just get a stereo cable and hook it up to the TV ----- Original Message ----- From: Michael J. Richard To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, September 24, 2002 12:27 PM Subject: {AMSF} TV Stereo (OT?) On the topic of MTS stereo......I've always wondered something. When the days of stereo tuners started.....as in stereo VCR's.....why the hell don't hasn't anyone ever included the stereo circuitry into the modulator which "broadcasts" the VCR's output onto channel 3 or 4??? That is so stupid I've always though. You have NO idea how many people I have run into and seen using a STEREO vcr with their STEREO TV, and they're using Channel 3 or 4 on the TV to view movies or whatever from the VCR. Most of them not even realizing it's MONO. I have YET to see a stereo VCR that actually modulates the stereo pilot and stereo information on its channel 3 or 4 output. Isn't that dumb??? You would think they should have done that many years ago when stereo VCR's were first invented. Most people will not go through the trouble to hook up the A/V cables and use the A/V input on their stereo television. MJR n WYO ----- Original Message ----- From: Kevin T. To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, September 23, 2002 9:23 PM Subject: {AMSF} Re: Sony SRFA300 And speaking of which, nowadays Philips is selling a 20" model with so-called "Dual Speaker TV Sound"... it turns out that it has Stereo Left and Right inputs for a VCR/DVD/video game, etc., but the actual TV tuner does not have MTS Stereo/SAP reception! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ADVERTISEMENT I'm a Woman Man seeking a Man Woman Enter city or ZIP Age: to Show only ads with photos Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From tom_richard1980@yahoo.com Wed Sep 25 15:06:11 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: tom_richard1980@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_3); 25 Sep 2002 22:06:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 45539 invoked from network); 25 Sep 2002 22:06:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Sep 2002 22:06:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Sep 2002 22:06:09 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.168] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 25 Sep 2002 22:06:08 -0000 Date: Wed, 25 Sep 2002 22:06:07 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Success! Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 398 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Tom Mourgos" X-Originating-IP: 64.1.161.162 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38123538 X-Yahoo-Profile: tom_richard1980 I just won an AM Stereo radio for my car from Ebay. The seller is "Nordstromsauto" and he clearly described each radio he had as to whether it had "AM-stereo/FM-stereo" or "AM-mono/FM-Stereo" or not. I even e-mailed him to double-check. $56.00. No sweat. Now I better start liking nostalgia music because 960 KABL is the only AM-Stereo music station here. The rest are pretenders. Tom From meridian3891@cs.com Wed Sep 25 17:21:05 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: meridian3891@cs.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_3); 26 Sep 2002 00:21:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 74815 invoked from network); 26 Sep 2002 00:21:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Sep 2002 00:21:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.78) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Sep 2002 00:21:04 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.189] by n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 26 Sep 2002 00:21:03 -0000 Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 00:20:59 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: TV Stereo (Even further OT!) Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <003001c263e7$48b03d60$0701010a@keva> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1978 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Tony" X-Originating-IP: 152.163.189.99 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=48487815 X-Yahoo-Profile: onemeridian I notice that the S.A.P. (2nd Audio Programming) comes in along with the primary (stereo) audio of the TV stations...even during skip season...That's when I get TV stations fromBaltimore, MD, Washington, D.C., N.Y.C., etc., & I can also decode their S.A.P. audio as well. With cable TV starting at $42/month, I do not subscribe. Subsequently, I use the TV antenna that the prior owner of this house was nice enough to leave....... TONY --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Michael J. Richard" wrote: > On the topic of MTS stereo......I've always wondered something. When the days of stereo tuners started.....as in stereo VCR's.....why the hell don't hasn't anyone ever included the stereo circuitry into the modulator which "broadcasts" the VCR's output onto channel 3 or 4??? > That is so stupid I've always though. You have NO idea how many people I have run into and seen using a STEREO vcr with their STEREO TV, and they're using Channel 3 or 4 on the TV to view movies or whatever from the VCR. Most of them not even realizing it's MONO. I have YET to see a stereo VCR that actually modulates the stereo pilot and stereo information on its channel 3 or 4 output. Isn't that dumb??? You would think they should have done that many years ago when stereo VCR's were first invented. Most people will not go through the trouble to hook up the A/V cables and use the A/V input on their stereo television. > > MJR n WYO > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Kevin T. > To: amstereoforum@y... > Sent: Monday, September 23, 2002 9:23 PM > Subject: {AMSF} Re: Sony SRFA300 > > > And speaking of which, nowadays Philips is selling a 20" model with > so-called "Dual Speaker TV Sound"... it turns out that it has Stereo > Left and Right inputs for a VCR/DVD/video game, etc., but the actual > TV tuner does not have MTS Stereo/SAP reception! > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From rjskadl@yahoo.com Wed Sep 25 21:31:04 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: rjskadl@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 26 Sep 2002 04:31:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 60229 invoked from network); 26 Sep 2002 04:31:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Sep 2002 04:31:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Sep 2002 04:31:01 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.176] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 26 Sep 2002 04:31:01 -0000 Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 04:31:01 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Harris IBOC Roadshow NYC Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <01b501c262ad$b27261a0$d8f9bed8@kredding430cdt> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 240 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "rjskadl" X-Originating-IP: 24.186.98.159 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=29619919 X-Yahoo-Profile: rjskadl Hey everyone. I'm sorry I haven't posted anything about the Harris IBOC RoadShow yet. I have been real busy. I just wanted to let yous know that I haven't forgoten all of you. Consider my comments on the day as "Coming soon." -Russ From philipr@irac.pe.ca Thu Sep 26 05:17:11 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 26 Sep 2002 12:17:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 23108 invoked from network); 26 Sep 2002 12:17:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Sep 2002 12:17:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.68) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Sep 2002 12:17:10 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.136] by n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 26 Sep 2002 12:17:09 -0000 Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 12:17:08 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Heathkit PT-1 Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3296 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking Last night, I was the successful bidder on a Heathkit PT-1 (professional tuner). For those who are not familiar with this rig, it is a circa 1958 AM/FM tuner with an output for an AM Stereo decoder! This was back in the earliest days of experimenting with AM Stereo, and it was naturally assumed that the FCC would approve AM stereo. Later Heathkit tuners, such as the AJ-11 had a multiplex ouput - but that was for FM. My brother has a PT-1, complete with instruction manual and schematic. The PT-1 is very sensitive on both AM and FM - as I recall it has something like 12 or 14 tubes! Unlike the AJ-11, it uses an analogue tuning meter rather than dual magic eyes, so each tube is a full blown tube. Add to that - it uses rectifier diodes for the power supply, and I believe dual germanium diodes for the detector, and you can see how sensitive this rig can be. By contrast, the AJ-11 uses a tube detector - although it does use rectifier diodes in the power supply. Of course, the PT-1 has switchable wide/narrow bandwidth for AM. On wide, the response, according to the graph in the manual, is flat up to 6 khz, then gradually sloping about 5 or 6 db down to 9 khz, before the mighty whistle filter kicks in. Like the AJ-11, it has separate AM and FM tuning knobs, for stereo simulcast - eg. when an AM station played the "left" channel, while its FM station played the "right" channel. Apparently, some stations used to do this, in the late 50s, very early 60s, for special simulcast broadcasts - perhaps an hour or two per day. While my AJ-11 works great on FM, the AM sensitivity is very poor, and the sound is the same regardless of which way the wide/narrow switch is set. Likely an assembly error, or perhaps a bad paper capacitor? All the tubes test fine. Could be an outrageously bad alignment, or a hidden break on the wire wound arround the ferrite bar antenna. My brother's PT-1 is a screamer sensitivity wise, with incredible sound, so I have high hopes for the one I bid on. It may, of course, need some tweaking and troubleshooting, although the seller says it works well on AM and FM. Needless to say, I'll be asking my brother to send me a photocopy of his PT-1 manual and schematic. Now, what is going to be an interesting experiment, is to hook the input of Chris's AM stereo decoder to the AM stereo output - as I remember from the schematic, this RCA jack taps out of the second IF transformer, right before the dual diode detector - and hook up the outputs of the decoder to a stereo amp, to see if this baby will work as a CQUAM AM Stereo tuner. If so, it will be the easiest AM stereo conversion ever. If this works as planned, and it becomes a CQUAM AM Stereo tuner with the decoder plugged in, I'll borrow the digital camera from work and snap some photos to uplink to the site. Even if it doesn't, its nice to have a sensitive, wide band AM tuner! By the way, PT-1s do pop up on ebay from time to time. I believe there is an AJ-30 [or is it AJ-31?] which was a more advanced and expensive version of the AJ-11 on ebay now. It would be nice for any of these old vintage wideband AM/FM tuners to find a home where the AM is truly appreciated! Not just Heaths, but Fishers, Scotts etc. Phil From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Thu Sep 26 07:08:19 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 26 Sep 2002 14:08:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 86339 invoked from network); 26 Sep 2002 14:08:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Sep 2002 14:08:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14205.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.151) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Sep 2002 14:08:18 -0000 Message-ID: <20020926140818.24266.qmail@web14205.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.45.202.244] by web14205.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 26 Sep 2002 07:08:18 PDT Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 07:08:18 -0700 (PDT) Subject: MetroSound last week To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: John Pavlica X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio I was scouting out eBay, and I noticed that somebody paid $80 for a MetroSound last week! There must still be some interest out there for Analog AM Stereo! __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? New DSL Internet Access from SBC & Yahoo! http://sbc.yahoo.com From michaelj@vcn.com Thu Sep 26 07:25:40 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 26 Sep 2002 14:25:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 73482 invoked from network); 26 Sep 2002 14:25:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Sep 2002 14:25:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m1-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Sep 2002 14:25:38 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m1-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Thu, 26 Sep 2002 08:25:37 -0600 Message-ID: <001501c26568$8cb56ee0$0701010a@keva> To: References: <003001c263e7$48b03d60$0701010a@keva> <003301c264c8$c96e21b0$1400a8c0@FatMusic2000> Subject: Re: {AMSF} TV Stereo (OT?) Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 08:25:22 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Thanks Chuck Wasn't griping. Just curious why they never did that. I guess they just wanted to save money like anyone else. ----- Original Message ----- From: mychucky@funport.net To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2002 1:21 PM Subject: Re: {AMSF} TV Stereo (OT?) I'ts a little late to grip about this, you won't find this on the new DVD Recorders eather so just get a stereo cable and hook it up to the TV ----- Original Message ----- From: Michael J. Richard To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, September 24, 2002 12:27 PM Subject: {AMSF} TV Stereo (OT?) On the topic of MTS stereo......I've always wondered something. When the days of stereo tuners started.....as in stereo VCR's.....why the hell don't hasn't anyone ever included the stereo circuitry into the modulator which "broadcasts" the VCR's output onto channel 3 or 4??? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From groucho@skyweb.net Thu Sep 26 08:22:37 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 26 Sep 2002 15:22:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 34763 invoked from network); 26 Sep 2002 15:22:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Sep 2002 15:22:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Sep 2002 15:22:35 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g8QFO7pu027569 for ; Thu, 26 Sep 2002 11:24:08 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3D93254B.82BE93A2@skyweb.net> Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 11:18:36 -0400 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} MetroSound last week References: <20020926140818.24266.qmail@web14205.mail.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 I would Say so John.. I had heard of AM stereo and had no experience with AM stereo. never even heard an AM stereo signal before I became the stations engineer. I knew that the station was once AM stereo and still had all the gear in the racks disconnected. I had given myself a challenge to get this gear working. From day 1 that I took over as Chief Engineer of the station. I made it my goal to make the station AM Stereo Because of its music format. I even split the 3 studio mics to left, Center, right. Just last week I attended the Harris IBOC joke in NYC. and will Fully admit. My AM stereo Station sounds a hell of a Lot better that that poor demonstration they were so proud of with AM IBOC. I think My stations audio sounds Better than some of the local FM's. Besides being the stations engineer I am a partner in a world Class recording studio and I tour as a concert mix Engineer for many world known artists. sonically balanced sounding Audio is # 1 to Me.. and I will say point Blank AM IBOC sounds like Shit. I never knew Am stereo before this.. and I will say AM stereo Rules. if its done correctly. now we just need radio manufacturers to Build AM stereo C-Quam receivers. I blame this On the FCC.. they requested expanded band stations to be AM Stereo ,But never mandated manufacturers to build the receivers. with my listening range alone there are at least 7 AM stations running stereo. in a 4 month period I was able to aquire at least 4 AM Stereo receivers. they are out there but collecting dust. I personally have started a campaign to My listeners If they want to hear the station in its full Stereo separation to Buy a certain radio.. and for an additional Cost I will install the Stereo Decoders. this will cost the listener about $90 for an AM radio with Full Stereo. still cheaper than IBOC. Besides if you knew about IBOC it also uses QUAM Phase modulation on the sidbands. Its a choice of AM Stereo or IBOC you cannot run both at the same Time. AM Stereo forever.. I'm Hooked Neal John Pavlica wrote: > I was scouting out eBay, and I noticed that somebody paid $80 for a MetroSound > last week! There must still be some interest out there for Analog AM Stereo! > > __________________________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > New DSL Internet Access from SBC & Yahoo! > http://sbc.yahoo.com > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From redledge78@yahoo.com Thu Sep 26 08:33:15 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: redledge78@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 26 Sep 2002 15:33:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 27161 invoked from network); 26 Sep 2002 15:33:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Sep 2002 15:33:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.66) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Sep 2002 15:33:13 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.142] by n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 26 Sep 2002 15:33:13 -0000 Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 15:33:10 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Success! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 556 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "redledge78" X-Originating-IP: 64.1.161.162 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=59652447 X-Yahoo-Profile: redledge78 The ID of the Delco AM-Stereo is 16085414. It fits 92-95 GM cars. --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Tom Mourgos" wrote: > I just won an AM Stereo radio for my car from Ebay. The seller > is "Nordstromsauto" and he clearly described each radio he had as to > whether it had "AM-stereo/FM-stereo" or "AM-mono/FM-Stereo" or not. > I even e-mailed him to double-check. $56.00. No sweat. > > Now I better start liking nostalgia music because 960 KABL is the > only AM-Stereo music station here. The rest are pretenders. > > Tom From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Sep 26 10:45:42 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 26 Sep 2002 17:45:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 65832 invoked from network); 26 Sep 2002 17:45:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Sep 2002 17:45:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Sep 2002 17:45:39 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.157] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 26 Sep 2002 17:45:34 -0000 Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 17:45:32 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Audimax Stereo Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 277 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics There are two Audimax 4440A audio processors on eBay right now... get 'em both, and give your AM Stereo station that special "vintage" on-air sound! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=908772438 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=909068049 From ccuff@in4web.com Thu Sep 26 13:41:51 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 26 Sep 2002 20:41:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 12942 invoked from network); 26 Sep 2002 20:41:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Sep 2002 20:41:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Sep 2002 20:41:50 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.87]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Thu, 26 Sep 2002 16:39:03 -0400 Message-ID: <002101c2659c$f90122e0$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: Subject: (ot) tower collapse Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 16:40:37 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 I just read that a nearly 2000' TV tower collapsed in Nebraska, killing 2 engineers. Has anyone heard anything? What stations? They were apparently "strengthening the tower for digital TV" when it happened. Chris From penry@nortelnetworks.com Thu Sep 26 14:03:38 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: penry@nortelnetworks.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 26 Sep 2002 21:03:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 7325 invoked from network); 26 Sep 2002 21:03:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Sep 2002 21:03:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com) (47.103.122.112) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Sep 2002 21:03:36 -0000 Received: from zrc2c011.us.nortel.com (zrc2c011.us.nortel.com [47.103.120.51]) by zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id g8QL3mx05821 for ; Thu, 26 Sep 2002 16:03:48 -0500 (CDT) Received: by zrc2c011.us.nortel.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Thu, 26 Sep 2002 16:03:35 -0500 Message-ID: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A56079740409A810@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Cc: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: {AMSF} (ot) tower collapse Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 16:03:34 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) From: "Charles Penry" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=376233 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa5vhu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Early reports from yesterday... > Links to the story below: > > http://www.kotatv.com/localnews/story.asp?ID=12449 > http://www.kneb.com http://www.chadrad.com Charles -----Original Message----- From: Christopher Cuff [mailto:ccuff@in4web.com] Sent: Thursday, September 26, 2002 3:41 PM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} (ot) tower collapse I just read that a nearly 2000' TV tower collapsed in Nebraska, killing 2 engineers. Has anyone heard anything? What stations? They were apparently "strengthening the tower for digital TV" when it happened. Chris Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Sep 26 14:24:38 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 26 Sep 2002 21:24:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 23179 invoked from network); 26 Sep 2002 21:24:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Sep 2002 21:24:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d09.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.41) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Sep 2002 21:24:34 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d09.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.a1.2e029846 (16781) for ; Thu, 26 Sep 2002 17:24:22 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 17:24:21 EDT Subject: Re: {AMSF} (ot) tower collapse To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp news stories from: http://www.kotatv.com/localnews/story.asp?ID=12449 Television Transmission Tower Collapses in Nebraska 9/24/2002 4:22:02 PM Carl Agnelly A television tower in Nebraska collapsed late this morning, killing two people. The tower broadcasts for KDUH, a sister station of KOTA. A five-person crew was working on the tower site when it fell just before noon. The two workers killed were on the tower at the time. People on the scene say only about 50 feet of the 2,000 foot tower remains standing. The cause of the collapse is unknown. Winds were reportedly light. A nearby farmer who saw the tower fall called paramedics. The tower is located on a field near Hemingford, Nebraska. It was used to transmit KDUH throughout western Nebraska. The Occupational Safety and Health Administration has been called to investigate. ============================================================ http://www.kotatv.com/localnews/story.asp?ID=12464 2 killed in tower collapse identified 9/26/2002 9:17:16 AM KOTA The two men who were killed in the collapse of KDUH's transmission tower were identified today. 59-year-old Lawrence Sukalec and 25-year-old Daniel Goff, both of Illinois were on the tower at the time it collapsed. Meanwhile, the other three people who were injured were all released from the hospital today. Ron Badmilk and Bill Vocu are now home in Scottbluff. Tower worker Amber Odel is on her way back home to illinois. The Occupational Health and Safety Administration has sent out a team from its Omaha field office to conduct an investigation into the safety conditions at the time of the collapse. ============================================================== It was the last Dresser tower of its style left standing and the company that built those types of towers has long gone out of business. Just goes to show that no matter what you do..some towers will not be able to handle the extra weight load...something is going to give. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5..., Ray Communications Radio Network Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:MidAtlanticEngineeringService@yahoo.com http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereoradio-subcribe@topica.com amstereo-subcribe@topica.com amstereoradio-subscribe@yahoogroups.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ WARNING TO UNSOLICITED SPAMMERS !!! Pursuant to U.S. Code, title 47, Chapter 5, Subchapter II, "Any and all nonsolicited E-mail (SPAM) sent to this address is subject to a download and archival fee of 500 U.S."!! E-mailing denotes acceptance of these terms." Your message (if actually mailed) is in violation of the Federal Telephone Consumer Protection Act of 1991, and Collateral Code of Federal Regulations (47 CFR 64.1200). The TCPA allows a private right of action against the sender of unsolicited advertising. The recipient can sue for $500, or actualdamages (whichever is greater). ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------- Osama bin Laden can kiss my royal white American behind! From amstereoguy@hotmail.com Thu Sep 26 15:03:22 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereoguy@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 26 Sep 2002 22:03:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 81899 invoked from network); 26 Sep 2002 22:03:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Sep 2002 22:03:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (207.68.165.91) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Sep 2002 22:03:21 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 26 Sep 2002 15:03:20 -0700 Received: from 208.20.8.98 by sea2fd.sea2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Thu, 26 Sep 2002 22:03:20 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Heathkit PT-1 Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 18:03:20 -0400 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 26 Sep 2002 22:03:20.0972 (UTC) FILETIME=[86C454C0:01C265A8] From: "Chris Cuff" X-Originating-IP: [208.20.8.98] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37866059 Phil, it should work.. BUT- better check the alignment- that tuner was a kick-arse tuner, and could pull in Mars! My guess, is that it was never aligned. I worked at Heathkit center in AK in 1975, and most all kits brought in for "defects" were indeed never properly aligned. I have the DeWald tuner from 1959 with the AM Stereo output jack- it works GREAT! Any decoder has to be before the detector diodes, as the diodes strip the pilot info as well as most of the I channel afterwards. I also got in Rochester this year an Eico am only high fidelity tube tuner, with a decoder output.. haven't fooled with that one yet. I want to build a tube decoder for it. Koji has built an all tube AM Stereo tuner, which I hope to see someday. Chris _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx From penry@nortelnetworks.com Thu Sep 26 15:19:45 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: penry@nortelnetworks.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 26 Sep 2002 22:19:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 33818 invoked from network); 26 Sep 2002 22:19:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Sep 2002 22:19:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com) (47.103.122.112) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Sep 2002 22:19:45 -0000 Received: from zrc2c011.us.nortel.com (zrc2c011.us.nortel.com [47.103.120.51]) by zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id g8QMJvx22741 for ; Thu, 26 Sep 2002 17:19:57 -0500 (CDT) Received: by zrc2c011.us.nortel.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Thu, 26 Sep 2002 17:19:44 -0500 Message-ID: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A56079740409A96A@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: {AMSF} (ot) tower collapse Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 17:19:40 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) From: "Charles Penry" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=376233 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa5vhu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Bob said: ============================================================== It was the last Dresser tower of its style left standing and the company that built those types of towers has long gone out of business. Just goes to show that no matter what you do..some towers will not be able to handle the extra weight load...something is going to give. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering ----------------------------------------------------------- Bob and group, Dresser is a dirty word in my vocabulary. Three stories, the last story about their towers. 1. I had Dresser as a customer in Beaumont Texas that had 10 talkies. They were under a service contract with my company and each one of their talkies needed to be repaired about every three months. My other customers that used this model had perhaps one failure every couple of years per talkie. I was visiting the plant once and was discussing with the plant manager why the talkies were failing so much and he said that they took very good care of them and that particular model must be "no good". At that very moment we walked by one of the workers that was trying to assemble some type of steel gadget. We both watched as he tried to reach his hammer to drive a bolt through a hole. The hammer was just out of reach so he reached for his belt and grabbed his talkie and banged the bolt in. When he had finished and put his talkie back on his belt, I walked up to him and asked him if his radio was working and he said "yeah, works fine". I asked to see it and noticed that it did not work any more. I told the plant manager that as of that moment their service contract was cancelled and that they would be on a time & materials basis only. He sheepishly said "OK, I understand". 2. Dresser made escape modules for off-shore drilling platforms that resembled flying saucers. The crew would jump in it, seal the hatch, and it would drop into the ocean where they would wait for a rescue. One night an emergency evacuation was made on a platform. The crew loaded into the Dresser escape module and splashed into a calm ocean, whereupon the escape module promptly rolled over and sank to the bottom. There were no survivors. The oil companies then tested all the Dresser escape modules on their platforms, some with sandbags to simulate passenger loading and some without sandbags. Each one promptly rolled over and sank to the bottom of the ocean. It seems that the first time one was used in an emergency was actually the first time one was EVER used, as in the first time one was ever launched from a platform. Can you say-never tested? Dresser refunded the oil companies money. 3. There are two Dresser 2,000 foot towers serving Shreveport, Louisiana. The towers are about 4,000 feet from each other on the same small hill and are identical except one has an elevator and the other does not. The one with the elevator fell one night in a storm. No one was injured. The neighbors said that the wind was really blowing hard; the National Weather Service said they did not think there was a tornado. The tower was insured so the TV station had Dresser replaced it. Between the time that the original tower was built and the replacement was built, the Dresser Tower Company got a computer and a tower structural program. When the new tower was built it had a lot more steel on it in the form of more and larger cross braces. Dresser then immediately put a lot more steel on the adjacent tower, and I heard rumors that they went around the country putting more steel on all their big towers, all at no charge! When they finished, they immediately went out of the tower business. The rumor I heard was that someone had missed a decimal point on their slide-rule calculations. Years ago, I spent a beautiful day on the 1500 foot platform of the re-built tower installing a repeater and antenna for the TV station's two way system. You could still see twisted pieces of the old tower in the woods below. Creepy. Dresser? I'll pass. Charles [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From dav259@csiro.au Thu Sep 26 16:16:18 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 26 Sep 2002 23:16:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 48255 invoked from network); 26 Sep 2002 23:16:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Sep 2002 23:16:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Sep 2002 23:16:14 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8QNGCc00657 for ; Fri, 27 Sep 2002 09:16:13 +1000 (EST) Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2002 09:16:12 +1000 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: amstereoforum Subject: RE: Interesting web sites (fwd) Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public The Herald Sun Guide recently started publishing half a dozen or so interesting media related web sites each week. Looks as if ours may finally get several more visits from Melburnians. Ian ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2002 09:04:07 +1000 From: "Bullard, David" To: 'Ian Davidson' Subject: RE: Interesting web sites Thanks, mate ... will include it in a coming issue. Cheers Dave -----Original Message----- From: Ian Davidson [mailto:dav259@csiro.au] Sent: Thursday, 26 September 2002 18:32 To: bullardd@heraldsun.com.au Subject: Interesting web sites Hi Dave As Magic 693, Sport 927, 3AK, 3AW, and 3MP are all currently broadcasting in AM stereo the following site would be of interest to your Guide readers who would like to hear them in hi-fi stereo. http://www.amstereoradio.com cheers Ian ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Ian Davidson _--_|\ tel (H) 03 9534 8786 41 Smith Street / \ tel (W) 03 9545 8717 St. Kilda Beach Vic 3182 \_.--.*/ mobile: 0421 500 720 Australia v ian.davidson@csiro.au ----------------------------------------------------------------------- From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Thu Sep 26 20:52:06 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 27 Sep 2002 03:52:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 34195 invoked from network); 27 Sep 2002 03:52:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Sep 2002 03:52:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14204.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.146) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Sep 2002 03:52:05 -0000 Message-ID: <20020927035205.64316.qmail@web14204.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.127.54.199] by web14204.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 26 Sep 2002 20:52:05 PDT Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 20:52:05 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Hurricane/Tropical Storm DX To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: John Pavlica X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio Current tropical storm Isodore is making for some of the best DX'ing I've had in 15 years. Tonight is the first time EVER, that I've received 920 AM Stereo WOKY from Central Ohio up here. Also, 1540 is coming booming in Stereo tonight. 740 Toronto sounds like a local, but isn't stereo - we've got to give these guys the equipment to change that. Also, CHUM is booming too, but in MONO - what's up with that? Good luck with your DX BEFORE the storm arrives. __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? New DSL Internet Access from SBC & Yahoo! http://sbc.yahoo.com From stodd@sherbtel.net Thu Sep 26 20:58:28 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 27 Sep 2002 03:58:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 49713 invoked from network); 27 Sep 2002 03:58:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Sep 2002 03:58:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Sep 2002 03:58:27 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-89-96.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.96]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g8R3riQX026538 for ; Thu, 26 Sep 2002 22:53:46 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <007101c265da$630bf880$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A56079740409A96A@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} (ot) tower collapse Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 23:00:13 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude A Dresser tower went down in this area about 30 years ago. Doesn't surprise me they're out of business. ST PS- if you haven't visited this site, it's for an AMS station (and they're proud to proclaim it!) http://www.chadrad.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Charles Penry" To: Sent: Thursday, September 26, 2002 5:19 PM Subject: RE: {AMSF} (ot) tower collapse > Bob said: > ============================================================== > It was the last Dresser tower of its style left standing and the company > that built those types of towers has long gone out of business. > Just goes to show that no matter what you do..some towers will not be able > to handle the extra weight load...something is going to give. > > Bob Carter > Operations/Engineering > > ----------------------------------------------------------- > > > Bob and group, > Dresser is a dirty word in my vocabulary. > > Three stories, the last story about their towers. > > 1. I had Dresser as a customer in Beaumont Texas that had 10 talkies. They > were under a service contract with my company and each one of their talkies > needed to be repaired about every three months. My other customers that > used this model had perhaps one failure every couple of years per talkie. I > was visiting the plant once and was discussing with the plant manager why > the talkies were failing so much and he said that they took very good care > of them and that particular model must be "no good". At that very moment we > walked by one of the workers that was trying to assemble some type of steel > gadget. We both watched as he tried to reach his hammer to drive a bolt > through a hole. The hammer was just out of reach so he reached for his belt > and grabbed his talkie and banged the bolt in. When he had finished and put > his talkie back on his belt, I walked up to him and asked him if his radio > was working and he said "yeah, works fine". I asked to see it and noticed > that it did not work any more. I told the plant manager that as of that > moment their service contract was cancelled and that they would be on a time > & materials basis only. He sheepishly said "OK, I understand". > > 2. Dresser made escape modules for off-shore drilling platforms that > resembled flying saucers. The crew would jump in it, seal the hatch, and it > would drop into the ocean where they would wait for a rescue. One night an > emergency evacuation was made on a platform. The crew loaded into the > Dresser escape module and splashed into a calm ocean, whereupon the escape > module promptly rolled over and sank to the bottom. There were no > survivors. The oil companies then tested all the Dresser escape modules on > their platforms, some with sandbags to simulate passenger loading and some > without sandbags. Each one promptly rolled over and sank to the bottom of > the ocean. It seems that the first time one was used in an emergency was > actually the first time one was EVER used, as in the first time one was ever > launched from a platform. Can you say-never tested? Dresser refunded the > oil companies money. > > 3. There are two Dresser 2,000 foot towers serving Shreveport, Louisiana. > The towers are about 4,000 feet from each other on the same small hill and > are identical except one has an elevator and the other does not. The one > with the elevator fell one night in a storm. No one was injured. The > neighbors said that the wind was really blowing hard; the National Weather > Service said they did not think there was a tornado. The tower was insured > so the TV station had Dresser replaced it. Between the time that the > original tower was built and the replacement was built, the Dresser Tower > Company got a computer and a tower structural program. When the new tower > was built it had a lot more steel on it in the form of more and larger cross > braces. Dresser then immediately put a lot more steel on the adjacent > tower, and I heard rumors that they went around the country putting more > steel on all their big towers, all at no charge! When they finished, they > immediately went out of the tower business. The rumor I heard was that > someone had missed a decimal point on their slide-rule calculations. Years > ago, I spent a beautiful day on the 1500 foot platform of the re-built tower > installing a repeater and antenna for the TV station's two way system. You > could still see twisted pieces of the old tower in the woods below. Creepy. > > Dresser? I'll pass. > > > Charles > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > From stodd@sherbtel.net Thu Sep 26 21:03:22 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 27 Sep 2002 04:03:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 83357 invoked from network); 27 Sep 2002 04:02:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Sep 2002 04:02:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Sep 2002 04:02:31 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-89-96.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.96]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g8R3voQX027201 for ; Thu, 26 Sep 2002 22:57:51 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <00a001c265da$f53a26a0$d3a9fea9@me> To: Subject: theftlock Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2002 23:04:18 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit On a somewhat tangential topic, just how does Theftlock work? I know what it is; I just want to know how it works, and how it can be worked around. ST [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From ccuff@in4web.com Fri Sep 27 00:23:49 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 27 Sep 2002 07:23:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 47087 invoked from network); 27 Sep 2002 07:23:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Sep 2002 07:23:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Sep 2002 07:23:49 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.44]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Fri, 27 Sep 2002 03:21:04 -0400 Message-ID: <003801c265f6$a79c6540$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: <00a001c265da$f53a26a0$d3a9fea9@me> Subject: Re: {AMSF} theftlock Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2002 03:22:35 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 On my radio, it cannot be worked around - I should say that no one will TELL me how to work around it- It reads the VIN # from the car's computer- if it does not match, or is not there, it goes into shutdown and can only be revived by the dealer. The older theftlock radios could be set for "No theftlock" so you could do anything with them. CC ----- Original Message ----- From: Scott Todd To: Sent: Friday, September 27, 2002 12:04 AM Subject: {AMSF} theftlock > On a somewhat tangential topic, just how does Theftlock work? I know what it is; I just want to know how it works, and how it can be worked around. > > ST From dav259@csiro.au Fri Sep 27 02:38:04 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 27 Sep 2002 09:38:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 23291 invoked from network); 27 Sep 2002 09:38:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Sep 2002 09:38:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Sep 2002 09:38:03 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8R9bwc03811; Fri, 27 Sep 2002 19:37:58 +1000 (EST) Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2002 19:37:58 +1000 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: AM Stereo Experience Cc: amstereoforum Subject: digital radio Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public Dennis - I should be ashamed but it was 3MP-Dave from the UK who directed me to this Radio Australia site with several broadcasts available talking about the future and digital radio. Why he sometimes calls himself 3MP-Dave is still a mystery to me - even after asking him. He just says he loves getting anything from Easy Music 3MP. Anyway the site is ... http://www.abc.net.au/ra/feedback/ ... and there are several discussions about IBOC from the United States, and the two contenders from Europe - Eureka DAB, and DRM - Digital Radio Mondiale. After listening to all this I'm convinced we will natuarally, over time, get DRM here for long range broadcasts. It sounds fabulous. But what really surprised me was that we too may get IBOC. They came here and gave a display at the annual ABA (read FCC) conference. It possibly was rigged - but they are interested in getting it started in Oz. Let's face it - if it worked, it would be the easiest way to go. I always thought we'd get Eureka DAB - but learning what I did, I have to admit it probably only has been successful in the UK as it is so geographically small. I don't think it would work in Oz - except perhaps in a few capital cities. We may indeed end up with DAB in several capital cities and DRM everywhere else. And that may well work here. Thereagain - after hearing what the cost of a new radio would be - US$400 to start with - IBOC does have a genuine chance of success here - if only it worked. They said the average Oz household has between five and nine radios. If only IBOC worked it would be the obvious solution. Anyway Dennis - I think you've said before that you do listen to DRM broadcasts. It was all over my head - but now it isn't. How good is DRM? And if it is that good (it seems to me that it is) why couldn't it be used locally? They (the French or German man) said if they put a transmitter up equally between Melbourne and Sydney we could have countless quality options overnight. But - deep down where I live - I'd prefer our radio to be live and local as for the most part it is now. And for now I'm still on the AM stereo bandwagon. They do say in the broadcasts that almost nothing could quite replace AM radio which after 80 years has reached a standard of excellence. Something that simply couldn't be thrown away overnight. Praise the Lord! _________________ To subscribe to Dennis' list ... send a message to: amstereo@bellsouth.net In the Subject line, put the word "subscribe" (minus quotes) Then reply to the confirmation email. _________________ Digital Davo Downunder [who still is a bit confused] - AM STEREO FOREVER! - From mikeryan@tpg.com.au Fri Sep 27 04:18:18 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: mikeryan@tpg.com.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 27 Sep 2002 11:18:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 27502 invoked from network); 27 Sep 2002 11:18:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Sep 2002 11:18:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail1.tpgi.com.au) (203.12.160.57) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Sep 2002 11:18:17 -0000 Received: from server (syd-ts8-2600-056.tpgi.com.au [203.213.60.56]) by mail1.tpgi.com.au (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id g8RBIEm10198 for ; Fri, 27 Sep 2002 21:18:14 +1000 To: "Amstereoforum@Yahoogroups. Com" Subject: Digital Radio in the UK on BBC's Website Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2002 21:17:01 +1000 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Mike Ryan" Reply-To: X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7573532 X-Yahoo-Profile: mike111ryan Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi All, I thought you may be interested in the BBC=92s take on Digital Radio. http://www.bbc.co.uk/digitalradio/good_sound.shtml Regards=85Mike [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk Fri Sep 27 06:38:03 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 27 Sep 2002 13:38:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 80605 invoked from network); 27 Sep 2002 13:38:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Sep 2002 13:38:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.87) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Sep 2002 13:38:03 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.138] by n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Sep 2002 13:38:02 -0000 Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2002 13:38:00 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Digital Radio in the UK on BBC's Website Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 783 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Dave" X-Originating-IP: 217.148.40.131 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113985069 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereofan --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Mike Ryan" wrote: > Hi All, >=20 > I thought you may be interested in the BBC's take on Digital Radio. >=20 > http://www.bbc.co.uk/digitalradio/good_sound.shtml >=20 >=20 > Regards=85Mike >=20 >=20 This is your stadard DAB report you will find anywhere and looks=20 great in prnt though in reality Unfortunatly the UK is treating DAB=20 very badly by craming as many stations as they can in a multiplex and=20 so by doing so are sacrificing sound quality.=20 Now some stations are broadcasting in mono and or using lower bit=20 rates also going below 128kbs ie 96kb or even 60kbs I think I read=20 somewhere for speech stations. Germany is the oposite though with=20 just about all stations broadcasting at 192kb with just a very few=20 dropping down to 128kb... From amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk Fri Sep 27 06:46:08 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 27 Sep 2002 13:46:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 56173 invoked from network); 27 Sep 2002 13:46:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Sep 2002 13:46:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Sep 2002 13:46:08 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.141] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Sep 2002 13:46:08 -0000 Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2002 13:46:07 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: TV Stereo (Even further OT!) Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 486 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Dave" X-Originating-IP: 217.148.40.131 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113985069 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereofan --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Tony" wrote: > I notice that the S.A.P. (2nd Audio Programming) comes in along with > the primary (stereo) audio of the TV stations...even during skip > season...That's when I get TV stations fromBaltimore, MD, > Washington, D.C., N.Y.C., etc., & I can also decode their S.A.P. > audio as well. > I'm in the UK. What do you mean when you say 'I can also decode their S.A.P. audio as well" ? Sounds like an extra stereo feed ? From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Sep 27 06:56:52 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 27 Sep 2002 13:56:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 28630 invoked from network); 27 Sep 2002 13:56:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Sep 2002 13:56:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Sep 2002 13:56:51 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-88-120.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.120]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g8RDq9QX006593 for ; Fri, 27 Sep 2002 08:52:10 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <002f01c2662d$fd50fd20$d3a9fea9@me> To: Subject: closed circuit to Neal Newman Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2002 08:58:40 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Neal, Please contact me off list. I know of a guy that has an old transmitter or two that lives more or less in your neck of the woods. Scott Todd N0BST stodd@sherbtel.net [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From amfmdx@fastq.com Fri Sep 27 06:59:18 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 27 Sep 2002 13:59:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 52751 invoked from network); 27 Sep 2002 13:59:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Sep 2002 13:59:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Sep 2002 13:59:17 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt ([209.63.214.237]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id g8RDxFh84507 for ; Fri, 27 Sep 2002 06:59:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <013901c2662d$ee473240$6df9bed8@kredding430cdt> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: TV Stereo (Even further OT!) Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2002 06:58:15 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > I'm in the UK. What do you mean when you say 'I can also decode their > S.A.P. audio as well" ? Sounds like an extra stereo feed ? Secondary Audio Programming There is an embedded signal in the audio on many TV stations. Some carry Spanish translations and dubbings, some the BBC, some World Radio Network, they have all kinds of stuff in there. Fox Sports programs have no announcers and nothing but the sounds of the game and crowds at the games. Generally SAP is mono. Its kind of like SCS signals embedded in an FM transmission. Kevin From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Sep 27 08:36:06 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 27 Sep 2002 15:36:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 24443 invoked from network); 27 Sep 2002 15:36:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Sep 2002 15:36:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.88) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Sep 2002 15:36:05 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.191] by n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Sep 2002 15:36:05 -0000 Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2002 15:36:01 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Digital Radio in the UK on BBC's Website Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 900 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Now some stations are broadcasting in mono and or using lower > bit rates also going below 128kbs ie 96kb or even 60kbs I > think I read somewhere for speech stations. Indeed... take a look in the newsgroup "alt.radio.digital" and you'll find numerously constant complaints about the poor sound quality of DAB in the UK. There are web sites where you can download "captures" of DAB's MP2 data stream to listen to on your computer, and even at 192 kbps the sound quality is not perfect. One reason for this is that DAB uses a 48 kHz sampling rate -- actually greater than the 44.1 kHz CD standard -- so it "wastes" a lot of the data stream on trying to encode the extreme high audio frequencies (above 15 kHz) which are not effective for broadcast use anyway. Digital audio does have its advantages, but time and time again I think analog will always be the best choice for radio broadcasting. From dav259@csiro.au Sat Sep 28 01:49:07 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 28 Sep 2002 08:49:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 46294 invoked from network); 28 Sep 2002 08:49:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Sep 2002 08:49:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Sep 2002 08:49:05 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8S8n4c15899 for ; Sat, 28 Sep 2002 18:49:04 +1000 (EST) Date: Sat, 28 Sep 2002 18:49:04 +1000 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: amstereoforum Subject: OT - Defeat Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public Hey Johnny Electron in Toledo We - the Collingwood Magpies - just lost the Grand Final to the Brisbane Lions. But we walk proud and tall. Unfortunately there is no second prize. God bless the Toledo Mudhens! As they say in the classics - there is always next year. And Johnny - we all know your name is John Pavlica. Don't cave in to stupid pressure. You are one of the great movers and shakers on this list. Let the legend that is Johnny Electron live! sincerely Ian in ((( AM Stereo ))) From rwagoner@cox.net Sat Sep 28 17:54:44 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner@cox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 29 Sep 2002 00:54:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 54125 invoked from network); 29 Sep 2002 00:54:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Sep 2002 00:54:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.89) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Sep 2002 00:54:44 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.168] by n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 29 Sep 2002 00:54:43 -0000 Date: Sun, 29 Sep 2002 00:54:43 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: theftlock Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <003801c265f6$a79c6540$0101a8c0@pavilion> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 699 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Richard Wagoner" X-Originating-IP: 68.4.33.253 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=96123889 X-Yahoo-Profile: richardalanwagoner Interesting. On my '99 Silverado and my brother's '02 Corvette, Theftlock is the old system of setting codes yourself; the VIN number has nothing to do with it. Once you set it, the little light near the volume control flashes. I have never heard of a VIN number version. --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Christopher Cuff" wrote: > On my radio, it cannot be worked around - I should say that no one will TELL > me how to work around it- It reads the VIN # from the car's computer- if it > does not match, or is not there, it goes into shutdown and can only be > revived by the dealer. > The older theftlock radios could be set for "No theftlock" so you could do > anything with them. > CC From rwagoner@cox.net Sat Sep 28 17:58:06 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner@cox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 29 Sep 2002 00:58:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 66675 invoked from network); 29 Sep 2002 00:57:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Sep 2002 00:57:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.84) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Sep 2002 00:57:28 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.177] by n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 29 Sep 2002 00:57:28 -0000 Date: Sun, 29 Sep 2002 00:57:26 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: KDIS Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 231 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Richard Wagoner" X-Originating-IP: 68.4.33.253 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=96123889 X-Yahoo-Profile: richardalanwagoner I have unofficial word that KDIS will remain stereo when it moves to 1110 in Los Angeles; that means ESPN radio might turn off the stereo at 710 or they might run the pilot. I don't think ESPN radio has any stereo source material. From KC4QLP@aol.com Sat Sep 28 18:44:40 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 29 Sep 2002 01:44:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 92070 invoked from network); 29 Sep 2002 01:44:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Sep 2002 01:44:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r08.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.104) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Sep 2002 01:44:39 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.c9.2920ba79 (3842) for ; Sat, 28 Sep 2002 21:44:23 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: Date: Sat, 28 Sep 2002 21:44:23 EDT Subject: Re: {AMSF} KDIS To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 9/28/02 8:59:08 PM Eastern Daylight Time, rwagoner@cox.net writes: << I have unofficial word that KDIS will remain stereo when it moves to 1110 in Los Angeles; that means ESPN radio might turn off the stereo at 710 or they might run the pilot. I don't think ESPN radio has any stereo source material. >> ESPN radio network is pretty much like the rest of the talk networks ....all mono all the time Bob Carter Operations/Engineering WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5..., Ray Communications Radio Network Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:MidAtlanticEngineeringService@yahoo.com http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereoradio-subcribe@topica.com amstereo-subcribe@topica.com amstereoradio-subscribe@yahoogroups.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ WARNING TO UNSOLICITED SPAMMERS !!! Pursuant to U.S. Code, title 47, Chapter 5, Subchapter II, "Any and all nonsolicited E-mail (SPAM) sent to this address is subject to a download and archival fee of 500 U.S."!! E-mailing denotes acceptance of these terms." Your message (if actually mailed) is in violation of the Federal Telephone Consumer Protection Act of 1991, and Collateral Code of Federal Regulations (47 CFR 64.1200). The TCPA allows a private right of action against the sender of unsolicited advertising. The recipient can sue for $500, or actualdamages (whichever is greater). ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------- Osama bin Laden can kiss my royal white American behind! From mwradio@gmx.net Sat Sep 28 22:14:19 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: mwradio@gmx.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 29 Sep 2002 05:14:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 53524 invoked from network); 29 Sep 2002 05:14:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Sep 2002 05:14:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO smtp2.suscom.net) (64.78.119.252) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Sep 2002 05:14:17 -0000 Received: from localhost (smtp.suscom.net [64.78.119.252]) by smtp2.suscom.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id B414E211A3 for ; Sun, 29 Sep 2002 01:13:47 -0400 (EDT) Received: from stratus (ip192.65.susc.suscom.net [64.78.65.192]) by smtp2.suscom.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 4756F211A0 for ; Sun, 29 Sep 2002 01:13:47 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <00a701c26776$f4784600$c0414e40@stratus> To: Subject: Another NOS SRF-42 on ebay Date: Sun, 29 Sep 2002 01:13:32 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-Virus-Scanned: by AMaViS new-20020517 From: "Joe Esposito" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=93604673 X-Yahoo-Profile: espositojm Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I am not the seller but if anyone is interested there is a "new" SRF-42 on ebay for a "Buy IT Now" of $55.00. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1384850616 Joe E. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From ccuff@in4web.com Sun Sep 29 01:31:27 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 29 Sep 2002 08:31:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 4250 invoked from network); 29 Sep 2002 08:31:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Sep 2002 08:31:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Sep 2002 08:31:26 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.50]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Sun, 29 Sep 2002 04:28:50 -0400 Message-ID: <007b01c26792$6eff33a0$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: theftlock Date: Sun, 29 Sep 2002 04:30:13 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 Yes, the '99 was the old system, and the 'Vette uses a "carry over" radio till 2003. Carry-over radios were used in GMC Jimmies too- till '96, which was why they had AM stereo and nothing else in GM except Caddy had it, as the Caddy DeVille radio was a carry over model from '94 even as new as 2000! I did have the pleasure of hearing a radio in a 98 Caterra- a new design, which featured AM Stereo. A GREAT radio! CC ----- Original Message ----- From: Richard Wagoner From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Sun Sep 29 14:06:24 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 29 Sep 2002 21:06:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 10617 invoked from network); 29 Sep 2002 21:06:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Sep 2002 21:06:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14204.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.146) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Sep 2002 21:06:23 -0000 Message-ID: <20020929210623.2998.qmail@web14204.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.127.54.199] by web14204.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 29 Sep 2002 14:06:23 PDT Date: Sun, 29 Sep 2002 14:06:23 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Can we help out AM 740? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: John Pavlica X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio Any suggestions if we can somehow help out AM 740 Toronto add stereo AM to their musical programming? I do believe that their tower is diplexed, so does that mean reduced bandwidth or AMS quality? __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? New DSL Internet Access from SBC & Yahoo! http://sbc.yahoo.com From stodd@sherbtel.net Sun Sep 29 15:25:36 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 29 Sep 2002 22:25:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 63650 invoked from network); 29 Sep 2002 22:25:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Sep 2002 22:25:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Sep 2002 22:25:34 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-88-118.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.118]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g8TMKkQX009824 for ; Sun, 29 Sep 2002 17:20:48 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <000e01c26807$670d9b80$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: <20020929210623.2998.qmail@web14204.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Can we help out AM 740? Date: Sun, 29 Sep 2002 17:27:29 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Diplexing makes it harder, but certainly not impossible. IIRC they diplex with CJBC on 860? Crawford has a 1220/1340 diplex in the Denver area with 1220 being stereo. They don't own 1340, but knowing Cris Alexander, that one could be made stereo as well. What we'd have to find out is what items they have already and then make a list of what's still needed. Obviously a stereo generator and stereo mod mon. and stereo audio processing. Any chance you can find out for us? ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Pavlica" > Any suggestions if we can somehow help out AM 740 Toronto add stereo AM to > their musical programming? I do believe that their tower is diplexed, so does > that mean reduced bandwidth or AMS quality? From ccuff@in4web.com Sun Sep 29 15:31:19 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 29 Sep 2002 22:31:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 73935 invoked from network); 29 Sep 2002 22:31:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Sep 2002 22:31:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Sep 2002 22:31:18 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.45]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Sun, 29 Sep 2002 18:28:45 -0400 Message-ID: <001901c26807$c2be33e0$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: <20020929210623.2998.qmail@web14204.mail.yahoo.com> <000e01c26807$670d9b80$d3a9fea9@me> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Can we help out AM 740? Date: Sun, 29 Sep 2002 18:30:04 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 I did call them a year ago, and they have no stereo equipment. There seemed to be no interest on their part to persue it, saying it was not economically possible. cc ----- Original Message ----- From: Scott Todd From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Sep 29 16:38:40 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 29 Sep 2002 23:38:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 44661 invoked from network); 29 Sep 2002 23:38:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Sep 2002 23:38:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.87) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Sep 2002 23:38:40 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.137] by n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 29 Sep 2002 23:38:40 -0000 Date: Sun, 29 Sep 2002 23:38:40 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Can we help out AM 740? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <000e01c26807$670d9b80$d3a9fea9@me> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 948 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.89.143 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Diplexing makes it harder, but certainly not impossible. The USA's first Expanded Band station, 1660 WJDM in Elizabeth, NJ, was diplexed with its parent station 1530 WJDM for a while. Both broadcast in AM Stereo using B.E. transmitters, and both sounded great. Then, 1660 decided to have New York City as its target listening area, and moved to a diplex with 1380 WKDM, where 1380 was in Stereo and 1660 was in mono. In case you are keeping track, I believe 1660 has moved to yet *another* transmitter site (now with "Jersey City" as their COL), with the USA's first 9 kW directional nighttime signal from an Expanded Band station. The aftermath of all this is that 1660 (now WWRU) is once again in Stereo, although with 100% mono "Radio Unica" as its programming; 1530 WJDM is *still* on the air, although now in mono; and 1380 is WLXE, also in mono, even after a switch from Spanish News to a "Regional Mexican" music format. From dav259@csiro.au Sun Sep 29 17:38:30 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 30 Sep 2002 00:38:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 19557 invoked from network); 30 Sep 2002 00:38:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Sep 2002 00:38:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Sep 2002 00:38:29 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8U0cSc19808 for ; Mon, 30 Sep 2002 10:38:28 +1000 (EST) Date: Mon, 30 Sep 2002 10:38:28 +1000 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: amstereoforum Subject: KDIS 710- Stereo's going out on 1/1/2003 (fwd) Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public from Darwin (I've responded - it take five minutes) ---------- Forwarded message ---------- If you guys have not heard yet, KDIS 710 is swapping frequencies with KSPN 1110. As 1110 has removed all of their stereo equipment, KDIS will be moving into a mono transmitter facility, and ESPN likes to shut off stereo wherever they go. We all should email Norm Avery, CE of KABC/KDIS and urge him to relocate the C-QuAM exciter and stereo STL equipment to the 1110 facility in Pasadena, and not just leave it for ESPN to remove and auction off. Go to http://www.kabc.com/contactus.asp choose "KABC Administration", and fill out the form with your name and information. Then fill out the comments box, address it to Norm Avery, CE KDIS 710/ KABC790, and write your comments urging him to relocate the stereo equipment to the 1110 transmitter plant. We should do this NOW, before we lose an all-music 50 kW AM stereo station in southern California. Yeah, its mainly aimed at kids, but still, there is a lot of adult contemporary/ top-40 stuff, too, and is one of the strongest AM stereo signals in this part of the country feeding all-stereo programming into the transmitter. Maybe at least 1110 can once again go stereo (lose one-gain one)- better than a lose-lose scenario if ESPN calls the shots. -Darwin S.CA From groucho@skyweb.net Sun Sep 29 17:58:18 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 30 Sep 2002 00:58:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 87327 invoked from network); 30 Sep 2002 00:58:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Sep 2002 00:58:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Sep 2002 00:58:17 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g8U0xrpu077997 for ; Sun, 29 Sep 2002 20:59:53 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3D97A0DE.1EF5269@skyweb.net> Date: Sun, 29 Sep 2002 20:54:54 -0400 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Can we help out AM 740? References: <20020929210623.2998.qmail@web14204.mail.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Hello John My station is Diplexed and I'm running full stereo. no problems here Neal CE-WTTM John Pavlica wrote: > Any suggestions if we can somehow help out AM 740 Toronto add stereo AM to > their musical programming? I do believe that their tower is diplexed, so does > that mean reduced bandwidth or AMS quality? > > __________________________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > New DSL Internet Access from SBC & Yahoo! > http://sbc.yahoo.com > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From dav259@csiro.au Mon Sep 30 01:57:02 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 30 Sep 2002 08:57:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 90321 invoked from network); 30 Sep 2002 08:57:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Sep 2002 08:57:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Sep 2002 08:57:00 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g8U8uxc16007; Mon, 30 Sep 2002 18:56:59 +1000 (EST) Date: Mon, 30 Sep 2002 18:56:59 +1000 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: amstereoforum Cc: Kit Subject: Kit - where are you? Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public Hey Kit We miss your reports from Upper Arlington, OH - or wherever you are - possibly back near the Rockies. Has anyone heard from Kit? It's been too long. Time to sign in with good or bad news. Last time I saw your name on screen Kit was in the FCC IBOC debacle. Please say something. We miss your oooomph! Ian Melbourne From michaelj@vcn.com Mon Sep 30 07:53:05 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 30 Sep 2002 14:53:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 28729 invoked from network); 30 Sep 2002 14:53:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Sep 2002 14:53:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m1-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.31) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Sep 2002 14:53:03 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m1-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Mon, 30 Sep 2002 08:53:02 -0600 Message-ID: <011501c26891$073bc760$0701010a@keva> To: Subject: distortion Date: Mon, 30 Sep 2002 08:52:40 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi all Wanted to ask about something. Yes....another one of those "engineering type" questions. This is something that has been going on with our AM STEREO exciter here at KEVA. I don't know if it's an easy fix....and no, I don't have an oscilliscope to check stuff. I'm just wondering if anyone else has had the same problem and how you've fixed it. Separation is very good. Although when there is something on just one channel, there appears to be a distorted image of it on the other side. For instance......I'll drop one channel of the audio chain. If I drop the left channel for instance.....then I hear audio only on the right. But in the left I hear kind of a "static image" of what's in the right. With most audio programming....it's pretty clean. But the more separation there is....such as an old country song that has a drum in one channel and a guitar in the other.....you can hear it. We've also got a few ads that have some cool effects on them where a voice will only be in one channel and move to the other or whatever. And there too it shows. When something goes to one side only.....you can hear the distortion on the other side. This happens with either channel....left or right. I know sometimes we've talked about pilot level and stuff and how that can affect and add distortion. I know with KMER I had some distortion when I first put the exciter in. Turned down the pilot level and everything cleared up. But that was constant distortion.....not this "channel-based" distortion that I've got. I haven't messed with the pilot level coming out of the exciter since I put it in here. I know on the modulation monitor....it shows the pilot level as being right where it should be. So that's why I haven't touched that. Meanwhile .... any ideas??? Let me know what you'd like me to try if I can. I'd like to clean this up so when something is really separated, it'll sound clean. Thanks Michael n WYO [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From jsgil@hal-pc.org Mon Sep 30 16:37:57 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 30 Sep 2002 23:37:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 90939 invoked from network); 30 Sep 2002 23:37:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Sep 2002 23:37:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.75) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Sep 2002 23:37:55 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.251] by n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Sep 2002 23:37:55 -0000 Date: Mon, 30 Sep 2002 23:37:55 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: distortion Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <011501c26891$073bc760$0701010a@keva> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 1809 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.140 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Michael J. Richard" wrote: > Hi all Although when there is something on just one channel, there appears to be a distorted image of it on the other side. For instance......I'll drop one channel of the audio chain. If I drop the left channel for instance.....then I hear audio only on the right.=20 But in the left I hear kind of a "static image" of what's in the right. With most audio programming....it's pretty clean. But the more separation there is....such as an old country song that has a drum in one channel and a guitar in the other.....you can hear it.=20=20 I don't know if this will help but here is what I think the problem is. This probably applies mostly to the original Motorola exciters but others may be affected also. Motorola recomends limiting heavy single channel modulation to 70% of the envelope modulation for the L+R portion. This is because the=20 phase deviation can increase to 71.5=B0 at -75% single channel envelope modulation which is also the FCC limit for deviation for C-QuAM.=20 1/Cos(71.5=B0) is 3.15 and this is the instataneous gain value that the IF signal in the decoder chips will bw multiplied by. If single channel modulation increases higher where the phase deviation would go to ~84=B0 then this gain factor is 10. These high levels of gain modulation caused by large phase deviations can cause big problems for decoder chips resulting in distortion. To combat this Motorola "encouraged" the manufacturers of AMS pre-processors to include circuits to limit heavy single channel modulation to prevent the decoders from malfunctioning. I don't know what kind of pre-processor you have but I think this probably where your problem is. You may=20 need to adjust the processor if it has an adjustment for this. JSG From stodd@sherbtel.net Mon Sep 30 17:54:07 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 1 Oct 2002 00:54:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 43027 invoked from network); 1 Oct 2002 00:54:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Oct 2002 00:54:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Oct 2002 00:54:06 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-88-169.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.169]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g910nIQc009794 for ; Mon, 30 Sep 2002 19:49:19 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <001101c268e5$5353de40$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: <20020929210623.2998.qmail@web14204.mail.yahoo.com> <3D97A0DE.1EF5269@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Can we help out AM 740? Date: Mon, 30 Sep 2002 19:56:04 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Diplexing isn't the problem- it's how close the two freqs. are. The closer they are, the narrower the bandwidth of the tuned circuits. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Neal Newman" > Hello John > My station is Diplexed and I'm running full stereo. no problems here > Neal CE-WTTM From stodd@sherbtel.net Mon Sep 30 18:06:46 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 1 Oct 2002 01:06:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 19302 invoked from network); 1 Oct 2002 01:06:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Oct 2002 01:06:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Oct 2002 01:06:45 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-88-169.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.169]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g9111wQc013309 for ; Mon, 30 Sep 2002 20:01:59 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <004101c268e7$18297760$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: distortion Date: Mon, 30 Sep 2002 20:08:44 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude My thoughts exactly, you just beat me to it. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "jsgilst" > Motorola recomends limiting heavy single channel modulation to 70% of > the envelope modulation for the L+R portion. . I don't know what kind of pre-processor > you have but I think this probably where your problem is. You may > need to adjust the processor if it has an adjustment for this. > > JSG From stodd@sherbtel.net Mon Sep 30 18:09:53 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 1 Oct 2002 01:09:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 92983 invoked from network); 1 Oct 2002 01:09:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Oct 2002 01:09:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Oct 2002 01:09:53 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-88-169.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.169]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g91155Qc014254 for ; Mon, 30 Sep 2002 20:05:07 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <004701c268e7$87fe01a0$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: <20020929210623.2998.qmail@web14204.mail.yahoo.com> <000e01c26807$670d9b80$d3a9fea9@me> <001901c26807$c2be33e0$0101a8c0@pavilion> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Can we help out AM 740? Date: Mon, 30 Sep 2002 20:11:51 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Maybe if they were going with all NEW equipment it might not be, but if we could scrounge up some good USED gear for them (make sure it's working first), they may change their tune. I suspect the most expensive part would be the STL, or possibly replacing their audio processor if it happens to be the dreaded 9200. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Christopher Cuff" > I did call them a year ago, and they have no stereo equipment. There seemed > to be no interest on their part to persue it, saying it was not economically > possible. > cc From michaelj@vcn.com Mon Sep 30 18:10:43 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 1 Oct 2002 01:10:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 36404 invoked from network); 1 Oct 2002 01:10:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Oct 2002 01:10:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m1-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Oct 2002 01:10:42 -0000 Received: from michael.netdragon (vcn94.usrtc-1.evan.wy.vcn.com [209.193.86.98]) by m1-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Mon, 30 Sep 2002 19:10:41 -0600 Message-ID: <001b01c268f0$66d574a0$7000a8c0@netdragon> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: distortion Date: Mon, 30 Sep 2002 19:14:50 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Thanks JS and Bob....just got your messages. This IS indeed one of the first AMS exciters. An early model. And the processing is from CRL......the first generation of AMS processing from CRL. This includes the CRL AM Stereo Matrix Processor, and the Stereo Preparation Processor. These two are the only processors. The stereo matrix processor had modifications done to it (as specified by CRL) for the NRSC 10Khz filter compliance. I did read something in the exciter manual as well about the 70% single channel modulation limit. According to the C-Quam modulation monitor, when in single channel modes......the left and right channels at max only show probably about 40% modulation on peaks. That's it. Does this help? MJR ----- Original Message ----- From: "jsgilst" To: Sent: Monday, September 30, 2002 4:37 PM Subject: {AMSF} Re: distortion From michaelj@vcn.com Mon Sep 30 18:26:01 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 1 Oct 2002 01:26:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 8357 invoked from network); 1 Oct 2002 01:26:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Oct 2002 01:26:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m1-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Oct 2002 01:26:00 -0000 Received: from michael.netdragon (vcn94.usrtc-1.evan.wy.vcn.com [209.193.86.98]) by m1-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Mon, 30 Sep 2002 19:25:59 -0600 Message-ID: <002401c268f2$89c10d60$7000a8c0@netdragon> To: References: <004101c268e7$18297760$d3a9fea9@me> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: distortion Date: Mon, 30 Sep 2002 19:30:41 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Here's what I tried guys..... Listening on my SRF-42 walkman as I did it..... The CRL am stereo matrix processor has separate trim pots for adjusting the L+R output and L-R output. I adjusted the main L+R output down to about 90%. Using the L meter on the modulation monitor in L+R mode......it showed peaks about 90%. Then adjusted the L-R for maximum separation. Still a little distortion when something is in only one channel. I killed the audio to the right channel and did these adjustments. Yes, still a little distortion but not nearly as much. Tweaked up the L-R just a bit more.....you know...so there appears to be less separation. Yes, when there is something in just one channel you can hear a bit of it over on the other channel.....but it's not bad. And listening on headphones, you can hear it more than you can just listening on the studio monitor or in the car. In other words I think I may have decreased the separation just a touch (a db or two) but.......there is still PLENTY of separation for the human ear. I don't know for sure if AM stereo is like FM stereo where if one channel is dead it is ABSOLUTELY dead and there is nothing there whatsoever. Again......the equalization card inside this exciter has problems....it always has and I've mentioned that before. I'm beginning to think the problem lies in there somewhere. As far as I'm concerned, though, there seems to be PLENTY of separation in everything. And even when it's a song that has a drum in one channel and vocal in the other, it still sounds marvelous and separated. I'm thinking this may be the best I'm going to get out of this exciter. I don't know if there are other adjustments on the equalization card (there are LOTS of little tiny trimmer pots on the back of that card.....the manual really doesn't tell which ones are for what, though.) Anyways.....more thoughts? Bob? When you are on your McMartin....do you have absolute total and complete silence on a channel when you have one channel dead? MJR From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Sep 30 20:27:48 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 1 Oct 2002 03:27:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 49625 invoked from network); 1 Oct 2002 03:27:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Oct 2002 03:27:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.78) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Oct 2002 03:27:48 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.140] by n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Oct 2002 03:27:48 -0000 Date: Tue, 01 Oct 2002 03:27:43 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: distortion Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <002401c268f2$89c10d60$7000a8c0@netdragon> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2745 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.87.142 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics The amount and quality of Stereo separation that you get from AM Stereo is dependent on a combination of several things: the station's audio processing; the station's exciter, transmitter, and antenna system; the design of your receiver; and the signal reception conditions. Assuming a "perfectly" transmitted AM Stereo signal with a strong local signal (but not too strong as to overload the receiver), the biggest factor is the design of your receiver. The latest Motorola C-Quam decoder chips (MC13022, MC13028) will give you the widest and "cleanest" Stereo separation, mostly because they have the most finely tuned "cosine compensation" in the C-Quam decoder. The older Motorola-type decoders (MC13020 and the Toshiba TA8124) will also give fine results, but with the possibility of some noticeable distortion on very wide-separation audio. And although popular over the decades, the Sony-type decoders (as used in your SRF-42) are actually the worst, since they don't decode the signal using the true C-Quam system at all, but rather send it through a Magnavox-type decoder. This will certainly give you satisfactory reception of C-Quam Stereo audio, but with a noticeable amount of added distortion due to the lack of C-Quam's "cosine compensation". This is mostly apparent as a "grundgy" sound when the bass track is off to one side in the Stereo image, as was common in 1960s music. On the other hand, the added second-harmonic distortion of the treble actually may make the audio sound more "bright" and "crisp", since these harmonics can extend past the 10 kHz audio limit of AM stations, especially on harmonically rich instruments like brass and strings. If you've never experienced AM Stereo through the latest Motorola MC13028 decoder (as used by Chris Cuff's decoder module), the improvement is really quite astonishing. To those familiar with the world of LPs and vinyl, it's like switching from a turntable with a ceramic cartridge to one with a high quality magnetic cartridge. Many of the imperfections which you may have previously thought were inherent limitations of AM Stereo's design suddenly disappear, leaving wide-separation, low-distortion audio, even from stations that are putting out rather marginal audio quality from their transmitters. In fact, it will even make *mono* stations sound better, and sensitivity will be improved as well due to the decoder's auto-IF-gain function. Nevertheless, if KEVA is putting out Stereo audio at least as good as what I've heard from your recording made on the SRF-42, then your C-Quam exciter is already performing very well and will certainly provide very enjoyable sound quality to both your mono and Stereo listeners. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Oct 01 00:48:16 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 1 Oct 2002 07:48:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 80801 invoked from network); 1 Oct 2002 07:46:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Oct 2002 07:46:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.67) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Oct 2002 07:46:35 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.134] by n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Oct 2002 07:46:32 -0000 Date: Tue, 01 Oct 2002 07:46:31 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Ultra-Hi-Fi AM Stereo Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 979 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.87.142 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics If you are in the mood for some truly high fidelity AM Stereo audio, I highly recommend you take the time to download and listen to this recording on the best set of speakers or headphones you have: http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/cquam.mp3 In case you are wondering, here is some background information on exactly how it came about: Audio Source: Toshiba laptop running "MPXPLAY" for DOS Audio Processing: None (no compression/limiting or pre-emphasis) Transmitter: unmodified "Alfredo Lite" Receiver: Realistic TM-152 with ceramic filter bypassed AM Stereo Decoder in receiver: Motorola MC13028 Third Generation C-Quam chip The resulting audio was originally recorded to CrO2 cassette tape with Dolby B NR, then transferred to CD-R, then directly "ripped" into the WAV audio which was used to make this MP3 file. Note that no "bass boost" was used... what you hear is the way it is on the original CD track, and that's the way it came through the AM Stereo! From philipr@irac.pe.ca Tue Oct 01 05:22:15 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 1 Oct 2002 12:22:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 42541 invoked from network); 1 Oct 2002 12:22:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Oct 2002 12:22:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Oct 2002 12:22:15 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.155] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Oct 2002 12:22:14 -0000 Date: Tue, 01 Oct 2002 12:22:13 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Heathkit PT-1 Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2073 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking The PT-1 arrived, in all its multi-tube glory. I believe I wasn't seeing double when I counted 16 tubes. I tried its AM stereo output with Chris's decoder board - the sound was very weak and distorted - perhaps the IF output is too much, the wrong impedance etc. But, without the decoder, the sound is nothing short of incrediable when broadcasting on the Alfredo Lite. Heath recommends tuning for maximum signal strength on narrow, then flipping over to wide. I then flipped the band select switch several times between our local heavily compressed "Lite Rock" [read bubble gum pop] FM station and my Alfredo-Lite. There is no comparison - highs are brighter, mids clearer and more defined, and the bass rolls out instead of being pumped out. The AM was superior by a WIDE margin. The local FM station sounded muddy by comparison - like sound trapped in a securely duct-taped cardboard box! Unlike the GE SR III, which has poor sensitivity on wideband, the PT- 1 is sensitive on wideband [although a little more so on narrow]. I then tuned in Radio Disney 1560 coming in some 6 or 7 hundred miles through the ether, and the sound was excellent, with a remarkably clean sound even when fading present. The PT-1 has a superb AGC - which is readily apparent when watching the tuning meter. Even local 720 CHTN sounded pretty darn good, and normally very muffled 630 CFCY sounded good. Of course, 1320 CKEC sounded on a par with the Alfredo Lite - simply breathtaking. Once I get a copy of the schematic from my brother, then I may have more insights into the AM stereo output, and whether or not it can be made compatiable with Chris's decoder board. But for now, I'm enjoying high fidelity radio and folks - its not on the FM band! Phil P.S. I should do an A-B comparison between AM and FM, using the same programming material, same amount of compression/limiting etc. by simulcasting on the Alfredo Lite and the Ramsey FM25B. I expect both will sound pretty good, as the Ramsey has far better FM sound than the local FMers! From penry@nortelnetworks.com Tue Oct 01 10:03:01 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: penry@nortelnetworks.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 1 Oct 2002 17:02:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 86711 invoked from network); 1 Oct 2002 17:02:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Oct 2002 17:02:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO zsc3s004.nortelnetworks.com) (47.81.138.65) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Oct 2002 17:02:24 -0000 Received: from zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com (zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com [47.103.122.112]) by zsc3s004.nortelnetworks.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id g91H2NE21427 for ; Tue, 1 Oct 2002 10:02:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from zrc2c011.us.nortel.com (zrc2c011.us.nortel.com [47.103.120.51]) by zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id g91H2ZV00258 for ; Tue, 1 Oct 2002 12:02:35 -0500 (CDT) Received: by zrc2c011.us.nortel.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Tue, 1 Oct 2002 12:02:21 -0500 Message-ID: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A560797404110011@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Times Article Date: Tue, 1 Oct 2002 12:02:12 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) From: "Charles Penry" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=376233 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa5vhu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit A semi-accurate article about the new digital enhancements to analog radios is in today's NY Times (free but must subscribe): http://www.nytimes.com/2002/09/30/technology/30RADI.html?todaysheadlines [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Tue Oct 01 10:57:25 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 1 Oct 2002 17:57:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 31175 invoked from network); 1 Oct 2002 17:57:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Oct 2002 17:57:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14202.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.144) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Oct 2002 17:57:24 -0000 Message-ID: <20021001175724.44286.qmail@web14202.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.45.202.244] by web14202.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 01 Oct 2002 10:57:24 PDT Date: Tue, 1 Oct 2002 10:57:24 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Toronto AMS woes To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: Johnny Electron X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio I believe AM 740 already bought a POS 9200 instead of the infamous 9100. __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? New DSL Internet Access from SBC & Yahoo! http://sbc.yahoo.com From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Tue Oct 01 10:58:28 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 1 Oct 2002 17:58:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 12605 invoked from network); 1 Oct 2002 17:58:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Oct 2002 17:58:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14204.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.146) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Oct 2002 17:58:23 -0000 Message-ID: <20021001175823.79498.qmail@web14204.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.45.202.244] by web14204.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 01 Oct 2002 10:58:23 PDT Date: Tue, 1 Oct 2002 10:58:23 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Target radios, round 2? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: Johnny Electron X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio Chris: How did you fair with the other Target radio? Was it as good as the 'ball' radio? There were none of those to be had in Ohio. __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? New DSL Internet Access from SBC & Yahoo! http://sbc.yahoo.com From scott.toenniessen@fmr.com Tue Oct 01 11:18:47 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: scott.toenniessen@fmr.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 1 Oct 2002 18:18:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 7710 invoked from network); 1 Oct 2002 18:18:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Oct 2002 18:18:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Oct 2002 18:18:45 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.143] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Oct 2002 18:18:44 -0000 Date: Tue, 01 Oct 2002 18:18:44 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: RDS in Boston Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 503 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "spt87a" X-Originating-IP: 192.223.226.6 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public I thought some might be interested even though its not AM Stereo related... It looks like Infinity decided to add RDS to their Boston FMs. First WBMX (Mix 98.5) started sending RDS 3 to 4 weeks ago. A week later WODS (Oldies 103.3) started. I don't know the complete list of Boston FMs owned by Infinity but its a trend I'll keep an eye on. There are already several other stations with RDS (I think 8 in the area now). Now if they would just plug that exciter back in at WBZ.... - Scott From amfmdx@fastq.com Tue Oct 01 11:20:01 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 1 Oct 2002 18:20:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 32974 invoked from network); 1 Oct 2002 18:20:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Oct 2002 18:20:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Oct 2002 18:20:01 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt (d168-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.200]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id g91IJxh97977 for ; Tue, 1 Oct 2002 11:19:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <081101c26976$b41aae20$6df9bed8@kredding430cdt> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Heathkit PT-1 Date: Tue, 1 Oct 2002 11:16:44 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > The PT-1 arrived, in all its multi-tube glory. I believe I wasn't > seeing double when I counted 16 tubes. I have a 11 tube Zenith C845L high fidelity. 10" speaker and 2" tweeter in the big wood box. Wide sound and awesome reproduction on AM. A really beautiful radio all the way around. Why the hell can't manufacturers make something equivalent today?? > But, without the decoder, the sound is nothing short of incrediable > when broadcasting on the Alfredo Lite. This Zenith was made in 1960 and it just kills me to hear the ads on the radio saying that the CCRadio sounds great. > Unlike the GE SR III, which has poor sensitivity on wideband, the PT- > 1 is sensitive on wideband [although a little more so on narrow]. I have a Zenith Royal 2000 Trans Symphony that sounds like this thing but its transistorized. That radio sounds magnificent on AM and will DX better than a SR III. This one is from 1961. > Once I get a copy of the schematic from my brother, then I may have > more insights into the AM stereo output, and whether or not it can > be made compatiable with Chris's decoder board. If your bro can't send it, go to www.justradios.com they are the dirt cheapest for schematics and repair documents I have ever seen anywhere on this earth AND THEY ARE IN CANADA for you! > But for now, I'm enjoying high fidelity radio and folks - its not on > the FM band! The AM sounds better than the FM on both the radios I listed. I also have a GE 780P that blows the doors off any FM radioo anywhere anytime anyway. What a smokin radio! I love that thing. Radios used to be so good and now they are so crap. If they would fix the programming and the receivers this IBOC $#!+ would have NEVER come up. Kevin From scott.toenniessen@fmr.com Tue Oct 01 11:25:27 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: scott.toenniessen@fmr.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 1 Oct 2002 18:25:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 68008 invoked from network); 1 Oct 2002 18:21:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Oct 2002 18:21:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Oct 2002 18:21:55 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.189] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Oct 2002 18:21:51 -0000 Date: Tue, 01 Oct 2002 18:21:50 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Times Article Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A560797404110011@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 269 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "spt87a" X-Originating-IP: 192.223.226.6 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Charles Penry" wrote: Anyone know if these include C-Quam decoding? It looks like Motorola thinks there is a market opportunity here. Maybe the auto makers they provide parts to are not as ready to add IBOC as some think. From philipr@irac.pe.ca Tue Oct 01 12:45:15 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 1 Oct 2002 19:45:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 47906 invoked from network); 1 Oct 2002 19:45:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Oct 2002 19:45:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Oct 2002 19:45:15 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.160] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Oct 2002 19:45:15 -0000 Date: Tue, 01 Oct 2002 19:45:14 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Heathkit PT-1 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <081101c26976$b41aae20$6df9bed8@kredding430cdt> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2942 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking Thanks Kevin for the tip RE www.justradios.com. Their prices on schematics are very good. They sell some interesting capacitors too. Old Zeniths, both tube and solid state, are great rigs. They hearken back to the days when engineers, manufacturers and workers really took pride in their work. I suspect their are lots of engineers and workers who would love to be involved in producing some great products - the trick is to find a manufacturer that is willing to sacrifice a small part of their profit margin to reap the rewards of a good reputation, and hopefully - if the consumers respect this - higher sales in the long term. I guess the bean counters need to take off their reading glasses and start looking at the horizon, as well as the immediate bottom line. We need people of vision - I guess that's why the bunch of us keep championing AM Stereo - we know its good, and we know it can really fill a need. It's a shame a visionary manufacturer hasn't come on board to work with us - or, maybe one has? Phil --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" wrote: > > The PT-1 arrived, in all its multi-tube glory. I believe I wasn't > > seeing double when I counted 16 tubes. > > I have a 11 tube Zenith C845L high fidelity. 10" speaker and 2" tweeter in > the big wood box. Wide sound and awesome reproduction on AM. A really > beautiful radio all the way around. Why the hell can't manufacturers make > something equivalent today?? > > > But, without the decoder, the sound is nothing short of incrediable > > when broadcasting on the Alfredo Lite. > > This Zenith was made in 1960 and it just kills me to hear the ads on the > radio saying that the CCRadio sounds great. > > > Unlike the GE SR III, which has poor sensitivity on wideband, the PT- > > 1 is sensitive on wideband [although a little more so on narrow]. > > I have a Zenith Royal 2000 Trans Symphony that sounds like this thing but > its transistorized. That radio sounds magnificent on AM and will DX better > than a SR III. This one is from 1961. > > > > Once I get a copy of the schematic from my brother, then I may have > > more insights into the AM stereo output, and whether or not it can > > be made compatiable with Chris's decoder board. > > If your bro can't send it, go to www.justradios.com they are the dirt > cheapest for schematics and repair documents I have ever seen anywhere on > this earth AND THEY ARE IN CANADA for you! > > > But for now, I'm enjoying high fidelity radio and folks - its not on > > the FM band! > > The AM sounds better than the FM on both the radios I listed. I also have a > GE 780P that blows the doors off any FM radioo anywhere anytime anyway. What > a smokin radio! I love that thing. > > Radios used to be so good and now they are so crap. If they would fix the > programming and the receivers this IBOC $#!+ would have NEVER come up. > > Kevin From philipr@irac.pe.ca Tue Oct 01 12:58:26 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 1 Oct 2002 19:58:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 4441 invoked from network); 1 Oct 2002 19:58:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Oct 2002 19:58:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Oct 2002 19:58:25 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.172] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Oct 2002 19:58:25 -0000 Date: Tue, 01 Oct 2002 19:58:25 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Heathkit PT-1 Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 386 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking For anyone on the list who is interested in acquiring a Heathkit PT- 1, here is one on ebay: Heathkit PT-1 Vac Tube Tuner AM/FM/AM Stereo Item # 1384381109 When they are in decent shape, they are a very sensitive great sounding rig on AM and FM, but especially on AM! I coveted my brother's PT-1 for years, now I have my own. Make sure this baby also gets a good home! Phil From ccuff@in4web.com Tue Oct 01 13:19:15 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 1 Oct 2002 20:19:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 79416 invoked from network); 1 Oct 2002 20:19:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Oct 2002 20:19:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Oct 2002 20:19:14 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.92]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Tue, 1 Oct 2002 16:16:48 -0400 Message-ID: <001e01c26987$a3b75e00$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} RDS in Boston Date: Tue, 1 Oct 2002 16:17:59 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 I just noticed today that WNEW has turned RDS back on, too. Waste of airwaves format-wise, but it does have RDS CC ----- Original Message ----- From: spt87a From ccuff@in4web.com Tue Oct 01 13:20:48 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 1 Oct 2002 20:20:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 35889 invoked from network); 1 Oct 2002 20:20:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Oct 2002 20:20:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Oct 2002 20:20:48 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.92]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Tue, 1 Oct 2002 16:18:22 -0400 Message-ID: <002601c26987$dbdd2580$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: <20021001175823.79498.qmail@web14204.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Target radios, round 2? Date: Tue, 1 Oct 2002 16:19:34 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 .Oh- The audiovox?....choke....gag..... :-) Stick with the Memorex- They will be back.. CC ----- Original Message ----- From: Johnny Electron To: Sent: Tuesday, October 01, 2002 1:58 PM Subject: {AMSF} Target radios, round 2? > Chris: > How did you fair with the other Target radio? Was it as good as the 'ball' > radio? There were none of those to be had in Ohio. > From stodd@sherbtel.net Tue Oct 01 16:45:14 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 1 Oct 2002 23:45:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 35561 invoked from network); 1 Oct 2002 23:45:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Oct 2002 23:45:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Oct 2002 23:45:13 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-89-183.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.183]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g91NeKQc015285 for ; Tue, 1 Oct 2002 18:40:21 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <002901c269a4$dde635c0$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Times Article Date: Tue, 1 Oct 2002 18:47:10 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Nope. And I knew that without reading the article. Not that a DSP chip couldn't have the code added (at least at the time of production) for AMS. Scott Todd ----- Original Message ----- From: "spt87a" To: Sent: Tuesday, October 01, 2002 1:21 PM Subject: {AMSF} Re: Times Article > --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Charles Penry" wrote: > > Anyone know if these include C-Quam decoding? > > It looks like Motorola thinks there is a market opportunity here. > Maybe the auto makers they provide parts to are not as ready to add > IBOC as some think. > > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > From stodd@sherbtel.net Tue Oct 01 16:52:34 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 1 Oct 2002 23:52:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 87703 invoked from network); 1 Oct 2002 23:52:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Oct 2002 23:52:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Oct 2002 23:52:33 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-89-183.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.183]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g91NliQc016747 for ; Tue, 1 Oct 2002 18:47:45 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <003101c269a5$e66cb740$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Heathkit PT-1 Date: Tue, 1 Oct 2002 18:54:34 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude I'd just about guarantee it's too much output. If you've got an oscilloscope where you can see the p-p output voltage, I'd bet it's several tenths of a volt to 1.5v on a local signal- far too much for the decoder. Try hooking the PT-1 output across a 100K pot, and the input to the decoder on the wiper, and find out where you get the best decoder output, and create a resistive voltage divider to match where the tap is set. Be sure to use a strong signal when making the setting. Otherwise it'll sound fine on weak and medium strength signals, but still overload on strong ones. Been there, done that. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Phil Rafuse" > The PT-1 arrived, in all its multi-tube glory. I believe I wasn't > seeing double when I counted 16 tubes. I tried its AM stereo output > with Chris's decoder board - the sound was very weak and distorted - > perhaps the IF output is too much, the wrong impedance etc. From ccuff@in4web.com Wed Oct 02 00:53:09 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 2 Oct 2002 07:53:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 22863 invoked from network); 2 Oct 2002 07:53:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Oct 2002 07:53:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Oct 2002 07:53:06 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.39]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Wed, 2 Oct 2002 03:50:39 -0400 Message-ID: <003101c269e8$90dfa420$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: <003101c269a5$e66cb740$d3a9fea9@me> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Heathkit PT-1 Date: Wed, 2 Oct 2002 03:51:49 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 These tube tuners have about a 500mv output. The decoder likes about 100mv. Use a 47K resistor off the output jack, and if needed, shunt the decoder input to ground with another resistor choosen for best results. CC ----- Original Message ----- From: Scott Todd To: Sent: Tuesday, October 01, 2002 7:54 PM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Heathkit PT-1 > I'd just about guarantee it's too much output. If you've got an From philipr@irac.pe.ca Wed Oct 02 04:48:49 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 2 Oct 2002 11:48:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 91610 invoked from network); 2 Oct 2002 11:48:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Oct 2002 11:48:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Oct 2002 11:48:49 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.179] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Oct 2002 11:48:49 -0000 Date: Wed, 02 Oct 2002 11:48:46 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Heathkit PT-1 Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 278 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking Thanks for the suggestions - I do have a scope, so this will be interesting - not just to measure the voltage but also to see what the waveforms look like too. Should be pretty easy to pad the output down and try it again! The stereo light did flicker at one point. Phil From philipr@irac.pe.ca Wed Oct 02 04:58:43 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 2 Oct 2002 11:58:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 74942 invoked from network); 2 Oct 2002 11:58:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Oct 2002 11:58:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Oct 2002 11:58:42 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.158] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Oct 2002 11:58:41 -0000 Date: Wed, 02 Oct 2002 11:58:41 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: another PT-1 on ebay Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 349 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking http://cgi.ebay.ca/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1385586138 note this is a tuner, not an amplifier! And, just because the dial lights light up doesn't automatically mean that it works! and the one I referred to yesterday: http://cgi.ebay.ca/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1384381109 Looks like the PT-1s are coming out of the woodwork! Phil From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Wed Oct 02 06:56:29 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 2 Oct 2002 13:56:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 56324 invoked from network); 2 Oct 2002 13:56:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Oct 2002 13:56:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14205.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.151) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Oct 2002 13:56:28 -0000 Message-ID: <20021002135628.44548.qmail@web14205.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.45.202.244] by web14205.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 02 Oct 2002 06:56:28 PDT Date: Wed, 2 Oct 2002 06:56:28 -0700 (PDT) Subject: NPR Wastes our Money on IBOC To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: John Pavlica X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio Forget about donating to your NPR station if they have so much money as to influence the FCC on how they're going to spend the big bucks on HD/IBOC at their stations; read their FCC comments filed about it on the following link: http://gullfoss2.fcc.gov/prod/ecfs/retrieve.cgi?native_or_pdf=pdf&id_document=6513293786 __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? New DSL Internet Access from SBC & Yahoo! http://sbc.yahoo.com From kevtronics@yahoo.com Wed Oct 02 07:34:10 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 2 Oct 2002 14:34:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 23511 invoked from network); 2 Oct 2002 14:34:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Oct 2002 14:34:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Oct 2002 14:34:09 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.146] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Oct 2002 14:34:07 -0000 Date: Wed, 02 Oct 2002 14:34:04 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Heathkit PT-1 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <003101c269e8$90dfa420$0101a8c0@pavilion> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 668 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > These tube tuners have about a 500mv output. The decoder likes > about 100mv. Use a 47K resistor off the output jack, and if needed, > shunt the decoder input to ground with another resistor choosen for > best results. On my Hallicrafters S-38C -- as I would assume on many tube radios -- the IF output is so strong, that all you need is to bring the AM Stereo decoder's IF input wire close to the radio's IF line, without actually being electrically connected to it (through a resistor or otherwise). I think if I connected the Hallicrafter's IF output signal to an outdoor antenna, it would put out a receivable signal on 455 kHz for quite some distance! From ccuff@in4web.com Wed Oct 02 07:37:49 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 2 Oct 2002 14:37:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 28879 invoked from network); 2 Oct 2002 14:37:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Oct 2002 14:37:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Oct 2002 14:37:48 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.93]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Wed, 2 Oct 2002 10:35:25 -0400 Message-ID: <001b01c26a21$1bb7f1a0$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: <20021002135628.44548.qmail@web14205.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} NPR Wastes our Money on IBOC Date: Wed, 2 Oct 2002 10:36:34 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 Now this is wierd- this coming from an organization that cries poverty all the time? And just where is the money for this "upgrade" going to come from? Us? The Taxpayers? Horsepucky! This crap has to stop. CC ----- Original Message ----- From: John Pavlica To: Sent: Wednesday, October 02, 2002 9:56 AM Subject: {AMSF} NPR Wastes our Money on IBOC From ccuff@in4web.com Wed Oct 02 07:40:53 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 2 Oct 2002 14:40:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 41641 invoked from network); 2 Oct 2002 14:40:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Oct 2002 14:40:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Oct 2002 14:40:52 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.93]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Wed, 2 Oct 2002 10:38:29 -0400 Message-ID: <002101c26a21$895354c0$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Heathkit PT-1 Date: Wed, 2 Oct 2002 10:39:38 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 True. I should also mention a "gimmik" connection- a turn of INSULATED wire around the plate terminal of the last IF tube- but be warned- the bandwidth is gonna be W I D E. Alternatively, come off the plate of the first IF tube, right out of the mixer, and use a ceramic filter. CC ----- Original Message ----- From: Kevin T. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Wed Oct 02 08:44:01 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 2 Oct 2002 15:43:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 72341 invoked from network); 2 Oct 2002 15:43:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Oct 2002 15:43:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.89) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Oct 2002 15:43:58 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.132] by n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Oct 2002 15:43:58 -0000 Date: Wed, 02 Oct 2002 15:43:57 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Heathkit PT-1 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <002101c26a21$895354c0$0101a8c0@pavilion> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1044 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics More info on the Heathkit PT-1 tuner... searching through Google web and groups, I found out that it was introduced in March 1958, with "PT" standing for "Professional Tuner". There was one web site that is supposed to have a GIF of its schematic diagram, but that turned out to be a dead link. Anyway, some details from a newsgroup posting: > > > > Actually, the Heathkit PT-1 and AJ-30 have a fairly elaborate AM section, using the following tube line-up: 6BA6 - RF Amplifier 6BE6 - Converter 6BA6 - 1st IF Amplifier 6BA6 - 2nd IF Amplifier two "crystal rectifiers" - full-wave detector 6AU6 - AVC Amplifier 1/2 12AU7 - AVC Rectifier 1/2 12AU7 - Meter Amplifier 1/2 12AU7 - AF Cathode follower This is just the AM section. There are nine more tubes for the FM section! The separate AVC IF amplifier is a feature usually only found in some communications receivers. When an FM stereo de- multiplexer was included in Heathkit's later tube tuners, the AM section was substantially scaled-back. < < < < From redledge78@yahoo.com Wed Oct 02 12:24:26 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: redledge78@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 2 Oct 2002 19:24:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 82658 invoked from network); 2 Oct 2002 19:24:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Oct 2002 19:24:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO proxycontent.homerelay.com) (209.75.47.201) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Oct 2002 19:24:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 25615 invoked from network); 2 Oct 2002 19:24:10 -0000 Received: from vtcomm-6.homerelay.com (HELO yahoo.com) (209.75.47.216) by 0 with SMTP; 2 Oct 2002 19:24:10 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Cc: Date: 2 Oct 2002 09:38 -0500 Subject:Re:{AMSF} Digest Number 390 [ Part 2 of 5 ] From: redledge78@yahoo.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=59652447 X-Yahoo-Profile: redledge78 I concur... -------------------- FROM : amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com DATE : Wed 10/02/2002 09:20:10 PDT SUBJECT: {AMSF} Digest Number 390 [ Part 2 of 5 ] ________________________________________________________________________ Message: 4 Date: Tue, 01 Oct 2002 18:18:44 -0000 From: "spt87a" Subject: RDS in Boston I thought some might be interested even though its not AM Stereo related... It looks like Infinity decided to add RDS to their Boston FMs. First WBMX (Mix 98.5) started sending RDS 3 to 4 weeks ago. A week later WODS (Oldies 103.3) started. I don't know the complete list of Boston FMs owned by Infinity but its a trend I'll keep an eye on. There are already several other stations with RDS (I think 8 in the area now). Now if they would just plug that exciter back in at WBZ.... - Scott ________________________________________________________________________ ________________________________________________________________________ Message: 5 Date: Tue, 1 Oct 2002 11:16:44 -0700 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" Subject: Re: Heathkit PT-1 > The PT-1 arrived, in all its multi-tube glory. I believe I wasn't > seeing double when I counted 16 tubes. I have a 11 tube Zenith C845L high fidelity. 10" speaker and 2" tweeter in the big wood box. Wide sound and awesome reproduction on AM. A really beautiful radio all the way around. Why the hell can't manufacturers make something equivalent today?? > But, without the decoder, the sound is nothing short of incrediable > when broadcasting on the Alfredo Lite. This Zenith was made in 1960 and it just kills me to hear the ads on the radio saying that the CCRadio sounds great. > Unlike the GE SR III, which has poor sensitivity on wideband, the PT- > 1 is sensitive on wideband [although a little more so on narrow]. I have a Zenith Royal 2000 Trans Symphony that sounds like this thing but its transistorized. That radio sounds magnificent on AM and will DX better than a SR III. This one is from 1961. > Once I get a copy of the schematic from my brother, then I may have > more insights into the AM stereo output, and whether or not it can > be made compatiable with Chris's decoder board. If your bro can't send it, go to www.justradios.com they are the dirt cheapest for schematics and repair documents I have ever seen anywhere on this earth AND THEY ARE IN CANADA for From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Wed Oct 02 18:52:39 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 3 Oct 2002 01:52:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 61691 invoked from network); 3 Oct 2002 01:52:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Oct 2002 01:52:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14201.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.143) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Oct 2002 01:52:38 -0000 Message-ID: <20021003015238.1996.qmail@web14201.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.127.54.199] by web14201.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 02 Oct 2002 18:52:38 PDT Date: Wed, 2 Oct 2002 18:52:38 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Please Email Motorola To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: John Pavlica X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio AMS Crew: Please take 5 minutes to email the folks at Motorola and request that they add the code for Motorola C-Quam AM stereo to their new "Symphony" Radio Chipset for automotive radios. It costs them no more hardware, just a couple lines of code that have already been written. If they want to improve on that code for weaker stations, that's all the better. Please email Motorola today. I sent emails to 4 different people, so it would help if they get CQuam requests from more than just me. __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? New DSL Internet Access from SBC & Yahoo! http://sbc.yahoo.com From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Oct 02 19:07:14 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 3 Oct 2002 02:07:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 65462 invoked from network); 3 Oct 2002 02:07:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Oct 2002 02:07:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Oct 2002 02:07:12 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-88-213.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.213]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g9322JQc010337 for ; Wed, 2 Oct 2002 21:02:20 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <004001c26a81$e29d99e0$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: <20021003015238.1996.qmail@web14201.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Please Email Motorola Date: Wed, 2 Oct 2002 21:09:16 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Would you happen to have a particular email address so we know it goes to the right people? Scott Todd ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Pavlica" > AMS Crew: > Please take 5 minutes to email the folks at Motorola and request that they add > the code for Motorola C-Quam AM stereo to their new "Symphony" Radio Chipset > for automotive radios. . From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Oct 03 00:25:25 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 3 Oct 2002 07:25:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 56785 invoked from network); 3 Oct 2002 07:25:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Oct 2002 07:25:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Oct 2002 07:25:25 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.188] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Oct 2002 07:25:25 -0000 Date: Thu, 03 Oct 2002 07:25:23 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Toronto AMS woes Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20021001175724.44286.qmail@web14202.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 672 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.68.27 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > I believe AM 740 already bought a POS 9200 instead of the infamous > 9100. Whatever Optimod they use, it's no match for the "Kevtronimod": http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/kevtronimod.mp3 Even without true matrix processing (yet), the results are surprisingly good, at least to my ears. On your computer, this MP3 file should be *LOUD*, but without distortion, because that is how the Kevtronimod works -- in this example, it's running at full tilt, with 700% volume compression. The Kevtronimod will soon be in use at "Stereo Country, WKMD" -- on 1500 AM Stereo (via my Alfredo Lite transmitter), and perhaps also on the FM band as well, just for fun. From stodd@sherbtel.net Thu Oct 03 02:29:48 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 3 Oct 2002 09:29:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 2996 invoked from network); 3 Oct 2002 09:29:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Oct 2002 09:29:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Oct 2002 09:29:46 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-89-70.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.70]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g939OsQc028696 for ; Thu, 3 Oct 2002 04:24:55 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <000b01c26abf$b63acd80$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Toronto AMS woes Date: Thu, 3 Oct 2002 04:31:51 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude If you can actually build one and send it to them for evaluation, I'd bet they'd put it in their air chain. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kevin T." To: Sent: Thursday, October 03, 2002 2:25 AM Subject: {AMSF} Re: Toronto AMS woes > > I believe AM 740 already bought a POS 9200 instead of the infamous > > 9100. > > Whatever Optimod they use, it's no match for the "Kevtronimod": > > http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/kevtronimod.mp3 > > Even without true matrix processing (yet), the results are > surprisingly good, at least to my ears. On your computer, this MP3 > file should be *LOUD*, but without distortion, because that is how > the Kevtronimod works -- in this example, it's running at full tilt, > with 700% volume compression. > > The Kevtronimod will soon be in use at "Stereo Country, WKMD" -- on > 1500 AM Stereo (via my Alfredo Lite transmitter), and perhaps also on > the FM band as well, just for fun. > > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > From philipr@irac.pe.ca Thu Oct 03 05:44:08 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 3 Oct 2002 12:44:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 58936 invoked from network); 3 Oct 2002 12:44:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Oct 2002 12:44:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.86) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Oct 2002 12:44:07 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.153] by n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Oct 2002 12:44:07 -0000 Date: Thu, 03 Oct 2002 12:44:07 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Toronto AMS woes Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 895 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking Any chance of seeing this rig? This has made me curious! Sounds terrific! A good processor always comes in handy! Phil --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin T." wrote: > > I believe AM 740 already bought a POS 9200 instead of the infamous > > 9100. > > Whatever Optimod they use, it's no match for the "Kevtronimod": > > http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/kevtronimod.mp3 > > Even without true matrix processing (yet), the results are > surprisingly good, at least to my ears. On your computer, this MP3 > file should be *LOUD*, but without distortion, because that is how > the Kevtronimod works -- in this example, it's running at full tilt, > with 700% volume compression. > > The Kevtronimod will soon be in use at "Stereo Country, WKMD" -- on > 1500 AM Stereo (via my Alfredo Lite transmitter), and perhaps also on > the FM band as well, just for fun. From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Thu Oct 03 07:29:47 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 3 Oct 2002 14:29:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 53949 invoked from network); 3 Oct 2002 14:29:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Oct 2002 14:29:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14207.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.173.71) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Oct 2002 14:29:47 -0000 Message-ID: <20021003142946.76304.qmail@web14207.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.45.202.244] by web14207.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 03 Oct 2002 07:29:46 PDT Date: Thu, 3 Oct 2002 07:29:46 -0700 (PDT) Subject: WBCO Ohio To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: John Pavlica X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio Central/North Central Ohio DX'ers Can anybody give me a signal report on WBCO 1540 Bucyrus? The engineer said he turned-on the AMS in August, BUT he hasn't been able to adjust the L-R yet. Can anybody verify the pilot or if they have ANY separation? __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? New DSL Internet Access from SBC & Yahoo! http://sbc.yahoo.com From amfmdx@fastq.com Thu Oct 03 09:31:51 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 3 Oct 2002 16:31:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 88476 invoked from network); 3 Oct 2002 16:27:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Oct 2002 16:27:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Oct 2002 16:27:14 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt (d206-osel-phx.fastq.com [209.63.214.193]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id g93GRDh63919 for ; Thu, 3 Oct 2002 09:27:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <001301c26af9$66e3c7c0$c1d63fd1@kredding430cdt> To: References: <20021003015238.1996.qmail@web14201.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Please Email Motorola Date: Thu, 3 Oct 2002 09:24:50 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > Please email Motorola today. > I sent emails to 4 different people, so it would help if they get CQuam > requests from more than just me. Gotta have some addresses John. Kevin From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Thu Oct 03 09:57:52 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 3 Oct 2002 16:57:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 71332 invoked from network); 3 Oct 2002 16:57:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Oct 2002 16:57:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14206.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.173.70) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Oct 2002 16:57:52 -0000 Message-ID: <20021003165752.6206.qmail@web14206.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.45.202.244] by web14206.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 03 Oct 2002 09:57:52 PDT Date: Thu, 3 Oct 2002 09:57:52 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Please write to Motorola to request C-Quam in their new Chipset To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: John Pavlica X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio When emailing our Motorola brethern, please mention the New York Times article about their Symphony Car Radio Chip Set and request MOTOROLA C-Quam AM Stereo encoding. Might also want to mention it's the world stadard, and that there's several hundred stations in the USA, plus a high concentration in Oz and Canada. Ian and our Aussie friends, you're invited to chime-in too. Some suggested Motorola people to pester: Mr. Steve Tremmel: rtca30@motorola.com Ms. Karen Bartell: karen.bartell@motorola.com Try the Motorola.Com website and perhaps you'll find more to send it to. __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? New DSL Internet Access from SBC & Yahoo! http://sbc.yahoo.com From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Thu Oct 03 10:00:34 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 3 Oct 2002 17:00:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 85536 invoked from network); 3 Oct 2002 17:00:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Oct 2002 17:00:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14207.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.173.71) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Oct 2002 17:00:34 -0000 Message-ID: <20021003170034.12403.qmail@web14207.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.45.202.244] by web14207.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 03 Oct 2002 10:00:34 PDT Date: Thu, 3 Oct 2002 10:00:34 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Some folks still care about LOCAL AMS Radio !!!!! To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: John Pavlica X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio Here's part of a message from an engineer of WBCO-AM: "The original owner sold the stations (including WQEL FM) to a local couple four or five years ago. He sold it for about 2/3 the price that Clear Channel had offered him because he wanted to ensure that the stations would remain local. The current owners (and a nice couple at that) run the station just the way local radio should be run; lots of high school sports (boys AND girls), extensive coverage of local fairs and festival, free remotes at the Kiwanis Pancake Day et. al. and local news. I turned the AM Stereo back on in early August..." __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? New DSL Internet Access from SBC & Yahoo! http://sbc.yahoo.com From philipr@irac.pe.ca Thu Oct 03 12:19:20 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 3 Oct 2002 19:19:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 30920 invoked from network); 3 Oct 2002 19:19:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Oct 2002 19:19:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Oct 2002 19:19:19 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.136] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Oct 2002 19:19:16 -0000 Date: Thu, 03 Oct 2002 19:19:12 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Some folks still care about LOCAL AMS Radio !!!!! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20021003170034.12403.qmail@web14207.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 979 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking Hats off to them - I hope the engineer will join the forum - I'm sure he'll get lots of assistance from our engineers! Phil --- In amstereoforum@y..., John Pavlica wrote: > Here's part of a message from an engineer of WBCO-AM: > > "The original owner sold the stations (including WQEL FM) to a local couple > four or five years ago. He sold it for about 2/3 the price that Clear Channel > had offered him because he wanted to ensure that the stations would remain > local. The current owners (and a nice couple at that) run the station just the > way local radio should be run; lots of high school sports (boys AND girls), > extensive coverage of local fairs and festival, free remotes at the > Kiwanis Pancake Day et. al. and local news. > > I turned the AM Stereo back on in early August..." > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > New DSL Internet Access from SBC & Yahoo! > http://sbc.yahoo.com From narkspud@hotmail.com Thu Oct 03 14:52:44 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: narkspud@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 3 Oct 2002 21:52:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 59623 invoked from network); 3 Oct 2002 21:52:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Oct 2002 21:52:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.88) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Oct 2002 21:52:42 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.134] by n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Oct 2002 21:52:42 -0000 Date: Thu, 03 Oct 2002 21:52:41 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Please write to Motorola to request C-Quam in their new Chipset Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20021003165752.6206.qmail@web14206.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1104 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "narkspud" X-Originating-IP: 67.89.146.146 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=81956306 X-Yahoo-Profile: narkspud Steve and Karen have been appropriately pestered by this Southern Californian. I suggest mentioning some call letters of stations in your local area (if any), and swearing that you listen to them religiously, and on what kind of radio, and that you're DYING to buy a new car stereo with AM Stereo abilities (which in my case was the gospel truth). Now who's with us? Please note: This is what I've been talking about--a technology by which they can add AM Stereo at NO additional manufacturing cost. Nada. Zippo. **This is what WILL get it done.** They would be absolutely kookoo to not include AM Stereo in this thing. And Motorola, of all people! They just need for somebody to remind them of the facts. So let's get writin'. narkspud > Some suggested Motorola people to pester: > > Mr. Steve Tremmel: rtca30@m... > Ms. Karen Bartell: karen.bartell@m... > > Try the Motorola.Com website and perhaps you'll find more to send it to. > > __________________________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > New DSL Internet Access from SBC & Yahoo! > http://sbc.yahoo.com From jsgil@hal-pc.org Thu Oct 03 15:14:37 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 3 Oct 2002 22:14:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 29298 invoked from network); 3 Oct 2002 22:14:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Oct 2002 22:14:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Oct 2002 22:14:21 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.165] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Oct 2002 22:14:21 -0000 Date: Thu, 03 Oct 2002 22:14:20 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Heathkit PT-1 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <003101c269e8$90dfa420$0101a8c0@pavilion> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1226 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.159 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Christopher Cuff" wrote: > These tube tuners have about a 500mv output. The decoder likes about 100mv. Question about the MC13028 input levels? According to the datasheet the max input level is 86dBuV and for best s/n and minimun distortion this occurs around 70dBuV. I assume that this is for unmodulated carrier but doesn't specify whether it is RMS, Peak, or PeakToPeak. From what info I can dig up on the dBuV spec is that it is so many dB above 1uV and that it is a voltage measurement not power meaning that it is calculated as 20*Log(value). From the way I have calculated it these are the values I got: Where: ^ = Raised to the power of 1e-6 = 1 microvolt 86dBuV -- 10^(86/20)*1e-6 = ~20mV 70dBuV -- 10^(70/20)*1e-6 = ~3.2mV This is much less than the 100mv you specified so I may not be calculating it correctly. From your experience what p-p unmod. input level does it take in to obtain .45V on the AGC filter (Pin 2) or 70dBuV as referenced in Fig. 13 of the datasheet. The other question I have is what the idle current is on the open collector pins 15(L) & 16(R). The sheet gives a 130uA p-p @ 100% mod. but doesn't specify the idle (or bias) current. JSG From jeffdeck@aol.com Thu Oct 03 15:27:19 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jeffdeck@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_4); 3 Oct 2002 22:27:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 45299 invoked from network); 3 Oct 2002 22:27:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Oct 2002 22:27:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.87) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Oct 2002 22:27:18 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.154] by n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Oct 2002 22:27:17 -0000 Date: Thu, 03 Oct 2002 22:27:17 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: WBCO Ohio Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20021003142946.76304.qmail@web14207.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 652 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jeffdeck2001" X-Originating-IP: 205.188.209.76 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=4430287 X-Yahoo-Profile: jeffdeck2001 John, WBCO is very, very weak in central Ohio. It is a 500 watt directional daytime station. I received WBCO this evening if they were playing oldies music. Happy to hear another AM station has activated C-QuAM stereo! When I am northwest of here, I will listen for any separation. Thanks again. 73, Jeff In a message dated 10/3/2002 10:31:23 AM Eastern Daylight Time, John writes: >Central/North Central Ohio DX'ers >Can anybody give me a signal report on WBCO 1540 Bucyrus? >The engineer said he turned-on the AMS in August, BUT he hasn't been >able to adjust the L-R yet. Can anybody verify the pilot or if they >have ANY separation? From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Oct 04 01:28:38 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 4 Oct 2002 08:28:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 41199 invoked from network); 4 Oct 2002 08:28:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Oct 2002 08:28:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Oct 2002 08:28:36 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.164] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 04 Oct 2002 08:28:36 -0000 Date: Fri, 04 Oct 2002 08:28:35 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: the Kevtronimod Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1639 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.77.2 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Any chance of seeing this rig? This has made me curious! Sounds > terrific! A good processor always comes in handy! Heh... I won't spill the exact secrets of the "Kevtronimod" just yet, but I will say that it is actually the opposite of 1070 WKMB's famous "Rontimod", which uses gentle multi-band compression followed by aggressive single-band limiting (through a vintage Gates Statesman). On the other hand, the "Kevtronimod" uses aggressive single-band compression followed by gentle multi-band limiting. This difference is mostly a matter of personal preference; in recent years, the widespread use of portable and car CD players in noisy environments has led record companies toward the use of heavy multi-band compression right on the CD audio, to make it sound "louder" and more "radio-like", so the use of multi-band compression in a radio station's processing (i.e. Optimod) is actually *doubling up* this effect, leading to an even further reduction of dynamic range. It's prevalent enough that I can often compare the cassette version of an album to the CD version, and the cassette will sound *better*, because of the analog-type audio processing that was used in its mastering process. Anyway, if you'd like to get a taste of the "Kevtronimod" in actual AM Stereo broadcast use, here are some examples that I did a while back: ftp://209.193.86.116/North-America/USA/NewJersey/1500kjfe.mp3 ftp://209.193.86.116/North-America/USA/NewJersey/kjfe-1.mp3 Note that the mention of a Shortwave Stereo transmitter on 6.250 MHz is, as of yet, still "vaporware"... it does sound neat in the ID, though! From dav259@csiro.au Fri Oct 04 01:39:03 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 4 Oct 2002 08:39:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 52057 invoked from network); 4 Oct 2002 08:39:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Oct 2002 08:39:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Oct 2002 08:39:00 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g948cwc21063; Fri, 4 Oct 2002 18:38:58 +1000 (EST) Date: Fri, 4 Oct 2002 18:38:58 +1000 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: amstereoforum Cc: AM Stereo Experience Subject: Digitally enhanced analog radio Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public This was recently posted on the Oz google board. Has anyone heard anything about it? If this actually worked it could be great for AM stereo - and Motorola may be back on side. Who knows? Sony might even return to the fold. - - - From: Programmer (spottylamond@hotmail.com) Subject: Motorola Debuts Digital Radio This is the only article in this thread View: Original Format Newsgroups: aus.radio.broadcast Date: 2002-10-02 19:30:29 PST Motorola Debuts Digital Radio Motorola's Semiconductor Products Sector has developed a new digital radio technology that "provides enhanced sound quality and improved signal reception for existing analog broadcasts" according to a corporate statement. While not positioning the technology as competitive with IBOC, it is being marketed as a digital radio alternative. "Motorola's Digital Radio takes familiar, age-old analog radio and catapults it into a new age," says Jim Turley, semiconductor industry analyst. "Now humble car radios will compare favorably with satellite radio, delivering more stations, better sound, and less interference ? at almost no cost." * Designed from 24-bit digital audio architecture, Motorola Digital Radio uses software algorithms to tune, filter, and improve the audio signal "in place of methods that are impossible to implement via analog circuits." According to the company, the benefits of Motorola Digital Radio include: * Range Extension FM Demodulator * Better Adjacent Interference Suppression * Improved Multipath Interference Suppression * Embedded Radio Data System * Stereo Separation * Dual Source Playback * Baseband Audio Processing Motorola plans to roll out the Digital Radio at the end of 2003, just in time for holiday buying. I wonder how long it will take to reach Australia. Still... don't give up on AM radio http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&group=aus.radio.broadcast From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Fri Oct 04 07:27:27 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 4 Oct 2002 14:27:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 82094 invoked from network); 4 Oct 2002 14:27:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Oct 2002 14:27:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14204.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.146) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Oct 2002 14:27:27 -0000 Message-ID: <20021004142727.54896.qmail@web14204.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.45.202.244] by web14204.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 04 Oct 2002 07:27:27 PDT Date: Fri, 4 Oct 2002 07:27:27 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Help Me Out Guys To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: John Pavlica X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio Kevin, Marv, Scott, Bob, anybody -want to back me up on the flaming I received on the Radio-Tech List that there's more than 200,000 AM Stereo listeners in the United States? __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? New DSL Internet Access from SBC & Yahoo! http://sbc.yahoo.com From evergreenterrace@buzzle.com Fri Oct 04 08:06:56 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: evergreenterrace@buzzle.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 4 Oct 2002 15:06:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 69703 invoked from network); 4 Oct 2002 15:06:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Oct 2002 15:06:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Oct 2002 15:06:55 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.140] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 04 Oct 2002 15:06:55 -0000 Date: Fri, 04 Oct 2002 15:06:51 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: the Kevtronimod Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 838 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgliradio" X-Originating-IP: 141.157.200.176 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=69711087 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgliradio > Heh... I won't spill the exact secrets of the "Kevtronimod" just yet, > but I will say that it is actually the opposite of 1070 WKMB's famous > "Rontimod", which uses gentle multi-band compression followed by > aggressive single-band limiting (through a vintage Gates Statesman). > On the other hand, the "Kevtronimod" uses aggressive single-band > compression followed by gentle multi-band limiting. The way to go is multiband all the way. BUT... if you do want wideband somewhere in the chain, it's best that it is your compressor and NOT your limiter. A wideband limiter following multiband compression basically can "undo" any IM the compressor has eliminated. It is best to use a wideband compressor with little IM and then do your multiband limiting. Your unit sounds pretty good. I'd love to know WHAT it is! From amfmdx@fastq.com Fri Oct 04 09:21:48 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 4 Oct 2002 16:21:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 99813 invoked from network); 4 Oct 2002 16:21:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Oct 2002 16:21:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Oct 2002 16:21:46 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt (d20-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.52]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id g94GLjh99714 for ; Fri, 4 Oct 2002 09:21:45 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <011901c26bc1$cb5683a0$f2d63fd1@kredding430cdt> To: References: <20021004142727.54896.qmail@web14204.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Help Me Out Guys Date: Fri, 4 Oct 2002 09:19:18 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > Kevin, Marv, Scott, Bob, anybody > -want to back me up on the flaming I received on the Radio-Tech List that > there's more than 200,000 AM Stereo listeners in the United States? Its a done deal, see below. Edwin, I am not going to argue anything but this one point because its a very foolish thing you have said. Your quote is below all this big pile of words. KNX in Los Angeles is stereo and I would bet they have more than 200k listeners. WBAP in Ft. Worth is stereo and I would bet they have more than 200k listeners. But then so do KABC in LA and KABL in San Francisco, WLS in Chicago and a ton of others and they also are in Stereo. I listen to C-QUAM stereo and I like it. I don't have to waste money on an AM IBAC radio that will only be usable in the day when I am at work, surrounded by computers and fluorescent lights in a concrete and steel mesh building. IBOC will not save AM radio. In fact, IBAC will not make any difference in FM radio also. The sole thing that will change anything at all is that the people programming radio expand playlists, stop McRadio, get rid of idiotic shock jocks and go for local content. The greedsters in the accounting departments who can't see past the next 15 minutes will NEVER let this happen until radio crashes around their feet. And its happening. Kids don't listen to radio. You can take that to the bank. It isn't the pipe, its what the pipe carries. If the content isnt good then the technical part is wasted. Its kind of like going to a fancy restaurant where a waiter comes out with a fancy silver platter with a shiny silver dome on it and when he goes to serve you, theres a steaming pile of dung under the cover. No matter how you dress it up, its still a reeking, steaming pile of dung. This is what radio is doing, serving crap in a new shiny platform. Its the programming guys. If you put good programming on people will listen and you will make tons of money. If you put IBAC on and the people realize they have to spend thousands on new radios, stereo equipment and the like, you can kiss radio goodbye. Kevin Message: 1 From: "Edwin Bukont" To: Subject: Re: [RT] IBOC/HD need not apply - it's already here / done. Date: Fri, 4 Oct 2002 00:10:22 -0400 Organization: Comm-Struction & Services Reply-To: radio-tech@broadcast.net I bet not one your 300 analog AM stereo stations has a verified listener base of 200,000. I would be surprised if they had that in total. "Its going to get a lot worse before it gets worse" - Lily Tomlin From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Oct 04 09:43:43 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 4 Oct 2002 16:43:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 74693 invoked from network); 4 Oct 2002 16:43:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Oct 2002 16:43:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Oct 2002 16:43:42 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-89-106.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.106]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g94Gcmco026930 for ; Fri, 4 Oct 2002 11:38:49 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <004801c26bc5$8181ec20$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: the Kevtronimod Date: Fri, 4 Oct 2002 11:45:51 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude That's exactly Orban's analog scheme. I never figured out why it would work, especially on urban and disco music, since the heavy bass could still cause pumping on the broadband limiter. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kevin T." > On the other hand, the "Kevtronimod" uses aggressive single-band > compression followed by gentle multi-band limiting. > From philipr@irac.pe.ca Fri Oct 04 09:52:55 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 4 Oct 2002 16:52:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 89938 invoked from network); 4 Oct 2002 16:52:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Oct 2002 16:52:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Oct 2002 16:52:54 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.136] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 04 Oct 2002 16:52:54 -0000 Date: Fri, 04 Oct 2002 16:52:54 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: The Kevtronimod v. the UniMod Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3171 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking Back in law school - 10 to 12 years ago - I maintained my sanity by building some kits, and scratch building a little stereo compressor/limiter. Inspired by CIHI Stereo 126, and frustrated by a total inability to get AM Stereo gear, even at the Sony Store, I named this little compressor limiter the "UniMod AM Stereo Processor" a cute little rig that runs virtually forever on 2 9 volt batteries, using a few transistors, a couple Op-Amps, and a 4049 non B series IC. Lots of good old fashioned pumping! Sounded kind of cool in those days on my old LPB 6B, and later on various Ramsey FM rigs. Come to think of it, CIHI had lots of pumping too, and they seemed to go off the air every time they played Timmy T's "One More Try". To this day, I associate this very song with a station bouncing off the air. Sadly I never heard CIHI in stereo. They later adopted their sister stations call letters, became CKHJ, playing C&W music. And yes, they call themselves "KHJ". Sort of like CFDR in Halifax, which calls themselves KIXX. Confusing? You bet! For a while, KHJ, in its FM guise, was on 93.1 - "93 KHJ" A few years ago 50 kw CFNB [with a massive coverage area] flipped to a pathetic 100 kw FM station with CIBX [I think] for call letters and a very pathetic coverage area for 100kw! I still have the "UniMod" - semi-retired now that I have the NanoCompressor. --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin T." wrote: > > Any chance of seeing this rig? This has made me curious! Sounds > > terrific! A good processor always comes in handy! > > Heh... I won't spill the exact secrets of the "Kevtronimod" just yet, > but I will say that it is actually the opposite of 1070 WKMB's famous > "Rontimod", which uses gentle multi-band compression followed by > aggressive single-band limiting (through a vintage Gates Statesman). > On the other hand, the "Kevtronimod" uses aggressive single-band > compression followed by gentle multi-band limiting. > > This difference is mostly a matter of personal preference; in recent > years, the widespread use of portable and car CD players in noisy > environments has led record companies toward the use of heavy > multi-band compression right on the CD audio, to make it sound > "louder" and more "radio-like", so the use of multi-band compression > in a radio station's processing (i.e. Optimod) is actually *doubling > up* this effect, leading to an even further reduction of dynamic > range. It's prevalent enough that I can often compare the cassette > version of an album to the CD version, and the cassette will sound > *better*, because of the analog-type audio processing that was used > in its mastering process. > > Anyway, if you'd like to get a taste of the "Kevtronimod" in actual > AM Stereo broadcast use, here are some examples that I did a while > back: > > ftp://209.193.86.116/North-America/USA/NewJersey/1500kjfe.mp3 > > ftp://209.193.86.116/North-America/USA/NewJersey/kjfe-1.mp3 > > Note that the mention of a Shortwave Stereo transmitter on 6.250 MHz > is, as of yet, still "vaporware"... it does sound neat in the ID, > though! From philipr@irac.pe.ca Fri Oct 04 10:06:07 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 4 Oct 2002 17:06:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 60252 invoked from network); 4 Oct 2002 17:06:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Oct 2002 17:06:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Oct 2002 17:06:06 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.137] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 04 Oct 2002 17:06:06 -0000 Date: Fri, 04 Oct 2002 17:06:05 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Help Me Out Guys Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <011901c26bc1$cb5683a0$f2d63fd1@kredding430cdt> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3686 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking On this side of the Canada-US border, smalltown AM Stereo CJFX has [or at least HAD] routine BBM weekly circulation figures of 100,000 or so people - not bad when Antigonish Town only has 5000 people. It shows the importance of 25,000 watts radiating off two 430 foot tall towers on 580 khz. However, once this goes dark in trade for 75kw of FM, the numbers may go down, as the FM contour maps reveal that most of Cape Breton Island - with approximately 175,000 people - much of said Island prime CJFX stomping ground since 1943, will be deep fringe territory for the FM. hey, their only so many PT-1s and Sansui's to go around! Once again, AM has a lot of advantages - including potentially enormous coverage areas - and the ability to roll over the hills, and back down to fill the valleys - something line of site FM cannot do. Its hard to beat a nice ground wave! There is gold in those kilohertz. Phil --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" wrote: > > Kevin, Marv, Scott, Bob, anybody > > -want to back me up on the flaming I received on the Radio-Tech List that > > there's more than 200,000 AM Stereo listeners in the United States? > > Its a done deal, see below. > > Edwin, > > I am not going to argue anything but this one point because its a very > foolish thing you have said. Your quote is below all this big pile of words. > > KNX in Los Angeles is stereo and I would bet they have more than 200k > listeners. > WBAP in Ft. Worth is stereo and I would bet they have more than 200k > listeners. > > But then so do KABC in LA and KABL in San Francisco, WLS in Chicago and a > ton of others and they also are in Stereo. > > I listen to C-QUAM stereo and I like it. I don't have to waste money on an > AM IBAC radio that will only be usable in the day when I am at work, > surrounded by computers and fluorescent lights in a concrete and steel mesh > building. IBOC will not save AM radio. In fact, IBAC will not make any > difference in FM radio also. > > The sole thing that will change anything at all is that the people > programming radio expand playlists, stop McRadio, get rid of idiotic shock > jocks and go for local content. The greedsters in the accounting departments > who can't see past the next 15 minutes will NEVER let this happen until > radio crashes around their feet. And its happening. Kids don't listen to > radio. You can take that to the bank. > > It isn't the pipe, its what the pipe carries. If the content isnt good then > the technical part is wasted. Its kind of like going to a fancy restaurant > where a waiter comes out with a fancy silver platter with a shiny silver > dome on it and when he goes to serve you, theres a steaming pile of dung > under the cover. No matter how you dress it up, its still a reeking, > steaming pile of dung. > > This is what radio is doing, serving crap in a new shiny platform. > > Its the programming guys. If you put good programming on people will listen > and you will make tons of money. If you put IBAC on and the people realize > they have to spend thousands on new radios, stereo equipment and the like, > you can kiss radio goodbye. > > Kevin > > Message: 1 > From: "Edwin Bukont" > To: > Subject: Re: [RT] IBOC/HD need not apply - it's already here / done. > Date: Fri, 4 Oct 2002 00:10:22 -0400 > Organization: Comm-Struction & Services > Reply-To: radio-tech@b... > > I bet not one your 300 analog AM stereo stations has a verified > listener base of 200,000. I would be surprised if they had that in total. > > "Its going to get a lot worse before it > gets worse" - Lily Tomlin From jsgil@hal-pc.org Fri Oct 04 11:13:50 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 4 Oct 2002 18:13:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 89160 invoked from network); 4 Oct 2002 18:13:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Oct 2002 18:13:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Oct 2002 18:13:45 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.134] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 04 Oct 2002 18:13:45 -0000 Date: Fri, 04 Oct 2002 18:13:43 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Panasonic C-QuAM Generator Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 201 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.83 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst eBay has a Panasonic VP8254P AM Stereo Generator starting at a $1 but has a reserve not yet met. No telling what the minimun is. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1386195155 JSG From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Oct 04 16:53:48 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 4 Oct 2002 23:53:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 22906 invoked from network); 4 Oct 2002 23:53:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Oct 2002 23:53:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Oct 2002 23:53:47 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.131] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 04 Oct 2002 23:53:47 -0000 Date: Fri, 04 Oct 2002 23:53:45 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Digitally enhanced analog radio Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2134 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.96.144 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics Motorola's AMAX chip-set delivers an excellent level of quality from analog AM Stereo, as anybody with an AMAX-type Chrysler or Delco car radio, a Denon TU-680NAB, or a new Fanfare tuner can tell you. In fact I was just listening to a Chrysler AMAX radio today, and on a clear, well-processed AM signal, I have no doubt that most people would say it sounds *better* than FM, even in Mono. However, few radio manufacturers are willing to accomodate the extra cost and design effort that using the analog AMAX system in a receiver requires. And meanwhile, Motorola released the DSP code necessary to digitally receive C-Quam AM Stereo quite a while ago, and some radios, such as the Visteon CD-6, are already using DSP-based AM Stereo reception. In this case, the extra cost is neglibile, as the only difference versus standard mono AM is some extra lines of computer code programmed into the DSP chip, much like how support for RDS decoding on FM is added. So, if Motorola is going to place any effort at all into improving the performance of AM in this new digital system, why re-invent the wheel? An excellent set of standards for providing high quality AM and AM Stereo -- AMAX -- has already existed for a decade, so simply designing the new digital-based AM tuner to meet the existing AMAX standards would probably *save* them time and development costs versus starting from scratch and trying to find out what improvements to make (variable IF bandwidth, noise blanking, etc.). This being said, I have tried out Volkswagen's new 2002 "full-height" car radio which uses DSP-based reception, and I have to say that its performance on both AM and FM is very mediocre. It does have better than average mid-range audio response on AM, but they set the sampling rate too low, so the response drops off like a cliff at exactly 6 kHz. Correspondingly, the FM also sounds unnaturally dull, because its audio response is chopped off at 12 kHz! Even with the treble control turned all the way up, the high-end "crispness" is noticeably absent on FM. Also, there is NO STEREO INDICATOR, even for FM! From amfmdx@fastq.com Fri Oct 04 21:23:19 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 5 Oct 2002 04:23:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 89272 invoked from network); 5 Oct 2002 04:23:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Oct 2002 04:23:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Oct 2002 04:23:05 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt ([207.173.147.247]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id g954N3h16288 for ; Fri, 4 Oct 2002 21:23:04 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <01d601c26c26$872c9c40$f2d63fd1@kredding430cdt> To: Subject: For Jay Rogers... Date: Fri, 4 Oct 2002 21:20:23 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla You can smile about this Jay... · 47 C.F.R. § 73.1560 - Operating Power and Mode Tolerances o North American Broadcasting Company, Inc., Cave Creek, Arizona. $4,000 NAL. San Diego, CA District Office (8/30/02). "Its going to get a lot worse before it gets worse" - Lily Tomlin From dav259@csiro.au Fri Oct 04 21:35:05 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 5 Oct 2002 04:35:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 37766 invoked from network); 5 Oct 2002 04:34:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Oct 2002 04:34:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Oct 2002 04:34:29 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g954YSc23480 for ; Sat, 5 Oct 2002 14:34:28 +1000 (EST) Date: Sat, 5 Oct 2002 14:34:28 +1000 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Help Me Out Guys In-Reply-To: <011901c26bc1$cb5683a0$f2d63fd1@kredding430cdt> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public On Fri, 4 Oct 2002, Kevin - Mesa, Arizona wrote: > This is what radio is doing, serving crap in a new shiny platform. > > Its the programming guys. If you put good programming on people will listen > and you will make tons of money. If you put IBAC on and the people realize > they have to spend thousands on new radios, stereo equipment and the like, > you can kiss radio goodbye. I couldn't agree more. The footy is over here and Southern Cross is starting an experiment today networking 12 hours of prime time talkback radio each weekend to Oz's four biggest capitals - and presumably relays. Nationally from Sydney we're to be treated to the musings of Sharina - a clairvoyant with a successful track record - she predicted Tom and Nicole's divorce and Russell Crowe's Oscar nomination. Well - there you are - QED. And not to be outdone - nationally from Melbourne our health communicator - Dr Sally Cockburn (no joke) - whose success so far on radio has been running a sex therapy show on FM calling herself Dr Feelgood. God help us! May these programs fail abysmally. Tony Bell - the dingaling in charge of SCB - has said it's not a cost cutting excercise but "an exciting development". I would have quite happily moved to FM when it arrived commercially here in 1980. But I hate the programming! When AM stereo arrived five years later it was Christmas for me. And it still is. We need to broaden our horizons. Listeners will only embrace AM stereo if they actually like the programming first. AM stereo is the icing on the cake. Ian Melbourne From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Fri Oct 04 22:30:08 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 5 Oct 2002 05:30:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 89231 invoked from network); 5 Oct 2002 05:30:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Oct 2002 05:30:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web40803.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.78.180) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Oct 2002 05:30:07 -0000 Message-ID: <20021005053007.86262.qmail@web40803.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.34.134] by web40803.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 04 Oct 2002 22:30:07 PDT Date: Fri, 4 Oct 2002 22:30:07 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: {AMSF} For Jay Rogers... To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: <01d601c26c26$872c9c40$f2d63fd1@kredding430cdt> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio Thank you! Thank you! Thank you! Maybe they'll send the Boston boys to WALE! This is a great day! 73, Jay,N1WVQ __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Faith Hill - Exclusive Performances, Videos & More http://faith.yahoo.com From amfmdx@fastq.com Sat Oct 05 00:18:04 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 5 Oct 2002 07:18:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 68905 invoked from network); 5 Oct 2002 07:18:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Oct 2002 07:18:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Oct 2002 07:18:03 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt (d152-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.184]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id g957I2h17557 for ; Sat, 5 Oct 2002 00:18:02 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <022201c26c3e$fe3d5640$f2d63fd1@kredding430cdt> To: References: <20021005053007.86262.qmail@web40803.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} For Jay Rogers... Date: Sat, 5 Oct 2002 00:15:30 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla Jay, If you know the right people you can get them down there too... Theres more to come out of this I am sure. Kevin ----- Original Message ----- From: "JNR" To: Sent: Friday, October 04, 2002 10:30 PM Subject: Re: {AMSF} For Jay Rogers... > Thank you! Thank you! Thank you! Maybe they'll > send the Boston boys to WALE! > > This is a great day! > > 73, > Jay,N1WVQ > > __________________________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Faith Hill - Exclusive Performances, Videos & More > http://faith.yahoo.com > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > From alinton@esatclear.ie Sat Oct 05 05:18:45 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: alinton@esatclear.ie X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 5 Oct 2002 12:18:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 24861 invoked from network); 5 Oct 2002 12:18:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Oct 2002 12:18:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO davros) (194.145.130.183) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Oct 2002 12:18:44 -0000 Received: from Spooler by davros (Mercury/32 v3.30) ID MO000117; 5 Oct 02 13:18:48 +0100 Received: from spooler by totalbroadcast.net (Mercury/32 v3.30); 5 Oct 02 13:18:33 +0100 Received: from fr1.esatclear.ie (192.168.0.1) by davros (Mercury/32 v3.30) with ESMTP ID MG000116; 5 Oct 02 13:18:29 +0100 Message-Id: <5.1.1.2.2.20021005131722.0281bcc8@fr1> X-Sender: alinton@fr1 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1.1.3 (Beta) Date: Sat, 05 Oct 2002 13:18:28 +0100 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: the Kevtronimod In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed From: Andy Linton X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10800314 X-Yahoo-Profile: alinton1_ie Great quality Kev! I have a couple of questions: What was the chain? i.e. what tx, what receiver, how recorded? What is the second song on the 1500kjfe.mp3 file? thanks! From jeffdeck@aol.com Sat Oct 05 05:21:10 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jeffdeck@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 5 Oct 2002 12:21:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 81833 invoked from network); 5 Oct 2002 12:21:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Oct 2002 12:21:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Oct 2002 12:21:10 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.177] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 05 Oct 2002 12:21:04 -0000 Date: Sat, 05 Oct 2002 12:21:01 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Motorola Synphony Radio Chipset Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 13000 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jeffdeck2001" X-Originating-IP: 205.188.209.76 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=4430287 X-Yahoo-Profile: jeffdeck2001 This is the official Motorola press release on this subject: > >Motorola's Symphony(TM) Digital Radio Chipset Delivers Breakthrough >AM/FM Reception and Performance > >Christmas 2003 Radios Will Receive More Stations and Sound Notably >Better > >AUSTIN, Texas, Oct. 1 /PRNewswire-FirstCall/ -- Fans of AM/FM radio >wanting to enjoy improved sound need not pay for satellite digital >radio or wait for the introduction of land-based digital radio >broadcasts. In a move that has significant repercussions for the >digital radio industry, Motorola's (NYSE: MOT) Semiconductor >Products Sector has developed a new digital radio technology that >enhances sound quality and improves signal reception for existing AM >and FM analog broadcasts. > >Designed for home and automotive stereo systems, Motorola's Symphony >(TM) Digital Radio Chipset implements this new technology. Its >benefits to listeners are numerous: less static, fading, pops and >hisses; automatic tuning, so that adjacent stations won't interfere >with each other; extended listening range from existing signals; and >overall improved audio clarity and volume. The bottom line: > >listeners can hear more stations, whether at home or on the road, >tune to more remote stations with greater ease and enjoy higher >quality sound. > >Unlike other digital radio offerings, the Symphony Digital Radio >Chipset does not require broadcasters to buy new digital broadcast >equipment. Neither does it require consumers to pay a monthly >subscription fee like those charged by satellite services because it >operates on traditional AM/FM analog broadcasts. > >"Motorola's Symphony Digital Radio combines all of Motorola's >traditional strengths in semiconductors, communications, and >radios," says Jim Turley, semiconductor industry analyst. "It takes >familiar, age-old analog car radio and catapults it into a new age. >Now humble car radios will compare favorably with satellite radio, >delivering more stations, better sound, and less interference -- at >almost no cost. It's even upgradeable through software changes. When >Symphony-enabled radios hit the market at the end of 2003, they'll >definitely be on my Christmas list." > >Symphony Digital Radio technology, usable anywhere in the radio >spectrum, is being applied initially in radio receivers tuning >analog AM and FM signals. Impressed by the superior audio quality in >tests against high-end analog sound systems, several consumer >electronics manufacturers plan to introduce radios based on Symphony >Digital Radio in 2003. > >"In our quest to bring music lovers an ever-improved listening >experience, we are always looking for new technologies that will >help us advance sound quality and signal reception performance," >said Hyundai Autonet president J. J. Yoon. "Symphony Digital Radio >is truly a breakthrough technology for the radio industry much as >the CD was for the recording industry." > >Digital radio is a nascent and growing market. Today, there are an >estimated 800 million analog radios in cars and alarm clocks, boom >boxes and PCs throughout the United States. Two types of digital >radio, satellite and land-based, have focused on transmitting >digital formatted signals to radios equipped with digital receivers. >Symphony Digital Radio allows listeners to listen to the stations >broadcasting today, without changes at the transmitter. Overall, >Allied Business Intelligence predicts that shipments of digital >radio receivers in the United States will increase from 650,000 >units in 2002 to more than 33 million units in 2007. > >"Motorola's extensive experience with digital audio has given us a >keen understanding of consumer requirements and engineering >challenges in the audio market," said Motorola vice-president Bill >Pfaff. "With Symphony Digital Radio, we have built on that >experience and created a product that you have to hear to believe. >We believe this product will change the way people listen to the >radio." > > The Magic Behind Symphony Digital Radio > >The key to Symphony Digital Radio's performance leap is through >frequency tuning: by software instead of the traditional analog >means. Designed from the 24-bit DSP Symphony Digital Audio >architecture, Symphony Digital Radio uses software algorithms to >tune, filter and improve the signal using methods that are >impossible to implement via traditional analog circuits. One can >simply download new software to incorporate new radio features and >improvements. > >Motorola's Symphony Digital Audio has a long history of audio >innovation and improvements in a variety of sound systems from music >creation, mastering, commercial theatre surround-sound systems, to >home entertainment systems, to digital audio players such as MP3, >CDs and DVDs. The Symphony Digital Radio chipset can be used in a >variety of radio models, from the feature-rich high- end systems to >entry-level lower-feature versions. > > Benefits Include: >Range Extension FM Demodulator - The FM demodulator algorithm used in >Symphony Digital Radio, which separates the FM signal from the >carrier, provides superior range extension and improved Signal-to- >Noise Ratio (SNR) under weak signal conditions over traditional >digital demodulation techniques. In other words, this radio can >pick up weaker signals from a greater distance and still provide >sparkling clear reception. Essentially, the Symphony Digital Radio >can find low-level signals that a standard analog radio cannot. > >Better Adjacent Interference Suppression -- Adjacent radio signals >often interfere with each other, not only because they are close >together, but also because traditional tuning cannot lock onto a >signal and hold it under changing atmospheric and terrain >conditions. The Variable Intermediate Frequency Filter algorithm >used in Symphony Digital Radio automatically adjusts itself to both >100KHz and 200KHz band channel spacing, while dynamically reacting >to any changes in the environment. > >Improved Multipath Interference Suppression -- In environments with >mountains, hills, or tall buildings, radio signals bounce off hard >surfaces and are reflected multiple times onto a receiver's antenna. >These reflections can interfere with each other and cause buzzing, >pops, and sudden dropouts, phenomena collectively known as multipath >interference. The Symphony Channel Effects Equalizer minimizes the >effect of these many reflected signals for single antenna systems. >Additionally, by utilizing two antennas, the radio can make >intelligent decisions about signal conditions on both antennas to >form a better signal with reduced fading. > >Embedded Radio Data System/Radio Broadcast Data System Demodulation >and Decoding -- The Symphony Digital Radio baseband processor >contains an embedded RDS/RBDS demodulator and decoder with error >correction for those areas offering Radio Data System (RDS) >information on FM broadcasts. Such broadcasts typically involve >station and program identification as well as traffic information. >Station and program information is used to provide frequency >diversity for improved FM reception. The Symphony Digital Radio >chipset can take advantage of this by performing fast Alternate >Frequency switching inside the chipset, rather than by depending on >the much slower system microcontroller to make such decisions. > >Stereo Separation -- In addition, the Symphony Digital Radio provides >excellent stereo separation, often greater than 40 dB, thus exceeding >the performance of current premium analog radios. The software >architecture allows for audio processing and radio tuning >simultaneously on a single processor/software thread. The baseband >and audio processor can now handle dual audio streams. By using a >software approach to digital radio implementation, Motorola is able >to reach exceptional levels of digital radio integration in a >smaller, lighter and far more flexible platform. > >Dual Source Playback -- The Symphony Digital Radio chipset solution >can be configured for single or dual simultaneous source for >playback. In a car, this means separate front and rear-seat audio, >either two different radio stations or one radio and one CD input, >for example. In the home, this means that different family members >could use the same receiver to tune to their favorite stations in >different parts of the house. The Symphony's software architecture >allows for audio processing and radio tuning simultaneously on a >single processor/software thread. The baseband and audio processor >can also handle dual audio streams. By using a software approach to >digital radio implementation, Motorola is able to reach exceptional >levels of digital radio integration in a smaller, lighter and far >more flexible platform. > >Improved Flexibility -- Radio manufacturers can develop new features >through software programming instead of waiting for new silicon to be >added, thus improving performance without enlarging the footprint. >Manufacturers can tweak radio parameters, turn various algorithms on >or off for experimentation, even develop their own algorithms and >download them into RAM. A rich library of third party algorithms is >available today through Motorola's Symphony Digital Audio family. >The Symphony platform provides sufficient program and data RAM for >radio manufacturers to differentiate between their own radio models >via different down-loadable features, or to distinguish themselves >from other manufacturers by providing their own radio and audio >algorithms. > >Baseband Audio Processing -- The baseband/audio processor also >features a number of Motorola's well-established "plug and play" >audio post-processing features. Also, the open architecture of the >Motorola DSP platform allows for third-party development of new >audio algorithms. This combination creates a rich library of >functions that radio manufacturers can use to differentiate their >products. Some of these features include Bass Management, Delay >Management, volume control, dynamic range compression, parametric >equalization (EQ), graphic EQ, bass/midrange/treble control, >loudness, speaker compensation, Dolby B Noise Reduction, Soundfield >Processing, spectrum analysis and level display. > >Baseband Audio Decoding -- The baseband/audio processor provides >embedded multi-channel decoding of 5.1, or six-channel decoding, >Dolby Digital from DVD sources, as well as support for Dolby >ProLogic II and DTS Neo:6 in order to create multi-channel surround- >sound effects from stereo sources. > >Technical Features: > >The heart of the Symphony Digital Radio system is the baseband/audio >processor. All baseband radio and audio processing is performed on >this single chip rather than a series of chips. Highly integrated >with advanced features, the baseband/audio processor reduces space >and cost while providing a number of significant functions to >enhance performance: > >One or two RF front-end chips with AM, FM and Weatherband tuning >capability (200 KHz to 165 MHz) > >An all-digital DSP baseband/audio processor, including several >special-purpose DSPs and one general-purpose DSP on a single piece >of silicon > >An IF Sigma-Delta Analog-to-Digital (A/D) converter integrated with >audio A/D and Digital-to-Analog (D/A) converters to transfer data >between the RF front-end and the DSP back-end > >Digital input ports and Enhanced Serial Audio Interface (ESAI) to >connect external DSPs, Digital-to-Analog Converters (DACs) and other >devices to easily accommodate additional features > >An on-board 6-channel Asynchronous Sample Rate Converter (ASRC) for >interfacing to external digital devices, such as a MOST Bus or a DVD >player > >An on-board Sony-Philips Digital Interface Format (SPDIF) Receiver > >Pricing and Availability > >The Symphony Digital Radio Chip Set is available now in sample >quantities at a suggested retail sample price of $29.95 (USD) per >three-part chip set. Volume production is planned for 2003. > >About Motorola > >As the world's #1 producer of embedded processors, Motorola's >Semiconductor Products Sector creates DigitalDNA(TM) system-on-chip >solutions for a connected world. Our strong focus on wireless >communications and networking enables customers to develop smarter, >simpler, faster and synchronized products for the person, work team, >home and automobile. Motorola's worldwide semiconductor sales were >$4.9 billion (USD) in 2001. www.motorola.com/semiconductors > >Motorola, Inc. (NYSE: MOT) is a global leader in providing >integrated communications and embedded electronic solutions. Sales >in 2001 were $30 billion. For more information, please visit: >www.motorola.com > >MOTOROLA and the Stylized M Logo are registered in the US Patent & >Trademark Office. All other product or service names are the >property of their respective owners. > >Source: Motorola, Inc. From spfleck@citlink.net Sat Oct 05 09:15:16 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: spfleck@citlink.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 5 Oct 2002 16:15:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 73492 invoked from network); 5 Oct 2002 16:15:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Oct 2002 16:15:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO relay01.roc.frontiernet.net) (66.133.131.34) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Oct 2002 16:15:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 26109 invoked from network); 5 Oct 2002 16:15:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO Steve) ([170.215.241.180]) (envelope-sender ) by relay01.roc.frontiernet.net (qmail-ldap-1.03) with SMTP for ; 5 Oct 2002 16:15:15 -0000 Message-ID: <016e01c26c8a$66b7bf80$01c8a8c0@N2UBP> To: References: <1033804457.1168.23880.m12@yahoogroups.com> Subject: Digital radio - Motorola = signal processing Date: Sat, 5 Oct 2002 12:15:19 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Steve Fleckenstein" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=2988995 X-Yahoo-Profile: n2ubp Hasn't Blaupunkt had digital signal processing of analog signals built into their automotive line for a couple of years ? Sounds just like the Motorola announcement. Steve N2UBP From narkspud@hotmail.com Sat Oct 05 10:31:18 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: narkspud@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 5 Oct 2002 17:31:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 53839 invoked from network); 5 Oct 2002 17:31:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Oct 2002 17:31:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.83) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Oct 2002 17:31:17 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.137] by n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 05 Oct 2002 17:31:16 -0000 Date: Sat, 05 Oct 2002 17:31:15 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Reply from Motorola! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20021003165752.6206.qmail@web14206.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 494 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "narkspud" X-Originating-IP: 66.159.192.39 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=81956306 X-Yahoo-Profile: narkspud Quoting. . . . . . . "Because the Motorola Symphony Digital Radio chip set is software based, we are able to add features (like C-QUAM AM stereo) to the radio. The software for AM stereo is written (it was a labor of love for one of our software engineers). The decision to include it in the radio is up to the radio manufacturer. We have done our part by making the cost to upgrade a radio to AM stereo the cheapest it can be, just add some electrons. Thanks for your interest, Karen" From jeffdeck@aol.com Sat Oct 05 11:17:22 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jeffdeck@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 5 Oct 2002 18:17:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 31914 invoked from network); 5 Oct 2002 18:17:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Oct 2002 18:17:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Oct 2002 18:17:21 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.171] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 05 Oct 2002 18:17:21 -0000 Date: Sat, 05 Oct 2002 18:17:17 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Digital radio - Motorola = signal processing Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <016e01c26c8a$66b7bf80$01c8a8c0@N2UBP> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 336 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jeffdeck2001" X-Originating-IP: 152.163.189.99 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=4430287 X-Yahoo-Profile: jeffdeck2001 Motorola developed the Blaupunkt Digiceiver technology. 73, Jeff In a message dated 10/5/2002 12:16:54 PM Eastern Daylight Time, Steve writes: >Hasn't Blaupunkt had digital signal processing of analog signals >built into their automotive line for a couple of years ? Sounds just >like the Motorola announcement. > >Steve >N2UBP From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Oct 05 18:53:24 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 6 Oct 2002 01:53:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 33920 invoked from network); 6 Oct 2002 01:53:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Oct 2002 01:53:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Oct 2002 01:53:23 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.189] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Oct 2002 01:53:23 -0000 Date: Sun, 06 Oct 2002 01:53:19 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: the Kevtronimod Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <5.1.1.2.2.20021005131722.0281bcc8@fr1> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2272 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.81.130 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Great quality Kev! I have a couple of questions: > What was the chain? i.e. what tx, what receiver, how recorded? It was transmitted on Chris Cuff's "Alfredo Lite" C-Quam AM Stereo transmitter and received on a Sony SRF-A100 with Toshiba TA8124 decoder added on. It was then fed directly into the Aux input on my computer's sound card and encoded to MP3. > What is the second song on the 1500kjfe.mp3 file? That's "You Should Have Listened To Al" by Al Stewart, from one of his hard-to-find early albums called "Love Chronicles", recorded years before he became popular in 1976 with "Year Of The Cat". And speaking of which, here is a 1978 recording of "Year Of The Cat" as it was played on 95.5 WPLJ in New York City, featuring Al's spoken introduction explaining what the song is about. Cut and paste this URL into RealPlayer to hear it: pnm://207.50.192.228/other/PLJYearCat.ra Although obviously restricted by the limited response of this 32 kbps RealAudio stream, it gives you an example of how highly compressed WPLJ's audio was back then, as it continues to be today -- even more so now that the latest Optimud processors can digitally clip it to death to give a wonderful "make your ears bleed" sound. Digital peak clipping is a nasty thing, and unfortunately is even being done in the mastering process of many CDs today. Basically, in order to increase loudness, the top and bottom of the waveform is simply "hacked off" -- but unlike analog clipping which creates a distorted sound (like that of a guitar amp "fuzz box"), digital clipping works on a bit-by-bit basis to keep the audio volume at or below a certain reference level. I'm also seeing an increasing number of CDs being recorded with a 15.7 kHz MTS TV Stereo *pilot tone* in the audio. For example, "Bailamos" by Enrique Iglesias, "Foolish Games" by Jewel, and "If You're Gone" by Matchbox Twenty all contain pilot tones in their audio, right on the CDs! I can understand a bit of a 60 Hz hum leaking into the studio audio, but exactly how does a full strength MTS pilot tone get into the audio, and don't they see it on the spectrum analyzer before it gets mastered on the CD? Are there any studio recording buffs here that could shed some light on this? From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Oct 05 19:11:51 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 6 Oct 2002 02:11:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 87038 invoked from network); 6 Oct 2002 02:07:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Oct 2002 02:07:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Oct 2002 02:07:17 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.134] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Oct 2002 02:07:17 -0000 Date: Sun, 06 Oct 2002 02:07:16 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Digital radio - Motorola = signal processing Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 924 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.81.130 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Motorola developed the Blaupunkt Digiceiver technology. 73, Jeff And it also appears to be used in Volkswagen's new OEM car stereos. Listening to one in a 2002 VW Golf, it does have some form of noise reduction and automatic IF bandwidth control on AM, but alas, no C-Quam Stereo, and the maximum frequency response on strong signals is limited to 6 kHz. It almost fooled me, though, because once a station is tuned in, after a short delay the audio suddenly gets louder and clearer -- similar to the effect of AM Stereo being engaged shortly after a station is tuned in. p.s. If Motorola wants to keep analog AM alive, they should have a word with whoever is making those new LED-type traffic lights. Whenever I drive under one, I get a nice loud "SSSSSHHHH" on my radio as the noise and static generated by the LED's switching power supply momentarily wipes out the reception of even strong AM signals. From redledge78@yahoo.com Sun Oct 06 03:32:19 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: redledge78@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 6 Oct 2002 10:32:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 43708 invoked from network); 6 Oct 2002 10:32:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Oct 2002 10:32:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO proxymail.homerelay.com) (209.75.47.224) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Oct 2002 10:32:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 8308 invoked from network); 6 Oct 2002 10:32:05 -0000 Received: from vtcomm-6.homerelay.com (HELO yahoo.com) (209.75.47.216) by 0 with SMTP; 6 Oct 2002 10:32:05 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Cc: Date: 6 Oct 2002 03:32 -0500 Subject:Re:{AMSF} Digest Number 394 [ Part 5 of 5 ] From: redledge78@yahoo.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=59652447 X-Yahoo-Profile: redledge78 If it will be this easy to incorporate AM Stereo, manufacturers have no effing excuses.... Also, I did install a factory GM AM Stereo radio in my Buick Skyark. The radio's a 1992 AM/FM Cassette with an EQ. The sound quality is the real improvement though the high end could be a little better. Maybe I'll tape some AMS from the Denon but it's 3:30am so I'll do it later. ZZZZZZZZZZ..... Tom -------------------- FROM : amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com DATE : Sun 10/06/2002 01:28:32 PDT SUBJECT: {AMSF} Digest Number 394 [ Part 5 of 5 ] announcement. Steve N2UBP ________________________________________________________________________ ________________________________________________________________________ Message: 4 Date: Sat, 05 Oct 2002 17:31:15 -0000 From: "narkspud" Subject: Reply from Motorola! Quoting. . . . . . . "Because the Motorola Symphony Digital Radio chip set is software based, we are able to add features (like C-QUAM AM stereo) to the radio. The software for AM stereo is written (it was a labor of love for one of our software engineers). The decision to include it in the radio is up to the radio manufacturer. We have done our part by making the cost to upgrade a radio to AM stereo the cheapest it can be, just add some electrons. Thanks for your interest, Karen" ________________________________________________________________________ ________________________________________________________________________ Message: 5 Date: Sat, 05 Oct 2002 18:17:17 -0000 From: "jeffdeck2001" Subject: Re: Digital radio - Motorola = signal processing Motorola developed the Blaupunkt Digiceiver technology. 73, Jeff In a message dated 10/5/2002 12:16:54 PM Eastern Daylight Time, Steve writes: >Hasn't Blaupunkt had digital signal processing of analog signals >built into their automotive line for a couple of years ? Sounds just >like the Motorola announcement. > >Steve >N2UBP w recorded? From meridian3891@cs.com Sun Oct 06 09:13:04 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: meridian3891@cs.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 6 Oct 2002 16:13:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 64632 invoked from network); 6 Oct 2002 16:13:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Oct 2002 16:13:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Oct 2002 16:13:02 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.191] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Oct 2002 16:13:02 -0000 Date: Sun, 06 Oct 2002 16:13:01 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Digital radio - Motorola = signal processing Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 558 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Tony" X-Originating-IP: 205.188.209.76 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=48487815 X-Yahoo-Profile: onemeridian --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin T." wrote: > p.s. If Motorola wants to keep analog AM alive, they should have a > word with whoever is making those new LED-type traffic lights. > Whenever I drive under one, I get a nice loud "SSSSSHHHH" on my radio > as the noise and static generated by the LED's switching power supply > momentarily wipes out the reception of even strong AM signals. Kevin, Does this include the L.E.D. brake lights on newer cars & trucks too? I do not have AMS in the car. Tony From alinton@esatclear.ie Sun Oct 06 10:29:31 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: alinton@esatclear.ie X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 6 Oct 2002 17:29:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 23842 invoked from network); 6 Oct 2002 17:29:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Oct 2002 17:29:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO davros) (194.165.160.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Oct 2002 17:29:29 -0000 Received: from Spooler by davros (Mercury/32 v3.30) ID MO000103; 6 Oct 02 18:29:29 +0100 Received: from spooler by totalbroadcast.net (Mercury/32 v3.30); 6 Oct 02 18:29:18 +0100 Received: from fr1.esatclear.ie (192.168.0.1) by davros (Mercury/32 v3.30) with ESMTP ID MG000102; 6 Oct 02 18:29:16 +0100 X-MSReally-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Message-Id: <5.1.1.2.2.20021006182736.02aec438@fr1> X-Sender: alinton@fr1 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1.1.3 (Beta) Date: Sun, 06 Oct 2002 18:29:15 +0100 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: the Kevtronimod In-Reply-To: References: <5.1.1.2.2.20021005131722.0281bcc8@fr1> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed From: Andy Linton X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10800314 X-Yahoo-Profile: alinton1_ie Thanks for the info Kevin, I thought it was Al Stewart. Any chance of a copy of that track? I'd not heard it before. Why the add-on decoder for the SRFA-100, and can you give me details of it? Maybe off list if we're drifting too much! Cheers, ------------------------------- Andy Linton alinton@esatclear.ie Waterford, Ireland From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Sun Oct 06 11:51:03 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 6 Oct 2002 18:51:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 91579 invoked from network); 6 Oct 2002 18:51:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Oct 2002 18:51:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14201.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.143) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Oct 2002 18:51:00 -0000 Message-ID: <20021006185100.40271.qmail@web14201.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.127.54.199] by web14201.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 06 Oct 2002 11:51:00 PDT Date: Sun, 6 Oct 2002 11:51:00 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Another AM Stereo FAN is Born !!! To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: John Pavlica X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio Sharing some good news from another list: "I have a client low-power (700 Watt) omni AM ... I put a good stereo tuner at the transmitter site, tuned it to my Folk Music Public Radio Station, hooked it to the stereo Optimod-AM (that had been in mono for the last 4 years to save the cost of a second telco program line), and plugged the stereo card back into the BE AM-1 transmitter. Comments have been coming in fast and furious. The GM of the FM I'm re-broadcasting is amazed at how full and rich the sound is. The present owner of the AM station has had comments from his former programming client about how good it sounds. ... AM stereo done right has an organic, rich, emotionally satisfying feel to it that FM stereo just can't match. I know, I'm re-broadcasting a fully processed FM off-the-air signal. It still sounds really, really good on that little AM station. Probably the imperfection of the L+R and L-R audio phase match (due to side-band phase and amplitude non-linearities in the antenna system) creates a kind of stereo synthesizer effect that is artificial, but ( wow ) does it sound good. on this walker. . . Grady Moates Owner, LOUD & Clean Broadcast Science Voice 800 946-7007 Facsimile 800 529-5648 web email grady.moates@loudandclean.com " Sounds like we out to invite Grady to the AM Stereo party here on our list! __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Faith Hill - Exclusive Performances, Videos & More http://faith.yahoo.com From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Oct 06 19:14:10 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 7 Oct 2002 02:14:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 75723 invoked from network); 7 Oct 2002 02:14:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Oct 2002 02:14:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.67) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Oct 2002 02:14:08 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.136] by n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 07 Oct 2002 02:14:07 -0000 Date: Mon, 07 Oct 2002 02:14:07 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re:{AMSF} Digest Number 394 [ Part 5 of 5 ] Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 742 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.92.7 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > If it will be this easy to incorporate AM Stereo, manufacturers > have no effing excuses.... My question is, if the extra cost and effort to include AM Stereo in the DSP design is so small, then why isn't it a STANDARD FEATURE? I mean, Motorola wouldn't think of making the *FM* Stereo "optional", would they? I also don't recall seeing any mention of RDS, which would be extremely silly if it isn't included. RDS is very much like AM Stereo in that many stations transmit it, but very few radios receive it, and it has virtually no public awareness about its existence, at least in North America. (As opposed to Europe, where it's so popular that it's taken for granted, and even the *pirate* FM stations transmit with RDS!) From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Oct 06 19:25:18 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 7 Oct 2002 02:25:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 68305 invoked from network); 7 Oct 2002 02:25:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Oct 2002 02:25:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.87) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Oct 2002 02:25:18 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.183] by n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 07 Oct 2002 02:25:18 -0000 Date: Mon, 07 Oct 2002 02:25:16 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: the Kevtronimod Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <5.1.1.2.2.20021006182736.02aec438@fr1> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1345 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.92.7 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Thanks for the info Kevin, I thought it was Al Stewart. Any chance > of a copy of that track? I'd not heard it before. You're in luck, because I don't support the idea of music file "sharing" over the Internet, EXCEPT for songs that are virtually or completely unavailable otherwise. I'll work on it -- watch your e-mail box. > Why the add-on decoder for the SRFA-100, and can you give me > details of it? The Sony is an inherently VERY high quality radio, but is compromised by its "multi-system" decoder which doesn't properly decode C-Quam signals. The SRF-A100 easily accepts one of Chris's add-on decoders, and with careful design you can even get it to fit completely inside the case. A true Motorola-type C-Quam decoder improves the SRF-A100's audio quality very noticeably, both in reduced distortion and improved frequency response (especially in the low bass region). Combine it with proper NRSC de-emphasis and a 10 kHz "whistle filter", and it will give you true hi-fi AMAX sound quality that will rival that of the mid-'90s Chrysler and GM/Delco AMAX car radios. Here's an example of the net result of what I just described, as it sounded receiving WCTC 1450 AM Stereo on December 23, 2001: ftp://209.193.86.116/North-America/USA/NewJersey/wctc1223.mp3 If only all radios (and stations) sounded this good! From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Oct 06 19:55:08 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 7 Oct 2002 02:55:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 78843 invoked from network); 7 Oct 2002 02:55:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Oct 2002 02:55:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Oct 2002 02:55:08 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.165] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 07 Oct 2002 02:55:07 -0000 Date: Mon, 07 Oct 2002 02:55:07 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Another AM Stereo FAN is Born !!! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20021006185100.40271.qmail@web14201.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2509 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.92.7 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > AM stereo done right has an organic, rich, emotionally satisfying > feel to it that FM stereo just can't match. I know, I'm > re-broadcasting a fully processed FM off-the-air signal. > It still sounds really, really good on that little AM station. FM Stereo *does* sound very good when re-broadcast on AM Stereo. On an "Alfredo Lite", doing so allows you to really crank up the modulation, because the FM station's audio has already been squished to death through their OptiMud-type processor. And when you manage to come across an FM station with better than average audio (i.e. NPR, non-comm Jazz, Classical), that makes the end result all the more impressive. Although, I shouldn't put down Bob Orban too much. He is actually on my side regarding the issue of "hypercompression" -- the current trend of music being processed for maximum LOUDNESS right on the CD, which basically removes all traces of dyanmic range from the audio, and replaces it with the distortion caused by digital clipping. Thankfully, CD mastering engineers are finally starting to complain about this, after years of being FORCED to make CDs that way, from record companies which want their albums to sound LOUDER than the competition -- the good ol' "Loudness Wars", now on CD! Bob is also against this because the net result, when combined with Optimod-type processing on a radio station, is that these "hypercompressed" songs will sound QUIETER than others on the radio, because the newest Optimods detect the distortion caused by digital clipping and try to "correct" it. This leads to such annoying effects as the "quiet" and "loud" parts of a song being reversed, so that when the chorus begins and the full band kicks in, the audio level actually goes down! p.s. Don't buy the Beatles' latest "1" compilation album if you're against this -- it is terribly hypercompressed, and really f***s up the beautiful dynamic range that these songs had in their original form. For example, here is the amplitude graph of the song "Something", as it is on the original 1987 CD release of the "Abbey Road" album: http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/some-old.gif Then, compare it to how it is on the "1" CD, complete with the "flattened-off tops" characteristic of digital clipping: http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/some-new.gif And you though inferior remastering was only found on the el-cheapo K-Tel, Vee-Jay, and Pickwick LPs you bought in the five-and-dime stores decades ago! From redledge78@yahoo.com Sun Oct 06 20:28:17 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: redledge78@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 7 Oct 2002 03:28:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 27657 invoked from network); 7 Oct 2002 03:28:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Oct 2002 03:28:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO proxymail.homerelay.com) (209.75.47.224) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Oct 2002 03:28:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 10729 invoked from network); 7 Oct 2002 03:28:02 -0000 Received: from vtcomm-5.homerelay.com (HELO yahoo.com) (209.75.47.220) by 0 with SMTP; 7 Oct 2002 03:28:02 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit To: jeffdeck@aol.com,amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Cc: Date: 6 Oct 2002 20:28 -0500 Subject:Re:{AMSF} Digest Number 394 [ Part 5 of 5 ] From: redledge78@yahoo.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=59652447 X-Yahoo-Profile: redledge78 Manufacturers will have NO Excuses now -------------------- FROM : amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com DATE : Sun 10/06/2002 01:28:32 PDT SUBJECT: {AMSF} Digest Number 394 [ Part 5 of 5 ] announcement. Steve N2UBP ________________________________________________________________________ ________________________________________________________________________ Message: 4 Date: Sat, 05 Oct 2002 17:31:15 -0000 From: "narkspud" Subject: Reply from Motorola! Quoting. . . . . . . "Because the Motorola Symphony Digital Radio chip set is software based, we are able to add features (like C-QUAM AM stereo) to the radio. The software for AM stereo is written (it was a labor of love for one of our software engineers). The decision to include it in the radio is up to the radio manufacturer. We have done our part by making the cost to upgrade a radio to AM stereo the cheapest it can be, just add some electrons. Thanks for your interest, Karen" ________________________________________________________________________ ________________________________________________________________________ Message: 5 Date: Sat, 05 Oct 2002 18:17:17 -0000 From: "jeffdeck2001" Subject: Re: Digital radio - Motorola = signal processing Motorola developed the Blaupunkt Digiceiver technology. 73, Jeff In a message dated 10/5/2002 12:16:54 PM Eastern Daylight Time, Steve writes: >Hasn't Blaupunkt had digital signal processing of analog signals >built into their automotive line for a couple of years ? Sounds just >like the Motorola announcement. > >Steve >N2UBP ________________________________________________________________________ ________________________________________________________________________ Message: 6 Date: Sun, 06 Oct 2002 01:53:19 -0000 From: "Kevin T." Subject: Re: the Kevtronimod > Great quality Kev! I have a couple of questions: > What was the chain? i.e. what tx, what receiver, how recorded? It was transmitted on Chris Cuff's "Alfredo Lite" C-Quam AM Stereo transmitter and received on a Sony SRF-A100 with Toshiba TA8124 From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Sun Oct 06 21:33:42 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 7 Oct 2002 04:33:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 18451 invoked from network); 7 Oct 2002 04:33:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Oct 2002 04:33:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web40805.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.78.182) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Oct 2002 04:33:41 -0000 Message-ID: <20021007043341.60946.qmail@web40805.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.34.134] by web40805.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 06 Oct 2002 21:33:41 PDT Date: Sun, 6 Oct 2002 21:33:41 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: {AMSF} For Jay Rogers... To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: <022201c26c3e$fe3d5640$f2d63fd1@kredding430cdt> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio That's the thing: I don't know anyone @ the F.C.C.. But, I can still see the Enforcement Bureau on the website. Jay __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Faith Hill - Exclusive Performances, Videos & More http://faith.yahoo.com From groucho@skyweb.net Sun Oct 06 21:40:15 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 7 Oct 2002 04:40:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 29398 invoked from network); 7 Oct 2002 04:40:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Oct 2002 04:40:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Oct 2002 04:40:14 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g974ftYV036465 for ; Mon, 7 Oct 2002 00:41:55 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DA10ECD.816A20E0@skyweb.net> Date: Mon, 07 Oct 2002 00:34:21 -0400 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} For Jay Rogers... References: <20021007043341.60946.qmail@web40805.mail.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 I personally know 4 agents from the phily field office... and they are all ok Guys.. Neal JNR wrote: > That's the thing: I don't know anyone @ the > F.C.C.. But, I can still see the Enforcement > Bureau on the website. > > Jay > > __________________________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Faith Hill - Exclusive Performances, Videos & More > http://faith.yahoo.com > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From amfmdx@fastq.com Sun Oct 06 22:04:15 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 7 Oct 2002 05:04:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 54907 invoked from network); 7 Oct 2002 05:04:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Oct 2002 05:04:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Oct 2002 05:04:15 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt (d39-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.71]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id g9754Dh54262 for ; Sun, 6 Oct 2002 22:04:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <05ff01c26dbe$c772d280$f2d63fd1@kredding430cdt> To: References: <20021007043341.60946.qmail@web40805.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} For Jay Rogers... Date: Sun, 6 Oct 2002 22:02:45 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla Jay, I only know west coast guys and girls like June Butler, William Zears, Jeff Garretson and the like. You will have to get in touch with east coast guys to get something done. I think theres a Boston office but I am not sure. I only know people here in the San Diego office because they control the Phoenix area. Kevin ----- Original Message ----- From: "JNR" To: Sent: Sunday, October 06, 2002 9:33 PM Subject: Re: {AMSF} For Jay Rogers... > That's the thing: I don't know anyone @ the > F.C.C.. But, I can still see the Enforcement > Bureau on the website. > > Jay > > __________________________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Faith Hill - Exclusive Performances, Videos & More > http://faith.yahoo.com > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > From alfredot@inetarena.com Mon Oct 07 02:09:19 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: alfredot@inetarena.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 7 Oct 2002 09:09:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 85594 invoked from network); 7 Oct 2002 09:09:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Oct 2002 09:09:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.inetarena.com) (206.129.216.13) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Oct 2002 09:09:18 -0000 Received: from hendrie (1Cust82.tnt1.portland.or.da.uu.net [67.225.122.82]) by mail.inetarena.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id g9797oX00494 for ; Mon, 7 Oct 2002 02:07:50 -0700 (PDT) Date: Mon, 7 Oct 2002 02:09:03 -0700 (PDT) X-Sender: alfredo@hendrie.1610am.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Reply from Motorola! In-Reply-To: <1033892912.1035.92302.m12@yahoogroups.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: "Alfredo E. Torrejon" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=25132238 X-Yahoo-Profile: alfredotorrejon > Quoting. . . . . . . > > "Because the Motorola Symphony Digital Radio chip set is > software based, we are able to add features (like C-QUAM AM > stereo) to the radio. The software for AM stereo is written (it was > a labor of love for one of our software engineers). The decision > to include it in the radio is up to the radio manufacturer. We have > done our part by making the cost to upgrade a radio to AM stereo > the cheapest it can be, just add some electrons. Since the official press release went into so much detail about the FM functions of the chip but nothing about AM, I am still a bit skeptical about the performance of the AM algorithm. We'll have to see when manufacturers start to incorporate the Symphony chips into their radios--that is IF they decide to use the AM Stereo-capable version of the DSP code. Of course, I hope that the major manufacturers do pick the AM Stereo DSPs, but there's a cynical side of me that says that the engineering managers of Bose, Sony, etc. are locked into the marketing mentality that's been pushed over the last 15-20 years that says "FM radio is for music, AM is for spoken-word programming." Philips is the other manufacturer of DSP AM Stereo/FM Stereo receiver ICs, with the SAA7706H (see http://www.semiconductors.philips.com/pip/SAA7706H/N107http://www.semiconductors.philips.com/pip/SAA7706H/N107 ). From the description on that page, there are some variants of the chip that also include AM Co-channel and Adjacent channel detection algorithms in addition to AM Stereo. Note that receiver manufacturers still have the option to buy a SAA7706H that has only "plain vanilla" (i.e. low-fi mono) AM. Alfredo From alinton@esatclear.ie Mon Oct 07 02:58:10 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: alinton@esatclear.ie X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 7 Oct 2002 09:58:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 99107 invoked from network); 7 Oct 2002 09:58:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Oct 2002 09:58:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO davros) (159.134.148.168) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Oct 2002 09:58:08 -0000 Received: from Spooler by davros (Mercury/32 v3.30) ID MO00018C; 7 Oct 02 10:58:08 +0100 Received: from spooler by totalbroadcast.net (Mercury/32 v3.30); 7 Oct 02 10:58:00 +0100 Received: from fr1.esatclear.ie (192.168.0.1) by davros (Mercury/32 v3.30) with ESMTP ID MG00018B; 7 Oct 02 10:57:51 +0100 X-MSReally-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Message-Id: <5.1.1.2.2.20021007105507.02a8f7f8@fr1> X-Sender: alinton@fr1 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1.1.3 (Beta) Date: Mon, 07 Oct 2002 10:57:50 +0100 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: the Kevtronimod In-Reply-To: References: <5.1.1.2.2.20021006182736.02aec438@fr1> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed From: Andy Linton X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10800314 X-Yahoo-Profile: alinton1_ie At 02:25 07/10/2002 +0000, Kev wrote: >You're in luck, because I don't support the idea of music file >"sharing" over the Internet, EXCEPT for songs that are virtually or >completely unavailable otherwise. I'll work on it -- watch your >e-mail box. Great! Thanks! >The Sony is an inherently VERY high quality radio, but is compromised >by its "multi-system" decoder which doesn't properly decode C-Quam >signals. The SRF-A100 easily accepts one of Chris's add-on decoders, >and with careful design you can even get it to fit completely inside >the case. >I wonder if you could give me details of exactly how to add a CC decoder >to the SRFA-100 - I'm quite happy with the quality of mine, but it would >be interesting to hear the difference. I've also got a TM-152 here, but to me that doesn't sound as good as the Sony. >Here's an example of the net result of what I just described, as it >sounded receiving WCTC 1450 AM Stereo on December 23, 2001: > > ftp://209.193.86.116/North-America/USA/NewJersey/wctc1223.mp3 That really does sound excellent! rgds ----------------------------------- Andy Linton alinton@esatclear.ie Waterford, Ireland From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Mon Oct 07 07:22:50 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 7 Oct 2002 14:22:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 16599 invoked from network); 7 Oct 2002 14:22:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Oct 2002 14:22:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web40810.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.78.187) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Oct 2002 14:22:49 -0000 Message-ID: <20021007142248.5913.qmail@web40810.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.34.134] by web40810.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 07 Oct 2002 07:22:48 PDT Date: Mon, 7 Oct 2002 07:22:48 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Another AM Stereo FAN is Born !!! To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio What station is that? I've heard WLYN/1360-Lynn, Ma. is doing the exact same thing. WLYN USED to be stereo and I heard they were rebroadcasting WUMB-FM/91.9-Boston, which is the only F.M. folk station I've heard of. Come to think of it, it's the ONLY folk station I've heard of (besides the now-deceased WADN/1120-Concord, Ma.). Jay __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Faith Hill - Exclusive Performances, Videos & More http://faith.yahoo.com From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Mon Oct 07 07:25:31 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 7 Oct 2002 14:25:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 32939 invoked from network); 7 Oct 2002 14:25:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Oct 2002 14:25:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web40807.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.78.184) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Oct 2002 14:25:27 -0000 Message-ID: <20021007142527.16666.qmail@web40807.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.34.134] by web40807.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 07 Oct 2002 07:25:27 PDT Date: Mon, 7 Oct 2002 07:25:27 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: {AMSF} Another AM Stereo FAN is Born !!! To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: <20021006185100.40271.qmail@web14201.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio Hmmm...WLYN IS 700 Watts. I think Boston just gained another station. WLYN is too far for me to receive in Providence. Can anyone verify WLYN is back in stereo? 73, Jay,N1WVQ P.S.: I'll try on my radio but I doubt I'll hear it. __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Faith Hill - Exclusive Performances, Videos & More http://faith.yahoo.com From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Oct 07 08:05:19 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 7 Oct 2002 15:05:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 28565 invoked from network); 7 Oct 2002 15:05:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Oct 2002 15:05:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Oct 2002 15:05:17 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.190] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 07 Oct 2002 15:05:17 -0000 Date: Mon, 07 Oct 2002 15:05:16 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: re: Realistic TM-152 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <5.1.1.2.2.20021007105507.02a8f7f8@fr1> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 671 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > I've also got a TM-152 here, but to me that doesn't sound as good > as the Sony. The Realistic only has a 4.5 kHz ceramic filter, so it won't have the same high-end "sparkle" as the Sony, but it still does have pleasingly clear audio, due to the very gradual drop-off of the filter's response -- even in standard form, the TM-152 has some audio response all the way to about 12 kHz. And when you bypass the TM-152's ceramic filter and add on a new hi-fi MC13028 C-Quam decoder, then it REALLY starts to sound great: http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/cquam.mp3 Yes, this *is* AM Stereo you are hearing, as broadcast through the "Alfredo Lite" transmitter! From rjskadl@yahoo.com Mon Oct 07 08:17:25 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: rjskadl@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 7 Oct 2002 15:17:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 3220 invoked from network); 7 Oct 2002 15:17:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Oct 2002 15:17:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.88) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Oct 2002 15:17:22 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.157] by n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 07 Oct 2002 15:17:21 -0000 Date: Mon, 07 Oct 2002 15:17:20 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: IBOC Roadshow Comments Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3853 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "rjskadl" X-Originating-IP: 129.49.152.110 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=29619919 X-Yahoo-Profile: rjskadl At long last I am finally writing my comments about the poorly attended IBOC Roadshow. I really expected there to be more people there. IBOC is the future of radio isn't it? Not from where I was sitting. Harris was promising CD quality audio on FM and FM quality audio on AM. I don't get it. You can't fool a room full of engineers. What were they thinking. The audio samples were laughable. They picked worse case scenario sound on both the analog AM and FM and then played a simulation of how the IBOC will sound. I wasn't impressed. I'll leave it at that. There really isn't too much I can say that already hasn't been said. I do have a few comments though. As Mike mentioned, you could heat a full size house with all the extra equipment needed to run the IBOC gear. This brings up my first point. All the extra gear that is needed, and still it is a tricky system to implement. IBOC should be as simple as adding a subcarrier, but the proposed system is way too complicated. I can see possibly New York and a few of the other major markets implementing this system, but how in the world is a feeble company like Barnstable ever going to get this nightmare up and running. I see several hints that broadcasters are not completely sold on this system just yet. First off, the lack of attendance at the IBOC road show. Most of NYC's radio stations were not represented. Out of the stations that were represented, most didn't seem to be very supportive of IBOC. The crew from WQXR was highly skeptical. The GM of QXR stated that the audio isn't a problem, but t5hat the lack of effective programming is what's wrong with radio today. Second, We hear from both Phillips and Motorola about new DSP systems such as Motorola's symphony system. Why bother with DSP for analog if IBOC is the future? I think because perhaps the future of IBOC stinks and the big chip makers realize this. Third, I have been trying to aquire the BE AM Stereo exciter card from WLIE (formerly WLUX) and the engineers heading up the project are not ready to sell it to me yet. These are respectable engineers. They are known throughout the broadcasting industry. They are planning for IBOC, but will not part with the old AMS exciter? Mike mentioned that there are some nifty features with the IBOC data streams. I say Whoopty doo. Data streaming is already available through RDS or RBDS. All of the fancy schmantzy graphics and other crap is peripheral. Just more distractions for people driving down the road. Nobody is going to bother with this stuff on a home receiver, and the last thing I need to be doing is printing out coupons to TJMax while I am driving to work. They tried to sell the data streaming as the killer AP of IBOC. Too bad it already exists. "Why with the touch of a button, you can get the Traffic and weather instantly, without having to wait!" Yes, and then I can switch to another station that is playing music ant totally skip over your commercials. Sounds like a great way to make money. I think Digital disaster is an appropriate moniker. Perhaps Digital Disgrace is also appropriate. I just dont see how this is going to be implemented with grace. The transition to digital is going to be brutal and ugly. I think the best course of action is to stay with analog transmission and DSP on the receiver end. Digital has its place, and that is in on it's own band. You could probably even sell the new radios with DSP as digital radio. 95% of the population wouldn't know the difference or even care. As long as they get value for their money and good clean audio, that isall that matters. I seriously hope this is the route we go in. I am not holding out too much hope though. Look what the FCC did to us with the Telecom act of 1996. From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Mon Oct 07 12:33:05 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 7 Oct 2002 19:33:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 26107 invoked from network); 7 Oct 2002 19:33:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Oct 2002 19:33:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf09bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.169) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Oct 2002 19:33:02 -0000 Received: from juan ([67.34.180.169]) by imf09bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.19 201-253-122-122-119-20020516) with SMTP id <20021007193444.ZZCR11266.imf09bis.bellsouth.net@juan> for ; Mon, 7 Oct 2002 15:34:44 -0400 Message-ID: <003a01c26e38$584eac10$af78fea9@juan> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Another AM Stereo FAN is Born !!! Date: Mon, 7 Oct 2002 15:32:59 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Ahh Pickwick, havent heard that name in awhile Juan And you though inferior remastering was only found on the el-cheapo K-Tel, Vee-Jay, and Pickwick LPs you bought in the five-and-dime stores decades ago! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From amstereo@optushome.com.au Mon Oct 07 14:36:39 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereo@optushome.com.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 7 Oct 2002 21:36:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 60673 invoked from network); 7 Oct 2002 21:36:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Oct 2002 21:36:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail010.syd.optusnet.com.au) (210.49.20.138) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Oct 2002 21:36:37 -0000 Received: from unit (c17302.ipswc1.qld.optusnet.com.au [210.49.44.162]) by mail010.syd.optusnet.com.au (8.11.1/8.11.1) with SMTP id g97LaaF12834 for ; Tue, 8 Oct 2002 07:36:36 +1000 Message-ID: <002a01c26e49$a1e48050$1a02a8c0@unit> To: References: <1033575610.1484.99685.m12@yahoogroups.com> Subject: C-QUAM CHIPS Auction Date: Tue, 8 Oct 2002 07:36:44 +1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "amstereo - matt2" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=105920058 X-Yahoo-Profile: voltar_e http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1386542122 Pin format not serface mounted. 5 days left. --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.394 / Virus Database: 224 - Release Date: 3/10/2002 From stodd@sherbtel.net Mon Oct 07 18:11:15 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 8 Oct 2002 01:11:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 39486 invoked from network); 8 Oct 2002 01:11:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Oct 2002 01:11:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Oct 2002 01:11:15 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-89-142.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.142]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g9816Fbf014540 for ; Mon, 7 Oct 2002 20:06:16 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <005f01c26e67$ee454880$d3a9fea9@me> To: Subject: Fw: WGKA equipment Date: Mon, 7 Oct 2002 20:13:34 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Finally found out what happened to the WGKA stereo generator. I think you'll be pleased that at least it didn't end up in the trash. And I did invite CJ to join the list. ST > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "CJ" > To: "Scott Todd" > Sent: Monday, October 07, 2002 11:54 AM > Subject: Re: WGKA equipment > > > > Wow, wish you'd asked a me a couple months ago. You have a kindred spirit > > in the creative services guy we hired away from WSB. I gave the boxes to > > him, and he's restoring them. I wish the fcc would've mandated am stereo. > > I had a '86 MR-2 that had a nice am stereo radio in it but only one > station > > was doing am stereo at that time ('87) > > > > CJ Jackson > > Director of Engineering > > Salem Media of Georgia, Inc. > > 2970 Peachtree Road NE > > Suite 700 > > Atlanta, Ga 30305 > > 404-995-7355 (direct) > > 404-285-6180 (cell) > > cj@thefishatlanta.com > > > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Scott Todd" > > To: > > Sent: Monday, October 07, 2002 9:22 AM > > Subject: WGKA equipment > > > > > > > CJ > > > > > > Is the old WGKA AM stereo generator still gathering dust on a shelf > > > somewhere? I collect old broadcast gear, and was wondering if you're > > > planning on reinstalling it since you're playing Southern Gospel, or if > > > you'd just like to get rid of it? > > > > > > Scott Todd > > > KKMS/WWTC/KYCR > > > > > > > > > From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Oct 08 01:03:44 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 8 Oct 2002 08:03:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 44149 invoked from network); 8 Oct 2002 08:03:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Oct 2002 08:03:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Oct 2002 08:03:43 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.179] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 08 Oct 2002 08:03:42 -0000 Date: Tue, 08 Oct 2002 08:03:40 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: OT: the wrath of "hypercompression" Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 965 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.89.5 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics I think they should put "dynamic range" on the list of endangered species, because more and more CDs are starting to have audio waveforms that look like this: http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/loud.gif This is no joke -- that's the way this particular song is right on the CD (a 1997 album by a leading American pop group), with those nice blocky clipped-off square waves from start to finish. So, whether or not today's music sounds like garbage may be a matter of personal opinion, but it is pretty much a fact that it at least *looks* like garbage. All the more reason to go back to cassettes... with good CrO2 or Metal tape and Dolby NR, the sound quality they are capable of delivering is really quite stunning, and at the same time, they can handle high modulation levels much more gracefully than digital audio. I purposely made a few tapes with the VU meters jumping off the scale, and they still sound better than most of today's CDs. From narkspud@hotmail.com Tue Oct 08 10:24:37 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: narkspud@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 8 Oct 2002 17:24:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 41379 invoked from network); 8 Oct 2002 17:24:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Oct 2002 17:24:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Oct 2002 17:24:36 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.135] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 08 Oct 2002 17:24:27 -0000 Date: Tue, 08 Oct 2002 17:24:27 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: OT: the wrath of "hypercompression" Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1952 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "narkspud" X-Originating-IP: 67.89.146.146 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=81956306 X-Yahoo-Profile: narkspud I'll have to respectfully disagree with you on this one, Kevin, at least as far as the cassettes are concerned. What cassettes are capable of when recorded by knowledgable people on expensive equipment is one thing, but what they actually deliver when mass produced, and/or played on average equipment, and/or stored for a year or two, is quite another. The tight azimuth tolerance alone (almost NEVER right on either consumer-grade equipment or prerecorded cassettes) rules out cassette for me as a high-fidelity medium, at least until I can afford a Nakamichi Dragon, which isn't going to be for a good long while. I have a small screwdriver stationed by my cassette deck to adjust the azimuth for each tape, but that often doesn't help anyway because of skewing from old tape or a cheap shell. Then there's the tendency for the record companies to botch the levels, or the EQ, or the tape speed, or to use lousy tape stock, or pressure pads that fall out or turn to glue. Can you tell that I don't miss this format one bit? Don't blame the CD format just because the major labels are on a loudness jag. That's been going on since the 45s of the early 60's, it's just that with digital they've gotten "better" at it. Most classical and other hifi material is recorded at the official CD reference level of -12, as are several CD's from the 80's that I still have. Makes things interesting when assembling mix compilations. CD is capable of better sound than cassettes, and with much lower cost and greater durability and reliability. narkspud (who DOES miss vinyl) --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin T." wrote: > All the more reason to go back to cassettes... with good CrO2 or > Metal tape and Dolby NR, the sound quality they are capable of > delivering is really quite stunning, and at the same time, they can > handle high modulation levels much more gracefully than digital > audio. From philipr@irac.pe.ca Tue Oct 08 12:00:28 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 8 Oct 2002 19:00:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 74990 invoked from network); 8 Oct 2002 18:57:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Oct 2002 18:57:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.87) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Oct 2002 18:57:52 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.133] by n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 08 Oct 2002 18:57:52 -0000 Date: Tue, 08 Oct 2002 18:57:51 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: OT: the wrath of "hypercompression" Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1264 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking --- In amstereoforum@y..., "narkspud" wrote: > I'll have to respectfully disagree with you on this one, Kevin, at > least as far as the cassettes are concerned. What cassettes are > capable of when recorded by knowledgable people on expensive > equipment is one thing, but what they actually deliver when > mass produced, and/or played on average equipment, and/or > stored for a year or two, is quite another. > I'll cast my vote for reel-to-reel. My old Sony TC-399 [one motor, 3 heads, freq response up to 25,000 hz at 71/2 ips]is my true hi-fi reference. Unfortunately, the high cost of tape accounts for the layer of dust on its pristine cabinet. Come to think of it, my 50s era broadcast mono Magnicord - 3 motors, all direct drive, not a belt on that rig! sounds pretty good at 7 1/2 and spectacular at 15 ips. CDs certainly can sound great, albeit the 20 khz rolloff, which perhaps we humans shouldn't miss [but what about the pets?] And, a good vinyl pressing, cleaned, with a fresh stylus on a good turntable, has a sweet sound indeed. I've never had good luck with cassettes - maybe because stray magnetism from my speakers is partly erasing them, maybe its my "personal magnetism"? {lol at self}, or whatever. From michaelj@vcn.com Tue Oct 08 12:21:42 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 8 Oct 2002 19:21:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 54620 invoked from network); 8 Oct 2002 19:21:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Oct 2002 19:21:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m3-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.33) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Oct 2002 19:21:40 -0000 Received: from michael (vcn30.usrtc-1.evan.wy.vcn.com [209.193.86.34]) by m3-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Tue, 8 Oct 2002 13:21:40 -0600 To: Subject: RE: cassettes and now MP3's (used to be hypercompression) Date: Tue, 8 Oct 2002 13:20:41 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I myself usually keep a small screwdriver handy, as well as a mono-er for my headphones. I use this to align the head on most cassette decks......although whatever tape I'm usuing to align WITH can vary too. I tweak the head til there's no mushy in the mono. Then again I can put in another tape and it'll be off again. At least with CD's there's no question to "azimuth" and head alignment. I DO have one question, though. This IS stereo-related....... and I hope maybe you guys can help me out. I know that with MP3's....usually 128Kbps, 44khz is fantastic and can be CD quality as far as I can tell in most cases. If I rip a song from a silver (factory) CD and convert it to MP3 at 128/44 it's pretty much perfect. Yet sometimes I download a song, and it IS 128/44 yet the high end frequencies are "squashy". Know what I mean? The cymbals and high sounds tend to have a bit of a "squash" to them. That squash that kinda sounds like when your cassette heads were off a bit. Yes, I know that some might say "well that's just a compression thing. If you hear a 56Kbps mp3 you hear a lot more of that squash....it comes from compression." True, but how come when I do it, I don't get that??? Is it that the encoder that I use maybe does a better job than some of the other encoders out there? Anyways......now my question. Do any of you know of ANY kind of little program or application that can "fix" this? I work in the radio industry and high quality is important to me. I really don't like playing back songs on the air the you can tell are MP3's because of the squashy cymbols. Any ideas? (besides Yeah...go buy a real CD) MJR n WYO [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From narkspud@hotmail.com Tue Oct 08 13:08:10 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: narkspud@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 8 Oct 2002 20:08:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 71086 invoked from network); 8 Oct 2002 20:08:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Oct 2002 20:08:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.17.6) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Oct 2002 20:08:04 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 8 Oct 2002 13:08:04 -0700 Received: from 67.89.146.146 by lw11fd.law11.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Tue, 08 Oct 2002 20:08:03 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Re: {AMSF} RE: cassettes and now MP3's (used to be hypercompression) Date: Tue, 08 Oct 2002 13:08:03 -0700 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 08 Oct 2002 20:08:04.0168 (UTC) FILETIME=[68FCCC80:01C26F06] From: ". Narkspud" X-Originating-IP: [67.89.146.146] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=81956306 X-Yahoo-Profile: narkspud MP3 encoders vary wildly in quality, as do the people attempting to use them. Then there's discrete vs. joint stereo (joint has better highs but inferior separation). And once the high frequency damage is done, there's no fixing it. Besides, how do you know if your internet pals even ripped it from the actual CD (as opposed to the radio, or, God forbid, a homebrew CD made from another MP3)? A higher bitrate helps a lot. 128 doesn't do it for me. . .I insist on at least 160, but even then I find a lot of turkey files. I've pretty much given up on internet music trading anyway. . .all the rare and interesting stuff disappeared with Napster. The obvious solution. . .go to the store and. . .well, you already said it. narkspud PS Best encoder hands down: SW MP3 Converter for Mac. Takes forever, but it sho' sounds good. _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Tue Oct 08 13:48:44 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 8 Oct 2002 20:48:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 72217 invoked from network); 8 Oct 2002 20:48:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Oct 2002 20:48:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14206.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.173.70) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Oct 2002 20:48:44 -0000 Message-ID: <20021008204844.44711.qmail@web14206.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.45.202.244] by web14206.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 08 Oct 2002 13:48:44 PDT Date: Tue, 8 Oct 2002 13:48:44 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Hope for Analog: Motorola Chipset To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: John Pavlica X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio Hi Gang: This new "notice" was posted on our favorite 99-325 FCC comments this past week: http://gullfoss2.fcc.gov/prod/ecfs/retrieve.cgi?native_or_pdf=pdf&id_document=6513294101 Gives credit the DSP of analog signals like many of us have been trying to tell people. __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Faith Hill - Exclusive Performances, Videos & More http://faith.yahoo.com From dav259@csiro.au Tue Oct 08 16:34:48 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 8 Oct 2002 23:34:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 50636 invoked from network); 8 Oct 2002 23:34:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Oct 2002 23:34:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Oct 2002 23:34:46 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g98NYic09942 for ; Wed, 9 Oct 2002 09:34:44 +1000 (EST) Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 09:34:44 +1000 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: amstereoforum Subject: The Oz Radio Wave Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public This is from Ian MacRae's The Radio Wave Newsletter. Ian is well respected in the radio industry and runs a radio school plus still announces on a Sydney low power community station. Chris - any developments on what you were writing for Ian? AM STEREO LIVES! ---------------- "Oh, really?" I hear you say. I can remember the time that AM Stereo was launched in a big way by the Australian radio industry. This was to be the answer to the new threat of FM radio in the early 80's. In fact the station I was with took the concept one step further and relaunched with a new music format called Album Music. ("A.M." geddit?) This involved playing album cuts rather than singles some of which were quite long or even unfamiliar. Considering we had been a very successful Top 40/Contemporary Hits station this would seem to fly in the face of any conventional programming wisdom. But, hey, who was I to argue? As a humorous aside I should mention the TV commercial that was planned to launch this new AM Stereo format. It took days to set up hundreds of 12" album covers like standing dominoes in a line weaving around the TV studio floor. The idea was to film from overhead the spectacular sight of each album knocking the next one down weaving right along the line. Unfortunately, before the cameras were rolling, an overhead light came loose, fell on the assembled line up and all everyone could do was watch them all come tumbling down. That should have been seen as a portent of what was to come. Of course, the format was a disaster, with most people listening to unfamiliar album cuts on their AM mono radios. Sadly the manufacturers of radio receivers did not support AM Stereo with only a few of the major ones supplying the sets. Which was a shame because the sound coming through a good AM Stereo receiver was quite equal to FM stereo. I had one in my car at the time and it was actually better than FM because it had a warm roundness to the sound compared to FM's rather cold hard sound. So AM Stereo slowly faded from sight...and sound. Many stations around the world are still broadcasting in AM Stereo, having gone to the expense and trouble of installing the gear, and there are still some sets out there. In fact some of those stations are listed on a web site devoted to AM Stereo. http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/kevtronics/ This site also gives an excellent background to AM Stereo including a history from the U.S. perspective. In part it says: Today, virtually all radios have FM Stereo capability. However, the untold story is that Multiplex AM Stereo was actually the first technology to be ready for widespread use. well written Kevin T! Aussies (or others) on this list may like to subscribe to this newsletter as follows: A FINAL NOTE FROM THE EDITOR. The plan is to grow the list of people taking this e-letter, and encourage interactivity from our readers. If there is anyone you know either in or outside the radio industry who would like to receive THE RADIO WAVE they should simply ask to be subscribed by sending a blank e-mail to: radiowave@allaboutradio.net As you know it's free and you can unsubscribe at any time. - Copyright 2002 Ian MacRae Ian Melbourne From stodd@sherbtel.net Tue Oct 08 17:46:28 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 9 Oct 2002 00:46:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 38755 invoked from network); 9 Oct 2002 00:46:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Oct 2002 00:46:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Oct 2002 00:46:28 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-89-171.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.171]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g990f7bf027196 for ; Tue, 8 Oct 2002 19:41:27 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <002c01c26f2d$a381cf00$d3a9fea9@me> To: Subject: Fw: Symphony chipsets Date: Tue, 8 Oct 2002 19:48:30 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Maybe the news isn't so good after all. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: Tremmel Steve-rtca30 To: 'Scott Todd' ; Tremmel Steve-rtca30 ; Bartell Karen-r7aalh Sent: Tuesday, October 08, 2002 9:18 AM Subject: RE: Symphony chipsets Hi Scott, We have the algorithms, but haven't coded yet. Since the engineers who developed C-QUAM still work for me, we can do this if there is demand. None of our customers are asking for this. It is easy to code, but debugging takes time. Steve -----Original Message----- From: Scott Todd [mailto:stodd@sherbtel.net] Sent: Monday, October 07, 2002 8:22 PM To: rtca30@motorola.com; karen.bartell@motorola.com Subject: Symphony chipsets Hello, I'm writing to find out if your new Symphony chipsets will have AM stereo capability. Please consider adding it if it doesn't since it's just a few more lines of code and doesn't require any extra hardware. I've heard too much good AM stereo to give it up too easily. Thank you, Scott Todd [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From matthew.trim@eds.com Tue Oct 08 18:03:15 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: matthew.trim@eds.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 9 Oct 2002 01:03:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 61164 invoked from network); 9 Oct 2002 01:03:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Oct 2002 01:03:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO ns5.eds.com) (203.17.185.230) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Oct 2002 01:03:14 -0000 Received: from nnsy.eds.com (nnsy-3.eds.com [192.168.1.1]) by ns5.eds.com (8.11.6/8.11.1) with ESMTP id g99138P01420 for ; Wed, 9 Oct 2002 11:03:08 +1000 (EST) Received: from nnsy.eds.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by nnsy.eds.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g99137o04227 for ; Wed, 9 Oct 2002 11:03:08 +1000 (EST) Received: from ausym000.exau01.exch.eds.com ([134.251.177.117]) by nnsy.eds.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g99137d04223 for ; Wed, 9 Oct 2002 11:03:07 +1000 (EST) Received: by AUSYM000 with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id <4A7LBALR>; Wed, 9 Oct 2002 11:03:05 +1000 Message-ID: <533761B50551D511A6D200508B6F542809CAF351@AUSYM200> To: "'amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com'" Subject: RE: {AMSF} Fw: Symphony chipsets Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 11:02:39 +1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-Type: text/plain From: "Trim, Matthew L" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88615102 X-Yahoo-Profile: bofh2k2000 By the sounds of that, Motorola aren't willing to fund the coding and debugging of the decoder software unless a customer asks for (and presumably pays extra for) C-QUAM decoding. Maybe we can ask him how much it would cost for the development and we might be able to contribute a small amount each to the costs? Maybe in return they may provide us with a few free samples? :) This way C-QUAM could be included as standard in the chipset? No manufacturer is going to specify C-QUAM must be provided in the chipset if it is going to cost them extra. -----Original Message----- From: Scott Todd [mailto:stodd@sherbtel.net] Sent: Wednesday, 9 October 2002 10:48 AM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Fw: Symphony chipsets Maybe the news isn't so good after all. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: Tremmel Steve-rtca30 To: 'Scott Todd' ; Tremmel Steve-rtca30 ; Bartell Karen-r7aalh Sent: Tuesday, October 08, 2002 9:18 AM Subject: RE: Symphony chipsets Hi Scott, We have the algorithms, but haven't coded yet. Since the engineers who developed C-QUAM still work for me, we can do this if there is demand. None of our customers are asking for this. It is easy to code, but debugging takes time. Steve From stodd@sherbtel.net Tue Oct 08 18:05:48 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 9 Oct 2002 01:05:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 45152 invoked from network); 9 Oct 2002 01:05:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Oct 2002 01:05:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Oct 2002 01:05:29 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-89-171.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.171]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g9910Obf001366; Tue, 8 Oct 2002 20:00:25 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <004801c26f30$4a5e42c0$d3a9fea9@me> To: "Tremmel Steve-rtca30" , "Bartell Karen-r7aalh" Cc: References: Subject: Re: Symphony chipsets Date: Tue, 8 Oct 2002 20:07:47 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Dear Mr. Tremmel, Thank you for the courtesy of your reply. As a broadcast engineer, I'd be interested in seeing this feature implemented, and I'm going to be informing other radio people who feel this way as well. There are still quite a number of stations who bust their rear ends to put out a fantastic AM stereo product, including such powerhouses as WJR and KNX. I believe there are many more who would seriously consider AM stereo, perhaps for the first time if it were to be available in the chip set since platform motion would cease to be a concern and the little extra noise from going stereo would also be very much reduced. Plus the receiver availability will skyrocket. Realistically,how much extra cost would it be to add it and debug it? Over the production of millions of chips, I would think the total cost would be in the hundredths of a cent. Please consider putting AM stereo into this product. I know your competition at Omega Reception Technologies will have it in theirs. By the way, how would I go about obtaining some engineering samples of the Symphony chipsets? Thank you, Scott Todd ----- Original Message ----- From: Tremmel Steve-rtca30 To: 'Scott Todd' ; Tremmel Steve-rtca30 ; Bartell Karen-r7aalh Sent: Tuesday, October 08, 2002 9:18 AM Subject: RE: Symphony chipsets Hi Scott, We have the algorithms, but haven't coded yet. Since the engineers who developed C-QUAM still work for me, we can do this if there is demand. None of our customers are asking for this. It is easy to code, but debugging takes time. Steve -----Original Message----- From: Scott Todd [mailto:stodd@sherbtel.net] Sent: Monday, October 07, 2002 8:22 PM To: rtca30@motorola.com; karen.bartell@motorola.com Subject: Symphony chipsets Hello, I'm writing to find out if your new Symphony chipsets will have AM stereo capability. Please consider adding it if it doesn't since it's just a few more lines of code and doesn't require any extra hardware. I've heard too much good AM stereo to give it up too easily. Thank you, Scott Todd [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From radiomatt1@yahoo.com Tue Oct 08 18:46:14 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: radiomatt1@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 9 Oct 2002 01:46:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 43262 invoked from network); 9 Oct 2002 01:46:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Oct 2002 01:46:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Oct 2002 01:46:13 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.183] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 09 Oct 2002 01:46:13 -0000 Date: Wed, 09 Oct 2002 01:46:11 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: WGKA equipment Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <005f01c26e67$ee454880$d3a9fea9@me> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 2567 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "radiomatt1" X-Originating-IP: 67.33.127.109 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=91397024 X-Yahoo-Profile: radiomatt1 Wow =96 small world! I'm the guy who now has the WGKA AM stereo gear. For me, saving the gear wasn't merely about supporting=20 AM Stereo: It was about returning a favor. Atlanta's WGKA was the first radio station I ever saw. It was 1988. Although only in the 8th grade, I was already a full-fledged,=20 card-carrying radio geek! So, the chance to finally see a real radio=20 station was more exciting than a decade's worth of Christmases!=20 Mr. Eathel Holley owned 1190 WGKA, then a classical music station as=20 it had been since it went on the air in the 1950's. Mr. Holley was a polished broadcaster, a sharp businessman, but first=20 and foremost, Eathel was an engineer. So, when AM Stereo came out,=20 Eathel made it a top priority to convert WGKA to stereo. (Only 790=20 WQXI beat him to it in Atlanta.) Originally, WGKA broadcast Harris=20 AM Stereo, but then converted to C-QUAM in the mid 1980s. Mr. Holley=20 converted the Harris exciter to C-QUAM himself, noting, "The Harris exciters converted to Motorola stereo sound better than the=20 Motorola exciters."=20=20 As an engineer, Eathel Holley was also an audio purest. He always=20 believed in running low modulation levels, instead of compressing or=20 distorting his audio. He used the legendary Carver TX-11A for the=20 WGKA air monitor. He ran liners on the air saying, "The voice of the Arts in Atlanta, 1190 WGKA =96 now broadcasting in full-fidelity AM Stereo." To show off the capabilities of WGKA's high-fidelity AM Stereo for me, he flipped the monitors back and=20 forth from the board's program audio to the TX-11A off-air audio: I=20 honestly could not tell the difference =85 and I was blown away! Full=20 stereo sound all the way out to 15khz! Simply Stunning!!!=20=20=20=20 Eathel spent his entire morning showing me around WGKA, letting me=20 get a taste of every aspect of the radio station. His kindness=20 towards me, a young radio nut, went a long way towards fueling my=20 passion for our industry.=20=20 Eathel Holley sold the station in the mid 90's to a guy who kept the classical format =96 sort of =96 but the audio compression went up and the stereo went off. Salem then bought it a few years=20 later.=20=20 Considering Eathel Holley's kindness to me in sharing his love of=20 radio, making sure the WGKA Harris STA-!A AM Stereo exciter he=20 himself installed and maintained remains in good care seems like the=20 least I can do to return the favor. I'm honored to have the gear and thankful to WKGA's current engineer (another great radio guy) for making the effort to let me keep it. Matt Bailey Atlanta, GA From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Tue Oct 08 18:59:14 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 9 Oct 2002 01:59:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 71835 invoked from network); 9 Oct 2002 01:59:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Oct 2002 01:59:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf06bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.26) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Oct 2002 01:59:03 -0000 Received: from juan ([68.17.219.88]) by imf06bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.19 201-253-122-122-119-20020516) with SMTP id <20021009020045.QDK12062.imf06bis.bellsouth.net@juan> for ; Tue, 8 Oct 2002 22:00:45 -0400 Message-ID: <001101c26f37$70c1aae0$af78fea9@juan> To: References: Subject: DX: 1160 AM Date: Tue, 8 Oct 2002 21:59:02 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Need some help on an unidentified Station on 1160 Lots of Jazz, no I.D.'s............I have heard this the last few evenings. Is this Cuba ?.....I have been out of the "DX" Loop for awhile. Curious.................. Juan Gualda PD/MD WGYL-FM Vero Beach, FL [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Tue Oct 08 19:05:23 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 9 Oct 2002 02:05:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 76059 invoked from network); 9 Oct 2002 02:05:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Oct 2002 02:05:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf06bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.26) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Oct 2002 02:05:22 -0000 Received: from juan ([68.17.219.88]) by imf06bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.19 201-253-122-122-119-20020516) with SMTP id <20021009020704.VDT12062.imf06bis.bellsouth.net@juan>; Tue, 8 Oct 2002 22:07:04 -0400 Message-ID: <002e01c26f38$52766de0$af78fea9@juan> To: , Subject: WTTB Update Date: Tue, 8 Oct 2002 22:05:20 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit WTTB was hit by lightning at the Xmitter last week. C-QUAM is toast. Should have it back soon, but our Audiovault also too a dump Wednesday, so our Engineer is pretty busy. If it ain't one thing it's another......oh well... Juan Gualda PD/ MD WGYL/ WTTB/ WOSN/ WGNX [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Oct 08 19:15:11 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 9 Oct 2002 02:15:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 6809 invoked from network); 9 Oct 2002 02:15:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Oct 2002 02:15:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Oct 2002 02:15:10 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.190] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 09 Oct 2002 02:15:10 -0000 Date: Wed, 09 Oct 2002 02:15:07 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: cassettes and now MP3's (used to be hypercompression) Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2813 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.69.1 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics The quality of MP3, especially at 128 kbps, is really dependent on what STEREO FORMAT is used. Just like AM Stereo in the '80s, MP3 is a MULTI-Stereo-format system! Here are the formats that MP3 uses: * Simple Stereo. Individual Left and Right channels which each get half of the bit-rate. So, on a 128 kbps MP3 file, the Left and Right channels each get 64 kbps allocated to them. This method, although simple and easy to encode, really does not sound good below 160 kbps. At 128 kbps, it can sound particularly "harsh" and "gritty". * Mid/Side (MS) Stereo. The most common Stereo format for 128 kbps MP3s, it splits the audio into L+R and L-R matrix components, and then devotes less bits to the L-R component since in most music it doesn't contain as much "important" audio as the main L+R (mono) channel. As you can tell, this leads to problems on wide-separation recordings, as well as audio which has slight phasing problems which are normally inaudible but cause the encoding of the L-R channel to be very messed up, leading to a "chattery" or "underwater" sound, especially on cymbal crashes and other high-frequency sounds. * Intensity Stereo (IS). The most "brutal" of Stereo formats, it combines the high-frequency audio to Mono and then gives it a direction value based on the "intensity" of the audio, to tell it whether to direct the audio off to the Left or Right side to recreate the Stereo effect. This usually works better than you might expect, but again, wide separation can "confuse" it greatly, leading to a "chattering" effect. However, since the treble is summed to Mono, it is insensitive to phasing problems, and thus might actually sound better when encoding from a cassette tape with misaligned head azimuth. * Joint Stereo. A general format which instantaneously chooses between some or all of the above methods based on which would sound "best" with the currently playing audio content. So, a "Joint Stereo" MP3 file might contain 25% Simple Stereo and 75% Mid/Side Stereo frames, or even 95% Intensity Stereo and then 5% Simple Stereo for those brief instances where the audio content got too "challenging" for the Intensity encoding. I prefer "MusePack" (.MPC) and "Ogg Vorbis" (.OGG) over MP3, but if you really must use MP3, stick with the popular and freely available "LAME" encoder. Most "all-in-one" music production programs use the Fraunhofer encoder instead, but LAME just sounds better at 128 kbps and up. I have experienced some songs where Fraunhofer's MP3 encoding just falls to pieces, but LAME still sounds fairly good. And please, don't even THINK about using the "Xing" or "BladeEnc" encoders. These are very old technology and provide truly horrible results with virtually all audio. Avoid avoid avoid!!! From jsgil@hal-pc.org Tue Oct 08 20:03:54 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 9 Oct 2002 03:03:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 57690 invoked from network); 9 Oct 2002 03:03:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Oct 2002 03:03:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Oct 2002 03:03:53 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.164] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 09 Oct 2002 03:03:53 -0000 Date: Wed, 09 Oct 2002 03:03:53 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: cassettes and now MP3's (used to be hypercompression) Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2794 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.130.65 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Michael J. Richard" wrote: > I myself usually keep a small screwdriver handy, as well as a mono-er for my > headphones. I use this to align the head on most cassette > decks......although whatever tape I'm usuing to align WITH can vary too. I > tweak the head til there's no mushy in the mono. Then again I can put in > another tape and it'll be off again. At least with CD's there's no question > to "azimuth" and head alignment. I DO have one question, though. This IS > stereo-related....... and I hope maybe you guys can help me out. I know > that with MP3's....usually 128Kbps, 44khz is fantastic and can be CD quality > as far as I can tell in most cases. If I rip a song from a silver (factory) > CD and convert it to MP3 at 128/44 it's pretty much perfect. Yet sometimes > I download a song, and it IS 128/44 yet the high end frequencies are > "squashy". Know what I mean? The cymbals and high sounds tend to have a > bit of a "squash" to them. That squash that kinda sounds like when your > cassette heads were off a bit. Yes, I know that some might say "well > that's just a compression thing. If you hear a 56Kbps mp3 you hear a lot > more of that squash....it comes from compression." True, but how come when > I do it, I don't get that??? > Is it that the encoder that I use maybe does a better job than some of the > other encoders out there? Anyways......now my question. Do any of you > know of ANY kind of little program or application that can "fix" this? I > work in the radio industry and high quality is important to me. I really > don't like playing back songs on the air the you can tell are MP3's because > of the squashy cymbols. Any ideas? (besides Yeah...go buy a real CD) > > MJR n WYO > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] The LAME encoder is probably the best encoder out there. It can be found at http://www.mp3dev.org/mp3/ This engine has been used in several encoders on various platforms like Windoze, Mac, and Linux-UNIX. There is a page that talks about mp3 quality and how to get the best out of lame at http://www.r3mix.net/ Check out the links on the side bar for "Quality" and "Encoding". I have encoded using these settings and can rarely tell the difference between the original wav and mp3. Some of the key issues for good sound are, ATH (Absolute Threshold of Hearing) Mask, Using VBR (Variable Bit Rate) to reduce size without compromising quality, and using joint stereo (L+R, L-R), when there is little separation instead of discrete stereo. The LAME encoder will switch from joint to discrete when separation is great between channels dynamically on a frame by frame basis within a song without a loss in separation quality. JSG From KC4QLP@aol.com Tue Oct 08 22:21:10 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 9 Oct 2002 05:21:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 2268 invoked from network); 9 Oct 2002 05:21:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Oct 2002 05:21:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d08.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.40) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Oct 2002 05:21:08 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.180.f2a3968 (3842) for ; Wed, 9 Oct 2002 01:21:00 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <180.f2a3968.2ad516bb@aol.com> Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 01:20:59 EDT Subject: Feds to Decide on Digital Radio To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp From the Disassociated Depressed news wire {Associated Press} By DAVID HO .c The Associated Press WASHINGTON (AP) - Generations of radio listeners have contended with static and flat-sounding music. But now a new technology holds the promise of CD-quality sound for FM broadcasts and an end to AM's hiss, crackle and pop. The Federal Communications Commission is to decide Thursday whether to allow radio stations to broadcast digital signals and how they should do it. Digital radio's rollout could begin in a few months in some major cities, and consumers would start seeing digital receivers in car stereos and high-end audio systems next year. Digital radio could be the biggest update to the medium since the debut of FM in the 1940s, said Ken Mueller, radio curator at the Museum of Television & Radio in New York. Mueller said that like FM, which didn't become popular until the 1970s, ``it's going to take quite some time to phase in.'' ``We're not talking 30 years here,'' he said, but ``you have to wait until people start getting receivers to pick this up.'' Industry officials say they expect the FCC to approve a digital radio standard created by iBiquity Digital Corp., a company backed by large broadcasters including ABC and Viacom. The transition to digital radio differs from the one planned for digital television. Congress has set a goal of December 2006 for broadcasters to switch to digital TV signals. After that, anyone wanting to watch over-the-air broadcasts will need a TV with a digital tuner or a set-top converter. The iBiquity technology allows broadcasters to use their existing airwaves and simultaneously send digital and analog signals. Listeners won't have to buy a new radio to continue listening to their favorite stations, but will if they want better sound and other options. Robert Struble, iBiquity's president and chief executive, likened it to the advent of color television. ``If you had a black-and-white TV and your local station started broadcasting in color, your black-and-white TV still worked,'' he said. ``But if you wanted the new high-quality picture you've got to buy a new color TV. It's the same with digital radio.'' Manufacturers will start taking orders in January for digital radios, which will first show up in high-end home audio systems and car stereos, adding about $100 to the cost of a unit, Struble said. It's unclear how long it will take for the technology to show up in clock radios and portable radios. In addition to better sound quality, digital car stereos will allow listeners to choose to hear reports on stocks, sports, weather and traffic. Some models will have small screens, displaying pictures of the artist whose song is playing, news or advertising, Struble said. With models planned for 2004, listeners will be able to program the radio in advance to record broadcasts on a built-in hard drive. Struble said he envisions future digital radios combined with cell phones or handheld computers. With global positioning system technology, digital radios could play music, news or advertising tailored to a listener's location. Digital transmitters will cost radio stations on average about $75,000, Struble said. Mueller said the cost is not a big deal for many stations, but some smaller operations may choose to forgo the expense. Digital broadcasts use the same language as computers - a series of on and off electronic pulses. Broadcasts with the proposed technology won't increase a radio station's range, but digital signals can be cleaned up, removing garble and uneven reception. Some supporters of low-powered radio stations - often run by churches, community groups or schools broadcasting to their neighborhoods - worry that the iBiquity system will interfere with their airwaves. The broadcasters and electronics companies that back digital radio say tests show the system should not cause such problems. Digital radio is different than satellite radio, which is a pay service using satellites to send signals. Subscribers can listen to the same stations anywhere in the country. Sirius Satellite Radio and XM Satellite Radio Holdings are the only two companies offering the service. Canada and parts of Europe and Asia have had digital radio for years, but those broadcasts are carried on a frequency reserved in the United States for the military. On the Net: Federal Communications Commission: http://www.fcc.gov iBiquity: http://www.ibiquity.com National Association of Broadcasters: http://www.nab.org Museum of Television & Radio: http://www.mtr.org 10/08/02 18:48 EDT ============================================================== Oh boy!..isnt that news write up just a tad bit inflated with smoke and mirrors and general BS! Bob Carter Operations/Engineering WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5..., Ray Communications Radio Network Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereoradio-subcribe@topica.com amstereo-subcribe@topica.com amstereoradio-subscribe@yahoogroups.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ WARNING TO UNSOLICITED SPAMMERS !!! Pursuant to U.S. Code, title 47, Chapter 5, Subchapter II, "Any and all nonsolicited E-mail (SPAM) sent to this address is subject to a download and archival fee of 500 U.S."!! E-mailing denotes acceptance of these terms." Your message (if actually mailed) is in violation of the Federal Telephone Consumer Protection Act of 1991, and Collateral Code of Federal Regulations (47 CFR 64.1200). The TCPA allows a private right of action against the sender of unsolicited advertising. The recipient can sue for $500, or actualdamages (whichever is greater). ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------- Osama bin Laden can kiss my royal white American behind! From KC4QLP@aol.com Tue Oct 08 22:38:05 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 9 Oct 2002 05:38:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 18575 invoked from network); 9 Oct 2002 05:38:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Oct 2002 05:38:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d04.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.36) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Oct 2002 05:38:02 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.127.181b988d (3842) for ; Wed, 9 Oct 2002 01:37:59 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <127.181b988d.2ad51ab7@aol.com> Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 01:37:59 EDT Subject: Re: {AMSF} WTTB Update To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 10/8/02 10:05:18 PM Eastern Daylight Time, gualdaj@bellsouth.net writes: << WTTB was hit by lightning at the Xmitter last week. C-QUAM is toast. Should have it back soon, but our Audiovault also too a dump Wednesday, so our Engineer is pretty busy. If it ain't one thing it's another......oh well... Juan Gualda PD/ MD WGYL/ WTTB/ WOSN/ WGNX >> There's nothing like having some surge protectors and good grounding ...unless you have a direct hit..then nothing is going to save it. Good luck Juan and hope everything returns to normal soon for you down there. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5..., Ray Communications Radio Network Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereoradio-subcribe@topica.com amstereo-subcribe@topica.com amstereoradio-subscribe@yahoogroups.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ WARNING TO UNSOLICITED SPAMMERS !!! Pursuant to U.S. Code, title 47, Chapter 5, Subchapter II, "Any and all nonsolicited E-mail (SPAM) sent to this address is subject to a download and archival fee of 500 U.S."!! E-mailing denotes acceptance of these terms." Your message (if actually mailed) is in violation of the Federal Telephone Consumer Protection Act of 1991, and Collateral Code of Federal Regulations (47 CFR 64.1200). The TCPA allows a private right of action against the sender of unsolicited advertising. The recipient can sue for $500, or actualdamages (whichever is greater). ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------- Osama bin Laden can kiss my royal white American behind! From ccuff@in4web.com Wed Oct 09 00:33:01 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 9 Oct 2002 07:33:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 55143 invoked from network); 9 Oct 2002 07:33:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Oct 2002 07:33:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Oct 2002 07:33:00 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.23]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Wed, 9 Oct 2002 03:29:56 -0400 Message-ID: <002401c26f65$ea57d540$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: <127.181b988d.2ad51ab7@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} WTTB Update Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 03:31:42 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 That reminds me of seeing first-hand what a direct lightning hit can do- As a kid learning TV repair in the 60's, we had to go out and pick up an old Zenith B/W console where the ant got hit- I was awestruck. There was NOTHING left of the antenna, mast or wire- just black "flashing" on the side of the house where wire used to be. (The TV survived, with only a new tuner needed... ah, the good old tube days before microprocessors!) CC ----- Original Message ----- From kevtronics@yahoo.com Wed Oct 09 00:39:23 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 9 Oct 2002 07:39:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 56512 invoked from network); 9 Oct 2002 07:39:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Oct 2002 07:39:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.83) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Oct 2002 07:39:22 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.154] by n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 09 Oct 2002 07:39:22 -0000 Date: Wed, 09 Oct 2002 07:39:18 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: cassettes and now MP3's (used to be hypercompression) Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2672 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.89.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > I have encoded using these settings and can rarely tell the > difference between the original wav and mp3. MP3 will never be truly "CD quality" (whatever that is supposed to mean in the context of the pursuit of high fidelity audio) because it is inherently flawed when it comes to encoding audio frequencies above 16 kHz. "Lossy" digital audio compression, such as MP3, works by removing the frequencies from the audio that it thinks we can't hear. The trouble with MP3 is that the entire region from 16 kHz to the limit of just over 22 kHz is treated as a single chunk of frequencies, so the encoder has to decide whether to produce audio limited to 16 kHz of response, or full-bandwidth audio -- there is no in-between, where it could produce a bandwidth of 18 or 19 kHz, for example. Thus, especially at a 128 kbps MP3, these high frequencies are encoded very inaccurately, although this fault is usually overlooked because there is little musically important audio above 16 kHz and people are not very sensitive to audio at these extreme high frequencies. However, it is still enough that you can often tell that "something just isn't right" about the way MP3 audio sounds, or that there is a degradation to the treble response and accuracy but you can't quite describe it in words. Even at its maximum of 320 kbps, MP3 still has this problem, because it's just the way the system was designed. In fact, with the Intensity Stereo method I described in my last message, it is *impossible* to encode *any* audio above 16 kHz, as the ability to encode these high frequencies is completely *missing* from the MP3 Intensity Stereo system! Thus, in order to get past this inherent limitation of MP3, we will either have to wait for the "MP4" standard to be finalized, or switch to one of the alternative formats, such as MusePack (.MPC), Ogg Vorbis (.OGG), or Advanced Audio Coding (.AAC). Of these, Ogg Vorbis is the most promising, as it was designed from the ground up with a completely difference encoding scheme than MP3, and is a "free" format, which anybody can make use of -- unlike MP3, which actually is patented by Fraunhofer IIS in Germany, the company which invented the format. Or, of course, another alternative is to simply go back to analog! And a surprising amount of professional audio work is still being done in analog. For example, two big hit songs from the past year -- "Superman (It's Not Easy)" by Five For Fighting, and "Thank You" by Dido -- both started out in the studio as analog recordings. When played on a highly-processed FM station, you can even hear the tape hiss in the background. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Wed Oct 09 00:51:38 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 9 Oct 2002 07:51:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 55308 invoked from network); 9 Oct 2002 07:51:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Oct 2002 07:51:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.70) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Oct 2002 07:51:36 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.133] by n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 09 Oct 2002 07:51:36 -0000 Date: Wed, 09 Oct 2002 07:51:36 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Feds to Decide on Digital Radio Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <180.f2a3968.2ad516bb@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 893 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.89.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Digital broadcasts use the same language as computers - a series of > on and off electronic pulses. Broadcasts with the proposed > technology won't increase a radio station's range, but digital > signals can be cleaned up, removing garble and uneven reception. That's funny... the switch from analog to digital mobile phones actually CREATED "garble" and "uneven reception", even in areas of perfect signal strength. In addition, it *reduced* the useable audio frequency response, so that a normal analog telephone sounds spectacularly "Hi-Fi" in comparison! And, as we've already seen, IBOC will do the same thing to radio! Poorer reception... garbled digital audio... narrowed frequency response... but, dont'cha know, it's CRYSTAL CLEAR, with NO STATIC, so it must be perfect -- just like the David Duchovny/X-Files-wannabe Sprint PCS guy has been telling us on TV for years! From kevtronics@yahoo.com Wed Oct 09 01:02:10 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 9 Oct 2002 08:02:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 81215 invoked from network); 9 Oct 2002 08:02:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Oct 2002 08:02:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Oct 2002 08:02:06 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.250] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 09 Oct 2002 08:02:06 -0000 Date: Wed, 09 Oct 2002 08:02:06 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} WTTB Update Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <002401c26f65$ea57d540$0101a8c0@pavilion> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 649 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.89.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > There was NOTHING left of the antenna, mast or wire- just black > "flashing" on the side of the house where wire used to be. > (The TV survived, with only a new tuner needed... ah, the good old > tube days before microprocessors!) One good lightning zap vaporized the phone line going to my neighbor's house -- there was no trace of the copper wire left, just scraps of burnt rubber insulation on the ground. Our phone line was okay, but the surge took out the fuses in the phone panel (do new phone line installations even use fuses anymore?) and one of our phones was rendered half-dead (it still worked, but the audio was very quiet). From dav259@csiro.au Wed Oct 09 02:04:07 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 9 Oct 2002 09:04:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 48140 invoked from network); 9 Oct 2002 09:04:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Oct 2002 09:04:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Oct 2002 09:04:05 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g99943c10399; Wed, 9 Oct 2002 19:04:03 +1000 (EST) Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 19:04:03 +1000 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: amstereoforum Cc: Bob Betcher , Mark Day , Farah Farouque Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Feds to Decide on Digital Radio In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public On Wed, 9 Oct 2002, Kevin T. wrote: > And, as we've already seen, IBOC will do the same thing to radio! > Poorer reception... garbled digital audio... narrowed frequency > response... but, dont'cha know, it's CRYSTAL CLEAR, with NO STATIC, > so it must be perfect -- just like the David Duchovny/X-Files-wannabe > Sprint PCS guy has been telling us on TV for years! Wouldn't the Motorola Symphony system be popular with radio stations? - particularly for non-cashed up smaller outfits? After all - it wouldn't cost them anything! And there's the same (IBOC) argument for listeners. They wouldn't HAVE to buy new radios if they didn't want to hear superior sound. Can't we drum up a bit of publicity with the NAB? Maybe Richard, Bob, Mark, and Farrah you could write something about this in your radio columns ... http://mrtmag.com/ar/radio_motorolas_symphony_digital/ Ian Melbourne From michaelj@vcn.com Wed Oct 09 06:10:26 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 9 Oct 2002 13:10:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 48106 invoked from network); 9 Oct 2002 13:10:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Oct 2002 13:10:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m2-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.32) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Oct 2002 13:10:23 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m2-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Wed, 9 Oct 2002 07:10:22 -0600 Message-ID: <001501c26f95$378d1bc0$0701010a@keva> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: cassettes and now MP3's (used to be hypercompression) Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 07:10:18 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Thanks for all the explanations guys. I understand now what you're talking about and I've always wondered about "joint stereo" and so forth. Here's what I use for the most part. If we are encoding an ad or something that we created as a wav file, we then use a little program called DB PowerAmp Music Converter. It actually adds itself to a pop-up menu in Windows Explorer. It uses the LAME encoder. That's why those sound so good. Meanwhile, when I rip something from a CD, I usually use MusicMatch Jukebox for the most part. I'm not sure which encoder it uses. I just set it for 128kbps. Seems to sound okay as well. But I know on Kazaa, it will show you whether it's "joint stereo" or whatever. I download a lot with Kazaa. Otherwise I use WinMX. With that one, you can't tell what is used. I guess I ought to look for "discrete stereo" if I can find it when downloading. Makes a little more sense to me now. I know once you convert something to MP3, it's done. You can't go back. I just didn't know if there was a program that will decode an MP3 file, "analyze it" and figure out where the high end should be and fix it to sound right or what. MJR ----- Original Message ----- From: jsgilst To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From philipr@irac.pe.ca Wed Oct 09 06:16:23 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 9 Oct 2002 13:16:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 52028 invoked from network); 9 Oct 2002 13:16:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Oct 2002 13:16:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Oct 2002 13:16:22 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.148] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 09 Oct 2002 13:16:22 -0000 Date: Wed, 09 Oct 2002 13:16:19 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: The RANT in Digital! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <180.f2a3968.2ad516bb@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 5688 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking Oh, yeah - people are lining up in the Confederation Court Mall outside Radio Shack, waiting for it to open to buy a new Eureka 147 DAB radio! And the Moon IS made of green cheese. Well, yes we Canadians have been enjoying "hearing" about Eureka 147 DAB for several years now. A bunch of stations in Montreal, Toronto, Windsor and Vancouver broadcast in DAB along with their AM or FM. But, we Canadians haven't been "listening" to digital - because realistically speaking, there just aren't any receivers out there. Sorry, paying $2000 for an imported European rig at a high end Toronto Audio store does not equal mass market acceptance. The talk of REPLACING AM and FM with DAB has all but ceased. About a year ago, there was much hype on a DAB site I subscribe to - 'Radio Shack Canada to unveil new line of popularly priced DAB receivers in February 2002', or something to that effect. Here it is, October 2002, and I don't see any DAB rigs in the RS Canada website or flyers. Meanwhile, the CRTC is allowing every AM station who requests it the chance to "flip" to FM. I've seen applications where a 25 or 50 kw AM station surrendered its license for 860 watts of FM! Yep, trade in an 140 km radius coverage area for a 30 km radius coverage area. Smart move folks! Oh, you don't care about rural and small town listeners. But, oops, you forgot about the suburbs. Gulp, I guess the only thing we can do is to crank up the processor to bang the VU meters into submission and shout over the multipath and picketfencing. Smart move, lets pat each other on the back and congratulate ourselves! Oh, we should get new liners too. Liner Larry is starting to sound tired. I've heard wideband AM now for several years - first on my brothers PT-1, then on my GE SR III, and now on my own PT-1. I've heard AM stereo - on CJFX, CJLS, WTTM and now on my Alfredo Lite. CJFX is a tad steely sounding but with minimal compression, WTTM is DX, CJLS is DX too, but when the ether god smiles on me, I'm treated to awe inspiring stereo on 1340. News Flash - CJLS is converting to 18,000 watts of Class B1 FM. The plug will soon be pulled on 580 too. Well, at least I have my Alfredo Lite. Compared to DAB, AM Stereo was a resounding success in Canada. People could, for a period of time, actually find and buy AM Stereo receivers. Of course, while Sony made lots of them for a while, the Sony Store in Fredericton was too stupid to carry them, even though CIHI was agressively promoting its Stereo 126. But in other markets, people did buy AM Stereo radios, not in droves, but a lot more than DAB. Stations in medium and small markets converted to CQUAM stereo. What did wound AM stereo in Canada was a dwindling source of receivers, retail ignorance and the non-stop flipping from AM to FM. I'm not talking flipping the band select switch either! I'm talking the CRTC's brand of flipping. Now, the FM band is getting crowded. Instead of 100kw, 75kw and 50kw Class C and C1 stations, the CRTC is licensing all these Class B, B1, and A stations. "Static" is being replaced by multipath fuzz and signal dropouts due to shadowing. FM stations are using so much compression limiting that its now the AM stations, on a wideband tuner, that sound open, lifelike and hi-fi. Meanwhile, the public really doesn't care. Radio is free, TV is not. If you want to watch TV, you tie yourself down with coax to a dish or cable, get a good picture, and vegetate. Because people spend $50 plus bucks a month for cable or satellite, their willing to spend big bucks for a new TV. Yet they balk at paying $70 for an SR III. Oh, its just a radio. Yet how do they know about weather, traffic conditions and school closures. Radio - the medium that reaches everyone, that everyone depends on, but almost everyone takes for granted. For most people, FM sounds fine, even with the fuzz, and their not prepared to pay a penny extra for something that's toted to be "CD quality" as the DAB propaganda organ promises. But, interestingly enough, when I demonstrate wideband AM stereo, the reaction is - wow - this sounds better than FM. The public is cheap, yes, but not stupid. Stick wideband AM stereo in your boombox, promote it, and it will sell. It might cost you 50 cents extra, but it gives you a leg up on the competition. But, the competition doesn't bother, so why should we? WHY NOT? Even if IBOC offered a wonderful product, I would predict its downfall because the public won't shell out any $ for a free service - e.g. radio. But, IBOC offers the same phasey, simulated sound associated with highly compressed music downloads. Why pay extra for something that sounds worse? Why listen on your "regular" radio to an IBOC station broadcasting muddy audio when you can tune in the station that can't afford IBOC which sounds so much better? I suspect there will be a lot of old IBOC junk being sold for parts on eBay six years from now. If Eureka 147 DAB, which admittedly does have the technology to sound good, can't make it - why will IBOC, which will hammer the AM and FM bands with adjacent channel interference, and pester us with phasey, gritty sound, make it? One of my co-workers, also a former broadcaster, opined yesterday that there are an awful lots of great, wide open AM frequencies in Canada. A lot of good used transmitters freshly taken out of service too. Nature abhors a vacuum. Phil > Canada and parts of Europe and Asia have had digital radio for years, but > those broadcasts are carried on a frequency reserved in the United States for > the military. > From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Wed Oct 09 06:40:35 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 9 Oct 2002 13:40:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 11153 invoked from network); 9 Oct 2002 13:40:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Oct 2002 13:40:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14205.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.151) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Oct 2002 13:40:33 -0000 Message-ID: <20021009134033.63828.qmail@web14205.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.45.202.244] by web14205.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 09 Oct 2002 06:40:33 PDT Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 06:40:33 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Can you 'recycle' the AMS equipment? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: John Pavlica X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio Matt Bailey: Do you have a station in the Atlanta area that you can install the WKGA AM Stereo equipment in to bring it up to high quality stereo sound - recycling the AMS equipment for a new station? We'll help you get it going! __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Faith Hill - Exclusive Performances, Videos & More http://faith.yahoo.com From amfmdx@fastq.com Wed Oct 09 09:50:02 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 9 Oct 2002 16:50:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 27645 invoked from network); 9 Oct 2002 16:50:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Oct 2002 16:50:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Oct 2002 16:50:01 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt (d128-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.160]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id g99Gnxh22124; Wed, 9 Oct 2002 09:49:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <01c601c26fb3$e24cac60$56f9bed8@kredding430cdt> To: Cc: Subject: Old Tech Help Needed Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 09:49:48 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla I have come to the oracles seeking advice... I am working on a mid 50s era RCA Yachtsman. This unit has a BIG black capacitor thats blown to pieces in it. This unit has bands and, well.... we don't have to read these things anymore. Spoiled is what I am because I am used to looking at the caps and reading the numbers printed on the side. I need help reading the color bands on this thing. If it was a resistor this unit would be changed out by now.... This is what I have. There are 4 bands on one end and one on the other. End near the volume pot: 1st wide yellow band 2nd narrow violet band 3rd narrow orange band 4th narrow black band And on the far end near the heat sink: narrow orange band Can anyone tell me the value of this thing? It looks like a big resistor but its not because I can see the paper and foil all rolled up in the unit. Thanks in advance, Kevin This message has been composed of recycled electrons. None of these electrons has been harmed or injured in the creation and transmission of this message but they have been shamelessly exploited for this use. From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Wed Oct 09 10:49:51 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 9 Oct 2002 17:49:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 63173 invoked from network); 9 Oct 2002 17:49:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Oct 2002 17:49:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web40802.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.78.179) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Oct 2002 17:49:50 -0000 Message-ID: <20021009174950.96034.qmail@web40802.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.35.92] by web40802.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 09 Oct 2002 10:49:50 PDT Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 10:49:50 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: {AMSF} For Jay Rogers... To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: <3DA10ECD.816A20E0@skyweb.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio Is there a Boston office? Jay __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Faith Hill - Exclusive Performances, Videos & More http://faith.yahoo.com From mychucky@funport.net Wed Oct 09 13:59:49 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: mychucky@funport.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 9 Oct 2002 20:59:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 89305 invoked from network); 9 Oct 2002 20:58:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Oct 2002 20:58:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.funport.com) (216.199.19.6) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Oct 2002 20:58:32 -0000 Received: from FatMusic2000 ([]) by mail.funport.com (Merak 5.1.3) with SMTP id JFB36580 for ; Wed, 09 Oct 2002 16:54:17 -0400 Message-ID: <000e01c26fd6$ae9610f0$1400a8c0@FatMusic2000> To: References: <01c601c26fb3$e24cac60$56f9bed8@kredding430cdt> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Old Tech Help Needed Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 16:58:51 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=85836819 X-Yahoo-Profile: mychucky1 Hi Kevin, 470Mf was a popular value for power supply filters in the 50's and 60 and the color code seems to bear that out. Check the voltage and pick any cap from 350 mfd at the voltage you need. Regards Chuck ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" To: Cc: Sent: Wednesday, October 09, 2002 12:49 PM Subject: {AMSF} Old Tech Help Needed > I have come to the oracles seeking advice... > > I am working on a mid 50s era RCA Yachtsman. This unit has a BIG black > capacitor thats blown to pieces in it. This unit has bands and, well.... we > don't have to read these things anymore. Spoiled is what I am because I am > used to looking at the caps and reading the numbers printed on the side. I > need help reading the color bands on this thing. If it was a resistor this > unit would be changed out by now.... > > This is what I have. There are 4 bands on one end and one on the other. > > End near the volume pot: > 1st wide yellow band > 2nd narrow violet band > 3rd narrow orange band > 4th narrow black band > > And on the far end near the heat sink: > narrow orange band > > Can anyone tell me the value of this thing? It looks like a big resistor but > its not because I can see the paper and foil all rolled up in the unit. > > Thanks in advance, > Kevin > This message has been composed of recycled electrons. None of these > electrons has been harmed or injured in the creation and transmission of > this message but they have been shamelessly exploited for this use. > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > From ccuff@in4web.com Wed Oct 09 14:54:41 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 9 Oct 2002 21:54:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 82709 invoked from network); 9 Oct 2002 21:54:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Oct 2002 21:54:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Oct 2002 21:54:40 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.63]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Wed, 9 Oct 2002 17:51:31 -0400 Message-ID: <002301c26fde$4824f680$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: <01c601c26fb3$e24cac60$56f9bed8@kredding430cdt> <000e01c26fd6$ae9610f0$1400a8c0@FatMusic2000> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Old Tech Help Needed Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 17:53:19 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 These caps were bad right out of the factory- We had to replace these in sets that were only a year old way back when. The value of this one is a .047 uFD Yellow, 4; violet 7; orage is the multiplier, 3- meaning in todays terms,. a 473, or .047 Chris ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Wednesday, October 09, 2002 4:58 PM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Old Tech Help Needed From KC4QLP@aol.com Wed Oct 09 17:39:35 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 10 Oct 2002 00:39:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 89207 invoked from network); 10 Oct 2002 00:39:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Oct 2002 00:39:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r05.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.101) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Oct 2002 00:39:33 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.27.2eb933f1 (4238) for ; Wed, 9 Oct 2002 20:39:30 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <27.2eb933f1.2ad62641@aol.com> Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 20:39:29 EDT Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Feds to Decide on Digital Radio To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 10/9/02 5:04:22 AM Eastern Daylight Time, dav259@csiro.au writes: << Wouldn't the Motorola Symphony system be popular with radio stations? - particularly for non-cashed up smaller outfits? After all - it wouldn't cost them anything! And there's the same (IBOC) argument for listeners. They wouldn't HAVE to buy new radios if they didn't want to hear superior sound.>> I agree..and besides we wouldnt have the interference that IBOC would create as well << Can't we drum up a bit of publicity with the NAB? Maybe Richard, Bob, Mark, and Farrah you could write something about this in your radio columns ... http://mrtmag.com/ar/radio_motorolas_symphony_digital/ >> As far as publicity with the NAB ...hahahaha...LOL ..now thats funny..LOL! Thats like asking Hitler to be nice to the Jews and not to gas them. All we can do at this point is hope that the comments that were put in earlier this year will have some weight in what the FCC decides tomorrow {Thursday Oct 10,02} perhaps once again the politicians will "save us from ourselves" ..if that's the case again...God help us all. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5..., Ray Communications Radio Network Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereoradio-subcribe@topica.com amstereo-subcribe@topica.com amstereoradio-subscribe@yahoogroups.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ WARNING TO UNSOLICITED SPAMMERS !!! Pursuant to U.S. Code, title 47, Chapter 5, Subchapter II, "Any and all nonsolicited E-mail (SPAM) sent to this address is subject to a download and archival fee of 500 U.S."!! E-mailing denotes acceptance of these terms." Your message (if actually mailed) is in violation of the Federal Telephone Consumer Protection Act of 1991, and Collateral Code of Federal Regulations (47 CFR 64.1200). The TCPA allows a private right of action against the sender of unsolicited advertising. The recipient can sue for $500, or actualdamages (whichever is greater). ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------- Osama bin Laden can kiss my royal white American behind! From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Oct 09 17:42:03 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 10 Oct 2002 00:42:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 37262 invoked from network); 10 Oct 2002 00:42:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Oct 2002 00:42:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Oct 2002 00:42:00 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-89-103.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.103]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g9A0aibf008976 for ; Wed, 9 Oct 2002 19:37:00 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <002101c26ff6$314d9080$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Feds to Decide on Digital Radio Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 19:43:59 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude I wonder what would happen if someone decided to set up a cell phone system with the intention of reverting back to analog? The commercials could say harp on how digital doesn't deliver, and at least with occasional static and fading you could still communicate whereas the digital signal just drops out leaving an empty hole. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kevin T." > And, as we've already seen, IBOC will do the same thing to radio! > Poorer reception... garbled digital audio... narrowed frequency > response... but, dont'cha know, it's CRYSTAL CLEAR, with NO STATIC, > so it must be perfect -- just like the David Duchovny/X-Files-wannabe > Sprint PCS guy has been telling us on TV for years! From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Oct 09 17:49:45 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 10 Oct 2002 00:49:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 39024 invoked from network); 10 Oct 2002 00:49:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Oct 2002 00:49:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Oct 2002 00:49:44 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-89-103.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.103]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g9A0ihbf011172 for ; Wed, 9 Oct 2002 19:44:44 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <003601c26ff7$460170e0$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} The RANT in Digital! Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 19:52:11 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude And I hope the nature of you and your co-worker can fill that vacuum with wonderful AM stereo! ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Phil Rafuse" > One of my co-workers, also a former broadcaster, opined yesterday > that there are an awful lots of great, wide open AM frequencies in > Canada. A lot of good used transmitters freshly taken out of > service too. Nature abhors a vacuum. > > Phil From KC4QLP@aol.com Wed Oct 09 19:41:37 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 10 Oct 2002 02:41:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 57879 invoked from network); 10 Oct 2002 02:30:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Oct 2002 02:30:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d03.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.35) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Oct 2002 02:30:26 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.66.28a964fd (4238) for ; Wed, 9 Oct 2002 22:30:14 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <66.28a964fd.2ad64036@aol.com> Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 22:30:14 EDT Subject: Re: {AMSF} Old Tech Help Needed To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 10/9/02 5:56:17 PM Eastern Daylight Time, ccuff@in4web.com writes: << These caps were bad right out of the factory- We had to replace these in sets that were only a year old way back when. The value of this one is a .047 uFD Yellow, 4; violet 7; orage is the multiplier, 3- meaning in todays terms,. a 473, or .047 Chris >> I'd say the cap had anywheres from 200 to 450 VDC across it ....a simple volt meter could tell you what the voltage is at that point ...and go with a cap that has a higher rating than what the voltage is that you measure in the circuit.. Just remember safety safety safety when working on high voltage circuits. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5..., Ray Communications Radio Network Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereoradio-subcribe@topica.com amstereo-subcribe@topica.com amstereoradio-subscribe@yahoogroups.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ WARNING TO UNSOLICITED SPAMMERS !!! Pursuant to U.S. Code, title 47, Chapter 5, Subchapter II, "Any and all nonsolicited E-mail (SPAM) sent to this address is subject to a download and archival fee of 500 U.S."!! E-mailing denotes acceptance of these terms." Your message (if actually mailed) is in violation of the Federal Telephone Consumer Protection Act of 1991, and Collateral Code of Federal Regulations (47 CFR 64.1200). The TCPA allows a private right of action against the sender of unsolicited advertising. The recipient can sue for $500, or actualdamages (whichever is greater). ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------- Osama bin Laden can kiss my royal white American behind! From n0uiheric@aol.com Wed Oct 09 20:37:22 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 10 Oct 2002 03:37:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 17464 invoked from network); 10 Oct 2002 03:37:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Oct 2002 03:37:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r05.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.101) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Oct 2002 03:37:21 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-r05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.c6.133ad8f5 (4262) for ; Wed, 9 Oct 2002 23:37:16 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 23:37:16 EDT Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fw: WGKA equipment To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih WGKA finally has an FM affiliate...WFSH 104.7 in Athens, GA. "104.7 The Fish" is also owned by Salem. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From amfmdx@fastq.com Wed Oct 09 23:28:50 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 10 Oct 2002 06:28:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 19830 invoked from network); 10 Oct 2002 06:28:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Oct 2002 06:28:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Oct 2002 06:28:48 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt ([208.187.57.109]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id g9A6Slq49596 for ; Wed, 9 Oct 2002 23:28:47 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <038101c27026$2cad0580$56f9bed8@kredding430cdt> To: References: <27.2eb933f1.2ad62641@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Feds to Decide on Digital Radio Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 23:27:56 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > As far as publicity with the NAB ...hahahaha...LOL ..now thats funny..LOL! > Thats like asking Hitler to be nice to the Jews and not to gas them. Eddie Fritts needs to just go the hell away.... Kevin From amfmdx@fastq.com Wed Oct 09 23:35:48 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 10 Oct 2002 06:35:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 36636 invoked from network); 10 Oct 2002 06:35:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Oct 2002 06:35:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Oct 2002 06:35:48 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt ([208.187.57.109]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id g9A6Zlq49652 for ; Wed, 9 Oct 2002 23:35:47 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <03a501c27027$270e9de0$56f9bed8@kredding430cdt> To: References: <66.28a964fd.2ad64036@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Old Tech Help Needed Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 23:34:56 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > Just remember safety safety safety when working on high voltage circuits. I am using all the safety training I got while in Navy electronics school aeons ago. The military was pretty serious when it came to giving safety training. All I can tell you was that when that paper cap went, it must have been spectacularly loud. Thats a big black SOB and there was a BIG burn mark on the chassis on it from the fireball. Kevin From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Oct 10 01:42:29 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 10 Oct 2002 08:42:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 91546 invoked from network); 10 Oct 2002 08:42:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Oct 2002 08:42:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Oct 2002 08:42:29 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.154] by n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 10 Oct 2002 08:42:28 -0000 Date: Thu, 10 Oct 2002 08:42:26 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Old Tech Help Needed Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <03a501c27027$270e9de0$56f9bed8@kredding430cdt> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 731 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.78.4 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > All I can tell you was that when that paper cap went, it must have > been spectacularly loud. Thats a big black SOB and there was a BIG > burn mark on the chassis on it from the fireball. Heh... a while back I was working on a Sony tape deck. It was originally part of an integrated stereo system with special connections, and I was trying to get it to work as a stand-alone unit. First was the power connection. Right on the circuit board it had a sticker saying "120 VAC". So, I found the two power input wires and that's what I applied to them. *POW!* Now with a zapped-off circuit trace and a burned-out voltage regulator, I discovered that it was really only expecting 12 VDC, despite what the sticker said. From spfleck@citlink.net Thu Oct 10 04:41:21 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: spfleck@citlink.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 10 Oct 2002 11:41:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 68361 invoked from network); 10 Oct 2002 11:41:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Oct 2002 11:41:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO relay01.roc.frontiernet.net) (66.133.131.34) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Oct 2002 11:41:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 29227 invoked from network); 10 Oct 2002 11:41:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO Steve) ([170.215.240.249]) (envelope-sender ) by relay01.roc.frontiernet.net (qmail-ldap-1.03) with SMTP for ; 10 Oct 2002 11:41:17 -0000 Message-ID: <01bd01c27051$f6bdf020$01c8a8c0@N2UBP> To: References: <1034239859.425.43560.m12@yahoogroups.com> Subject: Oh, its just a radio Date: Thu, 10 Oct 2002 07:41:24 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Steve Fleckenstein" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=2988995 X-Yahoo-Profile: n2ubp >Because people >spend $50 plus bucks a month for cable or satellite, their willing >to spend big bucks for a new TV. Yet they balk at paying $70 for an >SR III. Oh, its just a radio. Yet how do they know about weather, >traffic conditions and school closures. Radio - the medium that >reaches everyone, that everyone depends on, but almost everyone >takes for granted. Perhaps in Canada this is true. Please allow me to paint you a picture of radio choices 70 miles northwest of New York City in the Middletown, NY area. Middletown used to have a local AM/FM outlet with local news, local programming, local school closings, local talk shows with topics of local interest, carrying the Mets baseball games, and a weekend DJ former bing band era vocal artist who spun old Sinatra records on AM and a progressive rock outlet on FM. It wasn't great but it was local content on local topics of interest. The hills in this area are full of iron ore which seem to wreak havoc on reception of NYC FM outlets in traveling automobiles. The NYC AM outlets are more concerned with getting a strong signal out to long island suburbs and therefore antenna patterns are adjusted accordingly. The Middletown stations were sold off to a comglomorate, turned into satellite / microwave fed lights out studios sourced from a megastudio in Poughkeepsie. The few times I have tried to tolerate their programming to listen for a school snow closing I have been disappointed. Wouldn't dare break into a satellite feed to provide local information. Doesn't matter now anyhow. The AM station gave up on their ESPN feed and has gone all Spanish (except for still carried Mets games). Warwick has a small Mom and Pop AM station that gets into Middletown. I am totally turned off by utlra democrat Uncle Mel in the morning, bad mouthing every area of the county that is not Warwick. Newburgh has an AM outlet WGNY still running low power on a temp antenna since their tower came down. Town doesn't want to let them rebuild the tower. A low power Cornwall station was broadcasting CNN. AM stereo is pretty much gone except when the DX comes in at night. NYC has abandoned AM Stereo. Radio Manufacturers have abandoned AM. Best AM radio in my house is a 1989 vintage Sangean ATS-803A portable and my late 70's vintage Lafayette discrete PLL AM/FM tuner. The new dept. store sourced stuff is pretty much just a single cheap chip that barely picks up a local AM station, stuck in the radio so that they can claim it is AM and FM. FM is outright sad unless you are at home with a decent receiver and roof mount antenna and rotor. Below 92 mhz I can get born again christian station translators booming in, three in a row ALL transmitting the same exact programming, or multiple New Jersey and Albany controlled NPR stations all transmitting pretty much the same content. Commericial FM broadcasts - most of the programming just plain sucks. Stations that claim to be jazz stations that really play ancient MoTown, ghetto music for the rice boys in their thumper wagons with coffee can fart pipe mufflers, stations with more commericials than content, canned national lights out satellite feeds with lame announcers. So that is why I find myself mining MP3 files on the internet and listening to commericial free music from the DirecTV satellite feed. That is why I get my weather from a dedicated NWS SAME code FM reciever. That is why I use my police scanner to listen to school bus frequencies to listen for school closings and the road crews for road conditions. That is why I converted all my old LP's and tapes to CD-R. Radio today, content, consumer equipment, attitude just plain sucks. The people who care are swept aside for the corporate good. Steve N2UBP From philipr@irac.pe.ca Thu Oct 10 06:36:32 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 10 Oct 2002 13:36:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 92634 invoked from network); 10 Oct 2002 13:36:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Oct 2002 13:36:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Oct 2002 13:36:29 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.154] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 10 Oct 2002 13:36:29 -0000 Date: Thu, 10 Oct 2002 13:36:29 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Old Tech Help Needed Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <03a501c27027$270e9de0$56f9bed8@kredding430cdt> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1203 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" wrote: > > Just remember safety safety safety when working on high voltage circuits. > > I am using all the safety training I got while in Navy electronics school > aeons ago. The military was pretty serious when it came to giving safety > training. > > All I can tell you was that when that paper cap went, it must have been > spectacularly loud. Thats a big black SOB and there was a BIG burn mark on > the chassis on it from the fireball. > > Kevin Sounds like a similar situation to the 0.047 paper cap [often encased in black plastic, also with that hard to figure out colour code - why is it so easy for resistors but so hard for caps?]used in 50s era tube Zenith Trans-oceanics that is wired across the AC line. When the cap developes a short, its a big BANG! Never ocurred in those days to use a fuse - except for the military, and for some good kits. A nice polyester, or polypropeline cap, rated for 600 or 630 volts, should do the job nicely and last for a few centuries or so. I like the yellow ones. A nice orange drop is OK too. Phil P.S. Kevin, tell us more about your RCA that your working on! From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Thu Oct 10 11:12:08 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 10 Oct 2002 18:12:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 19907 invoked from network); 10 Oct 2002 18:12:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Oct 2002 18:12:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14206.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.173.70) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Oct 2002 18:12:07 -0000 Message-ID: <20021010181207.76637.qmail@web14206.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.45.202.244] by web14206.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 10 Oct 2002 11:12:07 PDT Date: Thu, 10 Oct 2002 11:12:07 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Read It and Weep To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: John Pavlica X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio The FCC is clearly full of politicians, not engineers! Just released: -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- FCC Approves Ibiquity's IBOC Technology Washington - Oct 10, 2002- The FCC has approved the in-band on-channel digital broadcasting technology developed by Ibiquity Digital Corporation for use by stations. Following an extensive review, the FCC's decision will allow radio stations to begin immediately broadcasting digitally using the Ibiquity-developed IBOC technology, which has been branded HD Radio. Ibiquity previously announced that consumer electronics manufacturers utilizing HD Radio technology will debut products at the upcoming International Consumer Electronics Show (CES) in January. This ruling allows for broadcasters to proceed immediately with IBOC broadcasting while the final IBOC standards are established. Digital FM has been approved for both daytime and nighttime broadcast, AM digital for daytime broadcast. Ibiquity is working closely with the National Radio Systems Committee (NRSC), co-sponsored by the National Association of Broadcasters (NAB) and the Consumer Electronics Association (CEA), to develop final FM and AM IBOC standards. Ibiquity and the NAB have touted the improved audio and additional datacasting capabilities of IBOC as being the key to radio station acceptance and implementation of the technology. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- (insert food poisoning sounds) __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Faith Hill - Exclusive Performances, Videos & More http://faith.yahoo.com From jimshelden@garfield-wa.com Thu Oct 10 12:07:25 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jimshelden@garfield-wa.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 10 Oct 2002 19:07:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 6607 invoked from network); 10 Oct 2002 19:07:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Oct 2002 19:07:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.78) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Oct 2002 19:07:24 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.187] by n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 10 Oct 2002 19:07:23 -0000 Date: Thu, 10 Oct 2002 19:07:21 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Greetings All Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 953 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Jim Shelden" X-Originating-IP: 134.121.82.119 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=73693137 X-Yahoo-Profile: jimshelden I have been in the background, lurking on this list for some time now, and wanted to say 'hi', and ask for some help. I'm looking for Am stereo exciters and mod monitors that might be purchased from some of those who have turned them off. Let me give you a little background... I consult for several stations in E. Wa and N. Idaho. About three years ago I put in a new BE Am1A at KWAL-620 and since it came with cquam installed, I talked the owner into rebuilding the whole audio chain to stereo. The station is about half live, and half sat. c/w, but it sounds great, and we really have gotten lots of positive response to the am stereo. I have at least 2 other stations who would convert if we could find the equipment affordably. Any leads you could pass along would be helpful. I suspect there are lots of exciters and processors sitting in transmitter racks, not being used. This list is a great resource, Thanks! Jim KC7BJ From meridian3891@cs.com Thu Oct 10 12:15:55 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: meridian3891@cs.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 10 Oct 2002 19:15:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 18787 invoked from network); 10 Oct 2002 19:15:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Oct 2002 19:15:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Oct 2002 19:15:55 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.140] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 10 Oct 2002 19:15:52 -0000 Date: Thu, 10 Oct 2002 19:15:52 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Read It and Weep Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20021010181207.76637.qmail@web14206.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1933 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Tony" X-Originating-IP: 205.166.36.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=48487815 X-Yahoo-Profile: onemeridian "That's strange....Tony never vomits at home." Murphy's golden rule: "He who has the gold makes the rules." Tony --- In amstereoforum@y..., John Pavlica wrote: > The FCC is clearly full of politicians, not engineers! Just released: > -------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------ > FCC Approves Ibiquity's IBOC Technology > Washington - Oct 10, 2002- The FCC has approved the in-band on- channel digital > broadcasting technology developed by Ibiquity Digital Corporation for use by > stations. Following an extensive review, the FCC's decision will allow radio > stations to begin immediately broadcasting digitally using the > Ibiquity-developed IBOC technology, which has been branded HD Radio. > > Ibiquity previously announced that consumer electronics manufacturers utilizing > HD Radio technology will debut products at the upcoming International Consumer > Electronics Show (CES) in January. > > This ruling allows for broadcasters to proceed immediately with IBOC > broadcasting while the final IBOC standards are established. Digital FM has > been approved for both daytime and nighttime broadcast, AM digital for daytime > broadcast. Ibiquity is working closely with the National Radio Systems > Committee (NRSC), co-sponsored by the National Association of Broadcasters > (NAB) and the Consumer Electronics Association (CEA), to develop final FM and > AM IBOC standards. > > Ibiquity and the NAB have touted the improved audio and additional datacasting > capabilities of IBOC as being the key to radio station acceptance and > implementation of the technology. > -------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------ > (insert food poisoning sounds) > > __________________________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Faith Hill - Exclusive Performances, Videos & More > http://faith.yahoo.com From philipr@irac.pe.ca Thu Oct 10 12:36:32 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 10 Oct 2002 19:36:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 13664 invoked from network); 10 Oct 2002 19:36:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Oct 2002 19:36:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.70) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Oct 2002 19:36:31 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.143] by n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 10 Oct 2002 19:36:25 -0000 Date: Thu, 10 Oct 2002 19:36:24 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Read It and Weep Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20021010181207.76637.qmail@web14206.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2603 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking "OK class, please identify the common element in these words: Quadraphonic Sound L-Cassette Tri-planes IBOC monochrome monitor" Little Johnny pipes up, "Teacher, these things are all extinct, but you can see them in a museum, just like the dinosaurs. And, they will never, ever come back. "Very good. Now class, please identify the common element in these words: skateboards roller skates/roller blades drive in theatres Ford Thunderbird [remember, it was extinct for a while, after a long line of Blunderbirds and Thunderchickens] AM Stereo in-line six-cylinder engines LPs " Little Sarah pipes up, "Teacher, their all cool things that almost dissappeared, but came back after a while, and became popular again." Politicians come and go, good ideas stay and are built upon. --- In amstereoforum@y..., John Pavlica wrote: > The FCC is clearly full of politicians, not engineers! Just released: > ------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------- > FCC Approves Ibiquity's IBOC Technology > Washington - Oct 10, 2002- The FCC has approved the in-band on- channel digital > broadcasting technology developed by Ibiquity Digital Corporation for use by > stations. Following an extensive review, the FCC's decision will allow radio > stations to begin immediately broadcasting digitally using the > Ibiquity-developed IBOC technology, which has been branded HD Radio. > > Ibiquity previously announced that consumer electronics manufacturers utilizing > HD Radio technology will debut products at the upcoming International Consumer > Electronics Show (CES) in January. > > This ruling allows for broadcasters to proceed immediately with IBOC > broadcasting while the final IBOC standards are established. Digital FM has > been approved for both daytime and nighttime broadcast, AM digital for daytime > broadcast. Ibiquity is working closely with the National Radio Systems > Committee (NRSC), co-sponsored by the National Association of Broadcasters > (NAB) and the Consumer Electronics Association (CEA), to develop final FM and > AM IBOC standards. > > Ibiquity and the NAB have touted the improved audio and additional datacasting > capabilities of IBOC as being the key to radio station acceptance and > implementation of the technology. > ------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------- > (insert food poisoning sounds) > > __________________________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Faith Hill - Exclusive Performances, Videos & More > http://faith.yahoo.com From ccuff@in4web.com Thu Oct 10 15:10:14 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 10 Oct 2002 22:10:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 82554 invoked from network); 10 Oct 2002 21:53:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Oct 2002 21:53:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Oct 2002 21:53:09 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.90]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Thu, 10 Oct 2002 17:50:07 -0400 Message-ID: <000901c270a7$3de0fec0$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: <20021010181207.76637.qmail@web14206.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Read It and Weep Date: Thu, 10 Oct 2002 17:51:50 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 Just remember tho- this just says that "If stations want to, they can"- Not that many want to. There are too many negative factors weighing in , especially now: The economy in the dumpster. There is simply no money for upgrades of this magnitude. People do not care about "McRadio" anymore. Radio, in general, is not at the top of a lot of peoples adgendas right now. It probably never will be again. Lets just be there for those that still care. CC From amstereoguy@hotmail.com Thu Oct 10 15:11:27 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereoguy@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 10 Oct 2002 22:11:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 53361 invoked from network); 10 Oct 2002 22:11:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Oct 2002 22:11:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (207.68.165.133) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Oct 2002 22:11:27 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 10 Oct 2002 15:11:27 -0700 Received: from 208.20.8.90 by sea2fd.sea2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Thu, 10 Oct 2002 22:11:27 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Oh, its just a radio Date: Thu, 10 Oct 2002 18:11:27 -0400 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 10 Oct 2002 22:11:27.0527 (UTC) FILETIME=[FA8F3B70:01C270A9] From: "Chris Cuff" X-Originating-IP: [208.20.8.90] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37866059 Steve, I live near there, too. WTBQ would be an OK station if they dumped Mel. WRRV has been ruined but I have to admit I do listen to Boris and Jen. WALL is wrecked. I remember calling in requests to them, back in 1966- and hearing myself on the air! WBNR used to be stereo, and could also be a good station. But you are right- I have over 500 songs on my portable MP3 jukebox, and with a side of WCBS newsradio 88 at times, thats about all that is left. As for XM, I am not paying for something I wont use. BTW- I love your "rice boys" comments. ROTFLMAO! Chris >From: "Steve Fleckenstein" _________________________________________________________________ Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com From dav259@csiro.au Thu Oct 10 16:23:53 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 10 Oct 2002 23:23:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 8207 invoked from network); 10 Oct 2002 23:23:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Oct 2002 23:23:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Oct 2002 23:23:45 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9ANNic12286 for ; Fri, 11 Oct 2002 09:23:44 +1000 (EST) Date: Fri, 11 Oct 2002 09:23:44 +1000 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: amstereoforum Subject: FCC Approves IBOC; Powell Calls Order 'Historic' (fwd) Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public Trying to find a positive ... Some AM music stations MAY wire up for stereo - and find the whole episode a disaster in a year or so - and may revert back to AM stereo when the Symphony receivers are released in just over 12 months. If only the Symphony system would include AMS as a basic feature ... Looks like the intro of IBOC is going to handled the same way as AMS. I aint weeping yet! ________________________________________________ FCC Approves IBOC; Powell Calls Order 'Historic' The FCC has approved in-band, on-channel digital audio broadcasting as the technology U.S. stations will use to go digital. The decision clears the way for stations to use the system developed by Ibiquity Digital Corp. Although the commission said it is no longer considering using TV Channel 6 for digital radio use, it did not close the door on systems requiring new spectrum, should such new spectrum be identified. The Report and Order allows FMs to transmit both a digital and analog signal both day and night, and AMs during the day only. Stations that want to begin digital transmissions would need to file a request for Special Temporary Authorization with the FCC. FCC Chairman Michael Powell called the decision historic and said he is glad to see radio join other media in going digital. "I'm thrilled to see the radio wagon train get to the other side." Commissioners praised the Ibiquity Digital Corp. system for its spectral efficiency; both Commissioners Katheen Abernathy and Michael Copps said they can't wait to purchase IBOC receivers. (Those are slated to be introduced in January at the Consumer Electronics Show.) Ibiquity was pleased with the action. Vice President, Broadcast Engineering, Glynn Walden said, "IBOC is a concept rooted in the American concept of a free over-the-air broadcast system...a concept and a technology that allows each and every broadcaster to transition from an analog world to a digital future while re-using the existing infrastructure and allocated broadcast spectrum. IBOC is such a compelling concept that technology was developed. With this FCC decision, those benefits are now available for broadcasters to bring the benefits of HD digital radio to the U.S. public." The FCC Media Bureau staff feels they will learn a lot about IBOC technology when stations start to transmit a digital signal. If any interference occurs from a station that is transmitting both signals, especially interference to first adjacent channels, or to services broadcast on FM subcarriers, the commission hopes the parties would work it out. The agency would be ready to intervene in cases where stations are unable to come to an agreement about how to solve the interference, officials said. They said it was too soon to tell when the FCC would promulgate final IBOC rules, with licensing details. ####### From stodd@sherbtel.net Thu Oct 10 18:04:43 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 11 Oct 2002 01:04:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 1021 invoked from network); 11 Oct 2002 01:04:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Oct 2002 01:04:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Oct 2002 01:04:42 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-88-118.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.118]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g9B0wdbf028226 for ; Thu, 10 Oct 2002 19:59:40 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <001f01c270c2$88d4a9c0$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Old Tech Help Needed Date: Thu, 10 Oct 2002 20:06:11 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Probably because there's a few more bands, and there's usually an extra one for the voltage rating- the last one. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Phil Rafuse" > Sounds like a similar situation to the 0.047 paper cap [often > encased in black plastic, also with that hard to figure out colour > code - why is it so easy for resistors but so hard for caps?] From stodd@sherbtel.net Thu Oct 10 18:07:53 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 11 Oct 2002 01:07:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 76343 invoked from network); 11 Oct 2002 01:07:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Oct 2002 01:07:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Oct 2002 01:07:52 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-88-118.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.118]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g9B12mbf029097 for ; Thu, 10 Oct 2002 20:02:50 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <002301c270c2$fa1a7740$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Greetings All Date: Thu, 10 Oct 2002 20:10:21 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude If you go onto the Radio-tech forum at broadcast.net, I know a few on there who have just what you're looking for. They also sometimes pop up on ebay. Thanks for making your presence known and please keep us posted as to your progress. Scott Todd ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jim Shelden" > I have at least 2 other stations who would convert if we could find > the equipment affordably. Any leads you could pass along would be > helpful. I suspect there are lots of exciters and processors sitting > in transmitter racks, not being used. From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Oct 10 19:51:44 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 11 Oct 2002 02:51:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 11381 invoked from network); 11 Oct 2002 02:51:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Oct 2002 02:51:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r02.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.98) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Oct 2002 02:51:42 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.b2.13448a9f (4418) for ; Thu, 10 Oct 2002 22:51:30 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: Date: Thu, 10 Oct 2002 22:51:30 EDT Subject: Re: {AMSF} FCC Approves IBOC; Powell Calls Order 'Historic' (fwd) To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 10/10/02 7:27:08 PM Eastern Daylight Time, dav259@csiro.au writes: << Trying to find a positive ... Some AM music stations MAY wire up for stereo - and find the whole episode a disaster in a year or so - and may revert back to AM stereo when the Symphony receivers are released in just over 12 months. If only the Symphony system would include AMS as a basic feature ... Looks like the intro of IBOC is going to handled the same way as AMS. I aint weeping yet! >> Oh yeehaa! ...the FCC and the government "saving us" from ourselves again. I'm ready to sit back and watch this whole digital thing fall apart like the early days of AM Stereo Bob Carter Operations/Engineering WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5..., Ray Communications Radio Network Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereoradio-subcribe@topica.com amstereo-subcribe@topica.com amstereoradio-subscribe@yahoogroups.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ WARNING TO UNSOLICITED SPAMMERS !!! Pursuant to U.S. Code, title 47, Chapter 5, Subchapter II, "Any and all nonsolicited E-mail (SPAM) sent to this address is subject to a download and archival fee of 500 U.S."!! E-mailing denotes acceptance of these terms." Your message (if actually mailed) is in violation of the Federal Telephone Consumer Protection Act of 1991, and Collateral Code of Federal Regulations (47 CFR 64.1200). The TCPA allows a private right of action against the sender of unsolicited advertising. The recipient can sue for $500, or actualdamages (whichever is greater). ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------- Osama bin Laden can kiss my royal white American behind! From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Oct 10 19:57:19 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 11 Oct 2002 02:57:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 88981 invoked from network); 11 Oct 2002 02:57:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Oct 2002 02:57:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r04.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.100) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Oct 2002 02:57:19 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.142.233e48 (4418) for ; Thu, 10 Oct 2002 22:57:14 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <142.233e48.2ad7980a@aol.com> Date: Thu, 10 Oct 2002 22:57:14 EDT Subject: Re: {AMSF} Greetings All To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 10/10/02 3:08:45 PM Eastern Daylight Time, jimshelden@garfield-wa.com writes: << I have at least 2 other stations who would convert if we could find the equipment affordably. Any leads you could pass along would be helpful. I suspect there are lots of exciters and processors sitting in transmitter racks, not being used. This list is a great resource, Thanks! Jim KC7BJ >> Hi Jim! Nice to hear some noise from "7" land as we would say in the ham radio world. So far the best bet has been E-Bay if you can get the exciters and mod monitors away from the junk dealers and those that bid on items only to resell them else where. I'm still looking for a set up myself for WRCS-AM 970 out this way Bob Carter Operations/Engineering WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5..., Ray Communications Radio Network Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereoradio-subcribe@topica.com amstereo-subcribe@topica.com amstereoradio-subscribe@yahoogroups.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ WARNING TO UNSOLICITED SPAMMERS !!! Pursuant to U.S. Code, title 47, Chapter 5, Subchapter II, "Any and all nonsolicited E-mail (SPAM) sent to this address is subject to a download and archival fee of 500 U.S."!! E-mailing denotes acceptance of these terms." Your message (if actually mailed) is in violation of the Federal Telephone Consumer Protection Act of 1991, and Collateral Code of Federal Regulations (47 CFR 64.1200). The TCPA allows a private right of action against the sender of unsolicited advertising. The recipient can sue for $500, or actualdamages (whichever is greater). ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------- Osama bin Laden can kiss my royal white American behind! From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Oct 10 20:06:31 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 11 Oct 2002 03:06:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 13096 invoked from network); 11 Oct 2002 03:06:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Oct 2002 03:06:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d04.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.36) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Oct 2002 03:06:30 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.72.241a1c32 (4418) for ; Thu, 10 Oct 2002 23:06:23 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <72.241a1c32.2ad79a2e@aol.com> Date: Thu, 10 Oct 2002 23:06:22 EDT Subject: Re: {AMSF} Read It and Weep To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 10/10/02 6:41:55 PM Eastern Daylight Time, ccuff@in4web.com writes: << Just remember tho- this just says that "If stations want to, they can"- Not that many want to. There are too many negative factors weighing in , especially now: The economy in the dumpster. There is simply no money for upgrades of this magnitude. People do not care about "McRadio" anymore. Radio, in general, is not at the top of a lot of peoples adgendas right now. It probably never will be again. Lets just be there for those that still care. CC >> Amen to that! ..god help the stations and their engineers for the stations that can afford and decide to go IBOC interference mode on 540,550,*560*,570 and 580 ..cause if I start getting interfered with ,,then I'm going to make some "noise" and become some stations engineer and or station manager little pest {grin} From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Oct 10 21:19:10 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 11 Oct 2002 04:19:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 76662 invoked from network); 11 Oct 2002 04:19:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Oct 2002 04:19:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web12805.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.174.40) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Oct 2002 04:19:09 -0000 Message-ID: <20021011041909.14878.qmail@web12805.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [216.192.85.10] by web12805.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 10 Oct 2002 21:19:09 PDT Date: Thu, 10 Oct 2002 21:19:09 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Fwd: RE: Symphony DSP radio - AM Stereo To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "Kevin T." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics Here is the response I received from Motorola, with my message to them attached below. Karen's reply seems a little too consistent amongst the other ones that have been shared here. Perhaps Motorola has been getting enough inquiries about the Symphony DSP chipset's support for C-Quam AM Stereo that they've come up with this "cut & paste" text to reply with? > From: Bartell Karen-r7aalh > To: "'Kevin T.'" > CC: Tremmel Steve-rtca30 , > Hansen John-ra6595 > Subject: RE: Symphony DSP radio - AM Stereo > Date: Thu, 10 Oct 2002 10:25:18 -0700 > > Hi Kevin, > > Many thanks for your in-depth recomendations and suggestions. > > Because the Motorola Symphony Digital Radio chip set is software based, > we are able to add features (like C-QUAM AM stereo) to the radio. The > software for AM stereo is written (it was a labor of love for one of our > software engineers). The decision to include it in the radio is up to the > radio manufacturer. We have done our part by making the cost to upgrade a > radio to AM stereo the cheapest it can be, just add some electrons. > > Thanks again for your interest, > Karen > > -----Original Message----- > From: Kevin T. [mailto:kevtronics@yahoo.com] > Sent: Wednesday, October 09, 2002 10:32 PM > To: Steve Tremmel; Karen Bartell > Subject: Symphony DSP radio - AM Stereo > > Hello, > > I am writing to inquire about the status of AM Stereo support within > Motorola's new DSP-based "Symphony" radio chipset. I am the webmaster of > the AM Stereo Web Site at: > > http://www.AMStereoRadio.com > > and I also manage the AM Stereo Forum, a discussion group with over 100 > members in which we have the participation of AM Stereo listeners from > all around the world, as well as professionals from AM Stereo radio > stations and equipment manufacturers. Recently, some members have shared > their correspondence with you regarding the Symphony DSP design and its > potential to support AM Stereo. > > I believe it is imperative that support for C-Quam AM Stereo, conforming > to the established "AMAX" high quality receiver standards, be included in > the Symphony design. Hundreds of radio stations across the globe > continue to broadcast in AM Stereo, and it remains the only choice for > providing high fidelity Stereo sound from the AM band, without the > excessive cost and questionable performance of digital systems such as > IBOC (a.k.a. HD Radio). > > The lack of demand for AM Stereo support that you may have been seeing > from receiver manufacturers is *not* because of a lack of interest, but > rather from a lack of knowledge. Unfortunately, your own company has > shown little active support for C-Quam AM Stereo over the past few years, > despite the fact that Motorola's advancements of transmitter and receiver > design have raised the C-Quam system up to a very impressive level of > performance. > > Existing analog C-Quam decoder chips, together with compliance to the > "AMAX" AM receiver quality standards that were introduced a decade ago, > have provided us with some of the highest quality AM Stereo radios ever > manufactured, including many automotive receivers from Chrysler Corp., > Ford Motor Co./Visteon, and General Motors/Delco, as well as home radios > from Denon, portable radios from Sony, and now, new professional-quality > receivers from Fanfare Electronics. > > As you know, there are many aspects which need to be addressed in order > to produce a truly high-performance receiver, on both the AM and FM > bands, and when translated into digital computer code, that makes the > design even more critical. However, there is no need to start from > scratch when it comes to laying out the specifications for a high quality > AM tuner design. These parameters have already been established as the > "AMAX" standard, and Motorola has even manufactured a special AMAX > chipset with C-Quam AM Stereo support, known as the MC13027 and MC13122 > chips. *This* is the ideal starting point, which your new digital-based > design should aspire to mimic in terms of reception quality and audio > fidelity. After all, if digital can't live up to the quality standards > set by fully analog designs, then what is the point of using digital > anyway? > > Speaking on behalf of the entire AM Stereo community on the Internet, we > feel that Motorola's Symphony design has an extremely high potential for > finally providing the listening public with what they have desired for > decades: high-performance, high-fidelity AM radio with true Stereo > sound, *without* the unnecessary cost and questionable feasibility of > unproven and problematic fully-digital designs such as IBOC. > > It is obviously Motorola's prerogative whether or not to include support > for AM Stereo as a standard feature in the Symphony design. However, at > the very least, the design should offer a level of performance and sound > quality on the AM band -- *even in monaural* -- that can at least match > up to the analog specifications set by AMAX. It is obvious that the > single most important thing which can be done to improve the popularity > of AM radio listening is to finally offer a commonly available receiver > with crisp, clear sound and improved resistance to interference and > static. > > The existing analog AMAX design achieves this with wider audio bandwidth, > lower distortion, filtering out of adjacent channel interference, and RF > noise blanking to reduce the effect of power line static. This provides > a solid foundation upon which the benefits of C-Quam AM Stereo are even > greater -- to the level where many people actually prefer the sound of > AM Stereo over that of FM Stereo, because of the richer and more natural- > sounding audio processing that many AM Stereo stations make use of. > > I highly recommend that you inform your colleages and customers about the > AM Stereo Web Site mentioned above, so that they can experience the > wealth of information it contains. We also welcome your participation in > the AM Stereo Forum discussion group, which can be easily accessed by > clicking on the "Forum" link on the AM Stereo Web Site. We share many > common ideas and goals, and if Motorola can work together harmoniously > with the comments and suggestions from AM Stereo listeners and > professionals alike, then the Symphony design will be an even greater > success and will more greatly benefit all of us. > > Sincerely, > > Kevin Tekel > kevtronics@yahoo.com > Webmaster of The AM Stereo Web Site > Sysop of The AM Stereo Forum > http://www.AMStereoRadio.com/ __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Faith Hill - Exclusive Performances, Videos & More http://faith.yahoo.com From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Oct 10 21:29:49 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 11 Oct 2002 04:29:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 17672 invoked from network); 11 Oct 2002 04:29:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Oct 2002 04:29:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Oct 2002 04:29:47 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.248] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Oct 2002 04:29:47 -0000 Date: Fri, 11 Oct 2002 04:29:46 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Old Tech Help Needed Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <001f01c270c2$88d4a9c0$d3a9fea9@me> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 704 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.85.10 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Probably because there's a few more bands, and there's usually an > extra one for the voltage rating- the last one. I am reminded of Murphy's Law for solid-state radios, which states that a 10-dollar transistor will always blow to protect a 10-cent fuse. (Especially if somebody sticks in a "Slow-Blow" fuse... nothing about solid-state electronics' reactions to undesirable voltages and currents is "slow". This is why NASA's space equipment used vacuum tubes for many years after solid-state became common on Earth; tubes are willing to "forgive" temporary overloads that might otherwise leave astronauts stranded in space with no navigation, no communication, and/or no breathable air.) From matthew.trim@eds.com Thu Oct 10 21:33:55 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: matthew.trim@eds.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 11 Oct 2002 04:33:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 82713 invoked from network); 11 Oct 2002 04:33:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Oct 2002 04:33:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO ns5.eds.com) (203.17.185.230) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Oct 2002 04:33:54 -0000 Received: from nnsy.eds.com (nnsy-3.eds.com [192.168.1.1]) by ns5.eds.com (8.11.6/8.11.1) with ESMTP id g9B4XrP27448 for ; Fri, 11 Oct 2002 14:33:53 +1000 (EST) Received: from nnsy.eds.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by nnsy.eds.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9B4Xpo24047 for ; Fri, 11 Oct 2002 14:33:51 +1000 (EST) Received: from ausym000.exau01.exch.eds.com ([134.251.177.117]) by nnsy.eds.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9B4Xod24035 for ; Fri, 11 Oct 2002 14:33:50 +1000 (EST) Received: by AUSYM000 with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id <4A7LDB7X>; Fri, 11 Oct 2002 14:33:47 +1000 Message-ID: <533761B50551D511A6D200508B6F542809CAF35C@AUSYM200> To: "'amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com'" Subject: RE: {AMSF} Fwd: RE: Symphony DSP radio - AM Stereo Date: Fri, 11 Oct 2002 14:33:17 +1000 Importance: high X-Priority: 1 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-Type: text/plain From: "Trim, Matthew L" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88615102 X-Yahoo-Profile: bofh2k2000 It sure is a cut and paste reply - I got one as well! -----Original Message----- From: Bartell Karen-r7aalh [mailto:karen.bartell@motorola.com] Sent: Saturday, 5 October 2002 2:53 AM To: Trim, Matthew L Subject: FW: Symphony Card Radio Chipset - Including C-QUAM AM Stereo? Hi Matthew, Because the Motorola Symphony Digital Radio chip set is software based, we are able to add features (like C-QUAM AM stereo) to the radio. The software for AM stereo is written (it was a labor of love for one of our software engineers). The decision to include it in the radio is up to the radio manufacturer. We have done our part by making the cost to upgrade a radio to AM stereo the cheapest it can be, just add some electrons. Thanks for your interest, Karen -----Original Message----- From: Kevin T. [mailto:kevtronics@yahoo.com] Sent: Friday, 11 October 2002 2:19 PM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Fwd: RE: Symphony DSP radio - AM Stereo Here is the response I received from Motorola, with my message to them attached below. Karen's reply seems a little too consistent amongst the other ones that have been shared here. Perhaps Motorola has been getting enough inquiries about the Symphony DSP chipset's support for C-Quam AM Stereo that they've come up with this "cut & paste" text to reply with? > From: Bartell Karen-r7aalh > To: "'Kevin T.'" > CC: Tremmel Steve-rtca30 , > Hansen John-ra6595 > Subject: RE: Symphony DSP radio - AM Stereo > Date: Thu, 10 Oct 2002 10:25:18 -0700 > > Hi Kevin, > > Many thanks for your in-depth recomendations and suggestions. > > Because the Motorola Symphony Digital Radio chip set is software based, > we are able to add features (like C-QUAM AM stereo) to the radio. The > software for AM stereo is written (it was a labor of love for one of our > software engineers). The decision to include it in the radio is up to the > radio manufacturer. We have done our part by making the cost to upgrade a > radio to AM stereo the cheapest it can be, just add some electrons. > > Thanks again for your interest, > Karen > From dav259@csiro.au Thu Oct 10 23:20:44 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 11 Oct 2002 06:20:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 75039 invoked from network); 11 Oct 2002 06:20:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Oct 2002 06:20:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Oct 2002 06:20:42 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9B6Kfc04852 for ; Fri, 11 Oct 2002 16:20:41 +1000 (EST) Date: Fri, 11 Oct 2002 16:20:40 +1000 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: "'amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com'" Subject: RE: {AMSF} Fwd: RE: Symphony DSP radio - AM Stereo In-Reply-To: <533761B50551D511A6D200508B6F542809CAF35C@AUSYM200> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public So it's to be up to the manufacturers ... Is there anyway we could start a petition - which could be easily signed by anyone on any radio list - plus others interested - which could in turn be passed on to the manufacterers? ie. a web address where all could add their names and pledge to buy at least one Symphony AMS radio should they be made available. On Fri, 11 Oct 2002, Trim, Matthew L wrote: > It sure is a cut and paste reply - I got one as well! > From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Oct 11 00:31:13 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 11 Oct 2002 07:31:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 54839 invoked from network); 11 Oct 2002 07:31:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Oct 2002 07:31:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.87) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Oct 2002 07:31:11 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.140] by n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Oct 2002 07:31:11 -0000 Date: Fri, 11 Oct 2002 07:31:10 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Symphony DSP radio - AM Stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 835 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.85.10 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > So it's to be up to the manufacturers ... > Is there anyway we could start a petition - which could be easily > signed by anyone on any radio list - plus others interested - which > could in turn be passed on to the manufacterers? > ie. a web address where all could add their names and pledge to > buy at least one Symphony AMS radio should they be made available. Try this: http://www.PetitionOnline.com/ However, in the grand scheme of things, petitions -- especially in on-line form -- are usually futile, no matter how many signatures are collected. This is not to say that what we are trying to accomplish here is futile, but rather that it should be expressed in more constructive ways, such as continuing to send e-mails to Motorola, so that we can hopefully get more than just a "cut and paste" reply from them. From groucho@skyweb.net Fri Oct 11 01:29:26 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 11 Oct 2002 08:29:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 93280 invoked from network); 11 Oct 2002 08:29:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Oct 2002 08:29:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Oct 2002 08:29:24 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g9B8Vph1070424 for ; Fri, 11 Oct 2002 04:31:52 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DA68A85.E1607685@skyweb.net> Date: Fri, 11 Oct 2002 04:23:33 -0400 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fwd: RE: Symphony DSP radio - AM Stereo References: <20021011041909.14878.qmail@web12805.mail.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Just for the record. As An AMS station Engineer I too wrote to Karen and this was my response back from her.. It seems like a Form letter to all of us. Neal CE-WTTM Hi Neal, Because the Motorola Symphony Digital Radio chip set is software based, we are able to add features (like C-QUAM AM stereo) to the radio. The software for AM stereo is written (it was a labor of love for one of our software engineers). The decision to include it in the radio is up to the radio manufacturer. We have done our part by making the cost to upgrade a radio to AM stereo the cheapest it can be, just add some electrons. However, your research is commendable, and I will forward your letter to the appropriate people. Thanks for your interest, Karen From groucho@skyweb.net Fri Oct 11 01:38:25 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 11 Oct 2002 08:38:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 51145 invoked from network); 11 Oct 2002 08:38:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Oct 2002 08:38:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Oct 2002 08:38:24 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g9B8enh1072094; Fri, 11 Oct 2002 04:40:50 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DA68C9F.FC316901@skyweb.net> Date: Fri, 11 Oct 2002 04:32:31 -0400 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ABDX@topica.com, "amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com" , "radio-tech@broadcast.net" Subject: Re: [ ABDX ] IBOC is now reality References: <0.1600035844.694626511-1463792382-1034317402@topica.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 I just wonder this.. Am I the Only One that Wrote Powell after this Decision. and asked him How much of his retirement is being financed by Lucent? and how much money they actually paid him to pass HD Radio(IBOC). I may Not have My FCC license long after writing him.. But you sure can say I got Balls to ask Him... I wonder how many Others have thought this and Not written to ask? kevin redding wrote: > Some AM music stations MAY wire up for stereo - and find the whole > episode > a disaster in a year or so - and may revert back to AM stereo when the > Symphony receivers are released in just over 12 months. If only the > Symphony system would include AMS as a basic feature ... > Stolen shamelessly from another list. > > Looks like the intro of IBOC is going to handled the same way as AMS. I > aint weeping yet! > > ________________________________________________ > FCC Approves IBOC; Powell Calls Order 'Historic' > > The FCC has approved in-band, on-channel digital audio broadcasting > as the technology U.S. stations will use to go digital. The > decision clears the way for stations to use the system developed by > Ibiquity Digital Corp. > > Although the commission said it is no longer considering using TV > Channel 6 for digital radio use, it did not close the door on > systems requiring new spectrum, should such new spectrum be > identified. > > The Report and Order allows FMs to transmit both a digital and > analog signal both day and night, and AMs during the day only. > Stations that want to begin digital transmissions would need to > file a request for Special Temporary Authorization with the FCC. > > FCC Chairman Michael Powell called the decision historic and said > he is glad to see radio join other media in going digital. "I'm > thrilled to see the radio wagon train get to the other side." > > Commissioners praised the Ibiquity Digital Corp. system for its > spectral efficiency; both Commissioners Katheen Abernathy and > Michael Copps said they can't wait to purchase IBOC receivers. > (Those are slated to be introduced in January at the Consumer > Electronics Show.) > > Ibiquity was pleased with the action. Vice President, Broadcast > Engineering, Glynn Walden said, "IBOC is a concept rooted in the > American concept of a free over-the-air broadcast system...a > concept and a technology that allows each and every broadcaster to > transition from an analog world to a digital future while re-using > the existing infrastructure and allocated broadcast spectrum. IBOC > is such a compelling concept that technology was developed. With > this FCC decision, those benefits are now available for > broadcasters to bring the benefits of HD digital radio to the U.S. > public." > > The FCC Media Bureau staff feels they will learn a lot about IBOC > technology when stations start to transmit a digital signal. If any > interference occurs from a station that is transmitting both > signals, especially interference to first adjacent channels, or to > services broadcast on FM subcarriers, the commission hopes the > parties would work it out. The agency would be ready to intervene > in cases where stations are unable to come to an agreement about > how to solve the interference, officials said. > > They said it was too soon to tell when the FCC would promulgate > final IBOC rules, with licensing details. > > ####### > > ======================== > American Broadcast DXers > Greatest DX on earth! > ======================== > > ==^================================================================ > This email was sent to: groucho@skyweb.net > > EASY UNSUBSCRIBE click here: http://topica.com/u/?bUrKzU.bWeP3W > Or send an email to: ABDX-unsubscribe@topica.com > > T O P I C A -- Register now to manage your mail! > http://www.topica.com/partner/tag02/register > ==^================================================================ From dav259@csiro.au Fri Oct 11 03:01:19 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 11 Oct 2002 10:01:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 16623 invoked from network); 11 Oct 2002 10:01:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Oct 2002 10:01:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Oct 2002 10:01:06 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9BA14c16220 for ; Fri, 11 Oct 2002 20:01:04 +1000 (EST) Date: Fri, 11 Oct 2002 20:01:04 +1000 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Subject: {AMSF} Petition for AM Stereo Symphony DSP radio In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public On Fri, 11 Oct 2002, Kevin T. wrote: > Try this: > > http://www.PetitionOnline.com/ Thanks Kevin But if a petition was to be written I'm not the one to do it. I'm not technical enough - thereagain any petition would need to be in non-tech terms to get a maximum response. I'm so non-tech I don't even understand how the above site works. As I read it the most popular petition has 3533 signatories - and the 2nd most popular has 4794. I'm not a complete idiot (it's just a good act) but this doesn't make sense to me. Thanks for what you wrote to Motorola - it was first class. And Neal - God knows what you wrote ... at least you got an extra personal line ... :) I've been on AMS lists now for 2.5 years. In all that time we naturally agree on how good AMS is - and that the two main problems are: 1. Not enough people are aware it exists. 2. We NEED more radios! To me this Symphony thing could be the answer to the second problem if only we can convince some of the manufacturers to include this (VERY CHEAP) AMS option. But I am non-tech ... and may be wrong. Bob - why wouldn't AM radio stations not jump at this opportunity - with or without NAB support? If it would cost nothing surely they wouldn't be against it. Even if IBOC worked - you would think AM stations would welcome a technology that worked both day AND NIGHT. Indeed - IF IBOC does work a little bit - it will only make AM stations less competetive than they were before. To me - this Symphony digital/analog combo is the best thing I've heard about since joining an AMS list. To you techos on this list - please tell us frustrated listeners ... is it the cat's pajamas? ... or a dog (like IBOC seems to be)? But I'm reactivated - and want to stay focussed and positive! AM stereo radio is the best radio I've ever heard since ... FM stereo radio ... and I've been a convert - because of the hi-fi and separation - plus of course the PROGRAMMING (but that's a different issue). I reckon this Symphony thing is the most positive thing that any multinational has come up with since I joined an AMS list. Surely we must jump on the bandwagon and go with it! Ian Melbourne From philipr@irac.pe.ca Fri Oct 11 05:56:53 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 11 Oct 2002 12:56:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 83448 invoked from network); 11 Oct 2002 12:56:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Oct 2002 12:56:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Oct 2002 12:56:51 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.174] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Oct 2002 12:56:51 -0000 Date: Fri, 11 Oct 2002 12:56:50 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Motorola Symphony Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 4443 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking I suppose I'll get a cut and past response too! Phil Dear Ms. Bartell: Yesterday, the FCC announced approval of the IBOC system for FM [day=20 and night] and AM daytime only. Here in Canada, we have rejected=20 such a system. We presently use AM, FM and DAB, the latter based on=20 the Eureka 147 system also used in Europe. As a Canadian, I have great concerns about the interference which=20 will be caused by the IBOC system. This will of course be most=20 pronounced near the Canada-US border. Our three largest cities,=20 Toronto, Montreal and Vancouver, are all near enough to the border=20 that IBOC interference will very likely present a major problem to=20 Canadian AM and FM stations. While DAB will be immune from this=20 interference, DAB is not feasible for large coverage areas. It is=20 an excellent system for urban areas and immediate suburban=20 districts. It is a poor choice for more distant suburbs, small=20 cities, towns and rural areas. It is in these areas especially that=20 a bright future remains for FM and AM radio. I was pleased to hear recently that Motorola has introduced its new=20 Symphony receiver chip for AM and FM. This appears to be an=20 excellent example of combining digital and analogue technology to=20 create a superior product for the consumer. It offers what IBOC=20 originally promised but can't deliver =96 enhanced audio quality on=20 both bands and no added interference. It is my understanding that=20 the Symphony system uses the latest cutting edge digital signal=20 processing [DSP] techniques to enhance the fidelity of both FM AND=20 AM reception, without the need for any special encoding or=20 additional processing at the transmitter end. I am also pleased to note that Motorola has taken the time and=20 effort to write the digital code for AM Stereo for the Symphony=20 system. Motorola's CQUAM system has provided a high fidelity stereo=20 medium on the AM band. While interest in AM Stereo has declined in=20 recent years, this is largely due to false hopes concerning the IBOC=20 system and the indifference of receiver manufacturers. The Symphony Chip offers Motorola a chance to re-invigorate the=20 CQUAM system, as well as provide a superior response to IBOC. As=20 interests in IBOC wanes [given limited digital coverage areas,=20 adjacent channel interference, high equipment costs to broadcasters=20 and degraded analogue fidelity] the Symphony system will provide a=20 superior alternative to consumers, broadcasters and receiver=20 manufacturers. I therefore urge Motorola to re-commit itself to AM Stereo, and=20 provide full AM Stereo capability built in to the standard Symphony=20 Chip. While this might result in a net price increase to the=20 receiver manufacturer of a couple pennies per chip, this will ensure=20 that the Symphony Chip will have an additional major feature=20 available across the board. It will also serve to reduce confusion=20 in the marketplace, and ensure that "Motorola Symphony" is=20 synonymous with high fidelity, virtually interference free FM Stereo=20 AND AM Stereo. This will be one extra selling feature for receiver=20 manufacturers =96 an extra feature which, in a competitive=20 marketplace, could mean the difference between success and failure=20 of the product line.=20 I would be pleased to be provided with more information on the=20 Symphony Chip. I look forward to hearing in the near future that=20 the Symphony Chip will be offered with FM and AM Stereo as standard,=20 built in features. The FCC's decision to "let the marketplace=20 decide" was the primary blow to AM Stereo's introduction.=20=20 Unfortunately, the marketplace is often dictated to by the end=20 manufacturers. Don't let the marketplace decide =96 instead, let the=20 consumer decide.=20=20 Finally, I would highly recommend that you and other Motorola=20 executives refer your engineering and marketing staff to the AM=20 Stereo Website http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/kevtronics/=20=20 and in particular, the Forum on this site. The Forum has over a=20 hundred members worldwide, ranging from broadcast engineers to=20 consumers to engineers working for manufacturers of cutting edge=20 receivers and transmitters. Motorola's active participation in the=20 Forum would no doubt provide a wonderful opportunity to obtain=20 valuable input and feedback to ensure the success of the symphony=20 system and the successful re-introduction of CQUAM AM Stereo. Regards Phil Rafuse 5 Stewart Avenue Stratford PE C1B 1B1 Canada =20 =20 =20 From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Fri Oct 11 06:12:03 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 11 Oct 2002 13:12:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 75969 invoked from network); 11 Oct 2002 13:12:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Oct 2002 13:12:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14203.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.145) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Oct 2002 13:12:02 -0000 Message-ID: <20021011131202.70686.qmail@web14203.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.45.202.244] by web14203.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 11 Oct 2002 06:12:02 PDT Date: Fri, 11 Oct 2002 06:12:02 -0700 (PDT) Subject: AMS discussion on Radio-Tech list To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: John Pavlica X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio There's a very interesting topic on the Radio-Tech list about "Why AM Stereo Failed", and more positive support for AMS than what I had imagined. There are those that truly hate it, but 8 times as many aren't annoyed by it. __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Faith Hill - Exclusive Performances, Videos & More http://faith.yahoo.com From michaelj@vcn.com Fri Oct 11 06:38:02 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 11 Oct 2002 13:38:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 82599 invoked from network); 11 Oct 2002 13:37:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Oct 2002 13:37:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m1-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.31) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Oct 2002 13:37:56 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m1-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Fri, 11 Oct 2002 07:37:55 -0600 Message-ID: <001401c2712b$647c5f00$0701010a@keva> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Greetings All Date: Fri, 11 Oct 2002 07:37:49 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-Mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Way to go Jim! Just wanted to say a couple of years ago, I had the opportunity to hear KWAL as I was passing through Northern Idaho. I was extremely impressed with the processing and separation. That stations sounds AWESOME in stereo!! VERY nice job! MJR n WYO ----- Original Message ----- From: Jim Shelden To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, October 10, 2002 1:07 PM Subject: {AMSF} Greetings All I have been in the background, lurking on this list for some time now, and wanted to say 'hi', and ask for some help. I'm looking for Am stereo exciters and mod monitors that might be purchased from some of those who have turned them off. Let me give you a little background... I consult for several stations in E. Wa and N. Idaho. About three years ago I put in a new BE Am1A at KWAL-620 and since it came with cquam installed, I talked the owner into rebuilding the whole audio chain to stereo. The station is about half live, and half sat. c/w, but it sounds great, and we really have gotten lots of positive response to the am stereo. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From mychucky@funport.net Fri Oct 11 06:44:21 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: mychucky@funport.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 11 Oct 2002 13:44:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 85416 invoked from network); 11 Oct 2002 13:44:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Oct 2002 13:44:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.funport.com) (216.199.19.6) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Oct 2002 13:44:20 -0000 Received: from FatMusic2000 ([]) by mail.funport.com (Merak 5.1.3) with SMTP id JFB36580 for ; Fri, 11 Oct 2002 09:40:17 -0400 Message-ID: <008801c2712c$48071a80$1400a8c0@FatMusic2000> To: Subject: Fw: Date: Fri, 11 Oct 2002 09:44:11 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=85836819 X-Yahoo-Profile: mychucky1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Heres my informative response. ----- Original Message ----- From: Bartell Karen-r7aalh To: 'mychucky@funport.net' Sent: Friday, October 11, 2002 9:39 AM Subject: FW: Dear Chuck, Your email is being forwarded. Thanks again for your interest, Karen -----Original Message----- From: mychucky@funport.net [mailto:mychucky@funport.net] Sent: Friday, October 11, 2002 8:30 AM To: Karen Bartell Subject: Dear Karen, I did not even get a cut and paste replay to my email of two weeks ago on this subject...........What you have not said is exactly how much it will cost a manufacturer to include AM Stereo/C-Quam version in the Symphony chipset. Please responde with a per chip price WITH and WITHOUT the option on a per unit/radio price. Regards Chuck Simpson www.stereoam.com It sure is a cut and paste reply - I got one as well! -----Original Message----- From: Bartell Karen-r7aalh [mailto:karen.bartell@motorola.com] Sent: Saturday, 5 October 2002 2:53 AM To: Trim, Matthew L Subject: FW: Symphony Card Radio Chipset - Including C-QUAM AM Stereo? Hi Matthew, Because the Motorola Symphony Digital Radio chip set is software based, we are able to add features (like C-QUAM AM stereo) to the radio. The software for AM stereo is written (it was a labor of love for one of our software engineers). The decision to include it in the radio is up to the radio manufacturer. We have done our part by making the cost to upgrade a radio to AM stereo the cheapest it can be, just add some electrons. Thanks for your interest, Karen -----Original Message----- From: Kevin T. [mailto:kevtronics@yahoo.com] Sent: Friday, 11 October 2002 2:19 PM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Fwd: RE: Symphony DSP radio - AM Stereo Here is the response I received from Motorola, with my message to them attached below. Karen's reply seems a little too consistent amongst the other ones that have been shared here. Perhaps Motorola has been getting enough inquiries about the Symphony DSP chipset's support for C-Quam AM Stereo that they've come up with this "cut & paste" text to reply with? > From: Bartell Karen-r7aalh > To: "'Kevin T.'" > CC: Tremmel Steve-rtca30 , > Hansen John-ra6595 > Subject: RE: Symphony DSP radio - AM Stereo > Date: Thu, 10 Oct 2002 10:25:18 -0700 > > Hi Kevin, > > Many thanks for your in-depth recomendations and suggestions. > > Because the Motorola Symphony Digital Radio chip set is software based, > we are able to add features (like C-QUAM AM stereo) to the radio. The > software for AM stereo is written (it was a labor of love for one of our > software engineers). The decision to include it in the radio is up to the > radio manufacturer. We have done our part by making the cost to upgrade a > radio to AM stereo the cheapest it can be, just add some electrons. > > Thanks again for your interest, > Karen > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From philipr@irac.pe.ca Fri Oct 11 07:17:07 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 11 Oct 2002 14:17:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 88013 invoked from network); 11 Oct 2002 14:17:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Oct 2002 14:17:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.70) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Oct 2002 14:17:05 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.253] by n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Oct 2002 14:17:05 -0000 Date: Fri, 11 Oct 2002 14:17:04 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: cut and paste Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 140 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking I received the same old cut and paste response. I wasn't surprised. I just hope all our interest fuels some interest at Motorola. Phil From amfmdx@fastq.com Fri Oct 11 08:02:57 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 11 Oct 2002 15:02:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 17558 invoked from network); 11 Oct 2002 15:02:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Oct 2002 15:02:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Oct 2002 15:02:55 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt (d2-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.34]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id g9BF2sq82876; Fri, 11 Oct 2002 08:02:54 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <019101c27137$388b7a00$21f9bed8@kredding430cdt> To: Cc: "Johnny Electron" References: <20021011131202.70686.qmail@web14203.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} AMS discussion on Radio-Tech list Date: Fri, 11 Oct 2002 08:02:28 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > There's a very interesting topic on the Radio-Tech list about "Why AM Stereo > Failed", and more positive support for AMS than what I had imagined. There are > those that truly hate it, but 8 times as many aren't annoyed by it. I told you this was the case John. MOST engineers who aren't so lazy its pathetic love it because they want to be proud of their work and want to produce the best signal possible. You will find the guys who hate AM stereo are lazy as they come. The engineers don't hate AM stereo. Its the owners who are greedy and don't want to put out the best signal. They believe that they make more money by not putting out the best signal they can. Kevin From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Fri Oct 11 08:05:41 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 11 Oct 2002 15:05:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 63732 invoked from network); 11 Oct 2002 15:05:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Oct 2002 15:05:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14202.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.144) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Oct 2002 15:05:41 -0000 Message-ID: <20021011150539.68350.qmail@web14202.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.45.202.244] by web14202.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 11 Oct 2002 08:05:39 PDT Date: Fri, 11 Oct 2002 08:05:39 -0700 (PDT) Subject: We have engineering friends out there! To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: John Pavlica X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio John, I run AM Stereo on three out of the four AM station that I maintain for precisely the reasons you mention below (on Radio-Tech list). The fourth station is just too cheap to buy the exciter (and still has a mono air chain...). Bill Bowin Columbus, OH __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Faith Hill - Exclusive Performances, Videos & More http://faith.yahoo.com From mychucky@funport.net Fri Oct 11 10:09:37 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: mychucky@funport.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 11 Oct 2002 17:09:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 48109 invoked from network); 11 Oct 2002 17:09:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Oct 2002 17:09:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.funport.com) (216.199.19.6) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Oct 2002 17:09:36 -0000 Received: from FatMusic2000 ([]) by mail.funport.com (Merak 5.1.3) with SMTP id JFB36580 for ; Fri, 11 Oct 2002 13:05:34 -0400 Message-ID: <000d01c27148$f288a2a0$2a8e1f40@FatMusic2000> To: Subject: Fw: Date: Fri, 11 Oct 2002 13:09:22 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-Mimeole: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=85836819 X-Yahoo-Profile: mychucky1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Ok guys here is a response that I just received that clears it up a little more. We are being sent down the primrose path by the very Japanese that we spend massive amounts of money with. We have known for a long time that Aiwa of America and Sony of America are only empty shells that sell us only what they are told to sell us by there/our Japanese MASTERS. So once again we are told who is really in charge.................and it ain't us or rather the U.S. Have fun with this one Regards Chuck www.stereoam.com ----- Original Message ----- From: Bartell Karen-r7aalh To: 'mychucky@funport.net' Sent: Friday, October 11, 2002 10:04 AM Subject: RE: Hi again Chuck, Following is the information I received to pass on: First, we do not have the software done for C-QUAM. We have the algorithms, but have not yet coded. We have not had any requests from our key customers, including Japan, which is normally where the highest requirements come from. When, and, if, we code, it will be trivial for a manufacturer to include AM stereo. Thanks again for your interest. Best regards, Karen -----Original Message----- From: mychucky@funport.net [mailto:mychucky@funport.net] Sent: Friday, October 11, 2002 8:30 AM To: Karen Bartell Subject: Dear Karen, I did not even get a cut and paste replay to my email of two weeks ago on this subject...........What you have not said is exactly how much it will cost a manufacturer to include AM Stereo/C-Quam version in the Symphony chipset. Please responde with a per chip price WITH and WITHOUT the option on a per unit/radio price. Regards Chuck Simpson www.stereoam.com It sure is a cut and paste reply - I got one as well! -----Original Message----- From: Bartell Karen-r7aalh [mailto:karen.bartell@motorola.com] Sent: Saturday, 5 October 2002 2:53 AM To: Trim, Matthew L Subject: FW: Symphony Card Radio Chipset - Including C-QUAM AM Stereo? Hi Matthew, Because the Motorola Symphony Digital Radio chip set is software based, we are able to add features (like C-QUAM AM stereo) to the radio. The software for AM stereo is written (it was a labor of love for one of our software engineers). The decision to include it in the radio is up to the radio manufacturer. We have done our part by making the cost to upgrade a radio to AM stereo the cheapest it can be, just add some electrons. Thanks for your interest, Karen -----Original Message----- From: Kevin T. [mailto:kevtronics@yahoo.com] Sent: Friday, 11 October 2002 2:19 PM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Fwd: RE: Symphony DSP radio - AM Stereo Here is the response I received from Motorola, with my message to them attached below. Karen's reply seems a little too consistent amongst the other ones that have been shared here. Perhaps Motorola has been getting enough inquiries about the Symphony DSP chipset's support for C-Quam AM Stereo that they've come up with this "cut & paste" text to reply with? > From: Bartell Karen-r7aalh > To: "'Kevin T.'" > CC: Tremmel Steve-rtca30 , > Hansen John-ra6595 > Subject: RE: Symphony DSP radio - AM Stereo > Date: Thu, 10 Oct 2002 10:25:18 -0700 > > Hi Kevin, > > Many thanks for your in-depth recomendations and suggestions. > > Because the Motorola Symphony Digital Radio chip set is software based, > we are able to add features (like C-QUAM AM stereo) to the radio. The > software for AM stereo is written (it was a labor of love for one of our > software engineers). The decision to include it in the radio is up to the > radio manufacturer. We have done our part by making the cost to upgrade a > radio to AM stereo the cheapest it can be, just add some electrons. > > Thanks again for your interest, > Karen > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Fri Oct 11 10:29:58 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 11 Oct 2002 17:29:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 67421 invoked from network); 11 Oct 2002 17:29:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Oct 2002 17:29:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14201.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.143) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Oct 2002 17:29:57 -0000 Message-ID: <20021011172957.65011.qmail@web14201.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.45.202.244] by web14201.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 11 Oct 2002 10:29:57 PDT Date: Fri, 11 Oct 2002 10:29:57 -0700 (PDT) Subject: FCC spectrum To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: John Pavlica X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio Here's some text from the FCC, whaddaythink? "IBOC is spectrum efficient. It allows digital operations for all existing broadcasters with no new spectrum allocation requirements. The FCC noted that although it is no longer considering the proposed approach of requiring new spectrum in TV Channel 6, it is not today categorically foreclosing new spectrum options. In the event that new spectrum is identified for broadcast use, further consideration of both IBOC and non-IBOC out-of-band digital audio broadcasting approaches may be warranted." __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Faith Hill - Exclusive Performances, Videos & More http://faith.yahoo.com From amfmdx@fastq.com Fri Oct 11 11:08:04 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 11 Oct 2002 18:08:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 57451 invoked from network); 11 Oct 2002 18:08:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Oct 2002 18:08:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Oct 2002 18:08:03 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt (d88-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.120]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id g9BI82q89588 for ; Fri, 11 Oct 2002 11:08:02 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <01c801c27151$12ba8ae0$21f9bed8@kredding430cdt> To: References: <20021011172957.65011.qmail@web14201.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} FCC spectrum Date: Fri, 11 Oct 2002 11:07:32 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > it is not today categorically foreclosing new > spectrum options. In the event that new spectrum is identified for broadcast > use, further consideration of both IBOC and non-IBOC out-of-band digital audio > broadcasting approaches may be warranted." What they are saying is this.... The people might not buy this because we got a lot of pissed off comments in the proceedings from the public. If it doesn't work because people think it sucks, we can move it to the Eureka band. Kevin From n0uiheric@aol.com Fri Oct 11 13:27:48 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 11 Oct 2002 20:27:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 89868 invoked from network); 11 Oct 2002 20:27:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Oct 2002 20:27:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r07.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.103) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Oct 2002 20:27:46 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-r07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.37.2ecef272 (25914) for ; Fri, 11 Oct 2002 16:27:45 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <37.2ecef272.2ad88e40@aol.com> Date: Fri, 11 Oct 2002 16:27:44 EDT Subject: Re: {AMSF} FCC Approves IBOC; Powell Calls Order 'Historic' (fwd) To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih IBOC has also been proven to reduce the range of FM stations; locally, we could lose all but two non-commercial FM stations and as many as five commercial stations. Nearly all AM stations in St. Louis would be eliminated except for KMOX 1120. What the FCC has done is suicide. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Fri Oct 11 13:28:02 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 11 Oct 2002 20:28:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 81330 invoked from network); 11 Oct 2002 20:28:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Oct 2002 20:28:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r08.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.104) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Oct 2002 20:28:02 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-r08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.4c.132dd165 (25914) for ; Fri, 11 Oct 2002 16:27:46 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <4c.132dd165.2ad88e41@aol.com> Date: Fri, 11 Oct 2002 16:27:45 EDT Subject: Re: {AMSF} Oh, its just a radio To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih I would recommend buying the MFJ-306 shortwave converter for the automobile; it converts the 800-1200 kHz portion of the AM band to pick up shortwave broadcasts in the 19 (15 MHz), 25 (11 MHz), 31 (9 MHz) and 49 (6 MHz) international shortwave broadcast bands. It works with digital radios, too. It is available in the MFJ Enterprises hardcopy catalogue and online through Amateur Electronic Supply. It's easy to install for you techies! BTW, the address to request an MFJ hardcopy catalogue is: MFJ Enterprises 300 Industrial Park Road Starkville, MS 39759 U.S.A. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Oct 11 17:27:23 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 12 Oct 2002 00:27:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 91230 invoked from network); 12 Oct 2002 00:27:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Oct 2002 00:27:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Oct 2002 00:27:20 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-89-219.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.219]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g9C0MEbf024430 for ; Fri, 11 Oct 2002 19:22:16 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <001501c27186$7c82d2e0$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: <142.233e48.2ad7980a@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Greetings All Date: Fri, 11 Oct 2002 19:29:51 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Bob- Have you talked with Kevin Kidd? He's got some stations in TN that have some AMS exciters gathering dust and is on the RT forum. Scott Todd ----- Original Message ----- From: To: > I'm still looking for a set up myself for WRCS-AM 970 out this way > From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Oct 11 17:40:11 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 12 Oct 2002 00:40:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 12975 invoked from network); 12 Oct 2002 00:40:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Oct 2002 00:40:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Oct 2002 00:40:11 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-89-219.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.219]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g9C0Z6bf027203 for ; Fri, 11 Oct 2002 19:35:07 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <003201c27188$48627c20$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: <20021011041909.14878.qmail@web12805.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fwd: RE: Symphony DSP radio - AM Stereo Date: Fri, 11 Oct 2002 19:36:17 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Exact same one I got. Your best bet was to email the other guy that Jeff posted. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kevin T." > Karen's reply seems a little too consistent amongst the other ones that > have been shared here. From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Oct 11 17:42:33 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 12 Oct 2002 00:42:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 88565 invoked from network); 12 Oct 2002 00:42:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Oct 2002 00:42:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Oct 2002 00:42:32 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-89-219.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.219]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g9C0bRbf027696 for ; Fri, 11 Oct 2002 19:37:29 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <004701c27188$9cd9b700$d3a9fea9@me> To: Subject: Fw: [CRTech] iBiquity Date: Fri, 11 Oct 2002 19:45:05 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude We've got some kindred spirits out there. ST > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "ACN" > To: "CRTech" > Sent: Thursday, October 10, 2002 5:41 PM > Subject: Re: [CRTech] iBiquity > > > > I agree with you Scott. We must be prepared to demand that Congress not > > allow interference to our analog signals by any station that does try > adding > > IBOC. I guess the FCC is going to allow them to ruin their analog signal > > if they wish, but they do not have the right to cause loss of the ability > of > > our listeners to continue to receive our analog signals. > > > > Tom > > > > ACN Radio Network > > > > acn@acn-network.com > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Scott Todd" > > To: "CRTech" ; "Tim Pauly" > > Sent: Thursday, October 10, 2002 3:36 PM > > Subject: Re: [CRTech] iBiquity > > > > > > > Argh! I kind of figured they'd do it, but that doesn't mean it'll take > > off, > > > and I hope it doesn't. Digital belongs on its own band, though I'd got > > > email pals in Canada who tell me that Eureka 147 receivers aren't > exactly > > > flying out the door. I think folks are going to complain about the > extra > > > interference to the point it will be given up. > > > > > > Scott Todd > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Tim Pauly" > > > > > > > Did anyone else see that the FCC approved the iBiquity digital format > > > > today? > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > For CRTech resources visit http://CRTech.org/ > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: crtech-unsubscribe@crtech.org > > > List problems? E-mail: TechStaff@CRTech.org > > > > > > > > > --- > > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. > > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). > > Version: 6.0.394 / Virus Database: 224 - Release Date: 10/03/2002 > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > For CRTech resources visit http://CRTech.org/ > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: crtech-unsubscribe@crtech.org > > List problems? E-mail: TechStaff@CRTech.org > > > > > > From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Oct 11 17:47:43 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 12 Oct 2002 00:47:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 71939 invoked from network); 12 Oct 2002 00:47:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Oct 2002 00:47:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Oct 2002 00:47:43 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-89-219.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.219]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g9C0gbbf028717 for ; Fri, 11 Oct 2002 19:42:38 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <005301c27189$557e6440$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: <008801c2712c$48071a80$1400a8c0@FatMusic2000> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fw: Date: Fri, 11 Oct 2002 19:50:14 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Dude, hats off to you for knowing the right questions to ask. Did you tell her that you import radios? Scott Todd ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Friday, October 11, 2002 8:44 AM Subject: {AMSF} Fw: > Heres my informative response. > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Bartell Karen-r7aalh > To: 'mychucky@funport.net' > Sent: Friday, October 11, 2002 9:39 AM > Subject: FW: > > > Dear Chuck, > > Your email is being forwarded. > > Thanks again for your interest, > Karen > > -----Original Message----- > From: mychucky@funport.net [mailto:mychucky@funport.net] > Sent: Friday, October 11, 2002 8:30 AM > To: Karen Bartell > Subject: > > > Dear Karen, > > I did not even get a cut and paste replay to my email of two weeks ago on this subject...........What you have not said is exactly how much it will cost a manufacturer to include AM Stereo/C-Quam version in the Symphony chipset. Please responde with a per chip price WITH and WITHOUT the option on a per unit/radio price. > > > Regards > Chuck Simpson > www.stereoam.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > It sure is a cut and paste reply - I got one as well! > > -----Original Message----- > From: Bartell Karen-r7aalh [mailto:karen.bartell@motorola.com] > Sent: Saturday, 5 October 2002 2:53 AM > To: Trim, Matthew L > Subject: FW: Symphony Card Radio Chipset - Including C-QUAM AM Stereo? > > > Hi Matthew, > > Because the Motorola Symphony Digital Radio chip set is software based, we > are able to add features (like C-QUAM AM stereo) to the radio. The software > for AM stereo is written (it was a labor of love for one of our software > engineers). The decision to include it in the radio is up to the radio > manufacturer. We have done our part by making the cost to upgrade a radio to > AM stereo the cheapest it can be, just add some electrons. > > Thanks for your interest, > Karen > > -----Original Message----- > From: Kevin T. [mailto:kevtronics@yahoo.com] > Sent: Friday, 11 October 2002 2:19 PM > To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com > Subject: {AMSF} Fwd: RE: Symphony DSP radio - AM Stereo > > > Here is the response I received from Motorola, with my message to them > attached below. > > Karen's reply seems a little too consistent amongst the other ones that > have been shared here. Perhaps Motorola has been getting enough inquiries > about the Symphony DSP chipset's support for C-Quam AM Stereo that they've > come up with this "cut & paste" text to reply with? > > > > From: Bartell Karen-r7aalh > > To: "'Kevin T.'" > > CC: Tremmel Steve-rtca30 , > > Hansen John-ra6595 > > Subject: RE: Symphony DSP radio - AM Stereo > > Date: Thu, 10 Oct 2002 10:25:18 -0700 > > > > Hi Kevin, > > > > Many thanks for your in-depth recomendations and suggestions. > > > > Because the Motorola Symphony Digital Radio chip set is software based, > > we are able to add features (like C-QUAM AM stereo) to the radio. The > > software for AM stereo is written (it was a labor of love for one of our > > software engineers). The decision to include it in the radio is up to the > > radio manufacturer. We have done our part by making the cost to upgrade a > > radio to AM stereo the cheapest it can be, just add some electrons. > > > > Thanks again for your interest, > > Karen > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Oct 11 17:55:09 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 12 Oct 2002 00:55:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 40263 invoked from network); 12 Oct 2002 00:55:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Oct 2002 00:55:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Oct 2002 00:55:08 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-89-219.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.219]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g9C0o3bf000252 for ; Fri, 11 Oct 2002 19:50:04 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <007c01c2718a$5ef78320$d3a9fea9@me> To: Subject: Fw: [CRTech] iBiquity Date: Fri, 11 Oct 2002 19:51:13 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude More evidence of the lack of interest in HD radio- ST > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "WDBARadio@wdba.com" > To: "CRTech" > Sent: Friday, October 11, 2002 7:52 AM > Subject: Re: [CRTech] iBiquity > > > > > >Did anyone else see that the FCC approved the iBiquity digital format > > > >today? > > > > High-powered FM in Pennsylvania. Broadcasts to many of the reindeer in > the > > National Forest (who don't need the Gospel and whose antennae are NOT > > digitally-tuned.) Ask me again in about 5 years if it's still an issue. > > Anybody remember Radio Shacks highly-touted "digital cassettes"? (Oooo.. > > that was LOW of me!) > > > > Jerry Meloon, WDBA > > > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > For CRTech resources visit http://CRTech.org/ > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: crtech-unsubscribe@crtech.org > > List problems? E-mail: TechStaff@CRTech.org > > > > > > From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Oct 11 17:55:11 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 12 Oct 2002 00:55:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 83481 invoked from network); 12 Oct 2002 00:55:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Oct 2002 00:55:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Oct 2002 00:55:11 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-89-219.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.219]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g9C0o3bh000252 for ; Fri, 11 Oct 2002 19:50:07 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <007d01c2718a$60b38b00$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: <0.1600035844.694626511-1463792382-1034317402@topica.com> <3DA68C9F.FC316901@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: [ ABDX ] IBOC is now reality Date: Fri, 11 Oct 2002 19:57:40 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude I haven't- YET, but that's a bonza idea, as they say down under. Will definitely carve out a few minutes to do it in the near future. Scott Todd ----- Original Message ----- From: "Neal Newman" > I just wonder this.. > Am I the Only One that Wrote Powell after this Decision. and asked him How > much of his retirement is being financed by Lucent? and how much money they > actually paid > him to pass HD Radio(IBOC). I may Not have My FCC license long after > writing him.. But you sure can say I got Balls to ask Him... > I wonder how many Others have thought this and Not written to ask? From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Oct 11 17:58:47 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 12 Oct 2002 00:58:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 44356 invoked from network); 12 Oct 2002 00:58:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Oct 2002 00:58:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Oct 2002 00:58:47 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-89-219.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.219]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g9C0rgbf001024 for ; Fri, 11 Oct 2002 19:53:43 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <008701c2718a$e18dfe40$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: <20021011150539.68350.qmail@web14202.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} We have engineering friends out there! Date: Fri, 11 Oct 2002 20:01:19 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude I hope you've invited him to join us. BTW, I haven't heard any directive from Salem HQ about adding HD to our signals. I'd probably cart it all off to the other site and just leave it in the boxes if they did. I sure didn't include it when asked about items which could be put under capital projects. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Pavlica" > I run AM Stereo on three out of the four AM station that I maintain > > Bill Bowin > Columbus, OH From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Oct 11 18:01:18 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 12 Oct 2002 01:01:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 12156 invoked from network); 12 Oct 2002 01:01:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Oct 2002 01:01:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Oct 2002 01:01:18 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-89-219.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.219]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g9C0uDbf001487 for ; Fri, 11 Oct 2002 19:56:14 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <008d01c2718b$3b9e0600$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: <000d01c27148$f288a2a0$2a8e1f40@FatMusic2000> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fw: Date: Fri, 11 Oct 2002 20:03:50 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Marv (Southcott)- I'm not trying to force your hand, but any chance you could request some AMS chipsets so Motorola would be sure to include it? Scott Todd ----- Original Message ----- From: > Ok guys here is a response that I just received that clears it up a little more. We are being sent down the primrose path by the very Japanese that we spend massive amounts of money with. We have known for a long time that Aiwa of America and Sony of America are only empty shells that sell us only what they are told to sell us by there/our Japanese MASTERS. > So once again we are told who is really in charge.................and it ain't us or rather the U.S. From dav259@csiro.au Fri Oct 11 18:27:21 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 12 Oct 2002 01:27:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 998 invoked from network); 12 Oct 2002 01:27:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Oct 2002 01:27:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Oct 2002 01:27:19 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9C1RGc04951 for ; Sat, 12 Oct 2002 11:27:17 +1000 (EST) Date: Sat, 12 Oct 2002 11:27:16 +1000 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: amstereoforum Subject: "New!" Symphony system radios Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public I can see it now. In 13 months time - in Tandy / Retrovision / Dick Smith's / The Good Guys / Megamart / K-Mart / Target brochures. "NEW!!" ** DIGITAL RADIO ** AM Stereo / FM Stereo True Hi Fidelity At no extra cost! ** all you've ever wanted in a radio ** It doesn't matter what the advertising gurus may say - this could be the biggest thing since Ben Hur. It doesn't matter that Symphony may only be a bit of bright red lipstick on the sturdy old analog cow. This is how advertising works. If it sounds as good - or even hopefully better - than current C-Quam we gotta do whatever we can to see AMS Symphony is successfully launched. THIS IS OUR MISSION!! Ian From dav259@csiro.au Fri Oct 11 18:46:17 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_0); 12 Oct 2002 01:46:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 970 invoked from network); 12 Oct 2002 01:46:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Oct 2002 01:46:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Oct 2002 01:46:15 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9C1kDc05913 for ; Sat, 12 Oct 2002 11:46:14 +1000 (EST) Date: Sat, 12 Oct 2002 11:46:13 +1000 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: amstereoforum Subject: OT - world's most liveable city Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public It's true! Melbourne and Vancouver are the world's most liveable cities. http://asia.cnn.com/2002/WORLD/europe/10/04/world.cities/ We only "lost" winning outright - due to our weather. We do sometimes get the four seasons in one day. If only they'd included radio in their criteria. We would have won hands down! We have the best radio in the world. And we also have a pretty fair bonus. PROGRAMMING! It's pretty much live and local ... and ... AMS! Ian Marvellous Melbourne From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Fri Oct 11 22:01:52 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 12 Oct 2002 05:01:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 74056 invoked from network); 12 Oct 2002 05:01:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Oct 2002 05:01:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web40803.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.78.180) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Oct 2002 05:01:50 -0000 Message-ID: <20021012050150.77064.qmail@web40803.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.36.131] by web40803.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 11 Oct 2002 22:01:50 PDT Date: Fri, 11 Oct 2002 22:01:50 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: {AMSF} OT - world's most liveable city To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio Congratulations! Does Vancouver have any A.M. Stereo stations left? Jay __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Faith Hill - Exclusive Performances, Videos & More http://faith.yahoo.com From amfmdx@fastq.com Fri Oct 11 23:37:04 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 12 Oct 2002 06:37:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 70209 invoked from network); 12 Oct 2002 06:37:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Oct 2002 06:37:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Oct 2002 06:37:03 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt ([209.63.214.238]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id g9C6b2q03781 for ; Fri, 11 Oct 2002 23:37:02 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <005601c271b9$be2cf120$eed63fd1@kredding430cdt> To: References: <37.2ecef272.2ad88e40@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} FCC Approves IBOC; Powell Calls Order 'Historic' (fwd) Date: Fri, 11 Oct 2002 23:36:47 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > What the FCC has done is suicide. I don't know if its suicide but I do know that this whole thing is stupid. Kevin From kfornal@loa.com Fri Oct 11 23:51:17 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kfornal@loa.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 12 Oct 2002 06:51:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 30213 invoked from network); 12 Oct 2002 06:51:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Oct 2002 06:51:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO lakemtao03.cox.net) (68.1.17.242) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Oct 2002 06:51:17 -0000 Received: from OMNIBOOK ([68.9.127.164]) by lakemtao03.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20021012065116.NTJA16428.lakemtao03.cox.net@OMNIBOOK> for ; Sat, 12 Oct 2002 02:51:16 -0400 To: Subject: WOR-HD Date: Sat, 12 Oct 2002 02:50:43 -0400 Message-ID: <002201c271bb$b26bfdc0$0401a8c0@OMNIBOOK> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2616 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Keith Fornal" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=110312140 X-Yahoo-Profile: theradboy Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit It has begun.. At 9:00AM, October 11, 2002, WOR-HD was born. http://wor710.com/Engineering/iboc/worhd.htm Keith Fornal Treasurer Dutch Island Lighthouse Society www.dutchislandlighthouse.org [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Oct 12 00:23:12 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 12 Oct 2002 07:23:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 97049 invoked from network); 12 Oct 2002 07:23:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Oct 2002 07:23:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.70) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Oct 2002 07:23:12 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.141] by n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 12 Oct 2002 07:23:12 -0000 Date: Sat, 12 Oct 2002 07:23:12 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: WOR-HD Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <002201c271bb$b26bfdc0$0401a8c0@OMNIBOOK> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2933 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.77.6 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > It has begun.. > At 9:00AM, October 11, 2002, WOR-HD was born. > http://wor710.com/Engineering/iboc/worhd.htm Yeah, and then at 6:15 PM on October 11, 2002, WOR-HD died for the night... LOL. After seeing this mentioned on the web, I tuned in 710 WOR this evening -- the absolute strongest AM signal at my location in New Jersey -- on my trusty Sony SRF-A100 in Wideband AM Stereo mode, and heard this: http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/wor.mp3 The audio response is noticeably narrowed -- a spectrum analysis reveals it drops off like a cliff at 6.2 kHz... but there are no digital subcarriers to be heard as background noise. Then, after a few minutes, I realized I was listening to WOR's signal AFTER SUNSET... so they are not ALLOWED to use the digital signal at night! A 50,000-watt clear channel Class A radio station that has been effectively reduced to a DAYTIMER... hahaha! Here is a spectrum analysis of 710 WOR's nighttime analog audio... you can see the 6.2 kHz response limit; note that the "spikes" at higher frequencies are various heterodynes caused by the 10 kHz carrier whistle and by recording the audio directly to my computer's sound card, and thus not part of WOR's signal: http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/wor-hd.gif Tommorow I'll try to catch WOR right at sunset time so we can all hear what happens at the instant they switch off the IBOC / HD Radio digital subcarriers and return to normal analog AM mono broadcasting. Although, it seems they are using a reduced analog audio bandwidth even at night -- perhaps iBiquity *requires* stations using IBOC to keep the same limited audio response full-time, so that the analog signal won't be so obviously superior to listeners. WOR's analog audio bandwidth of 6.2 kHz is actually a bit beyond the typical 5 kHz limit that is specified for IBOC stations, however I believe the limit can be adjusted based on the quality of the digital signal they want to deliver. That extra 1.2 kHz of analog audio bandwidth may mean that WOR is only broadcasting the digital signal in its base 20 kbps Mono form, rather than in the 36 kbps "Enhanced" Stereo form... which would make sense, since WOR is a 100% monaural station and it is very doubtful they would spend the money to upgrade it all to Stereo just for the IBOC digital broadcasts which NOBODY can hear anyway. Meanwhile, it will only make WOR's competition sound so much better in comparison -- this is 770 WABC, recieved on the same Sony SRF-A100 radio a year ago: http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/wabc.mp3 Not bad for a mono talk station, I think. Finally, the biggest joke in all of this is HD Radio's slogan: "HD Radio: Pure Digital. Clear Radio." I knew it... it's the same old trick that the digital cell phone companies are trying to pull. It's DIGITAL, so no matter how HORRIBLE it sounds and how POOR the reception is, it MUST be PERFECT! From dav259@csiro.au Sat Oct 12 03:02:36 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 12 Oct 2002 10:02:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 86613 invoked from network); 12 Oct 2002 10:02:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Oct 2002 10:02:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Oct 2002 10:02:35 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9CA2Yc00404 for ; Sat, 12 Oct 2002 20:02:34 +1000 (EST) Date: Sat, 12 Oct 2002 20:02:34 +1000 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Subject: Re: {AMSF} WOR-HD In-Reply-To: <002201c271bb$b26bfdc0$0401a8c0@OMNIBOOK> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public On Sat, 12 Oct 2002, Keith Fornal wrote: > It has begun.. > At 9:00AM, October 11, 2002, WOR-HD was born. > http://wor710.com/Engineering/iboc/worhd.htm Yo! I encourage everyone to do their pathetic little survey (advertising expo). My response to their question "Do you have any comments regarding WOR's digital radio operation?" The new Motorola Symphony system which is AM stereo complient will be the biggest thing to happen to AM radio! Day and night! IBOC is a dog. I reckon when Symphony receivers are released in 13 months time AM stations will be clamouring for a way out of the digital mess. You've got to admit the good thing about IBOC is that analog radio does get to survive! And listeners will be able to make a choice. Oooops - I think we've been down this road before. From bjackson@indyradio.com Sat Oct 12 06:40:09 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 12 Oct 2002 13:40:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 25033 invoked from network); 12 Oct 2002 13:40:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Oct 2002 13:40:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Oct 2002 13:40:09 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.158] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 12 Oct 2002 13:40:09 -0000 Date: Sat, 12 Oct 2002 13:40:08 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: WOR-HD Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <002201c271bb$b26bfdc0$0401a8c0@OMNIBOOK> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 720 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923" X-Originating-IP: 172.156.196.206 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 Anyone else send in a few comments? http://wor710.com/Engineering/iboc/hdform.htm My favorites include "I hear more high frequencies" and "I hear reduced interference!" Could anyone closer to NY post an audio clip of WOR during the day? Here in Indianapolis, WLW is too strong for me to get any good signal. -Brad Jackson -Susquehanna Indianapolis -WFMS/WGLD/WGRL --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Keith Fornal" wrote: > It has begun.. > At 9:00AM, October 11, 2002, WOR-HD was born. > http://wor710.com/Engineering/iboc/worhd.htm > > > > Keith Fornal > Treasurer > Dutch Island Lighthouse Society > www.dutchislandlighthouse.org > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From bjackson@indyradio.com Sat Oct 12 07:13:15 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 12 Oct 2002 14:13:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 41011 invoked from network); 12 Oct 2002 14:13:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Oct 2002 14:13:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Oct 2002 14:13:14 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.157] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 12 Oct 2002 14:13:14 -0000 Date: Sat, 12 Oct 2002 14:13:14 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [ ABDX ] IBOC is now reality Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3DA68C9F.FC316901@skyweb.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 4422 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923" X-Originating-IP: 172.148.79.183 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 I know that online petitions usually don't work...However I did sign this one: A petition has been established for the re-regulation of radio at petitiononline.com. You can access it with the link provided... http://www.petitiononline.com/rereg/petition.html Read, and if interested, sign. --- In amstereoforum@y..., Neal Newman wrote: > I just wonder this.. > Am I the Only One that Wrote Powell after this Decision. and asked him How > much of his retirement is being financed by Lucent? and how much money they > actually paid > him to pass HD Radio(IBOC). I may Not have My FCC license long after > writing him.. But you sure can say I got Balls to ask Him... > I wonder how many Others have thought this and Not written to ask? > > > kevin redding wrote: > > > Some AM music stations MAY wire up for stereo - and find the whole > > episode > > a disaster in a year or so - and may revert back to AM stereo when the > > Symphony receivers are released in just over 12 months. If only the > > Symphony system would include AMS as a basic feature ... > > Stolen shamelessly from another list. > > > > Looks like the intro of IBOC is going to handled the same way as AMS. I > > aint weeping yet! > > > > ________________________________________________ > > FCC Approves IBOC; Powell Calls Order 'Historic' > > > > The FCC has approved in-band, on-channel digital audio broadcasting > > as the technology U.S. stations will use to go digital. The > > decision clears the way for stations to use the system developed by > > Ibiquity Digital Corp. > > > > Although the commission said it is no longer considering using TV > > Channel 6 for digital radio use, it did not close the door on > > systems requiring new spectrum, should such new spectrum be > > identified. > > > > The Report and Order allows FMs to transmit both a digital and > > analog signal both day and night, and AMs during the day only. > > Stations that want to begin digital transmissions would need to > > file a request for Special Temporary Authorization with the FCC. > > > > FCC Chairman Michael Powell called the decision historic and said > > he is glad to see radio join other media in going digital. "I'm > > thrilled to see the radio wagon train get to the other side." > > > > Commissioners praised the Ibiquity Digital Corp. system for its > > spectral efficiency; both Commissioners Katheen Abernathy and > > Michael Copps said they can't wait to purchase IBOC receivers. > > (Those are slated to be introduced in January at the Consumer > > Electronics Show.) > > > > Ibiquity was pleased with the action. Vice President, Broadcast > > Engineering, Glynn Walden said, "IBOC is a concept rooted in the > > American concept of a free over-the-air broadcast system...a > > concept and a technology that allows each and every broadcaster to > > transition from an analog world to a digital future while re-using > > the existing infrastructure and allocated broadcast spectrum. IBOC > > is such a compelling concept that technology was developed. With > > this FCC decision, those benefits are now available for > > broadcasters to bring the benefits of HD digital radio to the U.S. > > public." > > > > The FCC Media Bureau staff feels they will learn a lot about IBOC > > technology when stations start to transmit a digital signal. If any > > interference occurs from a station that is transmitting both > > signals, especially interference to first adjacent channels, or to > > services broadcast on FM subcarriers, the commission hopes the > > parties would work it out. The agency would be ready to intervene > > in cases where stations are unable to come to an agreement about > > how to solve the interference, officials said. > > > > They said it was too soon to tell when the FCC would promulgate > > final IBOC rules, with licensing details. > > > > ####### > > > > ======================== > > American Broadcast DXers > > Greatest DX on earth! > > ======================== > > > > ==^================================================================ > > This email was sent to: groucho@s... > > > > EASY UNSUBSCRIBE click here: http://topica.com/u/?bUrKzU.bWeP3W > > Or send an email to: ABDX-unsubscribe@t... > > > > T O P I C A -- Register now to manage your mail! > > http://www.topica.com/partner/tag02/register > > ==^================================================================ From alinton@esatclear.ie Sat Oct 12 10:19:46 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: alinton@esatclear.ie X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 12 Oct 2002 17:19:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 17765 invoked from network); 12 Oct 2002 17:19:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Oct 2002 17:19:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO davros) (194.145.132.84) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Oct 2002 17:19:44 -0000 Received: from Spooler by davros (Mercury/32 v3.30) ID MO000027; 12 Oct 02 18:19:45 +0100 Received: from spooler by totalbroadcast.net (Mercury/32 v3.30); 12 Oct 02 18:19:30 +0100 Received: from fr1.esatclear.ie (192.168.0.1) by davros (Mercury/32 v3.30) with ESMTP ID MG000026; 12 Oct 02 18:19:27 +0100 X-MSReally-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Message-Id: <5.1.1.2.2.20021012181754.02e1f7b0@fr1> X-Sender: alinton@fr1 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1.1.3 (Beta) Date: Sat, 12 Oct 2002 18:19:26 +0100 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Metrosound A/B switch? In-Reply-To: References: <002201c271bb$b26bfdc0$0401a8c0@OMNIBOOK> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed From: Andy Linton X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10800314 X-Yahoo-Profile: alinton1_ie Hi, Can someone remind me please which position is Kahn and which is CQUAM on the Metrosound's A/B switch? Thanks And am I right in thinking that the audio output jack is not de-emphasized? I sounds much brighter than the fm output. rgds From ccuff@in4web.com Sat Oct 12 12:12:08 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 12 Oct 2002 19:12:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 16326 invoked from network); 12 Oct 2002 19:12:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Oct 2002 19:12:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Oct 2002 19:12:07 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.87]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Sat, 12 Oct 2002 15:09:13 -0400 Message-ID: <001301c27223$13b44bc0$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: <002201c271bb$b26bfdc0$0401a8c0@OMNIBOOK> <5.1.1.2.2.20021012181754.02e1f7b0@fr1> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Metrosound A/B switch? Date: Sat, 12 Oct 2002 15:10:48 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 Andy, when the switch is OUT, it is in Cquam mode (a). CC ----- Original Message ----- From: Andy Linton To: Sent: Saturday, October 12, 2002 1:19 PM Subject: {AMSF} Metrosound A/B switch? > Hi, > > Can someone remind me please which position is Kahn and which is CQUAM on > the Metrosound's A/B switch? > From alinton@esatclear.ie Sat Oct 12 13:11:52 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: alinton@esatclear.ie X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 12 Oct 2002 20:11:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 74527 invoked from network); 12 Oct 2002 20:11:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Oct 2002 20:11:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO davros) (194.145.132.84) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Oct 2002 20:11:51 -0000 Received: from Spooler by davros (Mercury/32 v3.30) ID MO000067; 12 Oct 02 21:11:51 +0100 Received: from spooler by totalbroadcast.net (Mercury/32 v3.30); 12 Oct 02 21:11:42 +0100 Received: from fr1.esatclear.ie (192.168.0.1) by davros (Mercury/32 v3.30) with ESMTP ID MG000066; 12 Oct 02 21:11:34 +0100 X-MSReally-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Message-Id: <5.1.1.2.2.20021012211117.02e9ae50@fr1> X-Sender: alinton@fr1 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1.1.3 (Beta) Date: Sat, 12 Oct 2002 21:11:33 +0100 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Metrosound A/B switch? In-Reply-To: <001301c27223$13b44bc0$0101a8c0@pavilion> References: <002201c271bb$b26bfdc0$0401a8c0@OMNIBOOK> <5.1.1.2.2.20021012181754.02e1f7b0@fr1> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed From: Andy Linton X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10800314 X-Yahoo-Profile: alinton1_ie At 15:10 12/10/2002 -0400, you wrote: >Andy, when the switch is OUT, it is in Cquam mode (a). >CC Thanks Chris! rgds ----------------------------------- Andy Linton alinton@esatclear.ie Waterford, Ireland From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Sat Oct 12 15:23:31 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 12 Oct 2002 22:23:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 43142 invoked from network); 12 Oct 2002 22:23:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Oct 2002 22:23:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14207.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.173.71) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Oct 2002 22:23:29 -0000 Message-ID: <20021012222329.79690.qmail@web14207.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.127.54.199] by web14207.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 12 Oct 2002 15:23:29 PDT Date: Sat, 12 Oct 2002 15:23:29 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Tune in to your local digital buzzsaw today To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: John Pavlica X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio I was going to tune-in WLW 700 Cincy and 950 WWJ Detroit to see if they have the HD/IBOC crap running, but then I remembered they aren't allowed to have it on after sunset. (but maybe the mono audio is crap that's cut-off at 5KHz all day long, not just at night). __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Faith Hill - Exclusive Performances, Videos & More http://faith.yahoo.com From stodd@sherbtel.net Sat Oct 12 17:59:42 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 13 Oct 2002 00:59:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 90499 invoked from network); 13 Oct 2002 00:59:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Oct 2002 00:59:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Oct 2002 00:59:41 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-89-254.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.254]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g9D0sYbf021259 for ; Sat, 12 Oct 2002 19:54:35 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <001301c27254$2dc1f360$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} WOR-HD Date: Sat, 12 Oct 2002 20:02:16 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Not yet it isn't. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ian Davidson" > The new Motorola Symphony system which is AM stereo complient will be the > biggest thing to happen to AM radio! Day and night! IBOC is a dog. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Oct 12 18:02:11 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 13 Oct 2002 01:02:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 38532 invoked from network); 13 Oct 2002 01:02:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Oct 2002 01:02:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.83) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Oct 2002 01:02:10 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.170] by n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Oct 2002 01:02:10 -0000 Date: Sun, 13 Oct 2002 01:02:07 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: 710 WOR is now 690-730 "WOR-HD" Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2633 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.69.32 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics As WOR puts a flamethrower signal in my direction here in central NJ, I had a good listen to their "HD" signal today. Regardless of how narrow-bandwidth your radio is, the "splatter" onto adjacent channels is horrible! Even on a regular AM radio, I tune in 690, 700, 720, or 730 kHz and all I hear is "HISSSSSSS". While the "HD" signal is active during the daytime, WOR does limit their analog audio to 5 kHz of response, and since the digital subcarriers are sucking up part of their modulation, it also sounds noticeably QUIETER than the other 50,000-watt NYC stations, such as nearby 660 WFAN and 770 WABC. When received on a Sony SRF-A100 in Wide Bandwidth mode, you can truly see the digital subcarriers of WOR's signal extending up to 15 kHz in the audio graph: http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/wor-hd.gif Most of it is phase-modulated, so in Mono mode you don't hear the digital noise that much, but in "forced" AM Stereo mode -- whether it be C-Quam or Kahn mode -- you can clearly hear a large amount of background hiss and static as well as an annoying "motorboating" noise. It basically sounds like an ordinary AM signal being interfered by a computer or other RF-noisy device -- but no matter how strong the signal is, the noise never goes away... until sunset, when they switch it off! I managed to catch WOR's "HD" switch-off at 6:15 PM (current NYC sunset time) today, as recieved on the Sony in wide bandwidth Stereo mode: http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/wor-hd.mp3 The interesting thing is that when they switch back to analog, the audio response is increased from 5 kHz to just over 6 kHz, which only sounds a little bit better. Perhaps they don't want to make the change too jarring, as it would be if they stepped up to the full 10 kHz analog bandwidth they were transmitting before they started using IBOC/"HD". For any of you who can hear WOR's signal via skywave DX before they switch off the "HD" at 6:15 PM, or just after local NYC sunrise in the morning when they switch it on, I would be interested in reception reports and/or recordings of how this is affecting reception of the 690-730 kHz range. I suppose a worse-case scenario is a time when both 700 WLW and 710 WOR are putting out "HD" signals simultaneously -- they would pretty much wipe each other out with the "HISSSSS"! p.s. This afternoon, 710 WOR was broadcasting a sports event that was also being aired on local WCTC 1450 AM STEREO. I do have a recording of me flipping back and forth between these two stations on the Sony, which I will also upload soon for all to hear and compare! From stodd@sherbtel.net Sat Oct 12 18:41:41 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 13 Oct 2002 01:41:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 31521 invoked from network); 13 Oct 2002 01:41:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Oct 2002 01:41:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Oct 2002 01:41:40 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-89-254.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.254]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g9D1aXbf027530 for ; Sat, 12 Oct 2002 20:36:34 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <005d01c2725a$0b4b42e0$d3a9fea9@me> To: Subject: my comments to WOR Date: Sat, 12 Oct 2002 20:44:15 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Didn't hear it directly, but heard an mp3 on the web. If this is the future of radio, it looks bleak indeed. To get rid of all that hiss, you'd have to narrow a radio's IF to the point of sounding muffled. Time to admit the failure of HD and wait for the Omega Reception Technologies and Motorola Symphony chips to take care of the problem on the receiver end. ST [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Oct 12 19:09:32 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 13 Oct 2002 02:09:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 38845 invoked from network); 13 Oct 2002 02:09:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Oct 2002 02:09:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web12807.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.174.42) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Oct 2002 02:09:30 -0000 Message-ID: <20021013020925.21092.qmail@web12807.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [216.192.69.32] by web12807.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 12 Oct 2002 19:09:25 PDT Date: Sat, 12 Oct 2002 19:09:25 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Reply from WOR To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "Kevin T." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics I wrote in a rather harsh comment to the form on WOR's web site, and I was surprised to quickly get the following reply back from them: --- Tom Ray wrote: > From: "Tom Ray" > To: > Subject: Digital > Date: Sat, 12 Oct 2002 21:30:13 -0400 > > You really should give it a chance. While I was a big fan of AM stereo, > it was still plagued by the normal problems of AM reception. IBOC isn't. > > And you must be listening on a wideband radio....which is quite the > rarity. I have a "wideband" AM stereo radio in the car (stock Ford AM > stereo radio), and can't tell the difference between the 5kHz audio now > being transmitted and the 9.5kHz audio we were transmitting. And can't > hear the digital carriers. And no, I'm not deaf. You'd be surprised > what I can hear that others can't. > > Unfortunately, the public is starting to purchase XM and Sirius satellite > radios. Unless AM and FM stations have some way to compete with the > digital audio on these services, we don't stand a chance. > > I do agree that the AM and FM bands were not meant to carry this digital > signal. The TV bands were not meant to carry HDTV, either, but they are. > Another unfortunate fact of life is that the general public won't go out > and buy an expensive radio (like they're not buying HDTV's) if we move to > another band. Witness what has happened in Canada, who decided to go > with Eureka 147 in L band. They're starting to shut them off......radios > aren't selling. Another problem is that the FCC screwed up big time in > the 1960's with the AM band. If they didn't add a boatload of 1KW > peashooter stations that contribute greatly to interference, we wouldn't > have the 10kHz rolloff we are forced to have and could actually transmit > a reasonable signal. > > Thomas R. Ray, III, CSRE > Corporate Director of Engineering > Buckley Broadcasting/WOR Radio > New York > 212-642-4462 fax: 212-921-4751 __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Faith Hill - Exclusive Performances, Videos & More http://faith.yahoo.com From spfleck@citlink.net Sun Oct 13 07:27:02 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: spfleck@citlink.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 13 Oct 2002 14:27:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 92279 invoked from network); 13 Oct 2002 14:27:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Oct 2002 14:27:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO relay02.roc.frontiernet.net) (66.133.131.35) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Oct 2002 14:27:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 13519 invoked from network); 13 Oct 2002 14:27:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO Steve) ([170.215.243.232]) (envelope-sender ) by relay02.roc.frontiernet.net (qmail-ldap-1.03) with SMTP for ; 13 Oct 2002 14:27:00 -0000 Message-ID: <013f01c272c4$97b87580$01c8a8c0@N2UBP> To: References: <1034500275.416.5039.m12@yahoogroups.com> Subject: WOR comments Date: Sun, 13 Oct 2002 10:26:59 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Steve Fleckenstein" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=2988995 X-Yahoo-Profile: n2ubp Another unfortunate fact of life is that the general public won't go out > and buy an expensive radio (like they're not buying HDTV's).................. Why would anyone in the NYC metro area purchase HDTV if.... Most of the HDTV xmitter gear was blown away on 9-11 And at least 70 percent of the public is tethered to CATV or a dish that doesn't directly support HDTV. And even if HDTV xmitters weren't blown away on 9-11 the signal cannot cover out to the pre 9-11 B contour without strategic placement of non exsistant translators. This is not based on personl knowledge but based on conversations with people in the business and data mining.. It could be total fecal matter. Maybe folks would buy a more expensive radio if the programming was worth listening to ? Steve From alinton@esatclear.ie Sun Oct 13 10:37:53 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: alinton@esatclear.ie X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 13 Oct 2002 17:37:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 32673 invoked from network); 13 Oct 2002 17:37:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Oct 2002 17:37:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO davros) (194.145.133.26) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Oct 2002 17:37:51 -0000 Received: from Spooler by davros (Mercury/32 v3.30) ID MO000034; 13 Oct 02 18:37:51 +0100 Received: from spooler by totalbroadcast.net (Mercury/32 v3.30); 13 Oct 02 18:37:47 +0100 Received: from fr1.esatclear.ie (192.168.0.1) by davros (Mercury/32 v3.30) with ESMTP ID MG000033; 13 Oct 02 18:37:37 +0100 X-MSReally-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Message-Id: <5.1.1.2.2.20021013183635.028c36e0@fr1> X-Sender: alinton@fr1 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1.1.3 (Beta) Date: Sun, 13 Oct 2002 18:37:36 +0100 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Metrosound A/B switch? In-Reply-To: <001301c27223$13b44bc0$0101a8c0@pavilion> References: <002201c271bb$b26bfdc0$0401a8c0@OMNIBOOK> <5.1.1.2.2.20021012181754.02e1f7b0@fr1> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed From: Andy Linton X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10800314 X-Yahoo-Profile: alinton1_ie Chris, The front of the unit indicates that OUT is B and IN is A! Which is correct please? At 15:10 12/10/2002 -0400, you wrote: >Andy, when the switch is OUT, it is in Cquam mode (a). >CC >----- Original Message ----- >From: Andy Linton >T > > > Hi, > > > > Can someone remind me please which position is Kahn and which is CQUAM on > > the Metrosound's A/B switch? > > > > > ----------------------------------- Andy Linton alinton@esatclear.ie Waterford, Ireland From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Oct 13 13:48:16 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 13 Oct 2002 20:48:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 47605 invoked from network); 13 Oct 2002 20:48:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Oct 2002 20:48:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.78) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Oct 2002 20:48:16 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.153] by n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Oct 2002 20:48:15 -0000 Date: Sun, 13 Oct 2002 20:48:12 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Metrosound A/B switch? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <5.1.1.2.2.20021013183635.028c36e0@fr1> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 546 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.87.28 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > The front of the unit indicates that OUT is B and IN is A! > Which is correct please? The confusion is that although both use the same multi-system decoder, Sony radios have the "A" mode for C-Quam/Harris/Magnavox and "B" for Kahn... while the MetroSound has "A" (pushed in) for Kahn and "B" (NOT pushed in) for C-Quam/etc. The original owner's manual for the MetroSound can be seen here: http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/kevtronics/met.htm This is also linked on the Radios section of the http://www.AMStereoRadio.com web site. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Oct 13 14:06:43 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 13 Oct 2002 21:06:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 42206 invoked from network); 13 Oct 2002 21:06:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Oct 2002 21:06:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.89) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Oct 2002 21:06:42 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.143] by n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Oct 2002 21:06:42 -0000 Date: Sun, 13 Oct 2002 21:06:40 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: VW radio with non-working AM Stereo Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1331 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.87.28 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics At a swap meet today I picked up one of the few AM Stereo-equipped radios that Volkswagen sold in the USA. It is this model, with the DNR (Dynamic Noise Reduction) button on it indicating that it is a 1985 model with AM Stereo: http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/kevtronics/sc73etr.jpg And indeed, mine has a MC13020P C-Quam decoder chip sitting proudly in a corner of its circuit board. However, even on strong local AM Stereo signals -- including that of my own "Alfredo Lite" transmitter -- it never pops in to Stereo mode. The Stereo works fine on FM, and on AM the sound is pleasingly crisp and clear, but it acts as if the C-Quam decoder isn't there. So, does anyone have any tips for diagnosing a seemingly non-functional MC13020 chip in a radio? I.e., what voltages should I find on the various pins, especially in the pilot detector section? All of the necessary external components for the decoder appear to be there, and the chip has a 1984 date code on it, so it's one of the earliest generation of AM Stereo-equipped car radios. The only other strange thing about the radio I have is that its Right Front speaker output is dead -- no output. However, the other three amplifier channels are working fine, so I can use the Right Rear output instead and get Stereo from FM without trouble. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Oct 13 17:33:56 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 14 Oct 2002 00:33:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 2879 invoked from network); 14 Oct 2002 00:33:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Oct 2002 00:33:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Oct 2002 00:33:55 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.174] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Oct 2002 00:33:55 -0000 Date: Mon, 14 Oct 2002 00:33:54 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: WOR is in digital MONO Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 728 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.87.28 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics Further correspondence with 710 WOR's engineer reveals that their IBOC/"HD" digital signal is actually in glorious monaural, as their studios are currently only wired for mono, and an upgrade to Stereo is years away, if they are ever going to do it. The device generating the IBOC digital signal is actually a PC running Linux, with the digital audio data being fed to it through CAT-5 Ethernet cable. Also, WOR is considering returning their analog nighttime signal to full 10 kHz NRSC audio bandwidth, so when the IBOC/"HD" digital splatter-o-matic is off, we can at least enjoy them with the same audio fidelity as before (versus the 6.2 kHz bandwidth their nighttime analog audio is currently being limited to). From rjskadl@yahoo.com Sun Oct 13 19:48:53 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: rjskadl@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 14 Oct 2002 02:48:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 56899 invoked from network); 14 Oct 2002 02:48:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Oct 2002 02:48:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Oct 2002 02:48:51 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.187] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Oct 2002 02:48:51 -0000 Date: Mon, 14 Oct 2002 02:48:49 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: WOR, Ugh! Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1842 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "rjskadl" X-Originating-IP: 24.186.98.159 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=29619919 X-Yahoo-Profile: rjskadl Congratulations to WOR for being the first Station to sacrifice good audio quality for the biggest gimmick to hit radio since RDS. Not that their audio was all that to begin with, but WOR has such bad audio now that you can barely tell the difference between the callers and the hosts in the studio. I thought at first that maybe I was being too critical. I have a trained ear and know a thing or two about Audio processing. I decided to round up some people and do a sound test. I brought six co-workers into the back office today and played four AM stations. They are not radio people either. The age range was from 18 to 50+. The optimus stereo in the back office has a rather narrow audio bandwidth for its AM section, probably around 5 kHz. The stations I selected were 660 WFAN, 710 WOR, 740 WGSM, and 770 WABC. I played about 20 seconds of each. I repeated the process three times. There was no discussion. Each listener was given a slip of paper and told to rank the stations in audio quality from 1 being the best to 4 being the worst. The Results: Of six people four thought WFAN sounded best and WABC second best. Two thought WABC sounded best and WFAN second Best. All four thought WGSM was third place, and all thought that WOR sounded the worst. If this is the future of radio, then I don't think the future looks very bright. I am suprised that WOR would be using the 4.5K audio cutoff when they could be using an 8K cutoff. It ain't like there are any digital receivers in existence yet. When people actually have HD radios, then WOR can up the bitrate and lower the analog audio cutoff to 4.5, but for now I think that they should be more concerned about their analog quality than their digital quality. I plan on surveying more people when I get a chance. I find this all very interesting. From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Sun Oct 13 21:05:56 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 14 Oct 2002 04:05:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 67566 invoked from network); 14 Oct 2002 04:05:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Oct 2002 04:05:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf03bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.143) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Oct 2002 04:05:56 -0000 Received: from juan ([67.35.5.38]) by imf03bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.19 201-253-122-122-119-20020516) with SMTP id <20021014040738.JDQK28929.imf03bis.bellsouth.net@juan> for ; Mon, 14 Oct 2002 00:07:38 -0400 Message-ID: <000601c27336$fe07fdc0$af78fea9@juan> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} WOR, Ugh! Date: Mon, 14 Oct 2002 00:05:54 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Amen !!!!!! Juan Gualda WGYL, WOSN, WTTB, WGNX Subject: {AMSF} WOR, Ugh! Congratulations to WOR for being the first Station to sacrifice good audio quality for the biggest gimmick to hit radio since RDS. Not that their audio was all that to begin with, but WOR has such bad audio now that you can barely tell the difference between the callers and the hosts in the studio. I thought at first that maybe I was being too critical. I have a trained ear and know a thing or two about Audio processing. I decided to round up some people and do a sound test. I brought six co-workers into the back office today and played four AM stations. They are not radio people either. The age range was from 18 to 50+. The optimus stereo in the back office has a rather narrow audio bandwidth for its AM section, probably around 5 kHz. The stations I selected were 660 WFAN, 710 WOR, 740 WGSM, and 770 WABC. I played about 20 seconds of each. I repeated the process three times. There was no discussion. Each listener was given a slip of paper and told to rank the stations in audio quality from 1 being the best to 4 being the worst. The Results: Of six people four thought WFAN sounded best and WABC second best. Two thought WABC sounded best and WFAN second Best. All four thought WGSM was third place, and all thought that WOR sounded the worst. If this is the future of radio, then I don't think the future looks very bright. I am suprised that WOR would be using the 4.5K audio cutoff when they could be using an 8K cutoff. It ain't like there are any digital receivers in existence yet. When people actually have HD radios, then WOR can up the bitrate and lower the analog audio cutoff to 4.5, but for now I think that they should be more concerned about their analog quality than their digital quality. I plan on surveying more people when I get a chance. I find this all very interesting. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Sun Oct 13 21:23:04 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 14 Oct 2002 04:23:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 22596 invoked from network); 14 Oct 2002 04:23:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Oct 2002 04:23:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14202.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.144) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Oct 2002 04:23:03 -0000 Message-ID: <20021014042303.63076.qmail@web14202.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.127.54.199] by web14202.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 13 Oct 2002 21:23:03 PDT Date: Sun, 13 Oct 2002 21:23:03 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Calling OZ: Ian, care to comment? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: John Pavlica X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio I'd dispute your comment about Australia. Take it from one who has been involved with AM stereo since the preliminary trial days (first with the Harris V-CPM system, then Motorola C-QUAM). All metro and most major regional commercial stations here converted to AMS back whenever in the mid-80's, but lost interest soon after. Within six months of the launch of AMS they had given up and all were clamoring to be allowed to convert to FM! But that's a different story!! There have been no new AM stereo transmitter installs since then, and the existing ones are disappearing by attrition. Equipment breaks, and is not fixed - no support from suppliers etc.. It's hard to convince owners to spend serious money on repairing/replacing AM stereo gear. AM stereo is not even a blip on the radar here now. New AMS radios are only found in a few imported cars - certainly not the mainstream locally built autos. Non-auto AMS radios are impossible to find. No AM stations promote themselves as stereo anymore. I look after two AM stereo stations (one easy-listening music and one talker) - and occasionally am forced to run in mono. I only get complaints from the local AM stereo evangelist - nobody else even knows. Peter Smerdon Radio 3AK /3MP Melbourne, Australia __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Faith Hill - Exclusive Performances, Videos & More http://faith.yahoo.com From dav259@csiro.au Sun Oct 13 23:31:51 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 14 Oct 2002 06:31:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 56737 invoked from network); 14 Oct 2002 06:31:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Oct 2002 06:31:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Oct 2002 06:31:49 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9E6VmP24932 for ; Mon, 14 Oct 2002 16:31:48 +1000 (EST) Date: Mon, 14 Oct 2002 16:31:48 +1000 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Calling OZ: Ian, care to comment? In-Reply-To: <20021014042303.63076.qmail@web14202.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public Hi Mr Electron On Sun, 13 Oct 2002, John Pavlica wrote: > I'd dispute your comment about Australia. Sadly - much of what Peter says is seemingly true. What comments was he responding to? > Take it from one who has been involved with AM stereo since the preliminary > trial days (first with the Harris V-CPM system, then Motorola C-QUAM). > All metro and most major regional commercial stations here converted to AMS > back whenever in the mid-80's, but lost interest soon after. Within six > months of the launch of AMS they had given up and all were clamoring to be > allowed to convert to FM! But that's a different story!! Most AM stations went stereo on 1 Feb 1985. A few (like 3XY) incorporated stereo in their logos and jingles - but not for long. Big talker 3AW started calling itself "AW-AM" and that didn't go over at all well. Very few ever mentioned the "s" word. Peter's correct about stations clamouring to be on the FM band. No major commercial AM licences have been issued since 1975 when 3MP and 2WS commenced. Since the early 90s several stations have participated in ABA auctions to be allowed to move to the FM band. In Melbourne 3KZ and 3DB "won" by bidding too much. They subsequently both went bankrupt and now are controlled by Clear Channel ... who else?? In Sydney 2WS and 2UW moved to FM and went broke and they too are now controlled by Clear Channel ... who else?? Many regional cities only had one commercial AM station. Several were allowed to move to FM - but since the two station rule some have been allowed two stations - one AM the other FM - and thankfully they're not permitted to simulcast. AMS Radios - right from its inception - were desperately rare to find - and that's for cars, walkmans, and tuners. The thinking seemed to be that AMS was a proven flop in the US - how could it ever survive here? Particularly given the recent success of commercial FM stations that commenced only five years earlier. Yet considering all it's had going against it our five remaining commercial AM stations are all transmitting in stereo. The only major station to switch it off was the ABC's 3LO in 1995. You hardly hear anything in stereo on top rating 3AW as it's all talk and they just don't bother with bumpers and such. And funnily enough for the last couple of years 3AK has for the most part been in stereo with no pilot. I've often thought of asking Peter about that but don't want to get on the wrong side of him. He IS doing a great job! 3MP went off air yesterday afternoon in a storm and they were back sounding as good as ever withing 30 minutes. Imagine if they had have been on auto - they may have been out for hours. btw - "Melbourne 3KZ" was a great AMS station in every way. > There have been no new AM stereo transmitter installs since then, and the > existing ones are disappearing by attrition. Equipment breaks, and is not > fixed - no support from suppliers etc.. That's funny for Peter to say - as 3AK installed a Nautel stereo transmitter in March last year - Jeff Welton verified this. I wouldn't think the extra cost of AMS would be massive in the big scheme of things. And I'd like to thing engineers are proud of their sound quality - I think Peter is. > It's hard to convince owners to spend serious money on repairing/replacing > AM stereo gear. > AM stereo is not even a blip on the radar here now. > New AMS radios are only found in a few imported cars - certainly not the > mainstream locally built autos. Non-auto AMS radios are impossible to find. > No AM stations promote themselves as stereo anymore. Unfortunately this is pretty true in beancounting land. In my opinion most of our problem (that can't be attributed to the FCC) was with the manufacturers - as most AM stations did go stereo. But you have to blame the stations too - as they never promoted it. It was like an embarrassment. Stations that had been around for about 60 years were pretty pissed off that they weren't originally allowed to apply for the first FM licences. They seemed to think AMS was a very meagre concilation prize. Even today I expect 80% of people would simply say AM stereo doesn't exist - 10% think it's been and gone - and half the rest simply don't care. > I look after two AM stereo stations (one easy-listening music and one > talker) - and occasionally am forced to run in mono. > I only get complaints from the local AM stereo evangelist - nobody else > even knows. > > > Peter Smerdon > Radio 3AK /3MP > Melbourne, Australia This is not exactly true as I know of at least five people complain (nicely) - plus some on this list. But he's not far off the mark. However - if Syphony (or any AMS) radios hit the market here Magic 693 and 3MP would be mad not to promote them. Magic already outrates (Clear Channel's) MIX-FM - and 3MP was consistently the top station overall for several consecutive surveys only eight years ago. And the secret in promoting Symphony will be the use of that very popular "d" word! I can't wait for the FM stations to cry foul - but they too can use it if they wish - and it may even make them sound better too! Pity it won't improve their programming. Ian "Local AM Stereo Evangelist" From rjskadl@yahoo.com Mon Oct 14 11:03:35 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: rjskadl@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 14 Oct 2002 18:03:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 78881 invoked from network); 14 Oct 2002 18:03:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Oct 2002 18:03:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Oct 2002 18:03:33 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.189] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Oct 2002 18:03:33 -0000 Date: Mon, 14 Oct 2002 18:03:31 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: ALMOST STEREO Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 549 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "rjskadl" X-Originating-IP: 129.49.152.110 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=29619919 X-Yahoo-Profile: rjskadl HELP! We got a station, They play music, Stereo Studio, Stereo Processing, Stereo Capable Transmitter, Only Problem? The BE AM1 is missing the AM Stereo Exciter Card! Please. If anyone has access to an AM1 Stereo Generatior Card, All we have to do is put it in the transmitter. Either an AM1 Stereo Card, or an external exiter would suffice. I thought I was getting one frome somewhere else, but they keep giving me the runaround. I think it would be cool to put another AMS on the air, especially after IBOC was just approved! -Rusty From rjskadl@yahoo.com Mon Oct 14 11:08:28 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: rjskadl@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 14 Oct 2002 18:08:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 75016 invoked from network); 14 Oct 2002 18:08:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Oct 2002 18:08:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Oct 2002 18:08:27 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.175] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Oct 2002 18:08:15 -0000 Date: Mon, 14 Oct 2002 18:08:14 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: ALMOST STEREO Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 549 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "rjskadl" X-Originating-IP: 129.49.152.110 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=29619919 X-Yahoo-Profile: rjskadl HELP! We got a station, They play music, Stereo Studio, Stereo Processing, Stereo Capable Transmitter, Only Problem? The BE AM1 is missing the AM Stereo Exciter Card! Please. If anyone has access to an AM1 Stereo Generatior Card, All we have to do is put it in the transmitter. Either an AM1 Stereo Card, or an external exiter would suffice. I thought I was getting one frome somewhere else, but they keep giving me the runaround. I think it would be cool to put another AMS on the air, especially after IBOC was just approved! -Rusty From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Oct 14 17:09:29 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 15 Oct 2002 00:09:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 3947 invoked from network); 15 Oct 2002 00:09:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Oct 2002 00:09:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Oct 2002 00:09:27 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.147] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Oct 2002 00:09:27 -0000 Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 00:09:27 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: ALMOST STEREO Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1525 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 207.200.166.75 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics You might want to contact 1170 WWTR in Bridgewater, NJ (simulcasting 1250 WMTR). When the station was built in 1997, they used a B.E. AM- 500 transmitter, and an engineer who worked for them said that it is Stereo-capable, so I assume they ordered it with the Stereo exciter card. However, they have never broadcast in Stereo, and WMTR says they have "no interest in AM Stereo, since IBOC will make it obsolete anyway", so you might have a chance. http://www.wmtram.com/ BTW, 1170 WWTR also uses an Optimod 9100 Stereo audio processor, and even a Stereo T1 STL, but alas, their signal is mono, and mostly likely will remain as such. Nevertheless, they are one of the best- sounding mono AM stations I have ever heard. p.s. Any hints on what station this is? 1240 WGBB maybe? Something else in the LI/CT area? Obviously it's not 540 WLUX/WLIE anymore <>. --- In amstereoforum@y..., "rjskadl" wrote: > HELP! > > We got a station, > They play music, > Stereo Studio, > Stereo Processing, > Stereo Capable Transmitter, > Only Problem? > > The BE AM1 is missing the AM Stereo Exciter Card! > > Please. If anyone has access to an AM1 Stereo Generatior Card, > All we have to do is put it in the transmitter. Either an AM1 Stereo > Card, or an external exiter would suffice. I thought I was getting > one frome somewhere else, but they keep giving me the > runaround. I think it would be cool to put another AMS on the air, > especially after IBOC was just approved! -Rusty From stodd@sherbtel.net Mon Oct 14 17:35:46 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 15 Oct 2002 00:35:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 65886 invoked from network); 15 Oct 2002 00:35:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Oct 2002 00:35:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Oct 2002 00:35:44 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-88-90.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.90]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g9F0UZjR018208 for ; Mon, 14 Oct 2002 19:30:37 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <002d01c273e3$2de2bd80$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} ALMOST STEREO Date: Mon, 14 Oct 2002 19:38:25 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Don't panic. There's an engineer named Kevin Kidd who posts on the Radio-Tech forum on broadcast.net. He's got one he pulled from another transmitter. Don't have his email address at home, but if you contact me at stodd@kkms.com, I do have it on my work computer. I'm not sure how much he'd want for it; I'd guess $500 or slightly less. Would be willing to chip in to help the station a small amount to fund it if they're a bit cheap. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "rjskadl" To: Sent: Monday, October 14, 2002 1:03 PM Subject: {AMSF} ALMOST STEREO > HELP! > > We got a station, > They play music, > Stereo Studio, > Stereo Processing, > Stereo Capable Transmitter, > Only Problem? > > The BE AM1 is missing the AM Stereo Exciter Card! > > Please. If anyone has access to an AM1 Stereo Generatior Card, > All we have to do is put it in the transmitter. Either an AM1 Stereo > Card, or an external exiter would suffice. I thought I was getting > one frome somewhere else, but they keep giving me the > runaround. I think it would be cool to put another AMS on the air, > especially after IBOC was just approved! -Rusty > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > From stodd@sherbtel.net Mon Oct 14 17:57:39 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 15 Oct 2002 00:57:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 51396 invoked from network); 15 Oct 2002 00:57:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Oct 2002 00:57:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Oct 2002 00:57:38 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-88-129.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.129]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g9F0pkjR023151 for ; Mon, 14 Oct 2002 19:52:30 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <000c01c273e6$3c6c5480$d3a9fea9@me> To: Subject: setting the clock- OT Date: Mon, 14 Oct 2002 19:59:35 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sad to say, but my AMS-equipped 88 Dodge Shadow bit the dust due to a catastrophic oil seal failure. I'm now driving a 93 Escort with mono radio that only tunes to 1620. (They must have had a pile of pre-93 made radios; this car was made in August of 93.) Until I'm able to get a suitable AMS replacement that tunes to 1700 or 1710 off ebay, I'll have to put up with what I've got. It's a rectangular DIN size radio with the four knobs on the right, AM,FM, presets and display in the center, and scan and seek buttons and volume control on the left. Trouble is, I don't know what combination of buttons to use in setting the clock on the fool thing. Anyone know the proceedure? ST PS the only major rust on the Shadow was under the spare tire. Would have left it somewhere on the freeway for sure this winter. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From groucho@skyweb.net Mon Oct 14 19:08:50 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 15 Oct 2002 02:08:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 3858 invoked from network); 15 Oct 2002 02:08:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Oct 2002 02:08:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Oct 2002 02:08:47 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g9F2BHtq033847 for ; Mon, 14 Oct 2002 22:11:17 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DAB7734.90EAFBD2@skyweb.net> Date: Mon, 14 Oct 2002 22:02:28 -0400 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: ALMOST STEREO References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Chances are if Its not WLUX 540 then its my sister station WNYG in babylon. BTW WGBB 1240 is also a sister station.... Now in Chinese WNYG has a B.E. transmitter and that's Russ's Baby... Russ If you Find Out about WWTR. and can get it.. I'll pick it up since its local. and Deliver it Myself.. then go Visit my in-laws up the road.. Neal Newman- CE WTTM "Kevin T." wrote: > You might want to contact 1170 WWTR in Bridgewater, NJ (simulcasting > 1250 WMTR). When the station was built in 1997, they used a B.E. AM- > 500 transmitter, and an engineer who worked for them said that it is > Stereo-capable, so I assume they ordered it with the Stereo exciter > card. However, they have never broadcast in Stereo, and WMTR says > they have "no interest in AM Stereo, since IBOC will make it obsolete > anyway", so you might have a chance. > > http://www.wmtram.com/ > > BTW, 1170 WWTR also uses an Optimod 9100 Stereo audio processor, and > even a Stereo T1 STL, but alas, their signal is mono, and mostly > likely will remain as such. Nevertheless, they are one of the best- > sounding mono AM stations I have ever heard. > > p.s. Any hints on what station this is? 1240 WGBB maybe? Something > else in the LI/CT area? Obviously it's not 540 WLUX/WLIE anymore > <>. > > --- In amstereoforum@y..., "rjskadl" wrote: > > HELP! > > > > We got a station, > > They play music, > > Stereo Studio, > > Stereo Processing, > > Stereo Capable Transmitter, > > Only Problem? > > > > The BE AM1 is missing the AM Stereo Exciter Card! > > > > Please. If anyone has access to an AM1 Stereo Generatior Card, > > All we have to do is put it in the transmitter. Either an AM1 > Stereo > > Card, or an external exiter would suffice. I thought I was getting > > one frome somewhere else, but they keep giving me the > > runaround. I think it would be cool to put another AMS on the air, > > especially after IBOC was just approved! -Rusty > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Oct 14 22:20:55 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 15 Oct 2002 05:20:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 65015 invoked from network); 15 Oct 2002 05:20:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Oct 2002 05:20:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Oct 2002 05:20:54 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.163] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Oct 2002 05:20:54 -0000 Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 05:20:54 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: setting the clock- OT Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <000c01c273e6$3c6c5480$d3a9fea9@me> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2178 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.94.174 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Sad to say, but my AMS-equipped 88 Dodge Shadow bit the dust due to > a catastrophic oil seal failure. I have some friends and family who still swear by their K-Cars, and I guess you got a decent amount of service from yours. Amongst American-made cars of the 1980s and early '90s, they're generally well-made, and of course many came with AM Stereo-equipped radios! (As the BNL song goes, "If I had a million dollars, I'd buy you a K-Car... a nice Reliant automobile.") > I'm now driving a 93 Escort with mono radio that only tunes to > 1620. (They must have had a pile of pre-93 made radios; this car > was made in August of 93.) Consider yourself lucky, as many pre-EB digital tuning radios only went up to 1610 kHz, and even today many radios only go down to 87.9 MHz on FM, so you can't listen to Channel 6 TV audio on 87.7 MHz. (OTOH, my Sparkomatic SR-430 is rather adventurous for a pre-EB radio, tuning *520*-1620 on AM and 87.5-*108.1* on FM!) > Trouble is, I don't know what combination of buttons to use in > setting the clock on the fool thing. Anyone know the proceedure? If it has an "AMS" button, that is often the "secret" multi-function button, which not only turns on the Auto Music Search cassette playing mode, but also enables manual tuning (rather than auto-seek) on the radio, and when held down, lets you set the digital clock. At least, that's the way I remember it working on Ford radios. p.s. Automotive clock placement is an interesting phenomenon. American cars usually have it built into the radio; Japanese cars usually have it in its own spot on the dashboard; and European cars usually have it along with the other gauges in the instrument cluster. Also, European cars usually have the fuel filler on the passenger's (outer) side, so that if you run out of gas on the road, you don't get run over by passing cars while refilling it from a can. Finally, antenna placement varies widely, although the driver's side rear is best, because at the rear it's away from the electrical noise of the engine, and on the inner side it's farther away from both errant tree branches and noisy power lines while driving. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Oct 15 07:07:36 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 15 Oct 2002 14:07:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 49544 invoked from network); 15 Oct 2002 14:07:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Oct 2002 14:07:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Oct 2002 14:07:33 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.137] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Oct 2002 14:07:33 -0000 Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 14:07:32 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: IBOC gone from 710 WOR (at least for now) Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 617 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics Just now while driving to work I noticed that the IBOC/"HD" digital signal is gone from 710 WOR... I can finally pick up stations on 690 and 730 kHz again without the splattering digital sidebands, and WOR's audio is significantly LOUDER and clearer. Even out in Hunterdon County, NJ, I can carry WOR through an underpass with absolutely no fading. Wouldn't it be fabulous if WOR has permanently switched off the IBOC after using it less than a week, based on the *overwhelming* amount of negative comments they have been getting about it all over the Internet, and I'm sure from many phone calls as well! From meridian3891@cs.com Tue Oct 15 09:08:06 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: meridian3891@cs.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 15 Oct 2002 16:08:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 16572 invoked from network); 15 Oct 2002 16:08:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Oct 2002 16:08:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Oct 2002 16:08:03 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.176] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Oct 2002 16:08:02 -0000 Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 16:07:59 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: IBOC gone from 710 WOR (at least for now) Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 859 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Tony" X-Originating-IP: 205.166.36.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=48487815 X-Yahoo-Profile: onemeridian I wonder how many listeners thought their neighbors were running electric power tools etc., when they were actually hearding the IBOC! Tony --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin T." wrote: > Just now while driving to work I noticed that the IBOC/"HD" digital > signal is gone from 710 WOR... I can finally pick up stations on 690 > and 730 kHz again without the splattering digital sidebands, and > WOR's audio is significantly LOUDER and clearer. Even out in > Hunterdon County, NJ, I can carry WOR through an underpass with > absolutely no fading. > > Wouldn't it be fabulous if WOR has permanently switched off the IBOC > after using it less than a week, based on the *overwhelming* amount > of negative comments they have been getting about it all over the > Internet, and I'm sure from many phone calls as well! From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Tue Oct 15 09:51:17 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 15 Oct 2002 16:51:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 71269 invoked from network); 15 Oct 2002 16:51:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Oct 2002 16:51:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web40802.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.78.179) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Oct 2002 16:51:14 -0000 Message-ID: <20021015165114.68456.qmail@web40802.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.36.234] by web40802.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 15 Oct 2002 09:51:14 PDT Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 09:51:14 -0700 (PDT) Subject: CHML/900 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio Did anyone else catch CHML/900 with a stereo pilot the other night? It was 2 nights ago and was NOT there yesterday, but there was more interference yesterday too. Also, has anyone else noticed NO pilot coming from WWKB/1520-Buffalo and WPTR/1540-Albany? 73, Jay,N1WVQ __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Faith Hill - Exclusive Performances, Videos & More http://faith.yahoo.com From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Oct 15 10:11:50 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 15 Oct 2002 17:11:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 77262 invoked from network); 15 Oct 2002 17:11:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Oct 2002 17:11:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Oct 2002 17:11:49 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.183] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Oct 2002 17:11:49 -0000 Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 17:11:48 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: IBOC gone from 710 WOR (at least for now) Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2067 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics Here is the e-mail reply I got from WOR's engineer. It seems that their IBOC exciter already crapped out... leave it to iBiquity to make a Linux system unreliable! From: "Tom Ray" Subject: Re: No IBOC on WOR today? Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 10:28:54 -0400 Actually, this is the only email I got. The exciter decided to go to 1's and 0's heaven yesterday. A new one is being delivered to the site as I type. It will be back up shortly. Similar to AM stereo, the exciter essentially plugs into the transmitter. THe exciter itself is a computer running Linux. The audio (magnitude) and RF (phase) run to the transmitter via cat-5 cable (first time I've ever connected a 50KW rig with cat-5!), and then connects to an interface box that outputs audio to the TX audio inputs, and RF through a BNC jack. In the transmitter is a relay that switches the transmitter between it's internal oscillator or the external exciter. This control voltage is derived from the interface box. The digital carriers phase modulate the transmitter......and the audio amplitude modulates the transmitter. The main difference is that you see the digital carriers on the mono modulation monitor....didn't have this issue with AM stereo. It's very strange standing in front of the phasor and hearing it hiss slightly.......which any engineer can tell you is very nerve wracking the first time you hear it, because that sound usually means you have a connection arcing over internally and it will soon take you off the air. In theory, if the exciter crashes, it should release the relay and allow the TX to operate on it's own oscillator. TX will dump on an under drive fault, then come back up. Yesterday's crash locked the relay in IBOC position and would not allow us to release it, so Mr. Auxiliary transmitter made a rare daytime appearance. This, quite honestly, is the first time I've had to reboot a transmitter. There are advantages and disadvantages to being #1 in something.....yesterday we learned a disadvantage. Sigh. From jwelton@nautel.com Tue Oct 15 10:56:30 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jwelton@nautel.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 15 Oct 2002 17:56:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 26766 invoked from network); 15 Oct 2002 17:56:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Oct 2002 17:56:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailserver.nautel.com) (24.222.4.134) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Oct 2002 17:56:29 -0000 Received: FROM jeff-welton BY mailserver.nautel.com ; Tue Oct 15 14:59:01 2002 -0300 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 14:55:05 -0300 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: {AMSF} CHML/900 Message-ID: <3DAC2C46.21825.CD8A28@localhost> X-Confirm-Reading-To: jwelton@nautel.com X-pmrqc: 1 Priority: normal In-reply-to: <20021015165114.68456.qmail@web40802.mail.yahoo.com> References: X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.02) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body From: "Jeff Welton" Reply-To: jwelton@nautel.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=26918678 > Did anyone else catch CHML/900 with a stereo > pilot the other night? It was 2 nights ago and > was NOT there yesterday, but there was more > interference yesterday too. Also, has anyone > else noticed NO pilot coming from > WWKB/1520-Buffalo and WPTR/1540-Albany? Our records show that CHML has had a stereo exciter going back to at least 1996 - whether it's on or not, I don't know. Can't speak for WWKB, but I know that WPTR has been suffering from interference problems with a station on my side of the 49th that has apparently not been reducing power at night. They noticed that the interference was worse when in stereo so they switched off the pilot and put the transmitter in mono until this issue is resolved - expect to hear the pilot again in the hopefully not too distant future. Best, Jeff Welton Nautel Customer Service Dept. Tel.: 1-902-823-3900 ext. 127 Fax: 1-902-823-3183 email: jwelton@nautel.com From groucho@skyweb.net Tue Oct 15 11:32:57 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 15 Oct 2002 18:32:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 72604 invoked from network); 15 Oct 2002 18:32:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Oct 2002 18:32:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Oct 2002 18:32:56 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g9FIZRtq009823 for ; Tue, 15 Oct 2002 14:35:27 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DAC5DA9.B46FBC1F@skyweb.net> Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 14:25:45 -0400 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} CHML/900 References: <3DAC2C46.21825.CD8A28@localhost> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 gee that seems To be the Norm for Am stations... Hell I sit in My studio Control room at Night. and Listen to I on the 4's on WTIR wintergarden/Orlando... I cannot hear my own signal. getting Very frustrated when Im asked by my Boss.. have You been powering down at Night.. and my answer is Yes. If I was at day power I would be hearing My own station. Not Florida But told him that if we feed them our audio then our listeners can hear our programming , and so Could I in the Control room. Neal Jeff Welton wrote: Can't speak for WWKB, but I know that WPTR has been suffering from interference > problems with a station on my side of the 49th that has apparently not been > reducing power at night. They noticed that the interference was worse when in > stereo so they switched off the pilot and put the transmitter in mono until > this issue is resolved - expect to hear the pilot again in the hopefully not > too distant future. > > Best, > > Jeff Welton > Nautel Customer Service Dept. > Tel.: 1-902-823-3900 ext. 127 > Fax: 1-902-823-3183 > email: jwelton@nautel.com > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From ccuff@in4web.com Tue Oct 15 12:14:46 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 15 Oct 2002 19:14:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 128 invoked from network); 15 Oct 2002 19:14:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Oct 2002 19:14:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Oct 2002 19:14:45 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.125]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Tue, 15 Oct 2002 15:13:35 -0400 Message-ID: <001001c2747e$f0abfde0$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC gone from 710 WOR (at least for now) Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 15:13:26 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 Today, I was trying them and also noticed the IBOC off- but they were running liners about how they are "Now in digital- giving you FM Stereo sound on am"..... actually using the "S" word. CC From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Tue Oct 15 12:49:23 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 15 Oct 2002 19:49:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 86512 invoked from network); 15 Oct 2002 19:49:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Oct 2002 19:49:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web40802.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.78.179) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Oct 2002 19:49:22 -0000 Message-ID: <20021015194922.9243.qmail@web40802.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.36.234] by web40802.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 15 Oct 2002 12:49:22 PDT Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 12:49:22 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Why didn't anyone tell me about this??? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: <001001c2747e$f0abfde0$0101a8c0@pavilion> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio Rush Flings Verbal Dung - 10/7 - Heard via WMAL at 12:25 PM on Monday. Rush Limbaugh said the word "sh*t" on the air. He was expressing frustration at the New York Times and Democrats. He immediately acknowledged his utterance, and asked his listeners to ignore it. No word yet on whether the FCC will issue a fine... __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Faith Hill - Exclusive Performances, Videos & More http://faith.yahoo.com From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Tue Oct 15 12:56:44 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 15 Oct 2002 19:56:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 63044 invoked from network); 15 Oct 2002 19:56:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Oct 2002 19:56:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web40805.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.78.182) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Oct 2002 19:56:44 -0000 Message-ID: <20021015195644.16983.qmail@web40805.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.36.234] by web40805.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 15 Oct 2002 12:56:44 PDT Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 12:56:44 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: {AMSF} CHML/900 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: <3DAC5DA9.B46FBC1F@skyweb.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio Here's a present: WTIR/1680 (407) 481-0551. 73, Jay,N1WVQ __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Faith Hill - Exclusive Performances, Videos & More http://faith.yahoo.com From KC4QLP@aol.com Tue Oct 15 13:03:18 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 15 Oct 2002 20:03:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 90773 invoked from network); 15 Oct 2002 20:03:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Oct 2002 20:03:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m06.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.161) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Oct 2002 20:03:18 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.9c.27e61bf6 (30950) for ; Tue, 15 Oct 2002 16:03:11 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <9c.27e61bf6.2addce7f@aol.com> Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 16:03:11 EDT Subject: Re: {AMSF} Why didn't anyone tell me about this??? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 10/15/02 3:51:11 PM Eastern Daylight Time, a1asurfradio@yahoo.com writes: << Rush Flings Verbal Dung - 10/7 - Heard via WMAL at 12:25 PM on Monday. Rush Limbaugh said the word "sh*t" on the air. He was expressing frustration at the New York Times and Democrats. He immediately acknowledged his utterance, and asked his listeners to ignore it. No word yet on whether the FCC will issue a fine... >> I've heard worse from various network talk show host and yet the beat goes on...and no one was fined. Seems as if the Fizzled Communications Commission is just that ....."fizzled"! I've heard things on radio that I wouldnt have dreamed of hearing everday 25-30 years ago. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5..., Ray Communications Radio Network Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereoradio-subcribe@topica.com amstereo-subcribe@topica.com amstereoradio-subscribe@yahoogroups.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ WARNING TO UNSOLICITED SPAMMERS !!! Pursuant to U.S. Code, title 47, Chapter 5, Subchapter II, "Any and all nonsolicited E-mail (SPAM) sent to this address is subject to a download and archival fee of 500 U.S."!! E-mailing denotes acceptance of these terms." Your message (if actually mailed) is in violation of the Federal Telephone Consumer Protection Act of 1991, and Collateral Code of Federal Regulations (47 CFR 64.1200). The TCPA allows a private right of action against the sender of unsolicited advertising. The recipient can sue for $500, or actualdamages (whichever is greater). ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------- Osama bin Laden can kiss my royal white American behind! From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Tue Oct 15 13:13:37 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 15 Oct 2002 20:13:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 33976 invoked from network); 15 Oct 2002 20:13:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Oct 2002 20:13:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web40809.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.78.186) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Oct 2002 20:13:36 -0000 Message-ID: <20021015201336.24173.qmail@web40809.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.36.234] by web40809.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 15 Oct 2002 13:13:36 PDT Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 13:13:36 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: {AMSF} Why didn't anyone tell me about this??? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: <9c.27e61bf6.2addce7f@aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio I thought it was still one of those seven deadly words. So, does the F.C.C. do anything anymore besides allow substandard emissions? 73, Jay,N1WVQ __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Faith Hill - Exclusive Performances, Videos & More http://faith.yahoo.com From kfornal@loa.com Tue Oct 15 14:13:49 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kfornal@loa.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 15 Oct 2002 21:13:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 45584 invoked from network); 15 Oct 2002 21:13:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Oct 2002 21:13:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO lakemtao02.cox.net) (68.1.17.243) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Oct 2002 21:13:48 -0000 Received: from OMNIBOOK ([68.9.127.164]) by lakemtao02.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20021015211345.PJVX12192.lakemtao02.cox.net@OMNIBOOK> for ; Tue, 15 Oct 2002 17:13:45 -0400 To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} Reply from WOR Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 17:13:26 -0400 Message-ID: <001801c2748f$b6f6ad00$0401a8c0@OMNIBOOK> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2616 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <20021013020925.21092.qmail@web12807.mail.yahoo.com> From: "Keith Fornal" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=110312140 X-Yahoo-Profile: theradboy Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit More from Tom Ray on the NYRMB: http://musicradio.computer.net/wwwboard/messages/180928.html Posted by Tom Ray on October 15, 2002 at 12:44:51: In Reply to: Re: Has WOR turned the digital radio signal on again today? posted by Charlie Menut on October 15, 2002 at 11:45:36: No such luck. The exciter had an "issue" fresh out of the box. We are presently replacing it, and should be back on later today. For those interested, AM stereo died about 10 years ago. Time to come into 2002. Tom Ray Corporate Director of Engineering Buckley Broadcasting/WOR Radio Keith Fornal Treasurer Dutch Island Lighthouse Society www.dutchislandlighthouse.org -----Original Message----- From: Kevin T. [mailto:kevtronics@yahoo.com] Sent: Saturday, October 12, 2002 10:09 PM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Reply from WOR I wrote in a rather harsh comment to the form on WOR's web site, and I was surprised to quickly get the following reply back from them: --- Tom Ray wrote: > From: "Tom Ray" > To: > Subject: Digital > Date: Sat, 12 Oct 2002 21:30:13 -0400 > > You really should give it a chance. While I was a big fan of AM stereo, > it was still plagued by the normal problems of AM reception. IBOC isn't. > > And you must be listening on a wideband radio....which is quite the > rarity. I have a "wideband" AM stereo radio in the car (stock Ford AM > stereo radio), and can't tell the difference between the 5kHz audio now > being transmitted and the 9.5kHz audio we were transmitting. And can't > hear the digital carriers. And no, I'm not deaf. You'd be surprised > what I can hear that others can't. > > Unfortunately, the public is starting to purchase XM and Sirius satellite > radios. Unless AM and FM stations have some way to compete with the > digital audio on these services, we don't stand a chance. > > I do agree that the AM and FM bands were not meant to carry this digital > signal. The TV bands were not meant to carry HDTV, either, but they are. > Another unfortunate fact of life is that the general public won't go out > and buy an expensive radio (like they're not buying HDTV's) if we move to > another band. Witness what has happened in Canada, who decided to go > with Eureka 147 in L band. They're starting to shut them off......radios > aren't selling. Another problem is that the FCC screwed up big time in > the 1960's with the AM band. If they didn't add a boatload of 1KW > peashooter stations that contribute greatly to interference, we wouldn't > have the 10kHz rolloff we are forced to have and could actually transmit > a reasonable signal. > > Thomas R. Ray, III, CSRE > Corporate Director of Engineering > Buckley Broadcasting/WOR Radio > New York > 212-642-4462 fax: 212-921-4751 __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Faith Hill - Exclusive Performances, Videos & More http://faith.yahoo.com Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ADVERTISEMENT Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From jsgil@hal-pc.org Tue Oct 15 14:18:39 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 15 Oct 2002 21:18:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 57297 invoked from network); 15 Oct 2002 21:18:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Oct 2002 21:18:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Oct 2002 21:18:38 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.130] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Oct 2002 21:18:37 -0000 Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 21:18:37 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: IBOC gone from 710 WOR (at least for now) Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1346 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.199 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin T." wrote: > > Similar to AM stereo, the exciter essentially plugs into the > transmitter. THe exciter itself is a computer running Linux. The > audio (magnitude) and RF (phase) run to the transmitter via cat-5 > cable (first time I've ever connected a 50KW rig with cat-5!), and > then connects to an interface box that outputs audio to the TX audio > inputs, and RF through a BNC jack. Mmm, that's interesting that it runs Linux. Once someone figures out how to talk to the "interface box" all it would take is a program written to generate the phase and amplitude equivalent of a C-QuAM signal, thus converting a IBOC exciter to a high quality digital C-QuAM exciter. Since the algorythms are software based there's no reason why it couldn't do both C-QuAM out to 6KHz and IBOC during the daytime and switch to full bandwidth C-QuAM at night. This concept could also be applied to mini 100mW C-QuAM transmitters. All that would be needed is an "interface box" that connects to your computer and outputs a 100mW C-QuAM signal. All the rest would be software based including the matrix processing. Since Linux is GPL ought to see if the iBiquity code is violating the GPL license by linking to the GPL libraries. If so this coud be a stumbling block for iBiquity. JSG From jsgil@hal-pc.org Tue Oct 15 14:30:20 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 15 Oct 2002 21:30:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 86071 invoked from network); 15 Oct 2002 21:30:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Oct 2002 21:30:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Oct 2002 21:30:19 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.178] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Oct 2002 21:30:19 -0000 Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 21:30:19 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: VW radio with non-working AM Stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1345 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.199 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin T." wrote: > > So, does anyone have any tips for diagnosing a seemingly > non-functional MC13020 chip in a radio? I.e., what voltages should I > find on the various pins, especially in the pilot detector section? > All of the necessary external components for the decoder appear to be > there, and the chip has a 1984 date code on it, so it's one of the > earliest generation of AM Stereo-equipped car radios. > > The only other strange thing about the radio I have is that its > Right Front speaker output is dead -- no output. However, the other > three amplifier channels are working fine, so I can use the Right > Rear output instead and get Stereo from FM without trouble. The biggest problem I've had with the chip not going into stereo is that the components for the pilot filter doesn't offer enough gain. In the datasheet it specifies that the filter can have a max. gain of 25 and a max. Q of 10. Once I reselected components to get as close to this the chip readily trips into stereo. The datasheet also has formulas to calculate the values for the components. The TM-152 never had this problem because their pilot filter had a gain of 50 and a TrimPot to adjust the level and it also had a 2nd order low pass filter to remove any L-R above about 40Hz. JSG From dav259@csiro.au Tue Oct 15 16:43:09 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 15 Oct 2002 23:43:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 39521 invoked from network); 15 Oct 2002 23:43:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Oct 2002 23:43:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Oct 2002 23:43:08 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9FNh6P04098 for ; Wed, 16 Oct 2002 09:43:06 +1000 (EST) Date: Wed, 16 Oct 2002 09:43:06 +1000 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: amstereoforum Subject: amstereoradio.com Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public In today's Herald Sun Guide's page listing seven interesting web sites: www.amstereoradio.com Ian Davidson writes "As Magic 693, Sport 927, 3AK, 3AW, and 3MP are all currently broadcasting in AM stereo the following site would be of interest to your Guide readers who would like to hear them in hi-fi stereo." [ if only we had some radios!! ] From stodd@sherbtel.net Tue Oct 15 17:59:49 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 16 Oct 2002 00:59:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 99631 invoked from network); 16 Oct 2002 00:59:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Oct 2002 00:59:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Oct 2002 00:59:48 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-88-233.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.233]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g9G0scjR021005 for ; Tue, 15 Oct 2002 19:54:39 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <003301c274af$b6a71fe0$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: setting the clock- OT Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 20:02:32 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Nope- no hissette on this thing. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kevin T." > If it has an "AMS" button, From stodd@sherbtel.net Tue Oct 15 18:14:24 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 16 Oct 2002 01:14:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 31065 invoked from network); 16 Oct 2002 01:14:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Oct 2002 01:14:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Oct 2002 01:14:23 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-88-233.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.233]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g9G19CjR024391 for ; Tue, 15 Oct 2002 20:09:14 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <007a01c274b1$c01302e0$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC gone from 710 WOR (at least for now) Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 20:17:07 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Somehow I doubt this is the case, but big companies have done things like this before. Don't know enough about it to prove one way or the other, but if YOU do... wouldn't it be great if we found out they were and could throw a monkey wrench into the works? ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "jsgilst" > Since Linux is GPL ought to see if the iBiquity code is violating the > GPL license by linking to the GPL libraries. If so this coud be a > stumbling block for iBiquity. From stodd@sherbtel.net Tue Oct 15 18:19:25 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 16 Oct 2002 01:19:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 31551 invoked from network); 16 Oct 2002 01:19:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Oct 2002 01:19:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Oct 2002 01:19:23 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-88-233.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.233]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g9G1EDjR025484 for ; Tue, 15 Oct 2002 20:14:14 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <008901c274b2$7358df00$d3a9fea9@me> To: Subject: WOKY Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 20:22:07 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I can't reveal where I heard this, but the engineer at WOKY (AMS 920, nostalgia format) in Milwaukee has been defying an order to turn off the CQUAM. Good radio engineers are hard to find, and this guy appears to be using that fact to his advantage. :) Scott Todd [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From dav259@csiro.au Tue Oct 15 18:49:20 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 16 Oct 2002 01:49:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 75255 invoked from network); 16 Oct 2002 01:49:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Oct 2002 01:49:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Oct 2002 01:49:18 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9G1nHP11027 for ; Wed, 16 Oct 2002 11:49:17 +1000 (EST) Date: Wed, 16 Oct 2002 11:49:17 +1000 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Why didn't anyone tell me about this??? In-Reply-To: <20021015194922.9243.qmail@web40802.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public On Tue, 15 Oct 2002, JNR wrote: > Rush Flings Verbal Dung - 10/7 - Heard via WMAL > at 12:25 PM on Monday. Rush Limbaugh said the > word "sh*t" on the air. In context it's used here sparingly by both callers (who are not necessarily cut off even being on 7 second delay) and presenters. There's only two great No-Nos. But occasionally they even get through on Community station 3RRR. 3AW's breakfast duo have coined a new word "bulltish" and it's becomming quite a popular expression here. eg. IBOC is bulltish From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Oct 15 19:38:13 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 16 Oct 2002 02:38:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 53736 invoked from network); 16 Oct 2002 02:38:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Oct 2002 02:38:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Oct 2002 02:38:12 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.129] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Oct 2002 02:38:11 -0000 Date: Wed, 16 Oct 2002 02:38:11 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Help liberate WMTR & WWTR's Stereo sound Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3773 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.70.29 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics First, a little history lesson: 1250 WMTR in Morristown, NJ had been an AM Stereo station for many years -- in fact, they were one of the first in New Jersey to use the C-Quam system in the early '80s, and promoted it on the air throughout the 1990s. Meanwhile, 1170 WBRW was set up in Bridgewater, NJ in 1997 as a brand new 243-watt non-directional daytimer (on a reactivated license of the original WBRW which went dark in 1990), with a Broadcast Electronics BE-500 transmitter with integrated C-Quam exciter, an Optimod 9100 AM Stereo audio processor, and a Stereo audio board in the studio -- but for some reason, WBRW's Stereo was never turned on at the transmitter. In early 1999, 1250 WMTR bought out 1170 WBRW with the intention of using it as a simulcast of their Nostalgia music format, and they changed 1170's call letters to WWTR to match. However, just weeks before the simulcast began, 1250 WMTR dropped their AM Stereo signal, and Stereo has never been heard from them since then. Meanwhile, 1170 WWTR also remains in mono. However, just today I got a reply back from a fellow who works for WMTR/WWTR, and he says that both stations are producing full Stereo audio that listeners never have a chance to hear! Both stations have Stereo audio boards and Stereo STLs, and when they are carrying the syndicated Westwood One "Adult Standards" music format, the satellite feed from that service is in full Stereo as well, all the way to the trailer with 1170 WWTR's transmitter in it. Therefore, here are *two* stations that are almost literally a flip of a switch away from broadcasting beautiful AM Stereo sound! But yet, my inquiries about this have only yielded a terse reply that they have "no interest" in broadcasting AM Stereo at either station, even though both are now owned by Greater Media, the company which has remained truly dedicated to top-notch Stereo sound at their flagship stations WCTC 1450 AM Stereo in New Brunswick, NJ and WPEN 950 "Stereo 95 AM" (as they ID on the air) in Philadelphia. I am asking all of you to join me in contacting WMTR/WWTR and let them know that for a very minimal effort, they could have two stations serving their listeners with excellent Stereo sound -- WITHOUT any of the drawbacks that IBOC/"HD" digital clearly demonstrates through its use at nearby 710 WOR in NYC. WMTR's web site at http://www.wmtram.com/ has an online feedback form, but it simply redirects to the e-mail address of Chris Edwards, who I believe is the General Manager of these stations (as well as WDHA 105.5 FM). You can e-mail him at: cedwards@wmtr-wdha.com I just find it very ironic that WMTR/WWTR is producing this beautiful Stereo sound that only their own employees get to hear! That is like producing a TV show in color and then airing it in black & white! Here are a some excerpts from the e-mail I got from the station employee today. > Hi there, Kevin! > > The board at WWTR is set up for stereo for those devices which send > to the board in stereo. > > The CDs and the feed from the T-1 line from Morrostown are stereo > (when they're playing music, I can hear the stereo separation in > the board feed). I can set the headphones or studio monitors for > PGM (which monitors the board) and hear the sources in stereo. > There is a "mono mix" meter on the board, which I never noticed > activated until WMTR began simulcasting, so maybe someone set up > the board to mix the stereo inputs after the PGM and send it to the > transmitter in mono, I'm not sure. > <> > > Actually, they did completely re-do the broadcast studio in early > 2000 in Morristown and moved a lot of stuff around. The board in > Morristown is stereo, and the signal is fed to WWTR in stereo. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Oct 15 19:49:29 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 16 Oct 2002 02:49:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 68959 invoked from network); 16 Oct 2002 02:49:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Oct 2002 02:49:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Oct 2002 02:49:29 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.170] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Oct 2002 02:49:29 -0000 Date: Wed, 16 Oct 2002 02:49:28 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: 900 CHML, 1520 WWKB, 1540 WPTR Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3DAC2C46.21825.CD8A28@localhost> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1944 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.70.29 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Our records show that CHML has had a stereo exciter going back to > at least 1996 -- whether it's on or not, I don't know. Tonight I can report that Entercom-owned 1520 WWKB in Buffalo, NY is sending out an AM Stereo signal (but with their usual mono talk programming). I couldn't pick up 900 CHML, as tonight seems to be a very "dead" night for the ionosphere -- local stations are coming in unusually loud and clear, even on the "graveyard" channels, and the usual 50 kW clear channels are either very weak or non-existent. > Can't speak for WWKB, but I know that WPTR has been suffering from > interference problems with a station on my side of the 49th that > has apparently not been reducing power at night. On 1540 I hear some sort of "ethnic" music which almost sounds like 1540 WNWR, a 50,000-watt Ethnic daytimer in the Philly area, however if they were really on the air at night with that signal I surely would hear them much more clearly here in NJ. > They noticed that the interference was worse when in stereo so they > switched off the pilot and put the transmitter in mono until > this issue is resolved - expect to hear the pilot again in the > hopefully not too distant future. Crawford stations such as 1540 WPTR make use of a special trick to "eliminate" platform motion for local listeners, by shifting the carrier about 15 Hz off center (while still keeping within the FCC's +/- 20 Hz tolerance). The side effect of this is that while it may improve the signal for local listeners, nighttime skywave DX listeners are treated to a very "fluttery" signal that is hard to hear during signal fades and is difficult for a radio to lock onto AM Stereo mode. In this case, the folks at WPTR may want to check if this carrier offset is actually hurting their local signal in this case. The interfering station may have its own carrier off-set a bit, causing an unharmonious blend of the two signals. From groucho@skyweb.net Tue Oct 15 21:32:12 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 16 Oct 2002 04:32:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 32185 invoked from network); 16 Oct 2002 04:32:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Oct 2002 04:32:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Oct 2002 04:32:11 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g9G4Yftq093562 for ; Wed, 16 Oct 2002 00:34:42 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DACEA16.BE5ED4EA@skyweb.net> Date: Wed, 16 Oct 2002 00:24:55 -0400 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Help liberate WMTR & WWTR's Stereo sound References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 the Chief Engineer for WCTC greater media who also handles the FM's WMGQ, WRAT Im sure also handles the 2 stations we are talking about.. his name is Keith Smeal I know him personally.. Next Time I see Him I can ask.. "Kevin T." wrote: > First, a little history lesson: 1250 WMTR in Morristown, NJ had been > an AM Stereo station for many years -- in fact, they were one of the > first in New Jersey to use the C-Quam system in the early '80s, and > promoted it on the air throughout the 1990s. > > Meanwhile, 1170 WBRW was set up in Bridgewater, NJ in 1997 as a brand > new 243-watt non-directional daytimer (on a reactivated license of > the original WBRW which went dark in 1990), with a Broadcast > Electronics BE-500 transmitter with integrated C-Quam exciter, an > Optimod 9100 AM Stereo audio processor, and a Stereo audio board in > the studio -- but for some reason, WBRW's Stereo was never turned on > at the transmitter. > > In early 1999, 1250 WMTR bought out 1170 WBRW with the intention of > using it as a simulcast of their Nostalgia music format, and they > changed 1170's call letters to WWTR to match. However, just weeks > before the simulcast began, 1250 WMTR dropped their AM Stereo signal, > and Stereo has never been heard from them since then. Meanwhile, > 1170 WWTR also remains in mono. > > However, just today I got a reply back from a fellow who works for > WMTR/WWTR, and he says that both stations are producing full Stereo > audio that listeners never have a chance to hear! Both stations have > Stereo audio boards and Stereo STLs, and when they are carrying the > syndicated Westwood One "Adult Standards" music format, the satellite > feed from that service is in full Stereo as well, all the way to the > trailer with 1170 WWTR's transmitter in it. > > Therefore, here are *two* stations that are almost literally a flip > of a switch away from broadcasting beautiful AM Stereo sound! But > yet, my inquiries about this have only yielded a terse reply that > they have "no interest" in broadcasting AM Stereo at either station, > even though both are now owned by Greater Media, the company which > has remained truly dedicated to top-notch Stereo sound at their > flagship stations WCTC 1450 AM Stereo in New Brunswick, NJ and WPEN > 950 "Stereo 95 AM" (as they ID on the air) in Philadelphia. > > I am asking all of you to join me in contacting WMTR/WWTR and let > them know that for a very minimal effort, they could have two > stations serving their listeners with excellent Stereo sound -- > WITHOUT any of the drawbacks that IBOC/"HD" digital clearly > demonstrates through its use at nearby 710 WOR in NYC. WMTR's web > site at http://www.wmtram.com/ has an online feedback form, but it > simply redirects to the e-mail address of Chris Edwards, who I > believe is the General Manager of these stations (as well as WDHA > 105.5 FM). You can e-mail him at: cedwards@wmtr-wdha.com > > I just find it very ironic that WMTR/WWTR is producing this beautiful > Stereo sound that only their own employees get to hear! That is like > producing a TV show in color and then airing it in black & white! > > Here are a some excerpts from the e-mail I got from the station > employee today. > > > Hi there, Kevin! > > > > The board at WWTR is set up for stereo for those devices which send > > to the board in stereo. > > > > The CDs and the feed from the T-1 line from Morrostown are stereo > > (when they're playing music, I can hear the stereo separation in > > the board feed). I can set the headphones or studio monitors for > > PGM (which monitors the board) and hear the sources in stereo. > > There is a "mono mix" meter on the board, which I never noticed > > activated until WMTR began simulcasting, so maybe someone set up > > the board to mix the stereo inputs after the PGM and send it to the > > transmitter in mono, I'm not sure. > > > <> > > > > Actually, they did completely re-do the broadcast studio in early > > 2000 in Morristown and moved a lot of stuff around. The board in > > Morristown is stereo, and the signal is fed to WWTR in stereo. > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From jwelton@nautel.com Wed Oct 16 05:24:27 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jwelton@nautel.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 16 Oct 2002 12:24:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 89164 invoked from network); 16 Oct 2002 12:24:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Oct 2002 12:24:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailserver.nautel.com) (24.222.4.134) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Oct 2002 12:24:26 -0000 Received: FROM jeff-welton BY mailserver.nautel.com ; Wed Oct 16 09:26:56 2002 -0300 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Date: Wed, 16 Oct 2002 09:23:03 -0300 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: 900 CHML, 1520 WWKB, 1540 WPTR Message-ID: <3DAD2FF2.5844.467651@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: References: <3DAC2C46.21825.CD8A28@localhost> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.02) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body From: "Jeff Welton" Reply-To: jwelton@nautel.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=26918678 > carrier about 15 Hz off center (while still keeping within the FCC's > +/- 20 Hz tolerance). > In this case, the folks at WPTR may want to check if this carrier > offset is actually hurting their local signal in this case. Actually, it's 10 Hz in WPTR's case, and their engineer tells me that was the first thing he tried. Switching the pilot off and putting the transmitter in mono mode was a last resort. At present they are apparently going through the channels trying to get the issue resolved under the international agreements. Regards, Jeff Welton Nautel Customer Service Dept. Tel.: 1-902-823-3900 ext. 127 Fax: 1-902-823-3183 email: jwelton@nautel.com From amstereo@optushome.com.au Wed Oct 16 05:39:59 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereo@optushome.com.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 16 Oct 2002 12:39:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 74132 invoked from network); 16 Oct 2002 12:39:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Oct 2002 12:39:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail011.syd.optusnet.com.au) (210.49.20.139) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Oct 2002 12:39:58 -0000 Received: from unit (c17302.ipswc1.qld.optusnet.com.au [210.49.44.162]) by mail011.syd.optusnet.com.au (8.11.1/8.11.1) with SMTP id g9GCdvN04756 for ; Wed, 16 Oct 2002 22:39:57 +1000 Message-ID: <000801c27511$20d06fa0$1a02a8c0@unit> To: References: <1034763125.1733.64140.m12@yahoogroups.com> Subject: symphony Date: Wed, 16 Oct 2002 22:39:54 +1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "amstereo - matt2" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=105920058 X-Yahoo-Profile: voltar_e Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Someone should remind motorolaq that philips is creating a chipset similar to the motorola, and that it's gonna be very similar, and that for motorolas chipset to stand out, they need to use am stereo as standard (then send the same thing in reverse to philips) i sent this to motorola and got the following responce -----Original Message----- ]To: Karen Bartell ]Subject: motorola / Philips DSP chips. ] ] ]Dear Karen, ] ]My names Matt bone from ipswich Auastralia, I've been informed that both motorola and Philips ]are each working on DSP AM/FM decoder chipsets. ] ]The way i see it, digital radio is going to flop, analogue radio will stay and florrish BUT only witht he ]support of companies like your self and philips. ] ]Both companies are designing chipsets that decode digitally, both have am-stereo as an option. ]This is see is going to be a slight problem. how are manufacturers going to choose between ] motorola's chips and Philips chips when the features are very similar. ] ]I have 2 motorola decoders here, one an MC13020 on an old Philips radio, and an MC13028 in a ] tuner i moded, and they both work brillient. I belive Philips will be the first to release an AM ] Stereo radio because they manufacture the tuners not just the chips. ] ] ]See, I heard a new Sony car radio the other day, and i sware to god, the AM section would all but ]be removed if sony had a choice, it sounded lifless, dull, boring, you couldn't hear the s's when ] words used them, it was pathetic, yet i have a deskside clock radio that produces a much wider ]frequency responce, why do manufacturers not care anymore? i dunno. ] ]anyway, if you add amstereo AS STANDARD, your chipset would stand out from the philips range, ] i want AM to servive, it has much better programming. ]theres alot of us am listeners, and were all appalled at the sinking quality on AM. LET IT LIVE. ]And please, no cut-and-paste reply i've seen it before. ] ]thanks, Matt. ] ]PS. how much extra is it to add amstereo to each chipset for manufacturersHi Matt, Karens reply Sorry, but the only answers I do have are "canned." First, we do not have the software done for C-QUAM. We have the algorithms, but have not yet coded. We have not had any requests from our key customers, including Japan, which is normally where the highest requirements come from. When, an if, we code, it will be trivial for a manufacturer to include AM stereo. The response to Symphony Digital Radio has been so strong, we have had to limit sampling, so we can provide the support our customers expect. Chipset sampling has been restricted to customers who will be building 1MU+ Symphony Digital Radios in 2003. General sampling and evaluation kit availability will be in 2Q03. I hope this helps. Thanks for your interest! Best regards, Karen --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.394 / Virus Database: 224 - Release Date: 3/10/2002 [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Oct 16 06:42:03 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 16 Oct 2002 13:42:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 29783 invoked from network); 16 Oct 2002 13:42:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Oct 2002 13:42:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Oct 2002 13:42:02 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-89-228.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.228]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g9GDapjR012741 for ; Wed, 16 Oct 2002 08:36:52 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <001901c2751a$32fc7300$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: <3DACEA16.BE5ED4EA@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Help liberate WMTR & WWTR's Stereo sound Date: Wed, 16 Oct 2002 08:44:47 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Please let him know that folks notice when the pilot is off. Wouldn't that be great if we could add two more stations to the AMS list just like that? Worse come to worse, ask him if you could flip the switch yourself. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Neal Newman" > the Chief Engineer for WCTC greater media who also handles the FM's WMGQ, > WRAT > Im sure also handles the 2 stations we are talking about.. his name is Keith > Smeal > I know him personally.. Next Time I see Him I can ask.. From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Oct 16 06:47:48 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 16 Oct 2002 13:47:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 38724 invoked from network); 16 Oct 2002 13:47:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Oct 2002 13:47:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Oct 2002 13:47:48 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-89-228.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.228]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g9GDgajR014116 for ; Wed, 16 Oct 2002 08:42:38 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <002301c2751b$01672960$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: <1034763125.1733.64140.m12@yahoogroups.com> <000801c27511$20d06fa0$1a02a8c0@unit> Subject: Re: {AMSF} symphony Date: Wed, 16 Oct 2002 08:50:32 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude At this point, it looks as only the Omega will have AMS. Let's hope they release theirs far enough in advance of Motorola's. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "amstereo - matt2" > Someone should remind motorolaq that philips is creating a chipset similar to the motorola, and that it's gonna be very similar, and that for motorolas chipset to stand out, they need to use am stereo as standard > First, we do not have the software done for C-QUAM. We have the algorithms, but have not yet coded. We have not had any requests from our key customers, including Japan, which is normally where the highest requirements come from. When, an if, we code, it will be trivial for a manufacturer to include AM stereo. From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Wed Oct 16 07:24:53 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 16 Oct 2002 14:24:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 11229 invoked from network); 16 Oct 2002 14:24:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Oct 2002 14:24:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14202.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.144) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Oct 2002 14:24:51 -0000 Message-ID: <20021016142451.86591.qmail@web14202.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.45.202.244] by web14202.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 16 Oct 2002 07:24:51 PDT Date: Wed, 16 Oct 2002 07:24:51 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Engineering Question on stereo audio for AMS To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: Johnny Electron X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio Bob Carter, Scott Todd, MJR etc... Does the Motorola (and Harris, BE, etc) C-Quam exciters generate the L-R signal, that is, can you just pipe in the discrete Left Channel Audio and Right Channel Audio and the Exciter generates the L-R for the C-Quam and L+R for the transmitter, or do you have to input L, R, L-R, and L+R from another audio source (ie audio processor)besides the exciter? If L-R needs to be external, is there an inexpensive way to generate it without having to spend big bucks on an Orban 9100 or CRL etc? Also, where exactly in the chain should you place the Modulation Monitor for accurate measurements? J.P. __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Faith Hill - Exclusive Performances, Videos & More http://faith.yahoo.com From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Oct 16 07:26:56 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 16 Oct 2002 14:26:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 87987 invoked from network); 16 Oct 2002 14:26:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Oct 2002 14:26:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Oct 2002 14:26:55 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-89-228.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.228]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g9GELijR024031 for ; Wed, 16 Oct 2002 09:21:45 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <003e01c27520$786e6820$d3a9fea9@me> To: Subject: Ford radios Date: Wed, 16 Oct 2002 09:29:40 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I'm attempting to identify a Ford radio that has EB and AMS, plus will fit the opening in my 93 Escort. I know the ones with B165 in the part number have at least AMS, but I've seen some purported premium systems with B132 in the p/n. I can't remember whether those were mono or not. Was it all premium radios all had AMS in that era, but those with B132 p/n on a non-premium radio mono? Chris, I know you're busy as ever, but I think you know the answer. Unfortunately people selling these radios on ebay are pretty clueless as to what they have. ST [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From groucho@skyweb.net Wed Oct 16 07:37:52 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 16 Oct 2002 14:37:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 35905 invoked from network); 16 Oct 2002 14:37:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Oct 2002 14:37:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Oct 2002 14:37:51 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g9GEeKtq037319 for ; Wed, 16 Oct 2002 10:40:20 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DAD7810.6C2CC596@skyweb.net> Date: Wed, 16 Oct 2002 10:30:40 -0400 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com" Subject: just a note Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Hello guys. after reading a response from motorola to a member Of this group I was compelled to write to Karen again at motorola here is what I recieved along with what I sent her... ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Hi Neal, Thanks again for your continuing interest. You obviously know your stuff! Best regards, Karen -----Original Message----- From: Neal Newman [mailto:groucho@skyweb.net] Sent: Wednesday, October 16, 2002 8:33 AM To: Bartell Karen-r7aalh Subject: Chipset programing Hello again Karen Thank you for your response to my request on the new Symphony chip set. I think Motorola is missing the point on this new chip set. As a broadcast engineer and partner in an AM stereo Station. the investment is minimal. I have personally seen I.B.O.C. as a total failure before the Fcc even approved it Foolishly last week. the reason I know this is that my station was one of the first test stations for AM I.B.O.C. now WOR in NY is running tests with I.B.O.C. and it was totally trashing the AM band for miles. until the I.B.O.C. exciter crashed. I don't know much more about 1mu+ Symphony. But If its I.B.O.C. related its going to fail. AM Stereo in the Minds of many out there think It Failed. my point is If it failed why are there so many stations still broadcasting in AM Stereo? and why are more engineers like myself trying to Add AM Stereo to our stations? the reason for this is because AM Stereo sounds great when its set-up correctly. So in your response you said and I quote: "We have not had any requests from our key customers, including Japan, which is normally where the highest requirements come from." I know that you know this.. but JAPAN is a Country not a key customer... Sony, Panasonic, Philips would be customers... as I know It. along with the U.S.A Australia and Canada ,and JAPAN have a big selection of radio stations transmitting In AM Stereo. but no radios available to the listening public. I as well as You know the end line Customers are the listeners not the radio manufacturers. If manufacturers don't request it. Its not added. and if its not added there are no radios for Listeners to use Thus making AM Stereo a dead issues as many feel it is. however those listeners that have modified radios to Get AMstereo are telling their Friends.and its spreading like fire. I cannot keep up with the requests for AM stereo modifications. If I had the finances I would become a radio manufacturer and produce Symphony Digital with Cquam capable radios ... A light just lit up. How about motorola financing this project. wishful thinking. Never happen In order for listeners to write to the manufacturers that will include the new chip set to ask for CQuam. we Need a List Of the manufacturers not the name of a Country... I know its realistic that motorola wont give out its clients names. But we Engineers are trying To jump on the bandwagon to re-light AM Stereo just before AM Digital radio (I.B.O.C.) falls flat on its face. Just remember you heard it here first. as I have recently read seems that Philips radio is also trying for a New digital Chip set. and I'm about to go push them also for Cquam. I just home the Folks at motorola know what they are doing Because it would Be a Huge mistake to create this chip set without the Cquam option. at least If the chip set has It. and its just the option of grounding 1 lead to turn it on or off. that would Be Fine would make life easier For us Engineers to modify the radios Of manufactures who opt Not to add a Cquam on off switch.for our listeners. In the Long run Karen.. its the Listeners that count not the manufacturers. many do not know about AM stereo. But those that do swear by it. Just hope you Folks make the Right Choice and not be penny wise dollar foolish. Again Respectfully Submitted Neal Newman From groucho@skyweb.net Wed Oct 16 07:47:21 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 16 Oct 2002 14:47:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 34760 invoked from network); 16 Oct 2002 14:47:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Oct 2002 14:47:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Oct 2002 14:47:21 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g9GEnqtq041193 for ; Wed, 16 Oct 2002 10:49:52 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DAD7A4C.3C8BED7C@skyweb.net> Date: Wed, 16 Oct 2002 10:40:12 -0400 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Engineering Question on stereo audio for AMS References: <20021016142451.86591.qmail@web14202.mail.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Hello Johnny I have the Harris AM Stereo exciter on My transmitter and It has a left and Right input and a L+R output along with the OSC output Via BNC. so the Exciter acts as the OSC to drive the transmitter. this also contains the L-R modulated sidebands. and the L+R output gets connected to the standard transmitter audio input. so I believe to answer your question you can connect your Left and Right channels directly to the exciter without a processor. and It will split them to L-R,L+R I dont know if the motorola exciter Does this. But the Harris Does Neal Newman Chief Engineer WTTM 1680 am stereo Johnny Electron wrote: > Bob Carter, Scott Todd, MJR etc... > Does the Motorola (and Harris, BE, etc) C-Quam exciters generate the L-R > signal, that is, can you just pipe in the discrete Left Channel Audio and Right > Channel Audio and the Exciter generates the L-R for the C-Quam and L+R for the > transmitter, or do you have to input L, R, L-R, and L+R from another audio > source (ie audio processor)besides the exciter? > > If L-R needs to be external, is there an inexpensive way to generate it without > having to spend big bucks on an Orban 9100 or CRL etc? > > Also, where exactly in the chain should you place the Modulation Monitor for > accurate measurements? > > J.P. > > __________________________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Faith Hill - Exclusive Performances, Videos & More > http://faith.yahoo.com > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Oct 16 08:03:07 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 16 Oct 2002 15:03:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 16272 invoked from network); 16 Oct 2002 14:54:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Oct 2002 14:54:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Oct 2002 14:54:08 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-89-228.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.228]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g9GEmvjR001363 for ; Wed, 16 Oct 2002 09:48:58 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <004601c27524$45e679c0$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: <3DAD7810.6C2CC596@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} just a note Date: Wed, 16 Oct 2002 09:56:54 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude GREAT points, Neal. Wish I had asked that myself. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Neal Newman" > Hello guys. after reading a response from motorola to a member Of this > group > I was compelled to write to Karen again From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Oct 16 08:20:22 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 16 Oct 2002 15:20:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 9901 invoked from network); 16 Oct 2002 15:09:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Oct 2002 15:09:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Oct 2002 15:09:55 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-88-152.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.152]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g9GF4ijR005669 for ; Wed, 16 Oct 2002 10:04:45 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <000001c27526$7a137de0$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: <20021016142451.86591.qmail@web14202.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Engineering Question on stereo audio for AMS Date: Wed, 16 Oct 2002 10:03:51 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Don't know about the Harris or BE, but I suspect they will be the same as the Motorola- terminals are for discrete R and L. The matrixing is done internally. Even the matrix processors output discrete R and L in the final product. Best place to monitor is usually provided by a coil in the transmitter itself, specifically placed to sample the output. There will be a set of terminals for connecting the mod mon. If monitoring remotely, you'll need an RF amp and antenna. The downside to that is you can often run into interference at night, especially if running low power at a somewhat distant location. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Johnny Electron" > Bob Carter, Scott Todd, MJR etc... > Does the Motorola (and Harris, BE, etc) C-Quam exciters generate the L-R > signal, that is, can you just pipe in the discrete Left Channel Audio and Right > Channel Audio and the Exciter generates the L-R for the C-Quam and L+R for the > transmitter, or do you have to input L, R, L-R, and L+R from another audio > source (ie audio processor)besides the exciter? From michaelj@vcn.com Wed Oct 16 08:47:43 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 16 Oct 2002 15:47:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 77969 invoked from network); 16 Oct 2002 15:47:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Oct 2002 15:47:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m1-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Oct 2002 15:47:42 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m1-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Wed, 16 Oct 2002 09:47:42 -0600 Message-ID: <000b01c2752b$5c5c6dc0$0701010a@keva> To: References: <20021016142451.86591.qmail@web14202.mail.yahoo.com> <000001c27526$7a137de0$d3a9fea9@me> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Engineering Question on stereo audio for AMS Date: Wed, 16 Oct 2002 09:47:40 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Yeah what they said :) Mine's the same way. Exciter has L and R inputs. The exciter itself generates the L+R output and the L-R signal that goes into the transmitter's oscillator input. Modulation monitor is hooked directly to the transmitter or to the RF amplifier if your transmitter is out at a remote location. That's how it workies! MJR ----- Original Message ----- From: Scott Todd To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, October 16, 2002 9:03 AM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Engineering Question on stereo audio for AMS Don't know about the Harris or BE, but I suspect they will be the same as the Motorola- terminals are for discrete R and L. The matrixing is done internally. Even the matrix processors output discrete R and L in the final product. Best place to monitor is usually provided by a coil in the transmitter itself, specifically placed to sample the output. There will be a set of terminals for connecting the mod mon. If monitoring remotely, you'll need an RF amp and antenna. The downside to that is you can often run into interference at night, especially if running low power at a somewhat distant location. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Johnny Electron" > Bob Carter, Scott Todd, MJR etc... > Does the Motorola (and Harris, BE, etc) C-Quam exciters generate the L-R > signal, that is, can you just pipe in the discrete Left Channel Audio and Right > Channel Audio and the Exciter generates the L-R for the C-Quam and L+R for the > transmitter, or do you have to input L, R, L-R, and L+R from another audio > source (ie audio processor)besides the exciter? Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ADVERTISEMENT Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From michaelj@vcn.com Wed Oct 16 09:07:31 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 16 Oct 2002 16:07:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 17012 invoked from network); 16 Oct 2002 16:07:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Oct 2002 16:07:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m3-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.33) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Oct 2002 16:07:26 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m3-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Wed, 16 Oct 2002 10:07:26 -0600 Message-ID: <001301c2752e$1e5c3520$0701010a@keva> To: References: <003e01c27520$786e6820$d3a9fea9@me> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Ford radios Date: Wed, 16 Oct 2002 10:07:25 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Good luck Scott! I have a Ford at home sitting on the shelf. Due to no pin-outs and no connector, I don't have a clue if it's AMS or not. I picked it up at a thrift store for $3. It looks nice, though. AM/FM Cassette. Beware.....I'm not sure about the '93's but I know the late 80s and early 90s had the older style (sounds like the style you have) that had the brackets hanging off the top and bottom for mounting. The newer radios don't. Yes, they're the same SIZE, so it'll fit, but may not have brackets to be screwed in. I know this because a former girlfriend of mine had an 87 Escort. I put a newer Ford radio in there (her cassette didn't work on the old one) and had to kinda retro-fit a few screws to hold it in place. I guess I'll have to check the model number on that one radio that I have. Who knows....maybe it's been sitting there all this time and it's AMS. I know the plugs on the back are not the standard Ford type....or at least not like the ones in her '87 Escort. This one looks a lot newer. Just on small connector on the rear with small pins. MJR n WYO ----- Original Message ----- From: Scott Todd To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, October 16, 2002 8:29 AM Subject: {AMSF} Ford radios I'm attempting to identify a Ford radio that has EB and AMS, plus will fit the opening in my 93 Escort. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From yahoo@thompsonhouse.org Wed Oct 16 09:36:14 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: yahoo@thompsonhouse.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 16 Oct 2002 16:36:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 32097 invoked from network); 16 Oct 2002 16:36:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Oct 2002 16:36:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Oct 2002 16:36:13 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.136] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Oct 2002 16:36:13 -0000 Date: Wed, 16 Oct 2002 16:36:13 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: 710 WOR is now 690-730 "WOR-HD" Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 4249 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "coreyatwork" X-Originating-IP: 216.171.155.178 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public I've always thought that IBOC is the wrong technology to apply to the present bands. I think another adaptation of QUAM to deliver digital data (instead of l-r, sorry traditional AM Stereo fans) would have work much better. Applying the right modulation techniques to the digital signal you could get a stable data rate of over 64KBPS that would be transparent to traditional listeners (and staying in the channel). Using an OGG codec (an open codec - no licensing fees) you could get "FM" quality sound from the 64K stream (or 3 to 6 talk shows at lower bit rates). As far as the FM side, I would use the entire spectrum above the MPX, (where the RDS, and SCA currently reside 53 KHz-100 KHz) to deliver a 128K to 256K stream (might get more using the right moduation technique). With the right codec, this would give "CD" quality audio. After this type "FM" digital became popular, stations could be given the option to stop MPX broadcasting and use the spectrum above 19 Khz to deliver even faster datarates (and be compatible with analog radios, though they would loose stereo at that point) I am more upset that the FCC is making propriatary the "rule". If I understand the ruling it gives iBiquity exculsive rights to the digital broadcasting standard (until their patent runs out). I have always thought that broadcasting standards should be open standards for all to have equal access to, not one company to have exclusive rights to. --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin T." wrote: > As WOR puts a flamethrower signal in my direction here in central NJ, > I had a good listen to their "HD" signal today. Regardless of how > narrow-bandwidth your radio is, the "splatter" onto adjacent channels > is horrible! Even on a regular AM radio, I tune in 690, 700, 720, or > 730 kHz and all I hear is "HISSSSSSS". > > While the "HD" signal is active during the daytime, WOR does limit > their analog audio to 5 kHz of response, and since the digital > subcarriers are sucking up part of their modulation, it also sounds > noticeably QUIETER than the other 50,000-watt NYC stations, such as > nearby 660 WFAN and 770 WABC. > > When received on a Sony SRF-A100 in Wide Bandwidth mode, you can > truly see the digital subcarriers of WOR's signal extending up to > 15 kHz in the audio graph: > > http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/wor-hd.gif > > Most of it is phase-modulated, so in Mono mode you don't hear the > digital noise that much, but in "forced" AM Stereo mode -- whether it > be C-Quam or Kahn mode -- you can clearly hear a large amount of > background hiss and static as well as an annoying "motorboating" > noise. It basically sounds like an ordinary AM signal being > interfered by a computer or other RF-noisy device -- but no matter > how strong the signal is, the noise never goes away... until sunset, > when they switch it off! > > I managed to catch WOR's "HD" switch-off at 6:15 PM (current NYC > sunset time) today, as recieved on the Sony in wide bandwidth Stereo > mode: > > http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/wor-hd.mp3 > > The interesting thing is that when they switch back to analog, the > audio response is increased from 5 kHz to just over 6 kHz, which only > sounds a little bit better. Perhaps they don't want to make the > change too jarring, as it would be if they stepped up to the full > 10 kHz analog bandwidth they were transmitting before they started > using IBOC/"HD". > > For any of you who can hear WOR's signal via skywave DX before they > switch off the "HD" at 6:15 PM, or just after local NYC sunrise in > the morning when they switch it on, I would be interested in > reception reports and/or recordings of how this is affecting > reception of the 690-730 kHz range. I suppose a worse-case scenario > is a time when both 700 WLW and 710 WOR are putting out "HD" signals > simultaneously -- they would pretty much wipe each other out with the > "HISSSSS"! > > p.s. This afternoon, 710 WOR was broadcasting a sports event that was > also being aired on local WCTC 1450 AM STEREO. I do have a recording > of me flipping back and forth between these two stations on the Sony, > which I will also upload soon for all to hear and compare! From kevtronics@yahoo.com Wed Oct 16 11:01:48 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 16 Oct 2002 18:01:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 8281 invoked from network); 16 Oct 2002 18:01:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Oct 2002 18:01:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.86) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Oct 2002 18:01:48 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.166] by n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Oct 2002 18:01:48 -0000 Date: Wed, 16 Oct 2002 18:01:47 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Optimod 9200 on eBay Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 446 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics Here is an Optimod 9200 mono AM audio processor on eBay... current bid price is $204.49, which is about all I'd pay for a mono processor that doesn't sound as loud or clean as the Stereo-capable 9100-B2.... http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=913712142 Oddly enough, if you go to Orban's web site, they say that the Stereo 9100 provides FM-quality sound from AM radios, while they make no such claim about the mono 9200.... From groucho@skyweb.net Wed Oct 16 12:27:55 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 16 Oct 2002 19:27:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 77229 invoked from network); 16 Oct 2002 19:27:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Oct 2002 19:27:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Oct 2002 19:27:53 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g9GJUODr063267 for ; Wed, 16 Oct 2002 15:30:24 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DADBC0D.7ABAA529@skyweb.net> Date: Wed, 16 Oct 2002 15:20:45 -0400 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Optimod 9200 on eBay References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 > as a User of a 9100B I will say Bob Orban is right... My Audio sounds as > good or better than some local Fm stations.. and it Is louder than the 9200 > I have on WHWH with the same amount Of modulation go figure Neal > Oddly enough, if you go to Orban's web site, they say that the Stereo > 9100 provides FM-quality sound from AM radios, while they make no > such claim about the mono 9200.... From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Oct 16 14:33:19 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 16 Oct 2002 21:33:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 54120 invoked from network); 16 Oct 2002 21:33:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Oct 2002 21:33:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Oct 2002 21:33:18 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-89-68.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.68]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g9GLS7jR026030 for ; Wed, 16 Oct 2002 16:28:08 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <001901c2755b$ab715440$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: <003e01c27520$786e6820$d3a9fea9@me> <001301c2752e$1e5c3520$0701010a@keva> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Ford radios Date: Wed, 16 Oct 2002 16:33:26 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Mine has a hole near each corner for removal. Do the bracketed radios have those too? I had a short-lived Geo Metro where the radio just fit into the hole, and removal was merely a matter of putting stiff wire or even nails of the right diameter into them and pulling it out. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael J. Richard" I'm not sure about the '93's but I know the late 80s and early 90s had the older style (sounds like the style you have) that had the brackets hanging off the top and bottom for mounting. The newer radios don't. Yes, they're the same SIZE, so it'll fit, but may not have brackets to be screwed in. From michaelj@vcn.com Wed Oct 16 14:38:00 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 16 Oct 2002 21:37:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 70469 invoked from network); 16 Oct 2002 21:37:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Oct 2002 21:37:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m1-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Oct 2002 21:37:59 -0000 Received: from michael (vcn28.usrtc-1.evan.wy.vcn.com [209.193.86.32]) by m1-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Wed, 16 Oct 2002 15:37:58 -0600 To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} Ford radios Date: Wed, 16 Oct 2002 15:37:48 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <001901c2755b$ab715440$d3a9fea9@me> From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Yep. I think that's how the newer ones are. I think the one I have at home is like that. I basically take a couple of pieces of a coat hanger and bend them into a V and use them to pull that kind out of there. That's kinda what I was talking about.....if ya have to go with a newer one, you might have to retrofit something to hold it in place. Now as far as FITTING in the hole, yeah it should fit right in. Good luck! Mike -----Original Message----- From: Scott Todd [mailto:stodd@sherbtel.net] Sent: Wednesday, October 16, 2002 3:33 PM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Ford radios Mine has a hole near each corner for removal. Do the bracketed radios have those too? I had a short-lived Geo Metro where the radio just fit into the hole, and removal was merely a matter of putting stiff wire or even nails of the right diameter into them and pulling it out. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael J. Richard" I'm not sure about the '93's but I know the late 80s and early 90s had the older style (sounds like the style you have) that had the brackets hanging off the top and bottom for mounting. The newer radios don't. Yes, they're the same SIZE, so it'll fit, but may not have brackets to be screwed in. Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ADVERTISEMENT Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From jsgil@hal-pc.org Wed Oct 16 14:53:43 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 16 Oct 2002 21:53:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 85951 invoked from network); 16 Oct 2002 21:53:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Oct 2002 21:53:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.67) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Oct 2002 21:53:42 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.169] by n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Oct 2002 21:53:42 -0000 Date: Wed, 16 Oct 2002 21:53:38 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: 710 WOR is now 690-730 "WOR-HD" Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2521 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.133 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@y..., "coreyatwork" wrote: > I've always thought that IBOC is the wrong technology to apply to the > present bands. I think another adaptation of QUAM to deliver digital > data (instead of l-r, sorry traditional AM Stereo fans) would have > work much better. Applying the right modulation techniques to the > digital signal you could get a stable data rate of over 64KBPS that > would be transparent to traditional listeners (and staying in the > channel). Using an OGG codec (an open codec - no licensing fees) you > could get "FM" quality sound from the 64K stream (or 3 to 6 talk shows > at lower bit rates). > I've actually thought of this also but the separation between the channels in C-QuAM is 30db (3%) on average. The exciter would need to be finely tweaked and the antenna system would need to be optimized for a flat delay time across the passband. A non-directional antenna would work best but directional ones would be harder to get tuned. The same holds true for the receiver. Digital tuners do a good job of making sure that the carrier is in the exact center of the IF filter and that the RF preselector antenna properly tracks 450KHz below the local oscillator. Unlike a QuAM signal where all you need is a good delay symetry between the upper and lower sidebands for good separation C-QuAM also requires the delay response to be as flat as possible to maximize proper C-QuAM to QuAM conversion in the decoder. This is why the ceramic filters used in C-QuAM receivers have a Gaussian response with a very flat Group Delay Time. Any departure from all of these requirements for both transmittion and receptioin will reduce channel separation and thus allow a digital signal on the Q(L-R) channel to bleed over into the envelope(L+R) channel. Add in interference during the nighttime and you get will some reduction in the envelope cancellation of a digital signal on the Q channel. Now what might be a better option is use the Q channel for an analog Second Audio Program. The same issues of separation applies but both signals are analog and it would appear as co-channel interference instead of a digital hash noise. The problem is still the same as IBOC if you put a digital signal on the Q channel in that the interference to other channels is still a problem. Whoever refered to putting a digital signal within the analog broadcast bands as Digital Disaster hit the nail on the head. Analog and digital signals don't mix when they occupy the same space. JSG From KC4QLP@aol.com Wed Oct 16 15:27:29 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 16 Oct 2002 22:27:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 70937 invoked from network); 16 Oct 2002 22:27:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Oct 2002 22:27:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m04.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.7) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Oct 2002 22:27:26 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.6b.6d32f (4328) for ; Wed, 16 Oct 2002 18:27:19 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <6b.6d32f.2adf41c7@aol.com> Date: Wed, 16 Oct 2002 18:27:19 EDT Subject: Re: {AMSF} Help liberate WMTR & WWTR's Stereo sound To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 10/16/02 9:43:43 AM Eastern Daylight Time, stodd@sherbtel.net writes: << Please let him know that folks notice when the pilot is off. Wouldn't that be great if we could add two more stations to the AMS list just like that? Worse come to worse, ask him if you could flip the switch yourself. ST >> It would be better to if he would put his station dead on frequency like everyone else to. Being off ..even by 10hz causes a terrible heterodyne and makes reception of other stations quite annoying..sometimes unlistenable when your in the outskirts of another station on the same frequency. The "beat note-heterodyne" will be the first thing someone hears long before other stations start coming in under them. I speak on experience on this as someone on 970 is off by 10hz and makes listening quite troublesome during PSSA and just before sunset. I've tryed "finding" who it is..but 970 is way to crowded here to get a possitive ID on the offender. With todays receivers,being off frequency isnt necessary anymore. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5..., Ray Communications Radio Network Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereoradio-subcribe@topica.com amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ WARNING TO UNSOLICITED SPAMMERS !!! Pursuant to U.S. Code, title 47, Chapter 5, Subchapter II, "Any and all nonsolicited E-mail (SPAM) sent to this address is subject to a download and archival fee of 500 U.S."!! E-mailing denotes acceptance of these terms." Your message (if actually mailed) is in violation of the Federal Telephone Consumer Protection Act of 1991, and Collateral Code of Federal Regulations (47 CFR 64.1200). The TCPA allows a private right of action against the sender of unsolicited advertising. The recipient can sue for $500, or actualdamages (whichever is greater). ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------- Osama bin Laden can kiss my royal white American behind! From KC4QLP@aol.com Wed Oct 16 15:34:30 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 16 Oct 2002 22:34:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 56201 invoked from network); 16 Oct 2002 22:34:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Oct 2002 22:34:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d02.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.34) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Oct 2002 22:34:29 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_dev1.2.) id r.2d.2522529e (4328) for ; Wed, 16 Oct 2002 18:34:24 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <2d.2522529e.2adf436f@aol.com> Date: Wed, 16 Oct 2002 18:34:23 EDT Subject: Re: {AMSF} Engineering Question on stereo audio for AMS To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 10/16/02 11:20:13 AM Eastern Daylight Time, stodd@sherbtel.net writes: << Don't know about the Harris or BE, but I suspect they will be the same as the Motorola- terminals are for discrete R and L. The matrixing is done internally. Even the matrix processors output discrete R and L in the final product. Best place to monitor is usually provided by a coil in the transmitter itself, specifically placed to sample the output. There will be a set of terminals for connecting the mod mon. If monitoring remotely, you'll need an RF amp and antenna. The downside to that is you can often run into interference at night, especially if running low power at a somewhat distant location. ST >> The Motorola is connected in the same manor and the Harris....so they are pretty much universal. As far as the mod monitor...near the coil works well,but if you have a case like me where you have a main and a backup transmitter..I have a run of RG-6 running to my phasor and at the end of this cable is a loop antenna. This works quite well for when having to switch from one transmitter to another. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5..., Ray Communications Radio Network Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereoradio-subcribe@topica.com amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ WARNING TO UNSOLICITED SPAMMERS !!! Pursuant to U.S. Code, title 47, Chapter 5, Subchapter II, "Any and all nonsolicited E-mail (SPAM) sent to this address is subject to a download and archival fee of 500 U.S."!! E-mailing denotes acceptance of these terms." Your message (if actually mailed) is in violation of the Federal Telephone Consumer Protection Act of 1991, and Collateral Code of Federal Regulations (47 CFR 64.1200). The TCPA allows a private right of action against the sender of unsolicited advertising. The recipient can sue for $500, or actualdamages (whichever is greater). ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------- Osama bin Laden can kiss my royal white American behind! From KC4QLP@aol.com Wed Oct 16 16:00:42 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 16 Oct 2002 23:00:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 85786 invoked from network); 16 Oct 2002 23:00:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Oct 2002 23:00:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d07.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.39) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Oct 2002 23:00:40 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.1e.2b66d3 (4328) for ; Wed, 16 Oct 2002 19:00:23 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <1e.2b66d3.2adf4986@aol.com> Date: Wed, 16 Oct 2002 19:00:22 EDT Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: 710 WOR is now 690-730 "WOR-HD" To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 10/16/02 12:37:22 PM Eastern Daylight Time, yahoo@thompsonhouse.org writes: << I've always thought that IBOC is the wrong technology to apply to the present bands. I think another adaptation of QUAM to deliver digital data (instead of l-r, sorry traditional AM Stereo fans) would have work much better. Applying the right modulation techniques to the digital signal you could get a stable data rate of over 64KBPS that would be transparent to traditional listeners (and staying in the channel). Using an OGG codec (an open codec - no licensing fees) you could get "FM" quality sound from the 64K stream (or 3 to 6 talk shows at lower bit rates). >> Well the whole problem of why the digital stream causes such a mess on either side of a stations carrier is because....well you take an ordinary AM Stereo exciter and try the same thing,put the digital on the L-R and your L+R is your analog feed.....see what type of mess you get.If you'll notice a station operating in stereo will seem "wider" or "splatter" more during the times when "stereo" modulation is being sent.The digital stream never really changes its modulation levels so it stays at a contant loud hiss...often heard "bleeding" through on the analog channel.This is very similar to how these IBOC exciters operate. These so called digital radios have to operate in the forced mode ,just like receiving AM Stereo on a force mode receiver as there is no pilot with IBOC. Now if there was a pilot riding on the carrier to carry the digital stream that would be great!,but there just isnt enough bandwidth to carry this out to provide a high enough bit rate to make it sound decent.There just isnt any way of making the digital transparent on AM ..there just isnt enough bandwidth to do what would need to be done. As fustrating as it is to hear the IBOC mess ...time will "correct" this "deal"...but sadly at the expense of making a mess of the band. With the cost to set up something like this and the economy situation..look for the flame throwers to jump on IBOC for a little while. Not many meduim and small stations will be able to do this. I have a feeling receiver sells wont be as hot as the IBOCers hope they will be. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5..., Ray Communications Radio Network Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereoradio-subcribe@topica.com amstereo-subcribe@topica.com amstereoradio-subscribe@yahoogroups.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ WARNING TO UNSOLICITED SPAMMERS !!! Pursuant to U.S. Code, title 47, Chapter 5, Subchapter II, "Any and all nonsolicited E-mail (SPAM) sent to this address is subject to a download and archival fee of 500 U.S."!! E-mailing denotes acceptance of these terms." Your message (if actually mailed) is in violation of the Federal Telephone Consumer Protection Act of 1991, and Collateral Code of Federal Regulations (47 CFR 64.1200). The TCPA allows a private right of action against the sender of unsolicited advertising. The recipient can sue for $500, or actualdamages (whichever is greater). ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------- Osama bin Laden can kiss my royal white American behind! From redledge78@yahoo.com Wed Oct 16 18:20:37 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: redledge78@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 17 Oct 2002 01:20:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 3558 invoked from network); 17 Oct 2002 01:20:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Oct 2002 01:20:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO proxymail.homerelay.com) (209.75.47.224) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Oct 2002 01:20:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 9748 invoked from network); 17 Oct 2002 01:20:22 -0000 Received: from vtcomm-5.homerelay.com (HELO yahoo.com) (209.75.47.220) by 0 with SMTP; 17 Oct 2002 01:20:22 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Cc: Date: 16 Oct 2002 06:18 -0500 Subject:Re:{AMSF} Digest Number 405 [ Part 4 of 5 ] From: redledge78@yahoo.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=59652447 X-Yahoo-Profile: redledge78 Well, you should listen to Rush more often.... Tom ________________________________________________________________________ ________________________________________________________________________ Message: 9 Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 12:56:44 -0700 (PDT) From: JNR Subject: Re: CHML/900 Here's a present: WTIR/1680 (407) 481-0551. 73, Jay,N1WVQ __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Faith Hill - Exclusive Performances, Videos & More http://faith.yahoo.com ________________________________________________________________________ ________________________________________________________________________ Message: 10 Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 16:03:11 EDT From: KC4QLP@aol.com Subject: Re: Why didn't anyone tell me about this??? In a message dated 10/15/02 3:51:11 PM Eastern Daylight Time, a1asurfradio@yahoo.com writes: << Rush Flings Verbal Dung - 10/7 - Heard via WMAL at 12:25 PM on Monday. Rush Limbaugh said the word "sh*t" on the air. He was expressing frustration at the New York Times and Democrats. He immediately acknowledged his utterance, and asked his listeners to ignore it. No word yet on whether the FCC will issue a fine... >> I've heard worse from various network talk show host and yet the beat goes on...and no one was fined. Seems as if the Fizzled Communications Commission is just that ....."fizzled"! I've heard things on radio that I wouldnt have dreamed of hearing everday 25-30 years ago. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5..., Ray Communications Radio Network Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC From dav259@csiro.au Wed Oct 16 19:27:25 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 17 Oct 2002 02:27:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 93308 invoked from network); 17 Oct 2002 02:27:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Oct 2002 02:27:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Oct 2002 02:27:23 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9H2RLP19617; Thu, 17 Oct 2002 12:27:21 +1000 (EST) Date: Thu, 17 Oct 2002 12:27:21 +1000 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: amstereoforum Cc: Subject: Please write a couple of lines! Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public There is a very good article by Mark Day in todays Australian Media supplement titled "Radio flounders in digital doldrums". It's about the last 12 years of "non-history" (my expression) of digital radio in Oz. Mark Day is arguably the most knowledgeable radio writer in OZ. He was one of the original owners of 3MP - and now has interests in the Ace Broadcasting Network which has several regional licences in Victoria - including AM stereo 3GV. It's a good short history but this paragraph has really upset me!! - - - - - - - But IBOC smacks of another AM stereo. Remember that? In the 1980s, AM stations, desperate to close the quality gap between themselves and FM, installed "exciters" on their transmitters that allegedly split the signal into stereo. It worked only in optimum conditions (I heard it once on my car radio!), but for consumers, it was a total failure. - - - - - - - He's saying AM Stereo DOESN'T WORK! - except in perfect conditions. Well - I have happily listened to it nearly every day for the last 17 years in *all* sorts of conditions. The full article is at: http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,5744,5298763%255E12280,00.html Please go to this page and then at the bottom enter your name, and location (city only) - and then PLEASE write a line or two just stating that AMS most certainly works!!! btw - he sarcastically concludes that it will probably take Australia 30 years (from 1990) to agree upon and launch digital radio - the same length of time it took for us to get commercial FM radio going - and sadly he may be right ... This was my comment: Mark I have happily listened to AM stereo radio almost every day for the last 17 years in all sorts of conditions. In most conditions it sounds as good as FM stereo - sometimes it sounds better! Why not give it another go? It wasn't a total failure with consumers. Most consumers weren't aware of its existence - and they still aren't. Next time you're in Melbourne tune into 3MP or Magic on a wideband receiver and I'm sure you'll be impressed! Ian From kevtronics@yahoo.com Wed Oct 16 19:36:07 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 17 Oct 2002 02:36:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 11858 invoked from network); 17 Oct 2002 02:36:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Oct 2002 02:36:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Oct 2002 02:36:07 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.189] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Oct 2002 02:36:07 -0000 Date: Thu, 17 Oct 2002 02:36:06 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Optimod 9200 on eBay Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3DADBC0D.7ABAA529@skyweb.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2988 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.78.146 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > as a User of a 9100B I will say Bob Orban is right... My Audio > sounds as good or better than some local Fm stations.. and it Is > louder than the 9200 I have on WHWH with the same amount Of > modulation go figure By the way, there is one effect I have noticed on some stations which I think is being caused by the Optimod 9100 processor. Whenever true single-channel audio is encountered (think "Here Comes The Sun" or "Year Of The Cat"), it starts out one that side of the Stereo image, but then quickly shifts toward the center. The audio is not totally blended to mono, but the separation becomes not nearly as wide as it could be. Then, when the other channel kicks in, suddenly full separation returns. I have heard this effect on stations like 600 WICC, 960 CHNS (now ex-Stereo), and 1090 WILD, and even in recordings of "France Bleu" on 864 kHz in Paris... also also on your 1680 WTTM, which makes me believe it is caused by the Optimod 9100-series. On WTTM, it is obvious during the "stereo studio microphone" segments, where the two hosts should be on opposite sides of the Stereo image, but when only one of them is talking, their audio gets shifted towards the center and sort of wanders around depending on how loudly they talk. However, there are other AM Stereo stations which retain full separation even with prolonged single-channel audio, such as 850 WREF, 1430 WNSW, and 1450 WCTC. Thus, it is not inherent in the C-Quam system itself, nor do I think the C-Quam exciters are causing it... I think it is an effect of the 75% L-R modulation limiter in the Optimod 9100 series, which reduces single-channel modulation to a maximum of 75% per C-Quam specs, but also allows the L+R mono modulation to still be at the full 100% or 125% during this time. This may increase loudness for mono listeners, but leads to reduced Stereo separation for AM Stereo listeners. Per the specs on Orban's web site, the 9100 has a jumper to disable this 75% limiter completely, so Neal, if you have time to tweak around at 1680 WTTM you might want to try that and see if it solves the problem of the stereoized DJs getting blended towards the center. You might also ask what kind of audio processing 1430 WNSW is using, because during the month or two when they were running single-channel audio 100% of the time, it was definitely as much off to the side that it could possibly be, and was not blended towards the center of the Stereo image. This may even be a difference between the "9100B" and "9100B2" versions of the Optimod AM Stereo processor... I'm not sure. And if anybody knows what kind of processor and C-Quam exciter 850 WREF in Connecticut is using, I'd love to know. With their Oldies format, they are truly the cleanest and *widest* AM Stereo station I've ever heard. Even over my 80-mile DX of their signal, I can really hear the Stereo sound "jump out at me" from those fantastic late '50s and early '60s recordings. From di316@freenet.carleton.ca Wed Oct 16 20:13:55 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: di316@ncf.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 17 Oct 2002 03:13:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 74817 invoked from network); 17 Oct 2002 03:13:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Oct 2002 03:13:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO tomts16-srv.bellnexxia.net) (209.226.175.4) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Oct 2002 03:13:49 -0000 Received: from ncf.ca ([64.230.18.232]) by tomts16-srv.bellnexxia.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.19 201-253-122-122-119-20020516) with ESMTP id <20021017031349.SCIM11760.tomts16-srv.bellnexxia.net@ncf.ca>; Wed, 16 Oct 2002 23:13:49 -0400 Message-ID: <3DAE2B02.6A432251@ncf.ca> Date: Wed, 16 Oct 2002 23:14:10 -0400 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.79 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: CHML/900 References: <1034763125.1733.64140.m12@yahoogroups.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-eGroups-From: Paul Cumming From: Paul Cumming X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=43835445 X-Yahoo-Profile: rahoule104 Jeff Welton (jwelton@nautel.com) wrote: >> Also, has anyone else noticed NO pilot coming from WWKB/1520-Buffalo >> and WPTR/1540-Albany? > Can't speak for WWKB, but I know that WPTR has been suffering from > interference problems with a station on my side of the 49th that has > apparently not been reducing power at night. I'm not totally sure, but the interference could be from 1540 CHIN in Toronto. I don't know offhand if they have a lower nighttime power. CHIN is an ethnic station. They could be 50,000 watts all the time, or possibly 10,000 at night -- I don't know. The Canadian AM Radio Directory that listed station power levels and used to be at http://www.entrenet.com/mizar/card/ is gone. To tell if that's really the station you're hearing, listen to CHIN online at their website: http://www.chinradio.com/ 1540 CHIN used to be stereo but isn't anymore, and a while ago someone from this mailing list or another emailed the engineers asking about that and got a reply to the effect of "Our exciter broke, and since we don't really care about AM stereo anymore, we're not going to fix it." The upcoming Eureka DAB was seen as a bigger priority. The engineers *were* willing to part with the old AM stereo gear, however. (According to digitalradio.ca, after a year of promises, we will *finally* get to buy DAB radios in Canada at Radio Shack later this month -- I'm going to hold Radio Shack to that deadline.) http://www.digitalradio.ca/DABCORE.cfm?page=DABNews&newsid=94 Here in Ottawa, I usually get both WPTR and CHIN together at once on 1540. WPTR is a little stronger, but CHIN still messes it up so badly as to make it mostly unlistenable. WPTR's stereo also sounds really fluttery, as Kevin pointed out. 1540 Radio (the name of company that owns CHIN) is also going to open up an ethnic FM station here in Ottawa. They will be one of four new FM stations that will be opening up here soon, filling in the hole in the middle of our FM dial between 94.9 and 99.1. (There is a low-power college station at 96.9, but they don't cover much of the city, and even less now that the first of the new FM stations went on the air at 97.1!!) An interesting fact: When Ottawa station CJSB 540 ("54 Rock") (AM stereo) switched to "The Bear 106.9" in late 1994, the general manager of the station decided to offer the old AM frequency to 1540 Radio so they could start up an Ottawa CHIN affiliate. CHIN's radio programming is available by satellite, so CHIN could conceivably just have some sort of device to receive the satellite programming and rebroadcast it. This donation would have probably reflected favourably on The Bear to the CRTC. (Not that The Bear was in trouble, but it seemed like something nice to have on their record.) However 1540 Radio turned him down, and 540 AM in Ottawa went dark, and has been ever since. -- Paul ---------------------- Paul Cumming paulc@ncf.ca From dav259@csiro.au Wed Oct 16 22:38:40 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 17 Oct 2002 05:38:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 79242 invoked from network); 17 Oct 2002 05:38:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Oct 2002 05:38:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Oct 2002 05:38:39 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9H5cbP04850 for ; Thu, 17 Oct 2002 15:38:37 +1000 (EST) Date: Thu, 17 Oct 2002 15:38:37 +1000 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Aussie exposure In-Reply-To: <004c01c25d07$745559a0$0101a8c0@pavilion> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public On Sun, 15 Sep 2002, Christopher Cuff wrote: > A fellow from Down Under, Ian MacRae has written me and asked if he could do > a piece in his radio trade paper about AMS. I was delighted, of course- Will > fill you all in as I know more. Chris - Did you ever do this article for Ian MacRae? I'm subscribed to his Newsletter and haven't seen anything yet. It'll be seen by a variety of people interested in radio. From groucho@skyweb.net Thu Oct 17 00:15:26 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 17 Oct 2002 07:15:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 3889 invoked from network); 17 Oct 2002 07:15:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Oct 2002 07:15:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Oct 2002 07:15:25 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g9H7HsDr066242 for ; Thu, 17 Oct 2002 03:17:56 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DAE61DE.C821EADC@skyweb.net> Date: Thu, 17 Oct 2002 03:08:15 -0400 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Optimod 9200 on eBay References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Interesting You say that Kevin when I first started up the stereo the separation was good.. But since the phone company has had problems with My Lines I noticed that One of the channels is off a Bit The main studio mike is in both L and R channels the main Guest mic is In the R only,and the 3rd second guest mic is in the L only when I first set it Up you could clearly tell what mic was being used. and in mono here all 3 mics fine.. I noticed it this past Saturday during the Bollywood Quiz-me show. that Momtra was on the main guest mic and she sounded like she was on the other side of the room.. I will be out at the site tomorrow evening to check it out.. among other Problems.. The Phone company issue is driving the neighbors To the Point of Filing an FCC Complaint... when its damp outside(rain) there seems To be a band Bonding on a telco line that makes all the Neighbors phones into WTTM radio receivers. and the phone company is telling them its the radio stations fault.. even my broadcast Lines are affected.... so I know its the telcos problem. and they wont Fix it.. like they installed a remote switch 200 feet from the antenna... and there is about 175 feet of Phone cable between the building and their BOX.. DUH.. its acting as a perfect antenna into their equipment.. Just Figures... ohhh it drives me crazy.. Neal "Kevin T." wrote: > > as a User of a 9100B I will say Bob Orban is right... My Audio > > sounds as good or better than some local Fm stations.. and it Is > > louder than the 9200 I have on WHWH with the same amount Of > > modulation go figure > > By the way, there is one effect I have noticed on some stations which > I think is being caused by the Optimod 9100 processor. Whenever true > single-channel audio is encountered (think "Here Comes The Sun" or > "Year Of The Cat"), it starts out one that side of the Stereo image, > but then quickly shifts toward the center. The audio is not totally > blended to mono, but the separation becomes not nearly as wide as it > could be. Then, when the other channel kicks in, suddenly full > separation returns. > > I have heard this effect on stations like 600 WICC, 960 CHNS (now > ex-Stereo), and 1090 WILD, and even in recordings of "France Bleu" on > 864 kHz in Paris... also also on your 1680 WTTM, which makes me > believe it is caused by the Optimod 9100-series. On WTTM, it is > obvious during the "stereo studio microphone" segments, where the two > hosts should be on opposite sides of the Stereo image, but when only > one of them is talking, their audio gets shifted towards the center > and sort of wanders around depending on how loudly they talk. > > However, there are other AM Stereo stations which retain full > separation even with prolonged single-channel audio, such as > 850 WREF, 1430 WNSW, and 1450 WCTC. Thus, it is not inherent in the > C-Quam system itself, nor do I think the C-Quam exciters are causing > it... I think it is an effect of the 75% L-R modulation limiter in > the Optimod 9100 series, which reduces single-channel modulation to a > maximum of 75% per C-Quam specs, but also allows the L+R mono > modulation to still be at the full 100% or 125% during this time. > This may increase loudness for mono listeners, but leads to reduced > Stereo separation for AM Stereo listeners. > > Per the specs on Orban's web site, the 9100 has a jumper to disable > this 75% limiter completely, so Neal, if you have time to tweak > around at 1680 WTTM you might want to try that and see if it solves > the problem of the stereoized DJs getting blended towards the center. > You might also ask what kind of audio processing 1430 WNSW is using, > because during the month or two when they were running single-channel > audio 100% of the time, it was definitely as much off to the side > that it could possibly be, and was not blended towards the center of > the Stereo image. > > This may even be a difference between the "9100B" and "9100B2" > versions of the Optimod AM Stereo processor... I'm not sure. And if > anybody knows what kind of processor and C-Quam exciter 850 WREF in > Connecticut is using, I'd love to know. With their Oldies format, > they are truly the cleanest and *widest* AM Stereo station I've ever > heard. Even over my 80-mile DX of their signal, I can really hear > the Stereo sound "jump out at me" from those fantastic late '50s and > early '60s recordings. > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Thu Oct 17 01:26:02 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 17 Oct 2002 08:26:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 77338 invoked from network); 17 Oct 2002 08:26:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Oct 2002 08:26:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web40801.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.78.178) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Oct 2002 08:26:01 -0000 Message-ID: <20021017082601.61991.qmail@web40801.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.34.32] by web40801.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 17 Oct 2002 01:26:01 PDT Date: Thu, 17 Oct 2002 01:26:01 -0700 (PDT) Subject: WPMZ/1110-East Providence, R.I. To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: <3DAE61DE.C821EADC@skyweb.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio I talked to the owner yesterday because his XMTR. was left on after sundown (it's a daytimer, but if the WHIM calls are on 1110, it can be on at nights. Go figure.) and mentioned stereo. His ad packet said stereo on the address label, but they are not stereo. I mentioned going stereo and he said that it was a priority once, but not any longer. When I mentioned about the group and that there are some engineers who may have some leads for cheap equipment, he sounded somewhat interested. I don't know what they need (when WHIM was on 1110, they were supposedly stereo) but I imagine some processing and an exciter. Their audio sounds great in mono so in stereo it should really blow people away. Do any of you have any leads on cheap used equipment that's still in working order? Thanks and 73, Jay,N1WVQ Master Control trainee at WPRI-TV/12 (CBS) Providence. __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Faith Hill - Exclusive Performances, Videos & More http://faith.yahoo.com From dav259@csiro.au Thu Oct 17 03:01:02 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 17 Oct 2002 10:01:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 8422 invoked from network); 17 Oct 2002 10:01:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Oct 2002 10:01:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Oct 2002 10:01:01 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9HA0xP18307; Thu, 17 Oct 2002 20:00:59 +1000 (EST) Date: Thu, 17 Oct 2002 20:00:59 +1000 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: amstereoforum Cc: Subject: PLEASE! PLEASE!! PLEASE!!! Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public All of you AM stereo Warriors **please** write a few words to "The Australian" newspapers site. All you need to do is say who you are and what city you live in - and then try and convince this *very* important national radio writer that AM stereo sounds great. Just a few words!!! This has never happened before - but I logged into the site tonight and my message is there! Unfortunately there's another ... We have this great technology in the States now called XM satellite radio. I just received it and I love it very much. I really don't see a need any more for regular radio - it's just garbage. It is geared towards kids, no good music, reception is bad. William Kimball Chicago, Ill., USA Please do this for the good of the international cause. If we can get this influential guy on side it would be a huge bonus for us in the land of Oz. And you people who work in radio can maybe say something technical. This is our one and only national newspaper (and I won't tell you who owns it - but his initials are RM). http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,5744,5298763%255E12280,00.html Thanks heaps in advance! Ian Proudly in AMS friendly Melbourne From philipr@irac.pe.ca Thu Oct 17 05:36:29 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 17 Oct 2002 12:36:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 35057 invoked from network); 17 Oct 2002 12:36:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Oct 2002 12:36:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.64) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Oct 2002 12:36:27 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.145] by n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Oct 2002 12:36:26 -0000 Date: Thu, 17 Oct 2002 12:36:26 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Toyota 5429 AM Stereo/FM car receiver Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 572 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking I have a line on a Toyota 5429 - it has the AM Stereo button clearly visable on the front panel. What kind of performers were they like - sensitivity, bandwidth etc. I suspect they'd only go up to 1610, which is not a major problem for me. I couldn't care less about the FM - its the AM Stereo performance I'd like to be clued in on. If I get it, it won't be put in my car - rather I'll use a 12 volt regulated power supply, brew up a whip antenna with a decent ground and use some up till now unused speakers in my house. Thanks for any and all input! Phil From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Oct 17 07:14:46 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 17 Oct 2002 14:14:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 91807 invoked from network); 17 Oct 2002 14:14:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Oct 2002 14:14:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web12805.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.174.40) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Oct 2002 14:14:45 -0000 Message-ID: <20021017141445.9830.qmail@web12805.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [66.200.203.66] by web12805.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 17 Oct 2002 07:14:45 PDT Date: Thu, 17 Oct 2002 07:14:45 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Fwd: Stereo Radio Station in North Carolina To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "Kevin T." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics This following is from an e-mail I got.... 990 WBTE is a non-directional 1000 watt daytime-only station licensed to Windsor, NC. > From: "Elder Gary L. Cordon, Sr." > To: > Subject: Stereo Radio Station in North Carolina > Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 17:20:02 -0400 > > WBTE 990 AM Radio Station is a stereo radio station. > > My name is Gary L. Cordon, Sr. I am the General Manager. The station is > 24-hour Gospel music and Community news/talk... > > > Email glcordon@email.com > > --- > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). > Version: 6.0.391 / Virus Database: 222 - Release Date: 9/19/02 __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Faith Hill - Exclusive Performances, Videos & More http://faith.yahoo.com From narkspud@hotmail.com Thu Oct 17 08:59:15 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: narkspud@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 17 Oct 2002 15:59:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 27223 invoked from network); 17 Oct 2002 15:59:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Oct 2002 15:59:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.64) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Oct 2002 15:59:09 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.170] by n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Oct 2002 15:59:09 -0000 Date: Thu, 17 Oct 2002 15:59:05 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: More Radio Pros on IBOC Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3037 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "narkspud" X-Originating-IP: 67.89.146.146 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=81956306 X-Yahoo-Profile: narkspud Excerpts from the CGC Communicator, a newsletter for radio engineers in Southern California. It updates weekly at http://www.bext.com/_CGC/contents.htm: FCC APPROVES IBOC/IBAC DIGITAL RADIO TECHNOLOGY In a First Report & Order, the FCC has approved "in-band/ on-channel" (IBOC) technology to bring the alleged benefits of digital radio to AM & FM listeners. The techniques developed by iBiquity Digital Corporation have been specifically approved for immediate use on an interim basis pending the development of final rules. However, iBiquity's AM system may only be used during daytime hours, at least for now. As CGC Communicator readers know, the iBiquity techniques are more properly called in-band/adjacent-channel (IBAC) since the digital power is transmitted primarily in the first adjacent channel sidebands. However, the term "IBOC" is fully acceptable if it is redefined as "in-band/off-channel" since off-channel is where the digital power lies. ****************************************************************** LETTERS TO THE EDITOR (100 WORDS OR LESS) ****************************************************************** IBOC/IBAC INTERFERES WITH AM DX RADIO RECEPTION The DX lists have been very active with posts about IBOC on AM. One post is copied below as an example. I would be curious what people on the west coast think of IBOC. In an example I heard, the signal of 710 kHz KABC, Los Angeles, suffered a coverage loss due to 700 Cincinnati's transmissions of IBOC. In fairness, I don't know if 710 cares that someone in Nevada is listening to their station, but for those of us that listen to stations outside of their "primary service areas," IBOC could pose a big problem. FredVobbe, w8hdu@wlio.com [The posting copied by Fred is from an AM DXer is Seaside, OR who writes: "After listening for two days of IBOC from KIXI-880, I can tell you that this white noise is going to be a problem for all DXers.... I hope [it] is all a bad dream and maybe we will wake up and it will be just that, a dream....] ****************************************************************** AM IBOC: PROCEED WITH CAUTION Internet postings show AM IBOC is causing some problems with local analog reception of the station sending the IBOC signal. KIXI's analog signal in Seattle carried a "frying bacon sound" and the fidelity of the station was reduced during IBOC tests (but iBiquity rolls off the high frequency response as part of their system requirements, so that part of the problem was expected). Also, spectrum analyzer tests showed that the station's digital sidebands exceeded the FCC's emissions mask by over 10 dB. Jump to New York. WOR lites up their iBiquity subcarriers on Friday, and shuts them off on Monday thanks to the frying bacon gremlin. Why are these problems showing up so late in the game? If these Internet postings are true, this is a terrifying situation. Mike Sullivan ****************************************************************** From fanfare@globility.com Thu Oct 17 09:31:00 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 17 Oct 2002 16:30:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 15154 invoked from network); 17 Oct 2002 16:30:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Oct 2002 16:30:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO newsletter1.elogic.com) (63.79.80.46) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Oct 2002 16:30:57 -0000 Received: from elogic.com (63.79.81.147) by newsletter1.elogic.com (PowerMTA(TM) v1.5); Thu, 17 Oct 2002 09:31:04 -0700 (envelope-from ) Received: from mail pickup service by elogic.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 17 Oct 2002 09:31:04 -0700 To: Subject: Broadcasting & Cable - CEA launches battle vs. DTV-tuner mandate Date: Thu, 17 Oct 2002 09:31:04 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4910.0300 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 17 Oct 2002 16:31:04.0299 (UTC) FILETIME=[964233B0:01C275FA] From: X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy AMFMguy (fanfare@globility.com) has sent you an article. Personal message: This could be the thin edge of the wedge that'll pry digital off'n the orde= r paper. CEA launches battle vs. DTV-tuner mandate Read the full article at:=20 http://www.tvinsite.com/broadcastingcable/index.asp?layout=3Dstory&doc_id= =3D105081&display=3DbreakingNews& From philipr@irac.pe.ca Thu Oct 17 10:37:55 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 17 Oct 2002 17:37:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 69270 invoked from network); 17 Oct 2002 17:37:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Oct 2002 17:37:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.64) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Oct 2002 17:37:48 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.155] by n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Oct 2002 17:37:48 -0000 Date: Thu, 17 Oct 2002 17:37:48 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: CHML/900 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3DAE2B02.6A432251@ncf.ca> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 904 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking According to the CHIN website, 1540 CHIN broadcasts 50kw day, 30 kw at night. Prior to 1984, CHIN 1540 was a sunrise to sunset operation - something that was [and is] pretty rare in Canada. CHIN has an FM transmitter providing a simulcast of the AM to fill in coverage gaps on 1540. There is also CHIN-FM as well with its own programming. Phil PS - On CHIN's website, they indicate that 1540 is Stereo. Likely yet another radio station website which hasn't been updated for a while! lol > I'm not totally sure, but the interference could be from 1540 CHIN in > Toronto. I don't know offhand if they have a lower nighttime power. > CHIN is an ethnic station. They could be 50,000 watts all the time, or > possibly 10,000 at night -- I don't know. The Canadian AM Radio > Directory that listed station power levels and used to be at > http://www.entrenet.com/mizar/card/ is gone. From evergreenterrace@buzzle.com Thu Oct 17 15:04:32 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: evergreenterrace@buzzle.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 17 Oct 2002 22:04:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 49686 invoked from network); 17 Oct 2002 22:04:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Oct 2002 22:04:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.90) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Oct 2002 22:04:32 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.157] by n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Oct 2002 22:04:31 -0000 Date: Thu, 17 Oct 2002 22:04:31 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Optimod 9200 on eBay Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 441 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgliradio" X-Originating-IP: 170.20.11.59 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=69711087 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgliradio --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin T." wrote: And if > anybody knows what kind of processor and C-Quam exciter 850 WREF in > Connecticut is using, I'd love to know. With their Oldies format, > they are truly the cleanest and *widest* AM Stereo station I've ever > heard. I THINK they are probably using the CRL Amigo AM processor. At least the audio sounds like it (wide stereo, yet flat and somewhat lifeless). From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Oct 17 17:51:26 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 18 Oct 2002 00:51:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 42029 invoked from network); 18 Oct 2002 00:51:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Oct 2002 00:51:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Oct 2002 00:51:25 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.143] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Oct 2002 00:51:25 -0000 Date: Fri, 18 Oct 2002 00:51:25 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Optimod 9200 on eBay Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1491 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 207.200.161.212 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > I THINK they are probably using the CRL Amigo AM processor. At > least the audio sounds like it (wide stereo, yet flat and somewhat > lifeless). 850 WREF does have extremely clean and wide sound, but I agree that it is somewhat lacking in "character", as it is not tuned to produce any kind of "sonic signature" that harkens back to when their Oldies music was originally played on AM radio. A gentle Stereo reverb or a bit of a "punch" to the processing would be a nice finishing touch. BTW, one interesting thing is that the company which owns 850 WREF, 800 WLAD (also in great sounding Stereo), and a few other small AM stations in Connecticut has expressed their optimism about IBOC, as if it was the greatest thing to come to the AM dial... nevermind the fact that the signal strength (or lack thereof!) and dial placement of WREF, WLAD, and their other stations would make them unsuitable for use with IBOC! I think at this point, the ONLY stations which might have any luck at using IBOC and providing an acceptable Digital signal to their local listeners will be the 50,000-watt Class A stations, like 700 WLW and 710 WOR which have begun to use it. Anything less, regardless of power level, is simply not going to work well, due to things like unfriendly directional nulls, adjacent channel and co-channel interference, and skywave propagation effects during the early morning and late afternoon hours (even during "daytime" hours when IBOC is allowed). From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Oct 17 18:03:08 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 18 Oct 2002 01:03:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 57128 invoked from network); 18 Oct 2002 01:03:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Oct 2002 01:03:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r04.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.100) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Oct 2002 01:03:07 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.65.1e3ede (3310) for ; Thu, 17 Oct 2002 21:03:02 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <65.1e3ede.2ae0b7c5@aol.com> Date: Thu, 17 Oct 2002 21:03:01 EDT Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fwd: Stereo Radio Station in North Carolina To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 10/17/02 10:15:48 AM Eastern Daylight Time, kevtronics@yahoo.com writes: << This following is from an e-mail I got.... 990 WBTE is a non-directional 1000 watt daytime-only station licensed to Windsor, NC. > From: "Elder Gary L. Cordon, Sr." > To: > Subject: Stereo Radio Station in North Carolina > Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 17:20:02 -0400 > > WBTE 990 AM Radio Station is a stereo radio station. > > My name is Gary L. Cordon, Sr. I am the General Manager. The station is > 24-hour Gospel music and Community news/talk... > >> Yeah I think I'll confirm this tomorrow. I have my serious doubts that the station is broadcasting in stereo...heck all the station has been running are songs over and over in a multi disc CD changer.....this is real poor mans radio from what I've heard from a few of my sources. A trip to Windsor NC is only but a 45 minute ride from Elizabeth City NC {where I am located} one day to speak to someone about transmitter maintance only yielded an empty greeting as nobody was attending the station..it was on the air but no one home...not even to answer the phone. Anyhow...I'll grab the SR-66 and take a trip and see if the pilot indicator pops on and see if indeed they are running in stereo....and hopefully catch someone "home" this time. BTW..a friend of mine was with me at the time when I was making my rounds one afternoon and he got some snap shots of WBTE and posted them up on his website--http://members.tripod.com/e92fm/wbte.html Stay tuned! Bob Carter Operations/Engineering WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5..., Ray Communications Radio Network Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereoradio-subcribe@topica.com amstereo-subcribe@topica.com amstereoradio-subscribe@yahoogroups.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ WARNING TO UNSOLICITED SPAMMERS !!! Pursuant to U.S. Code, title 47, Chapter 5, Subchapter II, "Any and all nonsolicited E-mail (SPAM) sent to this address is subject to a download and archival fee of 500 U.S."!! E-mailing denotes acceptance of these terms." Your message (if actually mailed) is in violation of the Federal Telephone Consumer Protection Act of 1991, and Collateral Code of Federal Regulations (47 CFR 64.1200). The TCPA allows a private right of action against the sender of unsolicited advertising. The recipient can sue for $500, or actualdamages (whichever is greater). ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------- Osama bin Laden can kiss my royal white American behind! From groucho@skyweb.net Thu Oct 17 18:42:38 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 18 Oct 2002 01:42:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 69486 invoked from network); 18 Oct 2002 01:42:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Oct 2002 01:42:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Oct 2002 01:42:37 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g9I1jAGr014559 for ; Thu, 17 Oct 2002 21:45:10 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DAF6563.C5509653@skyweb.net> Date: Thu, 17 Oct 2002 21:35:31 -0400 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Optimod 9200 on eBay References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 In reply to Kevin.. I found the problem today out at the site. why the 1st guest mic sounded like it was across the room listening to a Mono radio.... R63 a lousy 25 turn 5k pot that Controls the L+R output level of the harris exciter had a broken wiper wire from the PCboard.. I didn't have a side Mount version Of it so I used a top mount one that I found. till I get the Correct one. so I could keep the stereo on... what a project to take apart the exciter To get to the little guy. I was wondering why there was a crackle on the audio it was making an intermittent connection. Audio should sound much Better now.. this may also explain why the Old Engineer turned off the stereo He didn't want to Bother fixing it.. at first I thought the exciter was Off freq.. Neal From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Oct 17 19:24:51 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 18 Oct 2002 02:24:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 91011 invoked from network); 18 Oct 2002 02:24:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Oct 2002 02:24:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d07.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.39) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Oct 2002 02:24:49 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.8.2e77019c (3310) for ; Thu, 17 Oct 2002 22:24:42 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <8.2e77019c.2ae0caea@aol.com> Date: Thu, 17 Oct 2002 22:24:42 EDT Subject: Re: {AMSF} PLEASE! PLEASE!! PLEASE!!! To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp post your comments at the bottom of the page folks! http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,5744,5298763%255E1228 0,00.html Thanks for the heads up Ian .... ...here is what I posted on the site: IBOC is a failure in the making. IBOC will only offer the chance of receiving more interference on the AM band and does nothing for programming. Having listened to a short audio clip of WOR-AM 710 from New York City,{ listen to the clip here:http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/wor.mp3 } IBOC will only drive people farther away from AM radio because of additional noise in the form of hiss. The analog signal will also be degraded with a more narrow audio response,which sounds worse on already substandard receivers. The roll out of IBOC receivers isnt due until 2003 and the only receivers that will be available will be automotive and home based radio receivers....NOTHING portable. IBOC will as I see it, follow the doom and failures of AM Stereo as far as receivers are concerned. My opinion is that stations should focus on AM Stereo operation and push manufactures to produce receivers that will reproduce the audio quality that is being sent by todays AM stations.Further more, stations need to focus on more local content.Otherwise listeners will be suckered into XM satellite radio which you have to pay a monthly fee,only to hear mostly the same thing that you presently hear on AM/FM radio. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5..., Ray Communications Radio Network From ccuff@in4web.com Fri Oct 18 00:31:26 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 18 Oct 2002 07:31:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 58298 invoked from network); 18 Oct 2002 07:31:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Oct 2002 07:31:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Oct 2002 07:31:24 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.33]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Fri, 18 Oct 2002 03:30:15 -0400 Message-ID: <002701c27678$2cd67340$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: Re: WREF Date: Fri, 18 Oct 2002 03:30:02 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 Dennis Jackson is the engineer behind WREF's great sound. I have met him, and he is a great guy. As for Berkshire Broadcasting, I find it very hard to believe that they would look forward to iBOC. Irv Goldstien has always been a staunch ally of cquam. Chris ----- Original Message ----- From: Kevin T. To: Sent: Thursday, October 17, 2002 8:51 PM Subject: {AMSF} Re: Optimod 9200 on eBay > > I THINK they are probably using the CRL Amigo AM processor. At > > least the audio sounds like it (wide stereo, yet flat and somewhat > > lifeless). > > 850 WREF does have extremely clean and wide sound From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Oct 18 05:49:28 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 18 Oct 2002 12:49:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 14397 invoked from network); 18 Oct 2002 12:49:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Oct 2002 12:49:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Oct 2002 12:49:26 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-89-195.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.195]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g9ICiCjR010212 for ; Fri, 18 Oct 2002 07:44:13 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <000d01c276a4$d4638040$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: <2d.2522529e.2adf436f@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Engineering Question on stereo audio for AMS Date: Fri, 18 Oct 2002 07:49:40 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude I used to do that. I've got alternate mains on all three stations, but I discovered there were times I needed to use the mod monitor on the box I was working on, so I run coax from both transmitters to a ham type coax switch and can monitor the one I need. The only time it presents a problem is if one box goes down at my remote site, then I have to go out there and switch it manually and the board op has to put the monitors in program in the mean time. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: >> As far as the mod monitor...near the coil works well,but if you have a case > like me where you have a main and a backup transmitter..I have a run of RG-6 > running to my phasor and at the end of this cable is a loop antenna. This > works quite well for when having to switch from one transmitter to another. > From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Oct 18 06:05:18 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 18 Oct 2002 13:05:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 74205 invoked from network); 18 Oct 2002 13:05:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Oct 2002 13:05:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Oct 2002 13:05:15 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-89-195.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.195]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g9ID02jR013081 for ; Fri, 18 Oct 2002 08:00:03 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <003101c276a7$0a7ee6e0$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: <3DAE61DE.C821EADC@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Optimod 9200 on eBay Date: Fri, 18 Oct 2002 08:05:29 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude I'm getting that same problem with my remote site. Telco buck-passers won't take responsibility. Best thing to do is go out with a butt-set, go to the affected homes and temporarily disconnect the inside lines at the demark, and listen to the incoming line. If audio is there, it's proof positive it's the telco equipment. How to get them to acknowlege that fact is another matter. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Neal Newman" > among other Problems.. The Phone company issue is driving the neighbors To > the Point of Filing an FCC Complaint... when its damp outside(rain) there > seems To be a band Bonding on a telco line that makes all the Neighbors > phones into WTTM radio receivers. and the phone company is telling them its > the radio stations fault.. From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Oct 18 06:08:44 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 18 Oct 2002 13:08:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 8268 invoked from network); 18 Oct 2002 13:08:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Oct 2002 13:08:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Oct 2002 13:08:44 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-89-195.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.195]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g9ID3UjR013876 for ; Fri, 18 Oct 2002 08:03:31 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <003701c276a7$86bc5260$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: <20021017082601.61991.qmail@web40801.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} WPMZ/1110-East Providence, R.I. Date: Fri, 18 Oct 2002 08:08:58 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Just start calling former AMS stations. What with IBOC being approved it should be easier to talk them out of it for at best a nominal fee. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "JNR" Do any of you > have any leads on cheap used equipment that's > still in working order? From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Oct 18 06:10:46 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 18 Oct 2002 13:10:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 96448 invoked from network); 18 Oct 2002 13:10:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Oct 2002 13:10:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Oct 2002 13:10:45 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-89-195.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.195]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g9ID5VjR014335 for ; Fri, 18 Oct 2002 08:05:32 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <003b01c276a7$cf062e60$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: <20021017082601.61991.qmail@web40801.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} WPMZ/1110-East Providence, R.I. Date: Fri, 18 Oct 2002 08:10:59 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Forgot to mention, if you deal with a CC station, it's best to find out who the regional engineering supervisor is and deal with him. The local engineer or manager should know who it is and how to get a hold of him. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "JNR" Do any of you > have any leads on cheap used equipment that's > still in working order? From groucho@skyweb.net Fri Oct 18 06:24:53 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 18 Oct 2002 13:24:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 78934 invoked from network); 18 Oct 2002 13:24:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Oct 2002 13:24:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Oct 2002 13:24:52 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g9IDRMGr060178 for ; Fri, 18 Oct 2002 09:27:23 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DB009F5.2D0BA044@skyweb.net> Date: Fri, 18 Oct 2002 09:17:41 -0400 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Optimod 9200 on eBay References: <3DAE61DE.C821EADC@skyweb.net> <003101c276a7$0a7ee6e0$d3a9fea9@me> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 actually I met with the Neighbors yesterday.. they told me the phone company sent out a tech who reported to them that all the terminals in the box had severe Oxidation and the box has poor grounding. My reply was I told you all this was the case... the tech also told them that it would take 4 men 2 weeks to replace the box and or terminals..and the Phone company was planing on doing it within the next 2 years. that's not the answer they wanted to Hear. Personally I have Never seen the Phone company do that.. its all smoke and mirrors.. at least I wish to Believe that the neighbors now believe me . that its the phone company's Problem the Saga continues. Neal. Scott Todd wrote: > I'm getting that same problem with my remote site. Telco buck-passers won't > take responsibility. Best thing to do is go out with a butt-set, go to the > affected homes and temporarily disconnect the inside lines at the demark, > and listen to the incoming line. If audio is there, it's proof positive > it's the telco equipment. How to get them to acknowlege that fact is > another matter. > > ST > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Neal Newman" > > > among other Problems.. The Phone company issue is driving the neighbors > To > > the Point of Filing an FCC Complaint... when its damp outside(rain) there > > seems To be a band Bonding on a telco line that makes all the Neighbors > > phones into WTTM radio receivers. and the phone company is telling them > its > > the radio stations fault.. > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Oct 18 07:23:33 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 18 Oct 2002 14:23:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 94186 invoked from network); 18 Oct 2002 14:23:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Oct 2002 14:23:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Oct 2002 14:23:30 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-89-195.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.195]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g9IEIGjR001681 for ; Fri, 18 Oct 2002 09:18:17 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <006801c276b1$f8ebff20$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Toyota 5429 AM Stereo/FM car receiver Date: Fri, 18 Oct 2002 09:23:44 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude All the OEM AMS car radios of the era were pretty good. BTW, to your other topic of CHIN being agreeable to letting their AMS generator go, do they still have it, and if not, any idea of who got it? ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Phil Rafuse" > I have a line on a Toyota 5429 - it has the AM Stereo button clearly > visable on the front panel. What kind of performers were they like - > sensitivity, bandwidth etc. From amfmdx@fastq.com Fri Oct 18 07:37:00 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 18 Oct 2002 14:37:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 48728 invoked from network); 18 Oct 2002 14:36:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Oct 2002 14:36:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Oct 2002 14:36:36 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt (d188-osel-phx.fastq.com [209.63.214.175]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id g9IEaZq65529 for ; Fri, 18 Oct 2002 07:36:36 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <01ff01c276b3$a0a3ad20$58f9bed8@kredding430cdt> To: References: <20021017082601.61991.qmail@web40801.mail.yahoo.com> <003701c276a7$86bc5260$d3a9fea9@me> Subject: Re: {AMSF} WPMZ/1110-East Providence, R.I. Date: Fri, 18 Oct 2002 07:35:36 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > Just start calling former AMS stations. What with IBOC being approved it > should be easier to talk them out of it for at best a nominal fee. And you will get to pay Ibiquity a nominal fee each month to use IBOC. Kevin From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Fri Oct 18 08:26:12 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 18 Oct 2002 15:26:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 84051 invoked from network); 18 Oct 2002 15:25:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Oct 2002 15:25:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14205.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.151) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Oct 2002 15:25:35 -0000 Message-ID: <20021018152510.32422.qmail@web14205.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.127.54.199] by web14205.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 18 Oct 2002 08:25:10 PDT Date: Fri, 18 Oct 2002 08:25:10 -0700 (PDT) Subject: re:Toyota 5429 AM Stereo/FM car receiver To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: Johnny Electron X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio I believe that Alfredo has a 'fix' to change 2 capacitors to restore the bass and then it's a halfway decent AMS radio. Alfredo - which caps and what value? __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Faith Hill - Exclusive Performances, Videos & More http://faith.yahoo.com From philipr@irac.pe.ca Fri Oct 18 12:24:09 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 18 Oct 2002 19:24:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 56190 invoked from network); 18 Oct 2002 19:24:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Oct 2002 19:24:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.87) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Oct 2002 19:24:08 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.163] by n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Oct 2002 19:24:08 -0000 Date: Fri, 18 Oct 2002 19:24:07 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: re:Toyota 5429 AM Stereo/FM car receiver Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20021018152510.32422.qmail@web14205.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 654 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking Thanks! I checked out Alfredo's electronics page - and he lists the caps. Sounds like the Toyota car receiver is a pretty decent rig - its a go and I should be getting it shortley. Before long I should be up to three AM stereo receivers! Thanks again! Phil --- In amstereoforum@y..., Johnny Electron wrote: > I believe that Alfredo has a 'fix' to change 2 capacitors to restore the bass > and then it's a halfway decent AMS radio. Alfredo - which caps and what value? > > __________________________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Faith Hill - Exclusive Performances, Videos & More > http://faith.yahoo.com From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Oct 18 18:56:17 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 19 Oct 2002 01:56:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 85315 invoked from network); 19 Oct 2002 01:56:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Oct 2002 01:56:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Oct 2002 01:56:15 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.174] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 19 Oct 2002 01:56:15 -0000 Date: Sat, 19 Oct 2002 01:56:15 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: AM Stereo in Japan Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1774 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.82.32 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics I just came across the following MP3 files on the AM Stereo FTP server, and they are all recordings of AM Stereo stations in Japan. I haven't listened to them all yet, but the ones of JOLF, JOQR, and JOKR are all of extremely high quality -- flat frequency response, wide separation, high dynamic range, and no distortion. I don't know what receiver was used for these recordings, but a spectrum analysis graph reveals that it has carefully placed notch filters at 25 Hz, 50 Hz, 100 Hz, and 9 kHz to cut out the pilot tone, AC hum, and carrier whistle -- so it might even be directly from a C-Quam mod monitor. In any case, if you take the time to download these files, you will be treated to gorgeous AM Stereo sound that would put almost any FM station to shame -- in particular, since these Japanese stations seem to use noticeably more relaxed audio processing than U.S. stations; I guess the "Loudness War" isn't so extreme over there. Here are the links to download: ftp://209.193.86.116/JOLF1242.mp3 ftp://209.193.86.116/JOLF1242_Test_Transmission.mp3 ftp://209.193.86.116/JOQR1134_Test_Transmission_%28QR_Song_98%29.mp3 ftp://209.193.86.116/TBS_JOKR954.mp3 ftp://209.193.86.116/TBS_JOKR954_2.mp3 ftp://209.193.86.116/TBS_JOKR954_3.mp3 ftp://209.193.86.116/HBC_Sapporo_JOHR1287.mp3 ftp://209.193.86.116/HBC_Sapporo_JOHR1287_1.mp3 ftp://209.193.86.116/HBC_Sapporo_JOHR1287_2.mp3 ftp://209.193.86.116/HBC_Sapporo_JOHR1287_3.mp3 p.s. I can make out call letter and network IDs, "kilohertz", and "AM radio" in English amongst the Japanese speech, but so far nothing resembling the word "Stereo" (unlike Thailand, where almost every AM Stereo station includes the English phrase "AM Stereo" in its ID-- and also "Multiplex Stereo" for FM stations). From n0uiheric@aol.com Sat Oct 19 05:48:53 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 19 Oct 2002 12:48:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 38943 invoked from network); 19 Oct 2002 12:48:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Oct 2002 12:48:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m06.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.161) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Oct 2002 12:48:51 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-m06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.c.5f4307 (3940) for ; Sat, 19 Oct 2002 08:48:50 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: Date: Sat, 19 Oct 2002 08:48:50 EDT Subject: Re: {AMSF} Reply from WOR To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih This guy must be FULL OF IT! 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Sat Oct 19 06:14:12 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 19 Oct 2002 13:14:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 42714 invoked from network); 19 Oct 2002 13:14:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Oct 2002 13:14:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf01bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.141) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Oct 2002 13:14:09 -0000 Received: from juan ([67.34.33.8]) by imf01bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.19 201-253-122-122-119-20020516) with SMTP id <20021019131552.EBUS23449.imf01bis.bellsouth.net@juan> for ; Sat, 19 Oct 2002 09:15:52 -0400 Message-ID: <002001c27771$6b7d78b0$af78fea9@juan> To: Subject: WTTB Date: Sat, 19 Oct 2002 09:14:13 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit The Stereo is almost on at WTTB. Because we have been swapping STL's like musical chairs. WTTB has ended up with a composite Stereo STL. The engineer and myself are baffled....anyway We had the pilot on the other day, at least that works again... Juan [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From tom_richard1980@yahoo.com Sat Oct 19 06:56:40 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: tom_richard1980@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 19 Oct 2002 13:56:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 78156 invoked from network); 19 Oct 2002 13:56:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Oct 2002 13:56:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO proxymail.homerelay.com) (209.75.47.224) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Oct 2002 13:56:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 8837 invoked from network); 19 Oct 2002 13:56:35 -0000 Received: from vtcomm-5.homerelay.com (HELO yahoo.com) (209.75.47.220) by 0 with SMTP; 19 Oct 2002 13:56:35 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Cc: Date: 19 Oct 2002 06:52 -0500 Subject:IBOC -Cquam.. From: tom_richard1980@yahoo.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38123538 X-Yahoo-Profile: tom_richard1980 Don't you guys think that if IBOC succedes, that AM-Stereo in C-Quam will take off since IBOC on AM has to go off at night? Maybe it will turn out to be a blessing in disguise. Tom From groucho@skyweb.net Sat Oct 19 07:42:49 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 19 Oct 2002 14:42:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 82055 invoked from network); 19 Oct 2002 14:42:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Oct 2002 14:42:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Oct 2002 14:42:48 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g9JEjMGr038723 for ; Sat, 19 Oct 2002 10:45:22 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DB16DA7.191A6D71@skyweb.net> Date: Sat, 19 Oct 2002 10:35:19 -0400 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} IBOC -Cquam.. References: <200210191359.g9JDxLGr030207@pluto.skyweb.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Only If Lucent programs the IBOC(Linux) box with Stereo C-quam coding and I don't think that will happen. I have been listening to WOR's signal the past few days My Comment.. Either Turn off the IBOC or get off the air with that dirty signal.... there should Be a law about trashing the adjacent channels LOL.... Its really BAD....SHAME On the FCC.... better yet Shame on Buckley for wanting It.. Ok enough Flame on WOR....... Just fix it.... when the IBOC is On and there is no hash on Either adjacent maybe I'll accept IBOC.. Neal tom_richard1980@yahoo.com wrote: > Don't you guys think that if IBOC succedes, that AM-Stereo in C-Quam will take off since IBOC on AM has to go off at night? Maybe it will turn out to be a blessing in disguise. > > Tom > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From ccuff@in4web.com Sat Oct 19 14:02:26 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 19 Oct 2002 21:02:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 17898 invoked from network); 19 Oct 2002 21:02:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Oct 2002 21:02:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Oct 2002 21:02:26 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.51]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Sat, 19 Oct 2002 17:01:18 -0400 Message-ID: <000501c277b2$a3e87600$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: Subject: XM radio Date: Sat, 19 Oct 2002 17:00:59 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 Guys, I got an XM radio. My opinion? I LOVE it! The message I would have for broadcasters is "be afraid"- be VERY afraid. This stuff is incredible. I got on sale a Delphi unit, with the home kit at Best Buy- out the door with everything $200.00 After a brief setup, and initializing, it is the cats pajamas- There is stereo on all channels- even the 40's channel. Just played Tommy Dorsey, in full stereo. Is it CD quality? Nope- Is it better than FM?- Oh yes. Just waiting for the car kit to come in, and I will be all set. If only broadcast radio could be like this again... (btw- it re-broadcasts in AM stereo well, too..:-) Chris From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Oct 19 14:26:23 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 19 Oct 2002 21:26:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 93595 invoked from network); 19 Oct 2002 21:26:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Oct 2002 21:26:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Oct 2002 21:26:23 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.156] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 19 Oct 2002 21:26:23 -0000 Date: Sat, 19 Oct 2002 21:26:21 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: IBOC -Cquam.. Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3DB16DA7.191A6D71@skyweb.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1784 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.70.10 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Ok enough Flame on WOR....... Just fix it.... when the IBOC is On > and there is no hash on Either adjacent maybe I'll accept IBOC.. Over the years, they have redesigned the IBOC system numerous times because it has never worked as well as they wanted it to. Originally, the digital sidebands actually *did* fit within the +/- 10 kHz NRSC bandwidth limit, and it had a 96 kbps data rate for the digital audio. Then, they dropped the digital rate down to 48 kbps. Now it's at 36 kbps in "Enhanced Stereo" mode and 20 kbps in "Mono" mode, and they have added on an additional layer of digital sidebands extending to a +/- 15 kHz bandwidth. iBiquity says this is okay because it still fits into the "40 kHz total bandwidth" that AM stations are supposedly allocated. Maybe that's the case out in Alaska or Hawaii where there are only a handful of AM stations on the dial, but here in the metro NYC area, we have arrangements like 1040 kHz in NJ, 1050 in NYC, 1060 in Philly, 1070 in NJ, 1080 in CT, etc... stations are jam-packed all across the dial, even in the Expanded Band with the new low-power TIS/Community Info stations that have popped up. As-is, IBOC *might* have a chance of being successful, but *only* on the 50,000-watt Class A clear channel stations (like 710 WOR), which are the only ones which still have adequate "protection" of their adjancet channels during the daytime. Anything less -- even a 50,000 watt Class B station like 1010 WINS -- is going to run into major problems if they try to use IBOC, not only from adjacent channel interference but from things like directional signal nulls, which can already turn a regular analog signal into nothing but unintelligible distortion (especially in the case of WINS's nulls toward NJ). From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Oct 19 14:32:48 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 19 Oct 2002 21:32:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 37292 invoked from network); 19 Oct 2002 21:32:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Oct 2002 21:32:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.64) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Oct 2002 21:32:48 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.175] by n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 19 Oct 2002 21:32:48 -0000 Date: Sat, 19 Oct 2002 21:32:47 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: XM radio Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <000501c277b2$a3e87600$0101a8c0@pavilion> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 959 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.70.10 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Guys, I got an XM radio. My opinion? I LOVE it! The programming certainly has the opportunity to be very compelling, with vast music libraries, few or no commercials, and no "Loudness Wars" with competing stations. However, their process of playing music from 384 kbps MP2 files, putting it through the latest Optimod, and then sending it out over a 64 kbps AAC stream with "simulated" treble response always ends up having a wishy-washy, tinny, metallic type of sound to me. If you could possibly find a way to capture XM's audio into an MP3 file -- or even a CD-R disc -- for me to examine and listen more closely than in a noisy electronic store, that would be great. So far I have never heard of anybody putting up actual recordings of XM or Sirius on the web, but as long as they are short and for demonstration purposes only (i.e. you're not trying to rip them off) I don't see why there would be any possible legal problem with that. From ccuff@in4web.com Sat Oct 19 14:56:10 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 19 Oct 2002 21:56:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 13143 invoked from network); 19 Oct 2002 21:56:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Oct 2002 21:56:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Oct 2002 21:56:09 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.35]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Sat, 19 Oct 2002 17:55:01 -0400 Message-ID: <000e01c277ba$252e2a00$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: XM radio Date: Sat, 19 Oct 2002 17:54:48 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 I can do that- I have the Ripflash direct line in to MP3 recorder. I, too was still not sure when i was in Best Buy, but I liked it enough to buy it- if for no other reason than to have some variety- and it sure fills the bill there. With 175 channels now, it is hard not to find something cool. The only problem is ripping myself away from it- every time I go to shut it off, another song I had forgotten about starts playing. cc ----- Original Message ----- From: Kevin T. To: Sent: Saturday, October 19, 2002 5:32 PM Subject: {AMSF} Re: XM radio > If you could possibly find a way to capture XM's audio into an MP3 > file -- or even a CD-R disc -- From philipr@irac.pe.ca Sat Oct 19 18:19:20 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 20 Oct 2002 01:19:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 25021 invoked from network); 20 Oct 2002 01:19:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Oct 2002 01:19:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Oct 2002 01:19:19 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.146] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 20 Oct 2002 01:19:19 -0000 Date: Sun, 20 Oct 2002 01:19:15 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: AM Stereo in Japan Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2215 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.166.158.71 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking Fascinating, not only the incredible sound quality - but also the music, the IDs etc. The dynamic range is a real treat. I'd love to know what receiver was used. To my ears, this sounds like its going up a lot higher than 9 or 10khz. How much band width are these stations running anyway? Phil --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin T." wrote: > I just came across the following MP3 files on the AM Stereo FTP > server, and they are all recordings of AM Stereo stations in Japan. > I haven't listened to them all yet, but the ones of JOLF, JOQR, and > JOKR are all of extremely high quality -- flat frequency response, > wide separation, high dynamic range, and no distortion. > > I don't know what receiver was used for these recordings, but a > spectrum analysis graph reveals that it has carefully placed notch > filters at 25 Hz, 50 Hz, 100 Hz, and 9 kHz to cut out the pilot tone, > AC hum, and carrier whistle -- so it might even be directly from a > C-Quam mod monitor. In any case, if you take the time to download > these files, you will be treated to gorgeous AM Stereo sound that > would put almost any FM station to shame -- in particular, since > these Japanese stations seem to use noticeably more relaxed audio > processing than U.S. stations; I guess the "Loudness War" isn't so > extreme over there. > > Here are the links to download: > > ftp://209.193.86.116/JOLF1242.mp3 > ftp://209.193.86.116/JOLF1242_Test_Transmission.mp3 > ftp://209.193.86.116/JOQR1134_Test_Transmission_%28QR_Song_98% 29.mp3 > ftp://209.193.86.116/TBS_JOKR954.mp3 > ftp://209.193.86.116/TBS_JOKR954_2.mp3 > ftp://209.193.86.116/TBS_JOKR954_3.mp3 > ftp://209.193.86.116/HBC_Sapporo_JOHR1287.mp3 > ftp://209.193.86.116/HBC_Sapporo_JOHR1287_1.mp3 > ftp://209.193.86.116/HBC_Sapporo_JOHR1287_2.mp3 > ftp://209.193.86.116/HBC_Sapporo_JOHR1287_3.mp3 > > p.s. I can make out call letter and network IDs, "kilohertz", and > "AM radio" in English amongst the Japanese speech, but so far nothing > resembling the word "Stereo" (unlike Thailand, where almost every > AM Stereo station includes the English phrase "AM Stereo" in its ID-- > and also "Multiplex Stereo" for FM stations). From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Oct 19 19:36:10 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 20 Oct 2002 02:36:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 12619 invoked from network); 20 Oct 2002 02:36:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Oct 2002 02:36:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Oct 2002 02:36:09 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.169] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 20 Oct 2002 02:36:09 -0000 Date: Sun, 20 Oct 2002 02:36:05 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: AM Stereo in Japan Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1622 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.70.10 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Fascinating, not only the incredible sound quality - but also the > music, the IDs etc. The dynamic range is a real treat. Indeed... and I noticed one of the songs played by JOHR sounds almost like a Japanese version of Kelly Clarkson's "A Moment Like This".... ftp://209.193.86.116/HBC_Sapporo_JOHR1287.mp3 Okay, maybe not an exact copy of it... but the melody and voice are quite similar, IMO. > I'd love to know what receiver was used. To my ears, this sounds > like its going up a lot higher than 9 or 10khz. How much band > width are these stations running anyway? The MP3 encoding of these files varies between 10 and 15 kHz audio bandwidth, the best being the recordings of JOHR (1287 kHz), which appears to be transmitting about 12.5 kHz of audio bandwidth -- enough for a pleasingly crisp fidelity, without the "sizzle" of FM's extremely compressed top end. This is interesting because I thought Japanese AM stations were limited to the same ~8.5 kHz audio bandwidth (to fit within the 9 kHz channel spacing) as in Australia, but just as with Australian stations, it seems that this limit is either overlooked or is not applicable to AM Stereo stations, or perhaps is only applied to stations on certain frequencies and power levels (similar to North America's Class A, B, C, and D categories for AM stations). In any event, this just goes to show the clean, clear, "natural" sound that analog C-Quam AM Stereo is capable of -- something that IBOC/"HD" digital will never be able to provide, at least without a *major* revolution in the quality of "lossy" digital audio compression. From alfredot@inetarena.com Sat Oct 19 19:43:57 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: alfredot@inetarena.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 20 Oct 2002 02:43:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 90150 invoked from network); 20 Oct 2002 02:43:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Oct 2002 02:43:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.inetarena.com) (206.129.216.13) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Oct 2002 02:43:56 -0000 Received: from hendrie (1Cust91.tnt16.beaverton.or.da.uu.net [67.227.163.91]) by mail.inetarena.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id g9K2gOR09025 for ; Sat, 19 Oct 2002 19:42:24 -0700 (PDT) Date: Sat, 19 Oct 2002 19:43:36 -0700 (PDT) X-Sender: alfredo@hendrie.1610am.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: PLEASE! PLEASE!! PLEASE!!! In-Reply-To: <1034934849.2101.24859.m12@yahoogroups.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: "Alfredo E. Torrejon" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=25132238 X-Yahoo-Profile: alfredotorrejon I'm submitting the following. I've tried to make it as brief and non-technical as possible. --- The failure that consumers experienced with AM Stereo was largely the fault of receiver manufacturers. In the early 1990s, a set of receiver performance standards was established in the United States that would have given AM stations the potential for sound nearly as crisp and static-free as FM stereo. Unfortunately, most consumer electronics manufacturers ignored the standards, presumably because their marketing research showed that improved AM performance would not be an effective selling point for a radio. Thus, the widespread perception--both in the USA and internationally--of AM radio as an antiquated, low quality mono broadcast medium continues to this day. From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sat Oct 19 21:56:17 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 20 Oct 2002 04:56:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 10968 invoked from network); 20 Oct 2002 04:56:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Oct 2002 04:56:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.89) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Oct 2002 04:56:16 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.157] by n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 20 Oct 2002 04:56:16 -0000 Date: Sun, 20 Oct 2002 04:56:14 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: XM radio Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <000501c277b2$a3e87600$0101a8c0@pavilion> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1500 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.251 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Christopher Cuff" wrote: > Guys, I got an XM radio. My opinion? I LOVE it! > The message I would have for broadcasters is "be afraid"- be VERY afraid. > This stuff is incredible. > I got on sale a Delphi unit, with the home kit at Best Buy- out the door > with everything $200.00 > After a brief setup, and initializing, it is the cats pajamas- There is > stereo on all channels- even the 40's channel. Just played Tommy Dorsey, in > full stereo. > Is it CD quality? Nope- Is it better than FM?- Oh yes. > Just waiting for the car kit to come in, and I will be all set. > If only broadcast radio could be like this again... > (btw- it re-broadcasts in AM stereo well, too..:-) > Chris I would say that the crummy sound on FM has a lot to do with processing as our local college/NPR station that plays classical has a very natural and excellent sound. FM is great for the home especcially if you have a good antenna but it does suffer multipath in the car and that's where AM works best. To bad that the radio landscape didn't turn out that way. FM for stationary locations and AM for mobile. It looks like that the whole IBOC thing is about adding a lot more than one channel of information to a single station to compete with the 160 or so channels on satellite radio. This may work for FM with the wide bandwidth assigned to each channel but on AM you can't get any more quality/channels by going digital that you don't already have with analog. JSG From groucho@skyweb.net Sun Oct 20 01:15:12 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 20 Oct 2002 08:15:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 34932 invoked from network); 20 Oct 2002 08:15:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Oct 2002 08:15:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Oct 2002 08:15:11 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g9K8HjGr037270 for ; Sun, 20 Oct 2002 04:17:45 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DB2643A.95CB52C3@skyweb.net> Date: Sun, 20 Oct 2002 04:07:22 -0400 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC -Cquam.. References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 I just thought It would Be interesting to Find out If the management Of WPHE 690 knows about IBOC on 710 ... today I was driving down between trenton and Philly... and listening to 700 710 720 back and Forth... then slipped and went to 690 wow a Spanish station. that was getting Clobbered by the Hash.. I never knew it was there... looking it up in the FCC database its WPHE 690 down near Philly in Phoenixville, PA a 1 KW daytime Only station. Gee IBOC is on only during the Day... so that means from sunrise to sunset. they are Getting Clobbered.... .. anyone on the list Down that way to verify this..I know that If I was a normal listener of that station living in the Trenton area. and knew what the new interference was being caused by.. you bet I would Be on the Phone. Interesting thought.... Neal "Kevin T." wrote: > > Ok enough Flame on WOR....... Just fix it.... when the IBOC is On > > and there is no hash on Either adjacent maybe I'll accept IBOC.. > > Over the years, they have redesigned the IBOC system numerous times > because it has never worked as well as they wanted it to. Originally, > the digital sidebands actually *did* fit within the +/- 10 kHz NRSC > bandwidth limit, and it had a 96 kbps data rate for the digital > audio. Then, they dropped the digital rate down to 48 kbps. Now > it's at 36 kbps in "Enhanced Stereo" mode and 20 kbps in "Mono" mode, > and they have added on an additional layer of digital sidebands > extending to a +/- 15 kHz bandwidth. > > iBiquity says this is okay because it still fits into the "40 kHz > total bandwidth" that AM stations are supposedly allocated. Maybe > that's the case out in Alaska or Hawaii where there are only a > handful of AM stations on the dial, but here in the metro NYC area, > we have arrangements like 1040 kHz in NJ, 1050 in NYC, 1060 in > Philly, 1070 in NJ, 1080 in CT, etc... stations are jam-packed all > across the dial, even in the Expanded Band with the new low-power > TIS/Community Info stations that have popped up. > > As-is, IBOC *might* have a chance of being successful, but *only* on > the 50,000-watt Class A clear channel stations (like 710 WOR), which > are the only ones which still have adequate "protection" of their > adjancet channels during the daytime. Anything less -- even a 50,000 > watt Class B station like 1010 WINS -- is going to run into major > problems if they try to use IBOC, not only from adjacent channel > interference but from things like directional signal nulls, which can > already turn a regular analog signal into nothing but unintelligible > distortion (especially in the case of WINS's nulls toward NJ). > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Sun Oct 20 06:22:44 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 20 Oct 2002 13:22:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 33387 invoked from network); 20 Oct 2002 13:22:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Oct 2002 13:22:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14204.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.146) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Oct 2002 13:22:43 -0000 Message-ID: <20021020132242.65309.qmail@web14204.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.127.54.32] by web14204.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 20 Oct 2002 06:22:42 PDT Date: Sun, 20 Oct 2002 06:22:42 -0700 (PDT) Subject: XM thoughts To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: Johnny Electron X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio CCuff wrote: Guys, I got an XM radio. My opinion? I LOVE it! When I 'torture tested' an XM radio at BestBuy, I noted that several channels had 'fake stereo' like the 60's Capitol & Camdem LP's of 50's recordings; that is, there was even a setting to put treble in the left, or treble in the right channel to make bogus stereo. Also, there's digital monkeybusiness to produce all of the frequencies above 6KHz, so as not to waste bandwidth. I don't disagree that the programming is what broadcast radio needs, but I think if they cut the number of channels in half and doubled the bit rate quality on the remaining channel, they could have a winner for $5 a month. Also, how does it work driving down a tree-lined street? __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Y! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your web site http://webhosting.yahoo.com/ From evergreenterrace@buzzle.com Sun Oct 20 06:22:56 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: evergreenterrace@buzzle.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 20 Oct 2002 13:22:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 27469 invoked from network); 20 Oct 2002 13:22:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Oct 2002 13:22:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Oct 2002 13:22:56 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.152] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 20 Oct 2002 13:22:56 -0000 Date: Sun, 20 Oct 2002 13:22:55 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: WREF Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <002701c27678$2cd67340$0101a8c0@pavilion> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 198 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgliradio" X-Originating-IP: 170.20.11.59 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=69711087 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgliradio --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Christopher Cuff" wrote: > Dennis Jackson is the engineer behind WREF's great sound. I have met him, > and he is a great guy. Does WREF use the CRL Amigo? From stodd@sherbtel.net Sun Oct 20 11:28:55 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 20 Oct 2002 18:28:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 84329 invoked from network); 20 Oct 2002 18:28:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Oct 2002 18:28:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Oct 2002 18:28:51 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-88-176.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.176]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g9KINYjR018045 for ; Sun, 20 Oct 2002 13:23:35 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <001301c27866$980d4900$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: <3DB2643A.95CB52C3@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC -Cquam.. Date: Sun, 20 Oct 2002 13:29:12 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude If any station in my market starts interfering with any of my signals, they won't have to wait for someone in the audience to call- they're gonna get one from ME, followed by a signed letter on station letterhead, with a copy to the FCC. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Neal Newman" ..I know that If I was a > normal listener of that station living in the Trenton area. and knew what the > new interference was being caused by.. you bet I would Be on the Phone. > Interesting thought.... From stodd@sherbtel.net Sun Oct 20 11:31:13 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 20 Oct 2002 18:31:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 46358 invoked from network); 20 Oct 2002 18:30:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Oct 2002 18:30:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Oct 2002 18:30:54 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-88-176.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.176]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g9KIPbjR018368 for ; Sun, 20 Oct 2002 13:25:39 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <002301c27866$e1747be0$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: PLEASE! PLEASE!! PLEASE!!! Date: Sun, 20 Oct 2002 13:31:15 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Where were you going to post this again? I'd like to see the responses, if any. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Alfredo E. Torrejon" I'm submitting the following. I've tried to make it as brief and > non-technical as possible. > > --- > The failure that consumers experienced with AM Stereo was largely the > fault of receiver manufacturers. From KC4QLP@aol.com Sun Oct 20 12:09:22 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 20 Oct 2002 19:09:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 83832 invoked from network); 20 Oct 2002 19:09:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Oct 2002 19:09:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r03.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.99) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Oct 2002 19:09:21 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.129.194814f0 (30950) for ; Sun, 20 Oct 2002 15:09:16 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <129.194814f0.2ae4595b@aol.com> Date: Sun, 20 Oct 2002 15:09:15 EDT Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC -Cquam.. To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 10/20/02 2:28:14 PM Eastern Daylight Time, stodd@sherbtel.net writes: << If any station in my market starts interfering with any of my signals, they won't have to wait for someone in the audience to call- they're gonna get one from ME, followed by a signed letter on station letterhead, with a copy to the FCC. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Neal Newman" ..I know that If I was a > normal listener of that station living in the Trenton area. and knew what the > new interference was being caused by.. you bet I would Be on the Phone. > Interesting thought.... >> HERE! HERE! I second that as well! Bob Carter Operations/Engineering WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5..., Ray Communications Radio Network Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereoradio-subcribe@topica.com amstereo-subcribe@topica.com amstereoradio-subscribe@yahoogroups.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ WARNING TO UNSOLICITED SPAMMERS !!! Pursuant to U.S. Code, title 47, Chapter 5, Subchapter II, "Any and all nonsolicited E-mail (SPAM) sent to this address is subject to a download and archival fee of 500 U.S."!! E-mailing denotes acceptance of these terms." Your message (if actually mailed) is in violation of the Federal Telephone Consumer Protection Act of 1991, and Collateral Code of Federal Regulations (47 CFR 64.1200). The TCPA allows a private right of action against the sender of unsolicited advertising. The recipient can sue for $500, or actualdamages (whichever is greater). ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------- Osama bin Laden can kiss my royal white American behind! From groucho@skyweb.net Sun Oct 20 16:32:12 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 20 Oct 2002 23:32:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 97038 invoked from network); 20 Oct 2002 23:32:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Oct 2002 23:32:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Oct 2002 23:32:10 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g9KNYiGr048984 for ; Sun, 20 Oct 2002 19:34:45 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DB33B1A.A7B2EE92@skyweb.net> Date: Sun, 20 Oct 2002 19:24:10 -0400 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC -Cquam.. References: <129.194814f0.2ae4595b@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 well its 2 different markets.. The Spanish daytimer is in the Philly Market and WOR is the NY market. however you cannot Compair the signal of a 1 kW to the 50kw blowtorch. But the NY market station is interfering with the Philly stations signal In the Trenton/philly market area... KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 10/20/02 2:28:14 PM Eastern Daylight Time, > stodd@sherbtel.net writes: > > << If any station in my market starts interfering with any of my signals, they > won't have to wait for someone in the audience to call- they're gonna get > one from ME, followed by a signed letter on station letterhead, with a copy > to the FCC. > > ST > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Neal Newman" > > ..I know that If I was a > > normal listener of that station living in the Trenton area. and knew what > the > > new interference was being caused by.. you bet I would Be on the Phone. > > Interesting thought.... > > >> > HERE! HERE! I second that as well! > > Bob Carter > Operations/Engineering > > WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 > Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5..., Ray Communications Radio > Network > > Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering > services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. > e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net > http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice > Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC > WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC > WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC > > AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- > amstereoradio-subcribe@topica.com > > amstereo-subcribe@topica.com > amstereoradio-subscribe@yahoogroups.com > > KC4QLP Amateur Radio > Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va > www.kc4qlp.cjb.net > > voice contact-252-335-0856 > fax 1-209-254-8978 > _______________________________________________________ > > WARNING TO UNSOLICITED SPAMMERS !!! Pursuant to U.S. Code, title 47, Chapter > 5, Subchapter II, > > "Any and all nonsolicited E-mail (SPAM) sent to this address is subject to a > download and archival fee of 500 U.S."!! E-mailing denotes acceptance of > these terms." > Your message (if actually mailed) is in violation of the Federal Telephone > Consumer Protection Act of 1991, and Collateral Code of Federal Regulations > (47 CFR 64.1200). The TCPA allows a private right of action against the > sender of unsolicited advertising. The recipient can sue for $500, or > actualdamages (whichever is greater). > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > ------------------- > > Osama bin Laden can kiss my royal white American behind! > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Oct 20 18:16:05 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 21 Oct 2002 01:16:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 99011 invoked from network); 21 Oct 2002 01:16:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Oct 2002 01:16:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.88) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Oct 2002 01:16:03 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.188] by n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 21 Oct 2002 01:16:03 -0000 Date: Mon, 21 Oct 2002 01:16:01 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: IBOC -Cquam.. Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3DB33B1A.A7B2EE92@skyweb.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2284 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.87.147 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > well its 2 different markets.. The Spanish daytimer is in the > Philly Market and WOR is the NY market. however you cannot Compair > the signal of a 1 kW to the 50kw blowtorch. But the NY market > station is interfering with the Philly stations signal In the > Trenton/philly market area... Like I said, only 50,000-watt Class A (formerly Class I-A and I-B) stations have the kind of "protection" that would allow them to use IBOC without stepping onto each other or other stations. Even 50,000-watt Class B stations wouldn't work out. For example, 1050 WEVD in New York City has its 50,000-watt transmitter just a few dozen miles away from 250-watt 1070 WKMB in Stirling, NJ, which wouldn't stand a chance if WEVD decided to use IBOC. Then you have NYC's 30,000-watt 1190 WLIB also in close range to 1170 WWTR in central NJ. And think of the mess if 1660 WWRU decided to use IBOC -- you can bet that 1680 WTTM would be flooded with complaints about the interference! Unless they come up with some sort of "IBOC Lite" that uses a reduced bandwidth, I honestly do not believe that it will be a success for anything except the mega-signal 50 kW Class A stations... not only because of the interference, but because they are the only ones who can afford the equipment and the licensing fees to use IBOC. FYI, here are the stations that may potentially get interference from WOR's daytime IBOC signal, listed with daytime power level and distance from WOR's transmitter site, and also a link to the station's coverage map: 690 WADS Ansonia, CT - 3200W (DA-D) - 64 miles http://www.radio-locator.com/pats/WADS_AM_LD.gif 690 WPHE Phoenixville, PA - 1000W (DA-D) - 89 miles http://www.radio-locator.com/pats/WPHE_AM_LD.gif 700 WCAT Orange-Athol, MA - 2500W (ND-D) - 155 miles http://www.radio-locator.com/pats/WCAT_AM_LD.gif 700 WGOP Poolesville, MD - 25,000W (DA-D) - 194 miles http://www.radio-locator.com/pats/WGOP_AM_LD.gif 720 WWII Shiremanstown, PA - 2000W (ND-D) - 156 miles http://www.radio-locator.com/pats/WWII_AM_LD.gif 720 WVOA East Syracuse, NY - 1500W (DA-D) - 189 miles new Construction Permit - not on air yet And, for reference, here is the coverage map of 710 WOR's daytime signal itself: http://www.radio-locator.com/pats/WOR_AM_LU.gif From groucho@skyweb.net Sun Oct 20 20:54:04 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 21 Oct 2002 03:54:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 12586 invoked from network); 21 Oct 2002 03:54:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Oct 2002 03:54:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Oct 2002 03:54:02 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g9L3uaGr001183 for ; Sun, 20 Oct 2002 23:56:37 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DB37873.123A69B3@skyweb.net> Date: Sun, 20 Oct 2002 23:45:55 -0400 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC -Cquam.. References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Ohhh Man that's hurts.. If I know that WPHE is getting slammed.. I feel Sorry for WADS.. they Might as well go off the air. their signal and WOR's overlap. I was not sure if that was a second Spanish station that I heard . Now I know it was.. last night at sunset I thought I heard French. So I now know that was Montreal CINF on 690. hell I know they are in the testing stage. But this is Nuts.... Neal "Kevin T." wrote: > > well its 2 different markets.. The Spanish daytimer is in the > > Philly Market and WOR is the NY market. however you cannot Compair > > the signal of a 1 kW to the 50kw blowtorch. But the NY market > > station is interfering with the Philly stations signal In the > > Trenton/philly market area... > > Like I said, only 50,000-watt Class A (formerly Class I-A and I-B) > stations have the kind of "protection" that would allow them to use > IBOC without stepping onto each other or other stations. > > Even 50,000-watt Class B stations wouldn't work out. For example, > 1050 WEVD in New York City has its 50,000-watt transmitter just a few > dozen miles away from 250-watt 1070 WKMB in Stirling, NJ, which > wouldn't stand a chance if WEVD decided to use IBOC. Then you have > NYC's 30,000-watt 1190 WLIB also in close range to 1170 WWTR in > central NJ. And think of the mess if 1660 WWRU decided to use IBOC > -- you can bet that 1680 WTTM would be flooded with complaints about > the interference! > > Unless they come up with some sort of "IBOC Lite" that uses a reduced > bandwidth, I honestly do not believe that it will be a success for > anything except the mega-signal 50 kW Class A stations... not only > because of the interference, but because they are the only ones who > can afford the equipment and the licensing fees to use IBOC. > > FYI, here are the stations that may potentially get interference from > WOR's daytime IBOC signal, listed with daytime power level and > distance from WOR's transmitter site, and also a link to the > station's coverage map: > > 690 WADS Ansonia, CT - 3200W (DA-D) - 64 miles > http://www.radio-locator.com/pats/WADS_AM_LD.gif > > 690 WPHE Phoenixville, PA - 1000W (DA-D) - 89 miles > http://www.radio-locator.com/pats/WPHE_AM_LD.gif > > 700 WCAT Orange-Athol, MA - 2500W (ND-D) - 155 miles > http://www.radio-locator.com/pats/WCAT_AM_LD.gif > > 700 WGOP Poolesville, MD - 25,000W (DA-D) - 194 miles > http://www.radio-locator.com/pats/WGOP_AM_LD.gif > > 720 WWII Shiremanstown, PA - 2000W (ND-D) - 156 miles > http://www.radio-locator.com/pats/WWII_AM_LD.gif > > 720 WVOA East Syracuse, NY - 1500W (DA-D) - 189 miles > new Construction Permit - not on air yet > > And, for reference, here is the coverage map of 710 WOR's daytime > signal itself: > http://www.radio-locator.com/pats/WOR_AM_LU.gif > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Sun Oct 20 21:10:14 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 21 Oct 2002 04:10:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 93909 invoked from network); 21 Oct 2002 04:09:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Oct 2002 04:09:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14204.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.146) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Oct 2002 04:09:52 -0000 Message-ID: <20021021040952.51603.qmail@web14204.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.127.54.32] by web14204.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 20 Oct 2002 21:09:52 PDT Date: Sun, 20 Oct 2002 21:09:52 -0700 (PDT) Subject: XM Radio? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: Johnny Electron X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio Chris Cuff: XM Radio - have you gone to the dark side of the force? Listen to WIRY "Hometown Radio" and tell me if XM has a station like that? Does XM sound as good as AMS in a moving vehicle? __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Y! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your web site http://webhosting.yahoo.com/ From ccuff@in4web.com Mon Oct 21 00:38:59 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 21 Oct 2002 07:38:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 94792 invoked from network); 21 Oct 2002 07:38:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Oct 2002 07:38:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Oct 2002 07:38:58 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.32]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Mon, 21 Oct 2002 03:37:51 -0400 Message-ID: <001501c278d4$baa0dea0$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: <20021021040952.51603.qmail@web14204.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} XM Radio? Date: Mon, 21 Oct 2002 03:37:36 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 Heh heh... No, I haven't gone to the "Dark side".. My XM is in the house. The car kit for my car is not in stock yet, so I got the home base station. The only reason for this was to hear different stuff- and it sure delivers there. My parents love it- The 40's channel was on all day yesterday- the happiness it brought them was worth it all, as they can't get out much anymore. The only radio up here is hip-hop and rock. These things will never make it as portables, as the antenna has to be outside. There is NO signal when the antenna is indoors, so the radio has to be in one spot. I still have hopes that REAL radio will return, but as a "jukebox"- XM fits a need. CC ----- Original Message ----- From: Johnny Electron To: Sent: Monday, October 21, 2002 12:09 AM Subject: {AMSF} XM Radio? > Chris Cuff: XM Radio - have you gone to the dark side of the force? > From watan-ko@h4.dion.ne.jp Mon Oct 21 07:04:34 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: watan-ko@h4.dion.ne.jp X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 21 Oct 2002 14:04:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 60973 invoked from network); 21 Oct 2002 14:04:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Oct 2002 14:04:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hfep05.dion.ne.jp) (203.181.105.71) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Oct 2002 14:04:32 -0000 Received: from koji ([61.202.60.217]) by hfep05.dion.ne.jp with ESMTP id <20021021140431494.STZA@hfep05.dion.ne.jp> for ; Mon, 21 Oct 2002 23:04:31 +0900 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: AM Stereo in Japan Message-Id: <200210212259.BDI43783.OLBXUBP-@h4.dion.ne.jp> X-Mailer: Winbiff [Version 2.41] X-Accept-Language: ja,en Date: Mon, 21 Oct 2002 22:59:39 +0900 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: Koji WATANABE X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=67253313 X-Yahoo-Profile: irukero Dear Kevin, Thank you for your info about Japanese MP3 files. However, I suspect these files were recorded by radio. I think they were recorded through internet radio. In Japan, the simultaneous broadcasting through internet is not allowed, but some programs are broadcast through net. Also, even in Tokyo, we can't hear stations like TBS, JOLF and JOKR, which are in Tokyo, so clearly in these files. P.S. According to Nikkei news paper, Motorola semiconductor division will be taken over by French/Italian ST micro-electronics. Does anyone hear the news? Koji Watanabe Nagoya, Japan From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Oct 21 07:53:20 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 21 Oct 2002 14:53:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 77488 invoked from network); 21 Oct 2002 14:53:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Oct 2002 14:53:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.86) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Oct 2002 14:53:19 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.189] by n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 21 Oct 2002 14:53:19 -0000 Date: Mon, 21 Oct 2002 14:53:18 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Fwd: WOR - 710AM Interference Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 656 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics From another message board.... WOR - 710AM Interference Posted by Greg on October 21, 2002 at 08:19:54: I am wondering if it is just me or not. In the past couple of months, I have noticed that WOR on 710kHz has been generating noise below and above their main frequency of 710kHz. The noise extends from 680kHz to 730kHz and it takes the form of a noise rushhh. If its just me, I'll have to look into the local source but if it isn't, why has WOR Engineering not done anything about this? Better yet, why has the FCC not done anything? Don't the guys down on Varick Street pride themselves on being tough on these types of issues? From amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk Mon Oct 21 08:30:54 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 21 Oct 2002 15:30:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 61922 invoked from network); 21 Oct 2002 15:30:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Oct 2002 15:30:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Oct 2002 15:30:49 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.137] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 21 Oct 2002 15:30:49 -0000 Date: Mon, 21 Oct 2002 15:30:47 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: AM Stereo in Japan Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 430 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Dave" X-Originating-IP: 213.121.70.176 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113985069 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereofan > p.s. I can make out call letter and network IDs, "kilohertz", and > "AM radio" in English amongst the Japanese speech, but so far nothing > resembling the word "Stereo" (unlike Thailand, where almost every > AM Stereo station includes the English phrase "AM Stereo" in its ID- - > and also "Multiplex Stereo" for FM stations). Excellent AMS. I did'nt know about this ftp site. Do you have any recs of Thai AMS sts ? From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Oct 21 10:47:40 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 21 Oct 2002 17:47:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 66765 invoked from network); 21 Oct 2002 17:47:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Oct 2002 17:47:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Oct 2002 17:47:40 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.165] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 21 Oct 2002 17:47:39 -0000 Date: Mon, 21 Oct 2002 17:47:37 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: AM Stereo in Japan Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <200210212259.BDI43783.OLBXUBP-@h4.dion.ne.jp> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 758 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Thank you for your info about Japanese MP3 files. > However, I suspect these files were recorded by radio. I think they > were recorded through internet radio. In Japan, the simultaneous > broadcasting through internet is not allowed, but some programs are > broadcast through net. > Also, even in Tokyo, we can't hear stations like TBS, JOLF and > JOKR, which are in Tokyo, so clearly in these files. I think they are actually real recordings of AM Stereo radio. If you listen closely, you can hear some background noise, and in some of them, the signal drops out or gets weak and you can hear the static and carrier whistle. I think they were just recorded with a *very* good radio -- perhaps one of the "high-end" Japan-only AM Stereo radios. From philipr@irac.pe.ca Mon Oct 21 12:45:40 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 21 Oct 2002 19:45:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 68968 invoked from network); 21 Oct 2002 19:45:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Oct 2002 19:45:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Oct 2002 19:45:38 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.181] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 21 Oct 2002 19:45:38 -0000 Date: Mon, 21 Oct 2002 19:45:37 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: AM Stereo in Japan Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2031 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking I agree with Kevin - there is a very faint level of background noise which sounds very similar to what I experience when using my Alfredo- Lite transmitter with my Heath PT-1. It's subtle, but there. In addition, on some of the clips - the last 2 or 3 if my memory is correct, there is some subtle signs of fading - similar to what is often experienced near the NIF contour at night. The groundwave predominates, but there is just enough skywave action to slightly unsettle the signal, as opposed to more deep fading. The other possibility is that the signal is outside the NIF contour, but an extra good detector and AGC may be at work here. My theory is that they were recorded on a Sony A100 or equivelent rig - it certainly sounds like the highs are exceeding 10 khz. Something that may be a good idea to demonstrate hi-fi AM on clips is to start off by actually tuning the station in - then it becomes abundantly clear that it is recorded off an AM radio. Some AM stereo stations do have an FM transmitter or transmitters, so this technique demonstrates that it is actually a recording of the AM, rather than the simulcasting FM transmitter. Phil --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin T." wrote: > > Thank you for your info about Japanese MP3 files. > > However, I suspect these files were recorded by radio. I think they > > were recorded through internet radio. In Japan, the simultaneous > > broadcasting through internet is not allowed, but some programs are > > broadcast through net. > > Also, even in Tokyo, we can't hear stations like TBS, JOLF and > > JOKR, which are in Tokyo, so clearly in these files. > > I think they are actually real recordings of AM Stereo radio. If you > listen closely, you can hear some background noise, and in some of > them, the signal drops out or gets weak and you can hear the static > and carrier whistle. I think they were just recorded with a *very* > good radio -- perhaps one of the "high-end" Japan-only AM Stereo > radios. From philipr@irac.pe.ca Mon Oct 21 12:55:27 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 21 Oct 2002 19:55:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 20896 invoked from network); 21 Oct 2002 19:55:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Oct 2002 19:55:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.84) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Oct 2002 19:55:27 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.185] by n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 21 Oct 2002 19:55:16 -0000 Date: Mon, 21 Oct 2002 19:55:16 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: DSP and Symphony Chip Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1544 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking I posted this question(s) on the Ramsey website and received this response from their lead engineer: Is Ramsey going to come up with a DSP kit? Such a kit would be very useful for removing all the digital hash, given that the FCC has just approved IBOC, which will produce massive adjacent channel interference on the AM and FM bands. Also, Motorola recently announced their new Symphony receiver chip. This combines DSP technology to give conventional analogue AM and FM better reception, and includes AM Stereo capability. Motorola made sure that AM stereo code was written - a smart move on their part given that IBOC likely will be a major flop. Is Ramsey looking at a kit using the Symphony chip, or the similar chip offered by Philips? --------------------------------------------------------------------- ----------- Posts: 195 | From: Prince Edward Island Canada | IP: Logged Mark W Ramsey Employee Member # 14 Rate Member posted October 21, 2002 03:33 PM --------------------------------------------------------------------- ----------- We had a DSP kit at one time, but DSP technology was changing so fast that it made it obsolete fairly quickly. We simply cannot keep up with one-year product cycles on products and continue to pump out all of the other stuff we do. We do want to produce another one however, and you may see one in the future, hopefully! As far as the Motorola chips, we have not looked into them yet, but they sound interesting, thanks for the tip! -Mark W. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Oct 21 14:25:09 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 21 Oct 2002 21:25:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 77889 invoked from network); 21 Oct 2002 21:25:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Oct 2002 21:25:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.86) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Oct 2002 21:25:08 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.174] by n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 21 Oct 2002 21:25:07 -0000 Date: Mon, 21 Oct 2002 21:25:07 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: AM Stereo in Japan Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1554 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.91.41 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Something that may be a good idea to demonstrate hi-fi AM on clips > is to start off by actually tuning the station in - then it becomes > abundantly clear that it is recorded off an AM radio. Or, you can use a program like Cool Edit to do a "real time" spectrum analysis on the audio, allowing you to see things like the 25 Hz pilot tone, 9 or 10 kHz carrier whistle (or the notch filter to reduce it), and the limitation of the station's transmitted audio bandwidth. Some other wide-response AM Stereo recordings I'm proud of are of New York's 1600 WWRL in the summer of 2000, when they were transmitting excellent AM Stereo with response approaching 16 kHz! These were recorded during the daytime on a Sony SRF-A100 *outside of WWRL's 0.5 mV/m signal coverage contour* (try THAT with IBOC!).... ftp://209.193.86.116/North-America/USA/NewYork/wwrlnews.mp3 ftp://209.193.86.116/North-America/USA/NewYork/wwrlhist.mp3 ftp://209.193.86.116/North-America/USA/NewYork/wwrl-16s.mp3 ftp://209.193.86.116/North-America/USA/NewYork/wwrl-mix.mp3 There are all hosted on the reincarnation of the AM Stereo FTP server that belonged to Dennis's AM Stereo list. It was on the NRCDXAS server until that was shut down, but now it has reappared at: ftp://209.193.86.116/ Browse around and you'll find dozens upon dozens of AM Stereo MP3 recordings to download, although the file names don't give much clue as to the content of the audio, so unless you are familiar with the stations it will be an adventure to find the really good recordings. From ccuff@in4web.com Mon Oct 21 14:36:45 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 21 Oct 2002 21:36:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 26680 invoked from network); 21 Oct 2002 21:36:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Oct 2002 21:36:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Oct 2002 21:36:44 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.47]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Mon, 21 Oct 2002 17:35:37 -0400 Message-ID: <001601c27949$c33ca420$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: Subject: Fw: Hola Chris, Date: Mon, 21 Oct 2002 17:35:22 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 Hi all- Here is an email I just received, which I am passing along for anyone that might like to write him... CC ----- Original Message ----- From: Gregg E. Zuelke To: Sent: Monday, October 21, 2002 4:10 PM Subject: Hola Chris, > I was at the "National Association of Broadcaster's Radio Show" in Seattle > this past September. > > I have SERIOUS doubts that C-QUAM Stereo will ever fly. The current > technology is called "IBOC-AM", which when listening to it sounds like a > bright but watered down FM signal, being the bandwidth is only 5khz. It > definitely sounds stereo, but for the AM purists we may as well no longer > have AM, mono or C-QUAM. And the way the FCC was talking about > it at the luncheon I attended concerning IBOC, as soon as they can certify > night-time broadcasting with it, it will be approved and C-QUAM will be > gone. > > I'm not happy with either the AM or FM IBOC, but since people like > "ClearChannel", "AM/FM Inc.", "Citadel" and a few other big-wigs are > pushing for it --- since the sidebands will be used to advertise more > commercials to help bring in more money --- even the technical workshop > I attended for continuing credits for my 'Society of Broadcast Engineers' > certificates, 5 of the 7 hours of the presentation was designed for sales, > management and such on how to sell IBOC for $$$$, only the afternoon > had anything to do with the 'white-pages' technical aspect of how IBOC > works for engineering people --- so I suspect C-QUAM will soon be > gone since there are only two places still supporting C-QUAM, and > neither of them were at the NAB-R show. > > I wonder what ever happened to the phrase "The best interest of the > public" the FCC used to push a couple of decades ago. *SIGH* > > If you have anyone you can send this to or have a couple of e-mails > I can send this to, please let me know. And I'd like to know your > opinion on IBOC vs C-QUAM and the [most likely] impending > demise of C-QUAM for a horrible sounding FM-like bright sound. > > Gregg > Silver Springs, NV > P1-12-12947 (PG-GB-03757) (now no longer required licenses) > > From stodd@sherbtel.net Mon Oct 21 14:59:47 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 21 Oct 2002 21:59:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 78670 invoked from network); 21 Oct 2002 21:59:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Oct 2002 21:59:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Oct 2002 21:59:47 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-88-159.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.159]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g9LLs8jR015776 for ; Mon, 21 Oct 2002 16:54:25 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <000f01c2794d$3934cec0$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: <3DB37873.123A69B3@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC -Cquam.. Date: Mon, 21 Oct 2002 16:59:50 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude The IBOCle continues. AM broadcasters have been far too passive. Just think of what would have happened if the majority of AM stations, aside from the automated droids of the mega corporations, had joined in adding their names to my petition for better AM receiver standards? We'd have had radios improved to the point where they wouldn't have needed digital. I wonder if these other stations are just going to roll over and play dead and let WOR's digital hash decimate their audience? I hope not. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Neal Newman" > Ohhh Man that's hurts.. > If I know that WPHE is getting slammed.. I feel Sorry for WADS.. they Might > as well go off the air. From stodd@sherbtel.net Mon Oct 21 15:07:42 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 21 Oct 2002 22:07:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 60840 invoked from network); 21 Oct 2002 22:07:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Oct 2002 22:07:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Oct 2002 22:07:41 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-88-159.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.159]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g9LM2MjR017980 for ; Mon, 21 Oct 2002 17:02:23 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <002701c2794e$564a11e0$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} DSP and Symphony Chip Date: Mon, 21 Oct 2002 17:08:04 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Sorry to break the news to you, Phil, but AMS is NOT YET a part of the Symphony chip set. It COULD BE added, but until it is, you might not want to tell others it has it. OMEGA, OTOH, does have it, though I'm not sure how else their chip differs from Mot's. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Phil Rafuse" > Also, Motorola recently announced their new Symphony receiver chip. > This combines DSP technology to give conventional analogue AM and FM > better reception, and includes AM Stereo capability. Motorola made > sure that AM stereo code was written - a smart move on their part > given that IBOC likely will be a major flop. From stodd@sherbtel.net Mon Oct 21 15:12:04 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 21 Oct 2002 22:12:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 21373 invoked from network); 21 Oct 2002 22:12:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Oct 2002 22:12:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Oct 2002 22:12:03 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-88-159.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.159]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g9LM6hjR019185 for ; Mon, 21 Oct 2002 17:06:44 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <003501c2794e$f1dd0900$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: <200210212259.BDI43783.OLBXUBP-@h4.dion.ne.jp> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: AM Stereo in Japan Date: Mon, 21 Oct 2002 17:12:26 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Thank you for the news. I hadn't heard it until now. Somehow I don't think this is going to be good news. I fear they only want to raid their patents and then close the company down. Scott Todd ----- Original Message ----- From: "Koji WATANABE" > P.S. > > According to Nikkei news paper, Motorola semiconductor division will be > taken over by French/Italian ST micro-electronics. Does anyone hear the news? From evergreenterrace@buzzle.com Mon Oct 21 18:39:39 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: evergreenterrace@buzzle.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 22 Oct 2002 01:39:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 39506 invoked from network); 22 Oct 2002 01:39:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Oct 2002 01:39:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.90) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Oct 2002 01:39:37 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.157] by n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 22 Oct 2002 01:39:36 -0000 Date: Tue, 22 Oct 2002 01:39:36 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: WOR website IBOC update Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 104 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgliradio" X-Originating-IP: 170.20.11.59 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=69711087 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgliradio http://www.wor710.com/Engineering/iboc/hdindex.htm Included are samples.... The analog is still best. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Oct 21 20:49:59 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 22 Oct 2002 03:49:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 98334 invoked from network); 22 Oct 2002 03:49:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Oct 2002 03:49:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.84) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Oct 2002 03:49:57 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.133] by n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 22 Oct 2002 03:49:57 -0000 Date: Tue, 22 Oct 2002 03:49:54 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: WOR website IBOC update Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2076 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.91.41 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > http://www.wor710.com/Engineering/iboc/hdindex.htm > Included are samples.... > The analog is still best. ...Although, they managed to horribly over-modulate it to the point of digital clipping, even beyond the extreme audio processing that WOR has started to use to compensate for the analog coverage loss from using IBOC. Also, I am amused to hear that they have managed to make the IBOC digital audio sound even WORSE than a 32 kbps RealAudio 8.0 "webcast" on the internet. *That* is supposed to be "hi-fi, FM-quality"? That chattery, wishy-washy sound reminds me more of a 20 kbps Windows Media Audio file. I can only imagine what it would sound like in Stereo, with the total 36 kbps IBOC data rate shared between two audio channels instead of just one! And for comparison, even though it doesn't approach the true full quality that analog AM and AM Stereo has to offer, here is a recording of 710 WOR from back in 1997 when they were still putting out reasonably good analog mono sound -- and keep in mind this is nighttime reception, which as of yet is impossible with IBOC digital: http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/wor-hifi.mp3 In comparison, you can notice that the bass response on WOR's IBOC digital recording is rather weak, which further exaggerates the tinny, metallic sound of the low-bitrate digital audio. On any good radio -- even with a narrow audio response -- a well-processed analog AM signal (transmitted with full 10 kHz NRSC bandwidth) will sound more rich, natural, and indeed literally more "Hi-Fi" within the most important voice range of the lower frequencies. And if you're a fan of the type of sound that vacuum tubes used to deliver, analog AM is pretty much the only place left you can still hear broadcast media that sounds "mellow". It's the kind of sound you can't explain to someone who grew up with a Sony Discman instead of a Philco table radio, as it's almost as much of the sight and smell of glowing tubes and warm bakelite that produces the "mellow" sound, as it is the audio quality itself. From n0uiheric@aol.com Tue Oct 22 01:47:33 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 22 Oct 2002 08:47:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 39161 invoked from network); 22 Oct 2002 08:47:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Oct 2002 08:47:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m09.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.164) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Oct 2002 08:47:33 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-m09.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.72.24a8bafe (4262) for ; Tue, 22 Oct 2002 04:47:25 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <72.24a8bafe.2ae66a9d@aol.com> Date: Tue, 22 Oct 2002 04:47:25 EDT Subject: Re: {AMSF} XM Radio? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih I'm not impressed with XM...I heard it while I was getting my AM Mono/FM Stereo car radio (w/CD player) installed at Best Buy; seperation was FM-quality, at best. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From amstereo@optushome.com.au Tue Oct 22 06:03:26 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereo@optushome.com.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 22 Oct 2002 13:03:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 32335 invoked from network); 22 Oct 2002 13:03:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Oct 2002 13:03:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail010.syd.optusnet.com.au) (210.49.20.138) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Oct 2002 13:03:25 -0000 Received: from unit (c17302.ipswc1.qld.optusnet.com.au [210.49.44.162]) by mail010.syd.optusnet.com.au (8.11.1/8.11.1) with SMTP id g9MD3OF09097 for ; Tue, 22 Oct 2002 23:03:24 +1000 Message-ID: <001301c279cb$51521110$1a02a8c0@unit> To: Subject: WOR IBOC TESTS Date: Tue, 22 Oct 2002 23:02:46 +1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "amstereo - matt2" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=105920058 X-Yahoo-Profile: voltar_e Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I cant belive they payed all that money for that heap of crap. i compared it, and the quatisising effect (digital stepping) is so bad that it sounds JUST THE SAME AS the web stream on www.nova100.com.au website, and thats a 20Kbit/sec WMF stream. Try listening to wor's test file using a pair of ear phones, i just did, and i'm appaled. that audio is ferral, there should be laws that state if audio is advertised as Hi-Fi, then it should be 20 to 20Khz, and clean, a 64kbit/sec Mp3 sounds much more relaxed and clean compared to that iboc crap. Actually there is laws, FAULSE ADVERTISING. THE Signal isn't even FM like. the reason there 'samples' were done in 'WAV or PCM is because a second generation compression would kill the audio even more so. The worse bit, WOR digital will not survive in a car invironment because the road noise would render the audio in-audible. send direct links to these files to every radio station manager you can, because it's bad enough that the listeners are stuck with 4khz analogue audio due to recievers, the AM Band doesn't need another blow. I know what am can do, and i'm ashamed that the FCC allows this. they state that only listeners with high bandwidth radios will be able to hear the crap, So does that mean that stations who put out high definition analogue signals are going to be at a disadvantage because listeners will now have to by a new reciever that responds upto 3khz? 2khz for sony. nah, this is the death of the best listening post there is. --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.394 / Virus Database: 224 - Release Date: 3/10/2002 [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From philipr@irac.pe.ca Tue Oct 22 09:05:31 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 22 Oct 2002 16:05:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 61016 invoked from network); 22 Oct 2002 16:05:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Oct 2002 16:05:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.64) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Oct 2002 16:05:31 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.175] by n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 22 Oct 2002 16:05:30 -0000 Date: Tue, 22 Oct 2002 16:05:29 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: WOR website IBOC update Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1408 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking The analogue doesn't sound bad, for an Ibiquity reference radio. The digital has an annoying squeaking sound to try to distract the listener from the grainey digital synthesis of music and the human voice. The digital is listenable, but not HiFi, in the same way that SSB is listenable, but not hifi. And, this coarse, grainey, squeaky digital has a worse coverage area than analogue? Ibiquity, you've got to be kidding! This is the biggest marketing joke anyone has ever played on broadcasters and consumers! Maybe for 100% talks stations I could see digital - but only if it increased coverage, not decreased it. A bunch of years ago there was the CKO all news chain in Canada. It was all FM, typically 100kw Class C and C1 powerhouses. Part of CKO's glorious demise was blammed on the fact that a 60 mile coverage radius typical of high power FM amounted to one hour or less driving for the all important traveller/commuter market. By contrast, it was felt that successful 50 kw US talk stations had a 90 to 120 minute coverage radius, and you needed to hold the listner for 90 minutes. Now, imagine the digital coverage at say, 30 to 40 minutes tops. How will that hold the listener? Phil --- In amstereoforum@y..., "wgliradio" wrote: > http://www.wor710.com/Engineering/iboc/hdindex.htm > > Included are samples.... > > The analog is still best. From crashknorr@yahoo.com Tue Oct 22 12:16:12 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: crashknorr@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 22 Oct 2002 19:16:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 45041 invoked from network); 22 Oct 2002 19:16:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Oct 2002 19:16:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web11603.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.55) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Oct 2002 19:16:09 -0000 Message-ID: <20021022191609.76225.qmail@web11603.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [198.190.223.7] by web11603.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 22 Oct 2002 12:16:09 PDT Date: Tue, 22 Oct 2002 12:16:09 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: {AMSF} WOR IBOC TESTS To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: <001301c279cb$51521110$1a02a8c0@unit> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: Crash Knorr X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=20677990 X-Yahoo-Profile: crashknorr Obviously the hybrid mode is a mess, bad for the analog signal and probably bad for the digital signal too. The solution that some folks in the industry will likely propose is to abolish the analog signal altogether and to do it as soon as possible. __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Y! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your web site http://webhosting.yahoo.com/ From amstereo@optushome.com.au Tue Oct 22 14:31:37 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereo@optushome.com.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 22 Oct 2002 21:31:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 26019 invoked from network); 22 Oct 2002 21:31:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Oct 2002 21:31:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail012.syd.optusnet.com.au) (210.49.20.170) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Oct 2002 21:31:36 -0000 Received: from unit (c17302.ipswc1.qld.optusnet.com.au [210.49.44.162]) by mail012.syd.optusnet.com.au (8.11.1/8.11.1) with SMTP id g9MLVZN17857 for ; Wed, 23 Oct 2002 07:31:35 +1000 Message-ID: <000a01c27a12$2dcc7810$1a02a8c0@unit> To: Subject: Responce from WOR RE: IBOC Date: Wed, 23 Oct 2002 07:30:01 +1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "amstereo - matt2" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=105920058 X-Yahoo-Profile: voltar_e Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit HE THINKS HIS OUTPUTTING CLEAN DIGITAL AUDIO :) We know different don't we. ----- Original Message ----- From: amstereo - matt2 To: krichards@wor710.com Sent: Tuesday, October 22, 2002 9:28 AM Subject: You are kidding right? Mr K Richards, I can't believe you are happy about your stations output quality at the moment. IBOC has trashed your reputation as a broadcaster of true quality audio, shall i point you to a link that contains a recording of WOR's audio ~1997? http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/wor-hifi.mp3 WOR origional AMAX audio (10kHz) samle in mp3 (just to give iboc a chance) as you can hear, the only way to sound good on AM is in PURE analogue, and let DSP chips handle the cleanup process at the reciever end, Motorola and Philips are working on seperate DSP chips that will see AM sound better and FM sound smoother. AM is an environment that works very well. high bandwidth recievers are around, and they give FM a run for its money. You are alienating listeners who run high bandwidth recievers by the display of digital interference in your sidebands, there is an audio sample that shows what happens at your digital shut down time, when magically your analogue audio becomes clean. it's not only high bandwidth recievers, the roll off in many am recievers is gradual, and audio up to 9 khz still gets through though attenuated. the noise will still be presant in many cases. you should have gone for C-Quam am stereo in stead of IBOC, the chips are coming, AND AM Stereo has no licencing fees. Lucent can't make good modems, how are they supposed to make good AM digital. Ibiquity will never work. If it aint broke, don't try and fix it. this goes for AM, because it is the medium we fall back on during times of trouble because it is so easy to recieve. Digital will only serve to break AM as it's already in need of help, not in the signal area, but the programming. Hi-Fi is a designation that should never have been given to compressed audio streams especially one plagued with audio artifacts. Have a listen to this audio stream, and tell me if you can hear differences between IBOC and NOVA. (copy the following line in your browser from mms to .url mms--winmedialive.webhosting.bigpond.com-UCS-wh_nova100.url Nova100 melbourne AUSTRALIA audio stream 20kbit/sec, just as a comparison to WOR. http://www.wor710.com/Engineering/iboc/analog_dolans.wav WOR new analogue audio 5Khz limit (in pure WAV 5MB) http://www.wor710.com/Engineering/iboc/dolans_digital.wav WOR new IBOC digital audio (pure WAV so not to degrade the audio FURTHER) Guess which i'd choose. THE First one. AM Stereo isn't dead, it's waiting for the death of iboc then it'll be back, Motorola and Philips are working on am stereo DSP chip as we speak. Digital radio will only work in it's own band. SAVE THE AM Matt. WOR CE responce You must be kidding.............And more than likely have no experience as an engineer in any major or minor market. I am probably not going to make any sense with you but, I'll give it a try. Your arguments are illogical, on several technical levels alone. First, C-Quam is dead, both from a broadcaster's standpoint, and from the listeners standpoint. Where can any broadcaster buy a Motorola C-Quam exciter, and when is the last time you saw an AM stereo radio in any store, or for that matter at a new car dealer? In case you did not notice Motorola has been out of the AM Stereo business for years. Why it is dead really dos not matter, but in it's heyday it was still a difficult proposition. I know because I installed dozens of the exciters at existing stations, it was not easy and did not always work. Mainly due to the poor conditions of many AM antenna arrays the associated problems. Why do you think it has died? Do you think broadcasters wanted to spend thousands on a system which they were told would save AM, and then watch the whole scheme die a slow death? What a boondoggle! Your technical assumption that "AM is an environment that works very well" is ridiculous, do you have any idea how noisy the spectrum is in this day and age? I well remember when I was a kid growing up in the Midwest, listening to WLS, WKYC, WABC, yeah, they were high fidelity and sounded great, but those days are long gone. That is why we have the NRSC mask etc. now. On top of this you claim that Digital will break AM, that is baloney. C-Quam, being proclaimed as "AM-HiFi Stereo" came and went, why? Because in most cases it sounded like crap, was noisy, and beyond that, caused other problems. Again I know from experience, all the problems we had. I do not know what dream world you are living in, but I'll bet you anything that C-Quam will not be back. Example: How many major market AM stations are Transmitting in Stereo? Obviously you have not heard any of the Ibiquity tests. The WOR digital receiver output is FM like, no AM Stereo system can ever sound this clean, in the current noisy AM environment. You further claim that we are ruining reception for our wide band listeners....What wide band listeners? We have had only one complaint, from a gentleman in Queens who was restoring an old Atwater Kent radio, and said he heard a "whistle". After he tuned his radio into the center of WOR, the "whistle" went away. It seems very strange that the only complaints we are getting are from message boards and other sources like yourself who are not WOR regular listeners. We have a very vocal audience who are very likely to call and complain when they hear something wrong. We have had no calls. What does that tell you? I have 9 AM radios at home and only two of them are able to get the sidebands in the wide mode. The SRF Sony radio which has not been made in twenty years, and the AMAX Denon receiver I have can hear the IBOC carriers in the wide mode, and also in the narrow mode. How many of WOR listeners have these radios anyway? Apparently none. My Henry Kloss table radio needs to be tuned to the center of WOR where the sidebands go away, and my GE Superradio if tuned correctly sounds OK. I live less than 5 miles from the WOR transmitter, and have no problems. Keep in mind these are critical listening tests, most folks are listening in a car, or on narrow band table radios while working, that is the beauty of radio. I agree with you that there can be HiFi AM, I'd like to have it, but I do not live in a dream world, and besides we have the NRSC mask, and in my opinion 9khz or 10Khz bandwidth is not HiFi. I am the CE of a major market AM station, and I need to do anything I can to keep WOR in first place. I like Ibiquity because it works! By the way WOR is not paying any Ibiquity license fees, and neither is any other broadcaster right now. In case you have not heard, WOR is not transmitting an extremely narrowband (3.5khz) analog signal. I have the Orban 9200 set at 6khz bandwidth. On all of the radios we have tested we sound great. I was surprised at the results, when I found what I thought were wide band radios were in fact not. You also need to take into account, with the reduced analog bandwidth we are in fact able to be louder, this helps in fringe areas, and especially on Long Island, which is extremely noisy AM wise. This is a major improvement for our analog listeners. When you are ready to take a trip into reality, I invite you here to the WOR plant, once you hear the digital signal, and see how simple the installation at our transmitter was, you will see why the IBOC system will soon be a real savior of the AM band. Other than that, Ibiquity will have radios out there next year, in stores and cars. I would suggest you get on that Bandwagon with its promising future and figure out how to put their chip into your AM Stereo radios. Kerry Richards Chief Engineer WOR-AM Buckley Broadcasting Corporation --- What, it just says this message is risk free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.394 / Virus Database: 224 - Release Date: 3/10/2002 [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From stodd@sherbtel.net Tue Oct 22 17:49:51 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 23 Oct 2002 00:49:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 441 invoked from network); 23 Oct 2002 00:49:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Oct 2002 00:49:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Oct 2002 00:49:50 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-88-181.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.181]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g9N0hRjR022891 for ; Tue, 22 Oct 2002 19:43:29 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <000901c27a2e$04510ca0$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: <20021022191609.76225.qmail@web11603.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} WOR IBOC TESTS Date: Tue, 22 Oct 2002 19:49:14 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude In which case they might as well go the DRM route, since it's a world standard. It'll certainly be interesting to hear the manufacturers and consumer groups howling over the mass changeover and immediate obsolescence of multiple millions of analog receivers. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Crash Knorr" > Obviously the hybrid mode is a mess, bad for the analog > signal and probably bad for the digital signal too. > The solution that some folks in the industry will likely > propose is to abolish the analog signal altogether and > to do it as soon as possible. From stodd@sherbtel.net Tue Oct 22 18:14:44 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 23 Oct 2002 01:14:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 57095 invoked from network); 23 Oct 2002 01:14:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Oct 2002 01:14:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Oct 2002 01:14:44 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-88-181.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.181]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g9N19NjR029138 for ; Tue, 22 Oct 2002 20:09:25 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <000d01c27a31$a3d310e0$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: <000a01c27a12$2dcc7810$1a02a8c0@unit> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Responce from WOR RE: IBOC Date: Tue, 22 Oct 2002 20:15:11 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude I hate to break this to you, but the other guy was right on the availability of wide bandwidth receivers- they're around, but not in any vast quantity. I don't think that any argument that relies on them will make even the smallest dent. I'm all for bringing wider bandwidth radios back to the public. Second, Motorola and Phillips are NOT making these chips with AMS capability. It can be ADDED, but there's no evidence they will have it initially. Yes the basic code is written, but it hasn't been debugged. Marv Southcott did mention the Omega Reception Technologies system would have it, but for the sake of our credibility, please don't you or anyone else on this list say that the big M and Phillips will have it in their chips, because it won't be there, at least not initially. About the only way they would is if, and that's a BIG "if," Omega comes out with their chips far enough in advance of the others that they end up setting the pace. Question for Marv: any idea of when Omega plans to roll out their new technology (or are you even free to tell us?) Scott Todd ----- Original Message ----- From: "amstereo - matt2" > AM is an environment that works very well. high bandwidth recievers are around, and they give FM a run for its money. You are alienating listeners who run high bandwidth recievers by the display of digital interference in your sidebands, > Guess which i'd choose. THE First one. AM Stereo isn't dead, it's waiting > for the death of iboc then it'll be back, Motorola and Philips are working > on am stereo DSP chip as we speak. > From michaelj@vcn.com Tue Oct 22 19:03:41 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 23 Oct 2002 02:03:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 42053 invoked from network); 23 Oct 2002 02:03:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Oct 2002 02:03:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m2-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.32) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Oct 2002 02:03:41 -0000 Received: from michael (vcn91.usrtc-1.evan.wy.vcn.com [209.193.86.95]) by m2-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Tue, 22 Oct 2002 20:03:40 -0600 To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} Responce from WOR RE: IBOC Date: Tue, 22 Oct 2002 20:03:35 -0600 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) In-Reply-To: <000d01c27a31$a3d310e0$d3a9fea9@me> X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Importance: Normal From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit On that comment, I have one comment myself..... I know Aiwa isn't making AM Stereo radios anymore.....but I noticed on many many of their radios...walkmans...clock radios......they have a selection of "AM and AM Wide" on the selector dial. I'm assuming that the AM Wide means wide bandwidth AM and sounds better. I'm sure they'll argue with these comments and say "Hey....we tried bringing back wide bandwidth AM and nobody even noticed or cared." Hmmmm MJR n WYO -----Original Message----- From: Scott Todd [mailto:stodd@sherbtel.net] Sent: Tuesday, October 22, 2002 7:15 PM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Responce from WOR RE: IBOC I hate to break this to you, but the other guy was right on the availability of wide bandwidth receivers- they're around, but not in any vast quantity. I don't think that any argument that relies on them will make even the smallest dent. I'm all for bringing wider bandwidth radios back to the public. Second, Motorola and Phillips are NOT making these chips with AMS capability. It can be ADDED, but there's no evidence they will have it initially. Yes the basic code is written, but it hasn't been debugged. Marv Southcott did mention the Omega Reception Technologies system would have it, but for the sake of our credibility, please don't you or anyone else on this list say that the big M and Phillips will have it in their chips, because it won't be there, at least not initially. About the only way they would is if, and that's a BIG "if," Omega comes out with their chips far enough in advance of the others that they end up setting the pace. Question for Marv: any idea of when Omega plans to roll out their new technology (or are you even free to tell us?) Scott Todd ----- Original Message ----- From: "amstereo - matt2" > AM is an environment that works very well. high bandwidth recievers are around, and they give FM a run for its money. You are alienating listeners who run high bandwidth recievers by the display of digital interference in your sidebands, > Guess which i'd choose. THE First one. AM Stereo isn't dead, it's waiting > for the death of iboc then it'll be back, Motorola and Philips are working > on am stereo DSP chip as we speak. > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ADVERTISEMENT Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From KC4QLP@aol.com Tue Oct 22 21:52:42 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 23 Oct 2002 04:52:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 17012 invoked from network); 23 Oct 2002 04:52:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Oct 2002 04:52:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d07.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.39) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Oct 2002 04:52:39 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.39.2ef06f2c (3964); Wed, 23 Oct 2002 00:52:30 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <39.2ef06f2c.2ae7850d@aol.com> Date: Wed, 23 Oct 2002 00:52:29 EDT Subject: Re: {AMSF} WOR IBOC TESTS To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, amstereo@topica.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp << Obviously the hybrid mode is a mess, bad for the analog >signal and probably bad for the digital signal too. >The solution that some folks in the industry will likely >propose is to abolish the analog signal altogether and >to do it as soon as possible. >> The complete change over to digital wont be happening for a while yet. >The analogue doesn't sound bad, for an Ibiquity reference radio. >The digital has an annoying squeaking sound to try to distract the >listener from the grainey digital synthesis of music and the human >voice. >The digital is listenable, but not HiFi, in the same way that SSB is >listenable, but not hifi. And, this coarse, grainey, squeaky >digital has a worse coverage area than analogue? Ibiquity, you've >got to be kidding! This is the biggest marketing joke anyone has >ever played on broadcasters and consumers! Maybe for 100% talks >stations I could see digital - but only if it increased coverage, >not decreased it. After listening to the audio files and listening to WOR directly during the day here in Elizabeth City NC thanks to some heavy cloud cover last Thursday/Friday and today,the analog audio is heavily compressed with a bit of distortion and they are using an Optimod 9200. If it were me in that situation..I could clean that analog up and retain the loudness {I do it here at WGAI-loudest station and cleanest station covering two markets} One issue is that the test receiver has trouble handling receiving high modulated stations...very simular to am stereo receivers. WOR is modulating the analog at 122% The digital definately didnt sound like AM..it didnt have that "warm AM" sound..but more like the flat FM sound.The ringing I heard...I sure do hope was just the artifacts of the .wav file.Otherwise if it is a transmitted artifact...I'll just have to stick with listening in the analog mode. I would have to listen directly to a hybrid receiver to make my own judgement about the digital audio. There are just to many varibles that can screw up the sound of audio via the internet. Many commericals that we get sent to us via the internet have some degree of artifacts in them...something you would never hear in a CD most of the time..or on tape. Anyhow...its interesting to say the least...and it will be interesting to see how it all pans out. The IBOC folks have their arguments and that from what I've seen are very simular to the arguments that come from AM Stereo operators...IE receivers,cost of setting up,cost of equipment...etc etc etc. For us folks with plate modulated transmitters...looks like HD will not work with these rigs because of IQM and linear issues. Hmmm..I wonder how many AM stations out there in this country have solid state rigs? .....lets see ...new transmitter{s},IBOC exciter...,in my opinion,--sounds more expensive to me.Wonder how much the licencing fee will be to iBiquity later on..anyone have any inside info yet? Anyhow...hey Scott is right..there just arent as many wideband reveivers out there like there once was years ago..{thank manufactures for that} and Motorola and Phillips have stepped away from the C-Quam biz years ago....but the adding ability is there. Lets all be sure we have our "facts" before "mowing over" anyone in the biz. The industry already thinks of the as it is put, "the AM stereo club" as a group full of weirdos,pipe dreamers,wishful thinkers,and people for a lost cause trying to cause trouble. Grant it they might be right...or they might be wrong about IBOC...but either way we go...if folks keep lam blasting everyone in the industry...and IF digital radio fails....do you all think these folks are going to consider C-Quam after being hassled during the early days of IBOC? ...If it were me getting jumped on like that time after time...hell no I wouldnt consider it and I'd probably tell you where to go..and probably show you how to get there. Sit back..make observations...make comments and be sensible and level headed about it.....creating enemies in the industry results in no one learning anything from anyone. My two and half cents worth.... Bob Carter Operations/Engineering WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5..., Ray Communications Radio Network Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ Osama bin Laden and any crybaby that whines about the length of this email signature can kiss my royal white American behind! From kevtronics@yahoo.com Wed Oct 23 01:40:00 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 23 Oct 2002 08:40:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 70080 invoked from network); 23 Oct 2002 08:39:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Oct 2002 08:39:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Oct 2002 08:39:59 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.170] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 23 Oct 2002 08:39:59 -0000 Date: Wed, 23 Oct 2002 08:39:58 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: IBOC + C-Quam is possible Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 2804 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.95.40 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics From the following description attached below, it appears that with=20 the latest revision of IBOC, the audio region below 5 kHz is not used=20 for any digital data transmissions; it is *only* for the analog=20 audio portion of the "hybrid" signal. Thus, if you can live with the crummy 5 kHz frequency response, it=20 does appear to be possible to have C-Quam analog AM Stereo coexist=20 with IBOC digital on the same signal. And since the IBOC signal=20 generation is handled by computer code (in this case, a PC running=20 Linux), all it would take is some additional code to have the exciter=20 generate C-Quam for the 0-5 kHz analog audio and IBOC for the digital=20 sidebands. Stick in a 25 Hz C-Quam pilot tone, and then you have a=20 complete hybrid C-Quam AM Stereo / IBOC-"HD Radio" digital signal. Obviously this wouldn't have much appeal, as even with stereo, having=20 the analog audio limited to 5 kHz sounds very dull, and the limited=20 bandwidth is made even worse with the extra hissing and other strange=20 noises of the high frequency digital sidebands, the effect of which=20 would be exaggerated on those AM Stereo radios that automatically=20 switch into wide-bandwidth mode when a C-Quam signal is received (but=20 not for a mono signal).... but, it DOES appear to be possible. Also keep in mind that the use of a computer as the IBOC exciter=20 makes it easily "portable" to different systems if IBOC should become=20 a failure -- including pure analog C-Quam AM Stereo. All it would=20 take is a change in the computer code of the exciter, and C-Quam=20 generated in this manner would sound very nice indeed, considering=20 the high technical standards that IBOC stations have to meet, which=20 are the same standards of performance which help to deliver the=20 highest quality of C-Quam signal as possible from the station. Even=20 the makers of IBOC have said that radio stations will likely "have to=20 upgrade to AM Stereo quality standards" before they can transmit an=20 IBOC digital signal with success. =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D "The old NRSC spec was narrowed to permit IBOC. The analog baseband=20 exists out to =B1 4906 Hz from the carrier. The primary digital=20 sidebands extend from =B1 10356.1 Hz to =B1 14716.6 Hz removed from the=20 carrier. The secondary sidebands extend from =B1 5087.2 Hz to =B1 9447.7=20 Hz. A teriary sideband is provided for in the spec from =B1 363.4 Hz to=20 =B1 4723.8 Hz at low modulation, coexisting with the current analog=20 baseband, but I doubt anyone will attempt to use this piece of the=20 pie until analog broadcasting ceases altogether, at which point that=20 will become the primary digital baseband." From dav259@csiro.au Wed Oct 23 02:11:58 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 23 Oct 2002 09:11:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 80999 invoked from network); 23 Oct 2002 09:11:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Oct 2002 09:11:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Oct 2002 09:11:56 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9N9BsP03040 for ; Wed, 23 Oct 2002 19:11:55 +1000 (EST) Date: Wed, 23 Oct 2002 19:11:54 +1000 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Subject: Re: {AMSF} IBOC + C-Quam is possible In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public On Wed, 23 Oct 2002, Kevin T. wrote: > Even the makers of IBOC have said that radio stations will likely > "have to upgrade to AM Stereo quality standards" before they can > transmit an IBOC digital signal with success. We must all maintain the faith! (as Bob says ... nicely) We had the annual national Oz Commercial Radio stations awards (the rAWARDS) held in Melbourne over the weekend. This is an interesting insight from one of the speakers - virtually saying with all the other forms of audio now available we must be proud to proclaim what we most enjoy as "RADIO"! btw ... the first speaker was Bob Geldof whose first word uttered was "sh*t" - no doubt a touch of British class ... but he said alot of good things about radio supporting the local music industry. - - - Consultant Walter Sabo from New York gave the morning conference audience food for thought in his analysis of how stations should reinforce their radio brand to aid memory of the radio station. He also praised Australian radio, saying he had heard more innovative radio in Australia during three days than he had heard in America over the last three years. Radio has boxes all over the house, even in the bathroom, Sabo said, comparing radio with other media which sell their penetration rates by the number of subscribers. Compare that with the U.S.A 50% penetration rate of pay TV. Radio has a 98% penetration rate... TV people sell their ads based on penetration rates. Radio has such a high penetration rate that if we sell it too cheaply we are undervaluing it, said Sabo. In various exercises Sabo illustrated the way the human mind recalls information and linked it with the way radio stations should reinforce their brand. Things get attached to what you already know, according to Sabo, so radio stations should include the word RADIO in all their branding. Without the word radio it is hard for people to attach the name of the station to something they know. MIX is a brand of cake mix, Magic has another connotation, in the U.S.A. Z 100 is more well known as a brand of car not a radio station. Sabo urged stations to mention the word radio in their advertising to help listeners link the radio stations brand with something they know, not to confuse it with some other product that also may use the same name. He also suggested linking the brand name with essential elements which people remember such as survival (weather info for example) and sex (passionate words). All messages need to be consistent and to be repeated regularly by people who are like those in the target audience said Sabo. He presented research which showed recall of the Triple M brand name was the highest in eastern states radio markets (over 90%) and that Novas product recall (ie. identifying it as a radio stations) was 54%. There are three steps to implanting something in someones memory according to Sabo. Identifying What is it then asking what of it then storing the information IF there is something positive in it for me. In the brand recall research, conducted by ACNeilsen, other results showed recall of the various State Premiers names at 90%, recall of Cathy Freemans sport at 45% and recall of stations as follows: Gold FM at 84%, NEW 97.3 at 75%, Mix 106.5 at 86%, Magic 693 at 64% and Triple M at 93%. The important lesson about the information from the survey according to Sabo is that many people do not even know that your brand is for a radio station, so that you cannot do any more in-depth research until you solve that problem. Ian Victorian Radio Network News Melbourne From dav259@csiro.au Wed Oct 23 03:07:29 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 23 Oct 2002 10:07:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 22494 invoked from network); 23 Oct 2002 10:07:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Oct 2002 10:07:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Oct 2002 10:07:28 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9NA7QP05901 for ; Wed, 23 Oct 2002 20:07:26 +1000 (EST) Date: Wed, 23 Oct 2002 20:07:26 +1000 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: amstereoforum Subject: OT: He's back ... Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public This is definitely off topic. But I feel like I've gone back to our happy past. One of radio list's "Good Guys" is back - online. The master of overstatement - our Steve - is back on the internet at: Steven Dinius <10kc@fmtc.com> He's unlikely to join a list - but it would be bloody bonza if some of you might say a quick Hello! From amstereo@optushome.com.au Wed Oct 23 05:21:52 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereo@optushome.com.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 23 Oct 2002 12:21:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 25183 invoked from network); 23 Oct 2002 12:21:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Oct 2002 12:21:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail019.syd.optusnet.com.au) (210.49.20.160) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Oct 2002 12:21:51 -0000 Received: from unit (c17302.ipswc1.qld.optusnet.com.au [210.49.44.162]) by mail019.syd.optusnet.com.au (8.11.1/8.11.1) with SMTP id g9NCLnt08792 for ; Wed, 23 Oct 2002 22:21:50 +1000 Message-ID: <000401c27a8e$c24bfde0$1a02a8c0@unit> To: References: <1035374235.1782.52599.m12@yahoogroups.com> Subject: Re: WOR IBOC TESTS Date: Wed, 23 Oct 2002 22:21:47 +1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "amstereo - matt2" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=105920058 X-Yahoo-Profile: voltar_e *.wav files (or PCM) when ran at 44.1KHz 16BIT are the same format as raw CD audio, and is called as such "CD QUALITY", basically if you were to rip CD Tracks to .wav (via digital extraction) and burn back to CD 100 times, it would still be the same audio output regardless. even at 22.05 khz 16bit, the audio still retains most of the information, just isn't sampled as much, which can cause a bit of ringing, but concidering the WOR samples are 30 seconds, i'd guess they are infact 44.1khz and therefor the only artifacts you would be hearing are a direct result of the source audio it self. 44.1kHz @ 16bit stereo chews up 10 MB second. or 740 MB for 74 minutes (i know your prolly asking WHY does a 74 minute CD only have 650MB of data space, THE answer, File system over heads and CRC - cyclic redundancy check - basically what allows a DATA CD to be read faithfully even when scratched (to a point). Australia will not use iboc if i have anything to do with it. AM radio that sounds like a net stream doesn't wash. --- What, it just says this message is risk free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.406 / Virus Database: 229 - Release Date: 21/10/2002 From jwelton@nautel.com Wed Oct 23 05:46:39 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jwelton@nautel.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 23 Oct 2002 12:46:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 45641 invoked from network); 23 Oct 2002 12:46:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Oct 2002 12:46:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailserver.nautel.com) (24.222.4.134) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Oct 2002 12:46:38 -0000 Received: FROM jeff-welton BY mailserver.nautel.com ; Wed Oct 23 09:48:55 2002 -0300 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Date: Wed, 23 Oct 2002 09:45:06 -0300 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: {AMSF} WOR IBOC TESTS Message-ID: <3DB66FAB.20611.511770@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: <39.2ef06f2c.2ae7850d@aol.com> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.02) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body From: "Jeff Welton" Reply-To: jwelton@nautel.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=26918678 Bob C. wrote: > I wonder how many AM stations out there in this country have solid state rigs? I'm going out on a limb a little, as I can't make any guesses as to sales penetration by BE, CE, Harris or others, but I think you'll find that it works out to over 75%. However, not all solid state rigs are upgradeable for IBOC, so to carry a little further, I'm going to guess that only 30-35% have transmitters that can be upgraded. Don't quote these numbers as gospel, they're only estimates! > .....lets see ...new transmitter{s},IBOC exciter...,in my opinion,--sounds more > expensive to me.Wonder how much the licencing fee will be to iBiquity later > on..anyone have any inside info yet? Uh-huh, but it's not really inside info - most of it is publicly available. IBOC capable transmitter lists the same as a standard one. $13,000 - $160,000, depending on power level (1k to 50k). If the transmitter can be upgraded, the average over our range of power levels is about $1000/kW for the upgrade. Exciter will be somewhere between $20,000 and $40,000 (not sure yet- could possibly be less). Licencing fee has already been announced as a one-time only fee of fifteen times the annual FCC licence fee. They are still working on what the fee for datacasting will be. Broadcasters want a single fixed fee. Ibiquity is trying for a percentage of revenue. This should be worked out soon. Incidentally, if a broadcaster commits to upgrade to IBOC this year, the one-time fee is waived and the yearly datacasting fee is waived until 2005. This means savings of well over $10,000.00 for the average station to upgrade before 2003. Also, someone mentioned a quote from Ibiquity that the antenna system will have to be up to C-QUAM standards... ideally it will be a little more than that, as it should be flat to +/- 20kHz for best results. It can be made to work with less, but not any better than stereo works in a narrowband system. So you might want to add some consultant fees to the list, if you're budgeting. > Lets all be sure we have our "facts" before "mowing over" anyone in the biz. I agree whole-heartedly with this. I had unsubscribed from a previous forum due to repeat Clear Channel bashing. While I don't necessarily subscribe to their business practices, I defend their right to run their operation in any way they see fit, within the letter of the law. I count some CC engineers as friends, and my position does not lend itself toward being part, directly or indirectly, of any "dissing" of any potential customer! Play nice and the message comes across a whole bunch more emphatically. It's good to be passionate, but be careful not to cross the line between passionate and insulting. I.e.- "I just heard WXYZ and the whatever really sounded like crap", could probably be reworded a little more tactfully! Just my 0.02 on a relatively good morning! (BTW, Scott, both of the WWTC ND5's are upgradeable - in case you were wondering!) Regards, Jeff Welton Nautel Customer Service Dept. Tel.: 1-902-823-3900 ext. 127 Fax: 1-902-823-3183 email: jwelton@nautel.com From jsgil@hal-pc.org Wed Oct 23 11:41:52 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 23 Oct 2002 18:41:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 24327 invoked from network); 23 Oct 2002 18:41:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Oct 2002 18:41:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Oct 2002 18:41:49 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.138] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 23 Oct 2002 18:41:49 -0000 Date: Wed, 23 Oct 2002 18:41:49 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: IBOC + C-Quam is possible Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 2682 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.130.56 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin T." wrote: > From the following description attached below, it appears that with=20 > the latest revision of IBOC, the audio region below 5 kHz is not used=20 > for any digital data transmissions; it is *only* for the analog=20 > audio portion of the "hybrid" signal. >=20 > Thus, if you can live with the crummy 5 kHz frequency response, it=20 > does appear to be possible to have C-Quam analog AM Stereo coexist=20 > with IBOC digital on the same signal. And since the IBOC signal=20 > generation is handled by computer code (in this case, a PC running=20 > Linux), all it would take is some additional code to have the exciter=20 > generate C-Quam for the 0-5 kHz analog audio and IBOC for the digital=20 > sidebands. Stick in a 25 Hz C-Quam pilot tone, and then you have a=20 > complete hybrid C-Quam AM Stereo / IBOC-"HD Radio" digital signal. >=20 I brought this whole subject up several posts back about IBOC + C-Quam existing simutaneously but there is one issue that has to be=20 addressed. The mathematical representation of C-QuAM demonstrates that multiple sidebands out to the 6th harmonic related to the fundamental modulating frequencies are generated so a 5KHz limit for the audio would generate harmonics out to 30KHz. The process to remove these=20 involves generating the C-QuAM image first and the bandlimiting it to =B15KHz before adding it to the IBOC signal. This type of hybrid mode could actually be advantageous to a hybrid IBOC model. Most of the noticeable interference on AM is associated=20 with the higher frequencies and only under really bad signal=20 conditions will noise be noticeably objectional in the lower=20 frequencies. To give you an exmaple of this concept records have the RIAA curve that starts at 50Hz with a 6db/oct increase and plateaus from 500Hz to 2.1KHz and starts again at 6db/oct and continues on out past 20KHz. Although there was two reasons for this, one being that the needle would jump out of the groove if the bass signals were too strong, the other was for good noise protection for the higher frequencies. If iBiquity actually used a true IBOC + C-Quam model where IBOC would actualy use the analog portion below 5KHz this would reduce the needed bitrate for the full signal and the extra bits=20 could be used for the higher frequencies producing an overall higner=20 quality signal. This could also reduce the extra wide bantwidth now used for the IBOC signal lowering the amount of interference to=20 adjacent channels. If IBOC proves to be a major interference problem=20 at nignt and the FCC decides to not allow it at night then the exciter=20 could switch to full bandwidth C-QuAM at this time. JSG From fanfare@globility.com Wed Oct 23 13:35:18 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 23 Oct 2002 20:35:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 88440 invoked from network); 23 Oct 2002 20:35:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Oct 2002 20:35:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Oct 2002 20:35:16 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.152] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 23 Oct 2002 20:35:16 -0000 Date: Wed, 23 Oct 2002 20:35:14 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Responce from WOR RE: IBOC Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <000d01c27a31$a3d310e0$d3a9fea9@me> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2452 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Marv Southcott" X-Originating-IP: 64.56.233.245 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Scott Todd" wrote: > I hate to break this to you, but the other guy was right on the availability Marv Southcott did mention the Omega Reception Technologies system would > have it, but for the sake of our credibility, please don't you or anyone > else on this list say that the big M and Phillips will have it in their > chips, because it won't be there, at least not initially. About the only > way they would is if, and that's a BIG "if," Omega comes out with their > chips far enough in advance of the others that they end up setting the pace. > Question for Marv: any idea of when Omega plans to roll out their new > technology (or are you even free to tell us?) Right now, the Fanfare monitor/demod receiver supports AMS and FMS with its exceptionally quiet, FTA-100. As for Omega technology, its unique AMS capabilities are still only part of the story. When will it make its debut? You're right Scott, I am not at liberty to say. However, I think all should understand that the radio manufacturing business is not just a bunch of good ole boys bathing the wall in a local watering hole. There are serious things going on in the world's markets and everyone is loking at economies. Also, I hear that TI is experiencing difficulties and they're a major proponent of IBOC chipsets. Bottom lines are getting submerged in apathetic red stuff because new technologies, like IBOC, are so far from being truly viable. Not only that, the criminal failure of large conglomerates like Enron and Worldcom have destroyed the confidence of many potential buyers because many of them can no longer rely on having discretionary income. Yet some emerging technologies are hyped so far in advance of even being viable, let alone accepted, that those who are looking to buy new equipment, and don't want to be left out of the loop if the new technology is successful, lose interest entirely when it's not. FMX was a perfect example. As manufacturers, we lost at least a year of profitability then. If IBOC fails the litmus test, both the broadcaster and equipment manufacturer will lose together. In fact, the future of radio is still where it has always been, in the hands of the broadcasters. Let's hope they discover in time that the radio we already have serves the public just fine. All it needs is good quality receivers, analog or digital, and worthwhile content. From fanfare@globility.com Wed Oct 23 13:35:29 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 23 Oct 2002 20:35:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 88714 invoked from network); 23 Oct 2002 20:35:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Oct 2002 20:35:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.70) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Oct 2002 20:35:28 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.189] by n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 23 Oct 2002 20:35:15 -0000 Date: Wed, 23 Oct 2002 20:35:13 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Responce from WOR RE: IBOC Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <000d01c27a31$a3d310e0$d3a9fea9@me> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2452 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Marv Southcott" X-Originating-IP: 64.56.233.245 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Scott Todd" wrote: > I hate to break this to you, but the other guy was right on the availability Marv Southcott did mention the Omega Reception Technologies system would > have it, but for the sake of our credibility, please don't you or anyone > else on this list say that the big M and Phillips will have it in their > chips, because it won't be there, at least not initially. About the only > way they would is if, and that's a BIG "if," Omega comes out with their > chips far enough in advance of the others that they end up setting the pace. > Question for Marv: any idea of when Omega plans to roll out their new > technology (or are you even free to tell us?) Right now, the Fanfare monitor/demod receiver supports AMS and FMS with its exceptionally quiet, FTA-100. As for Omega technology, its unique AMS capabilities are still only part of the story. When will it make its debut? You're right Scott, I am not at liberty to say. However, I think all should understand that the radio manufacturing business is not just a bunch of good ole boys bathing the wall in a local watering hole. There are serious things going on in the world's markets and everyone is loking at economies. Also, I hear that TI is experiencing difficulties and they're a major proponent of IBOC chipsets. Bottom lines are getting submerged in apathetic red stuff because new technologies, like IBOC, are so far from being truly viable. Not only that, the criminal failure of large conglomerates like Enron and Worldcom have destroyed the confidence of many potential buyers because many of them can no longer rely on having discretionary income. Yet some emerging technologies are hyped so far in advance of even being viable, let alone accepted, that those who are looking to buy new equipment, and don't want to be left out of the loop if the new technology is successful, lose interest entirely when it's not. FMX was a perfect example. As manufacturers, we lost at least a year of profitability then. If IBOC fails the litmus test, both the broadcaster and equipment manufacturer will lose together. In fact, the future of radio is still where it has always been, in the hands of the broadcasters. Let's hope they discover in time that the radio we already have serves the public just fine. All it needs is good quality receivers, analog or digital, and worthwhile content. From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Oct 23 16:22:41 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 23 Oct 2002 23:22:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 62835 invoked from network); 23 Oct 2002 23:22:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Oct 2002 23:22:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Oct 2002 23:22:39 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-88-143.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.143]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g9NNHHjR020364 for ; Wed, 23 Oct 2002 18:17:18 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <004501c27aeb$27bd0f00$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: <3DB66FAB.20611.511770@localhost> Subject: Re: {AMSF} WOR IBOC TESTS Date: Wed, 23 Oct 2002 18:23:09 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude I figured they probably were, but I'm not going to bother asking to do it. :) Scott ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jeff Welton" > Just my 0.02 on a relatively good morning! > (BTW, Scott, both of the WWTC ND5's are upgradeable - in case you were > wondering!) > From KC4QLP@aol.com Wed Oct 23 16:24:39 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 23 Oct 2002 23:24:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 14321 invoked from network); 23 Oct 2002 23:24:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Oct 2002 23:24:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d06.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.38) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Oct 2002 23:24:39 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.104.1dfa3fa2 (30960); Wed, 23 Oct 2002 19:24:30 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <104.1dfa3fa2.2ae889ad@aol.com> Date: Wed, 23 Oct 2002 19:24:29 EDT Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC + C-Quam is possible To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, amstereo@topica.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 10/23/02 2:44:10 PM Eastern Daylight Time,=20 jsgil@hal-pc.org writes: << > Thus, if you can live with the crummy 5 kHz frequency response, it=20 > does appear to be possible to have C-Quam analog AM Stereo coexist=20 > with IBOC digital on the same signal. And since the IBOC signal=20 > generation is handled by computer code (in this case, a PC running=20 > Linux), all it would take is some additional code to have the exciter=20 > generate C-Quam for the 0-5 kHz analog audio and IBOC for the digital=20 > sidebands. Stick in a 25 Hz C-Quam pilot tone, and then you have a=20 > complete hybrid C-Quam AM Stereo / IBOC-"HD Radio" digital signal. >=20 =20 I brought this whole subject up several posts back about IBOC + C-Quam existing simutaneously but there is one issue that has to be=20 addressed. The mathematical representation of C-QuAM demonstrates that multiple sidebands out to the 6th harmonic related to the fundamental modulating frequencies are generated so a 5KHz limit for the audio would generate harmonics out to 30KHz. The process to remove these=20 involves generating the C-QuAM image first and the bandlimiting it to =B15KHz before adding it to the IBOC signal. >> 1st there just isnt enough bandwidth to pull this off..even remotely. 2nd....even if there was enough bandwidth...the analog side of the receiver= =20 would hear the hash from the nearby digital carriers bleeding ..even if=20 slightly would cause enough noise to drive anyone insane. Here is a link that will take you to a page of other links..downloadable pd= f=20 files that go into great detail on how HD radio is generated...the entire=20 process from start to finsh. IBOC White Papers=20 This link in particular is the link for AM digital radio {downloadable pdf= =20 file} http://www.bdcast.com/iboc/papers/Structure_and_Generation_of_Robust_Wavefo= rms .pdf I know a lot of folks will say..."ah but this info is from iBiguity...it mu= st=20 be slanted to show only what you need to see to be brain washed into thinki= ng=20 it will work" This doesnt prove whether it works or not...it just shows how it is suppose= =20 to work.Maybe knowing how it works...someone might have a solution on how t= o=20 "fix" the bugs if this HD radio ever flys. Hey..best to look into it and fix it now before standards are set and the i= nk=20 drys. To me this has become more than just AM Stereo...its preservation of a=20 useable medium,small town and rural community radio...the heart of=20 America.Lets all see to it that it doesnt become unusable due to noise that= =20 could have been fixed. Our observations and tactfully made comments to those working directly with= =20 the systems can either make it or break it. Face it folks..it HD radio is here whether we want it or not. Many people=20 said the same thing about AM Stereo when it came along....and the world did= nt=20 stop turning. Another 2 1/2 cents worth Bob Carter Operations/Engineering =20 WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3=20 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5..., Ray Communications Radio=20 Network=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20 =20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineeri= ng=20 services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net=20 Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC=20 WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com=20 = =20 KC4QLP Amateur Radio=20=20 Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________=20 From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Oct 23 16:37:14 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 23 Oct 2002 23:37:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 2440 invoked from network); 23 Oct 2002 23:37:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Oct 2002 23:37:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Oct 2002 23:37:14 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-88-143.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.143]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g9NNVpjR023877 for ; Wed, 23 Oct 2002 18:31:52 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <007501c27aed$3091e220$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Responce from WOR RE: IBOC Date: Wed, 23 Oct 2002 18:37:43 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Sorry to have to tell you this, but you'd assume wrong. The "wide" only means it tunes to 1700. The fidelity is no better than before. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael J. Richard" > I know Aiwa isn't making AM Stereo radios anymore.....but I noticed on many > many of their radios...walkmans...clock radios......they have a selection of > "AM and AM Wide" on the selector dial. I'm assuming that the AM Wide means > wide bandwidth AM and sounds better. From KC4QLP@aol.com Wed Oct 23 17:09:15 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 24 Oct 2002 00:09:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 67646 invoked from network); 24 Oct 2002 00:09:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Oct 2002 00:09:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m07.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.162) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Oct 2002 00:09:15 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id 1.19f.a7e7710 (30960); Wed, 23 Oct 2002 20:09:05 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <19f.a7e7710.2ae89421@aol.com> Date: Wed, 23 Oct 2002 20:09:05 EDT Subject: Re: WOR IBOC TESTS To: amstereo@topica.com, amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 10/23/02 7:07:14 PM Eastern Daylight Time, stodd@sherbtel.net writes: << By this time the majority of them do, but get this- unless it's only a year or two old, even the older SS transmitters will have to be scrapped! ST >> One would think that the system would have been made to adapt to more systems currently in use. Word has it from Tom at WOR that there is consideration on trying IBOC on their 35 year old Continental 317C-1 on the dummy load....no word yet if they will try this over the air if it works on the dummy load.He had luck with AM stereo at WTIC on one of their Continentals in the early days..but no luck on another Continental rig that WTIC had..it wouldnt pass any stereo separation BTW...I read somewheres that WOR will be at some point in the near future,will be testing stereo on the digital carrier.I forgot what type of music they will play for the test...or even if a day was set yet. Would be nice to have a digital test receiver just to listen to it for myself Bob Carter Operations/Engineering WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5..., Ray Communications Radio Network Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From matthew.trim@eds.com Wed Oct 23 17:09:38 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: matthew.trim@eds.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 24 Oct 2002 00:09:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 86448 invoked from network); 24 Oct 2002 00:09:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Oct 2002 00:09:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO ns5.eds.com) (203.17.185.230) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Oct 2002 00:09:37 -0000 Received: from nnsy.eds.com (nnsy-3.eds.com [192.168.1.1]) by ns5.eds.com (8.11.6/8.11.1) with ESMTP id g9O09VH14902 for ; Thu, 24 Oct 2002 10:09:31 +1000 (EST) Received: from nnsy.eds.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by nnsy.eds.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9O09RJ16048 for ; Thu, 24 Oct 2002 10:09:27 +1000 (EST) Received: from ausym000.exau01.exch.eds.com ([134.251.177.117]) by nnsy.eds.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9O09OR16023 for ; Thu, 24 Oct 2002 10:09:25 +1000 (EST) Received: by AUSYM000 with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Thu, 24 Oct 2002 10:09:06 +1000 Message-ID: <533761B50551D511A6D200508B6F542809CAF37F@AUSYM200> To: "'amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com'" Subject: Should we focussing more on AM Wideband instead of AMS? Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 10:08:44 +1000 Importance: high X-Priority: 1 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-Type: text/plain From: "Trim, Matthew L" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88615102 X-Yahoo-Profile: bofh2k2000 Hi, I'm starting to think we should put more resources into pushing AM Wideband audio with receiver manufacturers rather than AMS. Most of the Japanese AMS radios manufactured seem to have the same limited AM bandwidth as mono radios. In fact, apart from the Delco's, Chrysler Infinity Premium, SRF-A1, SRF-A100 and SRF-42, ST-JX220A/STJX230A, the Target Memorex Boombox and the older valve radios - 99% of AM Radios today are constructed as cheaply as possible! What's the point of stereo sound if the sonic quality is so badly compromised. I'm thinking that it may cost more to design and implement a decent AM Wideband receiver than to add one AMS chip. Perhaps the manufacturers real reason for dumping AMS was they didn't want to go to the effort to design a low noise, wide bandwidth AM receiver so felt it worthless having low quality stereo sound. I have a Sony SRF-S83 pocket receiver. It contains an all-in-one AM/FM decoder IC. The AM reception is quite good but it's very narrow. Could it really be widened by changing the chip design, or do a lot more discreet components need to be added in order to keep it low noise. I can't help but think that they can implement AM cheaply as long as they keep the bandwidth limited - and this could indirectly be a reason why AMS has been dropped - even by the Japanese. Cheers, Matt From KC4QLP@aol.com Wed Oct 23 17:21:37 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 24 Oct 2002 00:21:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 57629 invoked from network); 24 Oct 2002 00:21:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Oct 2002 00:21:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r10.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.106) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Oct 2002 00:21:37 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r10.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.b6.13f45cf2 (30960) for ; Wed, 23 Oct 2002 20:21:34 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: Date: Wed, 23 Oct 2002 20:21:34 EDT Subject: Re: {AMSF} Should we focussing more on AM Wideband instead of AMS? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 10/23/02 8:10:56 PM Eastern Daylight Time, matthew.trim@eds.com writes: << I'm thinking that it may cost more to design and implement a decent AM Wideband receiver than to add one AMS chip. Perhaps the manufacturers real reason for dumping AMS was they didn't want to go to the effort to design a low noise, wide bandwidth AM receiver so felt it worthless having low quality stereo sound. >> Well Matt,thats where the Omega Reception Technology would come into play,which if I'm reading all if this correctly..its been tested and probably doesnt cost that much more than todays radio receiver trash to make. Regardless...I'll be watching and listening for Marv Southcott closely to find out the latest on this technology as well The more you know,the more you grow. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5..., Ray Communications Radio Network Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From kevtronics@yahoo.com Wed Oct 23 19:06:19 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 24 Oct 2002 02:06:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 3095 invoked from network); 24 Oct 2002 02:06:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Oct 2002 02:06:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Oct 2002 02:06:17 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.182] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 24 Oct 2002 02:06:17 -0000 Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 02:06:16 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Should we focussing more on AM Wideband instead of AMS? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <533761B50551D511A6D200508B6F542809CAF37F@AUSYM200> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3086 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.78.143 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > I'm starting to think we should put more resources into pushing AM > Wideband audio with receiver manufacturers rather than AMS. It is clear that the FUTURE OF RADIO IS DIGITAL! However, we still have to figure out which *form* of digital technology is best. iBiquity is pushing it on both the transmitter and receiver side with their IBOC/"HD Radio" system, with highly questionable results. On the other hand, Digital Signal Processing of existing analog radio signals has been used for the past few years with excellent results, and now Motorola is putting their forces behind this form of "digital radio" with the "Symphony" chip-set. With DSP, there is no reason NOT to make use of AM Stereo, as it is only a matter of adding some extra computer code into the DSP microprocessor. And if you are going to already devote a certain amount of effort into developing and refining a high quality, wide bandwidth AM tuner in the digital code, the extra effort of adding support for AM Stereo is really not that huge. Motorola and Philips both have DSP receiver chipsets that will at least have the capability to support C-Quam AM Stereo reception, if the radio manufacturer so chooses. So, why not? It's like adding RDS to the FM tuner -- once everything is digital, then adding extra features becomes quite trivial and requires no additional hardware components, unlike analog tuner designs, where wide-band AM and AM Stereo would both require additional chips and components to add to an AM tuner. Ideally, a DSP-based receiver design could be packaged into something as small, cheap, and ubiquitous as today's portable MP3 players. This kind of availability will be the key to success for any radio system, and it may turn out that DSP-based reception of analog radio might be the only system that can accomplish this. XM and Sirius radio are both too fussy about reception of the satellite signal to be packaged into truly portable receivers. And at this point, IBOC/"HD Radio" receivers still take up a rack full of computer equipment -- not even CLOSE to being a Walkman-size unit that can run off a pair of AA batteries! And regardless of anything related to digital, Sony PROVED that cheap yet reasonably good-sounding and well-performing AMAX AM Stereo radios CAN be sold "en masse" at a very affordable price. The ubiquitous $29.99 Sony SRF-42 probably did more than anything else to help sustain the popularity of AM Stereo through the 1990s. Aside from a Chrysler car radio, it was my first AM Stereo radio, and I'm sure for many other people here as well. Moreover, WE NEED something like the SRF-42 again! Especially if the same price range can be maintained. Think of the public reaction: "Gee, should I spend $150 on a new digital radio and have it to receive the one or two local stations that are transmitting in 'HD Radio' digital, or should I go for the $29.99 AMAX AM Stereo Walkman and have EVERY AM station on the dial sound better and come in clearer, regardless if they transmit in AM Stereo or not!?" From KC4QLP@aol.com Wed Oct 23 20:31:08 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 24 Oct 2002 03:31:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 42478 invoked from network); 24 Oct 2002 03:31:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Oct 2002 03:31:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m04.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.7) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Oct 2002 03:31:05 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.aa.13efae0c (3310); Wed, 23 Oct 2002 23:30:57 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: Date: Wed, 23 Oct 2002 23:30:56 EDT Subject: WOR website adds coverage map detailing digital vs analog coverage To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, amstereo@topica.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Language: en X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp WOR engineering webpage update folks!...WOR has a coverage map up on the=20 website showing the digital to analog coverage. The site is: http://www.wor710.com/Engineering/iboc/hdcoverage.htm The coverage area was determined by using a prototype consumer automotive H= D=20 Radio with a 31=E2=80=9D whip antenna. =E2=80=93 Not a reference receiver. = =20 The point were the digital to analog blend took place was at their 2mV/M=20 contour.{just outside of Philadephia} This is considering too as they are=20 only running the digital carriers at -6db..which translates to a 1/4 of its= =20 power output ability. Bringing the digital carrier to full power,the digital stream could be=20 carried past Philadephia to their .5mV/M contour Bob Carter Operations/Engineering =20 WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3=20 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5..., Ray Communications Radio=20 Network=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20 =20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineeri= ng=20 services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net=20 Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC=20 WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com=20 = =20 KC4QLP Amateur Radio=20=20 Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________=20 From matthew.trim@eds.com Wed Oct 23 20:44:17 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: matthew.trim@eds.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 24 Oct 2002 03:44:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 17683 invoked from network); 24 Oct 2002 03:44:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Oct 2002 03:44:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO ns5.eds.com) (203.17.185.230) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Oct 2002 03:44:15 -0000 Received: from nnsy.eds.com (nnsy-3.eds.com [192.168.1.1]) by ns5.eds.com (8.11.6/8.11.1) with ESMTP id g9O3iEH18627 for ; Thu, 24 Oct 2002 13:44:14 +1000 (EST) Received: from nnsy.eds.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by nnsy.eds.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9O3iCJ17580 for ; Thu, 24 Oct 2002 13:44:12 +1000 (EST) Received: from ausym000.exau01.exch.eds.com ([134.251.177.117]) by nnsy.eds.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9O3iCR17576 for ; Thu, 24 Oct 2002 13:44:12 +1000 (EST) Received: by AUSYM000 with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Thu, 24 Oct 2002 13:43:57 +1000 Message-ID: <533761B50551D511A6D200508B6F542809CAF380@AUSYM200> To: "'amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com'" Subject: RE: {AMSF} Re: Should we focussing more on AM Wideband instead of AMS? Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 13:43:36 +1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-Type: text/plain From: "Trim, Matthew L" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88615102 X-Yahoo-Profile: bofh2k2000 OK, so we need to see a Wideband capable radio something like the SRF-42 be reintroduced in the marketplace. If we decide to go DSP though - do the DSP chipsets provide (or is it even technically possible) the sort of sound quality, sensitivity and selectivity we've come to enjoy from the SRF-A100 & Delco's etc, bearing in mind we have lost all the discrete audio components in these new DSP based radios. As far I've heard, the Philips DSP's do not come close to wide bandwidth output? Will the Symphony be able to do any better? What about the Omega? I realise that if you are talking a DSP chip, basically software is the limitation, however can software truly replicate 'analogue' sound quality? The sampling rate of the analogue TX signal received would need to be quite high to minimise digital artefacts wouldn't it? Have a read of this web page: http://www.fixup.net/tips/srfs83/srfs83.htm This bloke seems to know his stuff about pocket radios. He said the Sony SRF-M95, which "uses a Toshiba IC - TA2022AFN; there is no large electrolytic capacitor in it; therefore discrete and switching circuitry must have been used. I think this is why these two digital receivers sound just "digital" - clean with good stereo separation but not so musical. They have neither the warmness nor the energy of modified SRF-59 or outbox SRF-S83, very much like the very first CD players" The Analogue SRF-S83 is more sensitive and selective than all the digital tuners listed on the page and half the price of the SRF-M95 The only radio to come close to analogue sound quality is the SRF-M35 but it still is slightly less selective than the analogy tuned radio. Apparently Sony is still the king of portable radios - at least according to the research and opinions on the above webpage. I'm sure DSP's will improve and from what we hear of the Omega system - the potential is there. The risk is most manufacturers not specifying a particular quality standard for AM reception and thus the DSP's are locked a at 3-5khz rolloff like 99% of all radio's made today are. I just had a thought... these days we compare our transistor/IC based radio's to the valve radio's of yesteryear... in 5 years or so we may well wish our DSP radio's could sound as warm and fresh as our SRF-A100's/Delco's etc.. :) From groucho@skyweb.net Wed Oct 23 22:35:26 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 24 Oct 2002 05:35:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 1292 invoked from network); 24 Oct 2002 05:35:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Oct 2002 05:35:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Oct 2002 05:35:25 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g9O5c2ZD005798 for ; Thu, 24 Oct 2002 01:38:03 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DB78434.5B880F7@skyweb.net> Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 01:25:08 -0400 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Should we focussing more on AM Wideband instead of AMS? References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 To put it simply I cannot understand all this digital crap... the Human ear can Only hear so Much. to top that off Its an Analog device.. the only way I can see Digital is If they implant Digital to analog devices into our brains. the Ear is an analog Device.. so the hell with this Digital crap.. Now I feel better getting that off my chest Neal "Kevin T." wrote: > > I'm starting to think we should put more resources into pushing AM > > Wideband audio with receiver manufacturers rather than AMS. > > It is clear that the FUTURE OF RADIO IS DIGITAL! However, we still > have to figure out which *form* of digital technology is best. > iBiquity is pushing it on both the transmitter and receiver side > with their IBOC/"HD Radio" system, with highly questionable results. > On the other hand, Digital Signal Processing of existing analog radio > signals has been used for the past few years with excellent results, > and now Motorola is putting their forces behind this form of "digital > radio" with the "Symphony" chip-set. > > With DSP, there is no reason NOT to make use of AM Stereo, as it is > only a matter of adding some extra computer code into the DSP > microprocessor. And if you are going to already devote a certain > amount of effort into developing and refining a high quality, wide > bandwidth AM tuner in the digital code, the extra effort of adding > support for AM Stereo is really not that huge. Motorola and Philips > both have DSP receiver chipsets that will at least have the > capability to support C-Quam AM Stereo reception, if the radio > manufacturer so chooses. So, why not? It's like adding RDS to the > FM tuner -- once everything is digital, then adding extra features > becomes quite trivial and requires no additional hardware components, > unlike analog tuner designs, where wide-band AM and AM Stereo would > both require additional chips and components to add to an AM tuner. > > Ideally, a DSP-based receiver design could be packaged into something > as small, cheap, and ubiquitous as today's portable MP3 players. > This kind of availability will be the key to success for any radio > system, and it may turn out that DSP-based reception of analog radio > might be the only system that can accomplish this. XM and Sirius > radio are both too fussy about reception of the satellite signal to > be packaged into truly portable receivers. And at this point, > IBOC/"HD Radio" receivers still take up a rack full of computer > equipment -- not even CLOSE to being a Walkman-size unit that can run > off a pair of AA batteries! > > And regardless of anything related to digital, Sony PROVED that cheap > yet reasonably good-sounding and well-performing AMAX AM Stereo > radios CAN be sold "en masse" at a very affordable price. The > ubiquitous $29.99 Sony SRF-42 probably did more than anything else to > help sustain the popularity of AM Stereo through the 1990s. Aside > from a Chrysler car radio, it was my first AM Stereo radio, and I'm > sure for many other people here as well. > > Moreover, WE NEED something like the SRF-42 again! Especially if the > same price range can be maintained. Think of the public reaction: > "Gee, should I spend $150 on a new digital radio and have it to > receive the one or two local stations that are transmitting in 'HD > Radio' digital, or should I go for the $29.99 AMAX AM Stereo Walkman > and have EVERY AM station on the dial sound better and come in > clearer, regardless if they transmit in AM Stereo or not!?" > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From kevtronics@yahoo.com Wed Oct 23 23:08:14 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 24 Oct 2002 06:08:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 15653 invoked from network); 24 Oct 2002 06:08:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Oct 2002 06:08:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Oct 2002 06:08:13 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.184] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 24 Oct 2002 06:08:13 -0000 Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 06:08:13 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: WOR website adds coverage map detailing digital vs analog coverage Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 319 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.78.143 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > WOR engineering webpage update folks!...WOR has a coverage map up > on the website showing the digital to analog coverage. Now, compare it to their analog coverage map, which was at least accurate back when they were transmitting a plain fully-analog AM signal: http://www.wor710.com/Engineering/coveragemap.htm From jsgil@hal-pc.org Wed Oct 23 23:56:01 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 24 Oct 2002 06:56:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 29965 invoked from network); 24 Oct 2002 06:56:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Oct 2002 06:56:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Oct 2002 06:56:01 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.133] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 24 Oct 2002 06:56:01 -0000 Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 06:55:59 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Should we focussing more on AM Wideband instead of AMS? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <533761B50551D511A6D200508B6F542809CAF37F@AUSYM200> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1876 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.154 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Trim, Matthew L" Perhaps the manufacturers real > reason for dumping AMS was they didn't want to go to the effort to design a > low noise, wide bandwidth AM receiver so felt it worthless having low > quality stereo sound. > > I have a Sony SRF-S83 pocket receiver. It contains an all-in-one AM/FM > decoder IC. The AM reception is quite good but it's very narrow. Could it > really be widened by changing the chip design, or do a lot more discreet > components need to be added in order to keep it low noise. I can't help but > think that they can implement AM cheaply as long as they keep the bandwidth > limited - and this could indirectly be a reason why AMS has been dropped - > even by the Japanese. > > Cheers, > > Matt Once you go wideband you will need notch filters and you will also need a narrow band filter also for DX. The RF bandpass filter will have to track the local osc more closely for good reception. Since manufacturers see the AM band mostly as Sports & Talk they figure that for most people hi-fi on AM isn't much of an issue so why spent the extra money on the design. This has also been a self fulfilling prophecy for the manufacturers since they have slowly been reducing the bandwidth the programming on AM has shifted more towards talk and away from music because the music station's ratings have dropped because the format sounds so poor on narrowband radios. This has convinved people that AM sounds crummy because it is AM. Add in that broadcasters kept adding more pre-emphasis to compensate for the narrowband receivers which caused more interference to adjacent stations. To reduce the interference the manufacturers kept narrowing the bandwidth which added to the problem. This became a vicious cycle that has resulted in some of the narrowest receivers being manufactured. JSG From jsgil@hal-pc.org Thu Oct 24 00:14:14 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 24 Oct 2002 07:14:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 16892 invoked from network); 24 Oct 2002 07:14:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Oct 2002 07:14:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.66) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Oct 2002 07:14:13 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.252] by n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 24 Oct 2002 07:14:13 -0000 Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 07:14:12 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: IBOC + C-Quam is possible Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <104.1dfa3fa2.2ae889ad@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 995 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.154 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@y..., KC4QLP@a... wrote: > In a message dated 10/23/02 2:44:10 PM Eastern Daylight Time, > 1st there just isnt enough bandwidth to pull this off..even remotely. > 2nd....even if there was enough bandwidth...the analog side of the receiver > would hear the hash from the nearby digital carriers bleeding ..even if > slightly would cause enough noise to drive anyone insane. > There's no question that the digital hash would show up on an analog radio but in an IBOC receiver the DSP chip could use a brick wall filter at 5KHz to remove any digital info in the higher frequencies. The 5KHz analog stereo signal could be recovered without digital interference and the digital data would only need to carry the audio frequencies from 5KHz to 15KHz. That is a 3rd of the bandwidth that the digital stream doesn't have to carry so the upper frequencies cane be encoded at a higher quality. It would all be a matter of the DSP programming at transmitter and receiver. JSG From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Oct 24 00:44:18 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 24 Oct 2002 07:44:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 31019 invoked from network); 24 Oct 2002 07:44:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Oct 2002 07:44:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Oct 2002 07:44:16 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.167] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 24 Oct 2002 07:44:16 -0000 Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 07:44:16 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: IBOC + C-Quam is possible Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2226 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.78.143 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > The 5KHz analog stereo signal could be recovered without digital > interference and the digital data would only need to carry the > audio frequencies from 5KHz to 15KHz. That is a 3rd of the > bandwidth that the digital stream doesn't have to carry so the > upper frequencies cane be encoded at a higher quality. It would all > be a matter of the DSP programming at transmitter and receiver. Aah... now I see what you are proposing here. Sort of a permanent hybrid system, where the 0-5 kHz audio range would ALWAYS be taken from the analog part of the signal, and only the 5+ kHz high audio frequencies would be encoded over the digital data stream. An interesting approach, and it would definitely conserve bandwidth, so that a station wouldn't need digital sidebands splattering out over a +/- 15 kHz range. However, with analog AM, some forms of interference are going to always be present, no matter how much you narrow the response -- i.e., buzzing from dimmer lights and bad power lines, lightning crackles, TV/computer whines and whistles, etc. These are the little things that IBOC is trying to avoid completely -- nevermind the fact that once you get to a certain level of interference, *no* system is going to work well, analog or digital. But every day that I drive my half-hour commute and listen to a 250-watt analog AM station all the while with NO signal fade-outs, NO interference (except from one or two LED traffic lights -- those things should be shot to put them out of their RFI misery!!), and NO audio quality problems... I am reminded that plain old analog AM still has plenty of life life. It's just a matter of putting a little EFFORT into something which has been overlooked for so long. At this point, AM radio is like a bridge that everybody drives on, but nobody maintains. Without attention, it would crumble to pieces. And there are two proposed solutions: either restore the existing bridge and make it better than ever, or build a whole new bridge that is twice as wide, but actually has less lanes for cars to travel on. Which solution would you prefer? That is what every AM radio broadcaster, equipment manufacturer, and listener has to consider here. From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Oct 24 00:46:44 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 24 Oct 2002 07:46:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 64319 invoked from network); 24 Oct 2002 07:46:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Oct 2002 07:46:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d02.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.34) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Oct 2002 07:46:43 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.189.100f72a4 (3310) for ; Thu, 24 Oct 2002 03:46:41 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <189.100f72a4.2ae8ff61@aol.com> Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 03:46:41 EDT Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC + C-Quam is possible To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 10/24/02 3:14:46 AM Eastern Daylight Time, jsgil@hal-pc.org writes: << There's no question that the digital hash would show up on an analog radio but in an IBOC receiver the DSP chip could use a brick wall filter at 5KHz to remove any digital info in the higher frequencies. The 5KHz analog stereo signal could be recovered without digital interference and the digital data would only need to carry the audio frequencies from 5KHz to 15KHz. That is a 3rd of the bandwidth that the digital stream doesn't have to carry so the upper frequencies cane be encoded at a higher quality. It would all be a matter of the DSP programming at transmitter and receiver. JSG >> And on the transmitting end,...how would you make the digital robust enough to withstand all the interference that it will encounter? Thats one of the reasons why HD radio sounds like a mess now.Its encoded in such a manor to be robust which leaves no room to add "features" without having to have a digital carrier either side of the analog channel. Even if the digital is used to carry the stereo info,you will find that the digital stereo carrier more than likely wont be as stable or locking if you will compared to analog C-Quam stereo in the fringe areas.I can carry stereo on an AM stereo out to the edge of its secondary service area...something digital wont be able to do without really trashing up the band. Remember WOR's digital is only operating at a 1/4 of its digital power now.When they let the entire monster out of the box we probably will see adjacent channel stations start yelling {that is if they have any sense and care about their listeners and coverage area} And once again...we have this radio with DSP and the like and impliment a transmitting scheme of IBOC and C-Quam..your right back to square one.Everyone has to buy a new radio..otherwise they will hear the IBOC mess they hear now.No DSP/filtering = hash either way you go. An AM channel just isnt wide enough to do the ideal thing without sturring up alot of need for new equipment,channel shifting and having lots of stations leave the air....sorry I just dont see that happening, and then it goes back to the old question..."Will people really see a need for this...just to listen to a meduim that is majority talk radio?" ...With what people think of AM already and whatever damage HD radio does..the likelyhood of majority of Americans running to Best Buy,Wal-Mart or where ever to buy a new gadget would probably be low. Its a shame that DSP technology wasnt around 15-20 years ago like it is now.Things would be much different now for AM. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5..., Ray Communications Radio Network Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Oct 24 00:57:43 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 24 Oct 2002 07:57:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 45662 invoked from network); 24 Oct 2002 07:57:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Oct 2002 07:57:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r07.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.103) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Oct 2002 07:57:41 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.143.11c4c98 (3310) for ; Thu, 24 Oct 2002 03:57:39 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <143.11c4c98.2ae901f3@aol.com> Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 03:57:39 EDT Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC + C-Quam is possible To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 10/24/02 3:44:48 AM Eastern Daylight Time, kevtronics@yahoo.com writes: << But every day that I drive my half-hour commute and listen to a 250-watt analog AM station all the while with NO signal fade-outs, NO interference (except from one or two LED traffic lights -- those things should be shot to put them out of their RFI misery!!), and NO audio quality problems... I am reminded that plain old analog AM still has plenty of life life. It's just a matter of putting a little EFFORT into something which has been overlooked for so long.>> hahaha!..Oh boy I know a bunch of power lines that I would love to launch into outer space too! Rocket lanchers,power line buzz seeking missles would be a nice invention. << At this point, AM radio is like a bridge that everybody drives on, but nobody maintains. Without attention, it would crumble to pieces. And there are two proposed solutions: either restore the existing bridge and make it better than ever, or build a whole new bridge that is twice as wide, but actually has less lanes for cars to travel on. Which solution would you prefer? That is what every AM radio broadcaster, equipment manufacturer, and listener has to consider here. >> The broadcaster already has the high quality audio..we all have established that.It boils back to those "wonderful" receiver manufactures to make quality receivers. If the receiver is junk,then it will make what your listening to sound like junk no matter what gold comes out of those transmitters and into the ether. Scott Todd had a fix for that years ago with his petition,but it fell on the deaf ears of our now politcal FCC.If only the FCC were made up of engineers like it was many years ago when radio sounded great we wouldnt even be entertaining digital hokispokis magic crap. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5..., Ray Communications Radio Network Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From jsgil@hal-pc.org Thu Oct 24 01:22:13 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 24 Oct 2002 08:22:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 80040 invoked from network); 24 Oct 2002 08:22:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Oct 2002 08:22:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Oct 2002 08:22:11 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.128] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 24 Oct 2002 08:22:10 -0000 Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 08:22:09 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: IBOC + C-Quam is possible Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1512 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.154 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin T." wrote: > > But every day that I drive my half-hour commute and listen to a > 250-watt analog AM station all the while with NO signal fade-outs, NO > interference (except from one or two LED traffic lights -- those > things should be shot to put them out of their RFI misery!!), and NO > audio quality problems... I am reminded that plain old analog AM > still has plenty of life life. It's just a matter of putting a > little EFFORT into something which has been overlooked for so long. > There's no question that there is still plenty of life left in analog AM but if a scheme like this has enough benefit for iBuquity to write the codec for C-QuAM for the IBOC exciters it would give stations an option to also have a C-QuAM exciter that could go to full bandwidth at night when IBOC is turned off at night. During the daytime if there is enough bandwidth for the data stream to encode the 5-15KHz audio at a good rate it could be possible have an FM stereo like sound on AM. If IBOC does not take off the stations are left with a system that will do C-QuAM very well. It could be the best of both worlds for the radio stations and has the potential make IBOC sound better during the hybrid phase while smoothing the transition from analog to digital. AM IBOC may always stay hybrid if skywake interference at night causes too much signal degradation. With all factors involved I see a difficult situation for the nighttime use IBOC. JSG From jsgil@hal-pc.org Thu Oct 24 01:38:21 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 24 Oct 2002 08:38:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 30442 invoked from network); 24 Oct 2002 08:38:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Oct 2002 08:38:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.70) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Oct 2002 08:38:19 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.168] by n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 24 Oct 2002 08:38:04 -0000 Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 08:38:03 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: IBOC + C-Quam is possible Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <189.100f72a4.2ae8ff61@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2608 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.154 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@y..., KC4QLP@a... wrote: > And on the transmitting end,...how would you make the digital robust enough > to withstand all the interference that it will encounter? > Thats one of the reasons why HD radio sounds like a mess now.Its encoded in > such a manor to be robust which leaves no room to add "features" without > having to have a digital carrier either side of the analog channel. > Even if the digital is used to carry the stereo info,you will find that the > digital stereo carrier more than likely wont be as stable or locking if you > will compared to analog C-Quam stereo in the fringe areas.I can carry stereo > on an AM stereo out to the edge of its secondary service area...something > digital wont be able to do without really trashing up the band. > Remember WOR's digital is only operating at a 1/4 of its digital power > now.When they let the entire monster out of the box we probably will see > adjacent channel stations start yelling {that is if they have any sense and > care about their listeners and coverage area} > And once again...we have this radio with DSP and the like and impliment a > transmitting scheme of IBOC and C-Quam..your right back to square > one.Everyone has to buy a new radio..otherwise they will hear the IBOC mess > they hear now.No DSP/filtering = hash either way you go. > An AM channel just isnt wide enough to do the ideal thing without sturring up > alot of need for new equipment,channel shifting and having lots of stations > leave the air....sorry I just dont see that happening, and then it goes back > to the old question..."Will people really see a need for this...just to > listen to a meduim that is majority talk radio?" ...With what people think of > AM already and whatever damage HD radio does..the likelyhood of majority of > Americans running to Best Buy,Wal-Mart or where ever to buy a new gadget > would probably be low. > Its a shame that DSP technology wasnt around 15-20 years ago like it is > now.Things would be much different now for AM. > > Bob Carter > Operations/Engineering > I definitely agree that the IBOC hash is a mess on the AM band and that a digital signal is not as robust an analog C-QuAM but try telling iBiquity that. If iBiquity sees that there is an advantage to including C-QuAM in their IBOC exciter of having to encode a for 1/3 less bandwidth with stations having the option of full analog bandwidth at night that's more C-QuAM which is what we want. If people complain so much about the hash then a station could revert to C-QuAM at the flip of a switch. JSG From tom_richard1980@yahoo.com Thu Oct 24 06:15:15 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: tom_richard1980@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 24 Oct 2002 13:15:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 16951 invoked from network); 24 Oct 2002 13:15:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Oct 2002 13:15:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO proxymail.homerelay.com) (209.75.47.224) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Oct 2002 13:15:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 28236 invoked from network); 24 Oct 2002 13:15:11 -0000 Received: from vtcomm-6.homerelay.com (HELO yahoo.com) (209.75.47.216) by 0 with SMTP; 24 Oct 2002 13:15:11 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Cc: Date: 24 Oct 2002 06:10 -0500 Subject:Eff Cee Cee From: tom_richard1980@yahoo.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38123538 X-Yahoo-Profile: tom_richard1980 Somebody tell me why these FCC morons didn't wait 15 years to approve an IBOC system as they did with AM Stereo.... From amfmdx@fastq.com Thu Oct 24 07:30:50 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 24 Oct 2002 14:30:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 87570 invoked from network); 24 Oct 2002 14:30:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Oct 2002 14:30:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Oct 2002 14:30:47 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt (d33-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.65]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id g9OEUkP29929 for ; Thu, 24 Oct 2002 07:30:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <04fc01c27b69$d85496c0$70f9bed8@kredding430cdt> To: References: <200210241315.g9ODF7cQ013807@sd.fastq.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Eff Cee Cee Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 07:30:03 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > Somebody tell me why these FCC morons didn't wait 15 years to approve an IBOC system as they did with AM Stereo.... "Its all about the Benjamins." Kevin From stodd@sherbtel.net Thu Oct 24 09:20:59 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 24 Oct 2002 16:20:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 54541 invoked from network); 24 Oct 2002 16:20:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Oct 2002 16:20:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Oct 2002 16:20:58 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-89-112.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.112]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g9OGF4jR017361 for ; Thu, 24 Oct 2002 11:15:36 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <000f01c27b79$6a91e240$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Responce from WOR RE: IBOC Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 11:20:58 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude I certainly understand. I hope it's sooner rather than later, however, since even if they have a better product, it may not take off if it is introduced significantly later. What would have happened if Beta had been introduced after VHS? Even coming out first it didn't win it permanent success. I do understand Omega wants to do it right, though. Scott ----- Original Message ----- From: "Marv Southcott" > Right now, the Fanfare monitor/demod receiver supports AMS and FMS > with its exceptionally quiet, FTA-100. As for Omega technology, its > unique AMS capabilities are still only part of the story. When will > it make its debut? You're right Scott, I am not at liberty to say. From stodd@sherbtel.net Thu Oct 24 09:22:59 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 24 Oct 2002 16:22:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 8211 invoked from network); 24 Oct 2002 16:22:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Oct 2002 16:22:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Oct 2002 16:22:58 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-89-112.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.112]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g9OGHZjR018185 for ; Thu, 24 Oct 2002 11:17:37 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <001301c27b79$b2557740$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: <533761B50551D511A6D200508B6F542809CAF37F@AUSYM200> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Should we focussing more on AM Wideband instead of AMS? Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 11:23:30 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Nope- I bet you could get it to sound decent if you replaced the ceramic resonator. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Trim, Matthew L" > I have a Sony SRF-S83 pocket receiver. It contains an all-in-one AM/FM > decoder IC. The AM reception is quite good but it's very narrow. Could it > really be widened by changing the chip design, or do a lot more discreet > components need to be added in order to keep it low noise. From stodd@sherbtel.net Thu Oct 24 09:24:49 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 24 Oct 2002 16:24:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 60298 invoked from network); 24 Oct 2002 16:24:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Oct 2002 16:24:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Oct 2002 16:24:48 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-89-112.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.112]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g9OGJPjR018743 for ; Thu, 24 Oct 2002 11:19:27 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <001901c27b79$f3e92f80$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: <533761B50551D511A6D200508B6F542809CAF380@AUSYM200> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Should we focussing more on AM Wideband instead of AMS? Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 11:25:20 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude From what Marv told me, the Omega is outstanding. Don't know about Motorola, though they tout it as being pretty good. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Trim, Matthew L" > > As far I've heard, the Philips DSP's do not come close to wide bandwidth > output? Will the Symphony be able to do any better? What about the Omega? > From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Oct 24 12:59:19 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 24 Oct 2002 19:59:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 74515 invoked from network); 24 Oct 2002 19:59:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Oct 2002 19:59:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r06.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.102) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Oct 2002 19:59:17 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.10c.1962606b (3842) for ; Thu, 24 Oct 2002 15:58:56 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <10c.1962606b.2ae9aaff@aol.com> Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 15:58:55 EDT Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC + C-Quam is possible To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 10/24/02 4:38:41 AM Eastern Daylight Time, jsgil@hal-pc.org writes: << I definitely agree that the IBOC hash is a mess on the AM band and that a digital signal is not as robust an analog C-QuAM but try telling iBiquity that. If iBiquity sees that there is an advantage to including C-QuAM in their IBOC exciter of having to encode a for 1/3 less bandwidth with stations having the option of full analog bandwidth at night that's more C-QuAM which is what we want. If people complain so much about the hash then a station could revert to C-QuAM at the flip of a switch. JSG >> Its a good idea,but with as many broadcast companies that do not look favorably towards C-Quam to start with..it might be a hard sell. Once again..what will the listeners and radio stations get out of this? Radio station and listeners pay money for more equipment to hear the same ol thing thats already on. Its not how the programming is being delivered that is broke...its the programming thats broke. To many program directors/station managers and CEO's put to much faith into what consultants say it isnt funny. If a consultant told the decision maker at one of the larger broadcast companies to play Christmas music via LP's backwards because it would raise ratings..they would do it just because the consultant said it would work according to his "studies" Listeners want something worth listening to before they'll go after a new product. All iBiquity is listening to right now is the jingle in the money bags on the way to the bank. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5..., Ray Communications Radio Network Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Oct 24 13:02:28 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 24 Oct 2002 20:02:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 8267 invoked from network); 24 Oct 2002 20:02:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Oct 2002 20:02:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d08.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.40) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Oct 2002 20:02:27 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.12c.19c4f185 (3842); Thu, 24 Oct 2002 16:02:15 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <12c.19c4f185.2ae9abc6@aol.com> Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 16:02:14 EDT Subject: Re: {AMSF} Eff Cee Cee To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, amstereo@topica.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 10/24/02 9:53:17 AM Eastern Daylight Time, tom_richard1980@yahoo.com writes: << Somebody tell me why these FCC morons didn't wait 15 years to approve an IBOC system as they did with AM Stereo.... >> {sings---money money money mmmmooooonnnneeeeeyyyy!} Bob Carter Operations/Engineering WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5..., Ray Communications Radio Network Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From jsgil@hal-pc.org Thu Oct 24 14:25:08 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 24 Oct 2002 21:25:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 20691 invoked from network); 24 Oct 2002 21:25:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Oct 2002 21:25:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Oct 2002 21:25:06 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.182] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 24 Oct 2002 21:25:06 -0000 Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 21:25:04 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Should we focussing more on AM Wideband instead of AMS? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <001301c27b79$b2557740$d3a9fea9@me> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 927 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.90 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Scott Todd" wrote: > Nope- I bet you could get it to sound decent if you replaced the ceramic > resonator. >=20 Ceramic resonators. Those are hard to find. One source for those if your just doing a few conversions for yourself is the older cordless phones that operated at 50MHz. I usually see several of=20 these units at thrift stores for around $5.=20 The handset has a =B17.5KHz 6 element and the base usually has a =B16KHz one. The input and output termination impedance on the =B17.5KHz and wider ones in 1.5Kohm and the =B16KHz and narrower ones are 2Kohm. The main issue with these is that they are centered 455KHz instead of 450KHz which is what DTR uses. If you have an older mechanically tuned Hi-Fi receiver then it should work just fine. Remember if you put a wide filter in there you are going to need 10KHz notch filters or it will be impossible to listen to at night. JSG From jsgil@hal-pc.org Thu Oct 24 14:48:23 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 24 Oct 2002 21:48:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 28133 invoked from network); 24 Oct 2002 21:48:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Oct 2002 21:48:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Oct 2002 21:48:23 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.140] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 24 Oct 2002 21:48:23 -0000 Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 21:48:21 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: IBOC + C-Quam is possible Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 644 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.90 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst I tried some filtering on MP3s to create ones that just had the 5-15KHz audio range. The encoding was done with LAME at 32Kbps joint stereo and VBR with a quality of 3. The full bandwidth version has a good FM quality sound. You'd be suprised that 90% of the intelligable signal is contained in the 0-5KHz area because after listening to the 5-15Khz one it has almost all harmonics as it was hard to tell where in the song I was listening to. It was mainly cymbals and other higher frequency percussion instruments. The original full bandwidth version was 122Kbps while the 5-15KHz one was 77Kbps. That's a bitrate reduction of 37%. JSG From florida_amstereo@hotmail.com Thu Oct 24 14:53:31 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: florida_amstereo@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 24 Oct 2002 21:53:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 4093 invoked from network); 24 Oct 2002 21:53:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Oct 2002 21:53:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.37.184) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Oct 2002 21:53:30 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 24 Oct 2002 14:53:30 -0700 Received: from 209.240.198.61 by pv2fd.pav2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Thu, 24 Oct 2002 21:53:30 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Eef Cee Cee Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 21:53:30 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 24 Oct 2002 21:53:30.0628 (UTC) FILETIME=[CA75FC40:01C27BA7] From: "Donn Tillman" X-Originating-IP: [209.240.198.61] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83914824 Tom Richard astutely asked: >Somebody tell me why these FCC morons >didn't wait 15 years to approve an > >IBOC system as they did with AM >Stereo.... $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ Tom, I'm $ure the eff cee cee had many good rea$on$ to blanketly and prematurely approve IBOC without $ufficient& impartial te$ting and actually li$tening to the public's comment$. donn, st petersburg,fl usa _________________________________________________________________ Broadband? Dial-up? Get reliable MSN Internet Access. http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/default.asp From matthew.trim@eds.com Thu Oct 24 16:24:24 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: matthew.trim@eds.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 24 Oct 2002 23:24:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 66983 invoked from network); 24 Oct 2002 23:24:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Oct 2002 23:24:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO ns5.eds.com) (203.17.185.230) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Oct 2002 23:24:22 -0000 Received: from nnsy.eds.com (nnsy-3.eds.com [192.168.1.1]) by ns5.eds.com (8.11.6/8.11.1) with ESMTP id g9ONOFH00396 for ; Fri, 25 Oct 2002 09:24:15 +1000 (EST) Received: from nnsy.eds.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by nnsy.eds.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9ONOEJ27514 for ; Fri, 25 Oct 2002 09:24:14 +1000 (EST) Received: from ausym000.exau01.exch.eds.com ([134.251.177.117]) by nnsy.eds.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9ONODR27507 for ; Fri, 25 Oct 2002 09:24:13 +1000 (EST) Received: by AUSYM000 with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Fri, 25 Oct 2002 09:23:57 +1000 Message-ID: <533761B50551D511A6D200508B6F542809CAF383@AUSYM200> To: "'amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com'" Subject: RE: {AMSF} Should we focussing more on AM Wideband instead of AMS ? Date: Fri, 25 Oct 2002 09:23:35 +1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-Type: text/plain From: "Trim, Matthew L" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88615102 X-Yahoo-Profile: bofh2k2000 Excellent! Now which one is the Ceramic Resonator. Here's a link to the Circuit board photo: http://www.fixup.net/tips/srfs83/_derived/srfs83.htm_txt_bigcaps.gif Thanks Scott for the tip! :) -----Original Message----- From: Scott Todd [mailto:stodd@sherbtel.net] Sent: Friday, 25 October 2002 2:24 AM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Should we focussing more on AM Wideband instead of AMS? Nope- I bet you could get it to sound decent if you replaced the ceramic resonator. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Trim, Matthew L" > I have a Sony SRF-S83 pocket receiver. It contains an all-in-one AM/FM > decoder IC. The AM reception is quite good but it's very narrow. Could it > really be widened by changing the chip design, or do a lot more discreet > components need to be added in order to keep it low noise. Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From fanfare@globility.com Fri Oct 25 09:02:33 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 25 Oct 2002 16:02:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 98871 invoked from network); 25 Oct 2002 16:02:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Oct 2002 16:02:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Oct 2002 16:02:32 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.146] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 25 Oct 2002 16:02:32 -0000 Date: Fri, 25 Oct 2002 16:02:29 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: "AMS" has just taken on a new meaning Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 222 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Marv Southcott" X-Originating-IP: 64.56.234.175 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy In the latest published "RW NewsBytes" there's talk of a new AMS ("Advanced Modulation System") for AM where the bandwidth can be increased by 200%. Here's the URL http://www.rwonline.com/dailynews/one.php?id=2143 MS From mychucky@funport.net Fri Oct 25 09:54:41 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: mychucky@funport.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 25 Oct 2002 16:54:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 54118 invoked from network); 25 Oct 2002 16:54:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Oct 2002 16:54:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.funport.com) (216.199.19.6) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Oct 2002 16:54:34 -0000 Received: from FatMusic2000 ([]) by mail.funport.com (Merak 5.1.3) with SMTP id JFB36580 for ; Fri, 25 Oct 2002 12:50:49 -0400 Message-ID: <000801c27c47$250d8340$1400a8c0@FatMusic2000> To: References: <10c.1962606b.2ae9aaff@aol.com> Subject: Re: www.rwonline.com article Date: Fri, 25 Oct 2002 12:54:09 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=85836819 X-Yahoo-Profile: mychucky1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Check it out guys. Regards Chucky www.stereoam.com - Want to comment on this story? Email Guy Wire! - Read previous comments from Guy's Internet Mailbag 10.14.02 A Better Way to Implement AM IBOC by Guy Wire Like a small snowball slowly rolling from the top of a hill, IBOC conversion in the United States seems to be getting underway. Will the controversial invention now called HD Radio steadily grow and gather more speed as it courses down the slope of radio technology history? Or will it break apart encountering too many obstacles and fall by the wayside with earlier contestants like FM Quad and AM stereo? The FCC has just issued the long-awaited initial R&O authorizing deployment of HD. Radio aficionados in the six rollout markets have a ringside seat for this one. We're glad CEO Bob Struble and the Ibiquity brain trust took our advice and waived the licensing fees for early adopters through the end of this year. It just had to happen if deployment is going to be jump-started. And it reassures the industry that Ibiquity has more patience and caring for the long-term future of radio than many had given them credit for. Thanks Bob. I hate to ask again, but could you possibly extend this? Impressive in Seattle The NAB Radio Show in Seattle unveiled a few more clues on how the rollout is likely to fare. One group owner stepped up to the plate and announced purchasing IBOC transmission gear from Harris at the convention. Urban specialist Radio One was the first major market group to jump on the bandwagon and commit money to add HD. Ibiquity, along with Harris and other manufacturers are betting heavily that others will climb aboard soon. Over-the-air comparisons have confirmed in all tested markets that HD Radio on FM "sounds better" and clearly outperforms analog in mitigating noise and interference, plus adding the potential of expanded data services. Seattle NAB HD demos on Entercom's KISW and Infinity's KBKS played very well, as expected. Every FM IBOC demo in a fixed setting or moving vehicle I've heard over the past three years have delivered impressive results. HD FM clearly is ready. Whether data will become the "killer-app" for HD and make broadcasters significant revenue is the big unanswered question in this entire proceeding. If it were only about the FM band, HD Radio would likely have an easier task picking up converts and convincing consumers that the new radios will be worth buying. HD for AM, on the other hand, has emerged as a much more problematic and challenging proposition. Saddled with painfully narrow bandwidth and a compromised allocations scheme that allows neighboring adjacent channels to interfere with each other, HD on AM may be a snowball rolling uphill. The promise and the pain of AM The Ibiquity digital solution developed for AM has long held the promise of 15 kHz stereo and noise-free reception - a giant leap forward for all stations on the venerable low-fi band that would give them parity with today's FM stereo. While such extraordinary improvement appears to be mostly real, it will come at the expense of creating some new interference to analog listeners. That's the disconcerting part for many with vested interests in existing AM stations and those who are worried about being able to hear weaker signals. The interference will come in two flavors. The NRSC sounded the initial concern about nighttime coverage for HD and skywave interference, withholding endorsement of the system for FCC approval until more studies could be completed. Ibiquity's "final" report on this is expected shortly. The more overlooked scenario is daytime interference involving suburban and rim-shot stations trying to cover a nearby larger market served by a powerful second- or third-adjacent-channel signal. Much of this new perceived interference will be receiver induced. We've heard about a few over-the-air tests that are attempting to characterize what happens to the nighttime listenability of one station when subjected to HD noise from a first-adjacent station via groundwave or skywave. Several well-known engineers recently evaluated the impact of HD interference using WOR 710 and WLW 700 as test cases. We understand that measurements and qualitative assessments were made for skywave interference to groundwave reception and groundwave interference to skywave reception for all typical scenarios of desired to undesired signal strength ratios. Skywave interference to skywave reception was even considered. Does anyone besides members of AM DX clubs even do that anymore? Ibiquity's summary report on this has not been released yet, but it will likely say that only one of these modes is going to pose a real problem. Interference will be noticeable and objectionable only when someone tries to listen to a skywave or weaker groundwave signal in the presence of a stronger first adjacent interferer - like when a WLW skywave listener in northern New Jersey tries to hear the Reds ballgame with WOR bearing down with a signal stronger than about 2 mV/m. Is this scenario going to be a problem for significant numbers of AM radio listeners? Understanding the NIF Nighttime service coverage largely is determined by the NIF or nighttime interference free contour. The FCC calculates this number based on RSS summing of all predicted skywave signals arriving into the coverage area of a given station. Skywave signals reflected from the ionosphere generally achieve received levels of only 2 mV/m or less. Few stations nowadays have NIFs close to 2 mV/m - mostly the 50 kW clear channels and some of the very old regional channel stations. The majority of AM stations have NIFs higher than 5 mV/m. They lose a ton of meaningful nighttime service outside their primary 5 mV/m contour. NIFs of even 10 or 15 mV/m are common. Pity those above 20 mV/m. There are quite a few. The only silver lining in this ionospheric cloud is that much of the time, useful coverage extends to about half the NIF for many stations. Ibiquity figures that with skywave signals rarely exceeding 2 mV/m, little meaningful coverage will be lost. Using an extensive computerized study of existing AM signal coverage across the entire United States, they project the overall loss of service at less than 1 percent. If that's true, it's more of a confirmation of the sad fact that not too many folks listen to weaker signals at night on AM radio. It's mostly because they can't. You can't please 'em all The daytime interference issue for HD on AM is only beginning to be heard. Sandusky's nostalgia station KIXI demonstrated HD Radio for the Seattle NAB show, using an older Harris DX-50 transmitter. We understand Harris engineers encountered significant difficulty getting HD to work and keep it working for reasons not fully disclosed. Various broadcast.net radio-tech participants mention hearing noise interference beyond the first-adjacent channels throughout the KIXI coverage area. Similar comments followed the IBOC testing on AM 1140 in Las Vegas during recent conventions. I didn't hear anything significant on my rental car radio while cruising Seattle beyond the KIXI first adjacents. But depending on the design of the radio, perceived interference appears to vary considerably. Those with wider IF bandwidths and better high-end frequency response performance appear to be more vulnerable. I did think the KIXI on-air HD signal heard on several receivers in the Harris NAB booth sounded impressive compared to the analog. It's hard to argue otherwise with the high end opening up from 3 or 4 kHz all the way to FM-like 15 kHz response. In spite of minor compression artifacts, the average listener would almost certainly agree. Meeting the mask It's not really a matter of whether HD AM transmissions can meet the existing NRSC mask. Ibiquity has maintained in their considerable testing that they can. In fact, Ibiquity is saying the existing NRSC mask will be made even more restrictive than it is now, to afford better adjacent-channel and host analog protection. I guess that's reassuring, but many in this industry are still worried about HD AM digital interference to the millions of analog radios out there during the hybrid phase. Ibiquity engineers spent considerable effort making this work for the demos. But it may prove to be difficult to keep many existing transmitters within the mask when setup for HD AM by others. For several extended periods over the past year, WTOP 1500 in Washington, D.C., has been running HD to enable both day and night HD coverage and interference evaluation. Most of Ibiquity's concern has been focused on first adjacent interference. The digital sidesaddles sit 20 dB down, squarely in the middle of the first-adjacent passbands. They may have under-estimated how many radios respond to the second adjacents. Most existing radios seem to fare better suppressing interference from analog modulation limited by the NRSC mask than from HD digital. Suburban DC foreign language stations WPWC 1480 and WTRI 1520 are not too happy with all the new digital hash coming from WTOP. We've heard that it's made it almost impossible for many of their listeners to hear those less than 5 mV/m signals in the DC area. Such stations were bought and sold based on values supported by their ability to serve part of the larger metro area with the analog signal. Protecting the weak This might become a thorny problem for the FCC. Do daytime signals less than 5 mV/m deserve any protection with the advent of HD and the use of wider bandwidth radios? There are perhaps more than 1,000 stations licensed to bedroom communities trying to serve larger nearby markets. Some would suggest the FCC let the suburban genie out of the bottle long ago and it's now coming back to haunt them. The concept of city of license and maintenance of premium signal levels to ensure reliable service has taken a beating over the years. Blame some of that on greedy and opportunistic broadcasters. Many HD AM naysayers are predicting the band will become a sea of hash rendering all weaker signals unusable when most stations in every market convert. We may be seeing only the tip of the iceberg on this issue. As more HD AM signals come on the air, many more complaints will likely be heard. Even though the vast majority of AM listeners will benefit by HD, should the FCC pay any attention to these concerns before writing the final rules for HD AM? It could get messy. Skipping the AM hybrid mode A few consultants and industry observers, including yours truly, think there might be a better way to implement HD AM. Let the FCC authorize the standard for receivers now, but skip the AM hybrid mode entirely and delay conversion for transmission. The benefits of all-digital, similar to those being implemented for Digital Radio Mondiale, are dramatic and impressive. HD FM would deploy on schedule as proposed, allowing HD receivers for both AM and FM to begin filling the marketplace. In less than 10 years, the majority of all radios in use would be HD-capable, making it feasible for all stations in the AM service to make a one-time complete conversion to all-digital. Dropping analog has been the ultimate goal from the beginning. The FCC would set the date perhaps five years in advance, giving all parties with a vested interest plenty of time to prepare for the heralded event. FM could also convert to all-digital at the same time unless LPFMs and smaller stations needed more time. Certainly that could be negotiated. The precedent for mandating the end of the old service has already been established for TV. But no, this would not be another HDTV boondoggle. It's comparatively cheap and easy to add HD transmission to most AM stations and only a bit more challenging for FM. Something for everybody This proposal accomplishes several vitally important goals. First, it eliminates the messy hybrid transition phase for AM and all of the concerns about interference. Most important, it forces the issue of industry wide acceptance for all parties and guarantees the entire industry that HD Radio will be adopted. No more "let the marketplace decide" uncertainty. Stations will know well in advance they will have to make the conversion. Receiver manufacturers will know well in advance that analog radios will no longer be necessary and can focus on building HD and all digital designs. They have made it clear that it's more expensive to build and market both HD and analog-only radios. Prices for HD receiver chips would drop more rapidly enabling affordable Walkman and tabletop versions. Finally, it allows more time to further develop and enhance the HD AM system with software improvements that would later be conveyed to all the smart receivers already out there. No telling what technology breakthroughs might be uncovered and discovered in this arena over the next ten years. Protecting the present, enabling the future Some might argue that delaying HD conversion for AM would only cripple it more and give FM yet another technological advantage for many years. The percentage of radio listeners using AM has finally stopped eroding and has leveled off in 2002 at about 19 percent. Most of that is concentrated on the lucrative news/sports/talk formats and is not going to change because FM has HD. Our proposal effectively protects AM from any further loss of listening caused by interference until all stations convert to HD together. The most radical and unnerving realization here is that all existing analog radios would be rendered instantly useless. Lots of collectables, paperweights and throwaways would be created by the flick of a switch. While many of you might view this as unthinkable, it would just be another event in the long history of technological evolution that has relegated the hardware of old obsolete inventions to the scrap heap. Anybody who wants to keep using radio would have plenty of time and forewarning to acquire a new HD model. The analog-only radio just might become the next 386 DOS computer. Guy Wire is the pseudonym for a veteran broadcast engineer with major-market radio credentials. RW welcomes other points of view. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From penry@nortelnetworks.com Fri Oct 25 10:43:58 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: penry@nortelnetworks.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 25 Oct 2002 17:43:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 104 invoked from network); 25 Oct 2002 17:43:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Oct 2002 17:43:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com) (47.103.122.112) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Oct 2002 17:43:55 -0000 Received: from zrc2c011.us.nortel.com (zrc2c011.us.nortel.com [47.103.120.51]) by zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id g9PHi7v09056 for ; Fri, 25 Oct 2002 12:44:07 -0500 (CDT) Received: by zrc2c011.us.nortel.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Fri, 25 Oct 2002 12:43:53 -0500 Message-ID: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A56079740447B989@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: {AMSF} "AMS" has just taken on a new meaning Date: Fri, 25 Oct 2002 12:43:51 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) From: "Charles Penry" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=376233 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa5vhu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I see where it says "performance, range and sound quality" can be improved, with no modifications needed to a standard receiver to make it work. That means it will even work with the typical narrow bandwidth receiver like most people have. I see no mention of the "Advanced Modulation System" increasing bandwidth by 200%. Did I miss something? CP -----Original Message----- From: Marv Southcott [mailto:fanfare@globility.com] Sent: Friday, October 25, 2002 11:02 AM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} "AMS" has just taken on a new meaning In the latest published "RW NewsBytes" there's talk of a new AMS ("Advanced Modulation System") for AM where the bandwidth can be increased by 200%. Here's the URL http://www.rwonline.com/dailynews/one.php?id=2143 MS Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Oct 25 11:10:44 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 25 Oct 2002 18:10:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 55398 invoked from network); 25 Oct 2002 18:10:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Oct 2002 18:10:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Oct 2002 18:10:41 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.251] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 25 Oct 2002 18:10:41 -0000 Date: Fri, 25 Oct 2002 18:10:41 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: "AMS" has just taken on a new meaning Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A56079740447B989@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1269 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > I see no mention of the "Advanced Modulation System" increasing > bandwidth by 200%. Did I miss something? I think somebody misread the article. It talks about increasing the *modulation* to 200%. The article doesn't mention anything about bandwidth. In any event it sounds to me like another take-off on the Kahn "PowerSide" idea. But, there is only so much you can doctor up an AM signal before the negative consequences become apparent. And speaking of which, has anybody tried to get in touch with Mr. Kahn to ask what his thoughts about IBOC are? He must have some opinion, as widespread use of IBOC on AM would make his "PowerSide" and "SymmetraPeak" devices obsolete due to the incompatibility. p.s. Just to be clear, I have never supported the use of "AMS" as an acronym for "AM Stereo". First of all, the phrase "AM Stereo" isn't THAT long to write out completely, and more importantly, "AMS" is widely used by cassette players to stand for "Automatic Music Search", where it will automatically find the next song on the tape by detecting the blank spots between songs when fast-forwarding or rewinding. In fact, many stereos and car radios have an "AMS" button on them, and this doesn't mean if you push it you will get AM Stereo! From fanfare@globility.com Fri Oct 25 12:37:38 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 25 Oct 2002 19:37:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 90336 invoked from network); 25 Oct 2002 19:37:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Oct 2002 19:37:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Oct 2002 19:37:38 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.161] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 25 Oct 2002 19:37:34 -0000 Date: Fri, 25 Oct 2002 19:37:33 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: "AMS" has just taken on a new meaning Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1282 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Marv Southcott" X-Originating-IP: 64.56.234.175 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin T." wrote: > > I see no mention of the "Advanced Modulation System" increasing > > bandwidth by 200%. Did I miss something? > > p.s. Just to be clear, I have never supported the use of "AMS" as an > acronym for "AM Stereo". First of all, the phrase "AM Stereo" isn't > THAT long to write out completely, and more importantly, "AMS" is > widely used by cassette players to stand for "Automatic Music > Search", My apologies for the misfire. Thinking I had seen the word "bandwidth" was probably the result of the number of times I had seen that term today. Surely it was "increase modualtion to 200%". On a less important note, about the term "AMS" which, if you don't mind a minor correction, it is a 'definition', as opposed to an acronym (a word made up of the first letter of each word in a definition). I am not that familiar with the AMS to which you refer Kevin. The Delco/Bose system I have doesn't sport such a button. However, I have heard AM Stereo referred to as AMS a number of times by members of this and other groups. Therefore I respectfully suggest it be allowed to share its existence with the radio button you mention on the official list of definitions, if there is such a thing. M.S. From KC4QLP@aol.com Fri Oct 25 15:19:03 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 25 Oct 2002 22:19:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 57632 invoked from network); 25 Oct 2002 22:19:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Oct 2002 22:19:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m09.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.164) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Oct 2002 22:19:02 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m09.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.25.2fd6f2b9 (4418) for ; Fri, 25 Oct 2002 18:18:59 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <25.2fd6f2b9.2aeb1d52@aol.com> Date: Fri, 25 Oct 2002 18:18:58 EDT Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: "AMS" has just taken on a new meaning To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp << I think somebody misread the article. It talks about increasing the *modulation* to 200%. The article doesn't mention anything about bandwidth.>> Certainly increasing the modulation that high will not only cause some sort of distortion somewheres,so certainly it will seem to take up more bandwidth at that point. I'm thinking the whole point is to increase the signal to noise ratio in trying to over come the many man made noises that plague AM today. << In any event it sounds to me like another take-off on the Kahn "PowerSide" idea. But, there is only so much you can doctor up an AM signal before the negative consequences become apparent. And speaking of which, has anybody tried to get in touch with Mr. Kahn to ask what his thoughts about IBOC are? He must have some opinion, as widespread use of IBOC on AM would make his "PowerSide" and "SymmetraPeak" devices obsolete due to the incompatibility. >> Speaking of IBOC..I caught WOR strong enough this afternoon at the local high school football field {430pm ET-setting up for tonights HS ball game} to hear the hiss n' hash show. Although the mess didnt consume 700 or 720 because of signal strengh,WOR was just a little bit stronger than some daytimer.So you can imagion the wreck of noise I heard --WOR--hiss and hash under the program content and some daytimer just under that. What a mess! BTW..for those of us here in North America..do not forget to set your clocks back one hour before you go to bed Saturday night. The time goes back to standard time at 2am Sunday morning. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5..., Ray Communications Radio Network Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Oct 25 16:17:06 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 25 Oct 2002 23:17:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 92702 invoked from network); 25 Oct 2002 23:17:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Oct 2002 23:17:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.78) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Oct 2002 23:17:04 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.129] by n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 25 Oct 2002 23:17:04 -0000 Date: Fri, 25 Oct 2002 23:17:01 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: "AMS" has just taken on a new meaning Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1033 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.71.134 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > However, I have heard AM Stereo referred to as AMS a number of > times by members of this and other groups. Therefore I respectfully > suggest it be allowed to share its existence with the radio button > you mention on the official list of definitions, if there is such a > thing. You can call it whatever you want, but just remember that although many Ford car radios have AM Stereo, it has nothing to do with the "AMS" button on the radio, nor does a Ford radio having an "AMS" button necessary mean that it has AM Stereo. Even further confusion is caused by Ford using the "AMS" button not only to control the Automatic Music Search function of the cassette player, but also to switch between manual and auto-seek tuning modes for the radio! I'm just trying to avoid confusion, which is already rampant in the process of trying to find a radio that actually has AM Stereo, especially with various manufacturers using "FM/AM Stereo" or "Stereo AM/FM" to describe radios that are actually Stereo only on the FM band! From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Oct 25 16:54:51 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 25 Oct 2002 23:54:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 66292 invoked from network); 25 Oct 2002 23:54:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Oct 2002 23:54:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.78) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Oct 2002 23:54:51 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.191] by n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 25 Oct 2002 23:54:51 -0000 Date: Fri, 25 Oct 2002 23:54:50 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: re: IBOC / Daylight Saving Time / new WBBR audio Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <25.2fd6f2b9.2aeb1d52@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3566 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.71.134 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Speaking of IBOC..I caught WOR strong enough this afternoon at the > local high school football field {430pm ET-setting up for tonights > HS ball game} to hear the hiss n' hash show. During cloudy winter days, skywaves can come in all day long. I have heard 900 CHML from Ontario and 1520 WWKB from Buffalo, NY during broad daylight here in NJ. Also, the entire country is not one time zone! So the morning and evening hours become a large "gray zone" of stations overlapping onto each other, especially in the Expanded Band where a station can be on its 10,000 watt daytime power before local sunset and be received by skywave hundreds of miles to the east where it is already past sunset and the local stations have dropped down to 1000 watts or less. These are all factors which even daytime-only use of IBOC seems to ignore. As a consequence, I can imagine some point in the future if daytime-only IBOC becomes prevalent that people will say "it's so bad already, why not just let IBOC be used 24 hours a day, and may the most powerful station win the hash wars!" > BTW..for those of us here in North America..do not forget to set > your clocks back one hour before you go to bed Saturday night. > The time goes back to standard time at 2am Sunday morning. I would actually prefer it if we stayed on Daylight Saving Time (note that the commonly used plural form "Savings" is NOT correct) all year long. As somebody who is not a "morning person", I would much rather deal with a sunset at 8:30 AM than have the sun set on me at 4:15 PM. But, hey, at least we'll be able to enjoy more hours of non-IBOC- polluted radio on the AM band, although it will be of little benefit to 710 WOR listeners, as they clip their audio bandwidth down to a putrid 6 kHz even when IBOC is not in use. Does anyone know if 700 WLW also maintains a narrower audio bandwidth when transmitting at night? Meanwhile, in the pure analog world, 1130 WBBR in New York City has recently begun using a new homebrew audio processor known as the "Ariane", made by two local NY engineers. It is claimed to deliver a louder and more punchy sound, with less distortion. It doesn't sound all that different to me, and in any event WBBR has not transmitted an AM Stereo signal since about 1997. WBBR would instead be wise to copy the design of WKMB's "Rontimod" processor, which actually delivers louder, clearer audio with voice instead of music, since the old Gates Statesman limiter WKMB has it teamed up with doesn't have to cut down the gain so constantly. Those with MP3 audio capability and the time to download some files can now listen to a large repository of WKMB recordings that I have set up in this web directory: http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/wkmb/ The "wkmb1.mp3" through "wkmb6.mp3" series and "wkmbhifi.mp3" are particularly stunning to listen to, having been received on an Optimus 12-603 (GE Superadio III "clone") radio and then equalized for ideal AMAX audio response. Also, "wkmb-ngt.mp3" offers a rare glimpse of an AM daytimer announcing its switch to Post-Sunset Authority (PSSA) nighttime power, in this case only 50 watts, as received on a Realistic TM-152 and audio equalized for near-AMAX quality. Alas, no AM Stereo to be heard here, but stunning sound nonetheless -- especially combined with the chance to hear LPs played on the air, along with commercials and IDs from a cart machine that the DJ forgets to pot down, so you can hear it hiss in the background and then click off when the cart ends. From jsgil@hal-pc.org Fri Oct 25 17:34:44 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 26 Oct 2002 00:34:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 40403 invoked from network); 26 Oct 2002 00:34:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Oct 2002 00:34:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Oct 2002 00:34:44 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.248] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 26 Oct 2002 00:34:43 -0000 Date: Sat, 26 Oct 2002 00:34:41 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: "AMS" has just taken on a new meaning Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 1337 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.130.92 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Marv Southcott" wrote: > In the latest published "RW NewsBytes" there's talk of a new AMS=20 > ("Advanced Modulation System") for AM where the bandwidth can be=20 > increased by 200%. >=20 > Here's the URL >=20 > http://www.rwonline.com/dailynews/one.php?id=3D2143 >=20 > MS This is my take on this "Advanced Modulation System". There is no reason why you can't increase the level of sideband energy of frequencies above 5KHz to help compensate for the narrow bandwidth filters as long as the sum of all sideband energy within the =B15KHz bandwidth does not exceed -100% modulation. Distortion only occurs when -100% is exceeded for envelope detectors. With the full =B110.2KHz bandwidth the actual negative envelope modulation could go as high as -200% which means that the full bandwidth signal is operating in partial suppressed carrier mode. That means more energy in the sidebands and not in the carrier. This can all happen while not exceeding the sideband emission mask. This also poses no problem for synchronous detectors which the newer C-QuAM decoders heavly employ. If the cosine corrector circuit in the newer chips was designed in such a way, it would be possible to generate a version of C-QuAM that used -200% negative envelope=20 modulation and the chips would decode it properly.=20 JSG From jsgil@hal-pc.org Fri Oct 25 18:10:27 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 26 Oct 2002 01:10:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 91385 invoked from network); 26 Oct 2002 01:10:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Oct 2002 01:10:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.83) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Oct 2002 01:10:27 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.171] by n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 26 Oct 2002 01:10:27 -0000 Date: Sat, 26 Oct 2002 01:10:25 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Should we focussing more on AM Wideband instead of AMS ? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <533761B50551D511A6D200508B6F542809CAF383@AUSYM200> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 721 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.130.92 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Trim, Matthew L" wrote: > Excellent! > > Now which one is the Ceramic Resonator. > > Here's a link to the Circuit board photo: > http://www.fixup.net/tips/srfs83/_derived/srfs83.htm_txt_bigcaps.gif > ld get it to sound decent if you replaced the ceramic > resonator. > I don't see a resonator on the board and this looks like a pocket mini that runs on one cell. I see a red local osc and a black envelope detector transformer several inductors for FM and the AM antenna. I suspect that there are a bunch of SMD components on the other side and one may be a ceramic resonator. It may be difficult to impossible to find a wide SMD resonator to replace it with. JSG From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Oct 25 19:05:17 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 26 Oct 2002 02:05:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 39226 invoked from network); 26 Oct 2002 02:05:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Oct 2002 02:05:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Oct 2002 02:05:15 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-89-91.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.91]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g9Q1xojR025303 for ; Fri, 25 Oct 2002 20:59:51 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <002301c27c94$37df99c0$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: <533761B50551D511A6D200508B6F542809CAF383@AUSYM200> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Should we focussing more on AM Wideband instead of AMS? Date: Fri, 25 Oct 2002 21:05:52 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude What's on the other side of that board? That square red thing in the upper left corner is definitely a CR, but it could be for the FM for all I know since the image isn't sharp enough to read the writing on it. If it says 450 or 455 on it, then it's the right one. Otherwise there may be another one on the other side of the board. Instead of replacing it, I also just remembered that Chris Cuff puts a few pF of capacitance across them to widen them up. It can be as little as 5pF to a few hundred pF. You'll have to experiment. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Trim, Matthew L" To: Sent: Thursday, October 24, 2002 6:23 PM Subject: RE: {AMSF} Should we focussing more on AM Wideband instead of AMS? > Excellent! > > Now which one is the Ceramic Resonator. > > Here's a link to the Circuit board photo: > http://www.fixup.net/tips/srfs83/_derived/srfs83.htm_txt_bigcaps.gif > > Thanks Scott for the tip! > :) > > -----Original Message----- > From: Scott Todd [mailto:stodd@sherbtel.net] > Sent: Friday, 25 October 2002 2:24 AM > To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: {AMSF} Should we focussing more on AM Wideband instead of > AMS? > > > Nope- I bet you could get it to sound decent if you replaced the ceramic > resonator. > > ST > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Trim, Matthew L" > > > I have a Sony SRF-S83 pocket receiver. It contains an all-in-one AM/FM > > decoder IC. The AM reception is quite good but it's very narrow. Could > it > > really be widened by changing the chip design, or do a lot more discreet > > components need to be added in order to keep it low noise. > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Oct 25 19:37:12 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 26 Oct 2002 02:37:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 17176 invoked from network); 26 Oct 2002 02:37:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Oct 2002 02:37:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Oct 2002 02:37:11 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-89-91.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.91]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g9Q2VkjR001314 for ; Fri, 25 Oct 2002 21:31:47 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <008301c27c98$addfe540$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} "AMS" has just taken on a new meaning Date: Fri, 25 Oct 2002 21:37:48 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Mike is a good friend of mine. Haven't seen him in almost two years, though. I should ask if he's got a demonstration he could do for me next time I see him. Scott ----- Original Message ----- From: "Marv Southcott" > In the latest published "RW NewsBytes" there's talk of a new AMS > ("Advanced Modulation System") for AM where the bandwidth can be > increased by 200%. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Oct 25 19:37:35 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 26 Oct 2002 02:37:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 8359 invoked from network); 26 Oct 2002 02:37:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Oct 2002 02:37:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Oct 2002 02:37:35 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.186] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 26 Oct 2002 02:37:34 -0000 Date: Sat, 26 Oct 2002 02:37:34 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: "AMS" has just taken on a new meaning Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 967 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.71.134 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > With the full =B110.2KHz bandwidth the actual negative envelope > modulation could go as high as -200% which means that the full > bandwidth signal is operating in partial suppressed carrier mode. For what it's worth, the following is from the description of the=20 low-power AM mono transmitter kit (model "AMO") sold by Panaxis=20 Productions: "Our AMO uses carrier level shift to produce up to 300%=20 modulation with negligible distortion." It also lists an audio=20 frequency response of 20-20,000 Hz, a S/N ratio of 50 dB, 0.5%=20 distortion, and 0.005% carrier stability (through a crystal locked=20 divider). Regardless of the claim about 300% modulation, these seem=20 to be pretty impressive specs for a transmitter kit that is sold in=20 the same vogue as the typical Ramsey Electronics kits. Panaxis has a web site for their transmitter kits, although it lacks=20 many of the details of their printed catalog, including prices: http://www.panaxis.com/p-trans.html From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Oct 25 20:36:34 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 26 Oct 2002 03:36:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 60994 invoked from network); 26 Oct 2002 03:36:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Oct 2002 03:36:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Oct 2002 03:36:33 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-89-91.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.91]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g9Q3V7jR011683 for ; Fri, 25 Oct 2002 22:31:08 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <00ba01c27ca0$f8bf66a0$d3a9fea9@me> To: Subject: Very OT: Fw: Entertainment for you... Date: Fri, 25 Oct 2002 22:37:10 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sorry for something so OT, but this happened to a friend of mine who's a radio engineer, and this is the sort of thing that can't go unnoticed. This is the definition of redneck. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: MonsterFM.com/KBKH-FM To: Scott Todd Sent: Thursday, October 24, 2002 2:13 PM Subject: Entertainment for you... You may get a laugh at some of the materials at http://www.monsterfm.com/927/greed.htm as it's the beginnings of a narrative of what's been going on, here. You can download and listen to audio of the actual "raid" that was carried out against us and form your own opinion... Forgot to tell you, a friend of ours has another web site that is "officially" taking a poll of what people think of our EDC and various city and county officials for the local newspaper. The address for that is http://www.voiceofshamrock.com and you may want to look at this, too. (He says that, of the five votes IN FAVOR of EDC, four of those came directly from the EDC director's home e-mail address...) Terry Keith Hammond President/Technical Director http://www.MonsterFM.com MonsterFM.com/KBKH-FM P.O. Box 688 Shamrock, TX. 79079 (806) 256-1080 North Texas & Western Oklahoma's MonsterFM 92.7 (KBKH-FM) http://www.monsterfm.com/927 "Why is there NEVER enough money to do it right? But, ALWAYS enough money to do it again, later?" [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From n0uiheric@aol.com Fri Oct 25 23:33:56 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 26 Oct 2002 06:33:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 33569 invoked from network); 26 Oct 2002 06:33:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Oct 2002 06:33:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d07.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.39) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Oct 2002 06:33:54 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-d07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.47.25130b36 (3996) for ; Sat, 26 Oct 2002 02:33:51 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <47.25130b36.2aeb914f@aol.com> Date: Sat, 26 Oct 2002 02:33:51 EDT Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Should we focussing more on AM Wideband instead of AMS? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih The future of radio is NOT DIGITAL! Look at the problems we're having with the setup of DTV. DTV is TOTALLY INCOMPATIBLE with analog TV, so IBOC is TOTALLY INCOMPATIBLE with analog AM and FM. We should be focusing on GETTING RID of all terrestrial digital broadcasting, and keeping the analog form. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Fri Oct 25 23:33:57 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 26 Oct 2002 06:33:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 49478 invoked from network); 26 Oct 2002 06:33:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Oct 2002 06:33:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d09.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.41) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Oct 2002 06:33:57 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-d09.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.f4.23c71902 (3996) for ; Sat, 26 Oct 2002 02:33:54 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: Date: Sat, 26 Oct 2002 02:33:54 EDT Subject: Re: {AMSF} Eff Cee Cee To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih All about the Benjamins, eh? The FCC failed to act on AM Stereo because THEY WERE BUSY DISMANTLING A PERFECT SYSTEM OF REGULATION, and replacing it with a FAULTY SYSTEM OF REGULATION (as in deregulation). 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Oct 26 00:52:46 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 26 Oct 2002 07:52:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 7239 invoked from network); 26 Oct 2002 07:52:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Oct 2002 07:52:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.84) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Oct 2002 07:52:44 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.171] by n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 26 Oct 2002 07:52:44 -0000 Date: Sat, 26 Oct 2002 07:52:44 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Digital vs. analog Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <47.25130b36.2aeb914f@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2210 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.71.134 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > The future of radio is NOT DIGITAL! Look at the problems we're > having with the setup of DTV. It is a FACT. The future of radio is DIGITAL. However, that does NOT necessarily imply the transmission of digital signals on the existing AM, FM, and Shortwave bands. Instead, the digital technology can be used where it works best -- in the reception of ANALOG signals in these bands. The real benefit of digital in this case is that it can take $10.00+ worth of analog components -- carefully-tuned wide-response IF coils and ceramic filters, front end and AM Stereo decoder circuits, noise reduction circuits, audio equalization circuits, etc. -- and combine it all into a single inexpensive microprocessor chip, along with all the "ordinary" AM and FM Stereo receiver functions. A common objection from radio makers has been that adding a high-quality AM tuner, even without AM Stereo, "costs too much" in manufacturing costs, from the extra components and circuitry that is necessary. But when the entire tuner is contained within a single pre-programmed chip, they will no longer be able to complain. Adding new features, and enhancing existing ones, will only be a matter of changing the programming of the chip, so the additional cost will only be that of the programmer's labor to create and debug the code. And right now, we have the chance to catch this revolution just as it is gathering momentum. I don't anyone here would be surprised if IBOC/"HD Radio" falls flat on its face, either because of its own drawbacks, or from competition from enhanced use of existing analog signals. Right now the best thing we can do is keep pressuring Motorola and radio manufacturers to include AMAX AM Stereo as part of the new "Symphony" digital receiver chip design. It will be no more difficult to incorporate into the design than RDS for FM, and of course benefit us by finally having widely available, reasonably priced, and actively promoted receivers featuring high-fidelity, high-quality AM Stereo. I'll say it again. The future of radio is DIGITAL. And that is a GOOD thing, as long as the digital technology is used in the right places and in the right manner. From KC4QLP@aol.com Sat Oct 26 11:20:21 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 26 Oct 2002 18:20:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 73247 invoked from network); 26 Oct 2002 18:20:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Oct 2002 18:20:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d10.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.42) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Oct 2002 18:20:20 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d10.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.cb.2a40845d (25305) for ; Sat, 26 Oct 2002 14:20:12 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: Date: Sat, 26 Oct 2002 14:20:11 EDT Subject: Re: {AMSF} Very OT: Fw: Entertainment for you... To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 10/25/02 11:38:02 PM Eastern Daylight Time, stodd@sherbtel.net writes: << Sorry for something so OT, but this happened to a friend of mine who's a radio engineer, and this is the sort of thing that can't go unnoticed. This is the definition of redneck. ST >> Sounds more like terrorism to me. Sure hope justice is served here...and soon Bob Carter Operations/Engineering WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5..., Ray Communications Radio Network Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From fanfare@globility.com Sat Oct 26 17:55:35 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 27 Oct 2002 00:55:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 61525 invoked from network); 27 Oct 2002 00:55:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Oct 2002 00:55:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Oct 2002 00:55:33 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.154] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Oct 2002 00:55:33 -0000 Date: Sun, 27 Oct 2002 00:55:31 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: Should we focussing more on AM Wideband instead of AMS? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <47.25130b36.2aeb914f@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1988 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Marv Southcott" X-Originating-IP: 64.56.235.107 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy --- In amstereoforum@y..., n0uiheric@a... wrote: > The future of radio is NOT DIGITAL! Look at the problems we're having with I am afraid it is true Eric. Digital is as inevitable for radio as CD's were for the LP. However, we are a long way away from creating a DAB system that has as much credibility as the CD. If that were the case, we would then have an opportunity listen to the ultimate, which is the DCD. I wish everyone had access to DCDs such as the ones made of Richard Hyman by "Reference Records". These DCDs were made directly from the piano, sent through a computer and an STL to the glass master. If you ever want to validate your ears, and you like a grand piano played like no other person can, these are the CDs to use. You can check them out at; "http://www.referencerecordings.com/JAZZ.HTML" As well, putting together a receiver for consumer service is, unfortunately, not quite as simple as someone has portrayed in another string. Had that been the case, we would have had DAB a long time ago. There is such a thing in manufacturing as "repeatability", which means each unit produced must work as well as the first one. This one important fact separates the "1 off" hobby designer from the production designer. It's kind of analagous to the receiving antenna amplifier. If they worked as well as the manufacturer would have you believe, every antenna, for every frequency, would only have to be one foot long or less, with the appropriate amplifier installed in line. Even if they get it right, DAB may still have a problem getting out there. In Toronto, Eureka 147 DAB gets about 20 miles and dies. However, that is probably a function of the "L" Band Tx frequency. But the simulcast FM gets a whole lot farther and they both come off the CN Tower at about 1,600 ft. With an Omega receiver, it'll be that much farther again. The sooner people realize why radio signals only seem to get so far, the better off we'll all be. M. From redledge78@yahoo.com Sat Oct 26 21:54:22 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: redledge78@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 27 Oct 2002 04:54:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 25910 invoked from network); 27 Oct 2002 04:54:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Oct 2002 04:54:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO proxymail.homerelay.com) (209.75.47.224) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Oct 2002 04:54:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 11071 invoked from network); 27 Oct 2002 04:54:07 -0000 Received: from vtcomm-6.homerelay.com (HELO yahoo.com) (209.75.47.216) by 0 with SMTP; 27 Oct 2002 04:54:07 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit To: fanfare@globility.com,amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Cc: Date: 26 Oct 2002 20:53 -0500 Subject:Re:{AMSF} Re: Should we focussing more on AM Wideband instead of AMS? From: redledge78@yahoo.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=59652447 X-Yahoo-Profile: redledge78 I concur. Tom -------------------- FROM : Marv Southcott DATE : Sat 10/26/2002 05:55:31 PDT SUBJECT: {AMSF} Re: Should we focussing more on AM Wideband instead of AMS? --- In amstereoforum@y..., n0uiheric@a... wrote: > The future of radio is NOT DIGITAL! Look at the problems we're having with I am afraid it is true Eric. Digital is as inevitable for radio as CD's were for the LP. However, we are a long way away from creating a DAB system that has as much credibility as the CD. If that were the case, we would then have an opportunity listen to the ultimate, which is the DCD. I wish everyone had access to DCDs such as the ones made of Richard Hyman by "Reference Records". These DCDs were made directly from the piano, sent through a computer and an STL to the glass master. If you ever want to validate your ears, and you like a grand piano played like no other person can, these are the CDs to use. You can check them out at; "http://www.referencerecordings.com/JAZZ.HTML" As well, putting together a receiver for consumer service is, unfortunately, not quite as simple as someone has portrayed in another string. Had that been the case, we would have had DAB a long time ago. There is such a thing in manufacturing as "repeatability", which means each unit produced must work as well as the first one. This one important fact separates the "1 off" hobby designer from the production designer. It's kind of analagous to the receiving antenna amplifier. If they worked as well as the manufacturer would have you believe, every antenna, for every frequency, would only have to be one foot long or less, with the appropriate amplifier installed in line. Even if they get it right, DAB may still have a problem getting out there. In Toronto, Eureka 147 DAB gets about 20 miles and dies. However, that is probably a function of the "L" Band Tx frequency. But the simulcast FM gets a whole lot farther and they both come off the CN Tower at about 1,600 ft. With an Omega receiver, it'll be that much farther again. The sooner people realize why radio signals only seem to get so far, the better off we'll all be. M. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Oct 26 22:41:43 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 27 Oct 2002 05:41:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 68153 invoked from network); 27 Oct 2002 05:41:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Oct 2002 05:41:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.64) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Oct 2002 05:41:42 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.136] by n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Oct 2002 05:41:42 -0000 Date: Sun, 27 Oct 2002 05:41:38 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Thank you Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1688 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.71.6 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics I just realised now, a few weeks late, that The AM Stereo Forum recently celebrated its one-year anniversary, having been created on October 4th, 2001. I would like to thank everybody who is reading this, for making this possible. In the past year, I feel that the AM Stereo community has really come together. When I started the Forum, there was a lot of fragmentation between it and other AM Stereo groups on the Internet, and as a result, we couldn't present a united front to help attract members and promote AM Stereo -- a "marketplace war" of our own, if you will. Despite some bitter moments along the way, I am glad to see that the AM Stereo Forum here on Yahoo Groups has succeeded in becoming united and prosperous. I was once glad for us to have 25 members; now, we are getting new members almost daily, and the total is now up to 117 members. We also have had up to 642 messages posted per month, and now are quickly approaching our 5000th message posted to the Forum. All of your support and participation has made this possible, and I am very thankful for that. Hopefully even bigger and better things will continue to be in store for us. I would also like to thank some of our members that have been here since the beginning, including Chris Cuff, Scott Todd, Jeff Deck, Jay Rogers, Donn Tillman, Bob Carter, and Eric Bueneman -- and those are just the members I see on our very first page of message archives at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum/messages/1 Anyway, it's been a great year, folks, and I thank each and every one of you for making it possible! Kevin Tekel kevtronics@yahoo.com Founder/Sysop of The AM Stereo Forum From n0uiheric@aol.com Sat Oct 26 23:19:19 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 27 Oct 2002 06:19:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 94242 invoked from network); 27 Oct 2002 06:19:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Oct 2002 06:19:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d09.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.41) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Oct 2002 06:19:18 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-d09.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.158.1688a699 (16633) for ; Sun, 27 Oct 2002 01:19:16 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <158.1688a699.2aecdf64@aol.com> Date: Sun, 27 Oct 2002 01:19:16 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Digital vs. analog To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih Kevin, it is NOT FACT that the future of radio is digital. The future of radio is to REMAIN ANALOG. Why should we have a system (IBOC) that NO ONE WANTS? Radio was not broke before the idiots involved with IBOC got going. What did they do? THEY BROKE IT. Leave AM, FM and shortwave alone and ANALOG ONLY; the ONLY appropriate band for digital is above 1 GHz. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From possumhunter@netzero.net Sat Oct 26 23:26:15 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 27 Oct 2002 06:26:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 14237 invoked from network); 27 Oct 2002 06:26:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Oct 2002 06:26:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.90) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Oct 2002 06:26:15 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 26 Oct 2002 23:26:15 -0700 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Thank you Date: Sun, 27 Oct 2002 01:26:03 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 27 Oct 2002 06:26:15.0465 (UTC) FILETIME=[C08F1190:01C27D81] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.158.138.158] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Kevin T. wrote: In the past year, I feel that the AM Stereo community has really come together. Thank You for starting this group! I am a former broadcast engineer who was blown out after the consolidation and de-regulation of the Industry. You can take a man out of an AM radio station, but you cannot take the AM radio station out of the man! Simply put, I LOVE the sound of AM radio. I have a wonderful sounding RCA "Superbrain" console radio I normally listen to with an outboard CQUAM decoder feeding my all tube Dynaco Stereo system. Long live FREE RADIO! Death to the NAB! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of the New Generation From possumhunter@netzero.net Sat Oct 26 23:42:47 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: possumhunter@netzero.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 27 Oct 2002 06:42:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 45832 invoked from network); 27 Oct 2002 06:42:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Oct 2002 06:42:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rly-ip05.mx.aol.com) (64.12.138.9) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Oct 2002 06:42:47 -0000 Received: from logs-ti.proxy.aol.com (logs-ti.proxy.aol.com [152.163.194.135]) by rly-ip05.mx.aol.com (v89.10) with ESMTP id RELAYIN5-1027014204; Sun, 27 Oct 2002 01:42:04 -0400 Received: from llraper (AC9E8A9E.ipt.aol.com [172.158.138.158]) by logs-ti.proxy.aol.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with SMTP id g9R6eEe337848; Sun, 27 Oct 2002 01:40:15 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <014d01c27d83$af972060$9e8a9eac@llraper> To: Cc: References: <158.1688a699.2aecdf64@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Digital vs. analog Date: Sun, 27 Oct 2002 01:40:04 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Apparently-From: DodgeRamTrucker@aol.com From: "Possum Hunter" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 n0uiheric@aol.com wrote: >The future of radio is to REMAIN ANALOG. Why should we have a system (IBOC) that NO ONE WANTS? The Voice Of America digital experiments sure flopped on Short Wave! Anybody remember KUSW (now KTBN) and NDXI (now WEWN) broadcasting in AM Stereo on Short Wave? They sure did sound good! Now that most Tropical Band broadcasters have died, they should open the Tropical bands up for clear channel high fidelity DX stations. Both WWCR and WWRB have had their Short Wave stations on the bands, so why not? The FCC should also authorize Domestic Shortwave service in the United States. Long live FREE RADIO! Death to the NAB! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Oct 26 23:57:40 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 27 Oct 2002 06:57:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 93167 invoked from network); 27 Oct 2002 06:57:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Oct 2002 06:57:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.83) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Oct 2002 06:57:40 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.169] by n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Oct 2002 06:57:40 -0000 Date: Sun, 27 Oct 2002 06:57:40 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Digital vs. analog Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <158.1688a699.2aecdf64@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 455 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.71.6 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Kevin, it is NOT FACT that the future of radio is digital. The > future of radio is to REMAIN ANALOG. Why should we have a system > (IBOC) that NO ONE WANTS? Eric, please re-read my message. I do not support IBOC. I do, however, support DIGITAL reception of ANALOG signals. THAT is the optimum choice for providing enhanced quality on the AM and FM bands, while also retaining full compatibility and performance from existing analog receivers. From amfmdx@fastq.com Sun Oct 27 08:18:01 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 27 Oct 2002 16:18:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 69184 invoked from network); 27 Oct 2002 16:17:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Oct 2002 16:17:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Oct 2002 16:17:51 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt (d163-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.195]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id g9RGHoP66102 for ; Sun, 27 Oct 2002 09:17:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <000901c27dd4$60c299a0$c3f9bed8@kredding430cdt> To: References: <158.1688a699.2aecdf64@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Digital vs. analog Date: Sun, 27 Oct 2002 09:17:40 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > Kevin, it is NOT FACT that the future of radio is digital. Eric, this is the other Kevin. You delusional thing, the future of radio is digital. Its going to be for two reasons. The manufacturers want it and they have the money to make it happen. The radio stations want it and they have the resources to make it happen. The FCC is along for the ride picking up dollars all the way. > The future of radio is to REMAIN ANALOG. No, the past is analog. You can whine and cry until the cows come home and its still going to be digital. > Why should we have a system (IBOC) that NO ONE > WANTS? Radio was not broke before the idiots involved with IBOC got going. Now that you said this, its the first coherent and understandable thing you put out in this message. However, since you spoke in extreme generality, I have to take you to task again. Its not true that NO ONE wants IBOC. The manufacturers, the radio stations want it and the FCC wants it. If you were concise and said that the public had no interest, then I would whole heartedly agree with you. > What did they do? THEY BROKE IT. No they didn't break anything. They forwarded a very poorly thought out implementation. There are many things that the FCC could have done to this point and chose the worst implementation of all possibilities. > Leave AM, FM and shortwave alone and ANALOG > ONLY; the ONLY appropriate band for digital is above 1 GHz. To a certain extent, I agree with you on this. Heres what we have... Hopscotch addition of radio with sidebands that cause the most possible interference to signals. Heres some scenarios that could have had the least impact on listeners and the public in general. 1. Create a new band in the L band for digital transmissions only with powers granted up to 250 kW in order to get the same coverage of a Class C 100 kW FM station. 2. Mandate all radio/TV receivers be able to receive analog and digital signals and when the penetration reached 50% then begin to allow stations to transmit digital signals on the upper 50% of the broadcast bands until there was 85% penetration and switch to digital totally. For the most part, this would cause a mimimus of disruption for IBOC. 3. On TV, FM and AM this can be done in a similar manner. 1/3rd of the dial on the lower end of the bands will be used for full time digital transmissions. All stations in analog will have to move out of this band to another part of the spectrum allotment until they go digital. The lower end of the band with its additional coverage will be an incentive to go digital more quickly. After 3 years of the announcement, and opening of the bands, the spectrum allotment should be expanded to 1/2 the band. After 5 years 2/3s, 6 years 3/4ths and 7 years 8/10ths with 1/10th open in each band for LOCAL LOW POWERED digital transmissions and 1/10th open at the top for LOCAL LOW POWERED analog transmissions. I am sure someone can shoot this full of holes but we are going digital and I have said this since the beginning and the inception of any AM stereo list. I love AM stereo but its going. I wish Scott Todds petition which I signed would be granted but its not. The powers that be want digital because they see dollars. Its going to happen. Kevin From KC4QLP@aol.com Sun Oct 27 12:14:02 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 27 Oct 2002 20:14:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 61341 invoked from network); 27 Oct 2002 20:14:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Oct 2002 20:14:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r06.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.102) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Oct 2002 20:14:01 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.ac.2fd448f0 (16781) for ; Sun, 27 Oct 2002 15:13:59 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Sun, 27 Oct 2002 15:13:58 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Digital vs. analog To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 10/27/02 11:18:57 AM Eastern Standard Time, amfmdx@fastq.com writes: << Eric, this is the other Kevin. You delusional thing, the future of radio is digital. Its going to be for two reasons. The manufacturers want it and they have the money to make it happen. The radio stations want it and they have the resources to make it happen. The FCC is along for the ride picking up dollars all the way. >> {laughs to the point of of getting hiccups! LMAO!...Tell'em like it is Kevin R!} Bob Carter Operations/Engineering WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5..., Ray Communications Radio Network Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From stodd@sherbtel.net Sun Oct 27 15:15:15 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 27 Oct 2002 23:15:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 13768 invoked from network); 27 Oct 2002 23:15:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Oct 2002 23:15:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Oct 2002 23:15:14 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-88-70.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.70]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g9RN9fjT024817 for ; Sun, 27 Oct 2002 17:09:47 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <005a01c0a79a$fce45b00$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Thank you Date: Thu, 8 Mar 2001 00:22:06 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude I understand Salem is looking for an engineer in Cleveland OH. BTW, I've got one of those RCA radios you described, and I need one of the tall electrolytics for the top of the chassis. Doesn't have to be good, I just need it for looks. Scott Todd ----- Original Message ----- From: "Possum Hunter" To: Sent: Sunday, October 27, 2002 12:26 AM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Thank you > Kevin T. wrote: > In the past year, I feel that the AM Stereo community has really come > together. > > Thank You for starting this group! > > I am a former broadcast engineer who was blown out after the consolidation > and de-regulation of the Industry. > You can take a man out of an AM radio station, but you cannot take the AM > radio station out of the man! > > Simply put, I LOVE the sound of AM radio. I have a wonderful sounding RCA > "Superbrain" console radio I normally listen to with an outboard CQUAM > decoder feeding my all tube Dynaco Stereo system. > > Long live FREE RADIO! > Death to the NAB! > > Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ > Plate Modulation-The Choice Of the New Generation > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > From stodd@sherbtel.net Sun Oct 27 15:15:18 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 27 Oct 2002 23:15:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 73026 invoked from network); 27 Oct 2002 23:15:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Oct 2002 23:15:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Oct 2002 23:15:17 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-88-70.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.70]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g9RN9fjV024817 for ; Sun, 27 Oct 2002 17:09:50 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <005b01c0a79a$feeb2780$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: <158.1688a699.2aecdf64@aol.com> <014d01c27d83$af972060$9e8a9eac@llraper> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Digital vs. analog Date: Thu, 8 Mar 2001 00:25:34 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Somehow I don't think those stations succeeded each other. NDXE never was built, and WEWN never was stereo AFAIK. Didn't know that KUSW tried AMS. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Possum Hunter" > The Voice Of America digital experiments sure flopped on Short Wave! Anybody > remember KUSW (now KTBN) and NDXI (now WEWN) broadcasting in AM Stereo on > Short Wave? They sure did sound good! > From possumhunter@netzero.net Sun Oct 27 15:15:37 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 27 Oct 2002 23:15:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 38800 invoked from network); 27 Oct 2002 23:15:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Oct 2002 23:15:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.40) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Oct 2002 23:15:37 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 27 Oct 2002 15:15:37 -0800 To: References: <158.1688a699.2aecdf64@aol.com> <000901c27dd4$60c299a0$c3f9bed8@kredding430cdt> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Digital vs. analog Date: Sun, 27 Oct 2002 18:15:22 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 27 Oct 2002 23:15:37.0561 (UTC) FILETIME=[C2618C90:01C27E0E] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.132.221.166] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Kevin - Mesa, Arizona wrote: >You delusional thing, the future of radio is digital. Its going to be for two reasons. The manufacturers want it and they have the money to make it happen. The radio stations want it and they have the resources to make it happen. The FCC is along for the ride picking up dollars all the way. You mean the NAB and NPR wants it. The "Big Boy" media companies like Clear Channel, Cox, and Entercom along with the tax payer funded NPR stations can afford to go digital leaving the small one and two station operations to be left in the dust. After the little stations go broke, the big guys can buy them up and automate them or just let them go silent to keep them from drawing Arbitron numbers from the big signal stations. This is already happening here in the #60 Greenville-Spartanburg, SC market. Clear Channel took over the little 3000 Watt 96.7FM in Greenwood, SC then moved the city of license to Mauldin, SC and put the tower up near Traveler's Rest so the directional signal from the now 700 watt station just happens to go through Greenville to cover Mauldin, the new city of license! This leaves Greenwood with no locally owned and programmed radio station! (The other FM and 3AMs are automated) Newberry SC's ONLY FM, WGVC 106.3 was "stolen" and moved to the Greenville-Spartanburg market in the same way.......Oh yea this is an AM forum so: How do you keep a BIG signal 50,000 watt AM from pulling Arbitron numbers from your FM stations? This is how Clear Channel did it to WESC 660 KHZ: AM 660 in Greenville SC is a BIG signal station that can be heard from the North Carolina Mountains all of the way to the SC coast and deep into central Georgia. Clear Channel took it over, turned OFF the Stereo generator, screwed with the audio processing to make it sound bad and leased the signal to a non-profit religious FM for them to let preachers rant and beg for money on it all day! > > > The future of radio is to REMAIN ANALOG. The future of radio is BLEAK! Here is the true future of radio: NPR, Clear Channel, Disney-ABC, Entercom, Infinity, and Cox The FM dial full of canned satellite fed automated 12-In-A-Row jukebox formats and the AM dial full of canned Satellite fed automated Talk, and Spanish stations along with preachers ranting and raving through muffled transmitters with blown modulator tubes (and not a chance in hell to be replaced!) In the mean time, you will have one engineer running from transmitter site to transmitter site trying to keep 25 radio stations going for less money than a kid at McDonalds earns > > Its not true that NO ONE wants IBOC. The manufacturers, the radio stations want it and the FCC wants it. VERY TRUE! The manufacturers want to sell new digital transmitters and studio equipment along with new consumer radios. The NAB and NPR wants it to use as a weapon to destroy the little stations AND as an additional income source. Don't think that the big media companies wouldn't make the digital signal a subscription service then put 45 minutes of commercials per hour or preachers on the free analog signal! The FCC will have a gold mine selling digital licenses. > > If you were concise and said that the public had no interest, then I would whole heartedly agree with you. The public just wants decent sound in their car. This can be done with CQUAM-AMAX radios. An AMAX tuner sounds MUCH better than a pre-recorded music tape when it is tuned to a good AM signal. If FCC Mandated good AM tuners and return of proof of audio performance from radio stations along with returning to pre-1960 nighttime signal levels, that would be a REAL improvement for the AM band and would make the public tune it in. > > > Heres what we have... Hopscotch addition of radio with sidebands that cause the most possible interference to signals. Yep, Now even the X-Band is getting nasty at night. > >I love AM stereo but its going. I wish Scott Todds petition which I signed would be granted but its not. The powers that be want digital because they see dollars. Its going to happen. Another thing that will happen is more and more "Pirate" broadcasters will be popping up. The NAB and NPR sure did a number on LPFM, the LAST hope for real local radio programming. The FCC will make even more money fining and shutting down these pirates while they destroy the Constitutional right of free speech and the simple joy of ever hearing a high school football game on the radio again. Long live FREE RADIO! Death to the NAB! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From stodd@sherbtel.net Sun Oct 27 15:15:46 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 27 Oct 2002 23:15:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 65655 invoked from network); 27 Oct 2002 23:15:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Oct 2002 23:15:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Oct 2002 23:15:45 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-88-70.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.70]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g9RN9fjf024817; Sun, 27 Oct 2002 17:10:18 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <006001c0a79b$0f7b9260$d3a9fea9@me> To: , "[Dennis' AM Stereo List]" Subject: time off Date: Thu, 8 Mar 2001 00:37:25 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit If I'm gone from these lists for several days, please don't panic. My computer is getting a bit temperamental, and it won't always let me reply or send messages, though I can read them just fine. When I COMPLETELY power it off for a few hours, it will behave for awhile, but then it goes back to it's old antics. I hear a faint buzzing in the hard drive when it happens. If you've got any clues as to how to fix it, I'm all ears. Also, on boot-up, occasionally it stops dead in its tracks with a CMOS/GPNV Checksum Bad line while it's still on the DOS screen. Scott Todd [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From stodd@sherbtel.net Sun Oct 27 15:22:00 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 27 Oct 2002 23:22:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 45997 invoked from network); 27 Oct 2002 23:22:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Oct 2002 23:22:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Oct 2002 23:22:00 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-88-70.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.70]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id g9RNGWjR025980 for ; Sun, 27 Oct 2002 17:16:33 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <006c01c0a79b$ef27b420$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: <158.1688a699.2aecdf64@aol.com> <000901c27dd4$60c299a0$c3f9bed8@kredding430cdt> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Digital vs. analog Date: Thu, 8 Mar 2001 00:49:18 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude I'd be careful about dissing Entercom. So far a number of their stations still have AM stereo. Scott Todd ----- Original Message ----- From: "Possum Hunter" > You mean the NAB and NPR wants it. The "Big Boy" media companies like Clear > Channel, Cox, and Entercom along with the tax payer funded NPR stations can > afford to go digital leaving the small one and two station operations to be > left in the dust. From matthew.trim@eds.com Sun Oct 27 15:49:00 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: matthew.trim@eds.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 27 Oct 2002 23:49:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 11873 invoked from network); 27 Oct 2002 23:49:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Oct 2002 23:49:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO ns5.eds.com) (203.17.185.230) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Oct 2002 23:48:59 -0000 Received: from nnsy.eds.com (nnsy-3.eds.com [192.168.1.1]) by ns5.eds.com (8.11.6/8.11.1) with ESMTP id g9RNmwH00796 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 2002 10:48:58 +1100 (EST) Received: from nnsy.eds.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by nnsy.eds.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9RNmuJ27397 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 2002 10:48:56 +1100 (EST) Received: from ausym000.exau01.exch.eds.com ([134.251.177.117]) by nnsy.eds.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9RNmtR27387 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 2002 10:48:55 +1100 (EST) Received: by AUSYM000 with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Mon, 28 Oct 2002 10:48:36 +1100 Message-ID: <533761B50551D511A6D200508B6F542809CAF389@AUSYM200> To: "'amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com'" Subject: RE: {AMSF} Should we focussing more on AM Wideband instead of AMS ? Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 10:48:15 +1100 Importance: high X-Priority: 1 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-Type: text/plain From: "Trim, Matthew L" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88615102 X-Yahoo-Profile: bofh2k2000 G'day Scott, Here's the photo of the other side of the board (not very good I know) Mostly IC's (Amplifier and FM decoder I presume) http://www.fixup.net/tips/srfs83/_derived/srfs83.htm_txt_srf-s83.gif I just pulled my radio apart and the markings on the orange CR are 562JL According to: http://www.ee.washington.edu/circuit_archive/capacitors.html It is a 5,600 pf ? Hope this means something? Matt =) -----Original Message----- From: Scott Todd [mailto:stodd@sherbtel.net] Sent: Saturday, 26 October 2002 12:06 PM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Should we focussing more on AM Wideband instead of AMS? What's on the other side of that board? That square red thing in the upper left corner is definitely a CR, but it could be for the FM for all I know since the image isn't sharp enough to read the writing on it. If it says 450 or 455 on it, then it's the right one. Otherwise there may be another one on the other side of the board. Instead of replacing it, I also just remembered that Chris Cuff puts a few pF of capacitance across them to widen them up. It can be as little as 5pF to a few hundred pF. You'll have to experiment. ST From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Oct 27 15:59:39 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 27 Oct 2002 23:59:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 2655 invoked from network); 27 Oct 2002 23:59:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Oct 2002 23:59:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.90) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Oct 2002 23:59:29 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.142] by n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Oct 2002 23:59:29 -0000 Date: Sun, 27 Oct 2002 23:59:27 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Digital vs. analog Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <006c01c0a79b$ef27b420$d3a9fea9@me> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1161 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.89.8 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > I'd be careful about dissing Entercom. So far a number of their > stations still have AM stereo. We have to be careful about "dissing" anybody. Some of the finest AM Stereo stations in the country happen to be owned by corporations such as Clear Channel, Infinity, Disney/ABC, and Entercom. We may or may not agree with their corporate decisions, but that doesn't necessarily correlate to the quality and service of the individual stations that happen to be owned by them. Also, the messages on this group are viewable by anybody on the Internet, so you never know who might be reading our comments. I'm not trying to censor all anti-[corporation of your choice] opinions here. I think criticism is fine, as long as it is substantiated and constructive. But even if it is, too much of it gets tiring and becomes an annoyance -- just take for example all the negative political ads you see every time an election comes around. So, we have to think in more of a positive manner, with the goal of getting more people, stations, companies, and manufacturers to help us promote AM Stereo, and even just higher-quality AM radio in general. From possumhunter@netzero.net Sun Oct 27 16:01:12 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 28 Oct 2002 00:01:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 82243 invoked from network); 28 Oct 2002 00:01:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Oct 2002 00:01:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.196) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Oct 2002 00:01:12 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 27 Oct 2002 16:01:12 -0800 To: References: <158.1688a699.2aecdf64@aol.com> <000901c27dd4$60c299a0$c3f9bed8@kredding430cdt> <006c01c0a79b$ef27b420$d3a9fea9@me> Subject: The Sins Of Entercom Was: Digital vs. analog Date: Sun, 27 Oct 2002 19:00:21 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 28 Oct 2002 00:01:12.0071 (UTC) FILETIME=[2046A970:01C27E15] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.132.221.166] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Scott Todd wrote: > I'd be careful about dissing Entercom. So far a number of their stations still have AM stereo. Hmmm, The sins of Entercom. When Entercom took over WFBC AM 1330 and WORD AM 910 along with WSPA AM 950 this is what they did: WFBC was in CQUAM Stereo and simulcasting on WORD in Mono. Entercom took them over from Metromedia then they decided to turn OFF the stereo signal and change WFBC to WYRD and ID as WORD because the call letters fit a news talk station better. They took over WSPA from Spartan Radio Casting. WSPA was a very highly rated full service locally owned and programmed station as well as being the oldest radio station on the air in SC. Entercom switched WSPA from the better 950 to the lower coverage 910 channel and automated it then put WORD on the 950 channel still simulcasting with 1330. While raping WSPA, they also moved the CBS news from WSPA to WYRD-WORD. The Stereo equipment got sent to another market, along with the studio equipment leaving WSPA with a Digicaster in Greenville hooked to the STL sending the audio back to the 910 transmitter in Spartanburg! Entercom also was able to put two broadcast engineers in the unemployment line behind the displaced on air and office staff in the process. Long live FREE RADIO! Death to the NAB! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Oct 27 16:30:12 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 28 Oct 2002 00:30:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 21449 invoked from network); 28 Oct 2002 00:30:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Oct 2002 00:30:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.89) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Oct 2002 00:30:12 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.181] by n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Oct 2002 00:30:12 -0000 Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 00:30:10 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: time off Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <006001c0a79b$0f7b9260$d3a9fea9@me> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1126 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.89.8 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Also, on boot-up, occasionally it stops dead in its tracks with a > CMOS/GPNV Checksum Bad line while it's still on the DOS screen. CMOS is the part of your computer that keeps its basic settings stored when you have the power off. A problem with CMOS can be as simple as a weak back-up battery, or as major as internal hardware fault that requires replacing the whole system board. If you know how to access your computer's CMOS Setup (or BIOS Setup) -- usually by pressing a special key combination at start-up, or by using a special boot disk -- you should print out or write down all the settings, and then clear the CMOS by removing the back-up battery for a few hours, or by using the "clear CMOS" jumper if it has one (and is documented). Then, once the CMOS is cleared, you can start it up again, and re-enter the Setup settings, and it should work fine as long as there is no hardware fault. I still suspect a weak battery, as the date of your message is over a year behind, and a clock that runs slow or keeps resetting to January 1, 1980 is one sign of a computer battery in need of replacement. From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sun Oct 27 16:55:52 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 28 Oct 2002 00:55:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 79258 invoked from network); 28 Oct 2002 00:55:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Oct 2002 00:55:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.75) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Oct 2002 00:55:51 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.142] by n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Oct 2002 00:55:50 -0000 Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 00:55:47 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Digital vs. Analog Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 3816 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.88 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst Yea radio is going to be digital but in what form it will take has yet to be seen. If IBOC is going to fly it will depend on several factors. The first is the technical feasibility of implementing it in the real world. There is enough bandwidth to do this on the FM band, after they denied the empty spectrum to the LPFM to use for the IBOC sidebands. On AM this will be a=20 different story. As crowded as the AM band is especially in the NE one IBOC signal has the potential to step on another IBOC signal. During these periods dropouts will occur like a cell phone conversation. Clear Channel may be feeling that they have been sold a partial bill of goods after evaluating IBOC in the field and discovering that interference is greater than what they imagined and so requested it be reduced by 6db (=BC power) to minimize interference. Clear Channel owns enough stations in a=20 single market that one of their stations has a great potential stepping on the other. This problem occured in the daytime, add in the nighttime skywave issue and this interference=20 problem grows exponentially. The other side of equation is at the consumer level. If not enough IBOC radios are sold over a resonable period of time then we may see stations turning off IBOC exciters just like they did with AM Stereo. Obviously the 1st radios will turn up in cars like they did for AM Stereo, but as you see we had the big 3 putting AM=20 Strereo in cars and this did not get enough receivers to the market to sustain the AM Stereo cause. Granted that=20 there were other factors like the standard wars and the "Wrath of Kahn" to stall the acceptance of AM Stereo, trying to launch a new technology to replace an older technology will have a steep hill to climb as compared to one that is a compltely new idea like cell phones. Cell phones even had their own A2D conversion but they did it by forcing it onto the public an placing such a price differental=20 between the 2 modes that it became prohibitly expensive=20 to get a analog phone as compared to a digital one. This cost factor issue for IBOC is completely reversed as the older analog radios are cheap and the IBOC receivers will be prohibitly expensive. Add all this into the present=20 economic situation and few people will buy these radios. The future of the economy does not look great and people's money is going to get tighter and this will be the end of IBOC if good receiver penetration does not occur. Even Sirius and XM have not reached their expected financial=20 goals to sustain themselves an if the economy does not make a siginifigant turn around by Q2 of next year=20 satellite DAB will have to shut down. The tresterial broadcaster's fear of satellite DAB may be short lived if Sirius and XM don't make it reducing the motive that they need IBOC to offer extra channels to compete with SatDAB. DTV has not gained the projected receiver=20 penetration to th meet the analog cut off date and so broadcasters are asking for an extension and this will probably happen to radio also. Broadcasters are not going to alienate 60% of their listeners by shutting off the analog signal or making the analog signal=20 unuseable from digital interference, that would be financial suicide. Commercial broadcasting is supported by advertising dollars and they are not going to do anything stupid that would put a signifigant in dent in their income.=20=20 It all comes down to us consumers. If we don't buy these radios broadcasters won't waste their time with IBOC and the ones who have will end up shutting the off the exciter. We've already seen this happen to analog AM Stereo and IBOC=20 will be more complex to maintain than C-QuAM. A station is not going to spend the money on the egineer to keep the system tweaked if they are not receiving enough revenue off the digital signal. JSG From possumhunter@netzero.net Sun Oct 27 17:07:11 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 28 Oct 2002 01:07:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 31350 invoked from network); 28 Oct 2002 01:07:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Oct 2002 01:07:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.81) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Oct 2002 01:07:11 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 27 Oct 2002 17:07:11 -0800 To: References: Subject: Dissin' the big boys Was: Digital vs. analog Date: Sun, 27 Oct 2002 20:06:57 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 28 Oct 2002 01:07:11.0225 (UTC) FILETIME=[581D9E90:01C27E1E] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.132.221.166] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Kevin T. wrote: >Some of the finest AM Stereo stations in the country happen to be owned by corporations such as Clear Channel, Infinity, Disney/ABC, and Entercom. It is true that the big companies have some GREAT radio stations. Disney/ABC has a wonderful sounding signals on several clear channel stations such as WLS and WABC. At the same time they have raped and murdered other great Clear channel stations such as WQEW. Who knows what the logic is behind that. When we do gripe, moan, boo and hiss at the destruction of our favorite stations, it DOES get the attention of the big guys! All they want is the highest Arbitron ratings at the least cost. That is what they live and die by. I know of four success stories of AM stations being "rescued" in this market alone. WAIM 1230, WANS 1280, WKDY 1400, and WPCI 1490 Just how were these stations "rescued"? They were ALL turned off during the consolidations of ownership by the big media companies. The listeners griped moaned and complained to the FMs that they were owned by. ABS sold WAIM to a local owner for just the price of the land and it was put back on the air one day after it went silent. Clear Channel did the same thing with WANS. I forget which media company idiot let WKDY go at a county tax sale. and WPCI (formerly WMRB) was purchased from RC Cola Company and returned to the air after being silent for 10 years. > >Also, the messages on this group are viewable by anybody on the Internet, so you never know who might be reading our comments. That is GREAT! Hopefully we have some Engineers and PDs on here who work for the big media companies. Hopefully they will print out some of these posts and stick them in their boss's mail box at work in the morning! Wouldn't it be NICE of the CE of WSM could show the bean counters at Gaylord there is a Yahoo group that the entire membership wants to see the CQUAM turned back on? How about if somebody at KMOX slams an identical paper on the desk of a bean counter at Infinity? This group can make a BIG difference if we do it right. Does KMOX, WSM, WHAS, WQEW want FREE international advertising? You betcha they do! All they gotta do is turn the CQUAM generator back on and they get a link in the bookmarks file on this group and a logo in the photo album. > >So, we have to think in more of a positive manner, with the goal of getting more people, stations, companies, and manufacturers to help us promote AM Stereo, and even just higher-quality AM radio in general. OK Has anybody on this list contacted Motorola, Harris, Nautel, BE, or the other AM Stereo equipment manufacturers out there? Anybody let their local AM Stereo stations know about this group? How about Sony, Sangean, or Grundig? Ten-Tec anyone? Remember all it took was TWO people, Chris Justice from C. Crane Co., and Mr. Pai from Sangean to get Sangean to produce the PRD3 / CCRadio Long Distance AM portable radio! Long live FREE RADIO! Death to the NAB! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From possumhunter@netzero.net Sun Oct 27 17:13:58 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 28 Oct 2002 01:13:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 7455 invoked from network); 28 Oct 2002 01:13:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Oct 2002 01:13:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.190) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Oct 2002 01:13:58 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 27 Oct 2002 17:13:58 -0800 To: References: <005a01c0a79a$fce45b00$d3a9fea9@me> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Thank you Date: Sun, 27 Oct 2002 20:13:45 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 28 Oct 2002 01:13:58.0221 (UTC) FILETIME=[4AB447D0:01C27E1F] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.132.221.166] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Scott Todd wrote: > I understand Salem is looking for an engineer in Cleveland OH. I still have much love for radio, but now I am a RVIA certified RV repair technician and I have my own business. I wouldn't mind buying a silent AM and putting it back on the air, in STEREO of course. If it is a 1KW, I already have the transmitter! LOL I purchased this old RCA BTA1R to fix up and re-sell a couple of years ago. Well, I fully restored it and fell in love with the old beast and now I wouldn't sell it for anything! > > BTW, I've got one of those RCA radios you described, and I need one of the tall electrolytics for the top of the chassis. www.tubesandmore.com have NEW reproductions! Long live FREE RADIO! Death to the NAB! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From possumhunter@netzero.net Sun Oct 27 17:21:38 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 28 Oct 2002 01:21:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 76738 invoked from network); 28 Oct 2002 01:21:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Oct 2002 01:21:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.89) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Oct 2002 01:21:38 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 27 Oct 2002 17:21:38 -0800 To: References: <158.1688a699.2aecdf64@aol.com> <014d01c27d83$af972060$9e8a9eac@llraper> <005b01c0a79a$feeb2780$d3a9fea9@me> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Digital vs. analog Date: Sun, 27 Oct 2002 20:21:25 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 28 Oct 2002 01:21:38.0147 (UTC) FILETIME=[5CD76B30:01C27E20] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.132.221.166] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Scott Todd wrote: > Somehow I don't think those stations succeeded each other. NDXE never was built, It was on the air for testing at low power ONCE! It was never heard again. > >Didn't know that KUSW tried AMS. They were in Kahn stereo with a Kahn Good'N'Loud processor for a while. WOW! What a signal. KTBN Has had it back on the air modified as a PowerSide, but I think they now just run a pure AM signal. Long live FREE RADIO! Death to the NAB! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From amfmdx@fastq.com Sun Oct 27 21:08:45 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 28 Oct 2002 05:08:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 20718 invoked from network); 28 Oct 2002 05:08:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Oct 2002 05:08:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Oct 2002 05:08:44 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt (d66-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.98]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id g9S58gP74036 for ; Sun, 27 Oct 2002 22:08:42 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <00a001c27e40$02d1b620$c3f9bed8@kredding430cdt> To: References: <158.1688a699.2aecdf64@aol.com> <000901c27dd4$60c299a0$c3f9bed8@kredding430cdt> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Digital vs. analog Date: Sun, 27 Oct 2002 22:08:09 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > This is already > happening here in the #60 Greenville-Spartanburg, SC market. Having been a South Carolinian from Summerville, SC at one time, I find your comments very interesting. > Newberry SC's ONLY FM, WGVC 106.3 was "stolen" and moved to the > Greenville-Spartanburg market in the same way....... Speaking of Newberry, do you know Powell Way III who does weekends on WKDK 1230? > AM 660 in Greenville SC is a BIG signal station that can be heard from the > North Carolina Mountains all of the way to the SC coast and deep into > central Georgia. I remember WESC from my years in SC. They did have a big signal. > In the mean time, you will have one engineer running from transmitter site > to transmitter site trying to keep 25 radio stations going for less money > than a kid at McDonalds earns This comment is fitting. I call todays radio McRadio and have done so for quite some time. > The public just wants decent sound in their car. This can be done with > CQUAM-AMAX radios. Yeah but you can make more money doing digital because all the cars in the world will have to be refitted and you will put the digital radios in the new cars. Who cares about C-QUAM when they can FORCE everyone to buy radios to listen to. Me, I have a bazillion airchecks to listen to on CD. Let them go digital. > Yep, Now even the X-Band is getting nasty at night. The X-band is the new graveyard freqs. > Another thing that will happen is more and more "Pirate" broadcasters will > be popping up. I have long suspected this would happen. Where are you in SC? Kevin Mesa, Arizona From amfmdx@fastq.com Sun Oct 27 21:10:17 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 28 Oct 2002 05:10:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 94095 invoked from network); 28 Oct 2002 05:10:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Oct 2002 05:10:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Oct 2002 05:10:16 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt (d66-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.98]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id g9S5AFP74072 for ; Sun, 27 Oct 2002 22:10:15 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <00ac01c27e40$3a24eb60$c3f9bed8@kredding430cdt> To: References: <158.1688a699.2aecdf64@aol.com> <000901c27dd4$60c299a0$c3f9bed8@kredding430cdt> <006c01c0a79b$ef27b420$d3a9fea9@me> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Digital vs. analog Date: Sun, 27 Oct 2002 22:09:42 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla Entercom runs KUET 710 here in AM $tereo. Kevin ----- Original Message ----- From: "Scott Todd" To: Sent: Wednesday, March 07, 2001 11:49 PM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Digital vs. analog > I'd be careful about dissing Entercom. So far a number of their stations > still have AM stereo. From philipr@irac.pe.ca Mon Oct 28 05:30:09 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 28 Oct 2002 13:30:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 53872 invoked from network); 28 Oct 2002 13:30:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Oct 2002 13:30:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Oct 2002 13:30:07 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.142] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Oct 2002 13:30:07 -0000 Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 13:30:06 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Toyota car AM Stereo receiver Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 961 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking Just to update - I picked up a flawless 1988 Toyota car receiver with AM Stereo 5429 if my memory is correct. Of course, I didn't have the plug, but got on the internet, found a pin diagram for the plug - did a reversal for the socket - varified with my multitester, soldered the wires direct, hooked up a couple speakers, a crude wire antenna and a regulated power supply, and presto - I have highly stable, easy to tune, digital display, great sounding CQUAM stereo - WITH A PILOT LIGHT! [My fingers were getting numb from trying to tune the SRF-42 fine enough to actually receive stereo]. While lacking the impressive [but low fi] boom and tizz of local commercial FM, I am now hearing true AM Stereo as it was meant to be - open, detailed, smooth yet bright top end, with lots of dynamic range. I find the longer I listen to FM Stereo, the less I like it - the longer I listen to AM Stereo, the more I like it - minimal listener fatigue. From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Mon Oct 28 07:01:13 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 28 Oct 2002 15:01:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 65861 invoked from network); 28 Oct 2002 15:01:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Oct 2002 15:01:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14207.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.173.71) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Oct 2002 15:01:11 -0000 Message-ID: <20021028150109.68137.qmail@web14207.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.45.202.244] by web14207.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 28 Oct 2002 07:01:09 PST Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 07:01:09 -0800 (PST) Subject: Danger Will Robinson...KABL...Alert, Alert To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: John Electron X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio Our beveloved KABL in San Francisco is going to be one of the IBOC test stations! Top-notch audio in C-Quam is going to be going down the toilet! Uggh. Clear Channel's best sounding analog station in stereo too! Marv, please have your West Coast people make a ton of recordings of the station now, and then have an 'after' to show the measurable audio difference between super analog stereo and repressed analog mono. __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Y! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your web site http://webhosting.yahoo.com/ From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Oct 28 07:06:01 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 28 Oct 2002 15:06:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 39959 invoked from network); 28 Oct 2002 15:06:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Oct 2002 15:06:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.90) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Oct 2002 15:05:59 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.181] by n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Oct 2002 15:05:59 -0000 Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 15:05:59 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Danger Will Robinson...KABL...Alert, Alert Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20021028150109.68137.qmail@web14207.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 414 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Our beveloved KABL in San Francisco is going to be one of the IBOC > test stations! Actually, 960 KABL tested IBOC a long time ago... I don't know if they are planning to do it again, but after the tests, they switched the C-Quam back on and have been delivering excellent AM Stereo sound ever since. Our own 1680 WTTM was once also an IBOC test station, now back in great AM Stereo sound thanks to Neal. From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Mon Oct 28 08:56:40 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 28 Oct 2002 16:56:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 86367 invoked from network); 28 Oct 2002 16:56:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Oct 2002 16:56:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14202.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.144) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Oct 2002 16:56:38 -0000 Message-ID: <20021028165638.24084.qmail@web14202.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.45.202.244] by web14202.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 28 Oct 2002 08:56:38 PST Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 08:56:38 -0800 (PST) Subject: Fwd: Symphony Digital Radio To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: John Electron X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio Anybody for some good news today? This from the Motorola Website: Because the Motorola Symphony Digital Radio chip set is software based, we are able to add features (like C-QUAM AM stereo) to the radio. The decision to include it in the radio is up to the radio manufacturer. http://e-www.motorola.com/webapp/sps/site/application.jsp?nodeId=04M0zymyKJz __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Y! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your web site http://webhosting.yahoo.com/ From penry@nortelnetworks.com Mon Oct 28 09:51:43 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: penry@nortelnetworks.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 28 Oct 2002 17:51:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 20728 invoked from network); 28 Oct 2002 17:51:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Oct 2002 17:51:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com) (47.103.122.112) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Oct 2002 17:51:41 -0000 Received: from zrc2c011.us.nortel.com (zrc2c011.us.nortel.com [47.103.120.51]) by zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id g9SHprQ02372 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 2002 11:51:53 -0600 (CST) Received: by zrc2c011.us.nortel.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Mon, 28 Oct 2002 11:51:39 -0600 Message-ID: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A5607974044B344F@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: {AMSF} Fwd: Symphony Digital Radio Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 11:51:33 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) From: "Charles Penry" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=376233 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa5vhu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Their .mp3 audio examples sound really bad, both analog and "digital". The "digital" has less static hash, but sounds clipped and distorted. And both have no low end frequency response whatsoever. It would not impress me as an improvement if I was a customer for the chip set. And it looks like the C-QUAM AM stereo comment was added on as an afterthought, perhaps prompted by the efforts of people from this group. I think they need to work on their web presentation some more. Charles -----Original Message----- From: John Electron [mailto:toledohamradio@yahoo.com] Sent: Monday, October 28, 2002 10:57 AM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Fwd: Symphony Digital Radio Anybody for some good news today? This from the Motorola Website: Because the Motorola Symphony Digital Radio chip set is software based, we are able to add features (like C-QUAM AM stereo) to the radio. The decision to include it in the radio is up to the radio manufacturer. http://e-www.motorola.com/webapp/sps/site/application.jsp?nodeId=04M0zymyKJz [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From penry@nortelnetworks.com Mon Oct 28 10:02:03 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: penry@nortelnetworks.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 28 Oct 2002 18:02:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 4509 invoked from network); 28 Oct 2002 18:02:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Oct 2002 18:02:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com) (47.103.122.112) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Oct 2002 18:02:02 -0000 Received: from zrc2c011.us.nortel.com (zrc2c011.us.nortel.com [47.103.120.51]) by zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id g9SI2EQ13464 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 2002 12:02:14 -0600 (CST) Received: by zrc2c011.us.nortel.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Mon, 28 Oct 2002 12:02:00 -0600 Message-ID: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A5607974044B346D@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: {AMSF} Danger Will Robinson...KABL...Alert, Alert Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 12:01:54 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) From: "Charles Penry" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=376233 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa5vhu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Actually this may work toward the demise of AM IBOC. What better station to try the "dirty deed" than at one of the best sounding AM stereo stations in the US? If the music loving KABL listeners flood the station with complaints, then IBOC will likely go away there, leaving Clear Channel with a bad taste of 1's and 0's in their mouth. However, if there are few complaints, then the public will have spoken... Charles --------------------------------------------- From: John Electron [mailto:toledohamradio@yahoo.com] Sent: Monday, October 28, 2002 9:01 AM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Danger Will Robinson...KABL...Alert, Alert Our beveloved KABL in San Francisco is going to be one of the IBOC test stations! Top-notch audio in C-Quam is going to be going down the toilet! Uggh. Clear Channel's best sounding analog station in stereo too! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From amfmdx@fastq.com Mon Oct 28 10:08:51 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 28 Oct 2002 18:08:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 35235 invoked from network); 28 Oct 2002 18:08:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Oct 2002 18:08:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Oct 2002 18:08:50 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt (d143-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.175]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id g9SI8nP86664 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 2002 11:08:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <01cd01c27ead$033d82c0$c3f9bed8@kredding430cdt> To: References: <20021028165638.24084.qmail@web14202.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fwd: Symphony Digital Radio Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 11:08:24 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > Because the Motorola Symphony Digital Radio chip set is software based, we are > able to add features (like C-QUAM AM stereo) to the radio. The decision to > include it in the radio is up to the radio manufacturer. I hope that this Symphony chip radio sounds as good as my 1961 Zenith Royal 2000 Trans-Symphony. For a mono radio, it sounds phenomenal. If the Symphony chip radios sound near that good, its a winner all the way around! Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Mon Oct 28 12:59:58 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 28 Oct 2002 20:59:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 8133 invoked from network); 28 Oct 2002 20:59:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Oct 2002 20:59:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.40) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Oct 2002 20:59:57 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 28 Oct 2002 12:59:57 -0800 To: References: <158.1688a699.2aecdf64@aol.com> <000901c27dd4$60c299a0$c3f9bed8@kredding430cdt> <00a001c27e40$02d1b620$c3f9bed8@kredding430cdt> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Digital vs. analog Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 15:59:45 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 28 Oct 2002 20:59:57.0513 (UTC) FILETIME=[F8F28B90:01C27EC4] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.150.159.203] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Kevin - Mesa, Arizona wrote: > Speaking of Newberry, do you know Powell Way III who does weekends on WKDK 1230? No, But I used to do evenings on WAIM 1230 when it was a music station > > I remember WESC from my years in SC. They did have a big signal. Oh yea, You can here WESC in Beufort on Port Royal Island just as good as you can hear it in Greenville. > >This comment is fitting. I call todays radio McRadio and have done so for quite some time. The state of radio in general is pretty bad, and AM is disgusting. I am doing my part, I am trying to buy a 1000 Watt daytimer! > > Where are you in SC? I am in Rural Greenville County. OH YEA! New AMer to report...sorta: I heard a SUPER SOUNDING AM on 550 near Hodges, SC today playing Celtic music. The person who built that pirate knows what he is doing! (No. It ain't mine!) Long live FREE RADIO! Death to the NAB! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From possumhunter@netzero.net Mon Oct 28 13:29:35 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 28 Oct 2002 21:29:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 57453 invoked from network); 28 Oct 2002 21:29:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Oct 2002 21:29:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.82) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Oct 2002 21:29:34 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 28 Oct 2002 13:29:34 -0800 To: References: <20021028165638.24084.qmail@web14202.mail.yahoo.com> <01cd01c27ead$033d82c0$c3f9bed8@kredding430cdt> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fwd: Symphony Digital Radio Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 16:29:21 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 28 Oct 2002 21:29:34.0615 (UTC) FILETIME=[1C2ECA70:01C27EC9] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.150.159.203] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Kevin - Mesa, Arizona wrote: > I hope that this Symphony chip radio sounds as good as my 1961 Zenith Royal 2000 Trans-Symphony. Think about THAT statement for a while folks! Kevin hopes radio technology will IMPROVE BACK to the level it was 40 years ago! Yea, I am with ya Kevin. I want a new radio that sounds like my nearly 70 year old RCA Superbrain. The GE Superadio comes pretty close! I am gonna have to buy one of those Japanese market Sony AMs for myself. Long live FREE RADIO! Death to the NAB! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From possumhunter@netzero.net Mon Oct 28 13:35:13 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 28 Oct 2002 21:35:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 89247 invoked from network); 28 Oct 2002 21:35:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Oct 2002 21:35:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.196) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Oct 2002 21:35:13 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 28 Oct 2002 13:35:13 -0800 To: References: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A5607974044B346D@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Danger Will Robinson...KABL...Alert, Alert Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 16:35:01 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 28 Oct 2002 21:35:13.0204 (UTC) FILETIME=[E5FF5F40:01C27EC9] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.150.159.203] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Charles Penry wrote: > If the music loving KABL listeners flood the station with complaints, then IBOC will likely go away there, leaving Clear Channel with a bad taste of 1's and 0's in their mouth. Sounds like a good plan to me! I know the engineer at one station who has (illegally) turned the Kahn AM STEREO generator back on! No, I ain't ratting him out. If want to hear AM STEREO without platform motion, you will have to tune around and find the signal for yourself! Long live FREE RADIO! Death to the NAB! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From michaelj@vcn.com Mon Oct 28 13:38:44 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 28 Oct 2002 21:38:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 70706 invoked from network); 28 Oct 2002 21:38:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Oct 2002 21:38:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m2-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.32) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Oct 2002 21:38:43 -0000 Received: from michael (vcn81.usrtc-1.evan.wy.vcn.com [209.193.86.85]) by m2-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Mon, 28 Oct 2002 14:38:43 -0700 To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} Fwd: Symphony Digital Radio Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 14:37:49 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 In-Reply-To: From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I'd be willing to take a radio that sounds as good as my Delco UX-1!! That thing is AWESOME! The sound is amazing on the AM side. Delco had the RIGHT recipe when they made that one!! MJR n WYO -----Original Message----- From: Possum Hunter [mailto:possumhunter@netzero.net] Sent: Monday, October 28, 2002 2:29 PM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fwd: Symphony Digital Radio Kevin - Mesa, Arizona wrote: > I hope that this Symphony chip radio sounds as good as my 1961 Zenith Royal 2000 Trans-Symphony. Think about THAT statement for a while folks! Kevin hopes radio technology will IMPROVE BACK to the level it was 40 years ago! Yea, I am with ya Kevin. I want a new radio that sounds like my nearly 70 year old RCA Superbrain. The GE Superadio comes pretty close! I am gonna have to buy one of those Japanese market Sony AMs for myself. Long live FREE RADIO! Death to the NAB! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ADVERTISEMENT Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From possumhunter@netzero.net Mon Oct 28 16:29:06 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 29 Oct 2002 00:29:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 41449 invoked from network); 29 Oct 2002 00:29:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Oct 2002 00:29:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.98) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Oct 2002 00:29:05 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 28 Oct 2002 16:29:05 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fwd: Symphony Digital Radio Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 19:28:53 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 29 Oct 2002 00:29:05.0895 (UTC) FILETIME=[305DAF70:01C27EE2] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.152.237.184] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Michael J. Richard wrote: > I'd be willing to take a radio that sounds as good as my Delco UX-1!! I have had a couple of great AMs in the car: Kenwood KRC-939 multimode AM STEREO - was killed in a car wreck, and a Factory Chrysler that died in a car fire. Long live FREE RADIO! Death to the NAB! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From possumhunter@netzero.net Mon Oct 28 18:42:42 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 29 Oct 2002 02:42:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 48627 invoked from network); 29 Oct 2002 02:42:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Oct 2002 02:42:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.97) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Oct 2002 02:42:40 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 28 Oct 2002 18:42:40 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Danger Will Robinson...KABL...Alert, Alert Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 21:42:22 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 29 Oct 2002 02:42:40.0649 (UTC) FILETIME=[D9881790:01C27EF4] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.131.109.218] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 "Kevin T." wrote: > Our own 1680 WTTM was once also an IBOC test station, now back in great AM Stereo sound thanks to Neal. One of the BEST sounding AMs I have ever heard was when 1210 kHz in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania first turned on their CQUAM and got a brand new Harris DX-50 Transmitter. They went whole hawg promoting the STEREO signal and had an oldies format. I also used to love listening to Chris Underwood at night on 1190 WOWO in STEREO I had a bunch of tape but lost it in a flood :-( Long live FREE RADIO! Death to the NAB! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From groucho@skyweb.net Mon Oct 28 19:16:46 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 29 Oct 2002 03:16:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 89893 invoked from network); 29 Oct 2002 03:16:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Oct 2002 03:16:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Oct 2002 03:16:45 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g9T3JLRQ052518; Mon, 28 Oct 2002 22:19:21 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DBDFD7C.32176BD2@skyweb.net> Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 22:16:12 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ABDX@topica.com, "amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com" , "radio-tech@broadcast.net" Subject: Re: [ ABDX ] computer help? References: <0.1600035844.1963345462-1463747838-1035859169@topica.com> <0.1600035844.1213558604-1463792382-1035860791@topica.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 OK I know its Off Topic But maybe you guys have been getting the same thing for the past 2 weeks Now I keep getting the Following that pops up in my WIN.INI all by itself... I delete it and they keep coming back. and I have not a clue? [windows] forgot the exact line but I get brasil.exe,alevir.exe and scrsrv.exe not found when I reboot the computer anyone else getting these weird files? and If so how did you finally remove them? Norton anti virus finds that the machine is clean.. No virus's Neal From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Oct 28 22:24:30 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 29 Oct 2002 06:24:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 76973 invoked from network); 29 Oct 2002 06:24:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Oct 2002 06:24:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Oct 2002 06:24:30 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.134] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 29 Oct 2002 06:24:30 -0000 Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2002 06:24:29 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Fwd: Symphony Digital Radio Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A5607974044B344F@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1603 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.69.7 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Their .mp3 audio examples sound really bad, both analog and > "digital". The "digital" has less static hash, but sounds clipped > and distorted. And both have no low end frequency response > whatsoever. Indeed, the lack of quality of their demo recordings is really quite astonishing to listen to. I don't know how they got it to sound that bad, even in "analog" mode, short of some really wacky audio production. Neither example sounds like a legitimate recording of FM radio, either -- and despite the claim of increased Stereo separation, there is absolutely none to be heard in their examples! I could make a much more convincing example using ordinary *analog* signal processing -- a careful selection of IF bandwidth, RF impulse noise blanking, audio notch and low-pass filters, and Dynamic Noise Reduction (DNR) will clean up the sound of AM Stereo and FM Stereo nearly as well as even the best digital signal processing can achieve. Perhaps somebody here with a Carver TX-series tuner could give us an MP3 example of how its 1980s-era analog techniques clean up the sound of FM Stereo? Carver made some impressive claims about its tuners' ability to reduce multipath and background hiss on FM while still retaining good Stereo separation -- something I wish more car radios could do, as so far I have had to choose between a car radio that gives hissy, scratchy but wide-separation FM Stereo, or a car radio that delivers clean FM reception at the expense of having virtually no Stereo separation, even when tuned to a strong signal with the "ST" indicator glowing. From amfmdx@fastq.com Mon Oct 28 22:39:24 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 29 Oct 2002 06:39:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 71380 invoked from network); 29 Oct 2002 06:39:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Oct 2002 06:39:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Oct 2002 06:39:22 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt (d4-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.36]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id g9T6dKP05586 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 2002 23:39:21 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <023401c27f15$bc3f48e0$c3f9bed8@kredding430cdt> To: References: <20021028165638.24084.qmail@web14202.mail.yahoo.com> <01cd01c27ead$033d82c0$c3f9bed8@kredding430cdt> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fwd: Symphony Digital Radio Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 23:38:03 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > > I hope that this Symphony chip radio sounds as good as my 1961 Zenith > Royal 2000 Trans-Symphony. > > Think about THAT statement for a while folks! Kevin hopes radio technology > will IMPROVE BACK to the level it was 40 years ago! Yea, I am with ya Kevin. I have to tell you that this is one AWESOME sounding radio. I also have to tell you that I have a 1958 GE 780P that sounds even better then the Trans-Symphony! This thing is the best sounding radio I have EVER heard. PERIOD. If they still made radios like this, theres no way AM could lose. > The GE Superadio comes pretty close! The GE SRIII in wide mode is about as good as its gonna get for today. > I am gonna have to buy one of those > Japanese market Sony AMs for myself. *IF* you can afford it, and one shows on eBay, get a Sony SRF A-100 or SRF A-1. Those radios sound unbelievable. I have an A-1 but desperately want an A-100 also. They are phenomenal with a good set of headphones. Kevin From amfmdx@fastq.com Mon Oct 28 22:43:00 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 29 Oct 2002 06:43:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 81863 invoked from network); 29 Oct 2002 06:43:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Oct 2002 06:43:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Oct 2002 06:43:00 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt (d4-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.36]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id g9T6gxP05611 for ; Mon, 28 Oct 2002 23:42:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <024201c27f16$3dec4e60$c3f9bed8@kredding430cdt> To: References: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A5607974044B346D@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Danger Will Robinson...KABL...Alert, Alert Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 23:41:40 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > I know the engineer at one station who has (illegally) turned the Kahn AM > STEREO generator back on! No, I ain't ratting him out. There are several stations doing this. Hes not the only one. > If want to hear AM > STEREO without platform motion, you will have to tune around and find the > signal for yourself! Don't be fooled. Kahn has platform motion too. Its not the same or as bad as C-QUAM which has little with the new chips, but Kahn does have platform motion. Kevin From dav259@csiro.au Tue Oct 29 00:22:01 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 29 Oct 2002 08:22:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 41147 invoked from network); 29 Oct 2002 08:22:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Oct 2002 08:22:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Oct 2002 08:22:00 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g9T8L2P02407; Tue, 29 Oct 2002 19:21:03 +1100 (EST) Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2002 19:21:02 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Bob Betcher Cc: amstereoforum Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public Hi Bob As the US goes through its trials of IBOC digital radio I hope you are aware of the Symphony chip that Motorola has recently developed. In Australia we have heard talk of digital radio being "just around the corner" for 12 years. Yet despite Eureka being adopted in the UK and Canada - with little success - digital radio here seems many years away. The IBOC concept is great - improved sound quality - and nobody necessarily has to buy a new radio. But every report on it that I've seen (except from iBiquity) says it's a dog. This new Symphony chip from Motorola could be a better solution than IBOC. http://e-www.motorola.com/webapp/sps/site/application.jsp?nodeId=04M0zymyKJz It's digital processing of robust analogue signals may very well be the answer. It seems to have all the argued advantages of IBOC - but nobody would be disadvantaged by HAVING to buy new radios (as with Eureka) or suffer the interference that IBOC is reported to be creating. And as Motorola's blurb says ... "Because the Motorola Symphony Digital Radio chip set is software based, we are able to add features (like C-QUAM AM stereo) to the radio. The decision to include it in the radio is up to the radio manufacturer." This could be the kick along that AM radio needs! Stereo undistorted hi-fi radio costing the broadcasters nothing. I believe the cost of the AM stereo chip is less than US$3 per unit. What an opportunity - if only the manufacturers would seize it - or be mandated to seize it! How about the FCC just for once do something right? I hope you can bring this to the attention of your readers. regards Ian Melbourne, Australia ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Ian Davidson _--_|\ home: 61 3 9534 8786 41 Smith Street / \ work: 61 3 9545 8717 St. Kilda Beach Vic 3182 \_.--.*/ mobile: 61 0421 500 720 Australia v ian.davidson@csiro.au ----------------------------------------------------------------------- From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Oct 29 01:46:29 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 29 Oct 2002 09:46:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 8137 invoked from network); 29 Oct 2002 09:46:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Oct 2002 09:46:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Oct 2002 09:46:28 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.134] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 29 Oct 2002 09:46:28 -0000 Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2002 09:46:25 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: 1190 WOWO Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 789 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.69.7 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > I also used to love listening to Chris Underwood at night on 1190 > WOWO in STEREO > I had a bunch of tape but lost it in a flood :-( You're in luck: ftp://209.193.86.116/North-America/USA/Indiana/ There you'll find three scoped MP3 recordings I made of some tapes of 1190 WOWO back from the fall of 1992, featuring Chris Underwood and B.J. Stone.... thanks to Tony Straka for sending me these cassettes a while back... they are from his nighttime skywave DX reception of WOWO on a Realistic TM-152 at his location in eastern PA. Aside from some fading, and the limitations of the 56 kbps MP3 files I encoded them into, the quality is excellent, as is the music variety -- and the concept of a true Full Service 50,000-watt clear channel AM station playing music in Stereo. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Oct 29 01:49:55 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 29 Oct 2002 09:49:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 48148 invoked from network); 29 Oct 2002 09:49:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Oct 2002 09:49:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.68) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Oct 2002 09:49:55 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.187] by n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 29 Oct 2002 09:49:55 -0000 Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2002 09:49:52 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Danger Will Robinson...KABL...Alert, Alert Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <024201c27f16$3dec4e60$c3f9bed8@kredding430cdt> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 641 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.69.7 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Don't be fooled. Kahn has platform motion too. Its not the same or > as bad as C-QUAM which has little with the new chips, but Kahn does > have platform motion. Crank up Kahn AM Stereo on your "Surround Sound" system. You'll be treated to FRONT TO BACK platform motion! That's because the motion is between the L+R (front center) and L-R (matrixed rear) components, rather than the individual Left and Right channels. With headphones, or even criticially placed Stereo speakers, it is audible as a strange phasing effect, which may or may not be perceived as less annoying than C-Quam's side-to-side motion on unstable signals. From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Tue Oct 29 05:59:29 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 29 Oct 2002 13:59:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 82921 invoked from network); 29 Oct 2002 13:42:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Oct 2002 13:42:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14207.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.173.71) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Oct 2002 13:42:16 -0000 Message-ID: <20021029134216.49926.qmail@web14207.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.45.202.244] by web14207.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 29 Oct 2002 05:42:16 PST Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2002 05:42:16 -0800 (PST) Subject: Platform Motion - a thing of the past To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: John Electron X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio So-called "platform motion" has all but disappeared on all but the weakest of signals with the 3rd generation C-Quam chips. __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? HotJobs - Search new jobs daily now http://hotjobs.yahoo.com/ From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Tue Oct 29 06:10:56 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 29 Oct 2002 14:10:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 92109 invoked from network); 29 Oct 2002 13:43:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Oct 2002 13:43:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14205.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.151) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Oct 2002 13:43:05 -0000 Message-ID: <20021029134304.94092.qmail@web14205.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.45.202.244] by web14205.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 29 Oct 2002 05:43:04 PST Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2002 05:43:04 -0800 (PST) Subject: Fwd: X-Band FCC Rules To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: John Electron X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio Stereo AM still gets the preference for X-Banders: http://www.hallikainen.org/cgi-bin/section.pl?section=73.30 __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? HotJobs - Search new jobs daily now http://hotjobs.yahoo.com/ From fanfare@globility.com Tue Oct 29 06:56:35 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 29 Oct 2002 14:56:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 88242 invoked from network); 29 Oct 2002 14:35:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Oct 2002 14:35:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.64) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Oct 2002 14:35:15 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.133] by n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 29 Oct 2002 14:35:14 -0000 Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2002 14:35:14 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [ ABDX ] computer help? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3DBDFD7C.32176BD2@skyweb.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1303 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Marv Southcott" X-Originating-IP: 64.56.234.11 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy --- In amstereoforum@y..., Neal Newman wrote: > OK I know its Off Topic > But maybe you guys have been getting the same thing > for the past 2 weeks Now I keep getting the Following that pops up in my WIN.INI > all by itself... I delete it and they keep coming back. and I have not a clue? > [windows] > forgot the exact line but I get brasil.exe,alevir.exe and scrsrv.exe not found > when I reboot the computer > anyone else getting these weird files? and If so how did you finally remove them? > Norton anti virus finds that the machine is clean.. No virus's > > Neal Hi Neal: I realize this is off-topic but, being a humanitarian mission ;-)), according to what I've learned, your system has been infected by the "opasoft" worm. It's favorite spawning ground is within sytems that are set up for files sharing. I know that Norton is probably the most widely used anti-virus program, but it's not infallable. Also, and I don't mean to imply you haven't done this, but every anti-virus program is only as good as how current is its database. Want a good, antivirus program? Go to "www.grisoft.com" (psssst it's free). In the meantime, take a look at http://www.sophos.com/virusinfo/analyses/w32opaserva.html for information on removing the "opasoft" worm. Marv From fanfare@globility.com Tue Oct 29 07:14:12 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 29 Oct 2002 15:14:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 99507 invoked from network); 29 Oct 2002 15:14:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Oct 2002 15:14:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO columbus.globility.com) (205.189.152.11) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Oct 2002 15:14:11 -0000 Received: from FAN--MCS (dynamic-b2-11.highspeed.eol.ca [64.56.234.11]) by columbus.globility.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id g9TFEAD12708 for ; Tue, 29 Oct 2002 10:14:10 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <200210291014100827.005A0866@mail.globility.com> In-Reply-To: <3DBDFD7C.32176BD2@skyweb.net> References: <0.1600035844.1963345462-1463747838-1035859169@topica.com> <0.1600035844.1213558604-1463792382-1035860791@topica.com> <3DBDFD7C.32176BD2@skyweb.net> X-Mailer: Calypso Version 3.30.00.00 (4) Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2002 10:14:10 -0500 To: "Kevin Tekel" Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: [ ABDX ] computer help? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable From: "Marv Southcott" Reply-To: fanfare@globility.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy HI Neal: You're suffering the remnants of a worm virus. I put up an explanation of w= hat you might be going through for the benefit of the group. Go to " http:/= /www.sophos.com/virusinfo/analyses/w32opaserva.html " for removal instructi= ons. Also, make sure your Norton is up to date.=20 Cheers, Marv *********** REPLY SEPARATOR *********** On 10/28/2002 at 10:16 PM Neal Newman wrote: >OK I know its Off Topic >But maybe you guys have been getting the same thing > for the past 2 weeks Now I keep getting the Following that pops up in my >WIN.INI > all by itself... I delete it and they keep coming back. and I have not a >clue? >[windows] > forgot the exact line but I get brasil.exe,alevir.exe and scrsrv.exe >not found >when I reboot the computer > anyone else getting these weird files? and If so how did you finally >remove them? > Norton anti virus finds that the machine is clean.. No virus's > >Neal > > > > >Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum=20 > >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From scott.toenniessen@fmr.com Tue Oct 29 07:29:01 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: scott.toenniessen@fmr.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 29 Oct 2002 15:29:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 47080 invoked from network); 29 Oct 2002 15:22:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Oct 2002 15:22:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Oct 2002 15:22:08 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.160] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 29 Oct 2002 15:22:07 -0000 Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2002 15:22:06 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Breaking news from Boston Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 244 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "spt87a" X-Originating-IP: 151.204.227.218 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public Last night, WBZ mono 1030, this morning WBZ AM Stereo 1030!!! I verified on my Denon and Ford CD-6. Hope this isn't temporary because they are running on an old transmitter. Some email to them might be useful - www.wbz1030.com - Scott From possumhunter@netzero.net Tue Oct 29 08:19:38 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 29 Oct 2002 16:19:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 60949 invoked from network); 29 Oct 2002 16:19:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Oct 2002 16:19:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.98) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Oct 2002 16:19:36 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 29 Oct 2002 08:19:36 -0800 To: References: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A5607974044B346D@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> <024201c27f16$3dec4e60$c3f9bed8@kredding430cdt> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Danger Will Robinson...KABL...Alert, Alert Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2002 11:19:19 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 29 Oct 2002 16:19:36.0859 (UTC) FILETIME=[F9782EB0:01C27F66] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.154.197.251] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Kevin - Mesa, Arizona wrote: > Don't be fooled. Kahn has platform motion too. Its not the same or as bad as C-QUAM which has little with the new chips, but Kahn does have platform motion. It is true that Kahn can have some platform motion under some conditions (Heavy selective fading and Skywave-Groundwave multipath). Kahn does have its faults. It can get sounding pretty weird with adjacent channel interference and lightning crashes too. But then, FM STEREO can also get platform motion and rapid opening and collapsing of the stereo field when driving in the mountains. You KNOW such conditions will do weird things to the sound of IBOC digital! Still, you will have to admit ole Leonard Kahn could sure make an AM station sound GOOD! WQXR 1560 playing classical music in Kahn Stereo sounded BETTER than our local FM, even with co-channel WPAD under it. Long live FREE RADIO! Death to the NAB! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From michaelj@vcn.com Tue Oct 29 08:22:14 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 29 Oct 2002 16:22:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 1052 invoked from network); 29 Oct 2002 15:47:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Oct 2002 15:47:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m3-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.33) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Oct 2002 15:47:07 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m3-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Tue, 29 Oct 2002 08:47:07 -0700 Message-ID: <001501c27f62$68702de0$0701010a@keva> To: References: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A5607974044B346D@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> <024201c27f16$3dec4e60$c3f9bed8@kredding430cdt> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Danger Will Robinson...KABL...Alert, Alert Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2002 08:46:53 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Okay I know this has been discussed before, but I don't remember. To actually hear the Kahn AM Stereo you'd have to have an SRF-A100 or and SRF-A1 or something with a multi-sync decoder. I know on the Sonys there's no light to indicate stereo.....but does the Kahn system have a pilot tone like C-quam does? Do you think these engineers out there that are running Kahn AM Stereo are running with the Kahn pilot tone too? I don't know why I'm asking......I don't have a unit that has a multi-sync decoder with an indicator for stereo anyways. I'm just curious. I do have the Sony SRF-A1 walkman but unless it's local or a really good signal I doubt I'd be able to tell anyway. MJR n WYO ----- Original Message ----- From: Kevin - Mesa, Arizona To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, October 28, 2002 11:41 PM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Danger Will Robinson...KABL...Alert, Alert > I know the engineer at one station who has (illegally) turned the Kahn AM > STEREO generator back on! No, I ain't ratting him out. There are several stations doing this. Hes not the only one. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From possumhunter@netzero.net Tue Oct 29 08:23:45 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 29 Oct 2002 16:23:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 70583 invoked from network); 29 Oct 2002 16:23:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Oct 2002 16:23:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.202) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Oct 2002 16:23:45 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 29 Oct 2002 08:23:45 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: 1190 WOWO Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2002 11:23:33 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 29 Oct 2002 16:23:45.0233 (UTC) FILETIME=[8D830C10:01C27F67] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.154.197.251] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Kevin T. wrote: > There you'll find three scoped MP3 recordings I made of some tapes of 1190 WOWO back from the fall of 1992, THANKS A MILLION! Hey I have some tapes of the last day WQOK 1440 was on the air! I will see about getting them transfered and posted. On the amradiodx group I put some stuff up in the files folder from Laser 558, Atlantic 252, and WLS. Long live FREE RADIO! Death to the NAB! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From groucho@skyweb.net Tue Oct 29 08:49:41 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 29 Oct 2002 16:49:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 65009 invoked from network); 29 Oct 2002 16:18:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Oct 2002 16:18:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Oct 2002 16:18:52 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g9TGLURQ044507 for ; Tue, 29 Oct 2002 11:21:32 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DBEB4CD.C97BAA8F@skyweb.net> Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2002 11:18:21 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: [ ABDX ] computer help? References: <0.1600035844.1963345462-1463747838-1035859169@topica.com> <0.1600035844.1213558604-1463792382-1035860791@topica.com> <3DBDFD7C.32176BD2@skyweb.net> <200210291014100827.005A0866@mail.globility.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Thanks Marv.. I think I got it Licked now...... this was On my home PC's and they were not networked.. I also noticed this on all 18 machines at the studios which are networked.... Frustrating..... it was actually in the registry that it kept reloading itself.... I also found that someone installed AOL on this machine( my wifes friend) and I found AOL on 2 of the machines at the studios.... Neal Marv Southcott wrote: > HI Neal: > > You're suffering the remnants of a worm virus. I put up an explanation of what you might be going through for the benefit of the group. Go to " http://www.sophos.com/virusinfo/analyses/w32opaserva.html " for removal instructions. Also, make sure your Norton is up to date. > > Cheers, > > Marv > > *********** REPLY SEPARATOR *********** > > On 10/28/2002 at 10:16 PM Neal Newman wrote: > > >OK I know its Off Topic > >But maybe you guys have been getting the same thing > > for the past 2 weeks Now I keep getting the Following that pops up in my > >WIN.INI > > all by itself... I delete it and they keep coming back. and I have not a > >clue? > >[windows] > > forgot the exact line but I get brasil.exe,alevir.exe and scrsrv.exe > >not found > >when I reboot the computer > > anyone else getting these weird files? and If so how did you finally > >remove them? > > Norton anti virus finds that the machine is clean.. No virus's > > > >Neal > > > > > > > > > >Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > > >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From amfmdx@fastq.com Tue Oct 29 08:56:08 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 29 Oct 2002 16:56:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 73086 invoked from network); 29 Oct 2002 16:56:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Oct 2002 16:56:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Oct 2002 16:56:08 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt (d80-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.112]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id g9TGu6P17087 for ; Tue, 29 Oct 2002 09:56:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <038a01c27f6b$fa08bca0$c3f9bed8@kredding430cdt> To: References: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A5607974044B346D@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> <024201c27f16$3dec4e60$c3f9bed8@kredding430cdt> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Danger Will Robinson...KABL...Alert, Alert Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2002 09:55:23 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > Still, you will have to admit ole Leonard Kahn could sure make an AM station > sound GOOD! WQXR 1560 playing classical music in Kahn Stereo sounded BETTER > than our local FM, even with co-channel WPAD under it. Kahn sounds good. Good as FM. Still I prefer C-QUAM and the way it sounds. I would easily accept Kahn if it were the standard and AM stereo was still popular. Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Tue Oct 29 09:41:34 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 29 Oct 2002 17:41:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 93943 invoked from network); 29 Oct 2002 17:41:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Oct 2002 17:41:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.207) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Oct 2002 17:41:33 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 29 Oct 2002 09:41:33 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Breaking news from Boston Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2002 12:41:21 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 29 Oct 2002 17:41:33.0626 (UTC) FILETIME=[6C1749A0:01C27F72] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.154.197.251] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 spt87a wrote: > Last night, WBZ mono 1030, this morning WBZ AM Stereo 1030!!! I verified on my Denon and Ford CD-6. > > Hope this isn't temporary because they are running on an old transmitter. Some email to them might be useful - www.wbz1030.com I heard it too! This is the letter I sent them this morning: To: Engineering WAY TO GO! This morning I was listening to your Skywave signal in AM STEREO at my location in Piedmont, SC With many AM stations letting their plants fall into disrepair, it is nice to hear a radio station that not only keep it's plant in top-notch condition, but UPGRADES to AM STEREO. Now if we could only get more AMAX certified tuners on the market... I tuned in using a modified GE Superadio III with an external home-brew CQUAM decoder board. Antenna used: Alpha-Delta "Sloper" Model DX-SWL Keep up the GREAT work! I sure hope they keep that Stereo signal ON! Let's all FLOOD WBZ with emails! Long live FREE RADIO! Death to the NAB! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From possumhunter@netzero.net Tue Oct 29 11:46:07 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 29 Oct 2002 19:46:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 2789 invoked from network); 29 Oct 2002 19:45:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Oct 2002 19:45:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.124) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Oct 2002 19:46:02 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 29 Oct 2002 11:46:02 -0800 To: References: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A5607974044B346D@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> <024201c27f16$3dec4e60$c3f9bed8@kredding430cdt> <001501c27f62$68702de0$0701010a@keva> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Danger Will Robinson...KABL...Alert, Alert Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2002 14:45:50 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 29 Oct 2002 19:46:02.0326 (UTC) FILETIME=[CFC87760:01C27F83] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.139.195.108] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Michael J. Richard wrote: >but does the Kahn system have a pilot tone like C-quam does? Yes, If the Pilot is left on when in the PowerSide mode, One speaker with be louder than the other on a stereo tuner. > >Do you think these engineers out there that are running Kahn AM Stereo are running with the Kahn pilot tone too? The one I posted about is! LOL his way of thumbing his nose at the NAB, FCC, and stupid station beancounters that won't buy a legal CQUAM generator. > > I don't know why I'm asking......I don't have a unit that has a multi-sync decoder with an indicator for stereo anyways. The Sony ICF-2010 has a multi-sync decoder chip in it. It uses the chip in the Harris mode for the selectable sideband feature and can be modified for AM STEREO reception. You can buy Japanese market Sony AM STEREO radios from http://www.stereoam.com/ Long live FREE RADIO! Death to the NAB! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From possumhunter@netzero.net Tue Oct 29 13:47:28 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 29 Oct 2002 21:47:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 29924 invoked from network); 29 Oct 2002 21:47:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Oct 2002 21:47:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.197) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Oct 2002 21:47:26 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 29 Oct 2002 13:47:25 -0800 To: References: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A5607974044B346D@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> <024201c27f16$3dec4e60$c3f9bed8@kredding430cdt> <038a01c27f6b$fa08bca0$c3f9bed8@kredding430cdt> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Danger Will Robinson...KABL...Alert, Alert Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2002 16:32:50 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 29 Oct 2002 21:47:25.0866 (UTC) FILETIME=[C51C78A0:01C27F94] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.161.255.184] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Kevin - Mesa, Arizona wrote: > Kahn sounds good. Good as FM. Still I prefer C-QUAM and the way it sounds. CQUAM does have a "richer" sound when you have a nice strong signal. Where Kahn shines is when you have a weak, selective fading signal. The Harris system sounded great too. I have never heard a Magnavox station on the air, so I can't say much about them. Long live FREE RADIO! Death to the NAB! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Oct 29 14:26:01 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 29 Oct 2002 22:26:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 85752 invoked from network); 29 Oct 2002 22:25:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Oct 2002 22:25:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.68) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Oct 2002 22:25:59 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.167] by n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 29 Oct 2002 22:25:58 -0000 Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2002 22:25:54 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Danger Will Robinson...KABL...Alert, Alert Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2099 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.90.56 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > CQUAM does have a "richer" sound when you have a nice strong > signal. Where Kahn shines is when you have a weak, selective fading > signal. The Harris system sounded great too. I have never heard a > Magnavox station on the air, so I can't say much about them. The main advantage of C-Quam is that it has benefitted from two decades of use an improvement, especially with the newer MC13022 and MC13028 decoders introduced in the early to mid 1990s. On a properly designed receiver, the audio quality of C-Quam is now about as good as you could ever expect AM Stereo to be; the signal that today's C-Quam AM Stereo transmitters put out have no trouble meeting or exceeding the audio quality standards of FM Stereo. Kahn AM Stereo still has an advantage in the reception of weak, unstable signals -- but, at this point, it is early 1980s technology, and since there is no commercial interest in its use anymore, it will remain as such. Kahn's "Power-Side" system is still based on a fully functional Kahn AM Stereo exciter, with a switch right on the front panel to flip between Power-Side and so-called "Normal Stereo" modes. At this point, the FCC probably isn't going to care if a station flips it into Kahn Stereo mode, at least until it comes time for a station equipment inspection, but C-Quam remains the only approved system for broadcasting AM Stereo in most of the world. The Harris system was a very sophisticated system, but that was both its main advantage and disadvantage; in ideal conditions, it worked *beautifully*, but the receiver design proved to be overly complex, and as far as I know, no "multi-system" AM Stereo radios ever supported the Harris system properly. Magnavox was a very simplistic system for AM Stereo, and in real world use, its performance would have been comparable to that of C-Quam, except compatibility with regular mono radios wouldn't be quite as perfect. I know of only a handful of stations that ever broadcast Magnavox AM Stereo; one 1985 list I have only shows six Magnavox AM Stereo stations in the entire country. From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Tue Oct 29 14:28:51 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 29 Oct 2002 22:28:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 80255 invoked from network); 29 Oct 2002 22:28:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Oct 2002 22:28:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf23bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.195) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Oct 2002 22:28:51 -0000 Received: from juan ([67.34.48.187]) by imf23bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.19 201-253-122-122-119-20020516) with SMTP id <20021029223034.ZOXW3370.imf23bis.bellsouth.net@juan> for ; Tue, 29 Oct 2002 17:30:34 -0500 Message-ID: <002c01c27f9a$8d5e3dd0$af78fea9@juan> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Danger Will Robinson...KABL...Alert, Alert Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2002 17:28:48 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Kevin, what were the Magnavox stations on your list ? Also, does anybody have an aircheck of any of these stations ? Juan ----- Original Message ----- From: Kevin T. To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, October 29, 2002 5:25 PM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Danger Will Robinson...KABL...Alert, Alert > CQUAM does have a "richer" sound when you have a nice strong > signal. Where Kahn shines is when you have a weak, selective fading > signal. The Harris system sounded great too. I have never heard a > Magnavox station on the air, so I can't say much about them. The main advantage of C-Quam is that it has benefitted from two decades of use an improvement, especially with the newer MC13022 and MC13028 decoders introduced in the early to mid 1990s. On a properly designed receiver, the audio quality of C-Quam is now about as good as you could ever expect AM Stereo to be; the signal that today's C-Quam AM Stereo transmitters put out have no trouble meeting or exceeding the audio quality standards of FM Stereo. Kahn AM Stereo still has an advantage in the reception of weak, unstable signals -- but, at this point, it is early 1980s technology, and since there is no commercial interest in its use anymore, it will remain as such. Kahn's "Power-Side" system is still based on a fully functional Kahn AM Stereo exciter, with a switch right on the front panel to flip between Power-Side and so-called "Normal Stereo" modes. At this point, the FCC probably isn't going to care if a station flips it into Kahn Stereo mode, at least until it comes time for a station equipment inspection, but C-Quam remains the only approved system for broadcasting AM Stereo in most of the world. The Harris system was a very sophisticated system, but that was both its main advantage and disadvantage; in ideal conditions, it worked *beautifully*, but the receiver design proved to be overly complex, and as far as I know, no "multi-system" AM Stereo radios ever supported the Harris system properly. Magnavox was a very simplistic system for AM Stereo, and in real world use, its performance would have been comparable to that of C-Quam, except compatibility with regular mono radios wouldn't be quite as perfect. I know of only a handful of stations that ever broadcast Magnavox AM Stereo; one 1985 list I have only shows six Magnavox AM Stereo stations in the entire country. Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ADVERTISEMENT Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From jsgil@hal-pc.org Tue Oct 29 16:25:17 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 30 Oct 2002 00:25:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 63024 invoked from network); 30 Oct 2002 00:25:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Oct 2002 00:25:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.70) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Oct 2002 00:25:14 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.145] by n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Oct 2002 00:25:14 -0000 Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 00:25:12 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Danger Will Robinson...KABL...Alert, Alert Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 1876 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.137 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Possum Hunter" wrote: > Kevin - Mesa, Arizona wrote: > > Kahn sounds good. Good as FM. Still I prefer C-QUAM and the way it sounds. >=20 > CQUAM does have a "richer" sound when you have a nice strong signal. Where > Kahn shines is when you have a weak, selective fading signal.=20 Kahn always preforms better on skywave reception. This is because the 2 channels are separated by frequency and not phase. All of the other systems require phase linear reception within the passband. For both QuAM and C-QuAM both Left & Right signals are in both=20 sidebands and are separated by phase vectors that you can not recover by using either the USB or LSB alone as they will appear as a sum or difference depending on the detection angle of the SSB. It is only when the 2 sidebands are combined that the 2 channels will appear 90=B0 away reom each other. Any differential delay between the sidebands will compromise separation. With ISB even if the PLL is=20 locked but off phase, separation is not compromised but there will be a phase shift difference between the channels. Under extreme phase error like 90=B0 the L+R component in both channels will be 180=B0 out of phase and will null out in the listening environment while the L-R component will be in phase. This is also why a Kahn system sounds bad when listen to on a surround sound system under marginal conditions. It is possible to do an ISB version of C-QuAM by inserting a matrix processor just before the exciter that does a 90=B0 audio phase shift upon L-R. An ISB version of C-QuAM also reduces the problems=20 associated with heavy single channel modulation approaching 75%. In an ISB mode this problem would not show up until about 95%. This was the other advantage of Kahn ISB. It preformed better than all of the other systems under heavy single channel modulation. JSG=20 From evergreenterrace@buzzle.com Tue Oct 29 18:21:46 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: evergreenterrace@buzzle.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 30 Oct 2002 02:21:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 48509 invoked from network); 30 Oct 2002 02:21:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Oct 2002 02:21:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.69) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Oct 2002 02:21:45 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.136] by n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Oct 2002 02:21:39 -0000 Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 02:21:39 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Help against Dr. Sniffen Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 251 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgliradio" X-Originating-IP: 170.20.11.59 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=69711087 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgliradio There is an anti-AM post on the New York Radio Message Board. Help me fend off the good doctor who doesn't believe Am can sound good. http://www.musicradio77.com/wwwboard The thread started on 11/29 and is called Digital Radio Story in newsday From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Oct 29 19:12:14 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 30 Oct 2002 03:12:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 71399 invoked from network); 30 Oct 2002 03:12:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Oct 2002 03:12:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Oct 2002 03:12:12 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.251] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Oct 2002 03:12:12 -0000 Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 03:12:12 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Magnavox & Harris AM Stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <002c01c27f9a$8d5e3dd0$af78fea9@juan> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3131 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.90.56 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Kevin, what were the Magnavox stations on your list ? Also, does > anybody have an aircheck of any of these stations ? As of June 1985, these were the stations in the USA known to be using the Magnavox AM Stereo system: WOWO Ft. Wayne IN 1190 kHz Magnavox WSKQ Newark NJ 620 kHz Magnavox WLAN Lancaster PA 1390 kHz Magnavox WMSO Collierville TN 640 kHz Magnavox WIVK Knoxville TN 850 kHz Magnavox KTOL Lacey WA 1500 kHz Magnavox For perspective, the entire list this came from had 393 stations in the USA known to be broadcasting in AM Stereo at that time. The most common system was of course C-Quam; in second place, a surprisingly high number of stations using Harris, followed by Kahn in third place and Magnavox last. 1010 CFRB in Toronto was also rumored to have used Magnavox when they first switched on their AM Stereo in 1984, but by some point they were definitely using the C-Quam system. I have not heard a recording of an actual Magnavox AM Stereo station, but the "Alfredo Lite" C-Quam transmitter can be easily modified to transmit what is essentially a Magnavox-type signal (except without the proper Magnavox 5 Hz pilot tone). The only difference to my ears on a Sony multi-system radio is noticeably wider Stereo separation -- more due to the limitations of the "Alfredo Lite" transmitter rather than an inherent characteristic of C-Quam -- and slightly cleaner sound, since the Sony (and Sansui) multi-system radio don't support the "cosine correction" system which is needed for proper C-Quam decoding. I have also only heard one actual recording of a Harris AM Stereo station, 630 KHOW in Denver, and it sounds unusually grundgy and distorted, again because of the lack of proper decoding in the Sony multi-system radio. On a receiver that properly supported it, Harris was supposed to deliver the absolute best sound quality of any AM Stereo system, but especially with the very strange "sliding pilot tone"(!) version of the Harris system, the proper decoder design was way too complex to be practical for mass production. They switched to a fixed pilot tone of 55 Hz for a while, but that still wasn't enough to attract the design of true Harris AM Stereo receivers, so they eventually "gave up" and switched the pilot tone down to 25 Hz, which gave it a crude form of compatibility with existing C-Quam receivers, at the expense of noticeably increased distortion. Harris abandoned their own system by late 1984, in favor of producing the excellent Harris-brand C-Quam exciters that many stations are using today, but enough stations stuck on with the original Harris system exciters that by the time of the FCC decision in 1992, there were actually more stations still using Harris than Kahn. The FCC even extended the amount of time after the C-Quam standard decision that stations could continue to use the Harris system, so a station could legally transmit in Harris AM Stereo well into the mid-1990s. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Oct 29 21:47:06 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 30 Oct 2002 05:47:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 76667 invoked from network); 30 Oct 2002 05:47:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Oct 2002 05:47:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.67) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Oct 2002 05:47:05 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.170] by n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Oct 2002 05:47:05 -0000 Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 05:47:02 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: New IBOC station in NJ -- 1700 WI2XAM Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3685 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.90.56 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics Today I happened to tune in 1700 kHz on my car radio, and I was surprised to hear rock music being played! At first, I thought it was an unlicensed station somebody had set up in that particular neighborhood, but the signal carried on for a good while, and I caught the ID between songs: "WI2XAM, Warren, NJ". WI2XAM is an FCC-licensed "experimental" station, transmitting from the Lucent offices in Warren, NJ (the town in which I live) with 50 watts from what is claimed to be a 35-foot antenna. Its purpose is to test the IBOC digital system, and it is licensed for both daytime and nighttime broadcasting (both at the full 50 watts). And despite the daytime-only approval of IBOC, today WI2XAM was on the air for at least an hour after sunset, enough to splatter all over normally-strong skywave reception of WPTX 1690 AM Stereo from Maryland, and WI2XAM's digital sidebands even extend out enough to cause noticeable background hiss in the reception of local WTTM 1680 AM Stereo! First of all, you can hear a bit of what WI2XAM's test broadcast sounded like today -- with the muffled low-fi sound characteristic of IBOC's < 5 kHz analog audio limit -- as heard at my home during the daytime, roughly 5 miles away from the transmitter: http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/wi2xam.mp3 In addition to transmitting IBOC after sunset, two things about WI2XAM's signal cause concern for me: the splatter onto WTTM 1680, and the significant overlap with co-channel 10-watt TIS weather info station WPSH468, also on 1700 kHz, nearby in Manville, NJ. This map illustrates both situations: http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/wi2xam.gif Within the 0.5 mV/m signal contour, illustrated by the purple line in WTTM's case, licensed AM stations are supposed to have "interference- free" coverage -- referring to interference from other AM stations, not electrical interference from noisy power lines and such. So, theoretically, within the purple boundary, there should be no other stations whose signal(s) interfere with 1680 WTTM... and yet, there is WI2XAM in Warren, whose IBOC digital signal sidebands extend down to 1685 kHz -- splatting onto the upper half of WTTM's audio bandwidth within the black boundary I guestimated (based on my own observation of their signal coverage). So, Neal, if you have some time, you might have a word with both Lucent and the FCC about this... WI2XAM may be able to escape the rules because they are an "Experimental" station, but if that's the case, then what would stop them from transmitting right on 1680 kHz? There has to be *some* protection afforded to legitimately licensed stations... and that also brings up the issue of WI2XAM's large signal coverage overlap with a nearby 10-watt "Travelers' Information Service" (TIS) station, WPSH468, on 1700 kHz in Manville, NJ. In the overlapped area I drew on the map, the signals of these two stations is indeed about a 50/50 mix... and even outside of the blue line, WPSH468 is still audible in the background of WI2XAM's signal, as you can hear from the MP3 recording above. I don't know if TIS and Experimental stations are afforded any protection against each other's signals, but for two *FCC-licensed* stations, I find this signal overlap to be unacceptable, and it surely must be negatively affecting whatever tests Lucent may be doing with WI2XAM's IBOC signal. And in any event, WI2XAM's muddy, hissy, splattery IBOC audio simply cannot compare to Warren, NJ's first AM radio station, my own "KJFE" on 1500 kHz in C-Quam AM STEREO, as you can hear from this recording: ftp://209.193.86.116/North-America/USA/NewJersey/1500kjfe.mp3 From evergreenterrace@buzzle.com Tue Oct 29 22:18:06 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: evergreenterrace@buzzle.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 30 Oct 2002 06:18:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 10795 invoked from network); 30 Oct 2002 06:18:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Oct 2002 06:18:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.69) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Oct 2002 06:18:04 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.131] by n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Oct 2002 06:18:04 -0000 Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 06:18:04 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: 1700 WI2XAM... Neal Newman? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1722 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgliradio" X-Originating-IP: 151.204.159.85 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=69711087 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgliradio --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin T." wrote: > > WI2XAM is an FCC-licensed "experimental" station, transmitting from > the Lucent offices in Warren, NJ (the town in which I live) with > 50 watts from what is claimed to be a 35-foot antenna. Its purpose > is to test the IBOC digital system, and it is licensed for both > daytime and nighttime broadcasting (both at the full 50 watts). This is funny. This station serves no purpose. It's no "real" world test of anything. 50 watts? How about testing IBOC on WQEW or WLIM or some station in the 1300-1600 portion of the band that's crammed in with other locals. (WNYG would be a good test at 1440 with WNSW next door) This is crazy. >WI2XAM's digital sidebands even extend out enough to > cause noticeable background hiss in the reception of local WTTM 1680 > AM Stereo > > Within the 0.5 mV/m signal contour, illustrated by the purple line in > WTTM's case, licensed AM stations are supposed to have "interference- > free" coverage -- referring to interference from other AM stations, > not electrical interference from noisy power lines and such. So, > theoretically, within the purple boundary, there should be no other > stations whose signal(s) interfere with 1680 WTTM... and yet, there > is WI2XAM in Warren, whose IBOC digital signal sidebands extend down > to 1685 kHz -- splatting onto the upper half of WTTM's audio > bandwidth within the black boundary I guestimated (based on my own > observation of their signal coverage). This is bull and I hope Neal gets them! The FCC has brass balls sometimes! Neal, you should pull the NRSC mask and really do wideband AM to shove it down everyone's throat :-) From groucho@skyweb.net Wed Oct 30 07:38:21 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 30 Oct 2002 15:38:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 88840 invoked from network); 30 Oct 2002 15:38:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Oct 2002 15:38:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Oct 2002 15:38:20 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g9UFf1RQ084728 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 2002 10:41:02 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DBFFCD3.4B213493@skyweb.net> Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 10:37:56 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: 1700 WI2XAM... Neal Newman? References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Don't Worry Guys.. as a matter Of fact.. I know One of the HD radio Test techs.. last night he told me the station was on the air on 1700... but when I tuned in I heard only the manville TIS station with NOAA Weather. Today I will take a drive up to Warren and see how bad it really is.. If its really splattering onto 1680 up there.. I will take a friendly drive To the Lucent Office.. If they Don't comply. the FCC is the Next step.. I'm not one to panic Unless I am getting slammed by this 50 watt blowtorch. Because is 50 watts is no test. Russ is Correct. they should Use either WNSW or WNYG as test stations... I'll get back to you guys on this Later after My drive. Neal wgliradio wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin T." wrote: > > > > > WI2XAM is an FCC-licensed "experimental" station, transmitting > from > > the Lucent offices in Warren, NJ (the town in which I live) with > > 50 watts from what is claimed to be a 35-foot antenna. Its > purpose > > is to test the IBOC digital system, and it is licensed for both > > daytime and nighttime broadcasting (both at the full 50 watts). > > This is funny. This station serves no purpose. It's no "real" > world test of anything. 50 watts? How about testing IBOC on WQEW > or WLIM or some station in the 1300-1600 portion of the band that's > crammed in with other locals. (WNYG would be a good test at 1440 > with WNSW next door) This is crazy. > > >WI2XAM's digital sidebands even extend out enough to > > cause noticeable background hiss in the reception of local WTTM > 1680 > > AM Stereo > > > > Within the 0.5 mV/m signal contour, illustrated by the purple line > in > > WTTM's case, licensed AM stations are supposed to > have "interference- > > free" coverage -- referring to interference from other AM > stations, > > not electrical interference from noisy power lines and such. So, > > theoretically, within the purple boundary, there should be no > other > > stations whose signal(s) interfere with 1680 WTTM... and yet, > there > > is WI2XAM in Warren, whose IBOC digital signal sidebands extend > down > > to 1685 kHz -- splatting onto the upper half of WTTM's audio > > bandwidth within the black boundary I guestimated (based on my own > > observation of their signal coverage). > > This is bull and I hope Neal gets them! The FCC has brass balls > sometimes! > > Neal, you should pull the NRSC mask and really do wideband AM to > shove it down everyone's throat :-) > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From kevtronics@yahoo.com Wed Oct 30 09:21:56 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 30 Oct 2002 17:21:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 42276 invoked from network); 30 Oct 2002 17:21:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Oct 2002 17:21:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.66) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Oct 2002 17:21:52 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.169] by n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Oct 2002 17:21:52 -0000 Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 17:21:51 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Delco AMAX Stereo radio on eBay Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 444 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics Here is the revised version of the legendary Delco "UX-1" radio, featuring Expanded Band tuning and AMAX hi-fi AM Stereo sound with noise reduction and automatic bandwidth control. If you have a GM car with the standard dashboard opening, this is the radio to get -- also fits in many Chrysler Corp. cars with a wiring adapter. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1871379928 Current bid price is $14.99 with 4 days left. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Wed Oct 30 09:28:43 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 30 Oct 2002 17:28:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 29715 invoked from network); 30 Oct 2002 17:28:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Oct 2002 17:28:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Oct 2002 17:28:43 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.160] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Oct 2002 17:28:42 -0000 Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 17:28:42 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: 1700 WI2XAM... Neal Newman? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3DBFFCD3.4B213493@skyweb.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1174 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Today I will take a drive up to Warren and see how bad it really > is.. If its really splattering onto 1680 up there.. I will take a > friendly drive To the Lucent Office.. If they Don't comply. the FCC > is the Next step.. I'm not one to panic Unless I am getting slammed > by this 50 watt blowtorch. Because is 50 watts is no test. At least on my drive to work this morning, WI2XAM was not on the air. Lucent will probably not be broadcasting it full-time, but I will still check from time to time to see if it's on the air. I believe they also have a corresponding "experimental" FM station licensed for IBOC testing, which I have yet to check out to see if it has been doing any "test" broadcasts recently. Yes, 50 watts into a 35-foot antenna is nothing spectacular, but for local listeners in Warren, Bernards Twp., and Bridgewater, it may cause a noticeable amount of "hash" on 1680 and 1690 kHz. When WI2XAM is on the air at night, it will especially kill reception of WPTX 1690 AM Stereo from Maryland, as well as DX of WEUP 1700 AM Stereo from Alabama (and also some Spanish religious station which I have heard on 1700 at night but couldn't ID). From camenning@charter.net Wed Oct 30 10:51:23 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: camenning@charter.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 30 Oct 2002 18:51:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 64560 invoked from network); 30 Oct 2002 18:50:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Oct 2002 18:50:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Oct 2002 18:50:44 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.134] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Oct 2002 18:50:43 -0000 Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 18:50:42 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Fwd: Symphony Digital Radio Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1047 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "craigm55901" X-Originating-IP: 68.115.99.51 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=91639946 X-Yahoo-Profile: craigm55901 --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin T." wrote: > > Their .mp3 audio examples sound really bad, both analog and > > "digital". The "digital" has less static hash, but sounds clipped > > and distorted. And both have no low end frequency response > > whatsoever. > > Indeed, the lack of quality of their demo recordings is really quite > astonishing to listen to. I don't know how they got it to sound that > bad, even in "analog" mode, short of some really wacky audio > production. Neither example sounds like a legitimate recording of > FM radio, either -- and despite the claim of increased Stereo > separation, there is absolutely none to be heard in their examples! > Note: the web page indicates the samples were taken while an adjacent channel signal of equal level was present. I think is was meant to show an audio improvement, and not show the best than can be done. As an improvement, I think it did work. What remains to be seen is how well it will do in a production radio in the real world. Craig From meridian3891@cs.com Wed Oct 30 11:27:36 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: meridian3891@cs.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 30 Oct 2002 19:27:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 53137 invoked from network); 30 Oct 2002 19:27:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Oct 2002 19:27:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Oct 2002 19:27:35 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.133] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Oct 2002 19:27:35 -0000 Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 19:27:33 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: 1700 WI2XAM... Neal Newman? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1425 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Tony" X-Originating-IP: 205.166.36.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=48487815 X-Yahoo-Profile: onemeridian These stations with the "experimental" status are usually not on for any long periods of time; a few weeks at most. Tony --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin T." wrote: > > Today I will take a drive up to Warren and see how bad it really > > is.. If its really splattering onto 1680 up there.. I will take a > > friendly drive To the Lucent Office.. If they Don't comply. the FCC > > is the Next step.. I'm not one to panic Unless I am getting slammed > > by this 50 watt blowtorch. Because is 50 watts is no test. > > At least on my drive to work this morning, WI2XAM was not on the > air. Lucent will probably not be broadcasting it full-time, but I > will still check from time to time to see if it's on the air. I > believe they also have a corresponding "experimental" FM station > licensed for IBOC testing, which I have yet to check out to see if > it has been doing any "test" broadcasts recently. > > Yes, 50 watts into a 35-foot antenna is nothing spectacular, but for > local listeners in Warren, Bernards Twp., and Bridgewater, it may > cause a noticeable amount of "hash" on 1680 and 1690 kHz. When > WI2XAM is on the air at night, it will especially kill reception > of WPTX 1690 AM Stereo from Maryland, as well as DX of WEUP 1700 > AM Stereo from Alabama (and also some Spanish religious station > which I have heard on 1700 at night but couldn't ID). From meridian3891@cs.com Wed Oct 30 11:37:20 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: meridian3891@cs.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 30 Oct 2002 19:37:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 71479 invoked from network); 30 Oct 2002 19:37:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Oct 2002 19:37:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Oct 2002 19:37:19 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.248] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Oct 2002 19:37:19 -0000 Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 19:37:19 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: 1710 kHz (semi-on-topic) Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 655 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Tony" X-Originating-IP: 205.166.36.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=48487815 X-Yahoo-Profile: onemeridian I have been hearing a station on 1710 kHz which has been there since last year or so. It consists of Jewish music, talk about the Torah, & commentary in English & Hebrew (maybe Yiddish too?). I am able to pick it up MUCH better with the Radio Shack AM Loop antenna & DX-396 (grab it if you see it--$29.97!). Anybody hearing this or know anything about it? I know 1710 kHz is NOT used by broadcast stations, & have tried to look this up, only to find that they are broadcasting from Queens, Brooklyn, or Staten Island.......Any ideas or information? Tony P.S. I do not believe this station is broadcasting in stereo. ;-( From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Oct 30 12:18:00 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 30 Oct 2002 20:18:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 10840 invoked from network); 30 Oct 2002 20:17:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Oct 2002 20:17:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.95) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Oct 2002 20:17:59 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 30 Oct 2002 12:17:59 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} New IBOC station in NJ -- 1700 WI2XAM Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 15:17:22 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 30 Oct 2002 20:17:59.0713 (UTC) FILETIME=[710C4110:01C28051] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.151.229.31] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Kevin T. wrote: > First of all, you can hear a bit of what WI2XAM's test broadcast sounded like today -- with the muffled low-fi sound characteristic of IBOC's < 5 kHz analog audio limit Man alive that sounds BAD! If I ever left an AM station sounding that bad, the owner and/or GM would put my head up on a pike out in front of the tower! In fact, the kid next door has a little Radio Shack toy part 15 transmitter that sounds better than the IBOC station! It will be a sad day that when you want to hear Hi-Fi radio, you will have to listen to a pirate station.....or the kid next door playing his walkman CD deck over a Radio Shack toy! I guess I can't say much. I am Playing CDs over my RCA BTA1R blasting away into a dummy load (And making more stray RF than that kid could do on his best day) LOL I thought I heard something on 1700 last night, I will give it a closer listen this evening. > > Within the 0.5 mV/m signal contour, illustrated by the purple line in WTTM's case, licensed AM stations are supposed to have "interference-free" coverage -- referring to interference from other AM stations, Yea, I bet WTTM is REAL happy about that! The FCC said to the broadcasters "Y'all put in a STEREO studio, and new 10,000 watt transmitter with a CQUAM encoder and move to this part of the AM band where 90% of the radios can't pick up your signal, and we will protect your signal from interference for 600 miles." If memory serves me right, WTTM was the very first X-Band station on the air. Have you contacted their engineering staff? I am sure they would LOVE to have a tape of their signal being hammered by the IBOC station as ammo. I would also say the guys over at WPTX would want a tape too! I know when SCDOT stuck a TIS station on 1610 in the primary coverage area of WFIS 1600 about 11 years ago, Both the owner and I called everybody from the FCC to the DOT and the SCAB. After us calling and griping about that TIS (and it being mysteriously turned off several times a day), The SCDOT got the hint and replaced it with a TIS on 550 KHZ! > >I don't know if TIS and Experimental stations are afforded any protection against each other's signals, They are not, nor is a commercial Class D station protected while running Post Sunset Authority low power, but they MUST protect a commercial station running full legal power! I mean gee, I know I sure spent enough time getting the AMs I took care of within the NRSC splatter standards. If IBOC requires that much band width, many stations are going to be replacing antenna farms because they just don't have the kind of bandwidth needed. > > And in any event, WI2XAM's muddy, hissy, splattery IBOC audio simply cannot compare to Warren, NJ's first AM radio station, my own "KJFE" on 1500 kHz in C-Quam AM STEREO Hey, that thing sounds GOOD on the air! Long live FREE RADIO! Death to the NAB! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From groucho@skyweb.net Wed Oct 30 12:41:06 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 30 Oct 2002 20:41:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 30018 invoked from network); 30 Oct 2002 20:41:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Oct 2002 20:41:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Oct 2002 20:41:05 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g9UKhiRQ012886 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 2002 15:43:46 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DC043C6.91736501@skyweb.net> Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 15:40:38 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} 1710 kHz (semi-on-topic) References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Hello Tony I did a concert a few weeks ago in Jersey City... and I had reported to this group that I had also Heard this station.... Interesting enough that the NY Field office has done nothing about It.... I believe that its a local jewish group running into a Very short antenna.. somewhere in williamsburg brooklyn ,NY... the signal was fairly strong near the williamsburg bridge when I was out that way 2 weeks ago.. Neal Tony wrote: > I have been hearing a station on 1710 kHz which has been there since > last year or so. It consists of Jewish music, talk about the Torah, > & commentary in English & Hebrew (maybe Yiddish too?). I am able to > pick it up MUCH better with the Radio Shack AM Loop antenna & DX-396 > (grab it if you see it--$29.97!). > > Anybody hearing this or know anything about it? I know 1710 kHz is > NOT used by broadcast stations, & have tried to look this up, only to > find that they are broadcasting from Queens, Brooklyn, or Staten > Island.......Any ideas or information? > > Tony > > P.S. I do not believe this station is broadcasting in stereo. ;-( > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From meridian3891@cs.com Wed Oct 30 13:52:53 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: meridian3891@cs.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 30 Oct 2002 21:52:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 9418 invoked from network); 30 Oct 2002 21:52:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Oct 2002 21:52:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.88) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Oct 2002 21:52:52 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.248] by n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Oct 2002 21:52:52 -0000 Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 21:52:49 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} 1710 kHz (semi-on-topic) Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3DC043C6.91736501@skyweb.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1891 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Tony" X-Originating-IP: 205.166.36.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=48487815 X-Yahoo-Profile: onemeridian I thought it was mentioned in this group, but have been hearing it on since last winter (late 2001), & have heard it on even at 7:30 in the morning as well. I do not know Hebrew or Yiddish (& cannot even discern the difference), so I do not know if they are announcing any method of contact. MW pirates are few & far between, even more now that the expanded band stations have signed on! I'll keep an ear out for any contact information. Tony --- In amstereoforum@y..., Neal Newman wrote: > Hello Tony > I did a concert a few weeks ago in Jersey City... and I had reported to this > group that I had also Heard this station.... Interesting enough that the NY > Field office has done nothing about It.... I believe that its a local jewish > group running into a Very short antenna.. somewhere in williamsburg brooklyn > ,NY... > the signal was fairly strong near the williamsburg bridge when I was out > that way 2 weeks ago.. > Neal > > Tony wrote: > > > I have been hearing a station on 1710 kHz which has been there since > > last year or so. It consists of Jewish music, talk about the Torah, > > & commentary in English & Hebrew (maybe Yiddish too?). I am able to > > pick it up MUCH better with the Radio Shack AM Loop antenna & DX- 396 > > (grab it if you see it--$29.97!). > > > > Anybody hearing this or know anything about it? I know 1710 kHz is > > NOT used by broadcast stations, & have tried to look this up, only to > > find that they are broadcasting from Queens, Brooklyn, or Staten > > Island.......Any ideas or information? > > > > Tony > > > > P.S. I do not believe this station is broadcasting in stereo. ;-( > > > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From florida_amstereo@hotmail.com Wed Oct 30 14:30:09 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: florida_amstereo@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 30 Oct 2002 22:30:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 96058 invoked from network); 30 Oct 2002 22:30:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Oct 2002 22:30:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.37.184) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Oct 2002 22:30:08 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 30 Oct 2002 14:30:08 -0800 Received: from 209.240.198.61 by pv2fd.pav2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Wed, 30 Oct 2002 22:30:07 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: 1700 WI2XAM... Neal Newman? Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 22:30:07 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 30 Oct 2002 22:30:08.0558 (UTC) FILETIME=[E701FCE0:01C28063] From: "Donn Tillman" X-Originating-IP: [209.240.198.61] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83914824 Kevin Tekel, wrote ( in part): >and also some Spanish religious station which I have heard on 1700 at night but couldn't ID). That is most likely Spanish religious station, WJCC, out of Miami Springs, Fl and I have serious doubts about them powering down to 1000 watts at night, as I receive them here in St Petersburg better at night than the 1660 from Marco Island and the 1680 WTIR Winter Garden/Orlando and both Orlando and Marco Island are closer than Miami/Dade/ donn st petersburg,fl usa _________________________________________________________________ Get a speedy connection with MSN Broadband.  Join now! http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/freeactivation.asp From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Oct 30 16:12:18 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 31 Oct 2002 00:12:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 21713 invoked from network); 31 Oct 2002 00:12:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Oct 2002 00:12:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.122) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Oct 2002 00:12:18 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 30 Oct 2002 16:12:18 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: 1700 WI2XAM... Neal Newman? Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 19:12:04 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 31 Oct 2002 00:12:18.0288 (UTC) FILETIME=[2C9C8F00:01C28072] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.153.108.26] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Donn Tillman wrote: > That is most likely Spanish religious station, WJCC, out of Miami Springs, Fl and I have serious doubts about them powering down to 1000 watts at night They are not the only station that doesn't power down when they should. I know for fact that WPJM 800 does not power down to 438 watts at night like they should. Sometimes WLBG 860 does not power down to 12 watts either! I checked the X-band just a while ago and I heard WEUV Black Gospel with WJCC Spanish and KBGG Talk under it on 1700. I am in Greenville County, SC > > I receive them here in St Petersburg better at night than the 1660 from Marco Island and the 1680 WTIR Winter Garden/Orlando and both Orlando and Marco Island are closer than Miami/Dade/ By far, WTIR is the strongest X-Bander on the dial here tonight. KCJJ used to come in here like gangbusters, but now you can't hear either KCJJ or WTEL :-( Long live FREE RADIO! Death to the NAB! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From n0uiheric@aol.com Wed Oct 30 17:25:25 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 31 Oct 2002 01:25:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 72648 invoked from network); 31 Oct 2002 01:25:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Oct 2002 01:25:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m07.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.162) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Oct 2002 01:25:22 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-m07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.1a2.b039c72 (16633) for ; Wed, 30 Oct 2002 20:25:17 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1a2.b039c72.2af1e07c@aol.com> Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 20:25:16 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Digital vs. analog To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih The radio stations may want DIGITAL, but the people DO NOT. Keep AM and FM ANALOG ONLY! 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Wed Oct 30 17:25:25 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 31 Oct 2002 01:25:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 66534 invoked from network); 31 Oct 2002 01:25:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Oct 2002 01:25:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m08.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.163) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Oct 2002 01:25:23 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-m08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.9d.305dc518 (16633) for ; Wed, 30 Oct 2002 20:25:17 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <9d.305dc518.2af1e07d@aol.com> Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 20:25:17 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} (unknown) To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih With IBOC, you HAVE to buy a new radio. Let me repeat: IBOC IS INCOMPATIBLE WITH YOUR CURRENT ANALOG RECEIVERS! Go to http://www.digitaldisaster.org/ 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Oct 30 19:46:36 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 31 Oct 2002 03:46:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 33564 invoked from network); 31 Oct 2002 03:46:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Oct 2002 03:46:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.93) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Oct 2002 03:46:34 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 30 Oct 2002 19:46:34 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: 1700 WI2XAM... Neal Newman? Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 22:46:20 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 31 Oct 2002 03:46:34.0444 (UTC) FILETIME=[1B7A48C0:01C28090] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.153.108.26] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 wgliradio wrote: > How about testing IBOC on WQEW or WLIM or some station in the 1300-1600 portion of the band that's crammed in with other locals. (WNYG would be a good test at 1440 with WNSW next door) This is crazy. Perhaps those stations don't want to screw up their audio with IBOC! > > Neal, you should pull the NRSC mask and really do wideband AM to shove it down everyone's throat :-) Back in the "Good Ole Days" WLW 700 was certified by Mcintosh Laboratories to have frequency response from 20Hz to 20,000Hz. My antique RCA BTA1R is good out to 16,000Hz. Go ahead Neal, Show 'em what REAL Hi-Fi AM sounds like! Long live FREE RADIO! Death to the NAB! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From groucho@skyweb.net Wed Oct 30 20:03:13 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 31 Oct 2002 04:03:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 71114 invoked from network); 31 Oct 2002 04:03:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Oct 2002 04:03:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Oct 2002 04:03:11 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g9V45sk1050421 for ; Wed, 30 Oct 2002 23:05:54 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DC0AB62.66B6C8D9@skyweb.net> Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 23:02:42 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: 1700 WI2XAM... Neal Newman? References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 well to start with I am not running the standard 8kc audio feed... I am running a Full 15kc broadcast feed... so My audio to my transmitter is good from 20hz all the way to 15k In Full blown stereo I dont believe it can Get any Better than that..... SO Possum what are you Going to do with that RCA BTA1R of yours? you have a manual for it? Tonight I bought myself an RCA BTA-500R..... Yes Guys I bought the Old WERA backup transmitter from Jim Hawkins.... It will soon have a New home in NJ...Now I need to find a replacement IL303 choke. since the one in the transmitter is burnt up.. otherwise I will have to Rewind myself a New choke... My Next project is to drive to Indiana to Pickup an Old Gates BC-1H anyone have a Flat trailer I could Borrow? I'm still waiting for the details on the Gates... Neal Possum Hunter wrote: > wgliradio wrote: > > How about testing IBOC on WQEW or WLIM or some station in the 1300-1600 > portion of the band that's crammed in with other locals. (WNYG would be a > good test at 1440 with WNSW next door) This is crazy. > > Perhaps those stations don't want to screw up their audio with IBOC! > > > > Neal, you should pull the NRSC mask and really do wideband AM to shove it > down everyone's throat :-) > > Back in the "Good Ole Days" WLW 700 was certified by Mcintosh Laboratories > to have frequency response from 20Hz to 20,000Hz. > My antique RCA BTA1R is good out to 16,000Hz. > Go ahead Neal, Show 'em what REAL Hi-Fi AM sounds like! > > Long live FREE RADIO! > Death to the NAB! > > Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ > Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From kevtronics@yahoo.com Wed Oct 30 20:41:41 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 31 Oct 2002 04:41:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 48645 invoked from network); 31 Oct 2002 04:41:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Oct 2002 04:41:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.68) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Oct 2002 04:41:40 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.133] by n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Oct 2002 04:41:40 -0000 Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 04:41:37 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: 1700 WI2XAM... Neal Newman? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3DC0AB62.66B6C8D9@skyweb.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1710 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.93.15 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Tonight I bought myself an RCA BTA-500R..... Yes Guys I bought the > Old WERA backup transmitter from Jim Hawkins.... It will soon > have a New home in NJ... Heh... I suggest you tune it to 1700 kHz, put it in the back of a pickup truck and drive to the parking lot of the Lucent offices in Warren, and crank it up to blast away their 'testing' of WI2XAM with your own superior analog signal! Seriously, are you going to tune it to 1680 kHz and use it as a backup for WTTM? You could even hook up the C-Quam exciter to it and do something 1590 WERA only dreamed of -- broadcasting in AM Stereo! This is 100% true: throughout the late 1980s, WERA proudly announced themselves as "1590 AM *STEREO*" on the air, all the time -- yet, they NEVER broadcast in Stereo, and NEVER had a single piece of Stereo equipment in use at the station! It was only a pipe-dream, and a way of getting listeners to think, "Wow, WERA is in AM STEREO! I don't have an AM Stereo radio, but I'm sure this makes them sound better than the other AM stations anyway!" I fell victim to that myself... for years, one of my goals was to get my hands on an actual AM Stereo radio, just so I could finally hear WERA in STEREO... then, when I actually did in 1995, I found WERA to be a plain mono station, with no Stereo in sight. However, I also heard about the fact that Kahn stations had to either drop Stereo or switch to C-Quam, so I assumed that WERA was a Kahn station and simply shut it off. But, the engineer who worked at WERA at the time told me they NEVER actually broadcast in Stereo. The station was run on a shoe-string budget, with ailing 1960s equipment, so they could never afford it anyway. From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Oct 30 21:31:13 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 31 Oct 2002 05:31:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 45722 invoked from network); 31 Oct 2002 05:31:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Oct 2002 05:31:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.207) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Oct 2002 05:31:11 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 30 Oct 2002 21:31:11 -0800 To: References: <3DC0AB62.66B6C8D9@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: 1700 WI2XAM... Neal Newman? Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 00:30:56 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 31 Oct 2002 05:31:11.0843 (UTC) FILETIME=[B9195B30:01C2809E] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.153.108.26] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Neal Newman wrote: >My audio to my transmitter is good from 20hz all the way to 15k In Full blown stereo That is as good as she gets! > > SO Possum what are you Going to do with that RCA BTA1R of yours? Well, I got the old beast to fix up and re-sell, but in restoring it, I fell in love with her. I decided transmit to my antique radios with it, so I just run it in the Low Power mode at 250 Watts into a dummy load. Due to my being in the beam of WGVL 1440, I re-tuned the transmitter from 1450 to 1620. I am working on putting a 1000 watt daytimer on the air. If that comes to pass, you KNOW what that BTA1R will be doing! LOL > > you have a manual for it? Yes, if you need it, I will post it to the files section of the Amradiodx group. > >Tonight I bought myself an RCA BTA-500R... Oh, you will LOVE it! Those are SWEET sounding transmitters. > >Now I need to find a replacement IL303 choke. Peter Dahl http://www.pwdahl.com/ should be able to fix you up. > >My Next project is to drive to Indiana to Pickup an Old Gates BC-1H Whatcha going to do with the BC-1H? Fire it up on 1680 and show 'em what Plate Modulation is supposed to sound like? Long live FREE RADIO! Death to the NAB! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From KC4QLP@aol.com Wed Oct 30 22:02:00 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 31 Oct 2002 06:01:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 30612 invoked from network); 31 Oct 2002 06:01:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Oct 2002 06:01:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r02.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.98) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Oct 2002 06:01:58 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.91.255e9511 (30950) for ; Thu, 31 Oct 2002 01:01:54 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <91.255e9511.2af22151@aol.com> Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 01:01:53 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: 1700 WI2XAM... Neal Newman? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 10/30/02 11:04:46 PM Eastern Standard Time, groucho@skyweb.net writes: << well to start with I am not running the standard 8kc audio feed... I am running a Full 15kc broadcast feed... so My audio to my transmitter is good from 20hz all the way to 15k In Full blown stereo I dont believe it can Get any Better than that..... SO Possum what are you Going to do with that RCA BTA1R of yours? you have a manual for it? Tonight I bought myself an RCA BTA-500R..... Yes Guys >> Neal I suppose your getting ready to crank out a big signal on 75 meter AM sometime in the future? Bob Carter Operations/Engineering WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5..., Ray Communications Radio Network Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Oct 30 22:17:45 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 31 Oct 2002 06:17:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 16437 invoked from network); 31 Oct 2002 06:17:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Oct 2002 06:17:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.86) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Oct 2002 06:17:44 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 30 Oct 2002 22:17:44 -0800 To: Cc: Subject: Digital Mediumwave Transmitter on Air Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 01:17:29 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 31 Oct 2002 06:17:44.0773 (UTC) FILETIME=[39D0A750:01C280A5] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.153.108.26] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 http://www.telefunken-sendersysteme.de/int/News/news.html Digital Mediumwave Transmitter on Air From Monday 20 Aug. 2001 to Dec. 2001, Sender Freies Berlin (SFB) has broadcast its first FM programme (88,8 MHz) also in digital mode on medium wave frequency 810 kHz. Transmission took place with a 10 kW medium wave transmitter of our TRAM line. The modulation process was realised with an audio encoder of the Fraunhofer Institute and a DRM modulator of TELEFUNKEN. During all this time, the technique worked undisturbed, allowing conclusions on the transmission system's reliability. By the end of 2001, the digital transmission ended as scheduled due to the expiry of the broadcaster's trial licence. As from 21 Aug. 2001, DeutschlandRadio (DLR) broadcasts, regularly, in digital mode too on 855kHz. DeutschlandRadio Berlin uses this frequency alternatively for analog and digital broadcasting of its Berlin programme. For this purpose, a 25 kW transmitter of the TRAM line is operated together with the same DRM technique as used by SFB. Also this equipment works trouble-free, though a greater strain, linked with frequent changes between analog and digital service. From the transmitter site of Deutsche Telekom AG, Burg (Saxony-Anhalt), digital broadcasting is going on since summer 2001. On frequency 531 kHz, a 10 kW transmitter of our TRAM line together with DRM technique of TELEFUNKEN assures a daily 24 hours digital service for the "531 digital" programme. This field trial, organised by the Landesmedienanstalt Saxony-Anhalt, Hit- Radio Brocken and the publisher Mitteldeutsches Druck- und Verlagshaus, is intended first for a two years turn. For the moment, TELEFUNKEN SenderSysteme Berlin AG is, together with its partners, the sole marketer of complete DRM systems, allowing already today a regular broadcast service. In this connection, the technical equipment of Fraunhofer Institut für Integrierte Schaltungen, Deutsche Telekom and TELEFUNKEN SenderSysteme Berlin fulfils the requirements of the DRM standard CM 300/4a. From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Oct 30 22:48:23 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 31 Oct 2002 06:48:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 76448 invoked from network); 31 Oct 2002 06:48:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Oct 2002 06:48:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.83) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Oct 2002 06:48:23 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 30 Oct 2002 22:48:22 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: 1700 WI2XAM... Neal Newman? Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 01:48:07 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 31 Oct 2002 06:48:22.0993 (UTC) FILETIME=[817AC410:01C280A9] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.153.108.26] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Kevin T. wrote: >When WI2XAM is on the air at night, it will especially kill reception of WPTX 1690 AM Stereo from Maryland, as well as DX of WEUP 1700 AM Stereo from Alabama (and also some Spanish religious station which I have heard on 1700 at night but couldn't ID). The Spanish station is WJCC-AM 1700 kHz Miami Springs, Florida. Here is the info on it: http://www.radio-locator.com/cgi-bin/info?call=WJCC&service=AM Long live FREE RADIO! Death to the NAB! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Oct 30 22:53:35 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 31 Oct 2002 06:53:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 81528 invoked from network); 31 Oct 2002 06:53:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Oct 2002 06:53:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.84) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Oct 2002 06:53:34 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 30 Oct 2002 22:53:34 -0800 To: Cc: Subject: New X-Band TIS Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 01:53:19 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 31 Oct 2002 06:53:34.0683 (UTC) FILETIME=[3B42E2B0:01C280AA] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.153.108.26] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 A new TIS just popped on the air near me. It is on 1680 broadcasting WXJ21 NOAA Waether Radio. When I find it, I will let the group know. Long live FREE RADIO! Death to the NAB! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From groucho@skyweb.net Thu Oct 31 01:13:55 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 31 Oct 2002 09:13:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 85121 invoked from network); 31 Oct 2002 09:13:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Oct 2002 09:13:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Oct 2002 09:13:54 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g9V9Gbk1019492 for ; Thu, 31 Oct 2002 04:16:37 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DC0F433.BBD97368@skyweb.net> Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 04:13:23 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: 1700 WI2XAM... Neal Newman? References: <91.255e9511.2af22151@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 actually Going to Tune that baby up On 160 meters.... the present owner tried on 75 But burnt up choke IL303.... I may haveto rewind a New one to get it working.... KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 10/30/02 11:04:46 PM Eastern Standard Time, > groucho@skyweb.net writes: > > << well to start with I am not running the standard 8kc audio feed... > I am running a Full 15kc broadcast feed... so My audio to my transmitter is > good from 20hz all the way to 15k In Full blown stereo I dont believe it can > Get any Better than that..... SO Possum what are you Going to do with that > RCA > BTA1R of yours? you have a manual for it? Tonight I bought myself an RCA > BTA-500R..... Yes Guys >> > > Neal I suppose your getting ready to crank out a big signal on 75 meter AM > sometime in the future? > > Bob Carter > Operations/Engineering > > WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 > Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5..., Ray Communications Radio > Network > > Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering > services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. > e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net > Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC > WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC > WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC > > AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- > amstereo-subcribe@topica.com > > KC4QLP Amateur Radio > Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va > www.kc4qlp.cjb.net > > voice contact-252-335-0856 > fax 1-209-254-8978 > _______________________________________________________ > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Oct 31 07:54:33 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 31 Oct 2002 15:54:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 31770 invoked from network); 31 Oct 2002 15:54:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Oct 2002 15:54:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.78) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Oct 2002 15:54:32 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.190] by n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Oct 2002 15:54:32 -0000 Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 15:54:32 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Halloween update Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 673 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics IBOC test station 1700 WI2XAM is on the air again today, with the same music and observed signal strength. I will drive right past the transmitter site to see how bad the splatter onto 1680 WTTM gets. Meanwhile, keep your ears open for unlicensed 'pirate' stations to pop up out of nowhere today. Halloween, Christmas, and New Year's are the three days of the year that are most popular for 'pirate' stations. Most are small FM stations, such as 91.9 "WCFM" in Elizabeth, NJ that is on the air today, but some quite elaborate AM and shortwave pirates do appear, such as 1620 "WJDI" in Kingston, NY, which in 1996 claimed to have transmitted with 15,000 watts! From meridian3891@cs.com Thu Oct 31 08:19:16 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: meridian3891@cs.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 31 Oct 2002 16:19:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 76254 invoked from network); 31 Oct 2002 16:19:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Oct 2002 16:19:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.89) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Oct 2002 16:19:15 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.130] by n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Oct 2002 16:19:15 -0000 Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 16:19:15 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Halloween update Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 862 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Tony" X-Originating-IP: 205.166.36.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=48487815 X-Yahoo-Profile: onemeridian Another place to search is on 6925--6955 kHz shortwave, where there are PLENTY!! Tony --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin T." wrote: > IBOC test station 1700 WI2XAM is on the air again today, with the > same music and observed signal strength. I will drive right past the > transmitter site to see how bad the splatter onto 1680 WTTM gets. > > Meanwhile, keep your ears open for unlicensed 'pirate' stations to > pop up out of nowhere today. Halloween, Christmas, and New Year's > are the three days of the year that are most popular for 'pirate' > stations. Most are small FM stations, such as 91.9 "WCFM" in > Elizabeth, NJ that is on the air today, but some quite elaborate AM > and shortwave pirates do appear, such as 1620 "WJDI" in Kingston, NY, > which in 1996 claimed to have transmitted with 15,000 watts! From penry@nortelnetworks.com Thu Oct 31 09:43:37 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: penry@nortelnetworks.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 31 Oct 2002 17:43:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 8140 invoked from network); 31 Oct 2002 17:43:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Oct 2002 17:43:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com) (47.103.122.112) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Oct 2002 17:43:36 -0000 Received: from zrc2c011.us.nortel.com (zrc2c011.us.nortel.com [47.103.120.51]) by zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id g9VHhmI03939 for ; Thu, 31 Oct 2002 11:43:48 -0600 (CST) Received: by zrc2c011.us.nortel.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Thu, 31 Oct 2002 11:43:34 -0600 Message-ID: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A5607974045358BE@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: {AMSF} (unknown) Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 11:43:34 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) From: "Charles Penry" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=376233 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa5vhu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Troll? -----Original Message----- From: n0uiheric@aol.com [mailto:n0uiheric@aol.com] Sent: Wednesday, October 30, 2002 7:25 PM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} (unknown) With IBOC, you HAVE to buy a new radio. Let me repeat: IBOC IS INCOMPATIBLE WITH YOUR CURRENT ANALOG RECEIVERS! Go to http://www.digitaldisaster.org/ 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Oct 31 11:18:48 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 31 Oct 2002 19:18:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 53630 invoked from network); 31 Oct 2002 19:18:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Oct 2002 19:18:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.98) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Oct 2002 19:18:47 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 31 Oct 2002 11:18:47 -0800 To: References: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A5607974045358BE@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} (unknown) Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 14:18:31 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 31 Oct 2002 19:18:47.0801 (UTC) FILETIME=[565B3E90:01C28112] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.147.238.114] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Charles Penry wrote: > Troll? No, IBOC is as bad as it gets. period. take a look at http://www.digitaldisaster.org/ Long live FREE RADIO! Death to the NAB! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From jimshelden@garfield-wa.com Thu Oct 31 12:53:09 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jimshelden@garfield-wa.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 31 Oct 2002 20:53:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 22681 invoked from network); 31 Oct 2002 20:53:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Oct 2002 20:53:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.69) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Oct 2002 20:53:08 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.139] by n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Oct 2002 20:53:05 -0000 Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 20:53:05 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: 1700 WI2XAM... Neal Newman? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1070 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Jim Shelden" X-Originating-IP: 134.121.82.119 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=73693137 X-Yahoo-Profile: jimshelden --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Possum Hunter" wrote: > wgliradio wrote: > > > Back in the "Good Ole Days" WLW 700 was certified by Mcintosh Laboratories > to have frequency response from 20Hz to 20,000Hz. > My antique RCA BTA1R is good out to 16,000Hz. > Go ahead Neal, Show 'em what REAL Hi-Fi AM sounds like! > I remember working with an RCA "Ampliphase" design. Those rascals could transmit out to 30Khz at full power. It was a bugger to keep both RF chains phased correctly, But they sounded good when properly tuned. I also have a Gates BC-1H with the solid state audio board, that is matched thru a broad-banded ATU. This old girl sounds excellent on- air. Not in CQUAM yet, but maybe coming. BTW, anybody got any good sounding & simple designs for off-air studio monitoring 3 or 4 miles from the tower? My mod. mon. is at the transmitter, and I need to get clean wideband audio at the studio. Right now I'm using a simple tuned circuit & diode detector (like a crystal set), but I can hear a little distortion. Thanks... From ben@lennard.net.nz Thu Oct 31 13:11:28 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ben@lennard.net.nz X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 31 Oct 2002 21:11:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 91971 invoked from network); 31 Oct 2002 21:11:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Oct 2002 21:11:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Oct 2002 21:11:28 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.143] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Oct 2002 21:11:28 -0000 Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 21:11:27 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Guess who's back... Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1242 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Ben" X-Originating-IP: 203.98.50.151 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=118503946 X-Yahoo-Profile: benlennard Back again. Yes, he's back... And I can't remember how the rest of the Emiem song goes... But after a long absence, I'm back, in AMS free NZ. Well, sort of AMS free. Unofficially, we have 2 AMS stations - well 1.5. There is some guy in Dorkland - er - sorry I mean Auckland, who has a Chris Cuff AMS lite transmitter, and King Country Radio are unofficially experimenting with AMS. What's happened to Triple 9? Some of you may ask? Well, due to lack of resources, and not being able to make a good aerial system, I have given my AMS transmitter to my friend Cliff who works at King Country Radio. KCR is going FM, but is also keeping their AM transmitter going, and Cliff is going to experiment with AMS on that frequency. In the mean time, Triple 9 is now FMS on 88.5 (aerial system is so much easier to implement), and I am acting as Cliff's source for AMS stuff, as well as converting AM radio's if needed. Heck, just putting an AMS decoder in to an AM radio to open up the bandwidth and give you HiFi mono is good enough reason to install them. In other news: I still intend to get around to making my own AMS/FMS digital Tuner controller. I have no idea of a time frame for that. Ben, Wellington, New Zealand. From penry@nortelnetworks.com Thu Oct 31 15:21:58 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: penry@nortelnetworks.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 31 Oct 2002 23:21:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 42345 invoked from network); 31 Oct 2002 23:21:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Oct 2002 23:21:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com) (47.103.122.112) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Oct 2002 23:21:55 -0000 Received: from zrc2c011.us.nortel.com (zrc2c011.us.nortel.com [47.103.120.51]) by zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id g9VNM7I13150 for ; Thu, 31 Oct 2002 17:22:07 -0600 (CST) Received: by zrc2c011.us.nortel.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Thu, 31 Oct 2002 17:21:54 -0600 Message-ID: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A560797404570898@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: {AMSF} (unknown) Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 17:21:53 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) From: "Charles Penry" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=376233 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa5vhu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Well, let's see here, The sky is falling. All twice-divorced men are snipers. All 41-year-old Gulf War veterans are snipers. All men who converted from Baptist to Islam 17 years ago are snipers. All men who earned an expert marksmanship badge in the U.S. Army are snipers. All men born in New Orleans, Louisiana are snipers. All former members of the Louisiana National Guard are snipers. With IBOC, you HAVE to buy a new radio. Are any of the above true? Could all of the above possibly be a gross exaggeration of the truth? How does this type of exaggeration (lying) help promote analog AM Stereo? Perhaps I don't understand. Can you please explain to me how IBOC will make me HAVE to buy a new radio to hear the local stations that I normally listen to? If you are talking about the AM band and not the FM band, remember that I am an average consumer that sometimes listens to local AM stations. As an average listener, I don't really care to listen to out of town stations as I don't care what's happening in some other town, and I don't like to listen to all the weak signal static. I listen to local AM radio for news, traffic, weather, talk shows, and Radio Disney in beautiful AM Stereo when the grandkids are with me. There is no other music on my local AM radio dial anymore, other than Spanish, which I don't understand, though I enjoy listening to some of the music on occasions. And, though there are no stations that are broadcasting IBOC that are local to me yet, I am not so dumb as to try to listen to a station broadcasting in IBOC with my radio in the forced AM Stereo and/or the wideband mode. That would an improper mode setting and would be a silly thing to do. Kind of like complaining that I can't hear the local AM stations when I have my radio set to the FM band. I think (thought) everyone on this list was aware or is becoming aware of the interference issues with IBOC. I don't see how scare tactics that are distortions of the truth will help our cause. It will just make us appear as another "Chicken Little" to the outside world, and we will be ignored. Do you know who is looking at this list? You don't have to be a member of the group to read the messages. Our posts can be read on the web by anyone, including people that have the power to influence the decisions that can help our cause. Would you like help from some people from inside the NAB? Do you think it makes them feel good and want to help our cause (or yours) when you have a tag line of "Death to the NAB"? If you are worried about losing your ability to DX the AM band, fine but what does that have to do with AM Stereo. And, as an AM DX'er you are a minority, not the average listener, which the broadcast medium is designed for. And if you DX the AM band, you likely have a special receiver now that is made for or is optimum for DX reception. How will this new radio that you will have to buy due to IBOC help you with your AM DX hobby? Screaming little brats in the department store are disliked by the customers, the store staff, and usually get their just rewards at home, or sometimes out in the parking lot! (As the security camera reveals!) They don't usually get what they want, as it should be. What do you want, and what is the best way to get it? Think before you act. Re-read what I have written, then think before you reply to me. Charles -----Original Message----- From: Possum Hunter [mailto:possumhunter@netzero.net] Sent: Thursday, October 31, 2002 1:19 PM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} (unknown) Charles Penry wrote: > Troll? No, IBOC is as bad as it gets. period. take a look at http://www.digitaldisaster.org/ Long live FREE RADIO! Death to the NAB! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation ---------------------------------------------------------------------- -----Original Message----- From: n0uiheric@aol.com [mailto:n0uiheric@aol.com] Sent: Wednesday, October 30, 2002 7:25 PM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} (unknown) With IBOC, you HAVE to buy a new radio. Let me repeat: IBOC IS INCOMPATIBLE WITH YOUR CURRENT ANALOG RECEIVERS! Go to http://www.digitaldisaster.org/ 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Oct 31 17:37:24 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 1 Nov 2002 01:37:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 32734 invoked from network); 1 Nov 2002 01:37:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Nov 2002 01:37:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.86) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Nov 2002 01:37:23 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.143] by n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Nov 2002 01:37:22 -0000 Date: Fri, 01 Nov 2002 01:37:18 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Delco radio repair parts? Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1056 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 207.200.161.212 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics I just got this inquiry via e-mail. Can anybody help Mark out on this? It seems he has the less common "all-electronic" version of the Delco UX-1 radio, and the buttons for the volume control have worn out. > From: "M Malm" > To: > Subject: Delco AM stereo radio > Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 13:06:49 -0600 > > Hi, > I am a member of the AM stereo forum on Yahoo groups. I've read a > few of your posts on AM stereo radios by the major car > manufactures. I have a 1985 Pontiac Fiero GT with the optional > AM stereo radio and push button volume and balance controls. I am > looking for parts to repair the volume control push buttons. When > new they would give a nice "click" when pushed. Something in the > plastic has broken and now the buttons just stay pushed in. The > volume controls still work, but the buttons don't feel right and > don't look right. Do you know of a source for parts for GM > radios? Alot of web searching has turned up nothing. > > Thanks > > Mark Malm > mmalm@btinet.net From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Oct 31 17:51:46 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 1 Nov 2002 01:51:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 47961 invoked from network); 1 Nov 2002 01:51:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Nov 2002 01:51:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.197) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Nov 2002 01:51:46 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 31 Oct 2002 17:51:46 -0800 To: References: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A560797404570898@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} (unknown) Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 20:51:27 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 01 Nov 2002 01:51:46.0273 (UTC) FILETIME=[3C388D10:01C28149] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.144.124.174] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Charles Penry wrote: > With IBOC, you HAVE to buy a new radio. > > > Are any of the above true? Could all of the above possibly be a gross exaggeration of the truth? The last one is! > > Perhaps I don't understand. Can you please explain to me how IBOC will make me HAVE to buy a new radio to hear the local stations that I normally listen to? Most AM radios have a bandwidth of around 5 or 6 Khz. The better home and car radios have a 9Khz Bandwidth. With IBOC, Only 5Khz is under modulated lo-fi mono analog audio, with the digital data stream extending out to 25Khz. That means that your nice good sounding Delco radio will hear the lo-fi mono signal with a bunch of digital hash in the audio as well! In the US and Canada, radio channels are spaced 10Khz wide. This means an IBOC station will not only wipe out the first adjacent, but will get the second as well. How would this degrade radio in "REAL LIFE"? You are on the Southwest side of the New York market and want to listen to the evening news on WCBS 880. IBOC noise from WWL 870 and WLS 890 will be coming in on Skywave and destroy the analog, and most likely screw up the digital IBOC signal from WCBS. No matter HOW you do the math, you cannot fit three 25Khz wide signals in 30Khz of spectrum or.... You are in downtown Greenville, SC and you want to listen to Southern Gospel music on the 1000 watt daytimer, WCKI 1300. The IBOC noise from 5000 Watt WANS 1280 and 5000 Watt WYRD 1300 is going to keep you from listening to your Southern Gospel music! or... You are in Greenwood, SC and want to listen to Rush on 5000 Watt WCZZ 1090, Nope! The IBOC signal from 50,000 Watt WCSZ 1070 will kill that signal. You decide to try G.Gordon Liddy on 1000 Watt WLMA 1350. Not a chance with IBOC noise from WYRD 1330, WSSC 1340, and WELP 1360. The only other AM in Greenwood is 1000 Watt WCRS 1450, so you decide to listen to Southern Gospel, right? WRONG! IBOC from 5000 Watt WGVL 1440 and 5000 Watt WQXL 1470 will wipe it out. There are no other AM stations in Greenwood. > > How does this type of exaggeration (lying) help promote analog AM Stereo? > >I am not so dumb as to try to listen to a station broadcasting in IBOC with my radio in the forced AM Stereo and/or the wideband mode. True, but when you cannot hear your favorite small market station due to a IBOC Powerhouse next to it, please re-send this letter! > >Our posts can be read on the web by anyone, including people that have the power to influence the decisions that can help our cause. THAT'S GOOD! If MORE letters like the ones I write get stuck on station manager's desks, Perhaps they will think twice about IBOC conversion, or turning off their CQUAM generator. > > Would you like help from some people from inside the NAB? With the recent track record of the NAB when it comes to AM or small market stations, there is little to no chance they will help us. The NAB is who is pushing FOR IBOC, remember? > > Do you think it makes them feel good and want to help our cause (or yours) when you have a tag line of "Death to the NAB"? The tag line is there because of their actions. > > If you are worried about losing your ability to DX the AM band, fine but what does that have to do with AM Stereo. CQUAM and IBOC are NOT compatible with each other. You will only hear noisy Lo-Fi mono, or jammed CQUAM STEREO on your AMAX tuner when IBOC hits the street. Incase you are not aware, your analog TV is fixing to be landfill filler too! > > And, as an AM DX'er you are a minority, not the average listener, which the broadcast medium is designed for. See the above cases of LOCAL, not DX reception problems. > > And if you DX the AM band, you likely have a special receiver now that is made for or is optimum for DX reception. How will this new radio that you will have to buy due to IBOC help you with your AM DX hobby? If you call an old tube type radio from the 1930s a "Special Receiver", I guess that's OK. I doubt there is a person on this list that does not have a "Special Receiver" such as a Japanese market AM Stereo radio, or some home-brew Stereo decoder patched into a Mono AM radio. > >What do you want, and what is the best way to get it? High Fidelity AM STEREO radio is what all of us wants. The ONLY way we will keep it is to make enough noise that the station managers hear it. The NAB and NPR are for IBOC, so the FCC only hears the LOUD voice of the NAB and ignores the faint cries of the small market station owner. Long live FREE RADIO! Death to the NAB! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Oct 31 18:01:24 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 1 Nov 2002 02:01:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 23316 invoked from network); 1 Nov 2002 02:01:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Nov 2002 02:01:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web12801.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.174.36) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Nov 2002 02:01:23 -0000 Message-ID: <20021101020123.17495.qmail@web12801.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [207.200.161.212] by web12801.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 31 Oct 2002 18:01:23 PST Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 18:01:23 -0800 (PST) Subject: Fwd: Re: 1700 WI2XAM testing IBOC in NJ To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "Kevin T." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics Heh... WOR's IBOC test receiver is "about as big as a bus"... yeah, that must mean IBOC walkmans and boom-boxes are right around the corner, since the design is so compact and portable already! I still have the magazine article somewhere that said IBOC receivers would be on store shelves by 1993.... now, it is doubtful if we will even see them in 2003! --- "Thomas R. Ray, III" wrote: > From: "Thomas R. Ray, III" > To: "Kevin T." > Subject: Re: 1700 WI2XAM testing IBOC in NJ > Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 13:37:30 -0500 > > Unfortunately, our receiver is about as big as a bus....we don't have a > mobile one, yet. I'll give it a shot with the one we have, but suspect > the AGC would be swamped out here....I'm at the transmitter today. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Kevin T." > To: "Tom Ray" > Sent: October 31, 2002 11:28 AM > Subject: 1700 WI2XAM testing IBOC in NJ > >> FCC-licensed 50-watt "experimental" station WI2XAM on 1700 kHz is on the >> air testing IBOC from the Lucent offices in Warren, NJ (Somerset County). >> They were on the air Tuesday until at least an hour after sunset, and >> they're back on today (Oct. 31), playing continuous music with occasional >> legal IDs. Signal is fair to good within about a 10 mile radius of the >> transmitter, although it suffers interference from 10-watt weather info >> TIS station WPSH468 also on 1700 kHz in Manville, NJ. >> >> I'm just wondering if you have plans to use WOR's IBOC mobile test >> receiver to tune in WI2XAM. I assume their music is in Stereo on the >> IBOC side, which would be nice to hear for the first time. >> >> Kevin T. >> kevtronics@yahoo.com __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? HotJobs - Search new jobs daily now http://hotjobs.yahoo.com/ From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Oct 31 18:03:22 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 1 Nov 2002 02:03:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 51970 invoked from network); 1 Nov 2002 02:03:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Nov 2002 02:03:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.85) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Nov 2002 02:03:21 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 31 Oct 2002 18:03:21 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Delco radio repair parts? Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 21:02:43 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 01 Nov 2002 02:03:21.0640 (UTC) FILETIME=[DAB12280:01C2814A] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.144.124.174] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 >Do you know of a source for parts for GM radios? Master Electronics in Greenville SC 864-370-2064 OR Downtown Radio Service 2908 Stewart Cree Boulevard Charlotte, NC 28216 704-391-0801 Long live FREE RADIO! Death to the NAB! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Thu Oct 31 18:37:47 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 1 Nov 2002 02:37:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 91031 invoked from network); 1 Nov 2002 02:37:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Nov 2002 02:37:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf11bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.171) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Nov 2002 02:37:47 -0000 Received: from juan ([68.155.183.135]) by imf11bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.19 201-253-122-122-119-20020516) with SMTP id <20021101023930.BGUB3483.imf11bis.bellsouth.net@juan> for ; Thu, 31 Oct 2002 21:39:30 -0500 Message-ID: <001101c2814f$a97aec00$af78fea9@juan> To: References: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A560797404570898@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} (unknown) Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 21:37:46 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ) IBOC or whatever it is called, will die a slow, or if we are lucky, a fast death. If the future of AM is digital, so be it. Trying to do both at the same time, on the same channel is a mistake... It's One or the other, trying to do both... Analog and Digital will compromise both. I enjoy listening to out of town stations on the AM band. I will really miss DX'ing as we know it now, If IBOC continues. If I am a chicken Little, so be it. At least I will speak my mind. Enough said. Juan Gualda WTTB WGYL WOSN WGNX KB0GXM Charles Penry wrote: > With IBOC, you HAVE to buy a new radio. > > > Are any of the above true? Could all of the above possibly be a gross exaggeration of the truth? The last one is! > > Perhaps I don't understand. Can you please explain to me how IBOC will make me HAVE to buy a new radio to hear the local stations that I normally listen to? Most AM radios have a bandwidth of around 5 or 6 Khz. The better home and car radios have a 9Khz Bandwidth. With IBOC, Only 5Khz is under modulated lo-fi mono analog audio, with the digital data stream extending out to 25Khz. That means that your nice good sounding Delco radio will hear the lo-fi mono signal with a bunch of digital hash in the audio as well! In the US and Canada, radio channels are spaced 10Khz wide. This means an IBOC station will not only wipe out the first adjacent, but will get the second as well. How would this degrade radio in "REAL LIFE"? You are on the Southwest side of the New York market and want to listen to the evening news on WCBS 880. IBOC noise from WWL 870 and WLS 890 will be coming in on Skywave and destroy the analog, and most likely screw up the digital IBOC signal from WCBS. No matter HOW you do the math, you cannot fit three 25Khz wide signals in 30Khz of spectrum or.... You are in downtown Greenville, SC and you want to listen to Southern Gospel music on the 1000 watt daytimer, WCKI 1300. The IBOC noise from 5000 Watt WANS 1280 and 5000 Watt WYRD 1300 is going to keep you from listening to your Southern Gospel music! or... You are in Greenwood, SC and want to listen to Rush on 5000 Watt WCZZ 1090, Nope! The IBOC signal from 50,000 Watt WCSZ 1070 will kill that signal. You decide to try G.Gordon Liddy on 1000 Watt WLMA 1350. Not a chance with IBOC noise from WYRD 1330, WSSC 1340, and WELP 1360. The only other AM in Greenwood is 1000 Watt WCRS 1450, so you decide to listen to Southern Gospel, right? WRONG! IBOC from 5000 Watt WGVL 1440 and 5000 Watt WQXL 1470 will wipe it out. There are no other AM stations in Greenwood. > > How does this type of exaggeration (lying) help promote analog AM Stereo? > >I am not so dumb as to try to listen to a station broadcasting in IBOC with my radio in the forced AM Stereo and/or the wideband mode. True, but when you cannot hear your favorite small market station due to a IBOC Powerhouse next to it, please re-send this letter! > >Our posts can be read on the web by anyone, including people that have the power to influence the decisions that can help our cause. THAT'S GOOD! If MORE letters like the ones I write get stuck on station manager's desks, Perhaps they will think twice about IBOC conversion, or turning off their CQUAM generator. > > Would you like help from some people from inside the NAB? With the recent track record of the NAB when it comes to AM or small market stations, there is little to no chance they will help us. The NAB is who is pushing FOR IBOC, remember? > > Do you think it makes them feel good and want to help our cause (or yours) when you have a tag line of "Death to the NAB"? The tag line is there because of their actions. > > If you are worried about losing your ability to DX the AM band, fine but what does that have to do with AM Stereo. CQUAM and IBOC are NOT compatible with each other. You will only hear noisy Lo-Fi mono, or jammed CQUAM STEREO on your AMAX tuner when IBOC hits the street. Incase you are not aware, your analog TV is fixing to be landfill filler too! > > And, as an AM DX'er you are a minority, not the average listener, which the broadcast medium is designed for. See the above cases of LOCAL, not DX reception problems. > > And if you DX the AM band, you likely have a special receiver now that is made for or is optimum for DX reception. How will this new radio that you will have to buy due to IBOC help you with your AM DX hobby? If you call an old tube type radio from the 1930s a "Special Receiver", I guess that's OK. I doubt there is a person on this list that does not have a "Special Receiver" such as a Japanese market AM Stereo radio, or some home-brew Stereo decoder patched into a Mono AM radio. > >What do you want, and what is the best way to get it? High Fidelity AM STEREO radio is what all of us wants. The ONLY way we will keep it is to make enough noise that the station managers hear it. The NAB and NPR are for IBOC, so the FCC only hears the LOUD voice of the NAB and ignores the faint cries of the small market station owner. Long live FREE RADIO! Death to the NAB! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Oct 31 18:38:34 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: possumhunter@netzero.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 1 Nov 2002 02:38:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 52080 invoked from network); 1 Nov 2002 02:38:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Nov 2002 02:38:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rly-ip03.mx.aol.com) (64.12.138.7) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Nov 2002 02:38:33 -0000 Received: from logs-tm.proxy.aol.com (logs-tm.proxy.aol.com [152.163.197.5]) by rly-ip03.mx.aol.com (v89.10) with ESMTP id RELAYIN6-1031213804; Thu, 31 Oct 2002 21:38:04 -0400 Received: from llraper (AC907CAE.ipt.aol.com [172.144.124.174]) by logs-tm.proxy.aol.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with SMTP id gA12a2e342816 for ; Thu, 31 Oct 2002 21:36:02 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <015901c2814f$650c4e60$ae7c90ac@llraper> To: References: <20021101020123.17495.qmail@web12801.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fwd: Re: 1700 WI2XAM testing IBOC in NJ Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 21:05:41 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Apparently-From: DodgeRamTrucker@aol.com From: "Possum Hunter" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Kevin T. wrote: > I still have the magazine article somewhere that said IBOC receivers would be on store shelves by 1993.... now, it is doubtful if we will even see them in 2003! 2103 would be too soon as far as I am concerned! Long live FREE RADIO! Death to the NAB! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Oct 31 18:59:32 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 1 Nov 2002 02:59:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 80203 invoked from network); 1 Nov 2002 02:59:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Nov 2002 02:59:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.205) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Nov 2002 02:59:31 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 31 Oct 2002 18:59:31 -0800 To: References: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A560797404570898@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> <001101c2814f$a97aec00$af78fea9@juan> Subject: Re: {AMSF} (unknown) Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 21:59:18 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 01 Nov 2002 02:59:31.0511 (UTC) FILETIME=[B34AA470:01C28152] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.144.124.174] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Juan / John Gualda wrote: > If the future of AM is digital, so be it. Trying to do both at the same time, on the same channel is a mistake... I agree! Why not use the "Tropical Broadcast Band" for digital AM? That would make MUCH more sense then obsoleting every single radio that has been made! > > If I am a chicken Little, so be it. At least I will speak my mind. YOU are 100% right! NOW is the time we MUST speak up. Long live FREE RADIO! Death to the NAB! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Thu Oct 31 19:18:42 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 1 Nov 2002 03:18:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 22230 invoked from network); 1 Nov 2002 03:18:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Nov 2002 03:18:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf09bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.169) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Nov 2002 03:18:40 -0000 Received: from juan ([68.155.183.135]) by imf09bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.19 201-253-122-122-119-20020516) with SMTP id <20021101032024.IJJG24556.imf09bis.bellsouth.net@juan> for ; Thu, 31 Oct 2002 22:20:24 -0500 Message-ID: <000701c28155$604a4ac0$af78fea9@juan> To: References: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A560797404570898@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> <001101c2814f$a97aec00$af78fea9@juan> Subject: Re: {AMSF} (unknown) Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 22:18:40 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sounds good to me! Juan Juan / John Gualda wrote: > If the future of AM is digital, so be it. Trying to do both at the same time, on the same channel is a mistake... I agree! Why not use the "Tropical Broadcast Band" for digital AM? That would make MUCH more sense then obsoleting every single radio that has been made! > > If I am a chicken Little, so be it. At least I will speak my mind. YOU are 100% right! NOW is the time we MUST speak up. Long live FREE RADIO! Death to the NAB! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Oct 31 19:39:33 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 1 Nov 2002 03:39:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 35973 invoked from network); 1 Nov 2002 03:39:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Nov 2002 03:39:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.121) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Nov 2002 03:39:32 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 31 Oct 2002 19:39:32 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: 1700 WI2XAM... Neal Newman? Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 22:39:19 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 01 Nov 2002 03:39:32.0668 (UTC) FILETIME=[4A7E1FC0:01C28158] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.144.124.174] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Jim Shelden wrote: > I remember working with an RCA "Ampliphase" design. Those rascals could transmit out to 30Khz at full power. It was a bugger to keep both RF chains phased correctly, But they sounded good when properly tuned. Oh yea! There is a BTA5L Ampliphase on the air in this market. That bugger is LOUD on the air, but it just never worked right on CQUAM. I was not involved in the project, so I don't know if it was an alignment issue or what the problem was, but the phase distortion would have you hitting the "Mono" button QUICK! > > I also have a Gates BC-1H with the solid state audio board, that is matched thru a broad-banded ATU. This old girl sounds excellent on- air. Not in CQUAM yet, but maybe coming. She should sound good. I have worked on several BC1Gs and BC1Hs, they are a simple, reliable transmitter that has wonderful fidelity when they are working right. There are a bunch of them on the air in this market, but I am still a RCA fan! War Story: When I was at WAIM 1230, the main transmitter was a McMartin BA1K and there was an abandoned in place BTA1R in the transmitter room. To make a long story short, I got a wild hair up my rear end and fixed her up and plugged her in! The owner of the station heard it on the air and thought I had got some new audio equipment so he decided to come by the station to see just how much of his money I spent. He nearly croaked when he saw the old RCA all lit up and sounding pretty! Long live FREE RADIO! Death to the NAB! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Oct 31 20:04:31 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 1 Nov 2002 04:04:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 95390 invoked from network); 1 Nov 2002 04:04:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Nov 2002 04:04:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.194) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Nov 2002 04:04:31 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 31 Oct 2002 20:04:31 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Halloween update Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 23:04:17 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 01 Nov 2002 04:04:31.0590 (UTC) FILETIME=[C7EB7860:01C2815B] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.144.124.174] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Kevin T. wrote: >keep your ears open for unlicensed 'pirate' stations to pop up out of nowhere today. "Super Stereo Radio" is on the air here on 87.9 and 540 with "The Top Sound Is On The Bottom Of The Dial!"liners. I heard "Hillbilly Radio" on 5090Khz and Carolina Pirate Radio on 1620 claiming to be simulcasting on 87.9, but I couldn't hear the FM. A fun sounding Pirate station sure is better then canned sattelite fed same ole music, same ole talk, or same ole preachers ranting on the air. Thank goodness I have never heard a pirate broadcasting "Brother Stair"! Long live FREE RADIO! Death to the NAB! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From dav259@csiro.au Thu Oct 31 20:38:12 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 1 Nov 2002 04:38:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 77736 invoked from network); 1 Nov 2002 04:38:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Nov 2002 04:38:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Nov 2002 04:38:11 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA14cAP21293 for ; Fri, 1 Nov 2002 15:38:10 +1100 (EST) Date: Fri, 1 Nov 2002 15:38:10 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Subject: Re: {AMSF} (unknown) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public On Thu, 31 Oct 2002, Possum Hunter wrote: > Charles Penry wrote: > > With IBOC, you HAVE to buy a new radio. What is the composition of the NAB? Is it just the big stations or pretty well ALL stations? Does FM dominate over AM? Is there an argument for a separate association of smaller stations - who could have an alternative agenda. eg. In OZ most doctors are in the AMA and seem preoccupied with monetory issues. But about a quarter of the doctors are members of the "Doctors Reform Group" and they seem more skewed towards "healing the sick". Why couldn't the smaller station owners band together? If 200 stations formed an association and agreed to broadcast CQuam for, say the next five years, maybe just one manufacturer could be persuaded to produce Symphony or Omega AM stereo/FM stereo radios. What's in it for smaller stations actually being in the NAB? > >What do you want, and what is the best way to get it? > > High Fidelity AM STEREO radio is what all of us wants. The ONLY way we > will keep it is to make enough noise that the station managers hear it. Exactly! It doesn't matter if it's analog or digital - as long as it sounds good - and it works!!! Long live LIVE and LOCAL radio. Down with the NAB. Ian Melbourne From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Oct 31 22:02:35 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 1 Nov 2002 06:02:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 57654 invoked from network); 1 Nov 2002 06:02:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Nov 2002 06:02:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Nov 2002 06:02:34 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.128] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Nov 2002 06:02:34 -0000 Date: Fri, 01 Nov 2002 06:02:34 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Halloween update Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 492 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.71.19 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > A fun sounding Pirate station sure is better then canned sattelite > fed same ole music, same ole talk, or same ole preachers ranting on > the air. Thank goodness I have never heard a pirate broadcasting > "Brother Stair"! Tonight I heard a local FM pirate on 104.7 playing CHRISTMAS music, amongst excerpts from old movies and other strange audio clips. This is probably the same station that showed up last year as 104.7 "WENJ", although this time I didn't hear a live DJ or any IDs. From ben@lennard.net.nz Thu Oct 31 22:46:43 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ben@lennard.net.nz X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 1 Nov 2002 06:46:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 44240 invoked from network); 1 Nov 2002 06:46:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Nov 2002 06:46:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.90) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Nov 2002 06:46:42 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.129] by n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Nov 2002 06:46:42 -0000 Date: Fri, 01 Nov 2002 06:46:41 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Halloween update Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 812 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Ben" X-Originating-IP: 203.97.97.131 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=118503946 X-Yahoo-Profile: benlennard Speaking of Pirate Stations, Kev are you still running your pirate AMS station? W something KT? Steely Dan is playing of Crofton Radio at the mo... "Do It Again"... Ben, Windy Wellington, New Zealand. http://www.lennard.net.nz/ --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin T." wrote: > > A fun sounding Pirate station sure is better then canned sattelite > > fed same ole music, same ole talk, or same ole preachers ranting on > > the air. Thank goodness I have never heard a pirate broadcasting > > "Brother Stair"! > > Tonight I heard a local FM pirate on 104.7 playing CHRISTMAS music, > amongst excerpts from old movies and other strange audio clips. > This is probably the same station that showed up last year as 104.7 > "WENJ", although this time I didn't hear a live DJ or any IDs. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Nov 01 00:43:11 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 1 Nov 2002 08:43:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 44692 invoked from network); 1 Nov 2002 08:43:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Nov 2002 08:43:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Nov 2002 08:43:10 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.190] by n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Nov 2002 08:43:10 -0000 Date: Fri, 01 Nov 2002 08:43:09 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Halloween update Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 516 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.71.19 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Speaking of Pirate Stations, Kev are you still running your pirate > AMS station? W something KT? 1500 "KJFE" (formerly known as "WKTW") is currently off the air while equipment upgrades are in progress, including a new computer-based music system and new audio processing. It may also become a unique AM STEREO/FM MONO simulcast with the addition of an FM transmitter. Both will be operated in compliance with FCC Part 15 regulations, so although unlicensed, it technically won't be a "pirate" station. From ben@lennard.net.nz Fri Nov 01 00:52:29 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ben@lennard.net.nz X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 1 Nov 2002 08:52:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 26987 invoked from network); 1 Nov 2002 08:52:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Nov 2002 08:52:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Nov 2002 08:52:28 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.151] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Nov 2002 08:52:28 -0000 Date: Fri, 01 Nov 2002 08:52:26 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Halloween update Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 666 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Ben" X-Originating-IP: 203.97.97.130 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=118503946 X-Yahoo-Profile: benlennard > a new computer-based > music system iTunes??? ;-) -Ben. --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin T." wrote: > > Speaking of Pirate Stations, Kev are you still running your pirate > > AMS station? W something KT? > > 1500 "KJFE" (formerly known as "WKTW") is currently off the air while > equipment upgrades are in progress, including a new computer-based > music system and new audio processing. It may also become a unique > AM STEREO/FM MONO simulcast with the addition of an FM transmitter. > Both will be operated in compliance with FCC Part 15 regulations, so > although unlicensed, it technically won't be a "pirate" station. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Nov 01 01:10:56 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 1 Nov 2002 09:10:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 63556 invoked from network); 1 Nov 2002 09:10:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Nov 2002 09:10:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.88) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Nov 2002 09:10:55 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.176] by n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Nov 2002 09:10:54 -0000 Date: Fri, 01 Nov 2002 09:10:54 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: IBOC vs. AMAX Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1518 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.71.19 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics Just by the count of "Re:'s" in a row, you can tell that the debate over IBOC vs. AMAX AM Stereo has been very active on the New York Radio Message Board: "Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Digital Radio Story in newsday" http://musicradio.computer.net/wwwboard/messages/182530.html This is the latest in a thread where Mike Erickson keeps promoting AMAX and AM Stereo as the best choice for improving the AM band, and Allan Sniffen (proprietor of the message board) keeps parroting the IBOC industry hype and dismissing anything else as a failure. If you'd like to start from the beginning of the thread, it all began here: http://musicradio.computer.net/wwwboard/messages/182222.html It would be great to have Mike here in the AM Stereo Forum (if he isn't already!), but unfortunately his messages don't include an e-mail link, and Allan has dismissed me as "Mr. AM Stereo" (a title which I wear proudly!) and thus won't let me post messages to the Board myself. I have to say that normally Allan is a great guy, and I agree with a lot of what he says, but for some reason in this case he is heavily biased in favor of IBOC and refuses to consider any alternatives, and on this topic often he just doesn't know what he's talking about. For example, it took about half of that thread above just for him to understand that AMAX is an AM receiver quality standard, rather than some special kind of signal that an AM station transmits. From KC4QLP@aol.com Fri Nov 01 01:15:47 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 1 Nov 2002 09:15:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 44570 invoked from network); 1 Nov 2002 09:15:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Nov 2002 09:15:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r09.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.105) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Nov 2002 09:15:47 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r09.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.6c.25101d50 (4410) for ; Fri, 1 Nov 2002 04:15:42 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <6c.25101d50.2af3a03d@aol.com> Date: Fri, 1 Nov 2002 04:15:41 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} IBOC vs. AMAX To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 11/1/02 4:11:19 AM Eastern Standard Time, kevtronics@yahoo.com writes: << It would be great to have Mike here in the AM Stereo Forum (if he isn't already!), but unfortunately his messages don't include an e-mail link, and Allan has dismissed me as "Mr. AM Stereo" (a title which I wear proudly!) and thus won't let me post messages to the Board myself >> If I'm not mistaken...I think Mike is on this forum. Its been rather hectic around here...I hope I didnt dream it...lol Bob Carter Operations/Engineering WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5..., Ray Communications Radio Network Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From ben@lennard.net.nz Fri Nov 01 01:44:59 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ben@lennard.net.nz X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 1 Nov 2002 09:44:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 88101 invoked from network); 1 Nov 2002 09:44:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Nov 2002 09:44:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.67) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Nov 2002 09:44:58 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.250] by n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Nov 2002 09:44:58 -0000 Date: Fri, 01 Nov 2002 09:44:58 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: IBOC vs. AMAX Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2276 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Ben" X-Originating-IP: 203.97.97.131 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=118503946 X-Yahoo-Profile: benlennard In a lot of cases, Analogue beats Digital hands down. This is why I still have, and will for a long time (as long as cassette deck heads are available), a very large collection of chrome and metal cassettes at home. Plus, is also a good reason why i bothered to rebuild my Philips cassette deck after it's original mechanisem died... A good example is when I played two versions of The Eagles "Hotel California" to one of my tenants. One was an mp3, the other was on a Chrome cassette with Dolby C NR. Guess which recording won the test... ;-) Ben, Wellington, New Zealand. http://www.lennard.net.nz/ --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin T." wrote: > Just by the count of "Re:'s" in a row, you can tell that the debate > over IBOC vs. AMAX AM Stereo has been very active on the New York > Radio Message Board: > > "Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: > Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Digital Radio Story in newsday" > > http://musicradio.computer.net/wwwboard/messages/182530.ht ml > > This is the latest in a thread where Mike Erickson keeps promoting > AMAX and AM Stereo as the best choice for improving the AM band, and > Allan Sniffen (proprietor of the message board) keeps parroting the > IBOC industry hype and dismissing anything else as a failure. > > If you'd like to start from the beginning of the thread, it all began > here: > > http://musicradio.computer.net/wwwboard/messages/182222.ht ml > > It would be great to have Mike here in the AM Stereo Forum (if he > isn't already!), but unfortunately his messages don't include an > e-mail link, and Allan has dismissed me as "Mr. AM Stereo" (a title > which I wear proudly!) and thus won't let me post messages to the > Board myself. > > I have to say that normally Allan is a great guy, and I agree with a > lot of what he says, but for some reason in this case he is heavily > biased in favor of IBOC and refuses to consider any alternatives, and > on this topic often he just doesn't know what he's talking about. > For example, it took about half of that thread above just for him to > understand that AMAX is an AM receiver quality standard, rather than > some special kind of signal that an AM station transmits. From dav259@csiro.au Fri Nov 01 02:07:46 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 1 Nov 2002 10:07:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 13207 invoked from network); 1 Nov 2002 10:07:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Nov 2002 10:07:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Nov 2002 10:07:45 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA1A7hP08416 for ; Fri, 1 Nov 2002 21:07:43 +1100 (EST) Date: Fri, 1 Nov 2002 21:07:43 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Subject: Re: {AMSF} IBOC vs. AMAX In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public On Fri, 1 Nov 2002, Kevin T. wrote: > It would be great to have Mike here in the AM Stereo Forum (if he > isn't already!), but unfortunately his messages don't include an > e-mail link, and Allan has dismissed me as "Mr. AM Stereo" (a title > which I wear proudly!) and thus won't let me post messages to the > Board myself. Keep punching Kevin! On our Oz google board I've built up the reputation of being AM stereo fixated and may share that local title with Voltare-Matt2 who also cops heaps. But we gotta do what we gotta do. This is the AM stereo forum. And as a non-tech person I feel we must do whatever we can to advance the cause of AM stereo. Whether it's digital or analog is secondary. We want AM stereo! You've got to admit the iBiquity synopsis sounds great. Nobody is supposed to suffer as noone has to buy a new radio to maintain what they've already got. If only it worked! And doesn't destroy what we've already got. I'm really worried that IBOC may have a long and painful death - and that maybe Symphony and Omega won't even get a start. All this non-tech guy knows is that he'll happily listen to C-quam AM stereo till something better turns up. And he just has to hope and prey that the local stations keep broadcasting it - and that he can get his US allies to supply him with receivers. Both things looking less likely ... We MUST fight on! WE KNOW HOW GOOD IT IS!! I don't care how many people at the NAB read things like this. If any are watching they should have a good look at themselves. How much do they really love radio to create a system that possibly may destroy it? Hey! Welcome back Ben. What's the buzz? Are you the Lord Mayor of Greater Wellington yet? Ian Melbourne (the world's most liveable city - for Ben's benefit) From ben@lennard.net.nz Fri Nov 01 03:33:41 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ben@lennard.net.nz X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 1 Nov 2002 11:33:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 48231 invoked from network); 1 Nov 2002 11:33:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Nov 2002 11:33:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.87) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Nov 2002 11:33:40 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.136] by n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Nov 2002 11:33:40 -0000 Date: Fri, 01 Nov 2002 11:33:39 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} IBOC vs. AMAX Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2683 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Ben" X-Originating-IP: 203.97.97.131 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=118503946 X-Yahoo-Profile: benlennard > Hey! Welcome back Ben. What's the buzz? Are you the Lord >Mayor of > Greater Wellington yet? > > Ian > Melbourne > (the world's most liveable city - for Ben's benefit) Liked Melbourne, but love Wellington even more... ;-) Will resub to Friday humour once have hi speed internet at home, mean time I know the url... Anyway... In Australia and NZ, E147 is the standard set aside for digital radio. E147 is a new band as well, so will not (or should not?) impact on current AM band. E147, from samples I have personally heard, is absolutely f***inf amazing... Unlike IBOC, it will not impose directly on current AM or FM analoge broadcasts... - Ben, Windy Wellington. New Zealand. http://www.lennard.net.nz/ --- In amstereoforum@y..., Ian Davidson wrote: > On Fri, 1 Nov 2002, Kevin T. wrote: > > > It would be great to have Mike here in the AM Stereo Forum (if he > > isn't already!), but unfortunately his messages don't include an > > e-mail link, and Allan has dismissed me as "Mr. AM Stereo" (a title > > which I wear proudly!) and thus won't let me post messages to the > > Board myself. > > Keep punching Kevin! > > On our Oz google board I've built up the reputation of being AM stereo > fixated and may share that local title with Voltare-Matt2 who also cops > heaps. > > But we gotta do what we gotta do. This is the AM stereo forum. And as a > non-tech person I feel we must do whatever we can to advance the cause of > AM stereo. Whether it's digital or analog is secondary. We want AM > stereo! > > You've got to admit the iBiquity synopsis sounds great. > > Nobody is supposed to suffer as noone has to buy a new radio to maintain > what they've already got. If only it worked! And doesn't destroy what > we've already got. I'm really worried that IBOC may have a long and > painful death - and that maybe Symphony and Omega won't even get a start. > > All this non-tech guy knows is that he'll happily listen to C-quam AM > stereo till something better turns up. And he just has to hope and prey > that the local stations keep broadcasting it - and that he can get his US > allies to supply him with receivers. Both things looking less likely ... > > We MUST fight on! > > WE KNOW HOW GOOD IT IS!! > > I don't care how many people at the NAB read things like this. If any are > watching they should have a good look at themselves. How much do they > really love radio to create a system that possibly may destroy it? > > Hey! Welcome back Ben. What's the buzz? Are you the Lord Mayor of > Greater Wellington yet? > > Ian > Melbourne > (the world's most liveable city - for Ben's benefit) From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Nov 01 07:52:46 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 1 Nov 2002 15:52:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 31202 invoked from network); 1 Nov 2002 15:52:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Nov 2002 15:52:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Nov 2002 15:52:46 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.148] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Nov 2002 15:52:46 -0000 Date: Fri, 01 Nov 2002 15:52:44 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} IBOC vs. AMAX Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1412 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > In Australia and NZ, E147 is the standard set aside for digital > radio. E147 is a new band as well, so will not (or should not?) > impact on current AM band. > E147, from samples I have personally heard, is absolutely f***inf > amazing... Eureka 147 -- more commonly known as simply "DAB" (Digital Audio Broadcasting) -- uses MP2 audio (the predecessor to MP3) with bit- rates up to 256 kbps. From the samples I have heard, at 192 kbps and above it can sound better than AM Stereo or FM Stereo. At 160 kbps (more common), it sounds about the same. At 128 kbps, it sounds worse, although the sound is usually still tolerable to listen to. Thankfully, less than 128 kbps is not used on DAB for Stereo music; 80 kbps and 64 kbps are common for mono talk stations, with quality ranging from poor to acceptable. More impressive than it being "digital", is the lower amount of audio processing that most DAB stations use. Even the BBC's pop music stations, Radio 1 and Radio 2, use very relaxed processing, comparable to a typical Classical music station on the regular FM band. This is the one benefit of government-owned and -run stations; there is very little of the "Loudness War" as we have with commercial AM and FM stations. The BBC's Classical music station, Radio 3, is claimed to be broadcast with NO audio processing whatsoever, and certainly sounds like it, at least on DAB. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Nov 01 10:13:34 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 1 Nov 2002 18:13:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 95860 invoked from network); 1 Nov 2002 18:13:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Nov 2002 18:13:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.87) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Nov 2002 18:13:33 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.153] by n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Nov 2002 18:13:33 -0000 Date: Fri, 01 Nov 2002 18:13:31 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Message from WOR's CE Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 6877 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics The following message below was posted to the New York Radio Message Board today by Kerry Richards, 710 WOR's Chief Engineer. You can contact him at: krichards@wor710.com If Mr. Richards is being honest when he says he can't tell the difference with WOR's 5 kHz analog audio limit on hi-fi AMAX Denon and Sony tuners, then I think he must really have tin-can ears. All he needs to do is to go next door to 770 WABC to hear what analog AM audio is SUPPOSED to sound like, with full, crisp 10 kHz response -- and WITHOUT background hiss and splattering effects from the digital sidebands. He also claims that his model of Sony SRF-series AM Stereo radio (he doesn't specify which one, although it's probably a SRF-A1 or SRF- A100) "has not been made in almost twenty years", which is impossible because Sony didn't even *introduce* AM Stereo radios until 1984! Also notice the discussion of the 8.5 SECOND DELAY that IBOC adds to the signal. For baseball play-by-play, they have to bypass this delay on the analog signal, so therefore if you had an IBOC tuner during these broadcasts, the last 8.5 seconds of audio would be repeated when it enters digital mode, and if it blends back to analog due to poor reception, you would LOSE 8.5 seconds of audio as it skips back to real-time. And marginal signal areas with lots of blending between analog and digital modes would be pretty much useless and unintelligible! Posted by Kerry Richards CE WOR on November 01, 2002 at 12:39:59: I have sat by and watched all of the wild, great, sometimes confusing and inaccurate, comments about WOR and our testing of Ibiquity's HD radio system. Tom Ray, our Corporate Director of Engineering here at Buckley Broadcasting, (and my boss) has answered some of the posts here, now, I will give you some data from "the horses mouth". First, let me say I had some real concerns when we started this project several months ago. I was mainly concerned about the reduced analog audio bandwidth we were required to transmit, and also concerned we would get numerous listener complaints once we turned on the IBOC exciter. The reduced audio bandwidth turned out not to be an issue, and we recieved only one call from a listener when we turned on the IBOC exciter.(more later) Secondly, we had a great deal of preparation to make all of this happen. I had to rewire our Master Control and IFB monitoring system, because with the inherent IBOC delay, there was no way to monitor WOR off the air in the plant for operator use. Operators now monitor WOR off the 100% feed to the transmitter, instead of what comes off air. This also included re-wiring the notorious WOR time tone which now has to be sent out 8.5 seconds early (the HD radio exciter delay) so it arrives to our WOR listeners at exactly the top of the hour. At the transmitter, we had to run shielded CAT5 into the DX50 transmitter, and provide power for the IBOC interface box, install new processing and associated wiring for the HD signal. We also required wiring from the Ibiquity exciter into our remote control system. Once this was done, the actual tuning and testing of the IBOC exciter took several hours and was done on a Sunday afternoon while our Aux TX was on air. Although WOR had an STA from the FCC to operate the IBOC, we did not turn on the system "officially" until the day after the FCC approved IBOC. That day I recieved our one complaint. It was from a listener who refurbishes old radios. He was putting new tubes into an old Atwater Kent radio, and was hearing a "whistle". Once he retuned the radio, the whistle went away. That was our only complaint! In fact, we have recieved numerous listener comments that our signal has improved, and sounds louder and better on various radios! I attribute this to the increased level we are driving the analog signal with, since we had lowered it's bandwith. We now get several requests each day from inquiring listeners on where they can get an HD-Radio. However, from various message boards and posts we were subjected to a lot of mis-information and strange comments, I was surprised at how many "crackpots" there are are out there. WOR is not transmitting a 3.5khz bandwith analog signal. I have the bandwith set at 6khz on the Orban 9200. We arrived at this setting after numerous tests, we found that the majority of radios were in fact not as wide band as we thought, I have 9 AM radios at home, including the Denon AMAX tuner, and the Sony SRF radio. Those were the only two radios I had trouble with. The Sony SRF has not been made in almost twenty years, and I'm sure there are very few AMAX radios out there. The CC Radio, a high tech talk radio works fine, and so does the Henry Kloss Model One table radio which is wide band, both work well and WOR sounds great. We tested numerous other radios, both automotive and portables, no problems. So much for the Bandwidth concerns. WOR is not transmitting anything out of the NRSC mask, despite all the claims of others. We have taken numerous Spectrum Analyser measurments to ensure this. Yes, you can hear the digital carriers on our sidebands, but they are in the NRSC mask. We like to think of our digital carriers as the "WOR modem" on air! Our exciter did not burn up, we needed to reboot it, and the Ibquity engineers determined it should be replaced, since it wanted to be rebooted, which we did the next morning. The second exciter has been on air since, with no problems. We ramp down the analog delay to zero in the exciter, for all live sports events, then back to the 8.5 second delay after the live event is over. This is for those listeners at the games to be able to listen to WOR's play by play delay free. Ibiquity tells us they are working on this issue. Yes, Ibiquity is testing the signal in various vans and their laboratories in Warren NJ. We will eventually be testing at nightime, after the daytime data is in. This is a very time consuming project. Initial testing by Ibiquity has had some very positive data on the robust digital carriers in our coverage area. I now have a second IBOC receiver for our studio complex, and the results are very promising. WOR-HD is in fact FM "like" in quality, and blends nicely from analog to digital when tuning into WOR. Yes, I have actually heard it. If I had any complaint for Ibiquity it would be "send radios". Seriously, we need to get the radios out there, but we also need to complete some serious testing for Ibquity which we are doing now. Radios are coming out the second quarter of next year. I invite anyone who exhibits a desire for a serious technical discussion or has questions about WOR-HD, please e-mail me, likewise if you want to hear the HD radio system please contact me, Ibiquity is sending more radios soon. From possumhunter@netzero.net Fri Nov 01 10:42:55 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 1 Nov 2002 18:42:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 70989 invoked from network); 1 Nov 2002 18:42:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Nov 2002 18:42:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.193) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Nov 2002 18:42:53 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 1 Nov 2002 10:42:53 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} (unknown) Date: Fri, 1 Nov 2002 13:36:58 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 01 Nov 2002 18:42:53.0375 (UTC) FILETIME=[7CA1ACF0:01C281D6] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.138.59.101] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 "Ian Davidson" wrote: > What is the composition of the NAB? Is it just the big stations or pretty well ALL stations? Does FM dominate over AM? Any radio or TV station can join, but it is mostly made up of the big stations > > Why couldn't the smaller station owners band together? If 200 stations formed an association and agreed to broadcast CQuam for, say the next five years, maybe just one manufacturer could be persuaded to produce Symphony or Omega AM stereo/FM stereo radios. That would certainly be a good start. There are already a good bit of CQUAM stations on the air. The bad thing is some of the stations just added a stereo generator to a transmitter that already sounded bad. Now they broadcast 2 channels of crud instead of one. I think the FCC should bring back the old "proof of audio performance" checks. > > What's in it for smaller stations actually being in the NAB? A certificate to hang on the wall. Long live FREE RADIO! Death to the NAB! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From alfredot@inetarena.com Fri Nov 01 12:50:30 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: alfredot@inetarena.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 1 Nov 2002 20:50:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 62392 invoked from network); 1 Nov 2002 20:50:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Nov 2002 20:50:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.inetarena.com) (206.129.216.13) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Nov 2002 20:50:28 -0000 Received: from hendrie (1Cust226.tnt8.beaverton.or.da.uu.net [67.227.229.226]) by mail.inetarena.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id gA1KmDV24077; Fri, 1 Nov 2002 12:48:27 -0800 (PST) Date: Fri, 1 Nov 2002 13:49:34 -0800 (PST) X-Sender: alfredo@hendrie.1610am.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Cc: penry@nortelnetworks.com Subject: RE: (unknown) In-Reply-To: <1036143900.1707.88108.m4@yahoogroups.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: "Alfredo E. Torrejon" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=25132238 X-Yahoo-Profile: alfredotorrejon > With IBOC, you HAVE to buy a new radio. > > > Are any of the above true? Could all of the above possibly be a gross > exaggeration of the truth? The simple answer is this: while stations run IBOC in the hybrid (simultaneous analog and digital) mode, as WOR is currently doing, your analog radio will still work. However, there is an all-digital IBOC mode that won't be compatible with your radio. If IBOC rolls out successfully, the concern is that eventually, the FCC will set an "analog sunset" date, at which all stations will have to cease hybrid operation and switch to the all-digital mode. When that happens, all analog radios will become useless. A secondary concern is that if AM hybrid operation really causes as much interference as some say that it does, then AM listenership might further erode by the analog sunset date. Although this is just my opinion, I am worried that the worst might happen--receiver manufacturers decide to build IBOC FM only radios (no AM at all!). Unless the FCC makes them include AM, the manufacturers might say, "well, our marketing research shows that there is no interest in AM broadcasting in the United States." Far fetched? Well, that is exactly what Sony and other foreign consumer electronics manufacturers have said about AM Stereo. Alfredo From penry@nortelnetworks.com Fri Nov 01 12:55:57 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: penry@nortelnetworks.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 1 Nov 2002 20:55:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 95157 invoked from network); 1 Nov 2002 20:55:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Nov 2002 20:55:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com) (47.103.122.112) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Nov 2002 20:55:56 -0000 Received: from zrc2c011.us.nortel.com (zrc2c011.us.nortel.com [47.103.120.51]) by zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id gA1Ku8h04325 for ; Fri, 1 Nov 2002 14:56:08 -0600 (CST) Received: by zrc2c011.us.nortel.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Fri, 1 Nov 2002 14:55:54 -0600 Message-ID: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A560797404571100@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: {AMSF} Message from WOR's CE Date: Fri, 1 Nov 2002 14:55:53 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) From: "Charles Penry" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=376233 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa5vhu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Kevin, Did you actually read what Kerry Richards wrote? Kevin said: If Mr. Richards is being honest when he says he can't tell the difference with WOR's 5 kHz analog audio limit on hi-fi AMAX Denon and Sony tuners, then I think he must really have tin-can ears. All he needs to do is to go next door to 770 WABC to hear what analog AM audio is SUPPOSED to sound like, with full, crisp 10 kHz response -- and WITHOUT background hiss and splattering effects from the digital sidebands. I never read where Kerry Richards said he could not tell the "difference with WOR's 5 kHz analog audio limit on hi-fi AMAX Denon and Sony tuners". He even said "I have 9 AM radios at home, including the Denon AMAX tuner, and the Sony SRF radio. Those were the only two radios I had trouble with." So he said that he had trouble with those radios, though he did not elaborate on what those troubles were. I wonder how many of his customers listen to his product on those types of wideband radios. Kerry also said: The reduced audio bandwidth turned out not to be an issue, and we received only one call from a listener when we turned on the IBOC exciter.(more later) In fact, we have received numerous listener comments that our signal has improved, and sounds louder and better on various radios! I attribute this to the increased level we are driving the analog signal with, since we had lowered its bandwidth. He also said "I have the bandwidth set at 6khz on the Orban 9200." Kevin, that's 6Khz, not 5KHz. Keep your facts straight and refrain from the unjustified personal insults. Then Kevin said: He also claims that his model of Sony SRF-series AM Stereo radio (he doesn't specify which one, although it's probably a SRF-A1 or SRF- A100) "has not been made in almost twenty years", which is impossible because Sony didn't even *introduce* AM Stereo radios until 1984! I don't know when the SRF-A1 or SRF-A110 was made. Do you? If it was made in 1984 then 2002 minus 1984 comes to 18 years. How close to 20 years must one be to qualify for "almost twenty years"? I will see if there is a date on my SRF-A100 when I get home tonight. Stick to facts, if you don't think his radio is almost 20 years old then instead of telling us what is impossible, give us a fact. Tell us how old his radio is and what qualifies as "almost". Anyway, what is your point, other than personal insults? I suspect that the majority of his customers are listening on radios that are much newer that "almost twenty years" or even newer than 18 years old so it is a moot point. And then Kevin said: Also notice the discussion of the 8.5 SECOND DELAY that IBOC adds to the signal. For baseball play-by-play, they have to bypass this delay on the analog signal, so therefore if you had an IBOC tuner during these broadcasts, the last 8.5 seconds of audio would be repeated when it enters digital mode, and if it blends back to analog due to poor reception, you would LOSE 8.5 seconds of audio as it skips back to real-time. And marginal signal areas with lots of blending between analog and digital modes would be pretty much useless and unintelligible! Kerry said: We ramp down the analog delay to zero in the exciter, for all live sports events, then back to the 8.5 second delay after the live event is over. This is for those listeners at the games to be able to listen to WOR's play by play delay free. Ibiquity tells us they are working on this issue. Perhaps Ibiquity will come up with a solution for this. Perhaps not. I bet that Ibiquity is under a lot of pressure from WOR and other broadcasters in this situation to reduce the delay to something more useable, perhaps one or two seconds. And since it looks like some time before there are receivers available for consumers, Ibiquity has some time. And, after what Kerry said about Ibiquity working on the delay, your point is? Kerry Richards is the Chief Engineer for WOR 710 AM. As Chief Engineer, I doubt that it was his decision to put IBOC on WOR. Buckley Broadcasting, owner of WOR owns 18 stations so they are likely big enough that a Chief Engineer would not make those types of final decisions. Chief Engineer at WOR is his job and I'm sure he would like to keep it. I would suspect that IBOC was mostly a business, not a technical decision at WOR. Also, there is likely some pride that Kerry has in being the first Chief Engineer at the first station to operate IBOC full time without a STA. Kerry may be THE Chief Engineer that decides whether IBOC will be practical or not, and as such, he should stay as unbiased as he can. I did not see Kerry give any personal opinions that were anti-AMS or anti wideband AM in his comments here. I did see numerous indications of Kerry doing his job. His JOB. WOR advertises themselves as "Americas Talk and Information Station", so I doubt that they believe that they have a lot of use for FM quality stereo sound. It would be great for us to hear their liners in wonderful full bandwidth analog stereo but we few are not Kerry's customers. His customers are his bosses and the majority of the listeners of WOR. That is who he works for. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From penry@nortelnetworks.com Fri Nov 01 15:15:59 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: penry@nortelnetworks.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 1 Nov 2002 23:15:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 70434 invoked from network); 1 Nov 2002 23:15:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Nov 2002 23:15:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com) (47.103.122.112) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Nov 2002 23:15:57 -0000 Received: from zrc2c011.us.nortel.com (zrc2c011.us.nortel.com [47.103.120.51]) by zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id gA1NG9h10027 for ; Fri, 1 Nov 2002 17:16:10 -0600 (CST) Received: by zrc2c011.us.nortel.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Fri, 1 Nov 2002 17:15:56 -0600 Message-ID: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A5607974045712A3@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: The Sky Is Falling / Death To Chicken Little! Date: Fri, 1 Nov 2002 17:15:54 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) From: "Charles Penry" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=376233 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa5vhu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit First, I want to apologize to the group for not entering something in the Subject line. It is bad manners. I have now added some descriptive text. When I made my comments, I wanted some real discussion to take place, not just some overly negative one-liners that were being used for their shock value, or as a mean spirited Hate statement. Perhaps we have been watching too many negative political campaign ads on TV. Or listening to too many of them on beautiful analog AM Stereo. Or trying to understand them on the rolled off analog audio of an IBOC station. Or trying to use our analog brain to decode them through the swishy digitized audio on an IBOC receiver. Anyway, it looks like I got some real discussion going. Understand that I believe that both AM and FM IBOC is not a good technical solution and is not likely to be the great savior to radio. It will trash both bands for some listeners and from what I have heard so far, is not going to sound any better and quite possibly will not sound as good as even the average current analog receiver. However it is digital and just the word digital is often all that is needed to sell the public on a product. See below if you are interested in my responses, positioned to the far left, which are not necessarily my political views... Charles Charles wrote: > Perhaps I don't understand. Can you please explain to me how IBOC > will make me HAVE to buy a new radio to hear the local stations that I normally listen to? Most AM radios have a bandwidth of around 5 or 6 KHz. The better home and car radios have a 9Khz Bandwidth. With IBOC, Only 5Khz is under modulated lo-fi mono analog audio, with the digital data stream extending out to 25Khz. That means that your nice good sounding Delco radio will hear the lo-fi mono signal with a bunch of digital hash in the audio as well! In the US and Canada, radio channels are spaced 10Khz wide. This means an IBOC station will not only wipe out the first adjacent, but will get the second as well. It seems to me that many people on this list are often moaning about how narrow the bandwidth of the average receiver is. I have two Sony, an old Panasonic and Marantz component receivers and they all sound like they have about 5KHz of response on AM. I have numerous boom boxes and portable radios that also have narrow bandwidth AM receivers. One of my cars has the factory stock narrow bandwidth AM receiver. The only exceptions I have are a couple of Sony AMS receivers and a Blaupunkt mono car radio that has wide bandwidth. So out of perhaps 15 radios, I suppose I may have a problem with two. One of the AMS portables and the Blaupunkt may have a problem as these do not have a narrow bandwidth setting. So will I, as an average listener, HAVE to buy a new radio or all new radios to hear the local stations that I normally listen to? No. If I were an average consumer, I would throw the little radio away and not listen to AM on my car radio if it is that bad. It's almost time for a new car anyway. Or I could put the factory radio back in if I wanted to. I bought the little portable with AMS for the AM stereo and the Blaupunkt with wide AM bandwidth for good AM sound (I could not find an AMS car radio at the time). On those two points, I am not an average consumer, so if those two are dropped, I think I would not HAVE to buy any new radios to hear my local AM stations. Your situation, as an average consumer, may vary. Your situation, as a hobbyist will likely be impacted. How would this degrade radio in "REAL LIFE"? You are on the Southwest side of the New York market and want to listen to the evening news on WCBS 880. IBOC noise from WWL 870 and WLS 890 will be coming in on Skywave and destroy the analog, and most likely screw up the digital IBOC signal from WCBS. No matter HOW you do the math, you cannot fit three 25Khz wide signals in 30Khz of spectrum I don't think I will get enough Skywave reception from New Orleans or Chicago during the day do cause interference from IBOC sidebands while I am well within the 2.5 mV/m contour of my local New York fifty-thousand watt blowtorch non-directional AM station. Can you possibly explain the math behind that? or.... You are in downtown Greenville, SC and you want to listen to Southern Gospel music on the 1000 watt daytimer, WCKI 1300. The IBOC noise from 5000 Watt WANS 1280 and 5000 Watt WYRD 1300 is going to keep you from listening to your Southern Gospel music! Remember that as an average consumer, I only listen to local stations. The limit of local coverage contour of 2.5 mV/m for WCKI 1300 cuts right through what looks like the middle of downtown Greenville, so I may or may not consider it a local station with a signal worth listening to. If I work in any kind of building in a downtown area, I would likely not be able to receive much in the way of AM broadcast signals in my office anyway. http://www.radio-locator.com/cgi-bin/pat?call=WCKI&service=AM&status=L&hours =D For WANS on 1280, the distant coverage of 0.5 mV/m cuts through at about the same place: http://www.radio-locator.com/cgi-bin/pat?call=WANS&service=AM&status=L&hours =D For WYRD on 1330 (not 1300), the transmitter is near downtown Greenville, so at 30 KHz away this might or might not pose a problem. The facts are that IBOC stays within the FCC mandated mask. If there is interference, call the FCC, not the radio station and not Ibiquity. The FCC mandated the mask and all modulation schemes have to stay within it. http://www.radio-locator.com/cgi-bin/pat?call=WYRD&service=AM&status=L&hours =D or... You are in Greenwood, SC and want to listen to Rush on 5000 Watt WCZZ 1090, Nope! The IBOC signal from 50,000 Watt WCSZ 1070 will kill that signal. Get real. You are saying that I am in Greenwood so I am less than five miles from WCZZ with 5,000 watts, and well within their 25 mile 2.5 mV/m contour, and I can't hear them because I am in the 0.175 mV/m contour of WCSZ and my desired signal is being "killed" by their IBOC sidebands? I think I must need a new radio! http://www.radio-locator.com/cgi-bin/pat?call=WCZZ&service=AM&status=L&hours =D http://www.radio-locator.com/cgi-bin/pat?call=WCSZ&service=AM&status=L&hours =D You decide to try G.Gordon Liddy on 1000 Watt WLMA 1350. Not a chance with IBOC noise from WYRD 1330, WSSC 1340, and WELP 1360. Same words, different pictures: http://www.radio-locator.com/cgi-bin/pat?call=WLMA&service=AM&status=L&hours =D http://www.radio-locator.com/cgi-bin/pat?call=WYRD&service=AM&status=L&hours =D For other listeners here, try not to get Greenwood and Greenville confused. The only other AM in Greenwood is 1000 Watt WCRS 1450, so you decide to listen to Southern Gospel, right? WRONG! IBOC from 5000 Watt WGVL 1440 and 5000 Watt WQXL 1470 will wipe it out. There are no other AM stations in Greenwood. These are even more unbelievable! These two are at or outside the 0.15 mV/m contours. This means that they fall into this analog category: Fringe Coverage: Within this area, the station's signal will be very weak. You may be able to receive this station if you have a very good radio with a good antenna, but it's possible that interference from other stations may prevent you from picking up these stations at all. Hard to see how their IBOC sidebands could keep you from hearing a 1,000 watt station that is less than 5 miles away: http://www.radio-locator.com/cgi-bin/pat?call=WCRS&service=AM&status=L&hours =U http://www.radio-locator.com/cgi-bin/pat?call=WGVL&service=AM&status=L&hours =D http://www.radio-locator.com/cgi-bin/pat?call=WQXL&service=AM&status=L&hours =D > How does this type of exaggeration (lying) help promote analog AM > Stereo? > >I am not so dumb as to try to listen to a station broadcasting in IBOC >with my radio in the forced AM Stereo and/or the wideband mode. True, but when you cannot hear your favorite small market station due to a IBOC Powerhouse next to it, please re-send this letter! I just did. Please see the facts above. >Our posts can be read on the web by anyone, including people that have >the power to influence the decisions that can help our cause. THAT'S GOOD! If MORE letters like the ones I write get stuck on station manager's desks, Perhaps they will think twice about IBOC conversion, or turning off their CQUAM generator. Please re-read my screaming kid analogy and see if it fits your approach. > Would you like help from some people from inside the NAB? With the recent track record of the NAB when it comes to AM or small market stations, there is little to no chance they will help us. So, you really must work for the NAB? You are doing a good job of making sure your above statement comes true. The NAB is who is pushing FOR IBOC, remember? The NAB is made up of people. Some are pushing for IBOC. Some are ambivalent. Some are not in favor of IBOC. Which group are you influencing? Which group are you alienating? > Do you think it makes them feel good and want to help our cause (or > yours) when you have a tag line of "Death to the NAB"? The tag line is there because of their actions. So, clarify something for me. When you say "Death to the NAB!", are you talking about the National Association of Broadcasters and if so, are you saying that you want the NAB association to just die, or are you saying that you want to kill them yourself, or are you implying that you want to kill them with help of others that are easily swayed to your cause? Can you name the names of the individual people at the NAB that fall under the category of your "Death to the NAB!" or are does your "Death to the NAB!" cover all the individual people that work for or belong to the NAB? I just want to get this clarified so the record will be straight when the investigation is underway after the death or deaths start. > If you are worried about losing your ability to DX the AM band, fine > but what does that have to do with AM Stereo. CQUAM and IBOC are NOT compatible with each other. You will only hear noisy Lo-Fi mono, or jammed CQUAM STEREO on your AMAX tuner when IBOC hits the street. I think everyone on this group is aware of this. This is not news. Are you sure you are sending your emails to the correct group? As an average consumer, what local store can I go buy one of these types of CQUAM STEREO or AMAX radios that won't work? And I want one to connect to my home stereo, one for my car, and one to carry out into the yard when I am gardening. Incase you are not aware, your analog TV is fixing to be landfill filler too! What does my TV have to do with AM Stereo? I look forward to the day that my analog TV won't work and I will have a real excuse to tell the wife why we need, not want, a new flat panel screen HDTV! I just hope she doesn't find out about the low cost converters. > And, as an AM DX'er you are a minority, not the average listener, > which the broadcast medium is designed for. See the above cases of LOCAL, not DX reception problems. See my above factual answers. > And if you DX the AM band, you likely have a special receiver now that > is made for or is optimum for DX reception. How will this new radio that you will have to buy due to IBOC help you with your AM DX hobby? If you call an old tube type radio from the 1930s a "Special Receiver", I guess that's OK. I doubt there is a person on this list that does not have a "Special Receiver" such as a Japanese market AM Stereo radio, or some home-brew Stereo decoder patched into a Mono AM radio. Yes, myself included on the special receivers. What is your point? I don't expect to listen to one of the local stations in my area that is broadcasting IBOC with my SRF-A100 in the wideband forced stereo mode. That would be a silly thing to do and I am not that stupid. And yes, IBOC is likely to end AM medium wave DX'ing. Does the average consumer care? >What do you want, and what is the best way to get it? High Fidelity AM STEREO radio is what all of us wants. The ONLY way we will keep it is to make enough noise that the station managers hear it. The NAB and NPR are for IBOC, so the FCC only hears the LOUD voice of the NAB and ignores the faint cries of the small market station owner. One path to High Fidelity AM STEREO may be full IBOC with no analog component. Not much chance to DX with one of those. Will be local stations only. That will be a bummer. Long live FREE RADIO! Indeed! Death to the NAB! Lighten up! Death to the AMS! (American Mathematical Society) Remember that there are three kinds of mathematicians: those who can count and those who can't. Just kidding!!! Charles Part-time moderator of himself [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From florida_amstereo@hotmail.com Fri Nov 01 15:30:04 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: florida_amstereo@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 1 Nov 2002 23:30:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 59574 invoked from network); 1 Nov 2002 23:30:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Nov 2002 23:30:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.37.40) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Nov 2002 23:30:03 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 1 Nov 2002 15:30:03 -0800 Received: from 209.240.198.61 by pv2fd.pav2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Fri, 01 Nov 2002 23:30:03 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Sony SRF A300 Date: Fri, 01 Nov 2002 23:30:03 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 01 Nov 2002 23:30:03.0353 (UTC) FILETIME=[9A7FAC90:01C281FE] From: "Donn Tillman" X-Originating-IP: [209.240.198.61] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83914824 I would appreciate it if anyone could give me some details about the Sony SRF a300; there was some discussion about a month ago, that it was a good sounding radio, but I am trying to find out if: 1) if it has forced stereo (as the SRF-42) 2) if it has a headphone jack (or just the external speakers) 3) does it cover the extended am band, if not, how high does it goes 1610; 1620? thanks donn tillman st petersburg an am stereo/iboc free zone _________________________________________________________________ Unlimited Internet access -- and 2 months free!  Try MSN. http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/2monthsfree.asp From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Nov 01 18:13:14 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 2 Nov 2002 02:13:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 22941 invoked from network); 2 Nov 2002 02:13:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Nov 2002 02:13:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.90) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Nov 2002 02:13:12 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.181] by n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Nov 2002 02:13:12 -0000 Date: Sat, 02 Nov 2002 02:13:11 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Message from WOR's CE Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A560797404571100@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3566 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.71.163 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > He also said "I have the bandwidth set at 6khz on the Orban 9200." > Kevin, that's 6Khz, not 5KHz. Keep your facts straight and refrain > from the unjustified personal insults. Likewise. When the IBOC digital carriers are on, the analog audio response is limited to an absolute maximum of 5 kHz. That's not WOR's choice, that's the nature of the beast. The digital sidebands begin at just above +/- 5 kHz, and you can't have the analog audio clash into them. The 6 kHz that Kerry refers to is WOR's audio bandwidth when they are transmitting in PURE ANALOG mode at night, without the IBOC system on. This is strictly WOR's choice, as they could use the full 10 kHz NRSC response at night, just as they did before they started using IBOC during the daytime. > I don't know when the SRF-A1 or SRF-A110 was made. Do you? If it > was made in 1984 then 2002 minus 1984 comes to 18 years. How close > to 20 years must one be to qualify for "almost twenty years"? Sony's SRF-series AM Stereo radios weren't even *designed* until 1983. Their widespread introduction came in 1984, and new ones remained available until the late 1980s. The next Sony radio with AM Stereo that was sold in North America, the SRF-42 Walkman, made its debut in January 1994 and was featured in the Radio Shack catalog up to the year 2000. Does 2000 sound like "hasn't been made for almost twenty years" to you? > Anyway, what is your point, other than personal insults? I could ask the same thing about your own message here. I hate that I am writing a response as stern and argumentative as this one is right now, but I am obligated to defend my own statements against criticism, just as anybody else. > I suspect that the majority of his customers are listening on > radios that are much newer that "almost twenty years" or even newer > than 18 years old so it is a moot point. Moot point or not, it is WOR's loss, because the absolute highest quality AM and AM Stereo radios that have ever been sold in North America are the "AMAX" radios from 1993 to present. You can still walk into a store and buy a GE Superadio III radio or its Radio Shack clone that is AMAX certified and will sound even better than FM in Wide bandwidth mode. Also, we have the new AMAX AM Stereo receiver from Fanfare and Omega Reception Technologies which is the pioneer of a new generation of high quality analog AM Stereo radios. > I did not see Kerry give any personal opinions that were anti-AMS > or anti wideband AM in his comments here. Then you should see his private e-mail response to me. I took him up on his offer and sent him a professionally and courteously written message that focused the legitimate issues of how IBOC compares to AMAX in real-world conditions. He wrote back a scathing response filled with personal attacks and such illogical arguments as that C-QUAM AM Stereo is complex and problematic to set up on a station's transmitter; nevermind the fact that IBOC is modulated as QUAM and therefore requires the same exact type of performance objectives as AM Stereo does in order to transmit a good signal! Nevertheless, Kerry did mention that anybody who asks is free to come over and listen to a demonstration of WOR's IBOC digital audio at either their studios in NYC or at their transmitter site in NJ (the station has in its possession a total of two IBOC test receivers, and that is where they are set up). Just keep in mind that it will be in glorious monaural, as WOR does not have a Stereo audio chain set up yet. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Nov 01 18:54:37 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 2 Nov 2002 02:54:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 12021 invoked from network); 2 Nov 2002 02:54:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Nov 2002 02:54:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Nov 2002 02:54:36 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.172] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Nov 2002 02:54:36 -0000 Date: Sat, 02 Nov 2002 02:54:35 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: The Skywaves Are Falling / Death To Chicken Little! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A5607974045712A3@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 5531 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.71.163 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > I don't think I will get enough Skywave reception from New Orleans > or Chicago during the day do cause interference from IBOC sidebands > while I am well within the 2.5 mV/m contour of my local New York > fifty-thousand watt blowtorch non-directional AM station. Can you > possibly explain the math behind that? I live close enough to NYC that I can pick up 770 WABC on a crystal radio. Their signal booms in loud and clear, day and night. And yet, on my Aiwa bookshelf stereo system (manufactured in 1999) sitting here in my basement using only its supplied loop antenna, at night the skywave of 760 WJR from Detroit sometimes comes in strongly enough to splatter ONTO 770 WABC. Not the other way around; when I tune in 770 I can hear the "monkey chatter" coming from the SKYWAVE 760 WJR signal -- even without purposely adjusting the antenna to "null out" WABC's signal. Same thing with 650 WSM, which sometimes comes in strongly enough to splatter ONTO local 50,000-watt non-directional Class I-A station 660 WFAN. And yes, I *have* heard 870 WWL come in strongly enough to splatter onto local 880 WCBS -- even on a crummy Panasonic stereo with the typical 5 kHz audio bandwidth. This is exactly the kind of condition that will render IBOC useless at night. At sundown, the skywaves are going to come rolling in, no matter if the signals they are carrying are analog, digital, or some combination of both (as IBOC currently is) -- and short of totally screwing up the upper atmosphere, there is nothing we can do to stop skywave propagation. The AM band NEEDS to be arranged to make allowance for skywave at night, and for the past 80 years or so, it pretty much has been. IBOC may be able to mess with Texas, but it ain't gonna be able to mess with the skywaves, and even if we jacked up all the IBOC stations to 500,000 watts, they would still have reception problems in their local listening areas. > Remember that as an average consumer, I only listen to local > stations. Try living in central New Jersey and listening to FM. There are no "local stations". You have a choice between stations from NYC, Philly, the Lehigh Valley, and the Jersey Shore, all of which are about equally far away. Thus, almost EVERY 0.2 MHz increment across the band is filled with signals, and whatever your choice of station might be, it is probably going to have neighbors on either side of it. As is, it's already a tight fit, and in my own casual observations, I have found a SURPRISINGLY high number of "average" people who listen to FM signals which are technically "DX", especially in the car. They'll listen to 94.1 WYSP from Philly, even as 93.9 WNYC-FM from NYC and 94.3 WJLK from the Jersey Shore are bordering it. They'll listen to 96.1 WCTO from the Lehigh Valley, even as 95.9 WRAT from the Jersey Shore and 96.3 WQXR from NYC are bordering it. Etc.... so, if EVERY station on FM used IBOC, they'd all wipe each other out with interference, and the FM band in this area would be completely unlistenable except for small "halos" of a few miles around local non-commercial stations run by colleges and high schools. > Get real. You are saying that I am in Greenwood so I am less than > five miles from WCZZ with 5,000 watts, and well within their 25 > mile 2.5 mV/m contour, and I can't hear them because I am in the > 0.175 mV/m contour of WCSZ and my desired signal is being "killed" > by their IBOC sidebands? I think I must need a new radio! FYI, just this afternoon I was listening to Neal's own excellent WTTM 1680 AM Stereo well within its "Interference Free" daytime coverage contour -- and yet, the Lucent IBOC test station on 1700 kHz was splattering all over it with a loud and constant hissing/squealing noise, as heard on a Chrysler AMAX AM Stereo car radio with automatic bandwidth control. Despite WTTM's superb Stereo sound, the constant background noise from WI2XAM's IBOC sideband was really quite annoying to listen to. I don't think anybody with working ears would not be able to hear it and be annoyed by it. > And yes, IBOC is likely to end AM medium wave DX'ing. Does the > average consumer care? You can judge by yourself by listening to a clear channel (note lowercase C's) AM station that has its own call-in show at night, and observing the locations where people are calling in from. They might not get callers from "38 states and 7 Canadian provinces" as some 50,000-watt AM stations claim, but their practical nighttime skywave coverage area is still a few hundred miles. I hear people calling in to 1030 WBZ in Boston from as far away as Pennsylvania and Maryland. Then there is the incredible 740 CHWO from Ontario, with excellent Notalgia music and a LIVE DJ at night, and just the other day I heard him mention getting a call from a truck driver listening to CHWO down in Kentucky. CHWO is very proud of their large signal coverage at night, and as a station from Canada -- where IBOC is not and will not be used -- they have especially a lot to lose if IBOC becomes prevalent down here, with "foreign" IBOC signals splattering onto "their" purely analog AM band. > (American Mathematical Society) Remember that there are three > kinds of mathematicians: > those who can count and those who can't. Just kidding!!! Q. Why did the Microsoft programmer confuse Halloween with Christmas? A. Because OCT 31 = DEC 25. p.s. I think WOR should start playing Classical music. They could call it "I-BACH"! From possumhunter@netzero.net Fri Nov 01 19:31:12 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 2 Nov 2002 03:31:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 23453 invoked from network); 2 Nov 2002 03:31:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Nov 2002 03:31:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.91) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Nov 2002 03:31:11 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 1 Nov 2002 19:31:11 -0800 To: , Cc: , , References: Subject: WOR's Digital Interference with WLW/ re: Message from WOR's CE Date: Fri, 1 Nov 2002 22:30:57 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 02 Nov 2002 03:31:11.0511 (UTC) FILETIME=[4A316270:01C28220] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.166.43.165] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Kevin T." wrote: > The following message below was posted to the New York Radio Message Board today by Kerry Richards, 710 WOR's Chief Engineer. You can contact him at: krichards@wor710.com I am copying this to him, as well as the GM of WLW 700Khz and the GM of WFIS > > Posted by Kerry Richards CE WOR on November 01, 2002 at 12:39:59: > > In fact, we have received numerous listener comments that our signal has improved, and sounds louder and better on various radios! I attribute this to the increased level we are driving the analog signal with, since we had lowered it's bandwidth. It is true that with a news/talk station, by lowering the bandwidth, you can increase the modulation levels without going over 99% Negative and 125% Positive peaks. I have done this on several News/Talk stations I have done engineering for. > > WOR is not transmitting a 3.5khz bandwidth analog signal. I have the bandwidth set at 6khz on the Orban 9200. Again I agree with Kerry cutting the bandwidth of a News/Talk station. Most talk networks have rotten audio anyway, so the only thing you are cutting out is noise that would be transmitted over the air. > >WOR is not transmitting anything out of the NRSC mask, despite all the claims of others. We have taken numerous Spectrum Analyzer measurements to ensure this. Yes, you can hear the digital carriers on our sidebands, but they are in the NRSC mask. We like to think of our digital carriers as the "WOR modem" on air! Here is where I differ greatly with WORs Engineer! While it may be true that WOR's Digital data carriers are within the NRCS mask, the digital noise is constant where an analog signal, even with 9.5Khz bandwidth, has very little modulation density out near the 9Khz NRSC limit. I can hear the digital data stream on WOR, but it is not bad enough to be an irritant on my factory Toyota Am/FM/CD/Tape radio in my 2001 Toyota Tacoma. It is also listenable on several of my old tube radios, and my Sangean made Realistic DX-808. The digital noise does make it unlistenable with my GE Superadio in the "Narrow" mode, Realistic DX-400, RCA SuperBrain console, and my Sony SRF-42. That is no biggie to me because I am not normally a WOR listener anyway! However, I am a 700 WLW listener! WOR's digital noise makes an awful racket on my Toyota factory radio when it is tuned to WLW. It also makes WLW sound bad on my old Crosley radios that have "WLW" printed right on the dial instead of "700"! Even in the "Narrow" position, WLW is not listenable on my GE Superadio or my Sony SRF-42 or my SuperBrain. In fact, the only radios I own that sound good on WLW when WOR is running IBOC is my Sony ICF-2010 in lower sideband mode, and few of the "cheapie" AC/DC 5 tube table radios from the '50s. That is a shame because I do LOVE to listen to the "Big One's" Super Sounding audio. WLW could try to counter the digital noise with a Kahn PowerSide, but it would degrade that beautiful WLW sound. It is a special treat to hear the old Western Electric transmitter on the air! I have not heard it in a while. The only reason I didn't speak up about the problem until now is I though WOR was having technical problems. I was not aware of them broadcasting in IBOC Digital. I have had "whistling" Optimods drive me bonkers trying to figure out what was wrong, so I thought WOR was having such a problem! > >Yes, Ibiquity is testing the signal in various vans and their laboratories in Warren NJ. We will eventually be testing at nighttime, after the daytime data is in. This is a very time consuming project. That would explain the noise being a problem mostly during "Critical Hours". > > I invite anyone who exhibits a desire for a serious technical discussion or has questions about WOR-HD, please e-mail me, likewise if you want to hear the HD radio system please contact me, Ibiquity is sending more radios soon. I would love to hear the HD radio! I am an AM radio nut who would rather listen to a nice, Hi-Fi C-QUAM AM STEREO station than any FM. It would be VERY interesting to hear how the HD radio performs on a Sky Wave DX signal. I have not heard the X-Band test station in Warren, NJ. Even if it is on at night, I would never hear it with WEUP and WJCC coming in on SkyWave. Perhaps Ibiquity could scoot the test station up to 1710Khz??? There has been much discussion on this board about the test station jamming WTTM, much to the displeasure of WTTM's Engineer! I do know what would be the ultimate test for Ibiquity HD radio, IF the owner of WFIS would go along with cutting his Great Sounding audio: There is a HUGE co-channel interference problem between WFIS 1600 and short-spaced WTZQ that makes both stations unlistenable in the lucrative Greenville SC market. I wonder how the IBOC system would work under those conditions. I also wonder if the WFIS Harris SX1A transmitter, or the back up LPB AM-60 transmitter would transmit the IBOC signal without heavy modifications. I am sure WFIS's narrow bandwidth ATU would have to be replaced. Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From possumhunter@netzero.net Fri Nov 01 20:26:38 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 2 Nov 2002 04:26:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 78287 invoked from network); 2 Nov 2002 04:26:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Nov 2002 04:26:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.82) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Nov 2002 04:26:38 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 1 Nov 2002 20:26:38 -0800 To: References: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A5607974045712A3@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} The Sky Is Falling / Death To Chicken Little! Date: Fri, 1 Nov 2002 23:26:24 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 02 Nov 2002 04:26:38.0079 (UTC) FILETIME=[08FB60F0:01C28228] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.166.43.165] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Charles Penry wrote: > I don't think I will get enough Skywave reception from New Orleans or Chicago during the day do cause interference from IBOC sidebands while I am well within the 2.5 mV/m contour of my local New York fifty-thousand watt blowtorch non-directional AM station. Can you possibly explain the math behind that? When I was the back-up engineer at WESC 660 (now WLFJ), The guys at WNBC (now WFAN) sure raised enough hell, along with the local New York listeners of WNBC. When we would crank up the 10,000 Watt critical hours transmitter, then they would call raising all kinds of hell when we hit the Non-Directional 50,000 Watt daytime transmitter! It got so that the station manager would call the AM transmitter plant wondering what was wrong if he did NOT get a call from mad New Yorker! > > Get real. You are saying that I am in Greenwood so I am less than five miles from WCZZ with 5,000 watts, and well within their 25 mile 2.5 mV/m contour, and I can't hear them because I am in the 0.175 mV/m contour of WCSZ and my desired signal is being "killed" by their IBOC sidebands? I think I must need a new radio! > > Greenwood is a unique market with unique problems. They are close enough to the Greenville/Spartanburg/Anderson market, Augusta, GA market, and Columbia Market to be slammed with radio signals. Many of the out of market stations have MUCH stronger signals than the maps would indicate. These signals make a mess out of Grennwood's radio signals. > > So, you really must work for the NAB? You are doing a good job of making sure your above statement comes true. OK, YOU WIN! I removed the anti-NAB part of my sig file. Happy? > > So, clarify something for me. When you say "Death to the NAB!", are you talking about the National Association of Broadcasters and if so, are you saying that you want the NAB association to just die, YUP! The chances of that happening is very slim, but it is a nice thought. or are you saying that > >As an average consumer, what local store can I go buy one of these types of CQUAM STEREO or AMAX radios that won't work? Almost any store that sells portable radios have the AMAX GE Superadio, or you can go buy it's clone at Radio Shack. Many cars come with wide band AM radios and many of them are wide band STEREO, even if they are not AMAX certified for some reason. You can get an AMAX home stereo tuner from any good stereo dealer. > > And I want one to connect to my home stereo, one for my car, and one to carry out into the yard when I am gardening. Buy them from Kevtronics. We should support him for all he does for AM STEREO anyway. > > What does my TV have to do with AM Stereo? It is just another example of a popular electronic devise that will be made useless by a mostly unwanted digital service replacing it. > > I look forward to the day that my analog TV won't work and I will have a real excuse to tell the wife why we need, not want, a new flat panel screen HDTV! I just hope she doesn't find out about the low cost converters. Have you seen a converter in use for yourself? The Samsung I saw made a rotten looking picture! It was MUCH worse looking than the Analog signal from the built in tuner on the same TV, a Sony KV-27XBR45 > > And yes, IBOC is likely to end AM medium wave DX'ing. Does the average consumer care? Almost all over the road truckers running at night are listening to a DX signal on AM. Just ask Dave Nemo (WWL) or Bozo (WLW), or Bill Mack (WBAP) Many of the callers on 740 CHWO are DX listeners! Many other clear channels brag on their nighttime signal coverage as well. > > Death to the AMS! So, clarify something for me. When you say "Death to the AMS!", are you saying that you want the AMS association to just die, or are you saying that you want to kill them yourself, or are you implying that you want to kill them with help of others that are easily swayed to your cause? Can you name the names of the individual mathematicians at the AMS that fall under the category of your "Death to the AMS!" or are does your "Death to the AMS!" cover all the individual mathematicians that work for or belong to the AMS? I just want to get this clarified so the record will be straight when the investigation is underway after the death or deaths start. Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From KC4QLP@aol.com Fri Nov 01 22:27:20 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 2 Nov 2002 06:27:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 64005 invoked from network); 2 Nov 2002 06:27:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Nov 2002 06:27:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m05.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.8) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Nov 2002 06:27:17 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.135.16fa5715 (25305) for ; Sat, 2 Nov 2002 01:27:13 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <135.16fa5715.2af4ca40@aol.com> Date: Sat, 2 Nov 2002 01:27:12 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Message from WOR's CE To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp << The 6 kHz that Kerry refers to is WOR's audio bandwidth when they are transmitting in PURE ANALOG mode at night, without the IBOC system on. This is strictly WOR's choice, as they could use the full 10 kHz NRSC response at night, just as they did before they started using IBOC during the daytime. >> Its been my understanding from private emails from WOR engineering that the 6khz analog bandwidth had been adjusted for 6khz even during IBOC operation.I doubt seriously that anyone would notice the difference between 5khz and 6khz to begin with..so its really a moot point with me. The only time the analog bandwidth becomes a critical issue with IBOC is when they start testing their digital stream and start broadcasting in stereo and or when your running "other" services in the digital mode. I've had indepth conversations with these guys about how IBOC works and there are still some issues to be worked on and tested. > I suspect that the majority of his customers are listening on > radios that are much newer that "almost twenty years" or even newer > than 18 years old so it is a moot point. Whether or not folks are listening with old radios and new radios or how many years ago a radio was made is a weak arguement. I have a a radio that came stock with my 1998 Nissan and I can hear the IBOC carrier under the program content an hour before sunset here. Some radios are prone to hear it,others are not and whether those are major issues with iBiquity or not is not really known. I do know that an experimental station near Washington DC on I think 650khz is and has been testing IBOC and no one has had any trouble with regards to interference issues to WMAL 630khz or anything on 650khz sidebands. Even though it operates daytime only and is often heard rebroadcasting WTOP,no other issues have been reported by anyone I have contact with in the DC area. iBquity may have a different version of IBOC that is being tested...who knows really,but I've found that instead of blasting out every Tom, Dick and Harry thats deals with IBOC, sit back and try and learn something,that often you learn how something really works and you might be in a position to make something work better. Creating friends and learning something new....now thats power! Lamb blasting someone and being closed minded...now thats like the stone age. > I did not see Kerry give any personal opinions that were anti-AMS > or anti wideband AM in his comments here. In my private responses with them at WOR,I never had anything negative said about AM stereo or even being anti AM stereo. One of them that I spoke with seemed to enjoy setting up transmitters for AM Stereo..even explaining some trouble that certain transmitters had in regards to stereo separation issues..which I found interesting. I'm not very thrilled about IBOC either,but this is whats happening to radio right now...AM and FM and TV. It may not be in the best interest of the public now as we think of it...but think about it.....was the developement of AC power,TV and FM thought to be in the best interest of the public in its earlier days? Heck with AC,you could trace it back to Thomas Edison..who despised AC...and actually electrocuted dogs to prove how harmful AC was and impractical,but today we have AC running just about everything around us and no one is dropping off like flys and the arguement I'm sure was that you could electrocute a dog with DC as well...but the point of AC was that it was more effiencient to carry on electrical lines and easily produced. We could probably pull all the stakes and give every reason why IBOC wont work,but the other side could do the same and say how much it will work.My advise to all,and this is what I've been doing...dont be insulting or demanding.......learn everything you can about everything and you never know after all of that...you might make a positive difference in something. In this case...it could be to either improve IBOC or help in its demise......knowledge is power..remember that. Anyhow...my presents here may slack off over the up coming weeks and or months as the radio group that I work for is under going some changes and some ownership changes for the entire group,pending FCC approval.Its been a rough year around here and looks like all is settling down and new owners will be coming in possibly towards the end of the year or early part of next year. New possiblities await all of us here....but it has a sad twist as well,to me anyways as I will see a guy { Bill Ray that started Ray Communications Network -[which is still in business on Galaxy 4]- and Ray-D-O Biz group radio stations } that gave me my chance to prove my engineering skills and other radio skills, have to take a step out of the AM/FM radio business for now.To him I will always be greatful. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5..., Ray Communications Radio Network Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From dav259@csiro.au Fri Nov 01 23:31:52 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 2 Nov 2002 07:31:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 6434 invoked from network); 2 Nov 2002 07:31:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Nov 2002 07:31:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Nov 2002 07:31:50 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA27VnP15357 for ; Sat, 2 Nov 2002 18:31:49 +1100 (EST) Date: Sat, 2 Nov 2002 18:31:49 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Subject: Re: {AMSF} IBOC vs. AMAX In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public On Fri, 1 Nov 2002, Ben wrote: > In Australia and NZ, E147 is the standard set aside for digital > radio. E147 is a new band as well, so will not (or should not?) > impact on current AM band. Ben - DAB may work in NZ as it is geographically small - and may work down Australia's east coast and perhaps Adelaide and Perth - but it could never replace AM in the outback - which is far too sparsely populated. Trouble is receivers would initially cost A$400 to $600 - and the average Aussie household has between five and nine radios. They won't want to replace them all overnight. So AM will survive here for many years/indefinitely - either in analog or digital format. Checkout this Radio Australia site which features discussions on IBOC, DAB, and DRM - following the ABA's national conference a couple of months ago. http://www.abc.net.au/ra/feedback/ There's an example of DRM beamed from the Canary Islands to Melbourne and it sounds so much better than analog shortwave. In fact it sounds like FM mono. It may be possible down the track for us to go Eureka in populated areas and DRM to the bush. They even treat IBOC with some respect and admit if it does succeed in the US it may get a go here. They also say that the US stations (NAB??) had the balls (and the money) to create the new technology. I don't think most Oz stations have either to invest in what could end up a pipe dream. Then there's our ABC. They now broadcast to 98% of the continent - it would take a very benevolent government to fund any conversion - yet a government that didn't promise to replicate the existing networks would rightfully never be elected. So for now - I'm still 110% behind AM stereo - and would love to see some AMS/FMS Symphony or Omega radios hit the marketplace. To date I've never heard anyone in the local industry even recognise the possibilities of these "digital" analog radios. Ian East Wellington From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Nov 02 00:11:38 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 2 Nov 2002 08:11:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 45614 invoked from network); 2 Nov 2002 08:11:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Nov 2002 08:11:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.66) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Nov 2002 08:11:38 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.159] by n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Nov 2002 08:11:38 -0000 Date: Sat, 02 Nov 2002 08:11:37 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Message from WOR's CE Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <135.16fa5715.2af4ca40@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3159 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.71.163 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Its been my understanding from private emails from WOR engineering > that the 6khz analog bandwidth had been adjusted for 6khz even > during IBOC operation. Here is the spectrum analysis of WOR's IBOC signal that I performed myself using a Sony SRF-A100 receiver and Cool Edit: http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/wor-hd.gif You can clearly see the 5 kHz audio cut-off, followed by the intermediate digital sideband out to just below 10 kHz. Some space is given to allow for a 10 kHz carrier whistle, and then the main digital sideband extends out to 15 kHz away from the carrier. > I doubt seriously that anyone would notice the difference between > 5khz and 6khz to begin with. I can... once you get below 14 kHz or so, every 1 kHz drop in audio response becomes noticeable, especially with a direct A/B comparison. One local AM station broadcasts the typical full 10 kHz NRSC response, but uses syndicated traffic reports that come through with response sharply limited to 7 kHz. The difference between 7 and 10 kHz is immediately obvious, even on most "normal" AM radios, simply from listening to the relative quality between the DJ's voice and the the traffic reporter's voice, especially when they are having a conversation. And with anything less than 7 kHz, the drop in response becomes unmistakable, even without a direct comparison to something better. > Heck with AC,you could trace it back to Thomas Edison..who despised > AC...and actually electrocuted dogs to prove how harmful AC was This is funny, because DC can actually be the most lethal. When you tangle with a DC line, it can lock your muscles, so that you can't use your reflex to pull away from the power source -- so you just sit there and fry. With 60 Hz AC, you have 120 chances per second to pull away, since at those instants in the waveform the peak voltage is zero. That is what makes AC feel "tingly", for those of us who have experienced it in small doses, especially during childhood. :-) I know of one fellow who was working on an old ham radio and got locked up by a high voltage DC shock. He couldn't even scream. He was only rescued from electrocution when another person in the same room smelled his skin burning, turned around, and cut the power. This is a reminder of an important safety tip. NEVER directly touch somebody (or some animal) who is being electrically shocked, because you'll just get shocked yourself! Always try to cut the power first, and if that's not possible, use something insulated like a wooden broomstick handle to try to pry them away from the thing that is shocking them. And for the record, there are people who have been electrocuted by as little as 10 volts. It's the CURRENT (amperage) that causes the harm, not the voltage. Static electricity is THOUSANDS of volts, but the current is so low it doesn't hurt you. On the other hand, get on the wrong side of an automotive 12-volt system and you're in trouble, because a car battery can deliver hundreds of amps. (Except, of course, on that cold winter morning when you're late for work and really need to start your car....) From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Nov 02 09:33:07 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 2 Nov 2002 17:33:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 4182 invoked from network); 2 Nov 2002 17:33:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Nov 2002 17:33:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Nov 2002 17:33:06 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.134] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Nov 2002 17:33:06 -0000 Date: Sat, 02 Nov 2002 17:33:05 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: Message from WOR's CE Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <135.16fa5715.2af4ca40@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1903 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.80.139 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > In my private responses with them at WOR,I never had anything > negative said about AM stereo or even being anti AM stereo. It really depends on who you talk to. Tom Ray at WOR is a good guy. As much as he supports IBOC, he knows where we're coming from, and he can agree to disagree about the relative merits of analog AM vs. IBOC. However, I have gotten nothing but attitude from Kerry Richards. In addition to unwarranted personal attacks, he can't seem to make a point without typing it in ALL CAPITAL LETTERS with MANY EXCLAMATION POINTS!!! Mr. Richards simply does not believe that analog AM has any future. Try to present to him any evidence that indicates otherwise, and he dismisses you as a "crackpot", and refuses to believe any of what you say, even if it is 100% factual. He is also clearly wrong on some of the information he tries to make an argument with. In his latest reply to me, he said "WRONG AGAIN!!" (sic) when I mentioned that IBOC on AM is a 36 kbps data stream. He tried to say it's 96 kbps, which is actually the data rate for IBOC on the *FM* band. And, by the way, his Sony AM Stereo radio which he claims "has not been made in almost twenty years" is indeed a SRF-42 Walkman -- the same kind that was in the Radio Shack catalog as recently as two years ago. And despite what it may seem like, I am not trying to do any political-type "mud slinging" here. I am just pointing out my experience with correspondence with Mr. Richards, and I sincerely hope that the Chief Engineers of other IBOC stations will actually get their facts straight and will actually have a level-headed attitude when it comes to addressing legitimate concerns from their listeners. After all, radio stations are supposed support the interests of the listening public -- not the interests of the corporation owns them or supplies their transmitting equipment. From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sat Nov 02 11:09:14 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 2 Nov 2002 19:09:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 5372 invoked from network); 2 Nov 2002 19:09:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Nov 2002 19:09:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Nov 2002 19:09:13 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.172] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Nov 2002 19:09:13 -0000 Date: Sat, 02 Nov 2002 19:09:11 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Message from WOR's CE Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1923 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.235 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin T." wrote: > > Its been my understanding from private emails from WOR engineering > > that the 6khz analog bandwidth had been adjusted for 6khz even > > during IBOC operation. > > Here is the spectrum analysis of WOR's IBOC signal that I performed > myself using a Sony SRF-A100 receiver and Cool Edit: > > http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/wor-hd.gif > > You can clearly see the 5 kHz audio cut-off, followed by the > intermediate digital sideband out to just below 10 kHz. Some space > is given to allow for a 10 kHz carrier whistle, and then the main > digital sideband extends out to 15 kHz away from the carrier. > So much for being compliant with the NRSC 10.2KHz mask and that the analog audio goes up to 6KHz after looking at the graph. What a lier that guy is. The digital sidebands aren't 20db or so below the average analog sidebands like IBiquity said they were, it's more like 9-12db. The composite energy level weighted over a period of time for the digital sidebands is much greater than it would ever be for a analog signal that went to 15KHz and even if the modulation went to 200% like this new idea that was posted on rwonline.com . If all stations reverted to a 15KHz audio it would still be much better than IBOC as far as interference goes. This is probably just the beginning of the lies and fudged tests for IBOC to paint it in a better light. The digital hash from one station is equal to the sum of 100's of skywave signals that make up the background noise on AM. Could you imagine it being a 100 times worse at night if all stations went to IBOC. It would make analog reception impossible accelerating their position that everyboby needs to go out and buy a new HD AM radio. This has been their plan all along. Trash the AM band to behoove everyone to spend money they don't have on an expensive radio they don't need. JSG From fanfare@globility.com Sat Nov 02 12:19:33 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 2 Nov 2002 20:19:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 51775 invoked from network); 2 Nov 2002 20:19:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Nov 2002 20:19:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Nov 2002 20:19:32 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.188] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Nov 2002 20:19:31 -0000 Date: Sat, 02 Nov 2002 20:19:28 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: FCC Chmn - The role of the receiver Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 297 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Marv Southcott" X-Originating-IP: 64.56.233.244 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy Anyone who had concern for the diminishing importance placed on the role of the receiver in today's broadcast industry, can now take heart in the new recognition implied in a recent speech by FCC Chmn. Powell. Check out the following URL. http://www.fcc.gov/Speeches/Powell/2002/spmkp212.html From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Nov 02 12:54:46 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 2 Nov 2002 20:54:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 93075 invoked from network); 2 Nov 2002 20:54:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Nov 2002 20:54:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.67) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Nov 2002 20:54:44 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.144] by n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Nov 2002 20:54:44 -0000 Date: Sat, 02 Nov 2002 20:54:41 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: 650 WSM to simulcast on Sirius satellite Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1175 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.80.139 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics New programming and channel changes on Sirius satellite radio are going into effect on Monday, and one of them is that 650 WSM in Nashville will begin simulcasting on Sirius. As many of us here remember, WSM dropped their AM Stereo a while back, claiming that they were going to use the IBOC digital system which would make it useless. Now, apparently, WSM is finally reaching their goal of providing a digital broadcast, which will probably be in Stereo -- but on Sirius, instead of through IBOC. Now, they can say that if listeners want to hear WSM in "hi-fi digital Stereo" RIGHT NOW, 24 HOURS A DAY (not just during the daytime), all they have to do is sign up for Sirius. This should essentially make IBOC a moot point for WSM, since they will have reached their goal, just through a different method. So, now that IBOC is no longer the avenue through which they are going to achieve digital sound, why not switch the C-Quam AM Stereo back on? There is no reason not to, especially considering that there unquestionably are significantly more people in WSM's listening area with AM Stereo radios than there are people with Sirius satellite radios! From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Nov 02 16:01:46 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 3 Nov 2002 00:01:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 89457 invoked from network); 3 Nov 2002 00:01:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Nov 2002 00:01:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Nov 2002 00:01:45 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.174] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Nov 2002 00:01:44 -0000 Date: Sun, 03 Nov 2002 00:01:43 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: GE Superadio III Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 6402 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.80.139 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics In my quest for AMAX, today I finally bought a GE Superadio III. It was right on the shelf at Sears for $49.99, quite a bit less than the $64.95 that the mail-order C.Crane Co. charges for one -- and even less than the $59.99 which I believe Radio Shack is charging for their "Optimus" clone of the Superadio. I noticed that the latest version of the box doesn't mention AMAX or have the AMAX logo on it anymore, however it does mention something called "AM Accent" in reference to its Normal/Wide Bandwidth switch. And just as many people have talked about, poor dial calibration does appear to be a standard feature. On mine, the pointer reads about 100 kHz low, so that a station on 1080 kHz shows up more like 980 kHz on the dial. An easy fix, but annoying and something that should have been taken care of by better quality control at the factory. Aside from that, it really is an excellent radio, on both AM and FM. Its numerous tuned IF circuits really do help to give it amazing sensitivity and selectivity on both bands. On FM, I am picking up stations that before, only my car radio could get, such as a weak pirate station on 107.9 FM (probably from somewhere in NYC) playing Spanish music. My car radio was the only radio that could hear this, and even then it was very weak and noisy; now, the Superadio is picking it up loud and clear, with only moderate background hiss! The AM band, of course, is just as amazing. With it, I have picked up 600 WICC at night for the first time EVER! That's a 500-watt (nighttime) station from about 80 miles away, which normally gets overwhelmed by background noise of all the skywave signals coming in at night. The Superadio's 4-stage "tuned RF" front end really seems to be doing is job here, as the selectivity is incredible, WITHOUT giving low-fi muffled sound as a result. There's a reason why it has a "Normal/Wide" bandwidth switch rather than a "Narrow/Wide" switch -- the "Normal" bandwidth is not "narrow" by any means! It sounds like the full AMAX response is being achieved even in "Normal" mode, and yet, the selectivity is good enough that adjacent channel stations don't "splatter" over onto each other. I can pick up 1010 WINS, 1020 KDKA, 1030 WBZ, 1040 WJHR, 1050 WEVD, 1060 KYW, 1070 CHOK, 1080 WTIC, 1090 WBAL, 1100 WTAM, 1110 WBT, 1120 WPRX (Spanish language from Connecticut, which is probably NOT powering down to 500 watts at night!), 1130 WBBR, and 1140 WRVA all right next to each other, with only very minimal "monkey chatter" from the adjacent stations heard on each one -- and yet, the sound is still very crisp and clear. "Wide" bandwidth mode, however, is *VERY* wide, while the audio response really doesn't change all that drastically. I think the AMAX audio filtering remains in use with both settings, and the Wide mode simply disables all of the tuned-RF front end circuitry, dropping it down to the level of an ordinary transistor radio. As a result, when GE says the Wide mode is for "strong local stations", they really mean it! It does give crisper, more "hi-fi" audio, but the effect is quite subtle, as the "Normal" mode ALREADY sounds better that just about any other AM radio! Thus, I think GE designed the Superadio III as if it was to be permanently used in the "Normal" bandwidth mode, because in this mode you get the benefits of superior sensitivity, selectivity, and AMAX audio quality all at the same time. Then, they probably just threw in the so-called "Wide" mode as an afterthought, as a rather meaningless way of meeting the AMAX spec that requires at least two AM bandwidth settings to be manually or automatically available to the listener. Don't get me wrong, it DOES sound better in Wide mode, but it's really only useful for stations that are truly strong and local. But, in "Normal" mode, it's like having a built-in Select-A-Tenna -- the compromise it is able to achieve between selectivity and audio quality is really amazing. It also has a very good AGC, so weak signals come in clearly without having skywave signal fades drive it nuts. Overall, it reminds me a of a good vacuum tube radio, especially with the way it sounds. With its large 6-inch speaker and matching 2-inch tweeter, it delivers a pleasingly rich tone, with deep bass response that would put almost any boom-box to shame, even on AM. Now, I have the Radio Shack/Optimus "clone" of this radio, and I can now say that it is *not* as good as the GE. On the Optimus, everything is just a little bit cheaper than the Superadio; the speaker is smaller, the FM whip antenna is shorter, the AM ferrite bar antenna is shorter, the audio amp is less powerful, etc. It also behaves much more like a "regular" radio, with reception that is still very good, but not *stunningly* good like the way the GE is. The only possible benefit of the Optimus is that the dial calibration is better, and the Wide bandwidth mode is much more useable for general listening, although it doesn't meet the AMAX specs so the response is not as accurate and the unfiltered 10 kHz carrier whistle can be quite annoying at night. Overall, the GE Superadio III is not *perfect*, especially with the bad dial calibration and the excessively wide "Wide" mode, but it is without a doubt the best radio -- on both AM and FM -- that you can get for $49.99. Of course, many would say that the original Superadio and Superadio II are superior radios, and in many cases the older models do have superior performance, but in terms of radios that you can still find on store shelves, the Superadio III is the best of the bunch. It would be even better with AM Stereo and FM Stereo, and perhaps digital tuning, but again, you have to remember the price issue. The Superadio III also makes an excellent portable radio, with easy carry-about size and very long life from 6 D-cell batteries. p.s. Another "WOW!" moment as I finish this message -- again, for the first time EVER, on the Superadio I am hearing 1010 CFRB from Canada coming in ON TOP OF local 1010 WINS! This is honestly the first time I have EVER heard CFRB directly on their AM frequency, rather than through their 6.070 MHz shortwave relay. All this on the Superadio sitting in my basement, with NO Select-A-Tenna or other external antenna, and a computer on in the same room! From evergreenterrace@buzzle.com Sat Nov 02 16:10:54 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: evergreenterrace@buzzle.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 3 Nov 2002 00:10:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 66676 invoked from network); 3 Nov 2002 00:10:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Nov 2002 00:10:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Nov 2002 00:10:53 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.129] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Nov 2002 00:10:53 -0000 Date: Sun, 03 Nov 2002 00:10:53 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: 1290 GLI AM STEREO Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1294 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgliradio" X-Originating-IP: 170.20.11.59 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=69711087 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgliradio Last night, Jerry Mehrab and I were finally able to get our Part 15 AM in C-Quam. We were using a basic Magnavox set-up with L+R and L-R audio (we processed the L-R seperate from our main audio airchain which is feeding a Ramsey AM-25). The AM-25 is slightly modified to supply better audio performance than what Ramsey supplies (and to get rid of some FM'ing problems in the mono mode). There was just enough I and Q that we were able to insert 25Hz and we lit the light on the Sony XR-300 and my Chrysler in the car with about 20-25dB seperation (with minimal to no distortion artifacts in the audio). It is quite impressive. We're using a Hnat Hindes mic maze with a Moseley TAL-310 limiter and the Inovonics 222 for the NRSC mask in the L+R channel, with a Marti CL-40 limiter (FM pre-emphasis) in the L-R channel. It's not perfect, but it sounds VERY good. I actually thought it would work when Jerry showed me his SRF-42. He said he was rolling Magnavox and thought it was wild that the SRF-42 was doing stereo. I said the others should do it if we could get 25 Hz in there. If the SRF-42 could detect it, the others probably could... all they needed to know was that it was actually present. We used his old Heathkit and the rest is Long Island Radio History! From evergreenterrace@buzzle.com Sat Nov 02 16:44:50 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: evergreenterrace@buzzle.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 3 Nov 2002 00:44:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 17891 invoked from network); 3 Nov 2002 00:44:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Nov 2002 00:44:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Nov 2002 00:44:49 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.191] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Nov 2002 00:44:49 -0000 Date: Sun, 03 Nov 2002 00:44:49 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: Message from WOR's CE Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 597 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgliradio" X-Originating-IP: 170.20.11.59 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=69711087 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgliradio --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin T." wrote: >>Mr. Richards simply does not believe that analog AM has any future. Try to present to him any evidence that indicates otherwise, and he dismisses you as a "crackpot", and refuses to believe any of what you say, even if it is 100% factual. << Actually my correspondance with Mr. Richards has been very pleasant and I look forward to meeting with him to see IBOC first hand. I am not an IBOC supporter at all. The performance of IBOC on WOR is not a function of WOR or its engineers but the result of Ibiquity.. good or bad. From dav259@csiro.au Sat Nov 02 17:22:24 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 3 Nov 2002 01:22:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 62646 invoked from network); 3 Nov 2002 01:22:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Nov 2002 01:22:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Nov 2002 01:22:22 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA31MLP11068; Sun, 3 Nov 2002 12:22:21 +1100 (EST) Date: Sun, 3 Nov 2002 12:22:21 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: amstereoforum Cc: Subject: the NAB Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public Scott Are your stations members of the NAB? If so why? If not - why not? Bob and others may wish to say something here too. Our Possum Hunter (I bet you like our Dame Edna Everidge from Moonee Ponds) may have modified his sig file - but from what I perceive the NAB seems to be a monolithic empire of powerful broadcasters trying to control 100% of US broadcasting - as the FCC has abrogated its responsibilities - and seems to have sold out to the highest bidder. So much for free imaginative innovative broadcasting. Long live FREE RADIO! Death to the NAB! Ian - Melbourne [ where video hasn't killed the radio star ] From amfmdx@fastq.com Sat Nov 02 17:36:56 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 3 Nov 2002 01:36:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 34635 invoked from network); 3 Nov 2002 01:36:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Nov 2002 01:36:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Nov 2002 01:36:55 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt (d142-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.174]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gA31arP53303 for ; Sat, 2 Nov 2002 18:36:53 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <013001c282d9$21919ba0$cef9bed8@kredding430cdt> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} GE Superadio III Date: Sat, 2 Nov 2002 18:34:17 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > In my quest for AMAX, today I finally bought a GE Superadio III. > It was right on the shelf at Sears for $49.99, Well, its about time! Welcome to the best mono AM radio sold today. It sure sounds good and for what you get, you can't beat the price. > quite a bit less than > the $64.95 that the mail-order C.Crane Co. charges for one -- And a HELLUVA lot less than that POS CCRadio. Yes, the CCRadio is good but its not great. The best radio for the money is the GE SRIII. You can't beat it. > and > even less than the $59.99 which I believe Radio Shack is charging for > their "Optimus" clone of the Superadio. This 12-903 they sell is a complete piece of crap all the way around compared to the SRIII. > I noticed that the latest version of the box doesn't mention AMAX or > have the AMAX logo on it anymore, however it does mention something > called "AM Accent" in reference to its Normal/Wide Bandwidth switch. There is no AMAX mention on the box. It does meet AMAX specs though. > And just as many people have talked about, poor dial calibration does > appear to be a standard feature. The dial calibration is absolutely pathetic. If this had a digital readout though, it might be the best radio you can buy for sound and DX under $200. WAY under $200. > Aside from that, it really is an excellent radio, on both AM and FM. Yes it is. You can go to the web and see the Superadio website by David Moisan and see how to align the dial. > Its numerous tuned IF circuits really do help to give it amazing > sensitivity and selectivity on both bands. It works very well with a outdoor FM antenna. An outdoor AM antenna does nothing at all for it. The reception is good for the installed AM and FM antennas. > The AM band, of course, is just as amazing. With it, I have picked > up 600 WICC at night for the first time EVER! And this is THE most minimal DXing radio you can get. Its got a good sound and that it will DX is an added benefit. > There's a reason why it has a "Normal/Wide" bandwidth switch rather > than a "Narrow/Wide" switch -- the "Normal" bandwidth is not "narrow" > by any means! No its not narrow. Narrow is wide as a barn door. Wide is wide as an airplane hangar door! > It sounds like the full AMAX response is being > achieved even in "Normal" mode, and yet, the selectivity is good > enough that adjacent channel stations don't "splatter" over onto each > other. And they sound GREAT! > It does give crisper, more "hi-fi" audio, but > the effect is quite subtle, as the "Normal" mode ALREADY sounds > better that just about any other AM radio! To me, this is the best sounding AM radio made today. There is no boombox that comes close. There is not much that can touch it in the way of stereo equipment. > But, in "Normal" mode, it's like having a built-in Select-A-Tenna -- But try it with a SAT and you will see some REAL DX. > Overall, it reminds me a of a good vacuum tube radio, > especially with the way it sounds. If you look around and find an 1958 GE 780P Eight Transistor chrome plated radio, and you get sound so good that it will make you cry. This is probably the best sounding AM radio ever made. This radio is the great-great-great-great grandfather of the Superadios. This radio sounds better than every tube radio I have ever owned or heard. This radio was the first to have the same big ferrite that the Superadio series has. I have one and its phenomenal. > Now, I have the Radio Shack/Optimus "clone" of this radio, and I can > now say that it is *not* as good as the GE. This radio is a piece of crap only useful for being a bathroom radio at best. I had one and sold it quickly. > Overall, the GE Superadio III is not *perfect*, especially with the > bad dial calibration and the excessively wide "Wide" mode, but it > is without a doubt the best radio -- on both AM and FM -- that you > can get for $49.99. I can back this up completely. With a digital readout, this would blow out the CCRadio by a mile. > Of course, many would say that the original > Superadio and Superadio II are superior radios, and in many cases the > older models do have superior performance, but in terms of radios > that you can still find on store shelves, the Superadio III is the > best of the bunch. The Superadio and Superadio II are better in some ways and the Superadio III is better in some. The SR III gets the Xband and sounds better. The SR and SRII DX better. > All this on the Superadio > sitting in my basement, with NO Select-A-Tenna or other external > antenna, and a computer on in the same room! Glad to see you finally getting a DX radio. You got a good one! Kevin From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Nov 02 17:46:21 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 3 Nov 2002 01:46:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 75263 invoked from network); 3 Nov 2002 01:46:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Nov 2002 01:46:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.87) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Nov 2002 01:46:21 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.141] by n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Nov 2002 01:46:21 -0000 Date: Sun, 03 Nov 2002 01:46:19 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: 1290 GLI AM STEREO Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1019 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.80.139 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > I actually thought it would work when Jerry showed me his SRF-42. > He said he was rolling Magnavox and thought it was wild that the > SRF-42 was doing stereo. I said the others should do it if we > could get 25 Hz in there. If the SRF-42 could detect it, the > others probably could... all they needed to know was that it was > actually present. The SRF-42 uses the same old Sony chip which was actually designed for the Magnavox system, so it will sound better than a C-Quam signal. I have also noticed that the Stereo separation is wider with Magnavox than with C-Quam. If you transmit a Magnavox AM Stereo signal with a 25 Hz pilot tone, an ordinary C-Quam radio will have no trouble receiving it in full Stereo. It will sound a little distorted because the decoder will be trying to perform the C-Quam "cosine correction" on the wrong kind of signal, but it will still be true Stereo with accurate Left-to-Right separation. > We used his old Heathkit and the rest is Long Island Radio History! From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Nov 02 18:09:19 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 3 Nov 2002 02:09:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 9006 invoked from network); 3 Nov 2002 02:09:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Nov 2002 02:09:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.87) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Nov 2002 02:09:18 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.137] by n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Nov 2002 02:09:18 -0000 Date: Sun, 03 Nov 2002 02:09:17 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Station on 87.5 FM!!! Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 857 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.80.139 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics On my Superadio (which is turning out to be really SUPER), right now I am getting an FM radio signal on 87.5 MHz, playing Spanish music, LOUD AND CLEAR... yes, it is on 87.5!! It is actually BELOW the Channel 6 TV audio from Philly on 87.75 MHz! It is coming in absolutely full-quieting, as if the transmitter is right next door... I wonder if somebody in my neighborhood has set it up? The treble response is very crisp and clear, and the audio processing is good, although I can tell by the "pumping" that it is simple single-band compression. I have heard of pirates using 87.9 MHz before... but this is the first time I have ever heard an actual FM station all the way down on 87.5!! I guess they know that that's as low as most FM radios go, so it would make a very distinctive spot to put a transmitter -- but not exactly a legal one! From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Nov 02 18:31:46 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 3 Nov 2002 02:31:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 8949 invoked from network); 3 Nov 2002 02:31:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Nov 2002 02:31:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.84) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Nov 2002 02:31:45 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.155] by n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Nov 2002 02:31:45 -0000 Date: Sun, 03 Nov 2002 02:31:41 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: GE Superadio III Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <013001c282d9$21919ba0$cef9bed8@kredding430cdt> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1558 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.80.139 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > If this had a digital readout though, it might be the best radio > you can buy for sound and DX under $200. WAY under $200. There actually was a VERY RARE version of the original Superadio, called the "Superadio Plus", that had DIGITAL TUNING. Somewhere on the web is one user's review of it; it basically has the same performance as the analog-tuning model, except for a slight amount of background noise from the digital display. There was also a special "Chrome" Superadio with built-in cassette recorder -- another very rare model. I have also heard of an early '80s GE stereo boom-box with digital tuning that had AM reception and sound quality nearly equivalent to the original Superadio, but this is another model that has been lost to obscurity. > And this is THE most minimal DXing radio you can get. Its got a > good sound and that it will DX is an added benefit. One tip I have discovered -- it has better bass response on FM with the AFC turned OFF. For some reason, with the AFC on, the bass gets a little thinner. I generally don't like AFC on FM anyway, and I hate radios that have it stuck on all the time, giving a very "sloppy" and "grabby" tuning dial. > To me, this is the best sounding AM radio made today. There is no > boombox that comes close. Well, the Philips-Magnavox boom-boxes with the "ECO 5" tuner actually do come quite close -- their sound on AM is surprisingly crisp and clear; I have heard a response of 40 - 8000 Hz, +/- 3 dB specified. However, of course the reception isn't nearly as good. From amfmdx@fastq.com Sat Nov 02 20:01:40 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 3 Nov 2002 04:01:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 79673 invoked from network); 3 Nov 2002 04:01:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Nov 2002 04:01:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Nov 2002 04:01:38 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt (d43-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.75]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gA341bP55288 for ; Sat, 2 Nov 2002 21:01:37 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <016f01c282ed$a2c56260$cef9bed8@kredding430cdt> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: GE Superadio III Date: Sat, 2 Nov 2002 21:01:04 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > There actually was a VERY RARE version of the original Superadio, > called the "Superadio Plus", that had DIGITAL TUNING. Got one. > There was also a special "Chrome" Superadio with built-in cassette > recorder -- another very rare model. Got one. > I have also heard of an early '80s GE stereo boom-box with digital > tuning that had AM reception Dunno about this one. > Well, the Philips-Magnavox boom-boxes with the "ECO 5" tuner > However, of course the reception isn't nearly as good. If it won't DX, then its not as good. Kevin From n0uiheric@aol.com Sat Nov 02 20:36:42 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 3 Nov 2002 04:36:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 16382 invoked from network); 3 Nov 2002 04:36:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Nov 2002 04:36:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r06.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.102) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Nov 2002 04:36:41 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-r06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.a7.296effcb (4592) for ; Sat, 2 Nov 2002 23:36:37 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Sat, 2 Nov 2002 23:36:36 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} 650 WSM to simulcast on Sirius satellite To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih One of my DX buddies, Tom Bryant (K4CDL), is a retired Production Director for WSM (AM and FM). If they won't hook up the AM Stereo exciter to their new transmitter, and transmit in AM Stereo, then they should swap formats with Super Talk 99.7 WTN (WWTN). AM Mono is only good for News/Talk. Try to convince Paul Grundhauser at KMOX to switch on the Stereo for Don Wolff's jazz show only! WPHT seems to be doing it for Sid Mark! 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From possumhunter@netzero.net Sat Nov 02 21:16:30 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 3 Nov 2002 05:16:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 15993 invoked from network); 3 Nov 2002 05:16:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Nov 2002 05:16:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.123) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Nov 2002 05:16:29 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 2 Nov 2002 21:16:29 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: 1700 WI2XAM... Neal Newman? Date: Sun, 3 Nov 2002 00:16:15 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 03 Nov 2002 05:16:29.0309 (UTC) FILETIME=[2A4E9AD0:01C282F8] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.155.79.184] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Jim Shelden wrote: > BTW, anybody got any good sounding & simple designs for off-air studio monitoring 3 or 4 miles from the tower? My mod. mon. is at the transmitter, and I need to get clean wideband audio at the studio. Get a Potomac SMR-11. If that is wee bit bitt too much, get a GE Superadio 3 Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Sat Nov 02 21:25:28 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 3 Nov 2002 05:25:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 47189 invoked from network); 3 Nov 2002 05:25:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Nov 2002 05:25:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14202.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.144) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Nov 2002 05:25:27 -0000 Message-ID: <20021103052522.36870.qmail@web14202.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [65.221.47.68] by web14202.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 02 Nov 2002 21:25:22 PST Date: Sat, 2 Nov 2002 21:25:22 -0800 (PST) Subject: The Times, They are A-Changin' To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: John Electron X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio Yes, analog radio ‘technically’ still exists with IBOC, but from all accounts so far, it certainly isn’t what it should or could be. Today's Parable: Imagine if they came out with a 2004 model New Car that claimed 80 MPG in the city, and cost $100,000 each – but, oil refineries had to reformulate ALL gasoline - everywhere - in order to make these New Cars work. In addition, these New Cars also took-up two lanes on the highway for the extremely-wide high-tech fuel combustion burner in these New Cars. Also, all oil refineries would charge a $4000 royalty fee for every "New Car" to Ford/GM/Chrysler for this special fuel formulation discovery in their car lines. This new gasoline would also cost $4/gallon. You COULD still use this new car reformulated gasoline in your old car, but horsepower would be half of what it once was, and your fuel economy would also be reduced to half of your original MPG. However, IF you bought the new $100,000 car you would get 80 MPG with the new gas. In 5 years they will change the gasoline formulation one last time, and all the millions of cars on the road will be useless at that time. * Curtain Call * Here's our Cast of Characters for Our Story Above: New Car: IBOC Receiver (at 500% the cost of existing units). Refiners: iBiquity. Ford/GM/Chrysler: Radio Station Owners. New Formulated Gas: Truncated Analog / Digital Hybrid. 6Yr Gas: Date of Analog cut-off and all digital. Existing Cars: 400 million analog receivers. BTW: Did you hear that Kodak is going to stop manufacturing ALL 35MM film effective December 31, 2003? They will continue to manufacture only their APS film as they feel it is superior to their 35mm film counterpart. __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? HotJobs - Search new jobs daily now http://hotjobs.yahoo.com/ From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Sat Nov 02 21:58:56 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 3 Nov 2002 05:58:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 11858 invoked from network); 3 Nov 2002 05:58:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Nov 2002 05:58:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14208.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.173.72) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Nov 2002 05:58:55 -0000 Message-ID: <20021103055855.97976.qmail@web14208.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [65.221.47.68] by web14208.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 02 Nov 2002 21:58:55 PST Date: Sat, 2 Nov 2002 21:58:55 -0800 (PST) Subject: eBay #1394243874: AM STEREO HOME RECEIVER - RADIO SHACK? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: John Electron X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio This is a news flash to me that 'Realistic' Radio Shack made anything other than the TM-152 and Two Car Radios, but this guy says this has AM Stereo? http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1394243874 __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? HotJobs - Search new jobs daily now http://hotjobs.yahoo.com/ From amfmdx@fastq.com Sat Nov 02 22:38:27 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 3 Nov 2002 06:38:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 93561 invoked from network); 3 Nov 2002 06:38:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Nov 2002 06:38:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Nov 2002 06:38:25 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt (d91-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.123]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gA36cOP56736 for ; Sat, 2 Nov 2002 23:38:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <01b301c28303$5c641a80$cef9bed8@kredding430cdt> To: References: <20021103055855.97976.qmail@web14208.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} eBay #1394243874: AM STEREO HOME RECEIVER - RADIO SHACK? Date: Sat, 2 Nov 2002 23:36:35 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > This is a news flash to me that 'Realistic' > Radio Shack made anything other than the TM-152 and > Two Car Radios, but this guy says this has AM Stereo? Dunno for sure but I suspect not. Kevin From mrradioguy@excite.com Sun Nov 03 08:36:40 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: mrradioguy@excite.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 3 Nov 2002 16:36:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 6666 invoked from network); 3 Nov 2002 16:36:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Nov 2002 16:36:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Nov 2002 16:36:39 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.148] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Nov 2002 16:36:39 -0000 Date: Sun, 03 Nov 2002 16:36:38 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: AM stereo recordings Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1121 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "yowzah_1999" X-Originating-IP: 68.54.38.248 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=31730547 X-Yahoo-Profile: yowzah_1999 As the guy who put 1660 WMIB, and 1480 WODX on in stereo in May of 1999, I have a lot of first-hand experience in AM Stereo. I was able to turn the stereo on and off by remote, which came in handy to defuse the erroneous claim that "AM stereo hurts coverage". Funny, but FM stereo hurts coverage, but few know or care. We had liners cut for the stereo, which was the ABC Stardust format. Bud Buschardt is the PD of Stardust in Dallas (where it originates), and he is positively anal about correct stereo versions of songs... as a result, we had many treats on the air. I also did a total of eight 'test' shows between '99 and '01 when the station was sold, and taped them all on VHS Hi-Fi in stereo with no interruptions! I can make dubs for those who might be interested, for a small fee. And as (very) unfortunately, I am out of the AM Stereo engineering business with not even a signal to enjoy here in Naples, FL, I have some surplus AM Stereo gear as well. I can't believe that I just recently discovered this group! I did get a real hoot out of the aircheck of one of my 'test' shows!!! Phil Beckman From rwagoner@cox.net Sun Nov 03 10:28:53 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner@cox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 3 Nov 2002 18:28:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 79030 invoked from network); 3 Nov 2002 18:28:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Nov 2002 18:28:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Nov 2002 18:28:51 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.175] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Nov 2002 18:28:50 -0000 Date: Sun, 03 Nov 2002 18:28:49 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: GE Superadio III Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 662 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Richard Wagoner" X-Originating-IP: 68.4.33.253 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=96123889 X-Yahoo-Profile: richardalanwagoner >"Wide" bandwidth mode, however, is *VERY* wide, while the audio response really doesn't change all that drastically.< My SRIII is a few years old (maybe 8), and I have a different experience. Normal gives good selectivity, but wide sounds much much nicer. As good as any FM radio, while normal sounds good, not great, though better than almost anything else out there (besides my Carver TX11b). On an unrelated note, so far, as far as I know, there are no HD AM stations out here in Southern California. It is disappointing that the FCC would allow a system that destroys reception. I have asked a trusted engineer friend to comment on that. Richard Wagoner From rwagoner@cox.net Sun Nov 03 10:47:46 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner@cox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 3 Nov 2002 18:47:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 82597 invoked from network); 3 Nov 2002 18:47:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Nov 2002 18:47:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Nov 2002 18:47:42 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.135] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Nov 2002 18:47:42 -0000 Date: Sun, 03 Nov 2002 18:47:41 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: eBay #1394243874: AM STEREO HOME RECEIVER - RADIO SHACK? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20021103055855.97976.qmail@web14208.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 599 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Richard Wagoner" X-Originating-IP: 68.4.33.253 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=96123889 X-Yahoo-Profile: richardalanwagoner His eBay profile says he lives in the San Diego area ... even in the desert you can receive KNX 1070, which is in stereo. He SHOULD be able to "test it" as he says. --- In amstereoforum@y..., John Electron wrote: > This is a news flash to me that 'Realistic' > Radio Shack made anything other than the TM-152 and > Two Car Radios, but this guy says this has AM Stereo? > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1394243874 > > __________________________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > HotJobs - Search new jobs daily now > http://hotjobs.yahoo.com/ From amfmdx@fastq.com Sun Nov 03 11:07:28 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 3 Nov 2002 19:07:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 88221 invoked from network); 3 Nov 2002 19:07:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Nov 2002 19:07:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Nov 2002 19:07:27 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt (d167-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.199]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gA3J7QP64488 for ; Sun, 3 Nov 2002 12:07:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <006801c2836b$c3e99640$c7f9bed8@kredding430cdt> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: eBay #1394243874: AM STEREO HOME RECEIVER - RADIO SHACK? Date: Sun, 3 Nov 2002 12:03:56 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > His eBay profile says he lives in the San Diego area ... even in the > desert you can receive KNX 1070, which is in stereo. He SHOULD be able > to "test it" as he says. I'll back that up. I live in the Phoenix area and they smoke into here with a very solid stereo signal. Kevin From amfmdx@fastq.com Sun Nov 03 11:15:31 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 3 Nov 2002 19:15:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 94636 invoked from network); 3 Nov 2002 19:15:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Nov 2002 19:15:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Nov 2002 19:15:30 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt (d167-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.199]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gA3JFTP64589 for ; Sun, 3 Nov 2002 12:15:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <007001c2836c$e14b24a0$c7f9bed8@kredding430cdt> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: GE Superadio III Date: Sun, 3 Nov 2002 12:11:55 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > My SRIII is a few years old (maybe 8), and I have a different > experience. Normal gives good selectivity, but wide sounds much much > nicer. I have the same experience as you. The _W_I_D_E_ mode is REAL WIDE and it sounds great. I got my SR III about 1996 and have used one ever since. I have many radios but few if any sound better on AM. Kevin From amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk Sun Nov 03 12:53:38 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 3 Nov 2002 20:53:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 12591 invoked from network); 3 Nov 2002 20:53:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Nov 2002 20:53:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.64) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Nov 2002 20:53:37 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.143] by n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Nov 2002 20:53:37 -0000 Date: Sun, 03 Nov 2002 20:53:37 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Station on 87.5 FM!!! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1076 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Dave" X-Originating-IP: 213.121.67.212 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113985069 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereofan Probably from London (UK) I heard a pirate today the other end on 108 and with RDS! I live in the UK's south coast... --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin T." wrote: > On my Superadio (which is turning out to be really SUPER), right now > I am getting an FM radio signal on 87.5 MHz, playing Spanish music, > LOUD AND CLEAR... yes, it is on 87.5!! It is actually BELOW the > Channel 6 TV audio from Philly on 87.75 MHz! > > It is coming in absolutely full-quieting, as if the transmitter is > right next door... I wonder if somebody in my neighborhood has set > it up? The treble response is very crisp and clear, and the audio > processing is good, although I can tell by the "pumping" that it is > simple single-band compression. > > I have heard of pirates using 87.9 MHz before... but this is the > first time I have ever heard an actual FM station all the way down on > 87.5!! I guess they know that that's as low as most FM radios go, so > it would make a very distinctive spot to put a transmitter -- but not > exactly a legal one! From evergreenterrace@buzzle.com Sun Nov 03 13:39:38 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: evergreenterrace@buzzle.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 3 Nov 2002 21:39:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 56684 invoked from network); 3 Nov 2002 21:39:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Nov 2002 21:39:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Nov 2002 21:39:37 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.249] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Nov 2002 21:39:37 -0000 Date: Sun, 03 Nov 2002 21:39:35 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: 1290 GLI AM STEREO Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 509 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgliradio" X-Originating-IP: 170.20.11.59 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=69711087 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgliradio --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin T." wrote > > If you transmit a Magnavox AM Stereo signal with a 25 Hz pilot tone, > an ordinary C-Quam radio will have no trouble receiving it in full > Stereo. It will sound a little distorted because the decoder will be > trying to perform the C-Quam "cosine correction" on the wrong kind of > signal, but it will still be true Stereo with accurate Left-to-Right > separation. Actually there is little to no distortion. We were all surprised! From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Nov 03 15:16:02 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 3 Nov 2002 23:16:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 88272 invoked from network); 3 Nov 2002 23:16:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Nov 2002 23:16:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.64) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Nov 2002 23:16:01 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.148] by n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Nov 2002 23:16:01 -0000 Date: Sun, 03 Nov 2002 23:15:58 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: GE Superadio III Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2305 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.96.7 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > My SRIII is a few years old (maybe 8), and I have a different > experience. Normal gives good selectivity, but wide sounds much > much nicer. As good as any FM radio, while normal sounds good, not > great, though better than almost anything else out there (besides > my Carver TX11b). From my own tests of my Superadio III, it seems that in "Wide" mode, its audio response is literally only limited by what the station is transmitting. It thankfully includes proper NRSC de-emphasis, so with the Treble knob in the center position, the Superadio III will give you audio response that is pretty much flat as a ruler from at least 50 Hz up to 10 kHz, and then if you're lucky enough to be listening to a true wide-band station, you'll get audio response well above that point, only limited by the bandwidth of the station's transmitter and antenna system. In "Normal" mode, the Superadio III obviously has a narrower audio bandwidth, but since this is provided through the use of tuned IF circuits, rather than through a ceramic filter, it has a very gradual drop-off of treble response. With the Treble knob turned up to compensate, it will provide flat response up to at least 7.5 kHz, with a good amount of useable response up to 10 kHz and beyond. To ears, Wide mode with the treble knob centered and Normal mode with the treble knob turned up sound virtually identical, and both far exceed the audio quality of typical AM radios, as the Superadio also has a very nice AGC circuit, which does its job without introducing extra distortion (especially in the bass) like many the AGC's of many cheap AM radios do. One thing missing from the Superadio III, which would be welcome in both Normal and Wide modes, is a 10 kHz whistle notch filter. The AMAX spec is supposed to include a whistle filter, but the SRIII was actually designed before the AMAX specs were finalized, so it doesn't include one. It does, however, meet all the other applicable AMAX specs for portable radios, so that was good enough for it to be advertised as "AMAX Compatible". The main part of that is its excellent audio response, with properly matched de-emphasis, so the midrange (around 5 kHz) isn't unnaturally boosted like on other wide-band AM radios that don't have proper de-emphasis. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Nov 03 17:11:37 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 4 Nov 2002 01:11:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 93292 invoked from network); 4 Nov 2002 01:11:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Nov 2002 01:11:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Nov 2002 01:11:36 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.140] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 04 Nov 2002 01:11:36 -0000 Date: Mon, 04 Nov 2002 01:11:35 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: You have NOT been removed Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 966 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster X-eGroups-Announce: yes From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.96.7 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics To those of you who may have received "You have been removed from the group" messages in your e-mail... that is just because I cancelled the unused alternate AM Stereo Forum on SmartGroups that I created a few months ago. Back then I offered the opportunity to move this Forum over to SmartGroups because it has less on-screen advertising than Yahoo Groups, but the general concensus was that we should stay here on Yahoo, so since then, the other "AM Stereo Forum" on SmartGroups just sat unused... so I finally just cancelled it, in case somebody might come across it and then be confused that there is no activity on it! So, don't worry... if you're reading this, you're still a member of the *real* AM Stereo Forum here on Yahoo Groups. There were only about four or five "members" of the SmartGroups version, so most of you didn't get any notice that I cancelled it. Kevin Tekel kevtronics@yahoo.com Sysop of The AM Stereo Forum on Yahoo Groups From amfmdx@fastq.com Sun Nov 03 17:25:05 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 4 Nov 2002 01:25:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 75586 invoked from network); 4 Nov 2002 01:25:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Nov 2002 01:25:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Nov 2002 01:25:04 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt (d168-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.200]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gA41P3P70269 for ; Sun, 3 Nov 2002 18:25:03 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <00b501c283a0$3b0fea60$c7f9bed8@kredding430cdt> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: GE Superadio III Date: Sun, 3 Nov 2002 18:19:30 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > It does, however, meet all the other applicable AMAX > specs for portable radios, so that was good enough for it to be > advertised as "AMAX Compatible". So how about a DX report? Kevin From bjackson@indyradio.com Sun Nov 03 18:41:25 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 4 Nov 2002 02:41:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 38544 invoked from network); 4 Nov 2002 02:41:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Nov 2002 02:41:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.90) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Nov 2002 02:41:23 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.179] by n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 04 Nov 2002 02:41:23 -0000 Date: Mon, 04 Nov 2002 02:41:21 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: AM Stereo Exciter Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 175 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923" X-Originating-IP: 216.132.129.192 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 Not Sold by me: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1394687538 4 days left, now at 49.95. -Brad Jackson -Susquehanna Media, Indianapolis -WGRL/WGLD/WFMS From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Sun Nov 03 18:42:29 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 4 Nov 2002 02:42:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 3407 invoked from network); 4 Nov 2002 02:42:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Nov 2002 02:42:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf02bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.42) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Nov 2002 02:42:28 -0000 Received: from juan ([67.34.32.44]) by imf02bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.19 201-253-122-122-119-20020516) with SMTP id <20021104024412.LDVS29244.imf02bis.bellsouth.net@juan> for ; Sun, 3 Nov 2002 21:44:12 -0500 Message-ID: <002101c283ab$d21bd1c0$af78fea9@juan> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM stereo recordings Date: Sun, 3 Nov 2002 21:42:30 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hey Phil, Give me a call when you get a chance... Juan Gualda WTTB-1490 AM-Stereo WOSN. WGNX. WGYL gualdaj@bellsouth.net Subject: {AMSF} AM stereo recordings As the guy who put 1660 WMIB, and 1480 WODX on in stereo in May of 1999, I have a lot of first-hand experience in AM Stereo. I was able to turn the stereo on and off by remote, which came in handy to defuse the erroneous claim that "AM stereo hurts coverage". Funny, but FM stereo hurts coverage, but few know or care. We had liners cut for the stereo, which was the ABC Stardust format. Bud Buschardt is the PD of Stardust in Dallas (where it originates), and he is positively anal about correct stereo versions of songs... as a result, we had many treats on the air. I also did a total of eight 'test' shows between '99 and '01 when the station was sold, and taped them all on VHS Hi-Fi in stereo with no interruptions! I can make dubs for those who might be interested, for a small fee. And as (very) unfortunately, I am out of the AM Stereo engineering business with not even a signal to enjoy here in Naples, FL, I have some surplus AM Stereo gear as well. I can't believe that I just recently discovered this group! I did get a real hoot out of the aircheck of one of my 'test' shows!!! Phil Beckman [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sun Nov 03 19:09:01 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 4 Nov 2002 03:09:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 55899 invoked from network); 4 Nov 2002 03:09:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Nov 2002 03:09:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Nov 2002 03:09:00 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.171] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 04 Nov 2002 03:09:00 -0000 Date: Mon, 04 Nov 2002 03:08:58 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: 1290 GLI AM STEREO Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1055 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.49 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@y..., "wgliradio" wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin T." wrote > > > > If you transmit a Magnavox AM Stereo signal with a 25 Hz pilot > tone, > > an ordinary C-Quam radio will have no trouble receiving it in full > > Stereo. It will sound a little distorted because the decoder will > be > > trying to perform the C-Quam "cosine correction" on the wrong kind > of > > signal, but it will still be true Stereo with accurate Left-to-Right > > separation. > > Actually there is little to no distortion. We were all surprised! All of the systems are so similar that Sony was able to develop their 4-Way decoder to produce no more than 4% distortion on any of the systems when received. Even C-QuAM decoded as QuAM has little if any appearent distortion. This is what happens in the 3rd generation C-QuAM decoders when interference causes the cosine corrector circuit to produce more distortion than it would remove and the chip defaults to QuAM under those conditions. JSG From penry@nortelnetworks.com Sun Nov 03 19:30:44 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: penry@nortelnetworks.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 4 Nov 2002 03:30:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 30800 invoked from network); 4 Nov 2002 03:30:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Nov 2002 03:30:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com) (47.103.122.112) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Nov 2002 03:30:42 -0000 Received: from zrc2c011.us.nortel.com (zrc2c011.us.nortel.com [47.103.120.51]) by zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id gA43UsH11075 for ; Sun, 3 Nov 2002 21:30:54 -0600 (CST) Received: by zrc2c011.us.nortel.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Sun, 3 Nov 2002 21:30:40 -0600 Message-ID: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A560797404571447@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: The Skywaves Are Falling / Death To Chicken Little! Date: Sun, 3 Nov 2002 21:30:40 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) From: "Charles Penry" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=376233 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa5vhu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit First of all, I like the modified subject line of "The Skywaves Are Falling". Much more appropriate to the list. Well, here are my responses to Kevin's hand picked answers. And Kevin, what happened to the rest of my responses? Can't argue with the facts? Charles said: > I don't think I will get enough Skywave reception from New Orleans > or Chicago during the day do cause interference from IBOC sidebands > while I am well within the 2.5 mV/m contour of my local New York > fifty-thousand watt blowtorch non-directional AM station. Can you > possibly explain the math behind that? Then Kevin said: >I live close enough to NYC that I can pick up 770 WABC on a crystal >radio. Their signal booms in loud and clear, day and night. >And yet, on my Aiwa bookshelf stereo system (manufactured in 1999) >sitting here in my basement using only its supplied loop antenna, at >night the skywave of 760 WJR from Detroit sometimes comes in strongly >enough to splatter ONTO 770 WABC. Not the other way around; when I >tune in 770 I can hear the "monkey chatter" coming from the SKYWAVE >760 WJR signal -- even without purposely adjusting the antenna to >"null out" WABC's signal. >Same thing with 650 WSM, which sometimes comes in strongly enough to >splatter ONTO local 50,000-watt non-directional Class I-A station >660 WFAN. And yes, I *have* heard 870 WWL come in strongly enough to >splatter onto local 880 WCBS -- even on a crummy Panasonic stereo >with the typical 5 kHz audio bandwidth. >This is exactly the kind of condition that will render IBOC useless >at night. At sundown, the skywaves are going to come rolling in, no >matter if the signals they are carrying are analog, digital, or some >combination of both (as IBOC currently is) -- and short of totally >screwing up the upper atmosphere, there is nothing we can do to stop >skywave propagation. The AM band NEEDS to be arranged to make >allowance for skywave at night, and for the past 80 years or so, it >pretty much has been. IBOC may be able to mess with Texas, but it >ain't gonna be able to mess with the skywaves, and even if we jacked >up all the IBOC stations to 500,000 watts, they would still have >reception problems in their local listening areas. And Charles then answered: Kevin, Did you actually read what I wrote? I said "I don't think I will get enough Skywave reception from New Orleans or Chicago during the day to cause interference..." That's day day day day day day day day day day. Understand? That's day, as in not night. So what was your rant about night time skywave reception all about? Stick with the subject. I was discussing day reception. At the present time, IBOC is not authorized for night time operation. If you want to talk about how IBOC is going to trash night time reception, then that is another subject, not a response to my comments. If you don't have the facts to back up what you say, then agree with me. Stop changing the subject. Charles said: > Remember that as an average consumer, I only listen to local > stations. Then Kevin said: >Try living in central New Jersey and listening to FM. There are no >"local stations". You have a choice between stations from NYC, >Philly, the Lehigh Valley, and the Jersey Shore, all of which are >about equally far away. Thus, almost EVERY 0.2 MHz increment across >the band is filled with signals, and whatever your choice of station >might be, it is probably going to have neighbors on either side of >it. >As is, it's already a tight fit, and in my own casual observations, >I have found a SURPRISINGLY high number of "average" people who >listen to FM signals which are technically "DX", especially in the >car. They'll listen to 94.1 WYSP from Philly, even as 93.9 WNYC-FM >from NYC and 94.3 WJLK from the Jersey Shore are bordering it. >They'll listen to 96.1 WCTO from the Lehigh Valley, even as 95.9 WRAT >from the Jersey Shore and 96.3 WQXR from NYC are bordering it. >Etc.... so, if EVERY station on FM used IBOC, they'd all wipe each >other out with interference, and the FM band in this area would be >completely unlistenable except for small "halos" of a few miles >around local non-commercial stations run by colleges and high >schools. And Charles then answered: Kevin, I am not familiar with central New Jersey FM radio but what does this have to do with AM Stereo and how IBOC will affect it? I was talking about day time AM broadcast radio. Stop trying to avoid answering my questions by changing the subject. By the way, as for areas without local radio, I have been in places in the US that had no AM or FM broadcast coverage at all during the day and those people somehow still listened to music and got their news. During the day, in their cars, homes, and businesses. People adjust. Charles said: > Get real. You are saying that I am in Greenwood so I am less than > five miles from WCZZ with 5,000 watts, and well within their 25 > mile 2.5 mV/m contour, and I can't hear them because I am in the > 0.175 mV/m contour of WCSZ and my desired signal is being "killed" > by their IBOC sidebands? I think I must need a new radio! Then Kevin said: >FYI, just this afternoon I was listening to Neal's own excellent WTTM >1680 AM Stereo well within its "Interference Free" daytime coverage >contour -- and yet, the Lucent IBOC test station on 1700 kHz was >splattering all over it with a loud and constant hissing/squealing >noise, as heard on a Chrysler AMAX AM Stereo car radio with >automatic bandwidth control. Despite WTTM's superb Stereo sound, the >constant background noise from WI2XAM's IBOC sideband was really >quite annoying to listen to. I don't think anybody with working ears >would not be able to hear it and be annoyed by it. And Charles then answered: Kevin, There you go changing the subject again without answering my question or responding to my comments. What does WTTM and WI2XAM in New Jersey have to do with WCZZ in South Carolina and WCSZ in, for crying out loud, Mexico? Your FYI was not relevant to my comments. Do you really read what anyone writes, or is this just a forum for you to rant? Charles said: > And yes, IBOC is likely to end AM medium wave DX'ing. Does the > average consumer care? Then Kevin said: > You can judge by yourself by listening to a clear channel (note > lowercase C's) AM station that has its own call-in show at night, and > observing the locations where people are calling in from. They might > not get callers from "38 states and 7 Canadian provinces" as some > 50,000-watt AM stations claim, but their practical nighttime skywave > coverage area is still a few hundred miles. I hear people calling in > to 1030 WBZ in Boston from as far away as Pennsylvania and Maryland. > > Then there is the incredible 740 CHWO from Ontario, with excellent > Notalgia music and a LIVE DJ at night, and just the other day I heard > him mention getting a call from a truck driver listening to CHWO down > in Kentucky. CHWO is very proud of their large signal coverage at > night, and as a station from Canada -- where IBOC is not and will not > be used -- they have especially a lot to lose if IBOC becomes > prevalent down here, with "foreign" IBOC signals splattering onto > "their" purely analog AM band. And Charles then answered: Kevin, You do have a good point there. When I travel or when something is happening like a hurricane, I often dial up a target Blowtorch station and listen to what is going on there. I believe IBOC will end this nighttime DX'ing unless Ibiquity can pull a rabbit out of their hat (don't hold your breath). As for truckers, I am seeing more and more satellite radio antennas on their mirrors. It's got to be ideal for truckers, not having to constantly search for stations to hear good music and such, especially on AM during the day. By the way, did you notice that when I could not argue with you, I agreed and did not change the subject? You should try it some time; you might make more friends and allies to your cause that way. Then Kevin said: > (American Mathematical Society) Remember that there are three > kinds of mathematicians: > those who can count and those who can't. Just kidding!!! > Q. Why did the Microsoft programmer confuse Halloween with Christmas? > A. Because OCT 31 = DEC 25. And Charles then answered: Good one! See, I was agreeable again! Then Kevin said: > p.s. I think WOR should start playing Classical music. > They could call it "I-BACH"! I And Charles then answered: don't think their audio bandwidth would pass the B and the H, and not much of the C. See, still trying to be funny and agreeable. Happy Listening, Charles [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From amfmdx@fastq.com Sun Nov 03 20:04:39 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 4 Nov 2002 04:04:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 17827 invoked from network); 4 Nov 2002 04:04:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Nov 2002 04:04:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Nov 2002 04:04:37 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt (d129-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.161]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gA444ZP74454 for ; Sun, 3 Nov 2002 21:04:36 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <001f01c283b7$3b79ff60$a1f9bed8@kredding430cdt> To: References: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A560797404571447@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: The Skywaves Are Falling / Death To Chicken Little! Date: Sun, 3 Nov 2002 21:04:09 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > First of all, I like the modified subject line of "The Skywaves Are > Falling". Much more appropriate to the list. The skywaves aren't affected for now. IBAC is daytime only. They probably will be at night soon enough though... Just curious, are you a proponent of IBAC? This is not for argument, this is only for curiosity. IBAC, although I believe digital doesn't belong on the MW bands, can fit the AM [ BAND ] Stereo idea. It will be in stereo, just not C-QUAM. I don't have a problem with digital radio. I think that its a fine idea, I just believe that it belongs in the UHF bands where its a lot more stable for propagational conditions. Kevin From penry@nortelnetworks.com Sun Nov 03 20:39:10 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: penry@nortelnetworks.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 4 Nov 2002 04:39:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 99525 invoked from network); 4 Nov 2002 04:39:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Nov 2002 04:39:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com) (47.103.122.112) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Nov 2002 04:39:09 -0000 Received: from zrc2c011.us.nortel.com (zrc2c011.us.nortel.com [47.103.120.51]) by zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id gA44dLH14114 for ; Sun, 3 Nov 2002 22:39:22 -0600 (CST) Received: by zrc2c011.us.nortel.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Sun, 3 Nov 2002 22:39:08 -0600 Message-ID: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A56079740457144F@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: {AMSF} The Sky Is Falling / Death To Chicken Little! Date: Sun, 3 Nov 2002 22:39:00 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) From: "Charles Penry" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=376233 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa5vhu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit See below... Charles wrote: > I don't think I will get enough Skywave reception from New Orleans or Chicago during the day do cause interference from IBOC sidebands while I am well within the 2.5 mV/m contour of my local New York fifty-thousand watt blowtorch non-directional AM station. Can you possibly explain the math behind that? Then Possum Hunter wrote: When I was the back-up engineer at WESC 660 (now WLFJ), The guys at WNBC (now WFAN) sure raised enough hell, along with the local New York listeners of WNBC. When we would crank up the 10,000 Watt critical hours transmitter, then they would call raising all kinds of hell when we hit the Non-Directional 50,000 Watt daytime transmitter! It got so that the station manager would call the AM transmitter plant wondering what was wrong if he did NOT get a call from mad New Yorker! And Charles answered: Yes, stations operating critical hours are going to have coverage like nighttime coverage to certain locations. What are the current rules for operation of IBOC during critical hours (I don't know)? If IBOC is allowed to operate during critical hours, signals will be trashed, both analog and other IBOC. Charles wrote: > Get real. You are saying that I am in Greenwood so I am less than five miles from WCZZ with 5,000 watts, and well within their 25 mile 2.5 mV/m contour, and I can't hear them because I am in the 0.175 mV/m contour of WCSZ and my desired signal is being "killed" by their IBOC sidebands? I think I must need a new radio! > Then Possum Hunter wrote: > Greenwood is a unique market with unique problems. They are close enough to the Greenville/Spartanburg/Anderson market, Augusta, GA market, and Columbia Market to be slammed with radio signals. Many of the out of market stations have MUCH stronger signals than the maps would indicate. These signals make a mess out of Grennwood's radio signals. And Charles answered: Well, the simple math does not add up. I could be that Greenwood is at the right distance to get the first near-in daytime skywave signals from these other stations. I am not familiar with the area. Charles wrote: > So, you really must work for the NAB? You are doing a good job of making sure your above statement comes true. Then Possum Hunter wrote: OK, YOU WIN! I removed the anti-NAB part of my sig file. Happy? And Charles answered: Yes, I am happy! Thank you for removing the hateful sounding negative tag line. Death is about the ultimate negative comment that can be made, and in the AM Stereo context, it does not help our cause. Remember, you catch more flies with honey. Charles wrote: > So, clarify something for me. When you say "Death to the NAB!", are you talking about the National Association of Broadcasters and if so, are you saying that you want the NAB association to just die, Then Possum Hunter wrote: YUP! The chances of that happening is very slim, but it is a nice thought. or are you saying that And Charles answered: Ok, whatever you think is best...what happened to the answer to the rest of the question? Charles wrote: >As an average consumer, what local store can I go buy one of these types of CQUAM STEREO or AMAX radios that won't work? Then Possum Hunter wrote: Almost any store that sells portable radios have the AMAX GE Superadio, or you can go buy it's clone at Radio Shack. Many cars come with wide band AM radios and many of them are wide band STEREO, even if they are not AMAX certified for some reason. You can get an AMAX home stereo tuner from any good stereo dealer. And Charles answered: I almost forgot that I own a GE Superadio. We listen to it every morning in the bathroom while getting ready for the day. A few average consumers might buy a GE Superadio but it is a bit large with a form factor that is not "cool" (no glowing & flashing purple lights inside a translucent case)and for the price, it does not include the CD player that the average consumer wants. And you are correct, some cars still come with good sounding AM radios. I wonder how bad IBOC will trash them, even on channel! > Charles wrote: > And I want one to connect to my home stereo, one for my car, and one to carry out into the yard when I am gardening. Then Possum Hunter wrote: Buy them from Kevtronics. We should support him for all he does for AM STEREO anyway. And Charles answered: Out of context answer! I said local store. Is Kevtronics a local store to me? How many tens of thousands or millions of radios has Kevtronics sold to average consumers? > Charles wrote: > What does my TV have to do with AM Stereo? Then Possum Hunter wrote: It is just another example of a popular electronic devise that will be made useless by a mostly unwanted digital service replacing it. > And Charles answered: Yes, but bringing up other subjects besides things that affect AM Stereo (remember, it's the subject here!)is seen as the screaming kid syndrome and that does not help our cause. If you have a problem with Digital TV, then that is a subject for another forum. If the group here wants to talk about Digital TV, fine but it is irrelevant to be one screaming kid comment in a list of rants about how IBOC will affect AM Stereo, and should be discussed under a different subject and topic. Charles wrote: > I look forward to the day that my analog TV won't work and I will have a real excuse to tell the wife why we need, not want, a new flat panel screen HDTV! I just hope she doesn't find out about the low cost converters. Then Possum Hunter wrote: Have you seen a converter in use for yourself? The Samsung I saw made a rotten looking picture! It was MUCH worse looking than the Analog signal from the built in tuner on the same TV, a Sony KV-27XBR45 > And Charles answered: No, I have not seen a converter, only read a little bit about them. My wife and I did watch a HDTV in the store the other day. It was a hockey game. Have you seen the commercial where two guys are watching a large screen TV in the store and one of them passes out from the pleasure? That's how we felt. It was awesome. Almost like being there. I will have to start saving up my pennies. Want to buy some analog TV's? Charles wrote: > And yes, IBOC is likely to end AM medium wave DX'ing. Does the average consumer care? Then Possum Hunter wrote: Almost all over the road truckers running at night are listening to a DX signal on AM. Just ask Dave Nemo (WWL) or Bozo (WLW), or Bill Mack (WBAP) Many of the callers on 740 CHWO are DX listeners! Many other clear channels brag on their nighttime signal coverage as well. > And Charles answered: Actually, I think Bill Mack retired from WBAP a while back, but I understand what you are saying. Here is my answer to this that I sent out in another email: "Kevin, You do have a good point there. When I travel or when something is happening like a hurricane, I often dial up a target Blowtorch station and listen to what is going on there. I believe IBOC will end this nighttime DX'ing unless Ibiquity can pull a rabbit out of their hat (don't hold your breath). As for truckers, I am seeing more and more satellite radio antennas on their mirrors. It's got to be ideal for truckers, not having to constantly search for stations to hear good music and such, especially on AM during the day"... If the nighttime (and daytime!) band gets trashed, I will really miss a part of my hobby. > Death to the AMS! Then Possum Hunter wrote: So, clarify something for me. When you say "Death to the AMS!", are you saying that you want the AMS association to just die, or are you saying that you want to kill them yourself, or are you implying that you want to kill them with help of others that are easily swayed to your cause? Can you name the names of the individual mathematicians at the AMS that fall under the category of your "Death to the AMS!" or are does your "Death to the AMS!" cover all the individual mathematicians that work for or belong to the AMS? I just want to get this clarified so the record will be straight when the investigation is underway after the death or deaths start. And Charles answered: Gee, you write so well. Oh wait - you only cut and pasted the question I wrote to you, without answering it. You answer first! My comments were made in jest and not intended to be a Hate Statement, only an example of such. I hope and believe that all mathematicians realize that. Was your Hate Statement made in jest? Or, was yours meant to be a Hate Statement, as it appeared? By the way, there is a reason that the words hate and statement are capitalized when it is referenced to a statement. Just like the words Hate Crime are treated. Free Live Long Radio! Charles [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Nov 03 20:44:43 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 4 Nov 2002 04:44:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 70048 invoked from network); 4 Nov 2002 04:44:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Nov 2002 04:44:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.83) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Nov 2002 04:44:43 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.252] by n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 04 Nov 2002 04:44:42 -0000 Date: Mon, 04 Nov 2002 04:44:41 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: 1290 GLI AM STEREO Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1603 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.96.7 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > All of the systems are so similar that Sony was able to develop > their 4-Way decoder to produce no more than 4% distortion on any of > the systems when received. Actually the claimed figure was 5 percent. That's why the AMAX distortion spec was relaxed from 2.5% to 5.0% for battery-powered portable radios -- so the Sony SRF-42, with its pseudo-multi-system Sony decoder, could get the AMAX certification. > Even C-QuAM decoded as QuAM has little if any appearent distortion. It shows up as extra harmonics of the L-R component, which may actually make the audio sound more "bright" and "vivid". The only really audible degradation occurs when there's strong bass off to one side in the Stereo image -- for example, many 1960s songs where the bass is only in the Left or Right channel, rather than in the center. Without proper C-Quam decoding, the distortion becomes clearly audible, and may even make the whole audio image "shudder" along with the bass. On some AM Stereo stations this is worse than others; some sound nearly perfect on a Sony decoder, even with highly modulated wide-separation Stereo, but others sound especially "grundgy" and distorted. There are some AM Stereo stations that sound distorted both on a Sony radio and in plain MONO, but yet when I tune them in on a radio with a MC13022 or MC13028 C-Quam decoder, the distortion is "cleaned up" and they sound nearly perfect! These newer C-Quam decoders even noticeably improve the sound quality of pure mono stations, so it must be doing something special, possibly involving Synchronous detection. From dav259@csiro.au Sun Nov 03 20:59:29 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 4 Nov 2002 04:59:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 66940 invoked from network); 4 Nov 2002 04:59:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Nov 2002 04:59:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Nov 2002 04:59:26 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA44xPP06889 for ; Mon, 4 Nov 2002 15:59:25 +1100 (EST) Date: Mon, 4 Nov 2002 15:59:25 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} The Sky Is Falling / Death To Chicken Little! In-Reply-To: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A56079740457144F@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public You say yes, I say no. You say stop and I say go go go, oh no. You say goodbye and I say hello Hello hello I don't know why you say goodbye, I say hello Hello hello I don't know why you say goodbye, I say hello. Well I'm glad that's all been cleared up ... Still I wonder ... does it come in assorted colours? From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sun Nov 03 21:29:31 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 4 Nov 2002 05:29:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 74285 invoked from network); 4 Nov 2002 05:29:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Nov 2002 05:29:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Nov 2002 05:29:30 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.251] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 04 Nov 2002 05:29:30 -0000 Date: Mon, 04 Nov 2002 05:29:26 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: 1290 GLI AM STEREO Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 1875 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.253 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin T." wrote: > These newer C-Quam=20 > decoders even noticeably improve the sound quality of pure mono=20 > stations, so it must be doing something special, possibly involving=20 > Synchronous detection. I'll definitely agree to that. This was the biggest factor in the Harris system showing major strength without distortion under adverse conditions. In the Dec '78 issue of Popular Electronics it=20 describes all of the systems and the C-QuAM diagram shows a carrier level modulator that does the cosine correction. After that the signal is sent to two synchronous detectors at + and - 45=B0 degrees to directly demodulate the Left & Right Channels without having to dematrix them. From what I can tell the newer chips use full synchronous detection for the signal and only use the envelope to obtain 1/Cos=F8. The signal quality detector controls the level of cosine correction depending on the level of interference. When the interference gets to high cosine correction is turned off. The MC13020 used the envelope detector for L+R and had all the short comings of an envelope detector when it came to interference. I think it was Delco/GM that came up with the scheme to compare the Env Det & I Det in a negative feedback loop to gain modulate the signal. The big flaw in this is when the I Det went negative the=20 the feedback turned positive and the cosine corrector would latch up putting large spikes into L-R. This little circuit was what=20 Leonard Kahn sued GM over, claiming that it infringed on his inverse modulator. Why Motorola didn't stick with their original scheme outlined in Popular Electornics for their first decoder I don't know. From my understanding their 3rd generation chips seem to follow their original idea with the added signal quality detector to minimize=20 distortion during cosine correction. JSG From penry@nortelnetworks.com Sun Nov 03 21:37:34 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: penry@nortelnetworks.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 4 Nov 2002 05:37:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 37645 invoked from network); 4 Nov 2002 05:37:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Nov 2002 05:37:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com) (47.103.122.112) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Nov 2002 05:37:32 -0000 Received: from zrc2c011.us.nortel.com (zrc2c011.us.nortel.com [47.103.120.51]) by zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id gA45bi315929 for ; Sun, 3 Nov 2002 23:37:44 -0600 (CST) Received: by zrc2c011.us.nortel.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Sun, 3 Nov 2002 23:37:31 -0600 Message-ID: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A56079740457145B@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Was GE Superadio III - Now GE P780 Date: Sun, 3 Nov 2002 23:37:27 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) From: "Charles Penry" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=376233 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa5vhu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit "From: Kevin - Mesa, Arizona If you look around and find an 1958 GE 780P Eight Transistor chrome plated radio, and you get sound so good that it will make you cry. This is probably the best sounding AM radio ever made. This radio is the great-great-great-great grandfather of the Superadios. This radio sounds better than every tube radio I have ever owned or heard. This radio was the first to have the same big ferrite that the Superadio series has. I have one and its phenomenal." Is this the radio? http://www.transistor.org/feature/jutson/details.html And don't forget to click on the link at the bottom of the page to get a description from one of the designers! If this is what it looks like, I will start looking at the flea markets for one. Do you think GE will make an IBOC adapter for this radio? ROTFLMAO!!! Happy listening and remember - Free Live Radio! Charles [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From amfmdx@fastq.com Sun Nov 03 22:01:40 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 4 Nov 2002 06:01:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 96930 invoked from network); 4 Nov 2002 06:01:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Nov 2002 06:01:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Nov 2002 06:01:39 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt ([209.63.214.247]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gA461bP76609 for ; Sun, 3 Nov 2002 23:01:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <005c01c283c7$94224680$a1f9bed8@kredding430cdt> To: References: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A56079740457145B@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> Subject: GE P780 Date: Sun, 3 Nov 2002 23:01:10 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > Is this the radio? > http://www.transistor.org/feature/jutson/details.html This is the unit. Its a KICK ASS sounding radio. The best radio I have ever heard on AM and this includes the Zenith High Fidelity C845L 11 tube AM/FM unit with 10 inch speaker and 2 inch tweeter. The sound that comes out of this eight transistor unit is unbelievable. The bass response is superb. I had to rebuild mine but it sounds wonderful and DXes like a monster. This is truly one of the greatest radios ever built. It has great styling and the biggest drawback is that the thing weighs about 15 lbs. Its made of real chrome plated steel. If these quality radios and I include the portable Zenith Royal 2000 Trans-Symphony, were still made, then there would be NO need for IBAC. These radios and the GE SRIII also actually reproduce whats being sent and they sound great. Kevin Mesa, Arizona From possumhunter@netzero.net Sun Nov 03 22:07:56 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 4 Nov 2002 06:07:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 54111 invoked from network); 4 Nov 2002 06:07:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Nov 2002 06:07:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.197) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Nov 2002 06:07:55 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 3 Nov 2002 22:07:55 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: 1290 GLI AM STEREO Date: Mon, 4 Nov 2002 01:07:36 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 04 Nov 2002 06:07:55.0083 (UTC) FILETIME=[83FC19B0:01C283C8] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.158.229.156] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Kevin T wrote: > On some AM Stereo stations this is worse than others; some sound nearly perfect on a Sony decoder, even with highly modulated wide-separation Stereo, but others sound especially "grundgy" and distorted. There are several explanations to this: 1) The modulator tubes are about shot . 2) An Ampliphase transmitter that is out of alignment, or is broke. 3) The transmitter has an insufficient power supply, or has problems with it's power supply. 4) "The nature of the beast" of some Plate Modulated designs 5) McMartin transmitter 6) Problems between the antenna and transmitter 7) Bad or CHEAP component(s) in the audio chain Stations that have Polyphase Pulse Duration Modulation, such as the Harris SX, Gates, and DX lines, sound MUCH cleaner than other designs. I have often heard it said that the ultimate AM transmitter would sound as good as a Harris, be as reliable as a Continental, and as "grenade proof" as a CCA. The RCA BTA1R and BTA1S come close, but even my beloved BTA1R has phase distortion that can get nasty if I dont run a high pass filter on it. Many older transmitters have bass tilt distortion. This can be seen by modulating the transmitter at 50% with a square wave and watching the monitor output on an osciloscope. Many modern AM audio processors such as the Orban Optimod and Texar AudioPrizm/Eagle have a feature that allows you to "pre-distort" the audio to counter this type of distortion. >These newer C-Quam decoders even noticeably improve the sound quality of pure mono stations, so it must be doing something special, possibly involving Synchronous detection. Synchonous detection can hide many sins! I suspect it is just a better detector in them. Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Nov 03 22:22:23 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 4 Nov 2002 06:22:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 10285 invoked from network); 4 Nov 2002 06:22:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Nov 2002 06:22:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Nov 2002 06:22:23 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.164] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 04 Nov 2002 06:22:23 -0000 Date: Mon, 04 Nov 2002 06:22:22 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: The Sky Is Falling / Death To Chicken Little! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A56079740457144F@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1088 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.96.7 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > What are the current rules for operation of IBOC during critical > hours (I don't know)? If IBOC is allowed to operate during > critical hours, signals will be trashed, both analog and other > IBOC. Currently, testing of IBOC is allowed during "daytime" hours, which includes the "critical hours" up to sunset time. Notice I say *testing* of IBOC... because that's what it still is. The encoding type of the digital signal is changing almost weekly. Now they're using some sort of variable bit-rate system which can go up to 96 kbps depending on the audio content. They are considering the critical hours issue, since even before local sunset (and after local sunrise), the skywaves can be active enough to cause interference problems. One plan is to ultimately use THREE different power levels for the IBOC digital sidebands -- the highest level for daytime use (but still only enough to provide digital reception within the station's 0.5 mV/m coverage area), a reduced level for critical hours use, and an even further reduced level -- or completely off -- at night. From philipr@irac.pe.ca Mon Nov 04 05:47:32 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 4 Nov 2002 13:47:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 53308 invoked from network); 4 Nov 2002 13:47:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Nov 2002 13:47:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.69) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Nov 2002 13:47:31 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.252] by n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 04 Nov 2002 13:47:31 -0000 Date: Mon, 04 Nov 2002 13:47:29 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: GE Superadio III Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1442 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin T." wrote: > I noticed that the latest version of the box doesn't mention AMAX or > have the AMAX logo on it anymore, however it does mention something > called "AM Accent" in reference to its Normal/Wide Bandwidth switch. I bought my GE SR III back shortley after they were first introduced - I saw a bunch of them at Canadian Tire and just about danced through the aisles when I saw the AMAX logo on them - a couple months earlier I had first read about AMAX. When I took it home, I couldn't believe the sound quality. My SR III sounds fairly muddy on "normal" and is very hard to tune at the top of the dial - I have to put on my "micrometer fingers" [thanks Comander Eugene [Zenith] MacDonald for giving me this term!] Flip it to wide and it sounds teriffic! We recently bought the RS clone for work - to receive an FM signal from a Ramsey FM25A I built and feed it to one of our servers. This alows a wireless broadcast from our hearing room to the server room, and from there to all our offices. This gave me a chance to test the AM on the RS rig, before we set it up permanently on FM. The RS rig is OK, but not up to the GE! There is not a big difference in the sound when switching the bandwidths on the RS. From this, I suspect that the current crop of SR IIIs have a better sounding "normal" setting than the earlier ones - good for hi-fi dx! Phil From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Nov 04 07:48:45 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 4 Nov 2002 15:48:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 3378 invoked from network); 4 Nov 2002 15:48:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Nov 2002 15:48:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.68) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Nov 2002 15:48:44 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.187] by n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 04 Nov 2002 15:48:43 -0000 Date: Mon, 04 Nov 2002 15:48:43 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: AM Stereo Exciter Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 618 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Not Sold by me: > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1394687538 > 4 days left, now at 49.95. Note that the matching Motorola C-Quam modulation monitor is also on eBay, by the same seller: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1394685308 Current bid $50.00, 3 days left.... if this and the exciter are both in good working condition, they would make a great pair for some station to upgrade to Stereo! (My candidate for that would be the big 50 kW "Prime Time Radio" 740 CHWO in Toronto.... they are a FANTASTIC station, with excellent music and DJs... all they need is Stereo!) From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Nov 04 07:57:29 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 4 Nov 2002 15:57:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 46326 invoked from network); 4 Nov 2002 15:57:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Nov 2002 15:57:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.89) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Nov 2002 15:57:29 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.187] by n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 04 Nov 2002 15:57:28 -0000 Date: Mon, 04 Nov 2002 15:57:25 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Sony AM Stereo car radio on eBay Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 310 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics This is a Japanese-import Sony Double-DIN size car radio with AM Stereo and built-in CD and cassette players: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1394298610 The only catch is that it tunes the Japanese AM and FM bands; AM is from 522 to 1629 kHz in 9 kHz steps, and FM is from 76 to 90 MHz. From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Mon Nov 04 08:59:45 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 4 Nov 2002 16:59:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 74766 invoked from network); 4 Nov 2002 16:59:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Nov 2002 16:59:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14207.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.173.71) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Nov 2002 16:59:44 -0000 Message-ID: <20021104165944.8387.qmail@web14207.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.45.202.244] by web14207.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 04 Nov 2002 08:59:44 PST Date: Mon, 4 Nov 2002 08:59:44 -0800 (PST) Subject: Stereo equipment buyer one of us? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio Is eBayer "csgill" friend or foe of AM Stereo? Is he an engineer that'll install this equipment at a station, or just a reseller? Anybody know? __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? HotJobs - Search new jobs daily now http://hotjobs.yahoo.com/ From possumhunter@netzero.net Mon Nov 04 10:06:15 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 4 Nov 2002 18:06:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 42958 invoked from network); 4 Nov 2002 18:06:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Nov 2002 18:06:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.121) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Nov 2002 18:06:13 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 4 Nov 2002 10:06:13 -0800 To: References: <20021104165944.8387.qmail@web14207.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Stereo equipment buyer one of us? Date: Mon, 4 Nov 2002 13:05:46 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 04 Nov 2002 18:06:13.0590 (UTC) FILETIME=[DCB25F60:01C2842C] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.143.23.74] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 John P. wrote: > Is eBayer "csgill" friend or foe of AM Stereo? Is he an engineer that'll install this equipment at a station, or just a reseller? Anybody know? I don't know who he is, but I plan to bid on it when it gets closer to the end of the auction. I plan to put it on the air on a local commercial AM station. Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From possumhunter@netzero.net Mon Nov 04 13:55:26 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 4 Nov 2002 21:55:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 70884 invoked from network); 4 Nov 2002 21:55:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Nov 2002 21:55:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.80) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Nov 2002 21:55:25 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 4 Nov 2002 13:55:25 -0800 To: Subject: Fw: Message from Customer Care... Date: Mon, 4 Nov 2002 16:55:05 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 04 Nov 2002 21:55:25.0050 (UTC) FILETIME=[E134A5A0:01C2844C] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.153.75.247] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ----- Original Message ----- From: chinton@mcintoshlabs.com To: customercare@mcintoshlabs.com Cc: possumhunter@netzero.net Sent: Monday, November 04, 2002 4:39 PM Subject: RE: Message from Customer Care... Kevin, AM stereo is very rare and done with more than one format, so we never chose to support it. Chuck Hinton of McIntosh Tech Support "McIntosh Support" 11/03/02 12:28 PM Please respond to customercare To: cc: Subject: RE: Message from Customer Care... Subject: Ask An Expert first_name: Kevin last_name: Raper email: possumhunter@netzero.net country: UNITED STATES zip: 29681-2943 daytime_phone: evening_phone: time_to_call: request_info: MX406 AM/FM/CD Control Center Does the MX406 support Motorola C-QUAM AM Stereo? If not, does McIntosh make an AM Stereo tuner? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From KC4QLP@aol.com Mon Nov 04 13:56:09 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 4 Nov 2002 21:56:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 10271 invoked from network); 4 Nov 2002 21:56:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Nov 2002 21:56:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r09.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.105) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Nov 2002 21:56:08 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r09.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.1a4.b49bfb1 (3972) for ; Mon, 4 Nov 2002 16:55:50 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1a4.b49bfb1.2af846e6@aol.com> Date: Mon, 4 Nov 2002 16:55:50 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Stereo equipment buyer one of us? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp The bid is already up to $130.00 now....and hopefully all will go well THIS time for converting WRCS-AM 970 to stereo ...but not holding my breath.Seems like there is always some crook and or ebay reseller lurking somewheres Bob Carter Operations/Engineering WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5..., Ray Communications Radio Network Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From meridian3891@cs.com Mon Nov 04 15:00:07 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: meridian3891@cs.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 4 Nov 2002 23:00:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 9850 invoked from network); 4 Nov 2002 23:00:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Nov 2002 23:00:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Nov 2002 23:00:05 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.248] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 04 Nov 2002 23:00:05 -0000 Date: Mon, 04 Nov 2002 23:00:04 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: GE Superadio III Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 7186 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Tony" X-Originating-IP: 152.163.189.99 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=48487815 X-Yahoo-Profile: onemeridian I got mine a few months back & was downright astounded at the sound quality, sensitivity, & selectivity. I paid $150 for mine; it also has 4 SCA (subcarrier) decoder boards to listen to the SCA services; some of these are humorous! It is interesting how this radio brings in stations that normally "don't exist" with other receivers (except Sony 2010, DX-392, etc.). Have fun with it, Kevin. I know I am enjoying mine. Tony --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin T." wrote: > In my quest for AMAX, today I finally bought a GE Superadio III. > It was right on the shelf at Sears for $49.99, quite a bit less than > the $64.95 that the mail-order C.Crane Co. charges for one -- and > even less than the $59.99 which I believe Radio Shack is charging for > their "Optimus" clone of the Superadio. > > I noticed that the latest version of the box doesn't mention AMAX or > have the AMAX logo on it anymore, however it does mention something > called "AM Accent" in reference to its Normal/Wide Bandwidth switch. > > And just as many people have talked about, poor dial calibration does > appear to be a standard feature. On mine, the pointer reads about > 100 kHz low, so that a station on 1080 kHz shows up more like 980 kHz > on the dial. An easy fix, but annoying and something that should > have been taken care of by better quality control at the factory. > > Aside from that, it really is an excellent radio, on both AM and FM. > Its numerous tuned IF circuits really do help to give it amazing > sensitivity and selectivity on both bands. On FM, I am picking up > stations that before, only my car radio could get, such as a weak > pirate station on 107.9 FM (probably from somewhere in NYC) playing > Spanish music. My car radio was the only radio that could hear this, > and even then it was very weak and noisy; now, the Superadio is > picking it up loud and clear, with only moderate background hiss! > > The AM band, of course, is just as amazing. With it, I have picked > up 600 WICC at night for the first time EVER! That's a 500-watt > (nighttime) station from about 80 miles away, which normally gets > overwhelmed by background noise of all the skywave signals coming in > at night. The Superadio's 4-stage "tuned RF" front end really seems > to be doing is job here, as the selectivity is incredible, WITHOUT > giving low-fi muffled sound as a result. > > There's a reason why it has a "Normal/Wide" bandwidth switch rather > than a "Narrow/Wide" switch -- the "Normal" bandwidth is not "narrow" > by any means! It sounds like the full AMAX response is being > achieved even in "Normal" mode, and yet, the selectivity is good > enough that adjacent channel stations don't "splatter" over onto each > other. I can pick up 1010 WINS, 1020 KDKA, 1030 WBZ, 1040 WJHR, > 1050 WEVD, 1060 KYW, 1070 CHOK, 1080 WTIC, 1090 WBAL, 1100 WTAM, 1110 > WBT, 1120 WPRX (Spanish language from Connecticut, which is probably > NOT powering down to 500 watts at night!), 1130 WBBR, and 1140 WRVA > all right next to each other, with only very minimal "monkey chatter" > from the adjacent stations heard on each one -- and yet, the sound is > still very crisp and clear. > > "Wide" bandwidth mode, however, is *VERY* wide, while the audio > response really doesn't change all that drastically. I think the > AMAX audio filtering remains in use with both settings, and the Wide > mode simply disables all of the tuned-RF front end circuitry, > dropping it down to the level of an ordinary transistor radio. As a > result, when GE says the Wide mode is for "strong local stations", > they really mean it! It does give crisper, more "hi-fi" audio, but > the effect is quite subtle, as the "Normal" mode ALREADY sounds > better that just about any other AM radio! > > Thus, I think GE designed the Superadio III as if it was to be > permanently used in the "Normal" bandwidth mode, because in this mode > you get the benefits of superior sensitivity, selectivity, and AMAX > audio quality all at the same time. Then, they probably just threw > in the so-called "Wide" mode as an afterthought, as a rather > meaningless way of meeting the AMAX spec that requires at least two > AM bandwidth settings to be manually or automatically available to > the listener. Don't get me wrong, it DOES sound better in Wide mode, > but it's really only useful for stations that are truly strong and > local. > > But, in "Normal" mode, it's like having a built-in Select-A-Tenna -- > the compromise it is able to achieve between selectivity and audio > quality is really amazing. It also has a very good AGC, so weak > signals come in clearly without having skywave signal fades drive it > nuts. Overall, it reminds me a of a good vacuum tube radio, > especially with the way it sounds. With its large 6-inch speaker and > matching 2-inch tweeter, it delivers a pleasingly rich tone, with > deep bass response that would put almost any boom-box to shame, even > on AM. > > Now, I have the Radio Shack/Optimus "clone" of this radio, and I can > now say that it is *not* as good as the GE. On the Optimus, > everything is just a little bit cheaper than the Superadio; the > speaker is smaller, the FM whip antenna is shorter, the AM ferrite > bar antenna is shorter, the audio amp is less powerful, etc. It also > behaves much more like a "regular" radio, with reception that is > still very good, but not *stunningly* good like the way the GE is. > The only possible benefit of the Optimus is that the dial calibration > is better, and the Wide bandwidth mode is much more useable for > general listening, although it doesn't meet the AMAX specs so the > response is not as accurate and the unfiltered 10 kHz carrier whistle > can be quite annoying at night. > > Overall, the GE Superadio III is not *perfect*, especially with the > bad dial calibration and the excessively wide "Wide" mode, but it > is without a doubt the best radio -- on both AM and FM -- that you > can get for $49.99. Of course, many would say that the original > Superadio and Superadio II are superior radios, and in many cases the > older models do have superior performance, but in terms of radios > that you can still find on store shelves, the Superadio III is the > best of the bunch. It would be even better with AM Stereo and FM > Stereo, and perhaps digital tuning, but again, you have to remember > the price issue. The Superadio III also makes an excellent portable > radio, with easy carry-about size and very long life from 6 D-cell > batteries. > > p.s. Another "WOW!" moment as I finish this message -- again, for the > first time EVER, on the Superadio I am hearing 1010 CFRB from Canada > coming in ON TOP OF local 1010 WINS! This is honestly the first time > I have EVER heard CFRB directly on their AM frequency, rather than > through their 6.070 MHz shortwave relay. All this on the Superadio > sitting in my basement, with NO Select-A-Tenna or other external > antenna, and a computer on in the same room! From mark_608@hotmail.com Mon Nov 04 16:53:06 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: mark_608@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 5 Nov 2002 00:53:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 19919 invoked from network); 5 Nov 2002 00:53:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Nov 2002 00:53:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.17.94) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Nov 2002 00:53:04 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 4 Nov 2002 16:53:04 -0800 Received: from 136.1.1.101 by lw11fd.law11.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Tue, 05 Nov 2002 00:53:04 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Kenwood KT-880 Date: Mon, 04 Nov 2002 19:53:04 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 05 Nov 2002 00:53:04.0548 (UTC) FILETIME=[B2C2F640:01C28465] From: "Mark Sundquist" X-Originating-IP: [136.1.1.101] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=3850332 X-Yahoo-Profile: mark_608 Hey all, I have recently acquired one of these for the low,low price of $0.00(always a good deal!) It is a digital component tuner...has anyone tried to convert one of these...if so, how did it do? Thanks! Mark Sterling Heights,MI _________________________________________________________________ Broadband? Dial-up? Get reliable MSN Internet Access. http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/default.asp From penry@nortelnetworks.com Mon Nov 04 18:08:40 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: penry@nortelnetworks.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 5 Nov 2002 02:08:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 56241 invoked from network); 5 Nov 2002 02:08:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Nov 2002 02:08:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com) (47.103.122.112) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Nov 2002 02:08:39 -0000 Received: from zrc2c011.us.nortel.com (zrc2c011.us.nortel.com [47.103.120.51]) by zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id gA528p315259 for ; Mon, 4 Nov 2002 20:08:51 -0600 (CST) Received: by zrc2c011.us.nortel.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Mon, 4 Nov 2002 20:08:37 -0600 Message-ID: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A5607974045B802B@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: FW: [RT] Food for Thought (Screaming Kid Syndrome) Date: Mon, 4 Nov 2002 20:08:35 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) From: "Charles Penry" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=376233 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa5vhu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Look everyone; it's another example of the screaming kid syndrome, with an adult correcting the screaming kid's actions! I don't know if John P. is a member of this group. If you are, do you think that making up exaggerated stories and telling lies helps our cause? Take this overreacting, story telling screaming kid out of the mall and give him his deserved punishment! Again, let's be sensible and adult about what we say when we are trying to preserve AM Stereo. Charles ------------------------------------------- From the radio-tech forum: -----Original Message----- At 09:31 PM 11/2/02, John P. [toledohamradio@yahoo.com]wrote: >Today's Storytime: > >Imagine if they came out with a 2004 model New Car that claimed 80 MPG in the >city, and cost $100,000 each - but, oil refineries had to reformulate ALL >gasoline - everywhere - in order to make these New Cars work. In addition, >these New Cars also took-up two lanes on the highway for the extremely-wide >high-tech fuel combustion burner in these New Cars. Also, all oil refineries >would charge a $4000 royalty fee for every "New Car" to Ford/GM/Chrysler for >this special fuel formulation discovery in their car lines. This new gasoline >would also cost $4/gallon. You COULD still use this new car reformulated >gasoline in your old car, but horsepower would be half of what it once >was, and >your fuel economy would also be reduced to half of your original >MPG. However, >IF you bought the new $100,000 car you would get 80 MPG with the new >gas. In 5 >years they will change the gasoline formulation one last time, and all the >millions of cars on the road will be useless at that time. > >* Curtain Call * > >Here's our Cast of Characters for Our Story Above: >New Car: IBOC Receiver (at 500% the cost of existing units). >Refiners: iBiquity. >Ford/GM/Chrysler: Radio Station Owners. >New Formulated Gas: Truncated Analog / Digital Hybrid. >6Yr Gas: Date of Analog cut-off and all digital. >Existing Cars: 400 million analog receivers. > >BTW: Did you hear that K*dak is going to stop manufacturing ALL 35MM film >effective December 31, 2003? They will continue to manufacture only their APS >film as they feel it is superior to their 35mm film counterpart. From: Lowell Kiesow [mailto:kiesowle@plu.edu] Sent: Sunday, November 03, 2002 1:49 AM To: radio-tech@broadcast.net Subject: Re: [RT] Food for Thought Your analogy would be fine if more of the basis in facts for it were true. No manufacturers are predicting a 500% increase in the cost for an HD compatible radio. 30% is probably a lot closer and it would drop as production volumes increase. Neither the FCC, Ibiquity, or the NAB have proposed a six year phase out, or any other time line for that matter. And finally, AFAIK Kodak has made no such announcement. It would be very big news if they did. I'll stand corrected if you can cite a reliable source for such a statement. Besides, what does film have to do with this subject? _______________________________________________ Radio-tech mailing list [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From penry@nortelnetworks.com Mon Nov 04 18:14:17 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: penry@nortelnetworks.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 5 Nov 2002 02:14:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 32511 invoked from network); 5 Nov 2002 02:14:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Nov 2002 02:14:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com) (47.103.122.112) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Nov 2002 02:14:15 -0000 Received: from zrc2c011.us.nortel.com (zrc2c011.us.nortel.com [47.103.120.51]) by zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id gA52ER315409 for ; Mon, 4 Nov 2002 20:14:27 -0600 (CST) Received: by zrc2c011.us.nortel.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Mon, 4 Nov 2002 20:14:13 -0600 Message-ID: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A5607974045B802D@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: {AMSF} The Sky Is Falling / Death To Chicken Little! Date: Mon, 4 Nov 2002 20:14:11 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) From: "Charles Penry" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=376233 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa5vhu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello, The color of the sky ranges from very bright orange to blue to black, which some may point out as not being a color. Chicken is normally yellow or white without its feathers and before cooking. Goodbye, Charles -----Original Message----- From: Ian Davidson [mailto:dav259@csiro.au] Sent: Sunday, November 03, 2002 10:59 PM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: {AMSF} The Sky Is Falling / Death To Chicken Little! You say yes, I say no. You say stop and I say go go go, oh no. You say goodbye and I say hello Hello hello I don't know why you say goodbye, I say hello Hello hello I don't know why you say goodbye, I say hello. Well I'm glad that's all been cleared up ... Still I wonder ... does it come in assorted colours? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From florida_amstereo@hotmail.com Mon Nov 04 18:22:37 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: florida_amstereo@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 5 Nov 2002 02:22:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 6036 invoked from network); 5 Nov 2002 02:22:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Nov 2002 02:22:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.37.211) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Nov 2002 02:22:36 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 4 Nov 2002 18:22:36 -0800 Received: from 209.240.198.61 by pv2fd.pav2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Tue, 05 Nov 2002 02:22:35 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: the GE Superadio III/both Kevins Date: Tue, 05 Nov 2002 02:22:35 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 05 Nov 2002 02:22:36.0413 (UTC) FILETIME=[34A482D0:01C28472] From: "Donn Tillman" X-Originating-IP: [209.240.198.61] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83914824 Well New Jersy and Arizona Kevin, after your glowing recommendations, I decided to go and purchase a GE Superadio III after work today,... so I went to Sears, no dice. Then tried Best Buy, no dice. Circuit City, no dice. (are you seeing a pattern here?) a Sears outlet, no dice. (the young clerk asked me several times if I really wanted a radio w/o a c.d.; to tell you the truth, I don't think she had ever heard of a radio w/o a c.d.) Then to Walmart, no dice and to Target, again no dice (or GE Superadio III :) ) Tomorrow, I will try K-Mart, after that I guess I will have to order from C Crane. ~~~~~~~~~~~ Chris, at Target I did see a Memorex sphere radio/c.d. player, I believe the model number was MSP BX1600; is that the one that has a surprisingly good a.m. band. It was $40. (actually $39.95!) donn in iboc free, stereo am free and apparently GE Superadio III free St Pete. _________________________________________________________________ Unlimited Internet access -- and 2 months free!  Try MSN. http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/2monthsfree.asp From penry@nortelnetworks.com Mon Nov 04 18:29:57 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: penry@nortelnetworks.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 5 Nov 2002 02:29:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 82182 invoked from network); 5 Nov 2002 02:29:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Nov 2002 02:29:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com) (47.103.122.112) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Nov 2002 02:29:56 -0000 Received: from zrc2c011.us.nortel.com (zrc2c011.us.nortel.com [47.103.120.51]) by zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id gA52U8315929 for ; Mon, 4 Nov 2002 20:30:08 -0600 (CST) Received: by zrc2c011.us.nortel.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Mon, 4 Nov 2002 20:29:54 -0600 Message-ID: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A5607974045B8031@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: {AMSF} Re: The Skywaves Are Falling / Death To Chicken Little ! Date: Mon, 4 Nov 2002 20:29:53 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) From: "Charles Penry" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=376233 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa5vhu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Kevin-Mesa Arizona, If the question if for me, I am not a proponent of IBAC. I believe that IBOC is technically ill-conceived and was the idea of a few people that thought they would get rich from it. I believe that once a large number of stations get on the air with IBOC it will end medium wave reception of all but the most local (strongest) of signals, whether you are listening to existing analog, the analog or digital of a mixed analog/IBOC, or a digital only IBOC station. I am, however, an opponent of the screaming kid syndrome. It will not provide us with the results we are seeking. I worry that these screaming kids are actually an ad campaign by the proponents of IBOC. What better way to get many people in the industry to consider us crackpots and tune us out. And it cost them almost nothing, just a few emails. If it's not an ad campaign, then we are making it easy for them. Radio Free Live Long And Prosper, Charles Tag line one Tag line two Tag line three http://www.inserturlhere.oops Tag line four No more tag lines after this one -----Original Message----- From: Kevin - Mesa, Arizona [mailto:amfmdx@fastq.com] Sent: Sunday, November 03, 2002 10:04 PM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: The Skywaves Are Falling / Death To Chicken Little! > First of all, I like the modified subject line of "The Skywaves Are > Falling". Much more appropriate to the list. The skywaves aren't affected for now. IBAC is daytime only. They probably will be at night soon enough though... Just curious, are you a proponent of IBAC? This is not for argument, this is only for curiosity. IBAC, although I believe digital doesn't belong on the MW bands, can fit the AM [ BAND ] Stereo idea. It will be in stereo, just not C-QUAM. I don't have a problem with digital radio. I think that its a fine idea, I just believe that it belongs in the UHF bands where its a lot more stable for propagational conditions. Kevin Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From penry@nortelnetworks.com Mon Nov 04 18:40:41 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: penry@nortelnetworks.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 5 Nov 2002 02:40:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 43263 invoked from network); 5 Nov 2002 02:40:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Nov 2002 02:40:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com) (47.103.122.112) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Nov 2002 02:40:41 -0000 Received: from zrc2c011.us.nortel.com (zrc2c011.us.nortel.com [47.103.120.51]) by zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id gA52er316210 for ; Mon, 4 Nov 2002 20:40:53 -0600 (CST) Received: by zrc2c011.us.nortel.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Mon, 4 Nov 2002 20:40:39 -0600 Message-ID: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A5607974045B8039@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: {AMSF} Re: The Sky Is Falling / Death To Chicken Little! Date: Mon, 4 Nov 2002 20:40:36 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) From: "Charles Penry" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=376233 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa5vhu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit And what about northern Alaska medium wave stations? "Hey folks, here in Barrow, we get to broadcast IBOC to you during the daylight hours only, which for us means both weeks of summer. The rest of the year it's off, because it's dark all the time! So go out and buy that IBOC receiver now and beat the summer season rush!" Charles -----Original Message----- From: Kevin T. [mailto:kevtronics@yahoo.com] Sent: Monday, November 04, 2002 12:22 AM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: The Sky Is Falling / Death To Chicken Little! > What are the current rules for operation of IBOC during critical > hours (I don't know)? If IBOC is allowed to operate during > critical hours, signals will be trashed, both analog and other > IBOC. Currently, testing of IBOC is allowed during "daytime" hours, which includes the "critical hours" up to sunset time. Notice I say *testing* of IBOC... because that's what it still is. The encoding type of the digital signal is changing almost weekly. Now they're using some sort of variable bit-rate system which can go up to 96 kbps depending on the audio content. They are considering the critical hours issue, since even before local sunset (and after local sunrise), the skywaves can be active enough to cause interference problems. One plan is to ultimately use THREE different power levels for the IBOC digital sidebands -- the highest level for daytime use (but still only enough to provide digital reception within the station's 0.5 mV/m coverage area), a reduced level for critical hours use, and an even further reduced level -- or completely off -- at night. Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From possumhunter@netzero.net Mon Nov 04 18:58:38 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 5 Nov 2002 02:58:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 92933 invoked from network); 5 Nov 2002 02:58:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Nov 2002 02:58:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.200) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Nov 2002 02:58:37 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 4 Nov 2002 18:58:37 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} the GE Superadio III/both Kevins Date: Mon, 4 Nov 2002 21:58:21 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 05 Nov 2002 02:58:37.0211 (UTC) FILETIME=[3C941EB0:01C28477] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.156.155.226] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Donn Tillman wrote: > Well New Jersy and Arizona Kevin, after your glowing recommendations, I decided to go and purchase a GE Superadio III after work today,... I got mine at Lowes when they first came out. I got another one used from Bob Grove http://www.grove-ent.com for half of the price a few years later! -Kevin In South Carolina Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From dav259@csiro.au Mon Nov 04 19:05:39 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 5 Nov 2002 03:05:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 18494 invoked from network); 5 Nov 2002 03:05:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Nov 2002 03:05:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Nov 2002 03:05:38 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA535bP16418 for ; Tue, 5 Nov 2002 14:05:37 +1100 (EST) Date: Tue, 5 Nov 2002 14:05:37 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} The Sky Is Falling / Death To Chicken Little! In-Reply-To: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A5607974045B802D@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public On Mon, 4 Nov 2002, Charles Penry wrote: > Hello, Hello Hello > The color of the sky ranges from very bright orange to blue to black, which > some may point out as not being a color. Oh yes indeed - black is a colour - otherwise you could see through it. > Chicken is normally yellow or white without its feathers and before cooking. Indeed - overcook it and it turns black. > Goodbye, You say goodbye, I say hello > Charles Ian btw - I trust all proud Americans will cast a vote in tomorrows elections. It may not make much difference - but the more who do excercise their right to vote - the more difference it will make. As we say in Greater Oz - vote early and vote often! :) God Bless America ... and AMS! From florida_amstereo@hotmail.com Mon Nov 04 19:14:53 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: florida_amstereo@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 5 Nov 2002 03:14:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 80499 invoked from network); 5 Nov 2002 03:14:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Nov 2002 03:14:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.37.129) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Nov 2002 03:14:53 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 4 Nov 2002 19:14:53 -0800 Received: from 209.240.198.61 by pv2fd.pav2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Tue, 05 Nov 2002 03:14:52 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Re: {AMSF} the GE Superadio III/both Kevins Date: Tue, 05 Nov 2002 03:14:52 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 05 Nov 2002 03:14:53.0092 (UTC) FILETIME=[823FBE40:01C28479] From: "Donn Tillman" X-Originating-IP: [209.240.198.61] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83914824 The only Lowe's we have here is a home-building center (a competitor of Home Depot) We do have a strictly a Florida chain, Sound Advice, I may try them as well as K-Mart donn st petersburg,fl Kevin of the Palmetto State wrote: >I got mine at Lowes when they first >came out. I got another one used from >Bob Grove http://www.grove-ent.com for >half of the price a few years >later! -Kevin In South Carolina Long live FREE RADIO! _________________________________________________________________ Surf the Web without missing calls! Get MSN Broadband. http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/freeactivation.asp From jsgil@hal-pc.org Mon Nov 04 19:19:43 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 5 Nov 2002 03:19:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 36068 invoked from network); 5 Nov 2002 03:19:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Nov 2002 03:19:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Nov 2002 03:19:42 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.182] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 05 Nov 2002 03:19:42 -0000 Date: Tue, 05 Nov 2002 03:19:38 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: the GE Superadio III/both Kevins Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1500 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.173 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Donn Tillman" wrote: > > > > > > > > Well New Jersy and Arizona Kevin, after your glowing recommendations, I > decided to go and purchase a GE Superadio III after work today,... > > so I went to Sears, no dice. > > Then tried Best Buy, no dice. > > Circuit City, no dice. > > (are you seeing a pattern here?) > > a Sears outlet, no dice. > (the young clerk asked me several times if I really wanted a radio w/o a > c.d.; to tell you the truth, I don't think she had ever heard of a radio w/o > a c.d.) > > Then to Walmart, no dice > > and to Target, again no dice (or GE Superadio III :) ) > > Tomorrow, I will try K-Mart, after that I guess I will have to order from C > Crane. > ~~~~~~~~~~~ > Chris, at Target I did see a Memorex sphere radio/c.d. player, I believe the > model number was MSP BX1600; is that the one that has a surprisingly good > a.m. band. It was $40. (actually $39.95!) > > donn > in iboc free, stereo am free and apparently GE Superadio III free St Pete. > After someone said Sears were selling it for $49.99 I went to the local Sears and bought one. In the first hour I picked up WBAP 820 & KRLD 1080 like they were local stations. Also 680 & WOAI 1200 out of San Antonio. With a homemade Seletc-A-Tenna I picked up KFAQ 1170, WSM and a station out of Shreveport. Great DX radio. I could even listen to 820 in the wide mode with little interference and the treble turned up most of the time. JSG From kfornal@cox.net Mon Nov 04 19:27:14 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kfornal@cox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 5 Nov 2002 03:27:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 12627 invoked from network); 5 Nov 2002 03:27:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Nov 2002 03:27:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO lakemtao04.cox.net) (68.1.17.241) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Nov 2002 03:27:14 -0000 Received: from OMNIBOOK ([68.9.127.164]) by lakemtao04.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20021105032713.JROO1315.lakemtao04.cox.net@OMNIBOOK> for ; Mon, 4 Nov 2002 22:27:13 -0500 To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} the GE Superadio III/both Kevins Date: Mon, 4 Nov 2002 22:27:00 -0500 Message-ID: <001d01c2847b$3772cef0$0401a8c0@OMNIBOOK> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2616 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal From: "Keith Fornal" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=128541479 X-Yahoo-Profile: theradboy Amazon.com stocks them for $49.99 which is where I got mine last year. Here is a direct link: http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/B00000J061/qid=3D1036466690/sr=3D1-1= / ref=3Dsr_1_1_etk-electronics/102-8955427-3348941 Keith Fornal Treasurer Dutch Island Lighthouse Society www.dutchislandlighthouse.org -----Original Message----- From: Donn Tillman [mailto:florida_amstereo@hotmail.com]=20 Sent: Monday, November 04, 2002 9:23 PM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} the GE Superadio III/both Kevins Well New Jersy and Arizona Kevin, after your glowing recommendations, I=20 decided to go and purchase a GE Superadio III after work today,... so I went to Sears, no dice. Then tried Best Buy, no dice. Circuit City, no dice. (are you seeing a pattern here?) a Sears outlet, no dice. (the young clerk asked me several times if I really wanted a radio w/o a c.d.; to tell you the truth, I don't think she had ever heard of a radio w/o=20 a c.d.) Then to Walmart, no dice and to Target, again no dice (or GE Superadio III :) ) Tomorrow, I will try K-Mart, after that I guess I will have to order from C=20 Crane. ~~~~~~~~~~~ Chris, at Target I did see a Memorex sphere radio/c.d. player, I believe the=20 model number was MSP BX1600; is that the one that has a surprisingly good=20 a.m. band. It was $40. (actually $39.95!) donn in iboc free, stereo am free and apparently GE Superadio III free St Pete. _________________________________________________________________ Unlimited Internet access -- and 2 months free!=A0 Try MSN.=20 http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/2monthsfree.asp Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum=20 Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/=20 From florida_amstereo@hotmail.com Mon Nov 04 19:35:41 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: florida_amstereo@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 5 Nov 2002 03:35:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 48739 invoked from network); 5 Nov 2002 03:35:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Nov 2002 03:35:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.37.93) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Nov 2002 03:35:41 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 4 Nov 2002 19:35:41 -0800 Received: from 209.240.198.61 by pv2fd.pav2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Tue, 05 Nov 2002 03:35:40 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: RE: {AMSF} Re: The Sky Is Falling / Death To Chicken Little! Date: Tue, 05 Nov 2002 03:35:40 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 05 Nov 2002 03:35:41.0234 (UTC) FILETIME=[6A331920:01C2847C] From: "Donn Tillman" X-Originating-IP: [209.240.198.61] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83914824 Charles P of northern latitude 71.3 wrote: Hey folks, here in Barrow, we get to broadcast IBOC to you during the daylight hours only, which for us means both weeks of summer.  The rest of the year it's off, because it's dark all the time!  So go out and buy that IBOC receiver now and beat the summer season rush!" ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ I was reading about Barrow a few weeks ago and according to the U.S. Naval Observatory, you last day of sunlight this year is the 18th of November. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ U.S. Naval Observatory Astronomical Applications Department Sun and Moon Data for One Day The following information is provided for Barrow, North Slope Borough, Alaska (longitude W156.8, latitude N71.3): Monday 18 November 2002 Alaska Standard Time SUN Begin civil twilight 10:08 a.m. Sunrise 12:40 p.m. Sun transi 1:12 p.m. Sunset 1:45 p.m. End civil twilight 4:17 p.m. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ and when I saw that I wondered if all stations there were full time operations; it seems it would be difficult financially to be off the air 4 or 5 months at a time. curious donn. st petersburg,fl by contrast: 18 November 2002 st petersburg,fl sunrise: 06:55 a.m. sunset : 5:38 p.m. _________________________________________________________________ Get faster connections -- switch to MSN Internet Access! http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/default.asp From wa2fnq@optonline.net Mon Nov 04 19:42:51 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: wa2fnq@optonline.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 5 Nov 2002 03:42:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 71430 invoked from network); 5 Nov 2002 03:42:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Nov 2002 03:42:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.90) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Nov 2002 03:42:50 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.132] by n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 05 Nov 2002 03:42:50 -0000 Date: Tue, 05 Nov 2002 03:42:50 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: 1290 GLI AM STEREO Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2409 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wa2fnq" X-Originating-IP: 24.47.74.230 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=60059615 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa2fnq Just a little more info: The system is now running with a modified Fostex TT15 test oscillator generating the 25 Hz pilot tone in place of the Heathkit IG-72. The Ramsey AM-25 itself produced too many incidental phase modulation products to be used on AM Stereo. Something in Ramsey's design. Although I modified the stock audio I still wasn't happy with it. Building a new final/modulator helped in both cases. I used a 2N5913 driven by the RF output of the AM-25 series modulated by another 2N5913. L+R audio to the series modulator comes from a Radio Design Labs line amplifier. L-R audio from the Mosley is fed to a small mixer which sums in the 25 Hz piliot after the audio passes through a pre-emphasis network. The L-R audio then tickles a spot in the AM- 25's PLL. I also just cracked the audio pot open on the AM-25 board to modulate the RF drive slightly but below the point where unwanted products are produced. It works fine. Jerry, WA2FNQ .... 1290 AM Stereo --- In amstereoforum@y..., "wgliradio" wrote: > Last night, Jerry Mehrab and I were finally able to get our Part 15 > AM in C-Quam. > > We were using a basic Magnavox set-up with L+R and L-R audio (we > processed the L-R seperate from our main audio airchain which is > feeding a Ramsey AM-25). > > The AM-25 is slightly modified to supply better audio performance > than what Ramsey supplies (and to get rid of some FM'ing problems in > the mono mode). There was just enough I and Q that we were able to > insert 25Hz and we lit the light on the Sony XR-300 and my Chrysler > in the car with about 20-25dB seperation (with minimal to no > distortion artifacts in the audio). > > It is quite impressive. We're using a Hnat Hindes mic maze with a > Moseley TAL-310 limiter and the Inovonics 222 for the NRSC mask in > the L+R channel, with a Marti CL-40 limiter (FM pre-emphasis) in the > L-R channel. It's not perfect, but it sounds VERY good. > > I actually thought it would work when Jerry showed me his SRF-42. He > said he was rolling Magnavox and thought it was wild that the SRF- 42 > was doing stereo. I said the others should do it if we could get 25 > Hz in there. If the SRF-42 could detect it, the others probably > could... all they needed to know was that it was actually present. > We used his old Heathkit and the rest is Long Island Radio History! From florida_amstereo@hotmail.com Mon Nov 04 19:43:56 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: florida_amstereo@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 5 Nov 2002 03:43:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 1610 invoked from network); 5 Nov 2002 03:43:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Nov 2002 03:43:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.37.153) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Nov 2002 03:43:56 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 4 Nov 2002 19:43:56 -0800 Received: from 209.240.198.61 by pv2fd.pav2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Tue, 05 Nov 2002 03:43:55 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: RE: {AMSF} the GE Superadio III/both Kevins Date: Tue, 05 Nov 2002 03:43:55 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 05 Nov 2002 03:43:56.0294 (UTC) FILETIME=[91474260:01C2847D] From: "Donn Tillman" X-Originating-IP: [209.240.198.61] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83914824 Thanks for the info, Keith. Since someone else found one at Sears in Texas, I will try the next two closest Sears (one in Tampa and one in Bradenton) before I totally give up on buying one in person. But with the luck (or lack of luck) I had today, I may very well be ordereing from Amazon.com Donn st petersburg,fl ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Keith F wrote: Amazon.com stocks them for $49.99 which is where I got mine last year. Here is a direct link: http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/B00000J061/qid=1036466690/sr=1-1/ ref=sr_1_1_etk-electronics/102-8955427-3348941 _________________________________________________________________ Broadband? Dial-up? Get reliable MSN Internet Access. http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/default.asp From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Nov 04 19:54:53 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 5 Nov 2002 03:54:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 5669 invoked from network); 5 Nov 2002 03:54:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Nov 2002 03:54:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Nov 2002 03:54:52 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.182] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 05 Nov 2002 03:54:52 -0000 Date: Tue, 05 Nov 2002 03:54:50 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Fw: Message from Customer Care... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 418 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.73.142 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > AM stereo is very rare and done with more than one format, so we > never chose to support it. > Chuck Hinton of McIntosh Tech Support McIntosh may be clueless about AM Stereo (somebody please point them to www.amstereoradio.com so they can educate themselves), but their fellow M-named high-end audio company, Marantz, built quite a few AM Stereo-equipped receivers in the 1980s, including a few car radios. From wa2fnq@optonline.net Mon Nov 04 19:58:31 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: wa2fnq@optonline.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 5 Nov 2002 03:58:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 84333 invoked from network); 5 Nov 2002 03:58:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Nov 2002 03:58:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.89) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Nov 2002 03:58:31 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.164] by n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 05 Nov 2002 03:58:31 -0000 Date: Tue, 05 Nov 2002 03:58:30 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: WOR's Digital Interference with WLW/ re: Message from WOR's CE Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 6087 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wa2fnq" X-Originating-IP: 24.47.74.230 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=60059615 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa2fnq Just a question on a statment. WOR's chief says: >WOR is not transmitting anything out of the NRSC mask, despite all the claims of others. We have taken numerous Spectrum Analyzer measurements to ensure this. Maybe so but isn't the total power in the sidebands caused by occasional high frequencies much less than that produced by the continuous digital information? You're in the mask but creating one heck of a lot more interference. I think you're talking apples and oranges. There's a lot more to be considered then when you're just running analog. True? Jerry WA2FNQ --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Possum Hunter" wrote: > Kevin T." wrote: > > The following message below was posted to the New York Radio Message Board > today by Kerry Richards, 710 WOR's Chief Engineer. You can contact him at: > krichards@w... > > I am copying this to him, as well as the GM of WLW 700Khz and the GM of WFIS > > > > Posted by Kerry Richards CE WOR on November 01, 2002 at 12:39:59: > > > > In fact, we have received numerous listener comments that our signal has > improved, and sounds louder and better on various radios! I attribute this > to the increased level we are driving the analog signal with, since we had > lowered it's bandwidth. > > It is true that with a news/talk station, by lowering the bandwidth, you can > increase the modulation levels without going over 99% Negative and 125% > Positive peaks. I have done this on several News/Talk stations I have done > engineering for. > > > > WOR is not transmitting a 3.5khz bandwidth analog signal. I have the > bandwidth set at 6khz on the Orban 9200. > > Again I agree with Kerry cutting the bandwidth of a News/Talk station. Most > talk networks have rotten audio anyway, so the only thing you are cutting > out is noise that would be transmitted over the air. > > > >WOR is not transmitting anything out of the NRSC mask, despite all the > claims of others. We have taken numerous Spectrum Analyzer measurements to > ensure this. Yes, you can hear the digital carriers on our sidebands, but > they are in the NRSC mask. We like to think of our digital carriers as the > "WOR modem" on air! > > Here is where I differ greatly with WORs Engineer! While it may be true that > WOR's Digital data carriers are within the NRCS mask, the digital noise is > constant where an analog signal, even with 9.5Khz bandwidth, has very little > modulation density out near the 9Khz NRSC limit. I can hear the digital data > stream on WOR, but it is not bad enough to be an irritant on my factory > Toyota Am/FM/CD/Tape radio in my 2001 Toyota Tacoma. It is also listenable > on several of my old tube radios, and my Sangean made Realistic DX- 808. The > digital noise does make it unlistenable with my GE Superadio in the "Narrow" > mode, Realistic DX-400, RCA SuperBrain console, and my Sony SRF-42. That is > no biggie to me because I am not normally a WOR listener anyway! > > However, I am a 700 WLW listener! > WOR's digital noise makes an awful racket on my Toyota factory radio when it > is tuned to WLW. It also makes WLW sound bad on my old Crosley radios that > have "WLW" printed right on the dial instead of "700"! Even in the "Narrow" > position, WLW is not listenable on my GE Superadio or my Sony SRF- 42 or my > SuperBrain. In fact, the only radios I own that sound good on WLW when WOR > is running IBOC is my Sony ICF-2010 in lower sideband mode, and few of the > "cheapie" AC/DC 5 tube table radios from the '50s. That is a shame because I > do LOVE to listen to the "Big One's" Super Sounding audio. WLW could try to > counter the digital noise with a Kahn PowerSide, but it would degrade that > beautiful WLW sound. It is a special treat to hear the old Western Electric > transmitter on the air! I have not heard it in a while. > > The only reason I didn't speak up about the problem until now is I though > WOR was having technical problems. I was not aware of them broadcasting in > IBOC Digital. I have had "whistling" Optimods drive me bonkers trying to > figure out what was wrong, so I thought WOR was having such a problem! > > > >Yes, Ibiquity is testing the signal in various vans and their laboratories > in Warren NJ. We will eventually be testing at nighttime, after the daytime > data is in. This is a very time consuming project. > > That would explain the noise being a problem mostly during "Critical Hours". > > > > I invite anyone who exhibits a desire for a serious technical discussion > or has questions about WOR-HD, please e-mail me, likewise if you want to > hear the HD radio system please contact me, Ibiquity is sending more radios > soon. > > I would love to hear the HD radio! I am an AM radio nut who would rather > listen to a nice, Hi-Fi C-QUAM AM STEREO station than any FM. It would be > VERY interesting to hear how the HD radio performs on a Sky Wave DX signal. > I have not heard the X-Band test station in Warren, NJ. Even if it is on at > night, I would never hear it with WEUP and WJCC coming in on SkyWave. > Perhaps Ibiquity could scoot the test station up to 1710Khz??? There has > been much discussion on this board about the test station jamming WTTM, much > to the displeasure of WTTM's Engineer! > > I do know what would be the ultimate test for Ibiquity HD radio, IF the > owner of WFIS would go along with cutting his Great Sounding audio: There is > a HUGE co-channel interference problem between WFIS 1600 and short- spaced > WTZQ that makes both stations unlistenable in the lucrative Greenville SC > market. I wonder how the IBOC system would work under those conditions. I > also wonder if the WFIS Harris SX1A transmitter, or the back up LPB AM-60 > transmitter would transmit the IBOC signal without heavy modifications. I am > sure WFIS's narrow bandwidth ATU would have to be replaced. > > Long live FREE RADIO! > > Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ > Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Nov 04 20:47:05 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 5 Nov 2002 04:47:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 40435 invoked from network); 5 Nov 2002 04:47:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Nov 2002 04:47:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.84) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Nov 2002 04:47:04 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.184] by n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 05 Nov 2002 04:47:04 -0000 Date: Tue, 05 Nov 2002 04:47:03 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: WOR's Digital Interference with WLW Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2470 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.73.142 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Maybe so but isn't the total power in the sidebands caused by > occasional high frequencies much less than that produced by the > continuous digital information? You're in the mask but creating one > heck of a lot more interference. I think you're talking apples and > oranges. There's a lot more to be considered then when you're just > running analog. True? This is true. The NRSC "mask" was never designed to accomodate digital data sidebands. It was designed to keep analog audio from stepping onto second-adjacent channels, of which it does a perfect job because of the nearly universal use of a sharp "brick wall" cut-off just below 10 kHz. Analog AM stations actually *can* still transmit a full 20-20,000 Hz frequency response, as long as the high treble above 10.2 kHz is kept under a tightly controlled limit. It would still be enough to be audible on true wide-bandwidth radios, but obviously not everybody is using a Sony SRF-A100 or GE Superadio III, so it is far more practical to just use the 10 kHz cut-off and make the most of what you have below that point. Also, in Canada, the current form of IBOC on AM would NOT BE LEGAL even if they did want to use it!! This is because Canada has not only adopted the NRSC "RF mask" (like the USA), but also the NRSC "recommended audio mask" which mandates an even sharper cut-off above 10 kHz, to where it has to be reduced by at least 40 dB at 11 kHz, and 50 dB by 15 kHz, as you can see on this graph: http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/nrsc.gif The shaded background represents the Canadian NRSC audio bandwidth limit (which is only "voluntary" in the USA), with the line graph showing the typical response of a 10 kHz "brick wall" filter used for AM broadcasting. Meanwhile, one look at the audio spectrum of an IBOC signal reveals that the level of the digital sidebands actually *increases* above 10 kHz!... http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/wor-grph.gif This is the audio of 710 WOR, as received on a GE Superadio III in wide bandwidth mode. And yes, that "ringing" above 5 kHz *is* how their signal is broadcast! It is caused by modulation of the analog audio, and sounds really bad, as sort of a "scratchy", distorted effect. You can also tell from that graph that the SRIII's "wide" mode is truly barn-door bandwidth... at 15 kHz, the response is only about 4 dB down from its level at 10 kHz -- basically the same audio response as many FM radios! From penry@nortelnetworks.com Mon Nov 04 21:36:27 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: penry@nortelnetworks.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 5 Nov 2002 05:36:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 17156 invoked from network); 5 Nov 2002 05:36:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Nov 2002 05:36:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com) (47.103.122.112) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Nov 2002 05:36:26 -0000 Received: from zrc2c011.us.nortel.com (zrc2c011.us.nortel.com [47.103.120.51]) by zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id gA55aca25321 for ; Mon, 4 Nov 2002 23:36:38 -0600 (CST) Received: by zrc2c011.us.nortel.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Mon, 4 Nov 2002 23:36:25 -0600 Message-ID: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A5607974045B8075@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: {AMSF} Re: WOR's Digital Interference with WLW/ re: Message f rom WOR's CE Date: Mon, 4 Nov 2002 23:36:16 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) From: "Charles Penry" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=376233 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa5vhu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Jerry, As I understand the rules, if WOR is keeping their emissions within the FCC required NSRC mask, they are legal. It may turn out that the FCC mask that was developed based on pre-digital days, may not be enough to prevent severe interference. Apples = FCC requirements. Oranges = The real world. Happy listening, Charles Radio Free Live Long -----Original Message----- From: wa2fnq [mailto:wa2fnq@optonline.net] Sent: Monday, November 04, 2002 9:59 PM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: WOR's Digital Interference with WLW/ re: Message from WOR's CE Just a question on a statment. WOR's chief says: >WOR is not transmitting anything out of the NRSC mask, despite all the claims of others. We have taken numerous Spectrum Analyzer measurements to ensure this. Maybe so but isn't the total power in the sidebands caused by occasional high frequencies much less than that produced by the continuous digital information? You're in the mask but creating one heck of a lot more interference. I think you're talking apples and oranges. There's a lot more to be considered then when you're just running analog. True? Jerry WA2FNQ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From amfmdx@fastq.com Mon Nov 04 22:42:01 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 5 Nov 2002 06:41:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 85459 invoked from network); 5 Nov 2002 06:41:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Nov 2002 06:41:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Nov 2002 06:42:00 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt (d13-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.45]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gA56fxP09785 for ; Mon, 4 Nov 2002 23:41:59 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <016401c28496$50071f00$2439bbd0@kredding430cdt> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fw: Message from Customer Care... Date: Mon, 4 Nov 2002 23:41:01 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > AM stereo is very rare and done with more than one format, so we never chose to support it. > > Chuck Hinton of McIntosh Tech Support Too bad this fellow is ignorant. Kevin Mesa, Arizona From amfmdx@fastq.com Mon Nov 04 22:53:43 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 5 Nov 2002 06:53:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 77924 invoked from network); 5 Nov 2002 06:53:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Nov 2002 06:53:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Nov 2002 06:53:43 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt (d13-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.45]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gA56rfP09962 for ; Mon, 4 Nov 2002 23:53:41 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <019f01c28497$f239d640$2439bbd0@kredding430cdt> To: References: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A5607974045B8031@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: The Skywaves Are Falling / Death To Chicken Little! Date: Mon, 4 Nov 2002 23:52:43 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla Charles, On this item below, we totally agree. It was very ill conceived. Digital radio is not the issue, its the implementation for me that turns me off. The implementation is poor at best. I believe the result will be disasterous. Perhaps I will be wrong but I don't suspect so. Kevin > If the question if for me, I am not a proponent of IBAC. I believe that > IBOC is technically ill-conceived and was the idea of a few people that > thought they would get rich from it. I believe that once a large number of > stations get on the air with IBOC it will end medium wave reception of all > but the most local (strongest) of signals, whether you are listening to > existing analog, the analog or digital of a mixed analog/IBOC, or a digital > only IBOC station. From jsgil@hal-pc.org Mon Nov 04 22:56:50 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 5 Nov 2002 06:56:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 82548 invoked from network); 5 Nov 2002 06:56:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Nov 2002 06:56:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Nov 2002 06:56:49 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.140] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 05 Nov 2002 06:56:49 -0000 Date: Tue, 05 Nov 2002 06:56:48 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: WOR's Digital Interference with WLW/ re: Message from WOR's CE Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1465 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.55 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@y..., "wa2fnq" wrote: > Just a question on a statment. WOR's chief says: > > >WOR is not transmitting anything out of the NRSC mask, despite all > the > claims of others. We have taken numerous Spectrum Analyzer > measurements to > ensure this. > > Maybe so but isn't the total power in the sidebands caused by > occasional high frequencies much less than that produced by the > continuous digital information? You're in the mask but creating one > heck of a lot more interference. I think you're talking apples and > oranges. There's a lot more to be considered then when you're just > running analog. True? > > Jerry WA2FNQ > > After looking at the spectrum analisys that Kevin did of WOR's IBOC sidebands which was received on a wideband sony radio it appears that they go all the way to 15KHz. And Yes, the digital hash of IBOC has a much greater level of energy weighted over a period of time than analog sidebands. Even if the IBOC sidebands only went to 10KHz a 15KHz analog would have less energy overall. If IBOC is approved at night then one IBOC station would be equal to 100's of analog skywave signals. If they're talking about reducing the IBOC signal at night to reduce this then the IBOC signal will be more vulnerable to skywave interference. This is the dilema that IBOC faces at night. If IBOC does move to nighttime then there will be a lot of angry station egineers of analog stations. JSG From amfmdx@fastq.com Mon Nov 04 22:58:02 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_2_1); 5 Nov 2002 06:57:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 9741 invoked from network); 5 Nov 2002 06:57:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Nov 2002 06:57:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Nov 2002 06:58:01 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt (d13-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.45]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gA56w0P10001 for ; Mon, 4 Nov 2002 23:58:00 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <01cd01c28498$8c8643a0$2439bbd0@kredding430cdt> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} the GE Superadio III/both Kevins Date: Mon, 4 Nov 2002 23:57:02 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > But with the luck (or lack of luck) I had today, I may very well be > ordereing from Amazon.com You also can try outpost.com Kevin From ccuff@in4web.com Tue Nov 05 00:41:45 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Nov 2002 08:41:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 99906 invoked from network); 5 Nov 2002 08:41:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Nov 2002 08:41:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Nov 2002 08:41:43 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.42]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Tue, 5 Nov 2002 03:40:49 -0500 Message-ID: <003f01c284a6$f566fc80$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: Subject: recent posts Date: Tue, 5 Nov 2002 03:40:12 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 Re: The Sony car radio on ebay: $60.00 shipping! I have followed this guys stuff for a few months..... he has listed this model before. Re: MacIntosh- This person has no right working at a prestigious audio company when obviously he does not know about there being only one format for 10 years now. Alfredo Lites: I have 5 available now. More coming after the first of the year. To Ben- Welcome back!!! To everyone else- I am here... :-) This is my busiest time of the year, as I am involved with making custom Christmas lighting (another hobby) so this is consuming most of my time. Chris From ccuff@in4web.com Tue Nov 05 00:49:39 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Nov 2002 08:49:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 25560 invoked from network); 5 Nov 2002 08:49:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Nov 2002 08:49:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Nov 2002 08:49:37 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.42]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Tue, 5 Nov 2002 03:48:43 -0500 Message-ID: <004501c284a8$102186c0$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: Subject: More info Date: Tue, 5 Nov 2002 03:48:06 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 I kept reading... Yes, that Memorex sphere is the one- it "was" on sale at $29.95- but still a great candidate at $39.95. (I am on digest now, as my emails are topping 100 per day) Re: The super radio- A good radio, but absolutely horrid in the EB- even with a select-a-tenna. 3 different radios tried. This is (acocording to an old post by Alfredo) due to the varactor diodes not liking the higher freqs.) As soon as I have tuned any of these beyond 1600, it is as if the antenna is cut off. These should be orderable at Radio shack on line- but wait for thier sale- usually every 6 weeks or so. CC From amfmdx@fastq.com Tue Nov 05 07:02:52 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Nov 2002 15:02:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 94695 invoked from network); 5 Nov 2002 15:02:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Nov 2002 15:02:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Nov 2002 15:02:50 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt (d200-osel-phx.fastq.com [209.63.214.187]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gA5F2nP14712 for ; Tue, 5 Nov 2002 08:02:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <022501c284dc$564306e0$2439bbd0@kredding430cdt> To: References: <004501c284a8$102186c0$0101a8c0@pavilion> Subject: Re: {AMSF} More info Date: Tue, 5 Nov 2002 08:02:16 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > Re: The super radio- A good radio, but absolutely horrid in the EB- even > with a select-a-tenna. 3 different radios tried. Thats funny, because my SR III is my best portable above 1600. Believe it or not its a little better than my CCRadio and a Sony 2010. No $#!+. Kevin From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Nov 05 07:53:09 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Nov 2002 15:53:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 7694 invoked from network); 5 Nov 2002 15:53:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Nov 2002 15:53:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.89) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Nov 2002 15:53:06 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.164] by n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 05 Nov 2002 15:53:01 -0000 Date: Tue, 05 Nov 2002 15:52:57 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: More info Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <004501c284a8$102186c0$0101a8c0@pavilion> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1522 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Re: The super radio- A good radio, but absolutely horrid in the EB- > even with a select-a-tenna. 3 different radios tried. This is > (acocording to an old post by Alfredo) due to the varactor diodes > not liking the higher freqs.) > As soon as I have tuned any of these beyond 1600, it is as if the > antenna is cut off. > These should be orderable at Radio shack on line- but wait for > thier sale- usually every 6 weeks or so. The Radio Shack "Optimus" version of the Superadio definitely has this problem; on mine, it is almost completely dead above 1500 kHz. But the real GE Superadio III (at least the one I have) is still very good at the top of the dial. During the daytime, I can pick up distant 10-watt TIS stations clearer than on any other radio (even my car radio), and at night, it does a good job of Expanded Band DXing. But if you want a hot little radio from Radio Shack, try the small analog tuning DX-397 shortwave radio. I got mine on sale for $29.99. Even from the tiny built-in speaker, the sound quality on AM is incredible! It seems to have full 10+ kHz AMAX response, right out of the box, and the reception is surprisingly good as well. The DX-397 also does make a successful conversion to AM Stereo, although you might have to tweak its aggressive AGC which tends to pop it out of Stereo mode on any signal strength fluctuation. One tip: On AM, be sure to have the whip antenna completely folded in, otherwise you get strange images from the shortwave bands bleeding in. From possumhunter@netzero.net Tue Nov 05 07:54:12 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Nov 2002 15:54:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 9679 invoked from network); 5 Nov 2002 15:54:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Nov 2002 15:54:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.22) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Nov 2002 15:54:11 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 5 Nov 2002 07:54:11 -0800 To: References: <004501c284a8$102186c0$0101a8c0@pavilion> Subject: Re: {AMSF} More info Date: Tue, 5 Nov 2002 10:53:28 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 05 Nov 2002 15:54:11.0357 (UTC) FILETIME=[95174CD0:01C284E3] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.154.49.234] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Christopher Cuff wrote: > Re: The super radio- A good radio, but absolutely horrid in the EB- even with a select-a-tenna. 3 different radios tried. This is (acocording to an old post by Alfredo) due to the varactor diodes not liking the higher freqs.) As soon as I have tuned any of these beyond 1600, it is as if the antenna is cut off. I have one of the very first Superadio IIIs to come to town. It does a pretty decent job on X-band. I am well outside of the 1.5mv/m contour of any X-band station, but I can still hear a couple of them all day on my Superadio that my Sangean can't pull out of it's own internal noise, even on my big Sloper antenna. It will also pick up a TIS station that is 20 miles away. Like all of the early Superadios, it is muddy in the "Normal" mode, but sounds wonderful in the "Wide" mode. Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From spfleck@citlink.net Tue Nov 05 09:26:53 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: spfleck@citlink.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Nov 2002 17:26:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 4812 invoked from network); 5 Nov 2002 17:26:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Nov 2002 17:26:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO relay01.roc.frontiernet.net) (66.133.131.34) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Nov 2002 17:26:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 30292 invoked from network); 5 Nov 2002 17:26:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO Steve) ([170.215.241.103]) (envelope-sender ) by relay01.roc.frontiernet.net (qmail-ldap-1.03) with SMTP for ; 5 Nov 2002 17:26:50 -0000 Message-ID: <01f301c284f0$868b78a0$01c8a8c0@N2UBP> To: References: <1036474589.2489.17161.m15@yahoogroups.com> Subject: Superradio II - here it is at Sears with free shipping rebate Date: Tue, 5 Nov 2002 12:26:49 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Steve Fleckenstein" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=2988995 X-Yahoo-Profile: n2ubp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Search on " GE radio" at www.sears.com http://www.sears.com/sr/product/summary/productsummary.jsp?BV_SessionID=@@@@0203365433.1036516992@@@@&BV_EngineID=ccdiadcgjgiljiicehgcemgdffmdfko.0&vertical=SEARS&bidsite=&pid=05724655000 [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Tue Nov 05 10:11:11 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Nov 2002 18:11:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 73842 invoked from network); 5 Nov 2002 18:11:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Nov 2002 18:11:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14201.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.143) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Nov 2002 18:11:09 -0000 Message-ID: <20021105180857.7575.qmail@web14201.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.45.202.244] by web14201.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 05 Nov 2002 10:08:57 PST Date: Tue, 5 Nov 2002 10:08:57 -0800 (PST) Subject: SuperRadio and OT obit To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio CCuff said: "as soon as I have tuned any of these beyond 1600, it is as if the antenna is cut off. These should be orderable at Radio shack on line- but wait for thier sale- usually every 6 weeks or so". "Danger Will Robinson" - do you have the Radio Shack version or the genuine GE version? GE for some reason is better than the RS version with the shorter ferrite antenna. Speaking of Will Robinson, Jonathan Harris (aka Dr. Smith)@age 87,Sunday, R.I.P. __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? HotJobs - Search new jobs daily now http://hotjobs.yahoo.com/ From e92fmjamz@yahoo.com Tue Nov 05 13:47:18 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: e92fmjamz@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Nov 2002 21:47:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 67274 invoked from network); 5 Nov 2002 21:47:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Nov 2002 21:47:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14002.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.175.93) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Nov 2002 21:47:15 -0000 Message-ID: <20021105214715.86239.qmail@web14002.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [152.8.78.47] by web14002.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 05 Nov 2002 13:47:15 PST Date: Tue, 5 Nov 2002 13:47:15 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: More info To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: Ernest Jones X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=24963319 X-Yahoo-Profile: e92fmjamz I found that my radio shaft SR clone does the same thing above 1500khz on the supplied bar antenna, an outside antenna fixed this niceley! --- "Kevin T." wrote: > > Re: The super radio- A good radio, but absolutely > horrid in the EB- > > even with a select-a-tenna. 3 different radios > tried. This is > > (acocording to an old post by Alfredo) due to the > varactor diodes > > not liking the higher freqs.) > > As soon as I have tuned any of these beyond 1600, > it is as if the > > antenna is cut off. > > These should be orderable at Radio shack on line- > but wait for > > thier sale- usually every 6 weeks or so. > > The Radio Shack "Optimus" version of the Superadio > definitely has > this problem; on mine, it is almost completely dead > above 1500 kHz. > But the real GE Superadio III (at least the one I > have) is still very > good at the top of the dial. During the daytime, I > can pick up > distant 10-watt TIS stations clearer than on any > other radio (even my > car radio), and at night, it does a good job of > Expanded Band DXing. > > But if you want a hot little radio from Radio Shack, > try the small > analog tuning DX-397 shortwave radio. I got mine on > sale for $29.99. > Even from the tiny built-in speaker, the sound > quality on AM is > incredible! It seems to have full 10+ kHz AMAX > response, right out > of the box, and the reception is surprisingly good > as well. The > DX-397 also does make a successful conversion to AM > Stereo, although > you might have to tweak its aggressive AGC which > tends to pop it out > of Stereo mode on any signal strength fluctuation. > One tip: On AM, > be sure to have the whip antenna completely folded > in, otherwise you > get strange images from the shortwave bands bleeding > in. > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > ===== Ernest, Gates NC, USA WRCS 970 AM Ahoskie NC, Announcer,webmaster http://wrcs.cjb.net WQDK 99.3 FM Ahoskie NC, Fill in ------contact me-------- AIM: e92fmjamz2000 ICQ: 33155469 Yahoo: e92fmjamz __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? HotJobs - Search new jobs daily now http://hotjobs.yahoo.com/ From jsgil@hal-pc.org Tue Nov 05 13:52:08 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Nov 2002 21:52:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 38779 invoked from network); 5 Nov 2002 21:52:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Nov 2002 21:52:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Nov 2002 21:52:08 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.132] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 05 Nov 2002 21:52:08 -0000 Date: Tue, 05 Nov 2002 21:52:07 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: SuperRadio and OT obit Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20021105180857.7575.qmail@web14201.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 918 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.130.100 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@y..., "John P." wrote: > CCuff said: "as soon as I have tuned any of these beyond 1600, it is as if the > antenna is cut off. These should be orderable at Radio shack on line- but wait > for thier sale- usually every 6 weeks or so". > > "Danger Will Robinson" - do you have the Radio Shack version or the genuine GE > version? GE for some reason is better than the RS version with the shorter > ferrite antenna. > After I bought mine I thought that it worked pretty well in the EB as I picked up a distant TIS station also. It worked better than any other radio that I have. The two main issues I have with it is that the dial is not accurate especially on AM and the case could be made better. On CCrane's website they say the "construction is medium at best" and it definitely shows. Oh, and they could get rid the varactor diodes and put in a real tuning cap. JSG From mrradioguy@excite.com Wed Nov 06 04:11:52 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: mrradioguy@excite.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Nov 2002 12:11:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 46647 invoked from network); 6 Nov 2002 12:11:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Nov 2002 12:11:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Nov 2002 12:11:50 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.140] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Nov 2002 12:11:50 -0000 Date: Wed, 06 Nov 2002 12:11:48 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: AM Stereo radio & exciter Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 294 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "yowzah_1999" X-Originating-IP: 68.54.38.248 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=31730547 X-Yahoo-Profile: yowzah_1999 The AM stereo exciter for sale on E-Bay supposedly was hit by lightning and trashed. This information came from the former engineer and owner of WKII 1070 in Port Charlotte, FL. GE Superadios are also avaliable at True Value hardware stores (at least around here...) Phil Beckman Naples, FL From florida_amstereo@hotmail.com Wed Nov 06 05:26:12 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: florida_amstereo@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Nov 2002 13:26:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 4740 invoked from network); 6 Nov 2002 13:26:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Nov 2002 13:26:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.37.134) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Nov 2002 13:26:11 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 6 Nov 2002 05:26:11 -0800 Received: from 199.173.224.2 by pv2fd.pav2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Wed, 06 Nov 2002 13:26:10 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM Stereo radio & exciter Date: Wed, 06 Nov 2002 13:26:10 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 06 Nov 2002 13:26:11.0090 (UTC) FILETIME=[1273D720:01C28598] From: "Donn Tillman" X-Originating-IP: [199.173.224.2] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83914824 thanks for the additional info, Phil , on where I might find a GE Superadio III without ordering one through the mail; on the Sear's Website I put in different zip codes and there is not a Sear's within 50 miles of here that carries them; they would have to order. According to the st pete phone book, which is nearly out of date, their is one True-Value left here; will have to check it out. ----Original Message Follows---- From: "yowzah_1999" Reply-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} AM Stereo radio & exciter Date: Wed, 06 Nov 2002 12:11:48 -0000 The AM stereo exciter for sale on E-Bay supposedly was hit by lightning and trashed. This information came from the former engineer and owner of WKII 1070 in Port Charlotte, FL. GE Superadios are also avaliable at True Value hardware stores (at least around here...) Phil Beckman Naples, FL donn tillman p o box 952 st petersburg,fl 33731-0952 _________________________________________________________________ Help STOP SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail From meridian3891@cs.com Wed Nov 06 08:01:32 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: meridian3891@cs.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Nov 2002 16:01:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 39118 invoked from network); 6 Nov 2002 16:01:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Nov 2002 16:01:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.86) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Nov 2002 16:01:30 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.253] by n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Nov 2002 16:01:30 -0000 Date: Wed, 06 Nov 2002 16:01:29 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Station on 87.5 FM!!! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1006 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Tony" X-Originating-IP: 205.166.36.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=48487815 X-Yahoo-Profile: onemeridian Is it still on? That's strange! Tony --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin T." wrote: > On my Superadio (which is turning out to be really SUPER), right now > I am getting an FM radio signal on 87.5 MHz, playing Spanish music, > LOUD AND CLEAR... yes, it is on 87.5!! It is actually BELOW the > Channel 6 TV audio from Philly on 87.75 MHz! > > It is coming in absolutely full-quieting, as if the transmitter is > right next door... I wonder if somebody in my neighborhood has set > it up? The treble response is very crisp and clear, and the audio > processing is good, although I can tell by the "pumping" that it is > simple single-band compression. > > I have heard of pirates using 87.9 MHz before... but this is the > first time I have ever heard an actual FM station all the way down on > 87.5!! I guess they know that that's as low as most FM radios go, so > it would make a very distinctive spot to put a transmitter -- but not > exactly a legal one! From kevtronics@yahoo.com Wed Nov 06 09:18:00 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Nov 2002 17:17:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 94133 invoked from network); 6 Nov 2002 17:17:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Nov 2002 17:17:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.68) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Nov 2002 17:17:59 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.169] by n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Nov 2002 17:17:59 -0000 Date: Wed, 06 Nov 2002 17:17:59 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Outrageously priced Sony SRF-A100 on eBay Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 143 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics I know these little gems are increasing in value, but $550 for a Sony SRF-A100? http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=732390044 From kevtronics@yahoo.com Wed Nov 06 09:22:36 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Nov 2002 17:22:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 14513 invoked from network); 6 Nov 2002 17:22:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Nov 2002 17:22:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.90) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Nov 2002 17:22:35 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.250] by n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Nov 2002 17:22:35 -0000 Date: Wed, 06 Nov 2002 17:22:33 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: U.K. AM Stereo Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 257 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics Here's something for our European members -- an Aiwa stereo system with AM Stereo on eBay U.K.: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1395883782 It's a Japanese model, but since you use the same 9 kHz channel spacing on AM, you're in luck! From michaelj@vcn.com Wed Nov 06 09:24:47 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Nov 2002 17:24:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 33543 invoked from network); 6 Nov 2002 17:24:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Nov 2002 17:24:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m3-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.33) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Nov 2002 17:24:46 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m3-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Wed, 6 Nov 2002 10:24:46 -0700 Message-ID: <001c01c285b9$829f09e0$0701010a@keva> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Outrageously priced Sony SRF-A100 on eBay Date: Wed, 6 Nov 2002 10:25:31 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit THAT is a little rediculous. Then again.....we're talkin' RARE. This is probably the ONLY one in existance still in an unopened box. XEAK....is the seller. Is that a station in San Diego or that area? Wouldn't surprise me if this is something they found tucked away in a closet or in storage somewhere. I'd like to dig through some storage stuff at KYFO in Ogden, UT. I heard back in the 80s they bought CASES of these SRF-A100s to give away as promos because they were (under the KJQN calls) Kahn AM stereo. My buddy here in Evanston actually worked there at the time and he kifed one for himself. Unfortunately he says he hasn't seen it in years :( You watch, folks. This guy will probably get the $550 for it! MJR n WYO ----- Original Message ----- From: Kevin T. To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, November 06, 2002 10:17 AM Subject: {AMSF} Outrageously priced Sony SRF-A100 on eBay I know these little gems are increasing in value, but $550 for a Sony SRF-A100? http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=732390044 Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From michaelj@vcn.com Wed Nov 06 09:27:12 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Nov 2002 17:27:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 13809 invoked from network); 6 Nov 2002 17:27:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Nov 2002 17:27:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m2-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.32) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Nov 2002 17:27:11 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m2-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Wed, 6 Nov 2002 10:27:11 -0700 Message-ID: <002201c285b9$d8ec3d40$0701010a@keva> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} U.K. AM Stereo Date: Wed, 6 Nov 2002 10:27:55 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I'd try for it if I knew it could be switched for 10Khz spacing. I know my Aiwa walkman that I have can be programmed for either 9 or 10 with just the push of a few buttons. This is the nice one that records too. Got it through Chuck (simpson) a few years ago. MJR n WYO ----- Original Message ----- From: Kevin T. To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, November 06, 2002 10:22 AM Subject: {AMSF} U.K. AM Stereo Here's something for our European members -- an Aiwa stereo system with AM Stereo on eBay U.K.: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1395883782 It's a Japanese model, but since you use the same 9 kHz channel spacing on AM, you're in luck! Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From scott.toenniessen@fmr.com Wed Nov 06 10:55:11 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: scott.toenniessen@fmr.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Nov 2002 18:55:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 45898 invoked from network); 6 Nov 2002 18:55:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Nov 2002 18:55:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Nov 2002 18:55:08 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.143] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Nov 2002 18:55:08 -0000 Date: Wed, 06 Nov 2002 18:55:04 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Breaking news from Boston Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1423 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "spt87a" X-Originating-IP: 204.110.135.35 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public Unfortunately, it seems what I speculated below was true - they were running on an old transmitter. They were back in mono by late afternoon/early evening. - Scott --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Possum Hunter" wrote: > spt87a wrote: > > Last night, WBZ mono 1030, this morning WBZ AM Stereo 1030!!! I verified > on my Denon and Ford CD-6. > > > > Hope this isn't temporary because they are running on an old transmitter. > Some email to them might be useful - www.wbz1030.com > > I heard it too! This is the letter I sent them this morning: > > To: Engineering > > WAY TO GO! > This morning I was listening to your Skywave signal in AM STEREO at my > location in Piedmont, SC > > With many AM stations letting their plants fall into disrepair, it is nice > to hear a radio station that not only keep it's plant in top-notch > condition, but UPGRADES to AM STEREO. Now if we could only get more AMAX > certified tuners on the market... > > I tuned in using a modified GE Superadio III with an external home- brew > CQUAM decoder board. Antenna used: Alpha-Delta "Sloper" Model DX- SWL > > Keep up the GREAT work! > > > I sure hope they keep that Stereo signal ON! Let's all FLOOD WBZ with > emails! > > Long live FREE RADIO! > Death to the NAB! > > Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ > Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From amfmdx@fastq.com Wed Nov 06 11:07:28 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Nov 2002 19:07:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 81502 invoked from network); 6 Nov 2002 19:07:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Nov 2002 19:07:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Nov 2002 19:07:27 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt (d19-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.51]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gA6J7PP54464; Wed, 6 Nov 2002 12:07:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <006a01c285c7$aa461160$bbd63fd1@kredding430cdt> To: Cc: "Rick Lewis" References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Outrageously priced Sony SRF-A100 on eBay Date: Wed, 6 Nov 2002 12:06:48 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla F**k that!!!!!! $550!!!!!!!! I want an A-100 real bad but not at $550. I am sure some fool will buy it but it won't be me. I will have to deal with my A-1 and its flaky switches before I do an A-100 at that price. Still looking at DI for one cheap. Kevin ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kevin T." To: Sent: Wednesday, November 06, 2002 10:17 AM Subject: {AMSF} Outrageously priced Sony SRF-A100 on eBay > I know these little gems are increasing in value, but $550 for a > Sony SRF-A100? > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=732390044 > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > From kevtronics@yahoo.com Wed Nov 06 11:07:57 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Nov 2002 19:07:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 82417 invoked from network); 6 Nov 2002 19:07:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Nov 2002 19:07:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.69) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Nov 2002 19:07:51 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.139] by n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Nov 2002 19:07:50 -0000 Date: Wed, 06 Nov 2002 19:07:49 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Breaking news from Boston Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 722 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Unfortunately, it seems what I speculated below was true - they > were running on an old transmitter. They were back in mono by late > afternoon/early evening. I believe 650 WSM in Nashville also has a back-up transmitter still set up to transmit in C-Quam AM Stereo. 1560 WQEW Radio Disney in NYC is also capable of transmitting in AM Stereo with full Stereo separation (as they were briefly caught doing a few months back), perhaps even from the main transmitter, but chooses to broadcast in mono. They're one of the best-sounding mono AM music stations in the area, but nevertheless we have Radio Disney in full Stereo in Los Angeles, Chicago, Denver, Dallas/Ft. Worth, and Fresno, CA, so why not in NYC? From michaelj@vcn.com Wed Nov 06 11:18:23 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Nov 2002 19:18:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 38177 invoked from network); 6 Nov 2002 19:18:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Nov 2002 19:18:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m1-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Nov 2002 19:18:21 -0000 Received: from michael (vcn77.usrtc-1.evan.wy.vcn.com [209.193.86.81]) by m1-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Wed, 6 Nov 2002 12:18:20 -0700 To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} Outrageously priced Sony SRF-A100 on eBay Date: Wed, 6 Nov 2002 12:17:27 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 In-Reply-To: <006a01c285c7$aa461160$bbd63fd1@kredding430cdt> Importance: Normal From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Me too Kevin!! Turns out that A1 that I got has some problems. Haven't tried to DX with it yet.....but looks like some of the pins coming off of the main multiplexer chip on the board are no longer connected to what they were supposed to be. Probably Coke or other soda spilt on it or something. Looks like the traces have been eaten away. It DOES work....although on the FM side it doesn't receive in stereo and the reception is pretty distorted. Meanwhile on the AM side it works and receives in stereo, but every few (like 50 or 60) khz, there's a whine or buzz that's pretty consistant. So yeah, it works...kinda. Haven't had much success trying to solder pins that are THAT small and close together. Dealing with the same problem right now on a Pioneer tuner that I'm converting to stereo......that is IF I hear from Chris that he'll send me another decoder. (hint hint...hello Chris?? Are you tuned in in stereo?? :) ) Anyone have any suggestions for soldering and dealing with such small pins that are so close together? Seems like every time I attempt, all I do is end up with a drop of solder that ties 2 or 3 pins together. YUK!! NOT easy to clean up! MJR n WYO -----Original Message----- From: Kevin - Mesa, Arizona [mailto:amfmdx@fastq.com] Sent: Wednesday, November 06, 2002 12:07 PM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Cc: Rick Lewis Subject: Re: {AMSF} Outrageously priced Sony SRF-A100 on eBay F**k that!!!!!! $550!!!!!!!! I want an A-100 real bad but not at $550. I am sure some fool will buy it but it won't be me. I will have to deal with my A-1 and its flaky switches before I do an A-100 at that price. Still looking at DI for one cheap. Kevin [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Nov 06 12:08:21 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Nov 2002 20:08:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 40088 invoked from network); 6 Nov 2002 20:08:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Nov 2002 20:08:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Nov 2002 20:08:19 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-89-184.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.184]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id gA6K8FjR028246 for ; Wed, 6 Nov 2002 14:08:17 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <00e801c0a91b$6efd9ea0$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: <003f01c284a6$f566fc80$0101a8c0@pavilion> Subject: Re: {AMSF} recent posts Date: Fri, 9 Mar 2001 22:34:42 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Any place on the web we can see some of your creations? Scott Todd ----- Original Message ----- From: "Christopher Cuff" > To everyone else- I am here... :-) This is my busiest time of the year, as I > am involved with making custom Christmas lighting (another hobby) so this is > consuming most of my time. > > Chris From jsgil@hal-pc.org Wed Nov 06 12:28:54 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Nov 2002 20:28:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 79404 invoked from network); 6 Nov 2002 20:28:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Nov 2002 20:28:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Nov 2002 20:28:53 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.168] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Nov 2002 20:28:53 -0000 Date: Wed, 06 Nov 2002 20:28:52 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Outrageously priced Sony SRF-A100 on eBay Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1194 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.219 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Michael J. Richard" wrote: > > Anyone have any suggestions for soldering and dealing with such small pins > that are so close together? Seems like every time I attempt, all I do is > end up with a drop of solder that ties 2 or 3 pins together. YUK!! NOT > easy to clean up! > I haven't worked with SMD but I know someone that designs and builds prototypes for his company and have talked to him about how to solder SMD. The wright way to do it is to remove the chip with a special desoldering iron that heats all the pins up at once. Clean up the circuit board area to remove excess solder. Using a lignted magnifier solder paste and paint brush paint the paste onto the individual traces. Place the chip on top of the paste. Using another special iron that blows extremely hot air direct it over the pins to melt the solder paste which solders it to the board. This method has very good results but you have to have special irons. One reason why I have yet to mess with SMD. Chris may have a better way to deal with a few loose pins without having to remove the whole chip since he used the SMD version of the MC13028 in his decoders. JSG From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Nov 06 12:40:06 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Nov 2002 20:40:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 74900 invoked from network); 6 Nov 2002 20:40:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Nov 2002 20:40:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Nov 2002 20:40:06 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-89-184.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.184]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id gA6Ke2jR007095 for ; Wed, 6 Nov 2002 14:40:03 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <014801c0a91f$dfb16880$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: <005a01c0a79a$fce45b00$d3a9fea9@me> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Thank you Date: Fri, 9 Mar 2001 23:06:29 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude You sure about that? I tried looking there and didn't see any. There were plenty of smaller ones for under the chassis of table radios. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Possum Hunter" > > BTW, I've got one of those RCA radios you described, and I need one of the > tall electrolytics for the top of the chassis. > > www.tubesandmore.com have NEW reproductions! > > Long live FREE RADIO! From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Nov 06 12:54:11 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Nov 2002 20:54:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 39753 invoked from network); 6 Nov 2002 20:54:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Nov 2002 20:54:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Nov 2002 20:54:10 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-89-184.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.184]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id gA6Ks6jR010976 for ; Wed, 6 Nov 2002 14:54:08 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <015e01c0a921$d70ad480$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: 1700 WI2XAM... Neal Newman? Date: Fri, 9 Mar 2001 23:20:34 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Had an Ampliphase RCA 50G transmitter when I worked at KSTP. Even without being perfectly adjusted it sounded great. The 5kW Ampliphase was a real dog, though. I worked with an engineer who was once CE at KFGO. He told me he never could get his 5k Ampliphase to run stereo, and that the happiest day of his life was when he was able to turn his off and go back to an older transmitter which could run stereo. According to him the older 50G could convert to stereo as it used a better feedback system than the later 5kW. As for monitoring your station at the studio site, I've got some old Belar RF amps that downconvert to an output of approx. 250kHz, if your monitor isn't that fussy about what what freq. it has to see. Has some tuned stages that would help filter out any adjacent channel interference. Would send you one just for the price of shipping. Scott Todd ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jim Shelden" > I remember working with an RCA "Ampliphase" design. Those rascals > could transmit out to 30Khz at full power. It was a bugger to keep > both RF chains phased correctly, But they sounded good when properly > tuned. > I also have a Gates BC-1H with the solid state audio board, that is > matched thru a broad-banded ATU. This old girl sounds excellent on- > air. Not in CQUAM yet, but maybe coming. > > BTW, anybody got any good sounding & simple designs for off-air > studio monitoring 3 or 4 miles from the tower? From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Nov 06 13:00:48 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Nov 2002 21:00:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 55417 invoked from network); 6 Nov 2002 21:00:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Nov 2002 21:00:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Nov 2002 21:00:46 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-89-184.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.184]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id gA6L0fjR012894 for ; Wed, 6 Nov 2002 15:00:44 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <016801c0a922$c30d8800$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A560797404570898@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} (unknown) Date: Fri, 9 Mar 2001 23:27:08 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Computer is back up and running, but who knows for how long. Looks like problems with the mother board. Anyway, I've been reading these exchanges, and I must say I'm glad you're with us, Charles. What you have to say may not be pleasant, but I was wondering if we'd gotten too inbred and might be unwittingly engaging in some self-defeating behaviors. Please put up with us a little longer, and maybe we'll make it worth your while and better for our cause. Even if you see our shortcomings as bigger than they really are, it's needful to have someone like yourself around so we don't get too full of ourselves. Scott Todd ----- Original Message ----- From: "Charles Penry" > > How does this type of exaggeration (lying) help promote analog AM Stereo? > From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Nov 06 13:05:04 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Nov 2002 21:05:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 72746 invoked from network); 6 Nov 2002 21:05:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Nov 2002 21:05:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Nov 2002 21:05:03 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-89-184.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.184]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id gA6L50jR014118 for ; Wed, 6 Nov 2002 15:05:01 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <017801c0a923$5c876320$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} the NAB Date: Fri, 9 Mar 2001 23:31:27 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude NAB is a broadcasters' lobby to the US congress. And I believe the Salem organization is a member, even though you're right- they don't always look out for the interests of the little guys. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ian Davidson" To: "amstereoforum" Cc: Sent: Saturday, November 02, 2002 7:22 PM Subject: {AMSF} the NAB > > Scott > > Are your stations members of the NAB? > > If so why? > From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Nov 06 13:09:07 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Nov 2002 21:09:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 16544 invoked from network); 6 Nov 2002 21:09:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Nov 2002 21:09:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Nov 2002 21:09:06 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-89-184.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.184]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id gA6L93jR015312 for ; Wed, 6 Nov 2002 15:09:04 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <018401c0a923$ed42c760$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: GE Superadio III Date: Fri, 9 Mar 2001 23:35:30 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude I don't either. I have an FM converter that I installed some extra resistors to cut down on the AFC action, since a strong station a couple channels away could often pull it off of a weaker station I wanted to hear. As for why it adds distortion, it could be there's a bit of oscillator modulation, and the AFC is correcting for it. Low bass often wreaks havoc on the transmitting end as the exciter AFC tries to correct for that as well. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kevin T." > I generally don't like AFC on FM anyway, and I hate radios that have > it stuck on all the time, giving a very "sloppy" and "grabby" tuning > dial. From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Nov 06 13:11:22 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Nov 2002 21:11:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 81707 invoked from network); 6 Nov 2002 21:11:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Nov 2002 21:11:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Nov 2002 21:11:21 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-89-184.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.184]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id gA6LBIjR015979 for ; Wed, 6 Nov 2002 15:11:20 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <018f01c0a924$3e0f97e0$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM stereo recordings Date: Fri, 9 Mar 2001 23:37:46 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Glad you found our new incarnation, Phil. Good to have you back. There are engineers on this list looking for AMS gear, so hopefully they'll chime in here or contact you directly. Scott Todd ----- Original Message ----- From: "yowzah_1999" > And as (very) unfortunately, I am out of the AM Stereo engineering > business with not even a signal to enjoy here in Naples, FL, I have > some surplus AM Stereo gear as well. From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Nov 06 13:19:06 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Nov 2002 21:19:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 1023 invoked from network); 6 Nov 2002 21:19:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Nov 2002 21:19:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Nov 2002 21:19:05 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-89-184.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.184]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id gA6LJ2jR018297 for ; Wed, 6 Nov 2002 15:19:03 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <01a501c0a925$528054c0$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} IBOC vs. AMAX Date: Fri, 9 Mar 2001 23:45:29 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Is that site down? I'm getting a "not found" message. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kevin T." To: Sent: Friday, November 01, 2002 3:10 AM Subject: {AMSF} IBOC vs. AMAX > Just by the count of "Re:'s" in a row, you can tell that the debate > over IBOC vs. AMAX AM Stereo has been very active on the New York > Radio Message Board: > > "Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: > Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Digital Radio Story in newsday" > > http://musicradio.computer.net/wwwboard/messages/182530.html > > This is the latest in a thread where Mike Erickson keeps promoting > AMAX and AM Stereo as the best choice for improving the AM band, and > Allan Sniffen (proprietor of the message board) keeps parroting the > IBOC industry hype and dismissing anything else as a failure. > > If you'd like to start from the beginning of the thread, it all began > here: > > http://musicradio.computer.net/wwwboard/messages/182222.html > > It would be great to have Mike here in the AM Stereo Forum (if he > isn't already!), but unfortunately his messages don't include an > e-mail link, and Allan has dismissed me as "Mr. AM Stereo" (a title > which I wear proudly!) and thus won't let me post messages to the > Board myself. > > I have to say that normally Allan is a great guy, and I agree with a > lot of what he says, but for some reason in this case he is heavily > biased in favor of IBOC and refuses to consider any alternatives, and > on this topic often he just doesn't know what he's talking about. > For example, it took about half of that thread above just for him to > understand that AMAX is an AM receiver quality standard, rather than > some special kind of signal that an AM station transmits. > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Nov 06 13:26:02 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Nov 2002 21:26:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 29400 invoked from network); 6 Nov 2002 21:26:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Nov 2002 21:26:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Nov 2002 21:26:02 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-89-184.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.184]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id gA6LPwjR020314 for ; Wed, 6 Nov 2002 15:25:59 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <01af01c0a926$4a8ed560$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: AM Stereo Exciter Date: Fri, 9 Mar 2001 23:52:25 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude I know the guy who's the high bidder now- he's a decent guy, but don't know if he's planning on using it on air or just for the collection. I'd suspect he's planning on using it since he's a consulting engineer but doesn't have a lot of money. (He's a little too nice and sometimes gets taken advantage of.) ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kevin T." To: Sent: Monday, November 04, 2002 9:48 AM Subject: {AMSF} Re: AM Stereo Exciter > > Not Sold by me: > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1394687538 > > 4 days left, now at 49.95. > > Note that the matching Motorola C-Quam modulation monitor is also on > eBay, by the same seller: > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1394685308 > > Current bid $50.00, 3 days left.... if this and the exciter are both > in good working condition, they would make a great pair for some > station to upgrade to Stereo! > > (My candidate for that would be the big 50 kW "Prime Time Radio" > 740 CHWO in Toronto.... they are a FANTASTIC station, with excellent > music and DJs... all they need is Stereo!) > > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Nov 06 13:28:19 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Nov 2002 21:28:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 91634 invoked from network); 6 Nov 2002 21:28:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Nov 2002 21:28:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Nov 2002 21:28:18 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-89-184.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.184]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id gA6LSFjR020921 for ; Wed, 6 Nov 2002 15:28:16 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <01b701c0a926$9c3d7a60$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Kenwood KT-880 Date: Fri, 9 Mar 2001 23:54:43 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude If you can get a schematic for it, I'll be happy to help you figure it out. Scott Todd ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mark Sundquist" Subject: {AMSF} Kenwood KT-880 > ..has anyone tried to convert > one of these...if so, how did it do? From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Nov 06 13:44:08 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Nov 2002 21:44:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 66014 invoked from network); 6 Nov 2002 21:44:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Nov 2002 21:44:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sts.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Nov 2002 21:44:05 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-89-184.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.184]) by sts.sherbtel.net (8.12.2/8.12.2) with SMTP id gA6Li2jR025655 for ; Wed, 6 Nov 2002 15:44:03 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <01be01c0a928$d073a640$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Help against Dr. Sniffen Date: Sat, 10 Mar 2001 00:10:29 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Can't find the thread. 11/29 isn't here yet, so I checked for 10/29. Was the thread removed, per chance? ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "wgliradio" To: Sent: Tuesday, October 29, 2002 8:21 PM Subject: {AMSF} Help against Dr. Sniffen > There is an anti-AM post on the New York Radio Message Board. Help > me fend off the good doctor who doesn't believe Am can sound good. > > http://www.musicradio77.com/wwwboard > > The thread started on 11/29 and is called > > Digital Radio Story in newsday > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > From kevtronics@yahoo.com Wed Nov 06 14:20:38 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Nov 2002 22:20:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 6502 invoked from network); 6 Nov 2002 22:20:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Nov 2002 22:20:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Nov 2002 22:20:36 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.162] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Nov 2002 22:20:36 -0000 Date: Wed, 06 Nov 2002 22:20:34 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Planned AM Stereo station in NJ needs help Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2351 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.72.130 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics I got this in e-mail...... From: carlvanorden@webtv.net (Carl Vanorden) Date: Wed, Nov 6, 2002, 3:38pm Subject: NJRM announcement Hi Everyone! The New Jersey Radio Museum has applied with the FCC to establish a low powered radio station in the Town of Dover, NJ. We applied for a non commercial, non profit AM stereo station on 1580 khz with a TIS- type powered station of 10 watts or less, and a tower not higher than 35 feet. We feel that this application will effectively cover the Town of Dover strongly without interfering with existing stations. The goal of the radio station will be to broadcast historic radio broadcasts, represent the museum and to advertise it's existance and to serve the Town of Dover. We intend to program music of the 70's...broadcast news when we can physically do so and to record and broadcast town activities. While the radio station, as planned is a worthwhile endeavor, we also need contributions to the cause, all of which are TAX DEDUCTIBLE. We will need a transmitter, AM stereo, frequency agile to 1580khz and we are looking to find a TIS-type tower..10-35 feet to errect in the parking lot. As always we seek audio equipment and NJ radio station memorialbilia such as airchecks, ads, print media...anything we can show to the viewing public. We also seek cash donations that are tax-deductible. The NJRM has recently aquired a large house in the Town of Dover, NJ to be our future home, so efforts are not a joke, but a reality! We seek your help in obtaining information or equipment in whole or in part...or any information that would be helpful in gaining contributions of any form to the museum. We also seek people willing to serve as executives on the NJRM board. Specifically, we need a treasurer, hopefully located near or in the town of Dover, and a collector of "odds and ends"..that is picture frames and the like to use for display. The New Jersey Radio Museum intends to have a space for every radio station operating in the state....AM, FM , college, and community. If you have any information that could help us to achieve our goal of opening our museum soon, please contact me. carlvanorden@webtv.net Feel free to circulate this email amongst your radio friends! Sincerely, Carl M. Van Orden NJRM Manager http://home.attbi.com/~davekruh/WRAN/ From groucho@skyweb.net Wed Nov 06 14:24:26 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Nov 2002 22:24:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 20803 invoked from network); 6 Nov 2002 22:24:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Nov 2002 22:24:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Nov 2002 22:24:25 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gA6MRCc0008416 for ; Wed, 6 Nov 2002 17:27:12 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DC9961F.266AE357@skyweb.net> Date: Wed, 06 Nov 2002 17:22:23 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Planned AM Stereo station in NJ needs help References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 I wish they didn't Do that.. Because I have retained a consultant. to try and License a station on 1580 For daytime Only at 500 watts.up in North jersey . this Bites me in the Butt... "Kevin T." wrote: > I got this in e-mail...... > > From: carlvanorden@webtv.net (Carl Vanorden) > Date: Wed, Nov 6, 2002, 3:38pm > Subject: NJRM announcement > > Hi Everyone! > > The New Jersey Radio Museum has applied with the FCC to establish a > low powered radio station in the Town of Dover, NJ. We applied for a > non commercial, non profit AM stereo station on 1580 khz with a TIS- > type powered station of 10 watts or less, and a tower not higher than > 35 feet. > > We feel that this application will effectively cover the Town of > Dover strongly without interfering with existing stations. The goal > of the radio station will be to broadcast historic radio broadcasts, > represent the museum and to advertise it's existance and to serve the > Town of Dover. > > We intend to program music of the 70's...broadcast news when we can > physically do so and to record and broadcast town activities. While > the radio station, as planned is a worthwhile endeavor, we also need > contributions to the cause, all of which are TAX DEDUCTIBLE. We will > need a transmitter, AM stereo, frequency agile to 1580khz and we are > looking to find a TIS-type tower..10-35 feet to errect in the parking > lot. > > As always we seek audio equipment and NJ radio station memorialbilia > such as airchecks, ads, print media...anything we can show to the > viewing public. > > We also seek cash donations that are tax-deductible. The NJRM has > recently aquired a large house in the Town of Dover, NJ to be our > future home, so efforts are not a joke, but a reality! We seek your > help in obtaining information or equipment in whole or in part...or > any information that would be helpful in gaining contributions of any > form to the museum. We also seek people willing to serve as > executives on the NJRM board. Specifically, we need a treasurer, > hopefully located near or in the town of Dover, and a collector of > "odds and ends"..that is picture frames and the like to use for > display. > > The New Jersey Radio Museum intends to have a space for every radio > station operating in the state....AM, FM , college, and community. If > you have any information that could help us to achieve our goal of > opening our museum soon, please contact me. > carlvanorden@webtv.net > > Feel free to circulate this email amongst your radio friends! > > Sincerely, > > Carl M. Van Orden > NJRM Manager > http://home.attbi.com/~davekruh/WRAN/ > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From kevtronics@yahoo.com Wed Nov 06 14:27:42 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Nov 2002 22:27:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 69706 invoked from network); 6 Nov 2002 22:27:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Nov 2002 22:27:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Nov 2002 22:27:41 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.172] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Nov 2002 22:27:41 -0000 Date: Wed, 06 Nov 2002 22:27:40 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Help against Dr. Sniffen Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <01be01c0a928$d073a640$d3a9fea9@me> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 520 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.72.130 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Can't find the thread. 11/29 isn't here yet, so I checked for > 10/29. Was the thread removed, per chance? The proprietor of the New York Radio Message Board, Allan Sniffen, has been known to "clean out" older threads, and the ones which contain strong arguments against him get removed especially quickly, sometimes even before they scroll off to the second page of messages. Allan seems to think IBOC will be the savior of AM radio, so thus this thread got tossed in the electronic circular file post-haste. From jsgil@hal-pc.org Wed Nov 06 14:42:52 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Nov 2002 22:42:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 56128 invoked from network); 6 Nov 2002 22:42:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Nov 2002 22:42:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Nov 2002 22:42:51 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.164] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Nov 2002 22:42:51 -0000 Date: Wed, 06 Nov 2002 22:42:50 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: AM Stereo Exciter Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <01af01c0a926$4a8ed560$d3a9fea9@me> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 901 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.71 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Scott Todd" wrote: > I know the guy who's the high bidder now- he's a decent guy, but don't know > if he's planning on using it on air or just for the collection. I'd suspect > he's planning on using it since he's a consulting engineer but doesn't have > a lot of money. (He's a little too nice and sometimes gets taken advantage > of.) > I an earlier message, (5182), someone said that it was hit by lighting. I wonder if he reads our list. I hope he knows what he's getting if that is the case. If the damage is not too bad and he has the skills to repair it still would not be that bad of a buy. It seems that the bidding stopped at $192, a day before mesage 5182 was posted so I guess the word has gotten around. I just wish messages like this are posted early in the sale so we could better track exciter sales on eBay and where they came from. JSG From alfredot@inetarena.com Wed Nov 06 14:54:32 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: alfredot@inetarena.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Nov 2002 22:54:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 95718 invoked from network); 6 Nov 2002 22:54:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Nov 2002 22:54:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.inetarena.com) (206.129.216.13) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Nov 2002 22:54:31 -0000 Received: from hendrie (1Cust25.tnt17.beaverton.or.da.uu.net [65.227.179.25]) by mail.inetarena.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id gA6MqmV00160 for ; Wed, 6 Nov 2002 14:52:48 -0800 (PST) Date: Wed, 6 Nov 2002 15:54:01 -0800 (PST) X-Sender: alfredo@hendrie.1610am.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Fw: Message from Customer Care... In-Reply-To: <1036474589.2489.17161.m15@yahoogroups.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: "Alfredo E. Torrejon" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=25132238 X-Yahoo-Profile: alfredotorrejon > Kevin, > AM stereo is very rare and done with more than one format, so we never chose to support it. > > Chuck Hinton of McIntosh Tech Support > > > "McIntosh Support" > 11/03/02 12:28 PM > Please respond to customercare About 6 years ago, one of my friends did a summer internship with McIntosh Labs. He asked them why they didn't offer AM Stereo in their tuners. If I remember correctly, the answer that he got was that by the time that C-QUAM became the legal standard, there wasn't enough interest and/or that there weren't enough stations broadcasting stereo to warrant the expense of designing a tuner with AM Stereo. I will ask my friend to clarify why McIntosh was anti-AM Stereo. Alfredo From ccuff@in4web.com Wed Nov 06 15:01:16 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Nov 2002 23:01:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 99027 invoked from network); 6 Nov 2002 23:01:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Nov 2002 23:01:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Nov 2002 23:01:16 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.72]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Wed, 6 Nov 2002 18:00:22 -0500 Message-ID: <000501c285e8$335c7780$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: Subject: That Aiwa UK unit Date: Wed, 6 Nov 2002 17:59:44 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 That item does NOT have am stereo- it is a word for word description from the Aiwa Japan website. Now, it "might" be a Japan domestic model- but it is highly unlikely. CC From n0uiheric@aol.com Wed Nov 06 15:11:31 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Nov 2002 23:11:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 80745 invoked from network); 6 Nov 2002 23:11:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Nov 2002 23:11:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m05.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.8) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Nov 2002 23:11:29 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-m05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.18.27ece7a7 (4402) for ; Wed, 6 Nov 2002 18:11:17 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <18.27ece7a7.2afafb95@aol.com> Date: Wed, 6 Nov 2002 18:11:17 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Help against Dr. Sniffen To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih IBOC will NOT be the savior of AM or FM radio. It will be the DEATH of radio. BTW, I think it's time for the FCC to dump Powell. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Wed Nov 06 15:11:35 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Nov 2002 23:11:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 82193 invoked from network); 6 Nov 2002 23:11:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Nov 2002 23:11:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m07.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.162) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Nov 2002 23:11:35 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-m07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.40.26d36411 (4402) for ; Wed, 6 Nov 2002 18:11:19 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <40.26d36411.2afafb97@aol.com> Date: Wed, 6 Nov 2002 18:11:19 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Breaking news from Boston To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih Radio Disney has ALWAYS been in mono in St. Louis; guess ABC is too cheap to convert their St. Louis station (WSDZ 1260) to AM Stereo. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Wed Nov 06 15:11:45 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Nov 2002 23:11:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 73693 invoked from network); 6 Nov 2002 23:11:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Nov 2002 23:11:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m06.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.161) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Nov 2002 23:11:44 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-m06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.10f.19acdc93 (4402) for ; Wed, 6 Nov 2002 18:11:18 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <10f.19acdc93.2afafb96@aol.com> Date: Wed, 6 Nov 2002 18:11:18 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} the NAB To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih The NAB NEVER LOOKS OUT FOR THE LITTLE GUY, Scott. If I owned a radio station, I would join the National Federation of Community Broadcasters (NFCB) instead. While mostly non-commercial FM stations are in the organization, I wonder if they would welcome a community-oriented commercial AM station. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From penry@nortelnetworks.com Wed Nov 06 16:16:30 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: penry@nortelnetworks.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Nov 2002 00:16:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 11566 invoked from network); 7 Nov 2002 00:16:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Nov 2002 00:16:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com) (47.103.122.112) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Nov 2002 00:16:29 -0000 Received: from zrc2c011.us.nortel.com (zrc2c011.us.nortel.com [47.103.120.51]) by zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id gA70Geu08456 for ; Wed, 6 Nov 2002 18:16:40 -0600 (CST) Received: by zrc2c011.us.nortel.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Wed, 6 Nov 2002 18:16:27 -0600 Message-ID: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A5607974046278B2@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: {AMSF} Re: Fw: Message from Customer Care... Date: Wed, 6 Nov 2002 18:16:25 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) From: "Charles Penry" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=376233 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa5vhu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Alfredo, How much clarification do you need? Was McIntosh anti-AM Stereo or were they just not being pro-AM Stereo? I think that every receiver manufacturer was/is (by your standards) anti-AM Stereo. Ok, Sony and a few others made/make very few models that had/have AM Stereo. When you compare the list of radios that had/have AM Stereo to the list of all radios made during the same time period, I think you might see what I am talking about. All receiver manufacturers were/are (by your standards) anti-AM Stereo! I don't consider that one, two or three models out of hundreds of models that a particular manufacturer has made makes them pro-AM Stereo so they must be anti-AM Stereo! Was McIntosh being anti-AM Stereo or perhaps just pro-business? Other than the members on this list, myself included, how many people would have spent the extra money - at that time, or even now - on McIntosh receivers and tuners with AM Stereo? Or, to look at it from a business standpoint, how much more money would the inclusion of AM Stereo make for McIntosh? Or, how much money would McIntosh loose if they didn't include AM Stereo? They, along with most other manufacturers, apparently thought that it was not enough money to mess with. "Look here folks, the latest McIntosh plastic boom box featuring flashing Hot Pink and Cool Purple neon lights that pretends to pulsate with the music, all under a translucent cover! With 932 watts of tone-deafening ear splitting power feeding beryllium plastic speakers including seventeen 1" tweeters, twenty-two 47" sub-woofers and one 4" midrange (with a defeat switch, for that natural sound). Holds up to 2,474 of your favorite CD's and the semi-automatic changer will play MP3, JPG, MP4, MPH and regular CD's. With inputs for TV surround sound, computer sound, or any line level input. Has headphone jack and comes with an incredibly sexy cream-colored pair of cheap breakable under the chin headphones. On sale this week for only $349.95. With AM Stereo, where available, for only $379.95." Now, if this typical boom box were actually available today, how many people would spend an extra $30.00 for AM Stereo? That's only 8% more! My 16 year old son just bought a boom box not too unlike the one described above. He really did! I went to the store with him and after he decided on one, mostly based on looks, and finished playing with it, I tried the AM band to see how it sounded, which was typically crappy. He rolled his eyes and asked me why I was bothering with AM. And folks, he is the typical buyer, not us! If you don't believe me, go spend some time in your local electronics store and watch the people buying radios. They rarely try AM. We have been down this road before. Every time someone asks "why didn't AM Stereo catch on"? Actually it was a plot by receiver manufacturers in the mid-eighties. They decided that they could make much more money by waiting and charging 500% more for IBOC receivers than the 8% more that CQUAM receivers would have cost, so they did not make AM Stereo receivers. Sony and a few others were slow learners. And Alfredo, the real answer is - well McIntosh answered it. See below. -----Original Message----- From: Alfredo E. Torrejon [mailto:alfredot@inetarena.com] Sent: Wednesday, November 06, 2002 5:54 PM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: Fw: Message from Customer Care... > Kevin, > AM stereo is very rare and done with more than one format, so we never chose to support it. > > Chuck Hinton of McIntosh Tech Support > > > "McIntosh Support" > 11/03/02 12:28 PM > Please respond to customercare About 6 years ago, one of my friends did a summer internship with McIntosh Labs. He asked them why they didn't offer AM Stereo in their tuners. If I remember correctly, the answer that he got was that by the time that C-QUAM became the legal standard, there wasn't enough interest and/or that there weren't enough stations broadcasting stereo to warrant the expense of designing a tuner with AM Stereo. I will ask my friend to clarify why McIntosh was anti-AM Stereo. Alfredo [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From penry@nortelnetworks.com Wed Nov 06 16:28:28 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: penry@nortelnetworks.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Nov 2002 00:28:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 2576 invoked from network); 7 Nov 2002 00:28:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Nov 2002 00:28:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com) (47.103.122.112) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Nov 2002 00:28:26 -0000 Received: from zrc2c011.us.nortel.com (zrc2c011.us.nortel.com [47.103.120.51]) by zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id gA70Scu09035 for ; Wed, 6 Nov 2002 18:28:38 -0600 (CST) Received: by zrc2c011.us.nortel.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Wed, 6 Nov 2002 18:28:25 -0600 Message-ID: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A5607974046278C1@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: {AMSF} Re: Help against Dr. Sniffen Date: Wed, 6 Nov 2002 18:28:24 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) From: "Charles Penry" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=376233 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa5vhu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Eric, Sorry, the elections were yesterday. It looks like you lost. 73 and greater DX from Charles Tag line one Tag line two Tag line three Tag line four Tag line five Tag line six Tag line seven "For the money of love is the evil of all root"-1 Timothy Leary 7:35 PM -----Original Message----- From: n0uiheric@aol.com [mailto:n0uiheric@aol.com] Sent: Wednesday, November 06, 2002 5:11 PM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Help against Dr. Sniffen IBOC will NOT be the savior of AM or FM radio. It will be the DEATH of radio. BTW, I think it's time for the FCC to dump Powell. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From mark_608@hotmail.com Wed Nov 06 19:53:26 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: mark_608@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Nov 2002 03:53:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 91666 invoked from network); 7 Nov 2002 03:53:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Nov 2002 03:53:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.17.96) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Nov 2002 03:53:24 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 6 Nov 2002 19:53:24 -0800 Received: from 68.43.173.249 by lw11fd.law11.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Thu, 07 Nov 2002 03:53:24 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Kenwood KT-880 Date: Wed, 06 Nov 2002 22:53:24 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 07 Nov 2002 03:53:24.0529 (UTC) FILETIME=[38CC8A10:01C28611] From: "Mark Sundquist" X-Originating-IP: [68.43.173.249] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=3850332 X-Yahoo-Profile: mark_608 Thank you ,Scott...I will get to work finding a schematic for this thing.. Mark >From: "Scott Todd" >Reply-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com >To: >Subject: Re: {AMSF} Kenwood KT-880 >Date: Fri, 9 Mar 2001 23:54:43 -0600 > >If you can get a schematic for it, I'll be happy to help you figure it out. > >Scott Todd > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Mark Sundquist" > >Subject: {AMSF} Kenwood KT-880 > > > > >..has anyone tried to convert > > one of these...if so, how did it do? > > _________________________________________________________________ The new MSN 8: advanced junk mail protection and 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail From rjskadl@yahoo.com Wed Nov 06 20:25:49 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: rjskadl@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Nov 2002 04:25:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 44366 invoked from network); 7 Nov 2002 04:25:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Nov 2002 04:25:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.86) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Nov 2002 04:25:49 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.180] by n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 07 Nov 2002 04:25:49 -0000 Date: Thu, 07 Nov 2002 04:25:47 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 5402 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "rjskadl" X-Originating-IP: 24.186.98.159 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=29619919 X-Yahoo-Profile: rjskadl Just some random comments and thoughts from Russ about things being discussed here. Kevin T.: Mike Erickson is an active member of this board. Fear not! Neal: I don't see how the NJ Radio museum thinks they are going to put a 40 Watt AM Station on the air. The FCC just doesn't allow such things. Perhaps under a Special Temporary Authority, but nothing permanent. They can consider Carrier Current or Part 15, but that will not do the coverage they want. TIS is also out of the question for them, because TIS is just that, Traveler's Information. TIS stations are not allowed to broadcast music or anything at all entertaining. You have a much better chance getting a legitimate 250 watt minimum station on the air then they do their 40 watt job. Neal: It was indeed WNYG that I want to get an AM Stereo card for. I spoke to the CE at WNYG and he was under the impression that there was no original stereo card in the BE, but was able to convince him that there indeed had been at one point. He wants to try to track it down, because we believe that Harrold must have taken it for some reason. The point of all this gibberish is that we may well take you up on your offer to pick it up for us if he is able to track it down. As for Dr. Sniffen: All I can Say is "Resistence is Futile." You can't argue with the man. But it sure is fun to get him going. HD RADIO: Some people seem a bit confused with the real parameters of IBOC: REGULATORY: IBOC has been approved on an interim basis. Interim is the Key word here. (WOR is not testing, they are doing it for real.) The FCC hasn't yet decided to make IBOC a permanent fixture. The FCC hasn't ruled out creating new spectrum for pure digital down the line. The FCC has no plan to completely phase out Analog broadcasts at this time. (There is no plan to go all digital on the AM and FM band at this time.) They have also declared that it is completely up to the broadcasters whether or not they want to go digital or not. The FCC still sees AM Stereo as a Viable format, so AM stations if they so chose can remain completely analog and continue to use C-Quam. Stations However can not choose to do both IBOC and C-Quam at the same time. Expanded Band Stations 1610-1700 (duh) are allowed to drop their AM Stereo obligations if and only if they are upgrading to IBOC. ][ TECHNICAL STUFF: The IBOC Sidebands do fit into the NRSC Mask. Now as many people have pointed out the sidebands will produce much more noise, even within the mask, than regular audio would. Some people are confused by the actual bandwidth of IBOC. The analog Portion takes up roughly 5k bandwidth. Kevin T's graphs have demonstrated that, as did my own graphs that I produced right from the sound clips on the WOR engineering page. There is a bit of a silent trough from 5k to 10k. At 10k you can see the graph jump up a bit where it plateus and then drops off at about 15K. I think where people got confused is because of the fact that you can hear the digital sidebands on 730 and 690 from WOR. The actual sidebands are where they do belong. I am not saying that they aren't causing problems, they are, but they do happen to be where they are supposed to be. MORE TECHNICAL: Unlike the DRM system which would use the MPEG4 codec, IBOC is going to use some rediculous proprietary algorithm. This sucks because of Ibiquity's ability to slap on a licensing fee for the codec. What sucks even worse is that Ibiquity can choose to be the sole company to improve on their codec, so I expect improvement will be slow. If they had used MPEG4 (like DRM) we would see much more rapid codec improvement because it is an open source technology. Don't expect too many codec updates from Ibiquity real soon either. We were giving them some real great Ideas at the IBOC RoadShow, Like Quadrophonic sound for example, and they said, "well maybe down the road, but there is no real plan nor any real way to do that now." I got the impression that development is over, at least for now, and that the big push is on to sell units. The codec they use employs perceptual audio coding. what that does is it creates artificial highs. Satellite radio actually does the same thing. The way it works is that there isn't enough bandwidth to have a full 15k audio signal, so the codec actually takes the audio from the upper midrange and lower treble(for argument's sake, lets say 4k to 8k) Pitches it up an octave (making 4k-8k into 8k-16k) and injects it on top of the existing audio. This is what gives it that weird sound on the upper end which is especially noticable with AM IBOC in Stereo Mode. And Yes, we heard the samples right from Ibiquity. OK Enough for now. I agree and believe that the best thing we can do about IBOC is sit back and laugh, and do our best to keep Analog AM Stereo on the air, and continue to help people find radios and make them aware that AM stereo exists. Being too anti IBOC isn't going to help. It is fun to get the Dentist PO'd though. I expect to hear about us again in his weekly reflections. One other thing. I got my REGULATORY information right from the FCC website. They did mention our efforts in the commenting window. They made us sound foolish, all 35 of us, but did nonetheless acknowledge our existance. -Russ From amfmdx@fastq.com Wed Nov 06 22:32:41 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Nov 2002 06:32:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 3142 invoked from network); 7 Nov 2002 06:32:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Nov 2002 06:32:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Nov 2002 06:32:40 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt (d101-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.133]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gA76WcP79960 for ; Wed, 6 Nov 2002 23:32:38 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <008a01c28627$64730020$85f9bed8@kredding430cdt> To: References: <005a01c0a79a$fce45b00$d3a9fea9@me> <014801c0a91f$dfb16880$d3a9fea9@me> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Thank you Date: Wed, 6 Nov 2002 23:32:03 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla They have them. I have bought them there. Check closer. Its in the 2003 catalog. Kevin ----- Original Message ----- From: "Scott Todd" To: Sent: Friday, March 09, 2001 10:06 PM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Thank you > You sure about that? I tried looking there and didn't see any. There were > plenty of smaller ones for under the chassis of table radios. > > ST > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Possum Hunter" > > > BTW, I've got one of those RCA radios you described, and I need one of > the > > tall electrolytics for the top of the chassis. > > > > www.tubesandmore.com have NEW reproductions! > > > > Long live FREE RADIO! > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > From kevtronics@yahoo.com Wed Nov 06 23:51:00 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Nov 2002 07:50:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 98799 invoked from network); 7 Nov 2002 07:50:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Nov 2002 07:50:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Nov 2002 07:50:58 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.158] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 07 Nov 2002 07:50:58 -0000 Date: Thu, 07 Nov 2002 07:50:54 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: FCC ruling on IBOC Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 686 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.72.130 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > One other thing. I got my REGULATORY information right from the > FCC website. They did mention our efforts in the commenting > window. They made us sound foolish, all 35 of us, but did > nonetheless acknowledge our existance. Here is the document that Russ is referring to: http://hraunfoss.fcc.gov/edocs_public/attachmatch/FCC-02-286A1.pdf A poorly-formatted plain text version is also available for those who don't have an Acrobat PDF reader: http://hraunfoss.fcc.gov/edocs_public/attachmatch/FCC-02-286A1.txt It includes a list of all the people and companies who submitted comments to the FCC about IBOC; on page 25 there are quite a few from this Forum on the list. From rjskadl@yahoo.com Thu Nov 07 07:28:14 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: rjskadl@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Nov 2002 15:28:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 75791 invoked from network); 7 Nov 2002 15:28:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Nov 2002 15:28:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Nov 2002 15:28:12 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.180] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 07 Nov 2002 15:28:07 -0000 Date: Thu, 07 Nov 2002 15:28:07 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: FCC ruling on IBOC Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 907 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "rjskadl" X-Originating-IP: 129.49.152.110 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=29619919 X-Yahoo-Profile: rjskadl > > Here is the document that Russ is referring to: > > http://hraunfoss.fcc.gov/edocs_public/attachmatch/FCC-02-286A 1.pdf > Thanks Kevin. There is one point that I forgot to touch upon that I think will be of interest here. The discussion came up about whether or not stations with critical hours restrictions would be able to use IBOC during critical hours. I did not find anything about critical hours, but it does state that Stations with PSRAs and PSSAs can transmit IBOC during these times. Therefore I wouild assume that if ITis OK for PRe Sunrise and Post Sunset Authorizations, that it is probably OK for Critical hours as well. The PSRA and PSSA rule is a sure thing. Don't hold me to the critical hours though. I would imagine it is OK though, just because of the fact that it is ok for the PSSA and PSRA times, and also that Critical hours occur during Daytime Hours. From amfmdx@fastq.com Thu Nov 07 07:44:36 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Nov 2002 15:44:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 12635 invoked from network); 7 Nov 2002 15:44:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Nov 2002 15:44:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Nov 2002 15:44:36 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt ([207.173.147.250]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gA7FiZP86425 for ; Thu, 7 Nov 2002 08:44:35 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <018301c28674$7faf04e0$85f9bed8@kredding430cdt> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: FCC ruling on IBOC Date: Thu, 7 Nov 2002 08:44:01 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > It includes a list of all the people and companies who submitted > comments to the FCC about IBOC; on page 25 there are quite a few from > this Forum on the list. I begged like a dog to get people who were interested in radio and DXing to comment. A number did but what amazed me was that so FEW commented and now as always they are bitching. I have NO sympathy for those who didn't comment. We will all get hammered because of them. Too bad. For those who commented, thank you for doing your part. *I* appreciate it if no one else does. You all are heroes in my book. Kevin Mesa, Arizona From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Nov 07 08:05:00 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Nov 2002 16:04:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 81418 invoked from network); 7 Nov 2002 16:04:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Nov 2002 16:04:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Nov 2002 16:04:59 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.187] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 07 Nov 2002 16:04:54 -0000 Date: Thu, 07 Nov 2002 16:04:53 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Panasonic CQ-VAD7200U Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 392 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics This is listed as having "AM stereo radio" as well as "FM stereo radio". Other auctions of this model (by different sellers) use this same wording, so it appears to be written that way in Panasonic's own specifications for it. And for nearly $1500 for a glorified car radio, I would HOPE it would at least have AM Stereo! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1394527244 From penry@nortelnetworks.com Thu Nov 07 09:20:24 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: penry@nortelnetworks.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Nov 2002 17:20:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 84789 invoked from network); 7 Nov 2002 17:20:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Nov 2002 17:20:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com) (47.103.122.112) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Nov 2002 17:20:21 -0000 Received: from zrc2c011.us.nortel.com (zrc2c011.us.nortel.com [47.103.120.51]) by zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id gA7HKXj17267 for ; Thu, 7 Nov 2002 11:20:34 -0600 (CST) Received: by zrc2c011.us.nortel.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Thu, 7 Nov 2002 11:20:21 -0600 Message-ID: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A560797404627E33@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: DAB at Radio Shack Date: Thu, 7 Nov 2002 11:20:19 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) From: "Charles Penry" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=376233 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa5vhu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Digital radio arrives at Canadian Radio Shacks. Radio Shack to carry a full range of DAB receivers. On November 4th, RadioShack Canada Ltd. will become the first major retail chain in Canada to carry a full line of DAB (Digital Audio Broadcasting) products for the home and portable markets. 250 stores across the country will feature DAB units. Planned products include boomboxes, personal portable units, clock radios, home receivers and DAB computer attachments. Available immediately are the Perstel DR101 and the DR201 (FM/DAB/MP3 with 64 meg of internal memory) priced at $299(Cdn.) and $399 (Cdn.) respectively. Coming very soon is the DAB PCI card from Modular Tech. After that look for a clock radio and a very attractively priced home receiver. A 10 minute DAB demonstration DVD recently produced by DRRI will be on display in RadioStores across the country in addition to Battery Plus stores, a chain which was recently purchased by RadioShack's parent company. In all, 550 stores will receive the DVD's and along with brochures and information kits. Lastly, consumers will be treated to a travelling DAB demonstration show (put on by DRRI) which will be put on at high traffic malls in Toronto, Vancouver, Montreal and Windsor. RadioShack has committed to full support as additional markets begin broadcasting in DAB. This latest development is the culmination of discussions between RadioShack Canada and Digital Radio Roll-Out Inc. (DRRI) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From penry@nortelnetworks.com Thu Nov 07 09:26:55 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: penry@nortelnetworks.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Nov 2002 17:26:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 98057 invoked from network); 7 Nov 2002 17:26:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Nov 2002 17:26:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com) (47.103.122.112) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Nov 2002 17:26:54 -0000 Received: from zrc2c011.us.nortel.com (zrc2c011.us.nortel.com [47.103.120.51]) by zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id gA7HR6j18393 for ; Thu, 7 Nov 2002 11:27:06 -0600 (CST) Received: by zrc2c011.us.nortel.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Thu, 7 Nov 2002 11:26:52 -0600 Message-ID: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A560797404627E4F@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: AMS Questions Date: Thu, 7 Nov 2002 11:26:51 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) From: "Charles Penry" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=376233 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa5vhu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Questions. I woke up this morning, has anyone else done this? Any opinions or suggestions would be great. I went to work, does anyone else do this? I am new to the whole thing and suggestions would be great. I tried to start the car, do I need keys for this? Has anyone tried anything other than the car key? Does it work? I am a newbie to driving so I didn't bother to read the manual or anything just thought I would ask here. It was bright during the morning time today, did anyone else notice that? It seems weird that it happens everyday. Can I use a filter to make it look dark? And if it is dark would I have a hard time focusing my eyes? Should I try it first or maybe ask someone or use the search on my computer? But that would bring a whole other bunch of questions. What life do you use, how does it work, have you tried any others? I might have narrowed my choice to three different lives but I am hanging on till somone else makes up my mind on which to choose. Should I ask you to help me? Has anyone had a good/bad experience with this? Should I format my meal before microwaving it? Or throw the whole thing in at one time? Should I even use a microwave? Any suggestions on a good microwave or where they might host one for me to use? I think that is all the questions I have right now, should I have more? If so what ones would be good, any thoughts? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From philipr@irac.pe.ca Thu Nov 07 10:10:38 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Nov 2002 18:10:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 99917 invoked from network); 7 Nov 2002 18:10:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Nov 2002 18:10:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.70) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Nov 2002 18:10:36 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.136] by n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 07 Nov 2002 18:10:35 -0000 Date: Thu, 07 Nov 2002 18:10:32 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: DAB at Radio Shack Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A560797404627E33@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2951 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking I just checked radioshack.ca - while RS is not making a big deal about it, at least on their home page, type in DAB into "search" and out pops 2 units they now carry - presumably only in areas where DAB is on the air. For $299 CDN, you get a nice little FM/DAB pocket radio, with earphones and a sizable info LCD display - for song titles and other such info. For $100 CDN extra you get an MP3 player too. I suspect that I could order one, but as I live in FM land, I'd have to travel to Montreal as the nearest area where DAB is broadcast. What will be interesting to see is how long it takes for DAB to come to HRM (Halifax). C100, Q104, CHFX [not to be confused with CJFX], Sun FM etc. can get kind of messy in the downtown core, so DAB would likely be of benefit in the 'Little Big City' [my term for HRM]. Here in Charlottetown, local FM and even FM from Truro NS [40 air miles away] is virtually flawless, so it would be tougher to demonstrate signal enhancement. I've said it before, and I'll say it again, I'm all for Eureka 147 DAB as part of the Canadian radio broadcasting mix. Just keep FM [with its medium range reach potential] and AM [with its long range potential] available for service in areas where DAB is not feasible. Phil R. --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Charles Penry" wrote: > Digital radio arrives at Canadian Radio Shacks. > > > Radio Shack to carry a full range of DAB receivers. > > On November 4th, RadioShack Canada Ltd. will become the first major > retail chain in Canada to carry a full line of DAB (Digital Audio > Broadcasting) products for the home and portable markets. 250 stores > across the country will feature DAB units. Planned products include > boomboxes, personal portable units, clock radios, home receivers and > DAB computer attachments. Available immediately are the Perstel DR101 > and the DR201 (FM/DAB/MP3 with 64 meg of internal memory) priced at > $299(Cdn.) and $399 (Cdn.) respectively. Coming very soon is the DAB > PCI card from Modular Tech. After that look for a clock radio and a > very attractively priced home receiver. A 10 minute DAB demonstration > DVD recently produced by DRRI will be on display in RadioStores > across the country in addition to Battery Plus stores, a chain which > was recently purchased by RadioShack's parent company. In all, 550 > stores will receive the DVD's and along with brochures and > information kits. Lastly, consumers will be treated to a travelling > DAB demonstration show (put on by DRRI) which will be put on at high > traffic malls in Toronto, Vancouver, Montreal and Windsor. RadioShack > has committed to full support as additional markets begin > broadcasting in DAB. This latest development is the culmination of > discussions between RadioShack Canada and Digital Radio Roll-Out Inc. > (DRRI) > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Nov 07 11:03:56 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Nov 2002 19:03:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 41271 invoked from network); 7 Nov 2002 19:03:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Nov 2002 19:03:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Nov 2002 19:03:55 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.140] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 07 Nov 2002 19:03:49 -0000 Date: Thu, 07 Nov 2002 19:03:48 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: DAB at Radio Shack Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2290 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > I've said it before, and I'll say it again, I'm all for Eureka 147 > DAB as part of the Canadian radio broadcasting mix. Just keep FM > [with its medium range reach potential] and AM [with its long range > potential] available for service in areas where DAB is not feasible. The usefulness of DAB (Eureka 147) will be limited in North America because of its use of the "L-band", up in the high UHF frequency range. This limits coverage even moreso than UHF TV, requiring high power levels and delivering no better than strictly line-of-sight reception. Anything outside of urban areas will require numerous repeater towers, just like mobile phones. DAB in Europe uses the VHF frequency range, which was vacated in the 1980s when PAL color TV had established itself in the UHF band and the VHF TV band (used for 405-line B&W TV in the UK, and 819-line B&W TV in France) was finally shut down. This gives coverage similar to (although not quite as good as) regular FM radio. MP2 encoding is used, which is rather out-of-date and gives marginal results at the typical 128 kbps, but sounds good at 160 kbps and very nice at 192 kbps. One question is if DAB takes off in Canada and becomes successful, will that lead to the shut-down of all Canadian AM stations? I can imagine a scenario where all of the prominent FM stations move up to DAB, while the AM stations complete their move to FM. Nevermind the fact of the huge loss of coverage area, with people away from the big cities basically getting no local radio at all; I guess that's what satellite radio would be for, if XM or Sirius ever comes to Canada! p.s. Speaking of VHF TV in the UK, there were still half a million viewers of the 405-line black & white VHF TV service in 1980 when the phase-out began, but when it was finally shut down for good in 1985, the BBC claimed it only got 12 complaints. The shutdown also took with it the world's oldest working TV transmitter, broadcasting continually from 1949 to 1982. (Well, on 9/11/01, WCBS-TV in NYC fired up a 35-year-old Harris transmitter on the Empire State Building and then made use of Harris' last pair of tubes in stock to keep it running, but it had not been used as a main transmitter for many years since the WTC was built.) From jsgil@hal-pc.org Thu Nov 07 13:10:42 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Nov 2002 21:10:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 99016 invoked from network); 7 Nov 2002 21:10:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Nov 2002 21:10:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Nov 2002 21:10:40 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.190] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 07 Nov 2002 21:10:40 -0000 Date: Thu, 07 Nov 2002 21:10:38 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 2241 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.221 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@y..., "rjskadl" wrote: [ TECHNICAL STUFF: The IBOC Sidebands=20 > do fit into the NRSC Mask. Now as many people have pointed out the=20 > sidebands will produce much more noise, even within the mask, than=20 > regular audio would. Some people are confused by the actual=20 > bandwidth of IBOC. The analog Portion takes up roughly 5k=20 > bandwidth. Kevin T's graphs have demonstrated that, as did my own=20 > graphs that I produced right from the sound clips on the WOR=20 > engineering page. There is a bit of a silent trough from 5k to 10k.=20=20 > At 10k you can see the graph jump up a bit where it plateus and then=20 > drops off at about 15K. I think where people got confused is because=20 > of the fact that you can hear the digital sidebands on 730 and 690=20 > from WOR. The actual sidebands are where they do belong. I am not=20 > saying that they aren't causing problems, they are, but they do=20 > happen to be where they are supposed to be.=20=20 From both graphs posted by Kevin it definitely shows a portion of the IBOC sidebands in the 10-15KHz range. The Sony radio that these were taken from has a =B112.5KHz ceramic filter I think and the radio probably has some additional eq. circuits that helps flatten it out to 15KHz. Whether or not the IBOC sidebands that are above 10KHz are weak enough to be within the NRSC mask I don't know. The point is that the IBOC sidebands in the 10-15KHz range contain additional data and is not just harmonics from modulations below 10KHz. This shows that IBOC needs a full 30KHz bandwidth for its signal unlike analog AM that contains its full modulated spectrum within =B110.2KHz with only=20 harmonic by products from transmitter equipment non linearity or C-QuAM sidebands above 10.2KHz. So it is somewhat misleading to say that it fits within the NRSC mask when most people think of the=20 mask as representing the =B110.2KHz bandwidth of analog AM. As Kevin pointer out earlier that analog stations can brodcast above 10.2KHz just as long as these sidebands are 35-40db below the regular=20 sidebands. For proponents of IBOC the say it fits within the NRSC=20 mask is not telling the full story in that all relevent information is not within the =B110.2KHz bandwidth. JSG From amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk Thu Nov 07 14:13:11 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Nov 2002 22:13:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 6369 invoked from network); 7 Nov 2002 22:13:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Nov 2002 22:13:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Nov 2002 22:13:10 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.131] by n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 07 Nov 2002 22:13:10 -0000 Date: Thu, 07 Nov 2002 22:13:08 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: That Aiwa UK unit Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <000501c285e8$335c7780$0101a8c0@pavilion> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 318 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Dave" X-Originating-IP: 217.148.40.116 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113985069 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereofan --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Christopher Cuff" wrote: > That item does NOT have am stereo- it is a word for word description from > the Aiwa Japan website. Now, it "might" be a Japan domestic model- but it is > highly unlikely. > CC I've asked the guy to tune into 864khz France Bleu, you never know... From dav259@csiro.au Thu Nov 07 14:25:00 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Nov 2002 22:25:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 23421 invoked from network); 7 Nov 2002 22:25:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Nov 2002 22:25:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Nov 2002 22:24:59 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA7MOwP23627; Fri, 8 Nov 2002 09:24:58 +1100 (EST) Date: Fri, 8 Nov 2002 09:24:58 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: amstereoforum Cc: Subject: Scott - offline Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public Scott Todd's PC is out for repairs again. He hopes to be back in a day or two, but no guarantees. Anyone waiting for a message from him will have to wait a little longer. From michaelj@vcn.com Thu Nov 07 16:01:45 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Nov 2002 00:01:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 80335 invoked from network); 8 Nov 2002 00:01:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Nov 2002 00:01:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m1-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Nov 2002 00:01:44 -0000 Received: from michael (vcn84.usrtc-1.evan.wy.vcn.com [209.193.86.88]) by m1-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Thu, 7 Nov 2002 17:01:43 -0700 To: Subject: conversion questions Date: Thu, 7 Nov 2002 17:01:39 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) In-Reply-To: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Importance: Normal From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I have a few questions concerning conversions. I've tried this before and don't get too many answers :( But I'll try again. First off....if you have a combo AM/FM tuner chip such as the LA1836 then how do you kill the AM audio coming off of the chip. If you do that you won't have FM audio either. I tried just inserting the audio from the decoder right on top of the audio coming off the chip but that doesn't work either. I thought about just cutting the trace for the AM IF in....but then you won't have any AGC for the audio going into the decoder and no IF filtering. I know this kind of conversion has been done several times and this situation sounds familiar because I think it's the same situation that's in the Memorex "basketball" radio. Any suggestions??? Second. I've been converting these Mitsubishi stereos for use in my car. There are actually 2 types out there. Both radio types use the Texas Instruments SN761000 chip for the amplification stage before the signal goes into the amp. The volume control is run through this chip. On the ones with the Mitsumi-built AM and FM sections, I can "insert" the signal from the decoder just fine and the channels are separate. But on the Panasonic-built radios, there is something that tells this chip to go MONO when the radio is in AM mode. I know it's GOT to be one stupid pin somewhere that tells this chip to go to mono. It's the exact same chip. Yet on the panasonic-built stereos when I insert the signal from the decoder it comes out of both channels....it's MONO. Yet I've spent hours upon hours looking on the internet for some sort of data sheet on this TI chip (YES, even at TI itself) and can't find ANYTHING on it. I don't know the proper name for this chip....some sort of MPX (multiplexer?) chip??? Like I said....this is the chip that takes the signals from the AM and FM sections and amplifies them a bit and adds the volume control function and then sends the signal on to the radio's amp section. Anyone know anything about this chip? I'm thinking of sending an email to Texas Instruments and see if maybe they can provide me with a datasheet on this chip. I'm sure it's discontinued and that's why I can't seem to find any data on it. But it's got to be one simple stupid pin that I could cut the trace to that makes this thing switch to MONO when switched into the AM mode. The mitsumi-built radios don't do this. The panasonic ones do. Yet it's the SAME chip. Help? MJR n WYO [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From penry@nortelnetworks.com Thu Nov 07 16:12:01 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: penry@nortelnetworks.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Nov 2002 00:12:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 17984 invoked from network); 8 Nov 2002 00:12:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Nov 2002 00:12:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com) (47.103.122.112) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Nov 2002 00:12:00 -0000 Received: from zrc2c011.us.nortel.com (zrc2c011.us.nortel.com [47.103.120.51]) by zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id gA80CCj02250 for ; Thu, 7 Nov 2002 18:12:12 -0600 (CST) Received: by zrc2c011.us.nortel.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Thu, 7 Nov 2002 18:11:59 -0600 Message-ID: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A560797404660B96@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: {AMSF} (unknown) Date: Thu, 7 Nov 2002 18:11:57 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) From: "Charles Penry" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=376233 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa5vhu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable A quick Google search of "NRSC Mask" comes up with the following: http://www.scott-inc.com/html/80db.htm Goes out to 100 KHz. https://www.nab.org/scitech/AM_All_Digital_Report.pdf Goes out to 25 KHz. And here are the requirements from the FCC rules, off a FCC web page: ---------------------------------------------------------- Federal Communications Commission =A7 73.44 AM transmission system emission limitations. (a) The emissions of stations in the AM service shall be attenuated in accordance with the requirements specified in paragraph (b) of this section= . Emissions shall be measured using a properly operated and suitable swept-frequency RF spectrum analyzer using a peak hold duration of 10 minutes, no video filtering, and a 300 Hz resolution bandwidth, except that a wider resolution bandwidth may be employed above 11.5 kHz to detect transient emissions. Alternatively, other specialized receivers or monitors with appropriate characteristics may be used to determine compliance with the provisions of this section, provided that any disputes over measurement accuracy are resolved in favor of measurements obtained by using a calibrated spectrum analyzer adjusted as set forth above. (b) Emissions 10.2 kHz to 20 kHz removed from the carrier must be attenuate= d at least 25 dB below the unmodulated carrier level, emissions 20 kHz to 30 kHz removed from the carrier must be attenuated at least 35 dB below the unmodulated carrier level, emissions 30 kHz to 60 kHz removed from the carrier must be attenuated at least [5 + 1 dB/kHz] below the unmodulated carrier level, and emissions between 60 kHz and 75 kHz of the carrier frequency must be attenuated at least 65 dB below the unmodulated carrier level. Emissions removed by more than 75 kHz must be attenuated at least 43 + 10 Log (Power in watts) or 80 dB below the unmodulated carrier level, whichever is the lesser attenuation, except for transmitters having power less than 158 watts, where the attenuation must be at least 65 dB below carrier level. (c) Should harmful interference be caused to the reception of other broadcast or nonbroadcast stations by out of band emissions, the licensee may be directed to achieve a greater degree of attentuation than specified in paragraphs (a) and (b) of this section. (d) Measurements to determine compliance with this section for transmitter type acceptance are to be made using signals sampled at the output terminal= s of the transmitter when operating into an artificial antenna of substantially zero reactance. Measurements made of the emissions of an operating station are to be made at ground level approximately 1 kilometer from the center of the antenna system. When a directional antenna is used, the carrier frequency reference field strength to be used in order of preference shall be: (1) The measure nondirectional field strength. (2) The RMS field strength determined from the measured directional radiation pattern. (3) The calculated expected field strength that would be radiated by a nondirectional antenna at the station authorized power. (e) Licensees of stations complying with the ANSI/EIA-549-1988, NRSC-1 AM Preemphasis/Deemphasis and Broadcast Transmission Bandwidth Specifications (NRSC-1), prior to June 30, 1990 or from the original commencement of operation will, until June 30, 1994, be considered to comply with paragraph= s (a) and (b) of this section, absent any reason for the Commission to believ= e otherwise. Such stations are waived from having to make the periodic measurements required in =A7 73.1590(a)(6) until June 30, 1994. However, licensees must make measurements to determine compliance with paragraphs (a= ) and (b) of this section upon receipt of an Official Notice of Violation or = a Notice of Apparent Liability alleging noncompliance with those provisions, or upon specific request by the Commission. ------------------------------------------ So, if you read all of that without falling asleep, I wonder who will be th= e first to cry foul, that the harmful IBOC us not living up to the above rules. Before you say something, be sure you understand the rules. As for the posted graphs, remember that this setup is not the same as the FCC requirements detailed above, and the measured results may not be the same. So, let's all move to Canada and buy DAB receivers and be done with all thi= s US mess! -----Original Message----- From: jsgilst [mailto:jsgil@hal-pc.org]=20 Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 3:11 PM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} (unknown) --- In amstereoforum@y..., "rjskadl" wrote: [ TECHNICAL STUFF: The IBOC Sidebands=20 > do fit into the NRSC Mask. Now as many people have pointed out the=20 > sidebands will produce much more noise, even within the mask, than=20 > regular audio would. Some people are confused by the actual=20 > bandwidth of IBOC. The analog Portion takes up roughly 5k=20 > bandwidth. Kevin T's graphs have demonstrated that, as did my own=20 > graphs that I produced right from the sound clips on the WOR=20 > engineering page. There is a bit of a silent trough from 5k to 10k.=20=20 > At 10k you can see the graph jump up a bit where it plateus and then=20 > drops off at about 15K. I think where people got confused is because=20 > of the fact that you can hear the digital sidebands on 730 and 690=20 > from WOR. The actual sidebands are where they do belong. I am not=20 > saying that they aren't causing problems, they are, but they do=20 > happen to be where they are supposed to be.=20=20 From both graphs posted by Kevin it definitely shows a portion of the IBOC sidebands in the 10-15KHz range. The Sony radio that these were taken from has a =B112.5KHz ceramic filter I think and the radio probably has some additional eq. circuits that helps flatten it out to 15KHz. Whether or not the IBOC sidebands that are above 10KHz are weak enough to be within the NRSC mask I don't know. The point is that the IBOC sidebands in the 10-15KHz range contain additional data and is not just harmonics from modulations below 10KHz. This shows that IBOC needs a full 30KHz bandwidth for its signal unlike analog AM that contains its full modulated spectrum within =B110.2KHz with only=20 harmonic by products from transmitter equipment non linearity or C-QuAM sidebands above 10.2KHz. So it is somewhat misleading to say that it fits within the NRSC mask when most people think of the=20 mask as representing the =B110.2KHz bandwidth of analog AM. As Kevin pointer out earlier that analog stations can brodcast above 10.2KHz just as long as these sidebands are 35-40db below the regular=20 sidebands. For proponents of IBOC the say it fits within the NRSC=20 mask is not telling the full story in that all relevent information is not within the =B110.2KHz bandwidth. JSG [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From jsgil@hal-pc.org Thu Nov 07 17:05:19 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Nov 2002 01:05:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 10451 invoked from network); 8 Nov 2002 01:05:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Nov 2002 01:05:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Nov 2002 01:05:17 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.140] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 08 Nov 2002 01:05:16 -0000 Date: Fri, 08 Nov 2002 01:05:16 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: conversion questions Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3847 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.160 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Michael J. Richard" wrote: > I have a few questions concerning conversions. I've tried this before > and don't get too many answers :( But I'll try again. > First off....if you have a combo AM/FM tuner chip such as the LA1836 then > how do you kill the AM audio coming off of the chip. If you do that you > won't have FM audio either. I tried just inserting the audio from the > decoder right on top of the audio coming off the chip but that doesn't work > either. I thought about just cutting the trace for the AM IF in....but then > you won't have any AGC for the audio going into the decoder and no IF > filtering. I know this kind of conversion has been done several times and > this situation sounds familiar because I think it's the same situation > that's in the Memorex "basketball" radio. Any suggestions??? > Second. I've been converting these Mitsubishi stereos for use in my car. > There are actually 2 types out there. Both radio types use the Texas > Instruments SN761000 chip for the amplification stage before the signal goes > into the amp. The volume control is run through this chip. On the ones > with the Mitsumi-built AM and FM sections, I can "insert" the signal from > the decoder just fine and the channels are separate. But on the > Panasonic-built radios, there is something that tells this chip to go MONO > when the radio is in AM mode. I know it's GOT to be one stupid pin > somewhere that tells this chip to go to mono. It's the exact same chip. > Yet on the panasonic-built stereos when I insert the signal from the decoder > it comes out of both channels....it's MONO. Yet I've spent hours upon hours > looking on the internet for some sort of data sheet on this TI chip (YES, > even at TI itself) and can't find ANYTHING on it. I don't know the proper > name for this chip....some sort of MPX (multiplexer?) chip??? Like I > said....this is the chip that takes the signals from the AM and FM sections > and amplifies them a bit and adds the volume control function and then sends > the signal on to the radio's amp section. Anyone know anything about this > chip? I'm thinking of sending an email to Texas Instruments and see if > maybe they can provide me with a datasheet on this chip. I'm sure it's > discontinued and that's why I can't seem to find any data on it. But it's > got to be one simple stupid pin that I could cut the trace to that makes > this thing switch to MONO when switched into the AM mode. The mitsumi-built > radios don't do this. The panasonic ones do. Yet it's the SAME chip. > > Help? > > MJR n WYO > > > When I converted my Pioneer I had ordered a service manual for it to get the schematic. Even then it was not easy. They had run the mono AM output from the chip into the FM Stereo decoder which the stereo output of the chip had the deemphasis circuit. My solution to this was to use a Quad CMOS analog switch to switch the output of the FM Stereo decoder cip to the output of the AM Stereo decoder board and connect the output of the switches to where the output of the FM Stereo chip had connected. There was high and low voltage that would switch when it switched between AM and FM to control the switch. Now this does not sound like the exact same situation that you have but those CMOS switches come in handy with problems like these. As far as the TI chip is concerned if it does stereo in one radio and not another it sure sounds like there is probably a pin as a feature for mono/stereo selection that the logic in band selection switches it to mono when it is on AM. There is a website that has many datasheets on almost every brand of chip so you might want to look for a sheet at http://www.datasheetlocator.com . The site likes IE and the latest Netscape so older browsers don't work JSG From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Nov 07 17:10:59 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Nov 2002 01:10:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 88085 invoked from network); 8 Nov 2002 01:10:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Nov 2002 01:10:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.210) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Nov 2002 01:10:58 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 7 Nov 2002 17:10:58 -0800 To: References: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A560797404627E4F@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} AMS Questions Date: Thu, 7 Nov 2002 19:37:52 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 08 Nov 2002 01:10:58.0220 (UTC) FILETIME=[B1F58EC0:01C286C3] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.154.182.197] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Charles Penry wrote: > I woke up this morning, has anyone else done this? Any opinions or suggestions would be great. I should have stayed in bed. > > I went to work, does anyone else do this? Yes, and spent most of the day re-building the oscillator, control, and PDA boards along with the power supply of a Harris SX1 transmitter. I get the fun of re-building the power supply to the on air board in the morning. Thank You, Duke Energy for that nice voltage spike! Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Nov 07 17:11:04 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Nov 2002 01:11:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 22581 invoked from network); 8 Nov 2002 01:11:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Nov 2002 01:11:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.116) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Nov 2002 01:11:04 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 7 Nov 2002 17:11:04 -0800 To: References: <005a01c0a79a$fce45b00$d3a9fea9@me> <014801c0a91f$dfb16880$d3a9fea9@me> Subject: Electrolytic Caps Was:Thank you Date: Thu, 7 Nov 2002 19:46:44 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 08 Nov 2002 01:11:04.0057 (UTC) FILETIME=[B5703690:01C286C3] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.154.182.197] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Scott Todd wrote: > You sure about that? I tried looking there and didn't see any. There were plenty of smaller ones for under the chassis of table radios. Yes, I got the caps and tubes for an old Gatesway board I fixed up there too :-) Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Nov 07 20:23:12 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Nov 2002 04:23:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 73818 invoked from network); 8 Nov 2002 04:23:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Nov 2002 04:23:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.90) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Nov 2002 04:23:10 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.133] by n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 08 Nov 2002 04:23:10 -0000 Date: Fri, 08 Nov 2002 04:23:09 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: conversion questions Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2217 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.71.134 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > But on the Panasonic-built radios, there is something that tells > this chip to go MONO when the radio is in AM mode. I don't know whether to laugh or cry at the design of my Pioneer TX-520 tuner. It's an oldie from the early '80s, with a large old- fashioned tuning capactor with flywheel-weighted dial tuning, IF coils instead of a ceramic filter for selectivity, and best of all, an "AM Stereo" IF output jack on the rear panel, connected to "AM STEREO" and "GND" pins on the circuit board. It even uses an AM IF of 450 kHz, even though it has analog tuning, in order to make it more compatible with AM Stereo decoders. That seemed great until I actually tried converting it to AM Stereo. First of all, the supplied AM IF output is useless with Chris's decoder modules; it seems to carry a DC supply voltage along with the IF signal. I had to use a "clean" IF tap-in point, which was easy to find and provided excellent sound from an MC13028 decoder, powered by a nearby DC feed that is active only when the tuner is switched to the AM band. Then, I tried to feed the Left and Right output of the decoder back into the tuner's circuit board, so I could get AM Stereo out of the same output jacks it uses to provide FM Stereo. I tried the "piggyback" approach, but no luck! It turns out that the whole output circuit is *mechanically* switched to Mono on AM by the AM/FM band switch! They specifically included an extra set of pins on the switch with the exclusive purpose of forcing the AM audio to mono -- on the same radio that has a pin labelled as the "AM STEREO" output less than two inches away on the circuit board!! I eventually got around this by just bypassing the entire AM/FM audio switching part of the circuit, and leaving the audio outputs of the AM Stereo decoder and its own FM Stereo circuit active and tied together all the time, as the voltage switching is enough to keep the FM section quiet when you're listening to AM, and vice-versa. I also happily disabled the other *mechanically switched* feature which enforced use of FM muting in order to receive FM Stereo -- basically preventing Stereo reception of anything less than the strongest stations. From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Thu Nov 07 21:04:22 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Nov 2002 05:04:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 81003 invoked from network); 8 Nov 2002 05:04:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Nov 2002 05:04:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14203.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.145) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Nov 2002 05:04:20 -0000 Message-ID: <20021108050420.81690.qmail@web14203.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [65.221.47.68] by web14203.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 07 Nov 2002 21:04:20 PST Date: Thu, 7 Nov 2002 21:04:20 -0800 (PST) Subject: CQuam exciter winner? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio Question, is eBay "bluca64" one of our people on the list? Wondering if Bluca is going to install the CQuam exciter at a station? __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? U2 on LAUNCH - Exclusive greatest hits videos http://launch.yahoo.com/u2 From rjskadl@yahoo.com Thu Nov 07 21:34:25 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: rjskadl@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Nov 2002 05:34:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 78207 invoked from network); 8 Nov 2002 05:34:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Nov 2002 05:34:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Nov 2002 05:34:23 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.191] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 08 Nov 2002 05:34:23 -0000 Date: Fri, 08 Nov 2002 05:34:21 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: IBOC vs AMAX audio clip Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 336 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "rjskadl" X-Originating-IP: 24.186.98.159 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=29619919 X-Yahoo-Profile: rjskadl I just uploaded an audio clip to the files section. It is taken right from the Ibiquity Website. First you hear their supposed analog audio sample, then their IBOC audio sample. Lastly you hear a sample of the song in AMAX AM Stereo quality. So sit back, Relax, Laugh, and Enjoy. The file is called AM-IBOC-vs-AMAX.mp3 -Russ From matthew.trim@eds.com Thu Nov 07 22:13:16 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: matthew.trim@eds.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Nov 2002 06:13:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 91077 invoked from network); 8 Nov 2002 06:13:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Nov 2002 06:13:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO ns5.eds.com) (203.17.185.230) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Nov 2002 06:13:14 -0000 Received: from nnsy.eds.com (nnsy-3.eds.com [192.168.1.1]) by ns5.eds.com (8.11.6/8.11.1) with ESMTP id gA86DCL00395 for ; Fri, 8 Nov 2002 17:13:12 +1100 (EST) Received: from nnsy.eds.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by nnsy.eds.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA86DAD26206 for ; Fri, 8 Nov 2002 17:13:11 +1100 (EST) Received: from ausym000.exau01.exch.eds.com ([134.251.177.117]) by nnsy.eds.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gA86DAb26200 for ; Fri, 8 Nov 2002 17:13:10 +1100 (EST) Received: by AUSYM000 with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Fri, 8 Nov 2002 17:12:41 +1100 Message-ID: <33CDDBD8CAEFEB4191ABF6F799032AF238D66A@aubwm206> To: "'amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com'" Subject: RE: {AMSF} IBOC vs AMAX audio clip Date: Fri, 8 Nov 2002 17:12:40 +1100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-Type: text/plain From: "Trim, Matthew L" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88615102 X-Yahoo-Profile: bofh2k2000 Love it!!! -----Original Message----- From: rjskadl [mailto:rjskadl@yahoo.com] Sent: Friday, 8 November 2002 3:34 PM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} IBOC vs AMAX audio clip I just uploaded an audio clip to the files section. It is taken right from the Ibiquity Website. First you hear their supposed analog audio sample, then their IBOC audio sample. Lastly you hear a sample of the song in AMAX AM Stereo quality. So sit back, Relax, Laugh, and Enjoy. The file is called AM-IBOC-vs-AMAX.mp3 -Russ Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From n0uiheric@aol.com Fri Nov 08 00:14:40 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Nov 2002 08:14:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 59525 invoked from network); 8 Nov 2002 08:14:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Nov 2002 08:14:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r09.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.105) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Nov 2002 08:14:37 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-r09.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.19b.b7eda74 (16633) for ; Fri, 8 Nov 2002 03:14:34 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <19b.b7eda74.2afccc6a@aol.com> Date: Fri, 8 Nov 2002 03:14:34 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Help against Dr. Sniffen To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih I lost? Every candidate I voted for (both Republican and Democrat) won! 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From rwagoner@cox.net Fri Nov 08 00:42:24 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner@cox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Nov 2002 08:42:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 247 invoked from network); 8 Nov 2002 08:42:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Nov 2002 08:42:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Nov 2002 08:42:24 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.189] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 08 Nov 2002 08:42:24 -0000 Date: Fri, 08 Nov 2002 08:42:23 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: SuperRadio and OT obit Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20021105180857.7575.qmail@web14201.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 362 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Richard Wagoner" X-Originating-IP: 68.4.33.253 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=96123889 X-Yahoo-Profile: richardalanwagoner It seems to me that enough differences have been found -- and the RS version to be vastly inferior -- that we can no longer call the Radio Shack a "clone" of the SuperRadio III. > "Danger Will Robinson" - do you have the Radio Shack version or the genuine GE > version? GE for some reason is better than the RS version with the shorter > ferrite antenna. > From rwagoner@cox.net Fri Nov 08 00:42:52 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner@cox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Nov 2002 08:42:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 77018 invoked from network); 8 Nov 2002 08:42:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Nov 2002 08:42:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Nov 2002 08:42:51 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.175] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 08 Nov 2002 08:42:51 -0000 Date: Fri, 08 Nov 2002 08:42:47 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: SuperRadio and OT obit Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20021105180857.7575.qmail@web14201.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 362 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Richard Wagoner" X-Originating-IP: 68.4.33.253 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=96123889 X-Yahoo-Profile: richardalanwagoner It seems to me that enough differences have been found -- and the RS version to be vastly inferior -- that we can no longer call the Radio Shack a "clone" of the SuperRadio III. > "Danger Will Robinson" - do you have the Radio Shack version or the genuine GE > version? GE for some reason is better than the RS version with the shorter > ferrite antenna. > From ben@lennard.net.nz Fri Nov 08 01:48:07 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ben@lennard.net.nz X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Nov 2002 09:48:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 80271 invoked from network); 8 Nov 2002 09:48:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Nov 2002 09:48:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Nov 2002 09:48:06 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.168] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 08 Nov 2002 09:48:06 -0000 Date: Fri, 08 Nov 2002 09:48:03 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: IBOC vs AMAX audio clip Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 785 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Ben" X-Originating-IP: 203.97.97.131 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=118503946 X-Yahoo-Profile: benlennard Why are they even bothering with IBOC????? It sounded WORSE than the normal mono analogue sample. It sounded like the signal was passed through muddy water, with aliasing added in. Infact, it sounded like RealAudio Player over the airwaves... YUCK... If they want to go digital, they should go with E147 which ihave heard samples of and believe me it sounded great! --- In amstereoforum@y..., "rjskadl" wrote: > I just uploaded an audio clip to the files section. It is taken > right from the Ibiquity Website. First you hear their supposed > analog audio sample, then their IBOC audio sample. Lastly you hear a > sample of the song in AMAX AM Stereo quality. So sit back, Relax, > Laugh, and Enjoy. The file is called AM-IBOC-vs-AMAX.mp3 -Russ From philipr@irac.pe.ca Fri Nov 08 07:14:25 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Nov 2002 15:14:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 24783 invoked from network); 8 Nov 2002 15:14:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Nov 2002 15:14:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.66) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Nov 2002 15:14:21 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.154] by n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 08 Nov 2002 15:14:21 -0000 Date: Fri, 08 Nov 2002 15:14:20 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: DAB at Radio Shack Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3115 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking Kevin T. wrote: > One question is if DAB takes off in Canada and becomes successful, > will that lead to the shut-down of all Canadian AM stations? I can > imagine a scenario where all of the prominent FM stations move up to > DAB, while the AM stations complete their move to FM. Nevermind the > fact of the huge loss of coverage area, with people away from the big > cities basically getting no local radio at all; I guess that's what > satellite radio would be for, if XM or Sirius ever comes to Canada! Very good question. When DAB was first kicked around in Canada, the idea was that it would eventually replace AM and FM. Now the talk seems to be more along the idea of a third band. DAB is a great idea for the big cities, and I can see progressive small town stations wanting it for their immediate coverage area. But it doesn't make a lot of sense for cottage country, rural areas, etc. Right now, just about every small town station seems to be moving to FM - another couple years and the only AM stations left in Nova Scotia for example will be CHNS, CJCH and CFDR in HRM [Halifax] and CJCB and CHER in CBRM [Sydney - NS, so as not to confuse our Australian members!] Apparently, according to my brother who lives in CBRM, CHER's signal has much improved - thanks to a nice Nautel 10kwer and apparently now a circular pattern by day. With that kind of investment, I can't see MBS Radio moving it to FM - especially where its an oldies station. Depending on the age of the transmitter plant, it wouldn't surprise me if CJCB was moved to FM, just as fellow MBS CKCW in Moncton NB was moved to FM. But, as usual, I digress! What I would hope is that DAB [Eureka 147] will be successful, that FM will remain, and that AM will be reborn for regional coverage - doing what it does best - covering large swaths of sparsely poulated territory. Personally, I think the CRTC should have permitted stations with large AM coverage areas the opportunity to simulcast a Class A FM service [in geographical areas where plenty of FM frequencies remain] along with the AM so that the station could serve its primary city or town with FM, and rural areas with AM. It will be interesting to see if the CRTC puts a stop to AM to FM flipping where there would be a large loss of coverage. There is one application before them where it literally involves an abandonment of a large area to the east, in favour of new territory to the west. That same station was given a similar simulcast arrangement, but only as a temporary measure - with a firm conversion to FM only deadline. Maybe the CRTC will review its long standing policies, to the benefit of rural listeners in far flung areas. Case in point, my brother in law's only access to radio [he lives in Northern Alberta] is CBX Edmonton - a 50kw clear channel CBC Radio 1 service. Thanks to a GE SR II, he gets quite decent reception, even though CBX is 200 air miles away. It seems that CBC hasn't seen fit to put a low power FM rebroadcaster in every little community of 800 or so people. Phil R From penry@nortelnetworks.com Fri Nov 08 09:35:31 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: penry@nortelnetworks.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Nov 2002 17:35:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 52248 invoked from network); 8 Nov 2002 17:35:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Nov 2002 17:35:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com) (47.103.122.112) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Nov 2002 17:35:29 -0000 Received: from zrc2c011.us.nortel.com (zrc2c011.us.nortel.com [47.103.120.51]) by zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id gA8HZfn08486 for ; Fri, 8 Nov 2002 11:35:41 -0600 (CST) Received: by zrc2c011.us.nortel.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Fri, 8 Nov 2002 11:35:27 -0600 Message-ID: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A56079740466112D@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: {AMSF} Re: Help against Dr. Sniffen Date: Fri, 8 Nov 2002 11:35:27 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) From: "Charles Penry" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=376233 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa5vhu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sorry, I'm lost. Was Dr. Sniffen even running for office? Did he win election? Charles [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From penry@nortelnetworks.com Fri Nov 08 09:59:08 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: penry@nortelnetworks.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Nov 2002 17:59:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 976 invoked from network); 8 Nov 2002 17:59:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Nov 2002 17:59:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com) (47.103.122.112) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Nov 2002 17:59:07 -0000 Received: from zrc2c011.us.nortel.com (zrc2c011.us.nortel.com [47.103.120.51]) by zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id gA8HxIn12473 for ; Fri, 8 Nov 2002 11:59:18 -0600 (CST) Received: by zrc2c011.us.nortel.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Fri, 8 Nov 2002 11:59:05 -0600 Message-ID: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A560797404661188@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: {AMSF} IBOC vs AMAX audio clip Date: Fri, 8 Nov 2002 11:59:02 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) From: "Charles Penry" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=376233 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa5vhu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Great demonstration! Current AM Receiver: Sounds like they are going through the IBOC brick wall filter, removing all fidelity. Mounds mery mummled. IBOC DAB Digital Receiver: The fake treble sounds like fingernails on a blackboard. It might not sound as bad on a car radio at 70 MPH with all the windows down, between two tractor-trailers. Since this signal is stereo are they using all the IBOC digital bandwidth, including the analog portion? AMX AM Stereo Certified Radio: Sweet! And a very good impression of the IBOC announcer, to boot! Charles -----Original Message----- From: rjskadl [mailto:rjskadl@yahoo.com] Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 11:34 PM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} IBOC vs AMAX audio clip I just uploaded an audio clip to the files section. It is taken right from the Ibiquity Website. First you hear their supposed analog audio sample, then their IBOC audio sample. Lastly you hear a sample of the song in AMAX AM Stereo quality. So sit back, Relax, Laugh, and Enjoy. The file is called AM-IBOC-vs-AMAX.mp3 -Russ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Nov 08 10:58:34 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Nov 2002 18:58:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 45284 invoked from network); 8 Nov 2002 18:58:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Nov 2002 18:58:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.83) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Nov 2002 18:58:32 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.169] by n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 08 Nov 2002 18:58:32 -0000 Date: Fri, 08 Nov 2002 18:58:30 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: IBOC vs AMAX audio clip Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A560797404661188@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1657 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > IBOC DAB Digital Receiver: The fake treble sounds like fingernails > on a blackboard. This is actually mostly because the folks at iBiquity re-encoded their own demo file from a fairly good 128 kbps MP3 file into an awful-sounding 64 kbps ShockWave file for their web site. The original demo had truthful treble response up to 15 kHz, while this new version is cut off at 10 kHz and then everything above that point is just artificial digital "aliasing". Same thing with their demo of IBOC on FM! And the ironic thing is that iBiquity says they're constantly changing the digital audio encoding method that IBOC uses to increase its quality, but the content of this audio demo (with the announcer and the back-to-back audio clips) has not been changed since 1999, back when the company was known as "USA Digital Radio, Inc." and the AM and FM IBOC systems were completely different! It is obvious that iBiquity cannot prove their own claims about IBOC having "FM-like sound" on AM and "CD-quality sound" on FM, since their current audio clips are a complete joke. If it REALLY sounded as good as their claimed, why don't they let us actually hear it? And since they are a monopoly, with NO other company proposing IBOC systems to the FCC, the sad thing is that they might never have to prove their own claims, nor is there any incentive for them to improve the performance of their system or to make it more affordable to stations and listeners. p.s. One more thing... AMAX is actually pronounced "Ay-Max", as it is a concatenated way of saying "AM radio at its Maximum potential". I.e., "it's not just A-M.... it's A-Max!" From amstereoguy@hotmail.com Fri Nov 08 13:42:36 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereoguy@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Nov 2002 21:42:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 982 invoked from network); 8 Nov 2002 21:42:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Nov 2002 21:42:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (207.68.165.8) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Nov 2002 21:42:34 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 8 Nov 2002 13:42:34 -0800 Received: from 208.20.8.49 by sea2fd.sea2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Fri, 08 Nov 2002 21:42:34 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: antenna info Date: Fri, 08 Nov 2002 16:42:34 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 08 Nov 2002 21:42:34.0412 (UTC) FILETIME=[BF859EC0:01C2876F] From: "Chris Cuff" X-Originating-IP: [208.20.8.49] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37866059 This is a forwarded message i just got from a fellow that makes active antennas- Thought some of you might like looking at his stuff, and I left his entir email attached. Chris >From: "William Greeley" >To: >Subject: Comment from The AM STEREO Web Site >Date: Fri, 8 Nov 2002 16:15:44 -0500 > >As a fellow AM AMAX listener I was pleased to easily find so much >information on the internet. Your site looked to be a good cross-roads of >AM >BC information. I own two SRF-A100 Sony stereo radios and have a factory AM >stereo in my 87 Toyota. > >I am writing to simply inform you and other AM enthusiasts of an AM active >antenna that is little known in the consumer market place manufactured by >my >company LF Engineering in East Haven, CT. The AM receive only antenna is >called the M-601, and it is a completely sealed antenna and preamplifier >combination specifically designed for the US BC band with roll-off above >and >below the band. The little probe type antenna (26") was the selected >antenna >by Dennon for debut of their TU-680 AMAX radio in New Orleans in the early >1990's. The M-601 was certified by NAB lab testing, and it is today the >only >outdoor active broadcast of its kind specified for enclosed stadium use in >North America. Our link is http://www.lfengineering.com/products.htm for >further info on the M-601C and our other antenna products. Good listening. > >Bill Greeley >LF Engineering Co. _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 helps eliminate e-mail viruses. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus From ccuff@in4web.com Fri Nov 08 13:52:16 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Nov 2002 21:52:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 25443 invoked from network); 8 Nov 2002 21:52:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Nov 2002 21:52:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Nov 2002 21:52:14 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.49]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Fri, 8 Nov 2002 16:51:27 -0500 Message-ID: <001301c28770$e3460920$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: Subject: That Panasonic radio Date: Fri, 8 Nov 2002 16:50:42 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 That Panasonic Video/car stereo Kevin mentioned on ebay does NOT have am stereo. Just checked the service manual- not even the JAPAN model has it! The seller is exercizing their "creative writing" skills. Chris From ccuff@in4web.com Fri Nov 08 15:22:21 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Nov 2002 23:22:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 19185 invoked from network); 8 Nov 2002 23:22:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Nov 2002 23:22:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Nov 2002 23:22:20 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.77]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Fri, 8 Nov 2002 18:21:32 -0500 Message-ID: <000901c2877d$78ef36c0$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: Subject: decoder integration Date: Fri, 8 Nov 2002 18:20:45 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 Michael (and others) As for where to put the output of the decoder. I usually just leave the mono signal there. The decoder's output is stronger than the mono signal and will surpress it. The other thing to do if you want, is using a digital switching transistor running from the LED line of the decoder, into the base of a switching transistor, you can use the pilot signal to kill the mono audio at the DETECTOR output of the IC- it comes out of the IC and back into the IC, depending on the IC. You cant use the transistor trick at the stereo FM output, as it will mute ALL the audio. CC From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Nov 08 18:22:30 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 9 Nov 2002 02:22:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 71364 invoked from network); 9 Nov 2002 02:22:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Nov 2002 02:22:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web12802.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.174.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Nov 2002 02:22:29 -0000 Message-ID: <20021109022229.91812.qmail@web12802.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [216.192.94.128] by web12802.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 08 Nov 2002 18:22:29 PST Date: Fri, 8 Nov 2002 18:22:29 -0800 (PST) Subject: 1680 WTTM gets ratings! To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "Kevin T." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics I am happy to report that for the first time ever, WTTM 1680 AM Stereo has shown up in the central NJ Arbitron ratings! They only made it to the bottom of the chart with an 0.4 rating, but in an area with over a million radio listeners, that still means that thousands of people are listening to WTTM's South Asian music format, in AM Stereo where available! You can see the entire ratings chart here: http://www.radioandrecords.com/Subscribers/ratings/ratmain.asp?mkt=msu Knowing Yahoo, that link will probably "wrap around", so you can just go to http://www.radioandrecords.com and click on "Ratings", and then "Middlesex-Somerset-Union". p.s. I see that in the same ratings book in which 710 WOR turned on their IBOC signal, their central NJ rating dropped from 4.4 to 3.6. Coincidence? I think not! __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? U2 on LAUNCH - Exclusive greatest hits videos http://launch.yahoo.com/u2 From rwagoner@cox.net Fri Nov 08 22:13:18 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner@cox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 9 Nov 2002 06:13:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 11857 invoked from network); 9 Nov 2002 06:13:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Nov 2002 06:13:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Nov 2002 06:13:18 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.158] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 09 Nov 2002 06:13:18 -0000 Date: Sat, 09 Nov 2002 06:13:13 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: KLAC Los Angeles Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 440 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Richard Wagoner" X-Originating-IP: 68.4.33.253 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=96123889 X-Yahoo-Profile: richardalanwagoner The rumor in Los Angeles is that KLAC will drop their low-rated talk format and go back to "adult standards" at the end of 2002/beginning of 2003. At one time, I believe before Clear Channel bought them (through merger), KLAC sounded great in AMAX stereo, but it was turned off long ago. It will be interesting to see if it will indeed change back to music and if so, if it remains mono, fires up the stereo, or goes IBOC. Richard Wagoner From alfredot@inetarena.com Sat Nov 09 02:03:06 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: alfredot@inetarena.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 9 Nov 2002 10:03:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 2833 invoked from network); 9 Nov 2002 10:03:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Nov 2002 10:03:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.inetarena.com) (206.129.216.13) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Nov 2002 10:03:05 -0000 Received: from hendrie (1Cust223.tnt1.portland.or.da.uu.net [67.225.122.223]) by mail.inetarena.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id gA9A1KV20476; Sat, 9 Nov 2002 02:01:20 -0800 (PST) Date: Sat, 9 Nov 2002 03:02:40 -0800 (PST) X-Sender: alfredo@hendrie.1610am.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Cc: penry@nortelnetworks.com Subject: Re: Fw: Message from Customer Care... In-Reply-To: <1036683765.1198.18082.m12@yahoogroups.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: "Alfredo E. Torrejon" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=25132238 X-Yahoo-Profile: alfredotorrejon > Alfredo, > How much clarification do you need? Was McIntosh anti-AM Stereo or were > they just not being pro-AM Stereo? But my point was that the person who wrote the customer care reply mis-spoke for McIntosh when he said that there is more than one AM Stereo standard. The engineers with whom my college friend worked *knew*--back in 1996-- that C-QUAM was the standard. The decision of whether or not to support AM Stereo is theirs to make, and I'm not trying to contest that. > Was McIntosh being anti-AM Stereo or perhaps just pro-business? Other than > the members on this list, myself included, how many people would have spent > the extra money - at that time, or even now - on McIntosh receivers and > tuners with AM Stereo? Charles, from the sarcastic and rather disrespectful tone of your response, I can't help but assume that you see me as some bitter person who has the notion that receiver manufacturers are jerks who purposely wanted AM Stereo, and the AM broadcast band in general, to fail. Well, that's not the case; what seems more likely to me is that as manufacturers started to assume that AM broadcasting was on its way out in the USA, they decided that it wasn't worthwhile to make the engineering effort to build good (i.e. meeting or approaching AMAX specs) AM receivers. From the manufacturers' standpoint, this does make sense (i.e., if good sound on AM is not going to help sell more radios, why spend money on it). I think that AM broadcasters, as a whole, helped seal the fate of the band by falling asleep at the switch. Why didn't more AM broadcasters say, "hey, we spend a lot of time and money on engineering our signals, but they sound like absolute *trash* on these newer radios. If the market gets flooded with crummy receivers like these, *we* are going to be the ones who get hurt, not the radio manufacturers." Re-- the Boom Box example: I understand your point that aesthetics and gimmicks, rather than performance, drive the buying patterns of the people who buy most consumer gear. However, although McIntosh does pay a lot of attention to aesthetics and general image, they are not trying to target teenagers by building boomboxes like the one you described. From what my McIntosh friend told me of the company and its products, McIntosh is going for those customers who are willing to pay more for better performance. Alfredo From ccuff@in4web.com Sat Nov 09 08:36:43 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 9 Nov 2002 16:36:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 8225 invoked from network); 9 Nov 2002 16:36:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Nov 2002 16:36:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Nov 2002 16:36:42 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.51]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Sat, 9 Nov 2002 11:35:55 -0500 Message-ID: <001701c2880d$f88df340$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: Subject: extra cost of stereo?? Date: Sat, 9 Nov 2002 11:35:09 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 Funny- All this talk about how manufacturers won't add am stereo due to the cost increase.... How about the "Optical digital output" jack and circuitry that EVERY Aiwa mini system has, that NO ONE uses? Yet the board (used to be) equipped for the am stereo parts.... (Sony forced a redesign of the mother board when they took command of Aiwa last year- the only change was to remove the ams area) Or how about the Karaoke function? No one uses that, either. It is my opinion that the Japanese manufacturers were paid to discontinue am stereo.... just an opinion. CC From fanfare@globility.com Sat Nov 09 11:58:46 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 9 Nov 2002 19:58:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 55184 invoked from network); 9 Nov 2002 19:58:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Nov 2002 19:58:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.68) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Nov 2002 19:58:45 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.180] by n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 09 Nov 2002 19:58:45 -0000 Date: Sat, 09 Nov 2002 19:58:41 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Fw: Message from Customer Care... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2539 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Marv Southcott" X-Originating-IP: 64.56.235.104 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Alfredo E. Torrejon" wrote: > > Alfredo, > > How much clarification do you need? Was McIntosh anti-AM Stereo or were > > they just not being pro-AM Stereo? > > But my point was that the person who wrote the customer care reply > mis-spoke for McIntosh when he said that there is more than one AM Stereo > standard. The engineers with whom my college friend worked *knew*-- back > in 1996-- that C-QUAM was the standard. The decision of whether or not to > support AM Stereo is theirs to make, and I'm not trying to contest > that. Alfredo I don't know that anyone strongly opposed AM stereo at the outset. According to those in the business, it was poorly hyped by both the radio stations and by the manufacturers. I assume because of the format war and the lack of leadership offered by the mandating body (s) in promoting what they saw as a benefit to AM listeners. Don't forget, the radio stations have to be guided by what the public thinks and the public didn't seem to want to do much thinking about AM-stereo, any more than they did about FM-stereo at time of its inception. Remember this analogy? Before Dr. Ernest Dichter, the noted motivational psychologist, whose analyses brought the public's attention to body odor in order to stimulate deodorant sales, not too many people were concerned about body odor. Remember also, that stereo wasn't that old at the time either. FM stereo grew as a result of the selections it played. Now, the absence of stereo would show up in a NY minute. I wonder what will happen with IBOC and how it is hyped as Ibiquity takes its 2 seats on the CEA. As you all know, the AMSt war waged twixt Kahn and Motorola took its toll on both broadcasters and manufacturers. Having left the mode proponents to fight it out didn't do anyone any good at all, including the popularity or benefits of C-Quam. Without a groundswell of support for AMSt, manufacturers were bound to look at the additional cost of its inclusion and what business they would lose by eliminating it. I suppose that same analogy could apply to McIntosh. But by that time, the company was not under its original ownership, and marketing philosophies can change under new management. Fortunately for the proponents of AMSt, the Omega AM receiver has AMSt as an integral part of its design and those who've heard the rips know it will be what they are looking for. It will also find itself in the price ranges we all are looking for. M. From ben@lennard.net.nz Sat Nov 09 17:09:05 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ben@lennard.net.nz X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Nov 2002 01:09:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 25238 invoked from network); 10 Nov 2002 01:09:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Nov 2002 01:09:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Nov 2002 01:09:04 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.143] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 10 Nov 2002 01:09:04 -0000 Date: Sun, 10 Nov 2002 01:09:03 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: OT - looking for subsitute Xsistor Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 401 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Ben" X-Originating-IP: 203.97.97.131 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=118503946 X-Yahoo-Profile: benlennard Slightly OT, but some one on this list should be able to help. I need to find a subsitute transistor for a Japanese B1335A (assume it is actually a 2SB1335A). It's a PNP in a TO220 package, with a protection diode across the emitter and collector. If there is an equivalent with no diode, that is not a problem, can just mount one externally. Any ideas, pointers to web site? cheers, Ben. From possumhunter@netzero.net Sat Nov 09 17:52:58 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: possumhunter@netzero.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Nov 2002 01:52:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 80225 invoked from network); 10 Nov 2002 01:52:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Nov 2002 01:52:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rly-ip05.mx.aol.com) (64.12.138.9) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Nov 2002 01:52:57 -0000 Received: from logs-ti.proxy.aol.com (logs-ti.proxy.aol.com [152.163.194.135]) by rly-ip05.mx.aol.com (v89.10) with ESMTP id RELAYIN6-1109205206; Sat, 09 Nov 2002 20:52:06 -0400 Received: from ibm (AC98C89E.ipt.aol.com [172.152.200.158]) by logs-ti.proxy.aol.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with SMTP id gAA1pXl279725 for ; Sat, 9 Nov 2002 20:51:33 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <006e01c2885b$abc34da0$9ec898ac@ibm> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} OT - looking for subsitute Xsistor Date: Sat, 9 Nov 2002 20:51:20 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Apparently-From: DodgeRamTrucker@aol.com From: "Possum Hunter" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Ben wrote: > I need to find a subsitute transistor for a Japanese B1335A (assume it is actually a 2SB1335A). I looked in my NTE Semiconductors book and didn't see it, but you may try http://www.nteinc.com They even have the odd-ball Semiconductors that Harris puts in their Polyphase Pulse Duration Modulation transmitters! MCM Electronics http://www.mcmelectronics.com is another good bet. Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From n0uiheric@aol.com Sat Nov 09 17:54:14 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Nov 2002 01:54:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 50393 invoked from network); 10 Nov 2002 01:54:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Nov 2002 01:54:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r02.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.98) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Nov 2002 01:54:13 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-r02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.a3.31f42a0b (4426) for ; Sat, 9 Nov 2002 20:54:09 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Sat, 9 Nov 2002 20:54:09 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC + C-Quam is possible To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih I think it would be better not to sell IBOC receivers at all...but require all manufacturers to add shortwave broadcast coverage to current receivers for home and car use. Don't these manufacturers realize the Cold War is over? 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Sat Nov 09 17:54:14 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Nov 2002 01:54:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 82233 invoked from network); 10 Nov 2002 01:54:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Nov 2002 01:54:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d10.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.42) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Nov 2002 01:54:14 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-d10.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.ca.145db9f5 (4426) for ; Sat, 9 Nov 2002 20:54:08 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Sat, 9 Nov 2002 20:54:08 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: DAB at Radio Shack To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih Don't you think the U.S. should be moving military telemetry off the L-Band to make room for DAB? As for CBC service, the only service I get, besides Radio Canada International on shortwave and CBLA 99.1 Toronto through their Internet feed, is CBW 990 Winnipeg, MB. Even with Windows Media Player, CBLA's Internet feed isn't the greatest. So, IBOC-DAB is a BAD idea. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Nov 09 19:18:45 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Nov 2002 03:18:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 1105 invoked from network); 10 Nov 2002 03:18:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Nov 2002 03:18:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.89) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Nov 2002 03:18:44 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.171] by n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 10 Nov 2002 03:18:44 -0000 Date: Sun, 10 Nov 2002 03:18:40 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: 1110 WTBQ Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 717 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.95.24 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics As the article linked below explains, 1110 WTBQ in Florida, NY (not to be confused with the *state* of Florida!) is proud to be a locally owned and operated AM station with a wide variety of music and talk programs. WTBQ has just been granted a Construction Permit to upgrade from 250 to 500 watts, but they will remain daytime-only (and non- directional) -- although they have 24-hour programming through the webcast on their web site at http://www.wtbq.com Perhaps we can help them out, so WTBQ can upgrade to AM Stereo at the same time as their power increase? Coincidentally enough, they are just a stone's throw away from our own Chris Cuff.... http://www.th-record.com/archive/2002/11/09/radio09.htm From amfmdx@fastq.com Sat Nov 09 19:20:02 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Nov 2002 03:20:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 58502 invoked from network); 10 Nov 2002 03:20:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Nov 2002 03:20:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Nov 2002 03:20:01 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt (d157-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.189]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gAA3K0P62037 for ; Sat, 9 Nov 2002 20:20:01 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <051601c28867$772026c0$85f9bed8@kredding430cdt> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} KLAC Los Angeles Date: Sat, 9 Nov 2002 20:15:45 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > The rumor in Los Angeles is that KLAC will drop their low-rated talk > format and go back to "adult standards" at the end of 2002/beginning > of 2003. Thank God! I hope a lot more stations go off talk and on music. > At one time, I believe before Clear Channel bought them > (through merger), Absorbed by the Borg!! > KLAC sounded great in AMAX stereo, but it was turned > off long ago. It will be interesting to see if it will indeed change > back to music and if so, if it remains mono, fires up the stereo, or > goes IBOC. Keep your fingers crossed for AMAX! Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Sat Nov 09 20:19:17 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Nov 2002 04:19:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 27796 invoked from network); 10 Nov 2002 04:19:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Nov 2002 04:19:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.203) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Nov 2002 04:19:17 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 9 Nov 2002 20:19:17 -0800 To: References: <051601c28867$772026c0$85f9bed8@kredding430cdt> Subject: Re: {AMSF} KLAC Los Angeles Date: Sat, 9 Nov 2002 23:18:59 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 10 Nov 2002 04:19:17.0260 (UTC) FILETIME=[5589BCC0:01C28870] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.140.244.172] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Kevin - Mesa, Arizona wrote: > Thank God! I hope a lot more stations go off talk and on music. I hate talk radio too, but Talk and Sports sell commercials like you would not believe. The difference between selling Sports and Music is amazing, and there are no ASCAP or BMI fees for Talk. The old saying "Talk is cheap" sure applies to radio, that is why so many small stations run satellite fed talk shows. Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From n0uiheric@aol.com Sat Nov 09 23:05:02 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Nov 2002 07:05:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 34292 invoked from network); 10 Nov 2002 07:05:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Nov 2002 07:05:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d08.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.40) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Nov 2002 07:05:00 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-d08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.99.2f771f3a (4426) for ; Sun, 10 Nov 2002 02:04:55 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <99.2f771f3a.2aff5f17@aol.com> Date: Sun, 10 Nov 2002 02:04:55 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} KLAC Los Angeles To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih Clear Channel should SELL KLAC (and divest it's entire radio and TV portfolio, too). 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From ccuff@in4web.com Sun Nov 10 01:21:39 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Nov 2002 09:21:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 51983 invoked from network); 10 Nov 2002 09:21:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Nov 2002 09:21:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.67) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Nov 2002 09:21:37 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.154] by n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 10 Nov 2002 09:21:37 -0000 Date: Sun, 10 Nov 2002 09:21:37 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: 1110 WTBQ Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 464 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amstereoguy2001" X-Originating-IP: 208.20.8.46 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 Coincidentally enough, they are > just a stone's throw away from our own Chris Cuff.... > > http://www.th-record.com/archive/2002/11/09/radio09.htm Indeed they are- and even at 250 watts, they have an amazing coverage area. I am going to see them soon, as they are only 1/2 mile away from where I work. I DO know that they have a mono stl, BUT... a recent photo in the newspaper about one of their on air personalities clearly showed a STEREO board... CC From yaesu_dave@yahoo.com Sun Nov 10 06:13:50 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: yaesu_dave@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Nov 2002 14:13:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 15050 invoked from network); 10 Nov 2002 14:13:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Nov 2002 14:13:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14707.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.224.124) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Nov 2002 14:13:48 -0000 Message-ID: <20021110141348.20782.qmail@web14707.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.187.97.114] by web14707.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 10 Nov 2002 06:13:48 PST Date: Sun, 10 Nov 2002 06:13:48 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: {AMSF} KLAC Los Angeles To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: <051601c28867$772026c0$85f9bed8@kredding430cdt> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: David Wilson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=90738522 X-Yahoo-Profile: yaesu_dave --- "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" wrote: > > The rumor in Los Angeles is that KLAC will drop > their low-rated talk > > format and go back to "adult standards" at the end > of 2002/beginning > > of 2003. It's not a rumor, it's fact (as confirmed by Radio and Records): KLAC/L.A. To Go Adult Standards Next Month Earlier this week R&R reported rumors that Talk KLAC would flip to Adult Standards, and now sources inside the station are confirming those rumors - and KLAC staffers have reportedly been told the change will happen sooner rather than later. Don't expect the new format to be a mixture of some talk along with music, as other AMs have done in the past year or two; it will be all pop standards 24/7, with the exception of Los Angeles Lakers basketball. A mid-December launch date for the new KLAC format is expected to be announced soon. > > Thank God! I hope a lot more stations go off talk > and on music. > > Hear, hear! Yes, Virginia, there are still people who listen to music on AM radio, and no, we're not all in nursing homes! Best Regards, David __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? U2 on LAUNCH - Exclusive greatest hits videos http://launch.yahoo.com/u2 From evergreenterrace@buzzle.com Sun Nov 10 09:29:32 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: evergreenterrace@buzzle.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Nov 2002 17:29:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 94936 invoked from network); 10 Nov 2002 17:29:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Nov 2002 17:29:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.75) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Nov 2002 17:29:30 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.147] by n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 10 Nov 2002 17:29:29 -0000 Date: Sun, 10 Nov 2002 17:29:26 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: 1110 WTBQ Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 478 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgliradio" X-Originating-IP: 129.44.32.241 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=69711087 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgliradio > Perhaps we can help them out, so WTBQ can upgrade to AM Stereo at the > same time as their power increase? Coincidentally enough, they are > just a stone's throw away from our own Chris Cuff.... > > I know about this station first hand. They're using a BE transmitter. All they would need is a stereo card and another telco circuit to the transmitter (with a stereo processor). Right now they have an analog CRL chain with an Inovonics 222 at the transmitter. From evergreenterrace@buzzle.com Sun Nov 10 09:30:18 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: evergreenterrace@buzzle.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Nov 2002 17:30:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 98328 invoked from network); 10 Nov 2002 17:30:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Nov 2002 17:30:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Nov 2002 17:30:18 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.174] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 10 Nov 2002 17:30:18 -0000 Date: Sun, 10 Nov 2002 17:30:15 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: 1110 WTBQ Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 642 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgliradio" X-Originating-IP: 129.44.32.241 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=69711087 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgliradio --- In amstereoforum@y..., "amstereoguy2001" wrote: > Coincidentally enough, they are > > just a stone's throw away from our own Chris Cuff.... > > > > http://www.th-record.com/archive/2002/11/09/radio09.htm > > Indeed they are- and even at 250 watts, they have an amazing coverage > area. I am going to see them soon, as they are only 1/2 mile away > from where I work. > I DO know that they have a mono stl, BUT... a recent photo in the > newspaper about one of their on air personalities clearly showed a > STEREO board... > CC The board is not stereo. It is an A/B mono board. They would need one of those too! From spfleck@citlink.net Sun Nov 10 10:51:31 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: spfleck@citlink.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Nov 2002 18:51:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 13028 invoked from network); 10 Nov 2002 18:51:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Nov 2002 18:51:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO relay04.roc.frontiernet.net) (66.133.131.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Nov 2002 18:51:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 28869 invoked from network); 10 Nov 2002 18:51:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO Steve) ([170.215.241.103]) (envelope-sender ) by relay04.roc.frontiernet.net (qmail-ldap-1.03) with SMTP for ; 10 Nov 2002 18:51:29 -0000 Message-ID: <001001c288ea$2e6522e0$01c8a8c0@N2UBP> To: References: <1036938481.762.29918.m12@yahoogroups.com> Subject: WTBQ Date: Sun, 10 Nov 2002 13:51:29 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Steve Fleckenstein" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=2988995 X-Yahoo-Profile: n2ubp Heaven help us all if the tart antics of ultra democrat "Uncle Mel" are broadcast outside of Orange County on WTBQ. It just might lower the property values in Warwick. It isn't his politics that bother me. It's his crude attitude on the air towards anyone outside of his own backyard that gets my goat. I'm all for AM stereo and support of independent stations but not so that nasty and crude little men can badmouth the rest of the region. This guy is a real turnoff to me for an otherwise fine station.. then again.. maybe they kicked his butt out the door, I haven't listened in months. Steve N2UBP From rwagoner@cox.net Sun Nov 10 12:50:43 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner@cox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Nov 2002 20:50:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 16635 invoked from network); 10 Nov 2002 20:50:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Nov 2002 20:50:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.69) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Nov 2002 20:50:41 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.182] by n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 10 Nov 2002 20:50:41 -0000 Date: Sun, 10 Nov 2002 20:50:38 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} KLAC Los Angeles Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 240 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Richard Wagoner" X-Originating-IP: 68.4.33.253 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=96123889 X-Yahoo-Profile: richardalanwagoner > there are no ASCAP or BMI fees for Talk. The old saying "Talk is cheap" sure > applies to radio, that is why so many small stations run satellite fed talk > shows. Actually, they DO have to pay BMI and ASCAP if they run "bumper music." From rwagoner@cox.net Sun Nov 10 12:53:15 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner@cox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Nov 2002 20:53:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 91939 invoked from network); 10 Nov 2002 20:53:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Nov 2002 20:53:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Nov 2002 20:53:15 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.129] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 10 Nov 2002 20:53:15 -0000 Date: Sun, 10 Nov 2002 20:53:13 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} KLAC Los Angeles Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20021110141348.20782.qmail@web14707.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 210 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Richard Wagoner" X-Originating-IP: 68.4.33.253 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=96123889 X-Yahoo-Profile: richardalanwagoner > It's not a rumor, it's fact (as confirmed by Radio and > Records): > KLAC/L.A. To Go Adult Standards Next Month > It's rumor until it happens. CCU has a history of changing their minds at the last minute. From penry@nortelnetworks.com Sun Nov 10 22:05:40 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: penry@nortelnetworks.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Nov 2002 06:05:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 93388 invoked from network); 11 Nov 2002 06:05:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Nov 2002 06:05:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com) (47.103.122.112) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Nov 2002 06:05:39 -0000 Received: from zrc2c011.us.nortel.com (zrc2c011.us.nortel.com [47.103.120.51]) by zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id gAB65p009788 for ; Mon, 11 Nov 2002 00:05:52 -0600 (CST) Received: by zrc2c011.us.nortel.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Mon, 11 Nov 2002 00:05:38 -0600 Message-ID: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A560797404661752@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: {AMSF} Re: Fw: Message from Customer Care... Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 00:05:30 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) From: "Charles Penry" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=376233 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa5vhu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Charles says: I was responding to your below statement, from your first email. Alfredo first said: About 6 years ago, one of my friends did a summer internship with McIntosh Labs. He asked them why they didn't offer AM Stereo in their tuners. If I remember correctly, the answer that he got was that by the time that C-QUAM became the legal standard, there wasn't enough interest and/or that there weren't enough stations broadcasting stereo to warrant the expense of designing a tuner with AM Stereo. I will ask my friend to clarify why McIntosh was anti-AM Stereo. Alfredo now says: But my point was that the person who wrote the customer care reply mis-spoke for McIntosh when he said that there is more than one AM Stereo standard. The engineers with whom my college friend worked *knew*--back in 1996-- that C-QUAM was the standard. The decision of whether or not to support AM Stereo is theirs to make, and I'm not trying to contest that. Charles says: Your first statement says your friend said "by the time that C-QUAM became the legal standard, there wasn't enough interest and/or that there weren't enough stations broadcasting stereo to warrant the expense of designing a tuner with AM Stereo". I'm confused. If you meant something else, then you should have said something else. You said that you "will ask my friend to clarify why McIntosh was anti-AM Stereo" and your "anti-AM-Stereo" comment was what I was responding to. Alfredo now says: Charles, from the sarcastic and rather disrespectful tone of your response, I can't help but assume that you see me as some bitter person who has the notion that receiver manufacturers are jerks who purposely wanted AM Stereo, and the AM broadcast band in general, to fail. Charles says: I was not trying to be sarcastic nor disrespectful. You said that you "will ask my friend to clarify why McIntosh was anti-AM Stereo". Your words speak for themselves. Alfredo now says: Well, that's not the case; what seems more likely to me is that as manufacturers started to assume that AM broadcasting was on its way out in the USA, they decided that it wasn't worthwhile to make the engineering effort to build good (i.e. meeting or approaching AMAX specs) AM receivers. From the manufacturers' standpoint, this does make sense (i.e., if good sound on AM is not going to help sell more radios, why spend money on it). I think that AM broadcasters, as a whole, helped seal the fate of the band by falling asleep at the switch. Why didn't more AM broadcasters say, "hey, we spend a lot of time and money on engineering our signals, but they sound like absolute *trash* on these newer radios. If the market gets flooded with crummy receivers like these, *we* are going to be the ones who get hurt, not the radio manufacturers." Charles says: I agree completely, and apparently McIntosh agreed also. Alfredo now says: Re-- the Boom Box example: I understand your point that aesthetics and gimmicks, rather than performance, drive the buying patterns of the people who buy most consumer gear. However, although McIntosh does pay a lot of attention to aesthetics and general image, they are not trying to target teenagers by building boomboxes like the one you described. From what my McIntosh friend told me of the company and its products, McIntosh is going for those customers who are willing to pay more for better performance. Charles says: You are correct in that McIntosh is going for those customers who are willing to pay more for supposedly better performance. I went on their web page and it appears that McIntosh is still has the appearances of an "upper end" manufacturer and they don't seem to make boom boxes. I believe that my analogy still fits buyers that are the bulk of the money spent on boxes that include a radio. I found the specifications for the McIntosh AM/FM tuner on their web page: (AM) Frequency Response: 50 Hz to 6 KHz NRSC Unfortunately it has a very typical lousy audio response. And they brag about their "Ultra-stable, linear phase piezoelectric IF filters for FM and AM", and call the unit a "High-performance AM/FM broadcast monitor". Yeah, right! Too narrow for good music and may be just wide enough to hear IBOC hash... Happy listening, Charles [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Sun Nov 10 22:40:51 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Nov 2002 06:40:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 30099 invoked from network); 11 Nov 2002 06:40:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Nov 2002 06:40:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14206.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.173.70) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Nov 2002 06:40:51 -0000 Message-ID: <20021111064051.21939.qmail@web14206.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [65.221.47.68] by web14206.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 10 Nov 2002 22:40:51 PST Date: Sun, 10 Nov 2002 22:40:51 -0800 (PST) Subject: OT: Tornadoes in November To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio This is a weird weather year to be sure - a couple of Tornado touchdowns here in Ohio today - IN NOVEMBER! Of course, Clear Channel's local AM station was running football games - I guess a tornado warning (5 were killed) wasn't important enough for them. Sad. __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? U2 on LAUNCH - Exclusive greatest hits videos http://launch.yahoo.com/u2 From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Nov 10 23:02:34 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Nov 2002 07:02:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 44782 invoked from network); 11 Nov 2002 07:02:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Nov 2002 07:02:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.84) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Nov 2002 07:02:34 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.189] by n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Nov 2002 07:02:34 -0000 Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 07:02:30 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Saturn & Clarion AM Stereo Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 831 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.77.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics This appears to be one of the rare 1993-1994 Saturn car radios with AM Stereo. It doesn't have the manual "Am-St" push-button, but it is based on the same chassis as the other 1993+ Delco radios with 5-band graphic equalizer and AMAX AM Stereo: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1395673403 Meanwhile, here is a real gem that I just had the winning bid on... a Clarion "Audia-200E" car radio with AM Stereo and a huge list of other special features: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1395399377 They sure don't make 'em like they used to... I think most of today's aftermarket car stereos should be banned as a distraction while driving, because of their tiny, illegible buttons and flashy video- game-like displays -- not to mention their lack of quality on both the AM and FM bands. From amstereoguy@hotmail.com Mon Nov 11 06:54:15 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereoguy@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Nov 2002 14:54:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 11517 invoked from network); 11 Nov 2002 14:54:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Nov 2002 14:54:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (207.68.165.94) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Nov 2002 14:54:14 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 11 Nov 2002 06:54:13 -0800 Received: from 208.228.96.20 by sea2fd.sea2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Mon, 11 Nov 2002 14:54:13 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: BE stereo card Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 09:54:13 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 11 Nov 2002 14:54:13.0941 (UTC) FILETIME=[3357AE50:01C28992] From: "Chris Cuff" X-Originating-IP: [208.228.96.20] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37866059 Can anyone get me a BE stereo card- even a fried one? just to "study" it... I would not need it more than 2 or 3 days.... >;-) Chris > _________________________________________________________________ Help STOP SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail From amfmdx@fastq.com Mon Nov 11 07:20:28 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Nov 2002 15:20:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 75599 invoked from network); 11 Nov 2002 15:20:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Nov 2002 15:20:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Nov 2002 15:20:26 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt (d18-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.50]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gABFKPP83028; Mon, 11 Nov 2002 08:20:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <003101c28995$c3fa7a20$2439bbd0@kredding430cdt> To: Cc: "Kevin Tekel" References: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A560797404661752@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Fw: Message from Customer Care... Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 08:19:43 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > Charles says: > I'm confused. Charles my brother, your posts are rather tedious.... Out of the whole post the only coherent thing you said were the two words you stated and I quoted above. You have found a special spot in the hearts of all of us on the list, believe it or not. Kevin Mesa, Arizona From alinton@esatclear.ie Mon Nov 11 11:11:34 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: alinton@esatclear.ie X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Nov 2002 19:11:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 78933 invoked from network); 11 Nov 2002 19:11:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Nov 2002 19:11:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO davros) (194.145.134.103) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Nov 2002 19:11:30 -0000 Received: from Spooler by davros (Mercury/32 v3.30) ID MO000041; 11 Nov 02 19:11:31 -0000 Received: from spooler by totalbroadcast.net (Mercury/32 v3.30); 11 Nov 02 19:11:24 -0000 Received: from fr1.esatclear.ie (192.168.0.1) by davros (Mercury/32 v3.30) with ESMTP ID MG000040; 11 Nov 02 19:11:14 -0000 Message-Id: <5.1.1.2.2.20021111190938.00b758e0@fr1> X-Sender: alinton@fr1 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1.1.3 (Beta) Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 19:11:12 +0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} BE stereo card In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed From: Andy Linton X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10800314 X-Yahoo-Profile: alinton1_ie At 09:54 11/11/2002 -0500, you wrote: >Can anyone get me a BE stereo card- even a fried one? just to "study" it... >I would not need it more than 2 or 3 days.... >;-) >Chris > > > I've got one here Chris, I know it may be impractical, but I could lend you it if you don't get any other offers, or maybe take some pics of it. I'd let you have it except we have a project im mind here for it. I also have a manual for the rig it came out of. Any use? rgds ----------------------------------- Andy Linton alinton@esatclear.ie Waterford, Ireland ************************************************************** Scanned by MailScan Content-Security and Anti-Virus Software. Visit http://www.mwti.net for more info on eScan and MailScan. ************************************************************** From michaelj@vcn.com Mon Nov 11 11:22:07 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Nov 2002 19:22:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 65162 invoked from network); 11 Nov 2002 19:22:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Nov 2002 19:22:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m3-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.33) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Nov 2002 19:22:06 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m3-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Mon, 11 Nov 2002 12:22:06 -0700 Message-ID: <002d01bbf854$e37bbfe0$0701010a@keva> To: References: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A560797404661752@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> <003101c28995$c3fa7a20$2439bbd0@kredding430cdt> Subject: thundersnow! Date: Wed, 1 Jan 1997 19:30:14 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi gang Had some disturbing experiences coming into the station this morning. On Saturday evening, when the big storm moved through, we had a huge snow shower complete with lightning and thunder. And apparantly the we took a lightening hit here at the station. Gremlins crawling out everywhere this morning. First experience was walking into the studio finding a channel missing from the air monitor......yes, the genuine Motorola CQuam AM Stereo modulation monitor. Meters are both working properly. I think I've traced the problem down to one of the TI TL084CM chips on the meter board. Should be able to (hopefully) replace the chip and get the problem fixed. We're live all morning on both stations today because of a huge remote going on today in town at one of the local furniture/electronics stores. Low and behold, we get to the very first call-in and the Gentner DH1 hybird over on our FM station isn't working. Probably relay contacts that got melted together or melted away from lightning. I guess a quasi-engineer's work is never done :( MJR n WYO ----- Original Message ----- From: Kevin - Mesa, Arizona To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Cc: Kevin Tekel Sent: Monday, November 11, 2002 8:19 AM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Fw: Message from Customer Care... > Charles says: > I'm confused. Charles my brother, your posts are rather tedious.... Out of the whole post the only coherent thing you said were the two words you stated and I quoted above. You have found a special spot in the hearts of all of us on the list, believe it or not. Kevin Mesa, Arizona Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From michaelj@vcn.com Mon Nov 11 11:40:43 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Nov 2002 19:40:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 90226 invoked from network); 11 Nov 2002 19:40:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Nov 2002 19:40:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m3-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.33) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Nov 2002 19:40:42 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m3-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Mon, 11 Nov 2002 12:40:42 -0700 Message-ID: <004f01c289ba$3857dd80$0701010a@keva> To: Subject: thundersnow! Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 12:40:41 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi gang Had some disturbing experiences coming into the station this morning. On Saturday evening, when the big storm moved through, we had a huge snow shower complete with lightning and thunder. And apparantly the we took a lightening hit here at the station. Gremlins crawling out everywhere this morning. First experience was walking into the studio finding a channel missing from the air monitor......yes, the genuine Motorola CQuam AM Stereo modulation monitor. Meters are both working properly. I think I've traced the problem down to one of the TI TL084CM chips on the meter board. Should be able to (hopefully) replace the chip and get the problem fixed. We're live all morning on both stations today because of a huge remote going on today in town at one of the local furniture/electronics stores. Low and behold, we get to the very first call-in and the Gentner DH1 hybird over on our FM station isn't working. Probably relay contacts that got melted together or melted away from lightning. I guess a quasi-engineer's work is never done :( MJR n WYO ----- Original Message ----- From: Kevin - Mesa, Arizona To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Cc: Kevin Tekel Sent: Monday, November 11, 2002 8:19 AM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Fw: Message from Customer Care... > Charles says: > I'm confused. Charles my brother, your posts are rather tedious.... Out of the whole post the only coherent thing you said were the two words you stated and I quoted above. You have found a special spot in the hearts of all of us on the list, believe it or not. Kevin Mesa, Arizona Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From dav259@csiro.au Mon Nov 11 16:20:27 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Nov 2002 00:20:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 88712 invoked from network); 12 Nov 2002 00:20:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Nov 2002 00:20:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Nov 2002 00:20:26 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAC0KOP02918 for ; Tue, 12 Nov 2002 11:20:24 +1100 (EST) Date: Tue, 12 Nov 2002 11:20:24 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: amstereoforum Subject: "PHONY DIGITAL RADIO" Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public I still like the sound of Symphony becoming an AMS reality. This came from "The Oz Radio Wave" 10/13/02. An interesting story appeared recently in The NEW YORK TIMES which reported that MOTOROLA is readying a new chipset to create AM/FM analog receivers that take analog broadcasts, convert them to digital, and clean the signals up from multipath and interference problems. The first radios with the technology will be car radios to be available late next year. BLAUPUNKT has announced similar technology, "Digiciever." Reacting to this, a company called Ibiquity, who are in the business of producing genuine digital receivers, sent out the following release. (edited) ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ >Some of you may have seen the story Monday in the New York Times "As Digital Radio Stumbles, New Products Fill the Gap". There was a similar story in the Wall Street Journal and in several of the radio industry dailies. We have received some inquiries from broadcasters and investors about the articles, and thought it appropriate to try to put this article in perspective for you. Chipsets that improve analog performance do not offer the value upgrade in quality or the wireless data services offered by digital solutions, like iBiquity's HD Radio technology. The Motorola chips referred to in the article were actually unveiled earlier this month at the NAB Radio Show in Seattle, where they did not generate much interest. We were therefore not surprised to see these stories, but were somewhat bemused at the amount of coverage they have received, since the chipsets do not represent much of an upgrade from the current state of analog radio technology. Simply stated, these chips digitally process analog signals in receivers. This approach and technology are not new these types of "digital radios" have been on the market for several years from various manufacturers. Although the chips mentioned in the article use digital technology to process the received analog signal, these chips, cannot enhance the actual broadcast from the station it is still analog. While digital processing of an analog signal does yield important benefits, analog has inherent limitations that can only be addressed at the source using digital broadcast technology. Once a broadcast is transmitted digitally, audio quality is greatly enhanced, reception is crystal clear and new offerings such as the "Tivo for Radio" applications and other wireless data services can be provided. These benefits can be realized only through digital transmission. Our belief is that Motorola has announced this somewhat old news story with so much fanfare because they see a potential loss of business now that digital Radio technology is a reality. We'd also note that this effort - trying to improve analog in the face of a digital transition - appears to have been taken right from Motorola's cell phone business plan. As the analog market leader, they tried to extend the life of analog cell phones as the entire industry was transitioning to digital. The results of that strategy were devastating, as Motorola lost major market share to other cell phone providers who embraced digital technology. After many years in development and test, and with support from our valued partners, digital broadcasting in the U.S. is on the cusp of endorsement by the FCC. Every medium in the U.S. has made the transition to digital as consumers are demanding the latest in technical advancements. HD Radio technology represents a true upgrade from analog to digital in signal quality and wireless data capabilities. Enhancing analog will not offer the same range of benefits available from a digital transmission.> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ So basically this means if a radio station is not transmitting using fully digital equipment (even including digital microphones) and the listeners are not using total digital receivers then its phony digital radio were talking about. If youre interested in finding out more check out: http://www.ibiquity.com/navframe.html?01content.html LATE NEWS: (as reported by All Access Music Group this past week) As expected, the FCC has unanimously approved iBIQUITY's in-band on-channel digital radio system for use by terrestrial radio stations. Stations may immediately begin broadcasting digital signals, although radios to receive them are not yet commercially available. The NAB's EDDIE FRITTS issued an immediate statement following the Commission's 4-0 vote: "We salute the FCC for today's decision and congratulate BOB STRUBLE and the team at iBIQUITY for helping shepherd regulatory approval through the Commission. NAB was pleased to play a supporting role. "With today's FCC action, local radio stations are poised to deliver one of the most sweeping advancements in broadcasting in nearly a century. Community-focused programming has always made radio an indispensable part of the American fabric. We believe broadcasters will embrace this new technology because it will provide local listeners with unmatched audio quality and a host of new, innovative digitally-based services. From evergreenterrace@buzzle.com Mon Nov 11 22:30:24 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: evergreenterrace@buzzle.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Nov 2002 06:30:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 44444 invoked from network); 12 Nov 2002 06:30:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Nov 2002 06:30:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.84) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Nov 2002 06:30:23 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.190] by n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 12 Nov 2002 06:30:23 -0000 Date: Tue, 12 Nov 2002 06:30:21 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: "PHONY DIGITAL RADIO" Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 719 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgliradio" X-Originating-IP: 151.204.158.83 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=69711087 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgliradio --- In amstereoforum@y..., Ian Davidson wrote: > > As the analog market leader, they tried to extend the life > of analog cell phones as the entire industry was transitioning > to digital. The results of that strategy were devastating, > as Motorola lost major market share to other cell phone > providers who embraced digital technology. And as a company that has invested millions in a flawed and unworkable system, Ibiquity is ready to trash ANYTHING that comes along that is indeed better than their system. Do you see people clamoring for digital radio? WHY DON'T THEY UNDERSTAND IT'S NOT THE QUALITY OF THE AUDIO BUT THE QUALITY OF WHAT'S COMING OUT OF THE SPEAKER????????? God Damn IT! From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Nov 11 22:58:59 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Nov 2002 06:58:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 93084 invoked from network); 12 Nov 2002 06:58:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Nov 2002 06:58:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.64) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Nov 2002 06:58:57 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.174] by n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 12 Nov 2002 06:58:57 -0000 Date: Tue, 12 Nov 2002 06:58:53 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Now you see it, now you don't... Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1790 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.88.138 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics In the early 1990s, some Nissan and all Infiniti cars were equipped with excellent AM Stereo-capable radios; they were ahead of the game by including Expanded Band tuning and AMAX-type quality at least a year before these standards were introduced in 1993. Here is an example of one of these radios -- a CD/cassette combo (rare for its time) with a manual "AM-ST" push-button on the front panel: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1872333578 However, around 1995, Nissan/Infiniti went through some cost-cutting measures, which included things as meticulous as reducing the number of stitches per inch on the rear seat upholstery (since the back seat is used less often than the front and thus gets less wear). Unfortunately for us, this was another one of the consequences: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1872206553 Where's the "AM-ST" button? You don't see it, because Nissan -- not the radio manufacturer -- requested that the AM Stereo be removed, as well as the Dynamic Noise Reduction on the cassette player, while the rest of the radio remained basically the same. One AM radio engineer (who happened to own a 1992 Infiniti with the AM Stereo-equipped radio) with whom I spoke with on CompuServe at the time contacted Nissan about this, and they said that dropping these features saved them less than $1.00 in total manufacturing cost per car. The moral of the story: Never underestimate the ruthlessness of corporate cost-cutting -- which has given us other such gems as cars with no keyhole in the passenger side door or trunk lid (forcing reliance upon the power lock system), computer peripherals with no On/Off power switch, and the extinction of the BALANCE control on boom-boxes and integrated stereo systems. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Nov 11 23:11:57 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Nov 2002 07:11:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 14297 invoked from network); 12 Nov 2002 07:11:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Nov 2002 07:11:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.75) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Nov 2002 07:11:55 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.250] by n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 12 Nov 2002 07:11:55 -0000 Date: Tue, 12 Nov 2002 07:11:52 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: "PHONY DIGITAL RADIO" Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1345 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.88.138 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > WHY DON'T THEY UNDERSTAND IT'S NOT THE QUALITY OF THE AUDIO BUT THE > QUALITY OF WHAT'S COMING OUT OF THE SPEAKER????????? > God Damn IT! Heh... and the engineers at WOR prove this very hypocritically every time they insist that none of their listeners can tell the difference from their 5 kHz audio bandwidth cut-off, and that even for those who can, it doesn't matter because they'll still listen to WOR's programming anyway. Okay, so if your listeners are fine with a muffled, hissy analog mono AM signal, then exactly what incentive is there for them to run out and buy a $150 or $200 "HD Radio" if/when they become available? Especially when they can buy an XM or Sirius satellite radio for the same price and get hundreds of channels of exciting new programming, rather than the same old boring AM talk stations!? Same thing with HDTV... exactly where is the consumer interest in this?? Sure, people want to see their DVD movies with wide-screen video and Surround sound, but regular TV is fine by them -- it's the same old boring programming anyway. Cable and satellite TV doesn't have enough bandwidth to make all the channels HDTV, and off-air reception of HDTV is even more fussy than that of regular UHF TV, which even fewer people ever watch unless one of their local major network affiliates isn't on VHF. From dav259@csiro.au Tue Nov 12 00:17:56 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Nov 2002 08:17:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 32688 invoked from network); 12 Nov 2002 08:17:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Nov 2002 08:17:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Nov 2002 08:17:53 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAC8HpP27886 for ; Tue, 12 Nov 2002 19:17:51 +1100 (EST) Date: Tue, 12 Nov 2002 19:17:51 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: "PHONY DIGITAL RADIO" In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public On Tue, 12 Nov 2002, wgliradio wrote: > And as a company that has invested millions in a flawed and > unworkable system, Ibiquity is ready to trash ANYTHING that comes > along that is indeed better than their system. > > Do you see people clamoring for digital radio? > > WHY DON'T THEY UNDERSTAND IT'S NOT THE QUALITY OF THE AUDIO BUT THE > QUALITY OF WHAT'S COMING OUT OF THE SPEAKER????????? The Sydney Morning Herald Guide this week had three pages on digital radio and included comments by industry people saying things like "AM radio is not sexy" (whatever that means) and people aren't prepared to to spend big money "just on a radio". I dispute the first comment - as I'd expect sexiness to be in the ears (both ears) of the beholder. But for most listeners the second argument has legs. Eureka 147 was reportedly introduced in the UK eight years ago and has 100% market saturation. Yet the take up rate is only 3%. Most people seem to agree in a perfect world Eureka DAB would be the way to go - but we don't live in a perfect world. I'm getting tired of all this talk about digital. None of us is getting any younger - especially me. Much of it seems like a pipe dream. If digital radio was introduced here tomorrow I'd immediately buy one receiver - and if I was happy - many more! But you are right! The ONE! advantage that radio has as opposed to ANY other form of audio listening is PROGRAMMING. That's why we like it. That's why we listen. Why are PDs and station managers blind and deaf? Sack the beancounters and put radio back in the hands of people who care and have a genuine love of how it should be. Bring back the theater of the mind. And service to each local market. In OZ only 10% of the advertising industry's spend goes to radio. Stop all this careful automated junk. Look at and embrace your local market. And the advertising - much of it local - will follow. Ian From philipr@irac.pe.ca Tue Nov 12 06:55:54 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Nov 2002 14:55:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 45618 invoked from network); 12 Nov 2002 14:55:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Nov 2002 14:55:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Nov 2002 14:55:53 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.169] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 12 Nov 2002 14:55:53 -0000 Date: Tue, 12 Nov 2002 14:55:52 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: "PHONY DIGITAL RADIO" Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1822 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking --- In amstereoforum@y..., Ian Davidson wrote: > On Tue, 12 Nov 2002, wgliradio wrote: [edited] > The Sydney Morning Herald Guide this week had three pages on digital > radio and included comments by industry people saying things like "AM > radio is not sexy" (whatever that means) and people aren't prepared to to > spend big money "just on a radio". > I suspect that in the 1960s audio equipment industry people could, and likely did say, "tube amplifiers are not sexy and people aren't prepared to spend big money on "just an amplifier". Well, search "tube amplifiers" on your favorite search engine and you will find dozens of manufacturers making them again - at very high prices, with the exception of a lovely little 8 watt per channel kit I just built, which gives great sound for $140 US. Apparerently, building your own tube amp is a big hobby in Japan from what I've been told by a friendly Japanese tourist visiting sunny PEI this summer. Meanwhile, sales of GE SR IIIs seem brisk, our local Canadian Tire had 3 in stock a few weeks ago, then 0, and now 4 are on the shelves. There are a few moderately wide band rigs on the market - available someplaces - remember the Memorex that Chris told us about - people are buying these things and are enjoying listening to their favourite AM station which now "sounds like FM". Sometimes new technologies fade away, never to return. Other times, they fade away - only to come back much more popular than they ever were before. Give me a "phony digital radio" any day - if it works well, I want it! Let's remember that speakers and headphones are analogue devices. I can't hear anything in pure digital - can you? Well, maybe the Farmer in the DELL can - but I still can't find that elusive farmer in my DELL! Phil R. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Nov 12 07:15:11 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Nov 2002 15:15:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 73967 invoked from network); 12 Nov 2002 15:15:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Nov 2002 15:15:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Nov 2002 15:15:10 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.188] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 12 Nov 2002 15:15:10 -0000 Date: Tue, 12 Nov 2002 15:15:05 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: "PHONY DIGITAL RADIO" Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 619 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Let's remember that speakers and headphones are analogue devices. > I can't hear anything in pure digital - can you? I have an old CD player (made in 1987!) that will "play" CD-ROM discs as if they were audio discs. Doing so produces nothing but various patterns of white noise, but hey... that's DIGITAL SOUND you're hearing! > Well, maybe the Farmer in the DELL can - but I still can't find > that elusive farmer in my DELL! I suppose he's the one who turned the "E" in the logo at an angle. Intel: Where Quality is Job 1.000010495186! (just a joke from the days when the Pentium had a flawed math chip) From wa2fnq@optonline.net Tue Nov 12 08:22:40 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: wa2fnq@optonline.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Nov 2002 16:22:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 61704 invoked from network); 12 Nov 2002 16:22:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Nov 2002 16:22:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Nov 2002 16:22:39 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.159] by n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 12 Nov 2002 16:22:38 -0000 Date: Tue, 12 Nov 2002 16:22:35 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: "PHONY DIGITAL RADIO" Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2104 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wa2fnq" X-Originating-IP: 64.236.235.240 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=60059615 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa2fnq --- In amstereoforum@y..., "wgliradio" wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@y..., Ian Davidson wrote: > > > > As the analog market leader, they tried to extend the life > > of analog cell phones as the entire industry was transitioning > > to digital. The results of that strategy were devastating, > > as Motorola lost major market share to other cell phone > > providers who embraced digital technology. > > And as a company that has invested millions in a flawed and > unworkable system, Ibiquity is ready to trash ANYTHING that comes > along that is indeed better than their system. > > Do you see people clamoring for digital radio? > > WHY DON'T THEY UNDERSTAND IT'S NOT THE QUALITY OF THE AUDIO BUT THE > QUALITY OF WHAT'S COMING OUT OF THE SPEAKER????????? > > God Damn IT! This is absolutely right!! The Ibiquity system is obsolete right from the start. If there is ever the demand for more sophisticated audio schemes, like surround sound, the present Ibquity sytem cannot deliver it. The data rates are too low, there's too much compression and "perceptual audio coding" taking place. Present analog systems can deliver some of this now. If you look at Motorola's web site their Symphony chipset has the possiblities of delivering things like Dolby. Also there is more interest in them than Ibiquity would like to admit. Sorry Ibiquity.... worong again!! But the real issue is programming. There is not one thing worth listening to coming out of NYC radio on AM. But WOR thinks that they're going to fix the problem by giving us the Dolans and Bob Grant in digital. I don't think so. How about a 50 KW station playing oldies in AM Stereo. It seems to have worked up in CT. In one town the local FM station gave up playing oldies. Their competition, a little 2,5 KW AM Stereo station, is still going strong. Somebody must be listening. I know I am. It's time for radio stations to get their act together and put some decent programming on the air. That will help more than this digital crap. Jerry, WA2FNQ AM Stereo 1290 AM Stereo From fanfare@globility.com Tue Nov 12 08:25:51 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Nov 2002 16:25:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 69594 invoked from network); 12 Nov 2002 16:25:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Nov 2002 16:25:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Nov 2002 16:25:51 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.134] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 12 Nov 2002 16:25:51 -0000 Date: Tue, 12 Nov 2002 16:25:48 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: "PHONY DIGITAL RADIO" Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2263 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Marv Southcott" X-Originating-IP: 64.56.233.253 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Phil Rafuse" wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@y..., Ian Davidson wrote: > > radio is not sexy" (whatever that means) and people aren't > prepared to to > > spend big money "just on a radio". > can't hear anything in pure digital - can you? Well, maybe the > Farmer in the DELL can - but I still can't find that elusive farmer > in my DELL! > > Phil R. Where there is no obvious sharing of the wealth, it is pretty much expected that the proponents of a new technology will try to discredit their opponents, and vice versa. What gets missed though is the actual objective ... that of providing a better quality of radio service. In its best possible form, digital would be the choice. But there are couple of major flaws in the argument that are not being addressed. One would be that radio is being trashed generally by those who look upon it as just an electronic billboard, rather than a public entertainment medium which is paid for by advertising. Second, the quality of the content along with the quality of transmission, and finally the quality of the receiver have all served to reduce radio in some markets to a quality level not unlike that of a cell-phone. Speaking of which, IMHO digital so far, enjoys no more clarity than analog. If anything it is more often worse. The second would be in the capability of the receiver. With nothing really changing in receiver design, aside from replacing the analog form of modulation with digital, the load has been left on the backs of receiver manufacturers to make digital look good. I know that Omega will be able to deal with that problem effectively, but will every other manufacturer? But throughout these arduous trials, there is still another, much more serious problem to face. That would be trying to maintain the public's interest in radio. AM is said to be dying because it is noisy and unreliable which, we all know to be hype. (I was going to say it's a bunch of crap!) Perhaps an honest interpretation of listenership on the drives will tell the tale of who listens to what and when. Will digital help. Perhaps, if the analog carrier can take where it wants to go. oops, we're back to analog again. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Nov 12 09:27:23 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Nov 2002 17:27:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 81710 invoked from network); 12 Nov 2002 17:27:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Nov 2002 17:27:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Nov 2002 17:27:23 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.177] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 12 Nov 2002 17:27:22 -0000 Date: Tue, 12 Nov 2002 17:27:19 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: "PHONY DIGITAL RADIO" Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1244 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > One would be that radio is being trashed generally by those who > look upon it as just an electronic billboard, rather than a public > entertainment medium which is paid for by advertising. Note that iBiquity is hyping up the ability of IBOC to display text and other information on the radio's display. Of course, this technology already exists on FM as RDS (Radio Data System), which is uncommon in North America, but is so universally popular in Europe that even the pirate stations transmit with RDS! And on the AM band, what is essentially an AM version of RDS *has* been developed, and it *is* compatible with C-Quam AM Stereo, but for some reason there was no real interest in it.... perhaps because some FM stations have found that an RDS display distracts the listener too much, and they don't want people to try to read a scrolling text display while they're driving. Thus, RDS is mostly used just to display the station's ID and a quick promo, such as "Magic 98.3 WMGQ Continuous Soft Rock". There are also some cases of FM stations using the RDS Program Type (PTY) tag in an incorrect manner to try to attract listners... such as a Family Radio religious station using a PTY tag of "Top 40" or "Classic Rock". From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Tue Nov 12 10:27:24 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Nov 2002 18:27:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 50178 invoked from network); 12 Nov 2002 18:27:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Nov 2002 18:27:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14202.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.144) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Nov 2002 18:27:23 -0000 Message-ID: <20021112182718.77716.qmail@web14202.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.45.202.244] by web14202.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 12 Nov 2002 10:27:18 PST Date: Tue, 12 Nov 2002 10:27:18 -0800 (PST) Subject: Digital line of BS To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio As I've said 100 times before, digital is not always better than analog. My analog cellphone far outperforms any digital phone in my area = 0.0% dropped calls. My analog audio quality is excellent compared to the tinny robot sound our local cellphones have. Does anybody else have better digital quality than we do here in Ohio? Here's where it stinks: our lovely cellphone industry (the same who helped pass the ECPA and ban radio scanners) convinced the FCC to allow them to 'abandon' all analog cellphone service within 5 years! How does that servce the public interest? Let's see, I lose my inexpensive $10 analog service and pay for a new digital phone, then have a plan with 5000 minutes more than I need each month for 4 times the price? I guess with Political Action Committees and lobbyists, Money doesn't talk at the FCC, it screams. __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? U2 on LAUNCH - Exclusive greatest hits videos http://launch.yahoo.com/u2 From wa2fnq@optonline.net Tue Nov 12 13:42:24 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: wa2fnq@optonline.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Nov 2002 21:42:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 64210 invoked from network); 12 Nov 2002 21:42:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Nov 2002 21:42:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.86) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Nov 2002 21:42:23 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.157] by n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 12 Nov 2002 21:42:22 -0000 Date: Tue, 12 Nov 2002 21:42:19 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Digital line of BS Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20021112182718.77716.qmail@web14202.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2051 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wa2fnq" X-Originating-IP: 64.236.235.240 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=60059615 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa2fnq --- In amstereoforum@y..., "John P." wrote: > As I've said 100 times before, digital is not always better than analog. My > analog cellphone far outperforms any digital phone in my area = 0.0% dropped > calls. My analog audio quality is excellent compared to the tinny robot sound > our local cellphones have. Does anybody else have better digital quality than > we do here in Ohio? > > Here's where it stinks: our lovely cellphone industry (the same who helped pass > the ECPA and ban radio scanners) convinced the FCC to allow them to 'abandon' > all analog cellphone service within 5 years! How does that servce the public > interest? Let's see, I lose my inexpensive $10 analog service and pay for a > new digital phone, then have a plan with 5000 minutes more than I need each > month for 4 times the price? > > I guess with Political Action Committees and lobbyists, Money doesn't talk at > the FCC, it screams. > > The problem is anytime you slap the word "digital" on something people think it's better. Probably due to the fact that everyone was impressed with the difference between those scratchy old 45s and CDs. Well that ain't the case. Those that think IBOC sounds better because it's digital are probably the same people who think the pictures they get from Direct TV or DISH are breathtaking. They're overcompressed, lack detail and contain a ton of artifacts. A good analog picture looks better. I know. In my end of the bussiness I see this every day. IBOC is no different. It's the same thing only with audio. So let's go digital just so we can say we're digital!! We've screwed TV up with all this crap....now let's mess up radio. Broadcasters should be concerned with delivering the best possible product they can first. Give us some good programming and the ratings might even go up too. What a concept. Jerry WA2FNQ > > __________________________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > U2 on LAUNCH - Exclusive greatest hits videos > http://launch.yahoo.com/u2 From amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk Tue Nov 12 16:03:15 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Nov 2002 00:03:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 51731 invoked from network); 13 Nov 2002 00:03:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Nov 2002 00:03:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.78) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Nov 2002 00:03:14 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.172] by n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Nov 2002 00:03:14 -0000 Date: Wed, 13 Nov 2002 00:03:13 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Personal DAB Radio Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 64 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Dave" X-Originating-IP: 217.148.41.18 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113985069 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereofan http://www.simplyradios.com/acatalog/Home_New_Products_121.html From evergreenterrace@buzzle.com Tue Nov 12 19:07:09 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: evergreenterrace@buzzle.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Nov 2002 03:07:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 2302 invoked from network); 13 Nov 2002 03:07:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Nov 2002 03:07:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.66) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Nov 2002 03:07:08 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.135] by n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Nov 2002 03:06:59 -0000 Date: Wed, 13 Nov 2002 03:06:58 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: IBOC Close Ups Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 134 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgliradio" X-Originating-IP: 170.20.11.59 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=69711087 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgliradio Some Ibiquity close ups http://www.wor710.com/Engineering/iboc/ibocscreen.jpg http://www.wor710.com/Engineering/iboc/ibocgear.jpg From rwagoner@cox.net Wed Nov 13 00:17:57 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner@cox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Nov 2002 08:17:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 40961 invoked from network); 13 Nov 2002 08:17:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Nov 2002 08:17:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.64) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Nov 2002 08:17:55 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.169] by n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Nov 2002 08:17:55 -0000 Date: Wed, 13 Nov 2002 08:17:52 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: "PHONY DIGITAL RADIO" Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2149 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Richard Wagoner" X-Originating-IP: 68.4.33.253 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=96123889 X-Yahoo-Profile: richardalanwagoner > > But throughout these arduous trials, there is still another, much > more serious problem to face. That would be trying to maintain the > public's interest in radio. AM is said to be dying because it is > noisy and unreliable which, we all know to be hype. (I was going to > say it's a bunch of crap!) Perhaps an honest interpretation of > listenership on the drives will tell the tale of who listens to what > and when. Will digital help. Perhaps, if the analog carrier can take > where it wants to go. oops, we're back to analog again. One of the frustrations I have had over the years in writing my radio column is the fact that programmers in general are ignorant and many AM programmers are morons. I was told years ago that you shouldn't try to program anything of mass-appeal quality on AM because if its successful, then it will be copied on FM and you will lose your audience. That came from a MAJOR AM programmer of the time, I THINK with WLS. although I may be wrong. From my observations, people didn't leave AM. Most people listen on clock radios, portables, etc., or bad car stereos. They couldn't tell a real difference in audio quality ... if they even cared. But programmers put such crap on AM, then added so many commercials, that they drove listeners away from AM and onto FM. I firmly believe that if you put something of quality on AM, people would flock to it. Remember, it took Walter Sabo and his game zone/car tunes to destroy KFRC in San Francisco, which until he came aboard, was the top-rated music station in town. And that was 1985! One year of Sabo and the station was reduced to rubbish ... people were FORCED away from such bad programming. And KHJ was on an upswing when corporate forced it to go country in 1981. I can't figure out why, when so many AMs lose money (or barely break even), there aren't freeform stations taking hold just as FM freeform stations took over FM when THEY were all losing money. Seems a no-brainer to me. Decent programming could make AM hip easily ... especially to young kids who don't want to listen to the band that the boring adults listen to ... Richard Wagoner From dav259@csiro.au Wed Nov 13 01:09:30 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Nov 2002 09:09:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 23507 invoked from network); 13 Nov 2002 09:09:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Nov 2002 09:09:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Nov 2002 09:09:27 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAD99QP02728 for ; Wed, 13 Nov 2002 20:09:26 +1100 (EST) Date: Wed, 13 Nov 2002 20:09:26 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: "PHONY DIGITAL RADIO" In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public On Wed, 13 Nov 2002, Richard Wagoner wrote: > I firmly believe that if you put something of quality on AM, people > would flock to it. [snip] > > I can't figure out why, when so many AMs lose money (or barely break > even), there aren't freeform stations taking hold just as FM freeform > stations took over FM when THEY were all losing money. Seems a > no-brainer to me. Decent programming could make AM hip easily ... > especially to young kids who don't want to listen to the band that the > boring adults listen to ... In Melbourne's recent survey #7 two out of the top three stations were AM stations entirely due to good programming! Of course the footy finals, Spring Racing (Melbourne Cup) Carnival, and Bali bombing helped - but automated FM stations pay lip service to these things. The strange thing is that Clear Channel's Gold-FM came in fourth. And the only reason I can see for it is that the other four commercial FM stations all sound pretty much the boring careful same. Clear Channel's other station (thank God they're only allowed two!) MIX-FM is consistently beaten by AM stereo Magic 693. I'd venture to say that if MIX stole Magic's formula they wouldn't increase much if at all - as like Richard says I don't think the majority of listeners are as discerning as we are. Magic has gradually built up a solid loyal audience since its launch in 1994. People will listen to what they like particularly when it's consistent and provides a local service to the community it serves. It's a pity the masses aren't demanding better audio quality. Here it's only a widely help perception that FM audio has the edge. But thankfully programming is still Number One. And with radio - that's the way it should be. Ian Victorian Radio Network News From mychucky@funport.net Wed Nov 13 07:11:59 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: mychucky@funport.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Nov 2002 15:11:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 16445 invoked from network); 13 Nov 2002 15:11:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Nov 2002 15:11:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.funport.com) (216.199.19.6) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Nov 2002 15:11:58 -0000 Received: from FatMusic2000 ([]) by mail.funport.com (Merak 5.3.2) with SMTP id JFB36580 for ; Wed, 13 Nov 2002 10:11:59 -0500 Message-ID: <007b01c28b27$02400290$1400a8c0@FatMusic2000> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: "PHONY DIGITAL RADIO" Date: Wed, 13 Nov 2002 10:11:56 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=85836819 X-Yahoo-Profile: mychucky1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Look for a Radio Disney station what is mentioned here is happening on AM for them. ----- Original Message ----- From: Richard Wagoner To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, November 13, 2002 3:17 AM Subject: {AMSF} Re: "PHONY DIGITAL RADIO" > > But throughout these arduous trials, there is still another, much > more serious problem to face. That would be trying to maintain the > public's interest in radio. AM is said to be dying because it is > noisy and unreliable which, we all know to be hype. (I was going to > say it's a bunch of crap!) Perhaps an honest interpretation of > listenership on the drives will tell the tale of who listens to what > and when. Will digital help. Perhaps, if the analog carrier can take > where it wants to go. oops, we're back to analog again. One of the frustrations I have had over the years in writing my radio column is the fact that programmers in general are ignorant and many AM programmers are morons. I was told years ago that you shouldn't try to program anything of mass-appeal quality on AM because if its successful, then it will be copied on FM and you will lose your audience. That came from a MAJOR AM programmer of the time, I THINK with WLS. although I may be wrong. From my observations, people didn't leave AM. Most people listen on clock radios, portables, etc., or bad car stereos. They couldn't tell a real difference in audio quality ... if they even cared. But programmers put such crap on AM, then added so many commercials, that they drove listeners away from AM and onto FM. I firmly believe that if you put something of quality on AM, people would flock to it. Remember, it took Walter Sabo and his game zone/car tunes to destroy KFRC in San Francisco, which until he came aboard, was the top-rated music station in town. And that was 1985! One year of Sabo and the station was reduced to rubbish ... people were FORCED away from such bad programming. And KHJ was on an upswing when corporate forced it to go country in 1981. I can't figure out why, when so many AMs lose money (or barely break even), there aren't freeform stations taking hold just as FM freeform stations took over FM when THEY were all losing money. Seems a no-brainer to me. Decent programming could make AM hip easily ... especially to young kids who don't want to listen to the band that the boring adults listen to ... Richard Wagoner Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Nov 13 10:01:01 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Nov 2002 18:01:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 67786 invoked from network); 13 Nov 2002 18:01:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Nov 2002 18:01:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.122) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Nov 2002 18:01:00 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 13 Nov 2002 10:01:00 -0800 To: References: <004f01c289ba$3857dd80$0701010a@keva> Subject: Re: {AMSF} thundersnow! Date: Wed, 13 Nov 2002 12:49:36 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 13 Nov 2002 18:01:00.0422 (UTC) FILETIME=[9FC07A60:01C28B3E] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.133.157.182] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Michael J. Richard wrote: >And apparently the we took a lightening hit here at the station. Don't feel too bad, The Oscillator board got killed in the main Harris SX1 transmitter. You would not believe how hard it is to find 220 Ohm 2Watt Carbon Film Resistors around here! That is all I need to get that board back in service. Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Wed Nov 13 10:03:46 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Nov 2002 18:03:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 82339 invoked from network); 13 Nov 2002 18:03:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Nov 2002 18:03:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14203.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.145) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Nov 2002 18:03:45 -0000 Message-ID: <20021113180345.27691.qmail@web14203.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.45.202.244] by web14203.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 13 Nov 2002 10:03:45 PST Date: Wed, 13 Nov 2002 10:03:45 -0800 (PST) Subject: Personal DAB radio in UK To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio It would appear that the DAB radio band III in the UK uses our VHF TV channels #7 thru #13? Pretty poor battery life too - just 6 hours? __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? U2 on LAUNCH - Exclusive greatest hits videos http://launch.yahoo.com/u2 From philipr@irac.pe.ca Wed Nov 13 10:05:40 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Nov 2002 18:05:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 92263 invoked from network); 13 Nov 2002 18:05:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Nov 2002 18:05:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Nov 2002 18:05:40 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.170] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Nov 2002 18:05:37 -0000 Date: Wed, 13 Nov 2002 18:05:35 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: DAB hits Ottawa Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 681 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking Newsflash - the CRTC has just approved several transistional DAB undertakings for the Ottawa area. Here is one example: http://www.crtc.gc.ca/archive/ENG/Decisions/2002/db2002-360.htm Don't expect to be able to drive from Ottawa to Toronto, or Ottawa to Montreal, and be able to listen to DAB all the way. Apparently, Industry Canada hasn't even allocated any frequencies yet for the Ottawa Valley. Doesn't look like DAB will be a big hit with commuters, until the many holes in coverage get filled in. However, I'm sure there will be lots of folks in downtown Ottawa eager to go to there local Radio Shack and pay $300, plus tax, for an FM/DAB pocket radio. Phil R. From fanfare@globility.com Wed Nov 13 11:13:09 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Nov 2002 19:13:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 98273 invoked from network); 13 Nov 2002 19:13:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Nov 2002 19:13:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.69) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Nov 2002 19:13:08 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.157] by n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Nov 2002 19:13:08 -0000 Date: Wed, 13 Nov 2002 19:13:06 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: DAB hits Ottawa Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2446 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Marv Southcott" X-Originating-IP: 64.56.234.179 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Phil Rafuse" wrote: > Newsflash - the CRTC has just approved several transistional DAB > undertakings for the Ottawa area. > > Here is one example: > > http://www.crtc.gc.ca/archive/ENG/Decisions/2002/db2002-360.htm > > Don't expect to be able to drive from Ottawa to Toronto, or Ottawa > to Montreal, and be able to listen to DAB all the way. Apparently, > Industry Canada hasn't even allocated any frequencies yet for the > Ottawa Valley. > > Doesn't look like DAB will be a big hit with commuters, until the > many holes in coverage get filled in. > > However, I'm sure there will be lots of folks in downtown Ottawa > eager to go to there local Radio Shack and pay $300, plus tax, for > an FM/DAB pocket radio. > > Phil R. DAB in Toronto reaches about 18 miles right now, Phil. Not much of an incentive for the typical commuter. They can get their favorite AM or FM station easily 50 miles during the day. Perhaps its a little noisier a night. You can guess there's going to be a lot of repeaters needed to give that system the coverage it needs. However, if they ever did implement that, I understand it could well develop into what digital is supposed to be all about. As for Ottawa and DAB, I dunno. With its civil service citizenry being noted for their practicality, ponying up big bucks for experimental radio equipment is rather more wishful thinking than anything else. As for JP's comment about the UK and their DAB operating frequency, they are now on the optimum design frequency for Eureka 147. Canada could not get those frequencies, which is the reason why they's on L Band. Although, the TV freq's change here as too and Canadian DAB may find itself down there as well. That's because there a lot of government and industry proponents for it up here. The problem is, as everywhere else, manufacturers are not yet getting the appropriate signs from the buying public yet. I guess its because, no matter what they are offering, you have to give up something else to get it, and what you're getting is not so remarkably better. As a manufacturer, I have yet to see it been reported that the public are "demanding" digital broadcasting. Perhaps that's why we haven't seen a repeat of an earlier comment that merchants were concerned about having empty rack space next year because the DAB mandating process was not moving quickly enough. M. From michaelj@vcn.com Wed Nov 13 11:45:52 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Nov 2002 19:45:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 376 invoked from network); 13 Nov 2002 19:45:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Nov 2002 19:45:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m1-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Nov 2002 19:45:50 -0000 Received: from michael (vcn52.usrtc-1.evan.wy.vcn.com [209.193.86.56]) by m1-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Wed, 13 Nov 2002 12:45:49 -0700 To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} Re: DAB hits Ottawa Date: Wed, 13 Nov 2002 12:44:53 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) In-Reply-To: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Importance: Normal From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I agree with Marv's comments. I feel like the FCC is forcing this stuff down our throats. I'm still upalled at the whole digital TV situation and the way they "mandated" that all TV stations be digital by a certain date. So I guess that means they plan to FORCE tv stations to turn off their analog signals. How is 78-year-old Mrs. Jones going to feel when she can no longer watch "The Young and the Restless" because all of a sudden her analog TV is obselete??? If her TV died, she knows that she could go to Wal-Mart and get another TV for less than $100. Are you telling me that when analog TV goes obselete, we'll be able to go buy a digital TV for less than $100? I don't THINK so! So why do they think we will all have no problem with digital radio? I can go to wal-mart and get a cheapy analog clock radio or walkman for less than 10 bucks!! So can any of the other billions of americans. And we're all happy with the way that FM and AM are right now. I didn't hear anyone bitching about the way that FM sounds these days. Hey, it works with ANY FM radio that's out there right now. Now then, YEAH.....manufacturers could add some more bandwidth to improve the sound of AM radios manufactured nowadays (Thank you Marv!) but otherwise any AM radio out there right now will receive AM. No one's bitching. I just don't understand them. "But Michael, it's DIGITAL!!!!" LMAO! Okay....who the hell said digital was better???? I could include a list of the cuss words that I use every time my DIGITAL Verizon cell phone drops my call or makes me sound like a robot or like I'm swimming underwater. I get dropped calls all the time. When they were analog, I NEVER got a dropped call unless I completely lost the signal. Meanwhile I'm sitting here in good ol' Evanston with 5 lines of signal on my DIGITAL cell phone.....I'm talking to a customer.....and BEEP BEEP...SIGNAL FADED....CALL LOST. Why? Who knows! Digital isn't always better. Because and ONLY because I am an engineering type and I notice, can I tell that a CD has a little more clarity than FM radio. But I guarantee ya that most of the general public thinks FM is just as clear as a CD. Sure if you go around a hill you'll get some static, but I'd rather get a little "fuzz" on my signal tha n s ... oun.....d........lik.e...th.isss.....and have packet loss and sound like my modem connection isn't fast enough to receive a good signal. So I'm expected to go spend HUNDREDS...even a THOUSAND dollars on a new radio for my car or a new walkman just so I can say "Hey, I GOT DIGITAL!!!!!". No thanks! You said it perfectly Marv. "The public isn't DEMANDING digital." Instead it's being shoved down our throats by some ignorant yo-yo's at the FCC that are now even RICHER from taking bribes from Ibiquity. I just don't get it. I didn't ask for digital. No one did. It's not broke. Why are they trying to fix it?? Even AM can sound great if the manufacturers would just do it. It's already taken care of on the broadcasters' end. No broadcasters are limiting their bandwidth to 4 or 5 khz. We're ALL broadcasting 10khz audio. How's this question: Is it cheaper for a manufacturer to design and build an all-new radio with all components included to receive digital? Or is it cheaper to use a different ceramic filter, AMS (via the Symphony or Phillips chipsets) and add this to the existing designs. Check this out......good example for the marketing teams. If you went into Wal-Mart and saw a box for this new CD/Cassette/AM/FM boombox type radio and on the box was written "NEW! Now includes Enhanced AM!! AM that sounds so good you won't believe it's AM!" would you buy it? I know I'd give it a whirl. Especially if the display model was sitting on the shelf tuned into an AM station and I actually got to HEAR it. I'd say WOW!!! I even think we could turn this whole thing around! Kinda like the "AMax" thing. Let's invent a new standard called "Enhanced AM!". There is only ONE way to do it (not 15 different systems). Use the CQuam method of AM stereo and all the AMax specs. I can even hear myself announcing on the air "Here on KEVA. 1240 AM Stereo..now broadcasting with new enhanced AM technology!" Wouldn't this work? Why not? I think it would and I think it's MUCH cheaper for the consumer AND the broadcaster than ANY of this digital crap. We didn't ask for digital and I think it is extremely communistic and reminds me of Adolf Hitler when the government is shoving something down our throats and telling us "you WILL like it and you WILL use it". Phew! Didn't know I had that much of a rant bone in me! Michael n Wyoming (in AM STEREO!) Gee Mike....tell us how you REALLY feel! :) As for Ottawa and DAB, I dunno. With its civil service citizenry being noted for their practicality, ponying up big bucks for experimental radio equipment is rather more wishful thinking than anything else. The problem is, as everywhere else, manufacturers are not yet getting the appropriate signs from the buying public yet. I guess its because, no matter what they are offering, you have to give up something else to get it, and what you're getting is not so remarkably better. As a manufacturer, I have yet to see it been reported that the public are "demanding" digital broadcasting. M. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Nov 13 12:17:20 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Nov 2002 20:17:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 66586 invoked from network); 13 Nov 2002 20:17:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Nov 2002 20:17:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Nov 2002 20:17:19 -0000 Received: from me (208-38-89-237.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.237]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gADKHFTE001557 for ; Wed, 13 Nov 2002 14:17:16 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <001801c28b51$b8352e20$d3a9fea9@me> To: References: <004f01c289ba$3857dd80$0701010a@keva> Subject: Re: {AMSF} thundersnow! Date: Wed, 13 Nov 2002 14:17:39 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Digikey, Mouser, and some of the other larger parts houses have resistor kits. It's worth your while to have some of these on hand for both prototyping and repair. Scott Todd PS- motherboard on this computer is intermittant. Will be off line some more until it gets fixed, hopefully early next week, worst case. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Possum Hunter" > Don't feel too bad, The Oscillator board got killed in the main Harris SX1 > transmitter. You would not believe how hard it is to find 220 Ohm 2Watt > Carbon Film Resistors around here! That is all I need to get that board back > in service. From michaelj@vcn.com Wed Nov 13 12:28:09 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Nov 2002 20:28:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 15824 invoked from network); 13 Nov 2002 20:28:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Nov 2002 20:28:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m2-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.32) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Nov 2002 20:28:08 -0000 Received: from michael (vcn52.usrtc-1.evan.wy.vcn.com [209.193.86.56]) by m2-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Wed, 13 Nov 2002 13:28:07 -0700 To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} thundersnow! Date: Wed, 13 Nov 2002 13:27:11 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) In-Reply-To: <001801c28b51$b8352e20$d3a9fea9@me> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Importance: Normal From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Scott Good luck with your machine and motherboard! Here at the shop I have lots of spare motherboards....most of them used....taken from machines that have been upgraded. Most are AMD and Pentium II and III boards in the 300-500 Mhz range. Anything like that useful to you? Motherboard replacement is farely easy, although it can be tricky to get the right drivers installed for all of the onboard chips (IDE, sound, video) on the board. By the way, do you still want that Ford radio? I am SO sorry...I guess I kinda forgot about it. If you still want it, it is yours. Just let me know! Meanwhile back at the radio ranch, Gentner hybird is fixed. Had to change out a few resistors that got blown from the lightning. Meanwhile the Motorola AM Stereo monitor isn't fixed yet, but a replacement IC is on the way and will be here tomorrow. Wow...I almost feel like an engineer! :) MJR n WYO -----Original Message----- From: Scott Todd [mailto:stodd@sherbtel.net] Sent: Wednesday, November 13, 2002 1:18 PM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} thundersnow! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Wed Nov 13 12:28:09 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Nov 2002 20:28:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 29531 invoked from network); 13 Nov 2002 20:28:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Nov 2002 20:28:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14206.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.173.70) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Nov 2002 20:28:08 -0000 Message-ID: <20021113202808.29644.qmail@web14206.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.45.202.244] by web14206.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 13 Nov 2002 12:28:08 PST Date: Wed, 13 Nov 2002 12:28:08 -0800 (PST) Subject: "Digital Radio" from Design News magazine To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio http://www.manufacturing.net/dn/index.asp?layout=articleCurrentWeb&articleid=CA253880 I read this at the office in Design News magazine - looks like Motorola is doing a respectable job of staying in the fray for now. Let's hope Omega can join the pile soon! __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? U2 on LAUNCH - Exclusive greatest hits videos http://launch.yahoo.com/u2 From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Nov 13 12:32:00 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Nov 2002 20:32:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 61467 invoked from network); 13 Nov 2002 20:32:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Nov 2002 20:32:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.86) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Nov 2002 20:32:00 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.140] by n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Nov 2002 20:31:59 -0000 Date: Wed, 13 Nov 2002 20:31:58 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Planned AM Stereo station in NJ needs help Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3DC9961F.266AE357@skyweb.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 670 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amstereodude" X-Originating-IP: 208.38.89.237 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Daytime only? I thought the FCC quit issuing those over 20 years ago. Scott Todd --- In amstereoforum@y..., Neal Newman wrote: > I wish they didn't Do that.. Because I have retained a consultant. to try > and License a > station on 1580 For daytime Only at 500 watts.up in North jersey . this > Bites me in the Butt... > > "Kevin T." wrote: > > > I got this in e-mail...... > > > > From: carlvanorden@w... (Carl Vanorden) > > Date: Wed, Nov 6, 2002, 3:38pm > > Subject: NJRM announcement > > > > Hi Everyone! > > > > The New Jersey Radio Museum has applied with the FCC to establish a > > low powered radio station in the Town of Dover, NJ. From jsgil@hal-pc.org Wed Nov 13 13:09:50 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Nov 2002 21:09:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 65320 invoked from network); 13 Nov 2002 21:09:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Nov 2002 21:09:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.66) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Nov 2002 21:09:50 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.176] by n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Nov 2002 21:09:42 -0000 Date: Wed, 13 Nov 2002 21:09:41 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: "PHONY DIGITAL RADIO" Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1623 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.9 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Richard Wagoner" wrote: > I was told years ago that you shouldn't try > to program anything of mass-appeal quality on AM because if its > successful, then it will be copied on FM and you will lose your > audience. That came from a MAJOR AM programmer of the time, I THINK > with WLS. although I may be wrong. > > Richard Wagoner Funny you should bring this up because this is exactly what happened to our classic rock station on AM. Classic Rock 1070 KRBE, owned by Susquehanna, advertized itself as the first classic rock station in the nation. Whetner or not this was true at the time I don't know but they were the only C-QuAM station in town. They were spontaneous and reguarly took requests from the audience. In the morning they had "Breakfast in Bed with the Dead" which played several selections of Grateful Dead. There was good audience participation which made the public feel like they were a part of the whole radio process. This station became so popular that it drew a large audience from the FM stations. After a couple of years an FM station was started up to compete with it called Z107. Unfortunadely from the very start it suffered from the same disease that all FM stations suffer from, that is a limited playlist of monotinous programming. Even though the programming nowhere matched the AM station it eventually won out and the AM station switched formats. This would of never happened if there was good market saturation of AMAX quality receivers since the lack thereof was the determining factor in the listeners migrating to the FM stations. JSG From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Nov 13 13:25:12 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Nov 2002 21:25:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 15233 invoked from network); 13 Nov 2002 21:25:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Nov 2002 21:25:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Nov 2002 21:25:11 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.134] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Nov 2002 21:25:10 -0000 Date: Wed, 13 Nov 2002 21:25:09 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: KLAC Los Angeles Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 860 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amstereodude" X-Originating-IP: 208.38.89.237 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Don't bet on the stereo returning. Chances are the stereo equipment has been removed, and they don't add it back. While they don't necessarily require AMS be removed at any successful AMS station they buy, once it's out of the loop, I've never seen them put it back in. It might be worth your while to call them and see if they still have it and if they'd part with it. I hope to get a lot of CC's dust- gathering AMS equipment from this region. Scott Todd (posting while the computer is still running. Once I turn it back off it'll likely be impossible to reset.) Engergizer Bunny arrested- charged with battery. KLAC sounded great in AMAX stereo, but it was turned > off long ago. It will be interesting to see if it will indeed change > back to music and if so, if it remains mono, fires up the stereo, or > goes IBOC. > > Richard Wagoner From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Nov 13 14:05:46 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Nov 2002 22:05:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 36749 invoked from network); 13 Nov 2002 22:05:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Nov 2002 22:05:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.67) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Nov 2002 22:05:45 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.163] by n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Nov 2002 22:05:35 -0000 Date: Wed, 13 Nov 2002 22:05:32 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} thundersnow! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 528 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amstereodude" X-Originating-IP: 208.38.89.237 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Yep, still interested in the Ford radio. Please send it to me c/o my work address- KKMS, 2110 Cliff Rd., Eagan MN 55122. As far as the mb is concerned, I'm using a Duron 700MHz P-4 equivalent processor, so I'll be getting the same kind of board I have now. I suspect the board was bad from the beginning, but it didn't act up consistently until now. Scott By the way, > do you still want that Ford radio? I am SO sorry...I guess I kinda forgot > about it. If you still want it, it is yours. Just let me know! > From wa2fnq@optonline.net Wed Nov 13 14:18:11 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: wa2fnq@optonline.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Nov 2002 22:18:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 88273 invoked from network); 13 Nov 2002 22:18:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Nov 2002 22:18:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.68) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Nov 2002 22:18:10 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.250] by n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Nov 2002 22:18:10 -0000 Date: Wed, 13 Nov 2002 22:18:09 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: "Digital Radio" from Design News magazine Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20021113202808.29644.qmail@web14206.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 607 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wa2fnq" X-Originating-IP: 64.236.235.240 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=60059615 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa2fnq As much as Ibiquity doesn't want to admit it Motorola is still a big player. Let's hope they do good. Jerry WA2FNQ --- In amstereoforum@y..., "John P." wrote: > http://www.manufacturing.net/dn/index.asp? layout=articleCurrentWeb&articleid=CA253880 > > I read this at the office in Design News magazine - looks like Motorola is > doing a respectable job of staying in the fray for now. Let's hope Omega can > join the pile soon! > > __________________________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > U2 on LAUNCH - Exclusive greatest hits videos > http://launch.yahoo.com/u2 From michaelj@vcn.com Wed Nov 13 14:24:18 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Nov 2002 22:24:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 56703 invoked from network); 13 Nov 2002 22:24:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Nov 2002 22:24:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m3-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.33) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Nov 2002 22:24:17 -0000 Received: from michael (vcn52.usrtc-1.evan.wy.vcn.com [209.193.86.56]) by m3-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Wed, 13 Nov 2002 15:24:11 -0700 To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} thundersnow! Date: Wed, 13 Nov 2002 15:23:00 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) In-Reply-To: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Importance: Normal From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Yep! They do that. I've built a lot of Duron 700 machines. I can't even get them from my distributor anymore. Lowest I can get is Duron 1.3Ghz. Best of luck, and I really WILL get that AMS radio sent to ya! MJR n WYO -----Original Message----- From: amstereodude [mailto:stodd@sherbtel.net] Sent: Wednesday, November 13, 2002 3:06 PM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} thundersnow! I suspect the board was bad from the beginning, but it didn't act up consistently until now. Scott [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From groucho@skyweb.net Wed Nov 13 14:54:59 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Nov 2002 22:54:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 81365 invoked from network); 13 Nov 2002 22:54:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Nov 2002 22:54:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Nov 2002 22:54:57 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gADMvo4v034693 for ; Wed, 13 Nov 2002 17:57:51 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DD2D828.1EE670F0@skyweb.net> Date: Wed, 13 Nov 2002 17:54:32 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Planned AM Stereo station in NJ needs help References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 could not hurt to try.. worst they could do is deny the application and we try again.... still working on it.... amstereodude wrote: > Daytime only? I thought the FCC quit issuing those over 20 years > ago. > > Scott Todd > > --- In amstereoforum@y..., Neal Newman wrote: > > I wish they didn't Do that.. Because I have retained a > consultant. to try > > and License a > > station on 1580 For daytime Only at 500 watts.up in North jersey . > this > > Bites me in the Butt... > > > > "Kevin T." wrote: > > > > > I got this in e-mail...... > > > > > > From: carlvanorden@w... (Carl Vanorden) > > > Date: Wed, Nov 6, 2002, 3:38pm > > > Subject: NJRM announcement > > > > > > Hi Everyone! > > > > > > The New Jersey Radio Museum has applied with the FCC to establish > a > > > low powered radio station in the Town of Dover, NJ. > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk Wed Nov 13 15:46:38 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Nov 2002 23:46:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 83159 invoked from network); 13 Nov 2002 23:46:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Nov 2002 23:46:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Nov 2002 23:46:38 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.189] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Nov 2002 23:46:38 -0000 Date: Wed, 13 Nov 2002 23:46:34 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Personal DAB radio in UK Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20021113180345.27691.qmail@web14203.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 542 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Dave" X-Originating-IP: 217.148.41.156 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113985069 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereofan --- In amstereoforum@y..., "John P." wrote: > It would appear that the DAB radio band III in the UK uses our VHF TV channels > #7 thru #13? Pretty poor battery life too - just 6 hours? > It is the TV band III yes but the UK is about the only Country that does'nt use it. The last UK TV transmitters were swicthed off over 20 years ago. Re Battery life up until a few months ago the the DAB electronics drained so much power mains power was the only option. It's a great step forward in a very short time IMO. From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Nov 13 19:06:03 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Nov 2002 03:06:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 23364 invoked from network); 14 Nov 2002 03:06:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Nov 2002 03:06:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.201) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Nov 2002 03:06:02 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 13 Nov 2002 19:06:02 -0800 To: References: Subject: Daytimers Date: Wed, 13 Nov 2002 22:05:49 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 14 Nov 2002 03:06:02.0632 (UTC) FILETIME=[C3C9B880:01C28B8A] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.156.72.229] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 amstereodude wrote: > Daytime only? I thought the FCC quit issuing those over 20 years ago. No, it hasn't been too long ago when 40,000 Watt WBAJ-AM 890 kHz signed on the air. Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From dav259@csiro.au Wed Nov 13 20:06:43 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Nov 2002 04:06:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 32952 invoked from network); 14 Nov 2002 04:06:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Nov 2002 04:06:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Nov 2002 04:06:42 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAE46eP03322 for ; Thu, 14 Nov 2002 15:06:40 +1100 (EST) Date: Thu, 14 Nov 2002 15:06:40 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: amstereoforum Subject: RE: {AMSF} Re: DAB hits Ottawa In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public On Wed, 13 Nov 2002, Michael J. Richard wrote: > I'd say WOW!!! I even think we could turn this whole thing around! > Kinda like the "AMax" thing. Let's invent a new standard called > "Enhanced AM!". There is only ONE way to do it (not 15 different > systems). Use the CQuam method of AM stereo and all the AMax specs. > I can even hear myself announcing on the air "Here on KEVA. 1240 > AM Stereo..now broadcasting with new enhanced AM technology!" Nicely put Michael! We need to help educate the public with slogans like ... "Who wants to may big bucks for digital radio?" "For just an extra five bucks a set we want ENHANCED AM STEREO/FM STEREO." Why can't the blind mice at the NAB see the hole they're digging for the radio industry to fall into? From Tuesday's The Australian: Digital radio daze Australian digital radio seemed closer 10 years ago than it does today, says Russell Stendell, the ABC's head of radio development. [re. the current DAB trials] All radios will be supplied by the industry. Sixty receivers have been purchased from the UK, ranging in price from $700 to $2000 each. The trials mark the first time any country has asked consumers what they want from new radio services. Other countries have simply introduced the digital technology of their choice and watched it, at best, receive a vague welcome. Complete article at: http://australianit.news.com.au/articles/0,7204,5453664%5E15302%5E%5Enbv%5E,00.html From rwagoner@cox.net Wed Nov 13 23:19:22 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner@cox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Nov 2002 07:19:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 49300 invoked from network); 14 Nov 2002 07:19:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Nov 2002 07:19:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.88) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Nov 2002 07:19:22 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.129] by n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Nov 2002 07:19:21 -0000 Date: Thu, 14 Nov 2002 07:19:21 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: "PHONY DIGITAL RADIO" Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3023 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Richard Wagoner" X-Originating-IP: 68.4.33.253 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=96123889 X-Yahoo-Profile: richardalanwagoner Not necessarily true. The same thing happened among the FM "rockers" in Los Angeles: KLOS, the tight playlist station won out in the competition between them, KMET and KWST. Both KMET and KWST were far superior in programming, but KLOS got the ratings, eventually. Sometimes you don't know why a station loses momentum, but classic rock stations tend to have relatively fickle audiences (due to the burn factor of the format). I bet KRBE reacted to Z107 too much and lost listeners due to a combination of that and new-ness on the part of Z107. Had they stayed with it, once listeners got bored with Z107, I bet they would have come back, assuming that CR hasb't burned out as it has in most of the world. Heck, KLSX in LA had "classic rock" to itself for years, and its gone too (to talk). I still firmly believe that AM programmers forced people to FM. The typical FM radio has always "sounded better" than AM ... Why did it take until the mid 1980s for FM to take over? Was it perhaps the rush to talk and oldies in order to dominate those formats? The top-40 version of the Mighty 690 (XTRA/Tijuana-San Diego) was the last format that had good ratings on that station. KRLA (1110 AM) declined when it went all-oldies instead of the mix of currents/oldies it had during the 1970s-early 1980s. KFRC dominated until top-40 was replaced from 9 am to 3 pm with Game Shows, followed by a focus on "car tunes." KEZY dropped off the ratings charts completely when they went all-news. AM listenership in general has declined exactly with the decline in music programming on the band. Sad, really. I hope the Fabulous 570 KLAC (if they do indeed go back to music) does exceedingly well so that perhaps others will follow. Richard > > Funny you should bring this up because this is exactly what happened > to our classic rock station on AM. Classic Rock 1070 KRBE, owned by > Susquehanna, advertized itself as the first classic rock station in > the nation. Whetner or not this was true at the time I don't know > but they were the only C-QuAM station in town. They were spontaneous > and reguarly took requests from the audience. In the morning they had > "Breakfast in Bed with the Dead" which played several selections > of Grateful Dead. There was good audience participation which made > the public feel like they were a part of the whole radio process. > This station became so popular that it drew a large audience from the > FM stations. After a couple of years an FM station was started up to > compete with it called Z107. Unfortunadely from the very start it > suffered from the same disease that all FM stations suffer from, that > is a limited playlist of monotinous programming. Even though the > programming nowhere matched the AM station it eventually won out and > the AM station switched formats. This would of never happened if there > was good market saturation of AMAX quality receivers since the lack > thereof was the determining factor in the listeners migrating to the > FM stations. > > JSG From philipr@irac.pe.ca Thu Nov 14 07:40:11 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Nov 2002 15:40:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 46127 invoked from network); 14 Nov 2002 15:40:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Nov 2002 15:40:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Nov 2002 15:40:06 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.180] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Nov 2002 15:40:04 -0000 Date: Thu, 14 Nov 2002 15:40:02 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Project Do A Good Deed [in stereo, sort of] Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2135 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking We need to get the message out to the public that stereo or mono, AM can sound good. Now, provided there is a popular local AM station, why not purchase say a GE SR III to give to some good person or organization where the radio will be played on AM and people will hear it. Let's say there is a mom and pop convenience store in your neighbourhood - you know, the really nice folks that let you put up posters for that lost dog or cat - salt of the earth people. They have the radio on in the store - and by golly, those folks listen to an AM music station. A gift of appreciation to them - an SR III, all set up to their favourite AM station. Then, anyone who walks into that store is going to hear great sounding AM. Maybe, if they have a PA system, you can wire it up so it can be patched in. Or, maybe a seniors home - to be placed in the common room. What about your office or business. Make sure you have an SR III on, so when the boss comes in he says - Gee Phil, I never knew CHTN could sound so good! Or your customers, if you're in retail. Very small steps, I know. Tilting at windmills, maybe. But, the more people that hear good AM, the better. If you know say a manager of a store that sells the SR III, why not tell them what a great product they are selling and suggest they set up a display, with one on. If they patch the radio through the PA, make sure its an SR III, tuned to an AM station - provided the manager likes the station! What have YOU done for AM radio, lately? All of us on this list have done our bit for AM - let's try, to the best of our ability, to do some more. Not everyone on this list can afford to buy and donate an SR III. But, for those of us who can afford one, and can identify someone who would really enjoy it and use it on AM, it is an act of kindness which also advances the cause of AM. Doing a good deed in stereo, sort of. Of course, if you have a popular local AM Stereo station, can convert a good sounding boombox or whatever, it would make a doubly nice gift! CHER's Phil R. [and no, 950 CHER Sydney NS is not AM Stereo, yet!] From philipr@irac.pe.ca Thu Nov 14 07:44:46 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Nov 2002 15:44:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 66947 invoked from network); 14 Nov 2002 15:44:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Nov 2002 15:44:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Nov 2002 15:44:45 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.142] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Nov 2002 15:44:44 -0000 Date: Thu, 14 Nov 2002 15:44:43 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: just in follow up... Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 602 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking Do we have someone with an artistic flare in the group who could design a logo, which could be available on the site to download and print on a good colour printer? The idea is to have our already snappy looking AM Stereo logo, as well as an equally attractive enhanced AM logo, which we can print up and affix to our great sounding radios, and attach to any we modify, donate etc. While a logo printed on ordinary paper may be a trifly tacky looking, using card stock, photo paper, laminating etc. may allow each of us to crank out some eye catching logos to go with the ear catching sound. From philipr@irac.pe.ca Thu Nov 14 07:52:22 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Nov 2002 15:52:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 308 invoked from network); 14 Nov 2002 15:52:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Nov 2002 15:52:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Nov 2002 15:52:22 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.142] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Nov 2002 15:52:21 -0000 Date: Thu, 14 Nov 2002 15:52:21 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: DAB hits Ottawa Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 693 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Michael J. Richard" wrote in part: Let's > invent a new standard called "Enhanced AM!". There is only ONE way to do it > (not 15 different systems). Use the CQuam method of AM stereo and all the > AMax specs. I can even hear myself announcing on the air "Here on KEVA. > 1240 AM Stereo..now broadcasting with new enhanced AM technology!" > Wouldn't this work? Why not? Michael, I agree 1000% percent. It should apply to AM Stereo and wideband AM mono. A new standard, with a snappy logo! Eye catching, to go with the ear catching sound. Otherwise, ordinary folks will just assume that the great sounding AM is just FM. Phil R. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Nov 14 07:53:40 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Nov 2002 15:53:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 52255 invoked from network); 14 Nov 2002 15:53:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Nov 2002 15:53:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.88) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Nov 2002 15:53:38 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.129] by n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Nov 2002 15:53:38 -0000 Date: Thu, 14 Nov 2002 15:53:36 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: just in follow up... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 817 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > The idea is to have our already snappy looking AM Stereo logo, as > well as an equally attractive enhanced AM logo, which we can print > up and affix to our great sounding radios, and attach to any we > modify, donate etc. I think the official AMAX and AMAX Stereo logos are probably the best to use, since they would provide continuity with an existing system of promotion for high-qualiy AM and AM Stereo radios. However, I can agree that something new would be even better to use. I'm no graphical wizard, but I'll see what I can do. The trick is to create it as a vector image, so that the "jaggies" are not visible when printed. The original AM Stereo logo that I did, which you see on the home page of this group, is a bitmap image so it will obviously look computer-generated when you print it. From michaelj@vcn.com Thu Nov 14 07:58:39 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Nov 2002 15:58:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 82476 invoked from network); 14 Nov 2002 15:58:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Nov 2002 15:58:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m1-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.31) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Nov 2002 15:58:38 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m1-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Thu, 14 Nov 2002 08:58:36 -0700 Message-ID: <002d01c28bf6$b0186680$0701010a@keva> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} just in follow up... Date: Thu, 14 Nov 2002 08:58:28 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit As much as I'd love to design something or come up with something I think Kevin T took over those duties a long time ago. The am stereo website has what he'd probably call our "official" logos and such. So I guess it's already been done. Don't want to step on anyone's toes or hurt any feelings although I'm working on an updated logo for us here at KEVA with AM STEREO in the name. I wish I would have had it done sooner......we just had a buttload of phone book covers printed up to be distributed all over town. They all have the old logo that doesn't mention AM STEREO. MJR n WYO ----- Original Message ----- From: Phil Rafuse To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, November 14, 2002 8:44 AM Subject: {AMSF} just in follow up... Do we have someone with an artistic flare in the group who could design a logo, which could be available on the site to download and print on a good colour printer? The idea is to have our already snappy looking AM Stereo logo, as well as an equally attractive enhanced AM logo, which we can print up and affix to our great sounding radios, and attach to any we modify, donate etc. While a logo printed on ordinary paper may be a trifly tacky looking, using card stock, photo paper, laminating etc. may allow each of us to crank out some eye catching logos to go with the ear catching sound. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From michaelj@vcn.com Thu Nov 14 07:59:03 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Nov 2002 15:59:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 74734 invoked from network); 14 Nov 2002 15:59:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Nov 2002 15:59:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m1-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Nov 2002 15:59:03 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m1-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Thu, 14 Nov 2002 08:59:01 -0700 Message-ID: <003201c28bf6$be4e1880$0701010a@keva> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: just in follow up... Date: Thu, 14 Nov 2002 08:58:58 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit beat me to it ----- Original Message ----- From: Kevin T. To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, November 14, 2002 8:53 AM Subject: {AMSF} Re: just in follow up... > The idea is to have our already snappy looking AM Stereo logo, as > well as an equally attractive enhanced AM logo, which we can print > up and affix to our great sounding radios, and attach to any we > modify, donate etc. I think the official AMAX and AMAX Stereo logos are probably the best to use, since they would provide continuity with an existing system of promotion for high-qualiy AM and AM Stereo radios. However, I can agree that something new would be even better to use. I'm no graphical wizard, but I'll see what I can do. The trick is to create it as a vector image, so that the "jaggies" are not visible when printed. The original AM Stereo logo that I did, which you see on the home page of this group, is a bitmap image so it will obviously look computer-generated when you print it. Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From michaelj@vcn.com Thu Nov 14 08:07:05 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Nov 2002 16:07:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 4283 invoked from network); 14 Nov 2002 16:07:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Nov 2002 16:07:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m3-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.33) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Nov 2002 16:07:04 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m3-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Thu, 14 Nov 2002 09:07:03 -0700 Message-ID: <003a01c28bf7$de138780$0701010a@keva> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: DAB hits Ottawa Date: Thu, 14 Nov 2002 09:07:01 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit EXACTLY!! It has to be pointed out to, and obvious that it is AM that they are hearing. Otherwise, YES...they assume that the radio they are hearing is playing FM. With a snappy logo and such. I sorta agree with KT on the AMax thing.....but I guarantee you that to the average Joe consumer....if he sees a sticker or something with "AMax" written on it, he's gonna think "what the hell is AMax??" Whereas.....if he sees "Enhanced AM!" He'll have some sort of idea. yes, most of us know what AMax is.....but we're also not the average consumer or 20-something buyer. I say 20-something because anything younger than that are just kids and these days the kids are pretty much devoted to FM or CDs. My wife is 22 and absolutely REFUSES to listen to AM. Why? Because it's AM. Period! That's her theory. "I just don't! Who the hell listens to AM!?" She does NOW, but only because I'm on the air on an AM station. And since we've been married and she's heard the radio in MY car and my home tuners and stuff....even SHE now knows how good AM can sound. Yet still, she will not listen to it in her car because it sounds like CRAP! She has a 2001 Impala with the RDS / Cassette / CD radio. And the am on that thing is slightly better than telephone. Anyways....I'm rambling...back to our subject at hand. Like I said....AMax was wonderful....but the name has a lot to be desired. "Enhanced AM" tells people a lot more about what we're talking about than "AMax" does. MJR n WYO ----- Original Message ----- From: Phil Rafuse To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, November 14, 2002 8:52 AM Subject: {AMSF} Re: DAB hits Ottawa --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Michael J. Richard" wrote in part: Let's > invent a new standard called "Enhanced AM!". There is only ONE way to do it > (not 15 different systems). Use the CQuam method of AM stereo and all the > AMax specs. I can even hear myself announcing on the air "Here on KEVA. > 1240 AM Stereo..now broadcasting with new enhanced AM technology!" > Wouldn't this work? Why not? Michael, I agree 1000% percent. It should apply to AM Stereo and wideband AM mono. A new standard, with a snappy logo! Eye catching, to go with the ear catching sound. Otherwise, ordinary folks will just assume that the great sounding AM is just FM. Phil R. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Nov 14 09:55:26 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Nov 2002 17:55:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 76978 invoked from network); 14 Nov 2002 17:55:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Nov 2002 17:55:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Nov 2002 17:55:26 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.136] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Nov 2002 17:55:26 -0000 Date: Thu, 14 Nov 2002 17:55:25 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: DAB hits Ottawa Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <003a01c28bf7$de138780$0701010a@keva> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2346 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > I sorta agree with KT on the AMax thing.....but I guarantee you > that to the average Joe consumer....if he sees a sticker or > something with "AMax" written on it, he's gonna think "what the > hell is AMax??" Whereas.....if he sees "Enhanced AM!" He'll have > some sort of idea. The reason I support AMAX is because I am secretly embarking upon a campaign to promote AMAX as an alternative to IBOC (a.k.a. HD Radio) that offers proven real-world performance, quality, and cost- effectiveness. I am collecting AMAX receivers to use to make demonstration recordings of both "reference quality" sound from the Alfredo Lite transmitter as well as reception of real-world AM and AM Stereo signals at varying distances from the transmitter and reception conditions. This will be compiled onto a demo CD which I can churn out like popcorn and distribute to radio stations and receiver manufacturers as well as to the "average Joes and Janes" that you talk about. Of course the demo CD will also include comparisons to "regular" AM as well as IBOC in both analog and true digital mode, to make the advantages of AMAX and AMAX Stereo even more apparent. Meanwhile, I do recognize that there are a lot of radios out there that have excellent AM sound quality and reception but don't happen to officially meet the AMAX standards. In this case the AMAX Stereo logo can be edited to remove the "AX" part, leaving the same style of logo simply saying "AM Stereo", and also a version for monaural radios with the fancy "Stereo" script replaced with something like "Enhanced", as you say. But true AMAX and AMAX Stereo radios will still be promoted and labelled as such. After all, the new Fanfare tuner has the AMAX Stereo logo right on its front panel, so we shouldn't make their efforts lead to a dead-end if we were to drop use of the term "AMAX" (pronounced "Ay-Max") and what it stands for. p.s. If somebody would like to donate to me a Denon TU-680NAB, or one of the new Fanfare tuners, so that I can provide a true example of AMAX at its best, I would be more than happy to accept it. :-) Meanwhile I have the Chrysler and Delco AMAX car radios as well as the erstwhile Sony SRF-42 and GE Superadio III, all of which can provide very convincing demostrations of the benefits that AMAX and AMAX Stereo has to offer. From philipr@irac.pe.ca Thu Nov 14 12:54:31 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Nov 2002 20:54:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 87649 invoked from network); 14 Nov 2002 20:54:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Nov 2002 20:54:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.86) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Nov 2002 20:54:30 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.178] by n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Nov 2002 20:54:30 -0000 Date: Thu, 14 Nov 2002 20:54:28 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: DAB hits Ottawa Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2698 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking Sounds like a good strategy - keep the logos consistant. Are there any copyright issues on the AMAX logo? I'd love to have a demo CD when you're ready, to pass around at work. Phil R. --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin T." wrote: > > I sorta agree with KT on the AMax thing.....but I guarantee you > > that to the average Joe consumer....if he sees a sticker or > > something with "AMax" written on it, he's gonna think "what the > > hell is AMax??" Whereas.....if he sees "Enhanced AM!" He'll have > > some sort of idea. > > The reason I support AMAX is because I am secretly embarking upon a > campaign to promote AMAX as an alternative to IBOC (a.k.a. HD Radio) > that offers proven real-world performance, quality, and cost- > effectiveness. I am collecting AMAX receivers to use to make > demonstration recordings of both "reference quality" sound from the > Alfredo Lite transmitter as well as reception of real-world AM and > AM Stereo signals at varying distances from the transmitter and > reception conditions. > > This will be compiled onto a demo CD which I can churn out like > popcorn and distribute to radio stations and receiver manufacturers > as well as to the "average Joes and Janes" that you talk about. Of > course the demo CD will also include comparisons to "regular" AM as > well as IBOC in both analog and true digital mode, to make the > advantages of AMAX and AMAX Stereo even more apparent. > > Meanwhile, I do recognize that there are a lot of radios out there > that have excellent AM sound quality and reception but don't happen > to officially meet the AMAX standards. In this case the AMAX Stereo > logo can be edited to remove the "AX" part, leaving the same style of > logo simply saying "AM Stereo", and also a version for monaural > radios with the fancy "Stereo" script replaced with something > like "Enhanced", as you say. But true AMAX and AMAX Stereo radios > will still be promoted and labelled as such. After all, the new > Fanfare tuner has the AMAX Stereo logo right on its front panel, so > we shouldn't make their efforts lead to a dead-end if we were to drop > use of the term "AMAX" (pronounced "Ay-Max") and what it stands for. > > p.s. If somebody would like to donate to me a Denon TU-680NAB, or one > of the new Fanfare tuners, so that I can provide a true example of > AMAX at its best, I would be more than happy to accept it. :-) > Meanwhile I have the Chrysler and Delco AMAX car radios as well as > the erstwhile Sony SRF-42 and GE Superadio III, all of which can > provide very convincing demostrations of the benefits that AMAX and > AMAX Stereo has to offer. From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Nov 14 17:50:43 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Nov 2002 01:50:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 50318 invoked from network); 15 Nov 2002 01:50:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Nov 2002 01:50:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.41) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Nov 2002 01:50:42 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 14 Nov 2002 17:50:42 -0800 To: Subject: Re: Project Do A Good Deed [in stereo, sort of] Date: Thu, 14 Nov 2002 20:50:29 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 15 Nov 2002 01:50:42.0664 (UTC) FILETIME=[68171680:01C28C49] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.147.53.178] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Phil Rafuse" wrote: > Now, provided there is a popular local AM station, why not purchase say a GE SR III to give to some good person or organization where the radio will be played on AM and people will hear it. When you work at a small AM station, you end up doing many duties. This means your friendly broadcast engineer got tired of listening to the sales guys gripe and moan and got some rate cards and contracts and hit the streets selling ads! (and making commission) The station owner wants to see each salesperson bring in 15 new clients per month. I got 15 on my first day out! "What is the secret sales weapon?", you may ask. It is a GE Superadio III! When "Mr. Business Owner" hears how much BETTER his ad will sound on WFIS Vs. the other stations, I walk out with a signed contract and a check! I have Cool Edit Pro on my Laptop Computer, so I even let Mr. Business Owner record his own commercial if he wants. When I get back to the station, I just drop it into the Phantom II, and Mr. Business Owner is on the air. Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From bd6xray@lycos.com Thu Nov 14 19:53:16 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: bd6xray@lycos.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Nov 2002 03:53:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 84281 invoked from network); 15 Nov 2002 03:53:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Nov 2002 03:53:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Nov 2002 03:53:13 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.186] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Nov 2002 03:53:13 -0000 Date: Fri, 15 Nov 2002 03:53:12 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Daytimers Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 580 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bd6xray" X-Originating-IP: 152.163.189.99 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83174981 X-Yahoo-Profile: bd6xray --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Possum Hunter" wrote: > amstereodude wrote: > > Daytime only? I thought the FCC quit issuing those over 20 years ago. > > No, it hasn't been too long ago when 40,000 Watt WBAJ-AM 890 kHz signed on > the air. > > Long live FREE RADIO! > > Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ > Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation The FCC stopped accepting applications for new daytime only stations on Dec 1, 1987. WBAJ's first application was accepted on Sep 10, 1986. Al Hajny From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Nov 14 21:45:57 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Nov 2002 05:45:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 58865 invoked from network); 15 Nov 2002 05:45:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Nov 2002 05:45:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Nov 2002 05:45:57 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.175] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Nov 2002 05:45:57 -0000 Date: Fri, 15 Nov 2002 05:45:56 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Daytimers Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1779 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.71.130 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > The FCC stopped accepting applications for new daytime only stations > on Dec 1, 1987. However, there are some cases where old daytime-only stations went "dark" and then reappeared years later -- well after the 1987 cut-off -- as brand new daytime-only stations. One such case is 1170 WBRW (now known as WWTR) in Bridgewater, NJ. Its original incarnation (500-watts directional with CBS Audimax processing!) was on the air from 1970 to 1990. After it went dark and the towers were torn down, everyone thought they were gone for good. However, in 1993 a New York radio engineer bought the license to the defunct WBRW with plans to put it back on the air. He finally succeeded in February 1997 -- just hours before the cut-off of when "dark" stations would have their licenses permanently deleted. 1170 WBRW was reincarnated with all-new equipment and a 243-watt non-directional signal, which was entered in the FCC database as a "modification" to the original 500-watt license -- thus, what was essentially a brand new daytime-only AM station went on the air nearly a decade after the cut-off in 1987! Also, around 1995 or 1996, 50,000-watt 1010 WINS in New York City was expanding their directional signal pattern and bought out several neighboring stations to take them off the air to allow this. One of these was 1000 WRNJ in Hackettstown, NJ, which managed to reappear on 1510 kHz -- as another brand new daytime-only station. WRNJ was licensed for a flea-power nighttime signal from a separate transmitter site, but for several years they simply signed off at sunset (complete with the National Anthem and an invitation for listeners to tune in sister station 107.1 WRNJ-FM) until the nighttime site was finally built and put on the air. From ben@lennard.net.nz Fri Nov 15 00:31:50 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ben@lennard.net.nz X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Nov 2002 08:31:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 53548 invoked from network); 15 Nov 2002 08:31:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Nov 2002 08:31:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.69) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Nov 2002 08:31:49 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.157] by n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Nov 2002 08:31:48 -0000 Date: Fri, 15 Nov 2002 08:31:47 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: A good aerial system Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1069 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Ben" X-Originating-IP: 203.98.50.151 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=118503946 X-Yahoo-Profile: benlennard What ho folks! OK, I need to figure this out once and for all (esp if I get AMS going again in Crofton Downs). Bit of background: Eight Eighty Five (originally known as Triple 9) Would like to implement AMS full time (as well as our 88.5 FM frequency). However, the basic and sole reason we went FM in the end was: FM is so darn easy to implement, especially in terms of an Aerial system. But, AMS sounds so much better, and yours truely misses it! So, how does one implement a good and realiable AM Stero transmitter aerial???? I will be talking to Cliff this weekend to see how/if he has done any more tests with the AMS transmitter I gave him to experiment with King Country Radio. But still, I would love to reimplement AMS here (Chris, I will be in contact off list re this). BTW: Curently playing on 88.5 (and would sound better on 999): A very classic rock collection tonight: Boston, Loverboy, The Guess Who, Led Zep, Pink Floyd (Welcome to the Machine currently playing), etc... Requests, anyone?? cheers, Ben, Wellington, New Zealand. From KC4QLP@aol.com Fri Nov 15 00:55:01 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Nov 2002 08:54:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 81627 invoked from network); 15 Nov 2002 08:54:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Nov 2002 08:54:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d05.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Nov 2002 08:54:58 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.169.171ba31d (3842); Fri, 15 Nov 2002 03:54:55 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <169.171ba31d.2b06105e@aol.com> Date: Fri, 15 Nov 2002 03:54:54 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} A good aerial system To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Cc: ben@lennard.net.nz MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 11/15/02 3:38:25 AM Eastern Standard Time, ben@lennard.net.nz writes: > So, how does one implement a good and realiable AM Stero > transmitter aerial???? > > I will be talking to Cliff this weekend to see how/if he has done > any more tests with the AMS transmitter I gave him to experiment > with King Country Radio. > What frequency is this station on again? How close is the proposed station to a large body of water? I have found the key things to make an AM station cover great distances is one: ground conductivity and two:plenty of ground radials along with a good working radiator for what ever frequency you are on. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Nov 15 02:04:14 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Nov 2002 10:04:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 46304 invoked from network); 15 Nov 2002 10:04:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Nov 2002 10:04:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.87) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Nov 2002 10:04:14 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.151] by n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Nov 2002 10:04:14 -0000 Date: Fri, 15 Nov 2002 10:04:12 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: A good aerial system Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1846 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.71.130 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > BTW: Curently playing on 88.5 (and would sound better on 999): > A very classic rock collection tonight: Boston, Loverboy, The > Guess Who, Led Zep, Pink Floyd (Welcome to the Machine > currently playing), etc... Requests, anyone?? I recommend anything by Al Stewart... he's best known for his big 1976 hit "Year Of The Cat", which features a 35-second piano intro that is exclusively in the Left audio channel (and thus is great for testing/demonstrating Stereo separation!), but I think all of his songs are great. And of course, don't forget the epic "Bohemian Rhapsody" by Queen -- it's an excellent test of dynamic range, as even on the original 45 RPM single, its dynamics vary from full force at the brink of distortion, to just barely audible over the surface noise. That's strongly opposed to much of today's music, which is often so over- processed and over-compressed right on the CD, that the waveform graph ends up looking something like this: http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/souldec.gif That is the actual waveform graph of "Ooh It's Kinda Crazy" by the Canadian pop group "soulDecision", in case you would like to put it on your list of songs to avoid. Meanwhile, the widely Internet- shared "Rough Mix" (i.e. pre-mastering) of the current U.K. #1 hit "Unbreakable" by Westlife offers a far superior demonstration of proper dynamic range: http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/rough.gif Too bad on the actual CD/radio release, they ended up using a fully processed "Single Remix" version which ends up looking and sounding like this: http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/remix.gif For more discussion on this trend of "hypercompression" in today's music, check out the Usenet newsgroup "rec.audio.pro", accessible through a Usenet server or through http://www.google.com (click on "Groups"). From ben@lennard.net.nz Fri Nov 15 02:09:20 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ben@lennard.net.nz X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Nov 2002 10:09:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 30407 invoked from network); 15 Nov 2002 10:09:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Nov 2002 10:09:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO smtp-2.paradise.net.nz) (202.0.32.211) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Nov 2002 10:09:20 -0000 Received: from [203.79.65.90] (203-79-65-90.tnt8.paradise.net.nz [203.79.65.90]) by smtp-2.paradise.net.nz (Postfix) with ESMTP id 466959E4C0; Fri, 15 Nov 2002 23:09:19 +1300 (NZDT) User-Agent: Microsoft-Outlook-Express-Macintosh-Edition/5.02.2022 Date: Fri, 15 Nov 2002 23:09:45 +1300 Subject: Re: {AMSF} A good aerial system To: , Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <169.171ba31d.2b06105e@aol.com> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit From: Ben X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=118503946 X-Yahoo-Profile: benlennard >What frequency is this station on again? 999KHz >How close is the proposed station to a large body of water? Um... about 400meters from a local creek - although I don't think Wellington City Council would be too happy if I fed a cable to it... Oh, but during heavy rainy periods, my driveway does turn in to a river for a couple of days... ;-) >I have found the key things to make an AM station cover great distances is one: >ground conductivity and two:plenty of ground radials along with a good working >radiator for what ever frequency you are on. What are "ground radials" and "good working radiator" (will my Mitsubishi V6's radiator do?). ;-) Ben, Wellington, New Zealand (Currently playing Perl Jam - Black on our local station...). -- http://www.lennard.net.nz/ Ben Lennard, NCEE, Dip EE Electronics R&D Hm: +64 4 972 7567 Mb: +64 21 536 627 87 Spencer Street Crofton Downs Wellington New Zealand "To the optimist, the glass is half full. To the pessimist, the glass is half empty. To the engineer, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be." No animals were harmed in the transmission of this email, although the Dog next door is living on borrowed time, let me tell you! Those of you with an overwhelming fear of the unknown will be gratified to learn that there is no hidden message revealed by reading this warning backwards. From ben@lennard.net.nz Fri Nov 15 02:53:14 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ben@lennard.net.nz X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Nov 2002 10:53:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 72807 invoked from network); 15 Nov 2002 10:53:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Nov 2002 10:53:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Nov 2002 10:53:12 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.136] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Nov 2002 10:53:12 -0000 Date: Fri, 15 Nov 2002 10:53:12 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: A good aerial system Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2275 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Ben" X-Originating-IP: 203.98.50.151 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=118503946 X-Yahoo-Profile: benlennard Year of the Cat _ Specially for Spencer (My Cat), is cued and ready to go - great track! Sex Bomb (my theme tune - just quietly... - it's the Speedo's that does I think...), by Tom Jones is currently playing as we wind down the night to our Midnight to dawn "grave yard" shift... --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin T." wrote: > > BTW: Curently playing on 88.5 (and would sound better on 999): > > A very classic rock collection tonight: Boston, Loverboy, The > > Guess Who, Led Zep, Pink Floyd (Welcome to the Machine > > currently playing), etc... Requests, anyone?? > > I recommend anything by Al Stewart... he's best known for his big > 1976 hit "Year Of The Cat", which features a 35-second piano intro > that is exclusively in the Left audio channel (and thus is great for > testing/demonstrating Stereo separation!), but I think all of his > songs are great. > > And of course, don't forget the epic "Bohemian Rhapsody" by Queen -- > it's an excellent test of dynamic range, as even on the original > 45 RPM single, its dynamics vary from full force at the brink of > distortion, to just barely audible over the surface noise. That's > strongly opposed to much of today's music, which is often so over- > processed and over-compressed right on the CD, that the waveform > graph ends up looking something like this: > > http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/souldec.gif > > That is the actual waveform graph of "Ooh It's Kinda Crazy" by the > Canadian pop group "soulDecision", in case you would like to put it > on your list of songs to avoid. Meanwhile, the widely Internet- > shared "Rough Mix" (i.e. pre-mastering) of the current U.K. #1 hit > "Unbreakable" by Westlife offers a far superior demonstration of > proper dynamic range: > > http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/rough.gif > > Too bad on the actual CD/radio release, they ended up using a fully > processed "Single Remix" version which ends up looking and sounding > like this: > > http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/remix.gif > > For more discussion on this trend of "hypercompression" in today's > music, check out the Usenet newsgroup "rec.audio.pro", accessible > through a Usenet server or through http://www.google.com (click on > "Groups"). From ben@lennard.net.nz Fri Nov 15 02:56:52 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ben@lennard.net.nz X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Nov 2002 10:56:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 18284 invoked from network); 15 Nov 2002 10:56:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Nov 2002 10:56:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Nov 2002 10:56:52 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.182] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Nov 2002 10:56:52 -0000 Date: Fri, 15 Nov 2002 10:56:51 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: A good aerial system Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2275 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Ben" X-Originating-IP: 203.98.50.151 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=118503946 X-Yahoo-Profile: benlennard Year of the Cat _ Specially for Spencer (My Cat), is cued and ready to go - great track! Sex Bomb (my theme tune - just quietly... - it's the Speedo's that does I think...), by Tom Jones is currently playing as we wind down the night to our Midnight to dawn "grave yard" shift... --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin T." wrote: > > BTW: Curently playing on 88.5 (and would sound better on 999): > > A very classic rock collection tonight: Boston, Loverboy, The > > Guess Who, Led Zep, Pink Floyd (Welcome to the Machine > > currently playing), etc... Requests, anyone?? > > I recommend anything by Al Stewart... he's best known for his big > 1976 hit "Year Of The Cat", which features a 35-second piano intro > that is exclusively in the Left audio channel (and thus is great for > testing/demonstrating Stereo separation!), but I think all of his > songs are great. > > And of course, don't forget the epic "Bohemian Rhapsody" by Queen -- > it's an excellent test of dynamic range, as even on the original > 45 RPM single, its dynamics vary from full force at the brink of > distortion, to just barely audible over the surface noise. That's > strongly opposed to much of today's music, which is often so over- > processed and over-compressed right on the CD, that the waveform > graph ends up looking something like this: > > http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/souldec.gif > > That is the actual waveform graph of "Ooh It's Kinda Crazy" by the > Canadian pop group "soulDecision", in case you would like to put it > on your list of songs to avoid. Meanwhile, the widely Internet- > shared "Rough Mix" (i.e. pre-mastering) of the current U.K. #1 hit > "Unbreakable" by Westlife offers a far superior demonstration of > proper dynamic range: > > http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/rough.gif > > Too bad on the actual CD/radio release, they ended up using a fully > processed "Single Remix" version which ends up looking and sounding > like this: > > http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/remix.gif > > For more discussion on this trend of "hypercompression" in today's > music, check out the Usenet newsgroup "rec.audio.pro", accessible > through a Usenet server or through http://www.google.com (click on > "Groups"). From spfleck@citlink.net Fri Nov 15 06:30:25 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: spfleck@citlink.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Nov 2002 14:30:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 96393 invoked from network); 15 Nov 2002 14:30:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Nov 2002 14:30:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO relay02.roc.frontiernet.net) (66.133.131.35) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Nov 2002 14:30:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 5405 invoked from network); 15 Nov 2002 14:30:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO Steve) ([170.215.241.103]) (envelope-sender ) by relay02.roc.frontiernet.net (qmail-ldap-1.03) with SMTP for ; 15 Nov 2002 14:30:23 -0000 Message-ID: <014001c28cb3$891e63a0$01c8a8c0@N2UBP> To: References: <1037370306.840.32320.m12@yahoogroups.com> Subject: Project Do A Good Deed [in stereo, sort of Date: Fri, 15 Nov 2002 09:30:24 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Steve Fleckenstein" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=2988995 X-Yahoo-Profile: n2ubp | Now, provided there is a popular local AM station, why not purchase | say a GE SR III to give to some good person or organization where | the radio will be played on AM and people will hear it. Send them to me. I will put them up on a table at my daughters High School band Penny Social , send you a letter of thanks for a charitable donation (tax deductable), and you will be helping support my daughters rural high school band. Steve N2UBP From meridian3891@cs.com Fri Nov 15 07:33:01 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: meridian3891@cs.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Nov 2002 15:33:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 9633 invoked from network); 15 Nov 2002 15:33:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Nov 2002 15:33:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.83) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Nov 2002 15:33:00 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.164] by n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Nov 2002 15:32:49 -0000 Date: Fri, 15 Nov 2002 15:32:46 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: DAB hits Ottawa Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3010 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Tony" X-Originating-IP: 205.166.36.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=48487815 X-Yahoo-Profile: onemeridian I distinctively recall (roughly) 10 years ago, when the NAB was "pushing" to have all AM receivers manufactured to AMAX standards & also be equipped with C-QUAM decoders. My, oh my---how times changed! ;-( Hopefully, the NAB will come to their "senses," & drop their stance on IBOC the way they did AMAX & C-QUAM. As an owner of a GE SR3 myself, I agree that the difference is like night & day. I can tune in 1680 WTTM & it sounds like a local FM station over here (Northwest of Phila.). Tony --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin T." wrote: > > I sorta agree with KT on the AMax thing.....but I guarantee you > > that to the average Joe consumer....if he sees a sticker or > > something with "AMax" written on it, he's gonna think "what the > > hell is AMax??" Whereas.....if he sees "Enhanced AM!" He'll have > > some sort of idea. > > The reason I support AMAX is because I am secretly embarking upon a > campaign to promote AMAX as an alternative to IBOC (a.k.a. HD Radio) > that offers proven real-world performance, quality, and cost- > effectiveness. I am collecting AMAX receivers to use to make > demonstration recordings of both "reference quality" sound from the > Alfredo Lite transmitter as well as reception of real-world AM and > AM Stereo signals at varying distances from the transmitter and > reception conditions. > > This will be compiled onto a demo CD which I can churn out like > popcorn and distribute to radio stations and receiver manufacturers > as well as to the "average Joes and Janes" that you talk about. Of > course the demo CD will also include comparisons to "regular" AM as > well as IBOC in both analog and true digital mode, to make the > advantages of AMAX and AMAX Stereo even more apparent. > > Meanwhile, I do recognize that there are a lot of radios out there > that have excellent AM sound quality and reception but don't happen > to officially meet the AMAX standards. In this case the AMAX Stereo > logo can be edited to remove the "AX" part, leaving the same style of > logo simply saying "AM Stereo", and also a version for monaural > radios with the fancy "Stereo" script replaced with something > like "Enhanced", as you say. But true AMAX and AMAX Stereo radios > will still be promoted and labelled as such. After all, the new > Fanfare tuner has the AMAX Stereo logo right on its front panel, so > we shouldn't make their efforts lead to a dead-end if we were to drop > use of the term "AMAX" (pronounced "Ay-Max") and what it stands for. > > p.s. If somebody would like to donate to me a Denon TU-680NAB, or one > of the new Fanfare tuners, so that I can provide a true example of > AMAX at its best, I would be more than happy to accept it. :-) > Meanwhile I have the Chrysler and Delco AMAX car radios as well as > the erstwhile Sony SRF-42 and GE Superadio III, all of which can > provide very convincing demostrations of the benefits that AMAX and > AMAX Stereo has to offer. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Nov 15 08:19:15 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Nov 2002 16:19:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 92452 invoked from network); 15 Nov 2002 16:19:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Nov 2002 16:19:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Nov 2002 16:19:13 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.154] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Nov 2002 16:19:13 -0000 Date: Fri, 15 Nov 2002 16:19:12 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: A good aerial system Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 635 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics Speaking of music, I had a laugh when this came up in an eBay search for "AM Stereo".... it is a Beatles "Anthoropology" [sic] CD from Venezuela... not to be confused with an "Anthology" CD, or with "anthropology" (the study of human culture), of course: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=921819408 Perhaps it's made by the same company as this "Eric Crapton" [sic] CD: http://www.engrish.com/music/image/cdcover.jpg Finally, Quote of the Century (for us): "AM Stereo is better than AM plain." -- W. Wilson Goode, former mayor of Philadelphia, in response to a question by radio personality Joey Reynolds From meridian3891@cs.com Fri Nov 15 08:55:56 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: meridian3891@cs.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Nov 2002 16:55:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 34027 invoked from network); 15 Nov 2002 16:55:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Nov 2002 16:55:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Nov 2002 16:55:56 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.143] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Nov 2002 16:55:55 -0000 Date: Fri, 15 Nov 2002 16:55:55 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: A good aerial system Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 849 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Tony" X-Originating-IP: 205.166.36.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=48487815 X-Yahoo-Profile: onemeridian Maybe it is a CD-ROM of the *morphology* of *beetles & anthropods*! Wouldn't that be a hoot!? Tony --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin T." wrote: > Speaking of music, I had a laugh when this came up in an eBay search > for "AM Stereo".... it is a Beatles "Anthoropology" [sic] CD from > Venezuela... not to be confused with an "Anthology" CD, or with > "anthropology" (the study of human culture), of course: > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=921819408 > > > Perhaps it's made by the same company as this "Eric Crapton" [sic] CD: > > http://www.engrish.com/music/image/cdcover.jpg > > > Finally, Quote of the Century (for us): > > "AM Stereo is better than AM plain." > > -- W. Wilson Goode, former mayor of Philadelphia, in response to a > question by radio personality Joey Reynolds From amfmdx@fastq.com Fri Nov 15 11:17:08 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Nov 2002 19:17:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 71544 invoked from network); 15 Nov 2002 19:17:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Nov 2002 19:17:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Nov 2002 19:17:07 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt (d177-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.209]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gAFJH5v25802 for ; Fri, 15 Nov 2002 12:17:05 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <017201c28cdb$58eabb20$64f9bed8@kredding430cdt> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} A good aerial system Date: Fri, 15 Nov 2002 12:15:22 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > So, how does one implement a good and realiable AM Stero > transmitter aerial???? You gotta get it as close to 1/4th wavelength as possible. This means you need to go to the top of the band because its going to take the shortest aerial. The aerial needs to be VERTICAL. Horizontal orientation just plain is attenuated too much to do any good. You will be lucky to get a signal out of the backyard otherwise. At 510 kHz a 3m antenna is 1/49th of a 1/4th wave and at 1600 its 1/15th of a 1/4th wave antenna. 3m is the max length we can use for a part 15 [ unlicensed low power ] station. To make this up, you are going to have to make one hell of a loading coil. I have used a 5 gallon US bucket and used 14 ga wire and wound lots of turns on it until I was at or close to resonant. It takes a lot of winding and a lot of glue [coil dope] to make this winding. BE PATIENT. This goes from the center of the coax you should be feeding the antenna with. Heres what you have to do with the shield. You can do this two ways. Take wire and use a shovel to pierce the earth and you will take wires from the shield every 10 degrees and run them outwards like the spoke in a wheel as long as you can make them. The wire MUST be uninsulated. If you can't do the 10 degree thing do as many wires as possible. This is more difficult but way better. We have some cheap fencing we call chicken wire fence. Its pretty flimsy. You can either bury this about 1cm under the surface of the earth and connect it from the shield to the fencing. Do as big a swath as possible or you can nail it to the ground. You would have to experiment with the number of turns on the bucket but you can come close if you can figure the length of the antenna. Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Fri Nov 15 11:18:25 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Nov 2002 19:18:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 53246 invoked from network); 15 Nov 2002 19:18:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Nov 2002 19:18:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.84) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Nov 2002 19:18:24 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 15 Nov 2002 11:18:24 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} A good aerial system Date: Fri, 15 Nov 2002 14:18:11 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 15 Nov 2002 19:18:24.0757 (UTC) FILETIME=[C4D14250:01C28CDB] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.167.41.12] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Ben wrote: > So, how does one implement a good and reliable AM Stereo transmitter aerial???? The best aerial is 1/4 Wave length tall vertical tower that is series fed. The ground system should be 120 equally spaced copper radials that are 1/4 Wave length long that are buried just under the ground and silver soldered to a 4" copper strap around the base of the tower. You should also use a copper strap to ground the ATU cabinet. Now run a 4" copper strap back to the transmitter building along with the transmission line. Ground the building and the equipment to this ground strap with more 4" Copper strapping. In some cases, a folded Unipole antenna mounted on a grounded tower can give much better bandwidth and performance, especially when you are working with an electrically short tower or compromised ground system. Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From n0uiheric@aol.com Fri Nov 15 14:49:14 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Nov 2002 22:49:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 47512 invoked from network); 15 Nov 2002 22:49:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Nov 2002 22:49:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r06.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.102) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Nov 2002 22:49:12 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-r06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.134.179acc42 (3996) for ; Fri, 15 Nov 2002 17:49:05 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <134.179acc42.2b06d3e1@aol.com> Date: Fri, 15 Nov 2002 17:49:05 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: "PHONY DIGITAL RADIO" To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih The same thing happened in St. Louis. KXOK 630 dropped off the radar screen when they flipped from Top 40 to AC. They also tried Oldies, Talk, Hot AC, Talk, News and Urban AC before the station finally went off the air in 1994. The KXOK calls have been gone from St. Louis since 2000; the FM that had the calls (97.1, licensed to Florissant, MO) was also Urban AC, but later flipped to a hard-edged Classic Rock format. KXOK was replaced by all-talk KFTK; all syndicated except for local talk in afternoon drive. The AM side, once transmitting only an occasional pilot tone, is now full Stereo since Crawford acquired 630 and turned it into KJSL. The same thing happened with 550. KSD dropped off the radar screen for a while, after flipping from AC to Oldies about 1977. The station went all-News for a while, but enjoyed a revival as a Country station (1981-93), first as KSD, then as KUSA. After EZ Communications acquired the station, the calls reverted to KSD shortly after flipping to CNN Headline News. The station also tried simulcasting selected programs from KSDK Channel 5 (the former sister station of 550), including "Today", the 5:00 and 6:00 p.m. newscasts, and NBC Nightly News. The last format in Stereo for this station was Adult Standards (1995). Full stereo seperation was discontinued in 1997 when the station became KTRS; the pilot was switched off for good nearly two years ago. 1380 has suffered the biggest hit. The big problem they had was their 1,000-watt night signal, which is hit-and-miss outside the I-270/I-255 loop. After Doubleday acquired the station (then KWK) in 1978, the station was a rock-oriented Top 40 format (later simulcast on 106.5 FM), before switching to Oldies as KGLD in 1984. Since 1991, the station has tried an all-Sports format (KASP), a CHR simulcast (WKBQ) of 106.5 (and later, 104.1 FM), syndicated talk (KRAM), a Hot Country simulcast (again as WKBQ, simulcasting WKKX 106.5) before being donated to North Side Seventh-day Adventist Church in 1998. They tried free-form talk as KKWK, mainstream Jazz as KZJZ, and has been with it's current Southern Gospel format since December 1999. Several FM Top 40 stations have come and gone since 1975: 98 KSLQ (98.1), 106.5 KWK, 103.3 KHTR, Q-106.5 (WKBQ-FM), Hot 97 (KHTK, 97.1) and Q-104 (WKBQ). Unfortunately, the current CHR outlet is virtually unlistenable; Clear Channel's KSLZ (Z 107-7). Even News/Talk 1120 KMOX's audience is declining; from as high as 20% in it's AM Stereo days, they now get less than 10% of the local audience now. Competition from KTRS 550 and KWMU 90.7 has added to their woes. How the mighty have fallen! 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Fri Nov 15 14:49:14 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Nov 2002 22:49:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 88785 invoked from network); 15 Nov 2002 22:49:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Nov 2002 22:49:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r08.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.104) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Nov 2002 22:49:12 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-r08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.b2.150e61c4 (3996) for ; Fri, 15 Nov 2002 17:49:07 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Fri, 15 Nov 2002 17:49:07 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Daytimers To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih St. Louis has only one daytimer left; WRYT 1080 Edwardsville, IL. They've been trying to raise money ('a not-for-profit organization runs the station) to build facilities that would allow the station to go 24 hours. WEW 770 St. Louis now stays on until two hours after sunset at 250 watts (during the summer, the station can stay on as late as 10:30 p.m.), while KFUO 850 Clayton, MO has always stayed on until one hour after sunset, to coincide with Denver sunset. The former daytimers run these powers at night: KSTL 690 East St. Louis, IL-18 watts (in AM Stereo) KWRE 730 Warrenton, MO-120 watts KXEN 1010 Festus, MO-500 watts (in AM Stereo) KSIV 1320 Clayton, MO-270 watts (increased from 125 watts in the early 1990s) WBGZ 1570 Alton, IL-74 watts (and it gets out quite well, even into Missouri) KIRL 1460 St. Charles, MO is authorized for 500 watts, but their nighttime array has fallen into disrepair. They can operate 378 watts on their daytime array, however. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Fri Nov 15 14:49:23 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Nov 2002 22:49:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 88981 invoked from network); 15 Nov 2002 22:49:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Nov 2002 22:49:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m03.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.6) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Nov 2002 22:49:22 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-m03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.1bc.146baeff (3996) for ; Fri, 15 Nov 2002 17:49:12 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1bc.146baeff.2b06d3e8@aol.com> Date: Fri, 15 Nov 2002 17:49:12 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: "PHONY DIGITAL RADIO" To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih Now, FM programmers are driving listeners away from the band with the same thing that apparently drove listeners from AM...too many commercials. I'd rather be listening to a non-commercial AM or FM station or even a shortwave station than AM or FM stations that practically program all commercials! Didn't they learn a lesson from the failed attempt at KGBS 1020 Los Angeles (now KTNQ) decades ago? DSP might just be a better way to go than IBOC. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Fri Nov 15 15:20:09 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Nov 2002 23:20:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 91767 invoked from network); 15 Nov 2002 23:20:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Nov 2002 23:20:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14207.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.173.71) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Nov 2002 23:20:07 -0000 Message-ID: <20021115232007.96414.qmail@web14207.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [65.221.47.68] by web14207.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 15 Nov 2002 15:20:07 PST Date: Fri, 15 Nov 2002 15:20:07 -0800 (PST) Subject: My XM Radio Mathematics To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio XM Radio Math Problem, Per statistics in Radio World: XM Radio has 201,544 subscribers. They say that they gained 64,836 more last quarter, so even in a poor economy, let’s give them an additional 64,836 x 4 quarters = 259,344 more subscribers. They would then have a total of 460,888 subscribers a year from now. They say they use $90 million cash / quarter X 4 quarters = $360 million cash expenses. $360 Million / 460,888 = $781 per subscriber. So their cost is $781 per subscriber/year. Their income per subscriber would be $9.99 x 12 months = $120 / Year. Cost of $781 – Income of $120 = $ 661 LOSS per Subscriber even after doubling their subscribers. (Roughly a $300 Million Dollar annual loss). They would need 10 times the current subscribers, plus another $5/month additional per subscriber to break even - if they can keep expenses the same. I don’t see how XM Radio can survive another year, even if they merge with their competitors. I can’t believe Clear Channel has that kind of cash to prop them up for another year, but you never know. Maybe people don’t care about digital radio as much as the manufacturers think they do. __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your site http://webhosting.yahoo.com From jsgil@hal-pc.org Fri Nov 15 15:36:28 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Nov 2002 23:36:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 19642 invoked from network); 15 Nov 2002 23:36:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Nov 2002 23:36:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.86) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Nov 2002 23:36:26 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.142] by n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Nov 2002 23:36:26 -0000 Date: Fri, 15 Nov 2002 23:36:23 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: My XM Radio Mathematics Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20021115232007.96414.qmail@web14207.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1937 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.126 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@y..., "John P." wrote: > XM Radio Math Problem, Per statistics in Radio World: > > XM Radio has 201,544 subscribers. They say that they gained 64,836 more last > quarter, so even in a poor economy, let?s give them an additional 64,836 x 4 > quarters = 259,344 more subscribers. They would then have a total of 460,888 > subscribers a year from now. > > They say they use $90 million cash / quarter X 4 quarters = $360 million cash > expenses. > $360 Million / 460,888 = $781 per subscriber. So their cost is $781 per > subscriber/year. > > Their income per subscriber would be $9.99 x 12 months = $120 / Year. > Cost of $781 - Income of $120 = $ 661 LOSS per Subscriber even after doubling > their subscribers. (Roughly a $300 Million Dollar annual loss). > They would need 10 times the current subscribers, plus another $5/month > additional per subscriber to break even - if they can keep expenses the same. > > I don?t see how XM Radio can survive another year, even if they merge with > their competitors. If the economy doen't improve imediately to the point to gain 10x users then satallite radio is dead. SatDAB and IBOC do not have a guranteed revenue stream to support the technology so they will both be financial failures. Reminds me of all the dot coms that never really made a profit other that selling a lot of stock to enrich the company's founders and turned into dot bombs. I can?t believe Clear Channel has that kind of cash to prop > them up for another year, but you never know. > Maybe people don?t care about digital radio as much as the manufacturers think > they do. None of these companies really have the cash. They just get loans/ investors to cover it. As for CC they hid their profits by buying up all the radio stations. They eventually have to pay the piper and it showed when they had several quarters where they were bleeding red ink. JSG From dav259@csiro.au Fri Nov 15 18:16:07 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Nov 2002 02:16:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 21157 invoked from network); 16 Nov 2002 02:16:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Nov 2002 02:16:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Nov 2002 02:16:06 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAG2G4P00286 for ; Sat, 16 Nov 2002 13:16:04 +1100 (EST) Date: Sat, 16 Nov 2002 13:16:04 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: amstereoforum Subject: [RT] For someone's comment (fwd) Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public Looks as if Scott is off the air at home again. Kevin T - perhaps you should arrange that he could post from his work address . You did the same for me so that I can post from either Pine or Outlook (which put different addresses in the "from" field. btw - what frequencies do the satellite services use??? _________ Ian, Feel free to forward to the AMS lists. If this satellite thing folds, we may end up with a new band for terrestrial digital broadcasting and can scrap this IBOC debacle. ST [RT] For someone's comment: Tom Bosscher radio-tech@broadcast.net Fri, 15 Nov 2002 08:56:49 -0500 I promise, I will NOT say anything: (from RW-email list) >11-14-2002 XM LAYS OFF 80; NEEDS $250 MILLION WASHINGTON Money headaches continue at XM Satellite Radio, and now the company has laid off 80 people in an effort to reduced expenses. http://www.rwonline.com/dailynews/one.php?id=2247 11-14-2002 SIRIUS REPORTS MORE LOSSES IN Q3 Sirius reported an EBITDA loss of $60 million and a net loss applicable to common stockholders of $120 million, or $1.56 per share. http://www.rwonline.com/dailynews/one.php?id=2250 I'm outa here Tom Bosscher From fanfare@globility.com Sat Nov 16 06:48:25 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Nov 2002 14:48:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 92273 invoked from network); 16 Nov 2002 14:48:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Nov 2002 14:48:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.83) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Nov 2002 14:48:23 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.139] by n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Nov 2002 14:48:23 -0000 Date: Sat, 16 Nov 2002 14:48:22 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: My XM Radio Mathematics Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1506 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Marv Southcott" X-Originating-IP: 64.56.234.167 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy --- In amstereoforum@y..., "jsgilst" wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@y..., "John P." wrote: > > XM Radio Math Problem, Per statistics in Radio World: > If the economy doen't improve imediately to the point to gain 10x > users then satellite radio is dead. SatDAB and IBOC do not have a > guranteed revenue stream to support the technology so they will > both be financial failures. Reminds me of all the dot coms that > never really made a profit other that selling a lot of stock to > enrich the company's founders and turned into dot bombs. According to the following item in Audio Revolution's newsletter, someone's trying to sound the death knell on Sirius. "Sirius in Hertz Rental Cars Deal Comes As Sirius Denies Published Reports of Bankruptcy Amidst reports of a pending bankruptcy by Reuters, Sirus Satellite Radio, today announced that its service will be available in a range of rental cars from Hertz - the world's largest car rental company. The deal starts December 1, 2002 at major airport Hertz locations in California and Florida. Sirius specifically denied reports that they were going bankrupt in a second release sent today calling the Reuters report "misleading." " Unfortunately, when the press gets ahold of bad news and reports it, they usually don't report as loudly anything subsequent that is likely to discredit their original report. Hence, Sirius just got some unwelcome grease applied to its perch. M. From amfmdx@fastq.com Sat Nov 16 07:37:14 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Nov 2002 15:37:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 27842 invoked from network); 16 Nov 2002 15:37:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Nov 2002 15:37:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Nov 2002 15:37:13 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt ([209.63.214.239]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gAGFbCv44791 for ; Sat, 16 Nov 2002 08:37:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <02ad01c28d85$e27b66a0$64f9bed8@kredding430cdt> To: References: <1bc.146baeff.2b06d3e8@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: "PHONY DIGITAL RADIO" Date: Sat, 16 Nov 2002 08:36:07 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > Now, FM programmers are driving listeners away from the band with the same > thing that apparently drove listeners from AM...too many commercials. I'd > rather be listening to a non-commercial AM or FM station or even a shortwave > station than AM or FM stations that practically program all commercials! Three cheers for Eric! We agree! Having 6 minutes non stop of commercials is INSANE! Kevin From groucho@skyweb.net Sat Nov 16 08:57:27 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Nov 2002 16:57:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 17470 invoked from network); 16 Nov 2002 16:57:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Nov 2002 16:57:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Nov 2002 16:57:26 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gAGH1Pm2085492 for ; Sat, 16 Nov 2002 12:01:26 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DD678DE.B7F1656E@skyweb.net> Date: Sat, 16 Nov 2002 11:57:02 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: "PHONY DIGITAL RADIO" References: <1bc.146baeff.2b06d3e8@aol.com> <02ad01c28d85$e27b66a0$64f9bed8@kredding430cdt> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 that's nothing..... One night I was listening to a pair of DJ's interviewing a musical artist that was here from India.. they were taking calls Live from listeners. and totally forgot to play Any Commercials.. so at the End of the Hour. they played all their required commercials at one time.... this ran 24 minuets into the Next hosts Show. that host was so Upset that he just put on the automation and went Home... I was upset and Yelled at the hosts For playing 24 Mins of Commercials at one Time.. The GM told me to calm down. that I should not get so excited and just left it that way.. Never reprimanded the Hosts.. and they have done it twice since then.. Not quite 24 mins But for at least 15 mins of Commercials.. just listening to them makes me sick.... the other day I took a Ride out to an old High school station that I used to help out at on Long Island Mike E from this group is now the CE for that station. its run so well you would Not know its a high school station except for some of the ID's..... ROCK ON MIKE... I will be out there Tomorrow.. have that Certificate with you? Neal "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" wrote: > > Now, FM programmers are driving listeners away from the band with the same > > thing that apparently drove listeners from AM...too many commercials. I'd > > rather be listening to a non-commercial AM or FM station or even a > shortwave > > station than AM or FM stations that practically program all commercials! > > Three cheers for Eric! We agree! Having 6 minutes non stop of commercials is > INSANE! > > Kevin > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sat Nov 16 11:39:23 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Nov 2002 19:39:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 52801 invoked from network); 16 Nov 2002 19:39:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Nov 2002 19:39:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Nov 2002 19:39:21 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.167] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Nov 2002 19:39:20 -0000 Date: Sat, 16 Nov 2002 19:39:19 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: "PHONY DIGITAL RADIO" Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <02ad01c28d85$e27b66a0$64f9bed8@kredding430cdt> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1051 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.116 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" wrote: > > > Now, FM programmers are driving listeners away from the band with the same > > thing that apparently drove listeners from AM...too many commercials. I'd > > rather be listening to a non-commercial AM or FM station or even a > shortwave > > station than AM or FM stations that practically program all commercials! > > Three cheers for Eric! We agree! Having 6 minutes non stop of commercials is > INSANE! > > Kevin Before WBAP 820 went all talk on the midnight truckers road show it was music^H^H^H^H^H I mean commercials. Right up to the point when they switched formats you heard only 4 to 5 songs an hour. It got real tiring hearing about Shell RotellaT Motor Oil all the time along with other products for trucks. This was the only real C-QuAM station I had to listen to and it is 250mi away from me. for a Class A 50KW blowtorch they should have at least some music programs. So now I don't have any C-QuAM stations within reach of my radios. What a bummer! JSG From tampagar@webtv.net Sat Nov 16 15:01:58 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: tampagar@webtv.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Nov 2002 23:01:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 23473 invoked from network); 16 Nov 2002 23:01:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Nov 2002 23:01:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Nov 2002 23:01:56 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.162] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Nov 2002 23:01:56 -0000 Date: Sat, 16 Nov 2002 23:01:54 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: New Member Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2086 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "gar_fla_62" X-Originating-IP: 209.240.198.61 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=102439005 X-Yahoo-Profile: gar_fla_62 Hello! I found this group by accident while looking for a list of U.S. AM stations, as I had resumed my old interest in DXing. During much of the 80s, I was an AM stereo FANATIC! My friends couldn't understand my interest in AM stereo and I felt "alone" in a sense. I honestly think AM stereo sounded better than FM because it cut out the extreme high frequencies that I believe can take away from the quality of the sound. The lower frequency sound of AM stereo gave the music a more "solid" feel to it. Anyway, I gave up on AM stereo around the early 90s when the last AM hold out stations still playing music went to talk formats. So I didn't think AM stereo still existed today. I could now kick myself for not holding on to my Sony AM Stereo walkman. I was raised on AM radio and DXing. My family had just moved from North Jersey to South Jersey before I was born, so I grew up listening to 77 WABC when it was top 40 in the late 60s through the early 80s and hardly listened to WFIL in Philly even though it was so much closer. When WABC went to all talk in 82, I started listening to WNBC (also because of Howard Stern). They promoted themselves as "AM Stereo" and I quickly learned to feed two seperate AM radios through my regular stereo system and was amazed at the sound. It wasn't until 84 that I was able to find the Sony walkman. This was just when was moving down to Tampa, where I've been ever since. I remember sometimes getting a pretty good signal from WNBC for the first couple of hours after sunset and it was so fascinating to pick up stereo from such a distance. WLS Chicago had a much stronger signal here and didn't have the frequency clutter that WNBC would get from outside the US. Back then, I remember tuning the AM dial at night and picking up so many stereo stations from up north. Those were the days! DXing (even in only mono) used to be fun. Anymore, there"s either too many stations on what used to be "clear" channels, or there's very bothersome static from who knows what. Anyway, I'm so glad I found this forum and hope to share more......Gary From dav259@csiro.au Sat Nov 16 15:24:56 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Nov 2002 23:24:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 98505 invoked from network); 16 Nov 2002 23:24:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Nov 2002 23:24:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Nov 2002 23:24:54 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAGNOrP06192 for ; Sun, 17 Nov 2002 10:24:53 +1100 (EST) Date: Sun, 17 Nov 2002 10:24:53 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Subject: Re: {AMSF} New Member In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public On Sat, 16 Nov 2002, gar_fla_62 wrote: > I remember tuning the AM dial at night and picking up so many stereo > stations from up north. Those were the days! DXing (even in only > mono) used to be fun. Anymore, there"s either too many stations on > what used to be "clear" channels, or there's very bothersome static > from who knows what. Anyway, I'm so glad I found this forum and hope > to share more......Gary Welcome on board Gary! You must get hold of an AM stereo radio as 1130 WBF Bartow is still broadcasting good times oldies music in AMS. They even have "AM stereo" in their logo. You've got to love their street address: WWBF-AM Radio Station 1130 Radio Road Bartow, Florida 33830-7600 Phone 863-533-0744 http://www.wwbf.com/ Ian Melbourne, Australia (btw Melbourne, FL was named after our city by someone who was born here) From florida_amstereo@hotmail.com Sat Nov 16 15:47:01 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: florida_amstereo@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Nov 2002 23:47:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 54425 invoked from network); 16 Nov 2002 23:47:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Nov 2002 23:47:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.37.202) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Nov 2002 23:47:01 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 16 Nov 2002 15:47:00 -0800 Received: from 209.240.198.61 by pv2fd.pav2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Sat, 16 Nov 2002 23:47:00 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Re: {AMSF} New Member Date: Sat, 16 Nov 2002 23:47:00 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 16 Nov 2002 23:47:00.0801 (UTC) FILETIME=[75242B10:01C28DCA] From: "Donn Tillman" X-Originating-IP: [209.240.198.61] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83914824 Welcome Gary! Believe it or not, as recently as April or May or 2000; there was still an am-stereo station in the immediate Tampa Bay area - WGUL a.m. 860 was a.m. stereo until then, I have emailed them with no response and left word for their engineer to cal me; again no response. When I first discovered a.m. stereo in the early 1990's, there was WGTO - 540 am stereo out of Cypress Gardens/Winter Haven playing oldies from the 60's and 70's; WGUL - 860; WINQ (1010) , a station out of Port Charlotte at 1070 in am stereo, WONN - 1230 Lakeland in a.m. stereo; WSGX - 1280 stereo gold out of Sarasota and WSPB - 140 am out of Sarasota for stereo, until there were acquired by Clear Channel. (ditto for WGTO 540 and many other stations as well) and I understand at one time 1380 a.m. (now radio disney) was am stereo as well. Now, if you want your am stereo light to light up, you have to have a good tuner or receiver to put up WBF - 1130 am stereo out of Bartow..... or 590 Radio Cuba's classical music station also lights up the pilot light. At night I can't pick up anything in a.m. stereo on even a semi-regualar basis. donn st petersburg,fl _________________________________________________________________ The new MSN 8: advanced junk mail protection and 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail From amfmdx@fastq.com Sat Nov 16 15:56:33 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Nov 2002 23:56:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 3420 invoked from network); 16 Nov 2002 23:56:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Nov 2002 23:56:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Nov 2002 23:56:32 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt (d50-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.82]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gAGNuVv60371 for ; Sat, 16 Nov 2002 16:56:31 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <03bc01c28dcb$6f6a2520$64f9bed8@kredding430cdt> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} New Member Date: Sat, 16 Nov 2002 16:53:58 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > Hello! I found this group by accident while looking for a list of U.S. AM stations, as I had resumed my old interest in DXing. During much of the 80s, I was an AM stereo FANATIC! Hey brother, where've you been all these years? We have been around a while and we've been waiting for you. This is going to be the kind of place you are going to like. Kevin Mesa, Arizona From KC4QLP@aol.com Sat Nov 16 16:17:26 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Nov 2002 00:17:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 37079 invoked from network); 17 Nov 2002 00:17:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Nov 2002 00:17:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m04.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.7) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Nov 2002 00:17:26 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.6f.30f2f6ce (25305) for ; Sat, 16 Nov 2002 19:17:24 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <6f.30f2f6ce.2b083a13@aol.com> Date: Sat, 16 Nov 2002 19:17:23 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} New Member To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Welcome to the group Gary! ....hope you'll have fun with all of the technical and not so technical chatter here. BTW gang...I finally got the web stream back in stereo again on shoutcast.com. After just over a year and lousy software"updates" if thats what you want to call them ...I found the old software to return the webstream to stereo and hopefully it will support more listeners over this dial-up connection with the bit rate set a little lower than it was set before.Look for a part time stream relay to pop up soon as well. ...The webstream address is http://wgai.dyn.ee:8000 ....put that address in your player {winamp,Real player,and many others out there that support MPEG streams} and you'll be set. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From florida_amstereo@hotmail.com Sat Nov 16 16:37:49 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: florida_amstereo@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Nov 2002 00:37:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 35321 invoked from network); 17 Nov 2002 00:37:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Nov 2002 00:37:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.37.181) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Nov 2002 00:37:49 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 16 Nov 2002 16:37:49 -0800 Received: from 209.240.198.61 by pv2fd.pav2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Sun, 17 Nov 2002 00:37:48 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, amstereo@bellsouth.net Bcc: Subject: Memorex 1600 Date: Sun, 17 Nov 2002 00:37:48 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 17 Nov 2002 00:37:49.0056 (UTC) FILETIME=[8E0AF800:01C28DD1] From: "Donn Tillman" X-Originating-IP: [209.240.198.61] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83914824 After scouring every conceivable store within 25 miles of home, I never did find the GE Superadio III (guess I will order one through Sears)...... so I got another radio that Chris C and others had favorably discussed. It's available at Target and it's unusual to see a radio where it looks as though the f.m. band was an afterthought! The am has good sensitivity and inference rejection. (both from background stations and tv interference); the selectivity though is only fair, but the sound is great compared to most a.m. radios and the four position equalizer (rock, bass, classical and none) lets you taylor the sound to your tastes. The sound on both am and fm and c.d. is very good, but the selectivity on the f.m. band is a joke as is the very small (maybe four inch) antenna; I can only pick up the very strongest fm stations.... but for $40 I still think it's a lot of bang for the buck. donn st petersburg _________________________________________________________________ STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail From tampagar@webtv.net Sat Nov 16 17:11:08 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: tampagar@webtv.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Nov 2002 01:11:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 15502 invoked from network); 17 Nov 2002 01:11:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Nov 2002 01:11:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Nov 2002 01:11:08 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.128] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Nov 2002 01:11:08 -0000 Date: Sun, 17 Nov 2002 01:11:05 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: New Member Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <6f.30f2f6ce.2b083a13@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 594 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "gar_fla_62" X-Originating-IP: 209.240.198.61 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=102439005 X-Yahoo-Profile: gar_fla_62 Thanks for all the quick replies! Donn, 1380 was AM stereo back in the 80s. They were the AM broadcast for 104.7 WRBQ "Q 105". In fact, their station ID said "Q 105 FM and AM Stereo 1380". Back then Mason Dixon was the afternoon drive time DJ. Also, I thought I would share something which every AM fan should have in their file. If, like me, you happen to remember 77 WABC during it's top 40 days, this should bring back great memories. This site has plenty of the station's live recordings from the 60s and 70s. If only they had AM stereo back then!... http://musicradio.computer.net/ From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Nov 16 17:25:04 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Nov 2002 01:25:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 81280 invoked from network); 17 Nov 2002 01:25:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Nov 2002 01:25:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.68) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Nov 2002 01:25:04 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.180] by n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Nov 2002 01:25:04 -0000 Date: Sun, 17 Nov 2002 01:25:03 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: New Member Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1018 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.88.145 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > At night I can't pick up anything in a.m. stereo on even a semi- > regualar basis. How about 1620 WDHP from the U.S. Virgin Islands? They are one of the newest Expanded Band stations -- I believe they signed on in February 2002 -- and they are proud to broadcast in full AM Stereo. I have DXed them in Stereo all the way up here in New Jersey... that's roughly 1500 miles away! Meanwhile, that Spanish religious station on 530 kHz from the Turks & Caicos islands -- with a 100,000 watt Mono signal from a Nautel transmitter -- has a real flame-thrower signal at night, booming in loud and clear throughout most of the eastern USA. It's funny, because this station simulcasts the programming of 1330 WWRV from New York City, and I live less than 30 miles away from WWRV's transmitter, but I can't get WWRV at all (either during the day or at night) because of their directional signal pattern. But, at night, I can listen to their simulcast from thousands of miles away as if it was a local station! From possumhunter@netzero.net Sat Nov 16 18:25:05 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Nov 2002 02:25:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 82395 invoked from network); 17 Nov 2002 02:25:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Nov 2002 02:25:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.90) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Nov 2002 02:25:03 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 16 Nov 2002 18:25:03 -0800 Subject: Fw: [mecm] Warning to all list owners and moderators Date: Sat, 16 Nov 2002 21:24:44 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 1 X-MSMail-Priority: High X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Bcc: Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 17 Nov 2002 02:25:03.0052 (UTC) FILETIME=[8900D8C0:01C28DE0] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.148.113.43] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Coalbunny" To: Sent: Saturday, November 16, 2002 8:39 PM Subject: [mecm] Warning to all list owners and moderators I just got this from another group owner. I have heard of this happening, and in one case banned a guy that made a similar attempt with one of my groups. Be wary, and watch yer six! Carl owner of 7 yahoogroups and moderator of 3 more > Someone has been joining communities with the nickname YAHOO COMMUNITY MONITOR, and then posting the following: Yahoo Community Monitor says: > Yahoo Group Managers have been receiving a few complaints about your group.I am required to join your site and monitor it for about one month.I will not do anything to damage or ruin your site,I am only required to monitor it.The only thing required of you is to accept my application and make me a Manager of your group for the time I am there. If you cannot meet these requirements,Yahoo will have to shut your group down. > DO NOT!! make this person a manager! SHE/HE is a fake, and has been deleting groups once made a manager. BAN the member immediately. > Please let other groups know about this problem. > I just wanted to let ya'll know. Wouldn't want anything to happen to your groups. From tampagar@webtv.net Sat Nov 16 18:49:02 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: tampagar@webtv.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Nov 2002 02:49:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 17205 invoked from network); 17 Nov 2002 02:49:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Nov 2002 02:49:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Nov 2002 02:49:01 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.166] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Nov 2002 02:49:01 -0000 Date: Sun, 17 Nov 2002 02:48:59 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: New Member - DXing Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 915 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "gar_fla_62" X-Originating-IP: 209.240.198.61 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=102439005 X-Yahoo-Profile: gar_fla_62 Kevin, I think "directional" AM broadcasts are very interesting. For example, I mentioned to Donn about WRBQ 1380 AM stereo in the Tampa Bay area. They had a standard 5000 kw signal that switched directions at night. I live in northeast Tampa and could hardly pick up the signal after sunset. But when I was visiting my parents up in New Jersey one time, I actually picked up the station pretty good one night! KYW 1060 from Philadelphia is a 50,000 kw directional station which I remember was so hard to hear only 50 miles away at the Jersey shore during the evening, yet while driving down I 95 in the middle of North Carolina at night, KYW comes booming in as clear as could be! When I was first in college in Bethlehem, Pa (1980), I could often pick up 610 WIOD from Miami at night when I turned the radio in JUST the right direction, even though 610 WIP, only 50 miles to the south, dominated the frequency. From florida_amstereo@hotmail.com Sat Nov 16 19:16:05 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: florida_amstereo@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Nov 2002 03:16:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 41699 invoked from network); 17 Nov 2002 03:16:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Nov 2002 03:16:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.37.8) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Nov 2002 03:16:04 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 16 Nov 2002 19:16:04 -0800 Received: from 209.240.198.61 by pv2fd.pav2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Sun, 17 Nov 2002 03:16:04 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Shadow-casting on WRBX AM/FM Date: Sun, 17 Nov 2002 03:16:04 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 17 Nov 2002 03:16:04.0739 (UTC) FILETIME=[A9E93530:01C28DE7] From: "Donn Tillman" X-Originating-IP: [209.240.198.61] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83914824 From what I understand of WRBQ AM/FM (I believe they were the only stations owned by then small ClearChannel in the St Pete/Tampa market at the time) was that in the 80's when the FCC was more than a "paper tiger", that they (FCC) warned WRBQ about simucasting, something to the effect that it was not allowed in a market the size of the St Pete/Tampa market, so ClearChannel responded by shadow-casting, the AM was on a 10 second delay, so the time and temps were still accurate, but technically, WRBQ was no longer simucasting. I'm in s.e. St Petersburg a few blocks from Tampa Bay and 1380 booms in here at night, but I have noticed that it comes in better in Bradenton and even Sarasota at night than it does in north Tampa. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Kevin, I will have to try the 1620 frequency, I don't recall picking it up before. donn st petersburg,fl _________________________________________________________________ Tired of spam? Get advanced junk mail protection with MSN 8. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail From evergreenterrace@buzzle.com Sat Nov 16 20:11:22 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: evergreenterrace@buzzle.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Nov 2002 04:11:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 80514 invoked from network); 17 Nov 2002 04:11:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Nov 2002 04:11:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.86) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Nov 2002 04:11:22 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.144] by n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Nov 2002 04:11:22 -0000 Date: Sun, 17 Nov 2002 04:11:21 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: KAHN Communications RF Signal Processor (EBAY) Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 61 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgliradio" X-Originating-IP: 170.20.11.59 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=69711087 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgliradio http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=920092117 From tampagar@webtv.net Sat Nov 16 21:36:01 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: tampagar@webtv.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Nov 2002 05:36:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 52270 invoked from network); 17 Nov 2002 05:36:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Nov 2002 05:36:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Nov 2002 05:36:00 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.142] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Nov 2002 05:36:00 -0000 Date: Sun, 17 Nov 2002 05:35:58 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: KAHN Communications RF Signal Processor (EBAY) Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 186 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "gar_fla_62" X-Originating-IP: 209.240.198.61 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=102439005 X-Yahoo-Profile: gar_fla_62 Does anyone know how I can find an AM stereo radio (walkman type) anywhere other than over the internet? It seems that Sony and AIWA were still making them as of a couple of years ago? From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Sat Nov 16 22:03:41 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Nov 2002 06:03:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 94066 invoked from network); 17 Nov 2002 06:03:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Nov 2002 06:03:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14204.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.146) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Nov 2002 06:03:40 -0000 Message-ID: <20021117060340.61745.qmail@web14204.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [65.221.47.68] by web14204.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 16 Nov 2002 22:03:40 PST Date: Sat, 16 Nov 2002 22:03:40 -0800 (PST) Subject: AMS stations in CT. To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio Engineer Thomas O. forwarded to me: "These would be WLAD, Danbury and WREF, Ridgefield. Both Connecticut. Also in CT, WICC, Bridgeport and WQUN, Hamden are AM stereo." __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your site http://webhosting.yahoo.com From tampagar@webtv.net Sat Nov 16 22:17:55 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: tampagar@webtv.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Nov 2002 06:17:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 36747 invoked from network); 17 Nov 2002 06:17:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Nov 2002 06:17:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.75) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Nov 2002 06:17:54 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.153] by n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Nov 2002 06:17:54 -0000 Date: Sun, 17 Nov 2002 06:17:51 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: the death of KFRC Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 799 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "gar_fla_62" X-Originating-IP: 209.240.198.61 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=102439005 X-Yahoo-Profile: gar_fla_62 KFRC was one of the last great AM stereo music stations. I'm familiar with KFRC San Francisco because my older brother was stationed at Travis AFB during the late 70s. I spent a couple of summers out there, staying at his place in Fairfield. Since then, I've visited him in the S.F. Bay area a number of times. 1986 was the first and last time I enjoyed hearing KFRC in AM stereo. When I landed in San Francisco, I remember being anxious to get my AM stereo walkman out and hear what KFRC sounded like. That was when my brother broke the news to me that they were about to drop their top 40 format after all those years. If I remember correctly, KFRC changed their call letters and dropped the AM stereo broadcast. I can't understand why such major AM stereo stations simply vanished as they did. From amfmdx@fastq.com Sat Nov 16 22:33:51 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Nov 2002 06:33:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 70659 invoked from network); 17 Nov 2002 06:33:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Nov 2002 06:33:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Nov 2002 06:33:51 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt (d209-osel-phx.fastq.com [207.173.146.198]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gAH6Xnv64568 for ; Sat, 16 Nov 2002 23:33:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <041e01c28e03$24d6d3e0$64f9bed8@kredding430cdt> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} KAHN Communications RF Signal Processor (EBAY) Date: Sat, 16 Nov 2002 23:32:44 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla Well its stereo. Whats this unit do? Kevin ----- Original Message ----- From: "wgliradio" To: Sent: Saturday, November 16, 2002 9:11 PM Subject: {AMSF} KAHN Communications RF Signal Processor (EBAY) > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=920092117 > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Nov 16 22:34:51 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Nov 2002 06:34:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 71916 invoked from network); 17 Nov 2002 06:34:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Nov 2002 06:34:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.68) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Nov 2002 06:34:50 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.182] by n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Nov 2002 06:34:50 -0000 Date: Sun, 17 Nov 2002 06:34:49 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Fw: [mecm] Warning to all list owners and moderators Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1400 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.88.145 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics The "warning" itself sounds like the hoax here. It's almost a carbon copy of those fake "e-mail virus warnings". First of all, anything officially from Yahoo will have it spelled as "Yahoo!", with the exclamation point. So that's the easiest way to spot a fraudulent message from or about any division of Yahoo. Also, the warning is suspicious because a group has Moderators, not "Managers", and while a group owner (such as myself) can made any member a Moderator, only the group owner will have the ability to delete the group unless you specifically give that privelege to other Moderators. For example, I set up Chris Cuff as an additional Moderator of this group, will all of the same powers as me, except I did not give him the ability to delete this group. (Sorry Chris, but I think I'll save that decision for myself!) > > Please let other groups know about this problem. That sentence alone is a give-away that this is a hoax. The real problem here is not somebody going around and fradulently acting as a Yahoo employee, the problem is that the *warning* about this made-up nonsense is being spread around. The people with too much time on their hands who make up this stuff should just go back to playing Zork I on their Commodore 64. p.s. Look for the grating hidden under the leaves... never underestimate the power of a machete... and watch out for GRUES! From KC4QLP@aol.com Sat Nov 16 23:40:12 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Nov 2002 07:40:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 70877 invoked from network); 17 Nov 2002 07:40:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Nov 2002 07:40:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m03.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.6) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Nov 2002 07:40:11 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.10f.1a312294 (4410) for ; Sun, 17 Nov 2002 02:40:08 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <10f.1a312294.2b08a1d8@aol.com> Date: Sun, 17 Nov 2002 02:40:08 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} KAHN Communications RF Signal Processor (EBAY) To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 11/17/02 1:35:12 AM Eastern Standard Time, amfmdx@fastq.com writes: > Well its stereo. Whats this unit do? > > Kevin > > It looks to be like some sort of modulation monitor for Kahn AM Stereo. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From amfmdx@fastq.com Sun Nov 17 07:03:14 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Nov 2002 15:03:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 38152 invoked from network); 17 Nov 2002 15:03:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Nov 2002 15:03:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Nov 2002 15:03:13 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt (d57-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.89]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gAHF3Cv67025 for ; Sun, 17 Nov 2002 08:03:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <047e01c28e4a$4bf27460$64f9bed8@kredding430cdt> To: References: <10f.1a312294.2b08a1d8@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} KAHN Communications RF Signal Processor (EBAY) Date: Sun, 17 Nov 2002 08:01:54 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > It looks to be like some sort of modulation monitor for Kahn AM Stereo. Thats what it looked like. Its the first piece of Kahn gear I have ever seen on eBay. Kevin From paulparkinson@wi.rr.com Sun Nov 17 09:04:09 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: paulparkinson@wi.rr.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Nov 2002 17:04:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 62701 invoked from network); 17 Nov 2002 17:04:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Nov 2002 17:04:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail8.wi.rr.com) (24.94.162.176) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Nov 2002 17:04:08 -0000 Received: from MICRON1 ([65.30.180.103]) by mail8.wi.rr.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.757.75); Sun, 17 Nov 2002 11:02:29 -0600 Message-ID: <012501c28e5b$4abddc40$6500a8c0@MICRON1> To: Subject: Radio Disney Date: Sun, 17 Nov 2002 11:03:46 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Return-Path: paulparkinson@wi.rr.com From: "PaulParkinson" Reply-To: "PaulParkinson" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public WKSH 1640 Sussex Wi is now Radio Disney and they are AM Stereo . They sound great on my Radio Shack AM Stereo tuner . Its went on the air last night at about 745pm. Paul From tampagar@webtv.net Sun Nov 17 10:14:02 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: tampagar@webtv.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Nov 2002 18:14:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 75334 invoked from network); 17 Nov 2002 18:14:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Nov 2002 18:14:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.78) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Nov 2002 18:14:02 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.128] by n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Nov 2002 18:13:59 -0000 Date: Sun, 17 Nov 2002 18:13:59 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Radio Disney Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <012501c28e5b$4abddc40$6500a8c0@MICRON1> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 158 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "gar_fla_62" X-Originating-IP: 209.240.198.61 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=102439005 X-Yahoo-Profile: gar_fla_62 Radio Shack carries AM stereo tuners? What kind is it? I've called three different local Radio Shacks and was told they didn't have any AM stereo receivers. From florida_amstereo@hotmail.com Sun Nov 17 10:33:13 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: florida_amstereo@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Nov 2002 18:33:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 19943 invoked from network); 17 Nov 2002 18:33:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Nov 2002 18:33:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.37.196) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Nov 2002 18:33:13 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 17 Nov 2002 10:33:12 -0800 Received: from 209.240.198.61 by pv2fd.pav2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Sun, 17 Nov 2002 18:33:12 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Radio Shack,am stereo tuners Date: Sun, 17 Nov 2002 18:33:12 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 17 Nov 2002 18:33:12.0793 (UTC) FILETIME=[C92FE490:01C28E67] From: "Donn Tillman" X-Originating-IP: [209.240.198.61] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83914824 "gar_fla_62" wrote: >Radio Shack carries AM stereo >tuners? What kind is it? I've called >three different local Radio Shacks and >was told they didn't have any AM >stereo receivers. Radio Shack hasn't carried the am-stereo tuners for several years; I believe R.S. had these in the mid 1980's to maybe early to mid 1990's; other's on this list can give you the model numbers to look for on E-Bay; Thrift shops etc. donn _________________________________________________________________ STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail From tampagar@webtv.net Sun Nov 17 14:49:55 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: tampagar@webtv.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Nov 2002 22:49:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 17106 invoked from network); 17 Nov 2002 22:49:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Nov 2002 22:49:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Nov 2002 22:49:54 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.137] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Nov 2002 22:49:54 -0000 Date: Sun, 17 Nov 2002 22:49:52 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: What part about AM STEREO don't they understand? Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 418 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "gar_fla_62" X-Originating-IP: 209.240.198.61 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=102439005 X-Yahoo-Profile: gar_fla_62 The average person can not grasp the concept of AM Stereo! I've recently done plenty of shopping over the phone and in person in my quest for for an AM Stereo receiver. Even though I give specific details of what I'm looking for, EACH and EVERY person I speak with still thinks AM Stereo is simply listening to a standard AM broadcast through two speakers! It just goes to show how CONDITIONED most people are. Geez. From possumhunter@netzero.net Sun Nov 17 15:03:49 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Nov 2002 23:03:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 74027 invoked from network); 17 Nov 2002 23:03:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Nov 2002 23:03:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.41) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Nov 2002 23:03:49 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 17 Nov 2002 15:03:49 -0800 To: References: <041e01c28e03$24d6d3e0$64f9bed8@kredding430cdt> Subject: Re: {AMSF} KAHN Communications RF Signal Processor (EBAY) Date: Sun, 17 Nov 2002 18:03:30 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 17 Nov 2002 23:03:49.0250 (UTC) FILETIME=[96DE9E20:01C28E8D] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.174.199.81] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Kevin - Mesa, Arizona wrote: > Well its stereo. Whats this unit do? It has been a LONG time since I have seen one of those critters! It is a 1st generation Kahn AM Stereo Modulation Monitor. If only they had a pair of Kahn Good-N-Loud audio processors....... Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Nov 17 15:42:22 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Nov 2002 23:42:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 87138 invoked from network); 17 Nov 2002 23:42:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Nov 2002 23:42:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Nov 2002 23:42:21 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.181] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Nov 2002 23:42:21 -0000 Date: Sun, 17 Nov 2002 23:42:18 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Radio Shack,am stereo tuners Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 728 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.86.148 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Radio Shack hasn't carried the am-stereo tuners for several years; > I believe R.S. had these in the mid 1980's to maybe early to mid > 1990's; other's on this list can give you the model numbers to look > for on E-Bay; Thrift shops etc. Information and photos of every known AM Stereo receiver can be found on the AM Stereo Web Site. Go to http://www.amstereoradio.com and click on "Radios". If anybody knows of an AM Stereo-capable radio that is not shown on the web site, or has picture(s) of the ones that are shown without photos, please e-mail me. Note that I am excluding Japanese home-market radios since there are so many and these were never officially sold in North America (or Australia, the UK, etc.). From dwtpa97@earthlink.net Sun Nov 17 21:00:53 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dwtpa97@earthlink.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Nov 2002 05:00:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 18761 invoked from network); 18 Nov 2002 05:00:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Nov 2002 05:00:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO flamingo.mail.pas.earthlink.net) (207.217.120.232) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Nov 2002 05:00:52 -0000 Received: from sdn-ap-013scfairp0293.dialsprint.net ([63.183.129.39] helo=earthlink.net) by flamingo.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 18De1j-0001wK-00; Sun, 17 Nov 2002 21:00:51 -0800 Message-ID: <3DD8740E.61D29AF5@earthlink.net> Date: Mon, 18 Nov 2002 00:01:02 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.79 [en]C-CCK-MCD NSCPCD472 (Windows NT 5.0; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Cc: amstereo@bellsouth.net Subject: Re: {AMSF} Memorex 1600 References: From: dwtpa97 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38076959 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit There's almost always one or more used ones for sale on eBay, using the searchphrase "GE Superadio". Below is a link to it. Dick W. http://search.ebay.com/search/search.dll?MfcISAPICommand=GetResult&query=GE+SupeRadio&ht=1&st=2&SortProperty=MetaEndSort&BasicSearch=++ Donn Tillman wrote: > After scouring every conceivable store within 25 miles of home, I never did > find the GE Superadio III (guess I will order one through Sears)...... so I > got another radio that Chris C and others had favorably discussed. > > It's available at Target and it's unusual to see a radio where it looks as > though the f.m. band was an afterthought! > > The am has good sensitivity and inference rejection. (both from background > stations and tv interference); the selectivity though is only fair, but the > sound is great compared to most a.m. radios and the four position equalizer > (rock, bass, classical and none) lets you taylor the sound to your tastes. > > The sound on both am and fm and c.d. is very good, but the selectivity on > the f.m. band is a joke as is the very small (maybe four inch) antenna; I > can only pick up the very strongest fm stations.... but for $40 I still > think it's a lot of bang for the buck. > > donn > st petersburg > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Nov 17 21:45:27 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Nov 2002 05:45:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 74282 invoked from network); 18 Nov 2002 05:45:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Nov 2002 05:45:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Nov 2002 05:45:26 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.188] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Nov 2002 05:45:26 -0000 Date: Mon, 18 Nov 2002 05:45:25 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Memorex 1600 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3DD8740E.61D29AF5@earthlink.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1095 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.86.148 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > There's almost always one or more used ones for sale on eBay, using > the searchphrase "GE Superadio". Below is a link to it. > Dick W. > http://search.ebay.com/search/search.dll?MfcISAPICommand=GetResult& query=GE+SupeRadio&ht=1&st=2&SortProperty=MetaEndSort&BasicSearch=++ Yahoo doesn't handle long URLs properly, so without resorting to Cut and Paste to reassemble the long URL you gave, a better solution would be to simply go to: http://pages.ebay.com/search/items/basicsearch.html ...and then search for whatever key phrase you desire. In this case, searching for "Superadio" turned up five results: two Superadio II models, and three Superadio III models. Either model would be a fine choice; the III has better AMAX-type sound quality and Expanded Band tuning, while the II provides better reception and a higher quality of construction. BTW, of the two Superadio IIs listed, there are slight differences between them: one has a two-way speaker system with tweeter, while the other has just a single full-range speaker -- perhaps an earlier revision of the II model. From amfmdx@fastq.com Sun Nov 17 21:50:37 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Nov 2002 05:50:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 74579 invoked from network); 18 Nov 2002 05:50:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Nov 2002 05:50:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO webmail.fastq.com) (204.62.193.6) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Nov 2002 05:50:37 -0000 Received: from localhost (localhost.fastq.com [127.0.0.1]) by webmail.fastq.com (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gAI5ZH8f093945 for ; Sun, 17 Nov 2002 22:35:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Received: from 207.173.146.77 ( [207.173.146.77]) as user amfmdx@pop.fastq.com by webmail.fastq.com with HTTP; Sun, 17 Nov 2002 22:35:17 -0700 Message-ID: <1037597717.3dd87c151448f@webmail.fastq.com> Date: Sun, 17 Nov 2002 22:35:17 -0700 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Memorex 1600 References: In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) 3.1 From: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Originating-IP: 207.173.146.77 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla Quoting "Kevin T." : > BTW, of the two Superadio IIs listed, there are slight differences > between them: one has a two-way speaker system with tweeter, while > the other has just a single full-range speaker -- perhaps an earlier > revision of the II model. The one speaker is NOT a Superadio II but a Superadio. The two speaker unit with the tweeter IS a Superadio II. Kevin Mesa, AZ ------------------------------------------------- FastQ Communications Providing Innovative Internet Solutions Since 1993 From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Nov 17 22:09:47 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Nov 2002 06:09:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 68934 invoked from network); 18 Nov 2002 06:09:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Nov 2002 06:09:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.70) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Nov 2002 06:09:46 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.175] by n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Nov 2002 06:09:46 -0000 Date: Mon, 18 Nov 2002 06:09:44 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: AMAX demo Part 1 Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3218 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.86.148 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics Thanks to a recently acquired Chrysler "Infinity" radio which I just set up today, the first in a series of AMAX demonstration recordings (which will eventually go on a compilation CD) has been completed. Here is the Chrysler radio that I got on eBay: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1871159877 It is one of the excellent AMAX AM Stereo models with 5-band equalizer and speaker "joystick". I was surprised to discover that it has an orange display and illumination, instead of the more common aqua blue Chrysler color -- a nice touch. It also doesn't seem quite as selective as the other Chrysler AMAX radio I have in a 1995 Jeep, which may be a matter of circuit adjustment or of the type of antenna used (in this case, just a random length of wire clipped to the antenna jack, rather than an "official" car radio antenna with several thousand pounds of steel as its ground!). In any event, once hooked up to an "RF-clean" 12 VDC power supply and a stereo cassette recorder, I got some excellent recordings of AMAX AM Mono and AM Stereo. Here are some of our own 1680 WTTM from Priceton, NJ: http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/wttm.mp3 http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/wttm2.mp3 WTTM was running mostly talk programming this afternoon, but I did catch some Stereo commercials and a bit of the in-studio Stereo microphone placement. The Chrysler radio provides a nice crisp sound, with its Dynamic Noise Reduction (DNR), 10 kHz whistle notch filter, and auto-variable bandwidth helping to give the best sound quality even from weaker signals. It also sounds great in Mono, as you can hear from 1170 WWTR in Bridgewater, NJ: http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/wwtr.mp3 http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/wwtr2.mp3 It has a very nice rich tone, with excellent bass response. This is actually one of the provable advantages of AM over FM; a typical Optimod-type audio processor at a radio station has five or six "bands" of processing to work with. On FM, these bands are spread across the 15 kHz audio range, and have to deal with a more aggressive pre-emphasis curve. This often gives a harsh, strident, over-processed sound. On AM, these same five or six bands only have to deal with audio up to 10 kHz; thus, each band can focus on a narrower range of frequencies, providing more finely detailed processing, with greater attention to the most musically and vocally important mid-range frequencies. This allows AM stations to have consistently high modulation levels, without sounding over-processed like FM, and allows AM to provide high fidelity audio without losing definition of the mid-range. There is more to come, including samples from my own "Alfredo Lite" AM Stereo transmitter... I will also shortly have a Delco AMAX radio to see how it compares to the Chrysler. Stay tuned! p.s. The Chrysler radio also has an *excellent* cassette player... easily the best-sounding I have heard from a car radio. I just wish it had Dolby C NR, which is far superior to Dolby B... in fact, these AMAX demos were first recorded to standard Type I cassette tape with Dolby C and HX Pro, before being transferred to MP3 computer format. From ben@lennard.net.nz Sun Nov 17 22:10:57 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ben@lennard.net.nz X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Nov 2002 06:10:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 94490 invoked from network); 18 Nov 2002 06:10:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Nov 2002 06:10:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Nov 2002 06:10:56 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.172] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Nov 2002 06:10:56 -0000 Date: Mon, 18 Nov 2002 06:10:56 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: SLIGHTLY OT? Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 875 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Ben" X-Originating-IP: 203.98.48.150 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=118503946 X-Yahoo-Profile: benlennard Hi all, With the recent threads on analogue and digital transmissions, it got me thinking... "Is the Human Brain Analogue or Digital?" My answer: Digital. Reasoning: (and it may be flawed) The basic building block of the brain is the Neuron. What do Neurons do? They either fire or don't fire. That is they are either on or off, 1 or 0, ie - binary = digital. Now, what I was just wondering before is, what is the resolution of the Brain's D to A converter? Very high, I would imagine. Plus the technology we have today, would not come anywhere near it. That is: Brain's DAC resolution is equivalent to the sand in an hourglass, where as current technology = pebbles in an hourglass. What do you think? Are we digital or analogue, when it comes down to the thing that is processing what we see and do... Cheers, Mad Scientist of Crofton Downs. Ben. From rwagoner@cox.net Sun Nov 17 23:10:18 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner@cox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Nov 2002 07:10:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 84657 invoked from network); 18 Nov 2002 07:10:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Nov 2002 07:10:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.87) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Nov 2002 07:10:18 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.131] by n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Nov 2002 07:10:18 -0000 Date: Mon, 18 Nov 2002 07:10:14 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: the death of KFRC Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2088 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Richard Wagoner" X-Originating-IP: 68.4.33.253 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=96123889 X-Yahoo-Profile: richardalanwagoner --- In amstereoforum@y..., "gar_fla_62" wrote: > KFRC was one of the last great AM stereo music stations. I'm familiar with KFRC San Francisco because my older brother was stationed at Travis AFB during the late 70s. I spent a couple of summers out there, staying at his place in Fairfield. Since then, I've visited him in the S.F. Bay area a number of times. 1986 was the first and last time I enjoyed hearing KFRC in AM stereo. When I landed in San Francisco, I remember being anxious to get my AM stereo walkman out and hear what KFRC sounded like. That was when my brother broke the news to me that they were about to drop their top 40 format after all those years. If I remember correctly, KFRC changed their call letters and dropped the AM stereo broadcast. I can't understand why such major AM stereo stations simply vanished as they did. *** Right and wrong. KFRC got destroyed by Walter Sabo when he got put in charge and decided that being the top-rated top-40 music station wasn't good enough. So between the hours of 9 am and 3 pm, he insituted the Game Zone, 6 hours of radio game shows. KFRC's ratings tanked. The Game Zone was pulled, but Sabo was not. Soon after he dropped top-40 for Adult Standards, but kept the call letters (unlike the idiotic move he made in los Angeles by dropping the KHJ calls). "Magic 61" did well in the ratings, but not in ad revenue. So when RKO sold off the station , the format became oldies, and the "classic" jingles returned. The station became a simulcast with KFRC-FM, which has used the jingles for a short period before the simulcast. Now it is still a simulcast, but the 610 frequency is no longer mentioned except at the top-of-the-hour. Instead the FM frequency is hyped ... strange, considering that FM reception is so bad in San Francisco that most people probably listen to the AM. Anyway, I am not there so I don't know if it is stereo any more (hard to DX from LA any more, as another station covers them). But I understand Bobby Occean is still there. He's my favorite DJ of all time. Richard Wagoner From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Nov 18 01:30:59 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Nov 2002 09:30:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 51307 invoked from network); 18 Nov 2002 09:30:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Nov 2002 09:30:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Nov 2002 09:30:57 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.167] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Nov 2002 09:30:57 -0000 Date: Mon, 18 Nov 2002 09:30:55 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: SLIGHTLY OT? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1213 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.86.148 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > What do you think? Are we digital or analogue, when it comes down > to the thing that is processing what we see and do... I'd say humans are analogue, except for Americans, who are "analog". :-) Seriously, sound and light waves are analog(ue) in nature. Even something as simple as a sine wave can never be reproduced by a digital technique with full accuracy. 8-bit digital audio breaks the waveform into 255 stair-steps, and the results of that inaccuracy are clearly audible. 16-bit digital audio has improved this to 65,536 stair-steps, which is a lot better, but still not fully accurate. Digital is like playing a game of connect-the-dots, versus a real drawing. You can put more dots on the paper and place them closer together, but it can never perfectly recreate the original shape. p.s. Were it not for our obsession with digital, we (in America) could have had HDTV over a decade ago. Japan developed an analog HDTV system in the 1980s, with 1125 lines of resolution. Now, we have a digital HDTV system which offers as little as 720 lines of resolution, which isn't even as good as the 819-line black & white TV system that France had from the end of WWII through the 1980s! From amstereo@optushome.com.au Mon Nov 18 04:47:32 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereo@optushome.com.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Nov 2002 12:47:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 83910 invoked from network); 18 Nov 2002 12:47:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Nov 2002 12:47:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail025.syd.optusnet.com.au) (210.49.20.147) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Nov 2002 12:47:31 -0000 Received: from unit (c17302.ipswc1.qld.optusnet.com.au [210.49.44.162]) by mail025.syd.optusnet.com.au (8.11.1/8.11.1) with SMTP id gAIClUF10191 for ; Mon, 18 Nov 2002 23:47:30 +1100 Message-ID: <001d01c28f00$a801afd0$1a02a8c0@unit> To: References: <1037542236.1694.3146.m12@yahoogroups.com> Subject: new news group request help Date: Mon, 18 Nov 2002 22:47:29 +1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1123 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1123 From: "amstereo - matt2" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=105920058 X-Yahoo-Profile: voltar_e I'm wanting to set up an am stereo news group that will allow a greater reach of people, and i need your assistance, if you can go to the newsgroup alt.config (using your news reader - outlook express) and comment on [proposal]alt.amstereo i need ~ 100 requests for it and it'll come on-line. to configure your outlook express for news click tools -> accounts -> click ADD -> news -> enter a display name -> where it says news server your server will be [news.ISP ADDRESS] for example: news.bigond.net.au click OK > enter your display email address and click -> OK IF you can't get it working eing up your ISP and ask them for step by step instructions to set up news groups , you may already have these setup by defult. You need to add the news group ALT.CONFIG Then go to the message [proposal]alt.amstereo rightclick the message header and click 'reply to group' then type in a short message saying yes you want it. IF EVERYONE ON THIS form sas yes to it, that would be almost enough to get the group created. THEN there will be another outlet for amstereo related topics. please help, thanks. From tampagar@webtv.net Mon Nov 18 06:20:23 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: tampagar@webtv.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Nov 2002 14:20:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 7573 invoked from network); 18 Nov 2002 14:20:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Nov 2002 14:20:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.70) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Nov 2002 14:20:22 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.190] by n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Nov 2002 14:20:22 -0000 Date: Mon, 18 Nov 2002 14:20:19 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: the death of KFRC Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 671 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "gar_fla_62" X-Originating-IP: 209.240.198.61 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=102439005 X-Yahoo-Profile: gar_fla_62 I just checked KFRC's website and, on one hand, it's good to see they're playing top 40 from the 60s and 70s but it looks as though 610 is just being "used" by FM. Hey, do you know what ever became of Dr. Don Rose? Being that KFRC is non directional, I've wondered what the greatest distance is that the signal has been picked up. I remember hearing it at night one time when I visited the L.A. area back in 1977. KFI had a very strong night time signal up in the S.F. area. Believe it or not, when I returned to New Jersey from my California visit that summer, I picked up KFI! This only happened once and I would listen night after night in hopes of hearing it again. From mychucky@funport.net Mon Nov 18 06:44:15 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: mychucky@funport.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Nov 2002 14:44:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 56810 invoked from network); 18 Nov 2002 14:44:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Nov 2002 14:44:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.funport.com) (216.199.19.6) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Nov 2002 14:44:12 -0000 Received: from FatMusic2000 ([]) by mail.funport.com (Merak 5.3.2) with SMTP id JFB36580 for ; Mon, 18 Nov 2002 09:44:14 -0500 Message-ID: <004601c28f10$edf48930$1400a8c0@FatMusic2000> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Radio Disney Date: Mon, 18 Nov 2002 09:43:58 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=85836819 X-Yahoo-Profile: mychucky1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I would like to see the answer to this too. I work at Radio Shack and I am not aware of ANY receivers in stock currently our stores. Regards Chuck www.stereoam.com ----- Original Message ----- From: gar_fla_62 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, November 17, 2002 1:13 PM Subject: {AMSF} Re: Radio Disney Radio Shack carries AM stereo tuners? What kind is it? I've called three different local Radio Shacks and was told they didn't have any AM stereo receivers. Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From mychucky@funport.net Mon Nov 18 06:51:46 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: mychucky@funport.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Nov 2002 14:51:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 15813 invoked from network); 18 Nov 2002 14:51:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Nov 2002 14:51:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.funport.com) (216.199.19.6) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Nov 2002 14:51:42 -0000 Received: from FatMusic2000 ([]) by mail.funport.com (Merak 5.3.2) with SMTP id JFB36580 for ; Mon, 18 Nov 2002 09:51:44 -0500 Message-ID: <007c01c28f11$fa7765a0$1400a8c0@FatMusic2000> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} SLIGHTLY OT? Date: Mon, 18 Nov 2002 09:50:29 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=85836819 X-Yahoo-Profile: mychucky1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Very Profound, I think Ben is correct. It does appear to be digital......... ----- Original Message ----- From: Ben To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, November 18, 2002 1:10 AM Subject: {AMSF} SLIGHTLY OT? Hi all, With the recent threads on analogue and digital transmissions, it got me thinking... "Is the Human Brain Analogue or Digital?" My answer: Digital. Reasoning: (and it may be flawed) The basic building block of the brain is the Neuron. What do Neurons do? They either fire or don't fire. That is they are either on or off, 1 or 0, ie - binary = digital. Now, what I was just wondering before is, what is the resolution of the Brain's D to A converter? Very high, I would imagine. Plus the technology we have today, would not come anywhere near it. That is: Brain's DAC resolution is equivalent to the sand in an hourglass, where as current technology = pebbles in an hourglass. What do you think? Are we digital or analogue, when it comes down to the thing that is processing what we see and do... Cheers, Mad Scientist of Crofton Downs. Ben. Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From michaelj@vcn.com Mon Nov 18 06:55:37 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Nov 2002 14:55:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 61042 invoked from network); 18 Nov 2002 14:55:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Nov 2002 14:55:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m3-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.33) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Nov 2002 14:55:36 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m3-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Mon, 18 Nov 2002 07:55:35 -0700 Message-ID: <00a001c28f12$8b986980$0701010a@keva> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: the death of KFRC Date: Mon, 18 Nov 2002 07:55:32 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I pick up KFRC on an occasional basis at night here in Wyoming. Sometimes it's very faint and barely audible, other times it can be a pretty good signal. It's the only oldies at 610, though.....so when I hear it, I know it's them. I've never gotten a stereo pilot from them, though. I'm pretty sure they pulled the plug on the AM Stereo a while back and they're just mono these days. MJR n WYO ----- Original Message ----- From: gar_fla_62 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, November 18, 2002 7:20 AM Subject: {AMSF} Re: the death of KFRC I just checked KFRC's website and, on one hand, it's good to see they're playing top 40 from the 60s and 70s but it looks as though 610 is just being "used" by FM. Hey, do you know what ever became of Dr. Don Rose? Being that KFRC is non directional, I've wondered what the greatest distance is that the signal has been picked up. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Nov 18 07:27:25 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Nov 2002 15:27:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 27072 invoked from network); 18 Nov 2002 15:27:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Nov 2002 15:27:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Nov 2002 15:27:24 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.140] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Nov 2002 15:27:19 -0000 Date: Mon, 18 Nov 2002 15:27:19 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: new news group request help Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <001d01c28f00$a801afd0$1a02a8c0@unit> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1219 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > I'm wanting to set up an am stereo news group that will allow a > greater reach of people, and i need your assistance, if you can go > to the newsgroup alt.config (using your news reader - outlook > express) and comment on [proposal]alt.amstereo i need ~ 100 > requests for it and it'll come on-line. That's actually something I've thought about for years, even before any online AM Stereo community (such as this one) existed. However, I think the newsgroup address "alt.radio.amstereo" might be more appropriate, since several "alt.radio" groups already exist, including "alt.radio.broadcasting" and "alt.radio.pirate". It is true that a Usenet newsgroup is widely accessible, but that is both good and bad. The structure of this group gives us several features not available on a Usenet newsgroup, including a directory of our membership, a readily accessible and complete archive of all past messages, and the dedicated Files and Photos sections. Newsgroups are also open to unwanted "spam" and generally have little to no sense of security. At this point I don't know if I would actively promote the creation of an AM Stereo newsgroup, but if you want to go ahead, I suppose it wouldn't hurt. From tampagar@webtv.net Mon Nov 18 07:34:34 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: tampagar@webtv.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Nov 2002 15:34:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 32374 invoked from network); 18 Nov 2002 15:34:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Nov 2002 15:34:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Nov 2002 15:34:33 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.153] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Nov 2002 15:34:33 -0000 Date: Mon, 18 Nov 2002 15:34:30 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: the death of KFRC Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <00a001c28f12$8b986980$0701010a@keva> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 752 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "gar_fla_62" X-Originating-IP: 209.240.198.61 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=102439005 X-Yahoo-Profile: gar_fla_62 "I pick up KFRC on an occasional basis at night here in Wyoming. Sometimes it's very faint and barely audible, other times it can be a pretty good signal. It's the only oldies at 610, though.....so when I hear it, I know it's them. I've never gotten a stereo pilot from them, though. I'm pretty sure they pulled the plug on the AM Stereo a while back and they're just mono these days."..... Wyoming! Thanks for the info. That's great for a non directional signal. I can't wait to start DXing in AM stereo again (if I ever get one). I remember the stereo signal was an advantage in being able to identify the station I was looking for. I'm curious. Does anyone know of a 5000 kw station ever having been picked up completely across the country? From tampagar@webtv.net Mon Nov 18 07:42:14 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: tampagar@webtv.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Nov 2002 15:42:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 81702 invoked from network); 18 Nov 2002 15:42:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Nov 2002 15:42:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Nov 2002 15:42:13 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.160] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Nov 2002 15:42:07 -0000 Date: Mon, 18 Nov 2002 15:42:06 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Radio Shack Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <004601c28f10$edf48930$1400a8c0@FatMusic2000> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 260 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "gar_fla_62" X-Originating-IP: 209.240.198.61 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=102439005 X-Yahoo-Profile: gar_fla_62 Thanks for letting me know about Radio Shack, Chuck. It will save me a lot of time. As I've mentioned, even speaking directly with the people at Sony and AIWA didn't give any straight answer as to whether or not their AM stereo receivers are still available. From possumhunter@netzero.net Mon Nov 18 08:40:10 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Nov 2002 16:40:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 91942 invoked from network); 18 Nov 2002 16:40:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Nov 2002 16:40:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.80) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Nov 2002 16:40:09 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 18 Nov 2002 08:40:09 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: the death of KFRC Date: Mon, 18 Nov 2002 11:39:50 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 18 Nov 2002 16:40:09.0273 (UTC) FILETIME=[284EA290:01C28F21] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.141.135.21] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 gar_fla_62 wrote: >Does anyone know of a 5000 kw station ever having been picked up completely across the country? Sometimes I can hear KDIA-AM 1640 kHz here in South Carolina. KDIA sounds like a local in Hawaii between HI Sunset and CA Sunrise. Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From fanfare@globility.com Mon Nov 18 09:32:23 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Nov 2002 17:32:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 29811 invoked from network); 18 Nov 2002 17:32:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Nov 2002 17:32:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Nov 2002 17:32:22 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.157] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Nov 2002 17:32:09 -0000 Date: Mon, 18 Nov 2002 17:32:07 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: new news group request help Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2046 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Marv Southcott" X-Originating-IP: 64.56.234.167 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin T." wrote: > > I'm wanting to set up an am stereo news group that will allow a > > greater reach of people, I think the newsgroup address "alt.radio.amstereo" might be more > appropriate, since several "alt.radio" groups already exist, > including "alt.radio.broadcasting" and "alt.radio.pirate". > > It is true that a Usenet newsgroup is widely accessible, but that is > both good and bad. > At this point I don't know if I would actively promote the creation > of an AM Stereo newsgroup, but if you want to go ahead, I suppose it > wouldn't hurt. IMHO, the idea is appealing for a couple of reasons. While this group offers the great perks you have indicated Kevin, there is still the requirement that everyone wanting to comment must join. That, to some, is an unwelcome hassle because all they want to do is comment, without registering with the Yahoo machine. Lotsa people think the spam in their mail gets increased when they sign on with an "opt-in" group like Yahoo and Lycos, etc. Who knows. I get a couple of thousand spams a week, many of them saying I'm on an "opt-in" list somewhere. If you don't mind Matt, I would suggest you go with Kevin's suggestion that the usenet group be named "alt.radio.amstereo". Another benefit is that the AMstereo Forum can be advertised there and those interested can become further involved with the core advocacy this group offers. Finally, the draw from a usenet group is decidedly greater and brings opinions from everywhere. Yes, there's spam, but a quick highlight and delete of all that crap can be done very quickly. As for pics and files, anyone that interested will join the forum. P.S. If you do choose to post to any Usenet group, and you're will ing to accept mail privately, make sure you 'gimmick' your Email address so it can't be used by a spam list harvester. Use an extra character like an "X" in your email alias. Just tell people to remove it before sending. M. From tampagar@webtv.net Mon Nov 18 10:51:29 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: tampagar@webtv.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Nov 2002 18:51:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 60549 invoked from network); 18 Nov 2002 18:51:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Nov 2002 18:51:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.66) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Nov 2002 18:51:27 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.160] by n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Nov 2002 18:51:26 -0000 Date: Mon, 18 Nov 2002 18:51:24 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: the death of KFRC Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 303 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "gar_fla_62" X-Originating-IP: 209.240.198.61 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=102439005 X-Yahoo-Profile: gar_fla_62 Possum Hunter, thanks. This is interesting because I did a check for KDIA and they are shown to be only 1000 at night. http://www.geocities.com/amlogbook/freq.htm I'm starting to feel a little old because I'm used to thinking of AM going up to only around 1600. I haven't yet DXed beyond that. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Nov 18 11:01:43 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Nov 2002 19:01:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 34047 invoked from network); 18 Nov 2002 19:01:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Nov 2002 19:01:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.70) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Nov 2002 19:01:42 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.167] by n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Nov 2002 19:01:41 -0000 Date: Mon, 18 Nov 2002 19:01:34 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: new news group request help Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1858 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > offers the great perks you have indicated Kevin, there is still the > requirement that everyone wanting to comment must join. That, to > some, is an unwelcome hassle because all they want to do is > comment, without registering with the Yahoo machine. Anybody with a Yahoo account can post and read messages through the group's web site. You don't have to "join" the AM Stereo Forum group to participate in it. > Lotsa people think the spam in their mail gets increased when they > sign on with an "opt-in" group like Yahoo and Lycos, etc. Who > knows. I get a couple of thousand spams a week, many of them saying > I'm on an "opt-in" list somewhere. "Opt-in" is a hoax. There is no such thing, nor are there any legitimate "opt-out" lists. Spammers will do everything and anything to fool you into thinking that you somehow caused them to spam you, or that you have some easy way of preventing them from sending you more spam (via an "Remove me from your mailing list"-type link which actually causes you to get MORE spam because it identifies your e- mail address as a "live" target). Also note that the U.S. Senate bill which every spam uses to claim legitimacy doesn't exist either; it was proposed, but never approved. I use Yahoo e-mail exclusively and I get comparatively little "spam"; just 1 or 2 a day on average, that usually get automatically sorted into Yahoo Mail's "Bulk Mail" folder where they can be deleted without even having to read them. Yahoo itself will not generate any "spam" as long as you go to your "Marketing Prefereces" and un-check all of the "please send me information about..." categories. This will remove you from all of their internal junk- mail lists. While you're perusing the Usenet newsgroups, you might want to check out "alt.spam" for tips on how to deal with and prevent e-mail spam. From possumhunter@netzero.net Mon Nov 18 11:51:36 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Nov 2002 19:51:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 22336 invoked from network); 18 Nov 2002 19:51:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Nov 2002 19:51:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.79) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Nov 2002 19:51:35 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 18 Nov 2002 11:51:35 -0800 To: , References: <004601c28f10$edf48930$1400a8c0@FatMusic2000> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Radio Disney Date: Mon, 18 Nov 2002 14:51:22 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 18 Nov 2002 19:51:35.0495 (UTC) FILETIME=[E6A10570:01C28F3B] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.155.86.64] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Chuck wrote: > I would like to see the answer to this too. I work at Radio Shack and I am not aware of ANY receivers in stock currently our stores. I am saving my nickles and dimes to buy a gray market Sony srf-a300. Could I pick it up in Jacksonville and save on the shipping? I am in Central Florida a good bit during each Winter. Possum From possumhunter@netzero.net Mon Nov 18 12:14:27 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Nov 2002 20:14:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 87794 invoked from network); 18 Nov 2002 20:14:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Nov 2002 20:14:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.199) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Nov 2002 20:14:27 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 18 Nov 2002 12:14:27 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: the death of KFRC Date: Mon, 18 Nov 2002 15:14:14 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 18 Nov 2002 20:14:27.0039 (UTC) FILETIME=[182206F0:01C28F3F] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.155.86.64] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 gar_fla_62 wrote: > Possum Hunter, thanks. This is interesting because I did a check for KDIA and they are shown to be only 1000 at night. All X-band stations are 10KW day 1KW night Non-D > > I'm starting to feel a little old because I'm used to thinking of AM going up to only around 1600. I haven't yet DXed beyond that. Don't feel bad, my AtwaterKent radio only goes to 1500, and it is my best DXer. You should enjoy the X-band while you still can, it is quickly turning into just another graveyard. The FCC shoulda have followed my suggestion to make the X-band stations all 1-A Clears. and make stereo a requirement. But then, they didn't think much of my idea of bringing back SuperPower Clears and returning the Class 2 and Class 3s back to pre-1970 nighttime signal levels, doing away with pre-sunrise-Post sunset authority. Post sunset has even made many of the clears graveyards :-( Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From dav259@csiro.au Mon Nov 18 14:47:12 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Nov 2002 22:47:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 6203 invoked from network); 18 Nov 2002 22:47:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Nov 2002 22:47:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Nov 2002 22:47:09 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAIMl7P05333 for ; Tue, 19 Nov 2002 09:47:08 +1100 (EST) Date: Tue, 19 Nov 2002 09:47:07 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Subject: Re: {AMSF} new news group request help In-Reply-To: <001d01c28f00$a801afd0$1a02a8c0@unit> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public On Mon, 18 Nov 2002, amstereo - matt2 wrote: > I'm wanting to set up an am stereo news group that will allow a greater > reach of people, and i need your assistance, if you can go to the newsgroup > alt.config (using your news reader - outlook express) and comment on > [proposal]alt.amstereo i need ~ 100 requests for it and it'll come on-line. Hi Matt I think it's a great idea! - but think the category should come under "radio" so the its name would be "alt.radio.amstereo" to fit in with google normal structures. I couldn't understand your instructions but it seems anyone (not just google subscribers) can repond to your message at: http://groups.google.com/groups?dq=&hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&threadm=3dd8e535%240%2418872%24afc38c87%40news.optusnet.com.au&prev=/groups%3Fgroup%3Dalt.config If that's too long click on http://groups.google.com/groups?group=alt.config and find and respond to: 18 Nov 2002 [proposal]alt.amstereo (Marv already has started a new thread.) Ian From evergreenterrace@buzzle.com Mon Nov 18 15:20:00 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: evergreenterrace@buzzle.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Nov 2002 23:20:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 82750 invoked from network); 18 Nov 2002 23:20:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Nov 2002 23:20:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Nov 2002 23:19:59 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.130] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Nov 2002 23:19:59 -0000 Date: Mon, 18 Nov 2002 23:19:57 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Another anti-IBOC letter Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1639 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgliradio" X-Originating-IP: 170.20.11.59 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=69711087 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgliradio The best way to improve radio: Mandate AMAX technology in every AM radio. Every radio that has FM stereo must have AM stereo. The AM would operate in wideband in the stereo mode, and with a gentle rolloff in mono. If Symphony works (and I think it will), mandate that every receiver costing $25 or more to have it by 2008. Mandate RDS for all FM car radios and home tuners costing $50 or more by 2008. The problem with IBOC is that it isn't "cool". There is no public outcry for it (and XM and Sirius are in serious trouble). DVD's replaced VCR's because DVD's are EASIER to handle, it's EASIER to navigate and you get IMPORTANT extras. With IBOC, the audio quality slightly improves for FM (and degrades for AM) while you add BS bells and whistles. It's all fluff and no substance and nothing you COULDN'T do with RDS if you MANDATE IT! As for AM stereo, that works VERY well (and any engineer who tells you AM stereo CANNOT work is an engineer who shouldn't be working because he is clueless). AM stereo did not have an Ibiquity behind it... owned by major broadcasters with everything to lose if it doesn't work out. IBOC will never sound as good as wideband AM on a properly designed receiver. Period. Instead of IBOC, we should look towards improving receiver design and cleaning up our act. What we have in place (AM and FM) is capable of transmitting VERY high quality audio, audio which is preferred over digital compression by many. We need to enhance and not destroy. The technology is there, program the god-damn stations correctly, improve the receivers and you'll have your radio nirvana. From evergreenterrace@buzzle.com Mon Nov 18 15:22:56 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: evergreenterrace@buzzle.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Nov 2002 23:22:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 52108 invoked from network); 18 Nov 2002 23:22:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Nov 2002 23:22:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Nov 2002 23:22:56 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.182] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Nov 2002 23:22:56 -0000 Date: Mon, 18 Nov 2002 23:22:56 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: AMAX demo Part 1 (WTTM) Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 423 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgliradio" X-Originating-IP: 170.20.11.59 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=69711087 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgliradio --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin T." wrote: > Thanks to a recently acquired Chrysler "Infinity" radio which I just > set up today, the first in a series of AMAX demonstration recordings > (which will eventually go on a compilation CD) has been completed. This is some of the best AM audio I have heard. Neal Newman has done a fantastic job with WTTM. It is truly another nail in the IBOC coffin. From groucho@skyweb.net Mon Nov 18 16:23:23 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Nov 2002 00:23:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 39440 invoked from network); 19 Nov 2002 00:23:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Nov 2002 00:23:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Nov 2002 00:23:22 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gAJ0RMEx064588 for ; Mon, 18 Nov 2002 19:27:23 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DD98460.4DA20D2E@skyweb.net> Date: Mon, 18 Nov 2002 19:22:56 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: the death of KFRC References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 NOT TRUE.... there are at least or or 2 X band stations that are Licensed for 10kw Day non-directional and 9kw night directional Neal CE WTTM 1680 Possum Hunter wrote: > gar_fla_62 wrote: > > Possum Hunter, thanks. This is interesting because I did a check for KDIA > and they are shown to be only 1000 at night. > > All X-band stations are 10KW day 1KW night Non-D > > > > I'm starting to feel a little old because I'm used to thinking of AM > going up to only around 1600. I haven't yet DXed beyond that. > > Don't feel bad, my AtwaterKent radio only goes to 1500, and it is my best > DXer. You should enjoy the X-band while you still can, it is quickly turning > into just another graveyard. The FCC shoulda have followed my suggestion to > make the X-band stations all 1-A Clears. and make stereo a requirement. But > then, they didn't think much of my idea of bringing back SuperPower Clears > and returning the Class 2 and Class 3s back to pre-1970 nighttime signal > levels, doing away with pre-sunrise-Post sunset authority. Post sunset has > even made many of the clears graveyards :-( > > Long live FREE RADIO! > > Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ > Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From tampagar@webtv.net Mon Nov 18 16:27:55 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: tampagar@webtv.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Nov 2002 00:27:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 51712 invoked from network); 19 Nov 2002 00:27:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Nov 2002 00:27:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.66) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Nov 2002 00:27:54 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.174] by n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 19 Nov 2002 00:27:53 -0000 Date: Tue, 19 Nov 2002 00:27:52 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: DXing and broadcast power Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 161 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "gar_fla_62" X-Originating-IP: 209.240.198.61 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=102439005 X-Yahoo-Profile: gar_fla_62 Possum, was the signal you picked up from KDIA only 1kw ND? Or did they maybe have stronger signal at the times you received it from South Carolina and Hawaii? From possumhunter@netzero.net Mon Nov 18 16:32:07 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Nov 2002 00:32:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 51873 invoked from network); 19 Nov 2002 00:32:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Nov 2002 00:32:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.96) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Nov 2002 00:32:07 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 18 Nov 2002 16:32:07 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: DXing and broadcast power Date: Mon, 18 Nov 2002 19:31:55 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Nov 2002 00:32:07.0507 (UTC) FILETIME=[174A3A30:01C28F63] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.158.91.189] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 gar_fla_62 wrote: > Possum, was the signal you picked up from KDIA only 1kw ND? Or did they maybe have stronger signal at the times you received it from South Carolina and Hawaii? It should have been on 1KW, unless somthing was going on. Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From possumhunter@netzero.net Mon Nov 18 16:47:54 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Nov 2002 00:47:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 94620 invoked from network); 19 Nov 2002 00:47:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Nov 2002 00:47:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.20) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Nov 2002 00:47:54 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 18 Nov 2002 16:47:53 -0800 To: References: <3DD98460.4DA20D2E@skyweb.net> Subject: X-Band Was: the death of KFRC Date: Mon, 18 Nov 2002 19:47:41 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Nov 2002 00:47:53.0929 (UTC) FILETIME=[4B66C390:01C28F65] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.158.91.189] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Neal Newman wrote: >there are at least or or 2 X band stations that are Licensed for 10kw Day non-directional and 9kw night directional Now that is interesting! Which ones? I thought the whole idea behind the X-band was to have each station 10KW Day and 1KW Night non-d and protected for 600 miles, but I was out of the loop for a long time. Now I am back at it in the same station I started in, but with new owners who are actually improving the station! Can anybody on the list that can recommend a good AM consulting Engineer? Now that a couple of local AMs have gone silent, changed frequencies, or power levels, The station I am at wants to increase power and get a CQUAM generator. It looks to me like there is enough room for 5KW. We now have the whole station stereo all the way up to the Optimod. Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From groucho@skyweb.net Mon Nov 18 18:02:41 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Nov 2002 02:02:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 37979 invoked from network); 19 Nov 2002 02:02:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Nov 2002 02:02:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Nov 2002 02:02:38 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gAJ26eEx093439 for ; Mon, 18 Nov 2002 21:06:40 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DD99BA6.50EDA5A8@skyweb.net> Date: Mon, 18 Nov 2002 21:02:14 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} X-Band Was: the death of KFRC References: <3DD98460.4DA20D2E@skyweb.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 I believe the station up by me on WWRU 1660 is running that way... 10kw Day ND and 9kw directional at night...I am 99% sure of this.. this was a recent Change... Not sure of the second one though... as far as the 600 mile protection please tell me where I can find that in the Rules.. Because I thought that also but could Not Find it.. However I did find out that there is protection Coverage out to 125 Km From the .5mv Contour I know a few good consultants. the FCC is not accepting any AM Filings at this time.. even though I have one waiting myself... Neal Possum Hunter wrote: > Neal Newman wrote: > >there are at least or or 2 X band stations that are Licensed for 10kw Day > non-directional and 9kw night directional > > Now that is interesting! Which ones? I thought the whole idea behind the > X-band was to have each station 10KW Day and 1KW Night non-d and protected > for 600 miles, but I was out of the loop for a long time. Now I am back at > it in the same station I started in, but with new owners who are actually > improving the station! > > Can anybody on the list that can recommend a good AM consulting Engineer? > Now that a couple of local AMs have gone silent, changed frequencies, or > power levels, The station I am at wants to increase power and get a CQUAM > generator. It looks to me like there is enough room for 5KW. We now have the > whole station stereo all the way up to the Optimod. > > Long live FREE RADIO! > > Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ > Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Nov 18 19:15:22 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Nov 2002 03:15:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 78194 invoked from network); 19 Nov 2002 03:15:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Nov 2002 03:15:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Nov 2002 03:15:20 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.155] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 19 Nov 2002 03:15:20 -0000 Date: Tue, 19 Nov 2002 03:15:17 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: the death of KFRC Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1483 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.69.47 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > You should enjoy the X-band while you still can, it is quickly > turning into just another graveyard. ...Partly because of all the little 10-watt TIS stations that are being allocated on it. At my location, I can now pick up TISes on 1610, 1630, 1640, and 1700 kHz. I thought they were supposed to set aside 1710 kHz as the new TIS channel (moved up from 1610), but there is only one TIS in the whole USA allocated to 1710 kHz, and many digital tuning radios stop at 1700 kHz. They could have also used 520 kHz for TISes since a surprisingly high number of digital-tuning radios will tune down to 520 kHz. There are even some radios that will tune from 520 to 1720 kHz on AM, and I have even heard of one radio (with digital tuning) that goes up to *109.5 MHz* on FM! > and returning the Class 2 and Class 3s back to pre-1970 nighttime > signal levels, doing away with pre-sunrise-Post sunset authority. They thought mutual nighttime interference levels wouldn't go up when the "Local" Class C stations went from 250 watts to 1000 watts at night... they were wrong. Except when the ionosphere is dead, most Local stations struggle to get 10 miles of decent coverage radius at night. Lowering the nighttime power limit down to at most 500 watts would cut down the interference significantly, and coverage areas would actually improve even with the lower power levels -- not to mention the cumulative effect of lower energy consumption across the country. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Nov 18 19:46:12 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Nov 2002 03:46:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 89050 invoked from network); 19 Nov 2002 03:46:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Nov 2002 03:46:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.75) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Nov 2002 03:46:11 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.160] by n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 19 Nov 2002 03:46:10 -0000 Date: Tue, 19 Nov 2002 03:46:08 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: DXing and broadcast power Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1019 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.69.47 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > It should have been on 1KW, unless somthing was going on. In the very early days of the Expanded Band, full 10 kW daytime power may have been used after sunset. For example, during their first month or so of broadcasting, 1660 WJDM in Elizabeth, NJ -- then the ONLY Expanded Band station on the air -- ran full 10 kW daytime power until sign-off at 10:00 PM, with automated Oldies music playing in AM Stereo. 1660 in NJ is now WWRU licensed to Jersey City, with 9 kW directional at night, aimed sharply at New York City, leaving most of the signal out over the Atlantic Ocean. Thus, their nighttime signal on land is probably less than it was at 1 kW non-directional. I know that I don't pick them up as clearly here in central NJ anymore, although I can verify that WWRU is transmitting a C-Quam Stereo pilot tone 24 hours a day, even though their syndicated "Radio Unica" programming is 100% mono. Hey, at least it opens Delco receivers up to a wider bandwidth, and lights the "ST" indicator.... From tampagar@webtv.net Mon Nov 18 19:50:01 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: tampagar@webtv.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Nov 2002 03:50:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 88445 invoked from network); 19 Nov 2002 03:50:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Nov 2002 03:50:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.89) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Nov 2002 03:50:01 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.152] by n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 19 Nov 2002 03:50:01 -0000 Date: Tue, 19 Nov 2002 03:50:00 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: DXing and broadcast power Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 755 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "gar_fla_62" X-Originating-IP: 209.240.198.61 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=102439005 X-Yahoo-Profile: gar_fla_62 "It should have been 1kw, unless something was going on"...... I find it hard to imagine how only a 1kw could be heard so far away and on a frequency that's shared by other stations. Even in the late 70s and early 80s when I did some serious DXing from Northern California, I was able to only faintly hear 880 WCBS and 1210 WCAU (50kw ND clear channel stations) on the best nights. Maybe you heard them going with daytime power at night? Way back when I was growing up in the Jersey suburbs of Philadelphia, WIBG would cut their power from 50kw during the day to 10kw directional at night. Even being that close, the change was SO obvious. I can remember tuning to WIBG at night a couple of times where I could swear they were running on daytime power. From groucho@skyweb.net Mon Nov 18 20:04:32 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Nov 2002 04:04:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 1287 invoked from network); 19 Nov 2002 04:04:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Nov 2002 04:04:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Nov 2002 04:04:30 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gAJ48WEx025756 for ; Mon, 18 Nov 2002 23:08:33 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DD9B834.23968AAD@skyweb.net> Date: Mon, 18 Nov 2002 23:04:04 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: DXing and broadcast power References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 These Days WIBG 1020 is owned by a close personal friend of mine. and its a Daytime only station running at 500 watts.. Neal gar_fla_62 wrote: > "It should have been 1kw, unless something was going on"...... I find it hard to imagine how only a 1kw could be heard so far away and on a frequency that's shared by other stations. Even in the late 70s and early 80s when I did some serious DXing from Northern California, I was able to only faintly hear 880 WCBS and 1210 WCAU (50kw ND clear channel stations) on the best nights. Maybe you heard them going with daytime power at night? Way back when I was growing up in the Jersey suburbs of Philadelphia, WIBG would cut their power from 50kw during the day to 10kw directional at night. Even being that close, the change was SO obvious. I can remember tuning to WIBG at night a couple of times where I could swear they were running on daytime power. > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From possumhunter@netzero.net Mon Nov 18 20:06:58 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Nov 2002 04:06:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 33827 invoked from network); 19 Nov 2002 04:06:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Nov 2002 04:06:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.201) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Nov 2002 04:06:56 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 18 Nov 2002 20:06:55 -0800 To: References: <3DD98460.4DA20D2E@skyweb.net> <3DD99BA6.50EDA5A8@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} X-Band Was: the death of KFRC Date: Mon, 18 Nov 2002 23:06:39 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Nov 2002 04:06:55.0960 (UTC) FILETIME=[19681580:01C28F81] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.158.91.189] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Neal Newman wrote: > I believe the station up by me on WWRU 1660 is running that way... 10kw Day ND and 9kw directional at night...I am 99% sure of this.. this was a recent Change... That is interesting > > as far as the 600 mile protection please tell me where I can find that in the Rules.. Because I thought that also but could Not Find it.. However I did find out that there is protection Coverage out to 125 Km From the .5mv Contour I know I read it somewhere......My brain does get kind of foggy after a while! > > I know a few good consultants. the FCC is not accepting any AM Filings at this time. It seems like they want us small AMs to just dry up and die off, but it is not working. WFIS is giving the big boy stations up in Greenville a good sound threshing in the ratings. The original 1957 vintage ATU is falling apart, so that is the next project. All of the advertising that I sell goes to buy equipment LOL. I am thinking about a Kintronics ATU http://www.kintronic.com any suggestions? I was looking at buying another station, but only if I can move it to town. As it sits, there are only cow pastures in the .5mv Contour! LOL Somehow I just don't think cows are very interested in listening to music in AM STEREO. The equipment that is in the station is all junk, (a Radio Shack board is on the air!) but I have enough stuff laying around here to make it sound good on the air, including a fully restored transmitter I think I have found me a pair of DAP 310s and a Harris Stereo 80 board, I will know in the morning. Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From groucho@skyweb.net Mon Nov 18 20:28:03 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Nov 2002 04:28:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 91285 invoked from network); 19 Nov 2002 04:27:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Nov 2002 04:27:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Nov 2002 04:27:48 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gAJ4VoEx031425 for ; Mon, 18 Nov 2002 23:31:50 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DD9BDA9.A4B9F7E9@skyweb.net> Date: Mon, 18 Nov 2002 23:27:22 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} X-Band Was: the death of KFRC References: <3DD98460.4DA20D2E@skyweb.net> <3DD99BA6.50EDA5A8@skyweb.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Well I don't make much money as an Engineer about $12k a year don't ask how I survive I'm still trying to figure that out myself. But would love to put sweat equity into a station to become a partner somewhere. it was phasetek that Built the Diplexer and 6 tower phasor out at My site very well designed and built. as you can see from the Pics on my website http://www.angelfire.com/nj4/wttm Neal Possum Hunter wrote: > Neal Newman wrote: > > I believe the station up by me on WWRU 1660 is running that way... 10kw > Day ND and 9kw directional at night...I am 99% sure of this.. this was a > recent Change... > > That is interesting > > > > as far as the 600 mile protection please tell me where I can find that in > the Rules.. Because I thought that also but could Not Find it.. However I > did find out that there is protection Coverage out to 125 Km From the .5mv > Contour > > I know I read it somewhere......My brain does get kind of foggy after a > while! > > > > I know a few good consultants. the FCC is not accepting any AM Filings > at this time. > > It seems like they want us small AMs to just dry up and die off, but it is > not working. WFIS is giving the big boy stations up in Greenville a good > sound threshing in the ratings. The original 1957 vintage ATU is falling > apart, so that is the next project. All of the advertising that I sell goes > to buy equipment LOL. I am thinking about a Kintronics ATU > http://www.kintronic.com any suggestions? > > I was looking at buying another station, but only if I can move it to town. > As it sits, there are only cow pastures in the .5mv Contour! LOL Somehow I > just don't think cows are very interested in listening to music in AM > STEREO. The equipment that is in the station is all junk, (a Radio Shack > board is on the air!) but I have enough stuff laying around here to make it > sound good on the air, including a fully restored transmitter I think I > have found me a pair of DAP 310s and a Harris Stereo 80 board, I will know > in the morning. > > Long live FREE RADIO! > > Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ > Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From possumhunter@netzero.net Mon Nov 18 20:31:07 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Nov 2002 04:31:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 39439 invoked from network); 19 Nov 2002 04:31:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Nov 2002 04:31:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.97) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Nov 2002 04:31:06 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 18 Nov 2002 20:31:06 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: DXing and broadcast power Date: Mon, 18 Nov 2002 23:30:49 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Nov 2002 04:31:06.0494 (UTC) FILETIME=[79FE01E0:01C28F84] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.158.91.189] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 gar_fla_62 wrote: I find it hard to imagine how only a 1kw could be heard so far away and on a frequency that's shared by other stations. I am listening to KCJJ as I write this. It all depends on the way the ionosphere is brewing. Sorry, Neal 1680 is solid WTIR Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From groucho@skyweb.net Mon Nov 18 20:41:39 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Nov 2002 04:41:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 44860 invoked from network); 19 Nov 2002 04:41:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Nov 2002 04:41:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Nov 2002 04:41:37 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gAJ4jcEx034826 for ; Mon, 18 Nov 2002 23:45:39 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DD9C0E5.9C01BEA5@skyweb.net> Date: Mon, 18 Nov 2002 23:41:09 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: DXing and broadcast power References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 that's normal seems that Either WTIR or the TIS stations own 1680 Possum Hunter wrote: > gar_fla_62 wrote: > I find it hard to imagine how only a 1kw could be heard so far away and on a > frequency that's shared by other stations. > > I am listening to KCJJ as I write this. It all depends on the way the > ionosphere is brewing. Sorry, Neal 1680 is solid WTIR > > Long live FREE RADIO! > > Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ > Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From rwagoner@cox.net Mon Nov 18 21:36:50 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner@cox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Nov 2002 05:36:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 88203 invoked from network); 19 Nov 2002 05:36:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Nov 2002 05:36:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.66) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Nov 2002 05:36:49 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.252] by n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 19 Nov 2002 05:36:49 -0000 Date: Tue, 19 Nov 2002 05:36:49 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: SLIGHTLY OT? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 171 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Richard Wagoner" X-Originating-IP: 68.4.33.253 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=96123889 X-Yahoo-Profile: richardalanwagoner >Japan developed an analog HDTV system in the 1980s, with 1125 lines of resolution.< And they dropped it because it was so vastly inferior to the US standard. Richard From n0uiheric@aol.com Mon Nov 18 22:10:20 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Nov 2002 06:10:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 52859 invoked from network); 19 Nov 2002 06:10:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Nov 2002 06:10:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r02.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.98) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Nov 2002 06:10:18 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-r02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.a.28a49010 (4246) for ; Tue, 19 Nov 2002 01:10:12 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Tue, 19 Nov 2002 01:10:12 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: the death of KFRC To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih The reason why KFRC simulcasts it's FM outlet on 610 is because the terrain in the Bay Area is irregular. KOIT does the same with simulcasting it's FM outlet on 1260. When the FM coverage suffers from a severe "picket fence" effect (as I have experienced in mountainous areas near Portland, OR), the AM signal provides a strong signal. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From amfmdx@fastq.com Mon Nov 18 22:20:12 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Nov 2002 06:20:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 69579 invoked from network); 19 Nov 2002 06:20:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Nov 2002 06:20:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Nov 2002 06:20:11 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt ([208.187.57.106]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gAJ6KAv16944 for ; Mon, 18 Nov 2002 23:20:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <011401c28f93$8c451fa0$33f9bed8@kredding430cdt> To: References: <00a001c28f12$8b986980$0701010a@keva> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: the death of KFRC Date: Mon, 18 Nov 2002 23:18:57 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > I pick up KFRC on an occasional basis at night here in Wyoming. Sometimes it's very faint and barely audible, other times it can be a pretty good signal. I get it here in Mesa, Arizona and its WEAK. Kevin From amfmdx@fastq.com Mon Nov 18 22:21:17 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Nov 2002 06:21:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 4122 invoked from network); 19 Nov 2002 06:21:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Nov 2002 06:21:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Nov 2002 06:21:16 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt ([208.187.57.106]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gAJ6LFv16965 for ; Mon, 18 Nov 2002 23:21:15 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <011d01c28f93$b2e65840$33f9bed8@kredding430cdt> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Radio Shack Date: Mon, 18 Nov 2002 23:20:02 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > Thanks for letting me know about Radio Shack, Chuck. The last one sold was p/n 12-127. Kevin From tampagar@webtv.net Mon Nov 18 22:44:42 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: tampagar@webtv.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Nov 2002 06:44:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 51293 invoked from network); 19 Nov 2002 06:44:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Nov 2002 06:44:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Nov 2002 06:44:40 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.142] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 19 Nov 2002 06:44:40 -0000 Date: Tue, 19 Nov 2002 06:44:37 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: DXing and broadcast power Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 475 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "gar_fla_62" X-Originating-IP: 209.240.198.61 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=102439005 X-Yahoo-Profile: gar_fla_62 "I am listening to KCJJ as I write this"...... I was just listening to that frequency (1630) after reading your post and heard a station fading in and out. When fading in, the signal was pretty good. I didn't hear call letters but confirmed it was from Augusta, Georgia. I then looked up that frequency to find that station is listed as only 1kw non-directional at night. If their power really is that low, I'm fascinated at being able to receive it as I can here in Tampa. From dav259@csiro.au Mon Nov 18 23:29:05 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Nov 2002 07:29:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 6127 invoked from network); 19 Nov 2002 07:29:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Nov 2002 07:29:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Nov 2002 07:29:03 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAJ7T1P03136; Tue, 19 Nov 2002 18:29:01 +1100 (EST) Date: Tue, 19 Nov 2002 18:29:01 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: amstereoforum Cc: Steve Dinius <10kc@fmtc.com> Subject: Oz report Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public The last couple of days Talk 1116 3AK has been playing a few commercials in stereo. Very strange ... Sister station Easy Music 3MP is still pilot only after a few weeks - but the CEO says it will be "back to normal" soon. It's reassuring to see him equating AM stereo with "normal". And according to the Oz google newsgroup Newcastle's Good Time Oldies 2HD has gone mono a few days ago. When in Sydney in February 2HD was the ONLY station I could pick up in true stereo. Newcastle is Australia's 6th biggest city and we don't want to lose this one. Is there anyone on the list who can pick up and monitor 2HD? Another google contributor has said that Sport 927 3UZ is the only AM stereo station streaming in stereo at: http://www.ozracing.net.au/sport927.asx 3UZ is pretty much a racing station from 9 am to 11 pm - but plays some nice stereo music in its overnight talk program. I just checked it out and some of its station promos are in stereo. Ian Melbourne From crashknorr@yahoo.com Mon Nov 18 23:58:35 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: crashknorr@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Nov 2002 07:58:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 90121 invoked from network); 19 Nov 2002 07:58:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Nov 2002 07:58:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Nov 2002 07:58:34 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.156] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 19 Nov 2002 07:58:34 -0000 Date: Tue, 19 Nov 2002 07:58:33 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: DXing and broadcast power Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 814 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "crashknorr" X-Originating-IP: 207.69.118.135 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=20677990 X-Yahoo-Profile: crashknorr --- In amstereoforum@y..., "gar_fla_62" wrote: > "station is listed as only 1kw non-directional at night. If their power really is that low, I'm fascinated at being able to receive it as I can here in Tampa." < In the late 1920s, Costa Rican station NRH was heard on every continent and had regular listeners in the US. Power: 7 and a half watts. 250 watt and 1 kilowatt stations were routinely heard from coast to coast. In the very early days of broadcasting when only 3 or 4 wavelengths were known to mankind, some stations would sign off early in the evening to allow their listeners a chance to DX. In 1997 and 1998, TIS stations and pirates operated in the otherwise- vacant expanded band and were heard all over North America, although they were all running 100 watts or less. From philipr@irac.pe.ca Tue Nov 19 05:45:27 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Nov 2002 13:45:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 68961 invoked from network); 19 Nov 2002 13:45:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Nov 2002 13:45:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.68) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Nov 2002 13:45:25 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.175] by n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 19 Nov 2002 13:45:25 -0000 Date: Tue, 19 Nov 2002 13:45:24 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Wideband radios becoming more available Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1959 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking I find it rather interesting the claims from those associated with IBOC that point to the extreme rarity of wideband AM radios, and imply that they are no longer made. We all know of the GE SR III. Chris has told us of the Memorex - and perhaps a few of us have been lucky enough to pick this inexpensive AM performer. Recently, I had the opportunity to experience a 2002 or 2003 Ford Focus. My wife rented one [after an idiot totalled her 14 year old Volvo]. I switched the radio over to AM, and was thrilled to see that CHTN was being reproduced in wideband glory - not up to a Heath PT-1 or a GE SR III, but sounding very good all the same. If I were to offer a guess, I would say flat to 6 khz, with a smooth slope downward, then crashing down at 9khz. Very similar response to my Toyota AM Stereo car radio [not in a car] with the stereo button [and widebandwidth] engaged. Crank the treble control up to "7", keep the bass no higher than "3" and if you are at all paying attention to your driving, it sounds as good as FM. Ok, it sounds better, as CHTN uses less compression/limiting than Magic 93, even though they are controlled by the same LMA. My wife, normally a Magic 93 addict, has left it on CHTN, ejoying listening to oldies with lots of sparkle. I suspect that if we headed for the Nova Scotia south shore this weekend, listening to CHTN all the way, we would find WOR interfering with CHTN just before sunset between Bridgewater and Yarmouth. If I complained, I would probably be told that there is no such thing as a wideband car radio, that I was just imagining things etc. But, the salt water between New York and Nova Scotia enhances ground conductivity greatly. With a good radio, you can receive the big Boston and NY 50 kw stations fairly well by day, if you are close enough to the water. It's also amazing how much FM DX, particularly from Maine, which can be received - good old Troph! From tampagar@webtv.net Tue Nov 19 06:52:38 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: tampagar@webtv.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Nov 2002 14:52:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 10952 invoked from network); 19 Nov 2002 14:52:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Nov 2002 14:52:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Nov 2002 14:52:34 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.141] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 19 Nov 2002 14:52:33 -0000 Date: Tue, 19 Nov 2002 14:52:33 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: DXing and broadcast power Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 287 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "gar_fla_62" X-Originating-IP: 209.240.198.61 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=102439005 X-Yahoo-Profile: gar_fla_62 I'm trying to figure out how these low power stations can travel as far as claimed. In theory, I should then have no problem receiving many of the common 5kw stations from some place like California. Anymore, it's hard enough just getting 50kw stations from New York and Philadelphia. From amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk Tue Nov 19 07:23:06 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Nov 2002 15:23:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 53514 invoked from network); 19 Nov 2002 15:23:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Nov 2002 15:23:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.90) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Nov 2002 15:23:05 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.138] by n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 19 Nov 2002 15:23:05 -0000 Date: Tue, 19 Nov 2002 15:23:04 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Oz report Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 449 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "m1ctk" X-Originating-IP: 217.148.42.166 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113985069 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereofan > Another google contributor has said that Sport 927 3UZ is the only AM > stereo station streaming in stereo at: > http://www.ozracing.net.au/sport927.asx > Interesting though 3UZ's out of phase streaming though makes it sound terrible dificult to tell if it is full stereo but it is of course Btw anyone wanting to rec asx streams on to HDD should look for the progs ASF recorder or hi-net recorder. BOth freeware. Search on google etc From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Nov 19 07:33:17 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Nov 2002 15:33:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 5487 invoked from network); 19 Nov 2002 15:33:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Nov 2002 15:33:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Nov 2002 15:33:11 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.159] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 19 Nov 2002 15:33:10 -0000 Date: Tue, 19 Nov 2002 15:33:10 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: DXing and broadcast power Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1723 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > I'm trying to figure out how these low power stations can travel > as far as claimed. In theory, I should then have no problem > receiving many of the common 5kw stations from some place like > California. Anymore, it's hard enough just getting 50kw stations > from New York and Philadelphia. It's mostly a matter of how "clear" the frequency is -- i.e., how many or few other stations are broadcasting on it. The AM band in North America is congested enough that the signals of lower-power stations are not "protected" at night to any greater distance than their normal daytime coverage (or, for Class D stations, they have no nighttime protection at all!), so long-distance nighttime reception is a rarity. Class A 50,000-watt stations (known as "clear channel" stations) at least theoretically have protected nighttime skywave signal coverage areas, so these are the ones you can hear with the greatest regularity over long distances (usually 100 to 700 miles is the range of consistent skywave coverage from these stations). The Expanded Band (1620-1700 kHz) is unique in that when it was set up in the mid-1990s, it started out with only a handful of stations on the air, with basically no other stations in the entire WORLD using these frequencies (at least at any significant power level). This gave the opportunity for low-power signals to have incredible coverage, day and night. The Expanded Band has gradually gotten more crowded over the years since then, but with a little luck you can still have good long-distance nighttime reception similar to that of the 50,000 watt stations on lower frequencies, even though most Expanded Band stations use no more than 1000 watts at night. From amfmdx@fastq.com Tue Nov 19 07:42:26 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Nov 2002 15:42:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 57114 invoked from network); 19 Nov 2002 15:42:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Nov 2002 15:42:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Nov 2002 15:42:26 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt (d115-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.147]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gAJFgOv23233 for ; Tue, 19 Nov 2002 08:42:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <031601c28fe2$1d246320$33f9bed8@kredding430cdt> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: DXing and broadcast power Date: Tue, 19 Nov 2002 08:41:20 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla I could hear NJ, VA, and FL commonly on the X-band when there were few. I remember KXBT and the other station in Newark, NJ when they first came on. I could hear them easily in AZ. Kevin > It's mostly a matter of how "clear" the frequency is -- i.e., how > many or few other stations are broadcasting on it. > > The Expanded Band (1620-1700 kHz) is unique in that when it was set > up in the mid-1990s, it started out with only a handful of stations > on the air, with basically no other stations in the entire WORLD > using these frequencies (at least at any significant power level). > This gave the opportunity for low-power signals to have incredible > coverage, day and night. From tampagar@webtv.net Tue Nov 19 08:17:55 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: tampagar@webtv.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Nov 2002 16:17:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 40223 invoked from network); 19 Nov 2002 16:17:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Nov 2002 16:17:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Nov 2002 16:17:53 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.140] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 19 Nov 2002 16:17:53 -0000 Date: Tue, 19 Nov 2002 16:17:52 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: DXing and broadcast power Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <031601c28fe2$1d246320$33f9bed8@kredding430cdt> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 563 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "gar_fla_62" X-Originating-IP: 209.240.198.61 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=102439005 X-Yahoo-Profile: gar_fla_62 Thanks for all the information on the expanded band. I'm starting to better understand why a 1kw ND signal can be picked up for great distances if the frequency isn't shared by to many other stations. This reminds me of when I was living in New Jersey about 25 years ago and attempting to hear KFI Los Angeles after picking it up only one time. There was a station on that frequency that would often come in pretty strong. Turns out it was only a 1kw broadcast from some place in Ohio. I plan to spend much more of my evening time listening to the expaned band. From possumhunter@netzero.net Tue Nov 19 09:16:05 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Nov 2002 17:16:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 63034 invoked from network); 19 Nov 2002 17:16:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Nov 2002 17:16:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.85) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Nov 2002 17:16:04 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 19 Nov 2002 09:16:04 -0800 To: References: <3DD9C0E5.9C01BEA5@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: DXing and broadcast power Date: Tue, 19 Nov 2002 12:15:46 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Nov 2002 17:16:04.0453 (UTC) FILETIME=[574EC150:01C28FEF] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.140.249.58] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Neal Newman wrote: > that's normal seems that Either WTIR or the TIS stations own 1680 Why is it that the FCC thinks these 10 - 25 watt nighttime signals won't hurt anything when they can be heard for hundreds of miles on a clear channel? If the FCC keeps this up, they may as well just make the whole AM band all Class Cs and make the band such a mess that nobody can be heard at night.......wait, they have just about done that already! Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From possumhunter@netzero.net Tue Nov 19 09:19:00 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Nov 2002 17:19:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 2888 invoked from network); 19 Nov 2002 17:18:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Nov 2002 17:18:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.93) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Nov 2002 17:18:59 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 19 Nov 2002 09:18:59 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: DXing and broadcast power Date: Tue, 19 Nov 2002 12:18:47 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Nov 2002 17:18:59.0909 (UTC) FILETIME=[BFE33750:01C28FEF] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.140.249.58] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 gar_fla_62 wrote: I was just listening to that frequency (1630) after reading your post and heard a station fading in and out. When fading in, the signal was pretty good. I didn't hear call letters but confirmed it was from Augusta, Georgia. Yes, I am close enough to Augusta that I can hear their Groundwave signal in the Daytime, but I am in their "skip zone" at night, so most of the time I can still hear KCJJ. Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From possumhunter@netzero.net Tue Nov 19 09:40:16 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Nov 2002 17:40:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 40477 invoked from network); 19 Nov 2002 17:40:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Nov 2002 17:40:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.41) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Nov 2002 17:40:14 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 19 Nov 2002 09:40:14 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: DXing and broadcast power Date: Tue, 19 Nov 2002 12:40:01 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Nov 2002 17:40:14.0679 (UTC) FILETIME=[B7B5AE70:01C28FF2] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.140.249.58] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 gar_fla_62 wrote: > I'm trying to figure out how these low power stations can travel as far as claimed. In theory, I should then have no problem receiving many of the common 5kw stations from some place like California. Anymore, it's hard enough just getting 50kw stations from New York and Philadelphia. Reception does not depend on the power levels as much as the signal to noise ratio. On a quiet channel, there is no reason you couldn't hear a TIS for hundreds of miles. Put a half dozen TIS stations around the country on the same channel and you will not be able to hear any of them. Now add a 1KW station to the mix and you will hear the 1KW with some background noise from the TIS stations. Add a few more 1KW stations and you will only hear noise unless you are close to one of the stations. That is what the FCC did to the X-Band. Growing up I used to listen to several clears that I can no longer hear. WNBC 660 used to be a real clean signal, but now I can barely get WFAN on most nights. I used to be able to hear WBAP, WHO, KOA, CKLW, WCFL, WOR, WOWO, WLS, WABC, and many more all clear with no noise. Now I can still barely get WLS, WOR,WOWO, and WABC. The rest are in the mud. Most of this is due to the FCC giving nighttime power and post sunset to the small daytime stations on the clears. Am I the only one who misses listening to the Mexican "Border Blasters"? I always thought they were a hoot to listen to. I think it would be neat to hear a 500KW signal in stereo! Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From possumhunter@netzero.net Tue Nov 19 09:50:59 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Nov 2002 17:50:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 90851 invoked from network); 19 Nov 2002 17:50:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Nov 2002 17:50:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.47) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Nov 2002 17:50:54 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 19 Nov 2002 09:50:54 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: DXing and broadcast power Date: Tue, 19 Nov 2002 12:50:42 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Nov 2002 17:50:54.0344 (UTC) FILETIME=[34FAD080:01C28FF4] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.140.249.58] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Kevin T. wrote: > for Class D stations, they have no nighttime protection at all!), so long-distance nighttime reception is a rarity. I just mailed off a QSL card to a guy in Pittsburg, PA that heard WFIS 1600 with 25 Watts nightime power! He heard us with just a CCRadio. I also sent him a coverage map, some bumper stickers, keychains, pens, and some other junk I snatched out of the promotions bin when the manager wasn't looking. Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From meridian3891@cs.com Tue Nov 19 09:55:15 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: meridian3891@cs.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Nov 2002 17:55:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 4632 invoked from network); 19 Nov 2002 17:55:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Nov 2002 17:55:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.88) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Nov 2002 17:55:15 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.168] by n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 19 Nov 2002 17:55:15 -0000 Date: Tue, 19 Nov 2002 17:55:12 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: DXing and broadcast power Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 972 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Tony" X-Originating-IP: 205.166.36.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=48487815 X-Yahoo-Profile: onemeridian I recall during the early 90s, when I was able to pick up the aero- marine beacon "MER" on 1685 kHz (during the winter months) without any amplification or loop antenna; it was from Colombia, South America. I have also logged 3 MEDfers (100 mw beacons) during those times (each being roughly 80-100 miles away). Tony --- In amstereoforum@y..., "gar_fla_62" wrote: > Thanks for all the information on the expanded band. I'm starting to better understand why a 1kw ND signal can be picked up for great distances if the frequency isn't shared by to many other stations. This reminds me of when I was living in New Jersey about 25 years ago and attempting to hear KFI Los Angeles after picking it up only one time. There was a station on that frequency that would often come in pretty strong. Turns out it was only a 1kw broadcast from some place in Ohio. I plan to spend much more of my evening time listening to the expaned band. From mychucky@funport.net Tue Nov 19 12:41:50 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: mychucky@funport.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Nov 2002 20:41:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 1961 invoked from network); 19 Nov 2002 20:41:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Nov 2002 20:41:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.funport.com) (216.199.19.6) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Nov 2002 20:41:49 -0000 Received: from FatMusic2000 ([]) by mail.funport.com (Merak 5.3.2) with SMTP id JFB36580 for ; Tue, 19 Nov 2002 15:41:51 -0500 Message-ID: <009301c2900c$10bd6490$1400a8c0@FatMusic2000> To: References: <011d01c28f93$b2e65840$33f9bed8@kredding430cdt> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Radio Shack Date: Tue, 19 Nov 2002 15:41:38 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=85836819 X-Yahoo-Profile: mychucky1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I'll see if there is any anywhere in the country, I can search the network. The number seems a little short....but I don't go in again until Wednesday so be patient. Later guys Chucky ----- Original Message ----- From: Kevin - Mesa, Arizona To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, November 19, 2002 1:20 AM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Radio Shack > Thanks for letting me know about Radio Shack, Chuck. The last one sold was p/n 12-127. Kevin Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From fanfare@globility.com Tue Nov 19 18:50:05 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Nov 2002 02:50:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 39633 invoked from network); 20 Nov 2002 02:50:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Nov 2002 02:50:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.86) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Nov 2002 02:50:04 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.251] by n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 20 Nov 2002 02:50:04 -0000 Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 02:50:03 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Stations make plans in the wake of IBOC action Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 529 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Marv Southcott" X-Originating-IP: 64.56.234.130 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy I hadn't seen any comment on this story. It does tell of the speed of interest and deployment is not causing tremors. About KABL, my colleague listening just outside San Fran had this to say. they are apparently now into IBOC trials. He says thye're using their EBS as a cue to make the switchover. I'm intrigued by his description of the sound; "It's like a broken down 1947 telephone for about 15 minutes." then it goes back to normal.. I'm supposed to guess which is traditional KABL and which is IBOC ... sure. M. From fanfare@globility.com Tue Nov 19 18:52:30 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Nov 2002 02:52:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 75862 invoked from network); 20 Nov 2002 02:52:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Nov 2002 02:52:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.70) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Nov 2002 02:52:29 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.162] by n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 20 Nov 2002 02:52:29 -0000 Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 02:52:28 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Missing URL for "Stations make plans in the wake of IBOC action" Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 758 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Marv Southcott" X-Originating-IP: 64.56.234.130 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Marv Southcott" wrote: > I hadn't seen any comment on this story. It does tell of the speed of > interest and deployment is not causing tremors. > > About KABL, my colleague listening just outside San Fran had this to > say. they are apparently now into IBOC trials. He says thye're using > their EBS as a cue to make the switchover. I'm intrigued by his > description of the sound; "It's like a broken down 1947 telephone for > about 15 minutes." then it goes back to normal.. I'm supposed to > guess which is traditional KABL and which is IBOC ... sure. > > M. Sorry, the URL for the RW story, in case you haven't read it, is; http://www.rwonline.com/reference-room/iboc/03_rw_ibocnov6_1.shtml M. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Nov 19 20:08:59 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Nov 2002 04:08:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 97026 invoked from network); 20 Nov 2002 04:08:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Nov 2002 04:08:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Nov 2002 04:08:58 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.150] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 20 Nov 2002 04:08:58 -0000 Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 04:08:56 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Radio Shack Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <009301c2900c$10bd6490$1400a8c0@FatMusic2000> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 962 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.81.12 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > I'll see if there is any anywhere in the country, I can search the > network. The number seems a little short....but I don't go in again > until Wednesday so be patient. Radio Shack catalog number 12-127 is the Sony SRF-42 AMAX AM Stereo Walkman -- last featured in the 2000 Radio Shack catalog with a price of $29.99, and reported to be sold-out in most stores by 2001. But I still hold hope that a few RS stores out there somewhere might have a stash of SRF-42's in stock... I've seen the kind of stuff (read: junk) that shows up at RS close-out sales... like Color Computer III's (the "CoCo") and Tandy 1000HX's for $49.99 each, a decade after they became obsolete.... Seriously, my own Realistic TM-152 AM Stereo tuner was bought at a Radio Shack close-out sale in 1988 for just over $20, compared to the original price of $69.99. "Greedio Shake: You've Got Questions, We've Got Batteries. And may I interest you in a new Sprint PCS phone?" From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Nov 19 20:34:49 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Nov 2002 04:34:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 78083 invoked from network); 20 Nov 2002 04:34:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Nov 2002 04:34:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.90) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Nov 2002 04:34:45 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.176] by n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 20 Nov 2002 04:34:44 -0000 Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 04:34:43 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Missing URL for "Stations make plans in the wake of IBOC action" Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 400 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.81.12 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics IBOC is starting to remind me of the CBS "spinning disc" Color TV system... approved by the FCC, and launched with much fanfare, but incompatibility with regular black & white TV killed it; only 200 receiving sets intended for consumer use were ever built, and it was cancelled two years later in favor of the all-electronic NTSC color TV system which we are still using today, 50 YEARS later! From dav259@csiro.au Tue Nov 19 20:55:34 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Nov 2002 04:55:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 24818 invoked from network); 20 Nov 2002 04:55:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Nov 2002 04:55:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Nov 2002 04:55:32 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAK4tVP11847 for ; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 15:55:31 +1100 (EST) Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 15:55:31 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Robert Copeman - Anyone know him ? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public On Tue, 19 Nov 2002, m1ctk wrote: > Ian or anyone else (down under) ? He introduces one of the AMS tapes > I had sent a few years ago. MP3 at:- Dave old bean - I've never heard of him but apparently he's into DXing TV and radio ... "Since the first days of radio broadcasting, there has been an interest in trying to receive signals outside of the accepted limit of local reception. Like the famous explorers, mountain climbers, etc, dxers dream of new discoveries and receiving signals normally regarded impossible to receive by the average listener, (or viewer in the case of TV)." http://www.geocities.com/toddemslie/Robert_DX_intro.htm From possumhunter@netzero.net Tue Nov 19 21:00:02 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Nov 2002 05:00:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 61469 invoked from network); 20 Nov 2002 05:00:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Nov 2002 05:00:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.210) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Nov 2002 05:00:01 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 19 Nov 2002 21:00:01 -0800 To: References: <3DD98460.4DA20D2E@skyweb.net> <3DD99BA6.50EDA5A8@skyweb.net> <3DD9BDA9.A4B9F7E9@skyweb.net> Subject: Engineer Pay, ATUs, and Transmitters Was: X-Band Date: Tue, 19 Nov 2002 23:59:46 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 20 Nov 2002 05:00:01.0562 (UTC) FILETIME=[AE961FA0:01C29051] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.132.202.183] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Neal Newman wrote: > Well I don't make much money as an Engineer about $12k a year don't ask how I survive I'm still trying to figure that out myself. Don't feel bad Neal, Engineering is a labor of love for me as well. There sure ain't much money in it for me, in fact I make more from my advertising sales commissions than I do for keeping it on the air! > >it was phasetek that Built the Diplexer and 6 tower phasor out at My site very well designed and built. Kewl, I will get a quote from them on the ATU then. Do you have an opinion on BE's line of transmitters? We are looking at the BE AM1A PowerMizer http://www.bdcast.com/products/am_trans/am-1a.html as a main transmitter and putting the Harris SX1 on standby duty. This would put us in CQUAM STEREO and give the tiring SX1 a rest. The old standby transmitter, a Gates BC1F was sold several years ago. Lately the SX1 has become a bit of a problem child. I hate to retire the SX1 because it sounds so good on the air, but I don't like the 3AM transmitter repairs! We are also looking at the Nautel ND1 http://www.nautel.com/cgi-bin/products.cgi?action=display&id=7 and the Harris Gates1 http://www.broadcast.harris.com/product_portfolio/product_details.asp?sku=WW WGATESMW We do like the idea of the small footprint and built in CQUAM card in the BE. Both the owner and myself share the same dislike for McMartin, CCA, Continental, and Energy-Onix transmitters! Notice how I am NOT volunteering my RCA for the job! LOL Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From groucho@skyweb.net Tue Nov 19 21:49:10 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Nov 2002 05:49:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 99796 invoked from network); 20 Nov 2002 05:49:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Nov 2002 05:49:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Nov 2002 05:49:09 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gAK5rBed096879 for ; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 00:53:11 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DDB223B.6EB123D5@skyweb.net> Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 00:48:43 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Engineer Pay, ATUs, and Transmitters Was: X-Band References: <3DD98460.4DA20D2E@skyweb.net> <3DD99BA6.50EDA5A8@skyweb.net> <3DD9BDA9.A4B9F7E9@skyweb.net> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit that BE AM1A looks like a really nice transmitter... not familiar with the BE but it Comes with the AMS exciter Very cool Small too... The Nautel is also a good Choice.... The Harris Gates One is a fantastic transmitter that's what I have as my backup to the DX-10.. The DX-10 has really good Audio... I feel that the Gates one has better audio. If you plan on loosing that SX1. for the taking. it sure would sound great on the 160 meter Ham band.... that's why I got the RCA BTA-500R. BTW are you a ham also? I'm usually On 1850kc SSB Nightly My next project is for a unipole on 1885kc For the RCA on AM.. Neal-ka2caf CE WTTM. Possum Hunter wrote: > Neal Newman wrote: > > Well I don't make much money as an Engineer about $12k a year don't ask > how I survive I'm still trying to figure that out myself. > > Don't feel bad Neal, Engineering is a labor of love for me as well. There > sure ain't much money in it for me, in fact I make more from my advertising > sales commissions than I do for keeping it on the air! > > > >it was phasetek that Built the Diplexer and 6 tower phasor out at My site > very well designed and built. > > Kewl, I will get a quote from them on the ATU then. > > Do you have an opinion on BE's line of transmitters? We are looking at the > BE AM1A PowerMizer http://www.bdcast.com/products/am_trans/am-1a.html as a > main transmitter and putting the Harris SX1 on standby duty. This would put > us in CQUAM STEREO and give the tiring SX1 a rest. The old standby > transmitter, a Gates BC1F was sold several years ago. Lately the SX1 has > become a bit of a problem child. I hate to retire the SX1 because it sounds > so good on the air, but I don't like the 3AM transmitter repairs! > > We are also looking at the Nautel ND1 > http://www.nautel.com/cgi-bin/products.cgi?action=display&id=7 > and the Harris Gates1 > http://www.broadcast.harris.com/product_portfolio/product_details.asp?sku=WW > WGATESMW > > We do like the idea of the small footprint and built in CQUAM card in the > BE. > > Both the owner and myself share the same dislike for McMartin, CCA, > Continental, and Energy-Onix transmitters! > > Notice how I am NOT volunteering my RCA for the job! LOL > Long live FREE RADIO! > > Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ > Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From ben@lennard.net.nz Wed Nov 20 01:23:10 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ben@lennard.net.nz X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Nov 2002 09:23:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 87787 invoked from network); 20 Nov 2002 09:23:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Nov 2002 09:23:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Nov 2002 09:23:09 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.184] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 20 Nov 2002 09:23:08 -0000 Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 09:23:08 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: More from the mad scientist... Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 871 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Ben" X-Originating-IP: 203.98.48.150 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=118503946 X-Yahoo-Profile: benlennard Another thought on the digital domain... Have the digital folks got it right, and are we wasting our time fighting for analogue? Here's my reasoning (again might be flawed...): A 15kHz Sine wave, and a 15kHz Square wave will sound the same to the human ear. Why? The Human ear can hear up to 20kHz. A 15kHz sine wave is made up of the following: A fundamental: 15kHz Square wave, plus A first harmonic: a square wave at 3 times the fundamental frequency, and a third the amplitude of the fundamental. A second harmonic: a square wave at 5 times the fundamental frequency, and a fifth the amplitude of the fundamental. A third harmonic... a fifth... a sixth, etc... As the first harmonic of the 15kHz sine wave is at 45kHz, we will not hear it. All we hear is the 15kHz fundamental (ie - a 15kHz square wave). cheers, - Made scientist of Crofton Downs. From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Nov 20 06:52:31 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Nov 2002 14:52:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 72958 invoked from network); 20 Nov 2002 14:52:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Nov 2002 14:52:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.46) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Nov 2002 14:52:30 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 06:52:29 -0800 To: References: <3DD98460.4DA20D2E@skyweb.net> <3DD99BA6.50EDA5A8@skyweb.net> <3DD9BDA9.A4B9F7E9@skyweb.net> <3DDB223B.6EB123D5@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Engineer Pay, ATUs, and Transmitters Was: X-Band Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 09:52:11 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 20 Nov 2002 14:52:29.0914 (UTC) FILETIME=[730E2BA0:01C290A4] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.153.12.66] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Neal Newman wrote: > that BE AM1A looks like a really nice transmitter... not familiar with the BE but it Comes with the AMS exciter Very cool Small too. I have had good luck with other BE products in the past. Their cart machines and consoles were grenade proof! > >The Nautel is also a good Choice.... The Harris Gates One is a fantastic transmitter that's what I have as my backup to the DX-10. There is very little difference between the Gates1 and SX1. This SX1 has had a very hard life, including being baked in a very hot transmitter room every summer for the first 6 years of it's life then being dropped by the moving people when the station moved. I can't say anything bad about the SX1, it has been running 24/7 for 18 years, but then I know where there is an RCA BTA1R that has been running 24/7 for 42 years! LOL If RCA still made transmitters, the choice would be easy. > >If you plan on loosing that SX1. for the taking. it sure would sound great on the 160 meter Ham band.... that's why I got the RCA BTA-500R. Sorry, the SX1 will become the back up transmitter and the LPB AM60P will be removed from service. I was told one of the big reasons the SX1 was discontinued was it cannot be tuned above 1610. That is what the Harris guys told me anyway. > > BTW are you a ham also? Nope, Been meaning to get my Ham ticket, but always wind up having a million other projects calling my name. Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From groucho@skyweb.net Wed Nov 20 07:14:50 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Nov 2002 15:14:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 3136 invoked from network); 20 Nov 2002 15:14:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Nov 2002 15:14:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Nov 2002 15:14:49 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gAKFIqed037505 for ; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 10:18:53 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DDBA6D0.F14DBDD0@skyweb.net> Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 10:14:24 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Engineer Pay, ATUs, and Transmitters Was: X-Band References: <3DD98460.4DA20D2E@skyweb.net> <3DD99BA6.50EDA5A8@skyweb.net> <3DD9BDA9.A4B9F7E9@skyweb.net> <3DDB223B.6EB123D5@skyweb.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 LOL Yeah I know about the RCA.. I have the BTA-500R for 160 meters.... the SX1 Can go above 1610 the values of the Final LC network can Be changed.. thats what I did to the RCA. backups are always great to have. I was actually looking for an excuse to take a drive down south... Neal > Sorry, the SX1 will become the back up transmitter and the LPB AM60P will be > removed from service. I was told one of the big reasons the SX1 was > discontinued was it cannot be tuned above 1610. That is what the Harris guys > told me anyway. > > > > BTW are you a ham also? > > Nope, Been meaning to get my Ham ticket, but always wind up having a million > other projects calling my name. > > Long live FREE RADIO! > > Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ > Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From mychucky@funport.net Wed Nov 20 08:02:58 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: mychucky@funport.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Nov 2002 16:02:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 52454 invoked from network); 20 Nov 2002 16:02:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Nov 2002 16:02:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.funport.com) (216.199.19.6) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Nov 2002 16:02:53 -0000 Received: from FatMusic2000 ([]) by mail.funport.com (Merak 5.3.2) with SMTP id JFB36580 for ; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 11:02:51 -0500 Message-ID: <006801c290ae$45af2290$1400a8c0@FatMusic2000> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Radio Shack Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 11:02:46 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=85836819 X-Yahoo-Profile: mychucky1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Oh the SRF42,,,,,,,,,,,I work at a company store Part time to supplement the massive quantity of money I make being an engineer at 2 fm stations. The Associate stores may have inventory still , but I can't search that data base if there is one. Most overstock or discontinued stock goes to close out stores ..........however the close out stores are being discontinued and the one in Jacksonville has been closed ( closed a closeout store) totally new concept..... Anyway I will check the system. I sold my srf42 and only kept a Yamaha tx492 and the Aiwa 805 portable for personnel use. Actually I need the AM Stereo Chip for my 492 as a customer got my good chip.and I haven't had time to order one and even if I did then I got find the time to replace it. Ok later bud Chucky ----- Original Message ----- From: Kevin T. To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, November 19, 2002 11:08 PM Subject: {AMSF} Re: Radio Shack > I'll see if there is any anywhere in the country, I can search the > network. The number seems a little short....but I don't go in again > until Wednesday so be patient. Radio Shack catalog number 12-127 is the Sony SRF-42 AMAX AM Stereo Walkman -- last featured in the 2000 Radio Shack catalog with a price of $29.99, and reported to be sold-out in most stores by 2001. But I still hold hope that a few RS stores out there somewhere might have a stash of SRF-42's in stock... I've seen the kind of stuff (read: junk) that shows up at RS close-out sales... like Color Computer III's (the "CoCo") and Tandy 1000HX's for $49.99 each, a decade after they became obsolete.... Seriously, my own Realistic TM-152 AM Stereo tuner was bought at a Radio Shack close-out sale in 1988 for just over $20, compared to the original price of $69.99. "Greedio Shake: You've Got Questions, We've Got Batteries. And may I interest you in a new Sprint PCS phone?" Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From KC4QLP@aol.com Wed Nov 20 10:13:08 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Nov 2002 18:13:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 86061 invoked from network); 20 Nov 2002 18:13:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Nov 2002 18:13:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r09.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.105) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Nov 2002 18:13:07 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r09.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.5f.30620e54 (3964) for ; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 13:13:01 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <5f.30620e54.2b0d2aac@aol.com> Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 13:13:00 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Engineer Pay, ATUs, and Transmitters Was: X-Band To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 11/20/02 9:53:19 AM Eastern Standard Time, possumhunter@netzero.net writes: > Sorry, the SX1 will become the back up transmitter and the LPB AM60P will be > removed from service. I was told one of the big reasons the SX1 was > discontinued was it cannot be tuned above 1610. That is what the Harris > guys > told me anyway. > What are you going to do with the LPB AM 60P? I know of a station that is looking for an LPB so they can start night-time service. BTW...you guys arent the only ones working for peanuts in the is circus we call broadcasting...lol You learn quick to do without and how to become resourceful and thrifty!...hehehe...sometimes I think the wife thinks I'm nuts...but we gotta do what we gotta do! Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From jimshelden@garfield-wa.com Wed Nov 20 10:38:50 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jimshelden@garfield-wa.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Nov 2002 18:38:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 2601 invoked from network); 20 Nov 2002 18:38:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Nov 2002 18:38:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.78) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Nov 2002 18:38:50 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.183] by n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 20 Nov 2002 18:38:50 -0000 Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 18:38:47 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Engineer Pay, ATUs, and Transmitters Was: X-Band Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2251 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Jim Shelden" X-Originating-IP: 134.121.82.119 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=73693137 X-Yahoo-Profile: jimshelden I have an AM1A at one of my stations, and it is a very clean and cost effective way to get on AM stereo. It sounds very good in both mono and st. Capable of very high postive mod, and runs consistantly cool. Be sure you get the CRL "AM Amiga" processor to go with. It does a very good job of limiting -mod. It's only been off once in 3 years when a small switching supply failed. We're on 24/7, and been hit by lightning, and power line glitches, the AM1A, comes right back up. You should also be prepared to install their optional (or build yourself), line matcher so the swr is right at 1:1. The tx is real sensitive to any reflections. If you talk to Harris, they'll downgrade the BE stuff since the main power supply is a line operated switching unit w/o any transformer. And it is a complicated circuit, but my experience has been quite good. I also have an SX-5 at another station, and has been similiarly reliable. It uses a more conventional power supply to make 105v at 51 amps for 5Kw out. It is built like the provebial battleship. It will need an external AM st exciter, and it also sounds excellent on air. The Nautel ND1 is a good sounding unit, and has been quite reliable, but will need an exciter. I'd buy another BE in a minute. (fwiw) Jim KC7BJ > Do you have an opinion on BE's line of transmitters? We are looking at the > BE AM1A PowerMizer http://www.bdcast.com/products/am_trans/am- 1a.html as a > main transmitter and putting the Harris SX1 on standby duty. This would put > us in CQUAM STEREO and give the tiring SX1 a rest. The old standby > transmitter, a Gates BC1F was sold several years ago. Lately the SX1 has > become a bit of a problem child. I hate to retire the SX1 because it sounds > so good on the air, but I don't like the 3AM transmitter repairs! > > We are also looking at the Nautel ND1 > http://www.nautel.com/cgi-bin/products.cgi?action=display&id=7 > and the Harris Gates1 > http://www.broadcast.harris.com/product_portfolio/product_details.asp? sku=WW > WGATESMW > > We do like the idea of the small footprint and built in CQUAM card in the > BE. > > Both the owner and myself share the same dislike for McMartin, CCA, > Continental, and Energy-Onix transmitters! > From jimshelden@garfield-wa.com Wed Nov 20 10:39:00 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jimshelden@garfield-wa.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Nov 2002 18:39:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 22621 invoked from network); 20 Nov 2002 18:39:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Nov 2002 18:39:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Nov 2002 18:39:00 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.183] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 20 Nov 2002 18:39:00 -0000 Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 18:39:00 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Engineer Pay, ATUs, and Transmitters Was: X-Band Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2251 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Jim Shelden" X-Originating-IP: 134.121.82.119 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=73693137 X-Yahoo-Profile: jimshelden I have an AM1A at one of my stations, and it is a very clean and cost effective way to get on AM stereo. It sounds very good in both mono and st. Capable of very high postive mod, and runs consistantly cool. Be sure you get the CRL "AM Amiga" processor to go with. It does a very good job of limiting -mod. It's only been off once in 3 years when a small switching supply failed. We're on 24/7, and been hit by lightning, and power line glitches, the AM1A, comes right back up. You should also be prepared to install their optional (or build yourself), line matcher so the swr is right at 1:1. The tx is real sensitive to any reflections. If you talk to Harris, they'll downgrade the BE stuff since the main power supply is a line operated switching unit w/o any transformer. And it is a complicated circuit, but my experience has been quite good. I also have an SX-5 at another station, and has been similiarly reliable. It uses a more conventional power supply to make 105v at 51 amps for 5Kw out. It is built like the provebial battleship. It will need an external AM st exciter, and it also sounds excellent on air. The Nautel ND1 is a good sounding unit, and has been quite reliable, but will need an exciter. I'd buy another BE in a minute. (fwiw) Jim KC7BJ > Do you have an opinion on BE's line of transmitters? We are looking at the > BE AM1A PowerMizer http://www.bdcast.com/products/am_trans/am- 1a.html as a > main transmitter and putting the Harris SX1 on standby duty. This would put > us in CQUAM STEREO and give the tiring SX1 a rest. The old standby > transmitter, a Gates BC1F was sold several years ago. Lately the SX1 has > become a bit of a problem child. I hate to retire the SX1 because it sounds > so good on the air, but I don't like the 3AM transmitter repairs! > > We are also looking at the Nautel ND1 > http://www.nautel.com/cgi-bin/products.cgi?action=display&id=7 > and the Harris Gates1 > http://www.broadcast.harris.com/product_portfolio/product_details.asp? sku=WW > WGATESMW > > We do like the idea of the small footprint and built in CQUAM card in the > BE. > > Both the owner and myself share the same dislike for McMartin, CCA, > Continental, and Energy-Onix transmitters! > From dwtpa97@earthlink.net Wed Nov 20 14:29:11 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dwtpa97@earthlink.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Nov 2002 22:29:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 95551 invoked from network); 20 Nov 2002 22:29:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Nov 2002 22:29:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO snipe.mail.pas.earthlink.net) (207.217.120.62) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Nov 2002 22:29:10 -0000 Received: from sdn-ap-013scfairp0283.dialsprint.net ([63.183.129.29] helo=earthlink.net) by snipe.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 18EdLJ-0004OL-00 for amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 14:29:10 -0800 Message-ID: <3DDC0CB4.4732E59C@earthlink.net> Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 17:29:08 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.79 [en]C-CCK-MCD NSCPCD472 (Windows NT 5.0; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: DXing and broadcast power References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: dwtpa97 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38076959 In the early days (around 1925) of am radio, since there were very few stations, it was not uncommon for stations to be heard over most of the nation. For instance, WDAE in Tampa back then was probably only around 100 watts and yet was picked up in a majority of the 48 states at one time or another. Dick W. "Kevin T." wrote: > > I'm trying to figure out how these low power stations can travel > > as far as claimed. In theory, I should then have no problem > > receiving many of the common 5kw stations from some place like > > California. Anymore, it's hard enough just getting 50kw stations > > from New York and Philadelphia. > > It's mostly a matter of how "clear" the frequency is -- i.e., how > many or few other stations are broadcasting on it. The AM band in > North America is congested enough that the signals of lower-power > stations are not "protected" at night to any greater distance than > their normal daytime coverage (or, for Class D stations, they have no > nighttime protection at all!), so long-distance nighttime reception > is a rarity. Class A 50,000-watt stations (known as "clear channel" > stations) at least theoretically have protected nighttime skywave > signal coverage areas, so these are the ones you can hear with the > greatest regularity over long distances (usually 100 to 700 miles is > the range of consistent skywave coverage from these stations). > > The Expanded Band (1620-1700 kHz) is unique in that when it was set > up in the mid-1990s, it started out with only a handful of stations > on the air, with basically no other stations in the entire WORLD > using these frequencies (at least at any significant power level). > This gave the opportunity for low-power signals to have incredible > coverage, day and night. The Expanded Band has gradually gotten more > crowded over the years since then, but with a little luck you can > still have good long-distance nighttime reception similar to that of > the 50,000 watt stations on lower frequencies, even though most > Expanded Band stations use no more than 1000 watts at night. > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From ccuff@in4web.com Wed Nov 20 15:33:13 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Nov 2002 23:33:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 76334 invoked from network); 20 Nov 2002 23:33:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Nov 2002 23:33:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Nov 2002 23:33:12 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.93]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 18:27:28 -0500 Message-ID: <005b01c290ec$eec71020$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: Subject: ams is still alive Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 18:31:20 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 I know I've been quiet lately- but I do have some interesting items of note. Lately, as of the past 4 weeks or so, I have been contacted by several mom & pop stations wanting to go stereo. They all want decoders, they want demo radios. Another company that specializes in custom auto aftermarket electronics is also buying decoders. I put 4 "Lites" on ebay, and all were sold within 1 day. I have 1 left, besides my personal demo unit. More boards are being made now- as the email I got after the auction was over was incredible. So gang, There IS a spark- For some reason, it's bigger than ever. Very encouraging indeed. Chris From florida_amstereo@hotmail.com Wed Nov 20 15:42:41 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: florida_amstereo@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Nov 2002 23:42:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 49938 invoked from network); 20 Nov 2002 23:42:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Nov 2002 23:42:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.37.22) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Nov 2002 23:42:41 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 15:42:32 -0800 Received: from 209.240.198.61 by pv2fd.pav2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 23:42:32 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Cc: amstereo@bellsouth.net Bcc: Subject: WDAE, Tampa Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 23:42:32 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 20 Nov 2002 23:42:32.0788 (UTC) FILETIME=[7F0BA140:01C290EE] From: "Donn Tillman" X-Originating-IP: [209.240.198.61] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83914824 1250 Tampa now (owned by ClearChannel) is boosting of it's new 25,000 watt signal, most of which is directed to the Gof of Mexico (what they don't say is that night power is 5900 watts and here in s.e. St Pete, I get a stronger signal out of 1490 WWPR,Bradenton both day and night. WDAE, I guess was at 1250 by 1925, was one of the first licensed stations in the south east; there has always been a dispute as the whether WQAM (560-Miami) or WDAE (1250-Tampa) was the first station in Florida; at any rate both stations are certainly not the powerhouses they once were, WDAE-1250 in now WTKN-1250 and the WDAE call letters have shifted to 620 (the former WSUN); both 1250 and 620 are owned by ClearChannel. WTKN is business talk, infomercials and a taped delayed "dr" laura, and WSUN is sports drivel. WQAM, Miami is a Cox station and is a sports/talk format. ----Original Message Follows---- From: dwtpa97 Reply-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: DXing and broadcast power Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 17:29:08 -0500 In the early days (around 1925) of am radio, since there were very few stations, it was not uncommon for stations to be heard over most of the nation. For instance, WDAE in Tampa back then was probably only around 100 watts and yet was picked up in a majority of the 48 states at one time or another. Dick W. _________________________________________________________________ Add photos to your messages with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail From florida_amstereo@hotmail.com Wed Nov 20 15:45:35 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: florida_amstereo@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Nov 2002 23:45:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 64746 invoked from network); 20 Nov 2002 23:45:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Nov 2002 23:45:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.37.148) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Nov 2002 23:45:35 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 15:45:35 -0800 Received: from 209.240.198.61 by pv2fd.pav2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 23:45:35 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Re: {AMSF}Both ams & Cris Cuff are still alive Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 23:45:35 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 20 Nov 2002 23:45:35.0528 (UTC) FILETIME=[EBF78A80:01C290EE] From: "Donn Tillman" X-Originating-IP: [209.240.198.61] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83914824 That's great news on both counts! donn ----Original Message Follows---- From: "Christopher Cuff" Reply-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com To: Subject: {AMSF} ams is still alive Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 18:31:20 -0500 I know I've been quiet lately- but I do have some interesting items of note. Lately, as of the past 4 weeks or so, I have been contacted by several mom & pop stations wanting to go stereo. They all want decoders, they want demo radios. Another company that specializes in custom auto aftermarket electronics is also buying decoders. I put 4 "Lites" on ebay, and all were sold within 1 day. I have 1 left, besides my personal demo unit. More boards are being made now- as the email I got after the auction was over was incredible. So gang, There IS a spark- For some reason, it's bigger than ever. Very encouraging indeed. Chris _________________________________________________________________ Help STOP SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail From dav259@csiro.au Wed Nov 20 15:50:10 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Nov 2002 23:50:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 70445 invoked from network); 20 Nov 2002 23:50:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Nov 2002 23:50:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Nov 2002 23:50:09 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAKNo7P12711 for ; Thu, 21 Nov 2002 10:50:07 +1100 (EST) Date: Thu, 21 Nov 2002 10:50:07 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: amstereoforum Subject: a common misconception Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public Since my Mum had a stroke she has trouble tuning in stations using a rotary dial. So I've bought her an Optimus (made for Radio Shack by Sangean) "Outback" radio with large preset buttons. It drags in distant AM stations really well. My aunt saw me setting it up for her and said she'd possibly like one too. And knowing she likes ABC Classic-FM I said "You do realise that its only got the one big speaker so you'd be listening in mono". To which she said "Well I'm not interested if it doesn't pick up Classic-FM as I know they broadcast in stereo". She seemed genuinely surprised when I switched it to the FM band and still received her favourite station. Since FM arrived here (with stereo from day #1) as several community stations commenced in 1975, it's still a commonly held misconception that FM means stereo and AM means mono. This is what we're up against - and some dumbarse assistants at Tandy (Radio Shack) seem to delight in perpetuating this myth. Ian Melbourne From groucho@skyweb.net Wed Nov 20 16:39:37 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Nov 2002 00:39:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 20920 invoked from network); 21 Nov 2002 00:39:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Nov 2002 00:39:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Nov 2002 00:39:36 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gAL0heed053151 for ; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 19:43:40 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DDC2B12.C74D198A@skyweb.net> Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 19:38:42 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Engineer Pay, ATUs, and Transmitters Was: X-Band References: <5f.30620e54.2b0d2aac@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Hey Bob you should join some of us up On 1850kc LSB nightly For some real talk or on echolink? Neal ka2caf CE WTTM KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 11/20/02 9:53:19 AM Eastern Standard Time, > possumhunter@netzero.net writes: > > > Sorry, the SX1 will become the back up transmitter and the LPB AM60P will be > > removed from service. I was told one of the big reasons the SX1 was > > discontinued was it cannot be tuned above 1610. That is what the Harris > > guys > > told me anyway. > > > > What are you going to do with the LPB AM 60P? I know of a station that is > looking for an LPB so they can start night-time service. > BTW...you guys arent the only ones working for peanuts in the is circus we > call broadcasting...lol > You learn quick to do without and how to become resourceful and > thrifty!...hehehe...sometimes I think the wife thinks I'm nuts...but we gotta > do what we gotta do! > > Bob Carter > Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio group > > WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 > Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 > > Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering > services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. > e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net > Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC > WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC > WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC > Ray Communications Radio Network > > AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- > amstereo-subcribe@topica.com > > KC4QLP Amateur Radio > Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va > www.kc4qlp.cjb.net > > voice contact-252-335-0856 > fax 1-209-254-8978 > _______________________________________________________ > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Nov 20 16:43:06 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Nov 2002 00:43:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 39675 invoked from network); 21 Nov 2002 00:43:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Nov 2002 00:43:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.41) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Nov 2002 00:43:05 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 16:43:05 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} a common misconception Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 19:42:51 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 21 Nov 2002 00:43:05.0312 (UTC) FILETIME=[F432CE00:01C290F6] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.132.190.65] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Ian Davidson wrote: > it's still a commonly held misconception that FM means stereo and AM means mono. Unless you are parked under the tower, the blend circuit in most car radios bland the FM back to mono and cut off all of the highs. > > This is what we're up against - and some dumbarse assistants at Tandy (Radio Shack) seem to delight in perpetuating this myth. so we need to cook up a promo to air that states the truth: FM= Multipath distortion, hissy audio, blended mono, and listener fatigue AM= Crisp, clean sound, Perfect stereo separation at great distances from the transmitter, and smooth sound you can listen to for hours on end. Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From tampagar@webtv.net Wed Nov 20 16:44:46 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: tampagar@webtv.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Nov 2002 00:44:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 41681 invoked from network); 21 Nov 2002 00:44:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Nov 2002 00:44:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Nov 2002 00:44:46 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.180] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 21 Nov 2002 00:44:46 -0000 Date: Thu, 21 Nov 2002 00:44:42 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: ams is still alive Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <005b01c290ec$eec71020$0101a8c0@pavilion> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 967 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "gar_fla_62" X-Originating-IP: 209.240.198.61 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=102439005 X-Yahoo-Profile: gar_fla_62 With the pathetic bland state of FM radio these days, I was thinking how this would be the perfect time for AM stereo to make a come back. With FM, every major city has the same formats. Let's see. You have your "Mix", your "Kiss", your "Star", etc. And is there some rule against playing a true variety of music? So many of these stations (mainly clasic rock/pop) promote themselves as playing "a greater variety" of music. Give me a friggin break! All they do is play the same handfull of songs over and over and over and over again. "Original" is a four letter word to those who run these stations. And when you think of the narrowcasting of FM stations being directed at specific interests, the death of AM music radio should be seen today as a big mistake. However, if those in charge of running the radio broadcast industry are of the same mentality as those who run everything else having an effect on our lives, I would then have to lower my expectations. From groucho@skyweb.net Wed Nov 20 16:48:03 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Nov 2002 00:48:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 41585 invoked from network); 21 Nov 2002 00:48:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Nov 2002 00:48:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Nov 2002 00:48:03 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gAL0q6ed055750 for ; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 19:52:07 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DDC2D0B.832047F3@skyweb.net> Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 19:47:07 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF}Both ams & Cris Cuff are still alive References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 hehehe I bought one of them little Lites. just to have some fun on my property gee would that excite my RCA BTA-500R? LOL just kidding..... No pirate radio here... Neal CE WTTM Donn Tillman wrote: > That's great news on both counts! > > donn > > ----Original Message Follows---- > From: "Christopher Cuff" > Reply-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com > To: > Subject: {AMSF} ams is still alive > Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 18:31:20 -0500 > > I know I've been quiet lately- but I do have some interesting items of note. > Lately, as of the past 4 weeks or so, I have been contacted by several mom & > pop stations wanting to go stereo. > They all want decoders, they want demo radios. > Another company that specializes in custom auto aftermarket electronics is > also buying decoders. > I put 4 "Lites" on ebay, and all were sold within 1 day. > I have 1 left, besides my personal demo unit. > More boards are being made now- as the email I got after the auction was > over was incredible. > So gang, There IS a spark- For some reason, it's bigger than ever. > Very encouraging indeed. > Chris > > _________________________________________________________________ > Help STOP SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* > http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Nov 20 17:16:19 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Nov 2002 01:16:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 17438 invoked from network); 21 Nov 2002 01:16:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Nov 2002 01:16:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.92) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Nov 2002 01:16:18 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 17:16:18 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Engineer Pay, ATUs, and Transmitters Was: X-Band Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 20:16:03 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 21 Nov 2002 01:16:18.0284 (UTC) FILETIME=[981A32C0:01C290FB] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.132.190.65] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Jim Shelden wrote: > I have an AM1A at one of my stations, and it is a very clean and cost effective way to get on AM stereo. It sounds very good in both mono and st. Thanks for the input! It does seem like a great design and the small footprint is a big + in our small transmitter room. > > Capable of very high positive mod, and runs consistently cool. Now, I have always been warned not to run the positives over 100% when broadcasting in Stereo. Doesn't it distort the sound? > > Be sure you get the CRL "AM Amiga" processor to go with. It does a very good job of limiting -mod. We already have a pair of digital Optimod AMs. I was thinking about a Modulation Sciences StereoMax to drive them. > >You should also be prepared to install their optional (or build yourself), line matcher so the swr is right at 1:1. The tx is real sensitive to any reflections. I will keep this in mind. We have the original 1957 Universal tower on the air. We had to have all of the joints re-welded because the VSWR would change as the tower rocked in the wind! She is all welded, painted and re-guided now and looking pretty. > > If you talk to Harris, they'll downgrade the BE stuff since the main power supply is a line operated switching unit w/o any transformer. And it is a complicated circuit, but my experience has been quite good. I hear a lot of people badmouth BE stuff, so I always just thought they made junk. Then, I worked in a station that was almost all BE electronics. I found the BE products to be well designed, sound great, and built to be tough as a Wal-Mart steak. The morning idiots were ALWAYS spilling coffee in the console and banging the switches as hard as they could, but they just couldn't kill that BE board! Many people just don't understand how a switch mode power supply works. For some reason the old "Tube Swapper" engineers just can't figure out a switcher. I always thought they were less trouble to work on! > > I also have an SX-5 at another station, and has been similarly reliable. Our SX1 spent it's first 5 or 6 summers baking in a 160 degree transmitter building with ZERO ventilation. I have no doubt that baked a good 20 years out of it's life right there. Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Nov 20 17:37:24 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Nov 2002 01:37:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 26452 invoked from network); 21 Nov 2002 01:37:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Nov 2002 01:37:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.206) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Nov 2002 01:37:21 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 17:37:21 -0800 To: References: <3DDC2D0B.832047F3@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF}Both ams & Cris Cuff are still alive Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 20:37:07 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 21 Nov 2002 01:37:21.0629 (UTC) FILETIME=[891D58D0:01C290FE] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.132.190.65] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Neal Newman wrote: > I bought one of them little Lites. just to have some fun on my property gee would that excite my RCA BTA-500R? LOL just kidding..... You could build an amp to get that lite up to around 15 Watts, then use it to drive an old Harris Vanguard1 transmitter. Have you ever worked on a Vanguard? It has to be the very WORST thing to ever come out of Harris/Gates. > > No pirate radio here... awww come on, just aout everybody I know has plugged a part 15 transmitter into a longwire then drive around seeing how far it would go. (My reproduction Zenith Wireless Phonograph will go nearly a mile when driving an Alpha Delta DX-SWL Sloper) How about CQUAM on 160 meters? LOL Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Nov 20 17:53:04 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Nov 2002 01:53:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 92364 invoked from network); 21 Nov 2002 01:53:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Nov 2002 01:53:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.86) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Nov 2002 01:53:04 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 17:53:04 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: ams is still alive Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 20:52:49 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 21 Nov 2002 01:53:04.0062 (UTC) FILETIME=[BAD935E0:01C29100] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.132.190.65] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 gar_fla_62 wrote: > With the pathetic bland state of FM radio these days, I was thinking how this would be the perfect time for AM stereo to make a come back. Yes, a properly programmed AM can beat the socks off of the cookie cutter FMs. > > With FM, every major city has the same formats. Let's see. You have your "Mix", your "Kiss", your "Star", etc. And on the AMs, each city has one News/Talk, One sports, 2 Spanish, and a handfull of preachers ranting about the lack of donations. > >And is there some rule against playing a true variety of music? So many of these stations (mainly clasic rock/pop) promote themselves as playing "a greater variety" of music. Give me a friggin break! All they do is play the same handfull of songs over and over and over and over again Our local automated "Oldies 106.3" WGVC owned by Barnstable just palys the same 100 or so songs over and over. I mean Gee, TM Century's Gold Drive Oldies format has like 1100 songs in it, why not play them? > >. "Original" is a four letter word to those who run these stations. And when you think of the narrowcasting of FM stations being directed at specific interests, the death of AM music radio should be seen today as a big mistake. In Greenville, 1490 WPCI has a 24 hour automated MOR music format that sounds decent in CQUAM AM STEREO. They make a point of NOT playing the songs that you hear on all of the other stations. Because WPCI is a "toy" owned by the same guy who owns Paper Cutters, Inc. there are no commercials or promo spots played on the air. It is all music. From groucho@skyweb.net Wed Nov 20 17:55:41 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Nov 2002 01:55:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 43303 invoked from network); 21 Nov 2002 01:55:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Nov 2002 01:55:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Nov 2002 01:55:40 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gAL1xied075668 for ; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 20:59:44 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DDC3CDF.4DF16075@skyweb.net> Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 20:54:40 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Engineer Pay, ATUs, and Transmitters Was: X-Band References: X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Heck I run my Harris gates one and DX -10 at the Full limit between 120-125% modulation No distortion. I have tested them Up to 130% gotta love it.. I guess it depends On the Stereo exciter.. I have the Harris AMS exciter.. the Motorola is a different story... that I would Not attempt over 105% Neal Possum Hunter wrote: Now, I have always been warned not to run the positives over 100% when > broadcasting in Stereo. Doesn't it distort the sound? > > > > Be sure you get the CRL "AM Amiga" processor to go with. It does a very > good job of limiting -mod. > > We already have a pair of digital Optimod AMs. I was thinking about a > Modulation Sciences StereoMax to drive them. > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From groucho@skyweb.net Wed Nov 20 18:00:12 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Nov 2002 02:00:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 76439 invoked from network); 21 Nov 2002 02:00:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Nov 2002 02:00:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Nov 2002 02:00:12 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gAL24Eed077003 for ; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 21:04:15 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DDC3DED.2124F7B4@skyweb.net> Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 20:59:09 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF}Both ams & Cris Cuff are still alive References: <3DDC2D0B.832047F3@skyweb.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 I guess there is Nothing that Prevents me from pumping it into a real TIS Antenna.. Its less than 10 feet tall...... I should get a good signal out with that... BTW 2 cheers for Me.. I managed to get 3 TIS stations shut down today for being on 1680 and also not being Licensed in NYS LOL Next is to get the one in NJ shut down.. Neal Possum Hunter wrote: > Neal Newman wrote: > > I bought one of them little Lites. just to have some fun on my property > gee would that excite my RCA BTA-500R? LOL just kidding..... > > You could build an amp to get that lite up to around 15 Watts, then use it > to drive an old Harris Vanguard1 transmitter. > > Have you ever worked on a Vanguard? It has to be the very WORST thing to > ever come out of Harris/Gates. > > > > No pirate radio here... > > awww come on, just aout everybody I know has plugged a part 15 transmitter > into a longwire then drive around seeing how far it would go. (My > reproduction Zenith Wireless Phonograph will go nearly a mile when driving > an Alpha Delta DX-SWL Sloper) > > How about CQUAM on 160 meters? LOL > > Long live FREE RADIO! > > Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ > Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Nov 20 18:19:53 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Nov 2002 02:19:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 11213 invoked from network); 21 Nov 2002 02:19:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Nov 2002 02:19:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Nov 2002 02:19:49 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-191.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.191]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gAL2JkN2028658 for ; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 20:19:47 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <002401c29104$81a3fd60$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} just in follow up... Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 20:20:03 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude I did some interference elimination work for a gal that does graphic arts stuff. I'll check and see what her rates are if we can't come up with anything ourselves. ST (Back on line with a new main board after all these weeks, and happy to be here!) ----- Original Message ----- From: Phil Rafuse To: Sent: Thursday, November 14, 2002 9:44 AM Subject: {AMSF} just in follow up... > Do we have someone with an artistic flare in the group who could > design a logo, which could be available on the site to download and > print on a good colour printer? The idea is to have our already > snappy looking AM Stereo logo, as well as an equally attractive > enhanced AM logo, which we can print up and affix to our great > sounding radios, and attach to any we modify, donate etc. While a > logo printed on ordinary paper may be a trifly tacky looking, using > card stock, photo paper, laminating etc. may allow each of us to > crank out some eye catching logos to go with the ear catching sound. > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Nov 20 18:21:00 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Nov 2002 02:21:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 15067 invoked from network); 21 Nov 2002 02:20:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Nov 2002 02:20:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.46) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Nov 2002 02:21:00 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 18:21:00 -0800 To: References: <005b01c290ec$eec71020$0101a8c0@pavilion> Subject: Re: {AMSF} ams is still alive Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 21:20:45 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 21 Nov 2002 02:21:00.0212 (UTC) FILETIME=[A1E96740:01C29104] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.132.190.65] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Christopher Cuff wrote: > Lately, as of the past 4 weeks or so, I have been contacted by several mom & pop stations wanting to go stereo. That is GREAT! The more, the better! > >I put 4 "Lites" on ebay, and all were sold within 1 day. Yea, I have a Lite on my want list as well. I will get one after I get the Sony srf-a300. Hey, How about making a "Heavy" that would make 25 watts on 1600Khz (The nighttime power of WFIS), or a "Super" 1KW on 1600 > > So gang, There IS a spark- For some reason, it's bigger than ever. As soon as I get WFIS in Stereo, and get the web page up, You can bet there will be links to every AM Stereo page I can find that is any good! We need a bunch of "walkman" AM Stereo radios that are set to only hear 1600Khz to give away at remotes....... On the other end of the spectrum, Anybody got any plans for a home-brew CQUAM exciter to drive the SX1 with? Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Nov 20 18:45:14 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Nov 2002 02:45:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 17842 invoked from network); 21 Nov 2002 02:45:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Nov 2002 02:45:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.121) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Nov 2002 02:45:13 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 18:45:13 -0800 To: References: <3DDC2D0B.832047F3@skyweb.net> <3DDC3DED.2124F7B4@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF}Both ams & Cris Cuff are still alive Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 21:44:59 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 21 Nov 2002 02:45:13.0910 (UTC) FILETIME=[04621D60:01C29108] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.132.190.65] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Neal Newman wrote: > I guess there is Nothing that Prevents me from pumping it into a real TIS Antenna.. Its less than 10 feet tall...... I should get a good signal out with that... That should work! > > 2 cheers for Me.. I managed to get 3 TIS stations shut down today for being on 1680 and also not being Licensed in NYS LOL Next is to get the one in NJ shut down.. HIPP HIPP HOORAY! HIPP HIPP HOORAY! We have a TIS on 1680 that is broadcasting NOAA WeatherRadio WXJ21 that is located on I-385 at I-85. I can hear it at my house over 15 miles away on my Toyota factory radio! You guessed it, no license! I think it belongs to Blyth Construction, the contractor who is widening I-385 from 4 to 6 lanes. I have not complained about it because WTIR covers it up less than 20 yards away at night! I wouldn't mind getting my hands on a Potomac FIM-41Field Strength Meter and taking some readings of WTIR's daytime and nighttime signal levels the next time I go to Florida. I like to stay in the next county over (Lake County), so it would be easy to see if they are powering down at night. WTIR is the strongest nighttime AM signal on the dial here in South Carolina! Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From groucho@skyweb.net Wed Nov 20 19:11:53 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Nov 2002 03:11:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 83603 invoked from network); 21 Nov 2002 03:11:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Nov 2002 03:11:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Nov 2002 03:11:52 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gAL3Fued095569 for ; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 22:15:56 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DDC4EB3.84A3BDE6@skyweb.net> Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 22:10:43 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF}Both ams & Cris Cuff are still alive References: <3DDC2D0B.832047F3@skyweb.net> <3DDC3DED.2124F7B4@skyweb.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Been There done that.. when I took a trip down to visit family in Kissamee/St Pete I did just that.. I also had a friend who is a consulting Engineer and My Boss who went down to one of our sister stations not far from them.. and we all came up with the same results.. the meter did not move when it came time to power down... Nor early in the Morning at Power Up Time.... Gee what does that mean?????? > > I have not complained about it because WTIR covers it up less than 20 yards > away at night! > > I wouldn't mind getting my hands on a Potomac FIM-41Field Strength Meter and > taking some readings of WTIR's daytime and nighttime signal levels the next > time I go to Florida. I like to stay in the next county over (Lake County), > so it would be easy to see if they are powering down at night. WTIR is the > strongest nighttime AM signal on the dial here in South Carolina! > > Long live FREE RADIO! > > Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ > Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Nov 20 19:34:11 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Nov 2002 03:34:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 63299 invoked from network); 21 Nov 2002 03:34:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Nov 2002 03:34:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.22) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Nov 2002 03:34:10 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 19:34:10 -0800 To: References: <3DDC2D0B.832047F3@skyweb.net> <3DDC3DED.2124F7B4@skyweb.net> <3DDC4EB3.84A3BDE6@skyweb.net> Subject: WTIR was:Both ams & Cris Cuff are still alive Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 22:33:56 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 21 Nov 2002 03:34:10.0476 (UTC) FILETIME=[DAB686C0:01C2910E] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.132.190.65] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Neal Newman wrote: > we all came up with the same results.. the meter did not move when it came time to power down... Nor early in the Morning at Power Up Time.... Gee what does that mean?????? I would take a near field measurement of WTTM at low and high power and compare that to a near field measurement of WTIR. If they are at 10K, (and I have no doubt they are) I would gripe and groan to everybody in the FCC that would listen. My boss is personal friends with one of the inspectors in Atlanta, if you need a name I will get it for you. Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Nov 20 19:41:56 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Nov 2002 03:41:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 13733 invoked from network); 21 Nov 2002 03:41:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Nov 2002 03:41:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.79) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Nov 2002 03:41:56 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 20 Nov 2002 19:41:56 -0800 To: References: <3DDC3CDF.4DF16075@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Engineer Pay, ATUs, and Transmitters Was: X-Band Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 22:41:42 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 21 Nov 2002 03:41:56.0469 (UTC) FILETIME=[F0776A50:01C2910F] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.132.190.65] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Neal Newman wrote: > Heck I run my Harris gates one and DX -10 at the Full limit between 120-125% modulation No distortion. I have tested them Up to 130% gotta love it.. > I guess it depends On the Stereo exciter.. I have the Harris AMS exciter.. the Motorola is a different story... that I would Not attempt over 105% Hmm that is something to keep in mind. I wonder how the BE does with high positive modulation? Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From dav259@csiro.au Wed Nov 20 21:32:32 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Nov 2002 05:32:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 42227 invoked from network); 21 Nov 2002 05:32:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Nov 2002 05:32:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Nov 2002 05:32:31 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAL5WTP00799 for ; Thu, 21 Nov 2002 16:32:29 +1100 (EST) Date: Thu, 21 Nov 2002 16:32:29 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: ams is still alive In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public On Thu, 21 Nov 2002, gar_fla_62 wrote: > With FM, every major city has the same formats. Let's see. You have > your "Mix", your "Kiss", your "Star", etc. And is there some rule > against playing a true variety of music? So many of these stations > (mainly clasic rock/pop) promote themselves as playing "a greater > variety" of music. Give me a friggin break! All they do is play the > same handfull of songs over and over and over and over again. Gary Our AM stereo Magic 693 boasts that it's playlist is over 2,500 tracks and it's a great package. Our MIX-FM (owned by Clear Channel) on the other hand would be lucky to rotate 300 tracks. And Magic regularly outrates MIX. I've sent several on this list a tape of Magic 693 - if you'd like one give me your address off-list. Ian Melbourne, Oz From KC4QLP@aol.com Wed Nov 20 21:42:35 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Nov 2002 05:42:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 62927 invoked from network); 21 Nov 2002 05:42:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Nov 2002 05:42:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d09.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.41) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Nov 2002 05:42:35 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d09.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.36.31dddc17 (4254) for ; Thu, 21 Nov 2002 00:42:29 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <36.31dddc17.2b0dcc45@aol.com> Date: Thu, 21 Nov 2002 00:42:29 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Engineer Pay, ATUs, and Transmitters Was: X-Band To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 11/20/02 7:40:50 PM Eastern Standard Time, groucho@skyweb.net writes: > Hey Bob you should join some of us up On 1850kc LSB nightly For some real > talk > or on echolink? > Neal ka2caf > CE WTTM > > > Soon as I get the other half of my antenna string back up in the other tree I'll be able to get something going on 160 .... ...so perhaps in a few weeks I'll be back up and running on HF...time permitting. BTW..what is echolink? Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From KC4QLP@aol.com Wed Nov 20 22:27:29 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Nov 2002 06:27:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 8171 invoked from network); 21 Nov 2002 06:27:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Nov 2002 06:27:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m09.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.164) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Nov 2002 06:27:28 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m09.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.111.1c03f115 (4254) for ; Thu, 21 Nov 2002 01:27:26 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <111.1c03f115.2b0dd6cd@aol.com> Date: Thu, 21 Nov 2002 01:27:25 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Engineer Pay, ATUs, and Transmitters Was: X-Band To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 11/20/02 8:57:37 PM Eastern Standard Time, groucho@skyweb.net writes: > Heck I run my Harris gates one and DX -10 > at the Full limit between 120-125% modulation No distortion. I have tested > them Up to 130% gotta love it.. > I guess it depends On the Stereo exciter.. I have the Harris AMS exciter.. > the Motorola is a different story... that I would Not attempt over 105% > Neal > > I'm running a Motorola exciter here on a Raytheon RA 1000 and a McMartin BA 1k at modulation levels up to 123% {to stay within the legal limit} and have not had any distortion to speak of You can hear it for yourself at http:wgai.dyn.ee:8000/listen.pls ...the bitrate is set a little low because the server is on a dial-up...but at least you'll get the idea {broadcast in stereo too on the webstream} Best bet is to try early morning or evening when there arent as many people trying to tune in. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From KC4QLP@aol.com Wed Nov 20 22:47:46 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Nov 2002 06:47:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 2517 invoked from network); 21 Nov 2002 06:47:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Nov 2002 06:47:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d08.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.40) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Nov 2002 06:47:46 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.169.1765d21f (4254) for ; Thu, 21 Nov 2002 01:47:35 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <169.1765d21f.2b0ddb86@aol.com> Date: Thu, 21 Nov 2002 01:47:34 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} a common misconception To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 11/20/02 7:45:19 PM Eastern Standard Time, possumhunter@netzero.net writes: > so we need to cook up a promo to air that states the truth: > FM= Multipath distortion, hissy audio, blended mono, and listener fatigue > AM= Crisp, clean sound, Perfect stereo separation at great distances from > the transmitter, and smooth sound you can listen to for hours on end. > > Sounds like the script on one of the AMAX promos that I currently run. {usually heard near the top of the hour =various hours=and always at 11:58:50 pm break.....my way of welcoming in the new day on WGAI} =webstream at http://wgai.dyn.ee:8000/listen.pls The promo goes something like this =phrasing=: FM means clean stereo sound but not known for long distance reception{static burst} AM, long distance reception but not know for quality stereo sound.Well something's changed! AM now means clear stereo reception.AMAX! the name to look for when your buying your next receiver,look for the AMAX symbol! {diggling music}female voices singing}AMAX {end of spot} I have about 5 different versions of these...some quite serious to a bit humorous...like the one that starts out as talking about the "golden age of radio" and what sounds like an old radio program on an LP...that is scratched and the needl-needl-needl-needl-needl-{zip!} needle gets hung and is followed by a hip up to date flashy radio sound of the 90's...and so on and so forth. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From KC4QLP@aol.com Wed Nov 20 22:55:07 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Nov 2002 06:55:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 8473 invoked from network); 21 Nov 2002 06:55:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Nov 2002 06:55:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d07.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.39) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Nov 2002 06:55:07 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.a4.2fb883b3 (4254) for ; Thu, 21 Nov 2002 01:54:57 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Thu, 21 Nov 2002 01:54:56 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF}Both ams & Cris Cuff are still alive To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 11/20/02 8:38:49 PM Eastern Standard Time, possumhunter@netzero.net writes: > > > > No pirate radio here... > > awww come on, just aout everybody I know has plugged a part 15 transmitter > into a longwire then drive around seeing how far it would go. (My > reproduction Zenith Wireless Phonograph will go nearly a mile when driving > an Alpha Delta DX-SWL Sloper) > > Kind of reminds me of my "experimenting" days on 1620 before the expanded band got noisey. 100 watts into a 35 foot base loaded directional antenna yeilded 20 mile coverage in one direction and 55 mile coverage in the other..daytime!...and several states at night. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From KC4QLP@aol.com Wed Nov 20 23:08:53 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Nov 2002 07:08:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 61795 invoked from network); 21 Nov 2002 07:08:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Nov 2002 07:08:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r07.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.103) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Nov 2002 07:08:52 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.9b.30fceb2a (4254) for ; Thu, 21 Nov 2002 02:08:49 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <9b.30fceb2a.2b0de081@aol.com> Date: Thu, 21 Nov 2002 02:08:49 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} WTIR was:Both ams & Cris Cuff are still alive To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 11/20/02 10:35:03 PM Eastern Standard Time, possumhunter@netzero.net writes: > I would take a near field measurement of WTTM at low and high power and > compare that to a near field measurement of WTIR. If they are at 10K, (and > I > have no doubt they are) I would gripe and groan to everybody in the FCC > that > would listen. My boss is personal friends with one of the inspectors in > Atlanta, if you need a name I will get it for you. > > hehehe...yep Powell in SC can make some noise when it comes to stations not doing as they should...great guy he is ....I've talked with him when WVOC 560 in Columbia was doing some work..and suspected non pattern changes that I believe to this day wasnt taking place when they should have.{Engineer swore everything was running and being done as it should have....dont they all say that?!?} Even though WVOC doesnt offer any protection for WGAI...they have to protect WFIL...so when I get blasted,especially when WVOC is carrying ball games..I know darn well WFIL is getting hammered as well.But hey..WVOC is a Clear Channel station and they could almost get away with radio murder,its just the nature of that beast! Anyone needing field strength readings I have a meter ...just need compensation for the mileage..thats it. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From dav259@csiro.au Thu Nov 21 00:21:24 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Nov 2002 08:21:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 69257 invoked from network); 21 Nov 2002 08:21:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Nov 2002 08:21:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Nov 2002 08:21:23 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAL8LMP09652 for ; Thu, 21 Nov 2002 19:21:22 +1100 (EST) Date: Thu, 21 Nov 2002 19:21:22 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: amstereoforum Subject: Re: {AMSF} a common misconception In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public On Thu, 21 Nov 2002, Ian Davidson wrote: > So I've bought her an Optimus (made for Radio Shack by > Sangean) "Outback" radio with large preset buttons. It drags in distant > AM stations really well. Sorry about this. I'm doing a "Steve" or "Shane Filan" ... answering my own messages. I bought one of these myself as well - as it drags in far away stations better than the SRF-42 and much better than the Sony tuner or boombox. It also has a 'LW' band. 144 - 279 kHz What am I supposed to pick up on this band? So far all I've picked up is interference. Was this band created for pop up toasters? Cause nothing else pops up on it. Deluded Davo Downunder From don@idpt.com Thu Nov 21 00:37:31 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: don@idpt.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Nov 2002 08:37:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 80717 invoked from network); 21 Nov 2002 08:37:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Nov 2002 08:37:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout2-eri1.midsouth.rr.com) (24.165.200.7) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Nov 2002 08:37:30 -0000 Received: from primary (cpe-024-024-118-043.midsouth.rr.com [24.24.118.43]) by mailout2-eri1.midsouth.rr.com (8.11.4/8.11.4) with ESMTP id gAL8bUf27672 for ; Thu, 21 Nov 2002 02:37:30 -0600 (CST) To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} a common misconception Date: Thu, 21 Nov 2002 02:37:32 -0600 Message-ID: <001f01c29139$3f53b8d0$0202a8c0@primary> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2616 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal From: "Don Johnson" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=32705644 X-Yahoo-Profile: htmldon I will defer to the engineering minds on the list as to the usefulness of the Longwave band -- but I think it is mainly for pop-up toasters and/or listening to lightning interference :) I've never been able to pick up anything but noise, but supposedly there are a few stations or at least regular beacons on the band. I think there is also some ham activity and a lot of folks like the novelty of such low frequencies. There is a group of longwave fans (who I would really make fun of were I not an AM Stereo fan) at http://www.lwca.org/ I'd personally like to see this and other generally unused parts of the spectrum opened up to license-free experimental or community use. _________________ Don Johnson don@donjohnson.org -----Original Message----- From: Ian Davidson [mailto:dav259@csiro.au] Sent: Thursday, November 21, 2002 2:21 AM To: amstereoforum Subject: Re: {AMSF} a common misconception On Thu, 21 Nov 2002, Ian Davidson wrote: > So I've bought her an Optimus (made for Radio Shack by > Sangean) "Outback" radio with large preset buttons. It drags in distant > AM stations really well. Sorry about this. I'm doing a "Steve" or "Shane Filan" ... answering my own messages. I bought one of these myself as well - as it drags in far away stations better than the SRF-42 and much better than the Sony tuner or boombox. It also has a 'LW' band. 144 - 279 kHz What am I supposed to pick up on this band? So far all I've picked up is interference. Was this band created for pop up toasters? Cause nothing else pops up on it. Deluded Davo Downunder Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From dav259@csiro.au Thu Nov 21 00:50:43 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Nov 2002 08:50:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 14000 invoked from network); 21 Nov 2002 08:50:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Nov 2002 08:50:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Nov 2002 08:50:42 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAL8oeP11187 for ; Thu, 21 Nov 2002 19:50:40 +1100 (EST) Date: Thu, 21 Nov 2002 19:50:40 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} a common misconception In-Reply-To: <001f01c29139$3f53b8d0$0202a8c0@primary> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public On Thu, 21 Nov 2002, Don Johnson wrote: > There is a group of longwave fans (who I would really make fun of were I > not an AM Stereo fan) at http://www.lwca.org/ > > I'd personally like to see this and other generally unused parts of the > spectrum opened up to license-free experimental or community use. Me two 3XY! Thanks Don. So where do I stick the bread? I tried the battery compartment and I'm still waiting for something to pop up ... *nod* ;-/ anyhoo From groucho@skyweb.net Thu Nov 21 03:12:56 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Nov 2002 11:12:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 17108 invoked from network); 21 Nov 2002 11:12:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Nov 2002 11:12:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Nov 2002 11:12:53 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gALBGved002095 for ; Thu, 21 Nov 2002 06:16:57 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DDCBF5C.27665F2E@skyweb.net> Date: Thu, 21 Nov 2002 06:11:24 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} WTIR was:Both ams & Cris Cuff are still alive References: <3DDC2D0B.832047F3@skyweb.net> <3DDC3DED.2124F7B4@skyweb.net> <3DDC4EB3.84A3BDE6@skyweb.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 I have already done that. and the difference is Huge the only way to describe it would be on a scale of 1 to 10 10 Kw the scale would be 10 full scale reading at 1 Kw the scale would be 3 this reading difference was taken at my site standing 10 feet from the transmitter with the meter on the workbench..From this I can reasonably say that If there is no difference in the readings there is no power change. even at a distance you would notice the change. The groaning has already been made just waiting for the results... Possum Hunter wrote: I would take a near field measurement of WTTM at low and high power and compare that to a near field measurement of WTIR. If they are at 10K, (and I > have no doubt they are) I would gripe and groan to everybody in the FCC that > would listen. My boss is personal friends with one of the inspectors in > Atlanta, if you need a name I will get it for you. > > Long live FREE RADIO! > > Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ > Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From groucho@skyweb.net Thu Nov 21 03:27:55 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Nov 2002 11:27:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 23732 invoked from network); 21 Nov 2002 11:27:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Nov 2002 11:27:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Nov 2002 11:27:55 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gALBVved005343 for ; Thu, 21 Nov 2002 06:31:58 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DDCC2DE.93418EF6@skyweb.net> Date: Thu, 21 Nov 2002 06:26:22 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Engineer Pay, ATUs, and Transmitters Was: X-Band References: <36.31dddc17.2b0dcc45@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Echolink is software that allows you to get onto a Network Of repeaters or repeater conference rooms all over the world. or even directly to another ham that's Logged onto the system. like a telephone.. direct and private.. great stuff..or you can build or buy a small interface board for less than $50 and connect the computer to a radio or repeater and make a link to get on from an HT. cool stuff You have to be a radio amateur to use it. it validates the software by looking up your Calls in the fcc data base... and its Free.. works By Voice over IP . you can get it at http://www.echolink.org shame they don't make a commercial version of it.. would work well For Doing remotes with a laptop or emergency STL.. try it you will Be amazed... with a program like this You no longer need to buy a radio to get on the air.. Neal -KA2CAF CE WTTM 1680 am stereo Princeton ,NJ WYGG 88.1 Asbury Park,NJ WUPC 102.3 Arrowhead Village,NJ KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 11/20/02 7:40:50 PM Eastern Standard Time, > groucho@skyweb.net writes: > > > Hey Bob you should join some of us up On 1850kc LSB nightly For some real > > talk > > or on echolink? > > Neal ka2caf > > CE WTTM > > > > > > > > Soon as I get the other half of my antenna string back up in the other tree > I'll be able to get something going on 160 .... > ...so perhaps in a few weeks I'll be back up and running on HF...time > permitting. > > BTW..what is echolink? > > Bob Carter > Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio group > > WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 > Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 > > Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering > services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. > e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net > Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC > WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC > WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC > Ray Communications Radio Network > > AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- > amstereo-subcribe@topica.com > > KC4QLP Amateur Radio > Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va > www.kc4qlp.cjb.net > > voice contact-252-335-0856 > fax 1-209-254-8978 > _______________________________________________________ > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From groucho@skyweb.net Thu Nov 21 03:33:15 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Nov 2002 11:33:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 51459 invoked from network); 21 Nov 2002 11:33:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Nov 2002 11:33:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Nov 2002 11:33:14 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gALBbIed006550 for ; Thu, 21 Nov 2002 06:37:18 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DDCC41F.1920BC5E@skyweb.net> Date: Thu, 21 Nov 2002 06:31:43 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} a common misconception References: <169.1765d21f.2b0ddb86@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 I would love to play that stuff on My station. the PD probably wont allow it during the day Because its Not in Hindu.. But I could do it early in the Morning and On the Automation at night.. Care to share Via MP3? Neal KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 11/20/02 7:45:19 PM Eastern Standard Time, > possumhunter@netzero.net writes: > > > so we need to cook up a promo to air that states the truth: > > FM= Multipath distortion, hissy audio, blended mono, and listener fatigue > > AM= Crisp, clean sound, Perfect stereo separation at great distances from > > the transmitter, and smooth sound you can listen to for hours on end. > > > > > > Sounds like the script on one of the AMAX promos that I currently run. > {usually heard near the top of the hour =various hours=and always at 11:58:50 > pm break.....my way of welcoming in the new day on WGAI} > =webstream at http://wgai.dyn.ee:8000/listen.pls > > The promo goes something like this =phrasing=: FM means clean stereo sound > but not known for long distance reception{static burst} AM, long distance > reception but not know for quality stereo sound.Well something's changed! AM > now means clear stereo reception.AMAX! the name to look for when your buying > your next receiver,look for the AMAX symbol! {diggling music}female voices > singing}AMAX {end of spot} > I have about 5 different versions of these...some quite serious to a bit > humorous...like the one that starts out as talking about the "golden age of > radio" and what sounds like an old radio program on an LP...that is scratched > and the needl-needl-needl-needl-needl-{zip!} needle gets hung and is followed > by a hip up to date flashy radio sound of the 90's...and so on and so forth. > > Bob Carter > Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio group > > WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 > Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 > > Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering > services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. > e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net > Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC > WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC > WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC > Ray Communications Radio Network > > AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- > amstereo-subcribe@topica.com > > KC4QLP Amateur Radio > Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va > www.kc4qlp.cjb.net > > voice contact-252-335-0856 > fax 1-209-254-8978 > _______________________________________________________ > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From groucho@skyweb.net Thu Nov 21 03:58:40 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Nov 2002 11:58:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 79437 invoked from network); 21 Nov 2002 11:58:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Nov 2002 11:58:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Nov 2002 11:58:39 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gALC2ged011675 for ; Thu, 21 Nov 2002 07:02:42 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DDCCA12.CFB22CE7@skyweb.net> Date: Thu, 21 Nov 2002 06:57:06 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF}Both ams & Cris Cuff are still alive References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 reason For the Following No pirate radio Here.. as a 16 year old I took an old Tube TV Tuner added a few Varactor diodes rewound the channel 2 coil and made an FM oscillator. with a 5794 amp stage then a 6CL6 to 6146 . which drive either a 4Cx250 or a 4cx1000 Final amp. I originally built for Amps for use on the Tube GE prog-line 2 meter repeater I was playing with.depending on my mood. high Power FM amps are So Easy to Build... Yeah my parents used to say I "one day he will Either Burn the house down or blow it Up." I too used to experiment... had one great signal... however when a local kid up the block tried to do the same thing on his fathers Ham AM transmitter on 7.415 and Got caught.. He blamed me.. I got a Visit and I was Not on the air at the Time. so it kind of saved My Butt however He had taken some of my tape recordings of stuff I had recorded. which had My voice on it..Voice prints matched. and I was hit with a $10k Fine. but because I was 16 they reduced it to $250.. I was lucky not being on the air at the time of the visit.. so since that Day I no longer record anything I do on the air. and stay 100% legal.. I don't even experiment. anymore... food for thought... If you record a show and your voice is on it. and someone plays it on a unlicensed station.. If they match the Voice.. You are liable... and can Be fined... I was a clever kid. now much older and wiser... I have a 30 watt a 10 watt and a 1 watt FM exciter sitting in the closet as backups for the 2 FM's and translator I maintain.. I have been tempted to power them up during the Holiday season on 3 different Freqs simulcasting X-mas music No talk just music.. But have not done so.. maybe this year with the CC lite.. on 1580... but that would be part 15 still legal... Neal > In a message dated 11/20/02 8:38:49 PM Eastern Standard Time, > possumhunter@netzero.net writes: > > > > > > > No pirate radio here... > > > > awww come on, just aout everybody I know has plugged a part 15 transmitter > > into a longwire then drive around seeing how far it would go. (My > > reproduction Zenith Wireless Phonograph will go nearly a mile when driving > > an Alpha Delta DX-SWL Sloper) > > > > > > Kind of reminds me of my "experimenting" days on 1620 before the expanded > band got noisey. 100 watts into a 35 foot base loaded directional antenna > yeilded 20 mile coverage in one direction and 55 mile coverage in the > other..daytime!...and several states at night. > > Bob Carter > Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio group > > WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 > Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 > > Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering > services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. > e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net > Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC > WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC > WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC > Ray Communications Radio Network > > AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- > amstereo-subcribe@topica.com > > KC4QLP Amateur Radio > Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va > www.kc4qlp.cjb.net > > voice contact-252-335-0856 > fax 1-209-254-8978 > _______________________________________________________ > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Thu Nov 21 05:38:51 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Nov 2002 13:38:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 51443 invoked from network); 21 Nov 2002 13:38:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Nov 2002 13:38:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14204.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.146) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Nov 2002 13:38:49 -0000 Message-ID: <20021121133849.21097.qmail@web14204.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.45.202.244] by web14204.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 21 Nov 2002 05:38:49 PST Date: Thu, 21 Nov 2002 05:38:49 -0800 (PST) Subject: GE Super Radio III supplies To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio Many have been asking about the GE Super Radio III, and I have seen them at both Kmart and at Sears stores. __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus – Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From mychucky@funport.net Thu Nov 21 07:18:26 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: mychucky@funport.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Nov 2002 15:18:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 44947 invoked from network); 21 Nov 2002 15:18:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Nov 2002 15:18:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.funport.com) (216.199.19.6) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Nov 2002 15:18:26 -0000 Received: from FatMusic2000 ([]) by mail.funport.com (Merak 5.3.2) with SMTP id JFB36580 for ; Thu, 21 Nov 2002 10:18:28 -0500 Message-ID: <007501c29171$3f4a2170$1400a8c0@FatMusic2000> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} a common misconception Date: Thu, 21 Nov 2002 10:18:29 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=85836819 X-Yahoo-Profile: mychucky1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Submarines use that band ----- Original Message ----- From: Ian Davidson To: amstereoforum Sent: Thursday, November 21, 2002 3:21 AM Subject: Re: {AMSF} a common misconception On Thu, 21 Nov 2002, Ian Davidson wrote: > So I've bought her an Optimus (made for Radio Shack by > Sangean) "Outback" radio with large preset buttons. It drags in distant > AM stations really well. Sorry about this. I'm doing a "Steve" or "Shane Filan" ... answering my own messages. I bought one of these myself as well - as it drags in far away stations better than the SRF-42 and much better than the Sony tuner or boombox. It also has a 'LW' band. 144 - 279 kHz What am I supposed to pick up on this band? So far all I've picked up is interference. Was this band created for pop up toasters? Cause nothing else pops up on it. Deluded Davo Downunder Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From philipr@irac.pe.ca Thu Nov 21 07:39:38 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Nov 2002 15:39:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 76338 invoked from network); 21 Nov 2002 15:39:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Nov 2002 15:39:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Nov 2002 15:39:38 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.181] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 21 Nov 2002 15:39:38 -0000 Date: Thu, 21 Nov 2002 15:39:36 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: GE Super Radio III supplies Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20021121133849.21097.qmail@web14204.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 619 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking For Canadian members - Canadian Tire carries them for $79.99 CDN.=20=20 Some Wal-Mart stores and some Home Hardware stores carry them - I=20 have seen prices as low as $69.99 CDN, so shop around. let's hear=20 from our Aussie friends on stores and prices in that great country! Phil R. --- In amstereoforum@y..., "John P." wrote: > Many have been asking about the GE Super Radio III, and I have=20 seen them at > both Kmart and at Sears stores. >=20 > __________________________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Mail Plus =96 Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. > http://mailplus.yahoo.com From michaelj@vcn.com Thu Nov 21 08:25:45 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Nov 2002 16:25:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 89383 invoked from network); 21 Nov 2002 16:25:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Nov 2002 16:25:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m1-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.31) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Nov 2002 16:25:44 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m1-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Thu, 21 Nov 2002 09:25:44 -0700 Message-ID: <004101c2917a$a2333de0$0701010a@keva> To: References: <3DDCCA12.CFB22CE7@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF}Both ams & Cris Cuff are still alive Date: Thu, 21 Nov 2002 09:25:40 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Been getting lots of interesting comments here in Wyo about AM Stereo since I've been posting to a Salt Lake City radio forum. Even had some folks ask about possible conversions to their radios. Anyone have a few of Chris' decoders that they'd be willing to part with? Tried contacting Chris and no response. He sounds pretty busy right now. Attempted to convert my Pioneer home stereo receiver. I messed up a pin on one of the chips and it's dead now :( Interestingly enough, the whole AM/FM section is on a nice little plug-in card. Anyone know how I could get this card replaced??? Anyone in the electronics repair business? Successfully converted another Mitsu car stereo unit for my car. Extremely similar unit to the ones I've converted before....same chips and all except that for some unkown reason, on THIS unit when the radio is in AM mode, the chip will not let the "ST" indicator come on. Just mounted an LED for AM STEREO coming off of the decoder. This sucks because it's the EXACT NEC Display controller chip that the others had and with those, I could just run the ground side of the LED off the decoder to a certain pin and it would make the ST indicator turn on. doesn't work with this one, though. It's okay, though. I'll deal with having an external LED as long as I get the sound in stereo. This one sounds GOOD!! Took the blue ceramic filter off an older Mitsu factory AM Stereo radio and used it to replace the ceramic filter in this one. Turns it into a nice "wideband" receiver. Sounds as good as the Superadio :) I'm a bit bummed about my Pioneer receiver, though. I can't seem to ever try to do a project and have it go perfectly without any problems. I'm getting to the point where I don't trust myself that I'm not going to screw something up :( The AM section is fine on that unit, but apparantly the pin that I messed up is the FM signal detector so now the FM is dead. I'd really like some help getting a replacement card for it if I can. Any ideas? MJR n WYO [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From philipr@irac.pe.ca Thu Nov 21 08:37:17 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Nov 2002 16:37:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 57080 invoked from network); 21 Nov 2002 16:37:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Nov 2002 16:37:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Nov 2002 16:37:13 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.150] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 21 Nov 2002 16:37:13 -0000 Date: Thu, 21 Nov 2002 16:37:10 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: ams is still alive Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <005b01c290ec$eec71020$0101a8c0@pavilion> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2664 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking Yes, AM Stereo, and Enhanced fidelity AM, is very much on a roll: 1. My local Canadian Tire is cleaned out of GE SR IIIs - again. 2. I recently did some AM Stereo demos, to rave reviews, now that I have the Toyota/Panasonic AM Stereo receiver - the Sony SRF-42 was far too finicky to tune - but this Panasonic car stereo sounds great, is sensitive, and gives great at or near AMAX AM stereo. What works great for an antenna is a Vectronics tunable active antenna, with coax and a PL-259 [am I remembering this right?] to Motorola adapter, avail through RS. Sensitive, low noise - works great. Was listening to CJCH, CJLS and what used to be WKBW 1520 [WWKB?] with great results. CJFX's null is far too deep here for the Panasonic, but using a select antenna and the Sony SRF-42 I can pick up what's left of "Mutant X" on 580 and the delightful WTTM on 1680. In all, 5 stations in stereo, not including my own Alfredo Lite. 3. Considerable interest in AM and AM Stereo on the Ramsey Forum. several folks pestering Ramsey to come up with AM Stereo stuff. Chris is getting lots of mention there too. 4. Ebay, as a tool to sell and promote AM Stereo - congrats Chris! 5. 120 plus members and growing on the AMS Forum! My conclusion is that the IBOC talk is waking people up, making them aware of AM radio, thinking of music on AM radio, and all of IBOC's many problems is making people interested in AM Stereo all over again. This time, AM Stereo is a grass roots effort - Chief Engineers, Techs, hobbyists, microbroadcasters, past and present broadcast folks, Dxers, mom and pop stations, all interested. When IBOC fails, the big boys will have their stereo STLs, CQUAM friendly antenna arrays and all the other ingredients to make an easy transition to AM Stereo. In the meanwhile, the smaller stations will have an exciting product - that works! Welcome, folks, to the AM Stereo Renaissance! Phil R. --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Christopher Cuff" wrote: > I know I've been quiet lately- but I do have some interesting items of note. > Lately, as of the past 4 weeks or so, I have been contacted by several mom & > pop stations wanting to go stereo. > They all want decoders, they want demo radios. > Another company that specializes in custom auto aftermarket electronics is > also buying decoders. > I put 4 "Lites" on ebay, and all were sold within 1 day. > I have 1 left, besides my personal demo unit. > More boards are being made now- as the email I got after the auction was > over was incredible. > So gang, There IS a spark- For some reason, it's bigger than ever. > Very encouraging indeed. > Chris From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Nov 21 09:16:59 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Nov 2002 17:16:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 55626 invoked from network); 21 Nov 2002 17:16:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Nov 2002 17:16:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r08.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.104) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Nov 2002 17:16:57 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.1a8.c5680d7 (16781) for ; Thu, 21 Nov 2002 12:16:52 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1a8.c5680d7.2b0e6f04@aol.com> Date: Thu, 21 Nov 2002 12:16:52 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Engineer Pay, ATUs, and Transmitters Was: X-Band To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 11/21/02 6:29:50 AM Eastern Standard Time, groucho@skyweb.net writes: > You have to be a radio amateur to use it. it validates the software by > looking up > your Calls in the fcc data base... and its Free.. works By Voice over IP . > you can get it at > http://www.echolink.org > shame they don't make a commercial version of it.. would work well For > Doing > remotes with a laptop or emergency STL.. > try it you will Be amazed... with a program like this You no longer need > to > buy a radio to get on the air.. > Neal -KA2CAF > Cool deal Neal...got it and its up and running.So perhaps till I'm up and running onHF..we'll catch you via Echolink. Speaking of doing remotes and or having STL's via the internet...a friend of mine that runs a 1kw FM station in Kenbridge/Blackstone Va {WPEX 90.9 FM www.wpexonline.com} does all of his remotes via an internet stream.He uses a simple dial-up and Winblows Media to stream the audio from the remote site back to the station.He says it sounds great! {heard it myself!} and cost him very little to do.Its a lot cheaper than using a cell phone and less cumbersome than a Marti. He has a son that lives in Norfolk that regularly does a show on the FM from his home in Norfolk via that web stream.Other than the occassional buffering,you would never know he was over a 100 miles away coming to you live via the internet. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From michaelj@vcn.com Thu Nov 21 09:19:17 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Nov 2002 17:19:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 55102 invoked from network); 21 Nov 2002 17:19:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Nov 2002 17:19:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m1-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Nov 2002 17:19:16 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m1-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id ; Thu, 21 Nov 2002 10:19:16 -0700 Message-ID: <005701c29182$1cbb2d00$0701010a@keva> To: Cc: Subject: Ham interference Date: Thu, 21 Nov 2002 10:19:10 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi guys I know a lot of you are hams. I've got a buddy here that has a ham that lives next door and he gets tons of intereference on his radio/TV/phones, etc. It is especially annoying when my friend is trying to use the internet. Is there anything that can be done about this? I've experienced the same problem before when I had a ham living next door. Is this legal? Is there anything I can do for him.....maybe install some kind of a trap or filter on his phone lines?? thanks MJR n WYO [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Nov 21 09:23:28 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Nov 2002 17:23:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 69592 invoked from network); 21 Nov 2002 17:23:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Nov 2002 17:23:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d02.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.34) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Nov 2002 17:23:27 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.b0.2ff2bde1 (16781) for ; Thu, 21 Nov 2002 12:23:21 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Thu, 21 Nov 2002 12:23:20 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} a common misconception To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 11/21/02 6:37:06 AM Eastern Standard Time, groucho@skyweb.net writes: > I would love to play that stuff on My station. the PD probably wont allow > it > during the day Because its Not in Hindu.. But I could do it early in the > Morning > and On the Automation at night.. Care to share Via MP3? > Neal > > I sure can ....give me a little bit of time for the dust to settle on my end as things are in transistion right now. Our group isnt owned by Ray-D-O Biz L.L.C. anymore..its now Max Radio Of The Carolinas L.L.C. ...and everything is being "fixed" if you will. The previous owner made quite the mess of things and looks like this new group is finally going to get the stations back to where they need to be. Another plus is that they are an AM Stereo friendly group. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Nov 21 09:36:44 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Nov 2002 17:36:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 48142 invoked from network); 21 Nov 2002 17:36:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Nov 2002 17:36:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.90) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Nov 2002 17:36:43 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.252] by n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 21 Nov 2002 17:36:43 -0000 Date: Thu, 21 Nov 2002 17:36:43 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Ham interference Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <005701c29182$1cbb2d00$0701010a@keva> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1620 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > I've got a buddy here that has a ham that lives next door and he > gets tons of intereference on his radio/TV/phones, etc. In cases like this, the cause lies somewhere in a combination of high RF levels from the ham radio operator, along with today's cheaply made electronics. RF shielding is not nearly as good as it used to be; today, most computers aren't in metal cases anymore, and TV sets are built for the consistent signal levels from cable and satellite so they're not as sensitive and selective as they used to be when receiving regular on-air TV signals. And I have a fax machine that will pick up Shortwave stations from hundreds of miles away at night in its handset, nevermind ham signals from next door! Filters for both the ham and your neighbor can help a lot, but sometimes you just have cheaply made equipment that nothing will help. One trick I've heard is that if you take an old-fashioned corded telephone with a carbon microphone element and put an .01 uF capacitor across the mic, that will make it immune to even the strongest RF fields you can throw at it. p.s. Speaking of TV reception... I've noticed that in windy weather, UHF reception of even strong local signals tends to waver and fade out "with the breeze". Supposedly at UHF frequencies, even the leaves of a tree can block reception! Thus I continue to doubt that on-air HDTV reception, on UHF channels with digital's naturally higher signal strength requirements, will never work to any successful degree. It is simply never going to match the coverage of regular analog TV on the lower VHF channels. From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Nov 21 09:46:24 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Nov 2002 17:46:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 29278 invoked from network); 21 Nov 2002 17:46:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Nov 2002 17:46:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.203) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Nov 2002 17:46:22 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 21 Nov 2002 09:46:22 -0800 To: References: <1a8.c5680d7.2b0e6f04@aol.com> Subject: Remote Links Was: Engineer Pay, ATUs, and Transmitters Date: Thu, 21 Nov 2002 12:46:10 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 21 Nov 2002 17:46:22.0714 (UTC) FILETIME=[E7E6DDA0:01C29185] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.149.212.160] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: >a friend of mine that runs a 1kw FM station in Kenbridge/Blackstone Va {WPEX 90.9 FM www.wpexonline.com} does all of his remotes via an internet stream.He uses a simple dial-up and Winblows Media to stream the audio from the remote site back to the station.He says it sounds great! {heard it myself!} and cost him very little to do.Its a lot cheaper than using a cell phone and less cumbersome than a Marti. I would like to know more about this. Cell phone bills are killing us on high school sports broadcasts when they are playing outside of Marti range. Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Nov 21 09:48:20 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Nov 2002 17:48:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 26347 invoked from network); 21 Nov 2002 17:48:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Nov 2002 17:48:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m02.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.5) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Nov 2002 17:48:20 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.15a.17bfad56 (16781) for ; Thu, 21 Nov 2002 12:48:03 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <15a.17bfad56.2b0e7653@aol.com> Date: Thu, 21 Nov 2002 12:48:03 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Ham interference To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 11/21/02 12:20:47 PM Eastern Standard Time, michaelj@vcn.com writes: > Hi guys > I know a lot of you are hams. I've got a buddy here that has a ham that > lives next door and he gets tons of intereference on his radio/TV/phones, > etc. It is especially annoying when my friend is trying to use the > internet. Is there anything that can be done about this? I've experienced > the same problem before when I had a ham living next door. Is this legal? > Is there anything I can do for him.....maybe install some kind of a trap or > filter on his phone lines?? > > thanks > MJR n WYO > Sounds like this neighbor is really getting hammered.Often times in cases like this the interference is from front end overload on TV and Radios....not to much can be done about that.As far as other devices...certain lengths of wire..like speaker wires,phone lines can act as the perfect "receiving" antenna because they just happen to be of the lenght that would coincide with what frequency {wave length} the ham operator is operating on. A test would be to see if the interference increases,decreases and or hopefully goes away when the ham changes to a different ham band. Oh,and another thing...as far as the TV/radio goes...if an outside antenna is being used...one might want to look at the height of the tv/radio antenna and compare it to the height of the amateurs operating antennas. If the two are at and very close to the same height...bringing one up higher and or lower will help as well.Also if they are close in nature to each other..move them father away from each other..this will help lower the amount of RF being "dumped" into the radio and tv from the ham operator. There are filters for both the radio operator {low pass filter} and filters for the neighbor {high pass filters} that -might- help for the tv/radio..there are also filters for phone lines as well. Lets just hope this situation isnt severe like a case I had as a teenager getting into the radio hobby {and now business}. My neighbor and I tried everything....come to find out,my signal was being picked up through the power lines which in return caused almost everything to get interference in her house...even at 1 WATT! {needless to say..they moved!..lol} Another thing I have found over the years,and we talk about it here all the time...and its the quality of receivers today,both TV and radio.They just can not offer interference protection like the good old stuff. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Nov 21 09:49:30 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Nov 2002 17:49:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 20363 invoked from network); 21 Nov 2002 17:49:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Nov 2002 17:49:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.121) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Nov 2002 17:49:30 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 21 Nov 2002 09:49:30 -0800 To: References: <001f01c29139$3f53b8d0$0202a8c0@primary> Subject: Re: {AMSF} a common misconception Date: Thu, 21 Nov 2002 12:49:18 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 21 Nov 2002 17:49:30.0366 (UTC) FILETIME=[57C049E0:01C29186] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.149.212.160] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Don Johnson wrote: > I will defer to the engineering minds on the list as to the usefulness of the Longwave band -- but I think it is mainly for pop-up toasters and/or listening to lightning interference :) I used to love listening to Atlantic 252. Lofering is pretty fun :-) I should put my beacon back up, it was CW "P-O-S-S-U-M" Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Nov 21 09:51:42 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Nov 2002 17:51:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 95246 invoked from network); 21 Nov 2002 17:51:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Nov 2002 17:51:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.200) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Nov 2002 17:51:42 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 21 Nov 2002 09:51:42 -0800 To: References: <3DDC2D0B.832047F3@skyweb.net> <3DDC3DED.2124F7B4@skyweb.net> <3DDC4EB3.84A3BDE6@skyweb.net> <3DDCBF5C.27665F2E@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} WTIR was:Both ams & Cris Cuff are still alive Date: Thu, 21 Nov 2002 12:51:30 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 21 Nov 2002 17:51:42.0545 (UTC) FILETIME=[A6893410:01C29186] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.149.212.160] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Neal Newman wrote: > The groaning has already been made just waiting for the results... I would like to hear WTTM myself, so hopefully the FCC will do something soon. Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Nov 21 09:59:34 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Nov 2002 17:59:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 39905 invoked from network); 21 Nov 2002 17:59:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Nov 2002 17:59:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.204) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Nov 2002 17:59:33 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 21 Nov 2002 09:59:33 -0800 To: References: <3DDCCA12.CFB22CE7@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF}Both ams & Cris Cuff are still alive Date: Thu, 21 Nov 2002 12:59:21 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 21 Nov 2002 17:59:33.0694 (UTC) FILETIME=[BF5CD5E0:01C29187] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.149.212.160] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Neal Newman wrote: > He had taken some of my tape recordings of stuff I had recorded. which had My voice on it..Voice prints matched. and I was hit with a $10k Fine. but because I was 16 they reduced it to $250.. I was lucky not being on the air at the time of the visit. Oh man, that is a bad deal! > >I have been tempted to power them up during the Holiday season on 3 different Freqs simulcasting X-mas music No talk just music.. But have not done so.. maybe this year with the CC lite.. on 1580... but that would be part 15 still legal... My BTA1R blasting away into the dummy load should be perfectly legal. I was tempted to turn 'er loose on the sloper for Halloween, but I was a good boy and didn't do it! Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Nov 21 10:08:46 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Nov 2002 18:08:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 93329 invoked from network); 21 Nov 2002 18:08:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Nov 2002 18:08:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.207) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Nov 2002 18:08:46 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 21 Nov 2002 10:08:46 -0800 To: References: <169.1765d21f.2b0ddb86@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} a common misconception Date: Thu, 21 Nov 2002 13:08:34 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 21 Nov 2002 18:08:46.0567 (UTC) FILETIME=[08E68F70:01C29189] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.149.212.160] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Bob Carter wrote: > Sounds like the script on one of the AMAX promos that I currently run. My copy of the AMAX promos got killed when my house fell in a few years ago. I would LOVE to have MP3s or dubs of them if at all possible. > >some quite serious to a bit humorous...like the one that starts out as talking about the "golden age of radio" and what sounds like an old radio program on an LP...that is scratched and the needl-needl-needl-needl-needl-{zip!} needle gets hung and is followed by a hip up to date flashy radio sound of the 90's...and so on and so forth. That was my favorite one! LOL When I was at WAIM, we played them to make fun of WANS, an Adult Standards station that was in the same market. Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Nov 21 10:09:19 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Nov 2002 18:09:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 3159 invoked from network); 21 Nov 2002 18:09:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Nov 2002 18:09:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r07.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.103) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Nov 2002 18:09:19 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.1b9.9bf9c2a (16781) for ; Thu, 21 Nov 2002 13:09:13 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1b9.9bf9c2a.2b0e7b48@aol.com> Date: Thu, 21 Nov 2002 13:09:12 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Remote Links Was: Engineer Pay, ATUs, and Transmitters To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 11/21/02 12:47:23 PM Eastern Standard Time, possumhunter@netzero.net writes: > I would like to know more about this. Cell phone bills are killing us on > high school sports broadcasts when they are playing outside of Marti range. > > Long live FREE RADIO! > > Hey Possum,its just like using a shoutcast.com stream but this guy opted to use Windows Media server software and the like. I'm a fan of shoutcast/winamp..it doesnt take up as much system resources and doesnt take up nearly the hard drive space either. All you need is an internet connection on both ends and your off and running. The only draw backs are...if you use a dial-up connection like what I use for http://wgai.dyn.ee:8000/listen.pls {--which just happens to be down at the moment..gotta see whats up with that} you get disconnects.Gotta love it when you have a service that says "unlimited" service but you get knocked off line every 12 hours or so.Whatever happened to truth in advertising..or living up to what you say your going to offer. The other draw back is a dial-up.If its not a good one,will buffer,hiccup and skip. .you'll have to shop around and do some testing. One ISP in my area stinks when it comes to this.I've picked the best ISP around here for my purpose...very little buffering and skipping.While trying to listen to my stream on other dial-ups,instead of the program being the normal 1 to 3 minute delay...it was more like a 10 minute delay with frequent skipping...not good of you what to use it for server purposes.There are only two dial up ISP's here that offer that excellent service...your area might be better or worse than mine. Also I'm using a free service that converts my ever changing IP number to a web address..if anyone is interested..I'll direct you all to the program. Also ..on another note..the shoutcast server can be made to be either public or hidden from the public.That comes in handy if you dont want your "link" to be listened in on during commerical breaks too..and also keeps the bandwidth up to help insure less skipping back at the station. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Nov 21 10:18:57 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Nov 2002 18:18:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 54965 invoked from network); 21 Nov 2002 18:18:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Nov 2002 18:18:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.93) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Nov 2002 18:18:56 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 21 Nov 2002 10:18:56 -0800 To: References: <005701c29182$1cbb2d00$0701010a@keva> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Ham interference Date: Thu, 21 Nov 2002 13:18:44 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 21 Nov 2002 18:18:56.0933 (UTC) FILETIME=[74B50550:01C2918A] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.149.212.160] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Michael J. Richard wrote: I've got a buddy here that has a ham that lives next door and he gets tons of interference on his radio/TV/phones, etc. It is especially annoying when my friend is trying to use the internet. Is there anything that can be done about this? I got the RF out of the phone lines at WFIS by using 100% shielded phone wire, grounding the shield at the terminal block, then floating the shield at the phones. Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk Thu Nov 21 14:43:16 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Nov 2002 22:43:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 6204 invoked from network); 21 Nov 2002 22:43:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Nov 2002 22:43:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.89) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Nov 2002 22:43:15 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.135] by n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 21 Nov 2002 22:43:15 -0000 Date: Thu, 21 Nov 2002 22:43:13 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Ham interference Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <005701c29182$1cbb2d00$0701010a@keva> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 859 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "m1ctk" X-Originating-IP: 217.148.41.45 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113985069 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereofan --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Michael J. Richard" wrote: > Hi guys > I know a lot of you are hams. I've got a buddy here that has a ham that lives next door and he gets tons of intereference on his radio/TV/phones, etc. It is especially annoying when my friend is trying to use the internet. Is there anything that can be done about this? I've experienced the same problem before when I had a ham living next door. Is this legal? Is there anything I can do for him.....maybe install some kind of a trap or filter on his phone lines?? > If he's a decent helpful kind of guy he would hopefully be prepared to help your mate out by perhaps paying for various low-pass / high- pass filters etc even firite rings can help a little as has been said the problem is as much to do with him as with poorly made electronic equipment.. From ben@lennard.net.nz Thu Nov 21 15:03:50 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ben@lennard.net.nz X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Nov 2002 23:03:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 35119 invoked from network); 21 Nov 2002 23:03:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Nov 2002 23:03:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.68) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Nov 2002 23:03:47 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.156] by n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 21 Nov 2002 23:03:44 -0000 Date: Thu, 21 Nov 2002 23:03:43 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} a common misconception Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1269 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Ben" X-Originating-IP: 203.98.48.150 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=118503946 X-Yahoo-Profile: benlennard > > I'd personally like to see this and other generally unused parts of the > > spectrum opened up to license-free experimental or community use. Not sure if it is still the case, but LW is/has been used for Marine navigation in NZ. I know this, because one of the first Radio's I ever made (using a ZN414, and transistor Amplifier), I wound too many turns on the ferite rod, so was able to get LW as well as MW. Anyway, down on the LW band, was a constant beacon "dit - dit - dit - der - dit dit", which I later found out was a navigation beacon. Cheers, Ben, Wellington, New Zealand - where it is supposedly summer (humm - high winds, rain...) :-( --- In amstereoforum@y..., Ian Davidson wrote: > On Thu, 21 Nov 2002, Don Johnson wrote: > > > There is a group of longwave fans (who I would really make fun of were I > > not an AM Stereo fan) at http://www.lwca.org/ > > > > I'd personally like to see this and other generally unused parts of the > > spectrum opened up to license-free experimental or community use. > > Me two 3XY! > > Thanks Don. So where do I stick the bread? I tried the battery > compartment and I'm still waiting for something to pop up ... > > *nod* ;-/ anyhoo From ben@lennard.net.nz Thu Nov 21 15:06:13 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ben@lennard.net.nz X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Nov 2002 23:06:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 94745 invoked from network); 21 Nov 2002 23:06:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Nov 2002 23:06:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Nov 2002 23:06:06 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.171] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 21 Nov 2002 23:06:04 -0000 Date: Thu, 21 Nov 2002 23:06:01 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Ham interference Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 58 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Ben" X-Originating-IP: 203.98.48.150 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=118503946 X-Yahoo-Profile: benlennard Perhaps use a Steak instead? Oh - "HAM" - opps... ;-) From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Nov 21 15:17:09 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Nov 2002 23:17:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 58604 invoked from network); 21 Nov 2002 23:17:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Nov 2002 23:17:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r05.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.101) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Nov 2002 23:17:08 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.1bf.1528ae72 (4254) for ; Thu, 21 Nov 2002 18:17:03 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1bf.1528ae72.2b0ec36f@aol.com> Date: Thu, 21 Nov 2002 18:17:03 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} a common misconception To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 11/21/02 6:37:06 AM Eastern Standard Time, groucho@skyweb.net writes: << I would love to play that stuff on My station. the PD probably wont allow it during the day Because its Not in Hindu.. But I could do it early in the Morning and On the Automation at night.. Care to share Via MP3? Neal >> Ok..I plead ignorance here....is Hindu something like spanish or something totally different? Reason why I ask is that on the AMAX promo tape,there are two spanish versions of the AMAX promos that will be uploaded along with the others sometime in the near future. NewsRadio560 WGAI-AM Stereo-Broadcasting Quality AM Stereo Since 9-16-91 ------((((((AMAX)))))------ Bob Carter Operations/Engineering WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5..., Ray Communications Radio Network Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From groucho@skyweb.net Thu Nov 21 17:09:48 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Nov 2002 01:09:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 29869 invoked from network); 22 Nov 2002 01:09:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Nov 2002 01:09:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 01:09:46 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gAM1Doed085818 for ; Thu, 21 Nov 2002 20:13:51 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DDD834F.14370A70@skyweb.net> Date: Thu, 21 Nov 2002 20:07:28 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} a common misconception References: <1bf.1528ae72.2b0ec36f@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 is hindu like spanish? not even close but the one thing they do have in Common.. Neither sound anything like English.... but when you mix in any combination you can get either Spanglish or Hinglish.... Neal BTW I tried to call you On Echolink Left you a Little Hello message.... will try again Tomorrow.... have I got a story to tell you about what happened today..... LOL.... KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 11/21/02 6:37:06 AM Eastern Standard Time, > groucho@skyweb.net writes: > > << I would love to play that stuff on My station. the PD probably wont > allow it > during the day Because its Not in Hindu.. But I could do it early in the > Morning > and On the Automation at night.. Care to share Via MP3? > Neal >> > > Ok..I plead ignorance here....is Hindu something like spanish or something > totally different? > Reason why I ask is that on the AMAX promo tape,there are two spanish > versions of the AMAX promos that will be uploaded along with the others > sometime in the near future. > > NewsRadio560 WGAI-AM Stereo-Broadcasting Quality AM Stereo Since 9-16-91 > ------((((((AMAX)))))------ > Bob Carter > Operations/Engineering > > WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 > Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5..., Ray Communications Radio > Network > > Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering > services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. > e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net > http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice > Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC > WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC > WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC > > AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- > amstereo-subcribe@topica.com > > KC4QLP Amateur Radio > www.kc4qlp.cjb.net > > voice contact-252-335-0856 > fax 1-209-254-8978 > _______________________________________________________ > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From dav259@csiro.au Thu Nov 21 17:25:17 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Nov 2002 01:25:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 37099 invoked from network); 22 Nov 2002 01:25:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Nov 2002 01:25:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 01:25:16 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAM1PFP04352 for ; Fri, 22 Nov 2002 12:25:15 +1100 (EST) Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 12:25:15 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: amstereoforum Subject: Crisp Hi-Fi Radio Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public I've sent the following to our three daily papers - The Herald Sun, The Age, and The Australian. I urge all on the list to send it to any relevant publications in your area. I've modified the text here to suit US consumption - but maybe you could improve on it prior to sending it. Remember - keeping it short and snappy gives it a much better chance of being published. DOWN WITH THE NAB LIVE AND LOCAL RADIO FOREVER ---------- With all the dismal talk of IBOC digital radio's performance do we really need it? Motorola has developed the Symphony chip which will be released in radio receivers in twelve months time. This will not cost radio broadcasters anything and should only add about $5 to the purchase price of a radio. The Symphony system will digitally process current analog signals filtering out the pops and interference on AM and the multipath fuzziness on FM. It should be the shot in the arm that AM stereo broadcasting needs - though it sounds great even now. The NAB and independent broadcasters should embrace this new proven technology and ensure that these radios are in our shops next winter. ---------- Forwarded message ---------- To: Green Guide Subject: Crisp Hi-Fi Radio With all the talk of digital radio it is still 10 years away according to the technical head of ABC Radio. But do we need it? Motorola has developed the Symphony chip which will be released in radio receivers in twelve months time. This will not cost radio broadcasters anything and should only add about $10 to the purchase price of a radio. The Symphony system will digitally process current analogue signals filtering out the pops and interference on AM and the multipath fuzziness on FM. It should be the shot in the arm that AM stereo broadcasting needs - though it sounds great even now. Commercial Radio Australia and the ABC should embrace this new proven technology and ensure that these radios are in our shops for Christmas next year. Ian Davidson St. Kilda ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Ian Davidson _--_|\ tel (H) 03 9534 8786 41 Smith Street / \ tel (W) 03 9545 8717 St. Kilda Beach Vic 3182 \_.--.*/ mobile: 0421 500 720 Australia v ian.davidson@csiro.au ----------------------------------------------------------------------- From dav259@csiro.au Thu Nov 21 18:31:05 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Nov 2002 02:31:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 13787 invoked from network); 22 Nov 2002 02:31:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Nov 2002 02:31:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 02:31:03 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAM2V2P07905 for ; Fri, 22 Nov 2002 13:31:02 +1100 (EST) Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 13:31:02 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: amstereoforum Subject: Yahoo! miscues Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public Are others having troubles with Yahoo! deliveries? The last couple of days I've been getting the AMSF messages delivered way out of kilter. I sometime see replies to my and other posts before the original post appears. Yet on the website they're all in the right order. Is this happening in North America? - or has someone tripped over the cord in the Pacific?? Ian Downunder - and feeling I'm copping some digital delay. [Perhaps Yahoo! is testing IBOC] From di316@freenet.carleton.ca Thu Nov 21 19:06:11 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: paulc@ncf.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Nov 2002 03:06:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 71579 invoked from network); 22 Nov 2002 03:06:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Nov 2002 03:06:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO tomts8-srv.bellnexxia.net) (209.226.175.52) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 03:06:10 -0000 Received: from ncf.ca ([64.230.21.38]) by tomts8-srv.bellnexxia.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.19 201-253-122-122-119-20020516) with ESMTP id <20021122030609.HOTY24515.tomts8-srv.bellnexxia.net@ncf.ca> for ; Thu, 21 Nov 2002 22:06:09 -0500 Message-ID: <3DDD9F32.D772BD91@ncf.ca> Date: Thu, 21 Nov 2002 22:06:26 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.79 [en] (Windows NT 5.0; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: a common misconception References: <1037890085.341.64251.m12@yahoogroups.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-eGroups-From: Paul Cumming From: Paul Cumming X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=43835445 X-Yahoo-Profile: rahoule104 Ian Davidson (dav259@csiro.au) wrote: > It also has a 'LW' band. 144 - 279 kHz > What am I supposed to pick up on this band? So far all I've picked up is > interference. Was this band created for pop up toasters? Cause nothing > else pops up on it. I have the Radio Shack DX-398 multiband radio which has a longwave (LW) band from 153 to 519 kHz, receivable in AM, LSB, or USB. I've picked up a few beacons on it (mostly Morse Code beeping), as well as images of AM radio stations on the MW band. At 251 kHz, for example, I hear an image of CJRC 1150. Here in eastern Canada, I can pick up three beacons: 238 kHz, 343 kHz, and 378 kHz. Perhaps if I get out of the city and away from its electrical noise, I will be able to pick up more. I've heard that good reception of longwave signals requires a grounded antenna, since (I think) signals of frequencies that low mostly propagate thru the ground and water. I wish I could tune the DX-398 all the way down to 100 kHz so I could pick up the LORAN-C time/navigation signal. (LORAN-C is "pulse modulated"...I don't know if my radio could actually decode that...) Did you know that it is possible that unintended interaction between the LORAN-C signal and power lines may be responsible for a low-pitched humming sound some people hear continuously? I don't know anyone who has this problem, but it must be terrible. http://homepages.tesco.net/~John.Dawes2/cause.htm -- Paul ---------------------- Paul Cumming paulc@ncf.ca From michaelj@vcn.com Thu Nov 21 19:11:57 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Nov 2002 03:11:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 57432 invoked from network); 22 Nov 2002 03:11:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Nov 2002 03:11:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m2-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.32) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 03:11:55 -0000 Received: from michael (vcn93.usrtc-1.evan.wy.vcn.com [209.193.86.97]) by m2-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Thu, 21 Nov 2002 20:11:55 -0700 To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} Yahoo! miscues Date: Thu, 21 Nov 2002 20:11:52 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) In-Reply-To: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Importance: Normal From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hey mate, you just got too many kangrooos shaking the ground and them undergound cables down there! (he he ) Actually Ian....as far as I have seen I have noticed this too. I get my Yahoo message by email like you do. I don't use the web site. And YES...sometimes I'll see a reply to something labled "RE: " and yet I can't find the original, and then it finally pops up later. So it's Yahoo....not just you. And I'm sure Yahoo would claim that it's your or my provider's mail server....which I doubt too. Yahoo!!!! MJR n big Wyo -----Original Message----- From: Ian Davidson [mailto:dav259@csiro.au] Sent: Thursday, November 21, 2002 7:31 PM To: amstereoforum Subject: {AMSF} Yahoo! miscues Are others having troubles with Yahoo! deliveries? The last couple of days I've been getting the AMSF messages delivered way out of kilter. I sometime see replies to my and other posts before the original post appears. Yet on the website they're all in the right order. Is this happening in North America? - or has someone tripped over the cord in the Pacific?? Ian Downunder - and feeling I'm copping some digital delay. [Perhaps Yahoo! is testing IBOC] Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From stodd@sherbtel.net Thu Nov 21 19:29:14 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Nov 2002 03:29:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 61684 invoked from network); 22 Nov 2002 03:29:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Nov 2002 03:29:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 03:29:12 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-117.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.117]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gAM3SwN8012521 for ; Thu, 21 Nov 2002 21:29:10 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <000301c291d7$5ec8a880$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} a common misconception Date: Thu, 21 Nov 2002 21:25:06 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude It's a european broadcast band; used for marine and aero navigational beacons in much of the rest of the world, though that use is being phased out due to GPS. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: Ian Davidson > > It also has a 'LW' band. 144 - 279 kHz > > What am I supposed to pick up on this band? So far all I've picked up is > interference. Was this band created for pop up toasters? Cause nothing > else pops up on it. From e92fmjamz@yahoo.com Thu Nov 21 20:17:14 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: e92fmjamz@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Nov 2002 04:17:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 46237 invoked from network); 22 Nov 2002 04:17:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Nov 2002 04:17:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14006.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.175.122) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 04:17:13 -0000 Message-ID: <20021122041712.92989.qmail@web14006.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [152.8.78.47] by web14006.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 21 Nov 2002 20:17:12 PST Date: Thu, 21 Nov 2002 20:17:12 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: {AMSF} Remote Links Was: Engineer Pay, ATUs, and Transmitters To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: <1b9.9bf9c2a.2b0e7b48@aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: Ernest Jones X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=24963319 X-Yahoo-Profile: e92fmjamz Don't forget realaudio, if you ever used the realencoder G2 plus version, they have a codec at 20.7kb/s that offers near-cd quality mono, its a good codec if you can get your hands on it since its kindof old, configuring a realserver is not easy to do but the results are good once you get everything going with that codec --- KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 11/21/02 12:47:23 PM Eastern > Standard Time, > possumhunter@netzero.net writes: > > > > I would like to know more about this. Cell phone > bills are killing us on > > high school sports broadcasts when they are > playing outside of Marti range. > > > > Long live FREE RADIO! > > > > > > Hey Possum,its just like using a shoutcast.com > stream but this guy opted to > use Windows Media server software and the like. > I'm a fan of shoutcast/winamp..it doesnt take up as > much system resources and > doesnt take up nearly the hard drive space either. > All you need is an internet connection on both ends > and your off and running. > The only draw backs are...if you use a dial-up > connection like what I use for > http://wgai.dyn.ee:8000/listen.pls {--which just > happens to be down at the > moment..gotta see whats up with that} you get > disconnects.Gotta love it when > you have a service that says "unlimited" service but > you get knocked off line > every 12 hours or so.Whatever happened to truth in > advertising..or living up > to what you say your going to offer. > The other draw back is a dial-up.If its not a good > one,will buffer,hiccup and > skip. .you'll have to shop around and do some > testing. > One ISP in my area stinks when it comes to this.I've > picked the best ISP > around here for my purpose...very little buffering > and skipping.While trying > to listen to my stream on other dial-ups,instead of > the program being the > normal 1 to 3 minute delay...it was more like a 10 > minute delay with frequent > skipping...not good of you what to use it for server > purposes.There are only > two dial up ISP's here that offer that excellent > service...your area might be > better or worse than mine. > Also I'm using a free service that converts my ever > changing IP number to a > web address..if anyone is interested..I'll direct > you all to the program. > Also ..on another note..the shoutcast server can be > made to be either public > or hidden from the public.That comes in handy if you > dont want your "link" to > be listened in on during commerical breaks too..and > also keeps the bandwidth > up to help insure less skipping back at the station. > > Bob Carter > Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio group > > WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach > 104..., WQDK 99.3 > Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 > > > Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio > stations with engineering > services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. > e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net > Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC > WBXB-FM 100.1 > Edenton NC > WURB-FM 97.7 > Windsor NC > Ray > Communications Radio Network > > AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- > amstereo-subcribe@topica.com > > KC4QLP Amateur Radio > Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va > www.kc4qlp.cjb.net > > voice contact-252-335-0856 > fax 1-209-254-8978 > _______________________________________________________ > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > ===== Ernest, Gates NC, USA WRCS 970 AM Ahoskie NC, Announcer,webmaster http://wrcs.cjb.net WQDK 99.3 FM Ahoskie NC, Fill in ------contact me-------- AIM: e92fmjamz2000 ICQ: 33155469 Yahoo: e92fmjamz __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus – Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Nov 21 21:55:11 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Nov 2002 05:55:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 20356 invoked from network); 22 Nov 2002 05:55:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Nov 2002 05:55:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d05.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 05:55:10 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.b7.2a5ac603 (4254) for ; Fri, 22 Nov 2002 00:55:05 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 00:55:04 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Remote Links Was: Engineer Pay, ATUs, and Transmitters To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 11/21/02 11:18:07 PM Eastern Standard Time, e92fmjamz@yahoo.com writes: << Don't forget realaudio, if you ever used the realencoder G2 plus version, they have a codec at 20.7kb/s that offers near-cd quality mono, its a good codec if you can get your hands on it since its kindof old, configuring a realserver is not easy to do but the results are good once you get everything going with that codec >> Real Audio is and can be a REAL PAIN. I tried to set up a Real audio server once as well...takes way to much processor power to do something small.Another point about Real audio software...I think its one of those types of softwares thats been labeled as spyware.Also it seems to "want to take over your machine". I have an old version of the player on my machine because I have to use it sometimes to grab audio files off the net {ie: commericals}...if it werent for that...all I would have would be the codecs to make the web embedded player work on the WGAI web page {www.wgai560am.com} So once again..if you want simple,quick setup and low CPU burdens..shoutcast is a winner in that department. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From amfmdx@fastq.com Thu Nov 21 22:31:18 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Nov 2002 06:31:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 74106 invoked from network); 22 Nov 2002 06:31:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Nov 2002 06:31:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 06:31:17 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt (d29-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.61]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gAM6VGv16721 for ; Thu, 21 Nov 2002 23:31:16 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <029801c291f0$8ea2aec0$7ff9bed8@kredding430cdt> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} a common misconception Date: Thu, 21 Nov 2002 23:29:47 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > It also has a 'LW' band. 144 - 279 kHz > > What am I supposed to pick up on this band? So far all I've picked up is > interference. In Europe, Africa and Asia this is used for MUSIC, NEWS, etc just like any other broadcast station. In North and South America its used for aircraft beacons. They are fun to DX because you can hear Alaska, Hawaii, Nova Scotia, and Puerto Rico all in one hour. Can't do that on AM. Better yet, most of the stations are 40 watts or less. Kevin From matthew.trim@eds.com Thu Nov 21 22:40:05 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: matthew.trim@eds.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Nov 2002 06:40:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 9405 invoked from network); 22 Nov 2002 06:40:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Nov 2002 06:40:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO ns5.eds.com) (203.17.185.230) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 06:40:04 -0000 Received: from nnsy.eds.com (nnsy-3.eds.com [192.168.1.1]) by ns5.eds.com (8.11.6/8.11.1) with ESMTP id gAM6e2w18552 for ; Fri, 22 Nov 2002 17:40:02 +1100 (EST) Received: from nnsy.eds.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by nnsy.eds.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAM6e0C11471 for ; Fri, 22 Nov 2002 17:40:01 +1100 (EST) Received: from ausym000.exau01.exch.eds.com ([134.251.177.117]) by nnsy.eds.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAM6e0V11450 for ; Fri, 22 Nov 2002 17:40:00 +1100 (EST) Received: by AUSYM000 with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Fri, 22 Nov 2002 17:38:51 +1100 Message-ID: <33CDDBD8CAEFEB4191ABF6F799032AF238D69D@aubwm206> To: "'amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com'" Subject: RE: {AMSF} a common misconception Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 17:38:50 +1100 Importance: high X-Priority: 1 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-Type: text/plain From: "Trim, Matthew L" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88615102 X-Yahoo-Profile: bofh2k2000 LW was also used extensively in Australia in the early 1920's See: http://radiodx.com/spdxr/Aus_Longwavers.htm for some history! -----Original Message----- From: Kevin - Mesa, Arizona [mailto:amfmdx@fastq.com] Sent: Friday, 22 November 2002 4:30 PM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} a common misconception > It also has a 'LW' band. 144 - 279 kHz > > What am I supposed to pick up on this band? So far all I've picked up is > interference. In Europe, Africa and Asia this is used for MUSIC, NEWS, etc just like any other broadcast station. In North and South America its used for aircraft beacons. They are fun to DX because you can hear Alaska, Hawaii, Nova Scotia, and Puerto Rico all in one hour. Can't do that on AM. Better yet, most of the stations are 40 watts or less. Kevin From amfmdx@fastq.com Thu Nov 21 22:42:59 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Nov 2002 06:42:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 13481 invoked from network); 22 Nov 2002 06:42:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Nov 2002 06:42:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 06:42:59 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt (d29-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.61]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gAM6gwv16812 for ; Thu, 21 Nov 2002 23:42:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <02d401c291f2$308179a0$7ff9bed8@kredding430cdt> To: References: <007501c29171$3f4a2170$1400a8c0@FatMusic2000> Subject: Re: {AMSF} a common misconception Date: Thu, 21 Nov 2002 23:41:28 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > Submarines use that band I have installed and tested many submarine radio apparatuses and antennas and I can tell you that you are on the right track but submarines use frequencies lower than this. Submarines use frequencies between 76 Hz and 14 kHz under the water. They use satellites mostly when they are on the surface or with an antenna mast raised out of the water. They are not in AM stereo. :) Kevin Mesa, Arizona From ben@lennard.net.nz Thu Nov 21 22:50:28 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ben@lennard.net.nz X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Nov 2002 06:50:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 82311 invoked from network); 22 Nov 2002 06:50:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Nov 2002 06:50:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 06:50:28 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.131] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 22 Nov 2002 06:50:28 -0000 Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 06:50:27 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Yahoo! miscues Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 746 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Ben" X-Originating-IP: 203.98.48.150 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=118503946 X-Yahoo-Profile: benlennard It just Yahoo I'd say. Same thing is happening on the Microcontroller list I'm on, which is hosted by Yahoo... Ben, in Windy Wellington, New Zealand. --- In amstereoforum@y..., Ian Davidson wrote: > > Are others having troubles with Yahoo! deliveries? > > The last couple of days I've been getting the AMSF messages delivered way > out of kilter. I sometime see replies to my and other posts before the > original post appears. > > Yet on the website they're all in the right order. Is this happening in > North America? - or has someone tripped over the cord in the Pacific?? > > Ian > Downunder - and feeling I'm copping some digital delay. > > [Perhaps Yahoo! is testing IBOC] From don@idpt.com Thu Nov 21 23:33:26 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: don@idpt.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Nov 2002 07:33:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 20601 invoked from network); 22 Nov 2002 07:33:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Nov 2002 07:33:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout3-eri1.midsouth.rr.com) (24.165.200.8) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 07:33:26 -0000 Received: from primary (cpe-024-024-118-043.midsouth.rr.com [24.24.118.43]) by mailout3-eri1.midsouth.rr.com (8.11.4/8.11.4) with ESMTP id gAM7XPa19653 for ; Fri, 22 Nov 2002 01:33:25 -0600 (CST) To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} Remote Links Was: Engineer Pay, ATUs, and Transmitters Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 01:33:20 -0600 Message-ID: <001501c291f9$71aa5df0$0202a8c0@primary> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2616 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 In-Reply-To: From: "Don Johnson" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=32705644 X-Yahoo-Profile: htmldon Possum, I hate to say it, but Windows Media may be your best bet. Real Audio's codecs are the best IMHO, but setting up the server isn't easy. Plus, their server license is only valid for a year, so you have to hope that they release a new version with a new 1 yr. license in order to continue legally using it for free. Shoutcast is good and I used it for my online radio station. However, I had to use a crummy-sounding 22k stream because a lot of dial-up users couldn't reliably hear it otherwise. Windows Media is both easy and free -- and since I'd presume your remote computer would be on a dial-up connection -- you'll probably get more bang for your bandwidth. The encoder also acts as the server, so it's very easy to get going. The problem with WMA is the horrid codecs. The sound is very tinny especially at lower codecs. If you have at least a 56k remote connection, I'd recommend creating a new profile with a 32kbps mono audio stream (the presets have a twangy 32kbps stereo and twangy 20kbps mono options). You can download the encoder at http://www.microsoft.com/windows/windowsmedia/download/ _________________ Don Johnson don@donjohnson.org -----Original Message----- From: Possum Hunter [mailto:possumhunter@netzero.net] Sent: Thursday, November 21, 2002 11:46 AM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Remote Links Was: Engineer Pay, ATUs, and Transmitters KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: >a friend of mine that runs a 1kw FM station in Kenbridge/Blackstone Va {WPEX 90.9 FM www.wpexonline.com} does all of his remotes via an internet stream.He uses a simple dial-up and Winblows Media to stream the audio from the remote site back to the station.He says it sounds great! {heard it myself!} and cost him very little to do.Its a lot cheaper than using a cell phone and less cumbersome than a Marti. I would like to know more about this. Cell phone bills are killing us on high school sports broadcasts when they are playing outside of Marti range. Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From dav259@csiro.au Fri Nov 22 00:28:49 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Nov 2002 08:28:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 52463 invoked from network); 22 Nov 2002 08:28:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Nov 2002 08:28:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 08:28:48 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAM8SlP06181 for ; Fri, 22 Nov 2002 19:28:47 +1100 (EST) Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 19:28:47 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} Yahoo! miscues In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public On Thu, 21 Nov 2002, Michael J. Richard wrote: > Hey mate, you just got too many kangrooos shaking the ground and them > undergound cables down there! > > (he he ) > Actually Ian....as far as I have seen I have noticed this too. Thanks Michael Nice to know our little outpost is not being persecuted. I could say what are you replying to? - but yes - my post does appear six AMSF messages behind your reply. btw - contrary to common belief we don't have kangaroos jumping down Collins Street. Most Aussies have only seen "skippies" in sactuaries and zoos - but they are cute and friendly! btw2 - I've just seen Rush Limbharg (???) or should that be Loudarse inteviewed on Fox News Channel. And as the famous Aussie footy legend Captain Blood Jack Dyer once said "I'm not saying anything in case I say something". Even Mum used to say if you haven't got anything good to say don't say anything. btw3 - If I was gonna say anything ... let's just say I can understand why most on this list don't like talk radio. From don@idpt.com Fri Nov 22 00:42:12 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: don@idpt.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Nov 2002 08:42:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 59295 invoked from network); 22 Nov 2002 08:42:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Nov 2002 08:42:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout3-eri1.midsouth.rr.com) (24.165.200.8) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 08:42:11 -0000 Received: from primary (cpe-024-024-118-043.midsouth.rr.com [24.24.118.43]) by mailout3-eri1.midsouth.rr.com (8.11.4/8.11.4) with ESMTP id gAM8gBa24818 for ; Fri, 22 Nov 2002 02:42:11 -0600 (CST) To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} Yahoo! miscues Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 02:42:06 -0600 Message-ID: <001601c29203$0ccfb010$0202a8c0@primary> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2616 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 In-Reply-To: From: "Don Johnson" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=32705644 X-Yahoo-Profile: htmldon "... let's just say I can understand why most on this list don't like talk radio." I like talk radio. I don't think that the AM band would be as viable as it is now w/o the format. And on a personal note, I might not have gotten involved in politics and issues were it not for the down-to-earth, understandable discussion of issues that is provided by most talk radio shows, Rush Limbaugh included. I just wish he wasn't associated with the Clear Channel monopoly. __________________ Don Johnson don@donjohnson.org -----Original Message----- From: Ian Davidson [mailto:dav259@csiro.au] Sent: Friday, November 22, 2002 2:29 AM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: {AMSF} Yahoo! miscues On Thu, 21 Nov 2002, Michael J. Richard wrote: > Hey mate, you just got too many kangrooos shaking the ground and them > undergound cables down there! > > (he he ) > Actually Ian....as far as I have seen I have noticed this too. Thanks Michael Nice to know our little outpost is not being persecuted. I could say what are you replying to? - but yes - my post does appear six AMSF messages behind your reply. btw - contrary to common belief we don't have kangaroos jumping down Collins Street. Most Aussies have only seen "skippies" in sactuaries and zoos - but they are cute and friendly! btw2 - I've just seen Rush Limbharg (???) or should that be Loudarse inteviewed on Fox News Channel. And as the famous Aussie footy legend Captain Blood Jack Dyer once said "I'm not saying anything in case I say something". Even Mum used to say if you haven't got anything good to say don't say anything. btw3 - If I was gonna say anything ... let's just say I can understand why most on this list don't like talk radio. Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Nov 22 00:55:28 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Nov 2002 08:55:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 70241 invoked from network); 22 Nov 2002 08:55:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Nov 2002 08:55:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 08:55:28 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.179] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 22 Nov 2002 08:55:27 -0000 Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 08:55:26 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Man! I Feel Like an IBOC Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 691 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.86.130 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics For the second evening in a row, I caught Lucent's 50-watt test station WI2XAM on 1700 kHz (Warren, NJ) transmitting an IBOC signal after sunset -- and just like the day before, the programming consisted entirely of "Man! I Feel Like a Woman" by Shania Twain played over and over and over again, with no IDs or other music. So, if you manage to DX that on 1700, it's not some kid with a Ramsey transmitter kit and a CD player stuck in repeat mode -- it's Lucent's way of "testing" IBOC. I bet they have "Didn't We Almost Have It All" by Whitney Houston also cued up in case nighttime IBOC turns out to be a failure.... either that, or "Can't Lose What You Never Had" by Westlife. From dav259@csiro.au Fri Nov 22 01:38:15 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Nov 2002 09:38:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 48400 invoked from network); 22 Nov 2002 09:38:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Nov 2002 09:38:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 09:38:14 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAM9cDP09689 for ; Fri, 22 Nov 2002 20:38:13 +1100 (EST) Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 20:38:13 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} Yahoo! miscues In-Reply-To: <001601c29203$0ccfb010$0202a8c0@primary> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public On Fri, 22 Nov 2002, Don Johnson wrote: > I like talk radio. I don't think that the AM band would be as viable as > it is now w/o the format. > > And on a personal note, I might not have gotten involved in politics and > issues were it not for the down-to-earth, understandable discussion of > issues that is provided by most talk radio shows, Rush Limbaugh > included. I just wish he wasn't associated with the Clear Channel > monopoly. I agree Don. I love talk radio. We have three talk stations in Melbourne - two commercial and one ABC (govt owned but statutorily independent). It's a good balance. I'm old enough to remember when telephone talkback was intoduced here (late 60s ???) and it was the saviour to radio at the time which was suffering after 15 years of television. (We are usually a bit behind.) But it seems to me we are very fortunate that talk radio is pretty much local - not syndicated as it seems to be in the US. For the most part it covers local issues - then national - then global. Call me naive - but I really can't understand why you in the US have let things get into such a mess. Is absolutely everything reduced to the common dollar? Why are so many people against NPR? Are some people afraid of hearing alternate views on things? Why shouldn't a government provide a "service" to people when private enterprise won't? I don't know where you're from Don - but I'm sure that people in the UK, Canada, Oz, and New Zealand would be horrified if any govt shut down the BBC, CBC, ABC, or NZBC. (Maybe Ben wouldn't mind - I doubt whether 2ZB is his favourite station.) Long live talkback radio Long live live radio Long live local radio Death to the NAB (your fault Possum) LONG LIVE AM STEREO RADIO! Ian Melbourne From jsgil@hal-pc.org Fri Nov 22 01:43:36 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Nov 2002 09:43:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 73302 invoked from network); 22 Nov 2002 09:43:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Nov 2002 09:43:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.84) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 09:43:36 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.188] by n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 22 Nov 2002 09:43:35 -0000 Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 09:43:34 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF}Both ams & Cris Cuff are still alive Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <004101c2917a$a2333de0$0701010a@keva> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1230 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.234 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Michael J. Richard" wrote: > > I'm a bit bummed about my Pioneer receiver, though. I can't seem to ever try to do a project and have it go perfectly without any problems. I'm getting to the point where I don't trust myself that I'm not going to screw something up :( The AM section is fine on that unit, but apparantly the pin that I messed up is the FM signal detector so now the FM is dead. > I'd really like some help getting a replacement card for it if I can. Any ideas? > > MJR n WYO > Don't dispair, learning electronics is a lot like learning UNIX. In the beginning it can be a tough up hill battle but in the end it can pay off with the rewards of you work. Everybody makes mistakes but you just have to move beyond them. If you don't make any mistakes sometimes you don't always learn everything. What kind of Pioneer receiver is it, a DTR or mechanically tuned. Although DTR is nice my Pioneer DTR receiver that I converted suffers from display interference when I DX. They don't make receivers like they used to. I am growing partial to converting non-DTR/mechanical tuned radios if their LO has little phase noise as they are much quieter for DXing. JSG From don@idpt.com Fri Nov 22 03:30:40 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: don@idpt.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Nov 2002 11:30:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 89117 invoked from network); 22 Nov 2002 11:30:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Nov 2002 11:30:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout2-eri1.midsouth.rr.com) (24.165.200.7) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 11:30:39 -0000 Received: from primary (cpe-024-024-118-043.midsouth.rr.com [24.24.118.43]) by mailout2-eri1.midsouth.rr.com (8.11.4/8.11.4) with ESMTP id gAMBUcf08226 for ; Fri, 22 Nov 2002 05:30:38 -0600 (CST) To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} Yahoo! miscues Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 05:30:33 -0600 Message-ID: <000201c2921a$95499e30$0202a8c0@primary> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2616 In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Don Johnson" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=32705644 X-Yahoo-Profile: htmldon "But it seems to me we are very fortunate that talk radio is pretty much local - not syndicated as it seems to be in the US." Well there are lots of syndicated shows, but most markets have at least one or two major local talk hosts. I'm in Memphis, TN and on our big talk station (WREC) we have one major daytime host plus the morning crew and a talk host on weekends. Local issues are always covered and discussed -- sometimes to death. "Why are so many people against NPR?" So many people are against NPR because NPR represents so few people. You'd think "public radio" would stand for some democratically-oriented radio that represents the various needs and desires of the listening public. NPR doesn't do that. It is a symbol of the new American elitist aristocrat -- the limousine liberal. When it isn't boring you to tears, it's frustrating you to madness. It's stations play classical music (not the normal fare of the average working man/woman) and little else, not because people listen to it, but because NPR thinks it's "needed." I'm certainly not against non-commercial broadcasting; in fact I strongly support it. I probably watch PBS more so than any other network and if WKNO would bring back my BritComs I'd happily send them a financial contribution :) "Are some people afraid of hearing alternate views on things?" Yes. I'm afraid of hearing what the Sudan or China thinks about human rights. I'm afraid of hearing what the liberal parents of John Walker Lindh think about parenting. I'm afraid of hearing what Alec Baldwin, who said that Republican congressmen should be stoned, thinks about peace. I'm afraid of hearing what Michael Jackson thinks about child safety. I'm afraid of hearing what Sadam Hussein thinks about democracy or what the Taliban thinks about womens' rights or what David Duke thinks about black people. I AM afraid of giving credence to these viewpoints, and you should be too. People are welcome to believe whatever the wish, but I should be under no obligation to pay for it. "Why shouldn't a government provide a "service" to people when private enterprise won't?" Because if private enterprise -- which would have a profit motive based on ad revenue based on the number of listeners -- isn't providing that service; it probably means that the service would not engage enough listeners to justify the expense of the operation or the use of the spectrum. I believe that the free market is a much better way of delivering a service to people because it is the only way where individuals can have some impact on the quality or type of service they are receiving. This is not to say that the free market is perfect. Obviously, I'm concerned that the FCC didn't give enough guidance and set a standard when it came to AM Stereo. Of course, if they had set a standard, there would probably be lists devoted to disgruntled supporters of the Kahn or Magnavox systems that think that Motorola's corporate hacks influenced the FCC to choose C-Quam. In summation, If limosine liberals want programs about the lifestyles, beliefs, and culture of affluent elitist members of the Democrat party: they are welcome to pay for it themselves. Why should I -- or any taxpayer -- have to subsidize that? HOWEVER, public funding no longer makes up a significant part of either NPR or PBS. In a sense, private enterprise IS providing for these services because the people that want them are actually paying for them. As government funding was wisely removed, it was replaced by individual and charitable funding. That's the way it should be. "but I'm sure that people in the UK, Canada, Oz, and New Zealand would be horrified if any govt shut down the BBC, CBC, ABC, or NZBC." There seems to be a different attitude that these networks have. If PBS had "Football Night in the US" (like CBC's "Hockey Night in Canada"), I'd suspect their viewership would increase dramatically. That having been said, I HATE sports and popular culture in general and am glad that PBS's programming is diverse and educational. That's why when I get a few bucks in my pocket, I'll gladly and VOLUNTARILY donate to a cause I believe in. That's the way it should be. _____________________ Don Johnson don@donjohnson.org -----Original Message----- From: Ian Davidson [mailto:dav259@csiro.au] Sent: Friday, November 22, 2002 3:38 AM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: {AMSF} Yahoo! miscues On Fri, 22 Nov 2002, Don Johnson wrote: > I like talk radio. I don't think that the AM band would be as viable as > it is now w/o the format. > > And on a personal note, I might not have gotten involved in politics and > issues were it not for the down-to-earth, understandable discussion of > issues that is provided by most talk radio shows, Rush Limbaugh > included. I just wish he wasn't associated with the Clear Channel > monopoly. I agree Don. I love talk radio. We have three talk stations in Melbourne - two commercial and one ABC (govt owned but statutorily independent). It's a good balance. I'm old enough to remember when telephone talkback was intoduced here (late 60s ???) and it was the saviour to radio at the time which was suffering after 15 years of television. (We are usually a bit behind.) But it seems to me we are very fortunate that talk radio is pretty much local - not syndicated as it seems to be in the US. For the most part it covers local issues - then national - then global. Call me naive - but I really can't understand why you in the US have let things get into such a mess. Is absolutely everything reduced to the common dollar? Why are so many people against NPR? Are some people afraid of hearing alternate views on things? Why shouldn't a government provide a "service" to people when private enterprise won't? I don't know where you're from Don - but I'm sure that people in the UK, Canada, Oz, and New Zealand would be horrified if any govt shut down the BBC, CBC, ABC, or NZBC. (Maybe Ben wouldn't mind - I doubt whether 2ZB is his favourite station.) Long live talkback radio Long live live radio Long live local radio Death to the NAB (your fault Possum) LONG LIVE AM STEREO RADIO! Ian Melbourne Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From sub07@ridien.com Fri Nov 22 04:40:49 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: sub07@ridien.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Nov 2002 12:40:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 44530 invoked from network); 22 Nov 2002 12:40:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Nov 2002 12:40:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.75) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 12:40:48 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.142] by n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 22 Nov 2002 12:40:48 -0000 Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 12:40:47 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Stations make plans in the wake of IBOC action Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 793 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Robert Sillett" X-Originating-IP: 209.195.176.173 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=93468082 X-Yahoo-Profile: sillett Has KABL turned off AM Stereo? That would be a travesty. I used to live in San Francisco and listened to KABL all the time. It was amazing in stereo. --- Bob Sillett --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Marv Southcott" wrote: > I hadn't seen any comment on this story. It does tell of the speed of > interest and deployment is not causing tremors. > > About KABL, my colleague listening just outside San Fran had this to > say. they are apparently now into IBOC trials. He says thye're using > their EBS as a cue to make the switchover. I'm intrigued by his > description of the sound; "It's like a broken down 1947 telephone for > about 15 minutes." then it goes back to normal.. I'm supposed to > guess which is traditional KABL and which is IBOC ... sure. > > M. From tampagar@webtv.net Fri Nov 22 06:12:19 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: tampagar@webtv.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Nov 2002 14:12:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 19096 invoked from network); 22 Nov 2002 14:12:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Nov 2002 14:12:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 14:12:18 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.141] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 22 Nov 2002 14:12:17 -0000 Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 14:12:17 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Yahoo! miscues Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1063 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "gar_fla_62" X-Originating-IP: 209.240.198.61 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=102439005 X-Yahoo-Profile: gar_fla_62 Ian, you are so very right about things being a "mess" in the US. When talk radio first took over AM in the 80s, there was so much more to choose from in the way of personality and political views of talk show hosts. Today, not only are local talk hosts being replaced with more and more syndicated national hosts, the content has become so sanitized and dumbed down. It's so pathetic that I've all but given up on talk radio. And it's not a case of people "not wanting to hear alternative views". The frightening reality is that those who CONTROL our mass media don't want the real truth to become common knowledge. For example, the American "sheeple" are not being provided with the whole picture of this so called "war on terrorism". Sadly, the media is conditioning the masses with the false belief that they aren't giving up freedom with increased security. With all that's going on right now, yesterday's biggest headline was Michael Jackson hanging his kid over a balcony? WHAT? If you want to find truth anymore, you'll have to do so on the internet. From philipr@irac.pe.ca Fri Nov 22 06:35:40 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Nov 2002 14:35:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 12112 invoked from network); 22 Nov 2002 14:35:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Nov 2002 14:35:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 14:35:39 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.165] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 22 Nov 2002 14:35:39 -0000 Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 14:35:38 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Man! I Feel Like an IBOC Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1072 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking Wow! 100% Canadian content - and its not a Canadian staion! I beter email the CRTC quick! Personally, my all time favourite song would be "AM Stereo killed the IBOC Star". Any singers/musicians in the forum who could help put this together? It would be a hoot to download. Phil R. --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin T." wrote: > For the second evening in a row, I caught Lucent's 50-watt test > station WI2XAM on 1700 kHz (Warren, NJ) transmitting an IBOC signal > after sunset -- and just like the day before, the programming > consisted entirely of "Man! I Feel Like a Woman" by Shania Twain > played over and over and over again, with no IDs or other music. > > So, if you manage to DX that on 1700, it's not some kid with a Ramsey > transmitter kit and a CD player stuck in repeat mode -- it's Lucent's > way of "testing" IBOC. > > I bet they have "Didn't We Almost Have It All" by Whitney Houston > also cued up in case nighttime IBOC turns out to be a failure.... > either that, or "Can't Lose What You Never Had" by Westlife. From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Nov 22 06:57:22 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Nov 2002 14:57:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 14064 invoked from network); 22 Nov 2002 14:57:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Nov 2002 14:57:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 14:57:21 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-80.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.80]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gAMEvEN2023829 for ; Fri, 22 Nov 2002 08:57:17 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <00b401c29237$804ece20$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: KAHN Communications RF Signal Processor (EBAY) Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 08:57:34 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Nope- ebay is about your only chance; that and thrift stores, garage sales and flea markets. Lack of receivers was second only to Kahn's lawsuit wars that hampered acceptance of AMS. List member Chuck Simpson can import them from Japan, but not all of them can be fully converted to US standards. Scott Todd ----- Original Message ----- From: gar_fla_62 > Does anyone know how I can find an AM stereo radio (walkman type) anywhere other than over the internet? From michaelj@vcn.com Fri Nov 22 06:59:19 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Nov 2002 14:59:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 20449 invoked from network); 22 Nov 2002 14:59:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Nov 2002 14:59:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m1-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 14:59:19 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m1-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Fri, 22 Nov 2002 07:59:18 -0700 Message-ID: <001301c29237$bcb91d20$0701010a@keva> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF}Both ams & Cris Cuff are still alive Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 07:59:19 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit This one's a DTR. The decoder seemed to work okay, although it was not nearly perfect. With the chip that it uses, the AM and the FM come out of the same chip......hence my post a while back about how to "insert the audio" from the decoder. Yeah, it kinda worked...but it's not true stereo when you're inserting the signal on top of the mono signal. There's some separation, but not like it should be. Meanwhile I messed up the chip when trying to figure a way to make the STEREO indicator light. Been messing with electronics for about 15 or 20 years now. I've learned a LOT from all my mistakes. I keep swearing up and down that I'm never EVER going to try to solder something to one of the pins of one of those chips with the itty bitty small (slight bigger than a hair) pins.....because every time I do, I end up soldering 2 or 3 together. Always happens now matter how sharp I use a file to sharpen my soldering iron tip. In any case, I was going to leave that decoder in there and keep trying to play with it, but not being able to get in contact with anyone to get a decoder, I had to pull it out when my new stereo for the car came in and had to put it in there instead. I should have just dropped $100 or so and grabbed like 5 or 6 decoders from Chris at the time then that way I'd have them. I've had a couple of people contact me about putting decoders in their stereos since we went stereo here at KEVA. But I don't have any decoders to put in :( And beginning to wonder if I should trust myself with someone else's radio. If I mess mine up, that's one thing. But if I mess up someone else's.....well...then I'm out BIG BUCKS when I have to replace the whole thing. MJR n WYO ----- Original Message ----- From: jsgilst To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, November 22, 2002 2:43 AM Subject: Re: {AMSF}Both ams & Cris Cuff are still alive Don't dispair, learning electronics is a lot like learning UNIX. In the beginning it can be a tough up hill battle but in the end it can pay off with the rewards of you work. Everybody makes mistakes but you just have to move beyond them. If you don't make any mistakes sometimes you don't always learn everything. What kind of Pioneer receiver is it, a DTR or mechanically tuned. Although DTR is nice my Pioneer DTR receiver that I converted suffers from display interference when I DX. They don't make receivers like they used to. I am growing partial to converting non-DTR/mechanical tuned radios if their LO has little phase noise as they are much quieter for DXing. JSG [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Nov 22 07:03:55 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Nov 2002 15:03:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 48691 invoked from network); 22 Nov 2002 15:03:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Nov 2002 15:03:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 15:03:55 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-80.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.80]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gAMF3qN2025935 for ; Fri, 22 Nov 2002 09:03:53 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <00c301c29238$6c5922c0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <012501c28e5b$4abddc40$6500a8c0@MICRON1> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Radio Disney Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 09:04:12 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude I wish I had known when the changeover was going to take place. Was the station dark at all between when the old ownership and when RD took over? I'm not surprised that it happened as the previous folks didn't have a clue as to what made for good radio, though I did like the praise and worship music enough it was my main reason to add AMS decoding to my stereo. Scott Todd ----- Original Message ----- From: PaulParkinson > > WKSH 1640 Sussex Wi is now Radio Disney and they are AM Stereo . From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Nov 22 07:05:10 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Nov 2002 15:05:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 63128 invoked from network); 22 Nov 2002 15:05:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Nov 2002 15:05:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 15:05:09 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-80.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.80]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gAMF56N2026299 for ; Fri, 22 Nov 2002 09:05:07 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <00cb01c29238$98d7d260$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Radio Shack,am stereo tuners Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 09:05:27 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Maybe you should have a separate section for the Japanese market radios? ST ----- Original Message ----- From: Kevin T. > Note that I am excluding Japanese > home-market radios since there are so many and these were never > officially sold in North America (or Australia, the UK, etc.). From tampagar@webtv.net Fri Nov 22 07:08:53 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: tampagar@webtv.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Nov 2002 15:08:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 91160 invoked from network); 22 Nov 2002 15:08:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Nov 2002 15:08:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.87) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 15:08:52 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.160] by n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 22 Nov 2002 15:08:50 -0000 Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 15:08:50 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: trying to find an AM stereo receiver Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <00b401c29237$804ece20$827dfea9@home1> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 646 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "gar_fla_62" X-Originating-IP: 209.240.198.61 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=102439005 X-Yahoo-Profile: gar_fla_62 Nope- ebay is about your only chance; that and thrift stores, garage sales > and flea markets. Lack of receivers was second only to Kahn's lawsuit wars > that hampered acceptance of AMS. List member Chuck Simpson can import them > from Japan, but not all of them can be fully converted to US standards......Thanks. My search for an AM stereo has been frustrating. Say the words "AM Stereo" to most anyone and it's as if you're speaking a foreign language. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: gar_fla_62 > > > > Does anyone know how I can find an AM stereo radio (walkman type) anywhere > other than over the internet? From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Nov 22 07:13:31 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Nov 2002 15:13:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 85641 invoked from network); 22 Nov 2002 15:13:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Nov 2002 15:13:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 15:13:30 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-80.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.80]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gAMFDRN2028582 for ; Fri, 22 Nov 2002 09:13:28 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <00e101c29239$c3503540$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Another anti-IBOC letter Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 09:13:47 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Been there, done that. I co-wrote a petition with Larry Langford, owner of WGTO radio in SW Mich., to the FCC for just that, though I'm not sure the petition is still on line anywhere. If anyone knows where it is, please give the url so anyone who's fairly new to the AMS list can read it. Then they need to write a supportive response to the FCC, using the EXACT SAME FORMAT as you see on the petition, referencing the receiver standards petition co-authored by Scott Todd and Larry Langford, since it doesn't have an official Rule Making number assigned to it. Then send a signed original and 14 photocopies (yep!) If enough momentum is developed, they may yet act on it. Scott Todd ----- Original Message ----- From: wgliradio > The best way to improve radio: > > Mandate AMAX technology in every AM radio. Every radio that has FM > stereo must have AM stereo. The AM would operate in wideband in the > stereo mode, and with a gentle rolloff in mono. From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Nov 22 07:16:00 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Nov 2002 15:16:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 89313 invoked from network); 22 Nov 2002 15:15:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Nov 2002 15:15:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 15:15:58 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-80.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.80]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gAMFFtN2029225 for ; Fri, 22 Nov 2002 09:15:56 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <00e901c2923a$1b6111a0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <3DD98460.4DA20D2E@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} X-Band Was: the death of KFRC Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 09:16:15 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude I'd recommend Terry Hammond of www.monsterfm.com, or Mike Patton of Mike Patton and Assoc. There's also Garry Lysiac of Owl Engineering, though he's more expensive. He does have the advantage that he used to work for the FCC. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: Possum Hunter > Can anybody on the list that can recommend a good AM consulting Engineer? > Now that a couple of local AMs have gone silent, changed frequencies, or > power levels, The station I am at wants to increase power and get a CQUAM > generator. It looks to me like there is enough room for 5KW. We now have the > whole station stereo all the way up to the Optimod. From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Nov 22 07:19:50 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Nov 2002 15:19:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 98731 invoked from network); 22 Nov 2002 15:19:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Nov 2002 15:19:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 15:19:50 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-80.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.80]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gAMFJkN2000507 for ; Fri, 22 Nov 2002 09:19:48 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <00f101c2923a$a5910ba0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <3DD98460.4DA20D2E@skyweb.net> <3DD99BA6.50EDA5A8@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} X-Band Was: the death of KFRC Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 09:20:07 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Both Kintronics and Phasetek are good choices. Got a Phasetek phasor at WWTC, and it's well built. Make sure you order yours with both input resistance and reactance controls! One caveat about Phasetek- they may try to use some undersized relays for powering the tower day/night contactors. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: Possum Hunter > I am thinking about a Kintronics ATU From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Nov 22 07:32:28 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Nov 2002 15:32:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 88122 invoked from network); 22 Nov 2002 15:32:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Nov 2002 15:32:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 15:32:27 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-80.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.80]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gAMFWON2004127 for ; Fri, 22 Nov 2002 09:32:25 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <010401c2923c$6916f340$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <3DD98460.4DA20D2E@skyweb.net> <3DD99BA6.50EDA5A8@skyweb.net> <3DD9BDA9.A4B9F7E9@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Engineer Pay, ATUs, and Transmitters Was: X-Band Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 09:32:44 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude The Gates 1 is essentially the same thing as the SX-1; just a few less bells and whistles. It also uses a newer plastic FET that's much cheaper than the old metal TO-3 case ones. I've heard good things about all three makes. BE would be your best bet if you want AMS at the lowest cost. Having worked with Harris and Nautel transmitters, they're both reliable. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: Possum Hunter > Do you have an opinion on BE's line of transmitters? We are looking at the > BE AM1A PowerMizer http://www.bdcast.com/products/am_trans/am-1a.html as a > main transmitter and putting the Harris SX1 on standby duty. > > We are also looking at the Nautel ND1 > and the Harris Gates1 From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Nov 22 07:34:37 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Nov 2002 15:34:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 32291 invoked from network); 22 Nov 2002 15:34:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Nov 2002 15:34:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 15:34:36 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-80.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.80]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gAMFYXN2004801 for ; Fri, 22 Nov 2002 09:34:34 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <010d01c2923c$b5e56d00$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} More from the mad scientist... Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 09:34:53 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Nope- that would be 30kHz ST ----- Original Message ----- From: Ben > As the first harmonic of the 15kHz sine wave is at 45kHz, we will > not hear it. All we hear is the 15kHz fundamental (ie - a 15kHz > square wave). > > From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Nov 22 07:36:32 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Nov 2002 15:36:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 61169 invoked from network); 22 Nov 2002 15:36:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Nov 2002 15:36:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 15:36:31 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-80.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.80]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gAMFaSN2005324 for ; Fri, 22 Nov 2002 09:36:29 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <011901c2923c$faa4e9c0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <3DDC2D0B.832047F3@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF}Both ams & Cris Cuff are still alive Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 09:36:49 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Actually with a little amplification using the signal tapped from the INPUT to the last NE602 chip, it could. Feed L+R to the modulators conventionally. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: Neal Newman > hehehe I bought one of them little Lites. just to have some fun on my > property > gee would that excite my RCA BTA-500R? LOL just kidding..... From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Nov 22 07:40:18 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Nov 2002 15:40:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 46844 invoked from network); 22 Nov 2002 15:40:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Nov 2002 15:40:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 15:40:17 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-80.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.80]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gAMFeEN2006533 for ; Fri, 22 Nov 2002 09:40:15 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <011f01c2923d$81120f60$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Engineer Pay, ATUs, and Transmitters Was: X-Band Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 09:40:34 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude It does produce some distortion, mostly in the right channel, though it's rarely objectionable. Ditch the digital Optipumps and get yourself either a CRL Amigo AM processor or one of the new Omnia AM processors. They're already stereo, whereas the Optipumps are a mono pair and can't be ganged to work together. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: Possum Hunter > Now, I have always been warned not to run the positives over 100% when > broadcasting in Stereo. Doesn't it distort the sound? > > > > We already have a pair of digital Optimod AMs. I was thinking about a > Modulation Sciences StereoMax to drive them. From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Nov 22 07:42:52 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Nov 2002 15:42:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 48783 invoked from network); 22 Nov 2002 15:42:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Nov 2002 15:42:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 15:42:52 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-80.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.80]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gAMFgnN2007309 for ; Fri, 22 Nov 2002 09:42:50 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <012701c2923d$dd7cd000$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <005b01c290ec$eec71020$0101a8c0@pavilion> Subject: Re: {AMSF} ams is still alive Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 09:43:09 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude I've got a friend who knows of an outfit that makes fixed-tuned radios. I'm going to try and get a sample and see how it does with anAMS decoder added. Might be worth contracting to have a bunch made. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: Possum Hunter > As soon as I get WFIS in Stereo, and get the web page up, You can bet there > will be links to every AM Stereo page I can find that is any good! We need a > bunch of "walkman" AM Stereo radios that are set to only hear 1600Khz to > give away at remotes....... From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Nov 22 07:44:08 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Nov 2002 15:44:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 77442 invoked from network); 22 Nov 2002 15:44:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Nov 2002 15:44:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 15:44:08 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-80.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.80]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gAMFi4N2007711 for ; Fri, 22 Nov 2002 09:44:06 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <012d01c2923e$0ab29aa0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: ams is still alive Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 09:44:25 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Well worth hearing if you haven't gotten a tape of it yet. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: Ian Davidson > Our AM stereo Magic 693 boasts that it's playlist is over 2,500 tracks and > it's a great package. > I've sent several on this list a tape of Magic 693 - if you'd like one > give me your address off-list. From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Nov 22 07:50:13 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Nov 2002 15:50:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 74763 invoked from network); 22 Nov 2002 15:50:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Nov 2002 15:50:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 15:50:12 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-80.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.80]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gAMFo8N2009556 for ; Fri, 22 Nov 2002 09:50:10 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <013e01c2923e$e3b039c0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <3DDCCA12.CFB22CE7@skyweb.net> <004101c2917a$a2333de0$0701010a@keva> Subject: Re: {AMSF}Both ams & Cris Cuff are still alive Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 09:50:29 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Hey, even I've screwed stuff up before, so don't feel too bad. I'd suggest trying to find a replacement chip for the card. I can do the physical replacement if you'd like. BTW- for anyone needing a decent source for repair manuals, try www.servicemanuals.net for all the major brands of classic stuff. Scott Todd ----- Original Message ----- From: Michael J. Richard > I'm a bit bummed about my Pioneer receiver, though. I can't seem to ever try to do a project and have it go perfectly without any problems. I'm getting to the point where I don't trust myself that I'm not going to screw something up :( The AM section is fine on that unit, but apparantly the pin that I messed up is the FM signal detector so now the FM is dead. > I'd really like some help getting a replacement card for it if I can. Any ideas? From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Nov 22 07:51:20 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Nov 2002 15:51:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 77672 invoked from network); 22 Nov 2002 15:51:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Nov 2002 15:51:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 15:51:18 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-80.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.80]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gAMFpFN2009866 for ; Fri, 22 Nov 2002 09:51:16 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <014601c2923f$0b34cd80$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <1bf.1528ae72.2b0ec36f@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} a common misconception Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 09:51:35 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude That should be Hindi- the language of India. Hindu is the religion. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: > Ok..I plead ignorance here....is Hindu something like spanish or something > totally different? From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Nov 22 08:04:41 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Nov 2002 16:04:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 40913 invoked from network); 22 Nov 2002 16:04:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Nov 2002 16:04:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 16:04:39 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-80.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.80]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gAMG4aN2014315 for ; Fri, 22 Nov 2002 10:04:37 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <016301c29240$e8afe900$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <001301c29237$bcb91d20$0701010a@keva> Subject: Re: {AMSF}Both ams & Cris Cuff are still alive Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 10:04:57 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude If the stereo indicator is just an LED, you can parallel the LED driver output from the decoder right across the indicator. It's all open-collector architecture. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: Michael J. Richard Meanwhile I messed up the chip when trying to figure a way to make the STEREO indicator light. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Nov 22 08:04:45 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Nov 2002 16:04:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 6980 invoked from network); 22 Nov 2002 16:04:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Nov 2002 16:04:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.66) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 16:04:44 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.252] by n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 22 Nov 2002 16:04:44 -0000 Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 16:04:42 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: AM Stereo modulation & audio processing Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <011f01c2923d$81120f60$827dfea9@home1> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2295 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > It does produce some distortion, mostly in the right channel, > though it's rarely objectionable. The newer C-Quam decoder chips -- the MC13022, MC13028, and even the cheapie MC13024 -- are much, much better at dealing with high modulation levels. I've listened to stations like 1680 WTTM which transmit AM Stereo at as close to +125% modulation as possible and although they often sound a little distorted on older radios that use the MC13020 or Sony decoders, the audio from the newer Motorola decoders is nearly perfect -- it even seems to "clean up" the distorted audio that some mono AM stations are transmitting (especially those which use Kahn Power-Side). > Ditch the digital Optipumps and get yourself either a CRL Amigo AM > processor or one of the new Omnia AM processors. They're already > stereo, whereas the Optipumps are a mono pair and can't be ganged > to work together. There is the Optimod 9100-B2 which is designed for AM Stereo use, but it still doesn't sound as good as an Amigo AM or Omnia. The Optimod is too quick to blend single-channel audio towards mono, even though this is not necessary with AM Stereo in order to maintain loudness for mono listeners. The other processors deliver consistently wide Stereo separation, even when running single-channel audio for HOURS, as I've heard some AM Stereo stations mistakenly do. I believe 850 WREF in Connecticut uses an Amigo AM processor, and they have the widest, cleanest sound I've ever heard from an AM Stereo station. I'd love to hear a Stereo version of the homebrew "Rontimod" processor that 1070 WKMB uses (teamed up with a Gates Statesman limiter). I believe it is a dual-band processor which means that it can deliver a loud, punchy sound while still preserving the frequency response of the original audio more accurately than any modern processor which hacks up the audio into five or six different frequency bands. Orban actually recommends dual-band processing for Classical music stations because of this exact reason, but as WKMB demonstrates, it works just as well with Country music, as you can hear: http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/wkmb/wkmbhifi.mp3 p.s. I almost got a stereo CBS Audimax processor on eBay -- that would have been fun to fool around with! From philipr@irac.pe.ca Fri Nov 22 08:29:25 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Nov 2002 16:29:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 78368 invoked from network); 22 Nov 2002 16:29:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Nov 2002 16:29:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.89) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 16:29:24 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.174] by n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 22 Nov 2002 16:29:23 -0000 Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 16:29:22 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF}Both ams & Cris Cuff are still alive Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <001301c29237$bcb91d20$0701010a@keva> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3195 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking Don't despair - I thought I wrecked my Realistic DX-394 when putting in a new Kiwa filter, but I was eventually able to repair the damage I did to the PC board traces - good lighting - a big magnifying lamp helps - and a lot of patience! As for soldering 2 or 3 pins together, been there, done that! Are you sure the chip is fried, or is there still some solder shorting those tiny pins? Phil R. --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Michael J. Richard" wrote: > This one's a DTR. The decoder seemed to work okay, although it was not nearly perfect. With the chip that it uses, the AM and the FM come out of the same chip......hence my post a while back about how to "insert the audio" from the decoder. Yeah, it kinda worked...but it's not true stereo when you're inserting the signal on top of the mono signal. There's some separation, but not like it should be. Meanwhile I messed up the chip when trying to figure a way to make the STEREO indicator light. Been messing with electronics for about 15 or 20 years now. I've learned a LOT from all my mistakes. I keep swearing up and down that I'm never EVER going to try to solder something to one of the pins of one of those chips with the itty bitty small (slight bigger than a hair) pins.....because every time I do, I end up soldering 2 or 3 together. Always happens now matter how sharp I use a file to sharpen my soldering iron tip. In any case, I was going to leave that decoder in there and keep trying to play with it, but not being able to get in contact with anyone to get a decoder, I had to pull it out when my new stereo for the car came in and had to put it in there instead. I should have just dropped $100 or so and grabbed like 5 or 6 decoders from Chris at the time then that way I'd have them. I've had a couple of people contact me about putting decoders in their stereos since we went stereo here at KEVA. But I don't have any decoders to put in :( And beginning to wonder if I should trust myself with someone else's radio. If I mess mine up, that's one thing. But if I mess up someone else's.....well...then I'm out BIG BUCKS when I have to replace the whole thing. > > MJR n WYO > ----- Original Message ----- > From: jsgilst > To: amstereoforum@y... > Sent: Friday, November 22, 2002 2:43 AM > Subject: Re: {AMSF}Both ams & Cris Cuff are still alive > Don't dispair, learning electronics is a lot like learning UNIX. In > the beginning it can be a tough up hill battle but in the end it > can pay off with the rewards of you work. Everybody makes mistakes > but you just have to move beyond them. If you don't make any mistakes > sometimes you don't always learn everything. > > What kind of Pioneer receiver is it, a DTR or mechanically tuned. > Although DTR is nice my Pioneer DTR receiver that I converted > suffers from display interference when I DX. They don't make > receivers like they used to. I am growing partial to converting > non-DTR/mechanical tuned radios if their LO has little phase noise > as they are much quieter for DXing. > > JSG > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Fri Nov 22 08:31:02 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Nov 2002 16:31:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 24473 invoked from network); 22 Nov 2002 16:31:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Nov 2002 16:31:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14203.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.145) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 16:31:02 -0000 Message-ID: <20021122163102.9811.qmail@web14203.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [65.221.47.68] by web14203.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 22 Nov 2002 08:31:02 PST Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 08:31:02 -0800 (PST) Subject: Same song over and over again To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio somebody wrote: "Lucent's 50-watt test station WI2XAM on 1700 kHz (Warren, NJ) transmitting an IBOC signal after sunset -- and just like the day before, the programming consisted entirely of "Man! I Feel Like a Woman" by Shania Twain played over and over and over again" - My guess is that if they play the same song 200 times they might be able to record just one time the whole 3 minute song without obscene digital artifacts. Tell me, how are digital artifact supposed to be 'better' than static? I'll take the latter, with realtime audio and no delay. Analog AMS still better than IBOC. __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus – Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From e92fmjamz@yahoo.com Fri Nov 22 08:56:25 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: e92fmjamz@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Nov 2002 16:56:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 52549 invoked from network); 22 Nov 2002 16:56:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Nov 2002 16:56:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14004.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.175.120) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 16:56:24 -0000 Message-ID: <20021122165624.55676.qmail@web14004.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [152.8.78.47] by web14004.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 22 Nov 2002 08:56:24 PST Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 08:56:24 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: AM Stereo modulation & audio processing To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: Ernest Jones X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=24963319 X-Yahoo-Profile: e92fmjamz > p.s. I almost got a stereo CBS Audimax processor on > eBay -- that > would have been fun to fool around with! > theres a local AM/FM station that still has those installed in thier equipment racks, the FM is now using a optimud 8100, the AM is still on the Audimax/Volumax --- "Kevin T." wrote: > > It does produce some distortion, mostly in the > right channel, > > though it's rarely objectionable. > > The newer C-Quam decoder chips -- the MC13022, > MC13028, and even the > cheapie MC13024 -- are much, much better at dealing > with high > modulation levels. I've listened to stations like > 1680 WTTM which > transmit AM Stereo at as close to +125% modulation > as possible and > although they often sound a little distorted on > older radios that use > the MC13020 or Sony decoders, the audio from the > newer Motorola > decoders is nearly perfect -- it even seems to > "clean up" the > distorted audio that some mono AM stations are > transmitting > (especially those which use Kahn Power-Side). > > > Ditch the digital Optipumps and get yourself > either a CRL Amigo AM > > processor or one of the new Omnia AM processors. > They're already > > stereo, whereas the Optipumps are a mono pair and > can't be ganged > > to work together. > > There is the Optimod 9100-B2 which is designed for > AM Stereo use, but > it still doesn't sound as good as an Amigo AM or > Omnia. The Optimod > is too quick to blend single-channel audio towards > mono, even though > this is not necessary with AM Stereo in order to > maintain loudness > for mono listeners. The other processors deliver > consistently wide > Stereo separation, even when running single-channel > audio for HOURS, > as I've heard some AM Stereo stations mistakenly do. > I believe > 850 WREF in Connecticut uses an Amigo AM processor, > and they have the > widest, cleanest sound I've ever heard from an AM > Stereo station. > > I'd love to hear a Stereo version of the homebrew > "Rontimod" > processor that 1070 WKMB uses (teamed up with a > Gates Statesman > limiter). I believe it is a dual-band processor > which means that it > can deliver a loud, punchy sound while still > preserving the frequency > response of the original audio more accurately than > any modern > processor which hacks up the audio into five or six > different > frequency bands. Orban actually recommends > dual-band processing for > Classical music stations because of this exact > reason, but as WKMB > demonstrates, it works just as well with Country > music, as you can > hear: > > http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/wkmb/wkmbhifi.mp3 > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus – Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From groucho@skyweb.net Fri Nov 22 08:57:09 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Nov 2002 16:57:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 47248 invoked from network); 22 Nov 2002 16:57:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Nov 2002 16:57:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 16:57:08 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gAMH0Wed028475 for ; Fri, 22 Nov 2002 12:00:57 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DDE60FE.9B439B3B@skyweb.net> Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 11:53:18 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Man! I Feel Like an IBOC References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 OK Ill Post on this One..... I drove up there yesterday actually its not Lucent its Ibiquity I could not hear anything On 1700 just carrier.. But for 3 miles all I heard was hiss on 1680.1690 1710... In the corporate ceter where they are based.. 1680 was gone.. WTTM could not be heard at all which really upset me. outside the development WTTM could be heard with LOTS of interference. I stopped in to see My Friend who is actually working on this Project. so I could get a 5 cent tour to see IBOC in a working environment maybe even see what it looks like on a spectrum analyser right there.. However He was not in he was out in the Field. But one of his Co-workers came out and I told him I was there to see my friend. I had given the security guard my business card. which He gave to this guy.. as soon as he Saw I was the Engineer for 1680 WTTM he went off.. a tangent.. "ahh I see as soon as we get an experimental license Everyone's complaining about interference. they even complain when we are not on the air We keep a log of when we are on the air" I said Im not here for a complaint by boss wants to keep an open relationship with iniquity but since you mention it.. I can hear your signal On my station 1680 for about 3 Miles and Im not happy about that... in this industrial park Im sure I had Listeners But you blanket out 1680 in here. He then went off Well what do you expect your standing under the antenna.. If I were parked at your site I would Not hear anything For Miles on the adjacent" My response was First off that may be true But I can here Other stations from 1/4 mile away from My Tower.and you cannot compare a 50-100 watt transmitter To a 10 kW station. He walked away in a Huff.. at that point a woman came out asking why I wanted to see My friend.. I told her why I was there it was a friendly Visit I was more Interested in seeing this antenna he designed and the IBOC system. I told her who I was and she to asked about interference Complaint.. I said that's not why I'm here but it is an Issue.. and explained to Her that even at 50-100 watts their signal should not be heard On 1680 at the distance I am Hearing it... I asked her for her business card. (I cannot remember her name But If I saw her I would know who she was) she went to go get one and came back saying she didn't have anymore.. gee why don't I believe her..at that point my friend called into the security desk and I spoke with him.. and explained what happened.. He said he will set me up with a 5 cent tour. one day when he is Not out in the Field... Just my opinion To me it seems that they know they have a Problem. and wont talk to anyone about it.. Let me say this. I was very upset about the Interference. But before I went inside I called my boss at the parent Company. and told him what I was hearing and where I was and I was there for a friendly visit to see my Friend. he only words to me were just don't make Waves. but let them know that there is a concern about the Interference in that area.. and that's what I tried to do. But instead left with a bad taste In my mouth.. that maybe I should not have even stopped there for Friendly reasons.. just For curiosity what Time did you actually hear music material on 1700 I was there for almost 45 mins and in that area for almost 2 hours driving around. and heard nothing On 1700 just carrier... that was between 11 am and 2pm Neal "Kevin T." wrote: > For the second evening in a row, I caught Lucent's 50-watt test > station WI2XAM on 1700 kHz (Warren, NJ) transmitting an IBOC signal > after sunset -- and just like the day before, the programming > consisted entirely of "Man! I Feel Like a Woman" by Shania Twain > played over and over and over again, with no IDs or other music. > > So, if you manage to DX that on 1700, it's not some kid with a Ramsey > transmitter kit and a CD player stuck in repeat mode -- it's Lucent's > way of "testing" IBOC. > > I bet they have "Didn't We Almost Have It All" by Whitney Houston > also cued up in case nighttime IBOC turns out to be a failure.... > either that, or "Can't Lose What You Never Had" by Westlife. > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From groucho@skyweb.net Fri Nov 22 09:11:11 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Nov 2002 17:11:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 98168 invoked from network); 22 Nov 2002 17:11:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Nov 2002 17:11:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 17:11:10 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gAMHFFed034629 for ; Fri, 22 Nov 2002 12:15:15 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DDE6481.12AE5668@skyweb.net> Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 12:08:17 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} a common misconception References: <1bf.1528ae72.2b0ec36f@aol.com> <014601c2923f$0b34cd80$827dfea9@home1> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 exactly correct however we are a mullet language station because there are over 40 different dialects in India so I usually say South Asian. with 40 different radio hosts.. I guess is we are using about 40 of 40 but not sure I know of about 7 Neal Scott Todd wrote: > That should be Hindi- the language of India. Hindu is the religion. > > ST > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > > > Ok..I plead ignorance here....is Hindu something like spanish or something > > totally different? > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Nov 22 09:13:27 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Nov 2002 17:13:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 77379 invoked from network); 22 Nov 2002 17:13:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Nov 2002 17:13:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.87) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 17:13:26 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.173] by n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 22 Nov 2002 17:13:26 -0000 Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 17:13:25 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Both ams & Cris Cuff are still alive Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <013e01c2923e$e3b039c0$827dfea9@home1> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 560 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Hey, even I've screwed stuff up before, so don't feel too bad. Same here... I slipped while popping the heatsink off of the CPU of a Power Macintosh 7100 AV... now I know that a Power PC chip doesn't like to work with even one of its many tiny pins no longer intact. It was an old computer, from 1994, but for $10 at a flea market it served me remarkably well -- you can still do a lot of stuff with Mac OS 7.6 and a 66 MHz processor. Also, don't ask me how I know that the smoke from a burned-out printed circuit board smells really, really bad... From KC4QLP@aol.com Fri Nov 22 09:19:08 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Nov 2002 17:19:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 55978 invoked from network); 22 Nov 2002 17:19:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Nov 2002 17:19:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r08.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.104) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 17:19:07 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.ae.318e6443 (4418) for ; Fri, 22 Nov 2002 12:18:56 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 12:18:55 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Yahoo! miscues--moving to OT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 11/22/02 9:14:29 AM Eastern Standard Time, tampagar@webtv.net writes: > ". Sadly, the media is conditioning the masses with the false belief that > they aren't giving up freedom with increased security. With all that's > going on right now, yesterday's biggest headline was Michael Jackson > hanging his kid over a balcony? WHAT? If you want to find truth anymore, > you'll have to do so on the internet. > > Very true...the news media is not giving the whole deal on whats really going in our world. As far as talk radio goes,there are some out there that only give one side of the story as well. Thats why there are those like Chuck Harder {on Talk America Network and shortwave} and Oliver North to give us all both sides of the stories. NPR!..forget it completely!Thats a group that gets so much government funding on top of donations...a multimillion dollar outfit...and they still broadcast liberal crap. If they stopped receiving donations from the public and relied on government funding,programming would remain the same and the only ones that would be hurting would be those sitting in those very well out fitted offices and coming to work driving some car with a name that sounds like a cross between a sneeze and a cow passing gas. But hey,liberals have never and will never succeed in commerical radio...so they have to beg for money and make you think they are going broke..just so they can try and feed you more garbage on a noncomerical medium. The latest garbage....is someone that is trying to have it so all males HAVE to have birth control implanted in you...sort of like the womens birth control implant.When you want to start a family,you would have to appear before a judge to show proof that you can afford to start a family and that you are worthy of having a family. All this coming from a woman in office that was raped and believes every man on earth should feel her pain! I'm sorry..she needs to get out of office and get a life! This is being talked about in AMERICA folks!..this isnt the old USSR or China or some third world country..... Wake up PEOPLE!...there are crazy people that have been elected by...no doubt,crazy misinformed people, that are trying to control everything you do...even trying to take away your freedoms. People are so concerned about whats happening abroad with the war on terrorism that they have all but forgotten about whats happening with the "war" on liberals here on the home front. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Nov 22 09:28:01 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Nov 2002 17:28:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 12084 invoked from network); 22 Nov 2002 17:28:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Nov 2002 17:28:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 17:28:00 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.189] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 22 Nov 2002 17:27:54 -0000 Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 17:27:51 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Man! I Feel Like an IBOC Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3DDE60FE.9B439B3B@skyweb.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1399 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > just For curiosity what Time did you actually hear music material > on 1700 I was there for almost 45 mins and in that area for almost > 2 hours driving around. and heard nothing On 1700 just carrier... > that was between 11 am and 2pm On Wednesday and Thursday at around 5:00 to 6:00 PM while driving I heard them playing the Shania Twain song repeatedly, with no IDs. The analog audio was a very narrow bandwidth and very low modulation level (compared to WTTM) but it was there, along with the digital hissing on the adjacent channels. They are not only interfereing with 1680 WTTM, but also with reception of the community/weather info station on 1700 in Manville, NJ (which has surprisingly good modulation and really gets out for only 10 watts). In the Somerville area, 1700 kHz is almost a 50/50 mix between the two stations when they are both on the air. What you were probably hearing was the full digital mode of IBOC, with no "hybrid" analog audio added to it, so that means the digital "hash" is transmitted with FULL strength and will cause even more interference. BTW, which Lucent office is their transmitter at? The main office complex off I-78 Exit 36, or the smaller office off I-78 Exit 33 near the Somerset Hills hotel? Both are in Warren and on my car radio the signal strength of WI2XAM seemed to be about the same while driving around both offices. From jeffdeck@aol.com Fri Nov 22 09:40:22 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: Jeffdeck@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Nov 2002 17:40:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 29395 invoked from network); 22 Nov 2002 17:40:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Nov 2002 17:40:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d05.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 17:40:21 -0000 Received: from Jeffdeck@aol.com by imo-d05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.51.2798f01f (18707); Fri, 22 Nov 2002 12:40:07 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <51.2798f01f.2b0fc5f6@aol.com> Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 12:40:06 EST Subject: Re: AM Stereo To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Cc: amstereo@bellsouth.net MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 8.0 for Windows US sub 230 From: jeffdeck@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=4430287 X-Yahoo-Profile: jeffdeck2001 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit All, You need to ensure that there is a current limiting resistor in series with the LED, or you will destroy the LED and the AM stereo transistor output. It matters how the LED indicator is wired in the tuner or receiver. If you do accidentally connect the decoder's stereo indicator output directly to B+ the output would be destroyed. I have AM stereo decoders for sale at $25 each plus postage. I also include the connection details. Please let me know if you are interested. Watch eBay for a few AM stereo products that i will auction. 73, Jeff In a message dated 11/22/2002 11:05:53 AM Eastern Standard Time, Scott writes: >If the stereo indicator is just an LED, you can parallel the LED driver >output from the decoder right across the indicator. It's all open-collector >architecture. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From michaelj@vcn.com Fri Nov 22 10:40:26 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Nov 2002 18:40:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 99558 invoked from network); 22 Nov 2002 18:40:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Nov 2002 18:40:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m3-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.33) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 18:40:25 -0000 Received: from michael (vcn55.usrtc-1.evan.wy.vcn.com [209.193.86.59]) by m3-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Fri, 22 Nov 2002 11:40:24 -0700 To: Subject: RE: {AMSF}Both ams & Cris Cuff are still alive Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 11:40:15 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Actually Phil, the chip works perfectly. The pin that I'm talking about BROKE OFF where it goes into the IC. So there's no way to put another pin on it. I've even tried with the finest of fine tips on my soldering iron to heat up the tiny spec of metal where the pin used to be and attach something to it, but no workie. I just end up soldering that spot together with the pins on either side of it. That's why I figured I'd just replace the whole card. Now that I'm at my shop, I can tell ya that the Pioneer receiver is an SX-253R....and the AM/FM tuner plug-in card (the one with the chip on it) is labeled ANP-1729-B. It is amazing that Pioneer used a Sanyo LA1836 chip for the tuner on this thing (and probably many of their tuners) and yet never included AM Stereo. This particular chip has an actual "AM Stereo IF out" pin on it so that the signal could be fed into an AM Stereo decoder. This chip is the one with the small pins (if you want to call them that....they're actually traces of solder thinner than a piece of paper). Everything still works fine on the AM side. Apparantly this pin that I broke is the "FM Signal Detector" pin. It is amazing that pin 12 coming of this card is the signal for the STEREO indicator. Ground it, and it lights up. It's not an LED.....part of a light-up LCD display. Nonetheless, I think I screwed up another pin/trace or two. This receiver also has a "tuned" indicator on the display. At present, the "STEREO" indicator will not light at all when in AM mode....even if the card is unplugged. Used to, it did. So I also may have shorted something. (when I break something, I break it GOOD!). Meanwhile, when you change over to FM mode, the "tuned" and "stereo" indicators are lit at all times. Yes, when a station is coming in good in stereo, it is in stereo and the separation is there, but there is no longer any indication for stereo or not. Like I said, in searching for an IF tap or a voltage source for the AMS decoder, I may have shorted something on another chip in another part of the receiver. Probably the chip or its related componants that control the display. *sigh* I guess it is still usable for AM mono if I choose....and I'm sure it is just fine for the rest of the receiver's functions (IE Line In, CD, LD, Phono) but no FM at all now. I think I could probably live with the "stereo" and "tuned" indicators on at all times in FM mode, since it'll still receive in stereo. That's why I thought if I could just replace this "card". Wish I knew someone in the radio/electronics repair biz. I know damn good and well that I won't be able to purchase anything myself because I'm sure that Pioneer.....like all electronics manufacturers will tell me "this unit needs to be serviced by an authorized Pioneer service dealer." Don't know if I could "find" an "authorized pioneer service center" and have them get the card for me and sell it to me. That's why I was asking for suggestions or maybe even a starting point on where to find somewhere that I could get this card. Bummed in WYO -----Original Message----- From: Phil Rafuse [mailto:philipr@irac.pe.ca] Sent: Friday, November 22, 2002 9:29 AM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF}Both ams & Cris Cuff are still alive Are you sure the chip is fried, or is there still some solder shorting those tiny pins? Phil R. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From jsgil@hal-pc.org Fri Nov 22 13:30:47 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Nov 2002 21:30:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 64318 invoked from network); 22 Nov 2002 21:30:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Nov 2002 21:30:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.64) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 21:30:45 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.139] by n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 22 Nov 2002 21:30:45 -0000 Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 21:30:44 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF}Both ams & Cris Cuff are still alive Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <001301c29237$bcb91d20$0701010a@keva> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 2022 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.187 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Michael J. Richard" wrote: > This one's a DTR. The decoder seemed to work okay, although it was not nearly perfect. With the chip that it uses, the AM and the FM come out of the same chip......hence my post a while back about how to "insert the audio" from the decoder. Yeah, it kinda worked...but it's not true stereo when you're inserting the signal on top of the mono signal. There's some separation, but not like it should be.=20 Meanwhile I messed up the chip when trying to figure a way to make the STEREO indicator light.=20=20 Sounds a lot like my SX-2600. It ran the output of the AM into the FM Stereo decoder chip and both AM and FM exited the FM-St decoder chip with FM de-emphasis which has greater attenuation than the=20 NRSC AM de-emphasis. Combine this with the narrow =B13KHz IF filter and it was very muffeled. My solution to the switching was to use a CD4066 CMOS Quad analog switch as a DPDT switch to switch between=20 AM and FM which allowed me to apply the FM de-emphasis to FM only. I removed the RC de-emphasis network from the main PCB an placed them on another PCB along with the CMOS switch. The holes where I removed the=20 resistors allowed me the pick up the FM-St signal and return both the switched AMS and FMS back to the main PCB. I was also able to get the=20 STEREO indicator to light up in the florescent display but had to driectly drive one of the pins of the display with other signals from the display driver chip along with the AM-St ID from the decoder. All in all I ended up with 3 PCBs in the receiver. The way they make these newer receivers makes it difficult to impossible to adapt them=20 to AMS. If you can find a high quality mechanically tuned receiver with low phase noise in the LO and can get a wideband =B17.5KHz 455KHz ceramic filter from the handset of a 49MHz cordless phone and throw in a couple of 10KHz notch filters you can get sound quality that approaches the quality of thoes wideband AMS Chrysler and Delco radios. JSG From paulparkinson@ameritech.net Fri Nov 22 13:34:43 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: paulparkinson@ameritech.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Nov 2002 21:34:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 69956 invoked from network); 22 Nov 2002 21:34:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Nov 2002 21:34:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail1.wi.rr.com) (24.94.163.48) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 21:34:42 -0000 Received: from MICRON1 ([65.30.180.103]) by mail1.wi.rr.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.757.75); Fri, 22 Nov 2002 15:30:05 -0600 Message-ID: <002201c2926e$f21140b0$6500a8c0@MICRON1> To: References: <1037985550.1671.55986.m6@yahoogroups.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Digest Number 450 Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 15:34:32 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Return-Path: paulparkinson@ameritech.net From: "PaulParkinson" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=80232545 X-Yahoo-Profile: paulparkinson1 Message: 3 Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 09:04:12 -0600 From: "Scott Todd" Subject: Re: Radio Disney I wish I had known when the changeover was going to take place. Was the station dark at all between when the old ownership and when RD took over? I'm not surprised that it happened as the previous folks didn't have a clue as to what made for good radio, though I did like the praise and worship music enough it was my main reason to add AMS decoding to my stereo. Scott Todd ----- Original Message ----- From: PaulParkinson > > WKSH 1640 Sussex Wi is now Radio Disney and they are AM Stereo . Religion signed off on Wednesday morning with dead air a few hours at a time. Thursday and Friday they played chirping birds and Saturday they played be my guest from beauty and the beast. they signed on Radio Disney about 730pm Saturday with the format. I use a TM152 and an A100 radio to listen to them. From bjackson@indyradio.com Fri Nov 22 13:41:57 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Nov 2002 21:41:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 12176 invoked from network); 22 Nov 2002 21:41:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Nov 2002 21:41:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.69) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 21:41:57 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.248] by n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 22 Nov 2002 21:41:56 -0000 Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 21:41:55 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: AM Stereo modulation & audio processing Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20021122165624.55676.qmail@web14004.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1551 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923" X-Originating-IP: 64.25.100.14 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 Slightly off-topic... I know many people here are not fans of heavy processing. I, however, love it (I have an Aphex Dominator and Compellor and DBX 166xl in my home stereo). My ex hated it (big fan of classical and couldn't figure out how to bypass the processing) When I was the PD at a small modern rock station in southern Indiana in the early-mid 90's, we had the best processing... Out of the board into a pair of older Mosley limiters, into an EQ (flat except a 4 db boost at 32hz, and a 6 db boost at 12.5khz), into a pair of CBS Audimax/Volumax processors...STL...at the xmter, an Optimod with the XT Chasis running about 17db of compression. It didn't matter if you ran the board at 20% or 120%, the mod monitor just barely wiggled. And WINN 106.1 still has an Audimax/Volumax on their (mono) backup xmter. On topic: Over the Thanksgiving weekend, I'm going to our sister station (WZZB 1390) and going to run tape to convert into an mp3. A little background...WZZB still runs an AC format...Promotes itself on the air as AM Stereo, and AFAIK is the last Susquehanna station to run AM Stereo. -Brad Jackson -Susquehanna, Indianapolis -WGLD/WGRL/WFMS --- In amstereoforum@y..., Ernest Jones wrote: > > p.s. I almost got a stereo CBS Audimax processor on > > eBay -- that > > would have been fun to fool around with! > > > theres a local AM/FM station that still has those > installed in thier equipment racks, the FM is now > using a optimud 8100, the AM is still on the > Audimax/Volumax > > > From rjskadl@yahoo.com Fri Nov 22 14:31:52 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: rjskadl@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Nov 2002 22:31:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 35072 invoked from network); 22 Nov 2002 22:31:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Nov 2002 22:31:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.68) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 22:31:51 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.161] by n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 22 Nov 2002 22:31:51 -0000 Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 22:31:50 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Streaming Media (was: Remote Links) Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <001501c291f9$71aa5df0$0202a8c0@primary> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2189 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "rjskadl" X-Originating-IP: 129.49.152.110 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=29619919 X-Yahoo-Profile: rjskadl I have done work with All four of the Major Streaming systems, Real, Windows, MP3 and Quicktime. What I found was that Real audio and MP3 seem to be the most universal. Windows OS and Quicktime media don't get along, nor do MAC OS and Windows Media. Believe me, I got the PCs at home and the MACs at work. The Problem with Windows Media is that if you are using a MAC it is difficult to get the stream, and if you are lucky enough to get it the stream is of bad quality. Windows media does work well on windows systems though. The reverse is true of Quicktime streams and PCs. Windows & Quicktime don't mix well. Quicktime is an apple format which works beautifully on the MAC OS. It is not a coincidence that the two systems dont work well with each other. Real media does seem to work well on both MACs and PCs. It is in Real's best interest really to work fairly reliably on both systems though. Real does use a fair amount of processing power, but nothing too rediculous that I have seen. If you have a well maintained system Real will do you right. In my opinion I think Real's audio codecs sound the best. The 20kbps mono stream is suprisingly clear. Unfortunately you don't really get good stereo until you reach 64 and 96 kbps. MP3 seems to be pretty universal as well. Once again, not necessarily in the best interests of MP3, but I think the universal compatability has more to do with the fact that most mp3 technology seems to be open source kind of like the Linux OS. I was not too impressed with streaming mp3s in the early days, but I must say that we listen to live 365 in the office and the 128 kbps streams sound pretty good. It was a bit tricky trying to set up the mp3 stream, but that was a few years ago and I bet it has probably gotten much easier lately. If I was setting up a serious webcast station I would first go with real audio mono 20 kbps and stereo 96 kbps streams, and then add on a 56k stereo mp3 (shoutcast) as well as a 128k mp3 stream. If I were really ambitious I might also go with Windows media as a third option, but I think I would stop there and avoid setting up a quicktime stream. From rjskadl@yahoo.com Fri Nov 22 14:36:27 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: rjskadl@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Nov 2002 22:36:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 32571 invoked from network); 22 Nov 2002 22:36:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Nov 2002 22:36:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 22:36:26 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.163] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 22 Nov 2002 22:36:26 -0000 Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 22:36:26 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: AM Stereo modulation & audio processing Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 576 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "rjskadl" X-Originating-IP: 129.49.152.110 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=29619919 X-Yahoo-Profile: rjskadl --- In amstereoforum@y..., "bradleyj923" wrote: > Slightly off-topic... > > I know many people here are not fans of heavy processing. I, however, > love it If that is the case you would love 92.7 WLIR on Long Island. Talk about LOUD! The amazing thing is that they are able to be so LOUD and still sound pretty good. They got some Bad Ass Modified Aphex stuff on the air there. The aphex stuff is actually prototypes designed specifically for them. New York FM in general is very processed. WPLJ is a prime example. They are very loud too. From ccuff@in4web.com Fri Nov 22 15:16:38 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Nov 2002 23:16:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 18124 invoked from network); 22 Nov 2002 23:16:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Nov 2002 23:16:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 23:16:37 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.67]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Fri, 22 Nov 2002 18:10:56 -0500 Message-ID: <004001c2927c$f2637700$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: Subject: MJR- I have decoders Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 18:14:45 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 Michael, and all- I just made a batch of decoders. I have plenty now. I have been making the things nearly round the clock, between work and sleep.. I am also going to "try" and make up a batch of my walkmans... I just have to figure out a way to do without sleep..... I can't believe the sudden surge of interest in all this. Who said AM Stereo was dead? Chris From michaelj@vcn.com Fri Nov 22 15:39:06 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Nov 2002 23:39:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 64869 invoked from network); 22 Nov 2002 23:39:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Nov 2002 23:39:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m3-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.33) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Nov 2002 23:39:05 -0000 Received: from michael (vcn55.usrtc-1.evan.wy.vcn.com [209.193.86.59]) by m3-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Fri, 22 Nov 2002 16:39:05 -0700 To: Subject: RE: {AMSF}Both ams & Cris Cuff are still alive Date: Fri, 22 Nov 2002 16:38:55 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Wow! Sounds like quite a project. I'm really beginning to think that I'm better off just replacing the card from that unit and living with the AM MONO. At least then the receiver is still functional as it was. I'm still trying to understand the conversions as I go along. I have an ol= d Panasonic Boombox (circa 1988) that I was thinking about converting. It is analog tuning. The AM section actually sounds very decent....pretty good high end on it. Not muffled. Looks like this one has a Toshiba TA8127N chip. A combo AM/FM chip. I can see the ceramic filters right on the side and so forth. All controls are mechanical.....there's not really any "logic" type stuff in this unit. Possible conversion? I think this one would sound great. I'm just not experienced at all doing any "analog" conversions with an "all in one" chip. I'm thinking that maybe there is a= n extra pole on the AM / FM switch that I can use to switch back and forth between audio from the decoder and audio from the Toshiba chip? I'll have to take a closer look at the circuit board to figure out just what that switch actually does. I think it just closes (or opens) a circuit which goes straight to some pins on the chip that tells the chip to switch betwee= n AM and FM mode. Stereo indication is not a problem at all since this one has a plain ol' LED for that. Should be easy to wire to or parallel with the trigger already on the Toshiba chip. I've been studying the data sheet on the chip. Still not quite understanding it, though. Anyways.....thoughts? Should I attempt this? MJR n WYO -----Original Message----- From: jsgilst [mailto:jsgil@hal-pc.org] Sent: Friday, November 22, 2002 2:31 PM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF}Both ams & Cris Cuff are still alive Sounds a lot like my SX-2600. It ran the output of the AM into the FM Stereo decoder chip and both AM and FM exited the FM-St decoder chip with FM de-emphasis which has greater attenuation than the NRSC AM de-emphasis. Combine this with the narrow =B13KHz IF filter and it was very muffeled. My solution to the switching was to use a CD4066 CMOS Quad analog switch as a DPDT switch to switch between AM and FM which allowed me to apply the FM de-emphasis to FM only. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Nov 22 18:05:12 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Nov 2002 02:05:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 97343 invoked from network); 23 Nov 2002 02:05:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Nov 2002 02:05:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Nov 2002 02:05:12 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.168] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 23 Nov 2002 02:05:11 -0000 Date: Sat, 23 Nov 2002 02:05:11 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: AM Stereo modulation & audio processing Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2927 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.73.149 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > New York FM in general is very processed. WPLJ is a prime example. > They are very loud too. I don't know if it is just an NYC-area phenomenon, but today's FM audio processing seems to have increased loudness at the expense of distortion. I'm talking about plainly obvious, grundgy, in-your-face distortion that you can hear even on a table radio with a 3" speaker. Not surprisingly, it happens most often in music with prominent bass response. Everybody wants to have booming bass coming out of their speakers, but on the air those low frequencies suck up a lot of modulation energy. So, if you want to squeeze out the maximum loudness from your station, you have two choices: either reduce the bass level in your processing, making it sound tinny but clean, or just let the strong bass go through the processor to the point of clipping, which gives you loud bass but a distorted sound. And it's not just the bass that is distorted; it seems to affect all the higher frequencies as well. Take, for example, a song that starts out with somebody singing over a simple piano solo. It sounds fine until the bass player kicks in -- and then every strong bass note causes clearly audible "grundge" in the singer's voice and piano that are on top of it. Thus, even if your radio has too small of a speaker to let you hear the bass, you are still treated to the distorted higher frequencies in all their overprocessed glory. For a long time I just thought this was because I was using a crappy Panasonic analog-tuning stereo system, which just might have a naturally distorted FM tuner. But, I finally stopped to think that I am hearing this same distortion on *all* of my radios, and FM didn't USE to sound THAT bad in previous years! In fact, in my younger years I often taped songs off the radio, and playing these same cassettes back nowadays, they really surprise me by just how much better FM stations sounded back then -- even when captured on a cheapo Type I non-Dolby auto-level cassette. On the other hand, AM continues to have the advantage that on any halfway-decent radio, the similarly increased processing from AM stations hasn't led to any large distortion in the sound. Stations like 1680 WTTM manage to sound extremely LOUD when playing music, but still have extremely CLEAN, non-distorted audio. Listen on a radio with the newer generation of C-Quam decoders (with their apparent ability to "clean up" any distortion that may be present) and the sound quality is simply breathtaking -- even in mono, the sound is incredibly rich, clean, and natural-sounding. You hardly even notice the lower treble response limit because it is just so enjoyable to listen to. On a Jeep "Infinity Gold" high-power audio system with the Chrysler AMAX radio, you can even have deep bass on AM that is strong enough to vibrate your whole body -- without FM's distorted sound! From jsgil@hal-pc.org Fri Nov 22 18:07:55 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Nov 2002 02:07:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 59913 invoked from network); 23 Nov 2002 02:07:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Nov 2002 02:07:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.78) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Nov 2002 02:07:55 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.147] by n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 23 Nov 2002 02:07:55 -0000 Date: Sat, 23 Nov 2002 02:07:51 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF}Both ams & Cris Cuff are still alive Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2757 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.130.21 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Michael J. Richard" wrote: > Wow! Sounds like quite a project. I'm really beginning to think that I'm > better off just replacing the card from that unit and living with the AM > MONO. At least then the receiver is still functional as it was. > > I'm still trying to understand the conversions as I go along. I have an old > Panasonic Boombox (circa 1988) that I was thinking about converting. It is > analog tuning. The AM section actually sounds very decent....pretty good > high end on it. Not muffled. Looks like this one has a Toshiba TA8127N > chip. A combo AM/FM chip. I can see the ceramic filters right on the side > and so forth. All controls are mechanical.....there's not really any > "logic" type stuff in this unit. Possible conversion? I think this one > would sound great. I'm just not experienced at all doing any "analog" > conversions with an "all in one" chip. I'm thinking that maybe there is an > extra pole on the AM / FM switch that I can use to switch back and forth > between audio from the decoder and audio from the Toshiba chip? I'll have > to take a closer look at the circuit board to figure out just what that > switch actually does. I think it just closes (or opens) a circuit which > goes straight to some pins on the chip that tells the chip to switch between > AM and FM mode. Stereo indication is not a problem at all since this one > has a plain ol' LED for that. Should be easy to wire to or parallel with > the trigger already on the Toshiba chip. I've been studying the data sheet > on the chip. Still not quite understanding it, though. > Anyways.....thoughts? Should I attempt this? > Most of the older receivers use a multi-position rotary switch or they have radio style push buttons for the selector switch. On the AM input on these switches they usually have the stereo inputs connected together with a jumper wire so both channels will get AM. Remove the jumper wire and connect the AMS decoder to the 2 inputs. Beleive me analog receivers are easier. Thinks are larger and easier to track down. IF chips in these receivers usually have an NTE replacement so you can get pin outs if you look in their cross-reference catalog. The only pluses that a DTR has is precise station tuning, little if any LO phase noise and good antenna tracking with the LO. The downside for DTR is the digital (Can you say IBOC hash) noise from the logic controller used to tune and drive the display if is not well shielded. Since almost all DTR have very narrow band IF filters that filter out this noise there is little incentive for them to properly shield the digital circuits. An analog receiver will almost always be quieter especially fro DXing. JSG From bjackson@indyradio.com Fri Nov 22 22:55:15 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Nov 2002 06:55:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 59111 invoked from network); 23 Nov 2002 06:55:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Nov 2002 06:55:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.89) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Nov 2002 06:55:15 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.130] by n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 23 Nov 2002 06:55:15 -0000 Date: Sat, 23 Nov 2002 06:55:15 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: AM Stereo modulation & audio processing Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3870 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923" X-Originating-IP: 216.132.129.192 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 Not all heavily processed FM stations have distorted bass. It seems like that IS the case when stations are using digital processing like the 8400, or the FM-6 from Omnia (Which actually loses bass when hit too hard unlike an analog 8100). Our 80's station (WGRL) uses the Aphex dominator and Aural Exciter with Big Bottom. Combined with the analog 8100, it has very good, strong bass with very little distortion (the damn digital boards distort more than the processing it seems). Audio processing is not an exact science...It takes a lot of tweaking to get the sound you want. At the station I was talking about in my previous post (with like 5 processors), our engineer and I worked hard to compromise between loud and clean. He brought in all kinds of equipment to "show me what distortion" I was creating by tweaking the clippers. (Some kind of scope). We kept tweaking for almost 2 weeks before deciding it was just right. You CAN get 25db of compression on FM and keep it clean...If you're willing to work at it. (It also helped that we padded the boards down...instead of 0db being +8, we moved it to +4 for a little extra headroom). --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin T." wrote: > Not surprisingly, it happens most often in music with prominent bass > response. Everybody wants to have booming bass coming out of their > speakers, but on the air those low frequencies suck up a lot of > modulation energy. So, if you want to squeeze out the maximum > loudness from your station, you have two choices: either reduce the > bass level in your processing, making it sound tinny but clean, or > just let the strong bass go through the processor to the point of > clipping, which gives you loud bass but a distorted sound. > > And it's not just the bass that is distorted; it seems to affect all > the higher frequencies as well. Take, for example, a song that > starts out with somebody singing over a simple piano solo. It sounds > fine until the bass player kicks in -- and then every strong bass > note causes clearly audible "grundge" in the singer's voice and piano > that are on top of it. Thus, even if your radio has too small of a > speaker to let you hear the bass, you are still treated to the > distorted higher frequencies in all their overprocessed glory. > > For a long time I just thought this was because I was using a crappy > Panasonic analog-tuning stereo system, which just might have a > naturally distorted FM tuner. But, I finally stopped to think that I > am hearing this same distortion on *all* of my radios, and FM didn't > USE to sound THAT bad in previous years! In fact, in my younger > years I often taped songs off the radio, and playing these same > cassettes back nowadays, they really surprise me by just how much > better FM stations sounded back then -- even when captured on a > cheapo Type I non-Dolby auto-level cassette. > > On the other hand, AM continues to have the advantage that on any > halfway-decent radio, the similarly increased processing from AM > stations hasn't led to any large distortion in the sound. Stations > like 1680 WTTM manage to sound extremely LOUD when playing music, but > still have extremely CLEAN, non-distorted audio. Listen on a radio > with the newer generation of C-Quam decoders (with their apparent > ability to "clean up" any distortion that may be present) and the > sound quality is simply breathtaking -- even in mono, the sound is > incredibly rich, clean, and natural-sounding. You hardly even notice > the lower treble response limit because it is just so enjoyable to > listen to. On a Jeep "Infinity Gold" high-power audio system with > the Chrysler AMAX radio, you can even have deep bass on AM that is > strong enough to vibrate your whole body -- without FM's distorted > sound! From KC4QLP@aol.com Fri Nov 22 23:51:03 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Nov 2002 07:51:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 84362 invoked from network); 23 Nov 2002 07:51:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Nov 2002 07:51:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m05.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.8) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Nov 2002 07:51:02 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.156.17d4f3cf (30950) for ; Sat, 23 Nov 2002 02:50:57 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <156.17d4f3cf.2b108d61@aol.com> Date: Sat, 23 Nov 2002 02:50:57 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: AM Stereo modulation & audio processing To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 11/23/02 1:55:30 AM Eastern Standard Time, bjackson@indyradio.com writes: > You CAN get 25db of compression on > FM and keep it clean...If you're willing to work at it. (It also > helped that we padded the boards down...instead of 0db being +8, we > moved it to +4 for a little extra headroom). > That usually helps. I've seen to many installs where everything was run just to the point of maximum...and with the way board operators are,never paying attention to levels,you run into major overload and distortion just about constantly. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Nov 23 01:39:27 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Nov 2002 09:39:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 59272 invoked from network); 23 Nov 2002 09:39:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Nov 2002 09:39:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.66) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Nov 2002 09:39:25 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.183] by n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 23 Nov 2002 09:39:25 -0000 Date: Sat, 23 Nov 2002 09:39:24 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: AM Stereo modulation & audio processing Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3013 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.73.149 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Our 80's station (WGRL) uses the Aphex dominator and Aural Exciter > with Big Bottom. Combined with the analog 8100, it has very good, > strong bass with very little distortion (the damn digital boards > distort more than the processing it seems). Yes... I remember that "Y-107", the NYC area's now-defunct FM Country quadracast, had excellent deep bass -- a bit over-boosted if you ask me, but at least it was clean and undistorted. I later learned that Y-107 produced this with the same combination of Aphex equipment that you describe. Nowadays in NYC on the FM band, Clear Channel uses the latest digital Optimods, and Emmis uses the latest digital Omnias... and they all sound over-processed and distorted. In fact, ABC's 95.5 WPLJ was the processing leader for decades, with consistently loud, distorted, and overprocessed audio -- but now, Emmis's "Smooth(ered) Jazz" station, "CD 101.9", is actually louder on the air, and even more distorted. On the AM side, however, I have to compliment 1190 WLIB and 1560 WQEW (Radio Disney) for having excellent audio -- it is unfortunately not AM Stereo, but both stations are crisp, clear, and clean. On the other hand, something has to be out-of-whack at 1010 WINS -- for the past few months, their audio has been very "peaky", to the point of becoming unintelligible if you're in one of their nulls. It sounds like they have a graphic equalizer with the 4 kHz slider at +10 dB and all other frequency ranges at the normal setting. p.s. Back to FM music stations... part of what makes the audio processing less than enjoyable to listen to is the music they play. Since the mid-1990s there has been a trend of making CDs as "loud" as possible -- apparently listener research has given record companies that idea that people want CDs to sound more like FM radio, rather than vice-versa, so these days almost every album's audio is run through agressive multi-band compression and peak clipping (not limiting; the waveforms are simply *hacked off* on top and bottom, producing raw square waves) in the mastering process. So, it's like that right on the CD, and once the audio is trashed in this manner, it will already sound distorted just listening to it on a plain CD player, so radio station audio processing can only take part of the blame in making it sound horrible on the air. There is an excellent article on this subject whose URL was too long to print here without line-wrapping, so I made a quick link to it on my own server: http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/link.htm Even some of the more 'dynamic' hit songs of recent, like the original opera-style version of "To Where You Are" by Josh Groban, and the soft, jazzy "Don't Know Why" by Norah Jones, are the victims of this kind of excessively clipped processing. For example on Norah's song you may hear distortion when she sings the bridge parts, but that's not all from the FM station's processing -- it is distorted like that right on the CD! From dav259@csiro.au Sat Nov 23 01:53:35 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Nov 2002 09:53:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 42110 invoked from network); 23 Nov 2002 09:53:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Nov 2002 09:53:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Nov 2002 09:53:34 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gAN9rXP25176 for ; Sat, 23 Nov 2002 20:53:33 +1100 (EST) Date: Sat, 23 Nov 2002 20:53:33 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} Yahoo! miscues - OT In-Reply-To: <000201c2921a$95499e30$0202a8c0@primary> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public On Fri, 22 Nov 2002, Don Johnson wrote: > So many people are against NPR because NPR represents so few people. > You'd think "public radio" would stand for some democratically-oriented > radio that represents the various needs and desires of the listening > public. NPR doesn't do that. It is a symbol of the new American > elitist aristocrat -- the limousine liberal. When it isn't boring you > to tears, it's frustrating you to madness. It's stations play classical > music (not the normal fare of the average working man/woman) and little > else, not because people listen to it, but because NPR thinks it's > "needed." I guess NPR is like our Radio National - which I rarely listen to - but when I do its a bit highbrow and stuffy. But does have the odd gem - that no other station would touch. It only rates 1.5 - 2.0% right across the country. But this is only one of the ABC's six networks. The most successful is their local metro stations in all big cities. Our 3LO is currently the second top station - and that will make the commercial stations take a good look at themselves. Then there's JJJ-FM which is directed at youths - with mostly music and relevant talkback - no commercial station markets to this group as they don't spend enough. Then there's Newsradio - which has taken an AM frequency left behind during the early 90s FM licence auction as AM stations supposedly moved "upstairs" - many paid so much to get the licence that they went broke and had to sell to Clear Channel. Newsradio is a bonus as it's 24/7 news without any commercial interpretation. And it meant that our Federal Parliament (which under the ABC's charter must be on the radio) was thankfully moved from 3LO and the metro stations - where it didn't belong. Then there's Classic-FM which arguably we don't need in Melbourne as a community station does it pretty much as well. But it's a good thing for Adelaide - where it comes from. Finally there's the Regional Network of local stations that cover 98% of the country's listening audience with special bulletins for farmers etc. And this doesn't include Radio Australia - which goes to the world out of Melbourne. All of these stations run on a shoestring and perform a great service. We have an association here called "Friends of the ABC". Many former Premiers and Prime Ministers are members. Most while in office hated the ABC as it can't be bought out like commercial stations. The ABC typically criticises the government of the day - and that is very much its value. Though it is a government instrumentality it has pretty much total independence - and that's the way it should be. > I'm certainly not against non-commercial broadcasting; in fact I > strongly support it. I probably watch PBS more so than any other > network and if WKNO would bring back my BritComs I'd happily send them a > financial contribution :) Indeed the PBS Newshour is very objective. It's on free-to-air (broadcast) here weekdays at 5 pm. You can see the NBC, CBS, and ABC evening 22 min bulletins on cable here and they're not a patch on it. > Yes. I'm afraid of hearing what the Sudan or China thinks about human > rights. I'm afraid of hearing what the liberal parents of John Walker > Lindh think about parenting. I'm afraid of hearing what Alec Baldwin, > who said that Republican congressmen should be stoned, thinks about > peace. I'm afraid of hearing what Michael Jackson thinks about child > safety. I'm afraid of hearing what Sadam Hussein thinks about democracy > or what the Taliban thinks about womens' rights or what David Duke > thinks about black people. I AM afraid of giving credence to these > viewpoints, and you should be too. People are welcome to believe > whatever the wish, but I should be under no obligation to pay for it. Well I'm not! I WANT to hear these things. I'm not going to agree with much but we need to know what other people are thinking and doing. It seems to me that most US television newscasts are very introspective and sensationalist. Frankly I wouldn't be a bit surprised if half the US population think the capital of Australia is Vienna - half have never heard of Australia - and the third half are more worried about the price of KFC. > Because if private enterprise -- which would have a profit motive based > on ad revenue based on the number of listeners -- isn't providing that > service; it probably means that the service would not engage enough > listeners to justify the expense of the operation or the use of the > spectrum. So radio stations only should program to listeners with money??? Otherwise why bother? Maybe this is why US radio is in such a mess. > I believe that the free market is a much better way of delivering a > service to people because it is the only way where individuals can have > some impact on the quality or type of service they are receiving. Yeah - where four FM stations in Melbourne pretty much sound exactly the same and won't take risks - they may lose one ratings point. > This is not to say that the free market is perfect. Obviously, I'm > concerned that the FCC didn't give enough guidance and set a standard > when it came to AM Stereo. Of course, if they had set a standard, there > would probably be lists devoted to disgruntled supporters of the Kahn or > Magnavox systems that think that Motorola's corporate hacks influenced > the FCC to choose C-Quam. Oh if only that had happened!! Seems to be the high up people at the FCC are possibly bent and have big back pockets. > In summation, If limosine liberals want programs about the lifestyles, > beliefs, and culture of affluent elitist members of the Democrat party: > they are welcome to pay for it themselves. Why should I -- or any > taxpayer -- have to subsidize that? So the great man George Dubya Bush is not eletist? Funny that so many syndicated talk programs suck up to him. Tell me - what did he do for a living before he entered politics and decided to head up the free and unfree world? And why didn't he fight in Vietnam? If he was running Australia the ABC would give him heaps! > HOWEVER, public funding no longer makes up a significant part of either > NPR or PBS. In a sense, private enterprise IS providing for these > services because the people that want them are actually paying for them. > As government funding was wisely removed, it was replaced by individual > and charitable funding. That's the way it should be. No - it's just another form of commercialisation. > There seems to be a different attitude that these networks have. If PBS > had "Football Night in the US" (like CBC's "Hockey Night in Canada"), > I'd suspect their viewership would increase dramatically. That having > been said, I HATE sports and popular culture in general and am glad that > PBS's programming is diverse and educational. That's why when I get a > few bucks in my pocket, I'll gladly and VOLUNTARILY donate to a cause I > believe in. Here ABC radio does cover the footy, cricket, Olympics etc. and does a wonderful job. Unfortunately ABC-TV can't afford the TV rights. It's nice that you can afford to donate to stations that you think deserve it. But there's many poor disenfranchised listeners here who would be totally overlooked if it wasn't for our ABC. As I said Governments hate it - but any govt that said it would abolish the ABC would never be re-elected. > That's the way it should be. No - I think radio is dying in America as most people don't like the ridiculous situation of one corporation being allowed to own eight radio stations in any market. And I expect most hate all the syndication. Most want radio to be live and local. And most because of this aren't even willing to spend much on a radio receiver. They would think 'why should I - the way things are?'. Here the ABC - run on a shoestring compared to the commercials - keeps the bastards honest. And its news service is arguably the most respected in our land. This is the way it should be. Ian Proudly Downunder From bjackson@indyradio.com Sat Nov 23 02:48:17 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Nov 2002 10:48:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 57148 invoked from network); 23 Nov 2002 10:48:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Nov 2002 10:48:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Nov 2002 10:48:15 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.157] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 23 Nov 2002 10:48:15 -0000 Date: Sat, 23 Nov 2002 10:48:11 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: AM Stereo modulation & audio processing Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3907 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923" X-Originating-IP: 216.132.129.192 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 When we first put WGLD on the air as oldies (it had been new country), we kept the Aphex processors on for about a week. It really was odd hearing Johnny Rivers & the Beach Boys with bass :-) I really do hate the digital processors...The Omnia is the worst, imho. As far as the clipped CD's go...You're right. As the Bob Orban once said, with FM processing, garbage in, more garbage out. That's why I do sometimes put the compressors in my home system in "bypass" mode. On a recent trip to San Francisco, I picked up some custom remixed disks a club DJ of mine did for me...I don't know what he did...but they sound like crap...no peaks and I think he used single band compression (doesn't work well on techno). Our AC AM Stereo station uses two different CRL processors (one is a stereo preparation processor...not sure about the other)...After Thanksgiving, I'll post the MP3s...Very good audio! -Brad Jackson -Susquehanna Indianapolis -WGLD/WGRL/WFMS --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin T." wrote: > Yes... I remember that "Y-107", the NYC area's now-defunct FM Country > quadracast, had excellent deep bass -- a bit over-boosted if you ask > me, but at least it was clean and undistorted. I later learned that > Y-107 produced this with the same combination of Aphex equipment that > you describe. > > Nowadays in NYC on the FM band, Clear Channel uses the latest digital > Optimods, and Emmis uses the latest digital Omnias... and they all > sound over-processed and distorted. In fact, ABC's 95.5 WPLJ was the > processing leader for decades, with consistently loud, distorted, and > overprocessed audio -- but now, Emmis's "Smooth(ered) Jazz" station, > "CD 101.9", is actually louder on the air, and even more distorted. > > On the AM side, however, I have to compliment 1190 WLIB and 1560 WQEW > (Radio Disney) for having excellent audio -- it is unfortunately not > AM Stereo, but both stations are crisp, clear, and clean. On the > other hand, something has to be out-of-whack at 1010 WINS -- for the > past few months, their audio has been very "peaky", to the point of > becoming unintelligible if you're in one of their nulls. It sounds > like they have a graphic equalizer with the 4 kHz slider at +10 dB > and all other frequency ranges at the normal setting. > > p.s. Back to FM music stations... part of what makes the audio > processing less than enjoyable to listen to is the music they play. > Since the mid-1990s there has been a trend of making CDs as "loud" as > possible -- apparently listener research has given record companies > that idea that people want CDs to sound more like FM radio, rather > than vice-versa, so these days almost every album's audio is run > through agressive multi-band compression and peak clipping (not > limiting; the waveforms are simply *hacked off* on top and bottom, > producing raw square waves) in the mastering process. So, it's like > that right on the CD, and once the audio is trashed in this manner, > it will already sound distorted just listening to it on a plain CD > player, so radio station audio processing can only take part of the > blame in making it sound horrible on the air. > > There is an excellent article on this subject whose URL was too long > to print here without line-wrapping, so I made a quick link to it on > my own server: > > http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/link.htm > > Even some of the more 'dynamic' hit songs of recent, like the > original opera-style version of "To Where You Are" by Josh Groban, > and the soft, jazzy "Don't Know Why" by Norah Jones, are the victims > of this kind of excessively clipped processing. For example on > Norah's song you may hear distortion when she sings the bridge parts, > but that's not all from the FM station's processing -- it is > distorted like that right on the CD! From florida_amstereo@hotmail.com Sat Nov 23 05:27:33 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: florida_amstereo@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Nov 2002 13:27:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 36806 invoked from network); 23 Nov 2002 13:27:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Nov 2002 13:27:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.37.203) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Nov 2002 13:27:32 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 23 Nov 2002 05:27:32 -0800 Received: from 209.240.198.61 by pv2fd.pav2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Sat, 23 Nov 2002 13:27:31 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: NPR and other media Date: Sat, 23 Nov 2002 13:27:31 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 23 Nov 2002 13:27:32.0411 (UTC) FILETIME=[13F230B0:01C292F4] From: "Donn Tillman" X-Originating-IP: [209.240.198.61] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83914824 Bob Carter wrote: >"NPR!..forget it completely!Thats a group that gets so much government >funding on top of donations...a multimillion dollar outfit...and they still broadcast liberal crap. >If they stopped receiving donations from the public and relied on >government funding,programming would remain the same and the only ones that would be hurting would be those sitting in those very well out fitted offices and coming to work driving some car with a name that sounds like a cross between a sneeze and a cow passing gas. >But hey,liberals have never and will never succeed in commerical radio...so they have to beg for money and make you think they are going broke..just so they can try and feed you more garbage on a noncomerical medium. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ I'm not sure what qualifies as success in radio, If it's making a ton of money, then ClearChannel is definitely successful, and I would be willing to be that the ClearChannel's executives don't drive Chevrolet's or Fords. If you mean by success, realizing that the public airwaves are just that and belong to the public collectively. (remember liberals and moderates also pay taxes) then I suppose the non-commercial radio stations are successful. Both the left, middle of the road and the right beg for money to keep operations going. If you think just NPR begs or asks for money then spin your dial to some of the religious stations, they also ask for donations...... I don't have a problem with that, if I like the station I will contribute, if I don't I don't contribute and since I make sure my dial controls and switches are working, I simply change the station or turn the radio off..... a novel concept! :) As a veteran, I support our Constitution and the First Amendment in allowing all points of view ; granted some of the points of view I think are idiotic, but that's what a great democracy is all about. This talk of begging suddenly reminded me of Oral Roberts asking for 7 or 8 milion dollars several years ago, so that he could have a new plane to help spread his radio and tv ministry. I found this amusing, but hey, it's it right to beg and someone here in Florida donated the money to him. (it was tainted money, the donator was a race-track owner, but Oral was gracious and took the money anyway! :) donn st petersburg (where our low was 51° this morning) _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus From florida_amstereo@hotmail.com Sat Nov 23 10:18:38 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: florida_amstereo@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Nov 2002 18:18:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 42648 invoked from network); 23 Nov 2002 18:18:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Nov 2002 18:18:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.37.179) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Nov 2002 18:18:38 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 23 Nov 2002 10:16:22 -0800 Received: from 209.240.198.61 by pv2fd.pav2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Sat, 23 Nov 2002 18:16:20 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: News and the media(reply to gar_fl_62) Date: Sat, 23 Nov 2002 18:16:20 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 23 Nov 2002 18:16:22.0052 (UTC) FILETIME=[6D378E40:01C2931C] From: "Donn Tillman" X-Originating-IP: [209.240.198.61] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83914824 Several days ago; gar_fl_62 wrote: >{"With all that's going on right now, >yesterday's biggest headline was > >Michael Jackson hanging his kid over a balcony? >WHAT? If you want to >find truth anymore, you'll have to do so on the internet.   ~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Actually, I have found that you have to do your homework to find out who is behind the "news" sources, whether it's the internet; print, audio or video media. Some things on the internet disguised as "news" is nothing more than urban legend(s). In the print media, some consider the "Washington Times" a credible source, but they are owned by the Unification Church (the "Moonies"), so if you are depending on them to give you an unbiased story on religions or cults, you may have to wait for hell to freeze over. (no, not Hell, Mi which freezes over at least once a year :) ) When medical studies come out, you have to find out who funded the medical study... i.e. the news this week from Duke University states that the Atkins Diet is the panacea to good The Atkins Foundation. I listen to NPR as well as the other government subsidized radio network, the VOA; their World News Now seems to be pretty even handed; I also listen to the BBC World News on both shortwave and on of our local PBS stations. Also the PBS Newshour (7pm eastern) is very thorough and on each topic of the evening has both speakers from conservative and liberal point of view.(No Michael Jackson on the PBS Newshour, sorry! ) I find it best to gather the information from a variety of sources and then form my own opinion; no one news source (especially FOX with their catchy slogan) holds the patent on the truth. donn st petersburg _________________________________________________________________ Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963 From alinton@esatclear.ie Sat Nov 23 10:32:02 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: alinton@esatclear.ie X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Nov 2002 18:32:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 46196 invoked from network); 23 Nov 2002 18:32:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Nov 2002 18:32:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO davros) (194.165.165.115) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Nov 2002 18:32:00 -0000 Received: from Spooler by davros (Mercury/32 v3.30) ID MO0001C7; 23 Nov 02 18:32:01 -0000 Received: from spooler by totalbroadcast.net (Mercury/32 v3.30); 23 Nov 02 18:31:45 -0000 Received: from fr1.esatclear.ie (192.168.0.1) by davros (Mercury/32 v3.30) with ESMTP ID MG0001C6; 23 Nov 02 18:31:42 -0000 Message-Id: <5.1.1.2.2.20021123183104.0368bdb8@fr1> X-Sender: alinton@fr1 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1.1.3 (Beta) Date: Sat, 23 Nov 2002 18:31:40 +0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Car qrm prob Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed From: Andy Linton X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10800314 X-Yahoo-Profile: alinton1_ie Hi all, I know this is slightly OT, but I bet some of you have some good advice here. Interference in my car on AM. I'm getting a high-pitched crackle, constantly when the engine's running. It doesn't change in pitch in sympathy with the engine revs, but it does alter slightly when I accelerate. It's really annoying. Anyone got any suggestions please? FYI the car is a Honda Prelude, petrol, 2.2L fuel injected. Thanks. ----------------------------------- Andy Linton Waterford, Ireland ************************************************************** Scanned by MailScan Content-Security and Anti-Virus Software. Visit http://www.mwti.net for more info on eScan and MailScan. ************************************************************** From fanfare@globility.com Sat Nov 23 12:11:49 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Nov 2002 20:11:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 13791 invoked from network); 23 Nov 2002 20:11:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Nov 2002 20:11:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.75) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Nov 2002 20:11:48 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.164] by n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 23 Nov 2002 20:11:48 -0000 Date: Sat, 23 Nov 2002 20:11:47 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: An explanation of sorts Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2154 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Marv Southcott" X-Originating-IP: 64.56.235.13 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy I know this is off topic, but there are some things said, that if not refuted quickly, have a tendency to be believed as the truth. Yesterday, it was widely reported by our liberal press, both U.S. and Canadian that an aide to the Canadian Prime Minister's office had uttered a private slight on G.W.. I won't repeat it because it is demeaning and I don't wish to associate myself with it. It certainly does not describe my feeling about the man in any way. However, what I do take exception to is the double standard to which the press seem to apply the right to freedom of speech. In fact, in cases like this, it appears such a right is reserved for only the press. Therefore, anytime anyone of note says something that can be construed as inflammatory, whether it be in context or out, must be reported in the press. No doubt, what was said, or words of similar derogatory intent are, no doubt, shared aloud amongst themselves on many ocassions. Yet we don't see any of those comments being reported as part of the news, let alone to the World as this was. I don't for one moment agree that a responsible public servant, especially one who truly knew better, should not have said what she did, especially within earshot of the press. As I understand, it was a reference used as a habit and thought nothing of it until after she said it. However, being in communications, she no doubt dealt with the press and there could easily be more behind the reporter's motivation to report that a civil servant uttered something non- complimentary in favor of our neighbor's head of state. On its own, it was a stupid, albeit meaningless, comment. However, reported in the press, out of context, it serves as an embarassment for all Canadians, not to mention calling into question the voracity of our Canadian government. All this because a reporter got his rocks off by filing a frivilous story under the guise of the "public's right to know". Unfortunately, the public only has the right to know what the press wishes to tell it. The lady tendered her resignation, but it was refused. Thank you for your indulgence. Marv From fanfare@globility.com Sat Nov 23 12:56:18 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Nov 2002 20:56:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 53261 invoked from network); 23 Nov 2002 20:56:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Nov 2002 20:56:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.75) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Nov 2002 20:56:16 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.185] by n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 23 Nov 2002 20:56:15 -0000 Date: Sat, 23 Nov 2002 20:56:15 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: An explanation of sorts Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2154 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Marv Southcott" X-Originating-IP: 64.56.235.13 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy I know this is off topic, but there are some things said, that if not refuted quickly, have a tendency to be believed as the truth. Yesterday, it was widely reported by our liberal press, both U.S. and Canadian that an aide to the Canadian Prime Minister's office had uttered a private slight on G.W.. I won't repeat it because it is demeaning and I don't wish to associate myself with it. It certainly does not describe my feeling about the man in any way. However, what I do take exception to is the double standard to which the press seem to apply the right to freedom of speech. In fact, in cases like this, it appears such a right is reserved for only the press. Therefore, anytime anyone of note says something that can be construed as inflammatory, whether it be in context or out, must be reported in the press. No doubt, what was said, or words of similar derogatory intent are, no doubt, shared aloud amongst themselves on many ocassions. Yet we don't see any of those comments being reported as part of the news, let alone to the World as this was. I don't for one moment agree that a responsible public servant, especially one who truly knew better, should not have said what she did, especially within earshot of the press. As I understand, it was a reference used as a habit and thought nothing of it until after she said it. However, being in communications, she no doubt dealt with the press and there could easily be more behind the reporter's motivation to report that a civil servant uttered something non- complimentary in favor of our neighbor's head of state. On its own, it was a stupid, albeit meaningless, comment. However, reported in the press, out of context, it serves as an embarassment for all Canadians, not to mention calling into question the voracity of our Canadian government. All this because a reporter got his rocks off by filing a frivilous story under the guise of the "public's right to know". Unfortunately, the public only has the right to know what the press wishes to tell it. The lady tendered her resignation, but it was refused. Thank you for your indulgence. Marv From fanfare@globility.com Sat Nov 23 13:03:21 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Nov 2002 21:03:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 28074 invoked from network); 23 Nov 2002 21:03:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Nov 2002 21:03:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Nov 2002 21:03:21 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.163] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 23 Nov 2002 21:03:21 -0000 Date: Sat, 23 Nov 2002 21:03:18 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: An explanation of sorts Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 577 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Marv Southcott" X-Originating-IP: 64.56.235.13 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Marv Southcott" wrote: > I know this is off topic, but there are some things said, that if not > refuted quickly, have a tendency to be believed as the truth. > > I have no idea how or why this message got sent twice. There've been some weird happenings with respect to the Yahoo "groups" servers lately. In any event, if anyone has any interest in reading an account of that on which I had mounted my soapbox, here is the URL; http://www.nationalpost.com/utilities/story.html?id={E4BFA25A-3CB6- 4F9A-AF3F-07125D2A9D1E} M. From stodd@sherbtel.net Sat Nov 23 13:52:45 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Nov 2002 21:52:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 10837 invoked from network); 23 Nov 2002 21:52:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Nov 2002 21:52:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Nov 2002 21:52:44 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-118.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.118]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gANLqeN2021633 for ; Sat, 23 Nov 2002 15:52:42 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <001701c2933a$b49a6a00$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF}Both ams & Cris Cuff are still alive Date: Sat, 23 Nov 2002 15:53:03 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude There's a message board for people that like this classic and high end audio gear, IIRC it's called the Audio Asylum. They have message boards for several different catagories. Don't recall the url offhand, but I found it with a Google search. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: Michael J. Richard > I'm sure that Pioneer.....like all electronics manufacturers will tell me > "this unit needs to be serviced by an authorized Pioneer service dealer." > Don't know if I could "find" an "authorized pioneer service center" and have > them get the card for me and sell it to me. > That's why I was asking for suggestions or maybe even a starting point on > where to find somewhere that I could get this card. From tampagar@webtv.net Sat Nov 23 14:07:27 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: tampagar@webtv.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Nov 2002 22:07:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 71031 invoked from network); 23 Nov 2002 22:07:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Nov 2002 22:07:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Nov 2002 22:07:26 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.152] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 23 Nov 2002 22:07:26 -0000 Date: Sat, 23 Nov 2002 22:07:24 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: OT: An explanation of sorts Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1297 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "gar_fla_62" X-Originating-IP: 209.240.198.61 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=102439005 X-Yahoo-Profile: gar_fla_62 While I'll agree the media has a slight slant to the left, that's irrelevant to the more serious fact that the mass media is controlled and anything but the "free press" most are still under the illusion of. With all the important events happening in which have a genuine impact on our lives, the @ss media keeps the masses focused on O J, Monica, Ellian Gonzalez, car chases, shark attacks, kidnappings, etc. MSNBC's "question of the day" yesterday was something like "Has Michael Jackson Gone Too Far? Pllleeease! If the media maybe focused on the truth for a change, any thinking person (and there's not many of them) would probably have trouble sleeping at night. It wasn't that long ago when you could at least tune down the AM dial and hear some honest opinions being expressed. Most everything now is so sanitized of anything that may actually make you think", it's a friggin joke and it's NO accident. And BTW, nobody needs to say anything demeaning about G.W. Bush. He does a good enough job of that on his own. Don't get me wrong. I disliked Clinton just as much. Republican or Democrat, it doesn't matter because both sides are sell outs to a failing system and each do their fair share of crapping on the Constitution... (Sorry for the long reply to an OT post. Just had to vent.) From tampagar@webtv.net Sat Nov 23 14:15:50 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: tampagar@webtv.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Nov 2002 22:15:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 94318 invoked from network); 23 Nov 2002 22:15:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Nov 2002 22:15:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.78) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Nov 2002 22:15:50 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.155] by n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 23 Nov 2002 22:15:49 -0000 Date: Sat, 23 Nov 2002 22:15:49 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Streaming Media (was: Remote Links) Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 291 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "gar_fla_62" X-Originating-IP: 209.240.198.61 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=102439005 X-Yahoo-Profile: gar_fla_62 What ever happened to streaming media from US radio stations? The first couple of years I had internet access (1999-2001), I used to love listening to stations from other parts of the country. In a way, it was like DXing. With few rare exceptions, this suddenly became a thing of the past. From stodd@sherbtel.net Sat Nov 23 14:18:43 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Nov 2002 22:18:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 98021 invoked from network); 23 Nov 2002 22:18:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Nov 2002 22:18:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Nov 2002 22:18:43 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-118.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.118]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gANMIdN2023861 for ; Sat, 23 Nov 2002 16:18:40 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <005701c2933e$55cf4e60$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Yahoo! miscues - OT Date: Sat, 23 Nov 2002 16:19:02 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude So many on this list want to treat syndication as something that got big because of the Telecom act of 96. The real culprit was docket 80-90 from the early 80s which created a whole new bunch of (mostly) suburban FM stations. A lot of AMs were going dark as markets couldn't support all the stations available, and could only have been resurrected because of the low cost of syndication. Then Reagan stepped in and allowed duopolies, which allowed for better economy of scale, also saving a lot of smaller AMs, and in some cases, smaller FMs. BTW Ian, talk radio is about the only medium on the conservative side here. TV news, virtually all the major newspapers, the Hollywood left, all have it in for the Bush administration. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: Ian Davidson > No - I think radio is dying in America as most people don't like the > ridiculous situation of one corporation being allowed to own eight radio > stations in any market. And I expect most hate all the syndication. Most > want radio to be live and local. > From stodd@sherbtel.net Sat Nov 23 14:25:21 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Nov 2002 22:25:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 68263 invoked from network); 23 Nov 2002 22:25:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Nov 2002 22:25:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Nov 2002 22:25:20 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-118.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.118]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gANMPHN2024381 for ; Sat, 23 Nov 2002 16:25:18 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <006a01c2933f$42fe9b00$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <004001c2927c$f2637700$0101a8c0@pavilion> Subject: Re: {AMSF} MJR- I have decoders Date: Sat, 23 Nov 2002 16:25:40 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude I've got a way- don't necessarily "make" the radios. How about putting together some instructions and sell it as a kit for those of us willing to save you the time? Scott PS- how much will they be, premade or not? ----- Original Message ----- From: Christopher Cuff > I am also going to "try" and make up a batch of my walkmans... I just have > to figure out a way to do without sleep..... From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Nov 23 15:25:02 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Nov 2002 23:25:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 26570 invoked from network); 23 Nov 2002 23:25:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Nov 2002 23:25:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.67) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Nov 2002 23:25:01 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.135] by n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 23 Nov 2002 23:25:01 -0000 Date: Sat, 23 Nov 2002 23:25:01 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: 1250 WMTR back in AM Stereo Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1984 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.83.20 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics I am happy to report that for the first time since the spring of '99, 1250 WMTR in Morristown, NJ is once again transmitting an AM Stereo signal. I actually first noticed it today after sunset, when they were on their 1000 watt nighttime power (as compared to 5000 watts daytime). Their nighttime signal isn't very strong or stable here, but both my Chrysler AMAX radio and my Panasonic walkman (Japanese import) lock onto Stereo mode when I tune in 1250, and stay in Stereo until the signal becomes too weak or unstable to receive the pilot. So far I haven't heard any true Stereo sound in their music, but I know the Stereo indication from them is not "falsing" because the Chrysler radio uses the MC13022 chip with its "Noise Immune Pilot Detector" which *never* falses, since it only responds to a pilot tone of *exactly* 25 Hz (not even a 24 or 26 Hz tone will trigger it!). Meanwhile, I got some excellent demo recordings of 1680 WTTM in glorious AMAX Stereo, on their *nighttime* signal which still comes in very clearly as compared to their 10,000-watt daytime signal. Also, I have a whole Dolby C cassette full of 1170 WWTR broadcasting some of the finest Mono AMAX sound I have ever heard, and thanks to my recently installed CD-R burner, I am now ready to create the first Mono AMAX demo CD for distribution to receiver manufacturers, stations, listeners, and even iBiquity corporation! p.s. Speaking of the CD burner drive... it claims "48X" speed when reading CDs, but this high speed is actually a large detriment when trying to read old scratched-up CDs, especially on the outer tracks. It just goes haywire when trying to play some of my less-than-perfect audio CDs. Is true that the LOWER the speed of the CD-ROM (or CD-RW) drive, the better it works at reading scratched CDs with no trouble! In comparison, my single-speed (1X) CD-ROM drive will play through the same audio CDs with absolutely no trouble... not even a single skip! From don@idpt.com Sat Nov 23 15:53:41 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: don@idpt.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Nov 2002 23:53:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 94598 invoked from network); 23 Nov 2002 23:53:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Nov 2002 23:53:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout3-eri1.midsouth.rr.com) (24.165.200.8) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Nov 2002 23:53:40 -0000 Received: from primary (cpe-024-024-118-043.midsouth.rr.com [24.24.118.43]) by mailout3-eri1.midsouth.rr.com (8.11.4/8.11.4) with ESMTP id gANNrda07102 for ; Sat, 23 Nov 2002 17:53:40 -0600 (CST) To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} Re: Streaming Media (was: Remote Links) Date: Sat, 23 Nov 2002 17:53:36 -0600 Message-ID: <000401c2934b$8d199710$0202a8c0@primary> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2616 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Don Johnson" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=32705644 X-Yahoo-Profile: htmldon A lot of it was because of the controversy over streaming advertisements. Voice talent wanted more money if their ads were going to be broadcast online. Also, big sports like MLB wanted an additional cut if their games were going to be simulcast online. Clear Channel pulled all of their stations offline quoting that reason. Now, most of the stations that simulcast online have to have special filters that blank out their ads. It's the same with TV stations that have their newscasts online. Several stations, such as WSVN in Miami, have their outdoor cameras cut in whenever an ad is about to come on. It was very angering to me too -- I liked to listen to Rush Limbaugh on WJR's online stream rather than my local station because it sounded a lot better. WJR used a very good (I think it was 32k) Real Audio stream that sounded great. Now WJR has cut off their streaming audio, but my local Clear Channel drone has it. Unfortunately, they are using a plugin called HiWire and a Windows Media codec. It has decent low-frequency response, but it has a horrible twang and sounds a lot like IBOC. If you're going to stream to the masses, Real Audio is the only way to go -- it sounds decent even at 16k. _________________ Don Johnson don@donjohnson.org -----Original Message----- From: gar_fla_62 [mailto:tampagar@webtv.net] Sent: Saturday, November 23, 2002 4:16 PM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: Streaming Media (was: Remote Links) What ever happened to streaming media from US radio stations? The first couple of years I had internet access (1999-2001), I used to love listening to stations from other parts of the country. In a way, it was like DXing. With few rare exceptions, this suddenly became a thing of the past. Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From bjackson@indyradio.com Sat Nov 23 15:55:28 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Nov 2002 23:55:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 76167 invoked from network); 23 Nov 2002 23:55:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Nov 2002 23:55:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Nov 2002 23:55:27 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.252] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 23 Nov 2002 23:55:27 -0000 Date: Sat, 23 Nov 2002 23:55:24 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Streaming Media (was: Remote Links) Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 735 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923" X-Originating-IP: 216.132.129.192 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 --- In amstereoforum@y..., "gar_fla_62" wrote: > What ever happened to streaming media from US radio stations? The first couple of years I had internet access (1999-2001), I used to love listening to stations from other parts of the country. In a way, it was like DXing. With few rare exceptions, this suddenly became a thing of the past. There were a couple of different reasons. 1) You can't really make any money from the net feed, but it's very expensive. 2) The unions want extra $$$ if you stream their spots (We mute all of our commercial breaks on our sites...indyradio.com) 3) And don't forget the RIAA wants $$$ for streaming music now. -Brad Jackson -Susquehanna Indianapolis -WGLD/WGRL/WFMS From amstereo@optushome.com.au Sat Nov 23 16:44:07 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereo@optushome.com.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Nov 2002 00:44:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 34550 invoked from network); 24 Nov 2002 00:44:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Nov 2002 00:44:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail010.syd.optusnet.com.au) (210.49.20.138) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Nov 2002 00:44:06 -0000 Received: from unit (c17302.ipswc1.qld.optusnet.com.au [210.49.44.162]) by mail010.syd.optusnet.com.au (8.11.1/8.11.1) with SMTP id gAO0i5F08810 for ; Sun, 24 Nov 2002 11:44:05 +1100 Message-ID: <000e01c29352$977fc650$1a02a8c0@unit> To: References: <1038061894.2006.48833.m12@yahoogroups.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF}Both ams & Cris Cuff are still alive Date: Sun, 24 Nov 2002 10:44:05 +1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1123 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1123 From: "amstereo - matt2" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=105920058 X-Yahoo-Profile: voltar_e You can replace that pin (that has been broken off) by using a conductive pen and trace the pin back to where it should be. it should work in your situation asong as the chip isn't dead From bd6xray@lycos.com Sat Nov 23 17:45:23 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: bd6xray@lycos.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Nov 2002 01:45:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 71372 invoked from network); 24 Nov 2002 01:45:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Nov 2002 01:45:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.67) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Nov 2002 01:45:21 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.155] by n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 24 Nov 2002 01:45:21 -0000 Date: Sun, 24 Nov 2002 01:45:19 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Car qrm prob Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <5.1.1.2.2.20021123183104.0368bdb8@fr1> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 913 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bd6xray" X-Originating-IP: 205.188.209.76 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83174981 X-Yahoo-Profile: bd6xray Sounds like the electric fuel pump. Al Hajny --- In amstereoforum@y..., Andy Linton wrote: > Hi all, > > I know this is slightly OT, but I bet some of you have some good advice here. > > Interference in my car on AM. I'm getting a high-pitched crackle, > constantly when the engine's running. It doesn't change in pitch in > sympathy with the engine revs, but it does alter slightly when I accelerate. > > It's really annoying. Anyone got any suggestions please? > > FYI the car is a Honda Prelude, petrol, 2.2L fuel injected. > > Thanks. > > ----------------------------------- > Andy Linton > Waterford, Ireland > > ************************************************************** > Scanned by MailScan Content-Security and Anti-Virus Software. > Visit http://www.mwti.net for more info on eScan and MailScan. > ************************************************************** From KC4QLP@aol.com Sat Nov 23 19:28:20 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Nov 2002 03:28:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 99943 invoked from network); 24 Nov 2002 03:28:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Nov 2002 03:28:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m05.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.8) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Nov 2002 03:28:18 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.194.10b3d2c8 (1320) for ; Sat, 23 Nov 2002 22:28:15 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <194.10b3d2c8.2b11a14f@aol.com> Date: Sat, 23 Nov 2002 22:28:15 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Streaming Media (was: Remote Links) To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 11/23/02 5:16:11 PM Eastern Standard Time, tampagar@webtv.net writes: << What ever happened to streaming media from US radio stations? The first couple of years I had internet access (1999-2001), I used to love listening to stations from other parts of the country. In a way, it was like DXing. With few rare exceptions, this suddenly became a thing of the past. >> What happened? ...its called RIAA and the so called copywrite and pay to play deal. Honestly the RIAA needs to hold out one hand to accept cash and squat on the other hand and see which one fills up first! Bunch of damn crooks! Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From tampagar@webtv.net Sat Nov 23 19:44:52 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: tampagar@webtv.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Nov 2002 03:44:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 97794 invoked from network); 24 Nov 2002 03:44:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Nov 2002 03:44:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Nov 2002 03:44:51 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.174] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 24 Nov 2002 03:44:51 -0000 Date: Sun, 24 Nov 2002 03:44:48 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Streaming Media (was: Remote Links) Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 580 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "gar_fla_62" X-Originating-IP: 209.240.198.61 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=102439005 X-Yahoo-Profile: gar_fla_62 I figured the stopping of web radio broadcasts had something to do with $$$$ but didn't know the exact details. Thanks for clearing that up. Being that I'm from Jersey, I used to like listening to the web broadcast of New Jersey 101.5 (WKXW FM). They're unique in not only being an FM talk station during the week but they also switched to an all music format (oldies) on weekends that had the old top 40 AM feel to it. The station ID featured the classic "bell chime" that was heard on 77 Music Radio WABC during the late 60s and early 70s. It just goes to show that AM rules! From KC4QLP@aol.com Sat Nov 23 19:57:15 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Nov 2002 03:57:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 2397 invoked from network); 24 Nov 2002 03:57:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Nov 2002 03:57:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m09.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.164) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Nov 2002 03:57:14 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m09.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.c1.2aae6836 (1320) for ; Sat, 23 Nov 2002 22:57:05 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Sat, 23 Nov 2002 22:57:04 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Streaming Media (was: Remote Links) To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 11/23/02 10:46:45 PM Eastern Standard Time, tampagar@webtv.net writes: << I figured the stopping of web radio broadcasts had something to do with $$$$ but didn't know the exact details. Thanks for clearing that up. Being that I'm from Jersey, I used to like listening to the web broadcast of New Jersey 101.5 (WKXW FM). They're unique in not only being an FM talk station during the week but they also switched to an all music format (oldies) on weekends that had the old top 40 AM feel to it. The station ID featured the classic "bell chime" that was heard on 77 Music Radio WABC during the late 60s and early 70s. It just goes to show that AM rules! >> Well there are still quite a few of us web broadcasters out here ...My webstream of NewsRadio 560 WGAI AM Stereo gets in the neighborhood of 200 to 300 listeners total during any given day ..peek listening time from 9am til 4pm. ....not bad for a dial-up on shoutcast. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Sat Nov 23 22:02:33 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Nov 2002 06:02:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 71918 invoked from network); 24 Nov 2002 06:02:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Nov 2002 06:02:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14204.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.146) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Nov 2002 06:02:31 -0000 Message-ID: <20021124060231.16655.qmail@web14204.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [65.221.47.68] by web14204.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 23 Nov 2002 22:02:31 PST Date: Sat, 23 Nov 2002 22:02:31 -0800 (PST) Subject: Another Decent Engineer! To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio Brad Jackson wrote: "WZZB 1390... still runs an AC format...Promotes itself on the air as AM Stereo, and AFAIK is the last Susquehanna station to run AM Stereo. -Brad Jackson -Susquehanna, Indianapolis -WGLD/WGRL/WFMS" Let's hear it for Brad - another engineer who cares about high quality audio from one of his stations, and broadcasts in Stereo AM. Thanks Brad! Is there anything our team here can do to help with your AMS station? __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus – Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From bjackson@indyradio.com Sat Nov 23 22:36:27 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Nov 2002 06:36:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 60655 invoked from network); 24 Nov 2002 06:36:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Nov 2002 06:36:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Nov 2002 06:36:27 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.163] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 24 Nov 2002 06:36:27 -0000 Date: Sun, 24 Nov 2002 06:36:24 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Another Decent Engineer! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20021124060231.16655.qmail@web14204.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 819 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923" X-Originating-IP: 64.25.100.1 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 Actually, I'm not an engineer (but I can play one with an Optimod=20 key). I'm the morning producer for WFMS and on-air with WGLD and WGRL. But, we've got some kick a** engineers who do care about audio and AM=20 Stereo. Kind of odd that Susquehanna supports IBOC as a company=20 policy...but the engineers don't ;-) -Brad Jackson -Susquehanna Indianapolis -WGLD/WGRL/WFMS --- In amstereoforum@y..., "John P." wrote: > Let's hear it for Brad - another engineer who cares about high=20 quality audio > from one of his stations, and broadcasts in Stereo AM. Thanks Brad! > Is there anything our team here can do to help with your AMS=20 station? >=20 > __________________________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Mail Plus =96 Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. > http://mailplus.yahoo.com From michaelj@vcn.com Sat Nov 23 23:49:41 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Nov 2002 07:49:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 62158 invoked from network); 24 Nov 2002 07:49:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Nov 2002 07:49:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m2-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.32) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Nov 2002 07:49:40 -0000 Received: from michaelj (vcn71.usrtc-1.evan.wy.vcn.com [209.193.86.75]) by m2-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Sun, 24 Nov 2002 00:49:40 -0700 Message-ID: <007301c2938d$aa67db00$4b56c1d1@mshome.net> To: References: <194.10b3d2c8.2b11a14f@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Streaming Media (was: Remote Links) Date: Sun, 24 Nov 2002 00:46:56 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Took the words right out of my mouth, Bob! Them charging for a station to stream over the internet is like charging people who DX to listen to a station very far away. I say it's the same principle. By streaming on the internet, we are only allowing more people to hear our signal.....just as if we would have increased our power......or if that distant listener had just bought a super duper high power antenna that allowed them to pick up stations further away. That is all. Period. It's got nothing to do with distributing music for free, and US as radio stations pay annually THROUGH THE NOSE to play the music we do. Why won't they just leave us alone????? Michael J. Richard PD / Technician - KEVA AM Stereo 1240 Evanston, WY ----- Original Message ----- From: KC4QLP@aol.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, November 23, 2002 8:28 PM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Streaming Media (was: Remote Links) What happened? ...its called RIAA and the so called copywrite and pay to play deal. Honestly the RIAA needs to hold out one hand to accept cash and squat on the other hand and see which one fills up first! Bunch of damn crooks! Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From michaelj@vcn.com Sun Nov 24 00:00:12 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Nov 2002 08:00:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 57384 invoked from network); 24 Nov 2002 08:00:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Nov 2002 08:00:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m2-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.32) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Nov 2002 08:00:12 -0000 Received: from michaelj (vcn71.usrtc-1.evan.wy.vcn.com [209.193.86.75]) by m2-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Sun, 24 Nov 2002 01:00:11 -0700 Message-ID: <00ff01c2938f$233864e0$4b56c1d1@mshome.net> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: AM Stereo modulation & audio processing Date: Sun, 24 Nov 2002 00:57:28 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I bet the other CRL processor is the AM Stereo Matrix processor. Those are the two that I have here at KEVA AM Stereo 1240. Those two are it. Along with the Motorola Exciter, that is :) I love the sound too. Nice and clean and not squashed-sounding. Not bad for 20 year old processors ! MJR n WYO Our AC AM Stereo station uses two different CRL processors (one is a stereo preparation processor...not sure about the other)...After Thanksgiving, I'll post the MP3s...Very good audio! -Brad Jackson -Susquehanna Indianapolis -WGLD/WGRL/WFMS [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From groucho@skyweb.net Sun Nov 24 00:44:21 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Nov 2002 08:44:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 19891 invoked from network); 24 Nov 2002 08:44:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Nov 2002 08:44:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Nov 2002 08:44:21 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gAO8mRed000300 for ; Sun, 24 Nov 2002 03:48:27 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DE09149.268C6A40@skyweb.net> Date: Sun, 24 Nov 2002 03:43:53 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Streaming Media (was: Remote Links) References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 WTTM is streaming on the Net however.... you must be a subscriber For a mear $2 a month... Its worth it. just about pays the internet connection cost and streaming fees.. KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 11/23/02 10:46:45 PM Eastern Standard Time, > tampagar@webtv.net writes: > > << I figured the stopping of web radio broadcasts had something to do with > $$$$ but didn't know the exact details. Thanks for clearing that up. Being > that I'm from Jersey, I used to like listening to the web broadcast of New > Jersey 101.5 (WKXW FM). They're unique in not only being an FM talk station > during the week but they also switched to an all music format (oldies) on > weekends that had the old top 40 AM feel to it. The station ID featured the > classic "bell chime" that was heard on 77 Music Radio WABC during the late > 60s and early 70s. It just goes to show that AM rules! >> > > Well there are still quite a few of us web broadcasters out here ...My > webstream of NewsRadio 560 WGAI AM Stereo gets in the neighborhood of 200 to > 300 listeners total during any given day ..peek listening time from 9am til > 4pm. > ....not bad for a dial-up on shoutcast. > > Bob Carter > Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group > > WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 > Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 > > Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering > services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. > e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net > http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice > Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC > WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC > WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC > Ray Communications Radio Network > > AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- > amstereo-subcribe@topica.com > > KC4QLP Amateur Radio > Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va > www.kc4qlp.cjb.net > > voice contact-252-335-0856 > fax 1-209-254-8978 > _______________________________________________________ > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From groucho@skyweb.net Sun Nov 24 00:51:07 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Nov 2002 08:51:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 43515 invoked from network); 24 Nov 2002 08:51:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Nov 2002 08:51:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Nov 2002 08:51:06 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gAO8tCed001428 for ; Sun, 24 Nov 2002 03:55:13 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DE092DE.3AE0EBE@skyweb.net> Date: Sun, 24 Nov 2002 03:50:38 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Another Decent Engineer! References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 That's a funny statement.. Because after talking with My boss the other day Just before taking a visit to a friend at Ibiquity. I got that same feeling when he stated... we want to keep an open relationship with Ibiquity don't make waves but let them know about our Concern of interference with your station.. then the fit hit the shan...... Neal > . Kind of odd that Susquehanna supports IBOC as a company > policy...but the engineers don't ;-) > > -Brad Jackson > -Susquehanna Indianapolis > -WGLD/WGRL/WFMS > > --- In amstereoforum@y..., "John P." wrote: > > Let's hear it for Brad - another engineer who cares about high > quality audio > > from one of his stations, and broadcasts in Stereo AM. Thanks Brad! > > Is there anything our team here can do to help with your AMS > station? > > > > __________________________________________________ > > Do you Yahoo!? > > Yahoo! Mail Plus – Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. > > http://mailplus.yahoo.com > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From alfredot@inetarena.com Sun Nov 24 02:20:21 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: alfredot@inetarena.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Nov 2002 10:20:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 66987 invoked from network); 24 Nov 2002 10:20:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Nov 2002 10:20:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.inetarena.com) (206.129.216.13) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Nov 2002 10:20:21 -0000 Received: from hendrie (1Cust58.tnt15.beaverton.or.da.uu.net [67.227.162.58]) by mail.inetarena.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id gAOAIGT25311 for ; Sun, 24 Nov 2002 02:18:16 -0800 (PST) Date: Sun, 24 Nov 2002 02:19:56 -0800 (PST) X-Sender: alfredo@hendrie.1610am.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: AM Stereo modulation & audio processing In-Reply-To: <1038061894.2006.48833.m12@yahoogroups.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: "Alfredo E. Torrejon" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=25132238 X-Yahoo-Profile: alfredotorrejon After some audio purists made noise on rec.radio.broadcasting regarding audio processing, someone made a really brilliant statement: "Keep the compression UP! Keep the distortion DOWN!" A few years ago, I was at a university radio station that, for a long time had had an engineer who was a purist. He believed that radio stations should strive to present audio source material as accurately as possible. The processing used was an Optimod 8000 with the release time set to maximum and the input gain set low so that the limiter seldom engaged. However, I and another engineer, Brian, disagreed. We felt that the combination of our "quiet" on-air sound, and the lack of deep bass or super-sparkly highs gave the perception that we were too poor to afford better equipment. After working a summer internship with McIntosh Labs, Brian brought me some engineering samples of Analog Devices's SSM2120 audio processor ICs (sadly, these are out of production today). As I looked at the data sheet and saw the performance claims and ease of use of these ICs, the idea hit me: These chips should go into a multiband compressor! As a tradeoff between circuit complexity and flexibility, I settled on four bands, rather than the more standard five. To make a long story short, I built two prototype units, and one went into the airchain at our station during winter break in 1997. With the help of one of our senior producers, I adjusted the compressor for a good on-air sound. Using the compressor ehanced the punchiness of the bass and the sparkliness of the highs without adding any noticeable distortion or pumping. Flipping around the dial, we sounded about as loud as the other radio stations. The on-air staff and even listeners noted the difference, and all the feedback that I received was favorable. However, I have heard a lot of complete *crap* processing and sloppy airchains in every place that I've lived or visited. Neither FM nor AM is safe, and in my opinion, I've heard too many badly processed stations to begin listing 'em all! One of the engineers here takes it as gospel that AM stations must cut the highs and some of the bass from their audio because that's the way to process audio for "the vast majority of radios that people use." Some months ago, he started working at KXL 750 AM, and within a few weeks, he had the station's audio sounding like a Real Audio stream, complete with artifacts. Then there's KUIK 1360, which sounds like it is using very agressive AGC after the microwave STL; when someone is talking--especially if they pause a lot--the AGC picks up the STL noise. Hisssssss. With FM, it's really interesting to place an oscilloscope at the demodulator output of just an ordinary FM stereo tuner. Doing this gives a lot of insight into what's being heard. Some stations use heavy composite clipping, such as classic rocker 92.3 KGON. The waveform out of the demodulator looks rounded off (due to the clipping), and the station has a grungy, distorted sound, like an old record being played with a worn out needle. Others use multiband clipping so that some parts of the audio spectrum end up more distorted than others. For instance, 99.5 KWJJ runs heavy clipping on the bass, which makes the bass notes sound crunchy, and on the scope, one can see low-frequency square waves running along with the rest of the audio. I've heard some FMs, which run so much clipping on the treble that high-hat cymbals sound more like bags of broken glass; unfortunately, I haven't had a chance to look at their waveforms. Alfredo From ccuff@in4web.com Sun Nov 24 04:15:50 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Nov 2002 12:15:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 84524 invoked from network); 24 Nov 2002 12:15:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Nov 2002 12:15:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Nov 2002 12:15:49 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.43]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id ; Sun, 24 Nov 2002 07:10:11 -0500 Message-ID: <000201c293b2$09ed3ec0$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: Cc: Subject: Alfredo Lite updates Date: Sun, 24 Nov 2002 07:06:22 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 I have discovered a tip for any of you that have my little tranmitters.(This fix has been already done in the last 10 or so that have been sent out) Please look at the coils in the RF section- there are 4 in the RF1 area(some also have 4 more on the trace side of the board), and 2 in the RF2 area- These look like little blue resistors. The 4 in the RF1 area are 68uH (Blue Grey Black Gold color code) The 2 in the RF 2 area are 270 uH (Red, violet, brown, gold) MAKE SURE they are all going in the same direction- otherwise, they oppose each other and can effect the output range. They end up acting like traps! I also discovered a great way to make a cheap, excellent antenna- Darwin covered part of this a while back, but here goes: Take an old ferrite antenna out of a transistor radio- there will be 4 wires on it- use the wires with the higher resistance to them (this is the RF section) Make sure that you have a ground connected. I use the cold water pipe to the washer- whatever... Now, Put this loopstick in series with the transmitter output and a standard car radio rod anenna. Set up a radio outside, up loud so you can hear it- (I used a modified Memorex boomball) Now, slide the coil on the loopstick SLOWLY and listen- all of a sudden, the radio will kick into turbodrive- you have hit reasonance! I didn't stop there, however.... I then took a length of INSULATED wire, wrapped 10 turns around the rod of the car radio antenna I use for transmitting, and put the other end of this wire straight into the hot side of an AC outlet. (Make DAMN sure that this wire is insulated!!- NO electrical connection at all!) Readjusted the ferrite for reasonance, and holy shirt! - A combo carrier current/ air RF system. Audio was clean as a whistle all over the house and beyond.... :-) Chris From ccuff@in4web.com Sun Nov 24 04:37:54 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Nov 2002 12:37:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 20133 invoked from network); 24 Nov 2002 12:37:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Nov 2002 12:37:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Nov 2002 12:37:53 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.43]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Sun, 24 Nov 2002 07:32:15 -0500 Message-ID: <002301c293b5$1f57b300$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: Subject: radio kits Date: Sun, 24 Nov 2002 07:29:23 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 Scott, that is not a bad idea at all- It would be FAR easier for me to do kits. I already have the instructions and photo work done from when Down Unders Silicon Chip magazine was interested- but that fell through because he didn't like the SMD parts. As well, he didn't like the parts on both sides of the circuit board- well, too freaking bad- "I" like it the way it is! SMD is not that bad- I actually LIKE it!- as long as you do as I do, and use a pair of strong reading glasses to see up close, it is a piece of cake. BTW- the kits will have to sell for $50.00 each- No way I can do them any less. I will make up about 25 kits and put some on ebay, some for any of you that want to try them... (I have 500 already plated boards, so I can do plenty) stay tuned! CC From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Sun Nov 24 04:59:24 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Nov 2002 12:59:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 92018 invoked from network); 24 Nov 2002 12:59:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Nov 2002 12:59:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf12bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.52) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Nov 2002 12:59:23 -0000 Received: from juan ([67.34.22.44]) by imf12bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.19 201-253-122-122-119-20020516) with SMTP id <20021124130111.FHPQ22698.imf12bis.bellsouth.net@juan> for ; Sun, 24 Nov 2002 08:01:11 -0500 Message-ID: <001701c293b9$51a02dc0$af78fea9@juan> To: References: <000201c293b2$09ed3ec0$0101a8c0@pavilion> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Alfredo Lite updates Date: Sun, 24 Nov 2002 07:59:26 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Thanks Chris, I just checked mine, and they are NOT going in the same direction. Let's just hope my hand is steady enough to do the task. Soldering work does not come easy for me :-( Thanks again ! Juan I have discovered a tip for any of you that have my little tranmitters.(This fix has been already done in the last 10 or so that have been sent out) Please look at the coils in the RF section- there are 4 in the RF1 area(some also have 4 more on the trace side of the board), and 2 in the RF2 area- These look like little blue resistors. The 4 in the RF1 area are 68uH (Blue Grey Black Gold color code) The 2 in the RF 2 area are 270 uH (Red, violet, brown, gold) MAKE SURE they are all going in the same direction- otherwise, they oppose each other and can effect the output range. They end up acting like traps! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From spfleck@citlink.net Sun Nov 24 05:01:05 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: spfleck@citlink.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Nov 2002 13:01:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 1374 invoked from network); 24 Nov 2002 13:01:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Nov 2002 13:01:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO relay01.roc.frontiernet.net) (66.133.131.34) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Nov 2002 13:01:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 24187 invoked from network); 24 Nov 2002 13:01:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO Steve) ([170.215.241.103]) (envelope-sender ) by relay01.roc.frontiernet.net (qmail-ldap-1.03) with SMTP for ; 24 Nov 2002 13:01:04 -0000 Message-ID: <02f801c293b9$8bc26180$01c8a8c0@N2UBP> To: References: <1038133223.1793.66994.m12@yahoogroups.com> Subject: automotive noise Date: Sun, 24 Nov 2002 08:01:03 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Steve Fleckenstein" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=2988995 X-Yahoo-Profile: n2ubp noise... check ground bonding on the hood.. If that doesn't help verify antenna connections are okay.. then check other stuff by turning off and on various other devices in car like A/C. etc. I had a ford that where AM would quiet down only when A/C was on. Could be fuel pump. Steve From ccuff@in4web.com Sun Nov 24 07:10:13 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Nov 2002 15:10:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 24820 invoked from network); 24 Nov 2002 15:10:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Nov 2002 15:10:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Nov 2002 15:10:12 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.80]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Sun, 24 Nov 2002 10:04:31 -0500 Message-ID: <001101c293ca$64b5ad20$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: <000201c293b2$09ed3ec0$0101a8c0@pavilion> <001701c293b9$51a02dc0$af78fea9@juan> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Alfredo Lite updates Date: Sun, 24 Nov 2002 10:01:39 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 I should have added that as this is a "factory defect"- you can send them back to me for a quick fix if you don't want to solder... CC ----- Original Message ----- From: Juan / John Gualda From ccuff@in4web.com Sun Nov 24 07:14:02 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Nov 2002 15:14:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 50650 invoked from network); 24 Nov 2002 15:14:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Nov 2002 15:14:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Nov 2002 15:14:02 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.80]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Sun, 24 Nov 2002 10:08:24 -0500 Message-ID: <001701c293ca$ef28caa0$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: <1038133223.1793.66994.m12@yahoogroups.com> <02f801c293b9$8bc26180$01c8a8c0@N2UBP> Subject: Re: {AMSF} automotive noise Date: Sun, 24 Nov 2002 10:05:31 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 Fuel pumps are REAL bad offenders- when I had the Dodge, it was a problem- I added a capacitor across the pump lead-in wires at the tank- (no small feat!) it helped a lot. You want to put the cap in as close to the noise source as possible. Another thing- try carrying around a little transistor radio, and while the vehicle is idling, go all around the car and see where the noise is loudest. Chris ----- Original Message ----- From: Steve Fleckenstein To: Sent: Sunday, November 24, 2002 8:01 AM Subject: {AMSF} automotive noise From e92fmjamz@yahoo.com Sun Nov 24 08:49:11 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: e92fmjamz@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Nov 2002 16:49:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 31713 invoked from network); 24 Nov 2002 16:49:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Nov 2002 16:49:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14006.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.175.122) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Nov 2002 16:49:10 -0000 Message-ID: <20021124164910.88341.qmail@web14006.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [152.8.78.47] by web14006.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 24 Nov 2002 08:49:10 PST Date: Sun, 24 Nov 2002 08:49:10 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: {AMSF} automotive noise To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: <001701c293ca$ef28caa0$0101a8c0@pavilion> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: Ernest Jones X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=24963319 X-Yahoo-Profile: e92fmjamz yeah, the transistor radio is a good idea, I need to get in and attempt to fix my problem (loudest on the center of the hood), switching over to AM sounds like Im driving a airplane - coverage for most 1kw AM stations on my radio is 10 miles or less --- Christopher Cuff wrote: > Fuel pumps are REAL bad offenders- when I had the > Dodge, it was a problem- I > added a capacitor across the pump lead-in wires at > the tank- (no small > feat!) it helped a lot. > You want to put the cap in as close to the noise > source as possible. > Another thing- try carrying around a little > transistor radio, and while the > vehicle is idling, go all around the car and see > where the noise is loudest. > Chris > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Steve Fleckenstein > To: > Sent: Sunday, November 24, 2002 8:01 AM > Subject: {AMSF} automotive noise > > > > > ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > ===== Ernest, Gates NC, USA WRCS 970 AM Ahoskie NC, Announcer,webmaster http://wrcs.cjb.net WQDK 99.3 FM Ahoskie NC, Fill in ------contact me-------- AIM: e92fmjamz2000 ICQ: 33155469 Yahoo: e92fmjamz __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus – Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From michaelj@vcn.com Sun Nov 24 09:14:25 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Nov 2002 17:14:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 71375 invoked from network); 24 Nov 2002 17:14:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Nov 2002 17:14:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m1-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Nov 2002 17:14:24 -0000 Received: from michaelj (vcn83.usrtc-1.evan.wy.vcn.com [209.193.86.87]) by m1-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Sun, 24 Nov 2002 10:14:24 -0700 Message-ID: <001f01c293dc$8eb1cb60$5756c1d1@mshome.net> To: References: <000201c293b2$09ed3ec0$0101a8c0@pavilion> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Alfredo Lite updates Date: Sun, 24 Nov 2002 10:11:39 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit WOO HOO Chris!!!!!!!!! Can't wait to try this with mine!!!! I'll check the coils as well. You remember it's been quite a while since I bought mine from you. This should be fun! MJR n WYO ----- Original Message ----- From: Christopher Cuff To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Cc: ABDX@topica.com Sent: Sunday, November 24, 2002 5:06 AM Subject: {AMSF} Alfredo Lite updates I have discovered a tip for any of you that have my little tranmitters.(This fix has been already done in the last 10 or so that have been sent out) Please look at the coils in the RF section- there are 4 in the RF1 area(some also have 4 more on the trace side of the board), and 2 in the RF2 area- These look like little blue resistors. The 4 in the RF1 area are 68uH (Blue Grey Black Gold color code) The 2 in the RF 2 area are 270 uH (Red, violet, brown, gold) MAKE SURE they are all going in the same direction- otherwise, they oppose each other and can effect the output range. They end up acting like traps! I also discovered a great way to make a cheap, excellent antenna- Darwin covered part of this a while back, but here goes: Take an old ferrite antenna out of a transistor radio- there will be 4 wires on it- use the wires with the higher resistance to them (this is the RF section) Make sure that you have a ground connected. I use the cold water pipe to the washer- whatever... Now, Put this loopstick in series with the transmitter output and a standard car radio rod anenna. Set up a radio outside, up loud so you can hear it- (I used a modified Memorex boomball) Now, slide the coil on the loopstick SLOWLY and listen- all of a sudden, the radio will kick into turbodrive- you have hit reasonance! I didn't stop there, however.... I then took a length of INSULATED wire, wrapped 10 turns around the rod of the car radio antenna I use for transmitting, and put the other end of this wire straight into the hot side of an AC outlet. (Make DAMN sure that this wire is insulated!!- NO electrical connection at all!) Readjusted the ferrite for reasonance, and holy shirt! - A combo carrier current/ air RF system. Audio was clean as a whistle all over the house and beyond.... :-) Chris Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Sun Nov 24 11:52:15 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Nov 2002 19:52:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 70575 invoked from network); 24 Nov 2002 19:52:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Nov 2002 19:52:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web41006.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.93.5) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Nov 2002 19:52:14 -0000 Message-ID: <20021124195214.24287.qmail@web41006.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.36.117] by web41006.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 24 Nov 2002 11:52:14 PST Date: Sun, 24 Nov 2002 11:52:14 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: {AMSF} Alfredo Lite updates To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: <000201c293b2$09ed3ec0$0101a8c0@pavilion> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio Could that be why I was never able to get a pilot tone out of mine? I looked: one in each section is reversed. Should they be facing left or right, or it doesn't matter as long as they are all facing the same direction and NOT each other? Jay __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus – Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sun Nov 24 12:52:11 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Nov 2002 20:52:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 11285 invoked from network); 24 Nov 2002 20:52:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Nov 2002 20:52:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.69) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Nov 2002 20:52:11 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.167] by n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 24 Nov 2002 20:52:11 -0000 Date: Sun, 24 Nov 2002 20:52:09 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: AM Stereo modulation & audio processing Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 885 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.94 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Alfredo E. Torrejon" After working a summer internship with McIntosh Labs, > Brian brought me some engineering samples of Analog Devices's SSM2120 > audio processor ICs (sadly, these are out of production today). As I > looked at the data sheet and saw the performance claims and ease of use of > these ICs, the idea hit me: These chips should go into a multiband > compressor! > Alfredo I think the Analog Devices SSM2166 is still made but is only available as SMD. It is primarily used as a microphone speech processor and is popular among Ameteur Radio for use as a power mike. It has an adjustable compression ratio from 1:1 to 15:1 and many other features. BTW, are these multiband compressors parametric or are the crossover points fixed. And if so what are the most popular crossover points for a 4 band compressor. JSG From groucho@skyweb.net Sun Nov 24 14:07:16 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Nov 2002 22:07:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 90233 invoked from network); 24 Nov 2002 22:07:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Nov 2002 22:07:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Nov 2002 22:07:15 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gAOMBKed089727 for ; Sun, 24 Nov 2002 17:11:21 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DE14D76.221351BF@skyweb.net> Date: Sun, 24 Nov 2002 17:06:46 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: AM Stereo modulation & audio processing References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 you want hear some really bad audio Listen to WCNJ 89.3fm from the web... Gag.. cough...gag "Alfredo E. Torrejon" wrote: > After some audio purists made noise on rec.radio.broadcasting > regarding audio processing, someone made a really brilliant > statement: "Keep the compression UP! Keep the distortion DOWN!" > A few years ago, I was at a university radio station that, for a > long time had had an engineer who was a purist. He believed that radio > stations should strive to present audio source material as accurately as > possible. The processing used was an Optimod 8000 with the release time > set to maximum and the input gain set low so that the limiter seldom > engaged. > However, I and another engineer, Brian, disagreed. We felt that > the combination of our "quiet" on-air sound, and the lack of deep bass or > super-sparkly highs gave the perception that we were too poor to afford > better equipment. After working a summer internship with McIntosh Labs, > Brian brought me some engineering samples of Analog Devices's SSM2120 > audio processor ICs (sadly, these are out of production today). As I > looked at the data sheet and saw the performance claims and ease of use of > these ICs, the idea hit me: These chips should go into a multiband > compressor! As a tradeoff between circuit complexity and flexibility, I > settled on four bands, rather than the more standard five. To make a long > story short, I built two prototype units, and one went into the airchain > at our station during winter break in 1997. With the help of one of our > senior producers, I adjusted the compressor for a good on-air sound. > Using the compressor ehanced the punchiness of the bass and the > sparkliness of the highs without adding any noticeable distortion or > pumping. Flipping around the dial, we sounded about as loud as the other > radio stations. The on-air staff and even listeners noted the difference, > and all the feedback that I received was favorable. > However, I have heard a lot of complete *crap* processing and > sloppy airchains in every place that I've lived or visited. Neither FM > nor AM is safe, and in my opinion, I've heard too many badly processed > stations to begin listing 'em all! One of the engineers here takes it as > gospel that AM stations must cut the highs and some of the bass from their > audio because that's the way to process audio for "the vast majority of > radios that people use." Some months ago, he started working at KXL 750 > AM, and within a few weeks, he had the station's audio sounding like a > Real Audio stream, complete with artifacts. Then there's KUIK 1360, which > sounds like it is using very agressive AGC after the microwave STL; when > someone is talking--especially if they pause a lot--the AGC picks up the > STL noise. Hisssssss. > With FM, it's really interesting to place an oscilloscope at the > demodulator output of just an ordinary FM stereo tuner. Doing this gives > a lot of insight into what's being heard. Some stations use heavy > composite clipping, such as classic rocker 92.3 KGON. The waveform out of > the demodulator looks rounded off (due to the clipping), and the station > has a grungy, distorted sound, like an old record being played with a worn > out needle. Others use multiband clipping so that some parts of the audio > spectrum end up more distorted than others. For instance, 99.5 KWJJ runs > heavy clipping on the bass, which makes the bass notes sound crunchy, and > on the scope, one can see low-frequency square waves running along with > the rest of the audio. I've heard some FMs, which run so much clipping on > the treble that high-hat cymbals sound more like bags of broken glass; > unfortunately, I haven't had a chance to look at their waveforms. > > Alfredo > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From groucho@skyweb.net Sun Nov 24 14:17:48 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Nov 2002 22:17:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 53509 invoked from network); 24 Nov 2002 22:17:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Nov 2002 22:17:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Nov 2002 22:17:47 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gAOMLqed095483; Sun, 24 Nov 2002 17:21:53 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DE14FEE.3962C73B@skyweb.net> Date: Sun, 24 Nov 2002 17:17:18 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com" , "ABDX@topica.com" Subject: station heard Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 ok guys I have been listening for a few Nights now... WWRV in NJ is on 1330 and has 2 other transmitters I could not get the Calls sounded like WWIB or WWVB in NY.. But what are the calls and output power of their transmitter down In the Turks& Calicos Islands West Indies. because their signal on 530kc is so strong I thought they were in my backyard.. 530 was stronger than the parent transmitter on 1330 30 miles North of me... It even takes out the Rutgers Univ TIS station on 530.. which normally is solid here from 4 miles to the north.. Neal From evergreenterrace@buzzle.com Sun Nov 24 15:50:16 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: evergreenterrace@buzzle.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Nov 2002 23:50:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 18741 invoked from network); 24 Nov 2002 23:50:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Nov 2002 23:50:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.90) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Nov 2002 23:50:15 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.189] by n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 24 Nov 2002 23:50:15 -0000 Date: Sun, 24 Nov 2002 23:50:13 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: OT: FM Modulation Problems Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1855 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgliradio" X-Originating-IP: 170.20.11.59 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=69711087 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgliradio With the recent talk on processing, I thought I would ask about a Problem I was having. I am the CE of a small FM educational. We don't have much money, but have recently purchased a new transmitter and upgraded our processor from CBS gear to something a little more modern (1980's). We're running a DBX 168 (average level processor), a CRL SEP-800 (4-band limiter), a Hnat Hindes stereo generator/clipper and a Mod Sciences Composite Clipper. Our transmitter is a Nicom NT-300 we have a Belar FM monitor and Stereo monitor. The Belar FM monitor (FMM-1) is indicating an average level of 90% modulation. We have been able to clip the audio to the point where the monitor can look like tone (with less than a dB of deviation). The audio is clean, but we are not as loud as the mod monitor would indicate. If I increase the average level, the peak flasher starts to go off at 105%. BUT Checking the deviation meter on the exciter, even with the peak flasher going off, we are NOT near 75kHz deviation according to the exciter. The Belar stereo monitor, in the TOTAL mode with the PEAK setting, the modulation looks about 5-10% lower than on the Belar FM monitor. The Belar FM monitor was recalibrated by Belar in September 2001. Should I suspect it? I do not have access to scopes right now... when it was reinstalled with the new exciter, I did proof the system with borrowed scopes and it looked good... I am wondering if there is a problem... or... because it is an old monitor... I know some newer mod monitors (like the Belar Wizard and the Mod Sciences monitor) are more accurate allowing an extra dB or 2 of audio and still remaining legal because the peak detectors are more accurate. Should I increase the modulation to reference 75kHz on the Nicom (where we sound as loud as others) or should I believe what the Belar is telling me? From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Sun Nov 24 18:10:09 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Nov 2002 02:10:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 33672 invoked from network); 25 Nov 2002 02:10:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Nov 2002 02:10:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf11bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.151) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Nov 2002 02:10:07 -0000 Received: from juan ([67.34.22.44]) by imf11bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.19 201-253-122-122-119-20020516) with SMTP id <20021125021154.LXYD17441.imf11bis.bellsouth.net@juan> for ; Sun, 24 Nov 2002 21:11:54 -0500 Message-ID: <001a01c29427$c81e2790$af78fea9@juan> To: References: <000201c293b2$09ed3ec0$0101a8c0@pavilion> <001701c293b9$51a02dc0$af78fea9@juan> <001101c293ca$64b5ad20$0101a8c0@pavilion> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Alfredo Lite updates Date: Sun, 24 Nov 2002 21:10:09 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Chris, I don't have your new e-mail. Let me know what it is Juan gualdaj@bellsouth.net ----- Original Message ----- From: Christopher Cuff To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, November 24, 2002 10:01 AM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Alfredo Lite updates I should have added that as this is a "factory defect"- you can send them back to me for a quick fix if you don't want to solder... CC ----- Original Message ----- From: Juan / John Gualda [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Nov 24 18:47:53 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Nov 2002 02:47:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 99130 invoked from network); 25 Nov 2002 02:47:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Nov 2002 02:47:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Nov 2002 02:47:53 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.173] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 25 Nov 2002 02:47:53 -0000 Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2002 02:47:52 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Alfredo Lite updates Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <001a01c29427$c81e2790$af78fea9@juan> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1941 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.78.160 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics Another way to adjust the antenna for resonance is to use the transmitter at night when other stations on the channel create background noise in your signal. Position a nearby radio in a spot where the background noise (and 10 kHz whistle, if it is a wideband radio) is the loudest, indicating the weakest signal strength coming from your Alfredo Lite. Then, adjust the loading coil so that the noise from the radio is the quiestest, indicating the strongest signal from your transmitter. Just like carefully tuning an old- fashioned radio, it helps to move the coil back and forth while "zeroing in" on the exact spot that gives you the best signal. Radio Shack "Science Fair" electronic toy project kits are also a good source for transistor-radio-style ferrite bar coils to use as a loading coil for the Alfredo Lite. This will even give you handy spring clips for connecting the coil without soldering. Also, if your version of the Alfredo Lite has a trimmer capacitor near the crystal, you can use this to get your signal exactly on-frequency. Again, the best way is to listen at night. If another station in the background is creating a wavering effect, then your signal is a few dozen Hz off. Adjust the trimmer just a tiny bit, and if the wavering slows down into a platform motion effect (when listening in AM Stereo), then you know you're getting closer to the exact frequency. Theoretically, you could adjust it perfectly where your signal is exactly synchronized with the other station's and there is no platform motion, but in reality you have to settle for being a few Hz off. I can get mine to only a few back-and-forth audio motions per second, which means that my signal on 1500 kHz is within 2 or 3 Hz of 1500 WTOP's at night (since the beat rate between two slightly differing signal frequencies is what creates platform motion and determines what speed the audio image will move at). From n0uiheric@aol.com Sun Nov 24 21:22:18 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Nov 2002 05:22:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 57597 invoked from network); 25 Nov 2002 05:22:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Nov 2002 05:22:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r03.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.99) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Nov 2002 05:22:17 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-r03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.141.365342e (4246) for ; Mon, 25 Nov 2002 00:22:10 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <141.365342e.2b130d82@aol.com> Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2002 00:22:10 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} station heard To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih The calls would be WWRV...the same group owns Radio Vision Cristiana on 530 kHz from the Turks and Caicos Islands. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From groucho@skyweb.net Sun Nov 24 21:42:39 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Nov 2002 05:42:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 88208 invoked from network); 25 Nov 2002 05:42:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Nov 2002 05:42:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Nov 2002 05:42:38 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gAP5khed010478 for ; Mon, 25 Nov 2002 00:46:44 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DE1B82D.EFA71BEE@skyweb.net> Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2002 00:42:05 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} station heard References: <141.365342e.2b130d82@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 I know 1330 is WWRV but what are the calls and power level Of 530kc? 530 cannot also be WWRV it has to have a different call Neal n0uiheric@aol.com wrote: > The calls would be WWRV...the same group owns Radio Vision Cristiana on 530 > kHz from the Turks and Caicos Islands. > > 73 and good DX from Eric > Amateur Radio Station N0UIH > Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN > Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 > DXing The World since 1981 > Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel > PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION > "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From amfmdx@fastq.com Sun Nov 24 22:03:09 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Nov 2002 06:03:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 29010 invoked from network); 25 Nov 2002 06:03:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Nov 2002 06:03:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Nov 2002 06:03:07 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt (d47-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.79]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gAP636v31919 for ; Sun, 24 Nov 2002 23:03:06 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <080401c29447$bdf16d20$7ff9bed8@kredding430cdt> To: References: <141.365342e.2b130d82@aol.com> <3DE1B82D.EFA71BEE@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} station heard Date: Sun, 24 Nov 2002 22:58:55 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > I know 1330 is WWRV but what are the calls and power level Of 530kc? > 530 cannot also be WWRV it has to have a different call Neal, 530 is on Turks and Caicos. The call is Radio Vision Cristiana. WRTH states they are running 100 kW. My friend on another list, Patrick Griffith, states the CE says they are running about 40 kW. Turks and Caicos didn't issue them any calls. They just registered them as Radio Vision Cristiana. Kevin From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Nov 24 23:42:39 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Nov 2002 07:42:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 18066 invoked from network); 25 Nov 2002 07:42:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Nov 2002 07:42:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.88) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Nov 2002 07:42:39 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.176] by n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 25 Nov 2002 07:42:39 -0000 Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2002 07:42:38 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: station heard Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <080401c29447$bdf16d20$7ff9bed8@kredding430cdt> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 720 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.78.160 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > 530 is on Turks and Caicos. The call is Radio Vision Cristiana. > WRTH states they are running 100 kW. My friend on another list, > Patrick Griffith, states the CE says they are running about 40 kW. Whatever the power is, I've heard that they are using a Nautel transmitter. They used to be on 535 kHz, but after digital-tuning radios became common, they moved down to 530 kHz, apparently much to the benefit of their nighttime signal coverage. I remember back in 1996 when all I heard on 530 kHz was tiny CIAO from Canada, calling themselves "Hot 530". Anyway, if the Turks & Caicos station is coming in well on 530 kHz, check out 1620 kHz. You might hear WDHP in AM Stereo from the U.S. Virgin Islands. From KC4QLP@aol.com Sun Nov 24 23:56:17 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Nov 2002 07:56:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 36376 invoked from network); 25 Nov 2002 07:56:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Nov 2002 07:56:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r07.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.103) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Nov 2002 07:56:16 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.a.28ee4f48 (4418) for ; Mon, 25 Nov 2002 02:56:14 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2002 02:56:13 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} automotive noise To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 259 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 11/24/02 8:02:25 AM Eastern Standard Time, spfleck@citlink.net writes: > noise... check ground bonding on the hood.. If that doesn't help verify > antenna connections are okay.. then check other stuff by turning off and on > various other devices in car like A/C. etc. I had a ford that where AM > would > quiet down only when A/C was on. Could be fuel pump. > > Steve > Hey thats just like my Nissan now. I'm hearing some noise of some type..cant really explain what it is..but when the A/C kicks in...the noise on AM almost disappears completely! Steve..what was your fix for that noise problem? Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From ben@lennard.net.nz Mon Nov 25 00:48:18 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ben@lennard.net.nz X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Nov 2002 08:48:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 21173 invoked from network); 25 Nov 2002 08:48:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Nov 2002 08:48:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.68) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Nov 2002 08:48:17 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.183] by n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 25 Nov 2002 08:48:17 -0000 Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2002 08:48:16 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Lovin' it! Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 450 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Ben" X-Originating-IP: 203.98.48.151 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=118503946 X-Yahoo-Profile: benlennard Not quite AMS related, but I just got hi speed internet installed today...! I'm currently using iTunes to listen to "WOLF FM" at 56kbps and no rebuffering required. The quality is not bad - very acceptable with a little EQ to get rid of most of the washy type sounds. Tried a 128kbps - which worked (until the buffer ran out - has to reload every 30 secs or so). Are there any streaming AMS stations out there? Ben, Wellington, New Zealand. From florida_amstereo@hotmail.com Mon Nov 25 03:12:26 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: florida_amstereo@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Nov 2002 11:12:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 91577 invoked from network); 25 Nov 2002 11:12:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Nov 2002 11:12:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.37.7) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Nov 2002 11:12:24 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 25 Nov 2002 03:12:24 -0800 Received: from 209.240.198.61 by pv2fd.pav2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Mon, 25 Nov 2002 11:12:24 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Re: {AMSF} station heard Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2002 11:12:24 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 25 Nov 2002 11:12:24.0976 (UTC) FILETIME=[885D4900:01C29473] From: "Donn Tillman" X-Originating-IP: [209.240.198.61] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83914824 Neal wrote: I know 1330 is WWRV but what are the calls and power level Of 530kc? 530 cannot also be WWRV it has to have a different call Neal ~~~~~~~~~~~ Tell that to ClearChannel , that at last count has 6 WFLA's here in Florida, legally and officially they are not WFLA's but except for a very quick and fast i.d. at the top each hour, WFLA is prominently used as their station i.d. throughout the rest of the hour. _________________________________________________________________ Tired of spam? Get advanced junk mail protection with MSN 8. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail From philipr@irac.pe.ca Mon Nov 25 05:16:52 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Nov 2002 13:16:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 12963 invoked from network); 25 Nov 2002 13:16:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Nov 2002 13:16:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.70) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Nov 2002 13:16:51 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.160] by n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 25 Nov 2002 13:16:51 -0000 Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2002 13:16:51 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: CHNS in AM Stereo again??? Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 826 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking Last night I was listening to CHNS on my Toyota/Panasonic AM Stereo car receiver - when amid blasting and fading the AM Stereo indicator came on. There appeared to be stereo separation as well. This morning, however, the stereo indicator did not come on, while CJCH was clearly in stereo, with obvious separation. It may very well be falsing, although this is the first time I've noticed it. The other theory is with competitor 920 CJCH running an oldies format in AM Stereo now, the boys at MBS radio may have decided to try to fire up AM Stereo again. Apparently they had STL problems, which was the most recent reason for pulling the plug on stereo. As well, I just read that apparently there will be applications before the CRTC for Eureka 147 L-Band DAB for Halifax, so DAB is coming east. Phil R. From philipr@irac.pe.ca Mon Nov 25 05:39:11 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Nov 2002 13:39:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 8034 invoked from network); 25 Nov 2002 13:39:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Nov 2002 13:39:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Nov 2002 13:39:10 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.188] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 25 Nov 2002 13:39:10 -0000 Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2002 13:39:09 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Alfredo Lite updates Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <000201c293b2$09ed3ec0$0101a8c0@pavilion> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3322 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking Chris, could you put a picture or a drawing on this site to help guide us? I think I understand what you are saying: - - - - rather than l - l - or, are you refwering to the same direction of the color code? I don't think its the latter, as with coils, like resistors, I don't believe it matters which direction the coil is wired, unlike say an electrolytic cap. But, my understanding could be wrong here... I'll have a look at mine and double check the schematic. Antique Electronic Supply sells a nice antenna tuner kit - using a single gang plate tuner, some ABS pipe, wire, etc. to make a multipped coil with the tuning cap in parallel or series - this is determined with a flick of a switch. Just be careful not to tighten the cap too firm to the board, or you'll warp the cap, and it will short. There is no reason why you can't brew your own for much less $, with a plate tuner from your junk box, magnet wire - 22 guage works well - and lots of taps - just create little loops every so often. When the coil is finished, scrape the enamel of each loop, tin with solder, and use an aligator clip. By experimenting with the taps and the tuning cap, you can achieve resonance. I use an old Heathkit AJ-11 which has dreadful sensitivity on AM [must fix it someday as it actually should be pretty good] as my tuning reference receiver. --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Christopher Cuff" wrote: > I have discovered a tip for any of you that have my little tranmitters.(This > fix has been already done in the last 10 or so that have been sent out) > Please look at the coils in the RF section- there are 4 in the RF1 area(some > also have 4 more on the trace side of the board), and 2 in the RF2 area- > These look like little blue resistors. The 4 in the RF1 area are 68uH (Blue > Grey Black Gold color code) > The 2 in the RF 2 area are 270 uH (Red, violet, brown, gold) > MAKE SURE they are all going in the same direction- otherwise, they oppose > each other and can effect the output range. They end up acting like traps! > I also discovered a great way to make a cheap, excellent antenna- Darwin > covered part of this a while back, but here goes: > Take an old ferrite antenna out of a transistor radio- there will be 4 wires > on it- use the wires with the higher resistance to them (this is the RF > section) > Make sure that you have a ground connected. I use the cold water pipe to the > washer- whatever... Now, > Put this loopstick in series with the transmitter output and a standard car > radio rod anenna. > Set up a radio outside, up loud so you can hear it- (I used a modified > Memorex boomball) > Now, slide the coil on the loopstick SLOWLY and listen- all of a sudden, the > radio will kick into turbodrive- you have hit reasonance! > I didn't stop there, however.... I then took a length of INSULATED wire, > wrapped 10 turns around the rod of the car radio antenna I use for > transmitting, and put the other end of this wire straight into the hot side > of an AC outlet. (Make DAMN sure that this wire is insulated!!- NO > electrical connection at all!) > Readjusted the ferrite for reasonance, and holy shirt! - A combo carrier > current/ air RF system. > Audio was clean as a whistle all over the house and beyond.... :-) > Chris From philipr@irac.pe.ca Mon Nov 25 05:41:22 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Nov 2002 13:41:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 434 invoked from network); 25 Nov 2002 13:41:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Nov 2002 13:41:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Nov 2002 13:41:22 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.180] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 25 Nov 2002 13:41:22 -0000 Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2002 13:41:20 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: radio kits Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <002301c293b5$1f57b300$0101a8c0@pavilion> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1078 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking Sounds good to me! I have some experience with SMT stuff, thanks to a couple of Ramsey kits, so with my magnifying lamp I think I could do it again. parts on both sides is no problemo to moi! Phil R. --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Christopher Cuff" wrote: > Scott, that is not a bad idea at all- It would be FAR easier for me to do > kits. > I already have the instructions and photo work done from when Down Unders > Silicon Chip magazine was interested- but that fell through because he > didn't like the SMD parts. As well, he didn't like the parts on both sides > of the circuit board- well, too freaking bad- "I" like it the way it is! > SMD is not that bad- I actually LIKE it!- as long as you do as I do, and use > a pair of strong reading glasses to see up close, it is a piece of cake. > BTW- the kits will have to sell for $50.00 each- No way I can do them any > less. > I will make up about 25 kits and put some on ebay, some for any of you that > want to try them... (I have 500 already plated boards, so I can do plenty) > stay tuned! > CC From groucho@skyweb.net Mon Nov 25 06:12:57 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Nov 2002 14:12:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 23834 invoked from network); 25 Nov 2002 14:12:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Nov 2002 14:12:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Nov 2002 14:12:56 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gAPEH2ed036620 for ; Mon, 25 Nov 2002 09:17:03 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DE22FCC.5795508A@skyweb.net> Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2002 09:12:28 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} station heard References: <141.365342e.2b130d82@aol.com> <3DE1B82D.EFA71BEE@skyweb.net> <080401c29447$bdf16d20$7ff9bed8@kredding430cdt> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Humm I wonder what it take to get a station license down there?????? very interesting thanks Kevin Neal "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" wrote: > > I know 1330 is WWRV but what are the calls and power level Of 530kc? > > 530 cannot also be WWRV it has to have a different call > > Neal, > > 530 is on Turks and Caicos. The call is Radio Vision Cristiana. WRTH states > they are running 100 kW. My friend on another list, Patrick Griffith, states > the CE says they are running about 40 kW. > > Turks and Caicos didn't issue them any calls. They just registered them as > Radio Vision Cristiana. > > Kevin > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From groucho@skyweb.net Mon Nov 25 06:18:32 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Nov 2002 14:18:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 41092 invoked from network); 25 Nov 2002 14:18:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Nov 2002 14:18:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Nov 2002 14:18:31 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gAPEMaed040287 for ; Mon, 25 Nov 2002 09:22:37 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DE23119.56268871@skyweb.net> Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2002 09:18:01 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Lovin' it! References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 EBC WTTM 1680 am stereo is streaming but it cost a mear $2 a month to subscribe... that is to cover the cost of the streaming service and internet connection Neal Ben wrote: > Not quite AMS related, but I just got hi speed internet installed > today...! > > I'm currently using iTunes to listen to "WOLF FM" at 56kbps and > no rebuffering required. The quality is not bad - very acceptable > with a little EQ to get rid of most of the washy type sounds. > > Tried a 128kbps - which worked (until the buffer ran out - has to > reload every 30 secs or so). > > Are there any streaming AMS stations out there? > > Ben, Wellington, New Zealand. > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From ccuff@in4web.com Mon Nov 25 07:53:47 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Nov 2002 15:53:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 4973 invoked from network); 25 Nov 2002 15:53:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Nov 2002 15:53:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Nov 2002 15:53:40 -0000 Received: from Chris1 (unverified [208.228.96.20]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Mon, 25 Nov 2002 10:48:04 -0500 Message-ID: <000f01c2949a$d40f1d70$0d01a8c0@Chris1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Alfredo Lite updates Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2002 10:53:41 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Chris Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 That "is" what I mean- if say both gold bands are facing each other, the direction of the winding is 180 degrees opposite- I found this when I wound a 2 coils on a rod, and by mistake wound one turn set clockwise, and the other counter CW- it actually nulled the signal. Now, this may not apply to separate coils like I use, but it makes theoretical sense that it WOULD matter. I have seen many products that use coils, and ther is a dot on the PC board to indicate the direction they want them installed. cc ----- Original Message ----- From: "Phil Rafuse" To: Sent: Monday, November 25, 2002 8:39 AM Subject: {AMSF} Re: Alfredo Lite updates > Chris, could you put a picture or a drawing on this site to help > guide us? I think I understand what you are saying: > From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Nov 25 08:01:40 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Nov 2002 16:01:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 26501 invoked from network); 25 Nov 2002 16:01:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Nov 2002 16:01:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.75) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Nov 2002 16:01:39 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.181] by n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 25 Nov 2002 16:01:39 -0000 Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2002 16:01:38 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: automotive noise Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 967 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics One complete solution to automotive RF noise is to drive a diesel car! Diesel engines don't use spark plugs, therefore one major source of RF noise is eliminated, and they use a mechanical fuel injection pump, therefore there is no noise from an electric fuel pump. The only potential noise source is the alternator, but that is fairly easily dealt with, and besides that, everything is mechanical. Once started, you could even disconnect the battery and alternator and it would drive fine (just with no lights and no radio). The newer diesel cars are starting to use some electronic controls on the engine, but the diesel engine's design inherently will never have any use for spark plugs (that's the whole principle of how the diesel engine works; the fuel is so highly compressed that it ignites itself) or an electric fuel pump, so those two major RF noise sources still aren't there. Kevin T. 1981 Mercedes 240D Diesel 1992 VW Jetta "ECOdiesel" From jsgil@hal-pc.org Mon Nov 25 08:22:36 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Nov 2002 16:22:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 9867 invoked from network); 25 Nov 2002 16:22:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Nov 2002 16:22:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Nov 2002 16:22:36 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.148] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 25 Nov 2002 16:22:36 -0000 Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2002 16:22:35 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: Alfredo Lite updates Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <000f01c2949a$d40f1d70$0d01a8c0@Chris1> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1251 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.38 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Chris Cuff" wrote: > That "is" what I mean- if say both gold bands are facing each other, the > direction of the winding is 180 degrees opposite- I found this when I wound > a 2 coils on a rod, and by mistake wound one turn set clockwise, and the > other counter CW- it actually nulled the signal. > Now, this may not apply to separate coils like I use, but it makes > theoretical sense that it WOULD matter. > I have seen many products that use coils, and ther is a dot on the PC board > to indicate the direction they want them installed. > cc The ideal situation is that they don't share any mutual inductance at all. To do this the coils need to be mounted at right angles to each other with some distance between. To have them mounted close together in a straight line will either increase or decrease the inductance of both coils depending on whether the magnetic fields are additive of subtractive. 2 coils sharing mutual inductance will change the value of both coils and will alter what the calculated response should be. In the additive mode an increase in inductance will cause the low pass filters cutoff frequency to lower while in the subtractive mode it will raise the cutoff frequency. JSG From philipr@irac.pe.ca Mon Nov 25 08:31:39 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Nov 2002 16:31:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 67671 invoked from network); 25 Nov 2002 16:31:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Nov 2002 16:31:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Nov 2002 16:31:39 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.132] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 25 Nov 2002 16:31:38 -0000 Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2002 16:31:38 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: Alfredo Lite updates Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <000f01c2949a$d40f1d70$0d01a8c0@Chris1> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1278 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking I think I got it - colour codes should all be going in the same direction. So, with two coils in series, the gold bands would not be facing each other. With two coils in parallel, I'd assume the leads with the gold ends would connect together. So, although not polarized, think of the coils as capacitors or batteries, and follow that logic. Thanks Phil R. - --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Chris Cuff" wrote: > That "is" what I mean- if say both gold bands are facing each other, the > direction of the winding is 180 degrees opposite- I found this when I wound > a 2 coils on a rod, and by mistake wound one turn set clockwise, and the > other counter CW- it actually nulled the signal. > Now, this may not apply to separate coils like I use, but it makes > theoretical sense that it WOULD matter. > I have seen many products that use coils, and ther is a dot on the PC board > to indicate the direction they want them installed. > cc > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Phil Rafuse" > To: > Sent: Monday, November 25, 2002 8:39 AM > Subject: {AMSF} Re: Alfredo Lite updates > > > > Chris, could you put a picture or a drawing on this site to help > > guide us? I think I understand what you are saying: > > From amstereoguy@hotmail.com Mon Nov 25 08:34:44 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereoguy@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Nov 2002 16:34:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 68839 invoked from network); 25 Nov 2002 16:34:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Nov 2002 16:34:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (207.68.165.57) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Nov 2002 16:34:44 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 25 Nov 2002 08:34:44 -0800 Received: from 208.228.96.20 by sea2fd.sea2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Mon, 25 Nov 2002 16:34:44 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Alfredo Lite updates Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2002 11:34:44 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 25 Nov 2002 16:34:44.0409 (UTC) FILETIME=[8F909290:01C294A0] From: "Chris Cuff" X-Originating-IP: [208.228.96.20] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37866059 True, but this is mostly at much higher freqs than what we are dealing with here. I have had no problems with them at all, after making nearly 100 over the past 2 years - just a tweak I found that did make a little difference. These do darn good for only 10mw or so. The antenna is the main thing to pay attention to. CC > >The ideal situation is that they don't share any mutual inductance >at all. To do this the coils need to be mounted at right angles >to each other with some distance between. > > _________________________________________________________________ Add photos to your messages with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail From amstereoguy@hotmail.com Mon Nov 25 08:35:44 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereoguy@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Nov 2002 16:35:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 29707 invoked from network); 25 Nov 2002 16:35:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Nov 2002 16:35:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (207.68.165.162) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Nov 2002 16:35:44 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 25 Nov 2002 08:35:44 -0800 Received: from 208.228.96.20 by sea2fd.sea2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Mon, 25 Nov 2002 16:35:44 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Alfredo Lite updates Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2002 11:35:44 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 25 Nov 2002 16:35:44.0241 (UTC) FILETIME=[B33A3610:01C294A0] From: "Chris Cuff" X-Originating-IP: [208.228.96.20] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37866059 Thats it- You got it! CC >From: "Phil Rafuse" >Reply-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com >>I think I got it - colour codes should all be going in the same >direction. So, with two coils in series, the gold bands would not >be facing each other. With two coils in parallel, I'd assume the >leads with the gold ends would connect together. So, although not >polarized, think of the coils as capacitors or batteries, and follow >that logic. > >Thanks > >Phil R. _________________________________________________________________ Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963 From penry@nortelnetworks.com Mon Nov 25 08:36:21 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: penry@nortelnetworks.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Nov 2002 16:36:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 56853 invoked from network); 25 Nov 2002 16:36:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Nov 2002 16:36:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com) (47.103.122.112) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Nov 2002 16:36:20 -0000 Received: from zrc2c011.us.nortel.com (zrc2c011.us.nortel.com [47.103.120.51]) by zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id gAPGaVU19657 for ; Mon, 25 Nov 2002 10:36:32 -0600 (CST) Received: by zrc2c011.us.nortel.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Mon, 25 Nov 2002 10:36:19 -0600 Message-ID: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A560797404847BBD@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: FW: [RT] Mike Dorrough Modulation Idea Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2002 10:36:16 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) From: "Charles Penry" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=376233 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa5vhu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Not quite the AMS we are accustomed to discussing: Info and explanation from a discussion between Dorrough and John Battison: http://beradio.com/ar/radio_currents_12/index.htm#ams Charles [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From amstereoguy@hotmail.com Mon Nov 25 08:38:04 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereoguy@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Nov 2002 16:38:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 74519 invoked from network); 25 Nov 2002 16:38:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Nov 2002 16:38:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (207.68.165.122) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Nov 2002 16:38:04 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 25 Nov 2002 08:38:03 -0800 Received: from 208.228.96.20 by sea2fd.sea2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Mon, 25 Nov 2002 16:38:03 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: automotive noise Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2002 11:38:03 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 25 Nov 2002 16:38:03.0370 (UTC) FILETIME=[06279CA0:01C294A1] From: "Chris Cuff" X-Originating-IP: [208.228.96.20] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37866059 Somehow, I knew that was coming....... :-) CC "Spark plugs forever" >From: "Kevin T." >Reply-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com >To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com >Subject: {AMSF} Re: automotive noise >Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2002 16:01:38 -0000 > >One complete solution to automotive RF noise is to drive a diesel >car! _________________________________________________________________ Add photos to your messages with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail From philipr@irac.pe.ca Mon Nov 25 09:44:44 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Nov 2002 17:44:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 30503 invoked from network); 25 Nov 2002 17:44:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Nov 2002 17:44:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Nov 2002 17:44:41 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.131] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 25 Nov 2002 17:44:41 -0000 Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2002 17:44:40 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: automotive noise Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1205 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking Don't diesals use glowplugs - but an electric spark is just needed for initial start-up, then no further spark required? Phil R. --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin T." wrote: > One complete solution to automotive RF noise is to drive a diesel > car! Diesel engines don't use spark plugs, therefore one major > source of RF noise is eliminated, and they use a mechanical fuel > injection pump, therefore there is no noise from an electric fuel > pump. The only potential noise source is the alternator, but that is > fairly easily dealt with, and besides that, everything is mechanical. > Once started, you could even disconnect the battery and alternator > and it would drive fine (just with no lights and no radio). > > The newer diesel cars are starting to use some electronic controls on > the engine, but the diesel engine's design inherently will never have > any use for spark plugs (that's the whole principle of how the diesel > engine works; the fuel is so highly compressed that it ignites > itself) or an electric fuel pump, so those two major RF noise sources > still aren't there. > > Kevin T. > 1981 Mercedes 240D Diesel > 1992 VW Jetta "ECOdiesel" From philipr@irac.pe.ca Mon Nov 25 10:05:05 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Nov 2002 18:05:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 65043 invoked from network); 25 Nov 2002 18:05:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Nov 2002 18:05:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Nov 2002 18:05:04 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.177] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 25 Nov 2002 18:05:04 -0000 Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2002 18:05:04 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Car makers recognizing AM advantages Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1585 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking My wife just bought a new Mazda Protege ES GT [her previous car was 14 years old, so needless to say she's pretty proud of this fine BMW quasi-clone]. I was looking through the owners manual - under the radio section it list numerous disadvantages of FM listening in a car - and notes AM's longer range capability, ability to follow the ground over hills benefits of skywave reception etc. Lots of diagrams to explain AM's pros and FM's cons. They even did a cute little range comparison chart showing the AM advantage over FM. Nothing was said about AM having limited fidelity either. The whole "static" argument was largely ignored, focusing instead on the evils of multipath. The AM top end on the Mazda radio, while not up to that offered on the 2002 Ford Focus, is far superior to my 1994 Olds Achieva Delco radio [how I long for a Delco UX-1!]. Sensitivity seems good too. Maybe the OEM manufacturers are starting to rediscover AM. By the sound of the Mazda and especially the Focus radios, they would definetly NOT be compatible with IBOC 20 to 30 khz away. AM makes awfully good sense in a car, especially on a long trip. 10 kw CFCY and CHTN from PEI reach over most of Nova Scotia - while 75kw CHLQ [Magic 93] certainly cannot. AM radio is a big friend for travellers, and its about time that car manufacturers start touting the AM advantage. Phil R. P.S. Was a member of our group involved in writing this manual? Whoever it was must be an AM fan! It provided an awfully good layperson's explanation of AM v. FM broadcast propagation. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Nov 25 10:14:42 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Nov 2002 18:14:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 6626 invoked from network); 25 Nov 2002 18:14:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Nov 2002 18:14:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Nov 2002 18:14:42 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.252] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 25 Nov 2002 18:14:42 -0000 Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2002 18:14:40 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: automotive noise Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 821 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Don't diesals use glowplugs - but an electric spark is just needed > for initial start-up, then no further spark required? The "glow plugs" are just that -- they are electric heating elements that are used to warm up the engine prior to starting. If you took one out of the engine and applied voltage to it, you'd see it glow bright orange, like the heating elements inside a toaster. No spark is involved; the diesel fuel will easily combust itself once the temperature is high enough. With the latest diesel cars (such as VW's TDI), the glow plugs are not used at ambient temperatures above 40 degrees F -- you can just start the engine right away. FYI: a 747 jet airplane taking off a single time creates more pollution than an automobile -- gas or diesel -- does during its entire lifetime of use. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Nov 25 10:40:52 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Nov 2002 18:40:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 8193 invoked from network); 25 Nov 2002 18:40:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Nov 2002 18:40:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Nov 2002 18:40:50 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.143] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 25 Nov 2002 18:40:24 -0000 Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2002 18:40:23 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Car makers recognizing AM advantages Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2214 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > AM radio is a big friend for travellers, and its about time that > car manufacturers start touting the AM advantage. As somebody who lives and drives in an area with lots of hills and valleys, AM does indeed have better coverage. FM suffers from constant drop-outs and station-swapping due to the capture effect, and will either give you Stereo with lots of hiss and multipath, or muffled mono sound from radios with an agressive Stereo blend and high-filter circuit (as most car radios have these days). AM's groundwaves reach over the terrain and only in extreme circumstances will the signal be "shadowed" by surrounding hills. However, RF noise from power lines and other electrical devices is indeed a problem with on-the-road AM listening. Electric utility companies are legally obligated to fix any power line noise, but it can often be hard to track down; I know of many sections of power lines that create horrendous buzzing and crackling on AM one day, and then are perfectly fine the next day. Also, the proliferation of new LED-type traffic lights is a problem, as these use switching-type power supplies which can create a large amount of "IBOC-like" RF hash if not properly installed with correct filtering and grounding. There are some LED traffic lights that create little to no interference on AM, while many others will wipe out even strong AM signals with noise as you drive under them. I have contacted the manufacturers of these LED signals with no response. I then contacted the FCC about this and only got a form letter back with tips on dealing with household interference (from dimmer switches, etc.), which is totally not relevant. I also contacted the RFI liaison of the ARRL (ham radio organization) with no response. I finally contacted my local electric utility company and they say they have gotten complaints about LED traffic lights and are aware of the problem, but since it's not their equipment, they can't do anything to fix it or to ensure that new LED traffic signals are properly installed. They are also actually giving finanical benefits towards the installation of LED signals due to their lower energy consumption. Grrrr.... From alinton@esatclear.ie Mon Nov 25 10:54:15 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: alinton@esatclear.ie X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Nov 2002 18:54:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 31815 invoked from network); 25 Nov 2002 18:54:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Nov 2002 18:54:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO davros) (194.165.161.52) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Nov 2002 18:54:13 -0000 Received: from Spooler by davros (Mercury/32 v3.30) ID MO0002B1; 25 Nov 02 18:54:14 -0000 Received: from spooler by totalbroadcast.net (Mercury/32 v3.30); 25 Nov 02 18:53:45 -0000 Received: from fr1.esatclear.ie (192.168.0.1) by davros (Mercury/32 v3.30) with ESMTP ID MG0002B0; 25 Nov 02 18:53:36 -0000 Message-Id: <5.1.1.2.2.20021125184923.00b9cd10@fr1> X-Sender: alinton@fr1 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1.1.3 (Beta) Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2002 18:53:34 +0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: automotive noise In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed From: Andy Linton X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10800314 X-Yahoo-Profile: alinton1_ie At 16:01 25/11/2002 +0000, you wrote: >One complete solution to automotive RF noise is to drive a diesel >car! You reckon? Our works Land Rover Discovery (diesel) has a Sony radio, the AM isn't bad. But drive it for about an hour and suddenly a really bad crackling starts up, which sounds like several different interfering signals, some affected by engine revs, some not. AM is then totally unuseable, and FM is de-sensitized. We're pretty perplexed as to what's causing this, we suspect maybe an earthing strap somewhere. Again - advice appreciated! ----------------------------------- Andy Linton Waterford, Ireland ************************************************************** Scanned by MailScan Content-Security and Anti-Virus Software. Visit http://www.mwti.net for more info on eScan and MailScan. ************************************************************** From alinton@esatclear.ie Mon Nov 25 10:56:46 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: alinton@esatclear.ie X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Nov 2002 18:56:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 35386 invoked from network); 25 Nov 2002 18:56:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Nov 2002 18:56:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO davros) (194.165.161.52) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Nov 2002 18:56:44 -0000 Received: from Spooler by davros (Mercury/32 v3.30) ID MO0002B3; 25 Nov 02 18:56:45 -0000 Received: from spooler by totalbroadcast.net (Mercury/32 v3.30); 25 Nov 02 18:56:30 -0000 Received: from fr1.esatclear.ie (192.168.0.1) by davros (Mercury/32 v3.30) with ESMTP ID MG0002B2; 25 Nov 02 18:56:20 -0000 Message-Id: <5.1.1.2.2.20021125185424.03603688@fr1> X-Sender: alinton@fr1 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1.1.3 (Beta) Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2002 18:56:17 +0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Interfacing Alfredo with tube rig In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed From: Andy Linton X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10800314 X-Yahoo-Profile: alinton1_ie Hi all, Any suggestions please on how to interface an Alfredo AMS exciter with a tube AM transmitter? This rig has an ECH86 crystal oscillator, 807 driver and 2 813 finals. Thanks ----------------------------------- Andy Linton Waterford, Ireland ************************************************************** Scanned by MailScan Content-Security and Anti-Virus Software. Visit http://www.mwti.net for more info on eScan and MailScan. ************************************************************** From michaelj@vcn.com Mon Nov 25 11:07:59 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Nov 2002 19:07:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 88833 invoked from network); 25 Nov 2002 19:07:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Nov 2002 19:07:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m2-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.32) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Nov 2002 19:07:58 -0000 Received: from michael (vcn2.usrtc-1.evan.wy.vcn.com [209.193.86.6]) by m2-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Mon, 25 Nov 2002 12:07:58 -0700 To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} Re: Car makers recognizing AM advantages Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2002 12:07:22 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hills, eh? Try living out here in the intermountain west! Hills and mountains everywhere!! Here, we're ALWAYS dealing with lots of multi-path effects on FM. Around here, when ya get on the highway, you have tapes and/or CDs ready or ya learn to deal with the multi-path and static.....which a lot of us do. Or like ME, ya listen to AM :) On our honeymoon back in September, my wife and I went to Estes Park, Colorado. Now THAT is a town surrounded by mountains. The Denver stations don't get in there at all, and besides, my FM didn't work real well on that radio. So what'd we listen to? 560 KLZ in stereo! The WHOLE time. She didn't mind the "lite AC" format they were doing at the time. KLZ of course is one of our allies - Crawford....so the stereo sound was beautiful. Even up in Rocky Mountain National Park....that's what we listened to. Didn't have to put up with one bit of multi-path fff-f-f-ff-ffff-- or anything. Just nice steady beautiful stereo sound because AM follows the terrain and climbs right over those mountains! :) Unfortunately if we went back, we'd have to find something else to listen to now as KLZ has changed over to ESPN sports radio from what I've heard :( I've tested the LED traffic light theory now that they've converted all but one of our traffic signals here in Evanston over to LED's. These aren't new installs (although we just got a new one that is)....but instead they just replaced the incandescent bulbs with these "plates" of LED's. No intereference whatsoever around here, though. WYDOT must know what they're doing. Power line interference around town.....well...that's a different story. Pacific Power has a lot to be desired. AM reception is miserable here at my shop due to the power poles right outside that carry power, telephone from 2 telephone companies and cable (adelphia is now digital.....don't know if that makes a difference). LOTS of buzzes, squeels, and such here at the shop. Can't even pull in a clear signal from KEVA here at the shop. So here at the shop we have 4 radios all tuned in to my "shop" station.....which is running off of its own computer....about 1200 mp3's....running at AM 1000 through my Alfredo Lite. Speaking of which, in reference to another post...the coils on mine are indeed facing each other. Soldering iron is warming up as we speak so that I can turn those around to all face the same way. I'm also going to try the antenna thing with and old ferrite antenna from an old radio. MJR n WYO -----Original Message----- From: Kevin T. [mailto:kevtronics@yahoo.com] Sent: Monday, November 25, 2002 11:40 AM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: Car makers recognizing AM advantages > AM radio is a big friend for travellers, and its about time that > car manufacturers start touting the AM advantage. As somebody who lives and drives in an area with lots of hills and valleys, AM does indeed have better coverage. FM suffers from constant drop-outs and station-swapping due to the capture effect, and will either give you Stereo with lots of hiss and multipath, or muffled mono sound from radios with an agressive Stereo blend and high-filter circuit (as most car radios have these days). AM's groundwaves reach over the terrain and only in extreme circumstances will the signal be "shadowed" by surrounding hills. However, RF noise from power lines and other electrical devices is indeed a problem with on-the-road AM listening. Electric utility companies are legally obligated to fix any power line noise, but it can often be hard to track down; I know of many sections of power lines that create horrendous buzzing and crackling on AM one day, and then are perfectly fine the next day. Also, the proliferation of new LED-type traffic lights is a problem, as these use switching-type power supplies which can create a large amount of "IBOC-like" RF hash if not properly installed with correct filtering and grounding. There are some LED traffic lights that create little to no interference on AM, while many others will wipe out even strong AM signals with noise as you drive under them. I have contacted the manufacturers of these LED signals with no response. I then contacted the FCC about this and only got a form letter back with tips on dealing with household interference (from dimmer switches, etc.), which is totally not relevant. I also contacted the RFI liaison of the ARRL (ham radio organization) with no response. I finally contacted my local electric utility company and they say they have gotten complaints about LED traffic lights and are aware of the problem, but since it's not their equipment, they can't do anything to fix it or to ensure that new LED traffic signals are properly installed. They are also actually giving finanical benefits towards the installation of LED signals due to their lower energy consumption. Grrrr.... [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From michaelj@vcn.com Mon Nov 25 13:43:31 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Nov 2002 21:43:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 18237 invoked from network); 25 Nov 2002 21:43:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Nov 2002 21:43:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m1-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Nov 2002 21:43:30 -0000 Received: from michael (vcn2.usrtc-1.evan.wy.vcn.com [209.193.86.6]) by m1-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Mon, 25 Nov 2002 14:43:29 -0700 To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} Re: Alfredo Lite updates Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2002 14:42:53 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Well Chris, and all....tried it...bummer...no workie. Turned the coils all the same way. That's done and working and does seem a little stronger. Meanwhile I tried the thing with the ferrite bar and coil from an old radio. You were right, Chris. 4 wires coming off that coil. Doesn't seem to matter which 2 I choose....no matter how slow or how far down I slide the coil on the bar, doesn't make any difference. On the radio it came out of, 2 of the wires were soldered together and on a terminal on the tuning capacitor block thing. Another was attached to this long leg on the tuner (probably GND) and then the other went to a terminal on the board. One wire has a black coloring on it, one is pink like the wire color, then there's one with a red color and one with a green color. Does any of this help? Does the ferrite bar need to be grounded or something? You can tell that this is the part where things start getting over my head a bit. Wish I understood resenance and that stuff :( MJR n WYO -----Original Message----- From: Chris Cuff [mailto:amstereoguy@hotmail.com] Sent: Monday, November 25, 2002 9:36 AM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Alfredo Lite updates Thats it- You got it! CC >From: "Phil Rafuse" >Reply-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com >>I think I got it - colour codes should all be going in the same >direction. So, with two coils in series, the gold bands would not >be facing each other. With two coils in parallel, I'd assume the >leads with the gold ends would connect together. So, although not >polarized, think of the coils as capacitors or batteries, and follow >that logic. > >Thanks > >Phil R. _________________________________________________________________ Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963 Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From ccuff@in4web.com Mon Nov 25 14:12:22 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Nov 2002 22:12:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 40121 invoked from network); 25 Nov 2002 22:12:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Nov 2002 22:12:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Nov 2002 22:12:21 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.96]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Mon, 25 Nov 2002 17:00:28 -0500 Message-ID: <000701c294cd$a86cbbe0$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Alfredo Lite updates Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2002 16:57:32 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 The wire that went to the tuner was one end you want- separate the 2 joined wires- use an ohm meter to find the other end of the section you will be using. It does not get grounded. Take the ferrite right out of the wire sleeve- with the transmitter on and playing, slide it in SLOWLY and you will see all of a sudden the radio will pick up dramatically- IF the antenna you are using is any good... CC ----- Original Message ----- From: Michael J. Richard To: Sent: Monday, November 25, 2002 4:42 PM Subject: RE: {AMSF} Re: Alfredo Lite updates > Well Chris, and all....tried it...bummer...no workie. > Turned the coils all the same way. That's done and working and does seem a > little stronger. From KC4QLP@aol.com Mon Nov 25 15:13:54 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Nov 2002 23:13:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 98575 invoked from network); 25 Nov 2002 23:13:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Nov 2002 23:13:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d04.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.36) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Nov 2002 23:13:54 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.12c.1c0fc418 (1320) for ; Mon, 25 Nov 2002 18:13:49 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <12c.1c0fc418.2b1408ad@aol.com> Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2002 18:13:49 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Interfacing Alfredo with tube rig To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 11/25/02 1:57:06 PM Eastern Standard Time, alinton@esatclear.ie writes: << Hi all, Any suggestions please on how to interface an Alfredo AMS exciter with a tube AM transmitter? This rig has an ECH86 crystal oscillator, 807 driver and 2 813 finals. Thanks >> One thing is for sure .....the Alfredo lite does not have enough RF output by its self to drive the 807. You'll need to umpf it up by say 5 watts to even start playing high power AM Stereo radio. Just beware of your own countries communications rules before hooking this up to an antenna when you get that up and going ......a hundred or so watts will be heard for quite a long ways ..daytime and night time with the right antenna,and if your heard by the wrong person..ie your communcations regulator..they'll be a knockin on your door. I faded away quietly with my operation...as soon as reception reports started popping up on various dx groups..that was my sign saying.."time to exit left stage". It was fun while it lasted. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From n0uiheric@aol.com Mon Nov 25 15:16:20 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Nov 2002 23:16:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 45895 invoked from network); 25 Nov 2002 22:49:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Nov 2002 22:49:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m07.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.162) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Nov 2002 22:49:20 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-m07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id 7.84.2eb95ea (16633) for ; Mon, 25 Nov 2002 17:48:55 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <84.2eb95ea.2b1402d6@aol.com> Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2002 17:48:54 EST Subject: AM Stereo and Shortwave Converters To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih Recently, I installed an MFJ-306 shortwave converter in my 1993 Pontiac Bonneville. This converter allows for shortwave broadcasts to be converted to be heard on the AM portion of the radio (for example: WEWN Birmingham, AL, the flagship of EWTN Global Catholic Radio, broadcasts at night on 5825 kHz; the MFJ-306 converts it to be heard between 840 and 870 on the AM dial). The receiver that the converter is plugged into is not set up for AM Stereo, however (it's a Jensen AM Mono/FM Stereo radio with a CD player). This brings me to a hypothetical question. The MFJ-306 is made for car radios with digital readouts. If you plugged such a converter in to an AM Stereo/FM Stereo receiver, how will the shortwave converter affect AM Stereo reception? Right now, the converter doesn't affect AM Mono reception in the least. Will there be shortwave stations (such as, say, WBCQ Monticello, ME on 7415 or 9335 kHz) that will be "falsing", or lighting up the AM Stereo indicator? I'm just curious. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From KC4QLP@aol.com Mon Nov 25 15:19:27 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Nov 2002 23:19:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 80548 invoked from network); 25 Nov 2002 23:03:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Nov 2002 23:03:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m02.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.5) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Nov 2002 23:03:42 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id 1.11.30729f6 (1320) for ; Mon, 25 Nov 2002 18:03:35 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <11.30729f6.2b140647@aol.com> Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2002 18:03:35 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Car makers recognizing AM advantages To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 11/25/02 1:42:23 PM Eastern Standard Time, kevtronics@yahoo.com writes: << As somebody who lives and drives in an area with lots of hills and valleys, AM does indeed have better coverage. FM suffers from constant drop-outs and station-swapping due to the capture effect, and will either give you Stereo with lots of hiss and multipath, or muffled mono sound from radios with an agressive Stereo blend and high-filter circuit (as most car radios have these days). AM's groundwaves reach over the terrain and only in extreme circumstances will the signal be "shadowed" by surrounding hills. >> Amen to that! Here in the flat lands of extreme Eastern NC,if you go to the Outer Banks down around the Kitty Hawk/Nags Head dunes {it is one giant sand pile for those of you that have never seen it before} my signal here on 560 is effected on the south east side of the dune....a noticable drop in signal..especially at night can be noted as you pass on the southeast side..but once you round the other side of the dune...all is back to normal. MW signals will even travel a certain distance under water in our local bridge tunnels in the Hampton Roads area. All of the AM signals still keep coming in ....and its sad when a 70 some kilowatt FM that sits at the end of one of the tunnels in Hampton Va cant even be heard at the bottom of the tunnel. The VDOT tryed to "pipe" in the FM signals in those tunnels...it works well in one tunnel,and its a total RF mess in another. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From michaelj@vcn.com Mon Nov 25 15:29:18 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Nov 2002 23:29:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 27938 invoked from network); 25 Nov 2002 22:55:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Nov 2002 22:55:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m2-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.32) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Nov 2002 22:55:29 -0000 Received: from michael (vcn2.usrtc-1.evan.wy.vcn.com [209.193.86.6]) by m2-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Mon, 25 Nov 2002 15:44:20 -0700 To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} Re: Alfredo Lite updates Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2002 15:43:42 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 In-Reply-To: <000701c294cd$a86cbbe0$0101a8c0@pavilion> Importance: Normal From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit GOT IT!!! HOLY SHIRT CHRIS!!!! (stole your phrase, and believe it or not, that was the first thing out of my mouth. Well close anyway :) ) Talk about make a HELL of a difference!! I have my Pioneer reciever sitting here on the bench. Stuck a piece of insulated wire in the antenna jack so that it could just barely pick up the signal at all. Yet when I hook through this little coil I can get it good enough to where the signal comes in LOUD and CLEAR with no antenna! so THAT'S resonance, huh? LOVE IT! Here's what I tried for the carrier current antenna..... I took some speaker wire that I had....it's solid core 24 guage. Cut about a 2 foot length off of an old ac cord that I had....ends are insulated. Then took the speaker wire and wrapped it around and around and around that appliance cord.....kinda looks like a "coil" of sorts. Then I plug that thing into an outlet. Antenna output of the alfredo goes to the speaker wire. This should work as good as yours does, right? Seems to feed everywhere all over the building loud and clear. Can't wait to drive around outside and see how far it goes. Actual antenna is a "Car antenna rod" that's up on the roof. Comes inside through a co-axial cable. Not necessarily the best AM antenna but who knows? I know before I was getting excellent signal within blocks of this place just by having my ANTENNA output going to the cold water pipe, and the ground output going to the groud screw in the middle of an electrical outlet. Would that system still work and be maybe even stronger now with this coil? Or will the arial be better? Guess I shall see! THANKS!!! :) :) Michael n STEREO n WYO -----Original Message----- From: Christopher Cuff [mailto:ccuff@in4web.com] Sent: Monday, November 25, 2002 2:58 PM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Alfredo Lite updates The wire that went to the tuner was one end you want- separate the 2 joined wires- use an ohm meter to find the other end of the section you will be using. It does not get grounded. Take the ferrite right out of the wire sleeve- with the transmitter on and playing, slide it in SLOWLY and you will see all of a sudden the radio will pick up dramatically- IF the antenna you are using is any good... CC ----- Original Message ----- From: Michael J. Richard To: Sent: Monday, November 25, 2002 4:42 PM Subject: RE: {AMSF} Re: Alfredo Lite updates > Well Chris, and all....tried it...bummer...no workie. > Turned the coils all the same way. That's done and working and does seem a > little stronger. Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ADVERTISEMENT Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From alinton@esatclear.ie Mon Nov 25 16:18:27 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: alinton@esatclear.ie X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Nov 2002 00:18:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 94661 invoked from network); 26 Nov 2002 00:18:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Nov 2002 00:18:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO davros) (194.165.164.138) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Nov 2002 00:18:22 -0000 Received: from Spooler by davros (Mercury/32 v3.30) ID MO00030A; 26 Nov 02 00:18:26 -0000 Received: from spooler by totalbroadcast.net (Mercury/32 v3.30); 26 Nov 02 00:18:02 -0000 Received: from fr1.esatclear.ie (192.168.0.1) by davros (Mercury/32 v3.30) with ESMTP ID MG000309; 26 Nov 02 00:17:57 -0000 Message-Id: <5.1.1.2.2.20021126001617.00b8cbd8@fr1> X-Sender: alinton@fr1 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1.1.3 (Beta) Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 00:17:55 +0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Interfacing Alfredo with tube rig In-Reply-To: <12c.1c0fc418.2b1408ad@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed From: Andy Linton X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10800314 X-Yahoo-Profile: alinton1_ie At 18:13 25/11/2002 -0500, you wrote: >I > Any suggestions please on how to interface an Alfredo AMS exciter with a > tube AM transmitter? > > This rig has an ECH86 crystal oscillator, 807 driver and 2 813 finals. > > Thanks > >> >One thing is for sure .....the Alfredo lite does not have enough RF output by >its self to drive the 807. You'll need to umpf it up by say 5 watts to even >start playing high power AM Stereo radio. OK, but how could I modify the osc tube (or replace it) to accept the Alfredo input? >Just beware of your own countries communications rules before hooking this up >to an antenna when you get that up and going ... I'm aware of this, but it's a question I've been asked by someone who is located where those concerns aren't important! >. ----------------------------------- Andy Linton Waterford, Ireland ************************************************************** Scanned by MailScan Content-Security and Anti-Virus Software. Visit http://www.mwti.net for more info on eScan and MailScan. ************************************************************** From jsgil@hal-pc.org Mon Nov 25 18:15:23 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Nov 2002 02:15:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 63504 invoked from network); 26 Nov 2002 02:15:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Nov 2002 02:15:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.86) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Nov 2002 02:15:19 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.156] by n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 26 Nov 2002 02:15:19 -0000 Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 02:15:15 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: automotive noise Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1140 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.237 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin T." wrote: > > FYI: a 747 jet airplane taking off a single time creates more > pollution than an automobile -- gas or diesel -- does during its > entire lifetime of use. A bit OT Or as I heard it described to me: A jet plane puts out the same pollution on the 3 minute take off as 2300 cars do in on hour in rush hour traffic. Cars burn extremely clean nowdays as they have taken the brunt in air cleanup by the EPA. In my area when our pollution level was not low enough the EPA forced us to lower the speed limit from 70 to 55. After several lawsuits and studies showing that a speed reducion would have negligable effect on pollution the limits will be raised back up to 5mph under what they were before. Maybe we should require jet planes to burn cleaner fuel, reduce engine horespower, and be retrofitted with catalytic converters and all the other things car industry had to go through. Oh, but then this would cost an already aling industry something they can't afford and the planes might not fly after all the retrofitting. Now we can't have that can we. ;-) JSG From KC4QLP@aol.com Tue Nov 26 01:26:51 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Nov 2002 09:26:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 53024 invoked from network); 26 Nov 2002 09:26:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Nov 2002 09:26:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d03.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.35) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Nov 2002 09:26:50 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.36.323dcf14 (3842) for ; Tue, 26 Nov 2002 04:26:48 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <36.323dcf14.2b149857@aol.com> Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 04:26:47 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Interfacing Alfredo with tube rig To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10516 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 11/25/02 7:19:29 PM Eastern Standard Time, alinton@esatclear.ie writes: > OK, but how could I modify the osc tube (or replace it) to accept the > Alfredo input? > You'll need to add another stage of RF amplification from the output of your Alfredo.Then from that ,depending on how many watts of RF you get from your added stage of amplification you should be able to drive the 807 with enough RF to light off those 813's You may also need an RF tuning network between the Alfredo's amplifier and the input stage of the 807. Do a search on the net {google.com,dogpile.com,yahoo.com to name a few search engines} for low power RF amplifiers and or pirate radio transmitter and amplifier circuits....theres a gold mine of info out here on the net....just gotta dig it up. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From philipr@irac.pe.ca Tue Nov 26 05:20:09 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Nov 2002 13:20:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 98225 invoked from network); 26 Nov 2002 13:20:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Nov 2002 13:20:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Nov 2002 13:20:07 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.143] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 26 Nov 2002 13:20:06 -0000 Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 13:20:05 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Alfredo Lite coil mods Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 830 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking I spent a pleasurable 40 minutes with my Alfredo Lite, solder sucker, 15 watt soldering iron, and a little fine solder. All the coils are in the right direction now. The power output seems to have increased somewhat. What I really notice is that stereo reception with the Sony SRF-42 is way better on the A-L transmitter - easier to tune in and get good separation. On the Toyota/Panasonic rig, the separation is more obvious, and I can be pumping out a good signal on 1000 khz, then tune in CHNS on 960 [sadly, just mono] without interference - not bad as CHNS is not nearly as strong as the New York 50kwers here at night. Thanks to the good spacing on the A-L, the coil mod is pretty simple. Just be careful to use an iron at low wattage, and don't overheat the traces. It worked very well for me. Phil R. From jwelton@nautel.com Tue Nov 26 06:30:13 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jwelton@nautel.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Nov 2002 14:30:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 52849 invoked from network); 26 Nov 2002 14:30:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Nov 2002 14:30:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailserver.nautel.com) (24.222.4.134) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Nov 2002 14:30:12 -0000 Received: FROM jeff-welton BY mailserver.nautel.com ; Tue Nov 26 10:32:05 2002 -0400 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 10:29:40 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: {AMSF} Alfredo Lite coil mods Message-ID: <3DE34D0D.14238.8E3979@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.02a) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body From: "Jeff Welton" Reply-To: jwelton@nautel.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=26918678 > I spent a pleasurable 40 minutes with my Alfredo Lite, solder > sucker, 15 watt soldering iron, and a little fine solder. All the > coils are in the right direction now. Guys, I had been just sitting here, skimming over the last few days of messages, when I got to these ones. Normally, I try to lay low, but I've got to jump in here. YOU CAN NOT PUT A RADIAL INDUCTOR (lead on each end, looks like a resistor) IN BACKWARDS. There is no way. Period. Try an experiment. Take some solder or wire, whatever. Wind it clockwise around a pencil. Turn the pencil around - the wire is still wound clockwise. You can WIND an inductor backward, but on a pre-wound component, it absolutely does not matter which way it is installed in a circuit. Sorry for the rant, this is one of those things that lights my fuse. I got to witness an in-depth audiophile discussion of why the resistors with the silver tolerance stripe were so much better than the ones with the red stripe a few weeks ago (apparently, the resistors with the silver stripe make an amplifier sound much "warmer" than the red resistors, which give an "overly crisp" reproduction) - I'm still shaking my head!!! BTW, silver strip is 10% tolerance, red is 2%. Going back to my corner now (quit smoking 10 days ago, still a little edgy!) Regards, Jeff Welton Nautel Customer Service Dept. Tel.: 1-902-823-3900 ext. 127 Fax: 1-902-823-3183 email: jwelton@nautel.com From michaelj@vcn.com Tue Nov 26 06:36:17 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Nov 2002 14:36:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 75713 invoked from network); 26 Nov 2002 14:36:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Nov 2002 14:36:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m2-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.32) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Nov 2002 14:36:16 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m2-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Tue, 26 Nov 2002 07:36:16 -0700 Message-ID: <001101c29559$2cd0bae0$0701010a@keva> To: References: <3DE34D0D.14238.8E3979@localhost> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Alfredo Lite coil mods Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 07:36:14 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Umm...Chris? I think you just got yelled at. I'll just leave it at that. I don't know NEARLY enough about this stuff to argue. :D MJR n WYO ----- Original Message ----- From: Jeff Welton To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, November 26, 2002 7:29 AM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Alfredo Lite coil mods YOU CAN NOT PUT A RADIAL INDUCTOR (lead on each end, looks like a resistor) IN BACKWARDS. There is no way. Period. Try an experiment. Take some solder or wire, whatever. Wind it clockwise around a pencil. Turn the pencil around - the wire is still wound clockwise. You can WIND an inductor backward, but on a pre-wound component, it absolutely does not matter which way it is installed in a circuit. Sorry for the rant, this is one of those things that lights my fuse. I got to witness an in-depth audiophile discussion of why the resistors with the silver tolerance stripe were so much better than the ones with the red stripe a few weeks ago (apparently, the resistors with the silver stripe make an amplifier sound much "warmer" than the red resistors, which give an "overly crisp" reproduction) - I'm still shaking my head!!! BTW, silver strip is 10% tolerance, red is 2%. Going back to my corner now (quit smoking 10 days ago, still a little edgy!) Regards, Jeff Welton Nautel Customer Service Dept. Tel.: 1-902-823-3900 ext. 127 Fax: 1-902-823-3183 email: jwelton@nautel.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From groucho@skyweb.net Tue Nov 26 07:24:56 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Nov 2002 15:24:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 19418 invoked from network); 26 Nov 2002 15:24:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Nov 2002 15:24:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Nov 2002 15:24:56 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gAQFTcxi007289 for ; Tue, 26 Nov 2002 10:29:38 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DE39217.D708CD95@skyweb.net> Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 10:24:07 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Alfredo Lite updates References: <000201c293b2$09ed3ec0$0101a8c0@pavilion> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Ill chime in here for just one Comment on this... I think the guy from nautel may have a point however. I have seen this before... years ago as an apprentice Electrician I was nailed while working on some control wiring that was NOT terminated at the far End..with a Volt meter I discovered 90 volts AC on all the Control wires.. they were in a 2 Inch pipe running parallel with a group of 4 inch pipes with 500MCM power cables that were live feeding a huge printing press... about 600 feet or so In length... the Control wires became Inductively Live.. in that 500-600 feet the 2 pipes Became a linear inductive transformer. the 500MCM being the primary. and the Control wires the secondary. It was a learning experience to say the least.. NOW as for these inductor Coils being reversed.. its like Audio... If they are Close enough to each other and they are wound in reverse you can get Inductive Phase cancellation. I do allot Of Audio work.. recently During a repair job of a blown 2" JBL driver I discovered that the Company after all these years decided to finally Wind the Voice coils correct... For Years JBL2" voice coil drivers you needed to make the Black lead.(negative) the Positive and RED lead the Negative... so that the PA Systems would be In Phase when Running a 3-4 way system.. Now the Replacement Coils(Diaphrams) are Correct so you wire them RED to Red Black to Black..... So I believe that's what Chris discovered by accident is like the voice Coils being wound in reverse changes the Phase relationship In speakers to each other thus cancelling out the audio Most noticeable in the subs (Bass).. By placing all the coils in the same direction Providing that the Manufacturer wound and marked them all the same way he is putting them all In Phase. this may or may not affect the way the stereo generator drives the rest of the exciter( now Im guessing where these Inductors are in the Circuit). and why we now see a stronger stereo imaging Because its now IN Phase... when they are reversed with each other and OUT of Phase the Audio Cancels and the Imaging is not quite there... that's Exactly How I see it..... funny thing this also reminds me of My days at IBM when I was in Robotics.. I did multi layer PC board drafting( before they had CAD systems we did this by hand with Mylar and Tape) and I built prototype boards..there were all these guys I was working with they all had degrees Masters,Phd's in Electrical Engineering... and would always Say " in theory it should work" I had no degree at the time. and Lots of practical and would show them Why it would not work... Looked great on paper. ,But not in the real world. so in the Case of these inductors.... in theory it should not make a difference but in the real world It does...... Neal From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Nov 26 08:33:30 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Nov 2002 16:33:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 60742 invoked from network); 26 Nov 2002 16:33:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Nov 2002 16:33:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Nov 2002 16:33:29 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.167] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 26 Nov 2002 16:33:29 -0000 Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 16:33:27 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Alfredo Lite updates Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3DE39217.D708CD95@skyweb.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1552 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > NOW as for these inductor Coils being reversed.. its like Audio... > If they are Close enough to each other and they are wound in > reverse you can get Inductive Phase cancellation. Note that in audio, absolute phase also matters, not just relative phase between the two channels. Human voices naturally have greater negative peaks than positive peaks when viewed as a waveform, and when you flip the phase around so that these peaks come out on the positive side, people have noticed that the sound quality is just not as good. As your example indicated, we can't really trust equipment manufacturers to be correct when they label their positive speaker leads as "+" and the negative leads as "-", but it still may be beneficial to check that speakers are wired + to + and - to -, rather than just having the speakers in phase with each other, which may actually mean you have + going to - and - going to +. This issue isn't helped by inconsistent highlighting of speaker wires. I always thought the highlighted wire (of the two) was the positive lead, but I have a number of stereo systems which insist that the highlighted wire is the negative lead. And don't you love it when you go to an electronics store, and most of the stereo systems have their speakers wired out-of-phase? Maybe they think that "inside-your-head" sound is "cool". Speaking of which, I have an old Realistic receiver with an "IMX Stereo Expander" circuit that works even in mono AM mode. Turning it on just basically makes the sound out-of-phase. From jwelton@nautel.com Tue Nov 26 11:02:56 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jwelton@nautel.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Nov 2002 19:02:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 39458 invoked from network); 26 Nov 2002 19:02:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Nov 2002 19:02:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailserver.nautel.com) (24.222.4.134) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Nov 2002 19:02:55 -0000 Received: FROM jeff-welton BY mailserver.nautel.com ; Tue Nov 26 15:04:46 2002 -0400 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 15:02:18 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: {AMSF} Alfredo Lite coil mods Message-ID: <3DE38CF1.4220.187D49B@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: <001101c29559$2cd0bae0$0701010a@keva> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.02a) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body From: "Jeff Welton" Reply-To: jwelton@nautel.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=26918678 Marv: Thanks for the morale booster re: quitting smoking. BTW, I've had two messages bounced from your globility@fanfare.com address, which is the reason for this post to the group - sorry for the bandwidth usage. All: I've calmed down a little (deep breathing exercises) - sorry if I got a little wound up previously. Best, Jeff Welton Nautel Customer Service Dept. Tel.: 1-902-823-3900 ext. 127 Fax: 1-902-823-3183 email: jwelton@nautel.com From jsgil@hal-pc.org Tue Nov 26 11:26:52 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Nov 2002 19:26:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 71860 invoked from network); 26 Nov 2002 19:26:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Nov 2002 19:26:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Nov 2002 19:26:51 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.191] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 26 Nov 2002 19:26:51 -0000 Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 19:26:51 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Alfredo Lite coil mods Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3DE34D0D.14238.8E3979@localhost> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1738 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.230 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Jeff Welton" wrote: > > I spent a pleasurable 40 minutes with my Alfredo Lite, solder > > sucker, 15 watt soldering iron, and a little fine solder. All the > > coils are in the right direction now. > > Guys, I had been just sitting here, skimming over the last few days of > messages, when I got to these ones. Normally, I try to lay low, but I've got > to jump in here. > > YOU CAN NOT PUT A RADIAL INDUCTOR (lead on each end, looks like a resistor) IN > BACKWARDS. There is no way. Period. > > Try an experiment. Take some solder or wire, whatever. Wind it clockwise > around a pencil. Turn the pencil around - the wire is still wound clockwise. > You can WIND an inductor backward, but on a pre-wound component, it absolutely > does not matter which way it is installed in a circuit. This is pretty much what I thought to but I didn't want to be that blunt about it so I gave a more indirect theory. I got to > witness an in-depth audiophile discussion of why the resistors with the silver > tolerance stripe were so much better than the ones with the red stripe a few > weeks ago (apparently, the resistors with the silver stripe make an amplifier > sound much "warmer" than the red resistors, which give an "overly crisp" > reproduction) - I'm still shaking my head!!! BTW, silver strip is 10% > tolerance, red is 2%. > All those 10% resistors cause more even harmonic distortion 2th, 4th, 6th... where the 2% ones maintain better positive to negative waveform symetry. Some models of Boogie guitar tube amplifiers use different values of resistors (82K & 91K) on the plates of the phase splitter that drives the output tubes just for this porpose. JSG From philipr@irac.pe.ca Tue Nov 26 11:58:11 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Nov 2002 19:58:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 14421 invoked from network); 26 Nov 2002 19:58:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Nov 2002 19:58:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Nov 2002 19:58:10 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.144] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 26 Nov 2002 19:58:10 -0000 Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 19:58:10 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Alfredo Lite coil mods - straying OT here! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2926 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking Well, maybe the sweet smell of solder put me in an altered state of consciousness - thus providing an enhanced stereo effect! But seriously, the very tangible difference I noticed last night was how much easier it was to tune in the SRF-42 and yet get a good stereo effect. Maybe my hands were extra steady, maybe the humidity was just right, maybe it was the phases of the moon - or maybe something of a phase nature truly was going on. Four of these coils were, according to the schematic, in the QUAM section - which as I understand it, is very much the realm of phasing. I'm not sure what happened, I'm more confused than ever, but the A-L seems to work even better than before. I've always found phasing to be mystifying yet fascinating. It is true that some audiofile types bask in rather absurd notions. Take audio coupling capacitors, for example. I can buy into the idea that a non-polarized electrolytic capacitor or a mylar capacitor etc. etc. may sound a bit nicer than a garden variety polarized electrolytic, but when one brand of mylar capacitor is supposed to sound 'richer, meatier and more full of emotion' than another brand of mylar capacitor, I think of marketing hocus pocus rather than advanced audio engineering. Of course, if you pay $20 for an exotic capacitor rather than 59 cents, you are going to want to hear better sound, and perhaps our brains try to prevent us from feeling ripped off by perceiving an improvement in audio quality. That's not to say that there is never a difference, but sometimes it does seem a little ridiculous. We've all heard of the tubes v. transistors debate - I always just assumed that tube amplifiers are invariably warmer sounding than transistor amps. Well, that is until I built a little tube amp kit that is not exactly warm sounding. But, what detail to the mids! Lyrics leap out - full of meaty emotion...or does it just sound awesome because I built it myself? [lol at self] Phil R. --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Phil Rafuse" wrote: > I spent a pleasurable 40 minutes with my Alfredo Lite, solder > sucker, 15 watt soldering iron, and a little fine solder. All the > coils are in the right direction now. The power output seems to > have increased somewhat. What I really notice is that stereo > reception with the Sony SRF-42 is way better on the A-L transmitter - > easier to tune in and get good separation. On the Toyota/Panasonic > rig, the separation is more obvious, and I can be pumping out a good > signal on 1000 khz, then tune in CHNS on 960 [sadly, just mono] > without interference - not bad as CHNS is not nearly as strong as > the New York 50kwers here at night. > > Thanks to the good spacing on the A-L, the coil mod is pretty > simple. Just be careful to use an iron at low wattage, and don't > overheat the traces. It worked very well for me. > > > > Phil R. From philipr@irac.pe.ca Tue Nov 26 12:21:34 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Nov 2002 20:21:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 86105 invoked from network); 26 Nov 2002 20:21:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Nov 2002 20:21:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.66) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Nov 2002 20:21:34 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.185] by n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 26 Nov 2002 20:21:34 -0000 Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 20:21:33 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Capacitor "taste test" OT Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 466 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking Coke or Pepsi? Tube or Solid State? For discriminating listeners, may I offer the following capacitors=20 to please your auditory palete? CAPACITOR, MUSICAP, COUPLING, 3 =B5F @ 200 VDC=20 This capacitor has exceptional dynamics, speed, focus, correct=20 timbre and depth of field. True inter-transient silence.=20 .92" diameter x 2.88" length.=20 $24.29=20 Ok, Ok, I get the picture, I'll order, let's see... Qty 1,000,000 Phil R. P.S. I hope the leads are gold plated From jwelton@nautel.com Tue Nov 26 12:56:57 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jwelton@nautel.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Nov 2002 20:56:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 23113 invoked from network); 26 Nov 2002 20:56:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Nov 2002 20:56:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailserver.nautel.com) (24.222.4.134) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Nov 2002 20:56:56 -0000 Received: FROM jeff-welton BY mailserver.nautel.com ; Tue Nov 26 16:58:49 2002 -0400 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 16:56:24 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: {AMSF} Capacitor "taste test" OT Message-ID: <3DE3A7AD.24600.1F044CA@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.02a) Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: Quoted-printable Content-description: Mail message body From: "Jeff Welton" Reply-To: jwelton@nautel.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=26918678 > CAPACITOR, MUSICAP, COUPLING, 3 =B5F @ 200 VDC=20 >=20 > This capacitor has exceptional dynamics, speed, focus, correct=20 > timbre and depth of field. True inter-transient silence.=20 > .92" diameter x 2.88" length.=20 > $24.29=20 ROFL - thanks, Phil, I needed that!!! Ummm - those are the non-polarized caps for true bidirectional symmetry of= =20 electron flow, right? I'll take a couple dozen, as well. Thanks, Jeff Welton Nautel Customer Service Dept. Tel.: 1-902-823-3900 ext. 127 Fax: 1-902-823-3183 email: jwelton@nautel.com From alfredot@inetarena.com Tue Nov 26 13:02:05 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: alfredot@inetarena.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Nov 2002 21:02:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 31651 invoked from network); 26 Nov 2002 21:02:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Nov 2002 21:02:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.inetarena.com) (206.129.216.13) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Nov 2002 21:02:03 -0000 Received: from hendrie (1Cust126.tnt16.beaverton.or.da.uu.net [67.227.163.126]) by mail.inetarena.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id gAQL08T01304 for ; Tue, 26 Nov 2002 13:00:08 -0800 (PST) Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 13:01:50 -0800 (PST) X-Sender: alfredo@hendrie.1610am.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: AM Stereo modulation & audio processing In-Reply-To: <1038237378.1191.6724.m12@yahoogroups.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: "Alfredo E. Torrejon" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=25132238 X-Yahoo-Profile: alfredotorrejon > I think the Analog Devices SSM2166 is still made but is only > available as SMD. It is primarily used as a microphone speech > processor and is popular among Ameteur Radio for use as a power > mike. It has an adjustable compression ratio from 1:1 to 15:1 > and many other features. > > BTW, are these multiband compressors parametric or are the > crossover points fixed. And if so what are the most popular > crossover points for a 4 band compressor. On the prototype units, there was a choice of three different frequencies for each of the crossover points-- Band1-2: 80, 120, or 160 Hz Band2-3: 650, 1050, or 1300 Hz Band3-4: 3.9, 6.0, or 7.5 kHz I used three position switches rather than pots because the latter approach would have required four-gang potentiometers. I found that the best choice of frequencies depends on the program material, and needs to be determined by listening. For instance, if you had the first of the crossover points set at 80 Hz, your processing might do a good job in handling the heavy synthesized bass beat of hip-hop or techno music, but might not do such a great job with the bass guitar that you'd find in rock or blues. On the compressor that I was recently using as part of a low-powered AM Stereo station, I had the crossover points set at 160, 1050, and 3900 Hz. The 3900 Hz was kind of a "default" selection because of the 10kHz audio bandwidth. I don't remember exactly how I settled on 1050 Hz, but I do remember why I picked 160 Hz--despite that intuitively, I would think that using 160 Hz would make the bass too "muddy." If I used 80 or 120 Hz, the bass would have a "hollow" sound without a lot of "punch" because in the program material that I was broadcasting, there wasn't a lot of audio that low in the spectrum. Using 160 Hz, with the appropriate gain and compression setting created the effect I was looking for: it put a modest amount of emphasis on the bass instruments (mainly electric bass guitars), giving them a "full" sound that was not muddy. Alfredo P.S.: I had a spare SSM2120 IC, and I used that to build a gated AGC processor. I really wish that Analog Devices hadn't discontinued these ICs because they were so versatile and easy to use. The only close substitute that I know of is that "Analog Engine" IC line made by THAT Corporation (http://www.thatcorp.com/) From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Tue Nov 26 13:35:35 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Nov 2002 21:35:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 85188 invoked from network); 26 Nov 2002 21:35:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Nov 2002 21:35:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14204.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.146) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Nov 2002 21:35:34 -0000 Message-ID: <20021126213534.13336.qmail@web14204.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.45.202.244] by web14204.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 26 Nov 2002 13:35:34 PST Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 13:35:34 -0800 (PST) Subject: Human Brain, v1.000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio Neal said: ..."PC board drafting( before they had CAD systems we did this by hand with Mylar and Tape)" Me too, and these boards always worked - amazing isn't it - the human brain can actually be better than a computer becuase you can remember past problems much better than 'it works on paper'. Hey - just like IBOC AM - it looks like it ought to work on paper, but it doesn't in the real world skywave / groundwave low bit rate, etc... __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From groucho@skyweb.net Tue Nov 26 14:45:10 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Nov 2002 22:45:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 76804 invoked from network); 26 Nov 2002 22:45:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Nov 2002 22:45:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Nov 2002 22:45:10 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gAQMnqxi074620 for ; Tue, 26 Nov 2002 17:49:52 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DE3F93A.8A2A28A2@skyweb.net> Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 17:44:11 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Alfredo Lite coil mods - straying OT here! References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 > It is true that some audiofile types bask in rather absurd notions. Yeah some of them even think that the arrows on Monster cable tells what direction the Electrons should Flow... DUHHHH audio is AC.. the Electrons are Confused Because they go back and Forth... Gee what would happen if audio output from an amp was Digital. It would sound Like the HISS on 700 and 720kc but AudioFiles would still say the Digital sounds better... LOL Neal From crashknorr@yahoo.com Tue Nov 26 16:08:05 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: crashknorr@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Nov 2002 00:08:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 96711 invoked from network); 27 Nov 2002 00:08:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Nov 2002 00:08:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Nov 2002 00:08:04 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.191] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Nov 2002 00:08:04 -0000 Date: Wed, 27 Nov 2002 00:08:00 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Alfredo Lite coil mods Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <001101c29559$2cd0bae0$0701010a@keva> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 287 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "crashknorr" X-Originating-IP: 198.190.223.150 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=20677990 X-Yahoo-Profile: crashknorr Somebody with an oscilloscope could solve this arguement. Measure the power output with coils alledgedly "in backwards" and again after allegedly fixed. Check modulation linearity while you're at it. Anecdotal reports are crap. It's easy to fool yourself with the placebo effect. From jsgil@hal-pc.org Tue Nov 26 17:22:33 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Nov 2002 01:22:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 96285 invoked from network); 27 Nov 2002 01:22:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Nov 2002 01:22:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Nov 2002 01:22:32 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.157] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Nov 2002 01:22:32 -0000 Date: Wed, 27 Nov 2002 01:22:30 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: AM Stereo modulation & audio processing Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1987 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.230 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Alfredo E. Torrejon" > On the prototype units, there was a choice of three different > frequencies for each of the crossover points-- > Band1-2: 80, 120, or 160 Hz > Band2-3: 650, 1050, or 1300 Hz > Band3-4: 3.9, 6.0, or 7.5 kHz > > I used three position switches rather than pots because the latter > approach would have required four-gang potentiometers. I found that the > best choice of frequencies depends on the program material, and needs to > be determined by listening. I know that a crosover freq. of 200Hz is popular for subwoofers and using a 3rd order active filter works great when bi-amping. I guess the bass could sound muddy since a 160Hz 1st order would only attenuate 320Hz by 6db. I think Bose chose 180Hz as the crossover point for their first acoustimass system. Most tweeter crossovers are around 6-7KHz and I would think that would make a good fixed point to crossover at. As for the middle crossover point I guess that could be made variable. The others could be fixed 3rd order low pass & high pass active filters for good stop band attenuation. From what it sounds like your three position (4 gang?) switches are set up for 1st order passive filters, a high pass & low pass for each channel. I know when bi or tri amping it is desireable to use at least 3rd order filters and that the order is odd since even order ones can caues nulling effects at the crossover frequency. Active filters are great but they do cost more. Could you image what a parametric 3rd order filter would cost and that it would be overly complex. For one crossover point the low pass filters for 2 channels would require a 6 gang pot and the high pass would require 3 different values in a 6 gang pot. All in all if you wanted all 4 filters to operate from 1 control it would require a custom manufactured 12 gang pot. Maybe some of the most expensive multi-band compressors use something like this or maybe not. JSG From jeffdeck@aol.com Tue Nov 26 17:25:45 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: Jeffdeck@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Nov 2002 01:25:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 3537 invoked from network); 27 Nov 2002 01:25:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Nov 2002 01:25:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d05.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Nov 2002 01:25:45 -0000 Received: from Jeffdeck@aol.com by imo-d05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.14f.17e6dc0c (18251); Tue, 26 Nov 2002 20:25:42 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <14f.17e6dc0c.2b157916@aol.com> Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 20:25:42 EST Subject: Re: Alfredo Lite updates To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Cc: amstereo@bellsouth.net MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10638 From: jeffdeck@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=4430287 X-Yahoo-Profile: jeffdeck2001 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit All, If the coil is not mutually coupling to another coil, it is irrelevant which direction it is mounted flush on the board. When coils are coupled to other coils, such as in a transformer, then it certainly matters which direction the coil faces (look at the schematic diagrams of virtually any AM radio, you will see "hot" and "cold" wires for the AM loop and interstage I.F transformers). A "dot" for each winding may be present, to signify the phasing of the coupling coils with respect to each other. Ask any utility power line electrician about phasing, and what would happen if a 365kV step down transformer was not properly connected. Also radios with AM loop antennas do not have any "real" antenna; the magnetic lines of flux are enhanced by the ferrite material, so the coil electrically "appears" larger than it actually is in physical space. When you move the ferrite in and out of the coil, you are changing the inductance and resonance of the antenna's tuned circuit. SAT, Terk, and Radio Shack external antennas receive more stations than many unaided ferrite bar antennas due to their physically larger area to capture the AM wavelength (which is several hundred feet). Tuned circuit resonates the super antenna to specific frequency. I measured 30 dB RF gain using my Terk AM Advantage antenna, compared to the unaided ferrite bar in my Realistic TM-152 AM stereo tuner. Regarding stereo speaker connections to audio amplifier, it does not matter which side of the speaker connects to " + " and " - " of the amplifier, as long as all speaker connections are consistent to the amplifiers. You can connect your speaker's " + " lead to the amplifier's " - " terminal, as long as all speaker " + " leads connect to all amplifier " - " terminals. Phasing is lost if this is not practiced, which distorts the stereo and surround sound fields. It does not matter if you use the stripe on the speaker cable for either the " + " or " - " polarity. Also, "monster cable" is not worth the expense in many cases. Ensure that your speaker wire gauge is sufficient to exceed the current carried in the wire for the given distance, and it will be fine. Low frequency damping factor will not be compromised. In RF circuits, there are usually "hot and "cold" sides to vertically mounted axial lead resistors, and it can make a difference how these resistors are oriented and soldered to the circuit board. 73, Jeff In a message dated 11/26/2002 11:34:24 AM Eastern Standard Time, you write: >>NOW as for these inductor Coils being reversed.. its like Audio... >>If they are Close enough to each other and they are wound in >>reverse you can get Inductive Phase cancellation. > >Note that in audio, absolute phase also matters, not just relative >phase between the two channels. Human voices naturally have greater >negative peaks than positive peaks when viewed as a waveform, and >when you flip the phase around so that these peaks come out on the >positive side, people have noticed that the sound quality is just not >as good. > >As your example indicated, we can't really trust equipment >manufacturers to be correct when they label their positive speaker >leads as "+" and the negative leads as "-", but it still may be >beneficial to check that speakers are wired + to + and - to -, rather >than just having the speakers in phase with each other, which may >actually mean you have + going to - and - going to +. > >This issue isn't helped by inconsistent highlighting of speaker >wires. I always thought the highlighted wire (of the two) was the >positive lead, but I have a number of stereo systems which insist >that the highlighted wire is the negative lead. > >And don't you love it when you go to an electronics store, and most >of the stereo systems have their speakers wired out-of-phase? Maybe >they think that "inside-your-head" sound is "cool". > >Speaking of which, I have an old Realistic receiver with an "IMX >Stereo Expander" circuit that works even in mono AM mode. Turning it >on just basically makes the sound out-of-phase. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From stodd@sherbtel.net Tue Nov 26 17:46:31 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Nov 2002 01:46:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 25401 invoked from network); 27 Nov 2002 01:46:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Nov 2002 01:46:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Nov 2002 01:46:29 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-110.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.110]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gAR1kQN2001808 for ; Tue, 26 Nov 2002 19:46:27 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <000801a8ea50$a76c6420$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <36.323dcf14.2b149857@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Interfacing Alfredo with tube rig Date: Fri, 4 Jan 1980 04:10:22 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Not so fast there- you don't want to use the output of the Alfredo- that's a composite CQUAM signal. What you want to do is tap the signal going INTO the last NE-602 chip, which is amplitude limited L-R. Then add an amp stage or two to get enough drive and feed it where the crystal would normally go. Scott Todd ----- Original Message ----- From: > You'll need to add another stage of RF amplification from the output of your > Alfredo.Then from that ,depending on how many watts of RF you get from your > added stage of amplification you should be able to drive the 807 with enough > RF to light off those 813's From stodd@sherbtel.net Tue Nov 26 18:06:25 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Nov 2002 02:06:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 21197 invoked from network); 27 Nov 2002 02:06:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Nov 2002 02:06:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Nov 2002 02:06:19 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-110.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.110]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gAR26FN2006916 for ; Tue, 26 Nov 2002 20:06:17 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <001c01a8ea53$6c7f8600$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <000201c293b2$09ed3ec0$0101a8c0@pavilion> <3DE39217.D708CD95@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Alfredo Lite updates Date: Fri, 4 Jan 1980 04:30:11 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Similar effects, but different phenomena. With speakers, the air movement from the speaker pushing gets cancelled by the air from the one pulling. With inductors you have one magnetic field opposing another. Still, using Jeff's idea of winding a coil around a pencil leads me to believe he's right, unless there's something else in the construction of those little critters that would cause it not to be true, they should be able to be installed either way, since they aren't creating opposing fields. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Neal Newman" > So I believe that's what Chris discovered by accident is like the voice Coils > being wound in reverse changes the Phase relationship In speakers to each other > thus cancelling out the audio Most noticeable in the subs (Bass).. From stodd@sherbtel.net Tue Nov 26 18:11:22 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Nov 2002 02:11:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 44284 invoked from network); 27 Nov 2002 02:11:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Nov 2002 02:11:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Nov 2002 02:11:22 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-110.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.110]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gAR2BIN2008198 for ; Tue, 26 Nov 2002 20:11:19 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <002e01a8ea54$20f381e0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: AM Stereo modulation & audio processing Date: Fri, 4 Jan 1980 04:35:14 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude The EH Scott Company used 150Hz as their crossover freq. in their big biamped radios of the 30s and 40s. It was chosen because there is almost no voice energy below 150, so 160 is a good choice for a reason you probably didn't consider. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Alfredo E. Torrejon" > I don't remember exactly how I settled on > 1050 Hz, but I do remember why I picked 160 Hz--despite that intuitively, > I would think that using 160 Hz would make the bass too "muddy." From stodd@sherbtel.net Tue Nov 26 18:17:11 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Nov 2002 02:17:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 89665 invoked from network); 27 Nov 2002 02:17:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Nov 2002 02:17:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Nov 2002 02:17:10 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-110.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.110]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gAR2H7N2009750 for ; Tue, 26 Nov 2002 20:17:08 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <004601a8ea54$f0debdc0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Capacitor "taste test" OT Date: Fri, 4 Jan 1980 04:41:03 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude The hams on the AM Window message board have a term for folks like that- audiophools, as in "An audiophool and his money are soon parted." ;) ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Phil Rafuse" > For discriminating listeners, may I offer the following capacitors > to please your auditory palete? > > CAPACITOR, MUSICAP, COUPLING, 3 µF @ 200 VDC > > This capacitor has exceptional dynamics, speed, focus, correct > timbre and depth of field. True inter-transient silence. > .92" diameter x 2.88" length. > $24.29 > > Ok, Ok, I get the picture, From jsgil@hal-pc.org Tue Nov 26 21:04:36 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Nov 2002 05:04:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 187 invoked from network); 27 Nov 2002 05:04:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Nov 2002 05:04:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Nov 2002 05:04:35 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.157] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Nov 2002 05:04:35 -0000 Date: Wed, 27 Nov 2002 05:04:35 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Capacitor "taste test" OT Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <004601a8ea54$f0debdc0$827dfea9@home1> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 476 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.154 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Scott Todd" wrote: > The hams on the AM Window message board have a term for folks like that- > audiophools, as in "An audiophool and his money are soon parted." ;) > > ST Funny Some audiophools will tell you that they can tell the difference between the phase of the speakers if the woofer goes in on the initial strike of the bass drum instead of coming out. Something about a decrease in room pressure instead of an increase. From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Tue Nov 26 22:19:28 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Nov 2002 06:19:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 53482 invoked from network); 27 Nov 2002 06:19:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Nov 2002 06:19:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14207.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.173.71) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Nov 2002 06:19:27 -0000 Message-ID: <20021127061927.65693.qmail@web14207.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [65.221.47.68] by web14207.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 26 Nov 2002 22:19:27 PST Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 22:19:27 -0800 (PST) Subject: CCrane Radio per them To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio Here's the response that I got back from C Crane regarding audio frequency response for their radio: "Re: Technical Questions on the CCRadio Plus Thank you for your inquiry! In a normal noisy environment everything above 2.0 KHz is just static and white noise. The knob at center is 1.8 KHz, but turning the treble can increase the response. If it is filtered it is 6.0 KHz." So gang, does the audio go up to 6KHz, or whopped-off at 2KHz? They did not reply to my question about stereo AM. __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From evergreenterrace@buzzle.com Tue Nov 26 22:45:18 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: evergreenterrace@buzzle.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Nov 2002 06:45:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 96027 invoked from network); 27 Nov 2002 06:45:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Nov 2002 06:45:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Nov 2002 06:45:17 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.139] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Nov 2002 06:45:16 -0000 Date: Wed, 27 Nov 2002 06:45:15 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: GE 3-5280B Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 550 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgliradio" X-Originating-IP: 129.44.33.45 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=69711087 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgliradio Just one this baby on e-Bay EXCELLENT AM.... sensitive and wideband. With the AM and FM (which is very selective), you can tell the tuning section is from the SuperRadio II. Bass and Treble and FM AFC just like the GE SuperRadio I & II. Antenna terminals on rear and a CASSETTE DECK to make airchecks of the wideband AM (cassette deck has settings for Cr02 and Nornal bias tape). For sure an overlooked radio It does need some work, the controls are dirty and the deck is out of alignment and a tad slow.... but I think it can be fixed! From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Nov 26 23:21:56 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Nov 2002 07:21:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 27239 invoked from network); 27 Nov 2002 07:21:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Nov 2002 07:21:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.69) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Nov 2002 07:21:56 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.132] by n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Nov 2002 07:21:56 -0000 Date: Wed, 27 Nov 2002 07:21:55 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: AM Stereo modulation & audio processing Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2170 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.81.6 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Most tweeter crossovers are around 6-7KHz and I would think that > would make a good fixed point to crossover at. The main issue with selecting a crossover point for the treble processing is that vocal sibilance (when somebody pronounces the letter "S" strongly) will easily overmodulate the signal (and try to go past 100% negative modulation, causing a nasty "spitting" sound) and needs to be well-controlled for broadcast use. Most vocal sibilance occurs between 5 and 10 kHz, although today's highly pre-processed CD audio can extend it all the way to 20 kHz and beyond, even from male voices. Thus, the crossover shouldn't be set much above 5 kHz, as the treble processing is tuned to deal with sibilance while the midrange processing is more relaxed and wouldn't be able to properly deal with sibilance if its upper limit was set too high. In addition, strong high frequency percussion effects (like a cymbal crash) need to be properly limited as well. This is the real killer for FM, whose aggressive pre-emphasis curve equates to as much as a 17 dB boost at 15 kHz -- thus, the highs have to be really "squashed down" in order to achieve good modulation without exceeding the FCC limits. This can turn detailed musical features like hi-hats and drum brushes into just continuous white noise, because the high frequency pulses in the audio are so highly compressed, limited, and clipped. In comparison, this can make AM sound more crisp and vibrant than FM, even with its 10 kHz audio response limit, because rather than have the high treble (10-15 kHz) squashed to death, it is simply removed entirely and your imagination is allowed to fill in those high frequencies for you. Meanwhile, this allows the four or five bands of the station's audio processing to each concentrate on a narrower range of frequencies, allowing it to preserve more detail in the sound, especially from voice and from instruments which emphasize the mid-range, such as the piano and acoustic guitar. On a good AMAX receiver, this allows AM to sound more "open" and "natural" than FM, especially when combined with AM Stereo's matrix processing. From KC4QLP@aol.com Tue Nov 26 23:37:08 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Nov 2002 07:37:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 79326 invoked from network); 27 Nov 2002 07:37:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Nov 2002 07:37:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m08.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.163) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Nov 2002 07:37:08 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.141.394d442 (30950) for ; Wed, 27 Nov 2002 02:37:01 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <141.394d442.2b15d01d@aol.com> Date: Wed, 27 Nov 2002 02:37:01 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Interfacing Alfredo with tube rig To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 11/26/02 8:47:50 PM Eastern Standard Time, stodd@sherbtel.net writes: > Not so fast there- you don't want to use the output of the Alfredo- that's a > composite CQUAM signal. What you want to do is tap the signal going INTO > the last NE-602 chip, which is amplitude limited L-R. Then add an amp > stage > or two to get enough drive and feed it where the crystal would normally go. > > Scott Todd > Yeah I forgot about that "little" detail on the good ol Alfredo .....guess it would be helpful if I had one of these babies of my own. BTW...gonna get real busy around here now. The other engineer just quit today...so now its all up to me......again! hmmm...sleeping and eating...is that really necessary?...lol Neal I saw that you connected on Echolink earlier...looks like were just gonna have to set up a schedule. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From bjackson@indyradio.com Wed Nov 27 06:23:36 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Nov 2002 14:23:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 92762 invoked from network); 27 Nov 2002 14:23:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Nov 2002 14:23:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.86) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Nov 2002 14:23:36 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.173] by n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Nov 2002 14:23:36 -0000 Date: Wed, 27 Nov 2002 14:23:35 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Tuesday Night DX Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1218 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923" X-Originating-IP: 168.103.253.1 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 Last night seemed to be a great night to DX the east coast from Indianapolis... I caught 1680 WTTM in stereo as if it were a local station. It was around 8pm here...The music was a pretty good indication that I had the right station. Then, I heard a spot for a New Jersey restaurant and an English promo for the website. I also caught WOR (even next to WLW!). On my Carver tx-11a, WOR sounds like they run low bandwidth (5khz) audio, even in non-IBOC hours...Is this right or were my ears fooling me? And for the first time I had WFAN...But didn't get the stereo light on...Did WFAN ever get back into stereo? Also, I've found out that with the Radio Shack AM loop, I can usually get KCJJ (but not last night) in stereo with a pretty decent signal. Wow...Amazing processing. Some friends and I sat around Saturday night listening to the Saturday Night Retro show (One of them even tried calling in for a contest). On a side note...does anyone know if KCII in Washington Iowa is still doing music? I interviewed for a job out there a few years ago...No comment on why I didn't take the job ;-) -Brad Jackson -Susquehanna, Indianapolis -WGLD www.gold1045.com -WGRL www.retro939.fm -WFMS www.wfms.com From philipr@irac.pe.ca Wed Nov 27 06:59:21 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Nov 2002 14:59:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 43983 invoked from network); 27 Nov 2002 14:59:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Nov 2002 14:59:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.84) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Nov 2002 14:59:21 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.154] by n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Nov 2002 14:59:21 -0000 Date: Wed, 27 Nov 2002 14:59:18 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Alfredo Lite coil mods Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2454 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking The power output seems to > have increased somewhat. What I really notice is that stereo > reception with the Sony SRF-42 is way better on the A-L transmitter - > easier to tune in and get good separation. > > > Phil R. Chris came up with this idea and noted improvements, I tried them, and I certainly noticed improved ease of tuning on my SRF-42 to get a clear, obvious stereo effect. I agree that there appears, after hearing explainations from some very knowledgeable folks, to be no scientific basis for this. So, we have two people noting improvements, yet no apparent scientific basis. Has anyone else tried this mod? If so, what is your opinion on it? Speak up and be counted! I'm wondering if this could be related to lead length, part positioning or something of that nature? Or, is there something pecular as to how these little mini-chokes are wound? I'm assuming that they are simply tiny coils, with or without a ferrite form, then dipped in epoxy and with the colour code stamped on them. In other words, I'm assuming that these little things aren't constructed with, say a metallic film shield on top of the tiny coil of wire which is then connected to one lead. When I did my mod, I took 2 chokes of of the set of 4, rearranged them, then 1 out of the set of 2. When I re-installed them, I did install them a bit tighter to the PC board. Is it possible that this would affect things? When I resoldered one of the chokes in the QUAM section, I got it ever so slightly crooked - maybe a 1/16 of an inch. I used a bit more solder too. My hunch is no, we are dealing with one or so megahertz, not 1 or so gigahertz. But, I firmly believe there has been an improvement in the ability of the SRF-42 to tune in and latch on to the Alfredo Lite's CQUAM signal. Which suggests to me that maybe, just maybe, my Alfredo Lite is now doing a better job at broadcasting a stable, reliable stereo signal. Could it be that this operation resulted in a better [or worse] solder joint that is responsible for this? However, Chris's soldering looked darn good to me! So, in summary, if you are curious, enjoy soldering and have the right gear, you may want to try this mod anyway. The PC board is roomy, there are no adjacent solid state devices etc. Just be cautious about the traces. I'm glad I tried this suggestion. Somehow, something got changed, and my rig does work even better. Phil R. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Wed Nov 27 07:29:30 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Nov 2002 15:29:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 76199 invoked from network); 27 Nov 2002 15:29:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Nov 2002 15:29:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Nov 2002 15:29:29 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.158] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Nov 2002 15:29:23 -0000 Date: Wed, 27 Nov 2002 15:29:21 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Tuesday Night DX Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 863 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > I also caught WOR (even next to WLW!). On my Carver tx-11a, WOR > sounds like they run low bandwidth (5khz) audio, even in non-IBOC > hours...Is this right or were my ears fooling me? At night with the IBOC off, 710 WOR limits their audio response to 6 kHz. Even on a typical narrow-bandwidth radio, the difference between WOR's audio and that of other full-response AM stations is immediately noticeable. WOR also seems to cut out the low bass response, as if they have a 150 Hz high-pass filter installed. > And for the first time I had WFAN...But didn't get the stereo light > on...Did WFAN ever get back into stereo? Unfortunately no, and I have heard that WFAN's C-Quam exciter has been removed, even though they did not initially entertain offers to acquire it, due to the remote chance of them possibly returning to AM Stereo broadcasting. From michaelj@vcn.com Wed Nov 27 07:57:57 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Nov 2002 15:57:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 88784 invoked from network); 27 Nov 2002 15:57:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Nov 2002 15:57:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m2-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.32) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Nov 2002 15:57:46 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m2-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Wed, 27 Nov 2002 08:57:46 -0700 Message-ID: <006401c2962d$b9839be0$0701010a@keva> To: Subject: AM Stereo in Wyo Date: Wed, 27 Nov 2002 08:57:43 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi gang I know from time to time y'all ask me how the stereo stations are here in my little corner of the world. Things are still great. One update.....I was wondering one day while listening to KMER-Kemmerer....which I converted back in February.... and noticed it was mono. This had been going on for a few weeks and I was getting scared that the exciter had died or something went wrong. It's really scary especially now that I don't work for them anymore and if something goes wrong, I can't fix it. Couple of days ago I gave Jim a call over there and asked him about it. Looks like for some reason or another, someone had just turned the pilot off and hit the MONO button on the front of the exciter. He didn't remember what he was doing at the time or why he had to do that, but he just oops-ed. That's all :) I was listening to the car radio at the time, and on the cell phone with him. I told him I was just curious, that's all. As I said "I know I may be the only one listening in stereo or that cares, but I really do like to listen and hear the oldies in stereo."....so he pushed the buttons while we were on the phone and fixed it. Back in stereo. Beautiful sound of the oldies. And actually, he must have changed out a tube or two recently....I know back in February one of the modulators was starting to go pretty flat. When I was in Kemmerer back in May or June....I noted that there was some distortion in the right channel. It's gone now and sounds wonderful. So AM Stereo 950 KMER Good Time Oldies is now back in stereo after a short hiatus. Meanwhile here at my baby....KEVA...things are beautiful. Have still been having problems with that "spiking" and volume popping up and popping down on the air monitor. That's been a problem from the start, but I think I finally fixed it last week. I say this because I believe this may be of some help to the rest of you out there that have a genuine Motorola C-Quam stereo modulation monitor. On the rear of the monitor there is a rotary switch that has several settings to control the attenuation of the RF going into the unit.....i.e..local RF off the transmitter or RF coming from an RF amplifier and so forth. I think THIS switch has been the culprit. I exercised it really well and I haven't had popping since. That was almost a week ago. Meanwhile the monitor is sounding great again.....about a week ago I got the replacement IC for the blown one that caused the monitor to loose a channel. All fixed and sounding marvelous. So Southwest Wyoming's 2 AM Stereo stations are doing just great. Since the air check made directly off of the air monitor didn't really impress anyone, I'm thinking of bringing in my laptop soon and making some more air checks from my SRF-42. Things do sound a little better these days as a little while back I was able to tweak things a little and get some better separation. Will keep all posted! MJR n STEREO n WYO [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From amstereoguy@hotmail.com Wed Nov 27 08:40:37 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereoguy@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Nov 2002 16:40:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 33816 invoked from network); 27 Nov 2002 16:40:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Nov 2002 16:40:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (207.68.165.110) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Nov 2002 16:40:36 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 27 Nov 2002 08:40:29 -0800 Received: from 208.228.96.20 by sea2fd.sea2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Wed, 27 Nov 2002 16:40:29 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Alfredo Lite coil mods Date: Wed, 27 Nov 2002 11:40:29 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 27 Nov 2002 16:40:29.0305 (UTC) FILETIME=[B1F70690:01C29633] From: "Chris Cuff" X-Originating-IP: [208.228.96.20] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37866059 I had 10 of these that I made all at one time. All had identical antennas and inputs. I noticed 4 of them were a tad weaker than the others. Thats when I noticed the opposing coils in the weak sets. Turning them all in the same direction cured every one. Thats MY basis. Remember, the bumble bee , by the laws of physics, cannot fly..... :-) Chris _________________________________________________________________ The new MSN 8: smart spam protection and 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail From kevtronics@yahoo.com Wed Nov 27 09:16:02 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Nov 2002 17:16:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 50933 invoked from network); 27 Nov 2002 17:16:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Nov 2002 17:16:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Nov 2002 17:16:00 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.189] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Nov 2002 17:16:00 -0000 Date: Wed, 27 Nov 2002 17:15:59 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: eBay finds Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 499 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics Here's a chance to own one of the nicest AM Stereo car radios that Delco ever made, with AMAX certification, Expanded Band tuning, and automatic Dynamic Noise Reduction: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1941048774 Sony SRF-42 Walkman in original box, current bid price $51.00: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=740164744 Sherwood tuner in Australia, showing AM Stereo reception of Magic 693: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1941304097 From amfmdx@fastq.com Wed Nov 27 09:47:48 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Nov 2002 17:47:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 86446 invoked from network); 27 Nov 2002 17:47:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Nov 2002 17:47:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Nov 2002 17:47:47 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt (d117-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.149]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gARHljv17883 for ; Wed, 27 Nov 2002 10:47:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <003b01c2963c$e97eca40$4ef9bed8@kredding430cdt> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} GE 3-5280B Date: Wed, 27 Nov 2002 10:46:26 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > EXCELLENT AM.... sensitive and wideband. With the AM and FM (which > is very selective), you can tell the tuning section is from the > SuperRadio II. I had one of these. They needed help from day one. If you peak them up, then they are fine receivers. You WILL have to mess around with it to be a real hot receiver but it can be done. > Bass and Treble and FM AFC just like the GE SuperRadio I & II. Essentially what it is, is a SR II with a cassette player. > Antenna terminals on rear and a CASSETTE DECK to make airchecks of > the wideband AM (cassette deck has settings for Cr02 and Nornal bias > tape). The antenna terminals are useless. > It does need some work, the controls are dirty and the deck is out of > alignment and a tad slow.... but I think it can be fixed! Yeah, they can be fixed and once done its a real nice unit. Kevin From jwelton@nautel.com Wed Nov 27 11:46:39 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jwelton@nautel.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Nov 2002 19:46:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 83229 invoked from network); 27 Nov 2002 19:46:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Nov 2002 19:46:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailserver.nautel.com) (24.222.4.134) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Nov 2002 19:46:36 -0000 Received: FROM jeff-welton BY mailserver.nautel.com ; Wed Nov 27 15:46:26 2002 -0400 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Date: Wed, 27 Nov 2002 15:43:55 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Alfredo Lite coil mods ...and inductor polarity ;-) Message-ID: <3DE4E835.26413.1D93517@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.02a) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body From: "Jeff Welton" Reply-To: jwelton@nautel.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=26918678 > Thats MY basis. Remember, the bumble bee , by the laws of physics, cannot > fly..... :-) Remembering that open minds receive more information than closed ones, I went hunting on the theory that it is possible for it to make a difference which way an inductor is installed. I found some interesting things (including the possibility that bumblebees CAN fly!!!). First, I discovered that monster cables are available in many different configurations and tradenames - and that there are conflicting arguments as to which is best (don't ask how a search for "inductor moulded shielded construction" got all the hits for audio cables that it did - must be a Google thing!). Interestingly enough, some companies claim that shielding your high performance audio cables is bad: http://www.ear-usa.com/townshendcables.htm while others say it's good: http://www.dynamicsoundaudio.com/cable.htm I found it interesting that site #2, which promotes shielding, also recommends the cables sold on site #1, but removes the reference from #1's description that says cables should NOT be shielded!!! Anyway, back to inductor theory. A search of the US patent office turned up the process for manufacturing a moulded inductor (non-shielded in this case, but that doesn't really matter for our purpose) http://appft1.uspto.gov/netahtml/PTO/search-adv.html Enter the term "bead inductor" (including quotation marks) in the query box and click on result #3 to find out how they are made - you may need to download a TIFF plug-in for certain browsers - takes about 30 seconds on a high speed connection and there is a link through the Patent office's help page. The description indicates my theory was correct in that the orientation has no effect on the current flow or magnetic field, hence on mutual coupling.... but! The core is a ferrite powder/epoxy/rubber compound. I can see where every time one of these is soldered, heat transfer from the lead would change the characteristics of the core, causing effective inductance to change - possibly only slightly, but it would still change. In addition, it could have an effect on capacitance, which is the killer in inductors - less capacitance means lower Q, means "purer inductance" and slightly broader tuning characteristics. So I can see how removing a component and reinserting it could have an effect - whether it was reversed or even put in the same way. Further, there will be a point where repeated removal and reinsertion start to cause the opposite effect - the characteristics of the core change enough to move the inductance far enough from original that you pass the optimum and start to detune your circuit. I found this theory to be kind of fascinating - I don't usually pay a lot of attention to how these things are made, but it's making me reassess the used parts bin at home - maybe some things should not be used more than a few times! Regardless, I guess the point is that I can see where Phil and Chris could have realized changes by removing and resoldering the inductors. I'm still not convinced that orientation had anything to do with it, as mutual coupling is typically not a huge consideration at the frequencies and power levels being dealt with. However, I can't argue with results. There have been too many times here I've had the engineering team tell me that a specific mod shouldn't work, when I've seen it solve the problem. "Looks good on paper" is not just an expression! Anyway, thought the manufacturing info on how these little parts get put together might be of interest to some. BTW, just to get something on topic - I was at the CJCH site last Thursday - for the interest of the group they are running the Delta ASE-1 C-QUAM exciter, works like a champ. Must have been set up by a pro when it was installed. Maybe they called someone from the transmitter factory to come do it! (k', enough back patting!) Regards, Jeff Welton Customer Service Dept. Nautel Ltd. Tel.: 1-902-823-3900, ext. 127 Fax: 1-902-823-3183 jwelton@nautel.com From groucho@skyweb.net Wed Nov 27 13:29:49 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Nov 2002 21:29:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 16485 invoked from network); 27 Nov 2002 21:29:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Nov 2002 21:29:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Nov 2002 21:29:46 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gARLYTxi054080 for ; Wed, 27 Nov 2002 16:34:30 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DE53927.2EAEEAA6@skyweb.net> Date: Wed, 27 Nov 2002 16:29:11 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} eBay finds References: X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit That Delco radio is Sold..... I bought it to replace the dead radio In the Wife's car... Neal CE-WTTM "he who looks and does not Buy It Now looses" "Kevin T." wrote: > Here's a chance to own one of the nicest AM Stereo car radios that > Delco ever made, with AMAX certification, Expanded Band tuning, and > automatic Dynamic Noise Reduction: > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1941048774 > > Sony SRF-42 Walkman in original box, current bid price $51.00: > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=740164744 > > Sherwood tuner in Australia, showing AM Stereo reception of Magic 693: > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1941304097 > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From amstereoguy@hotmail.com Wed Nov 27 13:53:55 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereoguy@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Nov 2002 21:53:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 59271 invoked from network); 27 Nov 2002 21:53:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Nov 2002 21:53:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (207.68.165.129) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Nov 2002 21:53:54 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 27 Nov 2002 13:53:54 -0800 Received: from 208.20.8.41 by sea2fd.sea2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Wed, 27 Nov 2002 21:53:54 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Cc: dxer2_2000@hotmail.com Bcc: Subject: Re: Eurovox car radio Date: Wed, 27 Nov 2002 16:53:54 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 27 Nov 2002 21:53:54.0602 (UTC) FILETIME=[7ACBA0A0:01C2965F] From: "Chris Cuff" X-Originating-IP: [208.20.8.41] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37866059 Hi! Sorry I can't help- Never saw one here in New York before- I know that those security codes are a problem too- I have a great Mercededs radio that is useless because of that. I will forward your question to our AM stereo users group however, maybe someone on our list from Down Under can help- I will let you know. Chris >From: "dxer2_2000 of Cooma" >To: amstereoguy@hotmail.com >Subject: Eurovox car radio >Date: Thu, 28 Nov 2002 08:49:07 +1100 > >Dear Sir >Can you tell me if the Eurovox 6315 OE model has AM stereo? This came out >of a 1985 Holden Camira (Australia). I know that GM Holden placed AM stereo >units in cars around 1985. > >Also, is there a way around its security code. The dealer can't remember >the 4 digit code (of course!!!). > >Thanks for the help > >dxer2_2000 > > > _________________________________________________________________ Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963 From davidcoons@webtv.net Wed Nov 27 16:05:30 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: davidcoons@webtv.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Nov 2002 00:05:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 71575 invoked from network); 28 Nov 2002 00:05:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Nov 2002 00:05:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO smtpout-2001-1.public.lawson.webtv.net) (209.240.212.81) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Nov 2002 00:05:29 -0000 Received: from storefull-2311.public.lawson.webtv.net (lawson-public-ipmux-1-pip-7.public.lawson.webtv.net [209.240.212.98]) by smtpout-2001-1.public.lawson.webtv.net (WebTV_Postfix+sws) with ESMTP id E28E6BFB6 for ; Wed, 27 Nov 2002 16:05:28 -0800 (PST) Received: (from production@localhost) by storefull-2311.public.lawson.webtv.net (8.8.8-wtv-f/mt.gso.26Feb98) id QAA26819; Wed, 27 Nov 2002 16:05:28 -0800 (PST) X-WebTV-Signature: 1 ETAsAhQKJZKgXK/lEyjjBb+76AbuvsdozAIUY5DqM14t4WSZMtgAcvFvLX83HyE= Date: Wed, 27 Nov 2002 19:05:28 -0500 (EST) To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} CCrane Radio per them Message-ID: <5072-3DE55DC8-378@storefull-2311.public.lawson.webtv.net> In-Reply-To: "John P." 's message of Tue, 26 Nov 2002 22:19:27 -0800 (PST) Content-Disposition: Inline Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) X-eGroups-From: davidcoons@webtv.net (David Coons) From: davidcoons@webtv.net X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10533228 ccrane radio is a joke.ask them why they promote it as as having the" full rich sound of the human voice" "for the best sound possible" my voice is not limited to 2k! and if they are all that concerned about white noise,why is the amp full of hiss and distortion?anyone thinking of getting one save your money.buy a select-a-tenna and any cheap digital radio and you will be as good as the ccr or better! From kevtronics@yahoo.com Wed Nov 27 18:26:04 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Nov 2002 02:26:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 54796 invoked from network); 28 Nov 2002 02:26:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Nov 2002 02:26:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Nov 2002 02:26:02 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.253] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Nov 2002 02:26:02 -0000 Date: Thu, 28 Nov 2002 02:26:01 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Eurovox car radio Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 579 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.81.12 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics >> Can you tell me if the Eurovox 6315 OE model has AM stereo? This >> came out of a 1985 Holden Camira (Australia). I know that GM >> Holden placed AM stereo units in cars around 1985. If it's anything like this Eurovox MCC-2358P radio from an Aussie 1986 Porsche, then it will have a small "AM-STEREO-FM" logo, indicating its Stereo capability on both the AM and FM bands: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=803079294 Note the picture on the manual showing it tuned to 1377 kHz AM with the STereo indicator lit... that probably was a free promo for 3MP. From amfmdx@fastq.com Wed Nov 27 19:02:03 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Nov 2002 03:02:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 8306 invoked from network); 28 Nov 2002 03:02:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Nov 2002 03:02:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Nov 2002 03:02:02 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt (d7-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.39]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gAS320v37191 for ; Wed, 27 Nov 2002 20:02:00 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <017901c2968a$55a00980$4ef9bed8@kredding430cdt> To: References: <5072-3DE55DC8-378@storefull-2311.public.lawson.webtv.net> Subject: DX radios are not audiophile radios.... Date: Wed, 27 Nov 2002 20:00:38 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > ccrane radio is a joke. It isn't what they say... BUT! It is a good to above average DXradio for the casual DXer. Its not the best AM radio ever made but its better than about 90-95% for DXing > ask them why they promote it as as having the" > full rich sound of the human voice" "for the best sound possible" my > voice is not limited to 2k! First of all, its got a 6 kHz filter not 2k. Think about what they are saying. Anyone with a brain the size of a walnut knows that when they say that its best for the human voice is saying that this radio reproduces sound like crap because it only covers about 6 kHz. All radios that say they reproduce the human voice are saying this. Gotta think about what they are saying. With 6 kHz thats all its gonna reproduce. THIS IS WHAT DXING RADIOS DO. THEY NARROW THE BANDWIDTH TO REJECT EXTRANEOUS SIGNALS. This radio is not sold saying that its a Bose Wave Radio with full reproduction of the signal its given. And yes, the Bose isn't perfect either because there is no AM stereo on it. The CCRadio is sold as having the range of the human voice. No human voice goes to 50 Hz or to 20 kHz. Yes the reproduction sucks but the radio is sold as a DX radio. You guys need to understand the difference between DX radios and audiophile radios. DX radios pick up stations and have NARROW bandwidth to do it. Audiophile radios have wide bandwidth and sound great but they don't pick up jack $#!+. Sorry, thats about the size of things. As close as I have seen is the Zenith Royal 2000 Trans Symphony which is not bad as a DXer but surely no where near great, a GE SR III which sounds better than the other SR series and will DX ok but it isn't meant to DX either, and the best wide DX radio is the GE P780 which hasnt been made in aeons. It will DX but not as well as a narrow bandwidth radio like the Sony 2010 which sounds like crap but will pick up any signal that other radios don't even see. > and if they are all that concerned about > white noise,why is the amp full of hiss and distortion? My CCRadio is not like this. Maybe if you have one, you have one that needs work. > anyone thinking > of getting one save your money.buy a select-a-tenna and any cheap > digital radio and you will be as good as the ccr or better! Its not worth the $160 price tag but its a good to above average DXer. Its not made to be a audiophile radio. I wish you guys on the list could understand that radios are like tools. Radios are made to do different things. You will never find a radio that will do everything. Its not made and DX and good sound DO NOT go together with todays technology. Its just not made. The CCRadio is not sold as a audiophile unit. Its sold as a DX unit. It does a decent job as a DX radio, although its not the best ever made. Kevin Mesa, Arizona From davidcoons@webtv.net Wed Nov 27 19:19:48 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: davidcoons@webtv.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Nov 2002 03:19:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 13793 invoked from network); 28 Nov 2002 03:19:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Nov 2002 03:19:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO smtpout-2001-3.public.lawson.webtv.net) (209.240.212.83) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Nov 2002 03:19:46 -0000 Received: from storefull-2313.public.lawson.webtv.net (lawson-public-ipmux-1-pip-1.public.lawson.webtv.net [209.240.212.22]) by smtpout-2001-3.public.lawson.webtv.net (WebTV_Postfix+sws) with ESMTP id 59FBDBF86 for ; Wed, 27 Nov 2002 19:19:45 -0800 (PST) Received: (from production@localhost) by storefull-2313.public.lawson.webtv.net (8.8.8-wtv-f/mt.gso.26Feb98) id TAA22631; Wed, 27 Nov 2002 19:19:46 -0800 (PST) X-WebTV-Signature: 1 ETAtAhREUoVgN2R4a0Tmis4Wwi/1A5FuywIVAIy8sYIb9EUFyTkc6vmaM8fbwejl Date: Wed, 27 Nov 2002 22:19:45 -0500 (EST) To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} DX radios are not audiophile radios.... Message-ID: <25573-3DE58B51-842@storefull-2313.public.lawson.webtv.net> In-Reply-To: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" 's message of Wed, 27 Nov 2002 20:00:38 -0700 Content-Disposition: Inline Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) X-eGroups-From: davidcoons@webtv.net (David Coons) From: davidcoons@webtv.net X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10533228 the radio is sold to people who will do domestic dxing .10k channel with a 5k flat response,low distortion and super selectivity ,sensitivity can easily be made surpasing ,overall the ccradio...I had one.its nothing more than the typical sangean digital sw receiver with a longer ferrite rod..and since its sold primarily for am use how about a usable treble control,instead of the one they have ,peaked at 10k..narrow ban width can certainly be made to sound better with proper "tone" control From evergreenterrace@buzzle.com Wed Nov 27 21:11:26 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: evergreenterrace@buzzle.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Nov 2002 05:11:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 38250 invoked from network); 28 Nov 2002 05:11:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Nov 2002 05:11:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.68) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Nov 2002 05:11:25 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.140] by n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Nov 2002 05:11:24 -0000 Date: Thu, 28 Nov 2002 05:11:24 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: GE 3-5280B Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <003b01c2963c$e97eca40$4ef9bed8@kredding430cdt> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 610 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgliradio" X-Originating-IP: 129.44.32.165 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=69711087 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgliradio --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" wrote: > I had one of these. They needed help from day one. If you peak them up, then > they are fine receivers. You WILL have to mess around with it to be a real > hot receiver but it can be done. Actually the tuner seems just fine out of the box (and most likely unmodified from the original owner). Next to my SuperRadio, it's very competitive with better bandwidth. > The antenna terminals are useless. Haven't opened it up yet. Did realign the heads and give the outside a good once over. Have to bench it after the holiday! From kevtronics@yahoo.com Wed Nov 27 22:17:52 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Nov 2002 06:17:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 33328 invoked from network); 28 Nov 2002 06:17:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Nov 2002 06:17:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Nov 2002 06:17:51 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.181] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Nov 2002 06:17:51 -0000 Date: Thu, 28 Nov 2002 06:17:50 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: DX radios are not audiophile radios.... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <017901c2968a$55a00980$4ef9bed8@kredding430cdt> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 1939 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.81.12 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > First of all, its got a 6 kHz filter not 2k. That's 6 kHz *RF* bandwidth, not audio bandwidth. AM is double- sideband, so thus the CCRadio has an AM audio response of about 3 kHz -- no more. > THIS IS WHAT DXING RADIOS DO. THEY NARROW THE BANDWIDTH TO REJECT > EXTRANEOUS SIGNALS. Better say that is what CHEAP DXing radios do. With an inherently=20 good design, using multiple stages of Tuned RF circuitry, you don't=20 need to narrow the bandwidth to achieve good sensitivity and=20 selectivity. Does the CCRadio even use Tuned RF, let alone double- conversion? The C.Crane catalog doesn't say anything about it. Some of the best DXing radios were made decades ago. I have a classic=20 1950s vacuum tube Hallicrafters AM/shortwave reciever and its=20 reception is amazing; it can easily distinguish stations 5 kHz apart=20 on the shortwave bands, and the noise floor is extremely low, so very=20 weak signals can be received without having them swamped out with=20 background noise. Yet, it has a nearly "barn door" bandwidth; with=20 it, I have heard true 15+ kHz audio response from the few "hi-fi"=20 shortwave stations like Radio Exterior de Espa=F1a, as you can hear=20 from this MP3 recording: http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/ree-sw.mp3 > The CCRadio is not sold as a audiophile unit. Its sold as a DX > unit. Then how come C.Crane claims in their catalog that it has better=20 sound quality than the GE Superadio III? From their description of the Superadio III, which they sell horribly=20 overpriced at $64.95 each: "Good audio quality compared to other=20 AM/FM portable radios, except perhaps our CCRadio Plus." Nevermind the difference in AM bandwidths, the CCRadio is a smaller=20 radio with a smaller speaker, and thus even on FM it is always going=20 to sound tinny and dull in comparison to the GE's atonishingly full,=20 rich, crisp sound (thanks to a hefty 6-inch woofer, 2-inch tweeter,=20 and wide-range Bass and Treble controls). From kevtronics@yahoo.com Wed Nov 27 22:29:44 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Nov 2002 06:29:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 30889 invoked from network); 28 Nov 2002 06:29:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Nov 2002 06:29:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Nov 2002 06:29:41 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.129] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Nov 2002 06:29:41 -0000 Date: Thu, 28 Nov 2002 06:29:41 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: eBay finds Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3DE53927.2EAEEAA6@skyweb.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 462 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.81.12 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > That Delco radio is Sold..... I bought it to replace the dead > radio In the Wife's car... > Neal > CE-WTTM > "he who looks and does not Buy It Now loses" For those who are interested, here is a very close-up photo of the Delco AMAX radio: http://mywebpages.comcast.net/klingers/ebay/scott1.jpg Tweak up the graphic equalizer a bit, make sure the "Am-St" button is engaged, and be prepared to be blown away when you tune in 1680 WTTM the first time! From kevtronics@yahoo.com Wed Nov 27 22:29:47 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Nov 2002 06:29:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 49440 invoked from network); 28 Nov 2002 06:29:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Nov 2002 06:29:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Nov 2002 06:29:47 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.147] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Nov 2002 06:29:38 -0000 Date: Thu, 28 Nov 2002 06:29:35 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: eBay finds Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3DE53927.2EAEEAA6@skyweb.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 462 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.81.12 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > That Delco radio is Sold..... I bought it to replace the dead > radio In the Wife's car... > Neal > CE-WTTM > "he who looks and does not Buy It Now loses" For those who are interested, here is a very close-up photo of the Delco AMAX radio: http://mywebpages.comcast.net/klingers/ebay/scott1.jpg Tweak up the graphic equalizer a bit, make sure the "Am-St" button is engaged, and be prepared to be blown away when you tune in 1680 WTTM the first time! From alfredot@inetarena.com Wed Nov 27 22:59:06 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: alfredot@inetarena.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Nov 2002 06:59:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 10426 invoked from network); 28 Nov 2002 06:59:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Nov 2002 06:59:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.inetarena.com) (206.129.216.13) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Nov 2002 06:59:03 -0000 Received: from hendrie (1Cust142.tnt17.beaverton.or.da.uu.net [65.227.179.142]) by mail.inetarena.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id gAS6v8T01229 for ; Wed, 27 Nov 2002 22:57:08 -0800 (PST) Date: Wed, 27 Nov 2002 22:58:48 -0800 (PST) X-Sender: alfredo@hendrie.1610am.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Interfacing Alfredo with tube rig In-Reply-To: <1038316810.2577.98255.m9@yahoogroups.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: "Alfredo E. Torrejon" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=25132238 X-Yahoo-Profile: alfredotorrejon > >One thing is for sure .....the Alfredo lite does not have enough RF output by > >its self to drive the 807. You'll need to umpf it up by say 5 watts to even > >start playing high power AM Stereo radio. > > OK, but how could I modify the osc tube (or replace it) to accept the > Alfredo input? What if you ran the exciter input to the grid of the oscillator tube (so as to make it function like a preamp)? You'd have to disable the feedback in the oscillator, and how/if that's possible depends on the design of the oscillator circuit. Do you have a schematic that could be viewed online? Alfredo From alfredot@inetarena.com Wed Nov 27 23:42:04 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: alfredot@inetarena.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Nov 2002 07:42:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 75968 invoked from network); 28 Nov 2002 07:42:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Nov 2002 07:42:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.inetarena.com) (206.129.216.13) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Nov 2002 07:42:02 -0000 Received: from hendrie (1Cust142.tnt17.beaverton.or.da.uu.net [65.227.179.142]) by mail.inetarena.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id gAS7e5T05743 for ; Wed, 27 Nov 2002 23:40:06 -0800 (PST) Date: Wed, 27 Nov 2002 23:41:51 -0800 (PST) X-Sender: alfredo@hendrie.1610am.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Alfredo Lite coil mods In-Reply-To: <1038325709.82.1857.m12@yahoogroups.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: "Alfredo E. Torrejon" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=25132238 X-Yahoo-Profile: alfredotorrejon > Guys, I had been just sitting here, skimming over the last few days of > messages, when I got to these ones. Normally, I try to lay low, but I've got > to jump in here. > > YOU CAN NOT PUT A RADIAL INDUCTOR (lead on each end, looks like a resistor) IN > BACKWARDS. There is no way. Period. When I built the original prototype transmitter, I tried to minimize unwanted coupling between the coils by putting each pysically at 90 degrees with respect to its nearest neighbor. This simply meant that one coil would be mounted flush against the board and its neighbor would be inserted in "hairpin" fashion. However, the above claim about there being no way to put radial inductors "in backwards" is correct. You can think of it the way that Jeff describes it or think of it this way: when you "flip over" one of these coils, you also reverse the direction of current flow through the wire in the coil, so the polarity of the magnetic field coming off the coil doesn't change. The only way that you could flip the polarity of the magnetic field is by changing the direction in which the wire is wound around the coil (i.e. winding the coil by spinning the coil form clockwise instead of counterclockwise). I think this second scenario is what might have happened in Neal's speaker example. Remember the "right-hand-rule" from physics.* Alfredo * Go to http://purcell.phy.nau.edu/SeatExpts/resource/rhr/rhr.htm and scroll down to "Right-Hand Rule #2 (RHR #2)." From philipr@irac.pe.ca Thu Nov 28 05:56:14 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Nov 2002 13:56:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 14049 invoked from network); 28 Nov 2002 13:56:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Nov 2002 13:56:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.75) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Nov 2002 13:56:12 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.190] by n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Nov 2002 13:56:12 -0000 Date: Thu, 28 Nov 2002 13:56:10 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: DX Radios and other Quasi-OT ramblings etc. Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2610 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking One way of approaching having your cake and eating it too [DX and HiFi]is the simple use of an appropriate bandwidth switch. So many SW portables, of the modern variety, use a two position wide/narrow switch. 'Wide' equates to 6 or 7 khz of RF bandwith - e.g. audio response of up to 3000 or so Hz. Narrow usually = 4 khz of rf bandwidth and, you guessed it - audio up to about 2000 Hz. For my liking, the 2000 hz response is useless - while it does reduce adjacent channel interference, it muffles the human voice so badly that I'd rather try to use my grey matter to filter out Radio Netherlands out of the background [or even foreground] of some exotic DX, rather than have the exotic catch so muffled I cannot understand what they are saying. To me, the Sony 2010 has it right - for a DX radio, at wide, the audio is up to 4500 HZ flat on wide, with nice clear sound on AM and SW, less so on narrow. I agree that there is no such thing as the perfect radio - they all have their strong and weak points - my justification to my wife for having so many! Unfortunately, I have an ICF-SW77, not a 2010, and I'm tired of the muffled, garbled sound even on wide, and the useless synch detector, that either won't lock in, or, if it does, causes grotesque distortion. Yes, its an early 77, but still, I wish it were a 2010. Of course, my fantasy is a multipurpose portable with the following bandwidths: 18 khz [audio up to 9000 Hz]"DX HiFi - similar to a Heath PT-1" 9 khz [audio up to 4500 Hz] "more extreme DX, retaining good vocal clarity" 4.5 khz [audio up to 2250 hz]"extreme DX, including SSB" and, a little 3 band parametric EQ built in, to make the most of these bandwidths! Moving to home tuners and HiFi, with my PT-1, I can do a surprising amount of DX in the wide mode, which is almost identical to true AMAX. The PT-1, according to its manual, is ruler flat to 6000 Hz [audio], 6 db down at 9000 Hz, followed by a massive drop due to the whistle filter at about 9500 or so Hz, folloed by a partial recovery. While a tuner, and not a radio per se, It would be my #1 favourite. #2 would be my ZTO1000D, #3 my ZTO H500, #4 my SR III, #5 my SW77. Phil R. P.S. One DX radio with narrow filters I do like is the Grundig YB400. While even "wide" is pretty muddy, it does such a nice job on adjacent channel interference that its worth putting up with the muddy sound. AM is quite sensitive, and it screams with a SAT. FM is quite sensitive. Why, OH WHY, did I return that YB400 and get a pre-owned SW77??? Oh well, the SW 77 does LOOK impressive! From amfmdx@fastq.com Thu Nov 28 07:23:39 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Nov 2002 15:23:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 78510 invoked from network); 28 Nov 2002 15:23:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Nov 2002 15:23:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Nov 2002 15:23:37 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt ([209.63.214.239]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gASFNZv90274 for ; Thu, 28 Nov 2002 08:23:35 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <022401c296f1$ee360e80$4ef9bed8@kredding430cdt> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: DX radios are not audiophile radios.... Date: Thu, 28 Nov 2002 08:22:12 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > That's 6 kHz *RF* bandwidth, not audio bandwidth. Do you have one? No, its got 6 kHz of audio bandwidth. Thats pretty narrow but thats what it has. > > THIS IS WHAT DXING RADIOS DO. THEY NARROW THE BANDWIDTH TO REJECT > > EXTRANEOUS SIGNALS. > > Better say that is what CHEAP DXing radios do. No, thats what DXing radios do. I don't think that my Sony 2010 is cheap. Its $350 and it has narrow and narrower bandwidths. The DX-398 /ATS 909 is a very good radio and it DXes very well, and it has narrow bandwidth. They are very well made and are $250 when not on sale. Its not cheaply made nor is the Sony 2010. Its what DX radios do. They are narrow banded. You guys don't get it. > With an inherently > good design, using multiple stages of Tuned RF circuitry, you don't > need to narrow the bandwidth to achieve good sensitivity and > selectivity. You OBVIOUSLY don't understand DXing nor do you have any DX radios or you would not ever say this. You can NOT have wide bandwidth and DX. You can't pick out Trans-Atlantic and Trans-Pacific splits with wide bandwidth radios. I can do this with DX radios. They are different animals than audiophile radios. They are a tool with the exact opposite use than a wideband radio. They aren't made to sound good but are made for extreme long range reception. There are times I want to hear excellent sound and I don't use a DXing radio. I pull out an AM stereo radio like my A-1 or Delco car radio modified by Chris Cuff. Those are tools made for comfort like a big Cadillac. DX radios are dragsters. Not comfortable at all but you hear all over the world. I have heard Australia, Argentina, Croatia and others from here in the desert with DX radios. I can't do that with my radios made for sound. Sure I can DX regional stuff with them but not real DX. > Does the CCRadio even use Tuned RF, let alone double- > conversion? The C.Crane catalog doesn't say anything about it. TRF. Its not dual conversion. Hell, its hard to find a radio thats not TRF. > Some of the best DXing radios were made decades ago. I have a classic > 1950s vacuum tube Hallicrafters AM/shortwave reciever Which one is it? I collect all kinds of radios and easily have between 300 and 400. > and its > reception is amazing; it can easily distinguish stations 5 kHz apart > on the shortwave bands, Some of these radios are good but there is no way that they can even remotely compete with a well built expensive radio like the Grundig Satellit 700 or the Sony 2010 or even a DX-398 / ATS 909 with an external antenna. I love these old tube radios. I have many and have repaired many, many, many and even the HQ-180A which is the max of the max, the pinnacle of tube radios that were commercially available can receive as well as these tiny receivers I mentioned above. Even the Sylvania / General Dynamics R-1414 and the Litton R-390 can't receive as well as modern sets like the Drake R-8 series or SW-8 / Grundig Satellit 800. They are good, they weigh as much as an M-1 Abrams tank but they can't do what modern DX radios can. Sorry, technology marched on and left them behind. If you ever get your hands on one of these modern expensive DX radios, you would instantly understand what I am saying. > Then how come C.Crane claims in their catalog that it has better > sound quality than the GE Superadio III? This is something I don't agree with because it clearly doesn't sound as good as a SR III. This is patently false. I think that they should quit making this statement. >From their description of the Superadio III, which they sell horribly > overpriced at $64.95 each: "Good audio quality compared to other > AM/FM portable radios, except perhaps our CCRadio Plus." I have seen this. I don't agree with the statement they make with the comparison. The SR III is a audiophile set and not a DXing unit. It does sound very good and will DX domestic stations well. For reception, the CCRadio is slightly better. > Nevermind the difference in AM bandwidths, the CCRadio is a smaller > radio with a smaller speaker, And its not made to be a great sounding radio no matter what CCrane says. Its made to be a DX radio and it is a good to above average DXer. Sangean sells these overseas and they sell them as DX radios. CCrane is full of hype when they say it sounds great. Think DX and think about what made for the human voice means. You are a smart guy. I am sure you can read between the lines and understand. > and thus even on FM it is always going > to sound tinny and dull Yes. It is not an audiophile radio. Kevin, any radio thats not an audiophile radio sucks to you. You are entitled to that opinion. If you say that CCrane hypes this radio too much, I will agree with you. If you say that is doesn't do everything CCrane says, I will agree with you. If you say its overpriced, I will agree with you. But.. I won't agree with you that this radio is bad because its not an audiophiles set. The CCRadio is not AMAX, never will be, nor will any radio sold for DXing. Its a different animal than a radio like a SR III. I own the SR III and CCRadio and use each for different things. The best portable you can get off the shelf for good reception and great sound is the SR III. The best for DX is the Sony 2010 and its a phenomenally great seller. Hell this unit has been sold since 1985 without changes. Thats the hallmark of a great radio to be sold unchanged for 17 years and still be on the top. Its not an audiophiles radio in any way. Its a different tool for a different job. Kevin Mesa, Arizona From philipr@irac.pe.ca Thu Nov 28 07:43:16 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Nov 2002 15:43:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 31190 invoked from network); 28 Nov 2002 15:43:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Nov 2002 15:43:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Nov 2002 15:43:16 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.141] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Nov 2002 15:43:16 -0000 Date: Thu, 28 Nov 2002 15:43:14 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: DX radios are not audiophile radios.... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <022401c296f1$ee360e80$4ef9bed8@kredding430cdt> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1378 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking I don't think that my Sony 2010 is cheap. > Its $350 and it has narrow and narrower bandwidths. The DX- 398 /ATS 909 is a > very good radio and it DXes very well, and it has narrow bandwidth. They are > very well made and are $250 when not on sale. Its not cheaply made nor is > the Sony 2010. Its what DX radios do. They are narrow banded. You guys don't > get it. ... > Even the Sylvania / General Dynamics R-1414 and the Litton R-390 can't > receive as well as modern sets like the Drake R-8 series or SW-8 / Grundig > Satellit 800. They are good, they weigh as much as an M-1 Abrams tank but > they can't do what modern DX radios can. Sorry, technology marched on and > left them behind. If you ever get your hands on one of these modern > expensive DX radios, you would instantly understand what I am saying. ... > Kevin > Mesa, Arizona My brother has a 2010, and I love it. Wish I had one! Kevin, you mentioned about the Grundig Sat 800. The first generation ones were supposed to be troublesome, the current crop much improved. Have you tried one out? I say this because everytime I go into the local Radio Shack, there it is, staring at me, tempting me, and the price in Canada is very good - $599 CDN. How do they compare with, say the 2010? Almost as good but with a big cabinet? A mini review would be much appreciated! Thanks Phil R. From amfmdx@fastq.com Thu Nov 28 07:53:20 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Nov 2002 15:53:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 43292 invoked from network); 28 Nov 2002 15:53:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Nov 2002 15:53:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Nov 2002 15:53:19 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt ([209.63.214.239]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gASFrIv90685 for ; Thu, 28 Nov 2002 08:53:18 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <026001c296f6$14b93b00$4ef9bed8@kredding430cdt> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} DX Radios and other Quasi-OT ramblings etc. Date: Thu, 28 Nov 2002 08:51:55 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > One way of approaching having your cake and eating it too [DX and > HiFi]is the simple use of an appropriate bandwidth switch. Yes, this is true. More expensive sets have this. My 1978 Kenwood R-1000 has 12, 6, and 2.8 kHz settings. When I bought it, the thing was a pretty expensive unit. It sounds phenomenal in the 12 kHz setting. > To me, the Sony 2010 has it right - for a DX radio, at wide, the > audio is up to 4500 HZ flat on wide, with nice clear sound on AM and > SW, less so on narrow. I have one and love it but even at 4.5 kHz its not an audiophile set. Hell, the speaker is just too damn small. > Unfortunately, I have > an ICF-SW77, not a 2010, and I'm tired of the muffled, garbled sound > even on wide, and the useless synch detector, that either won't lock > in, or, if it does, causes grotesque distortion. Yes, its an early > 77, but still, I wish it were a 2010. I always wondered about the 77 and now I know. In fact Phil, you are the only one I know who has one. Kevin From amfmdx@fastq.com Thu Nov 28 09:03:33 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Nov 2002 17:03:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 44496 invoked from network); 28 Nov 2002 17:03:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Nov 2002 17:03:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Nov 2002 17:03:32 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt ([209.63.214.239]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gASH3Uv91530 for ; Thu, 28 Nov 2002 10:03:31 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <028801c296ff$e127bd20$4ef9bed8@kredding430cdt> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: DX radios are not audiophile radios.... Date: Thu, 28 Nov 2002 10:02:03 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > My brother has a 2010, and I love it. Wish I had one! They are pretty reasonable if you can find one on eBay but eBay is a crap shoot. > Kevin, you mentioned about the Grundig Sat 800. The first > generation ones were supposed to be troublesome, the current crop > much improved. Have you tried one out? I have used one and used its father, the SW-8. I don't own either but from my time using those of a couple of friends, I can tell you that both are excellent. The Sat 800 sounds fantastic when in wide mode. If you decide to get the 800, you will be really happy because it has several bandwidths and you can DX or pleasure listen. It is a very fine radio. It sounds better than the SW-8 and the 2010. Bigger box and bigger speaker. The 2010 receives better. Nothing in a portable radio that I have found receives better than the 2010. The GE P780 is close and if it could be switched to a narrow bandwidth, it would be better. Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Nov 28 10:04:00 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Nov 2002 18:03:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 70897 invoked from network); 28 Nov 2002 18:03:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Nov 2002 18:03:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.19) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Nov 2002 18:03:59 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 28 Nov 2002 10:03:59 -0800 To: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Another Decent Engineer! Date: Thu, 28 Nov 2002 13:03:47 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 28 Nov 2002 18:03:59.0095 (UTC) FILETIME=[86721070:01C29708] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.148.45.93] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Neal Newman wrote: > That's a funny statement.. Because after talking with My boss the other day Just before taking a visit to a friend at Ibiquity. I got that same feeling when he stated... we want to keep an open relationship with Ibiquity don't make waves but let them know about our Concern of interference with your station.. then the fit hit the shan...... And in the mean time, the CEO of Golden Strip Broadcasting, INC. just told me to hunt down what I need to get WFIS in Stereo as long as I can sell the Ads to pay for it! Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Nov 28 10:05:25 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Nov 2002 18:05:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 49717 invoked from network); 28 Nov 2002 18:05:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Nov 2002 18:05:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.122) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Nov 2002 18:05:25 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 28 Nov 2002 10:05:25 -0800 To: Subject: Re: {AMSF} OT: FM Modulation Problems Date: Thu, 28 Nov 2002 13:05:13 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 28 Nov 2002 18:05:25.0267 (UTC) FILETIME=[B9CEDE30:01C29708] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.148.45.93] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 wgliradio wrote: >The Belar FM monitor was recalibrated by Belar in September 2001. Should I suspect it? If you are friends with the CE of a "Big Boy" station near you with an off-air mod monitor in their studio, ask the engineer to dial up your station on it and see what the modulation level looks like. > >Should I increase the modulation to reference 75kHz on the Nicom (where we sound as loud as others) or should I believe what the Belar is telling me? Double check with another mod monitor before you condemn the mod monitor. Please remember your audio chain will not sound anywhere near as loud as a station with with "CHR" chain like 2 Audio Prizms driving an Optimod, or an Optimod 8200. One of the loudest FMs I have ever heard had a Modulation Sciences StereoMax driving a pair of DAP 310s driving an Optimod 8100 with the Optimod multiband compressor driving the STL into a Modulation Sciences Composit clipper into the transmitter. While that is way too much processing for most public stations, It blew a hole in the dial with the HI-NRG-CHR-Dance format. When you tuned to that station, you had to turn the volume down on your radio. Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Nov 28 10:06:23 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Nov 2002 18:06:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 49593 invoked from network); 28 Nov 2002 18:06:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Nov 2002 18:06:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.116) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Nov 2002 18:06:22 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 28 Nov 2002 10:06:22 -0800 To: Subject: AM Filings Was: X-Band Date: Thu, 28 Nov 2002 13:06:11 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 28 Nov 2002 18:06:22.0530 (UTC) FILETIME=[DBF08220:01C29708] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.148.45.93] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Neal Newman wrote: > I know a few good consultants. the FCC is not accepting any AM Filings at this time.. even though I have one waiting myself... The FCC is accepting AM filings for minor changes to stations, so I am still in need of a good consultant for WFIS as well as a silent station we will be putting back on the air. Now for the GOOD NEWS: The owner of WFIS is ordering a new ATU Friday! (Thank God!) Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Nov 28 10:08:44 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Nov 2002 18:08:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 36640 invoked from network); 28 Nov 2002 18:08:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Nov 2002 18:08:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.82) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Nov 2002 18:08:44 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 28 Nov 2002 10:08:44 -0800 To: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: AM Stereo modulation & audio processing Date: Thu, 28 Nov 2002 13:08:33 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 28 Nov 2002 18:08:44.0402 (UTC) FILETIME=[30807520:01C29709] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.148.45.93] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Neal Newman wrote: > you want hear some really bad audio Listen to WCNJ 89.3fm from the web... We have one that will win the bad audio prize: WPJM-800 Runners up include: WAIM-1230 WCKI-1300 WYRD-1330 WLMA-1350 WPCI-1490 (Stereo, but with a VERY bad sounding phone line STL) WDAB-1580 WKSF-99.9 WRIX-103.1 WGVC-106.3 Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Nov 28 11:56:46 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Nov 2002 19:56:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 59273 invoked from network); 28 Nov 2002 19:56:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Nov 2002 19:56:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.75) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Nov 2002 19:56:44 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.141] by n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Nov 2002 19:56:44 -0000 Date: Thu, 28 Nov 2002 19:56:43 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: DX radios are not audiophile radios.... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <022401c296f1$ee360e80$4ef9bed8@kredding430cdt> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1883 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.79.136 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Kevin, any radio thats not an audiophile radio sucks to you. You > are entitled to that opinion. I wouldn't take it to that extreme, but I do think that DXing isn't worth DXing if it sounds like the sound you get from a string attached to a tin can. Even if I could pick up signals from Mars on a particular radio, that wouldn't catch my interest unless the audio was at least halfway-decent for listening to. I don't think I'm the only one who actually finds it easier to "aurally DX" (i.e. pull signals out of the background "mud") with a WIDER audio bandwidth. If the bandwidth is too narrow, everything is just too muffled to work with. Audio response in the 3 to 6 kHz is probably THE most important for providing clear, understandable speech. If your radio cuts out everything above 3 kHz, then you are also cutting out all the clarity of the audio. You can't even ID CALL SIGNS properly because all the high frequency sibilants are lost, so you can't distinguish between "F" and "S", "V" and "C" and "Z", etc. > The CCRadio is not AMAX, never will be, nor will any radio sold for > DXing. So you're saying that there's something about the installation of a C-Quam decoder and a selection of different IF filters that somehow makes it incapable of being a "DXing" radio? What exactly is lost, or somehow compromised, by giving the listener the CHOICE of a wider bandwidth or AM Stereo reception if they so desire? Perhaps somebody here should take a CCRadio, add an AM Stereo decoder and the selection of a wider IF filter to it, and see exactly how much this compromises its DXing ability. You might be surprised that this would actually IMPROVE its DXing ability, due to the built-in IF AGC and synchronous detection features of the newer C-Quam decoders, which improves sensitivity and reduces distortion, even from plain mono signals. From amfmdx@fastq.com Thu Nov 28 15:18:48 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Nov 2002 23:18:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 32120 invoked from network); 28 Nov 2002 23:18:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Nov 2002 23:18:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Nov 2002 23:18:48 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt (d187-osel-phx.fastq.com [209.63.214.174]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gASNIkv95637 for ; Thu, 28 Nov 2002 16:18:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <031f01c29734$43d7b9a0$4ef9bed8@kredding430cdt> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: DX radios are not audiophile radios.... Date: Thu, 28 Nov 2002 16:17:03 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > Kevin, any radio thats not an audiophile radio sucks to you. You > > are entitled to that opinion. > > I wouldn't take it to that extreme, but I do think that DXing isn't > worth DXing if it sounds like the sound you get from a string > attached to a tin can. I stand by the statement. Kevin, this is personal like and dislike. You *ONLY* like audiophile radios. Thats fine. I like them too but I also like hearing Japan on AM radio at night. I have audiophile radios that would bring tears to your eyes that you have never seen. I love them. I also have many DXing radios and I love them even more. They carry me throughout the world. They are not for people like you and thats why all kinds of radios are made to please us both. > Even if I could pick up signals from Mars on > a particular radio, that wouldn't catch my interest unless the audio > was at least halfway-decent for listening to. Which brings me to the initial statement, which said that you think any radio that is not an audiophile radio sucks. This is fine and not a problem at all. Many radios are made for people like you. I only wish that more were made with AM stereo in C-QUAM which would please us both. Actually more radios are made to please people like you than for DXers. It only makes sense because there are more audiophiles than DXers. > I don't think I'm the only one who actually finds it easier to > "aurally DX" (i.e. pull signals out of the background "mud") with a > WIDER audio bandwidth. You are not the only one who likes wideband radios. However I doubt you have heard Europe on one of your wideband radios. If you aren't interested in that, its ok. The DX radio is a different tool. It doesn't make it suck, its just different. Just as you wouldn't use a sledge hammer to put tacks in a wall, you wouldn't use a tack hammer to drive in railroad spikes. The sledge hammer is the audiophile radio and the tack hammer is the DX radio. Its made to do finer work. Thats all. A different tool. > You can't even ID > CALL SIGNS properly because all the high frequency sibilants are > lost, so you can't distinguish between "F" and "S", "V" and "C" and > "Z", etc. I seem to do ok getting call signs on my Kenwood R-1000 when its on the 2.8 kHz setting. Maybe your ears aren't as good as mine, but I doubt it because I have lost about 40% of my hearing while being a gun captain in the Navy. > So you're saying that there's something about the installation of a > C-Quam decoder and a selection of different IF filters that somehow > makes it incapable of being a "DXing" radio? If you widen the filters, the radio loses its ability to DX. End of statement. Period. Narrow bandwidths reject noise and adjacent channel interference. Once you widen the filters then you lose the ability to clearly distinguish split channels sometimes 2 or 3 kHz off the 10 kHz channel. You can't do splits with a wide bandwidth. You can't. Until you have a real DX radio, you can't comprehend the difference. > What exactly is lost, > or somehow compromised, by giving the listener the CHOICE of a wider > bandwidth or AM Stereo reception if they so desire? See the above. There is nothing wrong with wanting wide bandwidth. You just can't DX with it. Your DX signal is buried under the more powerful domestic signals. I like radios with AM stereo and can prove it with the number of AM stereo receivers I own. I think it sounds wonderful. I like to DX too and would never use a GE SR III for serious DX or an AM stereo radio for serious DX either. I listen to them for richness of sound. > Perhaps somebody here should take a CCRadio, add an AM Stereo decoder > and the selection of a wider IF filter to it, and see exactly how > much this compromises its DXing ability. Why? The makers and the users already know what will happen. It won't DX. If you put wider filters on it, the thing is useless for DX then. What it needs to make you happy is two sets of filters. One for wide stuff and one for DX. The problem with this is that it would probably add $50 to a set and then no one would buy the thing because its too expensive. The CCRadio is what I would call an absolute minimal DX radio. I could introduce you to lots of people who say the CCRadio needs its current filter and a NARROWER one. Craig Siegenthaler at KIWA Electtronics is making lots of money doing just this. The KIWA modification to tighter filters make the CCRadio a very nice DX radio. If you want an audiophile set, buy one but the CCRadio is not designed for that. > You might be surprised that > this would actually IMPROVE its DXing ability, Uhhhh..... back to the same thing. No. Its not the case. Wide filters = NO DX. It would make it worse. This radio is sold as a DX radio and thats what it is. Its not bad, its just not made for wideband reception. Sorry, that its that way. Just because a radio has narrow filters doesn't make it bad, its just not made for what you want. Wide bandwidth = NO DX. Thats saying something equivalent to the sun will rise in the east. It just is. And yes, I still stick by the statement, if its not audiophile, then you think it sucks. Its not bad, its just that you want one type of radio and many of those radios are made. The CCRadio is not meant to make you happy. Its made to make the casual DXer or first time DXer happy. Different tool. Kevin Mesa, Arizona From stodd@sherbtel.net Thu Nov 28 17:57:35 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 29 Nov 2002 01:57:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 98573 invoked from network); 29 Nov 2002 01:57:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Nov 2002 01:57:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Nov 2002 01:57:35 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-85-83.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.85.83]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gAT1vVN2018945 for ; Thu, 28 Nov 2002 19:57:32 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <002001a8ea52$3687b780$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM Filings Was: X-Band Date: Fri, 4 Jan 1980 04:21:31 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Did you contact any of the three I suggested? There's yet another one down in Florida who might be able to help- Alan Alsobrook. Posts a lot on the bnet Radiotech forum. The others I'd suggest are Terry Hammond, Garry Lysiac, and Mike Patton. If you call any of them, please let them know I referred you to them. BTW, what make of ATU did you go with? Scott Todd ----- Original Message ----- From: "Possum Hunter" > I am still > in need of a good consultant for WFIS as well as a silent station we will be > putting back on the air. > > Now for the GOOD NEWS: > The owner of WFIS is ordering a new ATU Friday! (Thank God!) > From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Nov 28 18:11:47 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 29 Nov 2002 02:11:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 183 invoked from network); 29 Nov 2002 02:11:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Nov 2002 02:11:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Nov 2002 02:11:46 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.173] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 29 Nov 2002 02:11:46 -0000 Date: Fri, 29 Nov 2002 02:11:45 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: DX radios are not audiophile radios.... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <031f01c29734$43d7b9a0$4ef9bed8@kredding430cdt> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 6824 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.79.136 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > You are not the only one who likes wideband radios. However I doubt > you have heard Europe on one of your wideband radios. I have heard WDHP 1620 AM Stereo from the U.S. Virgin Islands here in New Jersey on a Panasonic AM Stereo walkman (Japanese import). That's about a 1500 mile distance -- not bad for 1000 watts on a now- relatively-crowded channel -- and I was getting it strong and stable enough to lock onto the Stereo pilot. The Panasonic isn't "wideband" but it is wider than any tin-can Sangean, with some degree of response all the way beyond 10 kHz. > If you widen the filters, the radio loses its ability to DX. End of > statement. Period. This statement is only partially correct. You lose the ability to "DX" when the radio's bandwidth is **greater than what the reception conditions can accomodate**. When a signal is coming in -- even very weakly -- with no closely neighboring signals, there is no reason why you can't pick it up with a wider bandwidth. Plenty of spectacular DXing has been done on simple homebrew crystal and one-tube (or one-transistor) radios and these radios have virtually unlimited bandwidth. On the AM broadcasting band in the Western Hemisphere, there is always going to be some overlap between stations, as they are allocated on 10 kHz channels and also broadcast a maximum of 10 kHz audio bandwidth. So, if adjacent-channel signal(s) are present, then you are always going to have some interference, no matter how narrow your receiver's bandwidth is; you could design a receiver with a totally unlistenable 1 kHz bandwidth, and that would still not escape adjacent-channel interference totally. Obviously there is some benefit to offering a reduced bandwidth for improved selectivity, but on the standard AM band, I have found that there is little benefit to using an audio bandwidth less than about 5 kHz. At that point you're already down to half of the available bandwidth, and anything lower just makes the audio less and less clear and intelligible. This is why modern AMAX radios with automatic bandwidth control use about 5 kHz as the lower limit of their audio bandwidth range. Hard-core DXers may desire an even narrower bandwidth in order to pick up signals from thousands of miles away, but for typical broadcast listening, 5 kHz is about as low as you can go and still provide sound that has enough fidelity to be satisfying to listen to for any amount of time, especially for music. Don't let your idea of what "wideband" AM can accomplish be skewed by your experiences with the GE Superadio III. For some reason, this radio's "Wide Band" mode is almost ridiculously wide, and for no real reason. It must have an effective IF bandwidth in Wide mode of at least 80 kHz, as I can hear stations that are 40 kHz apart on the dial lope onto each other in Wide Band mode -- and yet a large part of that is wasted because we can't hear much above 20 kHz anyway, and furthermore AM stations are limited to a maximum of 10 kHz audio response. A much more effective solution for "wideband" AM reception is the AMAX system used in 1990s Chrysler radios, with a 7.5 kHz (audio) ceramic filter combined with variable loading of the IF coil and additional audio-based filtering and equalization, to give a narrower or wider bandwidth as signal conditions allow. On a strong signal, its bandwidth will be maxed out, giving audio response that is flat (and accurate to the NRSC emphasis curve) up to about 8 kHz. Between 8 and 9 kHz, there is a gradual drop-off of response, and then above 9 kHz it drops off at a greater rate, to achieve a very effective 10 kHz "whistle filter". Meanwhile, as signal strength decreases and adjacent channel noise increases, the audio bandwidth is reduced gradually, down to about 5 kHz with a smooth and gradual drop-off above that point. For what you would call an "audiophile radio", this allows very good DXing to be achieved, as the bandwidth is always kept in agreement with what the reception conditions are able to withstand, and you don't have to choose between fixed "Narrow" and "Wide" settings -- or, as in the case of the Superadio III, "Normal" (which is actually "Wide" already) and "Wide Band" (which offers an essentially unlimited bandwidth). > Why? The makers and the users already know what will happen. It > won't DX. If you put wider filters on it, the thing is useless for > DX then. I never said that the listener would be FORCED to use the wider bandwidth if they didn't want to! They would simply have the CHOICE of using a wider bandwidth, if reception conditions allow for it. As-is, the Sangean "CCRadio" doesn't even give the CHOICE of having a wider bandwidth. It is stuck in Narrow "DXing" mode all the time, even for signals so strong they could be picked up in your head with a piece of tin foil placed on a metal tooth filling. You talk of radios being like "tools". That is fine, but since when can't you have a single radio that can act as more than one tool? That is why the transmission in your car has more than one gear. Fourth or fifth gear is fine for highway cruising, but obviously it wouldn't have much luck climbing a steep hill. Likewise, a car with only first gear would have the engine buzzing away at 8000 RPM at highway speeds. You could sell different cars built for each purpose, but that would be ridiculous. Thus, without any choice of different bandwidths -- either manual or automatically controlled -- the CCRadio lacks flexibility. If it was a $50 radio like the Superadio III, I could accept that and agree with you that it was only meant for DXing, not for good audio quality. But as a $160 radio, it is a VERY poor excuse to say that Mr. Chris Justice at the C.Crane Co. couldn't have told Sangean to spend the extra $2 per radio in manufacturing costs to include an additional ceramic filter and a bandwidth switch -- nevermind an additonal $2 on top of that to include AMAX-certified AM Stereo (which would bring with it the benefits of synchronous detection). > What it needs to make you happy is two sets of filters. One for > wide stuff and one for DX. The problem with this is that it would > probably add $50 to a set and then no one would buy the thing > because its too expensive. Please tell me where you got this figure from. Since when does an extra ceramic filter and a switch cost $50? In large production quantities, and considering the HUGE profit that Sangean and C.Crane must be making on the CCRadio already, the added cost would be negligible. FYI: Due to cost-cutting measures, for their 1996 models, Nissan/Infiniti removed AM Stereo from their car radios. They said it saved them about 50 cents per car in manufacturing costs. Hmph. From amfmdx@fastq.com Thu Nov 28 20:56:39 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 29 Nov 2002 04:56:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 13160 invoked from network); 29 Nov 2002 04:56:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Nov 2002 04:56:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Nov 2002 04:56:34 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt (d82-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.114]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gAT4uWv98288 for ; Thu, 28 Nov 2002 21:56:32 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <034e01c29763$7dd89e60$4ef9bed8@kredding430cdt> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: DX radios are not audiophile radios.... Date: Thu, 28 Nov 2002 21:55:07 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > I have heard WDHP 1620 AM Stereo from the U.S. Virgin Islands here in > New Jersey Big whoop. In New Jersey DXers regularly hear Norway, Croatia, Spain, France, Mauritania, Saudi Arabia and the like. I got WDHP here in AZ. Its nothing to get worked up about. You just can't admit that you might not know what you are talking about. > The Panasonic isn't "wideband" > but it is wider than any tin-can Sangean, with some degree of > response all the way beyond 10 kHz. Back to the point that all radios that aren't wide band suck. Kevin, just because its not wideband doesn't mean it sucks. > > If you widen the filters, the radio loses its ability to DX. End of > > statement. Period. > > This statement is only partially correct. No. This statement is correct. I believe that you are showing much ignorance. > Plenty of spectacular > DXing has been done on simple homebrew crystal and one-tube (or > one-transistor) radios and these radios have virtually unlimited > bandwidth. Yes but the days of spectacular reception was in the 1920s and early 1930s. I believe that was 70 to 80 years ago when the AM band was much less crowded. I have built these and have them in my collection. And NO you won't hear a TA or TP reception today with one. > So, if adjacent-channel signal(s) are present, then > you are always going to have some interference, no matter how narrow > your receiver's bandwidth is; I can pull two signals apart with my Sony 2010. I can have one buried 3 kHz away and pull it from under the other. I can do this with a Drake R-8, Grundig Sat 800 / Drake SW-8 and a host of other radios. Do you or have you ever used these radios. Unless you have, then you just plain don't have any comprehension of what can and can't be done. Until you have then you are ignorant of what I am talking about. Ignorance is not bad, it means you haven't seen or tried something. I don't believe you have used these radios and therefore you are ignorant of what I am saying. You really don't know DX and thats fine if you aren't interested in it. > Obviously there is some benefit to offering a reduced bandwidth for > improved selectivity, but on the standard AM band, I have found that > there is little benefit to using an audio bandwidth less than about > 5 kHz. There is if you want to hear Trans-Pacific or Trans-Atlantic stations or stations from deep South America like Argentina and Brazil on AM. I use 2.8 kHz and do fine. > At that point you're already down to half of the available > bandwidth, and anything lower just makes the audio less and less > clear and intelligible. Which brings me back to my statement that if its not wide and an audiophile unit to you it sucks. > Hard-core DXers may desire an even narrower bandwidth in order to > pick up signals from thousands of miles away, but for typical > broadcast listening, 5 kHz is about as low as you can go and still > provide sound that has enough fidelity to be satisfying to listen to > for any amount of time, especially for music. All serious DXers use filters narrower than this. If you want to listen to music then you do need a wideband radio to get all the fidelity. I use both wide and narrow filtered radios. > Don't let your idea of what "wideband" AM can accomplish be skewed by > your experiences with the GE Superadio III. I think I know a lot about radios. I own more than you have ever used. I think I have used more than the GE SR III if I own between 300 and 400 radios. > For some reason, this > radio's "Wide Band" mode is almost ridiculously wide, and for no real > reason. Now this is something I agree with and maybe the first coherent thing you have said. The SR III has an unbelievably wide setting in its wide mode. > A much more effective solution for "wideband" AM reception is the > AMAX system used in 1990s Chrysler radios, I own several of these. They won't DX. I'm not talking about hearing WHAS from New Jersey I am talking trans oceanic DX. They don't have the needed granularity to DX. They are locked to 10 kHz and need to be able to tune 1 kHz increments. To top it off they are far too wide to DX. They are good radios for listening. I like the ones I have with the joystick and 6 band graphic equalizer. > I never said that the listener would be FORCED to use the wider > bandwidth if they didn't want to! It would be nice to be able to choose the bandwidth but the average schmuck doesn't care about that and the radio is already $160. They probably didn't want to run the price up over $200 and not be able to sell the units. > You talk of radios being like "tools". That is fine, but since when > can't you have a single radio that can act as more than one tool? You can have this but be prepared to pay for the function. I have it on most of the radios that are $250 or up. > You could sell different cars built for each > purpose, but that would be ridiculous. You are right but radios under $250 generally don't have a bandwidth switch. If you are talking more expensive sets I agree. The CCRadio is not an expensive radio. Its kind of like a Volkswagen Beetle of radios. > Thus, without any choice of different bandwidths -- either manual or > automatically controlled -- the CCRadio lacks flexibility. I think I know what is bugging you, its not that the CCRadio doesn't do what its made to do, its the hype and BS that CCrane puts out for advertizing. > But as a $160 radio, it is a VERY poor excuse to say that > Mr. Chris Justice at the C.Crane Co. couldn't have told Sangean to > spend the extra $2 per radio in manufacturing costs to include an > additional ceramic filter and a bandwidth switch I believe your expectations of cost are very fantasyland. I am sure that the circuits and parts would be considerably more than $2. Where did you get this $2 figure? The anal extraction method? Fabricate it out of the air? > -- nevermind an > additonal $2 on top of that to include AMAX-certified AM Stereo > (which would bring with it the benefits of synchronous detection). How about this figure of $2? Did you use the anal extraction method on this one also? > Please tell me where you got this figure from. Since when does an > extra ceramic filter and a switch cost $50? Because there is more to the circuit than a filter and a switch. I am saying that you will be charged on the selling end about $50 for this. I will let you go on in the next message and say your piece. We are at the is too, is not, stage and probably will have to agree to disagree. Kevin Mesa, Arizona From jsgil@hal-pc.org Thu Nov 28 21:21:19 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 29 Nov 2002 05:21:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 72928 invoked from network); 29 Nov 2002 05:21:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Nov 2002 05:21:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.75) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Nov 2002 05:21:18 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.185] by n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 29 Nov 2002 05:21:18 -0000 Date: Fri, 29 Nov 2002 05:21:18 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: DX radios are not audiophile radios.... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 4782 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.134 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin T." wrote: > Perhaps somebody here should take a CCRadio, add an AM Stereo decoder=20 > and the selection of a wider IF filter to it, and see exactly how=20 > much this compromises its DXing ability. You might be surprised that=20 > this would actually IMPROVE its DXing ability, due to the built-in=20 > IF AGC and synchronous detection features of the newer C-Quam=20 > decoders, which improves sensitivity and reduces distortion, even=20 > from plain mono signals. Synchronous detection is the key to pulling DX stations out of the noise. It allows the use of wider IF filters since the BFO is the PLL osc and not the transmitted carrier. If an acjacent carrier is strong enough an envelope detector will use a mishmash of both carriers for the BFO and the result is both stations will compete for the envelope detector and the composite signal will be both signals with distortion byproducts. This is the inherent flaw of envelope detectors and the simple solution to this is to use a narrower IF filter. With synchronous detectors whichever signal captures the PLL is the one that will be received distortion free but an adjacent signal will be frequency inverted with the typical monkey chatter sound. The detected signal will be the sum of both signals but there won't be any quadrature byproduct distortion. If a receiver was designed with a =B115KHz filter but the PLL had the capability to lock onto the carrier that was tuned the center of the filter without being=20 disturbed by a strong adjacent carrier and the audio output was filtered with a 3KHz 30db/oct low pass filter the sound quality would still be better than a narrow 3KHz filter with envelope=20 detection. This is why the Harris system was so much better than=20 the others when it came to interference. The drawback to the Harris system operating in the fixed 90=B0 quadrature mode is the transmitter had to be operated at least =BD power so when the L-R sidebands were transmitted the PEP would not be exceeded. This is where C-QuAM solved the problem by making the envelope =3D to L+R thus allowing the mono signal to be transmitted at full transmitter power and the L-R component had no effect on PEP. The downside to envelope based stereo systems is the envelope is used for L+R and for distortion correction. This is fine for local signals but when interference drops the noise floor below 24db then the cosine corrector circuit starts expanding the noise. This was imediately noticeable in the 1st generation MC13020 chip and Motorola quickly realized that C-QuAM sounded great, better than any of the other systems under little or no interference but upon a fair amount of interference C-QuAM quickly showed its weakness and would sound much worse than the Harris, Kahn and maybe even the Magnavox systems. When C-QuAM first showed up on the scene it did not have the maturity that the Harris and Kahn systems had but Motorola quickly went to work on the problem and the result was the MC13022 and later the MC13028. The only way for Motorola to overcome the problem was to use synchornous detectors for L+R and just use the envelope for the information necessary to provide cosine correction. As the noise increases and distortion is generated the cosine correction factor is reduced to the point of minimal distortion for the given situation. This blending control is generated by the signal quality detector that measures the amount of interference and adjusts the amount of cosine correction for minimal distortion. As the interference gets bad enough the cosine corrector circuuit is completely turn off and the chip operates completely in the=20=20=20 QuAM mode just like the Harris system. The big tell tale signs that the later chips use synchronous detection for L+R is it makes even mono signals sound better and moderate mistuning does not cause distortion. These are the 2 main inherent qualities of synchronous detection. Anyone who has used synchronous detection before will imediately notice the vast improvements over the envelope detector.=20 If you have a radio with both synchronous and envelope detectors that=20 is manually switchable it's imediately appearent that the synchronous detector will pull a signal out of the noise with great clarity and=20 the envelope detector will be barely intelligible. The only time when synchronous detectors will produce more noise and distortion is on strong co-channel interference and the PLL can't decide which signal to lock onto. When this happens it can be quite annoying and the detection needs to fall back to envelope detection. I appears that the later generation C-QuAM chips preform this function pretty well also. When the PLL captures the carrier the signal is received=20 without distortion. JSG From alfredot@inetarena.com Fri Nov 29 00:09:32 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: alfredot@inetarena.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 29 Nov 2002 08:09:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 90677 invoked from network); 29 Nov 2002 08:09:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Nov 2002 08:09:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.inetarena.com) (206.129.216.13) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Nov 2002 08:09:30 -0000 Received: from hendrie (1Cust107.tnt17.beaverton.or.da.uu.net [65.227.179.107]) by mail.inetarena.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id gAT87YT21392 for ; Fri, 29 Nov 2002 00:07:34 -0800 (PST) Date: Fri, 29 Nov 2002 00:09:15 -0800 (PST) X-Sender: alfredo@hendrie.1610am.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: AM Stereo modulation & audio processing In-Reply-To: <1038412678.1486.88789.m1@yahoogroups.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: "Alfredo E. Torrejon" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=25132238 X-Yahoo-Profile: alfredotorrejon > would make a good fixed point to crossover at. As for the middle > crossover point I guess that could be made variable. The others could > be fixed 3rd order low pass & high pass active filters for good stop > band attenuation. From what it sounds like your three position > (4 gang?) switches are set up for 1st order passive filters, a high > pass & low pass for each channel. The filters were 2nd order active filters, but I didn't have the cancellation problems that you described because of the way that I derived the four bands. You can find documentation and schematics at http://www.inetarena.com/~alfredot/compressor3.html One fatal flaw of my circuit, however, was that I didn't use those coveted MusiCaps in my prototype. ;) Alfredo From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Nov 29 00:21:39 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 29 Nov 2002 08:21:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 7451 invoked from network); 29 Nov 2002 08:21:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Nov 2002 08:21:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.86) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Nov 2002 08:21:37 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.136] by n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 29 Nov 2002 08:21:37 -0000 Date: Fri, 29 Nov 2002 08:21:37 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: DX radios are not audiophile radios.... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <034e01c29763$7dd89e60$4ef9bed8@kredding430cdt> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3829 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.79.136 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Back to the point that all radios that aren't wide band suck. You're the one who keeps repeating that, not me.... so, Kev, say it as many times as necessary for you to admit it to yourself. :-) > You really don't know DX and thats fine if you aren't interested in > it. And you live in a fantasy land if you think Sangean designed a $50 radio (which C.Crane sells for $160) so people can use it to pick up AM stations from Norway and Saudia Arabia. The "CCRadio" was simply designed so the average schmo can pick up Art Bell or Rush Limbaugh from the peanut-whistle AM station across town during the day, or from the 50 kW Class I-A clear channel from 300 miles away at night. It was never meant to be an "extreme DXing" radio, and its occasional ability to do so is no more spectacular than when you sometimes see a Chevy Vega out-accelerate a Corvette. > Which brings me back to my statement that if its not wide and an > audiophile unit to you it sucks. I would sincerely hope that simply providing clear, understandable speech doesn't qualify as "audiophile". A 1922 Victrola phonograph with the mechanical horn speaker can provide clear, understandable speech and it is nowhere near "audiophile"-quality. Am I out of my mind in desiring AM audio that can at least live up to the standards of an 80-year-old gramophone? > I'm not talking about hearing WHAS from New Jersey I am talking > trans oceanic DX. And that is exactly what the CCRadio *wasn't* designed for. Hearing WHAS in New Jersey *would* be an example of a reasonable achievement for a $50-worth Sangean radio like the CCRadio. But trans-oceanic AM DX is so rare and so extreme that any "consumer-grade" radio isn't going to cut it. But, they SHOULDN'T have to cut it, because designing a $50 table radio for trans-oceanic AM DX is like designing a Hyundai Elantra for drag racing. That's just not a realistic goal for the price range, and it shouldn't ever be expected to be. > I believe your expectations of cost are very fantasyland. I am sure > that the circuits and parts would be considerably more than $2. > Where did you get this $2 figure? > Because there is more to the circuit than a filter and a switch. I > am saying that you will be charged on the selling end about $50 for > this. That's very funny, because GE manages to sell the WHOLE Superadio III -- with selectable bandwidth and all the other parts including a high-quality audio amp and speaker system -- for less than $50. The C.Crane Co. must be using some creative accounting if they claim adding a few extra parts would cost $50, while an ENTIRE radio with the same switchable-bandwidth feature sells for $49.99 at Sears. > How about this figure of $2? Did you use the anal extraction method > on this one also? If you dispute this, let's hear what your figure is for the cost of adding AM Stereo to a radio. Here's one real world example: In the early 1990s, Radio Shack sold two car radios that were virtually identical, except one had AM Stereo while the other did not. The model with AM Stereo sold for $10 more than the model without it. And that was using the original MC13020 chip with its high number of external components needed, including precision capacitors. Using a modern surface-mount MC13028 chip would likely cut this added cost down to $5, if not less. You're also ignoring the fact that C.Crane updated the CCRadio to the "CCRadio Plus", with audio input/output jacks, a special cassette recorder connection, a battery strength meter, and a redesigned case, WITHOUT increasing the price AT ALL. If adding all those new features didn't require a price increase, then what is so special about adding selectable bandwidth and/or AM Stereo that would jack up the price $50 or more, as you claim? From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Nov 29 01:12:38 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 29 Nov 2002 09:12:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 5217 invoked from network); 29 Nov 2002 09:12:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Nov 2002 09:12:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.78) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Nov 2002 09:12:38 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.169] by n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 29 Nov 2002 09:12:37 -0000 Date: Fri, 29 Nov 2002 09:12:37 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: AMAX promo & nighttime WTTM Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1547 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.79.136 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics Here is one of a set of four AMAX promos that were distributed to stations about a decade ago. The following is an MP3 recording of what I think is the best one of the four: http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/amax-4.mp3 And for a real-world AMAX listening experience, here is the 1000-watt nighttime signal of 1680 WTTM, as received on a Chrysler "Infinity" radio about 20 miles away: http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/wttm-st.mp3 This is local groundwave reception, but it is at almost exactly the edge of the predicted 0.5 mV/m coverage area, where IBOC digital reception would have already dropped to analog mono (nevermind the fact that IBOC can't be used at night, at least not yet). This recording also demonstrates the AMAX circuit's smooth Stereo blending and very effective Dynamic Noise Reduction. The only indication that the signal is weak is some slight chatter from adjacent channels and a few momentary drops to mono. There is no background hiss, and the noise floor doesn't increase at all when in Stereo mode. In fact, this radio is so "quiet" in Stereo mode that if an AM Stereo station is broadcasting mono audio, the "ST" light on the display is the ONLY way to tell that the radio is functioning in Stereo mode; it sounds exactly the same as if the Stereo decoder was completely turned off. I am due to receive a Delco AMAX radio any day now from a recent eBay purchase, which will give me the chance to see how it compares to the Chrysler radio in terms of both reception and sound quality. From groucho@skyweb.net Fri Nov 29 01:44:01 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 29 Nov 2002 09:44:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 26778 invoked from network); 29 Nov 2002 09:44:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Nov 2002 09:44:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Nov 2002 09:44:00 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gAT9mQxi086778 for ; Fri, 29 Nov 2002 04:48:36 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DE73680.2BFAD094@skyweb.net> Date: Fri, 29 Nov 2002 04:42:24 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} AMAX promo & nighttime WTTM References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 that MP3 Demo of the Off air of WTTM in Stereo.. sounds a hell of alot better than the IBOC Demo LOL ROFLMAO.. maybe Ibiquity should listen to a real C-Quam signal. and Get their act together.... I just hate the beginning of it where our PD is Singing... that's got to Go.... Neal "Kevin T." wrote: > Here is one of a set of four AMAX promos that were distributed to > stations about a decade ago. The following is an MP3 recording of > what I think is the best one of the four: > > http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/amax-4.mp3 > > And for a real-world AMAX listening experience, here is the 1000-watt > nighttime signal of 1680 WTTM, as received on a Chrysler "Infinity" > radio about 20 miles away: > > http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/wttm-st.mp3 > > This is local groundwave reception, but it is at almost exactly the > edge of the predicted 0.5 mV/m coverage area, where IBOC digital > reception would have already dropped to analog mono (nevermind the > fact that IBOC can't be used at night, at least not yet). > > This recording also demonstrates the AMAX circuit's smooth Stereo > blending and very effective Dynamic Noise Reduction. The only > indication that the signal is weak is some slight chatter from > adjacent channels and a few momentary drops to mono. There is no > background hiss, and the noise floor doesn't increase at all when in > Stereo mode. In fact, this radio is so "quiet" in Stereo mode that > if an AM Stereo station is broadcasting mono audio, the "ST" light on > the display is the ONLY way to tell that the radio is functioning in > Stereo mode; it sounds exactly the same as if the Stereo decoder was > completely turned off. > > I am due to receive a Delco AMAX radio any day now from a recent eBay > purchase, which will give me the chance to see how it compares to the > Chrysler radio in terms of both reception and sound quality. > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From amfmdx@fastq.com Fri Nov 29 07:19:59 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 29 Nov 2002 15:19:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 88250 invoked from network); 29 Nov 2002 15:19:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Nov 2002 15:19:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Nov 2002 15:19:58 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt (d50-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.82]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gATFJvv02338 for ; Fri, 29 Nov 2002 08:19:57 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <03e001c297ba$9525f840$4ef9bed8@kredding430cdt> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: DX radios are not audiophile radios.... Date: Fri, 29 Nov 2002 08:18:19 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla I said you would have the last word. You have it. AK6C uses a CCRadio to hear Trans-Atlantic and Trans-Pacific DX and he's rather successful at it. End of this thread for me. Kevin From michaelj@vcn.com Fri Nov 29 08:09:45 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 29 Nov 2002 16:09:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 38472 invoked from network); 29 Nov 2002 16:09:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Nov 2002 16:09:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m2-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.32) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Nov 2002 16:09:43 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m2-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Fri, 29 Nov 2002 09:09:43 -0700 Message-ID: <003201c297c1$b83a3560$0701010a@keva> To: References: <022401c296f1$ee360e80$4ef9bed8@kredding430cdt> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: DX radios are not audiophile radios.... Date: Fri, 29 Nov 2002 09:09:37 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Geez Kevin R....now you've REALLY got my brain churning. Been doing a little research on this Sony ICF2010. This looks like an awesome radio!!! Man I wish I would have done this sooner. Might have been able to get the in-laws to get me one of those instead of the 1935 Philco. And I think they probably paid $200 to $300 for that one. For that I could have gotten a 2010. Hmmmm......maybe next year? :) Guess I'll start watching EBay for one of those. It really looks neat! MJR n WYO [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Nov 29 08:20:14 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 29 Nov 2002 16:20:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 93794 invoked from network); 29 Nov 2002 16:20:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Nov 2002 16:20:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Nov 2002 16:20:12 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-84.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.84]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gATGK7N2019557; Fri, 29 Nov 2002 10:20:09 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <002801a8eaca$b879c6c0$827dfea9@home1> To: , Subject: off again Date: Fri, 4 Jan 1980 18:44:09 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I may be off the net again. The wife's been dropping off the phone payments, but for some reason they didn't get credited to our account in the past few months. Will lose (loose- for those who went to government schools) service on tue if she's not able to get something worked out today. May monitor the lists from work, but probably won't post much if at all. Scott Todd [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From philipr@irac.pe.ca Fri Nov 29 08:22:59 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 29 Nov 2002 16:22:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 55583 invoked from network); 29 Nov 2002 16:22:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Nov 2002 16:22:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.68) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Nov 2002 16:22:59 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.249] by n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 29 Nov 2002 16:22:58 -0000 Date: Fri, 29 Nov 2002 16:22:54 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: DX radios are not audiophile radios.... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <003201c297c1$b83a3560$0701010a@keva> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1452 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking The Sony 2010 is a very nice rig - it has a very good top end, for a DX radio. My brother has one which I covet! :) The synch detector works very well on it. I have a Sony ICF SW-77. The 77 is not as good, and the audio quality is very much hard-core dx. The synch detector works extremely poorly. Mine is a 1991 first year model - I got it used but in excellant ahape - box, all accessores etc. It does have very good sensitivity - especially on standard AM - its the hottest digital display radio on 530 to 1710 I have ever encountered. But at a suggested retail of almost $600 US and unavailable at all in Canada, it should be. It wouldn't surprise me if the synch detector would work better on more recent ones, but from what I have read, and my own experience, the 2010 is better! Phil R. --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Michael J. Richard" wrote: > Geez Kevin R....now you've REALLY got my brain churning. Been doing a little research on this Sony ICF2010. This looks like an awesome radio!!! Man I wish I would have done this sooner. Might have been able to get the in-laws to get me one of those instead of the 1935 Philco. And I think they probably paid $200 to $300 for that one. For that I could have gotten a 2010. Hmmmm......maybe next year? :) Guess I'll start watching EBay for one of those. It really looks neat! > > MJR n WYO > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Nov 29 09:13:17 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 29 Nov 2002 17:13:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 17978 invoked from network); 29 Nov 2002 17:13:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Nov 2002 17:13:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Nov 2002 17:13:11 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.143] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 29 Nov 2002 17:13:05 -0000 Date: Fri, 29 Nov 2002 17:13:02 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Sony AM Stereo boom-box on eBay Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 130 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics This is a Sony CFD-S22 boom-box converted to AM Stereo reception: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1941830765 From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Nov 29 09:18:56 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 29 Nov 2002 17:18:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 48346 invoked from network); 29 Nov 2002 17:18:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Nov 2002 17:18:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Nov 2002 17:18:55 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.156] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 29 Nov 2002 17:18:52 -0000 Date: Fri, 29 Nov 2002 17:18:52 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: More popular than ever Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 409 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics I noticed that if just 10 more messages are posted this month, that will make November 2002 the busiest month so far on the AM Stereo Forum in terms of number of messages posted. So far we have had over six hundred messages posted this month, and I also am happy to see that our membership is growing nearly every day; I believe we now have 133 members in total. Kevin T. Sysop of The AM Stereo Forum From amstereoguy@hotmail.com Fri Nov 29 15:42:13 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereoguy@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 29 Nov 2002 23:42:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 83682 invoked from network); 29 Nov 2002 23:42:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Nov 2002 23:42:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (207.68.165.73) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Nov 2002 23:42:12 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 29 Nov 2002 15:42:12 -0800 Received: from 208.20.8.25 by sea2fd.sea2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Fri, 29 Nov 2002 23:42:12 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Re: {AMSF} More popular than ever Date: Fri, 29 Nov 2002 18:42:12 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 29 Nov 2002 23:42:12.0460 (UTC) FILETIME=[F0A592C0:01C29800] From: "Chris Cuff" X-Originating-IP: [208.20.8.25] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37866059 Well, I can say that I received 5 requests in one day for decoders from the website today- a record! That does not sound like a lot, but each person also wanted info on am stereo related user groups. A year ago, I was getting maybe 1 inquirey a week- now, at least 20 personal emails to me per week relate to AMS. All of this has given me new energy to keep making new stuff. It seems that much to the dismay of the HD radio people, AM Stereo is the format that just refuses to die! Great stuff! CC _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus From possumhunter@netzero.net Fri Nov 29 16:06:29 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 30 Nov 2002 00:06:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 24264 invoked from network); 30 Nov 2002 00:06:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Nov 2002 00:06:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.199) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Nov 2002 00:06:29 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 29 Nov 2002 16:06:29 -0800 To: References: <002001a8ea52$3687b780$827dfea9@home1> Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM Filings Was: X-Band Date: Fri, 29 Nov 2002 19:06:13 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 30 Nov 2002 00:06:29.0101 (UTC) FILETIME=[54DF59D0:01C29804] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.161.127.121] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Scott Todd" > Did you contact any of the three I suggested? I have been having email problems, so I must have missed that post. > >BTW, what make of ATU did you go with? Kintronics Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From alfredot@inetarena.com Fri Nov 29 17:19:33 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: alfredot@inetarena.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 30 Nov 2002 01:19:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 46694 invoked from network); 30 Nov 2002 01:19:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Nov 2002 01:19:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.inetarena.com) (206.129.216.13) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Nov 2002 01:19:32 -0000 Received: from hendrie (1Cust16.tnt17.beaverton.or.da.uu.net [65.227.179.16]) by mail.inetarena.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id gAU1HYj06765 for ; Fri, 29 Nov 2002 17:17:35 -0800 (PST) Date: Fri, 29 Nov 2002 17:19:18 -0800 (PST) X-Sender: alfredo@hendrie.1610am.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: DX radios are not audiophile radios.... In-Reply-To: <1038498306.305.38741.m12@yahoogroups.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: "Alfredo E. Torrejon" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=25132238 X-Yahoo-Profile: alfredotorrejon > > THIS IS WHAT DXING RADIOS DO. THEY NARROW THE BANDWIDTH TO REJECT > > EXTRANEOUS SIGNALS. > > Better say that is what CHEAP DXing radios do. With an inherently > good design, using multiple stages of Tuned RF circuitry, you don't > need to narrow the bandwidth to achieve good sensitivity and > selectivity. Does the CCRadio even use Tuned RF, let alone double- > conversion? The C.Crane catalog doesn't say anything about it. I'm sorry--I have to agree with the other Kevin. Just ask any HAM who's worked the shortwave bands, and they will tell you that for voice communications, narrower bandwidth is better (to a degree). One detail that hasn't been made obvious in this discussion is that there are actually two important filter parameters that contribute to the selectivity of a DX-optimized radio. The first, of course, is the bandwidth, but the second is the stopband attenuation. If a radio's IF response has a narrow peak, but the "skirts" don't drop off rapidly enough, then strong signals near the desired frequency will "bleed" through, and this will make for less than optimal DXing. What the DX radio designers, even of expensive radios, try to do is to narrow the bandwidth of the receiver to pass only the frequencies needed to make human speech intelligible. Why? Because on weak signals in a crowded AM or shortwave band, the higher frequencies are likely to be polluted with unwanted electrical noise or with the sidebands of stations on nearby frequencies. This is especially true of the U.S AM broadcast band, which unlike the European AM band, is not "channelized" (that is, we don't limit audio bandwidth on this side of the Atlantic to 4.5 or 5.0 kHz). Of course, it would be nice if a radio had high sensitivity as well as a choice of several different IF filters, some optimized for DX and one for AMAX reception of local stations. However, it seems that what C. Crane was trying to accomplish was to design a DX radio that would be simple enough to use and affordable enough to appeal to the listeners of talk radio. It wasn't built for people who wanted to listen to music. Also, the use of double-conversion isn't necessary to build a good AM broadcast receiver, since the intermediate frequency that's the standard (450 kHz) causes the image to appear 900 kHz above the desired frequency. A properly designed dual-tuned AM front end can provide at least 80dB of image rejection under these conditions(1). Single-tuned front ends leave something to be desired, as I've seen the image rejection spec-ed out from 40 to 50 dB. The place where you need dual conversion is on the higher shortwave bands and with narrowband FM on the VHF bands. In both of these scenarios, you want the selectivity that is commonly available with 450 kHz IF filters, but you run into problems with image rejection because it becomes hard to build a front end that can sufficiently attenuate the image frequency. A common solution for VHF is to downconvert to 10.7 MHz (because filters for this frequency are readily available) and then to downconvert again to 450 or 455 kHz. Alfredo 1. This was the figure quoted for the accompanying front-end schematic in the book AM Stereo and TV Stereo: New Sound Dimensions. From KC4QLP@aol.com Fri Nov 29 18:22:50 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 30 Nov 2002 02:22:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 87997 invoked from network); 30 Nov 2002 02:22:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Nov 2002 02:22:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d07.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.39) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Nov 2002 02:22:49 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.78.31aa4a1a (4254) for ; Fri, 29 Nov 2002 21:22:45 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <78.31aa4a1a.2b197af5@aol.com> Date: Fri, 29 Nov 2002 21:22:45 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: DX radios are not audiophile radios.... To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 11/29/02 8:19:51 PM Eastern Standard Time, alfredot@inetarena.com writes: << I'm sorry--I have to agree with the other Kevin. Just ask any HAM who's worked the shortwave bands, and they will tell you that for voice communications, narrower bandwidth is better >> This is correct! I've been following this tread and quite frankly I about done with it all ready. Seems to me there is some sort of "competition" to see who can prove who right and wrong,brag,gloat and whatever sort of adjectives you might like to add here. Maybe some people cant help themselves when it comes to B.S. of this nature. We have 133 members here...ok so what...how many of those 133 contribute anything?..how many are possibly on lookers from the radio industry,here to "watch" the "circus"? Quite frankly its embarrassing.The type of quibble going on here...just over a damn receiver is something I would expect from my 7 and 11 year old children..not from adults. No wonder the radio industry think people here are a few filaments short of a light bulb. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From jsgil@hal-pc.org Fri Nov 29 19:12:09 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 30 Nov 2002 03:12:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 66749 invoked from network); 30 Nov 2002 03:12:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Nov 2002 03:12:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Nov 2002 03:12:09 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.137] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Nov 2002 03:12:09 -0000 Date: Sat, 30 Nov 2002 03:12:08 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: DX radios are not audiophile radios.... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 2024 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.42 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Alfredo E. Torrejon" wrote: > One detail > that hasn't been made obvious in this discussion is that there are > actually two important filter parameters that contribute to the > selectivity of a DX-optimized radio. The first, of course, is the > bandwidth, but the second is the stopband attenuation. If a radio's IF > response has a narrow peak, but the "skirts" don't drop off rapidly > enough, then strong signals near the desired frequency will > "bleed" through, and this will make for less than optimal DXing. > What the DX radio designers, even of expensive radios, try to do > is to narrow the bandwidth of the receiver to pass only the frequencies > needed to make human speech intelligible. Why? Because on weak signals > in a crowded AM or shortwave band, the higher frequencies are likely to be > polluted with unwanted electrical noise or with the sidebands of stations > on nearby frequencies.=20 I guess what would work good is a 5KHz response with very steep skirts and good stopband attenuation. A 6-element filter from the base of a 49MHz cordless phone that has a =B16KHz response and a 50db stopband attenuation would work. Cascade 2 of these together and you could have an IF response of ~=B14.5KHz with a stopband of 100db. If=20 you needed more HF attenuation a post detection low pass filter=20 could be added. > A properly designed dual-tuned AM front end can provide at > least 80dB of image rejection under these conditions(1).=20 Single-tuned > front ends leave something to be desired, as I've seen the image rejection > spec-ed out from 40 to 50 dB.=20 The older Tube radios had a dual tuned front end and used a loop instead of a ferrite rod. The RF amp was tuned also which required a 3 gang tuning cap. Used to have a Zenith clock radio in the family that was built like this. >=20 > 1. This was the figure quoted for the accompanying front-end schematic in > the book AM Stereo and TV Stereo: New Sound Dimensions. I have that book ;-) JSG From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Nov 29 20:44:00 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 30 Nov 2002 04:44:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 78200 invoked from network); 30 Nov 2002 04:43:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Nov 2002 04:43:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.78) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Nov 2002 04:43:59 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.141] by n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Nov 2002 04:43:59 -0000 Date: Sat, 30 Nov 2002 04:43:57 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: DX radios are not audiophile radios.... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 4044 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.74.18 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > I guess what would work good is a 5KHz response with very steep > skirts and good stopband attenuation. It is true that if all AM stations in North America limited their audio bandwidth to 5 kHz, and all radios had a frequency response to match, then adjacent-channel interference would be a thing of the past. However, in practice, audio with a "brick wall" at 5 kHz sounds very dull. It might be marginally acceptable for talk programming, but for music it would be especially unpleasant to listen to. Volkswagen's current car radios, based on a DSP design, have an AM audio bandwidth that is flat to 6 kHz and then drops off like a cliff. While this does provide greater mid-range clarity than other AM radios whose audio response starts dropping off as low as 2.5 or 3 kHz, the "brick wall" filter right in the middle of the effective human hearing range becomes very "artificial" to listen to. In comparison, a 4.5 kHz ceramic filter with a more gradual drop-off of response would be more pleasant to listen to, as it would allow some degree of audio response all the way to 10 kHz and beyond. In fact, the Realistic TM-152 uses a "4.5 kHz" ceramic filter, but its audio response beyond that point is high enough that it could really use a 10 kHz notch filter to cut out the carrier whistles, especially at night. By the way, this same type of VW radio appears to use a 12 kHz audio bandwidth for FM -- double that of the AM's 6 kHz, which are probably a function of the common digital audio sampling rates of 24 and 12 kHz, respectively (digital sampling rate = double the maximum audio bandwidth). On FM, it also sounds dull and artificial with that few kHz of high treble chopped off. And on weaker signals, the "high- blend" circuit can make FM sound downright *muffled*, not to mention the fact that it has no Stereo indicator at all, not even for FM. > The older Tube radios had a dual tuned front end and used a loop > instead of a ferrite rod. My old Hallicrafters radio can pick up local AM stations and stronger shortwave signals at night with *no antenna at all*. A few feet of wire clipped to the antenna terminal really perks things up and brings in most of the common shortwave broadcasts at night, and then as you increase the antenna length and put it up higher outside, the sensitivity keeps getting better and better. It may be a matter of personal preference, but I do feel that vacuum tube radios naturally have better sensitivity than solid-state designs. More specifically, tube radios offer a very wide dynamic range of the RF input; weak stations will sound quiet and strong stations will sound loud, but if you simply adjust the volume control to compensate, you can get clean reception of either type of signal. On the other hand, solid-state radios always seem to use an aggressive RF AGC (auto gain control) to improve their effective sensitivity, but it just ends up making strong signals distorted and weak signals filled with background hiss. I had a Sangean ATS-818 (a.k.a. Radio Shack DX-390) and it exhibited this problem to a large extent. Aside from its extremely narrow bandwidth, its very limited dynamic range of both the RF and audio just made it unpleasant to use. It was especially bad in SSB mode; I had to turn the RF Gain control nearly all the way down, or the audio would be almost completely unlistenable (and other users have reported this same problem in the rec.radio.shortwave group). However, one Sangean radio that actually impresses me is their little SG-622 with analog tuning, also sold as the Radio Shack DX-397. The tuning knob is very smooth and precise, and the audio from AM and Shortwave is simply excellent, even through the small built-in speaker. I can say that vacuum tube radio enthusiasts will enjoy using this radio. The only strange thing is that it has a Stereo headphone jack (even though its FM is not in Stereo) that is wired OUT OF PHASE, to give you that nice "inside your head" sound! From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Nov 29 21:24:51 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 30 Nov 2002 05:24:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 69507 invoked from network); 30 Nov 2002 05:24:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Nov 2002 05:24:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Nov 2002 05:24:50 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.140] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Nov 2002 05:24:50 -0000 Date: Sat, 30 Nov 2002 05:24:47 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: DX radios are not audiophile radios.... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <78.31aa4a1a.2b197af5@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1994 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.74.18 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > The type of quibble going on here...just over a damn receiver is > something I would expect from my 7 and 11 year old children..not > from adults. No wonder the radio industry think people here are a > few filaments short of a light bulb. Spirited discussion is the name of the game here. This would be a very boring place if everybody agreed with everybody about everything all the time. The interaction between members with different backgrounds and experiences is what helps keep this Forum active and interesting. And to offer a closing comment on this thread, part of the disagreement betwen the other Kevin and I was that we were talking about two different levels of DXing. The first level is that of simply being able to receive a distant signal, and that is what many people such as Kevin enjoy almost as if it were a sport. But the next level is that of the ability to receive a distant signal and have it *sound good*. For many people, this has been an attraction to AM Stereo for decades now, for its ability to receive distant stations in full Stereo sound with remarkable quality and fidelity. There is plenty of "DXing" available throughout the radio spectrum, but the ability to pick up a distant signal and have it reproduced in high-fidelity sound, in Stereo where available, is a true accomplishment, not only from the satisfaction of being able to receive the signal, but from the enjoyment of listening to the high quality audio it provides. And the point I was trying to make is that there is no reason a radio -- even the CCRadio -- can't be built to suit both flavors of DXing, just as high-quality radios have been able to do for decades, going back all the way to the grand console radios of the 1930s, which not only had beautifully rich tone and powerful audio, but also excellent reception. The GE Superadio III is able to do this, and that is what has kept it popular with both DXers and "audiophiles" for nearly a decade now. From jsgil@hal-pc.org Fri Nov 29 21:53:45 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 30 Nov 2002 05:53:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 8530 invoked from network); 30 Nov 2002 05:53:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Nov 2002 05:53:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Nov 2002 05:53:45 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.132] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Nov 2002 05:53:45 -0000 Date: Sat, 30 Nov 2002 05:53:44 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: DX radios are not audiophile radios.... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 3630 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.86 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin T." wrote: > > I guess what would work good is a 5KHz response with very steep > > skirts and good stopband attenuation. >=20 > It is true that if all AM stations in North America limited their=20 > audio bandwidth to 5 kHz, and all radios had a frequency response to=20 > match, then adjacent-channel interference would be a thing of the=20 > past. However, in practice, audio with a "brick wall" at 5 kHz=20 > sounds very dull. It might be marginally acceptable for talk=20 > programming, but for music it would be especially unpleasant to=20 > listen to. >=20 >=20 > In comparison, a 4.5 kHz ceramic filter with a more gradual drop-off=20 > of response would be more pleasant to listen to, as it would allow=20 > some degree of audio response all the way to 10 kHz and beyond. In=20 > fact, the Realistic TM-152 uses a "4.5 kHz" ceramic filter, but its=20 > audio response beyond that point is high enough that it could really=20 > use a 10 kHz notch filter to cut out the carrier whistles, especially=20 > at night. >=20 I brought up the idea of using surplus filters that would offer more BW for DXing but still offer good stopband attenuation. The 6-element =B16KHz filter i.e. CFW455F or SFH455F has a -3db BW @ =B14.5KHz, a -6db @ =B16KHz and probably a -10db @ =B18KHz. Cascade 2 of these together and you will have -6db BW @ =B14.5KHz, a -12db @ =B16KHz and probably a -20db @ =B18KHz. This would still be better than the typical 4-element =B13KHz filter that is used in most narrowband radios offering a wider passband response and excelent stopband attenuation. The 4-element =B13KHz filter gives you a stopband of -40db@=B19KHz and levels off at -35db. Using 2 =B16KHz filters offers a stopband of -70db@=B112.5KHz that levels off at -100db. You would still have good sounding voice but the receiver selectivity for DXing would be much better than using a single =B13KHz filter.=20 The TM-152 uses a SFG450G that has a -6db BW @ =B14.5KHz and a stopband of -40db@=B115KHz but it too levels off at -35db. It is a good compromise for local day/night operation offering good sound for both voice and music. However it doesn't roll off fast enough to offer enough attenuation for DXing when there is a strong 1st adjacent signal as this is appearent for the need for 10KHz whistle filters. The RF preselector doesn't give enough image rejection for DX purposes although a Select-A-Tenna will solve that problem. > It may be a matter of personal preference, but I do feel that vacuum=20 > tube radios naturally have better sensitivity than solid-state=20 > designs. More specifically, tube radios offer a very wide dynamic=20 > range of the RF input; weak stations will sound quiet and strong=20 > stations will sound loud, but if you simply adjust the volume control=20 > to compensate, you can get clean reception of either type of signal. >=20 A tube could handle a high level signal on the input of RF amp. a 100mVp-p signal would not cause the tube to distort but the base of a transistor can only handle a 5mV-p-p before distortion occurs and if 1 transistor is used for RF amp, Mixer, LO like most cheap AM radios do then the LO shouldn't be more than 10mVp-p and the RF input shouldn't be more than 10% of that. This doesn't leave much headroom above the noise floor so this type of front end exibits a=20 poor dynamic range and trying to DX with this front end the signal gets buried in electorn noise. A simple solution to this is to use a FET for the RF amp only as a FET can handle high level signals like a tube without distortion and also has much lower noise than a bipolar transistor. JSG From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Sat Nov 30 14:31:20 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 30 Nov 2002 22:31:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 47249 invoked from network); 30 Nov 2002 22:31:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Nov 2002 22:31:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web41006.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.93.5) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Nov 2002 22:31:18 -0000 Message-ID: <20021130223118.95943.qmail@web41006.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.33.66] by web41006.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 30 Nov 2002 14:31:18 PST Date: Sat, 30 Nov 2002 14:31:18 -0800 (PST) Subject: Can the Aussies confirm or deny these stations? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio From a search which netted me a post on "Hard-Core DX": - Australian AM stereo transmitters: The following stations transmit entirely or partially in stereo: 531 3GG Warragul 612 4QR* Brisbane (local programming only) 693 3EE Frankston " 4KQ Brisbane 702 2BL* Sydney 864 4GR Toowoomba 882 4BH Brisbane 927 3UZ Melbourne 954 2UE Sydney 1008 4TAB Brisbane 1017 2KY Sydney 1053 2CA Canberra 1116 3AK Melbourne 1143 2HD Newcastle 1242 3TR Sale " 4AK Toowoomba 1287 2TM Tamworth 1323 5DN Adelaide 1377 3MP Melbourne 1503 2BS Bathurst The one that interests me the most is 5DN. From the AMS list that I remember, there were no stations outside of areas 2-4. A 5 would be a new area! 73, N1WVQ __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Sat Nov 30 15:10:37 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 30 Nov 2002 23:10:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 96843 invoked from network); 30 Nov 2002 23:10:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Nov 2002 23:10:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web41008.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.93.7) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Nov 2002 23:10:36 -0000 Message-ID: <20021130231036.73787.qmail@web41008.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.33.66] by web41008.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 30 Nov 2002 15:10:36 PST Date: Sat, 30 Nov 2002 15:10:36 -0800 (PST) Subject: S.W. A.M.S.? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: <20021130223118.95943.qmail@web41006.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio Is there a way to put a stereo part 15 signal on 13.56MHz? How good would the audio be? Could I get to 7kC of audio or not? What is the power limit on 13.56? How about LW 175? Thanks, Jay __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Nov 30 16:13:50 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 1 Dec 2002 00:13:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 31813 invoked from network); 1 Dec 2002 00:13:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Dec 2002 00:13:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.84) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Dec 2002 00:13:49 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.143] by n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Dec 2002 00:13:49 -0000 Date: Sun, 01 Dec 2002 00:13:48 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: S.W. A.M.S.? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20021130231036.73787.qmail@web41008.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 1931 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.81.133 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Is there a way to put a stereo part 15 signal on 13.56MHz? How > good would the audio be? Could I get to 7kC of audio or not? What > is the power limit on 13.56? How about LW 175? Legal, low-power unlicensed transmitting in the USA can be done in a=20 slice of the shortwave band from 13.553 to 13.567 MHz. This gives=20 you 14 kHz of total bandwidth to work with, so as you say, if you=20 place a (double sideband) AM Stereo transmitter at 13.560 MHz, you=20 could transmit a maximum audio response of 7 kHz. By shortwave radio standards, 7 kHz of audio response is pretty good,=20 as most shortwave stations chop off their audio at anywhere from 4.5=20 to 6 kHz. It won't be as good as the few "hi-fi" shortwave stations=20 like Radio Exterior de Espa=F1a and CRI (China Radio International)=20 which are transmitting more than 10 kHz of audio bandwidth, but then=20 you don't have hundreds of thousands of watts to work with. For Part 15 use in this frequency range, the FCC actually doesn't=20 specify an exact limit on the power output or antenna length/height.=20 However, a radiated field strength limit is specified, and it is=20 quite restrictive, even moreso than on the regular AM broadcast band.=20 Nevertheless, even with very low power levels, shortwave signals can=20 be heard as far as the skywave propagation will take them, which can=20 be thousands of miles. For more information on this type of low-power unlicensed shortwave=20 radio, check out the following web site: http://home.att.net/~weatheradio/part15.htm It hasn't been updated in quite a while, but it is a large list of=20 all the known Part 15 stations, on longwave, AM, shortwave, 49 MHz=20 VHF (the cordless phone/baby monitor/walkie-talkie band), and FM,=20 with detailed information on the FCC Part 15 rules regarding each.=20 You will see 1500 "WKTW" as the one and only AM Stereo station=20 listed; that was an earlier incarnation of my own "Alfredo Lite"=20 transmitter. From KC4QLP@aol.com Sat Nov 30 17:48:15 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 1 Dec 2002 01:48:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 11174 invoked from network); 1 Dec 2002 01:48:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Dec 2002 01:48:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d10.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.42) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Dec 2002 01:48:14 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d10.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.18f.120c34ba (4254) for ; Sat, 30 Nov 2002 20:47:59 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <18f.120c34ba.2b1ac44f@aol.com> Date: Sat, 30 Nov 2002 20:47:59 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} S.W. A.M.S.? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 11/30/02 6:12:00 PM Eastern Standard Time, a1asurfradio@yahoo.com writes: << Is there a way to put a stereo part 15 signal on 13.56MHz? How good would the audio be? Could I get to 7kC of audio or not? What is the power limit on 13.56? How about LW 175? Thanks, Jay >> Hey Jay! C-Quam will work anywhere you want to put it on the radio spectrum.Expect a very local signal {a mile or so} on 13.560 mhz....but it is possible that it could be received a few hundred miles away {or around the world} given the right atmospheric conditions. The 1750 meter band {long wave} might yeild a slightly better and more predictable result..daytime coverage several miles...but expect distance coverage at night to be mainly 200 to 300 hundred miles...anything is possible though. Who will hear your signal in stereo other than you?...chances are you'll be the only one to listen to it in stereo with a modified radio. Keep us posted. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From dav259@csiro.au Sat Nov 30 18:42:10 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 1 Dec 2002 02:42:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 97273 invoked from network); 1 Dec 2002 02:42:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Dec 2002 02:42:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Dec 2002 02:42:09 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gB12g7P09034 for ; Sun, 1 Dec 2002 13:42:07 +1100 (EST) Date: Sun, 1 Dec 2002 13:42:07 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Can the Aussies confirm or deny these stations? In-Reply-To: <20021130223118.95943.qmail@web41006.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public On Sat, 30 Nov 2002, JNR wrote: > From a search which netted me a post on > "Hard-Core DX": "Hard-core" ... indeed ... :( > - Australian AM stereo transmitters: > > The following stations transmit entirely or > partially in stereo: > > 531 3GG Warragul No > 612 4QR* Brisbane (local programming only) No > 693 3EE Frankston Yes - Magic 693 (moved to South Melbourne) > " 4KQ Brisbane No [Clear Channel station] :( > 702 2BL* Sydney No > 864 4GR Toowoomba no idea > 882 4BH Brisbane No > 927 3UZ Melbourne Yes > 954 2UE Sydney No > 1008 4TAB Brisbane Yes > 1017 2KY Sydney No - currently experimenting with DAB > 1053 2CA Canberra Yes > 1116 3AK Melbourne Yes > 1143 2HD Newcastle Temporarily in mono > 1242 3TR Sale Now 3GV - Yes > " 4AK Toowoomba not sure > 1287 2TM Tamworth not sure > 1323 5DN Adelaide No - pity! > 1377 3MP Melbourne Temporarily in mono (pilot on) > 1503 2BS Bathurst probably yes > > The one that interests me the most is 5DN. From > the AMS list that I remember, there were no > stations outside of areas 2-4. A 5 would be a > new area! 5MU Murray Bridge was not that long ago AMS - but it seems to be gone. We need members in SA and WA! We also need the two Matts to say something about Qld and Mike Ryan to make some sense out of Sydney/NSW. And Samuel - where are you??? Jay - I'll repost your message on the Oz google ng to see if we can get answers to all of the above. Ian Melbourne From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Sat Nov 30 22:12:51 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 1 Dec 2002 06:12:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 82472 invoked from network); 1 Dec 2002 06:12:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Dec 2002 06:12:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14201.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.143) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Dec 2002 06:12:51 -0000 Message-ID: <20021201061251.33088.qmail@web14201.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [65.221.47.68] by web14201.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 30 Nov 2002 22:12:51 PST Date: Sat, 30 Nov 2002 22:12:51 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: More popular than ever To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio ccuff wrote: "Well, I can say that I received 5 requests in one day for decoders from the website today- a record!" Chris, just curious: has anybody mentioned my AM stereo flyers that I leave at hamfests? Wondering if they've done any good yet? __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Dec 01 01:15:13 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 1 Dec 2002 09:15:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 13933 invoked from network); 1 Dec 2002 09:15:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Dec 2002 09:15:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Dec 2002 09:15:11 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.136] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Dec 2002 09:15:08 -0000 Date: Sun, 01 Dec 2002 09:15:06 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Shortwave/Longwave AM Stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <18f.120c34ba.2b1ac44f@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1069 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.81.133 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Who will hear your signal in stereo other than you?...chances are > you'll be the only one to listen to it in stereo with a modified > radio. That is the main advantage of using a Kahn-type Independent Sideband AM Stereo system on Shortwave or Longwave. Just because C-Quam is the international standard on the AM (Mediumwave) band doesn't mean that it is set in stone for other frequency ranges. An ISB system would allow reception with any two conventional or SSB receivers (or on a single receiver with dual-channel ISB reception), and would be more able to withstand the strong propagation effects (fading, phasing) that Shortwave has. I'm still trying to track down any information on the unconfirmed report that about a decade ago, the World Administrative Radio Conference (WARC) approved use of C-Quam AM Stereo on the 49 meter (6 MHz) and 31 meter (9 MHz) Shortwave bands. This was mentioned on one web site with no other explanation and no reports of any Shortwave stations that have actually broadcast in C-Quam AM Stereo on these bands. From crashknorr@yahoo.com Sun Dec 01 11:23:06 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: crashknorr@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 1 Dec 2002 19:23:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 66393 invoked from network); 1 Dec 2002 19:23:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Dec 2002 19:23:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.83) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Dec 2002 19:23:05 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.144] by n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Dec 2002 19:23:04 -0000 Date: Sun, 01 Dec 2002 19:23:04 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: obscure newsletter gives kudos to Cuff Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 246 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "crashknorr" X-Originating-IP: 209.251.150.168 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=20677990 X-Yahoo-Profile: crashknorr Ionospheric Messenger, a newsletter devoted to Part 15 transmissions and the preservation of amplitude modulation, has given a tip of the hat to Chris Cuff and a link to this forum. http://www.part15.org/mwa/messenger/iono9.html From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Sun Dec 01 13:28:31 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 1 Dec 2002 21:28:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 32803 invoked from network); 1 Dec 2002 21:28:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Dec 2002 21:28:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web41013.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.93.12) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Dec 2002 21:28:30 -0000 Message-ID: <20021201212830.49175.qmail@web41013.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.33.66] by web41013.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 01 Dec 2002 13:28:30 PST Date: Sun, 1 Dec 2002 13:28:30 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: {AMSF} S.W. A.M.S.? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: <18f.120c34ba.2b1ac44f@aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio The thing is that while I am loving my new job up here, I desire to restart my internet station down in Florida, and if I ever get back down there to set it up, I'd like an over-the-air signal as well. I don't have enough $ to even buy time on an A.M., so I think Part 15 on a band where I can get more than a block signalwise is a good move. I remember the Columbia River microcaster giving signal levels at various levels (out to 180 miles or so). I've though about putting a station on LW for about 10 years right at 175kHz. What will the signal ranges be on 175kHz & 13.56MHz be? Neither station will be a beacon, it will be AM voice & music. Thanks & 73, Jay,N1WVQ __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Sun Dec 01 13:30:50 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 1 Dec 2002 21:30:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 8163 invoked from network); 1 Dec 2002 21:30:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Dec 2002 21:30:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web41002.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.93.1) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Dec 2002 21:30:49 -0000 Message-ID: <20021201213049.64832.qmail@web41002.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.33.66] by web41002.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 01 Dec 2002 13:30:49 PST Date: Sun, 1 Dec 2002 13:30:49 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: {AMSF} Can the Aussies confirm or deny these stations? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio Thank you, Ian. I hope areas 5-8 get members soon. Also, is 1 now Canberra (sp.?) I thought in broadcast it was 2, but I think the 2002 WRTH lists 1s. Jay __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From ccuff@in4web.com Sun Dec 01 13:43:04 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 1 Dec 2002 21:43:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 6830 invoked from network); 1 Dec 2002 21:43:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Dec 2002 21:43:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Dec 2002 21:43:04 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.41]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Sun, 1 Dec 2002 16:37:36 -0500 Message-ID: <000d01c29981$6ee30d80$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} obscure newsletter gives kudos to Cuff Date: Sun, 1 Dec 2002 16:34:29 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 Thanks Crash! It will be just a short while till after the holidays are over, and I can make more.... I am still getting requests for the little transmitters, and the boards are being plated in Kansas City now, due to arrive around Jan 10th or so... Chris ----- Original Message ----- From: crashknorr To: Sent: Sunday, December 01, 2002 2:23 PM Subject: {AMSF} obscure newsletter gives kudos to Cuff > > Ionospheric Messenger, a newsletter devoted to Part 15 transmissions > and the preservation of amplitude modulation, has given a tip of the > hat to Chris Cuff and a link to this forum. > > http://www.part15.org/mwa/messenger/iono9.html From ccuff@in4web.com Sun Dec 01 13:45:25 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 1 Dec 2002 21:45:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 32012 invoked from network); 1 Dec 2002 21:45:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Dec 2002 21:45:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Dec 2002 21:45:24 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.41]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Sun, 1 Dec 2002 16:39:57 -0500 Message-ID: <001501c29981$c2e343a0$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: <20021201061251.33088.qmail@web14201.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: More popular than ever Date: Sun, 1 Dec 2002 16:36:50 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 Ya know, Johnny, I never thought to ask when I get orders, but I "have" noticed a lot of Ham call letters attached to orders... I would guess that they are- Hey whatever works! CC ----- Original Message ----- From: John P. > Chris, just curious: has anybody mentioned my AM stereo flyers that I leave at > hamfests? Wondering if they've done any good yet? From evergreenterrace@buzzle.com Sun Dec 01 14:27:47 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: evergreenterrace@buzzle.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 1 Dec 2002 22:27:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 56656 invoked from network); 1 Dec 2002 22:27:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Dec 2002 22:27:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Dec 2002 22:27:46 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.141] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Dec 2002 22:27:46 -0000 Date: Sun, 01 Dec 2002 22:27:43 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: GLI 1290 Stereo Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 955 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgliradio" X-Originating-IP: 170.20.11.59 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=69711087 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgliradio We have pics of GLI 1290 AM Stereo... on the air legal Part 15 AM. You can check them out in the pics section. In the L+R Realistic EQ Hnat Hindes AGC CRL SEP-400 4 band compressor Moseley TAL-310 limiter Inovonics 222 NRSC filter/clipper (limiter bypassed) In the L-R Realistic EQ Marti CLH-40 Compressor Moseley TAL-280 Limiter Neve Limiter (modified out of a sound board) Fostex TT-15 tone generator, modified for 25Hz provides the pilot tone. The L-R audio is mixed with the 25Hz tone and inserted into the FM input of the improved Ramsey AM-25. The stereo is quite good to excellent (and I am told even better since Jerry installed the Moseley TAL-280 limiter in the L-R channel). Pre-emphasis is not perfect in the L-R, but is more than close enough where you cannot tell. The mono supported L+R audio is great and the station has better fidelity than most "real" AM stations, yet it has been measured well within the NRSC mask. From amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk Sun Dec 01 15:03:32 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 1 Dec 2002 23:03:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 39576 invoked from network); 1 Dec 2002 23:03:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Dec 2002 23:03:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Dec 2002 23:03:30 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.185] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Dec 2002 23:03:30 -0000 Date: Sun, 01 Dec 2002 23:03:30 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Can the Aussies confirm or deny these stations? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 380 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "m1ctk" X-Originating-IP: 81.7.62.73 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113985069 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereofan > > The one that interests me the most is 5DN. From > > the AMS list that I remember, there were no > > stations outside of areas 2-4. A 5 would be a > > new area! > 5MU Murray Bridge was not that long ago AMS - but > it seems to be gone. We need members in SA and WA! > I have 46 mins of 5MU, good quality from Aug 1991. I'll upload a clip to Dennis's list this week From possumhunter@netzero.net Sun Dec 01 15:03:47 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 1 Dec 2002 23:03:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 28083 invoked from network); 1 Dec 2002 23:03:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Dec 2002 23:03:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.190) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Dec 2002 23:03:47 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 1 Dec 2002 15:03:47 -0800 To: References: <20021201212830.49175.qmail@web41013.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} S.W. A.M.S.? Date: Sun, 1 Dec 2002 18:03:34 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 01 Dec 2002 23:03:47.0051 (UTC) FILETIME=[E75793B0:01C2998D] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.156.177.251] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 JNR wrote: >I don't have enough $ to even buy time on an A.M., so I think Part 15 on a band where I can get more than a block signalwise is a good move. Due to the poor maintenance of many AM stations, more often than not, you can get much better audio quality from your own Part 15 transmitter. > > I remember the Columbia River microcaster giving signal levels at various levels (out to 180 miles or so). What band was it on? > > I've thought about putting a station on LW for about 10 years right at 175kHz. What will the signal ranges be on 175kHz & 13.56MHz be? Neither station will be a beacon, it will be AM voice & music. Hmmm Perhaps I should quit fooling around with my lofer CW beacon "P-O-S-S-U-M" and stick a C-QUAM signal down there to simulcast my KAHN AM STEREO Part 15 on 1620. I wonder if an Alfredo will work on 175Khz??? Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From ccuff@in4web.com Sun Dec 01 15:12:36 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 1 Dec 2002 23:12:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 50218 invoked from network); 1 Dec 2002 23:12:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Dec 2002 23:12:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Dec 2002 23:12:36 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.61]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Sun, 1 Dec 2002 18:07:06 -0500 Message-ID: <006b01c2998d$f00e4260$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} GLI 1290 Stereo Date: Sun, 1 Dec 2002 18:04:00 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 Can you post some info on how you injected the signal into the Ramsey? I am most curious to see how you did it- thanks, Chris ----- Original Message ----- From: wgliradio To: Sent: Sunday, December 01, 2002 5:27 PM Subject: {AMSF} GLI 1290 Stereo > We have pics of GLI 1290 AM Stereo... on the air legal Part 15 AM. > You can check them out in the pics section. From ccuff@in4web.com Sun Dec 01 15:16:28 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 1 Dec 2002 23:16:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 55554 invoked from network); 1 Dec 2002 23:16:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Dec 2002 23:16:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Dec 2002 23:16:27 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.61]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Sun, 1 Dec 2002 18:10:59 -0500 Message-ID: <007f01c2998e$7acc2480$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: <20021201212830.49175.qmail@web41013.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} S.W. A.M.S.? Date: Sun, 1 Dec 2002 18:07:53 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 Sure it will work on 175!- but it will require minor coil and capacitor changes in the RF1 and RF 2 stages. Of course, you would need to modify an LW receiver for AMS to hear it... Chris ----- Original Message ----- From: Possum Hunter To: Sent: Sunday, December 01, 2002 6:03 PM Subject: Re: {AMSF} S.W. A.M.S.? I wonder if an Alfredo will work on 175Khz??? > > Long live FREE RADIO! > > Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sun Dec 01 17:51:10 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 2 Dec 2002 01:51:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 25845 invoked from network); 2 Dec 2002 01:51:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Dec 2002 01:51:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Dec 2002 01:51:09 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.174] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Dec 2002 01:51:09 -0000 Date: Mon, 02 Dec 2002 01:51:09 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Shortwave/Longwave AM Stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 1895 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.154 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin T." wrote: > > Who will hear your signal in stereo other than you?...chances are > > you'll be the only one to listen to it in stereo with a modified > > radio. >=20 > That is the main advantage of using a Kahn-type Independent Sideband=20 > AM Stereo system on Shortwave or Longwave. Just because C-Quam is=20 > the international standard on the AM (Mediumwave) band doesn't mean=20 > that it is set in stone for other frequency ranges. An ISB system=20 > would allow reception with any two conventional or SSB receivers (or=20 > on a single receiver with dual-channel ISB reception), and would be=20 > more able to withstand the strong propagation effects (fading,=20 > phasing) that Shortwave has. >=20 While multipath and selective fading via skywave results in less phase shift at MW frequencies the SW band is more affected by it and on VHF(FM) it can be really bad resulting in the picket fence effect. Even on mono SW signals this can cause a fair amount of signal cancellation when each sideband of a DSB signal cancels out each other instead of reinforcing each other. When an envelope detector is used to detect the affected signal this produces=20 harmonic distortion. You will get better reception if you use SSB mode to receive a DSB signal that is affected with this type of reception. Try to do stereo under these conditions and you can imagine what the result will be. This is why ISB stereo is such a logical choice in the SW bands. You don't get very far with a QuAM based signal and would mostly serve the local market but SW is=20 geared for DXing and you need a mode that will carry a stereo signal over long distances. You can use a C-QuAM exciter to generate an ISB signal using some additional audio processing. By phase shifting L-R by 90=B0 and leaving L+R alone this will generate an ISB signal as outlined in the 1988 ARRL handbook. From wa2fnq@optonline.net Sun Dec 01 18:01:58 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: wa2fnq@optonline.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 2 Dec 2002 02:01:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 51061 invoked from network); 2 Dec 2002 02:01:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Dec 2002 02:01:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Dec 2002 02:01:57 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.165] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Dec 2002 02:01:57 -0000 Date: Mon, 02 Dec 2002 02:01:56 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: GLI 1290 Stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <006b01c2998d$f00e4260$0101a8c0@pavilion> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3874 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wa2fnq" X-Originating-IP: 24.47.74.230 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=60059615 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa2fnq Hi Chris and all, Thanks for the interest in this thing. I'm basically doing things in a similar manner that I used on my 75 meter AM stereo transmitter. Here are the details: I misplaced the schematic I was making notes on and I'd have to take the transmitter totally apart to look but from memory I injected L - R audio in at the junction of R19 and the varactor in the PLL circut. You just need to FM the thing a bit. It doesn't take a lot of audio. The pre-emphasis network was a cut and try thing. I matched the 75 microsecond pre-emphasis in the Inovonics 222 and went from there. Like any of the Ramsey kits the AM-25 needed a bit of help. First problem was they sent an 18 volt wall wart to power the thing and the AM-25 runs on 12 volts. That was smart of them but I wasn't going to use the wall wart anyway. I have the transmitter powered by one of the 12 volt Astron supplies in my packet station. Q5 runs warm to the touch. Putting the transmitter on a proper 12 volt supply calmed down the heating quite a bit but I added a heat sink. Ever see a 2N3904 with a heatsink? I also had some heating of L6. Believe it or not I added a heat sink to it and it's running cool. First time I ever had to do that. This is all kinda jury rig but it will keep the AM-25 from burning up in 24/7 operation. BTW, one of the guys from the part 15 message board called Ramsey and they said the component overheating is normal. When I turned on my TV set I noticed that I was getting TVI from the AM-25. Traced that problem to the driver transistor for the PLL lock light. I didn't believe that one but it was taking off and going into bussiness for itself. A .01 mfd cap. across the LED connections cleaned that up. When I hooked it up to my antenna the range wasn't as good as my cheapie AM-1. That disappointed me. I'm using a good ground on both transmitters. I have 2 inches of braid going right to a cold water pipe. The antenna lead goes right out the window. Basically the AM-25s efficiency stinks. I wasn't overly impressed with the audio either. Listening on a Sony SRF-42 AM stereo receiver you could hear all kinds of trash being generated with the reciever in the stereo mode. This would happen as the unit modulated. A sign the transmitter was generating incidental phase modulation products. This must be something with Ramsey's design because the AM-1 seems to do this too! The audio in general was below my expectations. I solved those problems by building my own final/modulator. I used a 2N5913 series modulated by another 2N5913 in a similar system as used by the AM-1. The AM-25 board drives the new final. Audio on the AM-25 is turned off. All that circutry does now is to set the operating point of the RF output transistor of the AM-25. Audio to the series modulator comes from a broadcast quality line amplifier made by Radio Design Labs. On the RF amplifier, I used an output network of a pi-network design with an additional small loading coil to match in to the antenna. The coverage is much improved, the IPM products are gone and the spurious trash along with harmonics are well in part 15 specs. I've had the AM-25 in operation 24/7 for a few of months now with no trouble. It ain't CQUAM but it's stereo and it sounds OK. Hope this answers some questions. Jerry WA2FNQ GLI 1290 AM Stereo --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Christopher Cuff" wrote: > Can you post some info on how you injected the signal into the Ramsey? > I am most curious to see how you did it- > thanks, > Chris > ----- Original Message ----- > From: wgliradio > To: > Sent: Sunday, December 01, 2002 5:27 PM > Subject: {AMSF} GLI 1290 Stereo > > > > We have pics of GLI 1290 AM Stereo... on the air legal Part 15 AM. > > You can check them out in the pics section. From evergreenterrace@buzzle.com Sun Dec 01 18:40:32 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: evergreenterrace@buzzle.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 2 Dec 2002 02:40:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 62987 invoked from network); 2 Dec 2002 02:40:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Dec 2002 02:40:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Dec 2002 02:40:31 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.141] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Dec 2002 02:40:31 -0000 Date: Mon, 02 Dec 2002 02:40:28 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: GLI 1290 Stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 285 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgliradio" X-Originating-IP: 170.20.11.59 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=69711087 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgliradio --- In amstereoforum@y..., "wa2fnq" wrote: > > It ain't CQUAM but it's stereo and it sounds OK. > A little modest... it sounds better than OK. It beats WREF and WICC IMHO (stereo or mono... and this is before I have heard the latest improvement). Mike Erickson From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Dec 01 19:35:33 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 2 Dec 2002 03:35:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 21696 invoked from network); 2 Dec 2002 03:35:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Dec 2002 03:35:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.70) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Dec 2002 03:35:33 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.157] by n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Dec 2002 03:35:33 -0000 Date: Mon, 02 Dec 2002 03:35:30 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Delco - no AM Stereo Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1499 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.74.162 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics I recently got this "Saturn" Delco radio on eBay: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1395673403 With the 5-band equalizer, "Auto DNR", "Loud" and "CrO2" buttons, and full-logic tape player, it appeared to be one of the AM Stereo- equipped models, similar to the popular "UX-1". I haven't powered it up yet, but when I opened it up, I noticed that the tuner board is exactly the same as that of my 2000 Delco radio with narrow-bandwidth AM mono. I guess this means that appearances were deceiving, and it doesn't have AM Stereo... although I have heard that the high-end 1993-1994 Saturn radios supposedly did have AM Stereo, even though the feature was never advertised. Obviously it can still be converted to AM Stereo, and Chris has converted other Delco radios with the same tuner board with good results, but it's not the same as having AMAX-certified AM Stereo as a built-in feature, like the other 1993+ high-end Delco radios that look deceivingly similar to this one. So, if anybody would like to have this one as a conversion project, just let me know. It's actually a fairly easy conversion to AM Stereo, as all the required connections are easily accessible, and there is plenty of room for the decoder inside. The only catch is that the standard 3 kHz ceramic filter will have to be replaced to get anything better than telephone-quality audio on AM -- unless you bypass it entirely, for "barn door" bandwidth, but then that's no good for DXing. From dav259@csiro.au Sun Dec 01 20:36:20 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 2 Dec 2002 04:36:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 21958 invoked from network); 2 Dec 2002 04:36:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Dec 2002 04:36:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Dec 2002 04:36:18 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gB24aHP29394 for ; Mon, 2 Dec 2002 15:36:17 +1100 (EST) Date: Mon, 2 Dec 2002 15:36:17 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Can the Aussies confirm or deny these stations? In-Reply-To: <20021201213049.64832.qmail@web41002.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public On Sun, 1 Dec 2002, JNR wrote: > Thank you, Ian. I hope areas 5-8 get members > soon. Also, is 1 now Canberra (sp.?) I thought > in broadcast it was 2, but I think the 2002 WRTH > lists 1s. Jay - I think "1" is supposed to be the ACT - as the radio stations were originally given the same numbers as military zones - but as Canberra/ACT is surrounded by NSW their stations have commonly started with the NSW "2". (The post [zip] codes and interstate phone prefixes used to also follow this pattern.) From amfmdx@fastq.com Sun Dec 01 21:50:47 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 2 Dec 2002 05:50:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 4480 invoked from network); 2 Dec 2002 05:50:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Dec 2002 05:50:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Dec 2002 05:50:46 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt (d89-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.121]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gB25ojv55311 for ; Sun, 1 Dec 2002 22:50:45 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <00a201c299c6$bd824240$bff9bed8@kredding430cdt> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} obscure newsletter gives kudos to Cuff Date: Sun, 1 Dec 2002 22:50:36 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla Crash, This thing is pretty cool. Can you subscribe to it? Kevin ----- Original Message ----- From: "crashknorr" To: Sent: Sunday, December 01, 2002 12:23 PM Subject: {AMSF} obscure newsletter gives kudos to Cuff > > Ionospheric Messenger, a newsletter devoted to Part 15 transmissions > and the preservation of amplitude modulation, has given a tip of the > hat to Chris Cuff and a link to this forum. > > http://www.part15.org/mwa/messenger/iono9.html > > > > > > > > > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > From amfmdx@fastq.com Sun Dec 01 22:00:25 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 2 Dec 2002 06:00:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 53115 invoked from network); 2 Dec 2002 06:00:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Dec 2002 06:00:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Dec 2002 06:00:25 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt (d89-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.121]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gB260Ov55432 for ; Sun, 1 Dec 2002 23:00:24 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <00b601c299c8$162493c0$bff9bed8@kredding430cdt> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Delco - no AM Stereo Date: Sun, 1 Dec 2002 23:00:14 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > bypass it entirely, for "barn door" bandwidth, but then that's no > good for DXing. Sadly, most of us have to have some DX capability to hear ANY AM $tereo at all. Kevin Mesa, Arizona From crashknorr@yahoo.com Sun Dec 01 23:16:29 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: crashknorr@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 2 Dec 2002 07:16:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 6186 invoked from network); 2 Dec 2002 07:16:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Dec 2002 07:16:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Dec 2002 07:16:29 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.147] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Dec 2002 07:16:29 -0000 Date: Mon, 02 Dec 2002 07:16:28 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} obscure newsletter gives kudos to Cuff Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <00a201c299c6$bd824240$bff9bed8@kredding430cdt> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 402 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "crashknorr" X-Originating-IP: 209.251.150.154 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=20677990 X-Yahoo-Profile: crashknorr --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" wrote: > This thing is pretty cool. Can you subscribe to it? Thanks. Subscription not really available, just visit part15.org once a month and check the Newsroom page to see if anything new has been added. If people want to let the world know what they're doing with their part 15 AM transmitters they can send me the info. From amfmdx@fastq.com Sun Dec 01 23:24:50 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 2 Dec 2002 07:24:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 90523 invoked from network); 2 Dec 2002 07:24:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Dec 2002 07:24:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Dec 2002 07:24:49 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt (d89-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.121]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gB27Omv56135 for ; Mon, 2 Dec 2002 00:24:48 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <010401c299d3$de1d3340$bff9bed8@kredding430cdt> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} obscure newsletter gives kudos to Cuff Date: Mon, 2 Dec 2002 00:24:34 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla I have a special place for part 15 xmitters. I ran Lowfer beacon HOT on 186 kHz for a long time. Kevin Mesa, Arizona ----- Original Message ----- From: "crashknorr" To: Sent: Monday, December 02, 2002 12:16 AM Subject: Re: {AMSF} obscure newsletter gives kudos to Cuff > --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" wrote: > > > This thing is pretty cool. Can you subscribe to it? > > Thanks. Subscription not really available, just visit part15.org > once a month and check the Newsroom page to see if anything new > has been added. If people want to let the world know what > they're doing with their part 15 AM transmitters they can > send me the info. > > > > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > From anjill154@yahoo.com.au Sun Dec 01 23:44:39 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: anjill154@yahoo.com.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 2 Dec 2002 07:44:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 16876 invoked from network); 2 Dec 2002 07:44:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Dec 2002 07:44:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.83) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Dec 2002 07:44:39 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.158] by n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Dec 2002 07:44:39 -0000 Date: Mon, 02 Dec 2002 07:44:38 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Can the Aussies confirm or deny these stations? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20021130223118.95943.qmail@web41006.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1728 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "anjill154" X-Originating-IP: 203.220.154.192 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public Yes I can verify a few of them (unfortunately the situation is a bit dismal). The station I know that is definitely in stereo is 1053 2CA Canberra (the nations capital) which plays good time oldies. 873 2GB (talk) Sydney is in stereo but the separation is pretty bad. The ones I know of that are not is stereo are: 702 2BL Sydney (ABC local radio) 954 2UE Sydney (talk) 1017 2KY Sydney (racing) 1143 2HD Newcastle (variety) 1170 2CH Sydney (easy listening) pilot only 1269 2SM Sydney (music/variety) 1368 2GN Goulburn (oldies) The ones I have a suspicion of not being in Stereo are: 1287 2TM Tamworth 1503 2BS Bathurst All these stations giving up on AM stereo, it's enough to make you cry. Samuel From Ulladulla in NSW Australia --- In amstereoforum@y..., JNR wrote: > From a search which netted me a post on > "Hard-Core DX": > > - Australian AM stereo transmitters: > > The following stations transmit entirely or > partially in stereo: > > 531 3GG Warragul > 612 4QR* Brisbane (local programming only) > 693 3EE Frankston > " 4KQ Brisbane > 702 2BL* Sydney > 864 4GR Toowoomba > 882 4BH Brisbane > 927 3UZ Melbourne > 954 2UE Sydney > 1008 4TAB Brisbane > 1017 2KY Sydney > 1053 2CA Canberra > 1116 3AK Melbourne > 1143 2HD Newcastle > 1242 3TR Sale > " 4AK Toowoomba > 1287 2TM Tamworth > 1323 5DN Adelaide > 1377 3MP Melbourne > 1503 2BS Bathurst > > The one that interests me the most is 5DN. From > the AMS list that I remember, there were no > stations outside of areas 2-4. A 5 would be a > new area! > > 73, > N1WVQ > > > __________________________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. > http://mailplus.yahoo.com From n0uiheric@aol.com Sun Dec 01 23:45:34 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 2 Dec 2002 07:45:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 63074 invoked from network); 2 Dec 2002 07:45:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Dec 2002 07:45:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r04.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.100) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Dec 2002 07:45:32 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-r04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.12d.1c36211d (4592) for ; Mon, 2 Dec 2002 02:45:29 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <12d.1c36211d.2b1c6998@aol.com> Date: Mon, 2 Dec 2002 02:45:28 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Shortwave/Longwave AM Stereo To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih I don't think Kahn should be used on Longwave or Shortwave...C-QUAM ONLY! Besides, Kahn's AM Stereo system is not the legally-recognized standard; it's the Motorola system. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From jsgil@hal-pc.org Mon Dec 02 00:25:55 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 2 Dec 2002 08:25:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 56723 invoked from network); 2 Dec 2002 08:25:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Dec 2002 08:25:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.70) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Dec 2002 08:25:54 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.248] by n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Dec 2002 08:25:54 -0000 Date: Mon, 02 Dec 2002 08:25:52 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: Shortwave/Longwave AM Stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <12d.1c36211d.2b1c6998@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 1492 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.123 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@y..., n0uiheric@a... wrote: > I don't think Kahn should be used on Longwave or Shortwave...C-QUAM ONLY!=20 > Besides, Kahn's AM Stereo system is not the legally-recognized standard; it's=20 > the Motorola system. >=20 > 73 and good DX from Eric > Amateur Radio Station N0UIH > Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN > Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 > DXing The World since 1981 > Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel > PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION > "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 Yea, don't use Kahn. Use an ISB version C-QuAM by audio phase=20 shifting L-R by 90=B0. It would still be C-QuAM for legal purposes but it would offer the skywave performance of ISB and the great sound of C-QuAM giving the best of both worlds. It would just be=20 a different form of matrix processing that would process the audio to generate the phase shifting. Cosine correction is less prone to errors caused by interference because phase is returning to 0=B0 as the envelope is approaching -100% modulation whereas in regular=20 C-QuAM the phase is at its greatest when envelope is approaching=20 -100% modulation. This is the reason why C-QuAM has to be limited to 75% single channel modulation to avoid decoding errors. Phase shifting L-R by 90=B0 alows 95% single channel modulation before it will cause problems. It could be received with 2 radios tuned to=20 upper and lower sidebands. JSG From wa2fnq@optonline.net Mon Dec 02 10:31:08 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: wa2fnq@optonline.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 2 Dec 2002 18:31:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 34587 invoked from network); 2 Dec 2002 18:31:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Dec 2002 18:31:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Dec 2002 18:31:07 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.128] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Dec 2002 18:31:07 -0000 Date: Mon, 02 Dec 2002 18:31:06 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: GLI 1290 Stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 484 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wa2fnq" X-Originating-IP: 24.47.74.230 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=60059615 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa2fnq Maybe so.... but they don't have the audio engineer that I do . Jerry WA2FNQ GLI 1290 AM Stereo --- In amstereoforum@y..., "wgliradio" wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@y..., "wa2fnq" wrote: > > > > > It ain't CQUAM but it's stereo and it sounds OK. > > > > A little modest... it sounds better than OK. It beats WREF and WICC > IMHO (stereo or mono... and this is before I have heard the latest > improvement). > > > Mike Erickson From matthew.trim@eds.com Mon Dec 02 14:38:17 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: matthew.trim@eds.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 2 Dec 2002 22:38:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 43453 invoked from network); 2 Dec 2002 22:38:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Dec 2002 22:38:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO ns5.eds.com) (203.17.185.230) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Dec 2002 22:38:15 -0000 Received: from nnsy.eds.com (nnsy-2.eds.com [192.85.216.198]) by ns5.eds.com (8.11.6/8.11.1) with ESMTP id gB2McEE07883 for ; Tue, 3 Dec 2002 09:38:14 +1100 (EST) Received: from nnsy.eds.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by nnsy.eds.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gB2McAl12706 for ; Tue, 3 Dec 2002 09:38:11 +1100 (EST) Received: from ausym000.exau01.exch.eds.com ([134.251.177.117]) by nnsy.eds.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gB2Mc9a12676 for ; Tue, 3 Dec 2002 09:38:09 +1100 (EST) Received: by AUSYM000 with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Tue, 3 Dec 2002 09:36:50 +1100 Message-ID: <33CDDBD8CAEFEB4191ABF6F799032AF238D6BA@aubwm206> To: "'amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com'" Subject: Super Radio Clone finally available in Australia! (Radio Shack 1 2-903) Date: Tue, 3 Dec 2002 09:36:46 +1100 Importance: high X-Priority: 1 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-Type: text/plain From: "Trim, Matthew L" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88615102 X-Yahoo-Profile: bofh2k2000 http://www.lenoxx.com.au/product.asp?SKU=R300&branch=34&page=1 Lenoxx R300 Super Radio Super radio AM/FM Treble Bass Volume Band with AFC Band width wide/normal AC/DC Meas: 32cm x 22cm x 7cm Available for AUD $99 from Retravision stores! I still haven't been able to find the genuine GE Super Radio III on sale again in Oz. There was a 240v/50hz modified version available some years ago, (early 90's) however they were discontinued around 1994/1995 from what I can tell. I emailed Thomson Electronics (who bought out the GE Consumer Electronics division) and it looks like they are still being made and could be imported if a suitable local distributor could be found. The main problem is they need to be converted locally to 240v/50hz operation. Cheers, Matt From evergreenterrace@buzzle.com Mon Dec 02 14:51:32 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: evergreenterrace@buzzle.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 2 Dec 2002 22:51:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 36747 invoked from network); 2 Dec 2002 22:51:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Dec 2002 22:51:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.69) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Dec 2002 22:51:22 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.156] by n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Dec 2002 22:51:20 -0000 Date: Mon, 02 Dec 2002 22:51:19 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Tom Ray: Negative Comments toward our group in Radio World Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1528 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgliradio" X-Originating-IP: 170.20.11.59 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=69711087 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgliradio In Radio World (12/2/02) About WOR and IBOC: "Negative comments also have come from a group of AM stereo fanatics in New Jersey. These people live for the day AM stereo makes a comeback. They are not listening on typical AM radios. They have verbally and personally attacked both Kerry and me, as well as the radio station and Ibiquity. This group thinks that AM radio is a high fidelity medium. The also started a rumor that WOR was operating illegally." 1) Tom needs to chill out a bit. He can rest assured that big brother will make sure IBOC is forced onto us while we have no say... even though it is possibly the worst thing ever invented for broadcasting. Our views on IBOC are well founded and, hate to tell you, AM stereo and AMAX IMPROVES AM radio. Any engineer that says otherwise is foolish and misguided. 2) Do not blame the medium for poorly designed radios. IBOC does NOT IMPROVE AM and AM IBOC couldn't be further away from high fidelity. Instead of IBOC, AM receiver design should be improved over what the average person can purchase right now. 3) I believe that WOR is within the NRSC mask. However, the digital artifacts created from IBOC have an average to peak ratio of virtually 1:1. Off channel noise is SO MUCH WORSE with IBOC than with analog information. Cram IBOC onto stations with adjacents on either side... I don't think anyone here has to be told what THAT will sound like. DIGITAL FOR THE SAKE OF DIGITAL IS HERE. LOVE IT, NO MATTER HOW BAD IT SOUNDS! From amstereoguy@hotmail.com Mon Dec 02 15:06:58 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereoguy@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 2 Dec 2002 23:06:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 30702 invoked from network); 2 Dec 2002 23:06:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Dec 2002 23:06:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (207.68.165.29) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Dec 2002 23:06:57 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 2 Dec 2002 15:06:57 -0800 Received: from 208.20.8.129 by sea2fd.sea2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Mon, 02 Dec 2002 23:06:57 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Tom Ray: Negative Comments toward our group in Radio World Date: Mon, 02 Dec 2002 18:06:57 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 02 Dec 2002 23:06:57.0601 (UTC) FILETIME=[8354F310:01C29A57] From: "Chris Cuff" X-Originating-IP: [208.20.8.129] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37866059 Well, now I am offended! I am NOT in New Jersey!.. LOL.. I am in New Yawk. (but that's upstate NY, so it doesn't count) He doesnt realize how big this "group of fanatics" is becoming. I have ben at this freaking keyboard for 2 hours now, answering AM stereo questions, and I'm not done yet. One of the best ones is from a school system that wants instructional kit radios. There are gonna be a lot more "LPAM'ers" out there too- My initial order for more boards is not going to be enough. Wonder how much email THEY get in HD land (is that Heavy Distortion?) Chris >From: "wgliradio" > >"Negative comments also have come from a group of AM stereo fanatics >in New Jersey. These people live for the day AM stereo makes a >comeback. _________________________________________________________________ STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail From penry@nortelnetworks.com Mon Dec 02 16:36:55 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: penry@nortelnetworks.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 3 Dec 2002 00:36:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 18549 invoked from network); 3 Dec 2002 00:36:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Dec 2002 00:36:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO zsc3s004.nortelnetworks.com) (47.81.138.65) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Dec 2002 00:36:54 -0000 Received: from zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com (zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com [47.103.122.112]) by zsc3s004.nortelnetworks.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id gB30aq913719 for ; Mon, 2 Dec 2002 16:36:53 -0800 (PST) Received: from zrc2c011.us.nortel.com (zrc2c011.us.nortel.com [47.103.120.51]) by zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id gB30b5Y02897 for ; Mon, 2 Dec 2002 18:37:05 -0600 (CST) Received: by zrc2c011.us.nortel.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Mon, 2 Dec 2002 18:36:52 -0600 Message-ID: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A5607974048E70A0@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: {AMSF} Tom Ray: Negative Comments toward our group in Radio W orld Date: Mon, 2 Dec 2002 18:36:50 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) From: "Charles Penry" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=376233 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa5vhu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit We all need to chill out. Our comments such as "Any engineer that says otherwise is foolish and misguided" is indeed a personal attack, as we have been rightly accused of, and is not helping us get our message across, which is Hi-Fidelity Analog AM Stereo. "Listen to me you stupid idiot! You don't know what you are talking about so I will now tell you what you should know, you moron!" How receptive would you be to what I have to say if I come across to you that way? And how intelligent does it make me sound? For the record, except for us AMSF types, AM is not a high fidelity medium. Anyone that "says otherwise is foolish and misguided", to bounce our words back to us. When we say "Do not blame the medium for poorly designed radios" we are saying the same as "Consumer cassette recorders can have a frequency response to 60KHz, it's just that no tape manufacturer has wanted to make a cassette tape that has the performance characteristic to reproduce such high frequencies, so don't blame the cassette medium." Sorry, the available tape is an integral part of the cassette medium. If all manufacturers stop making cassette tape, the medium dies. The AM medium for the consumer includes everything from the transmitted audio source through the rest of the air chain and ends at the consumer with the receiver. The receiver is an integral part of the medium and cannot be separated from it. The general public does not currently have access to high fidelity AM radios, so AM is therefore not considered a high fidelity medium to the general public. You say that high fidelity radios are available to the general public? Well no, they really aren't, but for purposes of discussion let's say they are... Putting my general public person hat on: "So to get high fidelity on AM I will have to replace all my existing radios that have the AM band? All my old radios will all be obsolete and I will have to replace them with new high fidelity AM radios? My home stereo, my surround sound receiver in my recreation room, my kitchen radio, both my car radios, the radio in my garage workshop, my bedroom clock radio, all my kids radios, my families four walkmans, and a couple of more I have somewhere around the house? Well gee; I don't want to do that. That sounds as bad as this new fangled digital radio deal, where I will eventually have to replace all my radios. If I have to replace all my radios, wouldn't I be better off just going digital? Digital is always better, right?" Taking off my general public person hat: Folks, try to remember that we are currently a few fanatics (apparently growing in numbers!), and the real world is concerned with the general public, the place and group which all, most, or some of us don't qualify for. My position: I believe that Analog CQUAM AM Stereo is the best format, hopefully to be improved on by the Digital Signal Processing advances for receivers that loom on the horizon. I believe that IBOC in its present form for the AM band is not a viable product. IBOC AM may or may not improve, I don't know. In the long run, we shall see what survives. Perhaps one format? Both? Neither? Before we hit send, we should copy our mother. Would we want her to see what dirty words we are using or what we are saying about other people? Did we notice that I used the words "we", "us" and "our" throughout this email? That's because anything that any one of us writes here at the AMSF group (and other places) is considered by others to be from all of us and be a representative opinion of the entire AMSF group. We can certainly have different opinions however when one of us throws a rock through someone's window, we are all blamed. I believe we should continue to press forward with our Analog AM Stereo efforts and reduce the badmouthing of other formats and other individuals involved with other formats. I see an Analog AM Stereo snow ball heading towards Chris Cuff and it's getting bigger as it goes. Let's help keep it rolling and it will roll over and suck up everything as it goes. (What's in your wallet?) If we can get schools interested we can re-introduce AM to the youngsters, possibly opening up a whole new generation of listeners older than the Disney AM listener crowd! And please give the CC Radio a rest. This radio has nothing to do with Analog AM Hi-Fidelity Stereo or Analog AM Hi-Fidelity Mono. Start your own "I Hate (insert radio model here)" Yahoo group if you are all that excited about discussing your frustrations with the world. And while it can help our cause by asking manufacturers about making Analog AM Hi-Fidelity Stereo receivers, it does no good to bad mouth them in the press, on these forums or directly to them in correspondence for their choice in not doing so. Charles [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From evergreenterrace@buzzle.com Mon Dec 02 17:05:09 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: evergreenterrace@buzzle.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 3 Dec 2002 01:05:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 88616 invoked from network); 3 Dec 2002 01:05:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Dec 2002 01:05:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Dec 2002 01:05:05 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.181] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Dec 2002 01:05:05 -0000 Date: Tue, 03 Dec 2002 01:05:05 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Tom Ray: Negative Comments toward our group in Radio W orld Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A5607974048E70A0@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3566 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgliradio" X-Originating-IP: 170.20.11.59 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=69711087 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgliradio --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Charles Penry" wrote: > We all need to chill out. > > Our comments such as "Any engineer that says otherwise is foolish and > misguided" is indeed a personal attack, as we have been rightly accused of, > and is not helping us get our message across, which is Hi-Fidelity Analog AM > Stereo. That comment is general and not directed at any one particular engineer. > > For the record, except for us AMSF types, AM is not a high fidelity medium. What does that mean? That AM is "high fidelity" only with the right radio? Either it is or it isn't... period (and it is FM like). You cannot blame the transmission method on bad radios. Receiver design is paramount in ANY broadcast scheme. The AM medium for the consumer includes > everything from the transmitted audio source through the rest of the air > chain and ends at the consumer with the receiver. The receiver is an > integral part of the medium and cannot be separated from it. The general > public does not currently have access to high fidelity AM radios, so AM is > therefore not considered a high fidelity medium to the general public. But it CAN be and HAS been. That is where your argument goes out the window. High-Fidelity AM is not something new. It's only within the last 10-15 years that AM radio design has fallen over the side. > You say that high fidelity radios are available to the general public? Well > no, they really aren't, but for purposes of discussion let's say they are... When did I say they were available? I said they need to be IMPROVED OVER WHAT CONSUMERS CAN BUY TODAY. > Putting my general public person hat on: > "So to get high fidelity on AM I will have to replace all my existing radios > that have the AM band? All my old radios will all be obsolete and I will > have to replace them with new high fidelity AM radios? No, because 1) AM radio is backwards compatable on itself. Old radios would not be obsolete. 2) Radios are so poorly made today, you need to replace them every 2- 3 years anyhow. Just add the improved AMAX tuners in new radios. In 5-10 years, you'd have more than enough radios out there to make a difference. All with little to no added cost and no change to the current broadcast scheme. Unlike IBOC. > Before we hit send, we should copy our mother. Would we want her to see what > dirty words we are using or what we are saying about other people? Did we > notice that I used the words "we", "us" and "our" throughout this email? > That's because anything that any one of us writes here at the AMSF group > (and other places) is considered by others to be from all of us and be a > representative opinion of the entire AMSF group. We can certainly have > different opinions however when one of us throws a rock through someone's > window, we are all blamed. I posted it. It's my opinion and I speak for myself. If others have a different opionon (as you do), you have the right to respond. > > I believe we should continue to press forward with our Analog AM Stereo > efforts and reduce the badmouthing of other formats and other individuals > involved with other formats. I see an Analog AM Stereo snow ball heading > towards Chris Cuff and it's getting bigger as it goes. Are you sure Chris Cuff wanted you to speak for him? > > And please give the CC Radio a rest. This radio has nothing to do with > Analog AM Hi-Fidelity Stereo or Analog AM Hi-Fidelity Mono. Again, your view or the view of the entire forum? From KC4QLP@aol.com Mon Dec 02 18:45:50 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 3 Dec 2002 02:45:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 24047 invoked from network); 3 Dec 2002 02:45:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Dec 2002 02:45:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r07.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.103) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Dec 2002 02:45:50 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.1a8.ceb56eb (3310) for ; Mon, 2 Dec 2002 21:45:41 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1a8.ceb56eb.2b1d74d4@aol.com> Date: Mon, 2 Dec 2002 21:45:40 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Tom Ray: Negative Comments toward our group in Radio World To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/2/02 5:52:36 PM Eastern Standard Time, evergreenterrace@buzzle.com writes: << "Negative comments also have come from a group of AM stereo fanatics in New Jersey. These people live for the day AM stereo makes a comeback. They are not listening on typical AM radios. They have verbally and personally attacked both Kerry and me, as well as the radio station and Ibiquity. This group thinks that AM radio is a high fidelity medium. The also started a rumor that WOR was operating illegally." >> Its quite obvious that we have someone or someones on this list that really do not know what they are talking about.....and spreading rumors about stations operating illegally and attacking those in the business. Now ladies and gentlemen..it has reached the press...the press for the radio medium at that!..how long will it be before this reaches CNN,FOX or any of those other world wide general news companies?Does someone have to get sued first before they stop with the diarrhea of the mouth?!?Slamming people,companies and saying things that arent true is serious stuff folks! Its my opinion that those that do not have a clue as to whats going on in radio or even has any experince in engineering and FCC matters needs to shut their pie hole before this entire AM Stereo thing becomes the laughing stock of the industry. I've been on these list for a while and theres a few that wont be named,but if I didnt know better ..I'd think some of you were a few cables short of a working elevator. With this making Radio World..people will be coming here to "watch" the "circus". I've talked with Tom on several occassions...a very knowledgeable person and I doubt seriously any what was stated in Radio World would be "made up".AM stereo is great folks...but when you have something like IBOC coming....having a closed mind to it all will gain you nothing...no knowledge..no real sensible means of offering improvements.Radio is my job,my life,my life line and its my obligation in my profession to learn about it,regardless of whatever it might be...like it or not like it. Remember..you attack Tom or anyone else in the radio biz..you just as well be attacking me and the other engineers on this list as well. Advice:watch what you say on or off the list...the world wide waste land may be world wide...but this is a small world we live in. If the "insanity" continues..I'll exit left stage before I'm considered a liar,nut,or a rumor spreader. <<"So to get high fidelity on AM I will have to replace all my existing radios that have the AM band? All my old radios will all be obsolete and I will have to replace them with new high fidelity AM radios?>> Same can be said for FM. I really wonder how many people will be rushing out to buy a new radio within the next 7 years to listen to the lastest craze of digital radio.What I really wonder is..how happy will the general public be when or if the analog service is shut off and radio becomes 100% digital..making ALL current radios obsolete.It will be interesting to see how it all develops <> AMEN to that!..."spirited conversation" or not ...when it gets "silly" and out of hand and on the verge of people flaming others...thats where it needs to stop. Once again it falls back on knowing what your talking about before shooting your mouth off in a public media forum ....where hundreds are looking in. There may be over a hundred members here....but how many have this forum on Yahoo book marked and are reading these posts without becoming a memeber? For all we know the heads of the NAB or Saddam Hussein might be stopping in. We will never know. -:done venting:- Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From philipr@irac.pe.ca Mon Dec 02 19:00:06 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 3 Dec 2002 03:00:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 9029 invoked from network); 3 Dec 2002 03:00:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Dec 2002 03:00:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Dec 2002 03:00:05 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.168] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Dec 2002 03:00:03 -0000 Date: Tue, 03 Dec 2002 03:00:03 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Tom Ray: Negative Comments toward our group in Radio World Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2374 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.166.158.82 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking Apparently I am living in New Jersey. This comes as a great surprise to me. I know New Jersey is called the Garden State, and Prince Edward Island is the Garden of the Gulf [Gulf of St. Lawrence]. But, the Bridge that I drive over is 9 miles long, and ultimately takes me to the Metropolis of Moncton, and farther afield, the Megatropolis of Halifax [Canada's New York City]. Confused yet?! I hope so! ;) Since I now live in New Jersey, yet we have an Industry Canada office in Charlottetown, New Jersey it makes Industry Canada and the CRTC responsible for broadcasting in - you guessed it - New Jersey. Since IBOC is ILLEGAL in all parts of planet earth under the jurisdiction of Indusrty Canada and the CRTC, this could present a problem for WOR - perhaps a very tight directional pattern is in order in order to ensure that no IBOC signal reaches New Jersey! [Phil, get that tongue out of your cheek - NOW!] As well, Melborne is the second largest city in New Jersey - this will come as quite the shock to our Australian members. So I guess my muddy sounding 1994 Delco is not a typical radio! GOOD! WHEW! AM radio CAN be a high fidelity medium. OK, my local AM stations don't have as good top end as my local FM stations. But then again, my local FM stations don't have near the dynamic range of my local AM stations! So, what is HiFi - the highest highs, or the natural dynamics of music? Whether or not WOR is operating illegally is something I just can't really comment upon - as 720 CHTN provides a 10kw day, 7.5 kw night "shield" protecting "New Jersey Island North" from WOR. Actually, the fact that a big booster of IBOC has gone on the defensive is yet another indicator that the IBOC castle is starting to crumble before its been completed. Phil R. --- In amstereoforum@y..., "wgliradio" wrote: > In Radio World (12/2/02) > > About WOR and IBOC: > > "Negative comments also have come from a group of AM stereo fanatics > in New Jersey. These people live for the day AM stereo makes a > comeback. They are not listening on typical AM radios. They have > verbally and personally attacked both Kerry and me, as well as the > radio station and Ibiquity. This group thinks that AM radio is a > high fidelity medium. The also started a rumor that WOR was > operating illegally." > From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Dec 02 19:05:16 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 3 Dec 2002 03:05:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 89039 invoked from network); 3 Dec 2002 03:05:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Dec 2002 03:05:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.84) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Dec 2002 03:05:15 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.155] by n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Dec 2002 03:05:15 -0000 Date: Tue, 03 Dec 2002 03:05:13 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: DXers beware: WOR now testing nighttime IBOC Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1328 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.79.160 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics As I speak, 710 WOR in New York City is testing the IBOC digital system at night. For at least the past half-hour or so that I have listened, they have been transmitting it in alternate one-minute intervals; i.e. WOR broadcasts one minute of plain analog AM, then one minute of IBOC digital, then one minute of analog AM, etc. As I a local listener, when the IBOC is on, obviously it completely wipes out reception on 700 and 720 kHz, and the normally crystal- clear French Canadian stations on 690 and 730 are seriously splattered upon with a loud and annoying squealing hiss. Even reception of the normally very strong 740 CHWO is impaired with a background hiss and a grungdy, scratchy splatter noise which WOR's engineer claims is generated in my receiver, but I think it is actual splatter coming from their transmitter -- even outside the IBOC signal's bandwidth, as I have heard it on 680 kHz as well. (During the daytime it severely affects reception of 740 WGSM from Long Island.) Can anybody report if 700 WLW is doing the same? It would be very interesting if both WLW and WOR broadcast IBOC at night at the same time. Obviously it would cause mutual destruction of their signals over a wide area in the central-eastern USA where their skywave signals are both heard about equally strongly. From amfmdx@fastq.com Mon Dec 02 19:19:44 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 3 Dec 2002 03:19:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 91711 invoked from network); 3 Dec 2002 03:19:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Dec 2002 03:19:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Dec 2002 03:19:43 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt (d187-osel-phx.fastq.com [209.63.214.174]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gB33Jfv88239 for ; Mon, 2 Dec 2002 20:19:42 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <018c01c29a7a$cb60c6c0$bff9bed8@kredding430cdt> To: References: <33CDDBD8CAEFEB4191ABF6F799032AF238D6BA@aubwm206> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Super Radio Clone finally available in Australia! (Radio Shack 12-903) Date: Mon, 2 Dec 2002 20:19:29 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla Yes, this is the Radio Shack 12-903 and its really not anywhere near as good as the GE SRIII. If you have no other choice, this is as close as you will get. The upper end of the band is mushy. Kevin ----- Original Message ----- From: "Trim, Matthew L" To: Sent: Monday, December 02, 2002 3:36 PM Subject: {AMSF} Super Radio Clone finally available in Australia! (Radio Shack 12-903) > http://www.lenoxx.com.au/product.asp?SKU=R300&branch=34&page=1 > > Lenoxx R300 Super Radio > Super radio From philipr@irac.pe.ca Mon Dec 02 19:21:25 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 3 Dec 2002 03:21:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 11372 invoked from network); 3 Dec 2002 03:21:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Dec 2002 03:21:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.83) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Dec 2002 03:21:25 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.159] by n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Dec 2002 03:21:24 -0000 Date: Tue, 03 Dec 2002 03:21:24 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Tom Ray: Negative Comments toward our group in Radio World Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1367 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.166.158.82 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking Further comment - let's not attack each other, or our opponents. We can make our point based on persuasive arguments, logic, humour or whatever - but please abandon the personal attacks, or what is perceived as personal attacks. We don't need them. We don't have to make any apologies for the technology we support - its proven and it works well. We don't need to resort to "low blows". After all, today's IBOC supporter could be tommorrow's AM Stereo supporter. And, even if not, they are a human being, entitled to be treated with dignity and respect - and, entitled to their own opinions. Take the high road folks! We know that AM Stereo works well, we know that IBOC, at least for now, is a very troubled method of broadcasting. There is no need to be perceived as trashing each other, or those who hold differing opinions. Either IBOC is going to have to improve a lot, or its going the way of the L-Cassette. I'd say the 8-track, except 8-tracks were popular for many years. If IBOC does not improve, those interested in maximizing AM's potential will turn towards AM Stereo augmented by digital processing [on the receiver end] technology. May the best technology win. For short range broadcasting, my bets are on Eureka 147 L-band DAB. For long range broadcasting, I'm betting on the dark horse named "AM Stereo". Phil R. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Dec 02 19:22:09 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 3 Dec 2002 03:22:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 70646 invoked from network); 3 Dec 2002 03:22:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Dec 2002 03:22:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.69) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Dec 2002 03:22:09 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.178] by n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Dec 2002 03:22:09 -0000 Date: Tue, 03 Dec 2002 03:22:08 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Tom Ray: Negative Comments toward our group in Radio World Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2400 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.79.160 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics Tom Ray wrote: > They have verbally and personally attacked both Kerry and me, as > well as the radio station and Ibiquity. If I made any "attacks" against Mr. Ray and Mr. Richards, it was only in self defense. For example, I wrote an extremely polite and cordial e-mail to Mr. Richards about AMAX and how it compares to IBOC, and he wrote back with some of the most insulting language I have ever seen from a so-called "professional". He not only made it clear that he thinks AM Stereo, and any form of analog AM for that matter, is dead, but he made sure to personally attack me and other AM Stereo supporters in the process, calling us "crackpots". > This group thinks that AM radio is a high fidelity medium. Mr. Ray is quite hypocritical in this regard. He has stated repeatedly that the 10 kHz NRSC analog audio limit completely "killed" AM's fidelity -- he even mentions this in WOR's official web site announcement of when they started IBOC transmissions -- but then he turns around and says that WOR's 5 kHz analog audio (with the IBOC system) sounds fine to him, and that even on a wide-bandwidth Ford AM Stereo receiver, he can't tell any difference between it and the audio of other full-bandwidth analog AM stations. > The also started a rumor that WOR was operating illegally." It is a FACT that the IBOC signal does NOT meet the NRSC Analog Audio Bandwidth standard. However, the loophole is that this is not required in the USA; it is only a requirement in Canada. The FCC only made the NRSC *RF* Bandwidth limit mandatory, which allows the IBOC signal to "sneak underneath" it, at a level which is still strong enough to cause destructive harm to reception of adjacent channels. > 3) I believe that WOR is within the NRSC mask. That doesn't explain why they are causing a grundgy, scratchy splatter on 680, 740, and 750 kHz -- strong enoung to seriously impair daytime reception of 740 WGSM. The IBOC signal is not *supposed* be affecting these frequencies, as the digital sidebands are only supposed to extend from 695 to 725 kHz; however, something about the IBOC signal transmission is causing "splatter" far outside this range. I mentioned this to Mr. Ray, but he brushed it off as a fault of my own receiver -- which would be mighty coincidental, as I hear it on *all* of my radios, and *only* when WOR is transmitting an IBOC signal. From amfmdx@fastq.com Mon Dec 02 19:42:57 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 3 Dec 2002 03:42:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 70207 invoked from network); 3 Dec 2002 03:42:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Dec 2002 03:42:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Dec 2002 03:42:56 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt (d187-osel-phx.fastq.com [209.63.214.174]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gB33gtv88640 for ; Mon, 2 Dec 2002 20:42:55 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <01d501c29a7e$097c67e0$bff9bed8@kredding430cdt> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Tom Ray: Negative Comments toward our group in Radio World Date: Mon, 2 Dec 2002 20:42:41 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > I mentioned this to Mr. Ray, but he brushed it off as a > fault of my own receiver -- which would be mighty coincidental, as I > hear it on *all* of my radios, and *only* when WOR is transmitting an > IBOC signal. This is because you have a nice sounding wideband radios. Narrowband radios can reject the noise. Its sad that if you have a nice sounding radio, you will hear the splatter exceptionally bad. Tom Ray is right, its because of YOUR radios. Kevin Mesa, Arizona From bjackson@indyradio.com Mon Dec 02 19:58:40 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 3 Dec 2002 03:58:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 74522 invoked from network); 3 Dec 2002 03:58:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Dec 2002 03:58:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Dec 2002 03:58:40 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.178] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Dec 2002 03:58:39 -0000 Date: Tue, 03 Dec 2002 03:58:37 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Audio File Uploaded Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1446 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923" X-Originating-IP: 64.25.100.34 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 As promised, over the weekend I made a scoped aircheck of WZZB's light AC format. I made it while at my sisters house for Thanksgiving (about 15-20 miles from the tower as the crow flies)...However, since she has almost all touch lamps, there is a slight buzzing from those (I hate those stupid lights)...especially in the last part of the MP3 (after night power). Now, I do have a question for the more technical people on the list. At home on my Carver tx-11a (when I can pick it up) and in both of my vehicles (Delco UX-1 and an Infinity Gold in my Jeep), the music is almost crystal clear. However, I didn't want to take my Carver out of the rack, so I took down my old MCS 3050 tuner. On both the MCS and on my Sony SRF-42, WZZB has a distortion of some sort...mainly when the audio gets both loud and has a lot of seperation. I don't notice it on WGN or WLS or KCJJ (on the sony). So my question...Is the distortion becuase of the older Motorola chips, or is it a problem in the stations exciter? It's an hour and a half scoped down to just over 10 minutes. I didn't notice until I played the tape back that about 3/4 of the way in, I must have hit the DBX button on my tape deck. The deck hooked up to my PC only has Dolby, so for a few seconds the audio gets a little tinny. http://iw1.indyweb.net/~bjackson/ is the link. http://iw1.indyweb.net/~bjackson/ -Brad Jackson -Susquehanna, Indianapolis -WGLD/WGRL/WFMS From jsgil@hal-pc.org Mon Dec 02 20:03:24 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 3 Dec 2002 04:03:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 93144 invoked from network); 3 Dec 2002 04:03:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Dec 2002 04:03:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.66) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Dec 2002 04:03:23 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.179] by n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Dec 2002 04:03:10 -0000 Date: Tue, 03 Dec 2002 04:03:03 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Tom Ray: Negative Comments toward our group in Radio World Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 4861 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.130.116 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@y..., "wgliradio" wrote: > In Radio World (12/2/02) >=20 > About WOR and IBOC: >=20 > "Negative comments also have come from a group of AM stereo fanatics=20 > in New Jersey. These people live for the day AM stereo makes a=20 > comeback. They are not listening on typical AM radios. They have=20 > verbally and personally attacked both Kerry and me, as well as the=20 > radio station and Ibiquity. This group thinks that AM radio is a=20 > high fidelity medium. The also started a rumor that WOR was=20 > operating illegally." >=20 > 1) Tom needs to chill out a bit. He can rest assured that big=20 > brother will make sure IBOC is forced onto us while we have no say...=20 > even though it is possibly the worst thing ever invented for=20 > broadcasting. Our views on IBOC are well founded and, hate to tell=20 > you, AM stereo and AMAX IMPROVES AM radio. Any engineer that says=20 > otherwise is foolish and misguided.=20=20 >=20 > 2) Do not blame the medium for poorly designed radios. IBOC does NOT=20 > IMPROVE AM and AM IBOC couldn't be further away from high fidelity.=20=20 > Instead of IBOC, AM receiver design should be improved over what the=20 > average person can purchase right now. >=20 > 3) I believe that WOR is within the NRSC mask. However, the digital=20 > artifacts created from IBOC have an average to peak ratio of=20 > virtually 1:1. Off channel noise is SO MUCH WORSE with IBOC than=20 > with analog information. Cram IBOC onto stations with adjacents on=20 > either side... I don't think anyone here has to be told what THAT=20 > will sound like. >=20 > DIGITAL FOR THE SAKE OF DIGITAL IS HERE. LOVE IT, NO MATTER HOW BAD=20 > IT SOUNDS! We need to provide a good technical foundation for our position on IBOC. Spouting off complaints without substance against IBOC doesn't improve our public image. The IBOC sidebands may be 20db below the carrier but the digital hash is a continious wave of white noise. IBOC sibebands extend out to =B115KHz and their energy level is continuous. According to the IBOC technical info it is necessary to extend the transmitted bandwidth to =B115KHz when operating in hybrid mode. The bandwidth can only be reduced when IBOC goes to full digital. This will not happen until there is enough market penetration of digital radios and old analog models have been replaced through attrition. A station is not going to risk loosing advertising dollars by reducing their audience signinigantly because of lack of receivers. A measurement or calculation needs to be taken of what the IBOC sideband energy is over a period of a minute and compare that to an analog signal with full 15KHz audio. The continuous white noise definitely has more energy than what is contained in a typical analog signal with 15KHz audio weighted over a period of a minute. How many analog stations with 15KHz audio does it take to to equal the background noise generated by one IBOC station? A bunch! I may be 10, 20, 30, etc... but the whole point of reducing the bandwidth to 10.2KHz and fixing the pre-emphasis level was to reduce the interference problems in crowded markets like the NE. Could you imagine the interference being 10, 20, 30, etc... times as bad as it was before the frequency and eq restrictions if every station in the NE converted to IBOC? If nighttime IBOC was allowed this would be a real nightmare. I don't see why a 50KW class A non-directional station needs to use digital. At 75mi away the signal is still very strong and using a SupeRadio III in wideband mode with the treble turned up makes music sound pretty good and voice excellent even at night. It may not be exactly FM quality but for the news and talk format it is more than adequate. Adding C-QuAM to a music station will provide the enhancement needed to make it a successful station that can compete against FM. It is a lot cheaper to manufacture a wideband C-QuAM radio than it is a digital radio. Just look at the prices of SatDAB units and these aren't even portable because of power requirements. For a wideband mono AM radio the GE SupeRadio III is a great deal at $50. It will be awhile before digital radios can meet the power requirements and price of the current analog radios. It is not just technical obstacles that IBOC has to overcome but economic, migration time to full digital, and the public's desire to adopt digital radios. For the public to adopt digital the radios need to be priced in a range similar to analog models and the IBOC signal can't cause degradation to analog signals. If signal degradation occurs to analog radios this can be a big turn off to=20 the public if their analog radios are made useless creating a forced upgrade where everyone will have to replace all their radios. This leaves a very steep hill for IBOC to climb to gain the public's adoption, much more so that AM Stereo ever had. JSG From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Dec 02 20:10:48 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 3 Dec 2002 04:10:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 6268 invoked from network); 3 Dec 2002 04:10:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Dec 2002 04:10:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.83) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Dec 2002 04:10:47 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.172] by n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Dec 2002 04:10:47 -0000 Date: Tue, 03 Dec 2002 04:10:44 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Tom Ray: Negative Comments toward our group in Radio World Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <01d501c29a7e$097c67e0$bff9bed8@kredding430cdt> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1674 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.79.160 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > This is because you have a nice sounding wideband radios. > Narrowband radios can reject the noise. ONLY if it's digital-tuning, or if you have it tuned EXACTLY to the "center" of the signal... which nobody seems to be able to do on a regular tuning dial anymore. The other day I caught my own father listening to WOR (his most familiar station, as he's listened to it since childhood) -- thankfully at night, with IBOC off -- on an analog-tuning GE boom-box that was mis-tuned enough to give the typical raspy, distorted "lisp" of an off-tuned radio, as well as a piercingly strong 10 kHz carrier whistle (which the GE only filters out when you have it tuned to the center of a station). I asked him, "Don't you know how to tune a radio!?" and he said it sounded okay to him. If he was listening during the daytime, with WOR's IBOC on, it wouldn't "sound okay" -- the same off-tuning would have rendered the signal unlistenable with the loud hissing noise -- thus also ending a decades-long practice of *purposely* mis-tuning analog radios to gain some high frequency response, at the expense of increased distortion. Another factor is that no matter how narrow the bandwidth, IBOC makes the "Seek" function on a digital radio completely useless!! It will ALWAYS stop 10 or 20 kHz away from the desired frequency, as it "sees" the digital sidebands and doesn't know them to be any different than a correct AM signal. Even the "smart" Seek function of MC13022-based AMAX car radios (which can "detect" if a frequency is crowded with a mess of co-channel signals at night and skip over it if no listenable signal is present) is fooled by IBOC. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Dec 02 20:19:24 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 3 Dec 2002 04:19:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 48080 invoked from network); 3 Dec 2002 04:19:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Dec 2002 04:19:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Dec 2002 04:19:24 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.166] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Dec 2002 04:19:21 -0000 Date: Tue, 03 Dec 2002 04:19:19 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Audio File Uploaded Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1496 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.79.160 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > However, I didn't want to take my Carver out of the rack, so I took > down my old MCS 3050 tuner. On both the MCS and on my Sony SRF-42, > WZZB has a distortion of some sort...mainly when the audio gets > both loud and has a lot of seperation. The older Motorola and Sony AM Stereo decoders aren't as fine-tuned at dealing with high modulation levels and wide-separation Stereo as the newer Motorola decoders, so you will hear some distortion, especially in the bass when it is "off to one side" in the Stereo image. The Sony will be the worst, as their AM Stereo decoder actually doesn't properly decode the C-Quam signal; it was originally designed for the now-defunct *Magnavox* AM Stereo system, which doesn't have C-Quam's "Cosine Correction" feature (which is able to "cancel out" the distortion you hear). > I don't notice it on WGN or WLS or KCJJ (on the sony). It's a factor of the type of audio processing the station uses, how much modulation they are running, and what type of transmitter and C-Quam generator they use. Some AM Stereo stations do seem to have inherently "cleaner" signals than others, but the newer Motorola decoders are almost amazing in their ability to "clean up" any distortion in the received audio. There are AM Stereo stations like 1680 WTTM that run the maximum modulation level possible (just under +125%), which sound a bit distorted on older AM Stereo radio, but sound *perfectly* crisp, clear, and clean on the newer AMAX radios. From penry@nortelnetworks.com Mon Dec 02 20:21:36 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: penry@nortelnetworks.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 3 Dec 2002 04:21:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 11701 invoked from network); 3 Dec 2002 04:21:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Dec 2002 04:21:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Dec 2002 04:21:35 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.145] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Dec 2002 04:21:35 -0000 Date: Tue, 03 Dec 2002 04:21:34 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: DXers beware: WOR now testing nighttime IBOC Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 610 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wa5vhu" X-Originating-IP: 12.237.30.38 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=376233 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa5vhu Kevin T, Can you please tell us what model receiver you are hearing this interference on? Thanks --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin T." wrote: > As I speak, 710 WOR in New York City is testing the IBOC digital > system at night. ..... Even > reception of the normally very strong 740 CHWO is impaired with a > background hiss and a grungdy, scratchy splatter noise which WOR's > engineer claims is generated in my receiver, but I think it is actual > splatter coming from their transmitter -- even outside the IBOC > signal's bandwidth, as I have heard it on 680 kHz as well. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Dec 02 20:29:09 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 3 Dec 2002 04:29:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 35696 invoked from network); 3 Dec 2002 04:29:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Dec 2002 04:29:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Dec 2002 04:29:09 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.181] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Dec 2002 04:29:09 -0000 Date: Tue, 03 Dec 2002 04:29:07 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: DXers beware: WOR now testing nighttime IBOC Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 582 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.79.160 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Kevin T, > Can you please tell us what model receiver you are hearing this > interference on? > > Thanks Any AM radio ever made will hear it. The IBOC digital sidebands are strong enough that even the worst, most cheaply-made AM radio in my house will hear them. But for the record, I first heard WOR testing IBOC at night on a standard late 1990s Volkswagen car radio (made in Mexico by an unknown OEM manufacturer), which has about a 7 to 8 kHz audio bandwidth on AM -- pretty good, but by no means the best -- and that is what my initial observations were based on. From groucho@skyweb.net Mon Dec 02 20:32:43 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 3 Dec 2002 04:32:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 32953 invoked from network); 3 Dec 2002 04:32:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Dec 2002 04:32:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Dec 2002 04:32:42 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gB34bSxi099503 for ; Mon, 2 Dec 2002 23:37:28 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DEC33A6.E049C8C9@skyweb.net> Date: Mon, 02 Dec 2002 23:31:34 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Tom Ray: Negative Comments toward our group in Radio World References: <1a8.ceb56eb.2b1d74d4@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 My Turn to vent Here I kept Most of my received E-mail since the topic of IBOC has started.. and I have yet to see anything From anyone that said WOR was running illegally. Unless it was posted in Private.... The only thing I see was from Me stating that Ibiquity is Running more power than they are supposed to Under its experimental License and reason for knowing this is because I know the guy that is actually incharge of the Ibiquity Test station. and From Our discussions he told me How the test station is set-up, and I only quoted what he personally Told Me. also.. None of you guys that I know of are getting hammered by an IBOC station In your .5mv contour But My station Is... I'm loosing about 3 radial miles Of Coverage in my .5mv only when this Test station is On the air... personal point. I should not loose any Coverage with the power they are using 2 adjacent away PERIOD.. as far as WOR I don't Know Tom Ray. or Kerry? but this coming from another local Engineer(ME) He should Do some driving around and see the CRAP his station is doing to the smaller locals in the NY,NJ,CT,PA area... Plus and Minus 2 adjacent's away even though He may well be well within his legal Limits.when the digital is on Its just not right... I just happened to tune into WOR today forgot what time But it was in the middle of the day. and there was No IBOC to be Heard.. I am Sure that If there was another station Doing to him what He's doing to them. He would be a bit upset also. and Let Me Say this I am Not just another "AM stereo fanatic in New Jersey". I am the Engineer for a real good sounding AM Stereo Station in New Jersey and Proud of it. Here is what Tom does not have to say about his station,and IBOC. 1) He does not have to deal with TIS/HAR Stations being set-up on his frequency within His Contours causing dead zones and Coverage loss 2)He does not have to deal with a Co-channel station that's Over 1500 Miles away that blasts him out of his own Control room. 3) He does not have to deal with an experimental station on his Frequency so far I have not had any problems with this one..its only on during the day.. 4) He Does not have to deal with an experimental IBOC Station that Controls a 3 radial Mile area in his .5mv Contour From 2 adjacents away... 5) He does not have to care whether or not his station is clobbering anyone plus or minus 2 adjacents away Because technically he is within his legal Limits... which I think is the wrong attitude... He should care.. But From His comments I can see otherwise. Am I attacking him or His Station.. He may think so...I don't think so.. just making General FACTS.. He is Just like the rest of us getting paid for doing His Job. taking orders from the upper management However I would just like 10% of what he is making and I would Be very happy... take it or leave it.. I'm done Blowing Steam For now.. Neal Newman Chief Engineer WTTM 1680 am stereo Princeton,New Jersey KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 12/2/02 5:52:36 PM Eastern Standard Time, > evergreenterrace@buzzle.com writes: > > << "Negative comments also have come from a group of AM stereo fanatics > in New Jersey. These people live for the day AM stereo makes a > comeback. They are not listening on typical AM radios. They have > verbally and personally attacked both Kerry and me, as well as the > radio station and Ibiquity. This group thinks that AM radio is a > high fidelity medium. The also started a rumor that WOR was > operating illegally." >> > > Its quite obvious that we have someone or someones on this list that really > do not know what they are talking about.....and spreading rumors about > stations operating illegally and attacking those in the business. Now ladies > and gentlemen..it has reached the press...the press for the radio medium at > that!..how long will it be before this reaches CNN,FOX or any of those other > world wide general news companies?Does someone have to get sued first before > they stop with the diarrhea of the mouth?!?Slamming people,companies and > saying things that arent true is serious stuff folks! > Its my opinion that those that do not have a clue as to whats going on in > radio or even has any experince in engineering and FCC matters needs to shut > their pie hole before this entire AM Stereo thing becomes the laughing stock > of the industry. > I've been on these list for a while and theres a few that wont be named,but > if I didnt know better ..I'd think some of you were a few cables short of a > working elevator. > With this making Radio World..people will be coming here to "watch" the > "circus". > I've talked with Tom on several occassions...a very knowledgeable person and > I doubt seriously any what was stated in Radio World would be "made up".AM > stereo is great folks...but when you have something like IBOC > coming....having a closed mind to it all will gain you nothing...no > knowledge..no real sensible means of offering improvements.Radio is my job,my > life,my life line and its my obligation in my profession to learn about > it,regardless of whatever it might be...like it or not like it. Remember..you > attack Tom or anyone else in the radio biz..you just as well be attacking me > and the other engineers on this list as well. > Advice:watch what you say on or off the list...the world wide waste land may > be world wide...but this is a small world we live in. > If the "insanity" continues..I'll exit left stage before I'm considered a > liar,nut,or a rumor spreader. > > <<"So to get high fidelity on AM I will have to replace all my existing radios > that have the AM band? All my old radios will all be obsolete and I will > have to replace them with new high fidelity AM radios?>> > > Same can be said for FM. I really wonder how many people will be rushing out > to buy a new radio within the next 7 years to listen to the lastest craze of > digital radio.What I really wonder is..how happy will the general public be > when or if the analog service is shut off and radio becomes 100% > digital..making ALL current radios obsolete.It will be interesting to see how > it all develops > > < Analog AM Hi-Fidelity Stereo or Analog AM Hi-Fidelity Mono. Start your own > "I Hate (insert radio model here)" Yahoo group if you are all that excited > about discussing your frustrations with the world. >> > > AMEN to that!..."spirited conversation" or not ...when it gets "silly" and > out of hand and on the verge of people flaming others...thats where it needs > to stop. Once again it falls back on knowing what your talking about before > shooting your mouth off in a public media forum ....where hundreds are > looking in. There may be over a hundred members here....but how many have > this forum on Yahoo book marked and are reading these posts without becoming > a memeber? For all we know the heads of the NAB or Saddam Hussein might be > stopping in. We will never know. > > -:done venting:- > > Bob Carter > Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group > > WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 > Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 > > Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering > services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. > e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net > http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice > Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC > WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC > WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC > Ray Communications Radio Network > > AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- > amstereo-subcribe@topica.com > > KC4QLP Amateur Radio > Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va > www.kc4qlp.cjb.net > > voice contact-252-335-0856 > fax 1-209-254-8978 > _______________________________________________________ > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From penry@nortelnetworks.com Mon Dec 02 20:38:28 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: penry@nortelnetworks.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 3 Dec 2002 04:38:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 71328 invoked from network); 3 Dec 2002 04:38:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Dec 2002 04:38:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.90) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Dec 2002 04:38:25 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.134] by n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Dec 2002 04:38:24 -0000 Date: Tue, 03 Dec 2002 04:38:19 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: DXers beware: WOR now testing nighttime IBOC Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 892 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wa5vhu" X-Originating-IP: 12.237.30.38 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=376233 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa5vhu Kevin T, I say again, can you please tell us what model receiver you are hearing THIS interference on? I can't tell from your response if the Volkswagen car radio is what you are using tonight. Thanks some more --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin T." wrote: > > Kevin T, > > Can you please tell us what model receiver you are hearing this > > interference on? > > > > Thanks > > Any AM radio ever made will hear it. The IBOC digital sidebands are > strong enough that even the worst, most cheaply-made AM radio in my > house will hear them. > > But for the record, I first heard WOR testing IBOC at night on a > standard late 1990s Volkswagen car radio (made in Mexico by an > unknown OEM manufacturer), which has about a 7 to 8 kHz audio > bandwidth on AM -- pretty good, but by no means the best -- and > that is what my initial observations were based on. From groucho@skyweb.net Mon Dec 02 20:44:26 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 3 Dec 2002 04:44:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 93248 invoked from network); 3 Dec 2002 04:44:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Dec 2002 04:44:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Dec 2002 04:44:25 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gB34nBxi003322 for ; Mon, 2 Dec 2002 23:49:12 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DEC3664.297FE22A@skyweb.net> Date: Mon, 02 Dec 2002 23:43:16 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} DXers beware: WOR now testing nighttime IBOC References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 well when I tuned in WOR today I didn't hear the IBOC Signal.. I just wonder if when you heard it Going On and Off.. they were at the site doing some work on the exciter ohh I'm sorry the Linux box. with the Commercial software On it.. I thought all software for LINUX was FREE.. UNIX now that's a different story again Unless that's FREEBSD Its Free.. "Kevin T." wrote: > As I speak, 710 WOR in New York City is testing the IBOC digital > system at night. For at least the past half-hour or so that I have > listened, they have been transmitting it in alternate one-minute > intervals; i.e. WOR broadcasts one minute of plain analog AM, then > one minute of IBOC digital, then one minute of analog AM, etc. > > As I a local listener, when the IBOC is on, obviously it completely > wipes out reception on 700 and 720 kHz, and the normally crystal- > clear French Canadian stations on 690 and 730 are seriously > splattered upon with a loud and annoying squealing hiss. Even > reception of the normally very strong 740 CHWO is impaired with a > background hiss and a grungdy, scratchy splatter noise which WOR's > engineer claims is generated in my receiver, but I think it is actual > splatter coming from their transmitter -- even outside the IBOC > signal's bandwidth, as I have heard it on 680 kHz as well. (During > the daytime it severely affects reception of 740 WGSM from Long > Island.) > > Can anybody report if 700 WLW is doing the same? It would be very > interesting if both WLW and WOR broadcast IBOC at night at the same > time. Obviously it would cause mutual destruction of their signals > over a wide area in the central-eastern USA where their skywave > signals are both heard about equally strongly. > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From jsgil@hal-pc.org Mon Dec 02 20:49:28 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 3 Dec 2002 04:49:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 84194 invoked from network); 3 Dec 2002 04:49:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Dec 2002 04:49:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.64) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Dec 2002 04:49:27 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.164] by n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Dec 2002 04:49:27 -0000 Date: Tue, 03 Dec 2002 04:49:26 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Audio File Uploaded Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 1713 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.130.116 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@y..., "bradleyj923" wrote: > Now, I do have a question for the more technical people on the list.=20 > At home on my Carver tx-11a (when I can pick it up) and in both of my=20 > vehicles (Delco UX-1 and an Infinity Gold in my Jeep), the music is=20 > almost crystal clear. However, I didn't want to take my Carver out of=20 > the rack, so I took down my old MCS 3050 tuner. On both the MCS and=20 > on my Sony SRF-42, WZZB has a distortion of some sort...mainly when=20 > the audio gets both loud and has a lot of seperation. I don't notice=20 > it on WGN or WLS or KCJJ (on the sony). So my question...Is the=20 > distortion becuase of the older Motorola chips, or is it a problem in=20 > the stations exciter? >=20 The MC13020 chip can act up pretty bad under heavy one sided=20 modulation and when interference levels are moderate. The general result is high frequency crackle when the gain of the cosine=20 correction amp is very high. Large single channel signals can cause large phase deviations on downward modulation and add in interference the phase can approach 90=B0. Well 1/Cos90=B0 is infinity so the amp goes to max gain and stays there as in square wave clipping and so this is modulated into L-R. If the I detector goes negative then the=20 negative feedback cosine correction circuit turns to positive=20 feedback and latches up. A simple solution to this is to turn off cosine correction with a 100=B5f cap on pin 5 to ground. Doing this will detect L-R as QuAM and a synchronously detected L+R is available on the I detector if you so wish to add circuitry to process this. A simple switch and capacitor can be added to the receiver to turn cosine correction on and off. JSG From groucho@skyweb.net Mon Dec 02 21:16:17 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 3 Dec 2002 05:16:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 15044 invoked from network); 3 Dec 2002 05:16:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Dec 2002 05:16:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Dec 2002 05:16:16 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gB35L4xi013161 for ; Tue, 3 Dec 2002 00:21:04 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DEC3DDA.C02E97A1@skyweb.net> Date: Tue, 03 Dec 2002 00:15:06 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: DXers beware: WOR now testing nighttime IBOC References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 I can.... I can hear it On My Carver TX-11b(Wideband) On My wife's stock car radio which is a caviller... I can here it on my Non converted 2002 boomball...My sisters Stock radio in her Toyota corolla.. and in My van with a stock Ford radio.... My cheap Clock radio next to the Bed.. and several others... you want models I can get the #'s if you want.. But that's silly.. basically It does Not matter what radio If your in the Metro area You can Hear it on any AM receiver.. Trust Me Its not the Receivers.. Neal wa5vhu wrote: > Kevin T, > Can you please tell us what model receiver you are hearing this > interference on? > > Thanks > > --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin T." wrote: > > As I speak, 710 WOR in New York City is testing the IBOC digital > > system at night. ..... Even > > reception of the normally very strong 740 CHWO is impaired with a > > background hiss and a grungdy, scratchy splatter noise which WOR's > > engineer claims is generated in my receiver, but I think it is > actual > > splatter coming from their transmitter -- even outside the IBOC > > signal's bandwidth, as I have heard it on 680 kHz as well. > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From penry@nortelnetworks.com Mon Dec 02 21:28:20 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: penry@nortelnetworks.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 3 Dec 2002 05:28:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 92510 invoked from network); 3 Dec 2002 05:28:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Dec 2002 05:28:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Dec 2002 05:28:19 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.152] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Dec 2002 05:28:17 -0000 Date: Tue, 03 Dec 2002 05:28:17 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: DXers beware: WOR now testing nighttime IBOC Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3DEC3DDA.C02E97A1@skyweb.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1487 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wa5vhu" X-Originating-IP: 12.237.30.38 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=376233 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa5vhu See message 5771. --- In amstereoforum@y..., Neal Newman wrote: > I can.... I can hear it On My Carver TX-11b(Wideband) On My wife's stock car > radio which is a caviller... I can here it on my Non converted 2002 > boomball...My sisters Stock > radio in her Toyota corolla.. and in My van with a stock Ford radio.... My > cheap Clock radio next to the Bed.. and several others... you want models I > can get the #'s if you want.. But that's silly.. basically It does Not > matter what radio If your in the Metro area > You can Hear it on any AM receiver.. Trust Me Its not the Receivers.. > Neal > > wa5vhu wrote: > > > Kevin T, > > Can you please tell us what model receiver you are hearing this > > interference on? > > > > Thanks > > > > --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin T." wrote: > > > As I speak, 710 WOR in New York City is testing the IBOC digital > > > system at night. ..... Even > > > reception of the normally very strong 740 CHWO is impaired with a > > > background hiss and a grungdy, scratchy splatter noise which WOR's > > > engineer claims is generated in my receiver, but I think it is > > actual > > > splatter coming from their transmitter -- even outside the IBOC > > > signal's bandwidth, as I have heard it on 680 kHz as well. > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From penry@nortelnetworks.com Mon Dec 02 21:29:36 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: penry@nortelnetworks.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 3 Dec 2002 05:29:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 93879 invoked from network); 3 Dec 2002 05:29:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Dec 2002 05:29:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.83) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Dec 2002 05:29:35 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.137] by n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Dec 2002 05:29:35 -0000 Date: Tue, 03 Dec 2002 05:29:34 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: DXers beware: WOR now testing nighttime IBOC Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1662 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wa5vhu" X-Originating-IP: 12.237.30.38 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=376233 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa5vhu Sorry, message 5770. --- In amstereoforum@y..., "wa5vhu" wrote: > See message 5771. > > > > --- In amstereoforum@y..., Neal Newman wrote: > > I can.... I can hear it On My Carver TX-11b(Wideband) On My wife's > stock car > > radio which is a caviller... I can here it on my Non converted 2002 > > boomball...My sisters Stock > > radio in her Toyota corolla.. and in My van with a stock Ford > radio.... My > > cheap Clock radio next to the Bed.. and several others... you want > models I > > can get the #'s if you want.. But that's silly.. basically It does > Not > > matter what radio If your in the Metro area > > You can Hear it on any AM receiver.. Trust Me Its not the > Receivers.. > > Neal > > > > wa5vhu wrote: > > > > > Kevin T, > > > Can you please tell us what model receiver you are hearing this > > > interference on? > > > > > > Thanks > > > > > > --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin T." wrote: > > > > As I speak, 710 WOR in New York City is testing the IBOC digital > > > > system at night. ..... Even > > > > reception of the normally very strong 740 CHWO is impaired with > a > > > > background hiss and a grungdy, scratchy splatter noise which > WOR's > > > > engineer claims is generated in my receiver, but I think it is > > > actual > > > > splatter coming from their transmitter -- even outside the IBOC > > > > signal's bandwidth, as I have heard it on 680 kHz as well. > > > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Dec 02 21:33:58 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 3 Dec 2002 05:33:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 1607 invoked from network); 3 Dec 2002 05:33:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Dec 2002 05:33:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Dec 2002 05:33:57 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.187] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Dec 2002 05:33:57 -0000 Date: Tue, 03 Dec 2002 05:33:54 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Audio File Uploaded Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1227 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.79.160 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > As promised, over the weekend I made a scoped aircheck of WZZB's > light AC format. I had a chance to download it... wow, that's a big file... about 9.8 megs. Just one tip: if it sounds totally "underwater" when you play it, or refuses to play at all, that's because of some obscure compatibility problem between the file server and your computer... it shouldn't happen when web sites are properly set up to let you download MP3 files, but when they aren't, the fix is easy... just download an MP3 "Detox" or "Uncook" utility, such as from the following site: http://home.onestop.net/nvort/utilities.html Any of the programs on this site will quickly and easily fix the MP3 file so that you can play it completely glitch-free. Anyway, despite the slight crackly kind of distortion in the recording, the sound quality from 1390 WZZB is excellent... very wide Stereo separation and good audio processing, which make for superb audio that would really come to life on a modern AMAX receiver. And it's great to hear those modern songs on AM radio -- I reminds me of when 1040 WJHR in Flemington, NJ had a Top 40 format in 1998-1999 and even called themselves "AM STEREO 1040" in every single ID and liner! From penry@nortelnetworks.com Mon Dec 02 21:44:05 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: penry@nortelnetworks.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 3 Dec 2002 05:44:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 45268 invoked from network); 3 Dec 2002 05:44:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Dec 2002 05:44:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Dec 2002 05:44:04 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.167] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Dec 2002 05:44:04 -0000 Date: Tue, 03 Dec 2002 05:44:03 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Negative Comments - Message For wgliradio Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2149 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wa5vhu" X-Originating-IP: 12.237.30.38 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=376233 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa5vhu wgliradio, Perhaps your comment was not directed at any one particular engineer however you had just mentioned two engineers by name. The real world sees through your cleverness. And though my comments were directed to everyone on the AMSF list and not to just you, it seems that you felt the need to provide selective responses to some of my comments. In the future read and understand all of what I say and if you feel compelled to respond, don't be selective by quoting me out of context, twisting around what I write so it fits your agenda. Print everything I say and answer each item intelligently. Agree with me when you do and offer proper responses when you don't. People see what I write and then see what you do to what I have written and see your answers and they come to their own conclusions about the operation of your elevator. As an example, take you elevator to my comment "The general public does not currently have access to high fidelity AM radios, so AM is therefore not considered a high fidelity medium to the general public." And you said (your YELLING) "But it CAN be and HAS been. That is where your argument goes out the window. High-Fidelity AM is not something new. It's only within the last 10-15 years that AM radio design has fallen over the side." Well, how does my argument go out the window when I said "currently" and you said "But it CAN be and HAS been." Bring your elevator to the present, that's where I am and what I was discussing and I am still discussing, hence the word "currently". Not the past and not the past. And I was in no way speaking for Chris Cuff. I was merely making an observation based on two recent encouraging emails he has posted to the group. Unless you are his mouthpiece, I encourage Chris to speak up if I have offended him. If you did not understand what I meant about the snowball, contact me off list and I will explain it to you. I could go on but the petty bickering bores the rest of the group. Second floor Hardware, children's ware, ladies lingerie Oh... good morning Mr. Tyler Going... down Hahaha oooow Enjoy the ride, Charles From bjackson@indyradio.com Tue Dec 03 00:06:53 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 3 Dec 2002 08:06:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 88336 invoked from network); 3 Dec 2002 08:06:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Dec 2002 08:06:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.78) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Dec 2002 08:06:52 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.144] by n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Dec 2002 08:06:52 -0000 Date: Tue, 03 Dec 2002 08:06:49 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Audio File Uploaded Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1879 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923" X-Originating-IP: 64.25.100.142 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 Did you have trouble d/ling it, Kevin? I tried it from both home and the station and it worked OK for me. I know my IPS does NOT uses Win NT. As far as file size...I tried to make it as small as possible, and not introduce too much "digital noise" into it...So I used 44.1 khz VBR recording from Pro Tools. Being the "AM Stereo fanatic" (sorry) that I am, I'm trying to get down during hours and get some photos of the xmter plant. Our Indy engineers don't really do much with WZZB...We have a different staff down there. --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin T." wrote: > > As promised, over the weekend I made a scoped aircheck of WZZB's > > light AC format. > > I had a chance to download it... wow, that's a big file... about 9.8 > megs. Just one tip: if it sounds totally "underwater" when you play > it, or refuses to play at all, that's because of some obscure > compatibility problem between the file server and your computer... it > shouldn't happen when web sites are properly set up to let you > download MP3 files, but when they aren't, the fix is easy... just > download an MP3 "Detox" or "Uncook" utility, such as from the > following site: > > http://home.onestop.net/nvort/utilities.html > > Any of the programs on this site will quickly and easily fix the MP3 > file so that you can play it completely glitch-free. > > Anyway, despite the slight crackly kind of distortion in the > recording, the sound quality from 1390 WZZB is excellent... very wide > Stereo separation and good audio processing, which make for superb > audio that would really come to life on a modern AMAX receiver. And > it's great to hear those modern songs on AM radio -- I reminds me of > when 1040 WJHR in Flemington, NJ had a Top 40 format in 1998-1999 and > even called themselves "AM STEREO 1040" in every single ID and liner! From n0uiheric@aol.com Tue Dec 03 00:39:13 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 3 Dec 2002 08:39:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 36232 invoked from network); 3 Dec 2002 08:39:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Dec 2002 08:39:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r10.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.106) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Dec 2002 08:39:11 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-r10.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.31.31227ac1 (16930) for ; Tue, 3 Dec 2002 03:39:06 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <31.31227ac1.2b1dc7aa@aol.com> Date: Tue, 3 Dec 2002 03:39:06 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Tom Ray: Negative Comments toward our group in Radio World To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih I think it's people like Tom Ray that should get out of the radio business, and STAY OUT. Face the facts. IBOC is an unproven technology which will mess up both AM and FM. Nearly 90% of all AM radio stations would be eliminated if IBOC is ever implemented (my market would be severely affected; only KMOX 1120 would be allowed to remain if IBOC is ever implemented). Most of the nation's non-commercial educational FM radio stations would also be eliminated (locally, only KWMU 90.7 and KSIV-FM 91.5 would remain) and low-power commercial FMs would face the same fate (St. Louis would lose half it's commercial FMs) if IBOC were ever implemented. What would be better than the IBOC crap would be implementing DSP in all new receivers. DSP is as close to digital as AM and FM will ever get. Besides, nobody wants IBOC; Canadians have shown that they don't want DAB. It's another example of a failed deregulatory environment in action. The one thing that stunted AM Stereo's growth is that the FCC failed to require AM Stereo broadcasting, at least for the music-formatted stations. IBOC is already going the way of FMX, BETA videocassettes and Dolby System FM Stereo. IBOC is a miserable failure; anyone who believes that IBOC is the "future of radio" lacks REAL vision, and is living in a dream world. If you were to own a chain of AM and FM stations, wouldn't you want to require Stereo on all AM and FM signals, regardless of format? I would. Besides, all engineers must look at the Digital Disaster Web site. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From ccuff@in4web.com Tue Dec 03 02:21:36 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 3 Dec 2002 10:21:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 11564 invoked from network); 3 Dec 2002 10:21:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Dec 2002 10:21:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Dec 2002 10:21:36 -0000 Received: from Chris1 (unverified [208.228.96.20]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Tue, 3 Dec 2002 05:16:10 -0500 Message-ID: <006c01c29ab5$c2bf7300$0d01a8c0@Chris1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Negative Comments - Message For wgliradio Date: Tue, 3 Dec 2002 05:21:36 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Chris Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 Me? Offended? hardly! I am enjoying this current volley quite a bit. As for my plans, IF and when am stereo makes a strong comeback, I will be going back into manufacturing full time. I live for that day. I have seen a steady upwards trend towards the re-emergence of am stereo. BUT.. having been badly abused by radio, I just have to be very cautious about getting burned again. When I had to go before the bankruptcy judge last December, He was genuinely supportive of my efforts to try and bring improvement to radio. OK, I went overboard. I had a dream that people would beat a path to my door for new radios. Of course, it didn't happen that way... but we ARE getting noticed, and the old saying "Never give up on a dream" has long been my credo. (curiosly, Kevin R had told me to stop chasing people- "They will come to you"- How right he was! I tried ignoring emails from interested people, but they kept on emailing me anyway..) So, I'm here for the long run. Chris ----- Original Message ----- From: "wa5vhu" To: Sent: Tuesday, December 03, 2002 12:44 AM Subject: {AMSF} Negative Comments - Message For wgliradio From amfmdx@fastq.com Tue Dec 03 08:40:32 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 3 Dec 2002 16:40:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 78302 invoked from network); 3 Dec 2002 16:40:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Dec 2002 16:40:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Dec 2002 16:40:30 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt (d103-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.135]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gB3GeTv02353 for ; Tue, 3 Dec 2002 09:40:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <034001c29aea$a7e4a700$bff9bed8@kredding430cdt> To: References: <006c01c29ab5$c2bf7300$0d01a8c0@Chris1> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Negative Comments - Message For wgliradio Date: Tue, 3 Dec 2002 09:40:13 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > (curiosly, Kevin R had told me to stop chasing people- "They will come to > you"- How right he was! I tried ignoring emails from interested people, but > they kept on emailing me anyway..) When you have a good idea, people will pound down the door to get to you. You have a good idea. Why do you think women play hard to get? If they come after you, then you move away. The same psychology works with selling anything, especially if its good. It makes the buyer want it all the more. Don't forget me when you go into business big time. :) Kevin From wa2fnq@optonline.net Tue Dec 03 08:58:36 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: wa2fnq@optonline.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 3 Dec 2002 16:58:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 36731 invoked from network); 3 Dec 2002 16:58:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Dec 2002 16:58:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Dec 2002 16:58:35 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.187] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Dec 2002 16:58:35 -0000 Date: Tue, 03 Dec 2002 16:58:35 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Tom Ray: Negative Comments toward our group in Radio W orld Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A5607974048E70A0@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 488 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wa2fnq" X-Originating-IP: 64.236.235.240 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=60059615 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa2fnq Charles, With all due respect my off the shelf, $30 AIWA portable, of recent vintage is reasonably high fidelity. It's good enough to hear if the 10KHz NRSC filter in the transmitter audio chain is on or off. So radios are out there. Jerry WA2FNQ --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Charles Penry" wrote: The general > public does not currently have access to high fidelity AM radios, so AM is > therefore not considered a high fidelity medium to the general public. > > From evergreenterrace@buzzle.com Tue Dec 03 09:49:46 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: evergreenterrace@buzzle.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 3 Dec 2002 17:49:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 55199 invoked from network); 3 Dec 2002 17:49:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Dec 2002 17:49:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Dec 2002 17:49:45 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.136] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Dec 2002 17:49:43 -0000 Date: Tue, 03 Dec 2002 17:49:40 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Negative Comments - Message For wgliradio Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 923 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgliradio" X-Originating-IP: 209.139.110.104 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=69711087 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgliradio --- In amstereoforum@y..., "wa5vhu" wrote: > wgliradio, > Perhaps your comment was not directed at any one particular engineer > however you had just mentioned two engineers by name. The real world > sees through your cleverness. Did I directly say either engineer is foolish or misguided? Did I? If that is how you took it, well, that's your view. It was not the intended view. It was directed at many engineers I have spoken with who do not believe AMS is any benefit to the AM band... those who still believe you cannot modulate rigs and you lose coverage. Your other comment is absurd. If I post it is my view as I have said before, just like your post is your view. To take it any other way is incorrect. I do not agree with IBOC, nor do I agree with WOR's choice to use it. However, I do believe that Tom Ray is an excellent engineer who's opinion and mine differ. That is all. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Dec 03 10:41:30 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 3 Dec 2002 18:41:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 80632 invoked from network); 3 Dec 2002 18:41:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Dec 2002 18:41:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Dec 2002 18:41:29 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.143] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Dec 2002 18:41:29 -0000 Date: Tue, 03 Dec 2002 18:41:28 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: good AM radios (Aiwa, Philips-Magnavox, etc.) Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1341 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > With all due respect my off the shelf, $30 AIWA portable, of recent > vintage is reasonably high fidelity. It's good enough to hear if > the 10KHz NRSC filter in the transmitter audio chain is on or off. > So radios are out there. My Aiwa stereo system, made in 1999, also has surprisingly good sound on AM. It sounds like a good 1970s tuner, with a very gradual and "natural"-sounding reduction of high frequency response, as opposed to the sharp drop-off of a ceramic filter. In fact, at night it could really use a 10 kHz notch filter to cut out the carrier whistles. On it, I can instantly distinguish WOR's 5 or 6 kHz audio bandwidth from that of regular 10 kHz analog AM audio. The best of the recent years are the Philips-Magnavox radios with the European-made "ECO 5" tuner module, which uses all IF coils, instead of a ceramic filter on AM. I've heard that its AM frequency response is flat from 40 Hz to 8 kHz, but the useful response extends far beyond that. Given a good AM music station to listen to, its AM sounds better than the FM, providing a richer tone with less over- processing of the high treble. The only thing is that Philips and Magnavox now seem to have gone their separate ways in manufacturing consumer audio products... anybody know which one, or both, is still using the good AM tuner? From amfmdx@fastq.com Tue Dec 03 11:10:40 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 3 Dec 2002 19:10:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 30487 invoked from network); 3 Dec 2002 19:10:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Dec 2002 19:10:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Dec 2002 19:10:38 -0000 Received: from kredding430cdt (d103-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.135]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gB3JAbv08007 for ; Tue, 3 Dec 2002 12:10:37 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <039501c29aff$996b9de0$bff9bed8@kredding430cdt> To: Subject: 4 sale: GE SR III Date: Tue, 3 Dec 2002 12:10:08 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla GE Superadio III for sale. Working, clean, sounds good, will do domestic DX. $25 plus shipping. Send e-mail to amfmdx@fastq.com if interested. Kevin This message has been composed of recycled electrons. None of these electrons has been harmed or injured in the creation and transmission of this message but they have been shamelessly exploited for this use. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Dec 03 14:25:25 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 3 Dec 2002 22:25:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 16180 invoked from network); 3 Dec 2002 22:25:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Dec 2002 22:25:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.89) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Dec 2002 22:25:24 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.186] by n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Dec 2002 22:25:24 -0000 Date: Tue, 03 Dec 2002 22:25:23 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: WOR/WLW nighttime IBOC testing, explained Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1467 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.81.16 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics WOR's Tom Ray posted the following to the NY Radio Message Board explaining the procedure for the coordinated nighttime IBOC tests of 700 WLW and 710 WOR that will be ongoing: http://musicradio.computer.net/wwwboard/messages/185523.html He also mentions that WOR just intalled a new version of the "HD Radio" (a.k.a. IBOC) software in their transmitter, and today during the daytime I noticed that WOR's digital sidebands are stronger than ever. They are now significantly LOUDER than WOR's analog audio, enough to completely ruin reception of 740 WGSM from Long Island, which was at least marginally listenable before, but now is totally covered with noise and static for WOR's digital signal. Also, the IBOC system actually exceeds the NRSC AM bandwidth standard.... sort of. As you can see on this graph: http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/nrsc.gif IBOC is designed to conform to the standard NRSC bandwidth limit, which is defined by the horizontal line which steps down to -25 dB from 10 to 20 kHz. However, the diagonal dashed line you see is the more strict NRSC limit for a "Standard Noise Test Signal" -- a special kind of WHITE NOISE transmitted for testing purposes. IBOC's digital sidebands may not meet the exact specifications of this "noise" signal, but since it is essentially white noise, it could be construed as being bound to this stricter bandwidth limit -- which it does not meet. Just something to think about.... From ccuff@in4web.com Tue Dec 03 14:41:51 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 3 Dec 2002 22:41:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 41166 invoked from network); 3 Dec 2002 22:41:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Dec 2002 22:41:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Dec 2002 22:41:50 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.129]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Tue, 3 Dec 2002 17:36:26 -0500 Message-ID: <001501c29b1b$f97f7fa0$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: good AM radios (Aiwa, Philips-Magnavox, etc.) Date: Tue, 3 Dec 2002 17:33:16 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 The shelf systems have the ECO5 or ECO6 still, but not the boomboxes. The ECO6 does not have the pin area for the am stereo decoder like the ECO5, but are still convertable and good. Aiwa is now garbage, with the takeover by Sony completely ruining what was once a good product. Tech support is now done by Sony for both brands, and is abysmal. It seems all the manufacturers are really putting out crud these days. One of the worst is Harman/Infinity/JBL- these products are so shoddy and unreliable, I do not know what keps them in business. I have to repair this junk every day, but hopefully, I can chuck all that and go full time into AMS. Chris "All we have is American Made.... a Little cheesey, but nicely displayed" (Frank Zappa) From amfmdx@fastq.com Tue Dec 03 16:06:16 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 4 Dec 2002 00:06:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 11407 invoked from network); 4 Dec 2002 00:06:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Dec 2002 00:06:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Dec 2002 00:06:15 -0000 Received: from fastq (d11-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.43]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gB406Ev19063 for ; Tue, 3 Dec 2002 17:06:14 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <00ae01c29b28$f048dfa0$48f9bed8@com> To: Subject: SR III Date: Tue, 3 Dec 2002 17:06:03 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla The SR III has been sold. This message has been composed of recycled electrons. None of these electrons has been harmed or injured in the creation and transmission of this message but they have been shamelessly exploited for this use. From possumhunter@netzero.net Tue Dec 03 16:19:24 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 4 Dec 2002 00:19:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 13864 invoked from network); 4 Dec 2002 00:19:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Dec 2002 00:19:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.119) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Dec 2002 00:19:23 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 3 Dec 2002 16:19:23 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} WOR/WLW nighttime IBOC testing, explained Date: Tue, 3 Dec 2002 19:19:07 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 04 Dec 2002 00:19:23.0853 (UTC) FILETIME=[CC501FD0:01C29B2A] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.150.27.140] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Tom Ray wrote: >Tonight, WLW and WOR will be banging heads full steam ahead with IBOC carriers on full time. We will be testing for digital coverage to see where skywave interference causes the digital to drop out. I sure am glad we are 900Khz away from all of the IBOC noise. It makes me glad to be on 1600Khz! Kevin- WFIS 1600 AM From groucho@skyweb.net Tue Dec 03 17:00:02 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 4 Dec 2002 01:00:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 88614 invoked from network); 4 Dec 2002 01:00:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Dec 2002 01:00:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Dec 2002 00:59:59 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gB414XQB099125; Tue, 3 Dec 2002 20:04:34 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DED5317.4355602B@skyweb.net> Date: Tue, 03 Dec 2002 19:57:59 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "ABDX@topica.com" , Jeff DePolo WN3A , "radio-tech@broadcast.net" Subject: Re: {AMSF} WOR/WLW nighttime IBOC testing, explained References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Ohhh my I just made a recording from here at the house 10 seconds on each freq starting at 710,700,690,680,670 660,670,680,690,700, 710, 720,730,740, 750,760,770,760,750,740,730,720,and 710.... and willing to post it as an MP3 for all to listen too... If requested.. Guys No Shit.. AM is in deep trouble.. when I got to 750.. I caught the WBZ ID by accident.. Its really scary... I hope all of you out there are listening to the band tonight IBOC is really bad news.. The recording tells no lies Neal "Kevin T." wrote: > WOR's Tom Ray posted the following to the NY Radio Message Board > explaining the procedure for the coordinated nighttime IBOC tests of > 700 WLW and 710 WOR that will be ongoing: > > http://musicradio.computer.net/wwwboard/messages/185523.html > > He also mentions that WOR just intalled a new version of the "HD > Radio" (a.k.a. IBOC) software in their transmitter, and today during > the daytime I noticed that WOR's digital sidebands are stronger than > ever. They are now significantly LOUDER than WOR's analog audio, > enough to completely ruin reception of 740 WGSM from Long Island, > which was at least marginally listenable before, but now is totally > covered with noise and static for WOR's digital signal. > > Also, the IBOC system actually exceeds the NRSC AM bandwidth > standard.... sort of. As you can see on this graph: > > http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/nrsc.gif > > IBOC is designed to conform to the standard NRSC bandwidth limit, > which is defined by the horizontal line which steps down to -25 dB > from 10 to 20 kHz. However, the diagonal dashed line you see is the > more strict NRSC limit for a "Standard Noise Test Signal" -- a > special kind of WHITE NOISE transmitted for testing purposes. IBOC's > digital sidebands may not meet the exact specifications of this > "noise" signal, but since it is essentially white noise, it could be > construed as being bound to this stricter bandwidth limit -- which it > does not meet. Just something to think about.... > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From stodd@sherbtel.net Tue Dec 03 18:26:56 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 4 Dec 2002 02:26:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 78884 invoked from network); 4 Dec 2002 02:26:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Dec 2002 02:26:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Dec 2002 02:26:55 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-236.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.236]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gB42PqN2007218 for ; Tue, 3 Dec 2002 20:25:54 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <001701a8ea56$3314b400$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Tom Ray: Negative Comments toward our group in Radio World Date: Fri, 4 Jan 1980 04:50:04 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Perhaps that needs to be expressed in a reply letter to RW. With that and Neal's first hand observations, it would put a dent in their credibility. That and keeping our rhetoric otherwise civil should help our cause. Scott Todd Still got phones (for now!) and the hard drive hasn't croaked- still having problems even with the new main board, so it must be the hd. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kevin T." > If I made any "attacks" against Mr. Ray and Mr. Richards, it was only > in self defense. For example, I wrote an extremely polite and > cordial e-mail to Mr. Richards about AMAX and how it compares to > IBOC, and he wrote back with some of the most insulting language I > have ever seen from a so-called "professional". From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Dec 03 18:40:53 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 4 Dec 2002 02:40:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 8546 invoked from network); 4 Dec 2002 02:40:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Dec 2002 02:40:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Dec 2002 02:40:52 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.136] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 04 Dec 2002 02:40:52 -0000 Date: Wed, 04 Dec 2002 02:40:50 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: WOR/WLW nighttime IBOC testing, explained Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3DED5317.4355602B@skyweb.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1681 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.81.16 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Its really scary... I hope all of you out there are listening to > the band tonight IBOC is really bad news.. The recording tells no > lies This is true... it *is* scary to hear how WOR's IBOC signal is MURDERING the AM band all the way from 680 to 740 kHz. The normally clear French Canadian stations on 690 and 730 are GONE... completely covered up by the IBOC digital hiss and squealing noise. And of course I'm not going to even mention 700 WLW and WGN 720 AM Stereo because any skywave reception of them is simply a lost cause. The saddest thing for me is that WOR's digital sidebands are now so strong and splattery that even my normally crystal clear nighttime reception of 740 CHWO "Prime Time Radio" from Toronto is totally trashed with noting but noise, static, and splatter from WOR -- no matter how narrow-bandwidth of a radio I use. There must be something wrong with WOR's digital signal, as it is only supposed to extend up to 725 kHz (+/- 15 kHz bandwidth), but yet it is completely CLOBBERING reception on 740 kHz! CHWO has to be coming in with full city-grade signal strength just to be heard above WOR's noise. It even makes the "graveyard channels" look good in comparison. It is amazing how HUNDREDS of analog AM stations all transmitting on one of these Class C Local channels are still collectively MUCH less destructive to reception of neighboring frequencies than a SINGLE IBOC digital signal. That's because the NRSC Mask does a good job of managing the bandwidth of ANALOG stations, and keeping them within bounds -- but when a digital signal is allowed to "sneak through" the rules like this, the result is simply a mess. From n0uiheric@aol.com Tue Dec 03 19:16:28 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 4 Dec 2002 03:16:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 72107 invoked from network); 4 Dec 2002 03:16:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Dec 2002 03:16:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d04.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.36) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Dec 2002 03:16:27 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-d04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.35.3113ffb9 (4426) for ; Tue, 3 Dec 2002 22:16:16 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <35.3113ffb9.2b1ecd7f@aol.com> Date: Tue, 3 Dec 2002 22:16:15 EST Subject: If You Think IBOC Is Bad, Read This! To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih I have been fairly active in writing my elected officials lately (although I have still to write Missouri's new U.S. Senator, Jim Talent, and the Congressman that now represents our redrawn district, William Lacy Clay, Jr.) urging them to oppose further deregulation of the commercial media (especially radio). Here's what I wrote concerning IBOC: "Unproven technology has also been moved to the forefront since the Telecom Act was passed. The technology known as In-Band, On-Channel Digital Audio Broadcasting (IBOC-DAB), being pushed by iBiquity, is a massive failure. The AM and FM bands, on which this technology would be used, is not suited for digital broadcasting. The most appropriate place would be the L-Band at 1.4 GHz (1,400 MHz); this band is more suited for digital audio broadcasting than the AM and FM bands. AM and FM must remain broadcasting in an analog format. IBOC-DAB would force a majority of smaller broadcasters, which more people are depending on for diversity in viewpoints, community-oriented programming and music not available on corporate radio, off the air. Instead, existing technologies, such as Compatible Quadrature Amplitude Modulation (C-QUAM) AM stereo, developed by Motorola, should be strongly encouraged. AM stereo broadcasting has been proven in over two decades in the field; it provides for better sound quality than IBOC-DAB. Americans certainly don't want radio that sounds like it's being streamed on the Internet; this is basically what IBOC-DAB is." I didn't include any mention of DSP circuitry for AM and FM radios, however. The CBC's study on IBOC on AM showed that this technology is not suited to the band, and the Virginia Center for The Public Press' studies on IBOC in a real-world setting on FM indicates massive adjacent-channel interference. The Virginia Center for The Public Press has PSAs for your station to use; they're in the MP3 format. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From possumhunter@netzero.net Tue Dec 03 19:42:37 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 4 Dec 2002 03:42:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 62034 invoked from network); 4 Dec 2002 03:42:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Dec 2002 03:42:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.17) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Dec 2002 03:42:35 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 3 Dec 2002 19:42:35 -0800 To: Cc: , References: <3DED5317.4355602B@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} WOR/WLW nighttime IBOC testing, explained Date: Tue, 3 Dec 2002 22:42:17 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 04 Dec 2002 03:42:35.0768 (UTC) FILETIME=[2F42B780:01C29B47] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.169.72.89] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Neal Newman wrote: > Ohhh my I just made a recording from here at the house 10 seconds on each freq Please post it! > > Guys No Sh*t.. AM is in deep trouble.. My GOD at the noise down there around 700 and 710! They are killing WPTF 680 and even making CHWO 740 nearly unlistenable! > > Its really scary... I hope all of you out there are listening to the band tonight IBOC is really bad news.. The recording tells no lies Please do post your recording to the group. I am sending this to the AM740 and the AMRadioDX groups as well. Like I said, I am sure glad the station that signs my paycheck is 900Khz away from the noise! It would kill 1600 WFIS if 5000 Watt 1580 WDAB went IBOC. How would a station "defend itself" if a powerful station next to it went to IBOC? Blast away at 'em with a KAHN PowerSide? That would sure degrade our nice, clean audio. Our Canadian friends had better take note of what is going on with the US AM band because if 720 WGN, 750 WSB, or 760 WJR turns on an IBOC digital signal, few Canadians and no US DX listener would be able to hear "Prime Time Radio AM 740"! In the mean time, the owner of WFIS has told me, due to listener requests, to get a C-QUAM stereo signal on the air ASAP, even if I have to build an exciter myself! Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From possumhunter@netzero.net Tue Dec 03 20:22:26 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 4 Dec 2002 04:22:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 89161 invoked from network); 4 Dec 2002 04:22:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Dec 2002 04:22:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.204) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Dec 2002 04:22:26 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 3 Dec 2002 20:22:26 -0800 To: Cc: , References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: WOR/WLW nighttime IBOC testing, explained Date: Tue, 3 Dec 2002 23:22:13 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 04 Dec 2002 04:22:26.0112 (UTC) FILETIME=[C0044400:01C29B4C] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.169.72.89] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Kevin T. wrote: > This is true... it *is* scary to hear how WOR's IBOC signal is MURDERING the AM band all the way from 680 to 740 kHz. The normally clear French Canadian stations on 690 and 730 are GONE... completely covered up by the IBOC digital hiss and squealing noise. And of course I'm not going to even mention 700 WLW and WGN 720 AM Stereo because any skywave reception of them is simply a lost cause. > > The saddest thing for me is that WOR's digital sidebands are now so strong and splattery that even my normally crystal clear nighttime reception of 740 CHWO "Prime Time Radio" from Toronto is totally trashed with noting but noise, static, and splatter from WOR WOR's IBOC noise is MUCH louder than WLW's, even though WLW has a stronger signal. WLW is wiping out normally clear WPTF 680. Both WLW and WOR are unlistenable at my location in South Carolina from mutual interference and WOR is trashing CHWO. If the two "Big boys" on 700 and 710 can trash 60Khz+ of bandwidth, does that mean I can unplug the NRSC Optimod and put my Kahn Symmetra-Peak, DAP 310, and Universal Audio BL-40 Modulimiter back in the air chain? Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From groucho@skyweb.net Tue Dec 03 20:25:15 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 4 Dec 2002 04:25:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 16499 invoked from network); 4 Dec 2002 04:25:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Dec 2002 04:25:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Dec 2002 04:25:15 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gB44U2QB057281 for ; Tue, 3 Dec 2002 23:30:03 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DED8331.DFF5E3E7@skyweb.net> Date: Tue, 03 Dec 2002 23:23:13 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} If You Think IBOC Is Bad, Read This! References: <35.3113ffb9.2b1ecd7f@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 As I sit here at 11:21 pm... I am recording a talk show On 720 Being totally trashed by WOR.... 740 canada and WGSM on longisland dont exist anymore 690 I have also recorded tonight.. I thought Testing was Not to be with regular Programming Lets see Is this legal?????? Neal n0uiheric@aol.com wrote: > I have been fairly active in writing my elected officials lately (although I > have still to write Missouri's new U.S. Senator, Jim Talent, and the > Congressman that now represents our redrawn district, William Lacy Clay, Jr.) > urging them to oppose further deregulation of the commercial media > (especially radio). Here's what I wrote concerning IBOC: > > "Unproven technology has also been moved to the forefront since the Telecom > Act was passed. The technology known as In-Band, On-Channel Digital Audio > Broadcasting (IBOC-DAB), being pushed by iBiquity, is a massive failure. The > AM and FM bands, on which this technology would be used, is not suited for > digital broadcasting. The most appropriate place would be the L-Band at 1.4 > GHz (1,400 MHz); this band is more suited for digital audio broadcasting than > the AM and FM bands. AM and FM must remain broadcasting in an analog format. > IBOC-DAB would force a majority of smaller broadcasters, which more people > are depending on for diversity in viewpoints, community-oriented programming > and music not available on corporate radio, off the air. Instead, existing > technologies, such as Compatible Quadrature Amplitude Modulation (C-QUAM) AM > stereo, developed by Motorola, should be strongly encouraged. AM stereo > broadcasting has been proven in over two decades in the field; it provides > for better sound quality than IBOC-DAB. Americans certainly don't want radio > that sounds like it's being streamed on the Internet; this is basically what > IBOC-DAB is." > > I didn't include any mention of DSP circuitry for AM and FM radios, however. > The CBC's study on IBOC on AM showed that this technology is not suited to > the band, and the Virginia Center for The Public Press' studies on IBOC in a > real-world setting on FM indicates massive adjacent-channel interference. The > Virginia Center for The Public Press has PSAs for your station to use; > they're in the MP3 format. > > 73 and good DX from Eric > Amateur Radio Station N0UIH > Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN > Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 > DXing The World since 1981 > Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel > PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION > "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From groucho@skyweb.net Tue Dec 03 20:31:17 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 4 Dec 2002 04:31:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 10069 invoked from network); 4 Dec 2002 04:31:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Dec 2002 04:31:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Dec 2002 04:31:17 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gB44a4QB058645 for ; Tue, 3 Dec 2002 23:36:05 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DED849B.BB225176@skyweb.net> Date: Tue, 03 Dec 2002 23:29:15 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} If You Think IBOC Is Bad, Read This! References: <35.3113ffb9.2b1ecd7f@aol.com> <3DED8331.DFF5E3E7@skyweb.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Disregard the Time I posted.. the Clock here is off... I this was written at 8:30pm Neal Newman wrote: > As I sit here at 11:21 pm... I am recording a talk show On 720 Being totally > trashed by WOR.... > 740 canada and WGSM on longisland dont exist anymore > 690 I have also recorded tonight.. > I thought Testing was Not to be with regular Programming > Lets see Is this legal?????? > Neal > > n0uiheric@aol.com wrote: > > > I have been fairly active in writing my elected officials lately (although I > > have still to write Missouri's new U.S. Senator, Jim Talent, and the > > Congressman that now represents our redrawn district, William Lacy Clay, Jr.) > > urging them to oppose further deregulation of the commercial media > > (especially radio). Here's what I wrote concerning IBOC: > > > > "Unproven technology has also been moved to the forefront since the Telecom > > Act was passed. The technology known as In-Band, On-Channel Digital Audio > > Broadcasting (IBOC-DAB), being pushed by iBiquity, is a massive failure. The > > AM and FM bands, on which this technology would be used, is not suited for > > digital broadcasting. The most appropriate place would be the L-Band at 1.4 > > GHz (1,400 MHz); this band is more suited for digital audio broadcasting than > > the AM and FM bands. AM and FM must remain broadcasting in an analog format. > > IBOC-DAB would force a majority of smaller broadcasters, which more people > > are depending on for diversity in viewpoints, community-oriented programming > > and music not available on corporate radio, off the air. Instead, existing > > technologies, such as Compatible Quadrature Amplitude Modulation (C-QUAM) AM > > stereo, developed by Motorola, should be strongly encouraged. AM stereo > > broadcasting has been proven in over two decades in the field; it provides > > for better sound quality than IBOC-DAB. Americans certainly don't want radio > > that sounds like it's being streamed on the Internet; this is basically what > > IBOC-DAB is." > > > > I didn't include any mention of DSP circuitry for AM and FM radios, however. > > The CBC's study on IBOC on AM showed that this technology is not suited to > > the band, and the Virginia Center for The Public Press' studies on IBOC in a > > real-world setting on FM indicates massive adjacent-channel interference. The > > Virginia Center for The Public Press has PSAs for your station to use; > > they're in the MP3 format. > > > > 73 and good DX from Eric > > Amateur Radio Station N0UIH > > Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN > > Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 > > DXing The World since 1981 > > Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel > > PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION > > "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From KC4QLP@aol.com Tue Dec 03 20:55:59 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 4 Dec 2002 04:55:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 428 invoked from network); 4 Dec 2002 04:55:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Dec 2002 04:55:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d02.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.34) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Dec 2002 04:55:58 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.a3.33c25949 (4328) for ; Tue, 3 Dec 2002 23:55:54 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Tue, 3 Dec 2002 23:55:53 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} If You Think IBOC Is Bad, Read This! To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/3/02 11:26:38 PM Eastern Standard Time, groucho@skyweb.net writes: << As I sit here at 11:21 pm... I am recording a talk show On 720 Being totally trashed by WOR.... 740 canada and WGSM on longisland dont exist anymore 690 I have also recorded tonight.. I thought Testing was Not to be with regular Programming Lets see Is this legal?????? Neal Sitting here this evening listening with a Nems Clark Field Strengh meter {model number 1633} WOR 710 is coming in with a signal strengh of around 6.8mV ...and 700 WLW is slightly stronger at 7.4mV. The digital hash was noted 10 kc either side of both stations with a signal level on the hash running from 3.5mV to 4mV. On the car radio here in the parking lot of WGAI ...WOR and WLW each have hash noise that is transparent under each of them...and this spreads out 10 kc either side of those stations listening with a stock radio in a 98 Nissin Sentra. I'll check again once I get away from the station here...doing some late night tweaking to some programming issues here. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From amfmdx@fastq.com Tue Dec 03 21:14:45 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 4 Dec 2002 05:14:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 98987 invoked from network); 4 Dec 2002 05:14:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Dec 2002 05:14:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Dec 2002 05:14:45 -0000 Received: from fastq (d170-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.202]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gB45Eiv26217 for ; Tue, 3 Dec 2002 22:14:44 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <011401c29b54$08a53c80$48f9bed8@com> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: WOR/WLW nighttime IBOC testing, explained Date: Tue, 3 Dec 2002 22:14:32 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > WOR's IBOC noise is MUCH louder than WLW's, even though WLW has a stronger > signal. WLW is wiping out normally clear WPTF 680. Both WLW and WOR are > unlistenable at my location in South Carolina from mutual interference and > WOR is trashing CHWO. Obviously WOR is weaker here with the noise but it has been noted by western DXers such as myself to be interfering with Clear Channel's XETRA on 690 in Tijuana, KWLW on 700 in Salt Lake City, and Jack E. Dawn's KDWN 720 in Las Vegas. The interference was noted on DX radios in Arizona, [mine] California by AK6C and in Oregon by a very well known DXer who is in the board of directors of a major radio club. If we can hear it here, 2000 miles away, its gotta really be bad. For me here in AZ, the 690 interference was by far the worst. Kevin Mesa, Arizona From n0uiheric@aol.com Tue Dec 03 21:33:44 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 4 Dec 2002 05:33:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 68889 invoked from network); 4 Dec 2002 05:33:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Dec 2002 05:33:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m06.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.161) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Dec 2002 05:33:43 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-m06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.12f.1c9e9c2b (4459) for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 00:33:38 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <12f.1c9e9c2b.2b1eedb2@aol.com> Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 00:33:38 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} WOR/WLW nighttime IBOC testing, explained To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih WLW is giving KSTL AM Stereo 690 (17 miles away in East St. Louis, IL) extreme fits with it's fax-sounding sidebands; 710 is totally useless. WOR's sidebands aren't strong enough in St. Louis to give WGN AM Stereo 720 fits. 730 is a total mess tonight. Christopher Maxwell of the Digital Disaster site was right...IT IS AN AUDIO EQUIVALENT OF A FAX MACHINE! 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From KC4QLP@aol.com Tue Dec 03 22:56:07 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 4 Dec 2002 06:56:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 500 invoked from network); 4 Dec 2002 06:56:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Dec 2002 06:56:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r08.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.104) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Dec 2002 06:56:06 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.115.1b7ecd72 (30960) for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 01:55:57 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <115.1b7ecd72.2b1f00fd@aol.com> Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 01:55:57 EST Subject: WLW/WOR night time IBOC testing continues tonight...results from NC To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit On the car radio here in the parking lot of WGAI ...WOR and WLW each have hash noise that is transparent under each of them...and this spreads out 10 kc either side of those stations listening with a stock radio in a 98 Nissin Sentra. I'll check again once I get away from the station here...doing some late night tweaking to some programming issues here. ---------------- Now that I'm away from high levels of RF....the results on the car radio are the same as last night. WLW unlistenable at times...WGN 720 is very hard to hear most of the time. So that it in a nutshell folks .....the IBOC saga continues...... Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From jsgil@hal-pc.org Tue Dec 03 23:28:48 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 4 Dec 2002 07:28:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 77304 invoked from network); 4 Dec 2002 07:28:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Dec 2002 07:28:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Dec 2002 07:28:48 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.182] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 04 Dec 2002 07:28:48 -0000 Date: Wed, 04 Dec 2002 07:28:46 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: WOR/WLW nighttime IBOC testing, explained Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1684 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.210 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin T." wrote: > > Also, the IBOC system actually exceeds the NRSC AM bandwidth > standard.... sort of. As you can see on this graph: > > http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/nrsc.gif > > IBOC is designed to conform to the standard NRSC bandwidth limit, > which is defined by the horizontal line which steps down to -25 dB > from 10 to 20 kHz. However, the diagonal dashed line you see is the > more strict NRSC limit for a "Standard Noise Test Signal" -- a > special kind of WHITE NOISE transmitted for testing purposes. IBOC's > digital sidebands may not meet the exact specifications of this > "noise" signal, but since it is essentially white noise, it could be > construed as being bound to this stricter bandwidth limit -- which it > does not meet. Just something to think about.... I have drawn up a NRSC mask with the IBOC sidebands to show that the Primary sidebands in hybrid mode do exceed the NRSC mask for white noise defined by the dotted line. Unless the FCC has granted them an exemption to transmitt a continuous wave of white noise above this line then they are technically operating illegally. They would have to reduce the Primary sidebands by at least 7dB to come into compliance. http://www.hal-pc.org/~jsgil/AM-Stereo/NRSC-IBOC-Mask.gif The Tertiary Didital sidebands are transmitted in quadrature with the analog signal. Granted that these sidebands are >40dB below the analog signal but unless they are using C-QuAM to modulate the tertiary data for envelope compatibility it may be possible to hear the digital hash if you are close to the station and have a good s/n ratio. JSG From kfornal@cox.net Tue Dec 03 23:49:00 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kfornal@cox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 4 Dec 2002 07:49:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 94312 invoked from network); 4 Dec 2002 07:48:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Dec 2002 07:48:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO lakemtao01.cox.net) (68.1.17.244) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Dec 2002 07:48:59 -0000 Received: from OMNIBOOK ([68.9.127.164]) by lakemtao01.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20021204074858.LCRK2199.lakemtao01.cox.net@OMNIBOOK> for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 02:48:58 -0500 To: Subject: New IBOC station on 1670 Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 02:48:39 -0500 Message-ID: <000401c29b69$922c8de0$0401a8c0@OMNIBOOK> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2616 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Importance: Normal From: "Keith Fornal" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=128541479 X-Yahoo-Profile: theradboy From All Access (12/3): "iBIQUITY has applied to the FCC for another experimental license to test IBOC digital radio on AM. Already testing on 650 AM in FREDERICK, MD, the company is looking to use 1670 AM as well on a fulltime basis." What havoc with this cause WTTM 1680? Keith Fornal Treasurer Dutch Island Lighthouse Society www.dutchislandlighthouse.org From groucho@skyweb.net Wed Dec 04 00:08:00 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 4 Dec 2002 08:08:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 20361 invoked from network); 4 Dec 2002 08:07:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Dec 2002 08:07:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Dec 2002 08:07:59 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gB48CmQB012222 for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 03:12:48 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DEDB757.A9912C0D@skyweb.net> Date: Wed, 04 Dec 2002 03:05:43 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} New IBOC station on 1670 References: <000401c29b69$922c8de0$0401a8c0@OMNIBOOK> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 where did you find this Info Ibiquity had Filed for 640Khz for FREDERICK MD not 650.....and tell me where you found the 1670 application? Keith Fornal wrote: > >From All Access (12/3): > > "iBIQUITY has applied to the FCC for another experimental license to > test IBOC digital radio on AM. Already testing on 650 AM in FREDERICK, > MD, the company is looking to use 1670 AM as well on a fulltime basis." > > What havoc with this cause WTTM 1680? > > Keith Fornal > Treasurer > Dutch Island Lighthouse Society > www.dutchislandlighthouse.org > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From KC4QLP@aol.com Wed Dec 04 00:28:18 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 4 Dec 2002 08:28:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 62199 invoked from network); 4 Dec 2002 08:28:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Dec 2002 08:28:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r10.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.106) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Dec 2002 08:28:18 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r10.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.20.3b0733f (1320) for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 03:28:07 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <20.3b0733f.2b1f1696@aol.com> Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 03:28:06 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} New IBOC station on 1670 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 12/4/02 3:08:52 AM Eastern Standard Time, groucho@skyweb.net writes: > where did you find this Info Ibiquity had Filed for 640Khz for FREDERICK > MD > not 650.....and tell me where you found the 1670 application? > > > Neal, Go to the ever slow loading site of www.allaccess.com...then when it finally loads up...click on "net news" to the left of the page...sign in an scroll down. Its only a short blip...all that is there is what Kevin Fornal quoted. Sounds like to me world war 3 is about to begin and its gonna start in Jersey! Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From kfornal@cox.net Wed Dec 04 00:30:17 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kfornal@cox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 4 Dec 2002 08:30:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 88517 invoked from network); 4 Dec 2002 08:30:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Dec 2002 08:30:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO lakemtao04.cox.net) (68.1.17.241) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Dec 2002 08:30:17 -0000 Received: from OMNIBOOK ([68.9.127.164]) by lakemtao04.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20021204083016.GKIJ1248.lakemtao04.cox.net@OMNIBOOK> for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 03:30:16 -0500 To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} New IBOC station on 1670 Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 03:30:03 -0500 Message-ID: <000a01c29b6f$57beea80$0401a8c0@OMNIBOOK> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2616 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 In-Reply-To: <3DEDB757.A9912C0D@skyweb.net> Importance: Normal From: "Keith Fornal" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=128541479 X-Yahoo-Profile: theradboy Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I saw this as a news item on www.allaccess.com. I just checked the FCC Daily Digest but found nothing. Keith Fornal Treasurer Dutch Island Lighthouse Society www.dutchislandlighthouse.org -----Original Message----- From: Neal Newman [mailto:groucho@skyweb.net] Sent: Wednesday, December 04, 2002 3:06 AM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} New IBOC station on 1670 where did you find this Info Ibiquity had Filed for 640Khz for FREDERICK MD not 650.....and tell me where you found the 1670 application? Keith Fornal wrote: > >From All Access (12/3): > > "iBIQUITY has applied to the FCC for another experimental license to > test IBOC digital radio on AM. Already testing on 650 AM in FREDERICK, > MD, the company is looking to use 1670 AM as well on a fulltime basis." > > What havoc with this cause WTTM 1680? > > Keith Fornal > Treasurer > Dutch Island Lighthouse Society > www.dutchislandlighthouse.org > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ADVERTISEMENT Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From KC4QLP@aol.com Wed Dec 04 00:40:12 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 4 Dec 2002 08:40:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 68373 invoked from network); 4 Dec 2002 08:40:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Dec 2002 08:40:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m04.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.7) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Dec 2002 08:40:12 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.8f.25fb9de5 (1320) for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 03:39:57 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <8f.25fb9de5.2b1f195d@aol.com> Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 03:39:57 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} New IBOC station on 1670 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 12/4/02 3:28:36 AM Eastern Standard Time, KC4QLP@aol.com writes: > > where did you find this Info Ibiquity had Filed for 640Khz for > FREDERICK > > MD > > not 650.....and tell me where you found the 1670 application? > You know something....after hearing what I've heard tonight and last night..it amazes me that this sort of nonsense of interference can continue on....and now iBiquity has the nerve to want and set up "shop" on 1670...next to a commerical broadcaster...and then commence to creating interference.. I've seen nothing where broadcasters have to put up with this nonsense of accepting interference from "experimental" stations.{ high powered part 15 stations and in my opinion..licensed pirates! ---I know...these terms contradict themselves here...hehehe} Its my opinion and my findings that digital radio on AM will not be accepted by the general public..with or without the digital radio,unless some changes are made to the adjacent channel interference. Its beyond acceptable no ifs ands or buts about it. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From KC4QLP@aol.com Wed Dec 04 00:41:53 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 4 Dec 2002 08:41:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 82160 invoked from network); 4 Dec 2002 08:41:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Dec 2002 08:41:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m06.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.161) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Dec 2002 08:41:53 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.25.31d9d9e1 (1320) for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 03:41:51 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <25.31d9d9e1.2b1f19ce@aol.com> Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 03:41:50 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} New IBOC station on 1670 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 12/4/02 3:31:43 AM Eastern Standard Time, kfornal@cox.net writes: > I saw this as a news item on www.allaccess.com. I just checked the FCC > Daily Digest but found nothing. > Give it a few days or so at the most to pop up.Seems the FCC sometimes runs a day or two behind when it comes to there digest Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From dav259@csiro.au Wed Dec 04 01:56:13 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 4 Dec 2002 09:56:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 68465 invoked from network); 4 Dec 2002 09:56:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Dec 2002 09:56:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Dec 2002 09:56:12 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gB49uBP18196 for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 20:56:11 +1100 (EST) Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 20:56:11 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Tom Ray: Negative Comments toward our group in Radio World In-Reply-To: <001701a8ea56$3314b400$827dfea9@home1> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public On Fri, 4 Jan 1980, Scott Todd wrote: > Perhaps that needs to be expressed in a reply letter to RW. With that and > Neal's first hand observations, it would put a dent in their credibility. > That and keeping our rhetoric otherwise civil should help our cause. I haven't entered this discussion yet as I've been busy - but have scanned a bit of the crossfire. I'll say something that I've said before when we only had 70 members. I believe that this list is a discussion list on anything AM stereo. I don't mind seeing disagreements on it - and think they are often fruitful. I don't believe it's wrong to attack organisations which may have have members on this list. As long as we don't attack each other personally and stay focussed I say anything goes. The websites are the venue for nice friendly public advocacy. This is OUR place to discuss it amongst ourselves. To the lurkers here - God bless you! - but try and understand how much we believe what we believe ... and thankfully hear. When you lot come up with something better I will be the first to jump onto your bandwagon. To put this into perspective let me say this ... I love radio. I love it for the music - and the talk - and sometimes even the ads. - just as I actually like junk mail. I love its immediacy. I love its localness. I love its sound!!! And on the AM band - it HAS to be AM stereo ... until something better turns up. We all should IMO do what we can - and anything we can - to preserve and promote C-Quam till 'the cows come home' (sorry - bonza Oz expression). When something better comes along ... then let's go for it. + h a p p y c h r i s t m a s + Ian btw ... Good luck Scott with your home PC! From bjackson@indyradio.com Wed Dec 04 02:45:59 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 4 Dec 2002 10:45:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 80713 invoked from network); 4 Dec 2002 10:45:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Dec 2002 10:45:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Dec 2002 10:45:58 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.141] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 04 Dec 2002 10:45:58 -0000 Date: Wed, 04 Dec 2002 10:45:55 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: WOR/WLW nighttime IBOC testing, explained Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1780 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923" X-Originating-IP: 206.246.142.129 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 Because I have to be at WFMS at 4am, I didn't stay up last couple of nights to hear the battle of the hash...But I did set up a DAT running LP mode last night (starting at 8pm) on WLW (Carver tx-11a) and and a 120 minute tape on WGN (Sony SRF-42). On my way in this morning while scanning thru the tape, I did hear a lot of odd noises...At some points WGN just wasn't there at all (something that doesn't happen much here in Indy). At other times, there was what sounded like very fast paced morse code under the audio. Is that IBOC I was hearing? It seems like WOR is much more proud of their "Accomplishment" than WLW...Their site makes no mention of IBOC. Still, pretty sad for a station that, at one time, was certified by McIntosh as being Hi-Fi. -Brad Jackson -Susquehanna, Indianapolis -WGLD/WGRL/WFMS --- In amstereoforum@y..., "jsgilst" wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin T." wrote: > > > > > Also, the IBOC system actually exceeds the NRSC AM bandwidth > > standard.... sort of. As you can see on this graph: > > > > http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/nrsc.gif > > > > IBOC is designed to conform to the standard NRSC bandwidth limit, > > which is defined by the horizontal line which steps down to -25 dB > > from 10 to 20 kHz. However, the diagonal dashed line you see is the > > more strict NRSC limit for a "Standard Noise Test Signal" -- a > > special kind of WHITE NOISE transmitted for testing purposes. > IBOC's > > digital sidebands may not meet the exact specifications of this > > "noise" signal, but since it is essentially white noise, it could be > > construed as being bound to this stricter bandwidth limit -- which > it > > does not meet. Just something to think about.... > From philipr@irac.pe.ca Wed Dec 04 07:13:34 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 4 Dec 2002 15:13:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 65596 invoked from network); 4 Dec 2002 15:13:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Dec 2002 15:13:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.68) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Dec 2002 15:13:33 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.156] by n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 04 Dec 2002 15:13:33 -0000 Date: Wed, 04 Dec 2002 15:13:31 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: WOR nighttime IBOC testing Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 4525 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking I didn't even think to check last night, given that 720 CHTN is virtually in my back yard. But tonight I will give it a try with a highly selective, narrow band radio, e.g. the SW-77. My best bet would be to try to see what affect it would have on the Class A 50 kwer in Montreal on 690 khz. I can also see what effect it would have on the 10kwer in Newfoundland on 740 khz. I have also alerted my brothers, who are outside CHTN's 5 mv/m and 0.5 mv/m contours respectively, to keep an ear out for IBOC hash and see if there is any interference with CHTN. To the extent that any Canadian station's NIF contour is affected, I'm quite confident that complaints will be filed with Industry Canada. Love it or hate it, I can see the rationale for "tests" of IBOC at night - but they should be restricted to the early hours of the morning, until the technology has been proven harmless, in order to reduce possible negative effects on other broadcasters. In addition, I seriously question permitting testing at night on 50kw Class A stations relatively near the Canadian border. Once IBOC is carried via skywave accross an international boundary, the potential [double underline the word potential!] for an international incident exists, given that IBOC is not permitted in Canada. To the extent that it does not interfere with a Canadian station's NIF, there is not a lot that can be done. While it may be annoying to a Dxer, such as myself, the affected station is only promised a certain NIF contour, nothing more. To the extent that it does interfere with a stations NIF, I would hope the affected stations and their listeners will raise this matter with Industry Canada, and I would expect that Ottawa would deal with this through the various available channels, ranging from spectrum management to, if necessary, NAFTA. If this interference is as severe as it sounds, and it is not promptly rectified, its akin to jamming. To the extent WOR is unaware of the severity of the interference, that's one thing - to the extent that they are made aware of the severity of interference, and yet persist, is a matter for the best and brightest communication law specialists in Washington and Ottawa to ponder. If such testing can be permitted, presumably with full regulatory approval and full knowledge of its actual effects on spectrum management, and if such testing does in fact interefere with the NIF of one or more stations, then, by way of a purely hypothetical example, perhaps it could be appropriate, for experimentation purposes only, and with the full authorization of Industry Canada and the CRTC, for CFRA 580 Ottawa to run 50 kw in a circle at night, and for CJFX 580 Antigonish to run its 25kw in a circle at night, simultaneously, in an effort to test what affect this would have on 570, 580, and 590 in the eastern half of North America. The long term justification for this would be to reassess the interference potential between these two stations, and explore a new role for AM broadcasting in Canada as providing regional, interprovincial service, day and night. While CFRA would have the advantage of double the wattage, CJFX has the advantage of salt water ground conductivity and its impact on low angle skywave propagation. However, acting in reason, I expect the CRTC and Industry Canada to refuse wholeheartedly any such request for the "Battle of 580" based on clear, logical, technical arguments, along with common sense and respect for other broadcasters. Additionally, very likely neither CHUM Limited or Atlantic Broadcasters Limited would even think of making such am outrageous request, short of a real emergency. If nightime IBOC interference persists, even during this test stage, clear, logical, technical arguments, along with common sense and respect for other broadcasters will hopefully prevail and WOR will promptly do the right thing and cease this scale of testing as soon as they have been made fully aware of its nature and extent. If not, no doubt the FCC will revoke the authority for such testing. Otherwise, we just might be into a spectrum management war. Hopefully, cooler heads will prevail. Author's Disclaimer: Each paragraph of this post is intended to be read in conjunction with all other paragraphs. Selective quoting, without the full permission of the author, may be tantamount to libel if the effect or intent is to discredit the author or the AM Stereo Forum. Phil R. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Wed Dec 04 10:52:10 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 4 Dec 2002 18:52:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 71414 invoked from network); 4 Dec 2002 18:52:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Dec 2002 18:52:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.69) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Dec 2002 18:52:10 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.252] by n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 04 Dec 2002 18:52:10 -0000 Date: Wed, 04 Dec 2002 18:52:08 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: AM Stereo on 710 WOR Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 189 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics Well, sort of.... I just noticed that the "History" page on their web site shows both a GE Superadio III, and a Sony SRF-42 AM Stereo Walkman: http://www.wor710.com/History/history.htm From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Wed Dec 04 12:16:49 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 4 Dec 2002 20:16:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 94428 invoked from network); 4 Dec 2002 20:16:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Dec 2002 20:16:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14201.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.143) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Dec 2002 20:16:49 -0000 Message-ID: <20021204201649.39202.qmail@web14201.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.45.202.244] by web14201.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 04 Dec 2002 12:16:49 PST Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 12:16:49 -0800 (PST) Subject: WSM ought to be pis*ed To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio IF they are going to put a "radio Fax station" on the air on a frequency of 650 Kilohertz in the Amplitude Modulation band, then the good 'ole boys at WSM should be 'real happy' about that if it trashes their audio during the night. I truly beieve that WSM-AM is one station that is what a 'clear channel' frequency allocation is supposed to be about: a unique service (Grand Ole Opry) that can be heard over a very large area (several states on Saturday nights) for the benefit of the general public. If/when "Fax Radio 650" goes on the air in Maryland, WSM should see what happens when they turn their Cquam back on -if that quashes the IBOC or not? Also, I heard that the engineer at WSM hates IBOC - but then again, why did he turn off them Cquam if he isn't going to use IBOC at WSM? __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From KC4QLP@aol.com Wed Dec 04 12:51:31 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 4 Dec 2002 20:51:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 41458 invoked from network); 4 Dec 2002 20:51:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Dec 2002 20:51:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r08.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.104) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Dec 2002 20:51:06 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.99.30bdad0c (3842) for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 15:50:52 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <99.30bdad0c.2b1fc4ab@aol.com> Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 15:50:51 EST Subject: AM Stereo Exciter listed in Radio World used ads...for sale To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp I just received my December issue of Radio World today and was looking through the equipment ads in the back..and listed is an AM Stereo exciter. I thought I'd post it here for those of you looking for an exciter and had some money to spend...here it goes... Delta ASE-1 AM Stereo exciter,used 4 months,like new condition,$950. Bill Barry,WAMB,1617 Lebanon Rd, Nashville Tn 37210. 615-889-1960. I know I saw someone on here in just the past week mentioning trying to gather up some funds to buy an exciter for there station..but I forgot who it was. $950 is bad if you have the money to spend as I've seen these exciters go for almost this much on E-Bay when they do pop up Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From KC4QLP@aol.com Wed Dec 04 12:58:31 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 4 Dec 2002 20:58:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 65014 invoked from network); 4 Dec 2002 20:58:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Dec 2002 20:58:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d04.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.36) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Dec 2002 20:58:31 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.18d.12428bed (3842) for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 15:58:09 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <18d.12428bed.2b1fc660@aol.com> Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 15:58:08 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: WOR/WLW nighttime IBOC testing, explained To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/4/02 5:46:19 AM Eastern Standard Time, bjackson@indyradio.com writes: << At some points WGN just wasn't there at all (something that doesn't happen much here in Indy). At other times, there was what sounded like very fast paced morse code under the audio. Is that IBOC I was hearing? >> The IBOC carrier hash sounds like: SSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSHHHH HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH Thats probably what you heard wiping out WGN. Here in NC WLW and WOR were taking turns wiping each other out. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From ccuff@in4web.com Wed Dec 04 15:36:23 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 4 Dec 2002 23:36:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 36065 invoked from network); 4 Dec 2002 23:36:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Dec 2002 23:36:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Dec 2002 23:36:22 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.134]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 18:30:59 -0500 Message-ID: <000b01c29bec$c240a9c0$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: <99.30bdad0c.2b1fc4ab@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM Stereo Exciter listed in Radio World used ads...for sale Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 18:27:48 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 Here is what is heartbreaking about this post. This guy emailed me a while back, asking who sold am stereo radios? Here is a case where a station owner is gung-ho about stereo, but there is no incentive to use it if people cannot buy radios. Now the exciter is up for sale. I really wish I knew all the reasons why so many companies in Japan geared up (and built) am stereo radios, but why didn't they get marketed where it would have done some good? I do know that most were told not to bother with sending them here, as it was dead- but what made them stop producing them even in the Japan domestic market? WHY would a company stop making something that they were already tooled up for? We gotta do something here. Chris ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Wednesday, December 04, 2002 3:50 PM Subject: {AMSF} AM Stereo Exciter listed in Radio World used ads...for sale > I just received my December issue of Radio World today and was looking > through the equipment ads in the back..and listed is an AM Stereo exciter. > I thought I'd post it here for those of you looking for an exciter and had > some money to spend...here it goes... > > Delta ASE-1 AM Stereo exciter,used 4 months,like new condition,$950. Bill > Barry,WAMB,1617 Lebanon Rd, Nashville Tn 37210. 615-889-1960. From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Dec 04 16:16:05 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Dec 2002 00:16:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 71769 invoked from network); 5 Dec 2002 00:16:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Dec 2002 00:16:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.91) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 00:16:04 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 16:16:04 -0800 To: , , , , , , Subject: Letter to WOR and WLW Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 19:15:45 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 05 Dec 2002 00:16:04.0011 (UTC) FILETIME=[7F9C67B0:01C29BF3] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.152.181.82] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 The noise that was created by last night's test of WOR and WLW's IBOC signal was inexcusable. Normally clear WPTF 680 was wiped out by the noise from WLW, as was The Canadian clear 690. Both WLW and WOR were unlistenable due to mutual interference. The noise from WOR completely blocked out WGN 720 and made CHWO 740 unlistenable. WOR even caused some hiss in WSB 750's audio on my two better radios, A Sony ICF-2010 and GE SuperadioIII. The radios that I used to listen to the IBOC tests were: Toyota A56412 AM-FM-CD-Tape factory installed in my Toyota Tacoma Sangean ATS-818 on a Alpha-Delta DX-SWL Sloper Antenna GE SuperadioIII with the built-in Loppstick antenna Sony ICF-2010 on a Alpha-Delta DX-SWL Sloper Antenna and 4 foot open air loop AtwaterKent 36 on a Alpha-Delta DX-SWL Sloper Antenna Last night's tests proved that IBOC is not usable on the Medium Wave broadcast band. If stations want to use IBOC for skywave coverage, the FCC should set aside a new band for the purpose, such as one of the mostly unused "tropical" broadcast bands and the IBOC channels should be spaced at 20Khz. The best way to improve the existing AM band is to reduce night time noise levels and use the latest generation of Motorola's C-QUAM AM Stereo system. I have noticed that WOR's ratings have fell since the IBOC signal was put on the air. I have no doubt that the digital noise has caused listener tune-out. Kevin Raper, Engineer WFIS 1600AM From florida_amstereo@hotmail.com Wed Dec 04 16:32:12 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: florida_amstereo@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Dec 2002 00:32:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 72807 invoked from network); 5 Dec 2002 00:32:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Dec 2002 00:32:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.37.77) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 00:32:11 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 16:32:11 -0800 Received: from 209.240.198.61 by pv2fd.pav2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Thu, 05 Dec 2002 00:32:10 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Letter to WOR and WLW Date: Thu, 05 Dec 2002 00:32:10 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 05 Dec 2002 00:32:11.0317 (UTC) FILETIME=[C02B9650:01C29BF5] From: "Donn Tillman" X-Originating-IP: [209.240.198.61] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83914824 Great letter, Kevin...... I just hope your letter is read with open minds and maybe some of your suggestions taken seriously. I have not been able to observe any of the hash here yet. 710 here is the battle of Miami's 710 and Radio Havana's 710 (about 160 miles apart) trying to jam each other out. 710 in Miami is 50,000 watts day and 10,000 watts night(directional at night) and Radio Havana's 710 is estimated to be 100,000 watts day and night. Will have to check 700 WLW this evening; although their normal signal here is not that strong. Which leads me to the conclusion that there may be a good use for IBOC; it could be used in jamming; maybe the VOA,could broadcast in IBOC on the am band effectively jamming any Cuban stations near the frequency. (i.e. Radio Marti - 1180 am) donn st petersburg,fl ----Original Message Follows---- From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com To: ,,,,,, Subject: {AMSF} Letter to WOR and WLW Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 19:15:45 -0500 The noise that was created by last night's test of WOR and WLW's IBOC signal was inexcusable. Normally clear WPTF 680 was wiped out by the noise from WLW, as was The Canadian clear 690. Both WLW and WOR were unlistenable due to mutual interference. The noise from WOR completely blocked out WGN 720 and made CHWO 740 unlistenable. WOR even caused some hiss in WSB 750's audio on my two better radios, A Sony ICF-2010 and GE SuperadioIII. The radios that I used to listen to the IBOC tests were: Toyota A56412 AM-FM-CD-Tape factory installed in my Toyota Tacoma Sangean ATS-818 on a Alpha-Delta DX-SWL Sloper Antenna GE SuperadioIII with the built-in Loppstick antenna Sony ICF-2010 on a Alpha-Delta DX-SWL Sloper Antenna and 4 foot open air loop AtwaterKent 36 on a Alpha-Delta DX-SWL Sloper Antenna Last night's tests proved that IBOC is not usable on the Medium Wave broadcast band. If stations want to use IBOC for skywave coverage, the FCC should set aside a new band for the purpose, such as one of the mostly unused "tropical" broadcast bands and the IBOC channels should be spaced at 20Khz. The best way to improve the existing AM band is to reduce night time noise levels and use the latest generation of Motorola's C-QUAM AM Stereo system. I have noticed that WOR's ratings have fell since the IBOC signal was put on the air. I have no doubt that the digital noise has caused listener tune-out. Kevin Raper, Engineer WFIS 1600AM _________________________________________________________________ Add photos to your e-mail with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail From KC4QLP@aol.com Wed Dec 04 16:35:28 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Dec 2002 00:35:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 57823 invoked from network); 5 Dec 2002 00:35:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Dec 2002 00:35:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m04.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.7) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 00:35:28 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.63.15ed58d4 (3972) for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 19:35:02 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <63.15ed58d4.2b1ff936@aol.com> Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 19:35:02 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Letter to WOR and WLW To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/4/02 7:19:21 PM Eastern Standard Time, possumhunter@netzero.net writes: << The noise that was created by last night's test of WOR and WLW's IBOC signal was inexcusable. Normally clear WPTF 680 was wiped out by the noise from WLW, as was The Canadian clear 690. Both WLW and WOR were unlistenable due to mutual interference. >> Kevin...perhaps a copy of this email should be forwarded to your local and the national office of the FCC. Maybe if enough folks pipe in with what they heard and make it known to the right people...something will maybe be done about it. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Dec 04 17:01:27 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Dec 2002 01:01:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 99191 invoked from network); 5 Dec 2002 01:01:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Dec 2002 01:01:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.194) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 01:01:25 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 17:01:25 -0800 To: Subject: I heard WTTM For The First Time!!! Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 20:01:13 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 05 Dec 2002 01:01:25.0777 (UTC) FILETIME=[D5E8F010:01C29BF9] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.152.181.82] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Today, I heard WTTM come up out of the noise during critical hours (around 4:15 PM EDT) and had it solid until WTIR came up. I was able to still hear WTTM until they switched to low power. WOW! What GREAT audio, Neal. Is that a CRL Amigo in your air chain? If it is, I want one! Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Dec 04 17:16:39 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Dec 2002 01:16:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 77699 invoked from network); 5 Dec 2002 01:16:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Dec 2002 01:16:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.17) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 01:16:37 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 17:16:37 -0800 To: References: <63.15ed58d4.2b1ff936@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Letter to WOR and WLW Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 20:16:26 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 05 Dec 2002 01:16:37.0552 (UTC) FILETIME=[F55EC300:01C29BFB] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.152.181.82] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: > Kevin...perhaps a copy of this email should be forwarded to your local and the national office of the FCC. > Maybe if enough folks pipe in with what they heard and make it known to the right people...something will maybe be done about it. The FCC already got a that email. LOL What is being done to the AM broadcast band is disgusting. Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Dec 04 17:22:33 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: possumhunter@netzero.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Dec 2002 01:22:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 9249 invoked from network); 5 Dec 2002 01:22:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Dec 2002 01:22:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rly-ip05.mx.aol.com) (64.12.138.9) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 01:22:33 -0000 Received: from logs-tl.proxy.aol.com (logs-tl.proxy.aol.com [152.163.207.135]) by rly-ip05.mx.aol.com (v89.10) with ESMTP id RELAYIN4-1204202157; Wed, 04 Dec 2002 20:21:57 1900 Received: from ibm (AC98B552.ipt.aol.com [172.152.181.82]) by logs-tl.proxy.aol.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with SMTP id gB51IfL321518 for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 20:18:41 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <011301c29bfc$39d63a40$52b598ac@ibm> To: Subject: Fw: HD Radio Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 20:18:25 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Apparently-From: DodgeRamTrucker@aol.com From: "Possum Hunter" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ----- Original Message ----- From: Kerry Richards To: Possum Hunter Cc: Tom Ray Sent: Wednesday, December 04, 2002 8:04 PM Subject: HD Radio Kevin, I'm sorry you do like the HD radio scheme. 1.The majority of the radios you are listening on are NOT typical AM Radios. Ibiquity has spent thousands researching this issue and has the data to prove it. 2. AM Stereo via C-Quam is a dead issue. More stations have shut it off than those that are currently operating. It really never worked very well, especially here in the NYC metro area. Kahn's system although fraught with other issues actually has less platform shifting than C-Quam, but that is another issue entirely. I always thought it was funny that you could get some kind of stereo out of two AM Radios, one tuned up and one tuned down with the Kahn system. Sorry those days are long gone.. 3. The FCC and the NAB have endorsed this IBOC testing period, not any extra spectrum. It is very doubtful this will ever happen. 4. What makes you think WOR's ratings have dropped? Where did you get that data? I'm happy to tell you that is clearly not the case. If we had complaints from listeners, we do not know anything about it here. In fact, we have had positive responses, because with the reduced analog bandwidth, we are now louder on the dial on the majority of radios. Most of our responses to our HD questionnaire have to do with "Where can I get an HD Radio?". WOR is licensed to NYC, WLW to Cincinnati, we are not required to protect anywhere or anyone in South Carolina. I've seen some of your previous posts on various message boards, the only thing I think you might be right on is the level of the digital carriers, during Critical Hours and at Nighttime. This is why Ibiquity is conducting these tests. We may have different settings in the end for the carriers, day and night. I'm trying to keep an open mind about this. I can tell you from the Horse's mouth that the initial response has been very positive. Some of the tests have been very good. Minimal interference outside the primary service area. We have had no disastrous reports of interference such as you claim, from anywhere. The latest Ibiquity software produces an excellent digital signal, its far better than C-Quam could ever be. I know because I hear it every day on the IBOC receiver. The only complaints like yours seem to come from those pushing AM Stereo or some other agenda which is so unrealistic, and therefore in our estimation from the other end of the Horse. If I were you, I'd wait and see the complete test results before passing judgement on this new technology. Thanks for you interest in WOR-HD. Kerry Richards Chief Engineer WOR-AM Buckley Broadcasting Corporation [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From evergreenterrace@buzzle.com Wed Dec 04 17:34:50 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: evergreenterrace@buzzle.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Dec 2002 01:34:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 8889 invoked from network); 5 Dec 2002 01:34:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Dec 2002 01:34:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 01:34:49 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.137] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 05 Dec 2002 01:34:49 -0000 Date: Thu, 05 Dec 2002 01:34:49 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: WOR/WLW nighttime IBOC testing, explained Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 296 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgliradio" X-Originating-IP: 170.20.11.59 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=69711087 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgliradio > If the two "Big boys" on 700 and 710 can trash 60Khz+ of bandwidth, does > that mean I can unplug the NRSC Optimod and put my Kahn Symmetra- Peak, DAP > 310, and Universal Audio BL-40 Modulimiter back in the air chain? I thought about this as well. At least that would be less disturbing! From KC4QLP@aol.com Wed Dec 04 17:36:58 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Dec 2002 01:36:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 23151 invoked from network); 5 Dec 2002 01:36:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Dec 2002 01:36:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m08.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.163) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 01:36:58 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.42.31a51adf (3972) for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 20:36:52 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <42.31a51adf.2b2007b4@aol.com> Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 20:36:52 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Letter to WOR and WLW To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/4/02 8:18:02 PM Eastern Standard Time, possumhunter@netzero.net writes: << The FCC already got a that email. LOL What is being done to the AM broadcast band is disgusting. >> Isnt that the truth ....I've listen to the mess with the narrowest of narrow radios that I have and the noise just seems to pop up where it shouldnt be popping up. Glad I caught the testing last night...it would have been a real mess outside with the field strengh meter away from any man made noise....well it was cold enough last night..24 degrees and wind chill of 16...but tonight its 32..wind chill of 25 and dropping and a mix bag of stuff falling out of the sky. One things is for sure..its colder here than what the weather guessers said it would be. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From KC4QLP@aol.com Wed Dec 04 18:07:58 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Dec 2002 02:07:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 73064 invoked from network); 5 Dec 2002 02:07:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Dec 2002 02:07:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r03.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.99) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 02:07:57 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.190.11b1b621 (3972) for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 21:07:53 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <190.11b1b621.2b200ef9@aol.com> Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 21:07:53 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fw: HD Radio To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/4/02 8:24:28 PM Eastern Standard Time, possumhunter@netzero.net writes: << 1.The majority of the radios you are listening on are NOT typical AM Radios. Ibiquity has spent thousands researching this issue and has the data to prove it. >> I'd like to see this "data".I've listen on comunications receivers...we are talking about tight bandpasses here and I still here the "noise".Seems like there is an agenda here and its more than just attacking various groups and making assumptions about everyone. I read an interesting write up written by Skip Pizzi in this months radio world.From what I gathered,his take is that the FCC is making the same mistakes that they made with AM Stereo and its doomed for failure...no matter how much they hype it up. Sad thing I noticed while reading these write-ups on IBOC...what was written is the same hash that you can read on WOR's web site! Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From KC4QLP@aol.com Wed Dec 04 18:17:55 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Dec 2002 02:17:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 68482 invoked from network); 5 Dec 2002 02:17:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Dec 2002 02:17:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d06.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.38) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 02:17:54 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.199.11a1945e (3972) for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 21:17:45 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <199.11a1945e.2b201149@aol.com> Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 21:17:45 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: WOR/WLW nighttime IBOC testing, explained To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/4/02 8:50:44 PM Eastern Standard Time, evergreenterrace@buzzle.com writes: << > If the two "Big boys" on 700 and 710 can trash 60Khz+ of bandwidth, does > that mean I can unplug the NRSC Optimod and put my Kahn Symmetra- Peak, DAP > 310, and Universal Audio BL-40 Modulimiter back in the air chain? I thought about this as well. At least that would be less disturbing! >> I know of a station...in an untold,unnamed place that took the NRSC filter out of line...made the audio go from sounding like a telephone broadcast to a normal sound.They also have an old Kahn Symmetra-Peak in the rack..whether it works or not is another story. Shame that station isnt closer to NYC! {grin} Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Dec 04 18:37:06 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Dec 2002 02:37:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 89109 invoked from network); 5 Dec 2002 02:37:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Dec 2002 02:37:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.118) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 02:37:05 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 18:37:05 -0800 To: "Kerry Richards" Cc: "Tom Ray" References: <002001c29bfa$45c43110$0101010a@studiok> Subject: Re: HD Radio Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 21:36:49 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 05 Dec 2002 02:37:05.0389 (UTC) FILETIME=[32FC39D0:01C29C07] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.152.181.82] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Kerry, Please don't think that I am anti-WOR or anti-technology, because I am just the opposite. I am very concerned about state of AM radio in general and the station that issues my paychecks in particular. At WFIS, we have done everything we can to make our audio the best possible and even helped other AM stations outside of our market do the same free of charge! We have converted our production and on-air studios to all digital and stereo, re-built out Harris SX1 transmitter, and now looking for C-QUAM gear that is priced within our small market budget. to answer your very valid points in your letter: 1. It is true that I have radios that the average "Joe" does not have, such as a 1930's vintage AtwaterKent, but there are millions of Toyota trucks with the factory radios on the road. There is a strong public interest in high quality AM radios. This has been proven by the brisk sales of the Sangean/ C-Crane CCRadio and GE's Superadio series. WFIS requires the make and model of radio used to receive a QSL card. The vast majority of QSLs have gone to those listeners with CCRadios. 2. I agree that Kahn's AM Stereo system worked better in night time listening conditions, but the newest Motorola chips have all but eliminated the platform motion that plagued the technology in the 80's. A C-QUAM signal on a high quality AM radio sounds MUCH better than 90% of the FMs. I do have a Part 15 station that is in Kahn Stereo, I am going to switch it to C-QUAM too. 3. IBOC isn't the first bad idea the FCC has endorsed. Canada has the right idea putting digital radio up on the L band so it does not interfere with AM and FM. 4. According to Arbitron, WOR is number 19 in the ratings with a 2.4 share. WOR was pulling a 2.5 before you stated testing the IBOC signal. Personally, If I was the GM, I would fire the PD and clean house if I couldn't pull better than a 2.4 in the nation's largest radio market with a 50,000 Watt clear channel station. 5. Most listeners don't gripe, they just change stations. 6. No matter what city you are licensed to, you are not allowed to splatter nearly 60Khz of bandwidth. My home is within the protected .5mv/Meter contour of WSB 750 and you are not allowed to splatter it with digital hash. Is it not a violation of International law to interfere with the Skywave signal of Canadian Clears? It is reasonable to expect the tests would Zap 690, but to blast 740's signal with digital noise is a bit much. 7. From what I have read on the HD radio system, reduction of the digital sidebands would cause too many drop-outs to make it useful. 8. High quality AM stereo is not unrealistic. This evening I was able to hear Neal Newman's WTTM 1680 during critical hours. Even on my Mono Factory Toyota radio, the sound quality was astounding. If I could get WFIS sounding like that, my boss might actually give me a raise! 9. Comparisons of which end of a horse we are coming from serves no useful purpose. I think we both have the same goal, the betterment of AM radio in general and the betterment of that stations that sign our paychecks in particular. It does concern me that the much higher levels and width of your sidebands is of no concern of yours. The higher noise level harms AM radio in general, not just one or two stations that are outside of your market. 10. It was both sad and disgusting to hear the low bandwidth analog audio and buzz on WLW, a station that was once certified by McIntosh Labs as High Fidelity. Kevin Raper Engineer WFIS 1600 Golden Strip Broadcasting, Inc. ----- Original Message ----- From: Kerry Richards To: Possum Hunter Cc: Tom Ray Sent: Wednesday, December 04, 2002 8:04 PM Subject: HD Radio Kevin, I'm sorry you do like the HD radio scheme. 1.The majority of the radios you are listening on are NOT typical AM Radios. Ibiquity has spent thousands researching this issue and has the data to prove it. 2. AM Stereo via C-Quam is a dead issue. More stations have shut it off than those that are currently operating. It really never worked very well, especially here in the NYC metro area. Kahn's system although fraught with other issues actually has less platform shifting than C-Quam, but that is another issue entirely. I always thought it was funny that you could get some kind of stereo out of two AM Radios, one tuned up and one tuned down with the Kahn system. Sorry those days are long gone.. 3. The FCC and the NAB have endorsed this IBOC testing period, not any extra spectrum. It is very doubtful this will ever happen. 4. What makes you think WOR's ratings have dropped? Where did you get that data? I'm happy to tell you that is clearly not the case. If we had complaints from listeners, we do not know anything about it here. In fact, we have had positive responses, because with the reduced analog bandwidth, we are now louder on the dial on the majority of radios. Most of our responses to our HD questionnaire have to do with "Where can I get an HD Radio?". WOR is licensed to NYC, WLW to Cincinnati, we are not required to protect anywhere or anyone in South Carolina. I've seen some of your previous posts on various message boards, the only thing I think you might be right on is the level of the digital carriers, during Critical Hours and at Nighttime. This is why Ibiquity is conducting these tests. We may have different settings in the end for the carriers, day and night. I'm trying to keep an open mind about this. I can tell you from the Horse's mouth that the initial response has been very positive. Some of the tests have been very good. Minimal interference outside the primary service area. We have had no disastrous reports of interference such as you claim, from anywhere. The latest Ibiquity software produces an excellent digital signal, its far better than C-Quam could ever be. I know because I hear it every day on the IBOC receiver. The only complaints like yours seem to come from those pushing AM Stereo or some other agenda which is so unrealistic, and therefore in our estimation from the other end of the Horse. If I were you, I'd wait and see the complete test results before passing judgement on this new technology. Thanks for you interest in WOR-HD. Kerry Richards Chief Engineer WOR-AM Buckley Broadcasting Corporation [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From n0uiheric@aol.com Wed Dec 04 18:38:34 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Dec 2002 02:38:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 87988 invoked from network); 5 Dec 2002 02:38:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Dec 2002 02:38:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d05.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 02:38:34 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-d05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.15c.17e296b2 (4340) for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 21:38:29 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <15c.17e296b2.2b201624@aol.com> Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 21:38:28 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fw: HD Radio To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih Hey, Kerry Richards SHOULD GET OUT OF THE RADIO BUSINESS, TOO! Isn't that typical of the LIES that the IBOC-DAB people spread? AM Stereo is ALIVE AND WELL. Besides, IBOC is UNAFFORDABLE. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Wed Dec 04 18:38:40 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Dec 2002 02:38:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 88139 invoked from network); 5 Dec 2002 02:38:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Dec 2002 02:38:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d07.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.39) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 02:38:40 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-d07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.78.321327c2 (4340) for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 21:38:30 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <78.321327c2.2b201625@aol.com> Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 21:38:29 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} WSM ought to be pis*ed To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih Their former Production Director, Tom Bryant (K4CDL), hates IBOC, too. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From groucho@skyweb.net Wed Dec 04 18:50:49 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Dec 2002 02:50:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 81162 invoked from network); 5 Dec 2002 02:50:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Dec 2002 02:50:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 02:50:48 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gB52u4Ii070366 for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 21:56:05 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DEEBE48.9636B5AA@skyweb.net> Date: Wed, 04 Dec 2002 21:47:36 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fw: HD Radio References: <011301c29bfc$39d63a40$52b598ac@ibm> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Cough cough gag.... I almost choked on my Dinner... Is this guy for Real? Hey I broke my neck back in 1995 and I'm on some really Good Stuff .. . I don't know Kerry at all, .But after reading the Below. hell would Like to take some of the stuff he is taking they seem to be Better than what Im taking.. I think that someone locked him in a room and pumped His head full of stuffing His ears must Be clogged remember we are all wrong and He is Right. someone's been feeding him stuff He knows nothing about. its the Corporate world and the CE is now a pencil pusher Not a techie" ."In theory it works so in the real world it Must work" I believe its called Brainwashed.... a good example would Be take a blind man and place a heat lamp Near him and tell him that its the Sun and its the middle of the day...... after a few Months of this... you place him out in a field in the Middle of the Night with the heat lamp On.. I will bet he would tell you that its the Middle of the day and when you ask how he knows this he will reply... "cant you feel the heat of the sun". As for Kerry ...for him to say that" It really never worked very well, especially here in the NYC metro area." He really has No Idea of what he is talking about.. He should listen to WTTM ,WPAT,WCTC, and WPHT..I forgot the other 3 that I can hear.. Yes Kerry is Right the Kahn system is Gone....It was not accepted by the FCC.. C-Quam was.... Gee If C-Quam is a dead issue why are More stations looking to add it? IBOC is also Quam Based( I could be wrong here but from my HD road show book I'm Not). Yes the FCC and NAB have endorsed this IBOC testing period no argument there.. But after the results they may Not Endorse IBOC at all .. its Only a testing period... "WOR is licensed to NYC, WLW to Cincinnati, we are not required to protect anywhere or anyone in South Carolina." Well he had better look into the Regs again... Because He is not allowed to interfere with another station. that's why there is an adjacent channel protection rule.. and they are slamming several other stations. " Minimal interference outside the primary service area. We have had no disastrous reports of interference such as you claim, from anywhere" Just Wait It has not hit the Fan just YET.... Today I took a drive to one of the stations that's adjacent to WOR... that stations Engineer and I had a really nice tech talk over Lunch. in our conversation I asked If he noticed a Problem with his signal lately.. He had Mentioned that he was getting this weird hiss on his Signal, and didn't know where it was coming from and he had tried Everything to find It.. with No Luck... Lets just Say on the drive back to his station I turned on My radio and scanned up and down the Dial and Showed him.. He was totally supprised He even went to one of the HD road shows and Had No idea that the testing had started.. He now knows where the hiss is coming From and is not a happy camper... all I did was open his Eyes. before today he was a Blind man with no Idea.. I guess as the saying goes" He who Does not know Does Not Complain" I am sure we will be hearing about it in the near Future. anyone else want to take a trip to their Friendly radio station near them and open some Eyes... "The only complaints like yours seem to come from those pushing AM Stereo or some other agenda which is so unrealistic" I really like My AM stereo. I am not pushing any other station to Do it unless they ask For my help. as far as agenda Yes I have one.. and its realistic. IBOC is bad News. It causes too much interference on the Adjacent stations.. I want to see IBOC Gone... Its going to ruin the AM broadcast band not Improve it.. I personally don't need to wait to see the results of the Tests. I have a brain and all I have to do is turn on ANY AM receiver and Listen to what's going on. But I forgot the Stations that are testing( notice I didn't Mention the Calls) think they are In the Right and allowed to Interfere with an Adjacent station because "*** is licensed to NYC, *** to Cincinnati, we are not required to protect anywhere or anyone in South Carolina." I didn't say it.... they Did........ Neal Possum Hunter wrote: > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Kerry Richards > To: Possum Hunter > Cc: Tom Ray > Sent: Wednesday, December 04, 2002 8:04 PM > Subject: HD Radio > > Kevin, > > I'm sorry you do like the HD radio scheme. > > 1.The majority of the radios you are listening on are NOT typical AM Radios. Ibiquity has spent thousands researching this issue and has the data to prove it. > > 2. AM Stereo via C-Quam is a dead issue. More stations have shut it off than those that are currently operating. It really never worked very well, especially here in the NYC metro area. Kahn's system although fraught with other issues actually has less platform shifting than C-Quam, but that is another issue entirely. I always thought it was funny that you could get some kind of stereo out of two AM Radios, one tuned up and one tuned down with the Kahn system. Sorry those days are long gone.. > > 3. The FCC and the NAB have endorsed this IBOC testing period, not any extra spectrum. It is very doubtful this will ever happen. > > 4. What makes you think WOR's ratings have dropped? Where did you get that data? I'm happy to tell you that is clearly not the case. > > If we had complaints from listeners, we do not know anything about it here. In fact, we have had positive responses, because with the reduced analog bandwidth, we are now louder on the dial on the majority of radios. Most of our responses to our HD questionnaire have to do with "Where can I get an HD Radio?". > > WOR is licensed to NYC, WLW to Cincinnati, we are not required to protect anywhere or anyone in South Carolina. > > I've seen some of your previous posts on various message boards, the only thing I think you might be right on is the level of the digital carriers, during Critical Hours and at Nighttime. This is why Ibiquity is conducting these tests. We may have different settings in the end for the carriers, day and night. I'm trying to keep an open mind about this. > > I can tell you from the Horse's mouth that the initial response has been very positive. Some of the tests have been very good. Minimal interference outside the primary service area. We have had no disastrous reports of interference such as you claim, from anywhere. The latest Ibiquity software produces an excellent digital signal, its far better than C-Quam could ever be. I know because I hear it every day on the IBOC receiver. > > The only complaints like yours seem to come from those pushing AM Stereo or some other agenda which is so unrealistic, and therefore in our estimation from the other end of the Horse. > > If I were you, I'd wait and see the complete test results before passing judgement on this new technology. > > Thanks for you interest in WOR-HD. > > Kerry Richards > Chief Engineer > WOR-AM > Buckley Broadcasting Corporation > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Dec 04 18:53:07 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Dec 2002 02:53:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 1475 invoked from network); 5 Dec 2002 02:53:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Dec 2002 02:53:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.86) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 02:53:07 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 18:53:07 -0800 To: References: <199.11a1945e.2b201149@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: WOR/WLW nighttime IBOC testing, explained Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 21:52:54 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 05 Dec 2002 02:53:07.0000 (UTC) FILETIME=[70266B80:01C29C09] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.152.181.82] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: > I know of a station...in an untold,unnamed place that took the NRSC filter out of line...made the audio go from sounding like a telephone broadcast to a normal sound.They also have an old Kahn Symmetra-Peak in the rack..whether it works or not is another story. That Symmetra-Peak driving a DAP310 driving a BL40 was the clear winner of the loudness wars of the early '80s! It would sure stand out on today's AM dial! The mod meter would just sit on 99% Neg and 125 Pos, and never move during a song! Lord have mercy was that thing LOUD! Needless to say, that air chain wouldn't work well on a classical station. > > Shame that station isn't closer to NYC! {grin} LOL If they can splatter with digital, I see nothing wrong with splattering with analog. Seems fair to me! Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From KC4QLP@aol.com Wed Dec 04 19:16:22 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Dec 2002 03:16:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 57367 invoked from network); 5 Dec 2002 03:16:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Dec 2002 03:16:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m06.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.161) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 03:16:20 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.b8.32dceb66 (3972) for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 22:16:14 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 22:16:14 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fw: HD Radio To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/4/02 9:52:46 PM Eastern Standard Time, groucho@skyweb.net writes: << Just Wait It has not hit the Fan just YET.... Today I took a drive to one of the stations that's adjacent to WOR... that stations Engineer and I had a really nice tech talk over Lunch. in our conversation I asked If he noticed a Problem with his signal lately.. He had Mentioned that he was getting this weird hiss on his Signal, and didn't know where it was coming from and he had tried Everything to find It.. with No Luck... Lets just Say on the drive back to his station I turned on My radio and scanned up and down the Dial and Showed him.. He was totally supprised He even went to one of the HD road shows and Had No idea that the testing had started.. He now knows where the hiss is coming From and is not a happy camper... all I did was open his Eyes. before today he was a Blind man with no Idea.. I guess as the saying goes" He who Does not know Does Not Complain" I am sure we will be hearing about it in the near Future. anyone else want to take a trip to their Friendly radio station near them and open some Eyes... >> Good work Neal! Now if ALL of the stations that are operating on670,680,690,720,730,and 740 are contacted and pose the same question to them....then if they are noticing something different,and show them where the "noise" is coming from....hehehe..can you imagion the stir that will create?..not only at WLW and WOR...but now we are talking at the FCC's door step! If those being affected by this interference lay low and just let this happen,then certainly AM radio will get a heavy dose of "hash" before the industry realizes that IBOC isnt the goose that laid the golden egg for AM radio. Something else thats been mentioned a few times with regards to Canada....does anyone have any feel for what the Canadian stations feel about this threat? {I've got the nails...who has the hammer and the coffin for IBOC?} Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From KC4QLP@aol.com Wed Dec 04 19:21:04 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Dec 2002 03:21:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 52786 invoked from network); 5 Dec 2002 03:21:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Dec 2002 03:21:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d03.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.35) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 03:21:04 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.50.1560a395 (3972) for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 22:20:59 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <50.1560a395.2b20201b@aol.com> Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 22:20:59 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: WOR/WLW nighttime IBOC testing, explained To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/4/02 9:54:34 PM Eastern Standard Time, possumhunter@netzero.net writes: << That Symmetra-Peak driving a DAP310 driving a BL40 was the clear winner of the loudness wars of the early '80s! It would sure stand out on today's AM dial! The mod meter would just sit on 99% Neg and 125 Pos, and never move during a song! Lord have mercy was that thing LOUD! Needless to say, that air chain wouldn't work well on a classical station. > > Shame that station isn't closer to NYC! {grin} LOL If they can splatter with digital, I see nothing wrong with splattering with analog. Seems fair to me! >> hmm...now I'm gonna have to check that out and see if that unit in some unnamed nondisclosed location is working and test it out...hehehe ...maybe give that Washington DC station a dose of its own "medicine" thats on 980 thats contantly rapping everything up 20 miles away during daylight hours in the winter time. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From groucho@skyweb.net Wed Dec 04 19:33:55 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Dec 2002 03:33:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 3368 invoked from network); 5 Dec 2002 03:33:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Dec 2002 03:33:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 03:33:54 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gB53dCIi082301 for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 22:39:12 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DEEC864.BE119862@skyweb.net> Date: Wed, 04 Dec 2002 22:30:44 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} I heard WTTM For The First Time!!! References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Nope NO CRL in My chain My audio chain consists of a Radio Systems 12 channel Console into the TFT EAS Out of the EAS into a DBX 266 Compressor.( I did that to try to Control the output peaks from the DJ's to the Broadcast phone lines) Using my Hewlett Packard 4935A transmission test set with a 1k tone with an output of 0db into a mic channel on the Console Gave me at 100% a +4db output into the Compressor which in turn Gives me 0 db output to the phone lines. the Phone company set-up the 2 balanced 15kc broadcast lines so that at 0db in gave me 0db they use -10db as a reference.. and that's what I have an Equalized line at -10db across the board from 25hz to15kc Now at the Transmitter side 22 miles away from the studio( Can you say that's alot of Copper). It comes out of the Telco box into RITZ( Smart caster audio switch box) the smart caster plays the TOH ID's and whatever public Service programs I program it to play) anyway from the Ritz switch box Directly into My Orban 9100B stereo Optimod. the Left out into the left right out into the right of the Harris AMS-1 Stereo exciter. The Stereo Exciter Gives me the L+R audio out which is connected to the analog audio in of the DX 10 transmitter the L-R is composite from the BNC that Excites the transmitter the DX 10 has a BNC port for an external oscilator(exciter).. nothing special about My audio Chain... I believe in the KISS.. Keep it Simple stupid.. Most music today is on CD's and when they make CD's today they have already Compressed the Sound with all the Processing you will ever need.. Ever hear a Bad SONY WALKMAN CD PLayer? I think not.. that is why Most FM's sound like crap.. the are using more processing on top of the already Processed Program thats on the CD... If I was Running a station that was all Vinyl records I would have alot More Processing.. with CD's its Not necessary I almost Forgot the transmitter is Set-up so that with a 1 k tone at 0db gives me 100% modulation. But I am running +123% -95% Very Cool. glad you Finally got to hear the signal.. did you get it in Full Stereo?with pilot? WTIR is a Pain in My Butt... they seem to own the east coast all the way to Canada I just wish I didn't have to play by the Rules and Power down... as you can Figure out I power down I'm gone.... If you hear them well you determine if they are or Not doing what they are supposed to. You can tell I power down.. Neal . Possum Hunter wrote: > Today, I heard WTTM come up out of the noise during critical hours (around > 4:15 PM EDT) and had it solid until WTIR came up. I was able to still hear > WTTM until they switched to low power. > > WOW! What GREAT audio, Neal. Is that a CRL Amigo in your air chain? If it > is, I want one! > > Long live FREE RADIO! > > Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ > Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Dec 04 19:34:34 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: possumhunter@netzero.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Dec 2002 03:34:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 79558 invoked from network); 5 Dec 2002 03:34:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Dec 2002 03:34:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rly-ip05.mx.aol.com) (64.12.138.9) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 03:34:33 -0000 Received: from logs-tl.proxy.aol.com (logs-tl.proxy.aol.com [152.163.207.135]) by rly-ip05.mx.aol.com (v89.10) with ESMTP id RELAYIN5-1204223356; Wed, 04 Dec 2002 22:33:56 1900 Received: from ibm (AC98B552.ipt.aol.com [172.152.181.82]) by logs-tl.proxy.aol.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with SMTP id gB53VgL282568 for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 22:31:42 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <01ae01c29c0e$ce650f80$52b598ac@ibm> To: Subject: Fw: [AM740] Letter to WOR and WLW Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 22:31:20 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Apparently-From: DodgeRamTrucker@aol.com From: "Possum Hunter" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Brian Smith" To: Sent: Wednesday, December 04, 2002 7:20 PM Subject: Re: [AM740] Letter to WOR and WLW > I want to thank you for keeping me in the loop on these tests. Sounds like a complete boondoggle > down there. They have to realize at some point that AM IBOC is not going to work. Or keep spending > money on a system that will ruin rather than help AM. > > Brian Smith > AM 740 > ------------ > > > The noise that was created by last night's test of WOR and WLW's IBOC signal > was inexcusable. Normally clear WPTF 680 was wiped out by the noise from > WLW, as was The Canadian clear 690. Both WLW and WOR were unlistenable due > to mutual interference. The noise from WOR completely blocked out WGN 720 > and made CHWO 740 unlistenable. WOR even caused some hiss in WSB 750's audio > on my two better radios, A Sony ICF-2010 and GE SuperadioIII. > > The radios that I used to listen to the IBOC tests were: > Toyota A56412 AM-FM-CD-Tape factory installed in my Toyota Tacoma > Sangean ATS-818 on a Alpha-Delta DX-SWL Sloper Antenna > GE SuperadioIII with the built-in Loppstick antenna > Sony ICF-2010 on a Alpha-Delta DX-SWL Sloper Antenna and 4 foot open air > loop > AtwaterKent 36 on a Alpha-Delta DX-SWL Sloper Antenna > > Last night's tests proved that IBOC is not usable on the Medium Wave > broadcast band. If stations want to use IBOC for skywave coverage, the FCC > should set aside a new band for the purpose, such as one of the mostly > unused "tropical" broadcast bands and the IBOC channels should be spaced at > 20Khz. > > The best way to improve the existing AM band is to reduce night time noise > levels and use the latest generation of Motorola's C-QUAM AM Stereo system. > I have noticed that WOR's ratings have fell since the IBOC signal was put on > the air. I have no doubt that the digital noise has caused listener > tune-out. > > Kevin Raper, Engineer WFIS 1600AM > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AM740-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Dec 04 19:34:37 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: possumhunter@netzero.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Dec 2002 03:34:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 75098 invoked from network); 5 Dec 2002 03:34:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Dec 2002 03:34:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rly-ip05.mx.aol.com) (64.12.138.9) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 03:34:36 -0000 Received: from logs-tl.proxy.aol.com (logs-tl.proxy.aol.com [152.163.207.135]) by rly-ip05.mx.aol.com (v89.10) with ESMTP id RELAYIN5-1204223356; Wed, 04 Dec 2002 22:33:56 1900 Received: from ibm (AC98B552.ipt.aol.com [172.152.181.82]) by logs-tl.proxy.aol.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with SMTP id gB53UtL432802 for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 22:30:55 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <01a801c29c0e$b256bfa0$52b598ac@ibm> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fw: HD Radio Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 22:30:40 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Apparently-From: DodgeRamTrucker@aol.com From: "Possum Hunter" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: >does anyone have any feel for what the Canadian stations feel about this threat? I have been in contact with the guys at CHWO 740, and they ain't real happy about having their Skywave signal hashed by IBOC. > > {I've got the nails...who has the hammer and the coffin for IBOC?} I have the hammer....and a Passload Nailgun! Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From KC4QLP@aol.com Wed Dec 04 20:10:28 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Dec 2002 04:10:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 81705 invoked from network); 5 Dec 2002 04:10:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Dec 2002 04:10:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m03.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.6) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 04:10:26 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.8f.2609bcac (3310) for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 23:10:24 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <8f.2609bcac.2b202bb0@aol.com> Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 23:10:24 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fw: HD Radio To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/4/02 10:35:54 PM Eastern Standard Time, possumhunter@netzero.net writes: << >does anyone have any feel for what the Canadian stations feel about this threat? I have been in contact with the guys at CHWO 740, and they ain't real happy about having their Skywave signal hashed by IBOC. > > {I've got the nails...who has the hammer and the coffin for IBOC?} I have the hammer....and a Passload Nailgun! >> I wonder what CHWO - 740 can do about this interference problem.....can the ..I forget the name of the gov agency for Canadian communications....cant they get their 2 and a half cents in on this? I mean if all of us common everyday radio listeners and engineers..here on this forum and the other AM radio forums and just plain nonforum members are "wrong"....then someone outside of this country and other stations getting hammered need to start making some noise...a lot of it and the noise loud. Oh...I forgot,...who has the backhoe to dig the grave? {grin} Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Dec 04 20:13:53 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Dec 2002 04:13:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 82423 invoked from network); 5 Dec 2002 04:13:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Dec 2002 04:13:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.84) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 04:13:52 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 20:13:52 -0800 To: References: <3DEEC864.BE119862@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} I heard WTTM For The First Time!!! Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 23:13:40 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 05 Dec 2002 04:13:52.0837 (UTC) FILETIME=[B87E7750:01C29C14] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.152.181.82] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Neal Newman wrote: > glad you Finally got to hear the signal.. did you get it in Full Stereo?with pilot? No I was in my truck making a sales call, but the sound was awsome on my factory Toyota radio. I need to convert that thing to AM stereo. > > WTIR is a Pain in My Butt... they seem to own the east coast all the way to Canada. How do they get away with running 10KW 24/7? > > I just wish I didn't have to play by the Rules and Power down... as you can Figure out I power down I'm gone. Perhaps WTTM can do some DX tests at 10KW > >... If you hear them well you determine if they are or Not doing what they are supposed to. You can tell I power down. It is very clear that WTIR is at full power all of the time. If there is anything I can do about it, or the group can do, I will do it. Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Dec 04 20:36:58 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Dec 2002 04:36:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 82835 invoked from network); 5 Dec 2002 04:36:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Dec 2002 04:36:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.121) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 04:36:56 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 20:36:56 -0800 To: References: <8f.2609bcac.2b202bb0@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fw: HD Radio Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 23:36:40 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 05 Dec 2002 04:36:56.0784 (UTC) FILETIME=[F1640500:01C29C17] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.152.181.82] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: >I wonder what CHWO - 740 can do about this interference problem.....can the ..I forget the name of the gov agency for Canadian communications....cant they get their 2 and a half cents in on this? Hey I think I will send a copy of my letter to Industry Canada http://www.ic.gc.ca/ (The Canadian FCC) and CBC. I am sure they would be very interested in it! > > I mean if all of us common everyday radio listeners and engineers..here on this forum and the other AM radio forums and just plain nonforum members are "wrong"....then someone outside of this country and other stations getting hammered need to start making some noise...a lot of it and the noise loud. We don't have the money that Ibiquity has, but if we can get Motorola behind us...... We should also send a loud and clear message to the NAB and get our stations to get out of the NAB. > > Oh...I forgot,...who has the backhoe to dig the grave? {grin} I will pay to RENT ONE! In fact I am sure I can get one on a trade-out. LOL Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From KC4QLP@aol.com Wed Dec 04 20:47:05 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Dec 2002 04:47:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 56803 invoked from network); 5 Dec 2002 04:47:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Dec 2002 04:47:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m03.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.6) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 04:47:04 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.5a.1510a632 (3310) for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 23:47:00 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <5a.1510a632.2b203444@aol.com> Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 23:47:00 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fw: HD Radio To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/4/02 11:37:39 PM Eastern Standard Time, possumhunter@netzero.net writes: << Hey I think I will send a copy of my letter to Industry Canada http://www.ic.gc.ca/ (The Canadian FCC) and CBC. I am sure they would be very interested in it! I'm sure they would be very v e r y interested to see what American radio is going to do to Canadian radio.Certainly there has to be some sort of international things here in regards to American stations using IBOC and the interfence issues at hand. < We don't have the money that Ibiquity has, but if we can get Motorola behind < us...... < We should also send a loud and clear message to the NAB and get our stations Oh...I forgot,...who has the backhoe to dig the grave? {grin} I will pay to RENT ONE! In fact I am sure I can get one on a trade-out. LOL >> Oh me...wouldnt that be a fun one to explain to the bean counters...LOL! Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From michaelj@vcn.com Wed Dec 04 20:49:35 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Dec 2002 04:49:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 81218 invoked from network); 5 Dec 2002 04:49:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Dec 2002 04:49:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m1-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 04:49:35 -0000 Received: from michael (unverified [209.193.86.36]) by m1-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 21:49:35 -0700 To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} Fw: HD Radio Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 21:49:05 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 In-Reply-To: <15c.17e296b2.2b201624@aol.com> Importance: Normal From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I AGREE! Says Michael J whilst listening to his Alfredo Lite AM STEREO broadcast on a Delco UX-1, just after coming in from the car listening to KEVA AM STEREO 1240! MJR n WYO. -----Original Message----- From: n0uiheric@aol.com [mailto:n0uiheric@aol.com] Sent: Wednesday, December 04, 2002 7:38 PM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fw: HD Radio Hey, Kerry Richards SHOULD GET OUT OF THE RADIO BUSINESS, TOO! Isn't that typical of the LIES that the IBOC-DAB people spread? AM Stereo is ALIVE AND WELL. Besides, IBOC is UNAFFORDABLE. 73 and good DX from Eric [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From groucho@skyweb.net Wed Dec 04 20:50:01 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Dec 2002 04:50:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 99983 invoked from network); 5 Dec 2002 04:50:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Dec 2002 04:50:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 04:50:00 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gB54tIIi001575 for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 23:55:18 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DEEDA5F.6484EBF6@skyweb.net> Date: Wed, 04 Dec 2002 23:47:27 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fw: HD Radio References: <5a.1510a632.2b203444@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 BOB Im on Echolink WAKEUP lol KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 12/4/02 11:37:39 PM Eastern Standard Time, > possumhunter@netzero.net writes: > > << Hey I think I will send a copy of my letter to Industry Canada > http://www.ic.gc.ca/ (The Canadian FCC) and CBC. I am sure they would be > very interested in it! > > I'm sure they would be very v e r y interested to see what American radio > is going to do to Canadian radio.Certainly there has to be some sort of > international things here in regards to American stations using IBOC and the > interfence issues at hand. > > < We don't have the money that Ibiquity has, but if we can get Motorola behind > < us...... > < We should also send a loud and clear message to the NAB and get our stations > > Well good luck with Motorola..seems they have their own agenda as well,but > stranger things have happened. > One other thing we dont have that iBiquity currently has is the "we dont care > attitude what you think,...we are right you are wrong,why are you here > bugging us with interfence complaints etc etc etc etc [fades out into IBOC > hash...sssssssss]" {think I might have struck a nerve with Neal on that > one...lol} > > > Oh...I forgot,...who has the backhoe to dig the grave? {grin} > I will pay to RENT ONE! In fact I am sure I can get one on a trade-out. LOL > >> > Oh me...wouldnt that be a fun one to explain to the bean counters...LOL! > > Bob Carter > Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group > > WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 > Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 > > Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering > services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. > e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net > http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice > Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC > WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC > WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC > Ray Communications Radio Network > > AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- > amstereo-subcribe@topica.com > > KC4QLP Amateur Radio > Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va > www.kc4qlp.cjb.net > > voice contact-252-335-0856 > fax 1-209-254-8978 > _______________________________________________________ > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Dec 04 20:53:58 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: possumhunter@netzero.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Dec 2002 04:53:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 3097 invoked from network); 5 Dec 2002 04:53:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Dec 2002 04:53:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rly-ip05.mx.aol.com) (64.12.138.9) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 04:53:57 -0000 Received: from logs-tl.proxy.aol.com (logs-tl.proxy.aol.com [152.163.207.135]) by rly-ip05.mx.aol.com (v89.10) with ESMTP id RELAYIN10-1204235327; Wed, 04 Dec 2002 23:53:27 1900 Received: from ibm (AC98B552.ipt.aol.com [172.152.181.82]) by logs-tl.proxy.aol.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with SMTP id gB54ooL89257 for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 23:50:51 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <01f201c29c19$dcac73c0$52b598ac@ibm> To: Subject: Fw: Crtc Confirmation #82634 Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 23:50:38 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Apparently-From: DodgeRamTrucker@aol.com From: "Possum Hunter" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 ----- Original Message ----- From: "CRTC_Client_Services" To: Sent: Wednesday, December 04, 2002 11:48 PM Subject: Crtc Confirmation #82634 Notre numéro de référence: 82634 Voici ce que vous avez écrit au CRTC le 12/4/2002 11:45:08 PM Our Reference number: 82634 This is what you wrote to the CRTC on 12/4/2002 11:45:08 PM Plese do forgive me if I am sending this to the wrong person or agency, as I am not very familliar with the Canadian government or who regulates Canadian AM radio stations. WOR 710 and WLW 700 caused interference to over 80Khz of radio spectrum blanking out the AM clears from 670Khz to 750Khz. I have sent a copy of this letter to CHWO and I am sending it to the CBC. The following is a Letter I wrote to WOR and WLW about the interference caused by their night time on-air testing of IBOC Digital AM Radio: The noise that was created by last night's test of WOR and WLW's IBOC signal was inexcusable. At My Location in Piedmont, SC, Normally clear WPTF 680 was wiped out by the noise from WLW, as was The Canadian clear 690. Both WLW and WOR were unlistenable due to mutual interference. The noise from WOR completely blocked out WGN 720 and made CHWO 740 unlistenable. WOR even caused some hiss in WSB 750's audio on my two better radios, A Sony ICF-2010 and GE SuperadioIII. The radios that I used to listen to the IBOC tests were: Toyota A56412 AM-FM-CD-Tape factory installed in my Toyota Tacoma Sangean ATS-818 on a Alpha-Delta DX-SWL Sloper Antenna GE SuperadioIII with the built-in Loopstick antenna Sony ICF-2010 on a Alpha-Delta DX-SWL Sloper Antenna and 4 foot open air loop AtwaterKent 36 on a Alpha-Delta DX-SWL Sloper Antenna Last night's tests proved that IBOC is not usable on the Medium Wave broadcast band. If stations want to use IBOC for skywave coverage, the FCC should set aside a new band for the purpose, such as one of the mostly unused "tropical" broadcast bands and the IBOC channels should be spaced at 20Khz. The best way to improve the existing AM band is to reduce night time noise levels and use the latest generation of Motorola's C-QUAM AM Stereo system. I have noticed that WOR's ratings have fell since the IBOC signal was put on the air. I have no doubt that the digital noise has caused listener tune-out. Kevin Raper, WFIS 1600AM ---------------------------------------------- Merci d'avoir communiqué avec le CRTC. Si vous désirez obtenir de l'information ou déposer une plainte dirigée vers les entreprises que nous règlementons, nous recommuniquerons avec vous d'ici 10 jours ouvrables. S'il s'agit d'une question URGENTE, TEL LE DÉBRANCHEMENT DE SERVICES, veuillez communiquer avec nos Services à la clientèle au numéro sans frais 1-877-249-2782. Si vous appelez, nous vous prions d'aviser nos représentants que vous nous avez déjà envoyé un message. Si vous désirez joindre un document électronique ou modifier votre message original, veuillez répondre directement à cet accusé de réception. ---------------------------------------------- Thanks for contacting the CRTC. If you requested information or filed a complaint about one of the companies we regulate, we'll contact you again within 10 working days. If the matter is URGENT, SUCH AS DISCONNECTION OF SERVICES, please call our toll-free Client Services line at 1-877-249-2782. If you do call, please let our representatives know that you've already sent us a message. If you would like to send an email attachment or update your original message, please reply directly to this acknowledgement. 1-877-249-2782 /info@crtc.gc.ca/ télécopieur/facsimile (819) 994-0218 Conseil de la radiodiffusion et des télécommunications canadiennes / Ottawa, Ontario K1A 0N2 Canadian Radio-television and Telecommunications Commission / Ottawa, Ontario K1A 0N2 From michaelj@vcn.com Wed Dec 04 20:57:02 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Dec 2002 04:57:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 33643 invoked from network); 5 Dec 2002 04:57:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Dec 2002 04:57:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m1-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 04:57:01 -0000 Received: from michael (unverified [209.193.86.36]) by m1-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 21:57:01 -0700 To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} Fw: HD Radio Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 21:56:29 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Okay....you're forgetting something here, guys. I guess I should say I'm speaking for Kerry's next response because I'm sure he would say it too. The ultimate goal of all this is to eventually have ALL AM stations converted to IBOC. Does one IBOC station interfere with another one? That really is a good question, now isn't it? Say I'm in the middle somewhere. I dunno....Pennsylvania? Kentucky? Well I don't know my eastern states well....but seriously. If I'm equidistant from Cincinatti and New York and I can get both......is the IBOC hash from one going to interfere with the ability to pick up the other one digitally? Hmmmmmmm........ Ever thought about that? Has anyone ever asked this question? Let's say this goes all the way and all AM's become IBOC. Will you even be able to listen to one AM station that is 20 or 30 khz away from another one? Will the stronger one come in digitally in IBOC while the other one will be forced into analog 4.5khz mode with trashy artifacts from the stronger one? If not, then I imagine this is Ibiquity, Kerrry, and the FCC's reponse. "well one day we expect all AM's to be IBOC and at that point they'll all be IBOC an no one will be listening in analog anyway so you won't be able to hear the digital hash anyway." interesting thoughts, huh?' MJR n WYO -----Original Message----- From: KC4QLP@aol.com [mailto:KC4QLP@aol.com] Sent: Wednesday, December 04, 2002 8:16 PM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fw: HD Radio Good work Neal! Now if ALL of the stations that are operating on670,680,690,720,730,and 740 are contacted and pose the same question to them....then if they are noticing something different,and show them where the "noise" is coming from....hehehe..can you imagion the stir that will create?.. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From michaelj@vcn.com Wed Dec 04 20:58:15 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Dec 2002 04:58:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 9022 invoked from network); 5 Dec 2002 04:58:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Dec 2002 04:58:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m1-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.31) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 04:58:15 -0000 Received: from michael (unverified [209.193.86.36]) by m1-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 21:58:15 -0700 To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} I heard WTTM For The First Time!!! Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 21:57:44 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 In-Reply-To: <3DEEC864.BE119862@skyweb.net> Importance: Normal From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit LOVE THAT RADIO SYSTEMS CONSOLE!!!!! We have the same one on our FM station here! I wired it all up meself! EASY to work on and the gang at Radio Systems is WONDERFUL when it comes to support! MJR n WYO -----Original Message----- From: Neal Newman [mailto:groucho@skyweb.net] Sent: Wednesday, December 04, 2002 8:31 PM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} I heard WTTM For The First Time!!! Nope NO CRL in My chain My audio chain consists of a Radio Systems 12 channel Console into the TFT EAS Out of the EAS into a DBX 266 Compressor.( I did that to try to Control the output peaks from the DJ's to the Broadcast phone lines) Using my Hewlett Packard 4935A transmission test set with a 1k tone with an output of 0db into a mic channel on the Console Gave me at 100% a +4db output into the Compressor which in turn Gives me 0 db output to the phone lines. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Dec 04 21:09:40 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Dec 2002 05:09:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 58524 invoked from network); 5 Dec 2002 05:09:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Dec 2002 05:09:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.84) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 05:09:38 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 21:09:38 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} I heard WTTM For The First Time!!! Date: Thu, 5 Dec 2002 00:09:25 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 05 Dec 2002 05:09:38.0275 (UTC) FILETIME=[8287CB30:01C29C1C] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.152.181.82] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Michael J. Richard wrote: > LOVE THAT RADIO SYSTEMS CONSOLE!!!!! We have the same one on our FM station here! I wired it all up meself! EASY to work on and the gang at Radio Systems is WONDERFUL when it comes to support! I like my Behringer Eurodesk console in the air studio. I want another one for the Prod room. I am looking for a stereo mixer for my Part 15 station too. Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Dec 04 21:18:39 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Dec 2002 05:18:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 62319 invoked from network); 5 Dec 2002 05:18:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Dec 2002 05:18:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.206) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 05:18:39 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 4 Dec 2002 21:18:39 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fw: HD Radio Date: Thu, 5 Dec 2002 00:18:26 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 05 Dec 2002 05:18:39.0184 (UTC) FILETIME=[C4EFF500:01C29C1D] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.152.181.82] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Michael J. Richard wrote: > I AGREE! > Says Michael J whilst listening to his Alfredo Lite AM STEREO broadcast on a Delco UX-1, I am listening to my mono broadcast with my "New" Gates Level Devil in the audio chain to my BTA1R. Ahhhhh I do love that sound I wish RCA still made transmitters! Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From KC4QLP@aol.com Wed Dec 04 22:09:18 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Dec 2002 06:09:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 51072 invoked from network); 5 Dec 2002 06:09:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Dec 2002 06:09:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m05.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.8) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 06:09:17 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.144.43752b4 (3310) for ; Thu, 5 Dec 2002 01:09:12 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <144.43752b4.2b204788@aol.com> Date: Thu, 5 Dec 2002 01:09:12 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fw: HD Radio To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/4/02 11:58:17 PM Eastern Standard Time, michaelj@vcn.com writes: << Does one IBOC station interfere with another one? That really is a good question, now isn't it? Say I'm in the middle somewhere. I dunno....Pennsylvania? Kentucky? Well I don't know my eastern states well....but seriously. If I'm equidistant from Cincinatti and New York and I can get both......is the IBOC hash from one going to interfere with the ability to pick up the other one digitally? >> Right at the moment it doesnt matter and shouldnt matter if you can pick up both stations digitally....who has a digital radio other than the folks running the test? If you chase away the audience listening in the analog mode now....who is to say that the audience will be there when or if everything goes digital? The system of IBOC is a good idea to bring a sense of higher quality audio to stations...but it should not come at the expence of analog interference...it has to be compatable like AM Stereo or it just isnt going to fly. Besides..whats not broke..dont fix it....the only thing broke with radio is the programming these days and receiver quality. BTW Neal I'll be home in a jiffy if your still up on Echolink Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From kevtronics@yahoo.com Wed Dec 04 23:30:00 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Dec 2002 07:29:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 15889 invoked from network); 5 Dec 2002 07:29:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Dec 2002 07:29:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.87) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 07:29:58 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.171] by n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 05 Dec 2002 07:29:58 -0000 Date: Thu, 05 Dec 2002 07:29:55 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: hi-fi AM Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <199.11a1945e.2b201149@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2286 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.71.130 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > I know of a station...in an untold,unnamed place that took the NRSC > filter out of line...made the audio go from sounding like a > telephone broadcast to a normal sound.They also have an old Kahn > Symmetra-Peak in the rack..whether it works or not is another > story. Shame that station isnt closer to NYC! {grin} In the summer of 2000, "New York's Urban Mix" 1600 WWRL right in 'the Big Apple' broadcast with 25,000 watts of unlimited-bandwidth C-Quam AM Stereo. There was no NRSC filter in sight; I measured up to at least 17 kHz of audio response coming from WWRL's transmitter. With top-notch audio processing, including a "StereoMaxx Spatial Image Enlarger" (from Modulation Sciences Inc.), WWRL was absolutely magnificent to listen to; on any good AM Stereo radio, they sounded much better than FM; the same music on FM sounded especially "wimpy" and "lifeless" in comparison. The StereoMaxx gave WWRL a uniquely "bombastic" sound that was very distinctive. Unfortunately, for reasons that were never fully explained, WWRL's AM Stereo disappeared in early August of 2000, and shortly afterwards they re-enabled the 10 kHz NRSC audio filter, to complement their boring mono sound. And now since the fall of 2001, WWRL has been transmitting in Kahn Power-Side, so it is unlikely their C-Quam AM Stereo will return any time soon -- much to their detriment, as WWRL's ratings were at their highest during their hi-fi AM Stereo days; since then, they have dropped to the point where they don't even show up on the NYC Arbitron chart anymore. Coincidence? I think not! For those of you who have time to download MP3 files, here are some of 1600 WWRL's hi-fi AM Stereo days that I recorded myself on a Sony SRF-A100 radio, at my home in NJ which is actually outside of their 0.5 mV/m daytime coverage area -- but yet the sound is still perfectly crisp and clear: ftp://209.193.86.116/North-America/USA/NewYork/wwrlnews.mp3 ftp://209.193.86.116/North-America/USA/NewYork/wwrlhist.mp3 ftp://209.193.86.116/North-America/USA/NewYork/wwrl-16s.mp3 ftp://209.193.86.116/North-America/USA/NewYork/wwrl-mix.mp3 The day that IBOC can sound as good as this, without splattering all over the band, is the day that I give up on AM Stereo -- not a second sooner! From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Dec 05 01:06:40 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Dec 2002 09:06:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 53098 invoked from network); 5 Dec 2002 09:06:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Dec 2002 09:06:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.64) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 09:06:38 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.153] by n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 05 Dec 2002 09:06:38 -0000 Date: Thu, 05 Dec 2002 09:06:37 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: the Kevtronimod Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1177 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.71.130 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics The real key to AM Stereo's excellent sound quality is the audio processing that AM Stereo stations use. And as such, I'm constantly tinkering with the processing of my own low-power AM Stereo station, 1500 "KJFE"... which I like to refer to as the "Kevtronimod". I recorded one high quality example of what it sounds like with rather relaxed processing -- about 300% volume limiting and 140% Stereo expansion, as compared to the maximum 700% volume limiting and 500% Stereo expansion that it can put out. It's just a simple single-band system, and there is no compression or AGC used -- the limiter takes care of everything. In this case, a 15 kHz audio bandwidth was used, for true high fidelity sound. The file is rather big (5.4 megs), but I think it's well worth the download time: http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/kjfehifi.mp3 Of course, besides audio processing, music variety is another key ingredient for making an excellent radio station -- and the Kevtronimod takes it all in stride, as you'll hear a Dottie West song from dynamic LP vinyl immediately followed by a modern pop tune from Westlife that is already highly processed on the CD. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Dec 05 01:27:45 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Dec 2002 09:27:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 51571 invoked from network); 5 Dec 2002 09:27:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Dec 2002 09:27:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 09:27:42 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.141] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 05 Dec 2002 09:27:42 -0000 Date: Thu, 05 Dec 2002 09:27:42 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: one improvement at WOR Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 800 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.71.130 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics In these latest nighttime tests of IBOC digital on 710 WOR, I have noticed one minor improvement over before... with the IBOC on, their analog audio bandwidth has been extended to 6.2 kHz or so, up from IBOC's standard 5.0 kHz limit... although this is "cheating" because the digital carriers begin just above 5 kHz in the spectrum and the analog audio isn't supposed to "step" on them. Also, from looking at the specs, IBOC *does* use a pilot tone -- it's somewhere around 150 Hz, I believe, but it's phase-modulated, so regular mono radios won't hear it -- but if you are listening in "forced" AM Stereo, such as on a Sony or MetroSound radio, it contributes to the strange "motorboating" noise you get from the IBOC digital signal, in addition to the high frequency HISSSSS of course. From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Thu Dec 05 05:53:22 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Dec 2002 13:53:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 39521 invoked from network); 5 Dec 2002 13:53:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Dec 2002 13:53:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14206.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.173.70) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 13:53:19 -0000 Message-ID: <20021205135319.29403.qmail@web14206.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.45.202.244] by web14206.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 05 Dec 2002 05:53:19 PST Date: Thu, 5 Dec 2002 05:53:19 -0800 (PST) Subject: Can anybody help? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio I recently bought a radio from a wrecked '96 Cadillac Deville, and I'm wondering if anybody can help me get it into service? I believe that it has AM stereo too. Can anybody help me with the following: * I am looking for the 32-pin connector diagram. * Somebody said this has the GM 'theftlock' feature, but I don't see any indication of that in the way of logos or anything. Ideas? * If is Theftlock, does that mean this ends up in the parts bin and is not usuable in a second life as a 'tabletop' radio instead? * Others have said that even the airbags and car computer need to be connected to run this beast? Real nice, make something 'landfill material' when it could be recycled as a radio again? I wanna do some AMS DX - help! __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Thu Dec 05 06:26:47 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Dec 2002 14:26:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 51015 invoked from network); 5 Dec 2002 14:26:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Dec 2002 14:26:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14201.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.143) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 14:26:44 -0000 Message-ID: <20021205142644.37163.qmail@web14201.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.45.202.244] by web14201.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 05 Dec 2002 06:26:44 PST Date: Thu, 5 Dec 2002 06:26:44 -0800 (PST) Subject: Better to give, then maybe you'll 'receive' To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Cc: ABDX@topica.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio Hello all – Holiday Suggestion: Write a very nice letter and drop it in the snailmail (which is even better than an email) or even better yet, send a Christmas Card / Holiday Card to the engineer at your local (former) AM Stereo station. Ask him (or her?) if they would be kind enough to restore the C-Quam stereo AM during the week of Christmas so that listeners traveling about during the Christmas holidays could hear their Christmas music broadcast Christmas Eve and Day in STEREO AM? Be nice to him; remember, Santa’s watching! Maybe even do the same for the 50KW 1A clear frequency stations as well (I hate to use the term ‘clear channel’ for those stations). For just 37 cents it would be a nice holiday present for yourself, so think about mailing your lonely AM engineer a card, c/o the station, to restore the AMS for the holidays (maybe they’ll forget to turn it off too) as a few days a year in AM stereo is better then no days a year. Let all of us know how you fare. __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From philipr@irac.pe.ca Thu Dec 05 06:33:31 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Dec 2002 14:33:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 35314 invoked from network); 5 Dec 2002 14:33:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Dec 2002 14:33:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 14:33:30 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.185] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 05 Dec 2002 14:33:24 -0000 Date: Thu, 05 Dec 2002 14:33:24 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Better to give, then maybe you'll 'receive' Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20021205142644.37163.qmail@web14201.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 1588 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking Great idea - in Canada its 49 cents for a domestic stamp? What's=20 the price of a stamp in Australia? Phil R. Only former AM stereo station anywhere near my area is CHNS. I=20 should get their address! CKHJ [formerly CIHI] and CJCB are just too=20 fringe, and play C&W - but what the heck - I'll put 'em on my list=20 too! Phil R. --- In amstereoforum@y..., "John P." wrote: > Hello all =96 Holiday Suggestion: Write a very nice letter and drop=20 it in the > snailmail (which is even better than an email) or even better yet,=20 send a > Christmas Card / Holiday Card to the engineer at your local=20 (former) AM Stereo > station.=20=20 > Ask him (or her?) if they would be kind enough to restore the C- Quam stereo AM > during the week of Christmas so that listeners traveling about=20 during the > Christmas holidays could hear their Christmas music broadcast=20 Christmas Eve and > Day in STEREO AM? Be nice to him; remember, Santa's watching!=20=20 Maybe even do > the same for the 50KW 1A clear frequency stations as well (I hate=20 to use the > term `clear channel' for those stations). >=20 > For just 37 cents it would be a nice holiday present for yourself,=20 so think > about mailing your lonely AM engineer a card, c/o the station, to=20 restore the > AMS for the holidays (maybe they'll forget to turn it off too) as=20 a few days a > year in AM stereo is better then no days a year. Let all of us=20 know how you > fare. >=20 >=20 > __________________________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. > http://mailplus.yahoo.com From philipr@irac.pe.ca Thu Dec 05 06:40:46 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Dec 2002 14:40:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 94478 invoked from network); 5 Dec 2002 14:40:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Dec 2002 14:40:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.68) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 14:40:45 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.162] by n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 05 Dec 2002 14:40:44 -0000 Date: Thu, 05 Dec 2002 14:40:42 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: YIKES! Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 109 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking YIKES! How could I forget about CFCY? They used to broadcast in stereo before the change to C&W. Phil R. From groucho@skyweb.net Thu Dec 05 07:57:39 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Dec 2002 15:57:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 1662 invoked from network); 5 Dec 2002 15:57:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Dec 2002 15:57:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 15:57:38 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gB5G2sIi089741 for ; Thu, 5 Dec 2002 11:02:55 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DEF76D4.B84FB811@skyweb.net> Date: Thu, 05 Dec 2002 10:55:00 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fw: HD Radio References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 I will reply to this..... Michael the answer is an Easy one... Ibiquity is testing up in warren NJ on 1700 with a small "50 wattIBOC "station.. its really at 100 watts but wont go there.. and its trashing My station on 1680 for a 3 radial Mile area from their location when its on the air.. this is Not just hearsay from my listeners. I personally drove the area. so they cannot dispute my claim . from 1700 down to 1680... Now just imagine 2 10kw stations me on 1680 with IBOC and 1660 with IBOC both within 40 miles of each other if 1700 can Interfere with 1680 Don't you think 1680 would hash on 1660 You bet it will and 1660 would hash 1680.. radio disney is on 1650 and a MD station is on 1690... If they all ran IBOC.. the Expanded band would Not exist because our Digital would destroy each other..example. 710 is the analog audio the Digital is heard on 700 and 720..... up on 1700 is the analog its digital is on 1690 and 1710 so this is where it gets nuts.. start at the bottom If all the above stations were IBOC. 1650 would have Digital hash on 1640 and 1660 there Goes the Pennsy TIS system they are all on 1640.. the 1660 hash would be right on 1660's analog 1660's Digital would be Ontop of 1650's Digital also 1660's digital would be on 1670.... Now 1680 would have Digital on 1670 and 1690. so the 2 1670 digital signals clash.. and the 1690 digital would hash the MD 1690 analog of course 1690's digital would be Right on top of the 1680 analog did I confuse you yet? It would create a real Mess.. this is not theory this is Real... and these are just 10kw stations.. I get hammered almost Nightly from WTIR in Florida and occasionally WJNZ just figure them into the Picture If they too were IBOC and it was allowed at night.... Now finally Put this picture together with 25kw and 50 Kw stations From 660 680,690 700,710,720,730,740,750,760,770 Upto 880.. it is Not a pretty picture.... Right Now with just 1 station testing from my listening position everything from 680 to 740 is being HASHED. not necessary to say trashed But Hash is a better word for it I can just picture it now with several NY stations running this mode the Entire band had Better become digital. and AM radios as we know them would Be no more. I just wonder if Ibiquity is going to replace the Millions of useless AM radios that are in existing Cars Because I wont pay to replace mine if it aint broke. They want me to hear their Digital Format let them give me a radio after I hear it maybe Ill decide If its better I do have an open mind on this. NOW THAT'S A BRAINSTORM.. Let them supply us with radios during this test period. and let us all hear what this format actually sounds Like.. Hell they are interfering with millions of Listeners.. with only a hand full Of receivers. lets hear what all this is about. I'm willing to be a test subject Neal . "Michael J. Richard" wrote: > Okay....you're forgetting something here, guys. I guess I should say I'm > speaking for Kerry's next response because I'm sure he would say it too. > The ultimate goal of all this is to eventually have ALL AM stations > converted to IBOC. Does one IBOC station interfere with another one? That > really is a good question, now isn't it? Say I'm in the middle somewhere. > I dunno....Pennsylvania? Kentucky? Well I don't know my eastern states > well....but seriously. If I'm equidistant from Cincinatti and New York and > I can get both......is the IBOC hash from one going to interfere with the > ability to pick up the other one digitally? > Hmmmmmmm........ > Ever thought about that? > Has anyone ever asked this question? Let's say this goes all the way and > all AM's become IBOC. Will you even be able to listen to one AM station > that is 20 or 30 khz away from another one? Will the stronger one come in > digitally in IBOC while the other one will be forced into analog 4.5khz mode > with trashy artifacts from the stronger one? > If not, then I imagine this is Ibiquity, Kerrry, and the FCC's reponse. > "well one day we expect all AM's to be IBOC and at that point they'll all be > IBOC an no one will be listening in analog anyway so you won't be able to > hear the digital hash anyway." > > interesting thoughts, huh?' > > MJR n WYO > > -----Original Message----- > From: KC4QLP@aol.com [mailto:KC4QLP@aol.com] > Sent: Wednesday, December 04, 2002 8:16 PM > To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fw: HD Radio > > Good work Neal! > Now if ALL of the stations that are operating on670,680,690,720,730,and > 740 > are contacted and pose the same question to them....then if they are > noticing > something different,and show them where the "noise" is coming > from....hehehe..can you imagion the stir that will create?.. > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From michaelj@vcn.com Thu Dec 05 08:46:58 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Dec 2002 16:46:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 12356 invoked from network); 5 Dec 2002 16:46:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Dec 2002 16:46:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m1-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.31) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 16:46:57 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m1-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Thu, 5 Dec 2002 09:46:56 -0700 Message-ID: <003a01c29c7d$eca86860$0701010a@keva> To: References: <3DEF76D4.B84FB811@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fw: HD Radio Date: Thu, 5 Dec 2002 09:46:56 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Uh-huh! That's EXACTLY what I thought. It's going to be a MESS! Don't you think if all stations are IBOC that their own digital hash will trash each other??? Wonder why they didn't think of this. And Neal, you beat me to it as well. OKAY...I will have an open mind about this. You want to sell me on IBOC? Then give me a receiver. I ain't gonna pay the high price when what I've got right now ain't broke. Someone mentioned earlier something about the FCC approving this and how can all stations afford the upgrade? They CAN'T! So how will it happen? Just like Digital TV. The FCC will MANDATE a date that ALL stations MUST be IBOC. THAT will be the final step in forcing this sh*t down our throats. MJR n WYO ----- Original Message ----- From: Neal Newman To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, December 05, 2002 8:55 AM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fw: HD Radio I will reply to this..... Michael the answer is an Easy one... Ibiquity is testing up in warren NJ on 1700 with a small "50 wattIBOC "station.. its really at 100 watts but wont go there.. and its trashing My station on 1680 for a 3 radial Mile area from their location when its on the air.. this is Not just hearsay from my listeners. I personally drove the area. so they cannot dispute my claim . from 1700 down to 1680... Now just imagine 2 10kw stations me on 1680 with IBOC and 1660 with IBOC both within 40 miles of each other if 1700 can Interfere with 1680 Don't you think 1680 would hash on 1660 You bet it will and 1660 would hash 1680.. radio disney is on 1650 and a MD station is on 1690... If they all ran IBOC.. the Expanded band would Not exist because our Digital would destroy each other..example. 710 is the analog audio the Digital is heard on 700 and 720..... up on 1700 is the analog its digital is on 1690 and 1710 so this is where it gets nuts.. start at the bottom If all the above stations were IBOC. 1650 would have Digital hash on 1640 and 1660 there Goes the Pennsy TIS system they are all on 1640.. the 1660 hash would be right on 1660's analog 1660's Digital would be Ontop of 1650's Digital also 1660's digital would be on 1670.... Now 1680 would have Digital on 1670 and 1690. so the 2 1670 digital signals clash.. and the 1690 digital would hash the MD 1690 analog of course 1690's digital would be Right on top of the 1680 analog [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From philipr@irac.pe.ca Thu Dec 05 09:48:29 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Dec 2002 17:48:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 4153 invoked from network); 5 Dec 2002 17:48:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Dec 2002 17:48:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 17:48:28 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.177] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 05 Dec 2002 17:48:28 -0000 Date: Thu, 05 Dec 2002 17:48:09 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fw: HD Radio Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <003a01c29c7d$eca86860$0701010a@keva> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3288 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking Perhaps WOR or Ibiquity, for that matter, would see fit to lend one of our members within WOR's digital coverage area an HD receiver [perhaps for a week] for their evaluation. If IBOC is so wonderful on a digital receiver, it would be a great way to make their point. Of course, if a formal request is made to them, and they refuse, it makes our point! If they are at all serious about IBOC aka HD, they would have a few demos Phil R. P.S. If their excuse is that the receiver weighs 50 lbs., tell them Kevin T., Neal or whomever else will bring a friend to help them lift this "portable radio" into the trunk of their car. --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Michael J. Richard" wrote: > Uh-huh! That's EXACTLY what I thought. It's going to be a MESS! Don't you think if all stations are IBOC that their own digital hash will trash each other??? Wonder why they didn't think of this. > And Neal, you beat me to it as well. OKAY...I will have an open mind about this. You want to sell me on IBOC? Then give me a receiver. I ain't gonna pay the high price when what I've got right now ain't broke. Someone mentioned earlier something about the FCC approving this and how can all stations afford the upgrade? They CAN'T! So how will it happen? Just like Digital TV. The FCC will MANDATE a date that ALL stations MUST be IBOC. THAT will be the final step in forcing this sh*t down our throats. > > MJR n WYO > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Neal Newman > To: amstereoforum@y... > Sent: Thursday, December 05, 2002 8:55 AM > Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fw: HD Radio > > > I will reply to this..... > Michael the answer is an Easy one... > Ibiquity is testing up in warren NJ on 1700 with a small "50 wattIBOC > "station.. > its really at 100 watts but wont go there.. and its trashing My station on 1680 > for a 3 radial Mile area from their location when its on the air.. this is Not > just hearsay from my listeners. I personally drove the area. so they cannot > dispute my claim . > from 1700 down to 1680... > Now just imagine 2 10kw stations me on 1680 with IBOC and 1660 with IBOC > both within 40 miles of each other if 1700 can Interfere with 1680 Don't you > think 1680 would hash on 1660 > You bet it will and 1660 would hash 1680.. radio disney is on 1650 and a MD > station is on 1690... If they all ran IBOC.. the Expanded band would Not exist > because our Digital would destroy each other..example. 710 is the analog audio > the Digital is heard on 700 and 720..... up on 1700 is the analog its digital > is on 1690 and 1710 > so this is where it gets nuts.. > start at the bottom If all the above stations were IBOC. 1650 would have > Digital hash on 1640 and 1660 there Goes the Pennsy TIS system they are all on > 1640.. > the 1660 hash would be right on 1660's analog 1660's Digital would be Ontop of > 1650's Digital also 1660's digital would be on 1670.... Now 1680 would have > Digital on 1670 and 1690. so the 2 1670 digital signals clash.. and the 1690 > digital would hash the MD 1690 analog of course 1690's digital would be Right on > top of the 1680 analog > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Dec 05 11:20:46 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: possumhunter@netzero.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Dec 2002 19:20:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 31853 invoked from network); 5 Dec 2002 19:20:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Dec 2002 19:20:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rly-ip03.mx.aol.com) (64.12.138.7) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 19:20:45 -0000 Received: from logs-mtc-tg.proxy.aol.com (logs-mtc-tg.proxy.aol.com [64.12.102.135]) by rly-ip03.mx.aol.com (v89.10) with ESMTP id RELAYIN9-1205142001; Thu, 05 Dec 2002 14:20:01 1900 Received: from ibm (ACAA1233.ipt.aol.com [172.170.18.51]) by logs-mtc-tg.proxy.aol.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with SMTP id gB5JJ6p166984 for ; Thu, 5 Dec 2002 14:19:06 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <00e401c29c93$27fcce00$5a93b498@aoldsl.net> To: Subject: Fw: WOR/WLW Date: Thu, 5 Dec 2002 14:18:54 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Apparently-From: DodgeRamTrucker@aol.com From: "Possum Hunter" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ----- Original Message ----- From: Tom Ray To: possumhunter@netzero.net Sent: Thursday, December 05, 2002 1:47 PM Subject: WOR/WLW I would strongly disagree with your statements, particularly the statement about hiss caused by WOR to WSB. This is impossible, as the IBOC carriers are dead in the water at 725kHz. There are no emissions beyond this frequency. Unless you are listening with an extremely broad band radio, which is not the case of most listeners. Since you are in the business, I would also assume that you understand that your paycheck is made possible from the advertising sold within your 0.5mV/M contour, not on skywave. My main area of concern is WOR's 0.5mV/M coverage area, and the rules do not state that I need to protect WLW, and WLW has no obligation to protect me, outside an area slightly greater than this. The bottom line is that WOR's signal was not impacted within our 0.5mV/M contour. This is what pays my mortgage, and with Sirius and XM radios flying off the shelves here in the NY metro area, I fully intend to protect and defend my paycheck: I have two kids who depend on it. While it's nice that people in Florida like to listen to WOR on skywave, it does not add to WOR's bottom line. And if this testing were not done, we would not have data to work with. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Dec 05 11:53:13 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Dec 2002 19:53:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 97710 invoked from network); 5 Dec 2002 19:53:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Dec 2002 19:53:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.18) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 19:53:11 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 5 Dec 2002 11:53:11 -0800 To: References: <6DF6CA3C7B44D411827C06000000000005AF9F4B@MB-BP-05> Subject: Re: WOR's Interference to CHWO Date: Thu, 5 Dec 2002 14:52:57 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 05 Dec 2002 19:53:11.0141 (UTC) FILETIME=[F0A93150:01C29C97] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.170.18.51] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Thank you for your prompt reply. I tried to receive CBU 690. It was being splattered by WLW 700's IBOC Digital noise I then tried to receive CKAC 730 and CHWO 740. Both had severe buzz from WOR 710's IBOC Digital noise. When WLW and WOR is broadcasting a standard analog AM signal, I can receive CBU and CKAC pretty good, and CHWO 740 normally has a city grade signal at my location in Greenville County, South Carolina. I was able to make a positive ID on the source of the noise. I measured WLW 700's IBOC bandwidth at +- 25Khz on each side of 700Khz and I measured WOR 710's bandwidth at +- 30Khz making their signal 60 Khz wide! In contrast, I have measured CHWO 740's bandwidth to be +-9Khz, the legal NRSC standard. I thought US AM stations have to protect the Canadian Clears. When I worked for WPJM 800, we had to protect CKLW 800. I am sure that the high noise level of WOR's IBOC Digital carrier, and the short distance from New York City and the Canadian border would make WOR' IBOC noise interfere with Canadian stations in Canada. I live within the .5mv/Meter contour of WSB 750, and WOR's IBOC noise even caused hiss in WSB's audio at my house. I am a frequent listener of CHWO 740, and I would hate to loose my reception of that station. Thank you for your time and attention to this matter. Kevin Raper ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, December 05, 2002 1:37 PM Subject: RE: WOR's Interference to CHWO > Hello Mr. Raper: > > Your complaint as referenced in the subject of this e-mail has been > forwarded to me for a reply. I have a number of questions regarding your > complaint and if you could clarify, I will attempt to resolve your > complaint. > > First of all, I would like to know which station or stations you > were trying to receive and secondly, if you were able to identify the > interfering station. > > If you are a US resident, I might inform you that US stations are > not required to protect Canadian stations over US land mass and that the > reception of CHWO is not guaranteed over US. In any case, your answers to > above question might help me in understanding your complaint better. > > Thanks a lot. > > Kirit > From michaelj@vcn.com Thu Dec 05 11:57:41 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Dec 2002 19:57:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 47502 invoked from network); 5 Dec 2002 19:57:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Dec 2002 19:57:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m1-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 19:57:41 -0000 Received: from michael (unverified [209.193.86.58]) by m1-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Thu, 5 Dec 2002 12:57:41 -0700 To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} Audio File Uploaded Date: Thu, 5 Dec 2002 12:57:01 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hey I recognize that lite AC network :) That's Jones Radio's "AC" network. We run that one on our FM during the day. Nice airchecks Brad. The noise sounds familiar, though. I get the same kind of interference around my apartment outside. And I don't have any touch lamps. Sounds almost like TV or computer buzzing...mabye VCR or satellite. I get it all over the dial and I don't know what it is or where it's coming from. MJR n WYO -----Original Message----- From: bradleyj923 [mailto:bjackson@indyradio.com] Sent: Monday, December 02, 2002 8:59 PM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Audio File Uploaded As promised, over the weekend I made a scoped aircheck of WZZB's light AC format. I made it while at my sisters house for Thanksgiving (about 15-20 miles from the tower as the crow flies)...However, since she has almost all touch lamps, there is a slight buzzing from those (I hate those stupid lights)...especially in the last part of the MP3 (after night power). [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Dec 05 11:59:44 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Dec 2002 19:59:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 77370 invoked from network); 5 Dec 2002 19:59:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Dec 2002 19:59:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.85) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 19:59:43 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 5 Dec 2002 11:59:43 -0800 To: Cc: Subject: Fw: Hd Radio Date: Thu, 5 Dec 2002 14:59:29 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 05 Dec 2002 19:59:43.0685 (UTC) FILETIME=[DAA2A750:01C29C98] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.170.18.51] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ----- Original Message ----- From: Kerry Richards To: Dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com Cc: Tom Ray Sent: Thursday, December 05, 2002 1:15 PM Subject: Hd Radio Kevin, We need to face the facts and be logical here.... There are no AM Stereo radios being mass produced anymore. Most of the transmitter manufacturers are discontinuing any C-Quam support in favor of IBOC. The good news for you is you should be able to get an exciter and monitor cheap. But who has a radio??? While some of your argument makes a lot of sense it is not logical or practical. However it is nostalgic in nature, and I understand that. We still have one program here at WOR which uses the Turntables in Control Room 2, every Saturday night. I get a kick outta that. The whole world has gone digital, why? Because the marketplace has determined it sounds and works better. Try and buy a 45, you cannot get them, if you own a jukebox, you need to be burning CDs. I hated the day I could not buy my favorite hits on 45 anymore, but the market place has decided! I thought 45's sounded just fine. Since it almost impossible to easily overcome the noise in the AM Band, the idea of transmitting bits is very practical. We are one of the few places in the world where broadcasting is free and very independent. Broadcasters want their own turf, that is one of the reasons IBOC is becoming acceptable in the marketplace. I still insist you need to hear HD Radio in operation before claiming AM Stereo is a better or equal solution. Trust me it's not. Until you walk in my shoes you cannot make all the claims about AM Stereo and how wonderful it is. The sorry state of AM Stereo is proof enough. Not one station licensed to the NYC market is operating C-Quam. Why? I'll chalk up your ratings claim to your small market expereince. Our share is just fine, in a market this size with over 100 competing signals WOR is doing well. Besides we all know overall ratings mean nothing, look at the higher demographics, we shine there. Besides we are engineers, if they put trained apes on the air I still would have to keep the plant in operation. I leave the programming to the experts. WOR has one of the most vocal audiences in the world. If there were any interference transmitted as you claim, don't you think we would hear about it? What about our staff, the owner, and the station manager? Don't you think they would hear it? I'm speaking from practical experience here. We have not had complaints. Do you think our owner would let us ruin WOR by transmitting all of your imaginary interference? The next time you claim there is IBOC interference at 640 or way above 720 get out a spectrum analyzer and prove it. We have made numerous measurements, we are well under the NRSC mask. The interference you are claiming is probably due to the front end in your radio. Do you want me to seriously consider your complaints from a dial on an Atwater Kent radio in North Carolina to a Hewlett Packard spectrum analyzer here in New York at the transmitter where the RF is at it's highest? Is that logical? It is true that the IBOC system may hamper your DX listening pleasures, but time marches on...Just as radio in the sixties and seventies changed with the blooming of FM radio, now we have the internet and satellite radio. Any AM broadcaster who is seriously concerned about their future is looking to improve the signal to the listener in the market they serve, we do not sell time in South Carolina, WLW does not sell time in New York. Get the idea? While I find it impressive you have made digital improvements to your stations, you must come into the present, long gone are the days when any AM broadcaster transmitted a high fidelity signal. The NRSC did away with that. Sorry to say but right now IBOC from Ibiquity is the ony practcal solution at present. I urge you to reserve judgement until you have seen the installation, heard the results "off air", and when the radios start appearing next year, trying one of them out. Then your arguments about the comparison of IBOC and C-Quam will have some practicality to them. If you get to NYC, come and visit. I'd be happy to show what it's all about. Just call first, I'm at 212-798-8366. If you had seen some the ridiculous posts and emails we get here, you would find the comparison of the Horse's anatomy to those posts and emails, very mild indeed! Thanks, Kerry Richards Chief Engineer WOR-AM Buckley Broadcasting Corporation [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Dec 05 11:59:46 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: possumhunter@netzero.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Dec 2002 19:59:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 77622 invoked from network); 5 Dec 2002 19:59:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Dec 2002 19:59:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rly-ip03.mx.aol.com) (64.12.138.7) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 19:59:45 -0000 Received: from logs-mtc-tg.proxy.aol.com (logs-mtc-tg.proxy.aol.com [64.12.102.135]) by rly-ip03.mx.aol.com (v89.10) with ESMTP id RELAYIN3-1205145903; Thu, 05 Dec 2002 14:59:03 1900 Received: from ibm (ACAA1233.ipt.aol.com [172.170.18.51]) by logs-mtc-tg.proxy.aol.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with SMTP id gB5Jqxp78478; Thu, 5 Dec 2002 14:52:59 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <00ff01c29c97$e44f6b40$5a93b498@aoldsl.net> To: References: <6DF6CA3C7B44D411827C06000000000005AF9F4B@MB-BP-05> Subject: Re: WOR's Interference to CHWO Date: Thu, 5 Dec 2002 14:52:04 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Apparently-From: DodgeRamTrucker@aol.com From: "Possum Hunter" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Thank you for your prompt reply. I tried to receive CBU 690. It was being splattered by WLW 700's IBOC Digital noise I then tried to receive CKAC 730 and CHWO 740. Both had severe buzz from WOR 710's IBOC Digital noise. When WLW and WOR is broadcasting a standard analog AM signal, I can receive CBU and CKAC pretty good, and CHWO 740 normally has a city grade signal at my location in Greenville County, South Carolina. I was able to make a positive ID on the source of the noise. I measured WLW 700's IBOC bandwidth at +- 25Khz on each side of 700Khz and I measured WOR 710's bandwidth at +- 30Khz making their signal 60 Khz wide! In contrast, I have measured CHWO 740's bandwidth to be +-9Khz, the legal NRSC standard. I thought US AM stations have to protect the Canadian Clears. When I worked for WPJM 800, we had to protect CKLW 800. I am sure that the high noise level of WOR's IBOC Digital carrier, and the short distance from New York City and the Canadian border would make WOR' IBOC noise interfere with Canadian stations in Canada. I live within the .5mv/Meter contour of WSB 750, and WOR's IBOC noise even caused hiss in WSB's audio at my house. I am a frequent listener of CHWO 740, and I would hate to loose my reception of that station. Thank you for your time and attention to this matter. Kevin Raper ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, December 05, 2002 1:37 PM Subject: RE: WOR's Interference to CHWO > Hello Mr. Raper: > > Your complaint as referenced in the subject of this e-mail has been > forwarded to me for a reply. I have a number of questions regarding your > complaint and if you could clarify, I will attempt to resolve your > complaint. > > First of all, I would like to know which station or stations you > were trying to receive and secondly, if you were able to identify the > interfering station. > > If you are a US resident, I might inform you that US stations are > not required to protect Canadian stations over US land mass and that the > reception of CHWO is not guaranteed over US. In any case, your answers to > above question might help me in understanding your complaint better. > > Thanks a lot. > > Kirit > From michaelj@vcn.com Thu Dec 05 12:25:37 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Dec 2002 20:25:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 61456 invoked from network); 5 Dec 2002 20:25:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Dec 2002 20:25:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m3-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.33) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 20:25:35 -0000 Received: from michael (unverified [209.193.86.58]) by m3-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Thu, 5 Dec 2002 13:25:34 -0700 To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} Fw: HD Radio Date: Thu, 5 Dec 2002 13:24:59 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Ha! Ya know what they're going to say? "Well then why haven't you been at any of the NAB shows or anything. We've had demo booths and receivers set up all over the place at many different occasions. If you didn't make it down to hear it, then that's your problem. Go to our website and listen to the demos if you want to hear what it sounds like." I did. Sounds like sh*t. Like a RealAudio 28.8 feed complete with "jingle bell" artifacts on all the highs. MJR n WYO -----Original Message----- From: Phil Rafuse [mailto:philipr@irac.pe.ca] Sent: Thursday, December 05, 2002 10:48 AM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fw: HD Radio Perhaps WOR or Ibiquity, for that matter, would see fit to lend one of our members within WOR's digital coverage area an HD receiver [perhaps for a week] for their evaluation. If IBOC is so wonderful on a digital receiver, it would be a great way to make their point. Of course, if a formal request is made to them, and they refuse, it makes our point! If they are at all serious about IBOC aka HD, they would have a few demos [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Thu Dec 05 13:44:11 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Dec 2002 21:44:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 30546 invoked from network); 5 Dec 2002 21:44:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Dec 2002 21:44:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14203.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.145) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 21:44:10 -0000 Message-ID: <20021205214410.27203.qmail@web14203.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.45.202.244] by web14203.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 05 Dec 2002 13:44:10 PST Date: Thu, 5 Dec 2002 13:44:10 -0800 (PST) Subject: HD doesn't stand for Happy Day To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio An intelligent and humorous "Phil Rafuse" wrote: Perhaps WOR or Ibiquity,..would see fit to lend one of our members within WOR's digital coverage area an HD receiver [perhaps for a week] for their evaluation...Of course, if a formal request is made to them, and they refuse, it makes our point! If they are at all serious about IBOC aka HD, they would have a few demos Phil R. P.S. If their excuse is that the receiver weighs 50 lbs., tell them Kevin T., Neal or whomever else will bring a friend to help them lift this "portable radio" into the trunk of their car. Then I wrote: Phil, you cracked me up when you called this a 'portable radio'. Remember, when your 50 pound (23kG) radio doesn't work very well, you just turn it off, then turn it back on and wait 3 minutes for it to reboot! Ta-Daaa! __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Dec 05 14:12:57 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Dec 2002 22:12:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 92796 invoked from network); 5 Dec 2002 22:12:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Dec 2002 22:12:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d06.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.38) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 22:12:53 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.19c.d0faafa (3964) for ; Thu, 5 Dec 2002 17:12:48 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <19c.d0faafa.2b21295f@aol.com> Date: Thu, 5 Dec 2002 17:12:47 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Better to give, then maybe you'll 'receive' To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Language: en X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/5/02 9:28:39 AM Eastern Standard Time,=20 toledohamradio@yahoo.com writes: << Hello all =E2=80=93 Holiday Suggestion: Write a very nice letter and dro= p it in the snailmail (which is even better than an email) or even better yet, send a Christmas Card / Holiday Card to the engineer at your local (former) AM=20 Stereo station.=20=20 Ask him (or her?) if they would be kind enough to restore the C-Quam stere= o=20 AM during the week of Christmas so that listeners traveling about during the Christmas holidays could hear their Christmas music broadcast Christmas Ev= e=20 and Day in STEREO AM? Be nice to him; remember, Santa=E2=80=99s watching! Ma= ybe even do the same for the 50KW 1A clear frequency stations as well (I hate to use t= he term =E2=80=98clear channel=E2=80=99 for those stations). >> Good idea!....do it quick.The holidays are soon approaching {Running stereo here 24 hours and will be doing the annual format switch to= =20 Christmas music --48 hours of the sounds of the season starting midnight=20 12/24 til 115959p 12/25----even in stereo on the web ..shoutcast.com and=20 wgai560am.com} Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group =20 WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3=20 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 = =20 =20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineeri= ng=20 services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net=20 http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC=20 WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com=20 = =20 KC4QLP Amateur Radio=20=20 Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________=20 From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Dec 05 14:28:00 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Dec 2002 22:27:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 64525 invoked from network); 5 Dec 2002 22:27:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Dec 2002 22:27:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r02.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.98) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 22:27:58 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.1a5.d1d1268 (3964) for ; Thu, 5 Dec 2002 17:27:52 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1a5.d1d1268.2b212ce7@aol.com> Date: Thu, 5 Dec 2002 17:27:51 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fw: HD Radio To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/5/02 12:51:18 PM Eastern Standard Time, philipr@irac.pe.ca writes: << Perhaps WOR or Ibiquity, for that matter, would see fit to lend one of our members within WOR's digital coverage area an HD receiver [perhaps for a week] for their evaluation. If IBOC is so wonderful on a digital receiver, it would be a great way to make their point. Of course, if a formal request is made to them, and they refuse, it makes our point! If they are at all serious about IBOC aka HD, they would have a few demos Phil R. P.S. If their excuse is that the receiver weighs 50 lbs., tell them Kevin T., Neal or whomever else will bring a friend to help them lift this "portable radio" into the trunk of their car. >> LMAO!...50lb portable radio! LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL!!!!!!!! I would even take a weekend and come up to Jersey just to see this "pocket sized 50lb portable radio" ..LOL and listen to it myself. {mutters----50 lb portable radio...lol} Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Dec 05 15:46:02 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Dec 2002 23:46:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 964 invoked from network); 5 Dec 2002 23:46:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Dec 2002 23:46:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.16) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 23:46:02 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 5 Dec 2002 15:46:02 -0800 To: Subject: Fw: HD Radio Date: Thu, 5 Dec 2002 18:45:36 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 05 Dec 2002 23:46:02.0017 (UTC) FILETIME=[77F3B110:01C29CB8] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.175.105.54] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ----- Original Message ----- From: Tom Ray To: Possum Hunter Cc: krichards@wor710.com Sent: Thursday, December 05, 2002 5:23 PM Subject: Re: HD Radio Hey there: In response to your comments below: 1. It is true that I have radios that the average "Joe" does not have, such as a 1930's vintage AtwaterKent, but there are millions of Toyota trucks with the factory radios on the road. There is a strong public interest in high quality AM radios. This has been proven by the brisk sales of the Sangean/ C-Crane CCRadio and GE's Superadio series. WFIS requires the make and model of radio used to receive a QSL card. The vast majority of QSLs have gone to those listeners with CCRadios. >>>> Have you tested the Sangean/C-Crane radio? Audio response is 4kHz, at best. We know. We measured it. They put an EQ curve in the receiver to boost 1-2K. Now the SuperRadio.....that is a radio. I have one. They're great. But I live in WOR's null.....and usually use it in narrow mode to block interference picked up in wide mode. And this was before IBOC. The people with the C-Crane radios won't have a problem with an IBOC neighbor. If they listen as a DXer, that may be a different issue. 2. I agree that Kahn's AM Stereo system worked better in night time listening conditions, but the newest Motorola chips have all but eliminated the platform motion that plagued the technology in the 80's. A C-QUAM signal on a high quality AM radio sounds MUCH better than 90% of the FMs. I do have a Part 15 station that is in Kahn Stereo, I am going to switch it to C-QUAM too. >>>>> When discussing AM stereo, keep in mind that Kerry has not told you that he as a Morotola installer in the 1980's. He knows from whence he speaks about this. 3. IBOC isn't the first bad idea the FCC has endorsed. Canada has the right idea putting digital radio up on the L band so it does not interfere with AM and FM. >>>> But L band isn't much better. It is failing in Canada, partly because the public won't spring for the cost of the L band radios, which are somewhat expensive. With IBOC, you maintain your current frequency (no listener confusion), and if you don't buy an IBOC radio, you can still hear your station in analog. 4. According to Arbitron, WOR is number 19 in the ratings with a 2.4 share. WOR was pulling a 2.5 before you stated testing the IBOC signal. Personally, If I was the GM, I would fire the PD and clean house if I couldn't pull better than a 2.4 in the nation's largest radio market with a 50,000 Watt clear channel station. >>>>The PD was canned. You should note that, historically, over the past 5 years, WOR's ratings drift between 2.3 and 3.4.....and they come in cycles. This past book was in a down cycle. Next book we'll be up. But you also need to understand that our owner is very "hands on" and technically is the PD of the station. Enough said? 5. Most listeners don't gripe, they just change stations. >>>>> WOR's core listeners gripe, believe me. We canned a long time morning man two years ago....and, yes, those listeners did change stations.....after telling management what they could do with their new morning show. We received thousands of letters and emails of complaint. And any time we accidentally fart at the transmitter site, my phone rings off the hook and my email overflows with people wanting to know what I'm doing to "their" station. So, our core listeners will let us know flat out if they percieve a problem. 6. No matter what city you are licensed to, you are not allowed to splatter nearly 60Khz of bandwidth. My home is within the protected .5mv/Meter contour of WSB 750 and you are not allowed to splatter it with digital hash. Is it not a violation of International law to interfere with the Skywave signal of Canadian Clears? It is reasonable to expect the tests would Zap 690, but to blast 740's signal with digital noise is a bit much. >>>>> I have spent the past 3 nights starging at a spectrum analyzer driving around with iBiquity. We have not and were not splattering down to 750. Our spectrum is clean...it cuts off at 725, and in listening, I percieved none of the problems you are claiming. Whatever you were hearing was not the fault of WOR at 750. 7. From what I have read on the HD radio system, reduction of the digital sidebands would cause too many drop-outs to make it useful. >>>> Not really. We have been operating -6dB on the HD sidebands, and our coverage is solid to the Philly city line, 75 miles away. 8. High quality AM stereo is not unrealistic. This evening I was able to hear Neal Newman's WTTM 1680 during critical hours. Even on my Mono Factory Toyota radio, the sound quality was astounding. If I could get WFIS sounding like that, my boss might actually give me a raise! >>>>> Well, this is subjective. I agree that AM stereo can sound good......but it still has the problems of noise and narrow audio bandwidth that IBOC doesn't have. 9. Comparisons of which end of a horse we are coming from serves no useful purpose. I think we both have the same goal, the betterment of AM radio in general and the betterment of that stations that sign our paychecks in particular. It does concern me that the much higher levels and width of your sidebands is of no concern of yours. The higher noise level harms AM radio in general, not just one or two stations that are outside of your market. >>>>> Neighhhhhh. 10. It was both sad and disgusting to hear the low bandwidth analog audio and buzz on WLW, a station that was once certified by McIntosh Labs as High Fidelity. >>>>> WOR was once certified as high fidelity, too. But the FCC fixed that problem in the 1980's with the NRSC audio bandwidth restrictions. Then, you let the PD near the processing and boy, oh boy. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Dec 05 15:50:40 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Dec 2002 23:50:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 54399 invoked from network); 5 Dec 2002 23:50:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Dec 2002 23:50:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m04.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.7) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Dec 2002 23:50:39 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.193.11c52b5a (3964) for ; Thu, 5 Dec 2002 18:50:29 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <193.11c52b5a.2b214044@aol.com> Date: Thu, 5 Dec 2002 18:50:28 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fw: WOR/WLW To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/5/02 2:22:56 PM Eastern Standard Time, possumhunter@netzero.net writes: << I would strongly disagree with your statements, particularly the statement about hiss caused by WOR to WSB. This is impossible, as the IBOC carriers are dead in the water at 725kHz. There are no emissions beyond this frequency. Unless you are listening with an extremely broad band radio, which is not the case of most listeners. >> I find this very hard to beleive Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Dec 05 16:28:19 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Dec 2002 00:28:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 75712 invoked from network); 6 Dec 2002 00:28:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Dec 2002 00:28:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r03.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.99) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Dec 2002 00:28:16 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.14a.1868b82a (3964) for ; Thu, 5 Dec 2002 19:28:12 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <14a.1868b82a.2b21491c@aol.com> Date: Thu, 5 Dec 2002 19:28:12 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fw: HD Radio To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/5/02 6:47:20 PM Eastern Standard Time, possumhunter@netzero.net writes: << >>>>The PD was canned. You should note that, historically, over the past 5 years, WOR's ratings drift between 2.3 and 3.4.....and they come in cycles. This past book was in a down cycle. Next book we'll be up. But you also need to understand that our owner is very "hands on" and technically is the PD of the station. Enough said? >> Hmmm...the PD was canned...the owner is hands on and is "techincally the PD" ......how in holy contaminated toliet water can the owner fire himself?and still be the owner and employed at the station? Call me stupid but I sure didnt fall off of the cabbage truck yesterday. These folks are a piece of work...they keep talking in circles and lots of contradictions in the statements I read.When will the madness end? Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Dec 05 16:56:31 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: possumhunter@netzero.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Dec 2002 00:56:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 51368 invoked from network); 6 Dec 2002 00:56:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Dec 2002 00:56:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rly-ip05.mx.aol.com) (64.12.138.9) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Dec 2002 00:56:30 -0000 Received: from logs-wk.proxy.aol.com (logs-wk.proxy.aol.com [205.188.198.135]) by rly-ip05.mx.aol.com (v89.10) with ESMTP id RELAYIN6-1205195544; Thu, 05 Dec 2002 19:55:44 1900 Received: from ibm (ACAF6936.ipt.aol.com [172.175.105.54]) by logs-wk.proxy.aol.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with SMTP id gB60qBq146681; Thu, 5 Dec 2002 19:52:11 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <007d01c29cc1$b121d1c0$3669afac@aoldsl.net> To: "Tom Ray" Cc: References: <002001c29bfa$45c43110$0101010a@studiok> <013801c29cac$f2fb5220$6401a8c0@tomray> Subject: Re: HD Radio Date: Thu, 5 Dec 2002 19:51:56 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Apparently-From: DodgeRamTrucker@aol.com From: "Possum Hunter" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 >Hey there: > Have you tested the Sangean/C-Crane radio? Audio response is 4kHz, at best. We know. We measured it. Yes, I got one from C Crane. thought it sounded like sh*t, boxed it up and sent it back. The thing is more sensitive than most portable radios and it is fine to listening to talk, but not for music. > > Now the SuperRadio.....that is a radio. I have one. They're great. But I live in WOR's null.....and usually use it in narrow mode to block interference picked up in wide mode. And this was before IBOC. The people with the C-Crane radios won't have a problem with an IBOC neighbor. If they listen as a DXer, that may be a different issue. All of that is fine and dandy, but the majority of the radio listeners are listening in their cars. Both Ford and Chrysler still have great sounding wide band AM Stereo tuners in their premium radios. The GM, Toyota, and Nissan radios also have better than 7 Khz of bandwidth. On my Factory Toyota radio, I can sure hear the IBOC noise. I do think WOR made the right move by cutting the bandwidth. You don't need more than 5Khz on a talk station anyway. > >When discussing AM stereo, keep in mind that Kerry has not told you that he as a Morotola installer in the 1980's. He knows from whence he speaks about this. I have no doubt of Kerry's knowledge, but the C-QUAM chips have improved a good bit in the last 20 years. > >But L band isn't much better. It is failing in Canada, partly because the public won't spring for the cost of the L band radios, which are somewhat expensive. With IBOC, you maintain your current frequency (no listener confusion), and if you don't buy an IBOC radio, you can still hear your station in analog. Another reason IBOC will fail. What makes you think the public will pay big bucks for a HD radio that in the demo on your web site sounds like a low fi Streamed Real Audio feed? In the mean time those with analog radios get to hear hiss and buzz...... > >The PD was canned. Smart move > >But you also need to understand that our owner is very "hands on" and technically is the PD of the station. Enough said? Yea, I work for one of those too. > > Not really. We have been operating -6dB on the HD sidebands, and our coverage is solid to the Philly city line, 75 miles away. Only 75 miles of coverage sucks for a low frequency 50KW AM. I am 118 miles from WSB and have a .5mv/M signal. > >I agree that AM stereo can sound good......but it still has the problems of noise and narrow audio bandwidth that IBOC doesn't have. Most car radios don't go above 10Khz, or so on the FM or tape decks. Good car radios go to 10Khz on the AM as well. My grandmother's Delco has more bandwidth on the AM tuner than the FM or Tape! > >Neighhhhhh. Have some Oats! > >WOR was once certified as high fidelity, too. But the FCC fixed that problem in the 1980's with the NRSC audio bandwidth restrictions. NRSC did help stop SOME of the monkey chatter on night time AM by reducing AM to 10Khz. This reduction of interference is negated by the ultra-wide IBOC signal. > > Then, you let the PD near the processing and boy, oh boy. OK, I will tell you how I solved the problem of the PD screwing with the audio at a station I used to work at: I hooked up a Texar Audio Prizm and a CRL AM-4, and a half fried DAP 310 I had laying around to one of the Mono Audio Outs on the main air console. I had them where the PD could turn the knobs and watch the flashing lights and bouncing meters all he wanted. The "Real" audio processor, an Optimod 9100/A, was locked up in a cabinet in the transmitter room! It was quite funny to watch him tweak something on the CRLs then drive around listening. He would then call me out to his car to show me how much better the station sounded now that he tweaked it! He would do that about every 3 or 4 days. Only the GM and I knew where the Optimod was. The GM even played along sometimes by asking the PD to "Brighten" the sound a tad. Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Dec 05 17:04:26 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: possumhunter@netzero.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Dec 2002 01:04:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 40956 invoked from network); 6 Dec 2002 01:04:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Dec 2002 01:04:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rly-ip05.mx.aol.com) (64.12.138.9) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Dec 2002 01:04:24 -0000 Received: from logs-wk.proxy.aol.com (logs-wk.proxy.aol.com [205.188.198.135]) by rly-ip05.mx.aol.com (v89.10) with ESMTP id RELAYIN4-1205200322; Thu, 05 Dec 2002 20:03:22 -0500 Received: from ibm (ACAF6936.ipt.aol.com [172.175.105.54]) by logs-wk.proxy.aol.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with SMTP id gB611Tq149337 for ; Thu, 5 Dec 2002 20:01:30 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <00ac01c29cc2$fd5cc8a0$3669afac@aoldsl.net> To: Subject: Fw: [AM740] Webcasting Date: Thu, 5 Dec 2002 19:59:39 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Apparently-From: DodgeRamTrucker@aol.com From: "Possum Hunter" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Brian Smith" To: Sent: Thursday, December 05, 2002 4:44 PM Subject: Re: [AM740] Webcasting > Lot's of thought. But at present it's not a good financial route to take. You pay royalties for any > song you play on the radio. You pay AGAIN if it's also broadcast over the internet. You pay AGAIN if > it's broadcast over satellite. > > The whole idea of going to AM740 was to produce a relatively inexpensive signal to large audience. > The fact the signal travels so well to the US (except for the IBOC crap) was a bonus. CBC never > realized the US audience was an important part of the station. AM 740 know that all too well from > the number of people phoning in for requests. > > But it's not a dead issue. Just not a priority. > > Brian > ------- > > Brian > Has there been any thought given to streaming the station's audio over the internet? It would > improve the quality of the signal that we in the "boonies" are able to listen to. Also, who knows, > it might even attract more listeners. > Just a thought. > > Eric > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AM740-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Dec 05 17:19:35 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Dec 2002 01:19:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 32451 invoked from network); 6 Dec 2002 01:19:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Dec 2002 01:19:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d05.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Dec 2002 01:19:35 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.1c2.299d02a (3964) for ; Thu, 5 Dec 2002 20:19:29 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1c2.299d02a.2b215520@aol.com> Date: Thu, 5 Dec 2002 20:19:28 EST Subject: ..a possible turn of events regarding ownership limits of radio/tv/newspapers To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp From AP:Thu December 5, 2002 15:04 EST (Washington-AP) -- Federal regulators will hold a hearing in Richmond Virgina in February to get public opinion on rules limiting the ownership of newspapers and radio and television stations. The Federal Communications Chairman will release details of the hearing later. The agency is studying whether current ownership restrictions are still workable in a market changed by the Internet, satellite broadcasts and cable television. In September, the agency began reviewing how ownership rules affect competition, advertising, local news outlets and the diversity of voices providing news and information. The F-C-C expects to finish the review by spring. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Dec 05 17:41:05 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Dec 2002 01:41:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 24265 invoked from network); 6 Dec 2002 01:41:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Dec 2002 01:41:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m02.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.5) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Dec 2002 01:41:04 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.1c9.2a6dfd3 (3964) for ; Thu, 5 Dec 2002 20:40:53 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1c9.2a6dfd3.2b215a24@aol.com> Date: Thu, 5 Dec 2002 20:40:52 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: HD Radio To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/5/02 8:28:22 PM Eastern Standard Time, possumhunter@netzero.net writes: << OK, I will tell you how I solved the problem of the PD screwing with the audio at a station I used to work at: I hooked up a Texar Audio Prizm and a CRL AM-4, and a half fried DAP 310 I had laying around to one of the Mono Audio Outs on the main air console. I had them where the PD could turn the knobs and watch the flashing lights and bouncing meters all he wanted. The "Real" audio processor, an Optimod 9100/A, was locked up in a cabinet in the transmitter room! It was quite funny to watch him tweak something on the CRLs then drive around listening. He would then call me out to his car to show me how much better the station sounded now that he tweaked it! He would do that about every 3 or 4 days. Only the GM and I knew where the Optimod was. The GM even played along sometimes by asking the PD to "Brighten" the sound a tad. Kevin >> LMAO!...I would have loved to have done something like that with a former owner here...he was all the time monkeying with the sound of the FM stations .....for whatever reason he never complained about the nor wanted to adjust the processing on the AM here...and he listened to the AM quite a lot. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Dec 05 19:04:23 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Dec 2002 03:04:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 92632 invoked from network); 6 Dec 2002 03:04:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Dec 2002 03:04:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Dec 2002 03:04:22 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.251] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Dec 2002 03:04:22 -0000 Date: Fri, 06 Dec 2002 03:04:21 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Recording of WOR's nighttime IBOC hash Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1518 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.89.13 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics Here's what it sounds like in NJ, about 25 miles from WOR's transmitter. I recorded this on a Panasonic AM Stereo walkman (Japanese import), which has a fairly narrow bandwidth, but is generally good for DXing. The following audio sample starts out at 650 kHz (you will hear the WSM ID), then goes step-by-step up to 770 kHz, ending on strong, local, and analogly pure WABC -- with Stereo DX of Detroit's WJR just before it... they seemed to be transmitting audio only in the right channel at the time, for some reason. Here it is, about a 1 meg MP3 file: http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/worscan.mp3 Notice the hissy/scratchy splatter on 740 and 750 kHz, covering up CHWO and WSB... as I have discussed with Tom Ray at WOR, this is *not* coming directly from WOR's transmitter, but rather is supposedly a form of front end overload in my receiver, because WOR's digital sidebands are so strong... but even my best radio has this effect, not just "cheap" radios, so it is a real problem, regardless of exactly what is causing it. Meanwhile, this is what my DX of 740 CHWO sounded like before WOR turned on their IBOC at night, as heard on an Aiwa bookshelf system (which has a surprisingly hi-fi AM tuner): http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/chwo.mp3 I think CHWO should do their own "testing", in the form of disabling their 10 kHz NRSC audio filter... surely any additional interference that will cause on the adjacent channels will be far less destructive than what IBOC is doing. From jeffdeck@aol.com Thu Dec 05 19:22:10 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: Jeffdeck@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Dec 2002 03:22:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 91178 invoked from network); 6 Dec 2002 03:22:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Dec 2002 03:22:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r08.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.104) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Dec 2002 03:22:08 -0000 Received: from Jeffdeck@aol.com by imo-r08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id 1.c8.3144a572 (3890); Thu, 5 Dec 2002 22:22:02 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Thu, 5 Dec 2002 22:22:02 EST Subject: Re: Can anybody help? To: ABDX@topica.com Cc: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10638 From: jeffdeck@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=4430287 X-Yahoo-Profile: jeffdeck2001 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit All, There are atleast two types of Theftlock featured on GM radios. One form has four digit code that is user programmed by customer. If battery power is disconnected from the radio, it is locked. It cannot be unlocked without the customer's four digit code, or master code supplied by Delco. To get the master code, you press a few keys on the front of the radio, copy a few numbers from the radio's display, and call Delco hotline with your dealer service code and radio's numbers. Delco provides four digit code that unlocks the radio. This feature will be retired in 2004 model year GM radios, and is used for the Corvette CD or cassette radio with those huge buttons. GM's recent Theftlock incarnation involves the vehicle serial bus. A portion of the VIN is transmitted to the radio when initially installed. This VIN is stored in the radio's non-volatile memory. It is not erased when the battery power is disconnected, nor does the radio enter Theftlock mode after the battery is removed. Radio expects to see the VIN sent on the serial bus to match the code entered within the radio. If the VIN is missing or does not match, then the radio enters Theftlock mode. So, these GM radios will only function in late model GM vehicles using the serial bus. Radio's VIN is changed with a class two serial device. One other note worth mentioning: GM radios with this Theftlock feature are manufactured with the VIN memory empty (since they do not know which vehicle to be installed until final assembly). It may be possible then to use these radios in other vehicles that do not have serial bus and/or do not transmit VIN. Also keep in mind that if you exchange the GM radio for an after-market radio, you may lose door chimes and other electronic sounds that are now integrated with the radio, including ONStar. Fault code is also entered into the vehicle's onboard computer diagnostic chip. I enjoyed the WZZB air check; they need to adjust their levels though. In a message dated 12/5/2002 10:11:16 AM Eastern Standard Time, Chris writes: >This radio can be disabled (the theftlok)- you will have to visit a friendly >dealer to have them unlock it, but once unlocked it will not go back into >theftlok unless you make it do it. The 1996 DeVille radio 8is a definite on >ams as well. If you want a radio that kicks butt, find one from a 1997 or 98 >Caddy catterra- WOW! >OTOH, MY radio in my 2002 Malibu, will NOT run out side of the car. It reads >the VIN # from the car's central computer, and will never work unless it is >in my car. >CC [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From penry@nortelnetworks.com Thu Dec 05 20:13:57 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: penry@nortelnetworks.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Dec 2002 04:13:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 22860 invoked from network); 6 Dec 2002 04:13:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Dec 2002 04:13:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Dec 2002 04:13:56 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.173] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Dec 2002 04:13:55 -0000 Date: Fri, 06 Dec 2002 04:13:54 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Recording of WOR's nighttime IBOC hash Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 713 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wa5vhu" X-Originating-IP: 12.237.30.38 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=376233 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa5vhu --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin T." wrote: > Here's what it sounds like in NJ, about 25 miles from WOR's > transmitter. Excellent example Kevin T. If HD does not improve, the "FAX Machine" will be the death of AM Radio, not its saviour. When the average listner hears this garbage they will tune off as quick as they can push another radio button, or worse for the industry, put a CD in the player. All you Broadcast Engineers better polish up your other skills. You will be real busy working overtime installing HD transmitters and then shortly thereafter you will be out of work when most of the listners get run off by the noise. Anyone want to buy some ear plugs? Charles From n0uiheric@aol.com Thu Dec 05 20:16:13 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Dec 2002 04:16:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 59207 invoked from network); 6 Dec 2002 04:16:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Dec 2002 04:16:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m09.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.164) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Dec 2002 04:16:12 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-m09.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.157.1873e353 (4340) for ; Thu, 5 Dec 2002 23:16:08 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <157.1873e353.2b217e88@aol.com> Date: Thu, 5 Dec 2002 23:16:08 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fw: WOR/WLW To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih As far as WLW was concerned, I heard no IBOCrap hash any higher than 720 (and my Superadio III was not set to "Wideband" setting!). 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Thu Dec 05 20:16:15 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Dec 2002 04:16:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 28049 invoked from network); 6 Dec 2002 04:16:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Dec 2002 04:16:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d03.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.35) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Dec 2002 04:16:14 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-d03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.127.1c338745 (4340) for ; Thu, 5 Dec 2002 23:16:10 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <127.1c338745.2b217e8a@aol.com> Date: Thu, 5 Dec 2002 23:16:10 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fw: Hd Radio To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih Those who promote "HD" Radio is FULL OF CRAP. Does Tom Ray have a learning disability? 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From penry@nortelnetworks.com Thu Dec 05 20:29:50 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: penry@nortelnetworks.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Dec 2002 04:29:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 53203 invoked from network); 6 Dec 2002 04:29:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Dec 2002 04:29:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.70) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Dec 2002 04:29:49 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.130] by n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Dec 2002 04:29:48 -0000 Date: Fri, 06 Dec 2002 04:29:47 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fw: Hd Radio Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <127.1c338745.2b217e8a@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 774 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wa5vhu" X-Originating-IP: 12.237.30.38 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=376233 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa5vhu Eric, Please see previous postings about personal attacks and how they hurt our cause, not help us. Unless you are the mole? You work for iBIQUITY and are trying to make this group look bad to discredit us? Charles Seven Invisible Tag Lines Below This One --- In amstereoforum@y..., n0uiheric@a... wrote: > Those who promote "HD" Radio is FULL OF CRAP. Does Tom Ray have a learning > disability? > > 73 and good DX from Eric > Amateur Radio Station N0UIH > Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN > Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 > DXing The World since 1981 > Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel > PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION > "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From groucho@skyweb.net Thu Dec 05 21:01:23 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Dec 2002 05:01:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 7072 invoked from network); 6 Dec 2002 05:01:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Dec 2002 05:01:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Dec 2002 05:01:21 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gB656eIJ053392 for ; Fri, 6 Dec 2002 00:06:40 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DF02E84.5E40626B@skyweb.net> Date: Thu, 05 Dec 2002 23:58:44 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fw: HD Radio References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 > Not a problem Here I have a VAN... a car is to small to carry all My > gear.... > > P.S. If their excuse is that the receiver weighs 50 lbs., tell them > Kevin T., Neal or whomever else will bring a friend to help them > lift this "portable radio" into the trunk of their car. > > - From groucho@skyweb.net Thu Dec 05 21:26:01 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Dec 2002 05:26:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 17405 invoked from network); 6 Dec 2002 05:26:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Dec 2002 05:26:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Dec 2002 05:26:00 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gB65VJIJ059788 for ; Fri, 6 Dec 2002 00:31:19 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DF03448.9165A089@skyweb.net> Date: Fri, 06 Dec 2002 00:23:20 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fw: Hd Radio References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Kerry Does not know what He is talking about..... P. The sorry state of AM Stereo is proof enough. Not one station licensed to the NYC market is operating C-Quam. 3 of Multicultural NYC Based Stations are Running C-Quam WZRC is licensed to NYC the other WNSW 1430 and WPAT are both licensed to NJ But the studios are In NYC and they Cover NYC I consider them NYC stations. but If you want to be Picky WZRC is one.. HA... WTTM is NJ and If we can Find a Stereo Card.. WNYG could Be stereo WHWH has a stereo exciter. But since I have no control over that LMA even though its at My site and My parent Company owns it.. It could be AM stereo within 30 Mins.. you guys would have to Bug my buddy Mick for that.... LOL He is a good Guy... I am acquiring an older Console from Him at Nassau to build a backup studio For WTTM.. he has a second one. I may even Aquire to build a small backup studio at the transmitter site Neal From groucho@skyweb.net Thu Dec 05 21:45:44 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Dec 2002 05:45:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 90747 invoked from network); 6 Dec 2002 05:45:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Dec 2002 05:45:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Dec 2002 05:45:43 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gB65nkIJ064892 for ; Fri, 6 Dec 2002 00:49:47 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DF03898.9BCFB01E@skyweb.net> Date: Fri, 06 Dec 2002 00:41:44 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fw: WOR/WLW References: <193.11c52b5a.2b214044@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 this seems like a no win this guy has his Head in a spectrum analyser.... that's theory Not real world... I am Willing to bet that the Analyser belongs to Ibiquity.. Its rigged to be 5kc short from the mask. so anyone looking at says see we are within the mask LOL...725 My butt.. even my Boss while on a trip to NY heard it splatter 740 WGSM with a Rented car... not what I call a high Quality radio.. its a Standard car radio Hell my van has a Cheap radioshack car radio in it.. Ohh I see its a Cheap radio It has a bad front end.. Hell all Am radios have lousy front Ends these days... He Farts and they call him ? isn't that what he said.. No wonder the station sounds like S***T smells like it from what he said... Sorry Guys I just could not resist that one.. KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 12/5/02 2:22:56 PM Eastern Standard Time, > possumhunter@netzero.net writes: > > << I would strongly disagree with your statements, particularly the statement > about hiss caused by WOR to WSB. This is impossible, as the IBOC carriers > are dead in the water at 725kHz. There are no emissions beyond this > frequency. Unless you are listening with an extremely broad band radio, > which is not the case of most listeners. > >> > I find this very hard to beleive > > Bob Carter > Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group > > WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 > Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 > > Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering > services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. > e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net > http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice > Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC > WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC > WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC > Ray Communications Radio Network > > AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- > amstereo-subcribe@topica.com > > KC4QLP Amateur Radio > Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va > www.kc4qlp.cjb.net > > voice contact-252-335-0856 > fax 1-209-254-8978 > _______________________________________________________ > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From groucho@skyweb.net Thu Dec 05 22:14:06 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Dec 2002 06:14:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 42422 invoked from network); 6 Dec 2002 06:14:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Dec 2002 06:14:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Dec 2002 06:14:04 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gB66JMIJ072363; Fri, 6 Dec 2002 01:19:22 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DF03F85.13D15479@skyweb.net> Date: Fri, 06 Dec 2002 01:11:17 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "ABDX@topica.com" , "amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com" Subject: Guess WHO Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 well today was a first... only 6 of the staff showed Up to work in today's Snow. 3 of our sales personal 2 of whom are also Hosts... the PD myself and the receptionist I got To Play DJ from 6pm till 11 PM tonight.. I was on our website chat room and taking Phone calls Live on the air.. It was Fun It was great.. I was playing alot of OLD Classic Indian music playing from the 60's back to the 40's Since I listen to My own station I know what the other DJ's are playing I played Everything and anything They do not play and the Listeners were loving it...Engineer Neal here on wttm 1680 am stereo princeton,NJ EBC Radio.. and playing the only AMAX Promo with every half hour break... did anyone happen to catch me in action tonight??I am Now looking For MORE AM STEREO Promos If you have them send them my way I want to Play them.. and add them into my nightly automation system also. heheh some of the listeners said I should Be the PD.. If I had my way I would Be LOL.. because the DJ's play what they want to hear...and its always the same stuff.. I always thought it was the PD's job to Pick the music they play.. in our station his job is to Hire the Dj's and Advise them On their shows the rest is up to them.. almost like a non-com.... but Commercial..there is a term for this.. Ahhh yes local programming..freestyle... I hope to get on more often Neal From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Dec 05 22:38:38 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Dec 2002 06:38:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 13331 invoked from network); 6 Dec 2002 06:38:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Dec 2002 06:38:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.84) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Dec 2002 06:38:37 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.137] by n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Dec 2002 06:38:37 -0000 Date: Fri, 06 Dec 2002 06:38:33 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Fw: Hd Radio Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3DF03448.9165A089@skyweb.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1706 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.89.13 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > 3 of Multicultural NYC Based Stations are Running C-Quam > WZRC is licensed to NYC the other > WNSW 1430 and WPAT are both licensed to NJ But the studios are In > NYC and they Cover NYC I consider them NYC stations. > but If you want to be Picky WZRC is one.. HA... Actually I have not heard a Stereo signal from 1480 WZRC in about the past year or so. 1430 WNSW was off for a while too, but they turned the Stereo back on and now it sounds excellent when they play music with full Stereo sound. Same thing from 930 WPAT which even IDs as AM Stereo on the air. 1660 WWRU (lic. to Jersey City, NJ) is also transmitting an AM Stereo signal, day and night, although I haven't heard any true Stereo sound from their "Radio Unica" Spanish format. Other listenable AM Stereo signals in New York City include 600 WICC, 850 WREF, and 1490 WGCH from CT, 1450 WCTC and of course 1680 WTTM from NJ, and 1210 WPHT from PA. That's a total of seven AM Stereo signals, as compared to one IBOC station (710 WOR) and two Kahn Power-Side stations (1280 WADO & 1600 WWRL). > WHWH has a stereo exciter. But since I have no control over that > LMA even though its at My site and My parent Company owns it.. It > could be AM stereo within 30 Mins.. you guys would have to Bug my > buddy Mick for that.... LOL 1350 WHWH was in full AM Stereo up until about mid-1997. During their days as a Nostalgia music station in 1996-1997 they even promoted it in some of their IDs. But they dropped it shortly before switching to their business/financial talk format, and WHWH has never been in Stereo since then -- nor have they ever gotten any measurable *ratings* since they dumped the music format. From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Dec 05 23:05:07 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Dec 2002 07:05:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 36226 invoked from network); 6 Dec 2002 07:05:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Dec 2002 07:05:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.46) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Dec 2002 07:05:06 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 5 Dec 2002 23:05:06 -0800 To: References: <3DF03F85.13D15479@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Guess WHO Date: Fri, 6 Dec 2002 02:04:48 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 06 Dec 2002 07:05:06.0675 (UTC) FILETIME=[CE977C30:01C29CF5] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.155.232.101] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Neal Newman wrote: >did anyone happen to catch me in action tonight? Sorry, all I heard was "I-4 traffic and weather together on the tens" Wouldn't it be a rotten shame if their tower was to have an "accident"? > > Now looking For MORE AM STEREO Promos If you have them send them my way I want to Play them.. and add them into my nightly automation system also. Same here. I would LOVE to have the complete AMAX package, as well as anything else that somebody has cooked up. > >I hope to get on more often It is FUN to get on the air and "play radio"! Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Dec 05 23:30:25 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Dec 2002 07:30:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 41061 invoked from network); 6 Dec 2002 07:30:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Dec 2002 07:30:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Dec 2002 07:30:24 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.189] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Dec 2002 07:30:24 -0000 Date: Fri, 06 Dec 2002 07:30:24 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Guess WHO Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1100 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.89.13 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Sorry, all I heard was "I-4 traffic and weather together on the > tens" > Wouldn't it be a rotten shame if their tower was to have an > "accident"? For what it's worth, I'm about 20 miles northwest of WTTM, and I never hear WTIR at night, at least not since WTTM upgraded to AM Stereo with good audio processing. The only DX I have really gotten on 1680 was WJNZ "Stereo 1680 Jamz" from Michigan, which was booming in loud and clear for a few minutes one night, with excellent Stereo music... then it faded out and I was back to the normal clear signal from WTTM. > Same here. I would LOVE to have the complete AMAX package, as well > as anything else that somebody has cooked up. Somewhere, somebody must have a copy of the original CD that was given to radio stations... I have the audio of four of the AMAX promo "commercials", but it sounds like it was recorded from an old cassette, with hiss and fluttering. Nevertheless, here is the longer AMAX promo -- it's 1 minute long and more detailed than the other 30-second promos: http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/amax1min.mp3 From bjackson@indyradio.com Thu Dec 05 23:53:53 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Dec 2002 07:53:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 89016 invoked from network); 6 Dec 2002 07:53:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Dec 2002 07:53:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.84) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Dec 2002 07:53:53 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.158] by n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Dec 2002 07:53:53 -0000 Date: Fri, 06 Dec 2002 07:53:51 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Carver Stereo Question Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 746 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923" X-Originating-IP: 64.25.100.140 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 Having a Carver tx-11a, and loving it, the other day I picked up an older Carver receiver for the computer room. From what I saw on the www.amstereoradio.com page, I thought it had C-Quam. However, I've tried WGN, WJR, WLS, WZZB, and KCJJ and no stereo. Like the tx-11a, it does have very wide bandwidth (it could actually use a whistle filter), but I just can't get the stereo light to come one. I did open it up to see if I could find anything...but couldn't find anything to give me any insight. Here is a picture if it helps: http://iw1.indyweb.net/~bjackson/carver.jpg If anyone can confirm/deny if it has C-Quam...and if not, give me any info on converting it? Thanks! -Brad Jackson -Susquehanna, Indianapolis -WGLD/WGRL/WFMS From ccuff@in4web.com Fri Dec 06 00:19:02 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Dec 2002 08:19:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 73195 invoked from network); 6 Dec 2002 08:19:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Dec 2002 08:19:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Dec 2002 08:19:01 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.50]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Fri, 6 Dec 2002 03:13:41 -0500 Message-ID: <004701c29cfe$efd2efc0$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Recording of WOR's nighttime IBOC hash Date: Fri, 6 Dec 2002 03:10:26 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 I get hash from them on my Malibu radio- with it's 2K bandwidth, from 670 to 720! I have also heard the "morse code" someone else wrote about. this crap has to stop. There has to be a way to send a letter directly to Powell addressing this, bypassing the normal red tape methods. CC ----- Original Message ----- From: Kevin T. To: Sent: Thursday, December 05, 2002 10:04 PM Subject: {AMSF} Recording of WOR's nighttime IBOC hash From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Dec 06 00:19:33 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Dec 2002 08:19:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 56242 invoked from network); 6 Dec 2002 08:19:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Dec 2002 08:19:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.64) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Dec 2002 08:19:32 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.180] by n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Dec 2002 08:19:32 -0000 Date: Fri, 06 Dec 2002 08:19:28 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Carver Stereo Question Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 589 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.89.13 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Like the tx-11a, it does have very wide bandwidth (it could > actually use a whistle filter), but I just can't get the stereo > light to come on. I believe Chris Cuff had one of those, so perhaps he can fill us in with the details. If it does have AM Stereo, it likely uses the MC13020 decoder, which can get out of adjustment and refuse to enter Stereo mode; I have a 1985 Volkswagen car radio that is like that. And if it doesn't have built-in AM Stereo, then hopefully it will be like the Carver TX-2 tuner, which makes an easy and very high-quality conversion to AM Stereo. From amstereoguy@hotmail.com Fri Dec 06 00:31:51 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereoguy@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Dec 2002 08:31:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 4205 invoked from network); 6 Dec 2002 08:31:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Dec 2002 08:31:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (207.68.165.162) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Dec 2002 08:31:50 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 6 Dec 2002 00:31:50 -0800 Received: from 208.20.8.50 by sea2fd.sea2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Fri, 06 Dec 2002 08:31:50 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Carver Stereo Question Date: Fri, 06 Dec 2002 03:31:50 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 06 Dec 2002 08:31:50.0622 (UTC) FILETIME=[EC62C7E0:01C29D01] From: "Chris Cuff" X-Originating-IP: [208.20.8.50] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37866059 Ah!- Here is whats up: Look at the back- if it says "The Carver receiver"- it is am MONO- The only Carver receiver that had am stereo was the Carver 2000- They *look* identical. Chris >From: "Kevin T." >Reply-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com >To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com >Subject: {AMSF} Re: Carver Stereo Question >Date: Fri, 06 Dec 2002 08:19:28 -0000 > > > Like the tx-11a, it does have very wide bandwidth (it could > > actually use a whistle filter), but I just can't get the stereo > > light to come on. > >I believe Chris Cuff had one of those _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus From KC4QLP@aol.com Fri Dec 06 01:22:04 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Dec 2002 09:22:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 41659 invoked from network); 6 Dec 2002 09:22:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Dec 2002 09:22:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m08.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.163) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Dec 2002 09:22:03 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.18d.125bf9a1 (4238) for ; Fri, 6 Dec 2002 04:22:01 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <18d.125bf9a1.2b21c639@aol.com> Date: Fri, 6 Dec 2002 04:22:01 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Guess WHO To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 12/6/02 1:14:40 AM Eastern Standard Time, groucho@skyweb.net writes: > Now looking For MORE AM STEREO Promos If you have them send them my > way I want to Play them.. and add them into my nightly automation > system also. heheh some of the listeners said I should Be the PD.. If I > had my way I would Be LOL.. because the DJ's play what they want to > hear...and its always the same stuff.. > I'll getthem out on the net for all to grab to use on their stations. Just finshed networking some compoopers together at home and getting a smal...and I do mean small digital studio hooked up at home to use in conjunction with stuff back at the radio stations...soon as I get everything together..I'll upload some MP3s of AMAX promos. BTW..Neal sounds like you had an interesting day as well....had to go baby sit a 3kw trany today due to icing on the antenna....seems like the op there doesnt quite know what to do when ice comes around...ok so 98% of the people in the south freak out when they see snow..but thats a whole different topic....dang phones rang off the hook last night .....maybe people here will learn to chill out when winter weather arrives!..lol Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From KC4QLP@aol.com Fri Dec 06 01:27:58 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Dec 2002 09:27:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 12931 invoked from network); 6 Dec 2002 09:27:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Dec 2002 09:27:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r05.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.101) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Dec 2002 09:27:57 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.149.43ab51e (4238) for ; Fri, 6 Dec 2002 04:27:55 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <149.43ab51e.2b21c79a@aol.com> Date: Fri, 6 Dec 2002 04:27:54 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Guess WHO To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 12/6/02 2:31:31 AM Eastern Standard Time, kevtronics@yahoo.com writes: > Somewhere, somebody must have a copy of the original CD that was > given to radio stations... I have the audio of four of the AMAX promo > "commercials", but it sounds like it was recorded from an old > cassette, with hiss and fluttering. > CD?!?!...LOL ....these promos that I have were recorded onto cassette tape ...by the sound of the production...they were using turn tables and reel to reels to put everything together ...put on a master then copies were made from that....this is from the early 90's...like 90 - 91 time frame...CD's werent really catchy yet at radio stations for promos and commericals then as they still used the old small reels and cassettes.The only CD you would find would have music on them...seems like it wasnt until the mid 90's before CD's became a common place for everything around the radio station. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From bjackson@indyradio.com Fri Dec 06 02:48:12 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Dec 2002 10:48:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 25450 invoked from network); 6 Dec 2002 10:48:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Dec 2002 10:48:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Dec 2002 10:48:11 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.188] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Dec 2002 10:48:11 -0000 Date: Fri, 06 Dec 2002 10:48:11 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: Carver Stereo Question Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 814 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923" X-Originating-IP: 206.246.142.145 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Chris Cuff" wrote: > Ah!- Here is whats up: Look at the back- if it says "The Carver receiver"- > it is am MONO- The only Carver receiver that had am stereo was the Carver > 2000- They *look* identical. > Chris > Ahhhh! That's the problem...It is "The Carver Receiver"...So it is (wideband) mono :-( I guess the good news is that I have a Sansui multi-system AM Stereo tuner on the way. Chris, from what I've read, you'd be the man to answer this...How easy is it to convert something like this with one of your boards? I have good soldering skills (My other hobby is 8-bit computers, and with the TRS-80, you get good at replacing the 6809 CPU), but I don't have any diagrams of this unit. -Brad Jackson -Susquehanna, Indianapolis -WGLD/WGRL/WFMS From groucho@skyweb.net Fri Dec 06 03:24:12 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Dec 2002 11:24:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 95861 invoked from network); 6 Dec 2002 11:24:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Dec 2002 11:24:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Dec 2002 11:24:11 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gB6BTUIJ039998 for ; Fri, 6 Dec 2002 06:29:31 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DF08834.EEF014AB@skyweb.net> Date: Fri, 06 Dec 2002 06:21:24 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Fw: Hd Radio References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Interesting.. when I first went to the main Office back in June WZRC was in stereo or at least had a pilot on...I noticed it when I was in the Control room at that Time WNSW also had a pilot But had a humm on one of the channels.. remember someone told me to Tell Harold about it to get it Fixed. But that was later in the summer. Either way...your right there are at least 7 stations within the NY Metro area in Am Stereo. this may Be true about WHWH.. however fact remains the stereo exciter is there,and if I was told to turn it on. It would Be on.If WZRC is Not Stereo It too has an exciter.and all Harold has to do is Flip a switch. the studios are set-up for Stereo Nice Facilities.maybe on my Next trip to the office Ill take some photos.. Neal. > > Actually I have not heard a Stereo signal from 1480 WZRC in about the > past year or so. 1430 WNSW was off for a while too, but they turned > the Stereo back on and now it sounds excellent when they play music > with full Stereo sound. Same thing from 930 WPAT which even IDs as > AM Stereo on the air. 1660 WWRU (lic. to Jersey City, NJ) is also > transmitting an AM Stereo signal, day and night, although I haven't > heard any true Stereo sound from their "Radio Unica" Spanish format. > > Other listenable AM Stereo signals in New York City include 600 WICC, > 850 WREF, and 1490 WGCH from CT, 1450 WCTC and of course 1680 WTTM > from NJ, and 1210 WPHT from PA. That's a total of seven AM Stereo > signals, as compared to one IBOC station (710 WOR) and two Kahn > Power-Side stations (1280 WADO & 1600 WWRL). > 1350 WHWH was in full AM Stereo up until about mid-1997. During > their days as a Nostalgia music station in 1996-1997 they even > promoted it in some of their IDs. But they dropped it shortly before > switching to their business/financial talk format, and WHWH has never > been in Stereo since then -- nor have they ever gotten any measurable > *ratings* since they dumped the music format. > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From amstereoguy@hotmail.com Fri Dec 06 03:47:16 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereoguy@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Dec 2002 11:47:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 31256 invoked from network); 6 Dec 2002 11:47:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Dec 2002 11:47:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (207.68.165.105) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Dec 2002 11:47:15 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 6 Dec 2002 03:47:15 -0800 Received: from 208.228.96.20 by sea2fd.sea2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Fri, 06 Dec 2002 11:47:14 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Carver Stereo Question Date: Fri, 06 Dec 2002 06:47:14 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 06 Dec 2002 11:47:15.0180 (UTC) FILETIME=[38C45AC0:01C29D1D] From: "Chris Cuff" X-Originating-IP: [208.228.96.20] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37866059 It will not be a problem- I am in the process of sorting paperwork, and after 17 years of collecting, I cannot find anything, but I "may" have a schematic. I know Jeff Deck also has info on how to integrate decoders as he did a couple of Carvers. Chris >From: "bradleyj923" >--- In amstereoforum@y..., "Chris Cuff" wrote: > > Ah!- Here is whats up: Look at the back- if it says "The Carver >receiver"- > > it is am MONO- _________________________________________________________________ The new MSN 8: advanced junk mail protection and 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Dec 06 07:51:24 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Dec 2002 15:51:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 3588 invoked from network); 6 Dec 2002 15:51:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Dec 2002 15:51:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.84) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Dec 2002 15:51:22 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.183] by n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Dec 2002 15:51:17 -0000 Date: Fri, 06 Dec 2002 15:51:17 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Carver Stereo Question Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1287 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Chris, from what I've read, you'd be the man to answer this...How > easy is it to convert something like this with one of your boards? Chris would probably say that *anything* is easy to convert... but I can say that these older radios are generally much easier to add AM Stereo to than the new radios which cram the whole AM/FM tuner into a single surface-mount chip. Just hopefully it won't electronically force the audio into Mono when in AM mode. > I have good soldering skills (My other hobby is 8-bit computers, > and with the TRS-80, you get good at replacing the 6809 CPU) I still love old 8-bit computers... they aren't so good for typing up a 250-page dissertation or crunching thousands of numbers in a spreadsheet, but when it comes to both games and programming, they are much more enjoyable than any of today's computers. (And some of the capabilities of the Commodore 64 and Atari 800 *still* haven't been matched by today's PCs or Macs.) But the "Trash-80"... ugh. It was crude even by 1977 standards. No color, no sound, no lowercase text, blocky "graphics", 4K base RAM, and only THREE error messages for the whole Level I system: "WHAT?", "HOW?", and "SORRY". Heh... if Windows used only those three messages, I think it would be a lot more user-friendly! From bjackson@indyradio.com Fri Dec 06 08:13:14 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Dec 2002 16:13:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 65562 invoked from network); 6 Dec 2002 16:13:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Dec 2002 16:13:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Dec 2002 16:13:13 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.155] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Dec 2002 16:13:13 -0000 Date: Fri, 06 Dec 2002 16:13:12 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Carver Stereo Question Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2001 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923" X-Originating-IP: 64.25.100.62 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Kevin T." wrote: > Chris would probably say that *anything* is easy to convert... but I can say that these older radios are generally much easier to add > AM Stereo to than the new radios which cram the whole AM/FM tuner into a single surface-mount chip. Just hopefully it won't electronically force the audio into Mono when in AM mode. I'll try to scan the www for schematics. I don't think it forces to mono because it has a mono button on the front...if you press it, even on AM, it will cut out briefly when the button is only halfway pressed in. > > > I have good soldering skills (My other hobby is 8-bit computers, > > and with the TRS-80, you get good at replacing the 6809 CPU) > > I still love old 8-bit computers... they aren't so good for typing up a 250-page dissertation or crunching thousands of numbers in a spreadsheet, but when it comes to both games and programming, they are much more enjoyable than any of today's computers. (And some of the capabilities of the Commodore 64 and Atari 800 *still* haven't been matched by today's PCs or Macs.) > > But the "Trash-80"... ugh. It was crude even by 1977 standards. > No color, no sound, no lowercase text, blocky "graphics", 4K base RAM, and only THREE error messages for the whole Level I system: "WHAT?", "HOW?", and "SORRY". Heh... if Windows used only those three messages, I think it would be a lot more user-friendly! Actually, you're thinking of the true trash-80 (model I)...I use the TRS-80 Color Computer 1, 2, and 3. Not *really* a TRS-80 because it doesn't use the Z-80 CPU...The Color Computer (coco) uses the Motorola 6809 (1 and 2) or the 68b09e (3) CPU...Sold beginning in 1981 and was the first home PC to do true multi-tasking using OS-9 (Tandy's Unix), and had bulit in 6 bit Digital/analog converters for sound. It only took Microsoft about 10 years to learn how to multitask with several MB of ram...The CoCo can do it in 64kb :-) From amstereoguy@hotmail.com Fri Dec 06 08:43:12 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereoguy@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Dec 2002 16:43:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 33845 invoked from network); 6 Dec 2002 16:43:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Dec 2002 16:43:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (207.68.165.51) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Dec 2002 16:43:12 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 6 Dec 2002 08:43:11 -0800 Received: from 208.228.96.20 by sea2fd.sea2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Fri, 06 Dec 2002 16:43:11 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Carver Stereo Question Date: Fri, 06 Dec 2002 11:43:11 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 06 Dec 2002 16:43:11.0924 (UTC) FILETIME=[909C7740:01C29D46] From: "Chris Cuff" X-Originating-IP: [208.228.96.20] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37866059 True KT- The Carver has a completely separate AM front end IC- The LA1245, if I am not mistaken.. It's cake. Actually, I have one of each- a 2000 and a "receiver" that are both shot, but I can at least look at them. CC > _________________________________________________________________ The new MSN 8: smart spam protection and 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail From michaelj@vcn.com Fri Dec 06 08:50:26 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Dec 2002 16:50:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 2983 invoked from network); 6 Dec 2002 16:50:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Dec 2002 16:50:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m1-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Dec 2002 16:50:25 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m1-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Fri, 6 Dec 2002 09:50:25 -0700 Message-ID: <007201c29d47$9171fa40$0701010a@keva> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Carver Stereo Question Date: Fri, 6 Dec 2002 09:50:22 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Yup! The LA1245 is cake to convert. In the conversions I've done it's been this chip most of the time on all the mistubishi car radios I've done, as well as my JVC home tuner. MJR n WYO ----- Original Message ----- From: Chris Cuff To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, December 06, 2002 9:43 AM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Carver Stereo Question True KT- The Carver has a completely separate AM front end IC- The LA1245, if I am not mistaken.. It's cake. Actually, I have one of each- a 2000 and a "receiver" that are both shot, but I can at least look at them. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From scott.toenniessen@fmr.com Fri Dec 06 10:35:06 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: scott.toenniessen@fmr.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Dec 2002 18:35:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 25645 invoked from network); 6 Dec 2002 18:35:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Dec 2002 18:35:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Dec 2002 18:35:05 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.137] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Dec 2002 18:35:05 -0000 Date: Fri, 06 Dec 2002 18:35:03 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: good AM radios (Aiwa, Philips-Magnavox, etc.) Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 463 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "spt87a" X-Originating-IP: 204.110.135.35 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public As far as I know, Philips owns Magnavox. For the past couple of years they changed from branding everything "Magnavox" to "Phillips Magnavox" in what appears to be a transition to branding everything "Phillips" and retiring the Magnavox name. - Scott > The only thing is that Philips and Magnavox now seem to have gone > their separate ways in manufacturing consumer audio products... > anybody know which one, or both, is still using the good AM tuner? From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Dec 06 10:41:42 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Dec 2002 18:41:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 86447 invoked from network); 6 Dec 2002 18:41:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Dec 2002 18:41:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.87) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Dec 2002 18:41:36 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.159] by n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Dec 2002 18:41:25 -0000 Date: Fri, 06 Dec 2002 18:41:24 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Carver Stereo Question Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <007201c29d47$9171fa40$0701010a@keva> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 944 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Yup! The LA1245 is cake to convert. In the conversions I've done > it's been this chip most of the time on all the mistubishi car > radios I've done, as well as my JVC home tuner. By the way, I believe you can swap in an LA1247 chip with no other changes and get slightly better sensitivity. I have a Realistic receiver from the mid-'80s that forces the AM audio to mono -- but then offers the choice of using an IMX "Stereo Expander" feature on top of that... quite useless because all it does is boost the L-R component of the sound, and with mono audio, there is no L-R component to boost. If I turn the Stereo Expander all the way up, it just ends up making the mono AM sound slightly out-of-phase. It also has a rather poor front end... with the built-in AM antenna, it is fine, but hook up anything to its external AM antenna screw, and at night you'll get Shortwave stations and teletype noise coming in all across the AM band! From tomray@wor710.com Fri Dec 06 11:32:16 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: tomray@wor710.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Dec 2002 19:32:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 5167 invoked from network); 6 Dec 2002 19:32:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Dec 2002 19:32:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Dec 2002 19:32:15 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.169] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Dec 2002 19:32:06 -0000 Date: Fri, 06 Dec 2002 19:32:05 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: WOR-HD Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 9114 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wortomray2002" X-Originating-IP: 151.202.104.14 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public Well, I must say that I've had my entertainment for the day. And now it's my turn. - The HD radio we have is a piece of test equipment, much like a modulation monitor. If anyone can produce an insurance rider for the $15,000 price tag, I'd be happy to consider loaning it to you. You will be completely responsible for it's repair or replacement should it become damaged. - You don't believe that WOR's transmitted spectrum is not exceeding the NRSC requirements and the FCC rules. Prove it. I can prove we are operating legally. I have the measurement data to prove it. WOR's transmitter is not producing any emissions beyond +/-15kHz of the carrier. And these emissions are under the NRSC mask. For the person who says we are operating 7dBc above the NRSC mask....prove it. I have the data showing full compliance. Maybe you should read the regulations and the white papers on IBOC and see where the sidebands actually live. They are legal. - You want to write the FCC and Industry Canada. Have a great time! The IBOC nighttime tests were requested and sanctioned by the FCC. And maybe members posting here should become familiar with FCC regulations. We are under no obligation to protect skywave. We are under an obligation to protect groundwave contours. Stations producing skywave are required to protect us, not the other way around. We are a US Class A radio station, and the majority of protections are stations protecting us. - I will put my Optimod 9200 up against a BL-40, Level Devil or any other antiquated piece of processing equipment. My transmitter will be considerably louder and cleaner than yours. And it will be operating legally. And we recently found two Symetrapeaks and put them in the dumpster where they rightfully belong. - If you have studied receiver circuits, you would know about imaging and overload. Overload will produce unintended byproducts which appear as splatter, as will poor front end and tuning design. I can drive up to the WOR transmitter site and hear us at 1420. This is not coming from our transmitter (and again, I can prove it). This is being generated in my car radio. The same thing happens when I drive by WABC's transmitter site.....they appear on 1540 on my radio. - We are under an obligation by the FCC to transmit a clean spectrum. We are not under an obligation by the FCC to make sure your radio can properly acquire, process, or reproduce our clean spectrum. As long as our transmitted signal meets FCC regulations, we have met our obligation. This is clearly stated in the regulations. - Pay radio. Who the hell came up with that? IBOC will not require a listener to pay a fee to listen. - Receiver prices. Can anyone show me the information you have obtained on IBOC receiver prices? The price of an IBOC receiver will not exceed $100 (initially) of it's equivalent analog model. Over the next couple of years, the radios will be the same price as the current analog models. This isn't HDTV, and it sure isn't L band, where you can expect to pay many hundreds of dollars for a radio, far outside the budget of the average listener. - The average WOR listener, ie, the housewife and business professionals listening on their way to and from work, do not have the time to go out and buy, or research, the few decent quality AM radios that are on the market. They schlep into work listening to their stock AM radio. And on a stock AM radio, WOR sounds just fine. iBiquity has done their testing by obtaining one of each model radio that is currently available on the market. And their data is based on these models. What is your data based on? - My statement that WOR sounds just fine at 5kHz. This is selective editing. My statement was that, on the average car radio, ie, what is in my Ford Explorer, my wife's Ford Focus, and Kerry's Cadillac, there was no audible difference switching between NRSC audio and 5kHz audio. I guess this means that the audio bandwidth of the radio is below 5kHz, which is entirely the point of reducing the audio bandwidth. If the average radio cannot reproduce the transmitted spectrum, why am I transmitting it? If I could transmit to 20kHz I would. Since the radio can't hear it, it makes no sense to raise the station's electric bill transmitting information that the majority of people can't hear. - WOR's audio bandwidth. It has been claimed that it is 5kHz. We are actually (and this was correctly posted) transmitting at 6.2kHz. Yes, we are cheating on the IBOC....and the IBOC is working just fine with this extra audio bandwidth. Since we started transmitting IBOC, the bandwidth is 6.2kHz. The IBOC standard is 5kHz, and this is what we tell people, as it IS the standard. I fail to see the signifigance of this. - As with any new service, there are bugs to be worked out. And this requires real world testing. WOR is proud to be part of one of the biggest changes in radio transmission in decades, and have devoted our facility to help the cause. - Will Rogers once said that, even if you are on the right track, you will get run over if you simply stand still. As an engineer in the business, I would think you have an obligation to your employer to thoroughly research new developments, weigh the pros and cons, and ask questions and become informed before condemning said development. When you are unemployed in the next several years because of your refusal to acknowlege that change is in the wind, please do not come to me looking for employment. - My qualifications have been questioned. I have 25 years in this business, and have worked a various stations, at least two legendary giants. I had an FCC First Class License(which I obtained at 19 years old) that became and FCC General Class License. I am certified by the Society of Broadcast Engineers. I have Presidential recognition for my work on the Connecticut SECC/EAS committee for the development of a behind the scenes system to link state officials, EAS stations, and public utilities before a message goes out, I did the design work on a public prison escape alerting system for the state of Connecticut, I am on the New Jersey Anti-Terrorism Infrastructure Advisory Committee, I am on the Board of Directors for the Society of Broadcast Engineers, and am working on a project in association with the National Association of Broadcasters. I have wide industry respect by owners, managers, and engineers alike. I consult on the side. And I am piloting WOR into the 21st century. I know what I am talking about and know how to implement what I am talking about. And yes, I was a big proponent of AM stereo in it's heyday, converting at least three stations, and piloting the legendary WTIC through it's AM stereo phase. I have nothing against AM stereo. But it's time facts were faced, and AM stereo is not and will not be making a comeback. - The qualifications of the most vocal of the bunch here on this board seem to consist of: we can identify a radio : we can turn the radio on : and we can tune the radio to make it produce noise of some type. I probably should be impressed. Before you make some of the statements you are making, you should research the subject and become informed rather than shooting from the hip. If you think that your comments to the FCC will be taken seriously, I would hope that you look at some of the statements that are on this site. The FCC will dismiss them as asinine. They have work to do and no time to fool around. - AM as high fidelity. I define high fidelity as a system that can faithfully reproduce the full range of audio, both dynamic and frequency response, and does not contain noise and distortion. AM radio is limited to 9.5kHz audio bandwidth, most older transmitters have a noise floor of maybe -50dB, and there is inherent distortion in AM detectors, though the newer ones are almost immeasurable. AM is also suseptable to atmospheric and electrical noise. Maybe someone can help me understand how AM radio is high fidelity. - Anyone who wishes to educate him or herself, and can communicate without making libelous, slanderous, false, demeaning, and uninformed statements may feel free to contact me for a constructive discussion about IBOC. If you're going to be abusive and illogical, your message won't be answered. Oh. And we log all caller ID into our PBX here, so harassing phone calls will simply be turned over to the authorities. Kerry has received several "breathing" calls today. I will be pulling this information from the PBX shortly and forwarding it to NYPD. I am sick and tired of the crap that is being perpetrated by certain persons on various message boards. I would think that we're all adults and can discuss these topics. Looking at most of these posts, I guess my assumption on the adult part is incorrect. Thomas R. Ray, III, CSRE Corporate Director of Engineering Buckley Broadcasting/WOR Radio NYC tomray@wor710.com 212-642-4462 From tomray@wor710.com Fri Dec 06 11:36:13 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: tomray@wor710.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Dec 2002 19:36:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 83377 invoked from network); 6 Dec 2002 19:36:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Dec 2002 19:36:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.75) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Dec 2002 19:36:11 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.142] by n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Dec 2002 19:36:11 -0000 Date: Fri, 06 Dec 2002 19:36:11 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fw: WOR/WLW Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3DF03898.9BCFB01E@skyweb.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3314 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wortomray2002" X-Originating-IP: 151.202.104.14 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public And you, sir, are misinformed and foul mouthed. The spectrum analyzer is measuring transmitted performance.....and was being used in a real world environment. We also had 6 normal consumer radios to listen to. I am not hearing this on any radio. We had splatter passing "radio row" on the NJ turnpike, and some issues near Newark Airport. And a spectrum analyzer "rigged" to show 5kHz short of the mask would not have produced the full spectrum from 660-770kHz, as we were monitoring. And the FCC will also conduct tests with a spectrum analyzer, not in your theoretical "real world". I would rather have my head in a spectrum analyzer than up my ass, as your statement so aptly demonstrates. Tom Ray WOR Radio --- In amstereoforum@y..., Neal Newman wrote: > this seems like a no win this guy has his Head in a spectrum analyser.... that's > theory Not real world... I am Willing to bet that the Analyser belongs to > Ibiquity.. Its rigged to be 5kc short from the mask. so anyone looking at says > see we are within the mask LOL...725 My butt.. even my Boss while on a trip to > NY heard it splatter 740 WGSM > with a Rented car... not what I call a high Quality radio.. its a Standard car > radio > Hell my van has a Cheap radioshack car radio in it.. Ohh I see its a Cheap radio > It has a bad front end.. Hell all Am radios have lousy front Ends these days... > He Farts and they call him ? isn't that what he said.. No wonder the station > sounds like S***T smells like it from what he said... Sorry Guys I just could not > resist that one.. > > KC4QLP@a... wrote: > > > In a message dated 12/5/02 2:22:56 PM Eastern Standard Time, > > possumhunter@n... writes: > > > > << I would strongly disagree with your statements, particularly the statement > > about hiss caused by WOR to WSB. This is impossible, as the IBOC carriers > > are dead in the water at 725kHz. There are no emissions beyond this > > frequency. Unless you are listening with an extremely broad band radio, > > which is not the case of most listeners. > > >> > > I find this very hard to beleive > > > > Bob Carter > > Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group > > > > WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 > > Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 > > > > Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering > > services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. > > e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@e... > > http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice > > Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC > > WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC > > WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC > > Ray Communications Radio Network > > > > AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- > > amstereo-subcribe@t... > > > > KC4QLP Amateur Radio > > Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va > > www.kc4qlp.cjb.net > > > > voice contact-252-335-0856 > > fax 1-209-254-8978 > > _______________________________________________________ > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From jsgil@hal-pc.org Fri Dec 06 11:50:37 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Dec 2002 19:50:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 21751 invoked from network); 6 Dec 2002 19:50:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Dec 2002 19:50:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Dec 2002 19:50:35 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.142] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Dec 2002 19:50:33 -0000 Date: Fri, 06 Dec 2002 19:50:32 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Carver Stereo Question Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 753 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.198 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@y..., "Chris Cuff" wrote: > True KT- The Carver has a completely separate AM front end IC- The LA1245, > if I am not mistaken.. It's cake. Actually, I have one of each- a 2000 and a > "receiver" that are both shot, but I can at least look at them. > > CC > That's the same chip that the RS TM-152 uses. I was having some distortion issues with the TM-152 as it didn't sound as clean as my Pioneer DTR receiver which used the LA1265 that I had put a MC13020 decoder in it. I got the datasheet for the LA1245 to try to diagnose the problem but came to the conclusion that maybe the local osc in the TM-152 wasn't as stable as the one in my Pioneer that I assume has a LO referenced to a crystal. JSG From groucho@skyweb.net Fri Dec 06 13:51:13 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Dec 2002 21:51:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 9633 invoked from network); 6 Dec 2002 21:51:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Dec 2002 21:51:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Dec 2002 21:51:11 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gB6LuTIJ061038 for ; Fri, 6 Dec 2002 16:56:29 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DF11B1E.84355CCF@skyweb.net> Date: Fri, 06 Dec 2002 16:48:14 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} WOR-HD References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Ok my turn again we are not talking skywave During the Day ? No.... does the WOR contour Overlaps WPHE's Contour Yes is it ground wave... YES... is it Possible For WOR to Overload the Front End of 5 different radios at about 50 miles away... It may Be possible But I highly doubt it. Tom care to answer that For Me? Now if I was up in the Meadowlands would I expect WOR to overload a front End.? Absolutely.. I would expect it on any radio from any of the Big stations actually I would Expect it from a 500 watter If I was parked under its antenna . However I would Not expect it from a 50 watt test station From a mile and a half away. 2 adjacent over... this is the Question I would Like Tom and or Kerry to Answer... Would you Expect a 50 watt station To overload a front End from 1. Mile away 2 adjacent Over??? My answer would Be NO... what's theirs? I will say I love the last Comments.. but the answers always seem to be answered with more confusing answers... seems to me It does not matter if its a cheap or expensive radio we are listening to.. But the problem is our receivers? I guess I have this part Right... But and I quote" average WOR listener, ie, the housewife and business professionals listening on their way to and from work, do not have the time to go out and buy, or research, the few decent quality AM radios that are on the market. They schlep into work listening to their stock AM radio. And on a stock AM radio, WOR sounds just fine." gee aren't those the Same Type of radios WE are listening on??? But we are not Listening to 710 we are Trying to Listen to the Stations 2 adjacent away.. well some of us are? others are trying to get 700 and 720.. what makes WOR's listeners Radios different than what I listening On? I am totally confused here.. anyone else confused. My data is based on what the average listeners are using as radios The Same as your listeners.. Only that they are not listening to WOR... and whatever radio it is. the front End is Getting overloaded 50 miles away I'm Sorry I just cannot see that.. I'm not looking for a fight... I Don't have all the awards or credits You Do. But I am also an Engineer. been involved in broadcasting since my high school days. and I never heard such nonsense like this... Granted the Station may be Running within the legal Guidelines But that Does not make it right to Say IBOC is is ok and it must be every type of receiver that has the overload Problem. that's causing the hiss what I would Like is Proof. here is a challenge I would like to place any receiver I have and any receiver that anyone else here has against just one "stock am radio" that your listeners have that you claim they hear WOR fine.. I am Not Interested In whether WOR sounds fine. I know It sounds fine on any radio I have listened to it on.. I am interested in whether their radio will hear any hiss (or front end overload) within 1 Mile Of the 50 watt test station on 1700. and NOT hear any hiss on 1680. Prove this to Me.. I went on a friendly visit to Ibiquity. to try and learn More and to see IBOC first hand on an Analyser with My own 2 eyes. and was Met by a very Rude employee Like they had something to Hide I am not trying to Be Rude here I am trying to learn and understand why a 50 watt station can create so much noise on MY signal from over 1 Mile away. In My Protected Contour. and Not being Rude.. but If yourself Kerry or my Friend who works for Ibiquity can prove this to me .I will Possibly believe that IBOC. digital will Not trash the Common listener with their stock am radios.. that's all.. this has to be Proven . If this can Be proven to Me and I can understand all this... I would Be another Engineer in the Digital corner of this so called"Fight against IBOC". But in reality I don't see this challenge happening. I have Been advised by my Bosses to Not make Waves, However they also told me to Voice My Concerns. since the Test station is causing the Hash in my contour to my station. actually not just hash.. but to Blankets Me out for 1/4 to 1/2 mile from its location 2 adjacent away... I am sure that If I placed a Legal test station on 690 or 720 in the middle of midtown manhattan. the listeners of 710 would Be having Fits.. that's exactly what's happening in the Warren industrial park. Now Im probably talking Foolish.. But can we get Ibiquity to Do just that to prove a point. file for another experimental station on either 690 or 720 In Midtown and see if it interferes with 710??? show us the proof.... I think that's fair comments welcome Neal > . We are under an obligation to protect groundwave contours. Stations > producing skywave are required to protect us, not the other way > around. We are a US Class A radio station, and the majority of > protections are stations protecting us. > - If you have studied receiver circuits, you would know about imaging > and overload. Overload will produce unintended byproducts which > appear as splatter, as will poor front end and tuning design. I can > drive up to the WOR transmitter site and hear us at 1420. This is > not coming from our transmitter (and again, I can prove it). This is > being generated in my car radio. The same thing happens when I drive > by WABC's transmitter site.....they appear on 1540 on my radio. > - The average WOR listener, ie, the housewife and business > professionals listening on their way to and from work, do not have > the time to go out and buy, or research, the few decent quality AM > radios that are on the market. They schlep into work listening to > their stock AM radio. And on a stock AM radio, WOR sounds just > fine. iBiquity has done their testing by obtaining one of each model > radio that is currently available on the market. And their data is > based on these models. What is your data based on? From ccuff@in4web.com Fri Dec 06 14:31:10 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Dec 2002 22:31:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 92987 invoked from network); 6 Dec 2002 22:31:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Dec 2002 22:31:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Dec 2002 22:31:09 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.61]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id ; Fri, 6 Dec 2002 17:25:50 -0500 Message-ID: <000701c29d75$f989fe60$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: Cc: References: Subject: Bob Steele passes on Date: Fri, 6 Dec 2002 17:22:33 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 At 91, veteran radio morning man form WTIC 1080 in Hartford has passed away. He died peacefully in his sleep. I have many fond memories of Bob- Our family grew up with him. Our kitchen radio was always glued to WTIC. I met him once, and he was just as nice in person. He still maintained a once a month Saturday show, right up till the end. The crowing rooster, the joke of the day, The "oldie", the birthday lists.... This was when radio was radio. It is a sad day. Chris From evergreenterrace@buzzle.com Fri Dec 06 14:49:06 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: evergreenterrace@buzzle.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Dec 2002 22:49:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 27978 invoked from network); 6 Dec 2002 22:49:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Dec 2002 22:49:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Dec 2002 22:49:05 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.185] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Dec 2002 22:49:05 -0000 Date: Fri, 06 Dec 2002 22:49:03 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: WOR-HD Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2311 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgliradio" X-Originating-IP: 170.20.11.59 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=69711087 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgliradio --- In amstereoforum@y..., "wortomray2002" wrote: My 2 cents not being an IBOC supporter: I have not heard the extra splatter everyone else has spoken about in the nighttime tests. Monitoring on my Delco, it sounds the same as it always has. This afternoon I was listening to WOR in Flushing NY. I did not notice any change listening on the same radio. It does not seem to be any different with the newer software (in fact, I heard nothing abnormal while tuning up to listen to WGSM 740). I have not listened to my other reference radios. I have been quite busy with an install at one of my FM's and troubleshooting EAS at an AM. Tom is correct. IF you run a station within FCC legal parameters for transmission, there is NOTHING the end user can do if the receiver cannot faithfully reproduce that. It is a factor of poor receiver design (which has plagued AM AND FM for years). 1) I feel IBOC is the 800 pound gorilla for the AM band (especially in the 1200-1600 kc region). IBOC emissions, while they may be within the NRSC mask, are unlike anything anticipated when bandwidth regs were written. THAT is the problem. 2) I FULLY believe that WOR is completely legal. PERIOD 3) It is very difficult to change the FCC's mind. 4) We all are intitled to our opinions. Some love Powerside. I think it sucks. I also hate (with all my heart) the 9200 but love the 9100, the Omnia AM-3, the Arianne, Moseley TAL-310 and old CRL gear. The 9200 can get loud, but with artifacts I cannot tolerate listening to (and this is after playing with one, so it comes from experience). Some may not mind, it's their taste. Everyone has their likes and dislikes and has reasons for liking different gear. Tempers are high all over because of this (even on my part). 5) AM is only band limited by NRSC. AM is capable of high fidelity with properly designed AMAX radios and clean transmitter plants passing quality audio. I feel it is much closer to hi-fi than anything I have heard from iBiquity. BUT, I am one who CANNOT STAND compression noise in hf info, which is the symptom of HD Radio AM. I have not heard the new software. I would hope it is improved. But for now, wideband AM, to me, sounds better than HD Radio AM or and rivals clippy analog MPX FM. From possumhunter@netzero.net Fri Dec 06 16:02:55 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: possumhunter@netzero.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Dec 2002 00:02:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 84643 invoked from network); 7 Dec 2002 00:02:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Dec 2002 00:02:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rly-ip05.mx.aol.com) (64.12.138.9) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Dec 2002 00:02:46 -0000 Received: from logs-to.proxy.aol.com (logs-to.proxy.aol.com [152.163.204.2]) by rly-ip05.mx.aol.com (v89.10) with ESMTP id RELAYIN10-1206190205; Fri, 06 Dec 2002 19:02:05 1900 Received: from ibm (AC961DE1.ipt.aol.com [172.150.29.225]) by logs-to.proxy.aol.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with SMTP id gB701ig34633 for ; Fri, 6 Dec 2002 19:01:44 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <008501c29d83$ceb15540$e11d96ac@aoldsl.net> To: Subject: Fw: WOR's Interference to CHWO Date: Fri, 6 Dec 2002 18:44:44 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Apparently-From: DodgeRamTrucker@aol.com From: "Possum Hunter" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Cc: ; ; Sent: Friday, December 06, 2002 2:02 PM Subject: WOR's Interference to CHWO > Hello Mr. Raper, > > Thank you very much providing me with additional details on the radio > interference you are experiencing. It is apparent from your e-mail that you > were attempting to listen to Canadian stations which were interfered by US > stations. As I had explained to you in my previous e-mail, the reception of > Canadian AM stations is not interference protected over US land mass. Your > complaint would best be directed to the Federal Communications Commission in > Washington. > > Thank you very much for your interest, > > Kirit > > From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Fri Dec 06 16:53:37 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Dec 2002 00:53:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 31892 invoked from network); 7 Dec 2002 00:53:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Dec 2002 00:53:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf10bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.30) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Dec 2002 00:53:36 -0000 Received: from juan ([68.154.106.218]) by imf10bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.19 201-253-122-122-119-20020516) with SMTP id <20021207005525.CIBC4440.imf10bis.bellsouth.net@juan> for ; Fri, 6 Dec 2002 19:55:25 -0500 Message-ID: <006901c29d8b$12d66290$af78fea9@juan> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} WOR-HD Date: Fri, 6 Dec 2002 19:53:35 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit - The average WOR listener, ie, the housewife and business professionals listening on their way to and from work, do not have the time to go out and buy, or research, the few decent quality AM radios that are on the market. They schlep into work listening to their stock AM radio. And on a stock AM radio, WOR sounds just fine. Yep, and the average WOR listener could give a sh*t about HI-FI or improved sound on a TALK STATION. This is why IBOC will fail. Joe six pack and Jane Doe are not going to spend an extra $100 dollars to get so called Hi-FI talk ? Nope.. don't think so. IBOC has enough rope, let it hang itself. This expensive experiment is amusing, but it will soon be a footnote in AM Radio history. Juan Gualda KB0GXM WGNX-WTTB-WOSN-WGYL [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From possumhunter@netzero.net Fri Dec 06 17:30:20 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Dec 2002 01:30:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 53212 invoked from network); 7 Dec 2002 01:30:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Dec 2002 01:30:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.206) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Dec 2002 01:30:18 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 6 Dec 2002 17:30:18 -0800 To: , "Tom Ray" References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} WOR-HD Date: Fri, 6 Dec 2002 20:30:01 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 07 Dec 2002 01:30:18.0878 (UTC) FILETIME=[33BEA9E0:01C29D90] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.150.29.225] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 wortomray2002 wrote: > - The HD radio we have is a piece of test equipment, much like a modulation monitor. If anyone can produce an insurance rider for the $15,000 price tag, I'd be happy to consider loaning it to you. Today I was talking to Bob Cauthen at Broadcast Electronics about a transmitter I am buying from them when the discussion moved to IBOC. He told me BE has not released their IBOC Mod monitor yet, but it will be around $6000 bucks. If you paid 15 grand for it, you got screwed. > > - I will put my Optimod 9200 up against a BL-40, Level Devil or any other antiquated piece of processing equipment. The antique processing equipment I have is on my part 15 station at my house. The station I work for has a Optimod 9200. If I was in the same market as you, I would gladly take you up on the "Loud Wars" challenge on a weekend when there are no survey books floating around....or better yet, how about a sound quality war? I can make my station sound better than your IBOC signal. How about let's use Beethoven's 6th in F-Flat as the source audio I would even let YOU pick the transmitter that I use. Harris SX1, RCA BTA1R, or even one of Chris Cuff's home brew "Alfredo Lite" Part 15 transmitters. I think I could even do it on the LPB AM-60. As far as a sound quality war goes, I can just send Neal a copy of the Beethoven CD and he can play it on WTTM as it is now and win that one. > >And we recently found two Symetrapeaks and put them in the dumpster where they rightfully belong. Now that was real SMART! You coulda sold 'em on ebay or RW classifieds. > > - If you have studied receiver circuits, you would know about imaging and overload. Overload will produce unintended byproducts which appear as splatter, as will poor front end and tuning design. OK, Now I want you to explain to me how WOR's Skywave signal could be overloading the front end of a car radio nearly a thousand miles from the transmitter site. Perhaps WOR is also overloading my GE Superadio III? Never mind that the only time WOR has splattered these two radios was during IBOC transmissions. > > - The average WOR listener, ie, the housewife and business professionals listening on their way to and from work, do not have the time to go out and buy, or research, the few decent quality AM radios that are on the market. They schlep into work listening to their stock AM radio. And on a stock AM radio, WOR sounds just fine. Unless they drive Toyotas, Dodges, or Chevys. Tell me the reasoning of your logic. If Somebody in the NY area gripes about WOR blasting their favorite station CHWO, into noise, it is overloading of their cheap receiver. If some body a thousand miles away gripes about WOR blasting their favorite stations, WLW and CHWO, it is because they have too good of a radio with high bandwidth. Both gripers have the exact SAME make and model radio and are trying to listen to the same station. You just don't make any sense. > > iBiquity has done their testing by obtaining one of each model radio that is currently available on the market. And their data is based on these models.They missed a few! > >What is your data based on? Several "average" radios and a couple of the very best radios currently on the American consumer market. > > My statement was that, on the average car radio, ie, what is in my Ford Explorer, my wife's Ford Focus, and Kerry's Cadillac, there was no audible difference switching between NRSC audio and 5kHz audio. On this issue, I agree with you. There is no need at all for a News-Talk station to broadcast more than 5Khz. Most talk networks have one 7Khz of bandwidth anyway. > > Yes, we are cheating on the IBOC....and the IBOC is working just fine with this extra audio bandwidth. Perhaps that is why it makes hiss on 60Khz of radio spectrum. > > As an engineer in the business, I would think you have an obligation to your employer to thoroughly research new developments, weigh the pros and cons, and ask questions and become informed before condemning said development. Both my boss and I listened to the hash fest the other night that WOR and WLW made. Both of us agreed that it would drive too many listeners away. We both agreed C-QUAM is the best path to follow. > > When you are unemployed in the next several years because of your refusal to acknowlege that change is in the wind, please do not come to me looking for employment. I do not want to work for a radio station that has the attitude " We don't care who we splatter or how bad we screw up the AM band as long as we can make ourselves look legal to the FCC and people can hear us in the New York metro." > > - AM as high fidelity. I define high fidelity as a system that can faithfully reproduce the full range of audio, both dynamic and frequency response, and does not contain noise and distortion. I have heard many AM C-QUAM stations that sounded better than the IBOC clip on your web site. > > - Anyone who wishes to educate him or herself, and can communicate without making libelous, slanderous, false, demeaning, and uninformed statements may feel free to contact me for a constructive discussion about IBOC. I don't think any of the emails I have sent to you about this have been. I was not the one who made reference of what end of a horse any opinions were coming from. As a broadcast professional, I am very interested in this technology and how it will affect radio....and my paycheck. When the radio bands are full of IBOC noise, then people will just go buy XM radios, or just pop a CD in. Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Fri Dec 06 18:02:39 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: possumhunter@netzero.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Dec 2002 02:02:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 5144 invoked from network); 7 Dec 2002 02:02:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Dec 2002 02:02:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rly-ip05.mx.aol.com) (64.12.138.9) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Dec 2002 02:02:36 -0000 Received: from logs-to.proxy.aol.com (logs-to.proxy.aol.com [152.163.204.2]) by rly-ip05.mx.aol.com (v89.10) with ESMTP id RELAYIN1-1206210203; Fri, 06 Dec 2002 21:02:03 1900 Received: from ibm (AC961DE1.ipt.aol.com [172.150.29.225]) by logs-to.proxy.aol.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with SMTP id gB7214g79924 for ; Fri, 6 Dec 2002 21:01:04 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <00df01c29d94$7a3e0240$e11d96ac@aoldsl.net> To: References: <006901c29d8b$12d66290$af78fea9@juan> Subject: Re: {AMSF} WOR-HD Date: Fri, 6 Dec 2002 21:00:49 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Apparently-From: DodgeRamTrucker@aol.com From: "Possum Hunter" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Juan / John Gualda wrote: > Yep, and the average WOR listener could give a sh*t about HI-FI or improved sound on a TALK STATION. This is why IBOC will fail. Joe six pack and Jane Doe are not going to spend an extra $100 dollars to get so called Hi-FI talk ? Nope.. don't think so. IBOC has enough rope, let it hang itself. This expensive experiment is amusing, but it will soon be a footnote in AM Radio history. Very true. Why should WOR expect Joe Six Pack to pay an extra $100 bucks for digitaly compressed "Hi-Fi"? AMAX QUAM radios cost less than a dollar moe than a lo-fi AM. Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Fri Dec 06 18:39:58 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Dec 2002 02:39:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 71820 invoked from network); 7 Dec 2002 02:39:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Dec 2002 02:39:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf23bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.193) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Dec 2002 02:39:56 -0000 Received: from juan ([68.154.106.218]) by imf23bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.19 201-253-122-122-119-20020516) with SMTP id <20021207024145.HRAT14795.imf23bis.bellsouth.net@juan> for ; Fri, 6 Dec 2002 21:41:45 -0500 Message-ID: <001901c29d99$edd65900$af78fea9@juan> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} WOR-HD Date: Fri, 6 Dec 2002 21:39:56 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit wortomray2002 wrote: > - The HD radio we have is a piece of test equipment, much like a modulation monitor. If anyone can produce an insurance rider for the $15,000 price tag, I'd be happy to consider loaning it to you. Today I was talking to Bob Cauthen at Broadcast Electronics about a transmitter I am buying from them when the discussion moved to IBOC. He told me BE has not released their IBOC Mod monitor yet, but it will be around $6000 bucks. If you paid 15 grand for it, you got screwed. Any Radio Corp. that spends hard earned $$$ on IBOC must have deep pockets...my hat is off to them. God Bless em'...Most Radio groups will not spend $$$ on this crap. > >And we recently found two Symetrapeaks and put them in the dumpster where they rightfully belong. Now that was real SMART! You coulda sold 'em on ebay or RW classifieds. Again, Must have deep pockets. I guess $$$ is no option....Hey when you got the $$$, the heck with everything else , right ? Juan [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From jsgil@hal-pc.org Fri Dec 06 18:45:45 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Dec 2002 02:45:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 77919 invoked from network); 7 Dec 2002 02:45:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Dec 2002 02:45:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Dec 2002 02:45:45 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.139] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 07 Dec 2002 02:45:45 -0000 Date: Sat, 07 Dec 2002 02:45:45 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: WOR-HD Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 6774 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.26 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@y..., "wortomray2002" wrote: > Well, I must say that I've had my entertainment for the day. > > And now it's my turn. > > > - You don't believe that WOR's transmitted spectrum is not exceeding > the NRSC requirements and the FCC rules. Prove it. I can prove we > are operating legally. I have the measurement data to prove it. > WOR's transmitter is not producing any emissions beyond +/-15kHz of > the carrier. And these emissions are under the NRSC mask. For the > person who says we are operating 7dBc above the NRSC mask....prove > it. I have the data showing full compliance. Maybe you should read > the regulations and the white papers on IBOC and see where the > sidebands actually live. They are legal. > > - We are under an obligation by the FCC to transmit a clean > spectrum. We are not under an obligation by the FCC to make sure > your radio can properly acquire, process, or reproduce our clean > spectrum. As long as our transmitted signal meets FCC regulations, > we have met our obligation. This is clearly stated in the > regulations. > If you are refering to the graph with the NRSC mask and IBOC sidebands that was posted on this forum, it is a faithful representation of the IBOC graph in iBiquity's AM All Digital Report overlayed onto the NRSC mask with the more restricted dotted line for a white noise type signal which is the best description for the IBOC signal. Great care was taken to get an accurate measurement from the iBiquity graph by displaying the graph in an image program and countung pixels. It should be accurate well within 0.5dB of iBiquity's graph. The Primary sidebands during hybrid mode do exceed this dotted line by 7dB at 15KHz and at 10KHz don't exceed them at all. This dotted line was only meant as a test to measure certain parameters of a station's bantwidth and the FCC did not intend a station to broadcast white noise up to the limits of this mask as a program 24hrs/day. Could you imagine if half of the stations in a crowded market like the NE started broadcasting white noise as program material and what it would do to the other half that didn't? Beleive me there would be many complaints to the FCC if the average Joe knew how to file a complaint. As for the engineers at the other stations whose program wasn't white noise would definitely be filing complaints. You stated that the tests are done at -6dB of what the carriers will be and given that most antenna systems are not perfectly flat and that there is a -1dB cut at 15KHz then just maybe the Primary sidebands are just under this more restrictive mask which is what IBOC signal should governed by then WOR is probably just in compliance. Even Clear Channel, after taking several measurements on IBOC transmittions, stated that the IBOC sidebands should be transmitted at -6dB of what iBiquity recomended and I guess this is why WOR is testing at -6dB. There is no way for the Primary sidebands to be transmitted at the full power that iBiquity recomeds and still be below the mask for white noise type signals. But this is besides the point. Just as it is for analog transmittions the white noise test is just a test and not normal program material. "This is a Test! This is a test of iBuquity's digital hash white noise that has the potential to wipe out all reception for existing analog radios! This is only a test!" I sure wish this was only going to be a test and not a transmittion method ;-). When and if IBOC is approved for regular transmittions and as more stations come on line then it will be like many analog stations broadcasting white noise as program material. It is the additive effect of many stations that will have an exponential effect of the sound quality for the existing radios. There is no way iBiquity can fully simulate the effect of the interference issues that will exist in crowded markets for many overlapping IBOC signals and the effects it will have on existing radios. Time will tell the full story when and if many IBOC stations have been rolled out in crowded markets. For HDTV or IBOC-FM does not pose the many problems that AM (meduim wave) has. They don't have the overlapping signal problems and skywave issues. Even hams know better not mix diffefent signal types. They have separate spectrum set aside for CW, Data, Voice & TV. The tests that WOR is running may be within compliance but I don't see being able to increase IBOC signal without going into violation. The AM band is about 1.2MHz wide and represents aboout .05% of our total radio spectrum if you go up to 2GHz and I find it hard to believe that 1MHz of bandwidth can't be found where existing stations can put their DAB signal and not interfere with existing radios. Now this may mean that stations will spend more on setup but they won't have to deal with the overlay issues an if a higher frequency is used that means shorter and less expensive antennas. If a consumer was sold a DAB radio and when he put it on channel 710 and got WOR's DAB he wouldn't know and would't care if it was actually transmitting on 710KHz or some other frequency with the channel number 710 assigned to it. I think that trying to retrofit the existing AM band for digital mixed in with analog and given the inherent noise problems it has is a stupid idea. There are no US SW stations and I would be supprised if 1MHz of bandwidth couldn't be found there. Many other countries use the SW bands why can't we. I am not against digital as I have Satillite TV and for the most part it works pretty good but it does suffer from digital compression artifacts from time to time but I am more picky about artifacts in audio compression. When IBOC on AM was first proposed it boasted FM Stereo quality on AM which means a quality of what you get when receiving a classical station with minimal processing like multiband compression on a good home receiver. The kind of bitrate necessary for that is at least 160Kbps using the highest quality mp3 encoder with VBR. Now PAC boasts better compresion but I don't think it can cut the bitrate to one third of that and still get that kind of quality and using SBR(Spectral Band Replication) where only encoding up to 8KHz and synthetically generating frequencies above 8KHz is cheating. Well that can be done with analog AM to compensate for frequencies above 10KHz. That still gives analog AM a real frequency response higer than a SBR based DAB signal. Remember that DAB spelled backwards is BAD ;-). So now it will only be near mono FM quality. Is that 5 times better that the wideband sound of analog AM to justify a radio that costs 5 times as much? I din't think so. You may lose the background noise with DAB but it will be traded for digital artifacts. JSG From wa2fnq@optonline.net Fri Dec 06 18:59:24 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: wa2fnq@optonline.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Dec 2002 02:59:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 69617 invoked from network); 7 Dec 2002 02:59:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Dec 2002 02:59:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.69) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Dec 2002 02:59:23 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.163] by n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 07 Dec 2002 02:59:23 -0000 Date: Sat, 07 Dec 2002 02:59:19 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: WOR-HD Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2747 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wa2fnq " X-Originating-IP: 24.47.74.230 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=60059615 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa2fnq Tom, I'm not trying to pull your chain but gee whiz man.... What you're hearing on your radio at 1420 as you pull up to your transmitter or hear at 1540 when you drive by WABCs transmitter is most likely the second harmonic of the transmitter itself. Please don't tell me you don't see this on your spectrum analyzer at yor transmitter. Every transmitter puts out these products no matter how good they are. From a 50 KW transmitter I would imagine these products are pretty strong in the immeadiate area even if the transmitter is well within spec. This is why we had an additional 1480 KHz trap at WGSM, 740 when I was there. They had to reduce the second harmonic at 1480 because some of the locals wanted to listen to the station on that frequency. BTW, I don't consider IBOC a very high fidelity mode myself. At a datarate of 96 KB you aren't going to produce audio that's really worth a damn to anybody with a set of critical ears. It wont support more sophisticated audio modes so it's obsolete right from the start. I believe there's a digital future for radio somewhere. IBOC is a nice experiment but I think we should look for something that's better, not just good enough. Unfortunately people think that as soon as you slap the word digital on something that means it's better. That's not true. I see it evey day in my bussiness. People think digital TV is better, yet when you stick an good analog picture next to it you really see the diference. Unless you go easy on the compression you get all sorts of artifacts and loss of quality. It just doesn't work. With IBOC you might as well just settle for listening to .mp3's the rest of your life. Oh....my qualifications: I've been in the bussiness 30+ years. I'm currently the Manager of RF Systems for Home Box Office. I run their satellite uplink. I'm a charter member of the National Association of Radio and Telecommunications Engineers. I've worked at a good number of the radio staions here on Long Island both AM and FM. .... and I have a certificate from Harris saying I understand the workings of HD Radio. Plus other things. Next?? Jerry Mehrab WA2FNQ --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "wortomray2002" wrote: > - If you have studied receiver circuits, you would know about imaging > and overload. Overload will produce unintended byproducts which > appear as splatter, as will poor front end and tuning design. I can > drive up to the WOR transmitter site and hear us at 1420. This is > not coming from our transmitter (and again, I can prove it). This is > being generated in my car radio. The same thing happens when I drive > by WABC's transmitter site.....they appear on 1540 on my radio. hey appear on 1540 on my radio From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Fri Dec 06 19:18:20 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Dec 2002 03:18:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 44904 invoked from network); 7 Dec 2002 03:18:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Dec 2002 03:18:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf05bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.165) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Dec 2002 03:18:18 -0000 Received: from juan ([68.154.106.218]) by imf05bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.19 201-253-122-122-119-20020516) with SMTP id <20021207032007.HXGQ19374.imf05bis.bellsouth.net@juan> for ; Fri, 6 Dec 2002 22:20:07 -0500 Message-ID: <003101c29d9f$499508e0$af78fea9@juan> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: WOR-HD Date: Fri, 6 Dec 2002 22:18:17 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit IBOC is a nice experiment but I think we should look for something that's better, not just good enough. Unfortunately people think that as soon as you slap the word digital on something that means it's better. That's not true. I see it evey day in my bussiness. People think digital TV is better, yet when you stick an good analog picture next to it you really see the diference. Unless you go easy on the compression you get all sorts of artifacts and loss of quality. It just doesn't work. With IBOC you might as well just settle for listening to .mp3's the rest of your life. Amen....My Digital TV promises great picture on Dish Network....Well, it sucks...eventually, the Digital vs Static argument will go away. My Analog Cellcast is the "weapon of choice" when doing remotes. Digital sucks, as far as cell phones and brooadcast remotes go. IBOC will go away, let it be. It is a fad, nothing more, nothing less.... Bye Bye Bye, IBOC Juan [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From evergreenterrace@buzzle.com Fri Dec 06 19:29:48 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: evergreenterrace@buzzle.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Dec 2002 03:29:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 56402 invoked from network); 7 Dec 2002 03:29:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Dec 2002 03:29:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Dec 2002 03:29:45 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.179] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 07 Dec 2002 03:29:45 -0000 Date: Sat, 07 Dec 2002 03:29:41 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: WOR-HD Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 324 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgliradio " X-Originating-IP: 170.20.11.59 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=69711087 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgliradio --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "wa2fnq " wrote: Jerry's qualifications are second to none. His plants are alwyas the most organized and well maintained anywhere. He is a mentor and a friend and has forgotten more than most engineers will ever know, myself included in that statement. From possumhunter@netzero.net Fri Dec 06 19:50:37 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Dec 2002 03:50:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 47987 invoked from network); 7 Dec 2002 03:50:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Dec 2002 03:50:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.16) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Dec 2002 03:50:35 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 6 Dec 2002 19:50:35 -0800 To: Subject: AMAX Promos Date: Fri, 6 Dec 2002 22:50:23 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 07 Dec 2002 03:50:35.0608 (UTC) FILETIME=[CC81BD80:01C29DA3] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.150.29.225] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 OK guys, I have been informed that I get to have the fun and joy of going in Sunday and programming the Phantom for next week. If somebody can post the Mono AMAX spots, they will "accidentally" get programmed in, just like the accident that put the "Digital Disaster" PSAs on the air two weeks ago. Kevin From KC4QLP@aol.com Fri Dec 06 19:53:00 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Dec 2002 03:53:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 3149 invoked from network); 7 Dec 2002 03:53:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Dec 2002 03:53:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m02.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.5) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Dec 2002 03:52:59 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.b0.30bd310e (30950) for ; Fri, 6 Dec 2002 22:52:41 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Fri, 6 Dec 2002 22:52:41 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} WOR-HD To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp All I know is this is starting to look like one hell of a flame fest..as a friend of mine put it this evening, while talking about the BS coming from both "camps" on this issue. A few things I would like to know....what is the name and model of the radios used during the recent night -time IBOC test? Also is there any data readly available to the general public regarding which particular radios did not fair well during reception of a station transmitting IBOC?Avoiding those radios would be the key here...educating the public on how crappy their radio really is...maybe this would give the public the incentive to buy a better radio. My entire issue here is in regards to the "noise" or hash that is being heard on the adjacent channels on my receivers.If it IS indeed a receiver issue at hand ...then perhaps educating the public on which brand of radios will perform poorly may help ease the hostility across the board in regards to IBOC.We all know receiver quality sucks a big one....but which radios really suck is what we want to know.If I and the general public know which radios to dump...problem solved.."interference issue solved and fix" which is what we all are striving for from a broadcaster and listener point of view.I want to be able to tell anyone that would complain to me about reception issues,how to solve it and what exactly to solve it with. I'm all for a platform that will make radio better...but if the gathered info from all of these test is not shared,then how are the rest of us looking for valued and valid information suppose to know what will and what will not work? Lets work together on this ..we are all in the same biz..maybe not the same market..which is highly irrelevant,titles are irrelevant,but what is relevant here is the ability for everyone to come together with a cool head, come to some workable solutions for the industry as a whole...from the broadcaster to the consumer...now that --- is relevant. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Dec 06 20:47:28 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Dec 2002 04:47:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 21272 invoked from network); 7 Dec 2002 04:47:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Dec 2002 04:47:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Dec 2002 04:47:28 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.162] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 07 Dec 2002 04:47:25 -0000 Date: Sat, 07 Dec 2002 04:47:25 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: The solution for AM & FM digital radio! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3994 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.68.5 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > If a consumer was sold a DAB radio and when he put it on channel > 710 and got WOR's DAB he wouldn't know and would't care if it was > actually transmitting on 710KHz or some other frequency with the > channel number 710 assigned to it. Now this is a good idea... obviously there is demand, at least in the USA, for AM and FM stations to transmit a digital signal that would require no special procedure to listen to other than simply tuning in their existing AM or FM frequency. But... this does not necessarily have to be done by actually transmitting the digital signal on the station's existing frequency, as IBOC (In-Band, "On-Channel") does... the same result can be provided by giving the *appearance* of this, without actually "polluting" the ANALOG AM & FM bands with digital signals. The average consumer does not know or care that when they tune in Channel 2 on their TV, they are actually watching the video being transmitted on 55.25 MHz and hearing the audio being transmitted on 60.75 MHz. Nor do they know that most of these TV frequencies change depending on whether they are using standard broadcast TV or cable TV. All they know are the channel numbers and that's all they care about when trying to find a particular TV channel. So, if they buy a fancy new "digital" radio and it says "710 kHz AM" on the display, does the average Jane or Joe really care whether or not it is actually receiving a signal on 710 kHz? Digital radios could easily be constructed to correlate an existing AM or FM frequency with a new frequency in the L-Band or wherever else the new digital signals will be broadcast separately... and when a corresponding digital signal is found and is of receivable quality, the radio will automatically switch to it, perhaps with a "DIGITAL" indicator light illuminating in the same fashion as the "STEREO" indicator that lights up when a regular AM Stereo or FM Stereo signal is tuned in. THIS is what probably will be the ultimate solution for providing digital reception of existing AM and FM stations, by "linking" each AM and FM frequency to a corresponding frequency in the digital band, and each AM and FM station would have a digital transmitter (at their existing transmitter site) putting out their digital signal, with a power level in proportion to their existing AM/FM power level and "class" assignment. The end result of this would be EXACTLY the same as the IBOC system currently being tested -- but WITHOUT "polluting" the "legacy" ANALOG AM and FM bands with digital NOISE. It's actually quite similar to the way analog FM Stereo works. When an FM radio receives a 19 kHz pilot tone, it knows to look at a certain point in the received signal spectrum to find the L-R Stereo difference component in order to reproduce the Stereo sound. But what does it care whether this additional signal component is 30 kHz above the main analog signal, or 3000 MHz above the main analog signal? As long as there is a direct frequency-to-frequency correlation, then the end result is EXACTLY the same -- just with the added benefits of having the "enhanced" signal placed in a dedicated band, free from the very serious noise/interference issues of the INHERENTLY FLAWED IBOC system that is currently being experimented with by stations like 710 WOR. Mark my words... history can and will repeat itself. IBOC is reminding me very much of CBS's "Spinning Disc" color TV system, which actually WAS the FCC-APPROVED system for color TV for a short time. Was it a workable solution? Perhaps... but it was expensive and impractical, and less than two years later, the FCC cancelled its approval in favor of the fully electronic NTSC color TV system, which it had previously rejected as inferior. Now, we are still using the NTSC color TV system HALF A CENTURY later, while the Spinning Disc system is only a mere anecdote in the history of TV... just as I think IBOC will turn out to be. From KC4QLP@aol.com Fri Dec 06 21:25:28 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Dec 2002 05:25:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 97831 invoked from network); 7 Dec 2002 05:25:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Dec 2002 05:25:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m08.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.163) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Dec 2002 05:25:27 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.15a.187bb23d (30950) for ; Sat, 7 Dec 2002 00:25:24 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <15a.187bb23d.2b22e044@aol.com> Date: Sat, 7 Dec 2002 00:25:24 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} The solution for AM & FM digital radio! To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp << So, if they buy a fancy new "digital" radio and it says "710 kHz AM" on the display, does the average Jane or Joe really care whether or not it is actually receiving a signal on 710 kHz? Digital radios could easily be constructed to correlate an existing AM or FM frequency with a new frequency in the L-Band or wherever else the new digital signals will be broadcast separately... >> All sounds "neat" and workable,but you have a cost factor here.Thats where digital radio fails in Canada...cost. Plus the attitude of why should I buy X brand digital radio to hear the same thing on AM/FM which I think if I'm not mistaken, has a far better broadcast coverage area over the digital band. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From bjackson@indyradio.com Fri Dec 06 22:28:39 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Dec 2002 06:28:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 83738 invoked from network); 7 Dec 2002 06:28:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Dec 2002 06:28:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.90) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Dec 2002 06:28:37 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.135] by n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 07 Dec 2002 06:28:37 -0000 Date: Sat, 07 Dec 2002 06:28:35 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} WOR-HD Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <00df01c29d94$7a3e0240$e11d96ac@aoldsl.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1455 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923 " X-Originating-IP: 216.132.129.192 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Possum Hunter" wrote: > Very true. Why should WOR expect Joe Six Pack to pay an extra $100 bucks for > digitaly compressed "Hi-Fi"? AMAX QUAM radios cost less than a dollar moe > than a lo-fi AM. > This is something I've thought for a while...you hit the nail on the head. The IBOC guys keep saying "there are no high quality AM radios" and that average Joe and Jane won't spend extra $$$ for the higher quality radios that *are* available. I thought that one of the reasons why there were "no high quality radios" was because manufacturers were more interested in saving $2 worth of parts for C-Quam than in providing good sound. So, if they are unwilling to put that $2 into the radio, what makes the IBOC guys think they will add $50+ worth of parts (are there receiver licensing fees too?) in there? Are Sony, Pioneer, JVC going to retool their entire production lines for radios they can *only* sell in the US? No other country has endorsed IBOC. I'm not trying to be a jerk about this...I think it is a legit question. The NAB couldn't get the radio guys to spend the money for AMAX certified products, so why do they think they can do the same for IBOC? And think of your average listener...Do they *really* care about digital AM & FM...or do they want decent sound quality on their $10 walkman? Thoughts? -Brad Jackson -Susquehanna, Indianapolis -WGLD/WGRL/WFMS From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Dec 06 23:06:23 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Dec 2002 07:06:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 95794 invoked from network); 7 Dec 2002 07:06:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Dec 2002 07:06:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.75) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Dec 2002 07:06:22 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.151] by n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 07 Dec 2002 07:06:22 -0000 Date: Sat, 07 Dec 2002 07:06:19 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: WOR-HD Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2110 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.68.5 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > And think of your average listener...Do they *really* care about > digital AM & FM... Probably not... but some of the IBOC proponents are saying things like "AM and FM have to compete with XM/Sirius satellite!!" Okay, is satellite radio something new and exciting? Yes... but is it affordable to the consumer? No... and as a result, is it making any money? No... both XM and Sirius are losing so much money that they've already had serious cut-backs, and one or both may fail entirely if more consumers don't sign up. As far as I know, AM and FM radio are free everywhere in the world (some European countries used to have a tax for owning a radio receiver, but I believe that is long gone), and that is one of its principle advantages. Even the receivers are commonly available at no cost, as the medium has remained in use long enough that there is a steady supply of old but perfectly working hand-me-down radios to be used. And before anybody is going to spend even $0.01 for any kind of new radio, the *programming* being offered by radio stations needs to be of a level of quality and interest that it would justify the equipment cost. If people don't like the music or talk shows of a particular station, they won't listen to it no matter how good the reception or audio quality is. And on the other hand, if people have a favorite radio station, they will often still listen to it through significant levels of static and interference, and/or with very poor audio quality. The end justifies the means... not the other way around. > or do they want decent sound quality on their $10 walkman? You can very seriously buy a $6.99 AM-only "Flavoradio" at Radio Shack, hook up its earphone jack to the aux input of a stereo system, and be treated to surprisingly high-fidelity AM sound. Sometimes the simplest radios actually sound the best. And if you are so inclined, a Flavoradio can actually be converted to AM Stereo very successfully; the reception won't be anything fantastic, but it *will* work, and will deliver good AM Stereo sound from local stations. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Dec 06 23:34:25 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Dec 2002 07:34:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 36758 invoked from network); 7 Dec 2002 07:34:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Dec 2002 07:34:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.69) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Dec 2002 07:34:24 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.136] by n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 07 Dec 2002 07:34:24 -0000 Date: Sat, 07 Dec 2002 07:34:21 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: The solution for AM & FM digital radio! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <15a.187bb23d.2b22e044@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2525 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.68.5 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > All sounds "neat" and workable,but you have a cost factor here. I'm not saying that I would prefer any digital radio system... but for those who absolutely believe that radio will die unless it goes digital, this is what I believe to be the best solution, as it would leave the existing analog AM and FM bands unharmed, while providing the same ideology as what IBOC is promoting (digital reception of existing AM/FM stations). Anybody who supports IBOC needs to sit down, give the AM radio band a close scan, and consider to themselves just many of these stations would be *gone* if IBOC was fully implemented and every station was transmitting the digital sidebands. I did that this afternoon (daytime groundwave reception), just on an average Panasonic stereo system from 1994 -- no Select-A-Tenna, no AMAX, no AM Stereo... just a plain, "typical" AM radio. Here is the result, just up to 800 kHz: 530 Rutgers University TIS - moderate strength 540 WLIE - weak but listenable 550 no station 560 WFIL - weak but listenable 570 WMCA - strong local reception 580 (WHP - too weak to be listenable) 590 WARM - weak but listenable 600 (WICC - too weak to be listenable) 610 WIP - weak but listenable 620 WJWR - strong local reception 630 no station 640 WWJZ - moderate strength 650 no station 660 WFAN - very strong local reception 670 no station 680 WOR "splatter" 690 WOR digital sideband, rendering WPHE unlistenable 700 WOR digital sideband 710 WOR main analog audio - very strong local reception 720 WOR digital sideband 730 WOR digital sideband 740 WOR "splatter", rendering WGSM unlistenable 750 WOR "splatter" 760 no station 770 WABC - very strong local reception 780 no station 790 WAEB - moderate strength 800 (WTMR - too weak to be listenable) Now imagine if every station in this list was using IBOC, and took up as big of a chunk of the AM dial as WOR's digital signal does. This would probably be the result: 530 Rutgers TIS 570 WMCA 620 WJWR 660 WFAN 710 WOR 770 WABC all other frequencies: digital sideband noise/splatter As a result, my reception of WLIE, WFIL, WARM, WIP, WWJZ, and WAEB would be wiped out, as well as any chance of hearing WHP, WICC, WPHE, WGSM, and WTMR on a better radio -- and that's only up to 800 kHz! With my suggested plan for having AM and FM stations "linked" to digital signals in a new band, my reception of analog AM would be untouched, and I would likely have good digital reception of WMCA, WJWR, WWJZ, WFAN, WOR, WABC, and WAEB as an extra bonus. From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sat Dec 07 01:47:37 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Dec 2002 09:47:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 55437 invoked from network); 7 Dec 2002 09:47:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Dec 2002 09:47:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.86) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Dec 2002 09:47:36 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.135] by n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 07 Dec 2002 09:47:29 -0000 Date: Sat, 07 Dec 2002 09:47:26 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: The solution for AM & FM digital radio! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1492 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.141 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: > > With my suggested plan for having AM and FM stations "linked" to > digital signals in a new band, my reception of analog AM would be > untouched, and I would likely have good digital reception of WMCA, > WJWR, WWJZ, WFAN, WOR, WABC, and WAEB as an extra bonus. I thought that was my idea ;-), just kidding. But seriously, this idea is in a sense no different than how digital is being handled with HDTV which my city is supposed to be rolling out. We have around 16 analog TV channels give or take a few and with the total of 68 channels, even after the upper portion of the band has been absconded for cellular use. There is enough empty channels available for every station to have 3 more for digital, God forbid that would ever happen ;-). The point being is there is no issue of overlap and stations interfering with each other and the analog stations won't be trashed. In my area the same is partially true for FM IBOC in that there is enough space between stations to put the digital carrier. This is also the reason why the NAB bought^H^H^H^H^H^H I mean influenced congress to kill LPFM as we knew it because the menbers of NAB had long ago planned to use this space for DAB. BAD^H^H^H I mean DAB on FM would not have happened if LPFM went foward. Now I'm sure in more crowded markets there will also be problems with FM IBOC with overlap just as we are having with AM IBOC. JSG From groucho@skyweb.net Sat Dec 07 02:23:31 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Dec 2002 10:23:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 18632 invoked from network); 7 Dec 2002 10:23:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Dec 2002 10:23:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Dec 2002 10:23:30 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gB7ASnIJ045201 for ; Sat, 7 Dec 2002 05:28:50 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DF1CB60.135564DB@skyweb.net> Date: Sat, 07 Dec 2002 05:20:16 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: WOR-HD References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Hear hear I will second that statement. could Not have said it better.. You know its a Funny thing.. I also have one of those Certificates from Harris that Says I understand the workings of HD radio... anyone Else in this Group have one.. Please step up to the mic... I made a Visit To Jerry's place.. all I could say is WOW....I didn't get No attitude like I did at Ibiquity.. the place was astounding.. I got to see some really Nice Gear in action. and From what I was told later what I saw was nothing there is alot more to see. Its like Disney land It takes a few visits to really see everything. I'm looking forward to My next visit. its a great Education to talk with Jerry. I used to work as the Engineer for a 10 watt ITFS TV station. But the stuff Jerry's Running. I could Not absorb Enough Info on that short stay.. Thank you Jerry "wgliradio " wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "wa2fnq " > wrote: > > Jerry's qualifications are second to none. His plants are alwyas the > most organized and well maintained anywhere. > > He is a mentor and a friend and has forgotten more than most > engineers will ever know, myself included in that statement. > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From groucho@skyweb.net Sat Dec 07 02:24:48 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Dec 2002 10:24:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 49862 invoked from network); 7 Dec 2002 10:24:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Dec 2002 10:24:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Dec 2002 10:24:47 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gB7AU7IJ045499 for ; Sat, 7 Dec 2002 05:30:08 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DF1CBAB.247D9F85@skyweb.net> Date: Sat, 07 Dec 2002 05:21:31 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} AMAX Promos References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 ok I give what digital disaster PSA's Possum Hunter wrote: > OK guys, I have been informed that I get to have the fun and joy of going in > Sunday and programming the Phantom for next week. If somebody can post the > Mono AMAX spots, they will "accidentally" get programmed in, just like the > accident that put the "Digital Disaster" PSAs on the air two weeks ago. > > Kevin > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From groucho@skyweb.net Sat Dec 07 02:38:22 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Dec 2002 10:38:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 18354 invoked from network); 7 Dec 2002 10:38:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Dec 2002 10:38:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Dec 2002 10:38:21 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gB7AhfIJ048234 for ; Sat, 7 Dec 2002 05:43:41 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DF1CEDA.A29EFAE@skyweb.net> Date: Sat, 07 Dec 2002 05:35:06 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: The solution for AM & FM digital radio! References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Interesting Kevin Now try that On the expanded band . and I think you for got 1330 is now transmitting on 530 from the Turks and calicos West Indies.. they come booming in here to Spotswood area... when they Do the Rutgers TIS is no More.. 530 comes in as strong as Humm WCTC at times at least that's what I get here.. "Kevin T. " wrote: > > All sounds "neat" and workable,but you have a cost factor here. > > I'm not saying that I would prefer any digital radio system... but > for those who absolutely believe that radio will die unless it goes > digital, this is what I believe to be the best solution, as it would > leave the existing analog AM and FM bands unharmed, while providing > the same ideology as what IBOC is promoting (digital reception of > existing AM/FM stations). > > Anybody who supports IBOC needs to sit down, give the AM radio band a > close scan, and consider to themselves just many of these stations > would be *gone* if IBOC was fully implemented and every station was > transmitting the digital sidebands. I did that this afternoon > (daytime groundwave reception), just on an average Panasonic stereo > system from 1994 -- no Select-A-Tenna, no AMAX, no AM Stereo... just > a plain, "typical" AM radio. Here is the result, just up to 800 kHz: > > 530 Rutgers University TIS - moderate strength > 540 WLIE - weak but listenable > 550 no station > 560 WFIL - weak but listenable > 570 WMCA - strong local reception > 580 (WHP - too weak to be listenable) > 590 WARM - weak but listenable > 600 (WICC - too weak to be listenable) > 610 WIP - weak but listenable > 620 WJWR - strong local reception > 630 no station > 640 WWJZ - moderate strength > 650 no station > 660 WFAN - very strong local reception > 670 no station > 680 WOR "splatter" > 690 WOR digital sideband, rendering WPHE unlistenable > 700 WOR digital sideband > 710 WOR main analog audio - very strong local reception > 720 WOR digital sideband > 730 WOR digital sideband > 740 WOR "splatter", rendering WGSM unlistenable > 750 WOR "splatter" > 760 no station > 770 WABC - very strong local reception > 780 no station > 790 WAEB - moderate strength > 800 (WTMR - too weak to be listenable) > > Now imagine if every station in this list was using IBOC, and took up > as big of a chunk of the AM dial as WOR's digital signal does. This > would probably be the result: > > 530 Rutgers TIS > 570 WMCA > 620 WJWR > 660 WFAN > 710 WOR > 770 WABC > all other frequencies: digital sideband noise/splatter > > As a result, my reception of WLIE, WFIL, WARM, WIP, WWJZ, and WAEB > would be wiped out, as well as any chance of hearing WHP, WICC, WPHE, > WGSM, and WTMR on a better radio -- and that's only up to 800 kHz! > > With my suggested plan for having AM and FM stations "linked" to > digital signals in a new band, my reception of analog AM would be > untouched, and I would likely have good digital reception of WMCA, > WJWR, WWJZ, WFAN, WOR, WABC, and WAEB as an extra bonus. > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From amstereoguy@hotmail.com Sat Dec 07 03:40:56 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereoguy@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Dec 2002 11:40:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 73426 invoked from network); 7 Dec 2002 11:40:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Dec 2002 11:40:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (207.68.165.88) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Dec 2002 11:40:56 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 7 Dec 2002 03:36:42 -0800 Received: from 208.228.96.20 by sea2fd.sea2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Sat, 07 Dec 2002 11:36:42 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: need a hand! Date: Sat, 07 Dec 2002 06:36:42 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 07 Dec 2002 11:36:42.0606 (UTC) FILETIME=[EA22F8E0:01C29DE4] From: "Chris Cuff" X-Originating-IP: [208.228.96.20] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37866059 Guys- this is important. I need a REAL simple Dc to Dc converter that will give me 5 volts from 1.5 volts. Here is what it MUST have: A current output of 15ma. at 5 volts. Be super small. Be noise free. Be low cost, buildable without custom parts. I will even toss around a simple cap/diode voltage doubler, etc. Again, it has to be TINY. There is a significant product development event happening that all of us AMS supporters will be happy about. Thats all you get for now... ;-) Chris _________________________________________________________________ The new MSN 8: advanced junk mail protection and 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail From wa2fnq@optonline.net Sat Dec 07 09:19:49 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: wa2fnq@optonline.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Dec 2002 17:19:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 50380 invoked from network); 7 Dec 2002 17:19:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Dec 2002 17:19:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.69) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Dec 2002 17:19:47 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.144] by n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 07 Dec 2002 17:19:42 -0000 Date: Sat, 07 Dec 2002 17:19:41 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: WOR-HD Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3DF1CB60.135564DB@skyweb.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3031 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wa2fnq " X-Originating-IP: 24.47.74.230 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=60059615 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa2fnq Thanks Neal and WGLIRadio .... Both of you are doing a great job yourselves. I find Radio is made up of a bunch of really neat, caring people. It refreshing to get back to it every once in a while. And I hate seeing radio get screwed up the same way TV is. Nobody wants to go out and spend more money to get the same service they get now. To quote facts from a letter in this months TV Broadcast Engineering magazine, there were just over 300,00 DTV sets sold as compared to 29 million analog color sets last year. So what does IBOC offer?? Nothing much in my opinion. Poorer audio?? OK. Datacasting?? You can have that now. Give me great quality and the ability to do things like surround sound and 5.1 audio and maybe you'll have something. IBOC isn't and never will be there. It's truely digital for digitals sake and gives us nothing new. To say radio has to do this to compete with XM and Sirrus is a farce. They're no competition. And if satellite radios are "flying off the shelf", as one IBOC proponent on this board has claimed, (You'd like me to say you name wouldn't you? Well I'm NOT!) then maybe you should look at your programming first. At least that's the comments I've read by people who have bought satellite radio receivers. So your not going to fix that by going digital. Like I said before, it's a interesting experiment....but that's it. Oh BTW, if there's anyone who thinks AM can't be hi fi I can find alot of guys who think otherwise. Jerry WA2FNQ --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, Neal Newman wrote: > Hear hear I will second that statement. could Not have said it better.. > > You know its a Funny thing.. I also have one of those Certificates from > Harris that Says I understand the workings of HD radio... anyone Else in > this Group have one.. Please step up to the mic... > I made a Visit To Jerry's place.. all I could say is WOW....I didn't get No > attitude like I did at Ibiquity.. the place was astounding.. I got to see > some really Nice Gear in action. and From what I was told later what I saw > was nothing there is alot more to see. Its like Disney land It takes a few > visits to really see everything. I'm looking forward to My next visit. its a > great Education to talk with Jerry. I used to work as the Engineer for a 10 > watt ITFS TV station. But the stuff Jerry's Running. I could Not absorb > Enough Info on that short stay.. > Thank you Jerry > > "wgliradio " wrote: > > > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "wa2fnq " > > wrote: > > > > Jerry's qualifications are second to none. His plants are alwyas the > > most organized and well maintained anywhere. > > > > He is a mentor and a friend and has forgotten more than most > > engineers will ever know, myself included in that statement. > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From groucho@skyweb.net Sat Dec 07 09:23:23 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Dec 2002 17:23:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 56578 invoked from network); 7 Dec 2002 17:23:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Dec 2002 17:23:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Dec 2002 17:23:21 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gB7HSbpB029925 for ; Sat, 7 Dec 2002 12:28:38 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DF22DB8.89BFC926@skyweb.net> Date: Sat, 07 Dec 2002 12:19:52 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com" Subject: DELCO am Stereo Radio Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Ok Guys I guess it just plugs into the Dash.. Just received an Ebay package for the Wife's car. a DELCO model 16194965 AM Stereo radio. and I need a pin out and or a plug for it.. any Ideas? Chris? Jeff? the Info on the Tag PROD ID FM20EV DELCO 898HHA (whatever that is) the radio physically is In Great shape 10 out of 10 if it works and it has that wonderful Am-St switch on it.. I am going to hit the local junk yard and see if I can find a plug there.. Neal From groucho@skyweb.net Sat Dec 07 13:32:36 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Dec 2002 21:32:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 1922 invoked from network); 7 Dec 2002 21:32:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Dec 2002 21:32:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Dec 2002 21:32:36 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gB7LbupB090531 for ; Sat, 7 Dec 2002 16:37:57 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DF2681E.51A594E9@skyweb.net> Date: Sat, 07 Dec 2002 16:29:02 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com" Subject: New Kid on the block Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Hi Guys there is a New Kid on the block here.. Its my 9 year son Dale.. For the Holidays I bought him his first Radio... however he has to Build it Himself.. we were in radio shack today I could Not Believe they still sold basic crystal radios and Other kits... Im in there all the Time and never noticed maybe they only put them out for the holidays. Either way He is building as I type the AM/Shortwave Radio CAT# 28-183 Covers the AM BC Band from 520khz to 1720khz two shortwave bands 6-8 Mhz and 12-17 Mhz cool little kit I already thought If its feasible to add the C-quam decoder to It LOL.... I doubt it.. Neal From bd6xray@lycos.com Sat Dec 07 13:43:04 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: bd6xray@lycos.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Dec 2002 21:43:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 37326 invoked from network); 7 Dec 2002 21:43:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Dec 2002 21:43:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Dec 2002 21:43:03 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.253] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 07 Dec 2002 21:43:01 -0000 Date: Sat, 07 Dec 2002 21:43:00 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: DELCO am Stereo Radio Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3DF22DB8.89BFC926@skyweb.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1060 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bd6xray " X-Originating-IP: 64.12.96.170 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83174981 X-Yahoo-Profile: bd6xray --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, Neal Newman wrote: > Ok Guys I guess it just plugs into the Dash.. Just received an Ebay > package for the Wife's car. a DELCO model 16194965 AM Stereo radio. and > I need a pin out and or a plug for it.. any Ideas? Chris? Jeff? > the Info on the Tag > PROD ID FM20EV > DELCO 898HHA (whatever that is) > the radio physically is In Great shape > 10 out of 10 if it works > and it has that wonderful Am-St switch on it.. > I am going to hit the local junk yard and see if I can find a plug > there.. > Neal This has prompted me to dig in the basement and get out my Delco receiver. I took out of the car about 10 years ago after someone went through a red light. It has AM Stereo, plugs into my current vehicle, but is about 3-4 kHz off. Does anyone know if it needs a new crystal, or is there a warping adjustment? Any other hints? It has all the pin-outs stamped into the top cover, in case anyone needs that. PROD ID AD ETR SM NO 3 7 PKG NO PART NO 16067012 Thanks, Al Hajny From crashknorr@yahoo.com Sat Dec 07 14:56:45 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: crashknorr@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Dec 2002 22:56:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 48786 invoked from network); 7 Dec 2002 22:56:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Dec 2002 22:56:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Dec 2002 22:56:44 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.179] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 07 Dec 2002 22:56:44 -0000 Date: Sat, 07 Dec 2002 22:56:43 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: The solution for AM & FM digital radio! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1274 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "crashknorr " X-Originating-IP: 198.190.223.196 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=20677990 X-Yahoo-Profile: crashknorr > As a result, my reception of WLIE, WFIL, WARM, WIP, WWJZ, and WAEB > would be wiped out, as well as any chance of hearing WHP, WICC, WPHE, > WGSM, and WTMR on a better radio -- and that's only up to 800 kHz! That, of course, is one reason why Big Brother favors digital radio. The rich and powerful stations will prevail, mom and pop AM stations may not be able to afford to go digital, and you will have fewer viewpoints to hear. Nighttime reception of regional powerhouses -- often the only way to hear political views different from what the local Limbaugh/Boortz outlet is spewing -- will be obliterated by IBOC sidebands... and a digital radio can keep track of what you listen to, whereas an analog radio cannot. Under digital, all broadcasters will have to pay tribute to the corporation providing the algorithms used. If we eventually reach a point where most receivers prefer the digital signal or will not receive the analog signal at all, pirate and part 15 stations will no longer have any audience. Again, fewer viewpoints on the air. These are the reasons why the FCC and the big broadcasting chains are rushing helter-skelter into digital. It has nothing to do with technical issues and everything to do with extinguishing freedom. From ccuff@in4web.com Sat Dec 07 15:37:43 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Dec 2002 23:37:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 3466 invoked from network); 7 Dec 2002 23:37:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Dec 2002 23:37:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Dec 2002 23:37:42 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.24]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Sat, 7 Dec 2002 18:32:25 -0500 Message-ID: <002d01c29e48$70820bc0$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: Subject: Who is selling TM152? Date: Sat, 7 Dec 2002 18:29:07 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 Is ebayer "azrundfunk" on this group?- go check out ebay item 1943494578 Chris From KC4QLP@aol.com Sat Dec 07 16:03:33 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Dec 2002 00:03:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 93078 invoked from network); 8 Dec 2002 00:03:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Dec 2002 00:03:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m09.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.164) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Dec 2002 00:03:32 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m09.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.147.4799d35 (4410) for ; Sat, 7 Dec 2002 19:03:27 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <147.4799d35.2b23e64f@aol.com> Date: Sat, 7 Dec 2002 19:03:27 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} WOR-HD To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/7/02 1:29:30 AM Eastern Standard Time, bjackson@indyradio.com writes: << think they will add $50+ worth of parts (are there receiver licensing fees too?) >> No licensing fees for receivers....the licensing fees come in and are socked to the broadcasters Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Dec 07 16:09:26 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Dec 2002 00:09:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 83142 invoked from network); 8 Dec 2002 00:09:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Dec 2002 00:09:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Dec 2002 00:09:26 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.163] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 08 Dec 2002 00:09:26 -0000 Date: Sun, 08 Dec 2002 00:09:26 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: WOR hi-fi tonight Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 463 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.74.31 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics I have word from 710 WOR's engineer that they may be transmitting on their backup transmitter tonight (late Saturday night through early Sunday morning) while maintenance is being done on the main Harris DX-50 transmitter. Their backup is an old Continental tube rig, and it will be using Optimod 9100 audio processing with full hi-fi AMAX bandwidth -- a good complement to Joe Franklin's overnight show, which is the only remaining music program on WOR. From amfmdx@fastq.com Sat Dec 07 18:20:31 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Dec 2002 02:20:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 7954 invoked from network); 8 Dec 2002 02:20:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Dec 2002 02:20:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Dec 2002 02:20:29 -0000 Received: from fastq (d11-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.43]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gB82KSv73505 for ; Sat, 7 Dec 2002 19:20:28 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <027101c29e60$5164ba40$89f9bed8@com> To: References: <002d01c29e48$70820bc0$0101a8c0@pavilion> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Who is selling TM152? Date: Sat, 7 Dec 2002 19:20:02 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla It ain't me! Looks like a nice unit but the thing is pretty pricey. AM stereo stuff is going through the roof! Kevin ----- Original Message ----- From: "Christopher Cuff" To: Sent: Saturday, December 07, 2002 4:29 PM Subject: {AMSF} Who is selling TM152? > Is ebayer "azrundfunk" on this group?- go check out ebay item 1943494578 > Chris From possumhunter@netzero.net Sat Dec 07 18:25:03 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Dec 2002 02:25:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 7174 invoked from network); 8 Dec 2002 02:25:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Dec 2002 02:25:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.198) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Dec 2002 02:25:03 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 7 Dec 2002 18:25:03 -0800 To: References: <3DF1CBAB.247D9F85@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} AMAX Promos Date: Sat, 7 Dec 2002 21:24:43 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 08 Dec 2002 02:25:03.0360 (UTC) FILETIME=[03DC9800:01C29E61] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.139.184.88] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Neal Newman wrote: > ok I give what digital disaster PSA's They are from http://www.digitaldisaster.org/ you can download them here: http://radiofreerichmond.dyn.dhs.org/promo/PSA%20-%20DigitalDisaster1.mp3 http://radiofreerichmond.dyn.dhs.org/promo/PSA%20-%20DigitalDisaster2.mp3 http://radiofreerichmond.dyn.dhs.org/promo/PSA%20-%20DigitalDisaster3.mp3 These PSAs warn the public about how IBOC will destroy reception of small, local stations. Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From possumhunter@netzero.net Sat Dec 07 19:59:03 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Dec 2002 03:59:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 34524 invoked from network); 8 Dec 2002 03:59:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Dec 2002 03:59:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.98) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Dec 2002 03:59:02 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 7 Dec 2002 19:59:02 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} WOR hi-fi tonight Date: Sat, 7 Dec 2002 22:58:48 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 08 Dec 2002 03:59:02.0489 (UTC) FILETIME=[250B6490:01C29E6E] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.139.184.88] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 kevtronics@yahoo.com wrote: > I have word from 710 WOR's engineer that they may be transmitting on their backup transmitter tonight (late Saturday night through early Sunday morning) while maintenance is being done on the main Harris DX-50 transmitter. I wonder if we could talk him into plugging in the C-QUAM exciter? If you want to hear how a DX-50 is supposed to sound, listen to WSAI 1530. Remember when 1210 WOGL first installed the DX-50 and C-QUAM to play oldies? That thing sounded SWEET! Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From groucho@skyweb.net Sat Dec 07 20:09:36 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Dec 2002 04:09:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 10428 invoked from network); 8 Dec 2002 04:09:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Dec 2002 04:09:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Dec 2002 04:09:36 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gB84EupB000739 for ; Sat, 7 Dec 2002 23:14:57 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DF2C567.4FA91CF0@skyweb.net> Date: Sat, 07 Dec 2002 23:07:03 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} WOR hi-fi tonight References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 I know of 4 Harris DX series in my local area with C-quam and they all sound sweet.. I listened to the digital disaster Mp3's made me laugh. Its modem noise.. now if this guy would Use an Actual radio with an actual IBOC HASH on top of another station and not use the WRFR in the phone #... I would Air them in My Night Automation... anyone tell me off list where I could upload My MP3's of my live recordings. Neal Possum Hunter wrote: > kevtronics@yahoo.com wrote: > > I have word from 710 WOR's engineer that they may be transmitting on their > backup transmitter tonight (late Saturday night through early Sunday > morning) while maintenance is being done on the main Harris DX-50 > transmitter. > > I wonder if we could talk him into plugging in the C-QUAM exciter? > > If you want to hear how a DX-50 is supposed to sound, listen to WSAI 1530. > Remember when 1210 WOGL first installed the DX-50 and C-QUAM to play oldies? > That thing sounded SWEET! > > Long live FREE RADIO! > > Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ > Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Dec 07 20:23:10 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Dec 2002 04:23:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 31508 invoked from network); 8 Dec 2002 04:23:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Dec 2002 04:23:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.67) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Dec 2002 04:23:09 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.167] by n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 08 Dec 2002 04:23:07 -0000 Date: Sun, 08 Dec 2002 04:23:07 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: HD Radio vs. AMAX Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 792 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.74.31 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics The following MP3 file contains a direct comparison between the actual received "HD Radio" (a.k.a. IBOC) digital audio of 710 WOR (from a new clip on their web site), immediately followed by the AMAX hi-fi analog AM Stereo audio of 1450 WCTC, as heard on a Sony SRF-42: http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/hdvsamax.mp3 Now, which one sounds better to you: the 50,000-watt Class A station using hundreds of thousands of dollars of digital equipment, or the 1,000-watt Class C station that was received on a $29.99 Walkman? p.s. Any opinions on the new AMAX logo I created for the Forum's main page? The colors are somewhat of an inside reference... they are an abstract representation of a sunrise, as opposed to the planned "sunset" of analog radio & TV if digital takes over. From michaelj@vcn.com Sat Dec 07 22:53:23 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Dec 2002 06:53:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 4812 invoked from network); 8 Dec 2002 06:53:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Dec 2002 06:53:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m1-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.31) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Dec 2002 06:53:19 -0000 Received: from michaelj (unverified [209.193.86.97]) by m1-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Sat, 7 Dec 2002 23:53:19 -0700 Message-ID: <001b01c29e86$0ee9ba00$6156c1d1@mshome.net> To: References: <3DF22DB8.89BFC926@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} DELCO am Stereo Radio Date: Sat, 7 Dec 2002 23:50:11 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit That'd be your best bet, Neal. If this is the radio that Kevin T pointed out when it was on EBay it's probably newer than the UX1 that I've got. Nonetheless, the pinout should be etched into the metal right on top of the receiver. Meanwhile on the back side mine has about 12 pins (actually "blades") in a socket on the right rear if you're looking at it from the back side. I remember trying to explain this to someone one other time. If you have the radio sitting there.....look at its front. Now look up on top. Diagram will be in the upper left corner. Imagine that diagram being a piece of paper......slide that piece of paper toward the back of the radio and let it fold downward when ya get to the back edge. That's the order they are in. It's kinda wierd and I'm not at my shop right now where I have the radio running so I can't tell ya for sure if the hot is on the top or the hot is on the bottom. Heck, yours may be newer than mine so it may have the newer connectors. If that's the case then those are a dime a dozen at the junkyard. Hell, the guy didn't even charge me for mine! And my harness was a little harder to find. Came out of about an 84 Oldsmobile. The connector is actually THREE connectors that all connect on on top of each other in a row. There are 4 blade connections on each one. Again, this is probably one of the "older" UX-1's but MAN DOES IT SOUND GREAT!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Yours is probably newer in which case if it is, just go to the junk yard and go to just about ANY GM car from the late 80s all through the 90s and you'll see it. Most junkyards will let ya bring the radio with ya if you want...they'll mark it so they know its yours when you come back through. Then you can go look. OR if it's a junk yard that won't let ya in the actual yard (I hate those) then you can just bring the radio and they can go find it for you. What year is the wife's car? Does the radio and harness currently in it have the 3-piece connector harness? Or is the connector all one piece? They must be different otherwise you'd be able to plug it right in and go. OH....also...on the back of mine is ANOTHER 2-wire connector that's attached to the middle of the back of the radio. This must be wired as well. One of those wires is your "memory" wire, and the other is ground. Good luck and let me know if you need more help. I'll look right at mine and tell ya. Michael n WYO ----- Original Message ----- From: Neal Newman To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, December 07, 2002 10:19 AM Subject: {AMSF} DELCO am Stereo Radio Ok Guys I guess it just plugs into the Dash.. Just received an Ebay package for the Wife's car. a DELCO model 16194965 AM Stereo radio. and I need a pin out and or a plug for it.. any Ideas? Chris? Jeff? the Info on the Tag PROD ID FM20EV DELCO 898HHA (whatever that is) the radio physically is In Great shape 10 out of 10 if it works and it has that wonderful Am-St switch on it.. I am going to hit the local junk yard and see if I can find a plug there.. Neal [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From n0uiheric@aol.com Sat Dec 07 23:00:40 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Dec 2002 07:00:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 64752 invoked from network); 8 Dec 2002 07:00:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Dec 2002 07:00:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d07.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.39) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Dec 2002 07:00:40 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-d07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.f7.254e32cc (30970) for ; Sun, 8 Dec 2002 02:00:33 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Sun, 8 Dec 2002 02:00:33 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fw: Hd Radio To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih I do not work for IBiquity, I am a former commercial radio broadcaster who was forced out of the profession because my personal views on the radio business did not mesh with the corporate view. If there should be only one type of engineer that SHOULD stay in the business, it is one that supports C-QUAM AM Stereo, not IBOCrap. The C-QUAM supporter is, in my honest opinion, a more logical and more technologically advanced broadcaster than any supporter of IBOCrap. I believe IBOCrap supporters deserve every personal attack dished out to them, and should get out of the radio business, once and for all, and leave it to the REAL BROADCASTERS with REAL VISION. And the C-QUAM supporter has REAL VISION for the radio business. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Sat Dec 07 23:01:47 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Dec 2002 07:01:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 51848 invoked from network); 8 Dec 2002 07:01:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Dec 2002 07:01:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14207.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.173.71) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Dec 2002 07:01:47 -0000 Message-ID: <20021208070147.45605.qmail@web14207.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [65.221.47.68] by web14207.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 07 Dec 2002 23:01:47 PST Date: Sat, 7 Dec 2002 23:01:47 -0800 (PST) Subject: Calling Fellow Hams To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio Anybody happen to tear apart the 'drycell' battery adapter for the Yaesu VX-5R by chance? I'm curious how their DC to DC converter works and it if is a diode capacitor voltage doubler or a chip? I'd like to see if we can help Chris Cuff with his question: "...Dc to Dc converter that will give me 5 volts from 1.5 volts..." I do know that Maxim electronics makes a #MAX603 chip which gives you 5 volts from 3 volts up to about 350ma-500ma. Any other ideas? __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Sat Dec 07 23:07:56 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Dec 2002 07:07:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 87787 invoked from network); 8 Dec 2002 07:07:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Dec 2002 07:07:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14201.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.143) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Dec 2002 07:07:56 -0000 Message-ID: <20021208070756.89639.qmail@web14201.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [65.221.47.68] by web14201.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 07 Dec 2002 23:07:56 PST Date: Sat, 7 Dec 2002 23:07:56 -0800 (PST) Subject: A better bandplan & programming for AM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio If many of the AM stations aren't going to return to music-based programming, then why even bother with adding IBOC? When I listened to an XM satellite demo the voice/talk stations actually sounded worse than the music stations! So, are the big boys going to flip half of the stations back to music? If not, then why screw with it at all? I really like somebody's idea of leaving AM and FM as it is, BUT, a pilot tone on these stations would 'redirect' the receiver to a local VHF or UHF digital only band (old NTSC TV frequencies) if the digital component is strong enough. This way you could transmit 10.2KHz Cquam on AM 24/7. Since IBOC will NOT be approved for night-time use, you could have a nice sounding audio signal at night from the C-Quam AM stereo and listen to your digital artifact during the day! __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From crashknorr@yahoo.com Sat Dec 07 23:12:31 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: crashknorr@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Dec 2002 07:12:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 74153 invoked from network); 8 Dec 2002 07:12:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Dec 2002 07:12:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.84) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Dec 2002 07:12:31 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.170] by n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 08 Dec 2002 07:12:31 -0000 Date: Sun, 08 Dec 2002 07:12:27 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: need a hand! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 270 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "crashknorr " X-Originating-IP: 198.190.223.182 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=20677990 X-Yahoo-Profile: crashknorr I found a voltage tripler at http://cytium.net/hobby/voltagex3.htm ... it would be tiny if implemented in surface mount components. is 4.5 V close enough? If you posted your question in the newsgroup sci.electronics.design I suspect you would get more answers. From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Sat Dec 07 23:12:51 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Dec 2002 07:12:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 65975 invoked from network); 8 Dec 2002 07:12:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Dec 2002 07:12:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14208.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.173.72) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Dec 2002 07:12:51 -0000 Message-ID: <20021208071251.94645.qmail@web14208.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [65.221.47.68] by web14208.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 07 Dec 2002 23:12:51 PST Date: Sat, 7 Dec 2002 23:12:51 -0800 (PST) Subject: How are you receiving WLW tonight? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, abdx@topica.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio It's 2AM E.S.T. Sunday and the Delco radio is tuned to WLW. Does anybody else, or everybody else receiving the high-pitched whine / squeal in the audio like I am? It's almost like tinnitis in your ears - a real pain. IF I turn the equalizer for the 3.5K band all the way DOWN, then I can get rid of it, but they sound like they're in a paper sack. Sad. Maybe I just have too-good of a radio. __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From KC4QLP@aol.com Sun Dec 08 00:24:58 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Dec 2002 08:24:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 32051 invoked from network); 8 Dec 2002 08:24:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Dec 2002 08:24:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d08.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.40) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Dec 2002 08:24:58 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.15b.1897bc7d (30950) for ; Sun, 8 Dec 2002 03:24:55 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <15b.1897bc7d.2b245bd6@aol.com> Date: Sun, 8 Dec 2002 03:24:54 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Calling Fellow Hams To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 12/8/02 2:02:19 AM Eastern Standard Time, toledohamradio@yahoo.com writes: > I do know that Maxim electronics makes a #MAX603 chip which gives you 5 > volts > from 3 volts up to about 350ma-500ma. Any other ideas? > Thats a good start. A search on google.com might yeild the results your looking for. Philips has a converter in a chip as well.Seems most have a low operating end of 3.3 volts DC.Philips Semiconductors - PIP - PIP202-12M; DC to DC converter powertrain Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From ccuff@in4web.com Sun Dec 08 00:36:49 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Dec 2002 08:36:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 12565 invoked from network); 8 Dec 2002 08:36:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Dec 2002 08:36:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Dec 2002 08:36:48 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.27]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Sun, 8 Dec 2002 03:31:31 -0500 Message-ID: <000a01c29e93$bff857e0$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: need a hand! Date: Sun, 8 Dec 2002 03:28:12 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 Thanks Crash- that might just do it!- They do not give cap values, but I will breadboard one today and see if it flies. (Man!- What language is THAT?!) CC ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Sunday, December 08, 2002 2:12 AM Subject: {AMSF} Re: need a hand! > > I found a voltage tripler at http://cytium.net/hobby/voltagex3.htm > ... it would be tiny if implemented in surface mount components. is > 4.5 V close enough? From KC4QLP@aol.com Sun Dec 08 00:38:09 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Dec 2002 08:38:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 52955 invoked from network); 8 Dec 2002 08:38:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Dec 2002 08:38:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d07.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.39) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Dec 2002 08:38:08 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.10.296e0b9f (30950) for ; Sun, 8 Dec 2002 03:38:02 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <10.296e0b9f.2b245ee9@aol.com> Date: Sun, 8 Dec 2002 03:38:01 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} A better bandplan & programming for AM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 12/8/02 2:08:32 AM Eastern Standard Time, toledohamradio@yahoo.com writes: > I really like somebody's idea of leaving AM and FM as it is, BUT, a pilot > tone > on these stations would 'redirect' the receiver to a local VHF or UHF > digital > only band (old NTSC TV frequencies) if the digital component is strong > enough. > This way you could transmit 10.2KHz Cquam on AM 24/7. Chances of the current analog TV channels being auctioned for other radio services such as radio broadcasting wont be happening anytime soon.The sell of HDTV sets has been going a little slower than expected..so you might see a time extension placed on when the analog TV channels are to be shut off.Thats just some insight from a few engineers in the TV side of the biz. Now..second of all..why waste the bandwidth sending a tone that would "redirect the receiver" to a digital channel of what your listening to in analog?Sounds like the same thing with IBOC except its all on channel. I just dont see the great need for either one as its not the transmission thats needs fixing..its the programming end that needs retuning.But when your up against so many entertainment avenues as we have today {CD's,cassettee.internet,MP3 players,satellite to name a few} radio in general has quite a bit of competition compared to say 30 - 50 years ago when AM radio was king....indeed times have changed. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From KC4QLP@aol.com Sun Dec 08 00:42:48 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Dec 2002 08:42:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 39804 invoked from network); 8 Dec 2002 08:42:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Dec 2002 08:42:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d05.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Dec 2002 08:42:47 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.186.126106af (30950) for ; Sun, 8 Dec 2002 03:42:44 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <186.126106af.2b246003@aol.com> Date: Sun, 8 Dec 2002 03:42:43 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} How are you receiving WLW tonight? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 12/8/02 2:14:44 AM Eastern Standard Time, toledohamradio@yahoo.com writes: > It's 2AM E.S.T. Sunday and the Delco radio is tuned to WLW. Does anybody > else, > or everybody else receiving the high-pitched whine / squeal in the audio > like I > am? It's almost like tinnitis in your ears - a real pain. IF I turn the > equalizer for the 3.5K band all the way DOWN, then I can get rid of it, but > they sound like they're in a paper sack. Sad. Maybe I just have too-good > of a > radio. > I get way to much RF noise from the computer to hear them this time of the evening. Is it possible that the "high pitched whine" you hear might be heterodyne from a foreign broadcaster? With a highly selective radio and nulling out WLW would tell you if this is the case. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From ccuff@in4web.com Sun Dec 08 00:45:23 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Dec 2002 08:45:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 59017 invoked from network); 8 Dec 2002 08:45:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Dec 2002 08:45:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Dec 2002 08:45:23 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.27]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Sun, 8 Dec 2002 03:40:06 -0500 Message-ID: <003101c29e94$f2b9b380$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: <15b.1897bc7d.2b245bd6@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Calling Fellow Hams Date: Sun, 8 Dec 2002 03:36:47 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 Here is the problem. A well known manufacturer has given me a good quality walkman to see how it performs with am stereo. The rub? It uses ONE "aa" battery. The decoder MUST have 3 volts to run at all right, and better with 4.5 to 5 volts. Now you see the problem. I *can* fit the radio with a photo type 6 volt battery, but that would be bad, as life would be too short, and the cost of the batteries is prohibitive. CC ----- Original Message ----- From: From KC4QLP@aol.com Sun Dec 08 00:49:44 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Dec 2002 08:49:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 50414 invoked from network); 8 Dec 2002 08:49:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Dec 2002 08:49:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d07.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.39) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Dec 2002 08:49:44 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.16d.16aaa2bf (30950) for ; Sun, 8 Dec 2002 03:49:37 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <16d.16aaa2bf.2b2461a0@aol.com> Date: Sun, 8 Dec 2002 03:49:36 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: need a hand! To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 12/8/02 3:37:17 AM Eastern Standard Time, ccuff@in4web.com writes: > Thanks Crash- that might just do it!- They do not give cap values, but I > will breadboard one today and see if it flies. (Man!- What language is > THAT?!) > CC > Looks to be from Bangladesh Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Dec 08 01:13:51 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Dec 2002 09:13:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 55115 invoked from network); 8 Dec 2002 09:13:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Dec 2002 09:13:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.75) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Dec 2002 09:13:50 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.248] by n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 08 Dec 2002 09:13:50 -0000 Date: Sun, 08 Dec 2002 09:13:50 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: need a hand! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <000a01c29e93$bff857e0$0101a8c0@pavilion> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 397 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.74.31 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Thanks Crash- that might just do it!- They do not give cap values, > but I will breadboard one today and see if it flies. (Man!- What > language is THAT?!) Electronics slang language... the same language that uses the phrase "smoke the pot" to mean "overheat the variable resistor". :-) And any clues on what this 1.5V device is? Some sort of portable radio that runs on a single battery? From amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sun Dec 08 01:56:33 2002 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 35160 invoked from network); 8 Dec 2002 09:56:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Dec 2002 09:56:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Dec 2002 09:56:33 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: notify@yahoogroups.com Received: from [66.218.67.250] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 08 Dec 2002 09:56:33 -0000 Date: 8 Dec 2002 09:56:32 -0000 Message-ID: <1039341392.163.45874.w71@yahoogroups.com> X-eGroups-Application: poll X-Yahoo-Group-Post: system From: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: New poll for amstereoforum MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Enter your vote today! A new poll has been created for the amstereoforum group: If you had a choice to listen to your favorite AM music station, which format would you prefer? o C QuAM o HD Radio o Eureka o Kahn ISB To vote, please visit the following web page: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum/surveys?id=10990522 Note: Please do not reply to this message. Poll votes are not collected via email. To vote, you must go to the Yahoo! Groups web site listed above. Thanks! From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sun Dec 08 03:47:23 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Dec 2002 11:47:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 59613 invoked from network); 8 Dec 2002 11:47:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Dec 2002 11:47:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Dec 2002 11:47:22 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.153] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 08 Dec 2002 11:47:22 -0000 Date: Sun, 08 Dec 2002 11:47:21 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Calling Fellow Hams Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20021208070147.45605.qmail@web14207.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1066 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.164 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John P." wrote: > Anybody happen to tear apart the 'drycell' battery adapter for the Yaesu VX-5R > by chance? I'm curious how their DC to DC converter works and it if is a diode > capacitor voltage doubler or a chip? I'd like to see if we can help Chris Cuff > with his question: "...Dc to Dc converter that will give me 5 volts from 1.5 > volts..." > > I do know that Maxim electronics makes a #MAX603 chip which gives you 5 volts > from 3 volts up to about 350ma-500ma. Any other ideas? > I would use a CMOS Hex Inverter CD74HCU04 to build a square wave oscillator and use the rest of the inverters as the driver for the diode capacitor multiplier. I would highly recomend using schottly diodes as the voltage drop is ~.2V since you are using a 1.5V supply otherwise you may have to multiply by 10 to overcome the loss from the voltage drop of a silicone diode. With these you may only have to multiply by 5 or 6. These diodes are not cheap as last time I bought them they were a $1 each. JSG From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sun Dec 08 10:06:01 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Dec 2002 18:06:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 59626 invoked from network); 8 Dec 2002 18:06:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Dec 2002 18:06:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Dec 2002 18:06:00 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.167] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 08 Dec 2002 18:06:00 -0000 Date: Sun, 08 Dec 2002 18:05:59 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Calling Fellow Hams Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <003101c29e94$f2b9b380$0101a8c0@pavilion> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1431 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.130.8 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Christopher Cuff" wrote: > Here is the problem. A well known manufacturer has given me a good quality > walkman to see how it performs with am stereo. The rub? It uses ONE "aa" > battery. The decoder MUST have 3 volts to run at all right, and better with > 4.5 to 5 volts. > Now you see the problem. > I *can* fit the radio with a photo type 6 volt battery, but that would be > bad, as life would be too short, and the cost of the batteries is > prohibitive. > CC I think in the long run it is probably most economical to just use 2 AAA batteries instead of one AA battery. Add this to my previous comment on multipliers that if you have to multiply by 5 then the current draw from the battery will be 5 times that and if a MC13028 draws ~10ma then that means ~50ma will be drawn from the battery. This will severly shorten the life of an AA battery and the consumer will spend more on batteries and the manufacturer of the radio will have to spend more on components. You also have to consider the performance when the battery is at its half life and if there will be enough voltage for the decoder. I afraid you are approaching the law of dimmishing returns on this. These types of voltage multipliers start to loose their effeciency when you try to run them from very low voltage. If you were running them on 3V instead of 1.5V then that would be more economical. JSG From possumhunter@netzero.net Sun Dec 08 10:26:27 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Dec 2002 18:26:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 32621 invoked from network); 8 Dec 2002 18:26:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Dec 2002 18:26:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.206) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Dec 2002 18:26:25 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 8 Dec 2002 10:26:25 -0800 To: References: <20021208071251.94645.qmail@web14208.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} How are you receiving WLW tonight? Date: Sun, 8 Dec 2002 13:26:09 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 08 Dec 2002 18:26:25.0096 (UTC) FILETIME=[50DB0480:01C29EE7] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.138.108.90] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 John P.wrote: > It's 2AM E.S.T. Sunday and the Delco radio is tuned to WLW. Does anybody else, or everybody else receiving the high-pitched whine / squeal in the audio like I am? I heard it as well. It sounds like a component in their audio chain is going into oscillation. Skywave conditions were rotten last night with WOR buried in the noise. Phooey, I wanted to hear the old tube rig on the air! Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From possumhunter@netzero.net Sun Dec 08 11:38:02 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Dec 2002 19:38:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 99668 invoked from network); 8 Dec 2002 19:38:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Dec 2002 19:38:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.199) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Dec 2002 19:38:00 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 8 Dec 2002 11:38:00 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fw: Hd Radio Date: Sun, 8 Dec 2002 14:37:47 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 08 Dec 2002 19:38:00.0747 (UTC) FILETIME=[514357B0:01C29EF1] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.138.108.90] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 n0uiheric@aol.com wrote: > I do not work for IBiquity, I am a former commercial radio broadcaster who was forced out of the profession because my personal views on the radio business did not mesh with the corporate view. If you love radio so much, but hate the corporate way or running it, compete with them. Go to work for a mom and pop station, or better yet, go buy yourself an AM and run it the way you want. You can buy a class C local or a daytimer for the price of the land it is sitting on in many places. If you make money, you will know your way is better and if you go broke, you will know you were wrong. I think it is fun working for a mom & pop station that is a thorn in the side of the big corporate stations in Greenville! > > If there should be only one type of engineer that SHOULD stay in the business, it is one that supports C-QUAM AM Stereo, not IBOCrap. Honestly, I know several very good engineers who love AM that are not C-QUAM supporters. The fact is, C-QUAM is not the best option for many stations. Many stations have transmitters that do not work well in C-QUAM, or they have an all MONO format, such as News-Talk. > >The C-QUAM supporter is, in my honest opinion, a more logical and more technologically advanced broadcaster than any supporter of IBOCrap. I do agree that C-QUAM is the best option for Hi-Fi AM at this time. IBOC is more technologically advanced, but will be a big problem if it is rolled out as it is now. > > I believe IBOCrap supporters deserve every personal attack dished out to them, and should get out of the radio business, once and for all, and leave it to the REAL BROADCASTERS with REAL VISION. Personal attacks will get you nowhere because the attacked will write you off as a "kook" and your view will not be taken seriously. The way to help get rid of the IBOC noise and QRM on the AM bands is to help show the problems with the HD IBOC system and back up your claims with real measurements, audio recordings, and technical data. Attacking the guy who is told by his boss to install a HD exciter in his transmitter ain't going to do anything but piss him off and turn him against your position. Speaking of IBOC hash, I had a good online conversation with Tom Ray at WOR. I am not at liberty to put the details online, but we talked about a few ideas that would all but get rid of the IBOC hash and QRM to the other stations without harming the IBOC carrier. I am now looking forward to the next night time IBOC test to see if my idea works! Perhaps the guys at the test station can go ahead and try it to stop hashing WTTM? There is not a reason in the world why a manufacturer cannot build am AMAX C-QUAM stereo radio with an IBOC decoder. The radio could automatically switch between AM MONO, C-QUAM, or IBOC, depending on what system the radio station is using. I want to do everything I can to HELP iBIQUITY make HD radio work without hashing the other stations off of the air. My worst digital nightmare is for the 5,000 Watt station on 1580 to put the current IBOC on the air. If they do, I may as well go into WFIS, turn the transmitter off, and go home. Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From ccuff@in4web.com Sun Dec 08 13:14:18 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Dec 2002 21:14:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 88408 invoked from network); 8 Dec 2002 21:14:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Dec 2002 21:14:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Dec 2002 21:14:17 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.99]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Sun, 8 Dec 2002 16:09:01 -0500 Message-ID: <005101c29efd$91479fe0$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: The "Project" Date: Sun, 8 Dec 2002 16:05:40 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 I have no room to modify the unit. Just fitting a decoder in it was like passing a kidney stone. I *might* take them my converted "Porche design" pocket radio, just to show them what is possible, but .. um.. it's not one of their products.. LOL... Now, I do have one walkman that runs on 1.2 volts- a "Gum stick" battery, and it has am stereo. BUT- no schematic, and no identifiable parts- it is CRAMMED!- It does use a doubler or tripler somewhere, as the decoder chip has 5 volts on it. Arrgghh!- Wish walkmans were like they were in 1982 or so- about the size of a VHS tape.. CC ----- Original Message ----- From: From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sun Dec 08 13:34:07 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Dec 2002 21:34:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 31025 invoked from network); 8 Dec 2002 21:34:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Dec 2002 21:34:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Dec 2002 21:34:06 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.147] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 08 Dec 2002 21:34:06 -0000 Date: Sun, 08 Dec 2002 21:34:04 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: HD Radio vs. AMAX Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1768 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.48 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: > The following MP3 file contains a direct comparison between the > actual received "HD Radio" (a.k.a. IBOC) digital audio of 710 WOR > (from a new clip on their web site), immediately followed by the AMAX > hi-fi analog AM Stereo audio of 1450 WCTC, as heard on a Sony SRF-42: > > http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/hdvsamax.mp3 > > Now, which one sounds better to you: the 50,000-watt Class A station > using hundreds of thousands of dollars of digital equipment, or the > 1,000-watt Class C station that was received on a $29.99 Walkman? > > > p.s. Any opinions on the new AMAX logo I created for the Forum's main > page? The colors are somewhat of an inside reference... they are an > abstract representation of a sunrise, as opposed to the planned > "sunset" of analog radio & TV if digital takes over. The IBOC sample definitely sounds synthetic on the top end so Spectral Band Replication must be at work. It also has that warblely underwater sound that (un)realaudio has. At a quick casual listen it sounds like it has a 15KHz response but upon closer examination you can definitely tell it has a synthetic character to it. I imagine your ears would get tired of that and you would just turn the treble down and wouldn't sound much different than the primary 5KHz analog signal they are transmitting also. So what's the point in the end if there is no great sound improvement. On the other hand the AMAX C-QuAM sample may not have the (synthetic) frequency response of IBOC but the Stereo image provides a realism that IBOC can't match. Hey we could apply SBR to a C-QuAM signal for that "Synthetic" frequency response of 15KHz but why. JSG From amfmdx@fastq.com Sun Dec 08 14:17:41 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Dec 2002 22:17:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 56528 invoked from network); 8 Dec 2002 22:17:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Dec 2002 22:17:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Dec 2002 22:17:41 -0000 Received: from fastq (d128-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.160]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gB8MHev85199 for ; Sun, 8 Dec 2002 15:17:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <045101c29f07$89dc5160$89f9bed8@com> To: References: <005101c29efd$91479fe0$0101a8c0@pavilion> Subject: Re: {AMSF} The "Project" Date: Sun, 8 Dec 2002 15:17:03 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > I have no room to modify the unit. Just fitting a decoder in it was like > passing a kidney stone. Sounds like one of those little Sangean units that use one AAA battery. > Arrgghh!- Wish walkmans were like they were in 1982 or so- about the size of > a VHS tape.. Even the size of a pack of cigarettes might be an improvement, eh? Kevoin From n0uiheric@aol.com Sun Dec 08 15:29:14 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Dec 2002 23:29:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 62867 invoked from network); 8 Dec 2002 23:29:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Dec 2002 23:29:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r06.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.102) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Dec 2002 23:29:13 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-r06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.127.1c70faee (16930) for ; Sun, 8 Dec 2002 18:29:10 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <127.1c70faee.2b252fc6@aol.com> Date: Sun, 8 Dec 2002 18:29:10 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: WOR-HD To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih The consumer should have realized that it is MUCH CHEAPER to buy a shortwave converter for their car radio instead of subscribing to XM or Sirius satellite radio. An XM or Sirius-ready radio costs anywhere from $250 to $400 (minus installation and activation) and $11 per month subscription fee. With a shortwave converter, you pay only $90, and you can easily plug it in. The MFJ-306 that I have can be adjusted to cover a desired portion of the 19, 25, 31 and 49 meter (15, 11, 9 and 6 MHz) bands. These are designed to convert shortwave signals to be heard on a typical AM radio (even with digital readout). I can get a lot more stations for free using a shortwave converter. XM doesn't offer any foreign broadcasters, and Sirius only offers the BBC. On shortwave, I can choose from a wide range of broadcasters, such as the BBC, the Voice of America, Radio Netherlands and even EWTN Global Catholic Radio, which is received much better on shortwave than on FM (WOLG 95.9 FM out of Carlinville, IL); the local EWTN affiliate on AM (WRYT 1080 AM Mono) airs their programs on tape delay. A word to the wise: avoid satellite radio and buy a shortwave converter. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Sun Dec 08 15:29:14 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Dec 2002 23:29:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 75345 invoked from network); 8 Dec 2002 23:29:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Dec 2002 23:29:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r03.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.99) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Dec 2002 23:29:11 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-r03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.ca.15b29250 (16930) for ; Sun, 8 Dec 2002 18:29:09 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Sun, 8 Dec 2002 18:29:09 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} AMAX Promos To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih The Digital Disaster PSAs have been running on WSIE (88.7 FM) Edwardsville, IL (where I am PSA Director) for the past year and a half! 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From dav259@csiro.au Sun Dec 08 15:29:45 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Dec 2002 23:29:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 26695 invoked from network); 8 Dec 2002 23:29:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Dec 2002 23:29:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Dec 2002 23:29:44 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gB8NTcP04179; Mon, 9 Dec 2002 10:29:38 +1100 (EST) Date: Mon, 9 Dec 2002 10:29:38 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: amstereoforum Cc: Subject: streaming radio Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public Not a bad new site ... www.CrHear.com From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Dec 08 16:18:50 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 9 Dec 2002 00:18:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 38639 invoked from network); 9 Dec 2002 00:18:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Dec 2002 00:18:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.78) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Dec 2002 00:18:48 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.251] by n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 09 Dec 2002 00:18:45 -0000 Date: Mon, 09 Dec 2002 00:18:44 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: HD Radio vs. AMAX Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1471 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.82.30 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Hey we could apply SBR to a C-QuAM signal for that "Synthetic" > frequency response of 15KHz but why. I, for one, will put forth the opinion that AM radio sounds BETTER with the 10 kHz NRSC audio cut-off. It allows the audio in that range to be more cleanly processed. On FM, the high treble above 10 kHz needs to be really compressed and clipped to death in order to make it through the pre-emphasis curve without overmodulating. As a result, delicate high frequency sounds like hi-hats and drum brushes often get processed into almost a constant stream of white noise. So, whatever extra "crispness" is gained ends up being sacrificed as a loss of precision and detail. This is why a cleanly processed AM music station -- mono or Stereo -- is often perceived as being more crisp and clear than FM, even with the reduced audio bandwidth. When the treble is limited to 10 kHz and put through AM's less agressive pre-emphasis curve, it ends up being more natural-sounding than it would on FM. Most hi-fi AM receivers also have a slight boost of the mid-range (3 to 6 kHz) which makes vocals and instruments like guitars and pianos sound more "open" and not so much drowned out by the bass and treble. As one listener put it when KFRC was simulcasting their Oldies music in AM Stereo and FM Stereo, with AM Stereo it sounds like the lead singer is "in front of" the band, as opposed to sounding like they're singing from "behind" the band on FM. From amfmdx@fastq.com Sun Dec 08 16:19:14 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 9 Dec 2002 00:19:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 27947 invoked from network); 9 Dec 2002 00:19:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Dec 2002 00:19:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Dec 2002 00:19:13 -0000 Received: from fastq ([208.187.57.35]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gB90JCv87439 for ; Sun, 8 Dec 2002 17:19:12 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <049301c29f18$97a80e40$89f9bed8@com> To: References: <127.1c70faee.2b252fc6@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: WOR-HD Date: Sun, 8 Dec 2002 17:19:07 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > The MFJ-306 that I have can be adjusted to cover a desired portion of the 19, > 25, 31 and 49 meter (15, 11, 9 and 6 MHz) bands. These are designed to > convert shortwave signals to be heard on a typical AM radio Eric, your idea is ok but HF is going digital with DRM. Kevin From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sun Dec 08 18:15:57 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 9 Dec 2002 02:15:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 95938 invoked from network); 9 Dec 2002 02:15:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Dec 2002 02:15:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.64) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Dec 2002 02:15:57 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.155] by n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 09 Dec 2002 02:15:56 -0000 Date: Mon, 09 Dec 2002 02:15:56 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: HD Radio vs. AMAX Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2148 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.98 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: > > Hey we could apply SBR to a C-QuAM signal for that "Synthetic" > > frequency response of 15KHz but why. > > I, for one, will put forth the opinion that AM radio sounds BETTER > with the 10 kHz NRSC audio cut-off. It allows the audio in that > range to be more cleanly processed. On FM, the high treble above > 10 kHz needs to be really compressed and clipped to death in order to > make it through the pre-emphasis curve without overmodulating. As a > result, delicate high frequency sounds like hi-hats and drum brushes > often get processed into almost a constant stream of white noise. So, > whatever extra "crispness" is gained ends up being sacrificed as a > loss of precision and detail. > > This is why a cleanly processed AM music station -- mono or Stereo -- > is often perceived as being more crisp and clear than FM, even with > the reduced audio bandwidth. When the treble is limited to 10 kHz > and put through AM's less agressive pre-emphasis curve, it ends up > being more natural-sounding than it would on FM. Most hi-fi AM > receivers also have a slight boost of the mid-range (3 to 6 kHz) > which makes vocals and instruments like guitars and pianos sound more > "open" and not so much drowned out by the bass and treble. > > As one listener put it when KFRC was simulcasting their Oldies music > in AM Stereo and FM Stereo, with AM Stereo it sounds like the lead > singer is "in front of" the band, as opposed to sounding like they're > singing from "behind" the band on FM. The only problem with having the NRSC brick wall at 10.2KHz is that you need to start rolling of the receiver response at 8KHz to avoid a noticeable amount of ringing on certain types of music like loud rock with a heavily modulated top end. If it wasn't for that brick wall restriction then a more gradual roll off could be used where out to 10KHz is flat 12.5KHz is at -10dB and -15KHz is at -20dB. This would avoid the problem of the high treble robbing modulation while opening up the top end a bit which I think it needs. JSG From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Dec 08 18:47:32 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 9 Dec 2002 02:47:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 22153 invoked from network); 9 Dec 2002 02:47:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Dec 2002 02:47:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Dec 2002 02:47:31 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.141] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 09 Dec 2002 02:47:30 -0000 Date: Mon, 09 Dec 2002 02:47:30 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: HD Radio vs. AMAX Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1450 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.82.30 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > If it wasn't for that brick wall restriction then a more gradual > roll off could be used where out to 10KHz is flat 12.5KHz is at > -10dB and -15KHz is at -20dB. The NRSC spec actually allows a "transition range" where the response can follow a diagonal line from 0 dB at 10 kHz to -25 dB at 11 kHz. And this is the *RF* bandwidth spec, so "0 dB" is referenced to the level of the RF carrier, which is quite a bit higher than the actual *audio* level. With some careful adjustment, you could get useable 15+ kHz audio response from a wideband AM receiver while still perfectly fitting the signal within the NRSC specs; that is the same reason why IBOC's digital sidebands are strong enough to be audible as a hissing noise on a wideband receiver. The full NRSC bandwidth specs, including a pre-emphasis chart, can be found in the AM Stereo Forum's Files section. It is actually the Canadian specifications, but I believe they are the same as the U.S. specs, except that the FCC didn't make the *audio* bandwidth limit mandatory, only the *RF* bandwidth limit -- that is the whole reason why IBOC can occupy such a wide bandwidth and still be "legal". In the USA, the 75 uS pre-emphasis is also only mandatory for AM Stereo stations; mono AM stations can still use as much or as little pre- emphasis as they want (and I have local examples of both; one station that uses NO pre-emphasis, and another that uses a LOT of it!). From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Sun Dec 08 20:52:52 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 9 Dec 2002 04:52:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 29441 invoked from network); 9 Dec 2002 04:52:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Dec 2002 04:52:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14206.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.173.70) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Dec 2002 04:52:50 -0000 Message-ID: <20021209045250.33859.qmail@web14206.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [65.221.47.68] by web14206.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 08 Dec 2002 20:52:50 PST Date: Sun, 8 Dec 2002 20:52:50 -0800 (PST) Subject: Let the FCC know about CQuam vs IBOC etc... New Commish on board To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio There is (finally) a new FCC commissioner, and I would invite you to write to him and let him know about your concerns about IBOC, HDTV, Media Concentration (ClearChannel), etc...here's his email, and he has already replied to me, so there is apparently one person on the FCC with an open mind (so far at least). Politely email: Commissioner Adelstein" __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Dec 08 20:58:04 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 9 Dec 2002 04:58:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 24241 invoked from network); 9 Dec 2002 04:58:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Dec 2002 04:58:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.67) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Dec 2002 04:58:02 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.154] by n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 09 Dec 2002 04:58:02 -0000 Date: Mon, 09 Dec 2002 04:58:02 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: FM-quality Hi-Fi AM is possible, even with NRSC Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2406 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.82.30 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics People have always assumed that the NRSC AM bandwidth limit means that AM stations must cut off their audio response at 10 kHz, but that is actually not true. As we have experienced, the IBOC system on the AM band works by transmitting digital sidebands in the 10 to 15 kHz audio range at a rather high level, and yet it still fits within the NRSC bandwidth specs. And there is no reason regular analog AM couldn't put out true audio response up to even 20 kHz without exceeding the NRSC limit. Here is an interesting example which proves this... it is a spectrum analysis graph of a sample of WOR's IBOC signal (as received on their own modulation monitor) -- the blue line on the graph -- superimposed with the spectrum analysis of a typical FM station's audio -- the purple line -- normalized to the same peak level: http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/worvsfm.gif As you can see, the FM audio is actually putting out *less* response above 10 kHz than the IBOC signal is on AM. Of course, that is not taking into consideration the treble pre-emphasis that FM stations use, but considering that in this case, WOR was transmitting the IBOC sidebands at 6 dB less than their maximum allowed level, that would allow room for a decent amount of pre-emphasis to be used and still have the full 15+ kHz audio conform to the NRSC standard if it was transmitted on AM....... without needing any sort of sharp cut-off at or below 10 kHz, as AM stations typically use. So, it would take some tweaking of the audio processing to get the levels just right, but it can be done... allowing listeners with good wide-bandwidth AM radios (including the GE Superadio III) to enjoy full high-fidelity sound on AM, which will really put the synthetic, wishy-washy sound of IBOC/"HD Radio" to shame. And speaking of IBOC... its frequency response, as demonstrated by the audio clips WOR has on their web site, is really quite disappointing: http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/ibocgrph.gif As you can see, it drops off quite a bit at around 4.5 kHz (!), and then from there the "simulated" treble response keeps stair-stepping downwards. So, yes, it does offer "15 kHz" audio bandwidth, but at least the way WOR processes it, even a regular 10 kHz analog AM signal will sound brighter and more "hi-fi", as my previously posted IBOC vs. AMAX AM Stereo audio recording demonstrates. From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sun Dec 08 22:24:08 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 9 Dec 2002 06:24:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 61671 invoked from network); 9 Dec 2002 06:24:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Dec 2002 06:24:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Dec 2002 06:24:06 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.154] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 09 Dec 2002 06:24:06 -0000 Date: Mon, 09 Dec 2002 06:24:06 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: FM-quality Hi-Fi AM is possible, even with NRSC Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 4964 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.167 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: > People have always assumed that the NRSC AM bandwidth limit means > that AM stations must cut off their audio response at 10 kHz, but > that is actually not true. > > As we have experienced, the IBOC system on the AM band works by > transmitting digital sidebands in the 10 to 15 kHz audio range at a > rather high level, and yet it still fits within the NRSC bandwidth > specs. And there is no reason regular analog AM couldn't put out > true audio response up to even 20 kHz without exceeding the NRSC > limit. > The bad part about the IBOC signal technically being just in compliance by being just below the mask is that it is a continious wave of white noise. This mask (dotted line) was set by the FCC to test a transmitter's out of band emissions i.e outside 10.2KHz and did not intend for a station to broadcast that type of signal continuously. If they had any idea that this was the case they would have probably set it -20dB lower. This mask most likely was chosen based upon the summation of several skywave signals during regular program material and not all of them transmitting white noise. There is more energy present weighted over a period of time in the 10-15KHz IBOC sidebands than what is contained in a regular pre- emphasized analog signal that hasn't had it's frequency reduced above 10.2KHz. If a spectrum analyzer had a setting that showed an average weighted response with a slow time constant over a period of time instead of an instanteous peak response then I think that analog signal would definitely be below what an IBOC isgnal generates. If IBOC allowd these kind of energy levels I see no reason why an analog station can't have them either. Analog stations need to start their measuring their mask with an analyzer set on a slow response during program material. > Here is an interesting example which proves this... it is a spectrum > analysis graph of a sample of WOR's IBOC signal (as received on their > own modulation monitor) -- the blue line on the graph -- superimposed > with the spectrum analysis of a typical FM station's audio -- the > purple line -- normalized to the same peak level: > > http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/worvsfm.gif > > As you can see, the FM audio is actually putting out *less* response > above 10 kHz than the IBOC signal is on AM. Of course, that is not > taking into consideration the treble pre-emphasis that FM stations > use, but considering that in this case, WOR was transmitting the IBOC > sidebands at 6 dB less than their maximum allowed level, that would > allow room for a decent amount of pre-emphasis to be used and still > have the full 15+ kHz audio conform to the NRSC standard if it was > transmitted on AM....... without needing any sort of sharp cut-off at > or below 10 kHz, as AM stations typically use. > > So, it would take some tweaking of the audio processing to get the > levels just right, but it can be done... allowing listeners with good > wide-bandwidth AM radios (including the GE Superadio III) to enjoy > full high-fidelity sound on AM, which will really put the synthetic, > wishy-washy sound of IBOC/"HD Radio" to shame. > > And speaking of IBOC... its frequency response, as demonstrated by > the audio clips WOR has on their web site, is really quite > disappointing: > > http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/ibocgrph.gif > > As you can see, it drops off quite a bit at around 4.5 kHz (!), and > then from there the "simulated" treble response keeps stair-stepping > downwards. So, yes, it does offer "15 kHz" audio bandwidth, but at > least the way WOR processes it, even a regular 10 kHz analog AM > signal will sound brighter and more "hi-fi", as my previously posted > IBOC vs. AMAX AM Stereo audio recording demonstrates. I think the best approach for analog transmittion for analog AM is to have all the audio processing units and the C-QuAM exciter designed together, maybe not as one single unit but for them to work together in a highly optimized way. This new AMS (Advanced Modulation System) is, I think its kind of a next generation Symetra- Peak. If I understand the concept of the Symetra-Peak is that it was a phase shifter for the purpose reducing the incidence of the all peaks throughout the spectrum from adding up all at once and thus reducing peak signal level. I think what AMS does is analyze the signal mathematically in the digital domain and adjusts phases dynamically for minimum signal amplitude and maximum energy. When they say that it increases modulation to 200% it means it would take a carrier modulated 200% with a conventional signal to equal the sideband energy of a carrier modulated with an AMS processed signal to +125% & -100%. This could actually work pretty well if the algorythms are written well unlike many of the shortcommings of the Symetra-Peak. JSG From mark_608@hotmail.com Mon Dec 09 09:34:38 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: mark_608@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 9 Dec 2002 17:34:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 11812 invoked from network); 9 Dec 2002 17:34:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Dec 2002 17:34:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.17.85) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Dec 2002 17:34:37 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 9 Dec 2002 09:34:37 -0800 Received: from 136.2.1.101 by lw11fd.law11.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Mon, 09 Dec 2002 17:34:37 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Re: {AMSF} How are you receiving WLW tonight? Date: Mon, 09 Dec 2002 12:34:37 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 09 Dec 2002 17:34:37.0419 (UTC) FILETIME=[3EF2E3B0:01C29FA9] From: "Mark Sundquist" X-Originating-IP: [136.2.1.101] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=3850332 X-Yahoo-Profile: mark_608 I also heard this high pitched sound on 700 in my van at about 02:30 on Sunday...710 was completely wiped out by what sounded like digital noise. 720 didn't sound as bad, but there was noise there too(WGN would pop in and out of stereo). 690 and 680 had some noise as well, but not as loud. I am in Southeast Michigan, just north of Detroit and was listening on a Delco UX-1. Noise was audible both with the AM Stereo on and off (higher and lower bandwidth) Mark Sterling Heights,MI >From: "John P." >Reply-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com >To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, abdx@topica.com >Subject: {AMSF} How are you receiving WLW tonight? >Date: Sat, 7 Dec 2002 23:12:51 -0800 (PST) > >It's 2AM E.S.T. Sunday and the Delco radio is tuned to WLW. Does anybody >else, >or everybody else receiving the high-pitched whine / squeal in the audio >like I >am? It's almost like tinnitis in your ears - a real pain. IF I turn the >equalizer for the 3.5K band all the way DOWN, then I can get rid of it, but >they sound like they're in a paper sack. Sad. Maybe I just have too-good >of a >radio. > > >__________________________________________________ >Do you Yahoo!? >Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. >http://mailplus.yahoo.com _________________________________________________________________ Add photos to your messages with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail From jwelton@nautel.com Mon Dec 09 09:52:15 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jwelton@nautel.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 9 Dec 2002 17:52:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 48116 invoked from network); 9 Dec 2002 17:52:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Dec 2002 17:52:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailserver.nautel.com) (24.222.25.85) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Dec 2002 17:52:13 -0000 Received: FROM jeff-welton BY mailserver.nautel.com ; Mon Dec 09 13:52:30 2002 -0400 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Date: Mon, 09 Dec 2002 13:49:40 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: {AMSF} The solution for AM & FM digital radio! Message-ID: <3DF49F6E.3593.1256690@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: <15a.187bb23d.2b22e044@aol.com> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.02a) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body From: "Jeff Welton" Reply-To: jwelton@nautel.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=26918678 Bob Carter said: > All sounds "neat" and workable,but you have a cost factor here.Thats where > digital radio fails in Canada...cost. Plus the attitude of why should I buy X > brand digital radio to hear the same thing on AM/FM which I think if I'm not > mistaken, has a far better broadcast coverage area over the digital band. That plus the fact that you couldn't get a digital receiver here at all until about three weeks ago - and nobody is promoting it - and it's only being tested in three cities (granted those three cities cover 75% of our population - almost), but whose gonna buy a radio for a feature that only works in T.O. and Montreal. Cost wise, they don't run a whole bunch more than a comparable non- DAB, although most of the DAB radios I have seen have been higher end. As a matter of fact, until this month when Rad. Shack started selling them, the only places to get them were at Circuit City and Best Buy south of the border, because several of the radios that designed for Sirius and XM will also receive Eureka. Jeff Welton Down East (where I'll go from receiving seven stations to receiving none, if Eureka rolls through!) From florida_amstereo@hotmail.com Mon Dec 09 10:13:21 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: florida_amstereo@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 9 Dec 2002 18:13:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 31538 invoked from network); 9 Dec 2002 18:13:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Dec 2002 18:13:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.37.176) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Dec 2002 18:13:21 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 9 Dec 2002 10:10:19 -0800 Received: from 209.240.198.61 by pv2fd.pav2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Mon, 09 Dec 2002 18:10:18 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Re: {AMSF} The solution for AM & FM digital radio! Date: Mon, 09 Dec 2002 18:10:18 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 09 Dec 2002 18:10:19.0587 (UTC) FILETIME=[3BC7C930:01C29FAE] From: "Donn Tillman" X-Originating-IP: [209.240.198.61] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83914824 Jeff Welton wrote: >and nobody is promoting it(D.A.B.) - and it's only being tested in three >cities (granted those three cities cover 75% of our population almost. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ 1050 CHUM is promoting the D.A.B. radio available at Radio Shack, at least in their Christmas newsletter; I suspect, they're probably promoting in on the air also. donn st petersburg,fl ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ from the Christmas CHUM newsletter I received: ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ A COOL CHRISTMAS GIFT IDEA…! If you're looking for a cool Christmas gift, you'll want to check out the new Digital Audio Broadcasting (DAB) radio available at Radio Shack! This compact radio fits in your pocket and delivers CD quality audio! 1050 CHUM has been broadcasting in digital for a while now, but when we found out about these great little receivers we felt we had to tell you about it! Now we can all listen to 1050 CHUM in CD quality for relatively little cost!   Another cool feature is the LCD display that tells you key information about the song you are listening to on CHUM!   You can check it out right now by clicking here: http://www.radioshack.ca/estore/Product.aspx?language=en-CA&product=1208101&category=Pocket+Radios&catalog=RadioShack The $300 price tag would be approximately $225 U.S. ~~~Excerpts from Original Message~~ That plus the fact that you couldn't get a digital receiver here at all until about three weeks ago - and nobody is promoting it - and it's only being tested in three cities (granted those three cities cover 75% of our population - almost), but whose gonna buy a radio for a feature that only works in T.O. and Montreal. Cost wise, they don't run a whole bunch more than a comparable non- DAB, although most of the DAB radios I have seen have been higher end. As a matter of fact, until this month when Rad. Shack started selling them, the only places to get them were at Circuit City and Best Buy south of the border, because several of the radios that designed for Sirius and XM will also receive Eureka. Jeff Welton Down East (where I'll go from receiving seven stations to receiving none, if Eureka rolls through!) _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 helps eliminate e-mail viruses. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Mon Dec 09 10:26:29 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 9 Dec 2002 18:26:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 83714 invoked from network); 9 Dec 2002 18:26:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Dec 2002 18:26:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14201.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.143) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Dec 2002 18:26:28 -0000 Message-ID: <20021209182628.27929.qmail@web14201.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.45.202.244] by web14201.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 09 Dec 2002 10:26:28 PST Date: Mon, 9 Dec 2002 10:26:28 -0800 (PST) Subject: MULTI-SYSTEM DECODER (somebody could help make it so) Fanfare? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio Possum Hunter - "you're alright man", figuring out a way to make lemonade out of the lemons at this time in working with Tom Ray - Thank You. PH Wrote:"...Speaking of IBOC hash, I had a good online conversation with Tom Ray at WOR...we talked about a few ideas that would all but get rid of the IBOC hash and QRM to the other stations without harming the IBOC carrier..." I also agree on this one too IF IBOC exists, AND the digital QRM hash goes away, AND IBOC does NOT get approved for night-time but C-QUAM does, THEN (as PH wrote:)"... There is not a reason in the world why a manufacturer cannot build am AMAX C-QUAM stereo radio with an IBOC decoder. The radio could automatically switch between AM MONO, C-QUAM, or IBOC, depending on what system the radio station is using." You hit the nail on the head - the best of all worlds: * 25HZ pilot= CQUAM / AMAX Mode: w/Omega technology (or Symphony) * No Pilot or IBOC: Omega NoiseBlanker mode (even simulated phase shift stereo?) * IBOC present: Circuitry determines IF there is too much IBOC digital bit loss to keep the sytem in C-Quam until the IBOC stays at a more constant level. All of these modes could be enhanced with the Omega / Fanfare system which would aid in the lower signal levels while going through an underpass etc... Keep us posted on the developments Possum Hunter. This could be pretty slick if the IBOC noise level goes down as you've suggested. __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Mon Dec 09 10:31:22 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 9 Dec 2002 18:31:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 29533 invoked from network); 9 Dec 2002 18:31:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Dec 2002 18:31:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14204.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.146) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Dec 2002 18:31:21 -0000 Message-ID: <20021209183121.67837.qmail@web14204.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.45.202.244] by web14204.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 09 Dec 2002 10:31:21 PST Date: Mon, 9 Dec 2002 10:31:21 -0800 (PST) Subject: Anybody in 'plastics'? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, Christopher Cuff MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio Mr. "Christopher Cuff" wrote: "I have no room to modify the unit. Just fitting a decoder in it was like passing a kidney stone." Is there anybody on the list that has any connections in the plastic molding business? If we could make an 'insert' that would take the place of the existing battery compartment door and it would extend beyond the size of the current radio giving you real estate for the 3 batteries PLUS the decoder. It would need a door of its own for the 3 batteries. Sounds like a lot of monkey business, but it could help pave the way for some production CQuam again. It's much easier to lower DC voltage than to increase it in this case. Should have listened to 'Mrs. Robinson' - 'the future's in plastics!' __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From jsgil@hal-pc.org Mon Dec 09 11:51:50 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 9 Dec 2002 19:51:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 66875 invoked from network); 9 Dec 2002 19:51:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Dec 2002 19:51:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.78) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Dec 2002 19:51:50 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.171] by n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 09 Dec 2002 19:51:50 -0000 Date: Mon, 09 Dec 2002 19:51:47 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Anybody in 'plastics'? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20021209183121.67837.qmail@web14204.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1800 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.121 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John P." wrote: > Mr. "Christopher Cuff" wrote: > "I have no room to modify the unit. Just fitting a decoder in it was like > passing a kidney stone." > > Is there anybody on the list that has any connections in the plastic molding > business? If we could make an 'insert' that would take the place of the > existing battery compartment door and it would extend beyond the size of the > current radio giving you real estate for the 3 batteries PLUS the decoder. It > would need a door of its own for the 3 batteries. Sounds like a lot of monkey > business, but it could help pave the way for some production CQuam again. > It's much easier to lower DC voltage than to increase it in this case. > > Should have listened to 'Mrs. Robinson' - 'the future's in plastics!' > I had talked to someone who had some knowledge about plastic molding. He said that it was very expensive to have the metal mold machined and I think I remember he said something like $5000 but I could be wrong as this seems extremely high but I do remember that I was out of most peoples budget. I afraid that plastic molding is mostly reserved for the big boys. If we were going to have a case made I would suggest we make one for a whole radio and not just for a decoder. Having to install decoders can be a hassel and sometimes impossible and with this kind of investment necessary and it just makes more sense to have one made for a whole radio. I think a MC13024 based pocket size that is low price is perfect for a station to buy large quantities for giveaway for the promotion of AM Stereo. Remember we want a radio that people don't have to think twice about whether to spend it on a radio ot the next month's groceries as it is with DAB radios. JSG From philipr@irac.pe.ca Mon Dec 09 11:55:20 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 9 Dec 2002 19:55:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 53102 invoked from network); 9 Dec 2002 19:55:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Dec 2002 19:55:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Dec 2002 19:55:19 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.129] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 09 Dec 2002 19:55:18 -0000 Date: Mon, 09 Dec 2002 19:55:18 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: DAB, IBOC & CQUAM [not a high tech law firm!] Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3231 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking Right now, DAB is available in Toronto, Montreal, Windsor, and Vancouver - with Ottawa soon to come on line. I believe it will be coming to Edmonton and Calgary very soon. I think its soon on the agenda for Quebec City as well. Rumour has it that there will be applications before the CRTC for Halifax in the first half of 2003. Eureka 147 DAB was originally supposed to replace AM and FM in Canada - but that's like saying an electric car can replace not only a regular car, but also trucks and buses. Not the best analogy, for sure, but I'm still scratching my head for a really good analogy. Eureka 147 DAB offers a lot of promise for "built up areas" dense urban cores where both AM and FM have signal difficulties. For longer range broadcasting, especially to the suburbs, small cities and towns, and rural areas, FM and AM are a lot more practical. Marketers talk about the notion of a "felt need". If you are driving through downtown Toronto, and you experience poor reception of say Q107 in your car, you may be able to be persuaded to go for a new DAB car stereo. Or, you may just play CDs! But, if you're driving through downtown Charlottetown, there is no such incentive - local AM and FM is flawless when it comes to interference and noise. That's why I figure DAB MAY take off in the large cities. But there is really no need for it, from a consumer's view, in a city or town where a seven storey building is considered tall! There is, however, a felt need, amoung at least some people, to be able to listen to the radio on a long drive - in fact, the longer and farther you drive, the less likely you will be constantly feeding CDs - the more likely you will be seeking a weather forecast, some news, etc. Here is where FM, and even more AM, can shine. Thus, I would like to see, for the Canadian market, AM/FM/DAB radios, with the AM being CQUAM stereo, and both AM and FM enhanced by modern digital processing techniques - along with DAB for the urban core. Perhaps, as suggested previously, a smart chip could automatically switch over to DAB and back, as you enter/leave the urban core. As for the US market, its always possible that what IBOC needs is AM stereo, and vice versa. If the IBOC sideband issue can be improved, IBOC by day, with CQUAM at night just might work. Maybe it would be worth paying extra for an IBOC receiver, if it also came with CQUAM. Therefore, as part of IBOC testing, maybe it would be wise to try some CQUAM tests too. Why not try testing IBOC by day, then switching to CQUAM at night? Maybe its time to bury the hatchet, mend some fences, get our noses back in joint and get some good ideas brewing - digital and analogue. One system, by itself, may just not cut it. In some areas, we may have to agree to disagree, but there may be some room for common ground. Yet, from a technological side, there may be a lot of common circuitry, especially on the receiver side. So, while I remain skeptical about IBOC [just as I am skeptical about Eureka 147 DAB too], I'm willing to keep an open mind. Maybe, just maybe, those promoting IBOC will see CQUAM as a partner which could solve a lot of problems. Phil R. From philipr@irac.pe.ca Mon Dec 09 12:09:58 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 9 Dec 2002 20:09:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 22606 invoked from network); 9 Dec 2002 20:09:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Dec 2002 20:09:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.89) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Dec 2002 20:09:57 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.141] by n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 09 Dec 2002 20:09:57 -0000 Date: Mon, 09 Dec 2002 20:09:54 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Anybody in 'plastics'? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2255 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking On this point, I see RP Electronics is carrying a new line of translucent [your choice of blue or red] polycarbonate cases. While angular and plain, the translucent appearance spruces things up a bit. Something like this, with a battery door hatch, would be ideal. Phil R. --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "jsgilst " wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John P." > wrote: > > Mr. "Christopher Cuff" wrote: > > "I have no room to modify the unit. Just fitting a decoder in it was > like > > passing a kidney stone." > > > > Is there anybody on the list that has any connections in the plastic > molding > > business? If we could make an 'insert' that would take the place of > the > > existing battery compartment door and it would extend beyond the > size of the > > current radio giving you real estate for the 3 batteries PLUS the > decoder. It > > would need a door of its own for the 3 batteries. Sounds like a lot > of monkey > > business, but it could help pave the way for some production CQuam > again. > > It's much easier to lower DC voltage than to increase it in this > case. > > > > Should have listened to 'Mrs. Robinson' - 'the future's in > plastics!' > > > > I had talked to someone who had some knowledge about plastic > molding. He said that it was very expensive to have the metal > mold machined and I think I remember he said something like > $5000 but I could be wrong as this seems extremely high but I > do remember that I was out of most peoples budget. I afraid that > plastic molding is mostly reserved for the big boys. If we were > going to have a case made I would suggest we make one for a whole > radio and not just for a decoder. Having to install decoders > can be a hassel and sometimes impossible and with this kind of > investment necessary and it just makes more sense to have one > made for a whole radio. I think a MC13024 based pocket size that > is low price is perfect for a station to buy large quantities > for giveaway for the promotion of AM Stereo. Remember we want a > radio that people don't have to think twice about whether to spend > it on a radio ot the next month's groceries as it is with DAB radios. > > JSG From philipr@irac.pe.ca Mon Dec 09 12:24:43 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 9 Dec 2002 20:24:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 66824 invoked from network); 9 Dec 2002 20:24:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Dec 2002 20:24:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.78) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Dec 2002 20:24:41 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.253] by n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 09 Dec 2002 20:24:41 -0000 Date: Mon, 09 Dec 2002 20:24:41 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: enclosures Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 346 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking Check out this link: http://www.rpelectronics.com/ Look at enclosures and racks - ABS enclosures, the first of 4 headings - check out 1599BBKBAT, 1599BGYBAT and 1599EBKBAT. These are ABS, grey or black, not translucent polycarbonate. However, they have a battery door. Could be ideal for a little AM Stereo / FM Stereo Walkman. Phil R. From philipr@irac.pe.ca Mon Dec 09 12:36:38 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 9 Dec 2002 20:36:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 52614 invoked from network); 9 Dec 2002 20:36:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Dec 2002 20:36:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.88) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Dec 2002 20:36:36 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.138] by n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 09 Dec 2002 20:36:36 -0000 Date: Mon, 09 Dec 2002 20:36:33 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: enclosures Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 786 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking Just to follow up, according to the printed RP electronics catalogue, these cases are available in a cheaper, but not as strong, polystyrene. Also, optional beltclips are available - once again, handy for a walkman type rig. Personally, I'd opt for the ABS, which also has brass inserts for the screws - a quality touch. --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Phil Rafuse " wrote: > Check out this link: > > http://www.rpelectronics.com/ > > Look at enclosures and racks - ABS enclosures, the first of 4 > headings - check out 1599BBKBAT, 1599BGYBAT and 1599EBKBAT. These > are ABS, grey or black, not translucent polycarbonate. However, > they have a battery door. Could be ideal for a little AM Stereo / > FM Stereo Walkman. > > Phil R. From ccuff@in4web.com Mon Dec 09 14:06:26 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 9 Dec 2002 22:06:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 70652 invoked from network); 9 Dec 2002 22:06:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Dec 2002 22:06:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Dec 2002 22:06:24 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.65]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Mon, 9 Dec 2002 17:01:10 -0500 Message-ID: <003f01c29fce$03cc5f80$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Anybody in 'plastics'? Date: Mon, 9 Dec 2002 16:57:48 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 I "have" a radio all ready, just wanting a case. I have 500 circuit boards already plated, and the radio works fine. All I need is a custom case. A custom mold may be the only way 5 grand or not. Chris ----- Original Message ----- From: From stodd@sherbtel.net Mon Dec 09 14:20:36 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 9 Dec 2002 22:20:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 1842 invoked from network); 9 Dec 2002 22:20:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Dec 2002 22:20:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.70) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Dec 2002 22:20:34 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.150] by n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 09 Dec 2002 22:20:34 -0000 Date: Mon, 09 Dec 2002 22:20:33 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: DAB, IBOC & CQUAM [not a high tech law firm!] Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 943 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amstereodude " X-Originating-IP: 65.121.7.116 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude I agree with you, Phil, that we need to be less combative in our debate, but since both IBOC and CQUAM have night problems, I don't know that a IBOC-day/CQUAM-night solution would be well received. I think it's still fair to ask if IBOC is indeed enough of an improvement to be worth the extra expense. From what I can tell, regular AMS is better by day than IBOC, so why even go through the trouble of the latter? As a broadcaster, we still have to face the steep fees involved, and only the big guns will be able to do it. Plus John and Jane Q. Public will likely be apathetic to a much more expensive receiver for IBOC with so slight an improvement. Scott Todd > Why not try testing IBOC by day, then > switching to CQUAM at night? Maybe its time to bury the hatchet, > mend some fences, get our noses back in joint and get some good > ideas brewing - digital and analogue. One system, by itself, may > just not cut it. From stodd@sherbtel.net Mon Dec 09 14:29:31 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 9 Dec 2002 22:29:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 78328 invoked from network); 9 Dec 2002 22:29:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Dec 2002 22:29:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.83) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Dec 2002 22:29:31 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.157] by n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 09 Dec 2002 22:29:30 -0000 Date: Mon, 09 Dec 2002 22:29:27 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: The "Project" Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <005101c29efd$91479fe0$0101a8c0@pavilion> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 331 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amstereodude " X-Originating-IP: 65.121.7.116 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Christopher Cuff" wrote: > I have no room to modify the unit. Just fitting a decoder in it was like > passing a kidney stone. That shoots an idea I might have suggested, and that's a one transistor blocking oscillator using a transistor radio type coupling transformer. ST From ccuff@in4web.com Mon Dec 09 14:33:09 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 9 Dec 2002 22:33:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 2408 invoked from network); 9 Dec 2002 22:33:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Dec 2002 22:33:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Dec 2002 22:33:07 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.140]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id ; Mon, 9 Dec 2002 17:27:53 -0500 Message-ID: <000501c29fd1$bf4beac0$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: Cc: Subject: Radio TV special on tonite Date: Mon, 9 Dec 2002 17:24:30 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 Get your VCR's running- there is a 2 hour special Tonite on PBS 9PM to 11:00 PM EST Ken Burns special on the Men who made Radio. Should be worthwile! Chris From ccuff@in4web.com Mon Dec 09 14:44:07 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 9 Dec 2002 22:44:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 6448 invoked from network); 9 Dec 2002 22:44:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Dec 2002 22:44:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Dec 2002 22:44:07 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.140]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Mon, 9 Dec 2002 17:38:52 -0500 Message-ID: <002701c29fd3$48482a40$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: <005101c29efd$91479fe0$0101a8c0@pavilion> <045101c29f07$89dc5160$89f9bed8@com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} The "Project" Date: Mon, 9 Dec 2002 17:35:30 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 Today, I decided to try and repair a Aiwa walkman I got off ebay a year ago. This one was mis-advertised, so I got it for $5.00 and I knew it was a Japanese domestic model with am stereo. I had toyed with it time and again, but it was always dead. Come to find out, unlike any other model, it has a circuit that if there are no headphones plugged in, it will not turn on. It was because the jack also has a remote control part, and was broken. Anyway, now that it works, I see how they did the high voltage- there is a super mini DC-DC converter, all SMD, on board. The parts are so small, there is no room for values- but an LCR bridge will help figure out values. This walkman is cool, in that it has a LED for AM Stereo, but no indicator for FM stereo. It uses the TA2040, and performs well. Chris From ccuff@in4web.com Mon Dec 09 14:59:30 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 9 Dec 2002 22:59:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 64120 invoked from network); 9 Dec 2002 22:59:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Dec 2002 22:59:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Dec 2002 22:59:29 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.140]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id ; Mon, 9 Dec 2002 17:54:15 -0500 Message-ID: <004801c29fd5$6e303a20$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: Cc: References: Subject: DAB, IBOC & CQUAM Date: Mon, 9 Dec 2002 17:50:53 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 This morning, as conditions are good, I was DXing, but cannot get 720 out of Chicago due to digital noise. Today, on the Aiwa AM Stereeo walkman, I noticed that the adjacent channels to WOR were much cleaner now. BUT- now, I am having digital noise on WPHT 1210- tried several radios. Anyone testing IBOC in the 1180-1220 area? Chris From ccuff@in4web.com Mon Dec 09 15:02:24 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 9 Dec 2002 23:02:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 55166 invoked from network); 9 Dec 2002 23:02:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Dec 2002 23:02:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Dec 2002 23:02:23 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.140]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Mon, 9 Dec 2002 17:57:06 -0500 Message-ID: <004e01c29fd5$d465ffa0$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: Subject: new cheapie Date: Mon, 9 Dec 2002 17:53:44 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 The Walmart $5.00 pocket raio is now improved! I am not sh**ing you! It now has an extra AM IF can, and NO filters! I hooked up an am stereo/fm stero decoder, and it is incredible! Put it in a Ramsey clamshell enclosure, and you have a real nice tuner! Chris From KC4QLP@aol.com Mon Dec 09 17:36:33 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Dec 2002 01:36:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 37168 invoked from network); 10 Dec 2002 01:36:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Dec 2002 01:36:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d02.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.34) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Dec 2002 01:36:31 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.17a.1331dcde (4238) for ; Mon, 9 Dec 2002 20:36:17 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <17a.1331dcde.2b269f11@aol.com> Date: Mon, 9 Dec 2002 20:36:17 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} DAB, IBOC & CQUAM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/9/02 6:01:10 PM Eastern Standard Time, ccuff@in4web.com writes: << This morning, as conditions are good, I was DXing, but cannot get 720 out of Chicago due to digital noise. Today, on the Aiwa AM Stereeo walkman, I noticed that the adjacent channels to WOR were much cleaner now. BUT- now, I am having digital noise on WPHT 1210- tried several radios. Anyone testing IBOC in the 1180-1220 area? Chris >> The lastest station testing is WCHB.Taylor MI....50kw day,15kw night-time directional. They too has received complaints of serve adjacent channel interference. Also a point of interest,something I picked up on another list...take a look for yoursevles: Subj: Re: [NRC-am] WCHB iboc Date: 12/9/02 3:25:12 PM Eastern Standard Time From: paul@amtower.com (Paul Smith, W4KNX) Reply-to: am@nrcdxas.org To: am@nrcdxas.org This is BS, Bruce.... I was in Lancaster, PA a few weeks ago, when WLW was testing IBOC. I sent an email to them via their website telling them that their signal was not listenable due to some strange noise that was blocking them out. I got a note back from Tom Ray telling me two things: 1. I was not in their service area, and that WOR was not meant to be listenable in Lancaster, PA. ( It was very much listenable when the IBOC was off. 2. What I was hearing had to be some kind of electrical noise. My note was very nice and informational, however, I did NOT tell him that I had a pretty good working knowledge of the technical end of AM radio, and he basically blew me off as though I didnt matter. I was impressed that their DOE would answer me, but the tone of his note was that I was a dumb schmuck that didnt know what the hell I was talking about and that since I was not in their service area, it didnt matter. So, basically, unless you are in one of NYC's boroughs, they are going to ignore you... and NOT count your complaint. Paul Smith W4KNX Located in Sunny Sarasota Florida http://www.amtower.com paul@amtower.com Subj: RE: [NRC-am] WCHB iboc Date: 12/8/02 7:35:59 PM Eastern Standard Time From: fredv@nrcdxas.org (Frederick R. Vobbe) Reply-to: am@nrcdxas.org To: am@nrcdxas.org At 02:02 PM 12/8/2002 -0800, you wrote: >The IBOC noise is so "natural" sounding that I bet John and Jane Q. Listener >will think it's electrical noise and not even think of saying anything to >the stations...... Chuck, that's the beauty behind the scheme. You can buffalo a lot of non-engineer types in position of power, and drop hints that the person with the complaint lives in a noisy area. Someone like my dad, who listens to radio all day, would buy the spin and then be dumbfounded on how to resolve the issue. I bet 99.9% of the people would give up in disgust. And THAT, is what I think iBiquity and others hope will happen. I have to agree with the person(s) who said that it's not about improving the quality of radio, it's about controlling spectrum and a technology that has served us well. Unlike the pressure put on broadcasters with DTV, this move remind me of that bad neighbor who collects old cars. While you could care less about what the neighbor does to his property, his actions affect your property value and the perceptions the public has of you. In this example, any reasonable court would order the neighbor to clean up the mess. I think the FCC's reply so far is "it's not THAT bad". What I find interesting about this whole issue is that when I have written to some of the anti-IBOC people they are willing to supply recordings, data, example after example of cases where interference is encroaching on what should be a good signal. I can also site my experiences trying to listen to WOWO-1190 while driving back from Detroit this past week. Barry, your observations were especially interesting, as was Fred in Livonia, and Tom in Harrisburg. On the other side of the fence, when trying to establish dialog with the pro-IBOC folks, little or no replies are offered. And when I have received replies, they are very guarded. In short, I'm getting the feeling I'm asked to step into a dark alley to buy a watch. A side note, the people at DRM have been open to dialog and I've traded E-mails with several people high up in the company. So I ask myself, "what are they trying to hide?" This list is extremely large, as lists go. The reading to posting is obscenely one sided in read-only, and I have to assume that there are people in the lists that have ties to interests; corporate radio, manufacturing, and government. I would like to direct the following to those on the pro side of IBOC. You have seen the claims and rhetoric of many people in this list. Some with merit, other with here say and speculation. If you really think IBOC will work, and not cause problems, please address this concerns. If you don't care about the DXer, (and you do have the right to do so), what is your position on those of us who deal with B-grade signals from stations? I've listened to WLW for years. Am I to accept WOR's interference to WLW? Who will resolve it, WLW or WOR? In times of natural disaster, or national emergency, sometimes the radio listener has to secure reception from B-grade signals. Such was the case on 9/11 in various communities in rural America. How will we deal with the created interference, and who will restore to us the signals we need in a time of crisis? To me these are valid questions and need to be addressed with solutions, and not suggestions. I trust that those of you on the pro-IBOC side will be interested in supporting your claims with data, candor, and willing to allow neutral parties to test the technology free of business concerns. Doing so would limit the fear many of us have in this technology. It may also bring understanding, cooperation, and limit resistance to your efforts. Fred ======================================================== I'd have to say those two gentlemen made some very valid points....and so far those points are discard as either being outrageous,coming from someone that has no idea what they speak of,whiners,dreamers,whackos, and other adjectives that I wont repeat here. If I had to pick a digital system to use..it would be DRM.Having heard the shortwave broadcast test of this system,it certainly doesnt "spread" itself over a wide spectrum like IBOC appears to do......and of course the timely responses and openness from the DRM folks is another plus positive that they have ..that others are servilely lacking...speaking of lacking..still no timely response to the "receiver data" inquire either that I posted and asked for...... Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From KC4QLP@aol.com Mon Dec 09 18:11:17 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Dec 2002 02:11:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 2264 invoked from network); 10 Dec 2002 02:11:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Dec 2002 02:11:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d02.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.34) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Dec 2002 02:11:17 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.176.12af7a7c (4238) for ; Mon, 9 Dec 2002 21:11:05 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <176.12af7a7c.2b26a738@aol.com> Date: Mon, 9 Dec 2002 21:11:04 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: The "Project" To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/9/02 5:31:08 PM Eastern Standard Time, stodd@sherbtel.net writes: << That shoots an idea I might have suggested, and that's a one transistor blocking oscillator using a transistor radio type coupling transformer. ST >> That certainly would work if you had the room for it...but here's the big question...how much RF noise would it have generated? Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Dec 09 19:01:53 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Dec 2002 03:01:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 23543 invoked from network); 10 Dec 2002 03:01:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Dec 2002 03:01:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Dec 2002 03:01:53 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.163] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 10 Dec 2002 03:01:53 -0000 Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 03:01:52 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: DAB, IBOC & CQUAM [not a high tech law firm!] Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1753 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.71.35 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > I don't know that a IBOC-day/CQUAM-night solution would be well > received. I think it's still fair to ask if IBOC is indeed enough > of an improvement to be worth the extra expense. Whatever is used, has to be a *full-time* solution, if for no other reason than corporate politics. You can be sure that iBiquity and Motorola aren't going to work together on this, any more than Kahn and Motorola did the first time around. In this case, the clear choice will either be full-fledged use of IBOC (a.k.a. "HD Radio"), or some effective means of improving receiver design so that the capabilities of the existing analog AM and C-Quam AM Stereo systems will be more fully utilized, such as through Motorola's "Symphony" DSP-based receiver design. At this point, IBOC is still definitely a work in progress... the system is changing almost every week. We shall see how long they keep up with the testing and tweaking before they either achieve the results they're looking for, or just give up on the whole thing. I believe iBiquity's latest projection for IBOC receiver availability in U.S. stores is Spring 2003... all I can say is, I'll believe it when I see it! They have been promising IBOC receivers for a DECADE now... somewhere I have a 1993 magazine article that said IBOC was "just around the corner", just like HDTV! For what it's worth, WOR claims Visteon is going full steam ahead with IBOC, and already has IBOC-equipped car radios that are being used for reception tests... and because of this, they also claim Visteon is no longer supporting C-Quam AM Stereo in their radios. Anybody know this for sure? Do the latest Visteon CD-6 radios in "2003" Ford/Lincoln/Mercury/Mazda vehicles still support AM Stereo? From evergreenterrace@buzzle.com Mon Dec 09 19:03:06 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: evergreenterrace@buzzle.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Dec 2002 03:03:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 1412 invoked from network); 10 Dec 2002 03:03:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Dec 2002 03:03:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.78) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Dec 2002 03:03:06 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.133] by n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 10 Dec 2002 03:03:06 -0000 Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 03:03:01 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Radio TV special on tonite Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <000501c29fd1$bf4beac0$0101a8c0@pavilion> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 303 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgliradio " X-Originating-IP: 170.20.11.59 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=69711087 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgliradio --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Christopher Cuff" wrote: > Get your VCR's running- there is a 2 hour special Tonite on PBS 9PM to > 11:00 PM EST Ken Burns special on the Men who made Radio. > Should be worthwile! > Chris Empire Of The Air. This is 10 years old. Great special. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Dec 09 19:12:24 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Dec 2002 03:12:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 77171 invoked from network); 10 Dec 2002 03:12:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Dec 2002 03:12:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Dec 2002 03:12:24 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.133] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 10 Dec 2002 03:12:23 -0000 Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 03:12:21 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: DAB, IBOC & CQUAM Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <004801c29fd5$6e303a20$0101a8c0@pavilion> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1349 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.71.35 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > BUT- now, I am having digital noise on WPHT 1210- tried several > radios. > Anyone testing IBOC in the 1180-1220 area? I recall hearing about a station on 1180 kHz or so that is testing IBOC, including nighttime tests. Not sure where, but I will try to find out. I'm pretty sure it's not WHAM. My latest "DX machine" is a 1985 Volkswagen car radio (radio only, no cassette) that is supposed to have AM Stereo... reception is *excellent* on AM, day and night, with a very good compromise between selectivity and audio fidelity, but the strange thing is that its MC13020 won't enter Stereo mode when known AM Stereo stations are tuned in, even with perfect reception... but, it *will* pop into Stereo mode when a mix of stations on a channel causes "falsing"! So, I think its 25 Hz pilot detector is off-frequency. I also have the same VW radio, except as a 1986 model, which uses the exact same circuit board except with the AM Stereo and DNR (Dynamic Noise Reduction) sections completely empty, and even painted white as a warning not to install any parts there! These radios were made by Mitsubishi, and otherwise have excellent quality... but for some STUPID reason they killed the AM Stereo *and* DNR after only 1 year! A more fancy model with full-logic cassette also had its AM Stereo killed at the same time. Argh!! From possumhunter@netzero.net Mon Dec 09 19:51:05 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Dec 2002 03:51:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 7548 invoked from network); 10 Dec 2002 03:51:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Dec 2002 03:51:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.95) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Dec 2002 03:51:04 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 9 Dec 2002 19:51:04 -0800 To: Cc: Subject: Fw: [AM740] Tom Fulton passes away Date: Mon, 9 Dec 2002 22:50:45 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 10 Dec 2002 03:51:04.0838 (UTC) FILETIME=[5D2B2260:01C29FFF] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.158.70.22] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Brian Smith" To: Sent: Monday, December 09, 2002 3:04 PM Subject: [AM740] Tom Fulton passes away With the deepest regrets I must inform you that AM740 radio personality Tom Fulton passed away suddenly this morning after his morning show. Tom was 58. He was originally from British Columbia and has worked at CKFH (later CJCL), CJRT, CING-FM 108, CFRB and lastly CHWO as the morning man since they went to AM 740. He was The Big Kahuna at CKFH in the late 60's. You can listen to Tom from those days at this link: http://rockradioscrapbook.tripod.com/fulton.ram He is survived by wife Sheryl and 19 year old son Jesse From possumhunter@netzero.net Mon Dec 09 20:06:55 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: possumhunter@netzero.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Dec 2002 04:06:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 69670 invoked from network); 10 Dec 2002 04:06:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Dec 2002 04:06:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rly-ip03.mx.aol.com) (64.12.138.7) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Dec 2002 04:06:53 -0000 Received: from logs-tm.proxy.aol.com (logs-tm.proxy.aol.com [152.163.197.5]) by rly-ip03.mx.aol.com (v89.10) with ESMTP id RELAYIN5-1209230559; Mon, 09 Dec 2002 23:05:59 1900 Received: from ibm (AC9E4616.ipt.aol.com [172.158.70.22]) by logs-tm.proxy.aol.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with SMTP id gBA44vg459739 for ; Mon, 9 Dec 2002 23:04:57 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <018901c2a001$474f8380$1091b498@aoldsl.net> To: References: <004e01c29fd5$d465ffa0$0101a8c0@pavilion> Subject: Re: {AMSF} new cheapie Date: Mon, 9 Dec 2002 23:04:41 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Apparently-From: DodgeRamTrucker@aol.com From: "Possum Hunter" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 What is the make and model of this radio? I may have to get one to play with Kevin ----- Original Message ----- From: "Christopher Cuff" To: Sent: Monday, December 09, 2002 5:53 PM Subject: {AMSF} new cheapie > The Walmart $5.00 pocket raio is now improved! I am not sh**ing you! > It now has an extra AM IF can, and NO filters! > I hooked up an am stereo/fm stero decoder, and it is incredible! > Put it in a Ramsey clamshell enclosure, and you have a real nice tuner! > Chris > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Dec 09 20:31:04 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Dec 2002 04:31:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 74520 invoked from network); 10 Dec 2002 04:31:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Dec 2002 04:31:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.64) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Dec 2002 04:31:02 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.253] by n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 10 Dec 2002 04:31:00 -0000 Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 04:30:58 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: new cheapie Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <018901c2a001$474f8380$1091b498@aoldsl.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 711 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.71.35 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > What is the make and model of this radio? I may have to get one to > play with I dunno, but you can also try Radio Shack's $6.99 "Pocket Size AM Radio" -- the former "Flavoradio", now available in any color you want as long as it's black. This might be the last classic AM-only transistor radio still made, and yes, it does convert to AM Stereo quite nicely! One tip: It works better when you use a traditional 9-volt transistor radio battery, in place of its two AA cells; it has no trouble with the higher voltage, and that makes the AM Stereo decoder work better. Even in standard form, it's a great little AM radio, and I believe they still include that tiny "Secret Service agent" earphone! From groucho@skyweb.net Mon Dec 09 20:44:27 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Dec 2002 04:44:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 91861 invoked from network); 10 Dec 2002 04:44:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Dec 2002 04:44:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Dec 2002 04:44:27 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gBA4njsI032335 for ; Mon, 9 Dec 2002 23:49:48 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DF57055.959EA2D7@skyweb.net> Date: Mon, 09 Dec 2002 23:40:54 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fw: [AM740] Tom Fulton passes away References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Yeah I was listening to 740 tonight. they said Tom finished his show and was walking to his car when he collapsed outside the studios from a Heat attack... BTW they said the temp was -6 degrees with a wind chill of 12 below tomorrow's highs expected at 2 degrees... Now that's what I call Cold.... I guess no tower work in the winters Up there.... Possum Hunter wrote: > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Brian Smith" > To: > Sent: Monday, December 09, 2002 3:04 PM > Subject: [AM740] Tom Fulton passes away > > With the deepest regrets I must inform you that AM740 radio personality Tom > Fulton passed away suddenly this morning after his morning show. > Tom was 58. He was originally from British Columbia and has worked at CKFH > (later CJCL), CJRT, CING-FM 108, CFRB and lastly CHWO as the morning man > since they went to AM 740. > > He was The Big Kahuna at CKFH in the late 60's. You can listen to Tom from > those days at this link: > http://rockradioscrapbook.tripod.com/fulton.ram > > He is survived by wife Sheryl and 19 year old son Jesse > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From n0uiheric@aol.com Mon Dec 09 21:32:45 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Dec 2002 05:32:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 2486 invoked from network); 10 Dec 2002 05:32:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Dec 2002 05:32:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r08.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.104) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Dec 2002 05:32:42 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-r08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.15e.183a71f3 (30970) for ; Tue, 10 Dec 2002 00:32:40 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <15e.183a71f3.2b26d678@aol.com> Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 00:32:40 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fw: Hd Radio To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih Unfortunately, Possum, there are NO commercial mom-and-pop radio stations in the St. Louis area. I am working, however, in public radio. As a DJ, I am given more freedom in programming and PSA decisions in public radio than I would have even gotten with a mom-and-pop station. I had tried to buy a Class B daytimer with a group of former college radio DJs and a ham radio operator in 1989-90; unfortunately, more investors were interested in the same old failed on-air policies, formats that people were getting tired of, a continued interest in destroying AM radio, and personalities that overstayed their welcome on the airwaves than new policies, new formats, new technologies and new personalities (primarily homegrown talent) looking to build on the name recognition they built in college radio. IBOC is NOT TECHNOLOGICALLY ADVANCED...it's a STEP BACKWARD. One of the group says it's an attempt to reduce or eliminate our freedom of choice concerning programming. Deregulation has done a good job of reducing our free choice, not only in programming, but also stripping thousands of radio people of their jobs. If there is one company you should be helping, it's Motorola, not IBiquity. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From possumhunter@netzero.net Mon Dec 09 22:54:47 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: possumhunter@netzero.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Dec 2002 06:54:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 29112 invoked from network); 10 Dec 2002 06:54:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Dec 2002 06:54:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rly-ip03.mx.aol.com) (64.12.138.7) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Dec 2002 06:54:47 -0000 Received: from logs-tm.proxy.aol.com (logs-tm.proxy.aol.com [152.163.197.5]) by rly-ip03.mx.aol.com (v89.10) with ESMTP id RELAYIN10-1210014742; Tue, 10 Dec 2002 01:47:42 1900 Received: from ibm (AC9E4616.ipt.aol.com [172.158.70.22]) by logs-tm.proxy.aol.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with SMTP id gBA6k4g467102 for ; Tue, 10 Dec 2002 01:46:05 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <024801c2a017$c9291540$1091b498@aoldsl.net> To: References: <15e.183a71f3.2b26d678@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fw: Hd Radio Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 01:45:33 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Apparently-From: DodgeRamTrucker@aol.com From: "Possum Hunter" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 n0uiheric@aol.com wrote: > If there is one company you should be helping, it's Motorola, not IBiquity. I am putting at least one Motorola C-QUAM signal on the air where there was never one before. I am NOT putting IBiquity IBOC signals on the air. I think this action says what side of the IBOC Vs. C-QUAM debate I am on. Thee sooner IBOC dies the better, IMOHO, but if I can help them prevent another "Hash Fest" Like we heard from WLW and WOR the other night that killed 60-70Khz of spectrum, I will. Today, I was able to talk another station owner into getting OUT of the NAB. Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Dec 09 22:57:40 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Dec 2002 06:57:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 62564 invoked from network); 10 Dec 2002 06:57:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Dec 2002 06:57:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.67) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Dec 2002 06:57:39 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.142] by n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 10 Dec 2002 06:57:39 -0000 Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 06:57:37 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Fw: [AM740] Tom Fulton passes away Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3DF57055.959EA2D7@skyweb.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 388 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.71.35 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > BTW they said the temp was -6 degrees with a wind chill of 12 below > tomorrow's highs expected at 2 degrees... Now that's what I call > Cold.... I guess no tower work in the winters Up there.... Heh... remember, them's in Canadian degrees... so -6 degrees C is the same as 21 degrees F is to us... not too bad, considering that recently it's been even colder than that here in NJ. From jsgil@hal-pc.org Mon Dec 09 23:31:45 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Dec 2002 07:31:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 62733 invoked from network); 10 Dec 2002 07:31:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Dec 2002 07:31:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.89) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Dec 2002 07:31:45 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.147] by n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 10 Dec 2002 07:31:44 -0000 Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 07:31:44 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: DAB, IBOC & CQUAM Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1129 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.240 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: > > My latest "DX machine" is a 1985 Volkswagen car radio (radio only, no > cassette) that is supposed to have AM Stereo... reception is > *excellent* on AM, day and night, with a very good compromise between > selectivity and audio fidelity, but the strange thing is that its > MC13020 won't enter Stereo mode when known AM Stereo stations are > tuned in, even with perfect reception... but, it *will* pop into > Stereo mode when a mix of stations on a channel causes "falsing"! > So, I think its 25 Hz pilot detector is off-frequency. > If they use elctrolytics in the pilot filter they can dry out and change value which will change the BP frequency which would explain why it falses on co-channel interference and not the real pilot tone. Most components for this filter can be changed to offer more pilot tone gain and better detection under marginal contitions. Here is a schematic for components that will boost the pilot tone for good locking. http://www.hal-pc.org/~jsgil/AM-Stereo/MC13020P-PilotToneFix.gif JSG From ccuff@in4web.com Tue Dec 10 00:24:19 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Dec 2002 08:24:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 93110 invoked from network); 10 Dec 2002 08:24:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Dec 2002 08:24:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Dec 2002 08:24:18 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.41]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Tue, 10 Dec 2002 03:19:04 -0500 Message-ID: <005a01c2a024$555cb100$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: <004e01c29fd5$d465ffa0$0101a8c0@pavilion> <018901c2a001$474f8380$1091b498@aoldsl.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} new cheapie Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 03:15:40 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 You will not be disappointed!- It is a butt ugly thing, that would remind you of "cookie puss" (to those that have never seen a Carvel ice cream commercial on TV, Carvel makes these ice cream cakes shaped like figures for kids parties. Here in the NE USA, who can forget "Fudgie the Whale", Nutty the ghost, or Dumpie the pumpkin... ) Anyway, they are a hideous blue pocket radio, in the walkman section of any WalMart. The price is always $5.00 (higher in Canada, eh?) Chris ----- Original Message ----- From: Possum Hunter To: From ccuff@in4web.com Tue Dec 10 00:28:04 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Dec 2002 08:28:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 40167 invoked from network); 10 Dec 2002 08:28:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Dec 2002 08:28:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Dec 2002 08:28:04 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.41]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Tue, 10 Dec 2002 03:22:50 -0500 Message-ID: <006001c2a024$dbf30980$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: DAB, IBOC & CQUAM Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 03:19:27 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 More likely, the ceramic resonator has drifted- put one of my newer ones in- much better. 1180 is OK- I am getting 1170 out of Wheeling no problem, and 1190 as well. Now, during this morning, someone is wiping out everything from 540 to 670!!! Again, verified with 3 radios, including a non-digital TRF. CC ----- Original Message ----- From: To: > I recall hearing about a station on 1180 kHz or so that is testing > IBOC, including nighttime tests. Not sure where, but I will try to > find out. I'm pretty sure it's not WHAM. > > My latest "DX machine" is a 1985 Volkswagen car radio (radio only, no > cassette) that is supposed to have AM Stereo... reception is > *excellent* on AM, day and night, with a very good compromise between > selectivity and audio fidelity, but the strange thing is that its > MC13020 won't enter Stereo mode when known AM Stereo stations are > tuned in, From ccuff@in4web.com Tue Dec 10 00:31:17 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Dec 2002 08:31:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 46577 invoked from network); 10 Dec 2002 08:31:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Dec 2002 08:31:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Dec 2002 08:31:17 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.41]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Tue, 10 Dec 2002 03:26:03 -0500 Message-ID: <006e01c2a025$4efe06a0$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: new cheapie Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 03:22:40 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 Oh- I forgot- the brand is "Lennox sound"- MUCH better than the RS radio at $5.00, it also has now a separate 2 transistor FM front end. How they do this for a quid is beyond me! CC ----- Original Message ----- From: From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Dec 10 02:05:23 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Dec 2002 10:05:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 98298 invoked from network); 10 Dec 2002 10:05:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Dec 2002 10:05:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.75) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Dec 2002 10:05:22 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.135] by n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 10 Dec 2002 10:05:22 -0000 Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 10:05:21 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: DAB, IBOC & CQUAM Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <006001c2a024$dbf30980$0101a8c0@pavilion> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 834 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.71.35 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > More likely, the ceramic resonator has drifted- put one of my newer > ones in- much better. No resonator! Just a "coil in a can"!! I thought it might be a 262.5 kHz radio, but the ceramic filter says "450" right on it. I tried adjusting the coil, but even very carefully, I can't get it to lock onto real Stereo signals. > Now, during this morning, someone is wiping out everything from 540 > to 670!!! Again, verified with 3 radios, including a non-digital > TRF. Sure it's not 620 WJWR "Sporting News Radio" from northeast NJ? Their directional array is soooo bad that in some of their nulls, one of the sidebands AND the carrier TOTALLY disappear, leaving you with a "squawking duck" SSB signal! I wouldn't be surprised if something in their equipment totally went on the fritz and is spewing out IBOC-like hash. From amstereoguy@hotmail.com Tue Dec 10 03:17:09 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereoguy@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Dec 2002 11:17:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 57225 invoked from network); 10 Dec 2002 11:17:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Dec 2002 11:17:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (207.68.165.14) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Dec 2002 11:17:08 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 10 Dec 2002 03:09:54 -0800 Received: from 208.228.96.20 by sea2fd.sea2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Tue, 10 Dec 2002 11:09:54 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: DAB, IBOC & CQUAM Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 06:09:54 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 10 Dec 2002 11:09:54.0284 (UTC) FILETIME=[AABDC2C0:01C2A03C] From: "Chris Cuff" X-Originating-IP: [208.228.96.20] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37866059 You should have a copy of the original Radio-Electronics decoder build it article from Jan '84- Take out that can circuit, and use a resonator. Better still, use a 13028 decoder and bypass that 13020 circuit all together. As for 620, I cannot believe they are still allowed to broadcast such a harsh signal!- They have been bad as long as I remember. CC >From: "Kevin T. " > >No resonator! Just a "coil in a can"!! I thought it might be a >262.5 kHz radio, but the ceramic filter says "450" right on it. > >I tried adjusting the coil, but even very carefully, I can't get it >to lock onto real Stereo signals. _________________________________________________________________ Help STOP SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail From philipr@irac.pe.ca Tue Dec 10 07:04:31 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Dec 2002 15:04:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 54447 invoked from network); 10 Dec 2002 15:04:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Dec 2002 15:04:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.75) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Dec 2002 15:04:28 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.160] by n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 10 Dec 2002 15:04:28 -0000 Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 15:04:28 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: SAT to tune A-L Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 409 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking Has anyone tried using a Select-A-tenna to as an antenna tuner for the Alfredo-Lite transmitter? I'm thinking of the SAT with the front mount jack [model 540M, if my memory is correct], and wiring it, using a 1/8 plug, to in effect put the SAT in series with an external antenna, using the SAT's internal coil and variable capacitor to tune the external antenna. I may give this a try sometime. Phil From groucho@skyweb.net Tue Dec 10 08:07:03 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Dec 2002 16:07:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 68390 invoked from network); 10 Dec 2002 16:07:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Dec 2002 16:07:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Dec 2002 16:07:02 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gBAGCOTp011778 for ; Tue, 10 Dec 2002 11:12:25 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DF6103E.DACB2368@skyweb.net> Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 11:03:10 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Fw: [AM740] Tom Fulton passes away References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 I was So Tired when your Right your Right LOL... "Kevin T. " wrote: > > BTW they said the temp was -6 degrees with a wind chill of 12 below > > tomorrow's highs expected at 2 degrees... Now that's what I call > > Cold.... I guess no tower work in the winters Up there.... > > Heh... remember, them's in Canadian degrees... so -6 degrees C is > the same as 21 degrees F is to us... not too bad, considering that > recently it's been even colder than that here in NJ. > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From penry@nortelnetworks.com Tue Dec 10 10:30:09 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: penry@nortelnetworks.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Dec 2002 18:30:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 92179 invoked from network); 10 Dec 2002 18:30:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Dec 2002 18:30:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO zsc3s004.nortelnetworks.com) (47.81.138.65) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Dec 2002 18:30:07 -0000 Received: from zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com (zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com [47.103.122.112]) by zsc3s004.nortelnetworks.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id gBAIU5c27990 for ; Tue, 10 Dec 2002 10:30:06 -0800 (PST) Received: from zrc2c011.us.nortel.com (zrc2c011.us.nortel.com [47.103.120.51]) by zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id gBAIUHT14650 for ; Tue, 10 Dec 2002 12:30:17 -0600 (CST) Received: by zrc2c011.us.nortel.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Tue, 10 Dec 2002 12:30:03 -0600 Message-ID: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A560797404A21A10@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: {AMSF} Fw: Hd Radio Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 12:30:01 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) From: "Charles Penry" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=376233 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa5vhu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Thanks Possum for saying what I was thinking. n0uiheric, So, some 12 years ago you got with a group of losers, tried to buy a radio station, and then let your pessimism get the best of you when you discovered that you had indeed chosen the wrong people to go into business with. You then gave up and just became even more bitter about your life not working out as you had planned. That's the American spirit! Way to go!!! Who says you have to live in St. Louis? If you want to buy a small radio station you are likely going to have to get off your behind and move out to the middle of nowhere to be able to afford one to get you started. If you are successful, you can buy more stations, perhaps even in some medium or large markets. Or you can sit there and become more bitter every day about how you were kicked out of commercial radio, badmouthing on this list those who will not have you. It's your choice. Get over it or don't. If you don't get over it, don't expect much sympathy from the rest of the world as it moves on. And pick up the phone, dial 911 and ask then what TECHNOLOGICALLY ADVANCED means. They will send out someone who will explain it to you. Charles -----Original Message----- From: n0uiheric@aol.com [mailto:n0uiheric@aol.com] Sent: Monday, December 09, 2002 11:33 PM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fw: Hd Radio Unfortunately, Possum, there are NO commercial mom-and-pop radio stations in the St. Louis area. I am working, however, in public radio. As a DJ, I am given more freedom in programming and PSA decisions in public radio than I would have even gotten with a mom-and-pop station. I had tried to buy a Class B daytimer with a group of former college radio DJs and a ham radio operator in 1989-90; unfortunately, more investors were interested in the same old failed on-air policies, formats that people were getting tired of, a continued interest in destroying AM radio, and personalities that overstayed their welcome on the airwaves than new policies, new formats, new technologies and new personalities (primarily homegrown talent) looking to build on the name recognition they built in college radio. IBOC is NOT TECHNOLOGICALLY ADVANCED...it's a STEP BACKWARD. One of the group says it's an attempt to reduce or eliminate our freedom of choice concerning programming. Deregulation has done a good job of reducing our free choice, not only in programming, but also stripping thousands of radio people of their jobs. If there is one company you should be helping, it's Motorola, not IBiquity. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From KC4QLP@aol.com Tue Dec 10 12:10:16 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Dec 2002 20:10:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 12605 invoked from network); 10 Dec 2002 20:10:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Dec 2002 20:10:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r08.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.104) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Dec 2002 20:10:14 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.155.189c3f16 (4380) for ; Tue, 10 Dec 2002 15:10:05 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <155.189c3f16.2b27a41d@aol.com> Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 15:10:05 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fw: Hd Radio To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 12/10/02 1:32:24 PM Eastern Standard Time, penry@nortelnetworks.com writes: > Who says you have to live in St. Louis? If you want to buy a small radio > station you are likely going to have to get off your behind and move out to > the middle of nowhere to be able to afford one to get you started. If you > are successful, you can buy more stations, perhaps even in some medium or > large markets. > > Or you can sit there and become more bitter every day about how you were > kicked out of commercial radio, badmouthing on this list those who will not > have you. > > It's your choice. Get over it or don't. If you don't get over it, don't > expect much sympathy from the rest of the world as it moves on. > > And pick up the phone, dial 911 and ask then what TECHNOLOGICALLY ADVANCED > means. They will send out someone who will explain it to you. > > > Charles > > AMEN to that "brother" Charles! I dont know of many that hasnt said something similar over the past few years....but the "oh poor ol me" song keeps playing on. But in the mean time...I get my good laugh of the day..shake my head on move on to the next posting. {playing my fiddle} Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From stodd@sherbtel.net Tue Dec 10 13:19:22 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Dec 2002 21:19:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 37122 invoked from network); 10 Dec 2002 21:19:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Dec 2002 21:19:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Dec 2002 21:19:19 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.162] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 10 Dec 2002 21:19:14 -0000 Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 21:19:13 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fw: Hd Radio Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <155.189c3f16.2b27a41d@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 680 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amstereodude " X-Originating-IP: 65.121.7.116 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude > AMEN to that "brother" Charles! > I dont know of many that hasnt said something similar over the past few > years....but the "oh poor ol me" song keeps playing on. I understand KALT has gone dark. Probably could pick that up for a song. All set for AM stereo, too. One other thing- the guy that invented the steam engine, he originally wanted to break into the trade of making precision measuring instruments, like calipers, etc. The trade was too closed to newcomers, so he decided to give us something that made him world famous, and helped give us the industrial revolution instead of living the rest of his life an anonymous precision tool maker. Scott Todd From n0uiheric@aol.com Tue Dec 10 13:23:12 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Dec 2002 21:23:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 53724 invoked from network); 10 Dec 2002 21:23:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Dec 2002 21:23:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d08.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.40) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Dec 2002 21:23:12 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-d08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.61.2a714485 (4426) for ; Tue, 10 Dec 2002 16:23:05 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <61.2a714485.2b27b539@aol.com> Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 16:23:05 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} DAB, IBOC & CQUAM [not a high tech law firm!] To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih No, IBOCrap is UNACCEPTABLE...only AM Stereo and FM Stereo, with DAB replaced with shortwave. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Tue Dec 10 13:23:15 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Dec 2002 21:23:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 77346 invoked from network); 10 Dec 2002 21:23:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Dec 2002 21:23:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r04.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.100) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Dec 2002 21:23:13 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-r04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.b0.30f0a994 (4426) for ; Tue, 10 Dec 2002 16:23:09 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 16:23:09 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: WOR-HD To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih That's because DRM is more suited to SWBC than IBOCrap. We don't need AM or FM to be digital; IBOC is just not suited to our present radios. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Tue Dec 10 13:23:24 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Dec 2002 21:23:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 54096 invoked from network); 10 Dec 2002 21:23:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Dec 2002 21:23:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r02.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.98) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Dec 2002 21:23:23 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-r02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.126.1c822f0e (4426) for ; Tue, 10 Dec 2002 16:23:07 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <126.1c822f0e.2b27b53b@aol.com> Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 16:23:07 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Let the FCC know about CQuam vs IBOC etc... New Commish on board To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih I've already E-mailed the new commissioner...and the other Democrat, Mike Copps. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From fanfare@globility.com Tue Dec 10 13:49:22 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Dec 2002 21:49:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 81507 invoked from network); 10 Dec 2002 21:49:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Dec 2002 21:49:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.83) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Dec 2002 21:49:21 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.154] by n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 10 Dec 2002 21:49:20 -0000 Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 21:49:19 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: A little Canadian air Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2235 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Marv Southcott " X-Originating-IP: 64.56.234.177 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy Excuse the 'off-topic' post, but every once in awhile we see or hear US broadcast weatherpeople refer to "a blast of cold Canadian air" making its way down into the southern climes of its great neighbor to the south and causing great discomfort. It's probably true that, in the presence of a media that seems intent lately on taking the mickey out of their friendly neighbor to the north, they would refer to the air being "manufactured" up here for export. Probably to the CNN studios in particular. In fact it is fluctuating Jet Stream that sometimes gives much more cold air than you would normally get. And we get it as well. Unfortunately, when someone unfamiliar with Canada's metric temperature system (used all over the Eastern hemisphere and much of the western) comments on how cold the metric system makes it appear to be up here, simply reinforces the belief that some kind of snowline is ever present north of the 50th parallel. That has to hold truth for some because our Customs guys still see the odd car sporting US plates with snow skis on their roof rack in the dead of summer. But what really bothers me is that the metric system Canada and the US were about to adopt in 1983, was done by decree up here, but defeated by forces unknown in the US. As a result, Canada now reports its temperature in degrees Celsius(aka Centigrade)where water freezes at zero degrees C.(32F) and boils at 100 degrees C. (212F). Simple, yes(once you're used to it) ... scientifically advantageous, yes; popular ... no! As of this writing, our road signs are in kilometers, our meat is in pounds and kilograms, our gas and our booze is in liters (beer in pints mind you) and our standard paper size is still 8.5 x 11. In the foreseeable future, all of North America will be thinking in metric because schools will be blending it into the curriculm. That way it will find a more accepting audience. Sounds a little like IBOC doesn't it? BTW. Easy way to remember important temps C to F is; 10C = 50F; 20C = 68F(room temp), 30C = 86F(the reverse of 20C). US gal, a little less than 4 liters; 1 pound = a little less than 1/2 kilogram. Speed, 60mph = 100km/hr. Thank you for your indulgence. Marv From florida_amstereo@hotmail.com Tue Dec 10 14:58:13 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: florida_amstereo@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Dec 2002 22:58:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 11828 invoked from network); 10 Dec 2002 22:58:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Dec 2002 22:58:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.37.129) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Dec 2002 22:58:11 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 10 Dec 2002 14:49:37 -0800 Received: from 209.240.198.61 by pv2fd.pav2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Tue, 10 Dec 2002 22:49:37 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Artic Blasts of Cold Air Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 22:49:37 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 10 Dec 2002 22:49:37.0858 (UTC) FILETIME=[6AE6C220:01C2A09E] From: "Donn Tillman" X-Originating-IP: [209.240.198.61] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83914824 Your points are well taken, Marv. The meteorologist here that I think is the best in the area, refers to the cold air as "Artic blasts" and we have to remember that Russia, the U.S.(Alaska) as well as Canada have territory in the Artic circle. In fact, if I'm not mistaken, a member of this list resides within the Artic circle in Barrow,Alaska. Some other easy to remember points of reference for Celsius temperature are 28°C is 82°F(just reverse the figures) and 32° is 90°F. So, if in the middle of summer, you read where Toronto has a maximum temperature of 32°; trust me, they are not freezing, but rather running their air-conditioners. I don't know why the U.S. dropped the conversion to the metric program in 1983, but it does leave the U.S. out of sync with much of the rest of the world. donn --Excerpts from Original Message------ From: "Marv Southcott Reply-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} A little Canadian air Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 21:49:19 -0000 Excuse the 'off-topic' post, but every once in awhile we see or hear US broadcast weatherpeople refer to "a blast of cold Canadian air" making its way down into the southern climes of its great neighbor to the south and causing great discomfort. It's probably true that, in the presence of a media that seems intent lately on taking the mickey out of their friendly neighbor to the north, they would refer to the air being "manufactured" up here for export. Probably to the CNN studios in particular. In fact it is fluctuating Jet Stream that sometimes gives much more cold air than you would normally get. And we get it as well. Unfortunately, when someone unfamiliar with Canada's metric temperature system (used all over the Eastern hemisphere and much of the western) comments on how cold the metric system makes it appear to be up here, simply reinforces the belief that some kind of snowline is ever present north of the 50th parallel. That has to hold truth for some because our Customs guys still see the odd car sporting US plates with snow skis on their roof rack in the dead of summer. As of this writing, our road signs are in kilometers, our meat is in pounds and kilograms, our gas and our booze is in liters (beer in pints mind you) and our standard paper size is still 8.5 x 11. In the foreseeable future, all of North America will be thinking in metric because schools will be blending it into the curriculm. That way it will find a more accepting audience. Sounds a little like IBOC doesn't it? BTW. Easy way to remember important temps C to F is; 10C = 50F; 20C = 68F(room temp), 30C = 86F(the reverse of 20C). _________________________________________________________________ STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail From groucho@skyweb.net Tue Dec 10 15:10:51 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Dec 2002 23:10:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 28748 invoked from network); 10 Dec 2002 23:10:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Dec 2002 23:10:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Dec 2002 23:10:50 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gBANGD3g083657 for ; Tue, 10 Dec 2002 18:16:14 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DF67375.79278D18@skyweb.net> Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 18:06:30 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com" Subject: New Ratings Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 I am proud to say that in a 2 Month period we went From Not Being on the Arbitron list to last months 0.4% this month WTTM made it to .6% of our Market Getting there.. AM STEREO Rules. how Does that Billy Joel Song go.... Say goodbye to I BOC. Say goodbye to No Ratings Say goodbye to I BOC Say Hello to AM stereooooooo RATINGS.... LOL Neal From florida_amstereo@hotmail.com Tue Dec 10 15:17:31 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: florida_amstereo@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Dec 2002 23:17:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 43814 invoked from network); 10 Dec 2002 23:17:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Dec 2002 23:17:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.37.75) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Dec 2002 23:17:30 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 10 Dec 2002 15:17:30 -0800 Received: from 209.240.198.61 by pv2fd.pav2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Tue, 10 Dec 2002 23:17:30 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: "I heard it through the Grapevine" DAB ns IBOC Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 23:17:30 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 10 Dec 2002 23:17:30.0606 (UTC) FILETIME=[4FEFD8E0:01C2A0A2] From: "Donn Tillman" X-Originating-IP: [209.240.198.61] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83914824 My opinion and some hear-say (not heresy!) here. From where I am I have not heard any of the hash described, but then again, I cannot receive WOR here at all and WLW doesn't come in all that well here. I do think IBOC and Ibiquity will be here and not fade away. They seem to have invested a lot of money and they're not likely to let their investment go down the tubes easily. From what I've heard on the list, IBOC is not a very viable for the am band, but Ibiquity and their associates at WOR seem to be in it for the long haul; although I concede they could do some polishing on their public relations skills. In Canada, Duff Roman, who has close ties to the CHUM radio group, is also the chief spokesman for Eureka [ DAB (Digital Audio Broadcast)], which is apparently why CHUM AM-1050 is promoting DAB and the DAB receiver at Radio Shack; (and) I have to say, they do seem to have polished their public relations skills, no crude spokespeople for DAB and as far as I know the main limitation for DAB is distance, but no nighttime problems. I have also heard that one reason Canada (is going) went Euraka DAB is because..They suspected a while back that IBOC-AM's hash would trash their AM's, with no real recourse. Also Canada is committed to Eureka because they knew that IBOC would not work well enough for them to want to beat a path to Ibiquity's doorstep. With that said, Seems to me that WOR and Ibiquity are digging in their heels and intend to be around for a long time. Their "best defense is a good offense", where they slander their opponents, and it will probably work for them as well as it works the politicians to sling mud. btw- the minimum temperature here tomorrow will be around 16°C, but don't bring your snow-skies! :) donn in Canada's southernmost province - Florida _________________________________________________________________ Add photos to your messages with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail From rpena@syscom.com.mx Tue Dec 10 15:28:25 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: rpena@syscom.com.mx X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Dec 2002 23:28:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 15045 invoked from network); 10 Dec 2002 23:28:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Dec 2002 23:28:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO webserver.syscom.com.mx) (207.248.25.130) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Dec 2002 23:28:24 -0000 Received: from syscom.com.mx (syscom.com.mx [207.248.25.130]) by webserver.syscom.com.mx (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id gBB1Wfv15778 for ; Tue, 10 Dec 2002 18:32:41 -0700 X-RAV-AntiVirus: Verificado contra virus en: webserver.syscom.com.mx Received: from 148.233.19.45 (SquirrelMail authenticated user rpena) by syscom.com.mx with HTTP; Tue, 10 Dec 2002 18:32:42 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <52627.148.233.19.45.1039570362.squirrel@syscom.com.mx> Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 18:32:42 -0700 (MST) Subject: Requesting radio To: X-Priority: 3 Importance: Normal X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: SquirrelMail (version 1.2.4) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit From: rpena@syscom.com.mx X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public Dear Friends: I am Ramon Pena from Mexico, i need to obtain a AM stereo portable receiver. awaiting your response, Best Regards RAMON PENA From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Tue Dec 10 15:59:58 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Dec 2002 23:59:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 84912 invoked from network); 10 Dec 2002 23:59:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Dec 2002 23:59:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web41001.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.93.0) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Dec 2002 23:59:56 -0000 Message-ID: <20021210235956.39751.qmail@web41001.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.35.104] by web41001.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 10 Dec 2002 15:59:56 PST Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 15:59:56 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: {AMSF} A little Canadian air To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio But the Metric system, which uses Earth standards, will be totally useless when we go to Mars where there is different pressure than here. Therefore, water won't boil at 100ºC on Mars, but rather 50ºC, or in normal terms= 122ºF. So, HA! (Insert smiley face here). Mars- the Future. Kinda like A.M. Stereo, is it not? 73, N1WVQ __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From KC4QLP@aol.com Tue Dec 10 16:30:23 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 00:30:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 79131 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 00:30:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 00:30:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r05.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.101) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 00:30:22 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.142.4c0f5da (4380) for ; Tue, 10 Dec 2002 19:30:19 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <142.4c0f5da.2b27e11b@aol.com> Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 19:30:19 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} A little Canadian air--OT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/10/02 4:50:35 PM Eastern Standard Time, fanfare@globility.com writes: << But what really bothers me is that the metric system Canada and the US were about to adopt in 1983, was done by decree up here, but defeated by forces unknown in the US. As a result, Canada now reports its temperature in degrees Celsius(aka Centigrade)where water freezes at zero degrees C.(32F) and boils at 100 degrees C. (212F). Simple, yes(once you're used to it) ... scientifically advantageous, yes; popular ... no!>> Probably some dead head whiner in Washington DC that particularly doesnt like change, more than likely had something to do with the use of metrics here in the states. <> I visited Canada,Niagra Falls Canada to be exact in April.What little bit of Canada I did see,I was quite impressed with it all. Personally I found that it wasnt hard to get used to the differences in the metric system up there. I hope to return soon...sometime in 2003 family funds pending that is. I have brother in laws and sister in laws that live in Herkimer ,Rome, and Utica NY..and the trip to Canada is a must on every visit up there. Perhaps we can arrange an eye ball visit sometime. << Sounds a little like IBOC doesn't it? BTW. Easy way to remember important temps C to F is; 10C = 50F; 20C = 68F(room temp), 30C = 86F(the reverse of 20C). US gal, a little less than 4 liters; 1 pound = a little less than 1/2 kilogram. Speed, 60mph = 100km/hr. Thank you for your indulgence. Marv >> BTW..I found AM broadcasters to be quite different north of the border.Not just the cleaner sound of stations...like mine here,but the programming was quite refreshing as well. Seems like I remember hearing some AMers up there...like AM 1050..{dont remember any calls right off hand} seemed to have that fade in fade out sound to them {the sky wave and ground wave canceling distorted sound} ..are they using shortwave to link some of the AM stations in the outer reaches up there? Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From florida_amstereo@hotmail.com Tue Dec 10 16:50:55 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: florida_amstereo@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 00:50:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 9083 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 00:50:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 00:50:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.37.60) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 00:50:55 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 10 Dec 2002 16:50:55 -0800 Received: from 209.240.198.61 by pv2fd.pav2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 00:50:54 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Re: {AMSF} A little Canadian air-1050 CHUM Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 00:50:54 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 11 Dec 2002 00:50:55.0232 (UTC) FILETIME=[5C8DE800:01C2A0AF] From: "Donn Tillman" X-Originating-IP: [209.240.198.61] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83914824 I visited Canada,Niagra Falls Canada to Bob Carter wrote: >BTW..I found AM broadcasters to be >quite different north of the >border.>Not just the cleaner sound of stations...like mine here,but the programming was quite refreshing as well. >Seems like I remember hearing some AMers up there...like AM 1050..{dont remember any calls right off hand} seemed to have...... That would have been 1050 CHUM - Toronto,right down the road (QEW) from Niagara Falls and St Catherine. CHUM has returned to their oldies format; after a year of sports/talk. CHUM is also broadcasting in and promoting D.A.B. donn, st petersburg _________________________________________________________________ The new MSN 8: advanced junk mail protection and 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail From stodd@sherbtel.net Tue Dec 10 17:14:44 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 01:14:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 52001 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 01:14:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 01:14:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 01:14:44 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-85-65.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.85.65]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gBB1EeOd029260 for ; Tue, 10 Dec 2002 19:14:41 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <00bf01a8ea4c$49947bc0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <3DEEC864.BE119862@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} I heard WTTM For The First Time!!! Date: Fri, 4 Jan 1980 03:39:06 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Have you actually had someone make measurements on WTIR just before and after the switch time? Once you've done that and proved they don't power down, write them a letter on your company's letterhead explaining to them you know for a fact they are failing to power down. Send it certified mail, return receipt requested, so you have evidence they got the letter. Then give them about a week after receiving the return confirmation to see if they conform. If not, repeat the above proceedure, and then threaten them with FCC action, and send the FCC a copy of the letter. If they STILL don't do anything, and the FCC fails to take action, the next step is a lawsuit in civil court. Scott Todd phone is working again! ----- Original Message ----- From: "Possum Hunter" > > WTIR is a Pain in My Butt... they seem to own the east coast all the way > to Canada. > > How do they get away with running 10KW 24/7? From possumhunter@netzero.net Tue Dec 10 17:23:07 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 01:23:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 94504 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 01:23:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 01:23:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.117) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 01:23:06 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 10 Dec 2002 17:23:06 -0800 To: References: <61.2a714485.2b27b539@aol.com> Subject: IBOC on FM Was: DAB, IBOC & CQUAM [not a high tech law firm!] Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 20:22:41 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 11 Dec 2002 01:23:06.0011 (UTC) FILETIME=[DB6366B0:01C2A0B3] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.136.226.251] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 n0uiheric@aol.com wrote: >No, IBOCrap is UNACCEPTABLE...only AM Stereo and FM Stereo, with DAB replaced with shortwave. Actually IBiquity HD Radio IBOC could be made to work seamlessly on FM. If IBiquity was to put the digital stream on a SCA Subcarrier, the FM station could continue to use their analog FM MPX Stereo. An analog FM radio would never hear any IBOC noise or have any problems with QRM from the IBOC carrier. This would make the IBOC signal have nearly the same range as the analog FM MPX Stereo signal. Would IBiquity use this idea? I would be amazed if they did because then the IBOC FM radio station couldn't hash the audio of the Low Power and college radio stations! In fact, the FM station would have to IMPROVE it's analog audio to use IBOC on a subcarrier because the heavy composite clipping used by many CHR and Hi-N-R-G stations would kill the SCA signal. This would reduce the analog splatter. Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From possumhunter@netzero.net Tue Dec 10 18:01:26 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 02:01:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 48253 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 02:01:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 02:01:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.22) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 02:01:25 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 10 Dec 2002 18:01:25 -0800 To: References: <3DF67375.79278D18@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} New Ratings Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 21:01:12 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 11 Dec 2002 02:01:25.0858 (UTC) FILETIME=[36343420:01C2A0B9] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.136.226.251] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Neal Newman wrote: > I am proud to say that in a 2 Month period we went From Not Being on the Arbitron list to last months 0.4% this month WTTM made it to .6% of our Market And who says sound quality doesn't matter on AM radio and 5Khz with IBOC hash is just fine? The first month after WFIS put in the Optimod 9200, Eurodesk board and digital studio, WFIS showed up in the ratings with a .4, this was the fist time WFIS had been in the ratings in over 10 years! The latest book has WFIS at 3.2! Not too shabby for a 1000 Watt Daytimer, eh? It is easy to torture your local Clear Channel station, just get better ratings than they have! LOL Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From possumhunter@netzero.net Tue Dec 10 18:12:16 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 02:12:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 16165 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 02:12:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 02:12:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.191) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 02:12:15 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 10 Dec 2002 18:12:15 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fw: Hd Radio Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 21:12:02 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 11 Dec 2002 02:12:15.0233 (UTC) FILETIME=[B942F710:01C2A0BA] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.136.226.251] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 stodd@sherbtel.net wrote: > I understand KALT has gone dark. Probably could pick that up for a song. All set for AM stereo, too. If it is off of the air, it is silent illegally! I just checked the status of the license, it is supposed to be ON THE AIR! more than likely, you could get that station for the price of the land it is sitting on and perhaps the equipment. Station Search Details Call Sign: KALT Facility Id: 86827 Community of License: ATLANTA, TX Service: AM Fac Type: Status: LICENSED Status Date: 02/07/2001 Frequency: 1610 Channel: Lic Expir: 08/01/2005 Licensee: FAMILY WORSHIP CENTER CHURCH, INC. Address: P.O. BOX 262550 Address 2: City: BATON ROUGE State: LA Zip Code: 70826 Call Sign History View Call Sign History Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From KC4QLP@aol.com Tue Dec 10 18:16:51 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 02:16:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 41190 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 02:16:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 02:16:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m04.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.7) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 02:16:50 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.14c.18a81cab (4380) for ; Tue, 10 Dec 2002 21:16:21 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <14c.18a81cab.2b27f9f5@aol.com> Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 21:16:21 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} IBOC on FM Was: DAB, IBOC & CQUAM [not a high tech law firm!] To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/10/02 8:24:23 PM Eastern Standard Time, possumhunter@netzero.net writes: << Actually IBiquity HD Radio IBOC could be made to work seamlessly on FM. If IBiquity was to put the digital stream on a SCA Subcarrier, the FM station could continue to use their analog FM MPX Stereo. An analog FM radio would never hear any IBOC noise or have any problems with QRM from the IBOC carrier. This would make the IBOC signal have nearly the same range as the analog FM MPX Stereo signal.>> Yeah thats the trouble....the digital stream via a subcarrier would have "nearly" the same range as the analog.I beleive the goal is to have the digital carrier go as far as the present day analog.Having a digital carrier {AM or FM} to have the same coverage as the analog seems to come at the expense of bandwidth....which is directly associated with bit rate and the power level used.Plus the use of a subcarrier for a digital stream,you couldnt have the "added services" or purks if you will that would be found on an IBOC digital system...the bandwidth just isnt there for it on a subcarrier. <> I thought it was the NAB out to kill low power and college radio?..Or did the two "team" up? hehehe. It would be great if FM stations cleaned up their audio...like it would be nice if may AMs did the same thing.But what can you expect in a louder is better mentality broadcast world? Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From possumhunter@netzero.net Tue Dec 10 18:20:01 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 02:20:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 71471 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 02:20:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 02:20:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.206) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 02:20:01 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 10 Dec 2002 18:20:01 -0800 To: Subject: Fw: Kevin, here are today's Net News Headlines Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 21:19:48 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 11 Dec 2002 02:20:01.0209 (UTC) FILETIME=[CF014290:01C2A0BB] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.136.226.251] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 All Access Daily Email Update-Here are the latest headlines from ALLACCESS.COM: >CLEAR CHANNEL ENTERTAINMENT buys NEW JERSEY's METROPOLITAN ENTERTAINMENT GROUP The "Big Fish" Swallowed up another smaller fish! When will it ever end? Possum From KC4QLP@aol.com Tue Dec 10 18:21:18 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 02:21:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 5812 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 02:21:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 02:21:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r08.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.104) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 02:21:18 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.1ad.d6bae1a (4380) for ; Tue, 10 Dec 2002 21:21:15 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1ad.d6bae1a.2b27fb1a@aol.com> Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 21:21:14 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fw: Hd Radio To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/10/02 9:14:24 PM Eastern Standard Time, possumhunter@netzero.net writes: << Station Search Details Call Sign: KALT Facility Id: 86827 Community of License: ATLANTA, TX Service: AM Fac Type: Status: LICENSED Status Date: 02/07/2001 Frequency: 1610 Channel: Lic Expir: 08/01/2005 Licensee: FAMILY WORSHIP CENTER CHURCH, INC. >> Oh Brother!...another one of *-those-* stations?!?...Family Worship Center Chuch eh? ..seems like that bible thumper broadcaster has more FM translators than what you can shake a stick at. This group has a number of CP apps in this area for translators...and I have my doubts that they will ever be granted and or built. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From possumhunter@netzero.net Tue Dec 10 18:28:11 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 02:28:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 11274 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 02:28:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 02:28:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.91) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 02:28:11 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 10 Dec 2002 18:28:11 -0800 To: References: <14c.18a81cab.2b27f9f5@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} IBOC on FM Was: DAB, IBOC & CQUAM [not a high tech law firm!] Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 21:27:58 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 11 Dec 2002 02:28:11.0109 (UTC) FILETIME=[F3021150:01C2A0BC] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.136.226.251] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: >I thought it was the NAB out to kill low power and college radio?..Or did the two "team" up? hehehe. IBiquity is a joint venture of the major broadcast companies such as Clear Channel and NPR, these same companies are the movers and shakers in the NAB. Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From possumhunter@netzero.net Tue Dec 10 18:31:47 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 02:31:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 39998 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 02:31:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 02:31:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.87) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 02:31:47 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 10 Dec 2002 18:31:46 -0800 To: References: <1ad.d6bae1a.2b27fb1a@aol.com> Subject: Preachers On The Radio was: Fw: Hd Radio Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 21:31:34 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 11 Dec 2002 02:31:46.0955 (UTC) FILETIME=[73A98DB0:01C2A0BD] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.136.226.251] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: > Oh Brother!...another one of *-those-* stations?!?...Family Worship Center Chuch eh? ..seems like that bible thumper broadcaster has more FM translators than what you can shake a stick at. Oh, come on Bob, EVERY market needs a few dozen radio stations broadcasting preachers begging for money 24/7! Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From KC4QLP@aol.com Tue Dec 10 19:05:31 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 03:05:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 50793 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 03:05:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 03:05:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d06.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.38) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 03:05:31 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.90.30681efe (4380) for ; Tue, 10 Dec 2002 22:05:21 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <90.30681efe.2b280570@aol.com> Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 22:05:20 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Preachers On The Radio was: Fw: Hd Radio To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/10/02 9:33:34 PM Eastern Standard Time, possumhunter@netzero.net writes: << Oh, come on Bob, EVERY market needs a few dozen radio stations broadcasting preachers begging for money 24/7! >> LOL ....yeah sure they do...hehehe. In my market area... { Norfolk/Va Beach/Newport News and Elizabeth City/Nags Head} ...those two markets together have 9 AM's and 6 FM's that I can easily hear that run religious programming full time. Compared to the total number of stations in the two markets...it maybe a low number,but seems like one is popping up everytime you twist the dial. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From KC4QLP@aol.com Tue Dec 10 19:11:06 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 03:11:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 4024 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 03:11:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 03:11:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d08.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.40) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 03:11:06 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.18.29938cf7 (4380) for ; Tue, 10 Dec 2002 22:10:54 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <18.29938cf7.2b2806be@aol.com> Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 22:10:54 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Preachers On The Radio was: Fw: Hd Radio To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Opps!..like it matters..but add one more FM..for a total of 7 FM thumpers. While were on the topic...I thought it was weird when I was up in NY eariler this year to not hear a single station broadcasting religion full-time.Seems like the south and mid Atlantic is bombarded by this kind of format. << << Oh, come on Bob, EVERY market needs a few dozen radio stations broadcasting preachers begging for money 24/7! >> LOL ....yeah sure they do...hehehe. In my market area... { Norfolk/Va Beach/Newport News and Elizabeth City/Nags Head} ...those two markets together have 9 AM's and 6 FM's that I can easily hear that run religious programming full time. Compared to the total number of stations in the two markets...it maybe a low number,but seems like one is popping up everytime you twist the dial. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From possumhunter@netzero.net Tue Dec 10 19:21:33 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 03:21:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 85587 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 03:21:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 03:21:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.19) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 03:21:32 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 10 Dec 2002 19:21:32 -0800 To: References: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A560797404A21A10@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> Subject: Poor Pitiful Me Was: Hd Radio Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 22:21:19 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 11 Dec 2002 03:21:32.0598 (UTC) FILETIME=[673E8560:01C2A0C4] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.136.226.251] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Charles Penry wrote: > Or you can sit there and become more bitter every day about how you were kicked out of commercial radio, badmouthing on this list those who will not have you. > > It's your choice. Get over it or don't. If you don't get over it, don't expect much sympathy from the rest of the world as it moves on. Just how did the CEO of Clear Channel make it to the top? Did he sit on his a** having "Poor Pitiful Me Parties", or did he get off of his duff and make something of himself and his company? You can bet your last nickel that whiners do NOT make it to the top of the food chain in Radio or any other business. In order to make it in the "Dog-Eat-Dog" commercial radio business, you must be ruthless with a big "Can Do" attitude. In order to thrive in the commercial radio market, just being "good enough" is NOT good enough! You have to be BETTER than anybody else out there, or you will get run-over by the people who are. Do I want the FCC to level the playing field by forcing the manufacturers to put decent AM tuners in their stereos? You betcha! If they don't, I will STILL do my dead level best to make my station number 1. My big gripe about Public Radio is the fact that it is where the radio people who are not good enough to make it in the commercial market end up. Now the money that the government extorts from me in taxes goes to pay for radio programmers and personalities that are not good enough to make it in the "Real World". The FCC should remove all of the FMs that are not part of a broadcast school from the "Educational Channels" from 88.1 to 91.9. That would force all of the wannabes to get good, or get OUT and stop soaking up all of my tax dollars. If you are not good enough to pull ratings numbers, and support yourself with ad revenues, you should not be in the radio business. I will get off of my soap box now. Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Dec 10 19:32:32 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 03:32:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 18408 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 03:32:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 03:32:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 03:32:31 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.173] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Dec 2002 03:32:31 -0000 Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 03:32:28 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Ratings: analog AM up, IBOC down Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2472 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.79.26 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics Wow... four new members in one day! Welcome everybody! Anyway, the latest Aribtron ratings (technically "Arbitrend" ratings since they are only the second half of the non-finalized Fall 2002 Arbitrons) were released today for New York City and its surrounding areas, and the results are interesting when you compare 710 WOR (with their IBOC signal), and the various other analog AM and AM Stereo stations in the area. It can clearly be speculated that some WOR listeners will be turned off enough by the hash, hissing, and reduced audio quality of the IBOC signal that they'll switch from WOR to some other station... most likely 770 WABC since they are another 50 kW NYC talk station right next door on the dial. But can this be proved by the ratings? Well, I'll let the numbers speak for themselves. The first number shown for a station is the Fall 2002 Part 1 rating, which mostly covers the time before WOR started transmitting IBOC, and the second number is the Fall 2002 Part 2 rating, which mostly covers the time *since* WOR started transmitting IBOC. New York City ============= 710 WOR (IBOC).......... 2.4 -> 2.3 .... down 0.1 770 WABC ............... 3.3 -> 3.4 .... up 0.1 (coincidence??) 1010 WINS .............. 3.8 -> 4.2 .... up 0.4 660 WFAN ............... 2.1 -> 2.2 .... up 0.1 1100 WHLI .............. 0.7 -> 0.8 .... up 0.1 1170 WWTR/1250 WMTR..... 0.0 -> 0.3 .... up 0.3 Westchester County, NY ====================== 710 WOR (IBOC).......... 3.3 -> 2.3 .... down 1.0 (!) 770 WABC ............... 3.9 -> 4.3 .... up 0.4 660 WFAN ............... 2.6 -> 2.8 .... up 0.2 1010 WINS .............. 2.3 -> 2.7 .... up 0.4 1190 WLIB .............. 0.6 -> 0.8 .... up 0.2 Middlesex/Somerset/Union Counties, NJ ===================================== 710 WOR (IBOC).......... 3.6 -> 3.2 .... down 0.4 770 WABC ............... 3.8 -> 4.1 .... up 0.3 660 WFAN ............... 2.2 -> 2.6 .... up 0.4 1450 WCTC (AM STEREO)... 1.4 -> 1.6 .... up 0.2 1170 WWTR/1250 WMTR..... 1.3 -> 1.5 .... up 0.2 1680 WTTM (AM STEREO)... 0.4 -> 0.6 .... up 0.2 1190 WLIB............... 0.0 -> 0.3 .... up 0.3 Nassau/Suffolk Counties (Long Island), NY ========================================= 710 WOR (IBOC).......... 2.7 -> 2.9 .... up 0.2 770 WABC ............... 3.7 -> 3.9 .... up 0.2 (okay, both even) 1100 WHLI .............. 3.5 -> 3.7 .... up 0.2 1010 WINS .............. 3.5 -> 3.7 .... up 0.2 1050 WEVD .............. 0.0 -> 0.4 .... up 0.4 From possumhunter@netzero.net Tue Dec 10 19:37:38 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 03:37:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 57059 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 03:37:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 03:37:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.204) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 03:37:37 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 10 Dec 2002 19:37:37 -0800 To: References: <18.29938cf7.2b2806be@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Preachers On The Radio was: Fw: Hd Radio Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 22:37:24 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 11 Dec 2002 03:37:37.0582 (UTC) FILETIME=[A66B64E0:01C2A0C6] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.136.226.251] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: >While were on the topic...I thought it was weird when I was up in NY earlier this year to not hear a single station broadcasting religion full-time. What about WMCA 570? > >Seems like the south and mid Atlantic is bombarded by this kind of format. We are well blessed with 9FMs and 15AMs that are all trying to save us from sin and separate us from our money. Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From KC4QLP@aol.com Tue Dec 10 19:47:03 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 03:47:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 19420 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 03:47:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 03:47:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r02.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.98) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 03:47:02 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.6b.4228416 (4380) for ; Tue, 10 Dec 2002 22:46:56 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <6b.4228416.2b280f2f@aol.com> Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 22:46:55 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Poor Pitiful Me Was: Hd Radio To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/10/02 10:22:44 PM Eastern Standard Time, possumhunter@netzero.net writes: << Just how did the CEO of Clear Channel make it to the top? Did he sit on his a** having "Poor Pitiful Me Parties", or did he get off of his duff and make something of himself and his company? You can bet your last nickel that whiners do NOT make it to the top of the food chain in Radio or any other business. In order to make it in the "Dog-Eat-Dog" commercial radio business, you must be ruthless with a big "Can Do" attitude. In order to thrive in the commercial radio market, just being "good enough" is NOT good enough! You have to be BETTER than anybody else out there, or you will get run-over by the people who are.>> I whole heartly agree! Its a shame to see the whining and crying day in and day out.One thing I've found out over time is that usually...not always, but usually those that do waddle in there own misery, usually want everything handed to them,will be the first ones to call you a racist and try and take away everything that YOU earned. I'd say ship those people off to the moon! If people would get their heads out of their @&& ..they would realize that the only person that can make a change in this world is yourself..and that means getting out there and doing some hard labor. Running your mouth will usually end up having a foot placed in it. << My big gripe about Public Radio is the fact that it is where the radio people who are not good enough to make it in the commercial market end up. Now the money that the government extorts from me in taxes goes to pay for radio programmers and personalities that are not good enough to make it in the "Real World". The FCC should remove all of the FMs that are not part of a broadcast school from the "Educational Channels" from 88.1 to 91.9. That would force all of the wannabes to get good, or get OUT and stop soaking up all of my tax dollars. If you are not good enough to pull ratings numbers, and support yourself with ad revenues, you should not be in the radio business. >> NPR reminds me alot of communist run radio.They tell you what they want you to hear..and pump you up full of crap. I just cant understand why a government "sponsored" group has to ask the public for more money.{hmm...government dollars..underwriting,which is a lame non-comm excuse for a commerical..where is the money going I wonder!} If they were to run their outfits like any other commerical broadcaster,they could get by with what they have given to them by us tax payers via gov funding. We have a local college station here {WRVS 89.9 Elizabeth City State University}..the day they started running NPR news and other shows,the whole format of the station changed from HipHop and R&B to a smooth jazz....just the right format for those listening with crap fulled heads. Popularity of the station on campus went from an all time high to an all time low. Its amazing what control NPR has on their "affiliate" stations. Has anyone heard a station with NPR news/shows run a popular, highly listen to format...or just that elevator stuff that makes you nod off while driving...wiping out mailboxes for miles! lol Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From KC4QLP@aol.com Tue Dec 10 19:57:14 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 03:57:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 49958 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 03:57:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 03:57:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r05.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.101) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 03:57:14 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.102.20c80e8b (4380) for ; Tue, 10 Dec 2002 22:57:03 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <102.20c80e8b.2b28118f@aol.com> Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 22:57:03 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Preachers On The Radio was: Fw: Hd Radio To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/10/02 10:38:25 PM Eastern Standard Time, possumhunter@netzero.net writes: << What about WMCA 570? > >Seems like the south and mid Atlantic is bombarded by this kind of format. We are well blessed with 9FMs and 15AMs that are all trying to save us from sin and separate us from our money. >> I couldnt hear WMCA 570 in central upstate NY. Seems like if I remember correctly, WMCA beams a great part of their signal over into Manhattan from their transmitter site in what looks to be a marsh area just off the Jersey Turpike. {I think that what I was traveling on..wizzing past Newark airport and all..its been a few years since I was in that part of NY.} Well...heaven and God forbid that all of the religious stations disappear ...you'll have all of that money in your pocket and you would have sinned!.....{money being the root of all evil} ...lol Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Dec 10 19:59:37 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 03:59:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 30001 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 03:59:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 03:59:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 03:59:36 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.186] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Dec 2002 03:59:13 -0000 Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 03:59:12 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: The $5 Wonder Radio Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3024 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.79.26 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics Per Chris Cuff's recommendation, I stopped by Wal-Mart and picked up one of those $5.00 "cheapie" Lennox Sound AM/FM transistor radios. At first I didn't see it on the shelf because it's confusingly shaped just like a walkie-talkie... but if you look closer at the packaging, you'll see it's an "AM/FM Sports Radio", model PR-35M. For $5.00, it even includes stereo headphones and an instruction pamphlet! I have to say for the price, the quality of this little radio is amazing... it makes the brand-name portable devices costing 10 times as much look and feel like toys in comparison. It has a surprisingly solid feel, with a tiny but very smooth and precise tuning dial. Also, the included headphones actually sound quite good, far better than the "tin cans" you get with most other portable radios, CD players, and MP3 players. I have to say its FM is pretty lousy... there is very little selectivity, so it's just a battle between which stations can overpower their neighbors on the dial. But, thankfully for us, the AM tuner is fantastic! Sensitivity is average, but it responds VERY well to the help of a Select-A-Tenna, Terk AM Advantage, or other tuned loop antenna. The bandwidth is also pleasingly wide, just like the classic transistor radios of the '60s and '70s.... and it still has a decent amount of selectivity. I listened to the skywave signal of 1030 WBZ from Boston a full 40 minutes *before* sunset, even with a semi-local station on 1040 kHz, just using the built-in antenna. Then as a local daytimer on 1070 kHz signed off at sunset, I heard CBC Radio 1 from Canada loud and clear. Listen with good headphones, or hook it up to the Aux input of a stereo system, and its audio quality on AM will far exceed that of many receivers costing a hundred times as much as this little gem! It is also powered by three AA batteries, instead of the usual two, so that makes it work even better with an AM Stereo decoder. I say there is a reason Lennox Sound designed this radio with a Stereo headphone output, and included Stereo headphones with it, even though it's mono only... because it would make an excellent low-cost AM STEREO/FM MONO radio. I scratch my head at how they can sell it for only $5.00... even the headphones alone would easily cost that much on their own. And I have bought radios costing four or five times as much that were just complete GARBAGE... I mean plastic casing that cracks apart... tuning dials that are 200 kHz off and are almost impossible to use with any precision... reception so bad that it's just all hiss except for a few local stations... squeals, whistles, and images of Shortwave stations filling the AM band at night... etc. But seriously, none of that on this little radio! For what it's worth, in the past I have heard of other Lennox Sound radios having unusually good AM reception and sound quality, even some of their fancier radios with digital tuning. But this $5.00 radio is a great starting point! From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Tue Dec 10 20:18:59 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 04:18:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 84210 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 04:18:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 04:18:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web41009.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.93.8) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 04:18:59 -0000 Message-ID: <20021211041857.44456.qmail@web41009.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.35.104] by web41009.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 10 Dec 2002 20:18:57 PST Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 20:18:57 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: {AMSF} Preachers On The Radio was: Fw: Hd Radio To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: <18.29938cf7.2b2806be@aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio Rhode Island only has one full-time religious station, it's a 5kW AM waaaaaaay up there at 1590. The only other station is another commercial AM at 1220 doing it from 6A-1 or 2P. The rest of the time it's in Spanish. PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE don't tell the religious mega-broadcasters! We want them to think that R.I. is still a smudge on the way to Cape Cod and IT'S FULL OF CORRUPTION (and Catholics, which a lot of these broadcasters DON'T seem to be catering to.) Here's a look at the R.I. radio dial (I have it on good authority that one of these stations may go stereo soon. Not gonna say which one 'cuz if it doesn't then I have egg on mah face!) 550/WDDZ-Pawtucket. Radio Ditzey. 1k/500. 1st stereo station in R.I. back in the '80s as the 2nd WICE. ex-WPAW, WGNG, 2nd WICE, WPNW, W??? (as AM 550 the Buzz), 3rd WICE, 3rd WLKW. 630/WPRO-Providence. N/T/Rush/Bell. 5k DA-N. 790/WSKO-Providence. Sports. Pats. //WSKO-FM/99.7-Wakefield-Peacedale. R.I's 1st station. It's a mono FM sportsblabber. BLECCH! 5k DA-N. Stereo as WLKW. Went mono in 1998. ex-WEAN, WWAZ, 2nd WLKW. 920/WHJJ-Providence. N/T/URI Sports. C.C.. 5k DA-N. 990/WALE-Greenville. Brokered time. MANY F.C.C. Violations here. I know, I used to work for them. Telephone-audio. Apparently one of the towers that are supposed to be lit isn't. That's right: 3 out of 4 towers are lit. Oh, the F.A.A. won't care. 50k/5k. DA-6 (Yes, 6 towers!) ex-WLKW, 2nd WEAN. 1110/WPMZ-East Providence. Spanish. 5k DA-D. Stereo in the '80s and maybe the '90s. Says stereo on their ad sheets, but isn't. ex-WHIM. 1180/WJJF-Hope Valley. Country. 1.8k/1k CH ND. 1220/WRIB-Providence. Spanish, religion. 1k/166. ND. 1230/WXNI-Westerly. NPR. 1k ND. ex-WERI. 1240/WOON-Woonsocket. Full Service. 1k ND. Stereo until 1999. ex-WWON. 1290/WRNI-Providence. NPR. 5k DA-N. CP: 5k/10k DA-N. ex-WICE, WRCP. 1320/WARL-Attleboro, Mass. Urban. 5k DA. 1380/WNRI-Woonsocket. Talk. 2.5k/16. DA? Stereo until 1999. 1450/WLKW-West Warwick. Standards. 1k ND. ex-WWRI, WKRI, 3rd WHIM (2nd to use the calls), WDYZ, WHRC, WWRI again. 1540/WADK-Newport. N/T/Smooth Jazz. 1kW ND-D. 1590/WARV-Warwick. Commercial Religion. 5k DA. There...now that's more than you EVER wanted to know about R.I. A.M. radio! __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From kfornal@cox.net Tue Dec 10 20:35:17 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kfornal@cox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 04:35:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 22503 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 04:35:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 04:35:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO lakemtao01.cox.net) (68.1.17.244) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 04:35:16 -0000 Received: from OMNIBOOK ([68.9.127.164]) by lakemtao01.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20021211043514.EWBY2199.lakemtao01.cox.net@OMNIBOOK> for ; Tue, 10 Dec 2002 23:35:14 -0500 To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} Preachers On The Radio was: Fw: Hd Radio Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 23:35:01 -0500 Message-ID: <001501c2a0ce$ab298f90$0301a8c0@OMNIBOOK> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2616 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 In-Reply-To: <20021211041857.44456.qmail@web41009.mail.yahoo.com> Importance: Normal From: "Keith Fornal" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=128541479 X-Yahoo-Profile: theradboy Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit 1290/WRNI-Providence is actually now 10kw-U, DA-2. Since their transmitter site is just a little over a mile from my house, I get to hear them on my phone and all over the AM dial. I really would like to get an Alfredo Lite but I fear it would be overrun by WRNI. Keith Fornal Treasurer Dutch Island Lighthouse Society www.dutchislandlighthouse.org -----Original Message----- From: JNR [mailto:a1asurfradio@yahoo.com] Sent: Tuesday, December 10, 2002 11:19 PM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Preachers On The Radio was: Fw: Hd Radio Rhode Island only has one full-time religious station, it's a 5kW AM waaaaaaay up there at 1590. The only other station is another commercial AM at 1220 doing it from 6A-1 or 2P. The rest of the time it's in Spanish. PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE don't tell the religious mega-broadcasters! We want them to think that R.I. is still a smudge on the way to Cape Cod and IT'S FULL OF CORRUPTION (and Catholics, which a lot of these broadcasters DON'T seem to be catering to.) Here's a look at the R.I. radio dial (I have it on good authority that one of these stations may go stereo soon. Not gonna say which one 'cuz if it doesn't then I have egg on mah face!) 550/WDDZ-Pawtucket. Radio Ditzey. 1k/500. 1st stereo station in R.I. back in the '80s as the 2nd WICE. ex-WPAW, WGNG, 2nd WICE, WPNW, W??? (as AM 550 the Buzz), 3rd WICE, 3rd WLKW. 630/WPRO-Providence. N/T/Rush/Bell. 5k DA-N. 790/WSKO-Providence. Sports. Pats. //WSKO-FM/99.7-Wakefield-Peacedale. R.I's 1st station. It's a mono FM sportsblabber. BLECCH! 5k DA-N. Stereo as WLKW. Went mono in 1998. ex-WEAN, WWAZ, 2nd WLKW. 920/WHJJ-Providence. N/T/URI Sports. C.C.. 5k DA-N. 990/WALE-Greenville. Brokered time. MANY F.C.C. Violations here. I know, I used to work for them. Telephone-audio. Apparently one of the towers that are supposed to be lit isn't. That's right: 3 out of 4 towers are lit. Oh, the F.A.A. won't care. 50k/5k. DA-6 (Yes, 6 towers!) ex-WLKW, 2nd WEAN. 1110/WPMZ-East Providence. Spanish. 5k DA-D. Stereo in the '80s and maybe the '90s. Says stereo on their ad sheets, but isn't. ex-WHIM. 1180/WJJF-Hope Valley. Country. 1.8k/1k CH ND. 1220/WRIB-Providence. Spanish, religion. 1k/166. ND. 1230/WXNI-Westerly. NPR. 1k ND. ex-WERI. 1240/WOON-Woonsocket. Full Service. 1k ND. Stereo until 1999. ex-WWON. 1290/WRNI-Providence. NPR. 5k DA-N. CP: 5k/10k DA-N. ex-WICE, WRCP. 1320/WARL-Attleboro, Mass. Urban. 5k DA. 1380/WNRI-Woonsocket. Talk. 2.5k/16. DA? Stereo until 1999. 1450/WLKW-West Warwick. Standards. 1k ND. ex-WWRI, WKRI, 3rd WHIM (2nd to use the calls), WDYZ, WHRC, WWRI again. 1540/WADK-Newport. N/T/Smooth Jazz. 1kW ND-D. 1590/WARV-Warwick. Commercial Religion. 5k DA. There...now that's more than you EVER wanted to know about R.I. A.M. radio! __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From KC4QLP@aol.com Tue Dec 10 20:53:10 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 04:53:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 8874 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 04:53:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 04:53:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d05.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 04:53:09 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.b6.1642fa74 (4380) for ; Tue, 10 Dec 2002 23:53:05 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 23:53:05 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Preachers On The Radio was: Fw: Hd Radio To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/10/02 11:19:55 PM Eastern Standard Time, a1asurfradio@yahoo.com writes: << 990/WALE-Greenville. Brokered time. MANY F.C.C. Violations here. I know, I used to work for them. Telephone-audio. Apparently one of the towers that are supposed to be lit isn't. That's right: 3 out of 4 towers are lit. Oh, the F.A.A. won't care. 50k/5k. DA-6 (Yes, 6 towers!) ex-WLKW, 2nd WEAN. >> First check and see if the station has a modification on their license to have only certain towers lit.You'll find this to be the case with some multi towered arrays. Other than that......... Dunno about the F.A.A. not caring about unlit towers.Any aviators register any complaints about an unlit tower,or nearby residents file a complaint would certainly raise an eyebrow at the FAA . The result of that...many logged complaints over a short period of time should have resulted in atleast a letter being sent to the offending station, from the FCC.The letter would basically state..get it fixed or else.Repeated complaints in short order from this would then result in a surprise FCC inspection. Having a nonlit tower..especially in a high air traffic area,is highly irresponsible..jeopardizing not only lives in the sky but also for those on the ground close to the tower. About 5 years ago a new telco tower went up about 20 miles east of me...and the nit wit company building the tower did not light the tower after they got up to the 200' level.The result.....well the tower just happens to be in the flight path for the area Nighting Gale helicopter ambulance,the helicopter hit the tower one evening,killing everyone on board.{the helicopter was in route to the hospital from the Outer Banks NC} Needless to say,the FCC/FAA came down hard on the tower company and several law suits come out of this as well. Anyone so irresponsible with not keeping the lights functioning on towers,should just hand over the license to someone that gives 2 cents about the regulations and or go out of business.There is just no excuse for not lighting a tower{s} when its suppose to be lit.NONE Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From n0uiheric@aol.com Tue Dec 10 21:43:33 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 05:43:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 8556 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 05:43:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 05:43:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m02.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.5) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 05:43:33 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-m02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.146.4c6e793 (16930) for ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 00:43:29 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <146.4c6e793.2b282a81@aol.com> Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 00:43:29 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fw: Hd Radio To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih Some 12 years ago, I got together with a group of WINNERS. They were like me, willing to try new personalities, new programming ideas, and new analog technologies. We put jobs first. We didn't believe in the system of patronage and cronyism in radio employment that has contaminated the radio business. We didn't believe in the illegal form of radio called "shock radio". We felt that everyone in corporate radio were the LOSERS, refusing to try homegrown talent that understood the market better than anyone else, and refusing to clean up the medium for our youth. And we were very pro-AM Stereo. If there's one group of people that I'm still angry at, it's the LOSERS who run corporate radio today. I tried to move on with my career after the last commercial radio station I worked at was sold four years ago. Unfortunately, the corporate radio stations wouldn't have me for a fair price (which, for me, was a liveable wage). I was shocked and dismayed to find out that I was among over 12,000 people that have been cut loose since the illegal and unconstitutional Telecom Act went into effect in 1996. As for moving, I am no longer able to do so for two primary reasons. First, the majority of my family lives in the St. Louis area. I probably would want to buy a station within reasonable commuting distance (60 miles). Second, I tried relocating once before, and it didn't work. I couldn't even get a board operator's job in a small town close to Atlanta! Instead of working in commercial radio, I have had to switch to public radio. This choice was not mine; it was forced on me by the negative attitudes that corporate owners have toward homegrown talent and hard work. Working hard in the radio business in practically every non-management capacity for a decade or more will not necessarily get you the break you need. That's what I learned, the hard way. I will never work in commercial radio again, except as an owner. The attitude of "it's not WHAT you know, it's WHO you know" is not only a bad system, it's also very UN-AMERICAN. Such a system keeps out more qualified people; I've been passed over for younger, less-qualified people for various jobs. The correct, pro-American system is "it's not WHO you know, it's WHAT you know". If there are any REAL LOSERS, it's the corporate owners. They should stop bullying the independent station owners, the pro-AM Stereo folks, and the struggling talents in all associated fields. Give them a chance! 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CNns still use ha Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Tue Dec 10 22:24:00 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 06:24:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 63127 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 06:23:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 06:23:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web41004.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.93.3) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 06:23:57 -0000 Message-ID: <20021211062357.82675.qmail@web41004.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.35.104] by web41004.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 10 Dec 2002 22:23:57 PST Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 22:23:57 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: {AMSF} Preachers On The Radio was: Fw: Hd Radio To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio I haven't seen the tower personally, but having worked for the station for 5 months, they do NOT care about ANY regulations. Right now it's 01:21. They "sign-off" at Midnight. However, their carrier is still on. Isn't that illegal too? I think they are supposed to light 4 out of the 6 towers. We never took those readings. Hell, for two months we didn't even have control over the transmitter. Keith, what do you hear on 990 tonight? WLGZ knows about this. I need to get a letter off to the F.C.C.. They already fined the Phoenix sister station $4k for not switching power, something WALE has also done. They suck. Thanks for letting me rant! Jay P.S.: I'm in agreement with you about the regs. Either follow them or get the hell of the dial! __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Tue Dec 10 22:25:30 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 06:25:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 15791 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 06:25:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 06:25:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web41013.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.93.12) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 06:25:29 -0000 Message-ID: <20021211062529.63267.qmail@web41013.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.35.104] by web41013.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 10 Dec 2002 22:25:29 PST Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 22:25:29 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fw: Hd Radio To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: <146.4c6e793.2b282a81@aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio Eric... Two words... RIGHT ON! 73, Jay,N1WVQ __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Tue Dec 10 22:33:16 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 06:33:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 309 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 06:33:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 06:33:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web41004.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.93.3) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 06:33:13 -0000 Message-ID: <20021211063313.84085.qmail@web41004.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.35.104] by web41004.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 10 Dec 2002 22:33:13 PST Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2002 22:33:13 -0800 (PST) Subject: By the way To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: <20021211062529.63267.qmail@web41013.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio I didn't bother to look at a map, but KOCR/1310-Joplin, Mo. and WBBA/1580-Pittsfield, Il. are both silent. Apparently, there's a WBBA-FM/97.5 in Pittsfield too. Didn't look to see if they were on. KOCR is 5kW-Day, 1kW-Night. WBBA is 250W-Day, 12W-Night. I looked on www.100000watts.com by the way. 73, Jay,N1WVQ __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From possumhunter@netzero.net Tue Dec 10 22:35:46 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 06:35:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 77573 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 06:35:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 06:35:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.193) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 06:35:45 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 10 Dec 2002 22:35:45 -0800 To: References: <6b.4228416.2b280f2f@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Poor Pitiful Me Was: Hd Radio Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 01:35:31 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 11 Dec 2002 06:35:45.0171 (UTC) FILETIME=[88B80E30:01C2A0DF] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.147.204.164] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: > If people would get their heads out of their @&& ..they would realize that the only person that can make a change in this world is yourself..and that means getting out there and doing some hard labor. Right On! Nobody is going to give you a break or let you start on the top. If you want success, you have to earn it. Do your time in a small market station and learn the ropes. Having to go out and sell ads to support your station is a whole different animal than having the government to hand you a check for just squeaking by every week. > > We have a local college station here {WRVS 89.9 Elizabeth City State University}..the day they started running NPR news and other shows,the whole format of the station changed from HipHop and R&B to a smooth jazz....just the right format for those listening with crap fulled heads. Port Royal Island, South Carolina has a GREAT Smooth Jazz station on 99.7FM. The station is always lively and interesting and the wonderful audio quality is addictive to listen to. They have the Arbitron numbers in both Charleston and Savannah to show how great of a radio station 99.7 WJZX FM is. The reason this Smooth jazz station sounds so good is the fact that they have to keep the ratings high and sell ads in order to survive! Then, WJZX gets to pay all kinds of God-Awful taxes to help support the public jazz station across town that is run by people who are not good enough to make it on a commercial station. Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From n0uiheric@aol.com Tue Dec 10 22:48:21 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 06:48:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 95497 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 06:48:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 06:48:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r06.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.102) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 06:48:20 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-r06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.29.3323b9c1 (4246) for ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 01:48:14 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <29.3323b9c1.2b2839ae@aol.com> Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 01:48:14 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Poor Pitiful Me Was: Hd Radio To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih Hey, I got out there and worked my tail off, although it was at the smaller "mom-and-pop" stations that were in the market in the late 1990s. I haven't been actively searching for commercial radio work since the spring of 2001. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Tue Dec 10 22:48:32 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 06:48:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 41096 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 06:48:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 06:48:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m05.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.8) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 06:48:32 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-m05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.29.3323b9c2 (4246) for ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 01:48:29 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <29.3323b9c2.2b2839bd@aol.com> Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 01:48:29 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Preachers On The Radio was: Fw: Hd Radio To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih St. Louis is a little different; we only have two FM stations running Christian programming (WIBI 91.1 and KHCR 97.7, soon to be on 99.5, both Contemporary Christian). On AM, five stations serve primarily fundamentalist Christian audiences (AM Stereo supporter Crawford owns one of them, KJSL 630). Three serve primarily African-American audiences (Crawford owns one, KSTL 690, and Clear Channel owns KATZ 1600). One serves a Lutheran (Missouri Synod) audience, KFUO 850, while WRYT 1080 serves the area's 500,000 Catholics. When I lived in Atlanta (1988-92), there were at least 12 Christian stations. Of those, only two were FM (WWEV 91.5 and WVFJ 93.3). Now, three are FM (the aforementioned WWEV and WVFJ, plus WFSH 104.7). On AM, Christian programming in Atlanta is available on WAEC 860, WAFS 920, WNIV 970/WLTA 1400, WGUN 1010, WGKA 1190 (WFSH's sister station) and WDPC 1500/WDCY 1520; all serve the fundamentalist Christian majority in the market. African-American audiences are served by WTJH 1260, WAOK 1380 (Infinity owns that one) and WYZE 1480. While Atlanta has the largest Catholic diocese in the Southeast outside of Florida, no station serves the area's Catholics. Two of Atlanta's former Christian stations are now all-Spanish; WFTD 1080 (the station I worked for in the market, which I tried to convince management to convert to AM Stereo while I was there; it now simulcasts WPLO 610) and WAZX 1550 (ex-Stereo station WYNX). I believe that corporate entities (like Clear Channel and Infinity) should not be owning Christian radio stations; it's contrary to Christian teaching. Christian radio stations should only be owned by churches, not-for-profit religious organizations or educational institutions specializing in Christian-centered education. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Tue Dec 10 22:48:33 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 06:48:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 41104 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 06:48:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 06:48:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m04.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.7) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 06:48:32 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-m04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.104.21a96c28 (4246) for ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 01:48:27 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <104.21a96c28.2b2839bb@aol.com> Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 01:48:27 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Poor Pitiful Me Was: Hd Radio To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih Lowry Mays SAT ON HIS BUTT. That's how he illegally got control of Clear Channel. He didn't work himself half to death, like I did. He had cronies who were willing to give him the money to run the radio business into the ground, taking away hard-earned jobs from the radio workers, and using illegal voicetracking. And another thing, more people are listening to public radio now than ever before. Public radio has seen it's audience grow by more than 200%, while commercial radio audiences are down 27% from 1989. The public radio talent are MUCH BETTER than Howard Stern and all the other corporate thugs because they PLAY BY THE RULES. I would much rather play the radio game (right down to what I say on the air) by the rules and regulations of the FCC, not the policies of some corporation who don't know the first thing about using radio as an instrument of public service. Excessive greed in radio has to stop, before more careers are ruined. Public radio actually serves the public interest of not only the communities they serve, but of the nation. Commercial radio does not serve the public interest anymore. I am not whining here; I'm merely pointing out that commercial radio has become so dishonest and so artificial, that public radio is the ONLY REAL RADIO left, other than religious radio. And don't go telling me that public radio is "Communist"; they respect the First Amendment without violating the rules and regulations of the FCC. Public radio is TRULY AMERICAN, and RESPECTS FREE SPEECH RIGHTS. Corporate radio, in my honest opinion, is closer to Communism than public radio EVER WAS. Corporate radio DOES NOT RESPECT FREE SPEECH RIGHTS, and really does not serve the public interest. Radio is desperately in need of a level playing field, which Deregulation has needlessly eliminated. I think public radio is worth supporting; it's the only source left of programming with MAJOR SUBSTANCE, as in actually informing the public. What commercial radio has is ABSOLUTELY NO SUBSTANCE. Just programming for high-school dropouts. Ratings should not set ad rates, but rather community need. If the community needs a radio advertising alternative for small business, then you should provide that service. Anyway, ad rates are artificially high as it is, and so are radio salaries (especially the big-name talent). In my business plan, controlling costs would go as far as to control the salaries of on-air talent, not cut them loose in favor of illegal voicetracking. I would have had public service programming that wasn't available anywhere else. And I would have gone to the college and university radio stations within the St. Louis market to get the air talent, not outside the market. It's high time some new ideas come into radio, and that includes trying a lineup of 100% homegrown talent. Throw out the ratings book, a desire for excessive profits, and negative attitudes, and give new people a fair chance. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Tue Dec 10 22:48:33 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 06:48:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 31643 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 06:48:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 06:48:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m06.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.161) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 06:48:32 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-m06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.34.31a736c7 (4246) for ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 01:48:30 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <34.31a736c7.2b2839be@aol.com> Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 01:48:30 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} IBOC on FM Was: DAB, IBOC & CQUAM [not a high tech law firm!] To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih IBOC will NOT WORK on FM. It will make our radios obsolete; we would have to buy new radios. I think the U.S. should have given the European-developed DRM system (Digital Radio Mondiale) system a chance on AM instead of using IBOCrap. The system is the only one approved for use on AM in the rest of the world (not to mention LW and SW). FM was working perfectly in analog form; it wasn't broke. AM wasn't broke either. IBOCrap will not fix it; it'll make things worse. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Tue Dec 10 22:48:37 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 06:48:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 53982 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 06:48:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 06:48:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m08.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.163) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 06:48:37 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-m08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.75.43e530b (4246) for ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 01:48:33 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <75.43e530b.2b2839c0@aol.com> Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 01:48:32 EST Subject: OT: What Needs to Change To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih And if you want to hear more, then take a quote from the letters I've written to my elected officials: "Discrimination continues to run rampant in commercial radio; for example, homegrown talent, former public, college and small "mom-and-pop" station air talent have not been given the opportunities they have worked hard for years to earn. Patronage, cronyism and nepotism ('it's not WHAT you know, it's WHO you know') is a policy still largely in use in the commercial media; I see this policy as a dated policy that has kept many qualified people (myself included) from holding down well-paid positions in the commercial media. This has created an industry that has way too few 'haves' and far too many 'have nots', a totally un-American concept. I don't think Howard Stern should be paid $20 million per year; regardless of ratings, I don't think he's worth even one-tenth as much. I strongly believe that discrimination on the basis of local origin, especially in commercial broadcast employment, along with the use of patronage, cronyism and nepotism, should be permanently banned in the United States. In addition, there really should be a cap on the salaries of on-air personalities, so that those in sales and in less desirable time slots (such as overnights) can have a fair chance to make an honest living in the radio business." You think that's bad? Listen to this! "Workers with disabilities have been hurt most by the deregulation of the commercial media (especially radio). Many commercial radio stations I've visited between 1990 and 2001 did not have their studios and offices in compliance with the guidelines outlined in the Americans with Disabilities Act of 1990. Many stations are still not accessible for those confined to wheelchairs; others will not allow for workers with even minor disabilities (such as learning disabilities) to have access to commercial broadcast employment, regardless of whether that employment is in an on-air position or a support position (such as a computer technician). Currently, the unemployment rate among workers with disabilities in the general population is an artificially high 70%. The commercial media, through it's employment practices, have shut out more qualified workers through their negative attitudes toward workers with disabilities. Commercial radio station owners (especially those owned by major corporations) don't realize that they can get a tax break for hiring a person with a disability, and that the government is willing to underwrite 50% of the cost of adapting the station's studios and offices to comply with ADA guidelines. Making these reasonable accomodations would improve a station's community image; not doing so would make the station look bad in the eyes of the community at large." To add to the above remark: even admitting you have a disability might get you canned in any business (not just radio). On the subject of non-commercial radio experience: "One thing that continues to irk me is the loose policies concerning the counting of non-commercial radio experience as actual work experience. There should only be one policy for all radio stations; that of requiring all radio stations to count experience with non-commercial educational radio stations as actual work experience. Since a number of stations still won't count non-commercial radio experience as actual work experience (after all, working at a non-commercial radio station IS actual work experience), I have not had as successful of a career as I would like. There are many more like me who have struggled terribly to make an honest living in the radio business; many are more talented than those commercial radio continues to put on the air (especially those who consistently break FCC rules by presenting programming that is deemed to be indecent, such as these 'shock jocks')." This isn't whining. This is merely pointing out that this needs to change, and change NOW. On interpreting the FCC rules, here's my take: "There really should only be one interpretation of FCC rules: a strict, absolute and literal interpretation of FCC rules. If the FCC interpreted the rules like a Southern Baptist interprets his/her Bible, then we wouldn't have personalities like Howard Stern, the Greaseman, Bubba 'The Love Sponge' and Opie and Anthony polluting our airwaves with filth. Under a strict, absolute and literal interpretation of FCC rules, radio would be much, much better; the First Amendment wouldn't be perverted and abused as it is now. Radio would be listenable if the FCC's rules were interpreted literally." And on the threat of further deregulation: "Further deregulation of commercial radio is a recipe for economic disaster. Many more lives will be shattered because of lost jobs. Corporate dishonesty continues to run rampant; I no longer believe anything Clear Channel Communications says, for example. Further deregulation means lower salaries for the worker, higher advertising costs, higher unemployment, continuation of policies that violate federal anti-trust and anti-discrimination laws, and could open the doors to a flood of lawsuits. Clear Channel has been flooded with most of these lawsuits since Telecom was passed, ranging from breach of contract to anti-trust violations. Personally, I have also had a bad experience with Clear Channel: they wouldn't let me apply for an on-air job at KLOU (103.3 FM) St. Louis, MO in the summer of 2000." And to sum it up: "The media desperately is in need of positive change. Further deregulation of the commercial media is a change for the negative." And that's the truth. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Tue Dec 10 22:48:37 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 06:48:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 42178 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 06:48:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 06:48:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m09.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.164) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 06:48:37 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-m09.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.6.44053fb (4246) for ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 01:48:34 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <6.44053fb.2b2839c2@aol.com> Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 01:48:34 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} IBOC on FM Was: DAB, IBOC & CQUAM [not a high tech law firm!] To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih BTW, NPR is not a major company. Actually, it's Clear Channel, Disney/ABC and Infinity that teamed up. I didn't hear about any NPR involvement in IBiquity. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Tue Dec 10 22:48:38 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 06:48:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 98590 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 06:48:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 06:48:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m09.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.164) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 06:48:37 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-m09.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.1ad.d6e18b0 (4246) for ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 01:48:34 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1ad.d6e18b0.2b2839c1@aol.com> Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 01:48:33 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Poor Pitiful Me Was: Hd Radio To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih And another thing. The station I work for doesn't have much control from NPR; most of the programming is live and local. On a daily basis, only selected NPR voice-overs are used in the newscasts, and only two NPR programs are aired weekly ("Piano Jazz" and "Jazz Profiles"). PRI provides the station with "Echoes" (the only break from 24 hours of mainstream Jazz), "Riverwalk Jazz" (from the Riverwalk on the Landing in San Antonio), while WBEZ provides the station with "Jazz from Lincoln Center" and the program that we use as filler on overnights, "Jazz with Bob Parlocha". The control at my station comes from the Board of Trustees of the university that owns the station, not from NPR. And it's the only non-union NPR member station in the St. Louis market; KWMU 90.7 is affiliated with AFTRA. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Tue Dec 10 22:48:41 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 06:48:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 98631 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 06:48:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 06:48:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d02.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.34) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 06:48:40 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-d02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.162.1854a13d (4246) for ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 01:48:35 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <162.1854a13d.2b2839c3@aol.com> Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 01:48:35 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Poor Pitiful Me Was: Hd Radio To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih I seriously question the morality of "being ruthless". I strongly believe that anyone who is "ruthless" in any business is not respecting the values their faith (regardless of whether it's Christianity, Judaism, Islam or whatever) has taught them. Ruthlessness is a negative attitude, and is very dishonest. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From possumhunter@netzero.net Tue Dec 10 23:05:12 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 07:05:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 81645 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 07:05:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 07:05:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.92) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 07:05:12 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 10 Dec 2002 23:05:11 -0800 To: References: <20021211063313.84085.qmail@web41004.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} By the way Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 02:04:58 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 11 Dec 2002 07:05:11.0987 (UTC) FILETIME=[A5D2C830:01C2A0E3] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.147.204.164] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 JNR wrote: WBBA/1580-Pittsfield, Il. are both silent. WBBA is 250W-Day, 12W-Night. You could probably buy that station for the price of the real estate it is sitting on. Assuming all of the equipment is junk and is useless (99 times out of a hundred this is the case), You can buy a BE AM1A C-QUAM AM Transmitter for 12 grand, The Audio processing will cost you 3 grand, Eurodesk 24 channel board for 600 and 2 windows based computers with good sized hard drives and Cd burners for $500 bucks a copy at Wal Mart. Get a decent used EAS monitor for a couple hundred bucks. With 17 Grand in all new equipment, You can put automation software on one computer and hook it into the board. On the other computer, put Cool Edit Pro, Wave Cart, and your accounting software. Hook this computer to the board as well. Rip a bunch of CDs of your chosen music format into the hard drive of the automation computer. Now you can do the morning show live assist, then voice track the rest of the day. After you finish your air shift, go out and sell ads, then at night do your billing and paperwork. You can do your production work on the Cool Edit computer by using one of the AUX busses on the board while the automation continues to feed the main mix buss of the board. Use a timer to switch the transmitter between low and high power. You can have a great sounding station on the air 24/7 with no labor costs, a very low power bill, and that small of a station will have low ASCAP/BMI fees and taxes. It would be hard NOT to stay in the black ink with such a set-up if you WORK HARD. Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From possumhunter@netzero.net Tue Dec 10 23:32:36 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 07:32:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 55109 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 07:32:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 07:32:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.123) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 07:32:35 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 10 Dec 2002 23:32:35 -0800 To: References: <104.21a96c28.2b2839bb@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Poor Pitiful Me Was: Hd Radio Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 02:32:21 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 11 Dec 2002 07:32:35.0443 (UTC) FILETIME=[79664430:01C2A0E7] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.147.204.164] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 n0uiheric@aol.com wrote: >He had cronies who were willing to give him the money to run the radio business into the ground, taking away hard-earned jobs from the radio workers, and using illegal voicetracking. Please tell me where in the FCC Rules and Regulations where it is illegal to voicetrack a radio station. > >don't go telling me that public radio is "Communist"; they respect the First Amendment without violating the rules and regulations of the FCC. Public radio is TRULY AMERICAN, Are you saying that it is "American" to force companies and individuals to pay excessive taxes to support public radio stations they may or may not listen to? > > Ratings should not set ad rates, but rather community need. If the community needs a radio advertising alternative for small business, then you should provide that service. It is only fair that ad rates be based on the ratings of a radio station. A radio station with twice the listeners as the competition should have higher rates. It is only right and fair get paid more for having a radio station that is good enough to attract more listeners. If you don't like Clear Channel in your market, build a better radio station that will take ratings and ad revenues away from them. When their station falls off of the Arbitron ratings, buy them out for a song and turn that station around and beat Barnstable, Entercom, Cox, and Infinity out of your market. It shouldn't be too hard to lure listeners away from the canned formats that the corporate stations are running. While you are at it, you can buy another daytimer AM or two as a training ground for your bigger stations. Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From kevtronics@yahoo.com Wed Dec 11 00:17:53 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 08:17:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 96796 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 08:17:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 08:17:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 08:17:52 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.252] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Dec 2002 08:17:52 -0000 Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 08:17:51 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Lennox Sound audio samples Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 855 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.79.26 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics I must say I've have more fun DXing tonight with my $5.00 Lennox Sound radio than I've had in a long, long time... it's not AM Stereo, but the reception and sound quality are both fantastic, especially for the price. Here's an MP3 recording of French Canadian station 860 CJBC from Toronto, as received here in NJ on it... this is the audio directly from its headphone jack, with no equalization or anything else applied: http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/len-cjbc.mp3 And here's an example of some of the decent DX I got on it, including clips of 670 WSCR (Chicago), 760 WJR (Detroit), 800 CKLW (Windsor, ON), 840 WHAS (Louisville, KY), 890 WLS (Chicago), and 1000 WMVP (Chicago)... and this was just using the built-in antenna -- nothing else! http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/len-dx.mp3 All I can say is, not bad for a $5 radio! From dav259@csiro.au Wed Dec 11 00:29:59 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 08:29:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 31182 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 08:29:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 08:29:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 08:29:58 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gBB8TvP06579 for ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 19:29:57 +1100 (EST) Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 19:29:57 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Poor Pitiful Me Was: Hd Radio In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public On Wed, 11 Dec 2002, Possum Hunter wrote: > Are you saying that it is "American" to force companies and individuals to > pay excessive taxes to support public radio stations they may or may not > listen to? Hey Possum - Eric mightn't be saying this but I am! America spends heaps of taxpayers money on space research and military facilities and arms - in fact as much on the military as the next seven countries combined. The taxpayers could equally ask why? Another approach like getting on with rather than vilifying might be cheaper and more productive. Anyone can start a newspaper - but with broadcasting we're dealing with a finite public spectrum. I'd like to think that besides spending some taxpayers money on public roads, public hospitals, and other public infrastructure America could spend some on public broadcasting. And bugger the stupid ratings. You don't hear anyone in Canada, the UK, NZ, or Oz complaining about the government wasting taxpayers money on public broadcasting. Here the complaints are generally that the government is NOT doing us a service in continually cutting our ABC's budget. Our ABC's news is the only respected (broadcasting) news service in the country - though not the most popular. But at really bad times the ABC's ratings go up incredibly. It is not good for society (or the world for that matter) if the financially stongest always wins. Long live PUBLIC RADIO! Ian Melbourne From ccuff@in4web.com Wed Dec 11 00:41:52 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 08:41:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 35288 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 08:41:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 08:41:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 08:41:51 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.24]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 03:36:39 -0500 Message-ID: <009d01c2a0ef$f2e7ca60$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} The $5 Wonder Radio Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 03:33:14 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 Hee hee- This is already in the makings- I made one "AM Stereo / FM mono" radio, the other obvious problems were adding a stereo amp IC, dula vol control, etc, but it CAN be done- and cheap. cc ----- Original Message ----- From: > It is also powered by three AA batteries, instead of the usual two, > so that makes it work even better with an AM Stereo decoder. I say > there is a reason Lennox Sound designed this radio with a Stereo > headphone output, and included Stereo headphones with it, even though > it's mono only... because it would make an excellent low-cost > AM STEREO/FM MONO radio. > From dav259@csiro.au Wed Dec 11 00:55:03 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 08:55:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 62778 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 08:55:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 08:55:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 08:55:02 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gBB8t1P07887 for ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 19:55:01 +1100 (EST) Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 19:55:01 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Subject: Re: {AMSF} OT: What Needs to Change In-Reply-To: <75.43e530b.2b2839c0@aol.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public On Wed, 11 Dec 2002 n0uiheric@aol.com wrote: > "The media desperately is in need of positive change. Further deregulation of > the commercial media is a change for the negative." Eric I don't agree with all you say - but will stand behind you in having the right to say it. It's about time the FCC started acting like a "friendly judge" - caring about people outcomes rather than dollar outcomes. It's probably the reason it was set up for in the first place ... Ian From n0uiheric@aol.com Wed Dec 11 01:00:42 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 09:00:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 14199 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 09:00:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 09:00:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r06.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.102) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 09:00:41 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-r06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.179.1299d742 (4246) for ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 04:00:34 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <179.1299d742.2b2858b2@aol.com> Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 04:00:34 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Poor Pitiful Me Was: Hd Radio To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih It is clearly stated in FCC Rule 73.1208, Section A. It requires all prerecorded programs to be announced as such. In other words, voicetracked programs MUST be announced as being prerecorded. Failure to do so is illegal. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From florida_amstereo@hotmail.com Wed Dec 11 03:14:14 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: florida_amstereo@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 11:14:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 26593 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 11:14:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 11:14:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.37.50) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 11:14:13 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 03:13:29 -0800 Received: from 209.240.198.61 by pv2fd.pav2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 11:13:28 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Poor Pitiful //NPR Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 11:13:28 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 11 Dec 2002 11:13:29.0643 (UTC) FILETIME=[5584AFB0:01C2A106] From: "Donn Tillman" X-Originating-IP: [209.240.198.61] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83914824 >My big gripe about Public Radio is the >fact that it is where the radio >people who are not good enough to make it in the commercial market end up. Now the money that the government extorts from me in taxes goes to pay for radio programmers and personalities that are not good enough to make it in the "Real World". ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ I can't speak in generalities for NPR nationwide, but here in the St Pete/Tampa market, WUSF (University of South Florida) the people are the air on not wannabees; some have retired or been let go from ClearChannel, another - Roger Shulman - has two jobs, one with ClearChannel and one with WUSF. Another was a top rated morning man at 102.5 fm, but when Cox first bought the station, they totally automated it. (no time checks, no news, no traffic; just music w/o announcers) and this top rated morning personality is now a morning man on WUSF. As far as public funding, WUSF receives 7% from the federal gov't, the rest comes from sponsorships and the state of Florida, with approximately 51% coming from listener donations. My tax dollars support a lot of turkeys (i.e. gov't subsidized loans and bailouts) that I don't agree with or use, but I still pay my taxes and don't complain. not too much anyway! :) donn taxpayer in st petersburg _________________________________________________________________ The new MSN 8: advanced junk mail protection and 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Wed Dec 11 05:28:10 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 13:28:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 73914 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 13:28:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 13:28:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web41009.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.93.8) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 13:28:06 -0000 Message-ID: <20021211132806.39178.qmail@web41009.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.35.104] by web41009.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 05:28:06 PST Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 05:28:06 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: {AMSF} By the way To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio Plus, they would probably love to get rid of the AM and just keep the FM. If I ever get enough money (hopefully I won't need a lot!), there's a station in Northern New Hampshire like that that I've been thinking about for the last 6 years. It's so remote, only the town's AM is audible, and on occasion, 550 out of Vermont and 560 out of Maine which comes in staticky as hell. The other stations include four commercial F.M.s and now an N.H.P.R. affiliate in the commercial part of the band. The F.M.s are A.A.A., Easy Listening for a town in Maine, Country and Hot A.C.. So, as you can see there are a lot of holes to be filled up there. Now, nobody take my idea! You can come up & see it if I ever get the cash to buy it. However, being 23 and working for $10/hr., it'll be awhile! 73, Jay,N1WVQ __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Dec 11 05:58:03 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 13:58:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 18363 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 13:58:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 13:58:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 13:58:01 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.166] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Dec 2002 13:57:50 -0000 Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 13:57:50 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} New Ratings Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 430 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amstereodude " X-Originating-IP: 65.121.7.116 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Possum Hunter" wrote: > The first month after WFIS put in the Optimod 9200, > Eurodesk board and digital studio, WFIS showed up in the ratings with a .4, > this was the fist time WFIS had been in the ratings in over 10 years! Do you have a stereo-capable unit to replace the 9200? I seem to remember you saying your manager wanted to make the station stereo. ST From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Dec 11 06:00:40 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 14:00:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 51767 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 14:00:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 14:00:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.83) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 14:00:39 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.146] by n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Dec 2002 14:00:37 -0000 Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 14:00:37 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fw: Hd Radio Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 704 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amstereodude " X-Originating-IP: 65.121.7.116 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Possum Hunter" wrote: > > If it is off of the air, it is silent illegally! I just checked the status > of the license, it is supposed to be ON THE AIR! more than likely, you could > get that station for the price of the land it is sitting on and perhaps the > equipment. > > Station Search Details > Call Sign: KALT > Licensee: FAMILY WORSHIP CENTER CHURCH, INC. Then it must have recently changed hands. Didn't know Swaggart's organization had bought it. Haven't heard their signal for some time. Would be curious to know if they turned the stereo back on. It had been a sports format, and the pilot didn't last very long. ST From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Dec 11 06:09:27 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 14:09:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 38831 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 14:09:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 14:09:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 14:09:26 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.144] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Dec 2002 14:09:25 -0000 Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 14:09:24 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Preachers On The Radio was: Fw: Hd Radio Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <102.20c80e8b.2b28118f@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 71 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amstereodude " X-Originating-IP: 65.121.7.116 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude money being the root of all evil} ...lol > No, the LOVE of money. ST From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Dec 11 06:33:03 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 14:33:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 11718 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 14:33:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 14:33:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 14:32:52 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.252] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Dec 2002 14:32:51 -0000 Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 14:32:48 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Poor Pitiful Me Was: Hd Radio Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 799 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amstereodude " X-Originating-IP: 65.121.7.116 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, Ian Davidson > Hey Possum - Eric mightn't be saying this but I am! > > America spends heaps of taxpayers money on space research and military > facilities and arms - in fact as much on the military as the next seven > countries combined. The taxpayers could equally ask why? > It is not good for society (or the world for that matter) if the > financially stongest always wins. You'd better be glad we do spend so much on military and space research! A lot of that yields technology that has definite civilian benefit, such as the invention of teflon. It's also the reason Oz and those next seven nations combined haven't been overrun by their enemies. It's how we can keep civilian casualties down in any future wars, too. ST From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Dec 11 06:38:15 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 14:38:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 77015 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 14:38:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 14:38:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 14:38:11 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.182] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Dec 2002 14:38:04 -0000 Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 14:38:01 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} By the way Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20021211132806.39178.qmail@web41009.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 670 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amstereodude " X-Originating-IP: 65.121.7.116 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, JNR wrote: > > Now, nobody take my idea! You can come up & see > it if I ever get the cash to buy it. However, > being 23 and working for $10/hr., it'll be > awhile! I have no interest in moving to New England, so you're safe from me. One thing I'd like to suggest is for you to approach the owners and offer to program the station for them. You get to do the sales, et. al., and set a price for the station and a time frame for you to raise the needed cash to buy it (several years in mind.) Then move up there and do what needs to be done. That station could be yours sooner than you think! ST From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Dec 11 06:42:46 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 14:42:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 75529 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 14:42:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 14:42:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.89) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 14:42:46 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.134] by n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Dec 2002 14:42:46 -0000 Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 14:42:41 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Preachers On The Radio was: Fw: Hd Radio Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 401 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amstereodude " X-Originating-IP: 65.121.7.116 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude BTW- I agree that there are too many religious stations in many areas, but before you go condemning them wholesale, consider this- compare the regions where there are at least a few good Christian stations to where there are very few or none. What level of corruption do you see? Down south it may be small-time Billy Bob stuff. Compare that to what you see in the northeast. Nuff said. ST From groucho@skyweb.net Wed Dec 11 07:44:33 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 15:44:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 11470 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 15:44:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 15:44:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 15:44:31 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gBBFnq3g059092 for ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 10:49:53 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DF75C0D.F74161EC@skyweb.net> Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 10:38:54 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Preachers On The Radio was: Fw: Hd Radio References: <18.29938cf7.2b2806be@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 there are several 24 hour religious stations up here WFME family radio. WMCA. WNYG Possum Hunter wrote: > KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: > >While were on the topic...I thought it was weird when I was up in NY > earlier this year to not hear a single station broadcasting religion > full-time. > > What about WMCA 570? > > > >Seems like the south and mid Atlantic is bombarded by this kind of format. > > We are well blessed with 9FMs and 15AMs that are all trying to save us from > sin and separate us from our money. > > Long live FREE RADIO! > > Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ > Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From amfmdx@fastq.com Wed Dec 11 08:04:08 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 16:04:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 15000 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 16:04:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 16:04:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 16:04:05 -0000 Received: from fastq (d19-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.51]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gBBG44v75485 for ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 09:04:04 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <0a5201c2a12e$e4e86c00$89f9bed8@com> To: References: <20021211062357.82675.qmail@web41004.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Preachers On The Radio was: Fw: Hd Radio Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 09:03:48 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > I need to get a letter off to the F.C.C.. They > already fined the Phoenix sister station $4k for > not switching power, something WALE has also > done. Who could be behind getting KFNX a fine? Kevin From amfmdx@fastq.com Wed Dec 11 08:11:15 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 16:11:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 67066 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 16:11:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 16:11:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 16:11:15 -0000 Received: from fastq (d19-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.51]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gBBGBDv75680 for ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 09:11:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <0a5a01c2a12f$e4335760$89f9bed8@com> To: References: Subject: Ian, its none of your business.... Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 09:10:56 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > America spends heaps of taxpayers money on space research and military > facilities and arms - in fact as much on the military as the next seven > countries combined. The taxpayers could equally ask why? It was so we could keep you from speaking Japanese after WWII when the Australians would have been over run by the Japanese. We have a big military so the rest of the ungrateful nations of the world didn't have to go to communism. We have a big military because without it Europe would be speaking Russian today. We have a big military so South Korea can have a better life than North Korea. Ian, if it wasn't for us and our big military your life would suck today. Sorry, someone has to open your closed eyes. Hearing ungrateful people who hate us bitch because we keep them free pisses me the hell off. Its none of your Australian business what the hell we spend our money on in the USA. We really don't give a crap what you do with your tax money in Australia, there is no reason whatsoever for you to give a crap where we spend our money. YOU ARE NOT BEING TAXED TO PAY FOR IT, SO WHY ARE YOU COMPLAINING. Sorry to put this on the list because it is CERTAINLY NOT germane to AM stereo. I hope the rest of you forgive this rant. Kevin From amfmdx@fastq.com Wed Dec 11 08:16:27 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 16:16:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 23666 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 16:16:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 16:16:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 16:16:26 -0000 Received: from fastq (d19-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.51]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gBBGGPv75944 for ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 09:16:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <0a6201c2a130$9dec33c0$89f9bed8@com> To: References: <20021211041857.44456.qmail@web41009.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Preachers On The Radio was: Fw: Hd Radio Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 09:16:08 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > Rhode Island only has one full-time religious > station, it's a 5kW AM waaaaaaay up there at > 1590. WARV is still REL? > The only other station is another > commercial AM at 1220 doing it from 6A-1 or 2P. > The rest of the time it's in Spanish. They used to be WRCP in Portuguese. They changed to Spanish? > Here's a look at the R.I. radio dial (I have it > on good authority that one of these stations may > go stereo soon. Not gonna say which one 'cuz if > it doesn't then I have egg on mah face!) Now thats COOL! Tell us when they come on. I am very interested in knowing who it is. > There...now that's more than you EVER wanted to > know about R.I. A.M. radio! Yeah but it brings back a lot of memories. Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Dec 11 08:34:14 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 16:34:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 22719 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 16:34:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 16:34:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.81) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 16:34:12 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 08:34:12 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} New Ratings Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 11:33:54 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 11 Dec 2002 16:34:12.0219 (UTC) FILETIME=[22FCC4B0:01C2A133] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.171.105.146] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 stodd@sherbtel.net wrote: > Do you have a stereo-capable unit to replace the 9200? No, Not yet. The owner nearly had a stroke when he saw the price of the new ATU, I have to be gentle with him. I am trying to talk him into another EuroDesk 9000 for the prod room without it eating into my Engineering budget. I want it to be in the Production budget. In the mean time, I am looking at getting a 1KW Daytimer for myself and for the time being, simulcast WFIS on it. If that happens, I will put the 9200 on that station driving my "Pet" RCA BTA1R transmitter. Kevin From penry@nortelnetworks.com Wed Dec 11 08:35:57 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: penry@nortelnetworks.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 16:35:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 78437 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 16:35:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 16:35:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO zsc3s004.nortelnetworks.com) (47.81.138.65) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 16:35:56 -0000 Received: from zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com (zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com [47.103.122.112]) by zsc3s004.nortelnetworks.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id gBBGZsG00961 for ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 08:35:55 -0800 (PST) Received: from zrc2c011.us.nortel.com (zrc2c011.us.nortel.com [47.103.120.51]) by zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id gBBGa6W06877 for ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 10:36:07 -0600 (CST) Received: by zrc2c011.us.nortel.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 10:35:54 -0600 Message-ID: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A560797404A224FA@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: {AMSF} Ian, its none of your business.... Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 10:35:53 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) From: "Charles Penry" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=376233 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa5vhu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Kevin, You tell 'em! I have been to Australia and it is a wonderful place, however it appears that the local language there is becoming more and more Asian every day! So, who really won the war? Charles in "The Republic of Texas" -----Original Message----- From: Kevin - Mesa, Arizona [mailto:amfmdx@fastq.com] Sent: Wednesday, December 11, 2002 10:11 AM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Ian, its none of your business.... > America spends heaps of taxpayers money on space research and military > facilities and arms - in fact as much on the military as the next seven > countries combined. The taxpayers could equally ask why? It was so we could keep you from speaking Japanese after WWII when the Australians would have been over run by the Japanese. We have a big military so the rest of the ungrateful nations of the world didn't have to go to communism. We have a big military because without it Europe would be speaking Russian today. We have a big military so South Korea can have a better life than North Korea. Ian, if it wasn't for us and our big military your life would suck today. Sorry, someone has to open your closed eyes. Hearing ungrateful people who hate us bitch because we keep them free pisses me the hell off. Its none of your Australian business what the hell we spend our money on in the USA. We really don't give a crap what you do with your tax money in Australia, there is no reason whatsoever for you to give a crap where we spend our money. YOU ARE NOT BEING TAXED TO PAY FOR IT, SO WHY ARE YOU COMPLAINING. Sorry to put this on the list because it is CERTAINLY NOT germane to AM stereo. I hope the rest of you forgive this rant. Kevin Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Dec 11 08:45:05 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 16:45:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 36041 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 16:45:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 16:45:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.93) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 16:45:03 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 08:45:03 -0800 To: References: <179.1299d742.2b2858b2@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Poor Pitiful Me Was: Hd Radio Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 11:44:51 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 11 Dec 2002 16:45:03.0848 (UTC) FILETIME=[A7637680:01C2A134] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.171.105.146] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 n0uiheric@aol.com wrote: > It is clearly stated in FCC Rule 73.1208, Section A. It requires all prerecorded programs to be announced as such. In other words, voicetracked programs MUST be announced as being prerecorded. Failure to do so is illegal. A voice tracked program is no more a "pre-recorded program" than recorded station liners, jingles, promos, or commercials. The automation system is playing the music, inserting voices, commercials, and network breaks in real time. If you run a pre-recorded syndicated show such as "Oldies Coast To Coast", they come with an announcement that the show is recorded and may not be reproduced and it is copyrighted. If you record a show locally, you should include such an announcement. Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Dec 11 09:05:12 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 17:05:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 21985 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 17:05:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 17:05:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.119) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 17:05:12 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 09:05:11 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Poor Pitiful //NPR Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 12:04:59 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 11 Dec 2002 17:05:11.0948 (UTC) FILETIME=[7778E4C0:01C2A137] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.171.105.146] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Donn Tillman wrote: >WUSF (University of South Florida) the people are the air on not wannabees; some have retired or been let go from ClearChannel, The reason the FCC set aside the "Educational" channels on FM was for schools to put FM stations on the air as training grounds for people who are learning radio, NOT to give veteran broadcasters a place to be on the air when they retire, or preachers to beg for money. > > another - Roger Shulman - has two jobs, one with ClearChannel and one with WUSF. If he is not there just to teach up and coming radio students, he has no business there at all. He shouldn't be on the air, he should just be teaching the "tricks of the trade" to students, while the student is on the air. As a public service, WFIS has just such a training program with the local high schools. We teach them how to do production and sound slick on the air. We even have students calling the high school ball games on the air, doing the weather and news, and even have one learning engineering. Since the so-called "South Carolina Educational Radio Network" (NPR) ain't teaching these students, somebody has to! > >As far as public funding, WUSF receives 7% from the federal Ha! WFIS is teaching broadcasting without one nickel of tax money being spent, AND we are selling ads and blowing big hole in the ratings book while we do it! > > My tax dollars support a lot of turkeys (i.e. gov't subsidized loans and bailouts) that I don't agree with or use, but I still pay my taxes and don't complain. Public Radio is just such a turkey! I have a real problem with having money stolen from me by the tax collector to fund a radio station that is competing against me for listeners. Yes, I do gripe and complain about it, and if you want to see the phones light up, just get on the air and start talking about over-taxation. Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From penry@nortelnetworks.com Wed Dec 11 09:05:55 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: penry@nortelnetworks.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 17:05:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 99713 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 17:05:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 17:05:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO zsc3s004.nortelnetworks.com) (47.81.138.65) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 17:05:55 -0000 Received: from zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com (zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com [47.103.122.112]) by zsc3s004.nortelnetworks.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id gBBH5rG17995 for ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 09:05:53 -0800 (PST) Received: from zrc2c011.us.nortel.com (zrc2c011.us.nortel.com [47.103.120.51]) by zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id gBBH65W23034 for ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 11:06:06 -0600 (CST) Received: by zrc2c011.us.nortel.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 11:05:53 -0600 Message-ID: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A560797404A225A7@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: {AMSF} OT: What Needs to Change Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 11:05:50 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) From: "Charles Penry" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=376233 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa5vhu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Jerry, I fail to see what your rant has to do with the topic of this forum. The welcome page for the AMSF forum states: The AM STEREO Forum is your place to discuss AM Stereo and all aspects of AM radio associated with it. We can answer your technical questions as well as help beginners get started in the world of AM Stereo listening. Can we please stay on topic? Charles -----Original Message----- From: n0uiheric@aol.com [mailto:n0uiheric@aol.com] Sent: Wednesday, December 11, 2002 12:49 AM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} OT: What Needs to Change And if you want to hear more, then take a quote from the letters I've written to my elected officials: "Discrimination continues to run rampant in commercial radio; for example, homegrown talent, former public, college and small "mom-and-pop" station air talent have not been given the opportunities they have worked hard for years to earn. Patronage, cronyism and nepotism ('it's not WHAT you know, it's WHO you know') is a policy still largely in use in the commercial media; I see this policy as a dated policy that has kept many qualified people (myself included) from holding down well-paid positions in the commercial media. ------------------------------ Very long rant that has nothing to do with this forum snipped... [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From penry@nortelnetworks.com Wed Dec 11 09:17:45 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: penry@nortelnetworks.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 17:17:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 70843 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 17:17:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 17:17:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO zsc3s004.nortelnetworks.com) (47.81.138.65) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 17:17:44 -0000 Received: from zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com (zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com [47.103.122.112]) by zsc3s004.nortelnetworks.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id gBBHHhG20171 for ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 09:17:43 -0800 (PST) Received: from zrc2c011.us.nortel.com (zrc2c011.us.nortel.com [47.103.120.51]) by zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id gBBHHsW25030 for ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 11:17:55 -0600 (CST) Received: by zrc2c011.us.nortel.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 11:17:42 -0600 Message-ID: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A560797404A225E3@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: {AMSF} Poor Pitiful Me Was: Hd Radio Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 11:17:39 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) From: "Charles Penry" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=376233 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa5vhu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mr. Bueneman, If we must talk about Clear Channel, what's up with KABL these days? Is this Flagship station of Clear Channels Bay Area still broadcasting in beautiful CQUAM AM Stereo? Have they killed CQUAM to go IBOC yet? The listeners need to be ready to let KABL know if they don't like the new sound of the station as soon as it switches to IBOC. Now, I have just talked about Clear Channel and stayed on the topic of this forum. See how easy it is? Charles Live long and prosper. Or Die soon as a pauper. It's your choice. Blah Blah Blah -----Original Message----- From: n0uiheric@aol.com [mailto:n0uiheric@aol.com] Sent: Wednesday, December 11, 2002 12:48 AM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Poor Pitiful Me Was: Hd Radio Lowry Mays SAT ON HIS BUTT. That's how he illegally got control of Clear Channel. He didn't work himself half to death, like I did. He had cronies who were willing to give him the money to run the radio business into the ground, taking away hard-earned jobs from the radio workers, and using illegal voicetracking. And another thing, BARF! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From florida_amstereo@hotmail.com Wed Dec 11 09:48:11 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: florida_amstereo@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 17:48:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 15280 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 17:48:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 17:48:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.37.132) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 17:48:10 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 09:40:52 -0800 Received: from 199.173.225.21 by pv2fd.pav2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 17:40:51 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Re: Opinions on NPR Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 17:40:51 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 11 Dec 2002 17:40:52.0252 (UTC) FILETIME=[73315DC0:01C2A13C] From: "Donn Tillman" X-Originating-IP: [199.173.225.21] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83914824 Kevin R from the Palmetto state wrote: "The reason the FCC set aside the "Educational" channels on FM was for schools to put FM stations on the air as training grounds for people who are learning radio, NOT to give veteran broadcasters a place to be on the air when they retire, or preachers to beg for money." If this is still the case, then our gripe should be with the FCC; WUSF did start out as a 10 Watt station run by the students; all of that changed in the early to mid 1970's; if the FCC has not changed or modified the reasons and requirements for the "set aside" channels, then the FCC has a big job ahead of them!; From where I am, I can receive WUSF, WMNF (88.5-Tampa- a community station that does receive funding from the state of Florida) and 7 religious stations, all at full power except a "Family Radio" satellite feed that run 3,000 watts and a 100,000 watt station owned and run by the Catholic Archdiocese of St Petersburg. Right now, I have to say that I consider the FCC a bigger turkey than NPR, but the FCC is less of a turkey than low cost construction loans (gov't subsidized) for MacDonald's'. btw- I'm wondering how many of my tax dollars and yours are going to subsidize Ibiquity in it's ventures?? None, I hope, but I strongly suspect otherwise. and yes I know the phone lines light up whenever the talk of taxation comes up; it's been that way since before the Boston tea party (the mass exasperation; not the phone lines!). The same thing happens if you talk to people and ask if they earn enough money; even CEO's don't think they earn enough money. You would be hard-pressed to find anyone who thinks they earn too much or equally hard-pressed to find anyone who thinks they should pay more taxes. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ As far as WFIS goes, it's community service is commendable; just wish more stations across both bands would be even half as responsible and community oriented. >As a public service, WFIS has just such a training program with the >local high schools. >We teach them how to do production and sound slick on the air. We even have students calling the high school ball games on the air, doing the weather and news, and even have one learning engineering. Since the so-called "South Carolina Educational Radio Network" (NPR) ain't teaching these students, somebody has to! ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ _________________________________________________________________ STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Wed Dec 11 11:09:18 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 19:09:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 27925 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 19:09:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 19:09:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14201.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.143) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 19:09:17 -0000 Message-ID: <20021211190850.89111.qmail@web14201.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.45.202.244] by web14201.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 11:08:50 PST Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 11:08:50 -0800 (PST) Subject: Hey - We're Famous - or infamous? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio Taking my usual stroll down memory lane with the FCC Docket #99-325 I see a new filing dated December 10th and that a number of us will be 'served' documents regarding IBOC at night! Let us know what you get - Bob, Chris, Marv, Fred, Kevin, Kevin, Michael, Robert, Scott, Vicki, and anybody else I missed? __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From florida_amstereo@hotmail.com Wed Dec 11 11:34:05 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: florida_amstereo@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 19:34:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 59305 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 19:34:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 19:34:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.37.75) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 19:34:04 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 11:28:29 -0800 Received: from 199.173.224.2 by pv2fd.pav2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 19:28:28 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Hey - We're Famous - or infamous? Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 19:28:28 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 11 Dec 2002 19:28:29.0318 (UTC) FILETIME=[7BE77260:01C2A14B] From: "Donn Tillman" X-Originating-IP: [199.173.224.2] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83914824 I would rather be served refreshments, but I guess documents will do! Will everyone that signed be "served" documents? What all is involved; an in-depth questionaire? I did voice an opinion in regard to the petition, but as of yet have not had the "pleasure" of listening in to a station broadcasting in IBOC. donn st petersburg ----Original Message Follows---- From: "John P." Reply-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Hey - We're Famous - or infamous? Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 11:08:50 -0800 (PST) Taking my usual stroll down memory lane with the FCC Docket #99-325 I see a new filing dated December 10th and that a number of us will be 'served' documents regarding IBOC at night! Let us know what you get - Bob, Chris, Marv, Fred, Kevin, Kevin, Michael, Robert, Scott, Vicki, and anybody else I missed? __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com donn tillman p o box 952 st petersburg,fl 33731-0952 _________________________________________________________________ Add photos to your e-mail with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Wed Dec 11 11:45:54 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 19:45:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 69119 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 19:45:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 19:45:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web41008.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.93.7) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 19:45:48 -0000 Message-ID: <20021211194543.80095.qmail@web41008.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.35.104] by web41008.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 11:45:43 PST Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 11:45:43 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: {AMSF} Preachers On The Radio was: Fw: Hd Radio To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: <0a5201c2a12e$e4e86c00$89f9bed8@com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio MWAHAHAHAHA! __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From KC4QLP@aol.com Wed Dec 11 11:49:14 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 19:49:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 10498 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 19:49:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 19:49:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m09.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.164) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 19:49:13 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m09.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.188.126b0d9d (3310) for ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 14:48:23 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <188.126b0d9d.2b28f087@aol.com> Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 14:48:23 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Poor Pitiful Me Was: Hd Radio To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 12/11/02 4:01:16 AM Eastern Standard Time, n0uiheric@aol.com writes: > It is clearly stated in FCC Rule 73.1208, Section A. It requires all > prerecorded programs to be announced as such. In other words, voicetracked > programs MUST be announced as being prerecorded. Failure to do so is > illegal. > Stop taking the damn rules and regulations out of context! Shhhheeeeeez! some people! Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From KC4QLP@aol.com Wed Dec 11 11:56:14 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 19:56:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 72645 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 19:56:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 19:56:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m06.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.161) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 19:56:13 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.a7.2b4e4123 (3310) for ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 14:55:54 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 14:55:54 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Poor Pitiful //NPR To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 12/11/02 12:06:32 PM Eastern Standard Time, possumhunter@netzero.net writes: > If he is not there just to teach up and coming radio students, he has no > business there at all. He shouldn't be on the air, he should just be > teaching the "tricks of the trade" to students, while the student is on the > air. > > As a public service, WFIS has just such a training program with the local > high schools. We teach them how to do production and sound slick on the > air. > We even have students calling the high school ball games on the air, doing > the weather and news, and even have one learning engineering. Since the > so-called "South Carolina Educational Radio Network" (NPR) ain't teaching > these students, somebody has to! > Isnt that the truth! A good friend of mine that works over here at WRVS 89.9 is basically the only on air paid person...as it is his job to teach up coming students the broadcasting ropes. All of the educational stations around here do that..you never hear the same ol people on the air on those stations.You also never hear personalities from other stations on those noncomms as well.So many noncomms at one point had many nich formats..something you wouldnt find on commerical stations.Today you cant hardly tell the difference between the noncomm and the commerical station.Something is quite wrong with that. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From penry@nortelnetworks.com Wed Dec 11 12:21:26 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: penry@nortelnetworks.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 20:21:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 45591 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 20:21:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 20:21:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO zsc3s004.nortelnetworks.com) (47.81.138.65) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 20:21:24 -0000 Received: from zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com (zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com [47.103.122.112]) by zsc3s004.nortelnetworks.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id gBBKLNG14745 for ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 12:21:23 -0800 (PST) Received: from zrc2c011.us.nortel.com (zrc2c011.us.nortel.com [47.103.120.51]) by zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id gBBKLZW15658 for ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 14:21:35 -0600 (CST) Received: by zrc2c011.us.nortel.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 14:21:21 -0600 Message-ID: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A560797404A55ED6@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Is This Equip CQUAM? Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 14:21:21 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) From: "Charles Penry" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=376233 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa5vhu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Harris AM STM-1 Stereo AM Modulation monitor, excellent condition, and Harris AMS-G1 Am Stereo Exciter: http://www.lightnerelectronics.com/cgi-bin/cart/cart.pl?db=used.dat&category =&search=&method=&begin=61&display=10&price=&merchant = Is this CQUAM? If so, we need to get it on the air somewhere! Happy-------------(Pan L to R)------------Listening, Charles [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From n0uiheric@aol.com Wed Dec 11 12:26:47 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 20:26:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 33277 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 20:26:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 20:26:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m02.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.5) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 20:26:46 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-m02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.ac.3357dc59 (16633) for ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 15:26:36 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 15:26:36 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Poor Pitiful Me Was: Hd Radio To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih It is AMERICAN to force corporations to pay higher taxes, but not individuals. With the individual tax cuts put in place by El Presidente Bush, who's going to make up the difference? The corporations. Corporate America should pay higher taxes than individuals who make less than, say, $100,000 per year. Setting ad rates based on ratings is UNFAIR. It prices small business out of the market; many of those are looking for more business, and radio has long been proven to bring business in (although it hasn't done so for even big business in recent years). It is only fair to CONTROL AD RATES, not let them go sky high. And ad rates are artificially high as they are. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Wed Dec 11 12:26:49 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 20:26:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 6453 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 20:26:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 20:26:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m03.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.6) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 20:26:48 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-m03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.15b.18c7133a (16633) for ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 15:26:37 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <15b.18c7133a.2b28f97d@aol.com> Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 15:26:37 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} By the way To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih WBBA-FM is still on the air; their 10 kW signal on 97.5 makes it into suburban St. Louis frequently. KHCR 97.7 Potosi, MO is also apparently silent, preparing for a move to 99.5 in nearby Bismarck. The 97.7 frequency filed for the KHZR calls; KPCR-FM 94.1 is running the "Joy FM" Contemporary Christian format solo pending the move of KHCR to 99.5. I haven't checked 1580 lately, even though I have a local on 1570. I would think that either Davenport, IA or DuQuoin, IL would make it in while Pittsfield is off. 1310 in Joplin would be a good pickup for the owner of KQYX 1450/WMBH 1560. KQYX is 1 kW day and night; WMBH is 250 watts day/nine watts at night. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Dec 11 12:49:01 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 20:48:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 43396 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 20:48:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 20:48:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.207) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 20:48:59 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 12:48:59 -0800 To: References: <188.126b0d9d.2b28f087@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Poor Pitiful Me Was: Hd Radio Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 15:47:37 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 11 Dec 2002 20:48:59.0419 (UTC) FILETIME=[BADE5EB0:01C2A156] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.137.25.162] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: > Stop taking the damn rules and regulations out of context! You tell 'im Bob! If voice tracking was illegal, don't you think the cash strapped FCC would be out making money fining all of the voice tracked/automated stations? Just in my market you can hear 39 of them, including AM STEREO 1490 WPCI. Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From n0uiheric@aol.com Wed Dec 11 13:09:38 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 21:09:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 4926 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 21:09:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 21:09:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r08.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.104) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 21:09:37 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-r08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.12f.1d5cdc7e (3996) for ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 16:09:35 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <12f.1d5cdc7e.2b29038e@aol.com> Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 16:09:34 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Poor Pitiful Me Was: Hd Radio To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih That rule must be INTERPRETED LITERALLY, Bob. In other words, you're violating FCC rules by voicetracking WITHOUT ANNOUNCING the fact that it's PRE-RECORDED. By not doing so, you're confusing the listener. A good announcement for such: "The programming you hear on (insert your calls here) is pre-recorded." 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Wed Dec 11 13:09:50 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 21:09:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 11136 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 21:09:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 21:09:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r09.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.105) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 21:09:49 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-r09.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.151.18b7e80b (3996) for ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 16:09:36 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <151.18b7e80b.2b29038f@aol.com> Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 16:09:35 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Poor Pitiful Me Was: Hd Radio To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih I really don't care about KABL...I don't live near San Francisco/Oakland. CC owns only one AM station in St. Louis, and it's dull mono. The one I'm worried about going IBOC is not only KATZ, but also Infinity's KMOX. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Wed Dec 11 13:09:55 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 21:09:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 88869 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 21:09:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 21:09:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r10.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.106) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 21:09:54 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-r10.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.12e.1d4d98fd (3996) for ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 16:09:36 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <12e.1d4d98fd.2b290390@aol.com> Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 16:09:36 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Poor Pitiful Me Was: Hd Radio To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih But, a voicetracked program is NOT LIVE. Therefore, it HAS TO BE ANNOUNCED as being pre-recorded. Otherwise, listener confusion will result. Voicetracking has been proven to LOWER the ratings of a station. Locally, Clear Channel's KATZ-FM 100.3 is all voicetracked. They're now getting slaughtered by Radio One's WFUN-FM 95.5 (known as "Q 95-5") in the ratings. The Q is all live and mostly local; the only syndicated show they take is Russ Parr in the morning (from one of their sister stations in the Washington/Baltimore area). In the country market here, "93.7 The Bull" is getting murdered in the ratings by 92.3 WIL. "The Bull" is largely voicetracked. And 103.3 KLOU, which dropped Oldies for soft Classic Hits last summer, has fallen off the radar screen thanks to voicetracking. Both were once Top 10-rated stations in the 1980s and early 1990s. It's time to outlaw voicetracking, and give the live DJs their rightful places back. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Wed Dec 11 13:10:35 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 21:10:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 63373 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 21:10:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 21:10:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m03.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.6) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 21:10:35 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-m03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.54.4543b7f (3996) for ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 16:09:39 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <54.4543b7f.2b290392@aol.com> Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 16:09:38 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Opinions on NPR To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih Most of the people who work for NPR and it's member stations absolutely REFUSE to work in commercial radio. They believe that commercial radio is "dumbed down" radio (I believe that to be the case). Many of them believe in a strict and absolute interpretation of FCC rules. What NPR holds true to is that radio should not only be entertaining, but also educational. The station I work for has one other former commercial radio DJ besides myself. Leo Chears is a 40-year veteran of St. Louis jazz and blues radio, who has had stations such as KSD (now KTRS), KADI (now KIHT), WRTH (now KFNS) and WMRY (now WVRV) on his resume. Another former commercial radio talent that works in public radio is Mike Sampson, who was a co-host of "PM Magazine" on KTVI Channel 2 during the early 1980s (when the station was an ABC affiliate; it's now a Fox o&o). Even former KMOX meterologist Ben Abell (who was pushed out when KMOX began getting their forecasts from The Weather Channel) is now the meterologist on KWMU. By contrast to many markets, most of the non-commercial stations are owned by educational and not-for-profit institutions. Only three non-commercial FMs are run by Christian organizations; WIBI 91.1 by Illinois Bible Institute, which is headquartered at Blackburn College in Carlinville. They own stations from Chicago, IL to Farmington, MO. KSIV-FM 91.5 is owned by not-for-profit Bott Radio Network, a fundamentalist Christian organization. WCBW-FM 89.7 in East St. Louis is owned by New Life Evangelistic Center of St. Louis, and uses their media outlets to teach it's clients, many of whom were previously homeless, the skills needed to operate broadcast radio and TV stations. The rest of the secular non-commercial FMs: KDHX 88.1-Variety format, Double Helix Corporation (non-profit organization) WSIE 88.7-Mainstream jazz format, Southern Illinois University Edwardsville (carries only select NPR shows) KCLC 89.1-Adult Alternative format, Lindenwood University KCFV 89.5-Alternative Rock format, St. Louis Community College at Florissant Valley KYMC 89.7-Variety format, YMCA of West (St. Louis) County WLCA 89.9-Alternative format, Lewis and Clark Community College KRHS 90.1-Alternative format, Ritenour High School KWUR 90.3-Alternative format, Washington University KWMU 90.7-News/Talk format, University of Missouri-St. Louis (carries mostly NPR programs, some local shows, AFTRA-affiliated) Catholic programming was largely unavailable in largely Catholic markets (like St. Louis or Chicago) before EWTN Global Catholic Radio came on the air. It is one of the fastest-growing "denomination-specific" formats in the country, spurred by the Southern Baptist domination of Christian radio. WEWN in Birmingham, AL, a shortwave station, is the EWTN flagship. Before EWTN, there were very few all-Catholic stations, such as KBVM 88.3 in Portland, OR. As a public service director for a non-commercial station, it is my responsibility to select PSAs that create a powerful message for our listeners. The "Digital Disaster" PSAs have made our listeners aware of the dangers of IBOC. I'm awaiting some anti-Clear Channel PSAs from the Prometheus Radio Project. It's PUBLIC RADIO that's "where it's at" in radio, not corporate radio. And, I've identified AM NPR affiliates that could benefit from AM Stereo, especially stations like WOI 640 Ames, IA, KSUI 910 Iowa City, IA (in KCJJ's back yard) and WILL 580 Urbana, IL. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Wed Dec 11 13:33:49 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 21:33:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 76593 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 21:33:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 21:33:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r05.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.101) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 21:33:47 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-r05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.d.450c506 (30970) for ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 16:33:36 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 16:33:35 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Poor Pitiful Me Was: Hd Radio To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih I am not taking the rules out of context...it's the INDUSTRY that's taken the rules out of context. I quote FCC Rule 73.1208, Section A: "Any taped, filmed or recorded program material in which time is of special significance, or by which an affirmative attempt is made to create the impression that it is occuring simultaneous with the broadcast, SHALL BE ANNOUNCED at the beginning as taped, filmed or recorded. The language of the announcement SHALL BE CLEAR and IN TERMS COMMONLY UNDERSTOOD BY THE PUBLIC. For television stations, the announcement may be made visually or aurally". The only announcements that need not be announced as being prerecorded, as covered under FCC Rule 73.1208, Section B, are as follows: COMMERCIALS, PROMOS and PUBLIC SERVICE ANNOUNCEMENTS. Nothing beyond that. The announcer, as such, is NOT PROGRAM MATERIAL. For all intents and purposes, voicetracking VIOLATES FCC RULES. Unfortunately, this rule isn't strictly enforced; it should be strictly enforced. In other words, LIVE DJs ARE REQUIRED. The only alternative to live DJs is the satellite. The station I work for has a strict policy against voicetracking. It is also uneconomical, as fewer jobs have undermined a radio economy that has become basically a COMMAND economy. My take on it, as I wrote to my elected officials: "We need a permanent ban on voicetracking; all stations should be required to have an actual person on the premises 24/7/365. If the station won't hire overnight board operators (for syndicated programming) or on-air talent because of financial constraints or the excuse that the shift 'isn't salable' would be required to be off the air (as in studios and transmitter turned off) during those hours." 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Wed Dec 11 13:55:44 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 21:55:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 21484 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 21:53:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 21:53:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web41010.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.93.9) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 21:53:36 -0000 Message-ID: <20021211215336.35757.qmail@web41010.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.35.104] by web41010.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 13:53:36 PST Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 13:53:36 -0800 (PST) Subject: O.T. Rant on NPR & Religious frequency hogs To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: <54.4543b7f.2b290392@aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio That's 3 more relgious non-comms than we have up here. Now I'm worried for 60% Catholic Rhode Island. If WGBH-FM loses its grandfathered status from the Great Blue Hill (98kW), it will be 50kW, which means unless another school puts on a station, it could mean religion or NPR around 89.7. If there are any of you frequency hogs out there: DO NOT COME TO RHODE ISLAND! WE WERE THE 1ST TO DECLARE OUR INDEPENDENCE AND THE LAST TO SIGN THE CONSTITUTION BECAUSE WE ARE AGAINST CENTRALIZATION AND FOR INDEPENDENT THINKING. WE WANT OUR NON-COMM FMS LEFT ALONE AND OUR RELIGION AND NPR ON CRIPPLED AMS! 5kW AT 1590 OWNED BY A LOCAL IS A FINE PLACE FOR PREACHING. 1kW ON A GRAVEYARDER 40 MILES AWAY IS GOOD FOR NPR. 10kW ON 1290 IS NOT! To all Boston University WBUR-FM SNOBS: GET WRNI OFF THE AIR! CHANGE IT BACK TO WICE! MAKE IT AN URBAN STATION! WHILE YOU'RE AT IT: WXNI USED TO BE LIVE & LOCAL WERI! REMEMBER??? WRNI USED TO SUCK WHEN IT WAS WRCP, BUT AT LEAST IT WAS LOCAL! YOU DO NOT HAVE A LEGITIMATE OVER-THE-AIR COLLEGE RADIO STATION! LET THE KIDS ON WBUR-FM. MAKE WBUR (AM) AGAIN WOCB! THE CAPE NEEDS IT! YOU ARE THE Mc-WAL-MART OF THE NCE SET! LEAVE! To summarize: NPR is NOT sacred. Look how they lobbied to KILL LPFM in 1978! They deserve the fate of the HMS "Gaspee." In 1772, the HMS Gaspee was chasing the sloop Hannah. The Hannah was shallower than the Gaspee and turned to quickly for the Gaspee. The Gaspee ran aground in Warwick, R.I.. Providence locals heard of this, rowed out to the Gaspee, and burned it. 1½ years BEFORE the Boston Tea Party. That felt good! If I could change the rules, N.C.E. F.M.s would not be allowed to be part of a network, nor operate at more than 6kW unless, as an educational institution, had students operating the station (with exception for engineering departments), or as a community station. Independent churches could operate there, but at no greater or lesser power than 100 Watts, or sufficient power to cover the city of license, whichever is less. No chain broadcasting on non-commercial F.M.s. This is not to make anyone mad. I am mad...at the way radio is McDonaldized and Wal-Mart-ized and how like a cancer it has spread to the non-commercial band. I wonder, if I have chuldren they will be able to find the same little college stations in the low end of the dial, or if they will all merge into three megastations and all be NPR or religion like the rest of the country. College radio is as magical to me as hearing WOWO or WHAS in their heydays. Now, I wonder. Will we fall too? Jay Rogers's Radio Talk can be heard at this time on this same station. Now stay tuned for Glenn Hauser's World Of Radio coming up next. From the Blackstone Valley to Block Island, and all points inbetween, this is WRI AM and FM in Providence. __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Wed Dec 11 13:58:11 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 21:58:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 89514 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 21:57:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 21:57:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web41010.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.93.9) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 21:57:13 -0000 Message-ID: <20021211215713.36542.qmail@web41010.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.35.104] by web41010.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 13:57:13 PST Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 13:57:13 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: {AMSF} Poor Pitiful Me Was: Hd Radio To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio So, that whole "The following broadcast has been tape recorded by means of electrical transcription" still must be made? COOL! I should walk into Q.C. with that! Thanks! Jay __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From penry@nortelnetworks.com Wed Dec 11 14:15:31 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: penry@nortelnetworks.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 22:15:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 13151 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 22:15:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 22:15:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO zsc3s004.nortelnetworks.com) (47.81.138.65) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 22:15:31 -0000 Received: from zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com (zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com [47.103.122.112]) by zsc3s004.nortelnetworks.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id gBBMFTG21412 for ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 14:15:29 -0800 (PST) Received: from zrc2c011.us.nortel.com (zrc2c011.us.nortel.com [47.103.120.51]) by zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id gBBMFfW21051 for ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 16:15:41 -0600 (CST) Received: by zrc2c011.us.nortel.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 16:15:27 -0600 Message-ID: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A560797404A560FF@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: {AMSF} O.T. Rant on NPR & The Dallas Cowboys Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 16:15:21 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) From: "Charles Penry" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=376233 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa5vhu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit How 'bout those Cowboys! End of rant. -----Original Message----- From: JNR [mailto:a1asurfradio@yahoo.com] Sent: Wednesday, December 11, 2002 3:54 PM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} O.T. Rant on NPR & Religious frequency hogs That's 3 more NFL football teams than we have up here. Now I'm worried for the 60% Catholic Rhode Island football viewers. If WGBH-FM loses its grandfathered football broadcast status from the Great Blue Hill (98kW), it will be gardening shows only, which means unless another school puts on the football games, it could mean handyman shows or prosaic around 89.7. If there are any of you frequency hogs out there: COME TO RHODE ISLAND! WE WERE THE 1ST TO MAKE HAM SANDWICHES BECAUSE WE ARE NOT JEWISH OR MUSLIM. WE WANT OUR MTV.... [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From ccuff@in4web.com Wed Dec 11 14:49:37 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 22:49:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 93974 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 22:48:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 22:48:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 22:48:12 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.169]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 17:42:57 -0500 Message-ID: <003701c2a166$2cf6c0a0$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: Subject: KABL Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 17:39:32 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 I can tell you one thing- a LOT of listeners will be quite vocal if KABL screws up their sound. I would say nearly 20% of all decoders I send out go out to the bay area specifically to hear KABL in stereo. They must be an awsome station. Chris From ccuff@in4web.com Wed Dec 11 15:14:53 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 23:14:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 18978 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 23:09:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 23:09:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 23:09:32 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.169]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 18:04:20 -0500 Message-ID: <005901c2a169$29dbbda0$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: Subject: OT- Google Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 18:00:55 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 Interesting article in Newsweek that came today on Google. I always use it, and it is very good, but the article describes how it works it's magic- Fascinating! Just type in your name- you will be amazed at what it "knows" Type in "AM Stereo"..... Cool! (yet scarey I will admit. There is NO privacy when it comes to the internet!) Chris From jsgil@hal-pc.org Wed Dec 11 15:48:02 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Dec 2002 23:48:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 49092 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 23:36:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 23:36:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 23:36:34 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.142] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Dec 2002 23:36:14 -0000 Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 23:36:13 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Poor Pitiful Me Was: Hd Radio Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2602 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.130.116 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst I think the whole point of the voice tracking rule was to prevent the public from being misled into thinking that it was live and not pre-recorded. Now there are cases that I don't think that it is necessary like commercials and PSAs but where I draw the line is where a whole show with a DJ talking between songs like it is being done live when in fact it is pre-recorded is misleading and this is how I think the voice tracking rule was written in the beginning. The only time that I hear them announce this if it is a show where people are calling in and don't want people calling during a rebroadcast. I always hear the Art Bell Show say that this is a re-broadcast and not to call in. This seems to be the only time they have a motive to report it because they don't want people calling in. It is a disadvantage to report that the show has been pre-recorded when it comes to ratings because a live show will almost always have a higher rating than a pre-recorded show of the same content. It is just pure deception on their part to mislead the public in order to cut station costs at the expense of laid off DJs and the misled public. The same concept applies to so called local shows produced in an area other than where it is broadcast leading the public to think it is truly local and that they could if they wanted to go to the station and meet the DJ so to speak. I think the spirit of the voice- tracking rule was to prevent the deception of the public by broadcasters as to when and where the show is being produced. Now I'm not whole heartedly against voice tracking and will tolerate some without announcement and I can understand small mom & pop upstarts having to do it in order to build the station up but it has been abused by the big boys as a means for slashing costs across the board while putting most local air talent out of work. The main ingregient in the magic formula in radio is the live interaction of the audience with the station which makes people feel like they are apart of the process. The big boys have all but eliminated this and I wonder sometimes if they don't understand that they removed the main factor in the equation that makes radio fun and profitable. The pioneers of radio like Marconi, DeForrest and Armstrong are probably rolling their graves for what has happened to radio. In the short term buying 1000s of stations, firing all the staff, and fully automating them is a short lived get rich scheme that will put the whole radio industry in jepoardy. When radio fails these big boys will put new meaning into "To Enron-Ron-Ron To Enron-Ron-Ron". JSG From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Wed Dec 11 16:10:06 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Dec 2002 00:10:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 37260 invoked from network); 11 Dec 2002 23:52:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Dec 2002 23:52:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web41006.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.93.5) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Dec 2002 23:52:49 -0000 Message-ID: <20021211235248.96230.qmail@web41006.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.35.104] by web41006.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 15:52:48 PST Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 15:52:48 -0800 (PST) Subject: RE: {AMSF} O.T. Rant on NPR & The Dallas Cowboys To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A560797404A560FF@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio I dunno what that means, but that's funny man! Can they be roast beef & cheese sammiches? From Miller's Roast Beef from here in Beautiful East Prahvidence? Too late: WGBH already is all-gardening shows. Plus, some game shows. They're N.P.R. too, but also have a lot of local stuff. 73, N1WVQ __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Wed Dec 11 17:29:07 2002 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 46525 invoked from network); 12 Dec 2002 00:55:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Dec 2002 00:55:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Dec 2002 00:55:18 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: notify@yahoogroups.com Received: from [66.218.67.138] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 12 Dec 2002 00:55:08 -0000 Date: 12 Dec 2002 00:55:08 -0000 Message-ID: <1039654508.125296.50618.w19@yahoogroups.com> X-eGroups-Application: files X-Yahoo-Group-Post: system From: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: New file uploaded to amstereoforum MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello, This email message is a notification to let you know that a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the amstereoforum group. File : /KAAM.mp3 Uploaded by : MoodIndigo007 Description : DFW's Adult Standards station that plays the best music from the last 60 years. I recorded this feed from the Morning Show with John Mccoy using the Sony SRF-42... You can access this file at the URL http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum/files/KAAM.mp3 To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/files Regards, MoodIndigo007 From KC4QLP@aol.com Wed Dec 11 17:30:49 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Dec 2002 01:30:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 45880 invoked from network); 12 Dec 2002 01:30:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Dec 2002 01:30:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m06.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.161) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Dec 2002 01:30:13 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.69.31b538c4 (4410) for ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 20:30:07 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <69.31b538c4.2b29409f@aol.com> Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 20:30:07 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Poor Pitiful Me Was: Hd Radio To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/11/02 3:30:07 PM Eastern Standard Time, n0uiheric@aol.com writes: << Setting ad rates based on ratings is UNFAIR. It prices small business out of the market; many of those are looking for more business, and radio has long been proven to bring business in (although it hasn't done so for even big business in recent years). It is only fair to CONTROL AD RATES, not let them go sky high. And ad rates are artificially high as they are. >> Its called competition...thetas the whole force behind a successful business.If you have competition..it should -*hopefully*- give you the incentive to try and do better than the next guy .....but maybe I've got it all wrong,some folks just want things handed to them I suppose. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From KC4QLP@aol.com Wed Dec 11 17:37:52 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Dec 2002 01:37:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 46484 invoked from network); 12 Dec 2002 01:24:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Dec 2002 01:24:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r03.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.99) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Dec 2002 01:24:07 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.a.29bf71bd (4410) for ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 20:23:44 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 20:23:44 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Is This Equip CQUAM? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/11/02 3:22:40 PM Eastern Standard Time, penry@nortelnetworks.com writes: << Harris AM STM-1 Stereo AM Modulation monitor, excellent condition, and Harris AMS-G1 Am Stereo Exciter: http://www.lightnerelectronics.com/cgi-bin/cart/cart.pl?db=used.dat&category =&search=&method=&begin=61&display=10&price=&merchant = Is this CQUAM? If so, we need to get it on the air somewhere! Happy-------------(Pan L to R)------------Listening, Charles >> Yep..its C-Quam. Someone grab it up..looks like a good price for the lot. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From KC4QLP@aol.com Wed Dec 11 17:40:26 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Dec 2002 01:40:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 67318 invoked from network); 12 Dec 2002 01:40:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Dec 2002 01:40:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m06.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.161) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Dec 2002 01:40:20 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.b0.3107183d (4410) for ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 20:40:15 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 20:40:15 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Poor Pitiful Me Was: Hd Radio To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/11/02 4:14:33 PM Eastern Standard Time, n0uiheric@aol.com writes: << That rule must be INTERPRETED LITERALLY, Bob. In other words, you're violating FCC rules by voicetracking WITHOUT ANNOUNCING the fact that it's PRE-RECORDED. By not doing so, you're confusing the listener. A good announcement for such: "The programming you hear on (insert your calls here) is pre-recorded." >> So technically speaking....even a commerical can be considered as a short form program. Should we be announcing at the start of each commerical break...The following commericals your about to hear are prerecorded for you listening enjoyment!Should we be annoucing before we play any recorded song on the radio that the following song has been recorded for airing at this time?!? ...Me thinks you been dippin in the eggnog to much. If voice tracking were illegal as you seem to think ..dont you think the FCC would have come done on stations doing voice tracking? Yes! ..is there anything being done about voice tracking by the FCC? No!...Why?..because its not illegal! Until you become a lawyer for the FCC or become a paid staff member of the FCC {yeah right!..LMAO!} then basically all of this falls on deaf ears and blind eyes. like Paul Harvey would say....."Good Day!" Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From KC4QLP@aol.com Wed Dec 11 18:54:01 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Dec 2002 02:54:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 34527 invoked from network); 12 Dec 2002 02:54:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Dec 2002 02:54:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d10.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.42) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Dec 2002 02:54:00 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d10.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.16f.186549ad (4410) for ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 21:53:51 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <16f.186549ad.2b29543e@aol.com> Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 21:53:50 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} WOR-HD To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp I was just sitting here this evening catching up on some e-mails and have noticed that I havent received an answer to my question regarding IBOC/test/receivers. I was just hoping that my question would have been answered in a public forum...which receivers did not fair well during the testing of IBOC at iBiguity.Simple fair question that the public deserves to have an answer to. Well it has come to my attention while looking at the members list of this group...that the individual that the question was directed to,ISNT here on the list anymore! If the data results cant be given in a public forum..then there must certainly be something to hide.My opinion. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From groucho@skyweb.net Wed Dec 11 19:10:42 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Dec 2002 03:10:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 96492 invoked from network); 12 Dec 2002 03:10:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Dec 2002 03:10:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Dec 2002 03:10:39 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gBC3GQaN032365 for ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 22:16:27 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DF7FD2D.2096E5E2@skyweb.net> Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 22:06:21 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Is This Equip CQUAM? References: X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Yes this is C-Quam stuff The AMS-G1 is the model of the exciter that I am using at WTTM.. with a Orban 9100B it sounds great. hell If I had $500 I would Buy it... KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 12/11/02 3:22:40 PM Eastern Standard Time, > penry@nortelnetworks.com writes: > > << Harris AM STM-1 Stereo AM Modulation monitor, excellent condition, and > Harris AMS-G1 Am Stereo Exciter: > http://www.lightnerelectronics.com/cgi-bin/cart/cart.pl?db=used.dat&category > =&search=&method=&begin=61&display=10&price=&merchant > y=&search=&method=&begin=61&display=10&price=&merchant> = > > Is this CQUAM? If so, we need to get it on the air somewhere! > > Happy-------------(Pan L to R)------------Listening, > Charles >> > > Yep..its C-Quam. Someone grab it up..looks like a good price for the lot. > > Bob Carter > Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group > > WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 > Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 > > Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering > services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. > e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net > Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC > WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC > WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC > Ray Communications Radio Network > > voice contact-252-335-0856 > fax 1-209-254-8978 > _______________________________________________________ > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From KC4QLP@aol.com Wed Dec 11 19:11:22 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Dec 2002 03:11:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 25276 invoked from network); 12 Dec 2002 01:52:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Dec 2002 01:52:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r10.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.106) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Dec 2002 01:52:38 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r10.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.16a.1863b9e2 (4410) for ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 20:52:27 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <16a.1863b9e2.2b2945da@aol.com> Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 20:52:26 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Poor Pitiful Me Was: Hd Radio To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/11/02 4:34:43 PM Eastern Standard Time, n0uiheric@aol.com writes: << The announcer, as such, is NOT PROGRAM MATERIAL. For all intents and purposes, voicetracking VIOLATES FCC RULES. Unfortunately, this rule isn't strictly enforced; it should be strictly enforced. In other words, LIVE DJs ARE REQUIRED. The only alternative to live DJs is the satellite. The station I work for has a strict policy against voicetracking. It is also uneconomical, as fewer jobs have undermined a radio economy that has become basically a COMMAND economy. >> Lets see ...you just stated that the announcer is "not program material" ...the announcer records something that is say inserted between songs and or commerical breaks ......ok so you just stated that the --*announcer*-- is not program material..which in this case has been recorded. Then how in the sam hill in gods name can it be ILLEGAL? Something has to be considered program material before it has to fall under that ruling. Your contradicting yourself...the sad thing is ...you dont even know your doing it! Sadly radio cant be what it was 20 years ago...times change,economy changes,peoples lives change to reflect those changes...its called survival,the fittest of the fit..the stronger ones survive.Thats life...like it or lump it...get over it. {developing a method of sending shock therpy via email!} Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From kfornal@cox.net Wed Dec 11 19:48:57 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kfornal@cox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Dec 2002 03:48:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 14878 invoked from network); 12 Dec 2002 03:48:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Dec 2002 03:48:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO lakemtao04.cox.net) (68.1.17.241) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Dec 2002 03:48:19 -0000 Received: from OMNIBOOK ([68.9.127.164]) by lakemtao04.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20021212034818.HLGX22825.lakemtao04.cox.net@OMNIBOOK> for ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 22:48:18 -0500 To: Subject: KLAC flips to "FABULOUS 570" Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 22:47:55 -0500 Message-ID: <001501c2a191$44aa0c40$0301a8c0@OMNIBOOK> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2616 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Importance: Normal From: "Keith Fornal" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=128541479 X-Yahoo-Profile: theradboy Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From All Access (12/11): "KLAC-A/LOS ANGELES wound down its short-lived Talk format WEDNESDAY (12/11) with morning host GIL GROSS and middayer MICHAEL JACKSON graciously thanking their producers and staff as well as PD MARK AUSTIN THOMAS- the CLEAR CHANNEL station will flip to Adult Standards as "FABULOUS 570" with a launch on THURSDAY (12/12) at Noon, featuring a live appearance by ROD STEWART at the MUSEUM OF TELEVISION AND RADIO in BEVERLY HILLS and a SINATRA marathon to kick things off. The station continues as flagship for LOS ANGELES LAKERS basketball as well." Any chance they will be in AM Stereo? Keith Fornal Treasurer Dutch Island Lighthouse Society www.dutchislandlighthouse.org [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Dec 11 20:13:15 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Dec 2002 04:13:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 29267 invoked from network); 12 Dec 2002 04:13:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Dec 2002 04:13:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.119) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Dec 2002 04:13:13 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 20:13:13 -0800 To: References: Subject: Ad rates was: Poor Pitiful Me Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 23:12:56 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 12 Dec 2002 04:13:13.0724 (UTC) FILETIME=[CA128BC0:01C2A194] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.136.151.184] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 n0uiheric@aol.com wrote: > Setting ad rates based on ratings is UNFAIR. It prices small business out of the market; many of those are looking for more business, and radio has long been proven to bring business in (although it hasn't done so for even big business in recent years). It is only fair to CONTROL AD RATES, not let them go sky high. And ad rates are artificially high as they are. OK, I will bite on this one. In this case, I will use the ad rates for WFIS 1600 AM simply because I just happen to have a 2 year old rate card and the newest rate card on my desk right now. 2 years ago, Daytime rates were $4 for a :30 and $6 for a :60. No rates were even listed for Nighttime @25 Watts of power. Today the Daytime rates are $15 for a :30 and $20 for a :60 Nighttime rates are $7.50 for a :30 and $10 for a :60. Is such an increase in rates fair? Well, let's see just what happened in this time period. New ground system installed Tower re-welded and painted The following equipment has been purchased: Eurodesk 9000 board, 6 New Mikes, 4 new computers, PhantomII, 4 new Starguides, 2 Dennon CD players, 2 Dennon CD burners, Optimod 9200, Revox Reel tape machine, Telephone mix-minus, Fidelipac prod board, 4 new monitor speakers, 2 monitor amps, 2 Dennon Cassette decks, New studio furniture, TM Century production library, TM Century Gold Drive Oldies format, TM Century and Jam jingles, New Marti antenna. These upgrades caused WFIS to show in the ratings for the first time in 10 years. Now WFIS is pulling a 3.2 share! Now an advertiser has hundreds of times more listeners hearing his ads, Shouldn't he pay more for those listeners? Shouldn't he pay more for his ads to sound better on the air? Guess what, The rates are going up to $20 and $28 24 hours at the first of the year for all new contracts. Do we have the right to go up again? Well, will BE give us a new AM Stereo transmitter for free? How about a free Stereo mod monitor? What about that $6685 dollar ATU from Kintronics? Care to write me a check for that in exchange for us not going up on the ad rates? How about shipping me a free stereo audio processor along with that check, OK? If ad rates were fixed, do you think WFIS would have done ANY of these upgrades? Do you think we would be in the ratings book? Will we be screwing the eyes out of Mr. Poor Businessman? Well, a little bird landed on my shoulder with the rate card of my competitor in his beak. Entercom's 5KW WYRD 1330, the other news/talk station charges $120 for Daytime :30s and :60s, or $80 for night time :30s and :60s I would LOVE to see a rate card for WOR 710! Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation. From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Dec 11 20:22:59 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Dec 2002 04:22:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 67781 invoked from network); 12 Dec 2002 04:22:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Dec 2002 04:22:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.89) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Dec 2002 04:22:59 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 20:22:59 -0800 To: References: <54.4543b7f.2b290392@aol.com> Subject: PSAs Was: Opinions on NPR Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 23:22:47 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 12 Dec 2002 04:22:59.0477 (UTC) FILETIME=[27355C50:01C2A196] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.136.151.184] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 n0uiheric@aol.com > As a public service director for a non-commercial station, it is my responsibility to select PSAs that create a powerful message for our listeners. The "Digital Disaster" PSAs have made our listeners aware of the dangers of IBOC. I'm awaiting some anti-Clear Channel PSAs from the Prometheus Radio Project. OK, You are a Socialist and I am a Libertarian, so I am sure any more discussion of "Should the government rob me to pay you to compete with me?" will be fruitless. However, your enemy just happens to be MY enemy, so if you post the .mp3s of the Clear Channel PSAs, I will get them on the air. If I think they would get WFIS sued, they will at least be aired on my Part 15 in wonderful Kahn AM Stereo. Kevin From groucho@skyweb.net Wed Dec 11 20:37:45 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Dec 2002 04:37:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 15931 invoked from network); 12 Dec 2002 02:49:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Dec 2002 02:49:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Dec 2002 02:49:43 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gBC2tVaN026731 for ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 21:55:31 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DF7F848.77031FAE@skyweb.net> Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 21:45:28 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Poor Pitiful Me Was: Hd Radio References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 actually teflon was not developed. It was discovered by accident. as a residue left at the bottom af a Flask during an experiment "amstereodude " wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, Ian Davidson > > > Hey Possum - Eric mightn't be saying this but I am! > > > > America spends heaps of taxpayers money on space research and > military > > facilities and arms - in fact as much on the military as the next > seven > > countries combined. The taxpayers could equally ask why? > > > It is not good for society (or the world for that matter) if the > > financially stongest always wins. > > You'd better be glad we do spend so much on military and space > research! A lot of that yields technology that has definite civilian > benefit, such as the invention of teflon. It's also the reason Oz > and those next seven nations combined haven't been overrun by their > enemies. It's how we can keep civilian casualties down in any future > wars, too. > > ST > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From penry@nortelnetworks.com Wed Dec 11 20:50:18 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: penry@nortelnetworks.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Dec 2002 04:50:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 65658 invoked from network); 12 Dec 2002 04:50:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Dec 2002 04:50:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Dec 2002 04:50:17 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.186] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 12 Dec 2002 04:50:02 -0000 Date: Thu, 12 Dec 2002 04:50:01 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Poor Poor Pitiful Eric Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <151.18b7e80b.2b29038f@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1588 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wa5vhu " X-Originating-IP: 12.237.30.38 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=376233 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa5vhu Eric, No duh? I don't live anywhere near KABL either however I do care what happens to it as I understand that it is a CQUAM AM Stereo station, and one of the few that still plays great sounding music. Isn't that what this forum is about? And you were ranting on the subject of Clear Channel so I thought I would engage you about a Clear Channel subject that had something to do with this forum. So much for that idea! And I really don't give rats behind if there is a thermonuclear detonation so as to produce an EMP that takes out every radio station (and radio!) in the St. Louis area. So why do I have to listen to you rant about the sad state of St. Louis radio, including FM stations, which don't have anything to do with this forum. St. Louis isn't anywhere near where I live so I don't want to hear about it unless it has to do with AM Stereo. Go troll somewhere else. Try 80 meters. Thank you for your patience, Charles --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, n0uiheric@a... wrote: > I really don't care about KABL...I don't live near San Francisco/Oakland. CC > owns only one AM station in St. Louis, and it's dull mono. The one I'm > worried about going IBOC is not only KATZ, but also Infinity's KMOX. > > 73 and good DX from Eric > Amateur Radio Station M0UTH > Registered Monitor K0TEX, KM00N > Hazelwoodnot, MU Grid Square ME84 > DXing The World since 1891 > Turn On Qear Annel Cumnicatons! > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnmeonqearchannel > PRAY FOR AN END TO ERIC'S RANTS > "For the love of roots is the evil of all money"-2 Eric 10:37PM From KC4QLP@aol.com Wed Dec 11 20:54:48 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Dec 2002 04:54:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 1871 invoked from network); 12 Dec 2002 04:54:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Dec 2002 04:54:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r03.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.99) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Dec 2002 04:54:47 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.142.4e4de5a (4410) for ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 23:54:42 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <142.4e4de5a.2b297092@aol.com> Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 23:54:42 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Ad rates was: Poor Pitiful Me To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/11/02 11:21:28 PM Eastern Standard Time, possumhunter@netzero.net writes: << OK, I will bite on this one. In this case, I will use the ad rates for WFIS 1600 AM simply because I just happen to have a 2 year old rate card and the newest rate card on my desk right now. 2 years ago, Daytime rates were $4 for a :30 and $6 for a :60. No rates were even listed for Nighttime @25 Watts of power. Today the Daytime rates are $15 for a :30 and $20 for a :60 Nighttime rates are $7.50 for a :30 and $10 for a :60. >> How have the operating cost faired over that time period as well? {electric aka utilities,payroll,taxes etc} Did any of them go up as well? A radio station is just like any other business....it has to justify the cost of operating verses the cost of its product..aka advertising/programming. As anyone that has a brain would know is that not only does radio fall under this but TV falls under this as well. Newpapers even have their own type of ratings if you will....mainly it falls somewhere around circulation numbers and the like..and some other details which I have since forgotten from my days in the paper biz. Once again...its competition that it boils down too. If you arent good then you just arent going to be noticed in todays media...its not who you know..it is what you know and how good you are at what you do in this biz that gets you in and keeps you in. Hard pill to swallow...but those are just the facts.I make no excuses for anyone,I dont go easy on anyone either..just ask anyone that has worked and is presently working under me.I tolerate zero B.S. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From penry@nortelnetworks.com Wed Dec 11 21:19:43 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: penry@nortelnetworks.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Dec 2002 05:19:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 99537 invoked from network); 12 Dec 2002 05:19:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Dec 2002 05:19:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.78) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Dec 2002 05:19:40 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.251] by n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 12 Dec 2002 05:19:40 -0000 Date: Thu, 12 Dec 2002 05:19:40 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} O.T. - Poor Pitiful //NPR - Student Radio Stations Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 561 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wa5vhu " X-Originating-IP: 12.237.30.38 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=376233 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa5vhu Warinig - Off Topic Warinig - Off Topic Warning - FMS Not AMS Topic Go to http://www.keom.fm/ to see a high school station that covers most of the Dallas/Fort Worth Metromess with 61,000 watts and has a decent sized listening audience. They use students live during the day and sound like they are voice tracked at night with student announcers. I have read that the reason they use music of the 70's is so the students will be forced to work with music that they are not familiar with so they can work with any format when they graduate. Charles From penry@nortelnetworks.com Wed Dec 11 21:28:53 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: penry@nortelnetworks.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Dec 2002 05:28:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 22327 invoked from network); 12 Dec 2002 05:28:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Dec 2002 05:28:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.70) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Dec 2002 05:28:53 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.162] by n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 12 Dec 2002 05:28:52 -0000 Date: Thu, 12 Dec 2002 05:28:52 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: KAAM - New file Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <1039654508.125296.50618.w19@yahoogroups.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 580 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wa5vhu " X-Originating-IP: 12.237.30.38 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=376233 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa5vhu You beat me to it! I have been planning to go over to (near) their transmitter site with a diode detector and see what KAAM sounds like with no bandwidth limitations. Maybe this weekend if the weather is nice. A few years ago I was in the neighborhood and dropped by. Their engineer happened to be there so I got a tour of the transmitter shack. They had a brand new BE or Nautel as I (don't quite) recall. Well, everything was new as it was a new site location for them. Were they stereo then? I don't know as at that time I had not "Heard the Light!". Charles From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Dec 11 21:43:56 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Dec 2002 05:43:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 86186 invoked from network); 12 Dec 2002 05:14:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Dec 2002 05:14:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.79) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Dec 2002 05:14:06 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 21:14:06 -0800 To: References: <142.4e4de5a.2b297092@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Ad rates was: Poor Pitiful Me Date: Thu, 12 Dec 2002 00:13:53 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 12 Dec 2002 05:14:06.0636 (UTC) FILETIME=[4B60AEC0:01C2A19D] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.136.151.184] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: > How have the operating cost faired over that time period as well? {electric aka utilities,payroll,taxes etc} Did any of them go up as well? Yup! > > its not who you know..it is what you know and how good you are at what you do in this biz that gets you in and keeps you in. Hard pill to swallow...but those are just the facts.I make no excuses for anyone,I don't go easy on anyone either You are right, 100% right! Joe Six Pack doesn't give a damn if a radio station is owned by Clear Channel or his next door neighbor. He will listen to what he thinks is the best station broadcasting the format he likes to listen to. The ONLY reason more people are choosing to listen to 1600AM rather than the other 104 signals you can hear in our coverage area is the simple fact that we are working harder to be better than our competition is. > >..just ask anyone that has worked and is presently working under me.I tolerate zero B.S. And that is why you are still making money at a radio station that is standing on it's own feet instead of working in a run-down public station that is sucking the life out of the economy by feeding off of the taxes of the American public! Kevin From KC4QLP@aol.com Wed Dec 11 22:26:28 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Dec 2002 06:26:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 37650 invoked from network); 12 Dec 2002 04:03:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Dec 2002 04:03:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r06.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.102) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Dec 2002 04:03:47 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.9.45cf473 (4410) for ; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 23:03:36 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <9.45cf473.2b296498@aol.com> Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 23:03:36 EST Subject: WOWO 1190 AM---a trip down memory lane To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Take a look at this site folks ....it even mentions briefly WOWO running AM Stereo A selection from a decade of visits to tower and studio sites in the Northeast and beyond Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Dec 11 22:29:36 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Dec 2002 06:29:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 85604 invoked from network); 12 Dec 2002 04:15:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Dec 2002 04:15:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.204) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Dec 2002 04:15:34 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 20:15:34 -0800 To: References: <54.4543b7f.2b290392@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Opinions on NPR Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 23:15:22 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 12 Dec 2002 04:15:34.0256 (UTC) FILETIME=[1DD60700:01C2A195] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.136.151.184] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 n0uiheric@aol.com wrote: >They believe that commercial radio is "dumbed down" radio (I believe that to be the case). We are smart enough to be able to draw enough listeners and advertisers that we can stand on our own feet without being propped up with tax money. Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Dec 11 22:50:59 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Dec 2002 06:50:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 65780 invoked from network); 12 Dec 2002 04:28:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Dec 2002 04:28:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.206) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Dec 2002 04:28:46 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 20:28:46 -0800 To: References: <3DF7FD2D.2096E5E2@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Is This Equip CQUAM? Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 23:28:35 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 12 Dec 2002 04:28:46.0450 (UTC) FILETIME=[F6053D20:01C2A196] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.136.151.184] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Neal Newman wrote: > The AMS-G1 is the model of the exciter that I am using at WTTM.. with a Orban 9100B it sounds great. hell If I had $500 I would Buy it... I sent the owner of WFIS a note to buy it to convert the soon to be back up transmitter, The SX1 to stereo. Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Dec 11 23:06:54 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Dec 2002 07:06:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 42876 invoked from network); 12 Dec 2002 04:54:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Dec 2002 04:54:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.46) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Dec 2002 04:54:16 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 11 Dec 2002 20:54:16 -0800 To: References: <009d01c2a0ef$f2e7ca60$0101a8c0@pavilion> Subject: Re: {AMSF} The $5 Wonder Radio Date: Wed, 11 Dec 2002 23:54:04 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 12 Dec 2002 04:54:16.0560 (UTC) FILETIME=[86097F00:01C2A19A] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.136.151.184] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Christopher Cuff wrote: > Hee hee- This is already in the makings- I made one "AM Stereo / FM mono" radio, the other obvious problems were adding a stereo amp IC, dula vol control, etc, but it CAN be done- and cheap. OK, I went to Wally World and got a copy of this cheap, blue ugly duckling. A GE Superadio it ain't, but WOW, what AM fidelity! I am listening to CHWO 740 as I type this and it sounds great! I don't see how they made this thing and sold it for $5.00 bucks retail. Anyway, I take it that after conversion the C-QUAM board and stereo audio amp will live in the space that used to hold the speaker? Got any pics or schematics of the conversion? What C-QUAM chip are you using? This looks like a fun way to blow $30 bucks to upgrade a $5 radio! LOL Kevin From KC4QLP@aol.com Wed Dec 11 23:42:32 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Dec 2002 07:42:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 48570 invoked from network); 12 Dec 2002 07:33:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Dec 2002 07:33:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r10.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.106) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Dec 2002 07:33:21 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r10.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.b9.2b50cab4 (1320) for ; Thu, 12 Dec 2002 02:33:19 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Thu, 12 Dec 2002 02:33:18 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} The $5 Wonder Radio To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/12/02 2:08:56 AM Eastern Standard Time, possumhunter@netzero.net writes: << OK, I went to Wally World and got a copy of this cheap, blue ugly duckling. A GE Superadio it ain't, but WOW, what AM fidelity! I am listening to CHWO 740 as I type this and it sounds great! I don't see how they made this thing and sold it for $5.00 bucks retail. >> Sounds like I'm gonna have to check this radio out. Ernest...whata take a trip to Whirle World when you get home?...hehehe,nothing like killing time in a wal-mart durning Christmas break eh? lol Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From KC4QLP@aol.com Wed Dec 11 23:46:03 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Dec 2002 07:46:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 48015 invoked from network); 12 Dec 2002 06:08:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Dec 2002 06:08:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r07.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.103) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Dec 2002 06:08:09 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.a9.33832a18 (1320) for ; Thu, 12 Dec 2002 01:07:41 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Thu, 12 Dec 2002 01:07:40 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Poor Poor Pitiful Eric To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/12/02 12:37:36 AM Eastern Standard Time, penry@nortelnetworks.com writes: << St. Louis isn't anywhere near where I live so I don't want to hear about it unless it has to do with AM Stereo. Go troll somewhere else. Try 80 meters. Thank you for your patience, Charles >> > 73 and good DX from Eric > Amateur Radio Station M0UTH > Registered Monitor K0TEX, KM00N > Hazelwoodnot, MU Grid Square ME84 > DXing The World since 1891 > ! > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnmeonearchannel > PRAY FOR AN END TO ERIC'S RANTS > "For the love of roots is the evil of all money"-2 Eric 10:37PM LMAO!.......ok..who changed it? ROFLMAO! ============================ Anyhow ....ROFLMAO! ....I second the motion. There's enough craziness on 80/40/20 meters,the subject speaking and the subject matter would be well received and fit right in.Of course if anyone hears him yakkin on those bands...send out the radio police....last time I heard Technician class license holders where still restricted to CW on 80/40...and no privileges on 20 Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Dec 12 00:18:32 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Dec 2002 08:18:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 14048 invoked from network); 12 Dec 2002 08:18:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Dec 2002 08:18:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.64) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Dec 2002 08:18:31 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.191] by n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 12 Dec 2002 08:17:19 -0000 Date: Thu, 12 Dec 2002 08:17:18 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Poor Poor Pitiful Eric Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 944 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.86.128 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > And I really don't give rats behind if there is a thermonuclear > detonation so as to produce an EMP that takes out every radio > station (and radio!) in the St. Louis area. Actually, vacuum tube electronics will be fine... there was a lot of Cold War propaganda that said things to the effect of "in the event of a nuclear explosion, turn on your radio and tune it to either of the two Civil Defense triangle symbols on the dial". That was the CONELRAD system... where most radio stations would all go off the air while some would start transmitting at 640 or 1240 kHz to relay emergency information and messages from the government. (Today's NOAA Weather Radio system is actually a direct descendant of this.) There were one or two national tests of CONELRAD at the time, when *all* radio stations in the USA, except the CONELRAD transmitters, went off the air for a certain amount of time (a half-hour or hour, I believe). From ccuff@in4web.com Thu Dec 12 00:44:11 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Dec 2002 08:44:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 26876 invoked from network); 12 Dec 2002 08:44:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Dec 2002 08:44:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Dec 2002 08:44:09 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.46]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Thu, 12 Dec 2002 03:38:58 -0500 Message-ID: <00ae01c2a1b9$6f64e4a0$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: <009d01c2a0ef$f2e7ca60$0101a8c0@pavilion> Subject: Re: {AMSF} The $5 Wonder Radio Date: Thu, 12 Dec 2002 03:35:31 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 Actually, it will be amazingly easy and inexpensive to make. I have so many boards for my new radio, that I am simply cutting the decoder/amp area off, making a "Two-board" radio. (my radio board uses the TA8124, as I want the tuning indicators- mandatory for a manual radio, IMO) (plus I have 500 of the little suckers) Best part is now, I can go with an existing case- nearly anything that looks decent. Also, I can use the existing $5 radio chassis as it sits, so no alignment problems. One interesting other thing, is that this IC in this radio is a Telefunken IC, made for AM, with FM being an "oh by the way"- which is actually BETTER as you now have discrete circuits for the FM front end. Pix will be coming soon... CC ----- Original Message ----- From: Possum Hunter From ccuff@in4web.com Thu Dec 12 00:46:29 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Dec 2002 08:46:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 94719 invoked from network); 12 Dec 2002 08:46:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Dec 2002 08:46:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Dec 2002 08:46:26 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.46]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Thu, 12 Dec 2002 03:41:15 -0500 Message-ID: <00bc01c2a1b9$c16f1720$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} The $5 Wonder Radio Date: Thu, 12 Dec 2002 03:37:49 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 I know what you mean,. Bob- Walmart is a zoo these days, but I go on the way to work at 4 AM.... not bad at all! CC ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ?...hehehe,nothing like killing time in a wal-mart durning Christmas > break eh? lol > > Bob Carter From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Thu Dec 12 00:53:43 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Dec 2002 08:53:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 37248 invoked from network); 12 Dec 2002 08:53:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Dec 2002 08:53:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web41007.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.93.6) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Dec 2002 08:53:42 -0000 Message-ID: <20021212085337.11755.qmail@web41007.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.35.104] by web41007.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 12 Dec 2002 00:53:37 PST Date: Thu, 12 Dec 2002 00:53:37 -0800 (PST) Subject: Skywave stereo heard 12/11-12/12 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: <1039654508.125296.50618.w19@yahoogroups.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio Heard in stereo w/ pilots: WJR/760 WWKB/1520. All is well. Jay __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From jwelton@nautel.com Thu Dec 12 05:13:05 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jwelton@nautel.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Dec 2002 13:13:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 44267 invoked from network); 12 Dec 2002 13:13:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Dec 2002 13:13:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailserver.nautel.com) (24.222.25.85) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Dec 2002 13:13:02 -0000 Received: FROM jeff-welton BY mailserver.nautel.com ; Thu Dec 12 09:13:14 2002 -0400 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Date: Thu, 12 Dec 2002 09:10:28 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: KAAM - New file Message-ID: <3DF85280.26783.78F4F3@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: References: <1039654508.125296.50618.w19@yahoogroups.com> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.02a) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body From: "Jeff Welton" Reply-To: jwelton@nautel.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=26918678 Charles wrote: > ago I was in the neighborhood and dropped by. Their engineer > happened to be there so I got a tour of the transmitter shack. They > had a brand new BE or Nautel as I (don't quite) recall. Well, > everything was new as it was a new site location for them. Were they > stereo then? They bought a Nautel ND10 in October 1989, along with an AMPFET 1 for night and backup operation. The stereo exciter was interfaced to the AMPFET 1 in mid 1990; I don't know if it was installed on the ND10 before that or not, but the station was definitely all stereo by December 1990. If you were there anytime before mid-1995, the engineer you met was Cris Alexander, who is now the Director of Engineering for Crawford Broadcasting and has probably forgotten more about AM stereo than I know. FYI, Jeff Welton Nautel Customer Service Dept. Tel.: 1-902-823-3900 ext. 127 Fax: 1-902-823-3183 email: jwelton@nautel.com From stodd@sherbtel.net Thu Dec 12 05:35:51 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Dec 2002 13:35:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 39852 invoked from network); 12 Dec 2002 13:35:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Dec 2002 13:35:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Dec 2002 13:35:47 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.163] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 12 Dec 2002 13:33:12 -0000 Date: Thu, 12 Dec 2002 13:33:11 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Requesting radio Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <52627.148.233.19.45.1039570362.squirrel@syscom.com.mx> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 420 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amstereodude " X-Originating-IP: 65.121.7.116 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Hola, Ramon. Lo siento, pero no hay radios nuevos con AM estereo.=20=20 Estamos el tratar cambiarlo. You can find good used radios in auto=20 salvage yards and on ebay. Welcome to the group! (and those who=20 know espa=F1ol better than I do can kindly correct me if I butchered=20 the language after you've laughed your butts off) Scott Todd > I am Ramon Pena from Mexico, i need to obtain a AM stereo portable > receiver. From narkspud@hotmail.com Thu Dec 12 09:08:54 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: narkspud@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Dec 2002 17:08:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 41398 invoked from network); 12 Dec 2002 17:08:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Dec 2002 17:08:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Dec 2002 17:08:53 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.134] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 12 Dec 2002 17:08:52 -0000 Date: Thu, 12 Dec 2002 17:08:51 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: KLAC flips to "FABULOUS 570" Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <001501c2a191$44aa0c40$0301a8c0@OMNIBOOK> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 158 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "narkspud " X-Originating-IP: 67.89.146.146 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=81956306 X-Yahoo-Profile: narkspud > Any chance they will be in AM Stereo? They aren't as of 9:08 AM. Current format is "ticking alarm clock." Good beat, easy to dance to, I give it an 87. From florida_amstereo@hotmail.com Thu Dec 12 09:35:58 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: florida_amstereo@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Dec 2002 17:35:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 6793 invoked from network); 12 Dec 2002 17:35:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Dec 2002 17:35:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.37.157) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Dec 2002 17:35:56 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 12 Dec 2002 09:35:05 -0800 Received: from 199.173.225.2 by pv2fd.pav2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Thu, 12 Dec 2002 17:35:05 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: KLAC flips to "FABULOUS 570" Date: Thu, 12 Dec 2002 17:35:05 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 12 Dec 2002 17:35:05.0949 (UTC) FILETIME=[CF3178D0:01C2A204] From: "Donn Tillman" X-Originating-IP: [199.173.225.2] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83914824 Narkspud, Welcome back!, I was just deleting about 100 messages or more today and I came across several of your and wondered what had happened. Did KLAC swap frequencies?; it seems I read someone about a frequency swap in the L.A. area and the music station would most likely be stereo; I will try to find that message; it seems to me it was posted by Richard (last name escapes me now), who write a radio column in California. donn in am-stereo and iboc-free st petersburg! ----Original Message Follows---- From: "narkspud " Reply-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: KLAC flips to "FABULOUS 570" Date: Thu, 12 Dec 2002 17:08:51 -0000 > Any chance they will be in AM Stereo? They aren't as of 9:08 AM. Current format is "ticking alarm clock." Good beat, easy to dance to, I give it an 87. _________________________________________________________________ The new MSN 8: advanced junk mail protection and 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail From penry@nortelnetworks.com Thu Dec 12 10:16:06 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: penry@nortelnetworks.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Dec 2002 18:16:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 58155 invoked from network); 12 Dec 2002 18:16:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Dec 2002 18:16:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO zsc3s004.nortelnetworks.com) (47.81.138.65) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Dec 2002 18:16:04 -0000 Received: from zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com (zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com [47.103.122.112]) by zsc3s004.nortelnetworks.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id gBCIG2m02259 for ; Thu, 12 Dec 2002 10:16:02 -0800 (PST) Received: from zrc2c011.us.nortel.com (zrc2c011.us.nortel.com [47.103.120.51]) by zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id gBCIGEs09950 for ; Thu, 12 Dec 2002 12:16:14 -0600 (CST) Received: by zrc2c011.us.nortel.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Thu, 12 Dec 2002 12:16:01 -0600 Message-ID: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A560797404A568A3@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: {AMSF} Poor Pitiful Me Was: Hd Radio Date: Thu, 12 Dec 2002 12:16:00 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) From: "Charles Penry" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=376233 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa5vhu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit JSG said without, wasting more than one paragraph: The pioneers of radio like Marconi, DeForrest and Armstrong are probably rolling their graves for what has happened to radio. In the short term buying 1000s of stations, firing all the staff, and fully automating them is a short lived get rich scheme that will put the whole radio industry in jepoardy. When radio fails these big boys will put new meaning into "To Enron-Ron-Ron To Enron-Ron-Ron". -------------------------------- How can Marconi, DeForrest and Armstrong be rolling their graves if they are dead? Did you leave out one important word? Please give it a rest. Do you know how many live musicians Marconi, DeForrest and Armstrong put out of business by the invention of their new modern marvel called radio? Before radio came along people actually left their homes and went out to see and hear live music in person and perhaps enjoy some dancing. Radio put a stop to much of that as people could stay at home and listen to the live broadcast in the evenings of music from the clubs. These live broadcasts had smaller and smaller live audiences as time went on and the broadcasts were eventually moved from the very large clubs to smaller studios as the clubs went out of business. Then Thomas Edison or someone invented voice tracking and pre-recorded music and that ended that. Time marches on. Are you in step? Pick up the pace... left--your left--left--right--left... What the heck does Enron-Ron-Ron have to do with AM Stereo? Charles [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From jimshelden@garfield-wa.com Thu Dec 12 10:25:44 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jimshelden@garfield-wa.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Dec 2002 18:25:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 57060 invoked from network); 12 Dec 2002 18:25:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Dec 2002 18:25:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Dec 2002 18:25:43 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.175] by n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 12 Dec 2002 18:25:43 -0000 Date: Thu, 12 Dec 2002 18:25:42 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Ian, its none of your business.... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <0a5a01c2a12f$e4335760$89f9bed8@com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2280 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Jim Shelden " X-Originating-IP: 134.121.82.119 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=73693137 X-Yahoo-Profile: jimshelden --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" wrote: > > America spends heaps of taxpayers money on space research and military > > facilities and arms - in fact as much on the military as the next seven > > countries combined. The taxpayers could equally ask why? > > It was so we could keep you from speaking Japanese after WWII when the > Australians would have been over run by the Japanese. We have a big military > so the rest of the ungrateful nations of the world didn't have to go to (etc, etc, snipped) > > Kevin I agree, this thread doesn't belong in a technical forum, but Kevin's vociferous reponse to Ian's opinion strikes me as a good example of American arrogance. Historically, our use of military expertise has never been purely alturistic. Had the Japanese successfully invaded northern Au. they would have had a vast supply of resources, and access to Indonesian oil. WW.II would have been very different!! Australians and Americans fought and died together. In Vietnam, Australians were there, until they realised the folly of that enterprise. I Know! I was there! "The rest of the ungrateful nations of the world..." ? Do you really want to stand on that opinion publicly, Kevin? And tell Ian (basically) to "shut up"? This is a big, complex political and philosopical debate that won't be solved here. However, if the original issue of Ian's post was to discuss the best use of "public" money as it relates to radio, then the record is good. I can hear the CBC, NPR, and the BBC. All of these publicly funded broadcasters are excellent. I find the news and features to be balanced and well produced. I usually tune away from NPR when some lesbians come on and start whining about how bad they've got it. However, I support this public enterprise with both my taxes, and donations, because I do not posses the wisdom to tell some people to "shut up", and those I agree with to speak. Are multiple voices and variant opinions good for a society? Should we, in common, support this philosophy, and each put up a little money to make it work? Reading through the US Constitution and Bill of Rights would be a good starting point to form an opinion. Thanks for your consideration, From narkspud@hotmail.com Thu Dec 12 11:03:45 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: narkspud@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Dec 2002 19:03:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 2616 invoked from network); 12 Dec 2002 19:03:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Dec 2002 19:03:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.78) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Dec 2002 19:03:43 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.167] by n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 12 Dec 2002 19:03:38 -0000 Date: Thu, 12 Dec 2002 19:03:36 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: KLAC flips to "FABULOUS 570" Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 384 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "narkspud " X-Originating-IP: 67.89.146.146 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=81956306 X-Yahoo-Profile: narkspud >wondered what had happened. School happened. It'll happen again. It's now the break between quarters. It's Radio Disney and ESPN Radio that are switching in January. Don't know how that'll play out stereowise, but at the moment it's status quo. Disney's in stereo on 710 and ESPN is in mono on 1110. At 11 am, KLAC's ticking clock started ticking double-time. Clever. From kfornal@cox.net Thu Dec 12 11:14:25 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kfornal@cox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Dec 2002 19:14:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 73968 invoked from network); 12 Dec 2002 19:14:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Dec 2002 19:14:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO lakemtao03.cox.net) (68.1.17.242) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Dec 2002 19:14:24 -0000 Received: from OMNIBOOK ([68.9.127.164]) by lakemtao03.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20021212191423.MLZT26808.lakemtao03.cox.net@OMNIBOOK> for ; Thu, 12 Dec 2002 14:14:23 -0500 To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} New IBOC station on 1670 Date: Thu, 12 Dec 2002 14:13:52 -0500 Message-ID: <000401c2a212$9f1a09b0$0301a8c0@OMNIBOOK> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2616 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 In-Reply-To: <3DEDB757.A9912C0D@skyweb.net> Importance: Normal From: "Keith Fornal" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=128541479 X-Yahoo-Profile: theradboy Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I just found this in today's Daily Digest: AM STATION APPLICATIONS FOR EXPERIMENTAL STATION GRANTED -------------------------------------------------------- MD BPEX-20021121ABK WD2XXM 136922 IBIQUITY DIGITAL CORPORATION CP FOR EXPERIMENTAL STN ON FREQ 1670KHZ, P 650 KHZ FREDERICK, MD FREDERICK, MD FILED BY IBIQUITY DIGITAL CORP. Keith Fornal Treasurer Dutch Island Lighthouse Society www.dutchislandlighthouse.org -----Original Message----- From: Neal Newman [mailto:groucho@skyweb.net] Sent: Wednesday, December 04, 2002 3:06 AM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} New IBOC station on 1670 where did you find this Info Ibiquity had Filed for 640Khz for FREDERICK MD not 650.....and tell me where you found the 1670 application? Keith Fornal wrote: > >From All Access (12/3): > > "iBIQUITY has applied to the FCC for another experimental license to > test IBOC digital radio on AM. Already testing on 650 AM in FREDERICK, > MD, the company is looking to use 1670 AM as well on a fulltime basis." > > What havoc with this cause WTTM 1680? > > Keith Fornal > Treasurer > Dutch Island Lighthouse Society > www.dutchislandlighthouse.org > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ADVERTISEMENT Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From kfornal@cox.net Thu Dec 12 11:18:13 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kfornal@cox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Dec 2002 19:18:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 33907 invoked from network); 12 Dec 2002 19:18:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Dec 2002 19:18:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO lakemtao01.cox.net) (68.1.17.244) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Dec 2002 19:18:11 -0000 Received: from OMNIBOOK ([68.9.127.164]) by lakemtao01.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20021212191811.MPXU4411.lakemtao01.cox.net@OMNIBOOK> for ; Thu, 12 Dec 2002 14:18:11 -0500 To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} New IBOC station on 1670 Date: Thu, 12 Dec 2002 14:17:50 -0500 Message-ID: <000901c2a213$2c9d9b80$0301a8c0@OMNIBOOK> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2616 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 In-Reply-To: <000401c2a212$9f1a09b0$0301a8c0@OMNIBOOK> Importance: Normal From: "Keith Fornal" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=128541479 X-Yahoo-Profile: theradboy Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sorry about the garbled formatting. Here is a link to the webpage. http://hraunfoss.fcc.gov/edocs_public/attachmatch/DOC-229312A1.txt It is the last listing. Keith Fornal Treasurer Dutch Island Lighthouse Society www.dutchislandlighthouse.org -----Original Message----- From: Keith Fornal [mailto:kfornal@cox.net] Sent: Thursday, December 12, 2002 2:14 PM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: {AMSF} New IBOC station on 1670 I just found this in today's Daily Digest: AM STATION APPLICATIONS FOR EXPERIMENTAL STATION GRANTED -------------------------------------------------------- MD BPEX-20021121ABK WD2XXM 136922 IBIQUITY DIGITAL CORPORATION CP FOR EXPERIMENTAL STN ON FREQ 1670KHZ, P 650 KHZ FREDERICK, MD FREDERICK, MD FILED BY IBIQUITY DIGITAL CORP. Keith Fornal Treasurer Dutch Island Lighthouse Society www.dutchislandlighthouse.org -----Original Message----- From: Neal Newman [mailto:groucho@skyweb.net] Sent: Wednesday, December 04, 2002 3:06 AM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} New IBOC station on 1670 where did you find this Info Ibiquity had Filed for 640Khz for FREDERICK MD not 650.....and tell me where you found the 1670 application? Keith Fornal wrote: > >From All Access (12/3): > > "iBIQUITY has applied to the FCC for another experimental license to > test IBOC digital radio on AM. Already testing on 650 AM in FREDERICK, > MD, the company is looking to use 1670 AM as well on a fulltime basis." > > What havoc with this cause WTTM 1680? > > Keith Fornal > Treasurer > Dutch Island Lighthouse Society > www.dutchislandlighthouse.org > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ADVERTISEMENT Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Dec 12 11:58:48 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Dec 2002 19:58:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 40570 invoked from network); 12 Dec 2002 19:58:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Dec 2002 19:58:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r03.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.99) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Dec 2002 19:58:47 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.14f.18ad12dc (3310) for ; Thu, 12 Dec 2002 14:58:39 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <14f.18ad12dc.2b2a446f@aol.com> Date: Thu, 12 Dec 2002 14:58:39 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} New IBOC station on 1670 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit http://hraunfoss.fcc.gov/edocs_public/attachmatch/DOC-229312A1.txt AM STATION APPLICATIONS FOR EXPERIMENTAL STATION GRANTED MD BPEX-20021121ABK WD2XXM 136922 IBIQUITY DIGITAL CORPORATION CP FOR EXPERIMENTAL STN ON FREQ 1670KHZ, P650 KHZ FREDERICK, MD FREDERICK, MD FILED BY IBIQUITY DIGITAL CORP. fcc ================================================ Yep!...this just came down the FCC digest this afternoon. Looks like fireworks are gonna fly now over at WTTM. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From narkspud@hotmail.com Thu Dec 12 12:13:26 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: narkspud@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Dec 2002 20:13:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 63739 invoked from network); 12 Dec 2002 20:13:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Dec 2002 20:13:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.75) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Dec 2002 20:13:24 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.175] by n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 12 Dec 2002 20:13:20 -0000 Date: Thu, 12 Dec 2002 20:13:19 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: KLAC flips to "FABULOUS 570" Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 110 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "narkspud " X-Originating-IP: 67.89.146.146 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=81956306 X-Yahoo-Profile: narkspud Right now, Rod Stewart is LIVE on Fabulous 570 croaking out "These Foolish Things" in AM mono. Ah well. . . From kfornal@cox.net Thu Dec 12 12:49:36 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kfornal@cox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Dec 2002 20:49:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 85538 invoked from network); 12 Dec 2002 20:49:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Dec 2002 20:49:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO lakemtao02.cox.net) (68.1.17.243) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Dec 2002 20:49:35 -0000 Received: from OMNIBOOK ([68.9.127.164]) by lakemtao02.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20021212204935.FQQM2203.lakemtao02.cox.net@OMNIBOOK> for ; Thu, 12 Dec 2002 15:49:35 -0500 To: Subject: New Experimental Station on 1680 Date: Thu, 12 Dec 2002 15:49:13 -0500 Message-ID: <001101c2a21f$f14d5c20$0301a8c0@OMNIBOOK> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2616 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Importance: Normal From: "Keith Fornal" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=128541479 X-Yahoo-Profile: theradboy Remember Neal, don't shoot the messenger! FCC Daily Digest 12/12/02: AM STATION APPLICATIONS FOR EXPERIMENTAL STATION ACCEPTED FOR FILING -------------------------------------------------------------------- BLEX-20021129AAN WS2XTR 1680 KHZ STAR-H CORPORATION EVERGREEN HILLS, VA LICENSE TO COVER EXPERIMENTAL STATION http://hraunfoss.fcc.gov/edocs_public/attachmatch/DOC-229224A1.txt Keith Fornal Treasurer Dutch Island Lighthouse Society www.dutchislandlighthouse.org From penry@nortelnetworks.com Thu Dec 12 14:22:52 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: penry@nortelnetworks.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Dec 2002 22:22:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 18511 invoked from network); 12 Dec 2002 22:22:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Dec 2002 22:22:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO zsc3s004.nortelnetworks.com) (47.81.138.65) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Dec 2002 22:22:50 -0000 Received: from zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com (zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com [47.103.122.112]) by zsc3s004.nortelnetworks.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id gBCMMnm11374 for ; Thu, 12 Dec 2002 14:22:49 -0800 (PST) Received: from zrc2c011.us.nortel.com (zrc2c011.us.nortel.com [47.103.120.51]) by zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id gBCMN1s14461 for ; Thu, 12 Dec 2002 16:23:01 -0600 (CST) Received: by zrc2c011.us.nortel.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Thu, 12 Dec 2002 16:22:48 -0600 Message-ID: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A560797404A8DDA9@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: {AMSF}AM Stereo Poor AM Stereo Pitiful AM Stereo Me AM Stere o WasAM Stereo : AM Stereo Hd AM Stereo RadioAM Stereo Date: Thu, 12 Dec 2002 16:22:38 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) From: "Charles Penry" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=376233 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa5vhu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit -----Original Message----- From: n0uiheric@aol.com [mailto:n0uiheric@aol.com] Sent: Wednesday, December 11, 2002 12:49 AM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM Stereo Poor AM Stereo Pitiful AM Stereo Me AM Stereo Was AM Stereo: AM Stereo Hd AM Stereo Radio AM Stereo And AM Stereo another AM Stereo thing. The AM Stereo station AM Stereo I AM Stereo work AM Stereo for AM Stereo doesn't AM Stereo have AM Stereo much AM Stereo control AM Stereo from AM Stereo NPR AM Stereo; AM Stereo AM Stereo most AM Stereo of AM Stereo the AM Stereo programming AM Stereo is AM Stereo live AM Stereo and AM Stereo local AM Stereo. AM Stereo On AM Stereo a AM Stereo daily AM Stereo basis AM Stereo, AM Stereo only AM Stereo selected AM Stereo AM Stereo NPR AM Stereo voice AM Stereo - AM Stereo overs AM Stereo are AM Stereo used AM Stereo in AM Stereo the AM Stereo newscasts AM Stereo, AM Stereo and AM Stereo only AM Stereo two AM Stereo NPR AM Stereo programs AM Stereo are AM Stereo AM Stereo aired AM Stereo weekly AM Stereo ("AM Stereo Piano AM Stereo Jazz AM Stereo " AM Stereo and AM Stereo " AM Stereo Jazz AM Stereo Profiles AM Stereo "). AM Stereo PRI AM Stereo provides AM Stereo the AM Stereo station AM Stereo AM Stereo with AM Stereo " AM Stereo Echoes AM Stereo " AM Stereo (AM Stereo the AM Stereo only AM Stereo break AM Stereo from AM Stereo 24 AM Stereo hours AM Stereo of AM Stereo mainstream AM Stereo Jazz AM Stereo), AM Stereo " AM Stereo Riverwalk AM Stereo AM Stereo Jazz AM Stereo " AM Stereo (AM Stereo from AM Stereo the AM Stereo Riverwalk AM Stereo on AM Stereo the AM Stereo Landing AM Stereo in AM Stereo San AM Stereo Antonio AM Stereo), AM Stereo while AM Stereo WBEZ AM Stereo provides AM Stereo AM Stereo the AM Stereo station AM Stereo with AM Stereo " AM Stereo Jazz AM Stereo from AM Stereo Lincoln AM Stereo Center AM Stereo " AM Stereo and AM Stereo the AM Stereo program AM Stereo that AM Stereo we AM Stereo use AM Stereo as AM Stereo AM Stereo filler AM Stereo on AM Stereo overnights AM Stereo, AM Stereo " AM Stereo Jazz AM Stereo with AM Stereo Bob AM Stereo Parlocha AM Stereo ". AM Stereo AM Stereo The AM Stereo control AM Stereo at AM Stereo my AM Stereo station AM Stereo comes AM Stereo from AM Stereo the AM Stereo Board AM Stereo of AM Stereo Trustees AM Stereo of AM Stereo the AM Stereo university AM Stereo AM Stereo that AM Stereo owns AM Stereo the AM Stereo station AM Stereo, AM Stereo not AM Stereo from AM Stereo NPR AM Stereo. AM Stereo And AM Stereo it's AM Stereo the AM Stereo only AM Stereo non AM Stereo - AM Stereo union AM Stereo NPR AM Stereo member AM Stereo AM Stereo station AM Stereo in AM Stereo the AM Stereo St AM Stereo. AM Stereo Louis AM Stereo market AM Stereo; AM Stereo KWMU AM Stereo 90 AM Stereo. AM Stereo 7 AM Stereo is AM Stereo affiliated AM Stereo with AM Stereo AFTRA AM Stereo. AM Stereo AM Stereo AM Stereo 73 AM Stereo and AM Stereo good AM Stereo DX AM Stereo from AM Stereo Eric AM Stereo AM Stereo Amateur AM Stereo Radio AM Stereo Station AM Stereo N0UIH AM Stereo AM Stereo Registered AM Stereo Monitor AM Stereo KDX0STL AM Stereo, AM Stereo KMO0CN AM Stereo AM Stereo Hazelwood AM Stereo, AM Stereo MO AM Stereo Grid AM Stereo Square AM Stereo EM48 AM Stereo AM Stereo DXing AM Stereo The AM Stereo World AM Stereo since AM Stereo 1981 AM Stereo AM Stereo Turn AM Stereo Off AM Stereo Clear AM Stereo Channel AM Stereo Communications AM Stereo! AM Stereo AM Stereo http AM Stereo:// AM Stereo groups AM Stereo. AM Stereo yahoo AM Stereo. AM Stereo com AM Stereo / AM Stereo group AM Stereo / AM Stereo turnoffclearchannel AM Stereo AM Stereo PRAY AM Stereo FOR AM Stereo AN AM Stereo END AM Stereo TO AM Stereo COMMERCIAL AM Stereo RADIO AM Stereo DEREGULATION AM Stereo AM Stereo " AM Stereo For AM Stereo the AM Stereo love AM Stereo of AM Stereo money AM Stereo is AM Stereo the AM Stereo root AM Stereo of AM Stereo all AM Stereo evil AM Stereo "- AM Stereo 1 AM Stereo Timothy AM Stereo 6 AM Stereo: AM Stereo 10 AM Stereo [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From groucho@skyweb.net Thu Dec 12 16:26:29 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Dec 2002 00:26:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 86381 invoked from network); 13 Dec 2002 00:26:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Dec 2002 00:26:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Dec 2002 00:26:27 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gBD0WFaN039666 for ; Thu, 12 Dec 2002 19:32:16 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DF92833.F21ED626@skyweb.net> Date: Thu, 12 Dec 2002 19:22:11 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} New IBOC station on 1670 References: <14f.18ad12dc.2b2a446f@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 already sent my boss a letter about this.. we will see.. Even though Frederick is out of my contour. My listeners down that way will be yelling. tried a lookup to see how much power this station will be running and Found Nothing... anyone have any Ideas... Neal KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: > http://hraunfoss.fcc.gov/edocs_public/attachmatch/DOC-229312A1.txt > > AM STATION APPLICATIONS FOR EXPERIMENTAL STATION GRANTED > > MD BPEX-20021121ABK WD2XXM 136922 > IBIQUITY DIGITAL CORPORATION > CP FOR EXPERIMENTAL STN ON FREQ 1670KHZ, > P650 KHZ FREDERICK, MD > FREDERICK, MD > FILED BY IBIQUITY DIGITAL CORP. > > fcc > ================================================ > > Yep!...this just came down the FCC digest this afternoon. Looks like > fireworks are gonna fly now over at WTTM. > > Bob Carter > Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group > > WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 > Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 > > Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering > services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. > e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net > Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC > WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC > WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC > Ray Communications Radio Network > > voice contact-252-335-0856 > fax 1-209-254-8978 > _______________________________________________________ > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From groucho@skyweb.net Thu Dec 12 16:30:50 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Dec 2002 00:30:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 32877 invoked from network); 13 Dec 2002 00:30:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Dec 2002 00:30:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Dec 2002 00:30:49 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gBD0abaN044711 for ; Thu, 12 Dec 2002 19:36:38 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DF92937.F131A0B7@skyweb.net> Date: Thu, 12 Dec 2002 19:26:31 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} New Experimental Station on 1680 References: <001101c2a21f$f14d5c20$0301a8c0@OMNIBOOK> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Keith I already know about that one Its ok.. its daytime only.. Its not an IBOC station. and its well outside of my protected area... its a test station for a New antenna Design by Star-H and Kintronix. its Not a problem Unless they start testing at night. what's going to blow my Cork is the 1670 test station with its IBOC right on 1680. Neal Keith Fornal wrote: > Remember Neal, don't shoot the messenger! > > FCC Daily Digest 12/12/02: > > AM STATION APPLICATIONS FOR EXPERIMENTAL STATION ACCEPTED FOR FILING > -------------------------------------------------------------------- > BLEX-20021129AAN > WS2XTR > 1680 KHZ > STAR-H CORPORATION > EVERGREEN HILLS, VA > > LICENSE TO COVER EXPERIMENTAL STATION > > http://hraunfoss.fcc.gov/edocs_public/attachmatch/DOC-229224A1.txt > > Keith Fornal > Treasurer > Dutch Island Lighthouse Society > www.dutchislandlighthouse.org > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From amfmdx@fastq.com Thu Dec 12 17:30:06 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Dec 2002 01:30:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 4257 invoked from network); 13 Dec 2002 01:30:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Dec 2002 01:30:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Dec 2002 01:30:03 -0000 Received: from fastq ([208.187.57.36]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gBD1U2v34891 for ; Thu, 12 Dec 2002 18:30:02 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <000801c2a247$234fb840$2439bbd0@com> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Ian, its none of your business.... Date: Thu, 12 Dec 2002 18:27:22 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > I agree, this thread doesn't belong in a technical forum, but > Kevin's vociferous reponse to Ian's opinion strikes me as a good > example of American arrogance. Yep, I *AM* arrogant when it comes to America. I am an American first, and a citizen of the world 2nd. I think that the world owes us something because everytime they do stupid things, they come to us and ask us to save their butts. Americans have died to save France and Europe a lot of times. Because we put our money where our mouths are they aren't running around with swastikas and goosestepping. We pulled their butts out of Vietnam too. > Had the Japanese > successfully invaded northern Au. they would have had a vast supply > of resources, and access to Indonesian oil. So what? If we weren't there Ian and Australia would be eating sushi three times a day and washing it down with sake. > "The rest of the ungrateful nations of the world..." ? Do you really > want to stand on that opinion publicly, Kevin? And tell Ian > (basically) to "shut up"? Not a problem doing it my friend. I like you spent time in the military in places I didn't want to be to protect people from enemies that would have caused them irreparable harm. Been there, done that. Reading through Article 1 Sec. 8 tells us that funding for NPR is not in there. Kevin From amfmdx@fastq.com Thu Dec 12 17:30:30 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Dec 2002 01:30:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 73180 invoked from network); 13 Dec 2002 01:30:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Dec 2002 01:30:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Dec 2002 01:30:30 -0000 Received: from fastq ([208.187.57.36]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gBD1UQv34914; Thu, 12 Dec 2002 18:30:26 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Date: Thu, 12 Dec 2002 18:30:26 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <000701c2a247$31a6fc00$2439bbd0@com> To: "JNR" Cc: Subject: Re: {AMSF} O.T. Rant on NPR & Religious frequency hogs MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla JNR wrote on 12/11/02 11:45 pm: >That's 3 more relgious=20 >non-comms than we have up=20 >here. Now I'm worried for=20 >60% Catholic Rhode Island. If=20 >WGBH-FM loses its=20 >grandfathered status from=20 >the Great Blue Hill (98kW), it=20 >will be 50kW, which means=20 >unless another school puts=20 >on a station, it could mean=20 >religion or NPR around 89.7. > >If there are any of you=20 >frequency hogs out there:=20 >DO NOT COME TO RHODE=20 >ISLAND! WE WERE THE 1ST=20 >TO DECLARE OUR=20 >INDEPENDENCE AND THE LAST=20 >TO SIGN THE CONSTITUTION=20 >BECAUSE WE ARE AGAINST >CENTRALIZATION AND FOR=20 >INDEPENDENT THINKING. WE=20 >WANT OUR NON-COMM FMS=20 >LEFT ALONE AND OUR=20 >RELIGION AND NPR ON=20 >CRIPPLED AMS! 5kW AT 1590=20 >OWNED BY A LOCAL IS A FINE=20 >PLACE FOR PREACHING. 1kW=20 >ON A GRAVEYARDER 40 MILES=20 >AWAY IS GOOD FOR NPR.=20=20 >10kW ON 1290 IS NOT! > >To all Boston University=20 >WBUR-FM SNOBS: GET WRNI=20 >OFF THE AIR! CHANGE IT BACK=20 >TO WICE! MAKE IT AN URBAN=20 >STATION! WHILE YOU'RE AT=20 >IT: WXNI USED TO BE LIVE &=20 >LOCAL WERI! REMEMBER???=20=20 >WRNI USED TO SUCK WHEN=20 >IT WAS WRCP, BUT AT LEAST=20 >IT WAS LOCAL! YOU DO NOT=20 >HAVE A LEGITIMATE=20 >OVER-THE-AIR >COLLEGE RADIO STATION!=20=20 >LET THE KIDS ON WBUR-FM.=20 >MAKE WBUR (AM) AGAIN=20 >WOCB! THE CAPE NEEDS IT!=20 >YOU ARE THE Mc-WAL-MART=20 >OF THE NCE SET! LEAVE! > >To summarize: NPR is NOT=20 >sacred. Look how they=20 >lobbied to KILL LPFM in 1978!=20=20 >They deserve the fate of=20 >the HMS "Gaspee." In 1772,=20 >the HMS Gaspee was chasing=20 >the sloop Hannah. The=20 >Hannah was shallower than=20 >the Gaspee and turned to=20 >quickly for the Gaspee. The=20 >Gaspee ran aground in=20 >Warwick, R.I.. Providence=20 >locals heard of this, rowed=20 >out to the Gaspee, and=20 >burned it. 1=BD years BEFORE=20 >the Boston Tea Party. > >That felt good! > >If I could change the rules,=20 >N.C.E. F.M.s would not be=20 >allowed to be part of a=20 >network, nor operate at=20 >more than 6kW unless, as an >educational institution, had=20 >students operating the=20 >station (with exception for=20 >engineering departments),=20 >or as a community station.=20 >Independent churches could=20 >operate there, but at no=20 >greater or lesser power than=20 >100 Watts, or sufficient=20 >power to cover the city of=20 >license, whichever is less. No=20 >chain broadcasting on=20 >non-commercial F.M.s. > >This is not to make anyone=20 >mad. I am mad...at the way=20 >radio is McDonaldized and=20 >Wal-Mart-ized and how like a=20 >cancer it has spread to the >non-commercial band. I=20 >wonder, if I have chuldren=20 >they will be able to find the=20 >same little college stations in=20 >the low end of the dial, or if=20 >they will all merge into three >megastations and all be NPR=20 >or religion like the rest of=20 >the country. College radio is=20 >as magical to me as hearing=20 >WOWO or WHAS in their=20 >heydays. Now, I wonder. Will=20 >we fall too? > >Jay Rogers's Radio Talk can=20 >be heard at this time on this=20 >same station. Now stay=20 >tuned for Glenn Hauser's=20 >World Of Radio coming up=20 >next. From the Blackstone=20 >Valley to Block Island, and all=20 >points inbetween, this is WRI=20 >AM and FM in Providence. > >_____________________________ >_____________________ Do you=20 >Yahoo!? >Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful.=20 >Affordable. Sign up now.=20 >http://mailplus.yahoo.com > >Access The AM STEREO=20 >Forum on the web at:=20 >http://groups.yahoo.com/gr >oup/amstereoforum=20 > >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is=20 >subject to=20 >http://docs.yahoo.com/info >/terms/=20 > From amfmdx@fastq.com Thu Dec 12 17:30:31 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Dec 2002 01:30:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 67258 invoked from network); 13 Dec 2002 01:30:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Dec 2002 01:30:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Dec 2002 01:30:31 -0000 Received: from fastq ([208.187.57.36]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gBD1UTv34917; Thu, 12 Dec 2002 18:30:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Date: Thu, 12 Dec 2002 18:30:29 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <000d01c2a247$33e02320$2439bbd0@com> To: "JNR" Cc: Subject: Re: {AMSF} O.T. Rant on NPR & Religious frequency hogs MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla >IT: WXNI USED TO BE LIVE &=20 >LOCAL WERI! REMEMBER??? Being from Westerly at one time, yeah I remember. WERI was run by th=EB Urs= o family. They sucked, they were local though. They did carry HSFB and loca= l news. As bad as they were, they are a million times better than WXNI. I miss RI sometimes. Kevin From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Thu Dec 12 17:40:46 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Dec 2002 01:40:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 84000 invoked from network); 13 Dec 2002 01:40:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Dec 2002 01:40:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf09bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.149) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Dec 2002 01:40:46 -0000 Received: from juan ([68.153.65.151]) by imf09bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.19 201-253-122-122-119-20020516) with SMTP id <20021213014234.KULF8009.imf09bis.bellsouth.net@juan> for ; Thu, 12 Dec 2002 20:42:34 -0500 Message-ID: <005301c2a248$a6c923e0$af78fea9@juan> To: References: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A560797404A560FF@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} O.T. Rant on NPR & The Dallas Cowboys Date: Thu, 12 Dec 2002 20:40:43 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit How about those 'Canes ! Hello Fiesta Bowl ! Hello Another National Championship ! Ahhhh I feel better... Juan Gualda aka Juan O'Reilly aka John Waters Hurricanes Fan and Radio Program Director / Music Director of WGYL-FM in the Fort Pierce, Florida market, an AC station NOT all Christmas music. ----- Original Message ----- From: Charles Penry To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, December 11, 2002 5:15 PM Subject: RE: {AMSF} O.T. Rant on NPR & The Dallas Cowboys How 'bout those Cowboys! End of rant. -----Original Message----- From: JNR [mailto:a1asurfradio@yahoo.com] Sent: Wednesday, December 11, 2002 3:54 PM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} O.T. Rant on NPR & Religious frequency hogs That's 3 more NFL football teams than we have up here. Now I'm worried for the 60% Catholic Rhode Island football viewers. If WGBH-FM loses its grandfathered football broadcast status from the Great Blue Hill (98kW), it will be gardening shows only, which means unless another school puts on the football games, it could mean handyman shows or prosaic around 89.7. If there are any of you frequency hogs out there: COME TO RHODE ISLAND! WE WERE THE 1ST TO MAKE HAM SANDWICHES BECAUSE WE ARE NOT JEWISH OR MUSLIM. WE WANT OUR MTV.... [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Dec 12 18:52:44 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Dec 2002 02:52:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 71984 invoked from network); 13 Dec 2002 02:52:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Dec 2002 02:52:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m09.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.164) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Dec 2002 02:52:42 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m09.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.36.33be66fc (30960) for ; Thu, 12 Dec 2002 21:52:36 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <36.33be66fc.2b2aa574@aol.com> Date: Thu, 12 Dec 2002 21:52:36 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF}AM Stereo Poor AM Stereo Pitiful AM Stereo Me AM Stere o WasAM Ste... To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/12/02 5:23:57 PM Eastern Standard Time, penry@nortelnetworks.com writes: << Stereo money AM Stereo is AM Stereo the AM Stereo root AM Stereo of AM Stereo all AM Stereo evil AM Stereo "- AM Stereo 1 AM Stereo Timothy AM Stereo 6 AM Stereo: AM Stereo 10 AM Stereo >> LMAO!....Someone grab Penry quick..I think his needle is stuck..LMAO! Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Dec 12 18:58:37 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Dec 2002 02:58:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 41223 invoked from network); 13 Dec 2002 02:58:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Dec 2002 02:58:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m06.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.161) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Dec 2002 02:58:37 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.1e.47be893 (30960) for ; Thu, 12 Dec 2002 21:58:31 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1e.47be893.2b2aa6d7@aol.com> Date: Thu, 12 Dec 2002 21:58:31 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} New IBOC station on 1670 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/12/02 7:26:23 PM Eastern Standard Time, groucho@skyweb.net writes: << already sent my boss a letter about this.. we will see.. Even though Frederick is out of my contour. My listeners down that way will be yelling. tried a lookup to see how much power this station will be running and Found Nothing... anyone have any Ideas... Neal >> I dont know anything offical..but if I had to guess how much power to expect them to run...probably in the neighborhood of 50 to 100 watts Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From amfmdx@fastq.com Thu Dec 12 19:10:30 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Dec 2002 03:10:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 70646 invoked from network); 13 Dec 2002 03:10:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Dec 2002 03:10:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Dec 2002 03:10:30 -0000 Received: from fastq (d125-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.157]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gBD3ASv37278 for ; Thu, 12 Dec 2002 20:10:29 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <004901c2a255$2b0409c0$2439bbd0@com> To: References: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A560797404A8DDA9@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF}AM Stereo Poor AM Stereo Pitiful AM Stereo Me AM Stereo WasAM Stereo : AM Stereo Hd AM Stereo RadioAM Stereo Date: Thu, 12 Dec 2002 20:10:17 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > And AM Stereo another AM Stereo thing. The AM Stereo station AM Stereo I AM > Stereo work AM Stereo for AM Stereo doesn't AM Stereo have AM Stereo much AM > Stereo control AM Stereo from AM Stereo NPR AM Stereo; AM Stereo Charles my friend, You have way too much time on your hands. Being raised as a boy in the Metroplex, I can see what drove you to this absurdity. Actually I did get a laugh out of it but I am sure that Eric didn't... :PPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPP Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Dec 12 19:49:38 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: possumhunter@netzero.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Dec 2002 03:49:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 91136 invoked from network); 13 Dec 2002 03:49:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Dec 2002 03:49:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rly-ip04.mx.aol.com) (64.12.138.8) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Dec 2002 03:49:37 -0000 Received: from logs-wb.proxy.aol.com (logs-wb.proxy.aol.com [205.188.192.135]) by rly-ip04.mx.aol.com (v89.10) with ESMTP id RELAYIN2-1212224622; Thu, 12 Dec 2002 22:46:22 -0500 Received: from ibm (AC838538.ipt.aol.com [172.131.133.56]) by logs-wb.proxy.aol.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with SMTP id gBD3lBC208787 for ; Thu, 12 Dec 2002 22:47:12 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <00e601c2a25a$4d0932c0$388583ac@aoldsl.net> To: Subject: Fw: [Turn Off Clear Channel] Under Investigation? Date: Thu, 12 Dec 2002 22:46:59 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Apparently-From: DodgeRamTrucker@aol.com From: "Possum Hunter" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 The Media Mammoth that Stole the Airwaves Jeff Perlstein, December 4, 2002 Can you name a Texas-based multinational company that is facing a Department of Justice investigation, lawsuits for inappropriate business practices, a flurry of criticism in the mainstream press, and a bill in congress to curb its impact on the industry? Did you say Enron? Try again. This 800 lb. Texas gorilla has spent $30 billion since 1996 to become the world's largest radio broadcaster, concert promoter, and billboard advertising firm. It's a major player in American television and Spanish-language broadcasting. Clear Channel Communications of San Antonio may not be a household name yet, but in less than six years it has rocketed to a place alongside NBC and Gannett as one of the largest media companies in the United States. The mega-company has gained a reputation for its ugly hardball tactics. Clear Channel has played a leading role in destroying media diversity in the United States. And yes, it is the same media company that allegedly "blacklisted" certain songs following September 11, including Cat Stevens' Peace Train and John Lennon's Imagine [Clear Channel sent a list of 150 "questionable" songs to their affiliates suggesting they not be played]. "It's not just how big and powerful they are but how they do business, the arm twisting," Mike Jacobs, former independent label owner and manager of Blink 182, told Eric Boehlert who has been covering Clear Channel's shady business practices for Salon.com. Media Mobster Before passage of the 1996 Telecommunications Act, a company could not own more than 40 radio stations in the entire country. With the Act's sweeping relaxation of ownership limits, Clear Channel now owns approximately 1225 radio stations in 300 cities and dominates the audience share in 100 of 112 major markets. Its closest competitors -- CBS and ABC, media giants in their own right -- own only one-fifth as many stations. Accusations abound that Clear Channel illegally uses its dominance in radio to help secure control of the nation's live entertainment business. Several cities, including Denver and Cincinnati, have charged radio station managers with threatening to withdraw certain music from rotation if the artists do not perform at a Clear Channel venue. This tactic, known as "negative synergy," has allegedly been used to pressure record companies into buying radio-advertising spots in cities where they want to book concert venues. With this anti-competitive tactic of leveraging airplay against concert performances, Clear Channel has firmly solidified its hold in both areas. As a result, Clear Channel now owns, operates, or exclusively books the vast majority of amphitheaters, arenas, and clubs in the country. It also controls the most powerful promoters, who last year sold 27 million concert tickets. That is 23 million more than the closest competitor. While this may be good for Clear Channel owners and investors, a lot more is at stake here than the buying and selling of stocks. "Profit maximization has never been the sole point of U.S. communications policy," writes Douglas Gomery in a March 2002 white paper for the Economic Policy Institute. "Under the Communications Act of 1934, the Federal Communications Commission (FCC) is charged with allocating spectrum space to maximize 'the public interest'...and to encourage a diversity of voices so as to promote a vibrant democracy." Far from fostering a diversity of voices, Clear Channel's monopolistic practices are accelerating the homogenization of our airwaves. The company syndicates both Rush Limbaugh and Dr. Laura to hundreds of stations nationwide, shuts out independent artists who can't afford to go through high-priced middlemen, and is responsible for taking the practice of voice tracking to new heights (or depths, depending on your perspective). Voice tracking is the practice of creating brief, computer-assisted voice segments that attempt to fool the listener into thinking that a program is locally produced, when in fact the same content is being broadcast to upwards of 75 stations nationwide from a central site. So you have one overworked 'radio personality' recording the phrases, "Hello Topeka!" "Hi Springfield!" "How you feeling Oakland?" all day long. This consolidation is clearly counter to the Federal Communications Commission's (FCC) mandate to encourage media diversity. Now, however, the long-standing concerns of media activists are being echoed by the mainstream press, the courts regulatory agencies, and even by members of Congress. Mega-Monopoly Clear Channel is currently facing antitrust lawsuits from plaintiffs around the country, ranging from an Illinois concert goer concerned with soaring ticket prices to the nation's largest Latino-owned radio company. Alleging monopolistic behavior, however, is not the same as convincing a judge to move towards a trial. But last summer a small Denver-area concert promoter, called Nobody in Particular Presents, sued the media behemoth for antitrust violations, claiming that it "has used its size and clout to coerce artists... to use Clear Channel to promote their concerts or else risk losing airplay." The judge agreed to hear the case, and ruled that the evidence is "sufficient to make a case of monopolization and attempted monopolization under Section 2 of the Sherman Act." As a result, the halo of silence surrounding the company's anti- competitive practices may finally be shattered. Plaintiff's lawyers will be able to compel music industry insiders to testify regarding the often-repeated, off-the-record allegations that Clear Channel's radio stations have illegally rewarded or punished artists based on their dealings with the company's concert division. "The political terrain is really shifting," says Robert McChesney, author and professor of communications at the University of Illinois, Urbana-Champaign. "There's an opportunity for discussion about radio that would have been unthinkable six months or a year ago," he told Randy Dotinga in Wirednews.com. Irregular Regulators Despite a clear history of promoting consolidation, the Department of Justice and the FCC, the federal regulatory agencies charged with safeguarding the public interest in business and media respectively, are finally showing a spark of interest in holding Clear Channel accountable. While the Justice Department is spearheading its own "top secret" investigation of Clear Channel, the FCC has been mostly dragging its heels, with three notable exceptions: · After receiving numerous complaints from across the country, the FCC has announced it is investigating the claims by an advertiser in Chillicothe, Ohio, that Clear Channel is circumventing existing ownership limits by operating stations through shell companies in a practice known as "parking" or "warehousing" stations. Clear Channel has sold off stations to alleged front companies, which allow Clear Channel to continue operating the properties while also providing an easy way to buy back the stations, should the FCC slacken ownership limits in the future. · In Charlottesville, Virginia, the FCC has preliminarily denied a station transfer to Clear Channel and has scheduled a formal hearing to examine the situation. Big deal? Yes, because the FCC has not taken such an action since 1969 -- which, more than anything else, speaks to the FCC's lack of policy enforcement over the last thirty years and is one of the reasons why we have arrived at the current situation. · In Monterey, California the FCC has held up another Clear Channel transfer request at the urging of Congressman Sam Farr (D- Calif.). Congress Catches on to "Shady Practices" Fortunately, Farr is not alone in expressing concern over Clear Channel's shady business practices. He is joined by a handful of other vocal members of Congress, including Senator Russ Feingold of Wisconsin, who has proposed a bill to deal with the issue. Known for his work on campaign finance reform, Feingold launched the Competition in Radio and Concert Industries Act last June, saying: "We need to repair the damage that has been done through this anti-competitive behavior..." Without naming names, the Act takes direct aim at some of Clear Channel's business practices, such as the warehousing of stations for future purchase, "negative synergy" with concert promotions, and pay- to-play schemes between station owners and record companies. Consumer groups, minority-owned radio companies, labor unions, and independent artists have all thrown their support behind the Feingold bill. And not a moment too soon. The growing momentum to hold Clear Channel accountable for its excesses comes as the FCC -- chaired by Michael Powell, son of Secretary of State Colin Powell -- announced that it will review the last remaining protections on media diversity. If Powell's FCC follows his previous positions, this ruling could sweep away the very last remaining protections related to media ownership. Powell has publicly stated that he has "no idea what is meant by the public interest" and prefers to let the market resolve such thorny questions. FCC's Proposed Rules on Ownership On September 12 the FCC announced a proposed Rulemaking on Ownership. Dubbed the Omnibus Ownership Ruling by consumer advocates, it could be the final nail in the coffin of media diversity and the public interest. Under Powell's direction, and with a huge push from mega- media's deep-pocketed lobbyists, the Omnibus Ruling lumps together a number of disparate proposals bound by the same core principle of eliminating the last public interest protections in media ownership. Proposals include a call to end the ban on newspaper-TV cross- ownership in the same city, eliminate the rule limiting companies to eight radio stations in one listening area, and end the limit on national television broadcast ownership of 35% of the potential national audience. The Omnibus Ruling has newspaper moguls salivating at the possibility of amplifying reach through radio and TV without seriously investing in increased or better reporting -- they will broadcast their print stories. Radio giants are poised to swallow up the last remaining independent stations and smaller holdings. Cable companies and the networks are eager to merge so they can further downsize staff, increase audience, and maximize their already huge profits. The Campaign Clear Channel epitomizes the disasterous consequences of hyper- consolidation that resulted from the 1996 Telecom Act; a disasterthat activists say would further accelerate if the FCC implements the Omnibus ruling. They also see the Ruling as an opportunity to spot light the need for democratizing the media. The current rumblings in Washington, D.C. regarding Clear Channel are the direct result of many years of citizen agitation and organizing from the grassroots that continue to grow. Unionists and their allies have rallied in Seattle, Cleveland, and other cities. Community coalitions that hold Clear Channel accountable for the negative effects of over consolidation have emerged in Detroit and San Francisco. Letter writing campaigns have urged elected officials to reign in the company and make policy changes to protect the public interest. Several websites and hundreds of listserves have been providing information about Clear Channel's excesses and communities' resistance -- most notably clearchannelsucks.org and stopclearchannel.com. What's been sorely lacking is strategic coordination of these efforts to amplify their impact and link up with broader media-policy initiatives. A dynamic national coalition launched just such a campaign at the recent Reclaim the Media Conference, in Seattle during the weekend of September 12-15, 2002. Nationally recognized organizations such as FAIR, the Democratic Media Legal Project, Media Alliance, and Prometheus Radio Project began mapping out steps to mobilize public pressure around Clear Channel, the Feingold bill, the Omnibus Ruling, and beyond. Jeff Perlstein is the executive director of Media Alliance. A version of this article orginally appeared in Media File, media-alliance.org, the Alliance's newsletter. For more on corporate crimes and misdemeanors, see Corpwatch.org. To discuss this Article and other issues please visit the Guerrilla News Forum From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Dec 12 19:59:12 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Dec 2002 03:59:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 23128 invoked from network); 13 Dec 2002 03:59:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Dec 2002 03:59:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.122) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Dec 2002 03:59:12 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 12 Dec 2002 19:59:12 -0800 To: References: <14f.18ad12dc.2b2a446f@aol.com> <3DF92833.F21ED626@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} New IBOC station on 1670 Date: Thu, 12 Dec 2002 22:58:52 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 13 Dec 2002 03:59:12.0186 (UTC) FILETIME=[FEE3C9A0:01C2A25B] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.131.133.56] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Neal Newman wrote: > already sent my boss a letter about this.. Hmm, now wouldn't be a good test of IBOC for all of the stations on 1660, 1670, and 1680 to all do "DX Tests" on the same nights IBiquity has their legal pirate station on the air? What if some area hams accidentally allow their MARS enabled radios to get on 1670 and be modulated by a white noise generator? Possum From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Dec 12 20:21:52 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Dec 2002 04:21:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 22290 invoked from network); 13 Dec 2002 04:21:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Dec 2002 04:21:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d10.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.42) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Dec 2002 04:21:51 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d10.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.21.28a0c2fc (30960) for ; Thu, 12 Dec 2002 23:21:43 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <21.28a0c2fc.2b2aba57@aol.com> Date: Thu, 12 Dec 2002 23:21:43 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} New IBOC station on 1670 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/12/02 11:00:53 PM Eastern Standard Time, possumhunter@netzero.net writes: << Neal Newman wrote: > already sent my boss a letter about this.. Hmm, now wouldn't be a good test of IBOC for all of the stations on 1660, 1670, and 1680 to all do "DX Tests" on the same nights IBiquity has their legal pirate station on the air? What if some area hams accidentally allow their MARS enabled radios to get on 1670 and be modulated by a white noise generator? Possum >> Well I would almost guarantee that 99% of the stations on 1650,1660,1670,1680 and 1690 are not aware of this "experimental" station coming on the air. I think the only stations that will get hammered bad is WTTM and.....uhm ....what about that station on 1660 out of....uhm..is it NY now or are they still in NJ?What kind of listener base do they have in that area...or do they even get into that area? Well as long as we are on this topic of IBOC...an update. The question I had posted about receivers and test that were taken at iBiquity....well I posted a generalized question stating the same thing on another broadcast list.....and the answers I got today were: {scroll down...long answer!} Ok..I know your sitting on the edge of your seats..waiting for me to tell you what I was told today and I know your still waiting patience growing thin yet? still waiting I see ...... Well so am I! ....and everyone else wanting to know. A question was asked about a stations ERP towards a certain area....hey it was answered no time flat.The receiver data question.....it was like it was never posted and asked on that forum. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Thu Dec 12 20:37:02 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Dec 2002 04:37:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 51714 invoked from network); 13 Dec 2002 04:37:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Dec 2002 04:37:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14206.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.173.70) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Dec 2002 04:37:01 -0000 Message-ID: <20021213043701.96940.qmail@web14206.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [65.221.47.68] by web14206.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 12 Dec 2002 20:37:01 PST Date: Thu, 12 Dec 2002 20:37:01 -0800 (PST) Subject: KLAC 570 Mono to Stereo? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio Anybody got a contact we can talk to about putting stereo in at KLAC as they've flipped to "FABULOUS 570" ..."Right now, Rod Stewart is LIVE on Fabulous 570" __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Dec 12 21:22:07 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Dec 2002 05:22:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 94155 invoked from network); 13 Dec 2002 05:22:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Dec 2002 05:22:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.204) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Dec 2002 05:22:07 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 12 Dec 2002 21:22:07 -0800 To: Subject: Attention HAMs! Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 00:21:54 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 13 Dec 2002 05:22:07.0140 (UTC) FILETIME=[94318640:01C2A267] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.131.133.56] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Anybody want to have a famous fist? I need WFIS in Morse code around 15 or 20 WPM in a 1000Hz tone to make a new nighttime legal ID and a QSL promo. I think the Morse code ID will make it easier for DXers to ID the station during high noise conditions. Sorry, but since this is a promotions idea of a poorly paid engineer instead of the nearly non-existent promotions department, no pay is involved, but you will get a big "THANK YOU" and perhaps a bumper sticker, magnet, pen, coverage map,or anything else I can snatch out of the promotions box when nobody is looking. If you want to be the one, just email me a .mp3 or a .wav to dodgeramtrucker@aol.com, or upload it to the group files section and I will get it. Thanks, Kevin From groucho@skyweb.net Thu Dec 12 21:35:33 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Dec 2002 05:35:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 65687 invoked from network); 13 Dec 2002 05:35:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Dec 2002 05:35:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Dec 2002 05:35:33 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gBD5fKaN038139 for ; Fri, 13 Dec 2002 00:41:21 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DF9709A.A5843598@skyweb.net> Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 00:31:06 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Attention HAMs! References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 hey Kevin what Else you want in that CW message? and that's what I'll give Ya Neal Possum Hunter wrote: > Anybody want to have a famous fist? > I need WFIS in Morse code around 15 or 20 WPM in a 1000Hz tone to make a new > nighttime legal ID and a QSL promo. I think the Morse code ID will make it > easier for DXers to ID the station during high noise conditions. > > Sorry, but since this is a promotions idea of a poorly paid engineer instead > of the nearly non-existent promotions department, no pay is involved, but > you will get a big "THANK YOU" and perhaps a bumper sticker, magnet, pen, > coverage map,or anything else I can snatch out of the promotions box when > nobody is looking. > > If you want to be the one, just email me a .mp3 or a .wav to > dodgeramtrucker@aol.com, or upload it to the group files section and I will > get it. > > Thanks, > Kevin > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Dec 12 22:02:28 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: possumhunter@netzero.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Dec 2002 06:02:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 87120 invoked from network); 13 Dec 2002 06:02:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Dec 2002 06:02:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rly-ip04.mx.aol.com) (64.12.138.8) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Dec 2002 06:02:28 -0000 Received: from logs-wb.proxy.aol.com (logs-wb.proxy.aol.com [205.188.192.135]) by rly-ip04.mx.aol.com (v89.10) with ESMTP id RELAYIN2-1213005938; Fri, 13 Dec 2002 00:59:38 -0500 Received: from ibm (AC838538.ipt.aol.com [172.131.133.56]) by logs-wb.proxy.aol.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with SMTP id gBD60sC346988 for ; Fri, 13 Dec 2002 01:00:54 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <017201c2a26c$f95d3c80$388583ac@aoldsl.net> To: References: <3DF9709A.A5843598@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Attention HAMs! Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 01:00:42 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Apparently-From: DodgeRamTrucker@aol.com From: "Possum Hunter" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Neal Newman wrote: > hey Kevin what Else you want in that CW message? and that's what I'll give Ya Nope, just wanted the call letters. I want to have the call letters in CW then the legal ID in voice. I am also going to do a :30 wil the call letters in CW at the start of it. Just thought it would make it less trouble to pick the call letters ouf of the QRM with them in CW. Come to think of it, a promo for the morning show in Hindi would be cool! After we kill the Christmas music at 11:59PM on Christmas day, the Contempory music is going to be on Sunday only, and we are returning to Oldies! Thanks, Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Dec 12 22:03:50 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Dec 2002 06:03:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 51277 invoked from network); 13 Dec 2002 06:03:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Dec 2002 06:03:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.41) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Dec 2002 06:03:50 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 12 Dec 2002 22:03:50 -0800 To: Subject: Digital Disaster Part 2 Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 01:03:38 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 13 Dec 2002 06:03:50.0695 (UTC) FILETIME=[686DB370:01C2A26D] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.131.133.56] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 The next time I get half of a chance, I am going to cook up some new and impoved "Digital Disaster" promos using REAL honest to goodness IBOC hash from WOR. Anybody want me to post them to the files section? Kevin From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Dec 12 22:50:24 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Dec 2002 06:50:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 41808 invoked from network); 13 Dec 2002 06:50:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Dec 2002 06:50:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r03.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.99) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Dec 2002 06:50:24 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.125.1b4370a3 (4328) for ; Fri, 13 Dec 2002 01:50:17 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <125.1b4370a3.2b2add29@aol.com> Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 01:50:17 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Ad rates was: Poor Pitiful Me To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/13/02 1:02:59 AM Eastern Standard Time, n0uiheric@aol.com writes: << Correction, Bob...in commercial radio, it's not WHAT you know, it's WHO you know. And if you don't know anyone in upper management in commercial radio, you might just have to forget about a career in radio. This I also learned the hard way. >> All I can say is that you must have had one bad experience Eric. I've been in radio for 16 years now and when I got in...I didnt know anyone from Adam. I jumped in...learned the ropes and proved myself to others my worth....something I continue to do to this very day...everyday you have to stay one step ahead.Its like that everywhere you go...not just radio. Hey..I'm sorry you got a bad rap...maybe things would have turned out better for you in a different market...but everything happens for a reason. We'll agree to disagree. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Dec 12 22:51:13 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Dec 2002 06:51:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 53953 invoked from network); 13 Dec 2002 06:51:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Dec 2002 06:51:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.86) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Dec 2002 06:51:13 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 12 Dec 2002 22:51:13 -0800 To: Subject: AM Stereo on the CHEAP Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 01:51:00 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 13 Dec 2002 06:51:13.0070 (UTC) FILETIME=[069DB4E0:01C2A274] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.131.133.56] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Using an Alfredo as a C-QUAM generator, What is the best method you know of to amplify the composite signal up to the 5 Volts Peak-To-Peak required to drive a Harris SX1A's Stereo Generator Input? Kevin From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Dec 12 23:01:13 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Dec 2002 07:01:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 29197 invoked from network); 13 Dec 2002 07:01:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Dec 2002 07:01:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r02.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.98) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Dec 2002 07:01:13 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.1b8.ab5d5a5 (4328) for ; Fri, 13 Dec 2002 02:01:06 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1b8.ab5d5a5.2b2adfb2@aol.com> Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 02:01:06 EST Subject: holiday music on AM Stereo To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp From now until Christams Eve...I'm running some Christmas songs between the midnight and 2am ET time block during some of the longer commerical breaks during "For The People w/Chuck Harder" here.Getting everything "fine tuned" for our 48 hour Christmas music marathon starting midnight of the 24th....which is just a short time away! BTW..you can listen to WGAI online in {{stereo}} to at http://wgai.dyn.ee:8000/listen.pls this is MP3 streaming audio. BTW ...the bitrate is a little low...a draw back of being on a dial-up..sorry wish it where better .but with a little bit of EQing..you can easily kill that "ringing" that comes with lower bitrate streams. In the meantime..even though we're all talk...commericals/promos are in full stereo! Happy Holidays! from the Christmas spririt of the Albemarle! Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From dav259@csiro.au Fri Dec 13 00:36:50 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Dec 2002 08:36:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 96123 invoked from network); 13 Dec 2002 08:36:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Dec 2002 08:36:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Dec 2002 08:36:49 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gBD8amP10132 for ; Fri, 13 Dec 2002 19:36:48 +1100 (EST) Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 19:36:48 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: amstereoforum Subject: Beancounters are bad for radio Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public There is plenty of truth in what Eric has argued. Radio owners may appear to be the winners - but the general listening public are the losers. There was a time the FCC - did what our ABA did. If you wanted to buy a radio licence you would have to demonstrate to the national regulator that you were a "fit and proper" person/organisation and make a pledge to provide a "service" to the market in which you were going to operate in. Now when a new licence is up for grabs in Oz all you have to do is provide evidence that you haven't got a criminal record and have heaps of money. They are literally sold to the highest bidder - and often here to overseas interests like Clear Channel, the UK Daily Mail Group, and Irish Independent Newspapers. Up till about 1980 all Melbourne stations were locally owned. And all by people who cared about and had a passion for radio. It's all very well to say start with a little country outpost ... and grow. But big corporations come in and make offers that struggling stations can't refuse - or simply decimate the stugglers with the economies of scale that ruthless organisations are able to do. I'll say this till the cows come in. Anyone can open a newspaper. That industry is going the way of TV and radio - which is a shame - but it IS infinite. The media spectrum is finite. And thus needs to be regulated. If radio in Australia had been more locally owned by people who cared in 1985 I'm sure AMS would have had much of a better chance at success. It's still doing well in Melbourne because enough people in the local industry DO care. But more and more everyday it's being taken over by beancounters who ONLY worry about the bottom line. It really doesn't matter how enthusiastic the announcers, technicians, and so many others are if all "the boss" thinks about is profit. We'll end up with "Radio McDonalds". Things aren't too grim in Oz - and alot of the thanks for that is due to our publicly funded ABC. Our 3LO has just topped the ratings - and that says alot. It's not supposed to rate well - just provide a very good local service. But it's really making the commercial outfits have a good hard look at themselves. The "commercials" pay their "stars" heaps to keep them profitable. Yet "our ABC" (that's what we call it) pays its announcers award rates and because their staff are so committed and professional they have climbed to the top of the slippery pole. There's nothing wrong with public radio in Oz! And UK Dave - what have you got to say about things in the Motherland? Hey - better think about tea - where the hell is the bloody wok? Sayonara for now Davo Downunder From ccuff@in4web.com Fri Dec 13 00:38:57 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Dec 2002 08:38:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 78559 invoked from network); 13 Dec 2002 08:38:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Dec 2002 08:38:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Dec 2002 08:38:56 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.37]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Fri, 13 Dec 2002 03:33:47 -0500 Message-ID: <004101c2a281$df664e60$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM Stereo on the CHEAP Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 03:30:19 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 Darwin made a dandy 5 watt amp!- KT- Is the schematic in the "files" section yet? Chris ----- Original Message ----- From: Possum Hunter To: Sent: Friday, December 13, 2002 1:51 AM Subject: {AMSF} AM Stereo on the CHEAP > Using an Alfredo as a C-QUAM generator, What is the best method you know of > to amplify the composite signal up to the 5 Volts Peak-To-Peak required to > drive a Harris SX1A's Stereo Generator Input? > > Kevin > > From steveking@wgnradio.com Fri Dec 13 01:51:50 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: steveking@wgnradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Dec 2002 09:51:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 73844 invoked from network); 13 Dec 2002 09:51:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Dec 2002 09:51:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.78) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Dec 2002 09:51:49 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.154] by n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Dec 2002 09:51:49 -0000 Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 09:51:45 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Vinyl Rules! Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 7326 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgnhim " X-Originating-IP: 172.129.194.35 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71806925 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgnhim I know this is a bit off topic, but since most of the members of this group are, obviously, concerned with hearing a product that gives them the best sound, I thought you might find this article interesting. Steve King/WGN-AM, Chicago From the Nashville Tennessean: http://www.tennessean.com/business/archives/02/12/ 26344127.shtml?Element_ID&344127 'Vinyl Rules!' at Nashville's United Record Pressing=20 =20 By RICHARD LAWSON Staff Writer A banner hanging in United Record Pressing's shipping room gives a peek at what the Nashville company hopes for its future: ''Vinyl Rules! Pure analog, anti-digital revolution.'' Today's youth, with their compact discs and MP3 players, may know little of their lower-tech predecessors unless their baby boomer parents pulled the black discs from a dusty bin somewhere and spun them on a turntable. For United Record, phonograph records certainly haven't faded into extinction. It presses thousands of them each day and has seen business grow in the face of the digital recording age. Cris Ashworth, United Record's owner, knows, however, that vinyl probably won't dominate the way it did before cassettes and compact discs took hold, or usurp the growing use of digital downloads from the Internet. ''But there's a market there,'' he said. Since 1999, when he bought the operation on Chestnut Street near Greer Stadium, Ashworth has increased United Record's revenues from $1.4 million to $4 million by expanding the business to include the pressing of 12-inch, 33.3-rpm records. The number of employees has increased from 10 to 40. Vinyl sales plummeted in the 1980s. After bottoming out, demand has been steady for LPs =97 slang for 12-inch, ''long playing'' albums =97 over the past decade. Last year, 2.3 million LPs were shipped to U.S. markets, an increase of 3.7% over the 2.2 million shipped in 2000, according to the Recording Industry Association of America. That's a drop in the bucket compared with the 882 million CDs shipped. Distribution of vinyl 45-rpm singles has dipped dramatically over the past decade, from 19.8 million shipped in 1992 to 5.5 million last year, RIAA figures show. The 2001 sales showed promise with a 19% increase over the previous year. Singles and LPs were the only categories with sales increases for 2001. Ashworth is banking on demand hanging on and becoming a strong niche in the business. He also sees it as a little historic preservation. ''This business is as important to Nashville history as the RCA studio on Music Row,'' Ashworth said, referring to RCA Studio B, where artists from Elvis Presley to Roy Orbison to Dolly Parton recorded. ''I'm determined to keep it alive from that perspective.'' United Record has pressed promotional or dance-club records for Britney Spears, Christina Aguilera, N'Sync as well as numerous hip-hop and reggae artists. The medium is popular in techno, a genre of futuristic sounds played in dance clubs as part of a show where deejays spin records on multiple turntables to mix music on the spot. Country music has scaled back its use of vinyl. ''It's definitely becoming a smaller part of what we do,'' said Cary Ryan, director of production for RCA Label Group in Nashville. ''We don't really manufacture them for retail sale.'' Ryan said most of the vinyl from RCA goes to jukebox vendors, a lot of which still use 45s =97 the 7-inch discs with the large hole in the middle. Instead of vinyl records numbering in the tens of thousands, just a few thousand will be manufactured, Ryan said. 'A warmth' to analog sound Little about record pressing involves high technology. The basic pressing process has been around for about 100 years. Music captured on tape or recorded onto a computer is cut into a lacquer disc, with the grooves containing the sound information. The disc is sprayed with silver and dipped into a solution that plates it with nickel. The master plate goes to the pressing machines =97 and ''press'' is the operative word. Chips of vinyl are melted into a gooey ball, and a label is pushed into place. Then the puck-shaped mass is shifted to the nickel-plated master, where press exerts 150 tons of force to push the vinyl into every crevice. A new machine would be tough to come by. United Record's pressing machines were made by a Nashville company that no longer exists. The press itself has to be custom-made, and the rest of the equipment can be bought off the shelf. ''The youngest one I've got in here is probably 20 years old,'' Ashworth said. Companies have tried to use high technology to replicate low-tech vinyl's top-quality sound. Many recording professionals say digital sound, which is chopped up into the ones and zeros of computer data, pales in comparison to the continuous analog sound wave as captured on vinyl. ''Analog stuff just has a warmth to it that digital doesn't have,'' said Benny Quinn, a 26-year veteran in the business and chief mastering engineer at Masterphonics, a Music Row recording studio. Artists and recording engineers try to achieve the sound that vinyl produces, such as by running music that has been recorded digitally through an analog tape recorder. Quinn said the average person could tell the difference between a digital recording and a vinyl one if played next to each other. Analog is softer to the ear than digital, he said. ''A lot of people are mixing to analog,'' Quinn said. Sony Entertainment is pushing technology that attempts to make digital sound more like analog. 'Elvis has been good to us' United Record's history dates to the late 1940s, when RCA Victor introduced the 45 rpm record in response to Columbia Records' LP. Though in the back yard of country music, the company had Detroit's Motown Records as one of its largest customers. ''This used to be an all dedicated Motown manufacturing,'' Ashworth said. It once had many operations around the country. The company was one of several pressing operations in Nashville. ''It was extremely close-knit'' community, said Quinn, who started his career at Nashville Record Productions, a mastering operation down the street from United Record. He said the companies had common ownership. Over the years, however, United Record's owners prior to Ashworth consolidated as vinyl lost favor, leaving just the Nashville operation. Its four owners were in their 70s, and not all were in good health. They sold to Ashworth, a former corporate executive who once served as Nashville Gas Co.'s chief financial officer. At roughly the same time, nearby Dixie Record Pressing's owner James Gann was considering winding down. It pressed LPs, while United did only 45s. Ashworth merged the two. Ozell Simpkins, a former owner of United, still works with United Record and serves as chairman emeritus. Gann runs the shipping operations. United Record is one of just a handful of manufacturers in the country that press vinyl records. ''So many fewer places do that stuff that the remaining ones are busy,'' Quinn said. The 25th anniversary of Presley's death in August gave United Record a bump in a steady business for collectibles of the King's music. ''Elvis has been good to us,'' Ashworth said, noting that the company uses plates from 1979 to make the records. ''I can't complain.'' ''Our objective is to keep rockin' and rollin'.''=20 From dav259@csiro.au Fri Dec 13 03:58:03 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Dec 2002 11:58:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 7769 invoked from network); 13 Dec 2002 11:58:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Dec 2002 11:58:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Dec 2002 11:58:00 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gBDBvwP20151 for ; Fri, 13 Dec 2002 22:57:58 +1100 (EST) Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 22:57:58 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Vinyl Rules! In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public On Fri, 13 Dec 2002, wgnhim wrote: > I know this is a bit off topic, but since most of the members of this > group are, obviously, concerned with hearing a product that gives them > the best sound, I thought you might find this article interesting. > Steve King/WGN-AM, Chicago Good article Steve. There really is something about vinyl. Yes - it is softer but in a smooth sort of way - more naturally open and wide - not clipped or squashed. Pity it scratches so easily. Tandy (Radio Shack) are still selling plenty of belt drive turntables here and small speciallist record shops are starting to pop up here again. The vinyl renaissance has begun. Ian From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Dec 13 07:46:57 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Dec 2002 15:46:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 91458 invoked from network); 13 Dec 2002 15:46:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Dec 2002 15:46:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Dec 2002 15:46:56 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.184] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Dec 2002 15:46:56 -0000 Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 15:46:51 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Vinyl Rules! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3042 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 63.208.118.219 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > There really is something about vinyl. Yes - it is softer but in a > smooth sort of way - more naturally open and wide - not clipped or > squashed. The RIAA emphasis curve allows vinyl to have a kind of tonality -- for better or for worse -- that any other recording medium lacks. Because of this, the same albums were mastered using different kinds of audio processing depending on whether they ended up on vinyl, cassette, or CD; so, just as with AM vs. FM radio, it might not be the actual qualities of the medium that produce the differences you hear, but rather the type of audio processing used. Also, at least theoretically, there is no "brick wall" maximum to the level of a sound that can be reproduced by vinyl; it is simply a matter of making the groove squiggle more, to make a louder electrical impulse out of the stylus and therefore a louder sound out of your speakers. Obviously this is not limitless, but you may notice that 45 RPM singles are naturally louder than 33-1/3 RPM LPs; this is because they use more highly modulated grooves. CDs, on the other hand, have an absolute "brick wall" limit, referenced to 0 dB, above which it is impossible to increase the loudness any further without resorting to "hacking off" the tops and bottoms of the waveforms -- "brute force" digital clipping that causes a large amount of distortion, as pure sine waves are mangled into square waves. Unfortunately, this process is now almost the norm for CDs, as over the past decade record companies have been trying to make CDs sound "louder", to compete with the highly processed sound of FM radio and to drown out background noise when listening on portable CD players -- so, even Jazz and Opera CDs are now using digital clipping. Even worse, re-releases of old albums are being re-processed in this manner to increase loudness; I even have an official Abbey Road Studios remastered CD of a David Bowie album, which sounds great on the original 1971 LP, but on the 1999 CD, is digitally clipped to the point of clearly audible distortion. And modern pop recordings have gotten so bad that even without a critical ear, you can clearly hear the amount of Optimod-type compression and limiting being used, which really does make the music sound like a highly processed FM station, only with digital clipping distortion added on. And FM stations actually hate this, because their audio procesors can't make heads or tails out of this pre-processed sound and simply clamps down on the entire waveform, making these songs sound QUIETER on the air than a song that was recorded with a natural amount of dynamic range. The Optimod-type processors need a certain amount of peaks and valleys in the sound in order to do their work most effectively; otherwise, the processor can't respond and just ends up dropping the volume level to compensate (especially on Optimods, which use broadband AGC prior to the multi-band limiter, so you will still get to hear Audimax/Volumax-style "pumping"!). From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Dec 13 07:53:58 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Dec 2002 15:53:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 75159 invoked from network); 13 Dec 2002 15:53:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Dec 2002 15:53:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.89) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Dec 2002 15:53:57 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.178] by n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Dec 2002 15:53:57 -0000 Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 15:53:54 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: A reminder Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 516 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 63.208.118.219 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics All participation is welcomed here in the AM Stereo Forum, but please remember that there are better, more relevant places in which to carry on lengthy discussions about politics -- whether they be the politics of government or the politics of corporate radio. Keeping the discussions here at least tangentially related to AM Stereo will make this a more enjoyable place for all of our members. Thank you for your understanding and cooperation. Kevin Tekel kevtronics@yahoo.com Sysop of The AM Stereo Forum From groucho@skyweb.net Fri Dec 13 08:12:12 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Dec 2002 16:12:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 8199 invoked from network); 13 Dec 2002 16:12:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Dec 2002 16:12:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Dec 2002 16:12:11 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gBDGHxaN099765 for ; Fri, 13 Dec 2002 11:18:00 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DFA05DF.32DE1639@skyweb.net> Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 11:07:59 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Vinyl Rules! References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Vinyl Does rule just read below I thought it would get the platters turning again sometimes Old technology is better than the New digital stuff. Neal Breaking News In The Fight Against Audio Piracy!!! Music Industry Unveils New Piracy-Proof Format: A Black, Plastic Disc With Grooves On It Music bosses have unveiled a revolutionary new recording format that they hope will help win the war on illegal file sharing which is thought to be costing the industry millions of dollars in lost revenue. Nicknamed the 'Record', the new format takes the form of a black, vinyl disc measuring 12 inches in diameter, which must be played on a specially designed 'turntable'. "We can state with absolute certainty that no computer in the world can access the data on this disc," said spokesman Brett Campbell. "We are also confident that no-one is going to be able to produce pirate copies in this format without going to a heck of a lot of trouble. This is without doubt the best anti-piracy invention the music industry has ever seen." As part of the invention's rigorous testing process,the designers gave some discs to a group of teenage computer experts who regularly use file swapping software such as Limewire and gnutella and who admit to pirating music CDs. Despite several days of trying, none of them were able to hack into the disc's code or access any of the music files contained within it. "It's like, really big and stuff," said Doug Flamboise, one of the testers. "I couldn't get it into any of my drives. I mean, what format is it? Is it, like, from France or something?" Invention: Teenage computer hackers struggled to access the new disc. In the new format, raw audio data in the form of music is encoded by physically etching grooves onto the vinyl disc. The sound is thus translated into variations on the disc's surface in a process that industry insiders are describing as 'completely revolutionary' and 'stunningly clever.' To decode the data stored on the disc, the listener must use a special player which contains a 'needle' that runs along the grooves on the record surface, reading the indentations and transforming the movements back into audio that can be fed through loudspeakers. Even Shawn Fanning, the man who invented Napster, admits the new format will make file swapping much more difficult. "I've never seen anything like this," he told reporters. "How does it work?" Pirates: Their days are numbered. As rumours that a Taiwanese company has been secretly developing a 12 inch wide, turntable -driven, needle-based, firewire drive remain unconfirmed, it would appear that the music industry may, at last, have found the pirate-proof format it has long been searching for. From wa2fnq@optonline.net Fri Dec 13 08:35:54 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: wa2fnq@optonline.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Dec 2002 16:35:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 40255 invoked from network); 13 Dec 2002 16:35:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Dec 2002 16:35:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Dec 2002 16:35:32 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.143] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Dec 2002 16:35:27 -0000 Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 16:35:24 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Digital Disaster Part 2 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 467 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wa2fnq " X-Originating-IP: 64.236.235.240 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=60059615 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa2fnq If you post them I'll run them on my part 15 station. Maybe someone around the block will hear them. I have the current batch running now. Jerry WA2FNQ --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Possum Hunter" wrote: > The next time I get half of a chance, I am going to cook up some new and > impoved "Digital Disaster" promos using REAL honest to goodness IBOC hash > from WOR. Anybody want me to post them to the files section? > > Kevin From philipr@irac.pe.ca Fri Dec 13 09:25:54 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Dec 2002 17:25:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 64918 invoked from network); 13 Dec 2002 17:25:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Dec 2002 17:25:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Dec 2002 17:25:54 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.148] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Dec 2002 17:25:54 -0000 Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 17:25:51 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: A reminder Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 686 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking Hear hear! I echo that sentiment, in Stereo! Phil R. --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: > All participation is welcomed here in the AM Stereo Forum, but please > remember that there are better, more relevant places in which to > carry on lengthy discussions about politics -- whether they be the > politics of government or the politics of corporate radio. Keeping > the discussions here at least tangentially related to AM Stereo will > make this a more enjoyable place for all of our members. > > Thank you for your understanding and cooperation. > > Kevin Tekel > kevtronics@y... > Sysop of The AM Stereo Forum From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Dec 13 10:22:51 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Dec 2002 18:22:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 10401 invoked from network); 13 Dec 2002 18:22:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Dec 2002 18:22:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.66) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Dec 2002 18:22:50 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.166] by n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Dec 2002 18:22:50 -0000 Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 18:22:49 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: 1570 WPTW Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 567 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics Anybody know for sure if WPTW is in Stereo or not? It is mentioned in Scott Fybush's tour of Ohio transmitter sites: http://www.fybush.com/featuredsite.html """Our next stop, 20 minutes or so later, was in Piqua (say it "Pih- KWAH"), home to another AM/FM combo of some note. WPTW (1570) boasted "AM Stereo" on the sign out front, and meant it, though our noontime stop found the station doing death notices instead of music. It's a traditional small-town full service station, and it's still at it four years later (although in mono these days, I hear.)""" From amfmdx@fastq.com Fri Dec 13 10:51:05 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Dec 2002 18:51:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 45839 invoked from network); 13 Dec 2002 18:51:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Dec 2002 18:51:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Dec 2002 18:51:03 -0000 Received: from fastq ([209.63.214.247]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gBDIp2v54211 for ; Fri, 13 Dec 2002 11:51:02 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <006101c2a2d8$8eb5a5e0$f7d63fd1@com> To: Subject: $5 radio.... Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 11:50:49 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla Went to Wally World to see if I could get a $5 radio. They have none but they have a $5 headphone radio, a $10 AM/FM cassette player and a $25 CD player made by Lennoxx. Kevin "Its going to get a lot worse before it gets worse" - Lily Tomlin From possumhunter@netzero.net Fri Dec 13 12:00:25 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Dec 2002 20:00:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 30616 invoked from network); 13 Dec 2002 20:00:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Dec 2002 20:00:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.97) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Dec 2002 20:00:25 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 13 Dec 2002 12:00:25 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Vinyl Rules! Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 14:59:59 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 13 Dec 2002 20:00:25.0210 (UTC) FILETIME=[46B0DDA0:01C2A2E2] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.148.37.232] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 steveking@wgnradio.com wrote: >Many recording professionals say digital sound, which is chopped up onto the ones and zeros of computer data, pales in comparison to the continuous analog sound wave as captured on vinyl. > >''Analog stuff just has a warmth to it that digital doesn't have,'' said Benny Quinn, a 26-year veteran in the business and chief mastering engineer at Masterphonics, a Music Row recording studio. OK, Now I will agree that a direct to disk recorded LP can reproduce sound better than almost any digital format, but.... In the "Real World" of music and radio, there is no way you can tell me that sound that is analog to start with, then converted to digital and mixed then mastered in the digital domain then converted to analog and pressed to vinyl, sent to a radio station then played back on a QRK rim drive turn table with a dusty half worn out needle, then mixed into another board, then converted to digital and processed then converted back to analog in the stations audio processor, run through the C-QUAM exciter, then converted back to digital in the transmitter's PDM board to modulate the AM signal in analog then proceesed in the digital domain in the listener's AMAX radio with a Symphony chip is going to sound better on the air. Ad the dust, scratches and getting chucked on the control room desk a few times without a record shuck, and "Morning Zoo Crew" Cue burning it, how will that 45 sound compared to the music on the station's hard drive recorded in MPEG Layer 2? It won't take long for that 45 to sound like the AM station does in a thunderstorm! From groucho@skyweb.net Fri Dec 13 14:21:06 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Dec 2002 22:21:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 4953 invoked from network); 13 Dec 2002 22:21:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Dec 2002 22:21:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Dec 2002 22:21:05 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gBDMQmeV056852 for ; Fri, 13 Dec 2002 17:26:51 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DFA5C4D.40B67A39@skyweb.net> Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 17:16:45 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com" Subject: New news Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 seems there is an Engineer in the Pittsburgh area that's got a law firm sending out Docs Petition for reconsideration about IBOC.. its not what you think. I spoke with Him and will Finish my conversation with him over the weekend. he is trying to Push IBOC... not only Pushing it but that: " ALL EXPANDED BAND STATIONS SHOULD BE GIVEN IMMEDIATE AUTHORIZATION FOR NIGHT-TIME IBOC OPERATION" Looking at the list on the last few pages many of us are going to receive this package. Chris Cuff,Myself,Mike Erickson,Donn TillmanJuan seems everyone that filed a comment to the FCC is On this list. so You should Be getting yours soon. One Comment.. I was trying to explain My Concerns to this guy and he basically wondered If I had any sentences with ?? instead of Periods.... see where this is Going.... My concern is the expanded band I cannot see 1660 and 1680 both in NJ running IBOC without killing each other. Neal P.S. off to work I go wont be home Till 5 am(concert tonight) From penry@nortelnetworks.com Fri Dec 13 14:36:29 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: penry@nortelnetworks.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Dec 2002 22:36:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 36890 invoked from network); 13 Dec 2002 22:36:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Dec 2002 22:36:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO zsc3s004.nortelnetworks.com) (47.81.138.65) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Dec 2002 22:36:29 -0000 Received: from zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com (zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com [47.103.122.112]) by zsc3s004.nortelnetworks.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id gBDMaRg19955 for ; Fri, 13 Dec 2002 14:36:28 -0800 (PST) Received: from zrc2c011.us.nortel.com (zrc2c011.us.nortel.com [47.103.120.51]) by zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id gBDMaeD14235 for ; Fri, 13 Dec 2002 16:36:40 -0600 (CST) Received: by zrc2c011.us.nortel.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Fri, 13 Dec 2002 16:36:27 -0600 Message-ID: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A560797404A8E82E@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: {AMSF} New news Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 16:36:22 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) From: "Charles Penry" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=376233 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa5vhu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit This may be one of those "be careful what you ask for" situations. Let them put IBOC in a fairly clean part of the band and let's see how it trashes it! Charles -----Original Message----- From: Neal Newman [mailto:groucho@skyweb.net] Sent: Friday, December 13, 2002 4:17 PM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} New news seems there is an Engineer in the Pittsburgh area that's got a law firm sending out Docs Petition for reconsideration about IBOC.. its not what you think. I spoke with Him and will Finish my conversation with him over the weekend. he is trying to Push IBOC... not only Pushing it but that: " ALL EXPANDED BAND STATIONS SHOULD BE GIVEN IMMEDIATE AUTHORIZATION FOR NIGHT-TIME IBOC OPERATION" Looking at the list on the last few pages many of us are going to receive this package. Chris Cuff,Myself,Mike Erickson,Donn TillmanJuan seems everyone that filed a comment to the FCC is On this list. so You should Be getting yours soon. One Comment.. I was trying to explain My Concerns to this guy and he basically wondered If I had any sentences with ?? instead of Periods.... see where this is Going.... My concern is the expanded band I cannot see 1660 and 1680 both in NJ running IBOC without killing each other. Neal P.S. off to work I go wont be home Till 5 am(concert tonight) Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From n0uiheric@aol.com Fri Dec 13 14:36:48 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Dec 2002 22:36:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 37618 invoked from network); 13 Dec 2002 22:36:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Dec 2002 22:36:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d04.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.36) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Dec 2002 22:36:34 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-d04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.44.2ac3ba85 (3996) for ; Fri, 13 Dec 2002 17:36:31 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <44.2ac3ba85.2b2bbaef@aol.com> Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 17:36:31 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} New news To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih Neither would 1630 in Iowa City and 1650 in Cedar Falls, for that matter. I also won't think that 1640 in Sussex, WI can peacefully coexist with 1620 in South Bend, IN and even the proposed move of 1690 from Johnston City, IL to Berwyn, IL, either. Not even the 1620 in College Station, TX and 1630 in Fort Worth could peacefully coexist if IBOCrap was mandatory. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From ccuff@in4web.com Fri Dec 13 15:12:58 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Dec 2002 23:12:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 40179 invoked from network); 13 Dec 2002 23:12:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Dec 2002 23:12:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Dec 2002 23:12:58 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.63]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Fri, 13 Dec 2002 18:07:50 -0500 Message-ID: <002401c2a2fb$f877ffa0$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: Subject: Those "papers" came Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 18:04:19 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 I got my papers today. These papers are from a law firm representing Ibiquity and I guess the NRSC. (how the NRSC got railroaded into supporting digital on AM , I do not know) Anyway, all this crap is, is an attempt to force the FCC to approve night time iboc. There are all kinds of "test results" on adjacent channel interference.. If I can hear digital hash on a 2 khz BW car radio for 30 khz to either side of an iboc station, what are they using for testing? And why is this proposal only addressing the rescinding of NIGHT broadcasts? If anyone that also received this document wants to privately email me, feel free. Lets hash out some plans. CC From ccuff@in4web.com Fri Dec 13 15:18:07 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Dec 2002 23:18:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 24072 invoked from network); 13 Dec 2002 23:18:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Dec 2002 23:18:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Dec 2002 23:18:05 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.63]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Fri, 13 Dec 2002 18:12:57 -0500 Message-ID: <003701c2a2fc$b0101ee0$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: Re: $5 radio Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 18:09:27 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 I picked up 50 of these radios today..... The transforming has begun. (Mesa Kevin- I will send you one when I dig out the H) Chris From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Dec 13 15:19:27 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Dec 2002 23:19:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 47235 invoked from network); 13 Dec 2002 23:19:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Dec 2002 23:19:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Dec 2002 23:19:27 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-113.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.113]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gBDNJNOd013155 for ; Fri, 13 Dec 2002 17:19:24 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <002701a8ea3c$32d3d940$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <004101c2a281$df664e60$0101a8c0@pavilion> Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM Stereo on the CHEAP Date: Fri, 4 Jan 1980 01:43:56 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Except that you DON'T want to use the composite output. You'll want to tap the signal going INTO the last NE602 chip. That's the constant amplitude L-R signal. Scott ----- Original Message ----- From: "Christopher Cuff" > Darwin made a dandy 5 watt amp!- KT- Is the schematic in the "files" section > yet? > Chris > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Possum Hunter > > Using an Alfredo as a C-QUAM generator, What is the best method you know > of > > to amplify the composite signal up to the 5 Volts Peak-To-Peak required to > > drive a Harris SX1A's Stereo Generator Input? > > From KC4QLP@aol.com Fri Dec 13 15:24:38 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Dec 2002 23:24:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 36374 invoked from network); 13 Dec 2002 23:24:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Dec 2002 23:24:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r07.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.103) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Dec 2002 23:24:37 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.3a.3112ed5a (16781) for ; Fri, 13 Dec 2002 18:24:26 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <3a.3112ed5a.2b2bc62a@aol.com> Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 18:24:26 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} New news To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/13/02 5:22:21 PM Eastern Standard Time, groucho@skyweb.net writes: << seems there is an Engineer in the Pittsburgh area that's got a law firm sending out Docs Petition for reconsideration about IBOC.. its not what you think. I spoke with Him and will Finish my conversation with him over the weekend. he is trying to Push IBOC... not only Pushing it but that: " ALL EXPANDED BAND STATIONS SHOULD BE GIVEN IMMEDIATE AUTHORIZATION FOR NIGHT-TIME IBOC OPERATION" Looking at the list on the last few pages many of us are going to receive this package. Chris Cuff,Myself,Mike Erickson,Donn TillmanJuan seems everyone that filed a comment to the FCC is On this list. so You should Be getting yours soon. One Comment.. I was trying to explain My Concerns to this guy and he basically wondered If I had any sentences with ?? instead of Periods.... see where this is Going.... My concern is the expanded band I cannot see 1660 and 1680 both in NJ running IBOC without killing each other. Neal P.S. off to work I go wont be home Till 5 am(concert tonight) >> Got my copy of it today.Seems like only half of the story has been told on this doc. Nothing to mention the recent interference of the night-time test. Its also goes to state based on ceratain data that certain stations would be able to operate IBOC at night with full power digital carriers...other stations would only be able to operate a digital carrier on just one sideband and ceratain stations would have to operate with their digital carriers at -6db ...at night. If this is pushed through given the history of daytimers and stations that dont shift patterns and drop to night power like they are suppose to..what makes them think they will operate their digital carriers correctly as well. I find it interesting to note something on page 3 of this doc and I quote: "However,as digital receivers will be few in number during the first several years after the adoption of a digital standard,and as AM stations must continue to generate revenue to survive during those early years,any digital system must function without disrupting the continued operation of the legacy analog system and the installed fleet of analog receivers.Regrettably,both computer models and field test have shown that nighttime use of the AM IBOc system can,in certain instances,lead to intolerable levels of interference to the on going operation of legacy analog broadcasting for first adjacent channel stations.Such digital-into-analog interference is an obstacle to blanket adoption of the AM IBOc system." end quote. This was pretty much proven..at least to me during the recent nighttime test.Each station blanketing each other with digital noise in the analog form on all radios...even on a radio that only has a band pass of 5khz! for each broadcast channel. Ceratain markets I beleive would even have troubles in daylight hours...nighttime most certainly. If this passes through and is adopted fully for daytime and nighttime use...ceratainly money and pork barrel projects take on a great new meaning. Whats everyone elses take on the lastest and "greatest"? Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Fri Dec 13 15:29:30 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Dec 2002 23:29:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 54871 invoked from network); 13 Dec 2002 23:29:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Dec 2002 23:29:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14201.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.143) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Dec 2002 23:29:29 -0000 Message-ID: <20021213232929.5747.qmail@web14201.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [65.221.47.68] by web14201.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 13 Dec 2002 15:29:29 PST Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 15:29:29 -0800 (PST) Subject: Tell Your Friend that we're here to help To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio Charles- you probably haven't been on the AM Stereo list long enough to know what a decent group of people we are when it comes to helping people on the technical end upgrading to AM Stereo. We have already assisted in three stereo conversions (that I'm aware of), and will gladly participate in more. Tell your 'friend' to visit us over here, and who knows, maybe he'll end-up with low cost to free stereo AM equipment from our group allowing him to have his 'cake and eat it too' - he can save his money for his live talent and we can help him out with the stereo equipment? "Live assist" would probably be an option too. Charlie wrote: "What do you think my friend should do? Voice tracked AM Stereo or live AM Mono?" __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From KC4QLP@aol.com Fri Dec 13 15:33:36 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Dec 2002 23:33:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 54444 invoked from network); 13 Dec 2002 23:33:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Dec 2002 23:33:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r06.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.102) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Dec 2002 23:33:35 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.11.4953a1d (16781) for ; Fri, 13 Dec 2002 18:33:27 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <11.4953a1d.2b2bc846@aol.com> Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 18:33:26 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} New news To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/13/02 5:38:03 PM Eastern Standard Time, penry@nortelnetworks.com writes: << One Comment.. I was trying to explain My Concerns to this guy and he basically wondered If I had any sentences with ?? instead of Periods.... see where this is Going.... My concern is the expanded band I cannot see 1660 and 1680 both in NJ running IBOC without killing each other. Neal P.S. off to work I go wont be home Till 5 am(concert tonight) >> Its all part of the procedure game Neal...get the comments..do what you want with them and go from there.Lets hope someone is actually listening to the entirety of everyones statements and back them up with real world tests with real world equipment.You can pretty much do almost anything in a lab and get the results you want....notice I said "-almost-" ...you can also get a software program to tell you what you want it to tell you....as it relates to computers...computers and software is only as smart,crooked or true to give true information as the person programming them. Also..my concern isnt just for the expanded band...but its for the entire BCB in general. How was the concert Neal? Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From jsgil@hal-pc.org Fri Dec 13 15:47:21 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Dec 2002 23:47:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 87141 invoked from network); 13 Dec 2002 23:47:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Dec 2002 23:47:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.67) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Dec 2002 23:47:21 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.137] by n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Dec 2002 23:47:20 -0000 Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 23:47:20 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Poor Pitiful Me Was: Hd Radio Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A560797404A8E43F@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 459 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.13 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Charles Penry" > > What do you think my friend should do? Voice tracked AM Stereo or live AM > Mono? > > > Thank you for your suggestions, > > Charles > As much as it is the goal to get evry station to convert to AM Stereo I don't know if I would go as far as to lay off the local talent in order to get stereo especially in this day and age of the big boys mass elimination of local talent. JSG From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Dec 13 15:56:00 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Dec 2002 23:55:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 91563 invoked from network); 13 Dec 2002 23:55:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Dec 2002 23:55:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Dec 2002 23:55:59 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-113.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.113]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gBDNtuOd022364 for ; Fri, 13 Dec 2002 17:55:57 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <00a801a8ea41$4df69e60$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <18e.13228ad7.2b2bb740@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Poor Pitiful Me Was: Hd Radio Date: Fri, 4 Jan 1980 02:20:29 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude You're living in a dream world, dude. KUOM has been trying to pry the funds loose to get their ATU redesigned so they can resume stereo. They haven't been able to do so yet. A lot of other educational institutions are likely in the same boat. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: What's more: colleges do have money in > their budgets to convert AM stations to Stereo. > From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Dec 13 15:57:10 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Dec 2002 23:57:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 32196 invoked from network); 13 Dec 2002 23:57:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Dec 2002 23:57:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Dec 2002 23:57:09 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-113.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.113]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gBDNv6Od022655 for ; Fri, 13 Dec 2002 17:57:07 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <00ae01a8ea41$77899fc0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <3DFA5C4D.40B67A39@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} New news Date: Fri, 4 Jan 1980 02:21:39 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Rotsa ruck with the mail service in my area. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Neal Newman" > Chris Cuff,Myself,Mike Erickson,Donn TillmanJuan seems everyone that > filed a comment to the FCC is On this list. so You should Be getting > yours soon. From jsgil@hal-pc.org Fri Dec 13 15:59:51 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Dec 2002 23:59:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 27232 invoked from network); 13 Dec 2002 23:59:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Dec 2002 23:59:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Dec 2002 23:59:51 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.188] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Dec 2002 23:59:50 -0000 Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 23:59:48 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Vinyl Rules! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1595 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.13 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: > > And FM stations actually hate this, because their audio procesors > can't make heads or tails out of this pre-processed sound and simply > clamps down on the entire waveform, making these songs sound QUIETER > on the air than a song that was recorded with a natural amount of > dynamic range. The Optimod-type processors need a certain amount of > peaks and valleys in the sound in order to do their work most > effectively; otherwise, the processor can't respond and just ends up > dropping the volume level to compensate (especially on Optimods, > which use broadband AGC prior to the multi-band limiter, so you will > still get to hear Audimax/Volumax-style "pumping"!). With computers and digital audio processsing it may be better in the long run to do as much audio processing in the computer to each individual song so that each one will receive the right ammount of processing. These overprocessed CDs may eventually make it impossible to have the signal processed with an Optimod. Now this is more time consuming to listen to each song and decide what kind of processing is needed but this is probably the easiest approach to this problem. If a good setup can be configured then it might be possible to completely eliminate the on the fly Optimod type processing. All music is stored preprocessed in mp3 or ogg on the computer and is controlled via a computer interface by thr DJ. Several stations could pool together to do the preprocessing to divide the workload. JSG From jsgil@hal-pc.org Fri Dec 13 16:08:25 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Dec 2002 00:08:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 47286 invoked from network); 14 Dec 2002 00:08:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Dec 2002 00:08:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Dec 2002 00:08:24 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.129] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Dec 2002 00:08:24 -0000 Date: Sat, 14 Dec 2002 00:08:21 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: $5 radio.... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <006101c2a2d8$8eb5a5e0$f7d63fd1@com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 840 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.13 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" wrote: > Went to Wally World to see if I could get a $5 radio. They have none but > they have a $5 headphone radio, a $10 AM/FM cassette player and a $25 CD > player made by Lennoxx. > > Kevin > > "Its going to get a lot worse before it > gets worse" - Lily Tomlin I went to wally world last nignt and they had several so I picked one up. The headphones are CRUMMY. They sound like that they have a peak in the mid bass that gives it a cheap sound. The radio itself sounds pretty good with a fair amount of HF response on AM. Plug in a good set of headphones to get the full sound of what it can produce. The low bass is weak so they must have a high pass filter. The IF section has only 2 IF filters allowing a wider bandwidth than others with more cans. JSG From KC4QLP@aol.com Fri Dec 13 16:14:54 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Dec 2002 00:14:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 28616 invoked from network); 14 Dec 2002 00:14:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Dec 2002 00:14:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r04.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.100) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Dec 2002 00:14:53 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.185.137b15a3 (16781) for ; Fri, 13 Dec 2002 19:14:51 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <185.137b15a3.2b2bd1fa@aol.com> Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 19:14:50 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Those "papers" came To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/13/02 6:14:02 PM Eastern Standard Time, ccuff@in4web.com writes: << There are all kinds of "test results" on adjacent channel interference..>> Isnt that the truth..at least it would definately seem that way. << If I can hear digital hash on a 2 khz BW car radio for 30 khz to either side of an iboc station, what are they using for testing? And why is this proposal only addressing the rescinding of NIGHT broadcasts? If anyone that also received this document wants to privately email me, feel free. Lets hash out some plans. CC >> You know...I've asked the question on this list...about a week ago..I've asked the question on a broadcast engineers list...what radios that were tested,which one did not fair well for rejecting the digital carriers on adjacent channels of the station running IBOC. The first time the question was asked here in a public forum..the indivdual leaves the the list..the second time it was asked on another public forum,my question was ignored. I have some serious problem with that. Chris if you have any ideas and or thoughts on this pooper that we all just received...I'm open to entertain anything on your mind.That goes for anyone else as well. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From KC4QLP@aol.com Fri Dec 13 16:24:33 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Dec 2002 00:24:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 52429 invoked from network); 14 Dec 2002 00:24:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Dec 2002 00:24:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r10.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.106) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Dec 2002 00:24:32 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r10.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.12b.1d708c47 (16781) for ; Fri, 13 Dec 2002 19:24:26 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <12b.1d708c47.2b2bd43a@aol.com> Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 19:24:26 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} New news To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/13/02 6:58:12 PM Eastern Standard Time, stodd@sherbtel.net writes: << Rotsa ruck with the mail service in my area. ST >> Yeah...mail service is another pet peeve of mine.Someone sent me something priority mail on the 21st of Nov...and I still havent received my package.Glad the postal rates went up to take care of this wonderful service we are getting...lol BTW..the postmark is dated 12/10 on mine {they probably sent them all the same day more than likely}...so Scott you should be getting yours very soon. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Fri Dec 13 16:41:02 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Dec 2002 00:41:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 97672 invoked from network); 14 Dec 2002 00:41:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Dec 2002 00:41:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf09bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.169) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Dec 2002 00:41:02 -0000 Received: from juan ([68.155.91.244]) by imf09bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.19 201-253-122-122-119-20020516) with SMTP id <20021214004251.HUUR20447.imf09bis.bellsouth.net@juan> for ; Fri, 13 Dec 2002 19:42:51 -0500 Message-ID: <000101c2a309$790d67b0$af78fea9@juan> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Vinyl Rules! Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 08:03:42 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit It just so happens I am in the market for a turntable.I Was looking yesterday at various models on the internet. Quality is very important, as is being able to play 78's. Any suggestions ? Juan KB0GXM Go Canes ! ----- Original Message ----- From: Ian Davidson To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, December 13, 2002 6:57 AM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Vinyl Rules! On Fri, 13 Dec 2002, wgnhim wrote: > I know this is a bit off topic, but since most of the members of this > group are, obviously, concerned with hearing a product that gives them > the best sound, I thought you might find this article interesting. > Steve King/WGN-AM, Chicago Good article Steve. There really is something about vinyl. Yes - it is softer but in a smooth sort of way - more naturally open and wide - not clipped or squashed. Pity it scratches so easily. Tandy (Radio Shack) are still selling plenty of belt drive turntables here and small speciallist record shops are starting to pop up here again. The vinyl renaissance has begun. Ian [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From ccuff@in4web.com Fri Dec 13 16:52:56 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Dec 2002 00:52:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 39130 invoked from network); 14 Dec 2002 00:52:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Dec 2002 00:52:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Dec 2002 00:52:55 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.27]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Fri, 13 Dec 2002 19:47:47 -0500 Message-ID: <000a01c2a309$ef78cde0$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: Re: Vinyl rules! Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 19:44:17 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 Juan- Go to www.jandr.com and look for Thorens. Still nice turntables, Swiss made, with 78 RPM. Chris From jsgil@hal-pc.org Fri Dec 13 17:02:38 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Dec 2002 01:02:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 35984 invoked from network); 14 Dec 2002 01:02:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Dec 2002 01:02:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.83) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Dec 2002 01:02:37 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.160] by n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Dec 2002 01:02:36 -0000 Date: Sat, 14 Dec 2002 01:02:33 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Vinyl Rules! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <000101c2a309$790d67b0$af78fea9@juan> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1066 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.51 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Juan / John Gualda" wrote: > It just so happens I am in the market for a turntable.I Was looking yesterday at various models on the internet. > > Quality is very important, as is being able to play 78's. > Any suggestions ? > > Juan > KB0GXM I don't think you will find a turntable that is truely Hi-Fi and also plays 78s. The 78 uses a different needle and older middle of the road turntables had a needle that you could flip over to play 78s. For a good Hi-Fi turntable the cartridge alone can start at $75 and the turntable in the $200 range. You might want to hunt around at garage sales as sometimes people get rid of their equipment for $15-$25. If you can find a Dual or high end Technics that is either belt or direct drive then that is a bargain. These sold for $300-$400 new with cartridge. I knew someone that pick up a Bang & Olfson for a song. They don't made turntables like they used to. I have heard the linear tracking models don't wear out the record as fast as the traditional style. JSG From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Fri Dec 13 17:12:26 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Dec 2002 01:12:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 84859 invoked from network); 14 Dec 2002 01:12:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Dec 2002 01:12:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf11bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.171) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Dec 2002 01:12:25 -0000 Received: from juan ([68.155.91.244]) by imf11bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.19 201-253-122-122-119-20020516) with SMTP id <20021214011415.IRQU10083.imf11bis.bellsouth.net@juan> for ; Fri, 13 Dec 2002 20:14:15 -0500 Message-ID: <003001c2a30d$d8d671b0$af78fea9@juan> To: References: <000a01c2a309$ef78cde0$0101a8c0@pavilion> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Vinyl rules! Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 20:12:18 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Will Do. Thanks ! ----- Original Message ----- From: Christopher Cuff To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, December 13, 2002 7:44 PM Subject: {AMSF} Re: Vinyl rules! Juan- Go to www.jandr.com and look for Thorens. Still nice turntables, Swiss made, with 78 RPM. Chris [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Fri Dec 13 17:17:56 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Dec 2002 01:17:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 50711 invoked from network); 14 Dec 2002 01:17:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Dec 2002 01:17:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf11bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.171) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Dec 2002 01:17:55 -0000 Received: from juan ([68.155.91.244]) by imf11bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.19 201-253-122-122-119-20020516) with SMTP id <20021214011945.IXCY10083.imf11bis.bellsouth.net@juan> for ; Fri, 13 Dec 2002 20:19:45 -0500 Message-ID: <003601c2a30e$9d96ca90$af78fea9@juan> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Vinyl Rules! Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 20:17:48 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I have also heard about the non compatibility of 33/45 with 78's Is it a matter of the stylus ? I presently own a DUAL, it works great but doesn't play 78's It needs a new stylus, and that is another matter if I decide to keep it. I inherited a large 78 collection from my grandfather. Some of the 78's go back to WW II. As a matter of fact, my grandad was in the war, and used to tell stories of hauling around the big record player, and what a morale booster it was to listen to music...and 5 cent beers too :-) Anyway, some of those 78's from the war he still had, and gave to me. It is a great record collection, and I would love to listen to it. Maybe I need to just find a dedicated 78 player. Thanks Juan --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Juan / John Gualda" wrote: > It just so happens I am in the market for a turntable.I Was looking yesterday at various models on the internet. > > Quality is very important, as is being able to play 78's. > Any suggestions ? > > Juan > KB0GXM I don't think you will find a turntable that is truely Hi-Fi and also plays 78s. The 78 uses a different needle and older middle of the road turntables had a needle that you could flip over to play 78s. For a good Hi-Fi turntable the cartridge alone can start at $75 and the turntable in the $200 range. You might want to hunt around at garage sales as sometimes people get rid of their equipment for $15-$25. If you can find a Dual or high end Technics that is either belt or direct drive then that is a bargain. These sold for $300-$400 new with cartridge. I knew someone that pick up a Bang & Olfson for a song. They don't made turntables like they used to. I have heard the linear tracking models don't wear out the record as fast as the traditional style. JSG [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From steveking@wgnradio.com Fri Dec 13 17:24:07 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: steveking@wgnradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Dec 2002 01:24:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 66036 invoked from network); 14 Dec 2002 01:24:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Dec 2002 01:24:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Dec 2002 01:24:06 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.156] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Dec 2002 01:24:06 -0000 Date: Sat, 14 Dec 2002 01:24:06 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Vinyl rules! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <000a01c2a309$ef78cde0$0101a8c0@pavilion> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 263 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgnhim " X-Originating-IP: 172.145.71.161 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71806925 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgnhim I absolutely agree. I got a thorens turntable a year ago and love it. Steve --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Christopher Cuff" wrote: > Juan- Go to www.jandr.com and look for Thorens. Still nice turntables, Swiss > made, with 78 RPM. > Chris From possumhunter@netzero.net Fri Dec 13 17:47:07 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Dec 2002 01:47:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 1140 invoked from network); 14 Dec 2002 01:47:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Dec 2002 01:47:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.15) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Dec 2002 01:47:07 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 13 Dec 2002 17:47:07 -0800 To: References: <129.1d7c8e02.2b2b996c@aol.com> Subject: Question For Eric Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 20:46:47 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 14 Dec 2002 01:47:07.0137 (UTC) FILETIME=[B59B0710:01C2A312] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.161.201.198] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Eric, I have a question for you since you have shown that you are such an excellent radio consultant. On the edge of a medium market, the 60th largest market in the US, there is AM station in a small town that went silent after it's long ailing transmitter finally gave up the ghost. The Radio Shack audio equipment and 1960's vintage electronics in the station are shot, but there is a local broadcast engineer who can buy this station for the price of the land minus the estimated cost of demolition of the building and tower. If this engineer buys the station, he can't afford to hire an air staff, in fact, he can't afford to pay for a satellite programming service! This engineer does have enough working equipment he can pull from his home part 15 station, and an older but fully restored transmitter that can be tuned to the station's frequency. This engineer learned the ropes in a small market station, so he not only knows how to keep the equipment working, he is a pretty good DJ, salesman, pencil pusher, and bean counter. Here are my questions to you: Should the engineer buy and re-build the station into a good sounding AM C-QUAM station and host the Morning Drive live, with local interviews the mayor and fire chief, Local news and weather, and what have you? After 9AM, he could then run the station on a computer he has with voice tracking that he recorded while he goes out and sells ads, promotes that station, and maintains the equipment. At night he could take care of the station's paperwork and switch in a power soak to reduce down to the nighttime power. Should this engineer put the station on the air to serve this small town with local programming in the morning, and an alternative music format during the day in AMAX Stereo? OR Should this engineer just leave it alone and let the station die forever because some nut may try to sue him for voice tracking the station during part of the day and try to get the FCC to prosecute him under FCC Rule 73.1208, Section A? Even without the local station, you can still hear many radio stations in this market, including several preachers, a dozen or so Clear Channel stations, about as many Entercom stations, and a handful of Cox, Infinity, Keymarket, and Barnstable stations, none of which have ever so much as put up a billboard in the silent station's city of license or broadcast in AM Stereo. BTW, This engineer is part Native American (Cherokee Tribe), so it would be a minority owned station. I will be looking forward to your answer, Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Fri Dec 13 18:05:34 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Dec 2002 02:05:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 25489 invoked from network); 14 Dec 2002 02:05:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Dec 2002 02:05:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.205) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Dec 2002 02:05:34 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 13 Dec 2002 18:05:34 -0800 To: References: <003601c2a30e$9d96ca90$af78fea9@juan> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Vinyl Rules! Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 21:05:21 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 14 Dec 2002 02:05:34.0101 (UTC) FILETIME=[49685450:01C2A315] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.161.201.198] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Juan / John Gualda wrote: > I have also heard about the non compatibility of 33/45 with 78's Is it a matter of the stylus ? The 78RPM stylus is a different size and shape than the LP or 45 stylus. The EQ is different too. > > I presently own a DUAL, it works great but doesn't play 78's Go asking around local radio stations. You may be able to get a working 3 speed QRK rim drive with a tone arm on it FREE for the asking! Most stations used the Stanton 500 cartridge, if it has another one on it, buy a Stanton 500 because they make a 78RPM stylus for it. I used such a setup to record my 78s into Cool Edit Pro. I then used the software to clean up the noise and adjust the EQ. After I got the sound the way I wanted it, I burned the music onto CDs. Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Dec 13 18:34:25 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Dec 2002 02:34:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 93748 invoked from network); 14 Dec 2002 02:34:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Dec 2002 02:34:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.87) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Dec 2002 02:34:20 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.171] by n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Dec 2002 02:34:20 -0000 Date: Sat, 14 Dec 2002 02:34:18 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Another Reminder Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2014 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.70.2 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics People, this is the AM STEREO Forum. It is a place for discussing AM Stereo and things directly related to the transmission, reception, and listening enjoyment of AM Stereo signals. Lately, this subject matter has grown to include the topic of IBOC DAB, a.k.a. "HD Radio", and that is fine. It is, however, NOT a place for gratuitous Clear Channel bashing, lengthy discussions about voice tracking and radio station employment policies, or any other FCC/NAB/NPR/corporate radio conspiracy theories. Not only are there much more relevant places in which to discuss these subjects at length, having these topics discussed here constantly serves as a large annoyance to many of our members who wish to stay on the topic of AM Stereo. I gave a similar reminder about this earlier today, but it seemed to have only *increased* the amount of off-topic messages coming from two of our members. So, I hate to have to do this, but I have placed the memberships of "n0uiheric" and Charles Penry in moderated mode. This gives me the authority to review the incoming messages from them and post only the messages which I feel are appropriate for this Forum. I still do HIGHLY value the right of free speech, but I think some people fail to realize just how much exposure the content of this Forum is getting. If we act like a bunch of lunatics, we are going to be treated as such by the people and companies that have the ability to either help or hurt our cause -- yes, we even have had Clear Channel employees quietly viewing what is posted here. The membership policies of our 131 other members remains unchanged. Everybody else can still enjoy unmoderated use of this Forum, as usual. I don't LIKE to rule with an iron fist, but I consider unrestricted use of this Forum to be a privelege, and if you constantly abuse that privelege, you will have it taken away from you. Thank you for your understanding and cooperation. Kevin Tekel kevtronics@yahoo.com Sysop of The AM STEREO Forum From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Dec 13 19:42:57 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Dec 2002 03:42:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 75459 invoked from network); 14 Dec 2002 03:42:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Dec 2002 03:42:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Dec 2002 03:42:57 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-85-72.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.85.72]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gBE3grOd015290 for ; Fri, 13 Dec 2002 21:42:55 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <001d01a8ea61$02a1bec0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <3DFA5C4D.40B67A39@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} New news Date: Fri, 4 Jan 1980 06:07:27 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude There's something that seems almost evil about this-- getting a law firm involved? Hopefully they're communications attorneys, otherwise I suspect he may be trolling for libelous comments for him to sue us and shut us up. Let's keep it civil and technical. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Neal Newman" > seems there is an Engineer in the Pittsburgh area that's got a law firm > sending out Docs > Looking at the list on the last few pages many of us are going to > receive this package. > From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Dec 13 19:52:02 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Dec 2002 03:52:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 71741 invoked from network); 14 Dec 2002 03:52:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Dec 2002 03:52:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Dec 2002 03:52:01 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-85-72.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.85.72]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gBE3pwOd017220 for ; Fri, 13 Dec 2002 21:51:59 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <005101a8ea62$474ad7e0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <003601c2a30e$9d96ca90$af78fea9@juan> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Vinyl Rules! Date: Fri, 4 Jan 1980 06:16:31 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Yes- 78s use a 3 mil stylus; 33/45 use 1 mil. If you want to get into discussing audio equipment, I'd suggest trying the Audio Asylum forums. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Juan / John Gualda" > I have also heard about the non compatibility of 33/45 with 78's Is it a matter of the stylus ? From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Fri Dec 13 19:58:11 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Dec 2002 03:58:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 57326 invoked from network); 14 Dec 2002 03:58:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Dec 2002 03:58:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf08bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.48) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Dec 2002 03:58:10 -0000 Received: from juan ([68.155.91.244]) by imf08bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.19 201-253-122-122-119-20020516) with SMTP id <20021214040000.EFDC2064.imf08bis.bellsouth.net@juan> for ; Fri, 13 Dec 2002 23:00:00 -0500 Message-ID: <000f01c2a325$04c43480$af78fea9@juan> To: References: <003601c2a30e$9d96ca90$af78fea9@juan> <005101a8ea62$474ad7e0$827dfea9@home1> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Vinyl Rules! Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 22:58:10 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Ok then.....any turntables out there that are good 33/45 and 78.....with interchangable stylus ?... Juan ----- Original Message ----- From: Scott Todd To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, January 04, 1980 7:16 AM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Vinyl Rules! Yes- 78s use a 3 mil stylus; 33/45 use 1 mil. If you want to get into discussing audio equipment, I'd suggest trying the Audio Asylum forums. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Juan / John Gualda" > I have also heard about the non compatibility of 33/45 with 78's Is it a matter of the stylus ? Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Dec 13 20:05:34 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Dec 2002 04:05:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 68010 invoked from network); 14 Dec 2002 04:05:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Dec 2002 04:05:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Dec 2002 04:05:34 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-85-72.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.85.72]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gBE45TOd020284 for ; Fri, 13 Dec 2002 22:05:31 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <007001a8ea64$2b18e880$827dfea9@home1> To: Subject: data sheet needed Date: Fri, 4 Jan 1980 06:30:03 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I'm trying to convert a Sansui 5050 to AMS for a friend of mine. The AM chip is an HA1197. I tried to find a data sheet on the Hitachi web site, but nothing turns up. I'm trying to best determine which pins to use in the conversion. I've got the 5050 schematic, but I'm left to wonder about the function of some of those pins, and so believe I'd be helped with the data sheet. Thanks to anyone who can help. Scott Todd [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Dec 13 20:08:41 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Dec 2002 04:08:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 67500 invoked from network); 14 Dec 2002 04:08:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Dec 2002 04:08:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Dec 2002 04:08:40 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-85-72.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.85.72]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gBE48bOd020992 for ; Fri, 13 Dec 2002 22:08:38 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <007601a8ea64$9ab37700$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <003601c2a30e$9d96ca90$af78fea9@juan> <005101a8ea62$474ad7e0$827dfea9@home1> <000f01c2a325$04c43480$af78fea9@juan> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Vinyl Rules! Date: Fri, 4 Jan 1980 06:33:10 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Most modern cartridges have replaceable needles which allows swapping between sizes. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Juan / John Gualda" To: Sent: Friday, December 13, 2002 9:58 PM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Vinyl Rules! > Ok then.....any turntables out there that are good 33/45 and 78.....with interchangable stylus ?... > > > Juan > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Scott Todd > To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com > Sent: Friday, January 04, 1980 7:16 AM > Subject: Re: {AMSF} Vinyl Rules! > > > Yes- 78s use a 3 mil stylus; 33/45 use 1 mil. If you want to get into > discussing audio equipment, I'd suggest trying the Audio Asylum forums. > > ST > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Juan / John Gualda" > > > I have also heard about the non compatibility of 33/45 with 78's Is it a > matter of the stylus ? > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > From KC4QLP@aol.com Fri Dec 13 20:16:23 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Dec 2002 04:16:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 87744 invoked from network); 14 Dec 2002 04:16:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Dec 2002 04:16:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r05.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.101) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Dec 2002 04:16:22 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.c.49af60c (16781) for ; Fri, 13 Dec 2002 23:16:20 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Fri, 13 Dec 2002 23:16:19 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} New news To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/13/02 10:43:29 PM Eastern Standard Time, stodd@sherbtel.net writes: << There's something that seems almost evil about this-- getting a law firm involved? Hopefully they're communications attorneys, otherwise I suspect he may be trolling for libelous comments for him to sue us and shut us up. Let's keep it civil and technical. ST >> It states on page two of the doc that they are Glen Clark & Associates {"GCA"} and it goes further to say that GCA is a consulting engineering firm based in suburban Pittsburgh Pa. They are well known with the Commission. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Sat Dec 14 01:43:43 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Dec 2002 09:43:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 43148 invoked from network); 14 Dec 2002 09:43:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Dec 2002 09:43:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web41007.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.93.6) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Dec 2002 09:43:42 -0000 Message-ID: <20021214094342.98285.qmail@web41007.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.35.104] by web41007.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 14 Dec 2002 01:43:42 PST Date: Sat, 14 Dec 2002 01:43:42 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: {AMSF} New news To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: <3DFA5C4D.40B67A39@skyweb.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio Yeah, I got one yesterday (Friday 13). I was wondering about that. We didn't sign THAT, right? Thanks, Jay __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From groucho@skyweb.net Sat Dec 14 02:06:21 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Dec 2002 10:06:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 58693 invoked from network); 14 Dec 2002 10:06:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Dec 2002 10:06:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Dec 2002 10:06:20 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gBEAC9eV034147 for ; Sat, 14 Dec 2002 05:12:09 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DFB019C.A6D1CDA0@skyweb.net> Date: Sat, 14 Dec 2002 05:02:04 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Question For Eric References: <129.1d7c8e02.2b2b996c@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Here is my Reply.... you want any AM stereo partners????? LOL Neal BTW I am also looking to buy into a dark station and bring it back to life.. anyone else Interested.... I know a few CP's still open . Possum Hunter wrote: > Eric, I have a question for you since you have shown that you are such an > excellent radio consultant. > > On the edge of a medium market, the 60th largest market in the US, there is > AM station in a small town that went silent after it's long ailing > transmitter finally gave up the ghost. The Radio Shack audio equipment and > 1960's vintage electronics in the station are shot, but there is a local > broadcast engineer who can buy this station for the price of the land minus > the estimated cost of demolition of the building and tower. > > If this engineer buys the station, he can't afford to hire an air staff, in > fact, he can't afford to pay for a satellite programming service! This > engineer does have enough working equipment he can pull from his home part > 15 station, and an older but fully restored transmitter that can be tuned to > the station's frequency. This engineer learned the ropes in a small market > station, so he not only knows how to keep the equipment working, he is a > pretty good DJ, salesman, pencil pusher, and bean counter. > > Here are my questions to you: > Should the engineer buy and re-build the station into a good sounding AM > C-QUAM station and host the Morning Drive live, with local interviews the > mayor and fire chief, Local news and weather, and what have you? After 9AM, > he could then run the station on a computer he has with voice tracking that > he recorded while he goes out and sells ads, promotes that station, and > maintains the equipment. At night he could take care of the station's > paperwork and switch in a power soak to reduce down to the nighttime power. > > Should this engineer put the station on the air to serve this small town > with local programming in the morning, and an alternative music format > during the day in AMAX Stereo? > > OR > > Should this engineer just leave it alone and let the station die forever > because some nut may try to sue him for voice tracking the station during > part of the day and try to get the FCC to prosecute him under FCC Rule > 73.1208, Section A? > > Even without the local station, you can still hear many radio stations in > this market, including several preachers, a dozen or so Clear Channel > stations, about as many Entercom stations, and a handful of Cox, Infinity, > Keymarket, and Barnstable stations, none of which have ever so much as put > up a billboard in the silent station's city of license or broadcast in AM > Stereo. > > BTW, This engineer is part Native American (Cherokee Tribe), so it would be > a minority owned station. > > I will be looking forward to your answer, > > Kevin > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From KC4QLP@aol.com Sat Dec 14 02:54:35 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Dec 2002 10:54:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 943 invoked from network); 14 Dec 2002 10:54:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Dec 2002 10:54:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m06.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.161) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Dec 2002 10:54:32 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.6d.497dbef (1320) for ; Sat, 14 Dec 2002 05:54:23 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <6d.497dbef.2b2c67df@aol.com> Date: Sat, 14 Dec 2002 05:54:23 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Question For Eric To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 12/14/02 5:06:50 AM Eastern Standard Time, groucho@skyweb.net writes: > Here is my Reply.... > you want any AM stereo partners????? LOL > Neal > BTW I am also looking to buy into a dark station and bring it back to > life.. > anyone else Interested.... I know a few CP's still open . > Where are the CP's? As far as money wise....hehehehe...I think somewheres around here I may have 2 nickles I can rub together...lol Sucks when you pinch pennies and you still dont have what you would like to have at the end of the month.Sometimes I wonder how I do it. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From florida_amstereo@hotmail.com Sat Dec 14 04:52:56 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: florida_amstereo@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Dec 2002 12:52:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 71129 invoked from network); 14 Dec 2002 12:52:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Dec 2002 12:52:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.37.112) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Dec 2002 12:52:55 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 14 Dec 2002 04:48:58 -0800 Received: from 209.240.198.61 by pv2fd.pav2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Sat, 14 Dec 2002 12:48:58 GMT To: amstereo@bellsouth.net, amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Christmas in A.M. stereo Date: Sat, 14 Dec 2002 12:48:58 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 14 Dec 2002 12:48:58.0749 (UTC) FILETIME=[2B9222D0:01C2A36F] From: "Donn Tillman" X-Originating-IP: [209.240.198.61] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83914824 Here's hoping that many stations will join Bob Carter's, Magic 693 (Melbourne) and 1450 in central New Jersey in having holiday music and programming in A.M. stereo. Hope everyone on both lists have had a nice safe Hanukah or will have a nice safe and peaceful Christmas. donn in IBOC free, am stereo free St Pete _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus From amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk Sat Dec 14 06:10:15 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Dec 2002 14:10:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 90955 invoked from network); 14 Dec 2002 14:10:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Dec 2002 14:10:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.86) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Dec 2002 14:10:13 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.253] by n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Dec 2002 14:10:13 -0000 Date: Sat, 14 Dec 2002 14:10:13 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Champaign, Illinois JAVARADIO - WIDEBAND AM ? Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 222 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "m1ctk " X-Originating-IP: 81.7.61.80 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113985069 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereofan This one is free today for those who do not subscribe to this service. I point it out as the broadband audio link on this JR gives very nice near wideband sounding AM (mono) reception. Give it a go at www.javaradio.com From stodd@sherbtel.net Sat Dec 14 08:04:34 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Dec 2002 16:04:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 27783 invoked from network); 14 Dec 2002 16:04:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Dec 2002 16:04:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Dec 2002 16:04:32 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-202.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.202]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gBEG4SOd025258 for ; Sat, 14 Dec 2002 10:04:30 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <001601a8eac8$9cb84940$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <129.1d7c8e02.2b2b996c@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Question For Eric Date: Fri, 4 Jan 1980 18:29:03 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Are you sure the license is still good? I think the FCC has been deleting stations that have been dark for over a year. If you can buy it without killing yourself financially, please do so. Considering your engineering skills, would you be rebuilding the defunct transmitter? Wish I had some cash to invest and help you out. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Possum Hunter" > On the edge of a medium market, the 60th largest market in the US, there is > AM station in a small town that went silent after it's long ailing > transmitter finally gave up the ghost. From groucho@skyweb.net Sat Dec 14 08:18:12 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Dec 2002 16:18:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 21574 invoked from network); 14 Dec 2002 16:18:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Dec 2002 16:18:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Dec 2002 16:18:11 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gBEGO0eV017537 for ; Sat, 14 Dec 2002 11:24:00 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DFB58BF.64B867D3@skyweb.net> Date: Sat, 14 Dec 2002 11:13:51 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Question For Eric References: <129.1d7c8e02.2b2b996c@aol.com> <001601a8eac8$9cb84940$827dfea9@home1> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 as long as the station is still listed on the FCC data base It is Considered dark and can Be brought back. Once its Off the list. You have to apply as if it were a New station. a) they are not presently accepting applications b) to bring it back It must be licensed for unlimited 1kw day 500 night c) if its an old daytimer and its no longer on the List. kiss it goodbye forever d) transmitter is no problem for Possum.. he keeps his house warm all winter with an OLD BCA 1R1 into a dummy load... Hey what great efficiency he's getting keeps the oil bill down while listening to his own great Programming heheheheh..what more can you ask for. Neal Scott Todd wrote: > Are you sure the license is still good? I think the FCC has been deleting > stations that have been dark for over a year. If you can buy it without > killing yourself financially, please do so. Considering your engineering > skills, would you be rebuilding the defunct transmitter? Wish I had some > cash to invest and help you out. > > ST > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Possum Hunter" > > On the edge of a medium market, the 60th largest market in the US, there > is > > AM station in a small town that went silent after it's long ailing > > transmitter finally gave up the ghost. > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From amfmdx@fastq.com Sat Dec 14 16:15:17 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Dec 2002 00:15:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 1131 invoked from network); 15 Dec 2002 00:15:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Dec 2002 00:15:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Dec 2002 00:15:15 -0000 Received: from fastq (d42-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.74]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gBF0FEv00555 for ; Sat, 14 Dec 2002 17:15:14 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <01c001c2a3ce$f27a7fa0$f7d63fd1@com> To: Subject: Here we go! READ THIS Date: Sat, 14 Dec 2002 17:14:33 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla The law-yuhz that sent the package to all of us who commented on IBOC, want to kill the X-band and make it an IBOC only band. This is where our AM stereo is. Think about this. Kevin "Its going to get a lot worse before it gets worse" - Lily Tomlin From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Sat Dec 14 16:15:29 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Dec 2002 00:15:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 2441 invoked from network); 15 Dec 2002 00:15:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Dec 2002 00:15:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web41003.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.93.2) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Dec 2002 00:15:29 -0000 Message-ID: <20021215001529.62782.qmail@web41003.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.35.104] by web41003.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 14 Dec 2002 16:15:29 PST Date: Sat, 14 Dec 2002 16:15:29 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: {AMSF} Question For Eric To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio Well, it can't be WKNJ/550 because their permit expired in September. I looked at www.100000watts.com for market 60 and found no dark stations listed. Ooh! A search! 73, N1WVQ P.S.: Is this engineer you or someone else? __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From alfredot@inetarena.com Sat Dec 14 16:21:33 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: alfredot@inetarena.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Dec 2002 00:21:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 53481 invoked from network); 15 Dec 2002 00:21:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Dec 2002 00:21:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.inetarena.com) (206.129.216.13) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Dec 2002 00:21:32 -0000 Received: from hendrie (1Cust201.tnt3.portland.or.da.uu.net [65.239.64.201]) by mail.inetarena.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id gBF0IwO11583 for ; Sat, 14 Dec 2002 16:19:10 -0800 (PST) Date: Sat, 14 Dec 2002 16:13:41 -0800 (PST) X-Sender: alfredo@hendrie.1610am.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: AM Stereo on the CHEAP In-Reply-To: <1039786597.1726.8075.m12@yahoogroups.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: "Alfredo E. Torrejon" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=25132238 X-Yahoo-Profile: alfredotorrejon > Using an Alfredo as a C-QUAM generator, What is the best method you know of > to amplify the composite signal up to the 5 Volts Peak-To-Peak required to > drive a Harris SX1A's Stereo Generator Input? > > Kevin You could try to get more gain out of the two NPN stages after the envelope modulator. Each of these stages has a series combination of a resistor and capacitor connected between the emitter of the transistor and ground. The resistor sets the gain of the stage. Since linearity doesn't matter in your application, you could experiment with smaller resistors for more gain. The output stage should be able to do 5 volts p-p. Alfredo From possumhunter@netzero.net Sat Dec 14 17:02:41 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Dec 2002 01:02:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 84278 invoked from network); 15 Dec 2002 01:02:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Dec 2002 01:02:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.86) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Dec 2002 01:02:40 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 14 Dec 2002 17:02:40 -0800 To: References: <129.1d7c8e02.2b2b996c@aol.com> <001601a8eac8$9cb84940$827dfea9@home1> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Question For Eric Date: Sat, 14 Dec 2002 20:02:23 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 15 Dec 2002 01:02:40.0664 (UTC) FILETIME=[AAAD4980:01C2A3D5] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.162.159.34] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Scott Todd wrote: > Are you sure the license is still good? Yep! > > I think the FCC has been deleting stations that have been dark for over a year. This is a recent death. > >would you be rebuilding the defunct transmitter? No, the original 1930s vintage BC1E has been chopped up, modified, jury rigged, worn out, and abused beyond any chance of repair The metal cabinet has lots of rust on it inside and out like it was originally from a coastal radio station and none of the many modifications are documented. It will salvaged for spares for the "new" main transmitter, a fully restored 1960 vintage RCA BTA1R. The PCBs will be disposed of by a hazardous waste company. I may have a chance to get an MW1A as well. > >Wish I had some cash to invest and help you out. Getting the station is not a done deal yet, the list will be the first to know if I get it. Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From possumhunter@netzero.net Sat Dec 14 17:43:40 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Dec 2002 01:43:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 83283 invoked from network); 15 Dec 2002 01:43:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Dec 2002 01:43:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.115) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Dec 2002 01:43:39 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 14 Dec 2002 17:43:39 -0800 To: References: <129.1d7c8e02.2b2b996c@aol.com> <001601a8eac8$9cb84940$827dfea9@home1> <3DFB58BF.64B867D3@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Question For Eric Date: Sat, 14 Dec 2002 20:43:27 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 15 Dec 2002 01:43:39.0939 (UTC) FILETIME=[6484DF30:01C2A3DB] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.162.159.34] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Neal Newman wrote: > as long as the station is still listed on the FCC data base It is Considered dark and can Be brought back. Once its Off the list. You have to apply as if it were a New station. Under the new rules, there is NO WAY you could put this thing on the air from scratch! > >if its an old daytimer and its no longer on the List. kiss it goodbye forever Yup, I know of a couple that are dead forever because of that rule. > > transmitter is no problem for Possum.. he keeps his house warm all winter with an OLD BCA 1R1 into a dummy load... Hey what great efficiency he's getting keeps the oil bill down while listening to his own great Programming LOL, the old RCA BTA1R is a hoot to play with. I can tell she is just itching to get back on the air all of the time. From KC4QLP@aol.com Sat Dec 14 17:44:44 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Dec 2002 01:44:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 48195 invoked from network); 15 Dec 2002 01:44:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Dec 2002 01:44:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d04.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.36) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Dec 2002 01:44:44 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.c6.167f4747 (30960) for ; Sat, 14 Dec 2002 20:44:39 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Sat, 14 Dec 2002 20:44:39 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Here we go! READ THIS To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/14/02 7:16:05 PM Eastern Standard Time, amfmdx@fastq.com writes: << The law-yuhz that sent the package to all of us who commented on IBOC, want to kill the X-band and make it an IBOC only band. This is where our AM stereo is. Think about this. Kevin >> Kevin you can better believe that I'm hotter than a firecracker over this...as you could tell by my posting on the am@nrcdxas.org list. I will not stand to be ignored by some so called professional that wont even answer a question that deserves a dignified professional answer.Better believe that something big is gonna happen outta ..its my hope that the stations that are being hammered,their listeners,station managers and engineers will step up to the hot plate and grab this thing by the horns and get some results out of this. CC ...any ideas of what to do yet? ..if so drop me a private email...sounded like you had some brain storming by the reads of one of your emails a day or two ago. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Sat Dec 14 17:46:48 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Dec 2002 01:46:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 35172 invoked from network); 15 Dec 2002 01:46:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Dec 2002 01:46:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14208.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.173.72) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Dec 2002 01:46:47 -0000 Message-ID: <20021215014647.11082.qmail@web14208.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [65.221.47.68] by web14208.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 14 Dec 2002 17:46:47 PST Date: Sat, 14 Dec 2002 17:46:47 -0800 (PST) Subject: X-Band to X-Plode w/IBOC? Where's my mail? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio Interesting, whomp IBOC in the X-Band where the highest percentage of C-Quam stereo AM stations reside (by FCC design). Also, and a very big also, nearly all X-band stations are Mom & Pops - very few of the X-Banders are big conglomerates, so where in tarnation are they supposed to get their wheelbarrows of money to put their digital bitbucket sidebands on the air? They're still paying off their bank loans for their new X-Band transmitters now. Did these IBOC jokers ever think about why they would want to pay for IBOC when they're in the financial crapper now? Or, is this a way to force the independants out so the biggies (ClearChannel, Infinity, Cumulus,...) can absorb the X-banders too? I haven't received my package from the lawyers yet (and I don't know why) but I hope I receive it in time to make a late filing/ex parte comment about their 'results'. I did read some of it from the FCC website. BTW, do they even mention that 50KW CKLW occupies 800KHz and would be bombarded by IBOC sidebands? Waiting for my (ticking) package to arrive....... __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From possumhunter@netzero.net Sat Dec 14 18:02:59 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Dec 2002 02:02:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 32686 invoked from network); 15 Dec 2002 02:02:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Dec 2002 02:02:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.95) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Dec 2002 02:02:58 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 14 Dec 2002 18:02:58 -0800 To: References: <6d.497dbef.2b2c67df@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Question For Eric Date: Sat, 14 Dec 2002 21:02:47 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 15 Dec 2002 02:02:58.0604 (UTC) FILETIME=[17231EC0:01C2A3DE] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.162.159.34] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: > Sucks when you pinch pennies and you still dont have what you would like to have at the end of the month.Sometimes I wonder how I do it. Yea, when you work in small market radio, money can get a wee bit tight! It still beats working yourself to death for Clear Channel! Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From KC4QLP@aol.com Sat Dec 14 18:08:36 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Dec 2002 02:08:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 75793 invoked from network); 15 Dec 2002 02:08:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Dec 2002 02:08:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d10.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.42) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Dec 2002 02:08:36 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d10.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.7d.324700b7 (30960) for ; Sat, 14 Dec 2002 21:08:27 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <7d.324700b7.2b2d3e1a@aol.com> Date: Sat, 14 Dec 2002 21:08:26 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Question For Eric To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/14/02 9:01:55 PM Eastern Standard Time, possumhunter@netzero.net writes: << Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation >> Gotta question for ya....in your RCA..which style tubes do you use?..the old style metal plate tubes or those newer graphite tubes? I've got one of those still humming along at WRCS 970 AM in Ahoskie NC using graphite tubes...one of the very few I've seen that will run them and still sound good and run cool. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- Subscribe send an email to amstereo-subscribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Sat Dec 14 18:17:02 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Dec 2002 02:17:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 96890 invoked from network); 15 Dec 2002 02:17:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Dec 2002 02:17:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf18bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.38) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Dec 2002 02:17:01 -0000 Received: from juan ([68.155.91.244]) by imf18bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.19 201-253-122-122-119-20020516) with SMTP id <20021215021635.DLY14411.imf18bis.bellsouth.net@juan> for ; Sat, 14 Dec 2002 21:16:35 -0500 Message-ID: <004901c2a3e0$0e08ba50$af78fea9@juan> To: References: <3DFA5C4D.40B67A39@skyweb.net> <00ae01a8ea41$77899fc0$827dfea9@home1> Subject: Re: {AMSF} New news Date: Sat, 14 Dec 2002 21:17:01 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I have received nothing yet.....what should I expect ? what does it say ? Let me know... Thanks Juan gualdaj@bellsouth.net From: "Neal Newman" > Chris Cuff,Myself,Mike Erickson,Donn TillmanJuan seems everyone that > filed a comment to the FCC is On this list. so You should Be getting > yours soon. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From possumhunter@netzero.net Sat Dec 14 18:20:40 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: possumhunter@netzero.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Dec 2002 02:20:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 8062 invoked from network); 15 Dec 2002 02:20:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Dec 2002 02:20:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rly-ip05.mx.aol.com) (64.12.138.9) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Dec 2002 02:20:40 -0000 Received: from logs-mtc-tc.proxy.aol.com (logs-mtc-tc.proxy.aol.com [64.12.105.135]) by rly-ip05.mx.aol.com (v89.10) with ESMTP id RELAYIN1-1214212001; Sat, 14 Dec 2002 21:20:01 1900 Received: from ibm (ACA29F22.ipt.aol.com [172.162.159.34]) by logs-mtc-tc.proxy.aol.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with SMTP id gBF2I9T306609 for ; Sat, 14 Dec 2002 21:18:09 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <01a701c2a3e0$30787e40$5b93b498@aoldsl.net> To: References: <7d.324700b7.2b2d3e1a@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Question For Eric Date: Sat, 14 Dec 2002 21:17:58 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Apparently-From: DodgeRamTrucker@aol.com From: "Possum Hunter" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: > Gotta question for ya....in your RCA..which style tubes do you use?..the old style metal plate tubes or those newer graphite tubes? I have never had any luck with the graphite tubes, so I didn't even try them in my transmitter. I am running metal plate Eimac 4-400As. The worst tubes I have ever used are the Amperex tubes from France. They go soft FAST! > > I've got one of those still humming along at WRCS 970 AM in Ahoskie NC using graphite tubes...one of the very few I've seen that will run them and still sound good and run cool. That is the best AM transmitter that has ever been made! I should post the service manual to the files section :-) Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From stodd@sherbtel.net Sat Dec 14 18:22:02 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Dec 2002 02:22:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 9011 invoked from network); 15 Dec 2002 02:22:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Dec 2002 02:22:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Dec 2002 02:22:01 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-85-114.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.85.114]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gBF2LwOd004859 for ; Sat, 14 Dec 2002 20:21:59 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <000e01a8ea55$b5ec4c40$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <129.1d7c8e02.2b2b996c@aol.com> <001601a8eac8$9cb84940$827dfea9@home1> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Question For Eric Date: Fri, 4 Jan 1980 04:46:33 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude I've got a friend who might be willing to restore it. Please don't trash it. He may trade parts for your 1R for it. Will check for sure. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Possum Hunter" > No, the original 1930s vintage BC1E has been chopped up, modified, jury > rigged, worn out, and abused beyond any chance of repair The metal cabinet > has lots of rust on it inside and out like it was originally from a coastal > radio station and none of the many modifications are documented. It will > salvaged for spares for the "new" main transmitter, a fully restored 1960 > vintage RCA BTA1R. From amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sat Dec 14 18:46:54 2002 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 6573 invoked from network); 15 Dec 2002 02:46:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Dec 2002 02:46:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Dec 2002 02:46:53 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: notify@yahoogroups.com Received: from [66.218.66.142] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Dec 2002 02:46:53 -0000 Date: 15 Dec 2002 02:46:50 -0000 Message-ID: <1039920410.616785.34422.w67@yahoogroups.com> X-eGroups-Application: files X-Yahoo-Group-Post: system From: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: New file uploaded to amstereoforum MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello, This email message is a notification to let you know that a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the amstereoforum group. File : /rca_bta1r1_manual.djv Uploaded by : ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Description : BTA 1R1 Manual, Must use Lizardtech djvu to open You can access this file at the URL http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum/files/rca_bta1r1_manual.djv To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/files Regards, ICURAPossum_Hunter2 From amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sat Dec 14 18:59:39 2002 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 24850 invoked from network); 15 Dec 2002 02:59:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Dec 2002 02:59:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Dec 2002 02:59:39 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: notify@yahoogroups.com Received: from [66.218.67.249] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Dec 2002 02:59:39 -0000 Date: 15 Dec 2002 02:59:34 -0000 Message-ID: <1039921174.37000.34886.w70@yahoogroups.com> X-eGroups-Application: files X-Yahoo-Group-Post: system From: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: New file uploaded to amstereoforum MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello, This email message is a notification to let you know that a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the amstereoforum group. File : /rca_bta1r1_techbulletins.djv Uploaded by : ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Description : RCA BTA1R1 TechBulletins You can access this file at the URL http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum/files/rca_bta1r1_techbulletins.djv To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/files Regards, ICURAPossum_Hunter2 From KC4QLP@aol.com Sat Dec 14 19:07:26 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Dec 2002 03:07:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 83902 invoked from network); 15 Dec 2002 03:07:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Dec 2002 03:07:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d08.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.40) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Dec 2002 03:07:25 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.9c.2ae2bd77 (30960) for ; Sat, 14 Dec 2002 22:07:17 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <9c.2ae2bd77.2b2d4be5@aol.com> Date: Sat, 14 Dec 2002 22:07:17 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} New file uploaded to amstereoforum To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/14/02 10:00:35 PM Eastern Standard Time, amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com writes: << File : /rca_bta1r1_techbulletins.djv Uploaded by : ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Description : RCA BTA1R1 TechBulletins >> hehehe...I guess you and I have the few copies of these things left. One day I was looking at some old engineering stuff that was in some of the cabinets in the old engineering room at WRCS..there sat a few old catalogs of RCA transmitters and other assorted RCA products! They sure dont build'em like they used to thats for sure . Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- Subscribe send an email to amstereo-subscribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From KC4QLP@aol.com Sat Dec 14 19:12:27 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Dec 2002 03:12:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 52710 invoked from network); 15 Dec 2002 03:12:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Dec 2002 03:12:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r10.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.106) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Dec 2002 03:12:27 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r10.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.176.130850e3 (30960) for ; Sat, 14 Dec 2002 22:12:24 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <176.130850e3.2b2d4d18@aol.com> Date: Sat, 14 Dec 2002 22:12:24 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Question For Eric To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/14/02 9:22:02 PM Eastern Standard Time, possumhunter@netzero.net writes: << I have never had any luck with the graphite tubes, so I didn't even try them in my transmitter. I am running metal plate Eimac 4-400As. The worst tubes I have ever used are the Amperex tubes from France. They go soft FAST! > > Well dont feel bad .The graphites wont work in my Raytheon.But they do work well in my RCA...its amazing. In my McMartin..its half and half..it seems to like the combination of graphates in the RF and metal plate tubes in the modulator section.....now just gotta find where my high voltage short is in that rig. Amperex tubes....hehehe...the only thing they are good for are making lamps out of them.I've had to many of them in my McMartin where the grids would short out.Now these 833's made in China arent hitting on much either. An engineers work day is never done it seems...lol From amfmdx@fastq.com Sat Dec 14 19:16:48 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Dec 2002 03:16:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 34917 invoked from network); 15 Dec 2002 03:16:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Dec 2002 03:16:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Dec 2002 03:16:48 -0000 Received: from fastq (d73-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.105]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gBF3Gkv02741 for ; Sat, 14 Dec 2002 20:16:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <024d01c2a3e8$487d3320$f7d63fd1@com> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Here we go! READ THIS Date: Sat, 14 Dec 2002 20:15:53 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > Kevin you can better believe that I'm hotter than a firecracker over > this...as you could tell by my posting on the am@nrcdxas.org list. We have been talking about this on ABDX too. I am REAL whizzed about all this. Those freakin loser law-yuhz ruined my weekend. Theres no way in flamin Hades that what these fine officers of the court want to do will work. Who will pay the people who are forced off the X-band? Surely they have some recourse to recoup their losses if this comes about? > I will not > stand to be ignored by some so called professional that wont even answer a > question that deserves a dignified professional answer. Too bad he decided to leave the list instead of talking about it. I suppose this is something you might do if you don't have the courage of your convictions. He knows in his heart that this is a sham all the way around. > Better believe that > something big is gonna happen outta ..its my hope that the stations that are > being hammered,their listeners,station managers and engineers will step up to > the hot plate and grab this thing by the horns and get some results out of > this. Remember Leonard Kahn? I can see lawsuits in the future. I can see lots of lawsuits. The interference issues will bring lots of lawsuits. It will be a fiasco infinitely worse than AM stereo ever was. The lawyers are gonna make out big time. Let me give some quotes from page 20 of the propaganda the lawyers sent... They want to fast track this.... "...to compress the timeframe for finalizing the rules and policies that will affect the ultimate success of this service." Then comes the big lie... They think theres not going to be many harmed. "Precluding the use of IBOC by all AM stations at night because of the circumstances of a few, easily identifiable stations is unnecessary." The big lie is repeated again.... "Many AM stations presently operate with facilities which would not cause significant interference to distant stations if permitted to operate with IBOC facilities during night time hours. " Listen to this on page 3 and compare it to the items quoted from page 20.... "Regrettably, both computer models and field tests have shown that night time use of the AM IBOC system can in certain instances, lead to intolerable levels of interference to the ongoing operation of legacy analog broadcasting for first-adjacent channel stations. So what is it? Is it interfering or not a problem. I know the secret, I am sure you can figure it out as well. Just tune in the sidebands and you will know for sure. Kevin From KC4QLP@aol.com Sat Dec 14 19:26:19 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Dec 2002 03:26:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 62450 invoked from network); 15 Dec 2002 03:26:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Dec 2002 03:26:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d08.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.40) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Dec 2002 03:26:18 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.119.1c360811 (30960) for ; Sat, 14 Dec 2002 22:25:53 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <119.1c360811.2b2d5041@aol.com> Date: Sat, 14 Dec 2002 22:25:53 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Here we go! READ THIS To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/14/02 10:17:54 PM Eastern Standard Time, amfmdx@fastq.com writes: << I know the secret, I am sure you can figure it out as well. Just tune in the sidebands and you will know for sure. Kevin >> I dunno...seems like everytime I tune into the sidebands and the 1st adjacent..it all seems to be quite fuzzy to me....not very clear at all.I know if I try hard enough I can convince myself that what myself and the rest of the nation is hear is only our imagionations....now beleive that bogus line..you'll beleive that I have 10 moon rocks on sale that were transported to earth via UFO's just last week! I a nut shell..it all kinda sounds like the political chatter in DC. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From possumhunter@netzero.net Sat Dec 14 19:48:23 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Dec 2002 03:48:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 86871 invoked from network); 15 Dec 2002 03:48:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Dec 2002 03:48:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.20) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Dec 2002 03:48:22 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 14 Dec 2002 19:48:22 -0800 To: References: <129.1d7c8e02.2b2b996c@aol.com> <001601a8eac8$9cb84940$827dfea9@home1> <000e01a8ea55$b5ec4c40$827dfea9@home1> Subject: Gates BC1E Was:Question For Eric Date: Sat, 14 Dec 2002 22:48:09 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 15 Dec 2002 03:48:22.0727 (UTC) FILETIME=[D09BB570:01C2A3EC] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.162.159.34] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Scott Todd wrote: > I've got a friend who might be willing to restore it. Please don't trash it. He may trade parts for your 1R for it. Will check for sure. Trust me, Scott I am an antique electronics nut. If there was any way possible to get this thing back into safe operating condition, I would. When I was last in the station, I gave it a real close look-over. It has several rust holes in the cabinet and chassis, along with severe corrosion in all of the wiring. The breakers had been replaced with non-standard ones that had failed and were by-passed. When rust perferated a PCB capacitor, the oil escaped and shorted the high voltage transformer blowing a hole in it before popping the main power fuse to the station! The mercury vapor tubes were also broken. The transmitter cabinet is contaminated with PCBs and Mercury, but as far as I can tell, the toxic mess was contained in the bottom of the transmitter. The owner of the station said it was quite a show of fireworks inside of the transmitter, I bet it was! The data plate for the transmitter is missing, but since the station came on the air in the late '50s and it is a 30's vintage transmitter, somebody else had already got the "goodie" out of the old Gates before this station was even licensed. Anyway, several of the meters are missing from the old Gates, as well as the meter switches and Low Power switch! (How the hell did they take meter readings with no meters?!) Due to rust holes, high voltage is exposed when the transmitter is on the air. The modulation transformer is shorted to the case, so they just sat it on a block of wood! These are just a select few of the many problems the old Gates has. It is a crying shame, but this transmitter is FUBAR, and the rest of the radio station is in about the same state of repair as the transmitter. The good news is, I can put it on the air with a really cool vintage transmitter and build a vintage studio with antique goodies in one of the prod rooms. The main booth and other prod room will be modern stereo equipment. Perhaps I could patch in the antique studio to the air chain and broadcast old timey radio shows on Sunday from the "Historical Studio" for all of the local antique radio buffs to enjoy. I could even have "Open House" On "Vintage Radio Sunday" and give out bumper stickers and T-shirts along with any other junk I can cook up or trade out for. How about drawings for AM Stereo radios? That would be slick to give away AM Stereo Walkmans that are fixed to only hear MY station. No doubt, I could get the local High School cheerleader squad to make up some cheers for the station, like many did in the '50s. Wouldnt THAT be slick? Kevin From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Sat Dec 14 20:33:05 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Dec 2002 04:33:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 293 invoked from network); 15 Dec 2002 04:33:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Dec 2002 04:33:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf18bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.38) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Dec 2002 04:33:04 -0000 Received: from juan ([68.155.91.244]) by imf18bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.19 201-253-122-122-119-20020516) with SMTP id <20021215043238.EUAF14411.imf18bis.bellsouth.net@juan>; Sat, 14 Dec 2002 23:32:38 -0500 Message-ID: <007601c2a3f3$0fd4cd20$af78fea9@juan> To: , Subject: $5 Dollar Radio Date: Sat, 14 Dec 2002 23:33:05 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I ventured to Wally World today to buy the infamous $5 Radio. Selectivity sucks, but Sensitivity kicks A** for a little portable. Is it the best radio I have ever bought ?...No, but it is the best 5 bucks ever spent on a tiny radio. Heard lots of stuff, and it sounds good too. Just thought I'd throw my 2 cents in. Juan [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From n0uiheric@aol.com Sun Dec 15 00:19:54 2002 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 41931 invoked from network); 15 Dec 2002 08:19:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Dec 2002 08:19:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Dec 2002 08:19:54 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: N0UIHEric@aol.com Received: from [66.218.67.157] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Dec 2002 08:19:54 -0000 X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Dec 2002 06:12:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 3882 invoked from network); 15 Dec 2002 06:12:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Dec 2002 06:12:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d02.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.34) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Dec 2002 06:12:04 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-d02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.12e.1da8ba8c (4402) for ; Sun, 15 Dec 2002 01:11:58 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <12e.1da8ba8c.2b2d772e@aol.com> Date: Sun, 15 Dec 2002 01:11:58 EST Subject:Re: Question For Eric To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih X-eGroups-Edited-By: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-eGroups-Approved-By: kevtronics via web; 15 Dec 2002 08:19:53 -0000 My best advice is to run it with live programming in morning and, if one can afford it, afternoon drive. I would also set aside Sunday mornings for Christian programming; time for these shows can be brokered (I once worked in Christian radio). With alternative music, I don't know if there is a market for it where they are, but it's well worth a shot. But, avoid the artists who have negative reputations, such as Eminem, Marilyn Manson and some of the people who perform "gangsta rap". I would also mix in more alternative tracks from the '80s (ie: R.E.M., Depeche Mode, even as crude as The Dead Milkmen) and '90s (ie: Smashing Pumpkins, St. Etienne, Frank Black) with the current stuff. I worked for such a station; you would need a lot of variety with this format. To make it listenable, cram as many titles as you can into the studio computer (I would recommend a 120 GB hard drive or two); no station can get many listeners with just 300 titles! The computer at the radio station where I work currently has over 1,800 titles, plus another 5,000-6,000 titles in the studio collection. Limiting playlists have doomed many a station. The lowest rate I could find for satellite programming is $4,000 per year for "Jazz with Bob Parlocha"; however, it's fed for only 12 hours a night (10:00 p.m.-10:00 a.m. Eastern time). The show is fed from Chicago to both non-commercial and commercial stations. Many stations air this show overnights. If possible, you might want to develop a program of Native American music for the future. For examples of Native American programming, you might want to ask an Arizona listener for an aircheck of KTNN in Window Rock. They're a 50 kW full-time station on 660 that, as far as I know, broadcast programs in English and Navajo. You might also want to locate a nearby station airing Echoes (from Public Radio International), which plays some Native American music. As for technical details, use the equipment from your Part 15 station until you have the money needed for new equipment. Try to find a used transmitter (for backup) and exciter for a good price (I don't care if you have to rig up an Alfredo Lite to run on AC power). AMAX is a must. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sun Dec 15 00:42:33 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Dec 2002 08:42:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 22210 invoked from network); 15 Dec 2002 08:42:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Dec 2002 08:42:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Dec 2002 08:42:33 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.160] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Dec 2002 08:42:33 -0000 Date: Sun, 15 Dec 2002 08:42:29 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Vinyl Rules! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <003601c2a30e$9d96ca90$af78fea9@juan> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 198 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 66.25.34.70 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Juan / John Gualda" wrote: > > I have also heard about the non compatibility of 33/45 with 78's Is it a matter of the stylus ? > Yes. JSG From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Sun Dec 15 05:17:42 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Dec 2002 13:17:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 17178 invoked from network); 15 Dec 2002 13:17:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Dec 2002 13:17:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf01bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.161) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Dec 2002 13:17:40 -0000 Received: from juan ([68.155.91.244]) by imf01bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.19 201-253-122-122-119-20020516) with SMTP id <20021215131929.IEFB3518.imf01bis.bellsouth.net@juan> for ; Sun, 15 Dec 2002 08:19:29 -0500 Message-ID: <002e01c2a43c$587c4f50$af78fea9@juan> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Vinyl Rules! Date: Sun, 15 Dec 2002 08:17:40 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I took the advice from Chris C. and went to the J and R website. Found a Thorens with 78 (needs seperate stylus for 78, at $34.99) but that's ok. I have heard nice things about the Thorens. Juan ----- Original Message ----- From: jsgilst To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, December 15, 2002 3:42 AM Subject: {AMSF} Re: Vinyl Rules! --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Juan / John Gualda" wrote: > > I have also heard about the non compatibility of 33/45 with 78's Is it a matter of the stylus ? > Yes. JSG [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sun Dec 15 12:49:28 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Dec 2002 20:49:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 5012 invoked from network); 15 Dec 2002 20:49:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Dec 2002 20:49:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.86) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Dec 2002 20:49:27 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.148] by n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Dec 2002 20:49:26 -0000 Date: Sun, 15 Dec 2002 20:49:26 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: data sheet needed Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <007001a8ea64$2b18e880$827dfea9@home1> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 968 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.255 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Scott Todd" wrote: > I'm trying to convert a Sansui 5050 to AMS for a friend of mine. The AM chip is an HA1197. I tried to find a data sheet on the Hitachi web site, but nothing turns up. I'm trying to best determine which pins to use in the conversion. I've got the 5050 schematic, but I'm left to wonder about the function of some of those pins, and so believe I'd be helped with the data sheet. Thanks to anyone who can help. > > Scott Todd > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] It converts to a NTE1214 and the NTE crossreference has the pinouts ladeled. Hope This helps. 1 RF Amp DC Bypass 2 RF Tune 3 Converter Vcc 4 RF Amp Output 5 Converter Output 6 OSC Tank Circuit 7 Converter Input 8 3rd IF Amp Input 9 2nd IF Amp OUtput 10 DC Return (Substrate) 11 IF System Vcc 12 Detector Output 13 3rd IF Input Tune 14 AGC Bypass 15 Tune Meter Output 16 RF Amp DC Bypass JSG From stodd@sherbtel.net Sun Dec 15 12:50:43 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Dec 2002 20:50:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 18446 invoked from network); 15 Dec 2002 20:50:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Dec 2002 20:50:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Dec 2002 20:50:43 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-88.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.88]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gBFKodOd008996 for ; Sun, 15 Dec 2002 14:50:40 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <001d01a8eaf0$989880a0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <024d01c2a3e8$487d3320$f7d63fd1@com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Here we go! READ THIS Date: Fri, 4 Jan 1980 23:15:16 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Is it just my imagination, or did page 18 also contain a contradiction regarding WMC? From the end of the middle paragraph- "Under the five rule test, WMC would not be able to transmit the upper primary sidebands due to New Orleans. However, with reference to Class B stations, WMC would be able to transmit the lower promary sideband at "normal power." Now from the end of the following paragraph- "Under the five-rule test, WMC would be permitted to transmit the upper primary sideband at full power but would not be able to transmit the lower primary sideband." From that set of statements, looks like they wouldn't be able to transmit IBOC at all. One thing I'm definitely going to hit upon is their ascertion that it could be allowed in the expanded band immediately. The fact that portion of the band is the only place where it could be immediately actually shows digital needs a new band, not retrofitted into the old one, as there will be too many disparities, and some stations such as those in congested areas might not get as much bang for their HD buck as those in more sparsely populated regions. Scott Todd ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" > "Regrettably, both computer models and field tests have shown that night > time use of the AM IBOC system can in certain instances, lead to intolerable > levels of interference to the ongoing operation of legacy analog > broadcasting for first-adjacent channel stations. > > So what is it? Is it interfering or not a problem. From stodd@sherbtel.net Sun Dec 15 12:54:13 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Dec 2002 20:54:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 96676 invoked from network); 15 Dec 2002 20:54:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Dec 2002 20:54:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Dec 2002 20:54:13 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-88.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.88]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gBFKs9Od009706 for ; Sun, 15 Dec 2002 14:54:10 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <002301a8eaf1$158e8dc0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <129.1d7c8e02.2b2b996c@aol.com> <001601a8eac8$9cb84940$827dfea9@home1> <000e01a8ea55$b5ec4c40$827dfea9@home1> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Gates BC1E Was:Question For Eric Date: Fri, 4 Jan 1980 23:18:46 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude BC1E would be late 40s vintage. I think there's still one in standby service at KASM in Albany MN. You're right about it being FUBAR with that description. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Possum Hunter" To: Sent: Saturday, December 14, 2002 9:48 PM Subject: {AMSF} Gates BC1E Was:Question For Eric > Scott Todd wrote: > > I've got a friend who might be willing to restore it. Please don't trash > it. He may trade parts for your 1R for it. Will check for sure. > > Trust me, Scott I am an antique electronics nut. If there was any way > possible to get this thing back into safe operating condition, I would. When > I was last in the station, I gave it a real close look-over. It has several > rust holes in the cabinet and chassis, along with severe corrosion in all of > the wiring. The breakers had been replaced with non-standard ones that had > failed and were by-passed. When rust perferated a PCB capacitor, the oil > escaped and shorted the high voltage transformer blowing a hole in it before > popping the main power fuse to the station! The mercury vapor tubes were > also broken. The transmitter cabinet is contaminated with PCBs and Mercury, > but as far as I can tell, the toxic mess was contained in the bottom of the > transmitter. > > The owner of the station said it was quite a show of fireworks inside of the > transmitter, I bet it was! The data plate for the transmitter is missing, > but since the station came on the air in the late '50s and it is a 30's > vintage transmitter, somebody else had already got the "goodie" out of the > old Gates before this station was even licensed. > > Anyway, several of the meters are missing from the old Gates, as well as the > meter switches and Low Power switch! (How the hell did they take meter > readings with no meters?!) Due to rust holes, high voltage is exposed when > the transmitter is on the air. The modulation transformer is shorted to the > case, so they just sat it on a block of wood! These are just a select few of > the many problems the old Gates has. > > It is a crying shame, but this transmitter is FUBAR, and the rest of the > radio station is in about the same state of repair as the transmitter. > > > > The good news is, I can put it on the air with a really cool vintage > transmitter and build a vintage studio with antique goodies in one of the > prod rooms. The main booth and other prod room will be modern stereo > equipment. > > Perhaps I could patch in the antique studio to the air chain and broadcast > old timey radio shows on Sunday from the "Historical Studio" for all of the > local antique radio buffs to enjoy. I could even have "Open House" On > "Vintage Radio Sunday" and give out bumper stickers and T-shirts along with > any other junk I can cook up or trade out for. How about drawings for AM > Stereo radios? That would be slick to give away AM Stereo Walkmans that are > fixed to only hear MY station. No doubt, I could get the local High School > cheerleader squad to make up some cheers for the station, like many did in > the '50s. Wouldnt THAT be slick? > > Kevin > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > From michaelj@vcn.com Sun Dec 15 13:07:16 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Dec 2002 21:07:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 26842 invoked from network); 15 Dec 2002 21:07:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Dec 2002 21:07:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m1-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.31) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Dec 2002 21:07:15 -0000 Received: from michaelj (unverified [209.193.86.24]) by m1-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Sun, 15 Dec 2002 14:07:14 -0700 Message-ID: <004101c2a47d$860a89a0$1856c1d1@mshome.net> To: References: <176.130850e3.2b2d4d18@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Question For Eric Date: Sun, 15 Dec 2002 14:04:12 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit He he....I must have missed the original start of this thread. I only WISH I could still get the Eimac 4-400C's for MY McMartin here. This is our MAIN transmitter we're talking. 24/7 operation. Or should I say I wish the Eimac 4-400C's were still MADE. We're stuck with the Amperex's. Had a stint where I tried the ones from China. NEVER again. One of them went flat right away, another one litereally MELTED. The glass MELTED. THAT was interesting I must say. So it was back to the Amperex graphite tubes and a change-out every 6 months. Our McMartin just loves eating those Amperex's for lunch. I remember when we used to be able to get sometimes a year of use out of the Eimacs. Now I keep an even closer eye on them so that we can maintain the good quality stereo now that I did the AMS conversion back in August. 4 new Amperex tubes then, and those (knock on wood) are still going strong here in December. Must have gotten a good batch! MJR n WYO ----- Original Message ----- From: KC4QLP@aol.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, December 14, 2002 8:12 PM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Question For Eric In a message dated 12/14/02 9:22:02 PM Eastern Standard Time, possumhunter@netzero.net writes: << I have never had any luck with the graphite tubes, so I didn't even try them in my transmitter. I am running metal plate Eimac 4-400As. The worst tubes I have ever used are the Amperex tubes from France. They go soft FAST! > > Well dont feel bad .The graphites wont work in my Raytheon.But they do work well in my RCA...its amazing. In my McMartin..its half and half..it seems to like the combination of graphates in the RF and metal plate tubes in the modulator section.....now just gotta find where my high voltage short is in that rig. Amperex tubes....hehehe...the only thing they are good for are making lamps out of them.I've had to many of them in my McMartin where the grids would short out.Now these 833's made in China arent hitting on much either. An engineers work day is never done it seems...lol [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From stodd@sherbtel.net Sun Dec 15 13:08:43 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Dec 2002 21:08:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 13895 invoked from network); 15 Dec 2002 21:08:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Dec 2002 21:08:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Dec 2002 21:08:42 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-88.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.88]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gBFL8cOd012346 for ; Sun, 15 Dec 2002 15:08:40 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <003f01a8eaf3$1bddee80$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <3DFA5C4D.40B67A39@skyweb.net> <00ae01a8ea41$77899fc0$827dfea9@home1> <004901c2a3e0$0e08ba50$af78fea9@juan> Subject: Re: {AMSF} New news Date: Fri, 4 Jan 1980 23:33:16 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude It isn't nearly as bad as I'd feared. It is a "Petition for Reconsideration" and doesn't read any differently than any other formal FCC petition. I think the law firm was incorporated to keep everything in perfect form for Uncle. Basically they're asking the FCC to overturn its no IBOC at night ruling, saying that night HD may be implemented on most full time AM stations, and this document purports to give the conditions under which it can be done. I don't think they've fully made their case, and I intend to tell the FCC as much. ST ---- Original Message ----- From: "Juan / John Gualda" To: Sent: Saturday, December 14, 2002 8:17 PM Subject: Re: {AMSF} New news > I have received nothing yet.....what should I expect ? what does it say ? > > Let me know... > Thanks > > Juan > > gualdaj@bellsouth.net > > > > From: "Neal Newman" > > Chris Cuff,Myself,Mike Erickson,Donn TillmanJuan seems everyone that > > filed a comment to the FCC is On this list. so You should Be getting > > yours soon. > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > From stodd@sherbtel.net Sun Dec 15 13:11:10 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Dec 2002 21:11:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 46197 invoked from network); 15 Dec 2002 21:11:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Dec 2002 21:11:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Dec 2002 21:11:09 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-88.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.88]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gBFLB6Od012796 for ; Sun, 15 Dec 2002 15:11:07 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <004501a8eaf3$73cd3920$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <12e.1da8ba8c.2b2d772e@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Question For Eric Date: Fri, 4 Jan 1980 23:35:43 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Those were some pretty good suggestions, Eric, except Navajo is strictly SW America. Doubtless Possum Hunter would have to find or develop program material from the tribes that are native to his part of the country. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: > If possible, you might want to develop a program of Native American music for > the future. For examples of Native American programming, you might want to > ask an Arizona listener for an aircheck of KTNN in Window Rock. They're a 50 > kW full-time station on 660 that, as far as I know, broadcast programs in > English and Navajo. From michaelj@vcn.com Sun Dec 15 13:14:00 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Dec 2002 21:13:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 65546 invoked from network); 15 Dec 2002 21:13:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Dec 2002 21:13:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m1-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Dec 2002 21:14:00 -0000 Received: from michaelj (unverified [209.193.86.24]) by m1-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Sun, 15 Dec 2002 14:13:59 -0700 Message-ID: <005101c2a47e$77847840$1856c1d1@mshome.net> To: References: <007601c2a3f3$0fd4cd20$af78fea9@juan> Subject: Re: {AMSF} $5 Dollar Radio Date: Sun, 15 Dec 2002 14:10:52 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Well said Juan Did the same thing myself last night. This is a pretty amazing little $5 radio. Slectivity isn't the best, yet the nulling capabilities and directionalism of this little unit is pretty good. I'm really impressed! Especially for a "cheapest of the cheapos" $5 radio. MJR n WYO ----- Original Message ----- From: Juan / John Gualda To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com ; ABDX@topica.com Sent: Saturday, December 14, 2002 9:33 PM Subject: {AMSF} $5 Dollar Radio I ventured to Wally World today to buy the infamous $5 Radio. Selectivity sucks, but Sensitivity kicks A** for a little portable. Is it the best radio I have ever bought ?...No, but it is the best 5 bucks ever spent on a tiny radio. Heard lots of stuff, and it sounds good too. Just thought I'd throw my 2 cents in. Juan [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From stodd@sherbtel.net Sun Dec 15 13:17:05 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Dec 2002 21:17:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 57450 invoked from network); 15 Dec 2002 21:17:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Dec 2002 21:17:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Dec 2002 21:17:04 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-88.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.88]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gBFLH1Od013888 for ; Sun, 15 Dec 2002 15:17:02 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <005701a8eaf4$477cd000$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <002e01c2a43c$587c4f50$af78fea9@juan> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Vinyl Rules! Date: Fri, 4 Jan 1980 23:41:38 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude I've got an old Gates CB88- the BIG 16" platter. Got needles for microgroove (one mil for 45 and 33LP), and a three mil stylus for 78s and the old 16" 33RPM transcription disks. Got a whole pile of the latter of a locally produced program that used to air on KTIS, where I once worked. I loaned them the turntable and the disks so they could have copies for their archives. Using a Shure SC-39D cartridge. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Juan / John Gualda" > I took the advice from Chris C. and went to the J and R website. Found a Thorens with 78 (needs seperate stylus for 78, at $34.99) but that's ok. I have heard nice things about the Thorens. From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Sun Dec 15 13:21:01 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Dec 2002 21:21:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 77870 invoked from network); 15 Dec 2002 21:21:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Dec 2002 21:21:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web41009.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.93.8) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Dec 2002 21:21:00 -0000 Message-ID: <20021215212100.7739.qmail@web41009.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.35.104] by web41009.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 15 Dec 2002 13:21:00 PST Date: Sun, 15 Dec 2002 13:21:00 -0800 (PST) Subject: Lawyers thread To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: <024d01c2a3e8$487d3320$f7d63fd1@com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio If I were a pothead, I would've just received 26 free rolling papers! Oh, too much time in Florida! Hope your Sunday gets better, everyone. For the Aussies, I mean Monday. Back to listening to WBCQ/7.415. Good rock on the weekends. The rest of the time they blast some financial show at 4P.M. E.T.. For anyone who works at an AMS: How many of you are using SOLID STATE transmitters? Thanks and 73! N1WVQ __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From groucho@skyweb.net Sun Dec 15 13:22:24 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Dec 2002 21:22:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 85909 invoked from network); 15 Dec 2002 21:22:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Dec 2002 21:22:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Dec 2002 21:22:23 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gBFLSEeV043012 for ; Sun, 15 Dec 2002 16:28:14 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DFCF189.12AD9BF5@skyweb.net> Date: Sun, 15 Dec 2002 16:18:02 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Question For Eric References: <176.130850e3.2b2d4d18@aol.com> <004101c2a47d$860a89a0$1856c1d1@mshome.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 hey Michael do they have to be the 4-400C's because there is a pair of Eimac 4-400A's = NOS/NIB. On Ebay with a buy it Now of $325... he actually has 6 of them... If $325 is a good price for 2 let me know I have No Idea of what they go F= or Because I will Buy them to replace the 4-250's in My RCA BTA-500R Neal "Michael J. Richard" wrote: > He he....I must have missed the original start of this thread. I only WI= SH I could still get the Eimac 4-400C's for MY McMartin here. This is our = MAIN transmitter we're talking. 24/7 operation. Or should I say I wish th= e Eimac 4-400C's were still MADE. We're stuck with the Amperex's. Had a s= tint where I tried the ones from China. NEVER again. One of them went fla= t right away, another one litereally MELTED. The glass MELTED. THAT was i= nteresting I must say. So it was back to the Amperex graphite tubes and a = change-out every 6 months. Our McMartin just loves eating those Amperex's = for lunch. I remember when we used to be able to get sometimes a year of u= se out of the Eimacs. Now I keep an even closer eye on them so that we can= maintain the good quality stereo now that I did the AMS conversion back in= August. 4 new Amperex tubes then, and those (knock on wood) are still goi= ng strong here in December. Must have gotten a good batch! > > MJR n WYO > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: KC4QLP@aol.com > To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com > Sent: Saturday, December 14, 2002 8:12 PM > Subject: Re: {AMSF} Question For Eric > > In a message dated 12/14/02 9:22:02 PM Eastern Standard Time, > possumhunter@netzero.net writes: > > << I have never had any luck with the graphite tubes, so I didn't even = try > them > in my transmitter. I am running metal plate Eimac 4-400As. The worst tu= bes I > have ever used are the Amperex tubes from France. They go soft FAST! > > > > Well dont feel bad > .The graphites wont work in my Raytheon.But they do work well in my RCA= ...its > amazing. In my McMartin..its half and half..it seems to like the combin= ation > of graphates in the RF and metal plate tubes in the modulator section..= ...now > just gotta find where my high voltage short is in that rig. > Amperex tubes....hehehe...the only thing they are good for are making l= amps > out of them.I've had to many of them in my McMartin where the grids wou= ld > short out.Now these 833's made in China arent hitting on much either. > > An engineers work day is never done it seems...lol > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From stodd@sherbtel.net Sun Dec 15 13:31:15 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Dec 2002 21:31:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 40209 invoked from network); 15 Dec 2002 21:31:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Dec 2002 21:31:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Dec 2002 21:31:15 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-88.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.88]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gBFLVCOd016599 for ; Sun, 15 Dec 2002 15:31:13 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <005f01c2a481$4a3ad020$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: data sheet needed Date: Sun, 15 Dec 2002 15:31:09 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Big thanks! Looks like that's the ticket. I'll probably tap off of pin 8 and go from there. Didn't think I saw anything on the schematic that would indicate it could be tapped between the third IF amp and detector, but my experience with the 13028 tells me there's probably enough gain to be on par with what's there. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: > It converts to a NTE1214 and the NTE crossreference has the > pinouts ladeled. Hope This helps. From groucho@skyweb.net Sun Dec 15 13:33:56 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Dec 2002 21:33:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 74143 invoked from network); 15 Dec 2002 21:33:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Dec 2002 21:33:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Dec 2002 21:33:55 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gBFLdieV046149 for ; Sun, 15 Dec 2002 16:39:45 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DFCF43C.9D45B54F@skyweb.net> Date: Sun, 15 Dec 2002 16:29:32 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Lawyers thread References: <20021215212100.7739.qmail@web41009.mail.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 JNR wrote: I am... Harris DX-10 and a Gates One > For anyone who works at an AMS: How many of you > are using SOLID STATE transmitters? > > Thanks and 73! > N1WVQ > > __________________________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. > http://mailplus.yahoo.com > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From stodd@sherbtel.net Sun Dec 15 13:37:39 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Dec 2002 21:37:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 94318 invoked from network); 15 Dec 2002 21:37:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Dec 2002 21:37:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Dec 2002 21:37:38 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-88.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.88]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gBFLbZOd018150 for ; Sun, 15 Dec 2002 15:37:36 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <006901c2a482$2ee8aee0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <176.130850e3.2b2d4d18@aol.com> <004101c2a47d$860a89a0$1856c1d1@mshome.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Question For Eric Date: Sun, 15 Dec 2002 15:37:33 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Have you tried the Sovteks? I've heard a lot of bad reports about the Chinese stuff, but Russian seems to at least be a mixed bag. I talked with the former engineer of KYFR (ex KFNF), and they were going through 4-400s in six months as well when they were still using the old Wilkinson AM-1000A (now in my collection) as their main. I think Eimacs were still available then. It had Amperex inside when I got it. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael J. Richard" Had a stint where I tried the ones from China. NEVER again. One of them went flat right away, another one litereally MELTED. The glass MELTED. From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Sun Dec 15 14:13:17 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Dec 2002 22:13:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 97392 invoked from network); 15 Dec 2002 22:13:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Dec 2002 22:13:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf38bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.59) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Dec 2002 22:13:16 -0000 Received: from juan ([67.34.223.235]) by imf38bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.19 201-253-122-122-119-20020516) with SMTP id <20021215221506.DVAD7813.imf38bis.bellsouth.net@juan> for ; Sun, 15 Dec 2002 17:15:06 -0500 Message-ID: <000601c2a487$2bb72bc0$af78fea9@juan> To: References: <007601c2a3f3$0fd4cd20$af78fea9@juan> <005101c2a47e$77847840$1856c1d1@mshome.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} $5 Dollar Radio Date: Sun, 15 Dec 2002 17:13:17 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit It is $ well spent. Had a ball last night with it. Of course my wife said...."what do you need another radio for ?" I said...well what do you need another pair of shoes for ? The conversation ended there. Juan From: Michael J. Richard Subject: Re: {AMSF} $5 Dollar Radio Well said Juan Did the same thing myself last night. This is a pretty amazing little $5 radio. Slectivity isn't the best, yet the nulling capabilities and directionalism of this little unit is pretty good. I'm really impressed! Especially for a "cheapest of the cheapos" $5 radio. MJR n WYO ----- Original Message ----- From: Juan / John Gualda To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com ; ABDX@topica.com Sent: Saturday, December 14, 2002 9:33 PM Subject: {AMSF} $5 Dollar Radio I ventured to Wally World today to buy the infamous $5 Radio. Selectivity sucks, but Sensitivity kicks A** for a little portable. Is it the best radio I have ever bought ?...No, but it is the best 5 bucks ever spent on a tiny radio. Heard lots of stuff, and it sounds good too. Just thought I'd throw my 2 cents in. Juan [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From davidcoons@webtv.net Sun Dec 15 15:32:20 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: davidcoons@webtv.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Dec 2002 23:32:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 82333 invoked from network); 15 Dec 2002 23:32:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Dec 2002 23:32:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO smtpout-2001-2.public.lawson.webtv.net) (209.240.212.82) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Dec 2002 23:32:19 -0000 Received: from storefull-2315.public.lawson.webtv.net (lawson-public-ipmux-1-pip-3.public.lawson.webtv.net [209.240.212.23]) by smtpout-2001-2.public.lawson.webtv.net (WebTV_Postfix+sws) with ESMTP id 5D64679C2E for ; Sun, 15 Dec 2002 15:32:19 -0800 (PST) Received: (from production@localhost) by storefull-2315.public.lawson.webtv.net (8.8.8-wtv-f/mt.gso.26Feb98) id PAA06251; Sun, 15 Dec 2002 15:32:19 -0800 (PST) X-WebTV-Signature: 1 ETAtAhUAnLVHOElxytXEIxoTN/npgKLsNUoCFHztW9ub5GLzueEZlt9waKSgZ9RI Date: Sun, 15 Dec 2002 18:32:18 -0500 (EST) To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: iboc report Message-ID: <10654-3DFD1102-4408@storefull-2315.public.lawson.webtv.net> In-Reply-To: "Scott Todd" 's message of Sun, 15 Dec 2002 15:37:33 -0600 Content-Disposition: Inline Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) X-eGroups-From: davidcoons@webtv.net (David Coons) From: davidcoons@webtv.net X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10533228 I have recieved in the mail,a many page report "petition for reconsideration"mm docket 99-325 "digital audio broadcasting and their impact on terrestrial broadcasting" atempting to make a case for night time use of iboc,from garvey,schubert and barker washinton dc......since I am not in the radio industry in ay way why?? has anyone else on the list gotten the same? From groucho@skyweb.net Sun Dec 15 15:50:03 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Dec 2002 23:50:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 6934 invoked from network); 15 Dec 2002 23:50:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Dec 2002 23:50:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Dec 2002 23:50:02 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gBFNtqeV084852 for ; Sun, 15 Dec 2002 18:55:53 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DFD1421.60DE3A8@skyweb.net> Date: Sun, 15 Dec 2002 18:45:37 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} iboc report References: <10654-3DFD1102-4408@storefull-2315.public.lawson.webtv.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 David you probably sent in some comment to the FCC about IBOC at some point. seems everyone who Filed a comment Got one of these packages davidcoons@webtv.net wrote: > I have recieved in the mail,a many page report "petition for > reconsideration"mm docket 99-325 "digital audio broadcasting and their > impact on terrestrial broadcasting" atempting to make a case for night > time use of iboc,from garvey,schubert and barker washinton dc......since > I am not in the radio industry in ay way why?? has anyone else on the > list gotten the same? > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From radams5451@aol.com Sun Dec 15 16:39:59 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: radams5451@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Dec 2002 00:39:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 53931 invoked from network); 16 Dec 2002 00:39:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Dec 2002 00:39:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Dec 2002 00:39:56 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.176] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Dec 2002 00:39:54 -0000 Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 00:39:52 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Can anyone explain this phenomenon? Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 462 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Bob " X-Originating-IP: 205.188.209.76 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=58804163 X-Yahoo-Profile: solitary_hiker Tonight I was going to play a cd so I turned on my amp. Before I could turn on my cd player I began to hear what was clearly a radio transmission. The announcer was speaking French. The nearest French speaking location to me is Quebec. I live in upstate South Carolina. I guess it could have been a AM/FM broadcast but maybe short or long wave. The thing is I didn't have my tuner turned on. Can anyone explain this to me? Thanks and best regards, bob From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Dec 15 17:07:36 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Dec 2002 01:07:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 88058 invoked from network); 16 Dec 2002 01:07:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Dec 2002 01:07:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Dec 2002 01:07:35 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.156] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Dec 2002 01:07:35 -0000 Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 01:07:33 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Can anyone explain this phenomenon? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1246 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.81.25 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > I guess it could have been a AM/FM broadcast but maybe short or > long wave. The thing is I didn't have my tuner turned on. > Can anyone explain this to me? Somehow your audio amplifier picked up a radio signal and "rectified" it, allowing you to hear it. If a strong signal is present, and/or the audio device is rather cheaply made, this can happen quite often. For example, at night I can hear shortwave stations in the telephone handset of my fax machine. And try using a CB or ham radio transmitter in the same room in which a set of amplified computer speakers are on! I've also heard of guitar amplifiers picking up 2-way radio communications. What you heard was probably indeed a French language shortwave station from Canada. The CBC has some high-power transmitters up there, and in addition to the U.S. shortwave stations (which are pretty much all religious), they are some of the strongest shortwave you will pick up in North America. If it happens again, try to listen at the top of the hour and you should hear some station identification, perhaps preceded by a repeating piece of music or sound effect -- a so-called "interval signal" which shortwave stations use to help listeners find them on the dial. From possumhunter@netzero.net Sun Dec 15 17:34:58 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: possumhunter@netzero.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Dec 2002 01:34:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 20741 invoked from network); 16 Dec 2002 01:34:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Dec 2002 01:34:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rly-ip03.mx.aol.com) (64.12.138.7) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Dec 2002 01:34:57 -0000 Received: from logs-we.proxy.aol.com (logs-we.proxy.aol.com [205.188.195.5]) by rly-ip03.mx.aol.com (v89.10) with ESMTP id RELAYIN6-1215203408; Sun, 15 Dec 2002 20:34:08 -0500 Received: from ibm (AC89D8B3.ipt.aol.com [172.137.216.179]) by logs-we.proxy.aol.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with SMTP id gBG1WFc09668 for ; Sun, 15 Dec 2002 20:32:17 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <009201c2a4a2$f2365760$b3d889ac@aoldsl.net> To: References: <176.130850e3.2b2d4d18@aol.com> <004101c2a47d$860a89a0$1856c1d1@mshome.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Question For Eric Date: Sun, 15 Dec 2002 20:32:04 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Apparently-From: DodgeRamTrucker@aol.com From: "Possum Hunter" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Michael J. Richard wrote: > I only WISH I could still get the Eimac 4-400C's for MY McMartin here. You poor fellow, I would rather have to run that BC1E I may end up eating than a BRAND NEW McMartin! > >We're stuck with the Amperex's. Had a stint where I tried the ones from China. NEVER again. One of them went flat right away, another one literally MELTED. I have a melted tube I keep on my bar. it is a conversation starter. > >So it was back to the Amperex graphite tubes and a change-out every 6 months. Our McMartin just loves eating those Amperex's for lunch. One of the local Class Cs are on the air with a RCA BTA1S. He is getting nearly 14 months out of a set of Penta 4-400As. He rotates the modulator and PA tubes about once every other week. The Hungarian tubes tend to be made well too. Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Sun Dec 15 17:35:02 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Dec 2002 01:35:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 46684 invoked from network); 16 Dec 2002 01:35:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Dec 2002 01:35:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.94) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Dec 2002 01:35:01 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 15 Dec 2002 17:35:01 -0800 To: References: <176.130850e3.2b2d4d18@aol.com> <004101c2a47d$860a89a0$1856c1d1@mshome.net> <3DFCF189.12AD9BF5@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Question For Eric Date: Sun, 15 Dec 2002 20:34:45 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 16 Dec 2002 01:35:01.0605 (UTC) FILETIME=[59FB2150:01C2A4A3] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.137.216.179] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Neal Newman wrote: >there is a pair of Eimac 4-400A's NOS/NIB. On Ebay with a buy it Now of $325... he actually has 6 of them... If $325 is a good price for 2 let me know That is a bargain. www.tubesandmore.com gets $314.60 per tube for them! Kevin From KC4QLP@aol.com Sun Dec 15 17:48:28 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Dec 2002 01:48:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 86501 invoked from network); 16 Dec 2002 01:48:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Dec 2002 01:48:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r09.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.105) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Dec 2002 01:48:27 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r09.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.158.18fcf44b (4254) for ; Sun, 15 Dec 2002 20:48:24 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <158.18fcf44b.2b2e8ae7@aol.com> Date: Sun, 15 Dec 2002 20:48:23 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Here we go! READ THIS To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows sub 32 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/15/02 3:51:25 PM EST, stodd@sherbtel.net writes: << Is it just my imagination, or did page 18 also contain a contradiction regarding WMC? From the end of the middle paragraph- "Under the five rule test, WMC would not be able to transmit the upper primary sidebands due to New Orleans. However, with reference to Class B stations, WMC would be able to transmit the lower promary sideband at "normal power." >> Its my judgement that the whole thing is full of contradictions. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From KC4QLP@aol.com Sun Dec 15 18:03:04 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Dec 2002 02:03:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 75190 invoked from network); 16 Dec 2002 02:03:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Dec 2002 02:03:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d10.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.42) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Dec 2002 02:03:03 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d10.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.18b.1324e0f1 (4254) for ; Sun, 15 Dec 2002 21:02:53 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <18b.1324e0f1.2b2e8e4c@aol.com> Date: Sun, 15 Dec 2002 21:02:52 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Lawyers thread To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows sub 32 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/15/02 4:22:07 PM EST, a1asurfradio@yahoo.com writes: << For anyone who works at an AMS: How many of you are using SOLID STATE transmitters? >> Very good question.I'd be interesting in knowing what all of the AM broadcasters are using today. Seems like this IBOC mode isnt compatable with the ol cast iron boiler plate tube rigs.Hmmm...somewheres I'm hearing the ringing of cash registers at equipment manufactures. That ringing certainly cant be the man down the corner ringing the bell for the Salavation Army Tis the season! Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From KC4QLP@aol.com Sun Dec 15 18:04:32 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Dec 2002 02:04:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 51044 invoked from network); 16 Dec 2002 02:04:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Dec 2002 02:04:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r02.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.98) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Dec 2002 02:04:31 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.145.532fdbd (4254) for ; Sun, 15 Dec 2002 21:04:28 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <145.532fdbd.2b2e8eac@aol.com> Date: Sun, 15 Dec 2002 21:04:28 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Question For Eric To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows sub 32 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/15/02 4:23:14 PM EST, groucho@skyweb.net writes: << On Ebay with a buy it Now of $325... he actually has 6 of them... If $325 is a good price for 2 let me know I have No Idea of what they go For Because I will Buy them to replace the 4-250's in My RCA BTA-500R Neal >> $325 for two!...heck yeah thats a good price! Grab'em up! Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From possumhunter@netzero.net Sun Dec 15 18:19:10 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: possumhunter@netzero.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Dec 2002 02:19:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 9094 invoked from network); 16 Dec 2002 02:19:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Dec 2002 02:19:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rly-ip01.mx.aol.com) (205.188.156.49) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Dec 2002 02:19:09 -0000 Received: from logs-we.proxy.aol.com (logs-we.proxy.aol.com [205.188.195.5]) by rly-ip01.mx.aol.com (v83.35) with ESMTP id RELAYIN1-1215211833; Sun, 15 Dec 2002 21:18:33 -0500 Received: from ibm (AC89D8B3.ipt.aol.com [172.137.216.179]) by logs-we.proxy.aol.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with SMTP id gBG2G1c70095 for ; Sun, 15 Dec 2002 21:16:01 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <00c701c2a4a9$0e36dce0$b3d889ac@aoldsl.net> To: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Can anyone explain this phenomenon? Date: Sun, 15 Dec 2002 21:15:49 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Apparently-From: DodgeRamTrucker@aol.com From: "Possum Hunter" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 radams5451@aol.com wrote: > Before I could turn on my cd player I began to hear what was clearly a radio transmission. The announcer was speaking French. The nearest French speaking location to me is Quebec. I live in upstate South Carolina. Where in the Upstate are you? I am on the Anderson County-Greenville County Line. > >Can anyone explain this to me? Yep! If you are in West Greenville, There is a new Pirate station on 1680 serving the African American community. It frequently airs programs from the station "Africa 1" in French. I have also heard Caribbean music, ministers, and English language history programming. I am glad to see this little pirate station spitting in the eye of Cox's WJMZ 107.3 and WHTZ 98.1. Let's all hope the pirate listeners get all of the Arbitron diaries that normally hit WJMZ listeners. I have not had the time to devote to a "Fox Hunt" to find the station, but it has MUCH better audio than the other black religious station, WPJM 800. I have been thinking about going to WPJM and fixing it, but I don't want them any louder because they have a mean second harmonic on 1600 that wipes out WFIS in Greer. Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Sun Dec 15 18:26:24 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Dec 2002 02:26:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 76022 invoked from network); 16 Dec 2002 02:26:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Dec 2002 02:26:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.86) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Dec 2002 02:26:23 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 15 Dec 2002 18:26:23 -0800 To: References: <20021215212100.7739.qmail@web41009.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Lawyers thread Date: Sun, 15 Dec 2002 21:26:12 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 16 Dec 2002 02:26:23.0836 (UTC) FILETIME=[872241C0:01C2A4AA] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.137.216.179] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 JNR wrote: > For anyone who works at an AMS: How many of you are using SOLID STATE transmitters? I am fixing to convert one to stereo. I have a Part 15 rig in Kahn Stereo too. Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Sun Dec 15 18:49:53 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: possumhunter@netzero.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Dec 2002 02:49:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 6571 invoked from network); 16 Dec 2002 02:49:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Dec 2002 02:49:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rly-ip05.mx.aol.com) (64.12.138.9) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Dec 2002 02:49:53 -0000 Received: from logs-we.proxy.aol.com (logs-we.proxy.aol.com [205.188.195.5]) by rly-ip05.mx.aol.com (v89.10) with ESMTP id RELAYIN2-1215214927; Sun, 15 Dec 2002 21:49:27 1900 Received: from ibm (AC89D8B3.ipt.aol.com [172.137.216.179]) by logs-we.proxy.aol.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with SMTP id gBG2kqc107698 for ; Sun, 15 Dec 2002 21:46:53 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <00fc01c2a4ad$5e5f5a40$b3d889ac@aoldsl.net> To: References: <18b.1324e0f1.2b2e8e4c@aol.com> Subject: IBOC Conversion Was: Lawyers thread Date: Sun, 15 Dec 2002 21:46:41 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Apparently-From: DodgeRamTrucker@aol.com From: "Possum Hunter" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 KC4QLP@aol.com> > Seems like this IBOC mode isnt compatable with the ol cast iron boiler plate tube rigs.Hmmm...somewheres I'm hearing the ringing of cash registers at equipment manufactures. Here is the scoop on Solid State conversions to IBOC: No Harris "SX" or "Gates" series can be converted to IBOC. The only "MW" series transmitter than can be converted is the MW1A. The problem is the PDM board is not fast enough to handle the wide band IBOC signal. Harris is supposed to be working on the problem. The Harris "DX" series are IBOC ready, but require modification to the VSWR protection circuit to work with IBiquity HD Radio. No Continental or Energy Onix PDM transmitter can be converted for the same reason. All Nautel and BE Solid State transmitters are C-QUAM ready and IBOC compatible. Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Sun Dec 15 19:45:21 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Dec 2002 03:45:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 73671 invoked from network); 16 Dec 2002 03:45:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Dec 2002 03:45:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.89) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Dec 2002 03:45:20 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 15 Dec 2002 19:45:20 -0800 To: References: <12e.1da8ba8c.2b2d772e@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Question For Eric Date: Sun, 15 Dec 2002 22:45:07 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 16 Dec 2002 03:45:20.0757 (UTC) FILETIME=[8E8F0A50:01C2A4B5] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.137.216.179] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 n0uiheric@aol.com wrote: > With alternative music, I don't know if there is a market for it where they are, but it's well worth a shot. I honestly don't think that would fly, and I don't have the music to program it. For best selection, I have an Oldies format that is ready to air, but there is already a 6KW FM running ABC's Pure Gold satellite format, and a 5KW AM running "The Oldies Channel" I have enough music for a Big Band-Swing Format, but the 65+ Demo does not attract many advertisers. I also have enough music to do a good job with a soft Celtic format.(Enya, Loreena McKennit, Secret Garden) I just wonder if that may be a tad obscure run 24/7 I would also like to run a Smooth Jazz or R&B Oldies, but I don't have the music. The station went broke playing Country and Southern Gospel music. > > no station can get many listeners with just 300 titles! That is what makes me think I can go head to head with the other two oldies outlets. They just keep on playing to same 200 or so songs over and over and over. I have 2600 Oldies in MPEG Layer2 already in the computer running my Part 15. All I would have to do is change the IDs and it is "Plug and Play" > > If possible, you might want to develop a program of Native American music for the future. Now THAT would be a good thing to run on Sundays! There are many Cherokee in this area. > > As for technical details, use the equipment from your Part 15 station until you have the money needed for new equipment. Hmm, The stuff on my Part 15 is better than what is on the air in 99% of the commercial stations! > > Try to find a used transmitter (for backup) and exciter for a good price What I want to do is get a New BE as the main transmitter, and use the classic RCA for old timey radio programs and such. For a while, the RCA will have to be the only transmitter. > > (I don't care if you have to rig up an Alfredo Lite to run on AC power). AMAX is a must. Agreed! I played around with the RCA this evening, and I don't think it is going to work in CQUAM. It has a good bit of phase distortion in it. Kevin From amfmdx@fastq.com Sun Dec 15 19:53:21 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Dec 2002 03:53:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 337 invoked from network); 16 Dec 2002 03:53:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Dec 2002 03:53:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Dec 2002 03:53:20 -0000 Received: from fastq (d163-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.195]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gBG3rIv19190 for ; Sun, 15 Dec 2002 20:53:18 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <02e901c2a4b6$813480a0$49f9bed8@com> To: References: <024d01c2a3e8$487d3320$f7d63fd1@com> <001d01a8eaf0$989880a0$827dfea9@home1> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Here we go! READ THIS Date: Sun, 15 Dec 2002 20:51:57 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > Is it just my imagination, or did page 18 also contain a contradiction > regarding WMC? From the end of the middle paragraph- "Under the five rule > test, WMC would not be able to transmit the upper primary sidebands due to > New Orleans. However, with reference to Class B stations, WMC would be able > to transmit the lower promary sideband at "normal power." Yes. You caught it. They want to transmit in a way that is like Kahn POWERside. Anyway, most of the signal is for error correction. When you are at the fringe of the signal or on skywave you have to have the error correction factor from both sidebands. With one sideband and little or no error correction with even the slightest selective fade, you will have drop outs. I would not want to rely on IBAC as it is with two sidebands but with one and loss of most of the error correction, then its going to be really ugly. What I want to know is this. Say you have the digital signal locked. Say theres a fade. We all know that digital signals are prone to dropouts. I know it because I have a cell phone.... Anyway the digital signal is locked, the car you are in moves into a dead spot. It drops to analog and since digital has to be fed into a buffer to work its lagging behind the analog for a few seconds. We are told that the signal will drop to IBAC mono and if there are enough errors to analog. What happens when the signal reverts to analog? Do you lose 7 - 10 seconds of program? When the buffer fills and returns to digital, do you hear 10 -15 seconds of audio all over again? That sure will be irritating if that happens. Kevin From amfmdx@fastq.com Sun Dec 15 19:57:52 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Dec 2002 03:57:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 35360 invoked from network); 16 Dec 2002 03:57:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Dec 2002 03:57:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Dec 2002 03:57:51 -0000 Received: from fastq (d163-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.195]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gBG3vov19281 for ; Sun, 15 Dec 2002 20:57:50 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <02fb01c2a4b7$22f75480$49f9bed8@com> To: References: <007601c2a3f3$0fd4cd20$af78fea9@juan> <005101c2a47e$77847840$1856c1d1@mshome.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} $5 Dollar Radio Date: Sun, 15 Dec 2002 20:56:37 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla Will you be able to buy an IBOC radio for $5? ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael J. Richard" To: Sent: Sunday, December 15, 2002 2:10 PM Subject: Re: {AMSF} $5 Dollar Radio > Well said Juan > Did the same thing myself last night. This is a pretty amazing little $5 radio. Slectivity isn't the best, yet the nulling capabilities and directionalism of this little unit is pretty good. I'm really impressed! Especially for a "cheapest of the cheapos" $5 radio. From possumhunter@netzero.net Sun Dec 15 20:02:58 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Dec 2002 04:02:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 86912 invoked from network); 16 Dec 2002 04:02:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Dec 2002 04:02:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.88) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Dec 2002 04:02:56 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 15 Dec 2002 20:02:55 -0800 To: References: <129.1d7c8e02.2b2b996c@aol.com> <001601a8eac8$9cb84940$827dfea9@home1> <000e01a8ea55$b5ec4c40$827dfea9@home1> <002301a8eaf1$158e8dc0$827dfea9@home1> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Gates BC1E Was:Question For Eric Date: Sun, 15 Dec 2002 23:02:43 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 16 Dec 2002 04:02:55.0993 (UTC) FILETIME=[03874690:01C2A4B8] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.137.216.179] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Scott Todd wrote: >You're right about it being FUBAR with that description. The WHOLE STATION is in the same condition! The bearings on the turntables are worn so you can shake the platters! They have 2 well-worn Radio Shack cassette decks and all of the spots were on cassette because the cart machines died. They also have 2 Radio Shack WalkmanCD players (only one works) and one Radio shack mike that works. The only working board is a "bottom of the line" Realistic by Radio Shack. "EAS?" you may ask....ROFL...Yea RITE, uh huh SURE! The "Engineering room" and prod rooms are littered with scavenged equipment with most of the parts gone. I *THINK* I can salvage enough parts to fix my classic Gates "Yard" tube console! There is half of one in the engineering room. Kevin From amfmdx@fastq.com Sun Dec 15 20:09:45 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Dec 2002 04:09:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 91255 invoked from network); 16 Dec 2002 04:09:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Dec 2002 04:09:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Dec 2002 04:09:44 -0000 Received: from fastq (d163-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.195]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gBG49hv19428 for ; Sun, 15 Dec 2002 21:09:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <032a01c2a4b8$cbb57600$49f9bed8@com> To: References: <007601c2a3f3$0fd4cd20$af78fea9@juan> <005101c2a47e$77847840$1856c1d1@mshome.net> <000601c2a487$2bb72bc0$af78fea9@juan> Subject: Re: {AMSF} $5 Dollar Radio Date: Sun, 15 Dec 2002 21:08:30 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > Of course my wife said...."what do you need another radio for ?" I said...well what do you need another pair of shoes for ? > > The conversation ended there. I laughed my sorry butt off when I read this because we have had this conversation at my house before. Thanks for the laugh of the week! Kevin From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Dec 15 20:39:57 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Dec 2002 04:39:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 80011 invoked from network); 16 Dec 2002 04:39:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Dec 2002 04:39:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Dec 2002 04:39:57 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.139] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Dec 2002 04:39:57 -0000 Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 04:39:56 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: IBOC Conversion Was: Lawyers thread Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <00fc01c2a4ad$5e5f5a40$b3d889ac@aoldsl.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1031 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.81.25 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > No Continental or Energy Onix PDM transmitter can be converted for > the same reason. 710 WOR's engineer claims they have plans to try to make their old Continental (a 317C, I believe) backup transmitter work with IBOC. I hope they can't, though, because when it's on the air, the rich vacuum tube sound combined with full AMAX audio really makes them sound good.... at least in comparison to the way they sound with IBOC on; 660 WFAN, 770 WABC, and 880 WCBS have all always sounded better than WOR, even when they were using the Continental as their main transmitter (up to 1997). Speaking of which... I also have word that WOR's Christmas music this year will be transmitted with the same lousy 6 kHz audio bandwidth they normally use, with IBOC on during the daytime -- EXCEPT for after midnight on Christmas Eve when they'll switch to the full-bandwidth Continental, quote, "to make you AMAX lovers happy". Of course it'll still be mono, but it will be a rare chance to hear WOR with full-quality analog audio. From possumhunter@netzero.net Sun Dec 15 21:07:38 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Dec 2002 05:07:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 56644 invoked from network); 16 Dec 2002 05:07:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Dec 2002 05:07:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.123) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Dec 2002 05:07:37 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 15 Dec 2002 21:07:37 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC Conversion Was: Lawyers thread Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 00:07:24 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 16 Dec 2002 05:07:37.0008 (UTC) FILETIME=[0CCB2B00:01C2A4C1] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.137.216.179] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 kevtronics@yahoo.com wrote: > 710 WOR's engineer claims they have plans to try to make their old Continental (a 317C, I believe) backup transmitter work with IBOC. Uh huh, Yea Sure. A transmitter has to have frequency response out to 25Khz to work with IBOC. Depending on what generation the audio deck is, the 317C is only good out to 7 to 12 Khz. When they were running a 317 full time, WLW always sounded better when they were on the old 50KW Westinghouse. > > 660 WFAN, 770 WABC, and 880 WCBS have all always sounded better than WOR, "Just why did those stations sound better?", you may ask The one thing they all had in common was RCA Transmitters! > >I also have word that WOR's Christmas music this year will be transmitted with the same lousy 6 kHz audio bandwidth they normally use, with IBOC on during the daytime I wish I had a 50KW Class A in New York. As bad as the audio is getting on the New York stations I can hear (WFAN, WOR, WABC, WCBS, WQXR), If a fellow was to put a Stereo music format on one of them with a good audio chain and a DX50 transmitter, He should be able to pull a 10+ share! Kevin From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Dec 15 22:04:25 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Dec 2002 06:04:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 40412 invoked from network); 16 Dec 2002 06:04:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Dec 2002 06:04:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.87) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Dec 2002 06:04:24 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.188] by n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Dec 2002 06:04:24 -0000 Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 06:04:23 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Here we go! READ THIS Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <02e901c2a4b6$813480a0$49f9bed8@com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2132 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.81.25 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Anyway, most of the signal is for error correction. When you are > at the fringe of the signal or on skywave you have to have the > error correction factor from both sidebands. With one sideband and > little or no error correction with even the slightest selective > fade, you will have drop outs. In normal mode, only one of the two digital sidebands has to be decoded for the receiver to stay in full digital mode. However, despite their research which found that "no" AM radios have any audio response above 5 kHz, IBOC also offers a special mode which allows 8 kHz of analog audio bandwidth to be transmitted -- with the consequence that both digital sidebands have to be received in order to enable full digital mode reception. > What happens when the signal reverts to analog? Do you lose 7 - 10 > seconds of program? When the buffer fills and returns to digital, > do you hear 10 -15 seconds of audio all over again? The analog audio is delayed to match the lag of the digital audio. So even what regular analog listeners are hearing from an IBOC station is 8 to 9 seconds in the past. Obviously, time announcements have to be adjusted to compensate, and on-air personalities can no longer monitor the direct on-air signal in their headphones. A special provision is made, however, for broadcasts of live sporting events, where a delay would not be acceptable for spectators using portable radios to listen to the play-by-play at the game. In that case, the analog audio is not delayed, but the digital audio will lag behind by 8 or 9 seconds, and blending between digital and analog modes at the fringe of the station's coverage area will cause the synching problems you describe. There are already similar problems with regular analog radio stations which use the newfangled digital audio processors. In that case, the delay of the analog-to-digital conversion, digital audio processing, and final digital-to-analog audio output at the transmitter is only a fraction of a section, but still enough to cause an annoying echo in the DJ's headphones if the live air signal is being monitored. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Dec 15 23:19:00 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Dec 2002 07:19:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 4001 invoked from network); 16 Dec 2002 07:19:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Dec 2002 07:19:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.78) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Dec 2002 07:19:00 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.165] by n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Dec 2002 07:19:00 -0000 Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 07:18:57 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: IBOC Conversion Was: Lawyers thread Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3060 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.81.25 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > I wish I had a 50KW Class A in New York. As bad as the audio is > getting on the New York stations I can hear (WFAN, WOR, WABC, WCBS, > WQXR), If a fellow was to put a Stereo music format on one of them > with a good audio chain and a DX50 transmitter, He should be able > to pull a 10+ share! In addition to consistently good ratings, New York's now-defunct "American Popular Standards" on 50,000-watt 1560 WQEW had top-notch AM Stereo audio. Even after the switch from a simulcast of classical WQXR in 1993, they were one of the last hold-outs of the Kahn system, and WQEW's engineer (Herb Squire) even helped Leonard Kahn fight his battles in court. Finally in 1996, WQEW finally gave in and resumed broadcasting in AM Stereo -- this time using the C-Quam system, and sounding better than ever. Their audio was extremely crisp, clean, and well-processed, and it would put any of NYC's FM stations to shame (what I hear from the FM stations these days is nothing but sheer DISTORTION due to extreme amount of clipping and limiting they use in their processing to achieve all-out maximum loudness). But just as the good music on WQEW met its demise at the end of December 1998, so did the AM Stereo, and so did the RATINGS -- as far as I can tell, Radio Disney in mono on 1560 WQEW has NEVER shown up in the NYC Arbitron ratings. Admittedly, even with the mono Radio Disney broadcast, WQEW is still one of the best-sounding AM stations in NYC, but it is especially disappointing because they probably are literally the flick of a switch away from transmitting in AM Stereo again... not too long ago, a few listeners caught 1560 WQEW transmitting in full STEREO at night, but alas, that only lasted for a few hours, perhaps as an engineer was checking things out at the transmitter site and decided to fire up the C-Quam exciter. At the very least, a few dozen miles to the southwest in NJ, erstwhile 1000-watt 1450 WCTC in New Brunswick will be transmitting Christmas music in full, glorious AM Stereo sound. I'm still not sure what kind of transmitter or audio processing they use, but I think they use an Omnia or Amigo AM, as they are able to consistently maintain full separation during single-channel audio, unlike stations that use the Optimod 9100. And even during their talk programming, they sound darn good! In fact, WCTC's superb AM Stereo audio can easily beat the quality of WOR's full digital mode IBOC audio (which nobody can hear yet, due to the lack of receivers). IBOC digital does offer 15 kHz audio bandwidth, but perhaps to make the effects of the "simulated" treble less annoying, there is actually little response above 8 kHz, and overall the audio sounds duller and less crisp than 10 kHz's worth of AMAX analog AM audio. For a direct comparison, this MP3 file offers a sample of WOR's digital audio (taken directly from their iBiquity test receiver), followed by an example of WCTC's AM Stereo sound, as received on a Sony SRF-42: http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/hdvsamax.mp3 From KC4QLP@aol.com Sun Dec 15 23:29:24 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Dec 2002 07:29:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 7676 invoked from network); 16 Dec 2002 07:29:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Dec 2002 07:29:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r09.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.105) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Dec 2002 07:29:23 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r09.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.143.537bf71 (4238) for ; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 02:29:11 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <143.537bf71.2b2edac6@aol.com> Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 02:29:10 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} iboc report To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 12/15/02 6:32:36 PM Eastern Standard Time, davidcoons@webtv.net writes: > I have recieved in the mail,a many page report "petition for > reconsideration"mm docket 99-325 "digital audio broadcasting and their > impact on terrestrial broadcasting" atempting to make a case for night > time use of iboc,from garvey,schubert and barker washinton dc......since > I am not in the radio industry in ay way why?? has anyone else on the > list gotten the same? > Yep..several of us here have received just what you have there too. If you made comments to the FCC during the first commenting stage...then you were tagged to receive this document...and others that might follow. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From steveking@wgnradio.com Sun Dec 15 23:54:02 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: steveking@wgnradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Dec 2002 07:54:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 15456 invoked from network); 16 Dec 2002 07:54:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Dec 2002 07:54:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.70) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Dec 2002 07:54:01 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.143] by n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Dec 2002 07:54:01 -0000 Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 07:53:59 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Can anyone explain this phenomenon? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 544 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgnhim " X-Originating-IP: 172.174.131.116 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71806925 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgnhim How true! Back in my Rock & Roll days, now and then we'd suddenly hear a 2-way radio or one of the local AM or FM stations coming through one of our amplifiers. One night it was "Johnnie B Goode" and we switched songs and started playing along with Chuck Berry. Unfortunately, that was the only time we got to jam with Chuck on stage:-) Steve King, WGN-AM, Chicago --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: > I've also heard of guitar amplifiers picking up 2-way radio communications. > From dav259@csiro.au Sun Dec 15 23:59:55 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Dec 2002 07:59:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 84922 invoked from network); 16 Dec 2002 07:59:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Dec 2002 07:59:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Dec 2002 07:59:54 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gBG7xrP01680 for ; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 18:59:53 +1100 (EST) Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 18:59:53 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: amstereoforum Subject: Metrosound madness Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public I recently bought amplified PC speakers for home and connected the metrosound up to them right on top of the processor and the sound was great. Today I took it into work and no matter where I put it (even plugging it in on the otherside of the office) it sounded something shocking - presumably cause it is far too sensitive. Of course I am playing it using a Radio Shack car aerial as that was what most easily connected to the aerial output. Today when people walked in and saw the car aerial fully extended they thought I'd lost my last marble. (There is one left.) Apparently there are cables etc in all the walls and above the ceiling. I've seen the cables in the ceiling - it looks like a massive railway yard. Any suggestions? From ccuff@in4web.com Mon Dec 16 00:20:09 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Dec 2002 08:20:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 42573 invoked from network); 16 Dec 2002 08:20:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Dec 2002 08:20:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Dec 2002 08:20:08 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.50]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 03:15:01 -0500 Message-ID: <003401c2a4da$bbf02ae0$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Metrosound madness Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 03:11:27 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 Ian, you have the same problem anyone has regarding use of AM radios in buildings- you have to have the antenna outside- indoors in an office complex, or steel / concrete buildings, all you will get is interference... CC ----- Original Message ----- From: Ian Davidson To: amstereoforum Sent: Monday, December 16, 2002 2:59 AM Subject: {AMSF} Metrosound madness > Today I took it into work and no matter where I put it (even plugging it > in on the otherside of the office) it sounded something shocking - > presumably cause it is far too sensitive. From rwagoner@cox.net Mon Dec 16 00:21:35 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner@cox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Dec 2002 08:21:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 17369 invoked from network); 16 Dec 2002 08:21:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Dec 2002 08:21:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.84) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Dec 2002 08:21:35 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.142] by n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Dec 2002 08:21:35 -0000 Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 08:21:30 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Metrosound madness Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1009 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Richard Wagoner " X-Originating-IP: 68.4.33.253 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=96123889 X-Yahoo-Profile: richardalanwagoner Carver had an AM antenna design printed in the manual for the TX11b AM stereo/FM stereo tuner. I have it posted on my site, http://members.cox.net/rwagoner. --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, Ian Davidson wrote: > > I recently bought amplified PC speakers for home and connected the > metrosound up to them right on top of the processor and the sound was > great. > > Today I took it into work and no matter where I put it (even plugging it > in on the otherside of the office) it sounded something shocking - > presumably cause it is far too sensitive. > > Of course I am playing it using a Radio Shack car aerial as that was what > most easily connected to the aerial output. Today when people walked in > and saw the car aerial fully extended they thought I'd lost my last > marble. (There is one left.) > > Apparently there are cables etc in all the walls and above the ceiling. > I've seen the cables in the ceiling - it looks like a massive railway > yard. > > Any suggestions? From ccuff@in4web.com Mon Dec 16 00:22:34 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Dec 2002 08:22:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 66793 invoked from network); 16 Dec 2002 08:22:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Dec 2002 08:22:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Dec 2002 08:22:34 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.50]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 03:17:29 -0500 Message-ID: <004401c2a4db$148eef60$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Can anyone explain this phenomenon? Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 03:13:56 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 I hear it up here in NY but only on my non-superhet TRF radio- just about 4 PM any given day especially when DX conditions are good. This station comes in no matter where the tuner is set.... CC ----- Original Message ----- From: From rwagoner@cox.net Mon Dec 16 00:32:35 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner@cox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Dec 2002 08:32:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 546 invoked from network); 16 Dec 2002 08:32:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Dec 2002 08:32:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.89) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Dec 2002 08:32:35 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.138] by n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Dec 2002 08:32:35 -0000 Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 08:32:32 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: KLAC flips to "FABULOUS 570" Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1702 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Richard Wagoner " X-Originating-IP: 68.4.33.253 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=96123889 X-Yahoo-Profile: richardalanwagoner KLAC is not the one swapping frequencies. KSPN and KDIS will swap 1110 and 710; KDIS will take the stereo to 1110 and sports talk 710 will be mono. I asked Clear Channel's Roy Laughlin to look into putting AM stereo back on KLAC; he replied by sending a memo to one of KLAC's engineers, telling them to "get the kind of stereo Richard talked about" on the station. I will snd a followup soon, since the station is still mono. Clean, nice-sounding mono, however. Richard Wagoner --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Donn Tillman" wrote: > > Narkspud, Welcome back!, > > I was just deleting about 100 messages or more today and I came across > several of your and wondered what had happened. > > Did KLAC swap frequencies?; it seems I read someone about a frequency swap > in the L.A. area and the music station would most likely be stereo; I will > try to find that message; it seems to me it was posted by Richard (last name > escapes me now), who write a radio column in California. > > donn > in am-stereo and iboc-free st petersburg! > > > > ----Original Message Follows---- > From: "narkspud " > Reply-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com > To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com > Subject: {AMSF} Re: KLAC flips to "FABULOUS 570" > Date: Thu, 12 Dec 2002 17:08:51 -0000 > > > Any chance they will be in AM Stereo? > > They aren't as of 9:08 AM. Current format is "ticking alarm clock." > Good beat, easy to dance to, I give it an 87. > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > The new MSN 8: advanced junk mail protection and 2 months FREE* > http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail From ccuff@in4web.com Mon Dec 16 00:41:25 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Dec 2002 08:41:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 65198 invoked from network); 16 Dec 2002 08:41:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Dec 2002 08:41:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Dec 2002 08:41:25 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.50]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 03:36:20 -0500 Message-ID: <006701c2a4dd$b6ab4300$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Metrosound madness Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 03:32:46 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 Thanks for that info Richard- however, the metrosound is a car tuner- it will not work with a loop. It has an internal matching transformer, as car radios do, that actually make a loop worse than a rod... Chris ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Monday, December 16, 2002 3:21 AM Subject: {AMSF} Re: Metrosound madness > Carver had an AM antenna design printed in the manual for the TX11b AM > stereo/FM stereo tuner. I have it posted on my site, > http://members.cox.net/rwagoner. From KC4QLP@aol.com Mon Dec 16 00:54:33 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Dec 2002 08:54:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 13952 invoked from network); 16 Dec 2002 08:54:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Dec 2002 08:54:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m03.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.6) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Dec 2002 08:54:32 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.120.1afe29ff (4238) for ; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 03:54:26 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <120.1afe29ff.2b2eeec2@aol.com> Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 03:54:26 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Here we go! READ THIS To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 12/15/02 10:55:00 PM Eastern Standard Time, amfmdx@fastq.com writes: > What happens when the signal reverts to analog? Do you lose 7 - 10 seconds > of program? When the buffer fills and returns to digital, do you hear 10 > -15 > seconds of audio all over again? > > That sure will be irritating if that happens. > Well by design the analog part of the programming is supposed to be delayed so that when the flip from digital to analog comes about and vice versa..your not suppose to have any delays.I would imagion that the digital part of the receiver would be listening for the digital stream...start buffering and then without any drop out or pauses..revert back to the digital mode. What a hassle to listen to what could be an artifact filled digital stream...and interfence like never before on analog. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From KC4QLP@aol.com Mon Dec 16 00:57:13 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Dec 2002 08:57:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 84055 invoked from network); 16 Dec 2002 08:57:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Dec 2002 08:57:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r09.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.105) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Dec 2002 08:57:13 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r09.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.c3.2d80977b (4238) for ; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 03:57:06 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 03:57:05 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Gates BC1E Was:Question For Eric To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 12/15/02 11:03:21 PM Eastern Standard Time, possumhunter@netzero.net writes: > Scott Todd wrote: > >You're right about it being FUBAR with that description. > > The WHOLE STATION is in the same condition! The bearings on the turntables > are worn so you can shake the platters! They have 2 well-worn Radio Shack > cassette decks and all of the spots were on cassette because the cart > machines died. They also have 2 Radio Shack WalkmanCD players (only one > works) and one Radio shack mike that works. The only working board is a > "bottom of the line" Realistic by Radio Shack. "EAS?" you may > ask....ROFL...Yea RITE, uh huh SURE! > > The "Engineering room" and prod rooms are littered with scavenged equipment > with most of the parts gone. I *THINK* I can salvage enough parts to fix my > classic Gates "Yard" tube console! There is half of one in the engineering > room. > > Kevin > > Wow!....lol that station sounds slightly better equipped than most Willis Broadcasting owned radio stations! lol Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Dec 16 01:02:14 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Dec 2002 09:02:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 78701 invoked from network); 16 Dec 2002 09:02:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Dec 2002 09:02:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Dec 2002 09:02:14 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.140] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Dec 2002 09:02:14 -0000 Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 09:02:14 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Sony SRF-A100 on eBay Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 388 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.89.129 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics Prices keep climbing for "vintage" AM Stereo equipment... here is a Sony SRF-A100 multi-system AM Stereo receiver with a current bid price of $300 (gulp!).... http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=748004210 It does look virtually brand new, but with "no strap, case, or paperwork," I wouldn't really consider it to be worth over three times its original retail price. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Dec 16 01:10:37 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Dec 2002 09:10:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 36520 invoked from network); 16 Dec 2002 09:10:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Dec 2002 09:10:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.88) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Dec 2002 09:10:36 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.168] by n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Dec 2002 09:10:36 -0000 Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 09:10:34 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Can anyone explain this phenomenon? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 476 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.89.129 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > How true! Back in my Rock & Roll days, now and then we'd suddenly > hear a 2-way radio or one of the local AM or FM stations coming > through one of our amplifiers. I also have one Panasonic stereo system that will pick up aircraft communications on top of FM stations, especially near the top of the dial. Despite the fact that aircraft radio is transmitted as AM, I can still make out what is being said -- usually involving the word "niner" in there somewhere. :-) From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Dec 16 01:14:04 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Dec 2002 09:14:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 31474 invoked from network); 16 Dec 2002 09:14:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Dec 2002 09:14:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.75) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Dec 2002 09:14:03 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.187] by n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Dec 2002 09:14:03 -0000 Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 09:14:02 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Can anyone explain this phenomenon? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <004401c2a4db$148eef60$0101a8c0@pavilion> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 386 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.89.129 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > I hear it up here in NY but only on my non-superhet TRF radio- just > about 4 PM any given day especially when DX conditions are good. > This station comes in no matter where the tuner is set.... Heh... try using one of those $19.99 Coby pocket size AM/FM/LW/SW radios... it will pick up more shortwave stations all across the AM dial, than it does on its actual shortwave bands! From amstereorules@msn.com Mon Dec 16 01:18:18 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereorules@msn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Dec 2002 09:18:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 88288 invoked from network); 16 Dec 2002 09:18:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Dec 2002 09:18:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Dec 2002 09:18:16 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.174] by n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Dec 2002 09:18:16 -0000 Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 09:18:14 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: NEW AM BROADCAST FORMAT Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1135 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amstereorules " X-Originating-IP: 64.12.96.170 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=130870594 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereorules To compete with IBOC, I am going to propose a new AM MW broadcasting format to the FCC. This may sound familiar to a few of you, since this format is used today on the 40 meter ham band. We know that all AM radio stations now transmit a carrier at their center frequency on the dial, and two sidebands. This is a very inefficient transmission method, about 100 years old. My plan is to eliminate the carrier, and the station will need to transmit one or the other sideband. This will open the MW band to new frequencies, and the stations will have larger coverage areas, since their carrier will not be transmitted, and the power can be sent in one or both sidebands. Of course, it will require new radios, and the equipment manufacturers will love it. It is much more spectrum efficient. For stations that want AM stereo, they can transmit both sidebands. Does this comparison sound familiar to IBOC today? Make all C-QuAM stereo radios and transmitters obsolete. Not compatible with consumer receiving equipment, since there is reduced S/N ratio from\ IBOC digital carriers in the sidebands. Thoughts? From dav259@csiro.au Mon Dec 16 02:22:00 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Dec 2002 10:21:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 41666 invoked from network); 16 Dec 2002 10:21:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Dec 2002 10:21:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Dec 2002 10:21:59 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gBGALvP09429 for ; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 21:21:58 +1100 (EST) Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 21:21:57 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Metrosound madness In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public On Mon, 16 Dec 2002, Richard Wagoner wrote: > Carver had an AM antenna design printed in the manual for the TX11b AM > stereo/FM stereo tuner. I have it posted on my site, > http://members.cox.net/rwagoner. Thanks Richard! A very good helpful site ... But it seems to me there is no solution. I hate to say this - but what is the URL for the FM Stereo Forum? Some non-tech people like me are momentarily lost. This is something we should fix up - and maybe we can't. I guess this IS the MASSIVE fault with just mono AM radio. What I can't understand is why I can pull in a decent AM stereo signal in my work office with the SRF-42 - provided it's turned in the right direction. Yet even if I plug that into the PC speakers I am beseiged with interference. Similar to what I get out of the Metrosound. Is it all the other cords? Is it so different if you use an AC current? But why if I can pick up Magic 693 in my office so well through headbuds does it sound so much different when I simply connect the SRF-42 to the PC speakers - with the PC speakers connected to nothing else - but the power supply? Have I answered my own question? I know the above seems to be the same question. Is there a good answer? Better still - for idiots like me - is there a simple solution? t'is a puzzlement (c) The King and I, 1955 [addendum] Is there any way you can listen to clear AM stereo in an office beseiged with electric cords by using something with just batteries? I hope so ... Oh, I do hope so! (same show) For this moment in time I feel defeated. :( Ian - still determined to fight for the cause From jsgil@hal-pc.org Mon Dec 16 03:22:37 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Dec 2002 11:22:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 65496 invoked from network); 16 Dec 2002 11:22:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Dec 2002 11:22:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Dec 2002 11:22:36 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.130] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Dec 2002 11:22:36 -0000 Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 11:22:34 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: Metrosound madness Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 781 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.48 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, Ian Davidson wrote: > > What I can't understand is why I can pull in a decent AM stereo signal in > my work office with the SRF-42 - provided it's turned in the right > direction. Yet even if I plug that into the PC speakers I am beseiged > with interference. Similar to what I get out of the Metrosound. Is it > all the other cords? Whenever you connect an AM radio to a PC the PC puts out large amounts of RF interference and the electrical connection from the haedphone out to the PC is almost like a direct RF connection. I woud imagine that if you put isolation transformers from RS you would still have the problem. The only solution I think will work is to have it optically coupled but that gets expensive. JSG From jsgil@hal-pc.org Mon Dec 16 03:31:21 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Dec 2002 11:31:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 35007 invoked from network); 16 Dec 2002 11:31:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Dec 2002 11:31:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.84) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Dec 2002 11:31:21 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.177] by n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Dec 2002 11:31:21 -0000 Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 11:31:18 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: NEW AM BROADCAST FORMAT Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1911 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.48 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "amstereorules " wrote: > To compete with IBOC, I am going to propose a new AM MW broadcasting > format to the FCC. This may sound familiar to a few of you, since > this format is used today on the 40 meter ham band. > > We know that all AM radio stations now transmit a carrier at their > center frequency on the dial, and two sidebands. > This is a very inefficient transmission method, about 100 years old. > > My plan is to eliminate the carrier, and the station will need to > transmit one or the other sideband. > > This will open the MW band to new frequencies, and the stations will > have larger coverage areas, since their carrier will not be > transmitted, and the power can be sent in one or both sidebands. > > Of course, it will require new radios, and the equipment > manufacturers will love it. > > It is much more spectrum efficient. For stations that want AM > stereo, they can transmit both sidebands. > > Does this comparison sound familiar to IBOC today? Make all C-QuAM > stereo radios and transmitters obsolete. Not compatible with > consumer receiving equipment, since there is reduced S/N ratio from\ > IBOC digital carriers in the sidebands. > Thoughts? I would not recomend completely removing the carrier because the PLL won't have anything to lock onto. I think this new AMS (Advanced Modulation System) that allows an effective 200% modulation with a +125% & -100% of the envelope is a campatible solution. You could even allow the envelope to exceed -100% modulation for higher audio frequencies since both RF and IF filters greatly attenuate them and it can be used as compensation for this. With both of these mods the sidebands would be greatly enhanced in relation to the carrier and would be much closer to a suppressed carrier system tht is envelope compatible. JSG From groucho@skyweb.net Mon Dec 16 03:59:24 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Dec 2002 11:59:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 12820 invoked from network); 16 Dec 2002 11:59:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Dec 2002 11:59:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Dec 2002 11:59:24 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gBGC5D2D054749 for ; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 07:05:13 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DFDBF02.1197AAD3@skyweb.net> Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 06:54:42 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC Conversion Was: Lawyers thread References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Kevin I have been gathering X-mas music to play on WTTM for X-mas day Don't know If I will be at the station to play it or Not(I may go to the In-laws in NY) But If Im Home on Xmas Day I will be playing that stuff. otherwise I will be adding it to the Night automation a few days before and it will be mixed in with the Indian music.. keep an Ear out Neal "Kevin T. " wrote: > > I wish I had a 50KW Class A in New York. As bad as the audio is > > getting on the New York stations I can hear (WFAN, WOR, WABC, WCBS, > > WQXR), If a fellow was to put a Stereo music format on one of them > > with a good audio chain and a DX50 transmitter, He should be able > > to pull a 10+ share! > > In addition to consistently good ratings, New York's now-defunct > "American Popular Standards" on 50,000-watt 1560 WQEW had top-notch > AM Stereo audio. Even after the switch from a simulcast of classical > WQXR in 1993, they were one of the last hold-outs of the Kahn system, > and WQEW's engineer (Herb Squire) even helped Leonard Kahn fight his > battles in court. > > Finally in 1996, WQEW finally gave in and resumed broadcasting in AM > Stereo -- this time using the C-Quam system, and sounding better than > ever. Their audio was extremely crisp, clean, and well-processed, > and it would put any of NYC's FM stations to shame (what I hear from > the FM stations these days is nothing but sheer DISTORTION due to > extreme amount of clipping and limiting they use in their processing > to achieve all-out maximum loudness). > > But just as the good music on WQEW met its demise at the end of > December 1998, so did the AM Stereo, and so did the RATINGS -- as far > as I can tell, Radio Disney in mono on 1560 WQEW has NEVER shown up > in the NYC Arbitron ratings. > > Admittedly, even with the mono Radio Disney broadcast, WQEW is still > one of the best-sounding AM stations in NYC, but it is especially > disappointing because they probably are literally the flick of a > switch away from transmitting in AM Stereo again... not too long ago, > a few listeners caught 1560 WQEW transmitting in full STEREO at > night, but alas, that only lasted for a few hours, perhaps as an > engineer was checking things out at the transmitter site and decided > to fire up the C-Quam exciter. > > At the very least, a few dozen miles to the southwest in NJ, > erstwhile 1000-watt 1450 WCTC in New Brunswick will be transmitting > Christmas music in full, glorious AM Stereo sound. I'm still not > sure what kind of transmitter or audio processing they use, but I > think they use an Omnia or Amigo AM, as they are able to consistently > maintain full separation during single-channel audio, unlike stations > that use the Optimod 9100. And even during their talk programming, > they sound darn good! > > In fact, WCTC's superb AM Stereo audio can easily beat the quality of > WOR's full digital mode IBOC audio (which nobody can hear yet, due to > the lack of receivers). IBOC digital does offer 15 kHz audio > bandwidth, but perhaps to make the effects of the "simulated" treble > less annoying, there is actually little response above 8 kHz, and > overall the audio sounds duller and less crisp than 10 kHz's worth of > AMAX analog AM audio. For a direct comparison, this MP3 file offers > a sample of WOR's digital audio (taken directly from their iBiquity > test receiver), followed by an example of WCTC's AM Stereo sound, as > received on a Sony SRF-42: > > http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/hdvsamax.mp3 > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From groucho@skyweb.net Mon Dec 16 04:09:27 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Dec 2002 12:09:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 65101 invoked from network); 16 Dec 2002 12:09:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Dec 2002 12:09:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Dec 2002 12:09:26 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gBGCFH2D056599 for ; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 07:15:17 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DFDC15D.F0EC3133@skyweb.net> Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 07:04:45 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} NEW AM BROADCAST FORMAT References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 I Like it lets call it SSB Single Sideband.. and For Stereo DSB double Sideband Neat Idea.... BTW any of you Guys near Cleveland Ohio? I may be acquiring an Old RCA BTA-10H transmitter Need help moving it to New Jersey this is No joke I'm serious Neal "amstereorules " wrote: > To compete with IBOC, I am going to propose a new AM MW broadcasting > format to the FCC. This may sound familiar to a few of you, since > this format is used today on the 40 meter ham band. > > We know that all AM radio stations now transmit a carrier at their > center frequency on the dial, and two sidebands. > This is a very inefficient transmission method, about 100 years old. > > My plan is to eliminate the carrier, and the station will need to > transmit one or the other sideband. > > This will open the MW band to new frequencies, and the stations will > have larger coverage areas, since their carrier will not be > transmitted, and the power can be sent in one or both sidebands. > > Of course, it will require new radios, and the equipment > manufacturers will love it. > > It is much more spectrum efficient. For stations that want AM > stereo, they can transmit both sidebands. > > Does this comparison sound familiar to IBOC today? Make all C-QuAM > stereo radios and transmitters obsolete. Not compatible with > consumer receiving equipment, since there is reduced S/N ratio from\ > IBOC digital carriers in the sidebands. > Thoughts? > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Dec 16 07:42:46 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Dec 2002 15:42:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 47668 invoked from network); 16 Dec 2002 15:42:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Dec 2002 15:42:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Dec 2002 15:42:44 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.189] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Dec 2002 15:42:44 -0000 Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 15:42:40 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Metrosound madness Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1040 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > What I can't understand is why I can pull in a decent AM stereo > signal in my work office with the SRF-42 - provided it's turned in > the right direction. Yet even if I plug that into the PC speakers > I am beseiged with interference. Amplified PC speakers usually come with a "wall wart" power adapter that causes a lot of RF noise in its process of converting high voltage AC into low voltage DC power. It is possible to find a compatible power adapter that doesn't create an intolerable amount of RF noise, but that is mostly a matter of trial and error. A better choice would be to get PC speakers with a built-in AC power supply, as I have found them to be relatively interference-free. Or, you could upgrade to a small stereo amplifier hooked up to a regular pair of speakers. Radio Shack has made a nice small amplifier (the SA-150 or SA-155) as well as some small speakers that have been acclaimed for their good sound quality, but I don't know if you'll be able to find this -- do you still have Tandy stores Down Under? From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Dec 16 07:55:06 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Dec 2002 15:55:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 28071 invoked from network); 16 Dec 2002 15:55:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Dec 2002 15:55:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Dec 2002 15:55:05 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.174] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Dec 2002 15:55:04 -0000 Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 15:55:03 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Msg from CC Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 632 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics FYI to AM Stereo Forum members.... I just received an e-mail from a gentleman with a "@ClearChannel.com" address in regards to the AM Stereo Forum -- and he has been observing our activity here. Don't worry, overall he did have nice things to say, and in fact he happens to be an engineer for one of the Clear Channel stations that currently broadcasts in AM Stereo. That's all I want to say right now, as he's probably reading this himself, but I just thought I'd let you all know that we do have people who support our cause, even in places you might not expect. Kevin Tekel kevtronics@yahoo.com Sysop of The AM Stereo Forum From chiefspider@arachnae.com Mon Dec 16 08:12:40 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ChiefSpider@arachnae.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Dec 2002 16:12:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 14591 invoked from network); 16 Dec 2002 16:12:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Dec 2002 16:12:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO swan.mail.pas.earthlink.net) (207.217.120.123) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Dec 2002 16:12:38 -0000 Received: from 209-239-215-253.lax.jps.net ([209.239.215.253] helo=[209.239.216.148]) by swan.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 18NxrB-0004Iv-00 for amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 08:12:37 -0800 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: ChiefSpider@arachnae.com@smtp.mcyork.com Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <200212161057030467.00218675@mail.globility.com> References: <200212161057030467.00218675@mail.globility.com> Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 08:12:32 -0800 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} NEW AM BROADCAST FORMAT Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" From: "Fred Y. McCutcheon" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public Must be a shill for the CEA! Fred At 9:18 AM +0000 12/16/02, amstereorules wrote: >(Redirected by "Marv Southcott" ) >An ambitious soul, wouldn't you say? > >M. > >*********** BEGIN REDIRECTED MESSAGE *********** > >To compete with IBOC, I am going to propose a new AM MW broadcasting >format to the FCC. This may sound familiar to a few of you, since >this format is used today on the 40 meter ham band. > >We know that all AM radio stations now transmit a carrier at their >center frequency on the dial, and two sidebands. >This is a very inefficient transmission method, about 100 years old. > >My plan is to eliminate the carrier, and the station will need to >transmit one or the other sideband. > >This will open the MW band to new frequencies, and the stations will >have larger coverage areas, since their carrier will not be >transmitted, and the power can be sent in one or both sidebands. > >Of course, it will require new radios, and the equipment >manufacturers will love it. > >It is much more spectrum efficient. For stations that want AM >stereo, they can transmit both sidebands. > >Does this comparison sound familiar to IBOC today? Make all C-QuAM >stereo radios and transmitters obsolete. Not compatible with >consumer receiving equipment, since there is reduced S/N ratio from\ >IBOC digital carriers in the sidebands. >Thoughts? > > > > >Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > > >*********** END REDIRECTED MESSAGE *********** -- Fred McCutcheon Chief Spider Arachnae Management Limited From bjackson@indyradio.com Mon Dec 16 08:53:03 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Dec 2002 16:53:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 17128 invoked from network); 16 Dec 2002 16:53:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Dec 2002 16:53:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Dec 2002 16:53:02 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.152] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Dec 2002 16:53:01 -0000 Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 16:52:59 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Here we go! READ THIS Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 955 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923 " X-Originating-IP: 64.25.100.28 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: > There are already similar problems with regular analog radio stations > which use the newfangled digital audio processors. In that case, the > delay of the analog-to-digital conversion, digital audio processing, > and final digital-to-analog audio output at the transmitter is only a > fraction of a section, but still enough to cause an annoying echo in > the DJ's headphones if the live air signal is being monitored. That drives me crazy!!! At our oldies station, we use a digital board, digital Optimod, digital STL, and digital FM exciter...Most of our jocks will actually monitor the Program feed thru the headphones. And, when I worked at WTTS, it was a little worse...older digital optimod and a double digital STL hop (there was no line of sight of of town to the xmter)! -Brad Jackson -Susquehanna, Indianapolis -WGLD, WGRL, WFMS From bjackson@indyradio.com Mon Dec 16 09:28:29 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Dec 2002 17:28:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 61658 invoked from network); 16 Dec 2002 17:28:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Dec 2002 17:28:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Dec 2002 17:28:27 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.156] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Dec 2002 17:28:27 -0000 Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 17:28:25 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Sansui Tuner Question Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1406 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923 " X-Originating-IP: 64.25.100.28 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 Well, I did it...I finally convinced a friend to sell me his Sansui S-X1130 (the receiver that recieves all 4 types of AM Stereo). Does anyone else have one of these? It sounds fantastic on strong signals...But my problem is that on weak signals, if it can't get a "lock", it mutes...Todd never had an interest in AM and no antenna hooked up, and lost the manual. On FM, if I put it in mono, it will un-mute, but no luck on AM. Ideas? On a different note, I had a couple of friends e-mail the 2 stations here in Indianapolis (WIBC and WMYS which is now WXNT) that used to be Stereo. WMYS/WXNT had been Standards up until about a year ago...And were a test station for Harris in the 80's. When they switched to news/talk, they killed the C-Quam. WIBC was once stereo 24/7, then only on night power, then they killed stereo the same day WXNT did. It's been over a week, and no one has gotten a reply back even though they e-mailed the engineer, PD, and asst. PD. One even asked about stereo for only Christmas music. If anyone is within range, you may want to see if you can get a reply... WIBC.com newstalk1430.com And I've sent mail to a couple of former employers who killed stereo as well since I know the exciter is still in the xmter rack...WGCL in Bloomington, and WNVI in North Vernon. Just trying to do my part :-) -Brad Jackson -Susquehanna, Indianapolis -WGLD, WGRL, WFMS From radams5451@aol.com Mon Dec 16 09:34:26 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: radams5451@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Dec 2002 17:34:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 72627 invoked from network); 16 Dec 2002 17:34:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Dec 2002 17:34:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Dec 2002 17:34:26 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.174] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Dec 2002 17:34:26 -0000 Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 17:34:24 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Can anyone explain this phenomenon? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <00c701c2a4a9$0e36dce0$b3d889ac@aoldsl.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 614 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Bob " X-Originating-IP: 165.225.194.10 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=58804163 X-Yahoo-Profile: solitary_hiker Thanks PossumHunter and all the rest of the guys who explained what was going on. > Kevin, My amp is an old Kenwood KA-8300 coupled to a Kenwood KT-7300 tuner. Didn't pay a whole lot for it and I don't it was ever considered "high-end" so maybe that is the problem. Then too, it could have been one of those highpowered Quebec shortwave stations. It was some sort of discussion show. No music. I'll listen tonight at the top of the hour to try to identify the location. > Possum, I live in Mauldin. Small world huh? I'll try to pick of the pirate station tonight. > Again thanks guys and best regards. From philipr@irac.pe.ca Mon Dec 16 09:52:24 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Dec 2002 17:52:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 2665 invoked from network); 16 Dec 2002 17:52:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Dec 2002 17:52:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Dec 2002 17:52:18 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.141] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Dec 2002 17:52:18 -0000 Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 17:52:16 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Delco UX-1 Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 620 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking I have a possible line on a Delco UX-1. I have a question for those familiar with this rig: When you have the AM-ST switch activated, does this open up the bandwidth so that AM mono stations will have the benefit of wideband reception? Or, would it be necessary to tune in a CQUAM signal for this? In other words, is it necessary to have a pilot tone to engage wideband? Apparently, some AM Stereo rigs work this way. My circa 1988 Toyota car radio provides wideband reception on mono stations when the AM-ST button is activated. I'm wondering if the Delco UX-1 works on the same principle? Thanks Phil R. From jsgil@hal-pc.org Mon Dec 16 11:44:08 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Dec 2002 19:44:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 84075 invoked from network); 16 Dec 2002 19:44:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Dec 2002 19:44:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.87) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Dec 2002 19:44:08 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.130] by n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Dec 2002 19:44:07 -0000 Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 19:44:07 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Sansui Tuner Question Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1515 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.214 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "bradleyj923 " wrote: > Well, I did it...I finally convinced a friend to sell me his Sansui > S-X1130 (the receiver that recieves all 4 types of AM Stereo). Does > anyone else have one of these? It sounds fantastic on strong > signals...But my problem is that on weak signals, if it can't get a > "lock", it mutes...Todd never had an interest in AM and no antenna > hooked up, and lost the manual. On FM, if I put it in mono, it will > un-mute, but no luck on AM. > > Ideas? > > The Sansui compltely uses synchronous detection for both L+R and L-R so the PLL has to lock onto the carrier before you can get a signal. If it was not muted when the PLL is unlocked then the output would be extremely noisy. The more elegant solution in which I think the later C-QuAM chips use is to also have a envelope detector so L+R is obtained from the envelope detector when the PLL is unlocked. The circuitry is somewhat complex to detect whether the PLL is locked or not and have preform well and the Sansui decoder is built from discrete components so the parts count is already high. You would need to have several comparators, analog switches, resistors and capacitors to acomplish this and I think Sansui didn't want to invest that much in the design. Since all stations are supposed to be C-QuAM now you might want to think about installing a MC13028 decoder. Although the 4-way decoder is nice you will get little use from it nowdays. JSG From possumhunter@netzero.net Mon Dec 16 12:31:12 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Dec 2002 20:31:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 22320 invoked from network); 16 Dec 2002 20:31:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Dec 2002 20:31:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.18) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Dec 2002 20:31:11 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 12:31:11 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Can anyone explain this phenomenon? Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 15:27:35 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 16 Dec 2002 20:31:11.0340 (UTC) FILETIME=[124F32C0:01C2A542] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.131.33.16] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 radams5451@aol.com wrote: >Then too, it could have been one of those highpowered Quebec shortwave stations. There are no high power shortwave stations licensd to Quebec. It may be one of the relay stations in the carabian that belong to a European broadcaster, the VOA, or Radio Canada International French Service. See if it is a simulcast of CBC on 860 after WLBG goes to low power. > > Possum, I live in Mauldin. Small world huh? I'll try to pick of the pirate station tonight. In Mauldin during the day all I can hear on 1680 are the TIS stations. During Critical hours, you may get a bit of WTTM, and then WTIR ownes it at night. As near as I can tell, the Pirate station is in the area surrounded by Church Street, Cedar Lane, Blue Ridge Ave, and White Horse Rd. You can't hear it on I-85 because of the TIS stations. It comes in real strong around the intersection of White Horse and I-185, but it also has "Hot Spots" in Parker Heights, Mulberry, and Poe Mill. Perhaps they have more than one transmitter? Please do me a favor, Ride around Mauldin listening to 1600 WFIS. Please tell me if WTZQ's signal is eating it up on 1600. You will know if you hear WTZQ if you hear Adult Standards music under our Christmas music in the morning, or Talk during the day. If you can hear WTZQ in our signal, please email wfis16@aol.com and say what kind of radio you are listening to and where you heard the interference. WTZQ is killing our signal well within our .5mv/M contour and I need all the ammo I can get for when I fight that battle. Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Mon Dec 16 12:36:45 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: possumhunter@netzero.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Dec 2002 20:36:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 93017 invoked from network); 16 Dec 2002 20:36:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Dec 2002 20:36:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rly-ip02.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.160) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Dec 2002 20:36:44 -0000 Received: from logs-wm.proxy.aol.com (logs-wm.proxy.aol.com [205.188.199.132]) by rly-ip02.mx.aol.com (v83.35) with ESMTP id RELAYIN2-1216153612; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 15:36:12 -0500 Received: from ibm (AC832110.ipt.aol.com [172.131.33.16]) by logs-wm.proxy.aol.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with SMTP id gBGKZJZ375834 for ; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 15:35:20 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <00c001c2a542$a0e54600$102183ac@aoldsl.net> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Gates BC1E Was:Question For Eric Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 15:35:08 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Apparently-From: DodgeRamTrucker@aol.com From: "Possum Hunter" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: > Wow!....lol that station sounds slightly better equipped than most Willis Broadcasting owned radio stations! lol They must have some real "nice" ones, huh? Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Mon Dec 16 12:44:38 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: possumhunter@netzero.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Dec 2002 20:44:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 70659 invoked from network); 16 Dec 2002 20:44:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Dec 2002 20:44:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rly-ip03.mx.aol.com) (64.12.138.7) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Dec 2002 20:44:38 -0000 Received: from logs-wm.proxy.aol.com (logs-wm.proxy.aol.com [205.188.199.132]) by rly-ip03.mx.aol.com (v89.10) with ESMTP id RELAYIN8-1216154354; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 15:43:54 -0500 Received: from ibm (AC832110.ipt.aol.com [172.131.33.16]) by logs-wm.proxy.aol.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with SMTP id gBGKg2Z367971 for ; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 15:42:03 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <00ca01c2a543$913114e0$102183ac@aoldsl.net> To: References: <3DFDC15D.F0EC3133@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} NEW AM BROADCAST FORMAT Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 15:41:51 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Apparently-From: DodgeRamTrucker@aol.com From: "Possum Hunter" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Neal Newman wrote: > I may be acquiring an Old RCA BTA-10H transmitter Need help moving it to New Jersey this is No joke I'm serious You gonna load 'er up on 80 Meters? LOL That would would kill W1WCR's "Liberty Net" on 3950! Or, You gonna use at as a back-up to WTTM? If so, You are in for a "treat" getting it to work with Stereo! They are a bear to get the phase distortion out of it good enough for C-QUAM. Kevin From insomniaskunk@yahoo.com Mon Dec 16 12:58:06 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: insomniaskunk@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Dec 2002 20:58:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 57840 invoked from network); 16 Dec 2002 20:58:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Dec 2002 20:58:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Dec 2002 20:58:05 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.155] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Dec 2002 20:58:04 -0000 Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 20:58:02 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: I'm sure you get this question a lot but... Anywhere to get SRF-42 or others? Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 406 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Michi Sakayama " X-Originating-IP: 66.188.97.210 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=72920535 X-Yahoo-Profile: insomniaskunk ... Again, I'm sure this is the 'eternal question' that 'am stereo newbies' always post but... Is there ***ANYWHERE*** besides Ebay to get an SRF-42? Anyone selling any? ... Also, any reliable source to get AM Stereo receivers that don't cost $200+ ? I've been interested in this for a while, and just want to get ONE am stereo receiver! :) Please let me know if anyone can help... thanks, michi From amfmdx@fastq.com Mon Dec 16 12:59:21 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Dec 2002 20:59:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 56372 invoked from network); 16 Dec 2002 20:59:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Dec 2002 20:59:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Dec 2002 20:59:20 -0000 Received: from fastq (d192-osel-phx.fastq.com [209.63.214.179]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gBGKxJv39911 for ; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 13:59:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <008f01c2a545$f56bbbc0$96f9bed8@com> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Metrosound madness Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 13:58:59 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > But it seems to me there is no solution. Ian, sadly there is no solution to interference with AM transmissions. This is why FM was created. FM stereo is at the WTFDA. The address is wtfda@topica.com. The reason is that the cables are not shielded. Each 1 and 0 sent is like IBOC going over the air. The cables act as antennas since they aren't shielded and your SRF-42 picks up the signal. AM is very succeptible to noise. I wish there were a solution but there really is none. This is why many want digital radio, to get away from the interference. Kevin From KC4QLP@aol.com Mon Dec 16 15:21:50 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Dec 2002 23:21:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 64583 invoked from network); 16 Dec 2002 23:21:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Dec 2002 23:21:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m07.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.162) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Dec 2002 23:21:49 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.78.3321726f (4238) for ; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 18:21:41 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <78.3321726f.2b2fba05@aol.com> Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 18:21:41 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Here we go! READ THIS To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/16/02 11:56:56 AM Eastern Standard Time, bjackson@indyradio.com writes: << That drives me crazy!!! At our oldies station, we use a digital board, digital Optimod, digital STL, and digital FM exciter...Most of our jocks will actually monitor the Program feed thru the headphones. >> LOL ...the former owner of the stations here used to do live remotes via satellite.Needless to say you learn to either ignore the delay and carry on...or you imagion that your watching a bad Japanese Godzilla movie ...lol Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From badlhoch@hotmail.com Mon Dec 16 15:35:47 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: badlhoch@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Dec 2002 23:35:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 33365 invoked from network); 16 Dec 2002 23:35:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Dec 2002 23:35:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (216.33.237.30) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Dec 2002 23:35:47 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 15:35:47 -0800 Received: from 68.41.208.108 by lw7fd.law7.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 23:35:46 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Sansui Tuner Question Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 18:35:46 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 16 Dec 2002 23:35:47.0303 (UTC) FILETIME=[DC190770:01C2A55B] From: "Bill Adlhoch" X-Originating-IP: [68.41.208.108] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=59104360 I also have a sansui sx-1130 and unfortunately, it does auto mute on AM, wheich effectively ewliminates it as a DXing unit ----Original Message Follows---- From: "bradleyj923 " Reply-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Sansui Tuner Question Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 17:28:25 -0000 Well, I did it...I finally convinced a friend to sell me his Sansui S-X1130 (the receiver that recieves all 4 types of AM Stereo). Does anyone else have one of these? It sounds fantastic on strong signals...But my problem is that on weak signals, if it can't get a "lock", it mutes...Todd never had an interest in AM and no antenna hooked up, and lost the manual. On FM, if I put it in mono, it will un-mute, but no luck on AM. Ideas? On a different note, I had a couple of friends e-mail the 2 stations here in Indianapolis (WIBC and WMYS which is now WXNT) that used to be Stereo. WMYS/WXNT had been Standards up until about a year ago...And were a test station for Harris in the 80's. When they switched to news/talk, they killed the C-Quam. WIBC was once stereo 24/7, then only on night power, then they killed stereo the same day WXNT did. It's been over a week, and no one has gotten a reply back even though they e-mailed the engineer, PD, and asst. PD. One even asked about stereo for only Christmas music. If anyone is within range, you may want to see if you can get a reply... WIBC.com newstalk1430.com And I've sent mail to a couple of former employers who killed stereo as well since I know the exciter is still in the xmter rack...WGCL in Bloomington, and WNVI in North Vernon. Just trying to do my part :-) -Brad Jackson -Susquehanna, Indianapolis -WGLD, WGRL, WFMS _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus From groucho@skyweb.net Mon Dec 16 15:46:54 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Dec 2002 23:46:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 91605 invoked from network); 16 Dec 2002 23:46:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Dec 2002 23:46:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Dec 2002 23:46:53 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gBGNqig3016700 for ; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 18:52:45 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DFE64DC.E7A9E0F@skyweb.net> Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 18:42:20 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com" Subject: NOT AM Stereo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Not am stereo But AM related today at 4pm My shed Became the new home of an RCA BTA-500R that was the backup transmitter from the Dark WERA 1590... and the new dad is Proud Of it.. Pictures on the website shortly.. BTW Kevin(possum) If I get the BTA 10-H it will Go Live on 75 meters at the Full legal Limit.. LOL I'm still waiting for a return Email on that baby Neal From KC4QLP@aol.com Mon Dec 16 15:49:18 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Dec 2002 23:49:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 45257 invoked from network); 16 Dec 2002 23:49:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Dec 2002 23:49:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r04.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.100) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Dec 2002 23:49:17 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.76.275363c3 (4238) for ; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 18:49:04 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <76.275363c3.2b2fc070@aol.com> Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 18:49:04 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Gates BC1E Was:Question For Eric To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/16/02 3:41:14 PM Eastern Standard Time, possumhunter@netzero.net writes: << > Wow!....lol that station sounds slightly better equipped than most Willis Broadcasting owned radio stations! lol They must have some real "nice" ones, huh? Kevin >> hehehehe...you dont know the half of it. Most of the Willis stations I've been in were just shells of radio stations. One in particular is a station that simulcast with another FM station.....the main station if you will has a working studio and all....not much glory,but its operational.The other FM is in a small building..probably a 10 foot by 20 foot building...the 3kw trashmitter died so instead of replacing with a trashmitter to meet the licensed power...hehehe...they put in a 10 watt exciter connected to a 1kw amp and fed that into an antenna system with an ungodly high swr...so the amp folds back the power giving you a whooping 50 watts out of the amp!..lol ..so figuring the swr,line loss and probable antenna again...if any..you might have 5 or 10 watts present at the antenna. Programming is picked up on an Optimus analog radio tuned to the other FM. Now is gets better....this same group once owned an AM station that simulcasted with the two FM's .....all that was at the transmitter site was a 1kw transmitter {I forget what the transmitter was...it was in fair condition though with some years of neglect}...no studio equipment at all because in their eyes....lol, all they needed was a CLOCK RADIO!...lmao!, connected to the transmitter tuned to one of the FM signals. Just when you think you've seen it all..you really havent...lol. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From rwagoner@cox.net Mon Dec 16 15:53:12 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner@cox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Dec 2002 23:53:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 52840 invoked from network); 16 Dec 2002 23:53:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Dec 2002 23:53:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Dec 2002 23:53:11 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.178] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Dec 2002 23:53:11 -0000 Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 23:53:08 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Delco UX-1 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 760 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Richard Wagoner " X-Originating-IP: 68.4.33.253 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=96123889 X-Yahoo-Profile: richardalanwagoner Yes, it works that way. --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Phil Rafuse " wrote: > I have a possible line on a Delco UX-1. I have a question for those > familiar with this rig: When you have the AM-ST switch activated, > does this open up the bandwidth so that AM mono stations will have > the benefit of wideband reception? Or, would it be necessary to > tune in a CQUAM signal for this? In other words, is it necessary to > have a pilot tone to engage wideband? Apparently, some AM Stereo > rigs work this way. My circa 1988 Toyota car radio provides wideband > reception on mono stations when the AM-ST button is activated. I'm > wondering if the Delco UX-1 works on the same principle? > > Thanks > > Phil R. From dav259@csiro.au Mon Dec 16 16:06:13 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Dec 2002 00:06:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 25597 invoked from network); 17 Dec 2002 00:06:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Dec 2002 00:06:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Dec 2002 00:06:12 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gBH06BP23646 for ; Tue, 17 Dec 2002 11:06:11 +1100 (EST) Date: Tue, 17 Dec 2002 11:06:10 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Metrosound madness In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public On Mon, 16 Dec 2002, Kevin T. wrote: > A better choice would be to get PC speakers with a built-in AC power > supply, as I have found them to be relatively interference-free. Or > you could upgrade to a small stereo amplifier hooked up to a regular > pair of speakers. Radio Shack has made a nice small amplifier (the > SA-150 or SA-155) as well as some small speakers that have been > acclaimed for their good sound quality, but I don't know if you'll > be able to find this -- do you still have Tandy stores Down Under? Thanks Kevin! Most have inferred that the metrosound won't work well near a computer but you may have hit on the answer. The speakers I trialled it with at home are pretty cheap and do have their own power supply (ie. they're plugged into the PC processor - not a power adaptor) and it sounded very good through them - well as good as any CD sounds through them and better than streaming. And if that doesn't work I can try some small battery powered ones. All may not be lost. From davidcoons@webtv.net Mon Dec 16 16:17:33 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: davidcoons@webtv.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Dec 2002 00:17:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 75101 invoked from network); 17 Dec 2002 00:17:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Dec 2002 00:17:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO smtpout-2001-3.public.lawson.webtv.net) (209.240.212.83) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Dec 2002 00:17:32 -0000 Received: from storefull-2318.public.lawson.webtv.net (lawson-public-ipmux-1-pip-8.public.lawson.webtv.net [209.240.212.99]) by smtpout-2001-3.public.lawson.webtv.net (WebTV_Postfix+sws) with ESMTP id 314E4BF17 for ; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 16:17:31 -0800 (PST) Received: (from production@localhost) by storefull-2318.public.lawson.webtv.net (8.8.8-wtv-f/mt.gso.26Feb98) id QAA29916; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 16:17:32 -0800 (PST) X-WebTV-Signature: 1 ETAtAhUAv1/OUsgZtsIT57/J6E9WJHWV0fwCFGmXtvdXJ5YrhGXAZl/6v0pwpuCl Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 19:17:32 -0500 (EST) To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Here we go! READ THIS Message-ID: <29923-3DFE6D1C-4998@storefull-2318.public.lawson.webtv.net> In-Reply-To: "Kevin T. " 's message of Mon, 16 Dec 2002 06:04:23 -0000 Content-Disposition: Inline Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) X-eGroups-From: davidcoons@webtv.net (David Coons) From: davidcoons@webtv.net X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10533228 since iboc only needs one sideband to be decoded as with analog, why is it designed with both? From michaelj@vcn.com Mon Dec 16 16:19:16 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Dec 2002 00:19:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 74558 invoked from network); 17 Dec 2002 00:19:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Dec 2002 00:19:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m1-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.31) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Dec 2002 00:19:16 -0000 Received: from michael (unverified [209.193.86.28]) by m1-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 17:19:16 -0700 To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} Re: Delco UX-1 Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 17:19:09 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) In-reply-to: X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Importance: Normal From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Phil YEP!! That's exactly how it works. Push in that AM ST switch and you open up the bandwidth for ALL am stations, not just the stereo ones :) That's why I LOVE my UX-1. Michael n Wyo --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Phil Rafuse " wrote: > I have a possible line on a Delco UX-1. I have a question for those > familiar with this rig: When you have the AM-ST switch activated, > does this open up the bandwidth so that AM mono stations will have > the benefit of wideband reception? Or, would it be necessary to > tune in a CQUAM signal for this? In other words, is it necessary to > have a pilot tone to engage wideband? Apparently, some AM Stereo > rigs work this way. My circa 1988 Toyota car radio provides wideband > reception on mono stations when the AM-ST button is activated. I'm > wondering if the Delco UX-1 works on the same principle? > > Thanks > > Phil R. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Dec 16 17:40:38 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Dec 2002 01:40:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 93268 invoked from network); 17 Dec 2002 01:40:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Dec 2002 01:40:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.67) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Dec 2002 01:40:37 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.146] by n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Dec 2002 01:40:37 -0000 Date: Tue, 17 Dec 2002 01:40:34 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Metrosound madness Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <008f01c2a545$f56bbbc0$96f9bed8@com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2015 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.87.141 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > I wish there were a solution but there really is none. This is why > many want digital radio, to get away from the interference. Computer equipment can vary widely in the amount of RF noise it generates. My sister has a Sony VAIO laptop whose AC adapter generates whines and squeals all over the band that can be picked up farther away than the signal of my 100 mW AM Stereo transmitter! But yet my Toshiba laptop (with built-in AC adapter) is "quiet" enough that you can have an AM radio 10 feet away with no noise from it. Many desktop computers these days are using plastic cases which are obviously not as good for RF shielding as the thick metal cases that were common in the past (some of the old IBM AT and PS/2 computers were almost literally built like a tank!). Monitors are also a frustrating source of noise on the AM and shortwave bands. If you really want a monitor that doesn't wipe out reception with oscillator noise when in use, I recommend getting an old, high-quality Mitsubishi "Diamond Scan" monitor, or one of the original NEC MultiSync monitors. With a little luck, these can be found in used- but-perfectly-working condition at computer shows for almost nothing. Then, anything that uses a "wall wart" or "brick" type of external AC adapter can be a notorious culprit of RF noise, mostly of the buzzing type. As long as the voltages and plug types match, these can be substituted for other AC adapters that are known to be "RF quiet". Nobody should have to deal with constant man-made radio interference from an unknown source. With a little investigation, such as unplugging equipment and/or switching off circuit breakers one-by-one and carrying around a transistor radio to spot-check, you should be able to at least identify the sources of RF noise that are causing trouble. Of course, it might not be possible to eliminate or reduce these interference sources all the time, but it is good to at least know for sure where it might be coming from. From jsgil@hal-pc.org Mon Dec 16 17:41:34 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Dec 2002 01:41:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 63251 invoked from network); 17 Dec 2002 01:41:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Dec 2002 01:41:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.88) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Dec 2002 01:41:33 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.136] by n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Dec 2002 01:41:32 -0000 Date: Tue, 17 Dec 2002 01:41:31 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: Here we go! READ THIS Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <29923-3DFE6D1C-4998@storefull-2318.public.lawson.webtv.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 411 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.12 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, davidcoons@w... wrote: > since iboc only needs one sideband to be decoded as with analog, why is > it designed with both? So it can put out twice the amount of bandwidth of a continuous wave of white noise ;-). Actually it is there for redundancy in case there is noise in one sideband and not the other. It's supposed to add robustness to the signal integrety. JSG From KC4QLP@aol.com Mon Dec 16 17:44:22 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Dec 2002 01:44:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 14412 invoked from network); 17 Dec 2002 01:44:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Dec 2002 01:44:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m05.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.8) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Dec 2002 01:44:22 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.7c.32cfe4f2 (4238) for ; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 20:44:06 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <7c.32cfe4f2.2b2fdb65@aol.com> Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 20:44:05 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} NOT AM Stereo To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/16/02 6:48:12 PM Eastern Standard Time, groucho@skyweb.net writes: << BTW Kevin(possum) If I get the BTA 10-H it will Go Live on 75 meters at the Full legal Limit.. LOL I'm still waiting for a return Email on that baby Neal >> Or it could end up being "Radio Free NJ" into one backyard sized air cooled dummy load...LOL Hate to see the electric bill on that at 10kw! wow! Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From stodd@sherbtel.net Mon Dec 16 18:13:38 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Dec 2002 02:13:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 49127 invoked from network); 17 Dec 2002 02:13:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Dec 2002 02:13:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Dec 2002 02:13:37 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-237.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.237]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gBH2DYOd029004 for ; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 20:13:35 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <004201c2a571$e915c240$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <12e.1da8ba8c.2b2d772e@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Question For Eric Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 20:13:34 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude There are still some folks out there who know how to fix that. You may want to post to the Radiotech forum on bnet to see if anyone would be willing to help. I have a hard time believing you couldn't make it stereo. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Possum Hunter" > Agreed! I played around with the RCA this evening, and I don't think it is > going to work in CQUAM. It has a good bit of phase distortion in it. From stodd@sherbtel.net Mon Dec 16 18:22:00 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Dec 2002 02:22:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 81774 invoked from network); 17 Dec 2002 02:21:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Dec 2002 02:21:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Dec 2002 02:21:59 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-237.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.237]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gBH2LtOd001267 for ; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 20:21:57 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <005201c2a573$140ccb00$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC Conversion Was: Lawyers thread Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 20:21:56 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude WLW never had a Westinghouse. Their first 50kW was that big Western Electric which was later used to drive the big RCA 500kW. Then came the cathanode rig, then a more modern rig (can't remember what it was- Continental or Harris, most likely.) Except for the big amp which has been partially canibalized, they've still got all their old transmitters. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Possum Hunter" When they were running a 317 full time, WLW > always sounded better when they were on the old 50KW Westinghouse. From stodd@sherbtel.net Mon Dec 16 18:27:38 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Dec 2002 02:27:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 92758 invoked from network); 17 Dec 2002 02:27:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Dec 2002 02:27:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Dec 2002 02:27:37 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-237.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.237]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gBH2RXOd002779 for ; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 20:27:35 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <006001c2a573$dd9d70a0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <143.537bf71.2b2edac6@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} iboc report Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 20:27:34 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude hehe- what a way to make them spend their money! More of us need to hit the FCC with our comments. Let's bleed 'em dry, boys! ST ----- Original Message ----- From: > If you > made comments to the FCC during the first commenting stage...then you were > tagged to receive this document...and others that might follow. From stodd@sherbtel.net Mon Dec 16 18:30:30 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Dec 2002 02:30:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 49380 invoked from network); 17 Dec 2002 02:30:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Dec 2002 02:30:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Dec 2002 02:30:28 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-237.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.237]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gBH2UPOd003456 for ; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 20:30:26 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <007201c2a574$43d33620$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Metrosound madness Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 20:30:26 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude One other thing Chris didn't mention- loopstick antennas are less prone to some types of interference than rod antennas are. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ian Davidson" > Of course I am playing it using a Radio Shack car aerial From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Dec 16 18:33:30 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Dec 2002 02:33:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 17056 invoked from network); 17 Dec 2002 02:33:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Dec 2002 02:33:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Dec 2002 02:33:27 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.250] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Dec 2002 02:33:27 -0000 Date: Tue, 17 Dec 2002 02:33:26 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: No IBOC receivers until 2004 Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1207 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.87.141 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics From one of the comments iBiquity filed with the FCC: "...without FCC action, and subsequent broadcasting of IBOC beginning over the course of the Fall [2002], IBOC receivers at the CES show [sic] in January [2003] were unlikely to be successfully launched. In turn, without a successful CES show [sic], rack space in retail stores woukd not be allocated, receivers would not be sold in mass [sic], and consumers would have to wait an additional year to receive digital radio." Nevermind the fact that "CES" already stands for "Consumer Electronics Show", so saying "CES show" is redundant, and also that the proper phrase is "en masse", let's consider the current situation, as of just a few weeks before the CES on January 9-12, 2003... we have only a handful of AM stations transmitting IBOC (700 WLW, 710 WOR, 1200 WCHB, and maybe a few others), and no announcements of any IBOC receivers being ready for retail sale anytime soon... so, as I interpret iBiquity's comments, this means the official launch of IBOC receivers will be delayed until the next CES in January 2004, at the earliest. That's only 11 years after they first promised that IBOC receivers would be on store shelves! From stodd@sherbtel.net Mon Dec 16 18:38:08 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Dec 2002 02:38:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 13292 invoked from network); 17 Dec 2002 02:38:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Dec 2002 02:38:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Dec 2002 02:38:08 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-237.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.237]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gBH2c5Od005524 for ; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 20:38:06 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <009601c2a575$55cf4980$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <3DFDC15D.F0EC3133@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} NEW AM BROADCAST FORMAT Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 20:38:06 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude I'm too far away to help you physically, but having moved two dozen or more transmitters in my life, I can give you all the details you'll ever need. Scott ----- Original Message ----- From: "Neal Newman" > BTW any of you Guys near Cleveland Ohio? I may be acquiring an Old RCA > BTA-10H transmitter Need help moving it to New Jersey this is No joke I'm > serious From KC4QLP@aol.com Mon Dec 16 18:38:33 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Dec 2002 02:38:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 90890 invoked from network); 17 Dec 2002 02:38:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Dec 2002 02:38:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r08.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.104) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Dec 2002 02:38:33 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.a6.31377250 (4238) for ; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 21:38:28 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 21:38:28 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Question For Eric To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/16/02 9:14:24 PM Eastern Standard Time, stodd@sherbtel.net writes: << There are still some folks out there who know how to fix that. You may want to post to the Radiotech forum on bnet to see if anyone would be willing to help. I have a hard time believing you couldn't make it stereo. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Possum Hunter" > Agreed! I played around with the RCA this evening, and I don't think it is > going to work in CQUAM. It has a good bit of phase distortion in it. >> Does the phase distortion change at the lower power level? How new and how much have those tubes been used? Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- Subscribe send an email to amstereo-subscribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From KC4QLP@aol.com Mon Dec 16 18:40:55 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Dec 2002 02:40:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 32781 invoked from network); 17 Dec 2002 02:40:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Dec 2002 02:40:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d05.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Dec 2002 02:40:55 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.183.13aa7a25 (4238) for ; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 21:40:50 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <183.13aa7a25.2b2fe8b2@aol.com> Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 21:40:50 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} iboc report To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/16/02 9:29:09 PM Eastern Standard Time, stodd@sherbtel.net writes: << hehe- what a way to make them spend their money! More of us need to hit the FCC with our comments. Let's bleed 'em dry, boys! ST ----- Original Message ----- From: > If you > made comments to the FCC during the first commenting stage...then you were > tagged to receive this document...and others that might follow. >> I havent been up on the FCC site in a few days.Are they taking comments on this now? Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- Subscribe send an email to amstereo-subscribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Dec 16 18:41:02 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Dec 2002 02:41:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 37905 invoked from network); 17 Dec 2002 02:41:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Dec 2002 02:41:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Dec 2002 02:41:01 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.250] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Dec 2002 02:41:01 -0000 Date: Tue, 17 Dec 2002 02:40:56 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: IBOC Conversion Was: Lawyers thread Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <005201c2a573$140ccb00$827dfea9@home1> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1032 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.87.141 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > WLW never had a Westinghouse. Their first 50kW was that big > Western Electric which was later used to drive the big RCA 500kW. > Then came the cathanode rig, then a more modern rig (can't remember > what it was- Continental or Harris, most likely.) Except for the > big amp which has been partially canibalized, they've still got all > their old transmitters. I'd love to see WLW install a modern 500 kW transmitter and use *that* to put out an IBOC signal... suddenly I don't think 710 WOR would be so happy about using IBOC at night, or even during the daytime for that matter! Anybody know if PJB in the Caribbean on 800 kHz is still on the air with 500,000 watts? They are/were the highest-power AM station in the Western Hemisphere. p.s. Also, what about the use of IBOC on 530 or 1700 kHz... wouldn't the extra bandwidth place part of the signal outside of the allocated AM band? I know the FCC is picky about ham radio operators transmitting outside of their band limits... what about broadcast stations? From KC4QLP@aol.com Mon Dec 16 18:48:33 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Dec 2002 02:48:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 25968 invoked from network); 17 Dec 2002 02:48:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Dec 2002 02:48:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r10.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.106) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Dec 2002 02:48:32 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r10.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.ba.3265e6d7 (4238) for ; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 21:48:25 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 21:48:25 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} NEW AM BROADCAST FORMAT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/16/02 9:40:24 PM Eastern Standard Time, stodd@sherbtel.net writes: << I'm too far away to help you physically, but having moved two dozen or more transmitters in my life, I can give you all the details you'll ever need. Scott ----- Original Message ----- From: "Neal Newman" > BTW any of you Guys near Cleveland Ohio? I may be acquiring an Old RCA > BTA-10H transmitter Need help moving it to New Jersey this is No joke I'm > serious >> We may need all the info we can gather. If Neal gets this rig..I've already told him I would give him a hand. Nice Friday and weekend project for sure eh? lol Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- Subscribe send an email to amstereo-subscribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From stodd@sherbtel.net Mon Dec 16 18:51:08 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Dec 2002 02:51:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 98094 invoked from network); 17 Dec 2002 02:51:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Dec 2002 02:51:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Dec 2002 02:51:08 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-237.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.237]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gBH2p5Od009114 for ; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 20:51:06 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <00db01c2a577$26b9d780$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Sansui Tuner Question Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 20:51:06 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude If you can liberate them, there's someone who'll use them! ST ----- Original Message ----- From: > And I've sent mail to a couple of former employers who killed stereo > as well since I know the exciter is still in the xmter rack...WGCL in > Bloomington, and WNVI in North Vernon. Just trying to do my part :-) From stodd@sherbtel.net Mon Dec 16 18:57:54 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Dec 2002 02:57:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 67330 invoked from network); 17 Dec 2002 02:57:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Dec 2002 02:57:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Dec 2002 02:57:54 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-237.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.237]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gBH2voOd010998 for ; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 20:57:51 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <00e501c2a578$1833c620$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} I'm sure you get this question a lot but... Anywhere to get SRF-42 or others? Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 20:57:51 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude If you're talking portables and walkmans, unfortunately there aren't any new ones being made. We are working to change that, but it's a slow, hard process since nobody on this list has a lot of money to invest in such a project. Your best bet is to get a good FM stereo/AM mono radio and add a decoder to it. List member Chris Cuff makes them, and I believe Jeff Deck also does, or did until recently. A good boombox can be had for $65 or less (some much less!), and adding $25 for the decoder, you have what you want for less than $100. I'm not sure if Chris still modifies radios for people, but if he can at least supply a schematic (electrical diagram) of the unit, several of us are qualified to do the conversion. There are lots of good car radios with AM stereo if you just need something for your basement. Scott Todd ----- Original Message ----- From: > Is there ***ANYWHERE*** besides Ebay to get an SRF-42? Anyone selling > any? ... Also, any reliable source to get AM Stereo receivers that > don't cost $200+ ? From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Mon Dec 16 18:58:12 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Dec 2002 02:58:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 82868 invoked from network); 17 Dec 2002 02:58:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Dec 2002 02:58:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf17bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.177) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Dec 2002 02:58:12 -0000 Received: from juan ([67.34.223.235]) by imf17bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.19 201-253-122-122-119-20020516) with SMTP id <20021217030003.QIKA18217.imf17bis.bellsouth.net@juan>; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 22:00:03 -0500 Message-ID: <002501c2a578$24614c10$af78fea9@juan> To: , Subject: OT: Fw: Some New, Some Old, Lawyer Jokes Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 21:58:14 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Just recieved my papers from the Attorneys Juan Just for a laugh......... Subject: Some New, Some Old, Lawyer Jokes > > > > * The Post Office just recalled their latest stamps. They had > pictures of lawyers on them, and people couldn't figure out > which side to spit on. > > * How can a pregnant woman tell that she's carrying a future lawyer? > She has an uncontrollable craving for baloney. > > * How does an attorney sleep? > First he lies on one side, and then he lies on the other. > > * How many lawyer jokes are there? > Only three. The rest are true stories. > > * How many lawyers does it take to change a light bulb? > How many can you afford? > > * How many lawyers does it take to screw in a light bulb? > Three. One to climb the ladder, one to shake it, and one > to sue the ladder company. > > * If a lawyer and an IRS agent were both drowning, and > you could save only one of them, would you go to lunch > or read the paper? > > * What did the lawyer name his daughter? > Sue. > > * What do you call 25 skydiving lawyers? > Skeet. > > * What do you call a lawyer gone bad? > Senator. > > * What do you call a lawyer with an IQ of 50? > Your honor. > > * What do you throw to a drowning lawyer? > His partners. > > * What does a lawyer use for birth control? > His personality. > > * What happens when you cross a pig with a lawyer? > Nothing. There are some things a pig won't do. > > * What's the difference between a lawyer and a vulture? > The lawyer gets frequent flyer miles. > > * What's another difference between a lawyer and a vulture? > Removable wing tips. > > * Why does California have the most lawyers in the > country while New Jersey has the most toxic waste sites? > New Jersey got first choice. From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Mon Dec 16 19:01:25 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Dec 2002 03:01:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 81976 invoked from network); 17 Dec 2002 03:01:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Dec 2002 03:01:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf17bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.177) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Dec 2002 03:01:25 -0000 Received: from juan ([67.34.223.235]) by imf17bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.19 201-253-122-122-119-20020516) with SMTP id <20021217030317.QLPZ18217.imf17bis.bellsouth.net@juan> for ; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 22:03:17 -0500 Message-ID: <002d01c2a578$97be39c0$af78fea9@juan> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Delco UX-1 Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 22:01:27 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit The UX-1 in my car has narrow and wide (AM Stereo)....but when the radio detects the Pilot...it opens up even wider....WTTB sounds great in wide-band...but when the pilot is on, look out...it sounds awesome Juan ----- Original Message ----- From: Richard Wagoner To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, December 16, 2002 6:53 PM Subject: {AMSF} Re: Delco UX-1 Yes, it works that way. --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Phil Rafuse " wrote: > I have a possible line on a Delco UX-1. I have a question for those > familiar with this rig: When you have the AM-ST switch activated, > does this open up the bandwidth so that AM mono stations will have > the benefit of wideband reception? Or, would it be necessary to > tune in a CQUAM signal for this? In other words, is it necessary to > have a pilot tone to engage wideband? Apparently, some AM Stereo > rigs work this way. My circa 1988 Toyota car radio provides wideband > reception on mono stations when the AM-ST button is activated. I'm > wondering if the Delco UX-1 works on the same principle? > > Thanks > > Phil R. Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From possumhunter@netzero.net Mon Dec 16 20:48:18 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Dec 2002 04:48:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 22675 invoked from network); 17 Dec 2002 04:48:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Dec 2002 04:48:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.125) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Dec 2002 04:48:18 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 20:48:18 -0800 To: References: Subject: Phase Distortion Was: Question For Eric Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 23:48:00 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 17 Dec 2002 04:48:18.0152 (UTC) FILETIME=[84798680:01C2A587] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.174.134.114] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: > Does the phase distortion change at the lower power level? It stays about the same. There is perhaps a slight bit more on low Power, but not enough to matter. > > How new and how much have those tubes been used? I re-tubed the whole transmitter when I got it. There is less than a few hundred hours on the tubes. It has a new Peter Dahl modulation transformer, and a very low miles Peter Dahl Plate transformer and filter caps. All of the electrolytics and paper caps were replaced. along with the high voltage contactor. I tried using both the main oscillator and CONELRAD crystal inputs. I was thinking about a way to drive the IPAs with the composite signal to see if that gets rid of it. I just don't want to go modifying on my "Baby". The sound quality is very impressive in Mono. It just distorts the L-R in stereo making the audio sound grainy. I know the BE Exciter I borrowed for the test is working properly. Kevin From groucho@skyweb.net Mon Dec 16 21:45:35 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Dec 2002 05:45:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 86203 invoked from network); 17 Dec 2002 05:45:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Dec 2002 05:45:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Dec 2002 05:45:33 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gBH5pOg3024088 for ; Tue, 17 Dec 2002 00:51:25 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DFEB8E7.6D041674@skyweb.net> Date: Tue, 17 Dec 2002 00:40:56 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} NEW AM BROADCAST FORMAT References: <3DFDC15D.F0EC3133@skyweb.net> <009601c2a575$55cf4980$827dfea9@home1> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 thanks Scott Does not matter Mike got hold of me the BTA-10H is gone already No big deal there will always be others Neal Scott Todd wrote: > I'm too far away to help you physically, but having moved two dozen or more > transmitters in my life, I can give you all the details you'll ever need. > > Scott > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Neal Newman" > > > BTW any of you Guys near Cleveland Ohio? I may be acquiring an Old RCA > > BTA-10H transmitter Need help moving it to New Jersey this is No joke I'm > > serious > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From possumhunter@netzero.net Mon Dec 16 22:10:47 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Dec 2002 06:10:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 27223 invoked from network); 17 Dec 2002 06:10:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Dec 2002 06:10:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.122) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Dec 2002 06:10:44 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 22:10:44 -0800 To: References: <3DFDC15D.F0EC3133@skyweb.net> <009601c2a575$55cf4980$827dfea9@home1> <3DFEB8E7.6D041674@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} NEW AM BROADCAST FORMAT Date: Tue, 17 Dec 2002 01:10:31 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 17 Dec 2002 06:10:44.0732 (UTC) FILETIME=[08DDBBC0:01C2A593] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.174.134.114] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Neal Newman wrote: >Mike got hold of me the BTA-10H is gone already > No big deal there will always be others Neal, I know where there is a water vapor cooled Gates VP-50 on 1070Khz you could get for REAL cheap, maybe for the hauling. It has the optional 25KW cutback in it. It uses two 3CV30,000H3 Triodes running Class B to plate modulate a 7480 triode PA. It uses a 4CX3000A to light off the 7480. That transmitter weighs just over 12,000 pounds, so you will win the "Heavy Metal" AM contest with ease! It will certainly put a helluva signal on 75 meters! LOL How would you explain to the power company that you want 460Volt 3 phase power in your ham shack? Kevin From matthew.trim@eds.com Mon Dec 16 22:33:40 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: matthew.trim@eds.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Dec 2002 06:33:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 35756 invoked from network); 17 Dec 2002 06:33:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Dec 2002 06:33:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO ns5.eds.com) (203.17.185.230) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Dec 2002 06:33:39 -0000 Received: from nnsy.eds.com (nnsy-2.eds.com [192.85.216.198]) by ns5.eds.com (8.11.6/8.11.1) with ESMTP id gBH6XbK12612 for ; Tue, 17 Dec 2002 17:33:37 +1100 (EST) Received: from nnsy.eds.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by nnsy.eds.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gBH6XaF15093 for ; Tue, 17 Dec 2002 17:33:36 +1100 (EST) Received: from ausym000.exau01.exch.eds.com ([134.251.177.117]) by nnsy.eds.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gBH6Xar15089 for ; Tue, 17 Dec 2002 17:33:36 +1100 (EST) Received: by AUSYM000 with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Tue, 17 Dec 2002 17:32:43 +1100 Message-ID: <33CDDBD8CAEFEB4191ABF6F799032AF238D6FC@aubwm206> To: "'amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com'" Subject: Cheap: Omnia / Orban like compression for $US99: MBL4 Broadcast Date: Tue, 17 Dec 2002 17:32:04 +1100 Importance: high X-Priority: 1 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-Type: text/plain From: "Trim, Matthew L" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88615102 X-Yahoo-Profile: bofh2k2000 G'day, I found a very interesting product - software based 4 band audio processing - from http://www.burnill.co.uk/mbl4.php Basically it allows you to dedicate a computer with a quality soundcard to do the job of an Omnia or Orban Optimod. I downloaded the demo and gave it a shot and it sounds great. Would be great for low budget stations who cannot afford "the real thing"! Is anyone game to try it on their station up against a hardware compressor? The only downside is that a stable PC would need to be carefully built and tested with probably Windows 2000 to ensure reliability. It also has a plugin available which allows you to interface it with WinAMP etc and would allow you to run it on your playout computer assuming you are a Part 15 or other small broadcaster. Cheers, Matt From groucho@skyweb.net Mon Dec 16 22:41:08 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Dec 2002 06:41:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 75733 invoked from network); 17 Dec 2002 06:41:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Dec 2002 06:41:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Dec 2002 06:41:07 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gBH6kxg3038844 for ; Tue, 17 Dec 2002 01:46:59 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DFEC5E6.CCE4F862@skyweb.net> Date: Tue, 17 Dec 2002 01:36:22 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} NEW AM BROADCAST FORMAT References: <3DFDC15D.F0EC3133@skyweb.net> <009601c2a575$55cf4980$827dfea9@home1> <3DFEB8E7.6D041674@skyweb.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Don't tempt me Kevin LOL... up at My recording studio in CT I have 3 phase 480 and a nice Old 140 foot tower that My partner used to use for a Tow truck service he used to own. LOL.... . Possum Hunter wrote: > Neal Newman wrote: > >Mike got hold of me the BTA-10H is gone already > > No big deal there will always be others > > Neal, > I know where there is a water vapor cooled Gates VP-50 on 1070Khz you could > get for REAL cheap, maybe for the hauling. It has the optional 25KW cutback > in it. It uses two 3CV30,000H3 Triodes running Class B to plate modulate a > 7480 triode PA. It uses a 4CX3000A to light off the 7480. That transmitter > weighs just over 12,000 pounds, so you will win the "Heavy Metal" AM contest > with ease! It will certainly put a helluva signal on 75 meters! LOL > How would you explain to the power company that you want 460Volt 3 phase > power in your ham shack? > > Kevin > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From possumhunter@netzero.net Mon Dec 16 22:51:04 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: possumhunter@netzero.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Dec 2002 06:51:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 53525 invoked from network); 17 Dec 2002 06:51:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Dec 2002 06:51:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rly-ip03.mx.aol.com) (64.12.138.7) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Dec 2002 06:51:03 -0000 Received: from logs-mtc-tg.proxy.aol.com (logs-mtc-tg.proxy.aol.com [64.12.102.135]) by rly-ip03.mx.aol.com (v89.10) with ESMTP id RELAYIN4-1217015002; Tue, 17 Dec 2002 01:50:02 -0500 Received: from ibm (ACAE8672.ipt.aol.com [172.174.134.114]) by logs-mtc-tg.proxy.aol.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with SMTP id gBH3c9G302080 for ; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 22:38:15 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <005301c2a57d$b8cc7fa0$7286aeac@aoldsl.net> To: References: <005201c2a573$140ccb00$827dfea9@home1> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC Conversion Was: Lawyers thread Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 22:37:56 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Apparently-From: DodgeRamTrucker@aol.com From: "Possum Hunter" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Scott Todd wrote: > WLW never had a Westinghouse. The Western Electric replaced the low power '20s vintage Westinghouse. > > Then came the cathanode rig, then a more modern rig My stuff on WLW is at home and I am at work, but I think it was a Collins. > >Except for the big amp which has been partially canibalized, they've still got all their old transmitters. No, the oldest they have is the Western Electric, they started with a Westinghouse in the '20s Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Mon Dec 16 23:15:16 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: possumhunter@netzero.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Dec 2002 07:15:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 76491 invoked from network); 17 Dec 2002 07:15:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Dec 2002 07:15:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rly-ip03.mx.aol.com) (64.12.138.7) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Dec 2002 07:15:14 -0000 Received: from logs-mtc-tg.proxy.aol.com (logs-mtc-tg.proxy.aol.com [64.12.102.135]) by rly-ip03.mx.aol.com (v89.10) with ESMTP id RELAYIN3-1217021409; Tue, 17 Dec 2002 02:14:09 -0500 Received: from ibm (ACAE8672.ipt.aol.com [172.174.134.114]) by logs-mtc-tg.proxy.aol.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with SMTP id gBH3jOG277573 for ; Mon, 16 Dec 2002 22:45:29 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <007b01c2a57e$bcdf2c40$7286aeac@aoldsl.net> To: References: <00db01c2a577$26b9d780$827dfea9@home1> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Sansui Tuner Question Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 22:45:12 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Apparently-From: DodgeRamTrucker@aol.com From: "Possum Hunter" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Scott Todd wrote: > If you can liberate them, there's someone who'll use them! Yea, ME! If anybody will get me one, I will have it on the air in less than 24 hours after I get it! Kevin From KC4QLP@aol.com Mon Dec 16 23:21:49 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Dec 2002 07:21:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 82759 invoked from network); 17 Dec 2002 07:21:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Dec 2002 07:21:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r04.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.100) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Dec 2002 07:21:47 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.79.4b1ab7e (30950) for ; Tue, 17 Dec 2002 02:21:46 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <79.4b1ab7e.2b302a89@aol.com> Date: Tue, 17 Dec 2002 02:21:45 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Phase Distortion Was: Question For Eric To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 12/17/02 12:23:03 AM Eastern Standard Time, possumhunter@netzero.net writes: > The sound quality is very impressive in Mono. It just distorts the L-R in > stereo making the audio sound grainy. I know the BE Exciter I borrowed for > the test is working properly. > How is the RF drive with the BE exciter compared to the RF drive that the transmitter normally has? Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From KC4QLP@aol.com Mon Dec 16 23:32:32 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Dec 2002 07:32:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 54304 invoked from network); 17 Dec 2002 07:32:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Dec 2002 07:32:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m08.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.163) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Dec 2002 07:32:32 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.b0.314e972e (30950) for ; Tue, 17 Dec 2002 02:32:27 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Tue, 17 Dec 2002 02:32:27 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} NEW AM BROADCAST FORMAT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 12/17/02 1:42:04 AM Eastern Standard Time, groucho@skyweb.net writes: > Don't tempt me Kevin LOL... > up at My recording studio in CT I have 3 phase 480 and a nice Old 140 foot > tower > that My partner used to use for a Tow truck service he used to own. > LOL.... > Is that "Radio Free NJ" I hear again broadcasting on that air cooled dummy load in the backyard? LOL Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From jeffdeck@aol.com Tue Dec 17 02:48:54 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: Jeffdeck@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Dec 2002 10:48:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 57106 invoked from network); 17 Dec 2002 10:48:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Dec 2002 10:48:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d03.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.35) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Dec 2002 10:48:53 -0000 Received: from Jeffdeck@aol.com by imo-d03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.5b.32f03faa (3866); Tue, 17 Dec 2002 05:48:47 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <5b.32f03faa.2b305b0f@aol.com> Date: Tue, 17 Dec 2002 05:48:47 EST Subject: Re: I'm sure you get this question a lot but... Anywhere to get SRF-42... To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Cc: amstereo@bellsouth.net MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10638 From: jeffdeck@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=4430287 X-Yahoo-Profile: jeffdeck2001 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit All, Can someone please forward the link for FCC comments and its deadline date? My "papers" are 225 miles from me at the moment. What exactly are the lawyers stating in this filing? Scott: Yes I can sell AM stereo decoder boards to anyone on the list. If anyone is interested, please contact me off list for details. I am gathering service manuals for all Carver tuner products. TX-2 and TX-10 can successfully be modified for C-QuAM AM stereo at the moment. Groucho: I sent the Delco 2000 and UX-1 connection diagrams to you. Chris: Have you investigated the LM3354 inverter chip for your 5 volt need from 1.5 volt battery? Dave in GA: I will forward my address. I look forward to listening to the WWBF and Australia airchecks. Thank you! Please visit my poll and vote for your preferred AM stereo technology medium (until December 25). Thanks. eBay is an excellent source for AM stereo products at top price. Sony SRF-A100 is $300 currently. Another piece of information that I received on Delphi Theftlock feature: Starting with the 2000 model year, reinstalled radios must match the vehicle they were removed. Radio removed from Chevrolet will not function in Oldsmobile, as the electronic on board computers are different. This explains the ridiculously low resale prices for late model Delphi FM stereo/AM/CD car radios. 73, Jeff In a message dated 12/16/2002 9:58:09 PM Eastern Standard Time, Scott writes: >If you're talking portables and walkmans, unfortunately there aren't any new >ones being made. We are working to change that, but it's a slow, hard >process since nobody on this list has a lot of money to invest in such a >project. Your best bet is to get a good FM stereo/AM mono radio and add a >decoder to it. List member Chris Cuff makes them, and I believe Jeff Deck >also does, or did until recently. A good boombox can be had for $65 or less >(some much less!), and adding $25 for the decoder, you have what you want >for less than $100. I'm not sure if Chris still modifies radios for people, >but if he can at least supply a schematic (electrical diagram) of the unit, >several of us are qualified to do the conversion. There are lots of good >car radios with AM stereo if you just need something for your basement. > >Scott Todd [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From bjackson@indyradio.com Tue Dec 17 05:10:30 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Dec 2002 13:10:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 1678 invoked from network); 17 Dec 2002 13:10:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Dec 2002 13:10:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Dec 2002 13:10:29 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.155] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Dec 2002 13:10:29 -0000 Date: Tue, 17 Dec 2002 13:10:28 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Delco UX-1 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1089 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923 " X-Originating-IP: 206.246.142.145 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Phil Rafuse " wrote: > I have a possible line on a Delco UX-1. I have a question for those > familiar with this rig: When you have the AM-ST switch activated, > does this open up the bandwidth so that AM mono stations will have > the benefit of wideband reception? Or, would it be necessary to > tune in a CQUAM signal for this? In other words, is it necessary to > have a pilot tone to engage wideband? Apparently, some AM Stereo > rigs work this way. My circa 1988 Toyota car radio provides wideband > reception on mono stations when the AM-ST button is activated. I'm > wondering if the Delco UX-1 works on the same principle? > > Thanks > > Phil R. In my 1988 Beretta (hey, I work in radio!!!), the AM-ST button does seem to put it in semi-wide band...When you actually come upon a stereo station, it opens up even more. The only "problem" I have with my old UX-1 is that the FM stopped working about 5 years ago...No big loss :-) -Brad Jackson -Susquehanna, Indianapolis -WGLD, WGRL, WFMS From bjackson@indyradio.com Tue Dec 17 05:23:02 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Dec 2002 13:23:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 47941 invoked from network); 17 Dec 2002 13:23:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Dec 2002 13:23:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Dec 2002 13:23:01 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.253] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Dec 2002 13:23:01 -0000 Date: Tue, 17 Dec 2002 13:23:00 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Sansui Tuner Question Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 710 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923 " X-Originating-IP: 206.246.142.145 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "jsgilst " wrote: > Although the 4-way decoder is nice you will get little use from it > nowdays. > > JSG The main reason I wanted this unit was for the history factor...Well, that and the fact that it seems to be a well made machine...weighs a ton! From reading the comments, it seems the AM-mute can't be turned off...So much for dxing. However, I have found at least one station here in Indiana (no calls!) that must be using PowerSide with the pilot on...I don't get a stereo light on C-Quam units, but I do on the Sansui...Another fun advantage of a multi-system decoder! -Brad Jackson -Susquehanna, Indianapolis -WGLD/WGRL/WFMS From bjackson@indyradio.com Tue Dec 17 05:27:39 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Dec 2002 13:27:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 33334 invoked from network); 17 Dec 2002 13:27:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Dec 2002 13:27:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.70) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Dec 2002 13:27:38 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.171] by n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Dec 2002 13:27:37 -0000 Date: Tue, 17 Dec 2002 13:27:35 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: Metrosound madness Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <008f01c2a545$f56bbbc0$96f9bed8@com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 387 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923 " X-Originating-IP: 206.246.142.145 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" wrote: > > I wish there were a solution but there really is none. This is why many want > digital radio, to get away from the interference. > > Kevin But, can IBOC, even with error correction, *really* get thru bad electrical interference? -Brad Jackson -Susquehanna, Indianapolis -WGLD/WGRL/WFMS From bjackson@indyradio.com Tue Dec 17 05:35:58 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Dec 2002 13:35:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 82111 invoked from network); 17 Dec 2002 13:35:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Dec 2002 13:35:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Dec 2002 13:35:58 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.132] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Dec 2002 13:35:57 -0000 Date: Tue, 17 Dec 2002 13:35:56 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: No IBOC receivers until 2004 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 651 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923 " X-Originating-IP: 206.246.142.145 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: >...we have only a handful of AM stations transmitting IBOC > (700 WLW, 710 WOR, 1200 WCHB, and maybe a few others), and no > announcements of any IBOC receivers being ready for retail sale > anytime soon... so, as I interpret iBiquity's comments, this means > the official launch of IBOC receivers will be delayed until the next > CES in January 2004, at the earliest. That's only 11 years after > they first promised that IBOC receivers would be on store shelves! Is WLW doing IBOC full-time during the day? It seems like it comes and goes... From bjackson@indyradio.com Tue Dec 17 05:38:26 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Dec 2002 13:38:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 39238 invoked from network); 17 Dec 2002 13:38:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Dec 2002 13:38:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Dec 2002 13:38:25 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.182] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Dec 2002 13:38:25 -0000 Date: Tue, 17 Dec 2002 13:38:23 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Sansui Tuner Question Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <00db01c2a577$26b9d780$827dfea9@home1> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 593 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923 " X-Originating-IP: 206.246.142.145 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 I'm already a step ahead of you...I have a few calls in to their engineers and GM's :-) Keep your fingers crossed... -Brad Jackson -Susquehanna, Indianapolis --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Scott Todd" wrote: > If you can liberate them, there's someone who'll use them! > > ST > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > > > And I've sent mail to a couple of former employers who killed stereo > > as well since I know the exciter is still in the xmter rack...WGCL in > > Bloomington, and WNVI in North Vernon. Just trying to do my part :-) From jwelton@nautel.com Tue Dec 17 07:39:22 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jwelton@nautel.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Dec 2002 15:39:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 32361 invoked from network); 17 Dec 2002 15:39:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Dec 2002 15:39:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailserver.nautel.com) (24.222.25.85) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Dec 2002 15:39:19 -0000 Received: FROM jeff-welton BY mailserver.nautel.com ; Tue Dec 17 11:39:20 2002 -0400 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Date: Tue, 17 Dec 2002 11:36:47 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: {AMSF} IBOC Conversion Was: Lawyers thread Message-ID: <3DFF0C4A.22795.B29144@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: <00fc01c2a4ad$5e5f5a40$b3d889ac@aoldsl.net> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.02a) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body From: "Jeff Welton" Reply-To: jwelton@nautel.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=26918678 Possum stated: > All Nautel and BE Solid State transmitters are C-QUAM ready and IBOC > compatible. Uhm, yes to the first, no to the second for the Nautels, Kevin. Any Nautel transmitter that has the 'XL' prefix is IBOC compatible. Any 'ND' series transmitter with six LEDs on the power modules rather than three LEDs and a meter is upgradeable, but not currently compatible unless purchased this year. Any ND series with the power meter on the module (applies only to older ND5 and ND10 transmitters) is not currently upgradeable, but may be in the future. This would also apply to original version AMPFET 25 and 50 transmitters, not currently upgradeable, but maybe someday. Any of the original AMPFET series (the only ones we ever made that had blue front panels are not upgradeable and there are no plans to make them so. All of our transmitters, regardless of age, can be fitted with external RF drive, which would include a C-QUAM exciter. Anything built since 1993 will be capable of upgrade to the internal C-QUAM exciter or to an external exciter, although, as we discussed a few months back, that may change in the next revisions, depending on what happens with IBOC. Best Regards, Jeff Welton Nautel Customer Service Dept. Tel.: 1-902-823-3900 ext. 127 Fax: 1-902-823-3183 email: jwelton@nautel.com From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Dec 17 08:39:33 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Dec 2002 16:39:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 40868 invoked from network); 17 Dec 2002 16:39:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Dec 2002 16:39:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Dec 2002 16:39:29 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.142] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Dec 2002 16:39:29 -0000 Date: Tue, 17 Dec 2002 16:39:26 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: I'm sure you get this question a lot but... Anywhere to get SRF-42... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <5b.32f03faa.2b305b0f@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 862 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Can someone please forward the link for FCC comments and its > deadline date? My "papers" are 225 miles from me at the > moment. What exactly are the lawyers stating in this > filing? I put up a link to view the FCC comments at: http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/iboc.htm The mailing that everybody got is the second one on the list, 34 pages dated 12/10/2002. You will need Acrobat PDF Viewer to access it. They are basically trying to get IBOC approved for nighttime use on a case-by-case basis, based exclusively on *mathematical calculations* of how much interference it would cause for each station. I think fancy math, computer simulations, and the like are okay for initial experiments, but they are trying to use it to justify nighttime use of IBOC *without any real-world testing*... which is why I think this approach will clearly fail. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Dec 17 08:51:48 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Dec 2002 16:51:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 30563 invoked from network); 17 Dec 2002 16:51:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Dec 2002 16:51:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.89) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Dec 2002 16:51:45 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.142] by n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Dec 2002 16:51:45 -0000 Date: Tue, 17 Dec 2002 16:51:41 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Metrosound madness Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 884 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > But, can IBOC, even with error correction, *really* get thru > bad electrical interference? Nope... just the same as how a computer modem or fax machine won't work over a really noisy phone line. The digital decoding and error correction can only tolerate so much interference before it just gives up entirely -- just as how digital cell phones will often cut out and drop the connection, even without any prior warning of the signal quality being seriously degraded. Now, will IBOC be able to provide fully-intact digital reception in signal conditions where the same amount of interference would normally make a regular analog AM signal unlistenably poor? *That* is the big question, and we'll have to see *many* more test results of IBOC before can get an answer to that. It seems that the makers of IBOC themselves don't know it for sure, even after years of development. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Dec 17 08:53:51 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Dec 2002 16:53:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 45966 invoked from network); 17 Dec 2002 16:53:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Dec 2002 16:53:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Dec 2002 16:53:48 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.177] by n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Dec 2002 16:53:46 -0000 Date: Tue, 17 Dec 2002 16:53:44 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: No IBOC receivers until 2004 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 318 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Is WLW doing IBOC full-time during the day? It seems like it > comes and goes... I have heard that 700 WLW is only transmitting IBOC when iBiquity is doing reception tests of their signal. 710 WOR had a choice to operate in this manner as well, but they decided to just keep it on full-time during daytime hours. From amfmdx@fastq.com Tue Dec 17 10:26:00 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Dec 2002 18:26:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 80217 invoked from network); 17 Dec 2002 18:25:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Dec 2002 18:25:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Dec 2002 18:25:57 -0000 Received: from fastq (d214-osel-phx.fastq.com [207.173.146.75]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gBHIPuv66450 for ; Tue, 17 Dec 2002 11:25:56 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <008701c2a5f9$b1d59700$aed63fd1@com> To: Subject: FCC letter Date: Tue, 17 Dec 2002 11:25:35 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla Commissioners, gentlemen, I am writing in reply to the recent request on 99-325 by Mr. John Wells King of Garvey Schubert Barer to have IBOC allowed at night. Sirs, I am taking this opportunity to request as a end user that this NOT be allowed. I live in Arizona far from much of the testing that has been done with IBOC. I have had interference from the digital sidebands that cause me loss of service and difficulty in hearing regularly heard stations at my home. At present, although the interference, which sounds like rushing water on each side of the center frequency which is testing, it can be heard here. Not only is the interference with United States stations, it also interferes with international frequencies. In the early December testing with WLW running IBOC, I was unable to listen to sports programming from Southern California that I commonly listen to, without interference from XETRA. The digital artifact was quite destructive to XETRA. During the later testing between WLW and WOR considerable interference was noted between WORs IBOC upper sideband signal and KDWN from Las Vegas. This would cause secondary listeners, in a case of national emergency such as occurred on 9/11, would be rendered unable to retrieve information concerning the emergency. The same would be if there was an EAS message to be broadcast. The general public uses analog radio and the interference would possibly cause many listeners to be rendered unable to receive life saving notifications because of an increased noise floor due to the sideband digital transmission. In the petition on page 3 its noted "...computer models and field tests have shown that night time use of the AM IBOC system can in certain instances, lead to intolerable levels of interference..." If this interference is going to be intolerable in many cases, at least extrapolating what could be from what I have heard, then why cause the public to lose their service and notification of emergencies in any case? With the significant skywave that is observed on MW frequencies, I am of the opinion that digital will not work well, especially in the hybrid IBOC mode and will be destructive to the AM analog band in a way that will cause listeners to flee to other bands or entertainment venues. I disagree with the petition on page 4 that states, "...the number of stations which would cause interference is small." I believe that all stations not running IBOC would receive detrimental interference if I can hear the sidebands on the other side of the country from the testing. This interference has been noted also in California. It is for this reason that I believe that even the digital stations would interfere with one another in the IBOC hybrid mode. I would like to see further testing with several adjacent frequencies with stations such as 1060 KDUS,KNX 1070 kHz, KSCO 1080 kHz or some such clustered arrangement be tested. Furthermore until testing is done with 8 or so stations on a graveyard frequency such as 1230 and 1240 clustered in a fairly close proximity, then the true effect of IBOC will not be understood. Its for the reason that I feel testing in not only complete but I believe that real world testing has not even been accomplished that I am against the night time use of IBOC on MW frequencies at this time. Thank You Commissioners for your time in this matter. Kevin Redding 1357 S. Hall Mesa, Arizona 85204 "Its going to get a lot worse before it gets worse" - Lily Tomlin From groucho@skyweb.net Tue Dec 17 11:06:41 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Dec 2002 19:06:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 515 invoked from network); 17 Dec 2002 19:06:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Dec 2002 19:06:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Dec 2002 19:06:38 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gBHJBb4Q070720; Tue, 17 Dec 2002 14:11:58 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3DFF7479.65F93849@skyweb.net> Date: Tue, 17 Dec 2002 14:01:13 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com" , Bob Carter , David Hochfelder , Fran Little , Mike Erickson , Possum Hunter , rjskadl Subject: New home Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 for those of you following My thread... I lost out to getting the BTA-10H However You may look at the new toy...... I have Saved a piece of New Jersey Broadcast history I did not want to see it go to another ham in another State. It arrived at its new home at 4pm On 12/16/02 Its the backup transmitter that came out of the Now Dark WERA 1590 in Plainfield New Jersey. this retired transmitter I am restoring to be used up on 1885 of the 160 Meter Amateur radio band. The RCA-BTA500R http://www.angelfire.com/nj4/wttm/rca.html more pictures to Follow.. as work Progresses on the unit.. Neal Ka2caf CE-WTTM From KC4QLP@aol.com Tue Dec 17 11:34:55 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Dec 2002 19:34:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 33538 invoked from network); 17 Dec 2002 19:34:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Dec 2002 19:34:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r10.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.106) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Dec 2002 19:34:52 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r10.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.124.1ba33d15 (3972) for ; Tue, 17 Dec 2002 14:34:40 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <124.1ba33d15.2b30d650@aol.com> Date: Tue, 17 Dec 2002 14:34:40 EST Subject: AMAX campaign spots uploaded just in time for the holidays! To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit These 7 will be enough to get everyone started for now. There are just a few more that I will get up on the web after the first of the year. To get these spots..just go to the target URL and either a download will start autonatically..then save it to where ever...or go to the URL and right click and "save as". Operating systems may vary.Each MP3 file is an average size of 1200KB....an average of 30 seconds in length. http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice/amax1.mp3 http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice/amax2.mp3 http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice/amax3.mp3 http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice/amax4.mp3 http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice/amax5.mp3 http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice/amax6.mp3 http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice/amax7.mp3 Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Tue Dec 17 11:37:35 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Dec 2002 19:37:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 16024 invoked from network); 17 Dec 2002 19:37:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Dec 2002 19:37:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14202.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.144) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Dec 2002 19:37:35 -0000 Message-ID: <20021217193735.46514.qmail@web14202.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.45.202.244] by web14202.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 17 Dec 2002 11:37:35 PST Date: Tue, 17 Dec 2002 11:37:35 -0800 (PST) Subject: Fwd: 6 minute download on Cable Modem To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio Somebody was asking what we received in the mail regarding 99-325 IBOC, and here is a link to that package. CAUTION: it took me 6 minutes to download this on a cable modem, so it is not for the weak of data bit transfer.. http://gullfoss2.fcc.gov/prod/ecfs/retrieve.cgi?native_or_pdf=pdf&id_document=6513397625 __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From KC4QLP@aol.com Tue Dec 17 14:09:08 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Dec 2002 22:09:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 68979 invoked from network); 17 Dec 2002 22:09:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Dec 2002 22:09:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d07.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.39) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Dec 2002 22:09:06 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.fe.20dff0b9 (4254) for ; Tue, 17 Dec 2002 17:08:53 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Tue, 17 Dec 2002 17:08:52 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} IBOC Conversion Was: Lawyers thread To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/17/02 10:41:50 AM Eastern Standard Time, jwelton@nautel.com writes: << Any 'ND' series transmitter with six LEDs on the power modules rather than three LEDs and a meter is upgradeable, but not currently compatible unless purchased this year. Any ND series with the power meter on the module (applies only to older ND5 and ND10 transmitters) is not currently upgradeable, but may be in the future. This would also apply to original version AMPFET 25 and 50 transmitters, not currently upgradeable, but maybe someday. >> Hi Jeff, Dont know if you can answer this question..or pass it along to the technical department there. Like you stated and other transmitter manufactures have stated on having to make upgrades to a transmitter to make it IBOC compatible..what do those upgrades involve...at least on a general sense of things? The explaination of this might help some get the extreme basics of at least the components of an IBOC transmitter and how it works. Now only if those darn receivers didnt pick up all of that noise....hmm! Thanks, Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network _______________________________________________________ From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Tue Dec 17 14:19:13 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Dec 2002 22:19:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 10760 invoked from network); 17 Dec 2002 22:19:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Dec 2002 22:19:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14206.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.173.70) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Dec 2002 22:19:12 -0000 Message-ID: <20021217221202.27370.qmail@web14206.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.45.202.244] by web14206.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 17 Dec 2002 14:12:02 PST Date: Tue, 17 Dec 2002 14:12:02 -0800 (PST) Subject: AMAX mp3 files - another place to get them from? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio Hey Bob, too many people tried downloads and you went over your limit:( " AMAX campaign spots uploaded just in time for the holidays! __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From florida_amstereo@hotmail.com Tue Dec 17 16:36:07 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: florida_amstereo@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Dec 2002 00:36:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 3250 invoked from network); 18 Dec 2002 00:36:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by unknown-66-218-66-97.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Dec 2002 00:36:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.37.10) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Dec 2002 00:36:04 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 17 Dec 2002 16:35:06 -0800 Received: from 209.240.198.61 by pv2fd.pav2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Wed, 18 Dec 2002 00:35:05 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, amstereo@bellsouth.net Bcc: Subject: A.M. stereo engineers out there Date: Wed, 18 Dec 2002 00:35:05 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 18 Dec 2002 00:35:06.0918 (UTC) FILETIME=[5034EC60:01C2A62D] From: "Donn Tillman" X-Originating-IP: [209.240.198.61] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83914824 I have managed to get the name of the chief engineer at WGUL 860 mono (formerly am stereo till early 2000) and would like to send him a Christmas card, with an invitation to the join either or both a.m. stereo lists as well as give him the email addresses of any a.m. stereo engineers or any other employees at an a.m. stereo station on either list that he might want to commiserate with. I don't know if Mr. Miller was the engineer at WGUL during their stereo days or not. So if anyone on the list doesn't mind me giving your email address to WGUL's chief engineer, please let me know either on list or private email. donn tillman, hoping the WGUL may return to stereo as have other stations. _________________________________________________________________ STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Tue Dec 17 17:16:16 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Dec 2002 01:16:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 94192 invoked from network); 18 Dec 2002 01:16:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Dec 2002 01:16:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf02bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.22) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Dec 2002 01:16:14 -0000 Received: from juan ([67.34.223.235]) by imf02bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.19 201-253-122-122-119-20020516) with SMTP id <20021218011805.GJXW27457.imf02bis.bellsouth.net@juan> for ; Tue, 17 Dec 2002 20:18:05 -0500 Message-ID: <005801c2a633$10c6c480$af78fea9@juan> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} A.M. stereo engineers out there Date: Tue, 17 Dec 2002 20:16:17 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I would love to have WGUL in stereo. Ever since the 860 in Cocoa went dark, they boom in here really well. Florida is dangerously low on the AM stereo front. I am ashamed, especially with all that we used to have WQAM-560 WGBS-710 WBSS-980 etc... my e-mail at work is juan@wgylfm.com at home gualdaj@bellsouth.net Juan ----- Original Message ----- From: Donn Tillman To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com ; amstereo@bellsouth.net Sent: Tuesday, December 17, 2002 7:35 PM Subject: {AMSF} A.M. stereo engineers out there I have managed to get the name of the chief engineer at WGUL 860 mono (formerly am stereo till early 2000) and would like to send him a Christmas card, with an invitation to the join either or both a.m. stereo lists as well as give him the email addresses of any a.m. stereo engineers or any other employees at an a.m. stereo station on either list that he might want to commiserate with. I don't know if Mr. Miller was the engineer at WGUL during their stereo days or not. So if anyone on the list doesn't mind me giving your email address to WGUL's chief engineer, please let me know either on list or private email. donn tillman, hoping the WGUL may return to stereo as have other stations. _________________________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From stodd@sherbtel.net Tue Dec 17 17:18:29 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Dec 2002 01:18:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 56593 invoked from network); 18 Dec 2002 01:18:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Dec 2002 01:18:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Dec 2002 01:18:28 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-85-78.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.85.78]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gBI1IPOd011811 for ; Tue, 17 Dec 2002 19:18:26 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <001901c2a633$604d0b40$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC Conversion Was: Lawyers thread Date: Tue, 17 Dec 2002 19:18:27 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Per PJB- no, they haven't been 500kW for some years. They were using a 50k to drive some big amps, and they're down to just using the driver. There was some guy on the CR-Tech forum who was quite familiar with the operation. As far as IBOC on the dial ends, I guess Uncle must not be too concerned about the extra bandwidth, since they allowed that test station on 1700. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: > Anybody know if PJB in the Caribbean on 800 kHz is still on the air > with 500,000 watts? They are/were the highest-power AM station in > the Western Hemisphere. > > p.s. Also, what about the use of IBOC on 530 or 1700 kHz... wouldn't > the extra bandwidth place part of the signal outside of the allocated > AM band? From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Tue Dec 17 17:18:34 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Dec 2002 01:18:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 97476 invoked from network); 18 Dec 2002 01:18:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Dec 2002 01:18:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf02bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.22) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Dec 2002 01:18:33 -0000 Received: from juan ([67.34.223.235]) by imf02bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.19 201-253-122-122-119-20020516) with SMTP id <20021218012024.GMPJ27457.imf02bis.bellsouth.net@juan> for ; Tue, 17 Dec 2002 20:20:24 -0500 Message-ID: <006301c2a633$63ac62e0$af78fea9@juan> To: References: <008701c2a5f9$b1d59700$aed63fd1@com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} FCC letter Date: Tue, 17 Dec 2002 20:18:36 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Kevin, I may have missed how to reply...via mail...website ? I am ignorant as far as the FCC and their workings. I will do something. This is too damn important. Juan ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" To: Sent: Tuesday, December 17, 2002 1:25 PM Subject: {AMSF} FCC letter > Commissioners, gentlemen, > > I am writing in reply to the recent request on 99-325 by Mr. John > Wells King of Garvey Schubert Barer to have IBOC allowed at night. > Sirs, I am taking this opportunity to request as a end user that > this NOT be allowed. > > I live in Arizona far from much of the testing that has been done > with IBOC. I have had interference from the digital sidebands that > cause me loss of service and difficulty in hearing regularly heard > stations at my home. At present, although the interference, which > sounds like rushing water on each side of the center frequency which > is testing, it can be heard here. > > Not only is the interference with United States stations, it also > interferes with international frequencies. In the early December > testing with WLW running IBOC, I was unable to listen to sports > programming from Southern California that I commonly listen to, > without interference from XETRA. The digital artifact was quite > destructive to XETRA. > > During the later testing between WLW and WOR considerable > interference was noted between WORs IBOC upper sideband signal and > KDWN from Las Vegas. This would cause secondary listeners, in a case > of national emergency such as occurred on 9/11, would be rendered > unable to retrieve information concerning the emergency. The same > would be if there was an EAS message to be broadcast. The general > public uses analog radio and the interference would possibly cause > many listeners to be rendered unable to receive life saving > notifications because of an increased noise floor due to the > sideband digital transmission. > > In the petition on page 3 its noted "...computer models and field > tests have shown that night time use of the AM IBOC system can in > certain instances, lead to intolerable levels of interference..." If > this interference is going to be intolerable in many cases, at least > extrapolating what could be from what I have heard, then why cause > the public to lose their service and notification of emergencies in > any case? > > With the significant skywave that is observed on MW frequencies, I > am of the opinion that digital will not work well, especially in the > hybrid IBOC mode and will be destructive to the AM analog band in a > way that will cause listeners to flee to other bands or > entertainment venues. > > I disagree with the petition on page 4 that states, "...the number of > stations which would cause interference is small." I believe that > all stations not running IBOC would receive detrimental interference > if I can hear the sidebands on the other side of the country from > the testing. This interference has been noted also in California. > > It is for this reason that I believe that even the digital stations > would interfere with one another in the IBOC hybrid mode. > > I would like to see further testing with several adjacent > frequencies with stations such as 1060 KDUS,KNX 1070 kHz, KSCO 1080 > kHz or some such clustered arrangement be tested. Furthermore until > testing is done with 8 or so stations on a graveyard frequency such > as 1230 and 1240 clustered in a fairly close proximity, then the > true effect of IBOC will not be understood. > > Its for the reason that I feel testing in not only complete but I > believe that real world testing has not even been accomplished that > I am against the night time use of IBOC on MW frequencies at this > time. > > Thank You Commissioners for your time in this matter. > > Kevin Redding > 1357 S. Hall > Mesa, Arizona 85204 > > > "Its going to get a lot worse before it > gets worse" - Lily Tomlin > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > From stodd@sherbtel.net Tue Dec 17 17:24:06 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Dec 2002 01:24:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 62757 invoked from network); 18 Dec 2002 01:24:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Dec 2002 01:24:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Dec 2002 01:24:05 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-85-78.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.85.78]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gBI1O2Od013395 for ; Tue, 17 Dec 2002 19:24:03 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <002f01c2a634$292695e0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <3DFDC15D.F0EC3133@skyweb.net> <009601c2a575$55cf4980$827dfea9@home1> <3DFEB8E7.6D041674@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} NEW AM BROADCAST FORMAT Date: Tue, 17 Dec 2002 19:24:04 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Now THERE'S a transmitter that would be worth saving, if for no other reason than so few were ever made. I worked on one when I was at KJNP in North Pole AK. That one is now a standby for their MW 50B. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Possum Hunter" > Neal, > I know where there is a water vapor cooled Gates VP-50 on 1070Khz you could > get for REAL cheap, maybe for the hauling.> From stodd@sherbtel.net Tue Dec 17 17:41:50 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Dec 2002 01:41:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 90314 invoked from network); 18 Dec 2002 01:41:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Dec 2002 01:41:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Dec 2002 01:41:49 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-85-78.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.85.78]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gBI1fkOd018554 for ; Tue, 17 Dec 2002 19:41:47 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <007b01c2a636$a348d7a0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <3DFF7479.65F93849@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} New home Date: Tue, 17 Dec 2002 19:41:48 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude congrats on the new toy. Why was Jim Hawkins selling it? ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Neal Newman" > I have Saved a piece of New Jersey Broadcast history > Its the backup transmitter that came out of the Now Dark WERA 1590 in > Plainfield New Jersey. From KC4QLP@aol.com Tue Dec 17 18:54:58 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Dec 2002 02:54:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 7482 invoked from network); 18 Dec 2002 02:54:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Dec 2002 02:54:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r10.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.106) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Dec 2002 02:54:57 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r10.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.a9.3417270b (4254) for ; Tue, 17 Dec 2002 21:54:48 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Tue, 17 Dec 2002 21:54:48 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} AMAX mp3 files - another place to get them from? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/17/02 5:22:33 PM Eastern Standard Time, toledohamradio@yahoo.com writes: << Hey Bob, too many people tried downloads and you went over your limit:( " AMAX campaign spots uploaded just in time for the holidays! >> Thats geocities for you. Usually if you wait an hour or so..geocities will let you back in. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network _______________________________________________________ From KC4QLP@aol.com Tue Dec 17 19:28:33 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Dec 2002 03:28:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 84217 invoked from network); 18 Dec 2002 03:28:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Dec 2002 03:28:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r10.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.106) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Dec 2002 03:28:32 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r10.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.b2.16a21ced (4254) for ; Tue, 17 Dec 2002 22:28:27 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Tue, 17 Dec 2002 22:28:27 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} AMAX campaign spots uploaded just in time for the holidays! To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Ok folks...I've made a webpage that you can go to just encase your web browser is a little fussy...like they all can be from time to time. The website is: http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice/amax.html Just beware....hehehe...I just built this site as of 1025pm eastern on 12/17/02..and already..even to preview the site...you might be greeted by this message: "The web site you are trying to access has exceeded its allocated data transfer. Visit our help area for more information. Access to this site will be restored within an hour. Please try again later. http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice/amax.html" So if you hit a message like that..dont panic...just try later..maybe after the web traffic slows down some. Enjoy and happy holidays! << http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice/amax1.mp3 http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice/amax2.mp3 http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice/amax3.mp3 http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice/amax4.mp3 http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice/amax5.mp3 http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice/amax6.mp3 http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice/amax7.mp3 >> Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network _______________________________________________________ From rwagoner@cox.net Tue Dec 17 19:39:42 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner@cox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Dec 2002 03:39:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 95615 invoked from network); 18 Dec 2002 03:39:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Dec 2002 03:39:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Dec 2002 03:39:42 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.140] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Dec 2002 03:39:42 -0000 Date: Wed, 18 Dec 2002 03:39:38 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Metrosound madness Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1063 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Richard Wagoner " X-Originating-IP: 68.4.33.253 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=96123889 X-Yahoo-Profile: richardalanwagoner Funny you mention that. My wife's old IBM clone was "built like a tank" and put out a high pitch RF whine that was so bad it made AM unlistenable throughout the house. My Mac, still built well, is plastic outside with metal shields inside ... obviously built with the intention of reducing interference. Those "tanks" are not nearly as good as you might think. > Many desktop computers these days are using plastic cases which are > obviously not as good for RF shielding as the thick metal cases that > were common in the past (some of the old IBM AT and PS/2 computers > were almost literally built like a tank!). Monitors are also a > frustrating source of noise on the AM and shortwave bands. If you > really want a monitor that doesn't wipe out reception with oscillator > noise when in use, I recommend getting an old, high-quality > Mitsubishi "Diamond Scan" monitor, or one of the original NEC > MultiSync monitors. With a little luck, these can be found in used- > but-perfectly-working condition at computer shows for almost nothing. > From jsgil@hal-pc.org Tue Dec 17 20:11:24 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Dec 2002 04:11:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 72835 invoked from network); 18 Dec 2002 04:11:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Dec 2002 04:11:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Dec 2002 04:11:23 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.137] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Dec 2002 04:11:23 -0000 Date: Wed, 18 Dec 2002 04:11:19 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} A.M. stereo engineers out there Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <005801c2a633$10c6c480$af78fea9@juan> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 923 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.35 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Juan / John Gualda" wrote: > I would love to have WGUL in stereo. Ever since the 860 in Cocoa went dark, they boom in here really well. > > Florida is dangerously low on the AM stereo front. I am ashamed, especially with all that we used to have > WQAM-560 WGBS-710 WBSS-980 etc... > > my e-mail at work is > juan@w... > > at home > gualdaj@b... > > Houston is AM Stereo Dry. We used to have 1 C-QuAM, 2 Kahn and 1 Harris in the begining. There is the Spanish station that started out as Harris but don't know if the exciter was converted to C-QuAM as required in the mid '90s. The other Spanish station was Kahn but will light the pilot on a C-QuAM decoder. Both these station's pilot are not on all the time and neither have any true stereo separation. The Kahn one is extremely weak and distorted in one channel so it may be running in powerside mode. JSG From KC4QLP@aol.com Tue Dec 17 20:34:19 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Dec 2002 04:34:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 95313 invoked from network); 18 Dec 2002 04:34:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Dec 2002 04:34:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r03.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.99) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Dec 2002 04:34:19 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.68.2a546138 (4254) for ; Tue, 17 Dec 2002 23:34:12 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <68.2a546138.2b3154c4@aol.com> Date: Tue, 17 Dec 2002 23:34:12 EST Subject: {AMSF} AMAX mp3 files - alternate site To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Ok..geocities is just to tempermental about file transfers ....so I'm in the processing of setting up a mirrored site of the geocites site. The files are not on the other site as of yet as I have already transfered the MP3 files from the computer here at work to the home studio computer. So give me an hour to an hour and a half and the tripod site will be available. I'll post another note to let you all know when its fully ready. http://amax_1.tripod.com/index.html Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- Subscribe send an email to amstereo-subscribe@topica.com _______________________________________________________ From possumhunter@netzero.net Tue Dec 17 20:51:24 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Dec 2002 04:51:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 12107 invoked from network); 18 Dec 2002 04:51:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Dec 2002 04:51:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.197) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Dec 2002 04:51:23 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 17 Dec 2002 20:51:23 -0800 To: References: <76.275363c3.2b2fc070@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Gates BC1E Was:Question For Eric Date: Tue, 17 Dec 2002 23:02:42 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 18 Dec 2002 04:51:23.0522 (UTC) FILETIME=[1D607E20:01C2A651] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.130.196.166] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: >Most of the Willis stations I've been in were just shells of radio stations. We have some of those here! Entercom's WOLT-FM simulcasts WOLI-FM. They have a Panasonic Boom Box tuned to WOLT driving an Optimod 8000! When Clear Channel's WGVL 1440 was Simulcastig WSSL-FM, They had a GE Superradio tuned to WSSL-FM feeding the Optimod 9000. When the STL died at WESC 660Khz, Clear Channel put a Radio Shack analog radio on WESC-FM feeding the Optimod 9100/A2 (Yes, 660 USED to be in Stereo) Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Tue Dec 17 20:51:26 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Dec 2002 04:51:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 47392 invoked from network); 18 Dec 2002 04:51:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Dec 2002 04:51:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.195) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Dec 2002 04:51:25 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 17 Dec 2002 20:51:25 -0800 To: References: <3DFDC15D.F0EC3133@skyweb.net> <009601c2a575$55cf4980$827dfea9@home1> <3DFEB8E7.6D041674@skyweb.net> <3DFEC5E6.CCE4F862@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} NEW AM BROADCAST FORMAT Date: Tue, 17 Dec 2002 23:06:44 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 18 Dec 2002 04:51:25.0162 (UTC) FILETIME=[1E5ABCA0:01C2A651] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.130.196.166] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Neal Newman wrote: > Don't tempt me Kevin LOL... > up at My recording studio in CT I have 3 phase 480 and a nice Old 140 foot tower that My partner used to use for a Tow truck service he used to own. Yea, After you had to get a second mortgage on your house to pay the power bill, you may wish you never saw that VP-50! The thing that drove WHYZ broke, then under is the HUGE power bill and price of tubes. Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Tue Dec 17 20:51:26 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Dec 2002 04:51:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 42343 invoked from network); 18 Dec 2002 04:51:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Dec 2002 04:51:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.17) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Dec 2002 04:51:19 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 17 Dec 2002 20:51:19 -0800 To: Cc: References: <3DFF0C4A.22795.B29144@localhost> Subject: Re: {AMSF} IBOC Conversion Was: Lawyers thread Date: Tue, 17 Dec 2002 22:51:25 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 18 Dec 2002 04:51:19.0915 (UTC) FILETIME=[1B3A1BB0:01C2A651] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.130.196.166] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Jeff Welton wrote: > Uhm, yes to the first, no to the second for the Nautels, Kevin. OOPS! The BE salesman said they were! LOL Speaking of Nautel, What is the price on a 1000 Watt with C-QAUM card tuned to 1600Khz? Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Tue Dec 17 20:51:29 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Dec 2002 04:51:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 17740 invoked from network); 18 Dec 2002 04:51:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Dec 2002 04:51:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.86) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Dec 2002 04:51:18 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 17 Dec 2002 20:51:18 -0800 To: References: <79.4b1ab7e.2b302a89@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Phase Distortion Was: Question For Eric Date: Tue, 17 Dec 2002 22:51:13 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 18 Dec 2002 04:51:18.0406 (UTC) FILETIME=[1A53DA60:01C2A651] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.130.196.166] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: > How is the RF drive with the BE exciter compared to the RF drive that the transmitter normally has? I had it adjusted out to be the same. In fact, the old bugger sounded good in MONO when being driven by the C-QUAM signal, but the STEREO is NASTY! The distortion is coming from the L-R component. Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Tue Dec 17 20:56:40 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Dec 2002 04:56:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 22971 invoked from network); 18 Dec 2002 04:56:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Dec 2002 04:56:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.97) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Dec 2002 04:56:40 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 17 Dec 2002 20:56:40 -0800 To: References: <001901c2a633$604d0b40$827dfea9@home1> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC Conversion Was: Lawyers thread Date: Tue, 17 Dec 2002 23:56:28 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 18 Dec 2002 04:56:40.0227 (UTC) FILETIME=[DA25D730:01C2A651] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.130.196.166] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Kevin wrote: > Anybody know if PJB in the Caribbean on 800 kHz is still on the air with 500,000 watts? They are/were the highest-power AM station in the Western Hemisphere. No, but they sure killed CKLW when they went on the air! Now 800Khz is just another graveyard. PJB should fire the big rig back up and clean out 800 at night! Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Tue Dec 17 21:13:44 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Dec 2002 05:13:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 78676 invoked from network); 18 Dec 2002 05:13:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Dec 2002 05:13:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.47) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Dec 2002 05:13:44 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 17 Dec 2002 21:13:44 -0800 To: References: <3DFDC15D.F0EC3133@skyweb.net> <009601c2a575$55cf4980$827dfea9@home1> <3DFEB8E7.6D041674@skyweb.net> <002f01c2a634$292695e0$827dfea9@home1> Subject: VP-50 Was: NEW AM BROADCAST FORMAT Date: Wed, 18 Dec 2002 00:13:32 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 18 Dec 2002 05:13:44.0345 (UTC) FILETIME=[3C91D890:01C2A654] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.130.196.166] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Scott Todd wrote: > Now THERE'S a transmitter that would be worth saving, if for no other reason than so few were ever made. There is a very good reason Harris dropped the VP-50 from the line as fast as they did. The VP-50 and the Vanguard were DOGS! I would hate to have to earn a living with either one! I have been thinking about the Vanguard, They have a very low output solid state exciter that drives an IPA that drives a 4CX3000A Class AB1 PA. All you would have to do is cook up an alfredo on your frequency and amplify it's output to I think 5Watts, and you will have a STEREO Vanguard! Kevin From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Dec 17 21:24:14 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Dec 2002 05:24:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 68226 invoked from network); 18 Dec 2002 05:24:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Dec 2002 05:24:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.68) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Dec 2002 05:24:13 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.180] by n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Dec 2002 05:24:12 -0000 Date: Wed, 18 Dec 2002 05:24:12 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Metrosound madness Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1317 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.87.146 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > My wife's old IBM clone was "built like a tank" and put out a high > pitch RF whine that was so bad it made AM unlistenable throughout > the house. My Mac, still built well, is plastic outside with metal > shields inside ... obviously built with the intention of reducing > interference. The power supply is one of the main factors in determining how much RF noise a computer generates. Most PCs use switching-type power supplies which naturally cause more radio interference than a linear- type power supply. But, with proper design and shielding, this noise can be kept to a tolerable level. Macintosh computers are known to have high-quality power supplies, as evidenced by having multiple computers turned on in a room when a momentary power brown-out occurs; PCs will usually reboot because their power supplies' output dropped below the CPU can accept, but Macs will just keep on running as if nothing happened. The ultimate in RF shielding is the "Tempest" series of computers that IBM built for the U.S. government. These were very highly shielded to keep RF noise and electromagnetic radiation to a minimum, probably to avoid detection by the same kind of sensing equipment that the U.K. uses to rat out people who haven't paid their "telly tax" but still have a TV set on in their house. From KC4QLP@aol.com Tue Dec 17 21:29:08 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Dec 2002 05:29:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 32495 invoked from network); 18 Dec 2002 05:29:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Dec 2002 05:29:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m04.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.7) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Dec 2002 05:29:08 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.a4.31126979 (4254) for ; Wed, 18 Dec 2002 00:29:01 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Wed, 18 Dec 2002 00:29:01 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Gates BC1E Was:Question For Eric To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/17/02 11:52:23 PM Eastern Standard Time, possumhunter@netzero.net writes: << We have some of those here! Entercom's WOLT-FM simulcasts WOLI-FM. They have a Panasonic Boom Box tuned to WOLT driving an Optimod 8000! When Clear Channel's WGVL 1440 was Simulcastig WSSL-FM, They had a GE Superradio tuned to WSSL-FM feeding the Optimod 9000. When the STL died at WESC 660Khz, Clear Channel put a Radio Shack analog radio on WESC-FM feeding the Optimod 9100/A2 (Yes, 660 USED to be in Stereo) >> See at least Entercom had a processor between the radio and the transmitter....this Willis outfit has elcheapo radio + transmitter...or elcheapo clock radio flashing 12 plus transmitter...lol... Wish I had pictures of that one....lol Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- Subscribe send an email to amstereo-subscribe@topica.com _______________________________________________________ From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Dec 17 21:38:28 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Dec 2002 05:38:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 99039 invoked from network); 18 Dec 2002 05:38:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Dec 2002 05:38:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Dec 2002 05:38:27 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.174] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Dec 2002 05:38:27 -0000 Date: Wed, 18 Dec 2002 05:38:23 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: AMAX mp3 files - alternate site Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <68.2a546138.2b3154c4@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1095 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.87.146 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics I noticed these AMAX promos play a bit slowly as compared to the last time you made a compilation of a few of them, and also have some cassette-related phasing and sibilance problems, so I am in the process of remastering them using Cool Edit 2000, to restore them to proper speed and clean up the sound. When I get that done I'll upload them to my web server so people can listen to the "hi-fi" versions of these promos. And thanks for encoding them as 320 kbps MP3s... it's nice to know I'm not the only one who appreciates high-quality MP3 encoding. Too many people use 128 kbps, or even less, with the lousy "Xing" encoder, and the result is an awful ringy, chattery, wishy-washy type of sound that might even make IBOC sound better in comparison! FYI to all: the best-sounding MP3 encoder, at least most of the time, is "LAME", with Fraunhofer ("FhG") as an acceptable second choice. Don't use "Xing" for anything less than 192 kbps, and stay away from BladeEnc and QDesign at all costs! They may work faster, but even at high bit-rates they really trash the sound quality. From KC4QLP@aol.com Tue Dec 17 21:40:39 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Dec 2002 05:40:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 49745 invoked from network); 18 Dec 2002 05:40:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Dec 2002 05:40:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r10.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.106) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Dec 2002 05:40:38 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r10.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.b4.16a2e982 (4254) for ; Wed, 18 Dec 2002 00:40:34 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Wed, 18 Dec 2002 00:40:33 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Phase Distortion Was: Question For Eric To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/17/02 11:52:04 PM Eastern Standard Time, possumhunter@netzero.net writes: << > How is the RF drive with the BE exciter compared to the RF drive that the transmitter normally has? I had it adjusted out to be the same. In fact, the old bugger sounded good in MONO when being driven by the C-QUAM signal, but the STEREO is NASTY! The distortion is coming from the L-R component. Kevin >> Do you know how close the PA is to being neutralized?How clean is the output of the power supply? Does the phase noise vary with adjusting and tuning controls? You may be able to get that phase noise out with a little work. A buddy of mine exerimented with a home brew Kahn exciter with good results using the same make RCA that you have...so I dont see why it wouldnt work with C-Quam on your rig. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- Subscribe send an email to amstereo-subscribe@topica.com _______________________________________________________ From possumhunter@netzero.net Tue Dec 17 21:45:23 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Dec 2002 05:45:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 27027 invoked from network); 18 Dec 2002 05:45:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Dec 2002 05:45:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.200) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Dec 2002 05:45:22 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 17 Dec 2002 21:45:22 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Gates BC1E Was:Question For Eric Date: Wed, 18 Dec 2002 00:45:02 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 18 Dec 2002 05:45:22.0568 (UTC) FILETIME=[A7FFB080:01C2A658] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.130.196.166] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: > See at least Entercom had a processor between the radio and the transmitter....this Willis outfit has elcheapo radio + transmitter...or elcheapo clock radio flashing 12 plus transmitter...lol... ROFLMAO! I would LOVE to see that one! What I dont understand is why Entercom doesn't go into the radio and pull the multiplex out of it and feed that to the transmitter. It would sound better.....but still that is bad. Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Tue Dec 17 21:58:38 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Dec 2002 05:58:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 87084 invoked from network); 18 Dec 2002 05:58:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Dec 2002 05:58:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.206) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Dec 2002 05:58:38 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 17 Dec 2002 21:58:38 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Phase Distortion Was: Question For Eric Date: Wed, 18 Dec 2002 00:58:25 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 18 Dec 2002 05:58:38.0146 (UTC) FILETIME=[82334220:01C2A65A] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.130.196.166] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: >> Do you know how close the PA is to being neutralized? I played with it till I had the PA "Dead On". > >How clean is the output of the power supply? It is real clean with all new caps, and brand new rectifier stacks instead of the mercury vapor tubes. When you short the audio input, the carrier is an almost perfect sine wave. > > Does the phase noise vary with adjusting and tuning controls? I couldn't tell any difference by playing with different setting of the Loading and Tuning, but now we are barking up that tree....I wonder if the dummy load could be making it worse than it actually is? Hmmm. Another theory is the after-market modulation and PA transformers may not like the pilot tone? I had to return the C-QUAM Exciter, but it was a good experiment. I guess I should get my own exciter and play with it. Kevin From KC4QLP@aol.com Tue Dec 17 22:09:45 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Dec 2002 06:09:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 77693 invoked from network); 18 Dec 2002 06:09:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Dec 2002 06:09:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d07.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.39) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Dec 2002 06:09:44 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.149.551d3d9 (4254) for ; Wed, 18 Dec 2002 01:09:38 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <149.551d3d9.2b316b22@aol.com> Date: Wed, 18 Dec 2002 01:09:38 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Phase Distortion Was: Question For Eric To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/18/02 12:59:19 AM Eastern Standard Time, possumhunter@netzero.net writes: << I couldn't tell any difference by playing with different setting of the Loading and Tuning, but now we are barking up that tree....I wonder if the dummy load could be making it worse than it actually is? Hmmm. Another theory is the after-market modulation and PA transformers may not like the pilot tone?>> Its possible. Next time try an antenna....or hook the transmitter to the dummy load with a long run of coax to try and move the RF away from the rig. As far as aftermarket transformers..I havent had any trouble with that.Several years ago I had to replace the reactor and the modulation transformer in my Raytheon with some made from Peter Dahl..its working just as good as before. <> Bummer Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- Subscribe send an email to amstereo-subscribe@topica.com _______________________________________________________ From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Dec 17 22:13:20 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Dec 2002 06:13:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 72142 invoked from network); 18 Dec 2002 06:13:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Dec 2002 06:13:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Dec 2002 06:13:20 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.134] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Dec 2002 06:13:19 -0000 Date: Wed, 18 Dec 2002 06:13:19 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Phase Distortion Was: Question For Eric Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1607 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.87.146 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > I had to return the C-QUAM Exciter, but it was a good experiment. I > guess I should get my own exciter and play with it. Just a tip... if you were listening to the AM Stereo signal on a normal radio in an area where the signal strength was very high (and "dummy loads" WILL put out quite a bit of RF!), then that can cause quite a bit of distortion in the received audio that actually isn't coming from the transmitter; it is simply overloading the receiver, and AM Stereo makes this effect more noticeable. If you were using a pro-quality C-Quam modulation monitor, then yes, the distortion is probably being caused by the transmitter, but otherwise, you need to have the receiver in an area of more reasonable signal strength to get an accurate representation of what the received AM Stereo audio will sound like. I know... with a properly matched antenna, even a standard low power "Alfredo Lite" transmitter (good for maybe 20 mW) will overload most radios within a good 20 to 30 feet of the antenna... in my case, I have the transmitter set up in my basement workshop/computer room, with the antenna just outside, and if I put my Radio Shack "Superadio clone" on the same side of the room as the transmitter, it will just go nuts -- total distortion in the received audio. Even on the other side of the room, its audio isn't completely clean. A Sony SRF-A100 is more forgiving, but within this area its AM Stereo audio will sound rather "grundgy", as if I was overmodulating... but if I bring it a few rooms over, the audio perfectly clears up, with no trace of distortion. From amfmdx@fastq.com Tue Dec 17 22:33:15 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Dec 2002 06:33:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 73785 invoked from network); 18 Dec 2002 06:33:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Dec 2002 06:33:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Dec 2002 06:33:15 -0000 Received: from fastq (d72-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.104]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gBI6XEv00132 for ; Tue, 17 Dec 2002 23:33:14 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <00ce01c2a65f$45f9d4e0$aed63fd1@com> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Metrosound madness Date: Tue, 17 Dec 2002 23:32:43 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > But, can IBOC, even with error correction, *really* get thru bad > electrical interference? Brad, I am NOT an RF engineer. I work sometimes as a mechanical test engineer or a software engineer. I know zippo from RF but... Far be it from me to keep my mouth shut! I would hazard a guess and say no. I believe that with enough interference such as from unshielded cables for networks, telephones, power and the like inside the average office building, there will not be enough good bits to get error correction to make up for it all. Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Tue Dec 17 22:35:45 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: possumhunter@netzero.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Dec 2002 06:35:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 55745 invoked from network); 18 Dec 2002 06:35:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Dec 2002 06:35:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rly-ip01.mx.aol.com) (205.188.156.49) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Dec 2002 06:35:45 -0000 Received: from logs-wq.proxy.aol.com (logs-wq.proxy.aol.com [205.188.200.132]) by rly-ip01.mx.aol.com (v83.35) with ESMTP id RELAYIN1-1218012937; Wed, 18 Dec 2002 01:29:37 -0500 Received: from ibm (AC82C4A6.ipt.aol.com [172.130.196.166]) by logs-wq.proxy.aol.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with SMTP id gBI4lsm247090; Tue, 17 Dec 2002 23:47:57 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <000201c2a650$9ec06a80$a6c482ac@aoldsl.net> To: "Neal Newman" , , "Bob Carter" , "David Hochfelder" , "Fran Little" , "Mike Erickson" , "rjskadl" References: <3DFF7479.65F93849@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: New home Date: Tue, 17 Dec 2002 23:20:24 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Apparently-From: DodgeRamTrucker@aol.com From: "Possum Hunter" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Neal Newman wrote: > You may look at the new toy...... > The RCA-BTA500R These old RCAs are one of the most FUN "toys" I think has ever been made! I know you will have a blast fixing up your BTA500R, I sure have fun playing with my BTA1R Kevin From groucho@skyweb.net Tue Dec 17 23:04:09 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Dec 2002 07:04:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 32587 invoked from network); 18 Dec 2002 07:04:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Dec 2002 07:04:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Dec 2002 07:04:09 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gBI7A14Q033584 for ; Wed, 18 Dec 2002 02:10:01 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3E001CE5.8132548B@skyweb.net> Date: Wed, 18 Dec 2002 01:59:49 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} New home References: <3DFF7479.65F93849@skyweb.net> <007b01c2a636$a348d7a0$827dfea9@home1> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 He tried to get it to the 75 meter band and a few Components failed.. that I already replaced.. the RF Choke being the main One. Second he was planning on gettting another Big Boy. and needed the room however that deal fell through on him.. I didn't want to see it leave New Jersey So I took it.. Scott Todd wrote: > congrats on the new toy. Why was Jim Hawkins selling it? > > ST > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Neal Newman" > > I have Saved a piece of New Jersey Broadcast history > > > Its the backup transmitter that came out of the Now Dark WERA 1590 in > > Plainfield New Jersey. > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From amfmdx@fastq.com Tue Dec 17 23:31:15 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Dec 2002 07:31:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 89779 invoked from network); 18 Dec 2002 07:31:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Dec 2002 07:31:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Dec 2002 07:31:14 -0000 Received: from fastq (d72-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.104]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gBI7VDv00617 for ; Wed, 18 Dec 2002 00:31:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <01c401c2a667$5f3ef900$aed63fd1@com> To: References: <008701c2a5f9$b1d59700$aed63fd1@com> <006301c2a633$63ac62e0$af78fea9@juan> Subject: Re: {AMSF} FCC letter Date: Wed, 18 Dec 2002 00:30:41 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla Heres the website : http://www.fcc.gov/e-file/ecfs.html Click on submit a filing. The proceeding block put in 99-325. Go down and fill in the stuff and put something in the file a comment block. It will have a field saying in the field COMMENT change it and type in Reply to comments. Kevin ----- Original Message ----- From: "Juan / John Gualda" To: Sent: Tuesday, December 17, 2002 6:18 PM Subject: Re: {AMSF} FCC letter > Kevin, > > I may have missed how to reply...via mail...website ? > I am ignorant as far as the FCC and their workings. > > I will do something. This is too damn important. From dav259@csiro.au Wed Dec 18 01:04:25 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Dec 2002 09:04:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 58551 invoked from network); 18 Dec 2002 09:04:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Dec 2002 09:04:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Dec 2002 09:04:24 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gBI94NP21756 for ; Wed, 18 Dec 2002 20:04:23 +1100 (EST) Date: Wed, 18 Dec 2002 20:04:23 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Metrosound madness In-Reply-To: <00ce01c2a65f$45f9d4e0$aed63fd1@com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public On Tue, 17 Dec 2002, Kevin - Mesa, Arizona wrote: > > But, can IBOC, even with error correction, *really* get thru bad > > electrical interference? > Brad, > I would hazard a guess and say no. I believe that with enough interference > such as from unshielded cables for networks, telephones, power and the like > inside the average office building, there will not be enough good bits to > get error correction to make up for it all. I think Kevin's right. I took in my cheap self-powered amplified speakers to work and the result was only marginally better from those on a power transformer. But there is no tone control so I was stuck with hisses and hums that I couldn't even null a litle. I plugged the metrosound into a separate power outlet and there was no change. So I plugged my SRF-42 headphones into it (why I didn't think of that before could have saved alot of time) and the noises were still there. I've concluded the only way to listen to AM stereo in a closed conventional office building is through a battery operated receiver like the SRF-42 rotated to exactly the right direction. I'm back to my 'Realistic' fuzzy transistor radio played through a big speaker in mono with the tone set to low - but Magic 693 mono. Still alot better than several other options and I'm not complaining and look forward to the trip home. Ian From KC4QLP@aol.com Wed Dec 18 02:06:28 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Dec 2002 10:06:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 73722 invoked from network); 18 Dec 2002 10:06:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Dec 2002 10:06:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d09.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.41) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Dec 2002 10:06:28 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d09.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.6d.4e20bd8 (25305) for ; Wed, 18 Dec 2002 05:06:25 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <6d.4e20bd8.2b31a2a1@aol.com> Date: Wed, 18 Dec 2002 05:06:25 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: AMAX mp3 files - alternate site To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 12/18/02 12:39:32 AM Eastern Standard Time, kevtronics@yahoo.com writes: > I noticed these AMAX promos play a bit slowly as compared to the last > time you made a compilation of a few of them, and also have some > cassette-related phasing and sibilance problems, so I am in the > process of remastering them using Cool Edit 2000, to restore them to > proper speed and clean up the sound. When I get that done I'll > upload them to my web server so people can listen to the "hi-fi" > versions of these promos. Well considering that the production of these spots were done on what sounds like reeel to reels and then copied on mulitple cassette tapes in the late 80's...its amazing the quality is as good as it is. I did notice on one of the spots {forget which one it is now} towards the end of the spot has a noticable run across a tape splice sound. How that got through and not recut I have no clue....but who knows how the quality control was too. Yeah..I've run across a few grainy sounding MP3's at lower encoding rates.Anyhow,I encoded them at the higher rate so anyone could do just as your going to do.I wanted everyone to get exactly what I have here and what came from the AMAX campaign...a kind of nostalgia to if you will. The only thing I did when I ran these through my Cool Edit was run the hiss reduction on these...killed the annoying tape hiss. Other than that..your hearing the exact thing thats on the tape.Would have been nice if they had produced these for stations on CD's--high quality--..but different time different era. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From KC4QLP@aol.com Wed Dec 18 02:21:53 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Dec 2002 10:21:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 91404 invoked from network); 18 Dec 2002 10:21:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Dec 2002 10:21:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d03.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.35) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Dec 2002 10:21:53 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.9.4f86ced (25305) for ; Wed, 18 Dec 2002 05:21:41 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <9.4f86ced.2b31a635@aol.com> Date: Wed, 18 Dec 2002 05:21:41 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} AMAX mp3 files - alternate site To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Ok folks...my alternate site is up and running. Have fun with them...and just for kicks..let me know what you all do with them. Now its off to start a busy Wednesday...one week before Christmas! > Ok..geocities is just to tempermental about file transfers ....so I'm in the > > processing of setting up a mirrored site of the geocites site. The files > are > not on the other site as of yet as I have already transfered the MP3 files > from the computer here at work to the home studio computer. So give me an > hour to an hour and a half and the tripod site will be available. > I'll post another note to let you all know when its fully ready. > > http://amax_1.tripod.com/index.html > > Bob Carter > Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group > > WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 > Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 > > Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with > engineering > services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. > e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net > http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice > Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC > WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC > WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC > Ray Communications Radio Network > > AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- > Subscribe send an email to amstereo-subscribe@topica.com > _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From florida_amstereo@hotmail.com Wed Dec 18 03:02:51 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: florida_amstereo@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Dec 2002 11:02:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 88025 invoked from network); 18 Dec 2002 11:02:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Dec 2002 11:02:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.37.146) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Dec 2002 11:02:50 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 18 Dec 2002 02:59:33 -0800 Received: from 209.240.198.61 by pv2fd.pav2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Wed, 18 Dec 2002 10:59:33 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Cc: amstereo@bellsouth.net Bcc: Subject: Re: {AMSF} A.M. stereo engineers out there Date: Wed, 18 Dec 2002 10:59:33 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 18 Dec 2002 10:59:33.0550 (UTC) FILETIME=[8C0F44E0:01C2A684] From: "Donn Tillman" X-Originating-IP: [209.240.198.61] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83914824 Thanks, Juan I hope to prepare a letter of introduction and include your email address in it and send it either Thursday or Friday. I wanted and appreciate your offer, since, I have virtually no technical knowledge, in the event,he wanted to discuss any problems in returning to stereo. Hopefully this will be a first step in obtaining that goal. I have sent them emails in the past, but have never received any responses. donn ----Original Message Follows---- From: "Juan / John Gualda" Reply-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com To: Subject: Re: {AMSF} A.M. stereo engineers out there Date: Tue, 17 Dec 2002 20:16:17 -0500 I would love to have WGUL in stereo. Ever since the 860 in Cocoa went dark, they boom in here really well. my e-mail at work is juan@wgylfm.com at home gualdaj@bellsouth.net Juan ----- Original Message ----- From: Donn Tillman To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com ; amstereo@bellsouth.net Sent: Tuesday, December 17, 2002 7:35 PM Subject: {AMSF} A.M. stereo engineers out there I have managed to get the name of the chief engineer at WGUL 860 mono (formerly am stereo till early 2000) and would like to send him a Christmas card, with an invitation to the join either or both a.m. stereo lists as well as give him the email addresses of any a.m. stereo engineers or any other employees at an a.m. stereo station on either list that he might want to commiserate with. I don't know if Mr. Miller was the engineer at WGUL during their stereo days or not. So if anyone on the list doesn't mind me giving your email address to WGUL's chief engineer, please let me know either on list or private email. donn tillman, hoping the WGUL may return to stereo as have other stations. _________________________________________________________________ STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail From jwelton@nautel.com Wed Dec 18 05:06:48 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jwelton@nautel.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Dec 2002 13:06:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 60456 invoked from network); 18 Dec 2002 13:06:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Dec 2002 13:06:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailserver.nautel.com) (24.222.25.85) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Dec 2002 13:06:46 -0000 Received: FROM jeff-welton BY mailserver.nautel.com ; Wed Dec 18 09:06:45 2002 -0400 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Date: Wed, 18 Dec 2002 09:04:10 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: {AMSF} IBOC Conversion Was: Lawyers thread Message-ID: <3E003A0C.31260.1E48CE@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.02a) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body From: "Jeff Welton" Reply-To: jwelton@nautel.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=26918678 > IBOC compatible..what do those upgrades involve...at least on a general sense of > things? The explaination of this might help some get the extreme basics of at > least the components of an IBOC transmitter and how it works. Hey, Bob: The upgrades for the ND series transmitters involve replacing the PDM filters with higher bandwidth filters and replacing the oscillators and PDM drivers with new versions. Due to the higher required bandwidth of IBOC, the PDM frequency was getting too close to the Nyquist frequency of the passband, so we raised the PDM frequency from its nominal 69-85 kHz to about 130 kHz and increased the cutoff frequency of the PDM low pass filters on the modulators. The new oscillator still contains a crystal oscillator for mono broadcasting, but also contains an interface for an external IBOC exciter as well as associated IPM and phase correction circuitry. As far as the transmitter components go, there's no electrical difference from a conventional unit, except for the requirement to pass higher frequencies. We could probably have gone to 15kHz with very little twiddling of the original circuitry, but 20kHz did require some more dramatic adjustments. Regarding overall operation (the 'how it works'), I have to confess that I'm less clear on that than I probably should be, but I tend to focus my efforts on equipment that we actually have on the air, as this is what the calls at 3:00 a.m. always reference. If we start to ship any IBOC equipment, I'll be doing a crash course - I'd be happy to provide additional info then. I do have some Power Point presentations on IBOC operation somewhere, more informative than technical. Most of these were done by Ibiquity, so I'm not sure if I am able to give them out or not, but we may have one or two of our own - I'll take a look and let you know. Regards, Jeff Welton Nautel Customer Service Dept. Tel.: 1-902-823-3900 ext. 127 Fax: 1-902-823-3183 email: jwelton@nautel.com From jwelton@nautel.com Wed Dec 18 06:32:55 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jwelton@nautel.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Dec 2002 14:32:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 22727 invoked from network); 18 Dec 2002 14:32:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Dec 2002 14:32:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailserver.nautel.com) (24.222.25.85) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Dec 2002 14:32:52 -0000 Received: FROM jeff-welton BY mailserver.nautel.com ; Wed Dec 18 10:32:52 2002 -0400 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Date: Wed, 18 Dec 2002 10:30:20 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: {AMSF} IBOC Conversion Was: Lawyers thread Message-ID: <3E004E37.4273.6D1592@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.02a) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body From: "Jeff Welton" Reply-To: jwelton@nautel.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=26918678 > > Uhm, yes to the first, no to the second for the Nautels, Kevin. > > OOPS! The BE salesman said they were! LOL Sorry, Kevin, I think you misunderstood me - I was referring only to our gear, not BE's. By first and second I was speaking of all transmitters being (first) CQUAM ready and (second) IBOC compatible. As I said, some of our older gear is not upgradeable and probably never will be. Keeping in mind that our oldest solid state broadcast transmitters go back to 1973, with the US market being penetrated starting in 1983. > Speaking of Nautel, What is the price on a 1000 Watt with C-QAUM card tuned to > 1600Khz? The ND1 goes for around $13,000 (US$). You'd have to fight to get the C-QUAM card. I don't know if you were here six or so months ago when Keven (sp?) Tekel and I hashed this over (;->) but we don't quote C-QUAM anymore. What you'd probably end up doing is ordering a mono transmitter, then buying the C- QUAM exciter as an after sale item from Customer Service (it's about $1500.00). You'd get the board set up for a dummy load and have to tweak it into the antenna - same as if you got it with the transmitter. There's no electrical difference between the mono transmitter and the C-QUAM version, except for the RF Drive source. That's something you might want to work out with our Sales Department - sales@nautel.com - they make the call on what we do or do not offer in the product line. Regards, Jeff Welton Nautel Customer Service Dept. Tel.: 1-902-823-3900 ext. 127 Fax: 1-902-823-3183 email: jwelton@nautel.com From jsgil@hal-pc.org Wed Dec 18 09:47:38 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Dec 2002 17:47:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 41312 invoked from network); 18 Dec 2002 17:47:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Dec 2002 17:47:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Dec 2002 17:47:36 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.175] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Dec 2002 17:47:35 -0000 Date: Wed, 18 Dec 2002 17:47:35 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} FCC letter Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <01c401c2a667$5f3ef900$aed63fd1@com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 785 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.96 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" wrote: > Heres the website : http://www.fcc.gov/e-file/ecfs.html > > Click on submit a filing. > > The proceeding block put in 99-325. > > Go down and fill in the stuff and put something in the file a comment block. > It will have a field saying in the field COMMENT change it and type in Reply > to comments. > > Kevin > At my ham radio SIG metting last night I took my papers I was served and disussed the issue. I was told that it would be best that as a group we discuss what needs to go into the Reply. They recomended that we have as much technical information in it as possible to support our claim and that we file one well put together as a group instead of several less organized ones. JSG From fanfare@globility.com Wed Dec 18 10:01:32 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Dec 2002 18:01:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 9411 invoked from network); 18 Dec 2002 18:01:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Dec 2002 18:01:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.eol.ca) (205.189.151.1) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Dec 2002 18:01:31 -0000 Received: from FAN--MCS (dynamic-b2-210.highspeed.eol.ca [64.56.234.210]) by mail.eol.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id B37CA8DA56 for ; Wed, 18 Dec 2002 13:01:42 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <200212181301310165.057F4D59@mail.globility.com> In-Reply-To: References: X-Mailer: Calypso Version 3.30.00.00 (4) Date: Wed, 18 Dec 2002 13:01:31 -0500 To: "Kevin Tekel" Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Metrosound madness Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable From: "Marv Southcott" Reply-To: fanfare@globility.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy Hear, Hear!! My concern exactly. Does anyone have any idea who will take the hit if the signal drops out bec= ause of noise. You can expect one of them will be the radio manufacturer.=20 Ben Franklin said it all when he uttered "Details are trifles, but trifles = make perfection, and perfection is no trifle." M. *********** REPLY SEPARATOR *********** On 12/17/2002 at 4:51 PM Kevin T. wrote: >> But, can IBOC, even with error correction, *really* get thru >> bad electrical interference? > >Nope... just the same as how a computer modem or fax machine won't work >over a really noisy phone line. The digital decoding and error correction >can only tolerate so much interference before it just gives up entirely -- >just as how digital cell phones will often cut out and drop the >connection, even without any prior warning of the signal quality being >seriously degraded. > >Now, will IBOC be able to provide fully-intact digital reception in signal >conditions where the same amount of interference would normally make a >regular analog AM signal unlistenably poor? *That* is the big question, >and we'll have to see *many* more test results of IBOC before can get an >answer to that. It seems that the makers of IBOC themselves don't know it >for sure, even after years of development. > > > >Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum=20 > >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From bjackson@indyradio.com Wed Dec 18 11:02:00 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Dec 2002 19:01:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 45240 invoked from network); 18 Dec 2002 19:01:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Dec 2002 19:01:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Dec 2002 19:01:59 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.138] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Dec 2002 19:01:58 -0000 Date: Wed, 18 Dec 2002 19:01:57 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: Metrosound madness Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <00ce01c2a65f$45f9d4e0$aed63fd1@com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 732 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923 " X-Originating-IP: 64.25.100.58 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" wrote: > I would hazard a guess and say no. I believe that with enough interference > such as from unshielded cables for networks, telephones, power and the like > inside the average office building, there will not be enough good bits to > get error correction to make up for it all. > That's part of my point...Ibiquity keeps saying that AM-IBOC will provide "near CD quality audio on AM"...I just wondered if they had done any testing in a steel office building, or during a nice midwest thunderstorm...It seems to me that if IBOC reacts in any way like digital cell phones, the poor radio will go nuts switching between digital and analog. From philipr@irac.pe.ca Wed Dec 18 13:07:38 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Dec 2002 21:07:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 49208 invoked from network); 18 Dec 2002 21:07:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Dec 2002 21:07:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.89) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Dec 2002 21:07:37 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.160] by n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Dec 2002 21:07:04 -0000 Date: Wed, 18 Dec 2002 21:06:55 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Delco UX-1 Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1264 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking Thanks for the help from several of you folks on the Forum list who are familiar with the UX-1! By the way, I was successful on ebay and got the UX-1 very cheap. The seller made no reference to it being AM Stereo, but I recognized it right away, thanks to pictures on the radios section of the AM Stereo website. So, once I get it and install it [I'll likely need an adapter for the wiring harness, as my car is a 94 and this is likely late 80s/early 90s] I'll be able to drive in to work hearing a fringe, but stereo CJCH! Some sad news, the CRTC approved CJLS's flip to FM, so its goodbye to AM Stereo in Yarmouth NS. On the positive side, CJLS takes audio quality very seriously, so I bet their new 18,000 watts of Class B1 will sound great. But, their AM STereo sounded so good! By the way, maybe they'll have an AM Stereo exciter for sale - or more likely the 5kw transmitter plus AM Stereo exciter. Quite possibly a nice Nautel. The CRTC still hasn't approved the CJFX flip to total FM. Maybe, just maybe, the CRTC has picked up in the enormous eastern coverage loss. The comparative coverage contour maps illustrate this very clearly. It's hard to beat 25 kw of AM Stereo on 580 when you're dealing with rugged terrain! Phil R. From e92fmjamz@yahoo.com Wed Dec 18 13:21:07 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: e92fmjamz@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Dec 2002 21:21:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 8281 invoked from network); 18 Dec 2002 21:21:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Dec 2002 21:21:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14007.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.175.123) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Dec 2002 21:21:04 -0000 Message-ID: <20021218211849.43362.qmail@web14007.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [208.6.34.104] by web14007.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 18 Dec 2002 13:18:49 PST Date: Wed, 18 Dec 2002 13:18:49 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: {AMSF} Gates BC1E Was:Question For Eric To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: Ernest Jones X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=24963319 X-Yahoo-Profile: e92fmjamz welp, no pics for WBTE, BUT WURB is a different story....teehee http://members.tripod.com/e92fm/wurb.html enjoy! --- KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 12/17/02 11:52:23 PM Eastern > Standard Time, > possumhunter@netzero.net writes: > > << We have some of those here! > > Entercom's WOLT-FM simulcasts WOLI-FM. They have a > Panasonic Boom Box tuned > to WOLT driving an Optimod 8000! > When Clear Channel's WGVL 1440 was Simulcastig > WSSL-FM, They had a GE > Superradio tuned to WSSL-FM feeding the Optimod > 9000. > When the STL died at WESC 660Khz, Clear Channel put > a Radio Shack analog > radio on WESC-FM feeding the Optimod 9100/A2 (Yes, > 660 USED to be in Stereo) > >> > See at least Entercom had a processor between the > radio and the > transmitter....this Willis outfit has elcheapo > radio + transmitter...or > elcheapo clock radio flashing 12 plus > transmitter...lol... > Wish I had pictures of that one....lol > > Bob Carter > Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group > > WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach > 104..., WQDK 99.3 > Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 > > > Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio > stations with engineering > services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. > e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net > http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice > Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC > WBXB-FM 100.1 > Edenton NC > WURB-FM 97.7 > Windsor NC > Ray > Communications Radio Network > > AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- > Subscribe send an email to > amstereo-subscribe@topica.com > > > _______________________________________________________ > > > > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > ===== Ernest, Gates NC, USA WRCS 970 AM Ahoskie NC, Announcer,webmaster http://wrcs.cjb.net WQDK 99.3 FM Ahoskie NC, Fill in ------contact me-------- AIM: e92fmjamz2000 ICQ: 33155469 Yahoo: e92fmjamz __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From davidcoons@webtv.net Wed Dec 18 15:43:54 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: davidcoons@webtv.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Dec 2002 23:43:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 4906 invoked from network); 18 Dec 2002 23:43:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Dec 2002 23:43:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO smtpout-2001-3.public.lawson.webtv.net) (209.240.212.83) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Dec 2002 23:43:52 -0000 Received: from storefull-2312.public.lawson.webtv.net (lawson-public-ipmux-1-pip-2.public.lawson.webtv.net [209.240.212.5]) by smtpout-2001-3.public.lawson.webtv.net (WebTV_Postfix+sws) with ESMTP id B699ABEA3 for ; Wed, 18 Dec 2002 15:43:50 -0800 (PST) Received: (from production@localhost) by storefull-2312.public.lawson.webtv.net (8.8.8-wtv-f/mt.gso.26Feb98) id PAA23795; Wed, 18 Dec 2002 15:43:51 -0800 (PST) X-WebTV-Signature: 1 ETAuAhUAilUf6gtL1RK+yirfKN4SMUqzh64CFQCmmiItCfVLNHO+QBEyv32knv58FQ== Date: Wed, 18 Dec 2002 18:43:51 -0500 (EST) To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: carribean pjb Message-ID: <2182-3E010837-230@storefull-2312.public.lawson.webtv.net> In-Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" 's message of Tue, 17 Dec 2002 23:56:28 -0500 Content-Disposition: Inline Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) X-eGroups-From: davidcoons@webtv.net (David Coons) From: davidcoons@webtv.net X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10533228 not likley as there is nothing heard in orlando day or night where Ican recieve the bahamas on my srIII daytime From kevtronics@yahoo.com Wed Dec 18 17:16:51 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Dec 2002 01:16:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 91017 invoked from network); 19 Dec 2002 01:16:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Dec 2002 01:16:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Dec 2002 01:16:50 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.129] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 19 Dec 2002 01:16:50 -0000 Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 01:16:50 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: CJLS Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2007 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.93.12 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Some sad news, the CRTC approved CJLS's flip to FM, so its goodbye > to AM Stereo in Yarmouth NS. CJLS is actually already transmitting on two FM stations. 1340 kHz AM Stereo is still their main signal in Yarmouth, but they have two FM signals serving other areas of western NS. As I recall, one or both of these comes in weakly in Yarmouth, while of course the AM signal is much clearer. When I had a chance to listen to them while staying in Yarmouth, I have to say that CJLS is simply an all-around excellent station, in terms of music variety, on-air personalities, audio processing, and quality of their AM Stereo signal. They do use Nautel equipment, and at least at the time I was listening, they were transmitting with about 13 kHz audio bandwidth on their AM signal -- not compliant with the NRSC spec, but I won't snitch on them! And CJLS has their studios right on Main Street in Yarmouth -- you can't get more local than that! > On the positive side, CJLS takes audio quality very seriously, so I > bet their new 18,000 watts of Class B1 will sound great. But, > their AM STereo sounded so good! Indeed... even their ad in the local Yellow Pages specifically mentions "1340 AM Stereo". But, can somebody clarify, exactly what is the long-term goal of moving all these Canadian stations to FM? Do they eventually want to clear out the AM band ENTIRELY, or will a group of high-power, large-coverage AM signals (like 740 CHWO in Toronto) remain on the air indefinitely? I think 1000 CKBW in Bridgewater, NS should have stayed on the air as one of these regional stations... their AM signal had excellent coverage all along the southern coast of NS as I drove from Halifax to Yarmouth. Their FM signal simply couldn't compare. And then there's 960 CHNS, thankfully still on the air. I can't say much positive things about their dropping the AM Stereo, but they at least do have a great signal. And at night via skywave I can even pick them up here in NJ. From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Dec 18 17:23:07 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Dec 2002 01:23:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 45522 invoked from network); 19 Dec 2002 01:23:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Dec 2002 01:23:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Dec 2002 01:23:07 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-97.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.97]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gBJ1N3Od024713 for ; Wed, 18 Dec 2002 19:23:05 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <002501c2a6fd$3201a320$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <76.275363c3.2b2fc070@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Gates BC1E Was:Question For Eric Date: Wed, 18 Dec 2002 19:23:08 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude See if they'd be willing to trade your 9200 for their 9100B2. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Possum Hunter" > When the STL died at WESC 660Khz, Clear Channel put a Radio Shack analog > radio on WESC-FM feeding the Optimod 9100/A2 (Yes, 660 USED to be in Stereo) > > Kevin From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Dec 18 17:29:02 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Dec 2002 01:29:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 19071 invoked from network); 19 Dec 2002 01:29:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Dec 2002 01:29:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Dec 2002 01:29:02 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-97.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.97]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gBJ1SxOd026466 for ; Wed, 18 Dec 2002 19:29:00 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <002f01c2a6fe$05da6ce0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <79.4b1ab7e.2b302a89@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Phase Distortion Was: Question For Eric Date: Wed, 18 Dec 2002 19:29:04 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude The output network needs to be broadbanded. If it can be done with a Gates BC5P2 and a Gates 1T, that RCA shouldn't require too much modification to make it work. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Possum Hunter" > I had it adjusted out to be the same. In fact, the old bugger sounded good > in MONO when being driven by the C-QUAM signal, but the STEREO is NASTY! The > distortion is coming from the L-R component. > From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Dec 18 17:57:16 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Dec 2002 01:57:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 1370 invoked from network); 19 Dec 2002 01:57:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Dec 2002 01:57:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Dec 2002 01:57:15 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-97.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.97]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gBJ1vCOd004226 for ; Wed, 18 Dec 2002 19:57:13 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <009f01c2a701$f73bea20$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Delco UX-1 Date: Wed, 18 Dec 2002 19:57:16 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Won't hurt to ask, Phil. Please do so and let us know what they say. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: > By the way, maybe they'll have an AM Stereo exciter for sale - or > more likely the 5kw transmitter plus AM Stereo exciter. Quite > possibly a nice Nautel. From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Dec 18 18:04:13 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Dec 2002 02:04:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 68175 invoked from network); 19 Dec 2002 02:04:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Dec 2002 02:04:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Dec 2002 02:04:12 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-97.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.97]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gBJ248Od006078 for ; Wed, 18 Dec 2002 20:04:09 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <00a901c2a702$ef181020$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <20021218211849.43362.qmail@web14007.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Gates BC1E Was:Question For Eric Date: Wed, 18 Dec 2002 20:04:13 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude No public file; tower painting and lighting violations- anyone up to filing a complaint with Uncle? ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ernest Jones" To: Sent: Wednesday, December 18, 2002 3:18 PM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Gates BC1E Was:Question For Eric > welp, no pics for WBTE, BUT WURB is a different > story....teehee > > http://members.tripod.com/e92fm/wurb.html > enjoy! > --- KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: > > In a message dated 12/17/02 11:52:23 PM Eastern > > Standard Time, > > possumhunter@netzero.net writes: > > > > << We have some of those here! > > > > Entercom's WOLT-FM simulcasts WOLI-FM. They have a > > Panasonic Boom Box tuned > > to WOLT driving an Optimod 8000! > > When Clear Channel's WGVL 1440 was Simulcastig > > WSSL-FM, They had a GE > > Superradio tuned to WSSL-FM feeding the Optimod > > 9000. > > When the STL died at WESC 660Khz, Clear Channel put > > a Radio Shack analog > > radio on WESC-FM feeding the Optimod 9100/A2 (Yes, > > 660 USED to be in Stereo) > > >> > > See at least Entercom had a processor between the > > radio and the > > transmitter....this Willis outfit has elcheapo > > radio + transmitter...or > > elcheapo clock radio flashing 12 plus > > transmitter...lol... > > Wish I had pictures of that one....lol > > > > Bob Carter > > Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group > > > > WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach > > 104..., WQDK 99.3 > > Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 > > > > > > Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio > > stations with engineering > > services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. > > e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net > > > http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice > > Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC > > WBXB-FM 100.1 > > Edenton NC > > WURB-FM 97.7 > > Windsor NC > > Ray > > Communications Radio Network > > > > AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- > > Subscribe send an email to > > amstereo-subscribe@topica.com > > > > > > > _______________________________________________________ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to > > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > > > > > ===== > Ernest, Gates NC, USA > WRCS 970 AM Ahoskie NC, Announcer,webmaster http://wrcs.cjb.net > WQDK 99.3 FM Ahoskie NC, Fill in > ------contact me-------- > AIM: e92fmjamz2000 > ICQ: 33155469 > Yahoo: e92fmjamz > > __________________________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. > http://mailplus.yahoo.com > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > From amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Wed Dec 18 18:39:22 2002 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 40746 invoked from network); 19 Dec 2002 02:39:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Dec 2002 02:39:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.67) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Dec 2002 02:39:21 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: notify@yahoogroups.com Received: from [66.218.67.178] by n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 19 Dec 2002 02:39:21 -0000 Date: 19 Dec 2002 02:39:20 -0000 Message-ID: <1040265560.82949.58459.w55@yahoogroups.com> X-eGroups-Application: files X-Yahoo-Group-Post: system From: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: New file uploaded to amstereoforum MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello, This email message is a notification to let you know that a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the amstereoforum group. File : /Amaxjing.mp3 Uploaded by : kevtronics Description : The AMAX "Jingle", by itself. Remastered for good quality and correct playback speed. You can access this file at the URL http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum/files/Amaxjing.mp3 To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/files Regards, kevtronics From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Dec 18 19:08:04 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Dec 2002 03:08:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 68498 invoked from network); 19 Dec 2002 03:08:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Dec 2002 03:08:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.124) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Dec 2002 03:08:03 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 18 Dec 2002 19:08:03 -0800 To: References: <9.4f86ced.2b31a635@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} AMAX mp3 files - alternate site Date: Wed, 18 Dec 2002 19:25:25 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Dec 2002 03:08:03.0172 (UTC) FILETIME=[D817EA40:01C2A70B] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.155.210.132] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: >Have fun with them...and just for kicks..let me know what you all do with them. I got programming the Phantom duty tonight, so they were "accidently" programmed in to run on WFIS. Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Dec 18 19:08:12 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Dec 2002 03:08:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 90596 invoked from network); 19 Dec 2002 03:08:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Dec 2002 03:08:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.17) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Dec 2002 03:08:12 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 18 Dec 2002 19:08:12 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} A.M. stereo engineers out there Date: Wed, 18 Dec 2002 19:28:18 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Dec 2002 03:08:12.0531 (UTC) FILETIME=[DDABFC30:01C2A70B] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.155.210.132] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Donn Tillman wrote: > I have managed to get the name of the chief engineer at WGUL 860 mono (formerly am stereo till early 2000) and would like to send him a Christmas card, with an invitation to the join either or both a.m. stereo lists as well as give him the email addresses of any a.m. stereo engineers or any other employees at an a.m. stereo station on either list that he might want to commiserate with. We are not Stereo YET, but will be very soon. He is welcome to contact me at possumhunter@netzero.net or at WFIS 1600. Kevin, WFIS-Golden Strip Broadcasting From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Dec 18 19:08:14 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Dec 2002 03:08:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 23077 invoked from network); 19 Dec 2002 03:08:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Dec 2002 03:08:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.86) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Dec 2002 03:08:13 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 18 Dec 2002 19:08:13 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Phase Distortion Was: Question For Eric Date: Wed, 18 Dec 2002 19:36:13 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Dec 2002 03:08:13.0851 (UTC) FILETIME=[DE7566B0:01C2A70B] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.155.210.132] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 kevtronics@yahoo.com wrote: > If you were using a pro-quality C-Quam modulation monitor, then yes, the distortion is probably being caused by the transmitter, I was using a BE AM Stereo mod monitor and a Sony SRF-42. Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Dec 18 19:08:16 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Dec 2002 03:08:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 23139 invoked from network); 19 Dec 2002 03:08:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Dec 2002 03:08:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.82) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Dec 2002 03:08:16 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 18 Dec 2002 19:08:15 -0800 To: References: Subject: CJLS and CJFX Date: Wed, 18 Dec 2002 19:56:34 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Dec 2002 03:08:15.0979 (UTC) FILETIME=[DFBA1BB0:01C2A70B] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.155.210.132] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 philipr@irac.pe.ca wrote: >Some sad news, the CRTC approved CJLS's flip to FM, so its goodbye to AM Stereo in Yarmouth NS. Chances are, another station will take over the old CJLS plant and frequency. > >By the way, maybe they'll have an AM Stereo exciter for sale - or more likely the 5kw transmitter plus AM Stereo exciter. Quite possibly a nice Nautel. If they would like to help "Mother Earth" by recycling that exciter and or transmitter, please give them my email addy! I would be more than happy to help them in this way. This would ensure a C-QUAM signal will stay on the air, just a few thousand miles away on 1600Khz! > > The CRTC still hasn't approved the CJFX flip to total FM. Maybe, just maybe, the CRTC has picked up in the enormous eastern coverage loss. Perhaps CHWO could be convinced to take the frequency and simulcast AM 740 on it? Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Dec 18 19:08:17 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Dec 2002 03:08:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 1747 invoked from network); 19 Dec 2002 03:08:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Dec 2002 03:08:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.203) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Dec 2002 03:08:17 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 18 Dec 2002 19:08:17 -0800 To: References: <3E003A0C.31260.1E48CE@localhost> Subject: Re: {AMSF} IBOC Conversion Was: Lawyers thread Date: Wed, 18 Dec 2002 20:11:53 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Dec 2002 03:08:17.0427 (UTC) FILETIME=[E0970E30:01C2A70B] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.155.210.132] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Jeff Welton wrote: > I do have some Power Point presentations on IBOC operation somewhere, more informative than technical. Most of these were done by Ibiquity, so I'm not sure if I am able to give them out or not, but we may have one or two of our own - I'll take a look and let you know. Could you post them online so we all can see them? Thanks, Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Dec 18 19:08:20 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Dec 2002 03:08:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 1848 invoked from network); 19 Dec 2002 03:08:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Dec 2002 03:08:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.88) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Dec 2002 03:08:19 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 18 Dec 2002 19:08:19 -0800 To: References: <6d.4e20bd8.2b31a2a1@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: AMAX mp3 files - alternate site Date: Wed, 18 Dec 2002 20:19:36 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Dec 2002 03:08:19.0488 (UTC) FILETIME=[E1D18A00:01C2A70B] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.155.210.132] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: > Well considering that the production of these spots were done on what sounds like reeel to reels and then copied on mulitple cassette tapes in the late 80's...its amazing the quality is as good as it is. Some of these are not the same spots that the South Carolina Broadcasters accosiation sent out in 1990. If I can find anybody with the SCBA spots, I will post them too. > >Would have been nice if they had produced these for stations on CD's--high quality--..but different time different era. Speaking of Quality, Anybody else on this list run the program "Sonrise"? This week's show sounds like the DAT tape they recorded the CD from was dragging! It also has a bunch of drop-outs on the CD. "Ah, it don't matter about quality, it's just going to an AM station!" Grrrrrrr, Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Dec 18 19:08:23 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Dec 2002 03:08:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 75572 invoked from network); 19 Dec 2002 03:08:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Dec 2002 03:08:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.94) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Dec 2002 03:08:23 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 18 Dec 2002 19:08:23 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC Conversion Was: Lawyers thread Date: Wed, 18 Dec 2002 20:45:44 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Dec 2002 03:08:23.0523 (UTC) FILETIME=[E4393B30:01C2A70B] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.155.210.132] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 kevtronics@yahoo.com wrote: > Finally in 1996, WQEW finally gave in and resumed broadcasting in AM Stereo -- this time using the C-Quam system, and sounding better than ever. I always did like the sound of that station. It is a shame they sold out, but money talks :-( > >not too long ago, a few listeners caught 1560 WQEW transmitting in full STEREO at night, but alas, that only lasted for a few hours, perhaps as an engineer was checking things out at the transmitter site and decided to fire up the C-Quam exciter. If anybody on the list knows the engineer for ABC, perhaps he could be talked into turning on the C-QUAM exciters at WQXR and WABC. Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Dec 18 19:08:27 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Dec 2002 03:08:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 23432 invoked from network); 19 Dec 2002 03:08:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Dec 2002 03:08:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.22) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Dec 2002 03:08:27 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 18 Dec 2002 19:08:27 -0800 To: References: <9c.2ae2bd77.2b2d4be5@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} New file uploaded to amstereoforum Date: Wed, 18 Dec 2002 21:03:29 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Dec 2002 03:08:27.0593 (UTC) FILETIME=[E6A64390:01C2A70B] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.155.210.132] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: > hehehe...I guess you and I have the few copies of these things left. Actually, I found that BTA1R1 service info online! My RCA didn't come with ANY documentation. > > One day I was looking at some old engineering stuff that was in some of the cabinets in the old engineering room at WRCS..there sat a few old catalogs of RCA transmitters and other assorted RCA products! Now THAT would be fun to read! > > They sure don't build'em like they used to that's for sure Amen! If only RCA still made broadcast stuff....Could you imagine what an RCA Broadcast CD player would look like? 65 pounds of aluminum and steel! LOL RCA was the best! Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Dec 18 19:08:36 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Dec 2002 03:08:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 75883 invoked from network); 19 Dec 2002 03:08:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Dec 2002 03:08:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.119) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Dec 2002 03:08:36 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 18 Dec 2002 19:08:35 -0800 To: References: <3E004E37.4273.6D1592@localhost> Subject: Re: {AMSF} IBOC Conversion Was: Lawyers thread Date: Wed, 18 Dec 2002 21:34:50 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Dec 2002 03:08:35.0982 (UTC) FILETIME=[EBA652E0:01C2A70B] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.155.210.132] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Jeff Welton wrote: > Sorry, Kevin, I think you misunderstood me - I was referring only to our gear, not BE's. Yea, the BE rep said Nautels were all IBOC compatible. No doubt now he was wrong! > >The ND1 goes for around $13,000 (US$). You'd have to fight to get the C-QUAM card. Gee, the AM1A comes with the C-QUAM card for $12,100 US. Perhaps I can negotiate me a deal. > > I don't know if you were here six or so months ago when Keven (sp?) Tekel and I hashed this over (;->) but we don't quote C-QUAM anymore. I am fairly new to this list. > >That's something you might want to work out with our Sales Department - sales@nautel.com - they make the call on what we do or do not offer in the product line. I will shoot them a Email then. Thanks, Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Dec 18 19:09:03 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Dec 2002 03:09:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 92075 invoked from network); 19 Dec 2002 03:09:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Dec 2002 03:09:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.200) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Dec 2002 03:09:02 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 18 Dec 2002 19:09:02 -0800 To: Subject: I know How You Feel, Neal! Date: Wed, 18 Dec 2002 22:06:57 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Dec 2002 03:09:02.0535 (UTC) FILETIME=[FB79FD70:01C2A70B] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.155.210.132] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 In the past few days, a local real estate company has gone all over my city of license putting "Talking House" transmitters on every house they are selling. These transmitters are all on 1610Khz and are screwing with reception of WFIS 1600. I have had 3 listener complaints today! What can I do about them? Ain't they under Part 15 too? Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Dec 18 19:43:42 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Dec 2002 03:43:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 75147 invoked from network); 19 Dec 2002 03:43:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Dec 2002 03:43:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.195) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Dec 2002 03:43:39 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 18 Dec 2002 19:43:39 -0800 To: References: <76.275363c3.2b2fc070@aol.com> <002501c2a6fd$3201a320$827dfea9@home1> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Gates BC1E Was:Question For Eric Date: Wed, 18 Dec 2002 22:43:26 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Dec 2002 03:43:39.0575 (UTC) FILETIME=[D17D2470:01C2A710] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.155.210.132] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Scott Todd wrote: > See if they'd be willing to trade your 9200 for their 9100B2. We are going to use the 9200 for another station that Golden Strip Broadcasting is buying to simulcast. I have asked Clear Channel about that Optimod and they won't get rid of it, or the BE Exciter. WFIS is a thorn in their side taking ratings from the same demo as their stations. Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Dec 18 19:49:07 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Dec 2002 03:49:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 70819 invoked from network); 19 Dec 2002 03:48:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Dec 2002 03:48:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.123) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Dec 2002 03:48:55 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 18 Dec 2002 19:48:55 -0800 To: References: <20021218211849.43362.qmail@web14007.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Gates BC1E Was:Question For Eric Date: Wed, 18 Dec 2002 22:48:43 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Dec 2002 03:48:55.0639 (UTC) FILETIME=[8DE0AE70:01C2A711] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.155.210.132] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Ernest Jones wrote: > welp, no pics for WBTE, BUT WURB is a different story....teehee > > http://members.tripod.com/e92fm/wurb.html It is SHOCKING at what some of these groups do to radio stations! I need to get some pics of WFIS online. It is a very small station, but a class act, if I say so myself. Kevin From matthew.trim@eds.com Wed Dec 18 21:04:02 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: matthew.trim@eds.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Dec 2002 05:04:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 89174 invoked from network); 19 Dec 2002 05:04:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Dec 2002 05:04:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO ns5.eds.com) (203.17.185.230) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Dec 2002 05:04:00 -0000 Received: from nnsy.eds.com (nnsy-2.eds.com [192.85.216.198]) by ns5.eds.com (8.11.6/8.11.1) with ESMTP id gBJ53xg11957 for ; Thu, 19 Dec 2002 16:03:59 +1100 (EST) Received: from nnsy.eds.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by nnsy.eds.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gBJ53vC24995 for ; Thu, 19 Dec 2002 16:03:57 +1100 (EST) Received: from ausym000.exau01.exch.eds.com ([134.251.177.117]) by nnsy.eds.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gBJ53u224986 for ; Thu, 19 Dec 2002 16:03:57 +1100 (EST) Received: by AUSYM000 with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Thu, 19 Dec 2002 16:03:02 +1100 Message-ID: <33CDDBD8CAEFEB4191ABF6F799032AF238D704@aubwm206> To: "'amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com'" Subject: Easy AMS Conversion? Sony ST-JX220 on Ebay Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 16:02:21 +1100 Importance: high X-Priority: 1 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-Type: text/plain From: "Trim, Matthew L" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88615102 X-Yahoo-Profile: bofh2k2000 G'day, Have a look at this: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1946235412 I have the coveted Sony ST-JX220A which is the AM Stereo version of the ST-JX220 which was only sold in Canada and Australia. The AM Section in my ST-JX220A is awesome - sounds wider than my SRF-A1 and is probably as good as the SRF-A100 I can see no reason why the ST-JX220 would be anything less except for the lack of AM Stereo decoder - this would be a good buy for conversion I would think. I would recommend Chris / Kevin - check this baby out! - It's currently at $9.99 with no bids! Cheers, Matt =) From michaelj@vcn.com Wed Dec 18 22:19:52 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Dec 2002 06:19:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 31303 invoked from network); 19 Dec 2002 06:19:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Dec 2002 06:19:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m1-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Dec 2002 06:19:50 -0000 Received: from michaelj (unverified [209.193.86.24]) by m1-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Wed, 18 Dec 2002 23:19:49 -0700 Message-ID: <002e01c2a726$2ac2cac0$1856c1d1@mshome.net> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} A.M. stereo engineers out there Date: Wed, 18 Dec 2002 23:16:27 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I'm not an engineer, but I have lots of engineering knowledge and do most of the engineering here at KEVA. I did the stereo conversion here at KEVA and also at KMER in Kemmerer Wyoming. I'm available for questions. I'll help anyone I can. The engineers on this list helped ME like you can't imagine! I would NEVER have gotten KMER done without the help of Scott Todd and Bob Carter. And I certainly wouldn't have manged the conversion here at KEVA without Bob Carter's help. He has the same transmitter and told me EXACTLY how to do this. Now here we are in glorious AM Stereo! :) :) My email addy is michaelj@vcn.com . Michael n WYO Donn Tillman wrote: > I have managed to get the name of the chief engineer at WGUL 860 mono (formerly am stereo till early 2000) and would like to send him a Christmas card, with an invitation to the join either or both a.m. stereo lists as well as give him the email addresses of any a.m. stereo engineers or any other employees at an a.m. stereo station on either list that he might want to commiserate with. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From kevtronics@yahoo.com Wed Dec 18 22:27:45 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Dec 2002 06:27:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 84453 invoked from network); 19 Dec 2002 06:27:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Dec 2002 06:27:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Dec 2002 06:27:45 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.190] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 19 Dec 2002 06:27:45 -0000 Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 06:27:41 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: WABC Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 843 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.93.12 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > If anybody on the list knows the engineer for ABC, perhaps he could > be talked into turning on the C-QUAM exciters at WQXR and WABC. 770 WABC has never used C-Quam AM Stereo, as far as I can tell. They are rumoured to have used Kahn AM Stereo in the mid-1980s (*after* they switched from music to talk), but I have never heard of them using C-Quam. You might be referring to 660 WFAN, which is owned by Infinity and was in full AM Stereo until about a year ago. However, ABC/Disney also owns 1050 WEVD, another former (C-Quam) AM Stereo station in New York City, which dumped it around 1997 or so, during previous ownership. If the Stereo equipment is still there, ABC has never seen fit to use it, especially as WEVD is now an ESPN Radio affiliate for most of its broadcasting schedule, with some local sports talk programs. From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Dec 18 22:40:21 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: possumhunter@netzero.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Dec 2002 06:40:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 59738 invoked from network); 19 Dec 2002 06:40:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Dec 2002 06:40:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rly-ip05.mx.aol.com) (64.12.138.9) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Dec 2002 06:40:20 -0000 Received: from logs-to.proxy.aol.com (logs-to.proxy.aol.com [152.163.204.2]) by rly-ip05.mx.aol.com (v89.10) with ESMTP id RELAYIN1-1219013958; Thu, 19 Dec 2002 01:39:58 1900 Received: from ibm (AC9BD284.ipt.aol.com [172.155.210.132]) by logs-to.proxy.aol.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with SMTP id gBJ6ce411846 for ; Thu, 19 Dec 2002 01:38:41 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <004f01c2a729$3e0f8f20$d590b498@aoldsl.net> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: WABC Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 01:38:27 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Apparently-From: DodgeRamTrucker@aol.com From: "Possum Hunter" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 kevtronics@yahoo.com wrote: > 770 WABC has never used C-Quam AM Stereo, as far as I can tell. They are rumoured to have used Kahn AM Stereo in the mid-1980s (*after* they switched from music to talk), but I have never heard of them using C-Quam. I remember they used to light the stereo indicator on my Kenwood KRC-939 Multi-system radio. > > You might be referring to 660 WFAN, which is owned by Infinity and was in full AM Stereo until about a year ago. I used to LOVE listening to WNBC Stereo Oldies! Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Dec 18 22:40:58 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Dec 2002 06:40:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 9257 invoked from network); 19 Dec 2002 06:40:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Dec 2002 06:40:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.207) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Dec 2002 06:40:58 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 18 Dec 2002 22:40:58 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: WABC Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 01:40:40 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Dec 2002 06:40:58.0614 (UTC) FILETIME=[96D9A960:01C2A729] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.155.210.132] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 kevtronics@yahoo.com wrote: > 770 WABC has never used C-Quam AM Stereo, as far as I can tell. They are rumoured to have used Kahn AM Stereo in the mid-1980s (*after* they switched from music to talk), but I have never heard of them using C-Quam. I remember they used to light the stereo indicator on my Kenwood KRC-939 Multi-system radio. > > You might be referring to 660 WFAN, which is owned by Infinity and was in full AM Stereo until about a year ago. I used to LOVE listening to WNBC Stereo Oldies! Kevin From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Dec 19 00:03:19 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Dec 2002 08:03:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 1978 invoked from network); 19 Dec 2002 08:03:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Dec 2002 08:03:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d09.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.41) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Dec 2002 08:03:17 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d09.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.179.131db9bf (4410) for ; Thu, 19 Dec 2002 03:03:15 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <179.131db9bf.2b32d742@aol.com> Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 03:03:14 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} I know How You Feel, Neal! To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 12/18/02 10:11:12 PM Eastern Standard Time, possumhunter@netzero.net writes: > In the past few days, a local real estate company has gone all over my city > of license putting "Talking House" transmitters on every house they are > selling. These transmitters are all on 1610Khz and are screwing with > reception of WFIS 1600. I have had 3 listener complaints today! What can I > do about them? Ain't they under Part 15 too? > > Kevin > Yep..them trashmitters are part 15.Seems to me that they arent suppose to cause harmful interference to licensed broadcasters. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC Ray Communications Radio Network _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Dec 19 00:22:19 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Dec 2002 08:22:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 10848 invoked from network); 19 Dec 2002 08:22:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Dec 2002 08:22:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r04.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.100) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Dec 2002 08:22:17 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.11.510fe7b (4410) for ; Thu, 19 Dec 2002 03:22:12 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <11.510fe7b.2b32dbb3@aol.com> Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 03:22:11 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Gates BC1E Was:Question For Eric To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 12/18/02 9:07:29 PM Eastern Standard Time, stodd@sherbtel.net writes: > No public file; tower painting and lighting violations- anyone up to filing > a complaint with Uncle? > > ST > The station..if you can call it that does supposely have a public file located at the public library. As far as tower painting and all...you'd be lucky to get Willis radio to spend a dime on it. Heck another friend of mine that does some contract work for this group as well said he was at the "main office" and studios for Willis' other stations in the Norfolk Va area,when the area field office engineer from the FCC came in to do a surprise inspection. They didnt pass much of ANYTHING! and from what I was told all he got was a letter telling him to make the corrections and thats where it was left.This of course transpired AFTER the field engineer stepped out of Mr Willis' office. The previous engineer for that get up is a jack legged joke. His idea of trying to make a 3kw transmitter make power is by beating up the transmitter and tugging and twisting on knobs til they about fall off. Its amazing what will happen when you replace an old tired tube with a rebuilt and "clean up" years of neglect inside the transmitter. I'm still working on that tower situation...certainly the feds arent gonna do anything if ya know what I mean from the above comments. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Dec 19 00:27:33 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Dec 2002 08:27:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 64886 invoked from network); 19 Dec 2002 08:27:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Dec 2002 08:27:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m05.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.8) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Dec 2002 08:27:32 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.11a.1bd21353 (4410) for ; Thu, 19 Dec 2002 03:27:30 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <11a.1bd21353.2b32dcf1@aol.com> Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 03:27:29 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} AMAX mp3 files - alternate site To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 12/18/02 10:10:08 PM Eastern Standard Time, possumhunter@netzero.net writes: > KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: > >Have fun with them...and just for kicks..let me know what you all do with > them. > > I got programming the Phantom duty tonight, so they were "accidently" > programmed in to run on WFIS. > > Kevin > Ah!...you have a Phantom too?!? ...How big are your drives? The previous owner here I think got the smallest possible sized HD for mine. Wish I had Phantom software around...I hate the thought of mine taking one last burp and having to send it in just so someone can do what I could do. Mine is starting to get getting fussy about restarting if it is shut down for whatever reason. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Dec 19 00:29:38 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Dec 2002 08:29:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 66945 invoked from network); 19 Dec 2002 08:29:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Dec 2002 08:29:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m04.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.7) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Dec 2002 08:29:37 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.12f.1e1bd9be (4410) for ; Thu, 19 Dec 2002 03:29:32 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <12f.1e1bd9be.2b32dd6c@aol.com> Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 03:29:32 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} A.M. stereo engineers out there To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Donn Tillman wrote: > I have managed to get the name of the chief engineer at WGUL 860 mono (formerly am stereo till early 2000) and would like to send him a Christmas card, with an invitation to the join either or both a.m. stereo lists as well as give him the email addresses of any a.m. stereo engineers or any other employees at an a.m. stereo station on either list that he might want to commiserate with. You can put me in the loop to if you like. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From florida_amstereo@hotmail.com Thu Dec 19 02:26:19 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: florida_amstereo@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Dec 2002 10:26:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 39040 invoked from network); 19 Dec 2002 10:26:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Dec 2002 10:26:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.37.67) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Dec 2002 10:26:18 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 19 Dec 2002 02:23:37 -0800 Received: from 209.240.198.61 by pv2fd.pav2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Thu, 19 Dec 2002 10:23:37 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Re: {AMSF} A.M. stereo engineers out there Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 10:23:37 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Dec 2002 10:23:37.0820 (UTC) FILETIME=[B18EB9C0:01C2A748] From: "Donn Tillman" X-Originating-IP: [209.240.198.61] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83914824 Thanks Bob, Michael and Kevin from South Carolina; with you guys plus Juan and Neal, WGUL's engineer should have more than enough people to contact if he wants or needs any support or encouragement. Hopefully WGUL is interested. donn hoping WGUL can return to stereo. ----Original Message Follows---- From: KC4QLP@aol.com Reply-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} A.M. stereo engineers out there Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 03:29:32 EST Donn Tillman wrote: > I have managed to get the name of the chief engineer at WGUL 860 mono (formerly am stereo till early 2000) and would like to send him a Christmas card, with an invitation to the join either or both a.m. stereo lists as well as give him the email addresses of any a.m. stereo engineers or any other employees at an a.m. stereo station on either list that he might want to commiserate with. You can put me in the loop to if you like. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network _________________________________________________________________ Add photos to your messages with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail From groucho@skyweb.net Thu Dec 19 05:07:47 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Dec 2002 13:07:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 84761 invoked from network); 19 Dec 2002 13:07:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Dec 2002 13:07:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Dec 2002 13:07:46 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gBJDDd4Q096768 for ; Thu, 19 Dec 2002 08:13:40 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3E01C371.4424ECD5@skyweb.net> Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 08:02:41 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} I know How You Feel, Neal! References: <179.131db9bf.2b32d742@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 If you know who the real estate company is I would politely approach them and ask if the units can be switched to another Frequency. since they are interfering with a Licensed station. If Not. ask them to not use them Or you will have to take legal action for causing interference to an Federally Licensed Station... That will usually get them To do something and quick... I can just see it now.. about 5 of them in a 4 block area.. why Not connect them to satellite feeds and run a part 15 station. that Covers the whole Community. Now lets add IBOC to them.... You know why? Because am radios will be useless in a year or 2 and there will only be Digital am radios.... those little real estate transmitters will be useless.. unless they have IBOC... not only can you Drive by the house and hear Information. But you can Print out the fact sheets On the house From your digital am radios internal printer.. then again You will be in Copyright Violations For Printing On paper with Ink Not purchased From from anyone in this News group.... LOL KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 12/18/02 10:11:12 PM Eastern Standard Time, > possumhunter@netzero.net writes: > > > In the past few days, a local real estate company has gone all over my city > > of license putting "Talking House" transmitters on every house they are > > selling. These transmitters are all on 1610Khz and are screwing with > > reception of WFIS 1600. I have had 3 listener complaints today! What can I > > do about them? Ain't they under Part 15 too? > > > > Kevin > > > > Yep..them trashmitters are part 15.Seems to me that they arent suppose to > cause harmful interference to licensed broadcasters. > > Bob Carter > Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group > > WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 > Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 > > Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering > services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. > e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net > http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice > Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC > WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC > Ray Communications Radio Network > _______________________________________________________ > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Dec 19 05:22:34 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Dec 2002 13:22:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 51055 invoked from network); 19 Dec 2002 13:22:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Dec 2002 13:22:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.197) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Dec 2002 13:22:30 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 19 Dec 2002 05:22:29 -0800 To: References: <11a.1bd21353.2b32dcf1@aol.com> Subject: Phantom Was: AMAX mp3 files - alternate site Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 08:22:16 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Dec 2002 13:22:29.0960 (UTC) FILETIME=[AE695480:01C2A761] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.166.15.88] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 KC4QLP@aol.com > Ah!...you have a Phantom too?!? ...How big are your drives? The previous owner here I think got the smallest possible sized HD for mine. 20 Gig. You can get a bigger hard drive for it no problem. They also have an update you can get so it will play .MP3s as well as the .TMC, .MPEG, .MP2, and .WAV formats. > > Wish I had Phantom software around...I hate the thought of mine taking one last burp and having to send it in just so someone can do what I could do. Man, we would be up the creek if that happened right now! I will see what I can cook up on the software problem for you. > > Mine is starting to get getting fussy about restarting if it is shut down for whatever reason. Have you gone in and deleted unused files? If you have to de-frag it, you are in for some fun! It takes between 20 and 30 HOURS to do it. Is it running out of RAM? Kevin From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Thu Dec 19 05:36:15 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Dec 2002 13:36:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 33986 invoked from network); 19 Dec 2002 13:36:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Dec 2002 13:36:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14208.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.173.72) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Dec 2002 13:36:15 -0000 Message-ID: <20021219133615.83266.qmail@web14208.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.45.202.244] by web14208.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 19 Dec 2002 05:36:14 PST Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 05:36:14 -0800 (PST) Subject: 1560 New York AMS? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio Regarding AM Stereo on 1560 New York: > I think WQEQ is a time broker deal. Contact is Sean.P.Ferguson@abc.com > for more info on the WQEQ AM 1560. __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From philipr@irac.pe.ca Thu Dec 19 06:41:29 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Dec 2002 14:41:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 92270 invoked from network); 19 Dec 2002 14:41:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Dec 2002 14:41:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Dec 2002 14:41:27 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.187] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 19 Dec 2002 14:41:21 -0000 Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 14:41:18 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: CJLS and CJFX Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2991 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Possum Hunter" wrote in part: > Chances are, another station will take over the old CJLS plant and > frequency. I'm afraid not. Yarmouth NS, with a population of 8000 people, is a one station market. I don't think the CRTC would ever license a second station there. There is enough market for one station to make a decent income. > If they would like to help "Mother Earth" by recycling that exciter and or > transmitter, please give them my email addy! I would be more than happy to > help them in this way. This would ensure a C-QUAM signal will stay on the > air, just a few thousand miles away on 1600Khz! You may wish to contact CJLS [they have a nice website], congratulate them on their flip to FM for their main site [they've had the two FM repeaters [Barrington-Shelburne and Digby County] for years] and then inquire if they have a sale lined up for their AM transmitter and CQUAM exciter. Word to the wise - it may not go cheap, CJFX's old mono Nautel 10kwer sold for about $22,000 CDN, I believe in 1998 or so. Went to a station in North Carolina - Bob may know which one. One rumour was that it went to a Radio Disney station - some people around Antigonish snickered about Mickey Mouse buying it - but that's just an unreliable rumour. I believe CJFX acquired it new in 1982 or 1983 - it was the very first 10kw transmitter Nautel sold, said the media at the time. There is mention about this at the Nova Scotia Mueseum of Industry in Stellarton, NS [where they have a Nautel exciter board on display]. Atlantic Broadcasters Ltd. enjoyed many years of low energy bills, low maintenance bills, high modulation and no more broken glass from that pathetic mid 60s RCA [proof that RCA made ONE turkey] that couldn't go above 85% modulation. ABL got its present 25kw Nautel in 1991 - complete with CQUAM exciter. Now there is a powerhouse of a transmitter that may be up for sale. Such a shame what will likely happen to those two gorgeous 430 foot towers that are only 11 years old. > Perhaps CHWO could be convinced to take the frequency and simulcast AM 740 > on it? Once again, Antigonish is a small market: 5000 people in the town, add 3500 university students at ST.F.X.U. for 8 months of the year [recently ranked the number 1 predominantly undergrad university in Canada], with large rural areas surrounding the town, and stations in nearby towns [CIGO aka 101.5 The Hawk in Port HAWKesbury, and 1320 CKEC in New Glasgow. Plus, St.F.X.U. has its own campus station, CFXU [where yours truly used to work in its 690 days in the 1980s] which a couple months ago flipped to 5 watts of FM as The Fox [try saying CFXU 10 times and you'll know why!] The CRTC frowns big time on simulcasting 24/7. Lately, I have heard CHWO while checking for WOR IBOC interference - CHWO is a great station - although CJCH is pretty neat now too, and they're AM Stereo! Phil R. From philipr@irac.pe.ca Thu Dec 19 07:05:11 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Dec 2002 15:05:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 37344 invoked from network); 19 Dec 2002 15:05:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Dec 2002 15:05:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.86) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Dec 2002 15:05:10 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.146] by n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 19 Dec 2002 15:05:10 -0000 Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 15:05:10 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: CJLS Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2804 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote in part: But, can somebody clarify, exactly what > is the long-term goal of moving all these Canadian stations to FM? > Do they eventually want to clear out the AM band ENTIRELY, or will a > group of high-power, large-coverage AM signals (like 740 CHWO in > Toronto) remain on the air indefinitely? I wish I could! Early in the Eureka 147 DAB fantasy game, the powers that be were talking about how AM and FM would be replaced by DAB. I think that talk is softening, as evidenced by the massive numbers of AM to FM flips in Canada. The AM band is becoming really wide open - there are a few city stations left, but virtually every small town station has or will be doing a flip. Some of these flips make good sense all around, some don't. I don't know if there is a plan for AM. Perhaps the CRTC should be working on one - my vote would be for regional stations, not just in the big cities, but small towns where there is an AM powerhouse. > > I think 1000 CKBW in Bridgewater, NS should have stayed on the air as > one of these regional stations... their AM signal had excellent > coverage all along the southern coast of NS as I drove from Halifax > to Yarmouth. Their FM signal simply couldn't compare. I agree with you 100% on CKBW. My Dad got his start in radio there in 1949 or thereabouts, before moving to CJFX in 1952. For years CKBW was owned by 3 great guys who knew how to run a community focused commercial station. > And then there's 960 CHNS, thankfully still on the air. I can't say > much positive things about their dropping the AM Stereo, but they at > least do have a great signal. And at night via skywave I can even > pick them up here in NJ. CHNS is the old 1926 flagship for MBS Radio [Maritime Broadcasting System] MBS is a bit like a 24 station version of Clear Channel - I won't say much more. It's a shame they don't spend some money on CHNS, re-engineer the STL, then flip the CQUAM exciter back on. Also, they should take a few thousands of their millions, and instead of buying every little station in sight, buy a nice new 500 watt shortwave transmitter to get CHNX back on the air. Sure, they don't make any money on it, but isn't pride [and maybe some tax credits] worth it when you are laughing all the way to the bank. They can certainly afford a new transmitter for CHNX - the problem is that bean counters, not broadcasters, are running the show. The world needs some bean counters, who also happen to love radio, sure accountants and financial gurus are necessary - but if they want to buy stations, they should love radio too! Its great to make money - but public service is important too! Phil R. From amfmdx@fastq.com Thu Dec 19 08:36:41 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Dec 2002 16:36:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 30624 invoked from network); 19 Dec 2002 16:36:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Dec 2002 16:36:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Dec 2002 16:36:41 -0000 Received: from fastq (d101-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.133]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gBJGaev48743 for ; Thu, 19 Dec 2002 09:36:40 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <04f001c2a77c$bc187d20$aed63fd1@com> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: WABC Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 09:36:07 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > 770 WABC has never used C-Quam AM Stereo, as far as I can tell. They > are rumoured to have used Kahn AM Stereo in the mid-1980s (*after* > they switched from music to talk), but I have never heard of them > using C-Quam. I have a QSL somewhere stating the boys over in Lodi were Kahn. If I can find the thing easily, I might scan it and send it in.... Are you interested in QSL scans that state a station is AM stereo? Kevin Mesa, Arizona From michaelj@vcn.com Thu Dec 19 09:00:48 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Dec 2002 17:00:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 32241 invoked from network); 19 Dec 2002 17:00:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Dec 2002 17:00:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m1-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Dec 2002 17:00:46 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m1-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Thu, 19 Dec 2002 10:00:46 -0700 Message-ID: <002b01c2a780$21c05320$0701010a@keva> To: References: <04f001c2a77c$bc187d20$aed63fd1@com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: WABC Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 10:00:26 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Interesting thought Kevin. I don't suppose any of the cards mention STEREO and indeed mention which system? I'd be interested to also see a card from KSL 1160 mentioning stereo. I know John Dehnel was a big supporter of Kahn and I wonder if it's not maybe even still installed. I remember our engineer telling me when they'd run the Mormon Tabernacle Choir on Sundays, it was neat to hear that in STEREO. I think that may have been before the FCC approved Motorola, though. Man I wish I would have had a multi-system AMS radio back in those days!! MJR n WYO ----- Original Message ----- From: Kevin - Mesa, Arizona To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, December 19, 2002 9:36 AM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: WABC I have a QSL somewhere stating the boys over in Lodi were Kahn. If I can find the thing easily, I might scan it and send it in.... Are you interested in QSL scans that state a station is AM stereo? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From jwelton@nautel.com Thu Dec 19 09:04:30 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jwelton@nautel.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Dec 2002 17:04:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 28161 invoked from network); 19 Dec 2002 17:04:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Dec 2002 17:04:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailserver.nautel.com) (24.222.25.85) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Dec 2002 17:04:29 -0000 Received: FROM jeff-welton BY mailserver.nautel.com ; Thu Dec 19 13:04:27 2002 -0400 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 13:01:55 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: CJLS and CJFX Message-ID: <3E01C339.17040.EC66AB@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: References: X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.02a) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body From: "Jeff Welton" Reply-To: jwelton@nautel.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=26918678 > cheap, CJFX's old mono Nautel 10kwer sold for about $22,000 CDN, I > believe in 1998 or so. Went to a station in North Carolina - Bob > may know which one. One rumour was that it went to a Radio Disney Yep, WGFY in Charlotte (I love the Disney calls!). It was under LMA to Disney at the time the AMPFET 10 went in. I was in Richmond doing a site inspection while it was going in and dropped down to have a look. Freq. is now 1480 kHz. Incidentally, the transmitter was returned here from Antigonish before heading to Charlotte. > acquired it new in 1982 or 1983 - it was the very first 10kw > transmitter Nautel sold, said the media at the time. Yep again. Shipped in Feb./82 - the first solid state 10kW transmitter on the market at the time, although there were others within a few months, or so I'm told. Suffered exactly one off-air incident in 10 years of full time service, when a lightning strike took out almost everything in the old site that was connected to an AC power source - including the rectifiers in the transmitter. > ABL got its present 25kw Nautel in 1991 - complete with CQUAM > exciter. Now there is a powerhouse of a transmitter that may be up > for sale. You've got good sources, Phil, the ND25 shipped in July 1991. The only time it's been off-air since was when the hardline froze and buckled during a cold snap (-40 deg, with windchill in the -50's). It was kind of interesting because the hardline came out of the transmitter and up through the insulated ceiling into the uninsulated attic, then over to the phasor and down again - if it had all been run below the ceiling, the problem most likely wouldn't have happened! However, the C-QUAM exciter did not ship with the transmitter (we didn't start shipping ours until August 1993). CJFX purchased a separate exciter when they bought the transmitter - either a BE AX-10 or a Delta ASE-1, I believe, but it's been four or five years since I've been to that site. Regards, Jeff Welton Nautel Customer Service Dept. Tel.: 1-902-823-3900 ext. 127 Fax: 1-902-823-3183 email: jwelton@nautel.com From jwelton@nautel.com Thu Dec 19 09:04:31 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jwelton@nautel.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Dec 2002 17:04:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 90831 invoked from network); 19 Dec 2002 17:04:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Dec 2002 17:04:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailserver.nautel.com) (24.222.25.85) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Dec 2002 17:04:30 -0000 Received: FROM jeff-welton BY mailserver.nautel.com ; Thu Dec 19 13:04:27 2002 -0400 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 13:01:55 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: {AMSF} IBOC Conversion Was: Lawyers thread Message-ID: <3E01C339.4065.EC65BF@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.02a) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body From: "Jeff Welton" Reply-To: jwelton@nautel.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=26918678 > Yea, the BE rep said Nautels were all IBOC compatible. No doubt now he was > wrong! Well, all of our current models are - perhaps that's what he meant. > Gee, the AM1A comes with the C-QUAM card for $12,100 US. Perhaps I can > negotiate me a deal. I did say "around". By all means, talk to our Sales guys - they'll be the ones to give prices on transmitters. I'd be more than happy to give an exact price on coming down to install it (especially any time between now and May!!! - I'd even work in a "frigid North" discount!). Best, Jeff Welton Nautel Customer Service Dept. Tel.: 1-902-823-3900 ext. 127 Fax: 1-902-823-3183 email: jwelton@nautel.com From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Dec 19 09:46:16 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Dec 2002 17:46:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 5185 invoked from network); 19 Dec 2002 17:46:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Dec 2002 17:46:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m03.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.6) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Dec 2002 17:46:14 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.15e.18d6774f (4254) for ; Thu, 19 Dec 2002 12:46:07 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <15e.18d6774f.2b335fdf@aol.com> Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 12:46:07 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Phantom Was: AMAX mp3 files - alternate site To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/19/02 8:25:48 AM Eastern Standard Time, possumhunter@netzero.net writes: < 20 Gig. You can get a bigger hard drive for it no problem. They also have an update you can get so it will play .MP3s as well as the .TMC, .MPEG, .MP2, and .WAV formats. > The last owners talked with RDS about getting a larger drive and all and the software update for the MP3s and other formats for this Phantom...needless to say I think someone nearly had a heart attack when they were quoted a price. < Man, we would be up the creek if that happened right now! I will see what I can cook up on the software problem for you. > This one has no CD drive...only a floppy and of course the hard drives. What all do you know about how this software ticks? > Oh yeah..I've deleted everything that isnt used...old audio files,logs and timer functions.A defrag on mine takes about an hour and a half to do..thats even after doing that regularly. Running out of RAM?...dunno...not sure how to check that. What it does,it hangs up on booting up. It will get to a certain point and freeze up. Usually a good indication of when its not going to boot up properly is when the name of the mother board pops up in the top left hand corner of the screen during boot up,shows up as white colored letters instead of there usual yellow and red colors.When I see that happen, I usually have to hit "ctrl+alt+del" and reboot a few times before it decides its going to do like its suppose to.If I dont do that right when I see those white colored letters...I then have to shut it all the down and start over because it will lock right up. Once its up and running its fine after that. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network _______________________________________________________ From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Dec 19 10:02:41 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Dec 2002 18:02:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 72889 invoked from network); 19 Dec 2002 18:02:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Dec 2002 18:02:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r04.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.100) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Dec 2002 18:02:40 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.175.13baed51 (4254) for ; Thu, 19 Dec 2002 13:02:32 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <175.13baed51.2b3363b7@aol.com> Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 13:02:31 EST Subject: 1670 MD - Limited Time Offer--IBOC at WTTM's front door To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp From DCRTV.com: Digital Radio Tests On 1670 - 12/18 - More of those digital radio tests, this time on 1670 AM in the Frederick area on Wednesday. From the facility of Bonneville's WXTR (820 AM), which relays WTOP. It features audio from WTOP and co-owned WWZZ/WWVZ (104)..... Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network _______________________________________________________ From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Dec 19 12:23:37 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Dec 2002 20:23:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 33473 invoked from network); 19 Dec 2002 20:23:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Dec 2002 20:23:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.202) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Dec 2002 20:23:36 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 19 Dec 2002 12:23:36 -0800 To: References: <15e.18d6774f.2b335fdf@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Phantom Was: AMAX mp3 files - alternate site Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 15:23:19 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Dec 2002 20:23:36.0584 (UTC) FILETIME=[827E3080:01C2A79C] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.162.61.163] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 KC4QLP@aol.comwrote: >The last owners talked with RDS about getting a larger drive and all and the software update for the MP3s and other formats for this Phantom...needless to say I think someone nearly had a heart attack when they were quoted a price. Yea, They are nuts with pricing. Sorry guys, but the little stations just cannot pay as much as Clear Channel can for stuff! I wonder of there are any Phantom updates on the Warez web sites? > >This one has no CD drive...only a floppy and of course the hard drives. Right, When they installed it, they used an external CD drive to load in the program and TM Century Gold Drive. > >What all do you know about how this software ticks? It is standard MSDOS, Nothing weird about it. I have not messed with it much because it just keeps on working. > >What it does,it hangs up on booting up. It will get to a certain point and freeze up. Have you called RDS and asked them what they think the problem is? The good thing about RDS is when you call, the person who answers actually knows what he is doing! Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Dec 19 13:41:43 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Dec 2002 21:41:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 89847 invoked from network); 19 Dec 2002 21:41:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Dec 2002 21:41:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.120) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Dec 2002 21:41:41 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 19 Dec 2002 13:41:40 -0800 To: Subject: Fw: Nautel ND1 Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 16:38:35 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Dec 2002 21:41:40.0936 (UTC) FILETIME=[6A959480:01C2A7A7] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.162.61.163] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Look what I got in today's mail: >"Note that the ND1 transmitters are IBOC compatible, and as such, are no longer compatible for AM Stereo, due to the differing technical requirements." Hmmm That is funny because BE comes with the C-QUAM card in it AND it is IBOC compatible! What would make this transmitter not compatible with C-QUAM? Kevin ----- Original Message ----- From: "Shannon Morash" To: Sent: Thursday, December 19, 2002 2:14 PM Subject: Nautel ND1 Thank you for your e-mail message expressing interest in NAUTEL fully solid state Medium Wave AM Broadcast Transmitters. Attached is the technical information (in PDF format) and specially priced quotation (in MS Word format) you requested for the NAUTEL ND1, 1kW solid state AM broadcast transmitter. Note that the ND1 transmitters are IBOC compatible, and as such, are no longer compatible for AM Stereo, due to the differing technical requirements. Broadcasters can benefit from high reliability, dependability and performance with the many features and advantages of the NAUTEL ND1 transmitter, including: =B7 Overall efficiency better than 70% =B7 Solid state design utilizing digital circuit techniques results in superior audio performance and high efficiency and. =B7 Modular construction incorporating three PA assemblies provides failure reserve and simplifies maintenance NAUTEL offers solid state AM broadcast transmitters from 1,000 watts to 300,000 watts and higher, solid state FM broadcast transmitters from 3,500 watts to 40,000 watts and a digital FM exciter. NAUTEL AM and FM transmitters offer high overall efficiency and unique redundancy features based on over 30 years of solid state design experience. Since 1969, NAUTEL has shipped more than 4,500 solid state transmitters to over 160 countries worldwide. Should you require additional information, contact me. You can also contact me via E-mail: gmanteuffel@nautel.com, or visit our Internet website: www.nautel.com. Thank you for your interest in NAUTEL. We look forward to serving you. Very truly yours, Gary K. Manteuffel Manager, Broadcast Sales Nautel Maine, Inc. e-mail: gmanteuffel@nautel.com web site: www.nautel.com ph: (207) 947-8200 fax: 9207) 947-3693 Attachments: ND1930.doc and NDbrochure.pdf [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Dec 19 13:56:14 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Dec 2002 21:56:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 20005 invoked from network); 19 Dec 2002 21:56:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Dec 2002 21:56:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Dec 2002 21:56:13 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.158] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 19 Dec 2002 21:56:12 -0000 Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 21:56:12 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Fw: Nautel ND1 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 756 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.87.44 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > "Note that the ND1 transmitters are IBOC compatible, and as such, > are no longer compatible for AM Stereo, due to the differing > technical requirements." > Hmmm That is funny because BE comes with the C-QUAM card in it AND > it is IBOC compatible! What would make this transmitter not > compatible with C-QUAM? I'm hoping that's just their very poorly worded way of saying that you can't transmit IBOC and C-Quam at the same time. IBOC is basically just QUAM that is transmitting digital "hash" instead of analog audio. So, if anything, an "IBOC-compatible" transmitter would actually be BETTER for use with C-Quam AM Stereo, as it would have a wider and more linear bandwidth, which would give you wider and more accurate Stereo separation. From stodd@sherbtel.net Thu Dec 19 14:08:37 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Dec 2002 22:08:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 63813 invoked from network); 19 Dec 2002 22:08:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Dec 2002 22:08:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Dec 2002 22:08:37 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-116.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.116]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gBJM8XOd007319 for ; Thu, 19 Dec 2002 16:08:35 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <002d01c2a7ab$319fd600$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <11.510fe7b.2b32dbb3@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Gates BC1E Was:Question For Eric Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 16:08:40 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude If the FCC won't, bet your bottom dollar the FAA will! ST ----- Original Message ----- From: > I'm still working on that tower situation...certainly the feds arent gonna do > anything if ya know what I mean from the above comments. From stodd@sherbtel.net Thu Dec 19 14:12:53 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Dec 2002 22:12:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 5794 invoked from network); 19 Dec 2002 22:12:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Dec 2002 22:12:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Dec 2002 22:12:52 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-116.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.116]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gBJMCnOd008755 for ; Thu, 19 Dec 2002 16:12:50 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <003301c2a7ab$c9b936c0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} I know How You Feel, Neal! Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 16:12:55 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude As Bob said, they're not supposed to cause interference with licensed broadcasters. I suggest you write each of the realtors with offending transmitters a letter on official station letterhead, stating they're operating in violation of FCC part 15 rules and they need to cease and desist pronto, or both FCC and civil litigation will result. It would be helpful for you to quote the appropriate FCC passages about noninterference. Send the letters certified, with return receipt so none of them can say they weren't warned. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Possum Hunter" > In the past few days, a local real estate company has gone all over my city > of license putting "Talking House" transmitters on every house they are > selling. These transmitters are all on 1610Khz and are screwing with > reception of WFIS 1600. I have had 3 listener complaints today! What can I > do about them? From stodd@sherbtel.net Thu Dec 19 14:16:16 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Dec 2002 22:16:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 12496 invoked from network); 19 Dec 2002 22:16:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Dec 2002 22:16:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Dec 2002 22:16:15 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-116.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.116]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gBJMGAOd009837 for ; Thu, 19 Dec 2002 16:16:12 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <004301c2a7ac$42017340$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <12f.1e1bd9be.2b32dd6c@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} A.M. stereo engineers out there Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 16:16:17 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude I don't have the firsthand experience that Bob does, but I'm fairly well versed just from reading up on it and will offer whatever help I can. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: > Donn Tillman wrote: > > as > well as give him the email addresses of any a.m. stereo engineers or any > other employees at an a.m. stereo station on either list that he might want > to commiserate with. > > You can put me in the loop to if you like. From stodd@sherbtel.net Thu Dec 19 14:22:16 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Dec 2002 22:22:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 52470 invoked from network); 19 Dec 2002 22:22:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Dec 2002 22:22:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Dec 2002 22:22:15 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-116.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.116]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gBJMMBOd011684 for ; Thu, 19 Dec 2002 16:22:13 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <005801c2a7ad$196c3d60$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: CJLS and CJFX Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 16:22:18 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude At that age they could likely sell them or just give them to whomever is ambitious enough to take them down. It isn't that hard, really, if you have the right equipment. At that height you'd probably need a power winch to lower the sections. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: > ABL got its present 25kw Nautel in 1991 - complete with CQUAM > exciter. Now there is a powerhouse of a transmitter that may be up > for sale. Such a shame what will likely happen to those two gorgeous > 430 foot towers that are only 11 years old. From stodd@sherbtel.net Thu Dec 19 14:31:38 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Dec 2002 22:31:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 46589 invoked from network); 19 Dec 2002 22:31:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Dec 2002 22:31:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Dec 2002 22:31:36 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-116.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.116]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gBJMVWOd014580 for ; Thu, 19 Dec 2002 16:31:34 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <007c01c2a7ae$678c6f00$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fw: Nautel ND1 Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 16:31:39 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude I seem to remember a similar thread over a year ago, and Jeff said the sales droids (my term) didn't know what they were talking about in that regard. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Possum Hunter" > Look what I got in today's mail: > >"Note that the ND1 transmitters are IBOC compatible, and as such, are no > longer compatible for AM Stereo, due to the differing technical > requirements." > > What would make this transmitter not compatible with > C-QUAM? From ccuff@in4web.com Thu Dec 19 15:26:13 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Dec 2002 23:26:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 94344 invoked from network); 19 Dec 2002 23:26:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Dec 2002 23:26:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Dec 2002 23:26:11 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.94]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Thu, 19 Dec 2002 18:21:12 -0500 Message-ID: <002d01c2a7b4$cb445480$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: Subject: Fw: New AM Stereo Radio Station Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 18:17:09 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit A new station has joined the AMS ranks- I emailed him back with radio info, adding that for now, the best way to give his listeners AMS was retrofitting some inexpensive boomboxes.. CC ----- Original Message ----- From: wvol1470@aol.com To: ccuff@in4web.com Sent: Thursday, December 19, 2002 6:06 PM Subject: New AM Stereo Radio Station Hey Chris, My name is Roderick Heidelberg. I am the Operations Manager of WVOL 1470 AM in Nashville Tennessee. Last night at about 8:30 pm, we converted to AM Stereo. The only downside is nobody has a system equiped to recieve our AM stereo Signal. My question is how did other stations overcome this obsticle. How did they promote it. I was surfing the web and I came across this site. I see you guys make AM STERIOS. Do you still make them and if you do how can we get a few for promotions. I guess what I'm trying to say is WE NEED HELP. Heidelberg Broadcasting,LLC WVOL 1470 AM 1320 Brick Church Pike Nashville TN. 37207 John Heidelberg/Owner Roderick Heidelberg/Op. Manager [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From stodd@sherbtel.net Thu Dec 19 17:11:28 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Dec 2002 01:11:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 29471 invoked from network); 20 Dec 2002 01:11:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Dec 2002 01:11:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Dec 2002 01:11:27 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-126.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.126]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gBK1BOOd028679 for ; Thu, 19 Dec 2002 19:11:25 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <000701c2a7c4$bce75120$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <002d01c2a7b4$cb445480$0101a8c0@pavilion> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fw: New AM Stereo Radio Station Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 19:11:31 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude This is GREAT news. Thanks for sending it our way. While I'm here, there'a a question I've been meaning to ask but couldn't seem to remember to til now. How big a quantity would we have to start making decoders for the prices to drop appreciably? I don't doubt for a minute that you're sinking $25 into each now, but what would it take for even a $5 drop? Scott Todd ----- Original Message ----- From: "Christopher Cuff" To: Sent: Thursday, December 19, 2002 5:17 PM Subject: {AMSF} Fw: New AM Stereo Radio Station > A new station has joined the AMS ranks- > I emailed him back with radio info, adding that for now, the best way to give his listeners AMS was retrofitting some inexpensive boomboxes.. > CC > ----- Original Message ----- > From: wvol1470@aol.com > To: ccuff@in4web.com > Sent: Thursday, December 19, 2002 6:06 PM > Subject: New AM Stereo Radio Station > > > Hey Chris, > My name is Roderick Heidelberg. I am the Operations Manager of WVOL 1470 AM > in Nashville Tennessee. Last night at about 8:30 pm, we converted to AM Stereo. > The only downside is nobody has a system equiped to recieve our AM stereo Signal. > My question is how did other stations overcome this obsticle. How did they promote it. I was surfing the web and I came across this site. I see you guys make AM STERIOS. Do you still make them and if you do how can we get a few for promotions. I guess what I'm trying to say is WE NEED HELP. > > Heidelberg Broadcasting,LLC > WVOL 1470 AM > 1320 Brick Church Pike > Nashville TN. 37207 > > John Heidelberg/Owner > Roderick Heidelberg/Op. Manager > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Dec 19 18:10:01 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Dec 2002 02:10:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 99071 invoked from network); 20 Dec 2002 02:09:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Dec 2002 02:09:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Dec 2002 02:09:53 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.167] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 20 Dec 2002 02:09:52 -0000 Date: Fri, 20 Dec 2002 02:09:50 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Fw: New AM Stereo Radio Station Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <002d01c2a7b4$cb445480$0101a8c0@pavilion> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 231 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.87.44 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > A new station has joined the AMS ranks- And in Nashville, no less... we gotta really help them out, because if AM Stereo becomes a success for WVOL, you never know if 650 WSM might get the hint and flip their Stereo back on. From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Dec 19 18:44:58 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Dec 2002 02:44:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 75311 invoked from network); 20 Dec 2002 02:44:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Dec 2002 02:44:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.46) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Dec 2002 02:44:56 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 19 Dec 2002 18:44:56 -0800 To: References: <11.510fe7b.2b32dbb3@aol.com> <002d01c2a7ab$319fd600$827dfea9@home1> Subject: Tower Violations Was: Gates BC1E Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 19:56:57 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 20 Dec 2002 02:44:56.0613 (UTC) FILETIME=[C80D8D50:01C2A7D1] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.146.104.113] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Scott Todd wrote: > If the FCC won't, bet your bottom dollar the FAA will! You got that right! They have been nailing tower owners all over South Carolina. I just hope they don't bust the old junker station I am trying to get! Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Dec 19 18:44:58 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Dec 2002 02:44:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 20169 invoked from network); 20 Dec 2002 02:44:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Dec 2002 02:44:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.116) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Dec 2002 02:44:58 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 19 Dec 2002 18:44:58 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Fw: Nautel ND1 Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 20:03:22 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 20 Dec 2002 02:44:58.0481 (UTC) FILETIME=[C92A9610:01C2A7D1] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.146.104.113] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 kevtronics@yahoo.com >I'm hoping that's just their very poorly worded way of saying that you can't transmit IBOC and C-Quam at the same time. Perhaps, but you would think that the letter I sent them would be quite clear that I wanted a C-QUAM transmitter. This is what I emailed them: WFIS is now taking bids for a 1KW Solid State transmitter tuned to 1600Khz with a C-QUAM AM Stereo card in it. Could you please send me the specifications and price of a Nautel ND1 Stereo transmitter? At not time did I mention IBOC. > >So, if anything, an "IBOC-compatible" transmitter would actually be BETTER for use with C-Quam AM Stereo, That is what I would think, but Nautel should know more about their products than I do! Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Dec 19 18:45:02 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Dec 2002 02:45:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 62829 invoked from network); 20 Dec 2002 02:45:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Dec 2002 02:45:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.193) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Dec 2002 02:45:00 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 19 Dec 2002 18:45:00 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: CJLS and CJFX Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 20:28:24 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 20 Dec 2002 02:45:00.0370 (UTC) FILETIME=[CA4AD320:01C2A7D1] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.146.104.113] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 philipr@irac.pe.ca wrote: >Yarmouth NS, with a population of 8000 people, is a one station market. I don't think the CRTC would ever license a second station there. There is enough market for one station to make a decent income. That sure never stopped the FCC from letting corporate radio owners put anything and everything on the air here in the Greenville market! Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Dec 19 18:45:02 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Dec 2002 02:45:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 77475 invoked from network); 20 Dec 2002 02:45:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Dec 2002 02:45:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.206) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Dec 2002 02:45:02 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 19 Dec 2002 18:45:01 -0800 To: References: <3E01C339.4065.EC65BF@localhost> Subject: Re: {AMSF} IBOC Conversion Was: Lawyers thread Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 20:31:37 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 20 Dec 2002 02:45:01.0968 (UTC) FILETIME=[CB3EA900:01C2A7D1] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.146.104.113] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Jeff Welton wrote: >I'd be more than happy to give an exact price on coming down to install it (especially any time between now and May!!! - I'd even work in a "frigid North" discount!). Going by what Gary K. Manteuffel wrote me, the chances of that happening are slim :-( Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Dec 19 18:45:14 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Dec 2002 02:45:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 28338 invoked from network); 20 Dec 2002 02:45:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Dec 2002 02:45:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.119) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Dec 2002 02:45:14 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 19 Dec 2002 18:45:14 -0800 To: References: <15e.18d6774f.2b335fdf@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Phantom Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 20:52:17 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 20 Dec 2002 02:45:14.0414 (UTC) FILETIME=[D2A9C4E0:01C2A7D1] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.146.104.113] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Bob, Do you have the RDX Phantom or the Phantom II? Speaking of Phantoms, I now have permanent Phantom programming duty. How about a PSA for this group? If it is OK with the list owner, I will cook one up and get it in the air. Want me to post a dub? Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Dec 19 19:10:35 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Dec 2002 03:10:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 16788 invoked from network); 20 Dec 2002 03:10:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Dec 2002 03:10:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.85) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Dec 2002 03:10:32 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 19 Dec 2002 19:10:32 -0800 To: References: <007c01c2a7ae$678c6f00$827dfea9@home1> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fw: Nautel ND1 Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 22:10:20 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 20 Dec 2002 03:10:32.0005 (UTC) FILETIME=[5B37C750:01C2A7D5] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.146.104.113] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Scott Todd wrote: > I seem to remember a similar thread over a year ago, and Jeff said the sales droids (my term) didn't know what they were talking about in that regard. The question then becomes: How do you buy an AM Stereo transmitter from a company that makes them, but their sales staff thinks they are no longer made? I do like that BE. The idea of having it mount in my 19" rack is very attractive, and with the built in C-QUAM card, I just dont think I can loose. There is one on the air in MONO at WAIM 1230 and it sounds good. Kevin From e92fmjamz@yahoo.com Thu Dec 19 19:47:45 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: e92fmjamz@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Dec 2002 03:47:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 51587 invoked from network); 20 Dec 2002 03:47:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Dec 2002 03:47:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14008.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.175.124) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Dec 2002 03:47:44 -0000 Message-ID: <20021220034744.50984.qmail@web14008.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [208.6.34.87] by web14008.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 19 Dec 2002 19:47:44 PST Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 19:47:44 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: {AMSF} Tower Violations Was: Gates BC1E To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: Ernest Jones X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=24963319 X-Yahoo-Profile: e92fmjamz hehe, heres WBXB, just for kicks http://members.tripod.com/e92fm/wbxb.html I was there when thier tube was replaced..snapping pictures when the WBXB staff wasn't looking, then the idiot who went in there and arced the tuning knobs and making the tube put out even less power..he got 3kw for about 1 second..then the tube lost power..and never gained anything more than 1kw or so --- Possum Hunter wrote: > Scott Todd wrote: > > If the FCC won't, bet your bottom dollar the FAA > will! > > You got that right! They have been nailing tower > owners all over South > Carolina. I just hope they don't bust the old junker > station I am trying to > get! > > Kevin > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > ===== Ernest, Gates NC, USA WRCS 970 AM Ahoskie NC, Announcer,webmaster http://wrcs.cjb.net WQDK 99.3 FM Ahoskie NC, Fill in ------contact me-------- AIM: e92fmjamz2000 ICQ: 33155469 Yahoo: e92fmjamz __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Dec 19 20:10:25 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: possumhunter@netzero.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Dec 2002 04:10:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 2637 invoked from network); 20 Dec 2002 04:10:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Dec 2002 04:10:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rly-ip05.mx.aol.com) (64.12.138.9) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Dec 2002 04:10:24 -0000 Received: from logs-ti.proxy.aol.com (logs-ti.proxy.aol.com [152.163.194.135]) by rly-ip05.mx.aol.com (v89.10) with ESMTP id RELAYIN2-1219230953; Thu, 19 Dec 2002 23:09:53 1900 Received: from ibm (AC926871.ipt.aol.com [172.146.104.113]) by logs-ti.proxy.aol.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with SMTP id gBK3oLg410388 for ; Thu, 19 Dec 2002 22:50:23 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <007c01c2a7da$e9c97b80$a890b498@aoldsl.net> To: References: <002d01c2a7b4$cb445480$0101a8c0@pavilion> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fw: New AM Stereo Radio Station Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 22:50:05 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Apparently-From: DodgeRamTrucker@aol.com From: "Possum Hunter" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Christopher Cuff wrote: > A new station has joined the AMS ranks- That is GREAT news! The more, the better! Kevin From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Dec 19 21:19:11 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Dec 2002 05:19:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 4858 invoked from network); 20 Dec 2002 05:19:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Dec 2002 05:19:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d08.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.40) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Dec 2002 05:19:09 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.199.1298fd8a (4254) for ; Fri, 20 Dec 2002 00:19:03 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <199.1298fd8a.2b340247@aol.com> Date: Fri, 20 Dec 2002 00:19:03 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Phantom To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/19/02 9:48:47 PM Eastern Standard Time, possumhunter@netzero.net writes: << Bob, Do you have the RDX Phantom or the Phantom II? Speaking of Phantoms, I now have permanent Phantom programming duty. How about a PSA for this group? If it is OK with the list owner, I will cook one up and get it in the air. Want me to post a dub? Kevin >> I'm not sure which version of Phantom I have here...nothing on the Phantom or anywhere in my books does it say. I do know that the last program update that's had was back in 1999....also something that might ID a version here ...the encoding formats are CDI-C 4:1, ADPCMe-4:1,ADPCMI-4:1,PCM 16 bit,PCM 8 bit. I've had Phantom duty ever since I installed the thing.Do so many things around here,and get so little positive feed back on anything...but the minute something is out of wack...people go nuts! I just havent figured out what the deal is with that just yet. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network _______________________________________________________ From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Dec 19 21:31:48 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Dec 2002 05:31:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 65862 invoked from network); 20 Dec 2002 05:31:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Dec 2002 05:31:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r05.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.101) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Dec 2002 05:31:47 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.20.52c9a23 (4254) for ; Fri, 20 Dec 2002 00:31:43 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <20.52c9a23.2b34053e@aol.com> Date: Fri, 20 Dec 2002 00:31:42 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Phantom Was: AMAX mp3 files - alternate site To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/19/02 3:25:38 PM Eastern Standard Time, possumhunter@netzero.net writes: << Have you called RDS and asked them what they think the problem is? The good thing about RDS is when you call, the person who answers actually knows what he is doing! >> Yep....made the call long ago and this is the sad part here...they dont have any clear clue as to what could be causing this. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network _______________________________________________________ From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Dec 19 21:44:58 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: possumhunter@netzero.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Dec 2002 05:44:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 653 invoked from network); 20 Dec 2002 05:44:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Dec 2002 05:44:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rly-ip05.mx.aol.com) (64.12.138.9) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Dec 2002 05:44:56 -0000 Received: from logs-ti.proxy.aol.com (logs-ti.proxy.aol.com [152.163.194.135]) by rly-ip05.mx.aol.com (v89.10) with ESMTP id RELAYIN7-1220004438; Fri, 20 Dec 2002 00:44:38 1900 Received: from ibm (AC926871.ipt.aol.com [172.146.104.113]) by logs-ti.proxy.aol.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with SMTP id gBK5hYg38266 for ; Fri, 20 Dec 2002 00:43:34 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <00d601c2a7ea$b67c9900$a890b498@aoldsl.net> To: References: <199.1298fd8a.2b340247@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Phantom Date: Fri, 20 Dec 2002 00:43:22 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Apparently-From: DodgeRamTrucker@aol.com From: "Possum Hunter" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: > I'm not sure which version of Phantom I have here...nothing on the Phantom or anywhere in my books does it say. I do know that the last program update that's had was back in 1999.... Then you have a Phantom 1. On the Phantom II, when it is running, at the bottom center fo the screen it will say "Phantom II" My Phantom II is a whole different critter than yours, so I cant help you much. I have a buddy at a station with a Phantom 1. I will see if he has the software. The only way you will get anything out of RDS is to subscribe to their tech support at a real nice price! They want to give me a good screwing to update mine to MP3 support, and I am on their tech support! I have been searching the warez sites for the update. > > I've had Phantom duty ever since I installed the thing.Do so many things around here,and get so little positive feed back on anything...but the minute something is out of wack...people go nuts! I just havent figured out what the deal is with that just yet. One thing I can say about WFIS is you get lots of positive feedback and a nice $BONUS$ in your check when you do good. Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Dec 19 21:53:02 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: possumhunter@netzero.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Dec 2002 05:53:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 33350 invoked from network); 20 Dec 2002 05:53:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Dec 2002 05:53:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rly-ip05.mx.aol.com) (64.12.138.9) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Dec 2002 05:53:01 -0000 Received: from logs-ti.proxy.aol.com (logs-ti.proxy.aol.com [152.163.194.135]) by rly-ip05.mx.aol.com (v89.10) with ESMTP id RELAYIN7-1220005221; Fri, 20 Dec 2002 00:52:21 1900 Received: from ibm (AC926871.ipt.aol.com [172.146.104.113]) by logs-ti.proxy.aol.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with SMTP id gBK5ohg51483 for ; Fri, 20 Dec 2002 00:50:44 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <00ea01c2a7eb$b6802600$a890b498@aoldsl.net> To: References: <20.52c9a23.2b34053e@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Phantom Was: AMAX mp3 files - alternate site Date: Fri, 20 Dec 2002 00:50:32 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Apparently-From: DodgeRamTrucker@aol.com From: "Possum Hunter" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: >made the call long ago and this is the sad part here...they dont have any clear clue as to what could be causing this. I want to *THINK* the Phantom takes regular old fashioned SDRAM memory sticks, cant hurt to try upping the RAM and see what happens. It sure sounds to me like that is what is going on. Kevin From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Dec 19 21:59:43 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Dec 2002 05:59:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 40762 invoked from network); 20 Dec 2002 05:59:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Dec 2002 05:59:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m02.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.5) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Dec 2002 05:59:42 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.12c.1e3b7371 (4254) for ; Fri, 20 Dec 2002 00:59:31 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <12c.1e3b7371.2b340bc2@aol.com> Date: Fri, 20 Dec 2002 00:59:30 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Phantom To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/20/02 12:47:48 AM Eastern Standard Time, possumhunter@netzero.net writes: << Then you have a Phantom 1. On the Phantom II, when it is running, at the bottom center fo the screen it will say "Phantom II" My Phantom II is a whole different critter than yours, so I cant help you much. I have a buddy at a station with a Phantom 1. I will see if he has the software.>> Ok..cool I'll make a note of that.Mine at the bottom of the screen just says "The Phantom". If your buddy needs any updates...I have that 1999 update. <> Yeah I know,..we were at one time on there tech support. I cant understand why someone would charge so much for a DOS program ....winblows based automation system I probably could understand part of the high jacked priced. Have you found anything on the warez sites? I've looked for stuff before on those sites...gotta watch what you try and download..what you download might not be as advertised..I've seen may viruses and trojans parked in places like that. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network _______________________________________________________ From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Dec 19 22:11:16 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Dec 2002 06:11:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 14949 invoked from network); 20 Dec 2002 06:11:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Dec 2002 06:11:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d10.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.42) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Dec 2002 06:11:16 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d10.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.55.34260a53 (4254) for ; Fri, 20 Dec 2002 01:11:12 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <55.34260a53.2b340e7f@aol.com> Date: Fri, 20 Dec 2002 01:11:11 EST Subject: IBOC receiver question basically answered To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp I thought many of you would like what this guy has to say....somehow he knows that iBiquity only tested 4...thats right FOUR radio receivers....not all available receivers like someone in NYC boasted on this very list a few weeks ago. Looks like some IBOC testers creditablity is being shot all to heck oh mighty! For those of you not on the nrcdxas list...enjoy! Subj: [NRC-am] The Glen Clark IBOC Petition Date: 12/19/02 11:48:54 PM Eastern Standard Time From: bdm@bdmcomm.ca (Barry McLarnon) Reply-to: am@nrcdxas.org To: am@nrcdxas.org I finally had some time to read and digest (urp) the Clark petition. Here's my take on it. The case he makes is pretty simple. It boils down to this: 1. By allowing daytime AM IBOC operation, the FCC is affirming that the current daytime protection rules afford adequate protection against interference from stations running IBOC. 2. On a case by case basis, the nighttime operation of stations can be studied to see if they comply with the daytime protection rules. If they do, then it should be okay for them to go ahead and run IBOC at night. Some background: Most AM allotments provide 0 dB D/U (desired-to-undesired ratio) protection in daytime operation to other stations on 1st adjacent channels (i.e., they can put no more than 0.5 mV/m on the 0.5 mV/m protected contour of the other station). For new allotments since 1991, the protection level has been increased to 6 dB (no more than 0.25 mV/m on protected contours of other stations), and this applies to nighttime operation as well as daytime. According to Clark, standard propagation prediction software can be used to determine whether a given station provides 6 dB D/U protection to all stations on the lower 1st adjacent at night. If it does, then that station can run IBOC at full power on its lower sideband. If it doesn't provide 6 dB protection to all lower 1st adjacent stations, but does provide 0 dB protection, then it can run IBOC on the lower sideband, but at reduced power (6 dB lower). If it can't provide 0 dB protection, then there should be no IBOC transmitted on that sideband. The same argument applies to the upper 1st adjacent. There are then five different possibilities for IBOC operation: 1. Full power on both sidebands 2. Full power on one sideband, reduced power on the other sideband 3. Reduced power on both sidebands 4. Full power on one sideband, no power on the other sideband 5. Reduced power on one sideband, no power on the other sideband Let's consider the last two possibilities first. There are no one-sided modes like this in the AM IBOC specifications, and iBiquity has not submitted any test data for such a mode. The FCC Report & Order on IBOC definitely does not permit one-sided IBOC operation. Moreover, it is highly unlikely that iBiquity would want to see any operation like this, since a one-sided IBOC would be very unrobust and would place IBOC in general in a bad light. As for the other possibilities, we have to go back to the initial premise: is the FCC saying that the current rules are adequate for protection against IBOC interference? I don't think so - the jury is still out. The Report & Order appears to anticipate that there will be interference problems in daytime IBOC operation, and it sets out some procedures to deal with them (power reductions, and possibly turning off IBOC if other solutions can't be found). Furthermore, the evidence provided by iBiquity and the NRSC that IBOC won't cause serious interference problems is less than compelling. Interference tests were done on only four different analog receivers (despite that nonsense from Tom Ray about iBiquity testing all available receivers), which is a ridiculously small sample base to draw any conclusions from. And while it is true that all four receivers performed poorly with 1st adjacent interference at 0 dB D/U with or without IBOC, we don't know how they behaved at 6 dB D/U, since there is no test data for that condition. There were tests at 15 dB D/U, though, that showed significant impact from IBOC on most of the receivers, so that's a good indication that IBOC will cause some major problems in the 0-15 dB range. Another thing that bothers me about the Clark petition is that it ignores 2nd adjacent interference completely, dismissing it with a footnote: "2nd adjacent channel stations are not considered, as 2nd adjacent channel IBOC transmission will not affect receivers with a bandwidth of less than 5 kHz". They claim that most AM receivers fit this description, which is probably true in a sense, but it's a red herring. The fact that a receiver's audio response rolls off below 5 kHz doesn't make it immune to 2nd adjacent channel interference! FCC rules for 2nd adjacents allow 0 dB D/U on a station's 5 mV/m contour. In the lab test results from iBiquity, three out of the four receivers had problems with 2nd adjacent IBOC at 0 dB D/U. So, the potential for 2nd adjacent interference from IBOC can't be ignored. To wind this up, I think the Clark petition is half-baked and should be put aside. The IBOC interference issue is still very much an open question, and much more experience is needed with daytime operation before they open up the nighttime floodgates. Barry -- Barry McLarnon VE3JF Ottawa, ON bdm@bdmcomm.ca ============================================================ There ya go folks! I knew someones light bulbs werent screwed in to tight! Speak an untruth and it will come back to haunt you everytime! Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network _______________________________________________________ From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Dec 19 22:14:51 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: possumhunter@netzero.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Dec 2002 06:14:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 85930 invoked from network); 20 Dec 2002 06:14:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Dec 2002 06:14:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rly-ip05.mx.aol.com) (64.12.138.9) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Dec 2002 06:14:51 -0000 Received: from logs-ti.proxy.aol.com (logs-ti.proxy.aol.com [152.163.194.135]) by rly-ip05.mx.aol.com (v89.10) with ESMTP id RELAYIN10-1220011359; Fri, 20 Dec 2002 01:13:59 1900 Received: from ibm (AC926871.ipt.aol.com [172.146.104.113]) by logs-ti.proxy.aol.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with SMTP id gBK6C6g06995 for ; Fri, 20 Dec 2002 01:12:07 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <00fa01c2a7ee$b318d7c0$a890b498@aoldsl.net> To: References: <12c.1e3b7371.2b340bc2@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Phantom Date: Fri, 20 Dec 2002 01:11:55 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Apparently-From: DodgeRamTrucker@aol.com From: "Possum Hunter" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: > If your buddy needs any updates...I have that 1999 update. I will ask him. > >I cant understand why someone would charge so much for a DOS program Because they can! > > Have you found anything on the warez sites? I've looked for stuff before on those sites. I found hacks and pirate software for all of BSI's stuff. Nothing on the Phantom. Kevin From jon@kenneke.com Thu Dec 19 22:21:44 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jon@kenneke.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Dec 2002 06:21:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 77854 invoked from network); 20 Dec 2002 06:21:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Dec 2002 06:21:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO kenneke.com) (65.103.64.194) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Dec 2002 06:21:44 -0000 Received: from localhost (jon@localhost) by kenneke.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gBK6Lgg26252 for ; Thu, 19 Dec 2002 22:21:42 -0800 Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 22:21:42 -0800 (PST) To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: CC Alfredo Lite transmitters? In-Reply-To: <00fa01c2a7ee$b318d7c0$a890b498@aoldsl.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: jon X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=77819664 X-Yahoo-Profile: jonkenneke (My apologies for being rude about this, but felt it is a good AMSF public message) We run a Part 15 operation (Radio Takena) www.radiotakena.org here in Albany, OR. Our signals are in FM, AM, AM Stereo, and web stream. Being that I like to spread the AMS word, I just gave away and sold every single Alfredo we own (I have to admit, we are now AM mono). So, does any one on the list have any Alfredo lites they would like to sell (Chris???) I've got about 3 Part 15 stations that have indicated interested, plus I'd like to keep several around as spares. It's kinda embarassing to play AMS promo when, at the moment, are not in AMS. Thanks! Jon and Melissa -- Jon Kenneke KA7PGB Kenneke Communications http://www.kenneke.com Radio Takena KTK Listen at: http://www.live365.com/stations/kenneke From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Dec 19 22:22:21 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Dec 2002 06:22:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 78812 invoked from network); 20 Dec 2002 06:22:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Dec 2002 06:22:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m09.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.164) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Dec 2002 06:22:20 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m09.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.b0.317f6f48 (4254) for ; Fri, 20 Dec 2002 01:22:11 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Fri, 20 Dec 2002 01:22:11 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Phantom To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/20/02 1:18:52 AM Eastern Standard Time, possumhunter@netzero.net writes: << I found hacks and pirate software for all of BSI's stuff. Kevin >> Oh really?!?...hmmm! BTW..I'll look into the SDRAM and see what the deal is there...hadnt thought about that. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network _______________________________________________________ From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Dec 19 22:36:55 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Dec 2002 06:36:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 64755 invoked from network); 20 Dec 2002 06:36:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Dec 2002 06:36:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.98) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Dec 2002 06:36:53 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 19 Dec 2002 22:36:53 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Phantom Date: Fri, 20 Dec 2002 01:36:39 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 20 Dec 2002 06:36:53.0371 (UTC) FILETIME=[2F164CB0:01C2A7F2] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.146.104.113] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: > Oh really?!?...hmmm! This is the BEST warez search engine http://www.warezcrawler.net > > BTW..I'll look into the SDRAM and see what the deal is there...hadnt thought about that. I know the Phantom II uses SDRAM. Kevin From jsgil@hal-pc.org Fri Dec 20 00:25:53 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Dec 2002 08:25:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 70246 invoked from network); 20 Dec 2002 08:25:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Dec 2002 08:25:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.75) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Dec 2002 08:25:51 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.137] by n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 20 Dec 2002 08:25:51 -0000 Date: Fri, 20 Dec 2002 08:25:51 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Phantom Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <12c.1e3b7371.2b340bc2@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1023 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.82 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, KC4QLP@a... wrote: I cant understand > why someone would charge so much for a DOS program ....winblows based > automation system I probably could understand part of the high jacked priced. > Have you found anything on the warez sites? I've looked for stuff before on > those sites...gotta watch what you try and download..what you download might > not be as advertised..I've seen may viruses and trojans parked in places like > that. > I once purchased a DOS text editor for $60 long after windows had been on the scene. The big selling point was it was fast, powerful, small and effecient. A very well written program. DOS is much more stable than Windoze and the uptime of most DOS programs is many times greater than Windoze programs. A flashy eye candy GUI isn't everything in a program. In critical situations most people want a program that preforms as expected and doesn't crash and if it is written for DOS you are much better off than a Windoze based program. JSG From jsgil@hal-pc.org Fri Dec 20 00:48:47 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Dec 2002 08:48:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 39977 invoked from network); 20 Dec 2002 08:48:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Dec 2002 08:48:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Dec 2002 08:48:45 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.131] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 20 Dec 2002 08:48:45 -0000 Date: Fri, 20 Dec 2002 08:48:44 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Contour Levels Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 236 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.82 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst After hearing about all this talk about the mV/meter contour levels and looking at several coverave maps on radio-loator.com, what are the levels if applicable to the local(red), distant(purple), fringe(blue) coverage areas? JSG From ccuff@in4web.com Fri Dec 20 00:52:58 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Dec 2002 08:52:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 1113 invoked from network); 20 Dec 2002 08:52:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Dec 2002 08:52:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Dec 2002 08:52:57 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.28]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Fri, 20 Dec 2002 03:47:59 -0500 Message-ID: <007d01c2a803$fbd677a0$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} CC Alfredo Lite transmitters? Date: Fri, 20 Dec 2002 03:44:17 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 I have 100 boards coming in in January. I am only selling these on a one to a customer basis. I said in the beginning that these would be sold on a non-profit basis. I do not sell them to anyone that re-sells them for a profit. My cost to make them is very near $125.00 now, and that is the selling price. As I build them myself, I can control the quality of the transmitters, and help people with interface questions. My boards are still being plated in the USA, at a much higher cost than overseas, but thats the way it is. The waiting list is growing now, and already 45 are "pre-sold". My main focus, right now, is to get a usable radio out to the public. I have 4 different radios working now, with more coming as I think of new ideas. Chris ----- Original Message ----- From: jon From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Dec 20 02:09:08 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Dec 2002 10:09:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 21575 invoked from network); 20 Dec 2002 10:09:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Dec 2002 10:09:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.64) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Dec 2002 10:09:06 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.143] by n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 20 Dec 2002 10:09:05 -0000 Date: Fri, 20 Dec 2002 10:09:05 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Contour Levels Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1110 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.87.44 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > After hearing about all this talk about the mV/meter contour levels > and looking at several coverave maps on radio-loator.com, what are > the levels if applicable to the local(red), distant(purple), > fringe(blue) coverage areas? Keep in mind these are only estimated graphs, but Radio-Locator claims the "local" line is the 2.5 mV/m contour, the "distant" line is the 0.5 mV/m contour, and the "fringe" line is the 0.25 mV/m contour. For all except Class C "Local channel" stations, the 0.5 mV/m contour is the daytime "interference free" coverage area -- i.e. no interference from *other radio stations* should be heard -- and second adjacent channels *are* taken into consideration. For Class C stations, this only extends out the 1.0 mV/m contour (roughly halfway between the red and purple lines on the Radio-Locator maps). During nighttime hours, the "interference free" coverage area for each station can vary widely, but for all except the 50,000-watt Class A stations, the "local" 2.5 mV/m contour on the Radio-Locator maps is a good estimate of useful nighttime groundwave coverage. From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Dec 20 06:35:47 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Dec 2002 14:35:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 33022 invoked from network); 20 Dec 2002 14:35:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Dec 2002 14:35:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Dec 2002 14:35:28 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-160.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.160]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gBKEZOOd016271 for ; Fri, 20 Dec 2002 08:35:26 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <001101c2a835$0eead800$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <007c01c2a7ae$678c6f00$827dfea9@home1> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fw: Nautel ND1 Date: Fri, 20 Dec 2002 08:35:32 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude If you do decide to go with the BE, be sure to get the optional output tuning and loading network. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Possum Hunter" > I do like that BE. The idea of having it mount in my 19" rack is very > attractive, and with the built in C-QUAM card, I just dont think I can > loose. From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Dec 20 07:10:06 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Dec 2002 15:10:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 69756 invoked from network); 20 Dec 2002 15:10:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Dec 2002 15:10:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Dec 2002 15:10:05 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-160.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.160]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gBKFA2Od026493 for ; Fri, 20 Dec 2002 09:10:03 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <003f01c2a839$e53d5780$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <20021220034744.50984.qmail@web14008.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Tower Violations Was: Gates BC1E Date: Fri, 20 Dec 2002 09:10:10 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude What a mess! I take it all of his stations are like that? What denomination is the "good Bishop?" My guess is AME. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ernest Jones" > hehe, heres WBXB, just for kicks > From philipr@irac.pe.ca Fri Dec 20 08:08:10 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Dec 2002 16:08:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 65344 invoked from network); 20 Dec 2002 16:08:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Dec 2002 16:08:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Dec 2002 16:08:09 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.135] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 20 Dec 2002 16:08:08 -0000 Date: Fri, 20 Dec 2002 16:08:04 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} CC Alfredo Lite transmitters? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <007d01c2a803$fbd677a0$0101a8c0@pavilion> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2341 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Christopher Cuff" wrote in part: > The waiting list is growing now, and already 45 are "pre-sold". > My main focus, right now, is to get a usable radio out to the public. > I have 4 different radios working now, with more coming as I think of new > ideas. > Chris Folks, the AM stereo business is undergoing its rebirth! It could be that IBOC is the best thing to happen to AM Stereo! IBOC is attracting interest to AM, yet the test results to date are making a lot of people "baulk" or "balk" [thank you microsoft bookshelf]. We have new AM Stereo stations going on the air, old ones returning to music, heavy ebay activity, Chris wearing out soldering irons, people like yours truly finally with AM Stereo radios. 2002 has been a turn around year for AM Stereo. Consumer IBOC receivers may never hit the market, as for every delay, interest in AM Stereo keeps rising. Thanks to ebay, a lot of old AM Stereo radios, especially car radios, are finding new homes or cars. And, affordable wideband radios seem to have become available - not just GE SR IIIs and Realistic clones, but the Memorex ball, the $5 Lennox Sound. I'd argue that there are a lot more affordable wideband, or semi wide band radios on the market now than 5 years ago. As the FM band keeps getting more crowded, as DAB receivers are too pricey, I'm hoping that we'll have soon reached the bottom of the AM to FM flipping frenzy here in Canada, and that 2003 will be the begining [albeit slow at first] of an AM, and AM stereo, rebirth here in Canada. There are a lot of nice, rather open frequencies here now! Don't get any ideas though - there is an 80% ownership requirement, which is why we are a clear channel free zone, except for all those satellite fed syndicated programms. Yikes, speaking of syndicated programs more generally, I just remembered, Christmas Eve Mickey Mouse, Goofy and Company seize control of Magic 93 ... if I want to listen to Mickey and Goofy, I'll tune in 1560 in good old NYC, though I'd rather listen to 1680 WTTM! Maybe I'll try 1480 and WGFY to listen to Goofy's own signature station, if the ether cooperates!!! [yep, I like those call letters too]. Phil R. P.S. Left Channel - "Merry Christmas" Right Channel - "Happy Holidays" From philipr@irac.pe.ca Fri Dec 20 08:11:13 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Dec 2002 16:11:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 78660 invoked from network); 20 Dec 2002 16:11:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Dec 2002 16:11:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Dec 2002 16:11:13 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.170] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 20 Dec 2002 16:11:13 -0000 Date: Fri, 20 Dec 2002 16:11:12 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: CJLS and CJFX Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 723 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking Yes, the FCC and the CRTC are very, very different! The CRTC really regulates things, not near as much as they used to, but still a lot of regulation! It may be frustrating at times, but there are definite pluses to regulation too. Phil R. --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Possum Hunter" wrote: > philipr@i... wrote: > >Yarmouth NS, with a population of 8000 people, is a one station market. I > don't think the CRTC would ever license a second station there. There is > enough market for one station to make a decent income. > > That sure never stopped the FCC from letting corporate radio owners put > anything and everything on the air here in the Greenville market! > > Kevin From groucho@skyweb.net Fri Dec 20 10:13:20 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Dec 2002 18:13:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 37702 invoked from network); 20 Dec 2002 18:13:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Dec 2002 18:13:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Dec 2002 18:13:18 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gBKIJC4Q039804 for ; Fri, 20 Dec 2002 13:19:13 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3E035CBA.3A448B01@skyweb.net> Date: Fri, 20 Dec 2002 13:08:59 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} CC Alfredo Lite transmitters? References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Well If you listen in at night after 11pm to 6am when the Automation is Running You will Hear a mixture of South Asian and christmas Programming.. I added Over 150 christmas songs to the Night automation. Listen and Enjoy I am Planning a DX test for January 2003. with regular American Music Programming between CW ID's. so if you know some really good Stereo separation Music. and would Like me to play It.. Contact Me off list so I can tell you where to Upload the MP3. since I have No American Music at the station. You guys seem to know all the Old good stuff to play.. You send It.. I'll play It during the Test. Neal Newman "Phil Rafuse " wrote: > for all those satellite fed syndicated programms. Yikes, speaking > of syndicated programs more generally, I just remembered, Christmas > Eve Mickey Mouse, Goofy and Company seize control of Magic 93 ... if > I want to listen to Mickey and Goofy, I'll tune in 1560 in good old > NYC, though I'd rather listen to 1680 WTTM! > > Maybe I'll try 1480 and WGFY to listen to Goofy's own signature > station, if the ether cooperates!!! [yep, I like those call letters > too]. > > Phil R. > > P.S. > > Left Channel - "Merry Christmas" > Right Channel - "Happy Holidays" > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From jwelton@nautel.com Fri Dec 20 12:25:19 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jwelton@nautel.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Dec 2002 20:25:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 49271 invoked from network); 20 Dec 2002 20:25:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Dec 2002 20:25:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailserver.nautel.com) (24.222.25.85) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Dec 2002 20:25:17 -0000 Received: FROM jeff-welton BY mailserver.nautel.com ; Fri Dec 20 16:25:12 2002 -0400 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Date: Fri, 20 Dec 2002 16:22:38 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fw: Nautel ND1 Message-ID: <3E0343C5.31482.1757A9D@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.02a) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body From: "Jeff Welton" Reply-To: jwelton@nautel.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=26918678 To save time, I'm going to condense replies to several emails into one (long- winded) response. Please be patient! Kevin (Possum) wrote: > >"Note that the ND1 transmitters are IBOC compatible, and as such, are no > longer compatible for AM Stereo, due to the differing technical > requirements." > > Hmmm That is funny because BE comes with the C-QUAM card in it AND it is > IBOC compatible! What would make this transmitter not compatible with > C-QUAM? The big reason, as I recall, is due to the requirement for external RF input from the IBOC exciter. When we make a stereo transmitter, there is no mono oscillator installed, thus no way to connect an external (read IBOC) exciter. If you ordered the mono transmitter, you could connect either an external IBOC exciter or an external C-QUAM exciter. However, since company policy was to go with IBOC, the sales guys aren't permitted to quote a transmitter that isn't ready to connect the Ibiquity exciter, thus no stereo boards are being quoted. Then, Kevin T. wrote: > I'm hoping that's just their very poorly worded way of saying that > you can't transmit IBOC and C-Quam at the same time. This is true, and because of this, they decided they were no longer able to quote the C-QUAM exciter - see reasoning above. As I mentioned earlier, the mono transmitter is ready for C-QUAM, but the board would have to be ordered separately - and I'm not sure if the sales guys would quote it or not, although I know Customer Service will, on request. Then Scott said: > I seem to remember a similar thread over a year ago, and Jeff said the > sales droids (my term) didn't know what they were talking about in that > regard. They are well informed on what they can and can't quote, but not necessarily on the specific reasons. They are correct in saying that an IBOC compatible ND1 is not compatible for AM Stereo, in that an IBOC transmitter will have a mono oscillator with external RF input - this is not available on the C-QUAM board provided with stereo transmitters. Possum (responding to Kevin T.) came back with: > Perhaps, but you would think that the letter I sent them would be quite > clear that I wanted a C-QUAM transmitter. True, and this is one of those management decisions that I don't necessarily have to agree with, just follow. The word is we don't quote C-QUAM on new builds anymore. Like I said, I don't have to like or agree with it, just try to find ways to work around it! Finally, Kevin summed it up with: > How do you buy an AM Stereo transmitter from a company that makes them, > but their sales staff thinks they are no longer made? > > I do like that BE. The idea of having it mount in my 19" rack is very > attractive, and with the built in C-QUAM card, I just dont think I can > loose. As stated, effectively, we do not make AM stereo transmitters anymore. As much as it pains me to say it, the BE is a nice box and if they still offer it with C-QUAM, I can't see where you have much of a choice, unless you can swing the budget to go with ours and an external exciter, such as the Delta ASE-2. Jeff Welton Nautel Customer Service Dept. Tel.: 1-902-823-3900 ext. 127 Fax: 1-902-823-3183 email: jwelton@nautel.com From jwelton@nautel.com Fri Dec 20 12:34:12 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jwelton@nautel.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Dec 2002 20:34:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 9696 invoked from network); 20 Dec 2002 20:34:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Dec 2002 20:34:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailserver.nautel.com) (24.222.25.85) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Dec 2002 20:34:12 -0000 Received: FROM jeff-welton BY mailserver.nautel.com ; Fri Dec 20 16:34:07 2002 -0400 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Date: Fri, 20 Dec 2002 16:31:33 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fw: Nautel ND1 Message-ID: <3E0345DC.9618.17DA543@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: <3E0343C5.31482.1757A9D@localhost> References: X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.02a) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body From: "Jeff Welton" Reply-To: jwelton@nautel.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=26918678 > As stated, effectively, we do not make AM stereo transmitters anymore. Further to this, I mentioned the thread to our Customer Service Manager, who is also president of our Bangor office, as well as being on the board of directors for both facilities. He was quite unaware that we are no longer providing AM Stereo and is going to look into the reasoning behind it for me. I'll let you know what we discover, although I'm going on vacation for a couple of weeks, so it will probably be after Jan. 6/03 when I get back with the answer. Best Regards, Jeff Welton Nautel Customer Service Dept. Tel.: 1-902-823-3900 ext. 127 Fax: 1-902-823-3183 email: jwelton@nautel.com From possumhunter@netzero.net Fri Dec 20 14:16:17 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Dec 2002 22:16:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 33497 invoked from network); 20 Dec 2002 22:16:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Dec 2002 22:16:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.94) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Dec 2002 22:16:16 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 20 Dec 2002 14:16:16 -0800 To: References: <3E0343C5.31482.1757A9D@localhost> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fw: Nautel ND1 Date: Fri, 20 Dec 2002 17:15:59 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 20 Dec 2002 22:16:16.0708 (UTC) FILETIME=[6A410040:01C2A875] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.159.196.84] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Jeff Welton wrote: >since company policy was to go with IBOC, the sales guys aren't permitted to quote a transmitter that isn't ready to connect the Ibiquity exciter, thus no stereo boards are being quoted. Since IBOC is only licensed in the United States, Would they quote me a Canadian Spec ND1 with a Stereo board? It sure does not make ANY business sense to loose a sale because you refuse to sell a transmitter that is not IBOC compatible. What happened to "The Customer Is Always Right"? It makes zero sense for a radio station to buy a IBOC ready transmitter to support a format that not one single person can hear! > > As stated, effectively, we do not make AM stereo transmitters anymore. As much as it pains me to say it, the BE is a nice box and if they still offer it with > C-QUAM, I can't see where you have much of a choice, unless you can swing the budget to go with ours and an external exciter, such as the Delta ASE-2. We would certainly accept a bid for a ND1 and an external C-Quam exciter, but it would have to be in the $12,100 US price range (The price of a Stereo BE). Chances are the winning bidder for the WFIS transmitter will also get the contract for 2 other 1KW AM Stereo transmitters when we buy one station and LMA another....Then there is the little station that I am buying. Kevin. From ccuff@in4web.com Fri Dec 20 15:20:42 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Dec 2002 23:20:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 354 invoked from network); 20 Dec 2002 23:20:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Dec 2002 23:20:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Dec 2002 23:20:35 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.86]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Fri, 20 Dec 2002 18:15:37 -0500 Message-ID: <005701c2a87d$308fbd20$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: <002d01c2a7b4$cb445480$0101a8c0@pavilion> <000701c2a7c4$bce75120$827dfea9@home1> Subject: Re: {AMSF} new radios Date: Fri, 20 Dec 2002 18:11:54 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 It's not the cost of the parts- it is the time to do it as well. The decoders, thankfully, are easy to make- The decoders afford me a $5 profit, which is really just a token amount. I can't do "everthing" for free.. :-) I will be all out of MC13028's soon, (Right now, I am down to 30 chips)and will have to get more. I have to buy 500 minimum at a time and at this time of year, its a cost I cant shoulder. After the beginning of the year, I will buy more. The other problem is the 3,6 resonator- discontinued by Murata, but these will work with the very available 3.58 reasonator, except that for 455 khz IF's, they wont work as it is too far off. Thankfully, I have a good supply of TA8124's, and one of my new radios is using that. I took a Aiwa CSDMR1, that was made for this chip, and breadboarded the radio part, and it works extremely well. The front end will be the $5 walmart radio, so the whole thing will be afordable. CC From: Scott Todd To: Sent: Thursday, December 19, 2002 8:11 PM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fw: New AM Stereo Radio Station > This is GREAT news. Thanks for sending it our way. While I'm here, there'a > a question I've been meaning to ask but couldn't seem to remember to til > now. How big a quantity would we have to start making decoders for the > prices to drop appreciably? I don't doubt for a minute that you're sinking > $25 into each now, but what would it take for even a $5 drop? > > Scott Todd From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Dec 20 16:21:55 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Dec 2002 00:21:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 4125 invoked from network); 21 Dec 2002 00:21:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Dec 2002 00:21:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Dec 2002 00:21:54 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.136] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 21 Dec 2002 00:21:54 -0000 Date: Sat, 21 Dec 2002 00:21:53 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Fw: Nautel ND1 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 556 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.84.17 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > It sure does not make ANY business sense to loose a sale because > you refuse to sell a transmitter that is not IBOC compatible. Sorry for the interruption, but the correct usage of this word is one of my pet peeves: "loose" = (adj.) not tight ...rhymes with "caboose" "lose" = (verb) to no longer have ...rhymes with "fuse" I.e.: "You must have a screw loose in your head to lose a sale..." Again, sorry for being so picky, but this, along with using "alot" (not a word) to mean "a lot" (many/much of), is one of my biggest grammar annoyances. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Dec 20 16:40:45 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Dec 2002 00:40:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 87059 invoked from network); 21 Dec 2002 00:40:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Dec 2002 00:40:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.83) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Dec 2002 00:40:44 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.250] by n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 21 Dec 2002 00:40:44 -0000 Date: Sat, 21 Dec 2002 00:40:42 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: CBS Audimax + AM Stereo? Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1400 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.84.17 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics I am thinking of purchasing the following classic CBS Audimax 4450 stereo audio processor for use with my "Alfredo Lite" low-power AM Stereo transmitter. Any thoughts on how this would work out? http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=930599136 I know this unit was probably oriented towards use with FM Stereo stations, but my goal is to produce an FM-quality (at least) signal, and unlicensed Part 15 stations aren't bound to the NRSC bandwidth regulation. When retransmitting the audio of a local FM Stereo station on my "Alfredo Lite", it sounds excellent, as it should be when I am "borrowing" the results of that station's expensive Optimod or Omnia processor! Of course, the Audimax is crude in comparison, but I actually prefer a bit of a vintage single-band-compression sound, especially on AM. My other question is, what was the real difference between the Audimax and the Volumax? I've heard of many stations which used both in their audio chain, so I'm assuming they somehow complement each other -- but will an Audimax just by itself also get the job done? Also, are there any stations -- AM or FM -- that are known to still be using Audimax and/or Volumax processing? I heard that 1010 WINS in NYC is using "vintage" audio processing along these lines, and they do sound different than the other (mono) AM news/talk stations, but I'm not 100% sure. From possumhunter@netzero.net Fri Dec 20 17:35:17 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Dec 2002 01:35:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 72179 invoked from network); 21 Dec 2002 01:35:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Dec 2002 01:35:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.120) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Dec 2002 01:35:17 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 20 Dec 2002 17:35:17 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} CBS Audimax + AM Stereo? Date: Fri, 20 Dec 2002 20:35:00 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 21 Dec 2002 01:35:17.0357 (UTC) FILETIME=[376F71D0:01C2A891] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.152.133.104] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 kevtronics@yahoo.com wrote: > I am thinking of purchasing the following classic CBS Audimax 4450 stereo audio processor for use with my "Alfredo Lite" low-power AM Stereo transmitter. Any thoughts on how this would work out? With no peak limiting, it will not be as loud as other stations and may over modulate on the peaks. > > I actually prefer a bit of a vintage single-band-compression sound, especially on AM. I do like the sound of my Level Devil. > > My other question is, what was the real difference between the Audimax and the Volumax? The Audimax is just an AGC and the Volumax is just a peak limiter. They were made to work together. > > Also, are there any stations -- AM or FM -- that are known to still be using Audimax and/or Volumax processing? I *THINK* WASC 1530 in Spartanburg, SC is still using it. Kevin From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Dec 20 19:10:31 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Dec 2002 03:10:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 53736 invoked from network); 21 Dec 2002 03:10:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Dec 2002 03:10:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.64) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Dec 2002 03:10:31 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.131] by n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 21 Dec 2002 03:10:31 -0000 Date: Sat, 21 Dec 2002 03:10:29 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Ramsey's transmitter Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1158 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.84.17 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics This has nothing to do with AM Stereo but I just found it a bit coincidental... I recently was the winning bidder for this low-power FM Stereo tranmsitter on eBay: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1944321347 When it came time to send out payment, eBay identified the seller as "John Ramsey" of Mendon, NY. Now, there's Ramsey Electronics -- makers of various AM and FM transmitter kits -- run by a fellow also named John Ramsey. And, sure enough, Ramsey Electronics is based in Victor, NY -- just about 7 miles away from Mendon. Now, I'm no conspiracy theorist, but I just thought it was a bit strange that Mr. Ramsey would be selling an FM transmitter on eBay that is not made by his own company, and giving it a fair amount of praise in the write-up -- including mentioning that it "Does not use the crummy Rohm [FM Stereo generator] chip that everyone gripes about". Hmm... last time I checked, most of Ramsey Electronics' transmitters use this "crummy" chip. So it's nice to know Mr. Ramsey believes in the quality of his own company's products! What's next... Leonard Kahn selling a C-Quam exciter on eBay? LOL! From fanfare@globility.com Fri Dec 20 19:21:34 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Dec 2002 03:21:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 24267 invoked from network); 21 Dec 2002 03:21:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Dec 2002 03:21:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.eol.ca) (205.189.151.1) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Dec 2002 03:21:33 -0000 Received: from FAN--MCS (dynamic-b1-120.highspeed.eol.ca [64.56.233.120]) by mail.eol.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 67F2B87042 for ; Fri, 20 Dec 2002 22:21:32 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <200212202221240264.0091BFE3@mail.globility.com> In-Reply-To: References: X-Mailer: Calypso Version 3.30.00.00 (4) Date: Fri, 20 Dec 2002 22:21:24 -0500 To: "Kevin Tekel" Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Fw: Nautel ND1 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable From: "Marv Southcott" Reply-To: fanfare@globility.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy Actually, that is one of the most often mispelled words in common usage tod= ay. IMHO, whatever body decided that "looze" should not be the correct way = to spell what we now spell "lose" was not a particularly insightful to star= t with. Perhaps it is the same group that said you must not begin or end a = sentence with preposition.=20 Which reminds me of a famous episode of Designing Women wherein Dixie Carte= r recalled the following conversation. On being introduced to the visiting sister-in-law of a friend, she asked, "= Where in the east are you from?" to which the lady replied. "Where I come f= rom, we do not end our sentences with a preposition." To which Dixie was sa= id to reply "My apologies. Let me rephrase. Where in the east are you from,= bitch!" Cheers, Marv *********** REPLY SEPARATOR *********** On 12/21/2002 at 12:21 AM Kevin T. wrote: >> It sure does not make ANY business sense to loose a sale because >> you refuse to sell a transmitter that is not IBOC compatible. > >Sorry for the interruption, but the correct usage of this word is one=20 >of my pet peeves: > >"loose" =3D (adj.) not tight ...rhymes with "caboose" >"lose" =3D (verb) to no longer have ...rhymes with "fuse" > >I.e.: > >"You must have a screw loose in your head to lose a sale..." > >Again, sorry for being so picky, but this, along with using "alot"=20 >(not a word) to mean "a lot" (many/much of), is one of my biggest=20 >grammar annoyances. > > > >Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum=20 > >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From possumhunter@netzero.net Fri Dec 20 20:25:44 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Dec 2002 04:25:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 36103 invoked from network); 21 Dec 2002 04:25:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Dec 2002 04:25:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.41) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Dec 2002 04:25:44 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 20 Dec 2002 20:25:44 -0800 To: References: <20021220034744.50984.qmail@web14008.mail.yahoo.com> <003f01c2a839$e53d5780$827dfea9@home1> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Tower Violations Was: Gates BC1E Date: Fri, 20 Dec 2002 23:25:30 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 21 Dec 2002 04:25:44.0406 (UTC) FILETIME=[073B4760:01C2A8A9] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.167.234.240] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Ernest Jones wrote: > hehe, heres WBXB, just for kicks If you think that one is bad, I need to take you on a radio tour of South Carolina! Junk holes like WCKI, WPCC, WCCP, WPJM, WANS, WCRS AM & FM, WLBG, and WLMA all make this station look like a first class operation! What is sad is to see WCRS 1450 in this condition. Just a few years ago when Charlie Sparks was engineering, the station was in perfect condition, and that RCA BTA1S with Kahn processing made it the best sounding station on the dial. I fell in love with RCA Transmitters because of sound from his BTA1S. Now, WCRS is just another muffled up automated Southern Gospel station running on flat tubes with RFI in the audio chain :-( Kevin From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Dec 20 20:46:37 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Dec 2002 04:46:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 39180 invoked from network); 21 Dec 2002 04:46:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Dec 2002 04:46:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Dec 2002 04:46:37 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.156] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 21 Dec 2002 04:46:37 -0000 Date: Sat, 21 Dec 2002 04:46:35 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Fw: Nautel ND1 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <200212202221240264.0091BFE3@mail.globility.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1295 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.84.17 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > On being introduced to the visiting sister-in-law of a friend, she > asked, "Where in the east are you from?" to which the lady replied. > "Where I come from, we do not end our sentences with a > preposition." > To which Dixie was said to reply "My apologies. Let me rephrase. > Where in the east are you from, bitch!" A variant of this appears in the FAQ for the newsgroup "alt.english.usage": "Excuse me, where is the library at?" "Here at Hahvahd, we never end a sentence with a preposition." "Okay... Excuse me, where is the library at, a**hole?" If you have a LOT of time to kill, this makes for interesting reading: http://www.english-usage.com/faq.html And to make this discussion about seemingly trivial language usage distinctions at least a little relevant... when I first started discussing AM Stereo on CompuServe and the Internet, everybody pretty much called it "AM stereo". I always made it a point to capitalize the S in "Stereo", and that usage seems to have slowly but surely caught on amongst AM Stereo enthusiasts. Similarly, I prefer "C-Quam" over "C-QUAM", because that makes its more clear that it should be pronounced phonetically, rather than as individual letters. (Although even Motorola can't seem to make up their mind which form is correct!) From evergreenterrace@buzzle.com Fri Dec 20 21:37:06 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: evergreenterrace@buzzle.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Dec 2002 05:37:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 67579 invoked from network); 21 Dec 2002 05:37:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Dec 2002 05:37:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Dec 2002 05:37:05 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.253] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 21 Dec 2002 05:37:05 -0000 Date: Sat, 21 Dec 2002 05:37:03 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: CBS Audimax + AM Stereo? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1321 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgliradio " X-Originating-IP: 129.44.32.153 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=69711087 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgliradio --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: > I am thinking of purchasing the following classic CBS Audimax 4450 > stereo audio processor for use with my "Alfredo Lite" low-power > AM Stereo transmitter. Any thoughts on how this would work out? > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=930599136 > It's more of an AGC than a limiter. It does tend to get pumpy but, if used with the right release times (I belive resistors need to be changed, get your hands on a manual to do this) it can make up gain quite well. > > My other question is, what was the real difference between the > Audimax and the Volumax? I've heard of many stations which used both > in their audio chain, so I'm assuming they somehow complement each > other -- but will an Audimax just by itself also get the job done? The Audimax was the AGC, the Volumax is a peak limiter. > > Also, are there any stations -- AM or FM -- that are known to still > be using Audimax and/or Volumax processing? I heard that 1010 WINS > in NYC is using "vintage" audio processing along these lines, and > they do sound different than the other (mono) AM news/talk stations, > but I'm not 100% sure. The "vintage" gear at WINS is an Optimod 9100 tuned by engineers with good ears. From possumhunter@netzero.net Fri Dec 20 21:38:44 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: possumhunter@netzero.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Dec 2002 05:38:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 35159 invoked from network); 21 Dec 2002 05:38:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Dec 2002 05:38:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rly-ip05.mx.aol.com) (64.12.138.9) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Dec 2002 05:38:44 -0000 Received: from logs-mtc-tc.proxy.aol.com (logs-mtc-tc.proxy.aol.com [64.12.105.135]) by rly-ip05.mx.aol.com (v89.10) with ESMTP id RELAYIN4-1221003802; Sat, 21 Dec 2002 00:38:02 1900 Received: from ibm (ACA7EAF0.ipt.aol.com [172.167.234.240]) by logs-mtc-tc.proxy.aol.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with SMTP id gBL5a3o04621 for ; Sat, 21 Dec 2002 00:36:04 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <008001c2a8b2$d416bc20$f0eaa7ac@aoldsl.net> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} CBS Audimax + AM Stereo? Date: Sat, 21 Dec 2002 00:35:51 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Apparently-From: DodgeRamTrucker@aol.com From: "Possum Hunter" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 kevtronics@yahoo.com> >are there any stations -- AM or FM -- that are known to still be using Audimax and/or Volumax processing? I heard that 1010 WINS in NYC is using "vintage" audio processing along these lines, and they do sound different than the other (mono) AM news/talk stations, but I'm not 100% sure. If you want to hear what vintage processing sounds like, I have my RCA cranked up. I am driving it with a tube type Gates Level Devil. I can make a MP3 of it. The ole bugger sounds sweet listening on my RCA "SuperBrain" console! Kevin From jsgil@hal-pc.org Fri Dec 20 22:30:42 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Dec 2002 06:30:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 61202 invoked from network); 21 Dec 2002 06:30:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Dec 2002 06:30:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.68) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Dec 2002 06:30:41 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.190] by n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 21 Dec 2002 06:30:41 -0000 Date: Sat, 21 Dec 2002 06:30:41 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: OT: Compressed Audio Damages Hearing Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 138 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.214 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst Slightly off topic but saw this link on slashdot http://www.informatik.fh-hamburg.de/~windle_c/Logologie/MP3-Gefahr/MP3-risk.html JSG From e92fmjamz@yahoo.com Sat Dec 21 04:28:49 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: e92fmjamz@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Dec 2002 12:28:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 7364 invoked from network); 21 Dec 2002 12:28:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Dec 2002 12:28:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14006.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.175.122) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Dec 2002 12:28:48 -0000 Message-ID: <20021221122848.96296.qmail@web14006.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [208.6.34.86] by web14006.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 21 Dec 2002 04:28:48 PST Date: Sat, 21 Dec 2002 04:28:48 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: CBS Audimax + AM Stereo? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: Ernest Jones X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=24963319 X-Yahoo-Profile: e92fmjamz WRCS Ahoskie NC is using a CBS Audimax Volumax setup (version III i believe) it has a tendency to very pumpy with kindof bassy music, theres two sets there, one set for FM stereo, and one for AM. both units allow FULL fidelity through..no filters to speak of, one had to be added externally for WRCS to be compliant. and a kahn symetra-peak (helped kill some of the pumping and bring overall modulation up) was put back in service two nights ago from our engineer...he's around this group somewhere..teehee --- "wgliradio " wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. > " > wrote: > > I am thinking of purchasing the following classic > CBS Audimax 4450 > > stereo audio processor for use with my "Alfredo > Lite" low-power > > AM Stereo transmitter. Any thoughts on how this > would work out? > > > > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=930599136 > > > > It's more of an AGC than a limiter. It does tend to > get pumpy but, > if used with the right release times (I belive > resistors need to be > changed, get your hands on a manual to do this) it > can make up gain > quite well. > > > > > > My other question is, what was the real difference > between the > > Audimax and the Volumax? I've heard of many > stations which used > both > > in their audio chain, so I'm assuming they somehow > complement each > > other -- but will an Audimax just by itself also > get the job done? > > The Audimax was the AGC, the Volumax is a peak > limiter. > > > > Also, are there any stations -- AM or FM -- that > are known to still > > be using Audimax and/or Volumax processing? I > heard that 1010 WINS > > in NYC is using "vintage" audio processing along > these lines, and > > they do sound different than the other (mono) AM > news/talk > stations, > > but I'm not 100% sure. > > The "vintage" gear at WINS is an Optimod 9100 tuned > by engineers with > good ears. > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > ===== Ernest, Gates NC, USA WRCS 970 AM Ahoskie NC, Announcer,webmaster http://wrcs.cjb.net WQDK 99.3 FM Ahoskie NC, Fill in ------contact me-------- AIM: e92fmjamz2000 ICQ: 33155469 Yahoo: e92fmjamz __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From KC4QLP@aol.com Sat Dec 21 15:33:40 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Dec 2002 23:33:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 44620 invoked from network); 21 Dec 2002 23:33:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Dec 2002 23:33:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r10.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.106) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Dec 2002 23:33:39 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r10.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.bc.3141ba14 (30960); Sat, 21 Dec 2002 18:33:33 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Sat, 21 Dec 2002 18:33:33 EST Subject: Check out AM IBOC Test Data Report To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Cc: KC4QLP@aol.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Click here: AM IBOC Test Data Report http://www.nab.org/SciTech/amiboctestdata.asp Well well!..look at what someone found and pointed me to the site! Interesting enough the iBiquity report which is the first item listed is MISSING! Enjoy! Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network _______________________________________________________ From oldphones@webtv.net Sat Dec 21 15:45:29 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: oldphones@webtv.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Dec 2002 23:45:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 54479 invoked from network); 21 Dec 2002 23:45:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Dec 2002 23:45:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO smtpout-2001-3.public.lawson.webtv.net) (209.240.212.83) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Dec 2002 23:45:28 -0000 Received: from storefull-2117.public.lawson.webtv.net (lawson-public-ipmux-1-pip-1.public.lawson.webtv.net [209.240.212.22]) by smtpout-2001-3.public.lawson.webtv.net (WebTV_Postfix+sws) with ESMTP id 3A9B4BFC5; Sat, 21 Dec 2002 15:45:27 -0800 (PST) Received: (from production@localhost) by storefull-2117.public.lawson.webtv.net (8.8.8-wtv-f/mt.gso.26Feb98) id PAA20407; Sat, 21 Dec 2002 15:45:28 -0800 (PST) X-WebTV-Signature: 1 ETAsAhRHIxaUDx7rM4uEYPEDLc8Ox7J6yQIUe/Da/FXYRbkf2boFAOIeHuA6teY= Date: Sat, 21 Dec 2002 17:45:28 -0600 (CST) To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Cc: oldphones1@aol.com Subject: Fwd: Re: {AMSF} Changes Message-ID: <16723-3E04FD18-480@storefull-2117.public.lawson.webtv.net> Content-Disposition: Inline MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) X-eGroups-From: oldphones@webtv.net (oldphones) From: oldphones@webtv.net X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38022783 X-Yahoo-Profile: oldphones1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year to everyone on the AM Stereo forum , Please see the attached e-mail about MAJOR changes at my job and the LOSS of our service department! William P. Snyder Oldphones@ webtv. net (402) 593-6841 I Specialize in AM Stereo radios, collectable telephones, parts, and wiring items http://community.webtv.net/oldphones/OldPhonesRadiosPage [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From oldphones@webtv.net Sat Dec 21 15:49:01 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: oldphones@webtv.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Dec 2002 23:49:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 76224 invoked from network); 21 Dec 2002 23:49:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Dec 2002 23:49:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO smtpout-2001-3.public.lawson.webtv.net) (209.240.212.83) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Dec 2002 23:49:00 -0000 Received: from storefull-2117.public.lawson.webtv.net (lawson-public-ipmux-1-pip-1.public.lawson.webtv.net [209.240.212.22]) by smtpout-2001-3.public.lawson.webtv.net (WebTV_Postfix+sws) with ESMTP id 3D987BE27 for ; Sat, 21 Dec 2002 15:48:59 -0800 (PST) Received: (from production@localhost) by storefull-2117.public.lawson.webtv.net (8.8.8-wtv-f/mt.gso.26Feb98) id PAA20544; Sat, 21 Dec 2002 15:49:00 -0800 (PST) X-WebTV-Signature: 1 ETAsAhQsnTh8fl/af1ltdVDseYXvCEa/UgIUGf4l574hRimcj5Fh5+zAQJZ6uM4= Date: Sat, 21 Dec 2002 17:49:00 -0600 (CST) To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Digest Number 475 Message-ID: <16718-3E04FDEC-1870@storefull-2117.public.lawson.webtv.net> In-Reply-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com's message of 9 Dec 2002 15:33:28 -0000 Content-Disposition: Inline Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) X-eGroups-From: oldphones@webtv.net (oldphones) From: oldphones@webtv.net X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38022783 X-Yahoo-Profile: oldphones1 TEST This is a test to see if e-mail is bouncing William P. Snyder Oldphones@ webtv. net (402) 593-6841 I Specialize in AM Stereo radios, collectable telephones, parts, and wiring items http://community.webtv.net/oldphones/OldPhonesRadiosPage From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Dec 21 16:56:26 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Dec 2002 00:56:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 440 invoked from network); 22 Dec 2002 00:56:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Dec 2002 00:56:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Dec 2002 00:56:25 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.164] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 22 Dec 2002 00:56:25 -0000 Date: Sun, 22 Dec 2002 00:56:24 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Check out AM IBOC Test Data Report Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 385 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.89.130 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > http://www.nab.org/SciTech/amiboctestdata.asp Now I know why I heard the IBOC test station on 1700 kHz in NJ playing "Man! I Feel Like a Woman" by Shania Twain over and over and over again... this is no joke... they call it the "Shania Twain Interferer", or "STI", and it is used as part of IBOC's official testing procedure. More info on this is in Appendix H of the report. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Dec 21 17:34:35 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Dec 2002 01:34:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 89684 invoked from network); 22 Dec 2002 01:34:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Dec 2002 01:34:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Dec 2002 01:34:35 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.170] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 22 Dec 2002 01:34:34 -0000 Date: Sun, 22 Dec 2002 01:34:33 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: CBS Audimax + AM Stereo? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20021221122848.96296.qmail@web14006.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2319 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.89.130 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > WRCS Ahoskie NC is using a CBS Audimax Volumax setup (version III i > believe) it has a tendency to very pumpy with kindof bassy music I've found that in some cases, it's actually the *receiver* that generates the "pumping" effect. For example, one of my local mono AM stations uses home-brew processing together with a vintage Gates "Solid Statesman" limiter, and on some radios they "pump" a lot, but on other radios, they sound perfectly fine. This is because their processing lets through stronger bass "thumps" than what you get from a typical Optimod, and if the receiver's AGC (Auto Gain Control) is too fast-acting, it will "respond" to these audio pulses and cause the volume-"pumping" effect. But if the radio's AGC has a slower reaction time, it won't react to each audio pulse by cutting down the gain. This is less of a problem with most of today's music, which is already highly processed right on the original CD's. Unlike analog recording media, digital audio has an absolute "brick wall" volume limit; if you try to exceed this, the audio waveform gets harshly clipped into a near-square-wave. Since bass tones carry the greatest energy and have the largest waveforms, if you want to maintain a higher overall volume level of the music (as all of today's music producers seem to want), you have no choice but to cut down on the level of the bass tones, or else they will be really clipped to death and sound badly distorted. This affects both new recordings as well as "digitally remastered" versions of old music, which are also falling prey to this excessive processing, in order to "compete" with the consistently high volume level of modern music. So, if you've bought a new CD of an old favorite album, or perhaps a "Greatest Hits" collection, and found that the music is too consistently LOUD and just lacks the "oomph" of the original versions, you're right! LP enthusiasts have always claimed that vinyl sounds better than CDs... and now they just have even more evidence on their side, as in many cases, the original LP -- or even a good Chrome or Metal cassette with Dolby NR -- will *undisputably* have greater dynamic range than a modern CD version. Here's one good example of this trend: http://personal.inet.fi/private/ms99/RoxyMusicAvalon.html From trex@easystreet.com Sat Dec 21 17:37:26 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: trex@easystreet.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Dec 2002 01:37:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 91439 invoked from network); 22 Dec 2002 01:37:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Dec 2002 01:37:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO smtp.easystreet.com) (206.26.36.40) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Dec 2002 01:37:26 -0000 Received: from computer (dial-206-102-3-128.dial.easystreet.com [206.102.3.128]) by smtp.easystreet.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with SMTP id gBM1bJt12314 for ; Sat, 21 Dec 2002 17:37:19 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <000801c2a95a$2e2c4840$800366ce@computer> To: Subject: IBOC analysis of AM radios Date: Sat, 21 Dec 2002 17:33:49 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "trex" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit It does not seem to me to be valid to only analyze AM radios presently on the market today. Shouldn't the "installed base" of all AM radios ever manufactured and/or still in use be considered? Many AM radios in use dont have "de-emphisis" and thus the IBOC fuzznoise will be more of a problem! In addition, many people will keep their favorite best performing AM radio in use for decades (like a close friend). Limiting a study to radios presently on the market also is not really fair since there is that recent trend for many AM radio manufactures to make their radios sound worse than in the past. Also, shouldn't somone point out that probably millions of ordinary people (not counting radio hobbiests) have at one time or another done a bit of DX listening on AM and that hobby would really be degraded if the band was full on hash. Many of todays engineers of all types got started in their careers by building simple AM radios with oatmeal box or whatever. Such simple basic projects would not be possible with IBOC. Long term affect would be fewer engineers and technicians. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From ben@lennard.net.nz Sat Dec 21 22:34:26 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ben@lennard.net.nz X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Dec 2002 06:34:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 52440 invoked from network); 22 Dec 2002 06:34:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Dec 2002 06:34:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.88) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Dec 2002 06:34:26 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.162] by n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 22 Dec 2002 06:34:26 -0000 Date: Sun, 22 Dec 2002 06:34:23 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Merry Xmas in Stereo! Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 296 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Ben " X-Originating-IP: 203.98.48.150 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=118503946 X-Yahoo-Profile: benlennard Hi All! With only 3 days to go her ein NZ, may I take this oppourtunity to wish one and all a very Merry Xmas and all the best for 2003, From Lennard Electronics. Take care, and drive safe! Cheers, Ben Lennard CEO, Big Cheese, Head dude, of Lennard Electronics. http://www.lennard.net.nz From mmalm@btinet.net Sat Dec 21 23:30:09 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: mmalm@btinet.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Dec 2002 07:30:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 21241 invoked from network); 22 Dec 2002 07:30:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Dec 2002 07:30:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Dec 2002 07:30:08 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.142] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 22 Dec 2002 07:30:08 -0000 Date: Sun, 22 Dec 2002 07:30:07 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: AM stereo GM radio? Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 512 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "n0faz " X-Originating-IP: 12.15.122.182 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83590293 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0faz Hi, could someone with a knowledge of GM car stereos take a look at this auction on ebay and tell me if this is a AM stereo receiver? I can't make heads or tails out of it. I have a 97 GMC Yukon with the factory AM/FM cassete external CD player combination, and would love to swap out the origianl head unit with something that would have AM stereo. If it was CD player also, that would be a bonus as I could then remove the CD changer and install a shortwave receiver in that slot! Thanks. Mark, N0FAZ From mmalm@btinet.net Sat Dec 21 23:35:59 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: mmalm@btinet.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Dec 2002 07:35:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 82314 invoked from network); 22 Dec 2002 07:35:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Dec 2002 07:35:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.86) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Dec 2002 07:35:59 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.144] by n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 22 Dec 2002 07:35:59 -0000 Date: Sun, 22 Dec 2002 07:35:58 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: AM stereo GM radio? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 733 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "n0faz " X-Originating-IP: 12.15.122.182 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83590293 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0faz Forgot to add the link to the aution: http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll? ViewItem&item=1875169412 Mark --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "n0faz " wrote: > Hi, could someone with a knowledge of GM car stereos take a look at > this auction on ebay and tell me if this is a AM stereo receiver? I > can't make heads or tails out of it. I have a 97 GMC Yukon with the > factory AM/FM cassete external CD player combination, and would love > to swap out the origianl head unit with something that would have AM > stereo. If it was CD player also, that would be a bonus as I could > then remove the CD changer and install a shortwave receiver in that > slot! Thanks. > > Mark, N0FAZ From possumhunter@netzero.net Sun Dec 22 04:39:14 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Dec 2002 12:39:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 78467 invoked from network); 22 Dec 2002 12:39:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Dec 2002 12:39:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.123) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Dec 2002 12:39:13 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 22 Dec 2002 04:39:13 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM stereo GM radio? Date: Sun, 22 Dec 2002 07:38:57 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 22 Dec 2002 12:39:13.0492 (UTC) FILETIME=[22090140:01C2A9B7] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.175.240.74] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 mmalm@btinet.net wrote: > Hi, could someone with a knowledge of GM car stereos take a look at this auction on ebay and tell me if this is a AM stereo receiver? It is a MONO AM tuner. Long live FREE RADIO! Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From stodd@sherbtel.net Sun Dec 22 08:34:49 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Dec 2002 16:34:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 72781 invoked from network); 22 Dec 2002 16:34:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Dec 2002 16:34:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Dec 2002 16:34:47 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-178.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.178]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gBMGYi9x001831 for ; Sun, 22 Dec 2002 10:34:45 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <003201c2a9d8$119e1cc0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <16723-3E04FD18-480@storefull-2117.public.lawson.webtv.net> Subject: Re: Re: {AMSF} Changes Date: Sun, 22 Dec 2002 10:34:56 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Glad to know you're still with us. This list doesn't accept attachments so we didn't get to see the memo. Scott Todd ----- Original Message ----- From: > , Please see the attached e-mail about MAJOR changes at my job and the > LOSS of our service department! > > William P. Snyder From mmalm@btinet.net Sun Dec 22 17:43:54 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: mmalm@btinet.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Dec 2002 01:43:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 78353 invoked from network); 23 Dec 2002 01:43:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Dec 2002 01:43:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.83) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Dec 2002 01:43:54 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.168] by n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 23 Dec 2002 01:43:53 -0000 Date: Mon, 23 Dec 2002 01:43:51 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM stereo GM radio? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 650 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "n0faz " X-Originating-IP: 12.15.123.108 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83590293 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0faz Well that sucks, just what did I miss that said this was a mono radio? I'd read somewhere (probibly here) that a certain model of GMC radio from the smaller sport yute type vehicle had the AM stereo option. Mark --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Possum Hunter" wrote: > mmalm@b... wrote: > > Hi, could someone with a knowledge of GM car stereos take a look at this > auction on ebay and tell me if this is a AM stereo receiver? > > It is a MONO AM tuner. > > Long live FREE RADIO! > > Possum - Moderator of the AM DX Group > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amradiodx/ > Plate Modulation-The Choice Of The New Generation From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Dec 22 21:57:38 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Dec 2002 05:57:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 53582 invoked from network); 23 Dec 2002 05:57:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Dec 2002 05:57:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Dec 2002 05:57:37 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.137] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 23 Dec 2002 05:57:37 -0000 Date: Mon, 23 Dec 2002 05:57:35 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Merry AM Stereo Christmas Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1013 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.78.1 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics It has been my yearly tradition to record the Christmas music played in fantastic AM Stereo sound by New Jersey's own 1450 WCTC, and this year I got off to an early start... WCTC's 30-hour Christmas music special doesn't begin until 6 PM on December 24th, but they are already playing Christmas music in full Stereo sound as the "bumper" music for their talk shows. I recorded some excellent examples of this on Sunday, with my Chrysler AMAX radio truly bringing out the full sound quality that AM Stereo has to offer, even from less-than-ideal reception of a 1,000- watt Local channel talk station: http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/wctc22x1.mp3 http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/wctc22x2.mp3 Of course on Christmas I'll also be sure to tune in 1210 WPHT and 1680 WTTM, as I know both stations will also be playing music in top- notch AM Stereo sound. I hope all of you will have a chance to enjoy Christmas music in high fidelity AM sound, in AM Stereo where possible, this holiday season! From groucho@skyweb.net Sun Dec 22 22:02:21 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Dec 2002 06:02:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 61859 invoked from network); 23 Dec 2002 06:02:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Dec 2002 06:02:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Dec 2002 06:02:21 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gBN68H4Q080563 for ; Mon, 23 Dec 2002 01:08:18 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3E06A5E8.328CEE27@skyweb.net> Date: Mon, 23 Dec 2002 00:58:00 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Merry AM Stereo Christmas References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Kevin WTTM is already playing Christmas music mixed in during the Night Automation..... But will be Full Xmas music next week at Night... The PD wont allow Xmas music During the Day.. Unless I end up doing a show LOL.. Neal "Kevin T. " wrote: > It has been my yearly tradition to record the Christmas music played > in fantastic AM Stereo sound by New Jersey's own 1450 WCTC, and this > year I got off to an early start... WCTC's 30-hour Christmas music > special doesn't begin until 6 PM on December 24th, but they are > already playing Christmas music in full Stereo sound as the "bumper" > music for their talk shows. > > I recorded some excellent examples of this on Sunday, with my > Chrysler AMAX radio truly bringing out the full sound quality that AM > Stereo has to offer, even from less-than-ideal reception of a 1,000- > watt Local channel talk station: > > http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/wctc22x1.mp3 > http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/wctc22x2.mp3 > > Of course on Christmas I'll also be sure to tune in 1210 WPHT and > 1680 WTTM, as I know both stations will also be playing music in top- > notch AM Stereo sound. > > I hope all of you will have a chance to enjoy Christmas music in high > fidelity AM sound, in AM Stereo where possible, this holiday season! > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sun Dec 22 22:39:12 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Dec 2002 06:39:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 80229 invoked from network); 23 Dec 2002 06:39:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Dec 2002 06:39:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Dec 2002 06:39:09 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.185] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 23 Dec 2002 06:39:09 -0000 Date: Mon, 23 Dec 2002 06:39:08 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Part 15 question Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 485 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.0 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst A while back I was reading the part 15 regulations and it mentioned that "damped wave" or "class B", which I think it means digital, are prohibited. Or maybe it refers to a spark gap transmitter. Anyway, not that I would have any interest in it, if IBOC is considered a damped wave or class B modulation it sounds like that part 15 broadcasters would be prohibited from experimenting with IBOC. Any comments or a clearer definition of what damped wave or class B emissions mean? JSG From possumhunter@netzero.net Sun Dec 22 23:37:13 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Dec 2002 07:37:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 42914 invoked from network); 23 Dec 2002 07:37:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Dec 2002 07:37:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.81) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Dec 2002 07:37:11 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 22 Dec 2002 23:37:11 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Part 15 question Date: Mon, 23 Dec 2002 02:36:57 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 23 Dec 2002 07:37:11.0263 (UTC) FILETIME=[1AC20EF0:01C2AA56] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.135.252.33] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 jsgil@hal-pc.org > A while back I was reading the part 15 regulations and it mentioned that "damped wave" or "class B", which I think it means digital, are prohibited. Class B means Ultra Wide band emissions of radio waves. "Damped Wave" is the weak wide band signal produced by crude spark gap transmitters It would interfere with a broad band of frequencies creating lots of hash. The "Quenched Gap" transmitter could produce very little damping and had a very intense spark. Instead of having one big gap, it used a series of metal plates insulated by mica washers. the spark would jump these plates making a bunch of small sparks instead of one big one. These smaller sparks made it easier to quench the signal by using a capacitor to damp unwanted oscillations to ground. The transmitter was tuned to the desired frequency by the frequency of the alternator powering it,the size of the quenching plates, the size of the quenching capacitor, and by tuned RF circuits. Quenched gap transmitters were built with powers of 100KW+ It is no longer legal to use spark transmitters in the United States. Technically, Damped Wave spark gap transmitters were "Digital" signals, but were much more wide banded than IBOC hash. Kevin From jsgil@hal-pc.org Mon Dec 23 00:08:05 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Dec 2002 08:08:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 91191 invoked from network); 23 Dec 2002 08:08:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Dec 2002 08:08:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.70) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Dec 2002 08:08:02 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.178] by n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 23 Dec 2002 08:08:02 -0000 Date: Mon, 23 Dec 2002 08:08:01 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Part 15 question Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 327 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.215 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Possum Hunter" wrote: > > Technically, Damped Wave spark gap transmitters were "Digital" signals, but > were much more wide banded than IBOC hash. > > Kevin I guess you can classify IBOC as a narrow band spark gap transmitter when it comes to interference. ;-) JSG From ccuff@in4web.com Mon Dec 23 00:43:07 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Dec 2002 08:43:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 63996 invoked from network); 23 Dec 2002 08:43:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Dec 2002 08:43:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Dec 2002 08:43:05 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.32]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Mon, 23 Dec 2002 03:38:12 -0500 Message-ID: <003301c2aa5e$1992e420$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM stereo GM radio? Date: Mon, 23 Dec 2002 03:34:24 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 Only up to 1996, the radio in the GMC Jimmy and the deluxe Chevy S10 had AM Stereo. They were using up an overstock of Caddy radios. No GM car except the Caddy had AM Stereo after 1993- Also, Be VERY careful buying Caddy radios on ebay- most were 2 piece radios- the part in the dash looks exactly like a normal GM radio, but the receiver and amp are separate. CC ----- Original Message ----- From: From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Dec 23 01:35:23 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Dec 2002 09:35:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 38880 invoked from network); 23 Dec 2002 09:35:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Dec 2002 09:35:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Dec 2002 09:35:22 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.159] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 23 Dec 2002 09:35:22 -0000 Date: Mon, 23 Dec 2002 09:35:21 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM stereo GM radio? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <003301c2aa5e$1992e420$0101a8c0@pavilion> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 574 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.79.128 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > No GM car except the Caddy had AM Stereo after 1993- Make that 1994, perhaps... I have the '94 Pontiac full-line brochure and it shows several models as having the AM Stereo-equipped UX-1 radio as optional. Also, in the factory radio listings on the www.amstereoradio.com web site, I have a scan of the 1994 Buick brochure showing *seven* different models of AM Stereo radios. Also, the 1994 Oldsmobile Bravada brochure mentions an "AM Stereo/ FM Stereo" radio, but if you're talking exactly, then this fits your description because it's an SUV, not a GM *car*. From jsgil@hal-pc.org Mon Dec 23 02:37:32 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Dec 2002 10:37:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 64074 invoked from network); 23 Dec 2002 10:37:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Dec 2002 10:37:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Dec 2002 10:37:31 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.133] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 23 Dec 2002 10:37:31 -0000 Date: Mon, 23 Dec 2002 10:37:28 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: FCC coments for reconsideratin Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 582 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.239 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst Browsing the FCC website for replies for reconsideration for nighttime IBOC: http://gullfoss2.fcc.gov/cgi-bin/websql/prod/ecfs/comsrch_v2.hts?ws_mode=retrieve_list&id_proceeding=99-325 one of the comments is filed by Garvey Schubert Bayer on behalf of iBiquity with the author as John Wells King the same one who filed that half-baked pro IBOC petition for reconsideration. http://gullfoss2.fcc.gov/prod/ecfs/retrieve.cgi?native_or_pdf=pdf&id_document=6513398767 It is a complete reversal of position. The links may be wrapped so you may have to piece them together. JSG From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Dec 23 07:35:28 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Dec 2002 15:35:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 24996 invoked from network); 23 Dec 2002 15:35:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Dec 2002 15:35:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.70) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Dec 2002 15:35:26 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.138] by n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 23 Dec 2002 15:35:26 -0000 Date: Mon, 23 Dec 2002 15:35:24 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: FCC comments for reconsideration Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 727 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > http://gullfoss2.fcc.gov/prod/ecfs/retrieve.cgi?native_or_pdf=pdf&id_document=6513398767 > > It is a complete reversal of position. It looks to me like somebody just typed in that name and address, and wasn't really him. The fact that the comment was typed in unformatted and with no heading or signature gives evidence to this. The comment expresses a legitimate opinion nonetheless, but whoever posted it should have more accurately disclosed their real identity, at least in order for the FCC to consider it seriously. > The links may be wrapped so you may have to piece them > together. Because of this, I created a "quick link" to view the FCC comments about IBOC: http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/iboc.htm From amfmdx@fastq.com Mon Dec 23 07:36:08 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Dec 2002 15:36:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 53203 invoked from network); 23 Dec 2002 15:36:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Dec 2002 15:36:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Dec 2002 15:36:08 -0000 Received: from fastq ([208.187.57.110]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gBNFa6P04139 for ; Mon, 23 Dec 2002 08:36:07 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <001f01c2aa98$eda29000$6e39bbd0@com> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} FCC coments for reconsideratin Date: Mon, 23 Dec 2002 08:35:29 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > http://gullfoss2.fcc.gov/prod/ecfs/retrieve.cgi?native_or_pdf=pdf&id_documen t=6513398767 > > It is a complete reversal of position. APPARENTLY 5 COMMENTS DERAILED THIS PETITION AND CAUSED A COMPLETE REVERSAL BY IBIQUITY. The 5 people who stopped this petition cold are: Kevin Redding Eric Bueneman Powell Way Charles Hutton Gerry Bishop Don't stop commenting because we really need a strong showing to get the job done. Thank you to the 5 who commented and caused Ibiquity and the lawyers to reverse their petition. Kevin Mesa, Arizona From scott.toenniessen@fmr.com Mon Dec 23 07:41:51 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: scott.toenniessen@fmr.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Dec 2002 15:41:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 98810 invoked from network); 23 Dec 2002 15:41:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Dec 2002 15:41:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Dec 2002 15:41:51 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.135] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 23 Dec 2002 15:41:50 -0000 Date: Mon, 23 Dec 2002 15:41:49 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Lots of people DX Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <000801c2a95a$2e2c4840$800366ce@computer> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1858 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "spt87a " X-Originating-IP: 204.110.135.35 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=133257283 X-Yahoo-Profile: spt87a --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "trex" wrote: > Also, shouldn't somone point out that probably millions of ordinary people (not counting radio hobbiests) have at one time or another done a bit of DX listening on AM and that hobby would really be degraded if the band was full on hash. > The DX audience seems to be much bigger than many (most?) in the broadcast industry acknowledge. Last night I was listening to WBZ all night (midnight to 4am or so). During the first hour they probably took a good 10 calls and I don't think ANY of them were from the local area. New Jersey, Michigan, Pennsylvannia, NY, and further. They always get a lot of DX calls. Since they are one of the few AM stations in the east not running syndicated stuff after midnight, it is not surprising. And what is the industry estimate - for every person who calls their are 100 who never call but just listen? Actually, it must be way more than 100, like 1000. I'm still amazed that a few years back when WLIB NY bought WOWO Fort Wayne just to reduce it's power so they could run 24hrs that something like 150 people wrote to the FCC against modifying WOWO's signal. That legal move was so unpublicized, especially outside Fort Wayne, and I think most of the writers were DX listeners. They had a HUGE DX audience for AC music, on AM - in the mid 1990's! They used to get song requests from all over the eastern US, maybe more from out of the ground wave area than local. When I was in college traveling around in the early '90s, in some area's of upstate NY, WOWO was the ONLY reliable signal on AM or FM doing newcasts - IN NY STATE! Now those areas of NY probably hear WLIB and WOWO fighting it out in a big blast of static. It is a shame that the FCC and many of the station owners ignore the value of this service. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Dec 23 08:28:59 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Dec 2002 16:28:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 4466 invoked from network); 23 Dec 2002 16:28:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Dec 2002 16:28:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Dec 2002 16:28:59 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.141] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 23 Dec 2002 16:28:58 -0000 Date: Mon, 23 Dec 2002 16:28:57 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Catch 'em while you can Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 294 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics Here are two "Alfredo Lite" AM Stereo transmitters from Chris Cuff on eBay... both with "Buy It Now" for $125 each... these will go fast, so if you want one, act now! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1947080165 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1947080304 From amfmdx@fastq.com Mon Dec 23 08:42:55 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Dec 2002 16:42:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 51991 invoked from network); 23 Dec 2002 16:42:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Dec 2002 16:42:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Dec 2002 16:42:54 -0000 Received: from fastq ([208.187.57.110]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gBNGgsP06064 for ; Mon, 23 Dec 2002 09:42:54 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <006b01c2aaa2$40a25700$6e39bbd0@com> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Catch 'em while you can Date: Mon, 23 Dec 2002 09:42:15 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla I have a question. If theres an Alfredo Lite, is there a full power Alfredo transmitter? Kevin ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Monday, December 23, 2002 9:28 AM Subject: {AMSF} Catch 'em while you can > Here are two "Alfredo Lite" AM Stereo transmitters from Chris Cuff on eBay... both with "Buy It Now" for $125 each... these will go fast, so if you want one, act now! > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1947080165 > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1947080304 > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Dec 23 10:36:42 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Dec 2002 18:36:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 77604 invoked from network); 23 Dec 2002 18:36:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Dec 2002 18:36:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.75) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Dec 2002 18:36:41 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.141] by n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 23 Dec 2002 18:36:41 -0000 Date: Mon, 23 Dec 2002 18:36:41 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Catch 'em while you can Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <006b01c2aaa2$40a25700$6e39bbd0@com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1523 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > I have a question. If theres an Alfredo Lite, is there a > full power Alfredo transmitter? The "Lite" only refers to its lack of built-in audio processing (multi-band limiter, sort of like a mini-Optimod) and NRSC 10 kHz audio filtering. The output power is the same for both the full Alfredo Torrejon transmitter and Chris's "Alfredo Lite". Anyway, you can change the output transistors and/or add on an amplifier for extra power, up to a few watts if you really want to. Even in standard form, with a regulated 9VDC power supply, a properly matched antenna, a good ground, you can get up to a 1/4 mile range with a clear Stereo signal, and maybe a 1/2 mile with a weak but listenable signal. Good audio processing is also a big help, as on AM, higher modulation = higher effective output power. With unprocessed audio direct from a CD or MP3 player, you might only get 40% or 50% modulation before the treble peaks start to get clipped, creating a nasty "spitting" effect. A good test for maximum modulation is to simply rebroadcast the audio of a local FM station, as then you'll be taking advantage of their thousands of dollars' worth of audio processing and will be able to get close to full +125% / -100% modulation. I've done this and even at some distance away from the transmitter, I can get my Alfredo Lite's signal to be as loud or even louder than any of the local AM stations, and of course with full 15+ kHz bandwidth and however much pre- emphasis you choose, it will sound a lot more hi-fi too! From jsgil@hal-pc.org Mon Dec 23 11:21:28 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Dec 2002 19:21:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 60872 invoked from network); 23 Dec 2002 19:21:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Dec 2002 19:21:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.83) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Dec 2002 19:21:26 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.251] by n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 23 Dec 2002 19:21:26 -0000 Date: Mon, 23 Dec 2002 19:21:25 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: FCC comments for reconsideration Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1007 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.140 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: > It looks to me like somebody just typed in that name and address, and wasn't really him. The fact that the comment was typed in unformatted and with no heading or signature gives evidence to this. The comment expresses a legitimate opinion nonetheless, but whoever posted it should have more accurately disclosed their real identity, at least in order for the FCC to consider it seriously. > > http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/iboc.htm This is what I kind of thought as the address is different from the other 2 posts by Garvey Schubert Barer. If this is the case then I think it maybe against the law to submit an official document under a false identity or impersonating someone else or other group with it the intent misrepersent them. Just in case that this came from someone in the group or anyone who reads it that we do not condone this type activity and this will not help our cause. JSG From ccuff@in4web.com Mon Dec 23 12:07:52 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Dec 2002 20:07:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 41756 invoked from network); 23 Dec 2002 20:07:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Dec 2002 20:07:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Dec 2002 20:07:48 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.47]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Mon, 23 Dec 2002 15:02:56 -0500 Message-ID: <001801c2aabd$c0e26ac0$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: <006b01c2aaa2$40a25700$6e39bbd0@com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Catch 'em while you can Date: Mon, 23 Dec 2002 14:59:07 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 The full version of the Alfredo transmitter had built in peak limiters that used an IC that is un obtainable. It was a great design, but for the hobbyist and for someone that just wanted to hear what real AM stereo sounded like It was also way too expensive and compicated to build. I made 2- then designed the "lite" , which is all I make now. cc ----- Original Message ----- From: Kevin - Mesa, Arizona To: Sent: Monday, December 23, 2002 11:42 AM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Catch 'em while you can > I have a question. If theres an Alfredo Lite, is there a full power Alfredo > transmitter? From stodd@sherbtel.net Mon Dec 23 17:28:23 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Dec 2002 01:28:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 50444 invoked from network); 24 Dec 2002 01:28:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Dec 2002 01:28:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Dec 2002 01:28:21 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-85-99.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.85.99]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gBO1SH9x027448 for ; Mon, 23 Dec 2002 19:28:19 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <004901c2aaeb$c73a04e0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <006b01c2aaa2$40a25700$6e39bbd0@com> <001801c2aabd$c0e26ac0$0101a8c0@pavilion> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Catch 'em while you can Date: Mon, 23 Dec 2002 19:28:32 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude That seems to be a problem affecting big and small- to wit the post I saw today on the Radiotech forum at bnet: [RT] Manufacturer rant Robert Orban radio-tech@broadcast.net Fri, 20 Dec 2002 23:30:26 -0800 a.. Previous message: [RT] Re: Radio-tech digest, Vol 1 #2756 - 36 msgs b.. Next message: [RT] Manufacturer rant c.. Messages sorted by: [ date ] [ thread ] [ subject ] [ author ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---- I'd like to add that the last 8000 was manufactured 22 years ago and the last 9000 was manufactured 20 years ago. As another poster pointed out, components are being obsoleted more and more quickly by the Intels and Motorolas of the world. Any small manufacturer like Orban has to deal with this accelerating merry-go-round, where perfectly serviceable designs become no longer manufacturable solely because the components are no longer available to us. We try to keep a reasonable number of discontinued components in stock for repairs, but, sooner or later, things dry up. That is the way of the brave new 21st century world, whether we like it or not. Bob Orban ----- Original Message ----- From: "Christopher Cuff" > The full version of the Alfredo transmitter had built in peak limiters that > used an IC that is un obtainable. From possumhunter@netzero.net Mon Dec 23 17:41:40 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Dec 2002 01:41:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 247 invoked from network); 24 Dec 2002 01:41:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Dec 2002 01:41:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.63) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Dec 2002 01:41:40 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 23 Dec 2002 17:41:40 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Lots of people DX Date: Mon, 23 Dec 2002 18:57:11 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 24 Dec 2002 01:41:40.0354 (UTC) FILETIME=[9AF56620:01C2AAED] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.151.154.188] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 scott.toenniessen@fmr.com wrote: > The DX audience seems to be much bigger than many (most?) in the broadcast industry acknowledge. Just ask WWL 870, their over night trucker's show with Dave Nemo has an almost 100% DX audience and 100% DX ads! Many of the requests played on CHWO 740 are from DXers in the US. WSM's Grand Ole Opry was built on DX listeners. > > I'm still amazed that a few years back when WLIB NY bought WOWO Fort Wayne just to reduce it's power so they could run 24hrs that something like 150 people wrote to the FCC against modifying WOWO's signal. That was a very dark time in radio history. WOWO was my favorite station. > > It is a shame that the FCC and many of the station owners ignore the value of this service. The simple fact is, even in a good sized medium market such as Greenville-Spartanburg, There is no live overnight programming to listen to, and no English music to be heard on AM. All of the FMs are running canned "cookie cutter" programs. If you want to hear music, you have to tune in WSM 650, CHWO 740, or KCJJ 1630. If you are in downtown, you can hear MOR music on WPCI AM Stereo 1490. Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Mon Dec 23 17:41:57 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Dec 2002 01:41:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 64112 invoked from network); 24 Dec 2002 01:41:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Dec 2002 01:41:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.190) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Dec 2002 01:41:57 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 23 Dec 2002 17:41:57 -0800 To: Subject: Service Info Needed! Date: Mon, 23 Dec 2002 20:37:56 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 24 Dec 2002 01:41:57.0144 (UTC) FILETIME=[A4F75980:01C2AAED] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.151.154.188] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 HELP! I have 2 sick GLi Pro DC-4000MarkII Twin Compact Disc Players. Anybody got the service manual for them? Kevin From oldphones@webtv.net Mon Dec 23 17:46:50 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: oldphones@webtv.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Dec 2002 01:46:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 19320 invoked from network); 24 Dec 2002 01:46:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Dec 2002 01:46:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO smtpout-2001-1.public.lawson.webtv.net) (209.240.212.81) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Dec 2002 01:46:50 -0000 Received: from storefull-2115.public.lawson.webtv.net (lawson-public-ipmux-1-pip-7.public.lawson.webtv.net [209.240.212.98]) by smtpout-2001-1.public.lawson.webtv.net (WebTV_Postfix+sws) with ESMTP id C7CA6BE55 for ; Mon, 23 Dec 2002 17:46:49 -0800 (PST) Received: (from production@localhost) by storefull-2115.public.lawson.webtv.net (8.8.8-wtv-f/mt.gso.26Feb98) id RAA26060; Mon, 23 Dec 2002 17:46:49 -0800 (PST) X-WebTV-Signature: 1 ETAsAhR3OgGxTMT7bfGLuw5l4LaGDV0mZAIUdQtF9DDnP6ELKQZ3bjv6IMfFg9o= Date: Mon, 23 Dec 2002 19:46:49 -0600 (CST) To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Digest Number 503 Message-ID: <5701-3E07BC89-6378@storefull-2115.public.lawson.webtv.net> In-Reply-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com's message of 23 Dec 2002 09:30:11 -0000 Content-Disposition: Inline Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) X-eGroups-From: oldphones@webtv.net (oldphones) From: oldphones@webtv.net X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38022783 X-Yahoo-Profile: oldphones1 Chris Cuff is right about the TWO piece Caddy radios, Think I saw that on a 93 Caddy awhile back, kinda of a surprise when you were expecting a one piece radio. Hint: No antenna connection on the head unit! ALSO, watch out for the BOSE caddy radios with the special speaker/ amp assembly. The Amps are prone to go bad. Expensive to get repaired. MANY of the older (89 to about 94) Chevy/ GMC PICK-UP radios are 2, 3 piece systems,, a "fun" radio to work on hey,hey But they often are AM Stereo !! Ford has some 2 piece radios, also.... William P. Snyder Oldphones@ webtv. net (402) 593-6841 I Specialize in AM Stereo radios, collectable telephones, parts, and wiring items http://community.webtv.net/oldphones/OldPhonesRadiosPage From stodd@sherbtel.net Mon Dec 23 18:51:08 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Dec 2002 02:51:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 5360 invoked from network); 24 Dec 2002 02:51:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Dec 2002 02:51:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Dec 2002 02:51:06 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-85-99.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.85.99]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gBO2p29x016189 for ; Mon, 23 Dec 2002 20:51:03 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <00f401c2aaf7$56c9b960$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Service Info Needed! Date: Mon, 23 Dec 2002 20:51:17 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude try www.servicemanuals.net ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Possum Hunter" > HELP! I have 2 sick GLi Pro DC-4000MarkII Twin Compact Disc Players. Anybody > got the service manual for them? > From groucho@skyweb.net Mon Dec 23 18:58:31 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Dec 2002 02:58:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 72403 invoked from network); 24 Dec 2002 02:58:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Dec 2002 02:58:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Dec 2002 02:58:31 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gBO34RUr034678; Mon, 23 Dec 2002 22:04:28 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3E07CC3C.E8C0620E@skyweb.net> Date: Mon, 23 Dec 2002 21:53:48 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "ABDX@topica.com" , "amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com" Subject: Christmas music Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 It seems that My automation computer in the studio rebooted in my Christmas format after a power failure today at the studios.. So For the next 3 nights from 11pm to 6am WTTM will be 100% Christmas Music. So get out your tape recorders and Enjoy.. Ho Ho Ho merry Christmas from Rabbi Clause Neal From possumhunter@netzero.net Mon Dec 23 19:22:34 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Dec 2002 03:22:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 96023 invoked from network); 24 Dec 2002 03:22:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Dec 2002 03:22:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.118) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Dec 2002 03:22:33 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 23 Dec 2002 19:22:33 -0800 To: References: <3E07CC3C.E8C0620E@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Christmas music Date: Mon, 23 Dec 2002 22:22:21 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 24 Dec 2002 03:22:33.0427 (UTC) FILETIME=[B2DF0A30:01C2AAFB] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.151.154.188] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Neal Newman wrote: > So For the next 3 nights from 11pm to 6am WTTM will be 100% Christmas Music. We start our Christmas music at 6AM. On Christmas day, we will be running the Oldies Coast To Coast Christmas Sock-Hop. With all of the AMAX spots, CW IDs, and QSL promos running, it is pretty obvious the station engineer has taken over programming duty! LOL Kevin From KC4QLP@aol.com Mon Dec 23 23:54:19 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Dec 2002 07:54:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 54390 invoked from network); 24 Dec 2002 07:54:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Dec 2002 07:54:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r05.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.101) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Dec 2002 07:54:17 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.128.1e8a71e6 (25305) for ; Tue, 24 Dec 2002 02:54:12 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <128.1e8a71e6.2b396ca3@aol.com> Date: Tue, 24 Dec 2002 02:54:11 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Christmas music To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/23/02 10:24:15 PM Eastern Standard Time, possumhunter@netzero.net writes: << Neal Newman wrote: > So For the next 3 nights from 11pm to 6am WTTM will be 100% Christmas Music. We start our Christmas music at 6AM. On Christmas day, we will be running the Oldies Coast To Coast Christmas Sock-Hop. With all of the AMAX spots, CW IDs, and QSL promos running, it is pretty obvious the station engineer has taken over programming duty! LOL Kevin >> We started at midnight Christmas Eve...wewl! ....what a project to do...record the songs in the computer..then set the logs out and then make sure there arent no repeats! My fingers are sore! Enjoy folks and happy holidays to all! Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network _______________________________________________________ From dwtpa97@earthlink.net Tue Dec 24 05:52:54 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dwtpa97@earthlink.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Dec 2002 13:52:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 58099 invoked from network); 24 Dec 2002 13:47:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Dec 2002 13:47:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO falcon.mail.pas.earthlink.net) (207.217.120.74) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Dec 2002 13:47:08 -0000 Received: from sdn-ap-012scfairp0295.dialsprint.net ([63.189.177.41] helo=earthlink.net) by falcon.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 18QpOl-0002um-00 for amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com; Tue, 24 Dec 2002 05:47:08 -0800 Message-ID: <3E086591.FCDB6101@earthlink.net> Date: Tue, 24 Dec 2002 08:48:01 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.79 [en]C-CCK-MCD NSCPCD472 (Windows NT 5.0; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Merry AM Stereo Christmas References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: dwtpa97 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38076959 Merry Christmas to AM Stereo supporters around the world! Dick W. From philipr@irac.pe.ca Tue Dec 24 06:42:50 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Dec 2002 14:42:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 93223 invoked from network); 24 Dec 2002 14:31:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Dec 2002 14:31:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.88) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Dec 2002 14:30:54 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.176] by n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 24 Dec 2002 14:30:53 -0000 Date: Tue, 24 Dec 2002 14:30:52 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Merry Christmas / Happy Holidays! Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 349 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking May you and your family have a very Merry Christmas, or Happy Holidays, as the case may be! Enjoy the hustle and bustle, the gifts etc. but be sure to reflect on the true meaning of Christmas / or the holidays! Fire up that AM Stereo radio, or at least a wideband mono AM radio, and enjoy some music the amplitude modulation way! Phil R. From amfmdx@fastq.com Tue Dec 24 06:58:15 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Dec 2002 14:58:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 18452 invoked from network); 24 Dec 2002 14:58:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Dec 2002 14:58:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Dec 2002 14:58:10 -0000 Received: from fastq (d76-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.108]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gBOEw8P39031 for ; Tue, 24 Dec 2002 07:58:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <003d01c2ab5c$ca54ef20$66f9bed8@com> To: Subject: OT: Digital TV Date: Tue, 24 Dec 2002 07:57:32 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla Story from ZDNET. Why Uncle Sam might buy you a TV David Coursey, Executive Editor, AnchorDesk Friday, December 20, 2002 Talk back! How would you like Uncle Sam to help you buy a digital television? Would a $500 government rebate be enough to get you into the store? A TV industry analyst believes that, for many Americans, it would, and that tax credits may be the very best way to solve the chicken-and-egg problem that has stymied acceptance of next-generation digital TV. YOU MAY THINK it odd that the federal government would even consider paying for a hunk of your new TV set. After all, it's not like the government doesn't have other things to do with the money. But money is precisely what this is all about. When the feds authorized digital television, they assumed that existing television stations would abandon their old analog frequencies for the new digital channels. But that hasn't happened, and the 10-year timetable envisioned for the transition is now out the window. It's digital, it's got television... ...but it's not digital TV. HP's Media Center PC is the nicest PC I've used in a while. That's a problem, because the government has already spent the money it raised by auctioning off the frequencies that were to be vacated by the TV stations. They auctioned off those frequencies, in part, to telecom companies who were going to use the spectrum to offer new digital services. Now, we could talk about what a lunatic idea frequency auctions are, and how they haven't worked out nearly as well as proponents promised. But the fact remains that $16 billion in auction proceeds are already included in federal budget projections. IT'S UNLIKELY that money will be in the federal coffers as soon as Congress hoped. Until broadcasters give up their chunks of spectrum and switch to digital, the auction bidders aren't likely to pay up. If digital television adoption doesn't speed up soon, there's the possibility the transition from analog to digital won't be complete for another 20 years. It was supposed to be over and done with by the middle part of this decade. Phil Swann, editor of TVPredictions.com and a frequent guest on my radio program, is the force behind the $500 rebate idea. He thinks it's better to convince people to buy new televisions than to force digital TV tuners on them. That latter plan is just what the FCC has ordered consumer electronics manufacturers to do, beginning with big-screen TVs in 2004. Like many people, I sort of gag on the idea of tax dollars being used to help people buy television sets. I'd rather see the money do something useful, like feed hungry kids or provide decent mental health care. Of course, I'm not the idiot who linked the federal budget to getting people onto digital television, so I'm clearly out of step. OF COURSE, $16 billion isn't much--especially spread out over several years--when the federal budget deficit has been predicted by some analysts to top $200 billion (plus the cost of whatever happens in Iraq). But every little bit will help when we're talking about either raising taxes or cutting programs. Should any of that $16 billion be used as rebates to get people to switch to digital TV? Well, at $500 a set, a million digital televisions would cost a half-billion dollars. Twenty million sets--which you'd think would be enough to jumpstart the transition--would cost $10 billion. I can't imagine we'd actually spend that much, but the math illustrates just how expensive this program could be. In the digital age, the government could have important new roles to play beyond protecting our shores and delivering the mail. But should paying for television sets be one of them? In order to protect much-needed--and already budgeted--revenue, it may have to be. We'll see. Bob Ulm "Its going to get a lot worse before it gets worse" - Lily Tomlin From michaelj@vcn.com Tue Dec 24 09:21:22 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Dec 2002 17:21:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 16950 invoked from network); 24 Dec 2002 17:21:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Dec 2002 17:21:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m1-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.31) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Dec 2002 17:21:20 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m1-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Tue, 24 Dec 2002 10:21:19 -0700 Message-ID: <002101c2ab70$decf2740$0701010a@keva> To: Subject: Fw: amstereo.com web site Date: Tue, 24 Dec 2002 10:21:17 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit MessageHi gang I wrote to the owner of the amstereo.com domain asking about the name and what they planned on doing with it. Here's the response I got Michael n Wyo ----- Original Message ----- From: hostmaster@securedhosting.com To: 'Michael J. Richard' Sent: Friday, December 20, 2002 1:58 PM Subject: RE: site We are an Internet Service provider who purchased the domain name amstereo.com years ago speculatively. If you are interested in purchasing the domain, you are welcome to make an offer. Mike Winkel CIS Internet Services -----Original Message----- From: Michael J. Richard [mailto:michaelj@vcn.com] Sent: Thursday, December 19, 2002 1:04 AM To: hostmaster@amstereo.com Subject: site Hi I am an avid AM STEREO fan and user. I've converted several stations to AM stereo and I love the sound of it. I was just curious if your new site is going to have anything at all to do with AM Stereo as in....radio and broadcasting in AM Stereo, or if it's something else? If it's going to be a site devoted to C-quam AM Stereo then I am very anxious for it to come into being. Thanks Michael J. Richard KEVA AM Stereo 1240 Evanston, Wyoming [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From jsgil@hal-pc.org Tue Dec 24 10:34:08 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Dec 2002 18:34:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 75701 invoked from network); 24 Dec 2002 18:34:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Dec 2002 18:34:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Dec 2002 18:34:07 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.160] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 24 Dec 2002 18:34:07 -0000 Date: Tue, 24 Dec 2002 18:34:02 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Fw: amstereo.com web site Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <002101c2ab70$decf2740$0701010a@keva> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 965 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.130.68 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Michael J. Richard" wrote: > We are an Internet Service provider who purchased the domain name amstereo.com years ago speculatively. If you are interested in purchasing the domain, you are welcome to make an offer. > Sounds like they want a big price but I wouldn't offer more than what they paid in registration fees to maintain it. They are just cybersqatters and if big money is paid for a domain they have sqatted on it just encourages more squatting. According to whois it was created in June '97 and expires in June '03 so they have paid for 7 years to maintain it. If they have paid $50/yr then that adds up to $350 but I suspect that for most of those years it may be more like $35/yr which adds up to ~$250. You might try offering $300 for it to see if they will take it or you can wait until June '03 to see if they renew it, if not then you can register it yourself for much cheaper. JSG From KC4QLP@aol.com Tue Dec 24 12:55:00 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Dec 2002 20:54:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 59071 invoked from network); 24 Dec 2002 20:13:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Dec 2002 20:13:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d10.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.42) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Dec 2002 20:13:58 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d10.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.36.34c25594 (30950) for ; Tue, 24 Dec 2002 15:13:55 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <36.34c25594.2b3a1a03@aol.com> Date: Tue, 24 Dec 2002 15:13:55 EST Subject: Happy Holidays from NewsRadio 560 WGAI-AM Stereo To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp To friends old and new,may you all find this holiday filled with joy,fond memories and blessed with the knowledge of what Christmas is really all about. Its not about Santa Claus,getting gifts,eatting to much or any of that commerical "stuff". Its about the birth of the King of all Kings...Lord of all Lords..its the birth of Jesus Christ. Dont forget to reflect on the real reason for the season. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network _______________________________________________________ From groucho@skyweb.net Tue Dec 24 15:24:39 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Dec 2002 23:24:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 93651 invoked from network); 24 Dec 2002 23:24:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Dec 2002 23:24:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Dec 2002 23:24:38 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gBONUXUr012587; Tue, 24 Dec 2002 18:30:34 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3E08EBB2.E149BC0A@skyweb.net> Date: Tue, 24 Dec 2002 18:20:19 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "ABDX@topica.com" , "amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com" , "radio-tech@broadcast.net" Subject: Seasons Greetings Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Seasons Greetings to all from Myself and the Staff at WTTM 1680 am Stereo Princeton,New Jersey P.S. Santa all I want for christmas is an R-390 receiver,.and the FCC to mandate AM stereo receivers.... Neal Newman Chief Engineer -WTTM From ccuff@in4web.com Tue Dec 24 15:31:06 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Dec 2002 23:31:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 30561 invoked from network); 24 Dec 2002 23:31:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Dec 2002 23:31:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Dec 2002 23:31:05 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.74]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Tue, 24 Dec 2002 18:26:14 -0500 Message-ID: <006c01c2aba3$5118e480$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: <3E08EBB2.E149BC0A@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Seasons Greetings Date: Tue, 24 Dec 2002 18:22:23 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 And to all a good night!- I am listening to a CD made of WJR last year by Johhny Electron, and it is awsome what a class act that station is. JP- Howa about recording another disc?? hint hint.... :-) Chris ----- Original Message ----- From: Neal Newman From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Tue Dec 24 16:36:36 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Dec 2002 00:36:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 32493 invoked from network); 25 Dec 2002 00:36:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Dec 2002 00:36:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf15bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.175) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Dec 2002 00:36:36 -0000 Received: from juan ([68.155.89.6]) by imf15bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.19 201-253-122-122-119-20020516) with SMTP id <20021225003828.CEHC16758.imf15bis.bellsouth.net@juan>; Tue, 24 Dec 2002 19:38:28 -0500 Message-ID: <003501c2abad$b0ae4ca0$af78fea9@juan> To: Cc: Subject: Nice Christmas Gift Date: Tue, 24 Dec 2002 19:36:39 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I have never asked for a Medium Wave QSL for the stations I have heard in my on and off years of DXing, but I did ask the Caribbean Radio Lighthouse for one. Received it today from Jerry Baker to verify my reception of the station. They have a Nautel ND10 with 10 kw from St. John in Antigua, the Leeward Islands of the West Indies. A nice gift...made me smile. Merry Christmas to all.....may AM Stereo continue to make a comeback as it has in 2002, and know it has been a pleasure to learn so much from all of you. I am truly blessed. Merry Christmas, To all who participate, and to those that do not, have a great Wednesday. And to those in Canada who participate in Boxing day....... Happy Holidays to All Juan WGYL( #1 AC in the Ft. Pierce Metro) WTTB ( Southern most AM Stereo Station in the US) WOSN (#1 Nostalgia station in the US.. 12+ according to Arbitron) WGNX (The First Generation X Classic Rock Station) KB0GXM [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From stodd@sherbtel.net Tue Dec 24 18:44:02 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Dec 2002 02:44:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 87949 invoked from network); 25 Dec 2002 02:44:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Dec 2002 02:44:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Dec 2002 02:44:01 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-86.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.86]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gBP2hw9x021260 for ; Tue, 24 Dec 2002 20:43:59 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <003e01c2abbf$8592f860$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Fw: amstereo.com web site Date: Tue, 24 Dec 2002 20:44:15 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Kind of makes me wonder if the fact that he asked might make them consider renewing it. I hope not, but sometimes it's hard to predict when asking an innocent question can blow up in your face. Scott Todd where the Christmas music pickings aren't all that great. Wish SOMEONE would play Marvelous Toy. All the nostalgia stations are buried in QRM at night. ----- Original Message ----- From: > They are just > cybersqatters and if big money is paid for a domain they have > sqatted on it just encourages more squatting. You might try offering $300 for it > to see if they will take it or you can wait until June '03 to see > if they renew it, if not then you can register it yourself for > much cheaper. From stodd@sherbtel.net Tue Dec 24 18:48:38 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Dec 2002 02:48:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 97507 invoked from network); 25 Dec 2002 02:48:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Dec 2002 02:48:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Dec 2002 02:48:37 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-86.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.86]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gBP2mY9x021935 for ; Tue, 24 Dec 2002 20:48:35 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <005f01c2abc0$2a153a60$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <001f01c2aa98$eda29000$6e39bbd0@com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} FCC coments for reconsideratin Date: Tue, 24 Dec 2002 20:48:51 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude I'll be doing my part, probably this weekend I can set aside the time to do it. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" > Don't stop commenting because we really need a strong showing to get the job > done. From davidcoons@webtv.net Tue Dec 24 19:10:49 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: davidcoons@webtv.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Dec 2002 03:10:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 23331 invoked from network); 25 Dec 2002 03:10:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Dec 2002 03:10:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO smtpout-2001-1.public.lawson.webtv.net) (209.240.212.81) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Dec 2002 03:10:47 -0000 Received: from storefull-2316.public.lawson.webtv.net (lawson-public-ipmux-1-pip-6.public.lawson.webtv.net [209.240.212.97]) by smtpout-2001-1.public.lawson.webtv.net (WebTV_Postfix+sws) with ESMTP id F2AC9C08D for ; Tue, 24 Dec 2002 19:10:46 -0800 (PST) Received: (from production@localhost) by storefull-2316.public.lawson.webtv.net (8.8.8-wtv-f/mt.gso.26Feb98) id TAA08195; Tue, 24 Dec 2002 19:10:46 -0800 (PST) X-WebTV-Signature: 1 ETArAhNS6bq4DEgQ5bq7dLUab2r646rAAhQVjHvX5ZsZKTwgtdSbSNxs/5F9zQ== Date: Tue, 24 Dec 2002 22:10:46 -0500 (EST) To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Happy Holidays from NewsRadio 560 WGAI-AM Stereo Message-ID: <29104-3E0921B6-7878@storefull-2316.public.lawson.webtv.net> In-Reply-To: KC4QLP@aol.com's message of Tue, 24 Dec 2002 15:13:55 EST Content-Disposition: Inline Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) X-eGroups-From: davidcoons@webtv.net (David Coons) From: davidcoons@webtv.net X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10533228 Amen From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Dec 24 20:51:24 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Dec 2002 04:51:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 73456 invoked from network); 25 Dec 2002 04:51:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Dec 2002 04:51:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.89) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Dec 2002 04:51:22 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.147] by n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 25 Dec 2002 04:51:21 -0000 Date: Wed, 25 Dec 2002 04:51:21 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Seasons Greetings Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3E08EBB2.E149BC0A@skyweb.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1931 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.89.1 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Seasons Greetings to all from Myself and the Staff at WTTM 1680 am > Stereo Princeton,New Jersey Neal... thanks to you, I have already gotten my favorite Christmas present this year -- the absolutely magnificent AM Stereo sound on WTTM! On my Chrysler AMAX tuner, I can say without exaggeration that listening to the holiday music on WTTM is some of the best-sounding AM Stereo I have ever heard. I also happened to notice that tonight, WTTM's signal seems quite a bit stronger than usual... I don't know if you're keeping it at 10,000-watt daytime power at night, but either way, I won't complain! And for you DXers out there... if you tune in 1680 AM and hear fantastic music in full Stereo, you know you're listening to WTTM! I'll see if 710 WOR lives up to their promise of giving us a taste of full 10 kHz AMAX audio overnight... so far for the past few days, their audio has been even worse than usual, with the bandwidth cut down to 5 kHz all the time (even with the IBOC off), and a nasty "ringy" distortion. They're playing Christmas music too... but it just sounds like rubbish compared to WTTM. I'm sure 1210 WPHT will also sound fabulous tomorrow with their Christmas music in full Stereo. Meanwhile, 1450 WCTC is also playing music, but unfortunately they're continuing last year's trend of just simulcasting their FM sister station, and there must be a missing patch cord somewhere in the chain, because they're just running the L-R (stereo difference) audio, in mono, so it sounds very "echoey". However, in recent months WCTC has really turned itself around and brought back lots of live, local programming, so perhaps next year they'll be back to running their own independent Christmas music in full AM Stereo sound. Anyway, to everybody else here, I hope you are all enjoying your holidays, whatever they may be, and hopefully you have nice AM Stereo music to accompany you! From possumhunter@netzero.net Tue Dec 24 21:54:45 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: possumhunter@netzero.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Dec 2002 05:54:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 15838 invoked from network); 25 Dec 2002 05:54:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Dec 2002 05:54:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rly-ip03.mx.aol.com) (64.12.138.7) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Dec 2002 05:54:43 -0000 Received: from logs-tf.proxy.aol.com (logs-tf.proxy.aol.com [152.163.197.135]) by rly-ip03.mx.aol.com (v89.10) with ESMTP id RELAYIN6-1225005343; Wed, 25 Dec 2002 00:53:43 -0500 Received: from ibm (AC991E91.ipt.aol.com [172.153.30.145]) by logs-tf.proxy.aol.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with SMTP id gBP5rZX427347; Wed, 25 Dec 2002 00:53:36 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <008201c2abd9$f16e8440$911e99ac@aoldsl.net> To: , , Subject: Merry Christmas! DX TEST! Date: Wed, 25 Dec 2002 00:53:24 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Apparently-From: DodgeRamTrucker@aol.com From: "Possum Hunter" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Merry Christmas from the crew at WFIS 1600AM! Here is a GREAT Christmas gift from WFIS: WFIS is running a DX test! (Actually chasing down an RF problem in the phone lines!) WFIS does verify accurate reception reports! Enjoy, Kevin From amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Tue Dec 24 23:11:37 2002 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 35276 invoked from network); 25 Dec 2002 07:11:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Dec 2002 07:11:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Dec 2002 07:11:35 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: notify@yahoogroups.com Received: from [66.218.67.142] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 25 Dec 2002 07:11:35 -0000 Date: 25 Dec 2002 07:11:35 -0000 Message-ID: <1040800295.7644.28771.w22@yahoogroups.com> X-eGroups-Application: files X-Yahoo-Group-Post: system From: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: New file uploaded to amstereoforum MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello, This email message is a notification to let you know that a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the amstereoforum group. File : /ramsrad2.JPG Uploaded by : kevtronics Description : Chris Cuff's "Ramsey Electronics" AM Stereo/FM Stereo radio. (picture 1 of 2) You can access this file at the URL http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum/files/ramsrad2.JPG To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/files Regards, kevtronics From amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Tue Dec 24 23:12:12 2002 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 43407 invoked from network); 25 Dec 2002 07:12:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Dec 2002 07:12:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.90) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Dec 2002 07:12:12 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: notify@yahoogroups.com Received: from [66.218.67.135] by n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 25 Dec 2002 07:12:10 -0000 Date: 25 Dec 2002 07:12:10 -0000 Message-ID: <1040800330.5914.33470.w16@yahoogroups.com> X-eGroups-Application: files X-Yahoo-Group-Post: system From: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: New file uploaded to amstereoforum MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello, This email message is a notification to let you know that a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the amstereoforum group. File : /ramsrad4.JPG Uploaded by : kevtronics Description : Chris Cuff's "Ramsey Electronics" AM Stereo/FM Stereo radio. (picture 2 of 2) You can access this file at the URL http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum/files/ramsrad4.JPG To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/files Regards, kevtronics From fanfare@globility.com Wed Dec 25 10:22:16 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Dec 2002 18:22:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 6055 invoked from network); 25 Dec 2002 18:22:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Dec 2002 18:22:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Dec 2002 18:22:16 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.165] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 25 Dec 2002 18:22:15 -0000 Date: Wed, 25 Dec 2002 18:22:13 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: A Christmas greeting Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 589 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Marv Southcott " X-Originating-IP: 64.56.235.72 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy Yes, it's the time of year when all of us of the Christian persuasion celebrate the importance of our faith. However, at the same time, we recognize our brothers and sisters of other faiths who, while they may derive their faith from another perspective still stand together with us in terms of good will towards men, charity of the soul and love of country. Let us all with sincere hearts rejoice that, together, right shall always reign supreme, and wrong will die the death it deserves. Merry Christmas to all on this list along with a very happy and healthy New Year. Marv From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Wed Dec 25 13:47:28 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Dec 2002 21:47:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 86365 invoked from network); 25 Dec 2002 21:47:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Dec 2002 21:47:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14206.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.173.70) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Dec 2002 21:47:27 -0000 Message-ID: <20021225214727.79481.qmail@web14206.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [65.221.47.68] by web14206.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 25 Dec 2002 13:47:27 PST Date: Wed, 25 Dec 2002 13:47:27 -0800 (PST) Subject: Slim Pickin's for AM Stereo music, but a Merry Christmas anyhow To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio Hi Everybody, hope you're enjoying Christmas with friends and family. Big snowstorm here in the Midwest making for a White Christmas and then some. Not much to report on AM Stereo for Christmas :( Overnight tuning into 720AM WGN all I could get was a high pitch over music, and WLS was feeble as well, 2 Chicago Stereo stations with music - I'm assuming the big snowstorm destroyed the reception. WSPD did NOT turn on the AM Stereo as requested. WSAI 1530 Cincy had a good music program, but mono as usual, but decent fidelity. WJR ran a Disney program in MONO (pilot on, mono audio) all Christmas Eve and today until 4pm - now WJR finally in Stereo AM Again! Bright spot on the dial: CFCO 630 AM Stereo with extremely decent stereo music. Here's to another year of renewed interest in Stereo AM, and thanks to all who are supportive of our cause, including any Clear Channel station with the stereo AM audio on for the holidays. Merry Christmas to all, and to all, a good night! __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From ccuff@in4web.com Wed Dec 25 13:58:46 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Dec 2002 21:58:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 95009 invoked from network); 25 Dec 2002 21:58:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Dec 2002 21:58:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Dec 2002 21:58:45 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.91]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Wed, 25 Dec 2002 16:53:56 -0500 Message-ID: <000f01c2ac5f$95822480$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: <20021225214727.79481.qmail@web14206.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Slim Pickin's for AM Stereo music, but a Merry Christmas anyhow Date: Wed, 25 Dec 2002 16:50:03 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 It was dismal this morning- DX conditions were fine, but WPHT had talk radio, WWKB no pilot, talk. WJR as JP said was a mono feed. Got KCJJ for a while, and that was nice, and 1680 Jamz (sorry Neal- no reception this morning from NJ) SO.. I hate to say it, but I put on the XM, and was thrilled with the selection and quality of the Christmas program on the 40's channel. (I broadcast this via AM Stereo throughout the house (and a tad beyond.... ;-) Sound is actually quite good. Chris From kevtronics@yahoo.com Wed Dec 25 16:29:55 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Dec 2002 00:29:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 3307 invoked from network); 26 Dec 2002 00:29:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Dec 2002 00:29:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Dec 2002 00:29:55 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.172] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 26 Dec 2002 00:29:54 -0000 Date: Thu, 26 Dec 2002 00:29:54 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Slim Pickin's for AM Stereo music, but a Merry Christmas anyhow Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <000f01c2ac5f$95822480$0101a8c0@pavilion> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1433 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.95.17 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > It was dismal this morning- DX conditions were fine, but WPHT had > talk radio, WWKB no pilot, talk. WJR as JP said was a mono feed. > Got KCJJ for a while, and that was nice, and 1680 Jamz (sorry Neal- > no reception this morning from NJ) Overnight, I heard one of the AMAX promo liners (the "Zorro" one) on 1680 WTTM during the automated Christmas music -- that was nice. During the daytime today, things were better. There's nice Stereo music on 850 WREF and 1210 WPHT, and even 600 WICC broke away from their talk format to play some Christmas music in Stereo. Multicultural 930 WPAT was also playing music in Stereo, although not necessarily Christmas music. It was interesting to hear the Korean programming on 1430 WNSW play some Xmas music (in English), but unfortunately without any true Stereo separation. Same thing with 1660 WWRU, which broadcasts a Stereo signal 24/7, but carries the Spanish "Radio Unica" network which is only produced in mono. One thing I still have to do today is fire up the old Hallicrafters. There is just something about the holiday season, with snow falling outside, that makes an old vacuum tube radio seem to have even better reception and sound quality. p.s. For the part of the world that is already in December 26th -- happy Boxing Day, whatever that means! (Us Americans don't have any clue about most of these U.K./Irish/Australian/Canadian/etc. holidays...) From kevtronics@yahoo.com Wed Dec 25 20:37:58 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Dec 2002 04:37:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 87714 invoked from network); 26 Dec 2002 04:37:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Dec 2002 04:37:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Dec 2002 04:37:58 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.140] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 26 Dec 2002 04:37:57 -0000 Date: Thu, 26 Dec 2002 04:37:57 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: The JAM Song Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 993 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.87.14 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics If you recall the days of the '70s and '80s when contemporary music was still popular on AM, in Stereo where available, and stations had fantastic jingles to match, this will be fun: http://www.jingles.com/jam/collector/jamsong.html You can download and listen to "The JAM Song"... a sort of tribute that JAM Productions made to all the stations that were using their jingles at the time. It was originally released in 1985 on a promotional record, and features some neat Stereo effects as the "jingle singers" go through various station jingles from around the USA and around the world. One of the stations mentioned is KUSA... and somewhere I have an MP3 of 550 KUSA during their AM Stereo country music format in 1984 that features a *one-minute* jingle for the station. Those were the days... I can't imagine any station nowadays playing such a long "jingle song". I'll try to dig up this file and put it on my web server so people can download and take a listen to it. From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Dec 25 21:17:51 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Dec 2002 05:17:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 98793 invoked from network); 26 Dec 2002 05:17:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Dec 2002 05:17:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.194) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Dec 2002 05:17:51 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 25 Dec 2002 21:17:51 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} The JAM Song Date: Thu, 26 Dec 2002 00:16:55 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 26 Dec 2002 05:17:51.0101 (UTC) FILETIME=[22F3D2D0:01C2AC9E] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.161.208.244] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 kevtronics@yahoo.com wrote: > One of the stations mentioned is KUSA... and somewhere I have an MP3 of 550 KUSA during their AM Stereo country music format in 1984 that features a *one-minute* jingle for the station. Those were the days... I can't imagine any station nowadays playing such a long "jingle song". Remember the extra long jingles WLAC 1510 had? I think it was the "Rhythm Of The City" package. WLAC just ain't been the same since Billboard sold it. Kevin From dfr68819@wanadoo.fr Wed Dec 25 23:23:02 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dfr68819@wanadoo.fr X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Dec 2002 07:23:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 20591 invoked from network); 26 Dec 2002 07:23:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Dec 2002 07:23:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Dec 2002 07:23:01 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.146] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 26 Dec 2002 07:23:01 -0000 Date: Thu, 26 Dec 2002 07:22:59 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: AM stereo schematic Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 232 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Denis " X-Originating-IP: 213.41.140.239 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=117455200 X-Yahoo-Profile: pcvpcn Hello, I am French and my English is very bad, sorry. I look for the plan of an AM converter stereo for middles waves. The site: www.inetarena.com /~ alfredot/pics/is closed. Another site exists? Thank you for your answer. Denis From bjackson@indyradio.com Thu Dec 26 03:38:39 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Dec 2002 11:38:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 64139 invoked from network); 26 Dec 2002 11:38:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Dec 2002 11:38:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Dec 2002 11:38:38 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.147] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 26 Dec 2002 11:38:38 -0000 Date: Thu, 26 Dec 2002 11:38:37 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Slim Pickin's for AM Stereo music, but a Merry Christmas anyhow Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <000f01c2ac5f$95822480$0101a8c0@pavilion> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1249 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923 " X-Originating-IP: 206.246.142.133 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Christopher Cuff" wrote: > It was dismal this morning- DX conditions were fine, but WPHT had talk > radio, WWKB no pilot, talk. WJR as JP said was a mono feed. > Got KCJJ for a while, and that was nice, and 1680 Jamz (sorry Neal- no > reception this morning from NJ) > SO.. I hate to say it, but I put on the XM, and was thrilled with the > selection and quality of the Christmas program on the 40's channel. (I > broadcast this via AM Stereo throughout the house (and a tad beyond.... ;-) > Sound is actually quite good. > Chris I had to work 6pm-mid Christmas Eve at WFMS...On my way home, I was scanning the dial on the 'ol UX-1...dx conditions here in Indianapolis were not very good. I couldn't even get WGN, WLS, or WJR which usually have great signals here. WIBC here in Indy decided that, even though they have an exciter, music would sound better in mono ;-) Christmas day I got my fix though...WLS and WJR came through (but WJR seemed to be running a syndicated show produced in mono)...And can't forget about WZZB! Hope everyone had a Merry Christmas...Turned out to be a white one with 8 inches in my area. -Brad Jackson -Susquehanna, Indianapolis -WGLD/WGRL/WFMS From bjackson@indyradio.com Thu Dec 26 03:49:17 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Dec 2002 11:49:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 78700 invoked from network); 26 Dec 2002 11:49:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Dec 2002 11:49:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Dec 2002 11:49:16 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.150] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 26 Dec 2002 11:49:16 -0000 Date: Thu, 26 Dec 2002 11:49:12 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: The JAM Song Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1084 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923 " X-Originating-IP: 206.246.142.133 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: > One of the stations mentioned is KUSA... and somewhere I have an MP3 > of 550 KUSA during their AM Stereo country music format in 1984 that > features a *one-minute* jingle for the station. Those were the > days... I can't imagine any station nowadays playing such a long > "jingle song". Emmis owned WIBC here in Indy still has some of the :30 and :60 jingle songs...They usually play it going into the noon and 5pm news, and anytime the automation needs to fill time. When I was working overnights at WTTS, the evening guy and I found a storage closet un-locked full of 45's and reels. Old jingle packages from TM Productions (before the merger) where they proudly exclaimed "Stereo" in the then WGCL *FM* jingles! Also found was a 3:00 jingle song on 45 for what was at the time WTTS- AM talking about how great life was in south/central Indiana with WTTS and country favorites. And, yes, Brad made copies! -Brad Jackson -Susquehanna, Indianapolis -WGLD/WGRL/WFMS From don@idpt.com Thu Dec 26 04:37:30 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: don@idpt.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Dec 2002 12:37:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 45956 invoked from network); 26 Dec 2002 12:37:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Dec 2002 12:37:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout2-eri1.midsouth.rr.com) (24.165.200.7) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Dec 2002 12:37:28 -0000 Received: from primary (cpe-024-024-118-043.midsouth.rr.com [24.24.118.43]) by mailout2-eri1.midsouth.rr.com (8.11.4/8.11.4) with ESMTP id gBQCbRf16750 for ; Thu, 26 Dec 2002 06:37:28 -0600 (CST) To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} Re: Slim Pickin's for AM Stereo music, but a Merry Christmas anyhow Date: Thu, 26 Dec 2002 06:37:26 -0600 Message-ID: <000101c2acdb$8f3118d0$0202a8c0@primary> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2616 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: From: "Don Johnson" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=32705644 X-Yahoo-Profile: htmldon " p.s. For the part of the world that is already in December 26th -- happy Boxing Day, whatever that means! (Us Americans don't have any clue about most of these U.K./Irish/Australian/Canadian/etc. holidays...)" We celebrate Boxing day in America too... it's the day you BOX up all the gifts you don't like and take them back to the store :) _______________ Don Johnson don@idpt.com -----Original Message----- From: Kevin T. [mailto:kevtronics@yahoo.com] Sent: Wednesday, December 25, 2002 6:30 PM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: Slim Pickin's for AM Stereo music, but a Merry Christmas anyhow > It was dismal this morning- DX conditions were fine, but WPHT had > talk radio, WWKB no pilot, talk. WJR as JP said was a mono feed. > Got KCJJ for a while, and that was nice, and 1680 Jamz (sorry Neal- > no reception this morning from NJ) Overnight, I heard one of the AMAX promo liners (the "Zorro" one) on 1680 WTTM during the automated Christmas music -- that was nice. During the daytime today, things were better. There's nice Stereo music on 850 WREF and 1210 WPHT, and even 600 WICC broke away from their talk format to play some Christmas music in Stereo. Multicultural 930 WPAT was also playing music in Stereo, although not necessarily Christmas music. It was interesting to hear the Korean programming on 1430 WNSW play some Xmas music (in English), but unfortunately without any true Stereo separation. Same thing with 1660 WWRU, which broadcasts a Stereo signal 24/7, but carries the Spanish "Radio Unica" network which is only produced in mono. One thing I still have to do today is fire up the old Hallicrafters. There is just something about the holiday season, with snow falling outside, that makes an old vacuum tube radio seem to have even better reception and sound quality. p.s. For the part of the world that is already in December 26th -- happy Boxing Day, whatever that means! (Us Americans don't have any clue about most of these U.K./Irish/Australian/Canadian/etc. holidays...) Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Dec 26 06:53:58 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Dec 2002 14:53:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 88695 invoked from network); 26 Dec 2002 14:53:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Dec 2002 14:53:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.85) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Dec 2002 14:53:52 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 26 Dec 2002 06:53:52 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: The JAM Song Date: Thu, 26 Dec 2002 09:53:36 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 26 Dec 2002 14:53:52.0148 (UTC) FILETIME=[9AF11540:01C2ACEE] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.137.149.51] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Speaking of jingles.... Anybody have a copy of the "What A Great Place To Be" package from WOWO's Group W Westinghouse days? Kevin From rwagoner@cox.net Thu Dec 26 09:42:22 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner@cox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Dec 2002 17:42:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 91350 invoked from network); 26 Dec 2002 17:42:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Dec 2002 17:42:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Dec 2002 17:42:21 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.151] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 26 Dec 2002 17:42:21 -0000 Date: Thu, 26 Dec 2002 17:42:21 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Flashback Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 904 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Richard Wagoner " X-Originating-IP: 68.4.33.253 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=96123889 X-Yahoo-Profile: richardalanwagoner Don Barrett writes a daily Los Angeles radio comumn on his site, laradio.com (requires a subscription). Today he had a holiday memory that included the following from Mary Lyon: >As I usually did for the rest of my fellow schlubs who had to work the holiday, I made my signature "killer" chocolate chip cookies to bring in. Between newscasts, I wandered over with a plate of them for the KABC folks. I waved at Ken Minyard and the group from the engineer's booth. Through the glass, Minyard motioned for me to come over into the on-air booth. Shocked, terrified, intimidated, and UTTERLY thrilled, I tiptoed over. I mean, after all, this was the AM! The big guys. The grown-ups! I was being invited over from the kiddie table to join them at the big people's table for a few special moments.< Just thought you'd appreciate a memory from a time when AM was still king. Happy holidays! Richard Wagoner From michaelj@vcn.com Thu Dec 26 10:56:34 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Dec 2002 18:56:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 8911 invoked from network); 26 Dec 2002 18:56:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Dec 2002 18:56:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m1-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Dec 2002 18:56:33 -0000 Received: from michael (unverified [209.193.86.62]) by m1-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Thu, 26 Dec 2002 11:56:33 -0700 To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} Re: Fw: amstereo.com web site Date: Thu, 26 Dec 2002 11:56:05 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) In-Reply-To: <003e01c2abbf$8592f860$827dfea9@home1> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Importance: Normal From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Yikes! Good point Scott. Maybe I SHOULDN'T have asked. :( MJR n WYO -----Original Message----- From: Scott Todd [mailto:stodd@sherbtel.net] Sent: Tuesday, December 24, 2002 7:44 PM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Fw: amstereo.com web site Kind of makes me wonder if the fact that he asked might make them consider renewing it. I hope not, but sometimes it's hard to predict when asking an innocent question can blow up in your face. Scott Todd where the Christmas music pickings aren't all that great. Wish SOMEONE would play Marvelous Toy. All the nostalgia stations are buried in QRM at night. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From michaelj@vcn.com Thu Dec 26 11:06:54 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Dec 2002 19:06:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 65290 invoked from network); 26 Dec 2002 19:06:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Dec 2002 19:06:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m1-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.31) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Dec 2002 19:06:53 -0000 Received: from michael (unverified [209.193.86.62]) by m1-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Thu, 26 Dec 2002 12:06:53 -0700 To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} Re: Slim Pickin's for AM Stereo music Date: Thu, 26 Dec 2002 12:06:25 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) In-Reply-To: <000101c2acdb$8f3118d0$0202a8c0@primary> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Importance: Normal From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit No big Christmas presents from the Salt Lake City market either. This year both during the day and at night I listened in for some Christmas music in STEREO hoping that some of the big guys would turn their exciter back on for Christmas music. No go, though. My daytime DXing brought in the Salt Lake stations and no pilots there. Business as usual. Lots of Xmas music out there, but none in stereo. My locals (KEVA and semi-local KMER) in stereo with beautiful Xmas music (thanks to me:) ) but nothing coming in in stereo otherwise :( I was hoping maybe KALL 910, Radio Ditzee 860, 1320 KFNZ, 1280 KZNS (all who were stereo at one time) maybe would flip their exciters back on, but sadly, no. Even Xmas eve night, didn't hear a whole lot of anything out there. Was hoping for maybe KFI or KOMA to have stereo music. Don't remember if KOA-Denver ever was stereo. KSL had wonderful Xmas music going on....but even if they DID flip the exciter back (if it's even still installed) they were Kahn...not C-quam. KFAQ Tulsa not coming in very well and as far as I can tell, no pilot since they went news anyway. Had a good DX from Spokane, WA on 920. KXLY....normally news, playing Xmas music. But no stereo. Have no idea if they ever were stereo. Nope nope nope. Slim pickins says it all :( MJR n WYO [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From dfr68819@wanadoo.fr Thu Dec 26 11:55:45 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dfr68819@wanadoo.fr X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Dec 2002 19:55:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 23236 invoked from network); 26 Dec 2002 19:55:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Dec 2002 19:55:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Dec 2002 19:55:43 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.146] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 26 Dec 2002 19:55:43 -0000 Date: Thu, 26 Dec 2002 19:55:41 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: AM stereo schematic Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 233 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Denis " X-Originating-IP: 213.41.140.239 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=117455200 X-Yahoo-Profile: pcvpcn Hello, I am French and my English is very bad, sorry. I look for the plan of an AM converter stereo for middles waves. The site: www.inetarena.com /~ alfredot/pics/is closed. Another site exists? Thank you for your answer. Denis From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Dec 26 14:31:29 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Dec 2002 22:31:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 6393 invoked from network); 26 Dec 2002 22:31:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Dec 2002 22:31:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Dec 2002 22:31:28 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.155] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 26 Dec 2002 22:31:28 -0000 Date: Thu, 26 Dec 2002 22:31:28 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: AM stereo schematic Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1199 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.95.132 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Hello, I am French and my English is very bad, sorry. I look for > the plan of an AM converter stereo for middles waves. The site: > www.inetarena.com /~ alfredot/pics/is closed. Another site exists? > Thank you for your answer. Denis, I don't know if anybody here speaks French, but you're doing fine with your English so far, so I'll try to help you out. If you wish to add AM Stereo to a radio, we have a decoder available which you can use. Chris Cuff sells them; I believe the price is U.S. $25, and it will be no problem getting it mailed to you in France. For more information, you can e-mail him at ccuff@in4web.com or he reads this Forum so maybe he can reply to you here. You will need some knowledge of electronics to install it in a radio, but since you are asking about schematics, I think you will be fine. I just checked and it does appear that Alfredo's web site is not working. Does anybody know why? Another web site with technical information about AM Stereo circuits, including schematics, is the "AM Stereo Tech Zone": http://www.hal-pc.org/~jsgil/AM-Stereo/ Hopefully this information helps you. It is nice to have members here from all around the world! From ccuff@in4web.com Thu Dec 26 14:35:51 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Dec 2002 22:35:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 97620 invoked from network); 26 Dec 2002 22:35:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Dec 2002 22:35:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Dec 2002 22:35:50 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.68]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Thu, 26 Dec 2002 17:31:02 -0500 Message-ID: <002c01c2ad2d$edd22120$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM stereo schematic Date: Thu, 26 Dec 2002 17:27:08 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 Hi Denis- Do you need a decoder to listen to AM stereo broadcast? Something to make a present radio capable of receiving the AM Stereo signal? Or is your interest in a transmitter device? Chris ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, December 26, 2002 2:22 AM Subject: {AMSF} AM stereo schematic > Hello, I am French and my English is very bad, sorry. I look for the > plan of an AM converter stereo for middles waves. From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Dec 26 17:18:20 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Dec 2002 01:18:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 19518 invoked from network); 27 Dec 2002 01:18:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Dec 2002 01:18:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r09.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.105) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Dec 2002 01:18:19 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r09.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.1a8.e59b522 (4418) for ; Thu, 26 Dec 2002 20:18:13 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1a8.e59b522.2b3d0454@aol.com> Date: Thu, 26 Dec 2002 20:18:12 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Slim Pickin's for AM Stereo music, but a Merry Christmas anyhow To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/25/02 4:47:52 PM Eastern Standard Time, toledohamradio@yahoo.com writes: << Not much to report on AM Stereo for Christmas :( Overnight tuning into 720AM WGN all I could get was a high pitch over music, and WLS was feeble as well, 2 Chicago Stereo stations with music - I'm assuming the big snowstorm destroyed the reception. WSPD did NOT turn on the AM Stereo as requested. WSAI 1530 Cincy had a good music program, but mono as usual, but decent fidelity. WJR ran a Disney program in MONO (pilot on, mono audio) all Christmas Eve and today until 4pm - now WJR finally in Stereo AM Again! Bright spot on the dial: CFCO 630 AM Stereo with extremely decent stereo music. >> Well as usual we were the bright spot on the low end of the dial here...broadcasting all sorts of Christmas music off of the hard drive then at 7pm we went with ABC's live broadcast from the MGM studios in flordia with a break at 11p Christmas eve for a locla live Christmas eve service..then back to ABC's Christams special until 6pm Christmas day...with some more local churches for 3 hours ,followed by more music off of the hard drive ..giving listeners locally and via the internet a one hour extra bonus..running Christmas music until 1am 12/26/02. Lots of good feed back on this years big production as usual..and as usual I greated friends and family with the Sangean portable in the ol shirt pocket under the pull over sweater..enjoying and reaping from my works of turning a talk station into a music station for 49 hours. Hated to see Christmas go by so quickly ...again this year...and cant wait til next Christmas to do it all over again. I hope that everyone that tuned in enjoyed it all. Hope everyones 2003 will be better than 2002.We all are going to have a busy year coming up regarding IBOC....hope you all are ready to stand your ground. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network _______________________________________________________ From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Dec 26 20:27:25 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Dec 2002 04:27:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 95194 invoked from network); 27 Dec 2002 04:27:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Dec 2002 04:27:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.18) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Dec 2002 04:27:23 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 26 Dec 2002 20:27:23 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Flashback Date: Thu, 26 Dec 2002 19:40:24 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 27 Dec 2002 04:27:23.0896 (UTC) FILETIME=[4102BF80:01C2AD60] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.133.40.91] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 rwagoner@cox.net wrote: >Just thought you'd appreciate a memory from a time when AM was still king. AM is STILL where it counts! Most any idiot can make an FM sound decent, but it takes a real engineer to make a good sounding AM station. FM and Digital are just passing fads, both will go away soon. Kevin From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Dec 26 21:09:31 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Dec 2002 05:09:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 64147 invoked from network); 27 Dec 2002 05:09:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Dec 2002 05:09:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Dec 2002 05:09:30 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.158] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Dec 2002 05:09:30 -0000 Date: Fri, 27 Dec 2002 05:09:27 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: AM Stereo at its best (was: Re: Flashback) Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2423 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.72.133 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > AM is STILL where it counts! Most any idiot can make an FM sound > decent, It depends on your standards of what is "decent". Listen to nearly any of the New York City area FM stations and you will be less than impressed. From many, what I hear is simply a large amount of *distortion*. The slight distortion you might get from tuning a Sony SRF-42 to a highly modulated AM Stereo station pales in comparison to what these FM stations are putting out. I can flip back and forth on my GE Superadio III, and the FM stations just sound plain *lousy* compared to the AM stations. The FM is grundgy, gritty, and over- processed, while the AM is clean and clear, with sound that is much more dynamically pure. > but it takes a real engineer to make a good sounding AM station. I'd modify your comment to say that "most any idiot can make an AM mono station sound decent", as nowadays it basically just involves plugging in the Optimod and pushing a few buttons to get the standard "AM Talk" or "AM Music" presets. However, to make an AM station -- mono or Stereo -- stand out from the crowd and really sound special, does take a fair amount of engineering skill. And to that regard, I present the first in a series of MP3 recordings of AM Stereo that will really knock your socks off with their superb sound quality. I was listening to my tapes of 1680 WTTM's Christmas music and right away I could tell that it is some of the best- sounding AM Stereo I have ever heard. I made an MP3 of the best moments, which is quite long because there were two songs that were just so good, I didn't want listeners to miss any part of them. Here it is... at about 4.7 megs, it will take a while to download, but believe me when I say this, it is well worth the wait. The quality through the MP3 file is not as good as the original broadcast, but it is still more than enough to impress anybody who doubts that AM Stereo can deliver crisp, clear, distortion-free, wide-separation sound: ftp://209.193.86.116/amaxdemo/wttmxms1.mp3 I have lots more where this came from, including some equally good recordings of 1450 WCTC's talk programming that I processed with Dynamic Noise Reduction to give very clean sound -- similar to what Motorola's "Symphony" DSP radio should be able to achieve.... but more files will wait until Friday at work where I have a high-speed connection to upload them all. From dav259@csiro.au Thu Dec 26 21:22:40 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Dec 2002 05:22:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 24836 invoked from network); 27 Dec 2002 05:22:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Dec 2002 05:22:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Dec 2002 05:22:38 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gBR5MaP19195; Fri, 27 Dec 2002 16:22:36 +1100 (EST) Date: Fri, 27 Dec 2002 16:22:36 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: amstereoforum Subject: Re: {AMSF} Seasons Greetings In-Reply-To: <006c01c2aba3$5118e480$0101a8c0@pavilion> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public On Tue, 24 Dec 2002, Christopher Cuff wrote: > And to all a good night!- I am listening to a CD made of WJR last year by > Johhny Electron, and it is awsome what a class act that station is. > JP- Howa about recording another disc?? hint hint.... :-) > Chris Hey Chris - I'm just back - sortof - from an Oz Christmas. It's great to have you back the way you were (are!) and not pushing your Christmas lights - cuz they flash left and right almost at random - not like C-quam where the strings literally come out of the left channel when recorded "conventionally". (Look that up in your Funk and Wagnell's) Johnny - thanks! - for all you've done over the last 12 months. Keep it up. We have to fight on - as we will. There are many fish still to be fried. I hope you US lot understand the lingo. Let the Times Square New Years bell sound and we will all come out fighting for what we hear - and wan't everyone else to also hear and appreciate. We may be fanatics of sorts - some might say eccentric - but here we all are striving for a cause that won't hurt anyone - and can do many so much good - if they'd only embrace it. I've had a bit of family sickness over the last couple of days and AM stereo (and Woody - the dog) have made it much more comfortable to handle. Hey - full steam ahead ... ))) AM Stereo Forever! ((( Ian - Melbourne From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Dec 26 22:05:40 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Dec 2002 06:05:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 94773 invoked from network); 27 Dec 2002 06:05:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Dec 2002 06:05:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.96) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Dec 2002 06:05:37 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 26 Dec 2002 22:05:37 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM Stereo at its best (was: Re: Flashback) Date: Fri, 27 Dec 2002 01:05:25 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 27 Dec 2002 06:05:37.0914 (UTC) FILETIME=[FA1E85A0:01C2AD6D] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.133.40.91] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 kevtronics@yahoo.com > It depends on your standards of what is "decent". Listen to nearly any of the New York City area FM stations and you will be less than impressed. From many, what I hear is simply a large amount of *distortion*. When I was in NY a while back, the FMs did sound *VERY* grungy. I think all they do is plug in as many compressors as they can into the audio line then a composite clipper or two. One Station, I think it was "Z-100", was clipping the composite so much the Stereo light would flicker out with the peaks! No matter what you do to the audio, FM sounds tinny to me. About the best you can do on FM is a pair of Audio Prizms driving an Optimod 9100 with the Texar number 5 card. No matter what you do to an FM, a well engineered AM will sound better. > > The slight distortion you might get from tuning a Sony SRF-42 to a highly modulated AM Stereo station pales in comparison to what these FM stations are putting out. You should hear the AMs around here! Nothing like the sound of over-driven flat modulator tubes and gassy PA tubes to bring out the "best" in sound! I can honestly say WFIS 1600 is the best sounding station on the dial, AM or FM, in the Greenville-Spartanburg-Anderson market. WKDY 1400 does come close! It is a shame that WPCI Stereo 1490 has such a rotten STL phone drop. When they had the studio on site, it had sweet audio. > > I'd modify your comment to say that "most any idiot can make an AM mono station sound decent", as nowadays it basically just involves plugging in the Optimod and pushing a few buttons to get the standard "AM Talk" or "AM Music" presets. It does take a wee bit more than that. Getting decent audio out of the Optimod to the transmitter is just a small part of good AM audio. First, if you have a tube transmitter, you have to make sure you have good tubes in it. You must tweak the transmitter and balance the modulator tubes or tweak the PDM board and null out the hum. You also have to make sure the caps are good in the audio section and the RF deck and output tuning network is broadbanded enough. Now do you have a good sounding AM? Nope, not yet! You have to make sure your phasing equipment is broadbanded enough if you are directional, and make sure your ATU is broadbanded enough for a 15KC or wider signal. The wider your tower face, the better too. > > I was listening to my tapes of 1680 WTTM's Christmas music and right away I could tell that it is some of the best- sounding AM Stereo I have ever heard. Yea, Neal has damn good audio! Kevin From dav259@csiro.au Thu Dec 26 22:13:02 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Dec 2002 06:13:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 88826 invoked from network); 27 Dec 2002 06:13:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Dec 2002 06:13:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Dec 2002 06:13:01 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id gBR6D0P21051 for ; Fri, 27 Dec 2002 17:13:00 +1100 (EST) Date: Fri, 27 Dec 2002 17:13:00 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Slim Pickin's for AM Stereo music, but a Merry Christmas anyhow In-Reply-To: <20021225214727.79481.qmail@web14206.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public On Wed, 25 Dec 2002, John P. wrote: > Here's to another year of renewed interest in Stereo AM, and thanks to all who > are supportive of our cause, including any Clear Channel station with the > stereo AM audio on for the holidays. > > Merry Christmas to all, and to all, a good night! Our local GTV9 (Television City, Richmond, Vic) still uses the slogan "Still the One" - after almost 20 years of promoting themselves as "Let us be the One" (old Carpenters song) - and it's worked. They have stayed on the top that long. (A bit commercially unhealthy really - but it keeps the others on their toes.) Thanks Johnny. You're the One! It's almost three years since I joined Bryan's list and you have been so positive and focussed for the entire duration. Please never change! IMO you win the "Still the One" award for 2002 (thankfully amongst some very good challengers). Happy New Year! Ian From groucho@skyweb.net Thu Dec 26 23:04:29 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Dec 2002 07:04:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 13618 invoked from network); 27 Dec 2002 07:04:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Dec 2002 07:04:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Dec 2002 07:04:27 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gBR7AQUr039293 for ; Fri, 27 Dec 2002 02:10:27 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3E0BFA5F.DEB077AC@skyweb.net> Date: Fri, 27 Dec 2002 01:59:44 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM Stereo at its best (was: Re: Flashback) References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 For Those that Don't believe AM can have High fidelity.. Yeah Just listen to that MP'3 Wow even I didn't know the station sounded that good.... Caught it at the top of the hour when the Smartcaster kicks in with the station ID from the transmitter site and Overrides the studio Programming.. Very cool. Quality wise I guess that's what you get when you have a well known Concert Audio Mix Engineer/recording studio Engineer with many Gold and Platinum records hanging on the walls. as your Radio stations Chief Engineer.. LOL... Maybe I should open the Neal Newman school of Audio Engineering For Am stereo Engineers. Heck I used to teach recording at a 4 year college.speaking of which Hey Mike,Russell,Jerry..... You awake... maybe We should make 1580 AM stereo??? quick Get David C on the Phone.. Seriously..... good Equipment from the Console to the Transmitter is all that's needed. Besides a good set of Ears.. I'm Available to any AM stereo station who wants good audio.. just supply transportation and Lots of Stuarts cheeseburgers with rootbeer.. Ohh Yes a pay check with benefits.. and I'm fine... Just think Local#3 could call me back to work. and I could tell them where they can go..... that would make my day.. If not for WTTM I would be going nuts..... technically I have been out of work since march.. doing 1 or 2 Concerts a week. and just getting by Barely... I need a full time Job.. this is no joke... don't mind the nut behind the Keyboard. I'm just On 2 percecets. my back is killing... anyone looking for a partner in a Station? call it sweat Equity... I wish I owned a station AM or FM... prefer AM Stereo... Neal Possum Hunter wrote: > kevtronics@yahoo.com > > It depends on your standards of what is "decent". Listen to nearly any of > the New York City area FM stations and you will be less than impressed. > >From many, what I hear is simply a large amount of *distortion*. > > When I was in NY a while back, the FMs did sound *VERY* grungy. I think all > they do is plug in as many compressors as they can into the audio line then > a composite clipper or two. One Station, I think it was "Z-100", was > clipping the composite so much the Stereo light would flicker out with the > peaks! No matter what you do to the audio, FM sounds tinny to me. About the > best you can do on FM is a pair of Audio Prizms driving an Optimod 9100 with > the Texar number 5 card. No matter what you do to an FM, a well engineered > AM will sound better. > > > > The slight distortion you might get from tuning a Sony SRF-42 to a highly > modulated AM Stereo station pales in comparison to what these FM stations > are putting out. > > You should hear the AMs around here! Nothing like the sound of over-driven > flat modulator tubes and gassy PA tubes to bring out the "best" in sound! > > I can honestly say WFIS 1600 is the best sounding station on the dial, AM or > FM, in the Greenville-Spartanburg-Anderson market. WKDY 1400 does come > close! It is a shame that WPCI Stereo 1490 has such a rotten STL phone drop. > When they had the studio on site, it had sweet audio. > > > > I'd modify your comment to say that "most any idiot can make an AM mono > station sound decent", as nowadays it basically just involves plugging in > the Optimod and pushing a few buttons to get the standard "AM Talk" or "AM > Music" presets. > > It does take a wee bit more than that. Getting decent audio out of the > Optimod to the transmitter is just a small part of good AM audio. First, if > you have a tube transmitter, you have to make sure you have good tubes in > it. You must tweak the transmitter and balance the modulator tubes or tweak > the PDM board and null out the hum. You also have to make sure the caps are > good in the audio section and the RF deck and output tuning network is > broadbanded enough. > > Now do you have a good sounding AM? Nope, not yet! > You have to make sure your phasing equipment is broadbanded enough if you > are directional, and make sure your ATU is broadbanded enough for a 15KC or > wider signal. The wider your tower face, the better too. > > > > I was listening to my tapes of 1680 WTTM's Christmas music and right away > I could tell that it is some of the best- sounding AM Stereo I have ever > heard. > > Yea, Neal has damn good audio! > > Kevin > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From dfr68819@wanadoo.fr Fri Dec 27 01:17:36 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dfr68819@wanadoo.fr X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Dec 2002 09:17:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 92147 invoked from network); 27 Dec 2002 09:17:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Dec 2002 09:17:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.86) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Dec 2002 09:17:35 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.135] by n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Dec 2002 09:17:35 -0000 Date: Fri, 27 Dec 2002 09:17:32 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: AM stereo schematic Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1780 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Denis " X-Originating-IP: 80.15.216.24 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=117455200 X-Yahoo-Profile: pcvpcn One did not understand. For what I look it is a stereo coder to connect on a transmetter AM.Il had it it one on: www.inetarena.com / ~ alfredot / pics/ but this site is closed. Can you help me. In a month, I go to holidays to ORLANDO and I shall want to visit a radio station AM. My wish is to create a radio station AM stereo in France because it does not exist. I wish you a happy new year. Thank you for your reponce. denis. --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: > > Hello, I am French and my English is very bad, sorry. I look for > > the plan of an AM converter stereo for middles waves. The site: > > www.inetarena.com /~ alfredot/pics/is closed. Another site exists? > > Thank you for your answer. > > Denis, > > I don't know if anybody here speaks French, but you're doing fine > with your English so far, so I'll try to help you out. > > If you wish to add AM Stereo to a radio, we have a decoder available > which you can use. Chris Cuff sells them; I believe the price is > U.S. $25, and it will be no problem getting it mailed to you in > France. For more information, you can e-mail him at ccuff@i... > or he reads this Forum so maybe he can reply to you here. > > You will need some knowledge of electronics to install it in a radio, > but since you are asking about schematics, I think you will be fine. > > I just checked and it does appear that Alfredo's web site is not > working. Does anybody know why? > > Another web site with technical information about AM Stereo circuits, > including schematics, is the "AM Stereo Tech Zone": > > http://www.hal-pc.org/~jsgil/AM-Stereo/ > > Hopefully this information helps you. It is nice to have members > here from all around the world! From steveking@wgnradio.com Fri Dec 27 02:34:44 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: steveking@wgnradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Dec 2002 10:34:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 38730 invoked from network); 27 Dec 2002 10:34:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Dec 2002 10:34:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Dec 2002 10:34:44 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.182] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Dec 2002 10:34:44 -0000 Date: Fri, 27 Dec 2002 10:34:41 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: The JAM Song Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2332 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgnhim " X-Originating-IP: 172.161.221.38 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71806925 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgnhim Hey Brad, ask one of your friends at WIBC to see if they have any of the jingles from the late 60's or early 70's laying around. I think you'd enjoy listening to them. I worked at WIBC and WNAP-FM from 1969 to 1971 and, while I worked with TM productions to produce a jingle package for WNAP, the ones that just blew me away were the ones that WIBC had. I forget who wrote them, but to this day, along with the first WCFL, Chicago, jingles, the WIBC package stands out in my mind as being one of the best I've ever heard. For example, at that time, Gary Todd was WIBC's morning man and they had a wonderful long story jingle about this guy who got up in the middle of the night to do the morning show. Some of the lyrics went something like: "What kind of guy would do a thing like this? It's either got to be a clod or Gary Todd, or both. It's either got to be a clod or Gary Todd, your host. Strike back at the morning, man, with WIBC." They also had a great jingle for Chuck Riley, who did afternoons, that went, in part: "Wouldn't you really rather Riley? Wouldn't you Riley rather really? Riley'd really rather dazzle Indianapolis! WIBC." Damn, that was a great sounding station! Heck, Indianapolis was a great market. I'm sure you know that the call letters WGLD were used here in Chicago before they migrated south:-) Y'know, now that I think about it, I may have some old reel to reel copies of those WIBC jingles stashed in a box in the basement. Hmmmmm.... Steve King/WGN-AM, Chicago --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "bradleyj923 " wrote: > Emmis owned WIBC here in Indy still has some of the :30 and :60 > jingle songs...They usually play it going into the noon and 5pm news, > and anytime the automation needs to fill time. > > When I was working overnights at WTTS, the evening guy and I found a > storage closet un-locked full of 45's and reels. Old jingle packages > from TM Productions (before the merger) where they proudly > exclaimed "Stereo" in the then WGCL *FM* jingles! > > Also found was a 3:00 jingle song on 45 for what was at the time WTTS- > AM talking about how great life was in south/central Indiana with > WTTS and country favorites. > > And, yes, Brad made copies! > > -Brad Jackson > -Susquehanna, Indianapolis > -WGLD/WGRL/WFMS From bjackson@indyradio.com Fri Dec 27 03:19:47 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Dec 2002 11:19:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 45354 invoked from network); 27 Dec 2002 11:19:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Dec 2002 11:19:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.87) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Dec 2002 11:19:45 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.180] by n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Dec 2002 11:19:45 -0000 Date: Fri, 27 Dec 2002 11:19:41 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: The JAM Song Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1819 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923 " X-Originating-IP: 206.246.142.147 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "wgnhim " wrote: > Hey Brad, ask one of your friends at WIBC to see if they have any of > the jingles from the late 60's or early 70's laying around. I think > you'd enjoy listening to them. I worked at WIBC and WNAP-FM from 1969 > to 1971 and, while I worked with TM productions to produce a jingle > package for WNAP, the ones that just blew me away were the ones that > WIBC had. I forget who wrote them, but to this day, along with the > first WCFL, Chicago, jingles, the WIBC package stands out in my mind > as being one of the best I've ever heard. >SNIP< I'll have to ask around and see if those still exist. I know that WIBC has been through a couple of ownership changes and studio re- locations...It seems like that's when all of the "goodies" get lost. I'll also see if I can't get the current jingle songs uploaded as well. > Damn, that was a great sounding station! Heck, Indianapolis was a > great market. I'm sure you know that the call letters WGLD were used > here in Chicago before they migrated south:-) Actually, I didn't know that. I have always known them as Indy area calls...When I started with SI, we had WGRL on 104.5 and bought 93.9 with the WGLD calls. We then just fliped calls around to get WGLD up to 104.5 to do oldies with. Before moving to Indy, I grew up in southern Indiana and was more familiar with Louisville radio (talk about a waste of a market!) > Y'know, now that I think about it, I may have some old reel to reel > copies of those WIBC jingles stashed in a box in the basement. > Hmmmmm.... > > Steve King/WGN-AM, Chicago BTW Steve...Did you ever work with either Paul Kasey at WIBC or Charlie Brown at WNAP? -Brad Jackson -Susquehanna, Indianapolis -WGLD/WGRL/WFMS From amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk Fri Dec 27 04:24:05 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Dec 2002 12:24:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 11583 invoked from network); 27 Dec 2002 12:24:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Dec 2002 12:24:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.86) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Dec 2002 12:24:02 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.248] by n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Dec 2002 12:24:02 -0000 Date: Fri, 27 Dec 2002 12:24:02 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Stereo Recording of Radio Studio X (Itlay) Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 152 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "m1ctk " X-Originating-IP: 213.121.67.48 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113985069 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereofan 1000 miles DX - Info in the ID tag http://www.amstereo.audio-stream.net/amstereo/files/upload-here- please/Radio%20%20Studio%20X%20-%20Italy.mp3 From amfmdx@fastq.com Fri Dec 27 08:58:07 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Dec 2002 16:58:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 89300 invoked from network); 27 Dec 2002 16:58:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Dec 2002 16:58:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Dec 2002 16:58:06 -0000 Received: from fastq ([208.187.57.34]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id gBRGw5P51699 for ; Fri, 27 Dec 2002 09:58:05 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <001d01c2adc9$0235b0a0$2239bbd0@com> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM Stereo at its best (was: Re: Flashback) Date: Fri, 27 Dec 2002 09:57:13 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > When I was in NY a while back, the FMs did sound *VERY* grungy. Holy smokes! Its the correct spelling of GRUNGY. It used to be that NYC AMs sounded great. Those days seem to be over. Kevin Mesa, Arizona From groucho@skyweb.net Fri Dec 27 09:52:26 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Dec 2002 17:52:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 11599 invoked from network); 27 Dec 2002 17:52:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Dec 2002 17:52:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Dec 2002 17:52:24 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gBRHwJUr007695 for ; Fri, 27 Dec 2002 12:58:20 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3E0C9221.BF487AA9@skyweb.net> Date: Fri, 27 Dec 2002 12:47:13 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com" Subject: AM Stereo sound... Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Hey Yall Go Figure..... this Morning I got a call from the Union Hall local#3 to start work on Monday going back to data work with the same Company that Laid me off back on March 1st.. this will Be the 4th Time with this Company.... Never fear I am Not leaving WTTM or any of the Other station I maintain. It just Means I will be more exhausted and making more money.. Its about Time. I just dont know how long its Going to last... since they are only allowing members to work 26 weeks max then 26 weeks off.. but since I have been out since march I will Fight this... back to the old Grind... Neal From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Dec 27 10:34:03 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Dec 2002 18:34:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 64646 invoked from network); 27 Dec 2002 18:34:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Dec 2002 18:34:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Dec 2002 18:34:00 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.165] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Dec 2002 18:34:00 -0000 Date: Fri, 27 Dec 2002 18:34:00 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: More Hi-Fi AM Stereo Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1466 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics More excellent recordings of high fidelity AM Stereo are now available for download in this FTP directory: ftp://209.193.86.116/amaxdemo/ "wctc-br1.mp3" and "wctc-br2.mp3" are from Bernard Spigner's weekday afternoon talk show on 1450 WCTC, featuring fantastic holiday bumper music by Burl Ives (yes, he *did* do songs other than "Holly Jolly Christmas"!). These really show the quality that WCTC has to offer from their Stereo signal, even as a 1000-watt News/Talk station. "wctc-el1.mp3" and "wctc-el2.mp3" are from Jack Ellery's mid-day show. Jack has been on the air on various NJ radio stations for many years, and he's now back on WCTC and his wit and humor are more enjoyable than ever to listen to. "wctc-el2.mp3" is also a good example of what Dynamic Noise Reduction can achieve with AM Stereo. After the first few seconds when I was fiddling with the antenna, the signal settles down and with the DNR, the background noise becomes almost completely inaudible. IBOC's biggest claim to fame is the lack of background hiss/static when in digital mode; but even analog AM and FM can easily achieve the same result with some simple circuitry. More of 1680 WTTM will be coming soon, including some recordings from their normal South Asian programming which is quite interesting to listen to. In fact I now have enough to make a complete AMAX AM Stereo demo CD. Once I get the CDs burned, it will be free to anybody who wants me to mail them a copy. From groucho@skyweb.net Fri Dec 27 10:42:58 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Dec 2002 18:42:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 29201 invoked from network); 27 Dec 2002 18:42:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Dec 2002 18:42:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Dec 2002 18:42:58 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gBRImwUr024527 for ; Fri, 27 Dec 2002 13:48:58 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3E0C9DFA.23F54276@skyweb.net> Date: Fri, 27 Dec 2002 13:37:46 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} More Hi-Fi AM Stereo References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Place me on the list to get One thanks Neal CE WTTM "Kevin T. " wrote: > More excellent recordings of high fidelity AM Stereo are now available for download in this FTP directory: > > ftp://209.193.86.116/amaxdemo/ > > "wctc-br1.mp3" and "wctc-br2.mp3" are from Bernard Spigner's weekday afternoon talk show on 1450 WCTC, featuring fantastic holiday bumper music by Burl Ives (yes, he *did* do songs other than "Holly Jolly Christmas"!). These really show the quality that WCTC has to offer from their Stereo signal, even as a 1000-watt News/Talk station. > > "wctc-el1.mp3" and "wctc-el2.mp3" are from Jack Ellery's mid-day show. Jack has been on the air on various NJ radio stations for many years, and he's now back on WCTC and his wit and humor are more enjoyable than ever to listen to. > > "wctc-el2.mp3" is also a good example of what Dynamic Noise Reduction can achieve with AM Stereo. After the first few seconds when I was fiddling with the antenna, the signal settles down and with the DNR, the background noise becomes almost completely inaudible. IBOC's biggest claim to fame is the lack of background hiss/static when in digital mode; but even analog AM and FM can easily achieve the same result with some simple circuitry. > > More of 1680 WTTM will be coming soon, including some recordings from their normal South Asian programming which is quite interesting to listen to. In fact I now have enough to make a complete AMAX AM Stereo demo CD. Once I get the CDs burned, it will be free to anybody who wants me to mail them a copy. > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From possumhunter@netzero.net Fri Dec 27 11:16:36 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: possumhunter@netzero.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Dec 2002 19:16:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 36495 invoked from network); 27 Dec 2002 19:16:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Dec 2002 19:16:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rly-ip05.mx.aol.com) (64.12.138.9) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Dec 2002 19:16:35 -0000 Received: from logs-to.proxy.aol.com (logs-to.proxy.aol.com [152.163.204.2]) by rly-ip05.mx.aol.com (v89.10) with ESMTP id RELAYIN1-1227141600; Fri, 27 Dec 2002 14:16:00 1900 Received: from ibm (AC9F906B.ipt.aol.com [172.159.144.107]) by logs-to.proxy.aol.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with SMTP id gBRJEE423216 for ; Fri, 27 Dec 2002 14:14:15 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <009f01c2addc$1feaff20$5491b498@aoldsl.net> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} More Hi-Fi AM Stereo Date: Fri, 27 Dec 2002 14:14:03 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Apparently-From: DodgeRamTrucker@aol.com From: "Possum Hunter" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 kevtronics@yahoo.com wrote: > I now have enough to make a complete AMAX AM Stereo demo CD. Once I get the CDs burned, it will be free to anybody who wants me to mail them a copy. Please put me on the list for a CD. Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Fri Dec 27 11:16:53 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Dec 2002 19:16:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 42023 invoked from network); 27 Dec 2002 19:16:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Dec 2002 19:16:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.17) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Dec 2002 19:16:53 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 27 Dec 2002 11:16:53 -0800 To: References: <3E0C9221.BF487AA9@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM Stereo sound... Date: Fri, 27 Dec 2002 14:16:37 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 27 Dec 2002 19:16:53.0041 (UTC) FILETIME=[83800210:01C2ADDC] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.159.144.107] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Neal Newman wrote: > this Morning I got a call from the Union Hall local#3 to start work on Monday going back to data work with the same Company that Laid me off back on March 1st After that AMAX demo CD gets out, you may not have TIME to work for them because you will be busy doing AM radio work! Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Fri Dec 27 11:20:00 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Dec 2002 19:19:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 42508 invoked from network); 27 Dec 2002 19:19:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Dec 2002 19:19:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.96) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Dec 2002 19:20:00 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 27 Dec 2002 11:20:00 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: The JAM Song Date: Fri, 27 Dec 2002 14:19:49 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 27 Dec 2002 19:20:00.0235 (UTC) FILETIME=[F3138BB0:01C2ADDC] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.159.144.107] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 bjackson@indyradio.com wrote: > I grew up in southern Indiana and was more familiar with Louisville radio (talk about a waste of a market!) Yea, and the bad thing is WHAS used to have a great sounding Music format in AM STEREO. What a shame. Kevin From groucho@skyweb.net Fri Dec 27 11:27:08 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Dec 2002 19:27:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 636 invoked from network); 27 Dec 2002 19:27:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Dec 2002 19:27:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Dec 2002 19:27:08 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gBRJX6Ur039410 for ; Fri, 27 Dec 2002 14:33:07 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3E0CA84F.8DB570E@skyweb.net> Date: Fri, 27 Dec 2002 14:21:51 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM Stereo sound... References: <3E0C9221.BF487AA9@skyweb.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 wishful thinking..... BTW you want to Go down to Biloxi, MS, and pick up a transmitter for Me? LOL after Next week I could afford it.. but wont have the time to make the trip.. BTW its a CCA 1000D LOL.... Neal Possum Hunter wrote: > Neal Newman wrote: > > this Morning I got a call from the Union Hall local#3 to start work on > Monday going back to data work with the same Company that Laid me off back > on March 1st > > After that AMAX demo CD gets out, you may not have TIME to work for them > because you will be busy doing AM radio work! > > Kevin > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From possumhunter@netzero.net Fri Dec 27 12:04:11 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Dec 2002 20:04:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 29933 invoked from network); 27 Dec 2002 20:04:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Dec 2002 20:04:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.97) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Dec 2002 20:04:09 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 27 Dec 2002 12:04:09 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: AM stereo schematic Date: Fri, 27 Dec 2002 15:03:57 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 27 Dec 2002 20:04:09.0080 (UTC) FILETIME=[1DE93780:01C2ADE3] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.159.144.107] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 dfr68819@wanadoo.fr wrote: > In a month, I go to holidays to ORLANDO and I shall want to visit a radio station AM. If you are going to WGTO, they are now a MONO talk station. A better place to see a good AM Stereo station would be WTTM in Princeton, NJ. > > My wish is to create a radio station AM stereo in France because it does not exist. France Bleu in Paris used to be in AM Stereo, Are they now? Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Fri Dec 27 12:21:46 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Dec 2002 20:21:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 58248 invoked from network); 27 Dec 2002 20:21:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Dec 2002 20:21:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.122) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Dec 2002 20:21:46 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 27 Dec 2002 12:21:46 -0800 To: References: <3E0C9221.BF487AA9@skyweb.net> <3E0CA84F.8DB570E@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM Stereo sound... Date: Fri, 27 Dec 2002 15:21:33 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 27 Dec 2002 20:21:46.0222 (UTC) FILETIME=[940448E0:01C2ADE5] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.159.144.107] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Neal Newman wrote: >you want to Go down to Biloxi, MS, and pick up a transmitter for Me? Sure! Just send them the money, and I will go get it and keep it here...for good! LOL > >BTW its a CCA 1000D I can tell you from first hand experience that a CCA AM100D is a transmitter that sounds rotten on the air, kills tubes, has very poor cooling, weighs more than a battle ship, and requires it's own nuclear power plant to supply the electricity to run it. On the other hand, it is nearly indestructible. You can help the sound quality by changing out the modulation transformer and reactor. No need in wasting your time with Amperex tubes, the CCA will kill 'em in just a few days! Eimacs will go about 4 or 5 months, and the glass melted on Chinese tubes after about an hour. Before anybody asks, Yes, the pile of sh*t was adjusted and tuned dead on specs! You may be able to modify the cooling system and RF deck to get it sounding better on the air, but be ready to spend some bucks. You will also want to build a rectifier stack to replace the mercury vapor tubes. Kevin From dfr68819@wanadoo.fr Fri Dec 27 13:10:00 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dfr68819@wanadoo.fr X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Dec 2002 21:10:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 10808 invoked from network); 27 Dec 2002 21:09:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Dec 2002 21:09:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.70) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Dec 2002 21:09:59 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.161] by n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Dec 2002 21:09:59 -0000 Date: Fri, 27 Dec 2002 21:09:55 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: AM stereo schematic Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 670 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Denis " X-Originating-IP: 80.15.216.24 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=117455200 X-Yahoo-Profile: pcvpcn To PARIS France bleu is not stereo but to MARSEILLE France bleu is in numerique. Who can give me the schema of a stereo coder for transmetter AM? Denis --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Possum Hunter" wrote: > dfr68819@w... wrote: > > In a month, I go to holidays to ORLANDO and I shall want to visit a radio > station AM. > > If you are going to WGTO, they are now a MONO talk station. A better place > to see a good AM Stereo station would be WTTM in Princeton, NJ. > > > > My wish is to create a radio station AM stereo in France because it does > not exist. > > France Bleu in Paris used to be in AM Stereo, Are they now? > > Kevin From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Fri Dec 27 13:33:22 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Dec 2002 21:33:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 42647 invoked from network); 27 Dec 2002 21:33:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Dec 2002 21:33:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web41007.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.93.6) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Dec 2002 21:33:19 -0000 Message-ID: <20021227213318.31134.qmail@web41007.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.32.178] by web41007.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 27 Dec 2002 13:33:18 PST Date: Fri, 27 Dec 2002 13:33:18 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: AM stereo schematic To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio What's "numerique?" 73, Jay,N1WVQ __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Fri Dec 27 13:35:14 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Dec 2002 21:35:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 98599 invoked from network); 27 Dec 2002 21:35:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Dec 2002 21:35:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web41013.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.93.12) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Dec 2002 21:35:14 -0000 Message-ID: <20021227213514.12519.qmail@web41013.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.32.178] by web41013.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 27 Dec 2002 13:35:14 PST Date: Fri, 27 Dec 2002 13:35:14 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM Stereo sound... To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio It may be fun to see just how indestructible it truly is. Besides, blowing stuff up is fun. Yes I remember Beavis & Butthead. Why do you ask? 73, Jay,N1WVQ __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From mmalm@btinet.net Fri Dec 27 13:48:53 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: mmalm@btinet.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Dec 2002 21:48:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 46637 invoked from network); 27 Dec 2002 21:48:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Dec 2002 21:48:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.88) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Dec 2002 21:48:51 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.154] by n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Dec 2002 21:48:51 -0000 Date: Fri, 27 Dec 2002 21:48:49 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM stereo GM radio? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1134 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "n0faz " X-Originating-IP: 24.220.243.253 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83590293 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0faz --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: > > No GM car except the Caddy had AM Stereo after 1993- > > Make that 1994, perhaps... I have the '94 Pontiac full-line brochure > and it shows several models as having the AM Stereo-equipped UX-1 > radio as optional. Also, in the factory radio listings on the > www.amstereoradio.com web site, I have a scan of the 1994 Buick > brochure showing *seven* different models of AM Stereo radios. > > Also, the 1994 Oldsmobile Bravada brochure mentions an "AM Stereo/ > FM Stereo" radio, but if you're talking exactly, then this fits your > description because it's an SUV, not a GM *car*. OK, that's a good piece of info. I've seen a couple of Bravada radios for sale on ebay. I have emailed a couple of sellers and have gotten very good responses from them about AM stereo being an option on the equipment they sell. I'm getting a little tired of reading the "XYZ FM/AM stereo radio" descriptions though. It seems that I get alot of these when I search for "AM stereo". THANKS for the help guys, and Happy New Year! Mark From alfredot@inetarena.com Fri Dec 27 13:58:20 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: alfredot@inetarena.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Dec 2002 21:58:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 41364 invoked from network); 27 Dec 2002 21:58:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Dec 2002 21:58:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.inetarena.com) (206.129.216.13) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Dec 2002 21:58:19 -0000 Received: from hendrie (1Cust237.tnt8.beaverton.or.da.uu.net [67.227.229.237]) by mail.inetarena.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id gBRLtNM19470 for ; Fri, 27 Dec 2002 13:55:34 -0800 (PST) Date: Fri, 27 Dec 2002 13:56:14 -0800 (PST) X-Sender: alfredo@hendrie.1610am.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: AM stereo schematic In-Reply-To: <1040894075.177.51321.m12@yahoogroups.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: "Alfredo E. Torrejon" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=25132238 X-Yahoo-Profile: alfredotorrejon > Hello, I am French and my English is very bad, sorry. I look for the > plan of an AM converter stereo for middles waves. The site: > www.inetarena.com /~ alfredot/pics/is closed. Another site exists? > Thank you for your answer. > Denis I regret to say that I've temporarily taken down the electronics pages, partly due to my current unemployment situation. For now, all that I have up is my resume. I will be re-doing the pages soon. However, some of the schematics won't be coming back because the ICs required have been out of production for years (such as the Analog Devices SSM2120 and SSM2122 chips and the Motorola MC3340). I receive quite a few requests from frustrated people for information on where these chips might be obtained. Sadly, I have to tell these folks that I, too, have had no success finding suppliers for these ICs in recent years. Alfredo From michaelj@vcn.com Fri Dec 27 16:02:47 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Dec 2002 00:02:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 75499 invoked from network); 28 Dec 2002 00:02:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Dec 2002 00:02:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m2-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.32) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Dec 2002 00:02:45 -0000 Received: from michael (unverified [209.193.86.52]) by m2-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Fri, 27 Dec 2002 17:02:45 -0700 To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} More Hi-Fi AM Stereo Date: Fri, 27 Dec 2002 17:02:41 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) In-Reply-To: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Importance: Normal From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Heya! Me too! I'd LOVE one! Honestly, with the AMAX certification of the SRF-42, I could bring my SRF-42 and my laptop up to the radio station and record enough of KEVA's audio to burn to CD as well. :) It might be a little while. Also while I've got the list's attention (especially yours Kevin T) my ISP requested that I go down there so we could re-assign IP addresses on the servers so that they may get the new bank of modems working. I haven't done that yet. I've had too much going on lately. My wife had a baby 2 weeks ago, and now she's going in for gall bladder surgery tomorrow. So it may be after the new year, but point being....the IP address for that FTP site is going to change. I will let all know when it changes and what it changes to. MJR n WYO -----Original Message----- From: Kevin T. [mailto:kevtronics@yahoo.com] Sent: Friday, December 27, 2002 11:34 AM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} More Hi-Fi AM Stereo [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Dec 27 17:19:26 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Dec 2002 01:19:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 10207 invoked from network); 28 Dec 2002 01:19:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Dec 2002 01:19:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Dec 2002 01:19:25 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-73.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.73]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gBS1JMQ8014069 for ; Fri, 27 Dec 2002 19:19:23 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <008e01c2ae0f$373ecc00$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: AM stereo schematic Date: Fri, 27 Dec 2002 19:19:46 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Are the WGTO calls back in FL? Last I knew they were in SW Mich. The guy that helped me write the receiver petition had a station with those calls. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Possum Hunter" > If you are going to WGTO, they are now a MONO talk station. A better place > to see a good AM Stereo station would be WTTM in Princeton, NJ. > > From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Dec 27 17:20:33 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Dec 2002 01:20:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 75257 invoked from network); 28 Dec 2002 01:20:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Dec 2002 01:20:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.70) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Dec 2002 01:20:31 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.180] by n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Dec 2002 01:20:31 -0000 Date: Sat, 28 Dec 2002 01:20:30 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: AM Stereo in France & Spain (was: Re: AM stereo schematic) Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20021227213318.31134.qmail@web41007.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2002 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.81.4 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > What's "numerique?" I believe it is the French way to say "digital". Perhaps Denis means that this AM station is transmitting using the DRM (Digital Radio Mondial) system, which is Europe's alternative to IBOC. Do we still have any members from the UK or Ireland here? They usually get DX reception of "France Bleu" on 864 kHz from Paris (300,000 watts non-directional!) and perhaps could tell us whether or not it is still broadcasting in AM Stereo. (Note that for a while, they were broadcasting AM Stereo without the pilot tone, causing all but "forced Stereo" receivers like the Sonys or MetroSound to mistake it for a completely mono signal.) As the story goes, the French government only considers/ed the AM Stereo broadcasts on 864 kHz to be a "test", to see if the C-Quam system with work out okay within the more crowded European AM/MW band. Apparently they were concerned that an AM Stereo signal would require a greater bandwidth than a regular mono AM signal, but of course that isn't true (at least with properly adjusted transmitting equipment), and I doubt they would keep broadcasting it for years if it didn't meet their standards. Obviously, in terms of the percentage of their overall listenership, the AM Stereo on "France Bleu" is little more than a novelty, but as long as the equipment is installed and in working condition, there is really no reason why they can't or shouldn't continue to broadcast in AM Stereo. What I am still wondering about is the AM Stereo stations in Madrid, Spain. In the early 1990s, there were known to be a few using the C-Quam system, including "COPE" (a pop music station) with 50,000 watts on 999 kHz, but I have never been able to find out more information on this. It is quite doubtful that any are still using it today, but I'd at least like to know exactly which stations used it, for what time period, and whether these were also just "tests" of if they were really serious about AM Stereo broadcasting. From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Fri Dec 27 17:20:35 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Dec 2002 01:20:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 75263 invoked from network); 28 Dec 2002 01:20:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Dec 2002 01:20:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web41004.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.93.3) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Dec 2002 01:20:32 -0000 Message-ID: <20021228012032.5279.qmail@web41004.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.32.178] by web41004.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 27 Dec 2002 17:20:32 PST Date: Fri, 27 Dec 2002 17:20:32 -0800 (PST) Subject: RE: {AMSF} More Hi-Fi AM Stereo To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio Congrats on being a pops. What day did she have the baby? 73, Jay,N1WVQ __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Dec 27 17:24:03 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Dec 2002 01:24:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 2602 invoked from network); 28 Dec 2002 01:24:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Dec 2002 01:24:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Dec 2002 01:24:03 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-73.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.73]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gBS1NxQ8014860 for ; Fri, 27 Dec 2002 19:24:01 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <009401c2ae0f$dcac0a40$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <3E0C9221.BF487AA9@skyweb.net> <3E0CA84F.8DB570E@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM Stereo sound... Date: Fri, 27 Dec 2002 19:24:23 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude What for? The blue flash of those MV rectifiers is one of those things that gives those old boxes so much soul. I'm planning on building a stereo amp with 808 transmitting tubes for the outputs, and some 866s for rectifiers. You're right about the CCA being hard on tubes. The Wilkinsons were the same way. Seems only an RCA can get a year out of a set of 4-400s. Still that's peanuts compared to the 3-5 years you can get on a set of 833A bottles. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Possum Hunter" > You will also want to > build a rectifier stack to replace the mercury vapor tubes. From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Dec 27 17:38:18 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Dec 2002 01:38:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 21689 invoked from network); 28 Dec 2002 01:38:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Dec 2002 01:38:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Dec 2002 01:38:18 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-73.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.73]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gBS1cEQ8017395 for ; Fri, 27 Dec 2002 19:38:16 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <00b001c2ae11$da5e85e0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: AM stereo schematic Date: Fri, 27 Dec 2002 19:38:38 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Chris Cuff, the guy who makes the AM stereo decoders, also produces a low power AM stereo transmitter. It is identical to the one that was on Alfredo's site, except it doesn't have the three band audio limiter the original design had. This is because some of the chips have been discontinued, as Alfredo pointed out. I may still have the information copied on diskette. I'll email it to you. Scott Todd ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Friday, December 27, 2002 3:09 PM Subject: {AMSF} Re: AM stereo schematic > To PARIS France bleu is not stereo but to MARSEILLE France bleu is in > numerique. > Who can give me the schema of a stereo coder for transmetter AM? > Denis > > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Possum Hunter" > wrote: > > dfr68819@w... wrote: > > > In a month, I go to holidays to ORLANDO and I shall want to visit > a radio > > station AM. > > > > If you are going to WGTO, they are now a MONO talk station. A > better place > > to see a good AM Stereo station would be WTTM in Princeton, NJ. > > > > > > My wish is to create a radio station AM stereo in France because > it does > > not exist. > > > > France Bleu in Paris used to be in AM Stereo, Are they now? > > > > Kevin > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Dec 27 17:41:37 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Dec 2002 01:41:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 63241 invoked from network); 28 Dec 2002 01:41:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Dec 2002 01:41:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Dec 2002 01:41:36 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-73.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.73]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gBS1fXQ8017974 for ; Fri, 27 Dec 2002 19:41:34 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <00b601c2ae12$50c187a0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: AM stereo schematic Date: Fri, 27 Dec 2002 19:41:57 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude There's an outfit in Taxachusettes that carries a lot of obsolete semiconductors. In fact, they even buy the dies and such for a lot of them. I get my supplies of IRF-350s for my Gates 5 transmitter from Rochester Electronics. Have you tried them for the numbers you're looking for? ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Alfredo E. Torrejon" > Sadly, I > have to tell these folks that I, too, have had no success finding > suppliers for these ICs in recent years. From KC4QLP@aol.com Fri Dec 27 19:28:15 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Dec 2002 03:28:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 3978 invoked from network); 28 Dec 2002 03:28:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Dec 2002 03:28:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r10.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.106) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Dec 2002 03:28:14 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r10.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.194.129613fb (25305) for ; Fri, 27 Dec 2002 22:28:10 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <194.129613fb.2b3e744a@aol.com> Date: Fri, 27 Dec 2002 22:28:10 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM Stereo sound... To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/27/02 8:24:33 PM Eastern Standard Time, stodd@sherbtel.net writes: << Still that's peanuts compared to the 3-5 years you can get on a set of 833A bottles. ST >> Just dont get the ones made by the Chinese...you'll be lucky to get 2 years out of them without them going flat Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network _______________________________________________________ From KC4QLP@aol.com Fri Dec 27 19:30:43 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Dec 2002 03:30:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 69453 invoked from network); 28 Dec 2002 03:30:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Dec 2002 03:30:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r07.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.103) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Dec 2002 03:30:42 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.a5.32ba310d (25305) for ; Fri, 27 Dec 2002 22:30:32 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Fri, 27 Dec 2002 22:30:31 EST Subject: AM Stereo To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Well folks..check this out. A true Kahn AM Stereo part 15 station in my region is broadcasting on the internet...in stereo! Give it a looking and a listen and say what you all think! Sounds pretty sharp! WBDH RADIO 1570 Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network _______________________________________________________ From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Dec 27 20:05:30 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Dec 2002 04:05:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 94070 invoked from network); 28 Dec 2002 04:05:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Dec 2002 04:05:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.87) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Dec 2002 04:05:28 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.142] by n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Dec 2002 04:05:28 -0000 Date: Sat, 28 Dec 2002 04:05:24 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: AM Stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1090 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.96.132 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Well folks..check this out. A true Kahn AM Stereo part 15 station > in my region is broadcasting on the internet...in stereo! Here is the direct URL for their Internet broadcast MP3 stream... either click on this link and see what happens, or cut and paste it into the "Play Location" entry of WinAmp or some other MP3 player: http://www.live365.com/play/298442 It's a 96 kbps stream so you need a fast connection (DSL, Cable modem, Ethernet, etc.) to listen to it uninterrupted. But from what I can tell from the bit and pieces of it I can hear through my "56K" modem, it is in true Stereo, with fairly good quality -- although the programming is mostly Old Time Radio shows, so you won't get much chance to hear the Stereo sound. p.s. I don't know if it can truly be called a "Kahn" AM Stereo station... the true Kahn system used a "sideband compensator" to make it a bit more compatible with mono radios. This station is probably closer to pure ISB, or the "phased" ISB you can get from applying specially phased audio to a Magnavox- or even C-Quam-type transmitter. From jsgil@hal-pc.org Fri Dec 27 22:00:14 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Dec 2002 06:00:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 84749 invoked from network); 28 Dec 2002 06:00:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Dec 2002 06:00:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Dec 2002 06:00:13 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.137] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Dec 2002 06:00:13 -0000 Date: Sat, 28 Dec 2002 06:00:08 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: New Pictures Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 299 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.173 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst I have finally gained access to a digital camera to get some snapshots of some of my hardware mods. http://www.hal-pc.org/~jsgil/AM-Stereo/mods.html I also have a few samples of WBAP 820 at over 250mi away. As soom as I get my computer to talk to my stereo I will try to make them available. JSG From KC4QLP@aol.com Fri Dec 27 22:27:50 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Dec 2002 06:27:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 46922 invoked from network); 28 Dec 2002 06:27:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Dec 2002 06:27:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d03.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.35) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Dec 2002 06:27:49 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.72.27f4c8f1 (4238) for ; Sat, 28 Dec 2002 01:27:43 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <72.27f4c8f1.2b3e9e5f@aol.com> Date: Sat, 28 Dec 2002 01:27:43 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Catch 'em while you can To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 12/23/02 11:31:13 AM Eastern Standard Time, kevtronics@yahoo.com writes: > Here are two "Alfredo Lite" AM Stereo transmitters from Chris Cuff on > eBay... both with "Buy It Now" for $125 each... these will go fast, so if > you want one, act now! > eBay item 1947080304 (Ends Dec-29-02 06:30:49 PST ) - Portable AM Stereo Transmitter CQUAM This one is the last one remaing on ebay for now..grab it as the bidding ends on 12/29 Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com ______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From possumhunter@netzero.net Fri Dec 27 22:30:08 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Dec 2002 06:30:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 26168 invoked from network); 28 Dec 2002 06:30:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Dec 2002 06:30:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.197) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Dec 2002 06:30:07 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 27 Dec 2002 22:30:07 -0800 To: References: <3E0C9221.BF487AA9@skyweb.net> <3E0CA84F.8DB570E@skyweb.net> <009401c2ae0f$dcac0a40$827dfea9@home1> Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM Stereo sound... Date: Sat, 28 Dec 2002 01:29:49 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 28 Dec 2002 06:30:07.0764 (UTC) FILETIME=[90A19540:01C2AE3A] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.164.211.214] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Scott Todd wrote: > What for? The blue flash of those MV rectifiers is one of those things that gives those old boxes so much soul. The AM 1000D is hard on them and you can't see them inside the CCA box anyway. > >You're right about the CCA being hard on tubes. The Wilkinsons were the same way. McMartins are also tube killers. > > Seems only an RCA can get a year out of a set of 4-400s. I have been thinking about this. The AM1000D even is rough on the low level tubes. I wonder how it would act if you put another blower to force air up the front panel so the low level tubes could cool when the doors are closed. As for the short life of the modulators and PAs, If a fellow could get more airflow into the PA box with more volume and less speed, I think it would help. I have thought about running the filaments on DC. I also think blower vibrations and harmonics shorten the tube life. The best thing to do with a CCA is trade it off for an RCA! > > Still that's peanuts compared to the 3-5 years you can get on a set of 833A bottles. Tubes will last nearly forever in a Gates BC1G / BC1H if you keep it tuned right. Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Fri Dec 27 22:37:00 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Dec 2002 06:36:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 56934 invoked from network); 28 Dec 2002 06:36:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Dec 2002 06:36:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.63) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Dec 2002 06:36:59 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 27 Dec 2002 22:36:59 -0800 To: References: <194.129613fb.2b3e744a@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM Stereo sound... Date: Sat, 28 Dec 2002 01:36:47 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 28 Dec 2002 06:36:59.0582 (UTC) FILETIME=[861805E0:01C2AE3B] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.164.211.214] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: > Just dont get the ones made by the Chinese...you'll be lucky to get 2 years out of them without them going flat It makes you wonder how China Radio International stays on the air! LOL The Czech tubes are pretty good. Too bad you can't get American 833s any more. Kevin From KC4QLP@aol.com Fri Dec 27 22:49:49 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Dec 2002 06:49:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 91024 invoked from network); 28 Dec 2002 06:49:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Dec 2002 06:49:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m09.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.164) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Dec 2002 06:49:47 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m09.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.21.29599b8d (4238) for ; Sat, 28 Dec 2002 01:49:39 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <21.29599b8d.2b3ea383@aol.com> Date: Sat, 28 Dec 2002 01:49:39 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM Stereo sound... To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 12/28/02 1:38:46 AM Eastern Standard Time, possumhunter@netzero.net writes: > It makes you wonder how China Radio International stays on the air! LOL > > The Czech tubes are pretty good. Too bad you can't get American 833s any > more. > Yeah maybe China Radio has a hamster on wheel in cage that keeps them on the air...LOL Shame that most anything made American cant be found anymore.....guess the unions and politicians have all but killed this country.... Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com ______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From bjackson@indyradio.com Sat Dec 28 04:42:45 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Dec 2002 12:42:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 53903 invoked from network); 28 Dec 2002 12:42:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Dec 2002 12:42:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Dec 2002 12:42:45 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.134] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Dec 2002 12:42:45 -0000 Date: Sat, 28 Dec 2002 12:42:43 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: The JAM Song Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1322 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923 " X-Originating-IP: 64.25.100.22 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Possum Hunter" wrote: > Yea, and the bad thing is WHAS used to have a great sounding Music format in > AM STEREO. What a shame. > > Kevin They had a GREAT AM Stereo signal and processing...Well, until Jacor (CC) took over. If memory serves me right, weren't they one of, if not the, last 50kw stations to still play music in stereo? They still have one of the most entertaining pm drive guys though...Terry Meiners. I have friends who work for Cox and Radio One in Louisville...really sad to see these once great stations in such bad shape now...Most of the Cox studios are as big (as small???) as our Aux productions rooms at SI. But of course, when you have no live talent (some even have AM & PM drive voice tracked), you don't need a big studio. About 2 months ago, I was down visiting one of my buddies when all the bad storms and tornadoes went thru the area. The Radio One EAS was messed up so it was only doing the tones...you couldn't hear the actual warnings. I asked if he should get down to the station since he only lives a mile or so away. His reponse was something to the effect of "management doesn't care so why should I?" And he's one of the program directors!!! -Brad Jackson -Susquehanna, Indianapolis -WGLD, WGRL, WFMS From oldphones@webtv.net Sat Dec 28 05:28:16 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: oldphones@webtv.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Dec 2002 13:28:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 26953 invoked from network); 28 Dec 2002 13:28:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Dec 2002 13:28:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO smtpout-2001-2.public.lawson.webtv.net) (209.240.212.82) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Dec 2002 13:28:14 -0000 Received: from storefull-2118.public.lawson.webtv.net (lawson-public-ipmux-1-pip-4.public.lawson.webtv.net [209.240.212.24]) by smtpout-2001-2.public.lawson.webtv.net (WebTV_Postfix+sws) with ESMTP id 56F2479CA3 for ; Sat, 28 Dec 2002 05:28:14 -0800 (PST) Received: (from production@localhost) by storefull-2118.public.lawson.webtv.net (8.8.8-wtv-f/mt.gso.26Feb98) id FAA17136; Sat, 28 Dec 2002 05:28:13 -0800 (PST) X-WebTV-Signature: 1 ETAtAhQoxt4oQ+V4WjOMfJDNPk953PKX2AIVAIykHFfR+NlcQ2bWi2ii7ylxI6tZ Date: Sat, 28 Dec 2002 07:28:13 -0600 (CST) To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} SRF-A100 Message-ID: <6339-3E0DA6ED-13016@storefull-2118.public.lawson.webtv.net> In-Reply-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com's message of 28 Dec 2002 01:38:19 -0000 Content-Disposition: Inline Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) X-eGroups-From: oldphones@webtv.net (oldphones) From: oldphones@webtv.net X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38022783 X-Yahoo-Profile: oldphones1 Help! Has anyone on the list had problems with the battery power to their SRF-A100 going DEAD?? My SRF-A100 Died when I switched batteries to a fresh set of batteries, NO audio, no nothing. This happened once before when i bumped the radio, it came back after a couple of days. I need to find my AC Adaptor. Acts like the power switch OR the springs in the battery holder are bad. I use good quality Eveready E91 "AA" batts. Any Ideas?? Made for a DX-less Christmas. I fired up the AM$ Delco on Christmas Morning, DX conditions seemed poor. Also had the 1940 Zenith tube radio on for a awhile, still gets the local stations. William P. Snyder Oldphones@ webtv. net (402) 593-6841 I Specialize in AM Stereo radios, collectable telephones, parts, and wiring items http://community.webtv.net/oldphones/OldPhonesRadiosPage From amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk Sat Dec 28 07:10:32 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Dec 2002 15:10:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 97845 invoked from network); 28 Dec 2002 15:10:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Dec 2002 15:10:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.87) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Dec 2002 15:10:29 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.133] by n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Dec 2002 15:10:29 -0000 Date: Sat, 28 Dec 2002 15:10:28 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: AM Stereo in France & Spain (was: Re: AM stereo schematic) Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2911 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "m1ctk " X-Originating-IP: 81.7.62.143 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113985069 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereofan --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: > > What's "numerique?" > > I believe it is the French way to say "digital". Perhaps Denis means > that this AM station is transmitting using the DRM (Digital Radio > Mondial) system, which is Europe's alternative to IBOC. > > Do we still have any members from the UK or Ireland here? Only me! I feel quite out numbered here amounst a mainly US group They > usually get DX reception of "France Bleu" on 864 kHz from Paris > (300,000 watts non-directional!) and perhaps could tell us whether or > not it is still broadcasting in AM Stereo. Yes for sure (Note that for a while, > they were broadcasting AM Stereo without the pilot tone, causing all > but "forced Stereo" receivers like the Sonys or MetroSound to mistake > it for a completely mono signal.) > > As the story goes, the French government only considers/ed the > AM Stereo broadcasts on 864 kHz to be a "test", to see if the C- Quam > system with work out okay within the more crowded European AM/MW band. > Apparently they were concerned that an AM Stereo signal would require > a greater bandwidth than a regular mono AM signal, but of course that > isn't true (at least with properly adjusted transmitting equipment), > and I doubt they would keep broadcasting it for years if it didn't > meet their standards. > > Obviously, in terms of the percentage of their overall listenership, > the AM Stereo on "France Bleu" is little more than a novelty, but as > long as the equipment is installed and in working condition, there is > really no reason why they can't or shouldn't continue to broadcast in > AM Stereo. > > What I am still wondering about is the AM Stereo stations in Madrid, > Spain. In the early 1990s, there were known to be a few using the > C-Quam system, including "COPE" (a pop music station) with 50,000 > watts on 999 kHz, but I have never been able to find out more > information on this. It is quite doubtful that any are still using it > today, but I'd at least like to know exactly which stations used it, > for what time period, and whether these were also just "tests" of if > they were really serious about AM Stereo broadcasting. I get COPE coming in on 999 at night though no stereo. I wish I could encourage other countries to try c-quam stereo. Holland would use the system but they don't bother as they think no one has AM stereo radio's which is in Eurpoe is 99.8 true. the UK goverment is so soft as you probably hear about many things but totally the oposite when it comes to radio matters. If the interent and email had been as widely spread as now back in the early 1990's I'm sure the UK would have had AM stereo and probably most of Europe though discussion forums lie these emails to the RA etc etc What did you think of the MP3 from Italy ? Dave From amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk Sat Dec 28 07:37:29 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Dec 2002 15:37:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 18870 invoked from network); 28 Dec 2002 15:37:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Dec 2002 15:37:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.83) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Dec 2002 15:37:27 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.154] by n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Dec 2002 15:37:27 -0000 Date: Sat, 28 Dec 2002 15:37:25 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} More Hi-Fi AM Stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <009f01c2addc$1feaff20$5491b498@aoldsl.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 359 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "m1ctk " X-Originating-IP: 213.121.71.172 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113985069 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereofan --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Possum Hunter" wrote: > kevtronics@y... wrote: > > I now have enough to make a complete AMAX AM Stereo demo CD. Once I get > the CDs burned, it will be free to anybody who wants me to mail them a copy. > > Please put me on the list for a CD. > > Kevin And me if possible please. I'm in the UK From stodd@sherbtel.net Sat Dec 28 07:49:53 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Dec 2002 15:49:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 19335 invoked from network); 28 Dec 2002 15:49:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Dec 2002 15:49:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Dec 2002 15:49:52 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-188.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.188]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gBSFnnQ8000739 for ; Sat, 28 Dec 2002 09:49:50 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <001101c2ae88$d1f3db40$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <72.27f4c8f1.2b3e9e5f@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Catch 'em while you can Date: Sat, 28 Dec 2002 09:50:15 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Maybe our friend Denis over in France ought to bid on it. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: > eBay item 1947080304 (Ends Dec-29-02 06:30:49 PST ) - Portable AM Stereo > Transmitter CQUAM > > This one is the last one remaing on ebay for now..grab it as the bidding ends > on 12/29 > From stodd@sherbtel.net Sat Dec 28 07:52:04 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Dec 2002 15:52:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 81597 invoked from network); 28 Dec 2002 15:52:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Dec 2002 15:52:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Dec 2002 15:52:04 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-188.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.188]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gBSFq0Q8001248 for ; Sat, 28 Dec 2002 09:52:01 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <001b01c2ae89$1fe5c660$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <194.129613fb.2b3e744a@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM Stereo sound... Date: Sat, 28 Dec 2002 09:52:26 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Maybe after we get good AMS radio production underway, making some of those classic bottles could be next. :) ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Possum Hunter" Too bad you can't get American 833s any > more. > > Kevin From stodd@sherbtel.net Sat Dec 28 08:11:30 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Dec 2002 16:11:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 98774 invoked from network); 28 Dec 2002 16:11:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Dec 2002 16:11:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Dec 2002 16:11:27 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-188.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.188]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gBSGBOQ8004884 for ; Sat, 28 Dec 2002 10:11:25 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <003f01c2ae8b$d5e161c0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <6339-3E0DA6ED-13016@storefull-2118.public.lawson.webtv.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} SRF-A100 Date: Sat, 28 Dec 2002 10:11:50 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Check for oxidized contacts on the adapter jack. Scott ----- Original Message ----- From: > Help! Has anyone on the list had problems with the battery power > to their SRF-A100 going DEAD?? My SRF-A100 Died when I switched > batteries to a fresh set of batteries, NO audio, no nothing. From possumhunter@netzero.net Sat Dec 28 08:13:29 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Dec 2002 16:13:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 28760 invoked from network); 28 Dec 2002 16:13:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Dec 2002 16:13:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.98) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Dec 2002 16:13:29 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 28 Dec 2002 08:13:29 -0800 To: References: <194.129613fb.2b3e744a@aol.com> <001b01c2ae89$1fe5c660$827dfea9@home1> Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM Stereo sound... Date: Sat, 28 Dec 2002 11:13:11 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 28 Dec 2002 16:13:29.0062 (UTC) FILETIME=[0F07D060:01C2AE8C] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.167.167.17] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Scott Todd wrote: > Maybe after we get good AMS radio production underway, making some of those classic bottles could be next. :) That is a nice thought. It is my understanding that the ole Westinghouse tube factory in Elmira, NY is still there, just mothballed. Is this still true? The Hitachi tube plant in Greenville, SC is being shut down for good as well. There is a company that is making exact reproductions of the Edison carbon filament light bulbs and '01A tubes, perhaps they could be talked into making some REAL 4-400s that last more than a month! Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Sat Dec 28 08:22:49 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: possumhunter@netzero.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Dec 2002 16:22:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 17651 invoked from network); 28 Dec 2002 16:22:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Dec 2002 16:22:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rly-ip05.mx.aol.com) (64.12.138.9) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Dec 2002 16:22:48 -0000 Received: from logs-mtc-tc.proxy.aol.com (logs-mtc-tc.proxy.aol.com [64.12.105.135]) by rly-ip05.mx.aol.com (v89.10) with ESMTP id RELAYIN5-1228112203; Sat, 28 Dec 2002 11:22:03 1900 Received: from ibm (ACA7A711.ipt.aol.com [172.167.167.17]) by logs-mtc-tc.proxy.aol.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with SMTP id gBSGLYo277406 for ; Sat, 28 Dec 2002 11:21:34 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <003a01c2ae8d$2af7cd60$11a7a7ac@aoldsl.net> To: References: Subject: WHAS was: The JAM Song Date: Sat, 28 Dec 2002 11:21:23 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Apparently-From: DodgeRamTrucker@aol.com From: "Possum Hunter" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 bjackson@indyradio.com > They had a GREAT AM Stereo signal and processing...Well, until Jacor (CC) took over. If memory serves me right, weren't they one of, if not the, last 50kw stations to still play music in stereo? It was WHAS or WOWO > > The Radio One EAS was messed up so it was only doing the tones...you couldn't hear the actual warnings. I asked if he should get down to the station since he only lives a mile or so away. His reponse was something to the effect of "management doesn't care so why should I?" And he's one of the program directors!!! I bet the FCC would care! Kevin From stodd@sherbtel.net Sat Dec 28 08:30:45 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Dec 2002 16:30:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 66942 invoked from network); 28 Dec 2002 16:30:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Dec 2002 16:30:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Dec 2002 16:30:44 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-188.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.188]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gBSGUfQ8008395 for ; Sat, 28 Dec 2002 10:30:42 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <006301c2ae8e$873ff560$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <194.129613fb.2b3e744a@aol.com> <001b01c2ae89$1fe5c660$827dfea9@home1> Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM Stereo sound... Date: Sat, 28 Dec 2002 10:31:06 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Don't know about the Westinghouse factory, but even if the building is still there, doubtless much of the machinery is gone. If it IS still all there, THAT would be something to grab onto at least for a museum, if not for putting tubes back into production (which would be my preference.) Is there any way you could see if you could obtain part or all of the Hitachi equipment? If you only got the dies for the more popular duo triodes and audio output beam pentodes, that would be grand. I'd doubt they ever had the real classic stuff like 45s and such. I wonder how difficult it would be to reverse-engineer some of that stuff and not have it come out like Chinese crap? The only tubes that were ever made entirely by automation were the nuvistors. All others required a small amount of hand assembly. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Possum Hunter" > It is my understanding that the ole Westinghouse > tube factory in Elmira, NY is still there, just mothballed. Is this still > true? The Hitachi tube plant in Greenville, SC is being shut down for good > as well. From possumhunter@netzero.net Sat Dec 28 08:33:50 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Dec 2002 16:33:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 94139 invoked from network); 28 Dec 2002 16:33:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Dec 2002 16:33:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.81) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Dec 2002 16:33:49 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 28 Dec 2002 08:33:49 -0800 To: References: <21.29599b8d.2b3ea383@aol.com> Subject: American Made tubes was: AM Stereo sound... Date: Sat, 28 Dec 2002 11:33:37 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 28 Dec 2002 16:33:49.0521 (UTC) FILETIME=[E67B1410:01C2AE8E] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.167.167.17] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: > Shame that most anything made American cant be found anymore.....guess the unions and politicians have all but killed this country.... Well, the big corporations are as much to blame. They decided instead of building a tube for $40 a copy and selling it for $100, it is better to buy a knock-off of that tube in China for $5 bucks and sell it to radio stations for $300! Yes, in many cases the unions have priced themselves right out of a job, but how can American workers compete against Chinese forced labor camps and Indian sweatshops? Would you be willing to work 60+ hours a week for 50cents a day and live in a mud hut eating just a bowl of rice 3 meals a day? Hmmm come to think of it, that is about how most AM broadcast engineers live! nevermind. Kevin From stodd@sherbtel.net Sat Dec 28 08:44:48 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Dec 2002 16:44:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 54847 invoked from network); 28 Dec 2002 16:44:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Dec 2002 16:44:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Dec 2002 16:44:47 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-188.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.188]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gBSGihQ8011120 for ; Sat, 28 Dec 2002 10:44:44 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <006f01c2ae90$7d8cd360$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} New Pictures Date: Sat, 28 Dec 2002 10:45:09 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude I'm impressed. About the decoder in the SX2600- was that your design? Sure looks like a lot of parts on that thing. Do you have some more details of what it all does that you could share with us? Looks like you used a tunable circuit instead of a ceramic resonator. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: > I have finally gained access to a digital camera > to get some snapshots of some of my hardware mods. From possumhunter@netzero.net Sat Dec 28 08:48:06 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Dec 2002 16:48:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 4241 invoked from network); 28 Dec 2002 16:48:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Dec 2002 16:48:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.63) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Dec 2002 16:48:05 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 28 Dec 2002 08:48:05 -0800 To: References: <194.129613fb.2b3e744a@aol.com> <001b01c2ae89$1fe5c660$827dfea9@home1> <006301c2ae8e$873ff560$827dfea9@home1> Subject: Makin' Tubes was: AM Stereo sound... Date: Sat, 28 Dec 2002 11:47:53 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 28 Dec 2002 16:48:05.0514 (UTC) FILETIME=[E4B13EA0:01C2AE90] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.167.167.17] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Scott Todd wrote: >Is there any way you could see if you could obtain part or all of the Hitachi equipment? I am not sure how much of it would be good for making classic tubes. The only thing this plant has ever made is CRTs > >I wonder how difficult it would be to reverse-engineer some of that stuff and not have it come out like Chinese crap? I am sure reverse engineering is how China makes tubes. I think the keys to making good tubes would be good heavy filaments, thick metal plates with lots of surface area to radiate the heat like Eimac did on the 4-400s, getting a real good deep vacuum with good seals on the glass with plenty of getter on tubes that need it like 833s, and using a good glass such as Pyrex to make the bottle. Gold plated tube sockets would be a big plus as well. The Chinese just make the tubes as cheap as they can with them just barely able to make specs on the tube checker at the end of the production line. Kevin From groucho@skyweb.net Sat Dec 28 10:04:14 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Dec 2002 18:04:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 71956 invoked from network); 28 Dec 2002 18:04:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Dec 2002 18:04:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Dec 2002 18:04:13 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gBSIABoR023762 for ; Sat, 28 Dec 2002 13:10:11 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3E0DE58B.304D501D@skyweb.net> Date: Sat, 28 Dec 2002 12:55:23 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} American Made tubes was: AM Stereo sound... References: <21.29599b8d.2b3ea383@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Aint that the Truth....... they would rather spend $1000 on headphones and Blank CD's To make backup Copies then to Buy another Computer. or hire another Marketing person. > Would you be willing to work 60+ hours a week for 50cents a day and live in > a mud hut eating just a bowl of rice 3 meals a day? > > Hmmm come to think of it, that is about how most AM broadcast engineers > live! nevermind. > > Kevin > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sat Dec 28 11:28:23 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Dec 2002 19:28:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 83522 invoked from network); 28 Dec 2002 19:28:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Dec 2002 19:28:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Dec 2002 19:28:22 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.177] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Dec 2002 19:28:22 -0000 Date: Sat, 28 Dec 2002 19:28:21 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} New Pictures Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <006f01c2ae90$7d8cd360$827dfea9@home1> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1395 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.227 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Scott Todd" wrote: > I'm impressed. About the decoder in the SX2600- was that your design? Sure > looks like a lot of parts on that thing. Do you have some more details of > what it all does that you could share with us? Looks like you used a > tunable circuit instead of a ceramic resonator. > > ST > Yes I designed the circuit and drew the board out with a sharpie marker and yes there are a lot of parts on it but using the MC13020P is part of it. I used LC for the PLL since I didn't have any 3.6MHz resonators and the datasheet specified components for an LC osc. I used an Amidon L-33-2 where you wind your own. A very similar schematic is on my website at http://www.hal-pc.org/~jsgil/AM-Stereo/ under the name of C-QuAM Decoder. In it have redesigned the IF and AGC since I wasn't completely satisfied with it but otherwise everything else is pretty much the same. It doesn't have the NRSC de-emphasis though. I also added a small board for synchronous detection with the 13020 and there are also some schematics to some of the approaches I have used. There are 2 other circuit boards that use an analog switch to interface the decoder output with the 2600 and another to light the STEREO indicator in the florescent display anthough I don't think I would do this again on another conversion because of the complexity. JSG From e92fmjamz@yahoo.com Sat Dec 28 16:28:09 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: e92fmjamz@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 29 Dec 2002 00:28:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 7171 invoked from network); 29 Dec 2002 00:28:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Dec 2002 00:28:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14001.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.175.92) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Dec 2002 00:28:06 -0000 Message-ID: <20021229002806.97365.qmail@web14001.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [208.6.34.100] by web14001.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 28 Dec 2002 16:28:06 PST Date: Sat, 28 Dec 2002 16:28:06 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: {AMSF} American Made tubes was: AM Stereo sound... To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: <3E0DE58B.304D501D@skyweb.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: Ernest Jones X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=24963319 X-Yahoo-Profile: e92fmjamz well, thats how it be sometimes especially nowadays... those chinese tubes just don't cut it as far as I'm concerned...WRCS used to make 125% mod on the peaks with the old tubes in that RCA BTA 1R, now with those chinese tubes, lucky if we make 100% peak, I'm also riding the power up switch almost every day (im there) to keep full power out. needless to say the GM blew the old tubes, the RCA blew a cap (due to no AC) and he let it run at full power for a day before I arrived (to pick up my small paycheck) and noticed the tubes RED HOT, and calling the engineer (Hi Bob!) - we made all willis stations look and sound good that day. ;( --- Neal Newman wrote: > > > Aint that the Truth....... they would rather spend > $1000 on headphones and Blank > CD's To make backup Copies then to Buy another > Computer. or hire another > Marketing person. > > > > Would you be willing to work 60+ hours a week for > 50cents a day and live in > > a mud hut eating just a bowl of rice 3 meals a > day? > > > > Hmmm come to think of it, that is about how most > AM broadcast engineers > > live! nevermind. > > > > Kevin > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > ===== Ernest, Gates NC, USA WRCS 970 AM Ahoskie NC, Announcer,webmaster http://wrcs.cjb.net WQDK 99.3 FM Ahoskie NC, Fill in ------contact me-------- AIM: e92fmjamz2000 ICQ: 33155469 Yahoo: e92fmjamz __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From possumhunter@netzero.net Sat Dec 28 17:38:41 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: possumhunter@netzero.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 29 Dec 2002 01:38:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 86080 invoked from network); 29 Dec 2002 01:38:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Dec 2002 01:38:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rly-ip01.mx.aol.com) (205.188.156.49) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Dec 2002 01:38:40 -0000 Received: from logs-we.proxy.aol.com (logs-we.proxy.aol.com [205.188.195.5]) by rly-ip01.mx.aol.com (v83.35) with ESMTP id RELAYIN3-1228203809; Sat, 28 Dec 2002 20:38:09 -0500 Received: from ibm (AC8C4A34.ipt.aol.com [172.140.74.52]) by logs-we.proxy.aol.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with SMTP id gBT1bbc425579 for ; Sat, 28 Dec 2002 20:37:37 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <007301c2aeda$d89bfc00$6f91b498@aoldsl.net> To: References: <20021229002806.97365.qmail@web14001.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} American Made tubes was: AM Stereo sound... Date: Sat, 28 Dec 2002 20:37:25 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Apparently-From: DodgeRamTrucker@aol.com From: "Possum Hunter" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Ernest Jones wrote: > those chinese tubes just don't cut it as far as I'm concerned. I know nobody is doing it, but I wonder of it would be worthwhile to go into the business of re-building glass tubes such as 4-400s, 4-500s, and 833s? You should try the East European made tubes, they are not all that bad, compared to the Chinese. > >needless to say the GM blew the old tubes, the RCA blew a cap (due to no AC) and he let it run at full power for a day before I arrived (to pick up my small paycheck) and noticed the tubes RED HOT, It's a good thing you have an RCA, lesser transmitters would have died. > >- we made all willis stations look and sound good that day. Nothing like the sound of over-driven flat tubes, ya know! Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Sat Dec 28 17:53:40 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 29 Dec 2002 01:53:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 67817 invoked from network); 29 Dec 2002 01:53:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Dec 2002 01:53:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.85) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Dec 2002 01:53:38 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 28 Dec 2002 17:53:38 -0800 To: References: <21.29599b8d.2b3ea383@aol.com> <3E0DE58B.304D501D@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} American Made tubes was: AM Stereo sound... Date: Sat, 28 Dec 2002 20:53:19 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 29 Dec 2002 01:53:38.0881 (UTC) FILETIME=[1B4CAB10:01C2AEDD] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.140.74.52] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Neal Newman wrote: > Aint that the Truth....... they would rather spend $1000 on headphones and Blank CD's To make backup Copies then to Buy another Computer. or hire another Marketing person. If it was not for my sales commissions, I would not be able to afford to work in radio. The thing is, when I am out selling commercials, I am not at the station fixing and maintaining stuff. Kevin From michaelj@vcn.com Sat Dec 28 18:12:09 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 29 Dec 2002 02:12:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 26690 invoked from network); 29 Dec 2002 02:12:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Dec 2002 02:12:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO phosphorus.vcn.com) (209.193.72.22) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Dec 2002 02:12:08 -0000 Received: from phosphorus.vcn.com (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by phosphorus.vcn.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id gBT2CGjn004667 for ; Sat, 28 Dec 2002 19:12:16 -0700 Received: (from nobody@localhost) by phosphorus.vcn.com (8.12.6/8.12.6/Submit) id gBT2CGS5004666 for amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com; Sat, 28 Dec 2002 19:12:16 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: phosphorus.vcn.com: nobody set sender to michaelj@vcn.com using -f Received: from 209.193.86.43 ( [209.193.86.43]) as user michaelj@pop3.vcn.com by webmail.vcn.com with HTTP; Sat, 28 Dec 2002 19:12:16 -0700 Message-ID: <1041127936.3e0e5a005b320@webmail.vcn.com> Date: Sat, 28 Dec 2002 19:12:16 -0700 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: {AMSF} More Hi-Fi AM Stereo References: <20021228012032.5279.qmail@web41004.mail.yahoo.com> In-Reply-To: <20021228012032.5279.qmail@web41004.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) 3.1 From: michaelj@vcn.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Thanks Jay! December 11th! It's a boy! Our 2nd (although my first) We have another that's 20 months old. Gall bladder sugery was today and we're already home and she's doing great! MJR n WYO Quoting JNR : > > > > > Congrats on being a pops.  What day did she have > > the baby? > > > > 73, > > Jay,N1WVQ > > > > __________________________________________________ > > Do you Yahoo!? > > Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. > > http://mailplus.yahoo.com > > > > > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > > > From KC4QLP@aol.com Sat Dec 28 20:09:35 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 29 Dec 2002 04:09:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 31389 invoked from network); 29 Dec 2002 04:09:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Dec 2002 04:09:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r05.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.101) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Dec 2002 04:09:33 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.10c.1ced334c (3964) for ; Sat, 28 Dec 2002 23:09:30 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <10c.1ced334c.2b3fcf79@aol.com> Date: Sat, 28 Dec 2002 23:09:29 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} American Made tubes was: AM Stereo sound... To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 12/28/02 7:30:03 PM Eastern Standard Time, e92fmjamz@yahoo.com writes: > those chinese tubes just don't cut it as far as I'm > concerned...WRCS used to make 125% mod on the peaks > with the old tubes in that RCA BTA 1R, now with those > chinese tubes, lucky if we make 100% peak Thats an Amprex tube for ya...graphite plate tubes at that. With the right processing it could make 110% on modulation peaks..but you can only do so much with the ol CBS gear. One of the caps in the antenna coupling stage cracked and changed value...thus changing the load that the transmitter was seeing.Thats what killed the tubes...especially since I wasnt called and told that there was a problem until a day later. A simple phone call could have saved nearly a $1,000 in what it cost for new tubes. ...plus the cost for a new cap. The station was however on the air until the new tubes and cap came in.The tubes were really flat!and a mix of odd ball spare caps got the station the air at 500 watts. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com ______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Dec 28 20:48:05 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 29 Dec 2002 04:48:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 81856 invoked from network); 29 Dec 2002 04:48:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Dec 2002 04:48:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Dec 2002 04:48:04 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.151] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 29 Dec 2002 04:48:03 -0000 Date: Sun, 29 Dec 2002 04:48:02 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: AM station for sale on eBay Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 133 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.94.20 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics 10 kW in Albuquerque, New Mexico... starting bid is only $1 million! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3103327096 From KC4QLP@aol.com Sat Dec 28 21:16:40 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 29 Dec 2002 05:16:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 38771 invoked from network); 29 Dec 2002 05:16:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Dec 2002 05:16:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r09.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.105) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Dec 2002 05:16:38 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r09.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.74.28707fa9 (3964) for ; Sun, 29 Dec 2002 00:16:35 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <74.28707fa9.2b3fdf33@aol.com> Date: Sun, 29 Dec 2002 00:16:35 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} American Made tubes was: AM Stereo sound... To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 12/28/02 11:34:27 AM Eastern Standard Time, possumhunter@netzero.net writes: > Would you be willing to work 60+ hours a week for 50cents a day and live in > a mud hut eating just a bowl of rice 3 meals a day? > > Hmmm come to think of it, that is about how most AM broadcast engineers > live! nevermind. > You work 60+ hours a week for 50 cents!...how did you pull that one off? A nud hut and 3 meals a day?!? ...man your living high on the hog! LOL Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From e92fmjamz@yahoo.com Sat Dec 28 22:29:55 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: e92fmjamz@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 29 Dec 2002 06:29:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 29437 invoked from network); 29 Dec 2002 06:29:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Dec 2002 06:29:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14004.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.175.120) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Dec 2002 06:29:55 -0000 Message-ID: <20021229062955.39458.qmail@web14004.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [208.6.34.92] by web14004.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 28 Dec 2002 22:29:55 PST Date: Sat, 28 Dec 2002 22:29:55 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: {AMSF} American Made tubes was: AM Stereo sound... To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: <74.28707fa9.2b3fdf33@aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: Ernest Jones X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=24963319 X-Yahoo-Profile: e92fmjamz 60+hours... for 50cents a day...I'll be bigtimin then..oodles and noodles made a lot of dinners for me last semester. --- KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 12/28/02 11:34:27 AM Eastern > Standard Time, > possumhunter@netzero.net writes: > > > > Would you be willing to work 60+ hours a week for > 50cents a day and live in > > a mud hut eating just a bowl of rice 3 meals a > day? > > > > Hmmm come to think of it, that is about how most > AM broadcast engineers > > live! nevermind. > > > > You work 60+ hours a week for 50 cents!...how did > you pull that one off? A > nud hut and 3 meals a day?!? ...man your living high > on the hog! > LOL > > Bob Carter > Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group > > WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach > 104..., WQDK 99.3 > Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 > > Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio > stations with engineering > services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. > e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net > Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC > WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC > WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor > NC > Ray > Communications Radio Network > > AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- > amstereo-subcribe@topica.com > _______________________________________________________ > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > ===== Ernest, Gates NC, USA WRCS 970 AM Ahoskie NC, Announcer,webmaster http://wrcs.cjb.net WQDK 99.3 FM Ahoskie NC, Fill in ------contact me-------- AIM: e92fmjamz2000 ICQ: 33155469 Yahoo: e92fmjamz __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From alfredot@inetarena.com Sat Dec 28 22:43:40 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: alfredot@inetarena.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 29 Dec 2002 06:43:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 55519 invoked from network); 29 Dec 2002 06:43:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Dec 2002 06:43:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.inetarena.com) (206.129.216.13) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Dec 2002 06:43:40 -0000 Received: from hendrie (1Cust142.tnt17.beaverton.or.da.uu.net [65.227.179.142]) by mail.inetarena.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id gBT6fQM17264 for ; Sat, 28 Dec 2002 22:41:26 -0800 (PST) Date: Sat, 28 Dec 2002 22:43:11 -0800 (PST) X-Sender: alfredo@hendrie.1610am.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Parts (was Re: Re: AM stereo schematic) In-Reply-To: <1041066879.680.65378.m12@yahoogroups.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: "Alfredo E. Torrejon" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=25132238 X-Yahoo-Profile: alfredotorrejon > There's an outfit in Taxachusettes that carries a lot of obsolete > semiconductors. In fact, they even buy the dies and such for a lot of them. > I get my supplies of IRF-350s for my Gates 5 transmitter from Rochester > Electronics. Have you tried them for the numbers you're looking for? I checked their website, and they do not currently stock the MC3340 or the SSM2120/SSM2122. However,they do carry the NE592 video amplifier, though their price of $2.11 is a bit steep. If you need this IC, Debco Electronics ( http://debcoelectronics.com/ ) has them for $0.39 each! Given the difficulty of finding some of the parts required to build/fix AM Stereo gear, I have an idea: is there some way that a parts database could be added to the the AM Stereo page? Participators of our forum would submit information on where different components can be purchased and their prices. This would keep the information in one place where all could easily access it. What do you think? Alfredo From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Sun Dec 29 01:50:56 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 29 Dec 2002 09:50:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 18059 invoked from network); 29 Dec 2002 09:50:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Dec 2002 09:50:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web41010.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.93.9) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Dec 2002 09:50:54 -0000 Message-ID: <20021229095054.29256.qmail@web41010.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.32.178] by web41010.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 29 Dec 2002 01:50:54 PST Date: Sun, 29 Dec 2002 01:50:54 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM station for sale on eBay To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio Yeah, I saw that too a couple of days ago, but I am having trouble determining which station it is because there are 3 10kWs listed for the market on www.100000watts.com. 73, Jay,N1WVQ __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From dfr68819@wanadoo.fr Sun Dec 29 02:48:01 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dfr68819@wanadoo.fr X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 29 Dec 2002 10:48:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 39008 invoked from network); 29 Dec 2002 10:48:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Dec 2002 10:48:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.87) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Dec 2002 10:48:01 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.250] by n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 29 Dec 2002 10:48:01 -0000 Date: Sun, 29 Dec 2002 10:47:58 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: AM Stereo in France & Spain (was: Re: AM stereo schematic) Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2326 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Denis " X-Originating-IP: 80.15.216.218 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=117455200 X-Yahoo-Profile: pcvpcn You are right, France blue works well there stereo on 864Kcs to PARIS.Voir: http://perso.wanadoo.fr/tvignaud/am/rbleue/rbleue.htm Denis --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: > > What's "numerique?" > > I believe it is the French way to say "digital". Perhaps Denis means > that this AM station is transmitting using the DRM (Digital Radio > Mondial) system, which is Europe's alternative to IBOC. > > Do we still have any members from the UK or Ireland here? They > usually get DX reception of "France Bleu" on 864 kHz from Paris > (300,000 watts non-directional!) and perhaps could tell us whether or > not it is still broadcasting in AM Stereo. (Note that for a while, > they were broadcasting AM Stereo without the pilot tone, causing all > but "forced Stereo" receivers like the Sonys or MetroSound to mistake > it for a completely mono signal.) > > As the story goes, the French government only considers/ed the > AM Stereo broadcasts on 864 kHz to be a "test", to see if the C- Quam > system with work out okay within the more crowded European AM/MW band. > Apparently they were concerned that an AM Stereo signal would require > a greater bandwidth than a regular mono AM signal, but of course that > isn't true (at least with properly adjusted transmitting equipment), > and I doubt they would keep broadcasting it for years if it didn't > meet their standards. > > Obviously, in terms of the percentage of their overall listenership, > the AM Stereo on "France Bleu" is little more than a novelty, but as > long as the equipment is installed and in working condition, there is > really no reason why they can't or shouldn't continue to broadcast in > AM Stereo. > > What I am still wondering about is the AM Stereo stations in Madrid, > Spain. In the early 1990s, there were known to be a few using the > C-Quam system, including "COPE" (a pop music station) with 50,000 > watts on 999 kHz, but I have never been able to find out more > information on this. It is quite doubtful that any are still using it > today, but I'd at least like to know exactly which stations used it, > for what time period, and whether these were also just "tests" of if > they were really serious about AM Stereo broadcasting. From dfr68819@wanadoo.fr Sun Dec 29 02:59:08 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dfr68819@wanadoo.fr X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 29 Dec 2002 10:59:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 45323 invoked from network); 29 Dec 2002 10:59:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Dec 2002 10:59:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.68) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Dec 2002 10:59:07 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.188] by n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 29 Dec 2002 10:59:07 -0000 Date: Sun, 29 Dec 2002 10:59:07 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: AM stereo schematic Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 237 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Denis " X-Originating-IP: 80.15.216.218 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=117455200 X-Yahoo-Profile: pcvpcn The same site translates into English. http://translate.copernic.com:8060/? AlisUI=frames_ex/gen_toolbar&AlisSourceLang=fr&AlisTargetLang=en&AlisU ILang=en&AlisTargetURI=http% 3A//perso.wanadoo.fr/tvignaud/am/rbleue/rbleue.htm Denis. From steveking@wgnradio.com Sun Dec 29 03:25:45 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: steveking@wgnradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 29 Dec 2002 11:25:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 19589 invoked from network); 29 Dec 2002 11:25:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Dec 2002 11:25:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.68) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Dec 2002 11:25:44 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.151] by n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 29 Dec 2002 11:25:44 -0000 Date: Sun, 29 Dec 2002 11:25:43 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: The JAM Song Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1222 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgnhim " X-Originating-IP: 172.128.126.201 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71806925 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgnhim --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "bradleyj923 " wrote: > BTW Steve...Did you ever work with either Paul Kasey at WIBC or > Charlie Brown at WNAP? > > -Brad Jackson > -Susquehanna, Indianapolis > -WGLD/WGRL/WFMS While I'm familiar with both names, I don't recall working with either of them. I was in naptown from late 1969 till spring of 1971. At that time the stations were owned by Fairbanks broadcasting, which was a great company to work for. One of the things I enjoyed when I moved back to Chicago was being able to pick up WIBC at night. Now it's rare that their signal makes it up here. Another station, a bit farther south, that I used to be able to pick up, in AM Stereo, as Johnnie and I would be driving in to WGN, at night, was WHAS. That was back when Joe Donovan was doing the all night show. Their AM Stereo signal came into Chicago very clean and strong. In some areas WHAS used to come in stronger than some local stations. Not any more! BTW, Joe became a friend and we were very sorry to see him go. I know it's a bit off topic, but if anyone knows where he is now and could e-mail me, I'd love to get in touch with him, again. Steve King/WGN-AM, Chicago From evergreenterrace@buzzle.com Sun Dec 29 06:24:28 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: evergreenterrace@buzzle.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 29 Dec 2002 14:24:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 84579 invoked from network); 29 Dec 2002 14:24:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Dec 2002 14:24:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.70) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Dec 2002 14:24:25 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.253] by n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 29 Dec 2002 14:24:25 -0000 Date: Sun, 29 Dec 2002 14:24:21 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Trying to buy a good radio Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 879 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgliradio " X-Originating-IP: 170.20.11.59 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=69711087 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgliradio Just bought a new car on Thursday. The radio that came with the car left something to be desired on both bands, so I went searching Friday for a new one to replace it. Could not find a Blaupunkt anywhere. I looked them up online and none of the DigiCeiver's have cassette decks (I never use CD in the car). I looked at Sony, Pioneer, Kenwood and Panasonic receivers. If as much thought went into the actual tuner as the stupid displays on the front, they may actually be able to design a decent one with AMS. I wonder how much cheaper it would be to get rid of the glitzy displays and add AMS with a more functional display? Settled with a JVC. Fairly decent AM frequency response and a nice sounding FM section (although not as selective as some of the others on FM). Just goes to show, equipment made today can't hold a candle to the oldies but goodies. From oldphones@webtv.net Sun Dec 29 07:49:59 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: oldphones@webtv.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 29 Dec 2002 15:49:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 65284 invoked from network); 29 Dec 2002 15:49:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Dec 2002 15:49:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO smtpout-2001-1.public.lawson.webtv.net) (209.240.212.81) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Dec 2002 15:49:58 -0000 Received: from storefull-2112.public.lawson.webtv.net (lawson-public-ipmux-1-pip-6.public.lawson.webtv.net [209.240.212.97]) by smtpout-2001-1.public.lawson.webtv.net (WebTV_Postfix+sws) with ESMTP id 8A69CC53C; Sun, 29 Dec 2002 07:49:57 -0800 (PST) Received: (from production@localhost) by storefull-2112.public.lawson.webtv.net (8.8.8-wtv-f/mt.gso.26Feb98) id HAA08391; Sun, 29 Dec 2002 07:49:57 -0800 (PST) X-WebTV-Signature: 1 ETAtAhUAnKUp9gp7d+6SNAUYi4u08a0jCX0CFAtctHMtziAz5F0dtb6gesaFgMxH Date: Sun, 29 Dec 2002 09:49:57 -0600 (CST) To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, amstereo@yahoogroups.com Subject: KFAB TRANSMITTER Message-ID: <21546-3E0F19A5-10198@storefull-2112.public.lawson.webtv.net> Content-Disposition: Inline MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) X-eGroups-From: oldphones@webtv.net (oldphones) From: oldphones@webtv.net X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38022783 X-Yahoo-Profile: oldphones1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit William P. Snyder Oldphones@ webtv. net (402) 593-6841 I Specialize in AM Stereo radios, collectable telephones, parts, and wiring items http://community.webtv.net/oldphones/OldPhonesRadiosPage ---------- http://community-2.webtv.net/AM-DXer/KFABTRANSMITTER/ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From oldphones@webtv.net Sun Dec 29 08:10:23 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: oldphones@webtv.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 29 Dec 2002 16:10:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 5866 invoked from network); 29 Dec 2002 16:10:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Dec 2002 16:10:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO smtpout-2001-2.public.lawson.webtv.net) (209.240.212.82) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Dec 2002 16:10:22 -0000 Received: from storefull-2112.public.lawson.webtv.net (lawson-public-ipmux-1-pip-6.public.lawson.webtv.net [209.240.212.97]) by smtpout-2001-2.public.lawson.webtv.net (WebTV_Postfix+sws) with ESMTP id 4D7167A138 for ; Sun, 29 Dec 2002 08:10:19 -0800 (PST) Received: (from production@localhost) by storefull-2112.public.lawson.webtv.net (8.8.8-wtv-f/mt.gso.26Feb98) id IAA09186; Sun, 29 Dec 2002 08:10:18 -0800 (PST) X-WebTV-Signature: 1 ETAsAhQl0s/fsSvwBfuoiOiszcscX3qmEwIUDSAG2v5nULcsvXLoYIGdbp0IQ7k= Date: Sun, 29 Dec 2002 10:10:18 -0600 (CST) To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: KFAB TRANSMITTER Message-ID: <21549-3E0F1E6A-5674@storefull-2112.public.lawson.webtv.net> Content-Disposition: Inline Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) X-eGroups-From: oldphones@webtv.net (oldphones) From: oldphones@webtv.net X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38022783 X-Yahoo-Profile: oldphones1 I found a page on the KFAB -AM Transmitter 1110 Kcs 50,000 watts Omaha, NE The AM$ Continental was replaced by the New Harris about a year ago. This probably explains why KFAB no longer has an AM Stereo operation, the the new equipment being MONO AM. BTW_ I heard that the RCA ampliphase did get scrapped. A darn shame!! I had a tour of this transmitting site about the Summer of 1983 shortly before the conversion to AM Stereo, the Continteal was new at the time. The FM back up transmitter for KGOR 99.9 is also at this site. I had pictures of the AM equipment and the 1960 vintage KFAB-FM transmitter (now KGOR). Little has seemed to change from what I recall. William P. Snyder Oldphones@ webtv. net (402) 593-6841 I Specialize in AM Stereo radios, collectable telephones, parts, and wiring items http://community.webtv.net/oldphones/OldPhonesRadiosPage From oldphones@webtv.net Sun Dec 29 08:38:34 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: oldphones@webtv.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 29 Dec 2002 16:38:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 50204 invoked from network); 29 Dec 2002 16:38:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Dec 2002 16:38:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO smtpout-2001-2.public.lawson.webtv.net) (209.240.212.82) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Dec 2002 16:38:32 -0000 Received: from storefull-2112.public.lawson.webtv.net (lawson-public-ipmux-1-pip-6.public.lawson.webtv.net [209.240.212.97]) by smtpout-2001-2.public.lawson.webtv.net (WebTV_Postfix+sws) with ESMTP id 6C0177A157 for ; Sun, 29 Dec 2002 08:38:32 -0800 (PST) Received: (from production@localhost) by storefull-2112.public.lawson.webtv.net (8.8.8-wtv-f/mt.gso.26Feb98) id IAA10086; Sun, 29 Dec 2002 08:38:32 -0800 (PST) X-WebTV-Signature: 1 ETAsAhRSeHQxv2QHwwVQYk24yGa0Hhj0xwIUV2P78Xp+bf8qbDxpeR5y7rCv+LA= Date: Sun, 29 Dec 2002 10:38:31 -0600 (CST) To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Digest Number 510 Message-ID: <21546-3E0F2507-10269@storefull-2112.public.lawson.webtv.net> In-Reply-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com's message of 29 Dec 2002 09:20:47 -0000 Content-Disposition: Inline Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) X-eGroups-From: oldphones@webtv.net (oldphones) From: oldphones@webtv.net X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38022783 X-Yahoo-Profile: oldphones1 There has been a running discussion on tubes, here recently. some time also, I ran across a site for Westrex // Western Electric manufacturing tubes for audio equipment. Their old plant was/ is in the Kansas City area and production is moving to Huntsville, AL Whether they ever got into transmitting tubes, I don't know. Hardily anyone makes tubes in the States anymore, this may be an exception. I have heard good reports about the Russian made tubes, although ---Setvena OR something like that. William P. Snyder Oldphones@ webtv. net (402) 593-6841 I Specialize in AM Stereo radios, collectable telephones, parts, and wiring items http://community.webtv.net/oldphones/OldPhonesRadiosPage From oldphones@webtv.net Sun Dec 29 08:41:11 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: oldphones@webtv.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 29 Dec 2002 16:41:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 49666 invoked from network); 29 Dec 2002 16:41:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Dec 2002 16:41:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO smtpout-2001-1.public.lawson.webtv.net) (209.240.212.81) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Dec 2002 16:41:11 -0000 Received: from storefull-2112.public.lawson.webtv.net (lawson-public-ipmux-1-pip-6.public.lawson.webtv.net [209.240.212.97]) by smtpout-2001-1.public.lawson.webtv.net (WebTV_Postfix+sws) with ESMTP id BE8C8C537 for ; Sun, 29 Dec 2002 08:41:10 -0800 (PST) Received: (from production@localhost) by storefull-2112.public.lawson.webtv.net (8.8.8-wtv-f/mt.gso.26Feb98) id IAA10161; Sun, 29 Dec 2002 08:41:10 -0800 (PST) X-WebTV-Signature: 1 ETAsAhQshwcQ1tYrCQrKConYZ0znOxRdjAIUMBqL/R7D+yg0nO1TBIeKZISXnlI= Date: Sun, 29 Dec 2002 10:41:10 -0600 (CST) To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Western_Electric=AE_Brand_Audio_Products_History?= Message-ID: <21546-3E0F25A6-10272@storefull-2112.public.lawson.webtv.net> Content-Disposition: Inline MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) X-eGroups-From: oldphones@webtv.net (oldphones) From: oldphones@webtv.net X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38022783 X-Yahoo-Profile: oldphones1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit William P. Snyder Oldphones@ webtv. net (402) 593-6841 I Specialize in AM Stereo radios, collectable telephones, parts, and wiring items http://community.webtv.net/oldphones/OldPhonesRadiosPage ---------- http://www.westernelectric.com/history.html [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sun Dec 29 10:38:51 2002 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 73058 invoked from network); 29 Dec 2002 18:38:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Dec 2002 18:38:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.67) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Dec 2002 18:38:50 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: notify@yahoogroups.com Received: from [66.218.67.151] by n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 29 Dec 2002 18:38:49 -0000 Date: 29 Dec 2002 18:38:49 -0000 Message-ID: <1041187129.304.66023.w30@yahoogroups.com> X-eGroups-Application: polls X-Yahoo-Group-Post: system From: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Poll results for amstereoforum MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit The following amstereoforum poll is now closed. Here are the final results: POLL QUESTION: If you had a choice to listen to your favorite AM music station, which format would you prefer? CHOICES AND RESULTS - HD Radio, 0 votes, 0.00% - Eureka, 2 votes, 9.52% - Kahn ISB, 1 votes, 4.76% - C QuAM, 18 votes, 85.71% For more information about this group, please visit http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum For help with Yahoo! Groups, please visit http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/ From ccuff@in4web.com Sun Dec 29 13:52:53 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 29 Dec 2002 21:52:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 90996 invoked from network); 29 Dec 2002 21:52:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Dec 2002 21:52:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Dec 2002 21:52:51 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.30]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Sun, 29 Dec 2002 16:48:08 -0500 Message-ID: <002a01c2af83$6af4cd40$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: <3E0C9221.BF487AA9@skyweb.net> <3E0CA84F.8DB570E@skyweb.net> <009401c2ae0f$dcac0a40$827dfea9@home1> Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM Stereo sound... Date: Sun, 29 Dec 2002 16:44:07 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 My "over simplistic" view here- Why not bias the grids a bit more- why make anything work at 100% when these tubes are so expensive? This always drove me crazy! When I worked at Heathkit, they made that old orange amp that used 7868's, I think- and biased them so the plates ran orange- Stupid! Just for power? BS! I would rebias them, the tubes never burned out, and I NEVER had a complaint due to "reduced output" my 2 ¢ Chris From spfleck@citlink.net Sun Dec 29 14:36:54 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: spfleck@citlink.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 29 Dec 2002 22:36:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 36901 invoked from network); 29 Dec 2002 22:36:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Dec 2002 22:36:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.88) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Dec 2002 22:36:52 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.248] by n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 29 Dec 2002 22:36:52 -0000 Date: Sun, 29 Dec 2002 22:36:51 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Military training film on a New York radio station, WMCA Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 397 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Steve Fleckenstein " X-Originating-IP: 170.215.240.46 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=2988995 X-Yahoo-Profile: n2ubp http://www.archive.org/movies/details-db.php? collection=prelinger&collectionid=50701 Military training film on a New York radio station, WMCA, owned by the Nathan Straus family, showing its ownership, management and activities. Good view of radio in the era when most stations were locally owned and operated. Sponsor: U.S. Army Producer: Mitchell Film Associates Audio/Visual: Sd, B&W From ccuff@in4web.com Sun Dec 29 15:49:38 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 29 Dec 2002 23:49:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 22598 invoked from network); 29 Dec 2002 23:49:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Dec 2002 23:49:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Dec 2002 23:49:37 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.27]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Sun, 29 Dec 2002 18:44:54 -0500 Message-ID: <001e01c2af93$bacdd4a0$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Military training film on a New York radio station, WMCA Date: Sun, 29 Dec 2002 18:40:53 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 Ah memories...... "First on your dial- W-M-C-A..... New York" I remember them like it was yesterday. During the sixties, I can remember flipping between them and WABC- often hearing them playing the same hit at the same time. I met "Uncle" Joe Bova in 1963, and that was a real treat. someday, I gotta get my time machine done.... go back and re-live all the great radio days. Gotta get one of them Flux Capacitors first.. CC ----- Original Message ----- From: From fanfare@globility.com Sun Dec 29 16:20:25 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 30 Dec 2002 00:20:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 1444 invoked from network); 30 Dec 2002 00:20:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Dec 2002 00:20:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.eol.ca) (205.189.151.1) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Dec 2002 00:20:23 -0000 Received: from FAN--MCS (dynamic-b1-59.highspeed.eol.ca [64.56.233.59]) by mail.eol.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 444B687FD9 for ; Sun, 29 Dec 2002 19:20:23 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <200212291920200981.014525F9@mail.globility.com> In-Reply-To: References: X-Mailer: Calypso Version 3.30.00.00 (4) Date: Sun, 29 Dec 2002 19:20:20 -0500 To: "Kevin Tekel" Subject: Re: {AMSF} Military training film on a New York radio station, WMCA Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable From: "Marv Southcott" Reply-To: fanfare@globility.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy Hi Steve: Many thanks for bringing this site and the WMCA film to our(my) attention. = Aside from its nostalgic value, it sure does help provide answers to the qu= estion of what independent radio was like before the bottom line became mor= e important than community relevance. In its own way, Network radio played = just as important a part by bringing all the best entertainment programs to= local affiliates all over the country.=20 Surprising to those who think radio has no real entertainment value, at the= time that film was made community relevance and program quality was what m= ade the greatest contribution to the bottom line. And that continued well b= eyond the introduction of television.=20 Marv *********** REPLY SEPARATOR *********** On 12/29/2002 at 10:36 PM Steve Fleckenstein wrote: >http://www.archive.org/movies/details-db.php? >collection=3Dprelinger&collectionid=3D50701 > >Military training film on a New York radio station, WMCA, owned by=20 >the Nathan Straus family, showing its ownership, management and=20 >activities. Good view of radio in the era when most stations were=20 >locally owned and operated.=20 > >Sponsor: U.S. Army=20 >Producer: Mitchell Film Associates=20 >Audio/Visual: Sd, B&W=20 > > > >Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum=20 > >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From possumhunter@netzero.net Sun Dec 29 19:28:07 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 30 Dec 2002 03:28:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 38095 invoked from network); 30 Dec 2002 03:28:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Dec 2002 03:28:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.89) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Dec 2002 03:28:06 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 29 Dec 2002 19:28:06 -0800 To: References: <21549-3E0F1E6A-5674@storefull-2112.public.lawson.webtv.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} KFAB TRANSMITTER Date: Sun, 29 Dec 2002 18:25:05 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 30 Dec 2002 03:28:06.0061 (UTC) FILETIME=[779D75D0:01C2AFB3] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.171.221.134] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 oldphones@webtv.net wrote: > The AM$ Continental was replaced by the New Harris about a year ago. This probably explains why KFAB no longer has an AM Stereo operation, the new equipment being MONO AM. It would sure be easy enough to hook the stereo exciter to the DX-50. > > BTW_ I heard that the RCA Ampliphase did get scrapped. A darn shame!! Unless the RCA had big time problems, I woulda dumped the Continental and kept the RCA! Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Sun Dec 29 19:28:08 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 30 Dec 2002 03:28:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 38109 invoked from network); 30 Dec 2002 03:28:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Dec 2002 03:28:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.120) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Dec 2002 03:28:08 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 29 Dec 2002 19:28:08 -0800 To: References: <21546-3E0F2507-10269@storefull-2112.public.lawson.webtv.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Digest Number 510 Date: Sun, 29 Dec 2002 22:19:52 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 30 Dec 2002 03:28:08.0076 (UTC) FILETIME=[78D0ECC0:01C2AFB3] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.171.221.134] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 oldphones@webtv.net wrote: >There has been a running discussion on tubes, here recently. some time also, I ran across a site for Westrex // Western Electric manufacturing tubes for audio equipment. I noticed they still make the KT88 used as an audio tube in many transmitters. Western Electric tubes are *VERY* expensive, but if they made a grenade-proof 4-400 or 833, it would be worth the price. Perhaps they could be talked into running a batch? > >I have heard good reports about the Russian made tubes, lthough ---Setvena OR something like that. I have found the Russian made tubes to be of very high quality. I have them in my home HiFi gear. Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Sun Dec 29 19:28:10 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 30 Dec 2002 03:28:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 28432 invoked from network); 30 Dec 2002 03:28:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Dec 2002 03:28:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.203) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Dec 2002 03:28:09 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 29 Dec 2002 19:28:09 -0800 To: References: <74.28707fa9.2b3fdf33@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} American Made tubes was: AM Stereo sound... Date: Sun, 29 Dec 2002 22:24:27 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 30 Dec 2002 03:28:09.0705 (UTC) FILETIME=[79C97D90:01C2AFB3] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.171.221.134] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: > You work 60+ hours a week for 50 cents!...how did you pull that one off? A mud hut and 3 meals a day?!? ...man your living high on the hog! Yea! As a Christmas bonus, I even got an extra half cup of water! ...And Mama said I shoulda went to medical school! Look At me now, I am "Mr.Radio"! Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Sun Dec 29 20:43:17 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 30 Dec 2002 04:43:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 21562 invoked from network); 30 Dec 2002 04:43:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Dec 2002 04:43:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.194) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Dec 2002 04:43:15 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 29 Dec 2002 20:43:15 -0800 To: Subject: Welcome To WGCR! Date: Sun, 29 Dec 2002 23:42:50 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 30 Dec 2002 04:43:15.0796 (UTC) FILETIME=[F7A06940:01C2AFBD] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.171.221.134] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit http://www.wgcr.org/ A good sounding Gospel AM station! Kevin [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From KC4QLP@aol.com Sun Dec 29 21:31:08 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 30 Dec 2002 05:31:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 61004 invoked from network); 30 Dec 2002 05:31:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Dec 2002 05:31:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r08.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.104) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Dec 2002 05:31:05 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.138.1919864e (4410) for ; Mon, 30 Dec 2002 00:30:57 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <138.1919864e.2b413410@aol.com> Date: Mon, 30 Dec 2002 00:30:56 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} American Made tubes was: AM Stereo sound... To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 12/29/02 10:29:41 PM Eastern Standard Time, possumhunter@netzero.net writes: > Yea! As a Christmas bonus, I even got an extra half cup of water! > ...And Mama said I shoulda went to medical school! > Look At me now, I am "Mr.Radio"! > > Kevin > SSSshhhhhh!...not so loud!..you might start a stampede...engineers rushing to SC! Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Sun Dec 29 22:34:40 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 30 Dec 2002 06:34:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 68070 invoked from network); 30 Dec 2002 06:34:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Dec 2002 06:34:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14202.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.144) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Dec 2002 06:34:38 -0000 Message-ID: <20021230063438.92881.qmail@web14202.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [65.221.47.68] by web14202.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 29 Dec 2002 22:34:38 PST Date: Sun, 29 Dec 2002 22:34:38 -0800 (PST) Subject: 1690 Disaster OMG To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio It's 1:30am Eastern time, and taking a listen to 1690 on my Delco UX-1, it sounds like a buzzsaw! I can almost hear an analog station, but I'm assuming that terrible noise is digital hash that is nearly wiping-out the analog station? Switching off the AM/ST and reducing bandwidth, and still the noise is 80% the level of the analog - totally unacceptable. Anybody else that can concur, or record this disaster? It almost sounds like what you hear on shortwave sometimes. __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Dec 29 23:30:53 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 30 Dec 2002 07:30:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 23918 invoked from network); 30 Dec 2002 07:30:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Dec 2002 07:30:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Dec 2002 07:30:51 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.147] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Dec 2002 07:30:51 -0000 Date: Mon, 30 Dec 2002 07:30:50 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Welcome To WGCR! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 756 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.79.8 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > http://www.wgcr.org/ > A good sounding Gospel AM station! If you want to hear a good-sounding Stereo webcast from a top-notch radio network, take a listen to the BBC's Radio 2. Most American stations can only dream of having their kind of full-service, personality-driven AC/Oldies format -- including all the great U.K./Irish music that is never heard on the radio on this side of the pond, except maybe in Canada. Here's the direct link to their webcast, which you can cut and paste into the "Location:" field of RealPlayer. On a fast connection, it will sound surprisingly good, and even on an ordinary modem, it will sound at least as good as what IBOC will be like. rtsp://rmlivev8.bbc.net.uk/farm/*/ev7/live24/radio2/live/fmg2.ra From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Dec 29 23:45:11 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 30 Dec 2002 07:45:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 80085 invoked from network); 30 Dec 2002 07:45:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Dec 2002 07:45:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Dec 2002 07:45:10 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.249] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Dec 2002 07:45:10 -0000 Date: Mon, 30 Dec 2002 07:45:07 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: 1690 Disaster OMG Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20021230063438.92881.qmail@web14202.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 326 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.79.8 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > It's 1:30am Eastern time, and taking a listen to 1690 on my Delco > UX-1, it sounds like a buzzsaw! Where are you located? Here in NJ, WPTX 1690 AM Stereo is coming in as usual, with no noticeable noise. Perhaps you're hearing locally generated interference? Or some other Expanded Band station that is testing IBOC? From n0uiheric@aol.com Mon Dec 30 00:46:40 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 30 Dec 2002 08:46:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 46230 invoked from network); 30 Dec 2002 08:46:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Dec 2002 08:46:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m05.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.8) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Dec 2002 08:46:39 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-m05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.136.18a5a902 (30970) for ; Mon, 30 Dec 2002 03:46:26 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <136.18a5a902.2b4161e2@aol.com> Date: Mon, 30 Dec 2002 03:46:26 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Military training film on a New York radio station, WMCA To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih Let's not forget B.M.R., otherwise known as B. Mitchell Reed. His experience at WMCA was relived on "Cruisin' 1963", released in the early 1970s. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk Mon Dec 30 05:38:32 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 30 Dec 2002 13:38:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 47536 invoked from network); 30 Dec 2002 13:38:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Dec 2002 13:38:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Dec 2002 13:38:30 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.151] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Dec 2002 13:38:30 -0000 Date: Mon, 30 Dec 2002 13:38:30 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: AM Stereo in France & Spain (was: Re: AM stereo schematic) Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3201 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "m1ctk " X-Originating-IP: 81.7.53.97 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113985069 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereofan Intersted in your reply Kevin ? --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "m1ctk " wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " > wrote: > > > What's "numerique?" > > > > I believe it is the French way to say "digital". Perhaps Denis > means > > that this AM station is transmitting using the DRM (Digital Radio > > Mondial) system, which is Europe's alternative to IBOC. > > > > Do we still have any members from the UK or Ireland here? > > Only me! I feel quite out numbered here amounst a mainly US group > > They > > usually get DX reception of "France Bleu" on 864 kHz from Paris > > (300,000 watts non-directional!) and perhaps could tell us whether > or > > not it is still broadcasting in AM Stereo. > > Yes for sure > > (Note that for a while, > > they were broadcasting AM Stereo without the pilot tone, causing > all > > but "forced Stereo" receivers like the Sonys or MetroSound to > mistake > > it for a completely mono signal.) > > > > As the story goes, the French government only considers/ed the > > AM Stereo broadcasts on 864 kHz to be a "test", to see if the C- > Quam > > system with work out okay within the more crowded European AM/MW > band. > > Apparently they were concerned that an AM Stereo signal would > require > > a greater bandwidth than a regular mono AM signal, but of course > that > > isn't true (at least with properly adjusted transmitting > equipment), > > and I doubt they would keep broadcasting it for years if it didn't > > meet their standards. > > > > Obviously, in terms of the percentage of their overall > listenership, > > the AM Stereo on "France Bleu" is little more than a novelty, but > as > > long as the equipment is installed and in working condition, there > is > > really no reason why they can't or shouldn't continue to broadcast > in > > AM Stereo. > > > > What I am still wondering about is the AM Stereo stations in > Madrid, > > Spain. In the early 1990s, there were known to be a few using the > > C-Quam system, including "COPE" (a pop music station) with 50,000 > > watts on 999 kHz, but I have never been able to find out more > > information on this. It is quite doubtful that any are still using > it > > today, but I'd at least like to know exactly which stations used > it, > > for what time period, and whether these were also just "tests" of > if > > they were really serious about AM Stereo broadcasting. > > I get COPE coming in on 999 at night though no stereo. I wish I could > encourage other countries to try c-quam stereo. Holland would use the > system but they don't bother as they think no one has AM stereo > radio's which is in Eurpoe is 99.8 true. the UK goverment is so soft > as you probably hear about many things but totally the oposite when > it comes to radio matters. If the interent and email had been as > widely spread as now back in the early 1990's I'm sure the UK would > have had AM stereo and probably most of Europe though discussion > forums lie these emails to the RA etc etc > > What did you think of the MP3 from Italy ? > > Dave From philipr@irac.pe.ca Mon Dec 30 05:39:38 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 30 Dec 2002 13:39:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 49498 invoked from network); 30 Dec 2002 13:39:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Dec 2002 13:39:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Dec 2002 13:39:38 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.182] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Dec 2002 13:39:38 -0000 Date: Mon, 30 Dec 2002 13:39:35 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: AM Stereo station discovery? Maybe??? Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1525 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking Last night, I happened to be checking for AM Stereo stations with my converted for home use Toyota [Panasonic] AM Stereo car radio. CJCH was going in and out of the pilot as the signal tumbled between groundwave and skywave. I then checked CKDH 900 in Amherst NS, and was shocked when the stereo light came on! I suspected falsing, as this little 1kw station has never, to my knowledge, been in stereo. It is owned by MBS radio, same bunch that owns CHNS and 22 other stations. CKDH, although only 1000 watts, has a very impressive signal, as its transmitter site is located on the Tantramar Marshes - the same salt Marsh that Radio Canada International uses just a few miles away. While I suspected falsing, there did seem to be an obvious stereo effect on the Toyota receiver. On the pilot light-less Sony SRF-42, I couldn't seem to get a stereo effect - but that rig is very hard to tune for stereo - even with my Alfredo Lite. My theory is this - CKCW's AM stereo exciter supposedly went to CHNS, where it was tried - but MBS threw in the towel because of STL difficulties. I'm wondering if it wasn't sent up to CKDH for some testing purposes. The other theory is that there was some nifty twist on platform motion which seemed to give a nice "fake" stereo effect, along with some falsing to trigger the pilot light. Needless to say, I'll be keeping an eye [and an ear] on CKDH. Given that they play music [Lite Rock], and have great sound, stereo would be an extra treat. Phil R. From dfr68819@wanadoo.fr Mon Dec 30 09:21:55 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dfr68819@wanadoo.fr X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 30 Dec 2002 17:21:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 94409 invoked from network); 30 Dec 2002 17:21:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Dec 2002 17:21:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Dec 2002 17:21:52 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.130] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Dec 2002 17:21:52 -0000 Date: Mon, 30 Dec 2002 17:21:50 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: AM Stereo in France & Spain (was: Re: AM stereo schematic) Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 3674 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Denis " X-Originating-IP: 80.15.216.195 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=117455200 X-Yahoo-Profile: pcvpcn It is necessary to know that had France, no recepteur AM is equipped=20 to receive the stereo. the digital is going to allow to receive=20 broadcasts in AM st=E9reo with the sound CD. Denis --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "m1ctk "=20 wrote: > Intersted in your reply Kevin ? >=20 > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "m1ctk "=20 > wrote: > > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T.=20 "=20 > > wrote: > > > > What's "numerique?" > > >=20 > > > I believe it is the French way to say "digital". Perhaps Denis=20 > > means=20 > > > that this AM station is transmitting using the DRM (Digital=20 Radio=20 > > > Mondial) system, which is Europe's alternative to IBOC. > > >=20 > > > Do we still have any members from the UK or Ireland here?=20 > >=20 > > Only me! I feel quite out numbered here amounst a mainly US group > >=20 > > They=20 > > > usually get DX reception of "France Bleu" on 864 kHz from Paris=20 > > > (300,000 watts non-directional!) and perhaps could tell us=20 > whether=20 > > or=20 > > > not it is still broadcasting in AM Stereo.=20=20 > >=20 > > Yes for sure > >=20 > > (Note that for a while,=20 > > > they were broadcasting AM Stereo without the pilot tone,=20 causing=20 > > all=20 > > > but "forced Stereo" receivers like the Sonys or MetroSound to=20 > > mistake=20 > > > it for a completely mono signal.) > > >=20 > > > As the story goes, the French government only considers/ed the > > > AM Stereo broadcasts on 864 kHz to be a "test", to see if the C- > > Quam=20 > > > system with work out okay within the more crowded European=20 AM/MW=20 > > band.=20 > > > Apparently they were concerned that an AM Stereo signal would=20 > > require=20 > > > a greater bandwidth than a regular mono AM signal, but of=20 course=20 > > that=20 > > > isn't true (at least with properly adjusted transmitting=20 > > equipment),=20 > > > and I doubt they would keep broadcasting it for years if it=20 > didn't=20 > > > meet their standards. > > >=20 > > > Obviously, in terms of the percentage of their overall=20 > > listenership,=20 > > > the AM Stereo on "France Bleu" is little more than a novelty,=20 but=20 > > as=20 > > > long as the equipment is installed and in working condition,=20 > there=20 > > is=20 > > > really no reason why they can't or shouldn't continue to=20 > broadcast=20 > > in=20 > > > AM Stereo. > > >=20 > > > What I am still wondering about is the AM Stereo stations in=20 > > Madrid,=20 > > > Spain. In the early 1990s, there were known to be a few using=20 > the=20 > > > C-Quam system, including "COPE" (a pop music station) with=20 50,000=20 > > > watts on 999 kHz, but I have never been able to find out more=20 > > > information on this. It is quite doubtful that any are still=20 > using=20 > > it=20 > > > today, but I'd at least like to know exactly which stations=20 used=20 > > it,=20 > > > for what time period, and whether these were also just "tests"=20 of=20 > > if=20 > > > they were really serious about AM Stereo broadcasting. > >=20 > > I get COPE coming in on 999 at night though no stereo. I wish I=20 > could=20 > > encourage other countries to try c-quam stereo. Holland would use=20 > the=20 > > system but they don't bother as they think no one has AM stereo=20 > > radio's which is in Eurpoe is 99.8 true. the UK goverment is so=20 > soft=20 > > as you probably hear about many things but totally the oposite=20 when=20 > > it comes to radio matters. If the interent and email had been as=20 > > widely spread as now back in the early 1990's I'm sure the UK=20 would=20 > > have had AM stereo and probably most of Europe though discussion=20 > > forums lie these emails to the RA etc etc > >=20 > > What did you think of the MP3 from Italy ?=20 > >=20 > > Dave From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Dec 30 10:55:46 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 30 Dec 2002 18:55:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 8701 invoked from network); 30 Dec 2002 18:55:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Dec 2002 18:55:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.69) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Dec 2002 18:55:44 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.185] by n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Dec 2002 18:55:43 -0000 Date: Mon, 30 Dec 2002 18:55:42 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Harris/Gates 1 kW transmitter on eBay Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 180 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics It's a Gates BC-1T in the Albany, NY area, "recently taken out of service". Only 800 pounds! Current bid is $640. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1947945047 From philipr@irac.pe.ca Mon Dec 30 12:35:06 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 30 Dec 2002 20:35:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 72048 invoked from network); 30 Dec 2002 20:35:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Dec 2002 20:35:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Dec 2002 20:35:05 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.184] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Dec 2002 20:35:04 -0000 Date: Mon, 30 Dec 2002 20:35:01 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Harris/Gates 1 kW transmitter on eBay Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 947 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking I've always like Gates gear, especially the Levil Devil and the old Gatesway Consoles - I think mine is an old Gatesway 80 - 8 channel, mono,tube, loads of inputs. That BC-1T would sure look nice in my basesment! But, unless my wife was like Imelda Marcos, there wouldn't be enough "shoes for radios" points to cover this baby. So, I'll leave it for the New York/New Jersey folks with lots of space. As for my wife, her idea of a nice looking transmitter is the Alfredo Lite, which is not only a great little 10 mw performer, but it looks pretty nifty too! And, even with a set of 6 duracells, it doesn't weigh much more than a pair of shoes! Phil R. --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: > It's a Gates BC-1T in the Albany, NY area, "recently taken out of service". Only 800 pounds! Current bid is $640. > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1947945047 From philipr@irac.pe.ca Mon Dec 30 13:15:26 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 30 Dec 2002 21:15:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 81807 invoked from network); 30 Dec 2002 21:15:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Dec 2002 21:15:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.90) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Dec 2002 21:15:25 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.158] by n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Dec 2002 21:15:23 -0000 Date: Mon, 30 Dec 2002 21:15:23 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: AM Stereo Babies! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <1041127936.3e0e5a005b320@webmail.vcn.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 3488 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking Congrats MJR! Just imagine taking your son on his first transmitter=20 site tour! At age 3, I was backcueing records - goes to show what=20 happens when you spend hours in MCR and Production with your Dad,=20 watching him cue up those big old Gates transcription turntables [16=20 inch platters], cuing up old Magnicorders etc. I've got one of=20 those old tube Magnicorders in my basement - still works great -=20 circa 1955! One of the first toys I can remember as a kid was a=20 little toy reel to reel made by my Dad for me - A block of wood, two=20 5 inch reels - that's how I learned to thread a reel to reel at a=20 tender age. While my Dad was an announcer/manager, not a Chief=20 Engineer, I was just about born in a radio station, and it shows.=20=20 helping to deliver Christmas turkeys from the station's 1970 Dodge=20 van, setting up parade floats pulled by the stations muscle wagons=20 in the mid and late 70s - fun!=20 MJR's great news reminds me yet again that I'm going to be one of=20 those [e.g. a Daddy] in mid February - give or take a few weeks.=20=20 First for me and my better half. I've had to work breathing=20 exercises, pre-natal classes, baby's room prep, baby paraphenalia=20 shopping etc. into my electronics, dxing, etc. hobbies. Even so, I=20 managed to build a small stereo tube amp, do a major speaker=20 makeover, pretty up a pair of Heath PT-1s [Thank you eBay!!!] and=20 await a Delco UX-1 [which I'm sure will need a 21 to 12 pin=20 adapter], exercise a bunch of old tube and transistor gear so their=20 capacitors don't kick up, fire up the Alfredo Lite and aLSO THE OLD=20 LPB 6B all while working at a totally non-electronics related job=20 [well, until we redesign the recording/PA system for the main=20 Hearing room, hee hee]. Thoughts for new AM Stereo Dad's [and Mom's, if there are any on the=20 list]:=20 Baby's first words - AM [pronounced ay-em] Bab's second words: CQUAM [pronounced see-quam] Later - AM Stereo First science fair project - crystal radio Second science fair project - AM transmitter As for "IBOC", I'll leave that word for the neighbourhood crows=20 which are always flying arround, screaching - "eye-baulk, eye- baulk..." OK, OK I know, safety first - will rig up an old range hood in the=20 basement to suck out those solder fumes, years of twist connections=20 before first weilding a 15 watt soldering iron under Dad's watchful=20 eye, wash your hands after handling solder, don't burn your hands. Funny thing, those soldering iron burns and the smell of solder=20 didn't hurt me as a kid - or did they???=20=20 Pretty hard to get RF burns off an Alfredo Lite though.=20=20 Phil R. --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, michaelj@v... wrote: > Thanks Jay! > December 11th! It's a boy! Our 2nd (although my first) > We have another that's 20 months old. > Gall bladder sugery was today and we're already home and she's=20 doing great! >=20 > MJR n WYO >=20 > Quoting JNR : >=20 > >=20 > >=20 > >=20 > >=20 > > Congrats on being a pops.=A0 What day did she have > >=20 > > the baby? > >=20 > >=20 > >=20 > > 73, > >=20 > > Jay,N1WVQ > >=20 > >=20 > >=20 > > __________________________________________________ > >=20 > > Do you Yahoo!? > >=20 > > Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. > >=20 > > http://mailplus.yahoo.com > >=20 > >=20 > >=20 > >=20 > >=20 > >=20 > >=20 > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > >=20 > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > >=20 > >=20 > >=20 > >=20 > >=20 > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of=20 Service. > >=20 > >=20 > >=20 > >=20 > > From michaelj@vcn.com Mon Dec 30 15:35:55 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 30 Dec 2002 23:35:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 17183 invoked from network); 30 Dec 2002 23:35:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Dec 2002 23:35:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m1-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Dec 2002 23:35:52 -0000 Received: from michael (unverified [209.193.86.59]) by m1-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Mon, 30 Dec 2002 16:35:52 -0700 To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} AM Stereo Babies! Date: Mon, 30 Dec 2002 16:35:21 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) In-Reply-To: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Importance: Normal From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit LMAO!!! Thanks Phil! Hadn't had a good laugh today! Been too damn tired. At almost 3 weeks old, our little one is still not sleeping at night :( I LOVE the "baby's 1st and 2nd" words lines. That sounds SO much like me! Had my first transistor radio....a SNOOPY radio by the way....back in 1974. I was 5 years old. I kept asking and asking. I wanted a snoopy radio! And I finally got it. Used to listen to our local....KEUN in Eunice, Louisiana. That station happened to be my first gig in radio when I was 16 in 1986. I remember at that point the old Gates tube board......which was mono. I remember them "talking" about going AM STEREO. Never did happen. The boss was too cheap to spend the money. Ah, memories :) Now having just gotten my first very own oscilloscope, I just need to learn how to use this thing. I've always wanted one since digital electronics class in High School. I've seen our engineer use his on several occassions, but haven't had a whole lot of first hand experience. Believe it or not, I got this oscilloscope at a thrift store in Salt Lake City for $20. I figured what the hell....for $20 I'll give it a shot! Plugged it in at the store and could see that it does indeed work. Oh by the way...for you Phil and anyone else who wants to see.....baby pics are at www.cajuncomp.com/ethan . Most of those are from the birth....plus a Xmas pic of our 20 month old. MJR n WYO -----Original Message----- From: Phil Rafuse [mailto:philipr@irac.pe.ca] Sent: Monday, December 30, 2002 2:15 PM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} AM Stereo Babies! Congrats MJR! Just imagine taking your son on his first transmitter site tour! Thoughts for new AM Stereo Dad's [and Mom's, if there are any on the list]: Baby's first words - AM [pronounced ay-em] Bab's second words: CQUAM [pronounced see-quam] Later - AM Stereo First science fair project - crystal radio Second science fair project - AM transmitter As for "IBOC", I'll leave that word for the neighbourhood crows which are always flying arround, screaching - "eye-baulk, eye- baulk..." [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From KC4QLP@aol.com Mon Dec 30 16:37:06 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 31 Dec 2002 00:37:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 82577 invoked from network); 31 Dec 2002 00:37:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Dec 2002 00:37:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r06.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.102) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Dec 2002 00:37:05 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.4d.299c25a7 (4410) for ; Mon, 30 Dec 2002 19:36:56 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <4d.299c25a7.2b4240a8@aol.com> Date: Mon, 30 Dec 2002 19:36:56 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Harris/Gates 1 kW transmitter on eBay To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/30/02 3:35:37 PM Eastern Standard Time, philipr@irac.pe.ca writes: << I've always like Gates gear, especially the Levil Devil and the old Gatesway Consoles - I think mine is an old Gatesway 80 - 8 channel, mono,tube, loads of inputs. That BC-1T would sure look nice in my basesment! >> I've got a friend of mine that has a BC-1T. They are built very simular to the good ol Raytheons..and a great sounding rig on the air too! Someone got the time,money and the means to pick-up and haul this beast...it would make quite the nice basement wamer. Just watch it if you hook up an antenna with ground radials laying on dry grass or 2x4's....you might end up with a yard fire...a really hot situation...lol I heard a nice "little" fire was started this way. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- Subscribe send an email to amstereo-subscribe@topica.com _______________________________________________________ From stodd@sherbtel.net Mon Dec 30 17:06:23 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 31 Dec 2002 01:06:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 54036 invoked from network); 31 Dec 2002 01:06:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Dec 2002 01:06:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Dec 2002 01:06:19 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-232.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.232]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gBV16FQ8012785 for ; Mon, 30 Dec 2002 19:06:17 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <001301c2b068$e5c3d8a0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <21546-3E0F2507-10269@storefull-2112.public.lawson.webtv.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Digest Number 510 Date: Mon, 30 Dec 2002 19:06:46 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude The WECo equivalent of the 833A was the 357A- but it had the grid out the base rather than on top. MANY of their transmitters were later modified for the more plentiful 833. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Possum Hunter" Western Electric tubes are *VERY* expensive, but if they made > a grenade-proof 4-400 or 833, it would be worth the price. From KC4QLP@aol.com Mon Dec 30 17:20:54 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 31 Dec 2002 01:20:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 6540 invoked from network); 31 Dec 2002 01:20:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Dec 2002 01:20:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m08.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.163) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Dec 2002 01:20:53 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.188.1373db6b (4410) for ; Mon, 30 Dec 2002 20:20:46 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <188.1373db6b.2b424aee@aol.com> Date: Mon, 30 Dec 2002 20:20:46 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM Stereo Babies! To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 12/30/02 6:38:30 PM Eastern Standard Time, michaelj@vcn.com writes: << Had my first transistor radio....a SNOOPY radio by the way....back in 1974. I was 5 years old. I kept asking and asking. I wanted a snoopy radio! And I finally got it. Used to listen to our local....KEUN in Eunice, Louisiana. That station happened to be my first gig in radio when I was 16 in 1986. I remember at that point the old Gates tube board......which was mono. I remember them "talking" about going AM STEREO. >> Oh me!..I had one of those radios too growing up. Always listened to WGAI...where I am sitting today! Years later got into DXing..it wasnt much of a DX radio...but atleast it allowed me to listen to the greats of WABC,WCBS,WHO and many other while getting ready for school. That radio served me well...wish it had never fallen into the sink while tending to dish washing duties. Yes me and radio was inseparatable then just as it is now.When I first started hanging around the station here...WGAI also had an ol Gates board with them hugh round knobs,turntables set up on either side of the board..and the ol Raytheon was just sitting doing nothing as the McMartin was the main transmitter then.{seems like they always had some sort of issues with that thing too} Yep..back in the days when no station in my city was on 24hrs. WGAI was on the air daily from 530 am til 12 midnight...the other AM across town{WCNC 1240} was 6am til 1am 6 days a week...7am til 10pm Sundays..the the FM's were 6am til 1am. Now all of us except for the university station are on 24hrs ..and a new 50kw FM coming just after the start of the new year will to be 24hrs......gee how times change. Congrats on the new born Michael!..may your enrollment to "hair club for men" be really cheap....lol You'll need it after many more months of little sleep. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- Subscribe send an email to amstereo-subscribe@topica.com _______________________________________________________ From stodd@sherbtel.net Mon Dec 30 17:21:33 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 31 Dec 2002 01:21:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 41577 invoked from network); 31 Dec 2002 01:21:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Dec 2002 01:21:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Dec 2002 01:21:32 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-232.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.232]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gBV1LTQ8016383 for ; Mon, 30 Dec 2002 19:21:31 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <004401c2b06b$06a103c0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <4d.299c25a7.2b4240a8@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Harris/Gates 1 kW transmitter on eBay Date: Mon, 30 Dec 2002 19:22:00 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Just don't try to modulate them more than 100% or you'll zorch the mod components. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: > I've got a friend of mine that has a BC-1T. They are built very simular to > the good ol Raytheons..and a great sounding rig on the air too! From e92fmjamz@yahoo.com Mon Dec 30 18:16:38 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: e92fmjamz@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 31 Dec 2002 02:16:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 52178 invoked from network); 31 Dec 2002 02:16:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Dec 2002 02:16:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14004.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.175.120) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Dec 2002 02:16:38 -0000 Message-ID: <20021231021638.71750.qmail@web14004.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [208.6.34.117] by web14004.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 30 Dec 2002 18:16:38 PST Date: Mon, 30 Dec 2002 18:16:38 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM Stereo Babies! To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: <188.1373db6b.2b424aee@aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: Ernest Jones X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=24963319 X-Yahoo-Profile: e92fmjamz welp, my dad used to work at WRCS/WQDK from 80-88. my mom got pregnant with me and well..she & him spent a lot of days & nights there at that station..I was kindof born with a radio in my mouth...haaa...board op here I come..my first radio was a GE SR II. I don't know what happened to that radio..but it was my first. I also had a knack at the time to take apart and examine electronics...and not putting them back together.. I now work at WRCS whenever I'm home from school, and for inquiring minds..Im majoring in Electronics & Computer Technology. http://members.tripod.com/e92fm/wrcswqdk.html --- KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 12/30/02 6:38:30 PM Eastern > Standard Time, > michaelj@vcn.com writes: > > << Had my first transistor radio....a SNOOPY radio > by the way....back in 1974. > I was 5 years old. I kept asking and asking. I > wanted a snoopy radio! And > I finally got it. Used to listen to our > local....KEUN in Eunice, Louisiana. > That station happened to be my first gig in radio > when I was 16 in 1986. I > remember at that point the old Gates tube > board......which was mono. I > remember them "talking" about going AM STEREO. >> > > Oh me!..I had one of those radios too growing up. > Always listened to > WGAI...where I am sitting today! Years later got > into DXing..it wasnt much of > a DX radio...but atleast it allowed me to listen to > the greats of > WABC,WCBS,WHO and many other while getting ready for > school. That radio > served me well...wish it had never fallen into the > sink while tending to dish > washing duties. Yes me and radio was inseparatable > then just as it is > now.When I first started hanging around the station > here...WGAI also had an > ol Gates board with them hugh round knobs,turntables > set up on either side of > the board..and the ol Raytheon was just sitting > doing nothing as the McMartin > was the main transmitter then.{seems like they > always had some sort of issues > with that thing too} Yep..back in the days when no > station in my city was on > 24hrs. WGAI was on the air daily from 530 am til 12 > midnight...the other AM > across town{WCNC 1240} was 6am til 1am 6 days a > week...7am til 10pm > Sundays..the the FM's were 6am til 1am. Now all of > us except for the > university station are on 24hrs ..and a new 50kw FM > coming just after the > start of the new year will to be 24hrs......gee how > times change. > > Congrats on the new born Michael!..may your > enrollment to "hair club for men" > be really cheap....lol You'll need it after many > more months of little > sleep. > > Bob Carter > Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group > > WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach > 104..., WQDK 99.3 > Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 > > > Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio > stations with engineering > services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. > e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net > Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC > WBXB-FM 100.1 > Edenton NC > WURB-FM 97.7 > Windsor NC > Ray > Communications Radio Network > > AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- > Subscribe send an email to > amstereo-subscribe@topica.com > > _______________________________________________________ > > > > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > ===== Ernest, Gates NC, USA WRCS 970 AM Ahoskie NC, Announcer,webmaster http://wrcs.cjb.net WQDK 99.3 FM Ahoskie NC, Fill in ------contact me-------- AIM: e92fmjamz2000 ICQ: 33155469 Yahoo: e92fmjamz __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Dec 31 00:39:26 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 31 Dec 2002 08:39:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 15321 invoked from network); 31 Dec 2002 08:39:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Dec 2002 08:39:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.68) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Dec 2002 08:39:26 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.131] by n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Dec 2002 08:39:25 -0000 Date: Tue, 31 Dec 2002 08:39:25 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Happy 2003 Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 939 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.81.141 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics I would just like to wish everybody here a happy New Year, especially for the New Zealanders and Australians here who get to enjoy 2003 first! By the way, December 2002 has been by far the most active month yet here in the AM Stereo Forum... in fact, if you all become especially enthusiastic and post 37 more messages today (Dec. 31st), then we will have reached 1000 messages in a single month! But even the current amount is very impressive, and I am glad to see so many new members join in the past few months. I think 2003 will be a big year for AM radio... I think something is definitely going to really start to happen, be it AM Stereo, IBOC, DRM, or anything else. We'll just have to stay alert and hope for the best! Kevin Tekel kevtronics@yahoo.com Sysop of The AM Stereo Forum p.s. Am I the only one who will be calling the year by its correct name, "twenty-oh-three", instead of "two-thousand(-and)-three"? From groucho@skyweb.net Tue Dec 31 02:06:25 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 31 Dec 2002 10:06:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 66529 invoked from network); 31 Dec 2002 10:06:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Dec 2002 10:06:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Dec 2002 10:06:24 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id gBVACPVI038307 for ; Tue, 31 Dec 2002 05:12:26 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3E116B17.8E614181@skyweb.net> Date: Tue, 31 Dec 2002 05:01:59 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Harris/Gates 1 kW transmitter on eBay References: <4d.299c25a7.2b4240a8@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 I would love to get that BC-1T there was one at WTTM's site until 3 weeks ago Joe N3IBX in Washington's crossing ,PA now has it. there are some heavy Bidders on it.. Bet it will go for $1000 Its over $600 now.. wish I could afford it.. its Up In Albany ,NY about a 4 hour drive from here.. Neal P.S. Bob this New data Job I'm On is working 7-10's too many hours For Me because of My Concert schedule.. But Lots of Money to be made.... KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 12/30/02 3:35:37 PM Eastern Standard Time, > philipr@irac.pe.ca writes: > > << I've always like Gates gear, especially the Levil Devil and the old > Gatesway Consoles - I think mine is an old Gatesway 80 - 8 channel, > mono,tube, loads of inputs. > > That BC-1T would sure look nice in my basesment! >> > > I've got a friend of mine that has a BC-1T. They are built very simular to > the good ol Raytheons..and a great sounding rig on the air too! > Someone got the time,money and the means to pick-up and haul this beast...it > would make quite the nice basement wamer. > Just watch it if you hook up an antenna with ground radials laying on dry > grass or 2x4's....you might end up with a yard fire...a really hot > situation...lol > I heard a nice "little" fire was started this way. > > Bob Carter > Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group > > WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 > Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 > > Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering > services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. > e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net > Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC > WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC > WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC > Ray Communications Radio Network > > AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- > Subscribe send an email to amstereo-subscribe@topica.com > _______________________________________________________ > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From amstereoguy@hotmail.com Tue Dec 31 02:15:24 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereoguy@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 31 Dec 2002 10:15:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 52711 invoked from network); 31 Dec 2002 10:15:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Dec 2002 10:15:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (207.68.165.95) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Dec 2002 10:15:23 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 31 Dec 2002 02:15:22 -0800 Received: from 208.228.96.20 by sea2fd.sea2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Tue, 31 Dec 2002 10:15:22 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Happy 2003 Date: Tue, 31 Dec 2002 05:15:22 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 31 Dec 2002 10:15:22.0942 (UTC) FILETIME=[878B55E0:01C2B0B5] From: "Chris Cuff" X-Originating-IP: [208.228.96.20] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37866059 Well, here is my post to contribute to making it to 1000 posts! (of course, if we REALLY run off our fingers, we could have 2003 posts by midnight!.... :-) I look for good things ahead- and an especially good start to WVOL with their new AM Stereo with the classic hits format- Congrats! Chris >From: "Kevin T. " >Reply-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com >> >By the way, December 2002 has been by far the most active month yet >here in the AM Stereo Forum... in fact, if you all become especially >enthusiastic and post 37 more messages today (Dec. 31st), then we >will have reached 1000 messages in a single month! _________________________________________________________________ The new MSN 8: smart spam protection and 3 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail&xAPID=42&PS=47575&PI=7324&DI=7474&SU= http://www.hotmail.msn.com/cgi-bin/getmsg&HL=1216hotmailtaglines_smartspamprotection_3mf From dfr68819@wanadoo.fr Tue Dec 31 02:35:26 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dfr68819@wanadoo.fr X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 31 Dec 2002 10:35:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 45958 invoked from network); 31 Dec 2002 10:35:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Dec 2002 10:35:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Dec 2002 10:35:26 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.154] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Dec 2002 10:35:25 -0000 Date: Tue, 31 Dec 2002 10:35:25 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Parts (was Re: Re: AM stereo schematic) Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1185 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Denis " X-Originating-IP: 80.15.216.241 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=117455200 X-Yahoo-Profile: pcvpcn Si vous recherchez le SSM2120, on le trouve en France. Denis --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Alfredo E. Torrejon" wrote: > > There's an outfit in Taxachusettes that carries a lot of obsolete > > semiconductors. In fact, they even buy the dies and such for a lot of them. > > I get my supplies of IRF-350s for my Gates 5 transmitter from Rochester > > Electronics. Have you tried them for the numbers you're looking for? > > I checked their website, and they do not currently stock the > MC3340 or the SSM2120/SSM2122. However,they do carry the NE592 video > amplifier, though their price of $2.11 is a bit steep. If you need this > IC, Debco Electronics ( http://debcoelectronics.com/ ) has them for $0.39 > each! > Given the difficulty of finding some of the parts required to > build/fix AM Stereo gear, I have an idea: is there some way that a parts > database could be added to the the AM Stereo page? Participators of our > forum would submit information on where different components can be > purchased and their prices. This would keep the information in one place > where all could easily access it. What do you think? > > Alfredo From ben@lennard.net.nz Tue Dec 31 03:52:02 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: ben@lennard.net.nz X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 31 Dec 2002 11:52:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 94222 invoked from network); 31 Dec 2002 11:52:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Dec 2002 11:52:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Dec 2002 11:52:00 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.249] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Dec 2002 11:52:00 -0000 Date: Tue, 31 Dec 2002 11:51:58 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Happy 2003 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1707 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Ben " X-Originating-IP: 203.98.50.150 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=118503946 X-Yahoo-Profile: benlennard What ho!! Pip pip!! It's 2003 over here in NZ!! How is life in 2002?? 45 minutes in to the new year and nothing to report technologially wise... All I can say is that this little Kiwi is P**s** out of his tree, and has very little Export Gold left... :-( I get the feeling that absolutely nothing new is going to happen radio wise in NZ this year - no digital radio (they are playing with E147 in Auckland), and no *official* AMS stations... FMS seems to be the excepted standard here, and I think people would be asking, as regards to E147 - WHY??? Cheers! Ben, resident Kiwi and mad scientist of Crofton Downs. --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: > I would just like to wish everybody here a happy New Year, especially > for the New Zealanders and Australians here who get to enjoy 2003 > first! > > By the way, December 2002 has been by far the most active month yet > here in the AM Stereo Forum... in fact, if you all become especially > enthusiastic and post 37 more messages today (Dec. 31st), then we > will have reached 1000 messages in a single month! But even the > current amount is very impressive, and I am glad to see so many new > members join in the past few months. > > I think 2003 will be a big year for AM radio... I think something is > definitely going to really start to happen, be it AM Stereo, IBOC, > DRM, or anything else. We'll just have to stay alert and hope for > the best! > > Kevin Tekel > kevtronics@y... > Sysop of The AM Stereo Forum > > p.s. Am I the only one who will be calling the year by its correct > name, "twenty-oh-three", instead of "two-thousand(-and)-three"? From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Tue Dec 31 06:02:45 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 31 Dec 2002 14:02:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 24700 invoked from network); 31 Dec 2002 14:02:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Dec 2002 14:02:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web41001.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.93.0) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Dec 2002 14:02:44 -0000 Message-ID: <20021231140244.32180.qmail@web41001.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.32.178] by web41001.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 31 Dec 2002 06:02:44 PST Date: Tue, 31 Dec 2002 06:02:44 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Happy 2003 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio Just a little side note: if you were to take 2002 on a digital readout and read it upside down, it would still say 2002. This will happen again in 2112. By my count, this should be post #968. Only 32 more to go. 73, N1WVQ __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From philipr@irac.pe.ca Tue Dec 31 06:38:18 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 31 Dec 2002 14:38:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 12615 invoked from network); 31 Dec 2002 14:38:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Dec 2002 14:38:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Dec 2002 14:38:17 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.141] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Dec 2002 14:38:17 -0000 Date: Tue, 31 Dec 2002 14:38:16 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: CKDH still tripping the pilot light! Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 480 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking Last night, then again this morning, CKDH was still tripping the pilot light! There appears to be separation as well, especially noticable on their liners, which have a music bed. 1000 watts on a salt marsh, then crossing the salt water Northumberland Strait between Nova Scotia and PEI equals a pretty decent signal! And, with a Delco UX-1 and a Baby expected in the New year, this is one happy camper! [I'm expecting the UX-1 before the baby, thus the order!] Phil R. From philipr@irac.pe.ca Tue Dec 31 06:49:18 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 31 Dec 2002 14:49:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 26856 invoked from network); 31 Dec 2002 14:49:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Dec 2002 14:49:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Dec 2002 14:49:17 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.176] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Dec 2002 14:48:57 -0000 Date: Tue, 31 Dec 2002 14:48:55 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM Stereo Babies! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3652 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking Just imagine how much you can entertain the baby with the oscillioscope! I'm still trying to figure out how to use my little 20 Mhz Kenwood scope I got a couple years ago. Hook a microphone up to it, talk and sing into the mike, very entertaining for kids of all ages, myself included! Of course I've used it for other things too - like hooking it up to a Select-a-tenna, tuning in CHTN, and watching their carrier bounce away. Makes kind of a flashy looking totally non-calibrated field strength meter, when used this way! Checked out the Alfredo Lite's output too. Lots of fun, but no real work as yet. Should be good for checking out the AM Stereo output on the PT-1 though. And, have had fun hooking it up to an audio signal generator - handy for fine tuning speaker ports and the like. I bought a couple books on scopes awhile back - but was dissapointed. One concentrated on all kinds of other gear, spectrum analyzers and other stuff I can't afford. The other book was simple enough, but really didn't provide much in the way of practical applications. Guess the best thing is to learn by doing - starting by poking the probe around the IF stages of a battery operated radio for starters. Phil R. --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Michael J. Richard" wrote: > LMAO!!! > Thanks Phil! Hadn't had a good laugh today! Been too damn tired. At > almost 3 weeks old, our little one is still not sleeping at night : ( > > I LOVE the "baby's 1st and 2nd" words lines. That sounds SO much like me! > Had my first transistor radio....a SNOOPY radio by the way....back in 1974. > I was 5 years old. I kept asking and asking. I wanted a snoopy radio! And > I finally got it. Used to listen to our local....KEUN in Eunice, Louisiana. > That station happened to be my first gig in radio when I was 16 in 1986. I > remember at that point the old Gates tube board......which was mono. I > remember them "talking" about going AM STEREO. Never did happen. The boss > was too cheap to spend the money. > Ah, memories :) > > Now having just gotten my first very own oscilloscope, I just need to learn > how to use this thing. I've always wanted one since digital electronics > class in High School. I've seen our engineer use his on several occassions, > but haven't had a whole lot of first hand experience. Believe it or not, I > got this oscilloscope at a thrift store in Salt Lake City for $20. I > figured what the hell....for $20 I'll give it a shot! Plugged it in at the > store and could see that it does indeed work. > > > Oh by the way...for you Phil and anyone else who wants to see.....baby pics > are at www.cajuncomp.com/ethan . Most of those are from the birth....plus a > Xmas pic of our 20 month old. > > MJR n WYO > > -----Original Message----- > From: Phil Rafuse [mailto:philipr@i...] > Sent: Monday, December 30, 2002 2:15 PM > To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com > Subject: {AMSF} AM Stereo Babies! > > > Congrats MJR! Just imagine taking your son on his first transmitter > site tour! Thoughts for new AM Stereo Dad's [and Mom's, if there are any > on the > list]: > > Baby's first words - AM [pronounced ay-em] > > Bab's second words: CQUAM [pronounced see-quam] > > Later - AM Stereo > > First science fair project - crystal radio > > Second science fair project - AM transmitter > > As for "IBOC", I'll leave that word for the neighbourhood crows > which are always flying arround, screaching - "eye-baulk, eye- > baulk..." > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Dec 31 07:21:25 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 31 Dec 2002 15:21:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 2950 invoked from network); 31 Dec 2002 15:21:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Dec 2002 15:21:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Dec 2002 15:21:23 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.182] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Dec 2002 15:21:22 -0000 Date: Tue, 31 Dec 2002 15:21:22 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Parts (was Re: Re: AM stereo schematic) Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 917 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Si vous recherchez le SSM2120, on le trouve en France. A rough translation of the above: If you seek the SSM2120, one finds it in France. p.s. AltaVista's "Babelfish" is pretty good at translating between languages. You can find it at: http://babelfish.altavista.com Sorry, but I have to say it... if you use it to translate English into Chinese or Japanese, and then back to English again, it ends up sounding just like what you see in an Owner's Manual or instruction pamplet of most products today! For example, here is one of the paragraphs on the main page of this Forum, as translated into Chinese and then back into English: "AM the stereo sound discussion forum is your place discusses the AM stereo sound and all aspects AM with it radio associated. We as well as help the beginner to obtain start in the world AM the stereo sound to listen to be able to answer your technical question." LOL... From bjackson@indyradio.com Tue Dec 31 07:35:37 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 31 Dec 2002 15:35:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 66437 invoked from network); 31 Dec 2002 15:35:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Dec 2002 15:35:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Dec 2002 15:35:36 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.163] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Dec 2002 15:35:36 -0000 Date: Tue, 31 Dec 2002 15:35:34 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Parts (was Re: Re: AM stereo schematic) Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 701 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923 " X-Originating-IP: 64.25.100.51 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: > Sorry, but I have to say it... if you use it to translate English into Chinese or Japanese, and then back to English again, it ends up sounding just like what you see in an > Owner's Manual or instruction pamplet of most products today! > Sounds kind of like the instruction manual to my JVC CD player. The "shuffle" button, according to the manual "will cause the music to be played in an unexpected manner." I guess if I put in REM and it sounds like Barry Manilow, the CD player is working...After all, that *would* be unexpected ;-) -Brad Jackson -Susquehanna, Indianapolis -WGLD/WGRL/WFMS From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Dec 31 07:46:23 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 31 Dec 2002 15:46:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 62933 invoked from network); 31 Dec 2002 15:46:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Dec 2002 15:46:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Dec 2002 15:46:22 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.176] by n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Dec 2002 15:46:21 -0000 Date: Tue, 31 Dec 2002 15:46:21 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: CKDH still tripping the pilot light! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 623 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Last night, then again this morning, CKDH was still tripping > the pilot light! There appears to be separation as well, > especially noticable on their liners, which have a music > bed. Radio can and do "false" into AM Stereo mode from time to time, and may even give stereo-like illusions due to phasing effects, but on a stable signal with no noticeable "fluttering" effect in the background, then it is likely CKDH is actually transmitting in AM Stereo. The other day I picked up 1320 CKEC from New Glasgow, NS fairly strong and clear here in NJ just after local sunset, but alas, no Stereo to be found from them. From philipr@irac.pe.ca Tue Dec 31 08:17:28 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 31 Dec 2002 16:17:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 39016 invoked from network); 31 Dec 2002 16:17:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Dec 2002 16:17:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Dec 2002 16:17:26 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.151] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Dec 2002 16:17:26 -0000 Date: Tue, 31 Dec 2002 16:17:26 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: CKDH still tripping the pilot light! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2282 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking There was a bit of fluttering in the background while listening to CKDH, so it may be falsing. Yes, CKEC has always been mono, which is a shame. They are the strongest non-local AM signal in greater Charlottetown, bar none. 25,000 watts skimming across salt water - its a piece of cake. CKEC is locally owned and operated by The Hector Broadcasting Company - Doug Freeman. Doug also owns a recording studio. CKEC has a folks, friendly sound which is so refreshing these days. They actually have jingles, not just liners. CKEC has a great sound, sweet, smooth with lots of top end - complete with homemade slider boards, [you can easily rest your arm between each slider pot!] designed by their CE. Their transmitter site is not very old, 1986 or 1988 or so, when they went from 5000 to 25000 watts and changed location, new towers etc. as well. Circular pattern by day, tight cardiod directed east by night. Lots of DX from Europe. They have a good website as well. A good community orienteed staion, with varied programming, from rock to country to AC to even a tiny bit of jazz and classical. Likely a Nautel transmitter. Should not be difficult for them to go stereo on the transmitter end - would need new boards etc. though. And with FM sputtering and multipathing in to New Glasgow over the hills from Truro, Antigonish and Charlottetown, AM Stereo would be an inexpensive response. Rumour has it though that CKEC will flip to FM, as every Tom, Dick and Harriett station has done in Canada. Phil R. --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: > > Last night, then again this morning, CKDH was still tripping > > the pilot light! There appears to be separation as well, > > especially noticable on their liners, which have a music > > bed. > > Radio can and do "false" into AM Stereo mode from time to time, and may even give stereo-like illusions due to phasing effects, but on a stable signal with no noticeable "fluttering" effect in the background, then it is likely CKDH is actually transmitting in AM Stereo. > > The other day I picked up 1320 CKEC from New Glasgow, NS fairly strong and clear here in NJ just after local sunset, but alas, no Stereo to be found from them. From philipr@irac.pe.ca Tue Dec 31 08:40:05 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 31 Dec 2002 16:40:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 14631 invoked from network); 31 Dec 2002 16:40:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Dec 2002 16:40:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.87) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Dec 2002 16:40:05 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.135] by n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Dec 2002 16:40:05 -0000 Date: Tue, 31 Dec 2002 16:40:03 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Most improved AM station in Canada award for 2002! Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1818 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking I hereby commence the first annual Most Improved AM Station in Canada award! The winner for 2002 is [drumroll at 125% positive modulation]: 920 CJCH Halifax During 2002, this 25,000 watt radio station, which first went on the air in 1944, changed from an all sports national network format to a locally focused fusion of oldies and adult standards. They still broadcast local sports, e.g. Halifax Mooseheads hockey [Quebec Major Junior Hockey League] and other such stuff. They have a great sound [open, airy - with tasteful compression limiting and good dynamic range], lovely AM Stereo and they sound like a really top notch small town station [this is meant as a compliment!] yet they are in a city of 400,000 people. Their newscast actually sound like a newscast. Just listening to morning man Brian Phillips chatting about local current events with morning news guy [Rick Howe, I believe]reminds one of what radio should be. They haven't resorted to "cute" ??? [you mean barf, don't you Phil] names like Big Dog, Cat Country, The Hawk, The Fox, The X [also known as "the EX" - EX money maker, EX number one in market, EX number one small town station etc.], Magic this that and the other thing etc. They are proud to say their call letters. CHUM Group desrves a lot of credit for letting CJCH work on creating its own niche. CJCH is a fine station, most deserving of this award! Unfortunately, I cannot find an email address to extend my compliments. Their website, alas, is way out of date. Just hope that when I put the UX-1 in my car, I can enjoy listening to them! I hope the good people of HRM [Halifax Regional Municipality] appreciate them! Phil R. P.S. May 2003 see 960 CHNS get off their MBS Radio keister, put in a proper STL, and resume AM Stereo broadcasting! From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Dec 31 09:03:28 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 31 Dec 2002 17:03:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 33809 invoked from network); 31 Dec 2002 17:03:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Dec 2002 17:03:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Dec 2002 17:03:26 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.166] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Dec 2002 17:03:26 -0000 Date: Tue, 31 Dec 2002 17:03:25 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Panasonic AM Stereo signal generator on eBay Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 188 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics C-Quam system, RF output range 200 kHz to 2 MHz, "no manuals or probes, sold as-is". Starting bid is US $125, 4 days left: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3103663323 From dfr68819@wanadoo.fr Tue Dec 31 09:15:22 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dfr68819@wanadoo.fr X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 31 Dec 2002 17:15:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 60714 invoked from network); 31 Dec 2002 17:15:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Dec 2002 17:15:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Dec 2002 17:15:21 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.128] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Dec 2002 17:15:21 -0000 Date: Tue, 31 Dec 2002 17:15:20 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: DEAR AMERICAN FRIEND Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 37 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Denis " X-Originating-IP: 80.15.216.241 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=117455200 X-Yahoo-Profile: pcvpcn I SWISH YOU A HAPPY NEW YEAR. Denis From michaelj@vcn.com Tue Dec 31 09:17:59 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 31 Dec 2002 17:17:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 64244 invoked from network); 31 Dec 2002 17:17:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Dec 2002 17:17:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m1-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Dec 2002 17:17:58 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m1-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Tue, 31 Dec 2002 10:17:58 -0700 Message-ID: <006e01c2b0f0$8bfabc20$0701010a@keva> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} DEAR AMERICAN FRIEND Date: Tue, 31 Dec 2002 10:17:43 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Merci beaucoup Denis! Et vous, la meme chose! (did I say that right?) MJR n snowy WYO ----- Original Message ----- From: Denis To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, December 31, 2002 10:15 AM Subject: {AMSF} DEAR AMERICAN FRIEND I SWISH YOU A HAPPY NEW YEAR. Denis Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ADVERTISEMENT Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Dec 31 10:32:41 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 31 Dec 2002 18:32:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 12833 invoked from network); 31 Dec 2002 18:32:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Dec 2002 18:32:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.88) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Dec 2002 18:32:41 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.165] by n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Dec 2002 18:32:40 -0000 Date: Tue, 31 Dec 2002 18:32:40 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: DEAR AMERICAN FRIEND Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <006e01c2b0f0$8bfabc20$0701010a@keva> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 101 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Et vous, la meme chose! > > (did I say that right?) "And you, the same thing!" -- I guess so! From stodd@sherbtel.net Tue Dec 31 15:48:39 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 31 Dec 2002 23:48:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 11412 invoked from network); 31 Dec 2002 23:48:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Dec 2002 23:48:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Dec 2002 23:48:38 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-131.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.131]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gBVNmMxw011001 for ; Tue, 31 Dec 2002 17:48:23 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <002601c2b127$2fff5a20$827dfea9@home1> To: Subject: OT- Fw: Toob audio amp...... Date: Tue, 31 Dec 2002 17:48:55 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Thought the engineering types and audiophiles would get a kick out of this one. ----- Original Message ----- From: Scott Todd ----- Original Message ----- From: Dave Fortenberry OK, guys, we need this at KFIA. Any chance? ;-) Is that KOOL, or what? 04 / 30 / 98 WAVAC is now offering a $50,000 monoblock amplifier which uses the 833A transmitting tube for output. It also uses a triode-wired KT88 for the driver stage. The highly praised (and soon to be in production again) Western Electric 437A tube is used for the input stage. Running in Class A by using Nobu Shishido's design talents this unit is capable of 100 wpc.! The chassis is milled out of a solid block of aerospace-grade aluminum. This is a capacitor free, directly coupled design for the purest of musical reproduction. If i was a rich man... WAVAC Audio Lab. Yoshiki Industrial Co., Ltd. 1-38 Matugasaki 2-chrome Yonezawa Yamagata 992-0053 Japan voice +81 (238) 26-6800 fax +81 (238) 26-6820 Dave Fortenberry, ARS NA6DF CE Salem Communications, Sacramento www.jammerdave.com www.sacradio.com --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.427 / Virus Database: 240 - Release Date: 12/6/2002 [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From stodd@sherbtel.net Tue Dec 31 15:56:44 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 31 Dec 2002 23:56:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 98515 invoked from network); 31 Dec 2002 23:56:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Dec 2002 23:56:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Dec 2002 23:56:43 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-131.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.131]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id gBVNudxw012818 for ; Tue, 31 Dec 2002 17:56:41 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <003a01c2b128$58928240$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Most improved AM station in Canada award for 2002! Date: Tue, 31 Dec 2002 17:57:13 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude I suppose you could look up their phone number with a net search and call to congratulate them... ST ----- Original Message ----- From: > Unfortunately, I cannot find an email address to extend my > compliments. From stodd@sherbtel.net Tue Dec 31 16:09:11 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 1 Jan 2003 00:09:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 97136 invoked from network); 1 Jan 2003 00:09:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Jan 2003 00:09:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Jan 2003 00:09:08 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-131.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.131]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h01095xw015623 for ; Tue, 31 Dec 2002 18:09:06 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <004e01c2b12a$14e526e0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <002601c2b127$2fff5a20$827dfea9@home1> Subject: Re: {AMSF} OT- Fw: Toob audio amp...... Date: Tue, 31 Dec 2002 18:09:38 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude OOPS- forgot this server doesn't pass pictures, sorry. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Scott Todd" > Thought the engineering types and audiophiles would get a kick out of this one. From stodd@sherbtel.net Tue Dec 31 16:12:34 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 1 Jan 2003 00:12:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 43410 invoked from network); 1 Jan 2003 00:12:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Jan 2003 00:12:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Jan 2003 00:12:34 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-131.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.131]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h010CUxw016305 for ; Tue, 31 Dec 2002 18:12:32 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <005c01c2b12a$8f881c40$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Happy 2003 Date: Tue, 31 Dec 2002 18:13:04 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude This has got to be the year we start producing AMS radios, even on a fairly limited basis. I thought IBOC would be the death-knell for AMS, but looks like it hasn't turned out that way. I probably would have bailed out on the cause by now except the news this past few months has been encouraging. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chris Cuff" > I look for good things ahead- and an especially good start to WVOL with > their new AM Stereo with the classic hits format- > Congrats! > Chris > From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Dec 31 16:21:50 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 1 Jan 2003 00:21:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 30837 invoked from network); 1 Jan 2003 00:21:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Jan 2003 00:21:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Jan 2003 00:21:49 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.182] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Jan 2003 00:21:49 -0000 Date: Wed, 01 Jan 2003 00:21:47 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Most improved AM station in Canada award for 2002! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <003a01c2b128$58928240$827dfea9@home1> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 740 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.77.12 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > I suppose you could look up their phone number with a net search > and call to congratulate them... One web site gives the following e-mail address for CJCH, but I have no idea if it's still valid: 920cjch@newedge.net Meanwhile, I'd say the most improved AM station in the USA, or at least in the Northeast, is WCTC 1450 AM Stereo in New Brunswick, NJ. A few months ago, they did away with most of their syndicated programming and brought back a full line-up of live, local talk shows, even on weekends. Even with a 1000-watt Local channel signal, they have a news/talk format that's better-produced and more engaging to listen to than any of the 50,000-watt NYC stations -- and of course, WCTC broadcasts in full AM Stereo! From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Dec 31 16:27:31 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 1 Jan 2003 00:27:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 82001 invoked from network); 1 Jan 2003 00:27:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Jan 2003 00:27:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.87) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Jan 2003 00:27:31 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.168] by n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Jan 2003 00:27:30 -0000 Date: Wed, 01 Jan 2003 00:27:29 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Almost there... Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 150 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.77.12 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics C'mon folks... only about 14 more messages to go before midnight EST, and the AM Stereo Forum will have reached 1000 messages posted in one month! From groucho@skyweb.net Tue Dec 31 16:32:01 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 1 Jan 2003 00:32:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 56614 invoked from network); 1 Jan 2003 00:32:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Jan 2003 00:32:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Jan 2003 00:31:59 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h010btVI065525 for ; Tue, 31 Dec 2002 19:37:55 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3E1235CB.493E450A@skyweb.net> Date: Tue, 31 Dec 2002 19:26:52 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Almost there... References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Ok Ill post 1 Message "Kevin T. " wrote: > C'mon folks... only about 14 more messages to go before midnight EST, > and the AM Stereo Forum will have reached 1000 messages posted in one > month! > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From groucho@skyweb.net Tue Dec 31 16:32:23 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 1 Jan 2003 00:32:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 60957 invoked from network); 1 Jan 2003 00:32:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Jan 2003 00:32:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Jan 2003 00:32:23 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h010cRVI065644 for ; Tue, 31 Dec 2002 19:38:27 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3E1235EE.C65420B1@skyweb.net> Date: Tue, 31 Dec 2002 19:27:26 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Almost there... References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 maybe I'll make It 2 messages... LOL Happy "Kevin T. " wrote: > C'mon folks... only about 14 more messages to go before midnight EST, > and the AM Stereo Forum will have reached 1000 messages posted in one > month! > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From groucho@skyweb.net Tue Dec 31 16:33:00 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 1 Jan 2003 00:33:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 68651 invoked from network); 1 Jan 2003 00:33:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Jan 2003 00:33:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Jan 2003 00:32:59 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h010d2VI065778 for ; Tue, 31 Dec 2002 19:39:02 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3E123611.E56FCDA@skyweb.net> Date: Tue, 31 Dec 2002 19:28:02 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Almost there... References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Make It 3 Happy New Year.. Neal 11 More to go... "Kevin T. " wrote: > C'mon folks... only about 14 more messages to go before midnight EST, > and the AM Stereo Forum will have reached 1000 messages posted in one > month! > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From fanfare@globility.com Tue Dec 31 16:52:13 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 1 Jan 2003 00:52:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 97738 invoked from network); 1 Jan 2003 00:52:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Jan 2003 00:52:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.90) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Jan 2003 00:52:12 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.168] by n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Jan 2003 00:52:12 -0000 Date: Wed, 01 Jan 2003 00:52:09 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: The best in 2003 Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 42 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Marv Southcott " X-Originating-IP: 64.56.233.194 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy Happy New Year everyone. Marv @ Fanfare From amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk Tue Dec 31 16:56:42 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 1 Jan 2003 00:56:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 53980 invoked from network); 1 Jan 2003 00:56:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Jan 2003 00:56:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Jan 2003 00:56:42 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.167] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Jan 2003 00:56:42 -0000 Date: Wed, 01 Jan 2003 00:56:41 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Another one Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 51 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "m1ctk " X-Originating-IP: 81.7.53.20 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113985069 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereofan Reply to my posts Kevin and you'll add a few more! From narkspud@hotmail.com Tue Dec 31 17:43:54 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: narkspud@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 1 Jan 2003 01:43:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 77668 invoked from network); 1 Jan 2003 01:43:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Jan 2003 01:43:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.64) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Jan 2003 01:43:52 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.143] by n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Jan 2003 01:43:52 -0000 Date: Wed, 01 Jan 2003 01:43:51 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Good News from LA Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 358 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "narkspud " X-Originating-IP: 66.159.192.39 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=81956306 X-Yahoo-Profile: narkspud Here's a VERY happy new year message for the 1000 message campaign. Radio Disney KDIS 710's pilot has moved to 1110, apparently in anticipation of tomorrow's frequency switch with KSPN. It appears we won't be losing Radio Disney as we'd feared. Now if we can just get KLAC to get with the program, it'll be a REALLY, REALLY happy new year. narkspud From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Dec 31 17:44:14 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 1 Jan 2003 01:44:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 96571 invoked from network); 1 Jan 2003 01:44:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Jan 2003 01:44:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.70) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Jan 2003 01:44:14 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.139] by n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Jan 2003 01:44:13 -0000 Date: Wed, 01 Jan 2003 01:44:12 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Another one Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 789 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.77.12 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Reply to my posts Kevin and you'll add a few more! Here's something I think will stir up a discussion... are you going to say 2003 as "twenty-oh-three", "two-thousand-three", or "two-thousand-and-three"? Although "twenty-oh-three" is more correct according to the way we've been saying years in English for centuries, I think most people will call it "two-thousand(-and)-____" up to 2010, which *hopefully* people will finally start saying as "twenty-ten", since it is so much shorter than "two-thousand(-and)-ten". But for those who prefer the long version, using the "-and" is incorrect, because as I remember my 4th grade math teacher telling me, you only say "and" in a number when you mean a decimal point. So, 504 is "five-hundred-four", not "five-hundred-AND-four". From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Dec 31 18:02:28 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 1 Jan 2003 02:02:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 43057 invoked from network); 1 Jan 2003 02:02:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Jan 2003 02:02:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.75) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Jan 2003 02:02:26 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.174] by n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Jan 2003 02:02:26 -0000 Date: Wed, 01 Jan 2003 02:02:26 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Good News from LA Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1318 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.77.12 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Now if we can just get KLAC to get with the program, it'll be a > REALLY, REALLY happy new year. I've talked with 1110 KSPN's engineer, and they supposedly dropped AM Stereo because of concerns about lost coverage area, with their wacky directional signal, which was causing bad platform motion in the nulls, at least on the particular AM Stereo car radio he was using as an on-the-road test receiver. Still, with careful engineering, 1110 can still produce a good AM Stereo signal; I've seen stations with so many nulls that their signal pattern looks like Casper the Friendly Ghost, and they still do fine with AM Stereo. 710 KDIS is 50 kW non-directional during the day, which is as good of an AM signal as you can possible have in North America. Their 10 kW nighttime signal is directional, but is simply beamed out over the Pacific, so listeners in Hawaii can probably hear it better at night than people in Nevada or Arizona. However, right now it is a sad anniversary for NYC area residents, as it now has been four years since the demise of 1560 WQEW as a station playing "American Popular Standards" with 50,000 watts of AM Stereo sound. They dropped the Stereo about a day before Radio Disney took over at the end of December in 1998, so the final moments of WQEW were heard in mono. From jon@kenneke.com Tue Dec 31 18:11:30 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jon@kenneke.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 1 Jan 2003 02:11:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 20696 invoked from network); 1 Jan 2003 02:11:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Jan 2003 02:11:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO kenneke.com) (65.103.64.194) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Jan 2003 02:11:29 -0000 Received: from localhost (jon@localhost) by kenneke.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h012BSo24846 for ; Tue, 31 Dec 2002 18:11:28 -0800 Date: Tue, 31 Dec 2002 18:11:28 -0800 (PST) To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Almost there... In-Reply-To: <3E123611.E56FCDA@skyweb.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: jon X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=77819664 X-Yahoo-Profile: jonkenneke Allrighty, I'll bite, and even with AMSF content: Any good AMS hits this New Year's Eve? And, I've been thinking of making an Alfredo Lite kit (not to step on Chris's Toes), to solve (or help) the supply problem. Thoughts? I don't mind fronting the money for boards and such. They will probably sell for a bit more than Chris charges since I am a "for profit" (or at least break-even) outfit. So, let me know if it's worth my time to sit down with my PCB software and get a bunch of boards made up. Happy AMS New Year Jon On Tue, 31 Dec 2002, Neal Newman wrote: > Make It 3 > Happy New Year.. > Neal > > 11 More to go... > > "Kevin T. " wrote: > > > C'mon folks... only about 14 more messages to go before midnight EST, > > and the AM Stereo Forum will have reached 1000 messages posted in one > > month! > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > -- Jon Kenneke KA7PGB Kenneke Communications http://www.kenneke.com Radio Takena KTK Listen at: http://www.live365.com/stations/kenneke From dav259@csiro.au Tue Dec 31 18:43:51 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 1 Jan 2003 02:43:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 70588 invoked from network); 1 Jan 2003 02:43:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Jan 2003 02:43:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Jan 2003 02:43:49 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h012hmP24683 for ; Wed, 1 Jan 2003 13:43:48 +1100 (EST) Date: Wed, 1 Jan 2003 13:43:48 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Happy 2003 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public On Tue, 31 Dec 2002, Kevin T. wrote: > I would just like to wish everybody here a happy New Year, especially > for the New Zealanders and Australians here who get to enjoy 2003 > first! Thanks Kevin - just saw a bit of our celebrations on the CBS news. > p.s. Am I the only one who will be calling the year by its correct > name, "twenty-oh-three", instead of "two-thousand(-and)-three"? Yes - I hope so. It's definitely "two-thousand AND three" in Oz. We still talk proper here - fair dinkum mate! :) Happy New Year to all! Davo Downunder [ True dinks cobbers! And Ben ... Heppy New Yair! ] From possumhunter@netzero.net Tue Dec 31 19:44:11 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 1 Jan 2003 03:44:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 51386 invoked from network); 1 Jan 2003 03:44:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Jan 2003 03:44:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.20) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Jan 2003 03:44:10 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 31 Dec 2002 19:44:10 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM Stereo in France & Spain (was: Re: AM stereo schematic) Date: Tue, 31 Dec 2002 21:19:54 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 01 Jan 2003 03:44:10.0421 (UTC) FILETIME=[0B3E9E50:01C2B148] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.140.155.86] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 dfr68819@wanadoo.fr wrote: >It is necessary to know that had France, no recepteur AM is equipped to receive the stereo. the digital is going to allow to receive broadcasts in AM stéreo with the sound CD. The US IBOC system of digital AM promises almost CD quality with the HD Radio system, but in fact, the sound quality is worse than a low bit Real Audio feed and destroys the reception of analog radios. How bad does the European Digital broadcasting system interfere with analog radios? Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Tue Dec 31 19:46:35 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 1 Jan 2003 03:46:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 41348 invoked from network); 1 Jan 2003 03:46:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Jan 2003 03:46:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.80) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Jan 2003 03:46:34 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 31 Dec 2002 19:46:33 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Another one Date: Tue, 31 Dec 2002 22:46:22 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 01 Jan 2003 03:46:33.0979 (UTC) FILETIME=[60CFD4B0:01C2B148] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.140.155.86] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk wrote: > Reply to my posts Kevin and you'll add a few more! OK Here is my reply! Kevin From amfmdx@fastq.com Tue Dec 31 19:52:18 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 1 Jan 2003 03:52:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 48153 invoked from network); 1 Jan 2003 03:52:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Jan 2003 03:52:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Jan 2003 03:52:18 -0000 Received: from fastq (d210-osel-phx.fastq.com [207.173.146.199]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id h013qHP56491 for ; Tue, 31 Dec 2002 20:52:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <008601c2b149$292959e0$c792adcf@com> To: Subject: Happy New Year! Date: Tue, 31 Dec 2002 20:52:08 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla Senors, Prospero y feliz Nuevo Ano! Happy New Year from Arizona! Lets hope we get a renaissance of AM radio and DEATH TO IBOC! Kevin "Its going to get a lot worse before it gets worse" - Lily Tomlin From dav259@csiro.au Tue Dec 31 20:01:07 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 1 Jan 2003 04:01:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 14098 invoked from network); 1 Jan 2003 04:01:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Jan 2003 04:01:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Jan 2003 04:01:06 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h01415P27474 for ; Wed, 1 Jan 2003 15:01:05 +1100 (EST) Date: Wed, 1 Jan 2003 15:01:05 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Happy New Year! In-Reply-To: <008601c2b149$292959e0$c792adcf@com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public On Tue, 31 Dec 2002, Kevin - Mesa, Arizona wrote: > Senors, > > Prospero y feliz Nuevo Ano! > > Happy New Year from Arizona! Lets hope we get a renaissance of AM radio and > DEATH TO IBOC! Praise be to that bro! We sure hope all cats are very well indeed! And dogs as well ... It's 2003 in North America! We've just heard on 3LO from a reporter from the St Johns Telegram in Newfoundland, Canada. The fireworks have gone off and we're in for a good year! Ian (for once 16 hours ahead!) From jeffdeck@aol.com Tue Dec 31 20:39:00 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jeffdeck@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 1 Jan 2003 04:39:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 73172 invoked from network); 1 Jan 2003 04:39:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Jan 2003 04:39:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Jan 2003 04:39:00 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.164] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Jan 2003 04:39:00 -0000 Date: Wed, 01 Jan 2003 04:38:57 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: And then there were four. ... Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2234 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jeffdeck2001 " X-Originating-IP: 152.163.189.99 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=4430287 X-Yahoo-Profile: jeffdeck2001 All, My holiday trip to Detroit, Michigan area last week yielded some disappointing AM stereo news. WLLZ, licensed to Monroe, dropped stereo pilot. Current AM stereo count is four: CFCO, WJR, WEXL and WAAM. WJR will likely drop C-QuAM next year, as ABC is an IBOC proponent. WJR also aired feed from ABC in monaural with stereo pilot on December 25. WCHB and WMGC now use iBiquity's HD Radio (IBOC) in Detroit. My FM receiver now stops on either side of WMGC, as though stations were present. My analog FM seek and scan functions are virtually useless with this new creation. Kevin T: Please update your AM stereo station listing on the de facto web page. KAHI in Auburn, CA will NOT upgrade to C-QuAM. WKVX in Wooster, Ohio dropped C-QuAM two years ago. WBZ will NEVER return full time C-QuAM to air. It is important that this list is updated, as I reference it for my AM stereo product auctions. Two of my items this month went to AM stereo hot beds in the San Francisco and Boston areas. I also sold product to Luca, technician at Italy's Studio X AM stereo C-QuAM station. He needs another exciter and modulation monitor. Luca can be contacted at studio.x@lycos.com Did we reach 1000 list messages for December? It is nice to hear the regular formats return to the local and regional radio stations. I counted at least four Columbus area stations airing holiday music: WEGE, WMNI, WSNY and WQIO. WTVN and WFII played music on Christmas day, but did not change the talk preset on their processors. And it was aired in glorious monaural from these two former C-QuAM stations. I received Carver TX-12 service manual recently, and it appears to be a painless AM stereo conversion. Carver's TX-2 and TX-12 tuners can be easily modified for AM stereo. I am testing Delphi's new indash late model car radios for AM stereo. I tentatively identified one of the front end chips as Philips TEA6880. It has audio input for analog AM stereo, however the stereo indication is sent on an I2C bus to the microprocessor. Delphi's FM stereo/AM and FM stereo/AM/Cassette models do not have stereo indicator. There is also muRatu 450H3 ceramic filter used. Happy new year 2003! 73, Jeff From stodd@sherbtel.net Tue Dec 31 20:49:11 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 1 Jan 2003 04:49:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 38774 invoked from network); 1 Jan 2003 04:49:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Jan 2003 04:49:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Jan 2003 04:49:11 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-177.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.177]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h014n7xw002540 for ; Tue, 31 Dec 2002 22:49:09 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <002801c2b151$3458d720$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Almost there... Date: Tue, 31 Dec 2002 22:49:41 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude I've got an idea you've probably not considered- leave the making of Alfredo Lites to Chris, and you can work on the receiver end, perhaps producing one or more of Chris's circuits? Once these stations are on the air, folks are going to want to be able to hear them in stereo, and not all of them are going to want to fuss with hooking up a car radio in the house. Scott Todd ----- Original Message ----- From: "jon" > And, I've been thinking of making an Alfredo Lite kit (not to step on > Chris's Toes), to solve (or help) the supply problem. Thoughts? From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Dec 31 21:05:20 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 1 Jan 2003 05:05:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 55045 invoked from network); 1 Jan 2003 05:05:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Jan 2003 05:05:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.75) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Jan 2003 05:05:19 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.251] by n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Jan 2003 05:05:19 -0000 Date: Wed, 01 Jan 2003 05:05:17 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: And then there were four. ... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1136 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.73.128 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics Congratulations Jeff on posting our 1000th message for the month of December 2002! > WLLZ, licensed to Monroe, dropped stereo pilot. That is a bit odd, since WLLZ is owned by Crawford, which at least in the past has been a big supporter of AM Stereo at their stations. I also noticed that AM Stereo has not yet returned to 1540 WPTR in Albany, NY. Is Crawford giving up the faith... no pun intended? > WJR will likely drop C-QuAM next year, as ABC is an IBOC proponent. I wouldn't say that specifically; many broadcasting corporations are interested in the idea of IBOC, but they aren't exactly *proponents*, per se. I don't think WJR and many other stations will switch to IBOC at least until IBOC receivers become available -- and even then only if they consider the splattering digital sidebands, reduced audio quality, and loss of analog AM Stereo to be an acceptable compromise. Even iBiquity basically admits that stations who don't like these factors are free to keep using analog AM Stereo -- and I'm sure many, many stations will! Happy 2003, for everybody in the Eastern Standard Time zone and eastward! From stodd@sherbtel.net Tue Dec 31 22:08:08 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 1 Jan 2003 06:08:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 19568 invoked from network); 1 Jan 2003 06:08:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Jan 2003 06:08:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Jan 2003 06:08:07 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-88.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.88]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h01682xw014283 for ; Wed, 1 Jan 2003 00:08:03 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <001d01c2b15c$3a2e0fc0$827dfea9@home1> To: Subject: my submission to the FCC Date: Wed, 1 Jan 2003 00:08:36 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Before the Federal Communications Commission, per the Petition for Reconsideration re RM 99-325, filed by John Wells King on behalf of Glen Clark & Associates, I find it to be very premature at the very least. Their suggestion that IBOC be allowed immediately on the expanded band is a tacit and unwitting admission that this transmission scheme is best suited to a completely new band, and not the standard AM broadcast band since the stations are dispersed to such a degree that it is the only place it can be done. Secondly, it hasn't been proven to work during the day in many cases. I 'll cite two cases locally that it probably won't work at all. KTIS on 900 kHz licensed to Minneapolis/St. Paul and KDHL on 920 in Faribault, MN. Though KDHL beams its signal to the NE, it still has significant strength in much of the twin cities and all the way down to Rochester. Indeed, they have sold commercials to businesses over this wide area. The hybrid IBOC signal will trash the other station's analog signal. Yet another case would be KYCR on 1570, licensed to Golden Valley, MN, and WIXK licensed to New Richmond, WI. There would be significant mutual interference over St. Paul, which is well within coverage of both stations. At night, the 300W KTIS signal would be rendered unuseable should WLS commence IBOC operation. When I worked at KTIS, I usually turned the monitor down on the AM side at night as it was hard to listen to all the interference just in analog mode. Plus IBOC has not been tested using only one sideband. I strongly suspect that it would lack the requisite robustness required of any digital system. I am also unimpressed with the quality of the digital audio stream used in the AM scheme. It is only suitable for talk, and I know that at least 40% of the AM stations in my area still have music as a primary format. There also appears to be a contradiction on page 18 where at the end of the middle paragraph WMC would not be able to transmit the upper sidebands due to interference with 800 kHz New Orleans but would be able to transmit lower sidebands. At the end of the following paragraph it says WMC wouldn't be able to transmit the lower sidebands due to interference with WBBM. Sounds like WMC is out of luck either way. One other thing that has been bothering me is just how many receivers have been tested to see if they would suffer interference from stations transmitting IBOC on second and third adjacent channels. Much has been made of current radios having only 5kHz audio response, but that is a red herring. It isn't the same thing as saying it won't suffer audible interference, and according to WLW's night tests, many people who couldn't hear the primary signal could hear the hash all the way out to both coasts. In light of all this, I ask that the Glen Clark and Associates petition be denied, and furthermore, for IBOC to be scrapped for use in the AM band. Respectfully submitted, Scott Todd 3811 Hwy. 95 NW Cambridge MN 55008 [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From amstereo@optushome.com.au Tue Dec 31 23:47:49 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereo@optushome.com.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 1 Jan 2003 07:47:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 63671 invoked from network); 1 Jan 2003 07:47:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Jan 2003 07:47:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail012.syd.optusnet.com.au) (210.49.20.170) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Jan 2003 07:47:48 -0000 Received: from unit (c17190.ipswc1.qld.optusnet.com.au [210.49.44.50]) by mail012.syd.optusnet.com.au (8.11.1/8.11.1) with SMTP id h017llN09891 for ; Wed, 1 Jan 2003 18:47:47 +1100 Message-ID: <000601c2b16a$12470850$1b02a8c0@unit> To: References: <1041326446.367.28474.m12@yahoogroups.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Digest Number 512 Date: Wed, 1 Jan 2003 17:47:44 +1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1123 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1123 From: "amstereo - matt2" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=105920058 X-Yahoo-Profile: voltar_e happy new years everyone From dfr68819@wanadoo.fr Wed Jan 01 01:27:15 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dfr68819@wanadoo.fr X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 1 Jan 2003 09:27:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 8293 invoked from network); 1 Jan 2003 09:27:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Jan 2003 09:27:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.68) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Jan 2003 09:27:14 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.180] by n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Jan 2003 09:27:14 -0000 Date: Wed, 01 Jan 2003 09:27:12 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} AM Stereo in France & Spain (was: Re: AM stereo schematic) Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 692 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Denis " X-Originating-IP: 213.41.140.239 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=117455200 X-Yahoo-Profile: pcvpcn Regrettably, for the moment, I do not know how to re-lay in this=20 question. Denis --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Possum Hunter"=20 wrote: > dfr68819@w... wrote: > >It is necessary to know that had France, no recepteur AM is=20 equipped to > receive the stereo. the digital is going to allow to receive=20 broadcasts in > AM st=E9reo with the sound CD. >=20 > The US IBOC system of digital AM promises almost CD quality with=20 the HD > Radio system, but in fact, the sound quality is worse than a low=20 bit Real > Audio feed and destroys the reception of analog radios. >=20 > How bad does the European Digital broadcasting system interfere=20 with analog > radios? >=20 > Kevin From narkspud@hotmail.com Wed Jan 01 09:16:57 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: narkspud@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 1 Jan 2003 17:16:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 44492 invoked from network); 1 Jan 2003 17:16:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Jan 2003 17:16:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Jan 2003 17:16:56 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.142] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Jan 2003 17:16:54 -0000 Date: Wed, 01 Jan 2003 17:16:54 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Good News from LA Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 196 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "narkspud " X-Originating-IP: 66.159.192.39 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=81956306 X-Yahoo-Profile: narkspud > I've talked with 1110 KSPN's engineer, and they supposedly dropped > AM Stereo because of concerns about lost coverage area Well it's back now. KDIS is on 1110 with full, glorious AM Stereo. From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Wed Jan 01 12:59:18 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 1 Jan 2003 20:59:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 2910 invoked from network); 1 Jan 2003 20:59:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Jan 2003 20:59:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14203.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.145) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Jan 2003 20:59:17 -0000 Message-ID: <20030101205917.61311.qmail@web14203.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [65.221.47.68] by web14203.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 01 Jan 2003 12:59:17 PST Date: Wed, 1 Jan 2003 12:59:17 -0800 (PST) Subject: LA Stereo AM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio Is there somebody we can sincerely thank for keeping the stereo for RD in LA, and at the same time ask very nicely & gently about stereo on ESPN? wrote: ..."At this time, 710 is mono and is now IDing as KSPN Los Angeles (ESPN Sports),airing that network. 1110 is now broadcasting all Radio Disney programming IN STEREO. IDing as KDIS Pasadena/ Los Angeles."... __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From ccuff@in4web.com Wed Jan 01 15:11:03 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 1 Jan 2003 23:11:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 2293 invoked from network); 1 Jan 2003 23:10:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Jan 2003 23:10:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Jan 2003 23:11:02 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.89]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Wed, 1 Jan 2003 18:06:24 -0500 Message-ID: <001e01c2b1e9$d5258f20$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: <002801c2b151$3458d720$827dfea9@home1> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Almost there... Date: Wed, 1 Jan 2003 18:02:17 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 I agree Scott- As for the "lites", I have these under control. What we need is a contact that can speak Chinese and get some radios made over there. I know I wanted to see USA made radios, or Japanese, but to get mass produced radios to the public is going to HAVE to come from China. I can get a nearly endless supply of decoder IC's (100,000 of the 13028's alone) But asembly is going to have to be in China. Maybe advertising to find someone that is fluent in Chinese is a way to go. It's either that, or it is going to go even faster downhill. Chris ----- Original Message ----- From: Scott Todd To: Sent: Tuesday, December 31, 2002 11:49 PM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Almost there... > I've got an idea you've probably not considered- leave the making of Alfredo > Lites to Chris, and you can work on the receiver end From n0uiheric@aol.com Wed Jan 01 16:10:15 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 2 Jan 2003 00:10:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 7178 invoked from network); 2 Jan 2003 00:10:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Jan 2003 00:10:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m06.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.161) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Jan 2003 00:10:13 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-m06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.198.1329fbfc (16633) for ; Wed, 1 Jan 2003 19:10:06 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <198.1329fbfc.2b44dd5e@aol.com> Date: Wed, 1 Jan 2003 19:10:06 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} my submission to the FCC To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih Scott, I think IBOC should be scrapped for FM, too. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Jan 01 17:53:15 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 2 Jan 2003 01:53:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 43637 invoked from network); 2 Jan 2003 01:53:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Jan 2003 01:53:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Jan 2003 01:53:13 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-238.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.238]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h021rAxw029522 for ; Wed, 1 Jan 2003 19:53:11 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <002901c2b201$cba206a0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <198.1329fbfc.2b44dd5e@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} my submission to the FCC Date: Wed, 1 Jan 2003 19:53:47 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude I agree, but it works just well enough there that I'm not sure we can reverse the trend on that front. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: > Scott, I think IBOC should be scrapped for FM, too. From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Jan 01 17:55:01 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 2 Jan 2003 01:55:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 71096 invoked from network); 2 Jan 2003 01:55:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Jan 2003 01:55:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Jan 2003 01:55:01 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-238.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.238]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h021svxw029884 for ; Wed, 1 Jan 2003 19:54:58 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <003101c2b202$0baa8b00$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <002801c2b151$3458d720$827dfea9@home1> <001e01c2b1e9$d5258f20$0101a8c0@pavilion> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Almost there... Date: Wed, 1 Jan 2003 19:55:34 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude My cousin Tim lives in Taiwan. I'll have to see if I can get a hold of him. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Christopher Cuff" To: Sent: Wednesday, January 01, 2003 5:02 PM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Almost there... > I agree Scott- As for the "lites", I have these under control. What we need > is a contact that can speak Chinese and get some radios made over there. > I know I wanted to see USA made radios, or Japanese, but to get mass > produced radios to the public is going to HAVE to come from China. > I can get a nearly endless supply of decoder IC's (100,000 of the 13028's > alone) > But asembly is going to have to be in China. Maybe advertising to find > someone that is fluent in Chinese is a way to go. > It's either that, or it is going to go even faster downhill. > Chris > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Scott Todd > To: > Sent: Tuesday, December 31, 2002 11:49 PM > Subject: Re: {AMSF} Almost there... > > > > I've got an idea you've probably not considered- leave the making of > Alfredo > > Lites to Chris, and you can work on the receiver end > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Jan 01 18:02:46 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 2 Jan 2003 02:02:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 93503 invoked from network); 2 Jan 2003 02:02:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Jan 2003 02:02:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Jan 2003 02:02:45 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-238.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.238]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h0222fxw001432 for ; Wed, 1 Jan 2003 20:02:43 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <000901c2b203$208924e0$827dfea9@home1> To: Subject: Upper Midwest Broadcasting Date: Wed, 1 Jan 2003 20:03:18 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Looks like a small AM for sale at a firesale price (literally.) Look about 1/3 the way down the page. Anyone interested in moving to Virginia MN? I'm not, but will assist anyone here who does in getting the station back on the air. ST http://www.northpine.com/broadcast/ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From jsgil@hal-pc.org Wed Jan 01 20:17:23 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 2 Jan 2003 04:17:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 75474 invoked from network); 2 Jan 2003 04:17:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Jan 2003 04:17:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.78) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Jan 2003 04:17:22 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.168] by n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Jan 2003 04:17:22 -0000 Date: Thu, 02 Jan 2003 04:17:20 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Almost there... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <001e01c2b1e9$d5258f20$0101a8c0@pavilion> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 855 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.123 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Christopher Cuff" wrote: > I agree Scott- As for the "lites", I have these under control. What we need > is a contact that can speak Chinese and get some radios made over there. > I know I wanted to see USA made radios, or Japanese, but to get mass > produced radios to the public is going to HAVE to come from China. > I can get a nearly endless supply of decoder IC's (100,000 of the 13028's > alone) > But asembly is going to have to be in China. Maybe advertising to find > someone that is fluent in Chinese is a way to go. I'm afraid you're right and I sure hate to increase the already exorbinant trade deficit we have with China. I think even Mexico's labor is much more expensive than China. P.S. Are the endless supply of 13028s for the SMD or are good supplies available for DIPs too. JSG From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Jan 01 21:15:13 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 2 Jan 2003 05:15:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 19457 invoked from network); 2 Jan 2003 05:15:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Jan 2003 05:15:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.193) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Jan 2003 05:15:11 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 1 Jan 2003 21:15:11 -0800 To: References: <000901c2b203$208924e0$827dfea9@home1> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Upper Midwest Broadcasting Date: Thu, 2 Jan 2003 00:14:47 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 02 Jan 2003 05:15:11.0209 (UTC) FILETIME=[EC8A7D90:01C2B21D] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.147.225.196] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Scott Todd wrote: > Looks like a small AM for sale at a firesale price (literally.) WOW! that looks like a place where a good AM could thrive. With only 12 radio signals to compete with you, I don't see how you could lose. It has 3 Talk AMs, and 1 Talk, 2 Oldies, 1 AC, 1 Country, and a couple of non-profits to go against. It looks like a great place for a Nostalgia format AM! Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Jan 01 21:18:23 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 2 Jan 2003 05:18:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 87774 invoked from network); 2 Jan 2003 05:18:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Jan 2003 05:18:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.123) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Jan 2003 05:18:22 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 1 Jan 2003 21:18:22 -0800 To: References: <198.1329fbfc.2b44dd5e@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} my submission to the FCC Date: Thu, 2 Jan 2003 00:18:10 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 02 Jan 2003 05:18:22.0454 (UTC) FILETIME=[5E882960:01C2B21E] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.147.225.196] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 n0uiheric@aol.com wrote: >I think IBOC should be scrapped for FM, too. IBOC signals screaming on the FM dial will be GOOD for us! It will drive even more listeners to the Hi-Fi C-QUAM stations. Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Jan 01 21:28:25 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 2 Jan 2003 05:28:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 18077 invoked from network); 2 Jan 2003 05:28:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Jan 2003 05:28:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.208) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Jan 2003 05:28:24 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 1 Jan 2003 21:28:24 -0800 To: References: <002801c2b151$3458d720$827dfea9@home1> <001e01c2b1e9$d5258f20$0101a8c0@pavilion> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Almost there... Date: Thu, 2 Jan 2003 00:28:08 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 02 Jan 2003 05:28:24.0518 (UTC) FILETIME=[C563D660:01C2B21F] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.147.225.196] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Christopher Cuff wrote: > But asembly is going to have to be in China. Maybe advertising to find someone that is fluent in Chinese is a way to go. The QC in some of the China factories is quite good. If you can, you should try to get the one that produces the Grundig and GE radios. They seem to be very good quality. Kevin From stodd@sherbtel.net Thu Jan 02 17:37:17 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 3 Jan 2003 01:37:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 56566 invoked from network); 3 Jan 2003 01:37:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Jan 2003 01:37:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Jan 2003 01:37:15 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-48.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.48]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h031bCql012030 for ; Thu, 2 Jan 2003 19:37:13 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <003f01c2b2c8$bbf9aa60$827dfea9@home1> To: Subject: OT- Fw: WAVAC Audio Lab. Power Amplifiers Date: Thu, 2 Jan 2003 19:37:50 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Get a load of these high buck audio amps, especially the one at the top! > http://www.wavac-audio.gr.jp/poweramp_e.html From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Jan 02 20:25:34 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 3 Jan 2003 04:25:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 81381 invoked from network); 3 Jan 2003 04:25:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Jan 2003 04:25:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.15) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Jan 2003 04:25:32 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 2 Jan 2003 20:25:32 -0800 To: Subject: WTIR/WTTM Date: Thu, 2 Jan 2003 23:25:14 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 03 Jan 2003 04:25:32.0434 (UTC) FILETIME=[27773F20:01C2B2E0] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.158.71.161] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Is WTIR on the air tonight? WTTM ownes 1680 with a rock solid quieting signal......damn what GREAT audio! Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Jan 02 20:43:59 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 3 Jan 2003 04:43:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 43525 invoked from network); 3 Jan 2003 04:43:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Jan 2003 04:43:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.88) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Jan 2003 04:43:59 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 2 Jan 2003 20:43:59 -0800 To: References: <003f01c2b2c8$bbf9aa60$827dfea9@home1> Subject: Re: {AMSF} OT- Fw: WAVAC Audio Lab. Power Amplifiers Date: Thu, 2 Jan 2003 23:43:46 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 03 Jan 2003 04:43:59.0118 (UTC) FILETIME=[BB19D2E0:01C2B2E2] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.158.71.161] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Scott Todd wrote: > Get a load of these high buck audio amps, especially the one at the top! OK, Now these amps are marketed to the guys who claim they can hear the difference between lot numbers of the same brand and type of speaker wires. I have not seen a 833A that was made worth a sh*t in the past 10 or more years. Where are they getting ultra-high quality audiophile grade 833As? I ask this because I know where there is a lonely BC1G that needs a new home. Kevin From jsgil@hal-pc.org Thu Jan 02 22:10:55 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 3 Jan 2003 06:10:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 44596 invoked from network); 3 Jan 2003 06:10:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Jan 2003 06:10:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Jan 2003 06:10:54 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.148] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Jan 2003 06:10:54 -0000 Date: Fri, 03 Jan 2003 06:10:53 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: WBAP 820 Clip Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1109 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.47 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst I tried to upload an sound clip of WBAP 820 in Stereo to the files section but I never got a response back from Yahoo saying it was a successful upload although my upload meter for my dial-up connection shown that I uploaded something for quite some time. It could also be Netscape flaking out too. The files section looks like it is almost full so that may be the problem. I think Michael J had mentioned that he had an ftp server where we could upload clips also if I'm not mistaken or was it somebody else. I just don't have enough webspace to put sound clips up. If it doesn't show up in the files section soon I will try to upload it again unless there is a another site with more space where I can upload it. Anyway it is a clip of their bumper music for their midnight trucking road show which has good separation. It was recorded at over 250 miles away and there is some atmospheric disturbance but I have the 13020 chip operating in full synchronous QuAM mode which does a good job of eliminating the distortion caused by interference that you normally get with an envelope detector. JSG From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Jan 02 22:30:42 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 3 Jan 2003 06:30:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 43661 invoked from network); 3 Jan 2003 06:30:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Jan 2003 06:30:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Jan 2003 06:30:40 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.174] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Jan 2003 06:30:39 -0000 Date: Fri, 03 Jan 2003 06:30:39 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: WBAP 820 Clip Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1150 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.86.5 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics I shuffled some things around, and there is now about 5 megs of free space in the Files section here. Uploading on a modem will take some time, as the upload speed is still limited to 28.8 kbps or less, even if you have a "56K" modem (only the *download* speed is faster). It helps to have an external modem so you can see the data transfer lights blinking, to confirm that your file is actually being uploaded. The FTP server upon which you can upload AM Stereo related files is: ftp://209.193.86.116 If you're using a stand-alone FTP program (like WS_FTP), omit the "ftp://" part. Use a User ID of "anonymous" and send any text you want as the Password (although for Anonymous FTP you traditionally send your e-mail address as the password, that's not required). The directory structure should be fairly simple to navigate, and you can upload files in any directory you like. Don't bother with the "}" directory, though -- it's just the home for all the non-AM Stereo-related junk that I cleaned out of the other directories -- mostly "warez" and other rubbish that people upload to anonymous FTP servers for their own uses. From jsgil@hal-pc.org Thu Jan 02 23:13:07 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 3 Jan 2003 07:13:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 53526 invoked from network); 3 Jan 2003 07:13:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Jan 2003 07:13:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Jan 2003 07:13:06 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.249] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Jan 2003 07:13:06 -0000 Date: Fri, 03 Jan 2003 07:13:05 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: WBAP 820 Clip Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1318 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.101 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "jsgilst " wrote: > I tried to upload an sound clip of WBAP 820 in Stereo > to the files section but I never got a response back > from Yahoo saying it was a successful upload although > my upload meter for my dial-up connection shown that > I uploaded something for quite some time. It could > also be Netscape flaking out too. The files section > looks like it is almost full so that may be the problem. > I think Michael J had mentioned that he had an ftp server > where we could upload clips also if I'm not mistaken or > was it somebody else. I just don't have enough webspace > to put sound clips up. If it doesn't show up in the files > section soon I will try to upload it again unless there > is a another site with more space where I can upload it. > > Anyway it is a clip of their bumper music for their > midnight trucking road show which has good separation. > It was recorded at over 250 miles away and there is > some atmospheric disturbance but I have the 13020 chip > operating in full synchronous QuAM mode which does a > good job of eliminating the distortion caused by > interference that you normally get with an envelope > detector. > > JSG I posted the clip on the ftp site ftp://209.193.86.116/usa/tx/WBAP-1.mp3 JSG From groucho@skyweb.net Fri Jan 03 02:05:50 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 3 Jan 2003 10:05:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 91879 invoked from network); 3 Jan 2003 10:05:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Jan 2003 10:05:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Jan 2003 10:05:48 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h03ABsA0039697 for ; Fri, 3 Jan 2003 05:11:54 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3E155EF5.F3BFC0F7@skyweb.net> Date: Fri, 03 Jan 2003 04:59:17 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} WTIR/WTTM References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 I just woke up getting ready for the morning trip into NYC... after hearing your report I had to call the Burk and see if I powered down lastnight automatically. YES it did power down the Nice female voice on the Burk told me 12 amps and.998 watts...... thank you For your report Kevin. BTW since I'm Not in the City on saturday I will try and get to the Post office to mail you and Bob some CD's I have Bobs Address. Kevin(possum) please off list send me yours... thanks... Neal Newman CE- WTTM Director of The Newman Acadamy Of Audio Engineering For AM Stereo Engineers Yepper NAA..EASEY Possum Hunter wrote: > Is WTIR on the air tonight? > WTTM ownes 1680 with a rock solid quieting signal......damn what GREAT > audio! > > Kevin > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From dfr68819@wanadoo.fr Fri Jan 03 02:11:30 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dfr68819@wanadoo.fr X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 3 Jan 2003 10:11:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 54030 invoked from network); 3 Jan 2003 10:11:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Jan 2003 10:11:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.70) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Jan 2003 10:11:27 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.172] by n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Jan 2003 10:11:27 -0000 Date: Fri, 03 Jan 2003 10:11:26 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: AM stereo schematic Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1055 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Denis " X-Originating-IP: 213.41.140.239 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=117455200 X-Yahoo-Profile: pcvpcn If you want MC3340 I have 50 piece of that CI. --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Alfredo E. Torrejon" wrote: > > Hello, I am French and my English is very bad, sorry. I look for the > > plan of an AM converter stereo for middles waves. The site: > > www.inetarena.com /~ alfredot/pics/is closed. Another site exists? > > Thank you for your answer. > > Denis > > I regret to say that I've temporarily taken down the electronics > pages, partly due to my current unemployment situation. For now, all > that I have up is my resume. > I will be re-doing the pages soon. However, some of the > schematics won't be coming back because the ICs required have been out of > production for years (such as the Analog Devices SSM2120 and SSM2122 chips > and the Motorola MC3340). I receive quite a few requests from frustrated > people for information on where these chips might be obtained. Sadly, I > have to tell these folks that I, too, have had no success finding > suppliers for these ICs in recent years. > > Alfredo From philipr@irac.pe.ca Fri Jan 03 04:47:43 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 3 Jan 2003 12:47:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 94719 invoked from network); 3 Jan 2003 12:47:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Jan 2003 12:47:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Jan 2003 12:47:42 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.159] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Jan 2003 12:47:42 -0000 Date: Fri, 03 Jan 2003 12:47:40 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: WBAP 820 Clip Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 856 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "jsgilst " wrote in part: > > Anyway it is a clip of their [WBAP] bumper music for their > > midnight trucking road show which has good separation. > > It was recorded at over 250 miles away and there is > > some atmospheric disturbance but I have the 13020 chip > > operating in full synchronous QuAM mode which does a > > good job of eliminating the distortion caused by > > interference that you normally get with an envelope > > detector. > > > > JSG > > > I posted the clip on the ftp site > > ftp://209.193.86.116/usa/tx/WBAP-1.mp3 > > JSG At over 250 miles, this once again demonstrates the robust nature of modern CQUAM AM Stereo. Imagine getting such clear "static free" [to use the 1950's ballyhoo for FM] reception out of even a 100kw Class C FM station! Phil R. From philipr@irac.pe.ca Fri Jan 03 04:58:23 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 3 Jan 2003 12:58:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 5541 invoked from network); 3 Jan 2003 12:58:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Jan 2003 12:58:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.67) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Jan 2003 12:58:23 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.178] by n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Jan 2003 12:58:22 -0000 Date: Fri, 03 Jan 2003 12:58:22 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} OT- Fw: WAVAC Audio Lab. Power Amplifiers Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1178 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking Back in the fall, I built a nice little 8 watt per channel push pull tube amp kit using 4 11BM8 tubes. A tad weak in the bass [very small output transformers], but a very nice sounding amp, especially for $140 US without case. Available through AES, for those who are interested - a one night kit which is the total opposite of soldering SM components! Used with high efficency, slightly 'low bass heavy' speakers built by yours truly, this little amp packs a good wallop. Phil R. [who still uses 16 gauge lamp cord like speaker wire and does not use $30 a piece capacitors!] --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Possum Hunter" wrote: > Scott Todd wrote: > > Get a load of these high buck audio amps, especially the one at the top! > > OK, Now these amps are marketed to the guys who claim they can hear the > difference between lot numbers of the same brand and type of speaker wires. > I have not seen a 833A that was made worth a sh*t in the past 10 or more > years. Where are they getting ultra-high quality audiophile grade 833As? > I ask this because I know where there is a lonely BC1G that needs a new > home. > > Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Fri Jan 03 05:33:25 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 3 Jan 2003 13:33:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 37391 invoked from network); 3 Jan 2003 13:33:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Jan 2003 13:33:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.206) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Jan 2003 13:33:24 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 3 Jan 2003 05:33:24 -0800 To: References: <3E155EF5.F3BFC0F7@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} WTIR/WTTM Date: Fri, 3 Jan 2003 08:33:07 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 03 Jan 2003 13:33:24.0415 (UTC) FILETIME=[B0B17CF0:01C2B32C] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.149.22.147] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Neal Newman wrote: > YES it did power down the Nice female voice on the Burk told me 12 amps and.998 watts When I power down, Miss Burk tells me 0.74 amps and 25 watts. Wanna trade? LOL Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Fri Jan 03 06:01:28 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 3 Jan 2003 14:01:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 58044 invoked from network); 3 Jan 2003 14:01:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Jan 2003 14:01:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.115) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Jan 2003 14:01:28 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 3 Jan 2003 06:01:27 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} OT- Fw: WAVAC Audio Lab. Power Amplifiers Date: Fri, 3 Jan 2003 09:01:14 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 03 Jan 2003 14:01:27.0949 (UTC) FILETIME=[9C2863D0:01C2B330] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.149.22.147] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 philipr@irac.pe.ca wrote: > Back in the fall, I built a nice little 8 watt per channel push pull tube amp kit using 4 11BM8 tubes. I thought about getting that kit myself. I have been happy with every other kit I got from AES. They sell some neat toys. For my home stereo, I have 2 Dynaco Stereo 70s bridged Mono driving a pair of Pioneer HPM 60 speakers, and a pair of Dynaco Stereo 70s bridged mono driving a pair or Realistic Mach1 speakers. I just LOVE the sound of those Svetlana EL34s. > >Phil R. [who still uses 16 gauge lamp cord like speaker wire and does not use $30 a piece capacitors!] I use Esoteric Audio 100% Shielded audio wires and Esoteric Audio 12 gauge speaker wires. Kevin From philipr@irac.pe.ca Fri Jan 03 06:51:14 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 3 Jan 2003 14:51:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 18069 invoked from network); 3 Jan 2003 14:51:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Jan 2003 14:51:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Jan 2003 14:51:12 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.136] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Jan 2003 14:51:12 -0000 Date: Fri, 03 Jan 2003 14:51:12 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} very OT- Fw: WAVAC Audio Lab. Power Amplifiers Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 4545 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking I think you would like the 8 watt per side amp kit, although it wouldn't have near the guts of the Dynaco. It sounds a lot better once its been burned in for 3 to 4 hours. It smells nice, glows nice, and you can warm your hands above it. The piece of wood the kit comes with was a little small for my liking, I didn't want it so crowded - the power transformer gets quite hot, and so do those tubes! - so I cut a piece of oak plywood, and used some oak veneer edging for the edge, to avoid the plywood look, yet give a bit bigger chassis. Many people would probably build the thing on a metal chassis, with a metal cage. The company who makes them, S-5, I think in Arizona, now make a nice little case for them - I'll probably get one one day, as it really matches the PT-1 well and would keep the future toddler from burning him/herself. The amp kit is driven by my PT-1 Heath tuner - sounds nice, although FM sounds a tad muddy compared to wideband AM! Next project with that setup is to make an adjustable padder so that the AM Stereo output on the PT- 1 will work with one of Chris's decoders. The tube amp sounds pretty good even on a cheap 5 CD changer made by TEAC, which I bought as a refurbished item from Futureshop for $90 CDN. Ah yes, the Mach 1! One of my brothers has a pair of them, bought them new many years ago. First he had the non-ferro fluid ones, then sold them to buy the ferro fluid cooled ones. For a factory built speaker, they are good, in the "West Coast" sound tradition. My preference has always been for "west coast sound" myself - I love horn dynamic tweeters. Piezos sound too dry for me though. Dome tweeters are nice for background music and sleeping. Horns bring you right up on stage. Personally, my cup of tea is a 12 or 15 inch woofer, with a 20 to 30 pound magnet structure, a 3 to 4 inch voicecoil, some killer mini horn tweeters, a crude crossover - just a cap for the tweeters, no coil for the woofer. No midrange, breaking all the rules. Amazing how good the mids are on a 12 or 15 when you have 20 to 30 pounds of magnet! lol The upstairs stereo is 120 watts per side solid state [one of those RS aka Pyramid rack mount power amps, they really sound good when you replace the critical audio electrolytics with mylar caps] a Hitachi preamp [late 70s, early 80s] through 98 db/watt/m speakers - based on a pair of 12" Celestion woofers and a a pair of RS 3 x 7 inch horn tweeter squeezed in 21 x 16 x 12 inch boxes, crossed over with 2.2 uf mylar film caps. Downstairs its the 8 watts per side tube amp through 101 db/w/m speakers - consisting of a pair of generic 15" woofers from circa 1980 tub loaded Traynor Yorkville Sound speakers, [they look a lot like a Cerwin Vega woofer, except they have a stamped frame] along with 2 per speaker of the little RS 3.5 inch dynamic horn tweeters, wired in series, and with a 4uf cap. in 35 x 24 x 15 inch boxes. To quote Cerwin- Vegas' old slogan, loud is beautiful, if its clean. Funny thing, my wife never approved of that slogan... so when she's off to choir practice or with an improv group, its 'crank the stereo' time! lol Sony TC-399 reel to reel, Technics CD changer and Kenwood KT-413 round out the inputs for the upstairs stereo. Cassette deck? Yes, but I'm no fan of cassette, and in spite of its servo motor, being gone over by a tech etc., wife still says the speed is off. Wife says the speed is fine on the reel to reel though! Had occassion recently to repair a Hammond M-3 at my in-laws church. A new filter cap and a new Ruby 5U4GC did the trick. Although made in China, the Ruby tube looks good. Hard to beat those Russian tubes, though! Phil R. --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Possum Hunter" wrote: > philipr@i... wrote: > > Back in the fall, I built a nice little 8 watt per channel push pull tube > amp kit using 4 11BM8 tubes. > > I thought about getting that kit myself. I have been happy with every other > kit I got from AES. They sell some neat toys. For my home stereo, I have 2 > Dynaco Stereo 70s bridged Mono driving a pair of Pioneer HPM 60 speakers, > and a pair of Dynaco Stereo 70s bridged mono driving a pair or Realistic > Mach1 speakers. I just LOVE the sound of those Svetlana EL34s. > > > >Phil R. [who still uses 16 gauge lamp cord like speaker wire and does not > use $30 a piece capacitors!] > > I use Esoteric Audio 100% Shielded audio wires and Esoteric Audio 12 gauge > speaker wires. > > Kevin From philipr@irac.pe.ca Fri Jan 03 08:44:22 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 3 Jan 2003 16:44:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 38654 invoked from network); 3 Jan 2003 16:44:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Jan 2003 16:44:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Jan 2003 16:44:21 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.175] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Jan 2003 16:44:16 -0000 Date: Fri, 03 Jan 2003 16:44:16 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Tivoli Audio henry Kloss Model One Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 551 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking Having read various rave reviews online on the above radio, has anyone on this list tried it? The sound on FM is reported as very good, and good sensitivity as well. How is the AM performance? Top end? Sensitivity, selectivity? Any chance that the AM Mono, FM Stereo Model Two could be converted to AM Stereo? I'm wondering if Tivoli Audi would be interested in an AM Stereo / FM Stereo version? I see as well that custom radios are available, with corporate names - presumably call letters if you don't mind paying the bucks. Phil R. From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Fri Jan 03 11:41:43 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 3 Jan 2003 19:41:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 48581 invoked from network); 3 Jan 2003 19:41:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Jan 2003 19:41:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web41003.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.93.2) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Jan 2003 19:41:42 -0000 Message-ID: <20030103194142.44774.qmail@web41003.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.32.178] by web41003.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 03 Jan 2003 11:41:42 PST Date: Fri, 3 Jan 2003 11:41:42 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: {AMSF} Tivoli Audio henry Kloss Model One To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio It's not a bad rig. I like mine. I have the Model 1. Jay __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From ccuff@in4web.com Fri Jan 03 12:20:59 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 3 Jan 2003 20:20:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 8095 invoked from network); 3 Jan 2003 20:20:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Jan 2003 20:20:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Jan 2003 20:20:58 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.131]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Fri, 3 Jan 2003 15:16:23 -0500 Message-ID: <002301c2b364$6802a320$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Tivoli Audio henry Kloss Model One Date: Fri, 3 Jan 2003 15:12:13 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 I tried one- FM good. AM bad. The loop is wound and put around the magnet of the speaker inside. It is very poor at picking up, BUT- take out the loop and mount it differently, and it is OK. Now, the worst part- When in AM< the tivoli electronically makes the amp into mono! I had to carve up the circuit to do it. That was that. Chris ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Friday, January 03, 2003 11:44 AM Subject: {AMSF} Tivoli Audio henry Kloss Model One From amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk Fri Jan 03 12:26:28 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 3 Jan 2003 20:26:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 97687 invoked from network); 3 Jan 2003 20:26:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Jan 2003 20:26:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Jan 2003 20:26:28 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.141] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Jan 2003 20:26:28 -0000 Date: Fri, 03 Jan 2003 20:26:26 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: website updated Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 68 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "m1ctk " X-Originating-IP: 213.121.71.238 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113985069 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereofan Nothing special but it's up :- http://www.geocities.com/dave_m1ctk From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Fri Jan 03 15:11:55 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 3 Jan 2003 23:11:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 55757 invoked from network); 3 Jan 2003 23:11:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Jan 2003 23:11:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web41011.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.93.10) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Jan 2003 23:11:54 -0000 Message-ID: <20030103231153.43677.qmail@web41011.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.32.178] by web41011.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 03 Jan 2003 15:11:53 PST Date: Fri, 3 Jan 2003 15:11:53 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: {AMSF} Tivoli Audio henry Kloss Model One To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: <002301c2b364$6802a320$0101a8c0@pavilion> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio Unfortunately, Chris is right: the A.M. section IS crap. It's a good F.M. receiver and you can crank up the volume to full blast without it distorting. Maybe it was talked about before, but has anyone used the DX-402 (clone of the Sangean 909. I think it's the 909.). Mono, except for F.M. w/ headphones, but the receiver smokes! I live within 2 miles of a 5kW on 1110. I can pick up a 5kW on 1090 that's in stereo and 50+ miles away. I will check out the shielding tomorrow at WPRI-TV/12's master control. TONS of R.F. there! Chris, when you said the switch to A.M. put the Tivoli to mono. WAS that the Model 2? Model 3 comes out soon. 73, Jay,N1WVQ __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From ccuff@in4web.com Fri Jan 03 15:20:52 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 3 Jan 2003 23:20:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 32806 invoked from network); 3 Jan 2003 23:20:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Jan 2003 23:20:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Jan 2003 23:20:51 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.52]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Fri, 3 Jan 2003 18:16:16 -0500 Message-ID: <004701c2b37d$88cb3d60$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: <20030103231153.43677.qmail@web41011.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Tivoli Audio henry Kloss Model One Date: Fri, 3 Jan 2003 18:12:05 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 erk.... brainfart.... I was thinking of the model 88 Kloss nightmare regarding the stereo switching. Of course the Tivoli 1 is mono. The info is the same about the model 1- what I said before about the AM and the antenna position. The 88 put the antenna in the front of the cabinet, and hotglued the wires. It is a piece of Chinese junk. At leat the Tivoli's use the Philips chipset. I gotta get a model 2 and play wit it soon... CC ----- Original Message ----- From: JNR To: Sent: Friday, January 03, 2003 6:11 PM From JH_Radio@GameBox.net Fri Jan 03 15:31:32 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: JH_Radio@GameBox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 3 Jan 2003 23:31:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 52782 invoked from network); 3 Jan 2003 23:31:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Jan 2003 23:31:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO snickers.hotpop.com) (204.57.55.49) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Jan 2003 23:31:31 -0000 Received: from gamebox.net (kubrick.hotpop.com [204.57.55.16]) by snickers.hotpop.com (Postfix) with SMTP id CD5A4712C3 for ; Fri, 3 Jan 2003 23:30:52 +0000 (UTC) Received: from -enduser.GameBox.net (pcp03184855pcs.benslm01.pa.comcast.net [68.80.77.117]) by smtp-2.hotpop.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 70AF11B8A24 for ; Fri, 3 Jan 2003 23:08:56 +0000 (UTC) Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030103180920.00a44480@pop.GameBox.net> X-Sender: JH_Radio@pop.GameBox.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Fri, 03 Jan 2003 18:10:39 -0500 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: AM Stereo tuners/receivers Mime-Version: 1.0 X-HotPOP: ----------------------------------------------- Sent By HotPOP.com FREE Email Get your FREE POP email at www.HotPOP.com ----------------------------------------------- From: John X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113800107 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi. Just wondering what is the best AM Stereo tuner/receiver out there? I'd like the highest frequency response, and also able to DX. Thanks. Love in Christ: John Send me an email Aim: RainAngelsRule Add me to MSN with the address; RainAngelsRule@hotmail.com My website Welcome to Napster4TheBlind "Prayer does not change God; it changes you." - Authur unknown La vida es una buena aventura! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From alfredot@inetarena.com Fri Jan 03 16:00:42 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: alfredot@inetarena.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 4 Jan 2003 00:00:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 22797 invoked from network); 4 Jan 2003 00:00:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Jan 2003 00:00:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.inetarena.com) (206.129.216.13) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Jan 2003 00:00:41 -0000 Received: from hendrie (1Cust105.tnt16.beaverton.or.da.uu.net [67.227.163.105]) by mail.inetarena.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h03NwOL13201; Fri, 3 Jan 2003 15:58:25 -0800 (PST) Date: Fri, 3 Jan 2003 16:00:07 -0800 (PST) X-Sender: alfredo@hendrie.1610am.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Cc: dfr68819@wanadoo.fr Subject: Parts (was Re: Re: AM stereo schematic) In-Reply-To: <1041381181.874.68656.m4@yahoogroups.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: "Alfredo E. Torrejon" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=25132238 X-Yahoo-Profile: alfredotorrejon > Si vous recherchez le SSM2120, on le trouve en France. > Denis What is the name of the French supplier for the SSM2120? I have one compressor board that is stuffed, minus the SSM2120 ICs. Thanks, Alfredo From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Jan 03 20:26:08 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 4 Jan 2003 04:26:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 24983 invoked from network); 4 Jan 2003 04:26:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Jan 2003 04:26:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Jan 2003 04:26:07 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-75.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.75]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h044Q3ql010762 for ; Fri, 3 Jan 2003 22:26:05 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <004b01c2b3a9$7e69c0e0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030103180920.00a44480@pop.GameBox.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM Stereo tuners/receivers Date: Fri, 3 Jan 2003 22:26:44 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Right now all there is comes out of the auto salvage yards if you're talking less than $200. The other extreme is the Fanfare FT100A for around $1600, IIRC. That IS the best!! Otherwise there is nothing you can get at the big audio chain stores and such. The only other source is ebay. If you've got a good old classic stereo, chances are it can be modified with one of Chris Cuff's decoder boards. I did an early 70s Panasonic SC555 and the radio out of my Nissan Pathfinder. I'm also converting a Sansui 5050 for a friend of mine. We are working on getting at least a limited production of AMS radios ourselves, but we're hampered by the fact we're all folks of modest means. Scott Todd ----- Original Message ----- From: "John" > Just wondering what is the best AM Stereo tuner/receiver out there? From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Jan 03 20:32:04 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 4 Jan 2003 04:32:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 46103 invoked from network); 4 Jan 2003 04:32:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Jan 2003 04:32:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Jan 2003 04:32:04 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-75.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.75]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h044W0ql012323 for ; Fri, 3 Jan 2003 22:32:02 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <006401c2b3aa$533e4fc0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} website updated Date: Fri, 3 Jan 2003 22:32:41 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude You're right about it not being much, but I'm still glad it's out there. It's just that many more hits on a search engine, and that much more likely to give our cause the needed visibility. Scott Todd ----- Original Message ----- From: > Nothing special but it's up :- > > http://www.geocities.com/dave_m1ctk > From evergreenterrace@buzzle.com Fri Jan 03 22:14:12 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: evergreenterrace@buzzle.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 4 Jan 2003 06:14:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 20967 invoked from network); 4 Jan 2003 06:14:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Jan 2003 06:14:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.70) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Jan 2003 06:14:11 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.189] by n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 04 Jan 2003 06:14:11 -0000 Date: Sat, 04 Jan 2003 06:14:09 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: WSAI, WPTR Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 333 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgliradio " X-Originating-IP: 151.204.159.167 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=69711087 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgliradio Now that WSAI has switched to an oldies based format, what are the odds of some of our friends here on the board who live near Cincy OH and may have connections to get them to put 1530 in stereo?? Also, is WPTR going back in stereo at night? Seems like their co- channel conflict is over and they're strong again on Long Island. From rwagoner@cox.net Sat Jan 04 00:09:51 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner@cox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 4 Jan 2003 08:09:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 8385 invoked from network); 4 Jan 2003 08:09:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Jan 2003 08:09:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.68) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Jan 2003 08:09:49 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.248] by n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 04 Jan 2003 08:09:49 -0000 Date: Sat, 04 Jan 2003 08:09:45 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Clear CHannel and IBOC Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 681 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Richard Wagoner " X-Originating-IP: 68.4.33.253 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=96123889 X-Yahoo-Profile: richardalanwagoner From Radio World "Newsbytes" Date posted: 2003-01-02 Ibiquity, Clear Channel Come to Licensing Terms Ibiquity Digital Corp. and Clear Channel have inked a licensing agreement that sets the terms for all Clear Channel stations. Terms are confidential but Ibiquity President/CEO Robert Struble tells Radio World it includes a commitment for the initial stations to make the IBOC transition. Look for Ibiquity to shed more light on the Clear Channel deal, plus what other radio groups have planned for IBOC at next week's Consumer Electronics Show. Radio World is going to CES and will provide the latest on HD Radio as well as on XM and Sirius Satellite Radio here on RW Online. From amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk Sat Jan 04 04:17:25 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 4 Jan 2003 12:17:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 59211 invoked from network); 4 Jan 2003 12:17:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Jan 2003 12:17:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Jan 2003 12:17:24 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.151] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 04 Jan 2003 12:17:23 -0000 Date: Sat, 04 Jan 2003 12:17:21 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} website updated Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <006401c2b3aa$533e4fc0$827dfea9@home1> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 626 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "m1ctk " X-Originating-IP: 81.7.61.207 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113985069 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereofan --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Scott Todd" wrote: > You're right about it not being much, Oh right. Easy to be critical mate. Frankly I did'nt have to bother. I think a page or 2 is better than no page. I'm not inteding to compete with amstereoradio.com! but I'm still glad it's out there. You sure about that ?! > It's just that many more hits on a search engine, and that much more likely > to give our cause the needed visibility. > > Scott Todd > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > > > Nothing special but it's up :- > > > > http://www.geocities.com/dave_m1ctk > > From ccuff@in4web.com Sat Jan 04 04:31:31 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 4 Jan 2003 12:31:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 76723 invoked from network); 4 Jan 2003 12:31:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Jan 2003 12:31:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Jan 2003 12:31:31 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.40]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Sat, 4 Jan 2003 07:26:56 -0500 Message-ID: <000c01c2b3eb$fcdca400$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} website updated Date: Sat, 4 Jan 2003 07:22:44 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 I agree- Scott, that was a tad harsh. I would welcome a one page site, anywhere, any time. ANY exposure is most welcome, no matter how small. Chris ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Saturday, January 04, 2003 7:17 AM Subject: Re: {AMSF} website updated > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Scott Todd" wrote: > > You're right about it not being much, > > Oh right. Easy to be critical mate. Frankly I did'nt have to bother. From florida_amstereo@hotmail.com Sat Jan 04 05:36:26 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: florida_amstereo@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 4 Jan 2003 13:36:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 14757 invoked from network); 4 Jan 2003 13:36:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Jan 2003 13:36:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.37.107) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Jan 2003 13:36:24 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 4 Jan 2003 05:35:16 -0800 Received: from 209.240.198.61 by pv2fd.pav2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Sat, 04 Jan 2003 13:35:15 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Cc: amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk Bcc: Subject: Re: {AMSF} website updated Date: Sat, 04 Jan 2003 13:35:15 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 04 Jan 2003 13:35:16.0226 (UTC) FILETIME=[1DC03E20:01C2B3F6] From: "Donn Tillman" X-Originating-IP: [209.240.198.61] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83914824 I should have posted my compliments on your web-site earlier; I know it took a lot of effort and time. I wouldn't take the previous insult personally. Hopefully, some on the list can help, rather than criticize, by sending you tapes or c.d.'s of more am-stereo air checks. Thanks again, I know it's an effort of love on your part. donn, thankful in st pete,florida ----Original Message Follows---- From: "m1ctk " Reply-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} website updated Date: Sat, 04 Jan 2003 12:17:21 -0000 --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Scott Todd" wrote: > You're right about it not being much, ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Oh right. Easy to be critical mate. Frankly I did'nt have to bother. I think a page or 2 is better than no page. I'm not inteding to compete with amstereoradio.com! _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 helps eliminate e-mail viruses. Get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus From amfmdx@fastq.com Sat Jan 04 07:29:17 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 4 Jan 2003 15:29:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 87154 invoked from network); 4 Jan 2003 15:29:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Jan 2003 15:29:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Jan 2003 15:29:16 -0000 Received: from fastq (d143-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.175]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id h04FTFP64916 for ; Sat, 4 Jan 2003 08:29:15 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <02ab01c2b406$014381c0$c0f9bed8@com> To: References: <1041671554.610.25265.m12@yahoogroups.com> Subject: DX402 / DX398 Date: Sat, 4 Jan 2003 08:28:58 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > Maybe it was talked about before, but has anyone > used the DX-402 (clone of the Sangean 909. I > think it's the 909.). The DX-402 is the same as the Sangean 505. Its a good radio. The DX-398 is the clone of the ATS-909. > Mono, except for F.M. w/ > headphones, but the receiver smokes! I live > within 2 miles of a 5kW on 1110. I can pick up a > 5kW on 1090 that's in stereo and 50+ miles away. It will do this but if you get your hands on a DX-398 it blows the 402 away. I absolutely LOVE the DX-398. That is a cheap radio that does it all. I got mine for $149 but if you got it at the $99 price, you got a SMOKIN deal. You don't have to say anything Kevin T. I understand that the sound is too narrow for you, but as a DX radio the 402 is good and the 398 is awesome. Kevin From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Jan 04 11:11:48 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 4 Jan 2003 19:11:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 66401 invoked from network); 4 Jan 2003 19:11:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Jan 2003 19:11:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Jan 2003 19:11:47 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.172] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 04 Jan 2003 19:11:47 -0000 Date: Sat, 04 Jan 2003 19:11:46 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: DX402 / DX398 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <02ab01c2b406$014381c0$c0f9bed8@com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 814 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.84.20 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > You don't have to say anything Kevin T. I understand that the sound > is too narrow for you, but as a DX radio the 402 is good and the > 398 is awesome. All I can say is I had a Radio Shack DX-390 (clone of the Sangean ATS-818, I believe) and the bandwidth on LW/AM/SW -- even in "Wide" mode -- was so narrow, I had to off-tune by 2 or 3 kHz just to get intelligible audio (for example, to listen to 1070 kHz I would tune to 1073 kHz). On the other hand, I have a little $29.99 DX-397 (another Sangean clone) and for a cheap dial-tuning radio, the quality of construction, reception, and audio fidelity are all fantastic. Its AM tuner sounds almost like AMAX quality, and if a Shortwave station is broadcasting hi-fi audio, you will hear it. It also does make a successful conversion to AM Stereo! From stodd@sherbtel.net Sat Jan 04 11:22:13 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 4 Jan 2003 19:22:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 80807 invoked from network); 4 Jan 2003 19:22:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Jan 2003 19:22:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Jan 2003 19:22:12 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-85-140.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.85.140]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h04JM8ql012139 for ; Sat, 4 Jan 2003 13:22:10 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <001b01c2b426$adc94180$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} website updated Date: Sat, 4 Jan 2003 13:22:50 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude I know that, and yes I am very sincere when i say I'm glad it's out there. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: > I think a page or 2 is better than no page. I'm not inteding to > compete with amstereoradio.com! > > but I'm still glad it's out there. > > You sure about that ?! From stodd@sherbtel.net Sat Jan 04 11:27:51 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 4 Jan 2003 19:27:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 26725 invoked from network); 4 Jan 2003 19:27:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Jan 2003 19:27:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Jan 2003 19:27:50 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-85-140.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.85.140]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h04JRlql013276 for ; Sat, 4 Jan 2003 13:27:48 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <003901c2b427$7759e720$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} website updated Date: Sat, 4 Jan 2003 13:28:29 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude BTW- it wasn't meant to be an insult. My apologies to all who read it that way. ST From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Sat Jan 04 14:08:24 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 4 Jan 2003 22:08:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 40587 invoked from network); 4 Jan 2003 22:08:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Jan 2003 22:08:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web41008.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.93.7) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Jan 2003 22:08:21 -0000 Message-ID: <20030104220821.79606.qmail@web41008.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.32.178] by web41008.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 04 Jan 2003 14:08:21 PST Date: Sat, 4 Jan 2003 14:08:21 -0800 (PST) Subject: 710 The Buzz To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: <003901c2b427$7759e720$827dfea9@home1> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio After finally getting to hear the buzz on WOR's signal, I have to admit it is annoying. I heard it at 1705 ET, 2205Z and since sundown here is about 1630 in Rhode Island, I'd guess that WOR has it at night. I'm 170 miles away and the buzz is loud & clear. Sounds like the noise A.M. usually makes when there is no station on it. 73, Jay,N1WVQ __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Sat Jan 04 14:12:50 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 4 Jan 2003 22:12:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 31004 invoked from network); 4 Jan 2003 22:12:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Jan 2003 22:12:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web41015.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.93.14) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Jan 2003 22:12:49 -0000 Message-ID: <20030104221249.65395.qmail@web41015.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.32.178] by web41015.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 04 Jan 2003 14:12:49 PST Date: Sat, 4 Jan 2003 14:12:49 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: DX402 / DX398 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio I'll have to see if the local Rat Shack still has any 398s. Like I said, my 402 was $49.99. 73, Jay,N1WVQ __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From alfredot@inetarena.com Sat Jan 04 18:24:12 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: alfredot@inetarena.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Jan 2003 02:24:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 95949 invoked from network); 5 Jan 2003 02:24:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Jan 2003 02:24:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.inetarena.com) (206.129.216.13) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Jan 2003 02:24:11 -0000 Received: from hendrie (1Cust229.tnt17.beaverton.or.da.uu.net [65.227.179.229]) by mail.inetarena.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h052LsL07150 for ; Sat, 4 Jan 2003 18:21:54 -0800 (PST) Date: Sat, 4 Jan 2003 18:23:39 -0800 (PST) X-Sender: alfredo@hendrie.1610am.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: OT- Fw: WAVAC Audio Lab. Power Amplifiers In-Reply-To: <1041585526.265.47008.m12@yahoogroups.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: "Alfredo E. Torrejon" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=25132238 X-Yahoo-Profile: alfredotorrejon > Get a load of these high buck audio amps, especially the one at the top! > > > http://www.wavac-audio.gr.jp/poweramp_e.html Pardon my ignorance, but what do these audiophiles have against push-pull circuitry? I always thought that with tube amps, push-pull was superior because (1) the DC magnetic field in the output transformer nearly cancels out, thus preventing problems with DC core saturation and (2) even-order distortion is cancelled out. Pardon me if I'm wrong, but aren't these amps beefed up, overpriced versions of the audio stage in my "All American-5" tube radios?!? Alfredo From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Jan 04 18:40:22 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Jan 2003 02:40:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 12646 invoked from network); 5 Jan 2003 02:40:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Jan 2003 02:40:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.90) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Jan 2003 02:40:20 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.152] by n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 05 Jan 2003 02:40:20 -0000 Date: Sun, 05 Jan 2003 02:40:17 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: 710 The Hash Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20030104220821.79606.qmail@web41008.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 989 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.80.130 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > After finally getting to hear the buzz on WOR's signal, I have to > admit it is annoying. I heard it at 1705 ET, 2205Z and since > sundown here is about 1630 in Rhode Island, I'd guess that WOR > has it at night. This month's FCC-official sunrise and sunset times for NYC are 7:15 AM and 5:00 PM, respectively. Thus, except for special testing, 710 WOR is not supposed to transmit IBOC outside of this daytime range. However, if you want to get picky, they *are* violating the daytime-only rule; last time I checked, they drop the IBOC carriers about 30 seconds *after* they give the official top-of-hour tone at 5:00. Speaking of which, I've noticed that WOR is one of the few stations that still has a top-of-hour tone hard-wired into their audio chain. I think 1030 WBZ is still using that awful off-pitch EBS-like tone, but otherwise it's rare to hear a true station-generated hourly tone these days, especially from any less than a 50 kW Class A news/talk station. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Jan 04 19:37:50 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Jan 2003 03:37:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 98733 invoked from network); 5 Jan 2003 03:37:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Jan 2003 03:37:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web12808.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.174.43) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Jan 2003 03:37:48 -0000 Message-ID: <20030105033748.1196.qmail@web12808.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [216.192.80.130] by web12808.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 04 Jan 2003 19:37:48 PST Date: Sat, 4 Jan 2003 19:37:48 -0800 (PST) Subject: Fwd: New AM Stereo in France (?) To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "Kevin T." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics I just got this e-mail... I looked in my old World Radio/TV Handbook (1995 is the newest edition I have!), and Sud Radio on 819 kHz is listed as being 20,000 watts... so I guess European DXers have another AM Stereo station to look out for! > From: "NOSBOD" > To: > Subject: stereo am > Date: Sat, 4 Jan 2003 19:45:51 -0000 > > according to the world dx club France, Sud Radio broadcasts on > 819 kHz using c-quam since 13th may 2002. > > and according to the British dx club Italy radio studio x on > 1584 used 10 kw in stereo also have been testing on 1566 kHz > also in stereo with 400 watts intermittently. > they say they will be testing soon with 50 kw!!! > > STUART DOBSON > > C/O > NOSBOD > > NOSBOD@staffsgrubhoundsuk.freeserve.co.uk __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From possumhunter@netzero.net Sat Jan 04 20:04:19 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Jan 2003 04:04:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 37510 invoked from network); 5 Jan 2003 04:04:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Jan 2003 04:04:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.124) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Jan 2003 04:04:18 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 4 Jan 2003 20:04:18 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: OT- Fw: WAVAC Audio Lab. Power Amplifiers Date: Sat, 4 Jan 2003 23:04:01 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 05 Jan 2003 04:04:18.0665 (UTC) FILETIME=[85110590:01C2B46F] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.133.104.95] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Alfredo E. Torrejon wrote: > Pardon my ignorance, but what do these audiophiles have against push-pull circuitry? All push-pull amp designs introduce notch distortion, and there is no such thing as a perfectly matched, perfectly balanced pair of tubes. > >Pardon me if I'm wrong, but aren't these amps beefed up, overpriced versions of the audio stage in my "All American-5" tube radios?!? Yes, but not a single one of my 5 tube sets have a 833A for an audio amp tube! Kevin From bd6xray@lycos.com Sat Jan 04 20:13:47 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: bd6xray@lycos.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Jan 2003 04:13:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 37918 invoked from network); 5 Jan 2003 04:13:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Jan 2003 04:13:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Jan 2003 04:13:47 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.142] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 05 Jan 2003 04:13:47 -0000 Date: Sun, 05 Jan 2003 04:13:45 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: 710 The Hash Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1165 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bd6xray " X-Originating-IP: 152.163.189.99 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83174981 X-Yahoo-Profile: bd6xray --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: However, if you want to get picky, they *are* violating the > daytime-only rule; last time I checked, they drop the IBOC carriers > about 30 seconds *after* they give the official top-of-hour tone at > 5:00. I seem to recall that many years ago various communications attorneys consulted with their FCC contacts and made the determination that, for pattern/power changes, a window of +/- 30 seconds existed. This was about the same time that they also determined that "peaks of frequent recurrence" meant 10 or less in a one minute period. Several manufacturers have units with a "sliding" one-minute interval, displaying the number of modulation peaks exceeding 100% in that previous one minute interval. This term is applied to FM, + or - peaks, and negative AM peaks. AM positive peaks are absolutely limited to 125%. You should see zero of these exceeding +125% in the last minute. Of course, neither of these were ever codified, so if they were irritated with you, they could make whatever determination they wished on the spot. Al Hajny P.E. From possumhunter@netzero.net Sat Jan 04 20:15:01 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Jan 2003 04:15:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 19393 invoked from network); 5 Jan 2003 04:15:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Jan 2003 04:15:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.18) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Jan 2003 04:15:01 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 4 Jan 2003 20:15:01 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: 710 The Hash Date: Sat, 4 Jan 2003 23:14:47 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 05 Jan 2003 04:15:01.0267 (UTC) FILETIME=[04164E30:01C2B471] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.133.104.95] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 kevtronics@yahoo.com wrote: >However, if you want to get picky, they *are* violating the daytime-only rule; last time I checked, they drop the IBOC carriers about 30 seconds *after* they give the official top-of-hour tone at 5:00. You get + or - 5 minutes to switch to and from night time operation. > > Speaking of which, I've noticed that WOR is one of the few stations that still has a top-of-hour tone hard-wired into their audio chain. Yea, I think it sounds cool. I am trying to talk the boss into letting me put one on WFIS. > > I think 1030 WBZ is still using that awful off-pitch EBS-like tone, True, but they are the number one station in New England, so you can bet they ain't going to change anything. Kevin From evergreenterrace@buzzle.com Sun Jan 05 06:35:25 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: evergreenterrace@buzzle.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Jan 2003 14:35:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 93573 invoked from network); 5 Jan 2003 14:35:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Jan 2003 14:35:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Jan 2003 14:35:24 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.135] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 05 Jan 2003 14:35:24 -0000 Date: Sun, 05 Jan 2003 14:35:21 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: 710 The Hash Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 290 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgliradio " X-Originating-IP: 170.20.11.59 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=69711087 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgliradio --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "bd6xray " wrote: AM positive peaks are absolutely > limited to 125%. You should see zero of these exceeding +125% in the > last minute. I know many AM's that flaunt this rule. It's like going 60 in a 55 MPH zone. From amfmdx@fastq.com Sun Jan 05 09:02:45 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Jan 2003 17:02:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 3629 invoked from network); 5 Jan 2003 17:02:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Jan 2003 17:02:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Jan 2003 17:02:44 -0000 Received: from fastq (d130-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.162]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id h05H2hP83627 for ; Sun, 5 Jan 2003 10:02:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <006101c2b4dc$398de300$a2f9bed8@com> To: Subject: DX-390 Date: Sun, 5 Jan 2003 10:02:25 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla >All I can say is I had a Radio Shack DX-390 (clone of the Sangean >ATS-818, I believe) and the bandwidth on LW/AM/SW -- even in "Wide" >mode -- was so narrow, I had to off-tune by 2 or 3 kHz just to get >intelligible audio (for example, to listen to 1070 kHz I would tune >to 1073 kHz). Kevin, If you say the DX-390 is a POS, I will totally agree. Its USELESS. It is too narrow for you and too insensitive for me. That and the 818 are not worth a dime. >On the other hand, I have a little $29.99 DX-397 (another Sangean >clone) and for a cheap dial-tuning radio, the quality of >construction, reception, and audio fidelity are all fantastic. Its >AM tuner sounds almost like AMAX quality, and if a Shortwave station >is broadcasting hi-fi audio, you will hear it. It also does make a >successful conversion to AM Stereo! Hey, if you like it, then its a good radio. I have an older GE Monitor 10 with a big 6X9 speaker in it and its wide as a barn door and sounds great. I don't use this for DX but it does a great job for casual listening. Kevin "Its going to get a lot worse before it gets worse" - Lily Tomlin From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Sun Jan 05 11:53:45 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Jan 2003 19:53:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 78378 invoked from network); 5 Jan 2003 19:53:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Jan 2003 19:53:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14202.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.144) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Jan 2003 19:53:44 -0000 Message-ID: <20030105195344.5014.qmail@web14202.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.127.54.111] by web14202.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 05 Jan 2003 11:53:44 PST Date: Sun, 5 Jan 2003 11:53:44 -0800 (PST) Subject: WJR Top Of The Hour Tone To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio WJR AM-Stereo 760 (with better than FM quality most of the time) has a very slick "hard-wired" top of the hour "Tone" which resembles a nice bassy dual chime, and it's 'dead nuts' on the TOTH. I sure hope that ABC doesn't screw with the CQuam audio from WJR and dink around with IBOC. I find it interesting that news/talk stations are the first going to IBOC (ie: WLW & WOR). They have absolutely nothing to gain by digital - they're not adding stereo audio, and the digital codecs for voice seem to be worse than they are for music! So why are they fartin' around with IBOC at all? __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From stodd@sherbtel.net Sun Jan 05 13:28:02 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Jan 2003 21:28:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 37862 invoked from network); 5 Jan 2003 21:28:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Jan 2003 21:28:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Jan 2003 21:28:01 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-73.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.73]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h05LRwql001214 for ; Sun, 5 Jan 2003 15:27:59 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <003901c2b501$6d6dc3a0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: OT- Fw: WAVAC Audio Lab. Power Amplifiers Date: Sun, 5 Jan 2003 15:28:42 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude I think it's one of those faddish things. Somebody at some big named audio magazine claimed that single ended circuits are the only ones that can accurately reproduce the human voice and now the audiophools are all going single ended. I'd have to agree with you, however, and I really liked your description of those amps. :) I'll bet those high buck amps all use silver wire in their transformers. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Alfredo E. Torrejon" > Pardon my ignorance, but what do these audiophiles have against > push-pull circuitry? From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sun Jan 05 14:13:26 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Jan 2003 22:13:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 72861 invoked from network); 5 Jan 2003 22:13:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Jan 2003 22:13:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.67) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Jan 2003 22:13:25 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.179] by n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 05 Jan 2003 22:13:25 -0000 Date: Sun, 05 Jan 2003 22:13:24 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: WJR Top Of The Hour Tone Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20030105195344.5014.qmail@web14202.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1103 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.130.31 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John P." wrote: > WJR AM-Stereo 760 (with better than FM quality most of the time) has a very > slick "hard-wired" top of the hour "Tone" which resembles a nice bassy dual > chime, and it's 'dead nuts' on the TOTH. > > I sure hope that ABC doesn't screw with the CQuam audio from WJR and dink > around with IBOC. > I was listening a coule of nights ago to WBAP 820 and had thought they had mentioned that they were owned by Disney(ABC). Can anyone verify this as it might be a syndicated program owned by Disney that I heard. It would be ashamed to see such a high quality C-QuAM broadcast disapear for the use of IBOC. I don't see why a Class A ND station would ever need to use IBOC. For the local market that extends quite a distance the signal is strong enough to provide good listening on a wideband radio. Even in the distant market fair reception is possible with a wideband radio. I am just outside their fringe market and there are some times when reception is very good at night for a medium bandwidth AM Stereo radio. JSG From possumhunter@netzero.net Sun Jan 05 14:29:06 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Jan 2003 22:29:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 32213 invoked from network); 5 Jan 2003 22:29:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Jan 2003 22:29:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.79) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Jan 2003 22:29:05 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 5 Jan 2003 14:29:05 -0800 To: References: Subject: Overmodulation was: Re: 710 The Hash Date: Sun, 5 Jan 2003 17:28:10 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 05 Jan 2003 22:29:05.0690 (UTC) FILETIME=[DB3657A0:01C2B509] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.162.175.126] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 evergreenterrace@buzzle.com wrote: > I know many AM's that flaunt this rule. It's like going 60 in a 55 MPH zone. Clear Channel's Spanish station WGVL 1440 is one of them. I frequently measure them at 140%+ on the positive peaks. They are using a modified BC5H that was custom ordered by WQOK with a super duty power supply and driving it with an Optimod 9000 with the "Disco Modification". Kevin From n0uiheric@aol.com Sun Jan 05 15:18:40 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 5 Jan 2003 23:18:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 35244 invoked from network); 5 Jan 2003 23:18:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Jan 2003 23:18:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r10.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.106) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Jan 2003 23:18:37 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-r10.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.18e.14436caf (4459) for ; Sun, 5 Jan 2003 18:18:34 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <18e.14436caf.2b4a1749@aol.com> Date: Sun, 5 Jan 2003 18:18:33 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: 710 The Hash To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih Why don't they limit modulation to European standards? The European standard of 85% modulation has been proven to reduce or eliminate ACI, from what I know. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From bjackson@indyradio.com Sun Jan 05 16:06:02 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Jan 2003 00:06:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 67763 invoked from network); 6 Jan 2003 00:06:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Jan 2003 00:06:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.84) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Jan 2003 00:06:01 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.171] by n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Jan 2003 00:05:50 -0000 Date: Mon, 06 Jan 2003 00:05:46 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: 710 The Hash Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 800 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923 " X-Originating-IP: 216.132.129.192 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: I've noticed that WOR is one of the few stations > that still has a top-of-hour tone hard-wired into their audio chain. > I think 1030 WBZ is still using that awful off-pitch EBS-like tone, > but otherwise it's rare to hear a true station-generated hourly tone > these days, especially from any less than a 50 kW Class A news/talk > station. Here in Indianapolis, both 1070 WIBC and 1430 WXNT (used to be C-QuAM WMYS) have top of the hour tones in their audio chain...They play no matter what else is on the air. I know that WIBC uses one half of a telephone touch tone from a little home-made box their late engineer made...Don't know about WXNT. -Bradley Jackson -Susquehanna, Indianapolis From bjackson@indyradio.com Sun Jan 05 16:17:07 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Jan 2003 00:17:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 10418 invoked from network); 6 Jan 2003 00:17:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Jan 2003 00:17:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.67) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Jan 2003 00:17:07 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.135] by n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Jan 2003 00:17:05 -0000 Date: Mon, 06 Jan 2003 00:17:05 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: WJR Top Of The Hour Tone Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20030105195344.5014.qmail@web14202.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1013 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923 " X-Originating-IP: 216.132.129.192 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John P." wrote: > WJR AM-Stereo 760 (with better than FM quality most of the time) has a very > slick "hard-wired" top of the hour "Tone" which resembles a nice bassy dual > chime, and it's 'dead nuts' on the TOTH. > That reminded me...Back when 1070 WIBC *was* C-QuAM (now over a year since they killed it), the top of the hour tone was hard right. The left would be silent. > I sure hope that ABC doesn't screw with the CQuam audio from WJR and dink > around with IBOC. I don't know if he is here on the list or not, but about 4 months ago I was talking about IBOC in one of the broadcast newsgroups and got a personal e-mail from one of WJR's engineers. We sent a couple of AM Sereo positive messages back and forth. The feeling I got from him (again about 4 months ago) was that WJR's pilot was safe, and that he was very anti-IBOC. I still have his address...I may try to e-mail him. -Brad Jackson -Susquehanna, Indianapolis From bjackson@indyradio.com Sun Jan 05 16:22:39 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Jan 2003 00:22:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 17221 invoked from network); 6 Jan 2003 00:22:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Jan 2003 00:22:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.70) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Jan 2003 00:22:38 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.144] by n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Jan 2003 00:22:38 -0000 Date: Mon, 06 Jan 2003 00:22:38 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: WJR Top Of The Hour Tone Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 1192 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923 " X-Originating-IP: 216.132.129.192 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "jsgilst "=20 wrote: > I was listening a coule of nights ago to WBAP 820 and had thought=20 > they had mentioned that they were owned by Disney(ABC). Can anyone > verify this as it might be a syndicated program owned by Disney=20 that=20 > I heard. It would be ashamed to see such a high quality C-QuAM > broadcast disapear for the use of IBOC. I don't see why a Class A ND > station would ever need to use IBOC. For the local market that=20 > extends quite a distance the signal is strong enough to provide good > listening on a wideband radio. Even in the distant market fair > reception is possible with a wideband radio. I am just outside their > fringe market and there are some times when reception is very good=20 > at night for a medium bandwidth AM Stereo radio. >=20 > JSG Yes, according to their web site, wbap.com, they are an ABC=20 station...Copyright =A9 2003 ABC Radio Incorporated and First=20 MediaWorks. WBAP has a killer signal at night into Indiana. I get them with no=20 fading, no platform otion, and *with* a steady pilot on all of my=20 radios...even the wideband Carver tx-11a. -Brad Jackson -Susquehanna, Indianapolis From fanfare@globility.com Sun Jan 05 16:23:56 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Jan 2003 00:23:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 69494 invoked from network); 6 Jan 2003 00:23:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Jan 2003 00:23:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Jan 2003 00:23:55 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.143] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Jan 2003 00:23:55 -0000 Date: Mon, 06 Jan 2003 00:23:55 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: OT- Fw: WAVAC Audio Lab. Power Amplifiers Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <003901c2b501$6d6dc3a0$827dfea9@home1> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2677 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Marv Southcott " X-Originating-IP: 64.56.233.152 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Scott Todd" wrote: > I think it's one of those faddish things. Somebody at some big named audio > magazine claimed that single ended circuits are the only ones that can > accurately reproduce the human voice and now the audiophools are all going > single ended. I dunno, Scott, if I didn't know better I'd say you were a tad indisposed to personal preference. IMHO, wire and its intrinsic capabilities is as mystical as the semiconductor and its many commutations and permutations. "OFC" or "oxygen-free copper" wire came about as a means of dealing with the crystalline impurities being left in the copper in the annealing process. The theory being that varying current intensities seeking to dig deeper into the copper to maintain signal current levels were being met with some of this non-conductive material and the sound quality was affected adversely by intermittence of the current. However, the proof is usually more audibly evident in a standard resolution audio system when comparing, let's say, 8ga copper battery cables, which are often made of 'old copper' and finely processed 'cast' copper, from which audio cable conductors are often made. Old copper could compare with "old steel" which, as you may recall could errupt with rust boils a year after the car left the factory. As for silver, it is an even finer conductive material and is not particularly fraught with conductive anomolies. Therefore, instantaneous bursts of current are even less affected. It is a highly reliable and very popular amongst audio purists. However, the popular belief is that silver conductors present a 'brighter' sound (no pun intended). Products, be they performance cars or one-of-a-kind amplifiiers, exhibit high value to their owners which is usually the result of subjective/objective preference, with 'subjective' having the larger share. The majority of the posts in this newsgroup deal with quality of performance and personal preference. Otherwise, why would a number of you maintain veritable museums of AM Stereo receivers. I suspect that, if those in the group could afford more, their preferences would encompass more expensive AM stereo 'toys'. And, it would be my fondest hope that our FTA-100 might reach that status. It is usually by pushing the envelope, which this new amplifier we are speaking of is doing through its whimsical thinking. While manifesting itself in such an esoteric design as described here, later designs may take those tubes in yet another direction, albeit in a less flamboyant presentation. This is my 2 cents worth and I thank you for your kind indulgence. Marv From groucho@skyweb.net Sun Jan 05 18:10:02 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Jan 2003 02:10:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 8336 invoked from network); 6 Jan 2003 02:10:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Jan 2003 02:10:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Jan 2003 02:10:01 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (groucho.skyweb.net [66.6.132.253]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h062G9A0026523 for ; Sun, 5 Jan 2003 21:16:09 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3E18E3DE.E773DF3F@skyweb.net> Date: Sun, 05 Jan 2003 21:03:10 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com" Subject: AWIA radio Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 LOL almost fell off My seat.... Chris that's better than a Signal report seeing the stereo Light ON... Funny I don't see you in my Book for a QSL signal report. I never sent you s QSL certificate From WTTM.... Neal quick where's my inhaler asthma attack I'm laughing so hard.. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Jan 05 18:16:33 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Jan 2003 02:16:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 22081 invoked from network); 6 Jan 2003 02:16:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Jan 2003 02:16:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.84) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Jan 2003 02:16:31 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.190] by n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Jan 2003 02:16:31 -0000 Date: Mon, 06 Jan 2003 02:16:31 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: AWIA radio Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3E18E3DE.E773DF3F@skyweb.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 512 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.76.5 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Chris that's better than a Signal report seeing the stereo Light > ON... Funny I don't see you in my Book for a QSL signal report. Here's what Neal is referring to... Chris's eBay auction for an Aiwa radio with AM Stereo, shown tuned to 1680 WTTM with the Stereo light on: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1949167804 Meanwhile, I see that this "stereo_987" bidder has placed nearly 100 bids for it... was he trying to reach the reserve price in one-dollar increments or something?? From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Jan 05 18:26:45 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Jan 2003 02:26:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 18592 invoked from network); 6 Jan 2003 02:26:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Jan 2003 02:26:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.84) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Jan 2003 02:26:44 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.181] by n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Jan 2003 02:26:44 -0000 Date: Mon, 06 Jan 2003 02:26:42 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Ooh, I'm scared... Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1212 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.76.5 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics After mentioning here that I throught 710 WOR was not following the daytime-only mandate by transmitting IBOC for about 30 seconds after sunset each day (and then being informed of the pattern-change leeway time), I just got a stern e-mail from WOR's engineer basically telling me to knock it off, and that I shouldn't make claims that WOR is "violating FCC rules". WOR's engineers have always been very self-defensive about anything which can be seen as a claim that they are violating any FCC rules... first, about the amount of "splatter" from the IBOC onto adjacent channels... and now this. If WOR is truly operating in full accordance with FCC rules, then it makes you wonder why they get so worked up about even the slightest of comments from a group of "crackpot" (as they have called us) AM Stereo fanatics. Meanwhile, I have discussed with them the "ringing" type of distortion that is constantly present in their audio (even at night with the IBOC off), but they basically told me that they have no intention of getting it fixed, and that they don't even consider it to be a problem. I suppose I'll be getting another e-mail about *this* message, but I say to them... bring it on! From bjackson@indyradio.com Sun Jan 05 18:38:28 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Jan 2003 02:38:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 67692 invoked from network); 6 Jan 2003 02:38:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Jan 2003 02:38:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Jan 2003 02:38:26 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.142] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Jan 2003 02:38:26 -0000 Date: Mon, 06 Jan 2003 02:38:23 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Ooh, I'm scared... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 402 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923 " X-Originating-IP: 216.132.129.192 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: >about the amount of "splatter" from the IBOC onto adjacent > channels... and now this. > Kevin, remember, that's just your consumer radio being overloaded...Never mind that I can get it, too, here in Indianapolis! ;-) I guess that RF really carries! -Brad Jackson -Susquehanna, Indianapolis From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Sun Jan 05 18:45:23 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Jan 2003 02:45:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 57336 invoked from network); 6 Jan 2003 02:45:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Jan 2003 02:45:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf08bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.28) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Jan 2003 02:45:19 -0000 Received: from juan ([68.158.96.197]) by imf08bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.19 201-253-122-122-119-20020516) with SMTP id <20030106024712.SWID25832.imf08bis.bellsouth.net@juan> for ; Sun, 5 Jan 2003 21:47:12 -0500 Message-ID: <000e01c2b52d$a86e1e60$af78fea9@juan> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Ooh, I'm scared... Date: Sun, 5 Jan 2003 21:45:22 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I guess us "crackpots" don't know what we are talking about... A red flag goes up whenever someone is very defensive about what they do to the point they are paranoid...............but then again, we are "crackpots" right ? Sad, but true ----- Original Message ----- From: Kevin T. To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, January 05, 2003 9:26 PM Subject: {AMSF} Ooh, I'm scared... After mentioning here that I throught 710 WOR was not following the daytime-only mandate by transmitting IBOC for about 30 seconds after sunset each day (and then being informed of the pattern-change leeway time), I just got a stern e-mail from WOR's engineer basically telling me to knock it off, and that I shouldn't make claims that WOR is "violating FCC rules". WOR's engineers have always been very self-defensive about anything which can be seen as a claim that they are violating any FCC rules... first, about the amount of "splatter" from the IBOC onto adjacent channels... and now this. If WOR is truly operating in full accordance with FCC rules, then it makes you wonder why they get so worked up about even the slightest of comments from a group of "crackpot" (as they have called us) AM Stereo fanatics. Meanwhile, I have discussed with them the "ringing" type of distortion that is constantly present in their audio (even at night with the IBOC off), but they basically told me that they have no intention of getting it fixed, and that they don't even consider it to be a problem. I suppose I'll be getting another e-mail about *this* message, but I say to them... bring it on! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From n0uiheric@aol.com Sun Jan 05 18:56:37 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Jan 2003 02:56:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 58514 invoked from network); 6 Jan 2003 02:56:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Jan 2003 02:56:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r06.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.102) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Jan 2003 02:56:37 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-r06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.f6.26b9909d (4246) for ; Sun, 5 Jan 2003 21:56:32 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Sun, 5 Jan 2003 21:56:32 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Ooh, I'm scared... To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih Juan, I think it's the IBOC proponents that are the "crackpots". Did they know what they are doing will make 500 million radios obsolete? 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From di316@freenet.carleton.ca Sun Jan 05 20:03:14 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: paulc@ncf.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Jan 2003 04:03:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 67445 invoked from network); 6 Jan 2003 04:03:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Jan 2003 04:03:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO tomts25-srv.bellnexxia.net) (209.226.175.188) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Jan 2003 04:03:13 -0000 Received: from ncf.ca ([64.230.25.81]) by tomts25-srv.bellnexxia.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.19 201-253-122-122-119-20020516) with ESMTP id <20030106040311.CAWA23740.tomts25-srv.bellnexxia.net@ncf.ca>; Sun, 5 Jan 2003 23:03:11 -0500 Message-ID: <3E190019.3BB6C30E@ncf.ca> Date: Sun, 05 Jan 2003 23:03:37 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.79 [en] (Windows NT 5.0; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: DX402 / DX398 References: <1041756931.2722.65768.m12@yahoogroups.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-eGroups-From: Paul Cumming From: Paul Cumming X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=43835445 X-Yahoo-Profile: rahoule104 Kevin T. (kevtronics@yahoo.com) wrote: > All I can say is I had a Radio Shack DX-390 (clone of the Sangean > ATS-818, I believe) and the bandwidth on LW/AM/SW -- even in "Wide" > mode -- was so narrow, I had to off-tune by 2 or 3 kHz just to get > intelligible audio (for example, to listen to 1070 kHz I would tune > to 1073 kHz). I have a Radio Shack DX-398, and I'm afraid I frequently have to do the same thing to get good audio on local AM stations. I listen to 580 CFRA on 583 kHz. I'm considering trying the modification to widen its bandwidth and give it AM stereo. I got my DX-398 about a year ago at a close-out price -- CDN$150 compared to the full price of CDN$400. It was the demo model the store had on display. The only problem was that it was missing the battery cover. I'll have to see if I can order that part. I quite like the fact that it can tune freely all the way up to 29.999 MHz rather than be restricted to several small slices of the shortwave band (the various shortwave bands you see on other SW radios). I especially like its ability to tune the CB radio frequencies. Sometimes, on the weekend, I tune to 27.025 MHz and listen to truckers from the southern U.S.A. on CB channel 6. They mostly have directional antennas pointing north at higher than normal transmitting power. By the way, anyone else with a DX-398 -- tune it to 27.022 MHz. What is that? A birdie or something? It always seems to be picking up a really strong dead-air signal on that frequency. It's not listed as a birdie in the manual. -- Paul ---------------------- Paul Cumming paulc@ncf.ca From possumhunter@netzero.net Sun Jan 05 20:29:41 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Jan 2003 04:29:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 6168 invoked from network); 6 Jan 2003 04:29:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Jan 2003 04:29:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.84) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Jan 2003 04:29:38 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 5 Jan 2003 20:29:38 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Ooh, I'm scared... Date: Sun, 5 Jan 2003 23:29:25 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 06 Jan 2003 04:29:38.0909 (UTC) FILETIME=[399D98D0:01C2B53C] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.146.16.53] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 bjackson@indyradio.com wrote: > Kevin, remember, that's just your consumer radio being overloaded...Never mind that I can get it, too, here in Indianapolis! ;-) I guess that RF really carries! Just like the IBOC carriers overload my radios here in South Carolina 620 miles from the WOR transmitter and 336 miles from the WLW transmitter! Oh yea, I don't have "Typical AM radios". Nobody else has a GE Superadio, Toyota Facotry radio, Delco UX-1, Sony ICF-2010, Sangean ATS-818, Realistic DX-380, Realistic DX-200, Sony SRF-42, Aiwa boombox, or Zenith "WaveRadio" clone. Most certainly NOBODY listens to AM on a 5 tube radio anymore! I want to know the makes and models of the "Typical AM radios" that were used in the IBiquity tests for IBOC QRM. Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Sun Jan 05 20:43:14 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Jan 2003 04:43:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 99577 invoked from network); 6 Jan 2003 04:43:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Jan 2003 04:43:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.89) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Jan 2003 04:43:12 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 5 Jan 2003 20:43:12 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Ooh, I'm scared... Date: Sun, 5 Jan 2003 23:42:58 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 06 Jan 2003 04:43:12.0692 (UTC) FILETIME=[1EAB0740:01C2B53E] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.146.16.53] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 n0uiheric@aol.com wrote: > Juan, I think it's the IBOC proponents that are the "crackpots". Did they know what they are doing will make 500 million radios obsolete? You had better KNOW they know it! The electronics industry is just licking their chops waiting for the chance to replace every single AM and FM radio in the US! Not to mention they get to replace every single TV too! Harris, BE, Nautel, Continental, and Energy Onix is already filling orders to replace every single AM and TV transmitter, along with most FM transmitters in the US, and just drooling over the projected P&L sheets too! CCA died and nobody will save them because their transmitters cannot be made IBOC compatible, and it is too late to do the R&D to build them. (Not to mention CCA transmitters are crap boxes!) There is a helluva lot of money to be made at the expense of consumers and radio station owners. This is the corporate owner's and NPR's chance to kill off the little stations, so they are licking their chops too. Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Sun Jan 05 20:59:42 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Jan 2003 04:59:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 29297 invoked from network); 6 Jan 2003 04:59:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Jan 2003 04:59:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.63) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Jan 2003 04:59:42 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 5 Jan 2003 20:59:42 -0800 To: References: <1041756931.2722.65768.m12@yahoogroups.com> <3E190019.3BB6C30E@ncf.ca> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: DX402 / DX398 Date: Sun, 5 Jan 2003 23:59:28 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 06 Jan 2003 04:59:42.0101 (UTC) FILETIME=[6C66DC50:01C2B540] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.146.16.53] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Gee guys, I happen to LIKE my Sangean ATS-818! I have a home brew tuned RF amp in front of it I built with 2 '01A tubes. I am feeding the amp with a MFJ tuner coming from my Alpha-Delta DX-SWL Sloper. This is a killer set up for Long-Wave DX and Tropical Band DX. Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Sun Jan 05 21:57:20 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Jan 2003 05:57:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 43185 invoked from network); 6 Jan 2003 05:57:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Jan 2003 05:57:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.100) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Jan 2003 05:57:18 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 5 Jan 2003 21:57:18 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Ooh, I'm scared... Date: Mon, 6 Jan 2003 00:56:54 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 06 Jan 2003 05:57:18.0658 (UTC) FILETIME=[78AB9A20:01C2B548] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.146.16.53] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 kevtronics@yahoo.com wrote: >If WOR is truly operating in full accordance with FCC rules, then it makes you wonder why they get so worked up about even the slightest of comments from a group of "crackpot" (as they have called us) AM Stereo fanatics. On that I can't say I blame them. I know it sure would piss me off if somebody accused the station I work for of violating the FCC rules. Although we follow the FCC rules to the very letter, and go beyond, I still don't want an FCC inspection. They just might send one of those "Its my job to find SOMETHING wrong with every station" inspectors and I don't want the hassle. Of course, if the FCC does show up, I would be happy to take them on a radio tour of certain stations with no EAS, unpainted towers, burned out tower lights, not powering down, no NRSC filter, no legal IDs, improper remote transmitter monitoring, not running licensed power, wrong directional pattern, and a Clear Channel station with 140% positive peak modulation. > > Meanwhile, I have discussed with them the "ringing" type of distortion that is constantly present in their audio (even at night with the IBOC off), but they basically told me that they have no intention of getting it fixed, and that they don't even consider it to be a problem. Is it in both transmitters? If it is, it could be a phaser problem that would not be cost effective for them to repair. They don't give a rip about analog audio quality. News-Talk is not a Hi-Fi format anyway. Kevin From evergreenterrace@buzzle.com Sun Jan 05 22:08:54 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: evergreenterrace@buzzle.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Jan 2003 06:08:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 11517 invoked from network); 6 Jan 2003 06:08:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Jan 2003 06:08:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Jan 2003 06:08:54 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.128] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Jan 2003 06:08:53 -0000 Date: Mon, 06 Jan 2003 06:08:49 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Overmodulation was: Re: 710 The Hash Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 744 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgliradio " X-Originating-IP: 151.204.159.171 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=69711087 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgliradio --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Possum Hunter" wrote: > evergreenterrace@b... wrote: > > I know many AM's that flaunt this rule. It's like going 60 in a 55 MPH > zone. > > Clear Channel's Spanish station WGVL 1440 is one of them. I frequently > measure them at 140%+ on the positive peaks. They are using a modified BC5H > that was custom ordered by WQOK with a super duty power supply and driving > it with an Optimod 9000 with the "Disco Modification". > > Kevin The "Disco Modification" on an Optimod 9000 should have been to take it out in the parking lot and have an elephant do the Hustle on it. Terrible box. Loud, yeah, but I can make anything clip and distort for loudness. =Mike Erickson= From possumhunter@netzero.net Sun Jan 05 22:29:45 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Jan 2003 06:29:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 89283 invoked from network); 6 Jan 2003 06:29:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Jan 2003 06:29:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.191) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Jan 2003 06:29:43 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 5 Jan 2003 22:29:43 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Overmodulation was: Re: 710 The Hash Date: Mon, 6 Jan 2003 01:26:39 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 06 Jan 2003 06:29:43.0585 (UTC) FILETIME=[FFEFE910:01C2B54C] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.142.98.70] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 evergreenterrace@buzzle.com wrote: >The "Disco Modification" on an Optimod 9000 should have been to take it out in the parking lot and have an elephant do the Hustle on it. > > Terrible box. Loud, yeah, but I can make anything clip and distort for loudness. It is loud and nasty, but that is how most Spanish stations sound. All the "Disco Modification" did was keep the AGC from pumping as much on bass notes. The 9000 can be made to sound pretty decent, but this station just cranks it up and lets it splatter. Personally, I like the sound of a well tuned Omina, 9100/B or 9200, and even the old DAP 310. My part 15 rig with a DAP 310 driving a BL40 sounds as good, if not better than anything else in this market. Kevin From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Jan 05 23:07:54 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Jan 2003 07:07:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 97957 invoked from network); 6 Jan 2003 07:07:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Jan 2003 07:07:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.70) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Jan 2003 07:07:53 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.170] by n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Jan 2003 07:07:51 -0000 Date: Mon, 06 Jan 2003 07:07:47 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Ooh, I'm scared... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1329 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.93.23 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Is it in both transmitters? If it is, it could be a phaser problem > that would not be cost effective for them to repair. They don't > give a rip about analog audio quality. News-Talk is not a Hi-Fi > format anyway. It's coming from their 5 kHz audio filter, which they now have on full-time. When they were running 6.2 kHz audio, they sounded fine, with no such distortion -- but iBiquity caught them "cheating" and ordered them to drop the analog audio bandwidth back down to 5 kHz, per official IBOC specs. This distortion is even present in WOR's own recording of their modulation monitor, as provided on their web site. Doing a spectrum analysis of this recording, you can actually *see* the distortion: http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/worgrph.gif You see the main analog audio up to 5 kHz, and the primary IBOC carrier from 10 to 15 kHz... but see those zig-zags from 5 to about 8.5 kHz? That is the distortion that is "kicked up" by the modulation, which sounds like a scratchy, sizzling type of noise added to the audio, especially with music. It is also present at night with the IBOC off, so it must be somehow caused by whatever device is generating the 5 kHz "brick wall" audio filter. Again, when they were using a slightly wider 6.2 kHz audio bandwidth, there was no such distortion. From ccuff@in4web.com Mon Jan 06 00:45:52 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Jan 2003 08:45:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 59601 invoked from network); 6 Jan 2003 08:45:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Jan 2003 08:45:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Jan 2003 08:45:50 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.29]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Mon, 6 Jan 2003 03:41:18 -0500 Message-ID: <002201c2b55e$cad1de20$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: AWIA radio Date: Mon, 6 Jan 2003 03:37:04 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 Yup- I think they were being cautious. This person lives in PA, in a "stereo rich" area, and loves am stereo. They bought another radio about 3 months ago, but I cannot remember who they are, name -wise. CC ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Sunday, January 05, 2003 9:16 PM Subject: {AMSF} Re: AWIA radio From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Mon Jan 06 02:55:43 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Jan 2003 10:55:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 38361 invoked from network); 6 Jan 2003 10:55:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Jan 2003 10:55:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf06bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.26) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Jan 2003 10:55:42 -0000 Received: from juan ([68.158.96.197]) by imf06bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.19 201-253-122-122-119-20020516) with SMTP id <20030106105735.LRNL5500.imf06bis.bellsouth.net@juan> for ; Mon, 6 Jan 2003 05:57:35 -0500 Message-ID: <000e01c2b572$29e79fe0$af78fea9@juan> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Ooh, I'm scared... Date: Mon, 6 Jan 2003 05:55:44 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit It's really sad n0uiheric@aol.com wrote: > Juan, I think it's the IBOC proponents that are the "crackpots". Did they know what they are doing will make 500 million radios obsolete? You had better KNOW they know it! The electronics industry is just licking their chops waiting for the chance to replace every single AM and FM radio in the US! Not to mention they get to replace every single TV too! Harris, BE, Nautel, Continental, and Energy Onix is already filling orders to replace every single AM and TV transmitter, along with most FM transmitters in the US, and just drooling over the projected P&L sheets too! CCA died and nobody will save them because their transmitters cannot be made IBOC compatible, and it is too late to do the R&D to build them. (Not to mention CCA transmitters are crap boxes!) There is a helluva lot of money to be made at the expense of consumers and radio station owners. This is the corporate owner's and NPR's chance to kill off the little stations, so they are licking their chops too. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From mark_608@hotmail.com Mon Jan 06 07:06:41 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: mark_608@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Jan 2003 15:06:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 11634 invoked from network); 6 Jan 2003 15:06:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Jan 2003 15:06:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.17.181) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Jan 2003 15:06:41 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 6 Jan 2003 07:03:56 -0800 Received: from 136.1.1.154 by lw11fd.law11.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Mon, 06 Jan 2003 15:03:56 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Upper Midwest Broadcasting Date: Mon, 06 Jan 2003 10:03:56 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 06 Jan 2003 15:03:56.0896 (UTC) FILETIME=[D5F18E00:01C2B594] From: "Mark Sundquist" X-Originating-IP: [136.1.1.154] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=3850332 X-Yahoo-Profile: mark_608 Heh...my mother grew up in Virginia,MN...I remember the calls as being something else on 1400, though whenever we would go back and visit... Mark >From: "Scott Todd" >Reply-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com >To: >Subject: {AMSF} Upper Midwest Broadcasting >Date: Wed, 1 Jan 2003 20:03:18 -0600 > >Looks like a small AM for sale at a firesale price (literally.) Look about >1/3 the way down the page. Anyone interested in moving to Virginia MN? >I'm not, but will assist anyone here who does in getting the station back >on the air. > >ST > > http://www.northpine.com/broadcast/ > >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus From jwelton@nautel.com Mon Jan 06 07:24:42 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jwelton@nautel.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Jan 2003 15:24:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 91467 invoked from network); 6 Jan 2003 15:24:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Jan 2003 15:24:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailserver.nautel.com) (24.222.25.85) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Jan 2003 15:24:40 -0000 Received: FROM jeff-welton BY mailserver.nautel.com ; Mon Jan 06 11:25:04 2003 -0400 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Date: Mon, 06 Jan 2003 11:22:08 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: {AMSF} Ooh, I'm scared... Message-ID: <3E1966D8.32100.7202D0@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.02a) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body From: "Jeff Welton" Reply-To: jwelton@nautel.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=26918678 > Harris, BE, Nautel, Continental, and Energy Onix is already filling orders > to replace every single AM and TV transmitter, along with most FM > transmitters in the US, and just drooling over the projected P&L sheets too! Oh, please. Of the 750 (approximately) AM transmitters we have in the US, many are already compatible. Some can be upgraded - did I mention previously that we sell the upgrade kits at our cost? That leaves us a couple of hundred potential transmitter sales for the ones that can't be upgraded - this will phase in over about five to ten years, so 20-40 transmitters a year. As the US market only makes up about 5-10% of our total sales volume, even with the most generous estimate this will only make a 1% increase in sales. Our overseas market is expanding at two or three times this rate. Sorry, but the tx manufacturers aren't going to get rich off of this at all. Regards, Jeff Welton Nautel Customer Service Dept. Tel.: 1-902-823-3900 ext. 127 Fax: 1-902-823-3183 email: jwelton@nautel.com From amfmdx@fastq.com Mon Jan 06 08:17:20 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Jan 2003 16:17:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 30408 invoked from network); 6 Jan 2003 16:17:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Jan 2003 16:17:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Jan 2003 16:17:20 -0000 Received: from fastq (d90-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.122]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id h06GHJP03392 for ; Mon, 6 Jan 2003 09:17:19 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <031a01c2b59f$090bf000$a2f9bed8@com> To: Subject: WBAP Date: Mon, 6 Jan 2003 09:16:56 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla >I was listening a coule of nights ago to WBAP 820 and had thought >they had mentioned that they were owned by Disney(ABC). Can anyone >verify this as it might be a syndicated program owned by Disney that >I heard. WBAP is owned by CapCities, a subsidiary of ABC and Disney. They have been for many years part of CapCities. Kevin "Its going to get a lot worse before it gets worse" - Lily Tomlin From fanfare@globility.com Mon Jan 06 09:04:46 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Jan 2003 17:04:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 9803 invoked from network); 6 Jan 2003 17:04:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Jan 2003 17:04:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Jan 2003 17:04:45 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.248] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Jan 2003 17:04:43 -0000 Date: Mon, 06 Jan 2003 17:04:41 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Ooh, I'm scared... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3E1966D8.32100.7202D0@localhost> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1379 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Marv Southcott " X-Originating-IP: 64.56.235.50 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Jeff Welton" wrote: > > Harris, BE, Nautel, Continental, and Energy Onix is already filling orders > > to replace every single AM and TV transmitter, along with most FM > > transmitters in the US, and just drooling over the projected P&L sheets too! > > Oh, please. Of the 750 (approximately) AM transmitters we have in the US, many > are already compatible. Some can be upgraded - did I mention previously that > we sell the upgrade kits at our cost? I'm with Jeff. Certainly, manufacturers look for opportunities to stimulate sales. That's now they keep their doors open and their employees paid. However, the term "added value" has to be a part of the mix so the buyer knows he's getting something he'd really like to have before buying a new radio. The same would hold true for a radio station and buying into HD-Radio. Don't think for a moment that the buying public have rings in their noses. Just take a look at the members of this group. But hey, if HD-Radio offers honest, immediate, perceivable, added value, the entire supply-side of radio would be revitalized. That would certainly make all of us, includoing our employees a little happier. But I don't see anyone really salivating over it yet. As for us, we can just add another board to an already existing monitor. That's even better value. Marv From philipr@irac.pe.ca Mon Jan 06 10:02:03 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Jan 2003 18:02:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 25910 invoked from network); 6 Jan 2003 18:02:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Jan 2003 18:02:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.87) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Jan 2003 18:02:02 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.155] by n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Jan 2003 18:02:01 -0000 Date: Mon, 06 Jan 2003 18:02:01 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Ooh, I'm scared... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 5603 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking I agree. Sure, there are opportunities for the manufacture of new transmitting and receiving equipment with IBOC, assuming IBOC gets off the ground. But, if AM Stereo enjoys a big revival, as we hope it will, there will be lots of opportunities for new product sales. The difference is one of compatiability - widescale adoption of AM Stereo will not have a negative effect on anyone's existing receiver - widescale adoption of IBOC will. In the short term, IBOC might have higher sales - by messing up your existing receiver and forcing you to get a new one. But, it would just as likely drive people away from AM radio and radio in general. That would then hurt sales. AM Stereo is benign advantaged technology - it offers improvements without any negative consequences, just like colour TV, FM Stereo etc. For AM Stereo to succeed the second time around, the public needs to realize that good sound can come off the AM band, that AM does have advantages over FM [just as FM has advantages over AM] and that the modest extra price for an AM Stereo receiver will provide a useful feature expressed in simple terms: more choice, more range. The radio manufacturers have to realize that including AM stereo on their boombox, for say an extra $10 will boost sales over their competitors products. For most people, FM offers great sound for a free medium, so why should I pay more for IBOC or for that matter DAB? But if the public believes AM will sound as good as FM, with longer potential range, maybe Joe and Jane public will be interested in this feature. Put it to Joe and Jane this way - with AM Stereo, you have 14 stations [8 FM, 6 AM] you can enjoy in Anytown USA. Without AM Stereo, you can only enjoy 8 stations. Are you willing to pay an extra $10 to $20 for a boombox or car stereo that will allow you to pick up 6 extra stations that you can enjoy [enjoyment equals wide frequency response and stereo] without any monthly fees or commitments! Just a one time extra investment folks, and you can enjoy more stations! Will this work? Well, what is the programming like on those stations in Anytown? If its worth listening to, maybe Joe and Jane will start looking for a new radio. Anyone want to make one and get an extra sale? Someday, some enterprising company is going to come out with a really nice little AM Stereo [also with wideband frequency response] / FM Stereo radio, targeted toward a real need, with a direct order price of $100 to 150 US. And, just as CC Radios and Tivoli Audio radios have their market share, this new radio will have its market too - especially if this company works with AM Stereo stations for cross promoting - CONTEST PRIZES!!! The radio will have to look good, work well, and offer extra features too. An optional "wavemagnet" like antenna would be a nice touch for the office user. Get some focus groups together, and make sure that it will appeal to women as well as men. Time and time I've read this about the Tivoli - my wife liked it so much, I HAD to order a second one. To start, bypass the uninformed sales Droids - poor product knowledge amoung the 90% of Radio Shack sales staff that are uninformed will undo all the good that the 10% of guys and gals at RS who really know their stuff can do. You can substitute virtually any other name of an electronics manufacturer for Radio Shack. For example, the Sony store employees in Fredericton NB in 1989 to 1992 who had never heard of AM Stereo, ddin't carry any of the Sony AM Stereo products, while top rated local CIHI Stereo 126 was flogging AM Stereo! Remember, when AM Stereo began, the internet was in its infancy. The internet didn't achive massive success overnight. Consumers had to rely on the mostly clueless retail staff at the stores they associated with electronic innovation. Why would anyone want AM Stereo if they thought it was two channel "Awful Muddy". Convince Joe and Jane that AM sounds good, and then tell them about stereo. Phil R. P.S. My Rant for today... --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Marv Southcott " wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Jeff Welton" wrote: > > > Harris, BE, Nautel, Continental, and Energy Onix is already filling orders > > > to replace every single AM and TV transmitter, along with most FM > > > transmitters in the US, and just drooling over the projected P&L sheets too! > > > > Oh, please. Of the 750 (approximately) AM transmitters we have in the US, many > > are already compatible. Some can be upgraded - did I mention previously that > > we sell the upgrade kits at our cost? > > I'm with Jeff. Certainly, manufacturers look for opportunities to stimulate sales. That's now they keep their doors open and their employees paid. However, the term "added value" has to be a part of the mix so the buyer knows he's getting something he'd really like to have before buying a new radio. The same would hold true for a radio station and buying into HD-Radio. > > Don't think for a moment that the buying public have rings in their noses. Just take a look at the members of this group. > > But hey, if HD-Radio offers honest, immediate, perceivable, added value, the entire supply-side of radio would be revitalized. That would certainly make all of us, includoing our employees a little happier. But I don't see anyone really salivating over it yet. As for us, we can just add another board to an already existing monitor. That's even better value. > > Marv From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Jan 06 11:14:49 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Jan 2003 19:14:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 90863 invoked from network); 6 Jan 2003 19:14:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Jan 2003 19:14:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.66) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Jan 2003 19:14:47 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.138] by n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Jan 2003 19:14:47 -0000 Date: Mon, 06 Jan 2003 19:14:46 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Ooh, I'm scared... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1046 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Sure, there are opportunities for the manufacture of new > transmitting and receiving equipment with IBOC, assuming IBOC gets > off the ground. I just think there is something inherently flawed about IBOC if it cannot be used full-time without causing a serious degradation of reception. Every other enhancement to radio and TV broadcasting that the FCC has approved has met three main criteria: 1. compatibility with existing receivers, 2. can be used full-time on all stations, and 3. no extra interference caused by stations onto each other. AM Stereo, FM Stereo, color TV, TV Stereo, ARI, RDS, Dolby FM, FMX, FM subcarriers, etc. etc... and now IBOC comes along and blatantly fails to meet any of these criteria. (Note that I am not including HDTV because it is established as a separate signal, not as a "hybrid" on top of an analog signal, and I'm also not including the approval of the non-compatible CBS "spinning disc" color TV system, as it was subsequently rejected in favor of all-electronic, fully-compatible NTSC color TV.) From scott.toenniessen@fmr.com Mon Jan 06 12:23:34 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: scott.toenniessen@fmr.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Jan 2003 20:23:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 53160 invoked from network); 6 Jan 2003 20:23:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Jan 2003 20:23:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.86) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Jan 2003 20:23:33 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.136] by n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Jan 2003 20:23:28 -0000 Date: Mon, 06 Jan 2003 20:23:26 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: DX402 / DX398 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3E190019.3BB6C30E@ncf.ca> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 348 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "spt87a " X-Originating-IP: 204.110.135.35 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=133257283 X-Yahoo-Profile: spt87a --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, Paul Cumming wrote: > I'm considering trying the modification to widen its > bandwidth and give it AM stereo. > Is there info on how to do this? I seem to remember this being discussed a while back but I don't think the full details of how to do it were published. Thanks, Scott From scott.toenniessen@fmr.com Mon Jan 06 12:23:51 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: scott.toenniessen@fmr.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Jan 2003 20:23:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 21985 invoked from network); 6 Jan 2003 20:23:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Jan 2003 20:23:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.90) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Jan 2003 20:23:51 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.250] by n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Jan 2003 20:23:50 -0000 Date: Mon, 06 Jan 2003 20:23:50 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: DX402 / DX398 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3E190019.3BB6C30E@ncf.ca> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 348 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "spt87a " X-Originating-IP: 204.110.135.35 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=133257283 X-Yahoo-Profile: spt87a --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, Paul Cumming wrote: > I'm considering trying the modification to widen its > bandwidth and give it AM stereo. > Is there info on how to do this? I seem to remember this being discussed a while back but I don't think the full details of how to do it were published. Thanks, Scott From scott.toenniessen@fmr.com Mon Jan 06 12:42:33 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: scott.toenniessen@fmr.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Jan 2003 20:42:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 91332 invoked from network); 6 Jan 2003 20:42:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Jan 2003 20:42:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Jan 2003 20:42:28 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.143] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Jan 2003 20:42:28 -0000 Date: Mon, 06 Jan 2003 20:42:28 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: TM-152 + Chris Cuff decoder Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 192 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "spt87a " X-Originating-IP: 204.110.135.35 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=133257283 X-Yahoo-Profile: spt87a Plans for adding a Chris Cuff decoder to the TM-152 were around a while ago to improve the bandwidth. Are these on the net someplace or, can someone post them here? Thanks, Scott From scott.toenniessen@fmr.com Mon Jan 06 14:00:47 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: scott.toenniessen@fmr.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Jan 2003 22:00:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 90417 invoked from network); 6 Jan 2003 22:00:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Jan 2003 22:00:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Jan 2003 22:00:47 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.165] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Jan 2003 22:00:45 -0000 Date: Mon, 06 Jan 2003 22:00:42 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Denon TU680 Service Manual Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 343 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "spt87a " X-Originating-IP: 204.110.135.35 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=133257283 X-Yahoo-Profile: spt87a Sorry to make three requests in a row, but I'm wondering if anyone has a service manual for a Denon TU-680NAB who would be willing to scan it or make a copy of it for me. I've tried to order a copy from Denon's authorized parts dealers but it doesn't seem to be available (even though a number of other parts are). Thanks, Scott From amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk Mon Jan 06 15:21:34 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Jan 2003 23:21:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 95079 invoked from network); 6 Jan 2003 23:21:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Jan 2003 23:21:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Jan 2003 23:21:33 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.157] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Jan 2003 23:21:27 -0000 Date: Mon, 06 Jan 2003 23:21:23 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Fwd: New AM Stereo in France (?) Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20030105033748.1196.qmail@web12808.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1891 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "m1ctk " X-Originating-IP: 81.7.57.189 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113985069 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereofan --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T." wrote: > I just got this e-mail... I looked in my old World Radio/TV Handbook > (1995 is the newest edition I have!), and Sud Radio on 819 kHz is > listed as being 20,000 watts... so I guess European DXers have > another AM Stereo station to look out for! > > > From: "NOSBOD" > > To: > > Subject: stereo am > > Date: Sat, 4 Jan 2003 19:45:51 -0000 > > > > according to the world dx club France, Sud Radio broadcasts on > > 819 kHz using c-quam since 13th may 2002. > > > > and according to the British dx club Italy radio studio x on > > 1584 used 10 kw in stereo also have been testing on 1566 kHz > > also in stereo with 400 watts intermittently. > > they say they will be testing soon with 50 kw!!! > > > > STUART DOBSON > > > > C/O > > NOSBOD > > > > NOSBOD@s... > The tx is apprently only 1kw. Read this from the alt.radio.uk newsgroup :- Thierry VIGNAUD For information I'm the WRTH contributor for France In the latest edition the power is mentionned with 20 kW but it's a mistake (I had the official confirmation of the reduction of power after the deadline of the 2003 edition). actually Sud Radio is using a low power transmitter with only 1 kW. The older 20 kW Tx is out of order since 2 years. It's only after 1 year out off the air that Sud Radio has started this new transmitter. I have no information concerning the fact that they are using AM STEREO. The transmitter is located at 10 miles east from Toulouse (south west of France). GC : 01E37-43N37 You have some views of this TX on my web site at this http://perso.wanadoo.fr/tvignaud/galerie/am/31gaure.htm Thierry VIGNAUD - thierry.vignaud@NO-SPAM_laposte.net Boulogne-Billancourt (France) www.emetteurs.fr.fm From ccuff@in4web.com Mon Jan 06 15:28:55 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Jan 2003 23:28:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 11983 invoked from network); 6 Jan 2003 23:28:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Jan 2003 23:28:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Jan 2003 23:28:54 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.132]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Mon, 6 Jan 2003 18:24:24 -0500 Message-ID: <008a01c2b5da$2818b100$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: DX402 / DX398 Date: Mon, 6 Jan 2003 18:20:08 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 I did this before, but like so much stuff, I did not document it, because it was such a pain to do. I had to cut down the already tiny decoder board, glue it to the speaker magnet, and shoe-horn it all in. It came out good, tho. If I can ever find the time, I will do another one- Do they still sell this model? Chris ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Monday, January 06, 2003 3:23 PM Subject: {AMSF} Re: DX402 / DX398 From ccuff@in4web.com Mon Jan 06 15:32:15 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 6 Jan 2003 23:32:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 23507 invoked from network); 6 Jan 2003 23:32:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Jan 2003 23:32:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Jan 2003 23:32:15 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.132]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Mon, 6 Jan 2003 18:27:42 -0500 Message-ID: <00a401c2b5da$9e8353e0$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: Subject: Randy M Date: Mon, 6 Jan 2003 18:23:27 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 If Randy M. is on this list, I have been trying to email you back with AM Stereo info, but your emails keep coming back with errors. I get your emails, so if you want, email me your phone #- Thanks, Chris From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Jan 06 17:02:24 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Jan 2003 01:02:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 9640 invoked from network); 7 Jan 2003 01:02:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Jan 2003 01:02:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.87) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Jan 2003 01:02:21 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.153] by n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 07 Jan 2003 01:02:20 -0000 Date: Tue, 07 Jan 2003 01:02:19 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: WOR listeners say no to IBOC hash Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1947 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.82.30 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics The final Fall 2002 Arbitron ratings for New York City, Long Island, Westchester County, NY, and central NJ are all out today, and in all of these places, 710 WOR's ratings are down quite a bit. Gee, I wonder why... could it be that listeners are annoyed by the IBOC hash and poor audio quality? Meanwhile, Radio Disney on 1560 WQEW is showing up with ratings, perhaps for the first time ever since they dumped American Popular Standards 4 years ago... with an 0.3 at the bottom of the Westchester chart. So, as much as I dislike the format and the way it is run, I have to at least give them credit for getting kids to listen to today's pop music on *AM*. And Arbitron doesn't measure ratings for listeners under age 12, so that means these are even teenagers who are choosing Disney on AM over the typical pop music stations on FM. Also, on a happier note, WTTM 1680 AM Stereo is showing up with its first official central NJ ratings, with a small but respectable 0.6. And is it any coincidence that WTTM didn't get any ratings until *after* Neal got the AM Stereo up and running and sounding great? Anyway, it will be interesting to similarly monitor the ratings of 700 WLW, and any other station that's using IBOC. It it proves to be a turn-off factor for listeners -- even a small one -- then stations might not be so eager to use it. Nevertheless, I hear iBiquity is going to have some sort of display at the Consumer Electronics Show (CES) later this month in Las Vegas... so if anybody is in the area, it would be great if we could get a first-hand report on any IBOC demos they will be running... they keep telling us how wonderful and fantastic the IBOC digital audio sounds, but they have yet to post any actual samples of it for us to hear! (The ones on the iBiquity web site are from *1999*, and the forms of IBOC they were testing back then bear no resemblance to today's AM and FM IBOC formats.) From stodd@sherbtel.net Mon Jan 06 17:33:07 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Jan 2003 01:33:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 75304 invoked from network); 7 Jan 2003 01:32:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Jan 2003 01:32:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Jan 2003 01:32:58 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-96.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.96]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h071Wsql008885 for ; Mon, 6 Jan 2003 19:32:56 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <005501c2b5ec$d18d4180$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Upper Midwest Broadcasting Date: Mon, 6 Jan 2003 19:33:42 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Probably WHLB. Still trying to find somebody connected to the station to find out the extent of the damage and for how much they're willing to sell it. Got the help of another friend who emailed the local Chamber of Commerce to see if they knew. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mark Sundquist" > Heh...my mother grew up in Virginia,MN...I remember the calls as being > something else on 1400, though whenever we would go back and visit... From stodd@sherbtel.net Mon Jan 06 17:40:14 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Jan 2003 01:40:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 76673 invoked from network); 7 Jan 2003 01:40:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Jan 2003 01:40:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Jan 2003 01:40:14 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-96.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.96]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h071eAql010880 for ; Mon, 6 Jan 2003 19:40:12 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <007501c2b5ed$d565f260$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Denon TU680 Service Manual Date: Mon, 6 Jan 2003 19:40:58 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude try www.servicemanuals.net ST ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Monday, January 06, 2003 4:00 PM Subject: {AMSF} Denon TU680 Service Manual > Sorry to make three requests in a row, but I'm wondering if anyone > has a service manual for a Denon TU-680NAB who would be willing to > scan it or make a copy of it for me. I've tried to order a copy > from Denon's authorized parts dealers but it doesn't seem to be > available (even though a number of other parts are). > > Thanks, > > Scott > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > From stodd@sherbtel.net Mon Jan 06 17:44:29 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Jan 2003 01:44:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 17526 invoked from network); 7 Jan 2003 01:44:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Jan 2003 01:44:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Jan 2003 01:44:29 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-96.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.96]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h071iPql011976 for ; Mon, 6 Jan 2003 19:44:27 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <008901c2b5ee$6d562040$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <1041756931.2722.65768.m12@yahoogroups.com> <3E190019.3BB6C30E@ncf.ca> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: DX402 / DX398 Date: Mon, 6 Jan 2003 19:45:13 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Hey, that's pretty good! Gotta see a pix and schematic. I've tried to QSL shortwave stations with an odd combo of one-tube Aeriola Sr. and a 1929 vintage SW downconverter. Something tells me they don't believe me or else the mail service is rotten. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Possum Hunter" > Gee guys, I happen to LIKE my Sangean ATS-818! I have a home brew tuned RF > amp in front of it I built with 2 '01A tubes. From evergreenterrace@buzzle.com Mon Jan 06 17:44:35 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: evergreenterrace@buzzle.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Jan 2003 01:44:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 35860 invoked from network); 7 Jan 2003 01:44:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Jan 2003 01:44:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Jan 2003 01:44:34 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.147] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 07 Jan 2003 01:44:34 -0000 Date: Tue, 07 Jan 2003 01:44:31 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: WOR listeners say no to IBOC hash Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 667 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgliradio " X-Originating-IP: 170.20.11.59 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=69711087 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgliradio --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: > The final Fall 2002 Arbitron ratings for New York City, Long Island, > Westchester County, NY, and central NJ are all out today, and in all > of these places, 710 WOR's ratings are down quite a bit. Gee, I > wonder why... could it be that listeners are annoyed by the IBOC hash > and poor audio quality? > While I am the last person to support IBOC, I don't think the WOR showing the Fall book has much of anything to do with the digital hash or audio quality. WOR has been in this area for some time. Their last 6 books 2.4 / 2.3 / 2.3 / 2.3 / 2.5 / 2.2 From stodd@sherbtel.net Mon Jan 06 17:46:58 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Jan 2003 01:46:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 41816 invoked from network); 7 Jan 2003 01:46:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Jan 2003 01:46:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Jan 2003 01:46:58 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-96.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.96]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h071ksql012610 for ; Mon, 6 Jan 2003 19:46:55 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <009601c2b5ee$c61e17a0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: DX402 / DX398 Date: Mon, 6 Jan 2003 19:47:42 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Just parallel a few pf of capacitance across the ceramic filter. There is no set value, so you'll have to experiment. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: > > I'm considering trying the modification to widen its > > bandwidth and give it AM stereo. > > > > Is there info on how to do this? I seem to remember this being > discussed a while back but I don't think the full details of how to > do it were published. > From evergreenterrace@buzzle.com Mon Jan 06 17:48:28 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: evergreenterrace@buzzle.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Jan 2003 01:48:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 14364 invoked from network); 7 Jan 2003 01:48:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Jan 2003 01:48:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.70) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Jan 2003 01:48:28 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.164] by n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 07 Jan 2003 01:48:27 -0000 Date: Tue, 07 Jan 2003 01:48:26 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: WOR listeners say no to IBOC hash Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 740 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgliradio " X-Originating-IP: 170.20.11.59 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=69711087 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgliradio --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: > The final Fall 2002 Arbitron ratings for New York City, Long Island, > Westchester County, NY, and central NJ are all out today, and in all > of these places, 710 WOR's ratings are down quite a bit. Gee, I > wonder why... could it be that listeners are annoyed by the IBOC hash > and poor audio quality? > As for Westchester, the Summer book looks like a fluke as the normal rating for WOR is the mid 2's (look at WQXR and WXRK's numbers in this market). Westchester is also a new market for Arbitron (only 2- 3 years old). As for Nassu-Suffolk, WOR went down 1/10th a point and tied for their second best book in the last 6. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Jan 06 19:06:14 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Jan 2003 03:06:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 9606 invoked from network); 7 Jan 2003 03:06:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Jan 2003 03:06:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Jan 2003 03:06:14 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.190] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 07 Jan 2003 03:06:13 -0000 Date: Tue, 07 Jan 2003 03:06:11 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: WOR listeners say no to IBOC hash Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 308 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.82.30 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > WOR has been in this area for some time. Their last 6 books > > 2.4 / 2.3 / 2.3 / 2.3 / 2.5 / 2.2 In central NJ, they dropped down from 4.4 to 3.0, their worst rating in years... and in Westchester, they went from 3.2 to 2.3, while their main competitor 770 WABC is now the #1 station overall there. From evergreenterrace@buzzle.com Mon Jan 06 19:20:36 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: evergreenterrace@buzzle.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Jan 2003 03:20:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 26832 invoked from network); 7 Jan 2003 03:20:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Jan 2003 03:20:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Jan 2003 03:20:33 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.151] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 07 Jan 2003 03:20:33 -0000 Date: Tue, 07 Jan 2003 03:20:30 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: WOR listeners say no to IBOC hash Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 811 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgliradio " X-Originating-IP: 170.20.11.59 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=69711087 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgliradio --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: > > WOR has been in this area for some time. Their last 6 books > > > > 2.4 / 2.3 / 2.3 / 2.3 / 2.5 / 2.2 > > In central NJ, they dropped down from 4.4 to 3.0, their worst rating > in years... and in Westchester, they went from 3.2 to 2.3, while > their main competitor 770 WABC is now the #1 station overall there. These are the klnds of posts that make us look bad. Do you actually think IBOC played any role? Please. As I have said, I think IBOC is a joke, but if you're going to try to find reasons not to support IBOC, this is not where you want to look right now. The Westchester book is known for flux. The station has been in the 3's in 4 of the last 6 books in Market #33 (Middlesex NJ). From dav259@csiro.au Mon Jan 06 19:50:35 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Jan 2003 03:50:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 78658 invoked from network); 7 Jan 2003 03:50:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Jan 2003 03:50:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Jan 2003 03:50:34 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h073oWP24882; Tue, 7 Jan 2003 14:50:32 +1100 (EST) Date: Tue, 7 Jan 2003 14:50:32 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: amstereoforum Cc: Subject: stereo lightening Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public The Greater 3UZ - Sport 927 - has just introduced a snazzy new lightening flash news theme. It's first ever stereo news theme. Nice! Ian - Melbourne From ian_davidson@hotmail.com Mon Jan 06 20:03:16 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ian_davidson@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Jan 2003 04:03:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 77809 invoked from network); 7 Jan 2003 04:03:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Jan 2003 04:03:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.15.176) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Jan 2003 04:03:15 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 6 Jan 2003 20:01:50 -0800 Received: from 138.194.15.102 by lw10fd.law10.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Tue, 07 Jan 2003 04:01:50 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Aussie Ham reply about AM stereo Date: Tue, 07 Jan 2003 15:01:50 +1100 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 07 Jan 2003 04:01:50.0762 (UTC) FILETIME=[81BC50A0:01C2B601] From: "Ian Davidson" X-Originating-IP: [138.194.15.102] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83045090 Hey UK-Dave! What list is this from? Hmmmm??? >From: "m1ctk " > >The other week I simply asked if anyone is interested in am stereo accross >the ham radio packet network. May be of interest to Ian anyway :- > >Hi, here in Australia, we still have AM Stereo, but one cannot buy >an AM Stereo receiver. Nissan cars here put in as standard AM >Stereo, which was great and Pioneer did a good job selling Tuners >and Car Receivers. However it was mainly killed by the big time >HI Fi dealers, who Poo Pooed it no end and maybe saw it as a >competitor to its high falutin, hi fi, hi cost stereo systems. I don't know >now why am stations still run it? but no doubt they are keeping faith with >the original buyers and users. Maybe >it is a Government requirement that they ha to keep it going regardless. >Its funny though that when I tell folk about AM Stereo, they >just can't believe it exists Hi. Ok and all the best from VK 73 -de Dave, >VK2AWZ @ VK2EL _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Jan 06 20:10:32 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Jan 2003 04:10:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 86366 invoked from network); 7 Jan 2003 04:10:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Jan 2003 04:10:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Jan 2003 04:10:32 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.151] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 07 Jan 2003 04:10:31 -0000 Date: Tue, 07 Jan 2003 04:10:28 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: WOR listeners say no to IBOC hash Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1409 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.82.30 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Do you actually think IBOC played any role? Please. Frankly, yes, I do! Having personally listened to WOR on the narrowest of my narrow-band radios and the crappiest of my crappy radios, they always sound worse than all of their major competitors on the dial -- WFAN, WABC, WCBS, etc. Even if your radio isn't wide-band enough to hear the hiss, and even if you never hit the Seek button and end up with hash blasting to your ears as the radio automatically stops on 700 or 720 kHz, WOR still sounds worse than the other AM stations. Their audio processing is downright lousy, and the distortion and harshly clipped sibilants will drive you nuts -- and this continues even at night, when the IBOC is off, so it is their *CHOICE* to use such horrible audio! I have to admit, WOR *did* actually sound halfway decent for a few weeks when they were transmitting 6.2 kHz audio. It was clean and comparatively distortion-free. But then, iBiquity "caught" them and ordered them to drop it back down to the distorted 5 kHz audio, as per official IBOC specs. And FWIW, I heard from one employee of an electric utility company in central NJ. He got a call from a customer who reported "power line interference" that was mysteriously happening around WOR's signal during the daytime. I wonder how this customer felt when he told them that WOR is actually *transmitting* this interference! From possumhunter@netzero.net Mon Jan 06 20:24:33 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Jan 2003 04:24:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 74742 invoked from network); 7 Jan 2003 04:24:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Jan 2003 04:24:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.121) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Jan 2003 04:24:31 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 6 Jan 2003 20:24:31 -0800 To: References: <1041756931.2722.65768.m12@yahoogroups.com> <3E190019.3BB6C30E@ncf.ca> <008901c2b5ee$6d562040$827dfea9@home1> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: DX402 / DX398 Date: Mon, 6 Jan 2003 23:23:55 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 07 Jan 2003 04:24:31.0780 (UTC) FILETIME=[ACF72E40:01C2B604] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.148.196.50] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Scott Todd wrote: > Hey, that's pretty good! Gotta see a pix and schematic. Sorry, I dont have a digital cam to take a pic of my little amp. It is just a copy of the front-end of a 1920's vintage Splitdorf TRF radio. I control the gain with a rheostat on the filament (A+), just like the good ole days. I am powering it with the Battery Eliminator power supply kit AES sells. I have found the old RCA/Cunningham 201A tubes to be the best for this application, but any '01A will do just fine. I am running the filaments on DC. Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Mon Jan 06 20:27:43 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Jan 2003 04:27:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 44290 invoked from network); 7 Jan 2003 04:27:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Jan 2003 04:27:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.119) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Jan 2003 04:27:41 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 6 Jan 2003 20:27:41 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: WOR listeners say no to IBOC hash Date: Mon, 6 Jan 2003 23:26:49 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 07 Jan 2003 04:27:41.0574 (UTC) FILETIME=[1E177260:01C2B605] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.148.196.50] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 kevtronics@yahoo.com wrote: > And FWIW, I heard from one employee of an electric utility company in central NJ. He got a call from a customer who reported "power line interference" that was mysteriously happening around WOR's signal during the daytime. I wonder how this customer felt when he told them that WOR is actually *transmitting* this interference! Did the customer beleive the power company guy when he told them what was going on? No radio station manager in their right mind would transmit interference to their own signal, right? Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Mon Jan 06 20:34:34 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Jan 2003 04:34:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 26814 invoked from network); 7 Jan 2003 04:34:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Jan 2003 04:34:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.82) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Jan 2003 04:34:33 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 6 Jan 2003 20:34:33 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} stereo lightening Date: Mon, 6 Jan 2003 23:32:18 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 07 Jan 2003 04:34:33.0688 (UTC) FILETIME=[13BB0D80:01C2B606] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.148.196.50] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Ian Davidson wrote: > The Greater 3UZ - Sport 927 - has just introduced a snazzy new lightening flash news theme. It's first ever stereo news theme. Nice! Can you post a mp3 of it? Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Mon Jan 06 20:37:35 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Jan 2003 04:37:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 52955 invoked from network); 7 Jan 2003 04:37:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Jan 2003 04:37:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.118) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Jan 2003 04:37:34 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 6 Jan 2003 20:37:34 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} WOR listeners say no to IBOC hash Date: Mon, 6 Jan 2003 23:36:59 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 07 Jan 2003 04:37:34.0462 (UTC) FILETIME=[7F7AF9E0:01C2B606] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.148.196.50] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 kevtronics@yahoo.com wrote: >The final Fall 2002 Arbitron ratings for New York City, Long Island, Westchester County, NY, and central NJ are all out today, and in all of these places, 710 WOR's ratings are down quite a bit. Gee, I wonder why... could it be that listeners are annoyed by the IBOC hash and poor audio quality? WOR is the number 21 station in the New York metro with a big ole 2.2 share. Gee gads, If a 50,000 watt clear channel station cannot pull a 3 or better in New York, they should pull the plug and change everything they are doing! WINS is sure kicking @$$ with a 4.2! Perhaps it is time for Tom and Kerry to chuck that IBOC hash maker in the Hudson and buy a C-QUAM exciter, then hire the PD over at Prime Time Radio CHWO 740 as a consultant to put in an Adult Standards format. No doubt CHWO owns the ratings book in Toronto. As far as that goes, for a modest fee, I would be happy to program WOR with Oldies. I got a 3.2 share in the last Laurens County book! That ain't too shabby for a 1000 Watt daytimer, huh? WFIS 1600 only covers the Southeastern edge of the Greenville-Spartanburg-Anderson market, and we still pulled a .3! That ain't bad when you consider there is another AM 1600 that covers the Northwestern part of that market. > > And Arbitron doesn't measure ratings for listeners under age 12, so that means these are even teenagers who are choosing Disney on AM over the typical pop music stations on FM. If New York FM sounds like it did when I was there, I can see why teens would choose to listen to 1560. The FMs sound like sh*t. > > Also, on a happier note, WTTM 1680 AM Stereo is showing up with its first official central NJ ratings, with a small but respectable 0.6. And is it any coincidence that WTTM didn't get any ratings until *after* Neal got the AM Stereo up and running and sounding great? That means WTTM has quite a few White listeners, as well as Asians. WTTM's audio is so good, you cannot help but stay tuned to it. That shows that almost any format will fly on AM if the station sounds good. > > Anyway, it will be interesting to similarly monitor the ratings of 700 WLW, and any other station that's using IBOC. WLW dropped from a 10.4 in the first Fall book to a 10.2 in the second Fall book. This after it pulled an 11.1 last Spring. I sure hope Clear Channel doesn't screw up the audio on WSAI 1530 with IBOC. I was surprised they canned the Adult Standards format. They sounded good with it and had decent ratings. > >If it proves to be a turn-off factor for listeners -- even a small one -- then stations might not be so eager to use it. I think it is pretty stupid for a station to screw up it's audio on all of the analog radios out there so it can be heard on HD Radios that are not even on the market yet. Kevin From di316@freenet.carleton.ca Mon Jan 06 21:04:26 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: paulc@ncf.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Jan 2003 05:04:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 73484 invoked from network); 7 Jan 2003 05:04:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Jan 2003 05:04:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO tomts13-srv.bellnexxia.net) (209.226.175.34) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Jan 2003 05:04:26 -0000 Received: from ncf.ca ([64.230.18.154]) by tomts13-srv.bellnexxia.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.19 201-253-122-122-119-20020516) with ESMTP id <20030107050425.VOPW17918.tomts13-srv.bellnexxia.net@ncf.ca>; Tue, 7 Jan 2003 00:04:25 -0500 Message-ID: <3E1A5FF5.EEBBEF1C@ncf.ca> Date: Tue, 07 Jan 2003 00:04:53 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.79 [en] (Windows NT 5.0; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Two Articles on Eureka DAB vs. IBOC Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-eGroups-From: Paul Cumming From: Paul Cumming X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=43835445 X-Yahoo-Profile: rahoule104 First, this article and discussion on technology website Kuro5hin, written by a Norwegian. He's somewhat against IBOC and in favour of Eureka, altho the people posting comments make some interesting arguments for IBOC: http://www.kuro5hin.org/story/2003/1/6/103819/9665 ...And this article from the Globe and Mail (a Canadian national newspaper) on the slow consumer adoption of DAB in Canada: (This is also linked to from the Kuro5hin article, but worth a read in its own right.) http://www.globeandmail.com/servlet/ArticleNews/PEstory/TGAM/20021228/RDIGI/Business/business/business_temp/3/3/5/ Eureka-147 DAB radios are now on sale here in Ottawa, and have been since the beginning of December 2002. There are two models in each Radio Shack store: a CDN$300 model with DAB and FM reception, and a CDN$400 model with DAB and FM and a built-in MP3 player. I haven't bought one yet, but I will as soon as I find out any stations are on the air on the DAB band in this city. I've been listening to Toronto radio periodically via Internet streaming, and I'm wondering why they aren't shouting DAB from the rooftops. Except for the odd DAB commercial ("Have you heard radio's future today?") which *aren't even played anymore*, DAB seems to be really hush-hush. Why?? If you don't tell the public about it, how will they ever know? How will they ever know to buy the receivers and create the necessary installed base of DAB listeners? Why am I not hearing station IDs that go something like, "You're listening to CHUM-FM -- 104.5 FM -- and also on DAB channel 18!" Something about wanting to avoid "brand dilution" or something? At least when AM stereo was rolled out, some stations amended their names to show it, like "CFRA 58 AM STEREO". (They don't call themselves that anymore, even they still are stereo.) -- Paul ---------------------- Paul Cumming paulc@ncf.ca From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Jan 06 22:33:13 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Jan 2003 06:33:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 62150 invoked from network); 7 Jan 2003 06:33:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Jan 2003 06:33:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Jan 2003 06:33:11 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.185] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 07 Jan 2003 06:33:10 -0000 Date: Tue, 07 Jan 2003 06:33:09 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: 1160 WYNS Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1093 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.82.30 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics This is from the Philadelphia radio message board... 1160 WYNS was an AM Stereo station in eastern Pennsylvania, formerly Classic Country, and then Oldies -- both in Stereo. I don't know if there is much we can personally do about this, but in any event is sad to see an independently owned "home-town" station go dark, especially one that proudly broadcasted in AM Stereo. WYNS's 4000-watt daytime signal had excellent north-to-south coverage of eastern PA, and they also had a decent 1000-watt nighttime signal. If you'd like to access this message and its replies on the Philadelphia radio board, it can be found at: http://radio-info.com/boards/philadelphia/index.cgi?read=17401 ================================================================= WYNS no more. Name: Zinger Date: 1/5/03 11:22 a.m. "64.115.44.59" writes: The Station signed off New Years Day. FCC holds license. It is for sale. Lets all get together and chip in at least $5,000. Twenty people could do it. If I get serious responses then I will post an e-mail address and we can arrange a meeting place. From scott.toenniessen@fmr.com Mon Jan 06 22:52:53 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: scott.toenniessen@fmr.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Jan 2003 06:52:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 68542 invoked from network); 7 Jan 2003 06:52:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Jan 2003 06:52:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Jan 2003 06:52:52 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.132] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 07 Jan 2003 06:52:52 -0000 Date: Tue, 07 Jan 2003 06:52:52 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: DX402 / DX398 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <008a01c2b5da$2818b100$0101a8c0@pavilion> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 254 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "spt87a " X-Originating-IP: 151.204.226.82 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=133257283 X-Yahoo-Profile: spt87a --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Christopher Cuff" wrote: > If I can ever find the time, I will do another one- Do they still sell this > model? No but I thought it had been done before and wanted to attempt it on mine. - Scott From scott.toenniessen@fmr.com Mon Jan 06 22:53:02 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: scott.toenniessen@fmr.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Jan 2003 06:53:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 67064 invoked from network); 7 Jan 2003 06:53:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Jan 2003 06:53:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Jan 2003 06:53:02 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.132] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 07 Jan 2003 06:53:02 -0000 Date: Tue, 07 Jan 2003 06:53:01 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: DX402 / DX398 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <008a01c2b5da$2818b100$0101a8c0@pavilion> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 254 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "spt87a " X-Originating-IP: 151.204.226.82 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=133257283 X-Yahoo-Profile: spt87a --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Christopher Cuff" wrote: > If I can ever find the time, I will do another one- Do they still sell this > model? No but I thought it had been done before and wanted to attempt it on mine. - Scott From n0uiheric@aol.com Mon Jan 06 23:56:57 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Jan 2003 07:56:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 58244 invoked from network); 7 Jan 2003 07:56:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Jan 2003 07:56:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m06.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.161) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Jan 2003 07:56:57 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-m06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.b8.35b89e50 (4320) for ; Tue, 7 Jan 2003 02:56:55 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Tue, 7 Jan 2003 02:56:55 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: WOR listeners say no to IBOC hash To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih I'm pretty sure the listeners to KMOX 1120 St. Louis, MO would say "NO" to IBOCrap. Since they dropped AM Stereo in 2000, KMOX has lost roughly a third of it's listeners; it's last Stereo book was something like a 12.0 rating; the last book showed them with a 9.0 rating. If KMOX ever went to IBOC, then an FM station (most likely sister station KEZK 102.5, with a Soft AC format) would take the top spot away from the Once-Mighty 'Mox. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From dav259@csiro.au Tue Jan 07 00:42:08 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Jan 2003 08:42:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 21462 invoked from network); 7 Jan 2003 08:42:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Jan 2003 08:42:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Jan 2003 08:42:07 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h078g6P06167 for ; Tue, 7 Jan 2003 19:42:06 +1100 (EST) Date: Tue, 7 Jan 2003 19:42:06 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: WOR listeners say no to IBOC hash In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public Nice to see Eric regularly posting again. We need all points of view here and Eric has been a great contributor for a long time. Eric - keep punching! What's happened to Charles Penry? I think I need one of his philosophical views on 2003. It got to 104 degrees in Melbourne today and I was hanging out for a "Charles Penry fix". Is Charles still getting our messages? And if so Chas - what have you got to say ... in a very small nutshell? What CP ever said was no worse than our Slavic friend Shane Filan - who seems to have gone quiet of late. btw - talking of ratings - I looked at our December figures - and our Magic 693 (the only full blown AM stereo station in Melbourne at the moment) is Number 20 station nationally as far as the number of listeners go. In Melbourne its number 7. Could Charles please pontificate on how Magic 693 will go in 2003? How much Magic is too much? Ian (Chris - if you got to the end of this you should play 'Kismet' - specially the track about the guy under the olive tree ...) ___________________________________________ On Tue, 7 Jan 2003 n0uiheric@aol.com wrote: > I'm pretty sure the listeners to KMOX 1120 St. Louis, MO would say "NO" to > IBOCrap. Since they dropped AM Stereo in 2000, KMOX has lost roughly a third > of it's listeners; it's last Stereo book was something like a 12.0 rating; > the last book showed them with a 9.0 rating. If KMOX ever went to IBOC, then > an FM station (most likely sister station KEZK 102.5, with a Soft AC format) > would take the top spot away from the Once-Mighty 'Mox. From possumhunter@netzero.net Tue Jan 07 08:40:46 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: possumhunter@netzero.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Jan 2003 16:40:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 41874 invoked from network); 7 Jan 2003 16:40:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Jan 2003 16:40:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rly-ip03.mx.aol.com) (64.12.138.7) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Jan 2003 16:40:45 -0000 Received: from logs-mtc-ta.proxy.aol.com (logs-mtc-ta.proxy.aol.com [64.12.105.5]) by rly-ip03.mx.aol.com (v89.10) with ESMTP id RELAYIN7-0107113933; Tue, 07 Jan 2003 11:39:33 1900 Received: from ibm (ACA59E58.ipt.aol.com [172.165.158.88]) by logs-mtc-ta.proxy.aol.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with SMTP id h07GdMJ191768 for ; Tue, 7 Jan 2003 11:39:23 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <005701c2b66b$4f024560$3d91b498@aoldsl.net> To: References: Subject: KMOX Was: WOR listeners say no to IBOC hash Date: Tue, 7 Jan 2003 11:39:10 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Apparently-From: DodgeRamTrucker@aol.com From: "Possum Hunter" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 n0uiheric@aol.com wrote: >Since they dropped AM Stereo in 2000, KMOX has lost roughly a third of it's listeners; it's last Stereo book was something like a 12.0 rating; the last book showed them with a 9.0 rating. When will these station owners learn people want HiFi Stereo sound on both AM and FM? John Q Public does not care if he is listening to AM or FM. All he wants is good programming on a good sounding station. Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Tue Jan 07 12:40:07 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Jan 2003 20:40:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 26145 invoked from network); 7 Jan 2003 20:40:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Jan 2003 20:40:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.90) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Jan 2003 20:40:06 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 7 Jan 2003 12:33:06 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} website updated Date: Sat, 4 Jan 2003 10:02:56 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 07 Jan 2003 20:33:06.0450 (UTC) FILETIME=[FC021720:01C2B68B] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.168.222.199] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk wrote: > Nothing special but it's up :- You have some neat links on that page. I downloaded a bunch of the international airchecks this morning and last night. Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Tue Jan 07 12:40:07 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Jan 2003 20:40:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 26204 invoked from network); 7 Jan 2003 20:40:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Jan 2003 20:40:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.90) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Jan 2003 20:40:06 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 7 Jan 2003 12:33:06 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} WOR listeners say no to IBOC hash Date: Mon, 6 Jan 2003 23:07:12 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 07 Jan 2003 20:33:06.0450 (UTC) FILETIME=[FC021720:01C2B68B] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.148.196.50] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 kevtronics@yahoo.com wrote: >The final Fall 2002 Arbitron ratings for New York City, Long Island, Westchester County, NY, and central NJ are all out today, and in all of these places, 710 WOR's ratings are down quite a bit. Gee, I wonder why... could it be that listeners are annoyed by the IBOC hash and poor audio quality? WOR is the number 21 station in the New York metro with a big ole 2.2 share. Gee gads, If a 50,000 watt clear channel station cannot pull a 3 or better in New York, they should pull the plug and change everything they are doing! WINS is sure kicking @$$ with a 4.2! Perhaps it is time for Tom and Kerry to chuck that IBOC hash maker in the Hudson and buy a C-QUAM exciter, then hire the PD over at Prime Time Radio CHWO 740 as a consultant to put in an Adult Standards format. No doubt CHWO owns the ratings book in Toronto. As far as that goes, for a modest fee, I would be happy to program WOR with Oldies. I got a 3.2 share in the last Laurens County book! That ain't too shabby for a 1000 Watt daytimer, huh? WFIS 1600 only covers the Southeastern edge of the Greenville-Spartanburg-Anderson market, and we still pulled a .3! That ain't bad when you consider there is another AM 1600 that covers the Northwestern part of that market. > > And Arbitron doesn't measure ratings for listeners under age 12, so that means these are even teenagers who are choosing Disney on AM over the typical pop music stations on FM. If New York FM sounds like it did when I was there, I can see why teens would choose to listen to 1560. The FMs sound like sh*t. > > Also, on a happier note, WTTM 1680 AM Stereo is showing up with its first official central NJ ratings, with a small but respectable 0.6. And is it any coincidence that WTTM didn't get any ratings until *after* Neal got the AM Stereo up and running and sounding great? That means WTTM has quite a few White listeners, as well as Asians. WTTM's audio is so good, you cannot help but stay tuned to it. That shows that almost any format will fly on AM if the station sounds good. > > Anyway, it will be interesting to similarly monitor the ratings of 700 WLW, and any other station that's using IBOC. WLW dropped from a 10.4 in the first Fall book to a 10.2 in the second Fall book. This after it pulled an 11.1 last Spring. I sure hope Clear Channel doesn't screw up the audio on WSAI 1530 with IBOC. I was surprised they canned the Adult Standards format. They sounded good with it and had decent ratings. > >If it proves to be a turn-off factor for listeners -- even a small one -- then stations might not be so eager to use it. I think it is pretty stupid for a station to screw up it's audio on all of the analog radios out there so it can be heard on HD Radios that are not even on the market yet. Kevin From KC4QLP@aol.com Tue Jan 07 14:59:45 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Jan 2003 22:59:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 84268 invoked from network); 7 Jan 2003 22:59:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Jan 2003 22:59:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d06.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.38) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Jan 2003 22:59:44 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.117.1d44873b (4328) for ; Tue, 7 Jan 2003 17:59:32 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <117.1d44873b.2b4cb5d3@aol.com> Date: Tue, 7 Jan 2003 17:59:31 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Ooh, I'm scared... To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 1/5/03 11:30:12 PM Eastern Standard Time, possumhunter@netzero.net writes: << I want to know the makes and models of the "Typical AM radios" that were used in the IBiquity tests for IBOC QRM. Kevin >> I dont have the URL handy..but if you look back through the old messages on the list you'll find the URL I posted on the where you can find the test results and on which receivers were used.The statement made by one of those IBOC proponent engineers ...herein called "crackhead" stated and I paraphase {exact details is also on a past message on this list}..that every make and model radio made was tested". This has since been found to be false.I have since determined that there have been many "mis statements"made by this "crackhead" so since then I have choosen to ignore this "crackhead" and anything that he has to say. Any so called professional that is dignified in any sort of manor does not make overly generalized statements.Over generalizing certainly spells disaster in maintaining ones creditability. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- Subscribe send an email to amstereo-subscribe@topica.com _______________________________________________________ From KC4QLP@aol.com Tue Jan 07 15:15:32 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Jan 2003 23:15:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 53492 invoked from network); 7 Jan 2003 23:15:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Jan 2003 23:15:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m03.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.6) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Jan 2003 23:15:29 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.4f.295ebee8 (4328) for ; Tue, 7 Jan 2003 18:15:13 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <4f.295ebee8.2b4cb981@aol.com> Date: Tue, 7 Jan 2003 18:15:13 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} WOR listeners say no to IBOC hash To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 1/6/03 8:04:18 PM Eastern Standard Time, kevtronics@yahoo.com writes: << Nevertheless, I hear iBiquity is going to have some sort of display at the Consumer Electronics Show (CES) later this month in Las Vegas... so if anybody is in the area, it would be great if we could get a first-hand report on any IBOC demos they will be running... they keep telling us how wonderful and fantastic the IBOC digital audio sounds, but they have yet to post any actual samples of it for us to hear! (The ones on the iBiquity web site are from *1999*, and the forms of IBOC they were testing back then bear no resemblance to today's AM and FM IBOC formats.) >> Ahh!...how appropriate!..a Consumer Electronic Show showing off IBOC in "Lost Wages" Nv! I wonder if the demos will be anything like the "show" that Neal and others attended in NYC last fall?...hmm makes you wonder. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- Subscribe send an email to amstereo-subscribe@topica.com _______________________________________________________ From evergreenterrace@buzzle.com Tue Jan 07 15:35:07 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: evergreenterrace@buzzle.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 7 Jan 2003 23:35:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 78562 invoked from network); 7 Jan 2003 23:35:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Jan 2003 23:35:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.86) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Jan 2003 23:35:06 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.187] by n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 07 Jan 2003 23:35:06 -0000 Date: Tue, 07 Jan 2003 23:35:05 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: WOR listeners say no to IBOC hash Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1089 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgliradio " X-Originating-IP: 170.20.11.59 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=69711087 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgliradio --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: > > Do you actually think IBOC played any role? Please. > > Frankly, yes, I do! Having personally listened to WOR on the > narrowest of my narrow-band radios and the crappiest of my crappy > radios, they always sound worse than all of their major competitors > on the dial -- WFAN, WABC, WCBS, etc. > Yes, I agree it sounds bad, but the average listener probably doesn't notice! Plus, for MOST of the fall book (if not all), WOR was broadcasting in the more listenable 6.2 K bandwidth. > > And FWIW, I heard from one employee of an electric utility company in > central NJ. He got a call from a customer who reported "power line > interference" that was mysteriously happening around WOR's signal > during the daytime. I wonder how this customer felt when he told > them that WOR is actually *transmitting* this interference! I still don't think the average moron would notice. I mean, listen to all those clippy FM's that get good numbers in NYC and other major markets. From philipr@irac.pe.ca Tue Jan 07 16:12:07 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Jan 2003 00:12:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 73607 invoked from network); 8 Jan 2003 00:12:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Jan 2003 00:12:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.64) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Jan 2003 00:12:07 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.130] by n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 08 Jan 2003 00:12:07 -0000 Date: Wed, 08 Jan 2003 00:12:05 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: Ooh, I'm scared... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <117.1d44873b.2b4cb5d3@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3101 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.166.158.82 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking Hear hear! It would be easy to generalize and say that modern AM radios don't go above 3000 Hz. Then, I buy a Phillips boombox that goes up to 5500 hz. Chris comes accross a Memmorex at target that goes way up, and easily converts to stereo. GE SR IIIs are still made, and go up higher [wideband] than FM can! And so on, and so on...The fact of the matter is that there really isn't a typical AM radio anymore. It doesn't make a lot of sense to degrade your audio quality, even if it is only noticed on 25% of your listeners radios, for the sake of a broadcast method where there are NO consumer receivers available. In a move to make a truly portable IBOC receiver, I understand that Ibiquity has fitted it with 3 wheels. After a disatrous focus group experience, the decision was made to add a 4 HP Briggs and Stratton. Now that's portable! To even contemplate broadcasting all day in IBOC, without any consumer radios, even prototypes which could be given to employees and major sponsors, seems to make little business sense. IBOC consumer radios are likely 2 to 3 years away - does it really make sense to offer 5khz audio for that long, when nobody is listening to IBOC? Phil R. --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, KC4QLP@a... wrote: > In a message dated 1/5/03 11:30:12 PM Eastern Standard Time, > possumhunter@n... writes: > > << I want to know the makes and models of the "Typical AM radios" that were > used in the IBiquity tests for IBOC QRM. > > Kevin > >> > I dont have the URL handy..but if you look back through the old messages on > the list you'll find the URL I posted on the where you can find the test > results and on which receivers were used.The statement made by one of those > IBOC proponent engineers ...herein called "crackhead" stated and I paraphase > {exact details is also on a past message on this list}..that every make and > model radio made was tested". This has since been found to be false.I have > since determined that there have been many "mis statements"made by this > "crackhead" so since then I have choosen to ignore this "crackhead" and > anything that he has to say. > > Any so called professional that is dignified in any sort of manor does not > make overly generalized statements.Over generalizing certainly spells > disaster in maintaining ones creditability. > > Bob Carter > Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group > > WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 > Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 > > Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering > services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. > e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@e... > Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC > WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC > WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC > > AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- > Subscribe send an email to amstereo-subscribe@t... > _______________________________________________________ From florida_amstereo@hotmail.com Tue Jan 07 18:42:35 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: florida_amstereo@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Jan 2003 02:42:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 33967 invoked from network); 8 Jan 2003 02:42:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Jan 2003 02:42:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.37.21) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Jan 2003 02:42:33 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 7 Jan 2003 18:31:27 -0800 Received: from 209.240.198.61 by pv2fd.pav2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Wed, 08 Jan 2003 02:31:25 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, amstereo@bellsouth.net Bcc: Subject: more media deregulation Date: Wed, 08 Jan 2003 02:31:25 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 08 Jan 2003 02:31:27.0960 (UTC) FILETIME=[0BE82580:01C2B6BE] From: "Donn Tillman" X-Originating-IP: [209.240.198.61] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83914824 I find it interesting that something that has national implictations, is only being given one pubic hearing nationwide. Can you say "rairoaded"? excerpts from today's New York Times: ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ The New York Times New York, New York Tuesday, January 7, 2003 All News Media Inc. By BILL KOVACH and TOM ROSENSTIEL WASHINGTON Without much notice, the federal government is moving toward the most sweeping change ever in the rules that govern ownership of the American news media. This shift could reduce the independence of the news media and the ability of Americans to take part in public debate. Yet because of meager press coverage and steps taken by the Federal Communications Commission in its policy-making process, most people probably have no idea that it is taking place. Though those rules have been relaxed in the last 20 years, companies are still blocked from buying a newspaper and television station in the same city or from owning more than one TV station in the same market. Three weeks after it proposed eliminating those rules, the F.C.C. released a series of reports about the current media marketplace. But the reports focused almost entirely on the economic impact of relaxing the ownership rules. They largely ignore the public's interest in a diverse and independent press. The F.C.C. argues that technologies like the Internet offer Americans access to more information than ever and thus worries about monopolies are unfounded. But studies also show that most Americans receive their news from a handful of outlets. Beyond this, much of what appears on the Internet is repackaged from those outlets. The number of operations that gather original news is small and now may become smaller. The question of concentration is most acute at the local level. In most communities, even those with television and radio stations, the vast range of activities are covered by only one institution, the local newspaper. What will happen to communities if the ownership rules are eliminated? Among the possibilities is that one or two companies in each town would have an effective monopoly on reaching consumers by being allowed to control the newspaper, radio, TV, billboards and more — with costly consequences for businesses that need those outlets for advertising. Such a monopoly on information would also reduce the diversity of cultural and political discourse in a community. The precedent in radio is telling. Since the rules on ownership of radio were last relaxed in 1996, the two biggest companies went from owning 130 stations to more than 1,400. The F.C.C. chairman, Michael K. Powell, has scheduled only one public hearing, in Richmond, Va., on the proposal, and the public comment period will close at the end of this month. It is a small and brief opportunity, but one that the public should seize if it cherishes an independent press. Bill Kovach is chairman of the Committee of Concerned Journalists. Tom Rosenstiel is director of the Project for Excellence in Journalism. Copyright 2003 The New York Times Company All News Media Inc. Included Page: All News Media Inc _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Jan 07 18:44:18 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Jan 2003 02:44:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 58696 invoked from network); 8 Jan 2003 02:44:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Jan 2003 02:44:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.66) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Jan 2003 02:44:18 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.139] by n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 08 Jan 2003 02:44:18 -0000 Date: Wed, 08 Jan 2003 02:44:17 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: IBOC's narrow-bandwidth *digital* audio Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1185 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.94.18 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Hear hear! It would be easy to generalize and say that modern AM > radios don't go above 3000 Hz. Interestingly, even IBOC's *digital* audio has little frequency response above 4 kHz! Here is the spectrum analysis of the latest IBOC digital audio sample from WOR: http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/wor-dig.gif As you can see, it drops off quite sharply above 4.2 kHz or so, and then again starts gradually dropping off above 9 kHz, with the "stair-stepping" of the synthesized treble quite obvious above 11 kHz. This audio clip consists of a commercial (with music) followed by normal talk show voice audio. On a "live" graph, it shows very little useable frequency response above 12 to 13 kHz during the music, and the main voice audio is quite obviously focused on the < 4 kHz range, with sibilants only extending up to 8 or 9 kHz. So, especially with voice, a good wide-bandwidth AMAX radio tuned to a regular analog AM station -- mono or Stereo -- will actually sound more bright, crisp, and "hi-fi" than the digital IBOC audio -- and that's not even taking into consideration the wishy-washy, RealAudio- like digital compression "artifacts" in the sound. From dwtpa97@earthlink.net Tue Jan 07 19:38:31 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dwtpa97@earthlink.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Jan 2003 03:38:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 89413 invoked from network); 8 Jan 2003 03:38:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Jan 2003 03:38:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO snipe.mail.pas.earthlink.net) (207.217.120.62) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Jan 2003 03:38:29 -0000 Received: from sdn-ap-013scfairp0165.dialsprint.net ([63.183.128.165] helo=earthlink.net) by snipe.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 18W72x-0000rp-00 for amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com; Tue, 07 Jan 2003 19:38:28 -0800 Message-ID: <3E1B9D67.B02935D6@earthlink.net> Date: Tue, 07 Jan 2003 22:39:19 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.79 [en]C-CCK-MCD NSCPCD472 (Windows NT 5.0; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} more media deregulation References: From: dwtpa97 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38076959 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable It's alarming, but the public is stupid and unfortunately usually gets what= it deserves. I am finding it increasingly more difficult to vote for either party, for different reasons= . The Republicans are too far to the right and are owned by Big Business; the Democrats are too far to th= e left and are dominated by numerically obscure leftist special interest groups. I almost feel like to= ssing a coin at election time. (Just soapboxing!) Take care, Dick Donn Tillman wrote: > I find it interesting that something that has national implictations, is > only being given one pubic hearing nationwide. > > Can you say "rairoaded"? > > excerpts from today's New York Times: > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > The New York Times > New York, New York > Tuesday, January 7, 2003 > All News Media Inc. > By BILL KOVACH and TOM ROSENSTIEL > WASHINGTON > Without much notice, the federal government is moving toward the most > sweeping change ever in the rules that govern ownership of the American n= ews > media. > > This shift could reduce the independence of the news media and the abilit= y > of Americans to take part in public debate. > Yet because of meager press coverage and steps taken by the Federal > Communications Commission in its policy-making process, most people proba= bly > have no idea that it is taking place. > > Though those rules have been relaxed in the last 20 years, companies are > still blocked from buying a newspaper and television station in the same > city or from owning more than one TV station in the same market. > > Three weeks after it proposed eliminating those rules, the F.C.C. release= d a > series of reports about the current media marketplace. > But the reports focused almost entirely on the economic impact of relaxin= g > the ownership rules. They largely ignore the public's interest in a diver= se > and independent press. > > The F.C.C. argues that technologies like the Internet offer Americans acc= ess > to more information than ever and thus worries about monopolies are > unfounded. > > But studies also show that most Americans receive their news from a handf= ul > of outlets. Beyond this, much of what appears on the Internet is repackag= ed > from those outlets. The number of operations that gather original news is > small and now may become smaller. > > The question of concentration is most acute at the local level. In most > communities, even those with television and radio stations, the vast rang= e > of activities are covered by only one institution, the local newspaper. > > What will happen to communities if the ownership rules are eliminated? Am= ong > the possibilities is that one or two companies in each town would have an > effective monopoly on reaching consumers by being allowed to control the > newspaper, radio, TV, billboards and more =97 with costly consequences fo= r > businesses that need those outlets for advertising. > > Such a monopoly on information would also reduce the diversity of cultura= l > and political discourse in a community. > The precedent in radio is telling. Since the rules on ownership of radio > were last relaxed in 1996, the two biggest companies went from owning 130 > stations to more than > 1,400. > > The F.C.C. chairman, Michael K. Powell, has scheduled only one public > hearing, in Richmond, Va., on the proposal, and the public comment period > will close at the end of this month. > > It is a small and brief opportunity, but one that the public should seize= if > it cherishes an independent press. > > Bill Kovach is chairman of the Committee of Concerned Journalists. Tom > Rosenstiel is director of the Project for Excellence in Journalism. > > Copyright 2003 The New York Times Company > > HREF=3D"http://www.nytimes.com/2003/01/07/opinion/07KOVA.html?ex=3D104298= 1686&ei=3D1&en=3D5fc3682687a449ff">All > News Media Inc. > Included Page: All News Media Inc > > _________________________________________________________________ > MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE* > http://join.msn.com/?page=3Dfeatures/virus > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From dwtpa97@earthlink.net Tue Jan 07 19:44:52 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dwtpa97@earthlink.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Jan 2003 03:44:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 66721 invoked from network); 8 Jan 2003 03:44:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Jan 2003 03:44:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO snipe.mail.pas.earthlink.net) (207.217.120.62) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Jan 2003 03:44:51 -0000 Received: from sdn-ap-013scfairp0165.dialsprint.net ([63.183.128.165] helo=earthlink.net) by snipe.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 18W797-0001CQ-00 for amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com; Tue, 07 Jan 2003 19:44:50 -0800 Message-ID: <3E1B9EE5.BCD8C509@earthlink.net> Date: Tue, 07 Jan 2003 22:45:41 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.79 [en]C-CCK-MCD NSCPCD472 (Windows NT 5.0; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} more media deregulation References: From: dwtpa97 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38076959 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I apologize to the AMSF group for my last post being an off-topic message. = I thought I was replying privately to one of the members. Dick Donn Tillman wrote: > I find it interesting that something that has national implictations, is > only being given one pubic hearing nationwide. > > Can you say "rairoaded"? > > excerpts from today's New York Times: > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > The New York Times > New York, New York > Tuesday, January 7, 2003 > All News Media Inc. > By BILL KOVACH and TOM ROSENSTIEL > WASHINGTON > Without much notice, the federal government is moving toward the most > sweeping change ever in the rules that govern ownership of the American n= ews > media. > > This shift could reduce the independence of the news media and the abilit= y > of Americans to take part in public debate. > Yet because of meager press coverage and steps taken by the Federal > Communications Commission in its policy-making process, most people proba= bly > have no idea that it is taking place. > > Though those rules have been relaxed in the last 20 years, companies are > still blocked from buying a newspaper and television station in the same > city or from owning more than one TV station in the same market. > > Three weeks after it proposed eliminating those rules, the F.C.C. release= d a > series of reports about the current media marketplace. > But the reports focused almost entirely on the economic impact of relaxin= g > the ownership rules. They largely ignore the public's interest in a diver= se > and independent press. > > The F.C.C. argues that technologies like the Internet offer Americans acc= ess > to more information than ever and thus worries about monopolies are > unfounded. > > But studies also show that most Americans receive their news from a handf= ul > of outlets. Beyond this, much of what appears on the Internet is repackag= ed > from those outlets. The number of operations that gather original news is > small and now may become smaller. > > The question of concentration is most acute at the local level. In most > communities, even those with television and radio stations, the vast rang= e > of activities are covered by only one institution, the local newspaper. > > What will happen to communities if the ownership rules are eliminated? Am= ong > the possibilities is that one or two companies in each town would have an > effective monopoly on reaching consumers by being allowed to control the > newspaper, radio, TV, billboards and more =97 with costly consequences fo= r > businesses that need those outlets for advertising. > > Such a monopoly on information would also reduce the diversity of cultura= l > and political discourse in a community. > The precedent in radio is telling. Since the rules on ownership of radio > were last relaxed in 1996, the two biggest companies went from owning 130 > stations to more than > 1,400. > > The F.C.C. chairman, Michael K. Powell, has scheduled only one public > hearing, in Richmond, Va., on the proposal, and the public comment period > will close at the end of this month. > > It is a small and brief opportunity, but one that the public should seize= if > it cherishes an independent press. > > Bill Kovach is chairman of the Committee of Concerned Journalists. Tom > Rosenstiel is director of the Project for Excellence in Journalism. > > Copyright 2003 The New York Times Company > > HREF=3D"http://www.nytimes.com/2003/01/07/opinion/07KOVA.html?ex=3D104298= 1686&ei=3D1&en=3D5fc3682687a449ff">All > News Media Inc. > Included Page: All News Media Inc > > _________________________________________________________________ > MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE* > http://join.msn.com/?page=3Dfeatures/virus > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Tue Jan 07 20:37:00 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Jan 2003 04:37:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 40028 invoked from network); 8 Jan 2003 04:36:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Jan 2003 04:36:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14205.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.151) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Jan 2003 04:36:59 -0000 Message-ID: <20030108043659.10548.qmail@web14205.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.127.54.111] by web14205.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 07 Jan 2003 20:36:59 PST Date: Tue, 7 Jan 2003 20:36:59 -0800 (PST) Subject: The Whole sad IBOC story To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio If any of our Congressmen or Congresswomen, or the FCC and its chairman really care at all about our valuable USA radio spectrum (and not just for sale to the highest bidder), perhaps they will review this outsiders view of the huge mistake the FCC is making with shoving IBOC down our throats, just like they are doing with HDTV: http://www.kuro5hin.org/story/2003/1/6/103819/9665 __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From possumhunter@netzero.net Tue Jan 07 22:00:12 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Jan 2003 06:00:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 76066 invoked from network); 8 Jan 2003 06:00:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Jan 2003 06:00:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.205) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Jan 2003 06:00:11 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 7 Jan 2003 22:00:11 -0800 To: Cc: Subject: Fw: [AM740] Special QSL from CHWO - AM 740 Date: Wed, 8 Jan 2003 00:59:54 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 08 Jan 2003 06:00:11.0866 (UTC) FILETIME=[34BC8BA0:01C2B6DB] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.166.232.31] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Brian Smith" To: Sent: Tuesday, January 07, 2003 7:20 PM Subject: [AM740] Special QSL from CHWO - AM 740 > One last reminder that tomorrow on January 8, 2003, radio station CHWO AM 740 - Prime Time Radio > will be celebrating it's second anniversary and to commemorate this birthday, the station and the > Ontario DX Association will be issuing a special QSL for reports made on January 8, 2003 only. > > To received the special 2nd Anniversary CHWO AM 740 QSL card: > > *Station must be heard on January 8, 2003 from 0000 to 2359 (EST) > > *Time you heard the transmission (local or UTC); > > *Program Material (at least 10 minutes of specific program material heard: i.e., name of announcer, > commercials heard, news items etc.); > > *Signal/Sound Report, (a general overview of how well you heard the signal at your location and the > sound quality of the program). > > *Mention of the type of equipment and antenna you were using to hear the signal is helpful > information as well. > > All reception reports and comments for the station may be sent to: > > Brian Smith > QSL Manager for AM740 > Box 161, Willowdale Stn A, > Toronto, Ontario > Canada M2N 5S8 > > or email to am740@rogers.com / Tapes also accepted for QSL > > Thank you and good listening. > > Brian > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > AM740-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > From amfmdx@fastq.com Wed Jan 08 06:45:50 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Jan 2003 14:45:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 73224 invoked from network); 8 Jan 2003 14:45:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Jan 2003 14:45:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Jan 2003 14:45:49 -0000 Received: from fastq (d207-osel-phx.fastq.com [207.173.146.196]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id h08EjmP68720 for ; Wed, 8 Jan 2003 07:45:49 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <004301c2b724$a1ad73c0$c492adcf@com> To: Subject: KUET has flipped formats Date: Wed, 8 Jan 2003 07:45:46 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla 710 KUET is no more.... Its now KMIA and uses the slogans Radio Siete Diez and La Consentida plus they still have a stereo pilot. Kevin Mesa, Arizona "Its going to get a lot worse before it gets worse" - Lily Tomlin From mwradio@gmx.net Wed Jan 08 06:48:08 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: mwradio@gmx.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Jan 2003 14:48:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 54939 invoked from network); 8 Jan 2003 14:48:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Jan 2003 14:48:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m2.ispmail.dnbsi.com) (198.136.194.44) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Jan 2003 14:48:08 -0000 Received: from espositojm2 (0-1pool197-5.nas11.philadelphia1.pa.us.da.qwest.net [65.128.197.5]) by m2.ispmail.dnbsi.com (Postfix) with SMTP id E331FC73C6E for ; Wed, 8 Jan 2003 06:48:05 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <007401c2b724$f2fa70c0$06630780@espositojm2> To: References: <20030108043659.10548.qmail@web14205.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} The Whole sad IBOC story Date: Wed, 8 Jan 2003 09:48:01 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Joe Esposito" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=93604673 X-Yahoo-Profile: espositojm I've got a simple solution. Why not leave all existing "over the air" analog systems alone and only allow digital formats (HDTV, IBOC,...etc.) to broadcast through cable, satellite or XM? Joe Esposito ----- Original Message ----- From: "John P." To: Sent: Tuesday, January 07, 2003 11:36 PM Subject: {AMSF} The Whole sad IBOC story > If any of our Congressmen or Congresswomen, or the FCC and its chairman really > care at all about our valuable USA radio spectrum (and not just for sale to the > highest bidder), perhaps they will review this outsiders view of the huge > mistake the FCC is making with shoving IBOC down our throats, just like they > are doing with HDTV: > > http://www.kuro5hin.org/story/2003/1/6/103819/9665 > > __________________________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. > http://mailplus.yahoo.com > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > From badlhoch@hotmail.com Wed Jan 08 07:02:40 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: badlhoch@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Jan 2003 15:02:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 50278 invoked from network); 8 Jan 2003 15:02:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Jan 2003 15:02:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (216.33.237.159) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Jan 2003 15:02:35 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 8 Jan 2003 07:02:35 -0800 Received: from 136.1.1.154 by lw7fd.law7.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Wed, 08 Jan 2003 15:02:34 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Subject: Re: {AMSF} The Whole sad IBOC story Date: Wed, 08 Jan 2003 10:02:34 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 08 Jan 2003 15:02:35.0120 (UTC) FILETIME=[FA070700:01C2B726] From: "Bill Adlhoch" X-Originating-IP: [136.1.1.154] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=59104360 because "over the air" is FREE; and cable/sat/XM are pay services, I love getting HDTV via my roof antenna without any subscription FEES ----Original Message Follows---- From: "Joe Esposito" Reply-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com To: Subject: Re: {AMSF} The Whole sad IBOC story Date: Wed, 8 Jan 2003 09:48:01 -0500 I've got a simple solution. Why not leave all existing "over the air" analog systems alone and only allow digital formats (HDTV, IBOC,...etc.) to broadcast through cable, satellite or XM? Joe Esposito _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 helps eliminate e-mail viruses. Get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus From narkspud@hotmail.com Wed Jan 08 08:59:11 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: narkspud@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Jan 2003 16:59:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 43451 invoked from network); 8 Jan 2003 16:59:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Jan 2003 16:59:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Jan 2003 16:59:09 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.191] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 08 Jan 2003 16:59:09 -0000 Date: Wed, 08 Jan 2003 16:59:08 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: KNX Stereo Commercials Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 487 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "narkspud " X-Originating-IP: 67.89.146.146 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=81956306 X-Yahoo-Profile: narkspud It's always frosted me that KNX (News 1070 LA) airs all their commercials in 100% mono on their otherwise wonderful-sounding AM Stereo signal. Only the bumper music has been stereo. Well apparently that's finally coming to an end. I've been listening at work on my TM-152 this morning, and I've heard full separation on some of the commercials. They really jump out at you! Hopefully it will spread to the rest of them. Good job, guys. Now. . .KLAC, HOW 'BOUT IT? narkspud From michaelj@vcn.com Wed Jan 08 09:04:19 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Jan 2003 17:04:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 11990 invoked from network); 8 Jan 2003 17:04:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Jan 2003 17:04:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m1-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Jan 2003 17:04:17 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m1-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Wed, 8 Jan 2003 10:04:17 -0700 Message-ID: <012e01c2b737$f81c8c60$0701010a@keva> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} KNX Stereo Commercials Date: Wed, 8 Jan 2003 10:04:12 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I'll second that!! It's been wonderful to hear commercials and even news sounders and stuff in full stereo on KNX! It just goes to show how stereo can even enhance an all news station. Look at TV. Most TV stations are in stereo these days. Yet most TV is talk. But it's still wonderful to get commercials, program themes, etc in (((stereo))). KLAC? Uh......chances are pretty low. They're ClearChannel, aren't they? If they are then I'm pretty sure the chance is ZERO that they'll ever be stereo. If not, then MAYBE there's a chance. I know you guys in cali can confirm this....but was KLAC ever stereo? Sure would be a lot easier if they were at one time.....then they already HAVE the equipment and they just need to turn it on :) MJR n WYO ----- Original Message ----- From: narkspud To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, January 08, 2003 9:59 AM Subject: {AMSF} KNX Stereo Commercials It's always frosted me that KNX (News 1070 LA) airs all their commercials in 100% mono on their otherwise wonderful-sounding AM Stereo signal. Only the bumper music has been stereo. Well apparently that's finally coming to an end. I've been listening at work on my TM-152 this morning, and I've heard full separation on some of the commercials. They really jump out at you! Hopefully it will spread to the rest of them. Good job, guys. Now. . .KLAC, HOW 'BOUT IT? narkspud [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From penry@nortelnetworks.com Wed Jan 08 11:40:27 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: penry@nortelnetworks.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Jan 2003 19:40:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 46173 invoked from network); 8 Jan 2003 19:40:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Jan 2003 19:40:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO zsc3s004.nortelnetworks.com) (47.81.138.65) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Jan 2003 19:40:27 -0000 Received: from zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com (zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com [47.103.122.112]) by zsc3s004.nortelnetworks.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id h08JeP600022 for ; Wed, 8 Jan 2003 11:40:25 -0800 (PST) Received: from zrc2c011.us.nortel.com (zrc2c011.us.nortel.com [47.103.120.51]) by zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id h08Jebd06958 for ; Wed, 8 Jan 2003 13:40:38 -0600 (CST) Received: by zrc2c011.us.nortel.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Wed, 8 Jan 2003 13:40:25 -0600 Message-ID: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A560797404C9F1BD@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: {AMSF} Chinese Translator, was Almost there... Date: Wed, 8 Jan 2003 13:40:23 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) From: "Charles Penry" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=376233 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa5vhu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit CC, I work with a few people from China that might be willing to provide some translation work. Let me know and I will talk to them. Charles -----Original Message----- From: Christopher Cuff [mailto:ccuff@in4web.com] Sent: Wednesday, January 01, 2003 5:02 PM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Almost there... I agree Scott- As for the "lites", I have these under control. What we need is a contact that can speak Chinese and get some radios made over there. I know I wanted to see USA made radios, or Japanese, but to get mass produced radios to the public is going to HAVE to come from China. I can get a nearly endless supply of decoder IC's (100,000 of the 13028's alone) But asembly is going to have to be in China. Maybe advertising to find someone that is fluent in Chinese is a way to go. It's either that, or it is going to go even faster downhill. Chris ----- Original Message ----- From: Scott Todd To: Sent: Tuesday, December 31, 2002 11:49 PM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Almost there... > I've got an idea you've probably not considered- leave the making of Alfredo > Lites to Chris, and you can work on the receiver end Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From philipr@irac.pe.ca Wed Jan 08 12:12:27 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 8 Jan 2003 20:12:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 6817 invoked from network); 8 Jan 2003 20:12:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Jan 2003 20:12:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.89) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Jan 2003 20:12:25 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.249] by n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 08 Jan 2003 20:12:25 -0000 Date: Wed, 08 Jan 2003 20:12:22 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: A "dissertation" on the latest CRTC AM/FM Flip decision Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 7247 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking The CRTC has today granted approval for CJFX Antigonish to flip from 25,000 watts AM Stereo on 580 khz to FM by upgrading its 2,750 watt FM transmitter site on 98.9 mhz [Class B] to 75,390 watts also on 98.9 mhz [Class C1]. The 2,750 watt FM site was placed in service in December 1998 to address a major null in CJFX's western coverage area, exacerbated by CJFX's power increase from 10,000 to 25,000 watts in 1991. Sometimes more equals less, at least in certain directions! In 1998, as part of the decision to allow the 2,750 watt FM operation - originally approved as 1900 watts but with more height, the CRTC noted that it expected CJFX to convert to exclusive FM operation, at maximum Class B parameters, no later than August 2004. As a point of interest, CJFX has broadcast on 580 khz since it first signed on in March 1943; initially at 1000 watts, then 5000 watts [Marconi transmitter] in the late 40s, then 10,000 watts in the mid 60s [RCA, then Nautel in the early 80s], then 25,000 watts [Nautel] and AM Stereo in 1991. In the CRTC's decision released today, it was revealed that the CBC had intervened against this application, suggesting that CJFX be restricted to Class B maximum parameters [with the height involved, roughly 210 metre EHAAT, my rough calculations "guesstimate" this would have been roughly 28,000 watts ERP. Those of you on the list who growl about NPR will also shake your heads at the CBC's approach to frequency management: www.crtc.gc.ca/archive/ENG/Decisions/2003/db2003-7.htm This is rather ironic, as CJFX for many years served as a CBC affiliate, and the CBC could have shown a little consideration for the faithful service it received from CJFX between 1943 and the early 1980s. I can vividly remember the many complaints in the 1970s that my father, Bruce Rafuse, [then General Manager, at CJFX] received about the profanities uttered regularly on late night CBC spoken word programs, such as "Anthology". Being a CBC affiliate was a condition of license in those days, not an option. The CBC's approach reflected in today's decision certainly seems petty, and the CRTC showed very wise judgement in rejecting the CBC intervention. This decision certainly reinforces the CBC's reputation as a frequency spectrum hog. My review of the comparitive coverage contours indicates a significant improvement in CJFX's coverage in parts of the Nova Scotia mainland and a major improvement in coverage on Prince Edward Island. There will be a modest decrease in coverage along Nova Scotia's eastern shore, especially noted in the most easterly portions of the Halifax Regional Municipality. According to the contour map, there will be a significant decrease in coverage on Cape Breton Island, long a CJFX bastion of listeners and supporters, and where a significant portion of its approximately 300 shareholders reside. For AM to FM flips, the CRTC appears to rely on the 5 mv/m and 15 mv/m contours of the existing AM operation, and compares them to the 0.5 mv/m and 3 mv/m contours of the proposed FM station. This provides a reasonable basis of comparison in urban and suburban "built up" areas - however, many rural areas receive satisfactory service within an AM station's 0.5 mv/m contour. It all boils down to the extent of electrical interference - the lower frequencies of the AM dial have the disadvantage of being more prone to man made interference, power lines, light dimmers and the like, while enjoying the advantage of excellant ground wave characteristics. However, the 0.5 mv/m contour is not part of the submission to the CRTC for AM to FM flips. Accordingly, some rural listeners could lose radio service, unless they put up fairly elaborate outside FM Yagi receiving antennas on towers of a decent height - not a practical option for the average car or truck, and not cheap for the average home or business! No doubt, there will be areas where the FM coverage will significantly exceed the stated coverage contours, especially beyond open water. Thus, the PEI signal is likely to be even better than predicted, and coverage in northwestern Cape Breton will likely be much better than the contour maps indicate. In other areas, the coverage may be worse than predicted. It is difficult to believe that the coverage in central and eastern Cape Breton will be better than indicated on the contour maps, given the very rugged terrain present in western Cape Breton. The picturesque beauty of steep hills and green valleys also contributes to two of FM's great weaknesses: signal shadowing and multipath distortion. Although this latest "flip" represents a loss of yet another AM Stereo station, some listeners may be more concerned with recent format and personnel changes at CJFX resulting from a consultant inspired reaction to increased competition from its primary competitor, The Hawk [official call letters still CIGO] as well as purported demographic changes. CJFX, although AM Stereo continuously since 1991, never agressively promoted AM Stereo in spite of its new state-of-the-art 25,000 watt AM Stereo transmitter site 13 km north of the Town of Antigonish. CJFX demonstrated in the last dozen years that AM Stereo was no barrier to a good signal, as listeners in Newfoundland and Labrador were well aware. Many DXers in England, France and Scandinavia enjoyed tuning in to CJFX, as can be verified on a quick Google search on the web. AM to FM flips sometimes prove to be wise decisions: CIGO made a very successful flip from 10,000 watts on 1410 to 19,000 watts on 101.5 with a significant improvement in coverage, thus proving that a flip from AM to FM can improve coverage, just as CJFX's flip from AM to FM may prove that coverage can suffer significantly in some key directions. Certainly, the FM contour maps suggest this to be the case. A drive from Antigonish to Sydney Mines along the Trans- Canada Highway 105 should make for an interesting evaluation, once the FM power is at 75,390 watts and testing has been complete. Accordingly, very soon, the sole AM Stereo voice in Nova Scotia [unless seemingly stereo reception of CKDH is not falsing] will be CJCH, as CJLS recently received approval for a flip to FM. Ottawa area readers take note - expect CFRA to apply for approval to change from 50kw day, 10kw night to 50kw day and night. During the great Montreal-Ottawa ice storm of 2000, CFRA sought and received permission to do this on a temporary, emergency basis. With 50 kw at night, CFRA punches a pretty decent signal into eastern Canada. CFRA is, as I understand it, still AM Stereo. I suspect the CHUM Group will be pleased with today's CRTC decision! Phil R. This submission is presented pursuant to paragraph 2(b) of the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms, viz. "freedom of thought, belief, opinion and expression, including freedom of the press and other media of communication" and is to be construed and interpreted as a complete writing, and not interpreted or construed on the basis of selective quotes. Any reproduction, in whole or in part, is strictly prohibited without the express permission of the author. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Wed Jan 08 16:59:06 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 9 Jan 2003 00:59:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 26265 invoked from network); 9 Jan 2003 00:59:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Jan 2003 00:59:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.86) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Jan 2003 00:59:06 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.179] by n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 09 Jan 2003 00:59:05 -0000 Date: Thu, 09 Jan 2003 00:59:04 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: 570 KLAC Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <012e01c2b737$f81c8c60$0701010a@keva> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1441 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.89.10 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > KLAC? Uh......chances are pretty low. They're ClearChannel, > aren't they? If they are then I'm pretty sure the chance is ZERO > that they'll ever be stereo. 570 KLAC is owned by Clear Channel, and during their previous Adult standards music format, they were AM Stereo until December 19, 1998, when it was shut off, with claims that it was to prepare for IBOC testing. I've never heard of KLAC having anything to do with IBOC, so essentially since then they've just been a mono station. But, with the flip back to music, there might still be hope for a return to AM Stereo as long as the equipment is still there and is still in good working condition. Clear-Channel-owned 960 KABL and 920 WOKY have both had good success at running Adult Standards formats in full AM Stereo, so you never know if KLAC will also once again transmit a Stereo signal. As of yet, Clear Channel has been both critical and supportive of IBOC; say what you will about their policies and practices, but they *are* keenly bottom-line-oriented, so while they do see the promise of what IBOC is claiming, they don't want to sink big money into switching their stations to IBOC if it turns out to be a failure. I think some of their biggest AM stations, like 640 KFI, *may* give IBOC a try -- as indeed 700 WLW already is -- but otherwise I think their smaller and less directly profitable stations will have a more "wait-and-see" approach. From n0uiheric@aol.com Wed Jan 08 17:06:33 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 9 Jan 2003 01:06:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 78338 invoked from network); 9 Jan 2003 01:06:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Jan 2003 01:06:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r02.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.98) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Jan 2003 01:06:33 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-r02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.1a8.efcc44b (16633) for ; Wed, 8 Jan 2003 20:06:29 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1a8.efcc44b.2b4e2515@aol.com> Date: Wed, 8 Jan 2003 20:06:29 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} more media deregulation To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih The commercial broadcast industry (especially the illegal monopolies like Clear Channel, Infinity, Cumulus and Citadel) only THINKS the American public is stupid. They just aren't giving the public what it wants. Big Business should be BANNED from owning media outlets permanently (which is constitutional, under the First Amendment of the U.S. Constitution). I think the commercial broadcast industry (especially corporate radio) should embrace the same high programming standards that NPR has excelled at for years. The commercial broadcast industry still operates under the incorrect assumption that the average American still has only an eighth-grade education. The average American now has a high school education; more and more Americans are college-educated. Why don't they go for the highest common denominator possible, instead of continuing to do dumbed-down programming for a shrinking least common denominator. I think on-air talent (especially disc jockeys) should follow the same code of ethics as journalists, in my honest opinion. The media is purely to blame for what many people have called "the dumbing down of America". The United States, for the most part, should be ashamed of it's commercial broadcast industry. Further media deregulation will mean more and more corporate broadcasters will continue to pervert and subvert the First Amendment to satisfy their greed, and more people will be thrown out of work. It's something that America's economy doesn't need. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From kevtronics@yahoo.com Wed Jan 08 17:35:11 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 9 Jan 2003 01:35:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 83748 invoked from network); 9 Jan 2003 01:35:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Jan 2003 01:35:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Jan 2003 01:35:10 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.159] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 09 Jan 2003 01:35:10 -0000 Date: Thu, 09 Jan 2003 01:35:09 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Message from R.Disney 1110's engineer Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 697 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.89.10 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics This is from the Broadcasting Professionals Forum on CompuServe... Subj: LA AM Stereo Change From: Chris Hays ALT Sysop 76703,4257 To: Kevin Tekel [AM Stereo] 76362,2023 Date: 02-Jan-03 01:19 Kevin, FYI: KSPN and KDIS in Los Angeles switched frequencies the first of the year. KDIS (Radio Disney) is now 1110 am, and in stereo (better... newer transmitter and equipment at this site). KSPN 710 (ESPN Radio) will be mono. You might want to update any lists you have input into. An interesting sidebar: we were on the verge of taking it IBOC until Ibiquity and others discovered we had an NRSC agreement with our second adjacent Mexican (Xeprs 1090). Draw your own conclusions. Chris From evergreenterrace@buzzle.com Wed Jan 08 17:47:52 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: evergreenterrace@buzzle.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 9 Jan 2003 01:47:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 25290 invoked from network); 9 Jan 2003 01:47:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Jan 2003 01:47:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.75) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Jan 2003 01:47:51 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.145] by n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 09 Jan 2003 01:47:51 -0000 Date: Thu, 09 Jan 2003 01:47:49 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Message from R.Disney 1110's engineer Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 403 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgliradio " X-Originating-IP: 170.20.11.59 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=69711087 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgliradio --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: > > An interesting sidebar: we were on the verge of taking it IBOC until > Ibiquity and others discovered we had an NRSC agreement with our > second adjacent Mexican (Xeprs 1090). Draw your own conclusions. > > Chris Conclusion: IBOC is a joke. This is the first of many border AM comflicts on IBOC. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Wed Jan 08 18:47:34 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 9 Jan 2003 02:47:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 52804 invoked from network); 9 Jan 2003 02:47:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Jan 2003 02:47:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Jan 2003 02:47:33 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.143] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 09 Jan 2003 02:47:28 -0000 Date: Thu, 09 Jan 2003 02:47:27 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: NJ listeners switch from FM to AM, & WHLI ratings success Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1239 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.89.10 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics The Fall 2002 ratings for Trenton, NJ were released today, and they show an interesting result... local stronghold FM talk station "New Jersey 101.5" has taken a large drop in their ratings, while seemingly all of the listeners abandoning them -- and more -- switched over to AM talk stations: station... Spring 2002 rating -> Fall 2002 rating 101.5 WKXW-FM......... 9.1 -> 6.1 1210 WPHT AM Stereo... 0.0 -> 2.4 770 WABC.............. 0.0 -> 2.2 710 WOR............... 0.0 -> 2.0 Meanwhile on Long Island, daytime-only Adult Standards music station 1100 WHLI has made huge gains in their ratings all across the area... locally, they are now in third place, beating out all except two FM music stations, and over in Stamford/Norwalk, Connecticut they came out of nowhere (0.0) to show up tied for fifth place at 3.7! WHLI also showed significant gains in New York City, Bridgeport, CT, and even Monmouth/Ocean Counties in NJ, where they actually beat out one of two LOCAL Adult Standards stations. WHLI is unfortunately only mono, but they are a very good locally-run station nonetheless. They are owned by Barnstable, but I don't know if that necessarily implies any track record in regard to support for AM Stereo. From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Wed Jan 08 18:52:51 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 9 Jan 2003 02:52:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 98526 invoked from network); 9 Jan 2003 02:52:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Jan 2003 02:52:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14207.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.173.71) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Jan 2003 02:52:51 -0000 Message-ID: <20030109025251.17726.qmail@web14207.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.127.54.111] by web14207.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 08 Jan 2003 18:52:51 PST Date: Wed, 8 Jan 2003 18:52:51 -0800 (PST) Subject: AM Stereo fallacy Continues To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio This article about 'digital radio' is interesting, but last time I took a math class, 300 is more than 'only a few'. This joker believes that's how many Stereo AM stations remain. Care to correct his oversight? Article title: No matter which system wins, receivers' future looks digital __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From kevtronics@yahoo.com Wed Jan 08 19:54:45 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 9 Jan 2003 03:54:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 79440 invoked from network); 9 Jan 2003 03:54:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Jan 2003 03:54:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Jan 2003 03:54:45 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.248] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 09 Jan 2003 03:54:45 -0000 Date: Thu, 09 Jan 2003 03:54:40 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: AM Stereo fallacy Continues Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20030109025251.17726.qmail@web14207.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1936 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.89.10 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > No matter which system wins, receivers' future looks digital Cut and paste the URL together on one line to access: http://www.e-insite.net/ednmag/index.asp?layout=article&articleid= CA265497&pubdate=12%2F26%2F2002 More rubbish from this article: >>> "If nobody had mentioned the start of the digital transmissions on New York City's WOR (AM), the radio enthusiasts might never have known about them, because the HD Radio digital-sideband power levels on both AM and FM bands contain only about 1% of the energy in the analog signals." <<< Yeah, that must be why if you tune your radio to 700 or 720 kHz instead of 710, the resulting IBOC hash will be LOUDER than that of WOR's actual analog audio... and also why if you use the "Seek" or "Scan" function on a digital-tuning radio, it will stop on these adjacent channels instead of on 710 kHz. >>> "But the enthusiasts were warned, and, as soon as WOR switched on the digital signal, the hobbyists started to flood Internet newsgroups and mailing lists with howls of protest about muddy audio and hiss that allegedly interfered with reception of stations on adjacent channels." <<< As far as I know, nobody was "warned" and nobody was waiting to launch complaints "as soon as" WOR turned on the IBOC. Most of us discovered it ourselves when we tuned our AM dial anywhere between 680 and 750 kHz. And there is no "allegedly". Try listening to 690 WPHE or 740 WGSM anywhere within WOR's daytime coverage area and you'll be treated to various forms of hiss and splatter from WOR's IBOC signal, even on a typical narrow-bandwidth radio. >>> "the HD Radio receiver's digital channel has a pipeline, or processing, delay of approximately 4 seconds." <<< WOR's engineers say the delay of their IBOC signal is more like 8 to 9 seconds. I tend to believe their first-hand report, rather than whatever IBOC promo material this writer got his information from. From amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Wed Jan 08 21:22:31 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 46653 invoked from network); 9 Jan 2003 05:22:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Jan 2003 05:22:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Jan 2003 05:22:31 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: notify@yahoogroups.com Received: from [66.218.67.158] by n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 09 Jan 2003 05:22:31 -0000 Date: 9 Jan 2003 05:22:29 -0000 Message-ID: <1042089749.40346.88656.w37@yahoogroups.com> X-eGroups-Application: files X-Yahoo-Group-Post: system From: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: New file uploaded to amstereoforum MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello, This email message is a notification to let you know that a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the amstereoforum group. File : /1670stereo-2.mp3 Uploaded by : insomniaskunk Description : *Great* demo, recorded from SRF-42 on 01/08/03, 1670 AM WTDY. Really nice specimen, I think. You can access this file at the URL http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum/files/1670stereo-2.mp3 To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/files Regards, insomniaskunk From n0uiheric@aol.com Thu Jan 09 00:39:14 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 9 Jan 2003 08:39:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 74713 invoked from network); 9 Jan 2003 08:39:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Jan 2003 08:39:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m05.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.8) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Jan 2003 08:39:12 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-m05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.11e.1c61ef32 (30970) for ; Thu, 9 Jan 2003 03:39:07 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <11e.1c61ef32.2b4e8f2b@aol.com> Date: Thu, 9 Jan 2003 03:39:07 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM Stereo fallacy Continues To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih 300 is FAR MORE than "a few". There's four of them in my market alone! 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Jan 09 01:53:50 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 9 Jan 2003 09:53:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 21215 invoked from network); 9 Jan 2003 09:53:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Jan 2003 09:53:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Jan 2003 09:53:49 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.142] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 09 Jan 2003 09:53:49 -0000 Date: Thu, 09 Jan 2003 09:53:46 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: IBOC @ CES Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 381 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.89.10 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics Word has it that 840 KXNT will be iBiquity's demo IBOC station for the Consumer Electronics Show in Las Vegas -- to be held today (the 9th) through January 12th -- and has previously been heard testing IBOC on the air. I dare somebody to walk into the show with a Sony SRF-42 and a set of portable speakers, and give your own little demo of the IBOC hash for all to hear... From philipr@irac.pe.ca Thu Jan 09 05:06:16 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 9 Jan 2003 13:06:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 59148 invoked from network); 9 Jan 2003 13:06:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Jan 2003 13:06:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.64) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Jan 2003 13:06:15 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.147] by n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 09 Jan 2003 13:06:15 -0000 Date: Thu, 09 Jan 2003 13:06:13 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: IBOC @ CES Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 878 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking "Ah, but that is not a typical radio. A typical radio has to be certified as typical by iBiquity Corp. iBiquity Corp will certify that HD [aka IBOC] sounds good, so we don't need to worry our little heads over squishing sounds and synthesized treble. iBiquity is watching you!" Excerpts from the soon to be released best seller, 2004. George Orwell was off by 10 years. Phil R. In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: > Word has it that 840 KXNT will be iBiquity's demo IBOC station for > the Consumer Electronics Show in Las Vegas -- to be held today (the > 9th) through January 12th -- and has previously been heard testing > IBOC on the air. > > I dare somebody to walk into the show with a Sony SRF-42 and a set of > portable speakers, and give your own little demo of the IBOC hash for > all to hear... From amstereoguy@hotmail.com Thu Jan 09 05:27:36 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereoguy@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 9 Jan 2003 13:27:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 97626 invoked from network); 9 Jan 2003 13:27:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Jan 2003 13:27:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (207.68.165.61) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Jan 2003 13:27:35 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 9 Jan 2003 05:27:35 -0800 Received: from 208.228.96.20 by sea2fd.sea2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Thu, 09 Jan 2003 13:27:34 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Fwd: Comment from The AM STEREO Web Site Date: Thu, 09 Jan 2003 08:27:34 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 09 Jan 2003 13:27:35.0058 (UTC) FILETIME=[DEF05720:01C2B7E2] From: "Chris Cuff" X-Originating-IP: [208.228.96.20] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37866059 This is an email I just got from one of our friends from down under Chris >From: Mediamgt@aol.com >To: amstereoguy@hotmail.com >Subject: Comment from The AM STEREO Web Site >Date: Thu, 9 Jan 2003 07:57:50 EST > >Just an update for you on the Australian stations list. > >3MP, Melbourne, Victoria is back in mono, although the pilot tone is still >there. Seems to have co-incided with their move to new studios. > >And by the way, we have states not provinces here. You must be getting >confused with Canada (see the list of... ahem... "provinces" and call signs >on your Aussie AM stereo station list) > >Love the site! > >Paul Higgins _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 helps eliminate e-mail viruses. Get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus From michaelj@vcn.com Thu Jan 09 07:14:03 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 9 Jan 2003 15:14:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 30850 invoked from network); 9 Jan 2003 15:14:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Jan 2003 15:14:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m1-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.31) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Jan 2003 15:14:03 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m1-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Thu, 9 Jan 2003 08:14:02 -0700 Message-ID: <007f01c2b7f1$bd81d8c0$0701010a@keva> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} IBOC @ CES Date: Thu, 9 Jan 2003 08:14:00 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hmmmm.....I guess I will get MY first taste of the IBOC hash, then. I pick up KXNT loud and clear every night here in Wyo. Wonder if it's going to be enough to trash KOA right next door. MJR n WYO ----- Original Message ----- From: Kevin T. To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, January 09, 2003 2:53 AM Subject: {AMSF} IBOC @ CES Word has it that 840 KXNT will be iBiquity's demo IBOC station for the Consumer Electronics Show in Las Vegas -- to be held today (the 9th) through January 12th -- and has previously been heard testing IBOC on the air. I dare somebody to walk into the show with a Sony SRF-42 and a set of portable speakers, and give your own little demo of the IBOC hash for all to hear... Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From fanfare@globility.com Thu Jan 09 08:47:31 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 9 Jan 2003 16:47:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 51652 invoked from network); 9 Jan 2003 16:47:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Jan 2003 16:47:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.84) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Jan 2003 16:47:29 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.154] by n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 09 Jan 2003 16:47:29 -0000 Date: Thu, 09 Jan 2003 16:47:29 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: AM Stereo fallacy Continues Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20030109025251.17726.qmail@web14207.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1370 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Marv Southcott " X-Originating-IP: 64.56.233.45 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John P." wrote: > This article about 'digital radio' is interesting, but last time I took a math > class, 300 is more than 'only a few'. This joker believes that's how many > Stereo AM stations remain. Care to correct his oversight? > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John P." wrote: > This article about 'digital radio' is interesting, but last time I took a math > class, 300 is more than 'only a few'. This joker believes that's how many > Stereo AM stations remain. Care to correct his oversight? > > Article title: > pubdate=12%2F26%2F2002> No matter which system wins, receivers' future looks > digital Seems like a well written piece from a learned and credentialed writer. However, one might wonder why he was so dismissive of AM stereo. Perhaps the error in the number of AM Stereo stations there are Johnny E. is reporting influenced him that way. Maybe he had dealings with LK ;-)) However, when looking at the balance, one comment in particular jumped off the page at me. "Nobody can question the cleverness or technical sophistication of iBiquity's invention ...". I suppose taken in the context of the whole sentence, it has less the tone of an ultimatum? M. From michaelj@vcn.com Thu Jan 09 09:10:41 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 9 Jan 2003 17:10:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 88867 invoked from network); 9 Jan 2003 17:10:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Jan 2003 17:10:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m2-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.32) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Jan 2003 17:10:40 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m2-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Thu, 9 Jan 2003 10:10:40 -0700 Message-ID: <00e801c2b802$08579c80$0701010a@keva> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: AM Stereo fallacy Continues Date: Thu, 9 Jan 2003 10:10:36 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hmmmmmmmm. Good point, Marv. Well I guess I'd have to agree with the guy partially. I mean, hey.....this is a pretty neat invention by ibiquity. Kinda like inventing a roof that leaks.....or a car that only goes 30 mph and sputters. I feel it needs some MAJOR improvement. If ya want something that's NOT going to disrupt the current system then make something that's NOT going to disrupt the current system. Unfortunatly IBOC is not that. It's kinda close. If improved, and it didn't cause any additional interference other than that caused by an analog station, then I'd say it's GREAT! Unfortunately that is not the case :( I have yet to hear the IBOC hash, but I know I will be able to soon when 840-Las Vegas begins to use it. I'm really excited about that one. Heck, I didn't want to DX 830 or 850 anyways. MJR n WYO ----- Original Message ----- From: Marv Southcott To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, January 09, 2003 9:47 AM Subject: {AMSF} Re: AM Stereo fallacy Continues --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John P." However, when looking at the balance, one comment in particular jumped off the page at me. "Nobody can question the cleverness or technical sophistication of iBiquity's invention ...". I suppose taken in the context of the whole sentence, it has less the tone of an ultimatum? M. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From JH_Radio@GameBox.net Thu Jan 09 11:08:41 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: JH_Radio@GameBox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 9 Jan 2003 19:08:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 41098 invoked from network); 9 Jan 2003 19:08:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Jan 2003 19:08:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO snickers.hotpop.com) (204.57.55.49) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Jan 2003 19:08:36 -0000 Received: from gamebox.net (kubrick.hotpop.com [204.57.55.16]) by snickers.hotpop.com (Postfix) with SMTP id E81E671A6A for ; Thu, 9 Jan 2003 19:08:30 +0000 (UTC) Received: from -enduser.GameBox.net (pcp03184855pcs.benslm01.pa.comcast.net [68.80.77.117]) by smtp-2.hotpop.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6B16C1B865A for ; Thu, 9 Jan 2003 18:32:44 +0000 (UTC) Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030109133617.00a2b300@pop.GameBox.net> X-Sender: JH_Radio@pop.GameBox.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Thu, 09 Jan 2003 13:37:06 -0500 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} IBOC @ CES In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 X-HotPOP: ----------------------------------------------- Sent By HotPOP.com FREE Email Get your FREE POP email at www.HotPOP.com ----------------------------------------------- From: John X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113800107 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit *Grins* Why not right? Now if someone only did that for FM to, we'd be in good shape. I like my adjacent! At 09:53 AM 1/9/03 +0000, you wrote: >Word has it that 840 KXNT will be iBiquity's demo IBOC station for >the Consumer Electronics Show in Las Vegas -- to be held today (the >9th) through January 12th -- and has previously been heard testing >IBOC on the air. > >I dare somebody to walk into the show with a Sony SRF-42 and a set of >portable speakers, and give your own little demo of the IBOC hash for >all to hear... > > > >Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Love in Christ: John Bensalem, PA Send me an email Aim: RainAngelsRule MSN: RainAngelsRule@hotmail.com My website Welcome to Napster4TheBlind "Prayer does not change God; it changes you." - Authur unknown [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From JH_Radio@GameBox.net Thu Jan 09 11:59:03 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: JH_Radio@GameBox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 9 Jan 2003 19:59:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 71257 invoked from network); 9 Jan 2003 19:58:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Jan 2003 19:58:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO babyruth.hotpop.com) (204.57.55.14) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Jan 2003 19:59:02 -0000 Received: from gamebox.net (kubrick.hotpop.com [204.57.55.16]) by babyruth.hotpop.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 0917921129A for ; Thu, 9 Jan 2003 19:59:00 +0000 (UTC) Received: from -enduser.GameBox.net (pcp03184855pcs.benslm01.pa.comcast.net [68.80.77.117]) by smtp-2.hotpop.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A0D7F1B8A20 for ; Thu, 9 Jan 2003 18:43:33 +0000 (UTC) Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030109134625.038746e0@pop.GameBox.net> X-Sender: JH_Radio@pop.GameBox.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Thu, 09 Jan 2003 13:47:46 -0500 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: AM Stereo fallacy Continues In-Reply-To: <00e801c2b802$08579c80$0701010a@keva> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 X-HotPOP: ----------------------------------------------- Sent By HotPOP.com FREE Email Get your FREE POP email at www.HotPOP.com ----------------------------------------------- From: John X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113800107 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit But why doesn't Iboc broadcast in AM Stereo? If it did, someone might be able to walk in the trade show with an Analog AM Stereo portable, and show the people there the difference in how good analog quality AM Stereo really is. At 10:10 AM 1/9/03 -0700, you wrote: >Hmmmmmmmm. Good point, Marv. Well I guess I'd have to agree with the guy partially. I mean, hey.....this is a pretty neat invention by ibiquity. Kinda like inventing a roof that leaks.....or a car that only goes 30 mph and sputters. I feel it needs some MAJOR improvement. If ya want something that's NOT going to disrupt the current system then make something that's NOT going to disrupt the current system. Unfortunatly IBOC is not that. It's kinda close. If improved, and it didn't cause any additional interference other than that caused by an analog station, then I'd say it's GREAT! Unfortunately that is not the case :( >I have yet to hear the IBOC hash, but I know I will be able to soon when 840-Las Vegas begins to use it. >I'm really excited about that one. Heck, I didn't want to DX 830 or 850 anyways. > >MJR n WYO > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Marv Southcott > To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com > Sent: Thursday, January 09, 2003 9:47 AM > Subject: {AMSF} Re: AM Stereo fallacy Continues > > > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John P." > > However, when looking at the balance, one comment in particular > jumped off the page at me. "Nobody can question the cleverness or > technical sophistication of iBiquity's invention ...". I suppose > taken in the context of the whole sentence, it has less the tone of > an ultimatum? > > M. > > >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > >Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Love in Christ: John Bensalem, PA Send me an email Aim: RainAngelsRule MSN: RainAngelsRule@hotmail.com My website Welcome to Napster4TheBlind "Prayer does not change God; it changes you." - Authur unknown [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From jeffdeck@aol.com Thu Jan 09 14:55:06 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: Jeffdeck@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 9 Jan 2003 22:55:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 93852 invoked from network); 9 Jan 2003 22:55:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Jan 2003 22:55:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d02.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.34) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Jan 2003 22:55:05 -0000 Received: from Jeffdeck@aol.com by imo-d02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id 1.42.335f06c2 (4362); Thu, 9 Jan 2003 17:54:54 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <42.335f06c2.2b4f57be@aol.com> Date: Thu, 9 Jan 2003 17:54:54 EST Subject: Re: DETROIT IBOC for Jeff Deck To: ABDX@topica.com Cc: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10638 From: jeffdeck@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=4430287 X-Yahoo-Profile: jeffdeck2001 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Kevin, When I visited my family in the Detroit area, I heard the IBOC sidebands quite well on WMGC-FM and WCHB-AM. My tuner actually stops on WMGC's first adjacent upper and lower frequencies, as though it found a station. It sounds like a very loud bee hive on FM. WCHB sounds identical to WLW's testing on August 16 -- an FM-like "hiss" sound within the main audio channel, and a much louder "hiss" on either side of WCHB (1190 and 1210 kHz). In addition, there is a very low frequency continuous tone found on the main audio. Unfortunately, I do not have portable means to record a direct MP3 audio file for you. I can record to cassette, and dub to computer later. Do you want this sound byte? I also have WLW's IBOC file in MP3 format, recorded directly from Sony SRF-A1. You can find this in the AM stereo forum file area. Also, please view this item: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1950766004 In a message dated 1/9/2003 1:08:14 PM Eastern Standard Time, Kevin writes: >Steven Wiseblood wrote: >> >> WCHB-FM 105.9 & WMGC-FM 105.1, both in DETROIT, MI. > >I was asking to see if there was another AMer in the Motor City with IBOC. > >Jeff, can you hear these guys? If so how bad are the sidebands on FM. > >I was wondering if I could get a comparison to what I heard with KJZZ. > >Kevin [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Thu Jan 09 16:18:42 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Jan 2003 00:18:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 24640 invoked from network); 10 Jan 2003 00:18:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Jan 2003 00:18:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web41006.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.93.5) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Jan 2003 00:18:40 -0000 Message-ID: <20030110001840.44866.qmail@web41006.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.33.173] by web41006.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 09 Jan 2003 16:18:40 PST Date: Thu, 9 Jan 2003 16:18:40 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: {AMSF} 1160 WYNS To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio Are you still looking for people? 73, Jay,N1WVQ Please e-mail some more info to me privately at a1asurfradio@yahoo.com __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Jan 09 16:52:20 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Jan 2003 00:52:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 34841 invoked from network); 10 Jan 2003 00:52:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Jan 2003 00:52:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r08.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.104) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Jan 2003 00:52:19 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.70.28e8db7e (3972) for ; Thu, 9 Jan 2003 19:52:15 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <70.28e8db7e.2b4f733e@aol.com> Date: Thu, 9 Jan 2003 19:52:14 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} IBOC @ CES To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 1/9/03 10:15:19 AM Eastern Standard Time, michaelj@vcn.com writes: << Hmmmm.....I guess I will get MY first taste of the IBOC hash, then. I pick up KXNT loud and clear every night here in Wyo. Wonder if it's going to be enough to trash KOA right next door. MJR n WYO >> Chances are that it will probably effect KOA to some degree. You certainly cant mistake the hiss noise on either side of KXNT...it will be as loud as the analog programming ..either side of KXNT operating frequency. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- Subscribe send an email to amstereo-subscribe@topica.com ____________________________________________ From stodd@sherbtel.net Thu Jan 09 17:01:06 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Jan 2003 01:01:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 91448 invoked from network); 10 Jan 2003 01:01:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Jan 2003 01:01:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Jan 2003 01:01:05 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-143.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.143]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h0A112ql026721 for ; Thu, 9 Jan 2003 19:01:03 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <001401c2b843$e0d88100$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} NJ listeners switch from FM to AM, & WHLI ratings success Date: Thu, 9 Jan 2003 19:01:56 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Barnstable was the ones who built KBGG 1700, that mono CNN audio waste of bandwidth in Des Moines. They've got a reputation of being rather cheap, so no suprise WHLI is mono. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: > They are owned by Barnstable, but I don't know > if that necessarily implies any track record in regard to support for > AM Stereo. From dav259@csiro.au Thu Jan 09 17:09:57 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Jan 2003 01:09:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 62344 invoked from network); 10 Jan 2003 01:09:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Jan 2003 01:09:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Jan 2003 01:09:56 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0A19sP13887 for ; Fri, 10 Jan 2003 12:09:54 +1100 (EST) Date: Fri, 10 Jan 2003 12:09:54 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: amstereoforum Subject: 1160 WMLB Atlanta Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public Atlanta's adult standards station WMLB 1160 is upgrading from 10,000 to 50,000 watts and moving its tower from East Point to Austell. The station doesn't appear to be planning including AM stereo as part of the upgrade. Please go to http://radio-info.com - click on DX - and add your comments about AM stereo being the logical way to go as part of the upgrade. "Iloveradio" - the person who started the thread works at WMLB. Ian From stodd@sherbtel.net Thu Jan 09 17:19:19 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Jan 2003 01:19:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 85985 invoked from network); 10 Jan 2003 01:19:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Jan 2003 01:19:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Jan 2003 01:19:18 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-143.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.143]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h0A1JFql002979 for ; Thu, 9 Jan 2003 19:19:16 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <004e01c2b846$6c5dbfe0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <007f01c2b7f1$bd81d8c0$0701010a@keva> Subject: Re: {AMSF} IBOC @ CES Date: Thu, 9 Jan 2003 19:20:09 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude I hope so. What a better way to drive the nails in the IBOC coffin than for them to trash a big legacy signal. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael J. Richard" > Hmmmm.....I guess I will get MY first taste of the IBOC hash, then. I pick up KXNT loud and clear every night here in Wyo. > Wonder if it's going to be enough to trash KOA right next door. > From stodd@sherbtel.net Thu Jan 09 17:26:28 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Jan 2003 01:26:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 86277 invoked from network); 10 Jan 2003 01:26:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Jan 2003 01:26:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Jan 2003 01:26:27 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-143.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.143]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h0A1QNql005533 for ; Thu, 9 Jan 2003 19:26:25 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <006c01c2b847$6bca3d00$827dfea9@home1> To: Subject: Fw: [CRTech] brick wall filter Date: Thu, 9 Jan 2003 19:27:18 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude OK guys, get a load of what IBOC will REALLY be like on AM. :) ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Scott Todd" > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Kevin Kidd" > To: "CRTech" > Sent: Thursday, January 09, 2003 10:49 AM > Subject: Re: [CRTech] brick wall filter > > > > > > > > Try this link for a more realistic look at AM > > IBOC. > > > > http://www.kkbc.com/amiboc.html > > > > -- > > Later, > > > > Kevin > > WD4RAT > > mailto:kkidd@kkbc.com > > > > KK BROADCAST ENGINEERING > > http://www.kkbc.com > > > > AM GROUND SYSTEMS CO. > > http://amgroundsystems.com > > > > 51 Ridge Ln > > Lawrenceburg, TN 38464 > > Toll Free: 877-766-2999 > > FAX: 931-766-3974 From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Jan 09 17:27:56 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Jan 2003 01:27:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 69459 invoked from network); 10 Jan 2003 01:27:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Jan 2003 01:27:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m04.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.7) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Jan 2003 01:27:48 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.141.7622aba (3972) for ; Thu, 9 Jan 2003 20:27:45 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <141.7622aba.2b4f7b90@aol.com> Date: Thu, 9 Jan 2003 20:27:44 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: DETROIT IBOC for Jeff Deck To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 1/9/03 5:56:54 PM Eastern Standard Time, jeffdeck@aol.com writes: << When I visited my family in the Detroit area, I heard the IBOC sidebands quite well on WMGC-FM and WCHB-AM. My tuner actually stops on WMGC's first adjacent upper and lower frequencies, as though it found a station. It sounds like a very loud bee hive on FM. >> Oh joy! WRAL 101.5 FM in Raleigh NC is reported to have started broadcasting IBOC {saw the short blurb from a link at rwonline.com}. I've tryed to listen to WRAL here ...150 so miles east of that station and havent heard the "beehive" effect.I may be just to far away to really hear the negative effects of their digital transmissions here. Time will tell this spring/summer when the tropo picks up a bit. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- Subscribe send an email to amstereo-subscribe@topica.com _______________________________________________________ From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Jan 09 17:34:30 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Jan 2003 01:34:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 60799 invoked from network); 10 Jan 2003 01:34:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Jan 2003 01:34:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d03.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.35) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Jan 2003 01:34:30 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.126.1f249937 (3972) for ; Thu, 9 Jan 2003 20:34:25 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <126.1f249937.2b4f7d21@aol.com> Date: Thu, 9 Jan 2003 20:34:25 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Fw: [CRTech] brick wall filter To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 1/9/03 8:27:36 PM Eastern Standard Time, stodd@sherbtel.net writes: << OK guys, get a load of what IBOC will REALLY be like on AM. :) ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Scott Todd" > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Kevin Kidd" > To: "CRTech" > Sent: Thursday, January 09, 2003 10:49 AM > Subject: Re: [CRTech] brick wall filter > > > > > > > > Try this link for a more realistic look at AM > > IBOC. > > > > http://www.kkbc.com/amiboc.html > > >> LOL!!!!......that site pretty much says it all. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- Subscribe send an email to amstereo-subscribe@topica.com _______________________________________________________ From n0uiheric@aol.com Thu Jan 09 17:36:14 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Jan 2003 01:36:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 63068 invoked from network); 10 Jan 2003 01:36:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Jan 2003 01:36:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m02.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.5) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Jan 2003 01:36:13 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-m02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.ba.345c4dde (3996) for ; Thu, 9 Jan 2003 20:36:10 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Thu, 9 Jan 2003 20:36:09 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: DETROIT IBOC for Jeff Deck To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih This is why IBOC should be scrapped for AM and FM. Why didn't the U.S. allow the French DRM system to be tested? 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Jan 09 20:52:09 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Jan 2003 04:52:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 72215 invoked from network); 10 Jan 2003 04:52:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Jan 2003 04:52:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Jan 2003 04:52:09 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.179] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 10 Jan 2003 04:52:09 -0000 Date: Fri, 10 Jan 2003 04:52:08 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: OT: Gates limiter Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1223 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.76.10 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics I was just wondering if anybody here has any experience with an old Gates "Solid Statesman" audio limiter. I just got one, and it looks like new inside and works great, except for a "crackly" kind of audio distortion that happens more frequently as I make it compress the audio more aggressively. I've tried twiddling with some of the adjustments inside without much luck at eliminating the problem. Now, I am "cheating" by hooking it up to regular unbalanced audio inputs and outputs when it was designed to work with balanced audio connections, but that in itself doesn't seem to be the cause as when I set it to disable all limiting and clipping, it passes through audio that is prefectly clean and distortion-free. I did get a service manual with it, but it's for a different model -- the Solid Statesman AGC, while I have the slightly more sophisticated Solid Statesman "FM Limiter". Another oddity is that it has yellow and red lights on the front panel, but no matter how I use or abuse it, they never light up. I suppose they could both be burned out, but they're not labelled so does anybody know what their purpose is anyway? TIA for any help and advice on this non-AM-Stereo-related topic. From dfr68819@wanadoo.fr Fri Jan 10 01:49:53 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dfr68819@wanadoo.fr X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Jan 2003 09:49:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 79631 invoked from network); 10 Jan 2003 09:49:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Jan 2003 09:49:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.84) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Jan 2003 09:49:52 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.138] by n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 10 Jan 2003 09:49:52 -0000 Date: Fri, 10 Jan 2003 09:49:52 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Parts (was Re: Re: AM stereo schematic) Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 441 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Denis " X-Originating-IP: 213.41.140.239 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=117455200 X-Yahoo-Profile: pcvpcn Dear friend, Excuses I not to have write more . The French supplier who sells the SSM2120 is called: www.elecdif.com hello --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Alfredo E. Torrejon" wrote: > > Si vous recherchez le SSM2120, on le trouve en France. > > Denis > > What is the name of the French supplier for the SSM2120? I have > one compressor board that is stuffed, minus the SSM2120 ICs. > > Thanks, > > Alfredo From philipr@irac.pe.ca Fri Jan 10 05:23:51 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Jan 2003 13:23:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 1474 invoked from network); 10 Jan 2003 13:19:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Jan 2003 13:19:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Jan 2003 13:19:16 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.164] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 10 Jan 2003 13:16:34 -0000 Date: Fri, 10 Jan 2003 13:16:30 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Fw: [CRTech] brick wall filter Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <006c01c2b847$6bca3d00$827dfea9@home1> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2186 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking Now don't be so hard on poor Mickey!!! Mickey has large ears [two of them for stereo] which can tell the difference between CQUAM Hi- Fidelity and iBiquity IBOC Hi-Infidelity. Mickey hates squishing digital artifacts, and synthetic treble hurts his ears. The sound of IBOC sideband hash is akin to a 50,000 watt cat with 5/8 wavelength towers hissing, not Mickey's idea of a good time. The rumour has it that Mickey himself is a big AM Stereo fan, and is trying desparately to get WQEW 1560 Radio Disney back in AM Stereo. Maybe its because I'm preparing for fatherhood, but I'm sort of liking their nighttime format - well, its different at least! Will someone drive Mickey [he is scared of airports, too many security cats, he says] from Florida or California [wherever the REAL Mickey lives] to good ole NYC so Mickey can make a cameo appearance at 1560 and tell the boys and girls there to "like get with the program dudes" and put CQUAM back on. If you are transporing a CQUAM exciter and an old Gates or RCA transmitter, Mickey says he'll help you move the stuff. Everyone knows that Donald Duck is a big fan of single sideband, and the IBOC supporter at the Magic Kingdom is, well, none other than good old Goofy. So my bets are the next spectrum analysis will reveal good old Goofy. Phil R. --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Scott Todd" wrote: > OK guys, get a load of what IBOC will REALLY be like on AM. :) > > ST > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Scott Todd" > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Kevin Kidd" > > To: "CRTech" > > Sent: Thursday, January 09, 2003 10:49 AM > > Subject: Re: [CRTech] brick wall filter > > > > > > > > > > > > > Try this link for a more realistic look at AM > > > IBOC. > > > > > > http://www.kkbc.com/amiboc.html > > > > > > -- > > > Later, > > > > > > Kevin > > > WD4RAT > > > mailto:kkidd@k... > > > > > > KK BROADCAST ENGINEERING > > > http://www.kkbc.com > > > > > > AM GROUND SYSTEMS CO. > > > http://amgroundsystems.com > > > > > > 51 Ridge Ln > > > Lawrenceburg, TN 38464 > > > Toll Free: 877-766-2999 > > > FAX: 931-766-3974 From e92fmjamz@yahoo.com Fri Jan 10 05:54:43 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: e92fmjamz@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Jan 2003 13:54:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 49133 invoked from network); 10 Jan 2003 13:54:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Jan 2003 13:54:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14004.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.175.120) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Jan 2003 13:54:41 -0000 Message-ID: <20030110135441.579.qmail@web14004.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [152.8.78.47] by web14004.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 10 Jan 2003 05:54:41 PST Date: Fri, 10 Jan 2003 05:54:41 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: DETROIT IBOC for Jeff Deck To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: <141.7622aba.2b4f7b90@aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: Ernest Jones X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=24963319 X-Yahoo-Profile: e92fmjamz I have about a S8-S9 on my DX-398 of WRAL FM...they sound just like the analong signal...I *might* be taking a trip to raleigh this weekend --- KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 1/9/03 5:56:54 PM Eastern > Standard Time, jeffdeck@aol.com > writes: > > << When I visited my family in the Detroit area, I > heard the IBOC sidebands > quite well on WMGC-FM and WCHB-AM. My tuner > actually stops on > WMGC's first adjacent upper and lower frequencies, > as though it found a > station. It sounds like a very loud bee hive on > FM. >> > > Oh joy! WRAL 101.5 FM in Raleigh NC is reported to > have started broadcasting > IBOC {saw the short blurb from a link at > rwonline.com}. I've tryed to listen > to WRAL here ...150 so miles east of that station > and havent heard the > "beehive" effect.I may be just to far away to really > hear the negative > effects of their digital transmissions here. Time > will tell this > spring/summer when the tropo picks up a bit. > > Bob Carter > Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group > > WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach > 104..., WQDK 99.3 > Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 > > > Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio > stations with engineering > services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. > e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net > Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC > WBXB-FM 100.1 > Edenton NC > WURB-FM 97.7 > Windsor NC > Ray > Communications Radio Network > > AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- > Subscribe send an email to > amstereo-subscribe@topica.com > > _______________________________________________________ > > > > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > ===== Ernest, Gates NC, USA WRCS 970 AM Ahoskie NC, Announcer,webmaster http://wrcs.cjb.net WQDK 99.3 FM Ahoskie NC, Fill in ------contact me-------- AIM: e92fmjamz2000 ICQ: 33155469 Yahoo: e92fmjamz __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk Fri Jan 10 08:11:00 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Jan 2003 16:10:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 12964 invoked from network); 10 Jan 2003 16:09:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Jan 2003 16:09:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.88) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Jan 2003 16:09:35 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.154] by n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 10 Jan 2003 16:09:32 -0000 Date: Fri, 10 Jan 2003 16:09:31 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: UK IOM LW STATION PLANS TO BROADCAST IN AM STEREO AND DRM! Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 981 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Dave " X-Originating-IP: 81.7.63.96 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113985069 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereofan > I look forward to your station hopefully coming on air but can the >transmitter be am stereo I wonder ? Yes, its a relatively straight forward exercise to engineer our signal to add a stereo component, and we do propose being one of the first stations to do so. The main question is, which system to use. Motoroila's CQAM is much worse than the Kahn-Hazeltine system, . . . we are leaning towards the DRM standard at the moment which is fully compatible with regular AM and has now been adopted by the ITU. Receiver manufacturers are already tooling up and the re are now DRM stations broadcasting in 8 major US markets - a good start after just a few months. It looks very promising. An announcement is likely to be made on our web site after we appraise this, likely to be in April. Thank you for writing, Yours sincerely Paul Rusling -- Isle of Man International Broadcasting plc PO Box 279 Ramsey Isle of Man IM99 4HT http://www.longwaveradio.com From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Jan 10 13:42:45 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Jan 2003 21:42:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 5901 invoked from network); 10 Jan 2003 21:42:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Jan 2003 21:42:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Jan 2003 21:42:42 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-199.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.199]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h0ALgcql024882 for ; Fri, 10 Jan 2003 15:42:39 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <004101c2b8f1$5507d140$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} OT: Gates limiter Date: Fri, 10 Jan 2003 15:43:34 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude I should have a book for them (unless it was in the stash I sent Harold Hallikainen to archive- in which case it should be on his site.) I can photocopy it and send it to you. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, January 09, 2003 10:52 PM Subject: {AMSF} OT: Gates limiter > I was just wondering if anybody here has any experience with an old > Gates "Solid Statesman" audio limiter. I just got one, and it looks > like new inside and works great, except for a "crackly" kind of audio > distortion that happens more frequently as I make it compress the > audio more aggressively. I've tried twiddling with some of the > adjustments inside without much luck at eliminating the problem. > > Now, I am "cheating" by hooking it up to regular unbalanced audio > inputs and outputs when it was designed to work with balanced audio > connections, but that in itself doesn't seem to be the cause as when > I set it to disable all limiting and clipping, it passes through > audio that is prefectly clean and distortion-free. > > I did get a service manual with it, but it's for a different model -- > the Solid Statesman AGC, while I have the slightly more sophisticated > Solid Statesman "FM Limiter". > > Another oddity is that it has yellow and red lights on the front > panel, but no matter how I use or abuse it, they never light up. I > suppose they could both be burned out, but they're not labelled so > does anybody know what their purpose is anyway? > > TIA for any help and advice on this non-AM-Stereo-related topic. > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > From KC4QLP@aol.com Fri Jan 10 14:14:25 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Jan 2003 22:14:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 14232 invoked from network); 10 Jan 2003 22:14:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Jan 2003 22:14:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d09.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.41) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Jan 2003 22:14:25 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d09.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.152.1a2692ad (4254) for ; Fri, 10 Jan 2003 17:14:20 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <152.1a2692ad.2b509fbb@aol.com> Date: Fri, 10 Jan 2003 17:14:19 EST Subject: Radio short circuit...1st,outta control DJ's,then IBOC,now more DJ's To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp To: Sent: Thursday, January 09, 2003 6:41 PM Subject: Terrorist, animal, assassin > Hi all, Barry here. Did you hear about this? I think the radio-show hosts > should lose their jobs. > > MIAMI > -- Two Cuban-American radio-show hosts, who use jumbled recordings of Fidel > Castro to trick callers into believing they're talking with the Cuban > President, say they have duped another victim: Venezuelan President Hugo > Chavez. > A tape of Monday's prank, verified by Venezuelan officials, has the > President, who is struggling to end a month-old national strike by > opponents, happily answering what he thought would be a friendly call from > Mr. Castro, one of his closest allies. > But on the other end of the line were WXDJ-FM disc jockeys Joe Ferrero and > Enrique Santos, who ended the conversation by calling Mr. Chavez "terrorist" > and "animal," along with a few expletives. > During the call, they played disjointed snippets of a private conversation > between Mr. Castro and Mexican President Vicente Fox, which the Cuban leader > released last year. > "We never thought that we would be able to talk to Chavez," Mr. Ferrero > said. > He said they had tried about 10 times since Friday to bluff their way past > Mr. Chavez's aides at the Venezuelan presidential palace. > But on Monday, Mr. Ferrero said, he and a woman posed as telephone operators > and told a secretary that they needed the President's personal number to > connect him with Mr. Castro, who supposedly was in a hidden location and > could not receive calls. The announcers said the secretary finally > consented. > "Hello, Fidel?" Mr. Chavez answered. > "Yes. Did you receive my letter?" > "Yes, I received everything fine." > "I am ready to co-operate with you," Mr. Castro said. > After an exchange about the day of the week, Mr. Santos broke in and said > they were calling from Miami, adding, "Get out of Venezuela . . . terrorist! > . . . animal, assassin!" > Where does it end? Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- Subscribe send an email to amstereo-subscribe@topica.com _______________________________________________________ From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Jan 10 15:09:42 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 10 Jan 2003 23:09:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 1927 invoked from network); 10 Jan 2003 23:09:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Jan 2003 23:09:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Jan 2003 23:09:40 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-199.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.199]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h0AN9bql018929 for ; Fri, 10 Jan 2003 17:09:38 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <004f01c2b8fd$7bd839c0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} UK IOM LW STATION PLANS TO BROADCAST IN AM STEREO AND DRM! Date: Fri, 10 Jan 2003 17:10:33 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude So where did this guy get the idea that DRM is in the US? IBOC isn't DRM, and DRM isn't compatible with existing analog AM. And Kahn isn't authorized for stereo use anywhere in the world. He needs an education. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: > we are leaning towards the DRM standard at the moment which is fully > compatible with regular AM and has now been adopted by the ITU. > Receiver manufacturers are already tooling up and the re are now DRM > stations broadcasting in 8 major US markets - a good start after just > a few months. It looks very promising. From wa2fnq@optonline.net Fri Jan 10 18:04:24 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: wa2fnq@optonline.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Jan 2003 02:04:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 78294 invoked from network); 11 Jan 2003 02:04:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Jan 2003 02:04:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Jan 2003 02:04:24 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.129] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Jan 2003 02:04:23 -0000 Date: Sat, 11 Jan 2003 02:04:20 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} UK IOM LW STATION PLANS TO BROADCAST IN AM STEREO AND DRM! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <004f01c2b8fd$7bd839c0$827dfea9@home1> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1171 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wa2fnq " X-Originating-IP: 24.47.74.230 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=60059615 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa2fnq I believe at one point DRM had an IBOC (if you will) mode but it too wouldn't work with AM stereo. The difference is the audio coding. Ibiquity uses their PAC (perceptual audio coding) which is proprietary to them. DRM uses mp4. Which brings up this question: Why are we bothering with this Ibiquity garbage?? I wont get into an argument about Kahn. It's simply independant sideband transmission which can be used for alot of things besides stereo. Jerry WA2FNQ --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Scott Todd" wrote: > So where did this guy get the idea that DRM is in the US? IBOC isn't DRM, > and DRM isn't compatible with existing analog AM. And Kahn isn't authorized > for stereo use anywhere in the world. He needs an education. > > ST > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > > we are leaning towards the DRM standard at the moment which is fully > > compatible with regular AM and has now been adopted by the ITU. > > Receiver manufacturers are already tooling up and the re are now DRM > > stations broadcasting in 8 major US markets - a good start after just > > a few months. It looks very promising. From possumhunter@netzero.net Fri Jan 10 20:22:39 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Jan 2003 04:22:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 5406 invoked from network); 11 Jan 2003 04:22:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Jan 2003 04:22:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.81) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Jan 2003 04:22:39 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 10 Jan 2003 20:22:38 -0800 To: References: <001401c2b843$e0d88100$827dfea9@home1> Subject: Re: {AMSF} NJ listeners switch from FM to AM, & WHLI ratings success Date: Fri, 10 Jan 2003 01:41:14 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 11 Jan 2003 04:22:38.0986 (UTC) FILETIME=[13632EA0:01C2B929] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.151.83.97] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Scott Todd wrote: > Barnstable was the ones who built KBGG 1700, that mono CNN audio waste of bandwidth in Des Moines. They've got a reputation of being rather cheap, so no suprise WHLI is mono. The FCC should force the X-band station to go to C-QUAM. It was part of the deal to get on the X-band to start with. The three worst sounding FMs in this market are all Barnstable properties! WROQ, WTPT, WGVC all sound bad with WGVC being the worst. Kevin From miketx@swbell.net Fri Jan 10 21:00:00 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: miketx@swbell.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Jan 2003 04:59:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 78378 invoked from network); 11 Jan 2003 04:59:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Jan 2003 04:59:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web80213.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.79.48) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Jan 2003 04:59:58 -0000 Message-ID: <20030111045958.20874.qmail@web80213.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [65.65.29.1] by web80213.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 10 Jan 2003 20:59:58 PST Date: Fri, 10 Jan 2003 20:59:58 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: {AMSF} UK IOM LW STATION PLANS TO BROADCAST IN AM STEREO AND DRM! To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 From: MIKE OSWALD X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=378632 X-Yahoo-Profile: ozzieintexas Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit "wa2fnq " wrote: I believe at one point DRM had an IBOC (if you will) mode but it too wouldn't work with AM stereo. The difference is the audio coding. Ibiquity uses their PAC (perceptual audio coding) which is proprietary to them. DRM uses mp4. Which brings up this question: Why are we bothering with this Ibiquity garbage?? I wont get into an argument about Kahn. It's simply independant sideband transmission which can be used for alot of things besides stereo. Jerry WA2FNQ I keep reading conflicting stories about IBOC and if it can be broadcast in stereo. Can you broadcast in both IBOC and AM Stereo C-QUAM? I have not heard IBOC, but AM Stereo can sound awsome. If IBOC can't broadcast in AM Stereo, in my mind it is a set back in standards of quality. 73 Mike O Houston --- [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From kvzichi@yahoo.com Fri Jan 10 21:17:35 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kvzichi@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Jan 2003 05:17:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 13897 invoked from network); 11 Jan 2003 05:17:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Jan 2003 05:17:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Jan 2003 05:17:33 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.135] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Jan 2003 05:17:33 -0000 Date: Sat, 11 Jan 2003 05:17:33 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: schematic / help for MCS 3050 Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 914 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "kvzichi " X-Originating-IP: 67.217.103.163 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=59548075 X-Yahoo-Profile: kvzichi Hello! I've stumbled across an older JC Penney MCS 3050 (service number 683- 3050-00) and need some help from the experts here! It stops at the old band limit of 1620 kHz, and I'd dearly love to have it tune the ex- band if that is possible. Since I managed to get it to tune LW (altho it lacks the coils and front end, so all it gets is static at those freqs) I'll wager there is some way to 'trick' it into tuning slightly above 1620 too. Does anyone 1) have a schematic or service manual they can copy -- I'll be happy to reimburse postage and copying! or failing that 2) know what jumper to add or cut to expand the synthesizer to allow tuning outside the 'old' band? I'm new to this AM stereo game, but I'm having a blast playing with it -- I'm just disappointed that there are fewer and fewer stations offering stereo any more! Thanks for the help //Ken Zichi kvzichi@yahoo.com From KC4QLP@aol.com Fri Jan 10 21:44:24 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Jan 2003 05:44:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 22170 invoked from network); 11 Jan 2003 05:44:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Jan 2003 05:44:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r02.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.98) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Jan 2003 05:44:23 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.15e.19f64fe1 (25305) for ; Sat, 11 Jan 2003 00:44:16 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <15e.19f64fe1.2b51092f@aol.com> Date: Sat, 11 Jan 2003 00:44:15 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} UK IOM LW STATION PLANS TO BROADCAST IN AM STEREO AND DRM! To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 1/11/03 12:00:53 AM Eastern Standard Time, miketx@swbell.net writes: > I keep reading conflicting stories about IBOC and if it can be broadcast in > stereo. Can you broadcast in both IBOC and AM Stereo C-QUAM? I have not > heard IBOC, but AM Stereo can sound awsome. If IBOC can't broadcast in AM > Stereo, in my mind it is a set back in standards of quality. > > 73 > > Mike O > > Houston > You can not do IBOC and C-QUAM at the same time as they both use the same platform...basically called phase modulation. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From rwagoner@cox.net Sat Jan 11 00:35:52 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner@cox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Jan 2003 08:35:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 8364 invoked from network); 11 Jan 2003 08:35:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Jan 2003 08:35:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.68) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Jan 2003 08:35:51 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.184] by n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Jan 2003 08:35:51 -0000 Date: Sat, 11 Jan 2003 08:35:48 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: KNX Stereo Commercials Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 705 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Richard Wagoner " X-Originating-IP: 68.4.33.253 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=96123889 X-Yahoo-Profile: richardalanwagoner > It's always frosted me that KNX (News 1070 LA) airs all their > commercials in 100% mono on their otherwise > wonderful-sounding AM Stereo signal. Only the bumper music > has been stereo. > > Well apparently that's finally coming to an end. I've been > listening at work on my TM-152 this morning, and I've heard full > separation on some of the commercials. They really jump out at > you! Hopefully it will spread to the rest of them. Good job, guys. > It was only until recently that KNX had the capability to play commercials in stereo ... the old system was mono only for commercials. They appear to have moved to a computer-based commercial and jingle system that is indeed stereo. From n0uiheric@aol.com Sat Jan 11 00:45:52 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Jan 2003 08:45:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 59234 invoked from network); 11 Jan 2003 08:45:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Jan 2003 08:45:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r10.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.106) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Jan 2003 08:45:51 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-r10.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.84.6f7b3a2 (4426) for ; Sat, 11 Jan 2003 03:45:40 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <84.6f7b3a2.2b5133b3@aol.com> Date: Sat, 11 Jan 2003 03:45:39 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Radio short circuit...1st,outta control DJ's,then IBOC,now more DJ's To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih There's only one way to get rid of these out-of-control and illegal DJs...OPPOSE FURTHER DEREGULATION of the media. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Jan 11 01:08:46 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Jan 2003 09:08:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 50410 invoked from network); 11 Jan 2003 09:08:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Jan 2003 09:08:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.84) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Jan 2003 09:08:45 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.164] by n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Jan 2003 09:08:45 -0000 Date: Sat, 11 Jan 2003 09:08:41 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: KNX Stereo Commercials Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 783 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.93.27 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > It was only until recently that KNX had the capability to play > commercials in stereo ... the old system was mono only for > commercials. > They appear to have moved to a computer-based commercial and jingle > system that is indeed stereo. Perhaps the same thing has occured at 1210 WPHT in Philadelphia? Aside from the music programs on weekends, there was very little Stereo to be heard from them, but now recently I have noticed them playing things like liners and traffic report sounders with true Stereo sound. Also, when WPHT plays music it has a kind of "wishy-washy" tinge to the sound, characteristic of digitally compressed music storage (rare to hear on AM, although unfortunately now common on FM music stations), but their music *is* in Stereo nonetheless. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Jan 11 01:26:58 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Jan 2003 09:26:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 13736 invoked from network); 11 Jan 2003 09:26:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Jan 2003 09:26:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Jan 2003 09:26:57 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.131] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Jan 2003 09:26:57 -0000 Date: Sat, 11 Jan 2003 09:26:55 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: New IBOC (and AM Stereo) audio samples Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1557 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.93.27 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics I visited the IBOC web site at http://www.ibiquity.com/ and was surprised to discover new audio demos. The AM sample is of 840 KXNT (currently the flagship IBOC station for the CES in Las Vegas). On the web site, the samples are accessed through Shockwave Flash (.SWF) files, but with a little help from a "Shockwave Decompiler" program, I was able to losslessly extract the MP3 recordings that are contained in these Shockwave files, and have made them available on my server for all to hear: 840 KXNT in analog mono AM with 4.5 kHz bandwidth and purposely added interference: http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/amanalog.mp3 840 KXNT in digital IBOC audio, with Stereo-like sound... judge for yourself the quality (or lack thereof!): http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/am-iboc.mp3 Analog FM sample, purposely off-tuned or with poor signal strength: http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/fmanalog.mp3 FM IBOC digital sample, in glorious MONO and still plenty filled with obnoxious digital compression effects -- keep in mind this is supposed to be what IBOC will sound like on *FM*: http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/fm-iboc.mp3 Finally, I have just completed an update to the AM Stereo web site, including a new "Experience the AM Stereo Advantage" section with an interesting comparison between regular mono AM sound and hi-fi AM Stereo sound, using 1240 KEVA as the premiere example. Check it out: http://www.AMStereoRadio.com/ Click on "Sound" in the navigation bar or "Experience The AM Stereo Advantage" in the main page. From amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk Sat Jan 11 03:25:33 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Jan 2003 11:25:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 70303 invoked from network); 11 Jan 2003 11:25:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Jan 2003 11:25:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Jan 2003 11:25:31 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.159] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Jan 2003 11:25:31 -0000 Date: Sat, 11 Jan 2003 11:25:28 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} UK IOM LW STATION PLANS TO BROADCAST IN AM STEREO AND DRM! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <004f01c2b8fd$7bd839c0$827dfea9@home1> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 840 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Dave " X-Originating-IP: 213.121.71.8 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113985069 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereofan --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Scott Todd" wrote: > So where did this guy get the idea that DRM is in the US? IBOC isn't DRM, > and DRM isn't compatible with existing analog AM. And Kahn isn't authorized > for stereo use anywhere in the world. He needs an education. > > ST He tells me he means IBOC as DRM and IBOC are compatable but there not are they ? Sorry I have not been following the IBOC threads on here > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > > we are leaning towards the DRM standard at the moment which is fully > > compatible with regular AM and has now been adopted by the ITU. > > Receiver manufacturers are already tooling up and the re are now DRM > > stations broadcasting in 8 major US markets - a good start after just > > a few months. It looks very promising. From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sat Jan 11 04:47:35 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Jan 2003 12:47:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 63562 invoked from network); 11 Jan 2003 12:47:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Jan 2003 12:47:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Jan 2003 12:47:32 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.252] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Jan 2003 12:47:32 -0000 Date: Sat, 11 Jan 2003 12:47:29 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} UK IOM LW STATION PLANS TO BROADCAST IN AM STEREO AND DRM! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2157 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.114 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "wa2fnq " wrote: > I believe at one point DRM had an IBOC (if you will) mode but it too > wouldn't work with AM stereo. The difference is the audio coding. > Ibiquity uses their PAC (perceptual audio coding) which is > proprietary to them. DRM uses mp4. Which brings up this question: Why > are we bothering with this Ibiquity garbage?? > > I wont get into an argument about Kahn. It's simply independant > sideband transmission which can be used for alot of things besides > stereo. > > Jerry WA2FNQ > > > From what little I know about DRM and their hybrid mode is that it used vestigal sideband for the analog portion like TV does. I think the truncated sideband went out to 2.5KHz while the other went to its full bandwidth. To transmitt 2 channels with QuAM you need a double sideband signal so it is possible to do stereo with DRM but only out to 2.5KHz. Any audio above that would have to be mono. It would be somewhat pointless though since you really need at least 6KHz stereo for good imaging effects although you might be suprised with just 2.5KHz stereo and the rest mono for the higher frequencies as RealAudio does something to that effect. I don't know too much about PAC and I don't think anyone else does outside of Lucent other than it uses SBR for fake treble. With all the work that has been put into mpeg encoding I suspect that mp4 is more mature and has better compression algorithms with fewer artifacts with the possibility of having real treble at a low bitrate. Of the few samples I have heard of DRM it does seem to have a more realistic sound than IBOC. ISB does offer superior performance during skywave but it is more complicated to implement properly concerning the audio phasing filters. I never cared too much for the approach that Kahn used sinve complete separation at the receiver isn't possible. If the issue of envelope compatibility wasn't there I think the best stereo scheme is Linear ISB if a good audio phasing filter could be designed, however DSP makes this a simple problem to solve both for transmittion and reception. JSG From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sat Jan 11 04:55:11 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Jan 2003 12:55:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 71277 invoked from network); 11 Jan 2003 12:55:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Jan 2003 12:55:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Jan 2003 12:55:10 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.185] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Jan 2003 12:55:09 -0000 Date: Sat, 11 Jan 2003 12:55:08 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} UK IOM LW STATION PLANS TO BROADCAST IN AM STEREO AND DRM! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20030111045958.20874.qmail@web80213.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 652 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.114 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, MIKE OSWALD wrote: > > > > I keep reading conflicting stories about IBOC and if it can be broadcast in stereo. Can you broadcast in both IBOC and AM Stereo C-QUAM? I have not heard IBOC, but AM Stereo can sound awsome. If IBOC can't broadcast in AM Stereo, in my mind it is a set back in standards of quality. > > 73 > > Mike O > > Houston If IBOC didn't use the quadrature portion for the for the tertiary digital sidebands then it could be used for L-R for the full 4.5KHz analog audio but this would still sound dull as you need at least 6KHz stereo for good separation effects. JSG From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sat Jan 11 05:13:57 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Jan 2003 13:13:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 27373 invoked from network); 11 Jan 2003 13:13:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Jan 2003 13:13:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Jan 2003 13:13:56 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.166] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Jan 2003 13:13:56 -0000 Date: Sat, 11 Jan 2003 13:13:54 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: New IBOC (and AM Stereo) audio samples Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1079 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.114 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: > I visited the IBOC web site at http://www.ibiquity.com/ and was > surprised to discover new audio demos. The AM sample is of 840 KXNT > (currently the flagship IBOC station for the CES in Las Vegas). > > On the web site, the samples are accessed through Shockwave Flash > (.SWF) files, but with a little help from a "Shockwave Decompiler" > program, I was able to losslessly extract the MP3 recordings that are > contained in these Shockwave files, and have made them available on > my server for all to hear: > > 840 KXNT in analog mono AM with 4.5 kHz bandwidth and purposely added > interference: It still has that awful synthetic wishy-washy effect. I don't see how they can say that this sounds like FM Stereo. Just tune to an analog classical FM station that has little processing on a good home receiver and good antenna to get an idea of what analog FM really sounds like. As for the FM iboc sample it suffers from artifacts and definitely isn't CD quality. JSG From stodd@sherbtel.net Sat Jan 11 06:44:46 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Jan 2003 14:44:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 57913 invoked from network); 11 Jan 2003 14:44:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Jan 2003 14:44:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Jan 2003 14:44:45 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-166.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.166]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h0BEieql012425 for ; Sat, 11 Jan 2003 08:44:42 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <003d01c2b980$1d3d3c20$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} schematic / help for MCS 3050 Date: Sat, 11 Jan 2003 08:45:38 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Try www.servicemanuals.net for the service info. Cost will be about $20 with shipping. Is this digital or analog? There may not be any easy way to do it if it's digital, since the tuning range is usually burned into ROM, and not set by jumpers unless it's early generation digital. Analog would be easy- just adjust the oscillator coil and trimmer. Scott Todd ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Friday, January 10, 2003 11:17 PM Subject: {AMSF} schematic / help for MCS 3050 > Hello! > I've stumbled across an older JC Penney MCS 3050 (service number 683- > 3050-00) and need some help from the experts here! > > It stops at the old band limit of 1620 kHz, and I'd dearly love to > have it tune the ex- band if that is possible. Since I managed to get > it to tune LW (altho it lacks the coils and front end, so all it gets > is static at those freqs) I'll wager there is some way to 'trick' it > into tuning slightly above 1620 too. > > Does anyone 1) have a schematic or service manual they can copy -- > I'll be happy to reimburse postage and copying! or failing that > 2) know what jumper to add or cut to expand the synthesizer to allow > tuning outside the 'old' band? > > I'm new to this AM stereo game, but I'm having a blast playing with > it -- I'm just disappointed that there are fewer and fewer stations > offering stereo any more! > > > Thanks for the help //Ken Zichi kvzichi@yahoo.com > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > From evergreenterrace@buzzle.com Sat Jan 11 07:53:06 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: evergreenterrace@buzzle.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Jan 2003 15:53:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 40890 invoked from network); 11 Jan 2003 15:53:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Jan 2003 15:53:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.68) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Jan 2003 15:53:05 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.161] by n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Jan 2003 15:53:01 -0000 Date: Sat, 11 Jan 2003 15:53:00 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: OT: Gates limiter Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 317 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgliradio " X-Originating-IP: 129.44.33.10 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=69711087 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgliradio I've played with two of these in the past. Both had the same problem. Distortion around the 3-5k area if driven hard. I shotgunned the caps in both and it seemed to clear up the audio. As for limiters, yeah, brick wall but with LOTS of IM distortion if driven too hard, which was a product of older limiters. From jeffdeck@aol.com Sat Jan 11 08:54:06 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: Jeffdeck@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Jan 2003 16:54:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 25972 invoked from network); 11 Jan 2003 16:54:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Jan 2003 16:54:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m06.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.161) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Jan 2003 16:54:04 -0000 Received: from Jeffdeck@aol.com by imo-m06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.a3.37304f60 (3866); Sat, 11 Jan 2003 11:54:02 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Sat, 11 Jan 2003 11:54:01 EST Subject: Re: schematic / help for MCS 3050 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Cc: amstereo@bellsouth.net MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10638 From: jeffdeck@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=4430287 X-Yahoo-Profile: jeffdeck2001 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Ken, I have the MCS3050 tuner and schematic diagram. There are many open places on the microprocessor circuit board for diodes to be inserted. One of the diodes may convert it to 9kHz AM spacing, and another diode may enable the extended AM band. Schematic diagram does not specify this, and it is speculation on my part. I doubt that the varactor diodes in the AM front end have enough steam to tune up to 1700kHz. So you may need to replace them with modern version. How did you enable the long wave band? 73, Jeff In a message dated 1/11/2003 12:18:44 AM Eastern Standard Time, Ken writes: >Hello! > I've stumbled across an older JC Penney MCS 3050 (service number 683- >3050-00) and need some help from the experts here! > > It stops at the old band limit of 1620 kHz, and I'd dearly love to >have it tune the ex- band if that is possible. Since I managed to get >it to tune LW (altho it lacks the coils and front end, so all it gets >is static at those freqs) I'll wager there is some way to 'trick' it >into tuning slightly above 1620 too. > > Does anyone 1) have a schematic or service manual they can copy -- >I'll be happy to reimburse postage and copying! or failing that >2) know what jumper to add or cut to expand the synthesizer to allow >tuning outside the 'old' band? > > I'm new to this AM stereo game, but I'm having a blast playing with >it -- I'm just disappointed that there are fewer and fewer stations >offering stereo any more! > > > Thanks for the help //Ken Zichi kvzichi@yahoo.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Sat Jan 11 14:15:56 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Jan 2003 22:15:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 28048 invoked from network); 11 Jan 2003 22:15:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Jan 2003 22:15:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14207.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.173.71) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Jan 2003 22:15:55 -0000 Message-ID: <20030111221555.16330.qmail@web14207.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [204.118.184.114] by web14207.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 11 Jan 2003 14:15:55 PST Date: Sat, 11 Jan 2003 14:15:55 -0800 (PST) Subject: Let your station know how much you appreciate AM Stereo To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio >others wrote: It was only until recently that KNX had the capability to play >commercials in stereo ... the old system was mono only for commercials. >They appear to have moved to a computer-based commercial and jingle >system that is indeed stereo. - Then by all means, please call or write KNX and let them know that you appreciate it. When my local took their CQuam down, they said I was the only that noticed or cared; so let your favorites know how much you appreciate them now when they have AMS or improve upon it. Maybe even mail them a cassette or CD of an aircheck of how well they sound at your location in AM Stereo! __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Sat Jan 11 14:19:44 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Jan 2003 22:19:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 35277 invoked from network); 11 Jan 2003 22:19:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Jan 2003 22:19:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14204.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.146) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Jan 2003 22:19:44 -0000 Message-ID: <20030111221944.63173.qmail@web14204.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [204.118.184.114] by web14204.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 11 Jan 2003 14:19:44 PST Date: Sat, 11 Jan 2003 14:19:44 -0800 (PST) Subject: FCC says NO C-Quam with IBOC To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio IBOC 'CAN' broadcast in stereo, but nobody does. WOR is more of a waste than leaving on your CQuam pilot tone and broadcasting in mono, except they get to cause more interference this way. The FCC ruling says you must NOT run CQuam if you run IBOC. It also says that runing IBOC stereo will satisfy the FCC stereo requirement on the X-band. Too bad they don't enforce stereo with all of the mono cheaters in the X-Band. Are there any AM IBOC stations broadcasting music in (artifact-ladden) stereo or is it all wasted on talk radio BS? __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From jh926@comcast.net Sat Jan 11 15:40:05 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jh926@comcast.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 11 Jan 2003 23:40:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 50780 invoked from network); 11 Jan 2003 23:40:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Jan 2003 23:40:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO smtp.comcast.net) (24.153.64.2) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Jan 2003 23:40:04 -0000 Received: from -enduser.comcast.net (pcp03184855pcs.benslm01.pa.comcast.net [68.80.77.117]) by mtaout06.icomcast.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.07 (built Nov 25 2002)) with ESMTP id <0H8K0045VPPVOD@mtaout06.icomcast.net> for amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com; Sat, 11 Jan 2003 18:39:36 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 11 Jan 2003 18:40:39 -0500 Subject: Re: {AMSF} New IBOC (and AM Stereo) audio samples In-reply-to: X-Sender: jh926@mail.comcast.net To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Message-id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030111183906.04e58dc0@mail.comcast.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT From: John X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public I think AM Stereo sounds the best. The samples on your site that you uploaded from IBOC's thinggy sounds like utter crap! On the FM signal from them, it sounds like the highs are going on and off and on and off. The AM Stereo thing also has very low frequency response from them as well. At 09:26 AM 1/11/03 +0000, you wrote: >I visited the IBOC web site at http://www.ibiquity.com/ and was >surprised to discover new audio demos. The AM sample is of 840 KXNT >(currently the flagship IBOC station for the CES in Las Vegas). > >On the web site, the samples are accessed through Shockwave Flash >(.SWF) files, but with a little help from a "Shockwave Decompiler" >program, I was able to losslessly extract the MP3 recordings that are >contained in these Shockwave files, and have made them available on >my server for all to hear: > >840 KXNT in analog mono AM with 4.5 kHz bandwidth and purposely added >interference: >http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/amanalog.mp3 > >840 KXNT in digital IBOC audio, with Stereo-like sound... judge for >yourself the quality (or lack thereof!): >http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/am-iboc.mp3 > >Analog FM sample, purposely off-tuned or with poor signal strength: >http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/fmanalog.mp3 > >FM IBOC digital sample, in glorious MONO and still plenty filled with >obnoxious digital compression effects -- keep in mind this is >supposed to be what IBOC will sound like on *FM*: >http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/fm-iboc.mp3 > > >Finally, I have just completed an update to the AM Stereo web site, >including a new "Experience the AM Stereo Advantage" section with an >interesting comparison between regular mono AM sound and hi-fi AM >Stereo sound, using 1240 KEVA as the premiere example. Check it out: >http://www.AMStereoRadio.com/ >Click on "Sound" in the navigation bar or "Experience The AM Stereo >Advantage" in the main page. > > > >Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From KC4QLP@aol.com Sat Jan 11 16:08:35 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Jan 2003 00:08:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 70169 invoked from network); 12 Jan 2003 00:08:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Jan 2003 00:08:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r08.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.104) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Jan 2003 00:08:34 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.9c.2c2d2b88 (4418) for ; Sat, 11 Jan 2003 19:08:26 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <9c.2c2d2b88.2b520bfa@aol.com> Date: Sat, 11 Jan 2003 19:08:26 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} FCC says NO C-Quam with IBOC To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 1/11/03 5:21:18 PM Eastern Standard Time, toledohamradio@yahoo.com writes: << The FCC ruling says you must NOT run CQuam if you run IBOC. It also says that runing IBOC stereo will satisfy the FCC stereo requirement on the X-band. Too bad they don't enforce stereo with all of the mono cheaters in the X-Band. >> You can not operate C-Quam stereo and IBOC at the same time anyways as both systems use the same method of modulation.To make a ruling that you cant do both at the same time was kinda dumb really. Just goes to show the FCC is run by a bunch of lawyers and very few engineer types. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- Subscribe send an email to amstereo-subscribe@topica.com _______________________________________________________ From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Jan 11 20:53:23 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Jan 2003 04:53:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 52189 invoked from network); 12 Jan 2003 04:53:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Jan 2003 04:53:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.69) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Jan 2003 04:53:22 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.142] by n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 12 Jan 2003 04:53:22 -0000 Date: Sun, 12 Jan 2003 04:53:22 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: IBOC, DRM, and DAB Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2201 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.80.137 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > you might be suprised with just 2.5KHz stereo and the rest mono for > the higher frequencies as RealAudio does something to that effect. Under "challenging" audio conditions, such as nearly or completely out-of-phase audio, RealAudio chops off the Stereo separation at 3 kHz. RealAudio 8.0 can actually be surprisingly good in Stereo at as low as 32 kbps, such as a web-cast over a "56K" modem (those from the BBC are excellent), but it depends a lot on the source audio. Some music is "easy" to digitally compress and will provide very good results, while other music -- especially that with a lot of complex phasing effects -- will quickly bring the encoder to its knees and produce a very obvious degradation of the audio. As you can hear from the samples I linked to, IBOC acts in this same way. The only consistent advantage it provides over analog radio is a lower noise floor (higher S/N ratio). Every other aspect can be easily matched or exceeded by a well-processed analog AM Stereo or FM Stereo station -- distortion, frequency response, Stereo separation, etc. > I don't know too much about PAC and I don't think anyone else does > outside of Lucent other than it uses SBR for fake treble. The encoding system used by IBOC is very similar to "AAC", which a few portable MP3-type players support. On the other hand, the Euro/Canadian DAB system uses plain MP2 encoding -- the same as found on the audio track of Video CDs and some DVDs -- at bit rates ranging from 64 kbps mono to 192 kbps Stereo. Here is a sample of BBC Radio 2's DAB stream at 160 kbps... this is an actual bit-for-bit copy of the digital data stream that was sent to DAB receivers in the U.K.... http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/r2dab.mp2 Most popular audio programs will support MP2 files, such as Windows Media Player, RealPlayer, and WinAmp. DAB is actually streamed at a sampling rate of 48 kbps, which is higher than the CD standard of 44.1 kbps, although no useful benefit is provided, due to the limitations of the MP2 encoding (which many say sounds bad at 128 kbps or less -- but these people should hear IBOC and then they'll think it sounds fantastic in comparison!). From rwagoner@cox.net Sat Jan 11 23:11:44 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner@cox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Jan 2003 07:11:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 70737 invoked from network); 12 Jan 2003 07:11:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Jan 2003 07:11:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.70) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Jan 2003 07:11:44 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.157] by n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 12 Jan 2003 07:11:44 -0000 Date: Sun, 12 Jan 2003 07:11:44 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: New IBOC (and AM Stereo) audio samples Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1989 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Richard Wagoner " X-Originating-IP: 68.4.33.253 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=96123889 X-Yahoo-Profile: richardalanwagoner It is telling that they must resort to poorly tuned/received stations (the FM sounds like there is no antenna connected) to make the IBOC sound "better." Let's compare the AM sample (or FM for that matter) with my old Fisher tube receiver or my Carver TX11b ... Richard --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: > I visited the IBOC web site at http://www.ibiquity.com/ and was > surprised to discover new audio demos. The AM sample is of 840 KXNT > (currently the flagship IBOC station for the CES in Las Vegas). > > On the web site, the samples are accessed through Shockwave Flash > (.SWF) files, but with a little help from a "Shockwave Decompiler" > program, I was able to losslessly extract the MP3 recordings that are > contained in these Shockwave files, and have made them available on > my server for all to hear: > > 840 KXNT in analog mono AM with 4.5 kHz bandwidth and purposely added > interference: > http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/amanalog.mp3 > > 840 KXNT in digital IBOC audio, with Stereo-like sound... judge for > yourself the quality (or lack thereof!): > http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/am-iboc.mp3 > > Analog FM sample, purposely off-tuned or with poor signal strength: > http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/fmanalog.mp3 > > FM IBOC digital sample, in glorious MONO and still plenty filled with > obnoxious digital compression effects -- keep in mind this is > supposed to be what IBOC will sound like on *FM*: > http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/fm-iboc.mp3 > > > Finally, I have just completed an update to the AM Stereo web site, > including a new "Experience the AM Stereo Advantage" section with an > interesting comparison between regular mono AM sound and hi-fi AM > Stereo sound, using 1240 KEVA as the premiere example. Check it out: > http://www.AMStereoRadio.com/ > Click on "Sound" in the navigation bar or "Experience The AM Stereo > Advantage" in the main page. From dav259@csiro.au Sat Jan 11 23:42:48 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Jan 2003 07:42:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 39536 invoked from network); 12 Jan 2003 07:42:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Jan 2003 07:42:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Jan 2003 07:42:47 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0C7gkP22110 for ; Sun, 12 Jan 2003 18:42:46 +1100 (EST) Date: Sun, 12 Jan 2003 18:42:46 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Subject: Re: {AMSF} FCC says NO C-Quam with IBOC In-Reply-To: <20030111221944.63173.qmail@web14204.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public On Sat, 11 Jan 2003, John P. wrote: > IBOC 'CAN' broadcast in stereo, but nobody does. WOR is more of a waste than > leaving on your CQuam pilot tone and broadcasting in mono, except they get to > cause more interference this way. Johnny - you mean to say that those AM stations broadcasting in IBOC are transmitting mono??? I feel like Bazil Fawlty ... What's the flaming point???!!! Should IBOC actually succeed on the FM band (doubtful) - then AM would be a poorer relation that it is perceived to be even now. Is there a chance we could organise some sort of effort to contact every AM stereo station with a view for them to form a loose alliance to lobby the manufacturers of Symphony system radios to include C-quam stereo? Ian Melbourne From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Jan 12 02:03:36 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Jan 2003 10:03:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 43113 invoked from network); 12 Jan 2003 10:03:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Jan 2003 10:03:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Jan 2003 10:03:35 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.143] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 12 Jan 2003 10:03:35 -0000 Date: Sun, 12 Jan 2003 10:03:35 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Radio World: "HD Radio's Advances Generate Buzz" Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1997 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.96.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics I thought this article was ironically named (perhaps intentionally?), because on the FM band, that's exactly what IBOC, a.k.a. "HD Radio" generates -- a buzzing noise heard on either side of the signal, as opposed to the hissing "hash" of IBOC on the AM band. HD Radio's Advances Generate Buzz ================================= Radio World January 10, 2003 "Today's the day the baby finally leaves the nest." That's what Ibiquity President/CEO Robert Struble told attendees at its press conference at CES. He was referring to Ibiquity's technology being ready to transfer to development partners, such as receiver manufacturers and broadcasters, so they in turn can present it to consumers. The HD Radio announcements brought together some folks who often are friendly foes. CEA President/CEO Gary Shapiro said, "This show increasingly focuses on the digital lifestyle. Almost every American understands what CD quality is." He recalled that NAB and CEA both began in 1924 and shared an office in New York. Radio remains an important part of the industry, Shapiro said, and the dawning of HD Radio is critical. NAB's John Orlando said HD Radio would enhance the listener experience. "It's all going to be brought to them for free." Tweeter representative Bernie Sapienza said terrestrial radio going digital gives receiver manufactures a chance to talk about the tuner spec and "rejuvenate those price points." Kenwood USA's Bob Law said the dawning of HD Radio is an opportunity to replace existing product. "The potential we see is astounding." Delphi is testing various in-dash and aftermarket HD Radio prototypes with station WSHW(FM), Frankfurt Ind., near Delphi's Kokomo plant. Bob Schumacher said Delphi engineers are driving cars equipped with HD Radios to test for multipath issues, pops, fades, etc. The goal is to test under all conditions and stress the radio. Delphi OEM's and aftermarket HD Radios are available for automakers now, he said. From florida_amstereo@hotmail.com Sun Jan 12 04:54:53 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: florida_amstereo@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Jan 2003 12:54:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 5774 invoked from network); 12 Jan 2003 12:54:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Jan 2003 12:54:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.37.141) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Jan 2003 12:54:52 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 12 Jan 2003 04:54:23 -0800 Received: from 209.240.198.61 by pv2fd.pav2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Sun, 12 Jan 2003 12:54:23 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Re: [Dennis' AM Stereo List] - Re: Motorola Symphony Receiver Date: Sun, 12 Jan 2003 12:54:23 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 12 Jan 2003 12:54:23.0770 (UTC) FILETIME=[BB4727A0:01C2BA39] From: "Donn Tillman" X-Originating-IP: [209.240.198.61] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83914824 I certainly don't think we're shooting ourselves in the foot by letting the manufactures of radios know that we know that with the Symphony chip that can add am-stereo and diplomatically suggesting that they do. I also agree with Ian (or whoever else might have suggested it) that it would be nice if existing am stereo stations formed some type of alliance or organization to help am stereo along. I seems to me that many smaller stations are very dissatisfied with the N.A.B., so maybe another alliance is needed that would promote the causes of "Mom and Pop"(and even the smaller chains, i.e. Crawford) stations; i.e. am stereo and also live and local programming during at least morning and afternoon drive times. donn st petersburg, fl ----Original Message Follows---- From: Ian Davidson Reply-To: amstereo@bellsouth.net To: Dennis' AM Stereo List Subject: [Dennis' AM Stereo List] - Re: Motorola Symphony Receiver Date: Sun, 12 Jan 2003 18:27:01 +1100 (EST) On Sat, 11 Jan 2003, Scott Todd wrote: > I think we're shooting ourselves in the foot by saying the Symphony chipset > has AMS. It can be ADDED, but it DOESN'T come with it BUILT IN. As I said yesterday ... "One thing we have to consider soon (NOW!) is how we can convince the NAB to actually get the manufacturers of Symphony receivers to include C-Quam. Any thoughts???" Ian _________________________________________________________________ The new MSN 8 is here: Try it free* for 2 months http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/dialup From fanfare@globility.com Sun Jan 12 06:36:07 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Jan 2003 14:36:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 19415 invoked from network); 12 Jan 2003 14:36:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Jan 2003 14:36:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.eol.ca) (205.189.151.1) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Jan 2003 14:36:07 -0000 Received: from FAN--MCS (dynamic-b2-195.highspeed.eol.ca [64.56.234.195]) by mail.eol.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id A05A642C69 for ; Sun, 12 Jan 2003 09:36:24 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <200301120936050578.00120BEF@mail.globility.com> In-Reply-To: References: X-Mailer: Calypso Version 3.30.00.00 (4) Date: Sun, 12 Jan 2003 09:36:05 -0500 To: "Kevin Tekel" Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: [Dennis' AM Stereo List] - Re: Motorola Symphony Receiver Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable From: "Marv Southcott" Reply-To: fanfare@globility.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy Hi Donn: I don't know if such an animal exists, but would there not be some benefit = to forming an alliance of independent broadcasters which would consist of o= wners of less than, let's say (no more than) 2 stations. They could develop= their own voice for congress, rather than be tossed around like a rag doll= by the big guys, and by the FCC. Just a private thought.=20=20 Cheers, Marv *********** REPLY SEPARATOR *********** On 1/12/2003 at 12:54 PM Donn Tillman wrote: >I certainly don't think we're shooting ourselves in the foot by letting >the=20 >manufactures of radios know that we know that with the Symphony chip that= =20 >can add am-stereo and diplomatically suggesting that they do. > >I also agree with Ian (or whoever else might have suggested it) that it=20 >would be nice if existing am stereo stations formed some type of alliance >or=20 >organization to help am stereo along. > >I seems to me that many smaller stations are very dissatisfied with the=20 >N.A.B., so maybe another alliance is needed that would promote the causes >of=20 >"Mom and Pop"(and even the smaller chains, i.e. Crawford) stations; i.e. >am=20 >stereo and also live and local programming during at least morning and=20 >afternoon drive times. > >donn >st petersburg, fl > >----Original Message Follows---- >From: Ian Davidson >Reply-To: amstereo@bellsouth.net >To: Dennis' AM Stereo List >Subject: [Dennis' AM Stereo List] - Re: Motorola Symphony Receiver >Date: Sun, 12 Jan 2003 18:27:01 +1100 (EST) > >On Sat, 11 Jan 2003, Scott Todd wrote: > > > I think we're shooting ourselves in the foot by saying the Symphony=20 >chipset > > has AMS. It can be ADDED, but it DOESN'T come with it BUILT IN. > >As I said yesterday ... > >"One thing we have to consider soon (NOW!) is how we can convince the NAB >to actually get the manufacturers of Symphony receivers to include C-Quam. > >Any thoughts???" > >Ian > > > >_________________________________________________________________ >The new MSN 8 is here: Try it free* for 2 months=20 >http://join.msn.com/?page=3Ddept/dialup > > >Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum=20 > >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From florida_amstereo@hotmail.com Sun Jan 12 06:59:50 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: florida_amstereo@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Jan 2003 14:59:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 21133 invoked from network); 12 Jan 2003 14:59:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Jan 2003 14:59:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.37.59) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Jan 2003 14:59:49 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 12 Jan 2003 06:58:27 -0800 Received: from 209.240.198.61 by pv2fd.pav2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Sun, 12 Jan 2003 14:58:27 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: [Dennis' AM Stereo List] - Re: Motorola Symphony Receiver Date: Sun, 12 Jan 2003 14:58:27 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 12 Jan 2003 14:58:27.0827 (UTC) FILETIME=[10481C30:01C2BA4B] From: "Donn Tillman" X-Originating-IP: [209.240.198.61] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83914824 Marv, the am-stereo manufacturer and genius scribed: >"I don't know if such an animal >exists, but would there not be some > >benefit to forming an alliance of >independent broadcasters which would >consist of owners of less than, let's say (no more than) 2 stations. They >could develop their own voice for congress, rather than be tossed around >like a rag doll by the big guys, and by the FCC. ~~~~ Great minds think alike! :) That's more or less what I was suggesting, perhaps it should be open to all stations (mono as well as stereo); however I would say that now in the U.S.; even a chain with with less than 15 stations would be considered a "small operation", so I would say any entity that owned 15 stations or less could band together to lobby for the cause of good radio as opposed to the drivel heard on most U.S. stations these days. donn in chilly 10 degrees c. (at 9am) st pete Marv *********** REPLY SEPARATOR *********** On 1/12/2003 at 12:54 PM Donn Tillman wrote: >I certainly don't think we're shooting ourselves in the foot by letting >the >manufactures of radios know that we know that with the Symphony chip that >can add am-stereo and diplomatically suggesting that they do. > >I also agree with Ian (or whoever else might have suggested it) that it >would be nice if existing am stereo stations formed some type of alliance >or >organization to help am stereo along. > >I seems to me that many smaller stations are very dissatisfied with the >N.A.B., so maybe another alliance is needed that would promote the causes >of >"Mom and Pop"(and even the smaller chains, i.e. Crawford) stations; i.e. >am >stereo and also live and local programming during at least morning and >afternoon drive times. > >donn >st petersburg, fl > _________________________________________________________________ The new MSN 8: smart spam protection and 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail From florida_amstereo@hotmail.com Sun Jan 12 07:14:57 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: florida_amstereo@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Jan 2003 15:14:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 73709 invoked from network); 12 Jan 2003 15:14:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Jan 2003 15:14:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.37.156) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Jan 2003 15:14:55 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 12 Jan 2003 07:11:58 -0800 Received: from 209.240.198.61 by pv2fd.pav2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Sun, 12 Jan 2003 15:11:58 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Two Sad losses this week.... Date: Sun, 12 Jan 2003 15:11:58 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 12 Jan 2003 15:11:58.0718 (UTC) FILETIME=[F39C41E0:01C2BA4C] From: "Donn Tillman" X-Originating-IP: [209.240.198.61] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83914824 Sad that we will no longer hear (live at least) two voices, that have been heard on am (stereo where available) radio and t.v. Maurice Gibb died this morning in Miami Beach as a result of complications from surgery to fix a blocked intestine. Maurice and his brothers have entertained several generations with their music and the soundtrack from "Saturday Night Fever". The Saturday Night Fever" soundtrack sold more than 40 million copies. Maurice was preceeded in death by younger half-brother and singer Andy Gibb. Also, Sarah McClendon, age 92; who asked all presidents, Republicans and Democrats the hard edged questions that most of us would want to ask. She was at press conferences from President Roosevelt, to the current Bush administration. It is said that her hard edged questions to President Eisenhower, so infuriated him, that the veins in his neck would stick out. She once remarked that he should spend less time on the golf course and more time getting to know the American people. donn, St Petersburg _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8: advanced junk mail protection and 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail From wa2fnq@optonline.net Sun Jan 12 09:34:22 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: wa2fnq@optonline.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Jan 2003 17:34:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 63975 invoked from network); 12 Jan 2003 17:34:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Jan 2003 17:34:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Jan 2003 17:34:21 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.177] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 12 Jan 2003 17:34:21 -0000 Date: Sun, 12 Jan 2003 17:34:20 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} UK IOM LW STATION PLANS TO BROADCAST IN AM STEREO AND DRM! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 614 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wa2fnq " X-Originating-IP: 24.47.74.230 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=60059615 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa2fnq It's been done already. See: http://home.att.net/~broadcast_techniques/index.html Jerry WA2FNQ > ISB does offer superior performance during skywave but it is more > complicated to implement properly concerning the audio phasing > filters. I never cared too much for the approach that Kahn used > sinve complete separation at the receiver isn't possible. > If the issue of envelope compatibility wasn't there I think the > best stereo scheme is Linear ISB if a good audio phasing filter > could be designed, however DSP makes this a simple problem to > solve both for transmittion and reception. > > JSG From stodd@sherbtel.net Sun Jan 12 12:12:30 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Jan 2003 20:12:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 17377 invoked from network); 12 Jan 2003 20:12:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Jan 2003 20:12:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Jan 2003 20:12:27 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-173.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.173]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h0CKCOql017906 for ; Sun, 12 Jan 2003 14:12:25 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <000901c2ba77$11373320$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: OT: Gates limiter Date: Sun, 12 Jan 2003 14:13:24 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Kevin- looked for my limiter books, and the only ones I have are for the FM version of this limiter. If this is good enough for you, I'll copy it to send your way. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: > As for limiters, yeah, brick wall but with LOTS of IM distortion if > driven too hard, which was a product of older limiters. > From evergreenterrace@buzzle.com Sun Jan 12 12:17:56 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: evergreenterrace@buzzle.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 12 Jan 2003 20:17:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 19008 invoked from network); 12 Jan 2003 20:17:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Jan 2003 20:17:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Jan 2003 20:17:55 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.133] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 12 Jan 2003 20:17:54 -0000 Date: Sun, 12 Jan 2003 20:17:53 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: New IBOC (and AM Stereo) audio samples Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 324 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgliradio " X-Originating-IP: 170.20.11.59 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=69711087 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgliradio The IBOC samples are horrible. Analog FM sounds so much better than the bit-compressed audio demonstrated in these samples. As for the AM stereo/ AM mono sample on your page, I actually thought the wideband mono sample sounded very good (the stereo, minus the MP3 sampling, sounded better, but the mono was no slouch). From groucho@skyweb.net Sun Jan 12 16:41:51 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Jan 2003 00:41:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 22312 invoked from network); 13 Jan 2003 00:41:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Jan 2003 00:41:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Jan 2003 00:41:51 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (tc1-112.skyweb.net [66.6.130.240]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h0D0nex1065878; Sun, 12 Jan 2003 19:49:41 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3E220972.A3BC85C5@skyweb.net> Date: Sun, 12 Jan 2003 19:33:55 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ABDX@topica.com, "amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com" Subject: Re: [ ABDX ] Low power AM web sites References: <2136109468-1463792126-1042404665@topica.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 speaking Of low Power there seems to Be 2 New pirates on the air in New Jersey. I am trying to Find them both are spanish religious... Geee these guys come to this country with No regard to federal regulations.... and put up radio stations where they Feel like it.. one is in the Linden/Elizabeth area on 87.9Fm stereo. with a signal sometimes On 1620 resonating the Detuning stub of a local Cell tower talk about Clever.... the other one is somewhere Near the WTTM studios around the PlainField area On 107.9fm and 1620am anyone else here in NJ hear these stations Neal CE WTTM "Patrick Griffith, N0NNK / WPE9HVW" wrote: > Here are a couple of web sites that might be of interest. > > http://www.talkingsign.com/index.htm has information about the talking > sign transmitters that have been poppng up in various areas. > > http://www.issinfosite.com/nps_stations.htm has a listing of some of the > National Park Service TIS stations. ISS is a manufacturer of TIS > equipment. I believe this list only includes stations with transmitters > supplied by this company. > > Patrick Griffith, CBT, Westminster, CO, USA > > http://community.webtv.net/N0NNK/ > http://community.webtv.net/AM-DXer/ > > ======================== > American Broadcast DXers > Greatest DX on earth! > ======================== > > ==^================================================================ > This email was sent to: groucho@skyweb.net > > EASY UNSUBSCRIBE click here: http://topica.com/u/?bUrKzU.bWeP3W.Z3JvdWNo > Or send an email to: ABDX-unsubscribe@topica.com > > TOPICA - Start your own email discussion group. FREE! > http://www.topica.com/partner/tag02/create/index2.html > ==^================================================================ From JH_Radio@GameBox.net Sun Jan 12 18:01:25 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: JH_Radio@GameBox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Jan 2003 02:01:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 5738 invoked from network); 13 Jan 2003 02:01:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Jan 2003 02:01:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO snickers.hotpop.com) (204.57.55.49) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Jan 2003 02:01:24 -0000 Received: from gamebox.net (kubrick.hotpop.com [204.57.55.16]) by snickers.hotpop.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 3031A76AB3 for ; Mon, 13 Jan 2003 02:01:16 +0000 (UTC) Received: from -enduser.GameBox.net (pcp03184855pcs.benslm01.pa.comcast.net [68.80.77.117]) by smtp-1.hotpop.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9E04A2F8121 for ; Mon, 13 Jan 2003 02:01:13 +0000 (UTC) Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030112210509.02df6120@pop.GameBox.net> X-Sender: JH_Radio@pop.GameBox.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Sun, 12 Jan 2003 21:05:49 -0500 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: [ ABDX ] Low power AM web sites In-Reply-To: <3E220972.A3BC85C5@skyweb.net> References: <2136109468-1463792126-1042404665@topica.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-HotPOP: ----------------------------------------------- Sent By HotPOP.com FREE Email Get your FREE POP email at www.HotPOP.com ----------------------------------------------- From: John X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113800107 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Other then not being legal, if they are not interfering with anyone, what is the problem with having a pirate on the air? At 07:33 PM 1/12/03 -0500, you wrote: > speaking Of low Power > there seems to Be 2 New pirates on the air in New Jersey. I am trying to >Find them > both are spanish religious... Geee these guys come to this country with No >regard to federal regulations.... and put up radio stations where they Feel >like it.. one is in the Linden/Elizabeth area on 87.9Fm stereo. with a >signal sometimes On 1620 resonating > the Detuning stub of a local Cell tower talk about Clever.... > the other one is somewhere Near the WTTM studios around the PlainField >area On 107.9fm and 1620am > anyone else here in NJ hear these stations > > Neal >CE WTTM > >"Patrick Griffith, N0NNK / WPE9HVW" wrote: > >> Here are a couple of web sites that might be of interest. >> >> http://www.talkingsign.com/index.htm has information about the talking >> sign transmitters that have been poppng up in various areas. >> >> http://www.issinfosite.com/nps_stations.htm has a listing of some of the >> National Park Service TIS stations. ISS is a manufacturer of TIS >> equipment. I believe this list only includes stations with transmitters >> supplied by this company. >> >> Patrick Griffith, CBT, Westminster, CO, USA >> >> http://community.webtv.net/N0NNK/ >> http://community.webtv.net/AM-DXer/ >> >> ======================== >> American Broadcast DXers >> Greatest DX on earth! >> ======================== >> >> ==^================================================================ >> This email was sent to: groucho@skyweb.net >> >> EASY UNSUBSCRIBE click here: http://topica.com/u/?bUrKzU.bWeP3W.Z3JvdWNo >> Or send an email to: ABDX-unsubscribe@topica.com >> >> TOPICA - Start your own email discussion group. FREE! >> http://www.topica.com/partner/tag02/create/index2.html >> ==^================================================================ > > >Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Love in Christ: John Bensalem, PA Send me an email Aim: RainAngelsRule MSN: RainAngelsRule@hotmail.com My website Welcome to Napster4TheBlind "Prayer does not change God; it changes you." - Authur unknown [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From groucho@skyweb.net Sun Jan 12 18:19:23 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Jan 2003 02:19:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 75641 invoked from network); 13 Jan 2003 02:19:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Jan 2003 02:19:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Jan 2003 02:19:22 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (tc1-112.skyweb.net [66.6.130.240]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h0D2RBx1084151 for ; Sun, 12 Jan 2003 21:27:11 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3E222052.BE864093@skyweb.net> Date: Sun, 12 Jan 2003 21:11:30 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: [ ABDX ] Low power AM web sites References: <2136109468-1463792126-1042404665@topica.com> <5.2.0.9.0.20030112210509.02df6120@pop.GameBox.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Because the 107.9 is Interfering with the local high school station WWPH down in Plainsboro,NJ which is Licensed on 107.9 at 170 watts. besides It may also be the same group that just acquired 1070 am in Sterling.. a spanish church. that Just happens to be located In Plainfield. Not good if its the same group to have a Licensed AM station and Run a Pirated FM... It seem to have a really strong signal In the area.. Covers about 15 miles... Neal John wrote: > Other then not being legal, if they are not interfering with anyone, what is the problem with having a pirate on the air? > At 07:33 PM 1/12/03 -0500, you wrote: > > speaking Of low Power > > there seems to Be 2 New pirates on the air in New Jersey. I am trying to > >Find them > > both are spanish religious... Geee these guys come to this country with No > >regard to federal regulations.... and put up radio stations where they Feel > >like it.. one is in the Linden/Elizabeth area on 87.9Fm stereo. with a > >signal sometimes On 1620 resonating > > the Detuning stub of a local Cell tower talk about Clever.... > > the other one is somewhere Near the WTTM studios around the PlainField > >area On 107.9fm and 1620am > > anyone else here in NJ hear these stations > > > > Neal > >CE WTTM > > > >"Patrick Griffith, N0NNK / WPE9HVW" wrote: > > > >> Here are a couple of web sites that might be of interest. > >> > >> http://www.talkingsign.com/index.htm has information about the talking > >> sign transmitters that have been poppng up in various areas. > >> > >> http://www.issinfosite.com/nps_stations.htm has a listing of some of the > >> National Park Service TIS stations. ISS is a manufacturer of TIS > >> equipment. I believe this list only includes stations with transmitters > >> supplied by this company. > >> > >> Patrick Griffith, CBT, Westminster, CO, USA > >> > >> http://community.webtv.net/N0NNK/ > >> http://community.webtv.net/AM-DXer/ > >> > >> ======================== > >> American Broadcast DXers > >> Greatest DX on earth! > >> ======================== > >> > >> ==^================================================================ > >> This email was sent to: groucho@skyweb.net > >> > >> EASY UNSUBSCRIBE click here: http://topica.com/u/?bUrKzU.bWeP3W.Z3JvdWNo > >> Or send an email to: ABDX-unsubscribe@topica.com > >> > >> TOPICA - Start your own email discussion group. FREE! > >> http://www.topica.com/partner/tag02/create/index2.html > >> ==^================================================================ > > > > > >Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > > >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > > Love in Christ: > > John > > Bensalem, PA > > Send me an email > > Aim: RainAngelsRule > > MSN: > > RainAngelsRule@hotmail.com > > My website > > Welcome to Napster4TheBlind > > "Prayer does not change God; it changes you." - Authur unknown > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From tomray@wor710.com Sun Jan 12 18:28:24 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: tomray@wor710.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Jan 2003 02:28:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 11903 invoked from network); 13 Jan 2003 02:28:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Jan 2003 02:28:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.67) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Jan 2003 02:28:24 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.156] by n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Jan 2003 02:28:24 -0000 Date: Mon, 13 Jan 2003 02:28:22 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Ooh, I'm scared... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 7948 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wortomray " X-Originating-IP: 66.67.228.6 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: > WOR's engineers have always been very self-defensive about anything > which can be seen as a claim that they are violating any FCC rules... > first, about the amount of "splatter" from the IBOC onto adjacent > channels... and now this. > > If WOR is truly operating in full accordance with FCC rules, then it > makes you wonder why they get so worked up about even the slightest > of comments from a group of "crackpot" (as they have called us) > AM Stereo fanatics. You know, Mr. Tekel, I've had just about enough of your bullcrap. You want to know why I'm defensive about any claims of illegal operation? IT'S BECAUSE YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT THE HELL YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT!! And you are spreading blatant LIES, which our station attorneys call slander and libel. You should be thankful that I haven't unleashed the lawyers yet. They would have a field day with you. I take great pride in my job and in the condition of the WOR transmitter facility. When I started with WOR 5-1/2 years ago, the facility was in worse than poor condition, and it was off the air more than it was on. Within 6 months, I had the facility rewired, all levels from the STL's balanced, and a new transmitter installed. In 2002 we logged approximately 10 minutes total off the air, not counting maintenance time, for the entire year. The 10 minutes is attributable to power issues which are out of our control. We spent approximately 3 hours off the air in 2002 to tighten connections in the antenna system. And our operation is completely above board. Buckley Broadcasting does not run it's stations any other way. Let's see....what have you accused me of? ---Illegal occupied bandwidth. The bandwidth restrictions are spelled out in the FCC regulations. Maybe you should familiarize yourself with them. ---Overpower operation. This showed your blatant ignorance of the FCC regulations, particularly 73.51. WOR does not operate over power. ---Violating the "daytime only" rule. Once again, the FCC regulations spell out that a station has +/- 3 minutes to correct an apparrent illegal situation, ie, mode change. We are perfectly legal. ---Violations regarding our nighttime IBOC testing. Have you ever seen our STA? And do you know the conditions attached to it? All STA's are not created equally, and you are assuming that our STA is a "general" STA that most stations would get for IBOC operation. You would do good to study the FCC regulations, as you are extremely ignorant of the subparts of the rules. Before you open your mouth and accuse me or anyone else of doing something illegal, you should have your facts straight and know what you are talking about. Incidentally, Kerry Richards and I have both invited you to tour both the WOR studios and transmitter facility.....numerous times. You have yet to even acknowlege our invitations. What do you think is going to happen? That we're going to drag you out into the tower field and connect you to one of the towers? It flabbergasts me that you can spout off on topics you have no intimate knowlege of except what you think you know or have heard from others. And there are people on this board who actually think you know what you're talking about.....that's even more disturbing. If you really knew me the way you portray me, you would know that I run an extremely clean transmitter facility and there are no rule violations. I have been doing this for almost 26 years and have a reputation for running the cleanest shop in town wherever I have worked. And it's the same here in New York. I have literally walked out of facilities when an owner or manager has demanded that I operate a station at variance from the rules. If the FCC were to walk in tomorrow, they would leave after patting me on the back and shaking my hand, as in numerous other inspections I have been through in my career. No station I have worked at has ever been fined, much less written up, while I have run the Engineering department. Can you say the same? > Meanwhile, I have discussed with them the "ringing" type of > distortion that is constantly present in their audio (even at night > with the IBOC off), but they basically told me that they have no > intention of getting it fixed, and that they don't even consider it > to be a problem. That's right. It is a function of the filtering to 5kHz in the audio processor, and cannot be heard on a "typical" AM radio. I do not hear it in my car. I do not hear it at home. I hear it only in broadband monitors at the station, and I can hear it on the output of the processor. There is nothing to fix. Oh. And I notice now that you are stating that IBOC is responsible for the drop in this ratings book. What you neglected to mention is that WABC took just as significant a drop in ratings, worse than WOR did. And they're not running IBOC. To what do you atrribute this, you're so smart? We atrribute it to Arbitron diary placement, seeing as both talker competitors took a drop. If Arbitron places the diaries in locations that do not typically listen to talk radio, the stations will drop in the ratings. It has nothing to do with IBOC. Incidentally, I asked my friendly Harris rep the other day if I could buy an AM stereo exciter. After he recomposed himself, he was laughing so hard, he stated that an AM stereo exciter is no longer on their parts lists, and hasn't been for a few years. He doubted that he could get me one external, but thought he could scrounge up an internal board for the DX-50.....but it would be costly because he thought it would need to be specially built. Oh yes. And Kerry has shared with me your plans to have AM stereo decoders built. Save your money. Which brings me to my next statement. I guess I will be getting the last laugh. Numerous groups committed to putting IBOC on last week, several stations in New Jersey! Like Greater Media. And that was ALL stations, AM and FM. Are you going to accuse them of illegal operation, too? And why haven't you mentioned the station at 1400 in either Louisiana or Alabama, I forget where, that is presently running IBOC 24/7? No comment about their "illegal operation"? My prediction is that, by or at NAB (where I am presenting a paper on AM IBOC implementation, by the way, so I guess I DO know what I'm talking about!), the FCC will have a ruling on AM nighttime operation, and I'm willing to bet that it will be reduced IBOC sidebands for critical hours, full blast at all other times. Guess the fun is just beginning for you, eh? IBOC is here and it's not going away soon. Incidentally, I took a CD I made from an IBOC play session around to my neighbors this weekend. Didn't tell them what I had, but asked them to listen and write down the cut numbers of what they would prefer to listen to if they heard these songs on their car radios driving to work. There were two cuts per song....analog, followed by HD. Every one of them picked the HD versions. They were very surprised to find out that the HD versions were actually an AM radio station. And every one of them asked me where they could get an HD radio. These people are typical Americans. They know what I do for a living, and none of them hang around with me at the transmitter, but they know that if they need their equalizers on their stereo's set up, they call Tom because it will always sound good when I'm done. So with no up front knowlege of HD radio, they picked the HD cuts over analog. Maybe it's the power of suggestion? Did I hypnotize them? You have a lot to learn about life and this business, my friend. Too bad you don't take the time to do so. You'd be good in this business, especially if you opened your mind to new technologies. From groucho@skyweb.net Sun Jan 12 18:35:58 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Jan 2003 02:35:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 21800 invoked from network); 13 Jan 2003 02:35:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Jan 2003 02:35:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Jan 2003 02:35:57 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (tc1-112.skyweb.net [66.6.130.240]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h0D2hkx1087415; Sun, 12 Jan 2003 21:43:47 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3E222433.B806B97D@skyweb.net> Date: Sun, 12 Jan 2003 21:28:03 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com" , yu Subject: New AM Pics Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 I know Its not AM stereo related But it is AM related I was Lucky to meet up with an old friend of mine. and got a tour of the WMCA/WWDJ facilities... Took lots of pictures... Wish My studios looked Like these.. Very nice facility http://www.angelfire.com/nj4/wttm/wmca.html Neal From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Jan 12 19:23:14 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Jan 2003 03:23:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 52151 invoked from network); 13 Jan 2003 03:23:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Jan 2003 03:23:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Jan 2003 03:23:12 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.159] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Jan 2003 03:23:12 -0000 Date: Mon, 13 Jan 2003 03:23:12 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [ ABDX ] Low power AM web sites Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3E220972.A3BC85C5@skyweb.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2029 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.68.17 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > speaking Of low Power there seems to Be 2 New pirates on the air in > New Jersey. There are a bunch of them on the air in NJ and NYC. I used to hear a pirate from Brooklyn playing Spanish music with live DJs on 87.9 FM, but I think they got shut down. Now I hear all the time Spanish music on 87.5 FM (yes, 87.5!) and 107.9 FM, both apparently coming from "Radio Melodia" in Plainfield, NJ. This "station" even has a listing with their address and phone number in the local yellow pages!! The Spanish music on 1620 AM is actually a network of *16* different low-power transmitters throughout Union County, NJ. They are all professionally certified Part 15 transmitters and the FCC has deemed this operation to be legal. Coverage is spotty but on a good radio you can hear them for miles along Route 22 in the Union County area. Also, every Halloween, "WENJ" pops up on 104.5 or 104.7 FM from somewhere in Somerset or Middlesex County, playing music in Stereo with live DJs. This station has been on every year for a long time, going back to when they were on 1620 or 1630 kHz AM in the 1980s. I've heard it is run by "Tony Dee", the former engineer of 1590 WERA in Plainfield -- the station you got your RCA transmitter from! One of the most interesting cases regarding pirate stations is that of "Beat Radio", a group of pirates playing dance music that briefly went "legit", on the Beat Radio Network, heard on a group of AM stations -- including 1660 AM STEREO in NJ -- that formerly carried the "Radio Aahs" kids' format. As I recall, it broadcast from 7 PM to 7 AM on this network, and the daytime was filled with an eclectic automated mix of music, with no DJs or commercials. This lasted for a year at most, circa 1997-1998, before the network was dismantled and the stations were all sold. I would almost KILL to get a good recording of "Beat Radio" as they sounded in AM Stereo -- I do have some of "Radio Aahs" on 1660 in Stereo, but I never thought to record any of Beat Radio. From groucho@skyweb.net Sun Jan 12 19:49:35 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Jan 2003 03:49:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 55961 invoked from network); 13 Jan 2003 03:49:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Jan 2003 03:49:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Jan 2003 03:49:34 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (tc1-112.skyweb.net [66.6.130.240]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h0D3vPx1002904 for ; Sun, 12 Jan 2003 22:57:25 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3E22356C.3EAA2DEF@skyweb.net> Date: Sun, 12 Jan 2003 22:41:32 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: [ ABDX ] Low power AM web sites References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 well it seems to me that the 87.5 or 87.9 station is not playing the same material at 107.9fm But 107.9 and 1620 are simulcasting.. I'll have to look them up and pay them a visit... as far as Tony Dee and WENJ.... Nope Tony is not involved with that. I asked him. Tony Owns WODI down in BrookNeal,VA... I offered Tony a Stereo Exciter however all his gear is mono It would take too Much to switch it over.. Funny thing.. Tony's partner in the station Dave is an old Friend of mine from when I was a teenager... I found this Out yesterday when I gave Tony a tour of WTTM. while at the Site we called Dave and I could Hear WTTM played over the Phone in Brookneal ,VA. with WTIR attempting to Cover me up.. there is a picture of Tony Dee at the WTTM transmitter I took it last Night. and added it to The WTTM webpage this afternoon... The funniest thing about it is Tony and I both Worked at WBBR... Passed each other all the Time and didn't realize we knew each Other until Yesterday Neal "Kevin T. " wrote: > > speaking Of low Power there seems to Be 2 New pirates on the air in > > New Jersey. > > There are a bunch of them on the air in NJ and NYC. > > I used to hear a pirate from Brooklyn playing Spanish music with live > DJs on 87.9 FM, but I think they got shut down. > > Now I hear all the time Spanish music on 87.5 FM (yes, 87.5!) and > 107.9 FM, both apparently coming from "Radio Melodia" in Plainfield, > NJ. This "station" even has a listing with their address and phone > number in the local yellow pages!! > > The Spanish music on 1620 AM is actually a network of *16* different > low-power transmitters throughout Union County, NJ. They are all > professionally certified Part 15 transmitters and the FCC has deemed > this operation to be legal. Coverage is spotty but on a good radio > you can hear them for miles along Route 22 in the Union County area. > > Also, every Halloween, "WENJ" pops up on 104.5 or 104.7 FM from > somewhere in Somerset or Middlesex County, playing music in Stereo > with live DJs. This station has been on every year for a long time, > going back to when they were on 1620 or 1630 kHz AM in the 1980s. > I've heard it is run by "Tony Dee", the former engineer of 1590 WERA > in Plainfield -- the station you got your RCA transmitter from! > > One of the most interesting cases regarding pirate stations is that > of "Beat Radio", a group of pirates playing dance music that briefly > went "legit", on the Beat Radio Network, heard on a group of AM > stations -- including 1660 AM STEREO in NJ -- that formerly carried > the "Radio Aahs" kids' format. As I recall, it broadcast from 7 PM > to 7 AM on this network, and the daytime was filled with an eclectic > automated mix of music, with no DJs or commercials. This lasted for > a year at most, circa 1997-1998, before the network was dismantled > and the stations were all sold. > > I would almost KILL to get a good recording of "Beat Radio" as they > sounded in AM Stereo -- I do have some of "Radio Aahs" on 1660 in > Stereo, but I never thought to record any of Beat Radio. > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Jan 12 19:57:05 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Jan 2003 03:57:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 17256 invoked from network); 13 Jan 2003 03:57:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Jan 2003 03:57:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.86) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Jan 2003 03:57:04 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.146] by n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Jan 2003 03:57:04 -0000 Date: Mon, 13 Jan 2003 03:57:03 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: WOR violation Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1729 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.68.17 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics Mr. Ray (if you are actually going to read this reply, not do a cowardly "hit and run" like last time): The rest of your message is not worth responding to, but I do have one point to make. > That's right. It is a function of the filtering to 5kHz in the > audio processor, and cannot be heard on a "typical" AM radio. I do > not hear it in my car. I do not hear it at home. I hear it only > in broadband monitors at the station, and I can hear it on the > output of the processor. There is nothing to fix. Oh, really. That's nice because this distortion that WOR is transmitting is in VIOLATION OF THE FCC APPROVED IBOC STANDARDS. From the "IBOC AM Transmission Specifications", as included in the FCC ruling: "For hybrid mode operation, the power spectral density of the modulated AM carrier with the IBOC digital component disabled, at frequencies removed from the carrier by more than 5 kHz ... and up to 20 kHz must not exceed -75 dBc/300 Hz." Now, as you can see on this spectrum analysis graph: http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/worgrph.gif ...the peak level of the "ringing" distortion above 5 kHz is only about 10 dB below that of the main analog audio below 5 kHz. And since I doubt WOR is modulating its analog audio at a level of -65 dB, this clearly shows that the distortion -- which is present in WOR's audio even at night with the IBOC off -- is in violation of the official IBOC specifications. 700 WLW's 5 kHz audio does not have this distortion. Every shortwave station I have heard transmitting 5 kHz audio does not have this distortion. Like it or not, this IS a problem, and unless it is taken care of soon, I will be in contact with iBiquity and the FCC. Good day sir! From possumhunter@netzero.net Sun Jan 12 20:24:48 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Jan 2003 04:24:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 27859 invoked from network); 13 Jan 2003 04:24:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Jan 2003 04:24:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.87) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Jan 2003 04:24:47 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 12 Jan 2003 20:24:47 -0800 To: References: <2136109468-1463792126-1042404665@topica.com> <3E220972.A3BC85C5@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: [ ABDX ] Low power AM web sites Date: Sun, 12 Jan 2003 23:24:29 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 13 Jan 2003 04:24:47.0756 (UTC) FILETIME=[B4F76CC0:01C2BABB] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.144.51.38] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Neal Newman wrote: > there seems to Be 2 New pirates on the air in New Jersey. Speaking of Pirates, It seems the guys over at Black Liberation Radio 1680 have been busy. Never before have I heard it outside of the Berea / ParkerHeights area, but today they were lighting the Stereo light at my house 10 miles away! < no Stereo seperation> They also talked about an upcoming FM 87.9 and 96.3! Another pirate has popped up on 1620 playing nothing but BeeGees it is simulcasting on 6995 AM. > >with a signal sometimes On 1620 resonating the Detuning stub of a local Cell tower talk about Clever.... How the hell are they doing THAT? Did the Cell tower stub just happen to be tuned on 1620? Kevin From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sun Jan 12 20:33:59 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Jan 2003 04:33:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 44900 invoked from network); 13 Jan 2003 04:33:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Jan 2003 04:33:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.90) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Jan 2003 04:33:57 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.140] by n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Jan 2003 04:33:57 -0000 Date: Mon, 13 Jan 2003 04:33:54 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: UK IOM LW STATION PLANS TO BROADCAST IN AM STEREO AND DRM! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1267 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.20 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "wa2fnq " wrote: > > It's been done already. See: > > http://home.att.net/~broadcast_techniques/index.html > > Jerry WA2FNQ > > > ISB does offer superior performance during skywave but it is more > > complicated to implement properly concerning the audio phasing > > filters. I never cared too much for the approach that Kahn used > > sinve complete separation at the receiver isn't possible. > > If the issue of envelope compatibility wasn't there I think the > > best stereo scheme is Linear ISB if a good audio phasing filter > > could be designed, however DSP makes this a simple problem to > > solve both for transmittion and reception. > > > > JSG I think someone had posted a link about this exciter a while back but the specs don't say what method of modulation is used to generate SSB or ISB. I suspect they use QuAM like what is outlined in the ARRL handbook for the phasing method. If this is the case then without too much modification a C-QuAM version of ISB could be generated and the readily available C-QuAM decoder chips could be used with the addition of some post detection audio phasing filters, then the signal could be received distortion free on these chips. JSG From possumhunter@netzero.net Sun Jan 12 20:46:09 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Jan 2003 04:46:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 33028 invoked from network); 13 Jan 2003 04:46:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Jan 2003 04:46:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.120) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Jan 2003 04:46:08 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 12 Jan 2003 20:46:08 -0800 To: References: <3E22356C.3EAA2DEF@skyweb.net> Subject: WBBR Was: Low power AM web sites Date: Sun, 12 Jan 2003 23:45:55 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 13 Jan 2003 04:46:08.0651 (UTC) FILETIME=[B0707DB0:01C2BABE] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.144.51.38] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Neal Newman wrote: >The funniest thing about it is Tony and I both Worked at WBBR... Hey, I did some contract work for WBBR 1580 in the early '90s just before the call letter change to WDAB. WBBR's slogan was "WBBR - We Broadcast Better Radio" That station has one of the nicest buildings of any stand alone AM I have ever seen, filled with the worst junk for equipment. Kevin From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sun Jan 12 20:46:30 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Jan 2003 04:46:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 70868 invoked from network); 13 Jan 2003 04:46:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Jan 2003 04:46:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.78) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Jan 2003 04:46:29 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.141] by n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Jan 2003 04:46:29 -0000 Date: Mon, 13 Jan 2003 04:46:27 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [ ABDX ] Low power AM web sites Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3E220972.A3BC85C5@skyweb.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 621 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.20 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, Neal Newman wrote: one is in the Linden/Elizabeth area on 87.9Fm stereo. with a > signal sometimes On 1620 resonating > the Detuning stub of a local Cell tower talk about Clever.... Is that 1620KHz or 1620MHz in relation to the cell tower frequencies. Sounds like they are borrowing the power and coverage area of the cell tower to piggyback their signal. Are they trying to hetrodyne it down to the frequency range of the FM band by beating the signal against the cell tower frequency? Are there any more details/theory regarding this technique/phenominon? JSG From groucho@skyweb.net Sun Jan 12 20:55:28 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Jan 2003 04:55:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 90712 invoked from network); 13 Jan 2003 04:55:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Jan 2003 04:55:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Jan 2003 04:55:25 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (tc1-112.skyweb.net [66.6.130.240]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h0D53Gx1014381 for ; Mon, 13 Jan 2003 00:03:17 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3E2244D5.C3F8A53A@skyweb.net> Date: Sun, 12 Jan 2003 23:47:17 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: [ ABDX ] Low power AM web sites References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 actually its on 1620Kc... I wonder why it Even has a detuning stub wire. there are no radio stations anywhere near this Tower. except for a TIS on 1610kc... check out the New Pics of WMCA on my site.... I'm trying to add pics right now Of the old WERA 1590.. Funy thing during my tour of the WERA site I actually Found a WERA bumpersticker New Unused Most likely the very last One.. Im going to Frame It and hang it on My RCA BTA-500R transmitter that came from WERA... the WERA Pics will be able to Be seen at: http://www.angelfire.com/nj4/wttm/wera.html sometime tomorrow.. I have to make a Trip out to the island sometime this week.. how about a Tour of the New WLIE 540 site.. Neal "jsgilst " wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, Neal Newman > wrote: > one is in the Linden/Elizabeth area on 87.9Fm stereo. with a > > signal sometimes On 1620 resonating > > the Detuning stub of a local Cell tower talk about Clever.... > > Is that 1620KHz or 1620MHz in relation to the cell tower frequencies. > Sounds like they are borrowing the power and coverage area of the > cell tower to piggyback their signal. Are they trying to hetrodyne > it down to the frequency range of the FM band by beating the signal > against the cell tower frequency? Are there any more details/theory > regarding this technique/phenominon? > > JSG > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sun Jan 12 21:37:10 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Jan 2003 05:37:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 31477 invoked from network); 13 Jan 2003 05:37:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Jan 2003 05:37:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.86) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Jan 2003 05:37:09 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.252] by n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Jan 2003 05:37:09 -0000 Date: Mon, 13 Jan 2003 05:37:08 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Ooh, I'm scared... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 3792 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.20 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "wortomray " wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. "=20 > wrote: > > WOR's engineers have always been very self-defensive about anything=20 > > which can be seen as a claim that they are violating any FCC=20 > rules...=20 > > first, about the amount of "splatter" from the IBOC onto adjacent=20 > > channels... and now this. > >=20 > > If WOR is truly operating in full accordance with FCC rules, then=20 > it=20 > > makes you wonder why they get so worked up about even the slightest=20 > > of comments from a group of "crackpot" (as they have called us) > > AM Stereo fanatics. >=20 >=20 > You know, Mr. Tekel, I've had just about enough of your bullcrap.=20=20 > You want to know why I'm defensive about any claims of illegal=20 > operation? IT'S BECAUSE YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT THE HELL YOU'RE TALKING=20 > ABOUT!! And you are spreading blatant LIES, which our station=20 > attorneys call slander and libel. You should be thankful that I=20 > haven't unleashed the lawyers yet. They would have a field day with=20 > you. >=20 > I take great pride in my job and in the condition of the WOR=20 > transmitter facility. When I started with WOR 5-1/2 years ago, the=20 > facility was in worse than poor condition, and it was off the air=20 > more than it was on. Within 6 months, I had the facility rewired,=20 > all levels from the STL's balanced, and a new transmitter installed.=20=20 > In 2002 we logged approximately 10 minutes total off the air, not=20 > counting maintenance time, for the entire year. The 10 minutes is=20 > attributable to power issues which are out of our control. We spent=20 > approximately 3 hours off the air in 2002 to tighten connections in=20 > the antenna system. And our operation is completely above board.=20=20 > Buckley Broadcasting does not run it's stations any other way.=20=20 >=20 > Let's see....what have you accused me of? >=20 I do agree with WOR that they are probably operating within the FCC guidelines given that they have reduced the sidebands by 6dB. This should put it within the more restrictive mask for white noise for the primary sidebands. The interference issue is not that the peak power of the sidebands are just within the FCC limits but the overall power level is at a constant 100% of its maximum level. This is unlike a typical analog signal where energy levels may peak=20 instantaneously to these levels but if you averaged an analog signal over a period of time the power level would be much less. This means it would take the skywaves of many analog stations to add up to the background energy of just one IBOC station. This is the real=20 interference issue and is why it creates major interference problems for analog receivers and our discussions need to focus on this, not on accusing WOR of illegal operation. What I do find shortsided about WOR/iBiquity's attitude is that they take no concern/responsibility for interference suffered to medium bandwidth radios with a 6KHz=20 audio response from 2nd adjacent interference. They just assume that all radios have a 3KHz response. A =B16KHz filter response can preform very well at night even for distant markets and 2nd adjacent=20 interference from IBOC can wipe this out. It is more likely that a=20 2nd adjacent is closer to the desired station than a 1st adjacent and has a greater potential cause problems. If IBOC transmittions were forced to provide protection to 2nd adjacents for meduim bandwidth radios then there would very few instances where it could be used at night even at partial power. In very crowded markets it could also be a problem during the daytime. In their narrowmind only narrowband=20 radios exist and IBOC works under those circumstances but not for radios that have a wider response.=20 JSG From possumhunter@netzero.net Sun Jan 12 22:04:20 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Jan 2003 06:04:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 65503 invoked from network); 13 Jan 2003 06:04:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Jan 2003 06:04:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.190) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Jan 2003 06:04:20 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 12 Jan 2003 22:04:19 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: WOR violation Date: Mon, 13 Jan 2003 01:04:06 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 13 Jan 2003 06:04:19.0965 (UTC) FILETIME=[9CAE32D0:01C2BAC9] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.144.51.38] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 kevtronics@yahoo.com wrote: > 700 WLW's 5 kHz audio does not have this distortion. Every shortwave station I have heard transmitting 5 kHz audio does not have this distortion. Like it or not, this IS a problem, For lack of anything else to do this evening, I set the filtering at 5Khz on WFIS's Optimod 9200, the same processor used at WOR. It produced the same ringing you are talking about, so it must be the "Nature of the beast". Now I wonder if this is why WOR's IBOC signal during the night time testing was wider than WLW's.. Perhaps WOR should stick a 5Khz filter card in the old Optimod 9100 and see if the ringing and higher bandwidth goes away....or buy an Omina AM. Kevin From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Jan 12 23:04:29 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Jan 2003 07:04:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 9143 invoked from network); 13 Jan 2003 07:04:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Jan 2003 07:04:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Jan 2003 07:04:29 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.161] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Jan 2003 07:04:29 -0000 Date: Mon, 13 Jan 2003 07:04:28 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: WOR distorted audio Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 646 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.68.17 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > For lack of anything else to do this evening, I set the filtering > at 5Khz on WFIS's Optimod 9200, the same processor used at WOR. It > produced the same ringing you are talking about, so it must be the > "Nature of the beast". When WOR had their audio set to 6.2 kHz bandwidth (probably the "6 kHz" filter on the Optimod), it was perfectly clean, with absolutely none of this distortion. There must be something specific about the 5 kHz filter that is causing this problem -- and I guess that means 700 WLW isn't using an Optimod 9200, as from the recording I heard, their 5 kHz audio is clean and distortion-free, even during music. From dav259@csiro.au Mon Jan 13 00:16:25 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Jan 2003 08:16:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 41099 invoked from network); 13 Jan 2003 08:16:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Jan 2003 08:16:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Jan 2003 08:16:25 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0D8GNP21258 for ; Mon, 13 Jan 2003 19:16:23 +1100 (EST) Date: Mon, 13 Jan 2003 19:16:23 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Subject: Questions for Tom In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public Tom (from 710 WOR) Thanks for spending some of your time with us. Can this dumb non-tech Aussie just ask a few (to me) basic questions? I don't understand all the technical stuff and sometimes even the situation as it is in the US. I love radio - always have. I've listened to AM stereo almost every day for the last 18 years. It's brought a new dimension to my radio listening as mainly I've hated the programming on FM - which was commercially introduced here five years earlier and always has been in stereo. AM radio always had its plusses and minuses. FM - was introduced in Oz as the cure-all but AM still gets 47% of the listeners and has certain advantages - which we won't go into now. 1. As I understand it the AM stations broadcasting IBOC in the US are doing it only in mono. Why? 2. Can you honestly tell me - all things being equal - ie. if an AM station is broadcasting in accordance with the FCC standards - and the listeners are provided with decently performing radios ... Which actually sounds better ... C-Quam stereo or IBOC stereo? 3. Would your answer be different for stations broadcasting at 5K and 50K? (Only government ABC stations are permitted to transmit at 50K here.) 4. Are plans in hand for AM IBOC broadcasting to go stereo - and 24/7 - and if so when? I have an open mind. None of us is getting any younger and in Oz they've been talking up the digital radio scenario for 12 years saying it's just around the corner. And it's all come to nothing. Thanks to IBOC we in Oz are 'on hold' again - as if we ever weren't. I'm quite prepared to pay a decent price to hear decent reception. What I want is well programmed affordable stereo hi-fi radio. 5. Can IBOC ever make the floor move for me? Ian Melbourne From bjackson@indyradio.com Mon Jan 13 06:21:40 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Jan 2003 14:21:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 62474 invoked from network); 13 Jan 2003 14:21:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Jan 2003 14:21:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Jan 2003 14:21:38 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.164] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Jan 2003 14:21:37 -0000 Date: Mon, 13 Jan 2003 14:21:37 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: WOR distorted audio Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2794 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923 " X-Originating-IP: 206.246.142.149 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: < *snip* and I guess > that means 700 WLW isn't using an Optimod 9200, as from the recording > I heard, their 5 kHz audio is clean and distortion-free, even during > music. Can anyone tell me if WLW is running IBOC every day? It seems like one day they are running it, then 2 days later it sounds like they are back to pure analog. Anyone have any info? And almost on topic, it looks like within the next 6 months or so, all of our stations nationwide will be IBOC since Susquehanna is an investor (yippee). Just a personal opinion...I think that IBOC will be a "fad," if you will. I think, if we were all 100% honest with ourselves, we would agree that AM Stereo (as of 2003) is not a success. Why? Well, there's the programming, or lack thereof. But there is also the manufacturers...They helped kill it by cutting a nickel out of the cost of radios. If we assume that IBOC will follow the same or similar path, in 5 years or so IBOC may just die on its own... 1) If the programming doesn't change, why would a consumer pay extra to hear the same crap in highly compressed digital? People in my demographic (25 years old) have dropped radio listening more than any other generation. Most of my friends who don't work in radio tell me all the time how much radio sucks...And not just in Indianapolis. If Ibiquity thinks they can just take crap and relabel it digital crap, they have a surprise in store for them (crap is *still* crap). Even my parents are getting into this...My mother (50+) just bought a new Gateway PC with a CD burner...Called me up and asked where to get that "free music thing"...I pointed her to www.winmx.com and she's been burning CD's herself. She was amazed that she could fit so many MP3's on a CD and play it back (commercial free) in her DVD player at home! No more radio for her... 2) If IBOC doesn't take off fast, how long before the manuafacturers start dropping it? Even with (in the 80's) of many different companies, AM Stereo has never truly been labeled a success. And, I'm sure it would be more than the nickel it costs for C-CuAM. 3) Many of the Radio guys claim that one of the reasons they dropped and/or hated C-Quam was because how it supposedly affected sound quality and coverage (platform motion)...Just wait until they hear how a 5khz filter affects it...esp. if they are using an Optimod 9200! And how does IBOC coverage compare to analog coverage? OK...I'll step off my venting box now...I'm just worked up over our company's plan for IBOC...No word yet if the plan includes WZZB yet or not (it sometimes get treated as the unwanted stepchild) -Brad Jackson -Susquehanna, Indianapolis -WGLD/WGRL/WFMS From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Jan 13 08:04:51 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Jan 2003 16:04:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 49827 invoked from network); 13 Jan 2003 16:04:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Jan 2003 16:04:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Jan 2003 16:04:49 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.129] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Jan 2003 16:04:49 -0000 Date: Mon, 13 Jan 2003 16:04:48 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Questions for Tom Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2422 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Which actually sounds better ... C-Quam stereo or IBOC stereo? I have heard some recordings of the wideband AM Stereo stations you have in Australia, and at least in its current form, IBOC simply cannot match up to their sound quality. There is no question that digital *does* have advantages for radio broadcasting; IBOC is just using it in the wrong manner. The ideal use for digital technology would be in the receiver, such as Motorola's "Symphony" design, while radio stations continue to broadcast full-quality and fully compatible analog AM Stereo and FM Stereo signals. This would give the best of both worlds -- digital-quality reception on new radios without degrading the sound or reception of regular radios and without changing the way radio stations broadcast their signals. For what it's worth, here's one opinion that was posted to the Usenet newsgroup "alt.radio.broadcasting".... From: BIAS COMMS (biascomms@NOSPAMblueyonder.co.uk) Subject: Re: AM bandwidth vs. channel spacing Newsgroups: alt.radio.broadcasting, alt.radio.pirate Date: 2003-01-13 02:11:43 PST We have yet to hear ANY digital broadcasting format that can sound anywhere near as good as its analogue counterpart. Over here in Europe, we have "Eureka 147" digital audio broadcasting. It started out almost OK, but then the broadcasters decided to reduce the bit rate progressively to allow more "channels". The "quality" is now a poor joke, and usually sounds worse than a poor MP3. The broadcasters can't understand why nobody wants to buy the (expensive) radios to receive this "service"....... The IBOC trials and demonstarations we've heard (and yes, we were represented in Las Vegas) have been poorer than the European equivalent. It's truly appalling! It suffers from really obvious digital aliasing effects and all manner of distortion artifacts that just make it unlistenable. It also causes HUGE amounts of interference either side of the carrier (which will please the big corporates - half as many stations in each market on the FM band). IBOC is NOT the way to do digital broadcasting! The interference it causes will certainly give rise to a large number of lawsuits from minor stations, but the FCC have a great history of defending the indefensible..... It will probably be the death of broadcast radio in the USA. -- BIAS COMMS Everything gets easier with practice except getting up in the morning From e92fmjamz@yahoo.com Mon Jan 13 10:58:14 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: e92fmjamz@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Jan 2003 18:58:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 14786 invoked from network); 13 Jan 2003 18:57:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Jan 2003 18:57:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14001.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.175.92) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Jan 2003 18:57:57 -0000 Message-ID: <20030113185757.41337.qmail@web14001.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [152.8.78.47] by web14001.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 13 Jan 2003 10:57:57 PST Date: Mon, 13 Jan 2003 10:57:57 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Questions for Tom To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: Ernest Jones X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=24963319 X-Yahoo-Profile: e92fmjamz ..well..since I'm 80 miles from WRAL...I decided to record a lil audio from them....take a listen for yourself....... http://members.tripod.com/e92fm/wralhd.mp3 clip goes...mono stereo mono...@ 80 miles, I can't get a clean stereo signal on them. --- "Kevin T. " wrote: > > Which actually sounds better ... C-Quam stereo or > IBOC stereo? > > I have heard some recordings of the wideband AM > Stereo stations you have in Australia, and at least > in its current form, IBOC simply cannot match up to > their sound quality. There is no question that > digital *does* have advantages for radio > broadcasting; IBOC is just using it in the wrong > manner. > > The ideal use for digital technology would be in the > receiver, such as Motorola's "Symphony" design, > while radio stations continue to broadcast > full-quality and fully compatible analog AM Stereo > and FM Stereo signals. This would give the best of > both worlds -- digital-quality reception on new > radios without degrading the sound or reception of > regular radios and without changing the way radio > stations broadcast their signals. > > For what it's worth, here's one opinion that was > posted to the Usenet newsgroup > "alt.radio.broadcasting".... > > > From: BIAS COMMS (biascomms@NOSPAMblueyonder.co.uk) > Subject: Re: AM bandwidth vs. channel spacing > Newsgroups: alt.radio.broadcasting, alt.radio.pirate > Date: 2003-01-13 02:11:43 PST > > We have yet to hear ANY digital broadcasting format > that can sound anywhere near as good as its analogue > counterpart. > > Over here in Europe, we have "Eureka 147" digital > audio broadcasting. It started out almost OK, but > then the broadcasters decided to reduce the bit rate > progressively to allow more "channels". The > "quality" is now a poor joke, and usually sounds > worse than a poor MP3. The broadcasters can't > understand why nobody wants to buy the (expensive) > radios to receive this "service"....... > > The IBOC trials and demonstarations we've heard (and > yes, we were > represented in Las Vegas) have been poorer than the > European equivalent. It's truly appalling! It > suffers from really obvious digital aliasing effects > and all manner of distortion artifacts that just > make it unlistenable. It also causes HUGE amounts > of interference either side of the carrier (which > will please the big corporates - half as many > stations in each market on the FM band). > > IBOC is NOT the way to do digital broadcasting! The > interference it causes will certainly give rise to a > large number of lawsuits from minor stations, but > the FCC have a great history of defending the > indefensible..... It will probably be the death of > broadcast radio in the USA. > > -- > BIAS COMMS > > Everything gets easier with practice except getting > up in the morning > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > ===== Ernest, Gates NC, USA WRCS 970 AM Ahoskie NC, Announcer,webmaster http://wrcs.cjb.net WQDK 99.3 FM Ahoskie NC, Fill in ------contact me-------- AIM: e92fmjamz2000 ICQ: 33155469 Yahoo: e92fmjamz __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Jan 13 14:02:42 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Jan 2003 22:02:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 77758 invoked from network); 13 Jan 2003 22:02:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Jan 2003 22:02:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.68) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Jan 2003 22:02:40 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.174] by n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Jan 2003 22:02:37 -0000 Date: Mon, 13 Jan 2003 22:02:35 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: New IBOC audio samples... LOL! Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1634 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.88.160 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics I see Mr. Ray at WOR has added some new IBOC audio samples to his web site... they are mono music samples, claimed to be made with the latest version of the IBOC encoding system. These were made while WOR was on its backup transmitter, and Tom hooked up a CD player at the transmitter site to the IBOC exciter, running through their Optimod 9200 processor. Also included are comparison to the 5 kHz analog audio, as run through WOR's ringy, distorted, over-compressed Optimod (so it sounds a lot worse than what a properly processed analog AM station can do, even within a 5 kHz bandwidth, such as on shortwave). As he says on the site, "The stereo aspect of HD radio is *still in development*, but the mono digital audio sounds really good." You can judge that for yourself: http://www.wor710.com/Engineering/iboc/publicaudio.htm I am literally *laughing out loud* at how *BAD* the IBOC digital audio sounds... it is just almost undescribable to explain how much it mangles up the sound! A 20 kbps RealAudio web-cast on a 28.8K modem is FAR superior in comparison! And from a spectrum analysis of the digital recordings, it seems that the audio response above 4.5 kHz or so is completely synthesized -- i.e. FAKE -- with the IBOC digital audio, and there is still little to no useful response above 9 kHz. Of course I'll be sure to soon provide some examples of these same music clips as heard through a hi-fi analog AM transmitter and receiver -- even in Mono, just to make the comparison fair. I'll even use my old Gates Solid Statesman limiter as the audio processing if I can get it tuned up right! From e92fmjamz@yahoo.com Mon Jan 13 14:41:38 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: e92fmjamz@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Jan 2003 22:41:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 9734 invoked from network); 13 Jan 2003 22:41:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Jan 2003 22:41:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14004.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.175.120) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Jan 2003 22:41:37 -0000 Message-ID: <20030113224136.84744.qmail@web14004.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [152.8.78.47] by web14004.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 13 Jan 2003 14:41:36 PST Date: Mon, 13 Jan 2003 14:41:36 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: {AMSF} New IBOC audio samples... LOL! To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: Ernest Jones X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=24963319 X-Yahoo-Profile: e92fmjamz now...after listening to those samples...does anybody know why I stopped listening to the radio?...that WRAL clip was the first time I picked up a radio here...CD's/Mp3's dominate here...I see IBOCRAP as a total failure... --- "Kevin T. " wrote: > I see Mr. Ray at WOR has added some new IBOC audio > samples to his web > site... they are mono music samples, claimed to be > made with the > latest version of the IBOC encoding system. These > were made while > WOR was on its backup transmitter, and Tom hooked up > a CD player at > the transmitter site to the IBOC exciter, running > through their > Optimod 9200 processor. > > Also included are comparison to the 5 kHz analog > audio, as run > through WOR's ringy, distorted, over-compressed > Optimod (so it sounds > a lot worse than what a properly processed analog AM > station can do, > even within a 5 kHz bandwidth, such as on > shortwave). > > As he says on the site, "The stereo aspect of HD > radio is *still in > development*, but the mono digital audio sounds > really good." You > can judge that for yourself: > > http://www.wor710.com/Engineering/iboc/publicaudio.htm > > I am literally *laughing out loud* at how *BAD* the > IBOC digital > audio sounds... it is just almost undescribable to > explain how much > it mangles up the sound! A 20 kbps RealAudio > web-cast on a 28.8K > modem is FAR superior in comparison! And from a > spectrum analysis > of the digital recordings, it seems that the audio > response above > 4.5 kHz or so is completely synthesized -- i.e. FAKE > -- with the IBOC > digital audio, and there is still little to no > useful response above > 9 kHz. > > Of course I'll be sure to soon provide some examples > of these same > music clips as heard through a hi-fi analog AM > transmitter and > receiver -- even in Mono, just to make the > comparison fair. I'll > even use my old Gates Solid Statesman limiter as the > audio processing > if I can get it tuned up right! > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > ===== Ernest, Gates NC, USA WRCS 970 AM Ahoskie NC, Announcer,webmaster http://wrcs.cjb.net WQDK 99.3 FM Ahoskie NC, Fill in ------contact me-------- AIM: e92fmjamz2000 ICQ: 33155469 Yahoo: e92fmjamz __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From ccuff@in4web.com Mon Jan 13 15:15:01 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 13 Jan 2003 23:15:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 51073 invoked from network); 13 Jan 2003 23:15:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Jan 2003 23:15:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Jan 2003 23:15:01 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.55]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Mon, 13 Jan 2003 18:10:41 -0500 Message-ID: <003901c2bb58$5a97a900$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: Subject: It's the programming... Date: Mon, 13 Jan 2003 18:06:06 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 Yes- it's been all said before. I read the earlier post about needing programming that is worth listening to- This is THE most important key to success for a radio station. What will it matter whatever system is used, as long as there is nothing worth tuning into? How many stations have gone down the ratings toilet after abandoning their proven format? I can think of plenty in the NYC area alone. I received a ton of mail and email after my RW letter 2 years ago about this- yet it is just like the car makers- the public gets something forced on it that it does not want- "change for the sake of change" or in the case of HD radio, change to make some corporations wealthy, at the expense of the listening public. Too bad... these corporations will soon find out that you can't "polish a turd" Chris From wa2fnq@optonline.net Mon Jan 13 16:40:19 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: wa2fnq@optonline.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Jan 2003 00:40:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 378 invoked from network); 14 Jan 2003 00:40:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Jan 2003 00:40:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Jan 2003 00:40:19 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.142] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Jan 2003 00:40:19 -0000 Date: Tue, 14 Jan 2003 00:40:18 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: New IBOC audio samples... LOL! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 704 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wa2fnq " X-Originating-IP: 24.47.74.230 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=60059615 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa2fnq Well....I just let my wife listen to one of these IBOC clips from WOR. An untrained ear just like a typical listener. Her comment was "Gee, it sounds fuzzy". My comment "Gee, it sounds like ****". It still ain't right. I wouldn't be proud of this. A good AM station sounds much better (without the 5 KHz filter please). Heck, my modified Ramsey AM-25 sounds ten times better. Sorry. Just an opinion. I know this is still in development but it ain't ready for prime time. Hey,somebody has to say these things.... Chris was right in his comments. It's about programming not technology. But hey.... let's put bad programming on crappy sounding digital and really turn the pulic off. Jerry WA2FNQ From evergreenterrace@buzzle.com Mon Jan 13 16:41:20 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: evergreenterrace@buzzle.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Jan 2003 00:41:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 19942 invoked from network); 14 Jan 2003 00:41:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Jan 2003 00:41:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Jan 2003 00:41:19 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.150] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Jan 2003 00:41:19 -0000 Date: Tue, 14 Jan 2003 00:41:17 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: New IBOC audio samples... LOL! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1716 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgliradio " X-Originating-IP: 170.20.11.59 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=69711087 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgliradio --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: > > Of course I'll be sure to soon provide some examples of these same > music clips as heard through a hi-fi analog AM transmitter and > receiver -- even in Mono, just to make the comparison fair. I'll > even use my old Gates Solid Statesman limiter as the audio processing > if I can get it tuned up right! I would not use the Solid Statesman to make this comparison. It will not properly modulate like modern AM processors and your test would be inaccurate. I dare say an accurate test would be for WOR to A/B the digital/analog audio with full NRSC 10kHz bandwidth for the analog and then offer the digital sample. I was reviewing an old aircheck today while driving with an engineering consultant friend of mine (someone well known in the industry) who couldn't believe the audio quality. We were using a CRL AGC-400, CRL SEP-400, Moseley TAL-310 limiter and CRL LPF-100 NRSC filter/pre-emphasis. I will have to encode it for you to hear. Tom Ray is not the problem NOR is WOR. I am not a big fan of IBOC, I think analog radio with properly designed receivers is the key on both bands as well as programming that's enjoyable. Posts like WOR ratings are low because of IBOC make us look bad and you all know it. IBOC has NOTHING TO DO WITH WOR's NUMBERS... PERIOD! We have to be realists and not look at everything so narrow minded. The only problem with AM stereo is the fact that it has the "Edsel" moniker stuck with it. That is what our goal should be, to try and re-introduce the technology as something viable in a professional manner. Any other way and we'll be laughed at From wa2fnq@optonline.net Mon Jan 13 16:55:12 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: wa2fnq@optonline.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Jan 2003 00:55:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 53770 invoked from network); 14 Jan 2003 00:55:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Jan 2003 00:55:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.90) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Jan 2003 00:55:11 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.129] by n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Jan 2003 00:55:09 -0000 Date: Tue, 14 Jan 2003 00:55:08 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: New IBOC audio samples... LOL! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 853 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wa2fnq " X-Originating-IP: 24.47.74.230 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=60059615 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa2fnq This is very true. I echo these comments. Jerry WA2FNQ --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "wgliradio " wrote: > > Tom Ray is not the problem NOR is WOR. I am not a big fan of IBOC, I > think analog radio with properly designed receivers is the key on > both bands as well as programming that's enjoyable. > > Posts like WOR ratings are low because of IBOC make us look bad and > you all know it. IBOC has NOTHING TO DO WITH WOR's NUMBERS... > PERIOD! We have to be realists and not look at everything so narrow > minded. > > The only problem with AM stereo is the fact that it has the "Edsel" > moniker stuck with it. That is what our goal should be, to try and > re-introduce the technology as something viable in a professional > manner. Any other way and we'll be laughed at From stodd@sherbtel.net Mon Jan 13 17:02:29 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Jan 2003 01:02:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 66212 invoked from network); 14 Jan 2003 01:02:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Jan 2003 01:02:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Jan 2003 01:02:28 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-85-89.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.85.89]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h0E12Pql016800 for ; Mon, 13 Jan 2003 19:02:26 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <003901c2bb68$c14c6f40$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: WOR violation Date: Mon, 13 Jan 2003 19:03:28 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude That is likely the problem. WLW is actually using an Omnia FM-6 processor (you read that right, boys and girls!). ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Possum Hunter" > For lack of anything else to do this evening, I set the filtering at 5Khz on > WFIS's Optimod 9200, the same processor used at WOR. It produced the same > ringing you are talking about, so it must be the "Nature of the beast". Now > I wonder if this is why WOR's IBOC signal during the night time testing was > wider than WLW's.. From michaelj@vcn.com Mon Jan 13 17:22:23 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Jan 2003 01:22:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 81573 invoked from network); 14 Jan 2003 01:22:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Jan 2003 01:22:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m1-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.31) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Jan 2003 01:22:22 -0000 Received: from michael (unverified [209.193.86.43]) by m1-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Mon, 13 Jan 2003 18:22:22 -0700 To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} Re: New IBOC audio samples... LOL! Date: Mon, 13 Jan 2003 18:21:49 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I second that motion! I fully agree with those comments. And I too engineer two c-quam AM Stereo stations. I made the same comments a few weeks ago. Like introducing a bucket to the public that has a leak in it. It's okay, but it has its problems and I don't think they ought to be forcing it onto the market while it still has bugs and while the old technology is still better. Kinda like I'd still like to have and enjoy the sound quality better of ANALOG cellular technology over the new DIGITAL cellular technology ANY day. Here in Wyoming, Verizon FORCED the new DIGITAL cellular technology down our throats and gave us no choice but to use digital or use nothing. And it SUCKS! Improve the codecs. Make better stuff come at lower bit rates. Narrow it down even more so that the digital information stream takes a MUCH smaller piece of the sidebands and doesn't cause any more adjacent channel interference than the regular analog system does now. And make it sound BETTER.....not wishy washy squashy with "fake" highs. THEN I think I'd be really impressed. And PLEASE lay off of Tom and Kerry. Tom has proven numerous times again and again that they are doing nothing wrong and nothing illegal. The sound of IBOC is the sound of IBOC. That NOT being Tom or Kerry's fault. That is just how it sounds. In my humble opinion, I still think the technology needs some improvement. After all, I wouldn't buy a car that I'm not sure is going to get me down the road. Or one that may get me down the road but only go 30 miles an hour at top speed. Kinda like people haven't caught on to too many "electric" cars. They can only do a top speed of 30 or 40 mph. I'd rather stick with the old "gas engine" technology and be able to do the speed limit when the speed limit is 75. See what I mean? Thanks for reading Michael J. Richard KEVA - AM Stereo 1240 Evanston, Wyoming -----Original Message----- From: wa2fnq [mailto:wa2fnq@optonline.net] Sent: Monday, January 13, 2003 5:55 PM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: New IBOC audio samples... LOL! This is very true. I echo these comments. Jerry WA2FNQ --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "wgliradio " wrote: > > Tom Ray is not the problem NOR is WOR. I am not a big fan of IBOC, I > think analog radio with properly designed receivers is the key on > both bands as well as programming that's enjoyable. > > Posts like WOR ratings are low because of IBOC make us look bad and > you all know it. IBOC has NOTHING TO DO WITH WOR's NUMBERS... > PERIOD! We have to be realists and not look at everything so narrow > minded. > > The only problem with AM stereo is the fact that it has the "Edsel" > moniker stuck with it. That is what our goal should be, to try and > re-introduce the technology as something viable in a professional > manner. Any other way and we'll be laughed at Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From stodd@sherbtel.net Mon Jan 13 17:31:17 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Jan 2003 01:31:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 65599 invoked from network); 14 Jan 2003 01:31:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Jan 2003 01:31:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Jan 2003 01:31:17 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-85-89.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.85.89]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h0E1VDql024535 for ; Mon, 13 Jan 2003 19:31:14 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <007b01c2bb6c$c799c240$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: New IBOC audio samples... LOL! Date: Mon, 13 Jan 2003 19:32:16 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude I try not to post Me-too type replies, but I couldn't agree more with these comments. If I weren't so far from NYC I'd go and take up Tom Ray's invitation, though having a 9200 processor on one of my stations, I also checked the 5k setting, and there's no way it can sound good. Perhaps the IBOC sample could have sounded better than that. It would also be an excuse to get down to NJ and see some of you list members in the area and get a tour of WTTM. :) Scott Todd ----- Original Message ----- From: > Posts like WOR ratings are low because of IBOC make us look bad and > you all know it. IBOC has NOTHING TO DO WITH WOR's NUMBERS... > PERIOD! We have to be realists and not look at everything so narrow > minded. > > The only problem with AM stereo is the fact that it has the "Edsel" > moniker stuck with it. That is what our goal should be, to try and > re-introduce the technology as something viable in a professional > manner. Any other way and we'll be laughed at > From evergreenterrace@buzzle.com Mon Jan 13 17:42:52 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: evergreenterrace@buzzle.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Jan 2003 01:42:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 75662 invoked from network); 14 Jan 2003 01:42:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Jan 2003 01:42:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Jan 2003 01:42:51 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.179] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Jan 2003 01:42:51 -0000 Date: Tue, 14 Jan 2003 01:42:50 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: WOR violation Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <003901c2bb68$c14c6f40$827dfea9@home1> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 243 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgliradio " X-Originating-IP: 170.20.11.59 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=69711087 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgliradio --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Scott Todd" wrote: > That is likely the problem. WLW is actually using an Omnia FM-6 processor > (you read that right, boys and girls!). Omnia did make AM versions of their FM processors. From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Mon Jan 13 18:55:06 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Jan 2003 02:55:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 19448 invoked from network); 14 Jan 2003 02:55:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Jan 2003 02:55:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf25bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.197) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Jan 2003 02:55:05 -0000 Received: from juan ([67.34.4.204]) by imf25bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.19 201-253-122-122-119-20020516) with SMTP id <20030114025658.CBWQ1365.imf25bis.bellsouth.net@juan> for ; Mon, 13 Jan 2003 21:56:58 -0500 Message-ID: <000f01c2bb78$5866ffd0$af78fea9@juan> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: New IBOC audio samples... LOL! Date: Mon, 13 Jan 2003 21:55:07 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I have said this before, and I will say It again. IBOC has enough rope, let it hang itself. If you want me to get into long details..I will. But I don't want to send long winded posts. Just one question to ask yourself......putting AM Stereo aside. How many people do you know, have asked for Hi-Fi AM sound. ? The biggest complaint we get is about interference at our AM. Power lines, lightning etc.... Will IBOC help as far as the interference Problem ? I seriously doubt it, unless you are real close to the transmitter. Will a better receiver help ? Could be the answer. But we will see. Joe Sixpack tries to hear the game from a distant City, or maybe his favorite talk show...Does he care about HI-FI, or that he can actually pick up the broadcast ? Well, with Digital hash, at night, if it happens, forget it. What he needs is a decent reciever. By the way. We have sent a few listeners to buy the Super Radio III. A great HI-FI Analog Radio. We have received some great comments from the listeners with this Radio. Maybe the new Generation Motorola radios will help. Is it my imagination, or is Ibiquity scared of this "digital" radio ? We'll see. First and foremost. IBOC will stand or fall because of one entity. The listener. Will the average listener buy a higher priced reciver to hear what he can hear for the cheap radio he has in his bedroom, bathroom, car ? Maybe he WILL buy a radio to hear better programming. THAT will be the possible difference, but for that, there is XM. IBOC makes me laugh... Spend enough $$ and you CAN make a few bucks ! So much for the suckers............ Chris, you are correct about Polishing the turd....IBOC is the turd that can be polished with a lot of $$$$ but still is a turd. Programming Programming Programming ! I have been doing Radio 20+ years. Always a fad to deal with. Juan Gualda TC Radio Group --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: > > Of course I'll be sure to soon provide some examples of these same > music clips as heard through a hi-fi analog AM transmitter and > receiver -- even in Mono, just to make the comparison fair. I'll > even use my old Gates Solid Statesman limiter as the audio processing > if I can get it tuned up right! I would not use the Solid Statesman to make this comparison. It will not properly modulate like modern AM processors and your test would be inaccurate. I dare say an accurate test would be for WOR to A/B the digital/analog audio with full NRSC 10kHz bandwidth for the analog and then offer the digital sample. I was reviewing an old aircheck today while driving with an engineering consultant friend of mine (someone well known in the industry) who couldn't believe the audio quality. We were using a CRL AGC-400, CRL SEP-400, Moseley TAL-310 limiter and CRL LPF-100 NRSC filter/pre-emphasis. I will have to encode it for you to hear. Tom Ray is not the problem NOR is WOR. I am not a big fan of IBOC, I think analog radio with properly designed receivers is the key on both bands as well as programming that's enjoyable. Posts like WOR ratings are low because of IBOC make us look bad and you all know it. IBOC has NOTHING TO DO WITH WOR's NUMBERS... PERIOD! We have to be realists and not look at everything so narrow minded. The only problem with AM stereo is the fact that it has the "Edsel" moniker stuck with it. That is what our goal should be, to try and re-introduce the technology as something viable in a professional manner. Any other way and we'll be laughed at [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From KC4QLP@aol.com Mon Jan 13 19:32:30 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Jan 2003 03:32:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 51673 invoked from network); 14 Jan 2003 03:32:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Jan 2003 03:32:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r06.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.102) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Jan 2003 03:32:29 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.41.298d7539 (3972) for ; Mon, 13 Jan 2003 22:32:18 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <41.298d7539.2b54dec2@aol.com> Date: Mon, 13 Jan 2003 22:32:18 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: New IBOC audio samples... LOL! To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 1/13/03 8:22:53 PM Eastern Standard Time, michaelj@vcn.com writes: > Improve the codecs. Make better stuff come at lower bit rates. Narrow it > down even more so that the digital information stream takes a MUCH smaller > piece of the sidebands and doesn't cause any more adjacent channel > interference than the regular analog system does now. And make it sound > BETTER.....not wishy washy squashy with "fake" highs. THEN I think I'd be > really impressed. Unfornately digital streams dont seem to work that way. Its just like trying to force a data stream with a high bit rate down a dial-up...it just wont work due to lack of bandwidth. On MW there just isnt the bandwidth to send a data stream with a high enough bit rate to rid the stream of the obvious flaws in how it sounds after its decoded. I too have been saying "its the programming stupid and not how the programming is delivered".But seems as if the consultants are like the government..they know whats best for us better than we know ourselves. > And PLEASE lay off of Tom and Kerry. Tom has proven numerous times again > and again that they are doing nothing wrong and nothing illegal. The sound > of IBOC is the sound of IBOC. That NOT being Tom or Kerry's fault. That > is > just how it sounds. In my humble opinion, I still think the technology > needs some improvement. After all, I wouldn't buy a car that I'm not sure > is going to get me down the road. Or one that may get me down the road but > only go 30 miles an hour at top speed. Kinda like people haven't caught on > to too many "electric" cars. They can only do a top speed of 30 or 40 mph. > I'd rather stick with the old "gas engine" technology and be able to do the > speed limit when the speed limit is 75. > See what I mean? > > Thanks for reading > Michael J. Richard > KEVA - AM Stereo 1240 Evanston, Wyoming > > Well I've said this many time myself.....say something stupid folks and or say something that you cant back up in black and white and or with photos and you'll find yourselves up s%^s creek so fast with attorneys,law suits and the like your head will still be spinning 10 years from now. Tom is being more than patient and nicer than I would be. If I had half of the accusations that Tom has had thrown at him, lawyers would have been called and a trial date would have already been set. I'm not a fan of IBOC as I have a few audio and analog reception issues with it....as most of us here seem to have,but that is not grounds to start saying things that arent true {ie: ratings,whether someones station is legal or not etc!} My suggestion is that think before you say something...get your head out of your #$%,the chips off your shoulder and put the holier than thou attitudes to rest. This kind of nonsense is not solving anthing and its only proving who is and who isnt playing with a full deck here. I've sat on the side lines long enough on this.....get your act together or else. { I'm about two stupid remarks from some wise &%$, short of unsubscribing,,,keep up the stupidity and see what happens! } Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Mon Jan 13 20:01:38 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Jan 2003 04:01:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 38302 invoked from network); 14 Jan 2003 04:01:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Jan 2003 04:01:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf15bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.155) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Jan 2003 04:01:37 -0000 Received: from juan ([67.34.4.204]) by imf15bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.19 201-253-122-122-119-20020516) with SMTP id <20030114040330.QWIA16758.imf15bis.bellsouth.net@juan> for ; Mon, 13 Jan 2003 23:03:30 -0500 Message-ID: <000901c2bb81$a40d8540$af78fea9@juan> To: References: <41.298d7539.2b54dec2@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: New IBOC audio samples... LOL! Date: Mon, 13 Jan 2003 23:01:39 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I agree 100% about WOR's ratings. They have nothing to do with IBOC, as Ray the Engineer says, it's all about Diary placement. Just a question ? Will IBOC help when the programming is crap ? Not a Damn bit. IBOC is nothing but a sidebar here. Again Programming,Programming,Programming.... n a message dated 1/13/03 8:22:53 PM Eastern Standard Time, michaelj@vcn.com writes: > Improve the codecs. Make better stuff come at lower bit rates. Narrow it > down even more so that the digital information stream takes a MUCH smaller > piece of the sidebands and doesn't cause any more adjacent channel > interference than the regular analog system does now. And make it sound > BETTER.....not wishy washy squashy with "fake" highs. THEN I think I'd be > really impressed. Unfornately digital streams dont seem to work that way. Its just like trying to force a data stream with a high bit rate down a dial-up...it just wont work due to lack of bandwidth. On MW there just isnt the bandwidth to send a data stream with a high enough bit rate to rid the stream of the obvious flaws in how it sounds after its decoded. I too have been saying "its the programming stupid and not how the programming is delivered".But seems as if the consultants are like the government..they know whats best for us better than we know ourselves. > And PLEASE lay off of Tom and Kerry. Tom has proven numerous times again > and again that they are doing nothing wrong and nothing illegal. The sound > of IBOC is the sound of IBOC. That NOT being Tom or Kerry's fault. That > is > just how it sounds. In my humble opinion, I still think the technology > needs some improvement. After all, I wouldn't buy a car that I'm not sure > is going to get me down the road. Or one that may get me down the road but > only go 30 miles an hour at top speed. Kinda like people haven't caught on > to too many "electric" cars. They can only do a top speed of 30 or 40 mph. > I'd rather stick with the old "gas engine" technology and be able to do the > speed limit when the speed limit is 75. > See what I mean? > > Thanks for reading > Michael J. Richard > KEVA - AM Stereo 1240 Evanston, Wyoming > > Well I've said this many time myself.....say something stupid folks and or say something that you cant back up in black and white and or with photos and you'll find yourselves up s%^s creek so fast with attorneys,law suits and the like your head will still be spinning 10 years from now. Tom is being more than patient and nicer than I would be. If I had half of the accusations that Tom has had thrown at him, lawyers would have been called and a trial date would have already been set. I'm not a fan of IBOC as I have a few audio and analog reception issues with it....as most of us here seem to have,but that is not grounds to start saying things that arent true {ie: ratings,whether someones station is legal or not etc!} My suggestion is that think before you say something...get your head out of your #$%,the chips off your shoulder and put the holier than thou attitudes to rest. This kind of nonsense is not solving anthing and its only proving who is and who isnt playing with a full deck here. I've sat on the side lines long enough on this.....get your act together or else. { I'm about two stupid remarks from some wise &%$, short of unsubscribing,,,keep up the stupidity and see what happens! } Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com _______________________________________________________ [ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From JH_Radio@GameBox.net Mon Jan 13 21:08:12 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: JH_Radio@GameBox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Jan 2003 05:08:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 27189 invoked from network); 14 Jan 2003 05:08:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Jan 2003 05:08:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO snickers.hotpop.com) (204.57.55.49) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Jan 2003 05:08:10 -0000 Received: from gamebox.net (kubrick.hotpop.com [204.57.55.16]) by snickers.hotpop.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 46D3B71457 for ; Tue, 14 Jan 2003 05:07:28 +0000 (UTC) Received: from -enduser.GameBox.net (pcp03184855pcs.benslm01.pa.comcast.net [68.80.77.117]) by smtp-1.hotpop.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7205A2F8140 for ; Tue, 14 Jan 2003 04:05:02 +0000 (UTC) Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030113230317.00a34030@pop.GameBox.net> X-Sender: JH_Radio@pop.GameBox.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Mon, 13 Jan 2003 23:08:46 -0500 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: for those of you who think IBOC will sore well in the public... Mime-Version: 1.0 X-HotPOP: ----------------------------------------------- Sent By HotPOP.com FREE Email Get your FREE POP email at www.HotPOP.com ----------------------------------------------- From: John X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113800107 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Here's why I think it's not good. 1. Money issues. I know the broadcasters have to pay to upgrade the transmitters, but why would the public want to pay for new equipment? And what about the old stereos, etc? 2. It, to me, sounds horrible. From what I've heard of the samples, I'm not impressed. Admit, I am parsley deaf, so I probably am missing out on some of the artifacts. 3. What about those that prefer analog. If the FCC mandates this, what about all of those radios? and what about those audiophiles? I doubt IBOC sounds good to them. I know to me, I'd rather here analog any day. I always here these broadcasting professionals say how good it sounds, how it's revolutionary, etc. What about the average Joe? Doesn't the public get to here how it sounds to? I'm talking people like my mom, my dad, the average Joe with a radio etc. You say it's us with the problem of not liking change, and how it's so great. Firstly if the samples are any clue, then it's bad. I only wonder if decoding the sample to *.mp3, a lossy compression format would result in a miss acurit presentation of Iboc? And what about those people who live in area's in jersey ware you can get New York City/Philadelphia/Atlantic City/Ocean county? When IBOC reaches FM, the person with analog will probably not get much, as they are in the middle of anything, and even if you didn't DX, lot of buzz. And now the most important question of all. Why put stations on the air that are digital, when there is no receiver to play the stuff on? That out of all the things makes the least amount of sense. Love in Christ: John Bensalem, PA Send me an email Aim: RainAngelsRule MSN: RainAngelsRule@hotmail.com My website Welcome to Napster4TheBlind "Prayer does not change God; it changes you." - Authur unknown [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From n0uiheric@aol.com Mon Jan 13 22:22:06 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Jan 2003 06:22:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 96437 invoked from network); 14 Jan 2003 06:22:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Jan 2003 06:22:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r05.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.101) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Jan 2003 06:22:05 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-r05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.143.7c397dc (3858) for ; Tue, 14 Jan 2003 01:21:55 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <143.7c397dc.2b550682@aol.com> Date: Tue, 14 Jan 2003 01:21:54 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} It's the programming... To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih Chris, it's the quality of the programming that has allowed public radio stations (especially the NPR member stations) to nearly triple their audience in nearly a decade and a half. At the same time, due to the quality of the programming, commercial radio stations have lost over a quarter of it's listenership. It's quite obvious that an ever-growing number of listeners tend to prefer "Morning Edition" over Howard Stern, "Fresh Air" over Rush Limbaugh, "All Things Considered" over Dr. Laura, and even "Talk of The Nation" over the mindless chatter on commercial radio. Commercial radio programming desperately needs to be cleaned up, in my honest opinion. It's not just the quality, it's also the content. Sex-driven and bloodthirsty "shock radio" must be eliminated from our airwaves forever. I don't think Stern and Bubba are good for radio (AM or FM). We need to go back to localized radio, with good local (even homegrown) air talent. And we need to junk IBOCrap once and for all, and not only require all AM/FM receivers currently receiving FM Stereo to not only receive AM Stereo as well, but also to receive shortwave broadcasts. I've been listening to more and more shortwave as of late because the quality of programming on the likes of the BBC, Voice of America, Radio Japan and Radio Netherlands far outstrips the quality of programming on American commercial radio; shortwave radio stations seem to be public radio's only real rival. Even if you have an AM Stereo car radio, I recommend adding a shortwave converter. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Mon Jan 13 22:22:21 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Jan 2003 06:22:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 91698 invoked from network); 14 Jan 2003 06:22:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Jan 2003 06:22:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r06.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.102) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Jan 2003 06:22:20 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-r06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.184.1533c717 (3858) for ; Tue, 14 Jan 2003 01:21:55 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <184.1533c717.2b550683@aol.com> Date: Tue, 14 Jan 2003 01:21:55 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: WOR violation To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih WLW "The Once-Big 700" using an FM processor on AM? Their engineers must REALLY be screwed! 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From possumhunter@netzero.net Mon Jan 13 23:10:57 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Jan 2003 07:10:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 23187 invoked from network); 14 Jan 2003 07:10:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Jan 2003 07:10:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.88) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Jan 2003 07:10:56 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 13 Jan 2003 23:10:56 -0800 To: References: <003901c2bb68$c14c6f40$827dfea9@home1> Subject: WLW Date: Tue, 14 Jan 2003 02:03:13 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 14 Jan 2003 07:10:56.0427 (UTC) FILETIME=[152BA7B0:01C2BB9C] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.154.47.97] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Scott Todd wrote: >WLW is actually using an Omnia FM-6 processor Why on earth are they doing that? Why not use an Omnia AM box? Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Mon Jan 13 23:18:41 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Jan 2003 07:18:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 99116 invoked from network); 14 Jan 2003 07:18:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Jan 2003 07:18:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.208) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Jan 2003 07:18:41 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 13 Jan 2003 23:18:40 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} New IBOC audio samples... LOL! Date: Tue, 14 Jan 2003 02:18:28 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 14 Jan 2003 07:18:40.0994 (UTC) FILETIME=[2A12F420:01C2BB9D] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.154.47.97] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 When Joe Sixpack sees a HD TV in the store and and sees how much more resolution it has over analog NRSC TV, he is going to want to buy a HD Radio thinking it have sound quality that is many times better than his old Analog radio. Won't he be in for a shock when he hears the fuzzy, compressed and distorted audio of his HD radio compared to the sound of his old Delco UX1! Kevin From groucho@skyweb.net Tue Jan 14 00:16:15 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Jan 2003 08:16:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 5106 invoked from network); 14 Jan 2003 08:16:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Jan 2003 08:16:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Jan 2003 08:16:14 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (tc1-126.skyweb.net [66.6.130.254]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h0E8O6ol094818 for ; Tue, 14 Jan 2003 03:24:06 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3E23C5AA.EFD5C503@skyweb.net> Date: Tue, 14 Jan 2003 03:09:14 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: New IBOC audio samples... LOL! References: <007b01c2bb6c$c799c240$827dfea9@home1> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 My Doors are always open for a visit Neal > get down to NJ and see some of you list members in the area and get a > tour of WTTM. :) > > Scott Todd > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > > > Posts like WOR ratings are low because of IBOC make us look bad and > > you all know it. IBOC has NOTHING TO DO WITH WOR's NUMBERS... > > PERIOD! We have to be realists and not look at everything so narrow > > minded. > > > > The only problem with AM stereo is the fact that it has the "Edsel" > > moniker stuck with it. That is what our goal should be, to try and > > re-introduce the technology as something viable in a professional > > manner. Any other way and we'll be laughed at > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From dav259@csiro.au Tue Jan 14 00:28:10 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Jan 2003 08:28:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 96141 invoked from network); 14 Jan 2003 08:28:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Jan 2003 08:28:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Jan 2003 08:28:09 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0E8S7P20368 for ; Tue, 14 Jan 2003 19:28:07 +1100 (EST) Date: Tue, 14 Jan 2003 19:28:07 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Subject: Re: {AMSF} New IBOC audio samples... LOL! In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public On Tue, 14 Jan 2003, Possum Hunter wrote: > When Joe Sixpack sees a HD TV in the store and and sees how much more > resolution it has over analog NRSC TV, he is going to want to buy a HD Radio > thinking it have sound quality that is many times better than his old Analog > radio. Won't he be in for a shock when he hears the fuzzy, compressed and > distorted audio of his HD radio compared to the sound of his old Delco UX1! I doubt it Kevin. If he sees the better HDTV resolution he at least knows why he's paying all the extra dosh. Surely he'd want to hear 'HD radio' and shouldn't be put off by the sales assistant saying 'well you've got to accept that you're not going to get decent reception here' because that's the reason it's supposed to be putting analog to rest. Thereagain with Joe Sixpack one never knows ... Ian From dav259@csiro.au Tue Jan 14 00:42:48 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Jan 2003 08:42:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 70936 invoked from network); 14 Jan 2003 08:42:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Jan 2003 08:42:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Jan 2003 08:42:47 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0E8gkP20936 for ; Tue, 14 Jan 2003 19:42:46 +1100 (EST) Date: Tue, 14 Jan 2003 19:42:46 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Subject: Re: {AMSF} It's the programming... In-Reply-To: <143.7c397dc.2b550682@aol.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public On Tue, 14 Jan 2003 n0uiheric@aol.com wrote: > Chris, it's the quality of the programming that has allowed public radio > stations (especially the NPR member stations) to nearly triple their audience > in nearly a decade and a half. At the same time, due to the quality of the > programming, commercial radio stations have lost over a quarter of it's > listenership. QED Eric I knew you Yankees would eventually embrace public radio. God bless NPR, the CBC, the BBC, NZBC, and "our ABC" (as it's currently called) which they tell us costs us 8 cents a day. That's $29.20 annually for six radio networks - including our top rating local station! Bloody bonza value I have to say. And it IS the variety and quality of programming that commercial stations simply won't bother with ... as they count their beans ... Why should all of the finite public airwaves be dominated simply by profiteers who care more about their advertisers than their audience? Ian From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Jan 14 02:05:47 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Jan 2003 10:05:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 62379 invoked from network); 14 Jan 2003 10:05:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Jan 2003 10:05:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Jan 2003 10:05:46 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.139] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Jan 2003 10:05:46 -0000 Date: Tue, 14 Jan 2003 10:05:45 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Even more IBOC audio -- if you can stand it Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 809 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.68.1 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics For some reason, here's a "hidden" link which includes additional IBOC music samples, besides the ones that are available on the "public" audio page... perhaps because they sound even worse than the rest of the samples? http://www.wor710.com/Engineering/iboc/audio_samples.htm Even though it is included on the "public" page, I find the Sinatra sample to be the worst, because you can clearly hear the artificial harmonics that were incorrectly added to his voice and to the horn section, caused by it "guessing" the treble content... it's the same exact problem that the "MP3Pro" format has. And as Mr. Ray says, "The stereo HD simply isn't quite there yet." So, I guess that answers Ian's question if IBOC/"HD Radio" is Stereo on the AM band -- currently, the answer is no, it is glorious mono! From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Tue Jan 14 07:45:33 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Jan 2003 15:45:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 316 invoked from network); 14 Jan 2003 15:45:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Jan 2003 15:45:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14202.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.144) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Jan 2003 15:45:31 -0000 Message-ID: <20030114154531.79269.qmail@web14202.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.45.202.244] by web14202.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 14 Jan 2003 07:45:31 PST Date: Tue, 14 Jan 2003 07:45:31 -0800 (PST) Subject: Healthy AM Band Suggestion To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio A way to restore good health to the AM Band would be for noise reduction on the band. -One suggestion is for the FCC to enforce the requirements on how much RF hash comes out of half of the 120V items built these days. -Another would be to make the power companies comply when they have RF noisy insulators (fortunatley, during an icestorm, they usually blow-up first for some reason!) -Utilize DSP noise blankers, Omega technology, Symphony, Diciceiver, diversity antennas, etc... Lots of ways to improve radio, and the broadcasters don't have to spend very much at all; just kiss-up to the receiver manufacturers. Clear Channel is big enough to buy a receiver manufacturer and have them pump out radios that make their ananlog stereo stations sound decent. Perhaps they've forgotten that WLW was once owned by a receiver manufacturer - Crosley, and the 500,000watt 'BigOne' help sell the Crosley radios. And how did RCA sell Color TVs - they have their own company - NBC - broadcast color TV shows (Bonanza, The Tonight Show, etc...). __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From michaelj@vcn.com Tue Jan 14 08:20:27 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Jan 2003 16:20:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 52299 invoked from network); 14 Jan 2003 16:20:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Jan 2003 16:20:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m1-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.31) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Jan 2003 16:20:20 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m1-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id ; Tue, 14 Jan 2003 09:20:20 -0700 Message-ID: <005c01c07e46$02811b80$0701010a@keva> To: Cc: References: <20030114154531.79269.qmail@web14202.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: More IBOC BS....Price, Utah???? Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2001 09:21:09 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Can you believe this stuff??? Check it out. http://www.rwonline.com/dailynews/one.php?id=2442 No, the stations in Price that I do work for are NOT planning on or talking about IBOC. So I'm assuiming it's the others....KOAL-AM and KARB-FM. MJR n WYO [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From jbyrns@enteract.com Tue Jan 14 08:56:57 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Jan 2003 16:56:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 8685 invoked from network); 14 Jan 2003 16:56:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Jan 2003 16:56:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Jan 2003 16:56:56 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.156] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Jan 2003 16:56:55 -0000 Date: Tue, 14 Jan 2003 16:56:52 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: for those of you who think IBOC will sore well in the public... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20030113230317.00a34030@pop.GameBox.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1965 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.98.122 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, John wrote: > > Here's why I think it's not good. > 1. Money issues. I know the broadcasters have to pay to upgrade > the transmitters, but why would the public want to pay for new > equipment? And what about the old stereos, etc? This will be painless for the "public", the listeners in the automobile are the most important radio market, and as the stock of old cars are replaced, the new ones will have IBOC radio's, whose extra cost won't be noticed on the monthly car payments. > 2. It, to me, sounds horrible. From what I've heard of the > samples, I'm not impressed. Admit, I am parsley deaf, so I > probably am missing out on some of the artifacts. The "public", which is who counts, doesn't care what it sounds like, as long as the words used to describe it sound good, like "digital" and High Definition. > 3. What about those that prefer analog. If the FCC mandates > this, what about all of those radios? and what about those > audiophiles? I doubt IBOC sounds good to them. I know to me, > I'd rather here analog any day. It's only the lunatic fringe that prefers analog, not the vast bulk of the public, get with the program. > I only wonder if decoding the sample to *.mp3, a lossy > compression format would result in a miss acurit presentation > of Iboc? Yes, this is a well known problem, cascading of lossy compression schemes tends to create artifacts that normally aren't there. Lossy compression schemes like IBOC uses, and mp3 uses, are meant only for the final distribution of program material, they aren't meant to be cascaded with other lossy compression systems. > Why put stations on the air that are digital, when there is > no receiver to play the stuff on? The same argument could have been made when the analog FM stereo system first came out over 40 years ago. That's always a problem, but if you don't deal with it there will be no progress. John From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Jan 14 09:29:48 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Jan 2003 17:29:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 44169 invoked from network); 14 Jan 2003 17:29:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Jan 2003 17:29:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.86) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Jan 2003 17:29:48 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.174] by n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Jan 2003 17:29:42 -0000 Date: Tue, 14 Jan 2003 17:29:40 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Motion to Dismiss FCC's IBOC ruling Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 903 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics John Pavlica has filed a Motion to Dismiss the FCC's IBOC ruling, requesting that all AM and FM IBOC broadcasts be suspended until either the IBOC system can be modified to solve its many problems, or viable alternatives (such as continued support for analog AM Stereo and FM Stereo) can be officially considered. It has already received one reply of support from "REC Networks". The following link will direct you to the FCC site upon which you can view all of the documents that have been filed about the IBOC proceeding, with the newest ones (such as John's Motion and its reply) first: http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/iboc.htm If you would like to file a reply comment yourself, you can use the FCC's Electronic Comment Filing System. Be sure to use a proceeding number of 99-325, and use document type "Statement" (ST code) when entering your reply: http://www.fcc.gov/e-file/ecfs.html From groucho@skyweb.net Tue Jan 14 09:37:58 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Jan 2003 17:37:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 53157 invoked from network); 14 Jan 2003 17:37:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Jan 2003 17:37:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Jan 2003 17:37:58 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (tc1-78.skyweb.net [66.6.130.206]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h0EHjool061584 for ; Tue, 14 Jan 2003 12:45:50 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3E244951.B39F657D@skyweb.net> Date: Tue, 14 Jan 2003 12:30:57 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com" Subject: SRF-42 on Ebay Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Ok who is Ebay'er "Stereo_987" that's Bidding against me on the SRF-42? is that a User here on the list Neal From JH_Radio@GameBox.net Tue Jan 14 09:56:00 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: JH_Radio@GameBox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Jan 2003 17:56:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 42955 invoked from network); 14 Jan 2003 17:56:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Jan 2003 17:56:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO babyruth.hotpop.com) (204.57.55.14) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Jan 2003 17:56:00 -0000 Received: from gamebox.net (kubrick.hotpop.com [204.57.55.16]) by babyruth.hotpop.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 111FD210CC6 for ; Tue, 14 Jan 2003 17:55:23 +0000 (UTC) Received: from -enduser.GameBox.net (pcp03184855pcs.benslm01.pa.comcast.net [68.80.77.117]) by smtp-1.hotpop.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 27E352F85FF for ; Tue, 14 Jan 2003 17:33:41 +0000 (UTC) Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030114121624.032a02a0@pop.GameBox.net> X-Sender: JH_Radio@pop.GameBox.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Tue, 14 Jan 2003 12:21:01 -0500 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: ANALOG VERSES IBOC DIGITAL SAMPLES Mime-Version: 1.0 X-HotPOP: ----------------------------------------------- Sent By HotPOP.com FREE Email Get your FREE POP email at www.HotPOP.com ----------------------------------------------- From: John X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113800107 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi. I put them both in a play list in winamp and compared them side by side. It is of my opinion that the digital samples peaks are higher, and distorted. I've not put them in Sound Forge to check the peak numbers as of yet, however. Also, with the digital samples, the highs go in, and out and in, and out. At least with the analog samples, the highs are constantly there, without the faiding of the frequency response. Also, it is not distorted in the analog, and the peaks are lower. Sounds like the digital samples are normalized with and the saturation aloud to saturate .It's distorted as a result, on the digatal sample. It doesn't sound good to me, and I will not be rushing out to by a digatal radio. Though, at least people can compair something. Love in Christ: John Bensalem, PA Send me an email Aim: RainAngelsRule MSN: RainAngelsRule@hotmail.com My website Welcome to Napster4TheBlind "Prayer does not change God; it changes you." - Authur unknown [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From jsgil@hal-pc.org Tue Jan 14 10:46:19 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Jan 2003 18:46:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 58774 invoked from network); 14 Jan 2003 18:46:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Jan 2003 18:46:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Jan 2003 18:46:18 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.129] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Jan 2003 18:46:17 -0000 Date: Tue, 14 Jan 2003 18:46:16 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: More IBOC BS....Price, Utah???? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <005c01c07e46$02811b80$0701010a@keva> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 437 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.130.1 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Michael J. Richard" wrote: > Can you believe this stuff??? > Check it out. > > http://www.rwonline.com/dailynews/one.php?id=2442 > > No, the stations in Price that I do work for are NOT planning on or talking about IBOC. So I'm assuiming it's the others....KOAL-AM and KARB-FM. > > MJR n WYO > > They way it is being reported makes it sound like a bunch of propaganda. JSG From KC4QLP@aol.com Tue Jan 14 13:22:13 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Jan 2003 21:22:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 21457 invoked from network); 14 Jan 2003 21:22:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Jan 2003 21:22:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d02.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.34) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Jan 2003 21:22:11 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.11.74c6e23 (1320) for ; Tue, 14 Jan 2003 16:21:54 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <11.74c6e23.2b55d972@aol.com> Date: Tue, 14 Jan 2003 16:21:54 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} It's the programming... To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 1/14/03 1:23:39 AM Eastern Standard Time, n0uiheric@aol.com writes: << It's quite obvious that an ever-growing number of listeners tend to prefer "Morning Edition" over Howard Stern, "Fresh Air" over Rush Limbaugh, "All Things Considered" over Dr. Laura, and even "Talk of The Nation" over the mindless chatter on commercial radio. Commercial radio programming desperately needs to be cleaned up, in my honest opinion. It's not just the quality, it's also the content. >> I "hear" the chatter but show me the figures where this is so. If you cant show something like a source of where you obtained this information this group goes right back to square one....and that would be a bunch of nuts talking about a bunch of nothing that cant seem to get "it together". If you all are going to ever be taken seriously,lame opinions and jack legged "information" is going to have to be derailed. Just trying to be helpful here folks. Take it or leave it. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- Subscribe send an email to amstereo-subscribe@topica.com _______________________________________________________ From KC4QLP@aol.com Tue Jan 14 13:29:59 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Jan 2003 21:29:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 9821 invoked from network); 14 Jan 2003 21:29:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Jan 2003 21:29:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r03.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.99) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Jan 2003 21:29:57 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.94.32bd544b (1320) for ; Tue, 14 Jan 2003 16:29:53 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <94.32bd544b.2b55db50@aol.com> Date: Tue, 14 Jan 2003 16:29:52 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Healthy AM Band Suggestion To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 1/14/03 10:46:36 AM Eastern Standard Time, toledohamradio@yahoo.com writes: << A way to restore good health to the AM Band would be for noise reduction on the band. -One suggestion is for the FCC to enforce the requirements on how much RF hash comes out of half of the 120V items built these days. -Another would be to make the power companies comply when they have RF noisy insulators (fortunatley, during an icestorm, they usually blow-up first for some reason!) -Utilize DSP noise blankers, Omega technology, Symphony, Diciceiver, diversity antennas, etc... Lots of ways to improve radio, and the broadcasters don't have to spend very much at all; just kiss-up to the receiver manufacturers. >> Well we all know these things would go a long ways to helping AM,but if it doesnt have anything to do with digital or have "digital" in the name,manufactures probably would fear that there wont be a market for these things. This is the digital craze that we are living in now. Perhaps if those things mentioned above had been acted apon ....maybe 20 years ago,AM radio might....and I mean might have a different landscape today.Its just one of those things we will never know. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- Subscribe send an email to amstereo-subscribe@topica.com _______________________________________________________ From kfornal@cox.net Tue Jan 14 14:53:40 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kfornal@cox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Jan 2003 22:53:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 67075 invoked from network); 14 Jan 2003 22:53:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Jan 2003 22:53:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO lakemtao04.cox.net) (68.1.17.241) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Jan 2003 22:53:39 -0000 Received: from OMNIBOOK ([68.9.127.164]) by lakemtao04.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20030114225337.WRQY22825.lakemtao04.cox.net@OMNIBOOK> for ; Tue, 14 Jan 2003 17:53:37 -0500 To: Subject: FW: Memorex Sphere Boomball CD Music System #BX1600 will not become available Date: Tue, 14 Jan 2003 17:53:28 -0500 Message-ID: <001a01c2bc1f$c0f25430$0301a8c0@OMNIBOOK> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2616 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Importance: Normal From: "Keith Fornal" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=128541479 X-Yahoo-Profile: theradboy They still do have some in their retail stores, but it looks like it is/has been discontinued. Keith Fornal Treasurer Dutch Island Lighthouse Society www.dutchislandlighthouse.org -----Original Message----- From: Target.com [mailto:auto-response@target.com] Sent: Friday, January 10, 2003 12:10 PM To: kfornal@cox.net Subject: Memorex Sphere Boomball CD Music System #BX1600 will not become available Greetings from target.direct. We've recently learned from our supplier that the item you requested to be notified about, Memorex Sphere Boomball CD Music System #BX1600, will not be available in the foreseeable future. We're sorry not to have better news for you. Please note: This e-mail was sent from a notification-only address that cannot accept incoming e-mail. Please do not reply to this message. Sincerely, target.direct Guest Service From ccuff@in4web.com Tue Jan 14 15:36:55 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 14 Jan 2003 23:36:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 38176 invoked from network); 14 Jan 2003 23:36:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Jan 2003 23:36:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Jan 2003 23:36:23 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.156]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Tue, 14 Jan 2003 18:32:05 -0500 Message-ID: <000f01c2bc24$80b84640$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: <001a01c2bc1f$c0f25430$0301a8c0@OMNIBOOK> Subject: Re: {AMSF} FW: Memorex Sphere not become available Date: Tue, 14 Jan 2003 18:27:26 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 This is a unique "feature"of Target. They get exclusives for many items by nationally recognized brands, make a limited run, and then discontinue them. (Making them instant "collectors items") Another item was a very cool portable DVD player that worked on 12 volts or 120 volts, and even had component outputs- all for $79 available in Targets typical wild purple or pink colors. They went quickly, and are not coming back. One other unique item was a tiny Emerson digital AM FM walkman, not even pictured on Emersons website. Chris ----- Original Message ----- From: Keith Fornal To From possumhunter@netzero.net Tue Jan 14 22:37:46 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Jan 2003 06:37:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 77090 invoked from network); 15 Jan 2003 06:37:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Jan 2003 06:37:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.198) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Jan 2003 06:37:44 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 14 Jan 2003 22:37:44 -0800 To: References: <20030114154531.79269.qmail@web14202.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Healthy AM Band Suggestion Date: Wed, 15 Jan 2003 01:37:32 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 15 Jan 2003 06:37:44.0248 (UTC) FILETIME=[9C270380:01C2BC60] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.175.106.249] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Another thing they could do to help AM is to require Mono stations with talk programming more than 80% of the day to filter their audio at 5Khz while allowing only C-QUAM stations the full 10Khz bandwidth. This would help get rid of the "monkey chatter" on many night time AM signals. Kevin From amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Tue Jan 14 23:23:23 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 28459 invoked from network); 15 Jan 2003 07:23:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Jan 2003 07:23:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.88) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Jan 2003 07:23:22 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: notify@yahoogroups.com Received: from [66.218.67.136] by n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Jan 2003 07:23:22 -0000 Date: 15 Jan 2003 07:23:21 -0000 Message-ID: <1042615401.7081.94256.w17@yahoogroups.com> X-eGroups-Application: files X-Yahoo-Group-Post: system From: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: New file uploaded to amstereoforum MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello, This email message is a notification to let you know that a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the amstereoforum group. File : /ibocstat.txt Uploaded by : kevtronics Description : Kevin T.'s Reply Statement to the FCC regarding John Pavlica's Motion to Dismiss the IBOC ruling, as submitted January 15, 2003. In original formatted form, it is 14 pages long, so it is quite thorough and covers many issues in depth. You can access this file at the URL http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum/files/ibocstat.txt To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/files Regards, kevtronics From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Jan 15 06:08:57 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Jan 2003 14:08:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 11372 invoked from network); 15 Jan 2003 14:08:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Jan 2003 14:08:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Jan 2003 14:08:51 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-187.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.187]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h0FE8mql016475 for ; Wed, 15 Jan 2003 08:08:49 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <000601c2bc9f$c937e260$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: WOR violation Date: Wed, 15 Jan 2003 08:09:55 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude True, but WLW is in fact using the FM-6. I think the AM only went to the 4.5 version. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Scott Todd" wrote: > > That is likely the problem. WLW is actually using an Omnia FM-6 > processor > > (you read that right, boys and girls!). > > Omnia did make AM versions of their FM processors. From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Jan 15 06:20:54 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Jan 2003 14:20:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 18093 invoked from network); 15 Jan 2003 14:20:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Jan 2003 14:20:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Jan 2003 14:20:53 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-187.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.187]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h0FEKoql019659 for ; Wed, 15 Jan 2003 08:20:51 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <001801c2bca1$77872fa0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <143.7c397dc.2b550682@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} It's the programming... Date: Wed, 15 Jan 2003 08:21:57 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude I'll have to remember this next time the libs kvetch about the media being too dominated by conservatives. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: > It's quite obvious that an ever-growing number of listeners tend to prefer > "Morning Edition" over Howard Stern, "Fresh Air" over Rush Limbaugh, "All > Things Considered" over Dr. Laura, and even "Talk of The Nation" over the > mindless chatter on commercial radio. From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Jan 15 06:22:50 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Jan 2003 14:22:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 47871 invoked from network); 15 Jan 2003 14:22:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Jan 2003 14:22:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Jan 2003 14:22:49 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-187.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.187]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h0FEMkql020242 for ; Wed, 15 Jan 2003 08:22:47 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <002001c2bca1$bcf7ace0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <003901c2bb68$c14c6f40$827dfea9@home1> Subject: Re: {AMSF} WLW Date: Wed, 15 Jan 2003 08:23:53 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Omnia has only two AM processors- the 3 and the 4.5, but they have yet a third in their FM line, the 6. I heard the CE wanted the extra flexibility of the 6. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Possum Hunter" > Scott Todd wrote: > >WLW is actually using an Omnia FM-6 processor > > Why on earth are they doing that? Why not use an Omnia AM box? > > Kevin From fanfare@globility.com Wed Jan 15 07:14:54 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Jan 2003 15:14:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 77638 invoked from network); 15 Jan 2003 15:14:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Jan 2003 15:14:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.eol.ca) (205.189.151.1) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Jan 2003 15:14:53 -0000 Received: from FAN--MCS (unknown [64.56.235.37]) by mail.eol.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 48E0341FB5 for ; Wed, 15 Jan 2003 10:15:25 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <200301151014540343.003D3465@mail.globility.com> In-Reply-To: <002001c2bca1$bcf7ace0$827dfea9@home1> References: <003901c2bb68$c14c6f40$827dfea9@home1> <002001c2bca1$bcf7ace0$827dfea9@home1> X-Mailer: Calypso Version 3.30.00.00 (4) Date: Wed, 15 Jan 2003 10:14:54 -0500 To: "Kevin Tekel" Subject: Re: {AMSF} WLW Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable From: "Marv Southcott" Reply-To: fanfare@globility.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy Hi Scott: I was wondering if I might ask you for some assistance in this matter. Is there any way we can spread the word amongst installation engineers that= the FTA-100 is available to them for resale? I just got a message from an outfit in Indiana that's interested. If you kn= ow of any that I could make contact with, I'd appreciate it muchly. Interes= t, hence business, has diminished considerably since Ibiquity made the big = noise and stepped on AM Stereo. I would also make the same offer to you if such an opportunity might presen= t itself. Many thanks, Marv *********** REPLY SEPARATOR *********** On 1/15/2003 at 8:23 AM Scott Todd wrote: >Omnia has only two AM processors- the 3 and the 4.5, but they have yet a >third in their FM line, the 6. I heard the CE wanted the extra flexibilit= y >of the 6. > >ST > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Possum Hunter" > > >> Scott Todd wrote: >> >WLW is actually using an Omnia FM-6 processor >> >> Why on earth are they doing that? Why not use an Omnia AM box? >> >> Kevin > > >Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum=20 > >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Jan 15 07:31:05 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Jan 2003 15:31:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 73834 invoked from network); 15 Jan 2003 15:30:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Jan 2003 15:30:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Jan 2003 15:30:57 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-187.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.187]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h0FFUrql010906 for ; Wed, 15 Jan 2003 09:30:55 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <008301c2bcab$41810840$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <003901c2bb68$c14c6f40$827dfea9@home1> <002001c2bca1$bcf7ace0$827dfea9@home1> <200301151014540343.003D3465@mail.globility.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} WLW Date: Wed, 15 Jan 2003 09:32:01 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Marv, I take it you mean broadcast engineers? The best bet is to post on the broadcast.net Radiotech forum. That will get you audience to a host of engineers fast. There are a couple smaller lists I could post it to as well. One other thing, is you could market your receivers through broadcast.net, and even get a link to the Fanfare site on the same. Dave Biondi is the contact person, as he runs the show. Scott Todd ----- Original Message ----- From: "Marv Southcott" To: "Kevin Tekel" Sent: Wednesday, January 15, 2003 9:14 AM Subject: Re: {AMSF} WLW > Hi Scott: > > I was wondering if I might ask you for some assistance in this matter. > > Is there any way we can spread the word amongst installation engineers that the FTA-100 is available to them for resale? > I just got a message from an outfit in Indiana that's interested. If you know of any that I could make contact with, I'd appreciate it muchly. Interest, hence business, has diminished considerably since Ibiquity made the big noise and stepped on AM Stereo. > > I would also make the same offer to you if such an opportunity might present itself. > > Many thanks, > > Marv > From amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk Wed Jan 15 07:45:34 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Jan 2003 15:45:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 75374 invoked from network); 15 Jan 2003 15:45:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Jan 2003 15:45:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.69) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Jan 2003 15:45:34 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.183] by n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Jan 2003 15:45:26 -0000 Date: Wed, 15 Jan 2003 15:45:23 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Plymouth/Dodge AM Stereo 8track radio Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 88 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Dave " X-Originating-IP: 81.7.58.52 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113985069 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereofan http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll? ViewItem&category=6763&item=2400154752 From fanfare@globility.com Wed Jan 15 08:22:45 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Jan 2003 16:22:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 38449 invoked from network); 15 Jan 2003 16:22:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Jan 2003 16:22:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.eol.ca) (205.189.151.1) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Jan 2003 16:22:44 -0000 Received: from FAN--MCS (unknown [64.56.235.37]) by mail.eol.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id BA78241216 for ; Wed, 15 Jan 2003 11:23:16 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <200301151122450749.007B5453@mail.globility.com> In-Reply-To: <008301c2bcab$41810840$827dfea9@home1> References: <003901c2bb68$c14c6f40$827dfea9@home1> <002001c2bca1$bcf7ace0$827dfea9@home1> <200301151014540343.003D3465@mail.globility.com> <008301c2bcab$41810840$827dfea9@home1> X-Mailer: Calypso Version 3.30.00.00 (4) Date: Wed, 15 Jan 2003 11:22:45 -0500 To: "Kevin Tekel" Subject: Re: {AMSF} WLW Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable From: "Marv Southcott" Reply-To: fanfare@globility.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy First of all, my apologies for allowing this message to get onto the forum.= It was intended as personal to Scott.=20 However, so all those who are curious, this would have been my answer to Sc= ott.=20 We already advertise in Broadcast Magazine and Radio Shopper. We're on Broa= dcast Net as well. Response has been spotty. If you'll consider a shameless= plug at this point, we do have an excellent track record with the broadcas= ters now using our receivers, especially in translator situations. If anyon= e wants to know more, write to me or visit "http://www.fanfare.com" Unfortunately, receivers are kind of benign in the way many engineers view = them. Ours are very honest in their reproduction of off-air which, to those= engineers. is not "typical". Therefore, it is of no value.=20 I remember many years ago hearing this from one of my profs. "Shoot for the= sky and you'll at least hit the middle. Shoot for the middle and you'll mo= re than likely hit the ground." In many ways, that is where radio has taken= itself. Being the loudest, from and audiophile standpoint, is no better th= an pushing all the sliders of an equalizer to the wall. It doesn't make any= thing sound better. Again my apologies for the mis-key and the intrusion. Marv *********** REPLY SEPARATOR *********** On 1/15/2003 at 9:32 AM Scott Todd wrote: >Marv, > >I take it you mean broadcast engineers? The best bet is to post on the >broadcast.net Radiotech forum. That will get you audience to a host of >engineers fast. There are a couple smaller lists I could post it to as >well. One other thing, is you could market your receivers through >broadcast.net, and even get a link to the Fanfare site on the same. Dave >Biondi is the contact person, as he runs the show. > >Scott Todd > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Marv Southcott" >To: "Kevin Tekel" >Sent: Wednesday, January 15, 2003 9:14 AM >Subject: Re: {AMSF} WLW > > >> Hi Scott: >> >> I was wondering if I might ask you for some assistance in this matter. >> >> Is there any way we can spread the word amongst installation engineers >that the FTA-100 is available to them for resale? >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From amfmdx@fastq.com Wed Jan 15 08:24:48 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Jan 2003 16:24:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 3478 invoked from network); 15 Jan 2003 16:24:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Jan 2003 16:24:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Jan 2003 16:24:47 -0000 Received: from fastq (d173-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.205]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id h0FGOjP09156 for ; Wed, 15 Jan 2003 09:24:46 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <003301c2bcb2$9581af60$cdf9bed8@com> To: Subject: IBOC / AM stereo Date: Wed, 15 Jan 2003 09:24:30 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla >The same argument could have been made when the analog FM stereo >system first came out over 40 years ago. That's always a problem, but >if you don't deal with it there will be no progress. Well, its not the same..... Its on a different band and did not wreck what was already built. Kevin "Its going to get a lot worse before it gets worse" - Lily Tomlin From ccuff@in4web.com Wed Jan 15 08:31:36 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Jan 2003 16:31:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 49675 invoked from network); 15 Jan 2003 16:31:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Jan 2003 16:31:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Jan 2003 16:31:35 -0000 Received: from Chris1 (unverified [208.228.96.20]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Wed, 15 Jan 2003 11:27:18 -0500 Message-ID: <002801c2bcb3$926a19b0$0d01a8c0@Chris1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Plymouth/Dodge AM Stereo 8track radio Date: Wed, 15 Jan 2003 11:31:35 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Chris Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 This is from a 1969 or so- not am stereo, just stereo 8 track, mono am radio. Chris ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Wednesday, January 15, 2003 10:45 AM Subject: {AMSF} Plymouth/Dodge AM Stereo 8track radio > From kevtronics@yahoo.com Wed Jan 15 11:18:33 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Jan 2003 19:18:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 58975 invoked from network); 15 Jan 2003 19:18:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Jan 2003 19:18:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.88) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Jan 2003 19:18:30 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.147] by n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Jan 2003 19:18:30 -0000 Date: Wed, 15 Jan 2003 19:18:29 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: AM Stereo TIS? Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1150 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics I am involved with a group that is setting up a 10-watt AM "Travellers' Information Service" (TIS) station for a local community. Understandably, it will primarily broadcast voice messages, but is there any specific FCC rule against TISes transmitting in AM Stereo? Quite a few TISes are off-frequency enough to generate carrier beat tones that can "false" a receiver into AM Stereo mode, but I have yet to come across a TIS that actually transmits in AM Stereo. Also, is there some specific rule that TISes must limit their audio to telephone-quality, as I hear from all of the TISes in my area? I've heard about a "3 kHz" audio limit but I haven't come across any specific rules regarding it. And beyond that, would a TIS be bound by the same NRSC bandwidth regulations as regular full-power AM broadcast stations? And is the modulation limited to less than +125% / -100%? Only a few of the TISes in my area transmit what could be considered "broadcast standard" modulation levels. Some are so "quiet" I bet they are only running 25% modulation! p.s. I wonder when iBiquity will come up with the first TIS transmitting an IBOC signal.... From alinton@esatclear.ie Wed Jan 15 14:47:22 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: alinton@esatclear.ie X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Jan 2003 22:47:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 946 invoked from network); 15 Jan 2003 22:47:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Jan 2003 22:47:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO davros) (159.134.148.42) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Jan 2003 22:47:19 -0000 Received: from Spooler by davros (Mercury/32 v3.30) ID MO000011; 15 Jan 03 22:47:20 -0000 Received: from spooler by totalbroadcast.net (Mercury/32 v3.30); 15 Jan 03 22:46:55 -0000 Received: from fr1.esatclear.ie (192.168.0.1) by davros (Mercury/32 v3.30) with ESMTP ID MG000010; 15 Jan 03 22:46:49 -0000 X-MSReally-From: alinton@esatclear.ie Message-Id: <5.1.1.2.2.20030115224545.00b95768@fr1> X-Sender: alinton@fr1 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1.1.3 (Beta) Date: Wed, 15 Jan 2003 22:46:47 +0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: AMS in Italy - quick please! In-Reply-To: <008301c2bcab$41810840$827dfea9@home1> References: <003901c2bb68$c14c6f40$827dfea9@home1> <002001c2bca1$bcf7ace0$827dfea9@home1> <200301151014540343.003D3465@mail.globility.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed From: Andy Linton X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10800314 X-Yahoo-Profile: alinton1_ie Hi all, can someone please remind me which station in Italy is reputedly in AMS? Please respond quickly, a buddy is in Italy right now and wants to try to listen! rgds Andy From jbyrns@enteract.com Wed Jan 15 15:20:55 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Jan 2003 23:20:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 21871 invoked from network); 15 Jan 2003 23:20:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Jan 2003 23:20:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Jan 2003 23:20:53 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.147] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Jan 2003 23:20:53 -0000 Date: Wed, 15 Jan 2003 23:20:50 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: IBOC / AM stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <003301c2bcb2$9581af60$cdf9bed8@com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 948 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.198 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" < amfmdx@f...> wrote: > >The same argument could have been made when the analog FM stereo > >system first came out over 40 years ago. That's always a problem, but > >if you don't deal with it there will be no progress. > > Well, its not the same..... > Its on a different band and did not wreck what > was already built. I'm not sure what the "band" has to do with the issue? I think I understand your feelings to not "wreck what was already built", but it's the 21st century, and it is time to move on to more contemporary technology. They are doing the same thing over on the television "band", where a new system has been mandated, and what has already been built is scheduled for demolition. Look what has happened in the transportation industry, as well as other industries, over the years, where "what was already built" was wrecked, to make way for progress. John From ccuff@in4web.com Wed Jan 15 15:44:15 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Jan 2003 23:44:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 13658 invoked from network); 15 Jan 2003 23:44:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Jan 2003 23:44:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Jan 2003 23:44:13 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.60]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Wed, 15 Jan 2003 18:39:57 -0500 Message-ID: <002c01c2bcee$c34df660$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC / AM stereo Date: Wed, 15 Jan 2003 18:35:17 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 PROGRESS?!- try "regress"- It is one thing if the new system is far superior to the existing format. In the case of radio, it is not. It is "progress" only to the corporations that hope to make financial gains beacuse of it. Why do you think that the auto makers come up with such hienous monstrosities such as the Pontiac Aztec, or the Toyota Precis? Of course- to make the "old looking" cars undesireable- even if the current group of cars look like melted blocks of ice cream, or lemons cut in half, then squeezed sideways. What the current technology WILL do is finish off radio for good. The few remaining listeners will abandon it, and it will be done. CC ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Wednesday, January 15, 2003 6:20 PM Subject: {AMSF} Re: IBOC / AM stereo I think I > understand your feelings to not "wreck what was already built", but > it's the 21st century, and it is time to move on to more contemporary > technology. They are doing the same thing over on the television > "band", where a new system has been mandated, and what has already > been built is scheduled for demolition. Look what has happened in the > transportation industry, as well as other industries, over the years, > where "what was already built" was wrecked, to make way for progress. > > John From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Wed Jan 15 15:56:02 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Jan 2003 23:56:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 24732 invoked from network); 15 Jan 2003 23:56:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Jan 2003 23:56:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web41003.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.93.2) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Jan 2003 23:56:02 -0000 Message-ID: <20030115235602.1476.qmail@web41003.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.32.217] by web41003.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 15 Jan 2003 15:56:02 PST Date: Wed, 15 Jan 2003 15:56:02 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: {AMSF} Upper Midwest Broadcasting To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: <000901c2b203$208924e0$827dfea9@home1> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio Scott, was that station sold? 73, n1wvq __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From davidcoons@webtv.net Wed Jan 15 15:59:13 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: davidcoons@webtv.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 15 Jan 2003 23:59:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 84506 invoked from network); 15 Jan 2003 23:59:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Jan 2003 23:59:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO smtpout-2001-1.public.lawson.webtv.net) (209.240.212.81) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Jan 2003 23:59:09 -0000 Received: from storefull-2314.public.lawson.webtv.net (lawson-public-ipmux-1-pip-4.public.lawson.webtv.net [209.240.212.24]) by smtpout-2001-1.public.lawson.webtv.net (WebTV_Postfix+sws) with ESMTP id 9483DBE76 for ; Wed, 15 Jan 2003 15:59:08 -0800 (PST) Received: (from production@localhost) by storefull-2314.public.lawson.webtv.net (8.8.8-wtv-f/mt.gso.26Feb98) id PAA11984; Wed, 15 Jan 2003 15:59:08 -0800 (PST) X-WebTV-Signature: 1 ETAsAhQFDHgIcohP2VreE9yWi9osMtJqDAIUeUg1pzbbovFTccfvo2gD2zVhqRc= Date: Wed, 15 Jan 2003 18:59:08 -0500 (EST) To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC / AM stereo Message-ID: <18327-3E25F5CC-1070@storefull-2314.public.lawson.webtv.net> In-Reply-To: "Christopher Cuff" 's message of Wed, 15 Jan 2003 18:35:17 -0500 Content-Disposition: Inline Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) X-eGroups-From: davidcoons@webtv.net (David Coons) From: davidcoons@webtv.net X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10533228 were other digital systems ever tested by the fcc as in the 5 years of am stereo testing? From matthew.trim@eds.com Wed Jan 15 16:47:54 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: matthew.trim@eds.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Jan 2003 00:47:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 23761 invoked from network); 16 Jan 2003 00:47:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Jan 2003 00:47:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO ns5.eds.com) (207.169.189.136) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Jan 2003 00:47:49 -0000 Received: from nnsy.eds.com (nnsy-2.eds.com [192.85.216.198]) by ns5.eds.com (8.11.6/8.11.1) with ESMTP id h0G0lmA29449 for ; Thu, 16 Jan 2003 11:47:48 +1100 (EST) Received: from nnsy.eds.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by nnsy.eds.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0G0lks29892 for ; Thu, 16 Jan 2003 11:47:46 +1100 (EST) Received: from ausym000.exau01.exch.eds.com ([134.251.177.117]) by nnsy.eds.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0G0ljE29882 for ; Thu, 16 Jan 2003 11:47:45 +1100 (EST) Received: by AUSYM000 with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Thu, 16 Jan 2003 11:46:26 +1100 Message-ID: <33CDDBD8CAEFEB4191ABF6F799032AF238D752@aubwm206> To: "'amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com'" Subject: RE: {AMSF} Re: IBOC / AM stereo Date: Thu, 16 Jan 2003 11:46:30 +1100 Importance: high X-Priority: 1 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-Type: text/plain From: "Trim, Matthew L" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88615102 X-Yahoo-Profile: bofh2k2000 Exactly Chris... The only way radio will survive in a digital format is if a system such as Eureka 147 is used that has sufficiently high bit rates to ensure "CD/DVD Audio Quality". We're talking 256 kbit/s here - not the fake treble and low bit rates of IBOC! Consumers will then buy the digital product knowing that it provides "FM+ Quality" minus the interference/multipath problems. Here's where we are up to in Australia (as at March 2002) (VERY GOOD!) http://www.aba.gov.au/abanews/speeches/digital_tech/pdfrtf/gTanner0302.pdf We also have a similar problem to the US in that sufficient L-band spectrum may not be available for Eureka. However using VHF spectrum is an option as TV stations free up spectrum as they convert to digital. This also provides the propagation benefits of VHF vs L-Band. Analogue TV is scheduled to cease transmission in 2008 in Australia so a lot of VHF spectrum will be available then. No-one is going to buy a digital radio that has obvious digital artefacts and sounds worse than their $5 FM radio. The funny thing is that I can't see any right minded FM station converting to IBOC because they will not gain any increased coverage and the sound quality of their digital signal will be far worse than their analogue - where is the benefit?! Plus the costs to install would be prohibitive! Some AM stations may try and convert to IBOC thinking that some listeners may prefer digital artefacts over AC line noise or hum/static BUT hang on - the majority of AM listeners listen to Talk stations or are non audiophile listeners who obviously don't mind the sound they are receiving from their AM radios at the moment. (or don't have an FM radio in the car/boat/at work and don't care to buy one). The minority who buy an IBOC radio or one comes installed in their car will wonder why it keeps dropping out when they can normally listen fine 100km+ from the TX on their $5 analogue radio- they will demand a refund as they can't here their favourite talkback station on IBOC like they could on analogue. With no compelling reason for FM stations and most AM's to convert, there won't be the market penetration for IBOC to succeed. In fact, Eureka may even fail because at 256 kbit/s it really doesn't provide much improvement over a quality FM station. Remember most stations are using 256 kbit/s MUSICAM/MP2 (same codec as Eureka 147) in their playout systems, so the quality won't exceed this anyway) Imbiquity know this, that is why they are using the FCC to mandate IBOC as the official standard and attempting to "encourage" stations to convert to IBOC against all common sense and independent technical analysis. I would imagine WOR paid $0 for the IBOC exciter and TX license. Imbiquity know that if they can get a snowball effect they may succeed in bringing IBOC where AM Stereo failed. It sure seems the FCC is supporting IBOC a lot more than they did AM Stereo (I managed to keep my post on-topic!) :) Matt Check out this Canadian Broadcasting Corporation news release from 1995 - it sums things up their decision to go Eureka vs IBOC http://www.radio.cbc.ca/radio/digital-radio/drri_eia.html Here is a great technical paper on how Eureka 147 works: http://www.bbc.co.uk/rd/pubs/papers/paper_21/paper_21.html -----Original Message----- From: Christopher Cuff [mailto:ccuff@in4web.com] Sent: Thursday, 16 January 2003 9:35 AM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC / AM stereo PROGRESS?!- try "regress"- It is one thing if the new system is far superior to the existing format. In the case of radio, it is not. It is "progress" only to the corporations that hope to make financial gains beacuse of it. Why do you think that the auto makers come up with such hienous monstrosities such as the Pontiac Aztec, or the Toyota Precis? Of course- to make the "old looking" cars undesireable- even if the current group of cars look like melted blocks of ice cream, or lemons cut in half, then squeezed sideways. What the current technology WILL do is finish off radio for good. The few remaining listeners will abandon it, and it will be done. CC ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Wednesday, January 15, 2003 6:20 PM Subject: {AMSF} Re: IBOC / AM stereo I think I > understand your feelings to not "wreck what was already built", but > it's the 21st century, and it is time to move on to more contemporary > technology. They are doing the same thing over on the television > "band", where a new system has been mandated, and what has already > been built is scheduled for demolition. Look what has happened in the > transportation industry, as well as other industries, over the years, > where "what was already built" was wrecked, to make way for progress. > > John From kevtronics@yahoo.com Wed Jan 15 16:50:05 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Jan 2003 00:50:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 65997 invoked from network); 16 Jan 2003 00:50:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Jan 2003 00:50:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Jan 2003 00:50:03 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.165] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Jan 2003 00:49:45 -0000 Date: Thu, 16 Jan 2003 00:49:43 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: AMS in Italy - quick please! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <5.1.1.2.2.20030115224545.00b95768@fr1> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 925 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.79.155 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > can someone please remind me which station in Italy is reputedly in > AMS? That's "Radio Studio X" on 1584 kHz in Momigno, Italy... reported to be using 10,000 watts, and they are in full C-Quam AM Stereo, playing a wide variety of music (mostly in English). There is an excellent recording of them right here in the AM Stereo Forum's Files section, as received locally on a Sony SRF-42 with nearly perfect quality. "Radio Studio X" is transmitting at least 12 kHz of audio bandwidth, so on a good radio, they will have true hi-fi sound, which unfortunately isn't that common on the AM/mediumwave band in Europe. p.s. I'd love to hear some recordings of European LONGWAVE broadcast stations if anybody has the capability to do so. The longwave band is not used for broadcasting in North America and so far I haven't had any luck at getting distant reception of LW broadcast stations from across the "pond". From kevtronics@yahoo.com Wed Jan 15 17:06:44 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Jan 2003 01:06:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 7332 invoked from network); 16 Jan 2003 01:06:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Jan 2003 01:06:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.87) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Jan 2003 01:06:43 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.191] by n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Jan 2003 01:06:43 -0000 Date: Thu, 16 Jan 2003 01:06:41 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: IBOC / AM stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <33CDDBD8CAEFEB4191ABF6F799032AF238D752@aubwm206> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2142 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.79.155 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Check out this Canadian Broadcasting Corporation news release from > 1995 - it sums things up their decision to go Eureka vs IBOC > http://www.radio.cbc.ca/radio/digital-radio/drri_eia.html Here is a more detailed version of that document: http://www.radio.cbc.ca/radio/digital-radio/labnov.html Even though it was done all the way back in AUGUST 1995, it is amazing how much the problems with IBOC -- as this document highlights -- have NOT been remedied: > > > > AM and FM IBOC systems would produce substantially-reduced service coverage, compared to that of their analog "host" stations. ... Even with strong signals and no interference, the USA Digital AM IBOC system suffers audio quality impairments that experts judge to be "annoying"; consequently, this system is not capable of providing "CD-Quality" DAB service. ... Although all DAB receivers require time to recover when signals fail or listeners change frequencies, the recovery time of IBOC receivers is far too long to be practical in a real-world environment. The Eureka 147 system generally recovers from signal loss in 1 second or less. The IBOC systems can take from 5-9 seconds to recover. ... If two neighbouring first-adjacent-channel AM stations were both to implement IBOC DAB, the digital signals would fail wherever the desired station's signal is not at least 34 times stronger than that of the undesired station. ... Many AM stations in urban markets would experience DAB coverage that is substantially smaller than their AM service areas. ... Nighttime AM DAB service would likely be impractical for most stations, due to the presence of strong adjacent-channel skywave signals. < < < < *All* of these problems still exist, even after nearly *eight* years of development and "improvement" since then... so, will IBOC *ever* live up to its claims? I really don't think so... sooner or later, IBOC *is* going to be scrapped in favor of Eureka-147-type DAB -- hopefully sooner instead of later, so that the benefits of a digital radio system can be achieved without trashing analog AM and FM reception for a prolonged amount of time. From KC4QLP@aol.com Wed Jan 15 17:16:54 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Jan 2003 01:16:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 76759 invoked from network); 16 Jan 2003 01:16:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Jan 2003 01:16:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r07.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.103) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Jan 2003 01:16:53 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.97.329b9e40 (4238) for ; Wed, 15 Jan 2003 20:16:43 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <97.329b9e40.2b5761fb@aol.com> Date: Wed, 15 Jan 2003 20:16:43 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM Stereo TIS? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp << Understandably, it will primarily broadcast voice messages, but is there any specific FCC rule against TISes transmitting in AM Stereo? >> Why?!?....those stations send narrow bandwidth of audio and zero music <> For a TIS that sends information in the means of short voice messages,often on elcheapo recorders or they have the "programming" sent to the TIS via a regular phone line..3khz of audio bandwidth is all you need. Those stations are and have never been meant to have "high quality" audio transmissions just as their range is limited as well.The feds never intended for a TIS to cover hundreds of miles and garner mega ratings too.As far as the "queitness" of those stations...most do not have any sort of processing to speak of as well. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- Subscribe send an email to amstereo-subscribe@topica.com _______________________________________________________ From KC4QLP@aol.com Wed Jan 15 17:28:39 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Jan 2003 01:28:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 88293 invoked from network); 16 Jan 2003 01:28:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Jan 2003 01:28:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r07.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.103) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Jan 2003 01:28:38 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.171.193e3136 (4238) for ; Wed, 15 Jan 2003 20:28:26 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <171.193e3136.2b5764b9@aol.com> Date: Wed, 15 Jan 2003 20:28:25 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC / AM stereo To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 1/15/03 6:21:30 PM Eastern Standard Time, jbyrns@enteract.com writes: << I'm not sure what the "band" has to do with the issue? I think I understand your feelings to not "wreck what was already built", but it's the 21st century, and it is time to move on to more contemporary technology. They are doing the same thing over on the television "band", where a new system has been mandated, and what has already been built is scheduled for demolition. Look what has happened in the transportation industry, as well as other industries, over the years, where "what was already built" was wrecked, to make way for progress. John >> John...do you call creating a situation where todays receivers get interference from the digital carriers that will in effect block out the reception of most of the AM stations you can hear in your local area? Do you call progress when you listen to something digital..that is suppose to sound pure,sound worse than its analog counter part?Do you call progress by saying "hey we can transmit a signal in a digital form and still send you the same stale programming"?...and why?..whats the purpose for this "progress?...to just say we can do it? In my opinion,for IBOC to be a value added source on AM it will have to for one find a way possible to "fix" the interfence issue.2,it will have to be able to give you access to more services in the simular manor like subcarriers on FM stations provide.Last but not least 3,stations are going to have to provide something worth while for people to stay tuned too. IBOC by itself is not going to do that.IBOC will not be saving AM radio as it will be the same ol thing in comparison to its analog counter part. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- Subscribe send an email to amstereo-subscribe@topica.com _______________________________________________________ From kevtronics@yahoo.com Wed Jan 15 18:05:01 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Jan 2003 02:04:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 7856 invoked from network); 16 Jan 2003 02:04:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Jan 2003 02:04:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.75) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Jan 2003 02:04:59 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.161] by n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Jan 2003 02:04:54 -0000 Date: Thu, 16 Jan 2003 02:04:53 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: AM Stereo TIS? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <97.329b9e40.2b5761fb@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1481 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.79.155 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Those stations are and have never been meant to have "high quality" > audio transmissions just as their range is limited as well. The > feds never intended for a TIS to cover hundreds of miles and garner > mega ratings too. I am a member of the committee that will be putting the TIS on the air (in Dover, NJ, to be exact, hopefully on 1580 kHz), and I will have some say in its technical configuration. I'm just wondering if there is any specific FCC rule prohibiting TIS stations from transmitting hi-fi AM Stereo, and in particular, if the NRSC bandwidth limits would apply to it. The leader of our committee actually wanted to specifically set up a music-based, FCC-licensed "LPAM" station in AM Stereo, but as such a thing doesn't exist (yet) in the FCC's eyes, we had to settle for a voice-based TIS allocation. Even if it is just for pre-recorded voice messages, full hi-fi audio response with good modulation and processing will make it MUCH more pleasant to listen to, and in AM Stereo, I could give it a nice Stereo reverb effect to really spice up the sound! p.s. Also, could a TIS transmit AM Stereo in a system other than C-Quam? I see nothing in the FCC's 1993 C-Quam-only ruling that talks about TIS stations... and with "home-brew" equipment, a Magnavox-type AM Stereo transmitter would be easier to set up and would still provide very good results from C-Quam receivers, as one of the fellas here has done with a Ramsey AM-25 transmitter. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Wed Jan 15 18:09:36 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Jan 2003 02:09:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 26872 invoked from network); 16 Jan 2003 02:09:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Jan 2003 02:09:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.66) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Jan 2003 02:09:34 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.169] by n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Jan 2003 02:09:34 -0000 Date: Thu, 16 Jan 2003 02:09:33 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: IBOC / AM stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <171.193e3136.2b5764b9@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2256 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.79.155 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > stations are going to have to provide something worth while for > people to stay tuned too. IBOC by itself is not going to do that. > IBOC will not be saving AM radio as it will be the same ol thing in > comparison to its analog counter part. I specifically talked about that in this section of my statement submitted to the FCC: ==================================================================== IBOC is the wrong solution to radio's biggest problem ...[A]nother issue which has not been considered is that radio listeners are calling out for better programming from the radio, not just better quality from the signals they can receive -- and the approval of IBOC or any other method for improving the technical quality of radio service will not inherently achieve any benefit to the programming offered by radio stations if they do not take it upon themselves to truly connect with their listeners and broadcast not what is convenient to them, but rather what their listeners desire -- even if it means going against the trends of increased corporate ownership, automation, voice-tracking, national radio format consistency (such as Clear Channel's "Kiss FM" stations which do not simulcast each other, but essentially provide the same format across the country), and removal of nearly all local elements from the programming. As an example of this, the growing popularity of satellite radio services is not simply because of its consistent reception quality and digital audio. It is because satellite radio is delivering a wide variety of new and unique radio programming, much of which is commercial-free, and this is exactly what people are calling out for; indeed, many listeners will be extremely loyal to their "favorite" AM and FM radio station, even if the reception and/or sound quality provided by it is very poor -- and, on the other hand, even the strongest, clearest signals on the radio will not be tuned in if the listener does not desire their programming. Hopefully, radio stations are smart enough to not be under the delusion that IBOC alone will increase their popularity with listeners and advertisers, even despite all of the marketing hype that is currently being stirred up about "HD Radio". From narkspud@hotmail.com Wed Jan 15 20:41:02 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: narkspud@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Jan 2003 04:41:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 41162 invoked from network); 16 Jan 2003 04:40:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Jan 2003 04:40:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.88) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Jan 2003 04:40:59 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.250] by n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Jan 2003 04:40:59 -0000 Date: Thu, 16 Jan 2003 04:40:57 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: AM Stereo TIS? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 422 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "narkspud " X-Originating-IP: 66.159.192.39 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=81956306 X-Yahoo-Profile: narkspud Here's the rule, complete with the 3 khz lowpass filter requirement (#8 at the bottom). http://frwebgate.access.gpo.gov/cgi-bin/get-cfr.cgi?TITLE=47&PA RT=90&Section=242&TYPE=TEXT Also at this site, you can have loads of fun looking for TIS's near you with the FCC's own search thingy. http://www.fcc.gov/mb/audio/bickel/tis.html It's amazing how many of them are out there, installed, but not turned on. narkspud From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Jan 15 20:56:38 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Jan 2003 04:56:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 24883 invoked from network); 16 Jan 2003 04:56:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Jan 2003 04:56:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.198) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Jan 2003 04:56:38 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 15 Jan 2003 20:56:38 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM Stereo TIS? Date: Wed, 15 Jan 2003 19:53:32 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 16 Jan 2003 04:56:38.0054 (UTC) FILETIME=[A6D50460:01C2BD1B] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.158.12.238] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 kevtronics@yahoo.com wrote: > Also, is there some specific rule that TISes must limit their audio to telephone-quality, as I hear from all of the TISes in my area? There is a TIS station in Seveir County, TN that has full fidelity. It is located in Gatlinburg. There is another at Sugarlands Visitor Center in the Smkey Mountains National Park with decent audio. Kevin From KC4QLP@aol.com Wed Jan 15 21:40:28 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Jan 2003 05:40:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 54909 invoked from network); 16 Jan 2003 05:40:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Jan 2003 05:40:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m09.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.164) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Jan 2003 05:40:28 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m09.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.a6.329a57ed (4410) for ; Thu, 16 Jan 2003 00:40:24 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Thu, 16 Jan 2003 00:40:24 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM Stereo TIS? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 1/15/03 11:57:44 PM Eastern Standard Time, possumhunter@netzero.net writes: > kevtronics@yahoo.com wrote: > > Also, is there some specific rule that TISes must limit their audio to > telephone-quality, as I hear from all of the TISes in my area? > > There is a TIS station in Seveir County, TN that has full fidelity. It is > located in Gatlinburg. There is another at Sugarlands Visitor Center in the > Smkey Mountains National Park with decent audio. > > Kevin > If the TIS is operating with full fidelity { audio filter bypassed or gone! and or audio response above 3khz }....wouldnt that be a clear FCC violation? I would think so. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From n0uiheric@aol.com Wed Jan 15 21:45:44 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Jan 2003 05:45:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 92803 invoked from network); 16 Jan 2003 05:45:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Jan 2003 05:45:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d07.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.39) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Jan 2003 05:45:42 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-d07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.22.34eebdd7 (4426) for ; Thu, 16 Jan 2003 00:45:34 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <22.34eebdd7.2b57a0fd@aol.com> Date: Thu, 16 Jan 2003 00:45:33 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} It's the programming... To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih Here's an example. In St. Louis, NPR's Morning Edition is higher-rated than Howard Stern. Stern usually gets less than a 1.0 rating on KPNT 105.7; Morning Edition averages a 1.5 rating on KWMU 90.7, according to the most recent figures available (Fall 2001) from Arbitron. According to estimates put together by Duncan, commercial radio listnership has been down 27% since 1989 (based on a population of 280 million, that's a loss of over 70 million listeners). At the same time, public radio listenership has gone up from 14 million listeners to nearly 40 million listeners (and that figure is growing). It's obvious; American listeners are rejecting the culture of sexuality, death and personal attacks on commercial radio. The truth to the matter is that people are looking for substance in their radio programming, Bob. Commercial radio is failing to deliver on substance; shows like Howard Stern, Rush Limbaugh and Dr. Laura are created for people who are less educated than the average American (the average American now has a high school education). The quality of public radio programming is higher than commercial radio is because public radio primarily tailors for people with college and university educations; a growing number of Americans are now college-educated. Commercial radio has always made it a policy to disenfranchise better-educated people. The only way commercial radio can compete with public radio is to stop airing sex-driven and bloodthirsty trash radio, talk show hosts who attack their callers, and turn talk radio into a medium that does only two things: inform and educate. The major advantage that NPR and PRI have over the commercial networks is that NPR and PRI feed their talk shows in Stereo with Stereo music; the commercial networks (like Westwood One, Disney/ABC and Clear Channel/Premiere) are too cheap to feed their talk shows with Stereo music in Stereo. You don't need proof...just listen to the radio. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From KC4QLP@aol.com Wed Jan 15 21:57:50 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Jan 2003 05:57:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 75474 invoked from network); 16 Jan 2003 05:57:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Jan 2003 05:57:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m06.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.161) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Jan 2003 05:57:49 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.17.34873efb (4410) for ; Thu, 16 Jan 2003 00:57:46 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <17.34873efb.2b57a3d9@aol.com> Date: Thu, 16 Jan 2003 00:57:45 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} It's the programming... To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 1/16/03 12:46:19 AM Eastern Standard Time, n0uiheric@aol.com writes: > Here's an example. In St. Louis, NPR's Morning Edition is higher-rated than > Howard Stern. Stern usually gets less than a 1.0 rating on KPNT 105.7; > Morning Edition averages a 1.5 rating on KWMU 90.7, according to the most > recent figures available (Fall 2001) from Arbitron. > St. Louis is only one of how many markets rated by Arbitron? Certainly St. Louis does not speak for the entire country. Myself I wouldnt hardly say that Howard Stern by himself could be used as a sole example.There are many many more morning shows that are commerical that are better received and do far better than Howard.Howard Stern had his hey day...he has his little following and thankfully thats it. But to represent him as the sole man in morning radio is being much to narrowly focused.If you sight one...sight them all. Besides I have a friend of mine that works in the noncomerical broadcast end of the biz {engineering...no so much the --yawn--programming end of it}....and he lurks here as well....I'll just ask him to get the low down on the hoe down. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From KC4QLP@aol.com Wed Jan 15 22:14:05 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Jan 2003 06:14:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 19007 invoked from network); 16 Jan 2003 06:14:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Jan 2003 06:14:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d09.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.41) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Jan 2003 06:14:04 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d09.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.104.24d8ed89 (4410) for ; Thu, 16 Jan 2003 01:14:01 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <104.24d8ed89.2b57a7a9@aol.com> Date: Thu, 16 Jan 2003 01:14:01 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} It's the programming... To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 1/16/03 12:46:19 AM Eastern Standard Time, n0uiheric@aol.com writes: > The major advantage that NPR and PRI have over the commercial networks is > that NPR and PRI feed their talk shows in Stereo with Stereo music; the > commercial networks (like Westwood One, Disney/ABC and Clear > Channel/Premiere) are too cheap to feed their talk shows with Stereo music > in > Stereo. > You don't need proof...just listen to the radio. > Uhm...hello..the commerical networks do feed their various products in stereo. Disney/ABC feeds their music shows in stereo,Westwood and Jones Radio Networks do the same. As far as talk shows,why spend twice the money for two channel mono? Yep you have to pay for the bandwidth you use up on the satellite.Just happens that NPR is in the satellite distribution business themselves....now how noncommerical is that?!? Sounds highly commerical to me as they control of a fairly high number of birds {satellites} sitting up there around the Clark belt. Anyhow, 98% of a talk show is mono....have you seen anyone with two mouths,one for each ear? Nope me neither. Commerical broadcasters do not waste tax payers,advertisers,and listeners dollars on something lame like that...two channel mono....hehehehe,now thats crazy. Whats really crazy is that stations ..the majority of them in general...commerical and noncommerical have resorted to satellite feed programming for the majority of their broadcast day. Thats whats wrong with radio....---all--- of the syndication has dumbed down radio listening.We need local programming back into the hearts of every radio station. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From kevtronics@yahoo.com Wed Jan 15 22:46:15 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Jan 2003 06:46:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 7045 invoked from network); 16 Jan 2003 06:46:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Jan 2003 06:46:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Jan 2003 06:46:15 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.251] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Jan 2003 06:46:15 -0000 Date: Thu, 16 Jan 2003 06:46:13 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: It's the programming... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <22.34eebdd7.2b57a0fd@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1244 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.79.155 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > The major advantage that NPR and PRI have over the commercial > networks is that NPR and PRI feed their talk shows in Stereo with > Stereo music Also, rather than running paid programming or other syndicated shows that no one really listens to, public radio stations usually fill these "off-peak" time blocks by playing continuous, commercial-free classical or jazz music. There was a time when regular news/talk stations would integrate some music -- and I mean whole songs, not just "bumper" music for a few seconds after a commercial break -- into their programming, but now that is rare. Even all-news stations would play some music to break up the monotony, rather than just repeat the same news over and over again to fill up the time. Anyway, regarding stereo, New York City's public station 93.9 WNYC-FM often turns its Stereo pilot off during talk programming, and back on for music. Last time I checked, "Whaddaya Know" is broadcast in mono on WNYC-FM, even though I believe it is produced in Stereo. Their sister station 820 WNYC is strictly AM mono, although years ago I heard one isolated and unconfirmed report that they may have been in AM Stereo in the past, perhaps on their previous frequency of 830 kHz. From alfredot@inetarena.com Thu Jan 16 01:15:44 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: alfredot@inetarena.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Jan 2003 09:15:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 32369 invoked from network); 16 Jan 2003 09:15:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Jan 2003 09:15:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.inetarena.com) (206.129.216.13) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Jan 2003 09:15:42 -0000 Received: from hendrie (1Cust70.tnt15.beaverton.or.da.uu.net [67.227.162.70]) by mail.inetarena.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h0G9DHJ00087 for ; Thu, 16 Jan 2003 01:13:17 -0800 (PST) Date: Thu, 16 Jan 2003 01:15:11 -0800 (PST) X-Sender: alfredo@hendrie.1610am.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Healthy AM Band Suggestion In-Reply-To: <1042619698.650.8876.m12@yahoogroups.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: "Alfredo E. Torrejon" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=25132238 X-Yahoo-Profile: alfredotorrejon Bob Carter writes: > Well we all know these things would go a long ways to helping AM,but if it > doesnt have anything to do with digital or have "digital" in the > name,manufactures probably would fear that there wont be a market for these > things. This is the digital craze that we are living in now. Well, at least Omega, Symphony, and the Digiceiver technologies could be marketed as "Digitally Enhanced Reception." I just hope that the developers of these technologies can get the consumer electronics manufacturers to realize this. On a somewhat related note, I have a question: does anyone know which stations in San Francisco and Los Angeles are slated to test HD-Radio? Being a West Coast resident, I have not had a chance to listen to the WOR/WLW digital sidebands. Alfredo From fanfare@globility.com Thu Jan 16 03:47:08 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Jan 2003 11:47:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 81601 invoked from network); 16 Jan 2003 11:47:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Jan 2003 11:47:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Jan 2003 11:47:07 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.159] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Jan 2003 11:47:06 -0000 Date: Thu, 16 Jan 2003 11:47:06 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Healthy AM Band Suggestion Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 358 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Marv Southcott " X-Originating-IP: 64.56.234.24 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Alfredo E. Torrejon" wrote: > Bob Carter writes: > > which stations in San Francisco and Los Angeles are slated to test > HD-Radio? Being a West Coast resident, I have not had a chance to > listen to the WOR/WLW digital sidebands. > > Alfredo One that has been testing for a while now is KABL. M. From spfleck@citlink.net Thu Jan 16 04:32:28 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: spfleck@citlink.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Jan 2003 12:32:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 90623 invoked from network); 16 Jan 2003 12:32:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Jan 2003 12:32:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO relay02.roc.frontiernet.net) (66.133.131.35) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Jan 2003 12:32:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 22727 invoked from network); 16 Jan 2003 12:32:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO Steve) ([170.215.238.233]) (envelope-sender ) by relay02.roc.frontiernet.net (FrontierMTA 2.3.2) with SMTP for ; 16 Jan 2003 12:32:23 -0000 Message-ID: <01aa01c2bd5b$51d54480$01c8a8c0@N2UBP> To: References: <1042705973.569.78109.m12@yahoogroups.com> Subject: Re: It's the programming... Date: Thu, 16 Jan 2003 07:32:22 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Steve Fleckenstein" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=2988995 X-Yahoo-Profile: n2ubp To me, a non broadcast professional, listening in the extreme northwest corner of the NYC metro burbs in senic Middletown, NY.. Its the content.. Its the content Its the content.. The majority of commericial radio content in my listening area is a big zero, zilch, zigrot. Dumbed down for the rednecks and pimps on the corner. More commericals than content. Too short playlists. Newscasters that talk faster than used car dealers. Network broadcast Television isn't any better. Maybe I'm wrong and at the ripe old age of 46 outside of the demographic groups deemed worthy of being part of the listening public. Steve N2UBP From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Thu Jan 16 06:11:00 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Jan 2003 14:10:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 48035 invoked from network); 16 Jan 2003 14:10:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Jan 2003 14:10:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14203.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.145) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Jan 2003 14:10:57 -0000 Message-ID: <20030116141055.47538.qmail@web14203.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.45.202.244] by web14203.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 16 Jan 2003 06:10:55 PST Date: Thu, 16 Jan 2003 06:10:55 -0800 (PST) Subject: Testing more than one 'advanced' AM system To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio >From: davidcoons@webtv.net >Subject: Re: Re: IBOC / AM stereo >were other digital systems ever tested by the fcc as in the 5 years of >am stereo testing? zippo Thank you David, exactly my point, and why I filed a MOTION to put the brakes on IBOC until they can try out a couple of different and/or competing systems. I know that there are big money political lobbyists out there, but what ever happended to the good 'ole US of A capitalism where a couple of people get a shot at this instead of just one "not yet ready for primetime" player? Your comments at FCC Docket # 99-325 would be appreciated. __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From e92fmjamz@yahoo.com Thu Jan 16 07:32:52 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: e92fmjamz@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Jan 2003 15:32:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 48743 invoked from network); 16 Jan 2003 15:32:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Jan 2003 15:32:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14008.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.175.124) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Jan 2003 15:32:50 -0000 Message-ID: <20030116153248.16375.qmail@web14008.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [152.8.78.47] by web14008.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 16 Jan 2003 07:32:48 PST Date: Thu, 16 Jan 2003 07:32:48 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: It's the programming... To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: <01aa01c2bd5b$51d54480$01c8a8c0@N2UBP> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: Ernest Jones X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=24963319 X-Yahoo-Profile: e92fmjamz well, hey..at the moment..I'm in the demographic 18-24 yrs old...umm here in Greensboro, the content of the stations here are horrible, too commercialized in all aspects and have a tendency to repeat the same music over and over, I drained my bank account in december and bought a mp3/cd player for the car, the only time I hear the radio here is when I'm switching CD's and it sounds bad for those few seconds - unless its static :-) (WJMH 102.1 was on campus last week BTW), back near Norfolk VA, where I'm near, I usually have the radio on all the time, only problem is the saturation of urban formatted stations in the market...about 6 I believe, only one of those sound impressive to me, WWHV 102.1, as far as I know, they still have only 2 stopsets per hour. so with agreeing with everybody else, its gotta be the programming, it dosen't matter if the station has the worst processing on the planet, if the content is great, people will listen. --- Steve Fleckenstein wrote: > To me, a non broadcast professional, listening in > the extreme northwest > corner of the NYC metro burbs in senic Middletown, > NY.. > > Its the content.. > Its the content > Its the content.. > > The majority of commericial radio content in my > listening area is a big > zero, zilch, zigrot. > > Dumbed down for the rednecks and pimps on the > corner. > > More commericals than content. Too short playlists. > Newscasters that talk > faster than used car dealers. > > Network broadcast Television isn't any better. > > Maybe I'm wrong and at the ripe old age of 46 > outside of the demographic > groups deemed worthy of being part of the listening > public. > > Steve > N2UBP > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > ===== Ernest, Gates NC, USA WRCS 970 AM Ahoskie NC, Announcer,webmaster http://wrcs.cjb.net WQDK 99.3 FM Ahoskie NC, Fill in ------contact me-------- AIM: e92fmjamz2000 ICQ: 33155469 Yahoo: e92fmjamz __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From jbyrns@enteract.com Thu Jan 16 10:03:35 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Jan 2003 18:03:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 16522 invoked from network); 16 Jan 2003 18:03:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Jan 2003 18:03:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.90) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Jan 2003 18:03:31 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.128] by n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Jan 2003 18:03:24 -0000 Date: Thu, 16 Jan 2003 18:03:23 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: National LM-1981 data sheet wanted Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 107 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.98.63 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g Does anyone know where I might find a data sheet for the National LM- 1981 AM stereo decoder chip? John From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Thu Jan 16 10:10:29 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Jan 2003 18:10:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 70073 invoked from network); 16 Jan 2003 18:10:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Jan 2003 18:10:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web41005.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.93.4) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Jan 2003 18:10:28 -0000 Message-ID: <20030116181028.31457.qmail@web41005.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.32.217] by web41005.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 16 Jan 2003 10:10:28 PST Date: Thu, 16 Jan 2003 10:10:28 -0800 (PST) Subject: A.M. Stereo by the numbers To: AMSF MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio Here are the numbers of stations as per Kevin's log, dated 1/1/03: #of stations kHz 18 1490 15 1340 11 1430 10 920 8 1050, 1090, 1400. 7 580, 800, 1600, 1660. 6 600, 620, 900, 1260, 1290, 1390, 1410, 1440, 1450. 5 770, 930, 1070, 1150, 1240, 1470, 1480, 1620. 4 570, 590, 630, 680, 720, 730, 790, 850, 950, 990, 1080, 1190, 1280, 1300, 1350, 1370, 1380, 1550, 1680. 3 540, 560, 610, 690, 710, 740, 760, 830, 860, 864, 890, 910, 960, 980, 1040, 1060, 1110, 1140, 1160, 1170, 1210, 1242, 1270, 1310, 1320, 1330, 1420, 1510, 1540, 1640, 1650, 1670, 1700. 2 550, 576, 640, 660, 810, 820, 870, 927, 954, 970, 1000, 1010, 1020, 1053, 1100, 1116, 1130, 1180, 1197, 1230, 1250, 1278, 1287, 1332, 1360, 1520, 1530, 1560, 1580, 1590, 1630, 1690. 1 531, 567, 612, 639, 650, 657, 670, 693, 750, 780, 783, 792, 837, 840, 873, 880, 1008, 1030, 1044, 1098, 1120, 1134, 1143, 1179, 1200, 1206, 1314, 1368, 1377, 1413, 1431, 1460, 1494, 1503, 1584. 0 530, 700, 1500, 1570, 1610, all other 9kHz-spaced frequencies and other frequencies. Not included: KUOM among others. __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From jbyrns@enteract.com Thu Jan 16 10:10:43 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Jan 2003 18:10:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 35482 invoked from network); 16 Jan 2003 18:10:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Jan 2003 18:10:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.64) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Jan 2003 18:10:42 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.181] by n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Jan 2003 18:10:41 -0000 Date: Thu, 16 Jan 2003 18:10:38 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: IBOC / AM stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <171.193e3136.2b5764b9@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2132 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.98.63 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, KC4QLP@a... wrote: > > John...do you call creating a situation where todays receivers > get interference from the digital carriers that will in effect > block out the reception of most of the AM stations you can hear > in your local area? OK, let's take these issues one at a time, so we can concentrate on them, and not get confused. On what basis do you claim that the "digital carriers" "will in effect block out the reception of most of the AM stations you can hear in your local area"? Where is the study data to support this claim? With few exceptions, the stations in my local area are spaced approximately 50 kHz apart, with a couple as close as 40 kHz. It seems to me that 40 kHz spacing is more than enough for existing radios to reject any interference from the "digital carriers" of other stations. The one out of market station that I listen to is also 50 kHz from the adjacent local stations, and I would expect the presence of "digital carriers" to cause no interference to my reception of it either. I will grant you that sometimes there are adjacent channel stations in the same market, and the "digital carriers" would clearly be a problem in those cases. The one instance that I was aware of in this market, because I was a listener to one of the stations, no longer exists because the station went dark a couple of years ago. I suppose there could be other similar situations involving low power suburban stations in this area that I am not aware of, either because the stations have never interested me, or I live in the wrong part of the area to see the problem. Bottom line, I just don't see the "digital carriers" presenting a major problem for the reception of stations in the local area. In my opinion the aggressive night time directional antenna arrays used by some stations are a bigger menace than are "digital carriers". I think the biggest simple improvement the FCC could make in the AM band would be to eliminate night time sky wave protection for class A stations. Oops, I guess I sort of got off track, sorry. John From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Jan 16 10:23:54 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Jan 2003 18:23:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 69994 invoked from network); 16 Jan 2003 18:23:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Jan 2003 18:23:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.70) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Jan 2003 18:23:52 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.156] by n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Jan 2003 18:23:20 -0000 Date: Thu, 16 Jan 2003 18:23:17 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: IBOC / AM stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1425 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > It seems to me that 40 kHz spacing is more than enough for > existing radios to reject any interference from the > "digital carriers" of other stations. The consistently high strength of local IBOC signals can wipe out reception over a much wider bandwidth than what is coming out of the station's transmitter, even on selective narrow- band receivers. For example, I live 25 miles away from 710 WOR's transmitter, and when they have the IBOC on, it wipes out reception all the way from 680 through 750 kHz. Even though WOR's digital carriers only extend from 695 to 725 kHz, a type of "splatter" interference is heard on all of my radios over this wider range, because the strong IBOC signal overwhelms the front-end selectivity of the radio. Even on a narrow-band radio with a 3 kHz ceramic filter and the help of a Terk AM Advantage tuned loop antenna, my daytime reception of 690 WPHE is nearly unlistenable, and reception of 740 WGSM is also seriously degraded -- all because WOR is using IBOC on and around 710 kHz, and is effectively taking up a *70 kHz* chunk of the radio dial with their signal and its associated "hash" and "splatter". By this experience, if EVERY station was using IBOC, the whole AM band would be nothing but interference all the way from 500 to 1740 kHz (assuming stations on 530 and 1700 kHz would be using IBOC and would also be causing this wide-range splatter around their signals). From amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk Thu Jan 16 10:41:11 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Jan 2003 18:41:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 96663 invoked from network); 16 Jan 2003 18:41:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Jan 2003 18:41:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.88) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Jan 2003 18:41:10 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.143] by n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Jan 2003 18:41:10 -0000 Date: Thu, 16 Jan 2003 18:41:10 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: AMS in Italy - quick please! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1159 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Dave " X-Originating-IP: 81.7.54.200 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113985069 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereofan --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: > > can someone please remind me which station in Italy is reputedly in > > AMS? > > That's "Radio Studio X" on 1584 kHz in Momigno, Italy... reported to > be using 10,000 watts, and they are in full C-Quam AM Stereo, playing > a wide variety of music (mostly in English). > > There is an excellent recording of them right here in the AM Stereo > Forum's Files section, as received locally on a Sony SRF-42 with > nearly perfect quality. "Radio Studio X" is transmitting at least > 12 kHz of audio bandwidth, so on a good radio, they will have true > hi-fi sound, which unfortunately isn't that common on the > AM/mediumwave band in Europe. > > p.s. I'd love to hear some recordings of European LONGWAVE broadcast > stations if anybody has the capability to do so. The longwave band > is not used for broadcasting in North America and so far I haven't > had any luck at getting distant reception of LW broadcast stations > from across the "pond". Kevin does'nt mention my DX recording Andy. There's a sample on my site at www.amstereoradio.tk From amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk Thu Jan 16 10:55:07 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Jan 2003 18:55:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 50575 invoked from network); 16 Jan 2003 18:55:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Jan 2003 18:55:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.75) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Jan 2003 18:55:05 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.134] by n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Jan 2003 18:55:05 -0000 Date: Thu, 16 Jan 2003 18:55:03 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: AMS in Italy - quick please! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 424 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Dave " X-Originating-IP: 81.7.54.200 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113985069 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereofan > p.s. I'd love to hear some recordings of European LONGWAVE broadcast > stations if anybody has the capability to do so. The longwave band > is not used for broadcasting in North America and so far I haven't > had any luck at getting distant reception of LW broadcast stations > from across the "pond". What do you think about the LW station on 279 being AM stereo then ? (that's if it even starts broadcasting) From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Jan 16 11:29:06 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Jan 2003 19:29:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 66752 invoked from network); 16 Jan 2003 19:29:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Jan 2003 19:29:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Jan 2003 19:29:05 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.172] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Jan 2003 19:29:04 -0000 Date: Thu, 16 Jan 2003 19:29:04 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Yesterday Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 883 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics Since WOR's IBOC digital audio seemed to have so much trouble reproducting the Beatles' classic song "Yesterday" with any kind of decent quality -- even in mono -- I thought the time was ripe to bring out this recording for comparison: ftp://209.193.86.116/canada/chnsyest.mp3 It is a recording of "Yesterday" (the complete song plus liners and IDs) as heard in full C-Quam AM Stereo, on 960 CHNS in Halifax, NS in March 1997, as received on a Sony ST-JX220A tuner and originally recorded by Alex K. (who was kind enough to mail me a cassette of CHNS's great Stereo sound back when both he and CHNS were active in the world of AM Stereo). Even though the Sony receiver doesn't do proper C-Quam decoding and thus is a little distorted on wide-separation sound, it's still tremendously better in quality than IBOC's digital AM audio -- which, as WOR says, it's even in Stereo yet. From wa2fnq@optonline.net Thu Jan 16 12:25:08 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: wa2fnq@optonline.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Jan 2003 20:25:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 1901 invoked from network); 16 Jan 2003 20:25:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Jan 2003 20:25:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Jan 2003 20:25:07 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.179] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Jan 2003 20:25:06 -0000 Date: Thu, 16 Jan 2003 20:25:06 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Yesterday Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1494 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wa2fnq " X-Originating-IP: 64.236.235.240 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=60059615 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa2fnq Err.... you beat me. I put the exact same piece of Yesterday that WOR used on my web site. It's a recording made on an AIWA portable of yes .... a modified Ramsey AM-25 transmitter. While maybe it's not the best quality AM you'll ever hear it shows just how bad WORs analog audio samples are. Hey, it doesn't have all the digital artifacts either!! If you want to hear it go to: http://www.wa2fnq.hamradios.com/audsamp.htm The file is an uncompressed .wav file @1 meg. Jerry WA2FNQ --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: > Since WOR's IBOC digital audio seemed to have so much trouble reproducting the Beatles' classic song "Yesterday" with any kind of decent quality -- even in mono -- I thought the time was ripe to bring out this recording for comparison: > > ftp://209.193.86.116/canada/chnsyest.mp3 > > It is a recording of "Yesterday" (the complete song plus liners and IDs) as heard in full C-Quam AM Stereo, on 960 CHNS in Halifax, NS in March 1997, as received on a Sony ST-JX220A tuner and originally recorded by Alex K. (who was kind enough to mail me a cassette of CHNS's great Stereo sound back when both he and CHNS were active in the world of AM Stereo). > > Even though the Sony receiver doesn't do proper C-Quam decoding and thus is a little distorted on wide-separation sound, it's still tremendously better in quality than IBOC's digital AM audio -- which, as WOR says, it's even in Stereo yet. From wa2fnq@optonline.net Thu Jan 16 12:37:29 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: wa2fnq@optonline.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Jan 2003 20:37:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 27833 invoked from network); 16 Jan 2003 20:36:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Jan 2003 20:36:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Jan 2003 20:36:56 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.133] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Jan 2003 20:36:55 -0000 Date: Thu, 16 Jan 2003 20:36:52 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: IBOC / AM stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 667 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wa2fnq " X-Originating-IP: 64.236.235.240 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=60059615 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa2fnq Good for you John. You should live here in the Metro NYC, tri-state area where there is a signal on almost every channel. WOR happens to be the lucky exception with nobody to really bother on the first adjacent. I can't wait 'till they turn IBOC on full tilt in this around here. The AM band is just going to be a usless bunch of hash. FM isn't any better. Jerry WA2FNQ >With few exceptions, the stations in my > local area are spaced approximately 50 kHz apart, with a couple as > close as 40 kHz. It seems to me that 40 kHz spacing is more than > enough for existing radios to reject any interference from the > "digital carriers" of other stations. From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Jan 16 12:55:34 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Jan 2003 20:55:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 36040 invoked from network); 16 Jan 2003 20:55:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Jan 2003 20:55:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d04.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.36) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Jan 2003 20:55:34 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.198.1409aa53 (4328) for ; Thu, 16 Jan 2003 15:55:26 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <198.1409aa53.2b58763e@aol.com> Date: Thu, 16 Jan 2003 15:55:26 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: It's the programming... To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 1/16/03 1:46:56 AM Eastern Standard Time, kevtronics@yahoo.com writes: << There was a time when regular news/talk stations would integrate some music -- and I mean whole songs, not just "bumper" music for a few seconds after a commercial break -- into their programming, but now that is rare. Even all-news stations would play some music to break up the monotony, rather than just repeat the same news over and over again to fill up the time. >> Talk stations would still do this today IF it werent for the high royality rates from BMI,ASCAP and SESAC {the music license industry} The radio industry is effected by many outside things...and the music money grubbing industry is one of them. It shall be even more interesting regarding royality fees when and after everything go digital.Seems like I saw a rambling of such a subject in the lastest addition of Radio World....should make for some interesting reading. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- Subscribe send an email to amstereo-subscribe@topica.com _______________________________________________________ From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Jan 16 13:38:37 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Jan 2003 21:38:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 702 invoked from network); 16 Jan 2003 21:38:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Jan 2003 21:38:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m04.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.7) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Jan 2003 21:38:35 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.c9.2eaa5c3c (4328) for ; Thu, 16 Jan 2003 16:38:28 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Thu, 16 Jan 2003 16:38:27 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC / AM stereo To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 1/16/03 1:12:05 PM Eastern Standard Time, jbyrns@enteract.com writes: << Bottom line, I just don't see the "digital carriers" presenting a major problem for the reception of stations in the local area. In my opinion the aggressive night time directional antenna arrays used by some stations are a bigger menace than are "digital carriers". I think the biggest simple improvement the FCC could make in the AM band would be to eliminate night time sky wave protection for class A stations. Oops, I guess I sort of got off track, sorry. John >> What rock have you been hiding under? Where have you been when people make first hand comments about what they can and now can not hear now that the digital carriers are on WOR? A few on this list that live in that area can and will tell you first hand what stations they ---used--- to listen to but can no longer hear because of the interference.An engineer on this list in NJ can tell you first hand of interfence to his radio station from iBiguity test stations. A good portion of radio listeners in Washington DC that listened to WMAL 630 can tell you of the interfence to that station when an iBiguity station was testing on 650 {a small mentioning of that fact in this months Radio World} A great number of folks on the am@nrcdxas.org can tell you of the their experiences dealing with the interference from stations with STA's testing IBOC at night. For something that generates so much interference like this...it can not be for the good of AM radio. BTW,stations running highly directional antenna systems wont have much trouble with passing the IBOC medium. Tom at WOR has had no trouble with this at all. There is a gentleman on the am@nrcdxas.org list that found information on what radio stations people listened to during the 9/11 tragedy { I do not have his source handy }...the majority of people in this country were listening to stations with what can be considered as what was termed as "class B" signals {signal strengths..not license class}...the very signals that would be wiped out by the digital interference. If IBOC's interfence issues cant be fixed..and IBOC is allowed to go full steam ahead..what will people do for information during our next tragedy?Dont say..."oh they will listen to the strong digital station" Well if people were listening to the medium strength station and not the strongest local station...hmm that tells me that big corporate radio...or some out fit of stations in this country just didnt do a good job of keeping people informed...sending listeners looking for a station doing what it was licensed to do...serve the public! As far as killing skywave protection for class A stations....I dont see that happening...just as I dont see these folks working on a pipe dream that involves eliminating skywave signals all together with "special antennas". Obviously the law of physics cant be broken.AM will always have skywave and try and fit a wide broadcast mode into a narrow broadcast system,AKA the AM BCB..whats left over has gotta go somewhere,and in this case its spilling over pretty doggone close to the "other guys" channel.Thats just not progress. IBOC and any other digital system I have no objection to --if-- and ---only if--- it does not cause additional noise to an already extremely noisey broadcast environment.Those flaws have got to be dealt with and fixed in order for IBOC to be successful...otherwise listeners will get fed up even more than they are now with AM. 2-4 years is a long time to roll out receivers in mass numbers to the masses. 2-4 years of not having a digital receiver to overcome most of the noise will drive folks farther away. A prime example is AM Stereo. It to was suppose to be the goose that laid the golden egg and look what happened. Instead it was the goose that laid the beginning of many rotten eggs for AM radio. Someone better start polishing up IBOC's egg...its starting to look a little brown. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- Subscribe send an email to amstereo-subscribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net _______________________________________________________ From jbyrns@enteract.com Thu Jan 16 15:14:58 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Jan 2003 23:14:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 31268 invoked from network); 16 Jan 2003 23:14:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Jan 2003 23:14:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.87) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Jan 2003 23:14:57 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.183] by n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Jan 2003 23:14:54 -0000 Date: Thu, 16 Jan 2003 23:14:51 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: IBOC / AM stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2810 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.229 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " < kevtronics@y...> wrote: > The consistently high strength of local IBOC signals can wipe > out reception over a much wider bandwidth than what is coming > out of the station's transmitter, even on selective narrow- > band receivers. For example, I live 25 miles away from > 710 WOR's transmitter, and when they have the IBOC on, it > wipes out reception all the way from 680 through 750 kHz. The discussion was about wiping out reception of "local" signals, are you within the protected contours of any stations between 680 and 750 kHz? > Even though WOR's digital carriers only extend from 695 to > 725 kHz, a type of "splatter" interference is heard on all > of my radios over this wider range, because the strong IBOC > signal overwhelms the front-end selectivity of the radio. What are you saying here? Why don't the presumably even stronger main carrier, and analog sidebands, also overwhelm "the front-end selectivity of the radio"? > Even on a narrow-band radio with a 3 kHz ceramic filter and > the help of a Terk AM Advantage tuned loop antenna, my daytime > reception of 690 WPHE is nearly unlistenable, and reception of > 740 WGSM is also seriously degraded -- You didn't say exactly where you are located, just that you "live 25 miles away from 710 WOR's transmitter"? Surely WHPE can't be considered a "local" signal where you live. While you could live quite close to WGSM, they use an aggressive directional array, even during the day, and I suspect that it's unlikely you are anywhere near being within their protected contour. These examples appear to not be "local" stations for you. > all because WOR is using IBOC on and around 710 kHz, and is > effectively taking up a *70 kHz* chunk of the radio dial with > their signal and its associated "hash" and "splatter". If this is true, then it sounds like there is something wrong with WOR's transmitter, and it is not coming anywhere near meeting what ever the eventual spectral mask might be that the FCC chooses for IBOC operation. This seems like a simple matter of fixing the transmitter if it is broken. > By this experience, if EVERY station was using IBOC, the whole > AM band would be nothing but interference all the way from 500 > to 1740 kHz (assuming stations on 530 and 1700 kHz would be > using IBOC and would also be causing this wide-range splatter > around their signals). I don't see how that follows, please explain? So far you are basing your claim on the interference created to non "local" signals, when the discussion was about "local" signals. You have also presented evidence that suggests something was broken in WOR's transmitter, causing it to radiate energy over a much broader spectrum than it should. John From jbyrns@enteract.com Thu Jan 16 15:20:12 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Jan 2003 23:20:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 52486 invoked from network); 16 Jan 2003 23:20:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Jan 2003 23:20:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Jan 2003 23:20:11 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.169] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Jan 2003 23:20:11 -0000 Date: Thu, 16 Jan 2003 23:20:10 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: IBOC / AM stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1084 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.229 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, KC4QLP@a... wrote: > John >> > > What rock have you been hiding under? Where have you been > when people make first hand comments about what they can and > now can not hear now that the digital carriers are on WOR? I was responding to the statement that the digital carriers "will in effect block out the reception of most of the AM stations you can hear in your local area". I have not head anyone make any "first hand comments" about the "digital carriers" blocking out any local signals. I was simply stating my opinion that I thought very few local signals, e.g. those within whose protected contours the receiver is located, would be blocked by the "digital carriers". I don't think you know the eventual answer to this anymore than I do, we will just have to wait till there are more "digital carriers" on the air, to judge their true impact on other local signals. Until then, I am just as entitled to my opinion, as you are to yours. Tomorrow why don't you make an effort to get up on the right side of the bed. John From JH_Radio@GameBox.net Thu Jan 16 15:56:48 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: JH_Radio@GameBox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 16 Jan 2003 23:56:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 27306 invoked from network); 16 Jan 2003 23:56:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Jan 2003 23:56:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rizzo.jerky.net) (204.57.55.99) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Jan 2003 23:56:41 -0000 Received: from gamebox.net (kubrick.hotpop.com [204.57.55.16]) by rizzo.jerky.net (Postfix) with SMTP id DF4F230D8A for ; Thu, 16 Jan 2003 23:56:39 +0000 (UTC) Received: from -enduser.GameBox.net (pcp03184855pcs.benslm01.pa.comcast.net [68.80.77.117]) by smtp-1.hotpop.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 91EC62F8117 for ; Thu, 16 Jan 2003 23:56:08 +0000 (UTC) Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030116185240.02c0d5b0@pop.GameBox.net> X-Sender: JH_Radio@pop.GameBox.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Thu, 16 Jan 2003 19:00:29 -0500 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC / AM stereo In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 X-HotPOP: ----------------------------------------------- Sent By HotPOP.com FREE Email Get your FREE POP email at www.HotPOP.com ----------------------------------------------- From: John X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113800107 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi... While I don't or should I say haven't listen to sky wave AM, simply for the fact at AM sucks around here. The reception does at least... I listen to a lot and do lots of DXing on FM. The locals here in Philly don't cut it for me. If I want dance, I have to listen to WKOE. If WJJZ goes IBOC, forget about it. Yes, I realize that most of your average Joe doesn't care about the farther stations. But imagine, being in a place near toms river, or around that area? You get Atlantic City/Trenton/Philly/New York City around there, now in analog. Once all of them go digital, they will get nothing but hash! The digital doesn't sound good at all. My dad says oh "Cool" we'll be digital, but I haven't yet told him about the buzz, interference, etc. When I have attempted to explain to him this, he goes, well no one cares. Most people aren't like you, and don't DX. Most people will just run out and by the receivers. We shall see. and as for DXing, well looks like I won't be able to to do that for much longer. And if I want dance music, Hmmm... I don't know ware to turn. Or the type of Hot AC format that Atlantic City/New York City has to offer. Quite a bit difference then the Philly version, witch is turning more dance. (I'm not against that.) But that is my take on this. John - Bensalem, PA At 04:38 PM 1/16/03 -0500, you wrote: >In a message dated 1/16/03 1:12:05 PM Eastern Standard Time, >jbyrns@enteract.com writes: > ><< Bottom line, I just don't see the "digital carriers" presenting a > major problem for the reception of stations in the local area. In my > opinion the aggressive night time directional antenna arrays used by > some stations are a bigger menace than are "digital carriers". I > think the biggest simple improvement the FCC could make in the AM band > would be to eliminate night time sky wave protection for class A > stations. Oops, I guess I sort of got off track, sorry. > > John >> > >What rock have you been hiding under? Where have you been when people make >first hand comments about what they can and now can not hear now that the >digital carriers are on WOR? A few on this list that live in that area can >and will tell you first hand what stations they ---used--- to listen to but >can no longer hear because of the interference.An engineer on this list in NJ >can tell you first hand of interfence to his radio station from iBiguity test >stations. A good portion of radio listeners in Washington DC that listened to >WMAL 630 can tell you of the interfence to that station when an iBiguity >station was testing on 650 {a small mentioning of that fact in this months >Radio World} A great number of folks on the am@nrcdxas.org can tell you of >the their experiences dealing with the interference from stations with STA's >testing IBOC at night. >For something that generates so much interference like this...it can not be >for the good of AM radio. >BTW,stations running highly directional antenna systems wont have much >trouble with passing the IBOC medium. Tom at WOR has had no trouble with this >at all. >There is a gentleman on the am@nrcdxas.org list that found information on >what radio stations people listened to during the 9/11 tragedy { I do not >have his source handy }...the majority of people in this country were >listening to stations with what can be considered as what was termed as >"class B" signals {signal strengths..not license class}...the very signals >that would be wiped out by the digital interference. If IBOC's interfence >issues cant be fixed..and IBOC is allowed to go full steam ahead..what will >people do for information during our next tragedy?Dont say..."oh they will >listen to the strong digital station" Well if people were listening to the >medium strength station and not the strongest local station...hmm that tells >me that big corporate radio...or some out fit of stations in this country >just didnt do a good job of keeping people informed...sending listeners >looking for a station doing what it was licensed to do...serve the public! >As far as killing skywave protection for class A stations....I dont see that >happening...just as I dont see these folks working on a pipe dream that >involves eliminating skywave signals all together with "special antennas". >Obviously the law of physics cant be broken.AM will always have skywave and >try and fit a wide broadcast mode into a narrow broadcast system,AKA the AM >BCB..whats left over has gotta go somewhere,and in this case its spilling >over pretty doggone close to the "other guys" channel.Thats just not >progress. IBOC and any other digital system I have no objection to --if-- >and ---only if--- it does not cause additional noise to an already >extremely noisey broadcast environment.Those flaws have got to be dealt with >and fixed in order for IBOC to be successful...otherwise listeners will get >fed up even more than they are now with AM. 2-4 years is a long time to roll >out receivers in mass numbers to the masses. 2-4 years of not having a >digital receiver to overcome most of the noise will drive folks farther away. >A prime example is AM Stereo. It to was suppose to be the goose that laid the >golden egg and look what happened. Instead it was the goose that laid the >beginning of many rotten eggs for AM radio. >Someone better start polishing up IBOC's egg...its starting to look a little >brown. > >Bob Carter > Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group > > WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 >Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 > > Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering >services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. >e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net > Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC > WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC > WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC > Ray Communications Radio Network > >AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- >Subscribe send an email to amstereo-subscribe@topica.com > > KC4QLP Amateur Radio > Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va > www.kc4qlp.cjb.net > _______________________________________________________ > > > > > >Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Love in Christ: John Bensalem, PA Send me an email Aim: RainAngelsRule MSN: RainAngelsRule@hotmail.com My website Welcome to Napster4TheBlind "Prayer does not change God; it changes you." - Authur unknown [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From davidcoons@webtv.net Thu Jan 16 16:16:05 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: davidcoons@webtv.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Jan 2003 00:16:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 3856 invoked from network); 17 Jan 2003 00:16:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Jan 2003 00:16:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO smtpout-2001-4.public.lawson.webtv.net) (209.240.213.209) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Jan 2003 00:16:05 -0000 Received: from storefull-2316.public.lawson.webtv.net (storefull-2316.private.lawson.webtv.net [172.16.212.224]) by smtpout-2001-4.public.lawson.webtv.net (WebTV_Postfix+sws) with ESMTP id 58FB7BF29 for ; Thu, 16 Jan 2003 16:16:05 -0800 (PST) Received: (from production@localhost) by storefull-2316.public.lawson.webtv.net (8.8.8-wtv-f/mt.gso.26Feb98) id QAA04703; Thu, 16 Jan 2003 16:16:05 -0800 (PST) X-WebTV-Signature: 1 ETAtAhQkbgU1aOavia3p5WR/mJvioPcJNwIVALYHJ8YY8OBhArnYojJr4cOFUEOn Date: Thu, 16 Jan 2003 19:16:04 -0500 (EST) To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} It's the programming... Message-ID: <117-3E274B44-2281@storefull-2316.public.lawson.webtv.net> In-Reply-To: n0uiheric@aol.com's message of Thu, 16 Jan 2003 00:45:33 EST Content-Disposition: Inline Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) X-eGroups-From: davidcoons@webtv.net (David Coons) From: davidcoons@webtv.net X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10533228 you will find if you look at the demographics,politcal oriented talk radio listeners are better educated and higher income than radio listeners at large.shows lke howard stern and similar fm shock talk is an exception. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Jan 16 18:00:17 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Jan 2003 02:00:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 76343 invoked from network); 17 Jan 2003 02:00:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Jan 2003 02:00:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.66) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Jan 2003 02:00:16 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.166] by n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Jan 2003 02:00:16 -0000 Date: Fri, 17 Jan 2003 02:00:15 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Healthy AM Band Suggestion Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 734 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.95.8 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Well, at least Omega, Symphony, and the Digiceiver technologies > could be marketed as "Digitally Enhanced Reception." Ask the average Jane or Joe on the street if their radio is "digital" and they'll likely say yes, because it has "digital tuning". People really don't know the difference. I've even heard a DJ on an AM station on 1070 kHz say something like "We used to call ourselves 'the station in the middle of your dial', but since all radios are digital these days, that doesn't really mean anything anymore." Just as people think whenever they have two speakers they're automatically hearing "stereo" sound, they think that any radio with a numerical display and push-button tuning is automatically "digital". From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Jan 16 18:08:25 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Jan 2003 02:08:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 60760 invoked from network); 17 Jan 2003 02:08:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Jan 2003 02:08:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r07.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.103) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Jan 2003 02:08:25 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.a9.369d9bb9 (4328) for ; Thu, 16 Jan 2003 21:08:20 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Thu, 16 Jan 2003 21:08:19 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC / AM stereo To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 1/16/03 6:22:07 PM Eastern Standard Time, jbyrns@enteract.com writes: << I was responding to the statement that the digital carriers "will in effect block out the reception of most of the AM stations you can hear in your local area". I have not head anyone make any "first hand comments" about the "digital carriers" blocking out any local signals.>> This is the internet...the land where answers to questions are just as close as your finger tips.I dont know what groups your a part of ,but maybe joining several engineering list and other radio list might gain you some insight as to what others are saying about their first hand experience regarding IBOC. << Tomorrow why don't you make an effort to get up on the right side of the bed. >> Hey...you ask questions...I and others give you information based on my and their experience and some insight on what I've and others have seen other posted else where on the internet. If you perceive me as being harsh and seems like your not liking what your hearing regarding IBOC..hey I'm sorry.I'm not going to tell anyone what they want to hear just to placate to someone. Bottom line is..dont shoot the messager when he or she trys to deliver their answers to your questions If this came across as sharp...then maybe its you that needs to watch what side of the bed your getting up on and another cup of coffee in the morning. Best regards, Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- Subscribe send an email to amstereo-subscribe@topica.com _______________________________________________________ From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Jan 16 18:14:29 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Jan 2003 02:14:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 89058 invoked from network); 17 Jan 2003 02:14:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Jan 2003 02:14:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Jan 2003 02:14:28 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.250] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Jan 2003 02:14:28 -0000 Date: Fri, 17 Jan 2003 02:14:28 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: IBOC / AM stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1985 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.95.8 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > The discussion was about wiping out reception of "local" signals, > are you within the protected contours of any stations between 680 > and 750 kHz? All I can say is, before WOR turned on their IBOC, I got daytime reception of 690 WPHE and 740 WGSM that was weak, but nonetheless perfectly clear and listenable, even on an el cheapo Panasonic stereo system using no additional antenna. Now, with WOR's IBOC on, I can still hear these stations, but they are covered up with a constant "scratchy", grungy splatter that extends out over a far wider range than what WOR is actually transmitting. WOR's engineers have repeatedly claimed that their signal is fully within the IBOC bandwidth design, and I believe them... but regardless of the cause of this wide-range "splatter", I have heard it on a car radio even over 50 miles away from WOR's transmitter, and it is occuring on *every* radio I have, no matter how selective or narrow-bandwidth it is. In fact, just the other day I was down in the Princeton, NJ area (WTTM territory!) and I thought I had discovered a new station playing Nostalgia music on 740 kHz. Underneath the splatter from WOR's IBOC signal, it was coming in strong, as if it was a local station. I scratched my head to think of what station it could be, until the ID came on... "Prime Time Radio" 740 CHWO from Toronto... in the middle of the afternoon, during broad daylight with the sun shining brightly! This is another factor that the IBOC regulations ignore -- the "critical hours" after sunrise and before sunrise in which skywaves can still come in strongly, especially during winter, so that "nighttime" conditions are present well within the daytime hours. The FCC even allows IBOC to be used continuously from 6 AM to 6 PM, even if this extends for hours before sunset or after sunrise, in order to provide IBOC during the all-important "drive times" in winter -- nevermind the large potential for skywave interference. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Jan 16 18:24:48 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Jan 2003 02:24:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 76285 invoked from network); 17 Jan 2003 02:24:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Jan 2003 02:24:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Jan 2003 02:24:47 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.250] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Jan 2003 02:24:47 -0000 Date: Fri, 17 Jan 2003 02:24:44 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: IBOC / AM stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20030116185240.02c0d5b0@pop.GameBox.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 1364 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.95.8 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > But imagine, being in a place near toms river, or around that area? > You get Atlantic City/Trenton/Philly/New York City around there, > now in analog. I live in Somerset County, NJ -- well outside the local coverage area=20 of Philadelphia and Allowntown FM stations, which struggle to be=20 heard adjacent to, or even on the same channels as, stronger NYC FM=20 signals. But, many of today's car radios, as well as some home and=20 portable radio, are really quite selective on FM, and people *will*=20 listen to "DX" signals if they prefer the programming over their=20 local stations. For example, my sister lives in Bernards Twp., NJ, and she listens to=20 94.1 WYSP from Philly -- about 58 miles away. I was in the post=20 office in Martinsville, NJ, and they had their radio tuned to 104.5=20 WSNI from Philly -- about 51 miles away. A country station, 96.1=20 WCTO from Allentown, PA runs ads for the "Colorado Caf=E9" in Watchung,=20 NJ -- about 41 miles away -- and has received good Arbitron ratings=20 in Morristown, NJ -- about 40 miles away. All three are despite the=20 presence of strong NYC stations on 93.9, 104.3, and 96.3 MHz,=20 respectively. Adjacent channel reception is a fact of life on today's FM band,=20 especially in and around metropolitan areas. If IBOC is used to a=20 large extent on FM, the results will be just as devastating as they=20 will be on AM. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Jan 16 18:36:01 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Jan 2003 02:36:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 26029 invoked from network); 17 Jan 2003 02:36:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Jan 2003 02:36:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Jan 2003 02:36:01 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.180] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Jan 2003 02:36:01 -0000 Date: Fri, 17 Jan 2003 02:35:56 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: WOR's defective IBOC Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 573 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.95.8 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics First, they had an IBOC exciter blow up on them after only a few days of use, and now this, as posted to the NY Radio Message Board.... I guess the folks at iBiquity are using Emerson or Spark-O-Matic as their standard of quality control? ====================== Posted by Sid Schweiger on January 16, 2003 at 16:12:49: In Reply to: IBOC Audio Samples posted by Bob Seeburg on January 14, 2003 at 03:46:46: Tom Ray told us, in another forum, that he had a defective IBOC receiver. He's getting it replaced, and I'm guessing he'll re-post the samples at that time. From trex@easystreet.com Thu Jan 16 19:57:48 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: trex@easystreet.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Jan 2003 03:57:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 94153 invoked from network); 17 Jan 2003 03:57:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Jan 2003 03:57:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO smtp.easystreet.com) (206.26.36.40) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Jan 2003 03:57:47 -0000 Received: from computer (dial-206-102-3-221.dial.easystreet.com [206.102.3.221]) by smtp.easystreet.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with SMTP id h0H3vjb28102 for ; Thu, 16 Jan 2003 19:57:46 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <000c01c2bddb$4c7f64e0$dd0366ce@computer> To: Subject: Any spectrum analyser graphs online showing Mono am vs cqam vs iboc? Date: Thu, 16 Jan 2003 19:48:28 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "trex" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Are there any spectrum analyzer plots on line showing comparasions between: AM mono vs. AM stereo vs. AM IBOC station Would like to see 1 hour average power levels, peak power levels, etc. Perhaps measure 5 different analog AM stations for 1 hour, talk shows, sports, wide music and narrow restricted talk as transmitted. and do composite average of all. Horizontal range should be +/- 30 khz. Vertical should be normalized to carrier level. It would be good to superimpose, in different colors, the nsrc mask, and bandwith curves of narrow, medium and wide recievers (with and without nsrc deemphisis) tuned to 1st 2nd and 3rd adjacents, . Might be good to submit such graphs to fcc. Easy to visualize the impact of the added noise. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Jan 16 21:19:36 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Jan 2003 05:19:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 68683 invoked from network); 17 Jan 2003 05:19:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Jan 2003 05:19:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.63) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Jan 2003 05:19:34 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 16 Jan 2003 21:19:34 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM Stereo TIS? Date: Thu, 16 Jan 2003 18:44:19 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 17 Jan 2003 05:19:34.0235 (UTC) FILETIME=[058352B0:01C2BDE8] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.163.182.5] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: > If the TIS is operating with full fidelity { audio filter bypassed or gone! and or audio response above 3khz }....wouldnt that be a clear FCC violation? Yes, but it has been that way for years. perhaps it was grandfathered in? Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Jan 16 21:19:36 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Jan 2003 05:19:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 26552 invoked from network); 17 Jan 2003 05:19:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Jan 2003 05:19:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.190) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Jan 2003 05:19:36 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 16 Jan 2003 21:19:36 -0800 To: References: <22.34eebdd7.2b57a0fd@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} It's the programming... Date: Thu, 16 Jan 2003 19:24:36 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 17 Jan 2003 05:19:36.0186 (UTC) FILETIME=[06AD05A0:01C2BDE8] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.163.182.5] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 n0uiheric@aol.com wrote: > Commercial radio is failing to deliver on substance; Many of the programs on our commercial station such as Horseman's Radio Weekly, have as upper class demographics as you could ask for. The average listener makes $80,000 per year. He has 3 or more cars including a 1 ton truck, SUV, and a luxury car. This listener also has 15 or more acres of land, and 3 or more horses. We are NOT talking about "Bubba and Leroy" here. In return for airing such high quality programs, I get raped and screwed in taxes so the government can use MY money to fund public radio station to compete with me. Kevin From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Jan 16 21:30:33 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Jan 2003 05:30:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 88308 invoked from network); 17 Jan 2003 05:30:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Jan 2003 05:30:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.64) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Jan 2003 05:30:32 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.171] by n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Jan 2003 05:30:32 -0000 Date: Fri, 17 Jan 2003 05:30:30 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: "The best sounding AM receiver ever" Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2547 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.95.8 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics This was just posted to the NY Radio Message Board... it sounds like he's using a Visteon CD-6.... which, as I have heard, uses Digital Signal Processing to do what he describes; hopefully Motorola will also be smart enough to offer hi-fi AM Stereo as a feature in their own DSP-based "Symphony" design.... IBOC AM, AND THE BEST SOUNDING AM RECEIVER EVER Posted by Christopher Cassa on January 16, 2003 at 23:32:49: With all of this talk about IBOC on AM as of late, I am hearing many viewpoints which either oppose or support this new 'piggybacked' digital transmission method. I am going to withold commentary on audio performance until I hear it directly over the air. I WILL however, tip all of my fellow board readers off to an AM receiver that will knock your socks off (and make you not even care about IBOC!) And here's the best part: it will only cost you $40,000!! Go out and buy a 2001 or newer Lincoln LS. It comes equipped with a Ford/Alpine sound system. This thing has the BEST, repeat, BEST AM section I have ever heard! Not only can you hear right out to almost 10KHz, it is stereo to boot (not that it matters anymore). Listening on this radio to WCBS 880, WABC 770, or other stations which transmit decently wideband signals reveals a medium which is very nicely suited to clean, pleasing sounding voice transmission. The way it goes about producing such a good sound is interesting, and unique. Upon reception of a strong, noise free signal, the radio AUTOMATICALLY goes to wide receive mode, and sounds spectacular. When the signal weakens, it blends from wide to narrow to mask noise. The radio makes all bandwidth adjustments on it's own, and no parameters concerning this are user-selectable. Given the fairly intuitive nature of this unit, this is not usually a problem, UNTIL you try to listen to a station broadcasting IBOC. Then, regardless of whether you wanted to or not, the radio selects wide receive on reception of the strong signal. And THEN you hear what occupies the sidebands: the data stream. And for all the great work the engineers at Alpine put into this unit, it is being rendered obsolete by this new and improved method of broadcasting. Friends, what we have here is the first real issue of reverse compatibility with IBOC on AM. And I'm sure not the last. But don't let that stop you from going down to a dealership, pretending to be interested in the car, and test driving a really nice AM receiver (and a damn nice car too!)! Christopher Cassa N2YRP WPVU457 From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Jan 16 21:36:33 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Jan 2003 05:36:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 73277 invoked from network); 17 Jan 2003 05:36:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Jan 2003 05:36:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.125) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Jan 2003 05:36:33 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 16 Jan 2003 21:36:33 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC / AM stereo Date: Fri, 17 Jan 2003 00:36:21 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 17 Jan 2003 05:36:33.0350 (UTC) FILETIME=[64F3EE60:01C2BDEA] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.163.182.5] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 jbyrns@enteract.com wrote: > I was responding to the statement that the digital carriers "will in effect block out the reception of most of the AM stations you can hear in your local area". I have not head anyone make any "first hand comments" about the "digital carriers" blocking out any local signals. John, In this forum I posted that during the night test of WOR and WLW's IBOC signal, WOR's digital carrier caused the hashing of WSB 750. I live within the .5mv/Meter contour of WSB. The last time I checked, the day time WSB's signal strength at my home is .65 mv/Meter. I live 118.7 miles from the WSB transmitter site and 620.6 miles from the WOR Transmitter site. This happened on several radios that I own from cheapo to some of the best radios to ever be offered on the US market. Kevin From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Jan 16 21:55:50 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Jan 2003 05:55:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 40436 invoked from network); 17 Jan 2003 05:55:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Jan 2003 05:55:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Jan 2003 05:55:49 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.251] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Jan 2003 05:55:49 -0000 Date: Fri, 17 Jan 2003 05:55:46 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: 1-watt AM station for sale... only $2 million! Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 408 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.95.8 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics 1180 WGAB in Evansville, IN is for sale on eBay, with a "Buy It Now" price of a cool $2,000,000... quite amusing for a Class D station with a 670-watt daytime signal and a whopping 1-WATT nighttime signal: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2906571964 Somebody please tell me what the FCC was thinking when they allocated AM stations to use less power at night than a flashlight bulb? From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Thu Jan 16 22:13:40 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Jan 2003 06:13:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 27737 invoked from network); 17 Jan 2003 06:13:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Jan 2003 06:13:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web41007.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.93.6) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Jan 2003 06:13:39 -0000 Message-ID: <20030117061339.54477.qmail@web41007.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.32.217] by web41007.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 16 Jan 2003 22:13:39 PST Date: Thu, 16 Jan 2003 22:13:39 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: {AMSF} 1-watt AM station for sale... only $2 million! To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio Hey, didja check out that barren studio? I've never seen so much empty space. I've seen moldy space at a radio station, water damage, etc. (all at the same station: AM 1330 outside of Myrtle Beach), but not this barren. A talk station, huh? Now if I only had $50,000.... 73, Jay,N1WVQ __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From n0uiheric@aol.com Thu Jan 16 22:26:25 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Jan 2003 06:26:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 22532 invoked from network); 17 Jan 2003 06:26:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Jan 2003 06:26:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d04.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.36) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Jan 2003 06:26:24 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-d04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.157.1a7b31db (16633) for ; Fri, 17 Jan 2003 01:26:20 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <157.1a7b31db.2b58fc0c@aol.com> Date: Fri, 17 Jan 2003 01:26:20 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: It's the programming... To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih Kevin, let's not forget some NPR and PRI member stations run BBC World Service overnights. Local KWMU 90.7 runs BBC World Service overnight. Some NPR member stations which run Jazz formats have a choice between NPR's Jazz 24 service and "Jazz with Bob Parlocha", which originates from WBEZ 91.5 in Chicago. The only disadvantage is that Parlocha's show is only available for 12 hours per night (10:00 p.m.-10:00 a.m. Eastern time). Classical-formatted stations are usually stuck with NPR's 24-hour Classical music feed for overnights. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Thu Jan 16 22:26:25 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Jan 2003 06:26:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 73485 invoked from network); 17 Jan 2003 06:26:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Jan 2003 06:26:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d04.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.36) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Jan 2003 06:26:24 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-d04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.151.1a753858 (16633) for ; Fri, 17 Jan 2003 01:26:19 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <151.1a753858.2b58fc0b@aol.com> Date: Fri, 17 Jan 2003 01:26:19 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: It's the programming... To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih A lot of older listners are getting disenfranchised, Steve. Take one sad example. WCWA 1230 Toledo, OH (owned by CC) was getting good ratings with an Adult Standards format. Even though this was in mono, WCWA was consistently getting ratings in the 2.0 to 4.0 range. Then, about a year ago, CC pulled the plug on Adult Standards and went to a talk format. The 45-64 demographic seems to be the one with the most money to spend; commercial radio is shooting themselves in the foot by abandoning the 45-64 demographic. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Thu Jan 16 22:26:30 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Jan 2003 06:26:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 747 invoked from network); 17 Jan 2003 06:26:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Jan 2003 06:26:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d06.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.38) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Jan 2003 06:26:29 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-d06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.fb.35738a28 (16633) for ; Fri, 17 Jan 2003 01:26:21 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Fri, 17 Jan 2003 01:26:21 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} It's the programming... To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih Yes, Kevin, but the average NPR listener makes more money, hold Master's degrees and doctorates, and does not tolerate the hate-filled talk that is so dominant on commercial radio. I would rather have taxpayer money, small business and listener contributions supporting the balanced and substantial programming on NPR and PRI rather than support an advertiser that sponsors illegal FM shock radio or the hatred promoted by Rush Limbaugh and Dr. Laura. Horesmen's Radio Weekly is an EXCEPTION in commercial radio, not the rule. Most commercial radio programs are oriented toward people who never completed high school, make 42% less money than those who had at least completed high school, and this, the least common denominator, is shrinking daily. Very few commercial radio programs are oriented to people who have completed at least two years of college (with or without an Associate's degree), even fewer for those who have completed Bachelor's or Master's degrees or doctorates. In my honest opinion, it's the corporate entities who are raping and screwing the American listening public, not public radio. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Thu Jan 16 22:26:31 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Jan 2003 06:26:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 40792 invoked from network); 17 Jan 2003 06:26:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Jan 2003 06:26:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d08.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.40) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Jan 2003 06:26:30 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-d08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.e4.33bc5cd7 (16633) for ; Fri, 17 Jan 2003 01:26:23 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Fri, 17 Jan 2003 01:26:22 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC / AM stereo To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih Let's just get rid of IBOC and require all 50 kW AM stations to broadcast in AM Stereo. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From JH_Radio@GameBox.net Fri Jan 17 07:32:02 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: JH_Radio@GameBox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Jan 2003 15:32:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 65884 invoked from network); 17 Jan 2003 15:32:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Jan 2003 15:32:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO snickers.hotpop.com) (204.57.55.49) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Jan 2003 15:31:59 -0000 Received: from gamebox.net (kubrick.hotpop.com [204.57.55.16]) by snickers.hotpop.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 0E2F171237 for ; Fri, 17 Jan 2003 15:31:50 +0000 (UTC) Received: from -enduser.GameBox.net (pcp03184855pcs.benslm01.pa.comcast.net [68.80.77.117]) by smtp-1.hotpop.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EFBB82F8130 for ; Fri, 17 Jan 2003 00:00:30 +0000 (UTC) Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030116190342.02c10970@pop.GameBox.net> X-Sender: JH_Radio@pop.GameBox.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Thu, 16 Jan 2003 19:04:45 -0500 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC / AM stereo In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 X-HotPOP: ----------------------------------------------- Sent By HotPOP.com FREE Email Get your FREE POP email at www.HotPOP.com ----------------------------------------------- From: John X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113800107 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit John, You think IBOC sounds better then analog? The frequency response is higher? I beg to differ. At 11:14 PM 1/16/03 +0000, you wrote: >--- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " < >kevtronics@y...> wrote: >> The consistently high strength of local IBOC signals can wipe >> out reception over a much wider bandwidth than what is coming >> out of the station's transmitter, even on selective narrow- >> band receivers. For example, I live 25 miles away from >> 710 WOR's transmitter, and when they have the IBOC on, it >> wipes out reception all the way from 680 through 750 kHz. > >The discussion was about wiping out reception of "local" signals, are >you within the protected contours of any stations between 680 and 750 >kHz? > >> Even though WOR's digital carriers only extend from 695 to >> 725 kHz, a type of "splatter" interference is heard on all >> of my radios over this wider range, because the strong IBOC >> signal overwhelms the front-end selectivity of the radio. > >What are you saying here? Why don't the presumably even stronger main >carrier, and analog sidebands, also overwhelm "the front-end >selectivity of the radio"? > >> Even on a narrow-band radio with a 3 kHz ceramic filter and >> the help of a Terk AM Advantage tuned loop antenna, my daytime >> reception of 690 WPHE is nearly unlistenable, and reception of >> 740 WGSM is also seriously degraded -- > >You didn't say exactly where you are located, just that you "live 25 >miles away from 710 WOR's transmitter"? Surely WHPE can't be >considered a "local" signal where you live. While you could live >quite close to WGSM, they use an aggressive directional array, even >during the day, and I suspect that it's unlikely you are anywhere near >being within their protected contour. These examples appear to not be >"local" stations for you. > >> all because WOR is using IBOC on and around 710 kHz, and is >> effectively taking up a *70 kHz* chunk of the radio dial with >> their signal and its associated "hash" and "splatter". > >If this is true, then it sounds like there is something wrong with >WOR's transmitter, and it is not coming anywhere near meeting what >ever the eventual spectral mask might be that the FCC chooses for IBOC >operation. This seems like a simple matter of fixing the transmitter >if it is broken. > >> By this experience, if EVERY station was using IBOC, the whole >> AM band would be nothing but interference all the way from 500 >> to 1740 kHz (assuming stations on 530 and 1700 kHz would be >> using IBOC and would also be causing this wide-range splatter >> around their signals). > >I don't see how that follows, please explain? So far you are basing >your claim on the interference created to non "local" signals, when >the discussion was about "local" signals. You have also presented >evidence that suggests something was broken in WOR's transmitter, >causing it to radiate energy over a much broader spectrum than it >should. > >John > > > >Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Love in Christ: John Bensalem, PA Send me an email Aim: RainAngelsRule MSN: RainAngelsRule@hotmail.com My website Welcome to Napster4TheBlind "Prayer does not change God; it changes you." - Authur unknown [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From amfmdx@fastq.com Fri Jan 17 07:40:12 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Jan 2003 15:40:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 51508 invoked from network); 17 Jan 2003 15:40:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Jan 2003 15:40:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Jan 2003 15:40:11 -0000 Received: from fastq (d132-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.164]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id h0HFeAP85078 for ; Fri, 17 Jan 2003 08:40:11 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <002a01c2be3e$ad662ec0$a4f9bed8@com> To: Subject: question for John Byrne Date: Fri, 17 Jan 2003 08:39:51 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla John, Do you work for a company that runs IBOC or perhaps Ibiquity or some other company that is attached to the success of IBOC in any way? All I know is that when KXNT runs IBAC, its got a lot of miserable white noise over everything. I know that the buzzing on KJZZ-FM when it was testing IBAC was pretty bad also. At least I can say one thing for you. It takes a lot of big stones to come on the list and say IBAC isn't a problem when most of us can hear the crap from it. Kevin Mesa, Arizona "Its going to get a lot worse before it gets worse" - Lily Tomlin From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Jan 17 08:12:35 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Jan 2003 16:12:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 31002 invoked from network); 17 Jan 2003 16:12:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Jan 2003 16:12:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Jan 2003 16:12:34 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.150] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Jan 2003 16:12:34 -0000 Date: Fri, 17 Jan 2003 16:12:33 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: 3GG in AM Stereo? Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1526 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics 3GG is not on my list of Australian AM Stereo stations... can anybody verify that they are in Stereo, as reported in this recent Usenet newsgroup message..... From: Mike Pfeiffer (pfeiffermi@hotmail.com) Message 10 in thread Subject: Re: 3MP on FM.. Newsgroups: aus.radio.broadcast Date: 2003-01-10 05:20:28 PST "Elsie Flognoggle" wrote in message news:70978986.0301100217.53ff6ae7@posting.google.com... > 3MP used to brodcast in FM to the carpark and studio complex, only > because the AM reception was so poor. If you live within 1 km of > the Frankston studio, you could hear it. > Bert and I always used to listen to 3MP on FM when we parked the > Low-Loader in the carpark on our visits there. > Love always...Elsie 3GG until recently broadcast on FM into the Traralgon Centre Plaza and it was possible to pick up the FM signal around most of central Traralgon. I could pick it up at my place about 1km from their offices. I seem to remember it was only mono, but I guess the cost of running a Stereo FM transmitter is higher. Still, it's surprising since their AM signal is AM Stereo. Though last time I checked with their technician they were only running a mono feed to the AM sticks up at Buln Buln. Does anyone know if SeaFM Gippsland is going to pursue a translator for Traralgon? I find that reception of SeaFM is very poor with many blackspots. 3TRFM can be picked up clear as a bell in the CBD of Warragul (which is literally in a hole surrounded by mountains. Cheers, Mike From jbyrns@enteract.com Fri Jan 17 13:34:42 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Jan 2003 21:34:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 90378 invoked from network); 17 Jan 2003 21:34:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Jan 2003 21:34:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Jan 2003 21:34:41 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.189] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Jan 2003 21:34:41 -0000 Date: Fri, 17 Jan 2003 21:34:40 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: IBOC / AM stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3277 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.139 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Possum Hunter" < possumhunter@n...> wrote: > > John, In this forum I posted that during the night test of WOR and WLW's > IBOC signal, WOR's digital carrier caused the hashing of WSB 750. I live > within the .5mv/Meter contour of WSB. The last time I checked, the day time > WSB's signal strength at my home is .65 mv/Meter. I live 118.7 miles from > the WSB transmitter site and 620.6 miles from the WOR Transmitter site. This > happened on several radios that I own from cheapo to some of the best radios > to ever be offered on the US market. Kevin, I can see that I didn't fully engage my brain before typing, when I was looking for a simple definition for what might constitute a "local" station, and equated a "local" station with one whose protected contour the receiver was within. You are of course correct in sighting the 0.5mv/Meter contour of WSB, but what I was thinking of was something more in line with the 2.0mv/Meter night time protected contour for class B stations. 0.5mv/Meter is not what I would consider a real solid signal, judging by the stations I listen to, even 2.0mv/Meter can be marginal, and at the low end of the band hardly represents a "local" signal. Pending a better definition of what constitutes a "local" station, I think 2.0mv/Meter is consistent with some of the old FCC "recommendations". Just about anything can happen at night, especially at a distance of 118.7 miles from the transmitter, which hardly seems local, and probably puts you in the fading zone for WSB, where there is destructive interference between the ground wave and the sky wave. Nevertheless, yours is an interesting observation, and I am curious exactly what the mechanism causing this "hashing of WSB 750" at your location might be. It is conceivable to me that WOR's skywave signal could sometimes be stronger than WSB's signal at your location, due to fading of WSB's signal. It would be interesting to know if this "hashing of WSB 750" occurs in a blameless receiver with a synchronous detector? A synchronous detector would eliminate the audible demodulation of any signals more than 15 kHz from WSB's carrier. If the "hashing of WSB 750" still occurs when it is being received using a synchronous detector in a blameless receiver, then the problem is clearly not a problem with the HD radio system, but is a problem in WOR's transmitter, causing the radiation of energy beyond the band where it should be. Most of these reports seem like anecdotal evidence, whose meaning is unclear at best, and questionable at worst. It would be nice to have the results of an extensive scientifically conducted field test, using a number of different transmitting and receiving locations, where the transmitters, receivers, and other test and measuring equipment used in the tests was carefully calibrated, with known and well documented performance specifications. Short of the results of such a test, I guess we will just have to wait until enough stations are broadcasting in HD radio to see if the proponents of doom are correct, and HD radio does indeed block the reception of most of the local AM stations, or if people are still able to receive their local stations. John From KC4QLP@aol.com Fri Jan 17 14:18:33 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Jan 2003 22:18:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 31561 invoked from network); 17 Jan 2003 22:18:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Jan 2003 22:18:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m06.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.161) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Jan 2003 22:18:32 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.67.77d2597 (30960) for ; Fri, 17 Jan 2003 17:18:28 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <67.77d2597.2b59db33@aol.com> Date: Fri, 17 Jan 2003 17:18:27 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} It's the programming... To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 1/17/03 12:20:18 AM Eastern Standard Time, possumhunter@netzero.net writes: << Many of the programs on our commercial station such as Horseman's Radio Weekly, have as upper class demographics as you could ask for. The average listener makes $80,000 per year. He has 3 or more cars including a 1 ton truck, SUV, and a luxury car. This listener also has 15 or more acres of land, and 3 or more horses. We are NOT talking about "Bubba and Leroy" here.>> I run that same program here as well...{Saturdays at 7am ET} putting the show in the Phantom as we speak acually. I suppose for people to really understand high quality radio and the demographics behind many shows on the air,one must be educated enough to understand what it is they are listening to.Otherwise everything gets a "label"..often mislabeled due to not understanding the whole picture. << In return for airing such high quality programs, I get raped and screwed in taxes so the government can use MY money to fund public radio station to compete with me. Kevin >> Ahh!.....gotta love it ...life, taxes,death and more taxes Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- Subscribe send an email to amstereo-subscribe@topica.com _______________________________________________________ From KC4QLP@aol.com Fri Jan 17 14:26:19 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Jan 2003 22:26:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 34850 invoked from network); 17 Jan 2003 22:26:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Jan 2003 22:26:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m06.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.161) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Jan 2003 22:26:18 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.166.1a3e1f81 (30960) for ; Fri, 17 Jan 2003 17:26:15 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <166.1a3e1f81.2b59dd06@aol.com> Date: Fri, 17 Jan 2003 17:26:14 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} 1-watt AM station for sale... only $2 million! To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 1/17/03 12:56:31 AM Eastern Standard Time, kevtronics@yahoo.com writes: << 1180 WGAB in Evansville, IN is for sale on eBay, with a "Buy It Now" price of a cool $2,000,000... quite amusing for a Class D station with a 670-watt daytime signal and a whopping 1-WATT nighttime signal: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2906571964 Somebody please tell me what the FCC was thinking when they allocated AM stations to use less power at night than a flashlight bulb? >> I dunno what someone was thinking, but that station has a study that shows WGAB can go full power night-time {670 watts} with a directional pattern aimed towards Evansville IN.That right there would be enough incentive for someone to grab up that station. My guess..of course not having seen WGAB's study,I would guess to say that the station might be able to maintain non-directional status daytime with a tight directional pattern at night. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- Subscribe send an email to amstereo-subscribe@topica.com _______________________________________________________ From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Jan 17 15:30:32 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Jan 2003 23:30:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 7391 invoked from network); 17 Jan 2003 23:30:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Jan 2003 23:30:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Jan 2003 23:30:30 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-85-104.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.85.104]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h0HNURql000423 for ; Fri, 17 Jan 2003 17:30:28 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <000f01c2be80$9737c0e0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <20030115235602.1476.qmail@web41003.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Upper Midwest Broadcasting Date: Fri, 17 Jan 2003 17:31:39 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Not to my knowlege. Haven't been able to find any current info on the station's ownership. The church that owned it doesn't seem to exist anymore, and the principals involved don't seem to have any phone numbers listed. I hope to get up there in a few weeks to get a firsthand look-see, but no guarantees even then I'll come up with anything. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "JNR" > Scott, was that station sold? > > 73, > n1wvq From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Jan 17 15:45:01 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 17 Jan 2003 23:45:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 9367 invoked from network); 17 Jan 2003 23:45:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Jan 2003 23:45:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Jan 2003 23:45:00 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-85-104.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.85.104]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h0HNivql004410 for ; Fri, 17 Jan 2003 17:44:58 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <001901c2be82$9dca4520$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <33CDDBD8CAEFEB4191ABF6F799032AF238D752@aubwm206> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC / AM stereo Date: Fri, 17 Jan 2003 17:46:09 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude In areas of flat, open land, that may certainly be the case. According to Clay Frienwald of Entercomm, Seattle, it makes a big difference in mountainous terrain with the lack of multipath, plus the high end actually sounds better as it doesn't end up being compressed to death like it does in the analog realm with the preemphasis. I still think receiver technology will make IBOC a moot point even on FM, so don't take the above as any sort of personal support for it. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Trim, Matthew L" > The funny thing is that I can't > see any right minded FM station converting to IBOC because they will not > gain any increased coverage and the sound quality of their digital signal > will be far worse than their analogue - where is the benefit?! From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Jan 17 16:44:28 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Jan 2003 00:44:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 97848 invoked from network); 18 Jan 2003 00:44:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Jan 2003 00:44:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Jan 2003 00:44:26 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-85-92.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.85.92]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h0I0iNql018764 for ; Fri, 17 Jan 2003 18:44:24 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <003701c2be8a$eb8ac660$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <22.34eebdd7.2b57a0fd@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} It's the programming... Date: Fri, 17 Jan 2003 18:45:35 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Some of the most destructive ideas have come out of the educational elite- Fascism, Communism, the free sex movement, etc. I have discovered that outside of the hard sciences higher education actually makes you dumber Educational level and intellegence are absolutely no indications of decency or morality, and are often quite the opposite. They're so blinded by their own brilliance that when their ideas blow up in their faces, they'll blame it on lack of funding/education/right wing conspiracies, etc. Being an educated liberal means never having to say you're sorry. As to your assertion that NPR and PRI feed all of their stuff in stereo, I can only deduce that St. Louis must be an exception, because around MN, the stereo generators are always off during the talk shows. The pubcasters aren't exactly in the tank, but they're not #1 around here, either. Lots of commercial activity getting higher ratings, Rush being one of them. I'm college educated, and I prefer the right-wing talk of Medved, Prager, and Savage. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: > shows like Howard Stern, Rush Limbaugh and Dr. Laura are created for people > who are less educated than the average American (the average American now has > a high school education). > NPR and PRI feed their talk shows in Stereo with Stereo music; From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Jan 17 16:54:59 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Jan 2003 00:54:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 24349 invoked from network); 18 Jan 2003 00:54:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Jan 2003 00:54:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Jan 2003 00:54:58 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-85-92.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.85.92]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h0I0stql021487 for ; Fri, 17 Jan 2003 18:54:56 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <005501c2be8c$648609c0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC / AM stereo Date: Fri, 17 Jan 2003 18:56:07 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Lots of 20 and 30kHz separations around here. If either or both of two western Wis. stations (1590 and 1550) were to start transmitting digital, my station on 1570 would lose most of its coverage over St. Paul. If all three were digital, there'd be so much interference there would be a big dead zone where any single station could otherwise be heard in HD. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: Where is the study > data to support this claim? With few exceptions, the stations in my > local area are spaced approximately 50 kHz apart, with a couple as > close as 40 kHz. It seems to me that 40 kHz spacing is more than > enough for existing radios to reject any interference From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Jan 17 16:56:51 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Jan 2003 00:56:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 53607 invoked from network); 18 Jan 2003 00:56:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Jan 2003 00:56:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Jan 2003 00:56:51 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-85-92.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.85.92]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h0I0umql022354 for ; Fri, 17 Jan 2003 18:56:49 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <005b01c2be8c$a7b43820$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: It's the programming... Date: Fri, 17 Jan 2003 18:58:00 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude I remember when the old WMAQ used to do that. They had some excellent music. ASCAP and BMI have effectively put an end to that. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: > There was a time when regular news/talk stations would integrate some > music -- and I mean whole songs, not just "bumper" music for a few > seconds after a commercial break -- into their programming, but now > that is rare. Even all-news stations would play some music to break > up the monotony, rather than just repeat the same news over and over > again to fill up the time. From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Jan 17 17:02:18 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Jan 2003 01:02:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 34833 invoked from network); 18 Jan 2003 01:02:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Jan 2003 01:02:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Jan 2003 01:02:18 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-85-92.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.85.92]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h0I12Eql023706 for ; Fri, 17 Jan 2003 19:02:15 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <007501c2be8d$6a43f560$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Yesterday Date: Fri, 17 Jan 2003 19:03:27 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Do you have a link to the WOR HD sample for the doubters to do an A-B? Maybe we should call it HHD (for hardly high definition :). ST ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, January 16, 2003 1:29 PM Subject: {AMSF} Yesterday > Since WOR's IBOC digital audio seemed to have so much trouble reproducting the Beatles' classic song "Yesterday" with any kind of decent quality -- even in mono -- I thought the time was ripe to bring out this recording for comparison: > > ftp://209.193.86.116/canada/chnsyest.mp3 > > It is a recording of "Yesterday" (the complete song plus liners and IDs) as heard in full C-Quam AM Stereo, on 960 CHNS in Halifax, NS in March 1997, as received on a Sony ST-JX220A tuner and originally recorded by Alex K. (who was kind enough to mail me a cassette of CHNS's great Stereo sound back when both he and CHNS were active in the world of AM Stereo). > > Even though the Sony receiver doesn't do proper C-Quam decoding and thus is a little distorted on wide-separation sound, it's still tremendously better in quality than IBOC's digital AM audio -- which, as WOR says, it's even in Stereo yet. > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Jan 17 17:44:00 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Jan 2003 01:43:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 15849 invoked from network); 18 Jan 2003 01:43:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Jan 2003 01:43:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Jan 2003 01:43:58 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-85-92.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.85.92]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h0I1hsql003371 for ; Fri, 17 Jan 2003 19:43:56 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <00de01c2be93$3cbbb640$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <166.1a3e1f81.2b59dd06@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} 1-watt AM station for sale... only $2 million! Date: Fri, 17 Jan 2003 19:45:07 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude At least the equipment is stereo. Should be a cinch to add CQuAM. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: > In a message dated 1/17/03 12:56:31 AM Eastern Standard Time, > kevtronics@yahoo.com writes: > > << 1180 WGAB in Evansville, IN is for sale on eBay, with a "Buy It Now" > price of a cool $2,000,000... From alfredot@inetarena.com Fri Jan 17 17:47:42 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: alfredot@inetarena.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Jan 2003 01:47:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 93836 invoked from network); 18 Jan 2003 01:47:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Jan 2003 01:47:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.inetarena.com) (206.129.216.13) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Jan 2003 01:47:42 -0000 Received: from hendrie (1Cust96.tnt16.beaverton.or.da.uu.net [67.227.163.96]) by mail.inetarena.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h0I1jGJ13970 for ; Fri, 17 Jan 2003 17:45:16 -0800 (PST) Date: Fri, 17 Jan 2003 17:47:04 -0800 (PST) X-Sender: alfredo@hendrie.1610am.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Re: It's the programming... In-Reply-To: <1042792208.959.46315.m12@yahoogroups.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: "Alfredo E. Torrejon" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=25132238 X-Yahoo-Profile: alfredotorrejon > the plug on Adult Standards and went to a talk format. The 45-64 demographic > seems to be the one with the most money to spend; commercial radio is > shooting themselves in the foot by abandoning the 45-64 demographic. Logically, it follows that older people are going to have progressed further in their careers, and thus would have more money. However, this abandonment of that older demographic is a phenomenon that goes beyond the radio industry. A few months ago, 60 Minutes ran a piece on how television advertisers spend a lot of money advertising to people in the 25-54 demographic, but don't consider those over 54 to be as valuable an audience, despite the fact that advertisers and advertising agencies *know* that older people tend to have more money. Furthermore, they went on to say that many advertising execs consider the viewers of "Ed" and other shows targetted at the 20 and 30-something crowd to be a higher quality audience than that of 60 Minutes (!), despite the obvious fact that 60 Minutes' viewers tend to be older, more educated, and wealthier. Although the story didn't try to put forth any conclusions regarding why older audiences are ignored by advertisers, it seems to me that the answer is somewhat obvious. Old people have strong brand loyalties that they've built up over the years, and are fairly set in their ways. Younger people, on the other hand, are preoccupied with being hip and contemporary, and thus will respond to advertising that is filled with messages about what is "hip" and "contemporary." The advertisers' strategy is to target the younger people and start building brand loyalty with them, rather than taking on the more difficult task of persuading older people to change their ways. Sure, I think that this is an oversimplified model and somewhat of a cop-out, but it seems to be the advertising industry trend. Alfredo From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Fri Jan 17 18:57:10 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Jan 2003 02:57:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 12359 invoked from network); 18 Jan 2003 02:57:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Jan 2003 02:57:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf17bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.177) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Jan 2003 02:57:09 -0000 Received: from juan ([68.158.239.172]) by imf17bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.19 201-253-122-122-119-20020516) with SMTP id <20030118025905.UGCH1219.imf17bis.bellsouth.net@juan> for ; Fri, 17 Jan 2003 21:59:05 -0500 Message-ID: <000801c2be9d$495a1ae0$af78fea9@juan> To: References: <166.1a3e1f81.2b59dd06@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} 1-watt AM station for sale... only $2 million! Date: Fri, 17 Jan 2003 21:57:06 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit WGAB carries the Greaseman show. Good for them ! As far as one watt at night, yikes Juan ----- Original Message ----- From: KC4QLP@aol.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, January 17, 2003 5:26 PM Subject: Re: {AMSF} 1-watt AM station for sale... only $2 million! In a message dated 1/17/03 12:56:31 AM Eastern Standard Time, kevtronics@yahoo.com writes: << 1180 WGAB in Evansville, IN is for sale on eBay, with a "Buy It Now" price of a cool $2,000,000... quite amusing for a Class D station with a 670-watt daytime signal and a whopping 1-WATT nighttime signal: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2906571964 Somebody please tell me what the FCC was thinking when they allocated AM stations to use less power at night than a flashlight bulb? >> I dunno what someone was thinking, but that station has a study that shows WGAB can go full power night-time {670 watts} with a directional pattern aimed towards Evansville IN.That right there would be enough incentive for someone to grab up that station. My guess..of course not having seen WGAB's study,I would guess to say that the station might be able to maintain non-directional status daytime with a tight directional pattern at night. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- Subscribe send an email to amstereo-subscribe@topica.com _______________________________________________________ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ADVERTISEMENT Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Fri Jan 17 19:05:30 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Jan 2003 03:05:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 28083 invoked from network); 18 Jan 2003 03:05:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Jan 2003 03:05:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf17bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.177) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Jan 2003 03:05:30 -0000 Received: from juan ([68.158.239.172]) by imf17bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.19 201-253-122-122-119-20020516) with SMTP id <20030118030726.ULTX1219.imf17bis.bellsouth.net@juan>; Fri, 17 Jan 2003 22:07:26 -0500 Message-ID: <000801c2be9e$756eefb0$af78fea9@juan> To: Cc: Subject: WGAB, and the One watt serving the public Date: Fri, 17 Jan 2003 22:05:29 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Why WGAB 1180 AM Must Drastically Lower Power at Sunset WGAB 1180 AM is required by the Federal Communications Commission to drastically lower its power at sunset so that it doesn't interfere with other radio stations on the 1180 AM band. The primary radio station for which WGAB must lower power to accommodate is WHAM 1180 AM in Rochester, NY. WHAM, a 50,000-watt station owned by Clear Channel Communications (which owns some 4,000 radio stations in the United States) was created long before WGAB, so the FCC says it has priority coverage. Because WHAM's signal is so powerful and covers the Easter half of the United Stated, WGAB has to power down to a wattage that doesn't even cover its city of licence (Newburgh, IN). This is so WGAB's signal does not interfere with WHAM and others. The FCC, whose primary mission is to server the public interest, apparently believes WHAM is Rochester, NY serves the public interest of Newburg, IN better than WGAB in Newburgh, IN. (At night, WGAB can barely be heard a mile away from its tower site.) The FCC is basing their rule on archaic regulations from the early days of radio in which there were few radio stations in the United States. These stations were giver a large amount of power to cover areas that did not have radio coverage. However, as time passed and radio stations filled in the voids the powerful stations covered, the first stations were allowed to keep their power at the same levels despite the fact that they no longer served a purpose since their stations were all over the country. Also, back then, radio was the primary source of instant communications. Its only rival was the newspaper. Nowadays, we have local TV, cable TV, the Internet, and thousands of radio stations spread across the country. There is no longer a need to have 20 some radio stations broadcasting at 50,000 watts and covering the entire country "in the interest of public interest." Now, these giant powerhouses like WHAM are owned by companies like Clear Channel Communications and other who have billions of dollars and Washington lobbyists working for them. When it comes to WGAB's voice in the issue, we are simply brushed aside because we are a small family-run radio station and can't fork over money to lobbyists and politicians. Despite our best efforts, our pleas have fallen on deaf ears. Maybe someday, and honest person will come along and change the unfair and archaic rules that favor large radio corporations. Until then, we hope you enjoy our sunrise to sunset full-power programming. Oh. And by the way, if there's ever a tornado or other disaster during the night that would require communication to the public in Newburgh, we're sure WHAM will be right on it. After all, why should we serve the public interest here when a station in New York apparently does it for us already???? Jeff Davis General Manager [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Jan 17 19:17:51 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Jan 2003 03:17:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 46518 invoked from network); 18 Jan 2003 03:17:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Jan 2003 03:17:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Jan 2003 03:17:50 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.191] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Jan 2003 03:17:50 -0000 Date: Sat, 18 Jan 2003 03:17:47 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Yesterday Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <007501c2be8d$6a43f560$827dfea9@home1> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2104 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.72.139 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Do you have a link to the WOR HD sample for the doubters to do an > A-B? > Maybe we should call it HHD (for hardly high definition :). Here is WOR's audio sample directory: http://www.wor710.com/Engineering/iboc/Audio/ It contains recordings of mono IBOC-AM audio as compared to the same samples as received in analog AM mono, sharply band-limited to 5 kHz of course. It is also worth noting that if/when IBOC receivers become available, you'll never be able to get better than 5 kHz audio response out of them from analog AM stations, even from stations that aren't transmitting IBOC... because if they used any wider of a bandwidth in the receiver, you would start to hear the IBOC hiss/hash if you are tuned to an IBOC station but it isn't switched into digital mode (either during the 9-second acquisition delay, or when a signal disturbance drops it back to analog mode). So, in other words, the "analog" samples on WOR's site are as good as one of the newfangled IBOC/"HD Radio" receivers is ever going to sound when tuned to a station that's not transmitting IBOC -- which, as of yet, is about 99.9% of all AM stations in the USA -- or when you *are* tuned to an IBOC station, but it can't or isn't yet switched into digital mode. And the folks at iBiquity actually consider this an *advantage*! As I quote from their press material: > > > > "AM IBOC will limit the analog transmission bandwidth to 5 kHz, which allows receiver manfuacturers to increase the receiver's analog bandwidth to 5 kHz and eliminate the first adjacent channel overlap. This will improve the fidelity of the analog portion of IBOC transmission and maximize the available spectrum for IBOC." < < < < Nevermind the craziness of considering 5 kHz an "improvement" of audio fidelity, what kind of wild mushrooms were they chomping on when they referred to IBOC signals and "eliminate the first adjacent channel overlap" in the same sentence? The whole way the IBOC system *works* is by placing the digital sidebands right on top of a station's first adjacent (and second adjacent) channels! From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Fri Jan 17 19:18:24 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Jan 2003 03:18:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 29515 invoked from network); 18 Jan 2003 03:18:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Jan 2003 03:18:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf17bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.157) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Jan 2003 03:18:24 -0000 Received: from juan ([68.158.239.172]) by imf17bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.19 201-253-122-122-119-20020516) with SMTP id <20030118032020.UWCA1219.imf17bis.bellsouth.net@juan>; Fri, 17 Jan 2003 22:20:20 -0500 Message-ID: <001b01c2bea0$431241f0$af78fea9@juan> To: Cc: Subject: From WGAB Date: Fri, 17 Jan 2003 22:18:24 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Please copy and paste thie following letter and send it to the e-mail addresses listed below. FCC CHAIRMAN MICHAEL POWELL FCC COMMISSIONER MICHAEL COPPPS FCC COMMISSIONER KEVIN J. MARTIN CONGRESSMAN JOHN HOSTETTLER SENATOR RICHARD LUGER EVAN BAYH ALL HOUSE AND SENATE E-MAIL ADDRESSES To whom it may concern, I am writing in support of WGAB AM in Newburgh, IN to be allowed to broadcast at full power at night. WGAB 1180 AM is required by the federal communications commission to drastically lower its power at sunset so that it doesn't interfere with other radio stations on the 1180 AM band. The primary radio station in which WGAB must lower power to accommodate is WHAM1180 AM in Rochester, NY. WHAM, a 50,000-watt station owned by Clear Channel Communications. WGAB has to power down to a wattage that doesn't even cover its city of license (Newburgh, IN). The FCC, which primary mission is to serve the public interest, apparently believes WHAM in Rochester, NY serves the public interest of Newburgh, IN better than WGAB in Newburgh, IN. At night, WGAB can barely be heard a mile away from its tower site. The FCC is basing their rules on archaic regulations from the early days of radio in which there were few radio stations in the United States. These stations were given a large amount of power to cover areas that did not have radio coverage. However, as time passed and radio stations filled in the voids the powerful stations covered, the first stations were allowed to keep their power at the same levels despite the fact that it no longer served a purpose since their were stations all over the country. Also, back then, radio was the primary source of instant communications. Its only rival was the newspaper. Nowadays, we have local TV, cable TV, the Internet, and thousands of radio stations spread across the country. There is no longer a need to have 20 some radio stations broadcasting at 50,000 watts and covering the entire country "in the interest of public interest." Now,these giant powerhouses like WHAM are owned by companies like Clear Channel Communications and others who have billions of dollars and Washington lobbyists working for them. When it comes to WGAB's voice in the issue, they are simply brushed aside because they are a small family-run radio station and can't fork over money to lobbyists and politicians. Please garner the courage to correct this out-dated rule that hurts small family-run radio stations like WGAB. Thank you for your time. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From dav259@csiro.au Fri Jan 17 19:19:32 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Jan 2003 03:19:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 2655 invoked from network); 18 Jan 2003 03:19:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Jan 2003 03:19:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Jan 2003 03:19:31 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0I3JTP04370; Sat, 18 Jan 2003 14:19:29 +1100 (EST) Date: Sat, 18 Jan 2003 14:19:29 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Cc: Subject: The Oz Report ... programming ... and other things In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public On Fri, 17 Jan 2003, Alfredo E. Torrejon wrote: > The advertisers' strategy is to target the younger people > and start building brand loyalty with them, rather than taking on the more > difficult task of persuading older people to change their ways. Sure, I > think that this is an oversimplified model and somewhat of a cop-out, but > it seems to be the advertising industry trend. 1. I agree with all you said Alfredo. To me it's a problem for commercial radio as wealthier older people haven't got as much clout as they're not as easily influenced by advertising. 2. Besides those with tertiary qualifications there are so many 'qualified' by going through the school of hard knocks. Public radio should be something for everyone - not just something aimed at a perceived elite. 3. As a general comment public radio does raise the standard of radio overall as it is not beholdent to the advertising industry. 4. There is no number 4. 5. Kevin - I don't think 3GG has been in stereo for yonks. 6. How come the whole stupid Aussie thread "3MP on FM.. " appears on the US google board - when only the last three messages are directed to it? There is no talk of 3MP going to FM! 7. I haven't said this for several months ... WHAT HAVE YOU DONE IN THE LAST COUPLE OF WEEKS TO ADVANCE THE CAUSE OF AM STEREO? - contacted a radio station (phone, letter, e-mail, talkback) either giving praise of constructive criticism - writing to nespapers/magazines - demonstrating it to your friends/colleagues - supporting Johnny Electron's FCC motion The more people who advocate AM stereo - the sooner the renaissance will occur. 8. Would someone in the US please start a campaign for WMLB Atlanta to go AMS in its upgrading from 10K to 50K power. This Music of Your Life station is the perfect vehicle for AMS. Thanks Scott for being the only one on this big list to bother to comment on Dave Mitchell's thread on the DX link on radio-info.com. And the chances are good as long as people say something! (It could be said - why bitch here? - tell someone who cares.) 9. We are a discussion group - and shouldn't get too upset when individual members have contrasting views. All democratic institutions should have a variety of opinions. But we are basically about the AM stereo side of radio in general. Forget about the lurkers - they may learn something. Get off your butts and do something! 10. Tom - from WOR - I'm still awaiting your answers. 11. Matt #1 - very good article about digital radio. 12. see no. 4. Happy Martin Luther King day. Ian - Davo Downunder btw - I saw the Warner Bros 1959 movie 'A Summer Place' for the first time during the week. I thought is was visually and audibly great. Would have been even better in widescreen (- analog or digital). Good God - haven't life matters standards changed? We are lucky in Melbourne to have a station that will play this movie hit theme regularly in AM stereo! God bless Percy Faith and his Orchestra - where the violins indeed do come out of the left hand channel. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Jan 17 19:33:17 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Jan 2003 03:33:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 83152 invoked from network); 18 Jan 2003 03:32:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Jan 2003 03:32:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Jan 2003 03:32:32 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.191] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Jan 2003 03:32:13 -0000 Date: Sat, 18 Jan 2003 03:32:10 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: 1959 AM Stereo Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1231 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.72.139 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics Here's a web site with pictures and information about RCA's experimental AM Stereo system from 1959, as tested on WNBC in New York: http://www.enteract.com/~jbyrns/RCA-AM-Stereo.html The most interesting part are pictures and *schematics* of a prototype RCA/Victor AM Stereo receiver from this time period. It was an 8-tube design, and while it had Left and Right stereo output jacks, it looks like the built-in single speaker was only connected to one of the two Stereo audio channels, rather than reproducing the L+R mono audio. The system overall looks very similar to the Magnavox AM Stereo system of the 1980s, which in itself was almost 100% receiver- compatible with the C-Quam system, as Sony and Sansui's multi-system receivers demonstrated. So, from this schematic you could build yourself a vacuum tube AM Stereo receiver, and have it deliver true Stereo sound from today's C-Quam stations! (There is no mention of a pilot tone, so it essentially would be a "forced Stereo" receiver, just like the Sony SRF-series.) To my eyes, the schematic almost looks too simple to be true, at least as compared to the complexity of any modern AM Stereo decoder chip... but I'll leave that up to the experts. From amstereorules@msn.com Sat Jan 18 04:23:58 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereorules@msn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Jan 2003 12:23:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 89512 invoked from network); 18 Jan 2003 12:23:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Jan 2003 12:23:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Jan 2003 12:23:58 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.166] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Jan 2003 12:23:58 -0000 Date: Sat, 18 Jan 2003 12:23:54 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Yesterday Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 153 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amstereorules " X-Originating-IP: 64.12.96.170 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=130870594 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereorules Whoever beleives that this digital crap sounds better than analog AM heard on a good radio, like the Carver TX-11A , is full of crap. - Shane Filan From jbyrns@enteract.com Sat Jan 18 06:30:16 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Jan 2003 14:30:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 57222 invoked from network); 18 Jan 2003 14:30:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Jan 2003 14:30:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Jan 2003 14:30:16 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.154] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Jan 2003 14:30:15 -0000 Date: Sat, 18 Jan 2003 14:30:14 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Yesterday Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 476 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.30 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "amstereorules < amstereorules@m...>" wrote: > Whoever beleives that this digital crap sounds better than analog > AM heard on a good radio, like the Carver TX-11A , is full of crap. Anyone who thinks the TX-11a is a good AM radio is equally full of it. When I owned a TX-11a, I found the AM section to have several serious shortcomings. Even the little Radio Shack TM-152 is a far better AM radio. John From stodd@sherbtel.net Sat Jan 18 08:48:26 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Jan 2003 16:48:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 45704 invoked from network); 18 Jan 2003 16:48:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Jan 2003 16:48:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Jan 2003 16:48:05 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-123.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.123]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h0IGm2ql011246 for ; Sat, 18 Jan 2003 10:48:03 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <001f01c2bf11$8b5a5ee0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <166.1a3e1f81.2b59dd06@aol.com> <000801c2be9d$495a1ae0$af78fea9@juan> Subject: Re: {AMSF} 1-watt AM station for sale... only $2 million! Date: Sat, 18 Jan 2003 10:49:16 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Without a few extra towers to help them protect Rochester NY, how else are you going to do it other than a drastic power reduction? ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Juan / John Gualda" WGAB carries the Greaseman show. Good for them ! > > As far as one watt at night, yikes From stodd@sherbtel.net Sat Jan 18 08:51:28 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Jan 2003 16:51:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 17188 invoked from network); 18 Jan 2003 16:51:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Jan 2003 16:51:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Jan 2003 16:51:25 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-123.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.123]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h0IGpMql011990 for ; Sat, 18 Jan 2003 10:51:23 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <002501c2bf12$0263b2c0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <000801c2be9e$756eefb0$af78fea9@juan> Subject: Re: {AMSF} WGAB, and the One watt serving the public Date: Sat, 18 Jan 2003 10:52:35 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude This guy is a bit misinformed. In the event of such an emergency, WGAB is allowed to go full daytime power for the duration without commercials, and WHAM would have to put up with it. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Juan / John Gualda" > Oh. And by the way, if there's ever a tornado or other disaster during the night that would require communication to the public in Newburgh, we're sure WHAM will be right on it. After all, why should we serve the public interest here when a station in New York apparently does it for us already???? From bjackson@indyradio.com Sat Jan 18 15:56:20 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 18 Jan 2003 23:56:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 98162 invoked from network); 18 Jan 2003 23:56:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Jan 2003 23:56:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Jan 2003 23:56:19 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.167] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Jan 2003 23:56:19 -0000 Date: Sat, 18 Jan 2003 23:56:18 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Yesterday Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 957 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923 " X-Originating-IP: 216.132.129.192 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " wrote: > Anyone who thinks the TX-11a is a good AM radio is equally full of it. > When I owned a TX-11a, I found the AM section to have several serious > shortcomings. Even the little Radio Shack TM-152 is a far better AM > radio. > > John You're kidding, right? I must just not get your joke. The Carver tx- 11a is one of the best AM receivers ever made...the tx-11b is even a little better. How many other AM radios have a response of 30hz- 15khz? The noise reduction gives me a fantastic stereo signal on WZZB and KCJJ here in Indianapolis with no platform motion. When I worked at WTTS/WGCL, WGCL used one as an air monitor (even after killing the C-Quam). No offense, but with some of the comments you've posted (pro-IBOC wishy-washy digital and now this), have you had your ears checked lately? ;-) -Brad Jackson -Susquehanna, Indianapolis -WGLD/WGRL/WFMS From possumhunter@netzero.net Sat Jan 18 18:25:08 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Jan 2003 02:25:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 2412 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2003 02:25:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Jan 2003 02:25:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.201) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Jan 2003 02:25:07 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 18 Jan 2003 18:25:07 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC / AM stereo Date: Sat, 18 Jan 2003 21:24:48 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Jan 2003 02:25:07.0460 (UTC) FILETIME=[FBA7B440:01C2BF61] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.149.192.28] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 jbyrns@enteract.com wrote: >You are of course correct in sighting the 0.5mv/Meter contour of WSB, but what I was thinking of was something more in line with the 2.0mv/Meter night time protected contour for class B stations. WSB is a class 1A Non-Directional Clear, not a Class B, so it is protected out to it's .25mv/Meter line. > > 0.5mv/Meter is not what I would consider a real solid signal, judging by the stations I listen to, even 2.0mv/Meter can be marginal, Your radio must be a pile of junk! The radio I got a Wally World for 5 bucks does a GREAT job with .5mv/Meter signals. Perhaps you should buy a Fanfare. > >Just about anything can happen at night, especially at a distance of 118.7 miles from the transmitter, which hardly seems local, and probably puts you in the fading zone for WSB, where there is destructive interference between the ground wave and the sky wave. WSB is rock solid here 24/7 > > It would be interesting to know if this "hashing of WSB 750" occurs in a blameless receiver with a synchronous detector? Yes, I get it in a Sony ICF-2010, as well as my radios with envelope detectors. > >Most of these reports seem like anecdotal evidence, whose meaning is unclear at best, and questionable at worst. Very few on this list can afford to buy the test equipment it would take to do a very scientific test. Face it, other than the 4 or so AM station engineers on this forum and a couple of very serious electronics hobbyists, the people on here are fairly non-technical. All they know is they have a AM Stereo radio that they love the sound of, but when an IBOC signal pops on the air, it makes 50 or 60Khz of the AM band all around it useless. If the WOR HD installation is typical and working like it is supposed to, and I think it is, can you immagin what the AM band is going to sound like with hundreds of IBOC hash generators blasting away day and night? Both Entercom and Clear Channel have orders in to convert every radio station they own to IBOC. The Night time AM band will be useless when this happens. It is going to be bad enough in the Day time. Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Sat Jan 18 18:39:33 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Jan 2003 02:39:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 80312 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2003 02:39:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Jan 2003 02:39:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.97) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Jan 2003 02:39:31 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 18 Jan 2003 18:39:31 -0800 To: References: Subject: Carver TX11 Was: Yesterday Date: Sat, 18 Jan 2003 21:39:19 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Jan 2003 02:39:31.0662 (UTC) FILETIME=[FEC276E0:01C2BF63] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.149.192.28] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 jbyrns@enteract.com > Anyone who thinks the TX-11a is a good AM radio is equally full of it. When I owned a TX-11a, I found the AM section to have several serious shortcomings. They must have fixed these problems by the time the TX-11b hit the stores because I cannot say a single bad thing about it. Speaking if good AM tuners, Soon, I may have access to a Fanfare tuner. If and when this happens, I will put audio samples up for all to hear of WFIS and WPCI, as well as other local AMs. If I get another good critical hours signal of WTTM, I will post it as well. Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Sat Jan 18 18:52:30 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Jan 2003 02:52:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 2281 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2003 02:52:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Jan 2003 02:52:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.201) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Jan 2003 02:52:30 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 18 Jan 2003 18:52:30 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC / AM stereo Date: Sat, 18 Jan 2003 21:52:17 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Jan 2003 02:52:30.0039 (UTC) FILETIME=[CEB55E70:01C2BF65] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.149.192.28] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 n0uiheric@aol.com >Let's just get rid of IBOC and require all 50 kW AM stations to broadcast in AM Stereo. Forced conversion to C-QUAM makes no sense for many stations such as my local 50 KW on 1070 playing ESPN radio 24/7. It would cost a bloody fortune to get that old VP-50 converted, and what good would it do? All of the programming is mono. A better plan is to force a 5Khz audio limit on mono stations that have a talk format. This would get rid of much of the monkey chatter from the talk stations while allowing full fidelity from the music stations and stereo talkers. Kevin From amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sat Jan 18 19:45:48 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 27307 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2003 03:45:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Jan 2003 03:45:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.88) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Jan 2003 03:45:47 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: notify@yahoogroups.com Received: from [66.218.67.152] by n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 19 Jan 2003 03:45:46 -0000 Date: 19 Jan 2003 03:45:46 -0000 Message-ID: <1042947946.426693.90641.w31@yahoogroups.com> X-eGroups-Application: files X-Yahoo-Group-Post: system From: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: New file uploaded to amstereoforum MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello, This email message is a notification to let you know that a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the amstereoforum group. File : /IBOCscan.mp3 Uploaded by : kevtronics Description : Audio sample of a 650-770 kHz nighttime band scan with 710 WOR's IBOC signal on, as received on a Panasonic RF-HS90 AM Stereo walkman on December 4, 2002. Features 650 WSM (weak but clear), 660 WFAN (local), 670 WSCR (weak), 680 (blank), 690 (IBOC hiss), 700 (IBOC hash), 710 WOR (local analog signal), 720 (IBOC hash), 730 (IBOC hash+hiss), 740 CHWO (w/IBOC splatter), 750 WSB (w/IBOC splatter), 760 WJR (in AM Stereo), and 770 WABC (local). You can access this file at the URL http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum/files/IBOCscan.mp3 To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/files Regards, kevtronics From bjackson@indyradio.com Sat Jan 18 19:48:16 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Jan 2003 03:48:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 2047 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2003 03:48:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Jan 2003 03:48:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.84) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Jan 2003 03:48:16 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.141] by n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 19 Jan 2003 03:48:16 -0000 Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 03:48:11 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: IBOC / AM stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 491 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923 " X-Originating-IP: 216.132.129.192 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Possum Hunter" wrote: >snip< > Both Entercom > and Clear Channel have orders in to convert every radio station they own to > IBOC. The Night time AM band will be useless when this happens. It is going > to be bad enough in the Day time. > > Kevin Don't forget about Susquehanna as well :-( But our local CE is trying to stall on our IBOC conversion...We'll see... -Brad Jackson -Susquehanna, Indianapolis -WGLD/WGRL/WFMS From possumhunter@netzero.net Sat Jan 18 20:35:48 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Jan 2003 04:35:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 34163 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2003 04:35:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Jan 2003 04:35:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.82) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Jan 2003 04:35:47 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 18 Jan 2003 20:35:47 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} It's the programming... Date: Sat, 18 Jan 2003 23:35:34 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Jan 2003 04:35:47.0700 (UTC) FILETIME=[3CCD6340:01C2BF74] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.149.192.28] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 n0uiheric@aol.com >Horseman's Radio Weekly is an EXCEPTION in commercial radio, not the rule. It is very typical of the programming found on WFIS. We also carry Animal Planet Radio, Ask Martha Stewart, Hints From Heloise, Unshackled, Free Indeed, Rich Ideas, Clark Howard, Focus On The Family Magazine, Focus On The Family Commentary, Radio Superheroes (Old Time Radio Shows), Oldies Coast To Coast, Sonrise, and The Radio Factor along with other entertainment, news, comment, and information shows. We interview the local lawmakers and enforcers live on the air, including the mayors, police chiefs, and council members of the two cities of license we have.(WFIS is one of the last "Dual ID" radio stations) We are getting ready to add Travel Channel Radio and Glen Houser's World Of Radio. On Sunday, we air the services of several of the local churches so the shut-in members can hear their Sunday services. I am working on putting together a program called "Ask The Engineer" where listeners can call, fax, mail, or email technical questions and question in general about radio to be answered by the station engineer. We are also working on a locally produced agriculture show for farmers. WFIS is very involved with the local high schools in helping them put together a broadcasting class. We also have interns from the schools to come in and be trained in a "Real" radio station. We also air all of the sports from Hillcrest High School as well as games from Pleasant Grove Christian Academy. The station owner/ General Manager is a volunteer soccer coach for a local High School. WFIS is a very active member in several chambers of commerce and better business bureaus. Our commercial station does a MUCH better job fulfilling the public service obligation than ANY other station, commercial, non-commercial, or public, in this market. When you listen to WFIS, you get smarter, NOT dumbed down! Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Sat Jan 18 20:45:17 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Jan 2003 04:45:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 88408 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2003 04:45:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Jan 2003 04:45:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.89) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Jan 2003 04:45:16 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 18 Jan 2003 20:45:16 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC / AM stereo Date: Sat, 18 Jan 2003 23:45:03 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Jan 2003 04:45:16.0691 (UTC) FILETIME=[8FF28630:01C2BF75] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.149.192.28] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 bjackson@indyradio.com wrote: > Don't forget about Susquehanna as well :-( But our local CE is trying to stall on our IBOC conversion...We'll see... They are going to be spending some bucks to convert the stations here! Every one of the stations slated for IBOC conversion has VERY old tube type transmitters, one dating back to the 1930's! I am going see if I can snag the now unused C-QUAM generator out of one of the Entercom or Clear Channel stations. We think the rotten audio from IBOC will drive more listeners to our very clean sounding station. We just hope the station on 1580 does not convert. It is doubtful they will because it is a mom and pop daytimer with a tube transmitter running a Mexican format. Kevin From n0uiheric@aol.com Sat Jan 18 20:55:00 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Jan 2003 04:55:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 56621 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2003 04:54:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Jan 2003 04:54:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d07.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.39) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Jan 2003 04:54:59 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-d07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.69.3386f7b5 (657) for ; Sat, 18 Jan 2003 23:54:55 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <69.3386f7b5.2b5b899f@aol.com> Date: Sat, 18 Jan 2003 23:54:55 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} It's the programming... To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih I disagree with you on that, Scott...the educational elite put forth good ideas which should be tried. And one of those is cleaning up the airwaves (a view shared by fundamentalist Christians). The commercial radio industry is often obsessed with dumbing down America; it's time for more intelligent programming to take over the commercial airwaves, instead of talk radio that attacks everyone and anyone. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Sat Jan 18 20:55:00 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Jan 2003 04:55:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 39344 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2003 04:55:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Jan 2003 04:55:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d06.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.38) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Jan 2003 04:54:59 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-d06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.12b.2086a98c (657) for ; Sat, 18 Jan 2003 23:54:54 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <12b.2086a98c.2b5b899e@aol.com> Date: Sat, 18 Jan 2003 23:54:54 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} 1-watt AM station for sale... only $2 million! To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih If I were WGAB, I'd dump the Greaseman. If he's on in the morning, I feel Steve and D.C. (from WMLL 104.1 Jerseyville, IL/St. Louis, MO) would be a better fit for the market. Let's not forget there's a Cuban on 1180 broadcasting with 300,000 watts of power; they obliterate WHAM at times. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Sat Jan 18 20:55:06 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Jan 2003 04:55:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 3361 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2003 04:55:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Jan 2003 04:55:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d10.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.42) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Jan 2003 04:55:05 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-d10.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.fb.3598badb (657) for ; Sat, 18 Jan 2003 23:54:57 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Sat, 18 Jan 2003 23:54:57 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} The Oz Report ... programming ... and other things To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih Another station that should be lobbied for AM Stereo, Ian, is WRTH St. Louis, MO. Their frequency, 1430 kHz, is occupied by 11 AM Stereo stations. Ron Elz, whom I've dealt with several times, is the Operations Manager there. There are also two others that can be lobbied: WEW 770 St. Louis, MO (I've dealt with their CE, Vern Jackson, over the past 20 years; Rich Vannoy is their Operations Manager). Both of these stations broadcast primarily music. As I am lucky to be in a market with four AM Stereo stations, and still holding on to airchecks I did in the late 1980s and into the 1990s, let's hope AM Stereo doesn't become a museum piece. IBOC is already on it's treadmill to oblivion. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Sat Jan 18 21:14:37 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Jan 2003 05:14:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 72485 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2003 05:14:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Jan 2003 05:14:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web41015.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.93.14) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Jan 2003 05:14:35 -0000 Message-ID: <20030119051435.50247.qmail@web41015.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.32.217] by web41015.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 18 Jan 2003 21:14:35 PST Date: Sat, 18 Jan 2003 21:14:35 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: {AMSF} The Oz Report ... programming ... and other things To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio Eric, You said there were TWO others besides WRTH. You only mentioned WEW. What's the other one? 73, Jay,N1WVQ __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Sat Jan 18 21:17:21 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Jan 2003 05:17:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 30733 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2003 05:17:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Jan 2003 05:17:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web41010.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.93.9) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Jan 2003 05:17:20 -0000 Message-ID: <20030119051720.6920.qmail@web41010.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.32.217] by web41010.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 18 Jan 2003 21:17:20 PST Date: Sat, 18 Jan 2003 21:17:20 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: {AMSF} WGAB, and the One watt serving the public To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: <002501c2bf12$0263b2c0$827dfea9@home1> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio With the way the F.C.C. is nowadays, WGAB might as well go to 5-MegaWatts. I mean, who'd really care except for WHAM? WGAB would just have to tell the F.C.C. that they're trying to jam Castro! Yes, this was fececious (sp.?) 73, Jay,N1WVQ __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sat Jan 18 21:34:26 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 69635 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2003 05:34:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Jan 2003 05:34:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Jan 2003 05:34:26 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: notify@yahoogroups.com Received: from [66.218.67.165] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 19 Jan 2003 05:34:26 -0000 Date: 19 Jan 2003 05:34:23 -0000 Message-ID: <1042954463.303491.573.w43@yahoogroups.com> X-eGroups-Application: files X-Yahoo-Group-Post: system From: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: New file uploaded to amstereoforum MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello, This email message is a notification to let you know that a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the amstereoforum group. File : /Drm-st.mp3 Uploaded by : kevtronics Description : Audio sample of the European DRM (Digital Radio Mondial) system, as tested in Stereo on 15.170 MHz shortwave with reception from the U.K. to Greece. In this mode, DRM occupies an RF bandwidth of 10 kHz, i.e. the same as an analog AM station with 5 kHz audio bandwidth. If implemented on the North American AM band, DRM would not cause any "hash" to adjacent channels, but would not be compatible with regular analog AM radios. You can access this file at the URL http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum/files/Drm-st.mp3 To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/files Regards, kevtronics From possumhunter@netzero.net Sat Jan 18 21:43:23 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Jan 2003 05:43:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 60796 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2003 05:43:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Jan 2003 05:43:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.115) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Jan 2003 05:43:22 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 18 Jan 2003 21:43:21 -0800 To: References: <1042954463.303491.573.w43@yahoogroups.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} New file uploaded to amstereoforum Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 00:43:08 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Jan 2003 05:43:21.0993 (UTC) FILETIME=[AD596790:01C2BF7D] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.149.192.28] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 >Description : Audio sample of the European DRM (Digital Radio Mondial) system, as tested in Stereo on 15.170 MHz shortwave with reception from the U.K. to Greece. WOW! That sound millions of times better than HD Radio! > > In this mode, DRM occupies an RF bandwidth of 10 kHz, i.e. the same as an analog AM station with 5 kHz audio bandwidth. If implemented on the North American AM band, DRM would not cause any "hash" to adjacent channels, but would not be compatible with regular analog AM radios. It would make the most sense to put this DRM service on the mostly unused "Tropical Broadcast Band" Independent stations and small groups should be given first shot at such allocations. Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Sat Jan 18 21:56:18 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: possumhunter@netzero.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Jan 2003 05:56:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 36933 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2003 05:56:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Jan 2003 05:56:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rly-ip06.mx.aol.com) (205.188.156.51) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Jan 2003 05:56:17 -0000 Received: from logs-tp.proxy.aol.com (logs-tp.proxy.aol.com [152.163.204.135]) by rly-ip06.mx.aol.com (v89.10) with ESMTP id RELAYIN2-0119005538; Sun, 19 Jan 2003 00:55:38 -0500 Received: from ibm (AC95C01C.ipt.aol.com [172.149.192.28]) by logs-tp.proxy.aol.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with SMTP id h0J5XuKM316097 for ; Sun, 19 Jan 2003 00:33:56 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <023101c2bf7c$562dfea0$1cc095ac@aoldsl.net> To: References: <12b.2086a98c.2b5b899e@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} 1-watt AM station for sale... only $2 million! Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 00:33:44 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Apparently-From: DodgeRamTrucker@aol.com From: "Possum Hunter" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 n0uiheric@aol.com wrote: > Let's not forget there's a Cuban on 1180 broadcasting with 300,000 watts of power; they obliterate WHAM at times. Let's not forget WHY Cuba put that big blowtorch on 1180, The VOA put 50KW Radio Marti on that frequency and Cuba has always jammed anti-Castro radio stations. The US Information Agency, the parent of VOA, should have never been allowed to put a 50KW station on WHAM's clear channel. The VOA should get off of 1180Khz and/or give WHAM another channel with full power in the X-band. Kevin From amfmdx@fastq.com Sat Jan 18 22:38:13 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Jan 2003 06:38:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 31449 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2003 06:38:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Jan 2003 06:38:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Jan 2003 06:38:10 -0000 Received: from fastq (d162-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.194]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id h0J6c9P51924 for ; Sat, 18 Jan 2003 23:38:10 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <013001c2bf85$49ac9d40$efd63fd1@com> To: Subject: MCS 3050 Date: Sat, 18 Jan 2003 23:37:49 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla My son gave me a MCS 3050 and with the RS loop, its a pretty fair radio. Sounds ok on FM, fair on AM. Is there anything that can be done to get it to receive above 1620? And the Delco radio Chris Cuff modified smokes it. The MCS 3050, although good, won't beat that. Kevin Mesa, Arizona "Its going to get a lot worse before it gets worse" - Lily Tomlin From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sat Jan 18 22:38:23 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Jan 2003 06:38:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 25166 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2003 06:38:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Jan 2003 06:38:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Jan 2003 06:38:22 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.132] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 19 Jan 2003 06:38:22 -0000 Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 06:38:21 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: New file uploaded to amstereoforum Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <1042954463.303491.573.w43@yahoogroups.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 2193 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.110 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com wrote: >=20 > Hello, >=20 > This email message is a notification to let you know that > a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the amstereoforum=20 > group. >=20 > File : /Drm-st.mp3=20 > Uploaded by : kevtronics =20 > Description : Audio sample of the European DRM (Digital Radio Mondial) system, as tested in Stereo on 15.170 MHz shortwave with reception from the U.K. to Greece. In this mode, DRM occupies an RF bandwidth of 10 kHz, i.e. the same as an analog AM station with 5 kHz audio bandwidth. If implemented on the North American AM band, DRM would not cause any "hash" to adjacent channels, but would not be compatible with regular analog AM radios.=20 >=20 It does sound much better than IBOC most likely due to the advanced research Fraunhoffer has done on the mpeg codecs. PAC is still young and has a long way to go before it reaches this quality. I can tell that they are using SBR to generate a synthetic top end though. At a 1st casual listen it appears to sound really good with the high frequency response but upon closer examination the top end doesn't sound like it completely belongs to the lower frequency signal. I don't think it will ever be possible to regenerate missing spectrum that faithfully reproduces the original signal. Even the fixed 90=B0 Harris system received with an elvelope detector didn't generate these kind of artifacts. If you remember the so called big drawback to the Harris system is that it generated >20% distortion when received with an envelope detector during single channel modulation with the test tones but upon regular program material it appeared as increased treble boost. The FCC at the time wanted envelope=20 compatibility. This became the big selling point for C-QuAM pushing the envelope compatibility issue. Maybe they should try some quadrature distortion for the top end it just might sound better than the SBR they are using now. Nothing beats the crisp but warm sound of vinyl on an expensive turntable and cartrige, not even regular CDs. When the 9624 Super CDs become available then we will have the best of both worlds. JSG From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sat Jan 18 22:43:27 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Jan 2003 06:43:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 69603 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2003 06:43:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Jan 2003 06:43:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.64) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Jan 2003 06:43:27 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.144] by n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 19 Jan 2003 06:43:26 -0000 Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 06:43:25 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: New file uploaded to amstereoforum Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <1042954463.303491.573.w43@yahoogroups.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 2042 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.110 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com wrote: >=20 > File : /Drm-st.mp3=20 > Uploaded by : kevtronics =20 > Description : Audio sample of the European DRM (Digital Radio Mondial) system, as tested in Stereo on 15.170 MHz shortwave with reception from the U.K. to Greece. In this mode, DRM occupies an RF bandwidth of 10 kHz, i.e. the same as an analog AM station with 5 kHz audio bandwidth. If implemented on the North American AM band, DRM would not cause any "hash" to adjacent channels, but would not be compatible with regular analog AM radios.=20 >=20 It does sound much better than IBOC most likely due to the advanced research Fraunhoffer has done on the mpeg codecs. PAC is still young and has a long way to go before it reaches this quality. I can tell that they are using SBR to generate a synthetic top end though. At a 1st casual listen it appears to sound really good with the high frequency response but upon closer examination the top end doesn't sound like it completely belongs to the lower frequency content. I don't think it will ever be possible to regenerate missing spectrum that faithfully reproduces the original signal. Even the fixed 90=B0 Harris system received with an elvelope detector didn't generate these kind of artifacts. If you remember the so called big drawback to the Harris system was that it generated >20% distortion when received with an envelope detector during single channel modulation with the test tones but upon regular program material it appeared as increased treble boost. The FCC at the time wanted envelope compatibility. This became the big selling point for C-QuAM pushing the envelope compatibility issue. Maybe they should try some quadrature distortion for the top end it just might sound better than the SBR they are using now. Nothing beats the crisp but warm sound of vinyl on an expensive turntable and cartrige, not even regular CDs. When the 9624 Super CDs become available then we will have the best of both worlds. JSG From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sat Jan 18 22:45:36 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Jan 2003 06:45:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 66187 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2003 06:45:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Jan 2003 06:45:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.83) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Jan 2003 06:45:35 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.145] by n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 19 Jan 2003 06:45:35 -0000 Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 06:45:34 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Double Posting Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 73 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.110 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst Sorry for posting twice my last message. Netscape was acting flaky. JSG From dav259@csiro.au Sat Jan 18 23:46:34 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Jan 2003 07:46:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 77550 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2003 07:46:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Jan 2003 07:46:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Jan 2003 07:46:32 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0J7kVP12574 for ; Sun, 19 Jan 2003 18:46:31 +1100 (EST) Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 18:46:31 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Subject: Re: {AMSF} The Oz Report ... programming ... and other things In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public On Sat, 18 Jan 2003 n0uiheric@aol.com wrote: > Another station that should be lobbied for AM Stereo, Ian, is WRTH > St. Louis, MO. Then Eric - Let's do it! More info please. What's their format, contact details etc.? Were they ever AM stereo? From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Jan 18 23:47:49 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Jan 2003 07:47:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 1865 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2003 07:47:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Jan 2003 07:47:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Jan 2003 07:47:49 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.161] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 19 Jan 2003 07:47:49 -0000 Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 07:47:46 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: New file uploaded to amstereoforum Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3401 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.69.8 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Nothing beats the crisp but warm sound of vinyl on an expensive > turntable and cartrige, not even regular CDs. When the 9624 Super > CDs become available then we will have the best of both worlds. Although it might not be the highest-fidelity medium in the technical sense of the word, vinyl does have auditory characteristics that can be very pleasing to the ear, such as slight distortions that are preceived as greater "warmth" and "presence". Also, the quadrature L+R/L-R Stereo track layout often provides Stereo separation that seems far greater than the actual dB figure, much like AM Stereo. CDs also can sound quite good, but I would only really say that about CDs made prior to 1993. For some reason, 1993 was the year when the CD "loudness wars" emerged en masse, with audio frequently processed to the point of brute force digital clipping, where the tops and bottoms of the waveforms are simply "hacked off", greatly increasing loudness at the expense of a large loss of dynamic range and distortion created from sine waves being flat-topped into near-square waves. For example, here is a waveform graph of a recent U.K. #1 hit, in unprocessed "rough mix" form which was never intended for public release, but is widely shared on the Internet: http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/rough.gif It shows a gradual crescendo from start to finish, with the final chorus peaking up to 9 dB louder than the first verse, and only a single peak in the entire song reaches the maximum level. This is basically representative of how most CD audio was produced prior to 1993. (BTW, the Left channel graph is on top, and the Right channel graph is on bottom.) Now, here is the same song in "Single Remix" form, which is how it ended up on the official CD release: http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/remix.gif It has essentially had all of the dynamic range squeezed out of it, with less than 1 dB of difference in loudness between the opening "quiet" verse and the final "loud" chrous, and along the way, nearly *every* peak in the whole song has been clipped, at or within 0.5 dB of the maximum level the CD format can sustain. (In this case, the audio has been normalized to -1 dB just to give it some "headroom" below the absolute limit, and the small peaks above this level that you see are the result of the inaccuracies of MP3 encoding.) This is largely because consumers and record company producers alike have wanted their CDs to sound more like "the radio". So, CDs are louder and more "Optimod-like" than ever, at the expense of reduced dynamic range and quality. Even highly electronic dance music has suffered, since bass waveforms are the largest and need to be the most highly limited -- thus, today's music doesn't have the same "punch" to it as the disco/dance music of the '70s and '80s, since the large bass peaks have are now clipped down to a level barely any larger than the rest of the music. So, Super Audio CD (SACD) and DVD-Audio do hold some promise for improved audio quality, but mostly just because the "loudness wars" haven't reached these formats yet. But once the latest album from Avril Lavigne or Matchbox Twenty gets put out on SACD or DVD-Audio, then you can be sure the game will start all over again -- and all the more reason to keep those "classic" CDs and LPs spinning; your ears will thank you. From n0uiheric@aol.com Sun Jan 19 00:14:24 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Jan 2003 08:14:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 20432 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2003 08:14:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Jan 2003 08:14:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d08.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.40) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Jan 2003 08:14:23 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-d08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.ea.3444075d (4459) for ; Sun, 19 Jan 2003 03:14:19 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 03:14:18 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC / AM stereo To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih Kevin, forced conversion to C-QUAM makes good sense...more sense than forced conversion to IBOCrap. Local commercials and sweepers would have Stereo music anyway, which would compensate for the monaural talk. And it would especially enhance the local sports programming on many of these stations. I'm not talking about your local carrying ESPN Radio; I'm talking about those operating 50 kW non-directional at all hours. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From rwagoner@cox.net Sun Jan 19 00:36:28 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner@cox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Jan 2003 08:36:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 12196 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2003 08:36:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Jan 2003 08:36:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.90) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Jan 2003 08:36:27 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.144] by n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 19 Jan 2003 08:36:27 -0000 Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 08:36:24 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Yesterday Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 995 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Richard Wagoner " X-Originating-IP: 68.4.33.253 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=96123889 X-Yahoo-Profile: richardalanwagoner > Anyone who thinks the TX-11a is a good AM radio is equally full of it. > When I owned a TX-11a, I found the AM section to have several serious > shortcomings. Even the little Radio Shack TM-152 is a far better AM > radio. > > John That's the funniest thing I have read in a l-o-n-g time. The TX-11a and TX-11b, which is a minor improvement over the TX-11a, set a standard that even the Denon TU680NAB could not match. It is one of the best AM tuners since the Fishers of the 1960s. The TM-152, a crappy extremely narrow-band tuner that made AM stereo sound as bad as narrow-band AM mono shouldn't even be mentioned in mixed company. It is one of the reasons people felt AM stereo wasn't anything worth persuing. The only problem with the Carver is that it was designed pre-NRSC, so that it's nice, clean reception is actually better than what is being transmitted. I am sorry that I did not own my TX-11b before NRSC became the rule. I would have liked to hear 30 - 15 KHz AM stereo From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Jan 19 01:20:25 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Jan 2003 09:20:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 98930 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2003 09:20:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Jan 2003 09:20:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.75) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Jan 2003 09:20:24 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.160] by n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 19 Jan 2003 09:20:24 -0000 Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 09:20:19 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: TM-152 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 882 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.69.8 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > The TM-152, a crappy extremely narrow-band tuner that made AM > stereo sound as bad as narrow-band AM mono shouldn't even be > mentioned in mixed company. *I* would mention it. My Realistic TM-152, even with its original "4.5 kHz" ceramic filter, has good audio response all the way up to about 12 kHz, right out of the box. With a little help from an equalizer, it is a very good sounding AM Stereo tuner, and a very simple mod to bypass its audio output circuitry and use the direct audio outputs of its MC13020 chip turns it into an excellent sounding radio. The AM Stereo world is better for Radio Shack having sold the TM-152. It was simple, affordable, and generally fool-proof, and offered a good balance between audio fidelity and DXing capability (at least when attached to a good outdoor longwire antenna, with which the TM-152 really comes into its own). From possumhunter@netzero.net Sun Jan 19 04:19:20 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Jan 2003 12:19:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 13685 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2003 12:19:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Jan 2003 12:19:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.19) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Jan 2003 12:19:19 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 19 Jan 2003 04:19:19 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC / AM stereo Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 07:19:01 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Jan 2003 12:19:19.0073 (UTC) FILETIME=[FDAC2110:01C2BFB4] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.154.255.97] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 n0uiheric@aol.com wrote: > Kevin, forced conversion to C-QUAM makes good sense...more sense than forced conversion to IBOCrap. I agree that IBOC is bad, but forcing a broadcaster to convert his transmitter to a format that will do him no good is bad period. > > Local commercials and sweepers would have Stereo music anyway, which would compensate for the monaural talk. No they wouldnt because most mono AMs have mono studios and mono STLs. > > And it would especially enhance the local sports programming on many of these stations. Now I admit that it would sound real cool to have stereo mikes set up at ball games to sound like you are there, but the fact is NOBODY that I have ever seen uses a stereo feed for sports, Stereo station or not! > > I'm not talking about your local carrying ESPN Radio; I'm talking about those operating 50 kW non-directional at all hours. There is no reason to force an all talk station to stereo, but if his bandwidth was limited to 5Khz, it would stop his splatter form getting into a music station. I would be able to hear AM740 CHWO in wide band if WSB 750 was only 5Khz wide. Kevin From amfmdx@fastq.com Sun Jan 19 08:18:29 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Jan 2003 16:18:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 71371 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2003 16:18:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Jan 2003 16:18:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Jan 2003 16:18:28 -0000 Received: from fastq (d153-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.185]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id h0JGIRP56151 for ; Sun, 19 Jan 2003 09:18:27 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <000f01c2bfd6$59a9c500$b9f9bed8@com> To: Subject: TM-152 better than TX-11a? Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 09:18:04 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla ---John Byrne wrote..... > > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "amstereorules < > >amstereorules@m...>" wrote: > > Whoever beleives that this digital crap sounds better than analog > > AM heard on a good radio, like the Carver TX-11A , is full of crap. > > Anyone who thinks the TX-11a is a good AM radio is equally full of it. > When I owned a TX-11a, I found the AM section to have several serious > shortcomings. Even the little Radio Shack TM-152 is a far better AM > radio. > > John John, Obviously you work for one of the companies that have hitched their wagon to the fatally flawed use of IBAC on MW [ Adjacent Channel ] because no one on this list or almost any list would state that a TM-152 is better than a Carver TX-11a. You obviously hate AM stereo and I have no idea why you are on this list. I have NO problem with digital radio, as long as its on another band. In fact, if I EVER saw or could EVER have a chance to buy a digital radio I would. My only problem with it is that since its DESTRUCTIVE of what we currently have and is NOT backwardsly compatible. It NEVER will be backwardsly compatible so it should be on another band. That wouldn't make it IBOC though..... I am of the opinion that if we had to have digital on MW, DRM blows the doors of IBOC. That said, digital belongs on E-147. Kevin Mesa, Arizona "Its going to get a lot worse before it gets worse" - Lily Tomlin From narkspud@hotmail.com Sun Jan 19 08:30:35 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: narkspud@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Jan 2003 16:30:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 31713 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2003 16:30:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Jan 2003 16:30:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.75) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Jan 2003 16:30:35 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.186] by n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 19 Jan 2003 16:30:35 -0000 Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 16:30:34 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: TM-152 better than TX-11a? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <000f01c2bfd6$59a9c500$b9f9bed8@com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 164 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "narkspud " X-Originating-IP: 66.159.192.39 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=81956306 X-Yahoo-Profile: narkspud >John, >You obviously hate AM stereo and I have no idea why you are > on this list. Which brings up a question. . .when ARE we going to stop poking this troll? From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Sun Jan 19 08:42:29 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Jan 2003 16:42:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 40537 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2003 16:42:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Jan 2003 16:42:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf03bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.163) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Jan 2003 16:42:25 -0000 Received: from juan ([67.35.26.52]) by imf03bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.19 201-253-122-122-119-20020516) with SMTP id <20030119164421.IZOW5161.imf03bis.bellsouth.net@juan> for ; Sun, 19 Jan 2003 11:44:21 -0500 Message-ID: <000b01c2bfd9$c05fafa0$af78fea9@juan> To: References: <000f01c2bfd6$59a9c500$b9f9bed8@com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} TM-152 better than TX-11a? Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 11:42:27 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Well said Kevin Juan John, > I have NO problem with digital radio, as long as its on another band. In > fact, if I EVER saw or could EVER have a chance to buy a digital radio I > would. My only problem with it is that since its DESTRUCTIVE of what we > currently have and is NOT backwardsly compatible. It NEVER will be > backwardsly compatible so it should be on another band. That wouldn't make > it IBOC though..... > > I am of the opinion that if we had to have digital on MW, DRM blows the > doors of IBOC. That said, digital belongs on E-147. > > Kevin > Mesa, Arizona From JH_Radio@GameBox.net Sun Jan 19 09:52:47 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: JH_Radio@GameBox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Jan 2003 17:52:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 85080 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2003 17:52:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Jan 2003 17:52:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO snickers.hotpop.com) (204.57.55.49) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Jan 2003 17:52:46 -0000 Received: from gamebox.net (kubrick.hotpop.com [204.57.55.16]) by snickers.hotpop.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 7EDB576669 for ; Sun, 19 Jan 2003 17:52:36 +0000 (UTC) Received: from -enduser.GameBox.net (pcp03184855pcs.benslm01.pa.comcast.net [68.80.77.117]) by smtp-2.hotpop.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D5E021B867C for ; Sun, 19 Jan 2003 17:52:33 +0000 (UTC) Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030119125302.03a0c8e0@pop.GameBox.net> X-Sender: JH_Radio@pop.GameBox.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 12:57:13 -0500 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: New file uploaded to amstereoforum In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 X-HotPOP: ----------------------------------------------- Sent By HotPOP.com FREE Email Get your FREE POP email at www.HotPOP.com ----------------------------------------------- From: John X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113800107 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi, I love vinyl! Simply put, I'm still trying to convince my parents to get me a lazar turntable. Not much can beat the Techniques Sl-1200. I think vinyl rules, and cd's sound like crap compared to vinyl. As I see it, the true wave form is represented on vinyl. Ware as cd's are digital numbers on a disk. It's wrong that people take analog tapes, and convert them to digital cd's. Now if the music was recorded digitally, then that is a different story. Ware can one purchase 12 inches and radio edit's on vinyl? New vinyl. *Grins* Awh yes. Someone else out there is as nuts as I am, I hope.... At 07:47 AM 1/19/03 +0000, you wrote: >> Nothing beats the crisp but warm sound of vinyl on an expensive >> turntable and cartrige, not even regular CDs. When the 9624 Super >> CDs become available then we will have the best of both worlds. > >Although it might not be the highest-fidelity medium in the technical >sense of the word, vinyl does have auditory characteristics that can >be very pleasing to the ear, such as slight distortions that are >preceived as greater "warmth" and "presence". Also, the quadrature >L+R/L-R Stereo track layout often provides Stereo separation that >seems far greater than the actual dB figure, much like AM Stereo. > >CDs also can sound quite good, but I would only really say that about >CDs made prior to 1993. For some reason, 1993 was the year when the >CD "loudness wars" emerged en masse, with audio frequently processed >to the point of brute force digital clipping, where the tops and >bottoms of the waveforms are simply "hacked off", greatly increasing >loudness at the expense of a large loss of dynamic range and >distortion created from sine waves being flat-topped into near-square >waves. > >For example, here is a waveform graph of a recent U.K. #1 hit, in >unprocessed "rough mix" form which was never intended for public >release, but is widely shared on the Internet: > >http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/rough.gif > >It shows a gradual crescendo from start to finish, with the final >chorus peaking up to 9 dB louder than the first verse, and only a >single peak in the entire song reaches the maximum level. This is >basically representative of how most CD audio was produced prior to >1993. (BTW, the Left channel graph is on top, and the Right channel >graph is on bottom.) > >Now, here is the same song in "Single Remix" form, which is how it >ended up on the official CD release: > >http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/remix.gif > >It has essentially had all of the dynamic range squeezed out of it, >with less than 1 dB of difference in loudness between the opening >"quiet" verse and the final "loud" chrous, and along the way, nearly >*every* peak in the whole song has been clipped, at or within 0.5 dB >of the maximum level the CD format can sustain. (In this case, the >audio has been normalized to -1 dB just to give it some "headroom" >below the absolute limit, and the small peaks above this level that >you see are the result of the inaccuracies of MP3 encoding.) > >This is largely because consumers and record company producers alike >have wanted their CDs to sound more like "the radio". So, CDs are >louder and more "Optimod-like" than ever, at the expense of reduced >dynamic range and quality. Even highly electronic dance music has >suffered, since bass waveforms are the largest and need to be the >most highly limited -- thus, today's music doesn't have the same >"punch" to it as the disco/dance music of the '70s and '80s, since >the large bass peaks have are now clipped down to a level barely any >larger than the rest of the music. > >So, Super Audio CD (SACD) and DVD-Audio do hold some promise for >improved audio quality, but mostly just because the "loudness wars" >haven't reached these formats yet. But once the latest album from >Avril Lavigne or Matchbox Twenty gets put out on SACD or DVD-Audio, >then you can be sure the game will start all over again -- and all >the more reason to keep those "classic" CDs and LPs spinning; your >ears will thank you. > > > >Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Love in Christ: John Bensalem, PA Send me an email Aim: RainAngelsRule MSN: RainAngelsRule@hotmail.com My website Welcome to Napster4TheBlind "Prayer does not change God; it changes you." - Authur unknown [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From JH_Radio@GameBox.net Sun Jan 19 10:00:24 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: JH_Radio@GameBox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Jan 2003 18:00:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 16747 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2003 18:00:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Jan 2003 18:00:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO snickers.hotpop.com) (204.57.55.49) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Jan 2003 18:00:24 -0000 Received: from gamebox.net (kubrick.hotpop.com [204.57.55.16]) by snickers.hotpop.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 706777666F for ; Sun, 19 Jan 2003 18:00:19 +0000 (UTC) Received: from -enduser.GameBox.net (pcp03184855pcs.benslm01.pa.comcast.net [68.80.77.117]) by smtp-2.hotpop.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D16381B8687 for ; Sun, 19 Jan 2003 17:58:32 +0000 (UTC) Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030119130125.03a0f830@pop.GameBox.net> X-Sender: JH_Radio@pop.GameBox.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 13:03:22 -0500 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: TM-152 better than TX-11a? In-Reply-To: References: <000f01c2bfd6$59a9c500$b9f9bed8@com> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-HotPOP: ----------------------------------------------- Sent By HotPOP.com FREE Email Get your FREE POP email at www.HotPOP.com ----------------------------------------------- From: John X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113800107 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I was about to say I just purchased a TM-152 for $86 on EBay. Please don't tell me it's crap! I actually heard the sound from the TM-152 on the AMStereoRadio.com site. I thought it sounded great! At 04:30 PM 1/19/03 +0000, you wrote: > >John, > >>You obviously hate AM stereo and I have no idea why you are >> on this list. > >Which brings up a question. . .when ARE we going to stop >poking this troll? > > >Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Love in Christ: John Bensalem, PA Send me an email Aim: RainAngelsRule MSN: RainAngelsRule@hotmail.com My website Welcome to Napster4TheBlind "Prayer does not change God; it changes you." - Authur unknown [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From jbyrns@enteract.com Sun Jan 19 10:18:08 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Jan 2003 18:18:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 24026 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2003 18:18:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Jan 2003 18:18:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.69) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Jan 2003 18:18:06 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.161] by n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 19 Jan 2003 18:18:06 -0000 Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 18:18:05 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: It's the programming... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <005b01c2be8c$a7b43820$827dfea9@home1> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 826 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.98.183 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g Your memory is certainly better than mine, that must really go back a ways, to the time before WMAQ went country, to the early 70's, or before. John --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Scott Todd" wrote: > I remember when the old WMAQ used to do that. They had some excellent > music. ASCAP and BMI have effectively put an end to that. > > ST > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > > > There was a time when regular news/talk stations would integrate some > > music -- and I mean whole songs, not just "bumper" music for a few > > seconds after a commercial break -- into their programming, but now > > that is rare. Even all-news stations would play some music to break > > up the monotony, rather than just repeat the same news over and over > > again to fill up the time. From jbyrns@enteract.com Sun Jan 19 10:24:39 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Jan 2003 18:24:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 84439 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2003 18:24:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Jan 2003 18:24:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.90) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Jan 2003 18:24:39 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.140] by n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 19 Jan 2003 18:24:39 -0000 Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 18:24:38 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Yesterday Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 4819 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.98.183 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "bradleyj923 " < bjackson@i...> wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " > wrote: > > Anyone who thinks the TX-11a is a good AM radio is equally full of > it. > > When I owned a TX-11a, I found the AM section to have several > serious > > shortcomings. Even the little Radio Shack TM-152 is a far better > AM > > radio. > > > > John > > > You're kidding, right? I must just not get your joke. The Carver tx- > 11a is one of the best AM receivers ever made... Hardly, the TX11a has several serious problems! 1.) The TX11a is very noisy when using the small aperiodic AM loop antenna that was supplied with the tuner. There is a large amount of internally generated hiss on all but the local 50 kW flame throwers. Add a better antenna to solve the hiss problem, and we have problem #2. 2.) The front end of the TX11a is subject to third order IM problems, especially if a better antenna, than the small aperiodic loop supplied with the tuner, is used to cure the hiss problem. For example, I have nearby 50 kW stations on 670 kHz, and 720 kHz, which create a third order IM product in the TX11a on 620 kHz. At the time I owned the TX11a, I used to like to listen to a station on 620 kHz, which was wiped out by the TX11a circuitry. The 620 station is now only 42 miles distant, although when I owned the TX11a, I think the old transmitter site was about 60 miles away, and the power was lower, although the daytime field strength was greater than it is now, from the current transmitter site. 3.) This one is a matter of opinion and taste, but the excess high frequency audio response of the TX11a made my ears bleed. Yes the TX11a was fairly flat out to 15 kHz, neglecting the 10 kHz notch, as Bob Carver promised, but what was the point? There was also a significant peak in the response at 11 kHz, which I am sure accounted for some of the strange audio quality of the TX11a. Flat response out to 15 kHz was a dumb idea in any case. Any sensibly designed AM radio will cut its audio response off sharply at 10 kHz. Also flat response, even to only 10 kHz, makes the sound way to bright and uncomfortable, as most stations use a large amount of high frequency pre emphasis today, as they also did in the days when the TX11a was on the market. The TX11a did have a de emphasis switch, but I found the audio quality with the de emphasis switched in to be too dull sounding. I don't remember how it sounded in the narrow band mode without de emphasis, although from the frequency response plots I made when I owned my TX11a, it looks like it should have sounded OK in the narrow bandwidth setting, without de emphasis. I have complete frequency response plots that I made of the TX11a audio response in both wide band and narrow band modes, with and without de emphasis. I eventually gave up on the TX11a, and switched to the much better sounding Radio Shack TM-152 for my AM stereo listening. > the tx-11b is even a little better. I'm not familiar with the TX11b, hopefully it fixed some of the problems with the TX11a? Tell me abut the TX11b, how does it differ from the TX11a? > How many other AM radios have a response of 30hz- 15khz? This was one of the stupider ideas in the TX11a, and part of its problems. I don't know what Bob Carver was thinking when he did this? When the TX11a was on the market, the handwriting was already on the wall for the reduction of the AM mask to the point where stations would only be able to transmit 10 kHz audio, so what is the point? Even before the reduction of the AM mask, how many AM stations were there with audio response out to 15 kHz? AM radios are best designed with no audio response above the notch created by the 10kHz whistle filter, in my opinion. > The noise reduction gives me a fantastic stereo signal on WZZB > and KCJJ here in Indianapolis with no platform motion. It's probably been at least 15 years since I sold my TX11a, I must confess that I don't remember that it had an AM "noise reduction" circuit, but then if "noise reduction" was necessary on an AM station, I wouldn't be listening to it in the first place. I do remember that the TX11a had a weird FM noise suppression system, another strange idea that was incorporated in the TX11a. > No offense, but with some of the comments you've posted (pro-IBOC > wishy-washy digital and now this), have you had your ears checked > lately? ;-) This is the "AM-Stereo" group isn't it? IBOC is AM-Stereo for the new millennium. I'm not sure what you mean by the "wishy-washy digital" part? My hearing was seriously damaged by my TX11a, and in any case I have never claimed to be a "Golden Eared" Audiophile. John From jbyrns@enteract.com Sun Jan 19 10:33:52 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Jan 2003 18:33:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 71699 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2003 18:33:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Jan 2003 18:33:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Jan 2003 18:33:50 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.139] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 19 Jan 2003 18:33:50 -0000 Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 18:33:49 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: TM-152 better than TX-11a? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20030119130125.03a0f830@pop.GameBox.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 633 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.98.183 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, John wrote: > I was about to say I just purchased a TM-152 for $86 on EBay. > Please don't tell me it's crap! > I actually heard the sound from the TM-152 on the AMStereoRadio.com site. I thought it sounded great! Don't worry, the TM-152 does sound great, far better than the famous, but flawed Carver TX11a! Don't let all the stuffed shirts, and snobs, fool you, just relax and enjoy a great tuner. The people who designed the TM-152 knew what it takes to make a good sounding AM tuner, while Bob Carver was only obsessed with ideas like flat response to 15 kHz. John From evergreenterrace@buzzle.com Sun Jan 19 10:36:13 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: evergreenterrace@buzzle.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Jan 2003 18:36:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 43517 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2003 18:36:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Jan 2003 18:36:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.90) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Jan 2003 18:36:12 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.188] by n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 19 Jan 2003 18:36:12 -0000 Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 18:36:12 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: TM-152 better than TX-11a? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 857 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgliradio " X-Originating-IP: 170.20.11.59 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=69711087 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgliradio --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, John wrote: > > I was about to say I just purchased a TM-152 for $86 on EBay. > > Please don't tell me it's crap! > > I actually heard the sound from the TM-152 on the AMStereoRadio.com site. I thought it sounded great! > > > Don't worry, the TM-152 does sound great, far better than the famous, > but flawed Carver TX11a! Don't let all the stuffed shirts, and snobs, > fool you, just relax and enjoy a great tuner. The people who designed > the TM-152 knew what it takes to make a good sounding AM tuner, while > Bob Carver was only obsessed with ideas like flat response to 15 kHz. > > John Except that the TM-152 has HPF's because they cannot design the low end to not interfere with the pilot tone. From amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sun Jan 19 10:59:32 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 47174 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2003 18:59:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Jan 2003 18:59:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.69) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Jan 2003 18:59:32 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: notify@yahoogroups.com Received: from [66.218.66.141] by n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 19 Jan 2003 18:59:32 -0000 Date: 19 Jan 2003 18:59:29 -0000 Message-ID: <1043002769.181.18553.w66@yahoogroups.com> X-eGroups-Application: poll X-Yahoo-Group-Post: system From: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: New poll for amstereoforum MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Enter your vote today! A new poll has been created for the amstereoforum group: Which tuner sounds better on AM stereo stations? o Carver TX-11a o Realistic TM-152 To vote, please visit the following web page: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum/surveys?id=11024484 Note: Please do not reply to this message. Poll votes are not collected via email. To vote, you must go to the Yahoo! Groups web site listed above. Thanks! From stodd@sherbtel.net Sun Jan 19 11:57:13 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Jan 2003 19:57:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 50900 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2003 19:57:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Jan 2003 19:57:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Jan 2003 19:57:10 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-94.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.94]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h0JJuBbg016446 for ; Sun, 19 Jan 2003 13:57:08 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <001901c2bff5$21c2c320$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC / AM stereo Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 13:57:28 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Dude- let's grab those old transmitters for posterity. If nothing else, let the hams know they're available, and I'll bet they can find new homes. I'd love to come out and get a whole bunch of them, but I don't think my budget will be able to handle it. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Possum Hunter" Every > one of the stations slated for IBOC conversion has VERY old tube type > transmitters, one dating back to the 1930's! I am going see if I can snag > the now unused C-QUAM generator out of one of the Entercom or Clear Channel > stations. From stodd@sherbtel.net Sun Jan 19 12:02:36 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Jan 2003 20:02:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 6889 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2003 20:02:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Jan 2003 20:02:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Jan 2003 20:02:35 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-94.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.94]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h0JK2Wbg017561 for ; Sun, 19 Jan 2003 14:02:33 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <001d01c2bff5$e370abe0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <69.3386f7b5.2b5b899f@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} It's the programming... Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 14:03:49 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude You mean like pretending that Saddam Hussein and Kim Jong Il aren't a threat? I'll pass. So much of what is characterized as "hate radio" is little more than talkmeisters who have a contrary opinion to the prevailing wisdom. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Saturday, January 18, 2003 10:54 PM Subject: Re: {AMSF} It's the programming... > I disagree with you on that, Scott...the educational elite put forth good > ideas which should be tried. it's time for more intelligent > programming to take over the commercial airwaves, instead of talk radio that > attacks everyone and anyone. > From possumhunter@netzero.net Sun Jan 19 12:06:47 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Jan 2003 20:06:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 87708 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2003 20:06:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Jan 2003 20:06:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.95) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Jan 2003 20:06:47 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 19 Jan 2003 12:06:46 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Yesterday Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 15:06:30 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Jan 2003 20:06:46.0979 (UTC) FILETIME=[4B86F130:01C2BFF6] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.142.67.183] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 jbyrns@enteract.com wrote: > 3.) This one is a matter of opinion and taste, but the excess high frequency audio response of the TX11a made my ears bleed. Yes the TX11a was fairly flat out to 15 kHz, neglecting the 10 kHz notch, as Bob Carver promised, but what was the point? Many AM stations, including WFIS had good frequency response out to 16Khz or better. Even after NRSC, there are several stations around here that are cheating with 12Khz and 15Khz audio. Until a few months ago, one station had good audio out to 17Khz! > >Any sensibly designed AM radio will cut its audio response off sharply at 10 kHz. Also flat response, even to only 10 kHz, makes the sound way to bright and uncomfortable, as most stations use a large amount of high frequency pre emphasis today, as they also did in the days when the TX11a was on the market. It is true the old generation Optimod had way too much pre emphasis, but the NRSC curve is pretty listenable. It is very easy to make a de emphasis circuit to stick in the audio line. > >The TX11a did have a de emphasis switch, but I found the audio quality with the de emphasis switched in to be too dull sounding. This tuner was made well before NRSC came out, but the de emphasis can be changed to NRSC by swapping a few capacitors. The TX11a was made to de emphasize the old Optimod curve. > > This is the "AM-Stereo" group isn't it? IBOC is AM-Stereo for the new millennium. No, AM IBOC audio is Mono. > >My hearing was seriously damaged by my TX11a, OK, I just have to ask you how on earth the TX11a damaged your hearing. I have owned (and still own) many of Bob Carver's Stereo products, some I liked more than others, but none damaged my hearing. Did you have a DX catch on the TX-11a cranked up on your Carver Silver 7s driven by a Carver C1 pre-amp in a lightning storm? I lost much of my favorite Carver gear a few years ago when my house was flattened by a storm. I am slowly putting together another killer hi-fi with Dynaco and Mcintosh tube amps along with goodies from Magnum Dynalab, Carver, Wharfedale, Revox, Dennon, BSR, Altec, and others. The Fanfare tuner is on my "want list". Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Sun Jan 19 12:12:38 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Jan 2003 20:12:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 19053 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2003 20:12:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Jan 2003 20:12:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.20) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Jan 2003 20:12:37 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 19 Jan 2003 12:12:37 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: TM-152 better than TX-11a? Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 15:12:26 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Jan 2003 20:12:37.0902 (UTC) FILETIME=[1CB18AE0:01C2BFF7] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.142.67.183] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 jbyrns@enteract.com >The people who designed the TM-152 knew what it takes to make a good sounding AM tuner, John, I bet you love WOR's audio too, don't you? > >while Bob Carver was only obsessed with ideas like flat response to 15 kHz. Bob Carver has always been obsessed with ideas that made some GREAT Hi-Fi gear over the years. There is nothing like having an AM tuner that sounds like the Mod Monitor audio back at the transmitter. In fact, on a good transmitter you cant hear the difference from listening to the output of the audio processing and the off air signal on the TX11b! Kevin From jbyrns@enteract.com Sun Jan 19 12:15:24 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Jan 2003 20:15:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 2392 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2003 20:15:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Jan 2003 20:15:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Jan 2003 20:15:23 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.156] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 19 Jan 2003 20:15:22 -0000 Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 20:15:20 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: IBOC / AM stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2950 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.208 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Possum Hunter" < possumhunter@n...> wrote: > jbyrns@e... wrote: > >You are of course correct in sighting the 0.5mv/Meter contour of WSB, but > what I was thinking of was something more in line with the 2.0mv/Meter > night time protected contour for class B stations. > > WSB is a class 1A Non-Directional Clear, not a Class B, so it is protected > out to it's .25mv/Meter line. There is no class 1A anymore, now they are called class A, and I thought it was 0.1mv/Meter days, and 0.5mv/Meter nights, but then I don't have the latest copy of the FCC rules, so I suppose you are trying to tell me the protected contour has been downgraded from 0.1mv/Meter to 0.25mv/Meter? In any case, I was simply fishing around for some kind of workable definition of what might constitute a "local" signal, and 0.5mv/Meter seems way to weak/low to be considered a "local" signal, as far as I am concerned. > > 0.5mv/Meter is not what I would consider a real solid signal, judging by > the stations I listen to, even 2.0mv/Meter can be marginal, > > Your radio must be a pile of junk! The radio I got a Wally World for 5 bucks > does a GREAT job with .5mv/Meter signals. Perhaps you should buy a Fanfare. A lot of the problems are not dependent on the quality of the radio, take for example the night time fading zone created by sky wave interference with the ground wave. At 0.5mv/Meter you are probably well into this area with a 50 kW station. Not my idea of good reception on any radio. Also the SNR has pretty well gone to pot at the 0.5mv/Meter contour, even during the day. I like nice quiet radio, without any fading. What is the Fanfare's claim to fame? At least one of their products is, shall we say not too good. > >Just about anything can happen at night, especially at a distance of 118.7 > miles from the transmitter, which hardly seems local, and probably puts you > in the fading zone for WSB, where there is destructive interference between > the ground wave and the sky wave. > > WSB is rock solid here 24/7 I did say just about anything can happen at night didn't I, you are lucky, it isn't always so. > > It would be interesting to know if this "hashing of WSB 750" occurs in a > blameless receiver with a synchronous detector? > > Yes, I get it in a Sony ICF-2010, as well as my radios with envelope > detectors. The Sony ICF-2010 is hardly a blameless radio, suffering as it does from third order IM problems in the front end, although I admit they can be reduced to a usable level by switching in the attenuator, or reducing the RF gain. That problem with the Sony is probably not relevant to the situation at hand, so I would think that the fact that you still get the "hashing", even with a synchronous detector, would suggest to you that the problem is not the IBOC system itself, but is either a problem with WOR's transmitter, or your receiver. John From jbyrns@enteract.com Sun Jan 19 12:20:31 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Jan 2003 20:20:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 82017 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2003 20:20:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Jan 2003 20:20:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Jan 2003 20:20:30 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.178] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 19 Jan 2003 20:20:30 -0000 Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 20:20:26 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Carver TX11 Was: Yesterday Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 908 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.208 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Possum Hunter" < possumhunter@n...> wrote: > jbyrns@e... > > Anyone who thinks the TX-11a is a good AM radio is equally full of it. > When I owned a TX-11a, I found the AM section to have several serious > shortcomings. > > They must have fixed these problems by the time the TX-11b hit the stores > because I cannot say a single bad thing about it. I am curious what changes were made between the TX11a and TX11b? Do you know what the changes were, and if they did indeed fix the problems with the TX11a? Did they change the bandwidth in the wide IF mode, and the audio response, to be more closely aligned with the FCC regulations for AM broadcasting? Did they fix the third order IM problems in the AM front end? > Speaking if good AM tuners, Soon, I may have access to a Fanfare tuner. What is the Fanfare's claim to fame, as an AM stereo tuner? John From jbyrns@enteract.com Sun Jan 19 12:24:02 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Jan 2003 20:24:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 44890 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2003 20:24:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Jan 2003 20:24:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Jan 2003 20:24:02 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.142] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 19 Jan 2003 20:24:02 -0000 Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 20:23:58 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: TM-152 better than TX-11a? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <000f01c2bfd6$59a9c500$b9f9bed8@com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2022 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.208 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" < amfmdx@f...> wrote: > ---John Byrne wrote..... > > > > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "amstereorules < > > >amstereorules@m...>" wrote: > > > Whoever beleives that this digital crap sounds better than analog > > > AM heard on a good radio, like the Carver TX-11A , is full of crap. > > > > Anyone who thinks the TX-11a is a good AM radio is equally full of it. > > When I owned a TX-11a, I found the AM section to have several serious > > shortcomings. Even the little Radio Shack TM-152 is a far better AM > > radio. > > > > John > > John, > > Obviously you work for one of the companies that have hitched their wagon to > the fatally flawed use of IBAC on MW [ Adjacent Channel ] because no one on > this list or almost any list would state that a TM-152 is better than a > Carver TX-11a. You obviously hate AM stereo and I have no idea why you are > on this list. I'm not sure by what circuitous route you came to the above conclusions, but they are all wrong. First I don't believe the allocations policies used by the FCC were ever intended to permit adjacent channel reception of the sort you and the other DXers want. Second, I'm on this "list" and I said the TM-152 is better than a Carver TX-11a. Thirdly, I love AM stereo in all the many and varied flavors it has taken over the years. Lastly, IBOC is AM Stereo. > I have NO problem with digital radio, as long as its on another band. In > fact, if I EVER saw or could EVER have a chance to buy a digital radio I > would. My only problem with it is that since its DESTRUCTIVE of what we > currently have and is NOT backwardsly compatible. It NEVER will be > backwardsly compatible so it should be on another band. That wouldn't make > it IBOC though..... It was my understanding that IBOC was specifically designed to be backward compatible, aren't listeners to WOR still able to receive WOR's programming on their existing, non IBOC radios? John From jbyrns@enteract.com Sun Jan 19 12:27:07 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Jan 2003 20:27:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 49338 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2003 20:27:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Jan 2003 20:27:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Jan 2003 20:27:07 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.180] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 19 Jan 2003 20:27:07 -0000 Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 20:27:06 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: TM-152 better than TX-11a? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1780 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.208 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "wgliradio < evergreenterrace@b...>" wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " > wrote: > > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, John wrote: > > > I was about to say I just purchased a TM-152 for $86 on EBay. > > > Please don't tell me it's crap! > > > I actually heard the sound from the TM-152 on the > AMStereoRadio.com site. I thought it sounded great! > > > > > > Don't worry, the TM-152 does sound great, far better than the > famous, > > but flawed Carver TX11a! Don't let all the stuffed shirts, and > snobs, > > fool you, just relax and enjoy a great tuner. The people who > designed > > the TM-152 knew what it takes to make a good sounding AM tuner, > while > > Bob Carver was only obsessed with ideas like flat response to 15 > kHz. > > > > John > > Except that the TM-152 has HPF's because they cannot design the low > end to not interfere with the pilot tone. That is an interesting point in the design of the TM-152, and I don't know the answer to it. Just in the last few weeks someone on another forum claimed that the 25 Hz "pilot" isn't a problem, and that the "HPF" in the TM-152 is unnecessary, and can be removed. I suspect this may be system dependent, with it only being a problem in systems where several other factors come together in A bad way, but I don't really know, and I would like to find the truth to this claim. Also the "HPF" may be an example of the TM-152's designers knowing what they were doing, in addition to reducing the 25 Hz "pilot", the "HPF" may serve the purpose of providing aural balance to the signal. The "HPF" in the TM-152 is an interesting point worthy of more study. John From possumhunter@netzero.net Sun Jan 19 12:28:49 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Jan 2003 20:28:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 74438 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2003 20:28:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Jan 2003 20:28:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.117) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Jan 2003 20:28:49 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 19 Jan 2003 12:28:49 -0800 To: References: <001901c2bff5$21c2c320$827dfea9@home1> Subject: Old Trandmitters Was: IBOC / AM stereo Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 15:28:36 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Jan 2003 20:28:49.0089 (UTC) FILETIME=[5F90EB10:01C2BFF9] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.142.67.183] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Scott Todd wrote: > Dude- let's grab those old transmitters for posterity. Dude-a *VERY* low hours BC1G is getting a new home with me. This bugger even has the ORIGINAL TUBES still in it! I also know where there is a Rockwell/Collins hybrid 1KW. If it goes cheap or for the hauling, I will let the list know. Two boat anchors is enough for me to play with. I will be more than happy to help somebody load up a transmitter near me. Speaking of old transmitters, anybody on the list know where to buy UV-862 water cooled tubes? How bad is the price? Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Sun Jan 19 12:32:53 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Jan 2003 20:32:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 98836 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2003 20:32:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Jan 2003 20:32:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.80) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Jan 2003 20:32:52 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 19 Jan 2003 12:32:52 -0800 To: References: <69.3386f7b5.2b5b899f@aol.com> <001d01c2bff5$e370abe0$827dfea9@home1> Subject: Re: {AMSF} It's the programming... Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 15:32:40 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Jan 2003 20:32:52.0370 (UTC) FILETIME=[F092A720:01C2BFF9] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.142.67.183] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Scott Todd wrote: >So much of what is characterized as "hate radio" is little more than talkmeisters who have a contrary opinion to the prevailing wisdom. Yea, I myself have been accused of broadcasting "hate radio" because of some of my oprinons I have broadcasted. Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Sun Jan 19 12:38:51 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Jan 2003 20:38:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 33845 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2003 20:38:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Jan 2003 20:38:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.198) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Jan 2003 20:38:50 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 19 Jan 2003 12:38:50 -0800 To: References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030119125302.03a0c8e0@pop.GameBox.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: New file uploaded to amstereoforum Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 15:38:38 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Jan 2003 20:38:50.0637 (UTC) FILETIME=[C61DDBD0:01C2BFFA] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.142.67.183] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 John wrote: >Ware can one purchase 12 inches and radio edit's on vinyl? There is a plant in Nashville that presses vinyl for DJs and Jukebox services. Ask your local Jukebox company where they get their 45s. I have seen 45s and 12" Singles in several record stores. If you don't have any luck locally, call Gene at Horizon Music in Greenville, SC. He can find ANYTHING! Kevin From stodd@sherbtel.net Sun Jan 19 12:40:55 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Jan 2003 20:40:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 57338 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2003 20:40:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Jan 2003 20:40:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Jan 2003 20:40:55 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-94.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.94]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h0JKeobg024947 for ; Sun, 19 Jan 2003 14:40:52 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <007f01c2bffb$3d8f6760$827dfea9@home1> To: Subject: OT- relaquering a Dynaco Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 14:42:08 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit The only reason I'm posting this OT here is because it seems a lot of you are into vintage hi-fi gear. I've got a Dynaco FM-1 Dynatuner that needs the front panel relaquered. It had a nasty blemish below the tuning eye window, and a few minor ones around the tuning knob. But to get rid of the blemishes, I created shiny spots and had to scrub all the old laquer off, and now the panel needs a new coating. Anyone know what I could use to get it back to its original color? I want to put it on ebay when I'm done in order to finance a trip to pick up a vintage transmitter in SD. ST [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From stodd@sherbtel.net Sun Jan 19 12:49:34 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Jan 2003 20:49:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 50371 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2003 20:49:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Jan 2003 20:49:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Jan 2003 20:49:34 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-94.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.94]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h0JKnUbg026492 for ; Sun, 19 Jan 2003 14:49:31 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <009701c2bffc$7365a420$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <001901c2bff5$21c2c320$827dfea9@home1> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Old Trandmitters Was: IBOC / AM stereo Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 14:50:47 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude They'd be EXTREMELY expensive new, though I suspect a few are still kicking around since some very old transmitters are still in use down in Mexico and South America. Better to get them rebuilt. I think Econco may still do these old jugs. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Possum Hunter" > Speaking of old transmitters, anybody on the list know where to buy UV-862 > water cooled tubes? How bad is the price? From possumhunter@netzero.net Sun Jan 19 13:24:22 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: possumhunter@netzero.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Jan 2003 21:24:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 95131 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2003 21:24:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Jan 2003 21:24:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rly-ip06.mx.aol.com) (205.188.156.51) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Jan 2003 21:24:20 -0000 Received: from logs-wq.proxy.aol.com (logs-wq.proxy.aol.com [205.188.200.132]) by rly-ip06.mx.aol.com (v89.10) with ESMTP id RELAYIN2-0119162403; Sun, 19 Jan 2003 16:24:03 -0500 Received: from ibm (AC8E43B7.ipt.aol.com [172.142.67.183]) by logs-wq.proxy.aol.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with SMTP id h0JL5Kv0325224 for ; Sun, 19 Jan 2003 16:05:21 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <00ce01c2bffe$74425da0$4490b498@aoldsl.net> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Carver TX11 Was: Yesterday Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 16:05:08 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Apparently-From: DodgeRamTrucker@aol.com From: "Possum Hunter" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 jbyrns@enteract.com wrote: > I am curious what changes were made between the TX11a and TX11b? Do you know what the changes were, and if they did indeed fix the problems with the TX11a? I have never owned a TX11a, but I did own a TX11. The FM was MUCH improved from the TX11 to the TX11b. > > Did they change the bandwidth in the wide IF mode, and the audio response, to be more closely aligned with the FCC regulations for AM broadcasting? My TX11b was flat out to about 16Khz. The de emphasis was more closely matched to the old Optimod curve. You have to remember these tuners were made long before NRSC was the rule. It can be made to follow the NRSC standards. > > Did they fix the third order IM problems in the AM front end? Mine had no such problem, so they must have. > > What is the Fanfare's claim to fame, as an AM stereo tuner? The Fanfare FTA-100 is the only state-of-the art, AMAX-compliant, AM-stereo tuner being manufactured anywhere in the world. it uses the Motorola Symphony chip and has flat audio response following the NRSC curve from 25 Hz to 10Khz. I have played with Fanfare FM tuners, they are astounding. I am sure the AM tuner is too! Kevin From amfmdx@fastq.com Sun Jan 19 13:33:50 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Jan 2003 21:33:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 48185 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2003 21:33:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Jan 2003 21:33:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Jan 2003 21:33:49 -0000 Received: from fastq (d208-osel-phx.fastq.com [207.173.146.197]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id h0JLXmP60359 for ; Sun, 19 Jan 2003 14:33:48 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <003701c2c002$67446b80$c592adcf@com> To: References: <1043008856.1199.57343.m2@yahoogroups.com> Subject: IBOC is NOT AM or stereo. Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 14:33:01 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > I'm not sure by what circuitous route you came to the above > conclusions, but they are all wrong. First I don't believe the > allocations policies used by the FCC were ever intended to permit > adjacent channel reception of the sort you and the other DXers want. John, Ever is a very large word. If this was not the ORIGINAL intent, then why were at one time Clear Channel frequencies protected with only one station on the frequency? I believe that in this case, EVER is too big for you to back up. > Lastly, IBOC is AM Stereo. As IBOC exists today, it is NOT stereo according to Tom Ray at WOR and it is NOT AM. It is a digital transmission on the Medium band. AM is strictly an analog transmission scheme. > It was my understanding that IBOC was specifically designed to be > backward compatible, aren't listeners to WOR still able to receive > WOR's programming on their existing, non IBOC radios? Are you trying to tell me that if a station went totally digital that the listeners on analog radios would be able to receive and decode the digital signal? Surely you aren't saying this are you? Presently people listening to WOR on analog get a diminished analog product due to the extremely constricted bandwidth to allow the IBAC sidebands to destroy signals people can hear presently. I can't understand why the government and industry would not go more for E-147 and let the MW stations fade out and then once people made the switch to E-147 change the MW stations to digital. IBOC is very destructive to all signals on analog MW. Kevin Mesa, Arizona From dav259@csiro.au Sun Jan 19 14:12:29 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Jan 2003 22:12:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 98465 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2003 22:12:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Jan 2003 22:12:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Jan 2003 22:12:27 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0JMCPP18484 for ; Mon, 20 Jan 2003 09:12:25 +1100 (EST) Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 09:12:25 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC / AM stereo In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public On Sun, 19 Jan 2003, Possum Hunter wrote: > Now I admit that it would sound real cool to have stereo mikes set up at > ball games to sound like you are there, but the fact is NOBODY that I have > ever seen uses a stereo feed for sports, Stereo station or not! 3MMM-FM broadcasts our Aussie Rules footy in stereo. The crowd effects mikes pick up some wonderful atmosphere. 3AW (stereo) and 3LO (mono) don't bother. From possumhunter@netzero.net Sun Jan 19 14:29:51 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Jan 2003 22:29:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 65642 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2003 22:29:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Jan 2003 22:29:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.89) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Jan 2003 22:29:51 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 19 Jan 2003 14:29:51 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC / AM stereo Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 17:29:38 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Jan 2003 22:29:51.0157 (UTC) FILETIME=[48188E50:01C2C00A] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.142.67.183] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 jbyrns@enteract.com wrote: >What is the Fanfare's claim to fame? At least one of their products is, shall we say not too good. What Fanfare product do you not like? Kevin From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Jan 19 15:13:08 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Jan 2003 23:13:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 62219 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2003 23:13:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Jan 2003 23:13:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Jan 2003 23:13:08 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.177] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 19 Jan 2003 23:13:07 -0000 Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 23:13:03 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: TM-152 better than TX-11a? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1622 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.96.138 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Also the "HPF" may be an example of the TM-152's designers knowing > what they were doing, in addition to reducing the 25 Hz "pilot", > the "HPF" may serve the purpose of providing aural balance to the > signal. Quite a few AM Stereo tuners from the 1980s noticeably reduce the low bass response, and I believe it was mostly related to the Harris AM Stereo system. Harris used 200 Hz high-pass filters in the L-R component in their exciters, because at least for the first few years of development, their pilot tone was a game of musical chairs, ranging from 25 Hz to over 100 Hz and anywhere inbetween. Thus, at the higher end of this range, in the receiver the pilot tone might be audible as a constant background hum, so it was common for multi-system radios, such as from Sony, to high-pass the bass response. Then, once Harris moved their pilot town down to 25 Hz, this made it "compatible" with C-Quam-only radios (such as the TM-152), but at the expense of higher distortion, and perhaps in order to reduce the apparent amount of this distortion, radio makers responded by using similar high-pass filters to cut out the low bass response, usually below 80 or 100 Hz. Nowadays, with C-Quam as the standard and other systems no longer a consideration, the TM-152 sounds much better if you bypass its audio output circuitry and use the direct, unfiltered outputs of its MC13020 C-Quam decoder chip. This is as easy to do as make a few snips with wire cutters and then solder in two pieces of wire. You'll get an instant improvement in low bass response, and even the treble seems better. From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sun Jan 19 15:21:02 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Jan 2003 23:21:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 15811 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2003 23:21:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Jan 2003 23:21:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Jan 2003 23:21:02 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.184] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 19 Jan 2003 23:21:01 -0000 Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 23:21:00 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: TM-152 better than TX-11a? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 1049 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.231 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " wrote: >=20 > Also the "HPF" may be an example of the TM-152's designers knowing=20 > what they were doing, in addition to reducing the 25 Hz "pilot", the=20 > "HPF" may serve the purpose of providing aural balance to the signal. >=20 > The "HPF" in the TM-152 is an interesting point worthy of more study. >=20 > John The human ear hears a balanced response in the LF to HF ratio. Early speaker designers used a number that was the product of the LF & HF cutoffs. Ex: 35Hz x 15KHz =3D 525000. With this number the LF & HF cutoff for the 70Hz HPF used in the TM-152 is 7.5KHz which is about all you can get out of the =B14.5KHz ceramic filter including the stations NRSC pre-emphasis. It appears the HPF is use to keep it from sounding too bassy without enough highs and not to suppress the 25Hz pilot tone. Of the decoders I have built I don't use a HPF to remove the pilot and on must speaker systems there is enough attenuation at this frequency to make it a moot issue. JSG From narkspud@hotmail.com Sun Jan 19 15:23:48 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: narkspud@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Jan 2003 23:23:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 57636 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2003 23:23:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Jan 2003 23:23:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.75) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Jan 2003 23:23:47 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.175] by n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 19 Jan 2003 23:23:47 -0000 Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 23:23:44 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: OT: laser turntable Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20030119125302.03a0c8e0@pop.GameBox.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 616 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "narkspud " X-Originating-IP: 67.89.146.146 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=81956306 X-Yahoo-Profile: narkspud > Simply put, I'm still trying to convince my parents to get me a lazar turntable. > Not much can beat the Techniques Sl-1200. Ixnay on the laser turntable. Unless you know something that I don't, the only working version runs well into five figures, and all the independent reviews for it have been very negative. Seems its high frequency response is dreadful, and scratches and foreign stuff in the grooves tend to cause loud amp-blowing pops, even after the record's been machine-cleaned. For five figures you should be able to get a conventional turntable rig that sounds even better than reality. From jon@kenneke.com Sun Jan 19 15:24:24 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jon@kenneke.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Jan 2003 23:24:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 51213 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2003 23:24:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Jan 2003 23:24:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO kenneke.com) (65.103.64.194) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Jan 2003 23:24:24 -0000 Received: from localhost (jon@localhost) by kenneke.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0JNON027980 for ; Sun, 19 Jan 2003 15:24:23 -0800 Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 15:24:23 -0800 (PST) To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: TM-152 better than TX-11a? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: jon X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=77819664 X-Yahoo-Profile: jonkenneke That's very interesting. I'll have to "fix" my TM-152. Any specifics on where to snip, and jumper? Or, should I not be lazy and look at the schematic? :-) I imagine fidelity is improved across the board by removing the filter. The circuitry introduces phase differences based on frequency, and all that. Also probably has a roll-off at a high frequency somewhere. Jon > Nowadays, with C-Quam as the standard and other systems no longer a > consideration, the TM-152 sounds much better if you bypass its audio > output circuitry and use the direct, unfiltered outputs of its > MC13020 C-Quam decoder chip. This is as easy to do as make a few > snips with wire cutters and then solder in two pieces of wire. > You'll get an instant improvement in low bass response, and even the > treble seems better. > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > -- Jon Kenneke KA7PGB Kenneke Communications PO Box 3126 - Albany, OR 97321-0702 http://www.kenneke.com Radio Takena KTK - http://www.radiotakena.com From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sun Jan 19 15:40:32 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Jan 2003 23:40:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 44635 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2003 23:40:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Jan 2003 23:40:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.69) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Jan 2003 23:40:32 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.181] by n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 19 Jan 2003 23:40:31 -0000 Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 23:40:30 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: IBOC is NOT AM or stereo. Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <003701c2c002$67446b80$c592adcf@com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1094 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.231 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" wrote: > > I can't understand why the government and industry would not go more for > E-147 and let the MW stations fade out and then once people made the switch > to E-147 change the MW stations to digital. IBOC is very destructive to all > signals on analog MW. > > Kevin > Mesa, Arizona Better yet let the AM band become the community non-profit band. It is about 1.2MHz(.025% or less) of the total radio spectrum, less than 1/4 of a NTSC channel. It is plagued with noise from skywave and requires expensive antenna farms. I can't see why anyone would want to implement a digital system in this frequency range. It may be cheaper initially to use the existing antenna system but most stations will require new transmitters and down the road antenna maintenance and land costs will add up in the long run. It would be a good time the abandon this frequency range for an area above 30KHz where interference isn't an issue and implement a digital only system that has no backward compatibility issues. JSG From jbyrns@enteract.com Sun Jan 19 15:47:26 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 19 Jan 2003 23:47:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 73094 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2003 23:47:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Jan 2003 23:47:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Jan 2003 23:47:25 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.184] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 19 Jan 2003 23:47:20 -0000 Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 23:47:17 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Old Trandmitters Was: IBOC / AM stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 370 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.98.220 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Possum Hunter" < possumhunter@n...> wrote: > > Speaking of old transmitters, anybody on the list know where to buy UV-862 > water cooled tubes? How bad is the price? Good luck finding UV-862's, they have long since been obsolete. I understand even NBC had to have them handmade by RCA to keep their transmitters going. John From fanfare@globility.com Sun Jan 19 16:00:43 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Jan 2003 00:00:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 84659 invoked from network); 20 Jan 2003 00:00:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Jan 2003 00:00:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.86) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Jan 2003 00:00:42 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.172] by n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 20 Jan 2003 00:00:35 -0000 Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 00:00:34 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: OT: laser turntable Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 599 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Marv Southcott " X-Originating-IP: 64.56.235.80 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy On the subject of vinyl, most record cleaning machines use an alcohol/water compound. Cleans well, but leaves the grooves so clean they're often "squeaky". One product I've found that gets around that problem is a stylus treatment called LAST (liquid archival stylus treatment). This product works wonders. It's like spraying the stylus and the record with WD40. Most of the noise is removed, with the exception of that being generated by particles still in the grooves. They also have a very good, 2-part, record cleaning kit You can learn more at http://www.lastfactory.com/ Cheers, M. From jbyrns@enteract.com Sun Jan 19 16:02:07 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Jan 2003 00:02:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 87368 invoked from network); 20 Jan 2003 00:02:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Jan 2003 00:02:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Jan 2003 00:02:04 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.174] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 20 Jan 2003 00:02:04 -0000 Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 00:02:02 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: IBOC is NOT AM or stereo. Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <003701c2c002$67446b80$c592adcf@com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2389 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.98.220 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" < amfmdx@f...> wrote: > > I'm not sure by what circuitous route you came to the above > > conclusions, but they are all wrong. First I don't believe the > > allocations policies used by the FCC were ever intended to permit > > adjacent channel reception of the sort you and the other DXers want. > > John, > > Ever is a very large word. If this was not the ORIGINAL intent, then why > were at one time Clear Channel frequencies protected with only one station > on the frequency? I believe that in this case, EVER is too big for you to > back up. Kevin, I think you need to read a little more carefully, I said "adjacent channel", not co channel. And I am talking about adjacent channel reception in the area of relatively strong adjacent channel signals. > > Lastly, IBOC is AM Stereo. > > As IBOC exists today, it is NOT stereo according to Tom Ray at WOR And did he claim it isn't on tne menu? > and it is NOT AM. Nor are any of the so called "AM Stereo" systems actually AM. > It is a digital transmission on the Medium band. AM is strictly an > analog transmission scheme. That's a new one on me, I've seen plenty of AM systems used to transmit digital signals over the years, now you tell me it never really worked. > > It was my understanding that IBOC was specifically designed to be > > backward compatible, aren't listeners to WOR still able to receive > > WOR's programming on their existing, non IBOC radios? > > Are you trying to tell me that if a station went totally digital that the > listeners on analog radios would be able to receive and decode the digital > signal? Surely you aren't saying this are you? No, I'm not saying that, if a station went totally digital, then there would be no backward compatibility, but by that time all the analog only radios will be in landfills. > Presently people listening to WOR on analog get a diminished analog product > due to the extremely constricted bandwidth to allow the IBAC sidebands to > destroy signals people can hear presently. > > I can't understand why the government and industry would not go more for > E-147 and let the MW stations fade out and then once people made the switch > to E-147 change the MW stations to digital. IBOC is very destructive to all > signals on analog MW. There are several good reasons for that. John From bjackson@indyradio.com Sun Jan 19 16:10:01 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Jan 2003 00:10:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 15159 invoked from network); 20 Jan 2003 00:10:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Jan 2003 00:10:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Jan 2003 00:10:00 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.162] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 20 Jan 2003 00:10:00 -0000 Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 00:09:57 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Yesterday Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3654 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923 " X-Originating-IP: 216.132.129.192 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " wrote: > 1.) The TX11a is very noisy when using the small aperiodic AM loop > antenna that was supplied with the tuner. There is a large amount of > internally generated hiss on all but the local 50 kW flame throwers. > Add a better antenna to solve the hiss problem, and we have problem > #2. Rule #1...Never use the cheap (yes, even with Carver I say cheap) antennas they throw in with tuners. > 2.) The front end of the TX11a is subject to third order IM problems, > especially if a better antenna, than the small aperiodic loop supplied > with the tuner, is used to cure the hiss problem. For example, I have > nearby 50 kW stations on 670 kHz, and 720 kHz, which create a third > order IM product in the TX11a on 620 kHz. At the time I owned the > TX11a, I used to like to listen to a station on 620 kHz, which was > wiped out by the TX11a circuitry. The 620 station is now only 42 > miles distant, although when I owned the TX11a, I think the old > transmitter site was about 60 miles away, and the power was lower, > although the daytime field strength was greater than it is now, from > the current transmitter site. > I, personaly, have *never* had this problem. Not when I lived in Columbus, IN...Not in Bloomington, not here in Indy. I'm not saying it didn't happen to you, but I've never experienced it. > 3.) This one is a matter of opinion and taste, but the excess high > frequency audio response of the TX11a made my ears bleed. Yes the > TX11a was fairly flat out to 15 kHz, neglecting the 10 kHz notch, as > Bob Carver promised, but what was the point? There was also a ****** snip ********* I think the tx-11a was made before stations were limited to 10khz. When I lived in Columbus, 1010 WCSI was a great hot AC station...With measureable response out to at least 15khz. Maybe more...I've dubbed some old airchecks into Cool Edit 2000 and there seems to be some activity up to at least 18khz, but that may be tape hiss. > I'm not familiar with the TX11b, hopefully it fixed some of the > problems with the TX11a? Tell me abut the TX11b, how does it differ > from the TX11a? The tx-11b, I believe, had a 10khz cutoff...I only saw it in Ovation...Never upgraded from my a model, though. > It's probably been at least 15 years since I sold my TX11a, I must > confess that I don't remember that it had an AM "noise reduction" > circuit, but then if "noise reduction" was necessary on an AM station, > I wouldn't be listening to it in the first place. I do remember that > the TX11a had a weird FM noise suppression system, another strange > idea that was incorporated in the TX11a. It has the FM noise supression, as well as AM NR. From what I can tell, it may just cut off the high end. I also run my entire audio chain through a DNR filter, as well as an Aphex Dominator/compellor, though. > > > No offense, but with some of the comments you've posted (pro-IBOC > > wishy-washy digital and now this), have you had your ears checked > > lately? ;-) > > This is the "AM-Stereo" group isn't it? IBOC is AM-Stereo for the new > millennium. I'm not sure what you mean by the "wishy-washy digital" > part? IBOC, as of now, is *not* stereo. The "wishy-washy" part is the horrid digital compression artifacts and the fake treble...That new song...I think it's called "A Thousand Miles" sounds like crap coming out of DadPro on an analog station...Just imagine how it'll sound when you re-compress it in IBOC... -Bradley Jackson -Susquehanna, Indianapolis -WGLD/WGRL/WFMS From davidcoons@webtv.net Sun Jan 19 16:19:36 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: davidcoons@webtv.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Jan 2003 00:19:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 40632 invoked from network); 20 Jan 2003 00:19:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Jan 2003 00:19:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO smtpout-2001-3.public.lawson.webtv.net) (209.240.212.83) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Jan 2003 00:19:35 -0000 Received: from storefull-2318.public.lawson.webtv.net (lawson-public-ipmux-1-pip-8.public.lawson.webtv.net [209.240.212.99]) by smtpout-2001-3.public.lawson.webtv.net (WebTV_Postfix+sws) with ESMTP id 9A432BE9C for ; Sun, 19 Jan 2003 16:19:35 -0800 (PST) Received: (from production@localhost) by storefull-2318.public.lawson.webtv.net (8.8.8-wtv-f/mt.gso.26Feb98) id QAA17694; Sun, 19 Jan 2003 16:19:35 -0800 (PST) X-WebTV-Signature: 1 ETAsAhQGn3RDK04WiNeKNnEmAyX6fxeEsgIUJ6zD6QVlO1Kkr4QRtk0HZ2IdYl4= Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 19:19:34 -0500 (EST) To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Carver TX11 Was: Yesterday Message-ID: <29756-3E2B4096-2761@storefull-2318.public.lawson.webtv.net> In-Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" 's message of Sun, 19 Jan 2003 16:05:08 -0500 Content-Disposition: Inline Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) X-eGroups-From: davidcoons@webtv.net (David Coons) From: davidcoons@webtv.net X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10533228 the tx 11b is simply the tx 11a with a later generation decoder From rwagoner@cox.net Sun Jan 19 16:26:22 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner@cox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Jan 2003 00:26:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 54923 invoked from network); 20 Jan 2003 00:26:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Jan 2003 00:26:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO fed1mtao04.cox.net) (68.6.19.241) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Jan 2003 00:26:20 -0000 Received: from cox.net ([68.4.33.253]) by fed1mtao04.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20030120002620.JGIW21863.fed1mtao04.cox.net@cox.net> for ; Sun, 19 Jan 2003 19:26:20 -0500 Message-ID: <3E2B422B.6070704@cox.net> Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 16:26:19 -0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20021120 Netscape/7.01 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC is NOT AM or stereo. References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Richard Wagoner X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public > Nor are any of the so called "AM Stereo" systems actually AM. Huh? I must have missed something there. I didn't realize that AM stereo systems don't use amplitude modulation any more. From davidcoons@webtv.net Sun Jan 19 16:28:57 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: davidcoons@webtv.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Jan 2003 00:28:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 58299 invoked from network); 20 Jan 2003 00:28:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Jan 2003 00:28:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO smtpout-2001-5.public.lawson.webtv.net) (209.240.213.210) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Jan 2003 00:28:56 -0000 Received: from storefull-2318.public.lawson.webtv.net (storefull-2318.private.lawson.webtv.net [172.16.212.226]) by smtpout-2001-5.public.lawson.webtv.net (WebTV_Postfix+sws) with ESMTP id 68CC9BFBE for ; Sun, 19 Jan 2003 16:28:56 -0800 (PST) Received: (from production@localhost) by storefull-2318.public.lawson.webtv.net (8.8.8-wtv-f/mt.gso.26Feb98) id QAA18057; Sun, 19 Jan 2003 16:28:50 -0800 (PST) X-WebTV-Signature: 1 ETAsAhRVq/AMitS3w9Smc1s9Ws3Q2N74uwIUQYnfK2OHLbCSG6KEBj+ehhF5U6g= Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 19:28:50 -0500 (EST) To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC is NOT AM or stereo. Message-ID: <29755-3E2B42C2-3718@storefull-2318.public.lawson.webtv.net> In-Reply-To: Richard Wagoner 's message of Sun, 19 Jan 2003 16:26:19 -0800 Content-Disposition: Inline Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) X-eGroups-From: davidcoons@webtv.net (David Coons) From: davidcoons@webtv.net X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10533228 they dont..the stereo information is phase or frequency..." fm stereo" however uses am for its stereo info From rwagoner@cox.net Sun Jan 19 16:31:03 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner@cox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Jan 2003 00:31:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 69258 invoked from network); 20 Jan 2003 00:31:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Jan 2003 00:31:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO fed1mtao03.cox.net) (68.6.19.242) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Jan 2003 00:31:03 -0000 Received: from cox.net ([68.4.33.253]) by fed1mtao03.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20030120003102.JKHP28517.fed1mtao03.cox.net@cox.net> for ; Sun, 19 Jan 2003 19:31:02 -0500 Message-ID: <3E2B4346.9070804@cox.net> Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 16:31:02 -0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20021120 Netscape/7.01 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Carver TX11 Was: Yesterday References: <29756-3E2B4096-2761@storefull-2318.public.lawson.webtv.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Richard Wagoner X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public > The tx-11b, I believe, had a 10khz cutoff Not according to the specs, showing flat to 15K. I am curious about the de-emphasis. How different (other than the 10K NRSC cutoff) is the TX11a and TX11b deemphasis? I always thought the TX11b sounded better than just about everything else, especially when stations actually prcess cleanly (rare, actually, but great when done). Richard From n0uiheric@aol.com Sun Jan 19 16:31:23 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Jan 2003 00:31:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 65157 invoked from network); 20 Jan 2003 00:31:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Jan 2003 00:31:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r06.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.102) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Jan 2003 00:31:22 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-r06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.1c8.3c166ee (16930) for ; Sun, 19 Jan 2003 19:31:19 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1c8.3c166ee.2b5c9d57@aol.com> Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 19:31:19 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} 1-watt AM station for sale... only $2 million! To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih This 50 kW station is DIRECTIONAL away from Rochester, and didn't suffer from jamming until the USIA put Radio Marti on the frequency. Not only is Radio Marti jammed on 1180, but also on all shortwave frequencies. I used to get it with a local-like signal on it's daytime SW frequency of 13820 kHz before Cuba started switching on jammers transmitting bubble-style sound effects. WHAM would be better off going directional toward New England at night. If I had owned the station, I would have gone directional at night away from Newburgh, and find a way for both WGAB and co-channel WLDS Jacksonville, IL to go full-time on 1180. Either that or moving Radio Marti to a very directional X-band signal. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Sun Jan 19 16:31:28 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Jan 2003 00:31:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 22989 invoked from network); 20 Jan 2003 00:31:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Jan 2003 00:31:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r07.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.103) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Jan 2003 00:31:27 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-r07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.64.2b5de7c9 (16930) for ; Sun, 19 Jan 2003 19:31:21 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <64.2b5de7c9.2b5c9d59@aol.com> Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 19:31:21 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} The Oz Report ... programming ... and other things To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih Jay, that one is KIRL 1460 St. Charles, MO. The owner is Bill White (the former President of the National League and former St. Louis Cardinals first baseman). It is a 5 kW daytimer; it's 500-watt nighttime array is currently silent. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Sun Jan 19 16:31:28 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Jan 2003 00:31:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 41767 invoked from network); 20 Jan 2003 00:31:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Jan 2003 00:31:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r07.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.103) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Jan 2003 00:31:28 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-r07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.1d4.4439ba (16930) for ; Sun, 19 Jan 2003 19:31:20 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1d4.4439ba.2b5c9d58@aol.com> Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 19:31:20 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} New file uploaded to amstereoforum To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih The 120-meter band (2300-2500 kHz) is largely unused. But, an operator on 2490 kHz would have to provide protection to WWV's 2500 kHz signal from Fort Collins, CO and/or WWVH's signal on that same frequency from Kekaha, Kauai, HI. 60 meters is now largely unused in the Americas; 90 meters still has some broadcasters on the air there (like Radio Cultural on 3300 kHz from Guatemala or Nashville's WWCR on 3210 kHz). 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Sun Jan 19 16:31:32 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Jan 2003 00:31:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 65504 invoked from network); 20 Jan 2003 00:31:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Jan 2003 00:31:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r04.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.100) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Jan 2003 00:31:31 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-r04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.1da.4417b9 (16930) for ; Sun, 19 Jan 2003 19:31:18 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1da.4417b9.2b5c9d56@aol.com> Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 19:31:18 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} The Oz Report ... programming ... and other things To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih Format is Adult Standards. They may have considered AM Stereo when they ran Classic Country as WIL, but that probably went by the wayside when the station flipped to Adult Standards in 1990 (still as WIL). The calls were changed to WRTH in 1991. I have a Web address: try http://www.1430wrth.com/ Bonneville owns the station, along with WIL 92.3 (Country), WVRV 101.1 (Adult Alternative) and WSSM 106.5 (Smooth Jazz). The snail-mail address I have for WEW is: Variety 77 WEW Attention: Vern Jackson 2740 Hampton Avenue St. Louis, MO 63139 "Carbon copy" letters can be addressed to Rich Vannoy. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From davidcoons@webtv.net Sun Jan 19 16:51:42 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: davidcoons@webtv.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Jan 2003 00:51:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 55448 invoked from network); 20 Jan 2003 00:51:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Jan 2003 00:51:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO smtpout-2001-4.public.lawson.webtv.net) (209.240.213.209) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Jan 2003 00:51:40 -0000 Received: from storefull-2318.public.lawson.webtv.net (storefull-2318.private.lawson.webtv.net [172.16.212.226]) by smtpout-2001-4.public.lawson.webtv.net (WebTV_Postfix+sws) with ESMTP id 4B799BE49 for ; Sun, 19 Jan 2003 16:51:40 -0800 (PST) Received: (from production@localhost) by storefull-2318.public.lawson.webtv.net (8.8.8-wtv-f/mt.gso.26Feb98) id QAA18972; Sun, 19 Jan 2003 16:51:39 -0800 (PST) X-WebTV-Signature: 1 ETAsAhQTXq2j4ZWvVFlID+d188/aqbv0LAIUGg35dhJVmy7iNQNrYk7OM7j49Kc= Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 19:51:39 -0500 (EST) To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} It's the programming... Message-ID: <29752-3E2B481B-7183@storefull-2318.public.lawson.webtv.net> In-Reply-To: "Scott Todd" 's message of Sun, 19 Jan 2003 14:03:49 -0600 Content-Disposition: Inline Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) X-eGroups-From: davidcoons@webtv.net (David Coons) From: davidcoons@webtv.net X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10533228 and when you say talk radio "attacks"everyone and anyone ,you are by definition "attacking" talk radio hosts...simply because you dont agree with their views..free dialogue freinds is esential to liberty.lets not call anothers opinion "hate" when we dont like it. lets be glad we have the feedom expresion..and lets have more of the tolerance the left claims to want. From jbyrns@enteract.com Sun Jan 19 17:00:11 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Jan 2003 01:00:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 22649 invoked from network); 20 Jan 2003 01:00:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Jan 2003 01:00:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Jan 2003 01:00:10 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.160] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 20 Jan 2003 01:00:10 -0000 Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 01:00:08 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: IBOC / AM stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 353 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.155 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Possum Hunter" < possumhunter@n...> wrote: > jbyrns@e... wrote: > >What is the Fanfare's claim to fame? At least one of their products is, > shall we say not too good. > > What Fanfare product do you not like? The FM whip antenna, which doesn't even come close to a simple folded dipole in performance. John From droach@direct.ca Sun Jan 19 17:02:06 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: droach@direct.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Jan 2003 01:02:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 75975 invoked from network); 20 Jan 2003 01:02:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Jan 2003 01:02:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO priv-edtnes12-hme0.telusplanet.net) (199.185.220.222) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Jan 2003 01:02:05 -0000 Received: from dan.direct.ca ([64.180.122.175]) by priv-edtnes12-hme0.telusplanet.net (InterMail vM.5.01.05.17 201-253-122-126-117-20021021) with ESMTP id <20030120010201.XVNB12329.priv-edtnes12-hme0.telusplanet.net@dan.direct.ca> for ; Sun, 19 Jan 2003 18:02:01 -0700 Message-Id: <5.1.0.14.1.20030119170431.030b7d90@mail.direct.ca> X-Sender: droach@direct.ca@mail.direct.ca X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 17:05:18 -0800 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Carver TX11 Was: Yesterday In-Reply-To: <29756-3E2B4096-2761@storefull-2318.public.lawson.webtv.net > References: <"Possum Hunter" Mime-Version: 1.0 From: Dan Roach X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=75892843 X-Yahoo-Profile: rastadudeca Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Actually, that is not correct. The TX 11b is an NRSC compliant TX 11a. Unable to find any other difference in the schematics. Definitely both versions use the 13020 decoder. At 07:19 PM 1/19/03 -0500, you wrote: >the tx 11b is simply the tx 11a with a later generation decoder > > >Yahoo! Groups Sponsor >ADVERTISEMENT >107171a.jpg > >1071752.jpg > >Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the >Yahoo! Terms of Service. ---------- Dan Roach S.W.Davis Broadcast Technical Services 200-1543 Venables St Vancouver, BC V5L 2G8 Tel 604 255 2200 Fax 604 255 4083 droach@direct.ca [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From groucho@skyweb.net Sun Jan 19 17:02:50 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Jan 2003 01:02:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 99566 invoked from network); 20 Jan 2003 01:02:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Jan 2003 01:02:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Jan 2003 01:02:50 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (tc1-58.skyweb.net [66.6.130.186]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h0K1Alup037728 for ; Sun, 19 Jan 2003 20:10:47 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3E2B4915.84974ACC@skyweb.net> Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 19:55:49 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Yesterday References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 > Hello John I never Owned a Carver TX11a so I wont Comment on it except that Bob Carver must have found problems and redesigned it To Become the TX11b of which I do own one. since You really don't Know Me and I don't know You. I will let you know that Besides my background as a CE for an AM stereo station I am also a fairly well know Audio Engineer. In Both The Live and Recording Industry. I would consider myself as One who Has a Good set Of Ears. I have done live sound for many well know Entertainers. and many albums to my credit. I still do some touring ,but not Like I used to. I have heard IBOC directly From Ibiquity... not just the stuff from the WOR samples.. The TX11b is IMO probably one of the better if not the Best AM stereo receiver I have heard yet. and I do own several different AM Stereo receivers. IBOC may Be good On another spectrum. It may work On FM? sofar I have Not heard it On FM ,and I know they are testing In My market so To me that's a good sign.... However It sound not be used on the AM band In its present form.. Yes the FCC approved It. however daytime Only and for Night Testing with special permission. As I see It.. Unless Ibiquity gets It act together I don't see IBOC working Unless the FCC mandates all Digital On the MW band. and the 200+million AM radios Out there are Tossed Into Dumpsters.and replaced with 100% MW digital radios... I for One would giveup My Analog MW receiver for an IBOC receiver If Ibiquity takes It as a trade in Only... I wont Be Forced To buy one,and I cannot See Ibiquity replacing the Millions of analog receivers Out there.. I see this picture of Analog radios becoming Obsolete Because the FCC mandates IBOC only. and The Consumers joining in a class action lawsuit. against Ibiquity to replace their radios at Ibiquitys expense... As For XM.. is On a totally different spectrum and you not Forced to have it its your choice the Consumer... End of My rant For Now... had to get that off My chest.. but the blond is staying LOL... Neal > > > This is the "AM-Stereo" group isn't it? IBOC is AM-Stereo for the new > millennium. I'm not sure what you mean by the "wishy-washy digital" > part? My hearing was seriously damaged by my TX11a, and in any case I > have never claimed to be a "Golden Eared" Audiophile. > > John > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From davidcoons@webtv.net Sun Jan 19 17:04:07 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: davidcoons@webtv.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Jan 2003 01:04:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 33631 invoked from network); 20 Jan 2003 01:04:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Jan 2003 01:04:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO smtpout-2001-4.public.lawson.webtv.net) (209.240.213.209) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Jan 2003 01:04:06 -0000 Received: from storefull-2318.public.lawson.webtv.net (storefull-2318.private.lawson.webtv.net [172.16.212.226]) by smtpout-2001-4.public.lawson.webtv.net (WebTV_Postfix+sws) with ESMTP id A05A2BE3B for ; Sun, 19 Jan 2003 17:04:06 -0800 (PST) Received: (from production@localhost) by storefull-2318.public.lawson.webtv.net (8.8.8-wtv-f/mt.gso.26Feb98) id RAA19353; Sun, 19 Jan 2003 17:04:06 -0800 (PST) X-WebTV-Signature: 1 ETAuAhUAvy1h4T4yi8/YJrfV4IJmws+4WGkCFQCf6OCdPeaBKq6TbY074ED3Mc2xXQ== Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 20:04:05 -0500 (EST) To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Carver TX11 Was: Yesterday Message-ID: <29755-3E2B4B05-3756@storefull-2318.public.lawson.webtv.net> In-Reply-To: Dan Roach 's message of Sun, 19 Jan 2003 17:05:18 -0800 Content-Disposition: Inline Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) X-eGroups-From: davidcoons@webtv.net (David Coons) From: davidcoons@webtv.net X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10533228 thought it was,as the radio shack car stereo changed its decoding with the new model in 1989? had way less distortion From jbyrns@enteract.com Sun Jan 19 17:04:22 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Jan 2003 01:04:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 76325 invoked from network); 20 Jan 2003 01:04:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Jan 2003 01:04:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Jan 2003 01:04:22 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.168] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 20 Jan 2003 01:04:00 -0000 Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 01:03:55 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: IBOC / AM stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 389 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.155 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Possum Hunter" < possumhunter@n...> wrote: > Now I admit that it would sound real cool to have stereo mikes set up at > ball games to sound like you are there, but the fact is NOBODY that I have > ever seen uses a stereo feed for sports, Stereo station or not! WGN used to do the Cubs games in stereo, the crowd noise was awesome in stereo! John From groucho@skyweb.net Sun Jan 19 17:12:53 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Jan 2003 01:12:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 90218 invoked from network); 20 Jan 2003 01:12:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Jan 2003 01:12:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Jan 2003 01:12:52 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (tc1-58.skyweb.net [66.6.130.186]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h0K1Kmup039728 for ; Sun, 19 Jan 2003 20:20:49 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3E2B4B6D.63CD9CF4@skyweb.net> Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 20:05:49 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC / AM stereo References: <001901c2bff5$21c2c320$827dfea9@home1> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Hey Scott Talk about Old transmitters.. I just acquired 3 More For my Collection Now along with My Old RCA BTA-500R I just acquired a Gates BC-1H1 and a really old but Nice Collins 300G some hunters Must have shot at the transmitter Building.. there are 2 bullet holes in the cabinet.. Neal Scott Todd wrote: > Dude- let's grab those old transmitters for posterity. If nothing else, let > the hams know they're available, and I'll bet they can find new homes. I'd > love to come out and get a whole bunch of them, but I don't think my budget > will be able to handle it. > > ST > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Possum Hunter" > Every > > one of the stations slated for IBOC conversion has VERY old tube type > > transmitters, one dating back to the 1930's! I am going see if I can snag > > the now unused C-QUAM generator out of one of the Entercom or Clear > Channel > > stations. > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From alfredot@inetarena.com Sun Jan 19 17:16:20 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: alfredot@inetarena.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Jan 2003 01:16:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 23612 invoked from network); 20 Jan 2003 01:16:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Jan 2003 01:16:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.inetarena.com) (206.129.216.13) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Jan 2003 01:16:19 -0000 Received: from hendrie (1Cust7.tnt17.beaverton.or.da.uu.net [65.227.179.7]) by mail.inetarena.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h0K1Dpl22862 for ; Sun, 19 Jan 2003 17:13:52 -0800 (PST) Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 17:15:32 -0800 (PST) X-Sender: alfredo@hendrie.1610am.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: 1959 AM Stereo In-Reply-To: <1042878318.325.86191.m12@yahoogroups.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: "Alfredo E. Torrejon" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=25132238 X-Yahoo-Profile: alfredotorrejon > Here's a web site with pictures and information about RCA's > experimental AM Stereo system from 1959, as tested on WNBC in New > York: > > http://www.enteract.com/~jbyrns/RCA-AM-Stereo.html > > The most interesting part are pictures and *schematics* of a > prototype RCA/Victor AM Stereo receiver from this time period. [...] > To my eyes, the schematic almost looks too simple to be true, at > least as compared to the complexity of any modern AM Stereo decoder > chip... but I'll leave that up to the experts. I believe it. To understand this radio a little better, you have to look at the schematic of an "All-American 5" tube radio because that's where the front end and IF for this radio came from. A few additions and refinements were done to make it stereo: 1) The AVC (automatic volume control) circuit was replaced with a fancier "delayed AVC" circuit. V3-A (the 6AL5 diode tube) is the AVC detector. The effect of the 120k resistor from the cathode of this tube to the positive supply rail is that no AVC voltage is produced until the incoming signal strength exceeds a certain threshold. By connecting a high impedance voltmeter of a magic eye tube to the "red tip jack," the engineers could have observed the operation of the AVC circuit. 2) The AM detector, which is built around V3-B was designed with two outputs, 180 degrees out of phase wrt. each other. The L-R audio is superimposed through the 330k resistors. One subtle point that should be kept in mind here is that the left and right channels, as they appear at the volume control, are out of phase with respect to each other, so the wiring of the output transformers would have to be done with this in mind. 3) The second IF transformer has an extra winding to provide a signal to V5, the limiter tube. A transistor is wired as a constant current source to control the current going into the plate and screen grid of V5. The 5K "track" potentiometer sets the current level; presumably, this would affect the output of the limiter, thus allowing it to be used to match the level of the L-R audio to the L+R for optimum stereo separation. 4) V6 is part of a Foster-Seeley FM discriminator circuit. The AM/ST switch mutes the output of the FM detector for monaural operation. The "blue tip jack" is connected to the output of the FM detector for monitoring purposes. This jack could also be used as an aid when aligning the coils in FM discriminator. Alfredo From groucho@skyweb.net Sun Jan 19 17:23:37 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Jan 2003 01:23:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 70468 invoked from network); 20 Jan 2003 01:23:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Jan 2003 01:23:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Jan 2003 01:23:32 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (tc1-58.skyweb.net [66.6.130.186]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h0K1VQup041964 for ; Sun, 19 Jan 2003 20:31:27 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3E2B4DE7.955758AD@skyweb.net> Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 20:16:23 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: TM-152 better than TX-11a? References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 I knew I forgot something In My last post John as Of this point IBOC is NOT STEREO..... if it is I find that Interesting since according to Tom Ray unless I read his Post wrong stated that IBOC is MONO. they are working on writing the Code so that it can be stereo as Of Now its Still just MONO. or at least WOR is transmitting a Mono IBOC signal.. I guess I will Find out More when I meet Tom Ray on thursday. anyone else in here Going to the WOR open House???? as for your second question.... Its Only backwards compatible if it was working without trashing stations on the second adjacent... and that's not happening.... Lets give it time and see what happens Neal > > I'm not sure by what circuitous route you came to the above > conclusions, but they are all wrong. First I don't believe the > allocations policies used by the FCC were ever intended to permit > adjacent channel reception of the sort you and the other DXers want. > Second, I'm on this "list" and I said the TM-152 is better than a > Carver TX-11a. Thirdly, I love AM stereo in all the many and varied > flavors it has taken over the years. Lastly, IBOC is AM Stereo. > > > > It was my understanding that IBOC was specifically designed to be > backward compatible, aren't listeners to WOR still able to receive > WOR's programming on their existing, non IBOC radios? > > John > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sun Jan 19 17:25:30 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Jan 2003 01:25:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 34275 invoked from network); 20 Jan 2003 01:25:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Jan 2003 01:25:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.88) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Jan 2003 01:25:28 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.185] by n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 20 Jan 2003 01:25:28 -0000 Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 01:25:27 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: IBOC is NOT AM or stereo. Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 560 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.237 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " wrote: >=20 > Nor are any of the so called "AM Stereo" systems actually AM. >=20 > John C-QuAM is a modified version of QuAM for envelope compatibility. QuAM stands for Quadrature Amplitude Modulation. QuAM is Two AM Modulations, 1+L & 1+R, with each carrier fixed at 90=B0 of each other=20 and are summed together that results in a phase modulation component also. It is detected unlimited with two synchronous detectors to receive both channels. It is <<"_Amplitude_Modulation_">>. JSG From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sun Jan 19 17:35:42 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Jan 2003 01:35:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 45811 invoked from network); 20 Jan 2003 01:35:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Jan 2003 01:35:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Jan 2003 01:35:42 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.138] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 20 Jan 2003 01:35:42 -0000 Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 01:35:41 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} It's the programming... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <29752-3E2B481B-7183@storefull-2318.public.lawson.webtv.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 783 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.237 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, davidcoons@w... wrote: > and when you say talk radio "attacks"everyone and anyone ,you are by > definition "attacking" talk radio hosts...simply because you dont agree > with their views..free dialogue freinds is esential to liberty.lets not > call anothers opinion "hate" when we dont like it. lets be glad we have > the feedom expresion..and lets have more of the tolerance the left > claims to want. One talk show host (initals are MS) is so insulting at times that he goes beyond disagreeing as to demean the caller. It is one thing to disagree but insulting members of the audience doesn't accomplish anything. The caller didn't even get to finish defining his situation before MS attacked him. I can't see this a being productive. JSG From fanfare@globility.com Sun Jan 19 17:42:41 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Jan 2003 01:42:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 55829 invoked from network); 20 Jan 2003 01:42:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Jan 2003 01:42:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.78) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Jan 2003 01:42:41 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.180] by n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 20 Jan 2003 01:42:40 -0000 Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 01:42:39 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: IBOC / AM stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1791 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Marv Southcott " X-Originating-IP: 64.56.235.80 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Possum Hunter" < > possumhunter@n...> wrote: > > jbyrns@e... wrote: > > >What is the Fanfare's claim to fame? At least one of their products is, > > shall we say not too good. > > > > What Fanfare product do you not like? > > The FM whip antenna, which doesn't even come close to a simple folded > dipole in performance. > > John An interesting observation John, but hardly an professional assessment. The FM-2G works well in most situations. Some it does not because it has been compromised by something existing around it. Or, the expectation is beyond its capabilities. Tell me that you installed the unit atop a house within 50 miles of a radio tower and got nothing listenable and I'd say; - the cable has been compromised (shorted, open or broken). The FM-2G presents as an open circuit. - the unit is loading a nearby metal object - your tuner has a poor front end - the most common occurrence. Some say a vertical dipole is nothing more than a typical dipole. For all intents and purposes it is. But the loading and feed cause the top and bottom of its isotropic pattern be lopped off and added somewhat to its horizontal sensitivity. Therefore, to be fair in your comparison to a horizontal dipole, you should place the FM-2G on its side as well. Argue as you will, the FM-2G has done some pretty good things for the vast majority of its users. To say it didn't work for you without any qualification whatsoever is meaningless. It's now out in a College Band version (88-92MHz) and a mobile version and doing quite satisfactorily. Fortunately for those who find it doesn't work for them, there is a full refund. Cheers, Marv From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Jan 19 18:14:52 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Jan 2003 02:14:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 18372 invoked from network); 20 Jan 2003 02:14:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Jan 2003 02:14:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Jan 2003 02:14:51 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.167] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 20 Jan 2003 02:14:51 -0000 Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 02:14:48 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: creating a third broadcasting band Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <1d4.4439ba.2b5c9d58@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1258 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.96.138 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > The 120-meter band (2300-2500 kHz) is largely unused. That may be, but as you go higher above the "AM" band, you start losing local groundwave coverage and start increasing distant skywave coverage. The existing Expanded Band already has this problem. Radio stations were aware of this even back in the 1920s. That's why the first attempts to establish a new broadcasting band were done at up around 25 to 27 MHz -- the first "Apex" band, which a few hi-fi AM stations used in the late '20s and early to mid '30s. Then they started using the 40-50 MHz range, which eventually became the first FM band as the technology became available. I think if there is any chance for a new radio broadcasting band to be established in the USA, it would be in the "VHF-Low" range, approx. 30 to 50 MHz, or in the former Channel 6 TV range of 82-88 MHz... both of which may very well be completely abandoned by their existing users in a few years. Then, these areas will be wide open for other uses, and somewhere in there they could surely fit a new radio broadcasting band, using either AM or FM, with enough spacing between channels that adjacent-channel interference would not exist and where true hi-fi 20-20,000 Hz audio could be broadcast. From amymousie@yahoo.com Sun Jan 19 19:28:36 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Jan 2003 03:28:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 83515 invoked from network); 20 Jan 2003 03:28:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Jan 2003 03:28:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Jan 2003 03:28:33 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.143] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 20 Jan 2003 03:28:33 -0000 Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 03:28:31 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: 1959 AM Stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1080 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 67.118.16.25 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Alfredo E. Torrejon" wrote: > > Here's a web site with pictures and information about RCA's > > experimental AM Stereo system from 1959, as tested on WNBC in New > > York: > > > > http://www.enteract.com/~jbyrns/RCA-AM-Stereo.html > > > > The most interesting part are pictures and *schematics* of a > > prototype RCA/Victor AM Stereo receiver from this time period. > [...] > > To my eyes, the schematic almost looks too simple to be true, at > > least as compared to the complexity of any modern AM Stereo decoder > > chip... but I'll leave that up to the experts. > > I believe it. To understand this radio a little better, you have > to look at the schematic of an "All-American 5" tube radio because that's > where the front end and IF for this radio came from. A few additions and > refinements were done to make it stereo: =snip= Looking at this schematic with my untrained eyes, it looks like it was designed to receive QuAM/ISB _and_ the AF/FM system RCA was proposing at the time. Amy. <:3)~~~ From narkspud@hotmail.com Sun Jan 19 20:00:05 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: narkspud@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Jan 2003 04:00:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 76517 invoked from network); 20 Jan 2003 04:00:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Jan 2003 04:00:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.87) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Jan 2003 04:00:01 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.133] by n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 20 Jan 2003 04:00:00 -0000 Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 03:59:59 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: OT: laser turntable Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 649 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "narkspud " X-Originating-IP: 66.159.192.39 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=81956306 X-Yahoo-Profile: narkspud --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Marv Southcott " wrote: > On the subject of vinyl, most record cleaning machines use an > alcohol/water compound. Cleans well, but leaves the grooves so clean > they're often "squeaky". Ain't no alcohol goin' on my valuable vinyl! (Or on the junk either.) I was using the LAST stuff, prior to splurging on my VPI 16.5, but I choose my cleaning fluid carefully--the distilled-water-based Record Research Lab fluids. With those, the VPI does significantly better, and quite frankly has been a godsend. But if you can't afford the machine, LAST is an excellent choice. From alfredot@inetarena.com Sun Jan 19 20:26:33 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: alfredot@inetarena.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Jan 2003 04:26:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 3579 invoked from network); 20 Jan 2003 04:26:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Jan 2003 04:26:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.inetarena.com) (206.129.216.13) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Jan 2003 04:26:31 -0000 Received: from hendrie (1Cust122.tnt8.beaverton.or.da.uu.net [67.227.229.122]) by mail.inetarena.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h0K4O4B00794 for ; Sun, 19 Jan 2003 20:24:04 -0800 (PST) Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 20:25:51 -0800 (PST) X-Sender: alfredo@hendrie.1610am.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: TM-152 better than TX-11a? In-Reply-To: <1043008856.1199.57343.m2@yahoogroups.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: "Alfredo E. Torrejon" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=25132238 X-Yahoo-Profile: alfredotorrejon > > Anyone who thinks the TX-11a is a good AM radio is equally full of it. > > When I owned a TX-11a, I found the AM section to have several serious > > shortcomings. Even the little Radio Shack TM-152 is a far better AM > > radio. > > > > John One big problem with the design of the TM-152 is phase noise in the local oscillator. I've found (though I don't have the type of high-dollar spectrum analyzers that I'd need in order to give you any quantifiable figures) that the local oscillator in my Sony SRF-42 is actually cleaner than that of the TM-152. The local oscillator noise manifests itself as low-frequency noise when listening to C-QUAM encoded signals. With a moderately good pair of speakers or headphones, this noise is clearly audible. What the TM-152 designers might have been trying to do by high-pass filtering the tuner's audio output was to make this noise less audible. The problem is that the cutoff frequency of the filters, as originally designed, is high enough (around 150 hz or so) that it robs "punchiness" from the bass. I think that the only saving grace of this unit is its low price. It gave consumers the opportunity to add AM stereo without losing an arm and a leg. Plus, its cheap enough that experimenters can tinker with it without getting too paranoid about breaking it. Alfredo From alfredot@inetarena.com Sun Jan 19 21:20:49 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: alfredot@inetarena.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Jan 2003 05:20:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 46990 invoked from network); 20 Jan 2003 05:20:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Jan 2003 05:20:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.inetarena.com) (206.129.216.13) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Jan 2003 05:20:47 -0000 Received: from hendrie (1Cust122.tnt8.beaverton.or.da.uu.net [67.227.229.122]) by mail.inetarena.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h0K5ILB12996 for ; Sun, 19 Jan 2003 21:18:21 -0800 (PST) Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 21:20:05 -0800 (PST) X-Sender: alfredo@hendrie.1610am.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: TM-152 better than TX-11a? In-Reply-To: <1043024527.1142.76008.m3@yahoogroups.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=X-UNKNOWN Content-Transfer-Encoding: QUOTED-PRINTABLE From: "Alfredo E. Torrejon" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=25132238 X-Yahoo-Profile: alfredotorrejon >=20 > The human ear hears a balanced response in the LF to HF ratio. > Early speaker designers used a number that was the product of > the LF & HF cutoffs. Ex: 35Hz x 15KHz =3D 525000. With this number > the LF & HF cutoff for the 70Hz HPF used in the TM-152 is 7.5KHz > which is about all you can get out of the =B14.5KHz ceramic filter > including the stations NRSC pre-emphasis. It appears the HPF is > use to keep it from sounding too bassy without enough highs and > not to suppress the 25Hz pilot tone. I've seen some typical narrowband mono AM tuners intentionally roll off the bass, but they usually seem to use simple 6db/octave passive filters, rather than the 12db/octave active filter that the TM-152 uses. = =20 The stock Technics SA929, for instance, has a transistor wired as a switch that intentionally routes the receiver IC output through a 6db/octave high pass filter when the tuner is in AM mode. If you go to http://www.nrscstandards.org/amibocevaluationreportappd.pdf, you can see the test data that Ibiquity used to determine that virtually all AM radios have banwidth restricted to less than 5kHz. On page 3 of the report, you can see that four of the nine radios tested had a measurable drop in response at 100Hz, suggesting that they, too, intentionally high-pass filter the audio. I think that you're probably right about your conclusion regarding perceived tonal balance as the reason for the use of high-pass filters. = =20 Other theories that I've had were that (1) the designers were afraid that low frequency content from co-channel beat notes or from nearby lightning could damage the speakers if the volume control were turned up or (2) that the designers assumed that "serious" users would listen to music exclusively on FM, using the AM section only to catch the news or listen to the occasional ballgame; thus making the tuner "midrangey" sounding would, theoretically, increase the intelligibility of human speech.=20=20 However, on comparison, I don't think that my theories are as likely true as yours. Occam's razor is at work! :-) Alfredo From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sun Jan 19 21:22:06 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Jan 2003 05:22:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 48562 invoked from network); 20 Jan 2003 05:22:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Jan 2003 05:22:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Jan 2003 05:22:05 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.158] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 20 Jan 2003 05:22:05 -0000 Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 05:22:01 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: TM-152 better than TX-11a? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2101 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.20 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Alfredo E. Torrejon" wrote: > One big problem with the design of the TM-152 is phase noise in > the local oscillator. I've found (though I don't have the type of > high-dollar spectrum analyzers that I'd need in order to give you any > quantifiable figures) that the local oscillator in my Sony SRF-42 is > actually cleaner than that of the TM-152. > The local oscillator noise manifests itself as low-frequency noise > when listening to C-QUAM encoded signals. With a moderately good pair of > speakers or headphones, this noise is clearly audible. What the TM-152 > designers might have been trying to do by high-pass filtering the tuner's > audio output was to make this noise less audible. The problem is that the > cutoff frequency of the filters, as originally designed, is high enough > (around 150 hz or so) that it robs "punchiness" from the bass. > I think that the only saving grace of this unit is its low > price. It gave consumers the opportunity to add AM stereo without losing > an arm and a leg. Plus, its cheap enough that experimenters can tinker > with it without getting too paranoid about breaking it. > > Alfredo After running some calculations for the HPF in the TM-152 schematic I've come up with a corner freq of ~100Hz and a Q of ~1.25 to correct my eariler statement that it was at 70Hz. I agree that the low freq phase noise is bad enough that it is impossible to use the co-channel input on the MC13020 to detect co-channel interference even when using a reduced level of what Motorola recomends by using a larger resistor. It just doesn't sound as crisp and clean on the top end like another MC13020 decoder I installed in a DTR. On the circuit board the designers left pin 12 open with nothing hooked to it knowing that the LO had phase problems. This problem originates in the LA1245 RF,LO,IF Det chip and it probably fit the needs of the other criteria and accepted the phase noise. This chip was designed to be used with electronic tuning which would have eliminated the phase noise issue. JSG From possumhunter@netzero.net Sun Jan 19 21:27:17 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Jan 2003 05:27:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 69097 invoked from network); 20 Jan 2003 05:27:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Jan 2003 05:27:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.63) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Jan 2003 05:27:16 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 19 Jan 2003 21:27:16 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC / AM stereo Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 00:26:56 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 20 Jan 2003 05:27:16.0306 (UTC) FILETIME=[982B0320:01C2C044] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.147.17.135] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 jbyrns@enteract.com wrote: > The FM whip antenna, which doesn't even come close to a simple folded dipole in performance. You are comparing apples to oranges. the Fanfare antenna is a vertical while the folded dipole is usually on the horizontal plane. There are many factors that can make one antenna seem to pull in stations better than another: The transmitter output power Type of transmitting antenna and it's orientation on the tower Transmitting antenna height above the ground. Transmitting antenna height above average terrain Condition of transmitting equipment Is the station Stereo Does the station broadcast SCA Weather conditions Multipath Shape of terrain between the transmitter and receiver. How much vegetation there is between the transmitter and receiver Type of receiving antenna and it's orientation Receiving antenna height above the ground. Receiving antenna height above average terrain and a host of other conditions. If you are listening to FM in a crowded market like where I am, with a good directional antenna, you can hear 2 or 3 stations on the same frequency just by turning the antenna and switching between Horizontal and Vertical. I use 2 Channel Master Stereo Probe 9s. One is Vertical and one is Horizontal. I use Channel Master RG6 cable with no external amplification. All of these variables on the VHF FM band is just more proof of the superiority of Motorola C-QUAM Stereo on the MW AM band over the GE / Zenith Multiplex Stereo system on the VHF FM Broadcast band! Kevin From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Sun Jan 19 21:28:00 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Jan 2003 05:28:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 22750 invoked from network); 20 Jan 2003 05:27:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Jan 2003 05:27:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14205.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.151) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Jan 2003 05:27:59 -0000 Message-ID: <20030120052759.12245.qmail@web14205.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.166.38.54] by web14205.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 19 Jan 2003 21:27:59 PST Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 21:27:59 -0800 (PST) Subject: AM Used to have Decent Frequency Response To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio somebody wrote: "why bother with frequency response out to 15KHz?" Why...you should Go back to CKLW and WJR circa 1979, as they both went out past 15KHz and sounded great, to put it mildly. CKLW was even rumored to nearly hit 20KHz and severely pushed their 50KW power limit as well, plus their real people board-ops cued-up everything so tight that they still would whip any station's automation now-a-days. In fact, board ops got fired from CK when they were more than 2 seconds off for a spot more than three times! I'm not sure of the frequency response of these stations in the late 70's/very early 80's, but they very sounded decent too: WHAS, WSM, CFRB, WLS, WNBC and WMAQ. Anybody know for sure about the audio on these stations? Now, if we just had the FanFare Tuners back then, AM would be still be King, or tied with FM in listeners and music programing intead of the hotairbag talkers. (Actually, 2 ratings periods ago in Chicago, AM had the top spot and 3 of the top 4 spots! WLW is #1 in Cincy. WJR is #1 in Detroit, so all hope is not yet lost.) __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From possumhunter@netzero.net Sun Jan 19 21:44:45 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: possumhunter@netzero.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Jan 2003 05:44:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 62614 invoked from network); 20 Jan 2003 05:44:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Jan 2003 05:44:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rly-ip03.mx.aol.com) (64.12.138.7) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Jan 2003 05:44:44 -0000 Received: from logs-tm.proxy.aol.com (logs-tm.proxy.aol.com [152.163.197.5]) by rly-ip03.mx.aol.com (v89.10) with ESMTP id RELAYIN8-0120004344; Mon, 20 Jan 2003 00:43:44 1900 Received: from ibm (AC931187.ipt.aol.com [172.147.17.135]) by logs-tm.proxy.aol.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with SMTP id h0K5gGtW165461 for ; Mon, 20 Jan 2003 00:42:16 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <014f01c2c046$a944d760$a590b498@aoldsl.net> To: References: <20030120052759.12245.qmail@web14205.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM Used to have Decent Frequency Response Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 00:42:02 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Apparently-From: DodgeRamTrucker@aol.com From: "Possum Hunter" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 John P. wrote: > Go back to CKLW and WJR circa 1979, as they both went out past 15KHz and sounded great, to put it mildly. WLW was certified High Fidelity by McIntosh Labs. They had a frequency responce from 20Hz to 20Khz! WOR was also certified as High Fidelity. Both WNBC and WOWO was out to 16Khz and WWRL Was until they killed the C-QUAM signal. WQOK 1440 was full fidelity out to 20Khz as was WMRB 1490 and WCRS 1450. WORD 910 and WPCC 1410 was out to 15Khz. WFIS 1600 was out to 12Khz until NRSC. Kevin From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Sun Jan 19 21:45:47 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Jan 2003 05:45:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 77215 invoked from network); 20 Jan 2003 05:45:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Jan 2003 05:45:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14201.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.143) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Jan 2003 05:45:46 -0000 Message-ID: <20030120054546.25058.qmail@web14201.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.166.38.54] by web14201.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 19 Jan 2003 21:45:46 PST Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 21:45:46 -0800 (PST) Subject: Tigers games in Stereo on AM! To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio Somebody wrote: >"Now I admit that it would sound real cool to have stereo mikes >set up at ball games to sound like you are there, but the fact is NOBODY that >I have ever seen uses a stereo feed for sports, Stereo station or not! WJR broadcast all Detroit Tigers 'home' ballgames from the old Tiger Statium in AM Stereo from about 1989 until 2000. They threw 2 microphones out the front of the broadcast booth, and you could even hear the vendors yelling "Get your hot-doggies here", so the crowd and stadium announcer were in stereo. WJR is one class act when it comes to the technical quality of an AM station. Unfortunately, flea-powered WXYT bid $50million for the rights to broadcast the Tiger games, so no more Tigers in stereo over at 50KW AMSt WJR. __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From possumhunter@netzero.net Sun Jan 19 21:50:51 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Jan 2003 05:50:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 47660 invoked from network); 20 Jan 2003 05:50:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Jan 2003 05:50:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.206) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Jan 2003 05:50:50 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 19 Jan 2003 21:50:50 -0800 To: References: <001901c2bff5$21c2c320$827dfea9@home1> <009701c2bffc$7365a420$827dfea9@home1> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Old Trandmitters Was: IBOC / AM stereo Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 00:50:35 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 20 Jan 2003 05:50:50.0545 (UTC) FILETIME=[E31EC210:01C2C047] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.147.17.135] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Scott Todd wrote: >Better to get them rebuilt. I think Econco may still do these old jugs. The tubes in this transmitter were allowed to freeze with water in them, so the tubes broke. So the bottom line looks like tubes alone would make the transmitter cost more to put on the air than it is worth. What a shame. From jbyrns@enteract.com Sun Jan 19 22:11:37 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Jan 2003 06:11:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 37854 invoked from network); 20 Jan 2003 06:11:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Jan 2003 06:11:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Jan 2003 06:11:35 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.253] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 20 Jan 2003 06:11:35 -0000 Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 06:11:35 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Old Trandmitters Was: IBOC / AM stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 553 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.146 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Possum Hunter" < possumhunter@n...> wrote: > Scott Todd wrote: > >Better to get them rebuilt. I think Econco may still do these old jugs. > > The tubes in this transmitter were allowed to freeze with water in them, so > the tubes broke. So the bottom line looks like tubes alone would make the > transmitter cost more to put on the air than it is worth. What a shame. What make/model transmitter is this? Where was the transmitter originally installed? I didn't think anyone besides RCA used the 862? John From rwagoner@cox.net Sun Jan 19 22:35:19 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner@cox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Jan 2003 06:35:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 98437 invoked from network); 20 Jan 2003 06:35:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Jan 2003 06:35:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO fed1mtao06.cox.net) (68.6.19.125) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Jan 2003 06:35:16 -0000 Received: from cox.net ([68.4.33.253]) by fed1mtao06.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20030120063514.LRBK3267.fed1mtao06.cox.net@cox.net> for ; Mon, 20 Jan 2003 01:35:14 -0500 Message-ID: <3E2B98A3.1050502@cox.net> Date: Sun, 19 Jan 2003 22:35:15 -0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20021120 Netscape/7.01 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM Used to have Decent Frequency Response References: <20030120052759.12245.qmail@web14205.mail.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Richard Wagoner X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public KFI was mentioned in the LA Times as going to a full 20KHz high end years ago (probably late 1970s). We tested a Carrrier Current transmitter (LPB tube) and it showd on an analyser as going to 20KHz also ... but we had no tuners to hear it at the time. From possumhunter@netzero.net Sun Jan 19 23:27:49 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Jan 2003 07:27:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 68017 invoked from network); 20 Jan 2003 07:27:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Jan 2003 07:27:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.93) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Jan 2003 07:27:46 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 19 Jan 2003 23:27:46 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Old Trandmitters Was: IBOC / AM stereo Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 02:27:27 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 20 Jan 2003 07:27:46.0148 (UTC) FILETIME=[6D7D5A40:01C2C055] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.147.17.135] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 jbyrns@enteract.com wrote: Where was the transmitter originally installed? I didn't think anyone besides RCA used the 862? This is a vintage RCA that I was told was purchased new by WWL 870. It is in a station that Golden Strip Broadcasting may purchase. The main transmitter is a Continetal 317 C1. Kevin From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Jan 20 00:21:05 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Jan 2003 08:21:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 16172 invoked from network); 20 Jan 2003 08:21:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Jan 2003 08:21:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.69) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Jan 2003 08:21:04 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.174] by n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 20 Jan 2003 08:21:04 -0000 Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 08:21:02 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: WOR used IBOC in 1938 Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 525 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.88.137 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics Well, not exactly, but I found this on a radio history page and thought it was interesting, considering WOR's current experiment with IBOC transmissions that probably will also never meet with public favor: > > > > In 1938, WOR tried to push into the future when it began facsimile transmission, utilizing overnight hours to experimentally deliver a morning newspaper and other printed matter by radio. The effort never met with public favor, though it can be seen as a forerunner to today's online services. < < < < From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Jan 20 08:13:30 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Jan 2003 16:13:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 4932 invoked from network); 20 Jan 2003 16:13:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Jan 2003 16:13:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Jan 2003 16:13:25 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.168] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 20 Jan 2003 16:13:24 -0000 Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 16:13:23 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: 240V Realistic TM-152 on eBay Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 191 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics Realistic TM-152 AM Stereo tuner, equipped for 240V/50Hz AC power. Seller is in Australia. Starting bid is US$44.95... http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3001732157 From jbyrns@enteract.com Mon Jan 20 09:36:18 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Jan 2003 17:36:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 12223 invoked from network); 20 Jan 2003 17:36:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Jan 2003 17:36:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Jan 2003 17:36:17 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.188] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 20 Jan 2003 17:36:17 -0000 Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 17:36:15 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: IBOC is NOT AM or stereo. Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3E2B422B.6070704@cox.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2075 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.45 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, Richard Wagoner wrote: > > Nor are any of the so called "AM Stereo" systems actually AM. > > > Huh? I must have missed something there. I didn't realize that AM stereo > systems don't use amplitude modulation any more. What you missed was the context of my original statement, the statement I was responding to was, "As IBOC exists today, it is NOT stereo according to Tom Ray at WOR and it is NOT AM. It is a digital transmission on the Medium band. AM is strictly an analog transmission scheme." The point I was trying to make, although perhaps poorly, was that AM is not "strictly an analog transmission scheme", and is frequently used to transmit digital information. Typically when digital information is transmitted by radio using the limited resource of the "airwaves", its bandwidth is first limited by filtering it, or converting it to analog if you will, to conserve the limited radio spectrum space, and in the case of IBOC, to insure it doesn't extend beyond the first adjacent channels. Once the stream of digital ones and zeros has been converted to a band limited "analog" like signal, it can be modulated onto a "carrier" by any of the same means used to transmit analog signals, such as AM, PM, or various permutations of these, at this point it makes little difference whether the signal being transmitted was originally digital information, or if it was always "analog". Typically "digital" information is transmitted using some combination AM and PM, and the same is true of AM stereo, which uses both AM and PM modulation of the transmitter, hence it follows that if "digital" doesn't use "amplitude modulation", then by the same reasoning, neither does "AM stereo", and thus "AM stereo" is not AM either. Of course today in Medium Wave broadcasting things are even more convoluted, because we actually convert our ordinary "analog" signals to digital form, and then transmit them using digital techniques, as in the Harris DX-50, its siblings, and progeny. John From jbyrns@enteract.com Mon Jan 20 09:47:22 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Jan 2003 17:47:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 7761 invoked from network); 20 Jan 2003 17:47:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Jan 2003 17:47:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Jan 2003 17:47:21 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.157] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 20 Jan 2003 17:47:21 -0000 Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 17:47:20 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: IBOC / AM stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 5057 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.45 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Marv Southcott " wrote: > > An interesting observation John, but hardly an professional > assessment. Welcome to the Yahoo "AM Stereo" Group, where virtually no observations can be considered a "professional assessment", as another poster has pointed out to me. > The FM-2G works well in most situations. I may have misjudged your FM-2G, as I am assuming it is similar in performance to the clones sold by Magnum Dynalab, and Metz. I understood, perhaps wrongly that these three whip antennas are all identical, except for cosmetic items like the type of plating on the outside of the coil housing, the color of the plastic hood over the coil housing, and the decals on the coil housing. This is your chance to explain why your antenna is superior to these clones? > Some it does not because it > has been compromised by something existing around it. Would not the folded dipole also be similarly affected by "something existing around it"? In my test, the clone whip antenna replaced an existing folded dipole antenna, and was connected to the same feed line that had been connected to the folded dipole. The folded dipole was vertically mounted, not horizontally, for the test, the clone antenna replaced the dipole in the same attic space. > Or, the expectation is beyond its capabilities. My only expectation for the clone whip was that it would be similar in performance to the vertically mounted folded dipole I had been using. > Tell me that you installed the unit atop a house I did not install the clone whip "atop a house", I installed it in a fourth floor attic space, approximately 27 feet above street level, it was however installed "within 50 miles of a radio tower". > within 50 miles of a radio tower and got > nothing listenable and I'd say; I got a large number of listenable signals with the clone whip, it is not correct to infer that I got nothing listenable, the problem was that the vertically mounted folded dipole got listenable reception on several stations that were important to me, on which the clone whip didn't get listenable reception. > - the cable has been compromised (shorted, open or broken). The FM-2G > presents as an open circuit. Impossible, as the same cable was used with the clone whip, that had previously been used with the vertically mounted folded dipole, and was later again used with the folded dipole when it was reinstalled after the whip failed to perform. > - the unit is loading a nearby metal object The loading should have been similar, as the whip replaced the vertically mounted folded dipole for this test. > - your tuner has a poor front end - the most common occurrence. That might very well be, but if it is true, it only goes to demonstrate the superiority of the vertically mounted folded dipole over the whip, as the dipole delivered noticeably more signal strength to the tuner than did the whip. A superior antenna should improve the performance of a tuner with a "poor front end", as well as a tuner like the FTA-100. > Some say a vertical dipole is nothing more than a typical dipole. For > all intents and purposes it is. But the loading and feed cause the > top and bottom of its isotropic pattern be lopped off and added > somewhat to its horizontal sensitivity. Therefore, to be fair in your > comparison to a horizontal dipole, you should place the FM-2G on its > side as well. I took the opposite tack, and placed the dipole on its end. > Argue as you will, the FM-2G has done some pretty good things for the > vast majority of its users. To say it didn't work for you without any > qualification whatsoever is meaningless. I am not arguing, I am simply stating the results of my test as clearly as possible. And I want to emphasize again that my conclusions about the FM-2G may be all wet, as it was one of the FM-2G clones that I tested, not an actual FM-2G. I am hoping that you will expand on the differences between the FM-2G and it's clones, and explain what makes it superior to the clones. > It's now out in a College Band version (88-92MHz) and a mobile > version and doing quite satisfactorily. This is very good news indeed, as I had previously come to the conclusion that this may be the crux of the problem I had with the clone whip. I recently found a graph of the "gain" vs. frequency for one of these whips on the web, and it showed significantly more "gain" at the top of the FM band, than in the NCE portion at the bottom of the FM band. The vertically mounted folded dipole I used was cut to favor the low end of the FM band. This difference could account for most if not all of the performance difference I observed in my tests, which involved NCE ("College Band") stations almost exclusively. If this was the case, then hopefully the new "College Band" version of the whip should fix the problem. Does the "College Band" version simply have a longer whip, or was the coil also changed? John From jbyrns@enteract.com Mon Jan 20 09:52:38 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Jan 2003 17:52:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 31238 invoked from network); 20 Jan 2003 17:52:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Jan 2003 17:52:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Jan 2003 17:52:37 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.176] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 20 Jan 2003 17:52:36 -0000 Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 17:52:36 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: TM-152 better than TX-11a? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2173 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.45 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Alfredo E. Torrejon" < alfredot@i...> wrote: > One big problem with the design of the TM-152 is phase noise in > the local oscillator. I've found (though I don't have the type of > high-dollar spectrum analyzers that I'd need in order to give you any > quantifiable figures) that the local oscillator in my Sony SRF-42 is > actually cleaner than that of the TM-152. > The local oscillator noise manifests itself as low-frequency noise > when listening to C-QUAM encoded signals. With a moderately good pair of > speakers or headphones, this noise is clearly audible. What the TM-152 > designers might have been trying to do by high-pass filtering the tuner's > audio output was to make this noise less audible. The problem is that the > cutoff frequency of the filters, as originally designed, is high enough > (around 150 hz or so) that it robs "punchiness" from the bass. One relatively simple fix to improve the bass, if that is indeed a good thing, would be to change the "HPF" filter topology so that it only affected the "L-R" component of the signal, while leaving the full bass response in the normal AM "L+R" path. I understand why phase noise in the local oscillator is a problem, but I don't understand all its causes, do you know what causes the phase noise in the TM-152 oscillator? The TX11a seems to use a very similar AM radio chip to the one used in the TM-152, and also uses the on chip oscillator, but presumably doesn't have this problem, is this because the low frequency phase noise is reduced by the feedback provided by the synthesizer PLL? Could the phase noise problem be solved by building a better oscillator off chip? From my conversations with the designers of the CQuam chips, I know they were concerned with oscillator problems in "analog" tuned radios, unfortunately I wasn't particularly interested in this aspect of the system, and didn't pay good attention. I know there is also a "Tuning Compensator" chip designed to fix some of the problems with manually tuned radios, but I have never looked at it, I wonder if it includes any fix for oscillator phase noise? John From jbyrns@enteract.com Mon Jan 20 09:58:04 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Jan 2003 17:58:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 17751 invoked from network); 20 Jan 2003 17:58:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Jan 2003 17:58:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.67) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Jan 2003 17:58:04 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.183] by n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 20 Jan 2003 17:57:58 -0000 Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 17:57:57 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: IBOC / AM stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2559 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.45 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Possum Hunter" < possumhunter@n...> wrote: > jbyrns@e... wrote: > > The FM whip antenna, which doesn't even come close to a simple folded > dipole in performance. > > You are comparing apples to oranges. the Fanfare antenna is a vertical while > the folded dipole is usually on the horizontal plane. It was not a case of apples to oranges in my test of the vertical whip, which by the way was not actually the Fanfare version, but was one of the clones sold by Magnum Dynalab, and Metz. My test was apples to apples, as I tested the whip against the vertically mounted folded dipole which it replaced, although only temporarily, as the dipole was reinstalled when the whip failed to deliver the goods. > There are many factors that can make one antenna seem to pull in stations > better than another: > The transmitter output power > Type of transmitting antenna and it's orientation on the tower > Transmitting antenna height above the ground. > Transmitting antenna height above average terrain > Condition of transmitting equipment > Is the station Stereo > Does the station broadcast SCA > Weather conditions > Multipath > Shape of terrain between the transmitter and receiver. > How much vegetation there is between the transmitter and receiver > Type of receiving antenna and it's orientation > Receiving antenna height above the ground. > Receiving antenna height above average terrain > and a host of other conditions. > > If you are listening to FM in a crowded market like where I am, with a good > directional antenna, you can hear 2 or 3 stations on the same frequency just > by turning the antenna and switching between Horizontal and Vertical. I use > 2 Channel Master Stereo Probe 9s. One is Vertical and one is Horizontal. I > use Channel Master RG6 cable with no external amplification. > > All of these variables on the VHF FM band is just more proof of the > superiority of Motorola C-QUAM Stereo on the MW AM band over the GE / Zenith > Multiplex Stereo system on the VHF FM Broadcast band! That is certainly an impressive list of problems that can affect the FM stereo system, but if you are honest with yourself, don't you think there is an equally long, or even longer, list of problems that can plague the C-QUAM AM Stereo system? I have heard radio engineers comment that there are so many problems that can affect the C-QUAM AM Stereo system, that it is not really practical, and should be banished from the AM band, although I personally take exception to that view. John From jbyrns@enteract.com Mon Jan 20 10:02:42 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Jan 2003 18:02:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 25112 invoked from network); 20 Jan 2003 18:02:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Jan 2003 18:02:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Jan 2003 18:02:41 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.128] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 20 Jan 2003 18:02:41 -0000 Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 18:02:39 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Old Trandmitters Was: IBOC / AM stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 650 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.45 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Possum Hunter" < possumhunter@n...> wrote: > jbyrns@e... wrote: > Where was the transmitter originally installed? I didn't think anyone > besides RCA used the 862? > > This is a vintage RCA that I was told was purchased new by WWL 870. It is in > a station that Golden Strip Broadcasting may purchase. The main transmitter > is a Continetal 317 C1. Is it an antique RCA 50B transmitter, the elusive and mysterious BTA-50C, or a BTA-50D with the 862's in a Doherty linear amplifier? In any case it must be a cool old transmitter, which I hope ends up on display somewhere, rather than in a landfill. John From rwagoner@cox.net Mon Jan 20 10:33:01 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner@cox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Jan 2003 18:33:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 97741 invoked from network); 20 Jan 2003 18:32:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Jan 2003 18:32:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO fed1mtao03.cox.net) (68.6.19.242) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Jan 2003 18:32:59 -0000 Received: from cox.net ([68.4.33.253]) by fed1mtao03.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20030120183300.OZKH28517.fed1mtao03.cox.net@cox.net> for ; Mon, 20 Jan 2003 13:33:00 -0500 Message-ID: <3E2C40DB.3060503@cox.net> Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 10:32:59 -0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20021120 Netscape/7.01 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} 240V Realistic TM-152 on eBay References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Richard Wagoner X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public TM-152 for $45? That's as mich as when new, isn't it? And I still think it sounded awful. Narrowband stereo isn't better than narrowband mono to me. I'd rather have wideband mono than lousy sounding stereo. It was tuners like this that kept AM stereo from catching on. Richard From fanfare@globility.com Mon Jan 20 10:36:03 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Jan 2003 18:36:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 34610 invoked from network); 20 Jan 2003 18:36:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Jan 2003 18:36:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Jan 2003 18:36:03 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.142] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 20 Jan 2003 18:36:02 -0000 Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 18:36:02 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: IBOC / AM stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1895 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Marv Southcott " X-Originating-IP: 64.56.235.77 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " wrote: > > > Welcome to the Yahoo "AM Stereo" Group, where virtually no > observations can be considered a "professional assessment", as >another > I may have misjudged your FM-2G, as I am assuming it is similar in > performance to the clones sold by Magnum Dynalab, and Metz. This is your chance > to explain why your antenna is superior to these clones? > > It's now out in a College Band version (88-92MHz) and a mobile > > version and doing quite satisfactorily. > > This is very good news indeed, as I had previously come to the > conclusion that this may be the crux of the problem I had with the > clone whip. I recently found a graph of the "gain" vs. frequency for > one of these whips on the web, and it showed significantly more "gain" > at the top of the FM band, than in the NCE portion at the bottom of > the FM band. Does the "College Band" version > simply have a longer whip, or was the coil also changed? Response. We all have to take our turn in the barrel, John. It's just that you let the matter dangle by making an unqualified, blanket statement. Now that you've qualified the issue and provided some detail on the the criteria involved, I can understand your concern. The FM-2G was first introduced by me in 1982. The clone units you mention are both manufactured by Metz and based on the original FM-2G design. For the College Band version, the resonator(whip) has been retuned using an adaptor. Therefore its length is greater. However, it is cut to match the FM-2G coil tune, not that of the clones. Both the standard FM-2G and the College Band unit can be 'combined' for peak coverage at both 90MHz and 100MHz. Thank you for the completeness of your response, John. It is much appreciated. And thank you to the group for allowing this OT exchange. Marv From amymousie@yahoo.com Mon Jan 20 11:27:36 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Jan 2003 19:27:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 7874 invoked from network); 20 Jan 2003 19:27:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Jan 2003 19:27:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.69) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Jan 2003 19:27:34 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.144] by n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 20 Jan 2003 19:27:34 -0000 Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 19:27:34 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: IBOC is NOT AM or stereo. Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 701 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 64.175.245.17 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " wrote: > Typically "digital" information is transmitted using some combination > AM and PM, and the same is true of AM stereo, which uses both AM and > PM modulation of the transmitter, hence it follows that if "digital" > doesn't use "amplitude modulation", then by the same reasoning, > neither does "AM stereo", and thus "AM stereo" is not AM either. Umm, if I'm not mistaken, CQUAM uses a suppressed-carrier, amplitude- modulated signal in quadrature phase to the main amplitude-modulated carrier? Seems like that is the case. And fdrom what I know, most digital transmission schemes use quadrature AM. Amy. From philipr@irac.pe.ca Mon Jan 20 11:44:25 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Jan 2003 19:44:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 20257 invoked from network); 20 Jan 2003 19:44:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Jan 2003 19:44:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.64) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Jan 2003 19:44:23 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.162] by n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 20 Jan 2003 19:44:21 -0000 Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 19:44:19 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: OT - folded dipole FM antennas - On Topic - AM Stereo PT-1 Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2481 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking One example of a folded dipole FM antenna that is often set up vertically is the Ramsey TM100. While this antenna is intended as a transmitting antenna for microbroadcasting FM gear, it makes a rather nice omnidirectional receiving antenna. For example, the centre point of my TM100 is located 12 feet above the ground. My house is 130 feet above sea level. My guess is that the centre point of this antenna is about 50 feet above the average terrain. Hooked up to my Heath PT-1, I can pick up the 37 watt station on the Confederation Bridge, some 30 miles away [as the crow flies]. I can also pick up all the Halifax FM stations [some 80 to 90 miles away, with the Cobequid Mountains in the middle], some of the Saint John NB stations on occassion, Magic 94.9 in Kentville, and even on a few occassions 32 kw CKBW Bridgewater on 98.1. Quite a bit of the credit belongs to the 16 tube PT-1 though! As well, the PT-1 offers superior AM performance - 6 db down at 9000 hz [would go well beyond 9000 hz except for the potent whistle filter]. With NSRC pre-emphasis, the law in Canada whether or not a station is in AM Stereo, this results in a bit of a treble bump with the PT-1. Thus, the AM sounds brighter, cleaner and more "live" than FM. A good EQ can bring the response into a more "accurate" balance. Now to get this back to AM Stereo, the AM Stereo jack on the PT-1 is not for a decoder - but rather for the old stereo simulcast [one channel on AM, the other on the FM sister station] idea used by some sister stations prior to FM stereo. The PT-1 first came out in 1958, so it helped cover the gap between the introduction of stereo LPs and the introduction of FM stereo. I only realized this about the AM Stereo jack having acquired a Sams Photofact last week. I then did another experiment with Chris' decoder board, this time ignoring the AM Stereo jack and instead tapping out of the final IF stage, with a 50K pot to pad the IF output down - the result is great AM Stereo! There is a PT-1 on ebay right now - but the buy it now price is high and it doesn't included the metal top: cgi.ebay.ca/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3001517461&category=3284 But the pictures will give you an idea what these rigs are all about. Pt-1s do come up on eBay from time to time, and the prices are usually not bad - I got my latest one - in mint condition - for $11.50 US! My first one, in very good condition, cost $33US. Phil R. From jsgil@hal-pc.org Mon Jan 20 13:17:12 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Jan 2003 21:17:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 97373 invoked from network); 20 Jan 2003 21:17:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Jan 2003 21:17:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.64) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Jan 2003 21:17:11 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.164] by n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 20 Jan 2003 21:17:10 -0000 Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 21:17:06 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: TM-152 better than TX-11a? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 3120 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.97 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " wrote: >=20 > I understand why phase noise in the local oscillator is a problem, but=20 > I don't understand all its causes, do you know what causes the phase=20 > noise in the TM-152 oscillator? The TX11a seems to use a very similar=20 > AM radio chip to the one used in the TM-152, and also uses the on chip=20 > oscillator, but presumably doesn't have this problem, is this because=20 > the low frequency phase noise is reduced by the feedback provided by=20 > the synthesizer PLL? >=20 > Could the phase noise problem be solved by building a better=20 > oscillator off chip? >=20 > From my conversations with the designers of the CQuam chips, I know=20 > they were concerned with oscillator problems in "analog" tuned radios,=20 > unfortunately I wasn't particularly interested in this aspect of the=20 > system, and didn't pay good attention. I know there is also a "Tuning=20 > Compensator" chip designed to fix some of the problems with manually=20 > tuned radios, but I have never looked at it, I wonder if it includes=20 > any fix for oscillator phase noise? >=20 > John It is the Local Osc. that is the problem in the TM-152. Motorola=AE solved the phase noise problem in the decoder chips by running the PLL Osc. at 3.6MHz, 8x the IF of 450KHz. This reduced the phase noise by 18dB of what it would be at 3.6Mhz. If a 3.6MHz quartz crystal is used for the PLL there is no phase noise to speak of. All LC=20 oscillators have phase noise, some designs more than others and the way the LC Osc. that uses varactor diode caps in DTRs works is that a matched pair is used for both RF & LO tuning. When a station is=20 tuned on a DTR the divide by counter associated with the display generates the LO freq. and sends a control voltage to both RF & LO tuning caps and phase locks the LC LO on the AM chip to the LO signal generated by divide by counter. Any phase noise in the LC LO generates an error voltage in the PLL Loop filter and negates any phase noise. This also allows the RF tuned circuit to properly track the LO. If=20 the varactors are well matched and the circiut is well designed then the RF & LO tuning will track each other very closely. Having the LO accurately track the RF has always been a problem with mechanically tuned radios and the only solution is to add a trimmer cap to the RF for fine tuning and the TM-152 is no exception to this. For best AM Stereo reproduction it is desired to have the carrier in the exact center of the RF Bandpass(Antenna) and the ceramic IF filter. A well designed DTR does this very well but for a mechanically tuned radio like the TM-152 it is an issue. This is why I added a window detector on the PLL Loop Volts of the MC13020 chip that lit an LED when It was tuned the the center of the ceramic filter and a trim cap on the ferrite bar antenna to my TM-152. Pictures of this is on my AM Stereo Site at http://www.hal-pc.org/~jsgil/AM-Stereo under Hardware Modifications. If any of the theory on how a DTR works mentioned above is not accurate feel free to correct me as this is just my prespective on it. JSG From jsgil@hal-pc.org Mon Jan 20 13:56:52 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Jan 2003 21:56:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 41811 invoked from network); 20 Jan 2003 21:56:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Jan 2003 21:56:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Jan 2003 21:56:50 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.141] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 20 Jan 2003 21:56:50 -0000 Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 21:56:48 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: IBOC is NOT AM or stereo. Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1892 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.97 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "amymousie " wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " > wrote: > > > Typically "digital" information is transmitted using some > combination > > AM and PM, and the same is true of AM stereo, which uses both AM > and > > PM modulation of the transmitter, hence it follows that > if "digital" > > doesn't use "amplitude modulation", then by the same reasoning, > > neither does "AM stereo", and thus "AM stereo" is not AM either. > > Umm, if I'm not mistaken, CQUAM uses a suppressed-carrier, amplitude- > modulated signal in quadrature phase to the main amplitude-modulated > carrier? Seems like that is the case. > > And fdrom what I know, most digital transmission schemes use > quadrature AM. > > Amy. This is correct. You can think of QuAM as being defined directly in the rectangular co-ordinate system while the Magnavox AM/PM and Kahn ISB is directly defined in the polar co-ordinate system. Both modes can be converted to and from rectangular and polar representations. Phase Modulation is the result of a QuAM modulation and is non-linear while the AM/PM systems are defined polarly and the phase modulation is linear. In C-QuAM the signal is initially defined rectangularly and the QuAM portion is limited to remove the AM to obtain the PM. It is then redefined polarly unsig this PM and the 1+L+R that was initially used to generate the QuAM. The result is a non-linear AM/PM composite signal the closely resembles QuAM. As a result the AM and PM portions are interrelated in that there is a minimun departure from the original QuAM signal. The benefits of this is it has minimun spectrum spread especially for 2nd & 3rd harmonics as compared to the Magnavox and Kahn systems which could at times produce interference to 1st adjacent channels. JSG From jbyrns@enteract.com Mon Jan 20 15:17:13 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Jan 2003 23:17:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 7851 invoked from network); 20 Jan 2003 23:17:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Jan 2003 23:17:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Jan 2003 23:17:13 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.128] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 20 Jan 2003 23:17:13 -0000 Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 23:17:12 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: IBOC is NOT AM or stereo. Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2058 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.201 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "amymousie " < amymousie@y...> wrote: > > Umm, if I'm not mistaken, CQUAM uses a suppressed-carrier, amplitude- > modulated signal in quadrature phase to the main amplitude-modulated > carrier? Seems like that is the case. What you describe sounds more like a pure QUAM system than it does the CQuam system. The CQuam system in addition to adding "a suppressed- carrier, amplitude- modulated signal in quadrature phase to the main amplitude-modulated carrier", also distorts the amplitude of the resultant signal from what it would be in a pure QUAM system. Consider how a traditional CQuam exciter is interfaced with a transmitter. There are two signals feed to the transmitter, the first being the amplitude signal which is feed to the normal "AM" input of the transmitter. The second signal is a phase modulated constant amplitude signal which is feed to the transmitter in place of the normal crystal oscillator in the transmitter. There is not a quadrature phase signal anywhere in sight on the interface. This same AM/PM interface could also be used to feed a pure QUAM signal to the transmitter, but the amplitude signal would have a different form than it does with CQuam. Also consider that E.H. Armstrong used "a suppressed-carrier, amplitude- modulated signal in quadrature phase" to the carrier, to produce phase modulation in his FM transmitters. To produce FM, or frequency modulation, the audio signal was feed to this phase modulator through an integrator. > And fdrom what I know, most digital transmission schemes use > quadrature AM. Yes, that is the tendency today, in order to cram as many bits as possible into a fixed bandwidth, but it depends on the availability of powerful digital equalizers, which were very expensive before the days of VLSI. In any case, a QAM signal can also be considered as a combination of AM and PM signals, so it is hard to keep "AM" separate from "PM", conceptually they are all intertwined in these systems. John From amstereorules@msn.com Mon Jan 20 15:21:49 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereorules@msn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Jan 2003 23:21:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 54494 invoked from network); 20 Jan 2003 23:21:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Jan 2003 23:21:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.75) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Jan 2003 23:21:48 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.147] by n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 20 Jan 2003 23:21:36 -0000 Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 23:21:34 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: IBOC is NOT AM or stereo. Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 918 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amstereorules " X-Originating-IP: 204.32.69.242 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=130870594 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereorules Thank you D.W Falk. And I am Shane Filan, promoting the AM stereo experience. --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "amymousie " wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " > wrote: > > > Typically "digital" information is transmitted using some > combination > > AM and PM, and the same is true of AM stereo, which uses both AM > and > > PM modulation of the transmitter, hence it follows that > if "digital" > > doesn't use "amplitude modulation", then by the same reasoning, > > neither does "AM stereo", and thus "AM stereo" is not AM either. > > Umm, if I'm not mistaken, CQUAM uses a suppressed-carrier, amplitude- > modulated signal in quadrature phase to the main amplitude- modulated > carrier? Seems like that is the case. > > And fdrom what I know, most digital transmission schemes use > quadrature AM. > > Amy. From jbyrns@enteract.com Mon Jan 20 15:23:48 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 20 Jan 2003 23:23:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 37733 invoked from network); 20 Jan 2003 23:23:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Jan 2003 23:23:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Jan 2003 23:23:48 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.148] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 20 Jan 2003 23:23:48 -0000 Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 23:23:43 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: TM-152 better than TX-11a? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 4164 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.201 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "jsgilst " < jsgil@h...> wrote: >=20 > It is the Local Osc. that is the problem in the TM-152. OK, that is what I was assuming, but what are the causes of the phase=20 noise in the oscillator? > Motorola=AE > solved the phase noise problem in the decoder chips by running the > PLL Osc. at 3.6MHz, 8x the IF of 450KHz. This reduced the phase noise > by 18dB of what it would be at 3.6Mhz. If a 3.6MHz quartz crystal is > used for the PLL there is no phase noise to speak of. All LC=20 > oscillators have phase noise, some designs more than others and the > way the LC Osc. that uses varactor diode caps in DTRs works is that > a matched pair is used for both RF & LO tuning. When a station is=20 > tuned on a DTR the divide by counter associated with the display > generates the LO freq. and sends a control voltage to both RF & LO > tuning caps and phase locks the LC LO on the AM chip to the LO signal > generated by divide by counter. Any phase noise in the LC LO generates > an error voltage in the PLL Loop filter and negates any phase noise. OK, you seem to be confirming my speculation that the feedback in the=20 PLL and VCO of a digitally tuned radio acts to reduce the oscillator=20 phase noise. > This also allows the RF tuned circuit to properly track the LO. If=20 > the varactors are well matched and the circiut is well designed then > the RF & LO tuning will track each other very closely. Having the LO > accurately track the RF has always been a problem with mechanically > tuned radios and the only solution is to add a trimmer cap to the RF > for fine tuning and the TM-152 is no exception to this. I'm not sure what the PLL in a digitally tuned radio has to do with=20 tracking? The tracking problem seems to me to be pretty much the same=20 in a digitally tuned radio, as in a mechanically tuned radio.=20=20 Mechanically tuned radios solved the tracking problem either with cut=20 plate capacitors, or with padder capacitors. In an electronically=20 tuned radio using varactors, we don't have the cut plate capacitor=20 option, so we are pretty much left with using a padder capacitor,=20 which is what both the TX11a and the TM152 seem to do to solve the=20 tracking problem. Using a padder capacitor does not result in perfect=20 tracking, even in a digitally tuned radio with matched varactors, the=20 tracking is no better than in a similar mechanically tuned radio. > For best > AM Stereo reproduction it is desired to have the carrier in the > exact center of the RF Bandpass(Antenna) and the ceramic IF filter. > A well designed DTR does this very well but for a mechanically tuned > radio like the TM-152 it is an issue. I would think a mechanically tuned radio could do it better than a=20 digitally tuned radio, although the stability wouldn't be as good. As=20 I understood it the ceramic filters have a tolerance on their center=20 frequency, so the filters in every radio can end up with a different=20 center frequency. In a digitally tuned radio, the center frequency is=20 going to be dependent on the frequency of the crystal in the=20 synthesizer. I suppose if provision were made to adjust the frequency=20 of the crystal in the synthesizer, then you could set it to the center=20 of the ceramic filters in the radio, but without thinking about it, it=20 isn't clear to me that this center frequency would hold from the top=20 to the bottom of the AM band. > This is why I added a window > detector on the PLL Loop Volts of the MC13020 chip that lit an LED > when It was tuned the the center of the ceramic filter and a trim cap > on the ferrite bar antenna to my TM-152. Pictures of this is on my > AM Stereo Site at http://www.hal-pc.org/~jsgil/AM-Stereo under > Hardware Modifications. If any of the theory on how a DTR works > mentioned above is not accurate feel free to correct me as this is > just my prespective on it. OK, I think I stumbled across your web page a week or two ago, I may=20 have had a few questions for you, which I will have to email you if I=20 can remember them, like what are the Harris QUAM decoder modifications=20 to the TM-152 for? That is assuming I have the right web page? John From davidcoons@webtv.net Mon Jan 20 16:03:28 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: davidcoons@webtv.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Jan 2003 00:03:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 67029 invoked from network); 21 Jan 2003 00:03:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Jan 2003 00:03:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO smtpout-2001-2.public.lawson.webtv.net) (209.240.212.82) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Jan 2003 00:03:27 -0000 Received: from storefull-2315.public.lawson.webtv.net (lawson-public-ipmux-1-pip-3.public.lawson.webtv.net [209.240.212.23]) by smtpout-2001-2.public.lawson.webtv.net (WebTV_Postfix+sws) with ESMTP id B606E79C07 for ; Mon, 20 Jan 2003 16:03:26 -0800 (PST) Received: (from production@localhost) by storefull-2315.public.lawson.webtv.net (8.8.8-wtv-f/mt.gso.26Feb98) id QAA20314; Mon, 20 Jan 2003 16:03:26 -0800 (PST) X-WebTV-Signature: 1 ETAsAhQUtP4C04nIpLuEHirqTNGdgCa/FQIUcMdgO4BWxGxjs9tvyW/g/nfh+no= Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 19:03:25 -0500 (EST) To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} 240V Realistic TM-152 on eBay Message-ID: <21487-3E2C8E4D-22@storefull-2315.public.lawson.webtv.net> In-Reply-To: Richard Wagoner 's message of Mon, 20 Jan 2003 10:32:59 -0800 Content-Disposition: Inline Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) X-eGroups-From: davidcoons@webtv.net (David Coons) From: davidcoons@webtv.net X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10533228 tm-152 narrowband?? I get great wide audio from mine. From jsgil@hal-pc.org Mon Jan 20 16:39:44 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Jan 2003 00:39:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 39393 invoked from network); 21 Jan 2003 00:39:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Jan 2003 00:39:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.84) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Jan 2003 00:39:44 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.184] by n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 21 Jan 2003 00:39:44 -0000 Date: Tue, 21 Jan 2003 00:39:41 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: IBOC is NOT AM or stereo. Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1172 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.130.15 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " wrote: > > Also consider that E.H. Armstrong used "a suppressed-carrier, > amplitude- modulated signal in quadrature phase" to the carrier, to > produce phase modulation in his FM transmitters. To produce FM, or > frequency modulation, the audio signal was feed to this phase > modulator through an integrator. > > John This "Armstrong Phase Modulation" scheme resembles the C-QuAM system with no L+R modulation and just the L-R modulation. It then was limited to remove the amplitude modulation. If it was not multiplied up in frequency but hetrodyned it would have the same sidebands of a C-QuAM signal with no "I" in phase information and just "Q" quadrature information. Since there is no signal on the "I" carrier limiting multiplies the amplitude of the QuAM signal by the Cosine of the Angular Modulation. A C-QuAM decoder would decode it distortion free. You could say that Armstrong was C-QuAMming long before Motorola ever was and didn't even know it. The other reason for phase modulation to generate indirect FM is the center frequency drift is much easier to control. JSG From stodd@sherbtel.net Mon Jan 20 16:41:00 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Jan 2003 00:41:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 83749 invoked from network); 21 Jan 2003 00:40:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Jan 2003 00:40:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Jan 2003 00:40:59 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-85-79.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.85.79]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h0L0euKL019305 for ; Mon, 20 Jan 2003 18:40:57 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <008101c2c0e5$f39d20c0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <001901c2bff5$21c2c320$827dfea9@home1> <009701c2bffc$7365a420$827dfea9@home1> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Old Trandmitters Was: IBOC / AM stereo Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 18:42:15 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude I'd keep that transmitter out of the dump anyway. Doubtless there is an air-cooled version that could be substituted. Heck, I'd take it for my collection, tubes or not if I had the bucks to fetch it. My friend Mike Dorrough may know where to find some of those rare bottles. He may even want the transmitter, though I don't know how actively he's collecting since it's been a couple of years since I talked with him. What is the make and model of this transmitter? ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Possum Hunter" > The tubes in this transmitter were allowed to freeze with water in them, so > the tubes broke. So the bottom line looks like tubes alone would make the > transmitter cost more to put on the air than it is worth. What a shame. From florida_amstereo@hotmail.com Mon Jan 20 16:45:49 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: florida_amstereo@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Jan 2003 00:45:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 51775 invoked from network); 21 Jan 2003 00:45:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Jan 2003 00:45:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.37.30) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Jan 2003 00:45:48 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 20 Jan 2003 16:45:48 -0800 Received: from 209.240.198.61 by pv2fd.pav2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Tue, 21 Jan 2003 00:45:48 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Re: {AMSF} It's the programming... Date: Tue, 21 Jan 2003 00:45:48 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 21 Jan 2003 00:45:48.0757 (UTC) FILETIME=[70D14850:01C2C0E6] From: "Donn Tillman" X-Originating-IP: [209.240.198.61] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83914824 JSG wrote: >"One talk show host (initals are MS) is so insulting at times that he goes beyond disagreeing as to demean the caller. It is one thing to disagree but insulting members of the audience doesn't accomplish anything. The caller didn't even get to finish defining his situation before MS attacked him. I can't see this a being productive." JSG At first, I thought you had mistyped the initials and meant to type LS; but then I figured you meant Michael Savage; both he and LS are combatitive, but apparently some people like that form of entertainment...... it's probably why (JS) Jerry Springer does so well in some markets. ...am I starting to see a trend here, talk-show entertainers with a surname starting with S are all combative? donn st petersburg _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus From stodd@sherbtel.net Mon Jan 20 17:01:34 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Jan 2003 01:01:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 57416 invoked from network); 21 Jan 2003 01:01:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Jan 2003 01:01:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Jan 2003 01:01:33 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-85-79.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.85.79]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h0L11UKL025494 for ; Mon, 20 Jan 2003 19:01:31 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <00c201c2c0e8$d32d4420$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <00ce01c2bffe$74425da0$4490b498@aoldsl.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Carver TX11 Was: Yesterday Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 19:02:49 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Where did you hear it uses the Motorola Symphony chip? That's just been released whereas the tuner has been out over a year. My guess would be a 13028 or '22 chip. I know Marv has been working with a Symphony competitor- Omega Reception Technologies, but they haven't released their chip yet. I hope they get on the ball lest Motorola leave them in the dust. Scott ----- Original Message ----- From: "Possum Hunter" > The Fanfare FTA-100 is the only state-of-the art, AMAX-compliant, AM-stereo > tuner being manufactured anywhere in the world. it uses the Motorola > Symphony chip From stodd@sherbtel.net Mon Jan 20 17:03:07 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Jan 2003 01:03:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 88696 invoked from network); 21 Jan 2003 01:03:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Jan 2003 01:03:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Jan 2003 01:03:06 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-85-79.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.85.79]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h0L133KL025950 for ; Mon, 20 Jan 2003 19:03:04 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <00c801c2c0e9$0ac39ce0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <29755-3E2B4B05-3756@storefull-2318.public.lawson.webtv.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Carver TX11 Was: Yesterday Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 19:04:23 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Without looking at the schematic, they could have merely chosen better component values, or it could be an improved version of the 13020. IIRC someone saying there were many revisions that were not labeled on the chips themselves. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: > thought it was,as the radio shack car stereo changed its decoding with > the new model in 1989? had way less distortion > From stodd@sherbtel.net Mon Jan 20 17:06:29 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Jan 2003 01:06:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 37258 invoked from network); 21 Jan 2003 01:06:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Jan 2003 01:06:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Jan 2003 01:06:29 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-85-79.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.85.79]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h0L16QKL026976 for ; Mon, 20 Jan 2003 19:06:27 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <00ce01c2c0e9$836766e0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <001901c2bff5$21c2c320$827dfea9@home1> <3E2B4B6D.63CD9CF4@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC / AM stereo Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 19:07:45 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude You're my kind of guy. That 300G is a classic of mechanical art. Find someone who's good at auto body work to patch those holes. Lots of hams using those things on 160 and a few on 80. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Neal Newman" > Hey Scott Talk about Old transmitters.. I just acquired 3 More For my > Collection > Now along with My Old RCA BTA-500R I just acquired a Gates BC-1H1 and a > really old but Nice Collins 300G some hunters Must have shot at the > transmitter Building.. there are 2 bullet holes in the cabinet.. > Neal From davidcoons@webtv.net Mon Jan 20 17:07:32 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: davidcoons@webtv.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Jan 2003 01:07:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 42986 invoked from network); 21 Jan 2003 01:07:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Jan 2003 01:07:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO smtpout-2001-1.public.lawson.webtv.net) (209.240.212.81) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Jan 2003 01:07:32 -0000 Received: from storefull-2311.public.lawson.webtv.net (lawson-public-ipmux-1-pip-7.public.lawson.webtv.net [209.240.212.98]) by smtpout-2001-1.public.lawson.webtv.net (WebTV_Postfix+sws) with ESMTP id A4A59BE48 for ; Mon, 20 Jan 2003 17:07:31 -0800 (PST) Received: (from production@localhost) by storefull-2311.public.lawson.webtv.net (8.8.8-wtv-f/mt.gso.26Feb98) id RAA14022; Mon, 20 Jan 2003 17:07:31 -0800 (PST) X-WebTV-Signature: 1 ETAtAhUAriiFuQoxrRr5JzudUH7Pwv5VTBQCFDB9a+2N99jdnKDCyPbkYTSxinxx Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 20:07:31 -0500 (EST) To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Carver TX11 Was: Yesterday Message-ID: <8163-3E2C9D53-479@storefull-2311.public.lawson.webtv.net> In-Reply-To: "Scott Todd" 's message of Mon, 20 Jan 2003 19:04:23 -0600 Content-Disposition: Inline Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) X-eGroups-From: davidcoons@webtv.net (David Coons) From: davidcoons@webtv.net X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10533228 around 1988 the am stereo stations I listened to "moved" the distortion from left channel raspyness to low bass.always figured the new radio shack model was reworked to acount for this as the distortion was much lower From jsgil@hal-pc.org Mon Jan 20 17:24:34 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Jan 2003 01:24:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 20457 invoked from network); 21 Jan 2003 01:24:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Jan 2003 01:24:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Jan 2003 01:24:34 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.188] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 21 Jan 2003 01:24:34 -0000 Date: Tue, 21 Jan 2003 01:24:32 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: TM-152 better than TX-11a? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 4823 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.6 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " wrote: >=20 > > This also allows the RF tuned circuit to properly track the LO. If=20 > > the varactors are well matched and the circiut is well designed then > > the RF & LO tuning will track each other very closely. Having the LO > > accurately track the RF has always been a problem with mechanically > > tuned radios and the only solution is to add a trimmer cap to the RF > > for fine tuning and the TM-152 is no exception to this. >=20 > I'm not sure what the PLL in a digitally tuned radio has to do with=20 > tracking? The tracking problem seems to me to be pretty much the same=20 > in a digitally tuned radio, as in a mechanically tuned radio.=20=20 > Mechanically tuned radios solved the tracking problem either with cut=20 > plate capacitors, or with padder capacitors. In an electronically=20 > tuned radio using varactors, we don't have the cut plate capacitor=20 > option, so we are pretty much left with using a padder capacitor,=20 > which is what both the TX11a and the TM152 seem to do to solve the=20 > tracking problem. Using a padder capacitor does not result in perfect=20 > tracking, even in a digitally tuned radio with matched varactors, the=20 > tracking is no better than in a similar mechanically tuned radio. >=20 Using a single capacitor to pad the LO doesn't track very well when using matching capacitors for both the RF and IF tuning regardless of whether they are varactors or the TM-152 setup. Hence the reason why I put a trimcap on the TM-152 antenna. I modeled this padding method in Excel and found that there was a =B18KHz tracking error across the AM band between the LO and RF even after tweaking the padding values. On a Pioneer DTR is has more than one capacitor padding in some sort of series parallel configuration. When I=20 adjusted for tracking all across the dial I was amazed how well it tracked compared compared to the TM-152. >=20 > I would think a mechanically tuned radio could do it better than a=20 > digitally tuned radio, although the stability wouldn't be as good.=20 As=20 > I understood it the ceramic filters have a tolerance on their center=20 > frequency, so the filters in every radio can end up with a different=20 > center frequency.=20=20 Ceramic filters usually have a =B11KHz tolerance but I set the center of the window detection on the PLL Loop Volts on the 13020 when I had it tuned to the center of the ceramic filter by tuning for minimum treble response. It works pretty well across the whole dial. > In a digitally tuned radio, the center frequency is=20 > going to be dependent on the frequency of the crystal in the=20 > synthesizer. I suppose if provision were made to adjust the frequency=20 > of the crystal in the synthesizer, then you could set it to the center=20 > of the ceramic filters in the radio, but without thinking about it, it=20 > isn't clear to me that this center frequency would hold from the top=20 > to the bottom of the AM band. > This is the disadvantage of a DTR when the ceramic filter of its labeled center frequency by a great deal. If all stations' carriers are within the =B120Hz as required by the FCC then if the ceramic=20 filter is off by -2KHz at the low end of the dial then it will be off by -2KHz at the top end of the dial =B120Hz of the stations tolerance and the tolerance fo the DTR synthesizer. I would think that the=20 offset would be the pretty much the same across the dial within the sum of the tolerances of the stations' carriers and the synthesizer within =B1100Hz. The ceramic filters have tolerances 10 to 20 times=20 this. =20 >=20 > OK, I think I stumbled across your web page a week or two ago, I may=20 > have had a few questions for you, which I will have to email you if I=20 > can remember them, like what are the Harris QUAM decoder modifications=20 > to the TM-152 for? That is assuming I have the right web page? >=20 > John You got the right page. The reason I adapted the MC13020 chip for synchronous detection is that it used an envelope detector for L+R and there was nasty flaws in the Cosine correction circuit where it would latch up from positive feedback during interference and skywave reception. It doesn't take much to make this chip sound much worse than C-QuAM detected as QuAM so under these circumstances it really helped and greatly reduced platform motion during skywave reception. Contrary to what Motorola says in the datasheets about all the other chips besides the 13020 full synchronous detection is used for both L+R and L-R. The envelope detection is only used to develop the Cosine correction signal and a signal quality detector is used to determine the amount that can be used for the minimun amount of distortion. Under heavy interference Cosine correction is reduced to a minimun effectivily turning it into a QuAM receiver. JSG From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Mon Jan 20 17:40:28 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Jan 2003 01:40:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 85935 invoked from network); 21 Jan 2003 01:40:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Jan 2003 01:40:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14203.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.145) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Jan 2003 01:40:25 -0000 Message-ID: <20030121014025.51553.qmail@web14203.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.166.39.97] by web14203.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 20 Jan 2003 17:40:25 PST Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 17:40:25 -0800 (PST) Subject: Dumb Question To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio What ancilliary circuitry is required if the 3.6MHz resonator is replaced with a 3.6MHz crystal? __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From KC4QLP@aol.com Mon Jan 20 17:47:17 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Jan 2003 01:47:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 27545 invoked from network); 21 Jan 2003 01:47:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Jan 2003 01:47:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d04.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.36) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Jan 2003 01:47:07 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.a1.32cbc2c5 (18555) for ; Mon, 20 Jan 2003 20:46:51 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 20:46:50 EST Subject: DRM software receiver news. 20 January To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Language: en X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Ok folks...looks like DRM is about to take off on North Amercias BBC. The following is from an email I received today ---------------------------------------------------------------------------= --- ------------------------------------- Software now available. The software has been available since 31 December,= =20 but many people may not know this because of a problem with the e mail=20 utility. Apologies to those affected. please see http://www.DRMrx.org for=20 more details. BBC start DRM transmissions to North America. The BBC, in support of the DRM software radio project, have started test=20 transmissions from Radio Canada=E2=80=99s Sackville site. Details of the transmissions can be found on the Radio Netherlands web site= =20 at http://www.rnw.nl/realradio/html/drm_latest.html New Version of Software to be released by the end of January. A new version will be released later this month. This will have 2 main=20 changes, the 1st to fix a =E2=80=9Cbug=E2=80=9D that affects the Multimedia= decoder when=20 using Win9x or NT (but 2000 and XP are OK and not affected) The second change is to overcome a problem with some soundcards which have= =20 too high a samplerate offset (up to 700 ppm), especially some expensive=20 Terratec cards which show this behaviour (which is not good for the audio=20 quality anyway!!!).We will fix this by adding a software resampler module. New versions are included in the licence cost, so licensees will be e maile= d=20 as soon as the software is available for them to download. Direct conversion receiver. Many thanks to Frans Sessink in the Netherlands for providing the details o= f=20 his homemade DRM receiver: It is a fixed frequency receiver (tuned to the=20 Sines transmitter) built from a few components in an afternoon, and judging= =20 by the screenshots, it works too! A fun project, it really is worth a look:=20 http://www.drmrx.org/mods/Simple_fixed_channel_DRM-v2.pdf Regards, James Briggs VT Merlin Communications ---------------------------------------------------------------------------= --- ------------------------------------------ Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group =20 WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3=20 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 = =20 =20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineeri= ng=20 services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net=20 Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC=20 WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- Subscribe send an email to amstereo-subscribe@topica.com = =20=20=20 = =20 _______________________________________________________=20 From JH_Radio@GameBox.net Mon Jan 20 21:11:20 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: JH_Radio@GameBox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Jan 2003 05:11:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 20533 invoked from network); 21 Jan 2003 05:11:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Jan 2003 05:11:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO snickers.hotpop.com) (204.57.55.49) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Jan 2003 05:11:20 -0000 Received: from gamebox.net (kubrick.hotpop.com [204.57.55.16]) by snickers.hotpop.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 592A879525 for ; Tue, 21 Jan 2003 05:10:47 +0000 (UTC) Received: from -enduser.GameBox.net (pcp03184855pcs.benslm01.pa.comcast.net [68.80.77.117]) by smtp-2.hotpop.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 93A521B88F3 for ; Mon, 20 Jan 2003 18:39:52 +0000 (UTC) Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030120134153.03371ad0@pop.GameBox.net> X-Sender: JH_Radio@pop.GameBox.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 13:42:10 -0500 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} 240V Realistic TM-152 on eBay In-Reply-To: <3E2C40DB.3060503@cox.net> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 X-HotPOP: ----------------------------------------------- Sent By HotPOP.com FREE Email Get your FREE POP email at www.HotPOP.com ----------------------------------------------- From: John X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113800107 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Oh dear, and I probably overpaid at the $86 price. At 10:32 AM 1/20/03 -0800, you wrote: >TM-152 for $45? That's as mich as when new, isn't it? > >And I still think it sounded awful. Narrowband stereo isn't better than >narrowband mono to me. I'd rather have wideband mono than lousy sounding >stereo. > >It was tuners like this that kept AM stereo from catching on. > >Richard > > >Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Love in Christ: John Bensalem, PA Send me an email Aim: RainAngelsRule MSN: RainAngelsRule@hotmail.com My website Welcome to Napster4TheBlind "Prayer does not change God; it changes you." - Authur unknown [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From jsgil@hal-pc.org Mon Jan 20 21:15:57 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Jan 2003 05:15:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 86998 invoked from network); 21 Jan 2003 05:15:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Jan 2003 05:15:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Jan 2003 05:15:57 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.167] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 21 Jan 2003 05:15:56 -0000 Date: Tue, 21 Jan 2003 05:15:54 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Dumb Question Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20030121014025.51553.qmail@web14203.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 741 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.119 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John P." wrote: > What ancilliary circuitry is required if the 3.6MHz resonator is replaced with > a 3.6MHz crystal? > If you are talking about the MC13020 decoder the datasheet specifies components for LC, Ceramic, & Crystal. The Osc. on the MC13022 is set up th same way as the MC13020 and component values are very similar for a ceramic setup. If you wanted to use a LC or crystal PLL on the MC13022 then look at the MC13020 datasheet for component values. You may need to tweak the loop filter at pin 24 on the MC13022 for best lock capability. As for the MC13028 it may require some experimentation. The datasheet for the MC13020 is available in the files section. JSG From alfredot@inetarena.com Mon Jan 20 22:32:09 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: alfredot@inetarena.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Jan 2003 06:32:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 41372 invoked from network); 21 Jan 2003 06:32:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Jan 2003 06:32:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.inetarena.com) (206.129.216.13) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Jan 2003 06:32:07 -0000 Received: from hendrie (1Cust215.tnt16.beaverton.or.da.uu.net [67.227.163.215]) by mail.inetarena.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h0L6TfB27699 for ; Mon, 20 Jan 2003 22:29:41 -0800 (PST) Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 22:31:22 -0800 (PST) X-Sender: alfredo@hendrie.1610am.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: TM-152 better than TX-11a? In-Reply-To: <1043111342.1008.87564.m15@yahoogroups.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: "Alfredo E. Torrejon" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=25132238 X-Yahoo-Profile: alfredotorrejon > I understand why phase noise in the local oscillator is a problem, but > I don't understand all its causes, do you know what causes the phase > noise in the TM-152 oscillator? The TX11a seems to use a very similar > AM radio chip to the one used in the TM-152, and also uses the on chip > oscillator, but presumably doesn't have this problem, is this because > the low frequency phase noise is reduced by the feedback provided by > the synthesizer PLL? The main factor that drives phase noise is the "Q" of the oscillator tank coil. There are two things that are interesting about the local oscillator of the TM-152. The first is that the oscillator circuit in the LA1245 receiver IC has a built-in AGC circuit that holds the local oscillator level at pin #19 at 350mV. According to the data sheet, this was done for the benefit of varactor-tuned radios; apparently, excessive drive levels can detune varactor-based tank circuits, thus leading to poor tracking. I do not know what (if any) the effects of this AGC circuit are on phase noise. The second is that the TM-152's designers chose to put a 5.6k resistor across the local oscillator tank coil; this resistor does not show up in the circuits in the LA1245 data sheet. Sometime later this week, I think that I'm going to try to put a potentiometer there to see whether there's an optimum value for low phase noise or whether the phase noise is lowest without this component in the circuit. A few years ago, I went to a talk on the subject of low-noise varactor-tuned oscillator design. One thing that was pointed out was that the "Q" of hyper-abruct junction varactor diodes (which are what is used in AM tuners) becomes very poor at the lower end of the capacitance range. Unfortunately, the noise-reduction design techniques discussed at this talk all had the effect of reducing the oscillator's tuning range, so they are of no use for oscillators, such those in AM receivers, that must cover a wide frequency range. An alternate strategy taken by Motorola in their AMAX chipset and in their old "Tuning Stabilizer" IC was to run the local oscillator at a multiple of the required frequency (most likely 4X) and then divide it down. Alfredo From rwagoner@cox.net Mon Jan 20 23:48:43 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner@cox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Jan 2003 07:48:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 31203 invoked from network); 21 Jan 2003 07:48:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Jan 2003 07:48:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO fed1mtao03.cox.net) (68.6.19.242) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Jan 2003 07:48:41 -0000 Received: from cox.net ([68.4.33.253]) by fed1mtao03.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20030121074841.VJJB28517.fed1mtao03.cox.net@cox.net> for ; Tue, 21 Jan 2003 02:48:41 -0500 Message-ID: <3E2CFB5A.6090100@cox.net> Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 23:48:42 -0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20021120 Netscape/7.01 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} 240V Realistic TM-152 on eBay References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030120134153.03371ad0@pop.GameBox.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Richard Wagoner X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public Depends ... $45 back when it was new is worth, what, $90 now? > Oh dear, and I probably overpaid at the $86 price. > At 10:32 AM 1/20/03 -0800, you wrote: > >TM-152 for $45? That's as mich as when new, isn't it? From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Jan 20 23:50:22 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Jan 2003 07:50:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 89925 invoked from network); 21 Jan 2003 07:50:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Jan 2003 07:50:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.86) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Jan 2003 07:50:21 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.160] by n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 21 Jan 2003 07:50:20 -0000 Date: Tue, 21 Jan 2003 07:50:19 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: 240V Realistic TM-152 on eBay Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20030120134153.03371ad0@pop.GameBox.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 599 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.96.169 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Oh dear, and I probably overpaid at the $86 price. In 1988, Radio Shack was closing out brand new TM-152s at just over $20 each... but it seems that all AM Stereo radios with an enthusiast following have increased in value over the years. I now see even Sony SRF-42s -- originally sold for $29.99 each at Radio Shack up until three years ago -- going for more than twice that price on eBay, and SRF-A100s are now well into the multi-hundred-dollar range (and trust me, it is a good radio, but not *that* good that it should be going for more than three times its original retail price). From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Jan 20 23:54:38 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Jan 2003 07:54:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 73981 invoked from network); 21 Jan 2003 07:54:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Jan 2003 07:54:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Jan 2003 07:54:37 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.164] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 21 Jan 2003 07:54:37 -0000 Date: Tue, 21 Jan 2003 07:54:35 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: 240V Realistic TM-152 on eBay Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3E2CFB5A.6090100@cox.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 247 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.96.169 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Depends ... $45 back when it was new is worth, what, $90 now? At least in the USA, the original retail price of the TM-152 tuner at Radio Shack was $59.95, from its official introduction on November 30, 1985 until close-out some time in 1988. From ccuff@in4web.com Tue Jan 21 00:29:50 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Jan 2003 08:29:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 94883 invoked from network); 21 Jan 2003 08:29:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Jan 2003 08:29:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Jan 2003 08:29:49 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.24]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Tue, 21 Jan 2003 03:25:41 -0500 Message-ID: <002501c2c126$02ee87e0$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: <20030121014025.51553.qmail@web14203.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Dumb Question Date: Tue, 21 Jan 2003 03:20:51 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 John, Nothing else need be done- btw- a good source for 3.6 meg xtals is nearly any Delco radio- they use 3.6 for the tuner PLL, even non-stereo models. The crystal will not be suitable, as a rule, with manual tuned radios, due to the crustals extremely tight lock range. CC ----- Original Message ----- From: John P. To: Sent: Monday, January 20, 2003 8:40 PM Subject: {AMSF} Dumb Question > What ancilliary circuitry is required if the 3.6MHz resonator is replaced with > a 3.6MHz crystal? From scott.toenniessen@fmr.com Tue Jan 21 10:18:30 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: scott.toenniessen@fmr.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Jan 2003 18:18:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 63990 invoked from network); 21 Jan 2003 18:18:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Jan 2003 18:18:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Jan 2003 18:18:27 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.143] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 21 Jan 2003 18:18:27 -0000 Date: Tue, 21 Jan 2003 18:18:26 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Keep an two ears on KB 1520 Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 583 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "spt87a " X-Originating-IP: 204.110.135.35 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=133257283 X-Yahoo-Profile: spt87a Check out the discussion group www.wnymedia.com. Rumors have been swirling for a while about a format change at WWBK AM Stereo 1520 from business radio to a revival of the old top 40 KB sound (not sure which era - may be '50s/'60s or 60's/'70s.) Some previous KB personal seem to be involved including Danny Neaverth who lost his job on a Buffalo FM last summer and Hank Nevins. The Buffalo News ran a story on it a week or so ago as well. "Teasers" including old jingle packages started running today. For those in the Northeast, this will be an easy DX catch - Scott From scott.toenniessen@fmr.com Tue Jan 21 10:26:00 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: scott.toenniessen@fmr.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Jan 2003 18:25:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 83179 invoked from network); 21 Jan 2003 18:25:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Jan 2003 18:25:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Jan 2003 18:25:52 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.175] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 21 Jan 2003 18:25:52 -0000 Date: Tue, 21 Jan 2003 18:25:52 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Keep an two ears on KB 1520 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 275 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "spt87a " X-Originating-IP: 204.110.135.35 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=133257283 X-Yahoo-Profile: spt87a --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "spt87a " wrote: > Check out the discussion group www.wnymedia.com. Rumors have been > swirling for a while about a format change at WWBK AM Stereo 1520 Oops, that's WWKB. - Scott From michaelj@vcn.com Tue Jan 21 10:28:59 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Jan 2003 18:28:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 7230 invoked from network); 21 Jan 2003 18:28:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Jan 2003 18:28:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m2-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.32) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Jan 2003 18:28:58 -0000 Received: from michael (unverified [209.193.86.81]) by m2-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Tue, 21 Jan 2003 11:28:58 -0700 To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} Keep an two ears on KB 1520 Date: Tue, 21 Jan 2003 11:28:20 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Wow! This sounds like fun! Another AM possibly returning to music! Wish I could get them. Unfortunately 1520 is pounded by KOMA out here. They ARE still oldies a lot of the time , but MONO with no hopes whatsoever of returning to stereo :( MJR n WYO -----Original Message----- From: spt87a [mailto:scott.toenniessen@fmr.com] Sent: Tuesday, January 21, 2003 11:18 AM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Keep an two ears on KB 1520 Check out the discussion group www.wnymedia.com. Rumors have been swirling for a while about a format change at WWBK AM Stereo 1520 from business radio to a revival of the old top 40 KB sound (not sure which era - may be '50s/'60s or 60's/'70s.) Some previous KB personal seem to be involved including Danny Neaverth who lost his job on a Buffalo FM last summer and Hank Nevins. The Buffalo News ran a story on it a week or so ago as well. "Teasers" including old jingle packages started running today. For those in the Northeast, this will be an easy DX catch - Scott [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From philipr@irac.pe.ca Tue Jan 21 10:57:04 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Jan 2003 18:57:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 34473 invoked from network); 21 Jan 2003 18:57:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Jan 2003 18:57:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.70) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Jan 2003 18:57:02 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.181] by n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 21 Jan 2003 18:57:02 -0000 Date: Tue, 21 Jan 2003 18:57:01 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Keep an two ears on KB 1520 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1690 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking I'm keeping my fingers crossed. WWKB 1520 AM Stereo has a solid nightime signal here in PEI - it is the only solid signal to trip the pilot light here! Every night I check it out, but I don't stay because its talk - heck, if I want talk, I'll turn on CBC Radio One. I'll settle for just about any type of music in AM Stereo, but a 60s and 70s top 40 format would really appeal to me! Phil R. --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Michael J. Richard" wrote: > Wow! This sounds like fun! Another AM possibly returning to music! > Wish I could get them. Unfortunately 1520 is pounded by KOMA out here. > They ARE still oldies a lot of the time , but MONO with no hopes whatsoever > of returning to stereo :( > > MJR n WYO > > -----Original Message----- > From: spt87a > [mailto:scott.toenniessen@f...] > Sent: Tuesday, January 21, 2003 11:18 AM > To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com > Subject: {AMSF} Keep an two ears on KB 1520 > > > Check out the discussion group www.wnymedia.com. Rumors have been > swirling for a while about a format change at WWBK AM Stereo 1520 > from business radio to a revival of the old top 40 KB sound (not > sure which era - may be '50s/'60s or 60's/'70s.) Some previous KB > personal seem to be involved including Danny Neaverth who lost his > job on a Buffalo FM last summer and Hank Nevins. The Buffalo News > ran a story on it a week or so ago as well. > > "Teasers" including old jingle packages started running today. > > For those in the Northeast, this will be an easy DX catch > > - Scott > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From jbyrns@enteract.com Tue Jan 21 11:09:17 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Jan 2003 19:09:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 97423 invoked from network); 21 Jan 2003 19:09:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Jan 2003 19:09:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Jan 2003 19:09:16 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.178] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 21 Jan 2003 19:09:13 -0000 Date: Tue, 21 Jan 2003 19:09:12 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: IBOC is NOT AM or stereo. Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2307 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.98.119 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "jsgilst " < jsgil@h...> wrote: > > This is correct. You can think of QuAM as being defined directly > in the rectangular co-ordinate system while the Magnavox AM/PM and > Kahn ISB is directly defined in the polar co-ordinate system. Both > modes can be converted to and from rectangular and polar > representations. Phase Modulation is the result of a QuAM modulation > and is non-linear while the AM/PM systems are defined polarly and the > phase modulation is linear. I don't believe this is correct, AM/PM systems like the Magnavox system are nonlinear, not linear. I believe all the AM stereo systems with the exception of the Harris system, which was a pure QUAM system, are nonlinear, unless I have forgotten one. A pure ISB system would also be linear, but the Kahn system was not a pure ISB system, all it CISB. Generally I don't believe it is possible for a constant envelope PM signal, as is used in AM stereo systems when L = -R to be linear, except for the Harris system which was pure QUAM. I'm not sure what the formal definition of linear vs. non linear modulation is, but I think it comes down to linear systems not creating any additional sidebands around the carrier other than those that result from the direct translation of the modulating signal up to the carrier frequency, and the mirroring of those sidebands around the carrier. Non linear systems, like PM and FM create additional sidebands around the carrier at harmonics of the modulating frequencies, as well as at the sum and difference frequencies of the modulating signal frequencies. John > In C-QuAM the signal is initially defined > rectangularly and the QuAM portion is limited to remove the AM to > obtain the PM. It is then redefined polarly unsig this PM and the > 1+L+R that was initially used to generate the QuAM. The result is a > non-linear AM/PM composite signal the closely resembles QuAM. As a > result the AM and PM portions are interrelated in that there is a > minimun departure from the original QuAM signal. The benefits of this > is it has minimun spectrum spread especially for 2nd & 3rd harmonics > as compared to the Magnavox and Kahn systems which could at times > produce interference to 1st adjacent channels. > > JSG From fanfare@globility.com Tue Jan 21 11:17:56 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Jan 2003 19:17:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 90656 invoked from network); 21 Jan 2003 19:17:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Jan 2003 19:17:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Jan 2003 19:17:56 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.165] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 21 Jan 2003 19:17:55 -0000 Date: Tue, 21 Jan 2003 19:17:55 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Keep an two ears on KB 1520 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1428 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Marv Southcott " X-Originating-IP: 64.56.235.44 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "spt87a " wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "spt87a > " wrote: > > Check out the discussion group www.wnymedia.com. Rumors have been > > swirling for a while about a format change at WWBK AM Stereo 1520 > > Oops, that's WWKB. > > - Scott That's good news Scott. Especially the fact that it is in the same town where we make the FTA-100 AMAX / FM monitor. As you all know, 1050 CHUM had returned to a music format, but had not been able to maintain their stereo signal for very long after the format change. As a result, the nearest, and probably the best AM stereo signal in the whole area is CFCO 630. John P. very kindly sent me a few tracks from their off air. They are very good. Who knows, we might end up with two stations in the immediate area from which we can determine signal quality. The best though comes off our own generators and it is very clean. The one I'd really love to see go stereo is AM740. BTW, I noticed in one of Possumhunter's strings that the Fanfare FTA-100 uses the Motorola Symphony chipset. Not so, Kevin, my friend. No one uses that chipset in a production receiver as yet. In fact, the place you are going to see it first is in offshore products. They no longer want to pay much attention to US builders, unless they do big numbers. M. From ccuff@in4web.com Tue Jan 21 15:03:25 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 21 Jan 2003 23:03:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 36339 invoked from network); 21 Jan 2003 23:03:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Jan 2003 23:03:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Jan 2003 23:03:22 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.91]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Tue, 21 Jan 2003 17:59:15 -0500 Message-ID: <002901c2c1a0$0b916000$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Keep an two ears on KB 1520 Date: Tue, 21 Jan 2003 17:54:24 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 Now wait- didn't someone just post that all Entercom stations were ordered to switch to IBOC? If so, while it will be great to see an old childhood favorite come back, I remain "cautiously optomistic" When I was a kid, it was WKBW every night- and when they plated a bad song, we switched to WPTR. I used WWKB for radio design testing in recent years until they killed the music. CC (remembering when "classic hits" were new releases....) ----- Original Message ----- From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Jan 21 16:40:34 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Jan 2003 00:40:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 32095 invoked from network); 22 Jan 2003 00:40:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Jan 2003 00:40:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.64) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Jan 2003 00:40:33 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.162] by n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 22 Jan 2003 00:40:32 -0000 Date: Wed, 22 Jan 2003 00:40:32 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Keep an two ears on KB 1520 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <002901c2c1a0$0b916000$0101a8c0@pavilion> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1006 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.93.33 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > I used WWKB for radio design testing in recent years until they > killed the music. When I first discovered AM Stereo in 1995, WWKB was running the satellite "Real Country" format, and it sounded fantastic in Stereo. Here in NJ we actually could use a good nighttime-AM-skywave Country music station, as the last local Country station -- a 250-watt AM daytimer -- has just been sold and switched to a Gospel format (although all the Country DJs remain, and it is interesting to hear them now playing a totally different kind of music). But I guess WWKB may be going for what 1530 WSAI switched to -- a '50s/'60s Oldies format with a classic Top 40-style presentation. This would also be great to hear, although it would be even better if they kept WWKB in AM Stereo -- for the past night or two, I haven't been able to get a Stereo signal from them, but they've been flakey in the past; maybe they switch to a mono backup transmitter for one week every two months, or something like that. From possumhunter@netzero.net Tue Jan 21 16:51:51 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Jan 2003 00:51:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 87097 invoked from network); 22 Jan 2003 00:51:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Jan 2003 00:51:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.92) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Jan 2003 00:51:51 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 21 Jan 2003 16:51:51 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} WOR used IBOC in 1938 Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 19:43:13 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 22 Jan 2003 00:51:51.0452 (UTC) FILETIME=[7369E5C0:01C2C1B0] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.146.114.76] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 kevtronics@yahoo.com wrote: > In 1938, WOR tried to push into the future when it began facsimile transmission, utilizing overnight hours to experimentally deliver a morning newspaper and other printed matter by radio. The effort never met with public favor, though it can be seen as a forerunner to today's online services. That was in the days when most everyone had a wide band console radio in the living room. I bet that fax transmission made a helluva racket and splattered several channels just like IBOC does today. Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Tue Jan 21 16:51:54 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Jan 2003 00:51:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 70037 invoked from network); 22 Jan 2003 00:51:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Jan 2003 00:51:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.79) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Jan 2003 00:51:54 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 21 Jan 2003 16:51:54 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC / AM stereo Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 20:06:15 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 22 Jan 2003 00:51:54.0231 (UTC) FILETIME=[7511F070:01C2C1B0] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.146.114.76] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 jbyrns@enteract.com wrote: >It was not a case of apples to oranges in my test of the vertical whip, which by the way was not actually the Fanfare version, but was one of the clones sold by Magnum Dynalab, and Metz. OK then you were comparing Ice Cream to sh*t then. How can you badmouth Fanfare's antenna when the one you tested was a Metz or Magnum Dynalab? That is like me saying that a RCA BTA1R1 is a pile of junk because the CCA AM1000D was a crap box and they are both plate modulated with 4-400s as modulator tubes and PAs. The truth is the RCA BTA1R1 is one of the best tube transmitters ever made while the CCA AM1000D was one of the worst! Not that I am saying Magnum Dynalabs makes junk, because they do make some killer gear, but you can't use a Magnum Dynalabs product to judge a Fanfare product! The only honest way to compare antennas is to use a calibrated test range. Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Tue Jan 21 16:51:56 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Jan 2003 00:51:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 60183 invoked from network); 22 Jan 2003 00:51:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Jan 2003 00:51:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.96) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Jan 2003 00:51:56 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 21 Jan 2003 16:51:56 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Old Trandmitters Was: IBOC / AM stereo Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 21:39:43 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 22 Jan 2003 00:51:56.0292 (UTC) FILETIME=[764C6C40:01C2C1B0] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.146.114.76] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 jbyrns@enteract.com wrote: > Is it an antique RCA 50B transmitter, the elusive and mysterious BTA-50C, It is supposed to be a BTA50C. I have not seen this transmitter with my own eyes yet. I hope we can go take the nickel tour next week. Trust me, if I don't get it on the air, I will find it a home in a radio museum! Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Tue Jan 21 16:51:59 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Jan 2003 00:51:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 70596 invoked from network); 22 Jan 2003 00:51:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Jan 2003 00:51:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.125) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Jan 2003 00:51:58 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 21 Jan 2003 16:51:58 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: New file uploaded to amstereoforum Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 21:53:06 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 22 Jan 2003 00:51:58.0357 (UTC) FILETIME=[77878450:01C2C1B0] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.146.114.76] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 kevtronics@yahoo.com wrote: > CDs also can sound quite good, but I would only really say that about CDs made prior to 1993. For some reason, 1993 was the year when the CD "loudness wars" emerged en masse, with audio frequently processed to the point of brute force digital clipping, where the tops and bottoms of the waveforms are simply "hacked off", greatly increasing loudness at the expense of a large loss of dynamic range and distortion created from sine waves being flat-topped into near-square waves. This practice just makes zero sense. The big selling point of CDs was Dynamic range when CDs took over the vinyl and tape market. Another one I cannot figure out is why on earth radio show producers compress even more life out of the songs. When you play back the Fox All Access Countdown, the VU meters just sit on 0db and never wiggle or move for a whole song! You may as well listen to a sine wave. Do the producers not know that each radio station has an audio processor already in the air chain? Kevin From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Jan 21 17:24:31 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Jan 2003 01:24:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 99332 invoked from network); 22 Jan 2003 01:24:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Jan 2003 01:24:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Jan 2003 01:24:30 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.163] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 22 Jan 2003 01:24:30 -0000 Date: Wed, 22 Jan 2003 01:24:29 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: pre-processed audio, CDs, LPs, etc. Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2037 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.93.33 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > When you play back the Fox All Access Countdown, the VU meters just > sit on 0db and never wiggle or move for a whole song! You may as > well listen to a sine wave. Do the producers not know that each > radio station has an audio processor already in the air chain? Excessive pre-compression of the program material actually results in the audio being *quieter* once it gets on the air, because Optimod- type processors are designed to work with the peaks and valleys in the sound and use them as guides to do their processing magic. When the incoming audio has already been subjected to multi-band compression and clipping, the station's audio processor has nothing it can do except knock down the gain of every frequency range -- which reduces overall loudness. Even Bob Orban himself has identified this problem and talked about it in radio message groups. Clipping distortion also becomes more prominent, to the point where it can be annoyingly noticeable. For example, during the "loud" bridge sections of Norah Jones' big hit "Don't Know Why", you'll notice that her voice sounds distorted; but that's not a result of the station's audio processing... it's distorted RIGHT ON THE CD! Due to this trend of "hypercompression", even re-releases of old albums and "greatest hits" collections are subject to have their dynamic range destroyed. In many cases it's just better to raid your local thrift shops and garage sales to find the original LPs, in order to hear the original sonic beauty of your favorite recordings, even despite the pops and clicks. Plus you'll save a ton of money -- I go to the Princeton Record Exchange ( http://www.prex.com ) and they have racks and racks full of LPs at $1.00 each -- many of which look like they have never been played, and sound like it too. (And if you really want to, they also have a large collection of used CDs at $1.99 each, and by now they're probably giving away cassettes for pennies each, since this format has so quickly plummeted in popularity.) From stodd@sherbtel.net Tue Jan 21 18:14:02 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Jan 2003 02:14:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 79165 invoked from network); 22 Jan 2003 02:14:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Jan 2003 02:14:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Jan 2003 02:14:00 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-182.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.182]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h0M2DuhF028403 for ; Tue, 21 Jan 2003 20:13:58 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <005f01c2c1bc$1ded5260$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <002901c2c1a0$0b916000$0101a8c0@pavilion> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Keep an two ears on KB 1520 Date: Tue, 21 Jan 2003 20:15:18 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Unfortunately there are no Entercom stations in my market. If any of you are engineers in a market shared with one of their stations, please ask their engineer(s) if they could procure some of the old AMS gear for you. I'm hoping to grab onto some stuff from another major broadcasting company. Will supply details after it happens. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Christopher Cuff" To: Sent: Tuesday, January 21, 2003 4:54 PM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Keep an two ears on KB 1520 > Now wait- didn't someone just post that all Entercom stations were ordered > to switch to IBOC? > If so, while it will be great to see an old childhood favorite come back, I > remain "cautiously optomistic" > When I was a kid, it was WKBW every night- and when they plated a bad song, > we switched to WPTR. > I used WWKB for radio design testing in recent years until they killed the > music. > CC (remembering when "classic hits" were new releases....) > ----- Original Message ----- > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > From possumhunter@netzero.net Tue Jan 21 18:56:35 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Jan 2003 02:56:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 43923 invoked from network); 22 Jan 2003 02:56:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Jan 2003 02:56:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.192) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Jan 2003 02:56:33 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 21 Jan 2003 18:56:33 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Keep an two ears on KB 1520 Date: Tue, 21 Jan 2003 21:16:01 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 22 Jan 2003 02:56:33.0116 (UTC) FILETIME=[DED539C0:01C2C1C1] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.153.22.168] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 fanfare@globility.com wrote: >The one I'd really love to see go stereo is AM740. I would love to see that happen too, but it ain't likely. CBC still owns the transmitter and they just got a brand new MONO Optimod 9200. > > BTW, I noticed in one of Possumhunter's strings that the Fanfare FTA-100 uses the Motorola Symphony chipset. Not so, Kevin, my friend. Now I am wondering where I read that??? oh well. Kevin From jbyrns@enteract.com Tue Jan 21 20:54:08 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Jan 2003 04:54:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 4046 invoked from network); 22 Jan 2003 04:54:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Jan 2003 04:54:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.89) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Jan 2003 04:54:06 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.135] by n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 22 Jan 2003 04:54:06 -0000 Date: Wed, 22 Jan 2003 04:54:06 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: IBOC / AM stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1949 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.98.223 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Possum Hunter" < possumhunter@n...> wrote: > jbyrns@e... wrote: > >It was not a case of apples to oranges in my test of the vertical whip, > which by the way was not actually the Fanfare version, but was one of the > clones sold by Magnum Dynalab, and Metz. > > OK then you were comparing Ice Cream to sh*t then. How can you badmouth > Fanfare's antenna when the one you tested was a Metz or Magnum Dynalab? Why does this come off like you are trying to curry favor with Fanfare? I would suggest that it is not a good idea to be throwing sh*t around, you never know where it is going to actually stick. Did you read my Message that actually described my test, and Marv's response to it in Message 7181? I would suggest that you read Marv's response, and carefully consider what he actually says, and perhaps more importantly what he doesn't say. > That is like me saying that a RCA BTA1R1 is a pile of junk because the CCA > AM1000D was a crap box and they are both plate modulated with 4-400s as > modulator tubes and PAs. The truth is the RCA BTA1R1 is one of the best tube > transmitters ever made while the CCA AM1000D was one of the worst! > > Not that I am saying Magnum Dynalabs makes junk, because they do make some > killer gear, but you can't use a Magnum Dynalabs product to judge a Fanfare > product! > > The only honest way to compare antennas is to use a calibrated test range. This is ironic in a group where hardly a day goes by without someone making unsubstantiated claims about IBOC, based on very casual tests using completely uncharacterized receivers, and with no data on the spectrum actually being radiated by WOR's transmitter, or even if the transmitter is actually working correctly. I suppose you have antenna range measurements showing the superiority of the Fanfare "Ice Cream" whip, to the "sh*t" you equate the Metz, and Magnum Dynalab, whips with? John From jbyrns@enteract.com Tue Jan 21 20:57:38 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Jan 2003 04:57:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 51213 invoked from network); 22 Jan 2003 04:57:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Jan 2003 04:57:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Jan 2003 04:57:38 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.173] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 22 Jan 2003 04:57:37 -0000 Date: Wed, 22 Jan 2003 04:57:36 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Old Trandmitters Was: IBOC / AM stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1260 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.98.223 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Possum Hunter" < possumhunter@n...> wrote: > jbyrns@e... wrote: > > Is it an antique RCA 50B transmitter, the elusive and mysterious BTA-50C, > > It is supposed to be a BTA50C. I have not seen this transmitter with my own > eyes yet. I hope we can go take the nickel tour next week. Trust me, if I > don't get it on the air, I will find it a home in a radio museum! The BTA-50C seems to have been a rare transmitter, as no one seems to know anything about it. I would suggest that the first order of business would be to get some good photos of it, in case it should meet an unexpected fate. Also it would be good to make notes on the obvious details of its circuit topology. It would be interesting to know exactly what the BTA-50C was, and how many were built. I am betting that the BTA-50C is basically an upgraded 50B, with more "modern" industrial design, and probably a later model 5 kW driver for the 50 kW class B linear amp from the 50B. That would be something like a BTA-50D, with the class B 50 kW linear amplifier from the 50B, rather than the Doherty amp used in the BTA- 50D. I hope you do get a peak at this transmitter, and can report on it in detail here in the AMStereo group. John From possumhunter@netzero.net Tue Jan 21 22:00:14 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Jan 2003 06:00:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 74480 invoked from network); 22 Jan 2003 06:00:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Jan 2003 06:00:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.203) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Jan 2003 06:00:14 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 21 Jan 2003 22:00:14 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC / AM stereo Date: Wed, 22 Jan 2003 01:00:00 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 22 Jan 2003 06:00:14.0026 (UTC) FILETIME=[87CEA2A0:01C2C1DB] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.162.38.184] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 jbyrns@enteract.com wrote: >Why does this come off like you are trying to curry favor with Fanfare? I am merely stating that it is stupid to say Fanfare's product does not work because a competing product did not work as well as you think it should. That is the same as saying you don't like Marantz tape decks because your Panasonic tape deck didn't work well. > >This is ironic in a group where hardly a day goes by without someone making unsubstantiated claims about IBOC, based on very casual tests using completely uncharacterized receivers, and with no data on the spectrum actually being radiated by WOR's transmitter, or even if the transmitter is actually working correctly. At least those of us who are posting that we do not like Ibiquity's HD Radio system made such posts *AFTER* we heard the Ibiquity product on the air! Many of us posting on how bad the HD Radio system splatters analog stations are broadcast engineers. What are your qualifications to post your opinion on FM antennas that you have never used? > > I suppose you have antenna range measurements showing the superiority of the Fanfare "Ice Cream" whip, to the "sh*t" you equate the Metz, and Magnum Dynalab, whips with? No, I have no need for an Omni-Directional FM antenna. I spend less than three or four hours a week listening to FM. It requires a very directional antenna with lots of gain to receive the *ONLY* FM I listen to, Class C WJZX 99.7FM. The only antenna I have ever found that will put a usable signal into my receiver from this station is the Channel Master Stereo Probe 9, an antenna that is no longer in production. Sometimes I have to use the vertical antenna, sometimes the Horizontal, depending on conditions to get this station because it is 196 miles to my Southeast. Also on that frequency is a Class CO FM, WNNX, 127 miles to my South-Southwest and Class C1 WRFX-FM 107 miles to my Northeast. I am using a Dynaco FM-4 FM tuner with the optional Multiplex kit in it with all RCA tubes. I can honestly post that I like the Dynaco FM-4 beacuse I have one. I can also post that the RCA tubes work well in this unit because I am using them. Do I know the specs on the Stereo Probe 9? No, and I don't care what the specs are because it works for me. What you will not see me do is say the copycat Winegard FM antenna is as good, or as bad as the Channel Master I own without using it, and I have no desire to test it because I am happy with what I am already using. However, for a modest fee, as I have time away from the station I work for, I would be happy to post my opinion of any FM or AM antenna you wish to send me for testing. I get to KEEP the tested antenna if I like it! I will send back any antenna that I don't like freight collect. Kevin From jsgil@hal-pc.org Wed Jan 22 01:10:47 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Jan 2003 09:10:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 60816 invoked from network); 22 Jan 2003 09:10:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Jan 2003 09:10:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.68) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Jan 2003 09:10:46 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.158] by n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 22 Jan 2003 09:10:46 -0000 Date: Wed, 22 Jan 2003 09:10:44 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Keep an two ears on KB 1520 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 497 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.101 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Michael J. Richard" wrote: > Wow! This sounds like fun! Another AM possibly returning to music! > Wish I could get them. Unfortunately 1520 is pounded by KOMA out here. > They ARE still oldies a lot of the time , but MONO with no hopes whatsoever > of returning to stereo :( > > MJR n WYO Yea they have been in a deep KOMA for quite some time and I dought they will ever come out of it. Their call letters fit them perfectly. ;-) JSG From kevtronics@yahoo.com Wed Jan 22 01:26:49 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Jan 2003 09:26:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 8221 invoked from network); 22 Jan 2003 09:26:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Jan 2003 09:26:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.69) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Jan 2003 09:26:48 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.164] by n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 22 Jan 2003 09:26:48 -0000 Date: Wed, 22 Jan 2003 09:26:44 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Keep two ears on KB 1520 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 375 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.93.33 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Yea they have been in a deep KOMA for quite some time and I doubt > they will ever come out of it. Their call letters fit them > perfectly. ;-) The Garfield cartoon always uses the call letters "KBOR" to make fun of a "BORing" radio or TV station... but there actually *is* a KBOR; two of them, in fact -- on 1600 AM and 105.5 FM in Texas, both with a Spanish format. From jsgil@hal-pc.org Wed Jan 22 01:45:38 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Jan 2003 09:45:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 56472 invoked from network); 22 Jan 2003 09:45:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Jan 2003 09:45:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.68) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Jan 2003 09:45:37 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.191] by n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 22 Jan 2003 09:45:37 -0000 Date: Wed, 22 Jan 2003 09:45:35 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: IBOC is NOT AM or stereo. Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 2924 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.101 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " wrote: >=20 > I don't believe this is correct, AM/PM systems like the Magnavox=20 > system are nonlinear, not linear. I believe all the AM stereo systems=20 > with the exception of the Harris system, which was a pure QUAM system,=20 > are nonlinear, unless I have forgotten one. A pure ISB system would=20 > also be linear, but the Kahn system was not a pure ISB system, all it=20 > CISB. Generally I don't believe it is possible for a constant=20 > envelope PM signal, as is used in AM stereo systems when L =3D -R to be=20 > linear, except for the Harris system which was pure QUAM. I'm not=20 > sure what the formal definition of linear vs. non linear modulation=20 > is, but I think it comes down to linear systems not creating any=20 > additional sidebands around the carrier other than those that result=20 > from the direct translation of the modulating signal up to the carrier=20 > frequency, and the mirroring of those sidebands around the carrier.=20=20 > Non linear systems, like PM and FM create additional sidebands around=20 > the carrier at harmonics of the modulating frequencies, as well as at=20 > the sum and difference frequencies of the modulating signal=20 > frequencies. >=20 > John >=20 In dealing with the various AM Stereo schemes there are 2 definitions to linear depending on how you look at it. In the sense that Harris=20 is a linear system in that there are 2 AM modulators fixed at 90=B0 and each one's modulation is a linear representation of the modulating signal that produce no harmonics in relation the modulating signals. The resulting phase modulation from the summation of these 2 signals is not linearly related to L-R but is a product of both the L+R and L-R vectors based on the pythagorean therum and the phase deviation increases during the dips in the L+R modulation as it appoaches -100% modulation. Both QuAM and C-QuAM will have identical phase modulation but C-QuAM has an modified envelope that generates=20 harmonics because the envelope is not a natural representation of the result of adding 2 modulating signals. As defined by the evaluation comittee of the proposed systens linear meant that no harmonics were generated in relation to the modulating signals and occupied the same bandwidth as an mono AM signal. For the non-linear definition it meant that it was a multi- plicative process when a phase modulated carrier was amplitude modulated and the result produced harmonics which applies to the Belar, Magnavox, Kahn, and Motorola systems. For the Magnavox and Kahn systems the phase deviation in itself was a linear representation of the L-R signal and the Belar system the frequency deviation is linearly related to L-R but and all these modulations in themselves generate harmonics in relation to their modulating signals. More harmonics are also generated when these carriers are amplitude modulated with L+R. JSG From amstereorules@msn.com Wed Jan 22 02:42:52 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereorules@msn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Jan 2003 10:42:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 85552 invoked from network); 22 Jan 2003 10:42:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Jan 2003 10:42:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.66) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Jan 2003 10:42:52 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.139] by n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 22 Jan 2003 10:42:52 -0000 Date: Wed, 22 Jan 2003 10:42:50 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Keep an two ears on KB 1520 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 431 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amstereorules " X-Originating-IP: 204.32.70.23 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=130870594 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereorules Which Motorola AM stereo chip do you use then in your FTA-100? > BTW, I noticed in one of Possumhunter's strings that the Fanfare FTA-100 uses the Motorola Symphony chipset. Not so, Kevin, my friend. No one uses that chipset in a production receiver as yet. In fact, the place you are going to see it first is in offshore products. They no longer want to pay much attention to US builders, unless they do big numbers. > > M. From jbyrns@enteract.com Wed Jan 22 11:36:49 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Jan 2003 19:36:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 68623 invoked from network); 22 Jan 2003 19:36:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Jan 2003 19:36:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Jan 2003 19:36:49 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.248] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 22 Jan 2003 19:36:47 -0000 Date: Wed, 22 Jan 2003 19:36:46 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: IBOC / AM stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3159 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.51 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Possum Hunter" < possumhunter@n...> wrote: > jbyrns@e... wrote: > >Why does this come off like you are trying to curry favor with Fanfare? > > I am merely stating that it is stupid to say Fanfare's product does not work > because a competing product did not work as well as you think it should. > That is the same as saying you don't like Marantz tape decks because your > Panasonic tape deck didn't work well. You seem determined not to let sleeping dogs lie. For whatever reason, Marv choose not to go into the complete unabridged history of his whip antenna in his reply to my explanation of the test I conducted. I suggest again that you read Marv's reply. I don't believe your analogy is the proper one for this situation. You might want to go to the Fanfare web site at this URL: http://www.fanfare.com/ After getting the general lay of the land, focus in on this "gif" from the Fanfare web page, at this URL: http://www.fanfare.com/FM2G-R4.GIF Then give it some thought. Do this quickly, because I wouldn't be surprised if that "gif" is quickly replaced by another one, since it begs the question. > >This is ironic in a group where hardly a day goes by without someone making > unsubstantiated claims about IBOC, based on very casual tests using > completely uncharacterized receivers, and with no data on the spectrum > actually being radiated by WOR's transmitter, or even if the transmitter is > actually working correctly. > > At least those of us who are posting that we do not like Ibiquity's HD Radio > system made such posts *AFTER* we heard the Ibiquity product on the air! > Many of us posting on how bad the HD Radio system splatters analog stations > are broadcast engineers. Are you trying to tell me that "broadcast engineers" are somehow smarter than others, and able to make judgments about "IBOC" without the proper instrumentation needed to make the required measurements? If anything, the converse is probably true, or the "broadcast engineers" probably wouldn't be in broadcasting in the first place. > What are your qualifications to post your opinion > on FM antennas that you have never used? This question assumes facts not in evidence. > Do I know the specs on the Stereo Probe 9? No, and I don't care what the > specs are because it works for me. What you will not see me do is say the > copycat Winegard FM antenna is as good, or as bad as the Channel Master I > own without using it, and I have no desire to test it because I am happy > with what I am already using. The operative word here is "copycat", the word I used was "clone", which has an entirely different meaning. On what basis do you even call the Winegard FM antenna a Stereo Probe 9 "copycat"? From what little I know about the two antennas, IIRC, they are two quite different designs, so even the term "copycat" doesn't seem to apply in this case. And if one is a "copycat", how are you sure it isn't the Channel Master that is the "copycat"? I will say that the best FM antenna I ever owned was a Channel Master Mono Probe 10, which out performed antennas twice its size. John From jbyrns@enteract.com Wed Jan 22 11:40:22 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Jan 2003 19:40:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 99966 invoked from network); 22 Jan 2003 19:40:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Jan 2003 19:40:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Jan 2003 19:40:22 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.249] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 22 Jan 2003 19:40:18 -0000 Date: Wed, 22 Jan 2003 19:40:15 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: IBOC is NOT AM or stereo. Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 4030 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.51 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "jsgilst " < jsgil@h...> wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " > wrote: >=20 > >=20 > > I don't believe this is correct, AM/PM systems like the Magnavox=20 > > system are nonlinear, not linear. I believe all the AM stereo > systems=20 > > with the exception of the Harris system, which was a pure QUAM > system,=20 > > are nonlinear, unless I have forgotten one. A pure ISB system would=20 > > also be linear, but the Kahn system was not a pure ISB system, all > it=20 > > CISB. Generally I don't believe it is possible for a constant=20 > > envelope PM signal, as is used in AM stereo systems when L =3D -R to > be=20 > > linear, except for the Harris system which was pure QUAM. I'm not=20 > > sure what the formal definition of linear vs. non linear modulation=20 > > is, but I think it comes down to linear systems not creating any=20 > > additional sidebands around the carrier other than those that result=20 > > from the direct translation of the modulating signal up to the > carrier=20 > > frequency, and the mirroring of those sidebands around the carrier. = =20 > > Non linear systems, like PM and FM create additional sidebands > around=20 > > the carrier at harmonics of the modulating frequencies, as well as > at=20 > > the sum and difference frequencies of the modulating signal=20 > > frequencies. > >=20 > > John > >=20 >=20 >=20 > In dealing with the various AM Stereo schemes there are 2 definitions > to linear depending on how you look at it. In the sense that Harris=20 > is a linear system in that there are 2 AM modulators fixed at 90=B0 and > each one's modulation is a linear representation of the modulating > signal that produce no harmonics in relation the modulating signals. > The resulting phase modulation from the summation of these 2 signals > is not linearly related to L-R but is a product of both the L+R and > L-R vectors based on the pythagorean therum and the phase deviation > increases during the dips in the L+R modulation as it appoaches > -100% modulation. Both QuAM and C-QuAM will have identical phase > modulation but C-QuAM has an modified envelope that generates=20 > harmonics because the envelope is not a natural representation of > the result of adding 2 modulating signals. >=20 > As defined by the evaluation comittee of the proposed systens > linear meant that no harmonics were generated in relation to the > modulating signals and occupied the same bandwidth as an mono AM > signal. For the non-linear definition it meant that it was a multi- > plicative process when a phase modulated carrier was amplitude > modulated and the result produced harmonics which applies to the > Belar, Magnavox, Kahn, and Motorola systems. Isn't that what I just got through saying? My point was that you said=20 with respect to the Magnavox system "the phase modulation is linear".=20=20 But that is wrong, constant envelope phase modulation is never linear,=20 and constant envelope phase modulation is what the Magnavox system=20 uses for the "L-R" signal, hence the Magnavox system is nonlinear,=20 which you seem to agree with in your last sentence above. > For the Magnavox and Kahn systems the phase deviation in itself > was a linear representation of the L-R signal and the Belar system > the frequency deviation is linearly related to L-R but and all these > modulations in themselves generate harmonics in relation to their > modulating signals. More harmonics are also generated when these > carriers are amplitude modulated with L+R. The fact that the phase angle of a signal is a linear function of the=20 modulating signal doesn't make the modulation linear, in fact the=20 phase angle being a linear representation of the modulating signal=20 pretty much insures that the modulation is nonlinear, if the envelope=20 is constant. The fact that the envelope is also modulated in these=20 systems is irrelevant because the function modulating the envelope is=20 not the function that would be required to linearize the "phase=20 modulation". John From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Jan 22 12:20:24 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Jan 2003 20:20:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 87435 invoked from network); 22 Jan 2003 20:20:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Jan 2003 20:20:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.199) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Jan 2003 20:20:23 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 22 Jan 2003 12:20:23 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC / AM stereo Date: Wed, 22 Jan 2003 15:20:06 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 22 Jan 2003 20:20:23.0298 (UTC) FILETIME=[B1549620:01C2C253] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.132.160.101] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 jbyrns@enteract.com wrote: > You seem determined not to let sleeping dogs lie. The dog should still be awake! Let's kick this puppy some more. > > Are you trying to tell me that "broadcast engineers" are somehow smarter than others, and able to make judgments about "IBOC" without the proper instrumentation needed to make the required measurements? How much test equipment does it take to turn on a radio and hear a 50,000 Watt wideband hash generator? Anybody with a car radio can hear it and post about it. On the other hand, you cannot comment on the noise made by the DRM system just because you heard the Ibiquity HD Radio system on WOR. You said you didn't like the Fanfare antenna because you didnt like a similar antenna produced by another company. What makes you not like a product that you have never used? Kevin From crackpot_crackpotter@yahoo.com Wed Jan 22 13:05:06 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: crackpot_crackpotter@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Jan 2003 21:05:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 35455 invoked from network); 22 Jan 2003 21:05:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Jan 2003 21:05:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Jan 2003 21:05:04 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.141] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 22 Jan 2003 21:05:04 -0000 Date: Wed, 22 Jan 2003 21:05:03 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: IBOC is NOT AM or stereo. Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 542 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "crackpot_crackpotter " X-Originating-IP: 152.163.189.99 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=136104561 X-Yahoo-Profile: crackpot_crackpotter <<>> Wow! Talk about being up tight and rude there "John" or should we start by calling you by your real name of Tom Ray?!?! From jsgil@hal-pc.org Wed Jan 22 13:58:13 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 22 Jan 2003 21:58:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 8032 invoked from network); 22 Jan 2003 21:58:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Jan 2003 21:58:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.83) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Jan 2003 21:58:12 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.148] by n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 22 Jan 2003 21:58:11 -0000 Date: Wed, 22 Jan 2003 21:58:08 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: IBOC is NOT AM or stereo. Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1643 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.116 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "crackpot_crackpotter " wrote: >> <<> said >> with respect to the Magnavox system "the phase modulation is >> linear". > But that is wrong, constant envelope phase modulation is never >> linear, >> and constant envelope phase modulation is what the Magnavox system >> uses for the "L-R" signal, hence the Magnavox system is nonlinear, >> which you seem to agree with in your last sentence above.>>> >> The point I was trying to make is that the angle of deviation in PM and the frequency of deviation in FM is a linear representation of the modulating signal just as the envelope of a mono AM signal is a linear representation of its modulating signal. No where did I say that these systems, PM or FM, produced sidebands that linearly represented the spectral content of their modulating signals. On the contrary these systems as a whole produce harmonics that are 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th, 6th ... of the modulating signal and the greater the deviation the greater number of harmonics and in this respect these systems are non-linear in regards the the spectral content present in the sidebands. Let's not mince words incorrectly. > > Wow! Talk about being up tight and rude there "John" or should we > start by calling you by your real name of Tom Ray?!?! Yea this guy is turning ou to be a real Troll. I was just trying to give information about various modulation schemes. I just hope that the person who originally asked the question isn't more confused. JSG From jbyrns@enteract.com Wed Jan 22 16:24:14 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Jan 2003 00:24:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 47897 invoked from network); 23 Jan 2003 00:24:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Jan 2003 00:24:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.78) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Jan 2003 00:24:12 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.164] by n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 23 Jan 2003 00:24:12 -0000 Date: Thu, 23 Jan 2003 00:24:11 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: IBOC / AM stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 748 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.116 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Possum Hunter" < possumhunter@n...> wrote: > jbyrns@e... wrote: > > You seem determined not to let sleeping dogs lie. > > The dog should still be awake! Let's kick this puppy some more. At this point, as far as I am concerned, it is up to Marv to decide whether this puppy gets kicked some more, or if it can go back to sleep. It all depends on how much of the story he chooses to tell, and what parts of the story he chooses to keep under his hat. To get back on topic, the clone whips are supposed to work on AM as well as on FM. I would assume if the 75 Ohm coax feed line is of any significant length, it would cause problems on the AM band. Has anyone tried one of these whips on AM? John From kevtronics@yahoo.com Wed Jan 22 16:26:24 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Jan 2003 00:26:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 582 invoked from network); 23 Jan 2003 00:26:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Jan 2003 00:26:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.90) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Jan 2003 00:26:24 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.146] by n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 23 Jan 2003 00:26:21 -0000 Date: Thu, 23 Jan 2003 00:26:18 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: 1520 WWKB to flip to Oldies on January 27th Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 777 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.80.147 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics From the New York Radio Message Board.... let's hope the new format makes its debut in full, glorious AM Stereo sound! =================================================================== According to an article in the Buffalo News, 1520 WWKB will return to a music format on Monday, January 27 at 6 am. Morning person will be WKBW/WHTT legend Dan Neavereth. The station will feature a music format spotlighting 1958-74 oldies and Buffalo-area radio nostalgia. WKBW alumni Joey Reynolds' talk show will play overnights. Owner Entercom feels they can make money with the format. They feel that today's radio is too "predictable and sterile". Hmmmmmmmmmmmm. Supposedly, they are "negotiating" to get the WKBW calls back but will likely use the "KB" or "KB1520" liner. From jbyrns@enteract.com Wed Jan 22 16:32:10 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Jan 2003 00:32:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 52046 invoked from network); 23 Jan 2003 00:32:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Jan 2003 00:32:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Jan 2003 00:32:09 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.142] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 23 Jan 2003 00:32:09 -0000 Date: Thu, 23 Jan 2003 00:32:09 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: IBOC is NOT AM or stereo. Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2147 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.116 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "jsgilst " < jsgil@h...> wrote: > > The point I was trying to make is that the angle of deviation > in PM and the frequency of deviation in FM is a linear representation > of the modulating signal just as the envelope of a mono AM signal > is a linear representation of its modulating signal. No where did > I say that these systems, PM or FM, produced sidebands that linearly > represented the spectral content of their modulating signals. On the > contrary these systems as a whole produce harmonics that are 2nd, 3rd, > 4th, 5th, 6th ... of the modulating signal and the greater the > deviation the greater number of harmonics and in this respect these > systems are non-linear in regards the the spectral content present > in the sidebands. Let's not mince words incorrectly. I believe in common engineering usage, when one speaks of a linear modulation system, he is talking about some form of AM system, and when speaking of non linear modulation systems, one is speaking of a PM or FM type of system. I don't believe that the relationship between the information signal that is causing the modulation, and the parameter being modulated, has anything to do with whether the modulation is considered to be linear, or non linear. To call the Magnavox AM/PM system a linear PM system simply confuses the issue, and muddies the water, when clarity of usage is what is needed here. I have not looked this up in an engineering dictionary, so if anyone has one that gives the definition of linear and nonlinear modulation, I would be interested in hearing what it has to say on the matter. > Yea this guy is turning ou to be a real Troll. I was just trying to > give information about various modulation schemes. I just hope that > the person who originally asked the question isn't more confused. I wouldn't worry too much about it, I don't think there was anyone asking a question in the first place. I think this sub thread grew out of my assertion that digital information could be transmitted using AM modulation, a concept to which several people took exception. John From fanfare@globility.com Wed Jan 22 17:29:30 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Jan 2003 01:29:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 63269 invoked from network); 23 Jan 2003 01:29:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Jan 2003 01:29:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Jan 2003 01:29:27 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.146] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 23 Jan 2003 01:29:27 -0000 Date: Thu, 23 Jan 2003 01:29:24 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: IBOC / AM stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1726 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Marv Southcott " X-Originating-IP: 64.56.233.234 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " wrote: > At this point, as far as I am concerned, it is up to Marv to decide > whether this puppy gets kicked some more, > To get back on topic, the clone whips are supposed to work on AM as > well as on FM. I would assume if the 75 Ohm coax feed line is of any > significant length, it would cause problems on the AM band. Has > anyone tried one of these whips on AM? I have to say it was getting rather boring here until you happened on the scene John. Now I see some real debate going on here. However, if you're leaving it up to me to cap this subject, I would say it was dead a couple of exchanges ago. I don't know why you want to challenge a product in the abstract, but that's your privilege, But, again we're back to generalities, John. And again you're not providing imperical information to back up your allegation. To answer your question as to why all of the antennas you refer to, including the FM-2G, are claiming AM response as well as FM. It is because I made that statement a number of years ago when I introduced the antenna to the world. How did I determine that? With about 4 years of having an FM-2G mounted atop my Suburban, along with a Mobile VHF antenna and a cellular antenna. It did superbly on FM. On AM it was good for about the same distances as the dipole that GM had installed in the windshield, but much less directional. Thts' no glowing endorsement, as you all know. However, because of the vast difference in sensitivity between various radio models, it is referred to as being adequate for local AM reception. Conclude from that what you will. This dog's gonna take a nap. Nuff said? Marv From florida_amstereo@hotmail.com Wed Jan 22 18:42:15 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: florida_amstereo@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Jan 2003 02:42:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 62338 invoked from network); 23 Jan 2003 02:42:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Jan 2003 02:42:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.37.161) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Jan 2003 02:42:12 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 22 Jan 2003 18:42:12 -0800 Received: from 209.240.198.61 by pv2fd.pav2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Thu, 23 Jan 2003 02:42:12 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC / AM stereo Date: Thu, 23 Jan 2003 02:42:12 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 23 Jan 2003 02:42:12.0768 (UTC) FILETIME=[08704A00:01C2C289] From: "Donn Tillman" X-Originating-IP: [209.240.198.61] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83914824 GO MARV GO!! Unlike most of us, that merely ramble or talk about radio you actually produce products that help make radio listening more enjoyable. ~~~~~~~~~~~~ Among many other intelligent things, Marv S said: "I don't know why you want to challenge a product in the abstract, but that's your privilege, But, again we're back to generalities, John. And again you're not providing imperical information to back up your allegation. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ donn st petersburg,fl _________________________________________________________________ Add photos to your messages with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail From n0uiheric@aol.com Wed Jan 22 21:00:09 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Jan 2003 05:00:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 45409 invoked from network); 23 Jan 2003 05:00:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Jan 2003 05:00:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m09.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.164) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Jan 2003 05:00:07 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-m09.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.1de.c82c1 (657) for ; Thu, 23 Jan 2003 00:00:01 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1de.c82c1.2b60d0d1@aol.com> Date: Thu, 23 Jan 2003 00:00:01 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Tigers games in Stereo on AM! To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih KMOX 1120 broadcast Cardinals home baseball games and Blues home hockey games in AM Stereo from 1988 to 2000. The Blues may have fed their home games in Stereo to their FM affiliates; the Cardinals may have done the same. Many of the NFL flagship stations are now on FM; they broadcast their games (and probably feed them to FM affiliates) in Stereo. The Rams have an FM flagship (CC's 103.3 KLOU; I think they have just one year left on their contract). Unfortunately, the Blues now feed to their affiliates (AM and FM) in mono from KTRS 550. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Wed Jan 22 21:00:14 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Jan 2003 05:00:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 15481 invoked from network); 23 Jan 2003 05:00:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Jan 2003 05:00:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d03.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.35) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Jan 2003 05:00:14 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-d03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.29.36ca23c2 (657) for ; Thu, 23 Jan 2003 00:00:03 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <29.36ca23c2.2b60d0d3@aol.com> Date: Thu, 23 Jan 2003 00:00:03 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: creating a third broadcasting band To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih VHF is being used for DTV in the United States; the plan is to move the digital operations to their analog channels once the transition is complete. The better band for broadcasting is somewhere in the 700 MHz range; however, effective radiated powers would be five times that of FM radio stations, based on the audio powers for analog UHF-TV stations. For example: Class A: 30 kW at 328 feet above average terrain Class B1/C3: 125 kW at 328 feet above average terrain Class B/C2: 250 kW at 500 feet above average terrain Class C1: 500 kW at 1000 feet above average terrain Class C: 500 kW at 2000 feet above average terrain Another would be to set aside portions of unused shortwave spectrum for national broadcasting. The 2, 3 and 4 MHz bands may be suitable for such a service. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From jbyrns@enteract.com Wed Jan 22 21:13:36 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Jan 2003 05:13:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 44817 invoked from network); 23 Jan 2003 05:13:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Jan 2003 05:13:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Jan 2003 05:13:36 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.252] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 23 Jan 2003 05:13:36 -0000 Date: Thu, 23 Jan 2003 05:13:35 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: IBOC / AM stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1979 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.8 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Marv Southcott " wrote: > > I have to say it was getting rather boring here until you happened > on the scene John. Now I see some real debate going on here. Well thanks, when I arrived, I found there wasn't much independent thought here, the opinions were all rather inbred. I'm not sure how I ended up here, I'll have to go back and try to figure that out. > However, if you're leaving it up to me to cap this subject, > I would say it was dead a couple of exchanges ago. I agree, but "Possum Hunter" wanted to kick the dog a few more times. > I don't know why you want to challenge a product in the abstract, > but that's your privilege, But, again we're back to generalities, > John. And again you're not providing imperical information to back > up your allegation. I'm not sure what allegation you are talking about, I thought I was pretty specific that I felt that at best, the whips had poor performance at the low end of the FM band. You even seemed to agree with this view, if not explicitly, at least implicitly, since you have introduced the model FM-2G-C to fix exactly this problem. A question on the FM-2G-C if I might, why did you choose to use that chunky adapter, rather than simply supplying a longer whip for the "C" version? > To answer your question as to why all of the antennas you refer > to, including the FM-2G, are claiming AM response as well as FM. I didn't ask why the whips were claiming AM response, I know the answer to that. What I asked was if anyone had tried it on AM, because I suspected that the capacitance of any significant length of 75 Ohm coax would seriously attenuate AM signals, and was wondering what peoples experiences with the whips were on AM. The main reason I brought up the subject of the AM performance of the whips was to get the thread back on topic, this is after all the AM stereo group, not the FM stereo group. John From fanfare@globility.com Thu Jan 23 05:56:50 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Jan 2003 13:56:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 39564 invoked from network); 23 Jan 2003 13:56:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Jan 2003 13:56:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Jan 2003 13:56:48 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.253] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 23 Jan 2003 13:56:48 -0000 Date: Thu, 23 Jan 2003 13:56:45 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Digital dah dit Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 276 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Marv Southcott " X-Originating-IP: 64.56.233.156 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy While not specifically on topic for this group, the following article offers a rather interesting perspective on where the future of radio could be headed. " http://www.tvtechnology.com/features/Inside-Audio/index.shtml". Take a look at the article "Codecs in Review". M. From fanfare@globility.com Thu Jan 23 07:05:29 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Jan 2003 15:05:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 85941 invoked from network); 23 Jan 2003 15:05:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Jan 2003 15:05:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Jan 2003 15:05:27 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.160] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 23 Jan 2003 15:05:26 -0000 Date: Thu, 23 Jan 2003 15:05:26 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: IBOC / AM stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 734 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Mr.M S " X-Originating-IP: 64.56.233.156 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " wrote: > > A question on the FM-2G-C if I might, why did you choose to use that > chunky adapter, rather than simply supplying a longer whip for the "C" > version? Whip antennas are susceptible to high winds affecting their receive consistency. We use a tapered, 17x7SS PH whip which is quite resilient. The other brands use a 0.125" SS rod. However, its length at 54" pretty much stretches the limit in terms of remaining reasonably vertical under all weather conditions. To change the whip length would add to that problem. Therefore adding a rigid element at the base of the whip allows the required versatility, yet maintains status quo on windage. M. From amfmdx@fastq.com Thu Jan 23 08:40:24 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Jan 2003 16:40:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 10457 invoked from network); 23 Jan 2003 16:40:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Jan 2003 16:40:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Jan 2003 16:40:22 -0000 Received: from fastq (d180-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.212]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id h0NGeKP50609 for ; Thu, 23 Jan 2003 09:40:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <006701c2c2fe$0dee54c0$d4f9bed8@com> To: Subject: XM is gonna be rich.... Date: Thu, 23 Jan 2003 09:39:51 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > Wow! Talk about being up tight and rude there "John" or should we > start by calling you by your real name of Tom Ray?!?! Thats the funniest thing I heard in a long time. Whats funnier is that I was thinking the same thing. All I know is that when I heard WOR and WLW with their band destroying high noise level hash, all I could think is that the GREG principle still rules. Greed Ruins Everything Good. GO XM! IBOC IS GONNA MAKE YOU RICH. I am strongly considering an XM boombox now that I have heard IBOC on an analog radio. Kevin "Its going to get a lot worse before it gets worse" - Lily Tomlin From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Jan 23 09:08:22 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Jan 2003 17:08:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 51897 invoked from network); 23 Jan 2003 17:07:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Jan 2003 17:07:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.86) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Jan 2003 17:07:56 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.136] by n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 23 Jan 2003 17:07:55 -0000 Date: Thu, 23 Jan 2003 17:07:53 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: XM is gonna be rich.... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <006701c2c2fe$0dee54c0$d4f9bed8@com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 833 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > I am strongly considering an XM boombox now that I have heard IBOC > on an analog radio. XM's audio isn't going to sound much better than IBOC's digital audio. Along with Sirius, they all use the same encoding method, with low bit-rates (I've heard XM and Sirius average between 40 and 64 kbps) and "simulated" treble. I've heard XM demos in stores a few times and it always sounds tinny, metallic, and wishy-washy. Also, in order to conserve bandwidth, most if not all of the news/talk channels are in mono, and at an even more reduced bit-rate/quality. The only digital audio broadcasting system that has any kind of respectable audio quality is Eureka 147 DAB, but it looks like the USA won't be using it, at least not until IBOC is tried and turns out to be a flop, both technically and with consumers. From fanfare@globility.com Thu Jan 23 10:01:27 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Jan 2003 18:01:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 85210 invoked from network); 23 Jan 2003 18:01:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Jan 2003 18:01:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Jan 2003 18:01:26 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.140] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 23 Jan 2003 18:01:26 -0000 Date: Thu, 23 Jan 2003 18:01:22 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: XM is gonna be rich.... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <006701c2c2fe$0dee54c0$d4f9bed8@com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 803 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Mr.M S " X-Originating-IP: 64.56.233.156 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" wrote: > noise level hash, all I could think is that the GREG principle still rules. > > Greed Ruins Everything Good. > > GO XM! IBOC IS GONNA MAKE YOU RICH. > > Kevin > > "Its going to get a lot worse before it > gets worse" - Lily Tomlin Hey Kevin of Mesa AZ. Just an OT comment your signature quote "Its going to get a lot worse before it gets worse" - Lily Tomlin Is that closer or further from the truth now that she plays the President's Secretary on West Wing? ;-)) Cheers, M.S. P.S. If you listen to any FM out there, and it includes KRXS, you're listening to a Fanfare FT-1 that's translating from, I believe 97.3 to 97.5 or 97.1MHz. And it probably doesn't sound any worse than if they had paid for it. From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Thu Jan 23 11:01:40 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Jan 2003 19:01:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 54206 invoked from network); 23 Jan 2003 19:01:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Jan 2003 19:01:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14207.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.173.71) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Jan 2003 19:01:39 -0000 Message-ID: <20030123190138.63259.qmail@web14207.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.45.202.244] by web14207.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 23 Jan 2003 11:01:38 PST Date: Thu, 23 Jan 2003 11:01:38 -0800 (PST) Subject: Buffalo Stereo possibilities To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio Is it possible that WWKB is going stereo music in Buffalo so that Entercom can show-off their stereo AM? IBOC AM Stereo that is? If the end objective is to be a 'test' station for IBOC this could be a good station IF - they first run C-Quam, and then IBOC, that way you can make a recording for comparison purposes? Entercom has always cared about their sound quality in the past, as have several ABC-owned stations. WDAF in K.C. is an example of a first-class stereo AM music and personality station owned by Entercom. WJR, WLS, WBAP all show-off their stereo and are owned by ABC. There still are some 'good guys' that care about the sound of their AM stations, so what happens in Buffalo will be interesting for the other chains. __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Thu Jan 23 11:03:42 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Jan 2003 19:03:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 98535 invoked from network); 23 Jan 2003 19:03:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Jan 2003 19:03:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14202.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.144) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Jan 2003 19:03:41 -0000 Message-ID: <20030123190341.91388.qmail@web14202.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.45.202.244] by web14202.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 23 Jan 2003 11:03:41 PST Date: Thu, 23 Jan 2003 11:03:41 -0800 (PST) Subject: Engineers vs. Lawyers? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio Ut-ohh, got a package in the mail from 'the lawyers'. Afraid to open it. Guess it's not always so good to write to the FCC! __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From jbyrns@enteract.com Thu Jan 23 11:57:12 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Jan 2003 19:57:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 4701 invoked from network); 23 Jan 2003 19:57:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Jan 2003 19:57:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Jan 2003 19:57:10 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.141] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 23 Jan 2003 19:57:10 -0000 Date: Thu, 23 Jan 2003 19:57:09 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: IBOC / AM stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1228 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.98.49 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Mr.M S " < fanfare@g...> wrote: > > Whip antennas are susceptible to high winds affecting their > receive consistency. We use a tapered, 17x7SS PH whip which > is quite resilient. The other brands use a 0.125" SS rod. Hmm, this whole thin whip saga gets curiouser, and curiouser. Your competitive analysis department has obviously fallen down on the job. My "other brand" whip uses a tapered whip of the type you describe, rather than the 0.125" SS rod you claim they use, in fact it tapers to an amazing degree of thinness near the tip. > However, its length at 54" pretty much stretches the limit in > terms of remaining reasonably vertical under all weather > conditions. To change the whip length would add to that problem. > Therefore adding a rigid element at the base of the whip allows > the required versatility, yet maintains status quo on windage. I would accept some bending in high wind, in exchange for the better aesthetics of a continuous full length whip. I can't see some bending having a significant impact on the "receive consistency" of a simple half wave whip like this, if it were a gain antenna, then it would be another matter. John From jbyrns@enteract.com Thu Jan 23 12:01:49 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Jan 2003 20:01:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 91242 invoked from network); 23 Jan 2003 20:01:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Jan 2003 20:01:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Jan 2003 20:01:49 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.129] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 23 Jan 2003 20:01:48 -0000 Date: Thu, 23 Jan 2003 20:01:46 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: XM is gonna be rich.... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 801 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.98.49 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Mr.M S " < fanfare@g...> wrote: > > P.S. If you listen to any FM out there, and it includes KRXS, > you're listening to a Fanfare FT-1 that's translating from, I > believe 97.3 to 97.5 or 97.1MHz. And it probably doesn't sound > any worse than if they had paid for it. Could you elaborate on this just a bit? Are you saying that KRXS has a translator in Mesa, which uses an FT-1, or are you saying that KRXS itself uses an FT-1 to rebroadcast programming picked up off the air? I remember back in the 1950's, when FM was down and out, and satellites, and fiber optics hadn't yet come on the scene, FM stations were sometimes used to feed baseball games to a teams regional network of AM stations, saving on telephone line expenses. John From fanfare@globility.com Thu Jan 23 13:48:20 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Jan 2003 21:48:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 94509 invoked from network); 23 Jan 2003 21:48:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Jan 2003 21:48:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.eol.ca) (205.189.151.1) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Jan 2003 21:48:17 -0000 Received: from FAN--MCS (dynamic-b2-39.highspeed.eol.ca [64.56.234.39]) by mail.eol.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5BEE244C4D for ; Thu, 23 Jan 2003 16:49:29 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <200301231648170026.01EA3BA2@mail.globility.com> In-Reply-To: References: X-Mailer: Calypso Version 3.30.00.00 (4) Date: Thu, 23 Jan 2003 16:48:17 -0500 To: "Kevin Tekel" Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC / AM stereo Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable From: "Marv Southcott" Reply-To: fanfare@globility.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy You are relentless, aren't you John. Could it be that we are competing with= ourselves? ;- )) MS *********** REPLY SEPARATOR *********** On 1/23/2003 at 7:57 PM John wrote: >--- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Mr.M S " < >fanfare@g...> wrote: >>=20 >> Whip antennas are susceptible to high winds affecting their >> receive consistency. We use a tapered, 17x7SS PH whip which >> is quite resilient. The other brands use a 0.125" SS rod. > >Hmm, this whole thin whip saga gets curiouser, and curiouser. Your=20 >competitive analysis department has obviously fallen down on the job.=20=20 >My "other brand" whip uses a tapered whip of the type you describe,=20 >rather than the 0.125" SS rod you claim they use, in fact it tapers to=20 >an amazing degree of thinness near the tip. > >> However, its length at 54" pretty much stretches the limit in >> terms of remaining reasonably vertical under all weather >> conditions. To change the whip length would add to that problem. >> Therefore adding a rigid element at the base of the whip allows >> the required versatility, yet maintains status quo on windage. > >I would accept some bending in high wind, in exchange for the better=20 >aesthetics of a continuous full length whip. I can't see some bending=20 >having a significant impact on the "receive consistency" of a simple=20 >half wave whip like this, if it were a gain antenna, then it would be=20 >another matter. > >John > > > >Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum=20 > >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From ccuff@in4web.com Thu Jan 23 13:55:18 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Jan 2003 21:55:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 37958 invoked from network); 23 Jan 2003 21:55:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Jan 2003 21:55:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Jan 2003 21:55:18 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.56]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Thu, 23 Jan 2003 16:51:14 -0500 Message-ID: <002201c2c328$dd75fac0$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: XM is gonna be rich.... Date: Thu, 23 Jan 2003 16:46:19 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 Gotta disagree with you here, Kevin- As the owner of 2 XM radios, and all three holders (boombox, car and home kit) The sound is excellent, with the sound being equal or better than any 128K MP3 file I've heard. You will see for yourself at the Ham meet... :-) Chris ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, January 23, 2003 12:07 PM Subject: {AMSF} Re: XM is gonna be rich.... > > XM's audio isn't going to sound much better than IBOC's digital audio. > Along with Sirius, they all use the same encoding method, with low > bit-rates (I've heard XM and Sirius average between 40 and 64 kbps) > and "simulated" treble. From matthew.trim@eds.com Thu Jan 23 14:51:36 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: matthew.trim@eds.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Jan 2003 22:51:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 688 invoked from network); 23 Jan 2003 22:51:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Jan 2003 22:51:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO ns5.eds.com) (203.17.185.230) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Jan 2003 22:51:32 -0000 Received: from nnsy.eds.com (nnsy-2.eds.com [192.85.216.198]) by ns5.eds.com (8.11.6/8.11.1) with ESMTP id h0NMpVX25762 for ; Fri, 24 Jan 2003 09:51:31 +1100 (EST) Received: from nnsy.eds.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by nnsy.eds.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0NMpSv08919 for ; Fri, 24 Jan 2003 09:51:28 +1100 (EST) Received: from ausym000.exau01.exch.eds.com ([134.251.177.117]) by nnsy.eds.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0NMpSK08909 for ; Fri, 24 Jan 2003 09:51:28 +1100 (EST) Received: by AUSYM000 with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Fri, 24 Jan 2003 09:41:10 +1100 Message-ID: <33CDDBD8CAEFEB4191ABF6F799032AF238D771@aubwm206> To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Becker Grand Prix 1402 radio/cassette - 1989 - Any good? Date: Fri, 24 Jan 2003 09:41:11 +1100 Importance: high X-Priority: 1 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" From: "Trim, Matthew L" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88615102 X-Yahoo-Profile: bofh2k2000 G'day, I have the opportunity to purchase a Becker Grand Prix 1402 radio/cassette, made in 1989 for the bargain? price of $400AUD. It comes as is but is apparently fully tested and working, no wiring, original carton or manual. They have a few available apparently. It is AM Stereo with a "Mono" button for noisy signals. My question - is it worth this much and is it any good!? If they tune in 1khz increments perhaps someone on this list might want one as well? Cheers, Matt From n0uiheric@aol.com Thu Jan 23 15:58:17 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 23 Jan 2003 23:58:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 86117 invoked from network); 23 Jan 2003 23:58:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Jan 2003 23:58:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r04.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.100) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Jan 2003 23:58:15 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-r04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.116.1dd498ea (16930) for ; Thu, 23 Jan 2003 18:58:09 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <116.1dd498ea.2b61db91@aol.com> Date: Thu, 23 Jan 2003 18:58:09 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} 1520 WWKB to flip to Oldies on January 27th To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih The WKBW calls are still reserved for the ABC-TV affiliate (VHF Channel 7) in Buffalo. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From dav259@csiro.au Thu Jan 23 17:25:24 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Jan 2003 01:25:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 46065 invoked from network); 24 Jan 2003 01:25:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Jan 2003 01:25:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Jan 2003 01:25:22 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0O1PLP21641 for ; Fri, 24 Jan 2003 12:25:21 +1100 (EST) Date: Fri, 24 Jan 2003 12:25:21 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: amstereoforum Subject: Top 10 US radio groups Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public From the weekly OZ radio newsletter: Rank Group Est.revenue'01 # Stations # Markets 1 Clear Channel Communications $3.256 million 1,231 190 2 Viacom International $2,092 million 183 41 3 Cox Radio $428 million 81 18 4 Entercom $408 million 104 19 5 ABC Radio $410 million 58 29 6 Citadel Communications $313 million 205 41 7 Radio One $287 million 64 22 8 Emmis Communications $258 million 21 7 9 Cumulus Media $253 million 243 52 10 Hispanic Broadcasting $251 million 55 15 I've got a feeling CC's rev should be listed as 3.256 billion. What markets are Emmis Comms in? They sure are doing well! From n0uiheric@aol.com Thu Jan 23 17:56:44 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Jan 2003 01:56:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 70461 invoked from network); 24 Jan 2003 01:56:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Jan 2003 01:56:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m03.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.6) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Jan 2003 01:56:43 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-m03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.180.150550da (16930) for ; Thu, 23 Jan 2003 20:56:36 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <180.150550da.2b61f754@aol.com> Date: Thu, 23 Jan 2003 20:56:36 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: XM is gonna be rich.... To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih I've heard XM Satellite Radio at Best Buy; it sounds like an analog FM radio. And who wants to pay $11 per month for a service that doesn't even offer NPR and BBC World Service (like Sirius does)? I certainly don't! That's why I opted for the shortwave converter. The major advantage is that no extra antennas are needed (you can use your existing car radio antenna), and the programming is free. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Thu Jan 23 17:56:46 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Jan 2003 01:56:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 16241 invoked from network); 24 Jan 2003 01:56:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Jan 2003 01:56:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d02.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.34) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Jan 2003 01:56:46 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-d02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.142.887dbc5 (16930) for ; Thu, 23 Jan 2003 20:56:39 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <142.887dbc5.2b61f757@aol.com> Date: Thu, 23 Jan 2003 20:56:39 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} XM is gonna be rich.... To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih Kevin, get yourself a shortwave converter. Amateur Electronic Supply sells the MFJ-306 shortwave converter; it converts signals in the 19, 25, 31 and 49 meter bands (15, 11, 9 and 6 MHz) to be received on the AM broadcast band. You don't need an extra antenna, and you'll get more programming for free than paying $11 per month for a service that doesn't even offer BBC World Service! The only way XM is ever gonna get rich is if Clear Channel sells it's stake in the service. CC has been a big money drain for XM (and all of broadcasting). While making more than $3 billion in revenues, they can still find a way to lose $4-5 billion annually. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Thu Jan 23 17:56:48 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Jan 2003 01:56:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 16304 invoked from network); 24 Jan 2003 01:56:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Jan 2003 01:56:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m02.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.5) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Jan 2003 01:56:46 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-m02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.1bd.1c5dc0e2 (16930) for ; Thu, 23 Jan 2003 20:56:35 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1bd.1c5dc0e2.2b61f753@aol.com> Date: Thu, 23 Jan 2003 20:56:35 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Top 10 US radio groups To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih I know that Emmis is in St. Louis; they own K-She 95 (AOR-actual dial position is 94.7), K-Hits 96.3 (Classic Hits), 97.1 FM Talk (Hot Talk), 104.1 The Mall (hits of the 1980s and 1990s) and 105-7 The Point (Alternative). Their consistent ratings king is long-established AOR station K-She. Just two stations carry local morning shows; K-Hits carries ex-shock jock J.C. Corcoran (he has toned down his act considerably since the 1980s) and 104.1 The Mall is the flagship station for Steve and D.C. Quasi-legal shockmeisters Bob and Tom are aired locally KSHE (from sister station 94.7 WFBQ in Indianapolis), veteran Don Imus is aired locally on 97.1 FM Talk (from ex-AM Stereo station WFAN in New York), and illegal shock jock Howard Stern is aired locally on The Point. They also have a local afternoon show with two illegal shock jocks; one of their former DJs was recently in trouble with the law. Clear Channel, despite these revenues, have only shown one quarterly profit since the Telecom Act was passed; Viacom has also suffered financial losses in it's radio division. Cumulus seems to be slipping because of taking the CC approach and cutting loose hard-working DJs in favor of voicetracked programming when they should be investing money in developing on-air talent. At least one AM Stereo supporter (Entercom) made this list. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From jbyrns@enteract.com Thu Jan 23 18:45:25 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Jan 2003 02:45:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 65053 invoked from network); 24 Jan 2003 02:45:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Jan 2003 02:45:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.69) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Jan 2003 02:45:24 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.133] by n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 24 Jan 2003 02:41:05 -0000 Date: Fri, 24 Jan 2003 02:41:02 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: IBOC / AM stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <200301231648170026.01EA3BA2@mail.globility.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1485 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.98.163 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Marv Southcott" wrote: > You are relentless, aren't you John. I'm trying not to be on the subject of these thin whips, I know pretty much everything about them that I care to know right now. There is only one issue related to them that I would initiate a discussion on at this point, and that is how much their performance in the NCE portion of the band improves when they are retuned for that portion of the FM band. At this point I have nothing much to say on that subject, because I feel the ball is in my court to do some experiments, if my curiosity reaches a critical mass. Of course if someone comes forward with some antenna range measurements for the original shorter thin whips vs. verses one retuned for the NCE portion of the band, that would get my attention. I have no intention at this point of getting into any physical differences that may or may not exist between the Fanfare whip, and the clones, however if a statement is made about them, such as your statement that "The other brands use a 0.125" SS rod", which is wrong on the face of it, I will comment, as I did in this case, when I pointed out that my "other brand" whip has a tapered whip. > Could it be that we are competing with ourselves? ;- )) I am not going to enter into discussion of that issue at this time, as far as I am concerned it is up to you to decide what you want to say about the history of these whips. John From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Jan 23 21:12:59 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Jan 2003 05:12:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 21284 invoked from network); 24 Jan 2003 05:12:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Jan 2003 05:12:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.201) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Jan 2003 05:12:57 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 23 Jan 2003 21:12:57 -0800 To: References: <20030123190138.63259.qmail@web14207.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Buffalo Stereo possibilities Date: Fri, 24 Jan 2003 00:12:45 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 24 Jan 2003 05:12:57.0671 (UTC) FILETIME=[4208B570:01C2C367] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.156.254.218] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 John P. wrote: > Entercom has always cared about their sound quality in the past, You should hear some of our local Entercom stations before saying that! LOL Even when AM 1330 was WFBC, the flagship station of Multimedia, the old Ampliphase transmitter sounded REAL nasty. Today, 1330 is WYRD and it still sounds REAL nasty! Of the Entercom cluster here in the Upstate of South Carolina, (WYRD, WORD, WSPA-AM & FM, WFBC-FM, WOLI-FM, WOLT-FM) None of the stations have real good audio. Some just sound worse than the others. Kevin From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Jan 23 21:18:48 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Jan 2003 05:18:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 28145 invoked from network); 24 Jan 2003 05:18:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Jan 2003 05:18:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Jan 2003 05:18:47 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.134] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 24 Jan 2003 05:18:47 -0000 Date: Fri, 24 Jan 2003 05:18:46 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: XM is gonna be rich.... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <002201c2c328$dd75fac0$0101a8c0@pavilion> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1293 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.71.24 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > As the owner of 2 XM radios, and all three holders (boombox, car > and home kit) The sound is excellent, with the sound being equal or > better than any 128K MP3 file I've heard. As I understand it, XM and Sirius are both like one huge variable bit-rate system, with a finite total bandwidth, but a flexible bit allocation to each channel within this bandwidth. So, a channel carrying mono talk programming would be allocated a much lower bit-rate than a channel carrying "challenging" wide-separation Stereo music, and the ratios vary in real-time. In other words, the channels are allowed to "steal" bandwidth from each other, depending on their current programming content -- and that's why sometimes, a particular XM or Sirius channel can sound great, but other times, it won't sound much better than IBOC. And factor in providing "excellent" sound, even at low bit-rates, is the audio processing used, or lack thereof. At least theoretically, XM and Sirius don't have the "Loudness Wars" between the channels, so much more relaxed processing can be used, with greater dynamic range. Also, there is no pre-emphasis curve to deal with, so the high treble can come through with greater definition and clarity, at least as much as the "simulated" SBR treble can manage. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Jan 23 21:25:07 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Jan 2003 05:25:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 78336 invoked from network); 24 Jan 2003 05:25:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Jan 2003 05:25:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Jan 2003 05:25:02 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.142] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 24 Jan 2003 05:25:02 -0000 Date: Fri, 24 Jan 2003 05:24:59 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Becker Grand Prix 1402 radio/cassette - 1989 - Any good? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <33CDDBD8CAEFEB4191ABF6F799032AF238D771@aubwm206> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 788 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.71.24 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > I have the opportunity to purchase a Becker Grand Prix 1402 > radio/cassette, made in 1989 for the bargain? price of $400AUD. These are excellent radios, although expensive even today, as you can see. Both reception and sound quality are superb. The ones that have an "AM-FM STEREO" logo in the upper left hand corner of the cassette door are equipped with C-Quam AM Stereo. They can manually tune in 1 kHz increments -- rare for a car radio -- plus automatic seek tuning is available with a variable level of sensitivity for determining how strong a signal needs to be for it to stop on. Just make sure you get the security code with the radio. Otherwise the radio won't work, and you'll have to go to a Mercedes dealer to have them look up the code, which isn't cheap. From matthew.trim@eds.com Thu Jan 23 21:34:43 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: matthew.trim@eds.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Jan 2003 05:34:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 67654 invoked from network); 24 Jan 2003 05:34:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Jan 2003 05:34:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO ns5.eds.com) (203.17.185.230) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Jan 2003 05:34:42 -0000 Received: from nnsy.eds.com (nnsy-2.eds.com [192.85.216.198]) by ns5.eds.com (8.11.6/8.11.1) with ESMTP id h0O5YfX23019 for ; Fri, 24 Jan 2003 16:34:41 +1100 (EST) Received: from nnsy.eds.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by nnsy.eds.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0O5Ydv27162 for ; Fri, 24 Jan 2003 16:34:39 +1100 (EST) Received: from ausym000.exau01.exch.eds.com ([134.251.177.117]) by nnsy.eds.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0O5YcK27150 for ; Fri, 24 Jan 2003 16:34:38 +1100 (EST) Received: by AUSYM000 with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Fri, 24 Jan 2003 16:34:36 +1100 Message-ID: <33CDDBD8CAEFEB4191ABF6F799032AF238D773@aubwm206> To: "'amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com'" Subject: RE: {AMSF} Re: Becker Grand Prix 1402 radio/cassette - 1989 - An y good? Date: Fri, 24 Jan 2003 16:24:18 +1100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-Type: text/plain From: "Trim, Matthew L" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88615102 X-Yahoo-Profile: bofh2k2000 Sounds good.. it sounds like they are wideband when in AM Stereo mode as well.. Apparently Becker is a German radio manufacturer who have a reputation for quality. Here is some info from the Australian dealers website: http://www.soundlabsgroup.com.au/Becker/Default.htm Does anyone on the list want one? The dealer says they have "a few" available - I can ask how many and we can go from there if anyone's interested? Might be able to get them cheaper if we buy a few. Cheers, Matt -----Original Message----- From: Kevin T. [mailto:kevtronics@yahoo.com] Sent: Friday, 24 January 2003 3:25 PM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: Becker Grand Prix 1402 radio/cassette - 1989 - Any good? > I have the opportunity to purchase a Becker Grand Prix 1402 > radio/cassette, made in 1989 for the bargain? price of $400AUD. These are excellent radios, although expensive even today, as you can see. Both reception and sound quality are superb. The ones that have an "AM-FM STEREO" logo in the upper left hand corner of the cassette door are equipped with C-Quam AM Stereo. They can manually tune in 1 kHz increments -- rare for a car radio -- plus automatic seek tuning is available with a variable level of sensitivity for determining how strong a signal needs to be for it to stop on. Just make sure you get the security code with the radio. Otherwise the radio won't work, and you'll have to go to a Mercedes dealer to have them look up the code, which isn't cheap. Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Jan 23 22:10:16 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Jan 2003 06:10:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 86065 invoked from network); 24 Jan 2003 06:10:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Jan 2003 06:10:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.89) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Jan 2003 06:10:16 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.145] by n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 24 Jan 2003 06:10:15 -0000 Date: Fri, 24 Jan 2003 06:10:15 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: 1160 WYNS sold Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 905 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.71.24 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics 1160 WYNS in Lehighton, PA, an AM Stereo station that went dark at the beginning of the year when its local owners shut it down and turned in the license, has been sold to Millennium Communications for $425,000. (Note that this is not the same as Millennium Radio Group, which owns a number of NJ radio stations, including ex-AM Stereo 1260 WBUD in Trenton). As far as I can determine, WYNS was broadcasting in Stereo right until it went dark, so clearly the new owners have the choice of keeping the Stereo going with whatever the new format will be, if they so desire. And if not, this will at least possibly provide the opportunity for the C-Quam exciter and other associated equipment to be acquired and put into use at another station that is looking to upgrade to AM Stereo. In either case, I'll try to get the contact info for the new owners so we can find out what's what at WYNS. From evergreenterrace@buzzle.com Thu Jan 23 22:34:26 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: evergreenterrace@buzzle.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Jan 2003 06:34:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 3158 invoked from network); 24 Jan 2003 06:34:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Jan 2003 06:34:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Jan 2003 06:34:26 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.143] by n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 24 Jan 2003 06:34:26 -0000 Date: Fri, 24 Jan 2003 06:34:25 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: WSAI Stereo (??) Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 152 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgliradio " X-Originating-IP: 151.204.159.78 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=69711087 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgliradio On my way home tonight, I noticed that WSAI had the stereo pilot on. My Chrysler usually doesn't false, so I was wondering if anyone could verify? From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Jan 23 23:07:36 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Jan 2003 07:07:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 53397 invoked from network); 24 Jan 2003 07:07:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Jan 2003 07:07:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.89) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Jan 2003 07:07:34 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.159] by n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 24 Jan 2003 07:07:34 -0000 Date: Fri, 24 Jan 2003 07:07:31 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: WSAI Stereo (??) Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 531 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.71.24 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > On my way home tonight, I noticed that WSAI had the stereo pilot > on. My Chrysler usually doesn't false, so I was wondering if > anyone could verify? For years, there have been intermittent reports of 1530 WSAI seeming to have a Stereo pilot (most likely "falsing"), but they've never actually been transmitting in Stereo. Another frequency that *always* falses at night in the Northeast is 1510 kHz, due to the mix between WWZN in Boston (ex-Stereo) and WLAC in Nashville. Their carriers must be exactly 25 Hz apart! From dav259@csiro.au Fri Jan 24 00:33:55 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Jan 2003 08:33:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 59857 invoked from network); 24 Jan 2003 08:33:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Jan 2003 08:33:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Jan 2003 08:33:55 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0O8XqP08647; Fri, 24 Jan 2003 19:33:52 +1100 (EST) Date: Fri, 24 Jan 2003 19:33:52 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: amstereoforum Cc: Steve Dinius <10kc@fmtc.com> Subject: Public radio Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public Victoria is currently in a bad way with Oz suffering its worst drought in years and currently massive bushfires in the NE Vic Mountain region. Thankfully no lives have been lost - and thanks to the Kiwis for sending a band of willing fire fighters across the Tasman Pond to help us in our time of need! This is where radio becomes a "service" like no other medium can. The ABC Victorian regional stations have their own breakfast and late arvo (afternoon) programs - but at the moment the two ABC stations in the affected region are having local hourly updates on the hour - 24 hours a day. That's what I call taxpayers money well spent. And it only costs each Aussie 8 cents a day. IMO the FCC, CRTC, ABA, etc should make it a condition of ANY radio licence that the licencee MUST be able to provide a service to their local market at times like this. God bless public radio! Ian - Vic From jeffdeck@aol.com Fri Jan 24 01:05:58 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: Jeffdeck@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Jan 2003 09:05:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 66974 invoked from network); 24 Jan 2003 09:05:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Jan 2003 09:05:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r03.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.99) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Jan 2003 09:05:57 -0000 Received: from Jeffdeck@aol.com by imo-r03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.bd.2dc11904 (4539); Fri, 24 Jan 2003 04:05:53 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Fri, 24 Jan 2003 04:05:52 EST Subject: Re: WSAI Stereo (??) To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Cc: ABDX@topica.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 8.0 for Windows US sub 234 From: jeffdeck@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=4430287 X-Yahoo-Profile: jeffdeck2001 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable All, Last Sunday afternoon I noticed stereo pilot and separation from=20 WSAI. Beatles were playing, and there was unusual signal fading. My QTH is approximately 120 miles from this station. 73, Jeff In a message dated 1/24/2003 1:43:46 AM Eastern Standard Time, you write: >On my way home tonight, I noticed that WSAI had the stereo pilot=20 >on.=A0 My Chrysler usually doesn't false, so I was wondering if anyone=20 >could verify? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From par@longwaveradio.com Fri Jan 24 02:32:42 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: par@longwaveradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Jan 2003 10:32:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 62779 invoked from network); 24 Jan 2003 10:32:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Jan 2003 10:32:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO atlas.net.uk) (195.54.226.6) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Jan 2003 10:32:41 -0000 Received: from [213.249.184.169] (HELO [192.168.0.2]) by atlas.net.uk (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.0.2) with ESMTP id 9893438 for amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com; Fri, 24 Jan 2003 10:33:36 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: @pophost.atlas.co.uk (Unverified) Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <1043399160.2928.66979.m1@yahoogroups.com> References: <1043399160.2928.66979.m1@yahoogroups.com> Date: Fri, 24 Jan 2003 10:32:37 +0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: DAB audio quality Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" From: Paul Rusling X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=8876782 X-Yahoo-Profile: doctorradio2002 Kevin claimed that >The only digital audio broadcasting system that has any kind of >respectable audio quality is Eureka 147 DAB Needs some qualification Kevin - add the words "is capable of" as DAB in the Uk is sounding very ropey on some channels (notably some BBC ones) where they have lowered bit rates to cram more stations in. Admittedly, its the speech stations which are getting poor quality, with BBC Radio 3 (highbrow, mainly classical and 'world' music) still enjoying over a hundred bits. Paul Rusling From fanfare@globility.com Fri Jan 24 06:20:38 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Jan 2003 14:20:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 28028 invoked from network); 24 Jan 2003 14:20:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Jan 2003 14:20:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Jan 2003 14:20:36 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.173] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 24 Jan 2003 14:20:35 -0000 Date: Fri, 24 Jan 2003 14:20:35 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Electrical Engineer/Ham radio operator moves to stall IBOC Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 223 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Mr.M S " X-Originating-IP: 64.56.235.27 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy I think you'll all want to take a look at this URL. http://www.rwonline.com/dailynews/one.php?id=2506 Looks like RW does see both sides, or are they simply prophesizing this will be our own little Tiananmen Square. MS From philipr@irac.pe.ca Fri Jan 24 06:25:13 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Jan 2003 14:25:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 81538 invoked from network); 24 Jan 2003 14:25:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Jan 2003 14:25:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Jan 2003 14:25:12 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.250] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 24 Jan 2003 14:25:10 -0000 Date: Fri, 24 Jan 2003 14:25:10 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: WWKB where has the pilot light gone? Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 728 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking Interestingly, after months of regularly keeping tabs on 1520 WWKB and seeing the stereo pilot "on", in recent days, with the impending changes back to music, I've noticed that the pilot light is off. I've checked early evening, late evening, and early morning - good skywave signal, but alas no pilot light. The pessimist in me says they're gearing up for IBOC, perhaps in the summer, and have pulled the plug on CQUAM. The optimist in me is saying the CQUAM exciter is temporarily out of service for maintenance and freshning up, so that come Monday morning they'll make a nice splash with their 58 to 74 classic top 40 format. Has anyone else noticed this, someone a little closer to Buffalo than PEI? Phil R. From amstereoguy@hotmail.com Fri Jan 24 06:53:49 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereoguy@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Jan 2003 14:53:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 28922 invoked from network); 24 Jan 2003 14:53:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Jan 2003 14:53:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (207.68.165.12) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Jan 2003 14:53:47 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 24 Jan 2003 06:53:47 -0800 Received: from 208.228.96.20 by sea2fd.sea2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Fri, 24 Jan 2003 14:53:46 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Electrical Engineer/Ham radio operator moves to stall IBOC Date: Fri, 24 Jan 2003 09:53:46 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 24 Jan 2003 14:53:47.0181 (UTC) FILETIME=[65F5EDD0:01C2C3B8] From: "Chris Cuff" X-Originating-IP: [208.228.96.20] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37866059 Thats interesting!- I have always considered RW to be biased towards IBOC, which is why I cancelled my subscription. As well, a certain well-know member of their staff had me send items to him with the promise of doing a story for us. He will not return the items, or return email, but is still there. I will not mention names , even privately, as I am considering legal action. Yet another reason why radio sucks. Chris >From: "Mr.M S " >Reply-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com >To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com >Subject: {AMSF} Electrical Engineer/Ham radio operator moves to stall IBOC >Date: Fri, 24 Jan 2003 14:20:35 -0000 > >I think you'll all want to take a look at this URL. > >http://www.rwonline.com/dailynews/one.php?id=2506 _________________________________________________________________ The new MSN 8: smart spam protection and 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail From michaelj@vcn.com Fri Jan 24 07:09:02 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Jan 2003 15:09:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 52756 invoked from network); 24 Jan 2003 15:09:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Jan 2003 15:09:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m1-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Jan 2003 15:09:00 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m1-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Fri, 24 Jan 2003 08:08:59 -0700 Message-ID: <003601c2c3ba$84984420$0701010a@keva> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Electrical Engineer/Ham radio operator moves to stall IBOC Date: Fri, 24 Jan 2003 08:08:55 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Way to go John!! He made RW! Woohoo!! Geez, you think if we all back him, we'll get in there too? :) That's awesome. I'm glad RW is paying attention. And John did this right.....used the correct legal channels and made this a true-to-life legal MOTION against the FCC. John, you said just other day that you got a package from the FCC lawyuhs about this. Any news on it?? Again, congrats! MJR n WYO ----- Original Message ----- From: Mr.M S To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, January 24, 2003 7:20 AM Subject: {AMSF} Electrical Engineer/Ham radio operator moves to stall IBOC I think you'll all want to take a look at this URL. http://www.rwonline.com/dailynews/one.php?id=2506 Looks like RW does see both sides, or are they simply prophesizing this will be our own little Tiananmen Square. MS [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From jwelton@nautel.com Fri Jan 24 07:37:11 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jwelton@nautel.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Jan 2003 15:37:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 49530 invoked from network); 24 Jan 2003 15:37:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Jan 2003 15:37:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailserver.nautel.com) (24.222.25.85) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Jan 2003 15:37:10 -0000 Received: FROM jeff-welton BY mailserver.nautel.com ; Fri Jan 24 11:37:46 2003 -0400 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Date: Fri, 24 Jan 2003 11:34:24 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: {AMSF} 1160 WYNS sold Message-ID: <3E3124C0.29775.22D320@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.02a) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body From: "Jeff Welton" Reply-To: jwelton@nautel.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=26918678 > opportunity for the C-Quam exciter and other associated equipment to > be acquired and put into use at another station that is looking to > upgrade to AM Stereo. In either case, I'll try to get the contact > info for the new owners so we can find out what's what at WYNS. It will be an external exciter, such as the BE, Delta or Motorola. The station has our AMPFET 5 transmitter, shipped in 1986, with the stereo interface module and therefore would require an external, self-contained, stereo exciter. Incidentally, I haven't had any requests for a mono driver for the transmitter, so might be it will be back on in stereo. Regards, Jeff Welton Nautel Customer Service Dept. Tel.: 1-902-823-3900 ext. 127 Fax: 1-902-823-3183 email: jwelton@nautel.com From mychucky@funport.net Fri Jan 24 08:40:41 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: mychucky@funport.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Jan 2003 16:40:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 9149 invoked from network); 24 Jan 2003 16:40:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Jan 2003 16:40:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.funport.com) (216.199.19.6) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Jan 2003 16:40:39 -0000 Received: from FatMusic2000 ([]) by mail.funport.com (Merak 5.5.4) with SMTP id JFB36580 for ; Fri, 24 Jan 2003 11:40:42 -0500 Message-ID: <000f01c2c3c7$39d95d90$1400a8c0@FatMusic2000> To: References: Subject: Re: Employment Opportunities Date: Fri, 24 Jan 2003 11:39:55 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6700 From: X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=85836819 X-Yahoo-Profile: mychucky1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Any Body have any openings for a qualified engineer. 1st Class ticket mucho experience In Audio RF and some Video. Been checking SBE, NAB and inquiring locally. www.stereoam.com is not selling anything, hmmm nothing to sell. The station I am working for has been sold and the guy I replaced here 5 years ago is the engineer for the company that bought it. http://216.199.19.5/mychucky/resume will get you a brief synopsis Will relocate anywhere, yes even Montana. Pass this email on to anyone that may be interested. Slightly off subject of AM Stereo however as I am a qualified installer of AM Stereo exciters in the past I hope no one will mind. Later Guys Chuck [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Jan 24 09:32:42 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Jan 2003 17:32:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 14532 invoked from network); 24 Jan 2003 17:32:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Jan 2003 17:32:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Jan 2003 17:32:41 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.129] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 24 Jan 2003 17:32:41 -0000 Date: Fri, 24 Jan 2003 17:32:38 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: KB-1520 web site already up Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 681 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics 1520 WWKB in Buffalo, NY (which may possibly switch back to WKBW) already has the web site up for its new '50s/'60s music format, set to make its debut on January 27th: http://www.kb1520.com/main.php Note that if you just go to www.kb1520.com, all you get it a teaser saying "coming soon"... this is a "hidden" link! Here are the relevant e-mail links for asking if the new format will be in AM Stereo or not: General Station Feedback feedback@kb1520.com Hank Nevins Program Director hank@kb1520.com WWKB 1520 AM Entercom Buffalo, LLC 500 Corporate Parkway, Suite 200 Buffalo, NY 14226 Business: 716-843-0600 Fax Number: 716-843-0250 From jeffdeck@aol.com Fri Jan 24 09:35:14 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: Jeffdeck@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Jan 2003 17:35:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 41311 invoked from network); 24 Jan 2003 17:35:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Jan 2003 17:35:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r05.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.101) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Jan 2003 17:35:13 -0000 Received: from Jeffdeck@aol.com by imo-r05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.141.8970f1f (4539) for ; Fri, 24 Jan 2003 12:34:54 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <141.8970f1f.2b62d33d@aol.com> Date: Fri, 24 Jan 2003 12:34:53 EST Subject: Carver TX-2 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 8.0 for Windows US sub 234 From: jeffdeck@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=4430287 X-Yahoo-Profile: jeffdeck2001 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3002869242 All, Check out this guy's auction for Carver TX-2 tuner. He "stole" my description, word-for-word, not realizing that TX-2 do not arrive standard with AM stereo. It is a very simple modification, and AM stereo performance is above average. I had my laugh for today. 73, Jeff [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From jsgil@hal-pc.org Fri Jan 24 11:31:51 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Jan 2003 19:31:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 89063 invoked from network); 24 Jan 2003 19:31:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Jan 2003 19:31:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.83) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Jan 2003 19:31:50 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.160] by n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 24 Jan 2003 19:31:49 -0000 Date: Fri, 24 Jan 2003 19:31:48 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: MC13028 Ddecoder Chip Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 666 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.30 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst An interesting finding in building a 13028 decoder. The L & R outputs at pins 15 & 16 are inverted and should properly be labeled (-L) and (-R). I found this out two ways. Since the chip has little filtering for the rectified IF and with a demodulated signal at the output pins the 900KHz(2xIF) riding on top of the demodulated signal is greater in amplitude on the negative peak of the waveform than it is on the positive peak as observed on an O-Scope. It is also verifiable by overmodulating the signal generator which causes clipping at -100% modulation and the positive peak of the demodulated signal on the O-Scope is clipped and not the negative. JSG From philipr@irac.pe.ca Fri Jan 24 11:39:59 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Jan 2003 19:39:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 21225 invoked from network); 24 Jan 2003 19:39:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Jan 2003 19:39:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.86) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Jan 2003 19:39:58 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.170] by n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 24 Jan 2003 19:39:58 -0000 Date: Fri, 24 Jan 2003 19:39:58 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: The Day the music ... came back!!! Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1076 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking The Day the Music ... Died ... sorry, wrong record!!! The Day the Music ... came back!!! On KB 1520 Buffalo's Klassics I would ask everyone on the list, within listening range [gotta love that solid skywave signal] of WWKB, who is interested and intends to listen to them - to email them, show your appreciation, and ask that they broadcast in CQUAM AM Stereo. We know they have the exciter, we just want to make sure they have it on! Why not roll a tape and catch Danny's return on Monday, January 27, 2003 at 6 am EST. Marv, can you catch them on the Fanfare and have a tape rolling? Could you send them a tape so they will know just how good they sound on a currently manufactured AM Stereo radio? Ditto to everyone else within reach, using your best AM Stereo receiver. If you don't have an AM Stereo receiver, but have a wideband mono rig, roll the tape anyway. I would love for the good folks at KB 1520 to get a bunch of tapes or CDs from real listeners listening on typical wideband and typical AM Stereo radios! Thanks guys and gals! Phil R. From jbyrns@enteract.com Fri Jan 24 12:09:48 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 24 Jan 2003 20:09:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 80635 invoked from network); 24 Jan 2003 20:09:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Jan 2003 20:09:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.89) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Jan 2003 20:09:47 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.248] by n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 24 Jan 2003 20:09:43 -0000 Date: Fri, 24 Jan 2003 20:09:43 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: MC13028 Ddecoder Chip Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1357 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.98.96 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "jsgilst " < jsgil@h...> wrote: > An interesting finding in building a 13028 decoder. > The L & R outputs at pins 15 & 16 are inverted and > should properly be labeled (-L) and (-R). That's an interesting observation, but is it really a serious problem? What difference does the phase of the "L" & "R" outputs of the chip make, unless you are trying to directly replace a 13020 decoder IC with the 13028, and want to keep the same relative phase on the output of the tuner? With a clean sheet of paper, the complete tuner can have which ever output phase you want. > I found this out two ways. Since the chip has little > filtering for the rectified IF and with a demodulated > signal at the output pins the 900KHz(2xIF) riding > on top of the demodulated signal is greater in > amplitude on the negative peak of the waveform > than it is on the positive peak as observed on an > O-Scope. This is very interesting! Wasn't someone here claiming just the other day that the 13028 uses a synchronous detector for the (L+R), even though the data sheet says it uses an envelope detector? Your observation of greater 900 kHz on the negative peak, than on the positive peak of the outputs, would seem to suggest that the 13028 does actually use an envelope detector for the (L+R) signal. John From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Jan 24 16:14:35 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Jan 2003 00:14:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 18761 invoked from network); 25 Jan 2003 00:14:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Jan 2003 00:14:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.75) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Jan 2003 00:14:34 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.171] by n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 25 Jan 2003 00:14:30 -0000 Date: Sat, 25 Jan 2003 00:14:25 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Status report: 1530 WSAI, 1520 WWKB, 1560 WQEW Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 651 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.79.22 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics After checking with multiple radios tonight, I am almost certain that 1530 WSAI is transmitting an AM Stereo pilot tone, but I have not noticed any true Stereo audio. They do have a nice classic reverb in their audio, though. Also, 1520 WWKB is definitely mono right now; no C-Quam pilot is received, even when the signal is perfect. Finally, for a while this evening I could *swear* 1560 WQEW (Radio Disney) was transmitting an AM Stereo signal, with mono audio, as my radio would pop into Stereo mode and stay there for as long as I had them tuned in -- but I checked again a while later and my reception of them was back to plain mono. From jsgil@hal-pc.org Fri Jan 24 16:29:15 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Jan 2003 00:29:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 92645 invoked from network); 25 Jan 2003 00:29:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Jan 2003 00:29:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Jan 2003 00:29:14 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.155] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 25 Jan 2003 00:29:06 -0000 Date: Sat, 25 Jan 2003 00:29:06 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: MC13028 Ddecoder Chip Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2134 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.156 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "jsgilst " < > jsgil@h...> wrote: > > An interesting finding in building a 13028 decoder. > > The L & R outputs at pins 15 & 16 are inverted and > > should properly be labeled (-L) and (-R). > > That's an interesting observation, but is it really a serious problem? > What difference does the phase of the "L" & "R" outputs of the chip > make, unless you are trying to directly replace a 13020 decoder IC > with the 13028, and want to keep the same relative phase on the output > of the tuner? With a clean sheet of paper, the complete tuner can > have which ever output phase you want. It was something I just observed in tinkering with the chip. Some audiophools will say that they can tell the difference when a woofer goes in when it is supposed to come out. If it is advantageous to add an inverter to flip the phase and adds little if any to the parts count then might as well have it to correct phase. > > > I found this out two ways. Since the chip has little > > filtering for the rectified IF and with a demodulated > > signal at the output pins the 900KHz(2xIF) riding > > on top of the demodulated signal is greater in > > amplitude on the negative peak of the waveform > > than it is on the positive peak as observed on an > > O-Scope. > > This is very interesting! Wasn't someone here claiming just the other > day that the 13028 uses a synchronous detector for the (L+R), even > though the data sheet says it uses an envelope detector? Your > observation of greater 900 kHz on the negative peak, than on the > positive peak of the outputs, would seem to suggest that the 13028 > does actually use an envelope detector for the (L+R) signal. > > John All detectors, synchronous or envelope produce the 2nd harmonic of the IF and should be filtered. While the MC13020 and MC12022 have pins for the Env, I, & Q detectors where filter caps are used the MC13028 has no pins for filter caps and does some filtering within the chip but does not completely remove it. From jbyrns@enteract.com Fri Jan 24 21:12:05 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Jan 2003 05:12:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 11354 invoked from network); 25 Jan 2003 05:12:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Jan 2003 05:12:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.83) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Jan 2003 05:12:03 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.143] by n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 25 Jan 2003 05:12:02 -0000 Date: Sat, 25 Jan 2003 05:11:59 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: MC13028 Ddecoder Chip Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3100 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.238 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "jsgilst " < jsgil@h...> wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " > wrote: > > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "jsgilst " < > > jsgil@h...> wrote: > > > An interesting finding in building a 13028 decoder. > > > The L & R outputs at pins 15 & 16 are inverted and > > > should properly be labeled (-L) and (-R). > > > > That's an interesting observation, but is it really a serious > problem? > > What difference does the phase of the "L" & "R" outputs of the chip > > make, unless you are trying to directly replace a 13020 decoder IC > > with the 13028, and want to keep the same relative phase on the > output > > of the tuner? With a clean sheet of paper, the complete tuner can > > have which ever output phase you want. > > It was something I just observed in tinkering with the chip. Some > audiophools will say that they can tell the difference when a woofer > goes in when it is supposed to come out. If it is advantageous to > add an inverter to flip the phase and adds little if any to the parts > count then might as well have it to correct phase. I figured you were going to say there is a standard for the signal output polarity of AM tuners, actually I would be surprised if there isn't such a standard somewhere, as there are phase standards for most other audio equipment. I thin and audiophile would want a phase switch somewhere in his system, in case someone up stream isn't following the standards. > > > I found this out two ways. Since the chip has little > > > filtering for the rectified IF and with a demodulated > > > signal at the output pins the 900KHz(2xIF) riding > > > on top of the demodulated signal is greater in > > > amplitude on the negative peak of the waveform > > > than it is on the positive peak as observed on an > > > O-Scope. > > > > This is very interesting! Wasn't someone here claiming just the > other > > day that the 13028 uses a synchronous detector for the (L+R), even > > though the data sheet says it uses an envelope detector? Your > > observation of greater 900 kHz on the negative peak, than on the > > positive peak of the outputs, would seem to suggest that the 13028 > > does actually use an envelope detector for the (L+R) signal. > > All detectors, synchronous or envelope produce the 2nd harmonic of > the IF and should be filtered. While the MC13020 and MC12022 have > pins for the Env, I, & Q detectors where filter caps are used the > MC13028 has no pins for filter caps and does some filtering within > the chip but does not completely remove it. Quite a few detectors also produce the fundamental of the IF in the output, not just the 2nd and higher harmonics. I was just thinking that the effect you described is typical of diode type envelope detectors. I suppose the same is also generally true of synchronous detectors, and pseudo synchronous envelope detectors too, so maybe the effect isn't indicative of the type of detector in the chip, I'll have to think about it some. John From rjskadl@yahoo.com Fri Jan 24 21:18:18 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: rjskadl@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Jan 2003 05:18:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 62864 invoked from network); 25 Jan 2003 05:18:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Jan 2003 05:18:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Jan 2003 05:18:18 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.162] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 25 Jan 2003 05:18:18 -0000 Date: Sat, 25 Jan 2003 05:18:17 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: NYC AM TX Pics Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 652 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "rjskadl " X-Originating-IP: 24.187.99.188 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=29619919 X-Yahoo-Profile: rjskadl Yo Dudes! I had the Great fortune to be able to visit the TX sites of 1010 WINS, 710 WOR, and 1130 WBBR yesterday. I must say that the Engineers of all three stations were just great. The area of Northern New Jersey commonly known as "The Meadowlands" is Alive with AM Radio. You have Giants Stadium and Continental Airlines Arena surrounded by all but three of the NYC metro AM Stations. It is Truly a site to see. In case you missed out on the gathering yesterday, I took some pictures. Just go to my website and click on the small pics to see them full size. You can thank me later. -Rusty http://rjskadl.tripod.com/IBOC-Day.html From jsgil@hal-pc.org Fri Jan 24 21:47:13 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Jan 2003 05:47:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 98370 invoked from network); 25 Jan 2003 05:47:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Jan 2003 05:47:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Jan 2003 05:47:12 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.185] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 25 Jan 2003 05:47:12 -0000 Date: Sat, 25 Jan 2003 05:47:11 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: MC13028 Ddecoder Chip Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1194 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.168 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " > > Quite a few detectors also produce the fundamental of the IF in the > output, not just the 2nd and higher harmonics. I was just thinking > that the effect you described is typical of diode type envelope > detectors. I suppose the same is also generally true of synchronous > detectors, and pseudo synchronous envelope detectors too, so maybe the > effect isn't indicative of the type of detector in the chip, I'll have > to think about it some. > > John I can see unbalanced half wave detectors also producing the fundamental IF and very little of 2nd harmonic but the detectors used in all the Motorola decoders is a variation of their MC1496 modulator/demodulator which is a 4 quadrant full wave device. The pseudo synchronous envelope detector in the all the decoder chips is one of these and one input is driven by a limited signal as to operate it as a polarity switch so the output is always positive. This creates a very linear envelope detector as compared to a cheap diode detector found in most mono radios. They also have variations of these that are linear 4 quadrant multipliers, MC1494 & MC1495. JSG From possumhunter@netzero.net Fri Jan 24 21:48:56 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: possumhunter@netzero.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Jan 2003 05:48:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 594 invoked from network); 25 Jan 2003 05:48:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Jan 2003 05:48:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rly-ip03.mx.aol.com) (64.12.138.7) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Jan 2003 05:48:55 -0000 Received: from logs-mtc-ta.proxy.aol.com (logs-mtc-ta.proxy.aol.com [64.12.105.5]) by rly-ip03.mx.aol.com (v89.10) with ESMTP id RELAYIN6-0125004736; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 00:47:36 1900 Received: from ibm (ACA2CC51.ipt.aol.com [172.162.204.81]) by logs-mtc-ta.proxy.aol.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with SMTP id h0P5kQ4O439947 for ; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 00:46:27 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <00ce01c2c435$1494c4c0$51cca2ac@aoldsl.net> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} NYC AM TX Pics Date: Sat, 25 Jan 2003 00:46:15 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Apparently-From: DodgeRamTrucker@aol.com From: "Possum Hunter" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Now THIS is a great place to install a Continental transmitter! http://rjskadl.tripod.com/WBBR01.jpg From jbyrns@enteract.com Fri Jan 24 22:14:08 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Jan 2003 06:14:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 5042 invoked from network); 25 Jan 2003 06:14:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Jan 2003 06:14:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.84) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Jan 2003 06:14:07 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.172] by n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 25 Jan 2003 06:14:07 -0000 Date: Sat, 25 Jan 2003 06:14:07 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} NYC AM TX Pics Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <00ce01c2c435$1494c4c0$51cca2ac@aoldsl.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 306 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.73 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Possum Hunter" < possumhunter@n...> wrote: > Now THIS is a great place to install a Continental transmitter! > http://rjskadl.tripod.com/WBBR01.jpg In the proverbial dumpster? Those new transmitters don't have any personality at all, they are just "boxes". John From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Jan 24 22:25:27 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Jan 2003 06:25:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 28216 invoked from network); 25 Jan 2003 06:25:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Jan 2003 06:25:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web12808.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.174.43) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Jan 2003 06:25:27 -0000 Message-ID: <20030125062527.30665.qmail@web12808.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [216.192.79.22] by web12808.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 24 Jan 2003 22:25:27 PST Date: Fri, 24 Jan 2003 22:25:27 -0800 (PST) Subject: It's official... To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "Kevin T." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics It's official... the friendly engineers at 710 WOR are now childishly refusing to speak with me anymore. As the premiere IBOC station in the USA, this certainly paints a favorable picture about how IBOC and its supporters handle public relations, doesn't it? --- MAILER-DAEMON@yahoo.com wrote: > Date: 25 Jan 2003 04:40:07 -0000 > From: MAILER-DAEMON@yahoo.com > To: kevtronics@yahoo.com > Subject: failure delivery > > Message from yahoo.com. > Unable to deliver message to the following address(es). > > : > Connected to 161.58.14.6 but sender was rejected. > Remote host said: 551 5.0.0 We don't accept mail from this > hostname/address > > : > Connected to 161.58.14.6 but sender was rejected. > Remote host said: 551 5.0.0 We don't accept mail from this > hostname/address > > --- Original message follows. > > Return-Path: > Message-ID: <20030125044006.35877.qmail@web12805.mail.yahoo.com> > Received: from [216.192.79.22] by web12805.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, > 24 Jan 2003 20:40:06 PST > Date: Fri, 24 Jan 2003 20:40:06 -0800 (PST) > From: "Kevin T." > Subject: Re: WOR > To: Tom Ray > Cc: Kerry Richards > In-Reply-To: <008001c2c419$eabb86e0$6401a8c0@tomray> > MIME-Version: 1.0 > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > > > I would appreciate it if you would please refrain from requesting that > > my Chief Engineer go around my orders to make adjustments to WOR to > > your liking. It is not up to you to decide any aspect of WOR's > > operation. > > Mr. Ray, > > Before you go mouthing off, please read what I wrote again. I simply > reported my observation that WOR's splatter onto 680-750 kHz now seems > stronger than ever before, and I simply asked if you had modified the > level of WOR's IBOC sidebands again (as you did during the nighttime IBOC > tests). > > Obviously, as you probably have determined from my correspondence over > the past few months, if it was up to me, WOR wouldn't even be using IBOC > in the first place. But that's not the point, no matter how much you try > to make it to be in order to divert yourself from having to deal with the > real issues at hand. > > If you or Kerry simply don't want to answer any of my questions or > address any of my concerns about WOR's use of IBOC, then you should just > come right out and say it, rather than make false allegations about my > actions. > > I stand by everything I have written, including the 16-page statement > I have recently filed with the FCC in the IBOC proceeding (99-325). > And if you or Kerry can't or don't want to address the questions and > concerns of those who inquire, then perhaps WOR should get somebody else > to serve as Public Relations for its use of IBOC. > > Also, in the future, please refrain from making "hit and run" message > posts to the AM Stereo Forum. Just as anybody else, you are certainly > welcome to become a member, but only if you utilize it as a place for > discussion, rather than as a place to vent your frustration once every > few months. > > And for the record, the severe distortion in WOR's analog audio does make > it in violation of iBiquity's own rules and standards for the use of IBOC > (namely, the dB amount by which all analog audio response above 5 kHz > must be attenuated), but I guess that doesn't matter to you. > > Kevin Tekel > kevtronics@yahoo.com __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From dav259@csiro.au Fri Jan 24 23:03:16 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Jan 2003 07:03:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 54320 invoked from network); 25 Jan 2003 07:03:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Jan 2003 07:03:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Jan 2003 07:03:14 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0P73DP02588 for ; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 18:03:13 +1100 (EST) Date: Sat, 25 Jan 2003 18:03:13 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Subject: Re: {AMSF} It's official... In-Reply-To: <20030125062527.30665.qmail@web12808.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public On Fri, 24 Jan 2003, Kevin T. wrote: > It's official... the friendly engineers at 710 WOR are now childishly > refusing to speak with me anymore. As the premiere IBOC station in the > USA, this certainly paints a favorable picture about how IBOC and its > supporters handle public relations, doesn't it? I see ... As Maxwell Smart would say ... 'the o l d dummy spit". Now Tom ... what have you got to say to the rest of us? Hmmmm?? I nicely asked a couple of simple questions that you could have answered in two minutes. How proud are you of your new wizz-bang technology? Perhaps you better let WOR's promotions department provide the answers ... Ian - Melbourne From amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sat Jan 25 00:36:25 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 31789 invoked by uid 7800); 25 Jan 2003 08:36:25 -0000 Date: 25 Jan 2003 08:36:25 -0000 Message-ID: <1043483785.20.31788.m11@yahoogroups.com> X-eGroups-Application: polls X-Yahoo-Group-Post: system From: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Poll results for amstereoforum MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit The following amstereoforum poll is now closed. Here are the final results: POLL QUESTION: Which tuner sounds better on AM stereo stations? CHOICES AND RESULTS - Realistic TM-152, 0 votes, 0.00% - Carver TX-11a, 10 votes, 100.00% For more information about this group, please visit http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum For help with Yahoo! Groups, please visit http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/ From amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sat Jan 25 06:52:34 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 74332 invoked from network); 25 Jan 2003 14:52:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Jan 2003 14:52:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Jan 2003 14:52:33 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: notify@yahoogroups.com Received: from [66.218.67.150] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 25 Jan 2003 14:52:32 -0000 Date: 25 Jan 2003 14:52:31 -0000 Message-ID: <1043506351.32334.76758.w3@yahoogroups.com> X-eGroups-Application: files X-Yahoo-Group-Post: system From: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: New file uploaded to amstereoforum MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello, This email message is a notification to let you know that a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the amstereoforum group. File : /PO.STEREO.CMS.LYT Uploaded by : pcvpcn Description : a new PO coder stereo You can access this file at the URL http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum/files/PO.STEREO.CMS.LYT To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/files Regards, pcvpcn From stodd@sherbtel.net Sat Jan 25 09:40:37 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Jan 2003 17:40:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 72675 invoked from network); 25 Jan 2003 17:40:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Jan 2003 17:40:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Jan 2003 17:40:32 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-85-82.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.85.82]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h0PHeQhF005187 for ; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 11:40:29 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <003101c2c499$11457440$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Electrical Engineer/Ham radio operator moves to stall IBOC Date: Sat, 25 Jan 2003 11:41:56 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude I think you ought to do it ASAP if your funds will permit. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chris Cuff" > As well, a certain well-know member of their staff had me send items to him > with the promise of doing a story for us. He will not return the items, or > return email, but is still there. > I will not mention names , even privately, as I am considering legal action. From stodd@sherbtel.net Sat Jan 25 10:19:56 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Jan 2003 18:19:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 34598 invoked from network); 25 Jan 2003 18:19:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Jan 2003 18:19:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Jan 2003 18:19:55 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-85-82.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.85.82]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h0PIJqhF013361 for ; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 12:19:53 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <00ab01c2c49e$9240eac0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} NYC AM TX Pics Date: Sat, 25 Jan 2003 12:10:31 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude I agree. I'd have loved to have gotten that Continental for my collection if I could have afforded to go out there and get it. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Saturday, January 25, 2003 12:14 AM Subject: Re: {AMSF} NYC AM TX Pics > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Possum Hunter" < > possumhunter@n...> wrote: > > Now THIS is a great place to install a Continental transmitter! > > http://rjskadl.tripod.com/WBBR01.jpg > > In the proverbial dumpster? Those new transmitters don't have any > personality at all, they are just "boxes". > > John > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > From stodd@sherbtel.net Sat Jan 25 10:31:51 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Jan 2003 18:31:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 77240 invoked from network); 25 Jan 2003 18:31:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Jan 2003 18:31:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Jan 2003 18:31:51 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-85-82.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.85.82]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h0PIVlhF015955 for ; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 12:31:48 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <00c401c2c4a0$3cbc9ac0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Public radio Date: Sat, 25 Jan 2003 12:33:18 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude We had an especially bad grass fire season over here a few years back, and the local radio and TV stations seemed to do a reasonably good job. Even if they all don't do an equal share, folks around here usually know which stations to tune in, so there's no excuse not to be aware. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ian Davidson" To: "amstereoforum" > IMO the FCC, CRTC, ABA, etc should make it a condition of ANY radio > licence that the licencee MUST be able to provide a service to their local > market at times like this. > > God bless public radio! From stodd@sherbtel.net Sat Jan 25 10:35:52 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Jan 2003 18:35:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 59616 invoked from network); 25 Jan 2003 18:35:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Jan 2003 18:35:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Jan 2003 18:35:49 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-85-82.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.85.82]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h0PIZjhF016728 for ; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 12:35:46 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <00ce01c2c4a0$caa026e0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <000f01c2c3c7$39d95d90$1400a8c0@FatMusic2000> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Employment Opportunities Date: Sat, 25 Jan 2003 12:37:16 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude I don't know if it's been filled or not, but Salem was looking for an engineer for one of their station groups in Ohio. The person to contact is Hal Williams at halw@salem.cc. Even if that position has been filled, who knows where else they might be needing help. Scott ----- Original Message ----- From: > Any Body have any openings for a qualified engineer. 1st Class ticket mucho experience > In Audio RF and some Video. Been checking SBE, NAB and inquiring locally. > From stodd@sherbtel.net Sat Jan 25 11:04:06 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Jan 2003 19:04:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 63408 invoked from network); 25 Jan 2003 19:04:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Jan 2003 19:04:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Jan 2003 19:04:05 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-85-82.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.85.82]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h0PJ42hF022376 for ; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 13:04:03 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <010301c2c4a4$bde6dee0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <20030123190341.91388.qmail@web14202.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Engineers vs. Lawyers? Date: Sat, 25 Jan 2003 13:05:33 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude I wouldn't sweat it. I was thinking the same thing when that big envelope from Glenn Clark and Assoc. arrived, but I suspect it's some sort of formality. Please open it and let us know what it is. Congrats on it making the RW news bits. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "John P." > Ut-ohh, got a package in the mail from 'the lawyers'. Afraid to open it. > Guess it's not always so good to write to the FCC! From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sat Jan 25 11:06:22 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Jan 2003 19:06:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 98943 invoked from network); 25 Jan 2003 19:06:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Jan 2003 19:06:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.87) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Jan 2003 19:06:21 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.132] by n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 25 Jan 2003 19:06:21 -0000 Date: Sat, 25 Jan 2003 19:06:21 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: New file uploaded to amstereoforum Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <1043506351.32334.76758.w3@yahoogroups.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 685 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.226 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com wrote: > > Hello, > > This email message is a notification to let you know that > a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the amstereoforum > group. > > File : /PO.STEREO.CMS.LYT > Uploaded by : pcvpcn > Description : a new PO coder stereo > > You can access this file at the URL > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum/files/PO.STEREO.CMS.LYT > > To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit > > http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/files > > Regards, > > pcvpcn What is this. I am not familar with the extension .lyt JSG From stodd@sherbtel.net Sat Jan 25 11:16:20 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Jan 2003 19:16:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 24498 invoked from network); 25 Jan 2003 19:16:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Jan 2003 19:16:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Jan 2003 19:16:19 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-85-82.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.85.82]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h0PJGGhF024856 for ; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 13:16:17 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <010b01c2c4a6$73835fc0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Digital dah dit Date: Sat, 25 Jan 2003 13:17:47 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude I'm not as sure as that author that folks will accept the audible artifacts. I can imagine it now- a station promoting "You won't hear any digital artifacts on OUR station... because we don't use any!" ST ----- Original Message ----- From: > While not specifically on topic for this group, the following article offers a rather interesting perspective on where the future of radio could be headed. > From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sat Jan 25 11:25:47 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Jan 2003 19:25:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 72547 invoked from network); 25 Jan 2003 19:25:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Jan 2003 19:25:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.67) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Jan 2003 19:25:46 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.148] by n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 25 Jan 2003 19:25:46 -0000 Date: Sat, 25 Jan 2003 19:25:45 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Engineers vs. Lawyers? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <010301c2c4a4$bde6dee0$827dfea9@home1> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1352 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.226 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Scott Todd" wrote: > I wouldn't sweat it. I was thinking the same thing when that big envelope > from Glenn Clark and Assoc. arrived, but I suspect it's some sort of > formality. Please open it and let us know what it is. Congrats on it > making the RW news bits. > > > ST > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "John P." > > > Ut-ohh, got a package in the mail from 'the lawyers'. Afraid to open it. > > Guess it's not always so good to write to the FCC! After reading your Motion to Dismiss I didn't see anything in there that would bring any trouble but then again IANAL. There is a possibility that if the FCC takes interest in what we have to say all of us who have filed may get an invitation to represent our position in Washington. A lawyer friend of mine who filed comments on why Micro$oft should be broken up was asked if he wanted to speak in Washington and would have gone if wasn't for finances and his schedule. If an offer like this comes up it would not be mandatory to appear but it would help our position. Who knows with all the issues about station ownership by monopolies and that some of this is being looked at by Congress IBOC could be a factor in this since it gobbles up additional BW that could have been for LPFM or AM stations. JSG From possumhunter@netzero.net Sat Jan 25 12:06:30 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Jan 2003 20:06:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 84674 invoked from network); 25 Jan 2003 20:06:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Jan 2003 20:06:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.205) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Jan 2003 20:06:27 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 12:06:27 -0800 To: References: <00ab01c2c49e$9240eac0$827dfea9@home1> Subject: Re: {AMSF} NYC AM TX Pics Date: Sat, 25 Jan 2003 15:06:06 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 25 Jan 2003 20:06:27.0744 (UTC) FILETIME=[3E8A6A00:01C2C4AD] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.129.219.138] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Scott Todd wrote: > I agree. I'd have loved to have gotten that Continental for my collection The Continental 317C that was installed at WESC 660 was a muffle box from day one. Yes, it made a big ole loud signal, but sure wasn't high fidelity. The manual listed it's audio response as flat from 100Hz - 8Khz, and it would just barely do that! WESC always sounded much brighter on the 500 Watt Pre-Sunrise / 10,000 Watt critical hours transmitter, a Continental 316F. As much as I dislike the 317C, I do wonder why WBBR trashed theirs. Seems like if they could have sold it for any amount to a place that rebuilds transmitters like Armstrong or Transcom for even a few bucks it is better than paying a trash company to haul it off! Kevin From JH_Radio@GameBox.net Sat Jan 25 12:50:50 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: JH_Radio@GameBox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Jan 2003 20:50:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 38029 invoked from network); 25 Jan 2003 20:50:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Jan 2003 20:50:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO babyruth.hotpop.com) (204.57.55.14) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Jan 2003 20:50:49 -0000 Received: from gamebox.net (kubrick.hotpop.com [204.57.55.16]) by babyruth.hotpop.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 84CB0249F39 for ; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 20:49:19 +0000 (UTC) Received: from -enduser.GameBox.net (pcp03184855pcs.benslm01.pa.comcast.net [68.80.77.117]) by smtp-2.hotpop.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 38D4C1B8F06 for ; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 17:50:51 +0000 (UTC) Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030125125215.02e90ec0@pop.GameBox.net> X-Sender: JH_Radio@pop.GameBox.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Sat, 25 Jan 2003 12:55:28 -0500 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Best AM Radio, ever? Mime-Version: 1.0 X-HotPOP: ----------------------------------------------- Sent By HotPOP.com FREE Email Get your FREE POP email at www.HotPOP.com ----------------------------------------------- From: John X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113800107 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Okay Well I got the TM-152, and the thing sounds like crap. Hopefully I can get my $86 back. Mean while, what is the best AM Stereo radio to get? Features I'm looking for are Expanded AM Coverage, AMax certified, Noise blanking, selectable wide/Narrow mode, DX beast, as well as having good sound. And using the latest Motorola C-Quam decoder chip. Love in Christ: John Bensalem, PA Send me an email Aim: RainAngelsRule MSN: RainAngelsRule@hotmail.com My website Welcome to Napster4TheBlind "Prayer does not change God; it changes you." - Authur unknown [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From wbcradio@atlas.co.uk Sat Jan 25 13:13:16 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: wbcradio@atlas.co.uk X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Jan 2003 21:13:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 16306 invoked from network); 25 Jan 2003 21:13:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Jan 2003 21:13:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO atlas.net.uk) (195.54.226.6) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Jan 2003 21:13:15 -0000 Received: from [213.249.184.169] (account wbcradio@atlas.co.uk HELO [192.168.0.2]) by atlas.net.uk (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.0.2) with ESMTP id 9945742 for amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 21:14:11 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: wbcradio@atlas.co.uk@pophost.atlas.co.uk Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <1043510318.379.63258.m12@yahoogroups.com> References: <1043510318.379.63258.m12@yahoogroups.com> Date: Sat, 25 Jan 2003 21:13:07 +0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: A buffalo web site Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" From: Paul Rusling X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public Kevin T posted an odd ball URL for WWKB , or Wkbw, on 1520 which gets man nowhere. if anyone has the correct one I would appreciate it. thsanks Paul Rusling From PAR@longwaveradio.com Sat Jan 25 13:14:16 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: PAR@longwaveradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Jan 2003 21:14:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 98335 invoked from network); 25 Jan 2003 21:14:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Jan 2003 21:14:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO atlas.net.uk) (195.54.226.6) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Jan 2003 21:14:16 -0000 Received: from [213.249.184.169] (HELO [192.168.0.2]) by atlas.net.uk (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.0.2) with ESMTP id 9945768 for amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 21:15:12 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: wbcradio@longwaveradio.com@pophost.atlas.co.uk Message-Id: Date: Sat, 25 Jan 2003 21:14:10 +0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: ct: A buffalo web site From: Paul Rusling X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Kevin T posted an odd ball URL for WWKB , or Wkbw, on 1520 which gets man nowhere. if anyone has the correct one I would appreciate it. thanks Paul Rusling [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From PAR@longwaveradio.com Sat Jan 25 13:30:25 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: par@longwaveradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Jan 2003 21:30:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 31659 invoked from network); 25 Jan 2003 21:30:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Jan 2003 21:30:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO atlas.net.uk) (195.54.226.6) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Jan 2003 21:30:24 -0000 Received: from [213.249.184.169] (HELO [192.168.0.2]) by atlas.net.uk (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.0.2) with ESMTP id 9945939 for amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 21:31:21 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: @pophost.atlas.co.uk (Unverified) Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <1043510318.379.63258.m12@yahoogroups.com> References: <1043510318.379.63258.m12@yahoogroups.com> Date: Sat, 25 Jan 2003 21:21:00 +0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: WOR 710 - do they exist ? Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" From: Paul Rusling X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public If 710 WOR is a premier IBOCC station,may God help the rest of the. Its web site sucks,. Iv ahve just spent over 30 minutes trying to get it to give me some information. it crawls like a 94 site and tells me nothing. These guys do need to get a grip of their PR. Paul Rusling From rwagoner@cox.net Sat Jan 25 14:01:47 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner@cox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Jan 2003 22:01:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 89698 invoked from network); 25 Jan 2003 22:01:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Jan 2003 22:01:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO fed1mtao07.cox.net) (68.6.19.124) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Jan 2003 22:01:46 -0000 Received: from cox.net ([68.4.33.253]) by fed1mtao07.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20030125220142.BZGJ3373.fed1mtao07.cox.net@cox.net> for ; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 17:01:42 -0500 Message-ID: <3E330949.5050507@cox.net> Date: Sat, 25 Jan 2003 14:01:45 -0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20021120 Netscape/7.01 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} A buffalo web site References: <1043510318.379.63258.m12@yahoogroups.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Richard Wagoner X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public The page Kevin posted was renamed to the actual main web age for 1520. Just remove everything after .com. Richard From rwagoner@lausd.k12.ca.us Sat Jan 25 14:04:15 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner@lausd.k12.ca.us X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Jan 2003 22:04:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 74420 invoked from network); 25 Jan 2003 22:04:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Jan 2003 22:04:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO fed1mtao07.cox.net) (68.6.19.124) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Jan 2003 22:04:14 -0000 Received: from lausd.k12.ca.us ([68.4.33.253]) by fed1mtao07.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20030125220410.BZOJ3373.fed1mtao07.cox.net@lausd.k12.ca.us> for ; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 17:04:10 -0500 Message-ID: <3E3309DE.5030706@lausd.k12.ca.us> Date: Sat, 25 Jan 2003 14:04:14 -0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20021120 Netscape/7.01 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Best AM Radio, ever? References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030125125215.02e90ec0@pop.GameBox.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Richard Wagoner X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public Carver TX11b, Denon TU680NAB. The Denon was supposed to be the NAB's "SuperRadio," and it was good. I liked the Carver a little better. They're both expensive and hard to find, though. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Jan 25 14:17:28 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Jan 2003 22:17:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 24792 invoked from network); 25 Jan 2003 22:17:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Jan 2003 22:17:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Jan 2003 22:17:28 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.138] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 25 Jan 2003 22:17:28 -0000 Date: Sat, 25 Jan 2003 22:17:27 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: KB-1520 web site Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 588 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.93.12 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Kevin T posted an odd ball URL for WWKB , or Wkbw, on 1520 > which gets man nowhere. > if anyone has the correct one I would appreciate it. Looks like the new web site for "Buffalo's Klassic" KB-1520 is already up on their main page: http://www.kb1520.com/ I see Joey Reynolds will be back on KB-1520 again... this time as his syndicated overnight talk show, but I still enjoy listening to it, and it will be nice to hear it in full AMAX quality, rather than the clipped and distorted 5 kHz audio that is broadcast from the station that Joey's show originates from -- 710 WOR. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Jan 25 14:29:44 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Jan 2003 22:29:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 88037 invoked from network); 25 Jan 2003 22:29:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Jan 2003 22:29:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Jan 2003 22:29:44 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.182] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 25 Jan 2003 22:29:43 -0000 Date: Sat, 25 Jan 2003 22:29:42 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Best AM Radio, ever? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3E3309DE.5030706@lausd.k12.ca.us> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1436 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.93.12 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Carver TX11b, Denon TU680NAB. > The Denon was supposed to be the NAB's "SuperRadio," and it was > good. I liked the Carver a little better. In the 1990s, Chrysler and GM/Delco also made some excellent AMAX certified AM Stereo radios with Expanded Band tuning and auto- variable bandwidth for both great reception and great sound quality. With a 12-volt power supply and a pair of speakers, they will work very well at home, using only a short whip antenna or even just a random length of wire strung out across the room. I haven't used a real Denon or Carver tuner, but I'd say these radios can match of even exceed the quality of the AMAX home tuners, and also have the more sensitive and selective front end of a car radio design. > They're both expensive and hard to find, though. Carver TX-11a's are actually quite common on eBay; it seems every few weeks there's one up for bid, although the the final bid prices usually are above $200. The updated TX-11b and TX-11c models are more rare, and I only see a Denon TU-680NAB once in a while on eBay, although sometimes you see its AMAX-mono companion, the TU-660. But in terms of the best AM radio *ever*, that title would probably belong to one of the many vacuum-tube (valve)-based classics, anywhere from the grand console radios of the 1930s (back when a radio was a *piece of furniture*!) to the highly refined dual-tuner Heathkits of the '50s and '60s. From rwagoner@cox.net Sat Jan 25 14:44:54 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner@cox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Jan 2003 22:44:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 73387 invoked from network); 25 Jan 2003 22:44:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Jan 2003 22:44:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO fed1mtao02.cox.net) (68.6.19.243) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Jan 2003 22:44:53 -0000 Received: from cox.net ([68.4.33.253]) by fed1mtao02.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20030125224454.COKQ13566.fed1mtao02.cox.net@cox.net> for ; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 17:44:54 -0500 Message-ID: <3E331364.9090705@cox.net> Date: Sat, 25 Jan 2003 14:44:52 -0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20021120 Netscape/7.01 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Best AM Radio, ever? References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Richard Wagoner X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public I never heard of the TX-11c. What changes did it have? I thought Carver went "under" while the TX-11b was still being made. From rwagoner@cox.net Sat Jan 25 14:49:09 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner@cox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Jan 2003 22:49:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 73038 invoked from network); 25 Jan 2003 22:49:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Jan 2003 22:49:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO fed1mtao07.cox.net) (68.6.19.124) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Jan 2003 22:49:08 -0000 Received: from cox.net ([68.4.33.253]) by fed1mtao07.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20030125224904.CGFA3373.fed1mtao07.cox.net@cox.net> for ; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 17:49:04 -0500 Message-ID: <3E331464.80909@cox.net> Date: Sat, 25 Jan 2003 14:49:08 -0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20021120 Netscape/7.01 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Best AM Radio, ever? References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Richard Wagoner X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public By the way, I own the TX-11b and have owned a pre-AMAX (but supposedly would have been certified had AMAX certification been around) Delco AM stereo. The Carver was better. But Kevin is right: for far less money the Delco and Chrysler radios would work great, and the old tube radios (I happen to have Fisher "Professional AM Tuner," a Fisher wideband AM/FM receiver and will soon own a Harman Kardon tube receiver) really have the best sound, period. RIchard From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Jan 25 14:53:14 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Jan 2003 22:53:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 30049 invoked from network); 25 Jan 2003 22:53:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Jan 2003 22:53:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Jan 2003 22:53:13 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.188] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 25 Jan 2003 22:53:13 -0000 Date: Sat, 25 Jan 2003 22:53:12 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Carver TX-11c Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3E331364.9090705@cox.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 300 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.93.12 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > I never heard of the TX-11c. What changes did it have? I thought > Carver went "under" while the TX-11b was still being made. I don't know, but I did hear about it somewhere. Carver also made the PSB-11, which was similar in style and features to the TX-11a/b/c series and did have AM Stereo. From dav259@csiro.au Sat Jan 25 14:56:50 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 25 Jan 2003 22:56:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 50263 invoked from network); 25 Jan 2003 22:56:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Jan 2003 22:56:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Jan 2003 22:56:49 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0PMulP10624 for ; Sun, 26 Jan 2003 09:56:47 +1100 (EST) Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2003 09:56:47 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Subject: Re: {AMSF} A buffalo web site In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public On Sat, 25 Jan 2003, Paul Rusling wrote: > Kevin T posted an odd ball URL for WWKB , or Wkbw, on 1520 > which gets man nowhere. > if anyone has the correct one I would appreciate it. Paul - I sent them an email message 'from Lockport' yesterday and it got through OK. The adddress is: feedback@kb1520.com Still awaiting a reply. More messages requesting AMS needed! Ian From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Sat Jan 25 16:56:18 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Jan 2003 00:56:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 60086 invoked from network); 26 Jan 2003 00:56:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Jan 2003 00:56:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf20bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.80) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Jan 2003 00:56:18 -0000 Received: from juan ([68.153.68.61]) by imf20bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.25 201-253-122-122-125-20020815) with SMTP id <20030126005814.RFGC8096.imf20bis.bellsouth.net@juan> for ; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 19:58:14 -0500 Message-ID: <004301c2c4d5$bd2b12b0$af78fea9@juan> To: References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030125125215.02e90ec0@pop.GameBox.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Best AM Radio, ever? Date: Sat, 25 Jan 2003 19:56:19 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit John, I too owned one of those TM-152 radios. I was so impressed with it, I gave it away. Same with the Radio Shack AM Stereo car radio. The radio was great, but bandwidth was very narrow. Lots of distortion. That is in a landfill somewhere in Iowa. My Delco UX-1 and my Carver tx-11a are my favorite AM Stereo radios. I would have to give a nod to the Carver, it is simply amazing when listening to the Alfredo lite. I have a few airchecks of AM Stereo in full 15k fidelity from the Carver. As far as the features you are looking for, someone on this list is probably better qualified than myself to give you advice. Just my humble opinions on my personal favorites. Juan Gualda ----- Original Message ----- From: John To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, January 25, 2003 12:55 PM Subject: {AMSF} Best AM Radio, ever? Okay Well I got the TM-152, and the thing sounds like crap. Hopefully I can get my $86 back. Mean while, what is the best AM Stereo radio to get? Features I'm looking for are Expanded AM Coverage, AMax certified, Noise blanking, selectable wide/Narrow mode, DX beast, as well as having good sound. And using the latest Motorola C-Quam decoder chip. Love in Christ: John Bensalem, PA [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Jan 25 18:21:11 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Jan 2003 02:21:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 92998 invoked from network); 26 Jan 2003 02:21:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Jan 2003 02:21:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.84) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Jan 2003 02:21:09 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.168] by n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 26 Jan 2003 02:21:09 -0000 Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2003 02:21:09 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Realistic TM-152 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <004301c2c4d5$bd2b12b0$af78fea9@juan> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1162 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.93.12 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > I too owned one of those TM-152 radios. I was so impressed with it, > I gave it away. Same with the Radio Shack AM Stereo car radio. The > radio was great, but bandwidth was very narrow. Lots of distortion. The performance of the TM-152 improves dramatically when retrofitted with one of Chris's MC13028 decoders. This upgrades it to the latest C-Quam decoding for very clean, distortion-free, wide-separation Stereo sound, and its variable IF gain circuit improves sensitivity quite a bit, especially when only using the built-in ferrite bar antenna. And even with the standard ceramic filter in place, with a little equalization it has no trouble providing crisp, clear treble, up to 10 kHz and beyond. For example, here is a short recording of 1210 WPHT's weekend music made from my own Realistic TM-152, after being upgraded with the MC13028 decoder, but with the standard 4.5 kHz ceramic filter still in place: ftp://209.193.86.116/usa/pa/wpht.mp3 Even in original form, I still think the TM-152 is a very good radio, but adding in the modern MC13028 decoder certainly goes a long way towards improving its reception and sound quality. From davidcoons@webtv.net Sat Jan 25 18:32:36 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: davidcoons@webtv.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Jan 2003 02:32:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 75035 invoked from network); 26 Jan 2003 02:32:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Jan 2003 02:32:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO smtpout-2001-3.public.lawson.webtv.net) (209.240.212.83) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Jan 2003 02:32:35 -0000 Received: from storefull-2314.public.lawson.webtv.net (lawson-public-ipmux-1-pip-4.public.lawson.webtv.net [209.240.212.24]) by smtpout-2001-3.public.lawson.webtv.net (WebTV_Postfix+sws) with ESMTP id DD8DEBF9F for ; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 18:32:34 -0800 (PST) Received: (from production@localhost) by storefull-2314.public.lawson.webtv.net (8.8.8-wtv-f/mt.gso.26Feb98) id SAA22595; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 18:32:33 -0800 (PST) X-WebTV-Signature: 1 ETAuAhUAt+woGr+hXO0TYyn7f5tVigzS9g4CFQDNW/RM/3nx1+cOUoHk3ksVgamJ7g== Date: Sat, 25 Jan 2003 21:32:33 -0500 (EST) To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Realistic TM-152 Message-ID: <26329-3E3348C1-5927@storefull-2314.public.lawson.webtv.net> In-Reply-To: "Kevin T. " 's message of Sun, 26 Jan 2003 02:21:09 -0000 Content-Disposition: Inline Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) X-eGroups-From: davidcoons@webtv.net (David Coons) From: davidcoons@webtv.net X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10533228 using an eq,boost the 60hz bass 12db and the 8khz treble the same and it sounds great.if the station is well engineered distortion is negligable From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Jan 25 18:33:37 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Jan 2003 02:33:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 56055 invoked from network); 26 Jan 2003 02:33:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Jan 2003 02:33:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.67) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Jan 2003 02:33:37 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.174] by n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 26 Jan 2003 02:33:37 -0000 Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2003 02:33:35 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Nighttime DX report: 790 CIGM, etc. Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1431 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.93.12 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics For the first time in a long while, here in NJ tonight, 790 CIGM from Sudbury, Ontario is coming in loud and clear and in full Stereo, with a proper C-Quam pilot tone! And just as they did years ago when I first discovered them, they still sound excellent in Stereo with their country music format. So if you're in the northeast USA tonight, tune in 790 kHz and see if you can catch CIGM. I also briefly caught DX from 920 CJCH tonight, just long enough to verify that they are indeed broadcasting an Oldies music format in Stereo. I can hear fellow Halifax station 960 CHNS more often, but of course they have been Stereo-less for the past few years. I also got a Stereo indication from 900 CHML, but it was probably just "falsing". I also caught 1560 WQEW changing to their nighttime signal pattern at 8:00 PM EST, which seems strange since local sunset is at 5:00 PM, until you remember that WQEW has an agreement with their co-channel station in Bakersfield, CA that they can use daytime pattern until sunset in Bakersfield. They're also always off the air for a second or two during the change, unlike most stations which can make the switch almost instantaneously. During their "American Popular Standards" days, they'd always time it be exactly at the end of a song, and then immediately follow it with their music sweeper that started out with the song "Night and Day" -- quite appropriate. :-) From am740@rogers.com Sat Jan 25 19:05:16 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: am740@rogers.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Jan 2003 03:05:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 37828 invoked from network); 26 Jan 2003 03:05:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Jan 2003 03:05:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO fep03-mail.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com) (66.185.86.73) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Jan 2003 03:05:13 -0000 Received: from cr910465a ([24.100.130.139]) by fep03-mail.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com (InterMail vM.5.01.05.06 201-253-122-126-106-20020509) with ESMTP id <20030126030512.HXFL121195.fep03-mail.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com@cr910465a> for ; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 22:05:12 -0500 Message-ID: <008401c2c4e7$be318100$8b826418@ajax.phub.net.cable.rogers.com> To: Subject: CHWO DX Test - February 2, 2003 Date: Sat, 25 Jan 2003 22:05:12 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH LOGIN at fep03-mail.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com from [24.100.130.139] using ID at Sat, 25 Jan 2003 22:05:12 -0500 From: "Brian Smith" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=114197710 X-Yahoo-Profile: brian_smith_odxa Information on the upcoming CHWO - AM 740 DX Test Test Date: Sunday Morning, February 2, 2003 Test Time: 1230 AM to 0130 AM (EST) [0530 to 0630 UTC Sunday] --------------------------------------------------------------------- How Test Will Run: (all times are EST and approximates) --------------------------------------------------------------------- Time: 12:29 AM EST - Announcement of DX test. Time: 12:30 AM EST - CHWO voice and code identifiers. Music for 15 minutes beginning with these two songs: Beer Barrel Polka - Andrew Sisters Ricochet Romance - Teresa Brewer Time: 12:45 AM EST - CHWO voice and code identifiers. Music for 15 minutes beginning with these two songs: St. Louis Blues March - Glenn Miller Spin, Spin - Gordon Lightfoot Time: 01:00 AM EST - CHWO voice and code identifiers. Music for 15 minutes beginning with these two songs: The Battle of New Orleans - Johnny Horton Something To Sing About - The Travellers Time: 01:15 AM EST - CHWO voice and code identifiers. Music for 15 minutes beginning with these two songs: Colonel Bogey March - Mitch Miller California Here I Come - Al Jolson Time: 01:30 AM EST - Announcement of thank you for listening to the DX test. ---------------------------- You can mail or email me all reports and they will be forwarded to the station engineer. Brian Smith am740@rogers.com Box 161, Willowdale Stn A Toronto, Ontario Canada M2N 5S8 Reception Report Manager for CHWO AM 740 http://www.odxa.on.ca/chwo.html From watan-ko@h4.dion.ne.jp Sat Jan 25 19:10:40 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: watan-ko@h4.dion.ne.jp X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Jan 2003 03:10:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 39836 invoked from network); 26 Jan 2003 03:10:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Jan 2003 03:10:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Jan 2003 03:10:40 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.133] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 26 Jan 2003 03:10:40 -0000 Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2003 03:10:37 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: 1959 AM Stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 765 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "irukero " X-Originating-IP: 218.222.108.112 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=67253313 X-Yahoo-Profile: irukero Dear Kevin, > So, from this schematic you could build > yourself a vacuum tube AM Stereo receiver, and have it deliver true > Stereo sound from today's C-Quam stations! (There is no mention of a > pilot tone, so it essentially would be a "forced Stereo" receiver, > just like the Sony SRF-series.) > Yes, I also try to make C-QUAM stereo tuner with tubes, so I'm now collecting old papers of AM stereo published in late '50s and early '60s. I had also thought the RCA model can decode the C-QUAM signal, but I think its FM detector decodes the (L-R)/(1+L+R) , not L-R. So, like Natinal semiconductor's LM1981, we must multiply 1+L+R with the signal. However, I don't find any way to do so with tubes now. Sincerely, Koji Watanabe Shiga, JAPAN From possumhunter@netzero.net Sat Jan 25 19:11:06 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: possumhunter@netzero.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Jan 2003 03:11:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 97155 invoked from network); 26 Jan 2003 03:11:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Jan 2003 03:11:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rly-ip02.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.160) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Jan 2003 03:11:06 -0000 Received: from logs-mtc-tf.proxy.aol.com (logs-mtc-tf.proxy.aol.com [64.12.103.5]) by rly-ip02.mx.aol.com (v83.35) with ESMTP id RELAYIN1-0125221028; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 22:10:28 -0500 Received: from ibm (ACA13DA5.ipt.aol.com [172.161.61.165]) by logs-mtc-tf.proxy.aol.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with SMTP id h0Q320rw005351 for ; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 22:02:19 -0500 Message-ID: <00f201c2c4e7$55f4ef00$b486dd43@aoldsl.net> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Nighttime DX report: 790 CIGM, etc. Date: Sat, 25 Jan 2003 22:01:42 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Apparently-From: DodgeRamTrucker@aol.com From: "Possum Hunter" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 kevtronics@yahoo.com wrote: > For the first time in a long while, here in NJ tonight, 790 CIGM from Sudbury, Ontario is coming in loud and clear and in full Stereo, The Ionospere is hot tonight! I have them too in South Carolina. I am also getting a great signal from 1520 WWKB, a rare catch here. Kevin From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Sat Jan 25 19:31:16 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Jan 2003 03:31:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 86263 invoked from network); 26 Jan 2003 03:31:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Jan 2003 03:31:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf07bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.147) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Jan 2003 03:31:15 -0000 Received: from juan ([68.153.68.61]) by imf07bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.25 201-253-122-122-125-20020815) with SMTP id <20030126033311.BZKI24823.imf07bis.bellsouth.net@juan> for ; Sat, 25 Jan 2003 22:33:11 -0500 Message-ID: <000e01c2c4eb$62ab0910$af78fea9@juan> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Realistic TM-152 Date: Sat, 25 Jan 2003 22:31:16 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I should add, that I realize that the "mods" would make it a better radio, but at the time, and I still feel this way, that a wide bandwidth mono radio is better than a narrow band AM Stereo radio. Give me fidelity, or give me......well give me anything but death.... I might add...I should have kept the darn thing...if at least to put it on e-bay...same with that crappy Realistic AM Stereo car radio... It just made me cringe.....after hearing Hi-FI AM, These radios brought shame to the AM Stereo struggle. I can imagine "joe six pack" hearing these, would he tell his friends how good AM Stereo sounded.......I doubt it. I remember listening to the overnight show on WNWS-790 and the host Jerry Witchner (sp) , when asked by a listener, what he thought of AM Stereo..."just static from 2 speakers, instead of one"...as far as SOME of the AM Stereo products available at the time....he was right. First impressions are important. If I was to hear AM Stereo for the first time on the Realistic TN-152, I would give it a thumbs down. When demonstrating AM Stereo to friends, the most comments were ...."I didn't realize that AM sounded that good" This was on the SRF-42.......and unless you held it behind your head....you could NOT tell it was Stereo...but the wide bandwidth....ahhhh, sounded good (or if you listened on headphones). The SRF-42 was worthless for listening in Stereo unless you have headphones. So the future of MW is IBOC, narrow bandwidth, unless you pay to buy a radio, to listen to your favorite talk shows in a "semi" High Fidelity sound. I am discouraged. Juan Gualda Message ----- From: Kevin T. To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, January 25, 2003 9:21 PM Subject: {AMSF} Re: Realistic TM-152 > I too owned one of those TM-152 radios. I was so impressed with it, > I gave it away. Same with the Radio Shack AM Stereo car radio. The > radio was great, but bandwidth was very narrow. Lots of distortion. The performance of the TM-152 improves dramatically when retrofitted with one of Chris's MC13028 decoders. This upgrades it to the latest C-Quam decoding for very clean, distortion-free, wide-separation Stereo sound, and its variable IF gain circuit improves sensitivity quite a bit, especially when only using the built-in ferrite bar antenna. And even with the standard ceramic filter in place, with a little equalization it has no trouble providing crisp, clear treble, up to 10 kHz and beyond. For example, here is a short recording of 1210 WPHT's weekend music made from my own Realistic TM-152, after being upgraded with the MC13028 decoder, but with the standard 4.5 kHz ceramic filter still in place: ftp://209.193.86.116/usa/pa/wpht.mp3 Even in original form, I still think the TM-152 is a very good radio, but adding in the modern MC13028 decoder certainly goes a long way towards improving its reception and sound quality. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From amymousie@yahoo.com Sat Jan 25 19:42:28 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Jan 2003 03:42:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 36237 invoked from network); 26 Jan 2003 03:42:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Jan 2003 03:42:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Jan 2003 03:42:27 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.133] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 26 Jan 2003 03:42:27 -0000 Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2003 03:42:26 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: 1959 AM Stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2117 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 64.175.244.188 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "irukero " wrote: > Dear Kevin, > > > So, from this schematic you could build > > yourself a vacuum tube AM Stereo receiver, and have it deliver true > > Stereo sound from today's C-Quam stations! (There is no mention of > a > > pilot tone, so it essentially would be a "forced Stereo" receiver, > > just like the Sony SRF-series.) > > > > Yes, I also try to make C-QUAM stereo tuner with tubes, so I'm now > collecting old papers of AM stereo published in late '50s and > early '60s. A good start is the Sept. 1960 "RCA Review" paper titled, "A Compatible Stereophonic System for the AM Broadcast Band", by various researchers at the RCA Laboratories, Princeton, NJ, pp. 299-359. This is actually an overview of experiments in four AM stereo systems-- ISB, QuAM, AM/FM, and AM-FM/AM, all as tested on 660 WNBC in 1959- 1960. > I had also thought the RCA model can decode the C-QUAM signal, but I > think its FM detector decodes the (L-R)/(1+L+R) , not L-R. So, like > Natinal semiconductor's LM1981, we must multiply 1+L+R with the > signal. However, I don't find any way to do so with tubes now. The RCA system (later offered by Belar with some modifications) was a simple AM/FM matrx system-- the (L-R) signal was transmitted on the FM component of a frequency-modulated AM carrier. (The (L+R) was modulated on the AM envelope. The nominal deviation in the RCA FM signal was 1.2kHz (Belar modified this to 320Hz). The modified RCA Model XF-2 was one of three different models built to test the AM stereo systems under typical receiver conditions. I(t was actually designed to work with all four systems mentioned above. There were seven of these modified XF-2s in use for testing the systems under local and DX conditions. The other two models were actually the same, but with different circuitry, and were tuners. 8 of which had audio to 10kHz, with 10kHz notch filters. The other 3 had double-diode limiters. The performance of the XF-2? 4.6kHz bandwidth with 20dB stereo separation.. Amy. <:3~~~ From jbyrns@enteract.com Sat Jan 25 21:16:54 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Jan 2003 05:16:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 14544 invoked from network); 26 Jan 2003 05:16:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Jan 2003 05:16:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Jan 2003 05:16:51 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.157] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 26 Jan 2003 05:16:51 -0000 Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2003 05:16:49 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: 1959 AM Stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1804 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.98.216 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "irukero " < watan-ko@h...> wrote: > Dear Kevin, > > Yes, I also try to make C-QUAM stereo tuner with tubes, so I'm now > collecting old papers of AM stereo published in late '50s and > early '60s. > > I had also thought the RCA model can decode the C-QUAM signal, but I > think its FM detector decodes the (L-R)/(1+L+R) , not L-R. So, like > Natinal semiconductor's LM1981, we must multiply 1+L+R with the > signal. However, I don't find any way to do so with tubes now. Hi Koji, Multiplying by "1+L+R" may not be as difficult as you think. In the RCA schematic, take a look at the "tracking" circuit using the 2N398 transistor to control the plate/screen voltage of the limiter tube. If another way were found to do the tracking function, then the transistor could be feed with "1+L+R" to do the needed multiplication. Another transistor or two would probably be needed as a level shifter for the "1+L+R" signal. With some clever circuit design, the transistors could probably be replaced by tubes, to make it an all tube radio. If the limiter plate/screen voltage control is used to do the "1+L+R" multiplication, then another way must be found to do the tracking. I thought I had a couple of easy ways to do this, but they both depend on running the "limiter" tube in the linear mode, which probably means it would no longer serve as a good multiplier. I guess that means that the "tracking" problem would have to be solved by designing a very tight amplified AGC system. Although I think I have heard it said that tight amplified AGC systems give an undesirable tuning characteristic. At any rate it seems doable with a little thought, even using only tubes, no transistors, unlike the RCA circuit. John From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sat Jan 25 22:08:53 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Jan 2003 06:08:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 48100 invoked from network); 26 Jan 2003 06:08:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Jan 2003 06:08:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Jan 2003 06:08:52 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.144] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 26 Jan 2003 06:08:52 -0000 Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2003 06:08:51 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: Realistic TM-152 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <000e01c2c4eb$62ab0910$af78fea9@juan> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 2939 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.13 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Juan / John Gualda" wrote: > I should add, that I realize that the "mods" would make it a better radio, but at the time, and I still feel this way, that a wide bandwidth mono radio is better than a narrow band AM Stereo radio. Give me fidelity, or give me......well give me anything but death.... >=20 > I might add...I should have kept the darn thing...if at least to put it on e-bay...same with that crappy Realistic AM Stereo car radio... >=20 > It just made me cringe.....after hearing Hi-FI AM, These radios brought shame to the AM Stereo struggle. I can imagine "joe six pack" hearing these, would he tell his friends how good AM Stereo sounded.......I doubt it. >=20 >=20 > I remember listening to the overnight show on WNWS-790 and the host Jerry Witchner (sp) , when asked by a listener, what he thought of AM Stereo..."just static from 2 speakers, instead of one"...as far as SOME of the AM Stereo products available at the time....he was right. >=20 > First impressions are important. If I was to hear AM Stereo for the first time on the Realistic TM-152, I would give it a thumbs down. >=20 > When demonstrating AM Stereo to friends, the most comments were ...."I didn't realize that AM sounded that good" >=20 > This was on the SRF-42.......and unless you held it behind your head....you could NOT tell it was Stereo...but the wide bandwidth....ahhhh, sounded good (or if you listened on headphones). The SRF-42 was worthless for listening in Stereo unless you have headphones. >=20 > So the future of MW is IBOC, narrow bandwidth, unless you pay to buy a radio, to listen to your favorite talk shows in a "semi" High Fidelity sound. >=20 > I am discouraged. >=20 >=20 > Juan Gualda >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 This was my first impression of the TM-152 also. I don't understand why they put a =B14.5KHz filter in it in the first place and the LO has little more phase noise than is to be desired which I think it makes the top end sound a bit muddy even after replacing the ceramic filter with a =B17.5KHz one. If one was to do it right a complete redesign of the radio would be in order all the way from the front end to the decoder. The minimum I think that this radio should of came with is a wider IF filter and 10KHz notch filters and that would have been a great improvement. I used mine for experimental purposes and have it sounding pretty good. If they had used 455KHz for the IF instead of 450KHz then a wider ceramic filter can be scavenged from a 50MHz cordless phone but the ceramic resonator on the MC13020 is for a 450KHz IF and the datasheet for the chip shows that it can't be pulled more than =B13KHz from 450KHz so that rules out a 455KHz ceramic filter. I guess you could replace the PLL Osc on the chip with a tuneable LC PLL. Might as well redisign the whole circuit board. If you want to see my mods to my TM-152 look here. http://www.hal-pc.org/~jsgil/AM-Stereo/mods.html JSG From rwagoner@cox.net Sat Jan 25 22:18:21 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner@cox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Jan 2003 06:18:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 77289 invoked from network); 26 Jan 2003 06:18:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Jan 2003 06:18:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO fed1mtao01.cox.net) (68.6.19.244) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Jan 2003 06:18:21 -0000 Received: from cox.net ([68.4.33.253]) by fed1mtao01.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20030126061819.EWRC20584.fed1mtao01.cox.net@cox.net> for ; Sun, 26 Jan 2003 01:18:19 -0500 Message-ID: <3E337DAD.1000006@cox.net> Date: Sat, 25 Jan 2003 22:18:21 -0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20021120 Netscape/7.01 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Realistic TM-152 References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Richard Wagoner X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public > The performance of the TM-152 improves dramatically when retrofitted > with one of Chris's MC13028 decoders. This upgrades it to the latest > C-Quam decoding for very clean, distortion-free, wide-separation > Stereo sound, and its variable IF gain circuit improves sensitivity > quite a bit, especially when only using the built-in ferrite bar > antenna. And even with the standard ceramic filter in place, with a > little equalization it has no trouble providing crisp, clear treble, > up to 10 kHz and beyond. The separation is impressive, but I don't hear the clean highs. It sounds like slightly lower quality than the Carver at narrow bandwidth, and with a fewer lows. That could be in part to the mp3 encoding, however. Richard From rwagoner@cox.net Sat Jan 25 22:32:16 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner@cox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Jan 2003 06:32:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 70158 invoked from network); 26 Jan 2003 06:32:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Jan 2003 06:32:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO fed1mtao08.cox.net) (68.6.19.123) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Jan 2003 06:32:15 -0000 Received: from cox.net ([68.4.33.253]) by fed1mtao08.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20030126063210.EWCG1215.fed1mtao08.cox.net@cox.net> for ; Sun, 26 Jan 2003 01:32:10 -0500 Message-ID: <3E3380F0.409@cox.net> Date: Sat, 25 Jan 2003 22:32:16 -0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20021120 Netscape/7.01 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Marantz 2215B References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Richard Wagoner X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public Has anyone ever added a stereo decoder to a Marantz 2215B? Is there a way to expand the bandwidth a bit (or a lot)? Richard From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sat Jan 25 22:47:05 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Jan 2003 06:47:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 82660 invoked from network); 26 Jan 2003 06:47:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Jan 2003 06:47:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.90) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Jan 2003 06:47:03 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.169] by n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 26 Jan 2003 06:47:02 -0000 Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2003 06:47:00 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Marantz 2215B Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3E3380F0.409@cox.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 450 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.13 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, Richard Wagoner wrote: > Has anyone ever added a stereo decoder to a Marantz 2215B? Is there a > way to expand the bandwidth a bit (or a lot)? > > Richard Chris Cuff has a trick to widen the bandwidth for a ceramic filter by adding a small capacitor 20pf? or so from the input to the output of the filter. I don't remember exactly what size he uses as I think it varies between filters. JSG From amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sun Jan 26 00:20:35 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 49656 invoked from network); 26 Jan 2003 08:20:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Jan 2003 08:20:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Jan 2003 08:20:35 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: notify@yahoogroups.com Received: from [66.218.67.182] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 26 Jan 2003 08:20:35 -0000 Date: 26 Jan 2003 08:20:34 -0000 Message-ID: <1043569234.999588.95786.w59@yahoogroups.com> X-eGroups-Application: files X-Yahoo-Group-Post: system From: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: New file uploaded to amstereoforum MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello, This email message is a notification to let you know that a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the amstereoforum group. File : /wwrl-152.mp3 Uploaded by : kevtronics Description : A recording of 1600 WWRL, as received on a Realistic TM-152 tuner upgraded with an MC13028 decoder. Even with the standard 4.5 kHz ceramic filter in place, the received audio response is greater than 12 kHz; WWRL was not using NRSC 10 kHz audio filtering at this time, and their Modulation Sciences "StereoMaxx" provided excellent stereo separation. You can access this file at the URL http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum/files/wwrl-152.mp3 To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/files Regards, kevtronics From ccuff@in4web.com Sun Jan 26 00:56:38 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Jan 2003 08:56:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 58377 invoked from network); 26 Jan 2003 08:56:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Jan 2003 08:56:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Jan 2003 08:56:37 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.44]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Sun, 26 Jan 2003 03:52:37 -0500 Message-ID: <003d01c2c517$9431b340$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Marantz 2215B Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2003 03:47:37 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 Actually, as little as 5pf will work- each radio is different. Here where I live (out in the sticks, with no stations anywhere nearby) I frequently run a decoder right off the mixer, with barn door bandwidth. CC ----- Original Message ----- From: From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Jan 26 01:56:27 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Jan 2003 09:56:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 25756 invoked from network); 26 Jan 2003 09:56:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Jan 2003 09:56:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.68) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Jan 2003 09:56:27 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.187] by n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 26 Jan 2003 09:56:27 -0000 Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2003 09:56:27 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Marantz 2215B Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 782 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.87.7 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Chris Cuff has a trick to widen the bandwidth for a ceramic filter > by adding a small capacitor 20pf? or so from the input to the > output of the filter. That's if the radio *has* a ceramic filter. I have a Bogen receiver from the early '70s that doesn't even use any ICs (it's all discrete transistors), let alone ceramic filters, but it has a very narrow bandwidth AM tuner. Adding an AM Stereo decoder doesn't help, so I think it just has a lot of IF coils tuned for maximum selectivity at the expense of treble response. I also notice that it is also a "forced" FM Stereo tuner -- even when no station is tuned in, the hiss is heard in stereo, which is strange because I thought FM Stereo required the pilot tone to "lock onto" in order to receive Stereo audio? From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sun Jan 26 04:58:59 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Jan 2003 12:58:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 58259 invoked from network); 26 Jan 2003 12:58:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Jan 2003 12:58:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Jan 2003 12:58:56 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.139] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 26 Jan 2003 12:58:56 -0000 Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2003 12:58:55 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: MC 13028 Decoder Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 271 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.41 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst Here is a first attempt at using the MC13028 Chip. It uses a wide ceramic filter, notch filters, NRSC De-Emphasis, and additional eq hopefully providing a fairly flat response out to 9.5KHz http://www.hal-pc.org/~jsgil/AM-Stereo/MC13028-Decoder-ComponentSide.jpg JSG From jbyrns@enteract.com Sun Jan 26 07:36:29 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Jan 2003 15:36:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 49985 invoked from network); 26 Jan 2003 15:36:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Jan 2003 15:36:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.68) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Jan 2003 15:36:28 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.179] by n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 26 Jan 2003 15:36:28 -0000 Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2003 15:36:27 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Marantz 2215B Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 866 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.239 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " < kevtronics@y...> wrote: > I also notice that it is also a "forced" FM Stereo tuner -- even when > no station is tuned in, the hiss is heard in stereo, which is strange > because I thought FM Stereo required the pilot tone to "lock onto" in > order to receive Stereo audio? Isn't that what you mean by "forced FM Stereo", that everything, including mono stations, and interstation hiss, in addition to the stereo stations, is decoded as "stereo"? Sure the pilot tone is required to "lock" the local 38 kHz osc. to the 38 kHz osc. at the transmitter, but if it isn't a stereo transmission, then whatever frequency the local 38 kHz osc. free runs at is fine for decoding the noise or mono audio, as long as the audio outputs are also switched to the outputs of the stereo decoder. John From evergreenterrace@buzzle.com Sun Jan 26 10:30:02 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: evergreenterrace@buzzle.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Jan 2003 18:30:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 8654 invoked from network); 26 Jan 2003 18:28:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Jan 2003 18:28:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.64) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Jan 2003 18:28:21 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.252] by n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 26 Jan 2003 18:28:21 -0000 Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2003 18:28:21 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: WOR IBOC Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 128 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgliradio " X-Originating-IP: 129.44.33.132 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=69711087 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgliradio I would encourage anyone who has any dobuts to visit with Mr. Ray at the WOR facility. They have NOTHING to hide, trust me. From JH_Radio@GameBox.net Sun Jan 26 10:39:39 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: JH_Radio@GameBox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Jan 2003 18:39:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 68194 invoked from network); 26 Jan 2003 18:39:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Jan 2003 18:39:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO babyruth.hotpop.com) (204.57.55.14) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Jan 2003 18:39:38 -0000 Received: from gamebox.net (kubrick.hotpop.com [204.57.55.16]) by babyruth.hotpop.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 9728E211C16; Sun, 26 Jan 2003 18:39:10 +0000 (UTC) Received: from -enduser.GameBox.net (pcp03184855pcs.benslm01.pa.comcast.net [68.80.77.117]) by smtp-1.hotpop.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A0CCD2F814C; Sun, 26 Jan 2003 18:39:05 +0000 (UTC) Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030126133749.02e4a390@pop.GameBox.net> X-Sender: JH_Radio@pop.GameBox.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2003 13:43:17 -0500 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Realistics TM-152 (AM Stereo Only) tuner for sail Cc: Blindtech@yahoogroups.com, pc-audio@yahoogroups.com, Becky Knaub , aaron bradley , whiteunicorn@the-cia.net, FmTuners@yahoogroups.com, LatinBeauty419@aol.com Mime-Version: 1.0 X-HotPOP: ----------------------------------------------- Sent By HotPOP.com FREE Email Get your FREE POP email at www.HotPOP.com ----------------------------------------------- From: John X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113800107 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Well, I am lucky that I will be able to get a refund on the TM-152. He'll refund me $82. That is minus the shipping and EBay fees he paid for it. Does anyone want it for $86 not including shipping? This is how much I paid for the unit. And if anyone wants it, I will be willing to send it to you. Please let me know by Tuesday, January 28. Money orders or cashiers check. Please contact me privately, so I can give you my address to send the check or money order to.Once the check clears, or I receive the money order, I will ship the tuner to you. Includes users manual. everything works. Includes RCA output for connection to a sound system, and internal antenna. Has screws for connecting a outdoor antenna. For your confirmation, the item I won, and will be shipping to the first come, first serve interested party is at: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1950771718&ed=1042333799&ssPageName=ADME:B:EOT:US:3 If I here nothing by Tuesday, January 28, 2003, I will ship the tuner back to the person I won it from for a refund of $82. I'll only except people in the USA. Love in Christ: John Bensalem, PA Send me an email Aim: RainAngelsRule MSN: RainAngelsRule@hotmail.com My website Welcome to Napster4TheBlind "Prayer does not change God; it changes you." - Authur unknown [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From JH_Radio@GameBox.net Sun Jan 26 11:24:52 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: JH_Radio@GameBox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Jan 2003 19:24:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 2971 invoked from network); 26 Jan 2003 19:24:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Jan 2003 19:24:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO babyruth.hotpop.com) (204.57.55.14) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Jan 2003 19:24:52 -0000 Received: from gamebox.net (kubrick.hotpop.com [204.57.55.16]) by babyruth.hotpop.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 542D0210C8D for ; Sun, 26 Jan 2003 19:24:30 +0000 (UTC) Received: from -enduser.GameBox.net (pcp03184855pcs.benslm01.pa.comcast.net [68.80.77.117]) by smtp-1.hotpop.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EC5DF2F8114 for ; Sun, 26 Jan 2003 19:24:19 +0000 (UTC) Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030126141508.02eb12d0@pop.GameBox.net> X-Sender: JH_Radio@pop.GameBox.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2003 14:27:17 -0500 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Narrowing radio's down and some questions: (Carver TX-11 C, Sony SRF-42, Denon TU680NAB, Crisler/Delco Car radio, and Sony IBF-2010) Mime-Version: 1.0 X-HotPOP: ----------------------------------------------- Sent By HotPOP.com FREE Email Get your FREE POP email at www.HotPOP.com ----------------------------------------------- From: John X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113800107 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi. So far from what I'm hearing I have a choice betwene the Carver TX-11 C, Sony SRF-42, Denon TU680NAB, and Crisler/Delco Car radio. Witch moddle number is the crisler/Delco? I have seen some reports of the Sony IBF-2010 used for DXing. Is this radio an AM Stereo tuner? Now some questions for all the radio's mentioned above. How oftin do these radio's apear on Ebay? And what are the maxum prices that have been paied? What are these radio's worse? Do any of them come with intuernal antanna's? IF not, can they be fitted with outdore antenna's? Do these radio's have some way to connect them to a sound system via lineout either by RCA or Eighth inch mini plug? Also, is there a place ware I can here each of the radio's mentiond above in an uncompressed *.wav file? I do not want to make the mistake of perchaseing another radio only to have to either cell it, or send it back to the person I won it from. How do each of these radio's do for DX without modifacations? Thank you for any help you can provide. Love in Christ: John Bensalem, PA Send me an email Aim: RainAngelsRule MSN: RainAngelsRule@hotmail.com My website Welcome to Napster4TheBlind "Prayer does not change God; it changes you." - Authur unknown [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From n0uiheric@aol.com Sun Jan 26 11:27:30 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Jan 2003 19:27:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 71491 invoked from network); 26 Jan 2003 19:27:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Jan 2003 19:27:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r05.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.101) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Jan 2003 19:27:29 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-r05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.140.8bfb049 (30970) for ; Sun, 26 Jan 2003 14:27:21 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <140.8bfb049.2b659099@aol.com> Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2003 14:27:21 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} It's official... To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih I am one who has heard IBOCrap, and it is INCOMPATIBLE WITH MOST RADIOS. There are 500 million analog radios in the United States alone; EVERY SINGLE ONE WILL HAVE TO BE REPLACED if IBOCrap ever comes to pass. IBOCrap will make AM radio much worse. C-QUAM is more technologically advanced than IBOCrap; while IBOCrap is not capable of CD-like seperation, C-QUAM is. I think the opportunity here is to improve C-QUAM with the use of DSP technology, which will be the ONLY TRUE digital audio, not this FAKE digital audio that IBOCrap has been proven to do. IBOCrap should be abandoned for both AM and FM. Those who support IBOCrap should give up. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From jeffdeck@aol.com Sun Jan 26 11:38:03 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: Jeffdeck@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Jan 2003 19:38:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 80576 invoked from network); 26 Jan 2003 19:38:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Jan 2003 19:38:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r02.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.98) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Jan 2003 19:38:03 -0000 Received: from Jeffdeck@aol.com by imo-r02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.1ee.3ea892 (3924); Sun, 26 Jan 2003 14:37:58 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1ee.3ea892.2b659316@aol.com> Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2003 14:37:58 EST Subject: Re: MC 13028 Decoder To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Cc: amstereo@bellsouth.net MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 8.0 for Windows US sub 234 From: jeffdeck@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=4430287 X-Yahoo-Profile: jeffdeck2001 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit All, Before anyone gets too creative with their MC13028 chip, a few caveats are in order (based upon my extensive experiments with this chip): You must put 0.001uFd capacitors in parallel with pins 15 and 16 to electrical ground to remove the I.F from the recovered audio. Otherwise, this I.F can cause amplifiers downstream to oscillate. You cannot drift too far from 450kHz I.F -- the MC13028 uses divide-by components to detect the 25Hz pilot tone. For instance, 1/8 for the I.F PLL, and then 1/18K for the pilot tone PLL detector. This is an "all digital" implementation with over 600 transistors on the substrate. Also, the newer MC13028AP and MC13028AD chips have an internal 43pFd capacitor across the ceramic resonator input. MC13028 use full wave envelope detector to recover L+R. Synchronous detectors are used for the I and Q components, as well as to 'listen' for the 25Hz pilot tone. You can simply place your finger on the I.F input pin, and receive your favorite local AM and/or shortwave station. However, it will not be received in stereo. Do not use any capacitor, other than aluminum electrolytic, on pin 9. You must use tantalum capacitor (low ESR type) on pin 14. You can safely ground pin 8 to force monaural operation. You can place 1Mohm resistor across ceramic resonator to force stereo. Hal: In your picture, is this the chip that you purchased from me? Also, which components did you use for the 8x455kHz L/C oscillator? In a message dated 1/26/2003 8:00:27 AM Eastern Standard Time, Hal writes: >Here is a first attempt at using the MC13028 Chip. >It uses a wide ceramic filter, notch filters, NRSC >De-Emphasis, and additional eq hopefully providing >a fairly flat response out to 9.5KHz [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From stodd@sherbtel.net Sun Jan 26 12:06:37 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Jan 2003 20:06:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 26491 invoked from network); 26 Jan 2003 20:06:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Jan 2003 20:06:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Jan 2003 20:06:36 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-123.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.123]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h0QK6XhF012542 for ; Sun, 26 Jan 2003 14:06:34 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <002201c2c576$a5162560$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Marantz 2215B Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2003 14:08:05 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude In that case you'd need some sort of sweep generator and oscilloscope, and stagger-tune the IFs for better bandwidth, not unlike how video IFs are done in TV sets. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: > I think it just has a lot of IF coils tuned for maximum selectivity at > the expense of treble response. From rwagoner1@mac.com Sun Jan 26 12:18:19 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner1@mac.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Jan 2003 20:18:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 46184 invoked from network); 26 Jan 2003 20:18:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Jan 2003 20:18:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO fed1mtao07.cox.net) (68.6.19.124) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Jan 2003 20:18:18 -0000 Received: from mac.com ([68.4.33.253]) by fed1mtao07.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20030126201812.HZDN3373.fed1mtao07.cox.net@mac.com> for ; Sun, 26 Jan 2003 15:18:12 -0500 Message-ID: <3E34428B.5020501@mac.com> Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2003 12:18:19 -0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20021120 Netscape/7.01 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Narrowing radio's down and some questions: (Carver TX-11 C, Sony SRF-42, Denon TU680NAB, Crisler/Delco Car radio, and Sony IBF-2010) References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030126141508.02eb12d0@pop.GameBox.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Richard Wagoner X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135738921 X-Yahoo-Profile: richardalanwagoner Don't rule out the TX-11b. It is probably easier to find, and it is good. From stodd@sherbtel.net Sun Jan 26 12:42:06 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Jan 2003 20:42:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 56082 invoked from network); 26 Jan 2003 20:42:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Jan 2003 20:42:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Jan 2003 20:42:05 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-123.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.123]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h0QKg2hF020360 for ; Sun, 26 Jan 2003 14:42:03 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <005e01c2c57b$9a040840$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030126141508.02eb12d0@pop.GameBox.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Narrowing radio's down and some questions: (Carver TX-11 C, Sony SRF-42, Denon TU680NAB, Crisler/Delco Car radio, and Sony IBF-2010) Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2003 14:43:34 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude No to the Sony question. Don't overlook Carver's TX-11a and 11b, or if you want an easy AMS conversion, their TX-2. The car radios come in such a dizzying array of model numbers it's hard to pin anything down, but anything from 1993 on with a five band graphic equalizer will have both EB and AMS. Check your local salvage yard. You can get connectors with wires to hook them up from several sources including Best Buy and Audio King. Look for a dealer that sells the Turbowire brand. Scott Todd PS I'll bet your word searches come up with some interesting results. :) ----- Original Message ----- From: "John" > > Hi. > So far from what I'm hearing I have a choice betwene the Carver TX-11 C, Sony SRF-42, Denon TU680NAB, and Crisler/Delco Car radio. > Witch moddle number is the crisler/Delco? > I have seen some reports of the Sony IBF-2010 used for DXing. > Is this radio an AM Stereo tuner? From groucho@skyweb.net Sun Jan 26 13:40:52 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Jan 2003 21:40:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 79661 invoked from network); 26 Jan 2003 21:40:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Jan 2003 21:40:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Jan 2003 21:40:50 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (max1-220.skyweb.net [66.6.130.92]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h0QLmrKN029466 for ; Sun, 26 Jan 2003 16:48:53 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3E34543D.E0295B43@skyweb.net> Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2003 16:33:49 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} It's official... References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Just a simple question... But If AM Goes 100% digital.. will any of our Grand kids Be able to Build a simple Crystal radio and understand the Digital hash??? My 9 year old just Built His First crystal radio.. a few weeks ago. and is having a blast with It.. Funny thing the First station he tuned in was WOR.... "Listen daddy what I hear with My New radio I built" the disappointing thing of the Future is that in the Days of Digital.. that wont happen.."daddy all I hear is Static hiss its not working" so much for progress.. again thanks for the open tour Tom.. looking forward to the next one. Neal "wortomray " wrote: > Ian: > > You may feel free to contact me at tomray@wor710.com with any > questions you may have. > > To briefly answer you....I am extremely proud of my "whiz-bang" > technology. The majority of AM stations are hurting financially. > Granted, programming is part of the equation, but AM audio quality is > the pits and younger listeners have no clue what AM is. To bring > back the listeners, part of the equation is the audio quality. > > On a final note, some day my grandkids will open a book and see my > name listed along with Marconi's as an industry pioneer. Whether > it's right or wrong we won't know for a while. But someone has to > take the pioneering step and I'm damn proud to do it. > > What will your grandkids know about you? > > Tom Ray > tomray@wor710.com > > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, Ian Davidson > wrote: > > On Fri, 24 Jan 2003, Kevin T. wrote: > > > > > It's official... the friendly engineers at 710 WOR are now > childishly > > > refusing to speak with me anymore. As the premiere IBOC station > in the > > > USA, this certainly paints a favorable picture about how IBOC and > its > > > supporters handle public relations, doesn't it? > > > > I see ... > > > > As Maxwell Smart would say ... 'the o l d dummy spit". > > > > Now Tom ... what have you got to say to the rest of us? Hmmmm?? > > > > I nicely asked a couple of simple questions that you could have > answered > > in two minutes. How proud are you of your new wizz-bang technology? > > > > Perhaps you better let WOR's promotions department provide the > answers ... > > > > > > Ian - Melbourne > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From groucho@skyweb.net Sun Jan 26 13:55:31 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Jan 2003 21:55:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 52671 invoked from network); 26 Jan 2003 21:55:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Jan 2003 21:55:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Jan 2003 21:55:30 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (max1-220.skyweb.net [66.6.130.92]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h0QM3SKN033168 for ; Sun, 26 Jan 2003 17:03:28 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3E3457A7.CF00D012@skyweb.net> Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2003 16:48:23 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} WOR IBOC References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Hello Tom I would personally Like to say thank you to yourself and Kerry For the warm reception the other day... I had learned more than I expected. I still have my reservations of IBOC on AM.. It does sound much better than it did at the Road show.. still Needs lots of work. They need to get it narrower. and less artifacts. Sorry I was not impressed when You showed Me the analog audio and it had Hiss On it. If it did Not have had the hiss that would have made My day. I got the Tour of the van with my Friend Ken From Ibiquity.. I tried to point it out to Him but got a small run around.. I noticed that On the spectrum analyser on the Computer screen which shows the Overlay of spectrum 670, 680,690 700,710,720,730 ect.. that It may have been because it was parked Under the antennas But I did Notice with My own 2 eyes. that YES WOR's IBOC signal cut off at 725 and not any Higher which was a good thing to see. However The lower side IBOC signal was a bit hot as ken admitted and It DID go right down to 690 Not 695 as You suggest.. maybe You can Lower its level just a tad... this is why I am discussing this Off List so Kevin does not blow it all out of Phase ..LOL... But it did Go right down to 690 which Took me by supprise. something you may or may Not have noticed. this may have happened During some minor adjustments.. Overall.. I had a good Time got to see alot Of Old Friends I have Not seen in a while.. Don't know If your aware Of it,.and You Could not tell by looking at Me.,But but in 1995 I had Broken My neck and was Flat Out For 4 years. after a few surgery's and Tons of physical therapy..So I lost contact with everyone... Love that 317C.. I saw that WBBR's is in a Dumpster... Kerry said its looking for a New Home in 2 years. and If I'm Interested since I collect and restore old transmitters. I have 2 years of planning To find it a New home so It does Not End up in a dumpster... I have In My personal collection an RCA BTA-500R, a Gates BC-1H1 and a Collins 300G, and a Collins 830D FM That I am restoring.... quite a bit smaller than the 317C.. I almost had an RCA BTA-10H but someone beat me too it.. Overall what I did learn maybe I am wrong, But from the answer to My question Of 2 local stations In the same Contour sharing an IBOC signal.... using 1660 and My station on 1680 sharing IBOC signals On 1670 wont work... Yes the receiver will get the data from the 1 sideband But wont have the redundancy Of the second IBOC sideband and will Be subject to Lots Of Digital dropout... From what I understood of Ibiquitys answer is "that you cannot have Everything" this can word for word from Rich... which tells Me that stations like WOR listeners will have Both IBOC signals and Stations like Mine wont... That's not the answer I wanted to hear.. It has to work for all stations and not just some.. Personally I think IBOC will work very well On FM.. But unless they can get the above solved so that ALL stations can use BOTH IBOC signals. Its Not worth It in its current Form.. I am trying To Understand this But with each Question My answers are always answered with another Question.. sounds Like Union reps to Me.. LOL... BTW I am a local #3 Electrician who has been out of work since last March.. mostly Due to the Union Jerking My chain Because Of my Neck disability... that's why I fell back into Broadcast Engineering something I have been doing since I was 16.. and always looking For work.. Overall again Thank you for the Tour...and I am open To learning more.. and another tour one on one... Just hope Ibiquity gets the bugs solved.... respectfully Neal Newman-Ka2caf CE- WTTM From jh926@comcast.net Sun Jan 26 14:10:57 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jh926@comcast.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Jan 2003 22:10:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 6069 invoked from network); 26 Jan 2003 22:10:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Jan 2003 22:10:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO smtp.comcast.net) (24.153.64.2) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Jan 2003 22:10:55 -0000 Received: from -enduser.comcast.net (pcp03184855pcs.benslm01.pa.comcast.net [68.80.77.117]) by mtaout06.icomcast.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.09 (built Jan 7 2003)) with ESMTP id <0H9C0086ODLWG5@mtaout06.icomcast.net> for amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com; Sun, 26 Jan 2003 17:10:46 -0500 (EST) Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2003 17:15:45 -0500 Subject: Re: {AMSF} Narrowing radio's down and some questions: (Carver TX-11 C, Sony SRF-42, Denon TU680NAB, Crisler/Delco Car radio, and Sony IBF-2010) In-reply-to: <005e01c2c57b$9a040840$827dfea9@home1> X-Sender: jh926@mail.comcast.net To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Message-id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030126171533.031b2180@mail.comcast.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030126141508.02eb12d0@pop.GameBox.net> From: John X-Yahoo-Group-Post: public What is an Easy AMS conversion? At 02:43 PM 1/26/03 -0600, you wrote: >No to the Sony question. Don't overlook Carver's TX-11a and 11b, or if you >want an easy AMS conversion, their TX-2. The car radios come in such a >dizzying array of model numbers it's hard to pin anything down, but anything >from 1993 on with a five band graphic equalizer will have both EB and AMS. >Check your local salvage yard. You can get connectors with wires to hook >them up from several sources including Best Buy and Audio King. Look for a >dealer that sells the Turbowire brand. > >Scott Todd > >PS I'll bet your word searches come up with some interesting results. :) > > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "John" > > >> >> Hi. >> So far from what I'm hearing I have a choice betwene the Carver TX-11 C, >Sony SRF-42, Denon TU680NAB, and Crisler/Delco Car radio. >> Witch moddle number is the crisler/Delco? >> I have seen some reports of the Sony IBF-2010 used for DXing. >> Is this radio an AM Stereo tuner? > > >Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sun Jan 26 14:19:03 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Jan 2003 22:19:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 26686 invoked from network); 26 Jan 2003 22:19:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Jan 2003 22:19:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Jan 2003 22:19:03 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.133] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 26 Jan 2003 22:19:03 -0000 Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2003 22:19:01 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: MC 13028 Decoder Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <1ee.3ea892.2b659316@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2347 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.131.67 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, jeffdeck@a... wrote: > All, > Before anyone gets too creative with their MC13028 chip, a few caveats > are in order (based upon my extensive experiments with this chip): > > You must put 0.001uFd capacitors in parallel with pins 15 and 16 to > electrical ground to remove the I.F from the recovered audio. Otherwise, > this I.F can cause amplifiers downstream to oscillate. > I placed a 300pf to ground to solve this. also I have a 2nd order Low Pass Filter @ ~9.5KHz which quiclky attenuates anything above 15KHz. > You cannot drift too far from 450kHz I.F -- the MC13028 uses divide-by > components to detect the 25Hz pilot tone. For instance, 1/8 for the > I.F PLL, and then 1/18K for the pilot tone PLL detector. This is an "all > digital" implementation with over 600 transistors on the substrate. > In the datasheet I have it doesn't mentioned anything about using divide by counters for the pilot tone. Where did you come by this info? If a 455KHz is used then that would divide down to 25.278Hz. Chris has used radios with a 455KHz IF even with the 3.6MHz ceramic resonator and is able to detect stereo. > > Do not use any capacitor, other than aluminum electrolytic, on pin 9. Oops I used a tantalum. If it diesn't work I will use an electrolytic. > > 1Mohm resistor across ceramic resonator to force stereo. > Thats interesting. > Hal: In your picture, is this the chip that you purchased from me? > Also, which components did you use for the 8x455kHz L/C oscillator? > Yes it is the chip. I used an Amidon L-43-2 wind your own. You could probably use the smaller L-33-2 if desired. The L-43-2 was what is available to me at the store. I wound 48 turns of #34 wire and resonated it with a 100pf SM cap. I center tapped it at 50% to connect it at pin 13 via a .02uf ceramic cap for DC isolation. In messing with the tuning I am able to get the loop voltage to rest at .6V. If I vary the IF signal generator frequency the loop voltage varies accordingly. I can then retune the coil and get the loop voltage to rest a .6V again at a different frequency. In messing with the LC Osc on a MC13020 it acts the same so from my observation at this point it appears to be locking onto the IF. I will know more when I put in a radio and try to receive a Stereo station. JSG From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sun Jan 26 14:21:59 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Jan 2003 22:21:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 22464 invoked from network); 26 Jan 2003 22:21:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Jan 2003 22:21:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.66) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Jan 2003 22:21:58 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.180] by n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 26 Jan 2003 22:21:58 -0000 Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2003 22:21:57 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Marantz 2215B Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1092 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.131.67 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " < > kevtronics@y...> wrote: > > I also notice that it is also a "forced" FM Stereo tuner -- even when > > no station is tuned in, the hiss is heard in stereo, which is strange > > because I thought FM Stereo required the pilot tone to "lock onto" in > > order to receive Stereo audio? > > Isn't that what you mean by "forced FM Stereo", that everything, > including mono stations, and interstation hiss, in addition to the > stereo stations, is decoded as "stereo"? Sure the pilot tone is > required to "lock" the local 38 kHz osc. to the 38 kHz osc. at the > transmitter, but if it isn't a stereo transmission, then whatever > frequency the local 38 kHz osc. free runs at is fine for decoding the > noise or mono audio, as long as the audio outputs are also switched to > the outputs of the stereo decoder. > > John Sounds like the mute circuit isn't working or doesn't have one for the L-R 38KHz subcarrier detector. JSG From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Jan 26 14:37:57 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Jan 2003 22:37:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 56378 invoked from network); 26 Jan 2003 22:37:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Jan 2003 22:37:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Jan 2003 22:37:56 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.175] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 26 Jan 2003 22:37:56 -0000 Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2003 22:37:55 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: WOR IBOC Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2403 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.74.145 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics In response to Mr. Ray's message here, I stand 100% by all that I have said so far. As I have done since their IBOC signal went on the air last October, all I am doing is reporting my observations. Apparently Mr. Ray and the other engineers at WOR don't believe these observations, and have gotten defensive about this, to the point of making false accusations of what I have said -- but that doesn't change the fact that I can tune ANY radio to 740 or 750 kHz and hear "hash" and "splatter" that is directly coming from WOR's signal -- despite whatever their expensive spectrum analyzer is telling them. And please note that Mr. Ray continues to REFUSE to give any specific information on what models of radios he is using that allegedly are immunue to this kind of wide-bandwidth hash/splatter that I have been experiencing. If he has nothing to hide, then why can't he at least help us out by identifing some radios that supposedly will not receive WOR's splatter outside of the transmitted bandwidth they claim to be using? In this regard, on March 1, 2003, with the help of Chris Cuff, I will be giving a live demonstration of AM Stereo at the 2003 North Jersey Hamfest (amateur radio show) in Parsippany, NJ, which will also include a live demonstration of WOR's IBOC hash/splatter as received on multiple radios for all to hear. People who listen to this will be invited to contact Mr. Ray and report their own experiences and opinions. He may be able to disregard my own observations, but when dozens of people are reporting the same thing, that will substantiate a more serious issue that needs to be dealt with -- at least if he, WOR, and iBiquity/IBOC wish to maintain any sense of credibility. And again, if Mr. Ray can name the MAKE and MODEL number of a specific radio that does NOT receive "splatter" from WOR's signal across 680 to 750 kHz, all he has to do is mention it and then I will be happy to purchase and evaluate one of these radios, with which I will change my reported experiences with WOR's signal as appropriate. I also remind Mr. Ray that personal threats are not appropriate for this message board, and should be contained to private e-mails -- at least for those who he doesn't block out in a childish attempt to forcibly silence the issues that he refuses to address. Kevin Tekel Sysop of The AM Stereo Forum kevtronics@yahoo.com From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sun Jan 26 14:42:20 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Jan 2003 22:42:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 44684 invoked from network); 26 Jan 2003 22:42:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Jan 2003 22:42:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.87) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Jan 2003 22:42:19 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.157] by n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 26 Jan 2003 22:42:19 -0000 Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2003 22:42:19 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: WOR IBOC Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1416 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.131.67 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "wortomray " wrote: > > In regards to the splatter, testing with a factory calibrated > spectrum analyzer (costing $50,000), set up according to factory > specifications and FCC regulations for the measurement of the AM > spectrum, shows clearly that the IBOC sidebands drop off to nothing > at 695 and 725kHz. There is nothing beyond those areas. > > > Thomas R. Ray, III > Corporate Director of Engineering > Buckley Broadcasting/WOR Radio > NYC > tomray@w... I think the explanation as to why the IBOC hash appears to be received below 695KHz and above 725KHz is that if there is no signal within the passband when the radio is tuned 30KHz away from WOR's signal is that the AGC gain goes all the way up and anything getting through even though it may be 15KHz wawy from the center passband and greatly attenuated by the IF filter the envelope detector will see it and the IBOC hash acts as its own carrier and detects inself. If a synchronous detector is used and the PLL freq is near the center of the IF filter's passband then the output of the detector would be above 15KHz because it is beating against PLL frequency. To a synchronous detector with the radio tuned 30KHz away the pirmary IBOC sideband would be received in the 15-20KHz range and the secondary IBOC sideband at 20-25KHz. which is out of the hearing range. JSG From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Jan 26 14:55:06 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Jan 2003 22:55:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 71339 invoked from network); 26 Jan 2003 22:55:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Jan 2003 22:55:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Jan 2003 22:55:06 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.147] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 26 Jan 2003 22:55:06 -0000 Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2003 22:55:05 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: It's official... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1147 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.74.145 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > On a final note, some day my grandkids will open a book and see my > name listed along with Marconi's as an industry pioneer. Whether > it's right or wrong we won't know for a while. But someone has to > take the pioneering step and I'm damn proud to do it. There are many pioneers throughout history, but not all have turned out to be memorable. For example, what history book lists the name of the CBS engineer who invented their "spinning disc" color TV system? The spinning disc system, although FCC-approved like IBOC, turned out to be an inherently flawed and limited system that was scrapped after only two years of use in favor of the NTSC color TV system which we are still using today, half a century later. Thus, while it was the "pioneering" color TV system, it is all but forgotten today -- as I predict the inherently flawed IBOC system will also be, decades from now. And for the record, the real pioneer was Nikola Tesla, not Marconi. And it's appropriate, too, because if every AM station used IBOC, then the effect of all the hash and interfererence would be very similar to somebody using a Tesla coil. From ccuff@in4web.com Sun Jan 26 14:57:09 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Jan 2003 22:57:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 93044 invoked from network); 26 Jan 2003 22:57:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Jan 2003 22:57:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Jan 2003 22:57:09 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.39]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Sun, 26 Jan 2003 17:53:10 -0500 Message-ID: <003b01c2c58d$003180a0$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: MC 13028 Decoder Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2003 17:48:09 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 I have had no problems at all using the MC13028 decoders on 455. The lock range, with no parallel cap, is usually from 448 to 460 khz. All verified with a Sencore SG80, at weak to moderate signal conditions. Now this IS using the present batch of resonators I got a year or so ago- they have a broad range anyway- some of the other ones I had were much tighter. CC ----- Original Message ----- From: To: From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sun Jan 26 15:21:44 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Jan 2003 23:21:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 91595 invoked from network); 26 Jan 2003 23:21:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Jan 2003 23:21:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Jan 2003 23:21:43 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.138] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 26 Jan 2003 23:21:43 -0000 Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2003 23:21:41 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: MC 13028 Decoder Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <003b01c2c58d$003180a0$0101a8c0@pavilion> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 950 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.131.67 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Christopher Cuff" wrote: > I have had no problems at all using the MC13028 decoders on 455. The lock > range, with no parallel cap, is usually from 448 to 460 khz. All verified > with a Sencore SG80, at weak to moderate signal conditions. Now this IS > using the present batch of resonators I got a year or so ago- they have a > broad range anyway- some of the other ones I had were much tighter. > CC I'll agree with that. I think Jeff's point was that the 450KHz IF is divided by 18K to 25Hz and that pilot detector uses this. His point is that if the IF frequency is off by a great deal, say at 470KHz, then the pilot would have to be 26.11Hz. From what you have said in the past when using it at 455KHz with no problems then that probably means pilot detection also since the goal of installing a decoder is to receive stereo. I'll know more when I install mine in a 455KHz radio. JSG From ccuff@in4web.com Sun Jan 26 15:32:32 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Jan 2003 23:32:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 70829 invoked from network); 26 Jan 2003 23:32:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Jan 2003 23:32:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Jan 2003 23:32:32 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.39]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Sun, 26 Jan 2003 18:28:33 -0500 Message-ID: <009301c2c591$f19fb2a0$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: MC 13028 Decoder Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2003 18:23:32 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 I just did a Blaupunkt with a 460 Khz IF- I had to hand test several resonators to get one that would go to 462 khz, but it worked, and worked great. Sigh... the whole WORLD is geared to 455 or 450... and they have to get cute with 460..... CC ----- Original Message ----- From: From jeffdeck@aol.com Sun Jan 26 15:34:32 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jeffdeck@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Jan 2003 23:34:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 73699 invoked from network); 26 Jan 2003 23:34:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Jan 2003 23:34:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.68) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Jan 2003 23:34:31 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.165] by n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 26 Jan 2003 23:34:30 -0000 Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2003 23:34:28 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: MC 13028 Decoder Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1286 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jeffdeck2001 " X-Originating-IP: 64.12.96.170 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=4430287 X-Yahoo-Profile: jeffdeck2001 Hal, >In the datasheet I have it doesn't mentioned anything about using >divide by counters for the pilot tone. Where did you come by this >info? I spoke to one of the four Motorola engineers on the chip side. >I used an Amidon L-43-2 wind your own. You could >probably use the smaller L-33-2 if desired. The L-43-2 was what is >available to me at the store. Which store near you sells these coils? >I wound 48 turns of #34 wire and resonated it with a 100pf SM cap. I >center tapped it at 50% to connect it at pin 13 via a .02uf ceramic >cap for DC isolation. Did you run the coil from B+ to ground? Interesting that the L/C tunes the oscillator in the MC13028, since the oscillator type is not identical to the one used in the MC13020 chip. Off topic: WLLZ is still monaural. Is Cris Alexander connected with Crawford Broadcasting, and does Crawford still own WLLZ? I hope that their exciter is down, and will be repaired, but want to have confirmation. I also listened to WCHB-AM's loud hash on 1190 and 1220kHz (not very entertaining). During my next visit, I will record WMGC-FM's beehive sound for anyone interested (perhaps it will make the ratings (kidding!). It sounds like high speed digital data. And now I am signing off for the evening. 73, Jeff From evergreenterrace@buzzle.com Sun Jan 26 15:53:15 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: evergreenterrace@buzzle.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 26 Jan 2003 23:53:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 26773 invoked from network); 26 Jan 2003 23:53:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Jan 2003 23:53:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.66) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Jan 2003 23:53:15 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.182] by n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 26 Jan 2003 23:53:14 -0000 Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2003 23:53:13 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: WOR IBOC Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2091 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgliradio " X-Originating-IP: 170.20.11.59 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=69711087 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgliradio --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: >but that doesn't > change the fact that I can tune ANY radio to 740 or 750 kHz and hear > "hash" and "splatter" that is directly coming from WOR's signal -- > despite whatever their expensive spectrum analyzer is telling them. > I don't hear any artifacts in NYC on my SRF-42 or Chrysler AM Stereo car radio on 740 or 750. Under the WOR antenna, I still heard nothing at 740 and 750 on my SRF-42 or my Chrysler AM stereo car radio. > And please note that Mr. Ray continues to REFUSE to give any specific > information on what models of radios he is using that allegedly are > immunue to this kind of wide-bandwidth hash/splatter that I have been > experiencing. If he has nothing to hide, then why can't he at least > help us out by identifing some radios that supposedly will not > receive WOR's splatter outside of the transmitted bandwidth they > claim to be using? Why don't you take him up on his offer to meet with him, rather than this back and forth that ends up nowhere? > I also remind Mr. Ray that personal threats are not appropriate for > this message board, and should be contained to private e-mails -- at > least for those who he doesn't block out in a childish attempt to > forcibly silence the issues that he refuses to address. I know I would be pissed if someone said I was operating illegally when I wasn't. Oh, by the way, I still am not an IBOC supporter. Mr. Ray and I disagree on IBOC, but some like Nautel transmitters and others like Harris. Some liked Kahn and some don't. Engineers can differ on opinion, it doesn't make one engineer better or worse than the other. As individuals who are trying to present AM stereo as an avenue to improve AM, you've all lost your focus. All everyone thinks about this forum right now is that it is anti-IBOC. It SHOULD be a forum to demonstrate the positives of AM stereo. All this yelling looks foolish. Where were you last week Kevin? The invite to WOR was open to all interested? From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Jan 26 17:53:35 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Jan 2003 01:53:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 79302 invoked from network); 27 Jan 2003 01:53:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Jan 2003 01:53:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Jan 2003 01:53:34 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.250] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Jan 2003 01:53:33 -0000 Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 01:53:31 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Note to AM Stereo Forum members Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 790 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.74.145 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics Due to his personal attacks and offensive remarks, Mr. Tom Ray is no longer allowed to post messages to the AM Stereo Forum, and his messages have been removed from the archives. Since Mr. Ray took advantage of the Forum's ability for non-members to post messages, I have unfortunately had to suspend that privilege, at least temporarily. Anybody can still view the Forum messages on the web, but those who wish to post messages must become a member of the Forum. If WOR wishes to present their side of the issues regarding IBOC in this Forum, they are certainly welcome to do so, as long as they can find someone who can engage in constructive discussions without resorting to name-calling and offensive language. Kevin Tekel Sysop of The AM Stereo Forum kevtronics@yahoo.com From KC4QLP@aol.com Sun Jan 26 18:06:52 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Jan 2003 02:06:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 75275 invoked from network); 27 Jan 2003 02:06:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Jan 2003 02:06:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r03.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.99) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Jan 2003 02:06:51 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.3a.335bb044 (4238) for ; Sun, 26 Jan 2003 21:06:46 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <3a.335bb044.2b65ee36@aol.com> Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2003 21:06:46 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: WOR IBOC To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 1/26/03 6:54:31 PM Eastern Standard Time, evergreenterrace@buzzle.com writes: > Oh, by the way, I still am not an IBOC supporter. Mr. Ray and I > disagree on IBOC, but some like Nautel transmitters and others like > Harris. Some liked Kahn and some don't. Engineers can differ on > opinion, it doesn't make one engineer better or worse than the other. Amen!..I agree with that! > > As individuals who are trying to present AM stereo as an avenue to > improve AM, you've all lost your focus. All everyone thinks about > this forum right now is that it is anti-IBOC. It SHOULD be a forum > to demonstrate the positives of AM stereo. All this yelling looks > foolish. > This forum has become a lost cause.The fools running this forum and the insane vocal individuals that persist in pushing their hair brained unrealistic ideas and uncalled for accusations and unproven,unsubstantiated claims have certainly made this place THE laughing stock of the radio industry. The sad part is you fools cant see that and you keep on with the same old antics day in and day out. When someone gets sued for overloading there mouth..I will still be here to say "I told you so!" > Where were you last week Kevin? The invite to WOR was open to all > interested? > > Dunno why Kevin wont go....maybe he's affraid he'll learn something! If I were closer and had more free time to break away from the duties here..I would certainly take a trip to NYC and take the "50 cent tour". Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From evergreenterrace@buzzle.com Sun Jan 26 18:23:41 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: evergreenterrace@buzzle.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Jan 2003 02:23:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 26942 invoked from network); 27 Jan 2003 02:23:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Jan 2003 02:23:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Jan 2003 02:23:40 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.131] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Jan 2003 02:23:40 -0000 Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 02:23:40 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Note to AM Stereo Forum members Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1863 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgliradio " X-Originating-IP: 170.20.11.59 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=69711087 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgliradio --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: > Due to his personal attacks and offensive remarks, Mr. Tom Ray is > no longer allowed to post messages to the AM Stereo Forum, and his > messages have been removed from the archives. > > Since Mr. Ray took advantage of the Forum's ability for non-members > to post messages, I have unfortunately had to suspend that privilege, > at least temporarily. Anybody can still view the Forum messages on > the web, but those who wish to post messages must become a member of > the Forum. > > If WOR wishes to present their side of the issues regarding IBOC in > this Forum, they are certainly welcome to do so, as long as they can > find someone who can engage in constructive discussions without > resorting to name-calling and offensive language. Are you another Allan Sniffen? When you can't agree to disagree you just delete and ban. As a broadcast engineer in New York City, I can assure you that this forum is somewhat of a joke. The only reason it has gotten to this state is because all you can do is shout accusations at others and you don't have the balls to back it up after YOU WERE INVITED to the WOR plant to see IBOC in action. Instead, you sit on your prech, DX'ing with your 40 radios and claiming that WOR is out of compliance. I hope AM stereo does "make a comeback". That was the initial purpose of this forum. Instead, it has become a soapbox for you and your ignorance. As a moderator of the Long Island Radio Message Board, I am appalled at the fact that Mr. Ray was banned from this forum because his ideals differ from yours. You should be ashamed and you sir are a TERRIBLE moderator if you allow this to happen. Don't forget, YOU were the one who started this fire. YOU fired the first shot. =Mike Erickson= From KC4QLP@aol.com Sun Jan 26 18:31:33 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Jan 2003 02:31:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 61923 invoked from network); 27 Jan 2003 02:31:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Jan 2003 02:31:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d04.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.36) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Jan 2003 02:31:32 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.189.14e30da3 (4238) for ; Sun, 26 Jan 2003 21:31:27 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <189.14e30da3.2b65f3fe@aol.com> Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2003 21:31:26 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Note to AM Stereo Forum members To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > Due to his personal attacks and offensive remarks, Mr. Tom Ray is > no longer allowed to post messages to the AM Stereo Forum, and his > messages have been removed from the archives. > Thats quite unfortunate.Censorship at its highest! > Since Mr. Ray took advantage of the Forum's ability for non-members > to post messages, I have unfortunately had to suspend that privilege, > at least temporarily. Anybody can still view the Forum messages on > the web, but those who wish to post messages must become a member of > the Forum. Mr Ray was rightfully defending his and WOR's position with regards to IBOC and the things that have been said.To "cut off" his ability to do so whether anyone likes or dislikes IBOC is wrong....period! and childish to boot! > > If WOR wishes to present their side of the issues regarding IBOC in > this Forum, they are certainly welcome to do so, as long as they can > find someone who can engage in constructive discussions without > resorting to name-calling and offensive language. > Uhm...let me see...I'm confused now as many others probably are now as well. You "cut him off" from posting to the list...but yet you say this? Bottom line is this.....Tom and Kerry have every right to be highly P.Oed about what a certain individual is propagating all over the place. As far as my presence here now...its solely for the entertainment.The creditablitiy of this forum and what it is about is most certainly at rock bottom...a big fat ZERO. Its sad to see the lines of communication fall apart like it has. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From amymousie@yahoo.com Sun Jan 26 18:44:37 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Jan 2003 02:44:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 59282 invoked from network); 27 Jan 2003 02:44:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Jan 2003 02:44:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Jan 2003 02:44:35 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.173] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Jan 2003 02:44:35 -0000 Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 02:44:33 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Note to AM Stereo Forum members Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 181 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 64.175.244.188 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: -snip= * Amy just rolls her eyes * 9.9 I'm not going to say a word. Amy. <:3 )~~~ From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Sun Jan 26 19:09:43 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Jan 2003 03:09:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 15627 invoked from network); 27 Jan 2003 03:09:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Jan 2003 03:09:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf00bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.20) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Jan 2003 03:09:43 -0000 Received: from juan ([68.153.68.61]) by imf00bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.25 201-253-122-122-125-20020815) with SMTP id <20030127031139.PPFL18159.imf00bis.bellsouth.net@juan> for ; Sun, 26 Jan 2003 22:11:39 -0500 Message-ID: <005901c2c5b1$8bcee2f0$af78fea9@juan> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: WOR IBOC Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2003 22:09:46 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit A time out would benefit all. Juan TC Radio Group ----- Original Message ----- From: wortomray To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, January 26, 2003 7:53 PM Subject: {AMSF} Re: WOR IBOC And you can shove your forum up your ass. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From rwagoner1@mac.com Sun Jan 26 19:15:14 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner1@mac.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Jan 2003 03:15:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 96374 invoked from network); 27 Jan 2003 03:15:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Jan 2003 03:15:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO fed1mtao06.cox.net) (68.6.19.125) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Jan 2003 03:15:14 -0000 Received: from mac.com ([68.4.33.253]) by fed1mtao06.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20030127031508.KWGI3243.fed1mtao06.cox.net@mac.com> for ; Sun, 26 Jan 2003 22:15:08 -0500 Message-ID: <3E34A43E.3060806@mac.com> Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2003 19:15:10 -0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20021120 Netscape/7.01 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Note to AM Stereo Forum members References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Richard Wagoner X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135738921 X-Yahoo-Profile: richardalanwagoner Add me to the list who is disappointed with the "ban." I am not an engineer, but the exchange (sans the personal attacks from both sides) was very informative. Richard Wagoner From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Jan 26 19:23:15 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Jan 2003 03:23:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 17838 invoked from network); 27 Jan 2003 03:23:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Jan 2003 03:23:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.87) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Jan 2003 03:23:15 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.155] by n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Jan 2003 03:23:14 -0000 Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 03:23:14 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Note to AM Stereo Forum members Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <189.14e30da3.2b65f3fe@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2721 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.74.145 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Thats quite unfortunate. Censorship at its highest! I am not in favor of censorship. But when people come in here, refuse to engage in constructive discussion, and start using offensive language (to quote Mr. Ray, "you can take your forum and shove it up your ass"), that is unacceptable. Mr. Ray also failed to realise what exactly a personal attack is, and falsely accused me of issuing them against him. A personal attack would be saying "Tom Ray is an idiot for using IBOC on WOR". I have NEVER said anything like that. All I did was report my experiences with WOR's signal and how it is affecting the reception of a significant portion of the AM band over a wide physical area. Mr. Ray continually doubted the accuracy of such reports and in turn personally attacked *me* for having the audacity to post anything which might be seen as disagreeing with the configuration of WOR's transmissions. I am trying to be as objective about IBOC as anybody else here, but I tell it as I see it. I can tune any radio from 680 to 750 kHz and hear nothing but hash and splatter from WOR's signal. And that doesn't change no matter how much Mr. Ray tries to dispute my experiences or personally attack me. If he can't accept what I have to say, then that's his problem, not mine. If this makes me another Allan Sniffen, then so be it. I play by the rules. When I first set up this Forum, I wanted it to be a positive place which would foster the growth and popularity of AM Stereo through constructive discussion in a friendly atmosphere. Anybody is allowed to participate as long as they can respect this objective and respect their fellow members. Mr. Ray is the first person who I have had to take such action against, and hopefully he will be the last. C'mon guys, we're better than that. We're all adults here, and many of us are professionally involved in the radio industry. We have to act as such in order for our time spent here to be worthwhile. And furthermore, we are all equals here. You could be the Queen of England, but that doesn't give you the right to use offensive language and personally attack anybody as you see fit. And my actions against Mr. Ray would not change even if he was the biggest supporter of AM Stereo on Earth. I only take issue with his actions, not with his support of IBOC. And in that light, I have removed my ban against him (and from this point on, I will *never* ban anybody from the Forum, as a matter of policy). He is 100% welcome to join as a member and participate here -- as long as he can respect his fellow members and respect the purpose of this Forum. Kevin Tekel Sysop of The AM Stereo Forum kevtronics@yahoo.com From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Jan 26 19:32:43 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Jan 2003 03:32:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 32344 invoked from network); 27 Jan 2003 03:32:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Jan 2003 03:32:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.64) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Jan 2003 03:32:43 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.187] by n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Jan 2003 03:32:43 -0000 Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 03:32:41 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Note to AM Stereo Forum members Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 771 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.74.145 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > * Amy just rolls her eyes * 9.9 > > I'm not going to say a word. > > Amy. <:3 )~~~ Yes Dennis, my point is that everybody makes mistakes. You've made yours and I've made mine. But we and the other 150+ members of this Forum are better than that. We don't have to resort to personal attacks and name-calling to have a constructive discussion, even when there is a significant disagreement. And that's the whole reason why this Forum has been as successful as it is -- and I, with the help of everybody else here, would like to keep it that way. I'll say it again. Mr. Ray is completely welcome to participate here, as long as he can do so without resorting to using offensive language more befitting of a sailor than of a professional radio engineer. From evergreenterrace@buzzle.com Sun Jan 26 19:35:26 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: evergreenterrace@buzzle.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Jan 2003 03:35:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 36942 invoked from network); 27 Jan 2003 03:35:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Jan 2003 03:35:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.78) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Jan 2003 03:35:25 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.162] by n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Jan 2003 03:35:25 -0000 Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 03:35:25 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Note to AM Stereo Forum members Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 804 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgliradio " X-Originating-IP: 170.20.11.59 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=69711087 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgliradio --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: >>>When I first set up this Forum, I wanted it to be a positive place which would foster the growth and popularity of AM Stereo through constructive discussion in a friendly atmosphere<<< Instead it has turned into an Anti-IBOC forum. Kevin, what you have to remember is that you were the one who said that WOR was out of compliance. I can tell you from VISITING the site that your statement is untrue and you should not have made such a statement WITHOUT the proper proof from the proper test equipment. Any attack that station W--- is out of compliance is a personal attack against the engineer of the station who is the person responsible for the proper operation of his / her facility. Period. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Jan 26 20:07:50 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Jan 2003 04:07:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 3857 invoked from network); 27 Jan 2003 04:07:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Jan 2003 04:07:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Jan 2003 04:07:50 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.143] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Jan 2003 04:07:50 -0000 Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 04:07:49 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Note to AM Stereo Forum members Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1028 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.74.145 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Any attack that station W--- is out of compliance is a personal > attack against the engineer of the station who is the person > responsible for the proper operation of his / her facility. I have not made such allegations. All I have done is simply report my experience with WOR's signal. And my experience is that a station that is supposed to be on 710 kHz is causing severe interference over a range of 680 to 750 kHz on multiple receivers in multiple locations up to 50 miles away from the transmitter. That is my experience, and I stand by it, and by my right to report it without being personally attacked by those who might not want to believe it. But those people are certainly welcome to take a ride in my 1981 Mercedes 240D, listen to my car radio, and hear the same interference from WOR that I am hearing. And on that note, I am pleased to welcome Mr. Tom Ray of WOR as the 154th member of The AM Stereo Forum. Just as I said, he requested to join the Forum and I have approved his membership. From evergreenterrace@buzzle.com Sun Jan 26 20:18:17 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: evergreenterrace@buzzle.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Jan 2003 04:18:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 79109 invoked from network); 27 Jan 2003 04:18:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Jan 2003 04:18:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Jan 2003 04:18:17 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.135] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Jan 2003 04:18:16 -0000 Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 04:18:14 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Note to AM Stereo Forum members Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1589 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgliradio " X-Originating-IP: 170.20.11.59 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=69711087 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgliradio --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: > > Any attack that station W--- is out of compliance is a personal > > attack against the engineer of the station who is the person > > responsible for the proper operation of his / her facility. > > I have not made such allegations. All I have done is simply report > my experience with WOR's signal. And my experience is that a station > that is supposed to be on 710 kHz is causing severe interference over > a range of 680 to 750 kHz on multiple receivers in multiple locations > up to 50 miles away from the transmitter. > > That is my experience, and I stand by it, and by my right to report > it without being personally attacked by those who might not want to > believe it. But those people are certainly welcome to take a ride in > my 1981 Mercedes 240D, listen to my car radio, and hear the same > interference from WOR that I am hearing. > > And on that note, I am pleased to welcome Mr. Tom Ray of WOR as the > 154th member of The AM Stereo Forum. Just as I said, he requested to > join the Forum and I have approved his membership. And I invite you to listen on my Sony SRF-42, my Chrysler 1987 AM Stereo car radio, my JVC KSF-160 cassette car stereo, my GE 3-5280C portable, my GE SuperRadio and the stock Delco narrowband in my 1987 Chevrolet Spectrum. All do not have the problems you state. I do hear the sidebands on 700 and 720 and the noise floor is much higher than normal on 690 and 730, but 680 and 740... day and night... are just fine. From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Sun Jan 26 20:24:33 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Jan 2003 04:24:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 85186 invoked from network); 27 Jan 2003 04:24:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Jan 2003 04:24:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf12bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.52) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Jan 2003 04:24:33 -0000 Received: from juan ([68.153.68.61]) by imf12bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.25 201-253-122-122-125-20020815) with SMTP id <20030127042629.RMEY21240.imf12bis.bellsouth.net@juan> for ; Sun, 26 Jan 2003 23:26:29 -0500 Message-ID: <005201c2c5bc$003bd580$af78fea9@juan> To: Subject: IBOC Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2003 23:24:36 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Whatever the final outcome of IBOC, I learned my lesson with AM Stereo. I will buy a few IBOC receivers if they are ever available, and especially if they go on clearance...hold on to them, and sell them on e-bay for a nice profit in the future. Always looking for a way to make $ I am in Radio after all ! Juan TC Radio Group [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From possumhunter@netzero.net Sun Jan 26 20:31:24 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: possumhunter@netzero.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Jan 2003 04:31:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 86287 invoked from network); 27 Jan 2003 04:31:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Jan 2003 04:31:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rly-ip04.mx.aol.com) (64.12.138.8) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Jan 2003 04:31:23 -0000 Received: from logs-wo.proxy.aol.com (logs-wo.proxy.aol.com [205.188.200.6]) by rly-ip04.mx.aol.com (v89.10) with ESMTP id RELAYIN7-0126232754; Sun, 26 Jan 2003 23:27:54 -0500 Received: from ibm (AC8E6FA1.ipt.aol.com [172.142.111.161]) by logs-wo.proxy.aol.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with SMTP id h0R4Rvcb309271 for ; Sun, 26 Jan 2003 23:27:58 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <022901c2c5bc$72aa92a0$a16f8eac@aoldsl.net> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: WOR IBOC Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2003 23:27:47 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Apparently-From: DodgeRamTrucker@aol.com From: "Possum Hunter" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 evergreenterrace@buzzle.com wrote: > I know I would be pissed if someone said I was operating illegally when I wasn't. You had better know that I would be! > > Oh, by the way, I still am not an IBOC supporter. Nor am I. I think the IBOC noise will drive even more listeners away from the Medium Wave AM broadcast band, not to mention the loud sidebands will clobber us small stations that have a big station next door. I think Tom is a knowledgeable broadcast engineer that should be on this forum. Attacking him or censoring him is a bad move and will nothing to help our cause. If and when I can get away from work long enough, I want to go up north and take the nickel tours of WOR and WTTM. Kevin From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Jan 26 20:34:16 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Jan 2003 04:34:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 3055 invoked from network); 27 Jan 2003 04:34:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Jan 2003 04:34:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Jan 2003 04:34:15 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.165] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Jan 2003 04:33:49 -0000 Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 04:33:47 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: IBOC Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <005201c2c5bc$003bd580$af78fea9@juan> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 558 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.74.145 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > I will buy a few IBOC receivers if they are ever available, and > especially if they go on clearance...hold on to them, and sell > them on e-bay for a nice profit in the future. I think the day when we see IBOC radios on the shelf in stores is the day when they stop selling *mono* VCRs and TV sets. But you're right, regardless of anything else, the first IBOC recievers to be available will be collector's items -- just as a "spinning disc" color TV set is today, especially since they only made a handful of those before the system was scrapped. From possumhunter@netzero.net Sun Jan 26 20:34:56 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: possumhunter@netzero.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Jan 2003 04:34:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 71572 invoked from network); 27 Jan 2003 04:34:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Jan 2003 04:34:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rly-ip04.mx.aol.com) (64.12.138.8) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Jan 2003 04:34:55 -0000 Received: from logs-wo.proxy.aol.com (logs-wo.proxy.aol.com [205.188.200.6]) by rly-ip04.mx.aol.com (v89.10) with ESMTP id RELAYIN1-0126233125; Sun, 26 Jan 2003 23:31:25 -0500 Received: from ibm (AC8E6FA1.ipt.aol.com [172.142.111.161]) by logs-wo.proxy.aol.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with SMTP id h0R4Xocb310044 for ; Sun, 26 Jan 2003 23:33:51 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <024b01c2c5bd$44e8e640$a16f8eac@aoldsl.net> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: WOR IBOC Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2003 23:30:50 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Apparently-From: DodgeRamTrucker@aol.com From: "Possum Hunter" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 tomray@wor710.com wrote: > 3) The radio, manufacturer unknown, in Kerry's Hummer. Depending on the year model, Hummers have JVC or Delco radios from the factory. Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Sun Jan 26 20:52:43 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: possumhunter@netzero.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Jan 2003 04:52:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 79683 invoked from network); 27 Jan 2003 04:52:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Jan 2003 04:52:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rly-ip05.mx.aol.com) (64.12.138.9) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Jan 2003 04:52:43 -0000 Received: from logs-wo.proxy.aol.com (logs-wo.proxy.aol.com [205.188.200.6]) by rly-ip05.mx.aol.com (v89.10) with ESMTP id RELAYIN4-0126235212; Sun, 26 Jan 2003 23:52:12 -0500 Received: from ibm (AC8E6FA1.ipt.aol.com [172.142.111.161]) by logs-wo.proxy.aol.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with SMTP id h0R4oIcb337803 for ; Sun, 26 Jan 2003 23:50:18 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <026701c2c5bf$9182f7a0$a16f8eac@aoldsl.net> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2003 23:50:07 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Apparently-From: DodgeRamTrucker@aol.com From: "Possum Hunter" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 kevtronics@yahoo.com wrote: > I think the day when we see IBOC radios on the shelf in stores is the day when they stop selling *mono* VCRs and TV sets. You will see Kenwood and Alpine IBOC car radios on the shelf soon. Anyway, it won't be long and there will be NO VCRs on the store shelves. DVD recorders will replace them. I have no idea WHY they are still making and selling analog only TVs. The unknowing public is being screwed by manufactureres who are selling Joe Sixpack a TV that will be useless in just a couple of years when the manditory conversion to HDTV is complete. I think AM IBOC won't be around long. FM IBOC is a great idea and I think it will work there. In fact, I hope ALL FMs go to IBOC as soon as possible so the noise and screwy digital artifacts in the audio will drive listeners over to the analog AM radio station that signs my paycheck! I can hear our liners now "High Fidelity AM Stereo without the digital noise......1600 WFIS, Depend on It!" Kevin From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sun Jan 26 20:57:14 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Jan 2003 04:57:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 24659 invoked from network); 27 Jan 2003 04:57:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Jan 2003 04:57:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Jan 2003 04:57:13 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.142] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Jan 2003 04:57:11 -0000 Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 04:57:11 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: MC 13028 Decoder Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1621 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.30 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "jeffdeck2001 " wrote: > > >I used an Amidon L-43-2 wind your own. You could > >probably use the smaller L-33-2 if desired. The L-43-2 was what is > >available to me at the store. > Which store near you sells these coils? I got them at: Electronic Parts Outlet 3753-B Fondren Houston, TX 77063 1-800-403-3741 http://www.epo-houston.com/default.htm > > >I wound 48 turns of #34 wire and resonated it with a 100pf SM cap. I > >center tapped it at 50% to connect it at pin 13 via a .02uf ceramic > >cap for DC isolation. > Did you run the coil from B+ to ground? Interesting that the L/C > tunes the oscillator in the MC13028, since the oscillator type is not > identical to the one used in the MC13020 chip. > One end of the coil is grounded along with one end of the 100pf cap the other end of the coil is connected to the other end of the 100pf cap. I tapped it at 24 turns (50%) and connected it to pin 13 via a .02uf ceramic cap to isolate the potential DC difference between the grounded coil and the voltage on pin 13. The .02uf cap was arbitrary as it was surplus. You could use any value between .01uf to .1uf I guess. Well I got it installed in a radio an it does go to stereo on 820 WBAP but at 250 miles and poor skywave tonight it comes and goes. Well I guess I'll have to eat my words on L+R being detected with a synchronous detector as I get the familar crackle of an Env Det but it is not as bad as the Env Det in the MC13020 otherwise it seems to work as expected. My eq and notch filtering works great. JSG From JH_Radio@GameBox.net Sun Jan 26 21:15:07 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: JH_Radio@GameBox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Jan 2003 05:15:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 95556 invoked from network); 27 Jan 2003 05:15:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Jan 2003 05:15:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO babyruth.hotpop.com) (204.57.55.14) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Jan 2003 05:15:06 -0000 Received: from gamebox.net (kubrick.hotpop.com [204.57.55.16]) by babyruth.hotpop.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 13924211E60 for ; Mon, 27 Jan 2003 05:14:38 +0000 (UTC) Received: from -enduser.GameBox.net (pcp03184855pcs.benslm01.pa.comcast.net [68.80.77.117]) by smtp-1.hotpop.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5C2FA2F8313 for ; Mon, 27 Jan 2003 05:14:23 +0000 (UTC) Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030127001703.02c9b110@pop.GameBox.net> X-Sender: JH_Radio@pop.GameBox.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 00:18:29 -0500 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Wor IBOC Mime-Version: 1.0 X-HotPOP: ----------------------------------------------- Sent By HotPOP.com FREE Email Get your FREE POP email at www.HotPOP.com ----------------------------------------------- From: John X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113800107 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Now when is the next time WOR uses IBOC? I've heard two differing opinions on this, and well after this I wanna try for myself and see what happens. (Pulling in 10 10 WINS was well hmmm, tricky, perhaps WOR will be the same way? I'll check it out sometime tomorrow. Piece to all. At 12:41 AM 1/27/03 +0000, you wrote: >> Oh. And, incidentally, I believe I have asked you first for the >> name, model, make, and calibration date of the test equipment you >> are using. Give me your information, maybe I'll give you mine. > >My test equipment is every single receiver in my possession. The >list would be too long and too pointless, because you can turn on ANY >radio and it will receive hash and splatter from WOR all the way from >680 to 750 kHz, as well as distorted audio. Once again, if you know >of any radios that do NOT exhibit these effects, I'm sure we'd ALL >love to hear about it so that we can purchase and use these radios >that do not suffer so badly from WOR's use of IBOC. > >> And remove your amplifier from your antenna at home. Overloading >> causes splatter. > >Hah... it's more like WOR itself that causes splatter. Or how else >do you explain the splatter heard from 680 to 750 kHz on a 1985 >Volkswagen radio (OEM model # 176 035 173) with a 3 kHz ceramic >filter and the standard 30-inch unamplified antenna, both at my home >25 miles away from WOR's transmitter, and 45 miles away while driving >in the Princeton, NJ area? Or on a Panasonic RF-HS90 walkman in >these same conditions, again with a 3 kHz filter and using only its >built-in ferrite bar antenna? In that case I have posted a recording >of WOR's nighttime IBOC test in the Files section here, and it >clearly demonstrates "splatter" heard from WOR's signal as far away >as 750 kHz. > >And this splatter happens to sound exactly the same as that of a >regular analog AM station that is overmodulating. It is the same >"scratchy" effect that is "kicked up" by the modulation. So, either >WOR's audio is overmodulated, or there is some other interaction >between your IBOC signal and my radios that is causing this huge area >of splatter across the dial and across the state. > >p.s. I once again remind you that personal attacks will not be >tolerated here. Further offenses will result in your membership >being revoked and a complaint filed against you. > > > >Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Love in Christ: John Bensalem, PA Send me an email Aim: RainAngelsRule MSN: RainAngelsRule@hotmail.com My website Welcome to Napster4TheBlind "Prayer does not change God; it changes you." - Authur unknown [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From JH_Radio@GameBox.net Sun Jan 26 21:16:02 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: JH_Radio@GameBox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Jan 2003 05:16:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 22913 invoked from network); 27 Jan 2003 05:16:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Jan 2003 05:16:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO babyruth.hotpop.com) (204.57.55.14) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Jan 2003 05:16:01 -0000 Received: from gamebox.net (kubrick.hotpop.com [204.57.55.16]) by babyruth.hotpop.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 615BF213106 for ; Mon, 27 Jan 2003 05:15:42 +0000 (UTC) Received: from -enduser.GameBox.net (pcp03184855pcs.benslm01.pa.comcast.net [68.80.77.117]) by smtp-1.hotpop.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 130502F8356 for ; Mon, 27 Jan 2003 05:15:34 +0000 (UTC) Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030127001918.02d01bc0@pop.GameBox.net> X-Sender: JH_Radio@pop.GameBox.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 00:19:39 -0500 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: WOR IBOC Mime-Version: 1.0 X-HotPOP: ----------------------------------------------- Sent By HotPOP.com FREE Email Get your FREE POP email at www.HotPOP.com ----------------------------------------------- From: John X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113800107 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Kevin, Why don't you give it up? I mean come on, I'm 20 and buy now it's like what is the point? Look, if the guys eleagel , the FCC will do something about it, if not then well let it go. Actually no wait, even if he is ealeagel let it go. Iboc is coming to Philly, on FM probably sometime soon. DO I like it, no! Will it destroy DX for me? Hmmm... I imagine it will for the analog DXing I do, but who knows about digital DX? Do I think it'll fail? Yes. Do I think that the clips on the WOR website have artifacts? Yes. I think the analog sounds better. Though I haven't sent it to all my friends. And farther more, this is only my opinion on the subject. See as I see it is, yeah there are those of us who support IBOC, and those of us who don't. Out of all the people that live in this country, m if you walked up the street to so and so and asked, Oh yeah what do you think of the Iboc thing that's startin' to happen around the country. DO you think they will have any idea? Now as for my opinion of the sample, the highs' are tinny with IBOC, and the stereo separation isn't there. But think about it for a second here. Firstly I have hearing impairment, and I may be missing out on either how horrible it is, etc. But who knows, maybe the rest of the public won't agree with me. So it'll work. Either way, things will change. We'll either have to deal with things as they come, or fight it. Okay I don't like CD's, and think vinyl rules. I have this thing about the true wave form on cd not being right because of the digital numbers that are being used. But enough people don't agree with me. If they did, cd's wouldn't still be around. But hey man, it's like find the group that agrees with you. And enjoy what you enjoy. No one else have to enjoy it. It's what makes the world go 'round. But I say this, why not promote AM Stereo for the public? This is the AM Stereo list? I have nothing against either of you, but it's like take the guy up on the offer at least. Maybe you'll learn something. Keep an open mind. Listen to what the guy has to say. Now from what I've read, you seem to have a block going on there, and well dude that ain't cool. Not to mention you won't get along with people with a closed mind. Okay I don't like Iboc, and tom does. I think AM Stereo Rules, and so does DXing. Tom may not. Okay so big deal. Just because we don't agree on everything, that doesn't make either of us wrong or bad. It's just like you liking football and him liking baseball. Plus, everyone's ears are different. Perhaps your hearing something he is not? I want to here this IBOC stuff hash. Personally, I think anyone that will offer free tours of the engineering department and transmitter sites for free is being awfully generous. John - Bensalem, PA. Piece all! At 01:09 AM 1/27/03 +0000, you wrote: >Thanks for the kind words. > >The problem, you see, is that it is easier to sit behind a keyboard >and spew your crap, but it takes guts and willpower to look your >adversary in the eye and do the same. Apparrently Mr. Tekel has >neither, because he has turned down every offer made to him to >investigate the WOR facility. > >Apparrently, Mr. Tekel has taken on the role of FCC Commissioner >here. Maybe he should contact President Bush and request he be >placed on the FCC, he has shown extreme knowlege of the rules. > >As you know, you and I don't agree on IBOC. Do we hate each other? >No. Do we get along? Yes. Will I root for the Yankees when the Red >Sox are in town? Growing up in New England, the answer is an obvious >no. Will you razz me if the Yanks kick their butts into the next >state? You bet! If and when IBOC goes through the Commission, will >I stick my tongue out at you and say, "told you so!"? Yup. If IBOC >doesn't go through, will you stick your tongue out at me and >say "told you so!"? I expect you to. Will we shake hands and get a >brew? Yes to that, too. Life is too short to go through it with an >attitude hating people. > >I fully expect never to meet Mr. Tekel in person, as I don't think he >has the intestinal fortitude to confront, in person, someone who >looks right through him and calls his bluff. It's better to remain >ignorant and mouth off than to get educated so that you can argue on >the same level. > >No. Apparrently, bullies never change, and I'm tired of Mr. Tekel's >bullying. > >Those who showed up at our open house discovered that we know what >we're doing, that we are operating legally, and found out what IBOC >is about. They may still not like it, but they took the initive to >get an education and now have an appreciation of what it's all about, >and that's all I ask for before someone proclaims their grand >knowlege of the situation. And they also found out that Kerry and I >are not the monsters Mr. Tekel proclaims us to be. I hope those of >you who frequent this board are starting to see him for what he is. > > > > > >--- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "wgliradio >" wrote: >> I would encourage anyone who has any dobuts to visit with Mr. Ray >at >> the WOR facility. They have NOTHING to hide, trust me. > > >Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Love in Christ: John Bensalem, PA Send me an email Aim: RainAngelsRule MSN: RainAngelsRule@hotmail.com My website Welcome to Napster4TheBlind "Prayer does not change God; it changes you." - Authur unknown [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From JH_Radio@GameBox.net Sun Jan 26 21:17:10 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: JH_Radio@GameBox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Jan 2003 05:17:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 6820 invoked from network); 27 Jan 2003 05:17:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Jan 2003 05:17:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO babyruth.hotpop.com) (204.57.55.14) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Jan 2003 05:17:10 -0000 Received: from gamebox.net (kubrick.hotpop.com [204.57.55.16]) by babyruth.hotpop.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 616D12133AF for ; Mon, 27 Jan 2003 05:16:52 +0000 (UTC) Received: from -enduser.GameBox.net (pcp03184855pcs.benslm01.pa.comcast.net [68.80.77.117]) by smtp-1.hotpop.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DE28A2F8142 for ; Mon, 27 Jan 2003 05:16:47 +0000 (UTC) Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030127002026.02d2a490@pop.GameBox.net> X-Sender: JH_Radio@pop.GameBox.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 00:20:58 -0500 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Note To AM Stereo Forum Members. Mime-Version: 1.0 X-HotPOP: ----------------------------------------------- Sent By HotPOP.com FREE Email Get your FREE POP email at www.HotPOP.com ----------------------------------------------- From: John X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113800107 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Kevin, Personally though i don't agree with the Iboc on his side of things find his threads rather interesting. OR at least what he said. I think you are being unfair. Let's see, he banned you from e-mailing him. Then he comes on here to post his thoughts in answer to your questions, witch he didn't want to do. Then you tell him he's offensive, and ban him? I guess I'm next on the ban list for saying something that you don't agree with? That's sad. I don't think he used language that was offensive. Even "ass" you can get away with on the public airwaves. I think you should reconsider. This is person number three that didn't agree with your findings. Farther more, don't you think it should be a decision from the in tire list as to who gets banned and why? It is how I run my list. If there is a problem, I get the whole lists feedback both personally, and on my list. The answer that most people say is the way I make rules. I think that's only fair. Yeah I know I own the list. Yeah I know I could be a stickler, but I'm not that way. I'm on plenty of lists that things are runt that way. I'm more for the people. It is a way to get people to feel that when they m say something on your list they are being listen to buy the owner and that if they say something, as far as implementing rules that there thoughts actually mean something. Also, I have gotten e-mails personally thanking me for running my list the way I do. Just a friendly sujustion. John At 09:31 PM 1/26/03 -0500, you wrote: >> Due to his personal attacks and offensive remarks, Mr. Tom Ray is >> no longer allowed to post messages to the AM Stereo Forum, and his >> messages have been removed from the archives. >> > >Thats quite unfortunate.Censorship at its highest! > >> Since Mr. Ray took advantage of the Forum's ability for non-members >> to post messages, I have unfortunately had to suspend that privilege, >> at least temporarily. Anybody can still view the Forum messages on >> the web, but those who wish to post messages must become a member of >> the Forum. > >Mr Ray was rightfully defending his and WOR's position with regards to IBOC >and the things that have been said.To "cut off" his ability to do so whether >anyone likes or dislikes IBOC is wrong....period! and childish to boot! > > >> >> If WOR wishes to present their side of the issues regarding IBOC in >> this Forum, they are certainly welcome to do so, as long as they can >> find someone who can engage in constructive discussions without >> resorting to name-calling and offensive language. >> > >Uhm...let me see...I'm confused now as many others probably are now as well. >You "cut him off" from posting to the list...but yet you say this? >Bottom line is this.....Tom and Kerry have every right to be highly P.Oed >about what a certain individual is propagating all over the place. >As far as my presence here now...its solely for the entertainment.The >creditablitiy of this forum and what it is about is most certainly at rock >bottom...a big fat ZERO. >Its sad to see the lines of communication fall apart like it has. > >Bob Carter >Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group > >WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 >Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 > >Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering >services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. >e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net >Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC > WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC > WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC > Ray Communications Radio Network > >AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- >amstereo-subcribe@topica.com > > KC4QLP Amateur Radio > Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va > www.kc4qlp.cjb.net >_______________________________________________________ > > >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > >Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Love in Christ: John Bensalem, PA Send me an email Aim: RainAngelsRule MSN: RainAngelsRule@hotmail.com My website Welcome to Napster4TheBlind "Prayer does not change God; it changes you." - Authur unknown [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sun Jan 26 21:37:40 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Jan 2003 05:37:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 2145 invoked from network); 27 Jan 2003 05:37:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Jan 2003 05:37:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.83) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Jan 2003 05:37:39 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.176] by n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Jan 2003 05:37:39 -0000 Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 05:37:39 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: IBOC Rhetoric Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 1302 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.30 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst Rand Mode =3D ON I feel that my current posts about my decoder work have gone unnoticed by some because of the dwelling on IBOC. I guess I picked the wrong time to talk about it. At least a few people have taken interest. This forum is supposed productive and I think this qualifies. Most agree that IBOC is bad for analog radio but I don't beleive that WOR is operating illegally if they are transmitting the primary sidebands at -6dB of what iBiquity recomended. If I wasn't half way across the country I would probably take the tour of WOR. I think it is childish to delete posts in this situation. Seems to me that the previous AMS list suffered its demise because of this blacklisting. Rand Mode =3D OFF Now lets get back to buisness. The decoder I have designed Tries to follow the NRSC De-Emphasis and has 10KHz notch filters so this hopefully should make it AMAX compliant. It uses the MC13028 chip and I have it working with a LC oscillator instead of a ceramic resonator. I think this is signifigant since the resonators are getting hard to find. It also uses a surplus 455KHz =B17.5KHz ceramic filter for=20 mechanically tuned radios from a 50MHz cordless phone which=20 is similar to what is in the Chrysler Radios except it is a butterworth response and is not Group Delay Controlled. JSG From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Sun Jan 26 21:38:39 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Jan 2003 05:38:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 34604 invoked from network); 27 Jan 2003 05:38:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Jan 2003 05:38:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14202.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.144) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Jan 2003 05:38:39 -0000 Message-ID: <20030127053839.29202.qmail@web14202.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.164.240.72] by web14202.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 26 Jan 2003 21:38:39 PST Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2003 21:38:39 -0800 (PST) Subject: Verify WSAI? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio What's going on with WSAI? I get a 'stereo' pilot on a multi-mode receiver with pilot detection and on a Delco. True stereo, or just phase mod issues? __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Jan 26 22:14:15 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Jan 2003 06:14:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 50942 invoked from network); 27 Jan 2003 06:14:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Jan 2003 06:14:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.87) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Jan 2003 06:14:14 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.161] by n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Jan 2003 06:14:14 -0000 Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 06:14:13 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Verify WSAI? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20030127053839.29202.qmail@web14202.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 567 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.74.145 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > What's going on with WSAI? I get a 'stereo' pilot on a multi-mode > receiver with pilot detection and on a Delco. True stereo, or just > phase mod issues? For the past few nights, I have also been getting an AM Stereo indication from 1530 WSAI. I think it is pretty certain that they are transmitting a C-Quam pilot tone... but so far, no actual Stereo separation has been heard in their audio. By the way, WSAI is owned by Clear Channel. It is nice to see that one of their flagship 50,000-watt stations is showing at least some support for AM Stereo. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Jan 26 22:36:59 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Jan 2003 06:36:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 93066 invoked from network); 27 Jan 2003 06:36:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Jan 2003 06:36:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.67) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Jan 2003 06:36:58 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.129] by n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Jan 2003 06:36:58 -0000 Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 06:36:56 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: IBOC Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <026701c2c5bf$9182f7a0$a16f8eac@aoldsl.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 938 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.74.145 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > FM IBOC is a great idea and I think it will work there. In fact, I > hope ALL FMs go to IBOC as soon as possible so the noise and screwy > digital artifacts in the audio will drive listeners over to the > analog AM radio station that signs my paycheck! Here in NJ, there is one FM station that goes by the on-air name "Digital 102.7"... but fear not, they aren't using IBOC; that's just what they call themselves. I wonder if they'll change it to "Analog 102.7" if/when some of their competitors start using IBOC.... > I can hear our liners now "High Fidelity AM Stereo without the > digital noise..... 1600 WFIS, Depend on It!" Some of my favorite liners were on the now-defunct 1590 WERA in Plainfield, NJ, including such classics as "The world's first FM station on the AM dial... 1590 WERA!" and also numerous IDs as "AM Stereo" even though they never broadcast in Stereo and never even had any plans to upgrade to Stereo. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Jan 26 23:27:58 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Jan 2003 07:27:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 35178 invoked from network); 27 Jan 2003 07:27:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Jan 2003 07:27:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Jan 2003 07:27:57 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.141] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Jan 2003 07:27:56 -0000 Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 07:27:53 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Get ready for KB-1520 Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 480 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.74.145 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics The debut of 1520 WWKB's new music format is just hours away, at 6:00 AM EST.... but the big question is, will their AM Stereo be turned back on in time to accompany it? In any event, for those who are within listening range of their signal and are getting up early (or staying up very late!), it might be worthwhile to tune in and listen to the next step in what may turn out to be the renaissance of popular music formats on the big 50,000-watt AM and AM Stereo stations. From amfmdx@fastq.com Sun Jan 26 23:29:55 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Jan 2003 07:29:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 72823 invoked from network); 27 Jan 2003 07:29:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Jan 2003 07:29:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Jan 2003 07:29:54 -0000 Received: from fastq (d24-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.56]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id h0R7TqP50397 for ; Mon, 27 Jan 2003 00:29:52 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <002f01c2c5d5$c49c9fe0$38f9bed8@com> To: Subject: For Tom Ray Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 00:29:01 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla ---Tom Ray said---- >And I'd be careful how you word things directed towards me and WOR >from now on. I can consider your message a threat, and Lyndhurst PD >has requested I keep and forward copies of all messages aimed at me >or WOR to them. They are particularly interested in threats, as WOR >is a major player in NJ's Homeland security plan, and I sit on the NJ >homeland security committee. Tom, Does your boss at Buckley know that you are carrying on like this? Really, I am not going to talk about IBOC, I feel something is this nature is quite unprofessional. Please, leave this off list it casts a poor light on you and what you are doing. Really, I must ask if you are really doing the right thing. You ought to take a lesson of looking at the way Paul Jellison at WLW has handled this. It would help you greatly. Kevin Redding Mesa, Arizona "Its going to get a lot worse before it gets worse" - Lily Tomlin From ian_davidson@hotmail.com Mon Jan 27 01:22:46 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ian_davidson@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Jan 2003 09:22:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 99823 invoked from network); 27 Jan 2003 09:22:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Jan 2003 09:22:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.15.178) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Jan 2003 09:22:45 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 27 Jan 2003 01:21:24 -0800 Received: from 138.194.15.102 by lw10fd.law10.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Mon, 27 Jan 2003 09:21:24 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Re: {AMSF} It's official... Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 20:21:24 +1100 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 27 Jan 2003 09:21:24.0995 (UTC) FILETIME=[76BB1530:01C2C5E5] From: "Ian Davidson" X-Originating-IP: [138.194.15.102] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83045090 Oooops. Sorry - I forgot you can't put the list address in the cc field. For a moment there I thought I'd been flung ... and have to return as the Madman from Mars. [this message may be a bit redundant as I've just got 30 hours of e-mails in one hit - and haven't read all the huge pile of stuff yet] ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 19:28:27 +1100 (EST) From: Ian Davidson To: tomray@wor710.com Cc: amstereoforum Subject: Re: {AMSF} It's official... On Sun, 26 Jan 2003, wortomray wrote: >Ian: > >To briefly answer you....I am extremely proud of my "whiz-bang" >technology. The majority of AM stations are hurting financially. >Granted, programming is part of the equation, but AM audio quality is >the pits and younger listeners have no clue what AM is. To bring >back the listeners, part of the equation is the audio quality. Thanks Tom I am stuck like a shag on a rock out here in Oz. My main agenda is that I want to here my favourite radio stations (which happen to be AM) in hi-fi stereo. I've been fortunate enough to have had at least one - usually two - 24/7 AMS music stations to listen to since 1985. More at the start - before a couple "defected" to the FM band - and drastically altered their programming. Otherwise I may have followed them. I'm not technical - and don't care about the engineering side. I just know what I hear - and what I want to hear. Every report I've ever read about IBOC has been dismal - except those coming from people connected with IBOC. If it worked - or even if iBiquity gets it working - and was here - I'd buy two new radios tomorrow! And plenty more. I love radio. The trouble here is they've been talking about digital radio being "just around the corner" for 13 years. Unfortunately IBOC seems to have only muddied the waters here and set digital radio back another five or six years (according to Radio Australia) as it has entered the field as another contender with Eureka and DRM. We now have to wait (... and my - how we've waited) till it succeeds or fails in the US. I am angry. With networking, globalism, and beancounters. Radio was much better when run by people who loved and nurtured it. I'm also angry with the FCC - intially for the way it introduced AM stereo - and now similarly with IBOC. You may as well have it privatised. I'm also angry with the NAB which doesn't seem to do anything for small struggling stations (probably members). I'm equally angry about our CRA (Oz commercial broadcasters) for continually sitting on the fence. AM radio in Oz is very good! It continually gets about 47% of all listeners. I don't want these damn good stations to change overnight because of some pie in the sky transmission system. All I want is to be able to hear them (talk/sport/news/music/etc) in hi-fi stereo. Good luck with what you're doing. And PLEASE do it and get it over with quickly. (My e-mail has been down for 30 hours so I haven't read all that's gone before yet - except one saying that you'd been flung from the list. If so I'm sorry - and don't think it's at all fair.) Thanks! for your contributions. I hope your grandson remembers you well. Maybe like the king in "The King and I". Maybe not for what he brilliantly did but for being a man who tried ... And I mean that nicely. I think. Ian Melbourne _________________________________________________________________ Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963 From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Mon Jan 27 04:28:07 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Jan 2003 12:28:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 63538 invoked from network); 27 Jan 2003 12:28:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Jan 2003 12:28:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf40bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.63) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Jan 2003 12:28:07 -0000 Received: from juan ([68.153.68.61]) by imf40bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.25 201-253-122-122-125-20020815) with SMTP id <20030127123003.EOYT9581.imf40bis.bellsouth.net@juan> for ; Mon, 27 Jan 2003 07:30:03 -0500 Message-ID: <002301c2c5ff$8e024140$af78fea9@juan> To: References: <026701c2c5bf$9182f7a0$a16f8eac@aoldsl.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 07:28:10 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ----- Original Message ----- From: Possum Hunter To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, January 26, 2003 11:50 PM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC kevtronics@yahoo.com wrote: > I think the day when we see IBOC radios on the shelf in stores is the day when they stop selling *mono* VCRs and TV sets. You will see Kenwood and Alpine IBOC car radios on the shelf soon. Anyway, it won't be long and there will be NO VCRs on the store shelves. DVD recorders will replace them. I have no idea WHY they are still making and selling analog only TVs. The unknowing public is being screwed by manufactureres who are selling Joe Sixpack a TV that will be useless in just a couple of years when the manditory conversion to HDTV is complete. How much are Digital converters for DTV ? I keep hearing about them, and have yet to find one. There's enough Digital TV here to warrant buying one, but where ? Juan [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From amstereoguy@hotmail.com Mon Jan 27 04:39:01 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereoguy@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Jan 2003 12:39:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 11003 invoked from network); 27 Jan 2003 12:39:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Jan 2003 12:39:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (207.68.165.33) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Jan 2003 12:39:01 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 27 Jan 2003 04:39:00 -0800 Received: from 208.228.96.20 by sea2fd.sea2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Mon, 27 Jan 2003 12:39:00 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 07:39:00 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 27 Jan 2003 12:39:00.0926 (UTC) FILETIME=[116A95E0:01C2C601] From: "Chris Cuff" X-Originating-IP: [208.228.96.20] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37866059 There are 103 listed on ebay right now. search "HDTV Receiver" CC >From: "Juan / John Gualda" >Reply-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com > > How much are Digital converters for DTV ? I keep hearing about them, and >have yet to find one. There's enough Digital TV here to warrant buying one, >but where ? > > > Juan _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 helps eliminate e-mail viruses. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus From possumhunter@netzero.net Mon Jan 27 05:37:01 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: possumhunter@netzero.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Jan 2003 13:37:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 87549 invoked from network); 27 Jan 2003 13:37:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Jan 2003 13:37:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rly-ip04.mx.aol.com) (64.12.138.8) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Jan 2003 13:37:00 -0000 Received: from logs-tn.proxy.aol.com (logs-tn.proxy.aol.com [152.163.207.5]) by rly-ip04.mx.aol.com (v89.10) with ESMTP id RELAYIN4-0127083318; Mon, 27 Jan 2003 08:33:18 -0500 Received: from ibm (AC9E1920.ipt.aol.com [172.158.25.32]) by logs-tn.proxy.aol.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with SMTP id h0RDZtuI239167 for ; Mon, 27 Jan 2003 08:35:56 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <006601c2c608$ff2a5e80$20199eac@aoldsl.net> To: References: <026701c2c5bf$9182f7a0$a16f8eac@aoldsl.net> <002301c2c5ff$8e024140$af78fea9@juan> Subject: HDTV was: IBOC Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 08:35:44 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Apparently-From: DodgeRamTrucker@aol.com From: "Possum Hunter" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Juan / John Gualda wrote: > How much are Digital converters for DTV ? I keep hearing about them, and have yet to find one. There's enough Digital TV here to warrant buying one, but where ? Our local Best Buy sells one made by Samsung. The picture is awful. I don't remember the price. Kevin From philipr@irac.pe.ca Mon Jan 27 06:35:05 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Jan 2003 14:35:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 24866 invoked from network); 27 Jan 2003 14:35:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Jan 2003 14:35:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Jan 2003 14:35:04 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.248] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Jan 2003 14:35:04 -0000 Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 14:35:03 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: For the good of AM Radio... Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3905 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking Folks, for the good of AM radio, radio in general and in respect of human beings everywhere - let's shake hands and agree to disagree. I'm skeptical of IBOC, and I don't think it will catch on - but - I could be wrong. I know CQUAM AM Stereo sounds great - but what if in the mid to late 80s I had bought a TM-152, heard muddy AM stereo, and been "turned off"? Lucky for me that as a teenager, I heard my brother's Heathkit PT-1 that proved that AM can sound great. So, anything is possible - and IBOC may improve greatly - with the help of people like Tom who passionately believe in it. If IBOC is interfering with another station's signal, it would be make sense that the station experiencing interference would complain. It's fine to report personal observations - put them on the record, then move forward. Let's not burn any bridges here - should IBOC bomb, some of that technology might be reborn in CQUAM and we might find ourselves working together with Tom for the betterment of AM radio and radio in general. Should IBOC succeed, we need to focus on why we love AM - its potential, its DX capabilities, work at better digital compression techniques and try to preserve as much as we can. Personally, I don't think AM IBOC will succeed - but I think it just might end up making a wonderful contributuion to AM radio, through another form - perhaps. It is getting people interested in AM again - that's positive. It's creating open debate - that's positive as well. Assuming IBOC radios make it to the market at reasonable prices, I will likely get one fron the USA [they won't be sold here in Canada as the technology was long ago rejected in favour of Eureka 147 L- Band DAB] as a collectors item, and because IBOC DX could be rather fascinating. I'm a radio junkie, always have been, always will be. Moving away from this topic, I experimented with using a select-a- tenna as an antenna tuner for the Alfredo Lite transmitter. I used the 541-M [has the 1/8 inch jack on the front]. Simply feed the antenna in series - e.g. run the A-L into the SAT, then out again to the antenna. It certainly improves signal strength - and I found it seems to improve stereo performance too. My Sony SRF-42 is very hard to tune and get any amount of separation - but this changed dramatically with the SAT used on the transmitter end. While dedicating a SAT for this use may be a little pricey, if you have the 541M already, you can use it for this purpose, then simply unplug for the SAT's intended role of DXing. If you are thinking of buying a SAT, consider the extra $10 for the jack - its fun to hook it up to an oscillioscope too and examine the broadcast waveforms of local strong signals on the AM band. For those of you who have home made SATs, try them with an A-L. I tuned in WWKB this morning, but alas - they are in mono. Still, it was enjoyable to listen to them demolish their old format. They played a collage [sounding like Martha Stewart here] of old jingles, including a Stereo 15 jingle - so there is some hope. I also learned this morning while listening to WWKB an ICF SW-77 three feet from an active light dimmer that some of the new light dimmers are much better than their forbearers - hmmm, if they can improve light dimmers this much - maybe there is hope for IBOC! lol Remember, you can attract more flies with honey than with a flyswatter. Phil R. P.S. If I ever find myself in New York / New Jersey on vacation, I would love to tour WTTM's transmitter site and WOR's as well. Give a thumbs up to a CE who really believes in what he or she is doing - whether CQUAM or IBOC. Give a thumbs up to listeners as well - whether DXer's or audio critics, or hybrids of the two. People should feel free to report interference - although interference sometimes may have surprising, and legal, causes. From spfleck@citlink.net Mon Jan 27 06:46:07 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: spfleck@citlink.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Jan 2003 14:46:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 17435 invoked from network); 27 Jan 2003 14:46:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Jan 2003 14:46:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Jan 2003 14:46:07 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.155] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Jan 2003 14:46:05 -0000 Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 14:46:04 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: lunatics, gorillas and sledge hammers - IBOC vs the world Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1784 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Steve Fleckenstein " X-Originating-IP: 209.63.51.143 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=2988995 X-Yahoo-Profile: n2ubp I've been watching this IBOC discussion degrade into another WWF challenge. It is sad to see the technically astute on both sides get down to the level of " I don't like what you are saying so I'm gonna tell my mommy or daddy on you and get you to agree with me no matter what or force you to shut up." as well as "I gotta cram my religion down this guys throat to make my point." From my personal standpoint, a professed stupid uneducated end user of AM radio with no particular care as to what the final decision turns out to be, the WOR IBOC signal was not good the first week of IBOC transmissions in the Middletown, NY area. After the first week the birdies went away and the audio was cleaner on my cranky old traditional AM/FM K-Mart sourced radios. Sometimes the attitude read into e-mail is not a reflection of the senders desires. Keep this in mind when responding to each other with flame throwers. This observation made as a old time SysOp of a landline BBS back in the old days, FIDONET NEC and all for 10 years. I suggest everyone take a step back from the table and reflect on the stupidity of where this is going. Threatening to go to the FCC, ARRL, local police, big brother, Uncle Floyd, whoever because someone doesn't like what someone else is saying, boasting about how powerful they are in the land of Oz makes one look desperate and foolish rather than a PROFESSIONAL. I hope both sides take the high road on this issue and discuss the technical issues rather than brow beating each other. A little mutual respect would go a long way. I will shut up now and crawl back into my Igloo. Any threats to me from either sides due to my personal remarks above will result in instant addition of your e-mail address to my kill file. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Jan 27 07:14:18 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Jan 2003 15:14:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 34138 invoked from network); 27 Jan 2003 15:14:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Jan 2003 15:14:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Jan 2003 15:14:18 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.186] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Jan 2003 15:14:18 -0000 Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 15:14:16 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: HDTV Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <002301c2c5ff$8e024140$af78fea9@juan> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 910 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > How much are Digital converters for DTV ? I keep hearing about > them, and have yet to find one. There's enough Digital TV here to > warrant buying one, but where ? In addition, the majority of new digital TVs sold are still only "HDTV-Ready" or "HDTV Monitors", where a separate HDTV tuner box is required to receive on-air HDTV broadcasts. I suppose it's partly because of lack of consumer demand for true fully-equipped HDTVs (as "everybody" has cable or satellite), and also partly because of the chance to get people to pay TWICE for expensive new equipment -- first, thousands of dollars for an "HDTV-Ready" TV set, and then an additional few hundred for the separate HDTV tuner box. I even see some of these non-HDTV-equipped digital TV sets being advertised as having a "Built-In NTSC Tuner".... gee, the same as any other TV set manufactured within the past half-century! From philipr@irac.pe.ca Mon Jan 27 07:21:06 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Jan 2003 15:21:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 99967 invoked from network); 27 Jan 2003 15:21:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Jan 2003 15:21:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Jan 2003 15:21:06 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.179] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Jan 2003 15:20:59 -0000 Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 15:20:58 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: lunatics, gorillas and sledge hammers - IBOC vs the world Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1988 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking I agree. Phil R. --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Fleckenstein " wrote: > I've been watching this IBOC discussion degrade into another WWF > challenge. > > It is sad to see the technically astute on both sides get down to > the level of " I don't like what you are saying so I'm gonna tell my > mommy or daddy on you and get you to agree with me no matter what or > force you to shut up." as well as "I gotta cram my religion down this > guys throat to make my point." > > From my personal standpoint, a professed stupid uneducated end user > of AM radio with no particular care as to what the final decision > turns out to be, the WOR IBOC signal was not good the first week of > IBOC transmissions in the Middletown, NY area. After the first week > the birdies went away and the audio was cleaner on my cranky old > traditional AM/FM K-Mart sourced radios. > > Sometimes the attitude read into e-mail is not a reflection of the > senders desires. Keep this in mind when responding to each other with > flame throwers. This observation made as a old time SysOp of a > landline BBS back in the old days, FIDONET NEC and all for 10 years. > > I suggest everyone take a step back from the table and reflect on > the stupidity of where this is going. Threatening to go to the FCC, > ARRL, local police, big brother, Uncle Floyd, whoever because someone > doesn't like what someone else is saying, boasting about how powerful > they are in the land of Oz makes one look desperate and foolish > rather than a PROFESSIONAL. > > I hope both sides take the high road on this issue and discuss the > technical issues rather than brow beating each other. > > A little mutual respect would go a long way. > > I will shut up now and crawl back into my Igloo. > > Any threats to me from either sides due to my personal remarks above > will result in instant addition of your e-mail address to my kill > file. From jwelton@nautel.com Mon Jan 27 07:40:20 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jwelton@nautel.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Jan 2003 15:40:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 19681 invoked from network); 27 Jan 2003 15:40:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Jan 2003 15:40:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailserver.nautel.com) (24.222.25.85) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Jan 2003 15:40:19 -0000 Received: FROM jeff-welton BY mailserver.nautel.com ; Mon Jan 27 11:40:50 2003 -0400 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 11:37:35 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: {AMSF} OT: IBOC, ABUSE AND WASTED BANDWIDTH Message-ID: <3E3519FD.6907.AC7F93@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.02a) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body From: "Jeff Welton" Reply-To: jwelton@nautel.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=26918678 Okay, guys (and ladies, if applicable), enough is enough. 120 messages in my mailbox from this forum this morning. 50 were concerned with AM stereo. 52 were anti-IBOC, or totally IBOC related, with nothing to do with AM stereo. 16 were off-topic and not identified as such, but were at least interesting. 2 were off-topic and identified as such, thus easy to skip over (thanks, Eric!) I spent over an hour of my time pressing and and only about half of that time reading the messages which interested me. (nice site pics, Rusty - as I recall, the primary reason that WBBR junked the 317 was that no one was interested in coming to get it in the time frame they had to remove it - it was in the garage downstairs when I was there in August. They had originally planned, I believe, to relocate it to South America - that must have fallen through). Regardless, I get about 200 emails every Monday morning, and about 50 every other day of the week. The forum and other listserver emails are auto-sorted by Pegasus, so I can respond to customers (and delete my daily quota of spam) first, then review the lists. I don't have time to read every message in detail unless it directly affects my job, so I tend to do a lot of skimming and deleting. I had to do more than usual today, and the number of off-topic posts, especially the less than civil type, was amazing. I threatened this before, during a particular episode of bashing of one of the major radio groups, then held back and things died down. I'm hoping that will happen here, but in the meantime, I don't have time to spend half an hour a day culling the garbage in search of a pearl. Therefore, my time on this forum will have to be limited to personal time at home, which my social director will probably limit to once a week, so responses may not be as prompt as I would hope. If anyone has a question that requires a more urgent response, contact me directly. Depending on message volume and the trash:pearls ratio, I hope to change this in the future. Regards, Jeff Welton Nautel Customer Service Dept. Tel.: 1-902-823-3900 ext. 127 Fax: 1-902-823-3183 email: jwelton@nautel.com From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Jan 27 07:58:14 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Jan 2003 15:58:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 58556 invoked from network); 27 Jan 2003 15:58:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Jan 2003 15:58:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Jan 2003 15:58:14 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.174] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Jan 2003 15:58:14 -0000 Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 15:58:10 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Fwd: Radio 3 Samples Off DAB and FM Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1316 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics I haven't had a chance to listen to these samples myself yet, but it should be an interesting comparison between digital Eureka-147 DAB and regular analog FM Stereo... this is from the "alt.radio.digital" newsgroup: ===================================================================== From: DAB sounds worse than FM, in the UK (info@remove_this.digitalradiotech.co.uk) Subject: Radio 3 Samples Off DAB and FM Newsgroups: alt.radio.digital Date: 2003-01-22 16:26:12 PST Mat asked me to grab a sample of Radio 3 off FM and DAB to compare the stereo image because Andrew Virnuls said that the stereo image was much better on FM than on DAB. I recorded the raw 192kbps mp2 stream off DAB using the Modular Tech card and I recorded the analogue input to my sound card from my Denon FM tuner then encoded this to mp3 at 256kbps discrete stereo using Lame 3.93, lowpass filtered at 16kHz because it was off FM. These files can be downloaded from: http://www.digitalradiotech.co.uk/Radio_3_FM.mp3 http://www.digitalradiotech.co.uk/Radio_3_DAB.mp2 -- DAB sounds worse than FM - so put Radios 1-4 on DTT at 192kbps please "BBC DAB is no longer a hi-fi medium" - BBC Reception Advice www.digitalradiotech.co.uk -- Subscribe for free to the DAB Listeners Group Newsletter From jbyrns@enteract.com Mon Jan 27 08:08:39 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Jan 2003 16:08:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 39453 invoked from network); 27 Jan 2003 16:08:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Jan 2003 16:08:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Jan 2003 16:08:39 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.131] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Jan 2003 16:08:35 -0000 Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 16:08:35 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} OT: IBOC, ABUSE AND WASTED BANDWIDTH Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3E3519FD.6907.AC7F93@localhost> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 461 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.98.22 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Jeff Welton" wrote: > Okay, guys (and ladies, if applicable), enough is enough. > > 120 messages in my mailbox from this forum this morning. > > 50 were concerned with AM stereo. > 52 were anti-IBOC, or totally IBOC related, with nothing to do with AM stereo. What do you mean the "IBOC" messages had nothing to do with "AM stereo", "IBOC", or "HD radio" is the AM stereo system of the future. John From jsgil@hal-pc.org Mon Jan 27 08:55:07 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Jan 2003 16:55:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 59341 invoked from network); 27 Jan 2003 16:55:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Jan 2003 16:55:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Jan 2003 16:55:06 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.154] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Jan 2003 16:55:06 -0000 Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 16:55:05 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} OT: IBOC, ABUSE AND WASTED BANDWIDTH Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1210 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.201 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " wrote: > > > What do you mean the "IBOC" messages had nothing to do with "AM > stereo", "IBOC", or "HD radio" is the AM stereo system of the future. > > John This has yet to be seen. If you remember the IBOC-AM quality was going to be FM Stereo quality. A properly processed FM signal that is not a victum of the loudness wars is near CD quality. With a high quality home receiver with a good antenna you can't beat this. In some cases it is hard to tell the difference between FM and CD. In encoding MP3s my opinion is that it would take a bitrate of equal to or greater 128kbps VBR with the best encoder and no SBR. The original max bitrate was 92kbps Stereo which is not enough but from what I have heard only 36kbps Mono is being used with SBR. They are going to have to a lot better than this before I will convert. As it is now the faux treble SBR just doesn't cut it. At this point AM Stereo sounds better with a higher true frequency response at 10.2KHz. SBR could be used with analog AM to replicate the 10.2-15KHz and would still sound better than IBOC which has much greater SBR to original signal ratio. JSG From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Jan 27 09:05:13 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Jan 2003 17:05:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 15207 invoked from network); 27 Jan 2003 17:05:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Jan 2003 17:05:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.75) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Jan 2003 17:05:12 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.172] by n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Jan 2003 17:05:12 -0000 Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 17:05:09 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: OT: IBOC, ABUSE AND WASTED BANDWIDTH Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 882 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > What do you mean the "IBOC" messages had nothing to do with > "AM stereo", "IBOC", or "HD radio" is the AM stereo system of the > future. As of yet, that has yet to be proven, and IBOC/"HD Radio" does not currently offer Stereo sound on the AM band. However, you are correct that discussions about IBOC are entirely relevant to the topic of this Forum, as are discussions about the European DRM system. Both have the *potential* to cause significant change in the status of the AM/MW band -- for better or worse, that has yet to be conclusively determined, but in any event, widespread use of these digital systems *will* cause a change in the way AM radio is transmitted and received. And as much as many of us prefer the existing analog AM and AM Stereo systems, we must keep on top of that in order for this Forum to maintain its purpose and usefulness. From philipr@irac.pe.ca Mon Jan 27 09:11:56 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Jan 2003 17:11:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 35264 invoked from network); 27 Jan 2003 17:11:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Jan 2003 17:11:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Jan 2003 17:11:55 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.143] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Jan 2003 17:11:54 -0000 Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 17:11:54 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} OT: IBOC, ABUSE AND WASTED BANDWIDTH Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1367 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " wrote: > What do you mean the "IBOC" messages had nothing to do with "AM > stereo", "IBOC", or "HD radio" is the AM stereo system of the future. > > John That's a matter of opinion, and a matter of debate. First, we'll have to see if AM IBOC can be upgraded to stereo - at this point, my understanding is that its just mono - they're working on the stereo part. Second, we'll have to see if the performance improves [e.g. minimizing digital artifacts], third, see if receiver manufacturers can make decent HD receivers at affordable prices and finally, will the public embrace it? Perhaps we can agree that AM radio's future depends on improving the way it can be received by consumers - whether by AMAX CQUAM or IBOC. We know its possible to produce great sounding CQUAM receivers - even at very affordable prices. The jury is still out - it will be out for some time. However, I think we should be careful not to "trash" IBOC, just as IBOC supporters should be careful not to "trash" CQUAM AM Stereo. Point out IBOC's shortcomings, yes, but keep an open mind. I suspect that Jeff, like countless others, myself included, has grown tired of petty bickering between otherwise very intelligent, good folks who have so much to contribute to AM radio. Phil R. From jwelton@nautel.com Mon Jan 27 09:18:47 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jwelton@nautel.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Jan 2003 17:18:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 36130 invoked from network); 27 Jan 2003 17:18:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Jan 2003 17:18:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailserver.nautel.com) (24.222.25.85) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Jan 2003 17:18:45 -0000 Received: FROM jeff-welton BY mailserver.nautel.com ; Mon Jan 27 13:19:15 2003 -0400 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 13:16:01 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: {AMSF} OT: IBOC, ABUSE AND WASTED BANDWIDTH Message-ID: <3E35310E.1850.1069A9D@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: References: <3E3519FD.6907.AC7F93@localhost> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.02a) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body From: "Jeff Welton" Reply-To: jwelton@nautel.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=26918678 > What do you mean the "IBOC" messages had nothing to do with "AM > stereo", "IBOC", or "HD radio" is the AM stereo system of the future. Maybe I should have phrased this differently: "52 were IBOC related, of which 51 were back and forth flamefests, or condemnations/justifications of same, which did nothing to advance AM stereo interests, IBOC, broadcasting or anything else. One was a "reasonable message", in which JSG (wish I knew your name) presented a possible explanation of how a receiver could detect IBOC hash outside the passband even when it is in acceptable limits." Because I have an interest in IBOC, as well as AM stereo, I read all of those posts, even the less diplomatic ones, as I frequently learn things this way. Unfortunately, the above referenced 51 messages brought nothing to the table. I hope this is more clear. Regards, Jeff Welton Nautel Customer Service Dept. Tel.: 1-902-823-3900 ext. 127 Fax: 1-902-823-3183 email: jwelton@nautel.com From krichards@wor710.com Mon Jan 27 09:49:11 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: krichards@wor710.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Jan 2003 17:49:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 57209 invoked from network); 27 Jan 2003 17:49:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Jan 2003 17:49:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO buckleyradio.com) (161.58.14.6) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Jan 2003 17:49:10 -0000 Received: from kerrydesk (pool-151-202-103-107.ny5030.east.verizon.net [151.202.103.107]) by buckleyradio.com (8.11.6) id h0RHn9j21822 for ; Mon, 27 Jan 2003 12:49:09 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <001601c2c62b$9a3baa10$2a01010a@kerrydesk> To: Subject: WOR and IBOC Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 12:43:19 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Kerry Richards" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=136545831 X-Yahoo-Profile: kerryrichards710 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I find it hard to understand that the minute we started testing this new system we were attacked on this site and others. Apparently no one remembered that WOR has an STA to test the IBOC system from the FCC. That's first and foremost here. We at WOR are doing all the "grunt" work for all the other broadcasters and Ibiquity to see how the system behaves, including taking heat and answering questions from the public. This has not been an easy task, and quite frankly we have had one or two complaints from our WOR core audience, which were easily resolved. This forum and others have been a bed of mis-information, and illogical comments, some from those who think AM Stereo is somehow making a major comeback any day now. Also, those who now realize that with IBOC, DX listening as we now know it, will radically change with the implementation of this new technology. Whether or not this is good or bad is not up to me, that decision will rest with the Marketplace, Manufacturers, Ibiquity, Broadcasters and the FCC. This remains to be seen. As the Chief Engineer of a major market AM station, I am extremely interested in any technology which will improve the method of transmission. The facts speak for themselves, if this technology works it will in fact improve the "method of transmission". But, what else will it do? Yes, it does have sidebands which sound like hash, yes it has the potential to create interference in certain markets, and under certain conditions. The situation of running IBOC in the "hybrid" mode definitely has trade offs. Right now, sitting here in my office in Midtown Manhattan, I am hearing an acceptable feed from an HD receiver that makes WOR sound like FM, do I like it? Of course I like it...now if we can get radios out to our listeners this will be great. C-Quam in it's heyday was always a tricky issue. I'm not saying it never worked, and I'm not saying it did not sound good. And, I never said I did not like it. BUT, the marketplace has decided...and this is the problem, more broadcasters have turned it off, and more are turning it off as time goes on. Radios are hard to come by, and the public is ill informed about AM Stereo, as are many AM broadcasters. Those that know how good it can sound, and where the radios are far and few between. It really is a shame, but it is the present situation. When a company like Ibiquity invests millions in the "HD Radio" scheme, and broadcasters, manufacturers, and the FCC endorses it, the public will now have the ability to get this new system. I do not see this happening with any other solution for AM Radio including C-Quam. Our efforts have focused on getting what data we have on how the system works and sounds out to the public at large, including those on this forum and others. In particular I have invited many of you to WOR to see IBOC in action, and to exchange ideas and get a better understanding amongst fellow engineers. I have personally invited Kevin Tekel numerous times to the WOR transmitter, Studio Complex, and the SBE meeting I attend. He has never showed up, nor attended any SBE meeting. If Kevin has issues this is his first place to bring them, all of the engineers at the SBE meeting would be fascinated by what Kevin has to say, and I'm sure he would hear all the "War stories" about AM Stereo ad-nauseum. If Kevin saw what it is like maintaining a 50kw array and plant in 2003, and the difficulties therein, and get a dialogue going, he might have some idea of the realities of what AM radio is like in this day and age. Let alone hearing this new technology, instead he has decided to hide in his own little world in 'Central New Jersey" where he makes ridiculous complaints that WOR is operating illegally, and ruining his ability to hear WGSM which is a Korean language station with no signal in his direction. Kevin, in case you did not know we at WOR, have been in touch with WGSM's consulting engineer numerous times in the past several months. WGSM is in the process of working on their array, and I can assure you they are not interested in coverage in Central New Jersey, because without a several million dollar expenditure, this is not going to happen. They would like to direct their signal into the Korean community in Flushing, which is at present going to be difficult to do from the current city of license Huntingdon, New York. They have an STA, and may or may not be operating at fully licensed power, and in fact have reduced the power to 20kw, from 25 kw. This is precisely why I cannot take Kevin Tekel seriously, when I get some of his emails and see his crazy posts. They defy logic and reality, most times. He gets crazy when I call him a "crackpot", what do you think???? I have disclosed more info how things work here at WOR, and all the trails and tribulations of this whole IBOC experience, but Kevin can't take it, or show his face. Go figure.....I have nothing to hide, but apparently Kevin does. I still have an open door policy to ANYONE, including Kevin Tekel, to see IBOC in action, at the WOR facility. I'm at 212-798-8366, and can be reached most of the time to schedule a tour. I hope to have the opportunity to meet more engineers, and others who post to this Forum who want to discuss AM Stereo, IBOC, and AM Radio engineering, and I'm sure Kevin would find the experience rewarding as well. Kerry Richards Chief Engineer WOR-AM Buckley Broadcasting [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From michaelj@vcn.com Mon Jan 27 10:08:42 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Jan 2003 18:08:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 79834 invoked from network); 27 Jan 2003 18:08:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Jan 2003 18:08:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m2-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.32) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Jan 2003 18:08:41 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m2-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Mon, 27 Jan 2003 11:08:40 -0700 Message-ID: <01ce01c2c62f$1e4cafe0$0701010a@keva> To: References: <001601c2c62b$9a3baa10$2a01010a@kerrydesk> Subject: Re: {AMSF} WOR and IBOC Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 11:08:38 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I have to admit, I've skimmed over several messages myself in the past related to all of the IBOC stuff. And I also have to admit that this weekend's AMS Forum emails have now taken 2 hours to go through. I'm glad I did not miss this one. Kerry, good to see a post from you too. I've corrosponded personally with Tom as well. These guys really are first class. They've got their stuff straight. I would certainly consider it a privelage and an honor to be able to tour an operation like WOR's. That's something that I would kill to have the opportunity at. Unfortunately I'm way on the other side of the country and I don't see it happening as I can't afford a trip to NYC any time soon. I guess that's why I have a hard time understanding. Kevin is right there! An hour away, and he won't go talk to these guys. I only wish I was closer. I'd be there in a heartbeat. I love radio. I love engineering. I love to see other stations. Always have. Ever since I was a kid. I LOVE seeing radio stations. And this one, I can't. I'm too damn far away. I would never ever think a I'd be able to see the STUDIOS of a major market (the biggest market in the country, no less!) station, much less the transmitter plant! Kerry, Tom....if I ever make it up that way, I'd love the tour. Anyone else....if you're ever in Wyoming, stop by and see me. It ain't much to see, but i'll give ya the tour here too....and even point ya to a good place to grab a beer and shoot the sh*t. Michael J. Richard KEVA - AM / KNYN - FM / KOTB - FM Evanston Wyoming ----- Original Message ----- From: Kerry Richards To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, January 27, 2003 10:43 AM Subject: {AMSF} WOR and IBOC [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From amfmdx@fastq.com Mon Jan 27 10:13:00 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Jan 2003 18:13:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 35136 invoked from network); 27 Jan 2003 18:13:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Jan 2003 18:13:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Jan 2003 18:13:00 -0000 Received: from fastq (d175-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.207]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id h0RICwP62074 for ; Mon, 27 Jan 2003 11:12:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <004401c2c62f$a2eb7e20$9ef9bed8@com> To: Subject: The truth shall set you free Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 11:12:20 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla From: "Juan / John Gualda" Subject: Re: Re: Realistic TM-152 >I should add, that I realize that the "mods" would make it a better radio, but at the time, and I still feel >this way, that a wide bandwidth mono radio is better than a narrow band AM Stereo radio. Amen! I have mono radios such as the 11 tube Zenith High Fidelity on my back porch that is wide and sounds fantastic but it was made in 1960. I have a GE 780P dripping with chrome from 1958 that is unbelievable sounding and the bass response is unbelievable. But its 45 years old. I have a Zenith Royal 2000 Trans-Symphony that will bring tears to your eyes on AM but it was made in 1961. The only modern radio I have is the GE SRIII that sounds good and you can get off the shelf today. The Realistic 12-604A which I have is moderately good and it was last sold in 1999. I have a MCS 3050 that is ok but definitely in a leage lower than the ones mentioned above. The best sounding stereo radio I have is the Chris Cuff Delco and they are one of a kind. >Give me fidelity, or give me......well give me anything but death.... Let me put it this way. I used to have a T-shirt that said "Give me liberty or give me head". >I might add...I should have kept the darn thing...if at least to put it on e-bay...same with that crappy >Realistic AM Stereo car radio... I sold my TM-152. Wish I had it because I finally got the matching amp. The TM-152 is NOT a good radio. Sure you can modify it to sound ok but its out of the realm of the common listener. Generally though, you can figure that if it says Radio Shack, its second rate crap that SUCKS. That is why I call the place Radio SHAFT. >It just made me cringe.....after hearing Hi-FI AM, These radios brought shame to the AM Stereo >struggle. I can imagine "joe six pack" hearing these, would he tell his friends how good AM Stereo >sounded.......I doubt it. The early AM stereo stuff, well it frankly sucked other than the SRF-A1 or SRF-A100. >I remember listening to the overnight show on WNWS-790 and the host Jerry Witchner (sp) , when >asked by a listener, what he thought of AM Stereo..."just static from 2 speakers, instead of one"...as far >as SOME of the AM Stereo products available at the time....he was right. Well, its time someone was honest about it. Today it sounds a lot better but its probably way too late. I don't hate IBOC. I wish it didn't destroy the band adjacent to the signals. I think that in its present incarnation though it will kill the AM band in America once and for all. >First impressions are important. If I was to hear AM Stereo for the first time on the Realistic TN-152, I >would give it a thumbs down. Yes. It IS too narrow and it IS too tinny. Its a piece of crap like 99.98% of everything from Radio Shack. >When demonstrating AM Stereo to friends, the most comments were ...."I didn't realize that AM >sounded that good" When you send the signal to a receiver thats worth a crap. The manufacturers should be absolutely ashamed of themselves when you talk about what they sell today. The manufacturers suck and the programming on AM today is absolutely putrid. There is little to no music. People wonder why no one listens to AM. Well thats the cause. When people hear my old radios they say "Thats AM?" >This was on the SRF-42.......and unless you held it behind your head....you could NOT tell it was >Stereo...but the wide bandwidth....ahhhh, sounded good (or if you listened on headphones). The SRF 42 is not that great a radio. It is not the best AM stereo there is but at least when there is a pilot, whether its stereo or not, it sounds great because its WIDE. If you want to listen, even wide mono is great. >So the future of MW is IBOC, narrow bandwidth, unless you pay to buy a radio, to listen to your favorite >talk shows in a "semi" High Fidelity sound. Thats what the verdict appears to be. >I am discouraged. Thank God someone got enough stones to tell the truth here. AM can sound good but the early days of AM stereo sure had some crap for equipment. Kevin From tomray@wor710.com Mon Jan 27 10:47:16 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 83635 invoked from network); 27 Jan 2003 18:47:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Jan 2003 18:47:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.64) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Jan 2003 18:47:16 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: tomray@wor710.com Received: from [66.218.67.185] by n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Jan 2003 18:47:08 -0000 X-Sender: tomray@wor710.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Jan 2003 18:34:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 83438 invoked from network); 27 Jan 2003 18:34:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Jan 2003 18:34:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.88) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Jan 2003 18:34:10 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.161] by n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Jan 2003 18:34:10 -0000 Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 18:34:09 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: IBOC Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1088 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wortomray " X-Originating-IP: 151.202.103.107 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=136489311 X-Yahoo-Profile: wortomray X-eGroups-Approved-By: kevtronics via web; 27 Jan 2003 18:47:07 -0000 Kenwood will have an HD capable radio on the shelves 2nd quarter 2003....meaning by June. Visteon will have HD capable radios in Ford, Lincoln, and Mercury vehicles for the 2004 model year....meaning by June. Other radios will be following monthly after that. Sony is presently using WOR as a test station and is completing design on their HD. Incidentally, Sony only accounts for 8% of the radio market. --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: > > I will buy a few IBOC receivers if they are ever available, and > > especially if they go on clearance...hold on to them, and sell > > them on e-bay for a nice profit in the future. > > I think the day when we see IBOC radios on the shelf in stores is the > day when they stop selling *mono* VCRs and TV sets. > > But you're right, regardless of anything else, the first IBOC > recievers to be available will be collector's items -- just as a > "spinning disc" color TV set is today, especially since they only > made a handful of those before the system was scrapped. From tomray@wor710.com Mon Jan 27 10:48:53 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 79899 invoked from network); 27 Jan 2003 18:48:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Jan 2003 18:48:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Jan 2003 18:48:51 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: tomray@wor710.com Received: from [66.218.67.178] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Jan 2003 18:48:47 -0000 X-Sender: tomray@wor710.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Jan 2003 18:47:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 85197 invoked from network); 27 Jan 2003 18:47:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Jan 2003 18:47:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.75) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Jan 2003 18:47:53 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.189] by n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Jan 2003 18:47:53 -0000 Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 18:47:52 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: WOR Audio Samples Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 476 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wortomray " X-Originating-IP: 151.202.103.107 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=136489311 X-Yahoo-Profile: wortomray X-eGroups-Approved-By: kevtronics via web; 27 Jan 2003 18:48:44 -0000 It should be noted here that the present audio samples up on the WOR site were recorded with a bad HD radio. What did I have to compare it to? The new radio we have does not experience these artifacts, and does reproduce the stereo. So yes, the HD AM is in stereo. I would have posted new clips this weekend, but my sound card at home was acting up. I'll see if I can do so later tonight and post them. I'm going to do a digital dub from DAT here at the station. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Jan 27 11:08:59 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Jan 2003 19:08:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 84356 invoked from network); 27 Jan 2003 19:08:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Jan 2003 19:08:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.90) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Jan 2003 19:08:58 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.135] by n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Jan 2003 19:08:49 -0000 Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 19:08:48 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: The truth shall set you free Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <004401c2c62f$a2eb7e20$9ef9bed8@com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1562 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics >>First impressions are important. If I was to hear AM Stereo for the >>first time on the Realistic TN-152, I >would give it a thumbs down. > > Yes. It IS too narrow and it IS too tinny. Its a piece of crap like > 99.98% of everything from Radio Shack. When I got my TM-152, my first impression of it was that it sounds better than the Sony SRF-42, which was my only other non-car AM Stereo radio at the time. Maybe mine has a wider response than others, but I quickly found that with a little help from a graphic equalizer to employ appropriate bass and treble boosts, it can provide very high fidelity sound that is flat out to at least 12 kHz. No, it's not the best-sounding AM radio ever made. But I feel that for a single- bandwidth radio, it has a very good compromise between selectivity for DXing and treble response for enjoyable listening of both local and distant stations. Regardless if you personally like it or not, the Realistic TM-152 helped fill a need for low-cost, good-performing AM Stereo radios, just like the Sony SRF-42. And that's a need that continues today. Even if they aren't familiar with AM Stereo, plenty of people are looking for afforable radios that have good sound and reception on AM. There are some radios, like the GE Superadio III, that meet these requirements, but I don't think anybody can disagree that we need more to be available to the average consumer -- and this should continue to be a top priority for us and for everybody who supports the continued success of AM radio. From jbyrns@enteract.com Mon Jan 27 11:43:59 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Jan 2003 19:43:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 69981 invoked from network); 27 Jan 2003 19:43:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Jan 2003 19:43:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.89) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Jan 2003 19:43:58 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.186] by n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Jan 2003 19:43:58 -0000 Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 19:43:56 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} OT: IBOC, ABUSE AND WASTED BANDWIDTH Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 554 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.98.237 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Phil Rafuse " < philipr@i...> wrote: > > However, I think we should be careful not to "trash" IBOC, just as > IBOC supporters should be careful not to "trash" CQUAM AM Stereo. > Point out IBOC's shortcomings, yes, but keep an open mind. I have not seen any IBOC supporters "trashing" CQUAM AM Stereo, the only ones I have seen doing that are the Kahn ISB AM Stereo supporters. The trashing is mostly the other way around, with the analog AM stereo supporters trashing IBOC/HD radio. John From KC4QLP@aol.com Mon Jan 27 12:58:21 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Jan 2003 20:58:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 67843 invoked from network); 27 Jan 2003 20:58:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Jan 2003 20:58:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d07.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.39) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Jan 2003 20:58:20 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.1e0.710112 (4418) for ; Mon, 27 Jan 2003 15:58:11 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1e0.710112.2b66f762@aol.com> Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 15:58:10 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 1/27/03 1:49:09 PM Eastern Standard Time, tomray@wor710.com writes: << Kenwood will have an HD capable radio on the shelves 2nd quarter 2003....meaning by June. Visteon will have HD capable radios in Ford, Lincoln, and Mercury vehicles for the 2004 model year....meaning by June. Other radios will be following monthly after that. Sony is presently using WOR as a test station and is completing design on their HD. Incidentally, Sony only accounts for 8% of the radio market. >> Any idea yet on which manufacture{s} are producing the "home stereo" radios and portables yet? Automotive radios will certainly help IBOC take off seeing that most people spend most of their time in their vehicles.Having the home radio and portable will give it all that extra little kick. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- Subscribe send an email to amstereo-subscribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From jbyrns@enteract.com Mon Jan 27 14:04:55 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Jan 2003 22:04:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 33772 invoked from network); 27 Jan 2003 22:04:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Jan 2003 22:04:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Jan 2003 22:04:54 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.182] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Jan 2003 22:04:47 -0000 Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 22:04:46 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Some Thoughts on Receivers and IBOC (was Re: ...) Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3E35310E.1850.1069A9D@localhost> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 4230 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.98.211 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Jeff Welton" wrote: > "52 were IBOC related, of which 51 were back and forth flamefests, or > condemnations/justifications of same, which did nothing to advance AM stereo > interests, IBOC, broadcasting or anything else. One was a "reasonable > message", in which JSG (wish I knew your name) presented a possible explanation > of how a receiver could detect IBOC hash outside the passband even when it is > in acceptable limits." I would like to expand on my earlier comments on "blameless" receivers and IBOC. For a report of interference from "IBOC" transmissions to have any scientific meaning, I would expect the following data, at a minimum. 1.) The signal strengths at the receiver location of both the interfering signal, and the signal receiving the interference. 2.) Measurements of the selectivity characteristics of the receiver used in the test, covering both the radios pass band, and the reject area on each side of the pass band. 3.) A complete characterization of the receivers spurious response characteristics, with an emphasis on third order IM problems. This last point is particularly important, as many modern radios suffer from third order IM problems as a result of having aperiodic, or untuned, antenna circuits. Third order IM can give the appearance of interference where none actually exists outside the circuits of the radio. Some examples of radios with this problem are the Carver TX- 11a, and the Sony ICF-2010, although thankfully, the Sony includes an antenna attenuator, and an RF gain control, which can be used to mitigate the problem. Many modern automotive radios use similar aperiodic circuits, but do not suffer to the same extent, presumably because they are better designed. To illustrate how third order IM could create the appearance of a splatter problem where none exists, lets consider the case of WOR and WGSM that Kevin mentioned. This example is not meant to suggest this is the mechanism at work in Kevin's case, as I presume he is quite distant from WOR, although I haven't been able to figure out exactly where he lives. The Sony ICF-2010 can be used to demonstrate this effect up to at least 12 miles from the stations in question, and perhaps much further, as I haven't tried it at other than two fixed locations. Third order IM creates two inband spurious mixing products at frequencies which I will call Fs1 and Fs2, from two input signals, call them Fa and Fb, which are related by the following formulas: Fs1 = ((2 * Fa) - Fb) and Fs2 = ((2 * Fb) - Fa) if Fa = 660 kHz a strong local signal in the same area as WOR and Fb = 710 kHz WOR's signal then Fs1 = 610 kHz and Fs2 = 760 kHz Notice that the spurious signal at 760 kHz is not far removed from WGSM's frequency of 740 kHz. This spurious signal is probably far enough removed from WGSM's frequency so that it would not cause problems when WOR is broadcasting in ordinary monophonic analog AM. Now consider the situation when WOR broadcasts with "IBOC" sidebands extending from 695 kHz up through 725 kHz. We might expect the "IBOC" related sidebands around the spurious 760 kHz spurious resopnse to extend from 745 kHz up through 775 kHz, which would be bad enough in itself, but if we look at the formula for Fs2, we will see that all the sidebands of Fb are spread out by a factor of 2, so the "IBOC" related sidebands now extend all the way down to 730 kHz, and up to 790 kHz, at least as far as the receiver is concerned, and this is clearly enough to cause a serious problem with the reception of WGSM, even if these signals don't actually exist in the airwaves. This is why we must carefully insure that any receiver used to test for "IBOC" interference is totally "blameless". Since so many modern real receivers have problems like this, I would also consider it a problem if there were thousands of reports of "IBOC" interference from ordinary Joe's using this type of flawed radio. Time will tell if this is a problem for the population at large, as more HD stations come on the air, or if it is only a problem for a very small minority of radio nuts. John From jbyrns@enteract.com Mon Jan 27 14:22:35 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Jan 2003 22:22:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 40497 invoked from network); 27 Jan 2003 22:22:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Jan 2003 22:22:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Jan 2003 22:22:31 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.177] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Jan 2003 22:11:06 -0000 Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 22:11:04 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: FTAD-10K (was Re: IBOC) Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 616 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.98.211 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "wortomray " < tomray@w...> wrote: > Kenwood will have an HD capable radio on the shelves 2nd quarter > 2003....meaning by June. > > Visteon will have HD capable radios in Ford, Lincoln, and Mercury > vehicles for the 2004 model year....meaning by June. > > Other radios will be following monthly after that. > > Sony is presently using WOR as a test station and is completing > design on their HD. Incidentally, Sony only accounts for 8% of the > radio market. I wonder when Fanfare will introduce their FTAD-10K FM/AM/HD all mode stereo tuner? John From tomray@wor710.com Mon Jan 27 14:35:37 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 59460 invoked from network); 27 Jan 2003 22:35:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Jan 2003 22:35:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Jan 2003 22:35:36 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: tomray@wor710.com Received: from [66.218.67.135] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Jan 2003 22:35:36 -0000 X-Sender: tomray@wor710.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Jan 2003 20:51:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 71361 invoked from network); 27 Jan 2003 20:51:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Jan 2003 20:51:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.86) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Jan 2003 20:51:53 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.140] by n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Jan 2003 20:51:53 -0000 Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 20:51:52 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Curious Note Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 217 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wortomray " X-Originating-IP: 151.202.103.107 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=136489311 X-Yahoo-Profile: wortomray X-eGroups-Edited-By: kevtronics X-eGroups-Approved-By: kevtronics via web; 27 Jan 2003 22:35:35 -0000 I have replied to several comments today, and have yet to see them appear on the board. Is there censorship at work here? Or is the board software experiencing a problem. I see other people posting replies. [Sysop's Note: Mr. Ray's posts are subject to moderation. Messages containing personal attacks and/or offensive language will not be accepted.] From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Mon Jan 27 15:59:47 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 27 Jan 2003 23:59:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 18146 invoked from network); 27 Jan 2003 23:59:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Jan 2003 23:59:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web41006.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.93.5) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Jan 2003 23:59:45 -0000 Message-ID: <20030127235945.75907.qmail@web41006.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.32.140] by web41006.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 27 Jan 2003 15:59:45 PST Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 15:59:45 -0800 (PST) Subject: WWKB To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio It's too cold here in R.I. (9º) to check on my car radio, but has WWKB returned to stereo? 73, Jay,N1WVQ __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Mon Jan 27 16:03:08 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 00:03:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 42539 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 00:02:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 00:02:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf22bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.62) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 00:02:36 -0000 Received: from juan ([68.153.68.61]) by imf22bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.25 201-253-122-122-125-20020815) with SMTP id <20030128000433.DVGA25419.imf22bis.bellsouth.net@juan> for ; Mon, 27 Jan 2003 19:04:33 -0500 Message-ID: <001601c2c660$93590500$af78fea9@juan> To: References: <004401c2c62f$a2eb7e20$9ef9bed8@com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} The truth shall set you free Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 19:02:40 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane I don't hate IBOC either Kevin. I would be 100% for it if I was convinced it wouldn't damage Radio as it is now. Maybe I am wrong, and If I am I will be the first to admit it. If Analog and IBOC could exist and be 100% compatible, with neither suffering, I would be at the forefront of the parade, beating the drum of this new technology. Maybe Mr Ray can answer this question ? Is there really a demand, in your opinion, for higher fidelity talk programming ? and at the expense of quite a few radios out there in listening land ? What I am trying to say is IBOC promises higher fidelity, but limits the bandwidth to 5khz, is it really worth it for a talk station ? Juan ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" To: Sent: Monday, January 27, 2003 1:12 PM Subject: {AMSF} The truth shall set you free I don't hate IBOC. I wish it didn't destroy the band adjacent to the signals. I think that in its present incarnation though it will kill the AM band in America once and for all. Kevin From jbyrns@enteract.com Mon Jan 27 16:09:07 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 00:09:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 97000 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 00:09:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 00:09:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 00:09:06 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.179] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Jan 2003 00:09:06 -0000 Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 00:09:02 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: FTAD-10K (was Re: IBOC) Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 616 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.98.131 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "wortomray " < tomray@w...> wrote: > Kenwood will have an HD capable radio on the shelves 2nd quarter > 2003....meaning by June. > > Visteon will have HD capable radios in Ford, Lincoln, and Mercury > vehicles for the 2004 model year....meaning by June. > > Other radios will be following monthly after that. > > Sony is presently using WOR as a test station and is completing > design on their HD. Incidentally, Sony only accounts for 8% of the > radio market. I wonder when Fanfare will introduce their FTAD-10K FM/AM/HD all mode stereo tuner? John From jbyrns@enteract.com Mon Jan 27 16:13:13 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 00:13:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 71015 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 00:13:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 00:13:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 00:13:12 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.162] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Jan 2003 00:13:12 -0000 Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 00:13:10 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: FTAD-10K (was Re: IBOC) Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 293 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.98.131 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " < jbyrns@e...> wrote: Oops, sorry for posting this a second time, but there is something very strange going on with the server here today, that is causing a delay in posting some messages, the first copy finally showed up. John From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Mon Jan 27 16:22:49 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 00:22:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 90312 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 00:22:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 00:22:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf40bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.63) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 00:22:49 -0000 Received: from juan ([68.153.68.61]) by imf40bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.25 201-253-122-122-125-20020815) with SMTP id <20030128002445.QVLB9581.imf40bis.bellsouth.net@juan> for ; Mon, 27 Jan 2003 19:24:45 -0500 Message-ID: <002501c2c663$65f14d90$af78fea9@juan> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: HDTV Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 19:22:53 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I want just a sidebox to receive the digital signals, I undertand it won't look any better as my NTSC TV is the weakest link.....hey wait a minute..it's "digital", it must be better :-) Seriously, the prices are ridiculous. There is a new station here that just signed on (digital) and I'd like to see it, but I ain't paying $400 to see it. Thanks for the e-bay tip Chris. I checked, most are for Direct-TV, but there are a few converters, but pricey. Juan ----- Original Message ----- From: Kevin T. To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, January 27, 2003 10:14 AM Subject: {AMSF} Re: HDTV > How much are Digital converters for DTV ? I keep hearing about > them, and have yet to find one. There's enough Digital TV here to > warrant buying one, but where ? In addition, the majority of new digital TVs sold are still only "HDTV-Ready" or "HDTV Monitors", where a separate HDTV tuner box is required to receive on-air HDTV broadcasts. I suppose it's partly because of lack of consumer demand for true fully-equipped HDTVs (as "everybody" has cable or satellite), and also partly because of the chance to get people to pay TWICE for expensive new equipment -- first, thousands of dollars for an "HDTV-Ready" TV set, and then an additional few hundred for the separate HDTV tuner box. I even see some of these non-HDTV-equipped digital TV sets being advertised as having a "Built-In NTSC Tuner".... gee, the same as any other TV set manufactured within the past half-century! [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From evergreenterrace@buzzle.com Mon Jan 27 17:11:50 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: evergreenterrace@buzzle.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 01:11:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 86432 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 01:11:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 01:11:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 01:11:49 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.143] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Jan 2003 01:11:49 -0000 Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 01:11:48 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Curious Note Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 496 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgliradio " X-Originating-IP: 170.20.11.59 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=69711087 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgliradio --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "wortomray " wrote: > I have replied to several comments today, and have yet to see them > appear on the board. Is there censorship at work here? Or is the > board software experiencing a problem. I see other people posting > replies. > > > > [Sysop's Note: Mr. Ray's posts are subject to moderation. Messages > containing personal attacks and/or offensive language will not be > accepted.] Give it up Kevin! Geeze! From KC4QLP@aol.com Mon Jan 27 17:18:48 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 01:18:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 12025 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 01:18:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 01:18:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m08.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.163) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 01:18:48 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.1c4.418a4e4 (4418) for ; Mon, 27 Jan 2003 20:18:44 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1c4.418a4e4.2b673473@aol.com> Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 20:18:43 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Curious Note To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp << [Sysop's Note: Mr. Ray's posts are subject to moderation. Messages containing personal attacks and/or offensive language will not be accepted.] >> You know....I certainly hope this is not the case.God oh mighty...anyone have a pacifier for the babysitter?!? Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- Subscribe send an email to amstereo-subscribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From KC4QLP@aol.com Mon Jan 27 17:51:27 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 01:51:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 461 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 01:51:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 01:51:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m02.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.5) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 01:51:26 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.144.8dc272e (4418) for ; Mon, 27 Jan 2003 20:51:22 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <144.8dc272e.2b673c19@aol.com> Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 20:51:21 EST Subject: Verify WSAI?--nope--it isnt so--sorry guys To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 1/27/03 1:14:31 AM Eastern Standard Time, kevtronics@yahoo.com writes: << > What's going on with WSAI? I get a 'stereo' pilot on a multi-mode > receiver with pilot detection and on a Delco. True stereo, or just > phase mod issues? For the past few nights, I have also been getting an AM Stereo indication from 1530 WSAI. I think it is pretty certain that they are transmitting a C-Quam pilot tone... but so far, no actual Stereo separation has been heard in their audio. By the way, WSAI is owned by Clear Channel. It is nice to see that one of their flagship 50,000-watt stations is showing at least some support for AM Stereo. >> WSAI is not operating in stereo as many would hope. Its reported that there is a daytimer somewhere leaving their transmitter on after sunset.The FCC,I've been told is looking into it. More than likely the daytimer with dead air is just off frequency enough to make your radio think they are sending the 25hz pilot. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- Subscribe send an email to amstereo-subscribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From stodd@sherbtel.net Mon Jan 27 17:58:40 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 01:58:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 47839 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 01:58:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 01:58:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 01:58:40 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-85-108.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.85.108]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h0S1wahF011330 for ; Mon, 27 Jan 2003 19:58:38 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <000901c2c671$0007a3e0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030126141508.02eb12d0@pop.GameBox.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030126171533.031b2180@mail.comcast.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Narrowing radio's down and some questions: (Carver TX-11 C, Sony SRF-42, Denon TU680NAB, Crisler/Delco Car radio, and Sony IBF-2010) Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 20:00:12 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Carver TX-2 ----- Original Message ----- From: "John" > What is an Easy AMS conversion? From wa2fnq@optonline.net Mon Jan 27 17:59:44 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: wa2fnq@optonline.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 01:59:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 69209 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 01:59:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 01:59:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 01:59:43 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.176] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Jan 2003 01:59:43 -0000 Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 01:59:40 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Curious Note Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1598 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wa2fnq " X-Originating-IP: 24.47.74.230 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=60059615 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa2fnq I've been sifting through the posts tonight.... HMMM.... I see we're still up to the usual stuff.... Kevin?? BTW your absence Thursday night was duly noted. Maybe if you would have shown up, met Tom and Kerry and saw their operation it might have modified your opinion of them. I'm not an IBOC proponent but at least I have the professionalism to look at all sides. Let's try to make this board an exchange of good information. With some of the garbage I've seen here if I was an engineer at WOR I'd be pretty upset. Don't know what you guys have been listening on but I can't find any spurious junk from WOR out here on Long Island. All I hear is their digital sidebands either side of their analog signal. Oh yes, that's on my Honda car radio, my AIWA TX706 portable, my Sony SRF-42 or any other AM radio I've listened on. I've been in the bussiness and doing this stuff for 35 years so don't go questioning my credentials. You've lost sight of the real issue here. It's not WOR but ibiquity's system that's in question. WOR just happened to be the ones to stick their neck out and implement IBOC on their station. Give them credit for trying. They're doing their jobs. We're all trying to learn here. I do have an audio quality issue with the IBOC system. I awaitng the next audio post from Tom. It should be interesting. Gee, hope you don't consider this a personal attack and start censoring my posts. Jerry WA2FNQ > [Sysop's Note: Mr. Ray's posts are subject to moderation. Messages > containing personal attacks and/or offensive language will not be > accepted.] From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Jan 27 18:05:18 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 02:05:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 39345 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 02:05:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 02:05:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 02:05:02 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.171] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Jan 2003 02:04:55 -0000 Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 02:04:53 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Curious Note Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 893 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.90.25 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Give it up Kevin! Geeze! Personal disagreements are not appropriate for a public Forum like this, especially when they degrade to the level of personal attacks. If Mr. Ray has issues with my actions, he can discuss it with me privately, not here on the Forum. We have already had enough senseless arguing here in the past two days -- some of which I admit to being guilty of myself -- and it is time we get back to business. On a side note, I just received a very harrassing e-mail from somebody with the Yahoo screen name "crackpot_crackpotter", in reference to this message thread. This will be reported to Yahoo and to this person's Internet provider (through an IP number trace) so that appropriate action can be taken against whoever this person is. Heated personal disagreements are one thing, but when it gets to this barbaric of a level, that is simply intolerable. From stodd@sherbtel.net Mon Jan 27 18:06:12 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 02:06:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 29619 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 02:06:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 02:06:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 02:06:04 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-85-108.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.85.108]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h0S260hF013533 for ; Mon, 27 Jan 2003 20:06:01 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <001d01c2c672$08636be0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: MC 13028 Decoder Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 20:07:36 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude AFAIK Crawford still does own WLLZ, and Cris still works for them. I think you might be able to scrounge up a way to contact him if you do a Google search for Crawford Broadcasting. I used to have the info until I had to replace the motherboard in my computer...*sigh*. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Sunday, January 26, 2003 5:34 PM Subject: {AMSF} Re: MC 13028 Decoder > Hal, > >In the datasheet I have it doesn't mentioned anything about using > >divide by counters for the pilot tone. Where did you come by this > >info? > I spoke to one of the four Motorola engineers on the chip side. > > >I used an Amidon L-43-2 wind your own. You could > >probably use the smaller L-33-2 if desired. The L-43-2 was what is > >available to me at the store. > Which store near you sells these coils? > > >I wound 48 turns of #34 wire and resonated it with a 100pf SM cap. I > >center tapped it at 50% to connect it at pin 13 via a .02uf ceramic > >cap for DC isolation. > Did you run the coil from B+ to ground? Interesting that the L/C > tunes the oscillator in the MC13028, since the oscillator type is not > identical to the one used in the MC13020 chip. > > Off topic: WLLZ is still monaural. Is Cris Alexander connected with > Crawford Broadcasting, and does Crawford still own WLLZ? I hope > that their exciter is down, and will be repaired, but want to have > confirmation. > I also listened to WCHB-AM's loud hash on 1190 and 1220kHz (not very > entertaining). During my next visit, I will record WMGC-FM's beehive > sound for anyone interested (perhaps it will make the ratings > (kidding!). It sounds like high speed digital data. And now I am > signing off for the evening. 73, Jeff > > > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Jan 27 18:14:06 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 02:14:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 63490 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 02:14:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 02:14:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.75) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 02:14:06 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.185] by n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Jan 2003 02:14:05 -0000 Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 02:14:02 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Verify WSAI?--nope--it isnt so--sorry guys Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <144.8dc272e.2b673c19@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 643 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.90.25 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > WSAI is not operating in stereo as many would hope. Its reported > that there is a daytimer somewhere leaving their transmitter on > after sunset. The FCC,I've been told is looking into it. > More than likely the daytimer with dead air is just off frequency > enough to make your radio think they are sending the 25hz pilot. That is possible, but the "Stereo pilot" from 1530 WSAI has been pretty darn consistent these past few nights, even when their signal doesn't have any noticeable "flutter" to it (which typically is a sign of "falsing"). It also started happening suspiciously close to the debut of WSAI's Oldies music format. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Jan 27 18:29:23 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 02:29:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 84494 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 02:29:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 02:29:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 02:29:23 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.145] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Jan 2003 02:29:23 -0000 Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 02:29:20 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: KB-1520 - classic music, classic audio Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1965 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.90.25 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics I finally got a chance to hear the new Oldies music format on "KB-1520" (WWKB Buffalo, NY), and I must say the music selection and presentation are both excellent -- it sounds like they will be a real joy to listen to, just like 1530 WSAI. Their music focuses on the '60s, but with some late '50s and even some early '70s thrown into the mix. But what's even more interesting is KB-1520's audio processing; reminiscent of the old CBS Audimax/Volumax combo, it now prominently features wide-band processing, with that classic "punchy" sound, and yes, even a bit of "pumping" on songs with a strong bass line. It is generally heavy on the mid-range, but on a good receiver they do have a nice hi-fi sound. In any event, it is certainly distinctive to listen to, even as compared to neighboring 1530 WSAI, with their relatively "flat", Optimod/Omnia-style multi-band processing, even despite their touch of reverb (which does sound nice). This may also be part of the reason why KB-1520 has stopped transmitting an AM Stereo signal; if they have truly brought in some vintage audio processing gear, or at least integrated it into their audio chain (with the contemporary Optimod/Omnia still in place), then that would probably mean it is mono equipment, which would prevent them from delivering Stereo audio, unless they acquire a second set of the processing gear and pump out the classic audio in full Stereo. And as much as I am enjoying the music, I also look forward to listening to Joey Reynolds' talk show on the overnight shift, so I can compare WWKB's full-bandwidth audio with classic processing to that of his home station, 710 WOR, and their 5 kHz-bandwidth audio with processing provided by a modern Optimod 9200 working at full tilt. p.s. For those who have a better memory than me... wasn't 1520 then-WKBW the station where upon being fired, Joey nailed his shoes to the station's door with the message "Fill these!"? From rwagoner1@mac.com Mon Jan 27 18:29:25 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner1@mac.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 02:29:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 88686 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 02:29:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 02:29:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO fed1mtao02.cox.net) (68.6.19.243) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 02:29:24 -0000 Received: from mac.com ([68.4.33.253]) by fed1mtao02.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20030128022923.TQZE13566.fed1mtao02.cox.net@mac.com> for ; Mon, 27 Jan 2003 21:29:23 -0500 Message-ID: <3E35EB04.2020209@mac.com> Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 18:29:24 -0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20021120 Netscape/7.01 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: HDTV References: <002501c2c663$65f14d90$af78fea9@juan> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Richard Wagoner X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135738921 X-Yahoo-Profile: richardalanwagoner My next TV will be a plasma digital. I had to have my Zenith 10-year-old console TV repaired recently on principle, even though I could have replaced it with a new one probably cheaper (though it would have BEEN cheaper ... in build quality ... my Zenith is one of the last US-designed and built). I LIKE digital TV, at least the pictures I see in the stores. Richard From stodd@sherbtel.net Mon Jan 27 18:30:22 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 02:30:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 90978 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 02:30:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 02:30:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 02:30:21 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-85-108.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.85.108]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h0S2UIhF020060 for ; Mon, 27 Jan 2003 20:30:19 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <007e01c2c675$6d5bc800$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} IBOC Rhetoric Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 20:31:53 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Yo, Johnny G- have you got a PC board layout I could copy to roll my own? I'm definitely interested in building one of these. I don't think I'll use that torroid input, but everything else looks like it should make a boffo decoder, especially with the notch filters. Scott Todd ----- Original Message ----- From: > > Now lets get back to buisness. The decoder I have designed > Tries to follow the NRSC De-Emphasis and has 10KHz notch > filters so this hopefully should make it AMAX compliant. > It uses the MC13028 chip and I have it working with a LC > oscillator instead of a ceramic resonator. > > > > From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Mon Jan 27 18:43:28 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 02:43:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 97562 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 02:43:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 02:43:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf52bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.100) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 02:43:27 -0000 Received: from juan ([68.153.68.61]) by imf52bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.25 201-253-122-122-125-20020815) with SMTP id <20030128024524.JPXE9487.imf52bis.bellsouth.net@juan> for ; Mon, 27 Jan 2003 21:45:24 -0500 Message-ID: <000a01c2c677$0bb0a8d0$af78fea9@juan> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} KB-1520 - classic music, classic audio Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 21:43:31 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I havent heard 1520, but I must say Clear Channel has done a great job with WSAI-1530. I had a chat with Phil Beckman about this station, and I have listened about a week. I must say they are doing Oldies the way they should be done...Big Library..Lots of requests...a little reverb..lots of calls from all over the NE.....They are making fun of the FM oldies outlet....calling them the "70's station" as a lot of Oldies FM's are adding a massive amount of 70's to the playlist. "Real Oldies" vs "The 70's station"....gotta give CC some credit. Maybe they will turn on the C-QUAM. Listening to WSAI makes me smile....Good Job ! Juan ----- Original Message ----- From: Kevin T. To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, January 27, 2003 9:29 PM Subject: {AMSF} KB-1520 - classic music, classic audio I finally got a chance to hear the new Oldies music format on "KB-1520" (WWKB Buffalo, NY), and I must say the music selection and presentation are both excellent -- it sounds like they will be a real joy to listen to, just like 1530 WSAI. Their music focuses on the '60s, but with some late '50s and even some early '70s thrown into the mix. But what's even more interesting is KB-1520's audio processing; reminiscent of the old CBS Audimax/Volumax combo, it now prominently features wide-band processing, with that classic "punchy" sound, and yes, even a bit of "pumping" on songs with a strong bass line. It is generally heavy on the mid-range, but on a good receiver they do have a nice hi-fi sound. In any event, it is certainly distinctive to listen to, even as compared to neighboring 1530 WSAI, with their relatively "flat", Optimod/Omnia-style multi-band processing, even despite their touch of reverb (which does sound nice). This may also be part of the reason why KB-1520 has stopped transmitting an AM Stereo signal; if they have truly brought in some vintage audio processing gear, or at least integrated it into their audio chain (with the contemporary Optimod/Omnia still in place), then that would probably mean it is mono equipment, which would prevent them from delivering Stereo audio, unless they acquire a second set of the processing gear and pump out the classic audio in full Stereo. And as much as I am enjoying the music, I also look forward to listening to Joey Reynolds' talk show on the overnight shift, so I can compare WWKB's full-bandwidth audio with classic processing to that of his home station, 710 WOR, and their 5 kHz-bandwidth audio with processing provided by a modern Optimod 9200 working at full tilt. p.s. For those who have a better memory than me... wasn't 1520 then-WKBW the station where upon being fired, Joey nailed his shoes to the station's door with the message "Fill these!"? Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ADVERTISEMENT Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Jan 27 18:43:48 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 02:43:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 25046 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 02:43:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 02:43:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.70) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 02:43:48 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.168] by n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Jan 2003 02:43:48 -0000 Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 02:43:48 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: HDTV (and SDTV) Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3E35EB04.2020209@mac.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1757 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.90.25 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > I had to have my Zenith 10-year-old console TV repaired recently on > principle, even though I could have replaced it with a new one > probably cheaper These old American TV sets were built like tanks, and when properly taken care of, they'll probably never die. I even picked up a '60s B&W Zenith set from the curb, rescuing it from the trash -- I got it home, plugged it in, and it works absolutely fine to this day. I just wish I had the mechanical "Space Command" remote control to go with it! Also remember that even after analog TV broadcasts are discontinued (if they ever will be), these old TV sets will continue to work fine for VCRs and video games -- which is another thing... who is going to be the first to build an "HDTV" video game system, designed to produce Progressive Scan wide-screen digital video? That's something I don't think they've thought of yet. > I LIKE digital TV, at least the pictures I see in the stores. Remember that's HDTV you're seeing. It is NOT mandatory for TV stations to use HDTV! Instead, they can allocate the same bandwidth to providing several "SDTV" -- Standard Definition TV -- digital signals, which won't be wide-screen, and will likely have *worse* quality than today's analog TV, due to the digital picture and audio artifacts -- as anybody with digital Cable or satellite TV is already familiar with. (And when the provider loses synch with their digital satellite connection of the channel you're watching, the results are almost hilarious to watch -- any video turns into the weirdest science fiction movie you've seen, with multi-color blocks all over the screen, parts of people's bodies moving in all different directions, and scary monster-movie audio effects.) From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Mon Jan 27 18:48:30 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 02:48:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 35519 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 02:48:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 02:48:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf52bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.100) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 02:48:30 -0000 Received: from juan ([68.153.68.61]) by imf52bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.25 201-253-122-122-125-20020815) with SMTP id <20030128025026.JWHP9487.imf52bis.bellsouth.net@juan> for ; Mon, 27 Jan 2003 21:50:26 -0500 Message-ID: <001401c2c677$c03a0170$af78fea9@juan> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Verify WSAI?--nope--it isnt so--sorry guys Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 21:48:34 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit The pilot on 1530 is solid here when the signal from WSAI-1530 is solid...no seperation, but me thinks they have the pilot on. Can Stereo be far behind ? I hope so. This station kicks A** Juan ----- Original Message ----- From: Kevin T. To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, January 27, 2003 9:14 PM Subject: {AMSF} Re: Verify WSAI?--nope--it isnt so--sorry guys > WSAI is not operating in stereo as many would hope. Its reported > that there is a daytimer somewhere leaving their transmitter on > after sunset. The FCC,I've been told is looking into it. > More than likely the daytimer with dead air is just off frequency > enough to make your radio think they are sending the 25hz pilot. That is possible, but the "Stereo pilot" from 1530 WSAI has been pretty darn consistent these past few nights, even when their signal doesn't have any noticeable "flutter" to it (which typically is a sign of "falsing"). It also started happening suspiciously close to the debut of WSAI's Oldies music format. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From stodd@sherbtel.net Mon Jan 27 18:56:35 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 02:56:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 99209 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 02:56:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 02:56:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 02:56:30 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-85-108.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.85.108]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h0S2uRhF027194 for ; Mon, 27 Jan 2003 20:56:28 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <00cf01c2c679$14e21ae0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Note to AM Stereo Forum members Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 20:58:03 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Tell you what- you two can make the following deal: go and take a tour of WOR, keeping a respectful demeanor, and then he gets to go to your place and you can show him first hand what you've been experiencing. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: > All I have done is simply report > my experience with WOR's signal. And my experience is that a station > that is supposed to be on 710 kHz is causing severe interference over > a range of 680 to 750 kHz on multiple receivers in multiple locations > up to 50 miles away from the transmitter. From matthew.trim@eds.com Mon Jan 27 19:02:16 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: matthew.trim@eds.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 03:02:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 32872 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 03:02:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 03:02:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO ns5.eds.com) (203.17.185.230) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 03:02:15 -0000 Received: from nnsy.eds.com (nnsy-2.eds.com [192.85.216.198]) by ns5.eds.com (8.11.6/8.11.1) with ESMTP id h0S32DX15775 for ; Tue, 28 Jan 2003 14:02:13 +1100 (EST) Received: from nnsy.eds.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by nnsy.eds.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0S32Bv29718 for ; Tue, 28 Jan 2003 14:02:12 +1100 (EST) Received: from ausym000.exau01.exch.eds.com ([134.251.177.117]) by nnsy.eds.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0S329K29682 for ; Tue, 28 Jan 2003 14:02:10 +1100 (EST) Received: by AUSYM000 with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Tue, 28 Jan 2003 14:02:05 +1100 Message-ID: <33CDDBD8CAEFEB4191ABF6F799032AF238D779@aubwm206> To: "'amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com'" Subject: RE: {AMSF} Re: Note to AM Stereo Forum members Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 13:51:49 +1100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-Type: text/plain From: "Trim, Matthew L" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88615102 X-Yahoo-Profile: bofh2k2000 Sounds like a great idea - Kevin I hope you are open minded enough to take up Tom's challenge and invite him to see your place and show him the hash first hand. -----Original Message----- From: Scott Todd [mailto:stodd@sherbtel.net] Sent: Tuesday, 28 January 2003 12:58 PM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Note to AM Stereo Forum members Tell you what- you two can make the following deal: go and take a tour of WOR, keeping a respectful demeanor, and then he gets to go to your place and you can show him first hand what you've been experiencing. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: > All I have done is simply report > my experience with WOR's signal. And my experience is that a station > that is supposed to be on 710 kHz is causing severe interference over > a range of 680 to 750 kHz on multiple receivers in multiple locations > up to 50 miles away from the transmitter. Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From krichards@wor710.com Mon Jan 27 19:07:37 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 63237 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 03:07:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 03:07:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.88) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 03:07:36 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: krichards@wor710.com Received: from [66.218.67.164] by n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Jan 2003 03:07:36 -0000 X-Sender: krichards@wor710.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 00:57:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 85497 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 00:57:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 00:57:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 00:57:43 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.182] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Jan 2003 00:57:28 -0000 Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 00:57:27 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Some Thoughts on Receivers and IBOC (was Re: ...) Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3478 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kerry Richards " X-Originating-IP: 66.47.86.250 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=136545831 X-Yahoo-Profile: kerryrichards710 X-eGroups-Edited-By: kevtronics X-eGroups-Approved-By: kevtronics via web; 28 Jan 2003 03:07:36 -0000 John, This is a very sensible reply to the problem that happens when a wideband radio of any sort is used when the IBOC carriers are on. It is, in fact, one of the many reasons there may be noise of some sort reproduced at the audio output of any radio. Having asked Ibiquity about this, they demonstrated to me audio recordings where the "white noise" was below program audio, to the point where the "noise" was or was not objectionable. This is the core of the matter, just what is objectionable? This is a very subjective question. I have several radios which have an analog AM bandwidth out to about 7.5Khz, where, when the IBOC carriers come on the existing 5Khz audio response drops slightly. (About 3db) I hear this some mornings getting ready for work, when I have WOR on and the Burk puts the HD on at sunrise. Is this objectionable? This so called hiss is almost unoticable on any of my radios and I'm ten minutes from the WOR transmitter in the main lobe. I am talking about my AIWA and my Henry Kloss Model One radios, the Denon AMAX radio is not objectional in the narrow mode. I have said operating IBOC in the hybrid mode has some tradeoffs, so he we go. But, the bottom line is with about 1500 watts of power (the approximate level of WOR's IBOC carriers) we can deliver a digital stream to a new HD Radio. That to me is OK, and I can accept that. It is a very efficient use of the spectrum, and very surprising how far it gets out. John, your post is very refreshing because it brings to light some of the problems IBOC in the hybrid mode, bring to the current state of AM Radio. And that is why the testing is continuing even though there are no HD radios out there yet. I thought Neal Newman at the recent WOR tour and SBE meeting made a lot of sense in asking "couldn't Ibiquity squeeze the sidebands in a little?". Just like me when we started the whole process, I turned the Optimod 9200 to 6.2Khz analog bandwidth, which is now at 5Khz. All of this is very very subjective, when you consider what you get out of an HD radio in the end, which to me is fantastic. Kerry Richards Chief Engineer WOR-AM Buckley Broadcasting Corporation From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Jan 27 19:24:19 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 03:24:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 63844 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 03:24:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 03:24:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 03:24:18 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.248] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Jan 2003 03:24:18 -0000 Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 03:24:15 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Note to AM Stereo Forum members Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <00cf01c2c679$14e21ae0$827dfea9@home1> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1822 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.90.25 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Tell you what- you two can make the following deal: go and take a > tour of WOR, keeping a respectful demeanor, and then he gets to go > to your place and you can show him first hand what you've been > experiencing. Conditions at WOR's transmitter site are obviously not going to be the same as they are 25 to 50 miles away. I am reporting what I am experiencing at these distances, and that is the whole reason why I even bring it up. I would *expect* to hear such interference if I was within close proximity of multiple 50,000-watt AM transmitters; but these sorts of problems should NOT be happening at these significant distances away from the transmitter, where the received signal strength is considerably less. Nothing would be gained by a visit to WOR. They have an IBOC exciter, and they have a spectrum analyser which tells them the signal it is producing is within the FCC and iBiquity guidelines. As far as Mr. Ray and Mr. Richards are concerned, that's the end of the story, and think what you will, but I have no reason to not believe them. But that doesn't change what I am experiencing out here in the "real world" -- and, as you mention, ANYBODY is welcome to take a visit to my location and witness these same interference issues that I have been experiencing. I also note that when iBiquity had their 100-watt IBOC test station WI2XAM on the air on 1700 kHz from the Lucent offices here in Warren, I drove within a few hundred feet of it and I did not experience any of these same "splatter" interference problems I am getting from WOR's signal. Of course my car radio doesn't tune up to 1750 kHz so I didn't get to fully examine their upper sideband, but at least the lower sideband of their IBOC signal seemed to be contained within its claimed +/- 15 kHz bandwidth. From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Mon Jan 27 19:44:45 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 03:44:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 82272 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 03:44:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 03:44:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf52bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.101) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 03:44:45 -0000 Received: from juan ([68.153.68.61]) by imf52bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.25 201-253-122-122-125-20020815) with SMTP id <20030128034641.MPZY9487.imf52bis.bellsouth.net@juan> for ; Mon, 27 Jan 2003 22:46:41 -0500 Message-ID: <002401c2c67f$9bb9b360$af78fea9@juan> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Note to AM Stereo Forum members Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 22:44:49 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hey Kevin, give it a try, go to the WOR site, and then invite the engineers to experience what you hear... where you are at when you listen to YOUR radios.... Keep an open mind, just give it a chance.....at the very least go to WOR. Juan ----- Original Message ----- From: Kevin T. To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, January 27, 2003 10:24 PM Subject: {AMSF} Re: Note to AM Stereo Forum members > Tell you what- you two can make the following deal: go and take a > tour of WOR, keeping a respectful demeanor, and then he gets to go > to your place and you can show him first hand what you've been > experiencing. Conditions at WOR's transmitter site are obviously not going to be the same as they are 25 to 50 miles away. I am reporting what I am experiencing at these distances, and that is the whole reason why I even bring it up. I would *expect* to hear such interference if I was within close proximity of multiple 50,000-watt AM transmitters; but these sorts of problems should NOT be happening at these significant distances away from the transmitter, where the received signal strength is considerably less. Nothing would be gained by a visit to WOR. They have an IBOC exciter, and they have a spectrum analyser which tells them the signal it is producing is within the FCC and iBiquity guidelines. As far as Mr. Ray and Mr. Richards are concerned, that's the end of the story, and think what you will, but I have no reason to not believe them. But that doesn't change what I am experiencing out here in the "real world" -- and, as you mention, ANYBODY is welcome to take a visit to my location and witness these same interference issues that I have been experiencing. I also note that when iBiquity had their 100-watt IBOC test station WI2XAM on the air on 1700 kHz from the Lucent offices here in Warren, I drove within a few hundred feet of it and I did not experience any of these same "splatter" interference problems I am getting from WOR's signal. Of course my car radio doesn't tune up to 1750 kHz so I didn't get to fully examine their upper sideband, but at least the lower sideband of their IBOC signal seemed to be contained within its claimed +/- 15 kHz bandwidth. Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ADVERTISEMENT Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From KC4QLP@aol.com Mon Jan 27 20:35:30 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 04:35:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 66552 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 04:35:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 04:35:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d03.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.35) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 04:35:29 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.15b.1b04df9c (25305) for ; Mon, 27 Jan 2003 23:35:17 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <15b.1b04df9c.2b676285@aol.com> Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 23:35:17 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Note to AM Stereo Forum members To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 1/27/03 10:25:53 PM Eastern Standard Time, kevtronics@yahoo.com writes: > Conditions at WOR's transmitter site are obviously not going to be > the same as they are 25 to 50 miles away. ok...so if what your hearing there in NJ is as severe as you say it is,then the alledged interference should be stronger at the transmitter site....right?...hmm I am reporting what I am > experiencing at these distances, and that is the whole reason why I > even bring it up. I would *expect* to hear such interference if I > was within close proximity of multiple 50,000-watt AM transmitters Why not go and take Kerry and Tom up on their invite to WOR. Look at what they are looking at.See what they are doing different compared to what your doing in regards to measuring "the noise". <> Oh me..signs of a closed mind. A closed mind will not gain you the wealth of knowledge. << They have an IBOC exciter, and they have a spectrum analyser which tells them the signal it is producing is within the FCC and iBiquity guidelines. As far as Mr. Ray and Mr. Richards are concerned, that's the end of the story, and think what you will, but I have no reason to not believe them. But that doesn't change what I am experiencing out here in the "real world" -- and, as you mention, ANYBODY is welcome to take a visit to my location and witness these same interference issues that I have been experiencing>> As what was stated earlier,once the signal leaves the antenna..and the signal is proven and known to be compliant with the FCC rules,broadcasters are not obligated to "reduce" any "splatter".Perhaps instead of beating a dead horse,you would realize that what WOR is doing is completely 100% total LEGAL.Proof is in the pudding.Tom and Kerry do not bite...they wont knock your lights out...{snicker}{{oh sorry}} ..they want to help you understand what it is they are doing.They dont have to let you see anything. <> Not being able to tune up to 1750khz doesnt equate to a fair comparison agaisnt your comparisons to WOR. Further more...have you ever thought that maybe the digital foramat on the test station might have been a different and improved version...resulting in less interference to the first adjacent? Jumping to negative conclusions isnt the thing to do. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From wa2fnq@optonline.net Mon Jan 27 20:35:50 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: wa2fnq@optonline.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 04:35:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 29573 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 04:35:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 04:35:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.90) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 04:35:50 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.179] by n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Jan 2003 04:35:50 -0000 Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 04:35:49 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Note to AM Stereo Forum members Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 850 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wa2fnq " X-Originating-IP: 24.47.74.230 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=60059615 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa2fnq Kevin, Let's try this: Seeing I'm about 40 or so miles from the transmitter and I don't hear anything wrong with WOR's signal what else do you have around you that may be producing these products in your receivers?? It doesn't have to be in band. You may have something else causing your problem. Jerry WA2FNQ > Conditions at WOR's transmitter site are obviously not going to be > the same as they are 25 to 50 miles away. I am reporting what I am > experiencing at these distances, and that is the whole reason why I > even bring it up. I would *expect* to hear such interference if I > was within close proximity of multiple 50,000-watt AM transmitters; > but these sorts of problems should NOT be happening at these > significant distances away from the transmitter, where the received > signal strength is considerably less. From amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Mon Jan 27 21:15:02 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 36749 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 05:15:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 05:15:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.87) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 05:15:02 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: notify@yahoogroups.com Received: from [66.218.67.145] by n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Jan 2003 05:15:01 -0000 Date: 28 Jan 2003 05:15:01 -0000 Message-ID: <1043730901.234108.14623.w25@yahoogroups.com> X-eGroups-Application: files X-Yahoo-Group-Post: system From: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: New file uploaded to amstereoforum MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello, This email message is a notification to let you know that a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the amstereoforum group. File : /iboc/clarnarr.mp3 Uploaded by : kevtronics Description : Audio recording of a daytime 660 - 770 kHz band scan with 710 WOR's IBOC signal on, as received on a Clarion Audia 200E car radio in Narrow bandwidth mode, 25 miles away from WOR's transmitter. Listen for WOR's digital sidebands on 690, 700, 720, and 730 kHz, plus additional "splatter" heard on 740 and 750 kHz (which only occurs when WOR is transmitting IBOC). You can access this file at the URL http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum/files/iboc/clarnarr.mp3 To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/files Regards, kevtronics From jbyrns@enteract.com Mon Jan 27 21:22:34 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 05:22:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 19377 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 05:22:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 05:22:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.90) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 05:22:33 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.140] by n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Jan 2003 05:22:33 -0000 Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 05:22:33 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Note to AM Stereo Forum members Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2897 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.165 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " < kevtronics@y...> wrote: > > Nothing would be gained by a visit to WOR. They have an IBOC > exciter, and they have a spectrum analyser which tells them the > signal it is producing is within the FCC and iBiquity guidelines. > As far as Mr. Ray and Mr. Richards are concerned, that's the end of > the story, and think what you will, but I have no reason to not > believe them. Am I interpreting this last statement correctly, are you saying that you agree that WOR is operating within the parameters the FCC has set down for their test of the "HD radio" system? > But that doesn't change what I am experiencing out > here in the "real world" -- and, as you mention, ANYBODY is welcome > to take a visit to my location and witness these same interference > issues that I have been experiencing. I don't think anybody is going to pretend that "HD radio" isn't going to have an impact on the coverage of adjacent channel stations, and perhaps even some effect on 2nd adjacent stations, depending on how you care to look at it. But you seem to have agreed that the "HD radio" signal is confined to WOR's channel, as well as the two first adjacent channels. Given that, what is your proposed mechanism for the interference you are experiencing on the third adjacent channels and beyond? There must be some mechanism that is allowing your radio to hear this noise, what is it? Is it simply that you are using a radio with an IF that is way too wide, or is it something more complicated? If you are going to complain, you need to have a plausible explanation for what is causing the problem. We know part of the problem is that you are way outside the normal coverage areas of the stations you say WOR is interfering with, is this the rest of the problem, or is their more? > I also note that when iBiquity had their 100-watt IBOC test station > WI2XAM on the air on 1700 kHz from the Lucent offices here in Warren, > I drove within a few hundred feet of it and I did not experience any > of these same "splatter" interference problems I am getting from > WOR's signal. Of course my car radio doesn't tune up to 1750 kHz so > I didn't get to fully examine their upper sideband, but at least the > lower sideband of their IBOC signal seemed to be contained within its > claimed +/- 15 kHz bandwidth. Now you seem to be reversing course, and implying that WOR's transmitter isn't operating within the claimed parameters. Is WOR's transmitter operating properly or not? What do you think is causing WOR's signal to appear in your radio on channels so far removed from their frequency, what is the mechanism? Once we know that, then we could discuss how the problem might be fixed, but if you don't know what the problem is, how can you begin to know where to look for a solution? John From possumhunter@netzero.net Mon Jan 27 21:30:10 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 05:30:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 68149 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 05:30:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 05:30:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.90) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 05:30:10 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 27 Jan 2003 21:30:10 -0800 To: References: <00cf01c2c679$14e21ae0$827dfea9@home1> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Note to AM Stereo Forum members Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 00:29:50 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 28 Jan 2003 05:30:10.0436 (UTC) FILETIME=[53432440:01C2C68E] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.160.203.160] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Scott Todd wrote: > Tell you what- you two can make the following deal: go and take a tour of WOR, keeping a respectful demeanor, and then he gets to go to your place and you can show him first hand what you've been experiencing. I agree! Kevin, You could drive out to the WOR transmitter and see the splatter meter for yourself instead of having to rely on Cool Edit and a SRF-42. Put a scope on the mod monitor output of the DX-50 and see for yourself what is going out on the air. Then, Tom and / or Kerry can come out to your place and you can show them the splatter and they can use the spectrum analyzer and see what is going on and how IBOC trashes reception on radios that "Joe Sixpack" can buy, or has been able to buy in the past 5 years at Radio Shack, Best Buy, or Sears. There is no need in wasting time demonstrating the noise on Grandpaw's 22 tube Zenith Stratosphere or a modified Japanese market radio hooked to a pre-amp fed by a killer DX antenna. Everybody could then see for themselves that yes, WOR is legal AND that legal signal is causing real problems with Analog radios in the "Real World". After that, y'all can go to the local watering hole and take turns buying each other rounds of beer and be friends. One source of the noise could be an image in the receiving radio. In many radios, if you are close to the 1700Khz transmitter, you will get an image of it on 800 Khz (Station Frequency - IF frequency X 2 = Image frequency) You would be amazed at how many times I get cussed out because people hear WFIS on 700Khz! One guy even drove his car to the station to show me. His Blaupunkt Aspen radio not only had the image at 700Khz, but had another one of WFIS and WLFJ mixing at 680Khz. I had to show him on my Factory Toyota radio made by Fujitsu-Ten that the problem was only in his radio. I get this complaint often with the late 80's-Early 90's Chrysler AM Stereo radios as well. On the other hand, I live nearly 100 miles from the nearest X-Band station and *I* heard the noise and splatter on my un-modified Factory Toyota radio in South Carolina! Was the problem related to selective fading tricking my radio into hissing? Beats me, I don't have the personal funds to go out and buy several thousand dollars worth of test equipment to find out! All I know is *I* heard the noise and I could hear the hiss in the audio of WSB 750, and I live within the .5mv/Meter Day Time contour of WSB. Yes, I do indeed have a kick-@$$ dx rig and heard the noise on it too! Kevin From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Jan 27 22:43:14 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 06:43:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 4188 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 06:43:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 06:43:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.89) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 06:43:13 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.169] by n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Jan 2003 06:43:13 -0000 Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 06:43:12 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: a *rational* discussion of WOR's IBOC signal Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3986 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.90.25 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Am I interpreting this last statement correctly, are you saying > that you agree that WOR is operating within the parameters the FCC > has set down for their test of the "HD radio" system? I assume that the engineers at WOR, and the expensive spectrum anaylser they are looking at, would not lie to me. But EVEN IF WOR's signal is entirely contained with its allocated bandwidth, that does not change the fact that it is causing serious interference to reception of frequencies up to 40 kHz away from their carrier, even on typical narrow-bandwidth AM radios. > Is it simply that you are using a radio with an IF that is way too > wide, or is it something more complicated? If you are going to > complain, you need to have a plausible explanation for what is > causing the problem. My main issue is that on many ordinary AM radios, including those with the narrowest of the narrow bandwidths, I am hearing interference from 710 WOR's signal on 740 and 750 kHz that sounds EXACTLY the same as the "splatter" that is normally heard in either of two cases: 1., when a receiver is experiencing front-end overload, or 2., when a broadcast station is overmodulating. Explanation number 1 is highly questionable, considering that I have heard this "splatter" interference even on a highly selective car radio (with 3 kHz ceramic filter) up to 50 miles away from WOR's transmitter, and that is does not and NEVER HAS occured when WOR is not transmitting an IBOC signal. I have no evidence to prove explanation number 2, except that this "splatter" is clearly "kicked up" by WOR's analog audio modulation. I.e, it is heard much more strongly when WOR is transmitting audio, as compared to when they are transmitting silence -- but it IS still there when WOR is transmitting dead air. I think what it all boils down to is that the IBOC sidebands are broadcast with a certain amount of modulation in WOR's signal, and as far as ordinary AM radios are concerned, this modulation is no different than as if WOR decided to broadcast 15 kHz's worth of white noise through an ordinary analog transmitter. But when you add analog program audio that is highly processed to stay as near to the +125%/-100% limit as possible, IN ADDITION TO the modulation of the IBOC sidebands, then it seems that the total of the "hybrid" signal may add up to be effectively GREATER than +125% -- in other words, a form of overmodulation that may not be detected by WOR's monitoring equipment, but nonetheless can cause overmodulation-type "splatter" effects to receivers, even at distant locations. This is further evidenced by the fact that this "splatter" I am hearing has been noticeably louder at the times when WOR increased the level of their IBOC sidebands closer to the maximum limit, rather than at the "safe" -6 dB level, such as during their nighttime tests, and presumably also within recent weeks, considering that the "splatter" is now worse than ever, as I am receiving it. Also, I believe the reason why I did not experience this kind of "splatter" from WI2XAM's signal is that they were using very low analog modulation levels. Compared to other AM stations on the dial, their analog audio sounded very "quiet", as if it was only approaching, say, 50% modulation. Thus, when you add in WI2XAM's digital sidebands, the total probably didn't effectively exceed 125% or even 100% -- thus, no overmodulation-type "splatter" was heard. Now, before Mr. Ray and Mr. Richards get all upset, I AM NOT CLAIMING THAT WOR IS PURPOSELY OVERMODULATING. I am simply offering a THEORY that might possibly explain what I am experiencing. Also please refer to the audio samples which I am in the process of uploading. These were recorded on Monday afternoon from various receivers at my home in Warren, NJ, and contain "band scans" from 660 to 770 kHz which demonstrate the effect that WOR's IBOC signal is having upon the reception of nearby frequencies. From n0uiheric@aol.com Mon Jan 27 22:57:02 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 06:57:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 18324 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 06:57:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 06:57:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m02.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.5) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 06:57:01 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-m02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.7d.345606a8 (4402) for ; Tue, 28 Jan 2003 01:56:59 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <7d.345606a8.2b6783bb@aol.com> Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 01:56:59 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} The truth shall set you free To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih Personally, Kevin, I hate IBOCrap with a passion. There's an old saying: "If it ain't broke, DON'T FIX IT". AM radio wasn't broken before IBOCrap, and neither was FM radio. The FCC should have never allowed digital radio to be tested on the AM and FM bands, and kept them analog. The only appropriate place for digital radio currently is the L-Band, and the only proven system is Eureka 147. I also believe that the un-American commercial radio industry has gone way too far with censorship. Not only are "play by the rules" jocks being censored by corporate radio, but corporate radio management doesn't seem to want to accept criticism from those of us in this group or any other group. I've learned that the hard way, through my criticism of the industry's policies (including employment policies) on the public bulletin boards. The First Amendment of the Constitution of The United States guarantees our FREE SPEECH RIGHTS. And when a broadcast engineer threatens to turn us in to the local police because we're excercising our rights by criticizing a certain station, then our free speech rights are violated. In other words, it's "free speech for me (corporate radio owners) but not for thee (the average Joe or Jane). This is very unprofessional conduct; I find this to be very un-American, reeks of Stalinism, and should never be forgiven (regardless of whatever faith you practice). I especially feel threatened when someone connected with corporate radio threatens to turn me in to the police just because I am excercising my free speech rights by offering criticism. I support the elimination of IBOCrap. FM and AM should be analog only, unless the European DRM system, adopted for LW, AM and SW, can be improved to accomodate C-QUAM AM Stereo. I also do not support further deregulation of the commercial media; it's cost too many real radio professionals their jobs and careers (replaced largely by media fakes who only got in because they knew someone in upper management). I think those on this list should also write their elected officials and tell them to oppose efforts by the FCC to further deregulate the commercial media. Further deregulation will mean further erosion of the number of C-QUAM stations in the United States. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Mon Jan 27 22:57:02 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 06:57:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 89412 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 06:57:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 06:57:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r10.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.106) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 06:57:01 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-r10.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.41.2a3954f2 (4402) for ; Tue, 28 Jan 2003 01:56:58 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <41.2a3954f2.2b6783b9@aol.com> Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 01:56:57 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} KB-1520 - classic music, classic audio To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih As far as WSAI is concerned, last I heard, the station is LMAed by Clear Channel. They're probably way over the ownership limit for the Cincinnati market. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Mon Jan 27 23:02:59 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 99256 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 07:02:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 07:02:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 07:02:58 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: notify@yahoogroups.com Received: from [66.218.67.191] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Jan 2003 07:02:57 -0000 Date: 28 Jan 2003 07:02:56 -0000 Message-ID: <1043737376.184942.86951.w9@yahoogroups.com> X-eGroups-Application: files X-Yahoo-Group-Post: system From: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: New file uploaded to amstereoforum MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello, This email message is a notification to let you know that a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the amstereoforum group. File : /iboc/panascan.mp3 Uploaded by : kevtronics Description : Audio recording of a daytime 660 - 770 kHz band scan with 710 WOR's IBOC signal on, as received on a Panasonic SG-HM09A stereo system (analog tuning), 25 miles away from WOR's transmitter, using only the built-in antenna. Listen for the "splatter" heard around 740-750 kHz, which seriously harms reception of 740 WGSM (in this case, marginally audible with Korean language underneath the splatter) -- a station whose reception was weak but clear and interference-free before WOR started using IBOC. You can access this file at the URL http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum/files/iboc/panascan.mp3 To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/files Regards, kevtronics From n0uiheric@aol.com Mon Jan 27 23:27:52 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 07:27:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 40569 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 07:27:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 07:27:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m08.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.163) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 07:27:51 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-m08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.1ca.100eef7 (657) for ; Tue, 28 Jan 2003 02:27:46 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1ca.100eef7.2b678af1@aol.com> Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 02:27:45 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} OT: Anti-Voicetracking Petition To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih Bob, I don't think we're wasting the FCC's time...through VT, radio is abandoning the public interest. On the Web site, there's the case of a dangerous train derailment in Minot, ND. Six of the seven stations in the market are voicetracked; the needed information did not get out via commercial radio in the Minot market. This also shows how dangerous VT is to the public safety. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From rwagoner1@mac.com Tue Jan 28 00:13:28 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner1@mac.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 08:13:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 18027 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 08:13:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 08:13:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO fed1mtao06.cox.net) (68.6.19.125) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 08:13:27 -0000 Received: from mac.com ([68.4.33.253]) by fed1mtao06.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20030128081318.WRLY3243.fed1mtao06.cox.net@mac.com> for ; Tue, 28 Jan 2003 03:13:18 -0500 Message-ID: <3E363BA6.8030506@mac.com> Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 00:13:26 -0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20021120 Netscape/7.01 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} The truth shall set you free References: <7d.345606a8.2b6783bb@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Richard Wagoner X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135738921 X-Yahoo-Profile: richardalanwagoner > AM radio wasn't broken before IBOCrap, and > neither was FM radio. I'd disagree here. The problem has many different aspects, including (and in my opinion primarily) programming, modern receiver design, etc., but when the AM band, king of radio as recently as 1981 (or later in some parts) now commands only 25% of the listening audience, then it IS broken. There are some people who have never even ventured off the FM band. That's why the supporters so badly want digital IBOC to work: it could bring sound parity to AM and allow a band that is essentially a programming wasteland make a comeback. I sincerely doubt that there is an engineer anywhere that would purposely push something that sounded bad. Every engineer I know tries to get the best sound and constantly fights against programmers who want more punch. I'm not stating that IBOC suppoorters are right. Nor am I saying they are wrong. I have not heard IBOC in person myself, and mp3s are not a good way to hear it. But to say that AM radio isn't broken is, well, wrong. Richard Wagoner From amymousie@yahoo.com Tue Jan 28 00:40:03 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 08:40:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 63665 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 08:40:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 08:40:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.83) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 08:40:02 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.186] by n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Jan 2003 08:40:01 -0000 Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 08:40:00 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Something positive for/about AM stereo? Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 243 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 67.115.110.131 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie I would like to paraphrase Ian from Oz, if I may: What have you done to promote, advance, or otherwise put in a positive light, AM stereo? Is there anything positive about AM stereo? Is AM stereo worth the time and effort? Amy. <:3 )~~~ From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Jan 28 01:21:40 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 09:21:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 90674 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 09:21:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 09:21:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 09:21:39 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.157] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Jan 2003 09:21:39 -0000 Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 09:21:39 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: KB-1520... proud to be MONO? Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 864 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.90.25 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics I just heard their hourly ID, and it specifically mentioned something to the effect of "Playing Oldies, on an AM station IN MONO..... KB Radio, 1520!" Is this the first time that a radio station is actually promoting the fact that they are broadcasting in mono? It's really the first time I've heard a mention of such a thing since "Come On Eileen" was a hit (to quote its opening lyrics, "Poor old Johnny Ray / Sounded sad upon the radio / He moved a million hearts in mono").... Also, WWKB still has a few loose ends to tie up regarding programming mangement... at the top of the hour, so far I have either heard a rebroadcast of the news from fellow Buffalo station 930 WBEN (with no mention of 1520 WWKB), or a few minutes of dead air followed by repeated network announcements saying things like "The Joey Reynolds show, coming up at 0-6-40..." From rwagoner1@mac.com Tue Jan 28 01:30:43 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner1@mac.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 09:30:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 3048 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 09:30:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 09:30:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO fed1mtao08.cox.net) (68.6.19.123) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 09:30:42 -0000 Received: from mac.com ([68.4.33.253]) by fed1mtao08.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20030128093032.WJES1215.fed1mtao08.cox.net@mac.com> for ; Tue, 28 Jan 2003 04:30:32 -0500 Message-ID: <3E364DC2.50009@mac.com> Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 01:30:42 -0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20021120 Netscape/7.01 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Something positive for/about AM stereo? References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Richard Wagoner X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135738921 X-Yahoo-Profile: richardalanwagoner Personally I think it is worth the effort, but it is certainly an uphill battle. What receivers are currently available that will receive AM stereo in the home? None in the US. How about cars? I believe Chrysler is the only one still offering them. Additionally, stating that AM is in stereo means nothing to people who wonder why AM still sounds like crap on the same crappy radio they've owned for years. And more seriously, until programmers start putting something on AM worth listening to, then nothing will help. It's too bad the FCC cannot force manufacturers to put decent AM sections in their radios. Even mono AM sounds great when it is wideband. I like the sound of analog AM on a good radio, stereo or not. If GE can do it in a $50 portable, why can't the others? I understand that one of Kahn's requirements for licensing his system was that the receiver had to be good. Motorola didn't, and that may have hurt AM stereo more than anything (witness: the Radio Shack AM stereo tuner, or the Kraco car unit, both of which probably made more people tune away from AM stereo than anything else, at a time when the momentum was there). Convincing more stations to turn back on the C-QUAM exciter may help me personally, so I can hear AM stereo on my Carver TX-11b (with the limitation of seriously bad programming in Southern California). But it doesn't help AM in general if the public has no way to buy a radio and hear good AM. Richard > What have you done to promote, advance, or otherwise put in a > positive light, AM stereo? Is there anything positive about AM > stereo? Is AM stereo worth the time and effort? Richard From dav259@csiro.au Tue Jan 28 01:35:28 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 09:35:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 52200 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 09:35:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 09:35:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 09:35:27 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0S9ZQR00426; Tue, 28 Jan 2003 20:35:26 +1100 (EST) Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 20:35:26 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: amstereoforum Cc: Subject: KB1520 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=112635033 After ploughing (skimming) through what seemed like a hundred messages today does anyone know if KB1520 Buffalo launched in AM stereo? On the common thread of the moment I think it's good that the engineers at WOR are talking to us. Please all try and keep you hats on. I'm thankfully on a 3AK made up list of listeners and the CEO (who's very hands on) occasionally asks us how the reception is, what we think of something or other, and gives us a copy of any press releases. And it's good. It makes you feel more involved. His biggest concern so far was when there was trouble with reception in some areas and he wanted to know which suburbs were affected. It turns out the trouble (which I didn't detect) was caused by 4BC - 900 miles away in Brisbane and on the same frequency. Apparently they were given permission to increase power (from only 5K during the day) and it did affect some Melbourne listening I expect at night when maybe 4BC didn't power down early enough - but that is only my speculation - and we've been told the trouble has been sorted. Ian Melbourne From groucho@skyweb.net Tue Jan 28 02:00:55 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 10:00:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 24062 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 10:00:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 10:00:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 10:00:55 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (max1-170.skyweb.net [66.6.130.42]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h0SA8wjF019681 for ; Tue, 28 Jan 2003 05:08:58 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3E3652FA.3707C589@skyweb.net> Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 04:52:58 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Note to AM Stereo Forum members References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Jerry Check your Ears LOL.... Hold Onto Your Hats Boys. I came up with a real doosy....and it makes sense to Me..... BTW its Not Off topic... It Contains a form Of AM stereo.. If you Hear the Hash on 700 and 720.. In theory Yes IBOC is Working Correctly But we all know. that using up all the space in the Mask protecting the stations on the First adjacent Does Not mean Its right.... You know Me personally.. It may not Be as bad as he(KT) Describes.... However I too hear It here in New Jersey... I guess I have Problems with my receivers also??? Nahhh Doubt it.. what really has caught my attention is what Tom had Stated about the IBOC being 1500 watts??? Maybe I read that wrong?? Maybe he can Explain Further. Because If the IBOC sidebands are Only at 1500 watts... then can we swap the 1500 For the 50K LOL... for 1500 watts its got some punch..It covers just as far as the 50 kW. get Rid of the 50 kw........ Just kidding... what would solve this problem On the AM Band. would Be To take all the 25 and 50kw Stations, and make them Disappear then re-license EVERY AM station To a MAX of 10 kW... If you cannot do it with 10 kW day 1 Kw night.. Get off the Spectrum...... LOL... Hell what's the Difference all the big guys are Buying up all the smaller stations why not Be like Cell phones..using Cells of 10kw stations.. If you cannot Cover what you want buy another 10kw station and Simulcast.... didn't they do that on 107.1Fm with 4 transmitters they Covered 4 states.... Long Island and eastern CT with Westhampton... NJ and southern NY with Long branch..... Western NJ and PA from Straudsburg, and western CT and NY From westchester.... If you want the Coverage with a 10kw On AM.....I would Use my 1680 as an example. Because I can hear Both Florida and Michigan Here.. So for me to cover the East coast From Canada to Florida.. I would Run Just 3 stations... Florida and princeton.. and place One in Either NC or SC. for the Daytime Coverage... At night just run FL. and princeton..Simulcast all 3.. and I have the Entire east coast Covered. using a total Of only 30 kw day and 2 kw at night... who needs 50 kw.. Its a waste of Energy and Spectrum... now Here's another thought... IBOC is Digital.. Use a higher Bit coding and Run 3 stations off the 1 transmitter.... 1 station On lowersideband 1 station On Upper sideband. and analog...... WOW 2 Digital stereo Music stations and 1 analog Talk station Heck I just tripled the amount Of stations on the AM band.... REmember according to Ibiquity they way they have things Now.. Expanded band stations only Need 1 sideband For IBOC to work(snicker snicker).. But at the lower End of the band Lets see 540,570,620,660, 710,770, Right there are 6 transmitting stations.. If we use it they way I say... I see 12 New Digital Stereo stations and 6 talk stations 18 radio stations on 6 frequencies... and No Contour overlap problems.... why should I worry about digital drop out with No redundancy On these frequencies.... Ibiquity says It works Ok on the Expanded band. You were there and heard it Yourself. So why do we Need redundancy on both sidebands From 530 to 1600???? now just place a selector switch on the receivers to select switch sideband you want to listen to.. Just picture this... Buckley now can have 3 station formats On just 1 transmitter site... on 710 select Lowersideband and listen To Country 710-HD in Full digital stereo.... Center WOR talk In analog 5kc sounds good so far Right. Now Select Uppersideband and Listen To Oldies710-HD In Full Digital Stereo.. I get the royalty Rights to This Idea and Ibiquity sends me the Checks...LOL... You heard it right Here From Me.... So If Ibiquity takes This Idea. Do I become the Father of Digital AM radio???? at least My Idea is in the Open , and If they Do it I have lots of witnesses that It was My Idea First Ohhh Boy Looks Like I really Hit the jackpot Here for Flaming... Any Takers on this suggestion....??? I am a Glutton for a Beating right about Now... No I am Not Picking On WOR just a great thought... that flashed through My Brain at 4am and woke me up out of Bed Neal "wa2fnq " wrote: > Kevin, > > Let's try this: > > Seeing I'm about 40 or so miles from the transmitter and I don't hear > anything wrong with WOR's signal what else do you have around you > that may be producing these products in your receivers?? It doesn't > have to be in band. You may have something else causing your problem. > > Jerry WA2FNQ > > > Conditions at WOR's transmitter site are obviously not going to be > > the same as they are 25 to 50 miles away. I am reporting what I am > > experiencing at these distances, and that is the whole reason why I > > even bring it up. I would *expect* to hear such interference if I > > was within close proximity of multiple 50,000-watt AM transmitters; > > but these sorts of problems should NOT be happening at these > > significant distances away from the transmitter, where the received > > signal strength is considerably less. > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From dav259@csiro.au Tue Jan 28 02:18:36 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 10:18:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 7633 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 10:18:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 10:18:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 10:18:35 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0SAIYR02163 for ; Tue, 28 Jan 2003 21:18:34 +1100 (EST) Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 21:18:34 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Something positive for/about AM stereo? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=112635033 On Tue, 28 Jan 2003, amymousie wrote: > I would like to paraphrase Ian from Oz, if I may: > > What have you done to promote, advance, or otherwise put in a > positive light, AM stereo? Is there anything positive about AM > stereo? Is AM stereo worth the time and effort? > > Amy. <:3 )~~~ You are too kind Amy ... Most of us (I could say all of us) KNOW how good AM stereo can sound. And that's what we're all about. It's quite OK to have a bitch session here - after all we're only a discussion group. So bitch away! Industry people on "the other side" who are here have to realise - and probably do - that we love what we hear and that's why we're about what we're about. If they come up with something better - I'll be the first to jump on the bandwagon! Then maybe there won't be "another side". But - till then ... YOU!!! have to fight for what you know pleases you. Complain and bitch here by all means - butt! ... for God's sake contact your local stations when something either pleases you or doesn't. Write to your newspapers, the FCC, congressmen, or anyone who can make a difference. And for once Kevin Redding - I think you said it all. I don't think the powers that be at WOR would be too pleased with the initial damning messages that were received. But thankfully the mood from WOR seems to be changing - and it's good to be able to discuss this with them. I hope KT that you will take up their offer - and do the full tour. Even if it's personally uncomfortable - it's something you have to do for all our sakes. AM stereo forever! ... or until something better comes along. Pity about KB1520 ... but we must fight on. Ian Melbourne From groucho@skyweb.net Tue Jan 28 02:22:35 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 10:22:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 41347 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 10:22:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 10:22:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 10:22:35 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (max1-170.skyweb.net [66.6.130.42]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h0SAUbjF024917 for ; Tue, 28 Jan 2003 05:30:38 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3E36580C.335AE95B@skyweb.net> Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 05:14:36 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: a *rational* discussion of WOR's IBOC signal References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 You Know for once I think Kevin nailed it right on the head....... For those of us that did attend the Demo.... Tom did show us that with the IBOC OFF..the modulation was Right up just Below 125% I cannot remember exactly But I will say 123% to play it safe.. and when the IBOC was Turned back on the modulation went Way Up.. the reason For this is that The Modulation Meters are Not designed To listen to a signal as Wide as what they are transmitting.. Or something To that effect. So In reality.. as Kevin states It Just may Very well be possible that the TOTAL Modulation with the IBOC on is Greater than 125% Not saying that it is.. But From what I saw... It may Be possible... Tom or Kerry can refresh My memory on this with the Modulation Meter bandwidth and accuracy. Just remember 1 thing.. WOR is STA'd as a test Station so Even If the modulation was a Bit Hot Over 125% does Not Mean they are Running Illegally. as a test station The STA grants them a bit of Protection during these testing phases..Until a unit is designed and approved To accurately. give the Modulation Levels at the Full Bandwidth containing the IBOC signal.. Right now From what I saw the only way to set up the IBOC Level is using a spectrum analyser... again Tom or Kerry can answer that.... For I too am courious as to how they determined the IBOC level and the Total Modulation Level up to 125% with IBOC carrier... I know for a fact seeing it with My own 2 eyes they are between 100 and 123% without the IBOC to begin with...so I am fairly certain it is above that level combined with IBOC on.. But the analog is still at 123% Neal still getting an education and not flaming anyone.. "Kevin T. " wrote: > > Am I interpreting this last statement correctly, are you saying > > that you agree that WOR is operating within the parameters the FCC > > has set down for their test of the "HD radio" system? > > I assume that the engineers at WOR, and the expensive spectrum > anaylser they are looking at, would not lie to me. But EVEN IF WOR's > signal is entirely contained with its allocated bandwidth, that does > not change the fact that it is causing serious interference to > reception of frequencies up to 40 kHz away from their carrier, even > on typical narrow-bandwidth AM radios. > > > Is it simply that you are using a radio with an IF that is way too > > wide, or is it something more complicated? If you are going to > > complain, you need to have a plausible explanation for what is > > causing the problem. > > My main issue is that on many ordinary AM radios, including those > with the narrowest of the narrow bandwidths, I am hearing > interference from 710 WOR's signal on 740 and 750 kHz that sounds > EXACTLY the same as the "splatter" that is normally heard in either > of two cases: 1., when a receiver is experiencing front-end overload, > or 2., when a broadcast station is overmodulating. > > Explanation number 1 is highly questionable, considering that I have > heard this "splatter" interference even on a highly selective car > radio (with 3 kHz ceramic filter) up to 50 miles away from WOR's > transmitter, and that is does not and NEVER HAS occured when WOR is > not transmitting an IBOC signal. > > I have no evidence to prove explanation number 2, except that this > "splatter" is clearly "kicked up" by WOR's analog audio modulation. > I.e, it is heard much more strongly when WOR is transmitting audio, > as compared to when they are transmitting silence -- but it IS still > there when WOR is transmitting dead air. > > I think what it all boils down to is that the IBOC sidebands are > broadcast with a certain amount of modulation in WOR's signal, and as > far as ordinary AM radios are concerned, this modulation is no > different than as if WOR decided to broadcast 15 kHz's worth of white > noise through an ordinary analog transmitter. But when you add > analog program audio that is highly processed to stay as near to the > +125%/-100% limit as possible, IN ADDITION TO the modulation of the > IBOC sidebands, then it seems that the total of the "hybrid" signal > may add up to be effectively GREATER than +125% -- in other words, a > form of overmodulation that may not be detected by WOR's monitoring > equipment, but nonetheless can cause overmodulation-type "splatter" > effects to receivers, even at distant locations. > > This is further evidenced by the fact that this "splatter" I am > hearing has been noticeably louder at the times when WOR increased > the level of their IBOC sidebands closer to the maximum limit, > rather than at the "safe" -6 dB level, such as during their nighttime > tests, and presumably also within recent weeks, considering that the > "splatter" is now worse than ever, as I am receiving it. > > Also, I believe the reason why I did not experience this kind of > "splatter" from WI2XAM's signal is that they were using very low > analog modulation levels. Compared to other AM stations on the dial, > their analog audio sounded very "quiet", as if it was only > approaching, say, 50% modulation. Thus, when you add in WI2XAM's > digital sidebands, the total probably didn't effectively exceed 125% > or even 100% -- thus, no overmodulation-type "splatter" was heard. > > Now, before Mr. Ray and Mr. Richards get all upset, I AM NOT CLAIMING > THAT WOR IS PURPOSELY OVERMODULATING. I am simply offering a THEORY > that might possibly explain what I am experiencing. > > Also please refer to the audio samples which I am in the process of > uploading. These were recorded on Monday afternoon from various > receivers at my home in Warren, NJ, and contain "band scans" from > 660 to 770 kHz which demonstrate the effect that WOR's IBOC signal is > having upon the reception of nearby frequencies. > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From groucho@skyweb.net Tue Jan 28 02:43:09 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 10:43:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 86844 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 10:43:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 10:43:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 10:43:08 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (max1-202.skyweb.net [66.6.130.74]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h0SApCjF029708 for ; Tue, 28 Jan 2003 05:51:12 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3E365CDE.F520F6A7@skyweb.net> Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 05:35:10 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Something positive for/about AM stereo? References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Hello Amy I knew Nothing about AM stereo Nor Ever heard about AM stereo until I became the Chief Engineer at WTTM when I got the station It was in MONO.... But all the gear was in the racks... I didn't even have a AM stereo receiver except for the modulation meter... I would Go down to the transmitter site late at Night and replace the MONO studio Feed with My Laptop(BTW a Stereo feed was to Be installed just waiting for the Phone Company at that point). anyway Late at Night I would Play the laptop with a Full stereo american Format Of Rock,Country and Oldies.. and started to set-up the Audio chain.. what I heard coming out of the Modulation Meter into a set of headphones with Full separation. got me really excited how Good it started to sound... made me Tinker more.... to the Point where it is Now... Depending on what the DJ's play We are a south asian format station... alot of the classics are in mono and sound like hell no matter what I do... But the Newer music just sounds awesome In Full stereo separation... If you Get the chance listen to the WTTM Christmas File from the Forum DL section... On Christmas I took Control and Played X-mas music In Full stereo.. I think Kevin made the recording on an SRF-42.. It gave me Chills hearing it sound so good... If I was asked by another station Owner if its worth going IBOC or C-quam... at this point in Time.. It would Be C-quam... with the Right audio chain and Transmitter/exciter combo...C-quam AM stereo al the way.. besides its cheaper than IBOC. I feel its worth the Time and Effort.. So do the Owners of the station.. They were not sure Till I gave them a Converted Boom Ball radio... Neal "amymousie " wrote: > I would like to paraphrase Ian from Oz, if I may: > > What have you done to promote, advance, or otherwise put in a > positive light, AM stereo? Is there anything positive about AM > stereo? Is AM stereo worth the time and effort? > > Amy. <:3 )~~~ > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From watan-ko@h4.dion.ne.jp Tue Jan 28 05:22:58 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: watan-ko@h4.dion.ne.jp X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 13:22:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 78856 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 13:22:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 13:22:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.70) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 13:22:53 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.128] by n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Jan 2003 13:22:53 -0000 Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 13:22:52 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: 1959 AM Stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 205 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "irukero " X-Originating-IP: 219.108.96.87 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=67253313 X-Yahoo-Profile: irukero Dear John and Amy, Thank you for the kind and helpful info about 1959 RCA AM stereo. I think disabling the limiter and using FM discriminator will detect C- QUAM signal. I will try. Sincerely, Koji From bjackson@indyradio.com Tue Jan 28 07:17:38 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 15:17:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 61479 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 15:17:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 15:17:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 15:17:32 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.182] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Jan 2003 15:17:31 -0000 Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 15:17:28 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Verify WSAI?--nope--it isnt so--sorry guys Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <144.8dc272e.2b673c19@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 596 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923 " X-Originating-IP: 64.25.100.110 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 That does seem to be the case...I tried 3 different radios...Only one (Delco UX-1) kicked into stereo. No pilot on the others. -Bradley Jackson -Susquehanna, Indianapolis -WGLD/WGRL/WFMS --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, KC4QLP@a... wrote: > WSAI is not operating in stereo as many would hope. Its reported that there > is a daytimer somewhere leaving their transmitter on after sunset.The > FCC,I've been told is looking into it. > More than likely the daytimer with dead air is just off frequency enough to > make your radio think they are sending the 25hz pilot. > > Bob Carter From michaelj@vcn.com Tue Jan 28 07:18:48 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 15:18:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 31788 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 15:18:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 15:18:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m2-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.32) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 15:18:36 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m2-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Tue, 28 Jan 2003 08:18:36 -0700 Message-ID: <004601c2c6e0$85eef840$0701010a@keva> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} KB-1520... proud to be MONO? Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 08:18:32 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Well that answers my question. I was going to ask if anyone bothered to call or contact the engineering department over there and see if they'd turn the stereo back on. That's something that could be easily done with them having just been stereo. But I guess not. This makes sense to me. I can tell ya what's going on. This comes from the programming department. They are doing this to grab more listeners. Seriously. My boss here is one of these "old pros" that's been doing this stuff for about 30 years. Meanwhile I am a major audiophile, always looking for "stereo versions" of things. The way my boss put it to me is "no one wants to hear those old songs in stereo! When they heard them the first time they heard them all in MONO on an AM radio! That's what they want to hear! They don't care about stereo versions! Hell, people that hear the stereo versions now say that it drives them nuts having music here and drums there! They want to hear these oldies the way they heard them the first time!! When these songs were out everything on the radio was mono anyway!" This is the story I get from him every time I ask about stereo. He just shakes his head when I say that I finally found a "stereo version" of a song that I've been looking for forever. Anyways......the guys at 'kb' are going on the same theory. They're looking to be as close to the old sound as they can. That includes "pumping thumping" processing and MONO. I don't see that much merit to promoting it that way.....and I wouldn't see a problem broadcasting in AM Stereo....but then again, they are THAT MUCH into being faithful to the "original" sound of the times that they are trying to recreate. I think as long as they do this, they're not going to want to turn the stereo back on. :( MJR n WYO ----- Original Message ----- From: Kevin T. To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, January 28, 2003 2:21 AM Subject: {AMSF} KB-1520... proud to be MONO? I just heard their hourly ID, and it specifically mentioned something to the effect of "Playing Oldies, on an AM station IN MONO..... KB Radio, 1520!" [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From bjackson@indyradio.com Tue Jan 28 07:34:35 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 15:34:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 67356 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 15:34:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 15:34:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.64) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 15:34:33 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.133] by n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Jan 2003 15:34:30 -0000 Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 15:34:30 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: Note to AM Stereo Forum members Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <002401c2c67f$9bb9b360$af78fea9@juan> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 842 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923 " X-Originating-IP: 64.25.100.110 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Juan / John Gualda" wrote: > Hey Kevin, give it a try, go to the WOR site, and then invite the engineers to experience what you hear... where you are at when you listen to YOUR radios.... > > Keep an open mind, just give it a chance.....at the very least go to WOR. > > > Juan Heck, if I were closer, * I * sure would...Not only would I love to see such as classic station and transmitter, I'd love to meet the engineers behind it *regardless* of our differing views on AM Stereo...I seem to remember an article a few years back in RW about WOR losing all the phone lines into and out of the building, and how fast their engineers were able to get around the problem. Is my memory right here? -Bradley Jackson -Susquehanna, Indianapolis -WGLD/WGRL/WFMS -www.indyradio.com From jbyrns@enteract.com Tue Jan 28 08:28:56 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 16:28:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 23136 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 16:28:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 16:28:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 16:28:54 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.137] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Jan 2003 16:28:46 -0000 Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 16:28:45 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: Note to AM Stereo Forum members Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1542 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.98.234 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Possum Hunter" < possumhunter@n...> wrote: > > On the other hand, I live nearly 100 miles from the nearest X-Band station > and *I* heard the noise and splatter on my un-modified Factory Toyota radio > in South Carolina! Was the problem related to selective fading tricking my > radio into hissing? Beats me, I don't have the personal funds to go out and > buy several thousand dollars worth of test equipment to find out! All I know > is *I* heard the noise and I could hear the hiss in the audio of WSB 750, > and I live within the .5mv/Meter Day Time contour of WSB. > > Yes, I do indeed have a kick-@$$ dx rig and heard the noise on it too! This doesn't even pass the smell test! I forget the exact distance between your location and WOR, but I think is was a pretty significant distance, enough where WOR's ground wave would be virtually non existent by the time it reached you, making it hard for me to understand how you could be hearing interference from them during the day. Also I believe there are at least two other stations on 750 kHz between you and WOR, with omni antennas during the day, why aren't these stations causing even worse interference with WSB at your location, given the problem WOR is supposedly causing? This is ignoring the fact that WOR's signal is supposedly confined to the 695 kHz to 725 kHz range, which makes it even harder to believe your report. Are you sure the hiss you hear on WSB's audio isn't coming from some other source than WOR? John From amfmdx@fastq.com Tue Jan 28 08:29:08 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 16:29:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 87406 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 16:29:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 16:29:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 16:29:05 -0000 Received: from fastq (d89-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.121]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id h0SGT4P90675 for ; Tue, 28 Jan 2003 09:29:04 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <012801c2c6ea$48aadf80$96f9bed8@com> To: Subject: WSAI -- Hello Kevin! Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 09:28:24 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla >That is possible, but the "Stereo pilot" from 1530 WSAI has been >pretty darn consistent these past few nights, even when their signal >doesn't have any noticeable "flutter" to it (which typically is a >sign of "falsing"). It also started happening suspiciously close to >the debut of WSAI's Oldies music format. Kevin, Paul Jellison the CE of WLW and WSAI states that WSAI is not in stereo. As the CE, I think he would know. Let me put this to rest. WSAI is not in stereo and the falsing is from the station running OC all night. Mr. Jellison is rather exercised about this station with the OC. Kevin "Its going to get a lot worse before it gets worse" - Lily Tomlin From jbyrns@enteract.com Tue Jan 28 08:32:54 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 16:32:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 37463 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 16:32:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 16:32:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 16:32:48 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.182] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Jan 2003 16:32:46 -0000 Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 16:32:44 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: a *rational* discussion of WOR's IBOC signal Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 5678 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.98.234 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g Your THEORY about over modulation causing the splatter problem you hear doesn't hold water, if WOR is really checking their signal with a properly setup spectrum analyzer. Over modulation doesn't cause splatter into other channels without creating energy in those other channels, and a properly operating spectrum analyzer should show splatter due to over modulation, if it were happening. Just as an aside, it is possible to modulate more than 100% negative with the right transmitter, without causing splatter into other channels. Consider the old RCA Ampliphase transmitters, if you disconnect the RF feedback, and the negative peak clipper in the exciter, you can easily modulate more than 100% in the negative direction, without creating any splatter into adjacent channels. Greater than 100% negative modulation in this case results in the carrier phase flipping on high negative modulation, and then increasing in amplitude again with the phase reversed. This does not create any new frequency components in the radiated signal to cause splatter, however it will cause horrendous distortion in an envelope detector. The same effect of greater than 100% negative modulation can be noticed with any transmitter, if you use a high Q filter to reduce the carrier level some. This effect is sometimes seen in the nulls of directional antenna systems, when the carrier is attenuated more than the modulation sidebands. John --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " < kevtronics@y...> wrote: > > Am I interpreting this last statement correctly, are you saying > > that you agree that WOR is operating within the parameters the FCC > > has set down for their test of the "HD radio" system? > > I assume that the engineers at WOR, and the expensive spectrum > anaylser they are looking at, would not lie to me. But EVEN IF WOR's > signal is entirely contained with its allocated bandwidth, that does > not change the fact that it is causing serious interference to > reception of frequencies up to 40 kHz away from their carrier, even > on typical narrow-bandwidth AM radios. > > > Is it simply that you are using a radio with an IF that is way too > > wide, or is it something more complicated? If you are going to > > complain, you need to have a plausible explanation for what is > > causing the problem. > > My main issue is that on many ordinary AM radios, including those > with the narrowest of the narrow bandwidths, I am hearing > interference from 710 WOR's signal on 740 and 750 kHz that sounds > EXACTLY the same as the "splatter" that is normally heard in either > of two cases: 1., when a receiver is experiencing front-end overload, > or 2., when a broadcast station is overmodulating. > > Explanation number 1 is highly questionable, considering that I have > heard this "splatter" interference even on a highly selective car > radio (with 3 kHz ceramic filter) up to 50 miles away from WOR's > transmitter, and that is does not and NEVER HAS occured when WOR is > not transmitting an IBOC signal. > > I have no evidence to prove explanation number 2, except that this > "splatter" is clearly "kicked up" by WOR's analog audio modulation. > I.e, it is heard much more strongly when WOR is transmitting audio, > as compared to when they are transmitting silence -- but it IS still > there when WOR is transmitting dead air. > > I think what it all boils down to is that the IBOC sidebands are > broadcast with a certain amount of modulation in WOR's signal, and as > far as ordinary AM radios are concerned, this modulation is no > different than as if WOR decided to broadcast 15 kHz's worth of white > noise through an ordinary analog transmitter. But when you add > analog program audio that is highly processed to stay as near to the > +125%/-100% limit as possible, IN ADDITION TO the modulation of the > IBOC sidebands, then it seems that the total of the "hybrid" signal > may add up to be effectively GREATER than +125% -- in other words, a > form of overmodulation that may not be detected by WOR's monitoring > equipment, but nonetheless can cause overmodulation-type "splatter" > effects to receivers, even at distant locations. > > This is further evidenced by the fact that this "splatter" I am > hearing has been noticeably louder at the times when WOR increased > the level of their IBOC sidebands closer to the maximum limit, > rather than at the "safe" -6 dB level, such as during their nighttime > tests, and presumably also within recent weeks, considering that the > "splatter" is now worse than ever, as I am receiving it. > > Also, I believe the reason why I did not experience this kind of > "splatter" from WI2XAM's signal is that they were using very low > analog modulation levels. Compared to other AM stations on the dial, > their analog audio sounded very "quiet", as if it was only > approaching, say, 50% modulation. Thus, when you add in WI2XAM's > digital sidebands, the total probably didn't effectively exceed 125% > or even 100% -- thus, no overmodulation-type "splatter" was heard. > > Now, before Mr. Ray and Mr. Richards get all upset, I AM NOT CLAIMING > THAT WOR IS PURPOSELY OVERMODULATING. I am simply offering a THEORY > that might possibly explain what I am experiencing. > > Also please refer to the audio samples which I am in the process of > uploading. These were recorded on Monday afternoon from various > receivers at my home in Warren, NJ, and contain "band scans" from > 660 to 770 kHz which demonstrate the effect that WOR's IBOC signal is > having upon the reception of nearby frequencies. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Jan 28 08:42:33 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 16:42:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 65279 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 16:42:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 16:42:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web12808.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.174.43) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 16:42:32 -0000 Message-ID: <20030128164232.3960.qmail@web12808.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [66.200.203.66] by web12808.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 28 Jan 2003 08:42:32 PST Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 08:42:32 -0800 (PST) Subject: AM Stereo in the Philippines To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "Kevin T." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics I recently received this message: > Greetings! > > I came across your AM stereo webpage while surfing around one day and I > have to say that got me really interested in AM Stereo. It's just a > shame that AM Stereo radios are very hard to come across so everyone can > enjoy it. Anyway, I'd just like to make an addition to your world AM > Stereo station list for the next time you update your list: > > DWWW 774kHz Manila, The Philippines > > I'm not really sure if they broadcast in Stereo (as i don't have a stereo > AM radio yet) but they do announce on-air and in print-ads that they > broadcast in stereo, so that should be a safe assumption that they do. > Hope this helps :) > > Regards, > > Mel > > Manila, Philippines __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From michaelj@vcn.com Tue Jan 28 09:28:30 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 17:28:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 48039 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 17:28:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 17:28:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m3-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.33) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 17:28:29 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m3-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Tue, 28 Jan 2003 10:28:29 -0700 Message-ID: <00d601c2c6f2$aafba900$0701010a@keva> To: References: <3E3652FA.3707C589@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Note to AM Stereo Forum members Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 10:28:24 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Ya know Neal, it makes perfect sense to me! It really does! If they only need ONE sideband to transmit the digital, then why not! :) Have another station on the other sideband. Know what makes even more sense to me? Well....if you only have to use ONE sideband to do this.....then why not use BOTH sidebands to transmit the digital part of the signal. No, I don't mean having a redundancy...I mean put half of the digital info on one sideband, put the other half on the other. Sorta like having 2 phone lines for your modem and being able to recieve/transmit information to/from your computer at 112 kbps instead of 56kbps. NOW...if they do THAT do you think we could get better sound out of it??? I know a RealPlayer 56K feed certainly sounds better than a RealPlayer 28.8 feed. It just doesn't sound good. I wish it sounded better. And trashing the analog portion down to 5khz really sounds bad. That's half the bandwidth. I will admit that in my wife's 2001 Chevy Impala....the RDS stock radio that comes with the car.....no....it's probaby not above 5khz. The stations all sound the same. I haven't mentioned this here on the list yet, but KXNT 840 in Las Vegas STILL has their 5khz filter on....whether they are still transmitting IBOC or not. I don't think they are. I think that was just for the show down there a few weeks ago. But they still have the 5khz filter on, and on my SRF-42, as well as MY car radio, I can hear a major difference. They sound slightly better than phone. It reminds me of the old days when we used to use a "Comrex" phone system to recieve sports games. A single line comrex I guess sounded slightly better than regular phone. Added some low end to the sound and that's about it. That is how KXNT sounds right now. It sounds like crap. So, that having been said, and what I mentioned earlier....if instead of using both sidebands to have "redundencies", couldn't you just take advantage of having 2 sidebands to use, transmit MORE digital information so that the digital signal sounds better, and yet at the same time using both sidebands like that, be able to WIDEN the analog bandwidth to 7.5khz (the AMAX standard) so that it sounds better? I am serious here, folks. Honestly.....don't you think this would really go over better with the public if at least when you DO get out of range or lose the digital carrier, it STILL sounds decent?? It's only a few more khz. Widen the ANALOG portion to 7.5 khz. Then on the new IBOC receivers, make the analog mode TAKE ADVANTAGE AND REPRODUCE that full 7.5khz. Again, back to the old addage "AM radio sounds good....AM analog, that is." It really does. We receive our news/sports broadcasts on an analog SCPC receiver. Bandwidth is......7.5khz. Sounds fine to me and a hell of a lot better than muffled 5khz. *whew!* Yes, that was a mouthfull. I'm ready. Got my helmet on. I know I'll get blasted. But notice that I'm not killing IBOC. I'm not bad-mouthing it. Just looking to fix the major problem that most people have with it. The SOUND QUALITY. I'd rather listen to analog AM any day than listen to digital audio that has artifacts and fake highs and that wonderful digital wishy-washy sound. Comments????? MJR n WYO From: Neal Newman To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, January 28, 2003 2:52 AM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Note to AM Stereo Forum members Jerry Check your Ears LOL.... Hold Onto Your Hats Boys. I came up with a real doosy....and it makes sense to Me..... BTW its Not Off topic... It Contains a form Of AM stereo.. If you Hear the Hash on 700 and 720.. In theory Yes IBOC is Working Correctly But we all know. that using up all the space in the Mask protecting the stations on the First adjacent Does Not mean Its right.... You know Me personally.. It may not Be as bad as he(KT) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From steveking@wgnradio.com Tue Jan 28 09:31:48 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: steveking@wgnradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 17:31:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 98207 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 17:31:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 17:31:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.86) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 17:31:47 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.152] by n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Jan 2003 17:31:46 -0000 Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 17:31:44 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Something positive for/about AM stereo? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3E364DC2.50009@mac.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 947 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgnhim " X-Originating-IP: 172.158.195.251 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71806925 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgnhim GM still offers it, although only on Cadillacs and Ford still offers it, although a Mercury Merauder we recently tested for our "Radio Road Test" had one of the worst sounding AM-Stereo radios we've ever heard. That's a shame because Ford products used to have some really good sounding AM-Stereo radios. While I can't think of them at the moment, I believe, at least, two of the foreign brands still offer them on some models, too. For what it's worth, even though it's only a small part of our whole show, our "Radio Road Test" features have resulted in several of our listeners telling us that they specifically made sure the vehicle they were getting had AM-Stereo. This probably won't have any major impact on the industry, but ... "One small step.":-) Steve King/WGN-AM, Chicago --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, Richard Wagoner wrote: > How about cars? I believe Chrysler > is the only one still offering them. > From wa2fnq@optonline.net Tue Jan 28 09:51:18 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: wa2fnq@optonline.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 17:51:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 96545 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 17:51:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 17:51:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.90) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 17:51:17 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.177] by n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Jan 2003 17:51:08 -0000 Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 17:51:05 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: Note to AM Stereo Forum members Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3E3652FA.3707C589@skyweb.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 650 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wa2fnq " X-Originating-IP: 64.236.235.240 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=60059615 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa2fnq Neal, I can't confirm what I can't hear buddy. Yesterday I was driving in my car on the Sunken Meadow Parkway listening to the station on 690 with no problem. Hmmm.... And I live just inside the red line for WOR on the Radiolocator map. Sorry. I now leave this to all you brains to figure out. But be careful where you point the finger. I'm not defending IBOC just trying to give you information. If your neighbor pounds on your door and says you're causing TVI to one of his three TVs where do you look?? Have fun. Jerry WA2FNQ --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, Neal Newman wrote: > Jerry Check your Ears LOL.... From michaelj@vcn.com Tue Jan 28 10:28:01 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 18:28:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 64881 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 18:28:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 18:28:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m1-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 18:28:00 -0000 Received: from michael (unverified [209.193.86.94]) by m1-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Tue, 28 Jan 2003 11:27:59 -0700 To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} Something positive for/about AM stereo? Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 11:27:25 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Interesting that you'd write in today, Steve. Was about to mention on the list that last night WGN was coming in pretty good. Awesome STEREO! Nice job! Always good to have a station that cares! My Mitsubishi radio isn't AMS standard. I added the decoder board to it. It sounds awesome! I'm glad to hear that GM still has it in a radio or two. As far as I had seen, the newer GM vehicles all have this new RDS / multi-function radio (you actually set up many of the car's options using the radio!) that has no stereo indicator at all.....am OR FM! And does NOT have AM stereo, and the AM section sounds like crap! This is in my wife's 2001 Chevy Impala. My wife absolutely refuses to listen to AM at all on that thing because the sound is so crappy. That even includes if I'M on the air! She still won't! Not THAT radio anyway. She'll listen at home on our JVC home stereo....which I've converted to AM Stereo and widened the bandwidth. Like most people (and she too) will say "that one sounds like FM" :) Michael n WYO -----Original Message----- From: wgnhim [mailto:steveking@wgnradio.com] Sent: Tuesday, January 28, 2003 10:32 AM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Something positive for/about AM stereo? GM still offers it, although only on Cadillacs and Ford still offers it, although a Mercury Merauder we recently tested for our "Radio Road Test" had one of the worst sounding AM-Stereo radios we've ever heard. That's a shame because Ford products used to have some really good sounding AM-Stereo radios. While I can't think of them at the moment, I believe, at least, two of the foreign brands still offer them on some models, too. For what it's worth, even though it's only a small part of our whole show, our "Radio Road Test" features have resulted in several of our listeners telling us that they specifically made sure the vehicle they were getting had AM-Stereo. This probably won't have any major impact on the industry, but ... "One small step.":-) Steve King/WGN-AM, Chicago [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From bjackson@indyradio.com Tue Jan 28 10:50:20 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 18:50:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 1123 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 18:50:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 18:50:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 18:50:19 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.152] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Jan 2003 18:50:18 -0000 Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 18:50:17 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Something positive for/about AM stereo? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1683 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923 " X-Originating-IP: 64.25.100.129 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 Steve, thanks for the great segue! My 'ol Beretta with the UX-1 died on me over the weekend...And I don't like the gas mileage my Jeep gets for day to day driving. So, I've been (used...hey I work in radio!)car shopping. The salespeople drive me crazy! I was at a local Ford dealer asking if the Focus had AM Stereo. He told me "All radios are stereo." No amount of talking seemed to get my point across. So, does anyone know how hard it is to replace the mono radios with a C- Quam one? Do the older ones fit easily? I've also looked at some Neons...But all had mono radios. Can I take it out and put one of the AMAX Chrysler radios in its place? I figured someone out there knows! -Brad Jackson -Susquehanna, Indianapolis -WGLD/WGRL/WFMS -www.indyradio.com --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "wgnhim " wrote: > GM still offers it, although only on Cadillacs and Ford still offers > it, although a Mercury Merauder we recently tested for our "Radio Road > Test" had one of the worst sounding AM-Stereo radios we've ever heard. > That's a shame because Ford products used to have some really good > sounding AM-Stereo radios. While I can't think of them at the moment, > I believe, at least, two of the foreign brands still offer them on > some models, too. > For what it's worth, even though it's only a small part of our whole > show, our "Radio Road Test" features have resulted in several of our > listeners telling us that they specifically made sure the vehicle they > were getting had AM-Stereo. This probably won't have any major impact > on the industry, but ... "One small step.":-) > Steve King/WGN-AM, Chicago > From evergreenterrace@buzzle.com Tue Jan 28 10:54:32 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: evergreenterrace@buzzle.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 18:54:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 39711 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 18:54:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 18:54:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.67) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 18:54:31 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.175] by n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Jan 2003 18:54:22 -0000 Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 18:54:19 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: IBOC band scan Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 163 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgliradio " X-Originating-IP: 170.20.11.59 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=69711087 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgliradio The audio problems you hear on 740 and 750 seem something other than IBOC related. It does not sound like something you would associate with the IBOC IMHO. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Jan 28 11:01:31 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 19:01:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 78039 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 19:01:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 19:01:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 19:01:29 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.251] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Jan 2003 19:01:29 -0000 Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 19:01:28 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: IBOC band scan Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 829 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > The audio problems you hear on 740 and 750 seem something other than > IBOC related. > > It does not sound like something you would associate with the IBOC > IMHO. Nevertheless, what you are hearing on 740 and 750 kHz in these audio samples ONLY happens when WOR is transmitting IBOC. I have NEVER heard such interference before WOR started using IBOC, or at night when their IBOC signal is off. In fact, during WOR's nighttime test where the IBOC was turned on and off at one-minute intervals, so did this interference, both on my car radio and at home -- as experienced while I was trying to listen to the normally clear skywave signal of 740 CHWO from Toronto. One minute my reception would be perfectly fine, and the next minute it would be clobbered with "crackly" splatter interference. From jsgil@hal-pc.org Tue Jan 28 11:35:55 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 19:35:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 1604 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 19:35:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 19:35:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.75) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 19:35:54 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.136] by n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Jan 2003 19:35:49 -0000 Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 19:35:48 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: 1959 AM Stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 945 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.122 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "irukero " wrote: > Dear John and Amy, > > Thank you for the kind and helpful info about 1959 RCA AM stereo. I > think disabling the limiter and using FM discriminator will detect C- > QUAM signal. I will try. > > Sincerely, > Koji The output of an FM discriminator is the derivative of phase modulation and the signal will need to be sent through an intergrator. This is exactly how the LM1981 chip works which was designed for the Magnavox AM/PM system. By removing the limiter should give you a phase modulation component with amplitude modulation. An FM discriminator has 2 inputs and only one needs to be unlimited if both are unlimited it may produce distortion. Check the LM1981 datasheet for how they use an FM discriminator to detect phase motulation. They even had a scheme to use this chip to detect C-QuAM but Motorola denied that it did it correctly. JSG From jsgil@hal-pc.org Tue Jan 28 11:43:21 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 19:43:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 18775 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 19:43:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 19:43:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.88) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 19:43:21 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.177] by n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Jan 2003 19:43:18 -0000 Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 19:43:15 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: Note to AM Stereo Forum members Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 566 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.122 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " wrote: > > This doesn't even pass the smell test! I forget the exact distance > between your location and WOR, but I think is was a pretty significant > distance, enough where WOR's ground wave would be virtually non > existent by the time it reached you, making it hard for me to > understand how you could be hearing interference from them during the > day. > > John I've received groundwave at over 250 miles away during the day from a Class-A ND clear channel station. JSG From amfmdx@fastq.com Tue Jan 28 12:15:04 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 20:15:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 43584 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 20:15:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 20:15:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 20:15:03 -0000 Received: from fastq ([208.187.57.111]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id h0SKF1P99645 for ; Tue, 28 Jan 2003 13:15:01 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <016d01c2c709$d7b9b420$96f9bed8@com> To: Subject: For Kerry Richards Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 13:14:19 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla Kerry, What really is first and foremost is that the people are having something forced on them that they don't like and will cost them money. That said.... We have no doubt that you have the FCC authorization. We believe that you are meeting whatever FCC regulations there are. Let me get that out of the way. We believe the NAB and Ibiquity authroized you to do the testing and that you are doing exactly the testing that they prescribed. Let me help you understand why you are in radio hell with listeners. Its really simple. The sideband noise is so unbelievably onerous to all of us that we are screaming at the top of our lungs to the FCC and everyone else. Since you are doing what is allowed, the general listener doesn't care. All we know is that we have this loud hissing crap on our radios and we don't like it. The sidebands are awful and we out there in the real world are upset about it. Many are also upset that they will have no choice in the matter as we will be FORCED by the US government to replace several thousands of dollars of receiving apparatuses which we don't want to spend the money on. Its the noise and that we have no choice but to spend money for equipment that we did not ask for. Digital really does deserve to have its own band and let MW broadcasts in AM die its own death. Kevin Mesa, Arizona Message: 10 Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 12:43:19 -0500 From: "Kerry Richards" Subject: WOR and IBOC I find it hard to understand that the minute we started testing this new system we were attacked on this site and others. Apparently no one remembered that WOR has an STA to test the IBOC system from the FCC. That's first and foremost here. "Its going to get a lot worse before it gets worse" - Lily Tomlin From jbyrns@enteract.com Tue Jan 28 13:07:12 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 21:07:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 13110 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 21:07:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 21:07:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.87) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 21:07:11 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.163] by n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Jan 2003 21:07:11 -0000 Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 21:07:11 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: Note to AM Stereo Forum members Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <00d601c2c6f2$aafba900$0701010a@keva> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2460 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.98.205 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Michael J. Richard" < michaelj@v...> wrote: > Ya know Neal, it makes perfect sense to me! It really does! If they only need ONE sideband to transmit the digital, then why not! :) Have another station on the other sideband. > Know what makes even more sense to me? Well....if you only have to use ONE sideband to do this.....then why not use BOTH sidebands to transmit the digital part of the signal. No, I don't mean having a redundancy...I mean put half of the digital info on one sideband, put the other half on the other. Sorta like having 2 phone lines for your modem and being able to recieve/transmit information to/from your computer at 112 kbps instead of 56kbps. NOW...if they do THAT do you think we could get better sound out of it??? I know a RealPlayer 56K feed certainly sounds better than a RealPlayer 28.8 feed. I'm sure the "HD radio" people would also like to double their bit rate as you suggest, but I suspect they have looked at the situation carefully, and determined that it won't work. There are a number of possible reasons why your suggestion may not be workable. First, all digital data transmission systems that transmit data over a noisy, interference prone, one-way transmission medium, like the MW broadcast band, must use a lot of redundancy in the data to insure that it will get through. Some data systems use an "Automatic Repeat reQuest" system, that can eliminate the need for redundancy on relatively error free two way channels, but the "IBOC" system is neither. As a result a lot of redundancy is necessary to insure that the data gets through, and the "HD radio" listener hears the program he wants, without a lot holes being punched in the audio by errors causing funny sounds, or muting. Another possible reason for making the sidebands redundant is to minimize the impact of the digital sidebands on reception of the "HD radio" signal by analog radios. When there were four or five "IBOC" systems competing for approval, some of them configured the redundant digital sidebands in such a way as to minimize their effect on analog radios, although I am not sure if the "HD radio" system has this feature or not. In this scheme, the two digital sidebands are arranged so that their effect tends to cancel in an ordinary analog radio, minimizing the amount of digital noise the analog listener hears from the digital part of the signal. John From jbyrns@enteract.com Tue Jan 28 13:17:56 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 21:17:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 35874 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 21:17:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 21:17:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.67) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 21:17:55 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.170] by n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Jan 2003 21:17:54 -0000 Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 21:17:53 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: 1959 AM Stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1045 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.98.205 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "jsgilst " < jsgil@h...> wrote: > > The output of an FM discriminator is the derivative of phase > modulation and the signal will need to be sent through an > intergrator. Correct. > This is exactly how the LM1981 chip works which > was designed for the Magnavox AM/PM system. By removing the > limiter should give you a phase modulation component with > amplitude modulation. An FM discriminator has 2 inputs and > only one needs to be unlimited if both are unlimited it may > produce distortion. I only see one input in this 1959 discriminator circuit, where's the second input? > Check the LM1981 datasheet for how they > use an FM discriminator to detect phase motulation. Do you know where a copy of the LM1981 data sheet can be obtained? > They even > had a scheme to use this chip to detect C-QuAM but Motorola > denied that it did it correctly. Does this scheme perhaps only approximate the correct decoding function for CQuam? Was this supposed denial right or wrong? John From JH_Radio@GameBox.net Tue Jan 28 13:36:44 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: JH_Radio@GameBox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 21:36:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 575 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 21:36:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 21:36:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO babyruth.hotpop.com) (204.57.55.14) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 21:36:39 -0000 Received: from gamebox.net (kubrick.hotpop.com [204.57.55.16]) by babyruth.hotpop.com (Postfix) with SMTP id B2B5C21930D for ; Tue, 28 Jan 2003 21:22:14 +0000 (UTC) Received: from -enduser.GameBox.net (pcp03184855pcs.benslm01.pa.comcast.net [68.80.77.117]) by smtp-1.hotpop.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 638B22F8119 for ; Tue, 28 Jan 2003 21:21:09 +0000 (UTC) Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030127222058.040980b0@pop.GameBox.net> X-Sender: JH_Radio@pop.GameBox.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 22:21:34 -0500 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Note to AM Stereo Forum members In-Reply-To: <00cf01c2c679$14e21ae0$827dfea9@home1> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 X-HotPOP: ----------------------------------------------- Sent By HotPOP.com FREE Email Get your FREE POP email at www.HotPOP.com ----------------------------------------------- From: John X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113800107 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit That's the best idea I've heard yet. *Smiles* Then everyone will be happy! At 08:58 PM 1/27/03 -0600, you wrote: >Tell you what- you two can make the following deal: go and take a tour of >WOR, keeping a respectful demeanor, and then he gets to go to your place and >you can show him first hand what you've been experiencing. > >ST > >----- Original Message ----- >From: > >> All I have done is simply report >> my experience with WOR's signal. And my experience is that a station >> that is supposed to be on 710 kHz is causing severe interference over >> a range of 680 to 750 kHz on multiple receivers in multiple locations >> up to 50 miles away from the transmitter. > > >Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Love in Christ: John Bensalem, PA Send me an email Aim: RainAngelsRule MSN: RainAngelsRule@hotmail.com My website Welcome to Napster4TheBlind "Prayer does not change God; it changes you." - Authur unknown [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Tue Jan 28 13:38:24 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 21:38:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 4797 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 21:38:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 21:38:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web41012.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.93.11) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 21:38:23 -0000 Message-ID: <20030128213823.85588.qmail@web41012.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.32.140] by web41012.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 28 Jan 2003 13:38:23 PST Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 13:38:23 -0800 (PST) Subject: Lenny Con To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio From today's (1/28) All Access: Engineer and creator of one of the original AM Stereo systems LEONARD KAHN has filed an objection to the FCC's approval of iBIQUITY's IBOC digital radio system HD RADIO, reports INSIDE RADIO. KAHN's filing argues that the use of iBIQUITY's system can only work in daylight hours on AM, takes up too much bandwidth, and costs too much. The filing proposes a new panel of ex-Commissioners and experts to replace the industry committee that recommended the iBIQUITY system. Maybe we SHOULD support IBOC then. Why did engineers like his system? I don't get it. From what I've heard of the samples posted, Magnavox was the way to go with C-QUAM right behind it. IT'S ALL ABOUT THE SOUND, BABAY! Who cares about coverage if your station sounds like GARBAGE? J __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From wa2fnq@optonline.net Tue Jan 28 13:42:01 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: wa2fnq@optonline.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 21:42:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 9867 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 21:42:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 21:42:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 21:42:00 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.141] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Jan 2003 21:41:59 -0000 Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 21:41:57 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: IBOC band scan Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3040 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wa2fnq " X-Originating-IP: 64.236.235.240 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=60059615 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa2fnq I did one more check at lunch time of the AM band. Driving in my car here on Long Island. I could listen to the stations on 680, 690 and 760. WGSM, 740 is a few miles away so they don't count. There were no products from 710 outside of their digital sidebands either side of the analog signal. Let me give this one final shot in hopes somebody out there understands. Until you do a detailed intermod analysis of all the signals in the area, and there are alot of big transmitters in New Jersey, you may not understand what's really going on. Here's a personal example: I was operating Amateur TV on the 70 cm Ham band. We use a 2 meter FM simplex frequency as our chat channel while somebody else is transmitting TV. I was transmitting on TV and keyed my 2 meter transmitter to make a remark to someone who wasn't watching on TV. When I did, one of the guys noticed that I was bringing up the 2 meter repeater in New Haven, on a totally unrelated frequency.... so it would seem. Dropping any one of my transmitters or removing my video signal cleared the problem. Killing the color burst on my ATV signal also cleared the problem. The answer: My visual transmitter frequency plus my aural transmitter frequency plus my 2 meter transmitter frequency plus twice the colorburst frequency in my video in the proper combination equaled the 2 meter repeaters input. That 2 meter repeater was 45 miles away. The same thing is possible here. Can it happen somewhere else? Maybe, under the right conditions. There are a lot of big transmitters in a small area there. Any number of strong signals plus the IBOC sidebands can mix and create products. This does happen in the NY Metro area with non-IBOC AM stations. There isn't anything anyone is going to do about it. Maybe that isn't the case here, maybe it is. You decide. If it is then IBOC isn't directly at fault. If you're trying to use this to make a case against IBOC I'd be careful. You don't want to use examples that can have holes shot in them and right now I can do it with this one. Wild theories don't work either. Don't weaken our case by looking stupid and pointing to something that can be shot down. Know your facts, know what you're talking about before you make any statements or else we loose. I've said enough. Jerry WA2FNQ Manager, RF Systems Home Box Office > > Nevertheless, what you are hearing on 740 and 750 kHz in these audio > samples ONLY happens when WOR is transmitting IBOC. I have NEVER > heard such interference before WOR started using IBOC, or at night > when their IBOC signal is off. > > > > > In fact, during WOR's nighttime test where the IBOC was turned on and > off at one-minute intervals, so did this interference, both on my car > radio and at home -- as experienced while I was trying to listen to > the normally clear skywave signal of 740 CHWO from Toronto. One > minute my reception would be perfectly fine, and the next minute it > would be clobbered with "crackly" splatter interference. From JH_Radio@GameBox.net Tue Jan 28 13:47:06 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: JH_Radio@GameBox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 21:47:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 29184 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 21:47:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 21:47:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO babyruth.hotpop.com) (204.57.55.14) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 21:47:05 -0000 Received: from gamebox.net (kubrick.hotpop.com [204.57.55.16]) by babyruth.hotpop.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 1F49F21A48A for ; Tue, 28 Jan 2003 21:45:42 +0000 (UTC) Received: from -enduser.GameBox.net (pcp03184855pcs.benslm01.pa.comcast.net [68.80.77.117]) by smtp-2.hotpop.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BABE71BBAF8 for ; Tue, 28 Jan 2003 21:38:38 +0000 (UTC) Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030128163716.0397f3c0@pop.GameBox.net> X-Sender: JH_Radio@pop.GameBox.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 16:42:54 -0500 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Curious Note In-Reply-To: <1c4.418a4e4.2b673473@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-HotPOP: ----------------------------------------------- Sent By HotPOP.com FREE Email Get your FREE POP email at www.HotPOP.com ----------------------------------------------- From: John X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113800107 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Kevin, can't you turn the darn thing off about Tom? Man, you are so unfair. Must you have every single post from him say that? If you ask me, you are being unfair, and please turn it off. ( I do not think I am the only one that thinks this. I'm seriously considering leaving this joint, if you can not treat everyone equally. John At 08:18 PM 1/27/03 -0500, you wrote: ><< [Sysop's Note: Mr. Ray's posts are subject to moderation. Messages > containing personal attacks and/or offensive language will not be > accepted.] >> > >You know....I certainly hope this is not the case.God oh mighty...anyone have >a pacifier for the babysitter?!? > >Bob Carter > Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group > > WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 >Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 > > Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering >services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. >e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net > Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC > WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC > WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC > Ray Communications Radio Network > >AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- >Subscribe send an email to amstereo-subscribe@topica.com > > KC4QLP Amateur Radio > Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va > www.kc4qlp.cjb.net > > voice contact-252-335-0856 > fax 1-209-254-8978 > _______________________________________________________ > > > > > >Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Love in Christ: John Bensalem, PA Send me an email Aim: RainAngelsRule MSN: RainAngelsRule@hotmail.com My website Welcome to Napster4TheBlind "Prayer does not change God; it changes you." - Authur unknown [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From jbyrns@enteract.com Tue Jan 28 13:47:26 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 21:47:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 86353 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 21:47:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 21:47:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 21:47:26 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.191] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Jan 2003 21:47:25 -0000 Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 21:47:24 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: Note to AM Stereo Forum members Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 887 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.92 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "jsgilst " < jsgil@h...> wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " > wrote: > > > > > This doesn't even pass the smell test! I forget the exact distance > > between your location and WOR, but I think is was a pretty > significant > > distance, enough where WOR's ground wave would be virtually non > > existent by the time it reached you, making it hard for me to > > understand how you could be hearing interference from them during > the > > day. > > > > John > > > I've received groundwave at over 250 miles away during the day > from a Class-A ND clear channel station. If I remember correctly, the distance between WOR and "Possum Hunter" was something like three times that distance, which would have a VERY significant impact on the attenuation of the ground wave. John From ccuff@in4web.com Tue Jan 28 14:00:11 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 22:00:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 39754 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 22:00:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 22:00:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 22:00:11 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.29]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Tue, 28 Jan 2003 16:56:16 -0500 Message-ID: <001001c2c717$5f3b6b20$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC band scan Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 16:51:10 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 I will throw this in: Today, I did a test with my stock 2002 narrowband radio in my Chevy Malibu. I no longer hear any artifacts except that 700 and 720 are completely wiped out. During the first week, it was much more widespread in dial area. This is 80 miles NW of NYC. Interesting note: Best signal and sound: WCBS newsradio 880 770 WABC close 2nd. 1010 WINS- not bad, about equal to WOR. WOR "does" come in better than it did pre-HD. 1050- fair. Again, this is in fringe area. Chris From JH_Radio@GameBox.net Tue Jan 28 14:19:31 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: JH_Radio@GameBox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 22:19:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 19591 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 22:19:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 22:19:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO babyruth.hotpop.com) (204.57.55.14) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 22:19:27 -0000 Received: from gamebox.net (kubrick.hotpop.com [204.57.55.16]) by babyruth.hotpop.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 26111213C98 for ; Tue, 28 Jan 2003 22:19:17 +0000 (UTC) Received: from -enduser.GameBox.net (pcp03184855pcs.benslm01.pa.comcast.net [68.80.77.117]) by smtp-2.hotpop.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EDFB41B8FCC for ; Tue, 28 Jan 2003 21:40:49 +0000 (UTC) Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030128164429.00a3f870@pop.GameBox.net> X-Sender: JH_Radio@pop.GameBox.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 16:45:07 -0500 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Narrowing radio's down and some questions: (Carver TX-11 C, Sony SRF-42, Denon TU680NAB, Crisler/Delco Car radio, and Sony IBF-2010) In-Reply-To: <000901c2c671$0007a3e0$827dfea9@home1> References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030126141508.02eb12d0@pop.GameBox.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030126171533.031b2180@mail.comcast.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-HotPOP: ----------------------------------------------- Sent By HotPOP.com FREE Email Get your FREE POP email at www.HotPOP.com ----------------------------------------------- From: John X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113800107 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit No I mean what does Easy AMS conversion mean? Thanks, John At 08:00 PM 1/27/03 -0600, you wrote: >Carver TX-2 > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "John" > > > >> What is an Easy AMS conversion? > > >Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Love in Christ: John Bensalem, PA Send me an email Aim: RainAngelsRule MSN: RainAngelsRule@hotmail.com My website Welcome to Napster4TheBlind "Prayer does not change God; it changes you." - Authur unknown [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From ccuff@in4web.com Tue Jan 28 14:29:41 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 22:29:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 72487 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 22:29:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 22:29:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 22:29:39 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.134]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Tue, 28 Jan 2003 17:25:44 -0500 Message-ID: <000701c2c71b$7d4df2a0$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030126141508.02eb12d0@pop.GameBox.net><5.2.0.9.0.20030126171533.031b2180@mail.comcast.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030128164429.00a3f870@pop.GameBox.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF}questions: (Carver TX-2 ) Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 17:20:38 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 It means that you can easily add am stereo capability to the Carver TX2, using one of my 13028 based decoder boards. Jeff deck has done these conversions to the Carvers, and would probably supply you with needed hookup info. Chris ----- Original Message ----- From: John From KC4QLP@aol.com Tue Jan 28 14:52:52 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 22:52:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 69894 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 22:52:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 22:52:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m02.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.5) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 22:52:52 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.1f1.711c5f (4254) for ; Tue, 28 Jan 2003 17:52:41 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1f1.711c5f.2b6863b9@aol.com> Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 17:52:41 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Curious Note To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 1/28/03 4:49:12 PM Eastern Standard Time, JH_Radio@GameBox.net writes: << Man, you are so unfair. Must you have every single post from him say that? If you ask me, you are being unfair, and please turn it off. ( I do not think I am the only one that thinks this. I'm seriously considering leaving this joint, if you can not treat everyone equally. >> There is always another "joint"...one that is currently quiet...but sane...and above all FAIR. AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- Subscribe send an email to amstereo-subscribe@topica.com The group is open to discussion of all facets of AM broadcasting Of course keep in mind..certain few "trouble makers" that have been here for ages wont make the grade there...just be forewarned. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- Subscribe send an email to amstereo-subscribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Tue Jan 28 15:38:16 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 23:38:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 47509 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 23:38:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 23:38:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf16bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.56) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 23:38:14 -0000 Received: from juan ([65.80.41.40]) by imf16bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.25 201-253-122-122-125-20020815) with SMTP id <20030128234011.JHHU1101.imf16bis.bellsouth.net@juan> for ; Tue, 28 Jan 2003 18:40:11 -0500 Message-ID: <007c01c2c726$56a0f930$af78fea9@juan> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Something positive for/about AM stereo? Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 18:38:19 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ----- Original Message ----- From: bradleyj923 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, January 28, 2003 1:50 PM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Something positive for/about AM stereo? Steve, thanks for the great segue! My 'ol Beretta with the UX-1 died on me over the weekend...And I don't like the gas mileage my Jeep gets for day to day driving. So, I've been (used...hey I work in radio!)car shopping. The salespeople drive me crazy! I was at a local Ford dealer asking if the Focus had AM Stereo. He told me "All radios are stereo." No amount of talking seemed to get my point across. So, does anyone know how hard it is to replace the mono radios with a C- Quam one? Do the older ones fit easily? I've also looked at some Neons...But all had mono radios. Can I take it out and put one of the AMAX Chrysler radios in its place? I figured someone out there knows! -Brad Jackson -Susquehanna, Indianapolis -WGLD/WGRL/WFMS -www.indyradio.com Try mnrelectronics.com They carry a pretty good selection of car audio. I bought a new UX-1 there a few months ago, and they had the adapter for my Buick. The manager told me he bought a bunch of Delcos and he also carries Ford and Chrysler. He was great to deal with. BTW Had an opportunity to drive the radio station's Durango (2001) it had AM Stereo in it. The GM usually drives it, and he had no idea. I told him the Stereo light goes on when tuned to WTTB, so that was a good indication. He though I was being a smart ass. I never drive it, so I had no idea till I had to run some errands. Juan [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From jsgil@hal-pc.org Tue Jan 28 15:45:42 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 28 Jan 2003 23:45:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 55063 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2003 23:45:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Jan 2003 23:45:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.86) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Jan 2003 23:45:41 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.172] by n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Jan 2003 23:45:41 -0000 Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 23:45:40 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: 1959 AM Stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 2431 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.219 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "jsgilst " < > jsgil@h...> wrote: > >=20 > > The output of an FM discriminator is the derivative of phase > > modulation and the signal will need to be sent through an > > intergrator. >=20 > Correct. >=20 > > This is exactly how the LM1981 chip works which > > was designed for the Magnavox AM/PM system. By removing the > > limiter should give you a phase modulation component with > > amplitude modulation. An FM discriminator has 2 inputs and > > only one needs to be unlimited if both are unlimited it may > > produce distortion. >=20 > I only see one input in this 1959 discriminator circuit, where's the=20 > second input? >=20 It is usually within the transformer and from I know about solid state discriminators is that one coil is hooked to the diodes which are turned on during one half of the cycle and this is what needs to be limited and the other signal that passes through a series LC BPF preforms a 90=B0 phase shift at center frequency needs to be unlimited. As the frequency deviates from center the phase shift deviates from 90=B0 and thus outputs a voltage in reference to the frequency of deviation. You can think of the limited portion as being the PLL signal in a synchronous detector and and the unlimited portion as the signal being detected. > > Check the LM1981 datasheet for how they > > use an FM discriminator to detect phase motulation. >=20 > Do you know where a copy of the LM1981 data sheet can be obtained? Unfortunately I never obtained a datasheet for this chip but the Stan Prentiss book on AM Stereo had details of the chip and how to use it to decode C-QuAM. If anyone is interested I could upload the schematic but I don't think the chip is available. >=20 > > They even > > had a scheme to use this chip to detect C-QuAM but Motorola > > denied that it did it correctly. >=20 > Does this scheme perhaps only approximate the correct decoding=20 > function for CQuam? Was this supposed denial right or wrong? I think it is ony a close approximation and I most likely will agree=20 with Motorola but the engineers at National Semiconductor would probably tell you that it does it correctly. I have never listened=20 to it decoding C-QuAM but Sony's method used a similar scheme in=20 their 4-Way decoders and claimed to have less than 5% distortion decoding C-QuAM. >=20 > John From jsgil@hal-pc.org Tue Jan 28 16:14:23 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 29 Jan 2003 00:14:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 1889 invoked from network); 29 Jan 2003 00:14:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Jan 2003 00:14:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Jan 2003 00:14:13 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.131] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 29 Jan 2003 00:14:02 -0000 Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 00:14:01 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Lenny Con Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20030128213823.85588.qmail@web41012.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 782 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.219 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, JNR wrote: > From today's (1/28) All Access: > > Engineer and creator of one of the original AM > Stereo systems LEONARD KAHN has filed an > objection to the > FCC's approval of iBIQUITY's IBOC digital radio > system HD RADIO, reports INSIDE RADIO. KAHN's > filing argues that > the use of iBIQUITY's system can only work in > daylight hours on AM, takes up too much > bandwidth, and costs too > much. The filing proposes a new panel of > ex-Commissioners and experts to replace the > industry committee that > recommended the iBIQUITY system. > I checked the 99-325 docket for his filing and wasn't there so he must have it filed under somthing else. Does anyone know here he filed it or if he has filed it yet. JSG From JH_Radio@GameBox.net Tue Jan 28 16:54:46 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: JH_Radio@GameBox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 29 Jan 2003 00:54:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 93595 invoked from network); 29 Jan 2003 00:54:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Jan 2003 00:54:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rizzo.jerky.net) (204.57.55.99) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Jan 2003 00:54:45 -0000 Received: from gamebox.net (kubrick.hotpop.com [204.57.55.16]) by rizzo.jerky.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 3F020313EE for ; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 00:54:38 +0000 (UTC) Received: from -enduser.GameBox.net (pcp03184855pcs.benslm01.pa.comcast.net [68.80.77.117]) by smtp-2.hotpop.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6D7CB1BB935 for ; Tue, 28 Jan 2003 21:31:51 +0000 (UTC) Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030128163528.0397f720@pop.GameBox.net> X-Sender: JH_Radio@pop.GameBox.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 16:36:20 -0500 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Some Thoughts on Receivers and IBOC (was Re: ...) In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 X-HotPOP: ----------------------------------------------- Sent By HotPOP.com FREE Email Get your FREE POP email at www.HotPOP.com ----------------------------------------------- From: John X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113800107 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi, Everyone is talking about IBOC on AM. How much differently will this affect FM? I'd imagine the same.... John At 12:57 AM 1/28/03 +0000, you wrote: >John, > >This is a very sensible reply to the problem that happens when a >wideband radio of any sort is used when the IBOC carriers are on. >It is, in fact, one of the many reasons there may be noise of some >sort reproduced at the audio output of any radio. > >Having asked Ibiquity about this, they demonstrated to me audio >recordings where the "white noise" was below program audio, to the >point where the "noise" was or was not objectionable. This is the >core of the matter, just what is objectionable? > >This is a very subjective question. > >I have several radios which have an analog AM bandwidth out to about >7.5Khz, where, when the IBOC carriers come on the existing 5Khz audio >response drops slightly. (About 3db) I hear this some mornings >getting ready for work, when I have WOR on and the Burk puts the HD >on at sunrise. Is this objectionable? This so called hiss is almost >unoticable on any of my radios and I'm ten minutes from the WOR >transmitter in the main lobe. > >I am talking about my AIWA and my Henry Kloss Model One radios, the >Denon AMAX radio is not objectional in the narrow mode. > >I have said operating IBOC in the hybrid mode has some tradeoffs, so >he we go. But, the bottom line is with about 1500 watts of power (the >approximate level of WOR's IBOC carriers) we can deliver a digital >stream to a new HD Radio. That to me is OK, and I can accept that. > >It is a very efficient use of the spectrum, and very surprising how >far it gets out. > >John, your post is very refreshing because it brings to light some of >the problems IBOC in the hybrid mode, bring to the current state of >AM Radio. And that is why the testing is continuing even though there >are no HD radios out there yet. > >I thought Neal Newman at the recent WOR tour and SBE meeting made a >lot of sense in asking "couldn't Ibiquity squeeze the sidebands in a >little?". Just like me when we started the whole process, I turned >the Optimod 9200 to 6.2Khz analog bandwidth, which is now at 5Khz. > >All of this is very very subjective, when you consider what you get >out of an HD radio in the end, which to me is fantastic. > >Kerry Richards >Chief Engineer >WOR-AM >Buckley Broadcasting Corporation > > >Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Love in Christ: John Bensalem, PA Send me an email Aim: RainAngelsRule MSN: RainAngelsRule@hotmail.com My website Welcome to Napster4TheBlind "Prayer does not change God; it changes you." - Authur unknown [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From amymousie@yahoo.com Tue Jan 28 17:14:25 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 29 Jan 2003 01:14:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 42403 invoked from network); 29 Jan 2003 01:14:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Jan 2003 01:14:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Jan 2003 01:14:20 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.167] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 29 Jan 2003 01:14:20 -0000 Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 01:14:18 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Some Thoughts on Receivers and IBOC (was Re: ...) Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20030128163528.0397f720@pop.GameBox.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 329 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 67.115.110.131 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, John wrote: > Hi, > Everyone is talking about IBOC on AM. > How much differently will this affect FM? > I'd imagine the same.... > John This 7+ MB MP3 should give you some idea, courtesy on the NRC DX Audio Service: http://www.nrcdxas.org/mp3/iboc0400.mp3 Amy. <:3 )~~~ From watan-ko@h4.dion.ne.jp Tue Jan 28 17:22:46 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: watan-ko@h4.dion.ne.jp X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 29 Jan 2003 01:22:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 6450 invoked from network); 29 Jan 2003 01:22:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Jan 2003 01:22:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.87) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Jan 2003 01:22:45 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.166] by n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 29 Jan 2003 01:22:45 -0000 Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 01:22:43 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: 1959 AM Stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1123 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "irukero " X-Originating-IP: 192.218.64.12 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=67253313 X-Yahoo-Profile: irukero --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "jsgilst " Dear members, > > Do you know where a copy of the LM1981 data sheet can be obtained? > > Unfortunately I never obtained a datasheet for this chip but the > Stan Prentiss book on AM Stereo had details of the chip and how to > use it to decode C-QuAM. As I posted last year, I have the datasheet of LM1981. I asked Japanese National Semiconductor to supply it, they kindly searched their old archives and sent me "CLAU124 Linear application update" issued in 1984. The material is very detailed and depicts how to detect C-QUAM signal by the chip although the chip is designed for Magnavox system. I made its PDF and tried to upload the paper to share the fruit with members, however, I couldn't because of its huge size(20MB). Then, if you would like to see one, I will send it by CD-ROM with almost all of the AMS patents' PDF issued in U.S. and Japan. But I would like to ask you to pay for 5 dollars including postage and the cost of the CD-R disk. If the members would like to get it, please e-mail to me. Sincerely, Koji Watanabe From stodd@sherbtel.net Tue Jan 28 17:56:56 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 29 Jan 2003 01:56:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 16908 invoked from network); 29 Jan 2003 01:56:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Jan 2003 01:56:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Jan 2003 01:56:54 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-208.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.208]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h0T1uphF005101 for ; Tue, 28 Jan 2003 19:56:52 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <000701c2c739$ec4e1a40$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030126141508.02eb12d0@pop.GameBox.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030126171533.031b2180@mail.comcast.net> <000901c2c671$0007a3e0$827dfea9@home1> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Narrowing radio's down and some questions: (Carver TX-11 C, Sony SRF-42, Denon TU680NAB, Crisler/Delco Car radio, and Sony IBF-2010) Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 19:58:28 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Then again, I'm not sure it has the expanded band... ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Scott Todd" > Carver TX-2 > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "John" > > > > > What is an Easy AMS conversion? > From alfredot@inetarena.com Tue Jan 28 18:14:57 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: alfredot@inetarena.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_0); 29 Jan 2003 02:14:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 58437 invoked from network); 29 Jan 2003 02:14:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Jan 2003 02:14:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.inetarena.com) (206.129.216.13) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Jan 2003 02:14:55 -0000 Received: from hendrie (1Cust156.tnt17.beaverton.or.da.uu.net [65.227.179.156]) by mail.inetarena.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h0T2CNL08183 for ; Tue, 28 Jan 2003 18:12:23 -0800 (PST) Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 18:14:10 -0800 (PST) X-Sender: alfredo@hendrie.1610am.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Digest Number 549 In-Reply-To: <1043593042.408.52888.m12@yahoogroups.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=X-UNKNOWN Content-Transfer-Encoding: QUOTED-PRINTABLE From: "Alfredo E. Torrejon" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=25132238 X-Yahoo-Profile: alfredotorrejon > This was my first impression of the TM-152 also. I don't understand > why they put a =B14.5KHz filter in it in the first place and the LO > has little more phase noise than is to be desired which I think it > makes the top end sound a bit muddy even after replacing the ceramic > filter with a =B17.5KHz one. I was able to get a very slight improvement in local oscillator phase noise by removing the 5.6K ohm resistor that is connected across the local oscillator tank. This modification required a touch-up to the oscillator and antenna trimmer capacitors. I'm still curious how else an AM Stereo front end built around the LA1245 could be optimized. I suspect that a different oscillator coil with the tap closer to ground might help, since moving the tap in that direction would reduce the loading on oscillator tank circuit. Alfredo From alfredot@inetarena.com Tue Jan 28 18:24:35 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: alfredot@inetarena.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_1); 29 Jan 2003 02:24:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 29623 invoked from network); 29 Jan 2003 02:24:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Jan 2003 02:24:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.inetarena.com) (206.129.216.13) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Jan 2003 02:24:35 -0000 Received: from hendrie (1Cust156.tnt17.beaverton.or.da.uu.net [65.227.179.156]) by mail.inetarena.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h0T2M4L10196 for ; Tue, 28 Jan 2003 18:22:04 -0800 (PST) Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 18:23:52 -0800 (PST) X-Sender: alfredo@hendrie.1610am.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Marantz 2215B In-Reply-To: <1043593042.408.52888.m12@yahoogroups.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: "Alfredo E. Torrejon" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=25132238 X-Yahoo-Profile: alfredotorrejon > I also notice that it is also a "forced" FM Stereo tuner -- even when > no station is tuned in, the hiss is heard in stereo, which is strange > because I thought FM Stereo required the pilot tone to "lock onto" in > order to receive Stereo audio? A friend of mine had a German made Korting stereo that had "forced" FM Stereo (actually, he just had a schematic; the FM Stereo demultiplexer was an option not installed in his unit). In that implementation, there was an oscillator that had a small amount of the 19 KHz pilot injected into the tank circuit. This oscillator provided the drive for the diodes that detected the 38 KHz L-R subcarrier. If no 19 KHz pilot were present, then the oscillator would just free-wheel, and the diodes would continue to act as demodulators to whatever noise was around the frequency at which they were being driven. Alfredo From stodd@sherbtel.net Tue Jan 28 19:13:44 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_1); 29 Jan 2003 03:13:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 21487 invoked from network); 29 Jan 2003 03:13:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Jan 2003 03:13:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Jan 2003 03:13:42 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-110.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.110]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h0T3DHhH025568 for ; Tue, 28 Jan 2003 21:13:35 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <00ef01c2c744$a5133c40$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} KB-1520... proud to be MONO? Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 20:36:02 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude I'm surprised that nobody has taken the time to call them. Next time you're at a gas station that sells prepaid calling cards, and a lot of them do, get one for $5 or $10 (make sure it's the kind that DOESN'T charge a connect fee), look up the station's number on the net, and you can call them on your break at work. Calling a station should primarily be the task of those that can hear it, though I can lend a hand if need be. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: > I just heard their hourly ID, and it specifically mentioned something > to the effect of "Playing Oldies, on an AM station IN MONO..... > KB Radio, 1520!" > > Is this the first time that a radio station is actually promoting the > fact that they are broadcasting in mono? From stodd@sherbtel.net Tue Jan 28 19:13:46 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_1); 29 Jan 2003 03:13:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 90742 invoked from network); 29 Jan 2003 03:13:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Jan 2003 03:13:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Jan 2003 03:13:45 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-110.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.110]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h0T3DHhJ025568 for ; Tue, 28 Jan 2003 21:13:43 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <00f001c2c744$a8bda6a0$827dfea9@home1> To: Subject: OT-Fw: Streaming Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 20:50:59 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude A lot of you folks are oldies fans, and I invite you to hear Ugly Del do his Saturday Night Cruise program from 6-10P central on (of course) Saturday night. He plays a lot of stuff the "good times and eight oldies" station doesn't. ST > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Del Roberts" > > > > some listener has streamed the show on www.pirateradionetwork.com > > This is where radio fans "share" their favorite shows. Last Sat there were > > listeners from England, NY City, Texas, Montana and a dozen other states. From tomray@wor710.com Tue Jan 28 19:13:48 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 90770 invoked from network); 29 Jan 2003 03:13:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Jan 2003 03:13:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.90) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Jan 2003 03:13:46 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: tomray@wor710.com Received: from [66.218.67.188] by n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 29 Jan 2003 03:13:46 -0000 X-Sender: tomray@wor710.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_1); 29 Jan 2003 02:59:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 94371 invoked from network); 29 Jan 2003 02:59:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Jan 2003 02:59:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Jan 2003 02:59:40 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.147] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 29 Jan 2003 02:59:37 -0000 Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 02:59:35 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: Note to AM Stereo Forum members Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2059 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wortomray " X-Originating-IP: 66.67.228.6 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=136489311 X-Yahoo-Profile: wortomray X-eGroups-Approved-By: kevtronics via web; 29 Jan 2003 03:13:41 -0000 And I can guarantee that the hiss heard on WSB is not from WOR. We have no energy at 750....or 740, for that matter. Check your local area and you'll find the source. And incidentally, we rented one of WSB's studios recently and I spoke at length to their CE regarding IBOC. Not once did he say or intimate that he is encountering interference from WOR. --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Possum Hunter" < > possumhunter@n...> wrote: > > > > On the other hand, I live nearly 100 miles from the nearest X- Band station > > and *I* heard the noise and splatter on my un-modified Factory Toyota radio > > in South Carolina! Was the problem related to selective fading tricking my > > radio into hissing? Beats me, I don't have the personal funds to go out and > > buy several thousand dollars worth of test equipment to find out! All I know > > is *I* heard the noise and I could hear the hiss in the audio of WSB 750, > > and I live within the .5mv/Meter Day Time contour of WSB. > > > > Yes, I do indeed have a kick-@$$ dx rig and heard the noise on it too! > > This doesn't even pass the smell test! I forget the exact distance > between your location and WOR, but I think is was a pretty significant > distance, enough where WOR's ground wave would be virtually non > existent by the time it reached you, making it hard for me to > understand how you could be hearing interference from them during the > day. Also I believe there are at least two other stations on 750 kHz > between you and WOR, with omni antennas during the day, why aren't > these stations causing even worse interference with WSB at your > location, given the problem WOR is supposedly causing? This is > ignoring the fact that WOR's signal is supposedly confined to the 695 > kHz to 725 kHz range, which makes it even harder to believe your > report. Are you sure the hiss you hear on WSB's audio isn't coming > from some other source than WOR? > > John From stodd@sherbtel.net Tue Jan 28 19:13:50 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_1); 29 Jan 2003 03:13:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 95441 invoked from network); 29 Jan 2003 03:13:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Jan 2003 03:13:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Jan 2003 03:13:49 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-110.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.110]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h0T3DHhL025568 for ; Tue, 28 Jan 2003 21:13:46 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <00f101c2c744$aade63c0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030126141508.02eb12d0@pop.GameBox.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030126171533.031b2180@mail.comcast.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030128164429.00a3f870@pop.GameBox.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Narrowing radio's down and some questions: (Carver TX-11 C, Sony SRF-42, Denon TU680NAB, Crisler/Delco Car radio, and Sony IBF-2010) Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 21:03:48 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude I mean that it's easy for someone to add an AM stereo decoder. I've done a Panasonic SC555, my 91 Pathfinder radio, and I'm working on a friend's Sansui 5050. I'm going through a lot of extra work to get that one to look first class. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "John" To: Sent: Tuesday, January 28, 2003 3:45 PM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Narrowing radio's down and some questions: (Carver TX-11 C, Sony SRF-42, Denon TU680NAB, Crisler/Delco Car radio, and Sony IBF-2010) > No I mean what does Easy AMS conversion mean? > Thanks, > John > > At 08:00 PM 1/27/03 -0600, you wrote: > >Carver TX-2 > > > >----- Original Message ----- > >From: "John" > > > > > > > >> What is an Easy AMS conversion? > > > > > >Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > > >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > > Love in Christ: > > John > > Bensalem, PA > > Send me an email > > Aim: RainAngelsRule > > MSN: > > RainAngelsRule@hotmail.com > > My website > > Welcome to Napster4TheBlind > > "Prayer does not change God; it changes you." - Authur unknown > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > From stodd@sherbtel.net Tue Jan 28 19:13:55 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_1); 29 Jan 2003 03:13:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 19708 invoked from network); 29 Jan 2003 03:13:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Jan 2003 03:13:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Jan 2003 03:13:52 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-110.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.110]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h0T3DHhN025568 for ; Tue, 28 Jan 2003 21:13:50 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <00f201c2c744$ad391ca0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030127222058.040980b0@pop.GameBox.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Note to AM Stereo Forum members Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 21:10:55 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude It's called being salt and light in a darkened world. ;) ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "John" > That's the best idea I've heard yet. *Smiles* Then everyone will be happy! > At 08:58 PM 1/27/03 -0600, you wrote: > >Tell you what- you two can make the following deal: From stodd@sherbtel.net Tue Jan 28 19:16:24 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_1); 29 Jan 2003 03:16:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 23966 invoked from network); 29 Jan 2003 03:16:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Jan 2003 03:16:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Jan 2003 03:16:21 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-110.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.110]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h0T3GHhF026432 for ; Tue, 28 Jan 2003 21:16:18 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <00ff01c2c745$059de560$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Marantz 2215B Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 21:17:55 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Bet that would have had interesting results if he tuned a mono station with a 41kHz subcarrier! ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Alfredo E. Torrejon" If no > 19 KHz pilot were present, then the oscillator would just free-wheel, and > the diodes would continue to act as demodulators to whatever noise was > around the frequency at which they were being driven. > > Alfredo > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > From tomray@wor710.com Tue Jan 28 19:19:00 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 62168 invoked from network); 29 Jan 2003 03:18:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Jan 2003 03:18:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.68) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Jan 2003 03:18:59 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: tomray@wor710.com Received: from [66.218.67.249] by n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 29 Jan 2003 03:18:59 -0000 X-Sender: tomray@wor710.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_1); 29 Jan 2003 02:53:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 76347 invoked from network); 29 Jan 2003 02:53:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Jan 2003 02:53:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Jan 2003 02:53:57 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.177] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 29 Jan 2003 02:53:57 -0000 Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 02:53:52 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: a *rational* discussion of WOR's IBOC signal Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 9750 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wortomray " X-Originating-IP: 66.67.228.6 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=136489311 X-Yahoo-Profile: wortomray X-eGroups-Edited-By: kevtronics X-eGroups-Approved-By: kevtronics via web; 29 Jan 2003 03:18:58 -0000 I spent a good part of this morning discussing a birdie on 890 in the Meadowlands and on the west side of Manhattan with the WINS/WCBS engineers. It first appeared when WWRL increased power. It is an intermod product of 1600 and 710, resultant frequency 890. Neither station is at fault. It is generated in the receiver, and some radios do it, others don't. While we were looking around, we took their spectrum analyzer to the WOR transmitter, then out in the field. One set of tests were done connected to the transmitter monitor port on WOR's DX-50. The other test was done with a loop antenna in an area where the field strength from WOR is approximately 1.3 Volts per Meter. In both tests, the WOR IBOC sidebands are gone at 695 and 725. We show a small area of spectral regrowth at 685 and 735 which is 65dB under the carrier level. The rest of the spectrum is clean. At 685 and 735, the emissions of WOR should be well below -35dB below carrier, which they are by 30dB. And the spectrum analyzer shows no overmodulation. The analog channel modulation is limited to -98% and +120%. This has not only been verified by our recently calibrated modulation monitor, but by measurement on an oscilloscope. As seen from the birdie example above, receivers can and do generate spurious signals. The broadcaster is not responsible for the operation or actions of your radio, providing we are abiding by the rules and regulations of the FCC, which we are. And yes, a receiver can generate a spur in low signal areas, too. It's entirely possible it is being caused by the radio's AGC circuit if its filtering is too broad. And different detector circuits will exhibit overmodulation-like artifacts when they encounter certain conditions of modulation vectors they are not designed to receive. Don't forget.....many manufacturers put a low priority on the AM section....see any Blaupunkt manual. It mentions in the specifications section that the radio has an AM section, and that is the extent of the spec information. Something tells me they spent an entire 5 minutes design time on the AM section just because the radio is required to have one. Guaranteed it will not perform well. Maybe it's time to put the radios on test sets and see what their RF and IF sections really look like? If you would like me to post a recent photo of WOR's spectrum, I would be happy to do so. The picture doesn't lie. From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Tue Jan 28 19:30:35 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_1); 29 Jan 2003 03:30:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 62456 invoked from network); 29 Jan 2003 03:30:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Jan 2003 03:30:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf48bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.97) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Jan 2003 03:30:33 -0000 Received: from juan ([65.80.41.40]) by imf48bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.25 201-253-122-122-125-20020815) with SMTP id <20030129033230.ZYBM26640.imf48bis.bellsouth.net@juan> for ; Tue, 28 Jan 2003 22:32:30 -0500 Message-ID: <002401c2c746$cb607690$af78fea9@juan> To: Subject: Question To Tom Ray Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 22:30:38 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mr. Ray, You never answered my question, so I will post it again. Is the answer to talk stations like WOR better fidelity ? Have you had people ask your programming dept. for better fidelity from your station ? Do you think there is a market for Talk stations in HI-FI ? I am not a believer in IBOC, but I respect your opinion. Sincerely, Juan Gualda TC Radio Group KB0GXM [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From rwagoner1@mac.com Tue Jan 28 20:08:11 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner1@mac.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_1); 29 Jan 2003 04:08:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 71388 invoked from network); 29 Jan 2003 04:08:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Jan 2003 04:08:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO fed1mtao05.cox.net) (68.6.19.126) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Jan 2003 04:08:07 -0000 Received: from mac.com ([68.4.33.253]) by fed1mtao05.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20030129040755.FDFL3459.fed1mtao05.cox.net@mac.com> for ; Tue, 28 Jan 2003 23:07:55 -0500 Message-ID: <3E3753A7.2040208@mac.com> Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 20:08:07 -0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20021120 Netscape/7.01 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Question To Tom Ray References: <002401c2c746$cb607690$af78fea9@juan> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Richard Wagoner X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135738921 X-Yahoo-Profile: richardalanwagoner > Do you think there is a market for Talk stations in HI-FI ? I would say yes. THat's why I like sideband analog. In addition, one reason FM talkers are (supposedly) popular is their higher fidelity. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Jan 28 20:13:53 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_1); 29 Jan 2003 04:13:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 59684 invoked from network); 29 Jan 2003 04:13:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Jan 2003 04:13:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.84) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Jan 2003 04:13:52 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.161] by n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 29 Jan 2003 04:13:52 -0000 Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 04:13:50 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Question To Tom Ray Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <002401c2c746$cb607690$af78fea9@juan> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1108 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.96.28 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Is the answer to talk stations like WOR better fidelity ? News/Talk/Sports radio has been so successful on AM, and so rare on FM, precisely because audio fidelity is not a top priority for listeners. Sure, high-fidelity Stereo sound can be a benefit to any station, as AM Stereo proves; but in terms of the average listener, they are likely to listen to it as long as they like the programming and the reception and audio quality are at least marginally acceptable. Talk stations like 700 WLW and 710 WOR are using IBOC not because of a specific need for its claimed advantages, but rather just because they were presented with the opportunity to be the first to use a radically new technology. Because these corporate-owned 50,000-watt stations have decades of status backing them up, dabbling with IBOC is a win-win situation for them either way; if it becomes a success, they can triumph the fact that they were among the first to use it, and if it becomes a huge flop, it'll be no big deal, as the cost to them -- both financially and in terms of credibility -- will be negligible. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Jan 28 20:24:35 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_1); 29 Jan 2003 04:24:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 54047 invoked from network); 29 Jan 2003 04:24:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Jan 2003 04:24:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.88) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Jan 2003 04:24:34 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.174] by n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 29 Jan 2003 04:24:34 -0000 Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 04:24:33 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: AM vs. FM talk stations Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3E3753A7.2040208@mac.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1477 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.96.28 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > In addition, one reason FM talkers are (supposedly) popular is > their higher fidelity. That must be why New York City's FM talk station just bit the dust on Monday morning, after a few years of airing "shock jock" programming in an attempt to gain listeners, having their most prominent hosts fired in scandals, and subsequently having their ratings drop down to almost nothing. Philadelphia also had an FM (MONO) talk station for a number of years that was somewhat successful in its time, but also ultimately failed and was replaced with a music format. Now, Philly's primary choice for talk is once again on the AM band -- in AM Stereo, in fact, from Infinity-owned 1210 WPHT. The one place in this area where FM talk actually works is on "New Jersey 101.5", which usually gets very good ratings -- but mostly because the state of NJ lacks any AM signals which can match or even come close to the coverage of this 50 kW FM signal. However, smaller local AM talk stations in NJ, such as WCTC 1450 AM STEREO in New Brunswick, are also doing very well, even in areas where "NJ101.5" can also be heard -- because these smaller stations have an emphasis on the local area and their local communities, that this (nearly-)state-wide FM station can't provide. [An interesting footnote is that "NJ101.5" is now simulcasting on AM (mono) 1450 WKXW in Atlantic City -- unrelated to 1450 WCTC -- in order to fill in their coverage of the southern NJ shore.] From rwagoner1@mac.com Tue Jan 28 21:05:28 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner1@mac.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_1); 29 Jan 2003 05:05:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 13451 invoked from network); 29 Jan 2003 05:05:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Jan 2003 05:05:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO fed1mtao08.cox.net) (68.6.19.123) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Jan 2003 05:05:27 -0000 Received: from mac.com ([68.4.33.253]) by fed1mtao08.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20030129050515.FCWQ1215.fed1mtao08.cox.net@mac.com> for ; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 00:05:15 -0500 Message-ID: <3E376117.5020109@mac.com> Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 21:05:27 -0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20021120 Netscape/7.01 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: AM vs. FM talk stations References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Richard Wagoner X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135738921 X-Yahoo-Profile: richardalanwagoner > That must be why New York City's FM talk station just bit the dust on > Monday morning I read that. I'm hoping the same happens in Los Angeles. And that's why I said "(supposedly) popular" Richard From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Tue Jan 28 21:09:20 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_1); 29 Jan 2003 05:09:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 32887 invoked from network); 29 Jan 2003 05:09:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Jan 2003 05:09:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web41006.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.93.5) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Jan 2003 05:09:17 -0000 Message-ID: <20030129050917.66567.qmail@web41006.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.32.140] by web41006.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 28 Jan 2003 21:09:17 PST Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 21:09:17 -0800 (PST) Subject: OT: What will be the next 50kW to go oldies To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio From what I can tell, CKLW would be one of the best candidates because of its lackluster ratings. Is 500Watt CKWW still beating them in the ratings? 73, Jay,N1WVQ __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Jan 28 21:22:47 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_1); 29 Jan 2003 05:22:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 25238 invoked from network); 29 Jan 2003 05:22:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Jan 2003 05:22:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Jan 2003 05:22:46 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.128] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 29 Jan 2003 05:22:14 -0000 Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 05:22:11 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: From the history files Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 717 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.96.28 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics January 28, 1983 -- 105.5 WDHA in Dover, NJ became the first commercial radio station to broadcast music from a compact disc. January 1985 -- WDHA's sister station, 1250 WMTR in Morristown, NJ claimed to be the first AM Stereo station to broadcast music from a CD. WMTR had a contemporary music format at the time, and the song was "Borderline" by Madonna. One of WMTR's liners then was "24 Hours a Day, WMTR AM Stereo 1250, a Sound-Sational Experience!" Sadly, WMTR discontinued AM Stereo broadcasts in the spring of 1999. However, the first station in New Jersey to broadcast in AM Stereo -- 930 WPAT in Paterson, in 1984 -- continues to use it today, and even promotes it in many of their on-air IDs. From KC4QLP@aol.com Tue Jan 28 21:30:35 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_1); 29 Jan 2003 05:30:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 7365 invoked from network); 29 Jan 2003 05:30:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Jan 2003 05:30:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r07.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.103) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Jan 2003 05:30:35 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.44.2ceff5d0 (16781) for ; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 00:30:15 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <44.2ceff5d0.2b68c0e7@aol.com> Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 00:30:15 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: a *rational* discussion of WOR's IBOC signal To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 1/28/03 10:19:45 PM Eastern Standard Time, tomray@wor710.com writes: > It's entirely possible it is being caused by the radio's AGC circuit > if its filtering is too broad. And different detector circuits will > exhibit overmodulation-like artifacts when they encounter certain > conditions of modulation vectors they are not designed to receive. > Don't forget.....many manufacturers put a low priority on the AM > section.... This is very true...especially with the "Receiver in a chip" that is encountered mostly these days....there is very little front end selective tuning {if any at all...most are wide ..and I mean wide!}. > > Maybe it's time to put the radios on test sets and see what their RF > and IF sections really look like? > That would open the eyes of a many knuckle heads around here...maybe they'll see the light and stop with all of this nonsense. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From KC4QLP@aol.com Tue Jan 28 21:36:30 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_1); 29 Jan 2003 05:36:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 78986 invoked from network); 29 Jan 2003 05:36:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Jan 2003 05:36:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d08.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.40) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Jan 2003 05:36:28 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.20.8777e50 (16781) for ; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 00:35:57 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <20.8777e50.2b68c23c@aol.com> Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 00:35:56 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Question To Tom Ray To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 1/28/03 10:32:03 PM Eastern Standard Time, gualdaj@bellsouth.net writes: > Is the answer to talk stations like WOR better fidelity ? Have you had > people ask your programming dept. for better fidelity from your station ? > > Do you think there is a market for Talk stations in HI-FI ? > I've heard many talk AMers that sounded like they were in a cardboard box stuff with foam rubber.Thats how distorted and muffled they sounded. Its a wonder anyone can understand enough content to listen to those stations. Just because its talk..doesnt mean is doesnt deserve "hi-fi"...besides to reword the question...instead of a talk station using IBOC...why would a talk station use C-QUAM?.Answer:.to hopefully achieve the next best thing on AM to gain "hi-fi". Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net ____________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From possumhunter@netzero.net Tue Jan 28 21:52:25 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: possumhunter@netzero.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_1); 29 Jan 2003 05:52:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 77130 invoked from network); 29 Jan 2003 05:52:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Jan 2003 05:52:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rly-ip06.mx.aol.com) (205.188.156.51) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Jan 2003 05:52:23 -0000 Received: from logs-wq.proxy.aol.com (logs-wq.proxy.aol.com [205.188.200.132]) by rly-ip06.mx.aol.com (v89.10) with ESMTP id RELAYIN2-0129005138; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 00:51:38 -0500 Received: from ibm (AC8C3D9D.ipt.aol.com [172.140.61.157]) by logs-wq.proxy.aol.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with SMTP id h0T5eAsW375708 for ; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 00:40:11 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <012a01c2c758$dd5b68c0$9d3d8cac@aoldsl.net> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Note to AM Stereo Forum members Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 00:39:58 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Apparently-From: DodgeRamTrucker@aol.com From: "Possum Hunter" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 jbyrns@enteract.com wrote: > This doesn't even pass the smell test! I forget the exact distance between your location and WOR, but I think is was a pretty significant distance, enough where WOR's ground wave would be virtually non existent by the time it reached you, making it hard for me to understand how you could be hearing interference from them during the day. The hashing of WSB's signal was during the Night testing of WOR and WLW. I was merely stating that I live within the WSB .5mv/Meter daytime contour. > >Also I believe there are at least two other stations on 750 kHz between you and WOR, I normally have a quieting signal from WSB 24/7 at my location. BTW, the three longest distance groundwaves I can get in the Winter at midday are: 540 WFLE 440 Miles 690 WOKV 320 Miles With heavy QRM from WZAP 132 Miles away 700 WLW 336 Miles Kevin From fanfare@globility.com Tue Jan 28 22:10:17 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_1); 29 Jan 2003 06:10:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 8541 invoked from network); 29 Jan 2003 06:10:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Jan 2003 06:10:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.eol.ca) (205.189.151.1) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Jan 2003 06:10:15 -0000 Received: from FAN--MCS (dynamic-b2-84.highspeed.eol.ca [64.56.234.84]) by mail.eol.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id EC49243F22 for ; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 01:11:51 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <200301290110130560.0239F0A9@mail.globility.com> In-Reply-To: References: X-Mailer: Calypso Version 3.30.00.00 (4) Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 01:10:13 -0500 To: "Kevin Tekel" Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: a *rational* discussion of WOR's IBOC signal Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable From: "Marv Southcott" Reply-To: fanfare@globility.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy I have to say I am taken by the interest and concern being expressed this a= nd other groups who, up to now, have been more or less left to their own i= mpressions of what is actually transpiring with WOR's AM trials. Mr. Tekel'= s protestations notwithstanding, it is a credit to WOR's management that yo= u've taken this tack, Mr. Ray. However, as a manufacturer of radio receivers, I have to say that the broad= cast industry in general has not provided much incentive to manufacturers i= n providing an agreeable spec for technical proficiency. As a result, radio= s made for the mass market are generally of barely acceptable specification= . In fact, AM exists in many models in minimalist form just so that it can= be advertised as having AM.=20 Unfortunately, instead of criticizing the quality of these radios, as the i= ndustry might criticize the quality of a piece of transmission gear, many b= roadcasters have simply acquiesced and assumed the quality being offered is= what the public deems acceptable. Little do the broadcasters seem to reali= ze they are the real authority on how good a radio signal should sound. Yet= when crappy radios appear on the market in mounting numbers, no one, not t= he broadcasters, the NAB, the CEA or the SBE issue any kind of challenge or= critique that might cause the radio manufacturer to raise the bar on recei= ver quality. As a result, we find the broadcast profession surrounding them= selves with all manner of these so-dubbed, "typical" radios to establish a = norm, thinking the public could not possibly be the wiser. Perhaps its then= the realization sets in that practically every radio out there, save those= designed for a higher purpose, such as AM Stereo, sound so sadly similar.= =20 When we first entered this business, FM too was considered a throwaway in a= n audio system. If that was the case, think of how AM must been regarded. S= ince then, our company has been instrumental in raising the level of listen= er / broadcaster recognition of FM's audio potential ... so much so that th= e audio from a good FM signal can now compare 99% with the fidelity, sound = staging and ambience of the original source. While that may sound a little= self-indulgent, it was as much to the benefit of the broadcaster as it was= to the the listener.=20=20 In the early 90's, AM Stereo embarked on the same path in its quest to brin= g greater entertainment value to a medium that had allowed itself to become= broadcasting's bargain basement. Unfortunately, with little backing from t= he broadcast industry, benchmark monitors left the shelves because they wer= e considered a needless luxury. As a result many of those who could have r= aised the bar on AM with AM stereo simply signed off.=20=20=20 Here we are at the same crossroads again with another revolutionary new for= m of modulation. It implies that it will raise the bar for AM quality by st= andardizing the quality of sound in radio and eliminating noise ... but the= quality of programming or presentation will remain the same. ;+) While I = certainly can't speak to the future of IBOC in its present form, I can say = that modulating a signal in digital is not going to make all of radio's pro= blems go away. Even though it won't be heard, analog noise will still be a = factor. At the same time, I can also say that it will not fail because we d= id not try to meet the challenge of providing the added sensitivity and sel= ectivity required to make it viable for listeners at all points in the patt= ern. However, I cannot speak for other manufacturers.=20 If you hadn't suspected it already, I am a radio brat. I was brought up on = radio when content was king and TV was a 9" B&W screen. I know a radio rece= iver's potential for quality of reproduction, which is something the broadc= ast industry might want to pay more attention to. Cerrtainly all the memb= ers of this forum are aware of its true value as a source of information an= d entertainment. As a result, I don't believe noise, other than manufacture= d noise, has ever been a real problem with AM radio. Perhaps it has been mo= re of a challenge for certain other receivers though.=20=20 Finally, with the distance characteristic attributable to a free-running, a= nalog AM signal, everyone within reception range benefits, provided the con= tent has any value. Talk to any DXer. If a signal has noise, the human brai= n will readily filter out as much of it as necessary in order to concentrat= e on the content. No problem, they'll also hear the commercials with as muc= h interest as those listening to a fully quieted signal.=20 Good luck, Mr. Ray. You have a job to do. Do it well and it will never be = a failure. So ends my rant. Thank you for your indulgence. Marv Southcott Fanfare Electronics *********** REPLY SEPARATOR *********** On 1/29/2003 at 2:53 AM wortomray wrote: >I spent a good part of this morning discussing a birdie on 890 in=20 >the Meadowlands and on the west side of Manhattan with the WINS/WCBS=20 >engineers. It first appeared when WWRL increased power. It is an=20 >intermod product of 1600 and 710, resultant frequency 890. Neither=20 >station is at fault. It is generated in the receiver, and some=20 >radios do it, others don't. > >While we were looking around, we took their spectrum analyzer to the=20 >WOR transmitter, then out in the field. One set of tests were done=20 >connected to the transmitter monitor port on WOR's DX-50. The other=20 >test was done with a loop antenna in an area where the field strength=20 >from WOR is approximately 1.3 Volts per Meter. In both tests, the=20 >WOR IBOC sidebands are gone at 695 and 725. We show a small area of=20 >spectral regrowth at 685 and 735 which is 65dB under the carrier=20 >level. The rest of the spectrum is clean. At 685 and 735, the=20 >emissions of WOR should be well below -35dB below carrier, which they=20 >are by 30dB.=20=20 > >And the spectrum analyzer shows no overmodulation. The analog=20 >channel modulation is limited to -98% and +120%. This has not only=20 >been verified by our recently calibrated modulation monitor, but by=20 >measurement on an oscilloscope.=20=20 > >As seen from the birdie example above, receivers can and do generate=20 >spurious signals. The broadcaster is not responsible for the=20 >operation or actions of your radio, providing we are abiding by the=20 >rules and regulations of the FCC, which we are. And yes, a receiver=20 >can generate a spur in low signal areas, too.=20=20 > >It's entirely possible it is being caused by the radio's AGC circuit >if its filtering is too broad. And different detector circuits will >exhibit overmodulation-like artifacts when they encounter certain >conditions of modulation vectors they are not designed to receive. >Don't forget.....many manufacturers put a low priority on the AM >section....see any Blaupunkt manual. It mentions in the specifications >section that the radio has an AM section, and that is the extent of >the spec information. Something tells me they spent an entire 5 >minutes design time on the AM section just because the radio is >required to have one. Guaranteed it will not perform well. > >Maybe it's time to put the radios on test sets and see what their RF=20 >and IF sections really look like? > >If you would like me to post a recent photo of WOR's spectrum, I=20 >would be happy to do so. The picture doesn't lie. > > >Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum=20 > >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From amfmdx@fastq.com Tue Jan 28 22:37:16 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_1); 29 Jan 2003 06:37:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 39631 invoked from network); 29 Jan 2003 06:37:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Jan 2003 06:37:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Jan 2003 06:37:14 -0000 Received: from fastq (d179-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.211]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id h0T6bDP18151 for ; Tue, 28 Jan 2003 23:37:13 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 23:37:13 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <000301c2c760$c5ce1380$d3f9bed8@com> To: Subject: Leonard Kahn is my hero MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla Engineer Leonard Kahn petitions the FCC to halt the rollout of iBiquity's HD Radio. Kahn lists a menu of alleged problems, including the "huge costs" and "dramatic increase in interference" in AM signals, which he says "may force many independent rural stations out of business." Kevin Mesa, Arizona From n0uiheric@aol.com Tue Jan 28 23:52:09 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_1); 29 Jan 2003 07:52:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 55172 invoked from network); 29 Jan 2003 07:52:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Jan 2003 07:52:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d10.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.42) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Jan 2003 07:52:08 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-d10.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.9b.3336f5c5 (30970) for ; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 02:51:51 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <9b.3336f5c5.2b68e216@aol.com> Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 02:51:50 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} The truth shall set you free To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih I would disagree. AM radio wasn't broken before IBOCrap arrived...it won't improve AM audio one iota. Receiver design is one problem; the manufacturers are too cheap to manufacture a radio with an AM section that rivals FM. What's an additonal $3 to a consumer? Not much. IBOCrap won't do that at all. It will degrade audio quality on both AM and FM to the point where even 100 kW on FM in St. Louis won't get you past Clayton, or 50 kW on AM in New York won't get you past Staten Island. All of these will basically cover less ground than a 100-watt FM station. The only thing that really needs to be fixed on AM is it's receivers, not drop the proven transmission method in favor of one that would degrade the signal, severely reduce it's coverage area, and trash it's audio quality. Programming is a problem not only on AM, but also on FM. Many FM oldies stations are dropping hits from the late 1950s from their playlists, and basically become light Classic Hits stations. The problem is so few AMs are picking up a real oldies format (WWKB being one example, although it shouldn't have shut off it's AM Stereo exciter) that many listeners are being disenfranchised. The quality of FM programming is suffering, too...far too many songs on Top 40 radio, for example, are being aired with sexually explicit lyrics (I even caught one of the local CC stations airing a song not only with sexually explicit lyrics, but also a racial slur in the same lyrics). This kind of programming would make Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr. roll over in his grave. Listeners are abandoning commercial FM in droves, too. And independent AM and FM stations aren't the only alternatives; public radio, Internet radio, CDs, MP3 files and even, in a select few cases, shortwave stations are reaping corporate radio's lost audience. AM radio is broken not only because of IBOCrap, in addition to cookie-cutter formats that nobody will listen to (a malady on FM, too) and too much corporate control over radio ownership. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From JH_Radio@GameBox.net Wed Jan 29 02:05:58 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: JH_Radio@GameBox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_1); 29 Jan 2003 10:05:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 91842 invoked from network); 29 Jan 2003 10:05:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Jan 2003 10:05:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO babyruth.hotpop.com) (204.57.55.14) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Jan 2003 10:05:56 -0000 Received: from gamebox.net (kubrick.hotpop.com [204.57.55.16]) by babyruth.hotpop.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 1D54E212D63 for ; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 10:02:31 +0000 (UTC) Received: from -enduser.GameBox.net (pcp03184855pcs.benslm01.pa.comcast.net [68.80.77.117]) by smtp-2.hotpop.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 447201B8CAC for ; Tue, 28 Jan 2003 21:51:59 +0000 (UTC) Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030128165403.00a3b1e0@pop.GameBox.net> X-Sender: JH_Radio@pop.GameBox.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 16:56:58 -0500 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Note to AM Stereo Forum members In-Reply-To: <002401c2c67f$9bb9b360$af78fea9@juan> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 X-HotPOP: ----------------------------------------------- Sent By HotPOP.com FREE Email Get your FREE POP email at www.HotPOP.com ----------------------------------------------- From: John X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113800107 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Kevin, Tom stated on early posts that he has tryed to hear what you are hearing on multiple radio's, and has not heard what you are hearing. Why not go and check out what he has to offer? Maybe you'll learn something. Then you can have him hear what you are hearing. All of this debate over E-mail, without sound clipps at least, and then tom can bring some of his radio's to your place. Maybe he'll hear the same thing you do. Maybe you won't hear what you are hearing when you are closer to WOR? I know that doesn't make sense, but who knows? I think you should try and see what happens. What's the worst that can happen? At 10:44 PM 1/27/03 -0500, you wrote: >Hey Kevin, give it a try, go to the WOR site, and then invite the engineers to experience what you hear... where you are at when you listen to YOUR radios.... > >Keep an open mind, just give it a chance.....at the very least go to WOR. > > >Juan > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Kevin T. > To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com > Sent: Monday, January 27, 2003 10:24 PM > Subject: {AMSF} Re: Note to AM Stereo Forum members > > > > Tell you what- you two can make the following deal: go and take a > > tour of WOR, keeping a respectful demeanor, and then he gets to go > > to your place and you can show him first hand what you've been > > experiencing. > > Conditions at WOR's transmitter site are obviously not going to be > the same as they are 25 to 50 miles away. I am reporting what I am > experiencing at these distances, and that is the whole reason why I > even bring it up. I would *expect* to hear such interference if I > was within close proximity of multiple 50,000-watt AM transmitters; > but these sorts of problems should NOT be happening at these > significant distances away from the transmitter, where the received > signal strength is considerably less. > > Nothing would be gained by a visit to WOR. They have an IBOC > exciter, and they have a spectrum analyser which tells them the > signal it is producing is within the FCC and iBiquity guidelines. > As far as Mr. Ray and Mr. Richards are concerned, that's the end of > the story, and think what you will, but I have no reason to not > believe them. But that doesn't change what I am experiencing out > here in the "real world" -- and, as you mention, ANYBODY is welcome > to take a visit to my location and witness these same interference > issues that I have been experiencing. > > I also note that when iBiquity had their 100-watt IBOC test station > WI2XAM on the air on 1700 kHz from the Lucent offices here in Warren, > I drove within a few hundred feet of it and I did not experience any > of these same "splatter" interference problems I am getting from > WOR's signal. Of course my car radio doesn't tune up to 1750 kHz so > I didn't get to fully examine their upper sideband, but at least the > lower sideband of their IBOC signal seemed to be contained within its > claimed +/- 15 kHz bandwidth. > > > > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor > ADVERTISEMENT > > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > >Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Love in Christ: John Bensalem, PA Send me an email Aim: RainAngelsRule MSN: RainAngelsRule@hotmail.com My website Welcome to Napster4TheBlind "Prayer does not change God; it changes you." - Authur unknown [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From kevtronics@yahoo.com Wed Jan 29 02:06:12 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_1); 29 Jan 2003 10:06:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 18658 invoked from network); 29 Jan 2003 10:06:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Jan 2003 10:06:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Jan 2003 10:06:11 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.150] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 29 Jan 2003 10:06:10 -0000 Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 10:06:09 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: a *rational* discussion of WOR's IBOC signal Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <44.2ceff5d0.2b68c0e7@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1380 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.70.5 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > That would open the eyes of a many knuckle heads around here... > maybe they'll see the light and stop with all of this nonsense. Who's the knuckle head? I have never said that WOR is TRANSMITTING the wide-range "splatter" I hear on my radios. I have, however, said that WOR is CAUSING it -- regardless of how "clean" their transmitted signal may be. That's a small but very important difference when it comes to semantics. Claiming that WOR is *transmitting* out to 750 kHz would be to say that they are operating illegally, and that is what Mr. Ray is rightfully very picky about. But claiming that WOR is *causing* this splatter means that while it *does* exist, it could be coming from almost any source, or combination of sources. I will say it once again, for the record. Take it or leave it, believe it or don't believe it, but as I have observed on multiple radios in multiple locations and multiple reception conditions, WOR's IBOC signal is *causing* severe interference to reception of frequencies up to 40 kHz away from their carrier. The *source* of this interference is indeterminate as of yet, but the fact that it is occuring is unquestionable, as anybody who listens to the audio samples I have uploaded can hear, or who happens to be within range of WOR's signal and is listening to the same types of radios that I am using can hear. From JH_Radio@GameBox.net Wed Jan 29 03:17:40 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: JH_Radio@GameBox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_1); 29 Jan 2003 11:17:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 44833 invoked from network); 29 Jan 2003 11:17:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Jan 2003 11:17:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO babyruth.hotpop.com) (204.57.55.14) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Jan 2003 11:17:38 -0000 Received: from gamebox.net (kubrick.hotpop.com [204.57.55.16]) by babyruth.hotpop.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 05B1E21B94E for ; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 02:33:37 +0000 (UTC) Received: from -enduser.GameBox.net (pcp03184855pcs.benslm01.pa.comcast.net [68.80.77.117]) by smtp-2.hotpop.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 92DE91B8809 for ; Tue, 28 Jan 2003 21:45:55 +0000 (UTC) Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030128164545.00a3fc90@pop.GameBox.net> X-Sender: JH_Radio@pop.GameBox.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 16:49:09 -0500 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Curious Note In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 X-HotPOP: ----------------------------------------------- Sent By HotPOP.com FREE Email Get your FREE POP email at www.HotPOP.com ----------------------------------------------- From: John X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113800107 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Kevin, maybe I shouldn't bother saying anything no more.I would not like to get on your bad side! Seriously, it's gottin to the point ware I am afraid to say the wrong thing of offending you. For real, No joke. Especially after all of what has been going on the last few days, and reading how you've responded to the things that has occurred on the forum concerning Tom Ray and WOR. At 02:04 AM 1/28/03 +0000, you wrote: >> Give it up Kevin! Geeze! > >Personal disagreements are not appropriate for a public Forum like >this, especially when they degrade to the level of personal attacks. >If Mr. Ray has issues with my actions, he can discuss it with me >privately, not here on the Forum. We have already had enough >senseless arguing here in the past two days -- some of which I admit >to being guilty of myself -- and it is time we get back to business. > >On a side note, I just received a very harrassing e-mail from >somebody with the Yahoo screen name "crackpot_crackpotter", in >reference to this message thread. This will be reported to Yahoo and >to this person's Internet provider (through an IP number trace) so >that appropriate action can be taken against whoever this person is. >Heated personal disagreements are one thing, but when it gets to this >barbaric of a level, that is simply intolerable. > > > >Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Love in Christ: John Bensalem, PA Send me an email Aim: RainAngelsRule MSN: RainAngelsRule@hotmail.com My website Welcome to Napster4TheBlind "Prayer does not change God; it changes you." - Authur unknown [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Jan 29 03:53:12 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_1); 29 Jan 2003 11:53:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 69738 invoked from network); 29 Jan 2003 11:53:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Jan 2003 11:53:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Jan 2003 11:53:11 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-214.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.214]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h0TBqqhJ003817 for ; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 05:53:09 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <005101c2c78d$3a21b940$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <200301290110130560.0239F0A9@mail.globility.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: a *rational* discussion of WOR's IBOC signal Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 05:53:33 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude BINGO! I'm wondering how we could get enough broadcast engineers together to create a big collective yell that would be heard in the halls of these organizations? I suppose I could start with the SBE, since I'm a member, but there are a lot of good engineers that aren't. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Marv Southcott" > Little do the broadcasters seem to realize they are the real authority on how good a radio signal should sound. Yet when crappy radios appear on the market in mounting numbers, no one, not the broadcasters, the NAB, the CEA or the SBE issue any kind of challenge or critique that might cause the radio manufacturer to raise the bar on receiver quality. As a result, we find the broadcast profession surrounding themselves with all manner of these so-dubbed, "typical" radios to establish a norm, thinking the public could not possibly be the wiser. From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Jan 29 03:53:13 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_1); 29 Jan 2003 11:53:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 25049 invoked from network); 29 Jan 2003 11:53:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Jan 2003 11:53:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Jan 2003 11:53:08 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-214.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.214]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h0TBqqhH003817 for ; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 05:53:06 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <005001c2c78d$385c89a0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: a *rational* discussion of WOR's IBOC signal Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 05:49:35 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Kevin, I think it behooves you to work WITH WOR on this one. I believe what you're saying about it being a real problem, and if you're having it even though not everybody does, it could still be a big enough issue with enough other listeners to hamper HD's success. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: > The *source* of this interference is indeterminate as of yet, but the > fact that it is occuring is unquestionable, as anybody who listens to > the audio samples I have uploaded can hear, or who happens to be > within range of WOR's signal and is listening to the same types of > radios that I am using can hear. From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Wed Jan 29 04:43:06 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_1); 29 Jan 2003 12:43:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 24493 invoked from network); 29 Jan 2003 12:43:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Jan 2003 12:43:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf19bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.159) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Jan 2003 12:43:04 -0000 Received: from juan ([65.80.41.40]) by imf19bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.25 201-253-122-122-125-20020815) with SMTP id <20030129124500.ONSM9963.imf19bis.bellsouth.net@juan> for ; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 07:45:00 -0500 Message-ID: <001201c2c793$f6169430$af78fea9@juan> To: References: <20.8777e50.2b68c23c@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Question To Tom Ray Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 07:43:01 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Bob, I work for an AM Stereo talk station. Yes I think Stereo has a place on a talk station. But just because it's Stereo, doesn't make it Hi Fi. I am not saying that Stations should not spend thousands of $ to upgrade to IBOC. I am not saying that consumers should not spend hundreds of $ for an IBOC receiver. I am a capatalist, so they can spend all they want. I just doen't get it. WJR is a great example of a station that "get's it. Great audio, Stereo, and great programming. Some potential IBOC AM stations that I will not name, have horrible audio NOW. If they don't give a crap now, are they so dense to think that IBOC is the answer ? As far as WOR, I have always thought that they had a decent sound, so I respect them in what they feel is a way to sound better,but I respectfully disagree. but that's just my opinion. What I asked Mr. Ray was if consumers.... listeners to his station were asking for their talk shows in better fidelity. By the way Bob, I have never heard your stations, but I am looking forward to it on my next trip up to the Carolinas. Juan ----- Original Message ----- From: KC4QLP@aol.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, January 29, 2003 12:35 AM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Question To Tom Ray In a message dated 1/28/03 10:32:03 PM Eastern Standard Time, gualdaj@bellsouth.net writes: > Is the answer to talk stations like WOR better fidelity ? Have you had > people ask your programming dept. for better fidelity from your station ? > > Do you think there is a market for Talk stations in HI-FI ? > I've heard many talk AMers that sounded like they were in a cardboard box stuff with foam rubber.Thats how distorted and muffled they sounded. Its a wonder anyone can understand enough content to listen to those stations. Just because its talk..doesnt mean is doesnt deserve "hi-fi"...besides to reword the question...instead of a talk station using IBOC...why would a talk station use C-QUAM?.Answer:.to hopefully achieve the next best thing on AM to gain "hi-fi". Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net ____________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ADVERTISEMENT Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From KC4QLP@aol.com Wed Jan 29 05:28:04 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_1); 29 Jan 2003 13:28:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 95246 invoked from network); 29 Jan 2003 13:28:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Jan 2003 13:28:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d06.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.38) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Jan 2003 13:28:02 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.115.1e3759af (4254) for ; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 08:27:15 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <115.1e3759af.2b6930b2@aol.com> Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 08:27:14 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} The truth shall set you free To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 1/29/03 2:52:29 AM Eastern Standard Time, n0 uiheric@aol.com writes: > The problem is so few AMs are > picking up a real oldies format (WWKB being one example, although it > shouldn't have shut off it's AM Stereo exciter) that many listeners are > being > disenfranchised. And according to your "expert" analysis and information hot off the data sheets....just how many people are deluging KB1520 with hate calls,expressing dissatisfaction over --there--"must be a good reason for it" to shut off the C-QUAM mode? You might be surprised how few people either 1. didnt notice that they shut off the pilot and 2. dont have the radios to hear them in stereo to begin with.and 3.probably dont care. My best guess of the situation is that KB1520 wants to sound exactly like they did during the time era of when that format was super popular on {then WKBW} WWKB.That would probably be another good reason for them to work on a deal to grab the old calls back. {and yes they can do that..even if a TV station already has those calls==example ...WCNC-TV is licensed to Charlotte NC{western part of the state}--WCNC-AM is licensed to Elizabeth City NC{eastern part of the state}...and the two stations are not even remotely owned by the same company either.Also...yes an AM can have the same calls of an FM..case example ..before Barnstable bought WCMS in Norfolk Va...WCMS 100.5 used to simulcast its younger FM on the older WCMS-AM 1050.The AM calls were scraped when the format of the AM was changed from country to satellite fed "Music of Your Life". The calls are now WFOG...which about 10 years ago used to be on an FM in neighboring Suffolk Va. Incidentally,when a station changes calls..its amazing to see where the old former calls turn up again...WFOG calls turned up on a station..I forget exactly where..but somewhere in the North East--New England area of the country..and then only to return to the region where they had been for many decades,but on a different station. So to sum it up..dont be surprised to see 1520 as WKBW by years end,if not before. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From KC4QLP@aol.com Wed Jan 29 05:42:13 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_1); 29 Jan 2003 13:42:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 90184 invoked from network); 29 Jan 2003 13:42:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Jan 2003 13:42:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d03.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.35) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Jan 2003 13:42:11 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.174.15fb76df (4254) for ; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 08:41:58 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <174.15fb76df.2b693426@aol.com> Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 08:41:58 EST Subject: Re: a *rational* discussion of WOR's IBOC signal--the pressure is mounting-- To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 1/29/03 5:06:52 AM Eastern Standard Time, kevtronics@yahoo.com writes: > > That would open the eyes of a many knuckle heads around here... > > maybe they'll see the light and stop with all of this nonsense. > > Who's the knuckle head? I have never said that WOR is TRANSMITTING > the wide-range "splatter" I hear on my radios. I have, however, said > that WOR is CAUSING it -- regardless of how "clean" their transmitted > signal may be. That's a small but very important difference when it > comes to semantics. > > Claiming that WOR is *transmitting* out to 750 kHz would be to say > that they are operating illegally, and that is what Mr. Ray is > rightfully very picky about. But claiming that WOR is *causing* this > splatter means that while it *does* exist, it could be coming from > almost any source, or combination of sources. > > I will say it once again, for the record. Take it or leave it, > believe it or don't believe it, but as I have observed on multiple > radios in multiple locations and multiple reception conditions, WOR's > IBOC signal is *causing* severe interference to reception of > frequencies up to 40 kHz away from their carrier. > > The *source* of this interference is indeterminate as of yet, but the > fact that it is occuring is unquestionable, as anybody who listens to > the audio samples I have uploaded can hear, or who happens to be > within range of WOR's signal and is listening to the same types of > radios that I am using can hear. > I'm more confused now than I was yesterday. I think I need another two pots of coffee and a half a bottle of asprins and see if I can sort this one out. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From KC4QLP@aol.com Wed Jan 29 05:45:46 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_1); 29 Jan 2003 13:45:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 22255 invoked from network); 29 Jan 2003 13:45:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Jan 2003 13:45:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r05.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.101) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Jan 2003 13:45:45 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.1eb.817621 (4254) for ; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 08:45:08 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1eb.817621.2b6934e4@aol.com> Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 08:45:08 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Question To Tom Ray To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 1/29/03 7:44:14 AM Eastern Standard Time, gualdaj@bellsouth.net writes: > By the way Bob, I have never heard your stations, but I am looking forward > to it on my next trip up to the Carolinas. > > Juan > If and when you or anyone is in the area..stop in at the AM...I'll give you the 5 cent tour. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From philipr@irac.pe.ca Wed Jan 29 07:41:13 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_1); 29 Jan 2003 15:41:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 14676 invoked from network); 29 Jan 2003 15:41:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Jan 2003 15:41:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.70) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Jan 2003 15:41:03 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.155] by n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 29 Jan 2003 15:41:01 -0000 Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 15:40:57 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: a *rational* discussion of WOR's IBOC signal--the pressure is mounting-- Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <174.15fb76df.2b693426@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 6428 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking This is starting to remind me of a quarrel between two neighbours - one is a ham, the other is an avid TV viewer - using an antenna of course. The ham is 100% certain he is not causing any interference, and figures he has the gear to prove it. The TV viewer is 100% certain the ham is causing the interference, legally or otherwise. We know who the players are. Rather than shouting at each other over the fence, these two otherwise fine folks need to get together, shake hands, and work on this problem. I'm starting from the position that WOR is 100% legal, and that Kevin T. is experiencing weird interference that had begun at the same time WOR started testing IBOC. First, Kevin takes a tour of WOR with Tom, keeping an open mind and putting his best foot forward. No accusations. Keep it pleasant and informative. Now, Tom takes a tour of Kevin's place, and a ride in Kevin's VW [did I remember that correctly?]. Kevin points out the interference, and Tom listens to it. Now Tom is about to reply, "I have better things to do than tour Kevin's house". Maybe, maybe not. WOR is testing IBOC, and IBOC is going to need a lot of fine tuning to get anywhere - its going to need Tom and Kerry, but its also going to need input from folks like Kevin. Maybe it is all in the receivers, but if its affecting a whole bunch of them outside the near field, maybe there is a tweak here and there than can at least reduce this. While IBOC may not be fully compatiable with analogue AM, it does try to an extent, otherwise it would be DRM. Why not try to go the extra mile to finetune IBOC to make it more compatiable with analogue AM? Call it QC-IBOC, if you will - "Quasi-Compatiable IBOC". How many times has the neighbour ham been proved not to be at fault, but took the time to help his neighbour TV viewer's reception problems anyway? I am an AM Stereo fan, but not a fanatic. I don't live in New Jersey. I can't keep tabs on 710 WOR because 720 CHTN is just accross some salt water from my backyard. I want to see AM radio thrive. I want to see it sound good. I have 3 wideband AM Stereo radios, and 3 wideband mono radios to prove it. I want folks in rural fringe areas to have radio service, and choice in radio service, beyond FM's coverage and well beyond the coverage of Eureka 147 L Band DAB. I want to be able to DX at night, though I certainly don't expect to be able to DX plus or minus 20Khz from a local station. I certainly do expect to be able to DX plus or minus 40 khz though. I can understand a station's desire to have strong, interference free reception in their primary market - even in office buildings and parking garages. I can understand a talk station wanting to sound good. I can understand a station not wanting buzzsaw noises from a neighbouring station within its primary service area. Trading pot-shots at each other will not advance AM, be it CQUAM AM Stereo or IBOC. AM stereo improved a lot over the years - maybe IBOC can improve too without beating up too badly on our beloved, crowded [except here in Canada where its FM that's crowded] AM band. Come on guys, shake hands and give us a hand so that AM Stereo [IBOC, CQUAM, some warped combination of the two] will be a widespread reality for the listener. But, don't treat the DXer as some sort of "crackpot" either. A lot of folks DX on AM, whether they know it or not. Out of town sports, listening to a station from back home, etc. Just because someone is an AM Stereo fan doesn't make them a crackpot. Neither does supporting IBOC. Meanwhile, I'll be looking, with some amusement, at those cheap $300 DAB pocket radios from Radio Shack. Phil R. --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, KC4QLP@a... wrote: > In a message dated 1/29/03 5:06:52 AM Eastern Standard Time, > kevtronics@y... writes: > > > > > That would open the eyes of a many knuckle heads around here... > > > maybe they'll see the light and stop with all of this nonsense. > > > > Who's the knuckle head? I have never said that WOR is TRANSMITTING > > the wide-range "splatter" I hear on my radios. I have, however, said > > that WOR is CAUSING it -- regardless of how "clean" their transmitted > > signal may be. That's a small but very important difference when it > > comes to semantics. > > > > Claiming that WOR is *transmitting* out to 750 kHz would be to say > > that they are operating illegally, and that is what Mr. Ray is > > rightfully very picky about. But claiming that WOR is *causing* this > > splatter means that while it *does* exist, it could be coming from > > almost any source, or combination of sources. > > > > I will say it once again, for the record. Take it or leave it, > > believe it or don't believe it, but as I have observed on multiple > > radios in multiple locations and multiple reception conditions, WOR's > > IBOC signal is *causing* severe interference to reception of > > frequencies up to 40 kHz away from their carrier. > > > > The *source* of this interference is indeterminate as of yet, but the > > fact that it is occuring is unquestionable, as anybody who listens to > > the audio samples I have uploaded can hear, or who happens to be > > within range of WOR's signal and is listening to the same types of > > radios that I am using can hear. > > > > I'm more confused now than I was yesterday. I think I need another two pots > of coffee and a half a bottle of asprins and see if I can sort this one out. > > Bob Carter > Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group > > WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 > Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 > > Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering > services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. > e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@e... > Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC > WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC > WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC > Ray Communications Radio Network > > AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- > amstereo-subcribe@t... > > KC4QLP Amateur Radio > Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va > www.kc4qlp.cjb.net > _______________________________________________________ > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Wed Jan 29 08:04:48 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_1); 29 Jan 2003 16:04:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 89323 invoked from network); 29 Jan 2003 16:04:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Jan 2003 16:04:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14202.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.144) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Jan 2003 16:04:46 -0000 Message-ID: <20030129160446.41759.qmail@web14202.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.45.202.244] by web14202.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 08:04:46 PST Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 08:04:46 -0800 (PST) Subject: Uncle Leonard Kahn To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio Somebody's jerking my chain, for as of today, Leonard Kahn has NOT filed any comments on proceeding 99-325. You scared me to think Leonard Kahn and I totally agreed on something after his letter back to me regarding analog stereo AM! I've received documentation from the Virginia group's lawyer regarding their constant prodding of the FCC to take another look at IBOC/HD, and it looks like they are still in the wait and see mode too. __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From wa2fnq@optonline.net Wed Jan 29 08:15:50 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: wa2fnq@optonline.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_1); 29 Jan 2003 16:15:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 44593 invoked from network); 29 Jan 2003 16:15:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Jan 2003 16:15:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Jan 2003 16:15:49 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.180] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 29 Jan 2003 16:15:49 -0000 Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 16:15:48 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: a *rational* discussion of WOR's IBOC signal Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3154 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wa2fnq " X-Originating-IP: 64.236.235.240 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=60059615 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa2fnq Geez Kevin, As SYSOP of this board I would asume you read my post and Tom Rays last post. WOR is NOT the cause of any interference. They're one in a group of signals that mix and cause the problem. Turn any one of them off, including WORs IBOC, and the problem goes away. It's that simple to understand. Tom posted the perfect example. The problem with the spur on the west side of NYC is the station at 1600 KHz minus WOR at 710 KHz equals a spurious signal in some radios at 890 KHz. Simple math. Not complex like the example I gave in my post. Take either signal away and the spur disappears. Both stations are operating in a perfectly normal manner yet this DOES happen. I have some friends who live near Bald Hill here on Long Island. There are probably 150 paging and 2 way transmitters up there along with WBLI, WALK and a LPTV station. It's an RF nightmare with intermod all over the place. If you've ever done any RF work at a site like this you would know what I'm talking about. I have and I know. I'll say it again. I live in the WORs coverage area. The problem does not exsist out here on Long Island. It probably has to do with the directional pattern of some of the stations in the mix. Not all NYC stations are flame throwers out on the island. This is not a personal attack but I feel you do not understand basic RF engineering my friend. Or you're ignoring it to rally for a cause. I am not an IBOC proponent. But shoot yourself in the foot and you put a bullet in the rest of us too. Please think wisely before you speak. Jerry WA2FNQ Manager, RF Systems Home Box Office --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: > > That would open the eyes of a many knuckle heads around here... > > maybe they'll see the light and stop with all of this nonsense. > > Who's the knuckle head? I have never said that WOR is TRANSMITTING > the wide-range "splatter" I hear on my radios. I have, however, said > that WOR is CAUSING it -- regardless of how "clean" their transmitted > signal may be. That's a small but very important difference when it > comes to semantics. > > Claiming that WOR is *transmitting* out to 750 kHz would be to say > that they are operating illegally, and that is what Mr. Ray is > rightfully very picky about. But claiming that WOR is *causing* this > splatter means that while it *does* exist, it could be coming from > almost any source, or combination of sources. > > I will say it once again, for the record. Take it or leave it, > believe it or don't believe it, but as I have observed on multiple > radios in multiple locations and multiple reception conditions, WOR's > IBOC signal is *causing* severe interference to reception of > frequencies up to 40 kHz away from their carrier. > > The *source* of this interference is indeterminate as of yet, but the > fact that it is occuring is unquestionable, as anybody who listens to > the audio samples I have uploaded can hear, or who happens to be > within range of WOR's signal and is listening to the same types of > radios that I am using can hear. From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Wed Jan 29 08:18:18 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_1); 29 Jan 2003 16:18:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 84408 invoked from network); 29 Jan 2003 16:18:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Jan 2003 16:18:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14206.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.173.70) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Jan 2003 16:18:18 -0000 Message-ID: <20030129161818.73935.qmail@web14206.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.45.202.244] by web14206.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 08:18:18 PST Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 08:18:18 -0800 (PST) Subject: CKLW the big 8? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio Jay,N1WVQ wrote: "From what I can tell, CKLW would be one of the best candidates because of its lackluster ratings. Is 500Watt CKWW still beating them in the ratings?" In the Detroit ratings book that is correct. CKWW adult standards has FIVE TIMES the audience of 50KW CKLW talk. Imagine, 2.5 vs 0.5 and I can't even hear 580 at night! They must want CKLW to lose money. If they went back to "The Big 8" similar to the new WSAI, people would listen, or even if they moved the adult standards there they could do even better than 0.5, as we lost our local ClearChannel Adult standards station for infomercials and talk and folks would listen here too. I have pestered the CHUM radio group to swap formats, and they are very pigheaded and say there is no way that they will even consider it. Their engineer degraded me and said he went to far as to 'disable' the stereo STL for AM 800 so they will never go stereo again either. WHY so much hatred for Stereo AM from some of these engineers? Anybody else wants to suggest this to the CHUM group - good luck. At least they finally got smart with CHUM-AM again. __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From philipr@irac.pe.ca Wed Jan 29 08:59:58 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_1); 29 Jan 2003 16:59:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 58129 invoked from network); 29 Jan 2003 16:59:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Jan 2003 16:59:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Jan 2003 16:59:53 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.131] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 29 Jan 2003 16:59:51 -0000 Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 16:59:50 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: CKLW the big 8? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20030129161818.73935.qmail@web14206.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3489 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking The CHUM group got very smart with 920 CJCH - broadcasting a format that covers oldies and Adult Standards, along with some local sports in the evenings, in glorious AM Stereo, with only very modest compression/limiting, putting FM sister station CIOO to shame in the sound quality sweepstakes. I'm hearing lots of commercials on CJCH, and their announcer's sound like they are really enjoying themselves, two signs that a move from sports to music is working well for them. The real test, however, will be the Spring BBMs. Let's hope the good folks in HRM show their support. CHUM has kept 580 CFRA in AM Stereo, so I think an anti AM Stereo bias at CHUM's Windsor stations is more of a local "initiative" rather than a chain directive. Maybe CFRA will change to music, timed with 50 kw at night, when CJFX pulls the plug on its 25kw AM site. Mind you, if CFRA's ratings as news/talk are OK, why change? In a market of over one million people, I can see that a non CBC talk station might work. CFRA has long wanted to direct a strong signal toward Montreal to grab the Ottawa-Montreal commuter market. Even with only 10 kw at night, CFRA can be heard in the background [sometimes in the foreground] in CJFX's big NW null. 50kw would make that signal cleaner and more reliable. Phil R. P.S. Some weekend AM Stereo DXing may have revealed 1270 CJCB back in AM Stereo. It may just have been 25 hz falsing, but there seemed to be good separation. The economy is really starting to improve in Industrial Cape Breton, despite the closure of the steel plant and the last coal mine, and maybe, just maybe, MBS radio is turning the CQUAM exciter back on for the benefit of us "fanatics" and for folks with older cars and new expensive models from the big 3. The sound quality on CJCB was very, very good - and although I'm not a C&W fan, they were playing a very good mix of C&W. If you are making money, why not reduce your taxes a bit by buying some AM stereo gear, pleasing some listeners, and be able to honestly say "We're in Stereo". --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John P." wrote: > Jay,N1WVQ wrote: > "From what I can tell, CKLW would be one of the > best candidates because of its lackluster > ratings. Is 500Watt CKWW still beating them in > the ratings?" > > In the Detroit ratings book that is correct. CKWW adult standards has FIVE > TIMES the audience of 50KW CKLW talk. Imagine, 2.5 vs 0.5 and I can't even > hear 580 at night! They must want CKLW to lose money. If they went back to > "The Big 8" similar to the new WSAI, people would listen, or even if they moved > the adult standards there they could do even better than 0.5, as we lost our > local ClearChannel Adult standards station for infomercials and talk and folks > would listen here too. > > I have pestered the CHUM radio group to swap formats, and they are very > pigheaded and say there is no way that they will even consider it. Their > engineer degraded me and said he went to far as to 'disable' the stereo STL for > AM 800 so they will never go stereo again either. WHY so much hatred for > Stereo AM from some of these engineers? > > Anybody else wants to suggest this to the CHUM group - good luck. At least > they finally got smart with CHUM-AM again. > > __________________________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. > http://mailplus.yahoo.com From fanfare@globility.com Wed Jan 29 09:51:04 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_1); 29 Jan 2003 17:51:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 51353 invoked from network); 29 Jan 2003 17:49:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Jan 2003 17:49:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Jan 2003 17:49:30 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.253] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 29 Jan 2003 17:49:29 -0000 Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 17:49:28 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: CKLW the big 8? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20030129161818.73935.qmail@web14206.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1534 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Mr.M S " X-Originating-IP: 64.56.233.215 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John P." wrote: > > I have pestered the CHUM radio group to swap formats, and they are very > pigheaded and say there is no way that they will even consider it. Their > engineer degraded me and said he went to far as to 'disable' the stereo STL for > AM 800 so they will never go stereo again either. WHY so much hatred for > Stereo AM from some of these engineers? > > Anybody else wants to suggest this to the CHUM group - good luck. At least > they finally got smart with CHUM-AM again. When "1050 CHUM" first went back to their oldies format, they were intending to go stereo. However, they found they were looking at a lot of heavy maintenance to get back on line. That could easily have translated into the kind of $$ the corporation might not have budgeted. I agree with Phil about the attitude CHUM may have adopted. Where it is working, support it. Where it is not, don't abuse the budget unless it's part of the revenue stream. Also, there is news on the street of Moses Znaimer, the architect of much of CHUM's "CITY-TV" empire, leaving the company. But he's at a good age to retire and consult anyways. They could easliy be going through a reorganization patch which always takes a little time to 'gel'. Finally, CHUM was the spark plug for E147. And, with there being no official revitalization of AM Stereo in sight, the analogy applies "When a flower has died, no amount of water will revive it. It must be reborn in another." M.S. From jbyrns@enteract.com Wed Jan 29 10:14:10 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_1); 29 Jan 2003 18:14:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 97868 invoked from network); 29 Jan 2003 18:14:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Jan 2003 18:14:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Jan 2003 18:14:09 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.179] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 29 Jan 2003 18:14:09 -0000 Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 18:14:07 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Lenny Con Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20030128213823.85588.qmail@web41012.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1137 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.98.40 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g Any idea what Leonard's goal with this filing is? Does he hope that in addition to throwing out "IBOC", the FCC will revisit the analog AM stereo system issue, and give his CISB system the nod, rather than CQUAM? John --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, JNR wrote: > From today's (1/28) All Access: > > Engineer and creator of one of the original AM > Stereo systems LEONARD KAHN has filed an > objection to the > FCC's approval of iBIQUITY's IBOC digital radio > system HD RADIO, reports INSIDE RADIO. KAHN's > filing argues that > the use of iBIQUITY's system can only work in > daylight hours on AM, takes up too much > bandwidth, and costs too > much. The filing proposes a new panel of > ex-Commissioners and experts to replace the > industry committee that > recommended the iBIQUITY system. > > Maybe we SHOULD support IBOC then. Why did > engineers like his system? I don't get it. From > what I've heard of the samples posted, Magnavox > was the way to go with C-QUAM right behind it. > IT'S ALL ABOUT THE SOUND, BABAY! Who cares about > coverage if your station sounds like GARBAGE? > > J From jbyrns@enteract.com Wed Jan 29 10:24:46 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_1); 29 Jan 2003 18:24:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 72900 invoked from network); 29 Jan 2003 18:24:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Jan 2003 18:24:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Jan 2003 18:24:41 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.147] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 29 Jan 2003 18:24:41 -0000 Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 18:24:40 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: a *rational* discussion of WOR's IBOC signal Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <200301290110130560.0239F0A9@mail.globility.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 6473 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.98.40 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Marv Southcott" wrote: > I have to say I am taken by the interest and concern being expressed > this and other groups who, up to now, have been more or less left > to their own impressions of what is actually transpiring with WOR's > AM trials. Mr. Tekel's protestations notwithstanding, it is a credit > to WOR's management that you've taken this tack, Mr. Ray. > > However, as a manufacturer of radio receivers, I have to say that > the broadcast industry in general has not provided much incentive > to manufacturers in providing an agreeable spec for technical > proficiency. As a result, radios made for the mass market are > generally of barely acceptable specification. In fact, AM exists in > many models in minimalist form just so that it can be advertised > as having AM. > > Unfortunately, instead of criticizing the quality of these radios, > as the industry might criticize the quality of a piece of > transmission gear, many broadcasters have simply acquiesced and > assumed the quality being offered is what the public deems > acceptable. Little do the broadcasters seem to realize they are the > real authority on how good a radio signal should sound. Yet when > crappy radios appear on the market in mounting numbers, no one, not > the broadcasters, the NAB, the CEA or the SBE issue any kind of > challenge or critique that might cause the radio manufacturer to > raise the bar on receiver quality. As a result, we find the > broadcast profession surrounding themselves with all manner of these > so-dubbed, "typical" radios to establish a norm, thinking the public > could not possibly be the wiser. Perhaps its then the realization > sets in that practically every radio out there, save those designed > for a higher purpose, such as AM Stereo, sound so sadly similar. I think the receiver problem goes beyond just a desire on the part of the manufacturers to reduce costs. Take the narrow bandwidth that is a virtually universal feature of AM receivers, this isn't just a matter of cost cutting, but has been forced on the receiver manufacturers by the broadcast industry, due to the exponential increase in the number of AM stations that has occurred since WW2. To be acceptable as a general purpose receiver, usable by the general public in any location, narrow bandwidth is a necessity. Wide bandwidth is only usable relatively close to a transmitter. A few manufacturers have attempted to solve this problem by including switch-able wide and narrow bandwidths, but this does cost more money, and the fact that it is necessary only highlights the fact that narrow bandwidth is indispensable for analog AM reception. The need for narrow bandwidth does not however excuse the receiver manufactures from providing decent spurious response rejection. It is interesting that these same issues of cost, and receiver quality, were being raised on the editorial pages of radio magazines even prior to WW2, but seem to have been largely forgotten after WW2, when the concern was with television. > When we first entered this business, FM too was considered a > throwaway in an audio system. If that was the case, think of how AM > must been regarded. Since then, our company has been instrumental in > raising the level of listener / broadcaster recognition of FM's > audio potential ... so much so that the audio from a good FM signal > can now compare 99% with the fidelity, sound staging and ambience of > the original source. While that may sound a little self-indulgent, > it was as much to the benefit of the broadcaster as it was to the > the listener. > > In the early 90's, AM Stereo embarked on the same path in its quest > to bring greater entertainment value to a medium that had allowed > itself to become broadcasting's bargain basement. Wouldn't the early 80's be more nearly correct here, than is the "early 90's"? By the "early 90's" AM stereo had peaked in the U.S.A., and was already on it's way down. > Unfortunately, with little backing from the broadcast industry, > benchmark monitors left the shelves because they were considered a > needless luxury. As a result many of those who could have raised > the bar on AM with AM stereo simply signed off. > > Here we are at the same crossroads again with another revolutionary > new form of modulation. It implies that it will raise the bar for AM > quality by standardizing the quality of sound in radio and > eliminating noise ... but the quality of programming or presentation > will remain the same. ;+) While I certainly can't speak to the > future of IBOC in its present form, I can say that modulating a > signal in digital is not going to make all of radio's problems go > away. Even though it won't be heard, analog noise will still be a > factor. At the same time, I can also say that it will not fail > because we did not try to meet the challenge of providing the added > sensitivity and selectivity required to make it viable for listeners > at all points in the pattern. However, I cannot speak for other > manufacturers. Backtracking a bit to older forms of modulation, could you give us a brief discussion of the AM circuit topology used in your FTA-100 tuner, and how it deals with the various challenges of reception on the AM band. In particular I would be interested in hearing what steps have been take to avoid 3rd order IM problems of the sort the Carver TX-11A has? If I bought an FTA-100, would I be able to receive the station at 620 kHz, when there are nearby 50 kW transmitters on 670 kHz and 720 kHz? Your web site gives precious few specs. for the AM section of the FTA-100, the lack of specs. giving it some of the feel of the typical after thought AM section in many other tuners. The only relevant specification is the image response specification, which doesn't concern me directly, as I have not experienced this problem to any degree, but the low image rejection does imply a minimum of RF filtering in the front end of the FTA-100, which may also imply poor 3rd order IM performance, unless the RF amplifier and mixer stages are of really exemplary design. I notice from the photos of the FTA-100 on your web page that the only AM antenna input appears to be an "F" connector of the type used on FM, with no apparent provisions for connecting a loop. What sort of AM antenna do you recommend for use with the FTA-100? John From jsgil@hal-pc.org Wed Jan 29 11:53:38 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_1); 29 Jan 2003 19:53:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 17166 invoked from network); 29 Jan 2003 19:53:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Jan 2003 19:53:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Jan 2003 19:53:36 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.150] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 29 Jan 2003 19:53:36 -0000 Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 19:53:36 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Uncle Leonard Kahn Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20030129160446.41759.qmail@web14202.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 993 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.138 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John P." wrote: > Somebody's jerking my chain, for as of today, Leonard Kahn has NOT filed any > comments on proceeding 99-325. > > You scared me to think Leonard Kahn and I totally agreed on something after his > letter back to me regarding analog stereo AM! > > I've received documentation from the Virginia group's lawyer regarding their > constant prodding of the FCC to take another look at IBOC/HD, and it looks like > they are still in the wait and see mode too. > I looked at the 99-325 and didn't find it either unless he filed it under a different proceeding of filed by snail mail and the FCC hasn't had time to put it in electronic form and on the web. When I went to the Inside Radio website they had a short blurp under the title and when clicked on it just returned you back to the main page since it is a subscription site. Has anyone read the whole article to see if it was more info on how he filed. JSG From alfredot@inetarena.com Wed Jan 29 12:42:51 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: alfredot@inetarena.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_1); 29 Jan 2003 20:42:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 38357 invoked from network); 29 Jan 2003 20:42:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Jan 2003 20:42:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.inetarena.com) (206.129.216.13) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Jan 2003 20:42:50 -0000 Received: from hendrie (1Cust205.tnt17.beaverton.or.da.uu.net [65.227.179.205]) by mail.inetarena.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h0TKeIa05334 for ; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 12:40:19 -0800 (PST) Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 12:41:57 -0800 (PST) X-Sender: alfredo@hendrie.1610am.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Note to AM Stereo Forum members In-Reply-To: <1043640471.1074.3862.m2@yahoogroups.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: "Alfredo E. Torrejon" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=25132238 X-Yahoo-Profile: alfredotorrejon > > Thats quite unfortunate. Censorship at its highest! > > I am not in favor of censorship. But when people come in here, > refuse to engage in constructive discussion, and start using > offensive language (to quote Mr. Ray, "you can take your forum and > shove it up your ass"), that is unacceptable. Kevin, what I don't understand is, why didn't you accept WOR's offer to visit their transmitter site? If you're really experiencing the level of interference with WOR that you claim, then why didn't you take the opportunity to meet with WOR's engineers and *demonstrate* to them that there is an unacceptable level of hash. Then you could have them attempt to refute your claim, using their receivers and measurements from their spectrum analyzer. That would be a lot more educational and constructive (especially for people like me who live in markets that are not near any stations testing IBOC) than the shouting match that has been going on in this forum. All this shouting and making Tom Ray mad enough to ask that the forum be inserted into a bodily orifice does nothing for most participants. Alfredo From JH_Radio@GameBox.net Wed Jan 29 13:41:27 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: JH_Radio@GameBox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_1); 29 Jan 2003 21:41:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 61500 invoked from network); 29 Jan 2003 21:41:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Jan 2003 21:41:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rizzo.jerky.net) (204.57.55.99) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Jan 2003 21:41:02 -0000 Received: from gamebox.net (kubrick.hotpop.com [204.57.55.16]) by rizzo.jerky.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 5A7F436E2D for ; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 21:40:24 +0000 (UTC) Received: from -enduser.GameBox.net (pcp03184855pcs.benslm01.pa.comcast.net [68.80.77.117]) by smtp-1.hotpop.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1233F2F909E for ; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 21:01:33 +0000 (UTC) Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030129160410.026b7010@pop.GameBox.net> X-Sender: JH_Radio@pop.GameBox.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 16:06:39 -0500 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Narrowing radio's down and some questions: (Carver TX-11 C, Sony SRF-42, Denon TU680NAB, Crisler/Delco Car radio, and Sony IBF-2010) In-Reply-To: <000701c2c739$ec4e1a40$827dfea9@home1> References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030126141508.02eb12d0@pop.GameBox.net> <5.2.0.9.0.20030126171533.031b2180@mail.comcast.net> <000901c2c671$0007a3e0$827dfea9@home1> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-HotPOP: ----------------------------------------------- Sent By HotPOP.com FREE Email Get your FREE POP email at www.HotPOP.com ----------------------------------------------- From: John X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113800107 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I'd like the expanded band option... John Maybe I should just go for the crisler radio's? Or the one in that $40000 car, I don't remember who said it or what it was. All I remember is that he or she said it sounded the best he's ever heard. It selects the best listening environment, IE narrow or wide, and has great noise reduction. Ideas? At 07:58 PM 1/28/03 -0600, you wrote: >Then again, I'm not sure it has the expanded band... >ST > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Scott Todd" > > > >> Carver TX-2 >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "John" >> >> >> >> > What is an Easy AMS conversion? >> > > >Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Love in Christ: John Bensalem, PA Send me an email Aim: RainAngelsRule MSN: RainAngelsRule@hotmail.com My website Welcome to Napster4TheBlind "Prayer does not change God; it changes you." - Authur unknown [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From KC4QLP@aol.com Wed Jan 29 13:49:41 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_1); 29 Jan 2003 21:49:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 16523 invoked from network); 29 Jan 2003 21:49:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Jan 2003 21:49:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m08.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.163) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Jan 2003 21:49:40 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.aa.1785f1ff (3972) for ; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 16:49:27 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 16:49:27 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: a *rational* discussion of WOR's IBOC signal To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 1/29/03 11:17:18 AM Eastern Standard Time, wa2fnq@optonline.net writes: << This is not a personal attack but I feel you do not understand basic RF engineering my friend. Or you're ignoring it to rally for a cause. I am not an IBOC proponent. But shoot yourself in the foot and you put a bullet in the rest of us too. Please think wisely before you speak. Jerry WA2FNQ Manager, RF Systems Home Box Office >> {hides in corner with bullet proof vest on} Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- Subscribe send an email to amstereo-subscribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net _______________________________________________________ From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Wed Jan 29 13:59:57 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_1); 29 Jan 2003 21:59:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 25857 invoked from network); 29 Jan 2003 21:59:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Jan 2003 21:59:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14208.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.173.72) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Jan 2003 21:59:55 -0000 Message-ID: <20030129215954.98917.qmail@web14208.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.45.202.244] by web14208.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 13:59:54 PST Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 13:59:54 -0800 (PST) Subject: Stereo on AM - One person's viewpoints To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio AM and Stereo – the big picture. Reader’s Digest Condensed Book Version. PART ONE: Technical: Let me first state that I am very happy that IBOC/HD Radio was initially designed with working towards being compatible with existing analog AM broadcast band receivers, rather than scrap all existing (literally) half-billion AM receivers. I sincerely hope that Tom Ray’s work at WOR will help iBiquity to try out many different ways of transmitting stereo audio over great distances with compatibility to existing equipment. I hope that they’re open to using their new hardware with a different setup as well. Also let me state that it’s my opinion that Motorola C-Quam AM Stereo sounds great on a decent stereo AM receiver, especially those with the 2nd and 3rd generation chips which reduce the so-called ‘platform motion’ and have the gradual fade to mono. Receivers/tuners that come to mind in this category include the Chrysler 5-band-EQ radio of the 90’s, the Delco/GM ‘UX-1’ (and variants) with the ‘AM/ST’ pushbutton, the Sony SRF-A100/SRF-A1, and last and surely not least, the current production Fanfare FTA-100P monitor. It’s also my opinion that wideband mono AM sounds great on a GE SuperRadio with a station transmitting decent (not overcompressed) wideband audio. We’re talking the AMAX standard here (analog audio out to 7.5KHz with noise blanker technology). My goal is for a system that can incorporate the best of all 3 worlds listed above. How to do it is yet to be determined and tested. It is my opinion that a hybrid combination of all 3 would be great, and I have an idea to that effect (if iBiquity is interested – hint, hint.) Please note that this requires work on both the broadcast end, and on the receiver manufacturing end to put out a quality product. I agree with Marv S: the broadcasters and receiver manufacturers have to promote each other and care about the quality of both as well. PART TWO: Content: As someone had said before, “it’s the programming stupid”; this may or may not be related to success of the AM band, BUT it does appear that “If you play it, they will come” does work on the AM broadcast band. Specialty music formats will get people to find that tiny “AM” pushbutton again. Classic country, 60s & 70s music, even Radio Disney gets people to tune-in to AM again. Obviously, music is the best beneficiary of Stereo AM, although the commercial spots on ANY format station sound better in stereo. A ‘balance’ and MIX of MUSIC and News/Talk is probably the best plan for the band, but no matter how well the programming quality, it still falls back to PART ONE to have BOTH broadcasters AND receiver manufacturers put out a quality product. Let’s hope that everybody can put their heads together to figure out the best way to make a backwards compatible quality STEREO AM broadcasting and receiving system. PART THREE: SUGGESTION OF THE DAY: The HD-QUAM SYSTEM. __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Wed Jan 29 15:02:26 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_1); 29 Jan 2003 23:02:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 13437 invoked from network); 29 Jan 2003 23:02:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Jan 2003 23:02:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf52bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.101) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Jan 2003 23:02:22 -0000 Received: from juan ([68.158.106.197]) by imf52bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.25 201-253-122-122-125-20020815) with SMTP id <20030129230419.OELP9487.imf52bis.bellsouth.net@juan> for ; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 18:04:19 -0500 Message-ID: <001a01c2c7ea$7ab71a10$af78fea9@juan> To: References: <174.15fb76df.2b693426@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: a *rational* discussion of WOR's IBOC signal--the pressure is mounting-- Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 18:02:21 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I'm more confused now than I was yesterday. I think I need another two pots of coffee and a half a bottle of asprins and see if I can sort this one out. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net _______________________________________________________ Whatever you do, don't hit the bottle ! hi hi Juan [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From groucho@skyweb.net Wed Jan 29 15:11:29 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_1); 29 Jan 2003 23:11:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 23633 invoked from network); 29 Jan 2003 23:11:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 29 Jan 2003 23:11:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 29 Jan 2003 23:11:28 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (tc1-49.skyweb.net [66.6.130.177]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h0TNJXO2084287 for ; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 18:19:33 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3E385D95.EB7B0D32@skyweb.net> Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 18:02:46 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: a *rational* discussion of WOR's IBOC signal--the pressure is mounting-- References: <174.15fb76df.2b693426@aol.com> <001a01c2c7ea$7ab71a10$af78fea9@juan> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 LOL ok here is My Bill send all donations to the Children of Dr. Neal Newman Dr of radio-ology..... C/O My radio station.... LOL take 2 More asprin and try again Tomorrow... From what I can detect there is No Cure... as of Yet. Neal Juan / John Gualda wrote: > I'm more confused now than I was yesterday. I think I need another two pots > of coffee and a half a bottle of asprins and see if I can sort this one out. > > Bob Carter > Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group > > WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 > Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 > > Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering > services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. > e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net > Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC > WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC > WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC > Ray Communications Radio Network > > AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- > amstereo-subcribe@topica.com > > KC4QLP Amateur Radio > Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va > www.kc4qlp.cjb.net > _______________________________________________________ > Whatever you do, don't hit the bottle ! hi hi > > Juan > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Jan 29 16:51:23 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_1); 30 Jan 2003 00:51:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 90120 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 00:51:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 00:51:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 00:51:21 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-128.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.128]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h0U0nthF007841; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 18:49:57 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <004101c2c7f9$bf3b16a0$827dfea9@home1> To: , Subject: results of my look-see Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 18:51:35 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I went up to Virginia, MN to have a look at a station that went dark last Nov., WEEP (former WHLB) 1400. I thought I had a good lead on one of the principals of the station owner (Full Armor Ministries), but came up dry. I went to the address in Eveleth listed on the license, and the woman of the house gave me a forwarding address in Lincoln, NE. Seems to me I had seen one Lincoln reference on FAM's scarcely complete website. I checked with switchboard.com and came up empty on both the principal and FAM. I won't post his name and last known address on this public forum, but I'll give it to anyone interested via private email. The studios and transmitter are in separate buidings, and there was no smoke damage visible on the outside, so the fire damage must have been minimal and confined to the transmitter itself. Both buildings look in good shape on the outside, as is the tower, though the paint is flaking and faded beyond useless. That shouldn't be a problem as the stick is less than 200' and probably no longer requires paint and lights. There's also a four bay FM antenna, tuned to 107.1 from its days as an AM/FM combo. The FM moved to 99.9 and was sold off some years ago, so 107.1 could also be reactivated, though on that short stick, you wouldn't get very far. One other interesting note- the tower had three levels of obstruction lights at 1/3, 2/3 and the top. Must have been some very old lighting code, but I doubt they're needed anymore. I wish I had tried the courthouse records, though there's every chance they could be as dated as the FCC's. The other thing I wished I had done was to tape a note to the door. Someone had been in the studio/offices part in the last few days as evidenced by some fresh footprints and doorswipe in the snow. It's a three hour drive to get up there, and I'd prefer not to do that again if I don't have to. Anyone else have any suggestions? I suppose someone could try one of those paid search services like US Search, but my wife would take a dim view of my doing that since I'm not the one interested in purchasing the station. I could call the courthouse, but as I said earlier, it may not be better than what I got from the FCC. Anyone else have any suggestions? Scott Todd [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Jan 29 17:13:34 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_1); 30 Jan 2003 01:13:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 50554 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 01:13:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 01:13:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 01:13:33 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-74.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.74]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h0U1C9hF013792; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 19:12:11 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <001001c2c7fc$da924420$827dfea9@home1> To: , References: <004101c2c7f9$bf3b16a0$827dfea9@home1> Subject: Re: {AMSF} results of my look-see Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 19:13:49 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Well, leave it up to me to figure this out only AFTER sending the previous email and turning my computer off. I thought it was possible the switchboard.com search may have come up empty because it was an unlisted number, and I was right. They want $100,000 for the license and property (approx. 4.4 acres.) One other thing I should mention is that there are five satellite dishes out back, four C-band and one Ku-band. I found out the transmitter (a Harris) didn't have a fire per-se, but blew all its modules (I'm guessing the thing is an SX-1.) Got a name for the engineer, and will have to look him up to get more details, but I'm betting it'll be more trouble than it's worth to get it working again. One other thing- on my way home I stopped at the Eveleth station, and saw a couple old AM classics- an RCA 1R on the air, and a Collins 300G backup. Scott Todd ----- Original Message ----- From: "Scott Todd" > From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Jan 29 17:17:51 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_1); 30 Jan 2003 01:17:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 75618 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 01:17:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 01:17:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.87) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 01:17:50 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 17:17:50 -0800 To: References: <20030129050917.66567.qmail@web41006.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} OT: What will be the next 50kW to go oldies Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 20:17:37 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 30 Jan 2003 01:17:50.0735 (UTC) FILETIME=[681F99F0:01C2C7FD] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.128.190.214] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 "JNR" wrote: > From what I can tell, CKLW would be one of the best candidates because of its lackluster ratings. Too bad the noise level on 800Khz is to the point CKLW can no longer be heard in the Upstate of South Carolina. It would help if WPJM 800 would run their legal power at night! Kevin From groucho@skyweb.net Wed Jan 29 17:21:08 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_1); 30 Jan 2003 01:21:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 36500 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 01:21:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 01:21:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 01:21:07 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (tc1-49.skyweb.net [66.6.130.177]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h0U1TCOD026862 for ; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 20:29:13 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3E387BF5.BA58A4F8@skyweb.net> Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 20:12:21 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} results of my look-see References: <004101c2c7f9$bf3b16a0$827dfea9@home1> <001001c2c7fc$da924420$827dfea9@home1> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 well I have a gates BC-1h1 we could use to get it back on the air..... transmitter is not a problem..... and Either the RCA BTA 500r or Collins 300G For a backup thats my Investment Neal Scott Todd wrote: > Well, leave it up to me to figure this out only AFTER sending the previous > email and turning my computer off. I thought it was possible the > switchboard.com search may have come up empty because it was an unlisted > number, and I was right. They want $100,000 for the license and property > (approx. 4.4 acres.) One other thing I should mention is that there are > five satellite dishes out back, four C-band and one Ku-band. > > I found out the transmitter (a Harris) didn't have a fire per-se, but blew > all its modules (I'm guessing the thing is an SX-1.) Got a name for the > engineer, and will have to look him up to get more details, but I'm betting > it'll be more trouble than it's worth to get it working again. > > One other thing- on my way home I stopped at the Eveleth station, and saw a > couple old AM classics- an RCA 1R on the air, and a Collins 300G backup. > > Scott Todd > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Scott Todd" > > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Jan 29 17:31:57 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_1); 30 Jan 2003 01:31:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 94751 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 01:31:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 01:31:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.81) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 01:31:55 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 17:31:55 -0800 To: References: <000301c2c760$c5ce1380$d3f9bed8@com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Leonard Kahn is my hero Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 20:31:41 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 30 Jan 2003 01:31:55.0867 (UTC) FILETIME=[5FDC82B0:01C2C7FF] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.128.190.214] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Kevin - Mesa, Arizona wrote: > Engineer Leonard Kahn petitions the FCC to halt the rollout of iBiquity's HD Radio.Kahn lists a menu of alleged problems, including the "huge costs" and dramatic increase in interference" in AM signals, which he says "may force many independent rural stations out of business." Leonard Kahn hit the nail on the head with this one! IBOC noise will blast many of the smaller stations off of the air for good, and very few independent stations can buy the equipment. For most small stations, it is a struggle just to stay on the air. Kevin From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Wed Jan 29 19:00:24 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_3); 30 Jan 2003 03:00:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 19771 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 03:00:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 03:00:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf17bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.157) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 03:00:22 -0000 Received: from juan ([68.158.106.197]) by imf17bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.25 201-253-122-122-125-20020815) with SMTP id <20030130030219.HDZM14897.imf17bis.bellsouth.net@juan>; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 22:02:19 -0500 Message-ID: <002c01c2c80b$ba043ab0$af78fea9@juan> To: , Subject: Off to Detroit, Windsor Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 22:00:20 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit My brother is getting married this weekend in Troy, MI. So I am off to the wedding. What is the AM Stereo situation up there besides WJR ? Is there some good AM radio to listen for ? Juan [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From kevtronics@yahoo.com Wed Jan 29 19:18:52 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_3); 30 Jan 2003 03:18:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 44320 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 03:18:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 03:18:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 03:18:50 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.145] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Jan 2003 03:18:50 -0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 03:18:48 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Leonard Kahn is my hero Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 886 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.87.30 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Leonard Kahn hit the nail on the head with this one! I think he's just upset that IBOC will make his "PowerSide" system obsolete, because his analog Kahn AM Stereo/PowerSide equipment won't work with IBOC stations, and the IBOC stations that will be using the rumored single-sideband IBOC modes (as mentioned in the Glen Clark Associates petition) will generate it all within the IBOC exciter. BTW, I don't know if it was on this group or another, but a few years ago somebody wrote to Mr. Kahn about AM Stereo and actually got a response back from him, which they shared online. Does anybody have a copy of this? As I recall, he basically stated that even today, he refuses to support the C-Quam system, which he considers to be inherently flawed. p.s. Personally, I think the best way to describe Leonard Kahn is that he's the Ralph Nader of the radio industry. :-) From tomray@wor710.com Wed Jan 29 19:23:55 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 15398 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 03:23:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 03:23:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.68) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 03:23:55 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: tomray@wor710.com Received: from [66.218.67.131] by n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Jan 2003 03:23:54 -0000 X-Sender: tomray@wor710.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_3); 30 Jan 2003 03:07:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 24371 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 03:07:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 03:07:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 03:07:12 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.170] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Jan 2003 03:07:08 -0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 03:07:08 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Question To Tom Ray Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <002401c2c746$cb607690$af78fea9@juan> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1789 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wortomray " X-Originating-IP: 66.67.228.6 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=136489311 X-Yahoo-Profile: wortomray X-eGroups-Edited-By: kevtronics X-eGroups-Approved-By: kevtronics via web; 30 Jan 2003 03:23:53 -0000 Juan: > Is the answer to talk stations like WOR better fidelity ? Have you had people ask your programming dept. for better fidelity from your station ? We are constantly striving for the best the station can be. Obviously, better fidelity will help. We had a Visteon HD radio on in the conference room today. There is a BIG difference between the analog and HD signals, and the HD is a noticeable improvement, even with talk. Quite frankly (and those from the NY market will know this spot), when the Huffman-Koos spot hit, which starts with a lot of high frequency information that gets lost in the analog signal, it was quite startling and eyebrows went up at the manager's meeting. > Do you think there is a market for Talk stations in HI-FI ? Definately. The same way there was a market for talk in AM stereo. Stereo bumper music and spots just make the program sound better....and if you have the added feature of extended audio bandwidth, that makes it even better. Plus, with the stereo aspect, it's fun to had pan pots on the consoles! If you have a talk show with a crowd of people, you can have then surround the listener by creative use of pan pots. > I am not a believer in IBOC, but I respect your opinion. Thanks. I appreciate that. I'm simply a believer in what will give us a better on air presentation. As soon as we can get into the box the Visteon we have is in without damaging it, I'll make some recordings off this radio....it is an actual production model that will be appearing this summer in 2004 model year Ford products, so it's not a test unit. It has quite the sound to it. From tomray@wor710.com Wed Jan 29 19:24:40 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 7725 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 03:24:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 03:24:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 03:24:39 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: tomray@wor710.com Received: from [66.218.67.142] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Jan 2003 03:24:39 -0000 X-Sender: tomray@wor710.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_3); 30 Jan 2003 03:09:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 81031 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 03:09:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 03:09:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 03:09:03 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.191] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Jan 2003 03:08:59 -0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 03:08:57 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Question To Tom Ray Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1429 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wortomray " X-Originating-IP: 66.67.228.6 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=136489311 X-Yahoo-Profile: wortomray X-eGroups-Approved-By: kevtronics via web; 30 Jan 2003 03:24:37 -0000 While WOR is "corporate-owned", the Corporation is comprised of 4 members of a family. Buckley Broadcasting is one of the very few literal mom and pop operations left in the US. --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: > > Is the answer to talk stations like WOR better fidelity ? > > News/Talk/Sports radio has been so successful on AM, and so rare on > FM, precisely because audio fidelity is not a top priority for > listeners. Sure, high-fidelity Stereo sound can be a benefit to any > station, as AM Stereo proves; but in terms of the average listener, > they are likely to listen to it as long as they like the programming > and the reception and audio quality are at least marginally > acceptable. > > Talk stations like 700 WLW and 710 WOR are using IBOC not because of > a specific need for its claimed advantages, but rather just because > they were presented with the opportunity to be the first to use a > radically new technology. Because these corporate-owned 50,000- watt > stations have decades of status backing them up, dabbling with IBOC > is a win-win situation for them either way; if it becomes a success, > they can triumph the fact that they were among the first to use it, > and if it becomes a huge flop, it'll be no big deal, as the cost to > them -- both financially and in terms of credibility -- will be > negligible. From tomray@wor710.com Wed Jan 29 19:25:47 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 44977 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 03:25:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 03:25:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.78) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 03:25:47 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: tomray@wor710.com Received: from [66.218.67.248] by n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Jan 2003 03:25:46 -0000 X-Sender: tomray@wor710.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_3); 30 Jan 2003 03:18:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 4750 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 03:18:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 03:18:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.70) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 03:18:31 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.186] by n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Jan 2003 03:18:31 -0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 03:18:31 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: a *rational* discussion of WOR's IBOC signal Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <200301290110130560.0239F0A9@mail.globility.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 9018 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wortomray " X-Originating-IP: 66.67.228.6 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=136489311 X-Yahoo-Profile: wortomray X-eGroups-Edited-By: kevtronics X-eGroups-Approved-By: kevtronics via web; 30 Jan 2003 03:25:46 -0000 Marv: I will agree with your statements. However, as a broadcaster, how would one go about letting the radio manufacturers know what we need? There seems to be this big void between the stations and the manufacturers, and bridging it would seem to benefit both. And your points are well taken. I was on the ground floor when AM stereo came in in the early 1980's. I remember what a hoot it was to put it on and make it work.....and how cool it was to hear it on my car radio. Unfortunately, three things happened that made the consumer care less. One was that the stations didn't bother promoing the fact that they were stereo and that you needed to go get a radio. Second was, when you looked for a radio, the salespersons didn't know what you were talking about. Lastly was the confusion caused by the fact that Magnavox/Motorola/Harris worked on one setting, Kahn on the other. Most listeners couldn't care less what system you're transmitting in. They want to turn it on and hear it without futzing around. And unfortunately, a lot of receiver manufacturers got burned because of this. In light of Leonard Kahn's recent rumblings, I just hope IBOC doesn't turn into that sequel, "AM 2 - The Wrath of Kahn". From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Wed Jan 29 19:57:07 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_3); 30 Jan 2003 03:57:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 32554 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 03:57:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 03:57:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf25bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.197) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 03:57:05 -0000 Received: from juan ([68.158.106.197]) by imf25bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.25 201-253-122-122-125-20020815) with SMTP id <20030130035902.EOXM16469.imf25bis.bellsouth.net@juan> for ; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 22:59:02 -0500 Message-ID: <000601c2c813$a67981f0$af78fea9@juan> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Question To Tom Ray Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 22:57:03 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mr Ray, Thanks for the response. I appreciate your time. My opinion on IBOC may diifer from yours, but I still respect you taking time to answer. I know you are busy, God knows I am too.............. Long Live AM Radio....(In Stereo) Juan Sincerely Juan ----- Original Message ----- From: wortomray To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, January 29, 2003 10:07 PM Subject: {AMSF} Re: Question To Tom Ray Juan: > Is the answer to talk stations like WOR better fidelity ? Have you had people ask your programming dept. for better fidelity from your station ? We are constantly striving for the best the station can be. Obviously, better fidelity will help. We had a Visteon HD radio on in the conference room today. There is a BIG difference between the analog and HD signals, and the HD is a noticeable improvement, even with talk. Quite frankly (and those from the NY market will know this spot), when the Huffman-Koos spot hit, which starts with a lot of high frequency information that gets lost in the analog signal, it was quite startling and eyebrows went up at the manager's meeting. > Do you think there is a market for Talk stations in HI-FI ? Definately. The same way there was a market for talk in AM stereo. Stereo bumper music and spots just make the program sound better....and if you have the added feature of extended audio bandwidth, that makes it even better. Plus, with the stereo aspect, it's fun to had pan pots on the consoles! If you have a talk show with a crowd of people, you can have then surround the listener by creative use of pan pots. > I am not a believer in IBOC, but I respect your opinion. Thanks. I appreciate that. I'm simply a believer in what will give us a better on air presentation. As soon as we can get into the box the Visteon we have is in without damaging it, I'll make some recordings off this radio....it is an actual production model that will be appearing this summer in 2004 model year Ford products, so it's not a test unit. It has quite the sound to it. Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From kevtronics@yahoo.com Wed Jan 29 20:01:33 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_3); 30 Jan 2003 04:01:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 11275 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 04:01:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 04:01:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 04:01:33 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.134] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Jan 2003 04:01:32 -0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 04:01:29 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Question To Tom Ray Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2719 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.87.30 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > We had a Visteon HD radio on in the conference room today. There > is a BIG difference between the analog and HD signals, and the HD > is a noticeable improvement, even with talk. Obviously -- because comparing it to WOR's 5 kHz analog audio is unquestionably a biased comparison. While generally acceptable for talk programming, 5 kHz of audio response is not "hi-fi" by any means, and any expansion of that response -- even up to the 6.2 kHz which WOR previously was using -- will be perceived as a very noticeable improvement. If you had compared WOR's 5 kHz analog audio to that of a conventional analog AM station using ~10 kHz audio response -- and received on a radio that can reproduce this full bandwidth -- then the improvement of IBOC's digital audio would not be so noticeable, and it may even appear to be less crisp, clear, and "hi-fi" than the same regular analog AM (mono OR Stereo) that stations have been using for decades, due to the "artifacts" and inherent limitations of the digitally-compressed IBOC/"HD" audio. > Plus, with the stereo aspect, it's fun to had pan pots on the > consoles! If you have a talk show with a crowd of people, you can > have then surround the listener by creative use of pan pots. WTTM 1680 AM Stereo in Princeton, NJ often does this with their talk shows. The main host and callers are in the center of the audio image, while guests in the studio come through exclusively in the left or right channel. In Stereo, this provides a very attention- getting sound, and mono listeners don't notice any difference because C-Quam's matrix processing automatically makes up for the difference in levels. > As soon as we can get into the box the Visteon we have is in > without damaging it, I'll make some recordings off this radio....it > is an actual production model that will be appearing this summer in > 2004 model year Ford products, so it's not a test unit. It has > quite the sound to it. My question regarding this radio would be how it sounds in *analog* mode, particularly when tuned to non-IBOC stations. I presume that in order to prevent background hiss when it is tuned to an IBOC station but is not yet decoding the digital signal, the tuner probably employs a strict 5 kHz audio cut-off -- thus restricting even conventional analog AM stations to this same low-fidelity sound. Likewise, I would presume that the automatically variable bandwidth (depending on signal strength) and AM Stereo features are also no longer included in these new Visteon radios -- although everything is done by DSP code, so there's no real reason why they couldn't include the same high-performance analog AM Stereo tuner design as before. From tomray@wor710.com Wed Jan 29 20:04:19 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 61619 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 04:04:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 04:04:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 04:04:19 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: tomray@wor710.com Received: from [66.218.67.132] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Jan 2003 04:04:18 -0000 X-Sender: tomray@wor710.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_3); 30 Jan 2003 03:30:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 37100 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 03:30:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 03:30:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 03:30:01 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.135] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Jan 2003 03:30:00 -0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 03:29:57 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: a *rational* discussion of WOR's IBOC signal Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 4021 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wortomray " X-Originating-IP: 66.67.228.6 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=136489311 X-Yahoo-Profile: wortomray X-eGroups-Edited-By: kevtronics X-eGroups-Approved-By: kevtronics via web; 30 Jan 2003 04:04:18 -0000 I'm more than willing to show Kevin around and listen to things with him. Matter of fact, if he simply agrees not to drive us nutzo with emails, I'll unblock his address in WOR's server and we can chat in private. What about it Kevin? Shall we get together? Bring some people along, and I can probably arrange a tour of a couple of other sites, too. And I have a theory on Kevin's splatter issue.....it has to do with fundamental AM theory and receiver design, and will be somewhat lengthy....and it's late right now. I'll post it tomorrow night, as it makes sense with what's going on with Kevin's radios. From tomray@wor710.com Wed Jan 29 20:06:34 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 23508 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 04:06:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 04:06:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 04:06:33 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: tomray@wor710.com Received: from [66.218.67.161] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Jan 2003 04:06:14 -0000 X-Sender: tomray@wor710.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_3); 30 Jan 2003 03:38:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 54099 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 03:38:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 03:38:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.88) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 03:38:33 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.143] by n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Jan 2003 03:38:31 -0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 03:37:11 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Leonard Kahn is my hero Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1981 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wortomray " X-Originating-IP: 66.67.228.6 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=136489311 X-Yahoo-Profile: wortomray X-eGroups-Edited-By: kevtronics X-eGroups-Approved-By: kevtronics via web; 30 Jan 2003 04:06:10 -0000 WOR had a power side on for a while. Kahn's people accidentally disabled the VSWR protection on the Continental transmitter, known as the Magniphase. I found out one night when a contactor in the RF switching hung up and the transmitter came up at 50KW into nothing.....let me tell you, a 317C-1 sending 17KV of RF to ground makes a very large bang. So, after recomposing myself, I figured out that the tech missed a pin in his count inserting the RF from the exciter (there is no external input on a 317C). Moved it one pin (and one AND gate) over, and Mr. Magniphase worked fine. I documented the change and faxed it to Leonard, along with a "just so you know......here's the fix for your files" note. He actually called me up and yelled at me! Said I screwed up his installation. If a nanosecond makes that much difference, I think there is a major problem with the system design. Personally, I think Leonard is his own worst enemy. From di316@freenet.carleton.ca Wed Jan 29 20:06:50 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: paulc@ncf.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_3); 30 Jan 2003 04:06:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 65672 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 04:06:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 04:06:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO tomts10-srv.bellnexxia.net) (209.226.175.54) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 04:06:49 -0000 Received: from ncf.ca ([64.230.25.115]) by tomts10-srv.bellnexxia.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.19 201-253-122-122-119-20020516) with ESMTP id <20030130040648.IQWM23728.tomts10-srv.bellnexxia.net@ncf.ca> for ; Wed, 29 Jan 2003 23:06:48 -0500 Message-ID: <3E38A4DC.109879A1@ncf.ca> Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 23:06:52 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.79 [en] (Windows NT 5.0; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: AM Stereo on Slashdot Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-eGroups-From: Paul Cumming From: Paul Cumming X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=43835445 X-Yahoo-Profile: rahoule104 On tech news website Slashdot, there was a story and discussion about FM and XM radio recently. One poster started talking about AM stereo at one point. Here's the whole thread. The poster, who goes by the handle "PotatoHead", mentions AM stereo in more than one post: http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=51279&cid=5116379&mode=nested In case you're in a hurry, here are the individual posts, themselves. The second one is really good. He sometimes spells it "Am stereo" which can be a bit confusing to read. 1. http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=51279&cid=5116379 2. http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=51279&cid=5117165 3. http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=51279&cid=5119157 He also mentions "Dolby FM" in this post. Is this noise reduction or volume compression for FM like FMX? Why would it need an "alignment signal" to be periodically broadcast? http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=51279&cid=5117204 By the way, I wish some of the radio stations I listened to would give me a "recording countdown" and silence on either side of the song! -- Paul ---------------------- Paul Cumming paulc@ncf.ca From fanfare@globility.com Wed Jan 29 21:00:32 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 30 Jan 2003 05:00:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 43097 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 05:00:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 05:00:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.75) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 05:00:30 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.172] by n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Jan 2003 05:00:23 -0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 05:00:20 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: a *rational* discussion of WOR's IBOC signal Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3359 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Mr.M S " X-Originating-IP: 64.56.233.215 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "wortomray " wrote: > Marv: > > I will agree with your statements. However, as a broadcaster, how > would one go about letting the radio manufacturers know what we > need? There seems to be this big void between the stations and the > manufacturers, and bridging it would seem to benefit both. > > And your points are well taken. I was on the ground floor when AM > stereo came in in the early 1980's. I remember what a hoot it was to > put it on and make it work.....and how cool it was to hear it on my > car radio. (snip, snip) Thank you Tom for your unembellished candor. I think the biggest problem we have to face is the shear ignorance that is shown by those who perpetrate a new form of broadcast modulation on receiver manufacturers with the threat "If you don't get on board, you're gonna be left behind." And they do that not having one iota of proof that their system will succeed or be accepted by the public. In the meantime, specialty manufacturers, such as are we, experience an almost immediate drop in business because broadcasters and the listening public to whom we sell begin sitting on their wallets in anticipation of HD-Radio. Not only that. we're expected to fund our own R&D in bringing up a suitable receiver that will sell HD-radio. And, if it doesn't work, we're expected to eat what we have expended. That happened with FMX and it happened with AM Stereo. FMX caused the most suffering, although less to the broadcaster than the manufacturer because the upgrade was not that expensive. FMX had not been mandated and suffered only listener apathy. However, it took a year and a half for us to become profitable again. To answer your question about bridging the gap between broascaster and manufacturer, I for one, would be pleased to offer my services in establishing some honest, meaningful communication between us. However, Fanfare Electronics is but a small frog in a very big pond. I would suggest though that it also has to include those who wish to assume domain over broadcast band technology, which in this case is the iBiquity group. It is my impression from them that they supply the decoder and we supply the ring ... sorry, we supply the receiver with all the technical capabilities required to make their system work, no matter what the cost. But it must meet the market's cost expectations. Further, would it not be of value to address the subject of published specifications? Perhaps, the CAE, in concert with a panel of licensed engineering managers, could publish reasonable, minimum standards for receivers, much the same as were established for AMAX, This would encompass sensitivity, selectivity, noise floor, THD and frequency response. Easy-to-understand specifications would be published with each product. The CEA would decree that specifications be average, and not the best case. From that point on the manufacturer is on the honor system. However, the CEA could monitor performance complaints and intercede with the manufacturer if a blatent abuse is being perpetrated. Sorry if I ran over my allotted time. Thank you for listening. Let's keep up the dialog. Cheers, Marv > In light of Leonard Kahn's recent rumblings, I just hope IBOC doesn't > turn into that sequel, "AM 2 - The Wrath of Kahn". AMEN!! From rwagoner1@mac.com Wed Jan 29 21:47:45 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner1@mac.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 30 Jan 2003 05:47:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 68869 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 05:47:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 05:47:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO fed1mtao07.cox.net) (68.6.19.124) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 05:47:43 -0000 Received: from mac.com ([68.4.33.253]) by fed1mtao07.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20030130054741.SNMJ3373.fed1mtao07.cox.net@mac.com> for ; Thu, 30 Jan 2003 00:47:41 -0500 Message-ID: <3E38BC7F.8030702@mac.com> Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 21:47:43 -0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20021120 Netscape/7.01 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Leonard Kahn is my hero References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Richard Wagoner X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135738921 X-Yahoo-Profile: richardalanwagoner > p.s. Personally, I think the best way to describe Leonard Kahn is > that he's the Ralph Nader of the radio industry. :-) Ooh, that's harsh. Richard > From jsgil@hal-pc.org Wed Jan 29 23:35:03 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 30 Jan 2003 07:35:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 39890 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 07:35:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 07:35:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.75) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 07:35:02 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.132] by n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Jan 2003 07:35:02 -0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 07:35:01 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: a *rational* discussion of WOR's IBOC signal Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 355 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.153 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "wortomray " wrote: > > In light of Leonard Kahn's recent rumblings, I just hope IBOC doesn't > turn into that sequel, "AM 2 - The Wrath of Kahn". How fitting. I had actually used this phrase in a post here awhile back describing the AM Stereo wars. Boy, we sure are kind. ;-) JSG From jsgil@hal-pc.org Wed Jan 29 23:59:42 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 30 Jan 2003 07:59:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 66154 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 07:59:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 07:59:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.67) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 07:59:41 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.136] by n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Jan 2003 07:59:41 -0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 07:59:38 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Leonard Kahn is my hero Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <000301c2c760$c5ce1380$d3f9bed8@com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 676 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.153 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" wrote: > Engineer Leonard Kahn > petitions the FCC to halt the > rollout of iBiquity's HD Radio. > Kahn lists a menu of alleged > problems, including the > "huge costs" and "dramatic > increase in interference" in > AM signals, which he says > "may force many > independent rural stations > out of business." > > Kevin > Mesa, Arizona I'm interested in reading this and have searched the FCC website and is not under the 99-325 proceeding so either I don't know where to look or it is not there yet. Anyone who has more info on this petition and where to read it in full let us know. JSG From amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk Thu Jan 30 04:47:46 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 30 Jan 2003 12:47:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 47307 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 12:47:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 12:47:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 12:47:44 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.130] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Jan 2003 12:47:44 -0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 12:47:43 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Fwd: New file uploaded to amstereoforumeurope Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 808 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Dave " X-Originating-IP: 81.7.57.54 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113985069 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereofan --- In amstereoforumeurope@yahoogroups.com, amstereoforumeurope@yahoogroups.com wrote: Hello, This email message is a notification to let you know that a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the amstereoforumeurope group. File : /Radio Fax report on AM Stereo in the UK -1989.mp3 Uploaded by : amstereofan Description : SW station Radio Fax report on possible introduction of AM Stereo in the UK from 1989 ? You can access this file at the URL http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforumeurope/files/Radio%20Fax% 20%20report%20on%20%20AM%20Stereo%20in%20the%20UK%20-1989.mp3 To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/files Regards, amstereofan --- End forwarded message --- From amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk Thu Jan 30 04:57:43 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 30 Jan 2003 12:57:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 63220 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 12:57:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 12:57:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 12:57:42 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.129] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Jan 2003 12:57:42 -0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 12:57:42 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Any stations using Kahn ? Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 156 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Dave " X-Originating-IP: 81.7.57.54 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113985069 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereofan I presume not these days ? How many at the start ? amstereofan MOderator of the AM STereo Forum Europe http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforumeurope/ From mychucky@funport.net Thu Jan 30 06:39:15 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: mychucky@funport.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 30 Jan 2003 14:39:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 68768 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 14:39:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 14:39:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.funport.com) (216.199.19.6) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 14:39:07 -0000 Received: from FatMusic2000 ([]) by mail.funport.com (Merak 5.5.7) with SMTP id JFB36580 for ; Thu, 30 Jan 2003 09:39:09 -0500 Message-ID: <005201c2c86d$3cd92750$1400a8c0@FatMusic2000> To: References: <3E38BC7F.8030702@mac.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Leonard Kahn is my hero Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 09:38:21 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4920.2300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4920.2300 From: X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=85836819 X-Yahoo-Profile: mychucky1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I have spoken to him in the past, "CrackPot" comes to mind. ----- Original Message ----- From: Richard Wagoner To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, January 30, 2003 12:47 AM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Leonard Kahn is my hero > p.s. Personally, I think the best way to describe Leonard Kahn is > that he's the Ralph Nader of the radio industry. :-) Ooh, that's harsh. Richard > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ADVERTISEMENT Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From philipr@irac.pe.ca Thu Jan 30 07:50:26 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 30 Jan 2003 15:50:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 40889 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 15:50:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 15:50:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.87) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 15:50:21 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.181] by n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Jan 2003 15:50:21 -0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 15:50:17 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Stereo on AM - One person's viewpoints Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20030129215954.98917.qmail@web14208.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 5530 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking I like this "look outside the box" thinking. I'm looking forward to=20 Part III. Our real foe is apathy. I must say that when the tone=20 becomes more conciliatory, as it seems to have in the last 24 hours=20 or so, having both CQUAM and IBOC discussions makes this forum a=20 very interesting place. Brainstorming is always more productive=20 than brain bashing. I'm still very pro CQUAM, and IBOC suspicious,=20 but we're all learning and I'd love to buy an IBOC receiver, when=20 available at a reasonable price, because my curiosity has been=20 peaked and I'm first and formost a radio guy who believes that this=20 noisy, crowded [except here in Canada lol] band that we all seem to=20 love, has some real advantages. Let's keep the dialogue open folks. While IBOC at night may work for some allotments, it may not work=20 for others. Just as some stations have to switch patterns at night,=20 and/or reduce power, some stations may have to drop IBOC at night,=20 assuming IBOC is ultimately approved. While one station being able=20 to simultaneously broadcast in IBOC and CQUAM on the same frequency=20 seems impossible [but is anything truly impossible???] is it=20 possible that the same receiver could receive IBOC, yet when tuned=20 to a different frequency, receive CQUAM, based on what was=20 transmitted? In other words, a smart receiver which can switch=20 automatically between analogue QUAM and digital QUAM? Is it possible=20 that DSP technology could be used to help minimize some of the=20 inevitable yet legal IBOC "hash", thus making IBOC more=20 compatiable? Is it possible to design receivers that will better=20 handle complex combinations of frequencies so that receiver=20 generated interference becomes a thing of the past? Compatiability=20 is very important - if IBOC has minimal negative effects, and=20 substantial perceived positive ones, maybe it will succeed. Too=20 many negative effects, and listeners will be permanently driven from=20 the AM band. Positive effects, both in sound quality and our good=20 friend quality programming, will draw people to the band. Just some ramblings from a land where AM stations keep "flipping"=20 [the CRTC's word] to FM. Sometimes, its a good thing, othertimes,=20 its not. Phil R. having --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John P."=20 wrote: > AM and Stereo =96 the big picture. Reader's Digest Condensed Book=20 Version. >=20 > PART ONE: Technical: > Let me first state that I am very happy that IBOC/HD Radio was=20 initially > designed with working towards being compatible with existing=20 analog AM > broadcast band receivers, rather than scrap all existing=20 (literally) > half-billion AM receivers. I sincerely hope that Tom Ray's work=20 at WOR will > help iBiquity to try out many different ways of transmitting=20 stereo audio over > great distances with compatibility to existing equipment. I hope=20 that they're > open to using their new hardware with a different setup as well. >=20 > Also let me state that it's my opinion that Motorola C-Quam AM=20 Stereo sounds > great on a decent stereo AM receiver, especially those with the=20 2nd and 3rd > generation chips which reduce the so-called `platform motion' and=20 have the > gradual fade to mono. Receivers/tuners that come to mind in this=20 category > include the Chrysler 5-band-EQ radio of the 90's, the Delco/GM `UX- 1' (and > variants) with the `AM/ST' pushbutton, the Sony SRF-A100/SRF-A1,=20 and last and > surely not least, the current production Fanfare FTA-100P monitor. >=20 > It's also my opinion that wideband mono AM sounds great on a GE=20 SuperRadio with > a station transmitting decent (not overcompressed) wideband=20 audio. We're > talking the AMAX standard here (analog audio out to 7.5KHz with=20 noise blanker > technology).=20 >=20 > My goal is for a system that can incorporate the best of all 3=20 worlds listed > above. How to do it is yet to be determined and tested. It is my=20 opinion that > a hybrid combination of all 3 would be great, and I have an idea=20 to that effect > (if iBiquity is interested =96 hint, hint.)=20=20 >=20 > Please note that this requires work on both the broadcast end, and=20 on the > receiver manufacturing end to put out a quality product. I agree=20 with Marv S: > the broadcasters and receiver manufacturers have to promote each=20 other and care > about the quality of both as well. >=20 > PART TWO: Content: > As someone had said before, "it's the programming stupid"; this=20 may or may not > be related to success of the AM band, BUT it does appear that "If=20 you play it, > they will come" does work on the AM broadcast band. Specialty=20 music formats > will get people to find that tiny "AM" pushbutton again.=20 Classic=20 country, 60s > & 70s music, even Radio Disney gets people to tune-in to AM=20 again. Obviously, > music is the best beneficiary of Stereo AM, although the=20 commercial spots on > ANY format station sound better in stereo. A `balance' and MIX of=20 MUSIC and > News/Talk is probably the best plan for the band, but no matter=20 how well the > programming quality, it still falls back to PART ONE to have BOTH=20 broadcasters > AND receiver manufacturers put out a quality product. >=20 > Let's hope that everybody can put their heads together to figure=20 out the best > way to make a backwards compatible quality STEREO AM broadcasting=20 and receiving > system.=20=20 >=20 > PART THREE: SUGGESTION OF THE DAY: The HD-QUAM SYSTEM. >=20 >=20 > __________________________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. > http://mailplus.yahoo.com From michaelj@vcn.com Thu Jan 30 08:10:12 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 30 Jan 2003 16:10:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 59974 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 16:10:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 16:10:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m2-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.32) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 16:10:08 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m2-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Thu, 30 Jan 2003 09:10:08 -0700 Message-ID: <002e01c2c87a$0d9f3c60$0701010a@keva> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: a *rational* discussion of WOR's IBOC signal Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 09:10:04 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit LOL!!! I love it! I guess I'm just a punny guy! :) MJR n WYO ----- Original Message ----- From: wortomray To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, January 29, 2003 8:18 PM Subject: {AMSF} Re: a *rational* discussion of WOR's IBOC signal In light of Leonard Kahn's recent rumblings, I just hope IBOC doesn't turn into that sequel, "AM 2 - The Wrath of Kahn". [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From krichards@wor710.com Thu Jan 30 08:39:09 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 29939 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 16:39:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 16:39:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.90) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 16:39:08 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: krichards@wor710.com Received: from [66.218.67.172] by n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Jan 2003 16:39:08 -0000 X-Sender: krichards@wor710.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 30 Jan 2003 16:37:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 96462 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 16:37:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 16:37:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 16:37:05 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.158] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Jan 2003 16:36:54 -0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 16:36:53 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Any stations using Kahn ? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 4261 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kerry Richards " X-Originating-IP: 151.202.102.16 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=136545831 X-Yahoo-Profile: kerryrichards710 X-eGroups-Approved-By: kevtronics via web; 30 Jan 2003 16:39:08 -0000 The Kahn AM Stereo system is not legal anymore since the FCC has set C-Quam as the format for analog AM Stereo. But, Leonard's system can be used in the "Powerside" mode, which has been quite succesful with some stations. We have one at WOR, and it is for sale if anyone is interested. It is hard to say if "Powerside" operation works or not since it is so subjective, and today most radios are digital "tuning wise", where the Powerside really performed well was on a sliding tuner, where you tuned until it sounded best. When installing "Powerside" you can pick which sideband you want to push your signal into, and go from there. It is an adaptable situation depending where you need help, like if you have an interference problem on one sideband or the other. The Powerside is an outcome of lots of testing by Leonard Kahn as far back as the sixties. He did a lot of testing on WPAT, also at KDKA, his stereo system was a direct outcome of this early research. The idea is to push as much energy as possible into one sideband, helping the signal from the transmitter to the radio. Last I heard, WWRL has one on air. I'm sure there are lots of others. It is hard to tell but I think WWRL sounded better in C-Quam, with their new DX-25 transmitter and new widebanded antenna. Seems kind of foolish to have Tom Jones repair your array and get it perfectly symetrical, then put Leonards box on air and push everything into one sideband. But they will easily be ready for IBOC. Part of the problem for WWRL is some NJ Turnpike TIS station running at 1610khz, how that got through the FCC is hard to understand. There are many experts out there who have said that the Kahn AM Stereo system was far superior to C-Quam in that it behaved better and sounded better. One of the cute things about independent sideband operation was that Leonard used to take two standard AM radios and slightly tune one a little higher and the other a little lower and PRESTO!! you had stereo. (It really worked!) Several places including WFIL and WNBC ran the Kahn system for many years until the FCC shut it off, but that is another story. I can still vividly remember walking into studio 2A at WNBC, they were playing "California Dreamin'" by the Mama's and Papa's, the result on the air monitor was startling. It sounded great! Remember, in those days there was no NRSC curve so you could go out as far as you wanted, at WNBC it was like FM. Some said it sounded better than FM, especially in Queens and anywhere near the WNBC transmitter on City Island. One thing about Leonards stuff is that it is big! I'm talking a whole rack for the early stuff, AM Stereo Exciter STR-66. The new stuff is a half a rack....Not as easy as C-Quam either to install. None of the AM Stereo systems were easy to get to work, usually due to sideband issues in the antenna, or in the case of C-Quam trying to eliminate or supress the IPM components. We did not have all the tools then (Mid 80's) that we have now, so it was a lot harder to get to work, particularly on an older array. Most non-directional stations usually had no trouble. Nor did we have modern "state of the art" transmitters like today. Unfortunately for Leonard his "persona" is not as brilliant as some of his inventions. He has made so many enemies in this business from all the lawsuits he filed trying to get his stereo system approved. I particularly remember an episode where Herb Squire of WQXR fame really went to bat for him. Herb demonstrated in an FCC hearing that an old radio from the thirties actually sounded better than an modern AM Radio, and that the Kahn system had less platform shift than C- Quam on Stereo AM radios. It is not surprising that Leonard may be filing a suit against IBOC. This may be just a crazy rumor because we have not seen any procedings anywhere yet. Leonard has never won any of his actions before the FCC. Today he markets an interesting box "Symetra-Peak", it has been modernized and reduced in size from the older units. Another idea from Leonard that makes some sense, but again is subjective in nature and kind of a hard sell to most broadcasters. Kerry Richards Chief Engineer WOR-AM Buckley Broadcasting Corporation From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Jan 30 08:55:00 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 30 Jan 2003 16:54:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 73791 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 16:54:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 16:54:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.64) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 16:54:57 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.190] by n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Jan 2003 16:54:55 -0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 16:54:53 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Any stations using Kahn ? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2143 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > The Kahn AM Stereo system is not legal anymore since the FCC has set > C-Quam as the format for analog AM Stereo. Depending on how you interpret the FCC rules, you can say it is legal to transmit using any AM Stereo system you want, under the condition that if you're going to broadcast true Stereo audio, it has to be using the C-Quam system. In order words, you could install a Kahn, Harris, or Magnavox stereo exciter, and even have the appropriate pilot tone turned on, as long as you only use it to broadcast mono audio. This is how Kahn PowerSide is allowed, since it is a mono use of a Stereo system. Some PowerSide stations even transmit the 15 kHz Kahn AM Stereo pilot tone, even though it has no functional use for the PowerSide mode. > Last I heard, WWRL has one on air. I'm sure there are lots of > others. In NYC, 1280 WADO and 1600 WWRL are using PowerSide. In Philly, 610 WIP uses it. There are others throughout the country, but not nearly as many as there are (C-Quam) AM Stereo stations. > It is hard to tell but I think WWRL sounded better in C-Quam, with > their new DX-25 transmitter and new widebanded antenna. Seems kind > of foolish to have Tom Jones repair your array and get it perfectly > symetrical, then put Leonards box on air and push everything into > one sideband. 1600 WWRL did sound excellent with their NRSC filter disabled; I measured audio response from them up to at least 18 kHz. It was a great example of just how good analog AM Stereo can sound. > But they will easily be ready for IBOC. Part of the problem for > WWRL is some NJ Turnpike TIS station running at 1610khz, how that > got through the FCC is hard to understand. There is another TIS on 1610 in Watchung, NJ, which is technically in one of their many nulls, but WWRL clobbers them anyway, since they have the PowerSide set to use the *upper* sideband. Part of why WWRL may be using PowerSide is that especially at night, their directional signal has so many nulls, it looks like the petals of a flower: http://www.radio-locator.com/pats/WWRL_AM_LN.gif From philipr@irac.pe.ca Thu Jan 30 09:12:48 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 30 Jan 2003 17:12:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 69933 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 17:12:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 17:12:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 17:12:44 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.179] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Jan 2003 17:12:44 -0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 17:12:43 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Any stations using Kahn ? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1175 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote in part: ... > Part of why WWRL may be using PowerSide is that especially at night, > their directional signal has so many nulls, it looks like the petals > of a flower: > > > > > http://www.radio-locator.com/pats/WWRL_AM_LN.gif Quite the pattern, sort of reminds me of Seasame Street - Big Bird's head and beak! lol On a more serious note, weird patterns create quite the "challenge" especially when there is a good nearby market you'd like to serve, and the public expects you to serve, smack dab in the middle of a null. I remember when I was in Fredricton New Brunswick in the early 90s - 1260 CIHI's NIF contour [10 kw, omni by day, 3 tower peanut shaped pattern by night] didn't quite reach the Regent Mall at night - I remember hearing the blasting and fading on my car radio in the parking lot. Some pretty heavy compression limiting too! The solution Radio One sought, and got, from the CRTC was a couple strategically placed 50 watt FM transmitters - I understand this setup is still in place now that CIHI has been re-call-lettered CKHJ. Phil R. From michaelj@vcn.com Thu Jan 30 09:13:34 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 30 Jan 2003 17:13:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 42278 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 17:13:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 17:13:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m2-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.32) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 17:13:33 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m2-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Thu, 30 Jan 2003 10:13:32 -0700 Message-ID: <007901c2c882$e964db80$0701010a@keva> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Any stations using Kahn ? Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 10:13:29 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Interesting to note, and I know it's been mentioned here on this list before, but if you have a forced-stereo radio with the multi-sync decoder (such as the Sony SRF-A100 or its companion SRF-A1 walkman) you can flip it into Kahn mode and tell who and if someone is using powerside because you can hear the signal much louder on one channel than the other. I found this out about 6 months ago when I acquired an SRF-A1 walkman. KRVN 880 Lexington, Nebraska booms in here at night. I had always heard they use powerside, and now I know they do. On that walkman when I flip it into the Kahn setting, there it is.....most of their energy on the right side. Neat :) I had always heard about the 2-radio thing with Kahn's system. As a matter of fact, in our FTP site with all of the AM Stereo air checks.....there is actually file or two from a station (in Ohio? Maybe Indiana??) that was recorded the day they went stereo in Kahn mode. Announcer talking all about how they were now stereo and that you didn't need to buy a new radio to hear it.....just to take 2 radios...tune one a little to the left, and the other a little to the right if you wanted to hear it! Another neat air check that's priceless. Wish I could remember exactly which one it is. I think Kevin T probably can point us to it. One more Kahn note.....I remember some discussions here that there are still a few stations out there transmitting in Kahn stereo. Allegedly, their engineers were so dead-set against the Motorola system and major supporters of the Kahn system, that they're still transmitting in Kahn ISB stereo. I believe that right now, legally, you CAN....you just can't transmit the pilot tone. Is this correct?? Just in case I will DX and dial around with my SRF-A1 in Kahn mode from time to time just to check around. The people on this list who know about it refuse to release the names or calls of the stations because of fear that it would get the engineers and/or stations in trouble. "You'll just have to find them yourself" they say :) I know KSL in Salt Lake City was a major supporter of Kahn. I think it's been a while since the engineer pulled the Kahn exciter out, though. I listen all the time and don't hear any kind of separation on spots, liners, bumper music...whatever. I remember our engineer here used to always tell me that he had a Kahn receiver and if ya listened on Sundays you could hear the Mormon Tabernacle Choir in stereo. Anyways.....more AM Stereo nostalgia. Meanwhile I'll keep enjoying the C-Quam here at KEVA. I also will be posting some more air checks soon. It's been a little while. These will probably be made right off of the Motorola C-Quam modulation monitor. Michael n Wyo Michael J. Richard KEVA AM Stereo 1240 Evanston, Wyoming ----- Original Message ----- From: Kerry Richards To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, January 30, 2003 9:36 AM Subject: {AMSF} Re: Any stations using Kahn ? The Kahn AM Stereo system is not legal anymore since the FCC has set C-Quam as the format for analog AM Stereo. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From amfmdx@fastq.com Thu Jan 30 09:46:09 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 30 Jan 2003 17:46:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 12968 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 17:46:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 17:46:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 17:46:08 -0000 Received: from fastq (d211-osel-phx.fastq.com [207.173.146.72]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id h0UHk7U74561 for ; Thu, 30 Jan 2003 10:46:08 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <012601c2c887$5fdaa520$4892adcf@com> To: Subject: The Wrath of Kahn Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 10:45:25 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > I'm interested in reading this and have searched the FCC website > and is not under the 99-325 proceeding so either I don't know where > to look or it is not there yet. Anyone who has more info on this > petition and where to read it in full let us know. I got the story I sent off Radio World I think. Its not under 99-325 but it is supposed to be a seperate petition. I hope he does sue the crap out of them and gives them hell on earth at Ibiquity. Digital needs to be on E147. Kevin "Its going to get a lot worse before it gets worse" - Lily Tomlin From tomray@wor710.com Thu Jan 30 09:48:04 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 67329 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 17:48:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 17:48:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.90) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 17:48:03 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: tomray@wor710.com Received: from [66.218.67.153] by n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Jan 2003 17:48:03 -0000 X-Sender: tomray@wor710.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 30 Jan 2003 17:45:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 15456 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 17:45:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 17:45:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.75) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 17:45:22 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.172] by n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Jan 2003 17:45:19 -0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 17:45:19 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Question To Tom Ray Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3413 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wortomray " X-Originating-IP: 151.202.102.16 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=136489311 X-Yahoo-Profile: wortomray X-eGroups-Approved-By: kevtronics via web; 30 Jan 2003 17:48:00 -0000 > > If you had compared WOR's 5 kHz analog audio to that of a > conventional analog AM station using ~10 kHz audio response -- and > received on a radio that can reproduce this full bandwidth -- then > the improvement of IBOC's digital audio would not be so noticeable, > and it may even appear to be less crisp, clear, and "hi-fi" than the > same regular analog AM (mono OR Stereo) that stations have been using > for decades, due to the "artifacts" and inherent limitations of the > digitally-compressed IBOC/"HD" audio. Well, we compared it to our direct competition, WABC, and to WCBS and WINS during commercial breaks with music. The HD was still an extremely noticeable improvement. And it was crisper, cleaner, and had all the high frequency content than the analog stations.....and the background noise that was present in our conference room from the light dimmers and the computers in the business office on the other side of the wall was gone in HD mode. The artifacts you have heard in our audio samples were recorded with a bad test radio. This version of HD software does not exhibit those artifacts, except with stereo material present where the artifacts are minimal. The next version has no artifacts. > WTTM 1680 AM Stereo in Princeton, NJ often does this with their talk > shows. The main host and callers are in the center of the audio > image, while guests in the studio come through exclusively in the > left or right channel. In Stereo, this provides a very attention- > getting sound, and mono listeners don't notice any difference because > C-Quam's matrix processing automatically makes up for the difference > in levels. But there is an issue with putting someone exclusively left or right. While the matrix processing will make up for the difference in the mono channel, the mix is still off, and if the host interrups the callers, he will immediately override the caller in mono, as the mono matrix has only 50% of the energy of the caller (L only, for instance)and 100% of the host (full L+R). I prefer to offset only 10 dB or so to give the offset people a fighting chance with the mono matrix mix. > > My question regarding this radio would be how it sounds in *analog* > mode, particularly when tuned to non-IBOC stations. I presume that > in order to prevent background hiss when it is tuned to an IBOC > station but is not yet decoding the digital signal, the tuner > probably employs a strict 5 kHz audio cut-off -- thus restricting > even conventional analog AM stations to this same low-fidelity sound. > > Likewise, I would presume that the automatically variable bandwidth > (depending on signal strength) and AM Stereo features are also no > longer included in these new Visteon radios Actually, this radio sounds really good on conventional AM stations. It does have the auto bandwidth variation, and it opens wide enough to start picking up hiss from the IBOC sidebands before it blends, so it is hearing out to 5-6kHz at least. It narrows enough so I can listen to it at home....I'm 50 miles away and in WOR's major null, so being able to hear the station above the noise of the Explorer's fuel pump is interesting. It may even have AM Stereo active, though I really don't have anything to light it this close to the city, as I've seen the ST indicator come on when it locks on a station. From n0uiheric@aol.com Thu Jan 30 10:09:22 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 30 Jan 2003 18:09:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 80800 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 18:09:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 18:09:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d02.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.34) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 18:09:20 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-d02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.21.2aee1a10 (4459) for ; Thu, 30 Jan 2003 13:09:11 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <21.2aee1a10.2b6ac447@aol.com> Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 13:09:11 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} The truth shall set you free To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih Another example is in Louisville, where ex-AM Stereo station WHAS 840 and WHAS-TV 11 aren't even connected. WHAS is owned by Cheap Channel, while the A.H. Belo Company, known for spending TONS of money on their TV stations, owns WHAS-TV. Belo spent tons of money upgrading their St. Louis station, KMOV Channel 4. They were the last network affiliate in the market to go Stereo; but they spent more on building an emergency studio at their transmitter site, improved graphics, a new set for it's newscasts, and even it's second DTV channel. Belo should have bought WHAS (AM) and KMOX (AM) and dumped tons of money into those stations. Until 2001, the same situation happened in Chicago with Group W (and later, CBS and Infinity Broadcasting) owning ex-Stereo station WMAQ 670 (now WSCR) and NBC owning WMAQ-TV Channel 5. Another situation involved the WFUN calls. WFUN and WFUN-FM weren't even connected. WFUN 970 in Ashtabula, OH still, last I heard, had local ownership, while WFUN-FM 95.5 in Bethalto, IL was originally adopted by Bethalto Broadcasting Company (later Coltre Broadcasting Company) for a Pre-Teen format. At one time, the not-for-profit Parents for Kids' Radio LMAed the station from the company, owned by the Howe family of East Alton, IL. Today, WFUN-FM is owned by Radio One, and although they call themselves "Q 95-5", they have kept the calls (rather than, say, ask Jefferson Pilot for permission to use the WQXI-FM calls). Some calls are reserved, however; when Gannett Radio Division sold KUSA 550 (then broadcasting in AM Stereo) to American Radio Systems in 1993, the station had to drop the KUSA calls because the calls were reserved by Gannett for it's Denver TV station (the area's ABC-TV affiliate). The station had to return to their former call sign, KSD. The KSD calls are, unfortunately, reserved by Clear Channel for one of it's five FM stations; the 550 outlet became KTRS in 1998 (the only way these calls could return to 550 is if Dorsey bought the FM with the historic calls, at 93.7 on the dial). The same thing happened in Tampa with the WUSA calls; those calls are reserved by Gannett for their Washington, DC TV station (the local CBS-TV affiliate). Unfortunately, Clear Channel also owns the former WUSA-FM. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Thu Jan 30 10:09:24 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 30 Jan 2003 18:09:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 54327 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 18:09:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 18:09:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m04.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.7) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 18:09:24 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-m04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.184.160f2ff8 (4459) for ; Thu, 30 Jan 2003 13:09:08 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <184.160f2ff8.2b6ac443@aol.com> Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 13:09:07 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: CKLW the big 8? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih I'd think CKLW would be better off as an Oldies station, with so many FM Oldies stations dropping '50s tunes (especially those in the United States). But, I think Windsor management should fire the anti-AM Stereo engineers, and replace them with a pro-AM Stereo engineer. BTW, Karen Carroll is out as GM at ex-AM Stereo station KMOX; whoever takes over will have A LOT of work to do. The station would need a pro-AM Stereo GM, or at least someone who's willing to turn on the Stereo during "I Love Jazz", like sister station WPHT does with Sinatra. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From fanfare@globility.com Thu Jan 30 10:34:01 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 30 Jan 2003 18:34:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 19496 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 18:34:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 18:34:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 18:33:59 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.154] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Jan 2003 18:33:55 -0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 18:33:53 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: The Wrath of Kahn Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <012601c2c887$5fdaa520$4892adcf@com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 522 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Mr.M S " X-Originating-IP: 64.56.234.46 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" wrote: > > I'm interested in reading this and have searched the FCC website > > and is not under the 99-325 proceeding so either I don't know where > > to look or it is not there yet. Anyone who has more info on this > > petition and where to read it in full let us know. > > I got the story I sent off Radio World I think. Kevin: Take a look at; http://www.rwonline.com/dailynews/one.php?id=2547 That's what I think you're looking for. M. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Jan 30 10:34:23 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 30 Jan 2003 18:34:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 87447 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 18:34:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 18:34:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 18:34:22 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.183] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Jan 2003 18:34:22 -0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 18:34:22 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Question To Tom Ray Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3069 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > The artifacts you have heard in our audio samples were recorded with > a bad test radio. This version of HD software does not exhibit > those artifacts, except with stereo material present where the > artifacts are minimal. The next version has no artifacts. The AM IBOC sample on iBiquity's own web site sounds pretty much the same as the "bad" WOR samples, except it's in Stereo. All the samples of AM IBOC digital audio I've encountered so far have a surprisingly large drop-off of response just above 4 kHz (at least 6 dB!) and then another significant drop-off starting at around 8 to 9 kHz. Above about 12 kHz, AM IBOC's digital audio has little to no useful response, even though it technically does extend to 15 kHz. In comparison, a full-bandwidth analog AM signal will have flat response up to at least 9.5 kHz (using an Optimod's internal filter), with some stations pushing it right up to the 10.2 kHz limit. With careful use of pre-emphasis, this can and does give a crisper, brighter sound than what I've heard from AM IBOC so far. Of course, this "new" version of IBOC/"HD" may be a an improvement, but I'm just going by all the audio samples that have been made available by WOR and iBiquity so far. > It narrows enough so I can listen to it at home....I'm 50 miles away > and in WOR's major null, so being able to hear the station above the > noise of the Explorer's fuel pump is interesting. I had a chance to use the standard AM/FM/single-CD Visteon radio in a 2002 Explorer, and while it didn't have the CD-6's fancy hi-fi AM Stereo tuner, it did have a respectable amount of high end to the sound (maybe 6-7 kHz response) and there was no vehicle-generated RFI (alternator whine, spark plug buzzing, etc.) that I could hear, even on blank AM channels. > It may even have AM Stereo active, though I really don't have > anything to light it this close to the city, as I've seen the ST > indicator come on when it locks on a station. The Visteon may not be so sensitive, but I have received 1210 WPHT from Philly in AM Stereo during the daytime as far away as the Bridgeport, CT area. Other AM Stereo stations that may be receivable in the NYC area during the daytime include: 600 WICC Bridgeport, CT 850 WREF Ridgefield, CT 930 WPAT Paterson, NJ 1430 WNSW Newark, NJ 1450 WCTC New Brunswick, NJ 1490 WGCH Greenwich, CT 1660 WWRU Jersey City, NJ 1680 WTTM Princeton, NJ Common nighttime AM Stereo DX includes 720 WGN/Chicago, 760 WJR/ Detroit, 790 CIGM/Sudbury, ON, 890 WLS/Chicago, 1210 WPHT/Philly, 1680 WTTM/Princeton, NJ and/or 1680 WJNZ/Ada, MI, 1690 WPTX/Lexington Park, MD, and 1700 WEUP/Huntsville, AL -- although obviously some of these will require good selectivity to separate them from adjacent- channel NYC stations. p.s. Does it also have RDS on FM? That's another system that IBOC may make obsolete, but is still widely used amongst analog stations. In Europe, RDS is so common that even the *pirate* stations transmit it. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Jan 30 10:41:41 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 30 Jan 2003 18:41:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 33038 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 18:41:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 18:41:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 18:41:40 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.171] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Jan 2003 18:41:40 -0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 18:41:38 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: CKLW the big 8? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <184.160f2ff8.2b6ac443@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1011 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > BTW, Karen Carroll is out as GM at ex-AM Stereo station KMOX; > whoever takes over will have A LOT of work to do. 1120 KMOX was the last station on which I personally heard a baseball game broadcast with full Stereo sound. Just like on TV, the stadium ambience is amazing to listen to in Stereo, although it's rare even on FM stations because of the extra cost of running a second audio line (or for the extra bandwidth necessary for a digital stereo link; many sporting event feeds on the radio sound like single-ISDN, with better than telephone quality but with noticeable digital artifacts). > The station would need a pro-AM Stereo GM, or at least someone who's > willing to turn on the Stereo during "I Love Jazz", like sister > station WPHT does with Sinatra. 1210 WPHT is in AM Stereo all the time, even during talk programming, and lately they've started using more true Stereo sound in their liners, commercials, and bumper music than I've ever heard from them before. From tomray@wor710.com Thu Jan 30 11:02:37 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 94795 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 19:02:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 19:02:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 19:02:34 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: tomray@wor710.com Received: from [66.218.67.165] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Jan 2003 19:02:29 -0000 X-Sender: tomray@wor710.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 30 Jan 2003 17:54:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 31034 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 17:54:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 17:54:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 17:54:57 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.184] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Jan 2003 17:54:56 -0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 17:54:55 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: The Wrath of Kahn Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <012601c2c887$5fdaa520$4892adcf@com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1403 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wortomray " X-Originating-IP: 151.202.102.16 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=136489311 X-Yahoo-Profile: wortomray X-eGroups-Approved-By: kevtronics via web; 30 Jan 2003 19:02:29 -0000 On what grounds would he sue iBiquity? My uderstanding of the filing is that he is objecting to the costs involved. Very frankly, some of those costs would go into shaping up some AM antenna systems that should have been gone through a long time ago, and can only help out the AM band. And if he needs to sue someone, it would be the FCC (good luck) if they mandate IBOC. Regarding E147, if that were to operate on L band as it does in other countries, it would take 75 transmitter locations alone to cover Manhattan (this information came to me through Harris, as they have studies on this). Want to talk costs involved in putting in a new service? Can you imagine the nightmare this would cause? --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" wrote: > > I'm interested in reading this and have searched the FCC website > > and is not under the 99-325 proceeding so either I don't know where > > to look or it is not there yet. Anyone who has more info on this > > petition and where to read it in full let us know. > > I got the story I sent off Radio World I think. > > Its not under 99-325 but it is supposed to be a seperate petition. > > I hope he does sue the crap out of them and gives them hell on earth at > Ibiquity. Digital needs to be on E147. > > Kevin > > > > "Its going to get a lot worse before it > gets worse" - Lily Tomlin From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Thu Jan 30 11:16:10 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 30 Jan 2003 19:16:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 56334 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 19:15:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 19:15:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14208.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.173.72) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 19:15:53 -0000 Message-ID: <20030130191553.58733.qmail@web14208.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.45.202.244] by web14208.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 30 Jan 2003 11:15:53 PST Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 11:15:53 -0800 (PST) Subject: Part III "HD-QUAM" To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: John Pavlica X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio PART THREE: SUGGESTION OF THE DAY: The HD-QUAM SYSTEM. You heard it here first, the Pavlica HD-Quam AM Stereo Broadcasting System: Main emphasis to maintain compatibility with existing receivers, the ability to add data, and the ability to use a ‘portion’ of iBiquity’s technology and hardware. FOUR MAIN COMPONENETS OF THE “HD-Quam AMS” System: 1) Pilot Tones/Data 2) C-Quam AMAX (modified) 3) iBiquity digital enhancement (modified) 4) Omega Technology. 1) PILOT TONES / DATA: A) Maintains the existing 25Hz C-Quam stereo pilot tone. (Lights STEREO AM light). B) Adds a 15 Hz Pilot which indicates ‘digital enhancement available’. If no 15Hz pilot is present, then analog audio is real-time (for ballgames etc). With 15 Hz pilot, the consumer is able to switch select to keep reception all analog for real-time reception, or switch to HD for digital ENHANCEMENT (more on this in Item 3). When active, it also inserts a 7.5KHz brickwall filter (more later). (Lights HD STEREO AM light). C) Adds a 10 Hz low speed data. This ASCII will be modulated to provide only the station’s 3 or 4 digit call-letters, PLUS stations can transmit “WX WARN” for weather warnings, and “AMBER” for Amber Alerts, followed by the ‘Tune to xxxxx” frequency. (Lights “Amber LED” or RED LED for WX). 2) C-QUAM AMAX: Stations NOT transmitting “HD Enhancement” will remain unchanged. Those with “HD Enhancement” (15Hz pilot present AND 25Hz pilot present) will be similar to the present Motorola C-Quam but with a few changes. Stereo audio will be transmitted over the audio frequency range of only 30Hz to 7.5KHz, and then an AUDIO ‘brickwall’ filter kicks in between 7.5KHz and 8KHz. See Item 3 for the ‘rest of the audio’. 3) iBiquity DIGITAL ENHANCEMENT: In my opinion, iBiquity is trying to take ‘too big of a bite’ of the audio to be digitized. I suggest that they have an algorithm to reproduce ONLY the human hearing audio required between 5KHz and 12KHz. A VERY LOW power sidecar will extend either side of the AM Carrier between only 8KHz and 12KHz. By starting at 8KHz, analog audio can extend safely out to 7.5KHz to maintain AMAX reception. This 4KHz of bandwidth on each side should be able to provide a higher bit rate for the reduced requirements to reproduce ONLY human hearing audio between 5KHz and 12KHz. This HD “Digital Enhanced” audio is then MIXED with the (delayed) ANALOG audio which provides the 30Hz to 7.5KHz audio portion. There is purposely an overlap between 5KHz and 7500Hz, and an ‘equalizer’ control to adjust it for personal preference. With HD-CQUAM, the frequency response is theoretically 30Hz – 12KHz. 4) OMEGA Technology: Omega technology (from Fanfare Electronics) will be specified for use with the HD-QUAM system to provide noise blanking, mobile AM reception while driving through underpasses, and provide variable I.F. bandwidth for Analog-only mode. Mobile diversity reception (with 2 antennas) would also be an option. There you go iBiquity, a plan to maybe keep everybody happy. A mix of analog and digital is probably as good as it can get on the USA MW AM broadcast band. The above is Copyright © 2003 John Pavlica, Jr. __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From krichards@wor710.com Thu Jan 30 11:22:14 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 89158 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 19:22:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 19:22:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 19:22:12 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: krichards@wor710.com Received: from [66.218.66.140] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Jan 2003 19:22:11 -0000 X-Sender: krichards@wor710.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 30 Jan 2003 19:13:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 8001 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 19:13:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 19:13:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 19:13:23 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.182] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Jan 2003 19:13:23 -0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 19:13:22 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Question To Tom Ray/IBOC RADIO Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3126 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kerry Richards " X-Originating-IP: 151.202.102.16 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=136545831 X-Yahoo-Profile: kerryrichards710 X-eGroups-Approved-By: kevtronics via web; 30 Jan 2003 19:22:07 -0000 I just wanted to add that when we demoed the Visteon HD Radio at the recent WOR Transmitter tour, we had the radio sitting on the tool bench in a very noisy environment. We had just received the radio hours earler, and did not have the time to really do anything with it. Now, days later we have taken the radio out into the real world and find it is an amazing radio.The test unit we have is the actual Visteon HD production radio in a metal box with a handle and two "typical HI-FI" car speakers in it. We use a Radio Shack 12 volt DC supply when not in a vehicle to drive the unit since it has a "cigarette lighter" plug on the power cord. The antenna input is a BNC jack on the back, and we have put a small "whip" with adapter into this jack. Basically nothin' fancy. On a normal AM station this radio uses signal strength to open up the bandwidth. So listening to WINS or WCBS they sound pretty good. I'd say at least to 6khz or so. Pretty funny like this coming from Ibiquity with their 5khz brick wall. Then when you tune to WOR-HD, the first thing you hear is the analog audio. Since we have the analog processing set with the "balls to the walls" the signal is pretty loud, then about 8 seconds later the radio blends to the digital stream. The actual mix is very seamless and you think someone took a carpet off the speakers since the High end suddenly comes on. It is quite a surprise and improvement cause you do not know when exactly it is going to happen and it sounds remarkably better. After that there seems to be a 10 second period where the audio looses its little bit of grittiness, then calms down and delivers a clean stream. Very FM like, no stereo yet here at WOR. The radio displays in large lettering "ANALOG" when in analog, and "DIGITAL" once the HD stream is aquired. Our digital stream through the Orban 6200 is processed much less, and is very gentle so it is really clean. There are a few minor artifacts left though, and I'm sure Ibiquity's next software load will correct those.(Any day now.) We have not tested the stereo through this radio yet. We can't wait to do this though, maybe this weekend. What amazes me is that with about 1500 watts of digital carriers, we can deliver a clean FM like signal into a Midtown office building, where the analog ain't that great. It really works. Especially on the musical commercials. We have found out from other engineers that the word has come down, and several more major AM's here in NYC will be turning on HD this spring. (Including our competitors.) This Visteon HD radio is able to adapt to the new software loads unlike the laboratory test radios we previously had. Somebody else may beat us to AM Stereo IBOC here in NYC though, because our studio refurb is still underway. We are converting all of our call in lines to ISDN next week, which will give our talk programming an even cleaner sound. Thank you Telos! We are already using this system on one of our network shows and the difference is quite noticible. Kerry Richards Chief Engineer WOR-AM Buckley Broadcasting Corporation From mark_608@hotmail.com Thu Jan 30 11:35:25 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: mark_608@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 30 Jan 2003 19:35:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 97254 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 19:35:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 19:35:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.17.5) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 19:35:23 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 30 Jan 2003 11:33:27 -0800 Received: from 136.1.1.33 by lw11fd.law11.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Thu, 30 Jan 2003 19:33:26 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Off to Detroit, Windsor Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 14:33:26 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 30 Jan 2003 19:33:27.0043 (UTC) FILETIME=[76042D30:01C2C896] From: "Mark Sundquist" X-Originating-IP: [136.1.1.33] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=3850332 X-Yahoo-Profile: mark_608 I live in Sterling Heights,MI which is right near Troy! You will definitely want to listen to 630 CFCO out of Chatham,ON. They play a nice blend of 60's-80's music and are a great example of a full service radio station...I wish there were more like them! There is also a local religious station on 1340 that has AM$, but I don't really listen to them.(can't remember the calls...WEXL maybe?) 1070 out of Sarnia,ON has an on-again, off-again pilot, but I have not gotten any separation when the pilot is on. By far the most listenable besides WJR will be CFCO. Mark Sterling Heights,MI >From: "Juan / John Gualda" >Reply-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com >To: , >Subject: {AMSF} Off to Detroit, Windsor >Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 22:00:20 -0500 > >My brother is getting married this weekend in Troy, MI. So I am off to the >wedding. What is the AM Stereo situation up there besides WJR ? Is there >some good AM radio to listen for ? > >Juan > > > >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > _________________________________________________________________ The new MSN 8: smart spam protection and 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail From jbyrns@enteract.com Thu Jan 30 11:56:29 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 30 Jan 2003 19:56:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 41249 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 19:56:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 19:56:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 19:56:28 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.144] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Jan 2003 19:56:28 -0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 19:56:28 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Question To Tom Ray Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 990 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.254 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "wortomray " < tomray@w...> wrote: > > Well, we compared it to our direct competition, WABC, and to WCBS and > WINS during commercial breaks with music. The HD was still an > extremely noticeable improvement. And it was crisper, cleaner, and > had all the high frequency content than the analog stations.....and > the background noise that was present in our conference room from the > light dimmers and the computers in the business office on the other > side of the wall was gone in HD mode. The artifacts you have heard > in our audio samples were recorded with a bad test radio. This > version of HD software does not exhibit those artifacts, except with > stereo material present where the artifacts are minimal. The next > version has no artifacts. Stereo? Everyone here keeps telling me that "HD radio" is not stereo, when I refer to "HD radio" as the "AM stereo" of the new millennium. What's the scoop? John From jbyrns@enteract.com Thu Jan 30 12:09:33 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 30 Jan 2003 20:09:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 89200 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 20:09:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 20:09:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 20:09:30 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.130] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Jan 2003 20:09:30 -0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 20:09:30 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: The Wrath of Kahn Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 764 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.254 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Mr.M S " < fanfare@g...> wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" wrote: > > > I'm interested in reading this and have searched the FCC website > > > and is not under the 99-325 proceeding so either I don't know where > > > to look or it is not there yet. Anyone who has more info on this > > > petition and where to read it in full let us know. > > > > I got the story I sent off Radio World I think. > > Kevin: Take a look at; > > http://www.rwonline.com/dailynews/one.php?id=2547 > > That's what I think you're looking for. Uh, that's being a little incestuous, it sounds like Radio World's source is an internet "chat" group, perhaps even this one. John From scott.toenniessen@fmr.com Thu Jan 30 12:27:18 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: scott.toenniessen@fmr.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 30 Jan 2003 20:27:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 93898 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 20:27:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 20:27:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.64) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 20:27:16 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.164] by n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Jan 2003 20:27:14 -0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 20:27:13 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: KB Stereo Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 619 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "spt87a " X-Originating-IP: 204.110.135.35 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=133257283 X-Yahoo-Profile: spt87a Looks like they are working at the TX site. Last night the skywave was poor, but a bit before 11pm it improved and I put 1520 on for a while on my TM-152. During a song the carrier suddenly dropped for a few seconds. When it came back up, the stereo light popped on. The separation was very apparent on one of the new liners and the commercials. Then during the next song, carrier dropped again. When it came back up, back to mono. I got the second drop on tape so before and after comparison is easy. Maybe they have been on a backup transmitter that last few days and working on the main. - Scott From mwradio@gmx.net Thu Jan 30 12:41:55 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: mwradio@gmx.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 30 Jan 2003 20:41:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 85349 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 20:41:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 20:41:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m1.ispmail.dnbsi.com) (198.136.194.44) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 20:41:53 -0000 Received: from espositojm2 (0-1pool196-64.nas11.philadelphia1.pa.us.da.qwest.net [65.128.196.64]) by m1.ispmail.dnbsi.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 3D2E18FBD6 for ; Thu, 30 Jan 2003 12:41:52 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <04b501c2c8a0$03532b60$06630780@espositojm2> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} KB Stereo Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 15:41:46 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Joe Esposito" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=93604673 X-Yahoo-Profile: espositojm I sent an e-mail on Monday asking if they planned on returning to AM STEREO but have yet to get a response. Joe Esposito York, PA ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, January 30, 2003 3:27 PM Subject: {AMSF} KB Stereo > Looks like they are working at the TX site. Last night the skywave > was poor, but a bit before 11pm it improved and I put 1520 on for a > while on my TM-152. During a song the carrier suddenly dropped for > a few seconds. When it came back up, the stereo light popped on. > The separation was very apparent on one of the new liners and the > commercials. Then during the next song, carrier dropped again. > When it came back up, back to mono. I got the second drop on tape > so before and after comparison is easy. > > Maybe they have been on a backup transmitter that last few days and > working on the main. > > - Scott > > > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > From philipr@irac.pe.ca Thu Jan 30 13:04:15 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 30 Jan 2003 21:04:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 16285 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 21:04:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 21:04:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 21:04:11 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.157] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Jan 2003 21:04:11 -0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 21:04:09 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: The Wrath of Kahn Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2305 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking This is one of the reasons why I am sceptical of full scale Eureka 147 DAB here in Canada. Five or so years ago, the CRTC, Industry Canada, the CBC and the CAB [Canadian Association of Broadcasters] were all talking about Eureka 147 L Band DAB as replacing AM and FM. Now the word "replacing" seems to be itself "replaced" with MAY eventually replace. I can perhaps see DAB in the concrete canyons of a major city, where FM multipath is a real problem, and AM signals are having trouble getting into in office towers. But large suburban and rural areas - do they need it, and as Tom rightly points out - the cost could be astronomical, especially as the real estate to be covered gets larger and larger. Phil R. --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "wortomray " wrote: > On what grounds would he sue iBiquity? My uderstanding of the filing > is that he is objecting to the costs involved. Very frankly, some of > those costs would go into shaping up some AM antenna systems that > should have been gone through a long time ago, and can only help out > the AM band. > > And if he needs to sue someone, it would be the FCC (good luck) if > they mandate IBOC. > > Regarding E147, if that were to operate on L band as it does in other > countries, it would take 75 transmitter locations alone to cover > Manhattan (this information came to me through Harris, as they have > studies on this). Want to talk costs involved in putting in a new > service? Can you imagine the nightmare this would cause? > > > > > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" > wrote: > > > I'm interested in reading this and have searched the FCC website > > > and is not under the 99-325 proceeding so either I don't know > where > > > to look or it is not there yet. Anyone who has more info on this > > > petition and where to read it in full let us know. > > > > I got the story I sent off Radio World I think. > > > > Its not under 99-325 but it is supposed to be a seperate petition. > > > > I hope he does sue the crap out of them and gives them hell on > earth at > > Ibiquity. Digital needs to be on E147. > > > > Kevin > > > > > > > > "Its going to get a lot worse before it > > gets worse" - Lily Tomlin From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Jan 30 13:24:16 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 30 Jan 2003 21:24:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 24389 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 21:24:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 21:24:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m08.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.163) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 21:24:13 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.e4.346420b4 (4238) for ; Thu, 30 Jan 2003 16:24:07 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 16:24:07 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Any stations using Kahn ? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 1/30/03 12:15:32 PM Eastern Standard Time, michaelj@vcn.com writes: << One more Kahn note.....I remember some discussions here that there are still a few stations out there transmitting in Kahn stereo. Allegedly, their engineers were so dead-set against the Motorola system and major supporters of the Kahn system, that they're still transmitting in Kahn ISB stereo. I believe that right now, legally, you CAN....you just can't transmit the pilot tone. Is this correct?? >> I'd hate to see the how high the fine would be when those stations get slammed with a NAL.. Uhm...the way I see it...if your using the Kahn system to send audio to both sidebands in a stereo fashion...even without the pilot it would be illegal. The Kahn system as we know it today was intended to have only audio fed to one channel...therefore giving you the Power Side system. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- Subscribe send an email to amstereo-subscribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net _______________________________________________________ From jsgil@hal-pc.org Thu Jan 30 13:33:43 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 30 Jan 2003 21:33:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 54470 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 21:33:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 21:33:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.64) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 21:33:43 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.187] by n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Jan 2003 21:33:43 -0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 21:33:43 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Part III "HD-QUAM" Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20030130191553.58733.qmail@web14208.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2457 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.176 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, John Pavlica wrote: > > 3) iBiquity DIGITAL ENHANCEMENT: > In my opinion, iBiquity is trying to take ?too big of a bite? of the audio to > be digitized. I suggest that they have an algorithm to reproduce ONLY the > human hearing audio required between 5KHz and 12KHz. A VERY LOW power sidecar > will extend either side of the AM Carrier between only 8KHz and 12KHz. By > starting at 8KHz, analog audio can extend safely out to 7.5KHz to maintain AMAX > reception. This 4KHz of bandwidth on each side should be able to provide a > higher bit rate for the reduced requirements to reproduce ONLY human hearing > audio between 5KHz and 12KHz. This HD ?Digital Enhanced? audio is then MIXED > with the (delayed) ANALOG audio which provides the 30Hz to 7.5KHz audio > portion. There is purposely an overlap between 5KHz and 7500Hz, and an > ?equalizer? control to adjust it for personal preference. With HD-CQUAM, the > frequency response is theoretically 30Hz - 12KHz. > I brought this idea up a while back in this forum. 5KHz analog AM is still very robust and the human ear doesn't notice distortion in the lower frequencies like it does in the higher frequencies. I did a test with an MP3 encoder that allows filtering and when a highpass filter at 5KHz is used on audio there is not much information present in this range and is hard to tell what it is. These higher frequencies are mainly accents and sylabants to the 0-5KHz signal. If IBOC used a a true hybrid system where the 0-5KHz signal was C-QuAM then the IBOC datastream could be used to accurately encode the 5-15KHz range. In my experiments with MP3 encoding the get an FM Stereo quality signal I found that a 32KHz sample rate and a VBR quality of 3 produced a bitrate that ranged from 110-135kbps using one of the best encoders out there. Anything less produced to many artifacts and sounded synthetitc. It is my understanding that the original max bitrate for AM IBOC was 92kbps and even with PAC I don't think this is enough. From what I understand the bitrate is even lower now which means you may produce an FM mono quality signal but not FM Stereo. Using SBR to sytheticly generate the higher frequencies is cheating and as far as I'm concerned disqualifies any system from claiming that it is FM quality. If IBOC was to use a really true hybrid mode then a more natural wider stereo signal would be produced. JSG From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Jan 30 13:50:02 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 30 Jan 2003 21:50:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 25786 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 21:50:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 21:50:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m07.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.162) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 21:50:01 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.185.16122bb4 (4238) for ; Thu, 30 Jan 2003 16:49:30 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <185.16122bb4.2b6af7e9@aol.com> Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 16:49:29 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Question To Tom Ray To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 1/30/03 12:49:58 PM Eastern Standard Time, tomray@wor710.com writes: << Actually, this radio sounds really good on conventional AM stations. It does have the auto bandwidth variation, and it opens wide enough to start picking up hiss from the IBOC sidebands before it blends, so it is hearing out to 5-6kHz at least. It narrows enough so I can listen to it at home....I'm 50 miles away and in WOR's major null, so being able to hear the station above the noise of the Explorer's fuel pump is interesting. It may even have AM Stereo active, though I really don't have anything to light it this close to the city, as I've seen the ST indicator come on when it locks on a station. >> Wow!..that sounds like a very interesting radio! I've concluded that many of the problems associated with todays radios and the aledged interference issues is that the majority of AM radios made...made cheaply at that have front ends as wide as Lake Michigan is long.Thats pretty wide.With radios that claim to have a 3khz bandpass...that would more than likely be an audio band pass...not an IF bandpass per broadcast channel. If your IF (Intermediate Frequency) is 15-30 khz wide..your going to pick up and hear everything within that 15-30khz bandpass.So lets say your tuned to 710..as an example with a radio with an IF with a bandpass of 30khz...your certain to hear the digital carriers that are just either side of the analog "region" of 710.Tune to 730khz with that same radio...well gee no wonder the radio is "getting interference".It because the IF stage and more than likely the front end of the receiver is so wide..it still hears to a degree,whats happening on 710,and 720 and 730..and so on. Hams and DX advocates use radios with variable bandpasses all the time.It will knock out anything outside that bandpass...provided that the front end of the receiver is with worth five cents as well. So..with that in mind....this has me wondering something else.I dont know if with all of the testing that is being done on several stations with STA's across the country..if there are say two stations on one channel that would have competing sky waves at night...and skywave interference with someones groundwave just outside the protected contour,what would be the end result on the receiver end? Should be an interesting result. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- Subscribe send an email to amstereo-subscribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net _______________________________________________________ From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Jan 30 14:08:29 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 30 Jan 2003 22:08:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 38066 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 22:08:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 22:08:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d07.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.39) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 22:08:29 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.17d.16129cc1 (4238) for ; Thu, 30 Jan 2003 17:08:23 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <17d.16129cc1.2b6afc57@aol.com> Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 17:08:23 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Question To Tom Ray To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 1/30/03 1:35:35 PM Eastern Standard Time, kevtronics@yahoo.com writes: << p.s. Does it also have RDS on FM? That's another system that IBOC may make obsolete, but is still widely used amongst analog stations. >> Popularity of RDS is even less than that of AM Stereo. In my markets (Norfolk/Newport News/Virginia Beach and Elizabeth City/Nags Head) there are only at last count 3 stations using RDS out of a good 80-90 stations here. Those RDS stations may drop it all together tomorrow,...who knows I've seen them come and go here before in a market that often plays format and ownership musical chairs.Results are fairly simular across the country. So to put RDS in those receivers would be a hardly seldom used feature...like AM Stereo...your mileage may vary depending on where you are. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- Subscribe send an email to amstereo-subscribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net _______________________________________________________ From tomray@wor710.com Thu Jan 30 14:11:34 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 60410 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 22:11:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 22:11:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 22:11:33 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: tomray@wor710.com Received: from [66.218.67.170] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Jan 2003 22:11:21 -0000 X-Sender: tomray@wor710.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 30 Jan 2003 21:21:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 25882 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 21:21:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 21:21:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 21:21:49 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.139] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Jan 2003 21:21:49 -0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 21:21:48 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Question To Tom Ray Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1284 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wortomray " X-Originating-IP: 151.202.41.185 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=136489311 X-Yahoo-Profile: wortomray X-eGroups-Edited-By: kevtronics X-eGroups-Approved-By: kevtronics via web; 30 Jan 2003 22:11:17 -0000 HD for AM IS stereo. The algorithm isn't quite perfected yet....but the latest version of software is in test now. We'll hopefully have it on the air soon. --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " wrote: > Stereo? Everyone here keeps telling me that "HD radio" is not stereo, > when I refer to "HD radio" as the "AM stereo" of the new millennium. > What's the scoop? From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Jan 30 14:14:59 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 30 Jan 2003 22:14:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 28121 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 22:14:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 22:14:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r10.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.106) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 22:14:59 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r10.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.193.14e6d9d8 (4238) for ; Thu, 30 Jan 2003 17:14:37 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <193.14e6d9d8.2b6afdcc@aol.com> Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 17:14:36 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: The Wrath of Kahn To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 1/30/03 2:02:52 PM Eastern Standard Time, tomray@wor710.com writes: << Regarding E147, if that were to operate on L band as it does in other countries, it would take 75 transmitter locations alone to cover Manhattan (this information came to me through Harris, as they have studies on this). Want to talk costs involved in putting in a new service? Can you imagine the nightmare this would cause? >> E147 operation would be more expensive than converting to C-CUAM and or IBOC.Then you have receiver issues.Our neighbors to the north,Canada is seeing E147 flopping like a fish out of water.The coverage issues and having to depend on someone buying a radio just to hear you on that band are two strikes against it. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- Subscribe send an email to amstereo-subscribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net _______________________________________________________ From jsgil@hal-pc.org Thu Jan 30 14:23:10 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 30 Jan 2003 22:23:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 3481 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 22:23:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 22:23:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 22:23:09 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.160] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Jan 2003 22:23:09 -0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 22:23:08 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Any stations using Kahn ? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 3209 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.176 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kerry Richards " wrote: >=20 > There are many experts out there who have said that the Kahn AM=20 > Stereo system was far superior to C-Quam in that it behaved better=20 > and sounded better. One of the cute things about independent sideband=20 > operation was that Leonard used to take two standard AM radios and=20 > slightly tune one a little higher and the other a little lower and=20 > PRESTO!! you had stereo. (It really worked!) >=20 I am a proponent of ISB and Kahn had most of the bugs worked out of the reception problems that plagued AM Stereo reception in less than optimal conditions many years before anyone else did. One of the biggest problems of non-linear systems is the problems associated with the loss phase information when the amplitude approached -100% modulation. ISB in general helps overcome this because the phase is returning to zero when the envelope approaches -100% which makes it easier for distortion correction circuits to operate properly under adverse reception conditions. Kahn's method of distortion correction did not involve any phase information but only demodulating the envelope by ~50% which made it immune to the loss of phase information problem. The older MC13020 C-QuAM decoder actually produced less crackle distortion on a Kahn-ISB signal under adverse conditions since the phase was returning to zero during negative modulation peaks where a regular C-QuAM signal its phase is at its greatest when it is approacing the negative modulation peaks. This is why heavy single channel modulation had to be limited to 70% and Motorola pushed AM Stereo matrix processor manufacturers to add circuits to limit this. For an ISB signal received with a C-QuAM decoder the single channel modulation could go to 95% before these problems occur. With the technology available at the time when Kahn first implemented AM-Stereo he did more with less than any one else and produced the best sounding system that also allowed the use of existing technology, the 2 radio approach. The drawback to his system today is that encoding is not mathematically the same as decoding and as result his system didn't have the best separation but at the time it was a best fit approach sacrificing separation for a better sound under most conditions. Today I think an envelope compatible ISB system using DSP could be designed having excellent separation low distortion minimum spectrum spread and using full=20 synchronous detection in the receiver. As you can tell I prefer synchronous detection over envelope detection and this where all the non-linear systems fall short and where=20 the Harris-QuAM system excelled. The Harris system maintained its signal integrety as interference increased but all the others had signal degredation with interference. David Hershberger of Harris once mentioned that the best system would be Linear ISB. This would basically be a fixed 90=B0 QuAM system with the L-R audio phase shifted by 90=B0 in relation to L+R. If there wasn't this envelope compatibility issue any linear system using synchronous detection would have served AM much better than a non-linear envelope based system. JSG From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Jan 30 14:26:04 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 30 Jan 2003 22:26:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 86034 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 22:26:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 22:26:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r05.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.101) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 22:26:02 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.21.2af0c537 (4238) for ; Thu, 30 Jan 2003 17:25:59 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <21.2af0c537.2b6b0073@aol.com> Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 17:25:55 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Part III "HD-QUAM" To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Sounds interesting...but one question...how do you get a digital carrier and analog stereo to "live together" on the same transmission platform? Thats a lot of "stuff" to cram in a 10khz wide channel. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- Subscribe send an email to amstereo-subscribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net _______________________________________________________ From florida_amstereo@hotmail.com Thu Jan 30 15:32:10 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: florida_amstereo@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 30 Jan 2003 23:32:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 61935 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 23:32:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 23:32:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.37.32) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 23:32:07 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 30 Jan 2003 15:25:53 -0800 Received: from 209.240.198.61 by pv2fd.pav2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Thu, 30 Jan 2003 23:25:52 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: The Wrath of Kahn Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 23:25:52 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 30 Jan 2003 23:25:53.0524 (UTC) FILETIME=[EEC44B40:01C2C8B6] From: "Donn Tillman" X-Originating-IP: [209.240.198.61] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83914824 Tom Ray of WOR - 710 wrote about E147: "Regarding E147, if that were to operate on L band as it does in other countries, it would take 75 transmitter locations alone to cover Manhattan (this information came to me through Harris, as they have studies on this).  Want to talk costs involved in putting in a new service?  Can you imagine the nightmare this would cause? ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Can any of our Canadian friends let us know how CHUM 1050 Toronto handles this, with all the skyscrapers in Toronto, they have dozens or scores of transmitters? I understand the DAB they use in E147; DAB receivers are available in Radio Shack,Canada. donn in am stereo free and iboc free st petersburg,fl btw - 710 here is a mesh of 710 Radio Cuba and anti-Castro 710 am out of Miami, seeing who can jam the other. From here, it's a tie during the day and then when 710 in Miami powers and changing patterns at night, all I hear on 710 in Cuba (with a hint of Miami in the background) _________________________________________________________________ Tired of spam? Get advanced junk mail protection with MSN 8. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail From jsgil@hal-pc.org Thu Jan 30 15:37:12 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 30 Jan 2003 23:37:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 10638 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 23:37:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 23:37:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 23:37:11 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.177] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Jan 2003 23:37:10 -0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 23:37:09 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: The Wrath of Kahn Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2646 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.130.64 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "wortomray " wrote: > > > Regarding E147, if that were to operate on L band as it does in other > countries, it would take 75 transmitter locations alone to cover > Manhattan (this information came to me through Harris, as they have > studies on this). Want to talk costs involved in putting in a new > service? Can you imagine the nightmare this would cause? > Has a cost analysis of using the existing AM band for IBOC instead of another part of the spectrum been done. I am talking about the long term big picture for all the AM stations as a whole. I'm not saying using an Eureka type system but find another 1.2MHz of spectrum that isn't plagued with the reception problems AM has today. Consider the long term costs of maintaining an antenna farm, very tall towers for the long wavelength, directional arrays necessary, and the land whether you are leasing it or own it and having to pay taxes on it. Consider the AM broadcasters as a whole group and how many have transmitters that are too old and have too much IPM to use IBOC. Many will need new transmitters and some will not be able to get the directional arrays to function properly with IBOC. What about the skywave issues at night. Seems to me that long term costs for the AM broadcasters as a whole would be cheaper if DAB services for AM were relocated in another part of the spectrum that is not plagued with the noise issues that MW has. It would have been better if AM broadasters grabbed some spectrum early on when the the TV band was being chopped up. The bandwidth of the existing AM band is less than 1/4 of a sinle NTSC TV station and could have produced a superior transmittion system that didn't have to deal with compatibility issues of existing analog radios. Moving to a much higher frequency would mean electrically shorter antennas requiring less land and not having to use directional arrays to protect other stations' signals. Initial costs would be greater but in the long run I think it would be cheaper and have a better system initially that was specificly designed for DAB. To me this looks like the perfect jumping off point for broadcasters in the MW band to relieve themselves of all the negative aspects associated with it. In my opinion the MW band came into use because the techonogy of the day was capable of using it economically in transmittion and reception where much higher frequencies would have cost more. Technology today does not limit us in this respect and any chance to break away from these lower frequencies and their problems would be a big advantage. JSG From alfredot@inetarena.com Thu Jan 30 16:20:33 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: alfredot@inetarena.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 31 Jan 2003 00:20:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 49032 invoked from network); 31 Jan 2003 00:20:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Jan 2003 00:20:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.inetarena.com) (206.129.216.13) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jan 2003 00:20:31 -0000 Received: from hendrie (1Cust251.tnt16.beaverton.or.da.uu.net [67.227.163.251]) by mail.inetarena.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h0V0HoM04371 for ; Thu, 30 Jan 2003 16:17:52 -0800 (PST) Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 16:19:30 -0800 (PST) X-Sender: alfredo@hendrie.1610am.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: KB-1520... proud to be MONO? In-Reply-To: <1043769463.486.47899.m12@yahoogroups.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: "Alfredo E. Torrejon" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=25132238 X-Yahoo-Profile: alfredotorrejon > I just heard their hourly ID, and it specifically mentioned something > to the effect of "Playing Oldies, on an AM station IN MONO..... > KB Radio, 1520!" > > Is this the first time that a radio station is actually promoting the > fact that they are broadcasting in mono? No; back in 1990, I remember hearing a liner on KUSW (a now-defunct shortwave station) that said: "MONOPHONIC...The sound of the 90s! Stereo is a thing of the past." Alfredo From alfredot@inetarena.com Thu Jan 30 16:57:11 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: alfredot@inetarena.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 31 Jan 2003 00:57:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 3189 invoked from network); 31 Jan 2003 00:57:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Jan 2003 00:57:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.inetarena.com) (206.129.216.13) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jan 2003 00:57:10 -0000 Received: from hendrie (1Cust251.tnt16.beaverton.or.da.uu.net [67.227.163.251]) by mail.inetarena.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h0V0sbM12232 for ; Thu, 30 Jan 2003 16:54:37 -0800 (PST) Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 16:56:21 -0800 (PST) X-Sender: alfredo@hendrie.1610am.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: The truth shall set you free In-Reply-To: <1043769463.486.47899.m12@yahoogroups.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: "Alfredo E. Torrejon" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=25132238 X-Yahoo-Profile: alfredotorrejon > Personally, Kevin, I hate IBOCrap with a passion. There's an old saying: "If > it ain't broke, DON'T FIX IT". AM radio wasn't broken before IBOCrap, and > neither was FM radio. The FCC should have never allowed digital radio to be > tested on the AM and FM bands, and kept them analog. The only appropriate > place for digital radio currently is the L-Band, and the only proven system > is Eureka 147. First off, I have to mention that I am a really big fan of C-QUAM. However, I think that testing of IBOC under real-world conditions is a good thing, as long as the testing is objective and unbiased. From what I've read so far on this forum, the consensus, among those that visited the WOR transmitting facilities, seems to be that WOR's engineers followed good engineering practices in setting up the IBOC gear at their station. To put it simply, they followed all of the instructions from Ibiquity for the setup of the new equipment, and in my opinion, that's all that they can reasonably be expected to do for that phase of the project. I would much rather that IBOC be tested on stations like WOR, under real-world conditions with real broadcast transmitters, than for the FCC to accept this system based solely on in-house tests by Ibiquity on low-powered experimental stations with non-standard custom-made transmitters. My hope now is that the FCC's decision on the fitness for use of IBOC is made solely on an unbiased examination of data collected from the operation of WOR and other test stations, rather than pressure by Ibiquity and the Consumer Electronics Association. Alfredo From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Jan 30 17:26:24 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 31 Jan 2003 01:26:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 95705 invoked from network); 31 Jan 2003 01:26:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Jan 2003 01:26:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m08.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.163) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jan 2003 01:26:22 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.171.19f7b103 (4238) for ; Thu, 30 Jan 2003 20:26:18 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <171.19f7b103.2b6b2aba@aol.com> Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 20:26:18 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: The Wrath of Kahn To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp << The bandwidth of the existing AM band is less than 1/4 of a sinle NTSC TV station and could have produced a superior transmittion system that didn't have to deal with compatibility issues of existing analog radios >> Either way you go..its an expense.If you move to a "new broadcast band" you have to depend on the listeners buying the radios to listen to you on the new service.Thats like playing Russian roulette.Thats what the Canadians are doing with their digital broadcast band...and seems like they pulled the trigger and a bullet is about to exit out the end of the barrell (opps!..you bought a receiver,broadcaster eventually leaves that digital band because they can't attract advertiser dollars to pay the bills,you now have a fancy pricey radio but no one to listen to...you loose! broadcaster spent millions...opps! they loose! ) What if the listeners dont buy the receivers to equate to the number of AM radios on the market today...the listeners dont come to the new band..advertisers dont get the "bang for the buck" due to lower exposure to people ..advertiser then moves to another medium to get results then your new fangled broadcast band of few listeners is stuck with a debt that cant be paid off well..because the advertisers paying the radio stations bills are gone. Verses the current AM band..its certainly established and very familiar to most folks in the household.So no matter what form of transmission you use....if it fails,then its back to business as usual and your paying your bills--no problem.If it succeeds,great!...then its all gravy after taking care of the expense to upgrade. If you look at the cost of putting up any new broadcast facility verses upgrading one and maintaining a current facility..I think alot of broadcasters would opt not to move to a new band.Millions to build a new facility verses a few 100 thousand at the most to upgrade.I'd take the later figure and the current broadcast band. If IBOC becomes the new standard of AM radio..it will be a win win situation for all. Stations will either stay analog with there vintage broken down equipment--spending no money-- or stations will make improvements to their facilities(studio,transmitter,antennas) and go with IBOC.If IBOC becomes just a fad like AM stereo was...then the listeners get the privilege to listen to a state of the art,decent sounding reliable radio station. The general public would benefit ( we hope ) by higher quality receivers..tighter band passes to kill adjacent channel chatter,noise reduction and like. I know,the receiver deal almost sounds like an AMAX campaign. If this all comes to pass and the receiver manufactures have their feet held to the fire and start making decent radios..it will be a win win situtation no matter what the long range outcome of IBOC. Thats probably one of the better ways of looking at the entire situation. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- Subscribe send an email to amstereo-subscribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net _______________________________________________________ From florida_amstereo@hotmail.com Thu Jan 30 17:56:25 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: florida_amstereo@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 31 Jan 2003 01:56:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 9383 invoked from network); 31 Jan 2003 01:56:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Jan 2003 01:56:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.37.9) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jan 2003 01:56:24 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 30 Jan 2003 17:49:27 -0800 Received: from 209.240.198.61 by pv2fd.pav2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 01:49:26 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: ¿Why DAB instead of IBOC? Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 01:49:26 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 31 Jan 2003 01:49:27.0091 (UTC) FILETIME=[FCDA5030:01C2C8CA] From: "Donn Tillman" X-Originating-IP: [209.240.198.61] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83914824 Bob or Tom, With all the advantages of IBOC mentioned in about a dozen of so posts today and the disadvantages of DEB (E147) mentioned in several posts (mainly having to use many more transmission towers etc), does anyone have a clue as to why the CRTC gave the green-light to DAB or as to why the CHUM group of radio stations is supporting it? (I can certainly understand why Radio Shack Canada supports it--more sales for them), but why would the Canadian Radio & Television Commission support it. Also, what would you speculate the effects would be on radio markets, like the Windsor/Detroit radio market, where now you will have some listeners using different type of receivers, will U.S. listeners still be able to hear the stations out of Windsor (in other words, will the stations broadcast in both analogue and DAB as 1050 CHUM is), will Canadian listeners still have access to analogue equipment for the a.m. band or will it be phased out, much like analogue tv here is supposed to be phased out? donn more than curious in st petersburg _________________________________________________________________ Help STOP SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Thu Jan 30 19:13:14 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 31 Jan 2003 03:13:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 55638 invoked from network); 31 Jan 2003 03:13:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Jan 2003 03:13:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14202.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.144) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jan 2003 03:13:11 -0000 Message-ID: <20030131031311.76607.qmail@web14202.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.162.18.146] by web14202.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 30 Jan 2003 19:13:11 PST Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 19:13:11 -0800 (PST) Subject: WSPD promoting Kahn, and Kahn promoting Kahn To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio MJR wrote:"...There is actually file or two from a station (in Ohio? Maybe Indiana??) that was recorded the day they went stereo in Kahn mode. Announcer talking all about how they were now stereo and that you didn't need to buy a new radio to hear it.....just to take 2 radios...tune one a little to the left, and the other a little to the right if you wanted to hear it! Another neat air check that's priceless. Wish I could remember exactly which one it is." Michael, I recorded that from WSPD-Toledo when they first announced that they were broadcasting in Kahn AM Stereo (sorry for the poor audio quality from the old cassette). Leonard boasted that AM (at that time) could have better frequency response than FM. WSPD later went to a sweet-sounding C-Quam stereo system until Clear Channel instructed them to shut-off the stereo. Don't know if it's on our file section or just on the CD? J.P. __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From tomray@wor710.com Thu Jan 30 19:51:43 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 43229 invoked from network); 31 Jan 2003 03:51:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Jan 2003 03:51:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.66) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jan 2003 03:51:41 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: tomray@wor710.com Received: from [66.218.67.164] by n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Jan 2003 03:51:41 -0000 X-Sender: tomray@wor710.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 30 Jan 2003 22:11:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 77153 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 22:11:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 22:11:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.89) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 22:11:14 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.135] by n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Jan 2003 22:11:12 -0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 22:11:11 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Question To Tom Ray Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <185.16122bb4.2b6af7e9@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2164 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wortomray " X-Originating-IP: 151.202.41.185 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=136489311 X-Yahoo-Profile: wortomray X-eGroups-Edited-By: kevtronics X-eGroups-Approved-By: kevtronics via web; 31 Jan 2003 03:51:41 -0000 Actually, that would be an interesting question. And fun to try. Another issue with the AM radios, especially in cars, is that the auto manufacturers ignore problems created with AM reception. Case in point is the 1997 Explorer I drive. AM has been noisy since day one in lower signal areas.....and I've blamed either the radio or the ignition system. Of course, I've never listened to it with the engine off. Lo and Behold, I spotted a "silent" service bulletin on the vehicle on the internet.....seems there's a known problem with the fuel pump in said vehicle. Yup. Turn the key to on, noise, then it stops when the fuel pump does. Start the car, noise is constant. Now why do they have this as a "silent" bulletin? > So..with that in mind....this has me wondering something else. I dont > know if with all of the testing that is being done on several stations > with STA's across the country..if there are say two stations on one > channel that would have competing sky waves at night...and skywave > interference with someones groundwave just outside the protected > contour, what would be the end result on the receiver end? > Should be an interesting result. From matthew.trim@eds.com Thu Jan 30 19:51:59 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: matthew.trim@eds.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 31 Jan 2003 03:51:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 42133 invoked from network); 31 Jan 2003 03:51:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Jan 2003 03:51:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO ns5.eds.com) (207.169.189.136) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jan 2003 03:51:58 -0000 Received: from nnsy.eds.com (nnsy-2.eds.com [192.85.216.198]) by ns5.eds.com (8.11.6/8.11.1) with ESMTP id h0V3pvk17896 for ; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 14:51:57 +1100 (EST) Received: from nnsy.eds.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by nnsy.eds.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0V3pt909755 for ; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 14:51:55 +1100 (EST) Received: from ausym000.exau01.exch.eds.com ([134.251.177.117]) by nnsy.eds.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h0V3pt609751 for ; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 14:51:55 +1100 (EST) Received: by AUSYM000 with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 14:51:48 +1100 Message-ID: <33CDDBD8CAEFEB4191ABF6F799032AF238D786@aubwm206> To: "'amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com'" Subject: RE: {AMSF} ?Why DAB instead of IBOC? Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 14:51:51 +1100 Importance: high X-Priority: 1 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-Type: text/plain From: "Trim, Matthew L" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88615102 X-Yahoo-Profile: bofh2k2000 G'day Donn, Hope I'm not speaking out of turn but from what I understand of E147, it is superior in terms of efficiency - it can broadcast 6 CD quality stereo 256kbps programs on the same transmitter using one data stream which I think takes up less bandwidth than one VHF TV station. Although the implementation of E147 would be expensive in the L band due to the number of transmitters required, current thought is that when analog TV is fully digitised, spectrum in the low VHF bands can be used which will mean the propagation of the signal will be similar to current FM coverage except you could have one 100kw+ TX serving 6 radio stations. - a large cost saving there with no doubt better range than a traditional FM as power could be greater due to the reduction in the number of TX's required. Here's a link to the current thoughts on E147 in Australia and some more technical background: http://www.aba.gov.au/abanews/speeches/digital_tech/pdfrtf/gTanner0302.pdf Regards, Matt -----Original Message----- From: Donn Tillman [mailto:florida_amstereo@hotmail.com] Sent: Friday, 31 January 2003 11:49 AM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} ?Why DAB instead of IBOC? Bob or Tom, With all the advantages of IBOC mentioned in about a dozen of so posts today and the disadvantages of DEB (E147) mentioned in several posts (mainly having to use many more transmission towers etc), does anyone have a clue as to why the CRTC gave the green-light to DAB or as to why the CHUM group of radio stations is supporting it? (I can certainly understand why Radio Shack Canada supports it--more sales for them), but why would the Canadian Radio & Television Commission support it. Also, what would you speculate the effects would be on radio markets, like the Windsor/Detroit radio market, where now you will have some listeners using different type of receivers, will U.S. listeners still be able to hear the stations out of Windsor (in other words, will the stations broadcast in both analogue and DAB as 1050 CHUM is), will Canadian listeners still have access to analogue equipment for the a.m. band or will it be phased out, much like analogue tv here is supposed to be phased out? donn more than curious in st petersburg _________________________________________________________________ Help STOP SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From tomray@wor710.com Thu Jan 30 19:52:19 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 37618 invoked from network); 31 Jan 2003 03:52:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Jan 2003 03:52:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jan 2003 03:52:19 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: tomray@wor710.com Received: from [66.218.66.140] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Jan 2003 03:52:19 -0000 X-Sender: tomray@wor710.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 30 Jan 2003 22:13:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 62911 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 22:13:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 22:13:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 22:13:02 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.180] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Jan 2003 22:13:00 -0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 22:12:59 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: Question To Tom Ray Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <17d.16129cc1.2b6afc57@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 315 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wortomray " X-Originating-IP: 151.202.41.185 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=136489311 X-Yahoo-Profile: wortomray X-eGroups-Approved-By: kevtronics via web; 31 Jan 2003 03:52:18 -0000 I don't know if it has RDS. I don't have a data sheet on the radio. What stations in the City have an RDS signal up? I'll punch one up and find out. > << p.s. Does it also have RDS on FM? That's another system that IBOC > may make obsolete, but is still widely used amongst analog stations. > >> > From tomray@wor710.com Thu Jan 30 19:52:54 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 38797 invoked from network); 31 Jan 2003 03:52:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Jan 2003 03:52:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jan 2003 03:52:54 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: tomray@wor710.com Received: from [66.218.67.184] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Jan 2003 03:52:53 -0000 X-Sender: tomray@wor710.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 30 Jan 2003 22:17:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 57732 invoked from network); 30 Jan 2003 22:17:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 30 Jan 2003 22:17:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.87) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 30 Jan 2003 22:17:38 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.248] by n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 30 Jan 2003 22:17:38 -0000 Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 22:17:37 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Station LIst Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 126 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wortomray " X-Originating-IP: 151.202.41.185 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=136489311 X-Yahoo-Profile: wortomray X-eGroups-Approved-By: kevtronics via web; 31 Jan 2003 03:52:51 -0000 Kevin: You should take WFBL, Syracuse off your list. Exciter smoked several months ago and it was relegated to mono. TR From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Jan 30 19:56:23 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 31 Jan 2003 03:56:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 46003 invoked from network); 31 Jan 2003 03:56:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Jan 2003 03:56:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.68) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jan 2003 03:56:23 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.141] by n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Jan 2003 03:55:29 -0000 Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 03:55:28 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Station List Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 405 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.72.29 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > You should take WFBL, Syracuse off your list. Exciter smoked > several months ago and it was relegated to mono. Hmm... I don't mean to "out" anyone, but I believe someone associated with 1050 WFBL (at least going by their e-mail address) just recently joined this group. If they're reading this, perhaps they can enlighten us about the status of WFBL, and if/when they might return to AM Stereo? From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Jan 30 20:17:54 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 31 Jan 2003 04:17:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 76365 invoked from network); 31 Jan 2003 04:17:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Jan 2003 04:17:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jan 2003 04:17:52 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.171] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Jan 2003 04:17:52 -0000 Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 04:17:52 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: AM Stereo at its Ultimate Best Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1664 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.72.29 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics I recently won an eBay auction for a Panasonic VP-8253P AM Stereo generator... http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3105528036 ...and it just arrived today. Despite being sold "as-is", it works perfectly, and it is allowing me to experience AM Stereo with quality that I never thought was possible! It is a multi-system generator -- selectable for C-Quam, Harris (with 25 Hz pilot tone), Kahn ISB (15 Hz pilot), and Magnavox (5 Hz pilot). First impressions on a Sony SRF-A100 multi-system radio is that C-Quam, Kahn, and Magnavox all really sound the same, with no glaring differences between them. On the other hand, Harris is quite a bit more distorted; although with proper equipment, some claimed it was the best-sounding AM Stereo system of them all, unfortunately *no* consumer radios ever decoded it properly, thus producing this extra distortion. Anyway, the neat thing about this generator is that its output frequency can be set for anywhere from 200 to 2000 kHz -- thus, I can set it to 450 kHz and listen directly through a C-Quam AM Stereo decoder chip, without the need for it to be hooked up to any radio! With this configuration, I am experiencing UNBELIEVABLY high fidelity AM Stereo, with separation wide enough to make your head spin! Using fantastic Oldies music, I am making some test recordings that will really knock your socks off -- anybody who doubts that AM Stereo can sound good has never heard it like this! Some MP3 samples will be uploaded to the Files section here soon, and they are definitely a must-listen! You will not be disappointed, even by the most critical listening standards! From amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Thu Jan 30 20:29:52 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 91084 invoked from network); 31 Jan 2003 04:29:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Jan 2003 04:29:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jan 2003 04:29:51 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: notify@yahoogroups.com Received: from [66.218.67.178] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Jan 2003 04:29:51 -0000 Date: 31 Jan 2003 04:29:48 -0000 Message-ID: <1043987388.502742.80379.w55@yahoogroups.com> X-eGroups-Application: files X-Yahoo-Group-Post: system From: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: New file uploaded to amstereoforum MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello, This email message is a notification to let you know that a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the amstereoforum group. File : /ultramst.mp3 Uploaded by : kevtronics Description : This is an actual, unretouched MP3 sample of ultimate hi-fi AM Stereo, as generated by a Panasonic VP-8253P and directly received @ 450 kHz on a Toshiba TA8124 C-Quam AM Stereo decoder. Listen with headphones, and the Stereo separation is unbelievably wide, in addition to a full 16+ kHz frequency response. You can access this file at the URL http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum/files/ultramst.mp3 To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/files Regards, kevtronics From jbyrns@enteract.com Thu Jan 30 20:41:06 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 31 Jan 2003 04:41:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 85898 invoked from network); 31 Jan 2003 04:41:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Jan 2003 04:41:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jan 2003 04:41:06 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.144] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Jan 2003 04:41:06 -0000 Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 04:41:06 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Question To Tom Ray Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1337 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.172 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "wortomray " < tomray@w...> wrote: > > Actually, this radio sounds really good on conventional AM stations. > It does have the auto bandwidth variation, and it opens wide enough > to start picking up hiss from the IBOC sidebands before it blends, > so it is hearing out to 5-6kHz at least. It narrows enough so I can > listen to it at home....I'm 50 miles away and in WOR's major null, > so being able to hear the station above the noise of the Explorer's > fuel pump is interesting. Speaking of major nulls, I notice on the FCC web site that WOR has an application for a new antenna array, although I suppose I wouldn't be surprised if the data on the FCC web site is a little out of date, and the array has already been built and put into operation? I notice the nulls of this new array, to the WNW, and NNW, are much deeper than the NW null of the old array. I assume one null is to protect Seattle, does the second null protect anything, or is it just an artifact of the design? I also notice that the array does maintain the historic coverage of Philadelphia, although at a slightly reduced level, while the signal in the N.Y.C. area is increased slightly. What were the reasons for building a new array, as opposed to refurbishing the existing one? John From jsgil@hal-pc.org Thu Jan 30 20:55:11 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 31 Jan 2003 04:55:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 21925 invoked from network); 31 Jan 2003 04:55:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Jan 2003 04:55:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.90) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jan 2003 04:55:10 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.150] by n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Jan 2003 04:55:09 -0000 Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 04:55:07 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: The Wrath of Kahn Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <171.19f7b103.2b6b2aba@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1494 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.130.69 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, KC4QLP@a... wrote: > > << The bandwidth of the existing AM band is less than > 1/4 of a sinle NTSC TV station and could have produced a superior > transmittion system that didn't have to deal with compatibility > issues of existing analog radios >> > > Either way you go..its an expense.If you move to a "new broadcast band" you > have to depend on the listeners buying the radios to listen to you on the new > service.Thats like playing Russian roulette. As far as them moving to a new band it wouldn't make any difference especially if every station spot in the existing AM band has a spot in the new broadcast band and the spots would be assigned station numbers like TV stations except that the numbers would be associated with the old MW frequency like 630, 710, 820, 1200 etc. This would be transparent to the listener and the digital radios would go to the specific spot in the digital band when tuned to the associating spot in the MW band. The problem with buying new radios will be the same situation that occured with the C-QuAM radios and will be what makes or breaks IBOC success. If the radios are expensive and few in number and not portable then this will be the demise of IBOC. Remember there was the same push to get C-QuAM radios in cars, home receivers and portable units much like what is happening now with IBOC radios and unless market saturation occurs in a short time it will meet the same demise as C-QuAM. JSG From fanfare@globility.com Thu Jan 30 21:00:49 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 31 Jan 2003 05:00:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 75157 invoked from network); 31 Jan 2003 05:00:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Jan 2003 05:00:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jan 2003 05:00:49 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.189] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Jan 2003 05:00:49 -0000 Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 05:00:46 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: =?iso-8859-1?q?Re:_=BFWhy_DAB_instead_of_IBOC=3F?= Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2644 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Mr.M S " X-Originating-IP: 64.56.234.46 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Donn Tillman" wrote: > > Bob or Tom, > > With all the advantages of IBOC mentioned in about a dozen of so posts today > and the disadvantages of DEB (E147) mentioned in several posts (mainly > having to use many more transmission towers etc), does anyone have a clue as > to why the CRTC gave the green-light to DAB or as to why the CHUM group of > radio stations is supporting it? (I can certainly understand why Radio > Shack Canada supports it--more sales for them), but why would the Canadian > Radio & Television Commission support it. > > Also, what would you speculate the effects would be on radio markets, like > the Windsor/Detroit radio market, where now you will have some listeners > using different type of receivers, will U.S. listeners still be able to hear > the stations out of Windsor (in other words, will the stations broadcast in > both analogue and DAB as 1050 CHUM is), will Canadian listeners still have > access to analogue equipment for the a.m. band or will it be phased out, > much like analogue tv here is supposed to be phased out? As has already been alluded to on this group, UK's E.147 distribution pods are being loaded down with more stations. Hence the bit rate is allowed to drop to a less than palatable level and the resultant audio ends up being the same. Eureka in the Toronto / Windsor ON corridor is pretty good in terms of quality, but it has not begun to grow outward as yet. One person I know who has an E147 car radio says the signal doesn't reach too far outside the Metro area. We forget that E-147 operates optimally at about 325MHz. "L" Band is way above that and typically more elusive. I don't know that they have the receiver sales to substantiate the expense of repeaters as yet. On the topic of the broadcat band, IMHO, the one area were we part company with the normal mindset of broadcasting, AM or FM, is that we typically listen to radio on a home receiver. As long as listening tests are conducted on low resolution receivers, broadcasters deny themselves the true potential of what they are trying to do. Somehow radio stations have got stop compensating for every radio manufacturer's inadequate designs. A tailor friend of mine once said, "You can buy a suit with good material and a cheap cut, or one with cheap material and a good cut. Either way you have a suit that you won't be wearing very long." Cheers, M.> > _________________________________________________________________ > Help STOP SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* > http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail From jbyrns@enteract.com Thu Jan 30 21:04:52 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 31 Jan 2003 05:04:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 53532 invoked from network); 31 Jan 2003 05:04:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Jan 2003 05:04:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jan 2003 05:04:51 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.129] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Jan 2003 05:04:51 -0000 Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 05:04:49 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: AM Stereo at its Ultimate Best Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1276 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.172 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " < kevtronics@y...> wrote: > I recently won an eBay auction for a Panasonic VP-8253P AM Stereo > generator... Neat gadget, good catch. > Anyway, the neat thing about this generator is that its output > frequency can be set for anywhere from 200 to 2000 kHz -- thus, I can > set it to 450 kHz and listen directly through a C-Quam AM Stereo > decoder chip, without the need for it to be hooked up to any radio! > With this configuration, I am experiencing UNBELIEVABLY high fidelity > AM Stereo, with separation wide enough to make your head spin! > > Using fantastic Oldies music, I am making some test recordings that > will really knock your socks off -- anybody who doubts that AM Stereo > can sound good has never heard it like this! Some MP3 samples will > be uploaded to the Files section here soon, and they are definitely a > must-listen! You will not be disappointed, even by the most critical > listening standards! You could make even better recordings if you eliminated the AM stereo generator, and decoder chip, from the system entirely. AM stereo has to live in the real world of AM transmission systems, noise, and propagation problems, what do these recordings prove? John From amymousie@yahoo.com Thu Jan 30 21:50:11 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 31 Jan 2003 05:50:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 66306 invoked from network); 31 Jan 2003 05:50:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Jan 2003 05:50:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.64) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jan 2003 05:50:11 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.133] by n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Jan 2003 05:50:10 -0000 Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 05:50:09 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: The death of AM stereo? Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 865 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 67.118.16.157 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie I've always thought the survival of public-domain technology (and all of the AM stereo system patents have passed into the public domain by now) is dependent on the availability of resources. Looking around me, resources for AM stereo are few, and dwindling. I have yet to hear of anyone making a (relatively simple) C-QUAM decoder board without resorting to chips, or for that matter, AM stereo- and CQUAM theory in plain english. ISB, quadrature AM, and even the RCA/Belar systems could easily be explained, but there is very little on them. Once the supply of C-QUAM decoder dry up, will that be it, the end of C-QUAM? And no, nothing about DSP, please- This is something that's been promised for years, and well...I just don't trust relying on chips, especially if no "generic" equivalents are made. Don't mind me, I'm just a mouse. Amy. <:3 )~~~ From bd6xray@lycos.com Thu Jan 30 22:02:54 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: bd6xray@lycos.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 31 Jan 2003 06:02:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 29158 invoked from network); 31 Jan 2003 06:02:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Jan 2003 06:02:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jan 2003 06:02:51 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.173] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Jan 2003 06:02:51 -0000 Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 06:02:49 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: The Wrath of Kahn Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 413 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bd6xray " X-Originating-IP: 64.12.96.170 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83174981 X-Yahoo-Profile: bd6xray --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "wortomray " wrote: > And if he needs to sue someone, it would be the FCC (good luck) if > they mandate IBOC. It's not uncommon for the FCC to lose. Recent examples - courts keep overturning the FCC's EEOC rules, and the Supreme Court granted NextWave's suit to recover licenses the FCC had attempted to take back and had resold. Al Hajny From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Jan 30 22:37:42 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 31 Jan 2003 06:37:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 92161 invoked from network); 31 Jan 2003 06:37:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Jan 2003 06:37:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m06.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.161) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jan 2003 06:37:41 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.1a0.1006497c (4410) for ; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 01:37:39 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1a0.1006497c.2b6b73b3@aol.com> Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 01:37:39 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} The death of AM stereo? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 1/31/03 12:51:21 AM Eastern Standard Time, amymousie@yahoo.com writes: > Once the supply of C-QUAM decoder dry up, will that be it, the end of > C-QUAM? And no, nothing about DSP, please- This is something that's > been promised for years, and well...I just don't trust relying on > chips, especially if no "generic" equivalents are made Well if you had plenty of time on your hands..you could perhaps reverse engineer the IC chips...then build a circuit that is directly right down to the component level.End result would be something larger than what you could fit in your shirt pocket though. I'm sure somewhere there is a schematic of an early C-QUAM decoder that does not use IC's.Chris...the decoder guru of the group could probably give you some insight to this. Good luck in your search Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net ____________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Jan 30 22:47:43 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 31 Jan 2003 06:47:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 77704 invoked from network); 31 Jan 2003 06:47:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Jan 2003 06:47:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.69) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jan 2003 06:47:43 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.182] by n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Jan 2003 06:47:43 -0000 Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 06:47:41 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: AM Stereo at its Ultimate Best Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1932 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.72.29 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > AM stereo has to live in the real world of AM transmission systems, > noise, and propagation problems, what do these recordings prove? You could ask the same thing about the samples of IBOC that have been posted so far -- they were similarly made in ideal "laboratory" conditions. But the real point for these AM Stereo recordings is to demonstrate that once you have them both on an equal playing field, IBOC/"HD Radio" simply cannot match up to analog AM Stereo in terms of true high-fidelity audio reproduction. And these demonstrations *do* become relevant to the "real world" in terms of helping to give AM stations an accurate representation of what their choices are. So far, iBiquity has been basing many of their claimed advantages of IBOC on comparisons to noisy, monophonic 5 kHz analog AM, when in reality, analog AM is capable of *so* much more. And if reports about Visteon's upcoming IBOC-equipped car radios are true, then these radios will also greatly benefit analog AM and AM Stereo stations, and these benefits must be recognized and publicised. While many of us may disagree about the merits and drawbacks of IBOC/"HD Radio", none of us would be here if we didn't support the continued use and success of high-quality analog AM and AM Stereo radio. But instead of just simply seeking to *maintain* AM Stereo's current status, we should also be doing everything we can to help it *grow* in popularity -- one aspect of which includes overcoming the stereotype that analog AM (mono or Stereo) is somehow inherently limited in fidelity and incapable of producing true hi-fi sound. *We* know this to be true, but clearly not everybody else does -- and while we don't have millions of dollars to spend on a huge marketing and advertising campaign like iBiquity, we can certainly each do as much as we can to help out and spread the word (or, more accurately, spread the *sound*). From amymousie@yahoo.com Thu Jan 30 23:32:00 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 31 Jan 2003 07:32:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 87329 invoked from network); 31 Jan 2003 07:32:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Jan 2003 07:32:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jan 2003 07:32:00 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.188] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Jan 2003 07:32:00 -0000 Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 07:31:55 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: The death of AM stereo? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <1a0.1006497c.2b6b73b3@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1044 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 64.175.244.68 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, KC4QLP@a... wrote: > In a message dated 1/31/03 12:51:21 AM Eastern Standard Time, > amymousie@y... writes: > > > > Once the supply of C-QUAM decoder dry up, will that be it, the end of > > C-QUAM? And no, nothing about DSP, please- This is something that's > > been promised for years, and well...I just don't trust relying on > > chips, especially if no "generic" equivalents are made > > Well if you had plenty of time on your hands..you could perhaps reverse > engineer the IC chips...then build a circuit that is directly right down to > the component level.End result would be something larger than what you could > fit in your shirt pocket though. > I'm sure somewhere there is a schematic of an early C-QUAM decoder that does > not use IC's.Chris...the decoder guru of the group could probably give you > some insight to this. > Good luck in your search Some chip datasheets give you schematics of the chips, and some don't. Thank you for wishing me good luck. Amy. <:3 )~~~ From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Jan 30 23:33:52 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 31 Jan 2003 07:33:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 85900 invoked from network); 31 Jan 2003 07:33:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Jan 2003 07:33:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d10.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.42) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jan 2003 07:33:52 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d10.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.39.3332602d (4410) for ; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 02:33:50 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <39.3332602d.2b6b80dd@aol.com> Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 02:33:49 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: AM Stereo at its Ultimate Best To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 1/31/03 1:48:23 AM Eastern Standard Time, kevtronics@yahoo.com writes: > You could ask the same thing about the samples of IBOC that have been > posted so far -- they were similarly made in ideal "laboratory" > conditions. > I could have sworn that the WOR-HD samples would have counted as real world.They are in all intent and purpose recordings of what is being transmitted..(real world)..and your hearing the results of various updated improved versions of the IBOC software. TGIF! ...(of course that doesnt mean much to those of us officially & unofficially on the clock 24/7} Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From amfmdx@fastq.com Thu Jan 30 23:46:26 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 31 Jan 2003 07:46:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 21840 invoked from network); 31 Jan 2003 07:46:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Jan 2003 07:46:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jan 2003 07:46:26 -0000 Received: from fastq (d20-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.52]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id h0V7kOU96902 for ; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 00:46:25 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <003601c2c8fc$c326aa00$34f9bed8@com> To: Subject: Kahn is still my hero Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 00:45:43 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla Marv, You nailed it. THANK YOU. Kevin >Kevin: Take a look at; >http://www.rwonline.com/dailynews/one.php?id=2547 >That's what I think you're looking for. "Its going to get a lot worse before it gets worse" - Lily Tomlin From bjackson@indyradio.com Fri Jan 31 00:42:25 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 31 Jan 2003 08:42:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 75483 invoked from network); 31 Jan 2003 08:42:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Jan 2003 08:42:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.89) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jan 2003 08:42:22 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.160] by n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Jan 2003 08:42:22 -0000 Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 08:42:22 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Question To Tom Ray Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 952 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923 " X-Originating-IP: 64.25.100.108 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: > I had a chance to use the standard AM/FM/single-CD Visteon radio in > > > a 2002 Explorer, and while it didn't have the CD-6's fancy hi-fi > > > AM Stereo tuner, it did have a respectable amount of high end to the > sound (maybe 6-7 kHz response) and there was no vehicle-generated RFI > (alternator whine, spark plug buzzing, etc.) that I could hear, even > on blank AM channels. > And, I'm happy to report, I just picked up my 2003 Focus yesterday...WITH AM Stereo (You have to get the "premium" system with MP3 playback). The response is no where as wide as my UX-1, but I do get decent audio off of KCJJ. Speaking of...have they added some talk? I can only get them at night, and their new jingles say "Hot hits, hot talk KCJJ" (or something to that effect) -Brad Jackson -Susquehanna, Indianapolis -WGLD/WGRL/WFMS -www.indyradio.com From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Jan 31 00:48:35 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 31 Jan 2003 08:48:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 99698 invoked from network); 31 Jan 2003 08:48:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Jan 2003 08:48:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jan 2003 08:48:35 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.151] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Jan 2003 08:48:34 -0000 Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 08:48:33 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: AM Stereo at its Ultimate Best Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <39.3332602d.2b6b80dd@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 530 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.72.29 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > I could have sworn that the WOR-HD samples would have counted as > real world. They are in all intent and purpose recordings of what > is being transmitted..(real world). WOR's talk samples were "real world", but their music samples were recorded with a CD player hooked up directly to the IBOC exciter, and with the transmitter running into a dummy load; during this time, WOR's normal on-air programming was running on their backup transmitter, the old Continental. Or at least this is how Mr. Ray described it to me. From amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Fri Jan 31 01:04:31 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 59715 invoked from network); 31 Jan 2003 09:04:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Jan 2003 09:04:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jan 2003 09:04:31 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: notify@yahoogroups.com Received: from [66.218.67.181] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Jan 2003 09:04:31 -0000 Date: 31 Jan 2003 09:04:29 -0000 Message-ID: <1044003869.540889.30475.w58@yahoogroups.com> X-eGroups-Application: files X-Yahoo-Group-Post: system From: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: New file uploaded to amstereoforum MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello, This email message is a notification to let you know that a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the amstereoforum group. File : /ultramst2.mp3 Uploaded by : kevtronics Description : Another MP3 recording of ultimate hi-fi AM Stereo, with the same equipment and setup as "ultramst.mp3". You can access this file at the URL http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum/files/ultramst2.mp3 To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/files Regards, kevtronics From KC4QLP@aol.com Fri Jan 31 05:38:39 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 31 Jan 2003 13:38:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 78915 invoked from network); 31 Jan 2003 13:38:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Jan 2003 13:38:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r09.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.105) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jan 2003 13:38:37 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r09.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.15e.1b0a85f2 (3972) for ; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 08:38:34 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <15e.1b0a85f2.2b6bd659@aol.com> Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 08:38:33 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Kahn is still my hero To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 1/31/03 2:47:38 AM Eastern Standard Time, amfmdx@fastq.com writes: > >http://www.rwonline.com/dailynews/one.php?id=2547 > >That's what I think you're looking for. > Oh me!...the news byte is based on something from an internet chat group?? Which group and has anyone offically seen anything filed with the Commission on this yet? I'd be careful about putting much stock into basically what appears to be hear say right now. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From dwtpa97@earthlink.net Fri Jan 31 05:47:30 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dwtpa97@earthlink.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 31 Jan 2003 13:47:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 50212 invoked from network); 31 Jan 2003 13:47:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Jan 2003 13:47:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO falcon.mail.pas.earthlink.net) (207.217.120.74) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jan 2003 13:47:29 -0000 Received: from sdn-ap-012scfairp0025.dialsprint.net ([63.189.176.25] helo=earthlink.net) by falcon.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 18ebVw-0006Gd-00 for amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 05:47:29 -0800 Message-ID: <3E3A7EB8.BB78B3E6@earthlink.net> Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 08:48:40 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.79 [en]C-CCK-MCD NSCPCD472 (Windows NT 5.0; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Senate Hearings on Radio Consolidation References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: dwtpa97 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38076959 For anyone who may be interested, in this morning's paper it says that Senator John McCain has been holding hearings in the Senate regarding possible adverse effects of consolidation in the radio market, specifically mentioning Clear Channel Communications. Dick W. If anyone wants to pass on any comments to Senator McCain, his website address is: http://mccain.senate.gov/ From groucho@skyweb.net Fri Jan 31 06:51:41 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 31 Jan 2003 14:51:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 13142 invoked from network); 31 Jan 2003 14:51:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Jan 2003 14:51:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jan 2003 14:51:40 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (tc1-49.skyweb.net [66.6.130.177]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h0VExeOD002187; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 09:59:40 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3E3A8B54.EFFA0059@skyweb.net> Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 09:42:28 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kerry Richards " Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Any stations using Kahn ? References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 > Hi Kerry > Part of the problem > for WWRL is some NJ Turnpike TIS station running at 1610khz, how that > got through the FCC is hard to understand. You think that's bad.. That TIS is on the First adjacent Of WWRL... In February of 2002 the FCC licensed a TIS station for the NJ Turnpike on 1680 kHz right near you at Exit 16... which is still in my protected Contour. try to figure that one out. we have been fighting it since we bought the station.... I am just waiting for them to File for a TIS station on 710 kHz down around Exit 7a or exit 6 and See what happens LOL... How Do I get rid of them???? Its driving Me Nuts.... How do think I feel having a TIS Right on my Frequency In My Contour... its just as bad as them setting Up an IBOC station Down in Maryland On 1670 with its IBOC sideband on 1680 when Its on I lost all My Southern listeners. I want Ibiquity to put a 1 Kw IBOC test station on 700 out in nassau or suffolk County and See what happens... To me that's a real Live test of the system... Nothing against WOR.. But Its ok For them to do this to WTTM... I don't think so But they are Getting away with it... BTW I'm talking about the FCC approving all this and Getting away with It.. frustrated Neal From michaelj@vcn.com Fri Jan 31 07:18:51 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 31 Jan 2003 15:18:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 78959 invoked from network); 31 Jan 2003 15:18:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Jan 2003 15:18:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m1-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.31) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jan 2003 15:18:50 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m1-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 08:18:50 -0700 Message-ID: <004c01c2c93c$0c704420$0701010a@keva> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: AM Stereo at its Ultimate Best Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 08:18:45 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Good show Kevin! This stuff sounds marvelous!!! This is how good AM really CAN sound. I know that our engineer tells me stories about prior to 16 years ago before the 10khz NRSC brick wall was instated. At that time we had an old Raytheon transmitter....it's still in our storage unit somewhere. He said that thing had BETTER THAN FM quality. He said it was amazing and made our AM sound better than our FM. He said response was out to about 16 or 17khz. That goes to show you what AM CAN do. No one's saying you CAN'T get high fidelity audio from AM. But the repurcussions suffered include a LOT of splatter onto adjacent frequencies. LOTS more than when the NRSC instituted the 10khz cutoff. It CAN be done, but doesn't make much sense to do it. Add in the fact that if we DID go all the way up to 16khz, that would sound wonderful.....but the receivers we'd have to be able to pick up this wonderful sound would have barn-door bandwidth. You got a local station, and you'd be able to hear noise and splatter from that local station for 60,80 ...even 100khz on either side of it. Talk about no selectivity, huh. Then the beauty of FM came around. Now you could get that same 15khz of response, yet only interfere with the next .2 megahertz on either side of ya. Wow! And no line noise, no electrical noise, no lightning popping and stuff. Trust me, I remember. I grew up listening to AM in the 80s. I still LOVE AM. But these are observations of the whole world, and myself. I remember thinking the same things...and I was only 10...11...12 years old. He he..I also remember that turning the radio to FM was the only way to tune a station and make the little red light come on. I had no idea what that little red light meant, but I knew it would make it come on :) That was the FM Stereo indicator. I guess my point here (gee, Mike DO YOU have a point???) is that yes, it CAN be done. AM CAN sound that good, but the results would be deadly and with as crowded as the AM Band is today, everyone would be splattering all over everyone. (almost sounds like IBOC, huh?? :) ) Oh...FYI...the old Raytheon was put to rest in 1987 when they bought the McMartin BA-1K. We are actually licensed to 880 watts, and not 1000. So our McMartin sounds better than most of them because we're running it a touch under-power. Even at 133% it's quite clean. I installed the AM Stereo Exciter in August of last year and it sounds beautiful. MJR n WYO [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From jbyrns@enteract.com Fri Jan 31 07:36:47 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 31 Jan 2003 15:36:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 95697 invoked from network); 31 Jan 2003 15:36:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Jan 2003 15:36:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.66) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jan 2003 15:36:46 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.250] by n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Jan 2003 15:36:46 -0000 Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 15:36:46 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Question To Tom Ray Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 903 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.153 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "bradleyj923 " < bjackson@i...> wrote: > > And, I'm happy to report, I just picked up my 2003 Focus > yesterday...WITH AM Stereo (You have to get the "premium" system with > MP3 playback). The response is no where as wide as my UX-1, but I do > get decent audio off of KCJJ. The UX-1 is not a good point of reference because it varied so much over the years it was available. I had 1985 and 1992 UX-1's, both in the same make and model of car, and they couldn't have been more different in their audio response. The 1985 UX-1 was just about perfect, having what I would consider normal response in the narrow band position, and a nice wide response in the wide band position. In contrast the 1992 model was very muffled, the narrow position being super narrow, and "wide band" position still being noticeably lacking in highs. John From philipr@irac.pe.ca Fri Jan 31 07:49:43 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 31 Jan 2003 15:49:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 4301 invoked from network); 31 Jan 2003 15:49:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Jan 2003 15:49:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.64) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jan 2003 15:49:42 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.173] by n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Jan 2003 15:49:42 -0000 Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 15:49:41 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Question To Tom Ray Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1479 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking Point number 1 - a good reason to buy a Ford Focus! My wife had a rental Focus with the standard radio CD combo, and even the mono AM had amazingly decent bandwidth. Goes to show that its not only Marv who still makes CQUAM AM Stereo radios!!! Point number 2 - my ebay Delco UX-1 finally arrived last night - its a 12 pin 1989 model - so assuming it works, it should sound great. Hopefully the best $13.50 US I've ever spent! lol Phil R. --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "bradleyj923 " < > bjackson@i...> wrote: > > > > And, I'm happy to report, I just picked up my 2003 Focus > > yesterday...WITH AM Stereo (You have to get the "premium" system with > > MP3 playback). The response is no where as wide as my UX-1, but I do > > get decent audio off of KCJJ. > > The UX-1 is not a good point of reference because it varied so much > over the years it was available. I had 1985 and 1992 UX-1's, both in > the same make and model of car, and they couldn't have been more > different in their audio response. The 1985 UX-1 was just about > perfect, having what I would consider normal response in the narrow > band position, and a nice wide response in the wide band position. In > contrast the 1992 model was very muffled, the narrow position being > super narrow, and "wide band" position still being noticeably lacking > in highs. > > John From tomray@wor710.com Fri Jan 31 07:52:30 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 90581 invoked from network); 31 Jan 2003 15:52:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Jan 2003 15:52:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jan 2003 15:52:29 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: tomray@wor710.com Received: from [66.218.67.184] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Jan 2003 15:52:25 -0000 X-Sender: tomray@wor710.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 31 Jan 2003 15:07:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 58040 invoked from network); 31 Jan 2003 15:07:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Jan 2003 15:07:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jan 2003 15:07:21 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.253] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Jan 2003 15:07:14 -0000 Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 15:07:14 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Question To Tom Ray Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3236 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wortomray " X-Originating-IP: 151.202.41.185 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=136489311 X-Yahoo-Profile: wortomray X-eGroups-Edited-By: kevtronics X-eGroups-Approved-By: kevtronics via web; 31 Jan 2003 15:52:25 -0000 The short answer......they're building a golf course. Really. Now that you've finished laughing, here's the long answer. The area where the WOR site is built used to be a dump (uh, oh....Warning of New Jersey Cheap Shot coming!), but that describes New Jersey (ba-dum....CHING!). Seriously, the area was a dump, about 800 acres or so, extending from Lyndhurst south, and encompassing areas of 3 towns. The state of NJ has been trying for years to get the landowners to clean up their lands.....WOR's 40 acre piece of cesspool would have been about $80 Million, and, as you can imagine, Buckley's response was 2 words, the first starting with the letter "F". Fill in the blanks. So...along comes this company that leases old dumps from state agencies......environmentally cleans and caps the dumps, then develops the land. In this instance, the 800 or so acres will become 3 golf courses, office buildings, condos, time share condos, a convention center, several hotels and a train station. SO WOR is getting the boot. We are relocating an entire 2500 feet north, and expect to be breaking ground mid March. The area we are relocating to has never been developed (or been a dump), and is virgin swamp land. The deeper null is not our idea. Even though we are being forcibly relocated, the FCC has decided that they want us to pull our null in deeper anyway....the old 10% ratchet down provision. So, unfortunately, our NW-N coverage won't be what it used to be. But the good news is that everything will be new......transmitters, phasor, antenna system, generator, support equipment. So in that aspect, life will be good. Regarding our present antenna, it was renovated in 1997. So much for lasting renovations. --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " wrote: > Speaking of major nulls, I notice on the FCC web site that WOR has > an application for a new antenna array From tomray@wor710.com Fri Jan 31 07:52:39 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 14886 invoked from network); 31 Jan 2003 15:52:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Jan 2003 15:52:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.83) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jan 2003 15:52:38 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: tomray@wor710.com Received: from [66.218.67.175] by n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Jan 2003 15:52:38 -0000 X-Sender: tomray@wor710.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 31 Jan 2003 15:08:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 55748 invoked from network); 31 Jan 2003 15:08:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Jan 2003 15:08:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.67) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jan 2003 15:08:09 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.136] by n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Jan 2003 15:08:08 -0000 Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 15:08:07 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Station List Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 611 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wortomray " X-Originating-IP: 151.202.41.185 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=136489311 X-Yahoo-Profile: wortomray X-eGroups-Approved-By: kevtronics via web; 31 Jan 2003 15:52:38 -0000 WFBL is a Buckley station. I approved the removal, so I am associated with that station. --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: > > You should take WFBL, Syracuse off your list. Exciter smoked > > several months ago and it was relegated to mono. > > Hmm... I don't mean to "out" anyone, but I believe someone associated > with 1050 WFBL (at least going by their e-mail address) just recently > joined this group. > > If they're reading this, perhaps they can enlighten us about the > status of WFBL, and if/when they might return to AM Stereo? From tomray@wor710.com Fri Jan 31 07:52:51 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 5654 invoked from network); 31 Jan 2003 15:52:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Jan 2003 15:52:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.87) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jan 2003 15:52:50 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: tomray@wor710.com Received: from [66.218.67.188] by n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Jan 2003 15:52:50 -0000 X-Sender: tomray@wor710.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 31 Jan 2003 15:11:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 81809 invoked from network); 31 Jan 2003 15:11:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Jan 2003 15:11:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.84) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jan 2003 15:11:51 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.157] by n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Jan 2003 15:11:50 -0000 Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 15:11:50 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: The Wrath of Kahn Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 505 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wortomray " X-Originating-IP: 151.202.41.185 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=136489311 X-Yahoo-Profile: wortomray X-eGroups-Approved-By: kevtronics via web; 31 Jan 2003 15:52:46 -0000 But don't forget....Mr. Castro has no high powered transmitters in Cuba.........and I have a bridge here in NYC I can sell you cheap. > > From here, it's a tie during the day and then when 710 in Miami powers and > changing patterns at night, all I hear on 710 in Cuba (with a hint of Miami > in the background) > > _________________________________________________________________ > Tired of spam? Get advanced junk mail protection with MSN 8. > http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail From jbyrns@enteract.com Fri Jan 31 08:01:59 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 31 Jan 2003 16:01:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 93954 invoked from network); 31 Jan 2003 16:01:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Jan 2003 16:01:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jan 2003 16:01:55 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.171] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Jan 2003 16:01:40 -0000 Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 16:01:39 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Question To Tom Ray Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 513 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.153 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Phil Rafuse " < philipr@i...> wrote: > > Point number 2 - my ebay Delco UX-1 finally arrived last night - its > a 12 pin 1989 model - so assuming it works, it should sound great. > Hopefully the best $13.50 US I've ever spent! lol What is a "12 pin" model? Is "12 pins" good or bad? My $5.00 eBay UX-1 is still waiting in the basement to be fired up, if it even works. I think it is an early version, how do I tell if it is a "12 pin" model? John From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Jan 31 08:19:19 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 31 Jan 2003 16:19:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 2564 invoked from network); 31 Jan 2003 16:19:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Jan 2003 16:19:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jan 2003 16:19:19 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.250] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Jan 2003 16:19:17 -0000 Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 16:19:14 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: AM Stereo at its Ultimate Best Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <004c01c2c93c$0c704420$0701010a@keva> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2515 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > This is how good AM really CAN sound. I know that our engineer > tells me stories about prior to 16 years ago before the 10khz NRSC > brick wall was instated. It is still possible to have excellent sound quality even within the 10.2 kHz NRSC limit. It's mostly a matter of having clean, finely- tuned audio processing. In this regard, you can subjectively exceed the quality of many FM stations, which process often their audio so aggressively that it results in a noticeable and annoying amount of distortion, "pumping", and a narrowed Stereo image. This seems to be at its worst in the NYC area, and there are numerous AM stations I can tune to on a GE Superadio III and deliver audio much better than any of the FM stations, except maybe Jazz 88.3 WGBO and 96.3 WQXR (Classical music). Also, perceptual audio encoding systems, such as what IBOC and XM/Sirius use, make use of "Spatial Band Replication" to create "simulated" high frequencies based on harmonics of the lower frequencies. When done correctly, the effect can be surprisingly realistic. However, in relation to analog AM, it is also possible to do this *in reverse*. Using digital techniques, you can easily take the audio in the 10-15 kHz region that the NRSC filter would normally cut off, and "mirror" it in the 5-10 kHz range where it would be audible on normal AM radios with no change in their design needed. I've experimented with this, and the effect is not as artificial- sounding as you might think. High treble sounds in music are often just forms of white noise, which can easily be extended downwards from 10 kHz and still sound realistic, providing a more crisp sound to percussion. This also allows high treble sound effects like crystal chimes and tambourine rasps that would normally get cut off by the NRSC filter to be heard, without exceeding the 10 kHz bandwidth. I've even encountered one pop music song which has a sound effect of "S.O.S." tapped out in Morse code using a *12 kHz* tone; with a reverse-SBR system, this would be mirrored down to 8 kHz, allowing it to be heard over a standard AM station. I'll post some samples of this when I get a chance. One catch is that you can only really "mirror" the audio up to 15 kHz, as many songs contain a 15.7 kHz "pilot tone" -- caused by the refresh rate of any TVs that may have been in use at the time of recording -- and if you allow this to get "mirrored", it would show up as an annoying 4.3 kHz tone. From michaelj@vcn.com Fri Jan 31 08:25:52 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 31 Jan 2003 16:25:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 56218 invoked from network); 31 Jan 2003 16:25:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Jan 2003 16:25:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m2-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.32) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jan 2003 16:25:47 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m2-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 09:25:47 -0700 Message-ID: <006401c2c945$66f12000$0701010a@keva> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Question To Tom Ray Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 09:25:41 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I think ( help me here guys ) that the 12-pin you're talking about has 3 separate plugs that are on top of each other to plug into those 12 pins. If you look at it, you'll see 3 groups of 4 contacts. They are "blade" type contacts....not actual "pins". This is how mine is. Configuration should be etched right on the top of the receiver. If this is the one you have then you have the one that sounds AWESOME!! MJR n WYO ----- Original Message ----- From: John To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, January 31, 2003 9:01 AM Subject: {AMSF} Re: Question To Tom Ray --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Phil Rafuse " < philipr@i...> wrote: > > Point number 2 - my ebay Delco UX-1 finally arrived last night - its > a 12 pin 1989 model - so assuming it works, it should sound great. > Hopefully the best $13.50 US I've ever spent! lol What is a "12 pin" model? Is "12 pins" good or bad? My $5.00 eBay UX-1 is still waiting in the basement to be fired up, if it even works. I think it is an early version, how do I tell if it is a "12 pin" model? John Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ADVERTISEMENT Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From jbyrns@enteract.com Fri Jan 31 08:28:40 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 31 Jan 2003 16:28:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 60373 invoked from network); 31 Jan 2003 16:28:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Jan 2003 16:28:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.89) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jan 2003 16:28:39 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.137] by n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Jan 2003 16:28:39 -0000 Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 16:28:39 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: AM Stereo at its Ultimate Best Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1449 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.153 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " < kevtronics@y...> wrote: > > AM stereo has to live in the real world of AM transmission systems, > > noise, and propagation problems, what do these recordings prove? > > You could ask the same thing about the samples of IBOC that have been > posted so far -- they were similarly made in ideal "laboratory" > conditions. Most digital audio systems either work, or they don't work, the sound quality in the "laboratory" is the same as the sound quality in the "real world", unless the transmission system protects some bits more than others, then it can gradually degrade. Is the "HD radio" system of this latter type? If not, you test is not fair, as the sound quality of an analog AM signal is dependent on the radio "RF" circuitry, and especially on interference that may be received by the signal. > But the real point for these AM Stereo recordings is to demonstrate > that once you have them both on an equal playing field, IBOC/"HD > Radio" simply cannot match up to analog AM Stereo in terms of true > high-fidelity audio reproduction. Given the differences between analog and digital signals, your supposed leveling of the playing field, is really tilting the playing field to give the analog system an advantage. The public will not have the advantage of your special playing field, and will perceive the true situation, what ever that may be. John From krichards@wor710.com Fri Jan 31 08:49:44 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 97833 invoked from network); 31 Jan 2003 16:49:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Jan 2003 16:49:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.88) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jan 2003 16:49:44 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: krichards@wor710.com Received: from [66.218.67.180] by n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Jan 2003 16:49:42 -0000 X-Sender: krichards@wor710.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 31 Jan 2003 16:07:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 45573 invoked from network); 31 Jan 2003 16:07:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Jan 2003 16:07:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO buckleyradio.com) (161.58.14.6) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jan 2003 16:07:34 -0000 Received: from kerrydesk (pool-151-202-41-185.ny5030.east.verizon.net [151.202.41.185]) by buckleyradio.com (8.11.6) id h0VG7HD10964; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 11:07:17 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <002101c2c942$08cef2c0$2a01010a@kerrydesk> To: "Neal Newman" , References: <3E3A8B54.EFFA0059@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Any stations using Kahn ? Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 11:01:31 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Kerry Richards" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=136545831 X-Yahoo-Profile: kerryrichards710 X-eGroups-Approved-By: kevtronics via web; 31 Jan 2003 16:49:39 -0000 Neal, I really understand your issues and I can well understand why you are upset, but who are you using for a communications attorney in D.C.? Obviously, you were or are not being properly represented at the FCC. It just seems to me that anything in your protected contour should be kicked off. The Maryland issue is another thing though...that's obviously not your city of license. If I were you I'd fight this thing all the way...it makes no sense. There are plenty of other allocations that Turnpike could use. How about 780khz or 760 khz (ha, ha,).... Kerry.... ----- Original Message ----- From: "Neal Newman" To: ; Sent: Friday, January 31, 2003 9:42 AM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Any stations using Kahn ? > > Hi Kerry > > > Part of the problem > > for WWRL is some NJ Turnpike TIS station running at 1610khz, how that > > got through the FCC is hard to understand. > > You think that's bad.. That TIS is on the First adjacent Of WWRL... > In February of 2002 the FCC licensed a TIS station for the NJ Turnpike on > 1680 kHz right near you at Exit 16... which is still in my protected > Contour. try to figure that one out. we have been fighting it > since we bought the station.... I am just waiting for them to File for a TIS > station on 710 kHz down around Exit 7a or exit 6 and See what happens > LOL... > How Do I get rid of them???? Its driving Me Nuts.... How do think I feel > having a TIS Right on my Frequency In My Contour... its just as bad as them > setting Up an IBOC station Down in Maryland > On 1670 with its IBOC sideband on 1680 when Its on I lost all My Southern > listeners. > I want Ibiquity to put a 1 Kw IBOC test station on 700 out in nassau or > suffolk County > and See what happens... To me that's a real Live test of the system... > Nothing against WOR.. > But Its ok For them to do this to WTTM... I don't think so But they are > Getting away with it... > BTW I'm talking about the FCC approving all this and Getting away with It.. > > frustrated > Neal > > From droach@direct.ca Fri Jan 31 09:31:43 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: droach@direct.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 31 Jan 2003 17:31:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 60115 invoked from network); 31 Jan 2003 17:31:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Jan 2003 17:31:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO priv-edtnes03-hme0.telusplanet.net) (199.185.220.220) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jan 2003 17:31:42 -0000 Received: from dan.direct.ca ([64.180.122.175]) by priv-edtnes03-hme0.telusplanet.net (InterMail vM.5.01.05.17 201-253-122-126-117-20021021) with ESMTP id <20030131173141.GFMT19405.priv-edtnes03-hme0.telusplanet.net@dan.direct.ca> for ; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 10:31:41 -0700 Message-Id: <5.1.0.14.1.20030131093139.027a5990@mail.direct.ca> X-Sender: droach@direct.ca@mail.direct.ca X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 09:33:40 -0800 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: The death of AM stereo? In-Reply-To: References: <1a0.1006497c.2b6b73b3@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed From: Dan Roach X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=75892843 X-Yahoo-Profile: rastadudeca The C-QUAM exciters and modulation monitors that radio stations use develop and decode the C-QUAM signal using common generic integrated circuits... lots of 2 and 4 quadrant multipliers, and a sprinkling of CMOS and ECL chips. I've never seen one that used a custom C-QUAM decoder chip... From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Jan 31 09:46:35 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 31 Jan 2003 17:46:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 92712 invoked from network); 31 Jan 2003 17:46:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Jan 2003 17:46:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jan 2003 17:46:34 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.161] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Jan 2003 17:46:34 -0000 Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 17:46:33 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: The death of AM stereo? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.1.20030131093139.027a5990@mail.direct.ca> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 801 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > The C-QUAM exciters and modulation monitors that radio stations use > develop and decode the C-QUAM signal using common generic integrated > circuits... lots of 2 and 4 quadrant multipliers, and a sprinkling > of CMOS and ECL chips. I've never seen one that used a custom > C-QUAM decoder chip... I peeked inside my Panasonic multi-system AM Stereo generator. The ICs are dated 1984, and it looks like a computer motherboard from that time -- lots and lots of "simple"-looking ICs, mostly 16 or 18 pins. There is nothing glaringly "custom" or "proprietary" about its circuitry. I also have pictures showing the inside of a true-blue Motorola C-Quam exciter and mod monitor, which I found on an eBay auction. I'll add them to the Photos section here when I get a chance. From scott.toenniessen@fmr.com Fri Jan 31 10:42:57 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: scott.toenniessen@fmr.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 31 Jan 2003 18:42:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 64614 invoked from network); 31 Jan 2003 18:42:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Jan 2003 18:42:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.78) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jan 2003 18:42:56 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.142] by n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Jan 2003 18:42:55 -0000 Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 18:42:54 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Station List Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 729 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "spt87a " X-Originating-IP: 204.110.135.35 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=133257283 X-Yahoo-Profile: spt87a --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: > > You should take WFBL, Syracuse off your list. Exciter smoked > > several months ago and it was relegated to mono. > > Hmm... I don't mean to "out" anyone, but I believe someone associated > with 1050 WFBL (at least going by their e-mail address) just recently > joined this group. > > If they're reading this, perhaps they can enlighten us about the > status of WFBL, and if/when they might return to AM Stereo? I was just in that area on Jan 1. and they were stereo doing there new news/talk format. If it fried several months ago, they must have either fixed it or it fried within the last couple of weeks. - Scott From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Jan 31 10:55:01 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 31 Jan 2003 18:55:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 62864 invoked from network); 31 Jan 2003 18:55:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Jan 2003 18:55:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jan 2003 18:55:00 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.189] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Jan 2003 18:55:00 -0000 Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 18:54:58 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: 1050 WFBL - Stereo or not? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 418 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > I was just in that area on Jan 1. and they were stereo doing their > new news/talk format. If it fried several months ago, they must > have either fixed it or it fried within the last couple of weeks. I just checked the directory, and we do have a member here with an "@wfbl.com" e-mail address... if you're reading this, it would be appreciated if you could enlighten us about WFBL's Stereo status! From bjackson@indyradio.com Fri Jan 31 11:44:31 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 31 Jan 2003 19:44:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 82597 invoked from network); 31 Jan 2003 19:44:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Jan 2003 19:44:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jan 2003 19:44:25 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.158] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Jan 2003 19:44:25 -0000 Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 19:44:25 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Question To Tom Ray Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 995 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923 " X-Originating-IP: 64.25.100.36 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " wrote: > The UX-1 is not a good point of reference because it varied so much > over the years it was available. I had 1985 and 1992 UX-1's, both in > the same make and model of car, and they couldn't have been more > different in their audio response. The 1985 UX-1 was just about > perfect, having what I would consider normal response in the narrow > band position, and a nice wide response in the wide band position. In > contrast the 1992 model was very muffled, the narrow position being > super narrow, and "wide band" position still being noticeably lacking > in highs. > > John OK...My 1988 UX-1. It had very good sound in narrow band, and in wide band stere it was close to the GE SR III (Wide as a freakin' barn door!) It seems from co-workers' cars, you are right...the newer the UX-1, the narrower it got. - Brad Jackson - Susquehanna, Indianapolis - WGLD/WGRL/WFMS - www.indyradio.com From tomray@wor710.com Fri Jan 31 15:07:12 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 93817 invoked from network); 31 Jan 2003 23:07:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Jan 2003 23:07:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.67) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jan 2003 23:07:10 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: tomray@wor710.com Received: from [66.218.67.165] by n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Jan 2003 23:07:08 -0000 X-Sender: tomray@wor710.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 31 Jan 2003 20:53:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 95543 invoked from network); 31 Jan 2003 20:53:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Jan 2003 20:53:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.67) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jan 2003 20:53:41 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.143] by n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Jan 2003 20:53:41 -0000 Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 20:53:41 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: 1050 WFBL - Stereo or not? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 789 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wortomray " X-Originating-IP: 151.202.41.185 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=136489311 X-Yahoo-Profile: wortomray X-eGroups-Approved-By: kevtronics via web; 31 Jan 2003 23:07:07 -0000 Kevin: The WFBL email goes through our server, and I'm the ISP. I just looked at their email addresses.......the person registered doesn't exist, so I don't know how he got a yahoo ID. I also emailed the account to make sure....it got bounced. --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: > > I was just in that area on Jan 1. and they were stereo doing their > > > > new news/talk format. If it fried several months ago, they must > > > > have either fixed it or it fried within the last couple of weeks. > > > > > I just checked the directory, and we do have a member here with an > "@wfbl.com" e-mail address... if you're reading this, it would be > appreciated if you could enlighten us about WFBL's Stereo status! From tomray@wor710.com Fri Jan 31 15:08:13 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 15505 invoked from network); 31 Jan 2003 23:08:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Jan 2003 23:08:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jan 2003 23:08:04 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: tomray@wor710.com Received: from [66.218.67.186] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Jan 2003 23:08:04 -0000 X-Sender: tomray@wor710.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 31 Jan 2003 20:49:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 83436 invoked from network); 31 Jan 2003 20:49:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Jan 2003 20:49:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jan 2003 20:49:44 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.156] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Jan 2003 20:49:44 -0000 Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 20:49:44 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Station List Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1081 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wortomray " X-Originating-IP: 151.202.41.185 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=136489311 X-Yahoo-Profile: wortomray X-eGroups-Approved-By: kevtronics via web; 31 Jan 2003 23:08:04 -0000 Don't know what you were listening to, but there is no AM stereo exciter installed on their Harris SX-2.5. It was removed, and I walked their CE into reconfiguration of their Optimod for mono operation. --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "spt87a " wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " > wrote: > > > You should take WFBL, Syracuse off your list. Exciter smoked > > > several months ago and it was relegated to mono. > > > > Hmm... I don't mean to "out" anyone, but I believe someone > associated > > with 1050 WFBL (at least going by their e-mail address) just > recently > > joined this group. > > > > If they're reading this, perhaps they can enlighten us about the > > status of WFBL, and if/when they might return to AM Stereo? > > I was just in that area on Jan 1. and they were stereo doing there > new news/talk format. If it fried several months ago, they must > have either fixed it or it fried within the last couple of weeks. > > - Scott From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Jan 31 15:25:01 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 31 Jan 2003 23:25:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 10532 invoked from network); 31 Jan 2003 23:25:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Jan 2003 23:25:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jan 2003 23:25:00 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.151] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Jan 2003 23:25:00 -0000 Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 23:24:59 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Station List Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1477 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.80.9 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Don't know what you were listening to, but there is no AM stereo > exciter installed on their Harris SX-2.5. It was removed, and I > walked their CE into reconfiguration of their Optimod for mono > operation. Speaking of the upstate NY area, the last time I checked, 1150 WRUN in Utica was transmitting C-Quam Stereo with only one audio channel active, and the pilot tone turned off -- you could call it a form of "C-Quam PowerSide", but with no useful purpose. Somebody should relinquish their C-Quam exciter, refurbish it if necessary, and put it in the hands of an engineer who can make proper use of it at another station. Also, it seems that numerous stations possess unused C-Quam exciters, and it would actually benefit the causes of *both* analog AM Stereo and IBOC/"HD Radio" if these were dusted off and put back to use. AM stations need to meet AM Stereo quality standards in order successfully transmit IBOC, so installation of economical used C-Quam equipment would be good "practice" for any mono station that has interest in IBOC; in the meantime until if/when IBOC becomes a reality for them, use of C-Quam would benefit their listeners (especially if it is true that the new Visteon radios will support both C-Quam and IBOC on AM). And, in the event that IBOC does not become a success, they would already be delivering the highest quality signal to their listeners, at least until something better comes along (DRM? Eureka 147?). From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Jan 31 15:43:33 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 31 Jan 2003 23:43:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 88311 invoked from network); 31 Jan 2003 23:43:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 31 Jan 2003 23:43:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.87) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 31 Jan 2003 23:43:32 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.139] by n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 31 Jan 2003 23:43:30 -0000 Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 23:43:27 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: IBOC analog audio - 5 kHz vs. 6.2 kHz? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1121 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.80.9 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > On a normal AM station this radio [the new Visteon IBOC car radio] > uses signal strength to open up the bandwidth. So listening to WINS > or WCBS they sound pretty good. I'd say at least to 6khz or so. > Pretty funny like this coming from Ibiquity with their 5khz brick > wall. Perhaps you or Tom can clarify for us... is use of the 5 kHz filter at night (with IBOC off) mandated by iBiquity? I ask because it would be in WOR's own best interest to use the 6.2 kHz filter at night (like you did when you first started using IBOC), since these Visteon "HD" radios would apparently be able to capture the full response, and this slightly higher filter also does not suffer from the "ringing" distortion that the Optimod's 5 kHz filter has. But, iBiquity's own statements regarding the 5 kHz filter are quite contradictory; on one hand, they say using the 5 kHz filter at night (with IBOC off) will benefit listeners by reducing adjacent channel interference... but on the other hand, during the day when the IBOC carriers are on, apparently adjacent channel interference isn't a concern for them at all? From jsgil@hal-pc.org Fri Jan 31 18:25:54 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 1 Feb 2003 02:25:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 66173 invoked from network); 1 Feb 2003 02:25:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Feb 2003 02:25:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.75) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Feb 2003 02:25:53 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.169] by n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Feb 2003 02:25:52 -0000 Date: Sat, 01 Feb 2003 02:25:52 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Station List Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 828 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.138 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: >=20 > Speaking of the upstate NY area, the last time I checked, 1150 WRUN=20 > in Utica was transmitting C-Quam Stereo with only one audio channel=20 > active, and the pilot tone turned off -- you could call it a form of=20 > "C-Quam PowerSide", but with no useful purpose.=20=20 There's no powerside effect to it at all. There is just one stereo channel transmitting with an envelope equal to their mono signal with all the spectrum spread from the C-QuAM process which is=20 at its maximum during heavy single channel modulation. Now If they had a matrix processor that audio phase shifted one of the stereo inputs by 90=B0 in relation to the other then you would probably have a better version of powerside than what the Kahn system does. JSG From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Jan 31 18:31:33 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 1 Feb 2003 02:31:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 98901 invoked from network); 1 Feb 2003 02:31:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Feb 2003 02:31:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Feb 2003 02:31:32 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-204.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.204]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h112VShF001811 for ; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 20:31:30 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <008e01c2c99a$4651aea0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Question To Tom Ray Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 20:33:13 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude They've actually had it for quite some time. They were carrying Laura Ingraham live at one point, but I think they dropped it. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: > -- KCJJ. Speaking of...have they added some > talk? I can only get them at night, and their new jingles say "Hot > hits, hot talk KCJJ" (or something to that effect) From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Jan 31 18:35:38 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 1 Feb 2003 02:35:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 11727 invoked from network); 1 Feb 2003 02:35:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Feb 2003 02:35:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Feb 2003 02:35:37 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-204.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.204]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h112ZYhF002748 for ; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 20:35:35 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <009401c2c99a$d8877de0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <004c01c2c93c$0c704420$0701010a@keva> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: AM Stereo at its Ultimate Best Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 20:37:18 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Whatever you do, DON'T trash that Raytheon. There are hams who'd love to get their mitts on it. I can direct you to a ham AM message board where you can advertise it. Would love to get it myself, but the funds aren't there. I've got one with a zorched mod choke. It would be nice to have a working unit to compare to when I refurbish the other. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael J. Richard" > > Oh...FYI...the old Raytheon was put to rest in 1987 when they bought the McMartin BA-1K. We are actually licensed to 880 watts, and not 1000. So our McMartin sounds better than most of them because we're running it a touch under-power. Even at 133% it's quite clean. > I installed the AM Stereo Exciter in August of last year and it sounds beautiful. From krichards@wor710.com Fri Jan 31 18:51:56 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 52660 invoked from network); 1 Feb 2003 02:51:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Feb 2003 02:51:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.78) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Feb 2003 02:51:55 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: krichards@wor710.com Received: from [66.218.67.152] by n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Feb 2003 02:51:54 -0000 X-Sender: krichards@wor710.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 1 Feb 2003 01:00:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 37527 invoked from network); 1 Feb 2003 01:00:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Feb 2003 01:00:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.64) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Feb 2003 01:00:14 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.132] by n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Feb 2003 01:00:14 -0000 Date: Sat, 01 Feb 2003 01:00:11 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: IBOC analog audio - 5 kHz vs. 6.2 kHz? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2602 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kerry Richards " X-Originating-IP: 66.47.86.250 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=136545831 X-Yahoo-Profile: kerryrichards710 X-eGroups-Approved-By: kevtronics via web; 01 Feb 2003 02:51:50 -0000 No, we are looking for consistency. So 5khz is on the air 24/7. We are a talk station providing a 5khz legacy analog audio bandwidth period. Right now all of the listeners are in fact legacy listeners, since we have no HD radios yet. But in time, that will change. The 5khz signal is provided at 5khz so Ibiquity has a fair shot in completing their testing. Thereby allowing a complete coverage test for all the parties involved. If we kept it at 6.2khz the HD exciter reverts to a double sideband mode with less robustness, and for testing purposes this is not what we require. (We also overrun the lower digital carriers in the Magnitude channel at 6.2khz.) There are several manufacturers currently in the area working on the tests as well, so we have to play by Ibiquity's rules here. We expect the FCC to allow nightime IBOC service this year by the time the radios are out there so we do not feel this is an issue at present. Again the studies are proceeding and look favorable, remember the carriers during the initial IBOC tests at night do not seem to be as robust as everyone had previously thought. There is a 5- point plan to determine nightime operation of IBOC before the FCC. We just have to wait and see. The Visteon radio we are testing is Visteon's design and not Ibiquity's. It merely has their decoder chipset in it. I do not think Ibquity has considered anything in the analog area above 5khz, because the majority of AM radios they tested and have used in the van do not go much above 5khz. If there were more wideband AM radios out there this would be an issue, but current research says it is not. I know you don't like this but you ARE in the minority here. There are just not enough folks out there with wideband AM radios. Just as AM Stereo C-Quam signals have declined. Later this year it will get interesting, as the big boys here in NYC turn on the IBOC on their AM stations. By that time we will have a lot more data, and a good idea of how IBOC will be delivered at night and at what carrier level. So, for the forseeable future, WOR will be only providing a 5khz analog audio path on air. At present it is very doubtful we will transmit an analog NRSC 10khz signal ever again. We have started in earnest on our new stereo audio chain and studio refurb. We are waiting for the HD radios to get to the marketplace, and hope to be stereo by then. But there is a possibility someone else could beat us to the land of Stereo AM IBOC here in NYC. Time will tell. Kerry Richards Chief Engineer WOR-AM Buckley Broadcasting Corporation From tomray@wor710.com Fri Jan 31 18:52:53 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 13710 invoked from network); 1 Feb 2003 02:52:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Feb 2003 02:52:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.83) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Feb 2003 02:52:52 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: tomray@wor710.com Received: from [66.218.67.249] by n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Feb 2003 02:52:52 -0000 X-Sender: tomray@wor710.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 1 Feb 2003 01:38:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 78442 invoked from network); 1 Feb 2003 01:38:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Feb 2003 01:38:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Feb 2003 01:38:42 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.189] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Feb 2003 01:38:41 -0000 Date: Sat, 01 Feb 2003 01:38:39 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Station List Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1828 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wortomray " X-Originating-IP: 66.67.228.6 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=136489311 X-Yahoo-Profile: wortomray X-eGroups-Edited-By: kevtronics X-eGroups-Approved-By: kevtronics via web; 01 Feb 2003 02:52:49 -0000 C-QUAM modulation monitors make great pieces of test equipment, too. It's really easy to tune the transmitter for minimum IQM with a scope while programming is present. They come in very handy. --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: > AM stations need to meet AM Stereo quality standards in order > successfully transmit IBOC, so installation of economical used C-Quam > equipment would be good "practice" for any mono station that has > interest in IBOC; in the meantime until if/when IBOC becomes a > reality for them, use of C-Quam would benefit their listeners > (especially if it is true that the new Visteon radios will support > both C-Quam and IBOC on AM). And, in the event that IBOC does not > become a success, they would already be delivering the highest > quality signal to their listeners, at least until something better > comes along (DRM? Eureka 147?). From tomray@wor710.com Fri Jan 31 18:53:54 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 57706 invoked from network); 1 Feb 2003 02:53:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Feb 2003 02:53:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Feb 2003 02:53:54 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: tomray@wor710.com Received: from [66.218.67.145] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Feb 2003 02:53:54 -0000 X-Sender: tomray@wor710.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 1 Feb 2003 01:50:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 98949 invoked from network); 1 Feb 2003 01:50:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Feb 2003 01:50:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.87) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Feb 2003 01:50:50 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.253] by n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Feb 2003 01:50:50 -0000 Date: Sat, 01 Feb 2003 01:50:48 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: IBOC analog audio - 5 kHz vs. 6.2 kHz? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1676 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wortomray " X-Originating-IP: 66.67.228.6 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=136489311 X-Yahoo-Profile: wortomray X-eGroups-Approved-By: kevtronics via web; 01 Feb 2003 02:53:54 -0000 Kevin: We have a couple of reasons for keeping the audio bandwidth at one setting. One is that we really don't have any available remote control outputs to switch back and forth. I suppose it could be done with a relay to do multiple things, but we try to keep circuit paths as simple as possible. One less thing to go wrong. Another reason is that it isn't easy to remote the exciter filter switching. The exciter employs an audio filter "just in case" it's input exceeds bandwidth requirements, and also doubles as an instruction to the radio. It's extremely harsh and sounds absolutely awful.....plus produces spikes that cause overmodulation of the analog channel. If the exciter filtering didn't switch, the exciter would end up in the wrong mode. The exciter instructs the radio in what it needs to do.....for example, employing the 8kHz exciter filter tells the radio that the exciter is operating with this filter, and in this case, the HD radio will only operate if it aquires both sidebands at the same time. This makes the digital mode less robust than operating in the 5kHz mode, as the 5K mode only requires aquisition of one sideband. While this isn't a concern at the moment because the radios aren't available yet, it would screw up the testing that is going on. We also don't have the available status lights to tell the operator at the studio that everything is OK, so we wouldn't know if things are set up correctly after a switch. Lastly, keeping it in one mode is one less thing to go wrong. With the quality of operators available these days, the simpler the transmitter control can be, the better for everyone. From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Fri Jan 31 19:00:10 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 1 Feb 2003 03:00:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 68113 invoked from network); 1 Feb 2003 03:00:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Feb 2003 03:00:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14201.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.143) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Feb 2003 03:00:10 -0000 Message-ID: <20030201030010.75539.qmail@web14201.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [205.162.222.97] by web14201.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 19:00:10 PST Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 19:00:10 -0800 (PST) Subject: Kahn AMS new on the air 19Jan1983 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio Link to Kahn: http://www.amstereo.audio-stream.net/amstereo/files/stations/North-America/USA/Ohio/DualRadioISB-WSPD1370-ToledoOH-19Jan1983-%281%29.mp3 __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Fri Jan 31 19:09:40 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 1 Feb 2003 03:09:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 84190 invoked from network); 1 Feb 2003 03:09:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Feb 2003 03:09:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14201.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.143) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Feb 2003 03:09:40 -0000 Message-ID: <20030201030939.77348.qmail@web14201.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [205.162.222.97] by web14201.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 19:09:39 PST Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 19:09:39 -0800 (PST) Subject: WOR Engineering Staff To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio Tom Ray & staff: A sincere "Thank You" for taking the time to explain the 'behind the scenes' IBOC happenings at WOR-AM (HD). Most of us do want to be informed, as this is the AM Stereo group - in whatever form that may be - not necessarily just limited to C-Quam. __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From jon@kenneke.com Fri Jan 31 19:16:09 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jon@kenneke.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 1 Feb 2003 03:16:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 95370 invoked from network); 1 Feb 2003 03:16:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Feb 2003 03:16:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO kenneke.com) (65.103.64.194) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Feb 2003 03:16:09 -0000 Received: from localhost (jon@localhost) by kenneke.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h113G8R03091 for ; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 19:16:08 -0800 Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 19:16:08 -0800 (PST) To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} WOR Engineering Staff In-Reply-To: <20030201030939.77348.qmail@web14201.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: jon X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=77819664 X-Yahoo-Profile: jonkenneke I second that appreciation. The whole world (Well, maybe the country) is watching the WOR crew. If IBOC catches on, I may well end up having to install these systems, so this information is quite useful. And, I can say this, and still be an AMS fan. Jon On Fri, 31 Jan 2003, John P. wrote: > Tom Ray & staff: > A sincere "Thank You" for taking the time to explain the 'behind the scenes' > IBOC happenings at WOR-AM (HD). Most of us do want to be informed, as this is > the AM Stereo group - in whatever form that may be - not necessarily just > limited to C-Quam. -- Jon Kenneke, General Manager Kenneke Communications - http://www.kenneke.com PO Box 3126 - Albany, OR 97321-0702 Radio Takena KTK - http://www.radiotakena.org From JH_Radio@GameBox.net Fri Jan 31 19:41:32 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: JH_Radio@GameBox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 1 Feb 2003 03:41:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 8290 invoked from network); 1 Feb 2003 03:41:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Feb 2003 03:41:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO babyruth.hotpop.com) (204.57.55.14) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Feb 2003 03:41:31 -0000 Received: from gamebox.net (kubrick.hotpop.com [204.57.55.16]) by babyruth.hotpop.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 5B4EE21A00C for ; Sat, 1 Feb 2003 03:40:35 +0000 (UTC) Received: from -enduser.GameBox.net (pcp03184855pcs.benslm01.pa.comcast.net [68.80.77.117]) by smtp-1.hotpop.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2FCB92F8132 for ; Sat, 1 Feb 2003 03:34:43 +0000 (UTC) Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030131223810.02eac180@pop.GameBox.net> X-Sender: JH_Radio@pop.GameBox.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 22:38:54 -0500 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} WOR Engineering Staff In-Reply-To: References: <20030201030939.77348.qmail@web14201.mail.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-HotPOP: ----------------------------------------------- Sent By HotPOP.com FREE Email Get your FREE POP email at www.HotPOP.com ----------------------------------------------- From: John X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113800107 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Even though I'll admit I didn't understand alot of it, it was quite interesting. Thanks you guys. At 07:16 PM 1/31/03 -0800, you wrote: >I second that appreciation. The whole world (Well, maybe the country) is >watching the WOR crew. If IBOC catches on, I may well end up having to >install these systems, so this information is quite useful. > >And, I can say this, and still be an AMS fan. > >Jon > >On Fri, 31 Jan 2003, John P. wrote: > >> Tom Ray & staff: >> A sincere "Thank You" for taking the time to explain the 'behind the scenes' >> IBOC happenings at WOR-AM (HD). Most of us do want to be informed, as this is >> the AM Stereo group - in whatever form that may be - not necessarily just >> limited to C-Quam. > >-- >Jon Kenneke, General Manager >Kenneke Communications - http://www.kenneke.com >PO Box 3126 - Albany, OR 97321-0702 >Radio Takena KTK - http://www.radiotakena.org > > >Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Love in Christ: John Bensalem, PA Send me an email Aim: RainAngelsRule MSN: RainAngelsRule@hotmail.com My website Welcome to Napster4TheBlind "Prayer does not change God; it changes you." - Authur unknown [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From krichards@wor710.com Fri Jan 31 20:24:21 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 48721 invoked from network); 1 Feb 2003 04:24:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Feb 2003 04:24:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.88) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Feb 2003 04:24:20 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: krichards@wor710.com Received: from [66.218.67.156] by n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Feb 2003 04:24:20 -0000 X-Sender: krichards@wor710.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 1 Feb 2003 04:06:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 14923 invoked from network); 1 Feb 2003 04:06:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Feb 2003 04:06:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Feb 2003 04:06:23 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.174] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Feb 2003 04:06:22 -0000 Date: Sat, 01 Feb 2003 04:06:21 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: WOR Engineering Staff Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 4075 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kerry Richards " X-Originating-IP: 66.47.86.250 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=136545831 X-Yahoo-Profile: kerryrichards710 X-eGroups-Edited-By: kevtronics X-eGroups-Approved-By: kevtronics via web; 01 Feb 2003 04:24:18 -0000 Thanks Guys, this has been our immediate effort, just as was our recent WOR transmitter tour and HD demo. The idea being to get out the facts as we have them. This system in our humble estimation has a fighting chance once the bugs are worked out. This will be a major change for AM broadcasters and may be able to help many distressed AM operations all over the country, big and small. Many critics say about the current state of AM "if it works why change it? ", or "it has worked fine for 80 years, leave it alone". But there is also the old addage that if you have something someone wants to hear and can do a good job for your clients, listeners and advertisers will find you. If IBOC works, it will certainly help all AM Broadcasters, particularly since the audio results are so impressive because the listening and advertising public currently associate AM Radio with poor fidelity and pops, hums, clicks, and noises. We just have to work out all of the growing pains, and the changes that are to come, some not easily made to happen. Old habits die hard. Keep in mind I have not said it is better or works perfectly, but this will be the next way AM Broadcasters will be delivering AM Stereo to the listening public. (And this is the AM Stereo website isn't it??) THANKS, Kerry Richards Chief Engineer WOR-AM Buckley Broadcasting Corporation --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, jon wrote: > I second that appreciation. The whole world (Well, maybe the country) is > watching the WOR crew. If IBOC catches on, I may well end up having to > install these systems, so this information is quite useful. From KC4QLP@aol.com Fri Jan 31 21:10:46 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 1 Feb 2003 05:10:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 84965 invoked from network); 1 Feb 2003 05:10:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Feb 2003 05:10:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d04.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.36) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Feb 2003 05:10:45 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.9.8bff733 (3972) for ; Sat, 1 Feb 2003 00:10:36 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <9.8bff733.2b6cb0cc@aol.com> Date: Sat, 1 Feb 2003 00:10:36 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: AM Stereo at its Ultimate Best To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 1/31/03 9:36:26 PM Eastern Standard Time, stodd@sherbtel.net writes: << Whatever you do, DON'T trash that Raytheon. There are hams who'd love to get their mitts on it. I can direct you to a ham AM message board where you can advertise it. Would love to get it myself, but the funds aren't there. I've got one with a zorched mod choke. It would be nice to have a working unit to compare to when I refurbish the other. ST >> Whats the serial number on that Raytheon RA 1000 Michael?This one here is one of the first 200 off the production line here...188! Its been here in service since the late 40's early 50's and still going strong.( The orginal transmitter was a Gates when the station signed on in Nov 2 of 1947..500 watts daytime only...upgraded to 1kw day,500 night,two tower directional array in 1949 for 24 hour operation ). Dont know about the situation there in WY..but I personally find the McMartin to be classified very close to being a piece of junk. My Raytheon is ten times more reliable than my McMartin.Only time the Raytheon is off is to keep the cobb webs out and swap the 833's around from the RF section to the Modulation section...keep them evenly rotated. Atleat I'm not swaping out old flat tubes and putting new ones in every 6 months or so...which seems to be the case with these 4-400's.--especially in a McMartin box. Atleast I'm getting close to one years worth of good service out of them in an old RCA 1kw box. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- Subscribe send an email to amstereo-subscribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net _______________________________________________________ From KC4QLP@aol.com Fri Jan 31 21:34:08 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 1 Feb 2003 05:34:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 38542 invoked from network); 1 Feb 2003 05:34:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Feb 2003 05:34:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r09.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.105) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Feb 2003 05:34:07 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r09.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.3b.32cc7594 (3972) for ; Sat, 1 Feb 2003 00:34:04 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <3b.32cc7594.2b6cb64c@aol.com> Date: Sat, 1 Feb 2003 00:34:04 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC analog audio - 5 kHz vs. 6.2 kHz? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 1/31/03 9:55:03 PM Eastern Standard Time, tomray@wor710.com writes: << Another reason is that it isn't easy to remote the exciter filter switching. The exciter employs an audio filter "just in case" it's input exceeds bandwidth requirements, and also doubles as an instruction to the radio. It's extremely harsh and sounds absolutely awful.....plus produces spikes that cause overmodulation of the analog channel. If the exciter filtering didn't switch, the exciter would end up in the wrong mode. The exciter instructs the radio in what it needs to do.....for example, employing the 8kHz exciter filter tells the radio that the exciter is operating with this filter, and in this case, the HD radio will only operate if it aquires both sidebands at the same time. This makes the digital mode less robust than operating in the 5kHz mode, as the 5K mode only requires aquisition of one sideband. While this isn't a concern at the moment because the radios aren't available yet, it would screw up the testing that is going on. We also don't have the available status lights to tell the operator at the studio that everything is OK, so we wouldn't know if things are set up correctly after a switch.>> There was a link that Tom gave me several months ago..its somewhere in my bookmarks of 1000's of links to webpages ---all of them radio related--that talked about how IBOC is generated in the exciter/transmitter. I posted that link here in hopes that someone would do there "homework" in order to get a better understanding why the analog audio is cut off at 5khz. Its obvious someone didnt do there homework. Honestly there isnt a heck of a lot of difference between 5khz and 6.2khz audio bandpass. I'd say if you want "wideband" sounding audio...tighten up the front end of your radio to knock off adjacent channel sputter..and EQ everything.....and fake it. Every system has its "rules" that it must operate by...read up on the who's and the whys and it might help make 2+2=4 instead of 2+2=:5:! << Lastly, keeping it in one mode is one less thing to go wrong. With the quality of operators available these days, the simpler the transmitter control can be, the better for everyone. >> I certainly for one can go along with that as well. When your doing the "tight rope dance"....doing and over seeing many things at once,the last thing you need is to have some switch not get flipped,a button not pushed or have something simple break...ugh!..that reeks! With non technical types these days...you have try and dummy proof a radio station,and in my case and Tom & Kerrys situation,we have satellite networks to keep an eye on as well.I've heard the works of many board ops on various networks that if I could have gotten my hands around them and knock some sense into there skulls--eeer! I wonder how some of them even got the job with some dead air,miscues to show host,running two things at one time..you name it!!! One network in DC used to hate hearing from me...but persistence paid off. Its not easy out here folks,its not the fame and glory as it may seem from the outside. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- Subscribe send an email to amstereo-subscribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net _______________________________________________________ From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Jan 31 22:04:41 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 1 Feb 2003 06:04:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 39717 invoked from network); 1 Feb 2003 06:04:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Feb 2003 06:04:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Feb 2003 06:04:40 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.183] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Feb 2003 06:04:38 -0000 Date: Sat, 01 Feb 2003 06:04:37 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: IBOC analog audio - 5 kHz vs. 6.2 kHz? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3b.32cc7594.2b6cb64c@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2032 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.80.9 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Honestly there isnt a heck of a lot of difference between 5khz and > 6.2khz audio bandpass. In this case, the main difference is that the Optimod 9200's "brick wall" filter generates "ringing" distortion at the 5 kHz setting, while at the 6.2 kHz setting, it is perfectly "clean". Since the distortion of the 5 kHz filter occurs above 5 kHz, obviously the narrow a receiver's bandwidth, the less noticeable it is going to be. But on any AM radio whose response approaches 4 to 5 kHz -- and that includes a lot of them -- you start hearing it more, and on a wide-band AMAX-type receiver, it becomes annoyingly audible as a constant "sizzle" to the audio, especially with music. Obviously, I'm sure the folks at Orban could redesign the 5 kHz filter so that it is more spectrally clean and doesn't generate this type of distortion. But out of all the Optimod 9200s currently in use by AM stations, only a handful (such as WOR's) currently have any reason to use the 5 kHz audio filter, so the incentive for them to develop and distribute a firmware update to fix this problem is likely not very large. Another solution would be to actually step *downward* to the 4.5 kHz filter, which would actually sound better because it would allow for a more gradual drop-off, rather than a razor-sharp "brick wall" at 5 kHz. That's the reason why the Optimod's NRSC filter is actually 9.5 kHz instead of exactly 10 kHz; that extra .5 kHz of transistion range helps to eliminate the overshoot and ringing distortion that an abrupt "brick wall" filter tends to cause, and in turn, actually sounds better on the air. And speaking of audio filters -- I've noticed that FM's 15 kHz "brick wall" filter isn't a de facto rule anymore; there are numerous FM Stereo stations transmitting audio response that is flat to at least 17 kHz, such as New York's 101.1 WCBS-FM. This is yet another measure by which it exceeds the quality of IBOC/"HD Radio" on FM, which has a strict 15 kHz "brick wall" in its digital encoding. From amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Fri Jan 31 22:26:04 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 2972 invoked from network); 1 Feb 2003 06:26:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Feb 2003 06:26:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Feb 2003 06:26:04 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: notify@yahoogroups.com Received: from [66.218.67.141] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Feb 2003 06:26:03 -0000 Date: 1 Feb 2003 06:26:02 -0000 Message-ID: <1044080762.209170.2300.w21@yahoogroups.com> X-eGroups-Application: files X-Yahoo-Group-Post: system From: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: New file uploaded to amstereoforum MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello, This email message is a notification to let you know that a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the amstereoforum group. File : /slpycomp.mp3 Uploaded by : kevtronics Description : The "Sleepy's" Comparison - A recording of 710 WOR's digital HD Radio audio, followed by the same commercial jingle as heard in analog AM Stereo, received on an AMAX-certified Chrysler MR193971 car radio. You can access this file at the URL http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum/files/slpycomp.mp3 To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/files Regards, kevtronics From amfmdx@fastq.com Fri Jan 31 22:30:25 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 1 Feb 2003 06:30:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 83506 invoked from network); 1 Feb 2003 06:30:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Feb 2003 06:30:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Feb 2003 06:30:25 -0000 Received: from fastq (d161-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.193]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id h116UNU25685 for ; Fri, 31 Jan 2003 23:30:23 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <002201c2c9bb$4ca14560$c1f9bed8@com> To: References: <1043995064.2109.92166.m2@yahoogroups.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Digest Number 562 Date: Fri, 31 Jan 2003 23:29:38 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > Either way you go..its an expense.If you move to a "new broadcast band" > you have to depend on the listeners buying the radios to listen to you on > the new service. And this is different than IBOC in what way? I think digital is a great idea. I think that no matter where it goes that there will have to be the roll of the dice on whether people will buy the radios or not. I think a lot of people will be turned off when they find they have to replace everything. If I had my way... I would take one UHF TV channel off the air and put the whole digital band in the 6 mHz allotted to the station removed and give each station 20kHz to work in. The 6 mHz is bigger than what MW has now. Being that I am NOT in the FCC its just a dream and won't be considered. Give the band channel 14 and leave it at that. You can cover a good area with these frequencies and the radio signals at this frequencies penetrate into buildings easily. You would have little problem with skywave but possibly some with tropo skip unlike MW where its a propagational nightmare. Its not going to happen but it is just a thought. Kevin Mesa, Arizona From bjackson@indyradio.com Fri Jan 31 22:52:57 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 1 Feb 2003 06:52:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 89728 invoked from network); 1 Feb 2003 06:52:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Feb 2003 06:52:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Feb 2003 06:52:56 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.248] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Feb 2003 06:52:56 -0000 Date: Sat, 01 Feb 2003 06:52:54 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: The Wrath of Kahn Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2121 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923 " X-Originating-IP: 216.132.129.192 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 I found a little more info on Kahns' petitions than what RW had: 1) "The brilliant engineering mind and relentless campaigner who created one of the competeing AM Stereo systems is asking the FCC to halt iBiquity's digital scheme in its tracks. Kahn has plenty on his mind in Friday's filing, starting with iBiquity's incomplete plans for nighttime AM: 'The AM DAB situation is analogous to an automobile manufacturer introducing a new type of vehicle that can only be driven during daylight hours and is 1 1/2 times as wide as the widest vehicle on the road, so it can't be driven over most of America's highways.' Kahn says HD radio's AM version 'only works during daylight hours and occupies 1 1/2 times the current bandwidth.' Another argument: by accepting iBiquity's plan, the FCC is requiring 'massive equipment and license expenditures by participating AM and FM stations, and these huge costs, as well as a dramtic increase in interference, may force too many independent rural stations out of business.'" 2) Kahn petitions the FCC to create a "blue ribbon panel." He says it would recommend a "substitute procedure" for the current system of industry committees that "have failed on numerous occasions to provide proper assistance to the FCC. And most recently - the one that recommended MM-99-325, the rulemaking that's ushering in HD radio." He wants the panel of ex-Commissioners and other experts to "consider whether DAB proponents' obvious goal of complete digitalization of AM and FM is in the public interest." Kahn still waves the flag for AM stereo. --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "bd6xray " wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "wortomray " > wrote: > > And if he needs to sue someone, it would be the FCC (good luck) if > > they mandate IBOC. > > It's not uncommon for the FCC to lose. Recent examples - courts keep > overturning the FCC's EEOC rules, and the Supreme Court granted > NextWave's suit to recover licenses the FCC had attempted to take > back and had resold. > > Al Hajny From KC4QLP@aol.com Fri Jan 31 23:35:52 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 1 Feb 2003 07:35:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 1809 invoked from network); 1 Feb 2003 07:35:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Feb 2003 07:35:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m04.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.7) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Feb 2003 07:35:52 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.1db.1677622 (30960) for ; Sat, 1 Feb 2003 02:35:45 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1db.1677622.2b6cd2d0@aol.com> Date: Sat, 1 Feb 2003 02:35:44 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Digest Number 562 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 2/1/03 1:30:45 AM Eastern Standard Time, amfmdx@fastq.com writes: > > Either way you go..its an expense.If you move to a "new broadcast band" > > you have to depend on the listeners buying the radios to listen to you on > > the new service. > > And this is different than IBOC in what way? > Hey Kevin in Mesa!..good to see you lurking around here still. The difference in a "new broadcast band" and IBOC in respect to consumers buying the radios to listen to the new system is none. Its all a "hope and lets hope the listeners buy the radios" game. At least if things are done correctly..IBOC might be able to avoid the mistakes that occured with AM Stereo in the receiver department.If the people cant get the radio to listen to the new mode of transmission,what broadcasters do becomes a mute point then. History has a terrible tendency to repeat itself.But one thing to note that makes the IBOC scene different from AM Stereo is that you have only one system for In Band On Channel digital broadcasting whereas AM Stereo you had several different systems that were in competition in the market place....thats what mainly made AM Stereo fail...consumers grew tired quick of the switches,buttons to mess with just to listen to AM Stereo followed by confusion of what station was doing what.At that point listeners gave up and pretty much forgot about AM Stereo. Had the FCC put its foot down to start with and made a decision based on data from test,then maybe AM radio would look a little different today. With IBOC having one transmission system and receivers that for the most part do everything for you..it stands a better chance of success. <> Well considering Canadas Eureka band is in the 300mhz region of the spectrum....and UHF TV is anywheres from 500mhz and up.....that band would actually have more of a disadvantage for stations coverage wise compared to Canadas Eureka band.For a station on 500mhz to have the same coverage as one around 300mhz..your talking taller towers (that issue has become a big issue with the NIMBY across the country) and higher power transmitters/higher ERP's and more costly. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net ______________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Feb 01 00:26:34 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 1 Feb 2003 08:26:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 39973 invoked from network); 1 Feb 2003 08:26:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Feb 2003 08:26:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Feb 2003 08:26:34 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.162] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Feb 2003 08:26:34 -0000 Date: Sat, 01 Feb 2003 08:26:33 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Digest Number 562 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <1db.1677622.2b6cd2d0@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2520 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.80.9 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Had the FCC put its foot down to start with and made a decision > based on data from test,then maybe AM radio would look a little > different today. Actually, the FCC *did* do that right in the beginning. They evaluated all the different AM Stereo systems and decided that the Magnavox system would be the single standard. But then everybody else complained what a lousy choice that was, and the FCC went back and re-did the testing. But just before they were going to decide again on a single standard -- which would have been the Harris system -- they gave in and allowed all of the systems to be used, in the infamous "marketplace" decision. In reality, the Magnavox system would have been a very good choice. Although not the most technically sophisticated AM Stereo system -- in fact, it was the simplest system -- it actually offers the widest Stereo separation and lowest distortion (at least on Sony "multi- system decoders), and in regard to things like "platform motion", it would have been no better or worse than the C-Quam system. The only real difference is compatibility with mono receivers; C-Quam is the best at this, while Harris is the worst, and Kahn and Magnavox were both about average. But more importantly, out of the original group of AM Stereo proponents, Magnavox was the only one which actually manufactured receivers itself, so if it was approved as the single standard, you can bet that Magnavox radios with AM Stereo would quickly arrive on store shelves, and then the other brands would soon follow. Although they never admitted it, this alone was one of the reasons why the FCC originally favored the Magnavox system. After the marketplace decision, it seems that Magnavox all but gave up on their own system. I only have official count of SIX stations in the USA and Canada that ever used the Magnavox AM Stereo system, despite the fact that hundreds of thousands of "multi-system" receivers made by Sony, Sansui, and Metrosound supported it perfectly, and actually sounded the best with it. BTW, as of June 1985, here were the stations transmitting Magnavox AM Stereo: 620 WSKQ Newark, NJ 640 WMSO Collierville, TN 850 WIVK Knoxville, TN 1190 WOWO Ft. Wayne, IN 1390 WLAN Lancaster, PA 1500 KTOL Lacey, WA 1010 CFRB in Toronto, ON was also rumored to have used it in the beginning, but they eventually switched to C-Quam. It is known that the engineers at CFRB used the first three prototype multi-system AM Stereo car radios made by Sansui. From amymousie@yahoo.com Sat Feb 01 01:04:50 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 1 Feb 2003 09:04:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 22693 invoked from network); 1 Feb 2003 09:04:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Feb 2003 09:04:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.67) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Feb 2003 09:04:49 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.163] by n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Feb 2003 09:04:49 -0000 Date: Sat, 01 Feb 2003 09:04:45 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: New file uploaded to amstereoforum Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <1044080762.209170.2300.w21@yahoogroups.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 601 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 64.175.244.68 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com wrote: > File : /slpycomp.mp3 > Uploaded by : kevtronics > Description : The "Sleepy's" Comparison - A recording of 710 WOR's digital HD Radio audio, followed by the same commercial jingle as heard in analog AM Stereo, received on an AMAX-certified Chrysler MR193971 car radio. > > You can access this file at the URL > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum/files/slpycomp.mp3 Y'lmow, there's quite a world of difference in intelligability here between the two.... Amy. <:3 )~~~ From amymousie@yahoo.com Sat Feb 01 01:28:13 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 1 Feb 2003 09:28:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 19316 invoked from network); 1 Feb 2003 09:28:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Feb 2003 09:28:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.90) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Feb 2003 09:28:12 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.177] by n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Feb 2003 09:28:12 -0000 Date: Sat, 01 Feb 2003 09:28:09 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Digest Number 562 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 1520 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 64.175.244.68 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie > In reality, the Magnavox system would have been a very good choice.=20 > Although not the most technically sophisticated AM Stereo system --=20 > in fact, it was the simplest system -- it actually offers the=20 widest=20 > Stereo separation and lowest distortion (at least on Sony "multi- > system decoders), and in regard to things like "platform motion",=20 it=20 > would have been no better or worse than the C-Quam system. The=20 only=20 > real difference is compatibility with mono receivers; C-Quam is the=20 > best at this, while Harris is the worst, and Kahn and Magnavox were=20 > both about average. Actually, the RCA (later Belar) system was the simplest of all the=20 systems. It also showed quite a bit of promise, too. The system, as RCA originally proposed in November, 1959 was an am- modulated sum (L+R) channel, further modulated by an NFM carrier,=20 modulated by the difference (L-R) in much the same war C-QUAM=20 exciters plug into the Xtal socket to modulate the AM. The characteristics were very simple: * Deviation: 1.2kHz (RCA); 320 Hz (Belar) * Pre-empasis: 100 =B5s * Delay: 25 =B5s (transmitter's L+R, receiver's L-R) In the Belar tests of the late 1970's and early 1980's, the only 3=20 stations to test the system were WGMS, WTOP and WBT. RCA tested on=20 WNBC in 1959-1960. There has not been any RCA.Belar broadcast since 1982, when Belar=20 dropped out of the competition. Oh, and yes, I'd like to see some Magnavix schematics 'n such. I've=20 heard of its simplicity, but I haven't seen it. Amy. <:3 )~~~ From groucho@skyweb.net Sat Feb 01 02:07:34 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 1 Feb 2003 10:07:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 21621 invoked from network); 1 Feb 2003 10:07:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Feb 2003 10:07:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Feb 2003 10:07:33 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (tc1-2.skyweb.net [66.6.130.130]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h11AFeZ4050808 for ; Sat, 1 Feb 2003 05:15:41 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3E3B9A30.498845F6@skyweb.net> Date: Sat, 01 Feb 2003 04:58:08 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: AM Stereo at its Ultimate Best References: <004c01c2c93c$0c704420$0701010a@keva> <009401c2c99a$d8877de0$827dfea9@home1> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 what's this another OLd AM transmitter available for the taking???? where???? this would make #5 in my personal Collection.. LOL... Scott Todd wrote: > Whatever you do, DON'T trash that Raytheon. There are hams who'd love to > get their mitts on it. I can direct you to a ham AM message board where you > can advertise it. Would love to get it myself, but the funds aren't there. > I've got one with a zorched mod choke. It would be nice to have a working > unit to compare to when I refurbish the other. > > ST > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Michael J. Richard" > > > > > Oh...FYI...the old Raytheon was put to rest in 1987 when they bought the > McMartin BA-1K. We are actually licensed to 880 watts, and not 1000. So > our McMartin sounds better than most of them because we're running it a > touch under-power. Even at 133% it's quite clean. > > I installed the AM Stereo Exciter in August of last year and it sounds > beautiful. > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From jwelton@nautel.com Sat Feb 01 08:13:03 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jwelton@nautel.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 1 Feb 2003 16:13:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 60159 invoked from network); 1 Feb 2003 16:13:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Feb 2003 16:13:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO relay1.softcomca.com) (168.144.1.67) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Feb 2003 16:13:01 -0000 Received: from M2W039.mail2web.com ([168.144.251.144]) by relay1.softcomca.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.5329); Sat, 1 Feb 2003 11:13:00 -0500 Message-ID: <293580-2200326116130699@M2W039.mail2web.com> X-Priority: 3 X-URL: http://mail2web.com/ To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Digest Number 562 Date: Sat, 1 Feb 2003 11:13:00 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Return-Path: jwelton@nautel.com X-OriginalArrivalTime: 01 Feb 2003 16:13:00.0854 (UTC) FILETIME=[CAACDD60:01C2CA0C] From: "jwelton@nautel.com" Reply-To: jwelton@nautel.com X-Originating-IP: 24.222.130.184 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=26918678 Bob wrote: >Well considering Canadas Eureka band is in the 300mhz region of the=20 >spectrum....and UHF TV is anywheres from 500mhz and up.....that band would= =20 >actually have more of a disadvantage for stations coverage wise compared to=20 >Canadas Eureka band. Not to be a source of dissension, but Eureka in Canada actually in the L Band, from 1452-1492 MHz, so the coverage issues are in reality more serious than they would be if we were at 300 (or even 500) MHz. If anyone is interested, there is a fairly well written, and quite recent, article on Eureka in Canada at: http://www.mastersonaudio.com/features/20011201.htm Regards, Jeff Welton Customer Service Dept. Nautel Ltd. Tel: +1-902-823-3900, ext. 127 Fax: +1-902-823-3183 jwelton@nautel.com -------------------------------------------------------------------- mail2web - Check your email from the web at http://mail2web.com/ . From jbyrns@enteract.com Sat Feb 01 09:27:02 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 1 Feb 2003 17:27:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 25236 invoked from network); 1 Feb 2003 17:26:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Feb 2003 17:26:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.84) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Feb 2003 17:26:59 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.253] by n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Feb 2003 17:26:57 -0000 Date: Sat, 01 Feb 2003 17:26:56 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: The death of AM stereo? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1822 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.98.110 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "amymousie " < amymousie@y...> wrote: > I've always thought the survival of public-domain technology (and > all of the AM stereo system patents have passed into the public > domain by now) is dependent on the availability of resources. > Looking around me, resources for AM stereo are few, and dwindling. > I have yet to hear of anyone making a (relatively simple) C-QUAM > decoder board without resorting to chips, or for that matter, AM > stereo- and CQUAM theory in plain english. ISB, quadrature AM, and > even the RCA/Belar systems could easily be explained, but there is > very little on them. I don't know how Kahn's "ISB" system could be easily explained in "plain english", or even more complicated English for that matter, as the system never seemed to stand still long enough for there to be one single explanation of its operation. I wonder how many AM stereo exciters of one type Kahn built, before he moved on to the next revision of the system? Does anyone here even know the details of how the Kahn AM stereo system(s) really worked? There is a relatively simple "plain english" explanation of how the CQUAM system works, that if I remember correctly is also how the 13020 decoder chip works. If you understand QAM, and are willing to take one or two details on faith, then it is not too hard. Even with the FM/PM systems, simple explanations take a lot of FM theory on faith. > Once the supply of C-QUAM decoder dry up, will that be it, the end > of C-QUAM? Which is the cause, and which the effect? What would be the use of a supply of C-QUAM decoder chips, if the system were already dead? If you want to build a C-QUAM decoder, it isn't hard to do it with SSI type IC's, and then there is always the DSP option. John From jbyrns@enteract.com Sat Feb 01 09:30:55 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 1 Feb 2003 17:30:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 94430 invoked from network); 1 Feb 2003 17:30:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Feb 2003 17:30:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.88) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Feb 2003 17:30:55 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.140] by n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Feb 2003 17:30:54 -0000 Date: Sat, 01 Feb 2003 17:30:52 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Digest Number 562 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1907 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.98.110 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " < kevtronics@y...> wrote: > > Had the FCC put its foot down to start with and made a decision > > based on data from test,then maybe AM radio would look a little > > different today. > > Actually, the FCC *did* do that right in the beginning. They > evaluated all the different AM Stereo systems and decided that the > Magnavox system would be the single standard. But then everybody > else complained what a lousy choice that was, and the FCC went back > and re-did the testing. But just before they were going to decide > again on a single standard -- which would have been the Harris > system -- they gave in and allowed all of the systems to be used, in > the infamous "marketplace" decision. > > In reality, the Magnavox system would have been a very good choice. > Although not the most technically sophisticated AM Stereo system -- > in fact, it was the simplest system -- The RCA/Belar system is equally as simple as the Magnavox system, the major distinction being the RCA/Belar system used a low frequency audio boost network that causes it to operate as an FM system below about 1,592 Hz, and as a PM system above that. If I have the right specifications for the Magnavox system, it uses a lot more high frequency phase shift than the RCA/Belar system, resulting in considerably more "FM" deviation at high audio frequencies, while the low frequency boost in the RCA/Belar system results in more phase shift at low frequencies than with the Magnavox system. The greater high frequency phase shift in the Magnavox system would cause more adjacent channel splatter, while the increased low frequency phase shift used in the RCA/Belar system might require a more complex phase shift modulator in the transmitter, but would help reduce the effects of phase noise in the receivers local oscillator. John From florida_amstereo@hotmail.com Sat Feb 01 09:36:02 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: florida_amstereo@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 1 Feb 2003 17:36:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 44958 invoked from network); 1 Feb 2003 17:36:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Feb 2003 17:36:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.37.20) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Feb 2003 17:36:02 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 1 Feb 2003 09:24:47 -0800 Received: from 209.240.198.61 by pv2fd.pav2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Sat, 01 Feb 2003 17:24:47 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Columbia~May God be with Date: Sat, 01 Feb 2003 17:24:47 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 01 Feb 2003 17:24:47.0553 (UTC) FILETIME=[D1AAFB10:01C2CA16] From: "Donn Tillman" X-Originating-IP: [209.240.198.61] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83914824 the families, friends and co-workers of the astronauts that died in today's tragedy. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ I was glad to see that ClearChannel's Sport's Animal and the once proud 1250 am (now their regular programming consists of replays of a one political entertainer and health infomercials) are both picking up audio feeds from the news networks. Both of these stations used to have their own news departments before ClearChannel ownership. The one ClearChannel remaining news department (WFLA 970) is also covering this from the newtwork feed with some local coverage. Even Infinity's WQYK 1010 am was able to drop rehashing of the Super Bowl for nearly an hour and rebroadcast the audio for CNN. Also a few (about a fourth) of the commercial fm's are also broadcasting network audio feeds. _________________________________________________________________ Tired of spam? Get advanced junk mail protection with MSN 8. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail From KC4QLP@aol.com Sat Feb 01 10:52:17 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 1 Feb 2003 18:52:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 11934 invoked from network); 1 Feb 2003 18:52:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Feb 2003 18:52:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m08.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.163) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Feb 2003 18:52:16 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.27.37fa3b3f (25305) for ; Sat, 1 Feb 2003 13:52:04 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <27.37fa3b3f.2b6d7154@aol.com> Date: Sat, 1 Feb 2003 13:52:04 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Digest Number 562 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp << Actually, the FCC *did* do that right in the beginning. They > evaluated all the different AM Stereo systems and decided that the > Magnavox system would be the single standard. But then everybody > else complained what a lousy choice that was, and the FCC went back > and re-did the testing. But just before they were going to decide > again on a single standard -- which would have been the Harris > system -- they gave in and allowed all of the systems to be used, in > the infamous "marketplace" decision. >> To me..letting the market place decide is not doing something. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- Subscribe send an email to amstereo-subscribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net _______________________________________________________ From florida_amstereo@hotmail.com Sat Feb 01 11:34:35 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: florida_amstereo@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 1 Feb 2003 19:34:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 23429 invoked from network); 1 Feb 2003 19:34:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Feb 2003 19:34:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.37.96) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Feb 2003 19:34:34 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 1 Feb 2003 11:32:29 -0800 Received: from 209.240.198.61 by pv2fd.pav2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Sat, 01 Feb 2003 19:32:28 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: FCC's lack of action in am-stereo standards Date: Sat, 01 Feb 2003 19:32:28 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 01 Feb 2003 19:32:29.0511 (UTC) FILETIME=[A88CFD70:01C2CA28] From: "Donn Tillman" X-Originating-IP: [209.240.198.61] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83914824 In reference to the FCC not setting a standard for a.m. stereo, Bob Carter wrote: >"To me..letting the market place decide is not doing something. BINGO! EXACTLY........, the FCC abdicated their duties and responsibilities; something they( the FCC) are still good at (abdication or dereliction of duties) in many areas. I am really disappointed in Michael Powell's lack of decisive leadership. donn st petersburg ----Original Message Follows---- From: KC4QLP@aol.com Reply-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Digest Number 562 Date: Sat, 1 Feb 2003 13:52:04 EST << Actually, the FCC *did* do that right in the beginning. They > evaluated all the different AM Stereo systems and decided that the > Magnavox system would be the single standard. But then everybody > else complained what a lousy choice that was, and the FCC went back > and re-did the testing. But just before they were going to decide > again on a single standard -- which would have been the Harris > system -- they gave in and allowed all of the systems to be used, in > the infamous "marketplace" decision. >> To me..letting the market place decide is not doing something. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC _________________________________________________________________ The new MSN 8: smart spam protection and 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail From possumhunter@netzero.net Sat Feb 01 11:39:03 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 1 Feb 2003 19:39:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 91263 invoked from network); 1 Feb 2003 19:39:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Feb 2003 19:39:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.116) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Feb 2003 19:39:02 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 1 Feb 2003 11:39:02 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Any stations using Kahn ? Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 23:14:04 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 01 Feb 2003 19:39:02.0278 (UTC) FILETIME=[92A87A60:01C2CA29] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.154.13.182] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 It is no longer legal to use the Kahn ISB Stereo system anywhere in the world. The only legal way to use the Kahn ISB system is in the Powerside mode in Mono. That is the law, but there are two KAHN AM Stereo signals I can hear in this market! Kevin From amfmdx@fastq.com Sat Feb 01 11:43:00 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 1 Feb 2003 19:43:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 87354 invoked from network); 1 Feb 2003 19:42:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Feb 2003 19:42:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Feb 2003 19:42:59 -0000 Received: from fastq (d219-osel-phx.fastq.com [207.173.146.80]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id h11JgwU47285 for ; Sat, 1 Feb 2003 12:42:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <005f01c2ca2a$04db18e0$99f9bed8@com> To: References: <1044113157.386.28637.m12@yahoogroups.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Digest Number 565 Date: Sat, 1 Feb 2003 12:42:12 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > Hey Kevin in Mesa!..good to see you lurking around here still. Hey, they will let anyone in here! > The difference in a "new broadcast band" and IBOC in respect to consumers > buying the radios to listen to the new system is none. Its all a "hope and > lets hope the listeners buy the radios" game. Its going to be interesting. I don't know what to expect. I will buy one only because I want to see how the signals propagate if they do. I know that I did hear the mess from IBOC here in AZ when WLW and WOR were testing simultaneously. I think that this will cause the noise floor to be unbelievable. I do know that DX is dead on AM when it happens for analog. > At least if things are done > correctly..IBOC might be able to avoid the mistakes that occured with AM > Stereo in the receiver department. There wasn't a mistake. The FCC mandated MAGNAVOX and the lawsuits caused a change. > If the people cant get the radio to listen > to the new mode of transmission,what broadcasters do becomes a mute point > then. The receivers should be cheap and very close to the cost of a regular mono receiver or it will not be well received. This is why AM stereo was not successful early. I remember the prices in the 80s and they were not close to the prices of the mono radios. > thats what mainly made AM Stereo fail...consumers grew tired quick > of the switches,buttons to mess with just to listen to AM Stereo followed by > confusion of what station was doing what. Disagree. I think AM stereo failed because the cost of a receiver was about 40 - 60% more than a regular mono radio. > With IBOC having one transmission system and receivers that for the most part > do everything for you..it stands a better chance of success. I think XM will pick up a ton of listeners when IBOC gets going. I predict the number of listeners to MW and FM bands will shrink drastically. I think that MW will crash and burn because the numbers of listeners to MW are low already. The people who have analog sets will hear the hash and they will never comeback. I feel for people like you because of whats going to happen. Kevin Mesa, Arizona From jbyrns@enteract.com Sat Feb 01 11:53:34 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 1 Feb 2003 19:53:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 2304 invoked from network); 1 Feb 2003 19:53:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Feb 2003 19:53:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.68) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Feb 2003 19:53:33 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.163] by n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Feb 2003 19:53:31 -0000 Date: Sat, 01 Feb 2003 19:53:31 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Any stations using Kahn ? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 441 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.212 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Possum Hunter" < possumhunter@n...> wrote: > It is no longer legal to use the Kahn ISB Stereo system anywhere in the > world. The only legal way to use the Kahn ISB system is in the Powerside > mode in Mono. > > That is the law, but there are two KAHN AM Stereo signals I can hear in this > market! Let's see, it's against the law, and there are no receivers, so why would a station do this? John From stodd@sherbtel.net Sat Feb 01 12:19:30 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 1 Feb 2003 20:19:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 23096 invoked from network); 1 Feb 2003 20:19:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Feb 2003 20:19:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Feb 2003 20:19:28 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-53.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.53]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h11KJPhF023229 for ; Sat, 1 Feb 2003 14:19:26 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <004301c2ca2f$77fae440$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <004c01c2c93c$0c704420$0701010a@keva> <009401c2c99a$d8877de0$827dfea9@home1> <3E3B9A30.498845F6@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: AM Stereo at its Ultimate Best Date: Sat, 1 Feb 2003 14:21:11 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Raytheon RA-1000. Care to take a trip out to Evanston WY? ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Neal Newman" > what's this another OLd AM transmitter available for the taking???? where???? > this would make #5 in my personal Collection.. LOL... > From amfmdx@fastq.com Sat Feb 01 13:41:20 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 1 Feb 2003 21:41:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 99740 invoked from network); 1 Feb 2003 21:41:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Feb 2003 21:41:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Feb 2003 21:41:18 -0000 Received: from fastq (d79-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.111]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id h11LfHU48797 for ; Sat, 1 Feb 2003 14:41:17 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <00d501c2ca3a$8b503a80$99f9bed8@com> To: Subject: Select-A-Tenna for sale Date: Sat, 1 Feb 2003 14:40:29 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla Select-A-Tenna loop for sale. Standard unit. Sits next to the radio and amplifies signals. $27 shipped anywhere in the USA. Minty condition. Kevin Mesa, Arizona "Its going to get a lot worse before it gets worse" - Lily Tomlin From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sat Feb 01 14:17:57 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 1 Feb 2003 22:17:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 30178 invoked from network); 1 Feb 2003 22:17:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Feb 2003 22:17:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Feb 2003 22:17:55 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.132] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Feb 2003 22:17:55 -0000 Date: Sat, 01 Feb 2003 22:17:52 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: The death of AM stereo? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 1494 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.135 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " wrote: >=20 > I don't know how Kahn's "ISB" system could be easily explained in=20 > "plain english", or even more complicated English for that matter, as=20 > the system never seemed to stand still long enough for there to be one=20 > single explanation of its operation. I wonder how many AM stereo=20 > exciters of one type Kahn built, before he moved on to the next=20 > revision of the system? Does anyone here even know the details of how=20 > the Kahn AM stereo system(s) really worked? >=20 Kahn was not one for consistency. His receiver desigh morphed about as much as his exciter design. He kept his exciter design under lock and key for fear of someone stealing it I guess. The part that little is known about is the 2nd harmonic generator for L-R for better separation. The only reason I see for this circuit is to reduce distortion when received with the 2 radio approach otherwise his system is just a Magnavox system with L-R audio phase shifted by 90=B0 in relation to L+R. This second harmonic component made receiver design more difficult otherwise a Magnavox receiver could be used with the appropiate audio phase shifters attached to the output. >=20 > Which is the cause, and which the effect? What would be the use of a=20 > supply of C-QUAM decoder chips, if the system were already dead?=20=20 >=20 > John I can think of other uses, ham radio comes to mind. The chips can be adapted to do linear QuAM or ISB. JSG From bjackson@indyradio.com Sat Feb 01 15:29:08 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 1 Feb 2003 23:29:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 53615 invoked from network); 1 Feb 2003 23:29:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Feb 2003 23:29:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Feb 2003 23:29:06 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.143] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Feb 2003 23:29:06 -0000 Date: Sat, 01 Feb 2003 23:29:04 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Any stations using Kahn ? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 936 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923 " X-Originating-IP: 216.132.129.192 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " wrote: > Let's see, it's against the law, and there are no receivers, so why > would a station do this? > > John While I can't answer the why, but I know stations *do* it. Besides, just because it's illegal, does *not* mean there are no receivers. A receiver from the '80's doesn't just die when the FCC makes a rule. For example, I recently picked up a Sansui S-X1130 multi-system receiver...There is at least one signal I can pick up here in Indianapolis (but not an Indy station) that doesn't light the stereo light on any C-Quam radio, it does on the Sansui...Muddy bass on one side and highs on the other. I think that's a powerside station with the pilot on, right? Again, I don't know why the pilot is on, but there are radios that can pick it up (very few). - Brad Jackson - Susquehanna, Indianapolis - WGLD/WGRL/WFMS - www.indyradio.com From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Feb 01 16:23:47 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Feb 2003 00:23:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 4813 invoked from network); 2 Feb 2003 00:23:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Feb 2003 00:23:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.86) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Feb 2003 00:23:47 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.148] by n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Feb 2003 00:23:47 -0000 Date: Sun, 02 Feb 2003 00:23:45 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: The death of AM stereo? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 2385 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.75.21 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > The part that little is known about is the 2nd harmonic generator > for L-R for better separation. The only reason I see for this > circuit is to reduce distortion when received with the 2 radio > approach otherwise his system is just a Magnavox system with L-R > audio phase shifted by 90=B0 in relation to L+R. I've heard this called the "sideband tuning helper", and supposedly=20 later generations of Kahn's exciter (i.e. those now used for=20 PowerSide) reduced or eliminated this effect. Sony's block diagram from 1983 shows the Kahn exciter as the same as=20 a Magnavox exciter except for the audio phase shifts and a "Sideband=20 Compensator" added to the L-R signal. I have a book from 1986 which=20 shows a more detailed block diagram, depicting this sideband=20 compensator as consisting of two "constant gain frequency doublers"=20 (i.e. 2nd harmonic generators) and a "level squarer". But you should see the block diagram for the Harris system exciter.=20 Sony's 1983 service manual for the SRF-A1 shows the diagram for the=20 "sliding pilot tone" version of the Harris system, and even notes=20 that "This system may be changed as the receiver side has a large=20 load." The diagram they show includes the L+R audio being put=20 through an AM modulator and then back through an envelope detector --=20 all within the exciter! Harris must have used at least half a dozen different variations of=20 their AM Stereo system in 1983-1984, before finally announcing that=20 they were giving up on it and putting their effort behind Motorola's=20 C-Quam system. But yet, in 1992 when it came time for the FCC to=20 choose a single AM Stereo standard, there were still more stations=20 using the Harris system than there were Kahn AM Stereo stations. I'd still like to hear some more recordings of Harris AM Stereo if=20 anybody has any -- especially any that were received on a Sansui=20 tuner, which was the only design to even come close to properly=20 decoding the Harris system. There is one recording of 630 KHOW that=20 has been around for a while, but it was recieved on a Sony SRF-A100=20 and you can really hear the distortion. You might think that's just=20 from the way it was recorded to cassette, but with my own Panasonic=20 multi-system AM Stereo generator and SRF-A100, I can confirm that=20 Harris really does sound that distorted on a Sony radio (or even on a=20 regular mono radio, for that matter). From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Feb 01 16:29:50 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Feb 2003 00:29:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 11237 invoked from network); 2 Feb 2003 00:29:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Feb 2003 00:29:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Feb 2003 00:29:49 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.136] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Feb 2003 00:29:48 -0000 Date: Sun, 02 Feb 2003 00:29:47 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Any stations using Kahn ? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 801 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.75.21 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > There is at least one signal I can pick up here in Indianapolis > (but not an Indy station) that doesn't light the stereo light on > any C-Quam radio, it does on the Sansui...Muddy bass on one side > and highs on the other. I think that's a powerside station with > the pilot on, right? Yup... and while C-Quam is the only allowed system for AM Stereo, there are no rules against transmitting any other kinds of AM Stereo systems and other pilot tones... just if you're going to use it for true stereo audio, it has to be using the C-Quam system according to the FCC specs. 1570 WISP in Doylestown, PA is another Kahn PowerSide station which transmits the 15 Hz pilot tone.... which serves no useful purpose other than to indicate that the station's engineer is a die-hard Kahn fanatic. :-) From am740@rogers.com Sat Feb 01 17:08:59 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: am740@rogers.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Feb 2003 01:08:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 73841 invoked from network); 2 Feb 2003 01:08:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Feb 2003 01:08:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO fep02-mail.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com) (66.185.86.72) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Feb 2003 01:08:58 -0000 Received: from cr910465a ([24.100.130.139]) by fep02-mail.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com (InterMail vM.5.01.05.06 201-253-122-126-106-20020509) with ESMTP id <20030202010856.ZWOP123285.fep02-mail.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com@cr910465a> for ; Sat, 1 Feb 2003 20:08:56 -0500 Message-ID: <005801c2ca57$a9925420$8b826418@ajax.phub.net.cable.rogers.com> To: References: <1044113157.386.28637.m12@yahoogroups.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Digest Number 565 Date: Sat, 1 Feb 2003 20:08:23 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH LOGIN at fep02-mail.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com from [24.100.130.139] using ID at Sat, 1 Feb 2003 20:08:56 -0500 From: "Brian Smith" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=114197710 X-Yahoo-Profile: brian_smith_odxa I will check but I thought Canadian Eureka was in the 1400 mhz L band? Brian Smith ----------- Bob Carter wrote: Well considering Canadas Eureka band is in the 300mhz region of the spectrum....and UHF TV is anywheres from 500mhz and up.....that band would actually have more of a disadvantage for stations coverage wise compared to Canadas Eureka band. For a station on 500mhz to have the same coverage as one around 300mhz..your talking taller towers (that issue has become a big issue with the NIMBY across the country) and higher power transmitters/higher ERP's and more costly. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Feb 01 17:49:42 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Feb 2003 01:49:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 23805 invoked from network); 2 Feb 2003 01:49:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Feb 2003 01:49:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Feb 2003 01:49:42 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.249] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Feb 2003 01:49:42 -0000 Date: Sun, 02 Feb 2003 01:49:40 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: 970 WWDJ... another IBOC station soon? Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1652 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.75.21 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics Listening on my Superadio III today, I happened to notice that the audio from 970 WWDJ (Hackensack, NJ - a Christian music station in the New York City area) didn't seem as crisp and clear as the other AM stations, and in fact sounded quite a bit like WOR's limited-bandwidth audio. I ran a sample of their audio through Cool Edit's spectrum analyzer, and sure enough, WWDJ is cutting off their audio response just above 5 kHz -- although thankfully without the harsh "ringing" distortion like from WOR's 5 kHz audio. Is this a sign that WWDJ has plans to use IBOC, or are they just using a reduced audio bandwidth just for the fun of it? I guess we'll just have to wait and see. I did hear this during WWDJ's normal local music programming, so it wasn't because of some low-fidelity network feed; they must specifically have their audio processor set for a 5 kHz cut-off. If 970 WWDJ does decide to use IBOC, it is pretty much a fact that their digital sidebands will interfere with 950 WPEN (AM Stereo) and 990 WZZD from Philadelphia, especially right here in central NJ where these signals overlap. Also, there are numerous stations in the greater NJ/NY/CT/PA area on 960, 970, and 980 kHz which may also be affected, especially since WWDJ is only a 5000-watt Class B station and thus their signal does not enjoy nearly as much "breathing room" as does WOR's 50,000-watt Class A signal. For the record, WWDJ is, and as far as I can tell always has been, a plain mono station, and they are owned by Salem Communications. Meanwhile, co-owned and co-located 570 WMCA is running full 10 kHz analog mono AM audio, as usual. From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sat Feb 01 19:24:38 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Feb 2003 03:24:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 51177 invoked from network); 2 Feb 2003 03:24:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Feb 2003 03:24:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.88) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Feb 2003 03:24:37 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.168] by n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Feb 2003 03:24:32 -0000 Date: Sun, 02 Feb 2003 03:24:31 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: MC13028 Decoder Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1083 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.178 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst Well I've been testing out my MC13028 AMAX compliant decoder in my Nikko 8085 receiver and I'm making some fine tune adjustments to the audio response filters for the flattest NRSC respose out to 9.5KHz with notch filters. The receiver DXes pretty well with a Select-A-Tenna and I'm able to pick up 820 WBAP in stereo and 1510 WLAC. Some comments I have on the 13028 that also probably applies to the 13022 is that is has a glorified envelope detector circuit. Even in mono it has less distortion during interference and does better on slight detuning than the one in the 13020 but it's not as good as a synchronous detector. I guess you could say it is a compromise between envelope compatibility and low distortion. I have to say that I like the 13020 better when operated in full synchronous mode as any distortion present caused by not providing cosine correction is negligable compared to the crackle of the envelope detector under noisy and detuned conditions. I will soon post a zip file of the decoder with the circuit board pattern and schematic on my website. JSG From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Sat Feb 01 20:42:54 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Feb 2003 04:42:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 45904 invoked from network); 2 Feb 2003 04:42:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Feb 2003 04:42:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14202.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.144) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Feb 2003 04:42:53 -0000 Message-ID: <20030202044253.14527.qmail@web14202.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [65.221.44.26] by web14202.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 01 Feb 2003 20:42:53 PST Date: Sat, 1 Feb 2003 20:42:53 -0800 (PST) Subject: O.T. Moment of Silence To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio May I suggest of moment of silence for our crew of the original orbital shuttle, the Columbia. (The Enterprise only flew for landing tests, and never made it to Earth orbit). __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From possumhunter@netzero.net Sat Feb 01 20:46:22 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Feb 2003 04:46:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 90081 invoked from network); 2 Feb 2003 04:46:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Feb 2003 04:46:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.81) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Feb 2003 04:46:21 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 1 Feb 2003 20:46:21 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: The Wrath of Kahn Date: Sat, 1 Feb 2003 23:45:30 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 02 Feb 2003 04:46:21.0241 (UTC) FILETIME=[08349290:01C2CA76] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.132.34.194] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Anybody on the group know oif Kahn has a website? If not, what is the phone number and snail mail addy for Kahn Communications? Kahn has made some great sounding audio processing gear over the years. Kevin From tomray@wor710.com Sat Feb 01 20:53:22 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 328 invoked from network); 2 Feb 2003 04:53:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Feb 2003 04:53:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.75) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Feb 2003 04:53:22 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: tomray@wor710.com Received: from [66.218.67.170] by n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Feb 2003 04:53:22 -0000 X-Sender: tomray@wor710.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Feb 2003 02:21:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 36305 invoked from network); 2 Feb 2003 02:21:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Feb 2003 02:21:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.75) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Feb 2003 02:21:39 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.184] by n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Feb 2003 02:21:38 -0000 Date: Sun, 02 Feb 2003 02:21:38 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: WOR Engineering Staff Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20030131223810.02eac180@pop.GameBox.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1178 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wortomray " X-Originating-IP: 66.67.228.6 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=136489311 X-Yahoo-Profile: wortomray X-eGroups-Approved-By: kevtronics via web; 02 Feb 2003 04:53:18 -0000 Hey everyone: I read Kerry's post and echo what he said. I'd also like to say thanks. If there is anything you want to know, just ask. We don't hide behind ceremony and would rather you get answers than guess. And I'd like to reiterate that if anyone is interested in seeing the WOR transmitter facility, just email Kerry or myself. We'd love to show you around our "playground". Maybe a small group of you could get together and make the trek? Depending on the date/time, we might be able to arrange another site, too. Thanks again for the kind words. Like Kerry said, we're going to see where this advancement for AM takes us.....and having it stereo is a big plus. Oh. Ibiquity thinks they'll have the latest and greatest version of software to us in a couple of weeks. They're bug testing it now (they don't want to accidentally lock up a station the size of WOR....the press would never let them hear the end of it!). When it is installed, we'll record some new stereo tracks for you to hear. Right now, it sounds good with a mono source, but a little funky in stereo. It's still a work in progress for AM, so we need to give it time. TR From tomray@wor710.com Sat Feb 01 20:53:40 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 82388 invoked from network); 2 Feb 2003 04:53:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Feb 2003 04:53:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Feb 2003 04:53:40 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: tomray@wor710.com Received: from [66.218.67.159] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Feb 2003 04:53:40 -0000 X-Sender: tomray@wor710.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Feb 2003 02:24:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 86027 invoked from network); 2 Feb 2003 02:24:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Feb 2003 02:24:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Feb 2003 02:24:20 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.184] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Feb 2003 02:24:20 -0000 Date: Sun, 02 Feb 2003 02:24:20 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: IBOC analog audio - 5 kHz vs. 6.2 kHz? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 541 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wortomray " X-Originating-IP: 66.67.228.6 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=136489311 X-Yahoo-Profile: wortomray X-eGroups-Approved-By: kevtronics via web; 02 Feb 2003 04:53:40 -0000 FM IBOC is out to 20kHz. AM is out to 15kHz, unless it's operating in the digital only mode with no analog component. > And speaking of audio filters -- I've noticed that FM's 15 kHz "brick > wall" filter isn't a de facto rule anymore; there are numerous FM > Stereo stations transmitting audio response that is flat to at least > 17 kHz, such as New York's 101.1 WCBS-FM. This is yet another > measure by which it exceeds the quality of IBOC/"HD Radio" on FM, > which has a strict 15 kHz "brick wall" in its digital encoding. From jbyrns@enteract.com Sat Feb 01 21:08:54 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Feb 2003 05:08:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 26345 invoked from network); 2 Feb 2003 05:08:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Feb 2003 05:08:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Feb 2003 05:08:53 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.150] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Feb 2003 05:08:53 -0000 Date: Sun, 02 Feb 2003 05:08:51 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: The death of AM stereo? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 3047 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.56 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " < kevtronics@y...> wrote: > > The part that little is known about is the 2nd harmonic generator > > for L-R for better separation. The only reason I see for this > > circuit is to reduce distortion when received with the 2 radio > > approach otherwise his system is just a Magnavox system with L-R > > audio phase shifted by 90=B0 in relation to L+R. I thought the purpose of the "2nd harmonic generator" was to reduce=20 the distortion when the signal is received on a radio with an envelope=20 detector, and to provide a measure of envelope detector compatibility? > I've heard this called the "sideband tuning helper", and supposedly=20 > later generations of Kahn's exciter (i.e. those now used for=20 > PowerSide) reduced or eliminated this effect. >=20 > Sony's block diagram from 1983 shows the Kahn exciter as the same as=20 > a Magnavox exciter except for the audio phase shifts and a "Sideband=20 > Compensator" added to the L-R signal. I have a book from 1986 which=20 > shows a more detailed block diagram, depicting this sideband=20 > compensator as consisting of two "constant gain frequency doublers"=20 > (i.e. 2nd harmonic generators) and a "level squarer". >=20 > But you should see the block diagram for the Harris system exciter.=20 > Sony's 1983 service manual for the SRF-A1 shows the diagram for the=20 > "sliding pilot tone" version of the Harris system, and even notes=20 > that "This system may be changed as the receiver side has a large=20 > load." The diagram they show includes the L+R audio being put=20 > through an AM modulator and then back through an envelope detector --=20 > all within the exciter! I always thought the envelope detector was a standard part of many AM=20 stereo exciters, along with a limiter. The envelope detector, and=20 limiter develop the Amplitude Modulation audio signal, and Phase=20 Modulated carrier that are necessary to interface the exciter to a=20 traditional AM transmitter, whose interface consists of an "AM" audio=20 input, and an input for a phase modulated carrier. Of course systems=20 like C-QUAM, the RCA/Belar system, and others that feed the "AM" input=20 of the transmitter directly with the "L+R" signal, don't need the=20 envelope detector in the exciter. > Harris must have used at least half a dozen different variations of=20 > their AM Stereo system in 1983-1984, before finally announcing that=20 > they were giving up on it and putting their effort behind Motorola's=20 > C-Quam system. But yet, in 1992 when it came time for the FCC to=20 > choose a single AM Stereo standard, there were still more stations=20 > using the Harris system than there were Kahn AM Stereo stations. How many of those Harris exciters were still generating the Harris=20 system signal? It is my understanding that the Harris exciters were=20 easily converted to operation as C-QUAM exciters. Basically I think=20 you just feed the transmitters "AM" input with the "L+R" signal from=20 the matrix, rather than output of the envelope detector you mentioned=20 above. John From jbyrns@enteract.com Sat Feb 01 21:10:51 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Feb 2003 05:10:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 26920 invoked from network); 2 Feb 2003 05:10:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Feb 2003 05:10:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Feb 2003 05:10:51 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.137] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Feb 2003 05:10:51 -0000 Date: Sun, 02 Feb 2003 05:10:49 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: MC13028 Decoder Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 798 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.56 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "jsgilst " < jsgil@h...> wrote: > Well I've been testing out my MC13028 AMAX compliant > decoder in my Nikko 8085 receiver and I'm making some > fine tune adjustments to the audio response filters > for the flattest NRSC respose out to 9.5KHz with notch > filters. The receiver DXes pretty well with a Select-A-Tenna > and I'm able to pick up 820 WBAP in stereo and 1510 WLAC. > Some comments I have on the 13028 that also probably applies > to the 13022 is that is has a glorified envelope detector > circuit. What is a "glorified envelope detector"? If I remember correctly the 13020 uses a pseudo synchronous detector for the "envelope detector" function. What sort of circuit is this "glorified envelope detector" in the 13028? John From possumhunter@netzero.net Sat Feb 01 21:16:12 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Feb 2003 05:16:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 76902 invoked from network); 2 Feb 2003 05:16:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Feb 2003 05:16:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.208) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Feb 2003 05:16:11 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 1 Feb 2003 21:16:11 -0800 To: References: <3E3A8B54.EFFA0059@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Any stations using Kahn ? Date: Sun, 2 Feb 2003 00:15:56 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 02 Feb 2003 05:16:11.0757 (UTC) FILETIME=[336FA1D0:01C2CA7A] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.132.34.194] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Neal Newman wrote: > You think that's bad.. That TIS is on the First adjacent Of WWRL... In February of 2002 the FCC licensed a TIS station for the NJ Turnpike on 1680 kHz right near you at Exit 16... which is still in my protected Contour. If you think THAT is bad, The FCC allowed short-spaced WTZQ 1600 to go non-directional just 43 miles away from WFIS! WTZQ causes destructive interference well within the Northwestern part of the .5mv/Meter contour of WFIS, while WFIS causes destructive interference within the .5 mv/Meter contour of WTZQ. When we turn off the WFIS transmitter, WTZQ has a quieting signal at the WFIS transmitter site! Thee FCC guy who stamped his approval on the WTZQ application to go Non-D needs to learn more about radio! > >How Do I get rid of them???? Its driving Me Nuts.... I have the same question. WFIS has been trying to be nice about it and just get the FCC to move us up to 1610. We would be willing to give up 1600 with only enough notice to order a 1610 crystal to switch the transmitter, and are willing to order a DX-10, along with all of the needed upgrades to 10KW the same day we are approved for 1610. We have also tried being not so nice about it without much result. In the mean time, yet ANOTHER one of those damned "Talking House" trashmitters showed up on 1610 today in our city of license. Frustrated, Kevin From KC4QLP@aol.com Sat Feb 01 21:20:14 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Feb 2003 05:20:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 35081 invoked from network); 2 Feb 2003 05:20:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Feb 2003 05:20:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d03.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.35) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Feb 2003 05:20:13 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.29.37afe22c (25305) for ; Sun, 2 Feb 2003 00:20:05 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <29.37afe22c.2b6e0485@aol.com> Date: Sun, 2 Feb 2003 00:20:05 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: WOR Engineering Staff To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 2/1/03 11:53:44 PM Eastern Standard Time, tomray@wor710.com writes: << Oh. Ibiquity thinks they'll have the latest and greatest version of software to us in a couple of weeks. They're bug testing it now (they don't want to accidentally lock up a station the size of WOR....the press would never let them hear the end of it!). >> hehehe...wouldnt that be the bomb of all bombs that would just keep on blasting. << When it is installed, we'll record some new stereo tracks for you to hear. Right now, it sounds good with a mono source, but a little funky in stereo. It's still a work in progress for AM, so we need to give it time. TR >> Now thats going to be exciting to hear.Lets hope the "funkyness" is gone with the new version. BTW...any chance of the digital carriers running at night for any test anytime soon? I've got a few receivers I'm tightening up so to speak. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- Subscribe send an email to amstereo-subscribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net _______________________________________________________ From KC4QLP@aol.com Sat Feb 01 21:25:09 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Feb 2003 05:25:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 13301 invoked from network); 2 Feb 2003 05:25:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Feb 2003 05:25:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d02.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.34) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Feb 2003 05:25:08 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.c1.2e07e3fd (25305) for ; Sun, 2 Feb 2003 00:25:04 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Sun, 2 Feb 2003 00:25:03 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Any stations using Kahn ? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 2/2/03 12:16:32 AM Eastern Standard Time, possumhunter@netzero.net writes: << We have also tried being not so nice about it without much result. In the mean time, yet ANOTHER one of those damned "Talking House" trashmitters showed up on 1610 today in our city of license. Frustrated, Kevin >> A few sledge hammers and or rocket launchers would probably work real well for them trashmitters...lol Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- Subscribe send an email to amstereo-subscribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net _______________________________________________________ From amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sat Feb 01 21:25:42 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 24615 invoked from network); 2 Feb 2003 05:25:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Feb 2003 05:25:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.67) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Feb 2003 05:25:40 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: notify@yahoogroups.com Received: from [66.218.67.251] by n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Feb 2003 05:25:40 -0000 Date: 2 Feb 2003 05:25:36 -0000 Message-ID: <1044163536.269622.21812.w72@yahoogroups.com> X-eGroups-Application: files X-Yahoo-Group-Post: system From: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: New file uploaded to amstereoforum MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello, This email message is a notification to let you know that a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the amstereoforum group. File : /beckcomp.mp3 Uploaded by : kevtronics Description : An audio sample of AM IBOC/"HD Radio" in Stereo, immediately followed by the same musical segment as heard in C-Quam analog AM Stereo (with NRSC filter enabled). You can access this file at the URL http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum/files/beckcomp.mp3 To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/files Regards, kevtronics From amfmdx@fastq.com Sat Feb 01 21:27:43 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Feb 2003 05:27:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 39317 invoked from network); 2 Feb 2003 05:27:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Feb 2003 05:27:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Feb 2003 05:27:43 -0000 Received: from fastq (d79-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.111]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id h125RgU55547 for ; Sat, 1 Feb 2003 22:27:42 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <010501c2ca7b$b404d940$99f9bed8@com> To: Subject: Kahn stereo on the air.... Date: Sat, 1 Feb 2003 22:26:55 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla Kevin, I have said this in the past as well. I have heard stations in stereo running Kahn as well here in the western deserts. And I still will not say who they are. No need to mess with a good thing. Kevin Mesa, Arizona Message: 7 Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 23:14:04 -0500 From: "Possum Hunter" Subject: Re: Any stations using Kahn ? It is no longer legal to use the Kahn ISB Stereo system anywhere in the world. The only legal way to use the Kahn ISB system is in the Powerside mode in Mono. That is the law, but there are two KAHN AM Stereo signals I can hear in this market! Kevin This message has been composed of recycled electrons. None of these electrons has been harmed or injured in the creation and transmission of this message but they have been shamelessly exploited for this use. From amfmdx@fastq.com Sat Feb 01 21:31:39 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Feb 2003 05:31:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 42342 invoked from network); 2 Feb 2003 05:31:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Feb 2003 05:31:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Feb 2003 05:31:39 -0000 Received: from fastq (d79-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.111]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id h125VbU55573 for ; Sat, 1 Feb 2003 22:31:37 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <010d01c2ca7c$408049e0$99f9bed8@com> To: Subject: Kahn stereo Date: Sat, 1 Feb 2003 22:30:35 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla John, I have a receiver and I can hear it. I don't own a station or anything and really don't know anyone who does own one. Maybe the owner just wants to hear his station in stereo. KSL no longer has any stereo of any kind but for a long time "Music and the Spoken Word" was noted in Kahn stereo and it ran long after 1992. Kevin Mesa, Arizona Message: 9 Date: Sat, 01 Feb 2003 19:53:31 -0000 From: "John " Subject: Re: Any stations using Kahn ? --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Possum Hunter" < possumhunter@n...> wrote: > It is no longer legal to use the Kahn ISB Stereo system anywhere in the > world. The only legal way to use the Kahn ISB system is in the Powerside > mode in Mono. > > That is the law, but there are two KAHN AM Stereo signals I can hear in this > market! Let's see, it's against the law, and there are no receivers, so why would a station do this? John This message has been composed of recycled electrons. None of these electrons has been harmed or injured in the creation and transmission of this message but they have been shamelessly exploited for this use. From jbyrns@enteract.com Sat Feb 01 21:40:38 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Feb 2003 05:40:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 3834 invoked from network); 2 Feb 2003 05:40:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Feb 2003 05:40:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.86) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Feb 2003 05:40:37 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.184] by n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Feb 2003 05:40:37 -0000 Date: Sun, 02 Feb 2003 05:40:35 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Kahn stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <010d01c2ca7c$408049e0$99f9bed8@com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 392 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.56 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" < amfmdx@f...> wrote: > John, > > I have a receiver and I can hear it. I guess I wasn't clear enough, I didn't mean that there aren't people like you out there, who have old production Kahn AM stereo receivers. What I meant was you can't go into Circuit City and buy a new Kahn AM stereo receiver. Regards, John Byrns From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sat Feb 01 21:47:41 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Feb 2003 05:47:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 48117 invoked from network); 2 Feb 2003 05:47:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Feb 2003 05:47:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.84) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Feb 2003 05:47:41 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.141] by n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Feb 2003 05:47:41 -0000 Date: Sun, 02 Feb 2003 05:47:39 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: MC13028 Decoder Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1007 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.238 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " wrote: > What is a "glorified envelope detector"? If I remember correctly the > 13020 uses a pseudo synchronous detector for the "envelope detector" > function. What sort of circuit is this "glorified envelope detector" > in the 13028? > > John It's just my way of saying that the envelope detector in the 13028 preforms much better than the pseudo synchronous envelope detector in the 13020. That extra processing is probably done to overcome some of the shortcomings of an envelope detector in less than optimal reception conditions. Rumor has it that the 13028 does some digital processing of signals and may derive the envelope from the I & Q synchronous detectors using the Pythagorean therum. Don't quote me on this though but it appears that Motorola has done something different for envelope detection to improve the performance but it's not as good as full synchronous detection in a high noise environment. JSG From possumhunter@netzero.net Sat Feb 01 21:54:55 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: possumhunter@netzero.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Feb 2003 05:54:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 56509 invoked from network); 2 Feb 2003 05:54:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Feb 2003 05:54:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rly-ip02.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.160) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Feb 2003 05:54:54 -0000 Received: from logs-wm.proxy.aol.com (logs-wm.proxy.aol.com [205.188.199.132]) by rly-ip02.mx.aol.com (v83.35) with ESMTP id RELAYIN1-0202005416; Sun, 02 Feb 2003 00:54:16 -0500 Received: from ibm (AC8422C2.ipt.aol.com [172.132.34.194]) by logs-wm.proxy.aol.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with SMTP id h125qBU4070863 for ; Sun, 2 Feb 2003 00:52:26 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <00fc01c2ca7f$3e94ed40$c22284ac@aoldsl.net> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Any stations using Kahn ? Date: Sun, 2 Feb 2003 00:51:52 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Apparently-From: DodgeRamTrucker@aol.com From: "Possum Hunter" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: > A few sledge hammers and or rocket launchers would probably work real well for them trashmitters...lol Don't tempt me! Kevin From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Feb 01 22:00:35 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Feb 2003 06:00:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 15819 invoked from network); 2 Feb 2003 06:00:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Feb 2003 06:00:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Feb 2003 06:00:35 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.185] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Feb 2003 06:00:35 -0000 Date: Sun, 02 Feb 2003 06:00:32 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: IBOC/"HD" in Stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1082 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.94.139 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > When it is installed, we'll record some new stereo tracks for you > to hear. > Right now, it sounds good with a mono source, but a little funky in > stereo. It's still a work in progress for AM, so we need to give > it time. The thing with any perceptually encoded digital audio system is that it lacks consistency. The limitations of analog media (S/N ratio, frequency response, etc.) are constant no matter what the audio content they are dealing with is. But, especially at the low bit-rates that IBOC/"HD Radio" uses, a digital system can sound almost perfectly fine for some music, but downright horrible for other music. With that in mind, I'd love to hear HD try to deal with 'challenging' songs like "Windy" by The Association (which is so much out-of-phase that it sounds like a mistake in the mastering process). Also, whether you personally care for it or not, '70s disco-style music is also a good test, as most of it contains very strong and clearly defined percussion -- the "Theme From Shaft" is a good example of this, with its killer hi-hats. From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sat Feb 01 22:00:40 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Feb 2003 06:00:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 26772 invoked from network); 2 Feb 2003 06:00:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Feb 2003 06:00:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Feb 2003 06:00:40 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.140] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Feb 2003 06:00:39 -0000 Date: Sun, 02 Feb 2003 06:00:39 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: MC13028 Decoder Finished and Available for Download Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 135 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.238 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst I have finished the decoder package and is available for download at: http://www.hal-pc.org/~jsgil/AM-Stereo/MC13028-Decoder.zip JSG From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Feb 01 22:09:34 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Feb 2003 06:09:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 54437 invoked from network); 2 Feb 2003 06:09:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Feb 2003 06:09:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Feb 2003 06:09:33 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.176] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Feb 2003 06:09:33 -0000 Date: Sun, 02 Feb 2003 06:09:29 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Kahn stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <010d01c2ca7c$408049e0$99f9bed8@com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 336 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.94.139 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > KSL no longer has any stereo of any kind but for a long time "Music > and the Spoken Word" was noted in Kahn stereo and it ran long after > 1992. The actual cut-off date by which all U.S. AM Stereo stations had to convert to C-Quam or drop to mono was some time in 1994, with Harris stations getting a few more months to convert. From rwagoner1@mac.com Sat Feb 01 23:10:54 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner1@mac.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Feb 2003 07:10:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 6659 invoked from network); 2 Feb 2003 07:10:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Feb 2003 07:10:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO fed1mtao01.cox.net) (68.6.19.244) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Feb 2003 07:10:53 -0000 Received: from mac.com ([68.4.33.253]) by fed1mtao01.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20030202071051.QTAM20584.fed1mtao01.cox.net@mac.com> for ; Sun, 2 Feb 2003 02:10:51 -0500 Message-ID: <3E3CC47C.50300@mac.com> Date: Sat, 01 Feb 2003 23:10:52 -0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20021120 Netscape/7.01 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Kahn stereo References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Richard Wagoner X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135738921 X-Yahoo-Profile: richardalanwagoner Of course you can't go in to Circuit City and buy ANY AM stereo receiver ... Richard > I guess I wasn't clear enough, I didn't mean that there aren't people > like you out there, who have old production Kahn AM stereo receivers. > What I meant was you can't go into Circuit City and buy a new Kahn AM > stereo receiver. From n0uiheric@aol.com Sat Feb 01 23:48:24 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Feb 2003 07:48:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 38232 invoked from network); 2 Feb 2003 07:48:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Feb 2003 07:48:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r07.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.103) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Feb 2003 07:48:22 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-r07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.8f.28dda08f (30970) for ; Sun, 2 Feb 2003 02:48:16 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <8f.28dda08f.2b6e2740@aol.com> Date: Sun, 2 Feb 2003 02:48:16 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Columbia~May God be with To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih Clear Channel DOES NOT KNOW HOW to cover news in the right way! It's no wonder I rely on NPR, CBC Radio One and the Voice of America for this information; commercial radio is too unreliable for news coverage. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From ccuff@in4web.com Sun Feb 02 00:50:55 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Feb 2003 08:50:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 18319 invoked from network); 2 Feb 2003 08:50:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Feb 2003 08:50:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Feb 2003 08:50:53 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.23]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Sun, 2 Feb 2003 03:47:06 -0500 Message-ID: <006401c2ca96$ef5c3d60$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: The Wrath of Kahn Date: Sun, 2 Feb 2003 03:41:51 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 I did a google search for "Leonard Kahn" and it comes up with his company name and address, and phone #- doing a Yahoo "people search" turned up several Leonard Kahns in the NY area cc ----- Original Message ----- From: Possum Hunter To: Sent: Saturday, February 01, 2003 11:45 PM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: The Wrath of Kahn > Anybody on the group know oif Kahn has a website? If not, what is the phone > number From alfredot@inetarena.com Sun Feb 02 00:53:00 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: alfredot@inetarena.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Feb 2003 08:52:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 67892 invoked from network); 2 Feb 2003 08:52:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Feb 2003 08:52:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.inetarena.com) (206.129.216.13) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Feb 2003 08:52:59 -0000 Received: from hendrie (1Cust21.tnt15.beaverton.or.da.uu.net [67.227.162.21]) by mail.inetarena.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h128oP803128 for ; Sun, 2 Feb 2003 00:50:25 -0800 (PST) Date: Sun, 2 Feb 2003 00:49:45 -0800 (PST) X-Sender: alfredo@hendrie.1610am.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Kevin's IBOC bandscan aircheck Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: "Alfredo E. Torrejon" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=25132238 X-Yahoo-Profile: alfredotorrejon I downloaded Kevin's IBOC bandscan, covering 650-770kHz. I've listened to it a couple of times, but I'm not sure that I've yet gotten my arms around what I'm hearing here. Two observations that I've made so far are: 1) The radio used had pretty good selectivity. The first thing that is heard is a WSM ID, with the expected sideband splatter from WFAN. A station that I presume to be WJR can also be heard (in stereo) at 760, adjacent to WABC. 2) There is an "asymmetrical" property to the interference heard; I can hear what sounds like distorted modulation on top of hiss (which I remember that Kevin mentioned in a prior post) at 740 kHz, but I don't hear it at 680 kHz. Kevin--did you try other radios, preferrably one with a loopstick antenna, at the site where you captured this aircheck? If you were to take a radio with a loopstick antenna out there, you could try to null out the 740 kHz interference and then check whether that nulls out WOR's signal, as well. If WOR ends up nulling out in a different direction from the 740 kHz interference, then the interference that you're hearing at that frequency is being caused by WOR's signal mixing with something else and is not the fault of WOR. Alfredo From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Feb 02 01:02:18 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Feb 2003 09:02:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 60686 invoked from network); 2 Feb 2003 09:02:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Feb 2003 09:02:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Feb 2003 09:02:17 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.142] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Feb 2003 09:02:17 -0000 Date: Sun, 02 Feb 2003 09:02:13 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: The Wrath of Kahn Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <006401c2ca96$ef5c3d60$0101a8c0@pavilion> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 404 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.94.139 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > I did a google search for "Leonard Kahn" and it comes up with his > company name and address, and phone #- doing a Yahoo "people > search" turned up several Leonard Kahns in the NY area Ol' Lenny's middle initial is "R.", if that helps narrow it down. BTW, a web search for "C-Quam" will often turn up several sites about some fellow named "Leonard C. Quam". Maybe we should get him on our team! From ccuff@in4web.com Sun Feb 02 01:24:11 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Feb 2003 09:24:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 3525 invoked from network); 2 Feb 2003 09:24:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Feb 2003 09:24:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Feb 2003 09:24:10 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.23]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Sun, 2 Feb 2003 04:20:22 -0500 Message-ID: <007201c2ca9b$954a2080$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: New batch transmitters ready Date: Sun, 2 Feb 2003 04:15:08 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 I have 10 "Alfredo Lite" transmitters ready to go- several folks on the list asked about them, so before they hit ebay this afternoon, they're here. After these 10 are gone, it will be about 3 months till the next batch due to time constraints here at home. I made a few minor changes, the best one now being that I am including an AC adapter circuit, and the crystals are now in a socket that accomodates either the plain 2 legged crystals or the Cardinal programmable crystals- (no soldering). Price is $125.00 including mailing in the US and Canada. (PayPal payment is most convienient) Chris From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sun Feb 02 02:03:15 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Feb 2003 10:03:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 35447 invoked from network); 2 Feb 2003 10:03:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Feb 2003 10:03:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Feb 2003 10:03:14 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.185] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Feb 2003 10:03:14 -0000 Date: Sun, 02 Feb 2003 10:03:13 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: The Wrath of Kahn Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <006401c2ca96$ef5c3d60$0101a8c0@pavilion> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 592 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.252 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Christopher Cuff" wrote: > I did a google search for "Leonard Kahn" and it comes up with his company > name and address, and phone #- doing a Yahoo "people search" turned up > several Leonard Kahns in the NY area > cc > Yea there's the famous lawsuit against GM in the search claiming that the C-QuAM cosine correction circuit is a ripoff of his inverse modulator. They actually do the opposite. Kahn's reduces envelope modulation while the cosine corrector increases it. http://www.law.emory.edu/fedcircuit/feb98/97-1277.wpd.html JSG From powell@conterra.com Sun Feb 02 04:35:30 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: powell@conterra.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Feb 2003 12:35:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 50905 invoked from network); 2 Feb 2003 12:35:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Feb 2003 12:35:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO ziggy.conterra.com) (66.112.206.20) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Feb 2003 12:35:29 -0000 Received: from ziggy.conterra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ziggy.conterra.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h12CZSgr058225 for ; Sun, 2 Feb 2003 07:35:28 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from powell@conterra.com) Received: (from www@localhost) by ziggy.conterra.com (8.12.6/8.12.6/Submit) id h12CZRue058224 for amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com; Sun, 2 Feb 2003 07:35:27 -0500 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: ziggy.conterra.com: www set sender to powell@conterra.com using -f Received: from 209.213.26.22 ( [209.213.26.22]) as user powell@mail.conterra.com by ziggy.conterra.com with HTTP; Sun, 2 Feb 2003 07:35:27 -0500 Message-ID: <1044189327.3e3d108fd8aed@ziggy.conterra.com> Date: Sun, 2 Feb 2003 07:35:27 -0500 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: WFIS References: <1044162974.2150.76907.m13@yahoogroups.com> In-Reply-To: <1044162974.2150.76907.m13@yahoogroups.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) 3.1 From: powell@conterra.com X-Originating-IP: 209.213.26.22 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=8062869 X-Yahoo-Profile: W4OPW BTW, Greetings everyone, this is my first posting. I have been threatening to subscribe forever, just found the "roundtoit" Powell W4OPW and sometimes even WKDK ( like right now ) Quoting possumhunter@netzero.net > Message: 25 > Date: Sun, 2 Feb 2003 00:15:56 -0500 > From: "Possum Hunter" > Subject: Re: Re: Any stations using Kahn ? > > Neal Newman wrote: > > You think that's bad.. That TIS is on the First adjacent Of WWRL... In > February of 2002 the FCC licensed a TIS station for the NJ Turnpike on 1680 > kHz right near you at Exit 16... which is still in my protected Contour. > > If you think THAT is bad, The FCC allowed short-spaced WTZQ 1600 to go > non-directional just 43 miles away from WFIS! WTZQ causes destructive > interference well within the Northwestern part of the .5mv/Meter contour of > WFIS, while WFIS causes destructive interference within the .5 mv/Meter > contour of WTZQ. When we turn off the WFIS transmitter, WTZQ has a quieting > signal at the WFIS transmitter site! Thee FCC guy who stamped his approval > on the WTZQ application to go Non-D needs to learn more about radio! This is true, but don't forget up that way ( and in your area, but worse west, is the HORRID ground conductivity. Don't forget if you turn off the WFIS transmitter and get WTZQ well, remember your tower is acting as a super antenna. As I head toward Georgia on I-85 WFIS holds in well for many miles, in fact better than I had originally thought. As a side note, when we had 1600 on the DX challenge on a list, WTZQ and the Fayettteville 1600 were dominant at night. How many ways do we spell CHEATING. Of course there are other cheaters on the frequency too! Also the WGIV 1600 in Charlotte had asked that their 1660 allocation be shifted to 1610. And while we are at that, why CAN'T 530 be allocated for regular BC use in the US. It's TOO valuable a frequency, but NOOOOOOOO !!! Powell > >How Do I get rid of them???? Its driving Me Nuts.... > > I have the same question. WFIS has been trying to be nice about it and just > get the FCC to move us up to 1610. We would be willing to give up 1600 with > only enough notice to order a 1610 crystal to switch the transmitter, and > are willing to order a DX-10, along with all of the needed upgrades to 10KW > the same day we are approved for 1610. > > We have also tried being not so nice about it without much result. In the > mean time, yet ANOTHER one of those damned "Talking House" trashmitters > showed up on 1610 today in our city of license. > > Frustrated, > Kevin ------------------------------------------------- This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/ From amstereoguy@hotmail.com Sun Feb 02 08:13:33 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereoguy@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Feb 2003 16:13:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 42252 invoked from network); 2 Feb 2003 16:13:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Feb 2003 16:13:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (207.68.165.100) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Feb 2003 16:13:32 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 2 Feb 2003 08:13:31 -0800 Received: from 208.20.8.54 by sea2fd.sea2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Sun, 02 Feb 2003 16:13:31 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: email problems Date: Sun, 02 Feb 2003 11:13:31 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 02 Feb 2003 16:13:31.0862 (UTC) FILETIME=[07920F60:01C2CAD6] From: "Chris Cuff" X-Originating-IP: [208.20.8.54] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37866059 If anyone neds to get in touch with me, Please use this email amstereoguy@hotmail.com Someone sent a virus this morning that wiped out my outhouse express,so my ccuff@in4web.com is out of order for now. Thanks, Chris _________________________________________________________________ Help STOP SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail From jbyrns@enteract.com Sun Feb 02 09:38:09 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Feb 2003 17:38:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 38726 invoked from network); 2 Feb 2003 17:38:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Feb 2003 17:38:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Feb 2003 17:38:07 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.152] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Feb 2003 17:37:40 -0000 Date: Sun, 02 Feb 2003 17:37:39 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Kevin's IBOC bandscan aircheck Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1539 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.98.202 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Alfredo E. Torrejon" < alfredot@i...> wrote: > I downloaded Kevin's IBOC bandscan, covering 650-770kHz. I've > listened to it a couple of times, but I'm not sure that I've yet gotten my > arms around what I'm hearing here. Two observations that I've made so far > are: > 1) The radio used had pretty good selectivity. The first thing that is > heard is a WSM ID, with the expected sideband splatter from WFAN. A > station that I presume to be WJR can also be heard (in stereo) at 760, > adjacent to WABC. > 2) There is an "asymmetrical" property to the interference heard; I can > hear what sounds like distorted modulation on top of hiss (which I > remember that Kevin mentioned in a prior post) at 740 kHz, but I don't > hear it at 680 kHz. > Kevin--did you try other radios, preferrably one with a loopstick > antenna, at the site where you captured this aircheck? If you were to > take a radio with a loopstick antenna out there, you could try to null out > the 740 kHz interference and then check whether that nulls out WOR's > signal, as well. If WOR ends up nulling out in a different direction from > the 740 kHz interference, then the interference that you're hearing at > that frequency is being caused by WOR's signal mixing with something else > and is not the fault of WOR. Of course using a radio with a "loopstick antenna", that forms part of a resonant tuned circuit, may eliminate the interference problem even before he starts trying to null out various signals. John From amfmdx@fastq.com Sun Feb 02 09:47:22 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Feb 2003 17:47:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 50915 invoked from network); 2 Feb 2003 17:47:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Feb 2003 17:47:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Feb 2003 17:47:21 -0000 Received: from fastq (d56-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.88]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id h12HlKU61989 for ; Sun, 2 Feb 2003 10:47:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <007601c2cae3$07e302a0$88f9bed8@com> To: Subject: It ain't at WalMart Date: Sun, 2 Feb 2003 10:46:34 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla John, Your point is more than valid. You sure can't buy anything AM stereo at WalMart. I don't even think you can buy it in Japan. You can't buy anything IBOC anywhere and its not yet in stereo. Kevin ....John Byrns wrote.... I guess I wasn't clear enough, I didn't mean that there aren't people like you out there, who have old production Kahn AM stereo receivers. What I meant was you can't go into Circuit City and buy a new Kahn AM stereo receiver. Regards, John Byrns This message has been composed of recycled electrons. None of these electrons has been harmed or injured in the creation and transmission of this message but they have been shamelessly exploited for this use. From amfmdx@fastq.com Sun Feb 02 09:49:45 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Feb 2003 17:49:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 43766 invoked from network); 2 Feb 2003 17:49:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Feb 2003 17:49:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Feb 2003 17:49:45 -0000 Received: from fastq (d56-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.88]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id h12HniU62037 for ; Sun, 2 Feb 2003 10:49:44 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <007e01c2cae3$5db19020$88f9bed8@com> To: Subject: Kahn Date: Sun, 2 Feb 2003 10:48:58 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla Let me put it this way KT. It ran in stereo for that program until after the change of the millenium. Kevin Mesa, Arizona Message: 11 Date: Sun, 02 Feb 2003 06:09:29 -0000 From: "Kevin T. " Subject: Re: Kahn stereo > KSL no longer has any stereo of any kind but for a long time "Music > and the Spoken Word" was noted in Kahn stereo and it ran long after > 1992. The actual cut-off date by which all U.S. AM Stereo stations had to convert to C-Quam or drop to mono was some time in 1994, with Harris stations getting a few more months to convert. This message has been composed of recycled electrons. None of these electrons has been harmed or injured in the creation and transmission of this message but they have been shamelessly exploited for this use. From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sun Feb 02 11:13:19 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Feb 2003 19:13:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 6418 invoked from network); 2 Feb 2003 19:13:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Feb 2003 19:13:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Feb 2003 19:13:18 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.168] by n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Feb 2003 19:13:04 -0000 Date: Sun, 02 Feb 2003 19:13:03 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: email problems Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 534 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.130.93 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Chris Cuff" wrote: > > If anyone neds to get in touch with me, Please use this email > amstereoguy@h... > Someone sent a virus this morning that wiped out my outhouse express,so my > ccuff@i... is out of order for now. > Thanks, > Chris > Do yourself a favor and stop using LookOut Express. It is the biggest hole for virulii to creep into your system and you will always be on the lookout for them. You would be better off with Netscape-Mozilla, Eudora or Pegasus. JSG From stodd@sherbtel.net Sun Feb 02 11:58:35 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Feb 2003 19:58:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 29347 invoked from network); 2 Feb 2003 19:58:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Feb 2003 19:58:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Feb 2003 19:58:34 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-254.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.254]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h12JwUhF003219 for ; Sun, 2 Feb 2003 13:58:32 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <001f01c2caf5$b810c420$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} 970 WWDJ... another IBOC station soon? Date: Sun, 2 Feb 2003 14:00:19 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude If there's any push to add HD to Salem's stations, I haven't heard about it. In fact I've detected no enthusiasm at all. That's not to say we won't, but we're not interested in being guinea pigs either. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: > For the record, WWDJ is, and as far as I can tell always has been, a > plain mono station, and they are owned by Salem Communications. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Feb 02 12:03:46 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Feb 2003 20:03:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 41050 invoked from network); 2 Feb 2003 20:03:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Feb 2003 20:03:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Feb 2003 20:03:45 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.163] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Feb 2003 20:03:45 -0000 Date: Sun, 02 Feb 2003 20:03:42 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Kevin's IBOC bandscan aircheck Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1455 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.85.19 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Of course using a radio with a "loopstick antenna", that forms part > of a resonant tuned circuit, may eliminate the interference problem > even before he starts trying to null out various signals. I'm not sure if it counts as a "loopstick", but I was using a Panasonic walkman for this recording, which does have a (tiny) built-in ferrite bar antenna, and that was the only thing I was using (i.e. no Select-A-Tenna to help it). And to be fair, if I turned the receiver in a certain direction, the "splatter" interference to 740 and 750 kHz did reduce... and this also seemed to be the direction which reduced the strength of WOR's signal. In other words, in the directions in which WOR's signal was the strongest, this interference was the strongest as well. Also take a listen to the daytime band-scans in the Files section here. They exhibit the same problem, as heard on several receivers, including a Clarion car radio and a Panasonic home stereo system (with manual tuning). And for the record, I also hear this interference on my GE Superadio III, despite the accounts from some other WOR listeners with Superadios who claim they aren't getting this interference. However, these listeners are probably in the southeast lobe of WOR's directional signal (aimed right at NYC), while my listening (both at home and in the car) has all been done in the lesser southwest lobe of WOR's signal (the "legacy" lobe towards Philly). From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Feb 02 12:16:15 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Feb 2003 20:16:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 85813 invoked from network); 2 Feb 2003 20:16:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Feb 2003 20:16:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Feb 2003 20:16:15 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.143] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Feb 2003 20:16:14 -0000 Date: Sun, 02 Feb 2003 20:16:14 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: email problems Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1038 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.85.19 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Do yourself a favor and stop using LookOut Express. It is the > biggest hole for virulii to creep into your system and you will > always be on the lookout for them. You would be better off with > Netscape-Mozilla, Eudora or Pegasus. Any e-mail program that gives you manual control over attachments is fine. That way you can just delete any suspicious attachments before they have any chance to cause trouble. Some e-mail software is not only configured to automatically download and run .EXE attachments, but to also read JavaScript code in e-mails. That is just asking for serious trouble! Cautious users don't even leave JavaScript enabled while surfing the Web, and only turn it on for web sites which require it and that you know are legitimate. This is part of why I set up this group to not allow e-mail attachments. While the sharing of .JPG images is sometimes useful, the security and virus risk of HTML, JavaScript, and executable attachments is not worth it. Besides, plain text is a lot easier to read. From jbyrns@enteract.com Sun Feb 02 14:28:08 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Feb 2003 22:28:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 64643 invoked from network); 2 Feb 2003 22:28:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Feb 2003 22:28:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.66) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Feb 2003 22:28:07 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.158] by n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Feb 2003 22:28:07 -0000 Date: Sun, 02 Feb 2003 22:28:06 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Kevin's IBOC bandscan aircheck Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2981 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.195 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " < kevtronics@y...> wrote: > > Of course using a radio with a "loopstick antenna", that forms part > > of a resonant tuned circuit, may eliminate the interference problem > > even before he starts trying to null out various signals. > > I'm not sure if it counts as a "loopstick", but I was using a > Panasonic walkman for this recording, which does have a (tiny) > built-in ferrite bar antenna, and that was the only thing I was > using (i.e. no Select-A-Tenna to help it). I'm not familiar with "walkman" technology, to know if it is a tuned antenna or not, it certainly sounds like it has directional characteristics though, as you would expect in a "walkman" type radio. A Select-A-Tenna would probably help reduce any spurious responses the radio may generate. It would probably be a good idy it with a Select- A-Tenna, and see if the interference is reduced, or eliminated, if it is then the problem is in the radio, not WOR. Of course you must insure that the Select-A-Tenna is tuned to the frequency you are monitoring, or else it could make the interference worse. I guess I don't understand why you say "no Select-A-Tenna to help it", that makes it sound like you are not keeping an open mind, and are trying to pin the blame on WOR, and not the radio. > And to be fair, if I turned the receiver in a certain direction, the > "splatter" interference to 740 and 750 kHz did reduce... and this > also seemed to be the direction which reduced the strength of WOR's > signal. In other words, in the directions in which WOR's signal was > the strongest, this interference was the strongest as well. If it is a second or third order IM product in the receiver, you need to check to see if there is another orientation that reduces the interference, besides the one that nulls WOR. Of course, if the other station(S) that is involved in creating the IM product is on the same bearing, or the same bearing plus 180 degrees, then you won't see the interference nulled at two orientations of the radio. > Also take a listen to the daytime band-scans in the Files section > here. They exhibit the same problem, as heard on several receivers, > including a Clarion car radio and a Panasonic home stereo system > (with manual tuning). > > And for the record, I also hear this interference on my GE Superadio > III, despite the accounts from some other WOR listeners with > Superadios who claim they aren't getting this interference. However, > these listeners are probably in the southeast lobe of WOR's > directional signal (aimed right at NYC), while my listening (both at > home and in the car) has all been done in the lesser southwest lobe > of WOR's signal (the "legacy" lobe towards Philly). I don't understand this last comment at all, I would think the interference would be worse in the stronger lobe, whether the problme is with WOR, or is in the radio? John From rwagoner1@mac.com Sun Feb 02 14:54:12 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner1@mac.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Feb 2003 22:54:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 88940 invoked from network); 2 Feb 2003 22:54:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Feb 2003 22:54:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO fed1mtao01.cox.net) (68.6.19.244) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Feb 2003 22:54:09 -0000 Received: from mac.com ([68.4.33.253]) by fed1mtao01.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20030202225409.UQBV20584.fed1mtao01.cox.net@mac.com> for ; Sun, 2 Feb 2003 17:54:09 -0500 Message-ID: <3E3DA191.4010100@mac.com> Date: Sun, 02 Feb 2003 14:54:09 -0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20021120 Netscape/7.01 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: email problems References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Richard Wagoner X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135738921 X-Yahoo-Profile: richardalanwagoner I handle virus attacks by using a Mac. I can use any email program without worry. Richard > > Do yourself a favor and stop using LookOut Express. It is the > > biggest hole for virulii to creep into your system and you will > > always be on the lookout for them. You would be better off with > > Netscape-Mozilla, Eudora or Pegasus. > > Any e-mail program that gives you manual control over attachments is > fine. That way you can just delete any suspicious attachments before > they have any chance to cause trouble. > > Some e-mail software is not only configured to automatically download > and run .EXE attachments, but to also read JavaScript code in > e-mails. That is just asking for serious trouble! Cautious users > don't even leave JavaScript enabled while surfing the Web, and only > turn it on for web sites which require it and that you know are > legitimate. > > This is part of why I set up this group to not allow e-mail > attachments. While the sharing of .JPG images is sometimes useful, > the security and virus risk of HTML, JavaScript, and executable > attachments is not worth it. Besides, plain text is a lot easier to > read. From ccuff@in4web.com Sun Feb 02 14:55:29 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Feb 2003 22:55:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 90422 invoked from network); 2 Feb 2003 22:55:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Feb 2003 22:55:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Feb 2003 22:55:29 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.138]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Sun, 2 Feb 2003 17:51:41 -0500 Message-ID: <001c01c2cb0c$ebe69b00$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: email problems Date: Sun, 2 Feb 2003 17:46:26 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 It's all fixed now. I found out from a few other people that my problem was similar to what they had, and running scandisk fixed it. .... for now.... CC ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Sunday, February 02, 2003 3:16 PM Subject: {AMSF} Re: email problems > > Do yourself a favor and stop using LookOut Express. From ccuff@in4web.com Sun Feb 02 14:59:24 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Feb 2003 22:59:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 71743 invoked from network); 2 Feb 2003 22:59:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Feb 2003 22:59:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Feb 2003 22:59:23 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.138]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Sun, 2 Feb 2003 17:55:36 -0500 Message-ID: <002201c2cb0d$77b8ac40$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: Re:interference froom loopsticks Date: Sun, 2 Feb 2003 17:50:21 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 From the beginning of AM stereo, ferrite antennas have posed problems. Due to the high Q of a ferrite antenna, it makes them far more vulnerable to internal hash- even from the LED! That is why the external loop sets like the mini systems work out well. Keeping the decoder way away from the antenna is most important. I know that the later Aiwa and Sony walkmans (digital) often fully enclosed the decoder area in tin. CC ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Sunday, February 02, 2003 5:28 PM Subject: {AMSF} Re: Kevin's IBOC bandscan aircheck From KC4QLP@aol.com Sun Feb 02 15:18:53 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Feb 2003 23:18:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 52318 invoked from network); 2 Feb 2003 23:18:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Feb 2003 23:18:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r10.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.106) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Feb 2003 23:18:53 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r10.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.157.1b40b8fe (4410) for ; Sun, 2 Feb 2003 18:18:43 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <157.1b40b8fe.2b6f0153@aol.com> Date: Sun, 2 Feb 2003 18:18:43 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: email problems To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > > Do yourself a favor and stop using LookOut Express. It is the > > biggest hole for virulii to creep into your system and you will > > always be on the lookout for them. You would be better off with > > Netscape-Mozilla, Eudora or Pegasus. Isnt that the truth....using "Lookin You Up Exploder" AKA Outlook Express is only asking for trouble from those that like to send viruses and the nasty like. Thats one of the better things about AOL (aggrevation on line),..you have better control of what gets on the hard drive. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net http://www.geocities.com/midatlanticengineeringservice Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net voice contact-252-335-0856 fax 1-209-254-8978 _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From KC4QLP@aol.com Sun Feb 02 15:20:32 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Feb 2003 23:20:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 78175 invoked from network); 2 Feb 2003 23:20:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Feb 2003 23:20:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r07.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.103) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Feb 2003 23:20:27 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.ab.28e18da8 (4410) for ; Sun, 2 Feb 2003 18:20:17 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Sun, 2 Feb 2003 18:20:16 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: email problems To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Also set for no HTML messages here as well..which is another good thing to do to stop violient programs dead in there tracks. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sun Feb 02 17:41:22 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 3 Feb 2003 01:41:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 57013 invoked from network); 3 Feb 2003 01:41:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Feb 2003 01:41:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Feb 2003 01:41:20 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.191] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Feb 2003 01:41:20 -0000 Date: Mon, 03 Feb 2003 01:41:19 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re:interference froom loopsticks Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <002201c2cb0d$77b8ac40$0101a8c0@pavilion> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1424 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.130.18 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Christopher Cuff" wrote: > From the beginning of AM stereo, ferrite antennas have posed problems. Due > to the high Q of a ferrite antenna, it makes them far more vulnerable to > internal hash- even from the LED! > That is why the external loop sets like the mini systems work out well. > Keeping the decoder way away from the antenna is most important. > I know that the later Aiwa and Sony walkmans (digital) often fully enclosed > the decoder area in tin. > CC > Their Q doesn't vary linearly with a change in frequency to maintain the same BW across the dial. At 530kHz the BW may be as narrow as 7-8KHz making the audio sound bassy and muffled even if you have a wide IF filter. At 1700KHz the BW can be as wide as 25KHz which causes little high end roll off and great sound. This makes it real hard to develop a fixed EQ that gives a balanced frequency response acroos the whole dial. Lets say the ideal RF BW for a wideband AM Stereo receiver is 12.5KHz. At 530KHz the Q would need to be 42 and at 1700KHz the Q would be 136. Solid core materials like ferrite and iron powder tend to have a fairly flat Q across the their useable BW in most cases as seen in some of the graphs in the Amidon brochures. However this is not a problem for the air core antennas that are many inches in diameter and probably maintain a fairly constant BW across the AM dial. JSG From dav259@csiro.au Sun Feb 02 19:04:32 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 3 Feb 2003 03:04:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 40050 invoked from network); 3 Feb 2003 03:04:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Feb 2003 03:04:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Feb 2003 03:04:30 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1334TR02496 for ; Mon, 3 Feb 2003 14:04:29 +1100 (EST) Date: Mon, 3 Feb 2003 14:04:29 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: amstereoforum Subject: 65% US local satisfaction??? Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=112635033 From Ian McRae's [AllAboutRadio] The Radio Wave #14 Meanwhile, in the U.S. everything's just fine and dandy in Radioland, according to an NAB study: about 78% of Americans surveyed in a MELLMAN GROUP poll commissioned by the NAB believe radio stations regularly provide important news and information relevant to local communities. Only 3% said local stations are "not at all important" in providing relevant community news and information. Pollster MARK MELLMAN is quoted by the NAB as saying "Americans are satisfied with the job local radio stations are doing providing them with news, information and entertainment programming." This study also claims that by a 5-1 margin (65% to 13%), consumers are satisfied with overall local radio programming, with 77% agreeing that their favourite local radio stations provide the music that they like all, most, or some of the time, with 13% saying local stations rarely or never carry music that they like. Only 17% of survey subjects said local stations are providing less variety than they were 5 years ago, with 29% saying that stations are providing more variety, and 21% saying that they are providing the same amount of variety. Ian McRae's comment: ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Well, that report's got me scratching my head. It does't reflect what I'm hearing from Radio Wave subscribers in the U.S. Ian Davidson's comment: ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Me too 3XY! Sounds like a flawed survey to me. From stodd@sherbtel.net Sun Feb 02 19:58:34 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 3 Feb 2003 03:58:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 42889 invoked from network); 3 Feb 2003 03:58:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Feb 2003 03:58:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Feb 2003 03:58:32 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-103.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.103]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h133wThF016600 for ; Sun, 2 Feb 2003 21:58:30 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <00ae01c2cb38$c5d25c20$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} 65% US local satisfaction??? Date: Sun, 2 Feb 2003 22:00:18 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Me three, to use an old Three Stooges line. That was my reaction when I saw that published a few weeks ago. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ian Davidson" > Ian McRae's comment: > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > Well, that report's got me scratching my head. It does't reflect > what I'm hearing from Radio Wave subscribers in the U.S. > > Ian Davidson's comment: > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > Me too 3XY! Sounds like a flawed survey to me. From possumhunter@netzero.net Sun Feb 02 21:08:09 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 3 Feb 2003 05:08:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 35778 invoked from network); 3 Feb 2003 05:08:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Feb 2003 05:08:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.121) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Feb 2003 05:08:07 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 2 Feb 2003 21:08:07 -0800 To: References: <1044162974.2150.76907.m13@yahoogroups.com> <1044189327.3e3d108fd8aed@ziggy.conterra.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} WFIS Date: Mon, 3 Feb 2003 00:07:48 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 03 Feb 2003 05:08:07.0242 (UTC) FILETIME=[3D0E42A0:01C2CB42] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.134.106.243] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 powell@conterra.com wrote: > This is true, but don't forget up that way ( and in your area, but worse west, is the HORRID ground conductivity. Yes, and that does not help maters any, but I have listener's letters from as far Northwest as Cherokee, NC from the time WTZQ went dark about 10 years ago. > > Don't forget if you turn off the WFIS transmitter and get WTZQ well, remember your tower is acting as a super antenna. As I head toward Georgia on I-85 WFIS holds in well for many miles, in fact better than I had originally thought. Oh yes, WFIS has a killer signal into Georgia on I-85 and down past Greenwood to Promised Land. We have a very good signal to Joanna at the I-26 / I-385 junction. and We do very well in Woodruff and Enoree. My brand new ground system ROCKS! WTZQ can be heard under our signal from SC 20 to SC 101 on I-85. It can also be heard under our signal in Western Mauldin, Moonville, and Conestee. WTZQ kills our signal anywhere Northwest of Downtown Greenville when they are cheating. > > As a side note, when we had 1600 on the DX challenge on a list, WTZQ and the Fayetteville 1600 were dominant at night. How many ways do we spell CHEATING. Of course there are other cheaters on the frequency too! 1600 is quickly becoming another Class C channel at night. On our night power of 25 Watts, we used to get into Greenville, now we are lucky to hit Mauldin. When I was doing transmitter work last month, we were running our backup LPB transmitter on 25 Watts during the Day. WTZQ was clear as a bell in Northern Simpsonville, one of our cities of license! It is a shame Barnstable "stole" Newberry's FM, WGVC. They moved the license to Simpsonville with the transmitter at a cell tower in Spartanburg County and the studio is in with WROQ and WTPT in Greenville. But then, I am sure you are glad to get rid of that 25KW FM competing with your station! > > And while we are at that, why CAN'T 530 be allocated for regular BC use in the US. It's TOO valuable a frequency, but NOOOOOOOO !!! Cost of building the tower aside, it would be a killer channel during the day, but at night there is the flame thrower signal of Radio Vision Cristiana from South Caicos blasting away with 100,000 Watts! Kevin From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Mon Feb 03 00:25:59 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 3 Feb 2003 08:25:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 23613 invoked from network); 3 Feb 2003 08:25:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Feb 2003 08:25:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf19bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.179) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Feb 2003 08:25:55 -0000 Received: from juan ([67.34.193.158]) by imf19bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.25 201-253-122-122-125-20020815) with SMTP id <20030203082752.DIXV24826.imf19bis.bellsouth.net@juan>; Mon, 3 Feb 2003 03:27:52 -0500 Message-ID: <028b01c2cb5d$dfde7390$af78fea9@juan> To: , Subject: Detroit AM Stereo Date: Mon, 3 Feb 2003 03:25:56 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Thanks for the info John and Mark !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I must say I loved CFCO 630 AM A full Service AM Station in Strereo that played lots of music. This is all I listened to while in Detroit, and my visit to Windsor, Ontario. Had a bad experience coming back to the USA from Windsor.....yikes, make sure you take a Passport, or birth certificate when visiting Canada. I was lucky to make it back without a Passport...all I had was a DL and Voter's card. The immigration guy was an A** on my way back to the States. I know it's their job, but they need a lesson in courtesy ! Oh well........CFCO is a great station...what a signal ! What a station. Full Service in AM Stereo ! Juan Hi, I'm not sure what route you're taking to Troy, Michigan - but here's a few stations you may want to tune into. 1) CFCO 630 AM Stereo - Chatham, Ontario - good in Eastern Michigan, SW Ontario 24/7 and during the day in Northern Ohio. 2) WJR 760 AM Stereo - Detroit. Best 7-9am Sunday Morning "Patterns in Music" stereo music programming. Might be something on earlier than that too. 3) WAAM 1600 AM Stereo - Ann Arbor, Michigan. 4) WFOB 1430 AM Stereo - Fostoria, Ohio (IF you're driving down the Ohio Turnpike between Sandusky & Toledo. AT NIGHT ONLY: 720 WGN /890 WLS Chicago. Let me know if there's anything else you'd like to know about SE Michigan! John P. I live in Sterling Heights,MI which is right near Troy! You will definitely want to listen to 630 CFCO out of Chatham,ON. They play a nice blend of 60's-80's music and are a great example of a full service radio station...I wish there were more like them! There is also a local religious station on 1340 that has AM$, but I don't really listen to them.(can't remember the calls...WEXL maybe?) 1070 out of Sarnia,ON has an on-again, off-again pilot, but I have not gotten any separation when the pilot is on. By far the most listenable besides WJR will be CFCO. Mark Sterling Heights,MI [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From dwtpa97@earthlink.net Mon Feb 03 04:34:19 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dwtpa97@earthlink.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 3 Feb 2003 12:34:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 30092 invoked from network); 3 Feb 2003 12:34:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Feb 2003 12:34:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO snipe.mail.pas.earthlink.net) (207.217.120.62) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Feb 2003 12:34:17 -0000 Received: from sdn-ap-013scfairp0414.dialsprint.net ([63.183.129.160] helo=earthlink.net) by snipe.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 18ffnj-00064m-00 for amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com; Mon, 03 Feb 2003 04:34:16 -0800 Message-ID: <3E3E61EB.4E7B71B6@earthlink.net> Date: Mon, 03 Feb 2003 07:34:51 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.79 [en]C-CCK-MCD NSCPCD472 (Windows NT 5.0; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} 65% US local satisfaction??? References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: dwtpa97 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38076959 Those statistics, even if true, are misleading. To begin with, most Americans are very ignorant of any amount of detail pertaining to local or even national news. At best, they only know headline and sensational stories. They wouldn't know news detail, particularly local, if it hit them in the face. Secondly, they aren't interested in more detail - they only want to be entertained and not informed, with the exception of headline-type information. (This might help to explain their reported sense of satisfaction with current media.) In terms of variety, it's a demographic thing. Since the mega-companies are programming to the major demographic groups, it goes without saying that these larger targeted groups are being covered in one way or another. What the statistics don't say is whether such a restrictive and predictable agenda is culturally in the nation's best interest. The programming tends to be geared toward the lowest cultural level within any particular demographic group, which may have long term adverse consequences to traditional and fundamental American values. Dick W. Ian Davidson wrote: > >From Ian McRae's [AllAboutRadio] The Radio Wave #14 > > Meanwhile, in the U.S. everything's just fine and dandy in > Radioland, according to an NAB study: about 78% of Americans > surveyed in a MELLMAN GROUP poll commissioned by the NAB believe > radio stations regularly provide important news and information > relevant to local communities. > > Only 3% said local stations are "not at all important" in > providing relevant community news and information. > > Pollster MARK MELLMAN is quoted by the NAB as saying "Americans > are satisfied with the job local radio stations are doing > providing them with news, information and entertainment > programming." > > This study also claims that by a 5-1 margin (65% to 13%), > consumers are satisfied with overall local radio programming, > with 77% agreeing that their favourite local radio stations > provide the music that they like all, most, or some of the time, > with 13% saying local stations rarely or never carry music > that they like. > > Only 17% of survey subjects said local stations are providing > less variety than they were 5 years ago, with 29% saying that > stations are providing more variety, and 21% saying that they > are providing the same amount of variety. > > Ian McRae's comment: > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > Well, that report's got me scratching my head. It does't reflect > what I'm hearing from Radio Wave subscribers in the U.S. > > Ian Davidson's comment: From florida_amstereo@hotmail.com Mon Feb 03 05:19:57 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: florida_amstereo@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 3 Feb 2003 13:19:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 91632 invoked from network); 3 Feb 2003 13:19:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Feb 2003 13:19:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.37.14) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Feb 2003 13:19:55 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 3 Feb 2003 05:13:50 -0800 Received: from 199.173.224.2 by pv2fd.pav2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Mon, 03 Feb 2003 13:13:49 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Re: {AMSF} 65% US local satisfaction??? Date: Mon, 03 Feb 2003 13:13:49 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 03 Feb 2003 13:13:50.0220 (UTC) FILETIME=[179FCCC0:01C2CB86] From: "Donn Tillman" X-Originating-IP: [199.173.224.2] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83914824 I hate to sound "Clintonian" here, but what is the definition of "news"?....if it's as Dick defines it below, then the American public gets the news, no matter how sensational or irrelevant it may be to the "big picture". To me Michael Jackson dangling kids over the balcony or O.J. bashing his 17 daughter against the wall in the family dispute this past week (the 911 tape being played repeatedly) is not news. An outbreak of ethics in a large corporation, now that would be news! :) Another question, I have is who was questioned, and when........... if the survey was taken within a month after 11 September 2001 or taken on this past Saturday, immediately after the space shuttle tragedy, then of course, the results are skewed. ClearChannel's WFLA was spending about 15 per cent of their airtime yesterday patting themselves on the back for covering Saturday's tragedy better than any other radio station. What they didn't say was that thanks to consolidation that WFLA is the only a.m. station in the St Petersburg/Tampa market with a news department! (and the St Petersburg/Tampa radio market is in the top 20 nationally). As recently as five and a half years ago there were 4 a.m.radio stations with their own news departments. donn not satisfied with news coverage in this radio market. btw - there is not one news station here, such as WCBS in NYC; the news/talk moniker that many stations use is misleading and should be talk/some news Monday - Friday); but I realize that doesn't roll of the tongue as well and certainly doesn't sound good. ---Original Message Follows---- From: dwtpa97 Reply-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} 65% US local satisfaction??? Date: Mon, 03 Feb 2003 07:34:51 -0500 Those statistics, even if true, are misleading. To begin with, most Americans are very ignorant of any amount of detail pertaining to local or even national news. At best, they only know headline and sensational stories. They wouldn't know news detail, particularly local, if it hit them in the face. Secondly, they aren't interested in more detail - they only want to be entertained and not informed, with the exception of headline-type information. (This might help to explain their reported sense of satisfaction with current media.) _________________________________________________________________ Add photos to your messages with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail From philipr@irac.pe.ca Mon Feb 03 06:57:29 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 3 Feb 2003 14:57:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 53257 invoked from network); 3 Feb 2003 14:57:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Feb 2003 14:57:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.84) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Feb 2003 14:57:26 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.130] by n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Feb 2003 14:57:26 -0000 Date: Mon, 03 Feb 2003 14:57:25 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Select-a-tenna and Alfredo-Lite Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1774 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking A few months ago, some members of the forum was discussing loading coils / capacitors for tuning an antenna for best transmission on an Alfredo-Lite transmitter. At the time, I speculated that maybe a select-a-tenna might also work as a tuning device. At the time, I was without a SAT [having given my previous one as a gift to one brother, the one before that had been given to another brother]so it was just a theory. Since both brothers are now SAT equiped, I'll be keeping this one! Well, I have a SAT again [541M with the important front mounted jack] and I tried hooking it up to go in series - thanks to the 1/8" jack - with the antenna lead from the AL transmitter to a very modest antenna. The SAT tunes the antenna quite well, making a big improvement in transmitted signal strength. I also find it much easier to tune for good stereo reception on a Sony SRF-42 when using the SAT as a transmitting antenna tuner. Of course, all I have to do is pull the plug, then I can remove the antenna for dxing. I wouldn't suggest buying a SAT just for this, but if you are thinking of buying a SAT anyway for a nice receiving boost, I'd suggest paying the extra $10 to get the 541M [with jack]over the plain 541. Then it can double as an Alfredo-Lite tuner. You can also have fun by hooking the SAT 541M up to an oscilloscope to examine the rf waveforms of your signal - or other strong local signals. There is the rare occasional receiver with antenna jacks that may benefit from a direct connection to a SAT too - but all the rigs I've tried to date prefer the SAT simply being placed near the internal antenna. Of course, you can always try your talents at making a homemade SAT, and use that for your A-L transmitter as well! Phil R. From dwtpa97@earthlink.net Mon Feb 03 07:01:42 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dwtpa97@earthlink.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 3 Feb 2003 15:01:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 64025 invoked from network); 3 Feb 2003 15:01:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Feb 2003 15:01:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO snipe.mail.pas.earthlink.net) (207.217.120.62) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Feb 2003 15:01:42 -0000 Received: from sdn-ap-013scfairp0069.dialsprint.net ([63.183.128.69] helo=earthlink.net) by snipe.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 18fi6L-0004PK-00 for amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com; Mon, 03 Feb 2003 07:01:38 -0800 Message-ID: <3E3E847C.45E18966@earthlink.net> Date: Mon, 03 Feb 2003 10:02:20 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.79 [en]C-CCK-MCD NSCPCD472 (Windows NT 5.0; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} 65% US local satisfaction??? References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: dwtpa97 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38076959 My point was that sensational or headline news is ALL that they get. I think it takes more information than that to vote intelligently at the polls. It's even possible that we might not elect the best person because of our limited information - (Can anyone identify with this?) Dick W. Donn Tillman wrote: > I hate to sound "Clintonian" here, but what is the definition of > "news"?....if it's as Dick defines it below, then the American public gets > the news, no matter how sensational or irrelevant it may be to the "big > picture". > > > ---Original Message Follows---- > From: dwtpa97 > Reply-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com > To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: {AMSF} 65% US local satisfaction??? > Date: Mon, 03 Feb 2003 07:34:51 -0500 > > Those statistics, even if true, are misleading. To begin with, most > Americans are very ignorant of any amount of detail pertaining to local or > even national news. At best, they only know headline and sensational > stories. They wouldn't know news detail, particularly local, if it hit them > in the face. Secondly, they aren't interested in more detail - they only > want to be entertained and not informed, with the exception of headline-type > information. (This might help to explain their reported sense of > satisfaction with current media.) > From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Feb 03 07:19:17 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 3 Feb 2003 15:19:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 52013 invoked from network); 3 Feb 2003 15:19:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Feb 2003 15:19:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Feb 2003 15:19:16 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.138] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Feb 2003 15:19:15 -0000 Date: Mon, 03 Feb 2003 15:19:12 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Select-a-tenna and Alfredo-Lite Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 497 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > The SAT tunes the antenna quite well, making a big improvement in > transmitted signal strength. I also find it much easier to tune for > good stereo reception on a Sony SRF-42 when using the SAT as a > transmitting antenna tuner. How did you wire it up -- in series or in parallel with the antenna? I'd like to try this myself, with my similarly designed (and much more stylish-looking!) Terk "AM Advantage" loop antenna, which has an external antenna jack at no extra charge. From mwradio@gmx.net Mon Feb 03 07:44:49 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: mwradio@gmx.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 3 Feb 2003 15:44:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 35165 invoked from network); 3 Feb 2003 15:44:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Feb 2003 15:44:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m1.ispmail.dnbsi.com) (198.136.194.44) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Feb 2003 15:44:45 -0000 Received: from espositojm2 (0-1pool196-67.nas11.philadelphia1.pa.us.da.qwest.net [65.128.196.67]) by m1.ispmail.dnbsi.com (Postfix) with SMTP id B10BF8FB21 for ; Mon, 3 Feb 2003 07:44:43 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <018701c2cb9b$2ae64a60$06630780@espositojm2> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Select-a-tenna and Alfredo-Lite Date: Mon, 3 Feb 2003 10:44:40 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Joe Esposito" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=93604673 X-Yahoo-Profile: espositojm What kind of improvement did you see? A few feet? More? I was thinking of doing something similar to what you did. I wanted to have an antenna setup for my AL in my car so I planned on running the antenna out wire of my AL through the internal part of a Radio Shack loop antenna. I would then run the external output jack from the tuned Loop to my car antenna. I have a ccrane car antenna that I picked up at a hamfest for pennies. It has a spring coil at the base of the antenna so I thought I would just slip the external output wire from the Loop into the coil base... Here's the antenna: http://www.ccrane.com/am_fm_auto_antenna.asp Any other ideas? I want to re-transmit something from my car into an office building. The distance is about 100-150 feet? Joe Esposito ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Monday, February 03, 2003 9:57 AM Subject: {AMSF} Select-a-tenna and Alfredo-Lite > A few months ago, some members of the forum was discussing loading > coils / capacitors for tuning an antenna for best transmission on an > Alfredo-Lite transmitter. At the time, I speculated that maybe a > select-a-tenna might also work as a tuning device. At the time, I > was without a SAT [having given my previous one as a gift to one > brother, the one before that had been given to another brother]so it > was just a theory. Since both brothers are now SAT equiped, I'll be > keeping this one! > > Well, I have a SAT again [541M with the important front mounted jack] > and I tried hooking it up to go in series - thanks to the 1/8" jack - > with the antenna lead from the AL transmitter to a very modest > antenna. The SAT tunes the antenna quite well, making a big > improvement in transmitted signal strength. I also find it much > easier to tune for good stereo reception on a Sony SRF-42 when using > the SAT as a transmitting antenna tuner. Of course, all I have to > do is pull the plug, then I can remove the antenna for dxing. > > I wouldn't suggest buying a SAT just for this, but if you are > thinking of buying a SAT anyway for a nice receiving boost, I'd > suggest paying the extra $10 to get the 541M [with jack]over the > plain 541. Then it can double as an Alfredo-Lite tuner. > > You can also have fun by hooking the SAT 541M up to an oscilloscope > to examine the rf waveforms of your signal - or other strong local > signals. > > There is the rare occasional receiver with antenna jacks that may > benefit from a direct connection to a SAT too - but all the rigs > I've tried to date prefer the SAT simply being placed near the > internal antenna. > > Of course, you can always try your talents at making a homemade SAT, > and use that for your A-L transmitter as well! > > Phil R. > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Feb 03 07:53:44 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 3 Feb 2003 15:53:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 86472 invoked from network); 3 Feb 2003 15:53:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Feb 2003 15:53:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Feb 2003 15:53:43 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.178] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Feb 2003 15:53:43 -0000 Date: Mon, 03 Feb 2003 15:53:42 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Sony SRF-A100 on eBay Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 93 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics Catch it while you can: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2156894676 From philipr@irac.pe.ca Mon Feb 03 08:00:01 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 3 Feb 2003 16:00:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 19594 invoked from network); 3 Feb 2003 16:00:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Feb 2003 16:00:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Feb 2003 16:00:01 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.177] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Feb 2003 16:00:00 -0000 Date: Mon, 03 Feb 2003 15:59:58 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Select-a-tenna and Alfredo-Lite Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1487 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking I wired it in series - just rig up a matching plug - one terminal of the plug goes from the antenna lead comming from the AL, the other terminal of the plug is soldered to the wire leading to your antenna. If you find this works well, you can make a dummy jack - simply a 1/8" jack from RS with a tiny jumper wire soldered across the terminals. This way, when your SAT or equivelent is disconnected, say for dxing, you can fit the "dummy jack" on the plug so the AL will be hooked back up to its antenna, albeit without tuning. Phil R. P.S. I take it your Terk has no "active" circuitry - e.g. no built in preamp. If there is no provision for batteries or an ac adapter, this would be the case. I like the look of the SAT, although it does have a "dated" look to it! Looks great in the "shack", but the Terk looks better in the living room! --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: > > The SAT tunes the antenna quite well, making a big improvement in > > > > transmitted signal strength. I also find it much easier to tune for > > > > good stereo reception on a Sony SRF-42 when using the SAT as a > > > > transmitting antenna tuner. > > > > > How did you wire it up -- in series or in parallel with the antenna? > I'd like to try this myself, with my similarly designed (and much more > stylish-looking!) Terk "AM Advantage" loop antenna, which has an > external antenna jack at no extra charge. From amfmdx@fastq.com Mon Feb 03 08:00:06 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 3 Feb 2003 16:00:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 28677 invoked from network); 3 Feb 2003 16:00:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Feb 2003 16:00:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Feb 2003 16:00:05 -0000 Received: from fastq (d163-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.195]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id h13G04U81205 for ; Mon, 3 Feb 2003 09:00:04 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <004f01c2cb9d$34785300$d3f9bed8@com> To: Subject: Another for John Byrns Date: Mon, 3 Feb 2003 08:59:14 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla John, You know enough to know that a Walkman has a ferrite antenna in it. You are smarter than that. Next, I was able to hear the IBOC interference here in Arizona as well as AK6C in California and the moderator of the AMFMDX list when WLW and WOR were together at night running IBOC all three of us who live in different areas hear it on radios with ferrites, radios with loops and radios with wires. The noise is there and it is onerous. If we can hear it out west from WOR, KXNT, WCHB, WLW, and KIXI to mention a few, then its just flat ugly. PERIOD. Stop trying to sugar coat the white noise on an analog radio. Many proponents of IBOC keep telling us that there is no noise and that its transparent. Its not. Not today, not yesterday and not tomorrow unless something really wild happens with the laws of physics. I use wire antennas, loopsticks inboard and amplified ferrite rod loopsticks outboard, and passive loops. The first time I heard IBOC white noise was on a Sony ICF-2010 and also on a CCRadio to check one receiver against another. All there was on them was the internal ferrite antenna. I then tried a Kenwood R-1000 communications receiver on a wire and then an amplified ferrite loopstick antenna to do a little DFing. The deal was that the hash was coming from the northeast which is in the direction of WOR / WLW. AK6C lives in the desert where its electrically quiet and had the same thing. The moderator of AMFMTVDX has the noise but like me he lives in the city. I reported the times the tests were on and off each station and corresponded with A fellow named Darrell and Paul Jellison at WLW and they told me I heard the tests. Bottom line is that the noise is there, it travels a long way, the noise floor from IBOC is going to be from hell and theres going to be a lot of interference to even IBOC stations to other IBOC stations. Until you put about 20 stations in IBOC on 1230 and 20 in IBOC on 1240 and have them within 500 miles or so in a test, you are never going to have any idea of what its going to do. When I see this test and IF it works, and there isn't unbelievable interference to each other in digital or analog, then I will believe in IBOC. Right now, I don't have the faith IBOC promoters can do this. As for Kevin hearing the hash as widely on the band as he says, he may hear it that wide. I have never noted it more than 20 kHz away from the center freq. Generally it runs out about 15 kHz for me. Kevin Mesa, Arizona ---John Byrns Wrote--- I'm not familiar with "walkman" technology, to know if it is a tuned antenna or not, it certainly sounds like it has directional characteristics though, as you would expect in a "walkman" type radio. A Select-A-Tenna would probably help reduce any spurious responses the radio may generate. It would probably be a good idy it with a Select- A-Tenna, and see if the interference is reduced, or eliminated, if it is then the problem is in the radio, not WOR. Of course you must insure that the Select-A-Tenna is tuned to the frequency you are monitoring, or else it could make the interference worse. This message has been composed of recycled electrons. None of these electrons has been harmed or injured in the creation and transmission of this message but they have been shamelessly exploited for this use. From philipr@irac.pe.ca Mon Feb 03 08:24:33 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 3 Feb 2003 16:24:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 70342 invoked from network); 3 Feb 2003 16:24:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Feb 2003 16:24:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.84) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Feb 2003 16:24:32 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.181] by n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Feb 2003 16:24:27 -0000 Date: Mon, 03 Feb 2003 16:24:25 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Select-a-tenna and Alfredo-Lite Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <018701c2cb9b$2ae64a60$06630780@espositojm2> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 4926 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking The improvement is quite noticeable. The antenna I am using is horizontal, so the signal doesn't leave my property. I know, a terrible waste of RF- just being reflected towards the sky by the ground. I just haven't rigged up a nice little verticle yet. A little copper pipe and some spring weather will change that! But, in the house, its a big difference - the difference between poor reception on "typical" radios and solid reception. For instance, on a GE SR III, before, good reception but lots of nulls as you rotate the GE - after, flawless reception - virtually null proof. Sony SRF-42 - before, spotty reception walking around the house, after - solid everywhere. The easiest way to tune is to set up a radio which will receive the signal poorly [this could be putting a good radio in a deliberate null], then tune and watch the reception improve. What I did was fire up a light dimmer that buzzed the signal before I tuned the SAT - when properly tuned the buzz disappeared. The difference was quite dramatic, but you do need a steady hand - better yet, "micrometer fingers". I then double checked, and everywhere in the house and the yard the signal was much better. It won't turn an AL into a 50kw power house, but it does help. As for your antenna idea - the only way is to try it! The loading coil on the CC Crane antenna might throw it off - or, it might work great. I take it the RS loop also has no active circuitry and an output jack. If the CC Crane rig doens't work that great, you can always try one of those old full length [no loading coil] mobile CB antennas that is 104 or 108 or so inches. Tough to mount to a car though - a lot easier on a truck or SUV. Phil R. --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Joe Esposito" wrote: > What kind of improvement did you see? A few feet? More? > > I was thinking of doing something similar to what you did. > > I wanted to have an antenna setup for my AL in my car so I planned on > running the antenna out wire of my AL through the internal part of a Radio > Shack loop antenna. I would then run the external output jack from the > tuned Loop to my car antenna. > > I have a ccrane car antenna that I picked up at a hamfest for pennies. It > has a spring coil at the base of the antenna so I thought I would just slip > the external output wire from the Loop into the coil base... > > Here's the antenna: > http://www.ccrane.com/am_fm_auto_antenna.asp > > Any other ideas? I want to re-transmit something from my car into an office > building. The distance is about 100-150 feet? > > Joe Esposito > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > To: > Sent: Monday, February 03, 2003 9:57 AM > Subject: {AMSF} Select-a-tenna and Alfredo-Lite > > > > A few months ago, some members of the forum was discussing loading > > coils / capacitors for tuning an antenna for best transmission on an > > Alfredo-Lite transmitter. At the time, I speculated that maybe a > > select-a-tenna might also work as a tuning device. At the time, I > > was without a SAT [having given my previous one as a gift to one > > brother, the one before that had been given to another brother] so it > > was just a theory. Since both brothers are now SAT equiped, I'll be > > keeping this one! > > > > Well, I have a SAT again [541M with the important front mounted jack] > > and I tried hooking it up to go in series - thanks to the 1/8" jack - > > with the antenna lead from the AL transmitter to a very modest > > antenna. The SAT tunes the antenna quite well, making a big > > improvement in transmitted signal strength. I also find it much > > easier to tune for good stereo reception on a Sony SRF-42 when using > > the SAT as a transmitting antenna tuner. Of course, all I have to > > do is pull the plug, then I can remove the antenna for dxing. > > > > I wouldn't suggest buying a SAT just for this, but if you are > > thinking of buying a SAT anyway for a nice receiving boost, I'd > > suggest paying the extra $10 to get the 541M [with jack]over the > > plain 541. Then it can double as an Alfredo-Lite tuner. > > > > You can also have fun by hooking the SAT 541M up to an oscilloscope > > to examine the rf waveforms of your signal - or other strong local > > signals. > > > > There is the rare occasional receiver with antenna jacks that may > > benefit from a direct connection to a SAT too - but all the rigs > > I've tried to date prefer the SAT simply being placed near the > > internal antenna. > > > > Of course, you can always try your talents at making a homemade SAT, > > and use that for your A-L transmitter as well! > > > > Phil R. > > > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > > From philipr@irac.pe.ca Mon Feb 03 08:27:19 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 3 Feb 2003 16:27:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 90371 invoked from network); 3 Feb 2003 16:27:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Feb 2003 16:27:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Feb 2003 16:27:19 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.182] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Feb 2003 16:27:06 -0000 Date: Mon, 03 Feb 2003 16:27:06 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Sony SRF-A100 on eBay Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 361 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking I saw this and was tempted, until I saw that Jeff is bidding on it - I believe Jeff is one of our members and we have a sort of non- competition "code". Phil R. --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: > Catch it while you can: > > > > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2156894676 From michaelj@vcn.com Mon Feb 03 08:51:40 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 3 Feb 2003 16:51:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 60802 invoked from network); 3 Feb 2003 16:51:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Feb 2003 16:51:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m2-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.32) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Feb 2003 16:51:39 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m2-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Mon, 3 Feb 2003 09:51:38 -0700 Message-ID: <001e01c2cba4$74337680$0701010a@keva> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: WOR Engineering Staff Date: Mon, 3 Feb 2003 09:51:07 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Any chance there is a contest I could enter where WOR is giving away trip to NYC? :( I can dream :) Michael n WYO ----- Original Message ----- From: wortomray To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, February 01, 2003 7:21 PM Subject: {AMSF} Re: WOR Engineering Staff Hey everyone: I read Kerry's post and echo what he said. I'd also like to say thanks. If there is anything you want to know, just ask. We don't hide behind ceremony and would rather you get answers than guess. And I'd like to reiterate that if anyone is interested in seeing the WOR transmitter facility, just email Kerry or myself. We'd love to show you around our "playground". Maybe a small group of you could get together and make the trek? Depending on the date/time, we might be able to arrange another site, too. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Feb 03 09:23:28 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 3 Feb 2003 17:23:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 12477 invoked from network); 3 Feb 2003 17:23:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Feb 2003 17:23:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Feb 2003 17:23:27 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.146] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Feb 2003 17:23:26 -0000 Date: Mon, 03 Feb 2003 17:23:26 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: WFLA Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 629 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > What they didn't say was that thanks to consolidation that WFLA is > the only a.m. station in the St Petersburg/Tampa market with a news > department! What you are probably hearing is the "WFLA" news "network", rather than news coming locally from 970 WFLA in Tampa -- which is the one *real* WFLA. Clear Channel also calls 540 WFLF in Pine Hills/Orlando "WFLA", as well as 1450 WSPB in Sarasota. These "WFLA" stations simulcast lots of their programming from the real WFLA, and aside from the quick hourly ID, most listeners are none the wiser that they're not really listening to "WFLA" on 540 or 1450. From michaelj@vcn.com Mon Feb 03 09:25:15 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 3 Feb 2003 17:25:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 91713 invoked from network); 3 Feb 2003 17:25:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Feb 2003 17:25:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m2-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.32) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Feb 2003 17:25:14 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m2-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Mon, 3 Feb 2003 10:25:14 -0700 Message-ID: <009c01c2cba9$37d34760$0701010a@keva> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Sony SRF-A100 on eBay Date: Mon, 3 Feb 2003 10:25:14 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Yep, you're right Phil. He is. :( Guess I'll never have one either. MJR n WYO ----- Original Message ----- From: Phil Rafuse To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, February 03, 2003 9:27 AM Subject: {AMSF} Re: Sony SRF-A100 on eBay I saw this and was tempted, until I saw that Jeff is bidding on it - I believe Jeff is one of our members and we have a sort of non- competition "code". Phil R. --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: > Catch it while you can: > > > > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2156894676 Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From florida_amstereo@hotmail.com Mon Feb 03 10:18:11 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: florida_amstereo@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 3 Feb 2003 18:18:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 94639 invoked from network); 3 Feb 2003 18:18:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Feb 2003 18:18:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.37.118) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Feb 2003 18:18:10 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 3 Feb 2003 10:17:10 -0800 Received: from 199.173.225.21 by pv2fd.pav2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Mon, 03 Feb 2003 18:17:09 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: WFLA Date: Mon, 03 Feb 2003 18:17:09 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 03 Feb 2003 18:17:10.0472 (UTC) FILETIME=[77D1DC80:01C2CBB0] From: "Donn Tillman" X-Originating-IP: [199.173.225.21] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83914824 I was listening for about 20 minutes or so to the real WFLA (970 ot of Tampa), and since the news-reader kept mentioning the fact, that they were not going to be broadcasting the local "Gasparilla parade as previously scheduled; I assumed that this was a local feed blended or mixed with "ClearChannel" worldwide news network. I am well aware of the other WFLA's and have mentioned them before; It can be very confusing to people dx'ing or on the road, as there are "WFLA's" in Tampa,Orlando, Ft Pierce, Tallahassee and Sarasota(1450 am a.m.) (which simulcasts the WFLA out of Tampa, 23 hours a day - They have a contract/partnership with WWSB, channel 40 in Sarasota, to carry their evening newscasts). There are at least 5 WFLA's that I am aware of, but the original one, that I was listening to, does have their own news department, which feeds the news to the other ClearChannel stations in the St Petersburg/Tampa and Sarasota area. ----Original Message Follows---- From: "Kevin T. " Reply-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: WFLA Date: Mon, 03 Feb 2003 17:23:26 -0000 > What they didn't say was that thanks to consolidation that WFLA is > the only a.m. station in the St Petersburg/Tampa market with a news > department! What you are probably hearing is the "WFLA" news "network", rather than news coming locally from 970 WFLA in Tampa -- which is the one *real* WFLA. Clear Channel also calls 540 WFLF in Pine Hills/Orlando "WFLA", as well as 1450 WSPB in Sarasota. These "WFLA" stations simulcast lots of their programming from the real WFLA, and aside from the quick hourly ID, most listeners are none the wiser that they're not really listening to "WFLA" on 540 or 1450. "real" or original WFLA - 970 out of Tampa, there were so local angles mentioned, so I am assuming they were using their own news department; 1450 "WFLA" out of Sarasota simocasts the original about 23 hours a day; in fact bumpers on 970-WFLA advise listeners to tune into 1450, WFLA when "south of the skyway" for the same programming. WFLA, 540 out of Pine Hills/Orlando, seems to have their own news department. I don't know about the "WFLA's" in Tallahassee or Ft Pierce. _________________________________________________________________ The new MSN 8: advanced junk mail protection and 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail From powell@conterra.com Mon Feb 03 11:03:09 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: powell@conterra.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 3 Feb 2003 19:03:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 32371 invoked from network); 3 Feb 2003 19:02:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Feb 2003 19:02:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mx.matrixconsulting.net) (65.199.24.6) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Feb 2003 19:02:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 9719 invoked from network); 3 Feb 2003 19:02:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO bsae-skqpk3w8p5) (66.112.193.90) by mx.matrixconsulting.net with SMTP; 3 Feb 2003 19:02:50 -0000 Organization: BEARly Organized To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Date: Mon, 3 Feb 2003 14:02:43 -0500 Subject: more WFIS, WKDK etc Message-ID: <3E3E7683.18362.18E181@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: <1044285474.865.96754.m12@yahoogroups.com> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.01) From: "Powell E. Way III" Reply-To: powell@conterra.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=8062869 X-Yahoo-Profile: W4OPW On 3 Feb 2003 at 15:17, amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com wrote: > Message: 18 > Date: Mon, 3 Feb 2003 00:07:48 -0500 > From: "Possum Hunter" > Subject: Re: WFIS > > powell@conterra.com wrote: > > This is true, but don't forget up that way ( and in your area, but > > worse > west, is the HORRID ground conductivity. > > Yes, and that does not help maters any, but I have listener's letters > from as far Northwest as Cherokee, NC from the time WTZQ went dark > about 10 years ago. > > Don't forget if you turn off the WFIS > transmitter and get WTZQ well, remember your tower is acting as a > super antenna. As I head toward Georgia on I-85 WFIS holds in well > for many miles, in fact better than I had originally thought. > > Oh yes, WFIS has a killer signal into Georgia on I-85 and down past > Greenwood to Promised Land. We have a very good signal to Joanna at > the I-26 / I-385 junction. and We do very well in Woodruff and Enoree. > My brand new ground system ROCKS! I'll have to try here in West Columbia. My antenna on the HQ-180 favors that direction but I have all kinds of noise.... > WTZQ can be heard under our signal from SC 20 to SC 101 on I-85. It > can also be heard under our signal in Western Mauldin, Moonville, and > Conestee. WTZQ kills our signal anywhere Northwest of Downtown > Greenville when they are cheating. > > As a side note, when we had > 1600 on the DX challenge on a list, WTZQ and the Fayetteville 1600 > were dominant at night. How many ways do we spell CHEATING. Of course > there are other cheaters on the frequency too! > 1600 is quickly becoming another Class C channel at night. On our > night power of 25 Watts, we used to get into Greenville, now we are > lucky to hit Mauldin. When I was doing transmitter work last month, we > were running our backup LPB transmitter on 25 Watts during the Day. > WTZQ was clear as a bell in Northern Simpsonville, one of our cities > of license! Well as named by another broadcaster ( who had a high-falutin' job with the NAB promoting BIG corporate broadcasters till corporate yanked on his chain...) I am PMS [Powell's Monitoring Station]....well I tattle to the FCC. These went on the list. > It is a shame Barnstable "stole" Newberry's FM, WGVC. They moved the > license to Simpsonville with the transmitter at a cell tower in > Spartanburg County and the studio is in with WROQ and WTPT in > Greenville. Actually for WKDK I am glad it's gone. WKDK wouldn't apply for the frequency originally, not withstanding the first 2 times ALL the applicants were thrown out for violations. Art Sutton sold it for good money but it did NO service for the local area. NO and I repeat NO live content, except for a small gospel show on Sunday. WKDK was still out-rating the FM but barely! Now IF I can get us to get a new TX, but 1240 IS 1240! > Cost of building the tower aside, it would be a killer channel during > the day, but at night there is the flame thrower signal of Radio > Vision Cristiana from South Caicos blasting away with 100,000 Watts! !/4 wave is not THAT bad, but it is more expensive than one on 1600. Heck on 1600 I'd have a 5/8 wave ! > Kevin Powell From jbyrns@enteract.com Mon Feb 03 13:10:26 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 3 Feb 2003 21:10:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 74288 invoked from network); 3 Feb 2003 21:10:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Feb 2003 21:10:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Feb 2003 21:10:22 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.253] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Feb 2003 21:10:22 -0000 Date: Mon, 03 Feb 2003 21:10:22 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Another for John Byrns Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <004f01c2cb9d$34785300$d3f9bed8@com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2729 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.226 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" < amfmdx@f...> wrote: > John, > > You know enough to know that a Walkman has a ferrite antenna in it. You are > smarter than that. Yes, of course I assume a "Walkman" would have a ferrite bar antenna, but that was not the point. The point was whether or not the ferrite bar, or loop antenna, is tuned, or is aperiodic. Many home AM receivers, if not virtually all these days, use a small untuned air core loop antenna on AM. The Carver TX-11a is an example of this, where it causes IM problems in the front-end. It would not surprise me to find that many "Walkmen" radios use a similar scheme. The Sony ICF-2010 is a radio which I would assume uses a ferrite bar antenna, and I have been told it is untuned or aperiodic, the ICF-2010 is subject to many spurious responses due to this design feature. > The noise is there and it is onerous. If we can hear it out west from WOR, > KXNT, WCHB, WLW, and KIXI to mention a few, then its just flat ugly. PERIOD. > Stop trying to sugar coat the white noise on an analog radio. Many > proponents of IBOC keep telling us that there is no noise and that its > transparent. Its not. Not today, not yesterday and not tomorrow unless > something really wild happens with the laws of physics. I'm not telling you there is no noise, there is clearly noise on the adjacent channels. The question is, how many stations have their reception affected by this within their local coverage areas? Clearly there will be some stations whose local coverage areas will be affected, but generally the FCC has assigned local stations with enough spacing that the problem should affect only a minority of stations, given that an analog radio with decent selectivity, and spurious response rejection, is being used. Once the HD radio system has been fully implemented, maybe the FCC will have to consider reassigning a few stations to solve any adjacent channel interference problems that may exist. Note that I am only concerned with the reception of stations in their local coverage areas, I am not concerned with DX reception, as many on this list seem to be. > As for Kevin hearing the hash as widely on the band as he says, he may hear > it that wide. I have never noted it more than 20 kHz away from the center > freq. Generally it runs out about 15 kHz for me. I am glad to see you admit that you have never seen the white noise from "HD radio" more than 20 kHz away from the HD radio carrier, that is as I would expect it to be. Some on this list are claiming interference to stations 30 kHz, and more, away from the HD radio carrier. I would say that is clearly a problem in their radios. John From michaelj@vcn.com Mon Feb 03 14:24:07 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 3 Feb 2003 22:24:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 49414 invoked from network); 3 Feb 2003 22:24:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Feb 2003 22:24:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m2-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.32) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Feb 2003 22:24:06 -0000 Received: from michael (unverified [209.193.86.78]) by m2-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Mon, 3 Feb 2003 15:24:05 -0700 To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} Re: Sony SRF-A100 on eBay Date: Mon, 3 Feb 2003 15:23:36 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) In-Reply-To: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Importance: Normal From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Might I also add that even with the "no competitor" code of ethics we use here on the list, it still doesn't matter. I caused quite a stink about this about a year or two ago when I bid on an SRF-A100 on EBay and it was indeed Jeff that outbid me. In the end neither of us got it because it went for like $300 or something. Some of us agree on the code of not bidding against other list members, but I've seen it many times not make a hill of beans difference anyway :( I've had a lot of distraught moments bidding on AMS equipment on Ebay, only to get outbid by fellow list members. I don't have ANY of the "nice" AMS radios. Such as the Carver TX11a or the Denon TU680 NAB. Always wanted 'em. Never can get to 'em. I remember a discussion that I know Kevin Redding will recall also about how it's the "rich folks" that seem to get them all because they can afford to outbid everyone by the hundreds of dollars. Such is poor life. That's what I get for working in radio. MJR n WYO -----Original Message----- From: Phil Rafuse [mailto:philipr@irac.pe.ca] Sent: Monday, February 03, 2003 9:27 AM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: Sony SRF-A100 on eBay I saw this and was tempted, until I saw that Jeff is bidding on it - I believe Jeff is one of our members and we have a sort of non- competition "code". Phil R. --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: > Catch it while you can: > > > > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2156894676 Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From jeffdeck@aol.com Mon Feb 03 14:53:53 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: Jeffdeck@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 3 Feb 2003 22:53:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 98408 invoked from network); 3 Feb 2003 22:53:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Feb 2003 22:53:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m02.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.5) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Feb 2003 22:53:52 -0000 Received: from Jeffdeck@aol.com by imo-m02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.1e6.1018c26 (4230); Mon, 3 Feb 2003 17:53:46 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1e6.1018c26.2b704cfa@aol.com> Date: Mon, 3 Feb 2003 17:53:46 EST Subject: Re: Sony SRF-A100 on eBay To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Cc: amstereo@topica.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 8.0 for Windows US sub 231 From: jeffdeck@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=4430287 X-Yahoo-Profile: jeffdeck2001 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I will leave this forum so that you can bid against me. I am not rich. = =20 In a message dated 2/3/2003 5:25:13 PM Eastern Standard Time, you write: >Might I also add that even with the "no competitor" code of ethics we use >here on the list, it still doesn't matter.=A0 I caused quite a stink about >this about a year or two ago when I bid on an SRF-A100 on EBay and it was >indeed Jeff that outbid me.=A0 In the end neither of us got it because it = went >for like $300 or something.=A0 Some of us agree on the code of not bidding >against other list members, but I've seen it many times not make a hill of >beans difference anyway :( >I've had a lot of distraught moments bidding on AMS equipment on Ebay, onl= y >to get outbid by fellow list members.=A0 I don't have ANY of the "nice" AM= S >radios.=A0 Such as the Carver TX11a or the Denon TU680 NAB.=A0 Always want= ed >'em.=A0 Never can get to 'em.=A0=A0 I remember a discussion that I know Ke= vin >Redding will recall also about how it's the "rich folks" that seem to get >them all because they can afford to outbid everyone by the hundreds of >dollars. > >Such is poor life.=A0 That's what I get for working in radio. > >MJR n WYO >>I saw this and was tempted, until I saw that Jeff is bidding on it - >> I believe Jeff is one of our members and we have a sort of non- >>=A0 competition "code". >> >>=A0 Phil R. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From ccuff@in4web.com Mon Feb 03 15:13:02 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 3 Feb 2003 23:13:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 35964 invoked from network); 3 Feb 2003 23:13:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Feb 2003 23:13:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Feb 2003 23:13:02 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.25]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Mon, 3 Feb 2003 18:09:14 -0500 Message-ID: <004501c2cbd8$885d8540$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Sony SRF-A100 on eBay Date: Mon, 3 Feb 2003 18:03:56 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 An auction is just that. When a prized item comes up, it is not to be expected that one person can "lay claim" to it. An auction is "every man for himself, may the deepest pockets win"- Other lists I am on this happens all the time. There are some items that your only hope to find the item is a private yard sale or a neighborhood flea market, Church sale, whatever. (I found an original 1964 Beatles record player at a church rummage sale last year- One dollar.- a LOT more rare to find today than an SRFA100) Chris ----- Original Message ----- From: Michael J. Richard From michaelj@vcn.com Mon Feb 03 15:22:05 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 3 Feb 2003 23:22:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 45671 invoked from network); 3 Feb 2003 23:22:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Feb 2003 23:22:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m2-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.32) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Feb 2003 23:22:04 -0000 Received: from michael (unverified [209.193.86.78]) by m2-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Mon, 3 Feb 2003 16:22:03 -0700 To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} Re: Sony SRF-A100 on eBay Date: Mon, 3 Feb 2003 16:21:34 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) In-Reply-To: <004501c2cbd8$885d8540$0101a8c0@pavilion> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Importance: Normal From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I agree Chris That's why I've been searching thrift stores everywhere to find one. Found the SRF-A1 walkman that I have at a thrift store. My point was, that it's those with the deepest pockets that get the goods. I'll keep checking the thrift stores. I gave up a long time ago on ebay when I asked the list not to bid against me and someone did anyway. Some of us follow that "code" as a courtesy. Some could care less about courtesy. I figure if I don't bid on anything then I ain't got to worry about my feelings getting hurt when someone who has deeper pockets than I bids against me. MJR n WYO -----Original Message----- From: Christopher Cuff [mailto:ccuff@in4web.com] Sent: Monday, February 03, 2003 4:04 PM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Sony SRF-A100 on eBay An auction is just that. When a prized item comes up, it is not to be expected that one person can "lay claim" to it. An auction is "every man for himself, may the deepest pockets win"- Other lists I am on this happens all the time. There are some items that your only hope to find the item is a private yard sale or a neighborhood flea market, Church sale, whatever. (I found an original 1964 Beatles record player at a church rummage sale last year- One dollar.- a LOT more rare to find today than an SRFA100) Chris [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From florida_amstereo@hotmail.com Mon Feb 03 15:40:48 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: florida_amstereo@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 3 Feb 2003 23:40:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 89451 invoked from network); 3 Feb 2003 23:40:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Feb 2003 23:40:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.37.34) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Feb 2003 23:40:47 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 3 Feb 2003 15:40:04 -0800 Received: from 209.240.198.61 by pv2fd.pav2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Mon, 03 Feb 2003 23:40:04 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: more ClearChannel news Date: Mon, 03 Feb 2003 23:40:04 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 03 Feb 2003 23:40:04.0958 (UTC) FILETIME=[93E9CFE0:01C2CBDD] From: "Donn Tillman" X-Originating-IP: [209.240.198.61] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83914824 While trying to find a link to post about ClearChannel from the San Antonio News Express; I came acorss this from this past Friday's Miami Herald Business section: ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Hispanic network's suit against Clear Channel, HBC, tossed out Associated Press MIAMI - A judge Friday threw out a lawsuit accusing industry leader Clear Channel Communications and the Hispanic Broadcast Corporation of trying to drive the nation's largest Hispanic-owned radio operator out of business. Spanish Broadcasting System Inc. said in a statement it plans to appeal the decision by U.S. District Judge Patricia Seitz. The lawsuit alleged that Clear Channel and HBC frustrated SBS's plans to expand its operations and limited its ability to compete in top 10 Spanish-language markets. SPS also alleged the two companies hurt its share price, its reputation and its ability to raise money in an attempt to acquire it and eliminate it as competition in the fast-growing Hispanic market. Clear Channel denied the accusations. here is the link to the complete article: http://www.miami.com/mld/miamiherald/business/5078783.htm donn, st petersburg _________________________________________________________________ Add photos to your messages with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Mon Feb 03 15:53:38 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 3 Feb 2003 23:53:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 65211 invoked from network); 3 Feb 2003 23:53:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Feb 2003 23:53:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf14bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.34) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Feb 2003 23:53:37 -0000 Received: from juan ([67.34.193.158]) by imf14bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.25 201-253-122-122-125-20020815) with SMTP id <20030203235534.FIKI15990.imf14bis.bellsouth.net@juan> for ; Mon, 3 Feb 2003 18:55:34 -0500 Message-ID: <000a01c2cbdf$79d5de80$af78fea9@juan> To: References: <004501c2cbd8$885d8540$0101a8c0@pavilion> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Sony SRF-A100 on eBay Date: Mon, 3 Feb 2003 18:53:39 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Chris, You can triple your profit on the Beatles Record Player...I'll give you $3 bucks for it ! :-) Juan There are some items that your only hope to find the item is a private yard sale or a neighborhood flea market, Church sale, whatever. (I found an original 1964 Beatles record player at a church rummage sale last year- One dollar.- a LOT more rare to find today than an SRFA100) Chris ----- Original Message ----- From: Michael J. Richard michaelj@vcn.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From jsgil@hal-pc.org Mon Feb 03 16:04:37 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 4 Feb 2003 00:04:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 42367 invoked from network); 4 Feb 2003 00:04:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Feb 2003 00:04:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.64) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Feb 2003 00:04:37 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.183] by n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 04 Feb 2003 00:04:36 -0000 Date: Tue, 04 Feb 2003 00:04:34 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Select-a-tenna and Alfredo-Lite Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1298 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.130.56 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Phil Rafuse " wrote: > The improvement is quite noticeable. The antenna I am using is > horizontal, so the signal doesn't leave my property. I know, a > terrible waste of RF- just being reflected towards the sky by the > ground. I just haven't rigged up a nice little verticle yet. A > little copper pipe and some spring weather will change that! > > But, in the house, its a big difference - the difference between > poor reception on "typical" radios and solid reception. > > For instance, on a GE SR III, before, good reception but lots of > nulls as you rotate the GE - after, flawless reception - virtually > null proof. > > Sony SRF-42 - before, spotty reception walking around the house, > after - solid everywhere. > The SAT is a parallel resonant tank and I would think you would want to use series resonant in series with the antenna. If it is wired in series with the antenna then I think that the SAT may be acting as the transmitting antenna itself. The SAT is a high gain receiving antenna so it might make a good transmitting antenna. Might try to use it by itself as the transmitting antenna and see what you get. It will be bi-directional though just like it acts in the receiving mode. JSG From jsgil@hal-pc.org Mon Feb 03 16:19:45 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 4 Feb 2003 00:19:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 29460 invoked from network); 4 Feb 2003 00:19:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Feb 2003 00:19:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.78) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Feb 2003 00:19:43 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.177] by n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 04 Feb 2003 00:19:43 -0000 Date: Tue, 04 Feb 2003 00:19:39 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Another for John Byrns Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1515 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.130.56 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " wrote: The point was whether or not the ferrite > bar, or loop antenna, is tuned, or is aperiodic. Many home AM > receivers, if not virtually all these days, use a small untuned air > core loop antenna on AM. The Carver TX-11a is an example of this, > where it causes IM problems in the front-end. It would not surprise > me to find that many "Walkmen" radios use a similar scheme. All small handheld, clock, cheapie radios will most likeky use a tuned ferrite for its space saving aspects and is fine for narrowband but the BW varies too much for wideband if not designed properly. From the schematic of my Pioneer DTR receiver that uses a air core loop antenna it is definitely tuned as I have tweaked on it some. The reception aspects on the loop greatly increases when tuned and if it wasn't tuned then another tuned coil inside the receiver would have to be used for the RF preselector and this would add to the cost. It's cheaper if space permitting to use an air core antenna since the materials are plastic and insulated multistranded wire compared to Litz wire and ferrite bar. I think this is why they went back to this. These were used in many earlier tube radios and worked great but then miniturization came along with the transistor and the ferrite antenna became popular. I'll take an air core loop antenna over a ferrite any day for wideband AM. The BW is much more consistent across the whole AM dial. JSG From florida_amstereo@hotmail.com Mon Feb 03 18:24:32 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: florida_amstereo@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 4 Feb 2003 02:24:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 56581 invoked from network); 4 Feb 2003 02:24:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Feb 2003 02:24:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.37.92) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Feb 2003 02:24:31 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 3 Feb 2003 18:24:25 -0800 Received: from 209.240.198.61 by pv2fd.pav2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Tue, 04 Feb 2003 02:24:25 GMT To: amstereo@bellsouth.net Cc: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: "Owning the Waves" Date: Tue, 04 Feb 2003 02:24:25 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 04 Feb 2003 02:24:25.0966 (UTC) FILETIME=[898838E0:01C2CBF4] From: "Donn Tillman" X-Originating-IP: [209.240.198.61] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83914824 The (San Antonio) News Express' 3 part series on the ClearChannel empire. http://www.mysanantonio.com/expressnews/story.cfm?xla=saen&xlb=110&xlc=939033 _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 helps eliminate e-mail viruses. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus From stodd@sherbtel.net Mon Feb 03 18:40:02 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 4 Feb 2003 02:40:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 65095 invoked from network); 4 Feb 2003 02:40:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Feb 2003 02:40:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Feb 2003 02:40:01 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-189.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.189]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h142dwhF000160 for ; Mon, 3 Feb 2003 20:39:59 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <004b01c2cbf6$f942e7a0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <3E3E7683.18362.18E181@localhost> Subject: Re: {AMSF} more WFIS, WKDK etc Date: Mon, 3 Feb 2003 20:41:49 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Don't even think of getting a 5/8- those suckers put out a high angle lobe to the ionosphere that will cause skywave cancellation of your groundwave, especially during those critical hours and at night. 192 deg. is the best, often called an anti-fade antenna. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Powell E. Way III" > !/4 wave is not THAT bad, but it is more expensive than one on 1600. > Heck on 1600 I'd have a 5/8 wave ! From n0uiheric@aol.com Mon Feb 03 22:18:19 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 4 Feb 2003 06:18:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 6645 invoked from network); 4 Feb 2003 06:18:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Feb 2003 06:18:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d07.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.39) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Feb 2003 06:17:38 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-d07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.13.) id r.1d6.18f976c (4116) for ; Tue, 4 Feb 2003 01:12:18 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1d6.18f976c.2b70b3c2@aol.com> Date: Tue, 4 Feb 2003 01:12:18 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} more ClearChannel news To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih Clear Channel's "denial" of the TRUTH given them by the Spanish Broadcasting System shows us that Clear Channel cannot be trusted to own radio and television stations. In my honest opinion, they are clearly unqualified to own broadcast properties anywhere in the world. No wonder John McCain turned Lowry Mays into a poster boy for bad corporate behavior! 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From dav259@csiro.au Mon Feb 03 23:14:38 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 4 Feb 2003 07:14:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 84674 invoked from network); 4 Feb 2003 07:14:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Feb 2003 07:14:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Feb 2003 07:14:37 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h147AHR18478 for ; Tue, 4 Feb 2003 18:10:17 +1100 (EST) Date: Tue, 4 Feb 2003 18:10:17 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Subject: Re: {AMSF} more ClearChannel news In-Reply-To: <1d6.18f976c.2b70b3c2@aol.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=112635033 On Tue, 4 Feb 2003 n0uiheric@aol.com wrote: > Clear Channel's "denial" of the TRUTH given them by the Spanish Broadcasting > System shows us that Clear Channel cannot be trusted to own radio and > television stations. In my honest opinion, they are clearly unqualified to > own broadcast properties anywhere in the world. No wonder John McCain turned > Lowry Mays into a poster boy for bad corporate behavior! Our PM decided that today (parliaments first sitting since its summer break) we'd have a "debate" on Iraq. Mind you he said that only statements from all parties could be made. No questions could be asked as there wasn't time. (Wasn't time for questions of our elected ministers?!?) That's by the by - but the wonderful thing is that this 5 hour session (so far ... ) has been fully broadcast by the ABC's Newsradio. This network usually rates about 2% nationally - but on occasions like this it rates quite respectably. It was a very interesting trip home from work. Clear Channels contribution to news reporting in Oz are 3 minute hourly news updates during the day (when they're live) half of which seem to be traffic reports. God bless independent (from government) public radio! Ian Melbourne From philipr@irac.pe.ca Tue Feb 04 06:42:28 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 4 Feb 2003 14:42:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 10673 invoked from network); 4 Feb 2003 14:42:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Feb 2003 14:42:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.66) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Feb 2003 14:42:24 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.253] by n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 04 Feb 2003 14:42:24 -0000 Date: Tue, 04 Feb 2003 14:42:24 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: Sony SRF-A100 on eBay Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <004501c2cbd8$885d8540$0101a8c0@pavilion> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1625 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking I don't have a problem with this either, I just thought that this was the rule. Given the size of the list, it would be pretty hard to enforce. I see another AM Stereo item on ebay, one of our members has bid on it, so maybe I'll jump in! But not on the Sony, though - its going to sell for "big money". As for the really deep pockets, that's just what happens on ebay - if you really want it, and money is no object, put in an astronomical bid and you get it! If you are like the rest of us, you bide your time and wait till a Delco UX-1 comes up cheap, then rig it up for home use - a lot of effort - but that's how money is saved! By the way, there is a PT-1 for sale, closing today, and the last bid was something like $10.50. With response only 6 db down at 9khz, sensitive AM, and downrot hot on FM, somebody in the forum would enjoy it big time! I've got mine, and I'm not letting go of it!!! Phil R. --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Christopher Cuff" wrote: > An auction is just that. When a prized item comes up, it is not to be > expected that one person can "lay claim" to it. An auction is "every man for > himself, may the deepest pockets win"- Other lists I am on this happens all > the time. There are some items that your only hope to find the item is a > private yard sale or a neighborhood flea market, Church sale, whatever. (I > found an original 1964 Beatles record player at a church rummage sale last > year- One dollar.- a LOT more rare to find today than an SRFA100) > Chris > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Michael J. Richard From michaelj@vcn.com Tue Feb 04 06:54:16 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 4 Feb 2003 14:54:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 21031 invoked from network); 4 Feb 2003 14:54:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Feb 2003 14:54:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m2-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.32) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Feb 2003 14:54:14 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m2-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Tue, 4 Feb 2003 07:54:14 -0700 Message-ID: <001201c2cc5d$46c781a0$0701010a@keva> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Sony SRF-A100 on eBay Date: Tue, 4 Feb 2003 07:54:09 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Phil I stumbled on to my UX-1 at a thrift store in Utah. Paid a whole $3 for it. I know if i can find an SRF-A100 there, that's probably about what I'd pay for it as well. MAYBE as much as $5. I should have re-worded my response to begin with before I started stirring up bad feelings. I should have told ya "just go ahead and bid. From my experience it doesn't matter whether you're on this list or not, other members will bid against ya anyway. It's every man for himself and the deep pockets get the goods. So go ahead and bid on it!" I guess you can tell I'm still a little sore about the time it happened to me. I know I'll keep searching the thrift stores and such and I will eventually find one. And I'll really be able to gloat because I'll be able to say that I DIDN'T have to pay $200 for it. I need to watch the 'personal attacks'. Don't want to get censored or kicked off the list :) MJR n WYO ----- Original Message ----- From: Phil Rafuse To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, February 04, 2003 7:42 AM Subject: {AMSF} Re: Sony SRF-A100 on eBay I don't have a problem with this either, I just thought that this was the rule. Given the size of the list, it would be pretty hard to enforce. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From philipr@irac.pe.ca Tue Feb 04 07:28:43 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 4 Feb 2003 15:28:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 83551 invoked from network); 4 Feb 2003 15:28:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Feb 2003 15:28:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Feb 2003 15:28:42 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.140] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 04 Feb 2003 15:28:42 -0000 Date: Tue, 04 Feb 2003 15:28:39 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: Sony SRF-A100 on eBay Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <001201c2cc5d$46c781a0$0701010a@keva> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3191 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking Michael I'm not going to bid on the Sony because I know the price will go through the roof - I figure it will be purchased by a radio collector. There is something else I might bid on which is on ebay right now, a TM-152. Now we know it is a narrow bandwidth rig, but I wouldn't mind having a TM-152 at a good price. But I sure wouldn't pay big bucks for it. I got my UX-1 for $13.50 on ebay, so sometimes there are some bargins there. But the SRF-A100, the Carvers, etc. are going to go on ebay for a fortune 99.44% of the time. There is always that .66% though! Keep an eye out for those thrift shops. I got a gorgeous sony reel to reel and a little realistic amp, both in flawless condition, plus a box of 25 reel to reel tapes, all for $50 CDN at an old fashioned auction. My wife is surprisingly tolerant of my radio / audio collection, provided its all bargains. Once my little "AM Stereo Fanatic" [just kidding Tom!] is born, there won't be much time or money for radios - but if Chris comes out with a cool AM Stereo radio, well, I'd just have to get one...! But, the next time some interesting item is on ebay, I won't shy away from bidding simply because someone on the list is bidding, unless they were to specifically ask in the Forum that folks hold back. A good example would be if someone new didn't have any AM stereo gear, then asked us to hold back, I then wouldn't bid. But heck, if I walked into Cash Converters today and there was a working Sony SRFA100 for $50 CDN, I'd buy it and tell my wife they can go for $300 US on ebay. Cheers, and I hope you find a Sony SRFA100 for no more than the price of a box of Pampers! That will be my budget pretty soon! lol Phil R. --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Michael J. Richard" wrote: > Phil > I stumbled on to my UX-1 at a thrift store in Utah. Paid a whole $3 for it. I know if i can find an SRF-A100 there, that's probably about what I'd pay for it as well. MAYBE as much as $5. > I should have re-worded my response to begin with before I started stirring up bad feelings. I should have told ya "just go ahead and bid. From my experience it doesn't matter whether you're on this list or not, other members will bid against ya anyway. It's every man for himself and the deep pockets get the goods. So go ahead and bid on it!" > I guess you can tell I'm still a little sore about the time it happened to me. I know I'll keep searching the thrift stores and such and I will eventually find one. And I'll really be able to gloat because I'll be able to say that I DIDN'T have to pay $200 for it. I need to watch the 'personal attacks'. Don't want to get censored or kicked off the list :) > > MJR n WYO > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Phil Rafuse > To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com > Sent: Tuesday, February 04, 2003 7:42 AM > Subject: {AMSF} Re: Sony SRF-A100 on eBay > > > I don't have a problem with this either, I just thought that this > was the rule. Given the size of the list, it would be pretty hard > to enforce. > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Feb 04 09:10:38 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 4 Feb 2003 17:10:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 80893 invoked from network); 4 Feb 2003 17:10:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Feb 2003 17:10:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.90) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Feb 2003 17:10:38 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.148] by n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 04 Feb 2003 17:10:38 -0000 Date: Tue, 04 Feb 2003 17:10:36 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Sony SRF-A100 on eBay Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1166 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > I got my UX-1 for $13.50 on ebay, so sometimes there are some > bargins there. The real bargains are mis-labelled items, and/or items with no photo and a sparse description. Chris Cuff once got a rare Canadian Sony SRF-A1 "Coca Cola" AM Stereo Walkman at very cheap price because it was mis-labelled as a "Sony transistor radio", with no mention of "AM Stereo". Also, not every radio with AM Stereo is labelled as such! You can try to search for specific brands and narrow it down from there. For example, in any search for Delco, Chevrolet, Pontiac, Cadillac, etc. radios, you are bound to find many with the conspicuous "AM ST" button on the front panel -- but only a small amount of these will be specifically labelled as "AM Stereo" in the description. So, try searching for (with the "Search item titles and descriptions" check-box clicked): Carver TX* Sony SRF* Denon TU-* Delco radio* Delco stereo* Delco cass* Delco eq* (most models with the graphic equalizer have AM Stereo) Chev* radio*, Pontiac* radio* (etc.) Yes, the "*" wildcard works just as it does in DOS and UNIX -- use it to your advantage! From michaelj@vcn.com Tue Feb 04 10:31:04 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 4 Feb 2003 18:31:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 61983 invoked from network); 4 Feb 2003 18:31:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Feb 2003 18:31:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m2-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.32) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Feb 2003 18:31:02 -0000 Received: from michael (unverified [209.193.86.7]) by m2-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Tue, 4 Feb 2003 11:31:01 -0700 To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} Re: Sony SRF-A100 on eBay Date: Tue, 4 Feb 2003 11:30:24 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Yep! That's how I've found what I have over the years! I can only hope for a mislabeled SRF-A100 one day :) I've FOUND lots....as far as winning...no I haven't won hardly any. I did get my Marantz SR-541 tuner on EBay. Found it just as the auction was about to end and still picked it up for a mere $50 or so. Too bad the decoder in it doesn't work. Uses the old 13020 chip. Had numerous discussions with JSG on this.....just haven't tried any of the fixes yet. One of these days when I have a spare moment I will. Otherwise most AMS stuff I have I've converted myself with a decoder, or bought (like my SRF-42 and Sangean SR66 and Aiwa recording walkman) when they were still available. I'd like to be able to find some other outlets.....like internet classifieds or something like that. Where it's not an auction.....just a "For sale:" type thing. Auctions suck MJR n WYO -----Original Message----- From: Kevin T. [mailto:kevtronics@yahoo.com] Sent: Tuesday, February 04, 2003 10:11 AM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: Sony SRF-A100 on eBay The real bargains are mis-labelled items, and/or items with no photo and a sparse description. Chris Cuff once got a rare Canadian Sony SRF-A1 "Coca Cola" AM Stereo Walkman at very cheap price because it was mis-labelled as a "Sony transistor radio", with no mention of "AM Stereo". [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From powell@conterra.com Tue Feb 04 11:23:45 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: powell@conterra.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 4 Feb 2003 19:23:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 78194 invoked from network); 4 Feb 2003 19:23:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Feb 2003 19:23:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mx.matrixconsulting.net) (65.199.24.6) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Feb 2003 19:23:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 31697 invoked from network); 4 Feb 2003 19:23:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO bsae-skqpk3w8p5) (66.112.193.113) by mx.matrixconsulting.net with SMTP; 4 Feb 2003 19:23:39 -0000 Organization: BEARly Organized To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Date: Tue, 4 Feb 2003 14:23:31 -0500 Subject: Re: {AMSF} Digest Number 569 Message-ID: <3E3FCCE3.9706.144E0F@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: <1044342878.1477.84684.m9@yahoogroups.com> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.01) From: "Powell E. Way III" Reply-To: powell@conterra.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=8062869 X-Yahoo-Profile: W4OPW On 4 Feb 2003 at 7:14, stodd@sherbtel.net> said > > Message: 23 > Date: Mon, 3 Feb 2003 20:41:49 -0600 > From: "Scott Todd" <> Subject: Re: more WFIS, WKDK etc > > Don't even think of getting a 5/8- those suckers put out a high angle > lobe to the ionosphere that will cause skywave cancellation of your > groundwave, especially during those critical hours and at night. 192 > deg. is the best, often called an anti-fade antenna. > > ST On 1600 with 1KW day and flea at night it should not have an effect. It does on higher powers. 192 is what wave? Powell From jbyrns@enteract.com Tue Feb 04 11:55:50 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 4 Feb 2003 19:55:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 5130 invoked from network); 4 Feb 2003 19:55:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Feb 2003 19:55:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Feb 2003 19:55:48 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.168] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 04 Feb 2003 19:55:48 -0000 Date: Tue, 04 Feb 2003 19:55:46 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: Sony SRF-A100 on eBay Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 464 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.98.174 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g I got my UX-1 for $10.50 on eBay, it was simply labeled "Delco ETR radio with cassette and 5 band graphic equalizer", no mention of AM stereo. John --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Phil Rafuse " < philipr@i...> wrote: > > I got my UX-1 for $13.50 on ebay, so sometimes there are some > bargins there. But the SRF-A100, the Carvers, etc. are going to go > on ebay for a fortune 99.44% of the time. There is always that .66% > though! From jbyrns@enteract.com Tue Feb 04 13:05:07 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 4 Feb 2003 21:05:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 86234 invoked from network); 4 Feb 2003 21:05:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Feb 2003 21:05:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.89) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Feb 2003 21:05:06 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.140] by n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 04 Feb 2003 21:04:42 -0000 Date: Tue, 04 Feb 2003 21:04:42 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Select-a-tenna and Alfredo-Lite Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1555 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.98.225 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "jsgilst " < jsgil@h...> wrote: > > The SAT is a parallel resonant tank and I would think you would > want to use series resonant in series with the antenna. If it is > wired in series with the antenna then I think that the SAT may be > acting as the transmitting antenna itself. It is my guess that the "SAT" is acting as a loading coil in this application. You want a parallel resonant circuit in series with the antenna, not a series resonant circuit, so it's reactance will appear as a the fairly large inductor required to properly load a short piece of wire as an antenna. Of course a pure inductor would be better, but the big boys often use this same parallel resonant circuit approach to replace large inductors in phasors and the like, and series resonant circuits to replace large capacitors, all in the name of economy, as it certainly doesn't do much to help the bandwidth of the antenna system. > The SAT is a high gain > receiving antenna so it might make a good transmitting antenna. > Might try to use it by itself as the transmitting antenna and > see what you get. It will be bi-directional though just like it > acts in the receiving mode. I sort of doubt the "SAT" by itself makes a very good transmitting antenna. A note on the "SAT", IIRC the coil in the tuned circuit of the "SAT" consists of 22 turns of wire, the jack connects to a separate winding of two turns. That's from memory, so it may not be exactly correct, but it is something like that. John From jbyrns@enteract.com Tue Feb 04 13:18:10 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 4 Feb 2003 21:18:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 8104 invoked from network); 4 Feb 2003 21:18:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Feb 2003 21:18:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Feb 2003 21:18:09 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.129] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 04 Feb 2003 21:18:08 -0000 Date: Tue, 04 Feb 2003 21:18:06 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Another for John Byrns Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2912 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.98.225 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "jsgilst " < jsgil@h...> wrote: > > All small handheld, clock, cheapie radios will most likeky use a > tuned ferrite for its space saving aspects and is fine for > narrowband but the BW varies too much for wideband if not designed > properly. The same can be said for an air loop, a constant Q will not give a constant bandwidth, the Q must be made to increase with frequency for constant bandwidth. The circuit configuration has a major effect on this, it's more in the design than the type of loop used. > From the schematic of my Pioneer DTR receiver that uses a air core > loop antenna it is definitely tuned as I have tweaked on it some. I have had three home tuners that used air loops. In at least one case, the Carver TX-11a, the air loop was untuned. In all cases the air loop was very small, I would guess a square about 4 inches on a side, at most, for all three tuners. > The reception aspects on the loop greatly increases when tuned > and if it wasn't tuned then another tuned coil inside the receiver > would have to be used for the RF preselector and this would add to > the cost. Taking the Carver TX-11a as an example again, there is no preselector used between the small untuned air loop, and the RF amplifier stage. > It's cheaper if space permitting to use an air core antenna > since the materials are plastic and insulated multistranded wire > compared to Litz wire and ferrite bar. I think this is why they went > back to this. These were used in many earlier tube radios and worked > great but then miniturization came along with the transistor and the > ferrite antenna became popular. The air loops used in the old tube radios were generally quite a bit larger than the small external air loops I have seen supplied with modern AM tuners. The only advantage to the small modern detachable air loops, that I can see, is that they can be oriented independently of the radio itself. > I'll take an air core loop antenna > over a ferrite any day for wideband AM. The BW is much more > consistent across the whole AM dial. I'll take which ever delivers the most signal in the available space. Even with the air loop, the BW is still very far from consistent across the whole AM dial, and a ferrite bar will give more signal when there isn't room for a large air loop. The unloaded Q of the ferrite bars is so high anywhere in the MW band that design measures must be taken to provide adequate BW in a wideband radio, this makes the Q variation of the bar by itself pretty much irrelevant. Even an air loop will not work well in a wideband radio unless the proper circuit design precautions are taken to insure adequate BW across the whole AM dial. Just try putting a "SAT" next to the small air loop on a Carver TX-11a, and watch (hear) what happens to the Carver's 15 kHz audio response. John From JH_Radio@GameBox.net Tue Feb 04 16:44:35 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: JH_Radio@GameBox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 5 Feb 2003 00:44:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 8695 invoked from network); 5 Feb 2003 00:44:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Feb 2003 00:44:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO snickers.hotpop.com) (204.57.55.49) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Feb 2003 00:44:33 -0000 Received: from gamebox.net (kubrick.hotpop.com [204.57.55.16]) by snickers.hotpop.com (Postfix) with SMTP id ED0DD70E35 for ; Wed, 5 Feb 2003 00:44:26 +0000 (UTC) Received: from -enduser.GameBox.net (pcp03184855pcs.benslm01.pa.comcast.net [68.80.77.117]) by smtp-2.hotpop.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 52CC11B8322 for ; Wed, 5 Feb 2003 00:21:43 +0000 (UTC) Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030204192131.03139860@pop.GameBox.net> X-Sender: JH_Radio@pop.GameBox.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Tue, 04 Feb 2003 19:26:50 -0500 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Carver TX-11A or TX-11B Mime-Version: 1.0 X-HotPOP: ----------------------------------------------- Sent By HotPOP.com FREE Email Get your FREE POP email at www.HotPOP.com ----------------------------------------------- From: John X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113800107 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi, witch one is better? I know that the TX-11B isn't available as often, but give it time and it'll appear on EBay. Witch one is better and what are the differences in the performance (Specifically concerning the AM Stereo/Audiophile)of the TX-11A and TX-11B? As a side note: Bob Carver - I've seen that name some ware on a mailing list. Was it on here? Love in Christ: John Bensalem, PA Send me an email Aim: RainAngelsRule MSN: RainAngelsRule@hotmail.com My website Welcome to Napster4TheBlind "Prayer does not change God; it changes you." - Authur unknown [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From stodd@sherbtel.net Tue Feb 04 18:33:42 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 5 Feb 2003 02:33:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 70827 invoked from network); 5 Feb 2003 02:33:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Feb 2003 02:33:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Feb 2003 02:33:40 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-201.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.201]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h152XaC8029874 for ; Tue, 4 Feb 2003 20:33:38 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <004301c2ccbf$418d6300$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <3E3FCCE3.9706.144E0F@localhost> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Digest Number 569 Date: Tue, 4 Feb 2003 20:35:29 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Even at 1kW, you could be wiping out some of your fringe coverage during the morning and afternoon critical hours with a 5/8. 192 degrees is between 1/2 and 5/8- 180 deg. is 1/2; 225 deg = 5/8. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Powell E. Way III" > On 1600 with 1KW day and flea at night it should not have an effect. > It does on higher powers. 192 is what wave? From stodd@sherbtel.net Tue Feb 04 18:44:44 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 5 Feb 2003 02:44:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 62885 invoked from network); 5 Feb 2003 02:44:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Feb 2003 02:44:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Feb 2003 02:44:44 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-201.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.201]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h152ifC8003315 for ; Tue, 4 Feb 2003 20:44:42 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <005d01c2ccc0$cd6c2900$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030204192131.03139860@pop.GameBox.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Carver TX-11A or TX-11B Date: Tue, 4 Feb 2003 20:46:34 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude First question- the B has the expanded band, otherwise they're pretty much identical. Second question- not here ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "John" > Witch one is better and what are the differences in the performance (Specifically concerning the AM Stereo/Audiophile)of the TX-11A and TX-11B? > > As a side note: Bob Carver - I've seen that name some ware on a mailing list. Was it on here? From rwagoner1@mac.com Tue Feb 04 19:01:55 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner1@mac.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 5 Feb 2003 03:01:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 17435 invoked from network); 5 Feb 2003 03:01:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Feb 2003 03:01:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO fed1mtao07.cox.net) (68.6.19.124) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Feb 2003 03:01:21 -0000 Received: from mac.com ([68.4.33.253]) by fed1mtao07.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20030205030113.QZZD3373.fed1mtao07.cox.net@mac.com> for ; Tue, 4 Feb 2003 22:01:13 -0500 Message-ID: <3E407E81.5020308@mac.com> Date: Tue, 04 Feb 2003 19:01:21 -0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20021120 Netscape/7.01 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Carver TX-11A or TX-11B References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030204192131.03139860@pop.GameBox.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Richard Wagoner X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135738921 X-Yahoo-Profile: richardalanwagoner B also has NRSC de-emphasis, as I understand it. The A has non-NRSC. >TX11a and b< From amstereorules@msn.com Tue Feb 04 19:03:06 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereorules@msn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 5 Feb 2003 03:03:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 69381 invoked from network); 5 Feb 2003 03:03:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Feb 2003 03:03:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Feb 2003 03:03:06 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.151] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 05 Feb 2003 03:03:06 -0000 Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2003 03:03:04 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Carver TX-11A or TX-11B Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <005d01c2ccc0$cd6c2900$827dfea9@home1> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 682 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amstereorules " X-Originating-IP: 152.163.207.53 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=130870594 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereorules Wrong. The B has a better de emphasis for today's AM Both A and B has expanded band. B has a different FM tuner- not better, just different Al Stewart --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Scott Todd" wrote: > First question- the B has the expanded band, otherwise they're pretty much > identical. > > Second question- not here > ST > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "John" > > > Witch one is better and what are the differences in the performance > (Specifically concerning the AM Stereo/Audiophile)of the TX-11A and TX-11B? > > > > As a side note: Bob Carver - I've seen that name some ware on a mailing > list. Was it on here? From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Feb 04 19:13:00 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 5 Feb 2003 03:13:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 94782 invoked from network); 5 Feb 2003 03:12:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Feb 2003 03:12:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Feb 2003 03:12:59 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.142] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 05 Feb 2003 03:12:59 -0000 Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2003 03:12:57 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Carver TX-11A or TX-11B Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <005d01c2ccc0$cd6c2900$827dfea9@home1> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1599 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.72.23 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > First question- the B has the expanded band, otherwise they're > pretty much identical. Actually, I have a copy of the Owner's Manual for the TX-11a and in the specs it lists the AM tuning range as 520-1710 kHz -- so even the "a" model had the Expanded Band. As discussed a few weeks ago here, the concensus is that the TX-11b was revised to be more compliant with the AMAX receiver standards, including more accurate NRSC de-emphasis, and perhaps having response flat as a board out to 15 kHz was no longer a design priority since at that time (starting in 1988) many stations were already voluntarity reducing their transmitted bandwidth down to the 10 kHz NRSC spec (even though the FCC didn't require it until 1994 -- but *Canada* required full NRSC compliance starting in 1988). BTW... note that Australia also has a variant of the NRSC bandwidth regulation in their broadcasting rules. In fact, it is the same, except modified to fit the 9 kHz channel spacing. I.e., whereas the NRSC spec in North America calls for the transmitted RF to be -25 dB just above 10 kHz, in Australia it is -25 dB at just above 9 kHz, with the step-down to -35 dB at 18 kHz instead of at 20 kHz, and so on. With this in mind, I wonder if they're working on a variant of IBOC/"HD Radio" designed to fit a 9 kHz channel spacing? I haven't heard anything about it anywhere, but just as Australia was one of the first countries outside of North America to start using AM Stereo in the mid-1980s, I wouldn't be surprised if iBiquity is thinking about bringing IBOC to the Land Down Under. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Feb 04 19:18:42 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 5 Feb 2003 03:18:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 96823 invoked from network); 5 Feb 2003 03:18:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Feb 2003 03:18:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.89) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Feb 2003 03:18:41 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.186] by n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 05 Feb 2003 03:18:41 -0000 Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2003 03:18:40 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Carver TX-11A or TX-11B Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 490 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.72.23 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Wrong. The B has a better de emphasis for today's AM > Both A and B has expanded band. > B has a different FM tuner- not better, just different > Al Stewart Heh... is anybody here familiar with Vietnamese astrology? I'm wondering if 2003 is the Year Of The Cat. :-) BTW, Al's "YOTC" is still the single-channel stereo king, with a 35-second piano intro exclusively in the Left channel (at least on the full album version). It puts the intro of "Here Comes The Sun" to shame! From jsgil@hal-pc.org Tue Feb 04 20:39:12 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 5 Feb 2003 04:39:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 50914 invoked from network); 5 Feb 2003 04:39:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Feb 2003 04:39:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.66) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Feb 2003 04:39:11 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.135] by n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 05 Feb 2003 04:39:11 -0000 Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2003 04:39:08 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Another for John Byrns Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 587 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.10 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " wrote: Just try putting a "SAT" next to the small air loop on a Carver > TX-11a, and watch (hear) what happens to the Carver's 15 kHz audio > response. > > John My experience in putting a SAT next to a receiver with an air core antenna is it coesn't couple well at all and nulls out any field that the receiver is getting as the stand alone SAT is designed to be used with a ferrite antenna. The version for the air core receivers comes with a ferrite rod to couple with the air core to solve this. JSG From possumhunter@netzero.net Tue Feb 04 21:00:43 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 5 Feb 2003 05:00:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 22007 invoked from network); 5 Feb 2003 05:00:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Feb 2003 05:00:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.199) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Feb 2003 05:00:42 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 4 Feb 2003 21:00:42 -0800 To: Subject: The Sports Zone Date: Wed, 5 Feb 2003 00:00:27 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 05 Feb 2003 05:00:42.0901 (UTC) FILETIME=[8908B450:01C2CCD3] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.135.201.231] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 I ran across this today..just more funny stuff at "The Sports Zone" The FCC upholds its initial ruling that WHYZ Radio LP, owner of WCSZ-AM/San Souci, SC, must pay $8,000 for failing to have operational Emergency Alert System equipment. WHYZ did not file a response to the commission's April 2002 notice of apparent liability. Guess the FCC can't fine them for having a rotted out floor, eh? I should post pictures of that rat hole. It is the single worst radio station I have ever been in that was actually on the air! Kevin From dav259@csiro.au Tue Feb 04 21:29:21 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 5 Feb 2003 05:29:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 72413 invoked from network); 5 Feb 2003 05:29:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Feb 2003 05:29:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Feb 2003 05:29:20 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h155TJR15716 for ; Wed, 5 Feb 2003 16:29:19 +1100 (EST) Date: Wed, 5 Feb 2003 16:29:19 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Carver TX-11A or TX-11B In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=112635033 On Wed, 5 Feb 2003, Kevin T. wrote: > > Wrong. The B has a better de emphasis for today's AM > > Both A and B has expanded band. > > B has a different FM tuner- not better, just different > > Al Stewart > > Heh... is anybody here familiar with Vietnamese astrology? I'm > wondering if 2003 is the Year Of The Cat. :-) > > BTW, Al's "YOTC" is still the single-channel stereo king, with a > 35-second piano intro exclusively in the Left channel (at least on > the full album version). It's the Vietnamese Year of the Goat. I heard on the grapevine that Shane Filan may be bringing out a new rendition of "The Lonely Goatheard" from TSOM. It's gonna have cowbells on the left channel and puppet character noises on the right. :) From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Feb 04 21:31:01 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 5 Feb 2003 05:31:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 76440 invoked from network); 5 Feb 2003 05:31:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Feb 2003 05:31:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.86) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Feb 2003 05:31:00 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.182] by n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 05 Feb 2003 05:31:00 -0000 Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2003 05:30:59 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Fwd: WWKB out of Phase? Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1863 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.72.23 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics From the New York Radio Message Board.... it sounds like "KB-1520" is still a work in progress... so don't give up hope of them returning to AM Stereo just yet: ===================================================================== Posted by Rusty on February 04, 2003 at 22:55:32: Am I losing it? Or is KB 1520 broadcasting L-R audio instead of L+R audio? ===================================================================== Posted by Bob Smith on February 04, 2003 at 23:05:13: Where are you listening from? It may make a difference. KB sounds fine up to 80-90 miles from the transmitter here in western NY, where we're picking it up on groundwave only. For some reason when you get about 100 miles out, you start getting funny effects as the groundwave and skywave begin hitting your receiver out of phase with each other...sounds just like audio phase shifting. Go a little further away from Buffalo and you lose the groundwave, and lose that effect. The KB signal has been like that as long as I can remember. AFAIK they don't have their C-QUAM stereo generator turned on. ===================================================================== Posted by Rusty on February 04, 2003 at 23:27:05: I am listening from Long Island. Way out of Groundwave range. WWKB comes in like Gang busters here on the skywave at night. They seem to have fixed the problem, but I swear that they were broadcasting L-R for about an hour or so tonight. There were a bunch of Automation problems, and then L-R audio for about an hour. It sounds like it is back to normal now. Maybe they were working on something and just got their wires crossed. Anything is possible. The main thing is that someone noticed and uncrossed the wires. It really was weird. ===================================================================== From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Feb 04 21:40:21 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 5 Feb 2003 05:40:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 58124 invoked from network); 5 Feb 2003 05:40:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Feb 2003 05:40:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Feb 2003 05:40:21 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.140] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 05 Feb 2003 05:40:20 -0000 Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2003 05:40:16 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Carver TX-11A or TX-11B Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 550 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.72.23 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > It's the Vietnamese Year of the Goat. I heard on the grapevine > that Shane Filan may be bringing out a new rendition of "The Lonely > Goatheard" from TSOM. It's gonna have cowbells on the left channel > and puppet character noises on the right. :) Trust me... that won't happen until Leonard Kahn's old business partner Marvin Hazeltine makes a re-appearance first. :-) Oh, and how about Ragnar Danneskjold? We haven't heard from him in a while! "AM Stereo is better than AM plain." -- W. Wilson Goode, former mayor of Philadelphia From KC4QLP@aol.com Tue Feb 04 22:20:58 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 5 Feb 2003 06:20:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 65009 invoked from network); 5 Feb 2003 06:20:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Feb 2003 06:20:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r02.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.98) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Feb 2003 06:20:57 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.49.2a72a75e (16781) for ; Wed, 5 Feb 2003 01:20:55 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <49.2a72a75e.2b720747@aol.com> Date: Wed, 5 Feb 2003 01:20:55 EST Subject: test only...delete...ignore To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit test...this is only a test [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From dav259@csiro.au Tue Feb 04 23:47:58 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 5 Feb 2003 07:47:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 37637 invoked from network); 5 Feb 2003 07:47:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Feb 2003 07:47:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Feb 2003 07:47:56 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h157ltR21504 for ; Wed, 5 Feb 2003 18:47:55 +1100 (EST) Date: Wed, 5 Feb 2003 18:47:55 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Carver TX-11A or TX-11B In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=112635033 On Wed, 5 Feb 2003, Kevin T. wrote: > With this in mind, I wonder if they're working on a variant of > IBOC/"HD Radio" designed to fit a 9 kHz channel spacing? I haven't > heard anything about it anywhere, but just as Australia was one of > the first countries outside of North America to start using AM Stereo > in the mid-1980s, I wouldn't be surprised if iBiquity is thinking > about bringing IBOC to the Land Down Under. Yes Kevin - indeed iBiquity has made a case here. At last years Annual ABA National Conference in August they had reps from Eureka-DAB, DRM, and iBiquity-IBOC. It's only put us on hold for a lot longer. But if IBOC ever does succeed in the US I'm sure it would be adopted here. And let's face it - on paper it sounds like a good solution. Nobody would be forced to buy a new (or more expensive) radio. Pity it doesn't seem to work. > Oh, and how about Ragnar Danneskjold? We haven't heard from him in > a while! No - very strange. KR - what's the buzz? On Wed, 5 Feb 2003 KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: > test...this is only a test ... and Bob you passed with flying colours. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Wed Feb 05 00:12:05 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 5 Feb 2003 08:12:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 18156 invoked from network); 5 Feb 2003 08:12:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Feb 2003 08:12:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Feb 2003 08:12:04 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.173] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 05 Feb 2003 08:12:04 -0000 Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2003 08:12:02 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Upcoming DX opportunity Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 483 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.72.23 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics From the Northeast Radio Watch.... *And one late bit of news for the DXers out there: just as this issue of NERW was going to press, we heard from WBBR (1130) chief engineer Bob Janney, who tells us there will be a silent period on WBBR and WEVD (1050) next weekend. Listen for something else on both channels between 1:00 and 4:00 AM on Saturday morning (Feb. 8) and Sunday morning (Feb. 9); WWDJ (970 Hackensack NJ) will also be off, at least briefly, during those times. From ccuff@in4web.com Wed Feb 05 00:35:05 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 5 Feb 2003 08:35:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 93663 invoked from network); 5 Feb 2003 08:35:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Feb 2003 08:35:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Feb 2003 08:35:04 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.50]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Wed, 5 Feb 2003 03:31:21 -0500 Message-ID: <002301c2ccf0$385afe60$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030204192131.03139860@pop.GameBox.net> <005d01c2ccc0$cd6c2900$827dfea9@home1> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Carver TX-11A or TX-11B Date: Wed, 5 Feb 2003 03:26:01 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 The "a" has the expanded band- even the non-ams Carvers of 1986 on had the EB. CC ----- Original Message ----- From: Scott Todd To: Sent: Tuesday, February 04, 2003 9:46 PM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Carver TX-11A or TX-11B > First question- the B has the expanded band, otherwise they're pretty much > identical. > From philipr@irac.pe.ca Wed Feb 05 04:42:14 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 5 Feb 2003 12:42:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 98558 invoked from network); 5 Feb 2003 12:42:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Feb 2003 12:42:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Feb 2003 12:42:13 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.253] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 05 Feb 2003 12:42:12 -0000 Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2003 12:42:11 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: Sony SRF-A100 on eBay Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 733 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking That's why I was lucky too - no mention of AM Stereo - but it was very easy to see the "AM ST" button in the picture. By the way, it works great! Phil R. --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " wrote: > I got my UX-1 for $10.50 on eBay, it was simply labeled "Delco ETR > radio with cassette and 5 band graphic equalizer", no mention of AM > stereo. > > John > > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Phil Rafuse " < > philipr@i...> wrote: > > > > I got my UX-1 for $13.50 on ebay, so sometimes there are some > > bargins there. But the SRF-A100, the Carvers, etc. are going to go > > on ebay for a fortune 99.44% of the time. There is always that .66% > > though! From jbyrns@enteract.com Wed Feb 05 10:03:33 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 5 Feb 2003 18:03:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 96105 invoked from network); 5 Feb 2003 18:03:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Feb 2003 18:03:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.88) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Feb 2003 18:03:32 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.248] by n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 05 Feb 2003 18:03:32 -0000 Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2003 18:03:29 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Another for John Byrns Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1865 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.226 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "jsgilst " < jsgil@h...> wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " > wrote: > > Just try putting a "SAT" next to the small air loop on a Carver > > TX-11a, and watch (hear) what happens to the Carver's 15 kHz audio > > response. > > > > John > > > My experience in putting a SAT next to a receiver with an air core > antenna is it coesn't couple well at all and nulls out any field that > the receiver is getting as the stand alone SAT is designed to be used > with a ferrite antenna. The version for the air core receivers comes > with a ferrite rod to couple with the air core to solve this. Did you try placing the small air loop of the TX-11a directly against the back of the "SAT"? I tried the "SAT" three different ways with my TX-11a. 1.) With the small TX-11a air loop taped to the back of the "SAT". This worked, but I don't remember anything about its performance because it was inconvenient, and I only tried it briefly, before moving on to options #2 & #3. 2.) Used a single turn of wire around the outside diameter of the "SAT" to replace the stock TX-11a air loop. This worked the best of the three options, providing the greatest amount of signal. 3.) Used the jack on the front of the "SAT" to replace the stock TX- 11a air loop. This worked well, but not as well as the single turn coupling loop. I believe the jack on the front of the "SAT" connects to an internal two turn coupling loop, which is the full diameter of the "SAT", at least that is what the "SAT" company told me when I asked. Keep in mind that the TX-11a air loop is not tuned, so the size/ inductance of the loop used with the TX-11a is not too critical. I have not seen the version of the "SAT" that you mentioned, with the ferrite coupling rod. John From jbyrns@enteract.com Wed Feb 05 10:06:15 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 5 Feb 2003 18:06:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 18304 invoked from network); 5 Feb 2003 18:06:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Feb 2003 18:06:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.75) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Feb 2003 18:06:09 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.161] by n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 05 Feb 2003 18:05:56 -0000 Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2003 18:05:56 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: Sony SRF-A100 on eBay Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 596 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.226 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g I assume the "AM stereo" feature is not mentioned because the general public doesn't give a hoot about "AM stereo" or the "AM stereo" feature of the UX-1. It is probably only a small number of nuts that are interested in radios with the "AM stereo" feature. The sellers description probably reflects this general attitude. John --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Phil Rafuse " < philipr@i...> wrote: > That's why I was lucky too - no mention of AM Stereo - but it was > very easy to see the "AM ST" button in the picture. By the way, it > works great! > > Phil R. From philipr@irac.pe.ca Wed Feb 05 11:06:00 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 5 Feb 2003 19:06:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 61104 invoked from network); 5 Feb 2003 19:05:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Feb 2003 19:05:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Feb 2003 19:05:58 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.175] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 05 Feb 2003 19:05:57 -0000 Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2003 19:05:57 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: Sony SRF-A100 on eBay Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1900 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking Some ebay sellers are very knowledgable about what they sell, others are not. In this case, it was someone selling an old car radio with cassette, that's all they knew. The sellers description reflected the sellers ignorance, rather than the demand for the particular feature. Often sellers are not previous owners selling personal items, but auto salvage operations, buy and sells, etc. where they acquire "inventory" they know little about, then try to sell. Some of these folks, to their credit, get on the internet, learn about what they sell, provide a much better description and reap the benefit of a much higher auction price. If you can get an extra $50 US for an item by spending an hour on the net, you've just earned fifty bucks per hour, not bad! Between AM stereo enthusiasts - "nuts" is your term, not mine - and radio collectors in general, known AM stereo radios usually go for "big bucks" on ebay. On occassion, someone will be selling a car radio on ebay, claiming it to be AM Stereo, when it is not. They see an "AMS" button, thinking that stands for AM Stereo, when it in fact means automatic music search for the cassette player. Phil R. --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " wrote: > > I assume the "AM stereo" feature is not mentioned because the general > public doesn't give a hoot about "AM stereo" or the "AM stereo" > feature of the UX-1. It is probably only a small number of nuts that > are interested in radios with the "AM stereo" feature. The sellers > description probably reflects this general attitude. > > John > > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Phil Rafuse " < > philipr@i...> wrote: > > That's why I was lucky too - no mention of AM Stereo - but it was > > very easy to see the "AM ST" button in the picture. By the way, it > > works great! > > > > Phil R. From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Feb 05 11:17:28 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 5 Feb 2003 19:17:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 79096 invoked from network); 5 Feb 2003 19:17:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Feb 2003 19:17:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Feb 2003 19:17:27 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-226.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.226]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h15JGhC8016096 for ; Wed, 5 Feb 2003 13:17:25 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <001b01c2cd4b$7d310100$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} The Sports Zone Date: Wed, 5 Feb 2003 13:18:38 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Back in the 20s, you could get fined for having dust on your transmitter. How times have changed. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Possum Hunter" > Guess the FCC can't fine them for having a rotted out floor, eh? From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Feb 05 11:19:22 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 5 Feb 2003 19:19:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 48351 invoked from network); 5 Feb 2003 19:19:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Feb 2003 19:19:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Feb 2003 19:19:21 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-226.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.226]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h15JJIC8016979 for ; Wed, 5 Feb 2003 13:19:19 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <002901c2cd4b$c0ed1780$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <49.2a72a75e.2b720747@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} test only...delete...ignore Date: Wed, 5 Feb 2003 13:21:13 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude If this had been an actual emergency we would have fled in terror and you wouldn't have been informed. :) ST ----- Original Message ----- From: > test...this is only a test From michaelj@vcn.com Wed Feb 05 11:46:41 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 5 Feb 2003 19:46:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 44367 invoked from network); 5 Feb 2003 19:46:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Feb 2003 19:46:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m1-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Feb 2003 19:46:41 -0000 Received: from michael (unverified [209.193.86.14]) by m1-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Wed, 5 Feb 2003 12:46:40 -0700 To: Subject: AM Stereo radio available Date: Wed, 5 Feb 2003 12:45:55 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi all I wanted to take a minute to inform the list of something. I've mentioned several times that I go down to Utah on almost a weekly basis, and in my travels I'll always make a stop at a thrift store or two. 99% of the time at these thrift stores I see AM Stereo car radios. Particularly the Chryslers....and yes a few of the GM Delco UX-1's. I don't pick them up because I already have a UX-1 and I don't have a Chrysler car, so I don't need the Chrysler. If anyone has a Chrysler vehicle that one of these will fit in, I'd be happy to pick one of these up for you and ship it to you for the cost of the radio (usually about 10 or 15 bucks) and shipping cost. (probably about 5 bucks). That'd save you from having to go through the agonizing pain in the butt methods of EBay bidding and such. Like I said...pretty much every week I'll see a Chrysler unit that I'm pretty sure has AM Stereo. This'd be the one with AM/FM Cassette. And from time to time, a UX-1. Yesterday I saw a Ford one that was I believe one of the AM Stereo models. Please, if you're looking for one, just let me know and I can pick one up for you. I don't have the bucks to pick these up and sit on them or put them on Ebay. These are usually without the plugs that go on the back. That'd be up to you to go to your local junk yard and snag the connectors. Still saves you a lot of headache and money from having to go through Ebay. MJR n WYO [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From alfredot@inetarena.com Wed Feb 05 12:17:37 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: alfredot@inetarena.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 5 Feb 2003 20:17:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 44910 invoked from network); 5 Feb 2003 20:17:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Feb 2003 20:17:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.inetarena.com) (206.129.216.13) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Feb 2003 20:17:33 -0000 Received: from hendrie (1Cust155.tnt15.beaverton.or.da.uu.net [67.227.162.155]) by mail.inetarena.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h15KEuP04026 for ; Wed, 5 Feb 2003 12:14:56 -0800 (PST) Date: Wed, 5 Feb 2003 12:16:38 -0800 (PST) X-Sender: alfredo@hendrie.1610am.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Kevin's Bandscan Aircheck In-Reply-To: <1044285474.865.96754.m12@yahoogroups.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: "Alfredo E. Torrejon" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=25132238 X-Yahoo-Profile: alfredotorrejon > is then the problem is in the radio, not WOR. Of course you must > insure that the Select-A-Tenna is tuned to the frequency you are > monitoring, or else it could make the interference worse. > > I guess I don't understand why you say "no Select-A-Tenna to help it", > that makes it sound like you are not keeping an open mind, and are > trying to pin the blame on WOR, and not the radio. I disagree. I think that as a first pass, using the stock radio without any additional devices that could boost the signal strength or alter its pickup pattern was the right thing to do. However, I think that at this stage, the appropriate (and gentlemanly) thing to do is to try to make up with the WOR engineers. Try to get them to bring their spectrum analyzer out to the location where the interference was heard. I'm not trying to offend you in any way, Kevin, but you have to accept that for there to be any hope of a resolution over these interference problems, the WOR engineers are going to need data that they can trust. From what I've seen on this board, I believe that if they do see the spurious products on their own spectrum analyzer, then they will recognize that there's a problem and work towards fixing it. Alfredo From alfredot@inetarena.com Wed Feb 05 12:34:43 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: alfredot@inetarena.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 5 Feb 2003 20:34:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 78687 invoked from network); 5 Feb 2003 20:34:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Feb 2003 20:34:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.inetarena.com) (206.129.216.13) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Feb 2003 20:34:39 -0000 Received: from hendrie (1Cust155.tnt15.beaverton.or.da.uu.net [67.227.162.155]) by mail.inetarena.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h15KW2P07243 for ; Wed, 5 Feb 2003 12:32:03 -0800 (PST) Date: Wed, 5 Feb 2003 12:33:45 -0800 (PST) X-Sender: alfredo@hendrie.1610am.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Another for John Byrns In-Reply-To: <1044342878.1477.84684.m9@yahoogroups.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: "Alfredo E. Torrejon" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=25132238 X-Yahoo-Profile: alfredotorrejon > All small handheld, clock, cheapie radios will most likeky use a > tuned ferrite for its space saving aspects and is fine for narrowband > but the BW varies too much for wideband if not designed properly. > >From the schematic of my Pioneer DTR receiver that uses a air core > loop antenna it is definitely tuned as I have tweaked on it some. > The reception aspects on the loop greatly increases when tuned > and if it wasn't tuned then another tuned coil inside the receiver > would have to be used for the RF preselector and this would add to > the cost. It's cheaper if space permitting to use an air core antenna > since the materials are plastic and insulated multistranded wire > compared to Litz wire and ferrite bar. In the receivers that I've seen using "untuned" loops, the loop antenna connects into a tap on the RF preselector coil, so it becomes part of that tuned circuit. Though I could be wrong, I would say that such antennas are not "aperiodic" (untuned). Making a loop antenna resonant boosts its output in proportion to the Q of the tuned circuit, so this design strategy improves the sensitivity of the receiver. On the subject of tuned loops, some time ago, I built an outdoor AM loop antenna with the loop going into a dual-tuned circuit, with the coupling set so that even at the low end of the band, the bandwidth was 20 kHz or more. A lot of signal can be obtained when the loop is 3-4 feet across. :) Alfredo From KC4QLP@aol.com Wed Feb 05 12:52:12 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 5 Feb 2003 20:52:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 42178 invoked from network); 5 Feb 2003 20:52:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Feb 2003 20:52:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r10.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.106) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Feb 2003 20:52:10 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r10.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.21.2b2e17f4 (16781) for ; Wed, 5 Feb 2003 15:52:05 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <21.2b2e17f4.2b72d375@aol.com> Date: Wed, 5 Feb 2003 15:52:05 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Kevin's Bandscan Aircheck To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 2/5/03 3:18:42 PM Eastern Standard Time, alfredot@inetarena.com writes: << > I guess I don't understand why you say "no Select-A-Tenna to help it", > that makes it sound like you are not keeping an open mind, and are > trying to pin the blame on WOR, and not the radio. I disagree. I think that as a first pass, using the stock radio without any additional devices that could boost the signal strength or alter its pickup pattern was the right thing to do. However, I think that at this stage, the appropriate (and gentlemanly) thing to do is to try to make up with the WOR engineers. >> ( is holding breath and turning blue ) We must be expecting the parting of the Red Sea here....LOL This whole "problem" could have been resolved long ago if certain actions had not taken place on here. This whole deal reminds me of a ham radio operator and his neighbor. The neighbor will get "interference" he beleives is coming from his ham radio neighbor---even if the ham operator isnt home with all of his equipment off. Let a broadcaster change its facilities or test a new mode and attacks jump out of the wood work. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- Subscribe send an email to amstereo-subscribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net _______________________________________________________ From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Feb 05 13:27:26 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 5 Feb 2003 21:27:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 41549 invoked from network); 5 Feb 2003 21:27:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Feb 2003 21:27:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Feb 2003 21:27:25 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-244.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.244]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h15LRLC8003212 for ; Wed, 5 Feb 2003 15:27:22 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <005501c2cd5d$a4c32420$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM Stereo radio available Date: Wed, 5 Feb 2003 15:27:25 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude I'd go for that Ford radio IF it has expanded band. The one for my car is about the same size as the UX-1. Thanks, Scott ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael J. Richard" To: Sent: Wednesday, February 05, 2003 1:45 PM Subject: {AMSF} AM Stereo radio available > Hi all > I wanted to take a minute to inform the list of something. I've mentioned > several times that I go down to Utah on almost a weekly basis, and in my > travels I'll always make a stop at a thrift store or two. 99% of the time > at these thrift stores I see AM Stereo car radios. Particularly the > Chryslers....and yes a few of the GM Delco UX-1's. I don't pick them up > because I already have a UX-1 and I don't have a Chrysler car, so I don't > need the Chrysler. If anyone has a Chrysler vehicle that one of these will > fit in, I'd be happy to pick one of these up for you and ship it to you for > the cost of the radio (usually about 10 or 15 bucks) and shipping cost. > (probably about 5 bucks). That'd save you from having to go through the > agonizing pain in the butt methods of EBay bidding and such. Like I > said...pretty much every week I'll see a Chrysler unit that I'm pretty sure > has AM Stereo. This'd be the one with AM/FM Cassette. And from time to > time, a UX-1. Yesterday I saw a Ford one that was I believe one of the AM > Stereo models. Please, if you're looking for one, just let me know and I > can pick one up for you. I don't have the bucks to pick these up and sit on > them or put them on Ebay. These are usually without the plugs that go on > the back. That'd be up to you to go to your local junk yard and snag the > connectors. Still saves you a lot of headache and money from having to go > through Ebay. > > MJR n WYO > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > From amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk Wed Feb 05 14:52:47 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 5 Feb 2003 22:52:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 93126 invoked from network); 5 Feb 2003 22:52:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Feb 2003 22:52:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Feb 2003 22:52:46 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.185] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 05 Feb 2003 22:52:46 -0000 Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2003 22:52:45 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: AM Stereo Target Tuners Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 264 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Dave " X-Originating-IP: 81.7.62.134 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113985069 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereofan http://forums.mediauk.com/showthread.php? s=&threadid=26630&perpage=15&display=&pagenumber=2 > Target Tuners (it's a brand name I believe) are very simple fixed > frequency givewaway radios, usually bearing the logo of the station Collectors item now I guess ? From jbyrns@enteract.com Wed Feb 05 15:10:40 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 5 Feb 2003 23:10:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 91807 invoked from network); 5 Feb 2003 23:10:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Feb 2003 23:10:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Feb 2003 23:10:37 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.164] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 05 Feb 2003 23:10:37 -0000 Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2003 23:10:36 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Another for John Byrns Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1800 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.132 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Alfredo E. Torrejon" < alfredot@i...> wrote: > > In the receivers that I've seen using "untuned" loops, the loop > antenna connects into a tap on the RF preselector coil, so it > becomes part of that tuned circuit. Though I could be wrong, I > would say that such antennas are not "aperiodic" (untuned). That's not the way the Carver TX-11a works. The small air loop is connected to the primary of an RF transformer, whose secondary is broadly tuned by a fixed capacitor, presumably to eliminate out of band signals. The tuning of this transformer does not change as the radio is tuned across the MW band. The only significant RF selectivity is a double tuned circuit between the 1st RF amplifier and the 2nd RF amplifier. The RF amplifiers use discrete transistors and JFETs. The second RF amplifier feeds the LA1135 receiver IC without any additional selectivity. In looking at the schematic again, I notice that there is a 12 dB attenuator on the secondary of the RF transformer between the antenna and 1st RF amplifier, which is switched by an opto isolator. > Making a loop antenna resonant boosts its output in proportion to > the Q of the tuned circuit, so this design strategy improves the > sensitivity of the receiver. The untuned loop is probably the reason why the TX-11a has a very high hiss level when receiving anything except the local 50 kW stations less than 10 miles away. > On the subject of tuned loops, some time ago, I built an outdoor > AM loop antenna with the loop going into a dual-tuned circuit, with > the coupling set so that even at the low end of the band, the > bandwidth was 20 kHz or more. A lot of signal can be obtained when > the loop is 3-4 feet across. :) I can certainly believe that! John From amstereorules@msn.com Wed Feb 05 15:58:03 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereorules@msn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 5 Feb 2003 23:58:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 71071 invoked from network); 5 Feb 2003 23:58:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Feb 2003 23:58:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Feb 2003 23:58:01 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.176] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 05 Feb 2003 23:58:01 -0000 Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2003 23:57:59 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Another for John Byrns Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 103 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amstereorules " X-Originating-IP: 172.133.58.137 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=130870594 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereorules Ya gotta remember that the TX11-a has whopping 75DB S/N ratio in their AM specs. Ragnar Danneskjold From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Feb 05 16:01:34 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: possumhunter@netzero.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 6 Feb 2003 00:01:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 20567 invoked from network); 6 Feb 2003 00:01:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Feb 2003 00:01:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rly-ip04.mx.aol.com) (64.12.138.8) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Feb 2003 00:01:34 -0000 Received: from logs-wo.proxy.aol.com (logs-wo.proxy.aol.com [205.188.200.6]) by rly-ip04.mx.aol.com (v89.10) with ESMTP id RELAYIN6-0205185803; Wed, 05 Feb 2003 18:58:03 -0500 Received: from ibm (AC8F52A7.ipt.aol.com [172.143.82.167]) by logs-wo.proxy.aol.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with SMTP id h15NstDI366465 for ; Wed, 5 Feb 2003 18:54:56 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <00ef01c2cd71$f6bee7a0$a7528fac@aoldsl.net> To: References: <49.2a72a75e.2b720747@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} test only...delete...ignore Date: Wed, 5 Feb 2003 18:54:45 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Apparently-From: DodgeRamTrucker@aol.com From: "Possum Hunter" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Does this mean the list EAS is working? Kevin ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Wednesday, February 05, 2003 1:20 AM Subject: {AMSF} test only...delete...ignore > test...this is only a test > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > From jbyrns@enteract.com Wed Feb 05 17:34:04 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 6 Feb 2003 01:34:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 47456 invoked from network); 6 Feb 2003 01:34:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Feb 2003 01:34:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.84) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Feb 2003 01:34:01 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.148] by n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Feb 2003 01:34:00 -0000 Date: Thu, 06 Feb 2003 01:34:00 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Another for John Byrns Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 881 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.25 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "amstereorules < amstereorules@m...>" wrote: > Ya gotta remember that the TX11-a has whopping 75DB S/N ratio in > their AM specs. OK, I'll try and remember that, but why? Carver doesn't specify the field strength required to achieve a 75 dB SNR, although I suppose it might be part of some standard or other. The TX-11a specifications also say that a field strength of 250 uV/m is required for a 20 dB signal to noise ratio. From that we can deduce that a field strength of 141,000 uV/m is probably the minimum that could possibly produce a 75 dB SNR. A field strength of 141,000 uV/m seems consistent with my earlier comments. The TX-11a also specifies distortion as 0.9% at a field strength of 5,000 uV/m. I hate to think how high the distortion might rise at a field strength of 141,000 uV/m? John From kevtronics@yahoo.com Wed Feb 05 18:18:51 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 6 Feb 2003 02:18:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 64482 invoked from network); 6 Feb 2003 02:18:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Feb 2003 02:18:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Feb 2003 02:18:50 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.140] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Feb 2003 02:18:50 -0000 Date: Thu, 06 Feb 2003 02:18:48 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: The Sports Zone Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <001b01c2cd4b$7d310100$827dfea9@home1> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1327 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.95.29 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Back in the 20s, you could get fined for having dust on your > transmitter. > How times have changed. But, back then in the pre-FCC days, an inspector would come around with his test equipment, put a pencil mark on the tuning knob of the transmitter, and say "there, that's the frequency you transmit on". Then, no doubt by a few weeks later, the pencil mark would have been rubbed off when cleaning the transmitter... so setting up stations to operate on their assigned frequency was mostly a guessing game. Most stations were assigned to a single broadcasting frequency of 833 kHz (corresponding to a certain wavelength), but DXing could be achieved by tuning in errant stations that were transmitting +/- a few or many kHz away from the correct frequency. Needless to say whistles and squeals were common in reception! The digital frequency display on my AM Stereo generator, accurate down to 10 Hz tuning steps, is sure a luxury in comparsion! In fact, I use it to see how far off-center other stations are transmitting at... I just keep its output at a low level, and then carefully zero in to a station's frequency until the platform motion heard on an AM Stereo radio slows down and then disappears. If all stations were prefectly on-frequency, there would be no such thing as platform motion! From bjackson@indyradio.com Wed Feb 05 19:39:59 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 6 Feb 2003 03:39:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 76379 invoked from network); 6 Feb 2003 03:39:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Feb 2003 03:39:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.89) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Feb 2003 03:39:57 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.132] by n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Feb 2003 03:39:57 -0000 Date: Thu, 06 Feb 2003 03:39:55 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: iBiquity Update Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1010 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923 " X-Originating-IP: 64.25.100.80 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 iBiquity will propose a nighttime AM standard this month. Critics of iBiquity's HD Radio nave zeroed in on the lack of a nighttime digital solution for AM stations - but expect Bob Struble's company to file plans with the FCC and the NRSC very soon. Struble says he expects the debate to begin at that point - debate about power levels. This is a key issue because it involves the allocation scheme of nighttime "clears" that goes back decades. The idea was that a relative handful of stations would be allowed to have multi-state signals that take advantage of AM's nighttime propagation. While most others had to sign off or reduce power. Struble says iBiquity won't take any position in the debate over what the Digital Audio Broadcasting scheme should look like at night. Take note that it's not just a matter of coverage areas - it's also about dollars. As in station valuations. Rick Buckley's WOR, New York (710) jumped to become the first to adopt HD Radio - but they turn it off at sundown. From jsgil@hal-pc.org Thu Feb 06 02:59:20 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 6 Feb 2003 10:59:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 61706 invoked from network); 6 Feb 2003 10:59:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Feb 2003 10:59:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Feb 2003 10:59:19 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.251] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Feb 2003 10:59:01 -0000 Date: Thu, 06 Feb 2003 10:58:59 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Another for John Byrns Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 978 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.4 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Alfredo E. Torrejon" wrote: > > In the receivers that I've seen using "untuned" loops, the loop > antenna connects into a tap on the RF preselector coil, so it becomes part > of that tuned circuit. Though I could be wrong, I would say that such > antennas are not "aperiodic" (untuned). > Alfredo This is what I discovered with my Poineer. I got it 2nd hand and it didn't come with an AM antenna so I hat to make one. In the schematic it hooks to a RF transformer that has a varactor tuned circuit and can be manually tweaked. The first antenna I made was a 5" loop with 10 turns and was modeled after one for another Pioneer receiver. I had to tweak the RF transformer for good response. Not satisified with the sensitivity I made another that was 8" with 7 turns and had to retweak the RF transformer for good response. From this observation it appeared that the loop antenna was part of the tuned circiut. JSG From powell@conterra.com Thu Feb 06 08:25:37 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: powell@conterra.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 6 Feb 2003 16:25:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 25573 invoked from network); 6 Feb 2003 16:25:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Feb 2003 16:25:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mx.matrixconsulting.net) (65.199.24.6) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Feb 2003 16:25:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 32731 invoked from network); 6 Feb 2003 16:25:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO bsae-skqpk3w8p5) (66.112.193.86) by mx.matrixconsulting.net with SMTP; 6 Feb 2003 16:25:20 -0000 Organization: BEARly Organized To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Date: Thu, 6 Feb 2003 11:25:12 -0500 Subject: Thrift store finds.... Message-ID: <3E424618.14805.1D9184@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: <1044464084.1228.21042.m12@yahoogroups.com> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.01) From: "Powell E. Way III" Reply-To: powell@conterra.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=8062869 X-Yahoo-Profile: W4OPW Got a Carver TX-11B for $5.00............................. NOT! But did get something I have coveted for years. I never bought one new. GE 7-4885A. Digitally tuned AM-FM from the late 70's. It actually is about as sensitive as the CC radio or DX-398/ ATS-909. It has a 9/10 khz switch. I have the earlier model ( red display and no switch) and the keypad no longer works. Saw no AM stereo car radios either. I do have one for my 88 Cutlass. I just wish the heads weren't worn out on it. Checking the other stores later today...... Powell From meridian3891@cs.com Thu Feb 06 11:51:51 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: meridian3891@cs.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 6 Feb 2003 19:51:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 42691 invoked from network); 6 Feb 2003 19:51:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Feb 2003 19:51:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Feb 2003 19:51:50 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.140] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Feb 2003 19:51:50 -0000 Date: Thu, 06 Feb 2003 19:51:47 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Any stations using Kahn ? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1207 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Tony " X-Originating-IP: 205.166.36.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=48487815 X-Yahoo-Profile: onemeridian Since there is a toggle switch on the front of a Power-SIDE generator which is used for setting the generator to Power-SIDE mode or "AM Stereo," it could be (extremely) plausible that the switched was "accidentally bumped" from Power-SIDE to "AM Stereo" mode. (;-) Tony --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: > > There is at least one signal I can pick up here in Indianapolis > > (but not an Indy station) that doesn't light the stereo light on > > any C-Quam radio, it does on the Sansui...Muddy bass on one side > > and highs on the other. I think that's a powerside station with > > the pilot on, right? > > Yup... and while C-Quam is the only allowed system for AM Stereo, > there are no rules against transmitting any other kinds of AM Stereo > systems and other pilot tones... just if you're going to use it for > true stereo audio, it has to be using the C-Quam system according to > the FCC specs. > > 1570 WISP in Doylestown, PA is another Kahn PowerSide station which > transmits the 15 Hz pilot tone.... which serves no useful purpose > other than to indicate that the station's engineer is a die-hard > Kahn fanatic. :-) From JH_Radio@GameBox.net Fri Feb 07 13:25:44 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: JH_Radio@GameBox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 7 Feb 2003 21:25:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 86586 invoked from network); 7 Feb 2003 04:04:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Feb 2003 04:04:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO snickers.hotpop.com) (204.57.55.49) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Feb 2003 04:04:03 -0000 Received: from gamebox.net (kubrick.hotpop.com [204.57.55.16]) by snickers.hotpop.com (Postfix) with SMTP id C87F27105C for ; Fri, 7 Feb 2003 04:03:22 +0000 (UTC) Received: from -enduser.GameBox.net (pcp03184855pcs.benslm01.pa.comcast.net [68.80.77.117]) by smtp-2.hotpop.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 372041B8966 for ; Fri, 7 Feb 2003 03:58:48 +0000 (UTC) Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030206225757.02f3bec0@pop.GameBox.net> X-Sender: JH_Radio@pop.GameBox.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Thu, 06 Feb 2003 23:00:43 -0500 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: OT: Stereo Oldies Mime-Version: 1.0 X-HotPOP: ----------------------------------------------- Sent By HotPOP.com FREE Email Get your FREE POP email at www.HotPOP.com ----------------------------------------------- From: John X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113800107 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi. Does anyone here like stereo oldies? I love the stereo wide versions, alternate takes, and true stereo versions of the oldies not found on cd's! Am I the only one who knows, let alone cares? It's sad to see an album like Please Please me in mono on a CD, when the stereo vinyl is available! What is the difference between an wide stereo mix, alternate stereo mix, and true stereo mix? Thanks, John Love in Christ: John Bensalem, PA Send me an email Aim: RainAngelsRule MSN: RainAngelsRule@hotmail.com My website Welcome to Napster4TheBlind "Prayer does not change God; it changes you." - Authur unknown [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From amstereorules@msn.com Fri Feb 07 13:29:30 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereorules@msn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 7 Feb 2003 21:29:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 1558 invoked from network); 7 Feb 2003 01:14:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Feb 2003 01:14:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Feb 2003 01:14:30 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.140] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 07 Feb 2003 01:14:30 -0000 Date: Fri, 07 Feb 2003 01:14:28 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Another for John Byrns Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2331 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amstereorules " X-Originating-IP: 64.12.102.49 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=130870594 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereorules Kiddies, I will try to reply to John's reply. I'm trying.. .. John you gotta love the adulation: your name up in lights up there in that subject line. See it? It's right here. Johnnie Boy, you are so correct in describing Carver's MW untuned F.E.T. amp. What were they smoking? Their designer could've been absent when they were schooling I.M. products and all the nasty y'all get from a transistor- that isn't operating in it's linear range. Wow! You could had a oscillator. What a concept. But you know what Johnnie? You hang any old select-a-ma-antenna on them there MW antenna screws on the rear of that Carver TX-11a, tune in favourite MW stereo station, and presto you have some nice sounding stereo sound. Of course y'all need to be real close to the xmitter, and forget about DX'ing this baby with the wide switcher engaged. Has anybody figerred out the function and usefulness of that N.B. switch 'ma call it? This is Mr. Bobby W. Carver's specs for his pride and joy- TX-11a if you's all would like to see it- and some of y'all did reply off list (hey I won't cover the FM section here okay? After all, this is AM stereo list)- TUNING RANGE: 520 ~ 1710 kHz (that is kilo-cycles for old timers) SENSITIVITY: Terminal (what- is it dead?) 20 uV RADIATED (that's more like it): 250uV/m for 20dB S/N DISTORTION (5mV/M): 0.9% SELECTIVITY: 42 dB (you could drive a farm tracker through it's widely unselective barn door) YE HAW!! IMAGE REJECTION: 45 dB IF REJECTION: 34 dB (IF IT IS, SO BE IT) AGC FIGURE OF MERIT: 90 dB (hey it was once a major league baseball player, okay) AM STEREO SEPARATION: 40 dB (1 kHz) Of course, this is all we listen to, ya know! FREQUENCY RESPONSE: 20 Hz ~ 15 kHz SIGNAL-TO-NOISE RATIO: 75 dB POWER REQUIREMENTS: 120 Volt 60 Hz optional 240 Volt,50 Hz (for you fine European kiddies) POWER CONSUMPTION: 15 Watt (WOW! less than typ GE light bulb) DIMENSIONS: 17.5" W / 3.5" H / 12.5" D WEIGHT: 11.25 lbs (and so many souls put other stuff on top of it) Okay, stay away from grandpa's cough medicine, and be good. If you can't be good, be careful! Where else can you get this entertainment??? Ragnar, Your friendly irreverent correspondent From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Feb 07 13:44:46 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 7 Feb 2003 21:44:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 68307 invoked from network); 7 Feb 2003 09:29:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Feb 2003 09:29:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.75) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Feb 2003 09:29:46 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.141] by n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 07 Feb 2003 09:29:46 -0000 Date: Fri, 07 Feb 2003 09:29:45 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Just testing... Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 177 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.78.21 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics ...to make sure this group is still working today! Things have gotten awfully quiet lately, and I have a report of a posted message not showing up. So here goes nothing... From meridian3891@cs.com Fri Feb 07 13:47:30 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: meridian3891@cs.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 7 Feb 2003 21:47:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 85467 invoked from network); 7 Feb 2003 21:47:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Feb 2003 21:47:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Feb 2003 21:47:29 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.142] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 07 Feb 2003 21:47:29 -0000 Date: Fri, 07 Feb 2003 21:47:28 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Just testing... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 346 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Tony " X-Originating-IP: 205.166.36.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=48487815 X-Yahoo-Profile: onemeridian Maybe the hamsters in the server generator got too cold. ;) Tony --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: > ...to make sure this group is still working today! Things have > gotten awfully quiet lately, and I have a report of a posted message > not showing up. So here goes nothing... From jsgil@hal-pc.org Fri Feb 07 13:56:52 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 7 Feb 2003 21:56:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 13771 invoked from network); 7 Feb 2003 21:56:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Feb 2003 21:56:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Feb 2003 21:56:51 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.142] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 07 Feb 2003 21:56:51 -0000 Date: Fri, 07 Feb 2003 21:56:48 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Forum Down ? -- MP3 sample of my decoder Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 476 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.36 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst Well it seems that the forum may been down for awhile since my post hasn't shown up yet. Another Yahoo SNAFU! I had posted a test sample of my decoder I built recenty drivin by an IF modulator. Sorry it's not stereo but is there to demonstrate the freq response with a wide ceramic filter. There was more detail in my first post and may show up eventually. If not I will give more detail later. ftp://209.193.86.116/usa/misc/MC13028-FreqResponse-Mono-LaIslaBonita.mp3 JSG From jsgil@hal-pc.org Fri Feb 07 14:02:28 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 7 Feb 2003 22:02:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 37707 invoked from network); 7 Feb 2003 03:15:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Feb 2003 03:15:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.89) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Feb 2003 03:15:48 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.132] by n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 07 Feb 2003 03:15:48 -0000 Date: Fri, 07 Feb 2003 03:15:48 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: MC13028 Test Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 904 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.130.9 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst I have a sample of the output of The 13028 decoder I built recently. Since I don't have any AMS stations near by and I don't have an C-QuAM RF modulator I used a mono IF modulator. I know this isn't stereo but this mainly to demonstrate the frequency response of the filtering. The chain of processing goes as follows: Source: CD Player Eq for a 12.5KHz RF Bandpass simulated with a 1st Order 6.25KHz Low Pass Filter. NRSC 75us PreEmphasis with 8.7KHz Shelf(Pole). IF Modulator muRata =B17.5KHz 6-Element ceramic filter. MC13028 Decoder NRSC DeEmphasis High Q 10KHz Notch Filters 2nd Order Chebychev Low Pass Filter at ~9.5KHz with a High Freq. boost of ~11dB If anyone wants to pull it up in CoolEdit and do a spectral analisys of it please do. My copy is not available at the moment. The file is ~2MB in size. ftp://209.193.86.116/usa/misc/MC13028-FreqResponse-Mono-LaIslaBonita.mp3 JSG From dav259@csiro.au Fri Feb 07 14:04:21 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 7 Feb 2003 22:04:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 24892 invoked from network); 7 Feb 2003 04:42:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Feb 2003 04:42:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.78) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Feb 2003 04:42:41 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.147] by n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 07 Feb 2003 04:42:41 -0000 Date: Fri, 07 Feb 2003 04:42:40 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Oz - digital satellite broadcasting Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 1386 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "dav259 " X-Originating-IP: 138.194.15.102 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=112635033 X-Yahoo-Profile: dav259 Boo!!!!! My it's quiet in here. Has somebody tripped over the cord? Oz Newsroom latest ... Parliamentary questions on digital satellite broadcasting ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Opposition Communications spokesperson, Lindsay Tanner (Member for=20 Melbourne) put Digital Radio on the agenda in the House of=20 Representatives this week by asking a series of questions on notice=20 that suggested that the government might be delaying action on=20 digital satellite radio technology.=20 He asked:=20 Did the September 2001 report of the Rural Radio Inquiry recommend=20 that the minister should consider [the potential for] satellite=20 digital radio technology in regional and remote areas=85=20 Has satellite digital sound broadcasting been available to most of=20 the world for more than two years=85=20 Can trials be commenced immediately in north-west Australia using=20 affordable satellite =85 equipment=85=20 What is the government's position on conducting trials.=20 Did Australia in 1994=85 require the International Telecommunications=20 Union to reserve a satellite orbit position [for digital satellite=20 broadcasting]=20 Does the minister's department now want to suppress this notification Has [it] the capability to provide early universal service coverage=20 to all of Australia=85 [stay tuned for the Minister's answers] =20 dav259 Victorian Radio Newtwork News From ccuff@in4web.com Fri Feb 07 14:26:58 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 7 Feb 2003 22:26:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 35601 invoked from network); 7 Feb 2003 22:26:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Feb 2003 22:26:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Feb 2003 22:26:56 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.88]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Fri, 7 Feb 2003 17:23:17 -0500 Message-ID: <000b01c2cef6$c1cfe860$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030206225757.02f3bec0@pop.GameBox.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} OT: Stereo Oldies Date: Fri, 7 Feb 2003 17:17:51 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 I love the oldies in stereo!- I have the Dion & The Belmonts Bell Labs sessions recorded on reel in 1958 in stereo (a copy) It is outstanding. I have a lot of early Rock and Roll in stereo on MP3's on my portable player I use for demos. Chris ----- Original Message ----- From: John To: Sent: Thursday, February 06, 2003 11:00 PM Subject: {AMSF} OT: Stereo Oldies > > Hi. > Does anyone here like stereo oldies? From ccuff@in4web.com Fri Feb 07 14:29:29 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 7 Feb 2003 22:29:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 75329 invoked from network); 7 Feb 2003 22:29:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Feb 2003 22:29:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Feb 2003 22:29:28 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.88]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Fri, 7 Feb 2003 17:25:49 -0500 Message-ID: <001501c2cef7$1cdbb540$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Just testing... Date: Fri, 7 Feb 2003 17:20:24 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 My other yahoo group has been down since yesterday evening, still not back yet. And no where can I find an email for them to report problems.. CC ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Friday, February 07, 2003 4:47 PM Subject: {AMSF} Re: Just testing... > Maybe the hamsters in the server generator got too cold. > From michaelj@vcn.com Fri Feb 07 14:36:44 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 7 Feb 2003 22:36:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 51370 invoked from network); 7 Feb 2003 22:36:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Feb 2003 22:36:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m2-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.32) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Feb 2003 22:36:43 -0000 Received: from michael (unverified [209.193.86.22]) by m2-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Fri, 7 Feb 2003 15:36:43 -0700 To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} OT: Stereo Oldies Date: Fri, 7 Feb 2003 15:36:39 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) In-Reply-To: <000b01c2cef6$c1cfe860$0101a8c0@pavilion> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Importance: Normal From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Me too ! :) I go through extra efforts and love trying to dig up the "stereo version" of different songs....especially when I know there's one. Seems to me a little while back...6 or 8 months ago.... we had quite a bit of discussion on all of this. I was really impressed with this guy's knowledge of the originality of stereo recordings and what was and what wasn't and what was fabricated. Chris, you should remember all of this discussion. I don't remember who it was that knew all of this stuff......I know he's a regular member of this list, though. MJR n WYO -----Original Message----- From: Christopher Cuff [mailto:ccuff@in4web.com] Sent: Friday, February 07, 2003 3:18 PM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} OT: Stereo Oldies I love the oldies in stereo!- I have the Dion & The Belmonts Bell Labs sessions recorded on reel in 1958 in stereo (a copy) It is outstanding. I have a lot of early Rock and Roll in stereo on MP3's on my portable player I use for demos. Chris ----- Original Message ----- From: John To: Sent: Thursday, February 06, 2003 11:00 PM Subject: {AMSF} OT: Stereo Oldies > > Hi. > Does anyone here like stereo oldies? Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From ccuff@in4web.com Fri Feb 07 14:44:10 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 7 Feb 2003 22:44:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 9209 invoked from network); 7 Feb 2003 22:44:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Feb 2003 22:44:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Feb 2003 22:44:09 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.88]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Fri, 7 Feb 2003 17:40:30 -0500 Message-ID: <003001c2cef9$299e1640$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} OT: Stereo Oldies Date: Fri, 7 Feb 2003 17:35:04 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 It was Narkspud, I believe. cc ----- Original Message ----- From: Michael J. Richard To: Sent: Friday, February 07, 2003 5:36 PM Subject: RE: {AMSF} OT: Stereo Oldies . Chris, you should remember all of this > discussion. I don't remember who it was that knew all of this stuff......I > know he's a regular member of this list, though. From michaelj@vcn.com Fri Feb 07 14:52:06 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 7 Feb 2003 22:52:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 95827 invoked from network); 7 Feb 2003 22:52:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Feb 2003 22:52:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m1-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.31) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Feb 2003 22:52:05 -0000 Received: from michael (unverified [209.193.86.22]) by m1-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Fri, 7 Feb 2003 15:52:04 -0700 To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} OT: Stereo Oldies Date: Fri, 7 Feb 2003 15:52:00 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) In-Reply-To: <003001c2cef9$299e1640$0101a8c0@pavilion> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Importance: Normal From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Yup! I think that's right! MJR -----Original Message----- From: Christopher Cuff [mailto:ccuff@in4web.com] Sent: Friday, February 07, 2003 3:35 PM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} OT: Stereo Oldies It was Narkspud, I believe. cc ----- Original Message ----- From: Michael J. Richard To: Sent: Friday, February 07, 2003 5:36 PM Subject: RE: {AMSF} OT: Stereo Oldies . Chris, you should remember all of this > discussion. I don't remember who it was that knew all of this stuff......I > know he's a regular member of this list, though. Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From JH_Radio@GameBox.net Fri Feb 07 15:55:11 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: JH_Radio@GameBox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 7 Feb 2003 23:55:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 84302 invoked from network); 7 Feb 2003 23:55:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Feb 2003 23:55:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rizzo.jerky.net) (204.57.55.99) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Feb 2003 23:55:10 -0000 Received: from gamebox.net (kubrick.hotpop.com [204.57.55.16]) by rizzo.jerky.net (Postfix) with SMTP id BAB293344D for ; Fri, 7 Feb 2003 23:51:15 +0000 (UTC) Received: from -enduser.GameBox.net (pcp03184855pcs.benslm01.pa.comcast.net [68.80.77.117]) by smtp-1.hotpop.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 768B92F811C for ; Fri, 7 Feb 2003 22:55:46 +0000 (UTC) Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030207175947.032289b0@pop.GameBox.net> X-Sender: JH_Radio@pop.GameBox.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Fri, 07 Feb 2003 18:00:24 -0500 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: {AMSF} OT: Stereo Oldies In-Reply-To: References: <000b01c2cef6$c1cfe860$0101a8c0@pavilion> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-HotPOP: ----------------------------------------------- Sent By HotPOP.com FREE Email Get your FREE POP email at www.HotPOP.com ----------------------------------------------- From: John X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113800107 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cuol! I've been wondering ware you get the stuff? Princeton Record Exchange, or there another place? At 03:36 PM 2/7/03 -0700, you wrote: >Me too ! :) >I go through extra efforts and love trying to dig up the "stereo version" of >different songs....especially when I know there's one. >Seems to me a little while back...6 or 8 months ago.... we had quite a bit >of discussion on all of this. I was really impressed with this guy's >knowledge of the originality of stereo recordings and what was and what >wasn't and what was fabricated. Chris, you should remember all of this >discussion. I don't remember who it was that knew all of this stuff......I >know he's a regular member of this list, though. > >MJR n WYO > -----Original Message----- > From: Christopher Cuff [mailto:ccuff@in4web.com] > Sent: Friday, February 07, 2003 3:18 PM > To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: {AMSF} OT: Stereo Oldies > > > I love the oldies in stereo!- I have the Dion & The Belmonts Bell Labs > sessions recorded on reel in 1958 in stereo (a copy) It is outstanding. > I have a lot of early Rock and Roll in stereo on MP3's on my portable >player > I use for demos. > Chris > ----- Original Message ----- > From: John > To: > Sent: Thursday, February 06, 2003 11:00 PM > Subject: {AMSF} OT: Stereo Oldies > > > > > > Hi. > > Does anyone here like stereo oldies? > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > >Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Love in Christ: John Bensalem, PA Send me an email Aim: RainAngelsRule MSN: RainAngelsRule@hotmail.com My website Welcome to Napster4TheBlind "Prayer does not change God; it changes you." - Authur unknown [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From amstereorules@msn.com Fri Feb 07 17:48:24 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereorules@msn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 8 Feb 2003 01:48:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 28190 invoked from network); 8 Feb 2003 01:48:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Feb 2003 01:48:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Feb 2003 01:48:24 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.176] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 08 Feb 2003 01:48:24 -0000 Date: Sat, 08 Feb 2003 01:48:23 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: The Sports Zone Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 212 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amstereorules " X-Originating-IP: 152.163.197.187 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=130870594 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereorules wbrw@radiomailbox.com, How cray tell do you know how things were done in the 1920s- - Man you're barely in your twenties now! Al Stewart No, I'm not the one who sang YOTC, okay so don't ask! From bjackson@indyradio.com Fri Feb 07 17:50:09 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 8 Feb 2003 01:50:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 63169 invoked from network); 8 Feb 2003 01:50:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Feb 2003 01:50:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Feb 2003 01:50:09 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.174] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 08 Feb 2003 01:50:09 -0000 Date: Sat, 08 Feb 2003 01:50:09 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: OT: Stereo Oldies Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20030206225757.02f3bec0@pop.GameBox.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1275 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923 " X-Originating-IP: 64.25.100.94 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 I know that the PD of our oldies station, WGLD, *hates* stereo mixes. When we ripped our TM Century CD's into DadPro, he went out of his way to find the mono mixes of songs that we had been playing in stereo. It's an old philosophy...They came out in mono on AM, and by God we're going to keep them in mono :-) Brad Jackson Susquehanna, Indianapolis WGLD/WGRL/WFMS www.indyradio.com --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, John wrote: > > Hi. > Does anyone here like stereo oldies? > I love the stereo wide versions, alternate takes, and true stereo versions of the oldies not found on cd's! > Am I the only one who knows, let alone cares? > It's sad to see an album like Please Please me in mono on a CD, when the stereo vinyl is available! > What is the difference between an wide stereo mix, alternate stereo mix, and true stereo mix? > Thanks, > John > > > Love in Christ: > > John > > Bensalem, PA > > Send me an email > > Aim: RainAngelsRule > > MSN: > > RainAngelsRule@h... > > My website > > Welcome to Napster4TheBlind > > "Prayer does not change God; it changes you." - Authur unknown > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From dav259@csiro.au Fri Feb 07 18:02:00 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 8 Feb 2003 02:01:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 83942 invoked from network); 8 Feb 2003 02:01:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Feb 2003 02:01:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Feb 2003 02:01:58 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1821uR12871 for ; Sat, 8 Feb 2003 13:01:56 +1100 (EST) Date: Sat, 8 Feb 2003 13:01:56 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: OT: Stereo Oldies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=112635033 X-Yahoo-Profile: dav259 On Sat, 8 Feb 2003, bradleyj923 wrote: > It's an old philosophy...They came out in mono on AM, and by > God we're going to keep them in mono :-) I remember in 1985 when 3KZ 3XY and 3MP went AM stereo it was wonderful to hear some of the old favourites for the first time on radio in stereo. Truly a new dimension. Surely PDs should realise if a few listeners actually want to hear these tracks in mono all they have to do is press the mono/stereo switch. And as far as I know the only reason anyone chooses to drop back to mono is when listening to very weak signals. From amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Fri Feb 07 19:23:36 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 59112 invoked from network); 8 Feb 2003 03:23:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Feb 2003 03:23:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Feb 2003 03:23:35 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: notify@yahoogroups.com Received: from [66.218.67.173] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 08 Feb 2003 03:23:35 -0000 Date: 8 Feb 2003 03:23:34 -0000 Message-ID: <1044674614.5792.75647.w50@yahoogroups.com> X-eGroups-Application: files X-Yahoo-Group-Post: system From: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: New file uploaded to amstereoforum MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello, This email message is a notification to let you know that a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the amstereoforum group. File : /radios/Mc13028.gif Uploaded by : kevtronics Description : A sample frequency response graph from J.S. Gilstrap's MC13028-based AM Stereo decoder design. It shows that the audio response is basically flat to 9 kHz, followed by a gradual drop-off and then a sharp notch to reduce the 10 kHz carrier whistle typical of wide-band AM reception. You can access this file at the URL http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum/files/radios/Mc13028.gif To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/files Regards, kevtronics From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Fri Feb 07 20:07:40 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 8 Feb 2003 04:07:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 36456 invoked from network); 8 Feb 2003 04:07:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Feb 2003 04:07:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14204.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.146) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Feb 2003 04:07:40 -0000 Message-ID: <20030208040739.52042.qmail@web14204.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.127.58.117] by web14204.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 07 Feb 2003 20:07:39 PST Date: Fri, 7 Feb 2003 20:07:39 -0800 (PST) Subject: Leonard Kahn's Comments to the FCC aren't under 99-325 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio I finally found Uncle Leonard Kahn's comments to the FCC - and I have to agree with him - the FCC is full of stooges. http://gullfoss2.fcc.gov/prod/ecfs/retrieve.cgi?native_or_pdf=pdf&id_document=6513407527 __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Feb 07 20:43:22 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 8 Feb 2003 04:43:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 54670 invoked from network); 8 Feb 2003 04:43:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Feb 2003 04:43:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Feb 2003 04:43:20 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.167] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 08 Feb 2003 04:43:18 -0000 Date: Sat, 08 Feb 2003 04:43:17 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Leonard Kahn's Comments to the FCC aren't under 99-325 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20030208040739.52042.qmail@web14204.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 774 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.82.5 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > I finally found Uncle Leonard Kahn's comments to the FCC - and I > have to agree with him - the FCC is full of stooges. I didn't read through the whole thing yet, but right at the end, Kahn goes back to his old tricks; he is basically petitioning the FCC to re-approve use of his AM Stereo system, saying -- just as we have -- that there are "over 100 stations... that can just throw a switch and provide [Kahn/Hazeltine] AM Stereo... right now". Of course, he also takes the opportunity to throw in one last shot at the C-Quam system, whining once again about its platform motion (I guess he's never listened to an MC13022-based radio?) and its allegedly inreased bandwidth(?). Kahn's slogan throughout seems to be "Analog AM can do the job, day and night". From jsgil@hal-pc.org Fri Feb 07 21:07:43 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 8 Feb 2003 05:07:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 17666 invoked from network); 8 Feb 2003 05:07:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Feb 2003 05:07:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Feb 2003 05:07:37 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.189] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 08 Feb 2003 05:07:37 -0000 Date: Sat, 08 Feb 2003 05:07:35 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: New file uploaded to amstereoforum Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <1044674614.5792.75647.w50@yahoogroups.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 1629 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.176 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com wrote: >=20 > Hello, >=20 > This email message is a notification to let you know that > a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the amstereoforum=20 > group. >=20 > File : /radios/Mc13028.gif=20 > Uploaded by : kevtronics =20 > Description : A sample frequency response graph from J.S. Gilstrap's MC13028-based AM Stereo decoder design. It shows that the audio response is basically flat to 9 kHz, followed by a gradual drop-off and then a sharp notch to reduce the 10 kHz carrier whistle typical of wide-band AM reception.=20 >=20 > You can access this file at the URL >=20 > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum/files/radios/Mc13028.gif=20 >=20 > To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit >=20 > http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/files >=20 > Regards, >=20 > kevtronics Thanks for analizing it. It's kind of what I expected. Using the =B17.5KHz ceramic filter and RF bandwidth filter actually puts the raw receiver response at >-15dB@10KHz. The NRSC PreEmphasis helps overcome some of this plus the Chebychev Low Pass Filter boost @ ~9.5KHz. This attenuation at 10KHz allows it to DX fairly well when there is a local 1st adjacent. For instance I have a local 5KW sataion and a can sometimes DX a 50KW 1st adjacent at 250miles when skywave is right. It suppresses the adjacent carrier enough in most cases that it doesn't dominate the envelope detector. This filter is similar in bandwidth response to those used in the wideband Chrysler radios and probably has similar DX characteristics. JSG From amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Fri Feb 07 21:21:46 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 30439 invoked from network); 8 Feb 2003 05:21:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Feb 2003 05:21:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.66) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Feb 2003 05:21:46 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: notify@yahoogroups.com Received: from [66.218.67.248] by n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 08 Feb 2003 05:21:46 -0000 Date: 8 Feb 2003 05:21:46 -0000 Message-ID: <1044681706.140613.71051.w69@yahoogroups.com> X-eGroups-Application: files X-Yahoo-Group-Post: system From: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: New file uploaded to amstereoforum MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello, This email message is a notification to let you know that a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the amstereoforum group. File : /pdf/kahn.pdf Uploaded by : kevtronics Description : Leonard Kahn's Petition for Rule Making filed with the FCC in January 2003, which basically calls for the digital IBOC/"HD Radio" system to be scrapped in favor of reinstated use of Kahn's analog AM Stereo system. You can access this file at the URL http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum/files/pdf/kahn.pdf To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/files Regards, kevtronics From jsgil@hal-pc.org Fri Feb 07 21:51:01 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 8 Feb 2003 05:51:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 79024 invoked from network); 8 Feb 2003 05:50:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Feb 2003 05:50:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Feb 2003 05:50:59 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.134] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 08 Feb 2003 05:50:59 -0000 Date: Sat, 08 Feb 2003 05:50:59 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: New file uploaded to amstereoforum Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 309 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.46 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "jsgilst " > actually puts the raw receiver response at >-15dB@10KHz. > > > JSG This is weird. Some of my text semms to be a yahoo user ID or something and truncates it as -15dB@1... and is linked. It should read greater than minus 15dB at 10KHz. JSG From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Feb 07 22:38:36 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 8 Feb 2003 06:38:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 5914 invoked from network); 8 Feb 2003 06:38:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Feb 2003 06:38:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.83) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Feb 2003 06:38:35 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.182] by n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 08 Feb 2003 06:38:35 -0000 Date: Sat, 08 Feb 2003 06:38:35 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: @ Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 616 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.82.5 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > This is weird. Some of my text semms to be a yahoo user ID > or something and truncates it as -15dB@1... and is linked. > It should read greater than minus 15dB at 10KHz. Yahoo sees the @ (at sign) and thinks you are typing an e-mail address. To prevent spam, it blocks full e-mail addresses from being shown through the Yahoo Groups web interface; anything after the @ is truncated to the first character followed by "...". So, to use the @ in a conventional manner, just leave at least one space around it. Thus, if you typed "-15dB @ 10kHz", that way Yahoo wouldn't confuse it for an e-mail address. From amstereorules@msn.com Sat Feb 08 00:33:00 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereorules@msn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 8 Feb 2003 08:33:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 64396 invoked from network); 8 Feb 2003 08:32:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Feb 2003 08:32:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Feb 2003 08:32:59 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.179] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 08 Feb 2003 08:32:59 -0000 Date: Sat, 08 Feb 2003 08:32:57 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: AM stereo Round up on ebay Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 639 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amstereorules " X-Originating-IP: 205.188.209.76 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=130870594 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereorules Hey, Here is your round up of MW stereo items on the auction block for ya including a TU680nab and SrfA100- http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2156894676 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3005437100 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3005970004 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3006831443 http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2402921045 It's a buyers market out there, so grab 'em while y'all can. YE HAW! What was you're first MW stereo radio? Its now midnight in the greatland where I'm from. Enjoy the ride. AMStereoRules Leonard kahn is my hero From bjackson@indyradio.com Sat Feb 08 01:05:06 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 8 Feb 2003 09:05:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 92969 invoked from network); 8 Feb 2003 09:05:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Feb 2003 09:05:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.68) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Feb 2003 09:05:04 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.170] by n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 08 Feb 2003 09:05:04 -0000 Date: Sat, 08 Feb 2003 09:05:02 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: OT: Stereo Oldies Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 939 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923 " X-Originating-IP: 216.132.129.192 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, Ian Davidson wrote: > Surely PDs should realise if a few listeners actually want to hear these > tracks in mono all they have to do is press the mono/stereo switch. And > as far as I know the only reason anyone chooses to drop back to mono is > when listening to very weak signals. I guess maybe old habits die hard? Really, I have no idea why we did this. I helped with moving the music into DadPro...I even put many of the Beatles tunes in from my Mobile Fidelity Labs Master CD's and he put in mono mixes from non-remastered disks! On an FM station! When I asked him, he said that since people grew up listening to these oldies in mono, the research showed they wanted to keep hearing them in mono. Whatever. That's why I work 90% of the time on our country and 80's stations I guess ;-) Brad Jackson Susquehanna, Indianapolis WGLD/WGRL/WFMS http://www.indyradio.com From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Feb 08 01:50:40 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 8 Feb 2003 09:50:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 15567 invoked from network); 8 Feb 2003 09:50:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Feb 2003 09:50:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Feb 2003 09:50:39 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.187] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 08 Feb 2003 09:50:39 -0000 Date: Sat, 08 Feb 2003 09:50:37 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: OT: Stereo Oldies Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2056 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.82.5 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > When I asked him, he said that since people grew up listening to > these oldies in mono, the research showed they wanted to keep > hearing them in mono. Whatever. As long as the mono sum of the Stereo version is not harmed, this is a moot point because most radios can be manually switched into mono mode, and then that will give the same result as if the song was played in mono on the air. Exceptions might include Stereo mixes of some songs that are inferior to the mono "AM radio" mixes, or songs that are only available in Stereo in the long-winded album versions. Then there are songs which perpetually seem to get played in on the radio in their awful "simulated Stereo" versions, such as the Beatles' "Love Me Do" and Procol Harum's "A Whiter Shade of Pale". In the former case, a plain mono mix would sound much better for both mono and Stereo listeners, and in the latter case, a true Stereo version of this song *is* available if you look hard enough! There are also some '60s songs which have been re-released in modified Stereo mixes which have a more "contemporary" sound without such drastic left-to-right separation, such as having lead vocals only in the Left or Right channel. A few Beatles songs have been subjected to this, including "In My Life" and "We Can Work It Out", and if you don't have the original Stereo LP versions you might not know the difference. Modern "Greatest Hits"-type CD releases are also generally compressed and clipped to drastically increase loudness at the expense of dynamic range, but that's a whole other issue. And even with contemporary music, it is often interesting to hear just how much is lost when playing Stereo music in mono. For example, in Lenny Kravtiz's '70s-soul-styled 1991 hit "It Ain't Over 'Til It's Over", when you play it in mono, the synthesizer piano drops out completely. Despite being an important part of the song's instrumentation from start to finish, that particular element was mixed in *out-of-phase*, so mono listeners cannot hear it! From amstereorules@msn.com Sat Feb 08 03:15:00 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereorules@msn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 8 Feb 2003 11:14:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 75200 invoked from network); 8 Feb 2003 11:14:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Feb 2003 11:14:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Feb 2003 11:14:58 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.175] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 08 Feb 2003 11:14:58 -0000 Date: Sat, 08 Feb 2003 11:14:57 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: OT: Stereo Oldies Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1097 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amstereorules " X-Originating-IP: 152.163.201.211 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=130870594 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereorules > As long as the mono sum of the Stereo version is not harmed, this >is a moot point because most radios can be manually switched into >mono mode, and then that will give the same result as if the song >was played in mono on the air. Wrong. Wrong. Wrong. Stereo remixes of mono songs cannot be restored to there mono version by this method. You sound like Ted Turner colorizing all those classic movies, and telling his audience that they can turn down the color control on their TV. First of all, in mono everything is mixed to one channel. When it is re- recorded to stereo, many times they find the vocal track and put it in one channel. Then they find one of the instrument track, and put it in another channel. And so on, and so on. You press that "mono" button on your equipment, and you instantly cut those single channel sounds 6DB, and guess what, they weren't recorded 6DB down in the mono version! This is absolutely terrible process to the old classics (pre -1964 or thereabouts). Hey Mr. Moderator why did we lose 4 list members in four days? Remember, AMStereoRules From amstereoguy@hotmail.com Sat Feb 08 03:50:48 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereoguy@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 8 Feb 2003 11:50:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 62727 invoked from network); 8 Feb 2003 11:50:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Feb 2003 11:50:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (207.68.165.68) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Feb 2003 11:50:47 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 8 Feb 2003 03:50:47 -0800 Received: from 208.228.96.20 by sea2fd.sea2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Sat, 08 Feb 2003 11:50:46 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: OT: Stereo Oldies Date: Sat, 08 Feb 2003 06:50:46 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 08 Feb 2003 11:50:47.0209 (UTC) FILETIME=[51956990:01C2CF68] From: "Chris Cuff" X-Originating-IP: [208.228.96.20] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37866059 Mr "co-moderator" here- we lost Jeff Deck. A sad situation. We have 2 people on "Hard bouncing" so they have to be reset. One other person left after 1 day or so. Not as bad as it looks... :-) CC Mr. Moderator why did we lose 4 list members in four days? > >Remember, >AMStereoRules > > > > _________________________________________________________________ Add photos to your e-mail with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail From bjackson@indyradio.com Sat Feb 08 05:02:43 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 8 Feb 2003 13:02:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 42463 invoked from network); 8 Feb 2003 13:02:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Feb 2003 13:02:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Feb 2003 13:02:41 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.156] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 08 Feb 2003 13:02:40 -0000 Date: Sat, 08 Feb 2003 13:02:39 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: OT: Stereo Oldies Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 419 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923 " X-Originating-IP: 64.25.100.130 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Chris Cuff" wrote: > Mr "co-moderator" here- we lost Jeff Deck. A sad situation. We have 2 people > on "Hard bouncing" so they have to be reset. One other person left after 1 > day or so. > Not as bad as it looks... :-) > CC We lost Jeff? Where was the last place you put him? Seriously, I thought he was one of our "big time" AM Stereo supporters? From powell@conterra.com Sat Feb 08 06:54:48 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: powell@conterra.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 8 Feb 2003 14:54:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 96735 invoked from network); 8 Feb 2003 14:54:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Feb 2003 14:54:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO ziggy.conterra.com) (66.112.206.20) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Feb 2003 14:54:47 -0000 Received: from ziggy.conterra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ziggy.conterra.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h18Eskgr089926 for ; Sat, 8 Feb 2003 09:54:46 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from powell@conterra.com) Received: (from www@localhost) by ziggy.conterra.com (8.12.6/8.12.6/Submit) id h18EskOZ089925 for amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com; Sat, 8 Feb 2003 09:54:46 -0500 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: ziggy.conterra.com: www set sender to powell@conterra.com using -f Received: from 209.213.26.22 ( [209.213.26.22]) as user powell@mail.conterra.com by ziggy.conterra.com with HTTP; Sat, 8 Feb 2003 09:54:46 -0500 Message-ID: <1044716086.3e451a3681396@ziggy.conterra.com> Date: Sat, 8 Feb 2003 09:54:46 -0500 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: oldies in WHAT? References: <1044695107.2299.92983.m10@yahoogroups.com> In-Reply-To: <1044695107.2299.92983.m10@yahoogroups.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) 3.1 From: powell@conterra.com X-Originating-IP: 209.213.26.22 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=8062869 X-Yahoo-Profile: W4OPW At WKDK we have a 4 Seasons CD with all the hits from the original masters I guess, and my favorite as a radio test record is Rag Doll. It sounds correct in mono, but sounds sonically different when I listen in stereo. It doesn't have any different content, but the separation makes it sound very different. I have a compilation by Capitol of 70's oldies. It sounds fine on all cuts but one. The stereo is fine, but when listened to in mono the vocals are accidentally phased out. ONLY that cut on the CD. OOPS! What makes me furious is the oldies collections with " orignal artists" and tney have re sung the stuff and not very well. THAT is in VERRRRRRY fine print. I search for oldies collections and have enough to do a "CORRECT" 60's-70's format and a late 50's very early 60's one. I'd be amiss if I didn't mention my LARGE collection of Big Band. I was SO glad to be able to hear the Glenn Miller Orchestra in the Newberry Opera House. The female singer has her own CD's out. She gave me one. I played it 3 times while soaking in the tub last night. That CD WILL be featured on my big band segment Sunday morning. Powell ------------------------------------------------- This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/ From stodd@sherbtel.net Sat Feb 08 07:49:24 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 8 Feb 2003 15:49:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 88841 invoked from network); 8 Feb 2003 15:49:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Feb 2003 15:49:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Feb 2003 15:49:24 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-149.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.149]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h18FnD5N020082 for ; Sat, 8 Feb 2003 09:49:22 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <004d01c2cf89$ef6f1960$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: OT: Stereo Oldies Date: Sat, 8 Feb 2003 09:51:15 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude So what research was he looking at? I know our oldies stations never used mono mixes when stereo ones were available. I'll bet a lot of folks were blown away when they actually bought the record (unless it was a 45) and heard the separation they'd been missing. Did the record companies get a lot of complaints? Somehow I doubt it. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: > > and he > put in mono mixes from non-remastered disks! On an FM station! > > When I asked him, he said that since people grew up listening to > these oldies in mono, the research showed they wanted to keep hearing > them in mono. From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sat Feb 08 13:25:02 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 8 Feb 2003 21:25:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 25179 invoked from network); 8 Feb 2003 21:25:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Feb 2003 21:25:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.89) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Feb 2003 21:25:00 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.132] by n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 08 Feb 2003 21:24:59 -0000 Date: Sat, 08 Feb 2003 21:24:55 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Leonard Kahn's Comments to the FCC aren't under 99-325 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20030208040739.52042.qmail@web14204.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 1302 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.130.105 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John P." wrote: > I finally found Uncle Leonard Kahn's comments to the FCC - and I have to agree > with him - the FCC is full of stooges. >=20 > http://gullfoss2.fcc.gov/prod/ecfs/retrieve.cgi?native_or_pdf=3Dpdf&id_docu= me=3D=0D nt=3D6513407527 > I read it all the way through and I have to say my favorite paragraph is: "The AM DAB situation is analogous to an automobile manufacturer introducing a new type of vehicle that can only be driven during daylight hours and which is 1=BD times as wide as the widest vehicle on the road, so that it cannot be driven over most of America's highways. And which eventually will force all of the other cars off the road!" Kind of sums it all up. First thing comes to mind is getting caught behind a tractor transporting a mobile home with the label "Wide Load" on the back. Imagine if you will a road full of them every day, driving would be impossible and would have=20 to find some other form of transportation. I have to agree with him that a frequency separated system is more robust than a phase separated system when it comes to skywave reception. The biggest design obstacle is a high=20 quaity audio phase shifting system that offers a high degree=20 of separation in the L & R channels. JSG From jbyrns@enteract.com Sat Feb 08 13:47:33 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 8 Feb 2003 21:47:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 6233 invoked from network); 8 Feb 2003 21:47:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Feb 2003 21:47:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Feb 2003 21:47:32 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.163] by n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 08 Feb 2003 21:47:32 -0000 Date: Sat, 08 Feb 2003 21:47:31 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: AM stereo Round up on ebay Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1007 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.98.186 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g I hadn't heard of the YAMAHA TX-492 FM/AM STEREO TUNER being auctioned as eBay item 3005970004. Which AM stereo system(s) does the TX-492 support? Is it C-QUAM? Is it a single system radio, or a multi system radio? John --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "amstereorules < amstereorules@m...>" wrote: > Hey, > Here is your round up of MW stereo items on the auction block for ya > including a TU680nab and SrfA100- > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2156894676 > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3005437100 > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3005970004 > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3006831443 > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2402921045 > > It's a buyers market out there, so grab 'em while y'all can. YE HAW! > What was you're first MW stereo radio? > > Its now midnight in the greatland where I'm from. Enjoy the ride. > > AMStereoRules > Leonard kahn is my hero From jbyrns@enteract.com Sat Feb 08 13:52:42 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 8 Feb 2003 21:52:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 69333 invoked from network); 8 Feb 2003 21:52:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Feb 2003 21:52:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Feb 2003 21:52:41 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.160] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 08 Feb 2003 21:52:41 -0000 Date: Sat, 08 Feb 2003 21:52:39 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: OT: Stereo Oldies Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1363 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.98.186 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "amstereorules < amstereorules@m...>" wrote: > > As long as the mono sum of the Stereo version is not harmed, this > >is a moot point because most radios can be manually switched into > >mono mode, and then that will give the same result as if the song > >was played in mono on the air. > > Wrong. Wrong. Wrong. Stereo remixes of mono songs cannot > be restored to there mono version by this method. You sound like > Ted Turner colorizing all those classic movies, and telling his > audience that they can turn down the color control on their TV. > > First of all, in mono everything is mixed to one channel. When it > is re- recorded to stereo, many times they find the vocal track and > put it in one channel. Then they find one of the instrument track, > and put it in another channel. And so on, and so on. You > press that "mono" button on your equipment, and you instantly cut > those single channel sounds 6DB, and guess what, they weren't > recorded 6DB down in the mono version! This is absolutely > terrible process to the old classics (pre -1964 or thereabouts). The thing I don't like about some of the remixes, is that the EQ, and the effects, like the amount reverb, are often different in the remix than they were in the original, which changes the feel of the song. John From n0uiheric@aol.com Sat Feb 08 14:57:04 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 8 Feb 2003 22:57:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 98273 invoked from network); 8 Feb 2003 22:57:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Feb 2003 22:57:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d10.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.42) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Feb 2003 22:57:03 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-d10.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.187.15d32194 (4402) for ; Sat, 8 Feb 2003 17:57:00 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <187.15d32194.2b76e53c@aol.com> Date: Sat, 8 Feb 2003 17:57:00 EST Subject: End IBOC-DAB Now! To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih I don't think IBOC will ever be an acceptable DAB system for two reasons: 1) Massive ACI even within 2000 miles of a transmitter site 2) Incompatibility with existing AM and FM radios 3) Significant reductions in coverage, even for FM stations. For example, IBOC will cut down the range of a 100 kW FM from the current 45-60 mile primary coverage areas to less than 15 miles. At 50 kW ERP, the primary coverage would be cut from 32 miles to less than 10. And we would lose nearly 90% of all non-commercial educational FM stations (which we need now with the crappy programming on most commercial stations, especially the corporate stations) and many independent AM stations. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Sat Feb 08 14:57:10 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 8 Feb 2003 22:57:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 76335 invoked from network); 8 Feb 2003 22:57:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Feb 2003 22:57:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d07.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.39) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Feb 2003 22:57:09 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-d07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.188.15a7241d (4402) for ; Sat, 8 Feb 2003 17:56:58 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <188.15a7241d.2b76e539@aol.com> Date: Sat, 8 Feb 2003 17:56:57 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} iBiquity Update To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih The FCC should reject all IBOCrap...day and night, AM and FM. Tell the FCC today! 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From bjackson@indyradio.com Sat Feb 08 15:15:21 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 8 Feb 2003 23:15:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 62089 invoked from network); 8 Feb 2003 23:15:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Feb 2003 23:15:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Feb 2003 23:15:19 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.151] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 08 Feb 2003 23:15:19 -0000 Date: Sat, 08 Feb 2003 23:15:19 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: OT: Stereo Oldies Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <004d01c2cf89$ef6f1960$827dfea9@home1> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 895 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923 " X-Originating-IP: 216.132.129.192 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Scott Todd" wrote: > So what research was he looking at? I know our oldies stations never used > mono mixes when stereo ones were available. I'll bet a lot of folks were > blown away when they actually bought the record (unless it was a 45) and > heard the separation they'd been missing. Did the record companies get a > lot of complaints? Somehow I doubt it. > > ST > With this thread going on, I asked him (our PD was on before me today...so many sick people we all had to work this weekend!) about it. He says that many of the stereo mixes were done only by the engineers, with no input from the actual group, so they sound different from the mono mixes. Plus, he thought the MOFI versions of the Beatles had too much EQ (sounds fine to me). Brad Jackson Susquehanna, Indianapolis WGLD/WGRL/WFMS http://www.indyradio.com From ccuff@in4web.com Sat Feb 08 15:16:09 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 8 Feb 2003 23:16:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 48932 invoked from network); 8 Feb 2003 23:16:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Feb 2003 23:16:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Feb 2003 23:16:09 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.46]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Sat, 8 Feb 2003 18:12:31 -0500 Message-ID: <001b01c2cfc6$cc42cf80$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: AM stereo Round up on ebay Date: Sat, 8 Feb 2003 18:07:04 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 The Yamaha is a relatively new tuner- 1996 or so. The Japan market model uses the MC13028. The parts can be added to the US model. I have the schematic. Jeff Deck is selling this, so I know it has am stereo, and it does have the ext band. CC ----- Original Message ----- From jbyrns@enteract.com Sat Feb 08 15:36:53 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 8 Feb 2003 23:36:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 45727 invoked from network); 8 Feb 2003 23:36:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Feb 2003 23:36:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.84) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Feb 2003 23:36:34 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.185] by n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 08 Feb 2003 23:36:33 -0000 Date: Sat, 08 Feb 2003 23:36:31 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: OT: Stereo Oldies Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 740 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.146 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "amstereorules < amstereorules@m...>" wrote: > First of all, in mono everything is mixed to one channel. When it > is re- recorded to stereo, many times they find the vocal track and > put it in one channel. Then they find one of the instrument track, > and put it in another channel. And so on, and so on. You > press that "mono" button on your equipment, and you instantly cut > those single channel sounds 6DB, and guess what, they weren't > recorded 6DB down in the mono version! Wouldn't that be 3dB down? It would be 6dB down in the channel it was originally on, but it would appear in both channels, for an increase of 3dB, leaving a net of 3dB down, not 6dB. John From n0uiheric@aol.com Sat Feb 08 17:22:30 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 9 Feb 2003 01:22:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 4702 invoked from network); 9 Feb 2003 01:22:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Feb 2003 01:22:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m04.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.7) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Feb 2003 01:22:27 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-m04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.142.9ff21eb (4426) for ; Sat, 8 Feb 2003 20:22:26 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <142.9ff21eb.2b770751@aol.com> Date: Sat, 8 Feb 2003 20:22:25 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} End IBOC-DAB Now! To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih Actually, that's THREE reasons! 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From jlehmann@attbi.com Sat Feb 08 18:05:36 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jlehmann@attbi.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 9 Feb 2003 02:05:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 62466 invoked from network); 9 Feb 2003 02:05:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Feb 2003 02:05:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Feb 2003 02:05:34 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.171] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 09 Feb 2003 02:05:34 -0000 Date: Sun, 09 Feb 2003 02:05:30 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: AM Stereo Car Radios Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 453 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "n1zzn " X-Originating-IP: 66.30.163.53 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=98257848 X-Yahoo-Profile: n1zzn Hi everyone, I've been a member of the group for a while, but this is my first=20 time posting. I don't currently have any AM stereo radios, but I'm=20 interested in getting one. Would the easiest to find be a car radio?=20 Looking at the AM stereo website, it looks like quite a few cars had=20 AM stereo radios. Has anyone had any luck finding those at=20 junkyards? Also, would they be easy to set up in the house? Thanks, Jeff Lehmann =96 N1ZZN Hanson, MA From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Sat Feb 08 18:52:26 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 9 Feb 2003 02:52:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 52609 invoked from network); 9 Feb 2003 02:52:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Feb 2003 02:52:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf31bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.209) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Feb 2003 02:52:25 -0000 Received: from juan ([68.155.185.131]) by imf31bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.25 201-253-122-122-125-20020815) with SMTP id <20030209025423.BGTF7679.imf31bis.bellsouth.net@juan>; Sat, 8 Feb 2003 21:54:23 -0500 Message-ID: <000801c2cfe6$461675e0$af78fea9@juan> To: Cc: Subject: OT: Beach Music Date: Sat, 8 Feb 2003 21:52:23 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit WSAI-1530 has been playing Beach music tonight. This station is doing Oldies right ! If you havent listened, do so. It's just like the old days...requests....having fun. I wish them well. Juan [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From jlehmann@attbi.com Sat Feb 08 19:22:40 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jlehmann@attbi.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 9 Feb 2003 03:22:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 1922 invoked from network); 9 Feb 2003 03:22:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Feb 2003 03:22:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sccrmhc03.attbi.com) (204.127.202.63) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Feb 2003 03:22:38 -0000 Received: from amd (h00045a211584.ne.client2.attbi.com[66.30.163.53]) by sccrmhc03.attbi.com (sccrmhc03) with SMTP id <20030208233511003004d1vte>; Sat, 8 Feb 2003 23:35:11 +0000 To: Subject: AM Stereo Car Radios Date: Sat, 8 Feb 2003 18:35:13 -0500 Message-ID: <000401c2cfca$ba3a1fb0$6501a8c0@AMD> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2616 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Importance: Normal From: "Jeff Lehmann" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=98257848 X-Yahoo-Profile: n1zzn Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi everyone, I've been a member of the group for a while, but this is my first time posting. I don't currently have any AM stereo radios, but I'm interested in getting one. Would the easiest to find be a car radio? Looking at the AM stereo website, it looks like quite a few cars had AM stereo radios. Has anyone had any luck finding those at junkyards? Also, would they be easy to set up in the house? Thanks Jeff Lehmann - N1ZZN Hanson, MA [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Feb 08 19:42:57 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 9 Feb 2003 03:42:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 42851 invoked from network); 9 Feb 2003 03:42:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Feb 2003 03:42:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Feb 2003 03:42:55 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.191] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 09 Feb 2003 03:42:55 -0000 Date: Sun, 09 Feb 2003 03:42:54 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Hi-Fi WOR Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1281 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.87.11 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics Right now I am surprised to discover 710 WOR broadcasting what sounds like full hi-fi ~10 kHz analog audio bandwidth. The audio is a tad distorted, but that's probably an artifact of the vintage Continental tube-type transmitter they likely are using tonight. Sunday nights are the typical time for WOR to switch to this backup transmitter, just to give it a weekly work-out and keep it in operable condition, but lately while doing so they had continued to use the 5 kHz audio filter, per IBOC specs, even during Joe Franklin's music program (which Frankly made it sound very lousy). So if you are within local or DX reception of 710 WOR tonight, tune them in an enjoy a rare glimpse of 50,000 watts of full hi-fi analog AM sound beaming out from the Big Apple. But at least until midnight (EST) when Joe's music show comes on, it won't be much to listen to in terms of programming; infomercials and quack-ish medical programs with plenty of "phone line hum" in the background are the norm for WOR's off-peak-hours talk programming. And in that case, their usual 5 kHz audio filter is actually preferable, as it allows easier DX of adjacent signals like WLW 700 and WGN 720 AM Stereo -- at least when those Splatter-O-Matic IBOC sidebands are not turned on. From groucho@skyweb.net Sat Feb 08 20:08:14 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 9 Feb 2003 04:08:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 88805 invoked from network); 9 Feb 2003 04:08:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Feb 2003 04:08:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Feb 2003 04:08:12 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (tc1-58.skyweb.net [66.6.130.186]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h194GOVW058931 for ; Sat, 8 Feb 2003 23:16:26 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3E45D1D5.AEC83EF6@skyweb.net> Date: Sat, 08 Feb 2003 22:58:14 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Hi-Fi WOR References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Kevin this is because they are running the Contentinal transmitter... they always run the 317C for the Joe Franklin show and its In full 10kc bandwidth... its the only Time WOR runs that transmitter..... My guess is when they Go Full IBOC24/7 Ill place bets that they Run Full 10kc audio and Turn off the IBOC for all Joe Franklin shows... any takers Either that Or they will have to Lease Time From Me and continue to transmit Joes show from My house after I get that transmitter in about 2 years.... Hey I can dream cant I LOL... Neal "Kevin T. " wrote: > Right now I am surprised to discover 710 WOR broadcasting what sounds > like full hi-fi ~10 kHz analog audio bandwidth. The audio is a tad > distorted, but that's probably an artifact of the vintage Continental > tube-type transmitter they likely are using tonight. Sunday nights > are the typical time for WOR to switch to this backup transmitter, > just to give it a weekly work-out and keep it in operable condition, > but lately while doing so they had continued to use the 5 kHz audio > filter, per IBOC specs, even during Joe Franklin's music program > (which Frankly made it sound very lousy). > > So if you are within local or DX reception of 710 WOR tonight, tune > them in an enjoy a rare glimpse of 50,000 watts of full hi-fi analog > AM sound beaming out from the Big Apple. But at least until midnight > (EST) when Joe's music show comes on, it won't be much to listen to > in terms of programming; infomercials and quack-ish medical programs > with plenty of "phone line hum" in the background are the norm for > WOR's off-peak-hours talk programming. And in that case, their > usual 5 kHz audio filter is actually preferable, as it allows easier > DX of adjacent signals like WLW 700 and WGN 720 AM Stereo -- at least > when those Splatter-O-Matic IBOC sidebands are not turned on. > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From possumhunter@netzero.net Sat Feb 08 20:12:38 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 9 Feb 2003 04:12:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 88466 invoked from network); 9 Feb 2003 04:12:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Feb 2003 04:12:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.41) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Feb 2003 04:12:37 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 8 Feb 2003 20:12:37 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Hi-Fi WOR Date: Sat, 8 Feb 2003 23:12:22 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 09 Feb 2003 04:12:37.0812 (UTC) FILETIME=[7B0A0F40:01C2CFF1] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.174.184.121] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 kevtronics@yahoo.com wrote: > DX of adjacent signals like WLW 700 and WGN 720 AM Stereo -- at least when those Splatter-O-Matic IBOC sidebands are not turned on. If that is a slam against Spark-O-Matic, they actually produced a decent sounding AM Stereo / FM Stereo / Cassette. It was the "Factory" radio (Distributor or dealer installed) For the 1987 Yugo GV. Kevin From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sat Feb 08 21:05:38 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 9 Feb 2003 05:05:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 17195 invoked from network); 9 Feb 2003 05:05:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Feb 2003 05:05:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.69) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Feb 2003 05:05:36 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.165] by n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 09 Feb 2003 05:05:36 -0000 Date: Sun, 09 Feb 2003 05:05:35 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Hi-Fi WOR Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 551 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.144 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Possum Hunter" wrote: > kevtronics@y... wrote: > > DX of adjacent signals like WLW 700 and WGN 720 AM Stereo -- at least when > those Splatter-O-Matic IBOC sidebands are not turned on. > > If that is a slam against Spark-O-Matic, they actually produced a decent > sounding AM Stereo / FM Stereo / Cassette. It was the "Factory" radio > (Distributor or dealer installed) For the 1987 Yugo GV. > > Kevin Rumor had it that they we're going to make a station wagon called the Wego. ;-) JSG From jbyrns@enteract.com Sat Feb 08 21:20:47 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 9 Feb 2003 05:20:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 14243 invoked from network); 9 Feb 2003 05:20:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Feb 2003 05:20:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Feb 2003 05:20:45 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.130] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 09 Feb 2003 05:20:45 -0000 Date: Sun, 09 Feb 2003 05:20:41 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Hi-Fi WOR Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 689 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.151 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " < kevtronics@y...> wrote: > Right now I am surprised to discover 710 WOR broadcasting what sounds > like full hi-fi ~10 kHz analog audio bandwidth. The audio is a tad > distorted, but that's probably an artifact of the vintage Continental > tube-type transmitter they likely are using tonight. Sunday nights > are the typical time for WOR to switch to this backup transmitter, > just to give it a weekly work-out and keep it in operable condition, Hey, careful what you say about the 317C, I believe there are still stations using them as their main transmitter. It's actually a pretty nice transmitter. John From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Feb 08 21:22:57 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 9 Feb 2003 05:22:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 16463 invoked from network); 9 Feb 2003 05:22:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Feb 2003 05:22:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.86) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Feb 2003 05:22:56 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.187] by n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 09 Feb 2003 05:22:56 -0000 Date: Sun, 09 Feb 2003 05:22:56 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Hi-Fi WOR Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1451 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.87.11 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Rumor had it that they we're going to make a station wagon > called the Wego. ;-) Actually, Malcolm Bricklin -- the "Leonard Kahn" of the automotive industry, who brought Subaru to America in 1968, built his own futuristic sports cars in the 1970s, and came up with the idea to sell Yugos here in the 1980s -- now has plans to import new cars made by the same company that built the Yugo: Zastava Motor Works, or what he likes to call "ZMW". Planned are a hatchback, sedan, convertible, and pick-up, all priced under $10,000. He claims they should arrive by 2004. Here's the story from Forbes: http://www.forbes.com/2002/04/23/0423yugo.html And as for Sparkomatic radios, Chris Cuff can agree with me that they made some really fanstastic AM Stereo car radios, especially the top-of-the-line SR-430, with a 5-band graphic equalizer, neon orange LED display, and a very sensitive AM tuner with bandwidth selectable between Narrow and Barn-Door-Wide. It isn't perfect -- the volume control potentiometer tends to get "scratchy" with age -- but for a "cheap" brand, the quality and performance is impressive. Another "El Cheapo" car radio brand that made AM Stereo-equipped radios in the late '80s and early '90s was Kraco. Although I've never seen one in the flesh, Consumer Reports tested one of Kraco's AM Stereo models in 1993 and rated its AM tuner to be superior to that of an AM Stereo-equipped Chrysler factory radio. From KC4QLP@aol.com Sat Feb 08 21:26:23 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 9 Feb 2003 05:26:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 47719 invoked from network); 9 Feb 2003 05:26:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Feb 2003 05:26:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d03.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.35) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Feb 2003 05:26:22 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.186.15d8e6e5 (3842) for ; Sun, 9 Feb 2003 00:26:15 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <186.15d8e6e5.2b774077@aol.com> Date: Sun, 9 Feb 2003 00:26:15 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Hi-Fi WOR To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit << DX of adjacent signals like WLW 700 and WGN 720 AM Stereo -- at least when those Splatter-O-Matic IBOC sidebands are not turned on. If that is a slam against Spark-O-Matic, they actually produced a decent sounding AM Stereo / FM Stereo / Cassette. It was the "Factory" radio (Distributor or dealer installed) For the 1987 Yugo GV.>> Man sakes alive the slander slammin chasing lawyers would have a field day on this board Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From rwagoner1@mac.com Sat Feb 08 22:02:22 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner1@mac.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 9 Feb 2003 06:02:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 92646 invoked from network); 9 Feb 2003 06:02:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Feb 2003 06:02:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO fed1mtao04.cox.net) (68.6.19.241) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Feb 2003 06:02:20 -0000 Received: from mac.com ([68.4.33.253]) by fed1mtao04.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20030209060219.WUDV21697.fed1mtao04.cox.net@mac.com> for ; Sun, 9 Feb 2003 01:02:19 -0500 Message-ID: <3E45EEEC.80604@mac.com> Date: Sat, 08 Feb 2003 22:02:20 -0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20021120 Netscape/7.01 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Sparkomatic References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Richard Wagoner X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135738921 X-Yahoo-Profile: richardalanwagoner I had a Sparkomatic AM stereo I bought aftermarket for my old truck. Sounded great -- absolutely great -- on AM ... when it worked. The first had some problem that caused me to send it in to warranty service. The second (replacement) worked until the weather got hot, then it would receive only one station along the entire band. I sold the truck before I had it fixed again. My perception of Sparkomatic's lack of quality control came from that model. Too bad. It really sounded great. As I recall, it was even better than my factory AM stereo Delco in my '91 S-10. Richard From rwagoner1@mac.com Sat Feb 08 22:04:09 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner1@mac.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 9 Feb 2003 06:04:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 82336 invoked from network); 9 Feb 2003 06:04:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Feb 2003 06:04:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO fed1mtao08.cox.net) (68.6.19.123) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Feb 2003 06:04:08 -0000 Received: from mac.com ([68.4.33.253]) by fed1mtao08.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20030209060403.XAKQ247.fed1mtao08.cox.net@mac.com> for ; Sun, 9 Feb 2003 01:04:03 -0500 Message-ID: <3E45EF59.9090006@mac.com> Date: Sat, 08 Feb 2003 22:04:09 -0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20021120 Netscape/7.01 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Hi-Fi WOR References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Richard Wagoner X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135738921 X-Yahoo-Profile: richardalanwagoner The only Kraco AM stereo I heard sounded exactly like that lame Radio Shack AM stereo tuner. No high end, just stereo narrowband. That orange Sparkomatic was the model I mentioned in my last post. Richard Wagoner From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Sun Feb 09 01:39:13 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 9 Feb 2003 09:39:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 3465 invoked from network); 9 Feb 2003 09:39:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Feb 2003 09:39:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web41010.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.93.9) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Feb 2003 09:39:11 -0000 Message-ID: <20030209093911.81874.qmail@web41010.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.35.95] by web41010.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 09 Feb 2003 01:39:11 PST Date: Sun, 9 Feb 2003 01:39:11 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: {AMSF} OT: Beach Music To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: <000801c2cfe6$461675e0$af78fea9@juan> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio Which songs? "Summertime's Calling Me?" __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Sun Feb 09 01:43:58 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 9 Feb 2003 09:43:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 95491 invoked from network); 9 Feb 2003 09:43:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Feb 2003 09:43:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web41011.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.93.10) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Feb 2003 09:43:56 -0000 Message-ID: <20030209094356.81634.qmail@web41011.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.35.95] by web41011.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 09 Feb 2003 01:43:56 PST Date: Sun, 9 Feb 2003 01:43:56 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM Stereo Car Radios To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio Good to see you on here. I use a Chrysler radio I got off of Chris Cuff. He sells them. So does Chuck Simpson. They're both on the list. Welcome and 73! Jay,N1WVQ __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From jlehmann@attbi.com Sun Feb 09 11:15:26 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jlehmann@attbi.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 9 Feb 2003 19:15:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 39736 invoked from network); 9 Feb 2003 19:15:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Feb 2003 19:15:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rwcrmhc51.attbi.com) (204.127.198.38) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Feb 2003 19:15:25 -0000 Received: from amd (h00045a211584.ne.client2.attbi.com[66.30.163.53]) by rwcrmhc51.attbi.com (rwcrmhc51) with SMTP id <20030209181800051007c3kne>; Sun, 9 Feb 2003 18:18:00 +0000 To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} AM Stereo Car Radios Date: Sun, 9 Feb 2003 13:18:02 -0500 Message-ID: <000701c2d067$95ab5e00$6501a8c0@AMD> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2616 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 In-Reply-To: <20030209094356.81634.qmail@web41011.mail.yahoo.com> From: "Jeff Lehmann" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=98257848 X-Yahoo-Profile: n1zzn I went to a place that sells used auto parts today, and ended up with what looks like a Delco UX-1. It has the AM-ST button. Has anyone ever tried hooking one of these in the house? I just need to know how to hook up the power and speakers. Thanks Jeff Lehmann =96 N1ZZN Hanson, MA -----Original Message----- From: JNR [mailto:a1asurfradio@yahoo.com]=20 Sent: Sunday, February 09, 2003 4:44 AM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM Stereo Car Radios Good to see you on here.=A0 I use a Chrysler radio I got off of Chris Cuff.=A0 He sells them.=A0 So does Chuck Simpson.=A0 They're both on the list. Welcome and 73! Jay,N1WVQ __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum=20 Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.=20 From dwtpa97@earthlink.net Sun Feb 09 11:43:35 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dwtpa97@earthlink.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 9 Feb 2003 19:43:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 45686 invoked from network); 9 Feb 2003 19:43:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Feb 2003 19:43:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO scaup.mail.pas.earthlink.net) (207.217.120.49) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Feb 2003 19:43:33 -0000 Received: from sdn-ap-012scfairp0087.dialsprint.net ([63.189.176.87] helo=earthlink.net) by scaup.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 18hxMS-0005Ta-00 for amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com; Sun, 09 Feb 2003 11:43:32 -0800 Message-ID: <3E46AF79.B1BF9630@earthlink.net> Date: Sun, 09 Feb 2003 14:43:54 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.79 [en]C-CCK-MCD NSCPCD472 (Windows NT 5.0; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Sparkomatic References: <3E45EEEC.80604@mac.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: dwtpa97 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38076959 My experience with Sparkomatic was the same, very affordable, sounded great, broke down after about 6 months. Dick W. Richard Wagoner wrote: > I had a Sparkomatic AM stereo I bought aftermarket for my old truck. > Sounded great -- absolutely great -- on AM ... when it worked. The > first had some problem that caused me to send it in to warranty service. > The second (replacement) worked until the weather got hot, then it would > receive only one station along the entire band. I sold the truck before > I had it fixed again. My perception of Sparkomatic's lack of quality > control came from that model. > > Too bad. It really sounded great. As I recall, it was even better than > my factory AM stereo Delco in my '91 S-10. > > Richard > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From n0uiheric@aol.com Sun Feb 09 14:02:08 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 9 Feb 2003 22:02:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 41037 invoked from network); 9 Feb 2003 22:02:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Feb 2003 22:02:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r03.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.99) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Feb 2003 22:02:07 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-r03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.1cb.2248a8d (4246) for ; Sun, 9 Feb 2003 17:02:04 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1cb.2248a8d.2b7829dc@aol.com> Date: Sun, 9 Feb 2003 17:02:04 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} OT: Beach Music To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih Surprising for a Clear Channel LMA...Clear Channel (owned or LMAed) usually specializes in substandard programming. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Sun Feb 09 14:02:11 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 9 Feb 2003 22:02:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 42392 invoked from network); 9 Feb 2003 22:02:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Feb 2003 22:02:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r02.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.98) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Feb 2003 22:02:09 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-r02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.1df.184524d (4246) for ; Sun, 9 Feb 2003 17:02:03 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1df.184524d.2b7829db@aol.com> Date: Sun, 9 Feb 2003 17:02:03 EST Subject: Training Technicians for AM Stereo Conversions? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih I have an idea that might just help AM Stereo's cause. Suppose, for example, that those who currently specialize in converting current model consumer receivers for the home or car to receive AM Stereo could help train new technicians in the techniques needed to convert receivers with monaural AM sections (especially the current models) to receive AM Stereo broadcasts in the C-QUAM format. This, I believe, is badly needed. I wouldn't have minded sending my Jensen AM Mono/FM Stereo/CD deck that I had installed in my 1993 Pontiac Bonneville to Chris for AM Stereo conversion, but I currently have a shortwave converter hooked up to the rig. If only I had been trained to do AM Stereo receiver conversions myself. Besides AM Stereo, another need is for technicians who can install new ACI filters in FM receivers. One of those technicians is Dr. Bruce Elving of FM Atlas fame. Many FM receivers have those 180 kHz filters; the 2002 Chrysler Voyager that my father owns has 110 kHz filters installed in it's radio (but no AM Stereo). I would recommend those who buy AM/FM receivers from a place like Circuit City, Best Buy or even Radio Shack to have their receivers converted for AM Stereo and have 110 kHz ACI filters installed for FM. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From stodd@sherbtel.net Sun Feb 09 14:53:02 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 9 Feb 2003 22:53:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 29691 invoked from network); 9 Feb 2003 22:53:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Feb 2003 22:53:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Feb 2003 22:53:00 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-158.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.158]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h19MqW5N018297 for ; Sun, 9 Feb 2003 16:52:58 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <005601c2d08e$4929ba00$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <1df.184524d.2b7829db@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Training Technicians for AM Stereo Conversions? Date: Sun, 9 Feb 2003 16:54:37 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Converting radios to AM stereo isn't rocket science; in fact, it's quite easy unless you have no access to the IF signal. I find it's actually harder in some instances to get a decent stereo indicator for the front panel. I try and keep everything as original as possible, drilling a small hole for an LED only if there's no hope of using the one on the front panel (usually happens only with multiplexed flourescent displays.) Getting service manuals for home stereos usually isn't a problem. Car radios are another matter. There's only a handful of service centers around the country and they guard the service info quite closely, unless the unit is more than a few years old. I'll be glad to help anyone that needs it, provided you already have some knowlege of electronics and can read a schematic. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: > I have an idea that might just help AM Stereo's cause. Suppose, for example, > that those who currently specialize in converting current model consumer > receivers for the home or car to receive AM Stereo could help train new > technicians in the techniques needed to convert receivers with monaural AM > sections (especially the current models) to receive AM Stereo broadcasts in > the C-QUAM format. From stodd@sherbtel.net Sun Feb 09 14:54:59 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 9 Feb 2003 22:54:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 84128 invoked from network); 9 Feb 2003 22:54:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Feb 2003 22:54:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Feb 2003 22:54:58 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-158.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.158]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h19Mss5N018772 for ; Sun, 9 Feb 2003 16:54:56 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <005e01c2d08e$8f49b120$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <000701c2d067$95ab5e00$6501a8c0@AMD> Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM Stereo Car Radios Date: Sun, 9 Feb 2003 16:56:59 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Go to a store that sells the TurboWire brand of radio connectors, and when you get the ones for your radio, the wiring color code and function will be right on the package. Salvage yards are the best place to find good used AMS radios cheap. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jeff Lehmann" To: Sent: Sunday, February 09, 2003 12:18 PM Subject: RE: {AMSF} AM Stereo Car Radios > I went to a place that sells used auto parts today, and ended up with > what looks like a Delco UX-1. It has the AM-ST button. Has anyone ever > tried hooking one of these in the house? I just need to know how to hook > up the power and speakers. > > Thanks > Jeff Lehmann - N1ZZN > Hanson, MA > > -----Original Message----- > From: JNR [mailto:a1asurfradio@yahoo.com] > Sent: Sunday, February 09, 2003 4:44 AM > To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM Stereo Car Radios > > Good to see you on here. I use a Chrysler radio > I got off of Chris Cuff. He sells them. So does > Chuck Simpson. They're both on the list. > > Welcome and 73! > Jay,N1WVQ > > __________________________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. > http://mailplus.yahoo.com > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > > From stodd@sherbtel.net Sun Feb 09 14:56:10 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 9 Feb 2003 22:56:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 30741 invoked from network); 9 Feb 2003 22:56:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Feb 2003 22:56:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Feb 2003 22:56:10 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-158.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.158]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h19Mu65N019013 for ; Sun, 9 Feb 2003 16:56:08 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <006201c2d08e$ba1b9b20$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <187.15d32194.2b76e53c@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} End IBOC-DAB Now! Date: Sun, 9 Feb 2003 16:58:11 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude So where did you get those figures? ST ----- Original Message ----- From: > 3) Significant reductions in coverage, even for FM stations. > > For example, IBOC will cut down the range of a 100 kW FM from the current > 45-60 mile primary coverage areas to less than 15 miles. From ccuff@in4web.com Sun Feb 09 15:03:12 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 9 Feb 2003 23:03:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 89452 invoked from network); 9 Feb 2003 23:03:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Feb 2003 23:03:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Feb 2003 23:03:12 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.140]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Sun, 9 Feb 2003 17:59:36 -0500 Message-ID: <002701c2d08e$27766840$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: <1df.184524d.2b7829db@aol.com> <005601c2d08e$4929ba00$827dfea9@home1> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Training Technicians for AM Stereo Conversions? Date: Sun, 9 Feb 2003 17:54:07 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 The biggest problem with todays car radios is not the IF takeoff point- it is the fact that they are all using single wire input to the audio chip for AM- You cannot add a decoder to these radios, as there is no way to inject the audiio signal anymore. All of the audio mixing is done inside the chip- The radios that ARE convertable have such poor front ends that it is not worth it. Overloading, no usable AGC, etc. CC ----- Original Message ----- From: Scott Todd From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sun Feb 09 18:08:07 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 10 Feb 2003 02:08:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 57428 invoked from network); 10 Feb 2003 02:08:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Feb 2003 02:08:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Feb 2003 02:08:06 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.185] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 10 Feb 2003 02:08:06 -0000 Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2003 02:08:05 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Training Technicians for AM Stereo Conversions? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <005601c2d08e$4929ba00$827dfea9@home1> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1407 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.89 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Scott Todd" wrote: I find it's actually > harder in some instances to get a decent stereo indicator for the front > panel. I try and keep everything as original as possible, drilling a small > hole for an LED only if there's no hope of using the one on the front panel > (usually happens only with multiplexed flourescent displays.) It's not impossible to interface with the multiplexed florescent displays but it is difficult. You will definitely need a schematic for the display section. When I did my Poineer I was hoping that I could pull the same pin low that the FM stereo chip did but no luck. I thought this was so stupid since it takes more circuitry to have it enabled only during FM. It would have been easier to have the sole control of the STEREO indicator left to a single control signal from the decoder. But NO, Pioneer had to over egineer the damn thing! This was one of my first conversions with a 13020 and wanted it all to work as if it came from the factory. It would take a custom circuit for each radio to do this and would not be cost effective. I think a good alternative is to install an LED with a sticker around it saying AM Stereo. In a way it does look aftermarket but most AM Stereo equipped receivers have it plastered on the front somewhere anyway. When the LED lights attention is drawned towards the sticker. JSG From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Sun Feb 09 19:07:11 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 10 Feb 2003 03:07:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 22086 invoked from network); 10 Feb 2003 03:07:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Feb 2003 03:07:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14205.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.151) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Feb 2003 03:07:10 -0000 Message-ID: <20030210030710.92959.qmail@web14205.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [65.221.34.35] by web14205.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 09 Feb 2003 19:07:10 PST Date: Sun, 9 Feb 2003 19:07:10 -0800 (PST) Subject: AM Stereo Radios / Add to Tuner? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Cc: jlehmann@attbi.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio Welcome Jeff! Jeff wrote: "I don't currently have any AM stereo radios, but I'm interested in getting one. Would the easiest to find be a car radio?" Yes Jeff, the car radios are the most plentiful, and in many cases the best. Two of the best car stereos are the Chrysler (Infinity) Cassette with the 5-band EQualizer and 'joystick' speaker fader and the GM/Delco (UX1 model) with the separate pushbutton labeled "AM/ST" which adds wide bandwidth and stereo audio on AM. The older Delcos do NOT have the expanded band. eBay is a good spot to purchase some, as are several people on this list. ALSO, if you have a decent AM tuner now, we have 2 people on the list that can sell you a super AM Stereo converter board to add AMS to a mono tuner. WORDS OF CAUTION: many people on eBay will say "FM/AM Stereo" - nope, 99.4% of the time these radios are mono AM as are ones with "AMS" when it is automatic music search. If you send us the link of the radio that you're looking for we can tell you if we believe that it has AM stereo. We're all here to help the cause of AM Stereo! __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sun Feb 09 19:11:58 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 73074 invoked from network); 10 Feb 2003 03:11:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Feb 2003 03:11:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Feb 2003 03:11:58 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: notify@yahoogroups.com Received: from [66.218.67.253] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 10 Feb 2003 03:11:58 -0000 Date: 10 Feb 2003 03:11:57 -0000 Message-ID: <1044846717.367356.19379.w74@yahoogroups.com> X-eGroups-Application: files X-Yahoo-Group-Post: system From: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: New file uploaded to amstereoforum MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello, This email message is a notification to let you know that a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the amstereoforum group. File : /mp3-usa/wor-st.mp3 Uploaded by : kevtronics Description : A recording of 710 WOR in Hi-Fi Simulated AM Stereo. With a little stereo reverb added in, their analog audio from the old Continental transmitter is superior to IBOC/"HD Radio" digital! You can access this file at the URL http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum/files/mp3-usa/wor-st.mp3 To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/files Regards, kevtronics From amymousie@yahoo.com Sun Feb 09 20:24:48 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 10 Feb 2003 04:24:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 58806 invoked from network); 10 Feb 2003 04:24:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Feb 2003 04:24:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.87) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Feb 2003 04:24:48 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.180] by n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 10 Feb 2003 04:24:47 -0000 Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2003 04:24:47 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} End IBOC-DAB Now! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <006201c2d08e$ba1b9b20$827dfea9@home1> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 840 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 67.115.108.217 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Scott Todd" wrote: > So where did you get those figures? > > ST > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > > > 3) Significant reductions in coverage, even for FM stations. > > > > For example, IBOC will cut down the range of a 100 kW FM from the current > > 45-60 mile primary coverage areas to less than 15 miles. If I remember correctly, this sounds about right in order to maintain 100% modulation total for all carriers and subcarriers in an FM broadcast carrier. That's why we know that stereo reduces coverage for FM; so does SCA. FM-IBOC subcarriers also fits this, and further reduces coverage. Each subcarrier must be a percentage of total modulation. (This is also why AM stereo does NOT lose coverage, as there are no subcarriers.) Amy. <:3 )~~~ From n0uiheric@aol.com Sun Feb 09 22:12:30 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 10 Feb 2003 06:12:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 9131 invoked from network); 10 Feb 2003 06:12:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Feb 2003 06:12:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d05.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Feb 2003 06:12:28 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-d05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.15f.1b880fa3 (4560) for ; Mon, 10 Feb 2003 01:12:14 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <15f.1b880fa3.2b789cbe@aol.com> Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2003 01:12:14 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} End IBOC-DAB Now! To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih The Digital Disaster Web site cited an example of ACI in the Washington, DC area with two Class B FMs; WWMX 106.5 Baltimore, MD and WJFK-FM 106.7 Manassas, VA. WWMX's listenable radius would be cut by more than 50%, from 58 miles to 25 miles. You can see this at http://www.digitaldisaster.org/ In the St. Louis area, for example, if Class C3 KCLC 89.1 St. Charles, MO converted to IBOCrap, the IBOCrap sidebands would block reception of Class B WSIE 88.7 Edwardsville, IL in northern St. Louis County (which is in WSIE's primary). It would also force KCFV 89.5 Ferguson, MO and KNLH 89.5 Cedar Hill, MO off the air. The task is to end IBOC transmissions in the United States, and keep AM and FM analog. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From dnktaylor@yahoo.com Sun Feb 09 22:57:59 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dnktaylor@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 10 Feb 2003 06:57:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 42835 invoked from network); 10 Feb 2003 06:57:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Feb 2003 06:57:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO smtp012.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.173.32) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Feb 2003 06:57:57 -0000 Received: from 109-pm18.nwc.alaska.net (HELO dtaylor) (dnktaylor@209.112.142.109 with login) by smtp.mail.vip.sc5.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Feb 2003 06:57:55 -0000 Message-ID: <020301c2d0d1$bf6a6b40$9b8d70d1@dtaylor> To: References: <20030210030710.92959.qmail@web14205.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: AM Stereo Radios Date: Sun, 9 Feb 2003 21:57:51 -0900 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Dave Taylor" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=131000527 X-Yahoo-Profile: dnktaylor Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Jeff, Hi this is Dave Taylor in Anchorage Alaska. I am also a member of the AM Stereo forum though I'm not that active with postings. Anyway I saw you were looking for an AM Stereo car radio and I do have two of them if you are still interested. I have a GM/Delco AM Stereo/FM Stereo Cassette that came out of my wrecked 1994 GMC Sonoma Truck. This one features the Expanded AM band and meets the AMAX stereo standard. It's in excellent condition. The other one I have is a late '80's aftermarket unit made by Sherwood. It's the CRD 350 model AM Stereo/FM Stereo Cassette. Unfortunately the final output amplifier is not working but I know what replacement IC it takes and it can be repaired. We don't have any AM Stereo stations here anymore unfortunately. Let me know if you might be interested. Thanks, Dave [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From dnktaylor@yahoo.com Sun Feb 09 23:06:47 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dnktaylor@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 10 Feb 2003 07:06:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 57750 invoked from network); 10 Feb 2003 07:06:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Feb 2003 07:06:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO smtp013.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.173.57) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Feb 2003 07:06:46 -0000 Received: from 109-pm18.nwc.alaska.net (HELO dtaylor) (dnktaylor@209.112.142.109 with login) by smtp.mail.vip.sc5.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Feb 2003 07:06:45 -0000 Message-ID: <022001c2d0d2$faf05840$9b8d70d1@dtaylor> To: References: <20030210030710.92959.qmail@web14205.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM Stereo Radios / Add to Tuner? Date: Sun, 9 Feb 2003 22:06:45 -0900 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Dave Taylor" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=131000527 X-Yahoo-Profile: dnktaylor Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Oops, sorry. That last posting was supposed to go directly to Jeff. Dave [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Feb 09 23:18:35 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 10 Feb 2003 07:18:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 55136 invoked from network); 10 Feb 2003 07:18:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Feb 2003 07:18:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Feb 2003 07:18:35 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.142] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 10 Feb 2003 07:18:34 -0000 Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2003 07:18:33 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: AM Stereo Radios Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <020301c2d0d1$bf6a6b40$9b8d70d1@dtaylor> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 243 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.92.6 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > The other one I have is a late '80's aftermarket unit made by > Sherwood. It's the CRD 350 model AM Stereo/FM Stereo Cassette. Would you happen to know if the CRD-350 tunes the Expanded Band? I've heard that it does, but I'm not sure. From dnktaylor@yahoo.com Sun Feb 09 23:25:57 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dnktaylor@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 10 Feb 2003 07:25:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 1718 invoked from network); 10 Feb 2003 07:25:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Feb 2003 07:25:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO smtp014.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.173.58) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Feb 2003 07:25:56 -0000 Received: from 109-pm18.nwc.alaska.net (HELO dtaylor) (dnktaylor@209.112.142.109 with login) by smtp.mail.vip.sc5.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Feb 2003 07:25:55 -0000 Message-ID: <024901c2d0d5$a872c320$9b8d70d1@dtaylor> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: AM Stereo Radios Date: Sun, 9 Feb 2003 22:25:55 -0900 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Dave Taylor" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=131000527 X-Yahoo-Profile: dnktaylor Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit The one I have does not tune the expanded band. Only to 1620. Dave ----- Original Message ----- From: Kevin T. To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, February 09, 2003 10:18 PM Subject: {AMSF} Re: AM Stereo Radios > The other one I have is a late '80's aftermarket unit made by > Sherwood. It's the CRD 350 model AM Stereo/FM Stereo Cassette. Would you happen to know if the CRD-350 tunes the Expanded Band? I've heard that it does, but I'm not sure. Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From ccuff@in4web.com Mon Feb 10 00:43:52 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 10 Feb 2003 08:43:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 60450 invoked from network); 10 Feb 2003 08:43:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Feb 2003 08:43:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Feb 2003 08:43:51 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.42]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Mon, 10 Feb 2003 03:40:16 -0500 Message-ID: <005901c2d0df$45987920$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: <024901c2d0d5$a872c320$9b8d70d1@dtaylor> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: AM Stereo Radios Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2003 03:34:47 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 True- The CRD350 was built in 1992- right before the changeover to the EB requirments. CC ----- Original Message ----- From: Dave Taylor From jbyrns@enteract.com Mon Feb 10 06:11:27 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 10 Feb 2003 14:11:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 97094 invoked from network); 10 Feb 2003 14:11:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Feb 2003 14:11:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Feb 2003 14:11:26 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.146] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 10 Feb 2003 14:11:26 -0000 Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2003 14:11:25 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} End IBOC-DAB Now! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <15f.1b880fa3.2b789cbe@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 349 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.220 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, n0uiheric@a... wrote: > > The task is to end IBOC transmissions in the United States, and keep AM and > FM analog. Why would anyone want to keep AM and FM analog? Analog is an obsolete technology, which is only interesting from a historical perspective, and should be relegated to museum exhibits. John From amfmdx@fastq.com Mon Feb 10 07:29:29 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 10 Feb 2003 15:29:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 79383 invoked from network); 10 Feb 2003 15:29:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Feb 2003 15:29:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Feb 2003 15:29:28 -0000 Received: from fastq (d29-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.61]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id h1AFTRU09683 for ; Mon, 10 Feb 2003 08:29:27 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <003d01c2d119$0ebdc2e0$3df9bed8@com> To: Subject: OT: FM filter replacement Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2003 08:28:24 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla Eric, Changing FM filters for DXing is simple as can be. The filters have three legs. Check where the red dot is. Snip the legs off the old one. With the dot in the same direction, solder the legs on to where the old stubs are sticking out. You are done. Kevin Mesa, Arizona This message has been composed of recycled electrons. None of these electrons has been harmed or injured in the creation and transmission of this message but they have been shamelessly exploited for this use. From jsgil@hal-pc.org Mon Feb 10 07:39:06 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 10 Feb 2003 15:39:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 14382 invoked from network); 10 Feb 2003 15:39:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Feb 2003 15:39:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Feb 2003 15:39:05 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.141] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 10 Feb 2003 15:39:05 -0000 Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2003 15:39:04 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} End IBOC-DAB Now! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 4561 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.231 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, n0uiheric@a... wrote: > > > > The task is to end IBOC transmissions in the United States, and keep AM and > > FM analog. > > Why would anyone want to keep AM and FM analog? Analog is an obsolete > technology, which is only interesting from a historical perspective, > and should be relegated to museum exhibits. > > John Not nessisarily. If it really did offer the improvements boasted by iBiquity then that may be true. AM IBOC was supposed to offer FM Stereo quality and FM IBOC CD Quality. As it stands now both of these offer neither. On a high quality FM Stereo receiver it can be CD quality alomst with the full spectral content from the source. Most audiophiles will tell you that a 320kbps MP3 is not CD quality and some think that the 16Bit 44KHz CDs add digital quantitizing noise and think high quality vinyl on a high dollar turntable sounds better. Vinyl can reproduce frequencies much higher than a CD and the original CD4 Quad records used a 38KHz subcarrier to carry the additional 2 channels much like L-R for FM. This puts vinyl's frequency range above 50KHz. Only the 96KHz 24 Bit Super CDs will be able to beat this. FM IBOC would have to use a quality equal to an MP3 with a VBR range of 175-256kbps to come close to be called CD quality. As it stands now I think the max bitrate is 160. It SBR is used to replicate the missing upper frequencies for an FM signal then this automatically dis- qualifies it from ever being near CD quality. As for AM IBOC it was supposed to be FM Stereo Quality. What I consider the full potential quality of FM stereo is what you would hear from a classical station that has little if any processing done to the signal. As far a I m concerned it is CD quality with a slighty lower S/N ratio than a CD. Otherwise it produces all the spectral content from the original source. I don't see how you can get any better than this. For FM IBOC to boast CD quality they would need to use a non lossy compression scheme like 'shorten' which does a 2:1 compression. The bandwidth available to IBOC on AM is nowhere near what is needed to produce an FM Stereo quality signal as I think the original max bitrate was 92kbps but the system has yet to produce this with the same range as the analog signal. The minimum requirement would be a 32KHz 115-135kbps VBR MP3 to approach FM Stereo quality. The current bitrate for AM IBOC will never support this so it will NEVER be FM Stereo quality. As a result they have resorted to stripping all the high frequency content form the signal and reproducing it with SBR. Sounds worse than a bad 128kbps MP3 when they first came out. The goal was to also use some of the datastream for services other than audio and if this is done it will result in the the audio being degraded to a quality somewhat better than a telephone. This has already happened in Europe with Eureka for the news/talk format to squeeze in more channels and/or data. Analog AM & FM as it stands now limits the broadcaster from transmitting a low quality signal in exchange for other services which I think is a good thing. This is nothing more than a bait and switch tactic to get the public to buy these expensive radios only to hear reduced quality audio then what they receive now. It offers nothing to the consumer as a free service as part of the data- stream will be used for subscription services especially for FM. What you will see happen is the FM IBOC signal be reducied to that of a 128kbps MP3 in exchange for subscription services. Analog AM & FM offer a fixed quality medium that is more than adequate to deliver the content in a high quality medium for the given program material. On FM there is little if any program material that can't be faithfully reproduced. This will change however if IBOC FM is implemented as program material with a high datarate requirement will be sacrificed. On AM the quality will be reduced to what is necesary to carry an intelligable voice signal since a high percentage of the program material is news/talk with the sythetic high frequencies of SBR added in. A far as I'm concerned this does not approach the quality of 10.2KHz analog AM. The useable range of AM IBOC is well within the distance to receive a high quality analog signal. Outside of that IBOC will drop out like a digital cell phone and revert to analog which means that AM IBOC will always have to stay in the hybrid mode to maintain the range it has now. JSG From bjackson@indyradio.com Mon Feb 10 08:04:02 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 10 Feb 2003 16:04:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 42837 invoked from network); 10 Feb 2003 16:04:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Feb 2003 16:04:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.87) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Feb 2003 16:04:00 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.173] by n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 10 Feb 2003 16:04:00 -0000 Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2003 16:03:59 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} End IBOC-DAB Now! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1047 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923 " X-Originating-IP: 64.25.100.26 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " wrote: > Why would anyone want to keep AM and FM analog? Analog is an obsolete > technology, which is only interesting from a historical perspective, > and should be relegated to museum exhibits. > > John Uh, because: 1) Unlike what the marketing people have told you, digital is not another word for perfect. They're not synonyms. 1a) I can send you an MP3 file ripped directly off the digital CD...no analog involved at all. Using a low bit rate, it's going to sound bad...But, it *will* be digital! 1b) IBOC is like taking 1a and transmitting it. 2) The human ear is an analog device 3) Give me a nice MOFI LP over *any* CD...The frequency response of the LP's MOFI pressed were published as 10hz-70000hz (according to Audio Magazine, June 1990) Have you, John, ever critically listened to a nice Analog recording? It's very warm and natural sounding. Just my 2 cents, Brad Jackson Susquehanna, Indianapolis WGLD/WGRL/WFMS http://www.indyradio.com From bjackson@indyradio.com Mon Feb 10 08:06:13 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 10 Feb 2003 16:06:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 47298 invoked from network); 10 Feb 2003 16:06:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Feb 2003 16:06:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Feb 2003 16:06:12 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.135] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 10 Feb 2003 16:06:12 -0000 Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2003 16:06:11 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: IBiquity offers Incentive To Speed IBOC Adoption Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 799 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923 " X-Originating-IP: 64.25.100.26 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 IBiquity offers Incentive To Speed IBOC Adoption: The company is promising that the onetime HD Radio license fee won't exceed $5,000 for the first 125 commer- cial stations that sign up and will be completely waived for noncommercial stations, contingent upon each station making its "best commercial effort" to start digital broad- casting by June 30 and to continue to transmit in digital until at least Dec. 31, 2004. An iBiquity spokesman tells R&R this offer provides stations with an opportu- nity for "massive savings" in adoption of HD Radio, since the regular licensing fee is 15 times what a station pays in FCC regulatoy fees. For example, FM class B, C, C1 and C2 stations were required to pay a $4,975 regulatory fee last year. Multiplied by 15, that comes out to $74,625. Thoughts? From philipr@irac.pe.ca Mon Feb 10 08:26:01 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 10 Feb 2003 16:26:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 40588 invoked from network); 10 Feb 2003 16:25:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Feb 2003 16:25:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Feb 2003 16:25:52 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.248] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 10 Feb 2003 16:25:52 -0000 Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2003 16:25:52 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} End IBOC-DAB Now! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 8381 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking Very well said JSG! Many people today equate "digital" with "better", but that is not always the case. CDs were an enormous success with the public because they were more convenient and compact than LPs and most importantly they didn't suffer from clicks and pops with repeated play. The early, uncompressed CDs did sound wonderful [remember AAD and ADD CDs]but the heavy use of multiband limiting has abused an otherwise worthy technology. I love CDs myself, but I hate what some record company producers are doing with them. I'm amazed how good MP3s sound, and for a large music library on my computer and for casual listening they're great, but for either of my home stereos I like to listen to "real" CDs. Perhaps the best way for record companys to reduce the downloading and burning frenzy is to allow professionally recorded CDs to sound HiFi again, and then inform people how many compromises are made with MP3 and similar formats. However, most people like "free" and human nature being what it is, who can blame them? From a HiFi point of view, nothing sounds better than immediately recording a well pressed new LP onto reel to reel running at least 7.5 ips, better yet 15 ips, on a good reel to reel with response up to 25 to 30 khz. Not too practical for the real world, so a well recorded CD is pretty darn close!!! The best CD players sound better than the cheap ones because they do a better job of converting digital back to analogue - unless one gets an ear or brain transplant, and unless we entirely invent new digital musical instruments, analogue is here to stay in one form or another. Lets not carelessly toss digital into the mix unless its benefits truly outweigh its shortcomings. Remember that from a HiFi perspective, sounds are analogue, not digital. With digital technology, analogue sounds must be converted to digital, then back again, so we can hear them. Digital per say is not musical - just "ons" and "offs". Surprisingly though, the technology behind CDs can create a very musical sound - "can" is the operative word, as digital technolgy can be abused too. The only real advantage of digital over analogue AM and FM broadcasting is to improve S/N. If we gave analogue AM Stereo the same bandwidth as IBOC, it would be FM quality without the digital artifacts. Rather than add yet another layer of digital artifacts, why not reserve digital for the receiver only to improve s/n, as in the Omega and Symphony type systems. The very best broadcast sound can be heard from an FM stereo station with modest compression limiting, playing real CDs - e.g. the hard drive is used for commercials etc. but the music is direct from Cds with a real announcer/operator. CBC aside, I can only think of one station in Atlantic Canada that stills does it that old fashioned way. The next best is NRSC standard AM Stereo, with the same factors as cited above. Some would say that AM Stereo, without the NRSC rolloff and preemphasis, can actually beat FM stereo. I'd rather have honest response to 10,000 Hz than have synthetic fake treble to 15,000 Hz. Digital technology can lead to improvements - but when it comes to the existing AM and FM bands, analogue beats it hands down. Someday perhaps digital technology will improve to a sufficient extent that I'll eat my words - but not yet. Meanwhile, if you give digital enough bandwidth, and concentrate on music rather than piggybacking text messages and other such gobbly gook, it certainly can sound great. Phil R. --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "jsgilst " wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " > wrote: > > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, n0uiheric@a... wrote: > > > > > > The task is to end IBOC transmissions in the United States, and > keep AM and > > > FM analog. > > > > Why would anyone want to keep AM and FM analog? Analog is an > obsolete > > technology, which is only interesting from a historical perspective, > > and should be relegated to museum exhibits. > > > > John > > > Not nessisarily. If it really did offer the improvements boasted > by iBiquity then that may be true. AM IBOC was supposed to offer > FM Stereo quality and FM IBOC CD Quality. As it stands now both > of these offer neither. On a high quality FM Stereo receiver it > can be CD quality alomst with the full spectral content from the > source. Most audiophiles will tell you that a 320kbps MP3 is not > CD quality and some think that the 16Bit 44KHz CDs add digital > quantitizing noise and think high quality vinyl on a high dollar > turntable sounds better. Vinyl can reproduce frequencies much > higher than a CD and the original CD4 Quad records used a 38KHz > subcarrier to carry the additional 2 channels much like L-R for > FM. This puts vinyl's frequency range above 50KHz. Only the 96KHz > 24 Bit Super CDs will be able to beat this. FM IBOC would have > to use a quality equal to an MP3 with a VBR range of 175-256kbps > to come close to be called CD quality. As it stands now I think > the max bitrate is 160. It SBR is used to replicate the missing > upper frequencies for an FM signal then this automatically dis- > qualifies it from ever being near CD quality. As for AM IBOC it > was supposed to be FM Stereo Quality. What I consider the full > potential quality of FM stereo is what you would hear from a > classical station that has little if any processing done to the > signal. As far a I m concerned it is CD quality with a slighty > lower S/N ratio than a CD. Otherwise it produces all the spectral > content from the original source. I don't see how you can get any > better than this. For FM IBOC to boast CD quality they would need > to use a non lossy compression scheme like 'shorten' which does > a 2:1 compression. The bandwidth available to IBOC on AM is nowhere > near what is needed to produce an FM Stereo quality signal as I > think the original max bitrate was 92kbps but the system has yet > to produce this with the same range as the analog signal. The > minimum requirement would be a 32KHz 115-135kbps VBR MP3 to > approach FM Stereo quality. The current bitrate for AM IBOC will > never support this so it will NEVER be FM Stereo quality. As a > result they have resorted to stripping all the high frequency > content form the signal and reproducing it with SBR. Sounds worse > than a bad 128kbps MP3 when they first came out. The goal was to > also use some of the datastream for services other than > audio and if this is done it will result in the the audio being > degraded to a quality somewhat better than a telephone. This > has already happened in Europe with Eureka for the news/talk > format to squeeze in more channels and/or data. Analog AM & FM as > it stands now limits the broadcaster from transmitting a low > quality signal in exchange for other services which I think is > a good thing. This is nothing more than a bait and switch tactic > to get the public to buy these expensive radios only to hear > reduced quality audio then what they receive now. It offers > nothing to the consumer as a free service as part of the data- > stream will be used for subscription services especially for > FM. What you will see happen is the FM IBOC signal be reducied > to that of a 128kbps MP3 in exchange for subscription services. > Analog AM & FM offer a fixed quality medium that is more than > adequate to deliver the content in a high quality medium for > the given program material. On FM there is little if any > program material that can't be faithfully reproduced. This will > change however if IBOC FM is implemented as program material > with a high datarate requirement will be sacrificed. On AM > the quality will be reduced to what is necesary to carry an > intelligable voice signal since a high percentage of the > program material is news/talk with the sythetic high frequencies > of SBR added in. A far as I'm concerned this does not approach > the quality of 10.2KHz analog AM. The useable range of AM IBOC > is well within the distance to receive a high quality analog > signal. Outside of that IBOC will drop out like a digital cell > phone and revert to analog which means that AM IBOC will always > have to stay in the hybrid mode to maintain the range it has now. > > JSG From rwagoner1@mac.com Mon Feb 10 08:39:39 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner1@mac.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 10 Feb 2003 16:39:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 63689 invoked from network); 10 Feb 2003 16:39:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Feb 2003 16:39:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO fed1mtao01.cox.net) (68.6.19.244) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Feb 2003 16:39:38 -0000 Received: from mac.com ([68.4.33.253]) by fed1mtao01.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20030210163933.MEZ14924.fed1mtao01.cox.net@mac.com> for ; Mon, 10 Feb 2003 11:39:33 -0500 Message-ID: <3E47D5C9.2000109@mac.com> Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2003 08:39:37 -0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20021120 Netscape/7.01 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} End IBOC-DAB Now! References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Richard Wagoner X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135738921 X-Yahoo-Profile: richardalanwagoner > Why would anyone want to keep AM and FM analog? Analog is an obsolete > technology, which is only interesting from a historical perspective, > and should be relegated to museum exhibits. Interesting thought. Humans are analog, and must hear the material through analog means. A question could be raised as to why you would want to encode everything digitally, when you have to decode it on the other end. The real question is, can digital be made better? I don't know. Others here say no. > From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Feb 10 10:18:09 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 10 Feb 2003 18:18:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 84190 invoked from network); 10 Feb 2003 18:18:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Feb 2003 18:18:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Feb 2003 18:18:06 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.158] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 10 Feb 2003 18:18:06 -0000 Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2003 18:18:05 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: End IBOC-DAB Now! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2299 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > 3) Give me a nice MOFI LP over *any* CD...The frequency response of > the LP's MOFI pressed were published as 10hz-70000hz (according to > Audio Magazine, June 1990) Have you, John, ever critically listened > to a nice Analog recording? It's very warm and natural sounding. When used for audio recording, VHS or Beta Hi-Fi video tape can meet or exceed all the quality specifications of a typical CD -- yet it is 100% analog. Analog FM radio might not be "CD quality", it it can at least match the level of a good Dolby C Metal cassette, with an S/N ratio in the ~75 dB range -- enough to make background hiss inaudible for all but the most demanding Classical music listening. And although the frequency response of FM radio is still officially listed as being only 15 kHz, there is no reason why it can be extended up to at least 18.5 kHz, using the same type of "brick wall" filters as are used to meet the AM 10 kHz bandwidth standard. And indeed, I have measured some FM stations as having audio response up to at least 18 kHz -- but this extended range is only useful if they are playing music from analog or uncompressed digital sources; MP3 -- even at the highest rate of 320 kbps -- was simply NOT designed to produce any accurate frequency response above 16 kHz. If you look at a "live" spectrum analysis of an MP3 file as it is playing, you'll see that 90% of the time, a strict 16 kHz "brick wall" filter is used; only brief "bursts" or "spikes" of audio energy above 16 kHz is reproduced. This is because the German company which invented MP3 claims that people can't hear anything above 16 kHz, so there is no use in "wasting bits" to try to reproduce it accurately. In fact, if certain Stereo encoding methods are using (there are quite a few within the MP3 format), it is *impossible* to have any response above 16 kHz, even at 320 kbps. Radio stations that play their music direct from CDs, tapes, vinyl, etc. always sound the best -- even on AM. That's because any form of "lossy" digital compression does just that -- the end result is that certain parts of the audio content are missing, and it's really up to your own ears to determine how sensitive you are to this incompletely or inaccurately reproduced audio. From philipr@irac.pe.ca Mon Feb 10 11:38:23 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 10 Feb 2003 19:38:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 86397 invoked from network); 10 Feb 2003 19:38:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Feb 2003 19:38:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.90) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Feb 2003 19:38:23 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.172] by n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 10 Feb 2003 19:38:21 -0000 Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2003 19:38:19 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: End IBOC-DAB Now! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1143 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote in part: > > When used for audio recording, VHS or Beta Hi-Fi video tape can meet > or exceed all the quality specifications of a typical CD -- yet it is > 100% analog. > Very true. One Nova Scotia station used a high end VHS rig for the canned all night show and the sound quality was very good, although not very "tight", as carted weather forecasts etc. were a bit gappy. I suspect they would now use a computer and some automation software, as this would be a lot easier than making up a variety of tapes, having carts all lined up etc. With the cost of cart machines - does anybody even still make the darn things - computer hard drives do make sense. I think a station could get one heck of a nice computer for the cost of a cart deck or two. Then there was another station who had 6 individual Harris cart machines in MCR - a great way to spend lots of money - although if one had to be pulled out of service, it was barely a wrinkle. 2 more in news, and 2 recorders in production - yikes what a lot of $!!! Phil R. From jsgil@hal-pc.org Mon Feb 10 12:19:29 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 10 Feb 2003 20:19:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 14937 invoked from network); 10 Feb 2003 20:19:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Feb 2003 20:19:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Feb 2003 20:19:28 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.140] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 10 Feb 2003 20:19:28 -0000 Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2003 20:19:27 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} End IBOC-DAB Now! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1071 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.103 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "bradleyj923 " > > 3) Give me a nice MOFI LP over *any* CD...The frequency response of > the LP's MOFI pressed were published as 10hz-70000hz (according to > Audio Magazine, June 1990) What does MOFI stand for? During the late 70's three brought out half speed masters, Mobile Fidelity Sound Labs and their Original Master Recoedings, CBS with their version, and Nautilus SuperDics. The CBS ones had converted the source to 16 Bit 44KHz and gave it that CD sound of quantization. The one Nautilus I have did a digital remix from the original multitrack tape to a digital master. This one also had the digital CD effect. The Mobile Fidelity was the only one that obtained the 1st master tape of the recording and pressed on high quality vinyl from JVC. The other high quality records were regular Japanese pressings. Brand new they had few if any pops or clicks and had a very sweet sound. I didn't have the most evpensive turntable to play these but a Dual direct drive with a Shure V15III did a nice job. JSG From jbyrns@enteract.com Mon Feb 10 12:30:47 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 10 Feb 2003 20:30:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 42482 invoked from network); 10 Feb 2003 20:30:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Feb 2003 20:30:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Feb 2003 20:30:45 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.141] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 10 Feb 2003 20:30:45 -0000 Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2003 20:30:43 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} End IBOC-DAB Now! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2259 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.98.24 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "jsgilst " < jsgil@h...> wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " > wrote: > > Why would anyone want to keep AM and FM analog? Analog is an > > obsolete technology, which is only interesting from a historical > > perspective, and should be relegated to museum exhibits. > > Not nessisarily. If it really did offer the improvements boasted > by iBiquity then that may be true. Your comments, which I have snipped for brevity, read like most of the comments on this group, that is they are written from the Nerd's perspective, or that of an audiophile, or DXer. Now don't get me wrong, there is nothing wrong with being a Nerd, some of my best friends are Nerds, and I am an engineering Nerd myself. The problem is that there are many more stake holders in the digital radio issue than just audiophiles and DXers. Some of the other stake holders are the owners of the broadcast facilities, and the general public. In the big picture of things I suspect that there are really very few audiophiles and DXers, meaning that as stake holders, they don't really count for much, and it will be the Broadcasters, and Joe public, who have the final say. Before you say, but Joe public is being short changed by this digital radio stuff, I suggest you look at how some of your friends, who are not audiophiles, or DXers, use their radios, and what it is about radio that is actually important to them. Someone else claimed that "the human ear is an analog device." I for one would like to see some evidence that this is actually true. First, putting the analog vs. digital part of the issue aside for a moment, as I understand it, the way the human ear analyzes sound waves is very similar to the way many of the data compression algorithms that are used in digital systems work. That tells me that data compression is not unnatural. Second is the issue of how the results from the sound wave analysis are transmitted to the brain. This issue is not so clear to me, but I have heard arguments that the nervous system, which is the medium of transmission from the ears to the brain, is really essentially digital in nature, not analog. John From steveking@wgnradio.com Mon Feb 10 13:23:55 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: steveking@wgnradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 10 Feb 2003 21:23:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 74501 invoked from network); 10 Feb 2003 21:23:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Feb 2003 21:23:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Feb 2003 21:23:54 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.145] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 10 Feb 2003 21:23:54 -0000 Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2003 21:23:50 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Bob Crane (CC Radio) on WGN-AM tonight! Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 875 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgnhim " X-Originating-IP: 172.162.156.42 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71806925 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgnhim Just thought that you guys would like to know that Bob Crane of the C.Crane company will be our guest tonight (Monday night,Feb. 10) at 11:30 (Central) on Chicago's WGN-AM. If you'd like to join in the conversation you can call 312-591-7200. You can listen in over the air at 720 AM, but if you can't pick us up you can listen on the web at htt://www.wgnradio.com. If you call in I'd ask two favors. One, tell our producer, Denise, that you're from this group (I'd like to put some voices with the posts:-) and two, although I know we're all pretty passionate about AM Stereo and wanting companies to make it available on their products, PLEASE be polite. You get more bees with honey .... Thanks, Steve King/WGN-AM, Chicago PS. For those of you who haven't listened before, the really good sounding voice you'll hear on the air is my wife and co-host, Johnnie Putman. From bjackson@indyradio.com Mon Feb 10 14:12:25 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 10 Feb 2003 22:12:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 58582 invoked from network); 10 Feb 2003 22:12:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Feb 2003 22:12:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Feb 2003 22:12:24 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.146] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 10 Feb 2003 22:12:23 -0000 Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2003 22:12:23 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} End IBOC-DAB Now! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1107 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923 " X-Originating-IP: 64.25.100.1 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "jsgilst " wrote: > What does MOFI stand for? During the late 70's three brought out > half speed masters, Mobile Fidelity Sound Labs and their Original > Master Recoedings, CBS with their version, and Nautilus SuperDics. > The CBS ones had converted the source to 16 Bit 44KHz and gave it > that CD sound of quantization. The one Nautilus I have did a digital > remix from the original multitrack tape to a digital master. This > one also had the digital CD effect. The Mobile Fidelity was the > only one that obtained the 1st master tape of the recording and > pressed on high quality vinyl from JVC. The other high quality > records were regular Japanese pressings. Brand new they had few if > any pops or clicks and had a very sweet sound. I didn't have the > most evpensive turntable to play these but a Dual direct drive with > a Shure V15III did a nice job. > > JSG MOFI is Mobile Fidelity. In the late 1990's, they filed for bankruptcy, but their website is now back up saying new releases are on the way at http://www.mofi.com From jsgil@hal-pc.org Mon Feb 10 14:45:02 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 10 Feb 2003 22:45:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 81646 invoked from network); 10 Feb 2003 22:45:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Feb 2003 22:45:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.89) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Feb 2003 22:45:01 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.179] by n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 10 Feb 2003 22:45:01 -0000 Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2003 22:44:59 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} End IBOC-DAB Now! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 5375 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.169 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " wrote: > The problem > is that there are many more stake holders in the digital radio issue > than just audiophiles and DXers. Some of the other stake holders are > the owners of the broadcast facilities, and the general public. In > the big picture of things I suspect that there are really very few > audiophiles and DXers, meaning that as stake holders, they don't > really count for much, and it will be the Broadcasters, and Joe > public, who have the final say. Before you say, but Joe public is > being short changed by this digital radio stuff, I suggest you look at > how some of your friends, who are not audiophiles, or DXers, use their > radios, and what it is about radio that is actually important to them. > The big problem I have with the push for IBOC is that it has the potential to change the whole radio environment and not for the better in many cases. I consider this whole IBOC campaign to be very deceptive. 1st, a system is promised will do such and such but a major part of engineering has yet to be done. The interference issues are being brushed aside and the promised sound quality is a big lie. The testing is being done by the same company that has produced the equipment and no impartial 3rd party has been given the opportunity fully examine it. The major shareholders in this company are the monopolistic broadcasters who have corrupted our whole public broadcast system. Their license is granted as a public service with the privlidge of making money through advertising and other means but the responsibility to sevre the public interest must come 1st. When tropical storm Allison hit our area and was considered a disaster area a major portion of our cell phone service was down and our downtown and medical center was severly damaged. The main station that provided emergency information on a regular basis was the one that specialized in news and weather anyway while most of the rest went on with automated programming like nothing happened. Digital is happening for all the wrong reasons and the public is being reeled in with the promise of vastly improved sound. I see it as a way for them to extend their already abused monopolistic practices. Joe Public has little if any to gain by going digital for the free radio part of it and the extra subscription services are not going to offset the cost of the licenseing fees that this company will charge. Their scheme to offer a one time fee for the 1st adopters of the system will be taken up by the biggest broadcast conglomerates but the smaller independent station who can't afford it and/or want to see most of the bugs worked out before jumping in will not be offered the one time subscription fee and will most likely no be able to pay the re-occuring licensing. Add in that the IBOC hash will destroy reception of the smaller independent stations in some cases who do not have the resources to pursue the matter legally and will drive them out of existence. When you look at the the whole IBOC scheme in detail all of the negative factors will have a synergistic of effect driving the smaller broadcasters out of buisness and forcing the public to replace all their radios with much more expensive digital models. When everything is put into balance The consumer gets the shaft along with the stations who will have to buy IBOC compatible transmitters. As far as the exciter goes the broadcasters who have large investments in this technology company will reasorb most of the upgrade costs since it will come back to them the form of the investment they have in the company. Those smaller broadcasters who have no investment will have to foot the full bill which will enrich those broadcasters who have the large investments in the company. I'm not against investing and the smaller independent broadcaster has every right to invest but his voice will not be heard over the big investers. I see this as a big conflict of interest that serves the large monopolistic broadcasters at the expense of the independents. It may not be an Enron situation but the spirit of corporate greed is there. > Someone else claimed that "the human ear is an analog device." I for > one would like to see some evidence that this is actually true. > First, putting the analog vs. digital part of the issue aside for a > moment, as I understand it, the way the human ear analyzes sound waves > is very similar to the way many of the data compression algorithms > that are used in digital systems work. That tells me that data > compression is not unnatural. Second is the issue of how the results > from the sound wave analysis are transmitted to the brain. This issue > is not so clear to me, but I have heard arguments that the nervous > system, which is the medium of transmission from the ears to the > brain, is really essentially digital in nature, not analog. > > John The ear may very well have a digital approach to it but the resolution in some aspects is vastly superior to anything manmade. This is why it takes a 24 Bit 96KHz signal to meet the potential that vinyl can offer. Until codecs can determine how the human ear actually approaches this in detail there will be a mismatch and the ear will recognize the digital artifacts from low bitrate encodings. JSG From powell@conterra.com Mon Feb 10 14:49:44 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: powell@conterra.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 10 Feb 2003 22:49:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 94645 invoked from network); 10 Feb 2003 22:49:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Feb 2003 22:49:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mx.matrixconsulting.net) (65.199.24.6) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Feb 2003 22:49:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 6782 invoked from network); 10 Feb 2003 22:49:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO bsae-skqpk3w8p5) (66.112.193.70) by mx.matrixconsulting.net with SMTP; 10 Feb 2003 22:49:41 -0000 Organization: BEARly Organized To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2003 17:49:30 -0500 Subject: WHAAAT!!!! John? This is not the year 2053! Cc: Subject: Re: End IBOC-DAB Now! Message-ID: <3E47E62A.11990.2B94FB@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: <1044887888.2173.38712.m12@yahoogroups.com> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.01) From: "Powell E. Way III" Reply-To: powell@conterra.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=8062869 X-Yahoo-Profile: W4OPW On 10 Feb 2003 at 14:38,"John " whined : > > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, n0uiheric@a... wrote: > > > > The task is to end IBOC transmissions in the United States, and keep > > AM and FM analog. That would be the prudent thing for now. > Why would anyone want to keep AM and FM analog? Analog is an obsolete > technology, which is only interesting from a historical perspective, > and should be relegated to museum exhibits. > > John What in the absolute hell are you talking about? When you listen to your radio is the audio you hear digital? IF, per chance you are listening to an IBOC signal is it DIGITAL when it is reproduced from the speaker? WELLLL IS IT? AND the answer is NO. AS currently done, the IBOC standard for MW and FM, especially FM, and with the analog gone is a MAJOR STEP BACKWARDS in sonic quality. The data rates used AND the algorythym used are too lossy. On MW IBOC will not work at all with skywave as Ibiquity chose to use Lucents coding and not the one with DRM. DRM would be better but it isn't great. AND those writing codes for DAC's need to learn a lot. A lot of those are just defective in their processing. DAC = Digital to Analog converters. There was a very damning article in a magazine that specializes in chips and electronics. A dime is analog audio. MP3 it. I give you a penny back. What you are saying MAY be true in 50 years. Right now it isn't even close. NOT REMOTELY CLOSE. Powell From jsgil@hal-pc.org Mon Feb 10 14:53:25 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 10 Feb 2003 22:53:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 79949 invoked from network); 10 Feb 2003 22:53:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Feb 2003 22:53:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Feb 2003 22:53:25 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.164] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 10 Feb 2003 22:53:22 -0000 Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2003 22:53:22 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} End IBOC-DAB Now! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 748 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.169 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "bradleyj923 " wrote: > > MOFI is Mobile Fidelity. In the late 1990's, they filed for > bankruptcy, but their website is now back up saying new releases are > on the way at http://www.mofi.com I just didn't recognize it by those initials but by MFSL. I have the vinyl version of Dark Side of the Moon and almost bought the CD but the guy at the CD store talked me into purchasing the one on the Harvest label that was released in the UK. He said it came from the 1st master tape while the MFSL one was 2nd or 3rd generation that capitol had for the us market. He said that the UK one had less tape hiss. I have to say it has excellent sound for a recording from 1973. JSG From amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk Mon Feb 10 15:00:37 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 10 Feb 2003 23:00:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 57224 invoked from network); 10 Feb 2003 23:00:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Feb 2003 23:00:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.64) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Feb 2003 23:00:36 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.145] by n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 10 Feb 2003 23:00:35 -0000 Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2003 23:00:34 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Sony ST-JX220A Tuner on Ebay Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 290 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Dave " X-Originating-IP: 213.121.69.152 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113985069 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereofan http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll? ViewItem&item=3007414053&category=3282 Same person as I got mine from.. Worth getting perhaps though unfortunatly just like mine it has a few burn marks :-( What is this guy doing to these great tuners ?! I'm sure Ian's 220a is mint condittion :-) From ccuff@in4web.com Mon Feb 10 15:06:28 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 10 Feb 2003 23:06:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 3950 invoked from network); 10 Feb 2003 23:06:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Feb 2003 23:06:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Feb 2003 23:06:27 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.27]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Mon, 10 Feb 2003 18:02:51 -0500 Message-ID: <005901c2d157$c4eb2560$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} End IBOC-DAB Now! Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2003 17:57:20 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 > wrote: The problem > is that there are many more stake holders in the digital radio issue > > than just audiophiles and DXers. Some of the other stake holders > are Oh. I see. The companies at stake are above everything else. So some Richard Crania has an idea to make tons of money by setting new broadcast standards making his company very wealthy, at the expense of an un-knowing public and at the expense of hundreds of small radio stations. Where have we all heard this song before? Broadcasters want it? I don't think so. Radio stations that cannot even afford a decent modulation monitor are going to pay for this upgrade? To what advantage? It is still not going to bring people back to AM. Only programming can do that. If the public only knew what was happening.... I live for the day that I read how IBiquty goes down in flames. "Every man has a scheme that will not work" Chris From dav259@csiro.au Mon Feb 10 16:08:22 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 11 Feb 2003 00:08:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 56930 invoked from network); 11 Feb 2003 00:08:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Feb 2003 00:08:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Feb 2003 00:08:21 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1B08JR05235 for ; Tue, 11 Feb 2003 11:08:19 +1100 (EST) Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 11:08:19 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Sony ST-JX220A Tuner on Ebay In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=112635033 X-Yahoo-Profile: dav259 On Mon, 10 Feb 2003, Dave wrote: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3007414053&category=3282 > Same person as I got mine from.. > Worth getting perhaps though unfortunatly just like mine it has a few > burn marks :-( What is this guy doing to these great tuners ?! > > I'm sure Ian's 220a is mint condittion :-) Dave - Dr Ido should have switched it from 1377 as 3MP hasn't been in full stereo since it moved into its new purpose built studios a few months ago. ... but they're working on it. Ian From amymousie@yahoo.com Mon Feb 10 17:15:29 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 11 Feb 2003 01:15:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 6659 invoked from network); 11 Feb 2003 01:13:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Feb 2003 01:13:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.88) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Feb 2003 01:13:47 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.152] by n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Feb 2003 01:13:46 -0000 Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 01:13:45 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} End IBOC-DAB Now! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2518 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 64.175.245.80 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "jsgilst " wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " > wrote: =snip= > The big problem I have with the push for IBOC is that it has the > potential to change the whole radio environment and not for the > better in many cases. I consider this whole IBOC campaign to be =lotsa good stuff snipped for brevity= Don't forget the patents! Once the 17-year exclusivity clause for the patents for IBOC expires, there will be no incentive to charge exhorbinant (sp?) fees to use the system, much less to manufacture it, and there would be such disinterest to continue supporting it that little gets done with IBOC- It becomes an orphaned system, unsupported and not open. The result is millions of totally useless radios and no commercially-available system to fall back on. The death of radio as we know it, literally. This is really what killed C-QUAM in the US, for what it's worth- Patent royalties. The C-QUAM standard was adopted 17 years after the system was patented, and Motorola lost incentive to continue supporting C-QUAM, shutting down the departments overseeing the system, cutting off the manufacture of C-QUAM chips, leaving future radios to either use what stock is on hand or order the Japanese C- QUAM decoder chips (where a recent post here some weeks/months back said AM stereo is alive and well and on the shelfs in Japan). Fortunately, C-QUAM is reasonably open where it -could- be reconstructed-- It relies alot on existing technology for systems whose patents expired by the time C-QUAM was developed in 1975, so C- QUAM isn't lost, and there are those here whose goal has been to - preserve- the AM stereo systems and technology. Some of you know one already, who runs one of the other AM stereo lists. I personmally -dispise- making unexpired patented systems standards, or at the least, systems that are not openly published. Eureka DAB is openly published, DRM only half so (the codec used is patented by FHG, who is exacting royalty fees already for their portion of the DRM system), and IBOC is completely proprietary and not open. And I'm sure everyone here knows about the hulabaloo about the GIF and MP3 formats in recent years! All this mouse is saying is, just say "no" to IBOC, AM or FM-- PLEASE! For the sake of a long, living, healthy radio system for generations to come, no more proprietary crap! (Excuse my language- Bad cheese.) Amy. <:3 )~~~ From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Feb 10 21:38:41 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 11 Feb 2003 05:38:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 83438 invoked from network); 11 Feb 2003 05:38:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Feb 2003 05:38:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.68) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Feb 2003 05:38:40 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.169] by n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Feb 2003 05:38:40 -0000 Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 05:38:39 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Delco AMAX (vs. Chrysler AMAX) Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 4697 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.71.140 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics For $35 plus shipping I finally got my hands on a Delco AMAX radio from eBay (which was not advertised as such, but was from a 1995 Cadillac and had the "AM ST" button). Delco's implementation of the AMAX receiver design is probably the most complete, aside from the new Fanfare tuner -- but magic doesn't begin until you push the "AM ST" button. Without the "AM ST" button engaged, it acts like any other GM/Delco radio with mono AM -- you are treated to typically muffled 3 kHz audio response, although with the benefit of AMAX's noise blanking to cut out some of the buzzing and crackles typical of electrical RFI on the AM band. Push the "AM ST" button in, and the bandwidth instantly opens up to about 6 kHz -- but if you're listening to a mono station, that's all you'll get. Unlike Chrysler AMAX car radios, the Delco reserves full bandwidth for AM Stereo stations only, which is not so good if you don't have (m)any in your area. But when the Delco does encounter an AM Stereo signal -- even a rather weak or unstable one -- it quickly locks onto the Stereo pilot and then variably adjusts the bandwidth and Stereo separation to suit current signal conditions. These two criteria appear to be linked, so wide bandwidth = wide separation, and if signal conditions cause the audio to blend towards mono, the bandwidth will be reduced back down as well. It is, however, generally very keen on providing Stereo reception as often as it can, while still dropping to mono as appropriate in order to reduce or eliminate any occurence of "platform motion". On a repeadtedly unstable signal, which would ordinarily cause annoying left-to-right motion or would simply drop an ordinary AM Stereo radio to mono mode, the Delco quickly blends the Stereo separation back and forth, with the end result being almost like the "fluttering" you get when a weak FM Stereo signal reflects off of a passing airplane. The Delco is also a very sensitive tuner; while listening to a local TIS on 1640 kHz tonight, it had no trouble picking up Radio Disney from 1640 WKSH in Wisconsin in the background, and even though WKSH was very weak in the background, the Delco still quickly popped into Stereo mode and *stayed* in Stereo mode as long as the signal was at least minimally present. Similarly, I had a rare chance to hear "Stereo 1680 Jamz" (WJNZ) from Michigan underneath local 1680 WTTM. However, my one big complaint about it is that narrow bandwidth mode (with the "AM ST" button not pushed in) is mono-only, and even with the variable bandwidth, it just isn't as selective as it could be in AM Stereo mode. It actually does let you hear narrow-bandwidth AM Stereo, but only for a brief moment as you disengage the "AM ST" button; the AM Stereo mode seems to have a "delayed release" of a second or two, so that right after you switch from wide/Stereo mode to narrow/mono mode, you get a second or two of this "hidden" narrow/ Stereo mode. Also, even at its maximum bandwidth in Stereo mode, it just doesn't have the crisp top end of the Chrysler AMAX radios; I haven't done official measurements, but it seems that the Delco's audio response tops out at about 8 kHz and then has a rather gradual whistle filter (so you can still hear some whistles at night), while the Chrysler has good response up to at least 9.5 kHz on strong signals and then has a very sharp drop-off to completely eliminate the 10 kHz carrier whistle. However, the Chrysler AMAX radios don't seem to have as wide of a Stereo separation, and aren't as aggressive at maintaining Stereo reception of weak and/or unstable signals. So, for hi-fi listening of Stereo *and* mono AM signals, I still prefer the Chrysler AMAX radios (with 5-band equalizer and speaker "joystick" control). This is important if you have a number of mono AM stations that you'd like to hear in full-bandwidth quality. But for sensitive Stereo DXing and more consistent Stereo reception of weaker signals or nighttime skywave, the Delco is a better choice. Delco radios traditionally also have a greater range of tone control, so if you have one on the workbench at home hooked up to a pair of bookshelf-size speakers, it can really deliver a good bass response. In either case, I can definitely say that if *all* radios were designed to meet the AMAX specs like this, the AM band would be a much better place, and we probably wouldn't even be talking about IBOC/"HD Radio" or any other digital systems. AMAX was established a decade ago as an excellent set of receiver design and quality standards, and it's a shame that the FCC did not think to make it mandatory for all receivers. From jsgil@hal-pc.org Mon Feb 10 22:00:03 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 11 Feb 2003 06:00:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 21791 invoked from network); 11 Feb 2003 06:00:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Feb 2003 06:00:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.90) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Feb 2003 06:00:01 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.173] by n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Feb 2003 06:00:01 -0000 Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 05:59:57 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} End IBOC-DAB Now! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1577 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.83 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "amymousie " wrote: > > Don't forget the patents! Once the 17-year exclusivity clause for the > patents for IBOC expires, there will be no incentive to charge > exhorbinant (sp?) fees to use the system, much less to manufacture > it, and there would be such disinterest to continue supporting it > that little gets done with IBOC- It becomes an orphaned system, > unsupported and not open. The result is millions of totally useless > radios and no commercially-available system to fall back on. > The whole talk about digital on AM & FM started around 10 years ago so I wonder how many patents were filed way back when. This would mean that some are half way through their life expectancy and are facing a similar situation that Unisys has with the LZW compression that GIF & PDF uses. They are really trying to get the ball rolling to start to recoup the investment costs. If it doesn't start soon and take off then the investments will be lost never to be recovered. They are also trying to pull a Micro$oft and hook broadcasters into having to pay continual license fees to extend the revenue stream to compensate for what life is left in the main patents. It is IBOC or Bust for this company and all investors involved. Since the large broadcast conglomerates and car radio manufacturers are some of the main investers they have a vested interest in seeing it become a success and will stop at nothing having no concern with the distructiveness it will do the existing analog system. JSG From rwagoner1@mac.com Mon Feb 10 22:41:49 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner1@mac.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 11 Feb 2003 06:41:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 47028 invoked from network); 11 Feb 2003 06:41:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Feb 2003 06:41:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO fed1mtao04.cox.net) (68.6.19.241) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Feb 2003 06:41:47 -0000 Received: from mac.com ([68.4.33.253]) by fed1mtao04.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20030211064148.IDSR17019.fed1mtao04.cox.net@mac.com> for ; Tue, 11 Feb 2003 01:41:48 -0500 Message-ID: <3E489B28.2020703@mac.com> Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2003 22:41:44 -0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20021120 Netscape/7.01 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Delco AMAX (vs. Chrysler AMAX) References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Richard Wagoner X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135738921 X-Yahoo-Profile: richardalanwagoner > Push the "AM ST" button in, and the bandwidth instantly opens up to > about 6 kHz -- but if you're listening to a mono station, that's all > you'll get. Unlike Chrysler AMAX car radios, the Delco reserves full > bandwidth for AM Stereo stations only, which is not so good if you > don't have (m)any in your area. > > But when the Delco does encounter an AM Stereo signal -- even a > rather weak or unstable one -- it quickly locks onto the Stereo pilot > and then variably adjusts the bandwidth and Stereo separation to suit > current signal conditions. These two criteria appear to be linked, > so wide bandwidth = wide separation, and if signal conditions cause > the audio to blend towards mono, the bandwidth will be reduced back > down as well. That's not the way mine worked. It gave full bandwidth even with mono. From jsgil@hal-pc.org Mon Feb 10 22:59:51 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 11 Feb 2003 06:59:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 26823 invoked from network); 11 Feb 2003 06:59:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Feb 2003 06:59:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Feb 2003 06:59:50 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.181] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Feb 2003 06:59:50 -0000 Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 06:59:49 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: DXing Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 348 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.83 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst A couple of nights ago I pulled in what appeared to be a Travelers Information Service out of Florida on 1680 AM. The adds were about the movie studio associated with Disney. It came skipping across the Gulf of Mexico to South East Texas. I did not hear any call letters brfore it fadded out. Just curious what kind of power they are running. JSG From samuel@shoalhaven.net.au Mon Feb 10 23:08:19 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: samuel@shoalhaven.net.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 11 Feb 2003 07:08:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 49989 invoked from network); 11 Feb 2003 07:08:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Feb 2003 07:08:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Feb 2003 07:08:18 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.161] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Feb 2003 07:08:18 -0000 Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 07:08:17 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: "Stereo 2BS" (not anymore) Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1073 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "samuelheise " X-Originating-IP: 203.220.154.55 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=42510576 X-Yahoo-Profile: samuelheise Stereo 2BS may have been the last station in Australia to promote AM Stereo on their station up until several months ago. They ALLWAYS said "Stereo 2BS" and I mean no announcer, commentator or DJ would say 2BS without saying stereo first. But that's all in the past now they have reinvented themselves as "2BS Gold" and to top it all off they're in complete MONO. Here is an email I sent to them on their website at www.2bs.com.au (I wrote:) Hello, I really enjoy your programming a lot but miss the way you used to sound when you where in stereo. It really makes a big difference to the music. Thanks Samuel samt@dodo.com.au (reply): Thanks for your feedback. I have a really nice Voxon radio at home, so I miss us being in stereo as well. With so few stations in stereo and with receivers not being available to consumers now, it made sense for us not to put in stereo transmission equipment, when we recently updated our gear. Thanks for listening, sorry its not what you were used to. Phil Cole - General Manager 1503 2BS Gold / 99.3 B-Rock FM From samuel@shoalhaven.net.au Mon Feb 10 23:32:29 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: samuel@shoalhaven.net.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 11 Feb 2003 07:32:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 32646 invoked from network); 11 Feb 2003 07:32:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Feb 2003 07:32:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.83) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Feb 2003 07:32:28 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.147] by n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Feb 2003 07:32:28 -0000 Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 07:32:27 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: The only AM station in stereo for NSW Oz Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 721 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "samuelheise " X-Originating-IP: 203.220.154.55 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=42510576 X-Yahoo-Profile: samuelheise At the moment the only station I can hear which is in stereo in NSW (Coming from Canberra which is surrounded by NSW) is 1053 2CA. There maybe 1 or 2 others that I can't hear due to interference (wishful thinking). Stations that need updating on the AM Stereo website for NSW Australia: 2BS - 1503 AM STEREO Bathurst, NSW, Australia ("STEREO 2BS" Oldies) is now MONO (no pilot) 2TM - 1287 AM STEREO Tamworth, NSW, Australia (Talk) is now MONO (no pilot) 2HD - 1143 AM STEREO Newcastle, NSW, Australia (Sports/Talk) is now MONO (no pilot) 2GB - 873 AM STEREO Sydney, NSW, Australia (Talk) some stereo separation (but with no pilot??) i.e. Any AM stereo radio that relies on a pilot tone will not work. From amymousie@yahoo.com Mon Feb 10 23:44:52 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 11 Feb 2003 07:44:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 7237 invoked from network); 11 Feb 2003 07:44:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Feb 2003 07:44:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Feb 2003 07:44:52 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.155] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Feb 2003 07:44:49 -0000 Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 07:44:48 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} End IBOC-DAB Now! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2498 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 64.175.245.80 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "jsgilst " wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "amymousie " > wrote: > > > > > Don't forget the patents! Once the 17-year exclusivity clause for > the > > patents for IBOC expires, there will be no incentive to charge > > exhorbinant (sp?) fees to use the system, much less to manufacture > > it, and there would be such disinterest to continue supporting it > > that little gets done with IBOC- It becomes an orphaned system, > > unsupported and not open. The result is millions of totally useless > > radios and no commercially-available system to fall back on. > > > > The whole talk about digital on AM & FM started around 10 years ago > so I wonder how many patents were filed way back when. This would > mean that some are half way through their life expectancy and are > facing a similar situation that Unisys has with the LZW compression > that GIF & PDF uses. They are really trying to get the ball rolling > to start to recoup the investment costs. If it doesn't start soon > and take off then the investments will be lost never to be recovered. I had thought the IBOC patents were filed back in 1996. The earliest I ever heard of digital radio in America was around 1986-1987 or thereabouts. Even for 1996, that means they have about 10 years left before the patents have to be opened up to the public- At least the initial core patents anyway. > They are also trying to pull a Micro$oft and hook broadcasters into > having to pay continual license fees to extend the revenue stream > to compensate for what life is left in the main patents. It is IBOC > or Bust for this company and all investors involved. Since the large > broadcast conglomerates and car radio manufacturers are some of the > main investers they have a vested interest in seeing it become a > success and will stop at nothing having no concern with the > distructiveness it will do the existing analog system. Considering that Lucent Technologies, the sole remaining company involved in iBiquity, has been on very shaky financial grounds in recent times, the survivability of IBOC, even if the system is mandated ala HDTV, is very shaky, and potentially ruinous to the entire industry- A gamble that may be a disaster in the making. (Enron, anyone?) It is for these reasons, if nothing else, that IBOC must be prevented from being adopted, or -everyone- loses. Amy. <:3 )~~~ From amymousie@yahoo.com Mon Feb 10 23:46:43 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 11 Feb 2003 07:46:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 56840 invoked from network); 11 Feb 2003 07:46:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Feb 2003 07:46:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.70) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Feb 2003 07:46:42 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.143] by n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Feb 2003 07:46:42 -0000 Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 07:46:41 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: DXing Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 496 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 64.175.245.80 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "jsgilst " wrote: > A couple of nights ago I pulled in what appeared to > be a Travelers Information Service out of Florida > on 1680 AM. The adds were about the movie studio > associated with Disney. It came skipping across > the Gulf of Mexico to South East Texas. I did not > hear any call letters brfore it fadded out. Just > curious what kind of power they are running. Sounds like WTIR that I have heard of? Amy. <:3 )~~~ From samuel@shoalhaven.net.au Mon Feb 10 23:49:51 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: samuel@shoalhaven.net.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 11 Feb 2003 07:49:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 3869 invoked from network); 11 Feb 2003 07:49:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Feb 2003 07:49:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Feb 2003 07:49:51 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.142] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Feb 2003 07:49:51 -0000 Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 07:49:47 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Not sure about 2CS Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 184 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "samuelheise " X-Originating-IP: 203.220.154.55 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=42510576 X-Yahoo-Profile: samuelheise I'm not sure if the following station is in stereo because there is too much interference on 639khz. 2CS - 639 AM STEREO Coffs Harbour, NSW, Australia (Oldies/Adult Contemporary) From amymousie@yahoo.com Mon Feb 10 23:58:02 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 11 Feb 2003 07:58:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 24450 invoked from network); 11 Feb 2003 07:58:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Feb 2003 07:58:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.70) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Feb 2003 07:58:02 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.142] by n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Feb 2003 07:58:01 -0000 Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 07:58:01 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Not sure about 2CS Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 395 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 64.175.245.80 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "samuelheise " wrote: > I'm not sure if the following station is in stereo because > there is too much interference on 639khz. > 2CS - 639 AM STEREO Coffs Harbour, NSW, Australia (Oldies/Adult > Contemporary) As fas as I know, I think the most AM-stereo friendly state in Australia seems to be Queensland. Amy. <:3 )~~~ From alfredot@inetarena.com Mon Feb 10 23:58:40 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: alfredot@inetarena.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 11 Feb 2003 07:58:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 77364 invoked from network); 11 Feb 2003 07:58:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Feb 2003 07:58:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.inetarena.com) (206.129.216.13) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Feb 2003 07:58:39 -0000 Received: from hendrie (1Cust40.tnt1.portland.or.da.uu.net [67.225.122.40]) by mail.inetarena.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h1B7tve13881 for ; Mon, 10 Feb 2003 23:55:58 -0800 (PST) Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2003 23:57:48 -0800 (PST) X-Sender: alfredo@hendrie.1610am.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: OT: FM filter replacement In-Reply-To: <1044948750.2923.32659.m9@yahoogroups.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: "Alfredo E. Torrejon" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=25132238 X-Yahoo-Profile: alfredotorrejon > Changing FM filters for DXing is simple as can be. The filters have three > legs. Check where the red dot is. Snip the legs off the old one. With the > dot in the same direction, solder the legs on to where the old stubs are > sticking out. > > You are done. I once found an even cooler suggestion on the Web: Unsolder the filters and replace them with 3 pin SIP sockets. This way, you can easily swap out different filters until you find the ones that work best for you. The nice thing about the FM filters is that every one that I've seen is made to work with source and load impedances of 330 ohms, so they're interchangeable with no circuit modifications. No such luck is to be had with 450/455 kHz AM filters. :( Before I go, just one stupid question: does narrowing the bandwidth to 110 kHz cause noticeable distortion in the audio? Does the stereo separation suffer greatly? Alfredo From amymousie@yahoo.com Tue Feb 11 00:12:57 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 11 Feb 2003 08:12:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 74418 invoked from network); 11 Feb 2003 08:12:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Feb 2003 08:12:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.89) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Feb 2003 08:12:56 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.176] by n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Feb 2003 08:12:56 -0000 Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 08:12:55 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: OT: FM filter replacement Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 528 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 64.175.245.80 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Alfredo E. Torrejon" wrote: > Before I go, just one stupid question: does narrowing the bandwidth to 110 > kHz cause noticeable distortion in the audio? Does the stereo separation > suffer greatly? Yes, I would think you would lose the L-R subcarrier in the process. Let's see- 75kHz nominal deviation + 15kHz x2 for the baseband audio. That's 105kHz right there. For full stereo and SCA, you need about 275kHz bandwidth for broadcast FM stereo. Amy. <:3 )~~~ From n0uiheric@aol.com Tue Feb 11 01:31:56 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 11 Feb 2003 09:31:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 72712 invoked from network); 11 Feb 2003 09:31:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Feb 2003 09:31:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d09.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.41) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Feb 2003 09:31:55 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-d09.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.188.15c68eaa (4529) for ; Tue, 11 Feb 2003 04:31:51 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <188.15c68eaa.2b7a1d06@aol.com> Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 04:31:50 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} End IBOC-DAB Now! To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih Analog is NOT OBSOLETE, it has NEVER BEEN OBSOLETE, and WILL NEVER BE OBSOLETE! IBOCrap is already obsolete. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Feb 11 02:12:09 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 11 Feb 2003 10:12:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 28527 invoked from network); 11 Feb 2003 10:12:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Feb 2003 10:12:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Feb 2003 10:12:07 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.157] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Feb 2003 10:12:07 -0000 Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 10:12:06 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Delco AMAX (vs. Chrysler AMAX) Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3E489B28.2020703@mac.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 618 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.71.140 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > That's not the way mine worked. It gave full bandwidth even with > mono. Then you probably have an older Delco (non-Expanded Band, non-AMAX). These will give a fixed choice of Narrow or Wide bandwidth depending on whether you push in the "AM ST" button or not. But AM Stereo reception is still restricted to Wide mode only. To be exact, here is the radio I got from eBay: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2401065804 It looks like the older Delcos, except the orange PWR button is now integrated with the Volume knob, and the cassette player has a more simplistic three-button mechanism. From amymousie@yahoo.com Tue Feb 11 02:43:13 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 11 Feb 2003 10:43:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 49466 invoked from network); 11 Feb 2003 10:43:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Feb 2003 10:43:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Feb 2003 10:43:12 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.166] by n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Feb 2003 10:43:12 -0000 Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 10:43:09 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} End IBOC-DAB Now! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <188.15c68eaa.2b7a1d06@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1381 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 64.175.245.80 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, n0uiheric@a... wrote: > Analog is NOT OBSOLETE, it has NEVER BEEN OBSOLETE, and WILL NEVER BE > OBSOLETE! IBOCrap is already obsolete. Ya know, had something like IBOC been proposed in the 1960's (yes, digital audio was being experimented by the early 1960's), it would never have gotten past the FCC, since it does violate the traditional interference standards. These are the same interference standards that all the AM and FM stereo systems proposed over the decades had to meet, so why IBOC, why now? I'm just amazed that over a period of 50 years, there had been 11 analog and one digital AM stereo systems proposed, and the industry gets all hot and heavy for the one system- the digital one- that's the worst of all of them. (Yes, 11. I'm including both variants proposed in the 1959 and 1979 proposals, plus one so called "Noise Free Radio" that was supposedly based on the RCA system. The Kahn and Kahn/Hazeltine systems were different AM stereo systems with essentially the same result- ISB; the RCA and Belar systems were the same except for the peak nominal deviation, and I think the Belar system limited the FM L-R to 6025 Hz audio. The rest were CBS, Philco, Westinghouse, Motorola, Magnavox and Harris. Well, 12, if you count both of Harris' fixed quadrature and variable-phased systems.) Amy. <:3 )~~~ From florida_amstereo@hotmail.com Tue Feb 11 03:00:09 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: florida_amstereo@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 11 Feb 2003 11:00:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 68064 invoked from network); 11 Feb 2003 11:00:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Feb 2003 11:00:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.37.41) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Feb 2003 11:00:07 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 11 Feb 2003 03:00:07 -0800 Received: from 209.240.198.61 by pv2fd.pav2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Tue, 11 Feb 2003 11:00:06 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Re: {AMSF} DXing Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 11:00:06 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 11 Feb 2003 11:00:07.0336 (UTC) FILETIME=[BCEADA80:01C2D1BC] From: "Donn Tillman" X-Originating-IP: [209.240.198.61] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83914824 What you were picking up is full power, WTIR, out of Winter Garden, a suburb of Orlando. They're licensed for 10,000 watts day and 1,000 watts night; although Neal and others suspect they do not always power down. I am about 125 miles s.w. of them and care barely pick them up at night. donn, st petersburg,fl ----Original Message Follows---- From: "jsgilst " Reply-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} DXing Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 06:59:49 -0000 A couple of nights ago I pulled in what appeared to be a Travelers Information Service out of Florida on 1680 AM. The adds were about the movie studio associated with Disney. It came skipping across the Gulf of Mexico to South East Texas. I did not hear any call letters brfore it fadded out. Just curious what kind of power they are running. JSG _________________________________________________________________ Help STOP SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail From don@idpt.com Tue Feb 11 04:53:55 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: don@idpt.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 11 Feb 2003 12:53:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 35874 invoked from network); 11 Feb 2003 12:53:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Feb 2003 12:53:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout3-eri1.midsouth.rr.com) (24.165.200.8) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Feb 2003 12:53:54 -0000 Received: from primary (cpe-024-024-118-043.midsouth.rr.com [24.24.118.43]) by mailout3-eri1.midsouth.rr.com (8.11.4/8.11.4) with ESMTP id h1BCrrS17334 for ; Tue, 11 Feb 2003 06:53:53 -0600 (CST) To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} End IBOC-DAB Now! Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 06:53:41 -0600 Message-ID: <006801c2d1cc$a0e08f00$0202a8c0@primary> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2616 In-Reply-To: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Importance: Normal From: "Don Johnson" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=32705644 X-Yahoo-Profile: htmldon Well I agree with you, John :) My big problem with IBOC is the royalties issue. Broadcast standards should be open, and government shouldn't adopt an official standard where broadcasters have to pay a monopoly for the rights to use the mandated standard. There is nothing wrong with Digital, there should be concern with IBOC. This anti-digital nonsense sounds like people trying to preserve mechanical television in the 30's. The beginning of the sound at the microphone and the end of the sound at the ear may be analog, but digital is clearly the most effective and most efficient way of transmitting it. It is also the ONLY way we are going to get AM Stereo and hi-fidelity sound for broadcast radio. I hate to break it to some of the folks on this list, but C-QUAM isn't coming back. If they re-packaged it and re-marketed it, it would have a chance -- but there is simply no interest, and a bunch of raving lunatics on an e-mail list (myself included) isn't going to help the issue. I realize I'll be lynched for saying this -- but whenever there have been comparisons between IBOC and analog AM stereo, I've found the IBOC to sound slightly better. I'm no professionally trained audio expert and I honestly couldn't care less what the spectrum analysis says -- the IBOC sounds better and more clear. I'm a listener. People who listen to radio are listeners. They want better sound (and yes, better programming), not engineering mumbo-jumbo. I encourage the anti-digital folks out there to revert their computers back to analog, since the eye and hand are analog devices too. I'll stick with digital transmission of information, and sound. ______________ Don Johnson don@idpt.com -----Original Message----- From: John [mailto:jbyrns@enteract.com] Sent: Monday, February 10, 2003 8:11 AM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} End IBOC-DAB Now! --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, n0uiheric@a... wrote: > > The task is to end IBOC transmissions in the United States, and keep AM and > FM analog. Why would anyone want to keep AM and FM analog? Analog is an obsolete technology, which is only interesting from a historical perspective, and should be relegated to museum exhibits. John Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From groucho@skyweb.net Tue Feb 11 05:04:30 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 11 Feb 2003 13:04:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 22675 invoked from network); 11 Feb 2003 13:04:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Feb 2003 13:04:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Feb 2003 13:04:29 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (tc1-73.skyweb.net [66.6.130.201]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h1BDEY7m025743 for ; Tue, 11 Feb 2003 08:14:34 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3E48F268.CA7CFA01@skyweb.net> Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 07:54:00 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} DXing References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 well they are supposed to be Running 1 kw at sunset 10 kw during the day... but you take a guess as to which setting they were at... they kill me up here at times... after several complaints they disappeared for awhile.. ,but then they came back.. during the summer I could only hear them In my control room off air monitors .. and not my own signal... Yep that's Travellers Information Radio WTIR wintergarden/orlando Fla... Neal-CE WTTM 1680am Stereo "jsgilst " wrote: > A couple of nights ago I pulled in what appeared to > be a Travelers Information Service out of Florida > on 1680 AM. The adds were about the movie studio > associated with Disney. It came skipping across > the Gulf of Mexico to South East Texas. I did not > hear any call letters brfore it fadded out. Just > curious what kind of power they are running. > > JSG > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From amfmdx@fastq.com Tue Feb 11 06:56:27 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 11 Feb 2003 14:56:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 18865 invoked from network); 11 Feb 2003 14:56:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Feb 2003 14:56:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Feb 2003 14:56:24 -0000 Received: from fastq (d183-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.215]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id h1BEuMU46704 for ; Tue, 11 Feb 2003 07:56:22 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <018901c2d1dd$97de48a0$3df9bed8@com> To: Subject: Abandon ship, shes going down...... Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 07:55:16 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > If the public only knew what was happening.... > I live for the day that I read how IBiquty goes down in flames. You and me bro. I can see people leaving AM in droves, at least the few that are left. The station owners and programmers put their crappiest programming out instead of trying something new and innovative and then they wonder why people left. All I can say is when there are NO radios out there yet and everyone has a band full of hissing crap, radio will have effectively killed itself, especially on AM. I think that greed will catch up with these corporate $uck @$$es eventially and they will use the rope that was given them to strangle themselves. This is one of the dumbest things that anyone ever thought up and its going to be the downfall of a lot of people as it crashes around their feet. Digital isn't a problem but it belongs in the UHF band. One TV channel needs to be given to IBAC and on the low end of the UHF dial. This has been done in the past with channel 1 on VHF which went to FM. It can be done again for digital so a fair amount of coverage can be given without tremendous power being used. This will still give the broadcasters lower freqs than E147, and as far as that is concerned, I *still* think we should be using E147. If this is done, I am 110% for digital radio. The implementation of this IBAC system just plain sucks. If digital goes head to head on a seperate frequency band and wins, then I think its great. Kevin Mesa, Arizona This message has been composed of recycled electrons. None of these electrons has been harmed or injured in the creation and transmission of this message but they have been shamelessly exploited for this use. From amfmdx@fastq.com Tue Feb 11 07:01:22 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 11 Feb 2003 15:01:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 2417 invoked from network); 11 Feb 2003 15:01:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Feb 2003 15:01:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Feb 2003 15:01:21 -0000 Received: from fastq (d183-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.215]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id h1BF1KU46895 for ; Tue, 11 Feb 2003 08:01:20 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <019101c2d1de$498b3540$3df9bed8@com> To: Subject: WTIR for JSG Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 08:00:15 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla > A couple of nights ago I pulled in what appeared to > be a Travelers Information Service out of Florida > on 1680 AM. This is WTIR from Orlando running 10kw at night. Allotted 1 kW. Kevin Mesa, Arizona This message has been composed of recycled electrons. None of these electrons has been harmed or injured in the creation and transmission of this message but they have been shamelessly exploited for this use. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Feb 11 07:27:26 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 11 Feb 2003 15:27:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 84020 invoked from network); 11 Feb 2003 15:27:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Feb 2003 15:27:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.87) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Feb 2003 15:27:23 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.159] by n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Feb 2003 15:27:23 -0000 Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 15:27:22 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Digital vs. Analog Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <006801c2d1cc$a0e08f00$0202a8c0@primary> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1256 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > I hate to break it to some of the folks on this list, but C-QUAM > isn't coming back. It doesn't have to "come back". Worldwide, C-Quam AM Stereo has hundreds of stations broadcasting it and millions of radios receiving it. IBOC/"HD Radio" or any other digital radio system has a looong way to go before it can even match up to this. > I encourage the anti-digital folks out there to revert their > computers back to analog, since the eye and hand are analog devices > too. If you are looking a computer monitor as you read this, chances are you're witnessing analog technology. In the late '80s, computer video systems had to switch from digital to analog in order to allow more colors to be displayed on the screen. With digital, the color depth is limited by the number of wires you have running from the computer to the monitor. After the digital EGA standard with 64 colors, this became too cumbersome, so the VGA standard -- which today's computer video standards are still based upon -- switched to analog, and it can deliver over 16 MILLION colors through only THREE wires that carry color information (for Red, Green, and Blue). In this case, analog is more efficient and has better quality than digital. From amfmdx@fastq.com Tue Feb 11 07:38:47 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 11 Feb 2003 15:38:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 51217 invoked from network); 11 Feb 2003 15:38:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Feb 2003 15:38:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Feb 2003 15:38:45 -0000 Received: from fastq (d183-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.215]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id h1BFchU48435 for ; Tue, 11 Feb 2003 08:38:43 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <01bb01c2d1e3$81aee7a0$3df9bed8@com> To: Subject: OT: FM filters Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 08:37:36 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla >Before I go, just one stupid question: does narrowing the bandwidth to 110 >kHz cause noticeable distortion in the audio? Does the stereo separation >suffer greatly? This is a depends answer.... It really depends on the number of filters in the receiver. If you have 2 or less, no. If you have 3 it gets iffy and if you have 5 then probably. I have a Hafler 330 receiver and its modified with 5 110 kHz filters. Sometimes it receives in stereo, sometimes not. This is a DX only receiver for me and I can hear adjacents next to 100 kW flame throwers with this setup. If you want to keep stereo and also be able to DX a little I would not get less than 130. If I wanted to have more stereo but DX a little, I would run 150 kHz filters. For DX nothing wider than that. If I wanted audiophile stuff, I would run 230 kHz. And yes, I know people who have put in the sockets to change filters. If you have the time, its a good idea. Kevin Mesa, Arizona This message has been composed of recycled electrons. None of these electrons has been harmed or injured in the creation and transmission of this message but they have been shamelessly exploited for this use. From michaelj@vcn.com Tue Feb 11 07:59:29 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 11 Feb 2003 15:59:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 49334 invoked from network); 11 Feb 2003 15:59:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Feb 2003 15:59:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m1-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Feb 2003 15:59:27 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m1-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Tue, 11 Feb 2003 08:59:27 -0700 Message-ID: <005601c2d1e6$8dd49e00$0701010a@keva> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Delco AMAX (vs. Chrysler AMAX) Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 08:59:21 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Kevin Help my curiosity out here. Which connector system is on the back of yours? Is it the 12 pin system.....which is 12 "blades" and there are actually 3 connectors....one on top of the other....that make up the 12-pin female "connector" ?? Or is it the one that's got the smaller pins on it....where it's just one connector and the pins are a lot smaller in size? We have questions here on the list about this all the time. I'm curious about where was the year they switched from using the "big" plugs to the "little ones". MJR n WYO ----- Original Message ----- From: Kevin T. To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, February 11, 2003 3:12 AM Subject: {AMSF} Re: Delco AMAX (vs. Chrysler AMAX) To be exact, here is the radio I got from eBay: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2401065804 It looks like the older Delcos, except the orange PWR button is now integrated with the Volume knob, and the cassette player has a more simplistic three-button mechanism. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From bjackson@indyradio.com Tue Feb 11 08:17:06 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 11 Feb 2003 16:17:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 59593 invoked from network); 11 Feb 2003 16:17:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Feb 2003 16:17:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.89) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Feb 2003 16:17:05 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.249] by n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Feb 2003 16:17:01 -0000 Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 16:16:59 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: DXing Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 870 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923 " X-Originating-IP: 64.25.100.53 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "jsgilst " wrote: > A couple of nights ago I pulled in what appeared to > be a Travelers Information Service out of Florida > on 1680 AM. The adds were about the movie studio > associated with Disney. It came skipping across > the Gulf of Mexico to South East Texas. I did not > hear any call letters brfore it fadded out. Just > curious what kind of power they are running. > > JSG I believe you were hearing WTIR. Maybe someone else here knows for sure, but they almost *have* to be running full power day and night. Nine times out of ten they overpower both WTTM (which I have picked up twice here in Indianapolis) and Jamz 1680 from Grand Rapids, MI. Has anyone ever called them about their power levels at night? Brad Jackson Susquehanna, Indianapolis WGLD/WGRL/WFMS http://www.indyradio.com From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Feb 11 08:22:15 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 11 Feb 2003 16:22:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 70566 invoked from network); 11 Feb 2003 16:22:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Feb 2003 16:22:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.88) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Feb 2003 16:22:14 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.155] by n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Feb 2003 16:22:14 -0000 Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 16:22:14 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Delco radios Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <005601c2d1e6$8dd49e00$0701010a@keva> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1583 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > We have questions here on the list about this all the time. I'm > curious about where was the year they switched from using the "big" > plugs to the "little ones". My AMAX Delco has a production date of 1995 and uses the newer/smaller GM-style connections. There are actually four parts to the connector, although I'm only concerned about two of them -- one for the DC power and another on top of it for the front speaker outputs. I believe GM/Delco switched from the old "big" radio connectors to the new "small" radio connectors some time in 1988 or 1989. I also have one of the first AM Stereo car radios that Delco made, with a production date of October 1984. It is a RADIO ONLY (no cassette, no Equalizer), with a manual "AM ST/MONO" button (yes, the not-pushed-in position is specifically labeled as "MONO"). "AM ST" mode gives you wide bandwidth for both mono and Stereo stations with a sharp 10 kHz notch filter to cut out the carrier whistle. MONO mode noticeably improves selectivity and actually doesn't dull the sound all that much, but unfortunately does not allow AM Stereo reception. And like all older Delcos, this one tunes up to 1620 kHz on AM. One odd thing I've noticed about these Delco radios is that when you first power them up (after they've been away from DC power long enough to clear out the memory), they default to 1400 kHz AM. Not the bottom of the FM dial like most car radios, or 530 kHz AM like Chrysler radios -- to 1400 kHz AM! Did Delco use this frequency for their test equipment or something? From bjackson@indyradio.com Tue Feb 11 08:24:31 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 11 Feb 2003 16:24:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 75190 invoked from network); 11 Feb 2003 16:24:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Feb 2003 16:24:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Feb 2003 16:24:31 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.136] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Feb 2003 16:24:30 -0000 Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 16:24:30 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} End IBOC-DAB Now! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <188.15c68eaa.2b7a1d06@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 866 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923 " X-Originating-IP: 64.25.100.53 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, n0uiheric@a... wrote: > Analog is NOT OBSOLETE, it has NEVER BEEN OBSOLETE, and WILL NEVER BE > OBSOLETE! IBOCrap is already obsolete. > This is *somewhat* on-topic...The fact that digital may make itself obsolete. One of my good friends (Todd Berryman, MD at WTTS here) and I were musing at the fact that in 200 years, LP's will still be playable...All you need is a needle and something to rotate it. But, all the digital stuff, be it a CD, DAT, MD, etc., may not be playable...Same with recording masters...The analog tapes may go bad, but you may be able to get one play out of them. Digital tapes are either good or bad, nothing in the middle...But that's not a bad thing...It means the music on "Glitter" may get lost forever! Brad Jackson Susquehanna, Indianapolis WGLD/WGRL/WFMS http://www.indyradio.com From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Feb 11 08:25:37 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 11 Feb 2003 16:25:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 90268 invoked from network); 11 Feb 2003 16:25:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Feb 2003 16:25:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.67) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Feb 2003 16:25:36 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.157] by n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Feb 2003 16:25:35 -0000 Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 16:25:35 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: MetroSound tuner on eBay Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 380 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics Here is a MetroSound multi-system AM Stereo converter/tuner on eBay, from a seller in Sydney, Australia. Current bid price is U.S. $50.00 (yes, U.S. currency, not Australian dollars): http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3007165629 The seller also includes a link to the AM Stereo web site, but it is to Alex's old site, not to www.AMStereoRadio.com. From KC4QLP@aol.com Tue Feb 11 08:28:57 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 11 Feb 2003 16:28:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 56090 invoked from network); 11 Feb 2003 16:28:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Feb 2003 16:28:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r06.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.102) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Feb 2003 16:28:57 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.146.a42b761 (30950) for ; Tue, 11 Feb 2003 11:28:34 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <146.a42b761.2b7a7eb1@aol.com> Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 11:28:33 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} End IBOC-DAB Now! To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 2/11/03 7:54:28 AM Eastern Standard Time, don@idpt.com writes: <> This anti-digital nonsense thats going on is giving my delete key quite a workout. << It is also the ONLY way we are going to get AM Stereo and hi-fidelity sound for broadcast radio. I hate to break it to some of the folks on this list, but C-QUAM isn't coming back. If they re-packaged it and re-marketed it, it would have a chance >> Even if you were to repackage it..it still would not have a chance.The time for C-Quam to make a big splash was several decades ago,and that chance was pretty much screwed over. <<-- but there is simply no interest, and a bunch of raving lunatics on an e-mail list (myself included) isn't going to help the issue.>> There seems to be a few certified lunatics here...lol ...and somehow I beleive that in 50 years from now when technology moves forward and everything is digital and computer controled...we will still have these "lunatics" screaming "we want analog!". If they had there way about everything..we probably would be back to communicating via smoke signals.....provided that the environmental wackos didnt start screaming about pollution from the "high tech" smoke signals. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net __________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From bjackson@indyradio.com Tue Feb 11 08:30:05 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 11 Feb 2003 16:30:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 46526 invoked from network); 11 Feb 2003 16:30:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Feb 2003 16:30:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.87) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Feb 2003 16:30:02 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.150] by n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Feb 2003 16:30:01 -0000 Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 16:30:01 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} End IBOC-DAB Now! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <006801c2d1cc$a0e08f00$0202a8c0@primary> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 593 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923 " X-Originating-IP: 64.25.100.53 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Don Johnson" wrote: > I encourage the anti-digital folks out there to revert their computers > back to analog, since the eye and hand are analog devices too. I'll > stick with digital transmission of information, and sound. > > ______________ > Don Johnson > don@i... > Actually, there is a brand new motherboard that almost qualifies...It uses tubes for the on-board sound (Soundblaster compatible!) http://www.aopen.com/products/mb/ax4b-533tube.htm Everything that goes around comes around! Brad Jackson Susquehanna, Indianapolis From don@idpt.com Tue Feb 11 08:46:02 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: don@idpt.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 11 Feb 2003 16:46:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 75658 invoked from network); 11 Feb 2003 16:46:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Feb 2003 16:46:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout3-eri1.midsouth.rr.com) (24.165.200.8) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Feb 2003 16:46:01 -0000 Received: from primary (cpe-024-024-118-043.midsouth.rr.com [24.24.118.43]) by mailout3-eri1.midsouth.rr.com (8.11.4/8.11.4) with ESMTP id h1BGk0S19157 for ; Tue, 11 Feb 2003 10:46:00 -0600 (CST) To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} Re: Digital vs. Analog Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 10:45:49 -0600 Message-ID: <007301c2d1ed$0ea27f60$0202a8c0@primary> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2616 In-Reply-To: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Importance: Normal From: "Don Johnson" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=32705644 X-Yahoo-Profile: htmldon " If you are looking a computer monitor as you read this, chances are you're witnessing analog technology... In this case, analog is more efficient and has better quality than digital." Good argument, but the analogy is inadequate. The monitor is kinda like a speaker -- as a device that converts electronic impulses to something perceptible by a sense. The connection between the computer and monitor is analogous to the connection between a receiver and speakers. Given the choice, I'd prefer a digital connection between my receiver and speakers to reduce noise. (I've got two 50,000 watt AM stations within a half-mile of my house so I get lots of interference, on EVERYTHING) Anyway, monitors are moving back to digital with the advent of flat panel LCD's with DVI-D connectors. I once again encourage the analophiles to run back to the woods, get out the mechanical TV, trade in the digital computer for the adding machine, and invent a portable LP player :) ______________ Don Johnson don@idpt.com -----Original Message----- From: Kevin T. [mailto:kevtronics@yahoo.com] Sent: Tuesday, February 11, 2003 9:27 AM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: Digital vs. Analog > I hate to break it to some of the folks on this list, but C-QUAM > isn't coming back. It doesn't have to "come back". Worldwide, C-Quam AM Stereo has hundreds of stations broadcasting it and millions of radios receiving it. IBOC/"HD Radio" or any other digital radio system has a looong way to go before it can even match up to this. > I encourage the anti-digital folks out there to revert their > computers back to analog, since the eye and hand are analog devices > too. If you are looking a computer monitor as you read this, chances are you're witnessing analog technology. In the late '80s, computer video systems had to switch from digital to analog in order to allow more colors to be displayed on the screen. With digital, the color depth is limited by the number of wires you have running from the computer to the monitor. After the digital EGA standard with 64 colors, this became too cumbersome, so the VGA standard -- which today's computer video standards are still based upon -- switched to analog, and it can deliver over 16 MILLION colors through only THREE wires that carry color information (for Red, Green, and Blue). In this case, analog is more efficient and has better quality than digital. Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Feb 11 09:09:32 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 11 Feb 2003 17:09:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 9148 invoked from network); 11 Feb 2003 17:09:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Feb 2003 17:09:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Feb 2003 17:09:30 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.180] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Feb 2003 17:09:30 -0000 Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 17:09:29 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Digital vs. Analog AM & FM Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <007301c2d1ed$0ea27f60$0202a8c0@primary> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1559 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > I once again encourage the analophiles to run back to the woods, get > out the mechanical TV, trade in the digital computer for the adding > machine, and invent a portable LP player :) We could argue digital vs. analog forever, but the point in relevance to this group is that the AM and FM broadcasting bands were never meant to accomodate hybrid analog/digital transmissions, such as the IBOC system. There is simply not enough available bandwidth to do this without causing significant amounts of interference, especially if EVERY station would be using IBOC (which is currently a technical and regulatory *impossibility* -- as the Glen Clark Associates petition admits -- but can be theoretically argued nonetheless). There is no question that digital broadcasting would work best IN ITS OWN BAND, such as the Eureka 147 DAB system used in Canada, Europe, and Asia. But if we are going to continue using the AM and FM bands -- as we probably are for a LONG time -- then they must continue to use analog transmissions in order to maintain the current level of quality and service that they provide to millions of listeners. But there is no reason why digital technology can be used to enhance the *reception* of these analog AM & FM signals. This is what Motorola is supporting with the "Symphony" receiver design, and this is what *I* fully support. So, I'm 100% for the idea of DIGITAL AM STEREO and DIGITAL FM STEREO -- as long as the digital is in the RECEIVER, not clogging up the airwaves with IBOC hash! From philipr@irac.pe.ca Tue Feb 11 09:31:30 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 11 Feb 2003 17:31:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 51987 invoked from network); 11 Feb 2003 17:30:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Feb 2003 17:30:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Feb 2003 17:30:18 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.187] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Feb 2003 17:30:15 -0000 Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 17:30:14 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Delco radios Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 843 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: > > We have questions here on the list about this all the time. I'm > One odd thing I've noticed about these Delco radios is that when you > first power them up (after they've been away from DC power long enough > to clear out the memory), they default to 1400 kHz AM. Not the bottom > of the FM dial like most car radios, or 530 kHz AM like Chrysler > radios -- to 1400 kHz AM! Did Delco use this frequency for their test > equipment or something? Interesting, as in the old days of analogue tuning car radios - there was often a little tiny antenna trimer adjustment screw which you were to adjust for strongest reception on a station at or near 1400. Prior to flipping to FM, 1410 CIGO served well for this purpose. Phil R. From philipr@irac.pe.ca Tue Feb 11 09:54:50 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 11 Feb 2003 17:54:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 91541 invoked from network); 11 Feb 2003 17:54:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Feb 2003 17:54:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Feb 2003 17:54:49 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.167] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Feb 2003 17:54:46 -0000 Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 17:54:45 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Delco radios Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1492 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking Except for at night, when all we could hear was good old WPOP 1410, in Hartford CT. In fact, sometimes the jocks and jockesses at CIGO [once called "see-go"] could hear WPOP in their headphones when they flipped the McCurdy Board over to the off air monitor. There used to be jokes about 1050 CHUM "drifting in the parking lot" at night. 1260 CIHI used to blast and fade in the parking lot of the Regent Mall at night - not good when a local station can't properly reach its largest Mall at night! Ah, the joys of tight directional patterns and co-channel interference at night! And yes, this past Saturday, I was able to listen to WABC, WCBS, 1560 Radio Disney, and a whole bunch of New York 50Kwers at noon ADT! Don't ya love daytime winter skywave? Even 1680 WTTM was coming in at 9 am and 4 pm. No select-a-tenna or external antenna used here folks, just a decent radio or two or three with a ferrite bar antenna in my basement. Phil R. P.S. We have a rather smart mouse in this group - please inform your cats not to harm a mouse wearing headphones - it might be Amy! --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Phil Rafuse " wrote: > Interesting, as in the old days of analogue tuning car radios - > there was often a little tiny antenna trimer adjustment screw which > you were to adjust for strongest reception on a station at or near > 1400. Prior to flipping to FM, 1410 CIGO served well for this > purpose. > > Phil R. From jbyrns@enteract.com Tue Feb 11 10:00:52 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 11 Feb 2003 18:00:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 8956 invoked from network); 11 Feb 2003 18:00:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Feb 2003 18:00:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.89) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Feb 2003 18:00:51 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.137] by n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Feb 2003 18:00:51 -0000 Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 18:00:50 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} End IBOC-DAB Now! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 914 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.98.216 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "bradleyj923 " < bjackson@i...> wrote: > This is *somewhat* on-topic...The fact that digital may make itself > obsolete. One of my good friends (Todd Berryman, MD at WTTS here) and > I were musing at the fact that in 200 years, LP's will still be > playable...All you need is a needle and something to rotate it. But, > all the digital stuff, be it a CD, DAT, MD, etc., may not be > playable...Same with recording masters...The analog tapes may go bad, > but you may be able to get one play out of them. Digital tapes are > either good or bad, nothing in the middle...But that's not a bad > thing...It means the music on "Glitter" may get lost forever! I hear there is a bioengineered bacteria available now that eats vinyl. All the digital forces have to do is spread a little of this stuff around, and soon all the vinyl will be gone too! John From amymousie@yahoo.com Tue Feb 11 10:09:01 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 11 Feb 2003 18:09:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 43184 invoked from network); 11 Feb 2003 18:09:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Feb 2003 18:09:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Feb 2003 18:09:01 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.152] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Feb 2003 18:09:01 -0000 Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 18:09:00 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Delco radios Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 257 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 64.175.245.80 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Phil Rafuse " wrote: [...] > P.S. We have a rather smart mouse in this group - please inform your > cats not to harm a mouse wearing headphones - it might be Amy! :) Amy. <:3 )~~~ From jbyrns@enteract.com Tue Feb 11 10:15:40 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 11 Feb 2003 18:15:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 99067 invoked from network); 11 Feb 2003 18:15:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Feb 2003 18:15:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Feb 2003 18:15:37 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.249] by n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Feb 2003 18:15:35 -0000 Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 18:15:35 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: Digital vs. Analog Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <007301c2d1ed$0ea27f60$0202a8c0@primary> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 441 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.98.216 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Don Johnson" wrote: > > I once again encourage the analophiles to run back to the woods, get out > the mechanical TV, trade in the digital computer for the adding machine, > and invent a portable LP player :) I didn't realize "adding machines" were analog? The ones I remember, while not binary, were definitely digital in nature. Slide Rules, I would believe they were analog. John From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Feb 11 10:53:42 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 11 Feb 2003 18:53:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 43357 invoked from network); 11 Feb 2003 18:53:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Feb 2003 18:53:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.87) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Feb 2003 18:53:41 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.151] by n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Feb 2003 18:53:40 -0000 Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 18:53:40 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} End IBOC-DAB Now! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 358 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > I hear there is a bioengineered bacteria available now that eats > vinyl. All the digital forces have to do is spread a little of this > stuff around, and soon all the vinyl will be gone too! Not 45 RPM singles, though... they're actually made out of polystyrene, even though people call them "vinyl" -- and of course shellac 78's as well. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Feb 11 10:56:46 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 11 Feb 2003 18:56:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 25554 invoked from network); 11 Feb 2003 18:56:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Feb 2003 18:56:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Feb 2003 18:56:46 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.154] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Feb 2003 18:56:39 -0000 Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 18:56:38 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Digital vs. Analog Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 358 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > I didn't realize "adding machines" were analog? The ones I >remember, while not binary, were definitely digital in nature. Slide > Rules, I would believe they were analog. Back during the glory days of the Cold War, the Russians tried to outsmart us by making *trinary* computers (+1, 0, and -1, instead of just 1 and 0).... it didn't work. From amymousie@yahoo.com Tue Feb 11 12:16:47 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 11 Feb 2003 20:16:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 29461 invoked from network); 11 Feb 2003 20:16:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Feb 2003 20:16:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.68) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Feb 2003 20:16:46 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.252] by n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Feb 2003 20:16:45 -0000 Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 20:16:43 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Digital vs. Analog Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 673 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 64.175.245.80 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: > > I didn't realize "adding machines" were analog? The ones I > > > >remember, while not binary, were definitely digital in nature. Slide > > > > Rules, I would believe they were analog. > > > > > Back during the glory days of the Cold War, the Russians tried to > outsmart us by making *trinary* computers (+1, 0, and -1, instead of > just 1 and 0).... it didn't work. ENIAC, the great computer built in the 1940's, was decimal- Base 10. (Things you find out about from the ENIAC-on-a-Chip project: http://www.ee.upenn.edu/~jan/eniacproj.html) Amy. <:3 )~~~ From jbyrns@enteract.com Tue Feb 11 13:26:31 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 11 Feb 2003 21:26:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 39488 invoked from network); 11 Feb 2003 21:26:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Feb 2003 21:26:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.68) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Feb 2003 21:26:30 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.169] by n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Feb 2003 21:26:29 -0000 Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 21:26:28 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} End IBOC-DAB Now! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1981 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.27 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "jsgilst " < jsgil@h...> wrote: > > Joe Public has little if any to gain by going digital for the free > radio part of it and the extra subscription services are not going > to offset the cost of the licenseing fees that this company will > charge. Their scheme to offer a one time fee for the 1st adopters > of the system will be taken up by the biggest broadcast > conglomerates but the smaller independent station who can't afford > it and/or want to see most of the bugs worked out before jumping > in will not be offered the one time subscription fee and will most > likely no be able to pay the re-occuring licensing. Add in that > the IBOC hash will destroy reception of the smaller independent > stations in some cases who do not have the resources to pursue the > matter legally and will drive them out of existence. When you look > at the the whole IBOC scheme in detail all of the negative factors > will have a synergistic of effect driving the smaller broadcasters > out of buisness and forcing the public to replace all their radios > with much more expensive digital models. "driving the smaller broadcasters out of buisness" is perhaps the most beneficial effect IBOC could have. The AM band has become way too crowded over the last half century, and anything that can be done to eliminate a large number of the existing stations can only be good. In my view the number of stations needs to be cut back to level that existed in 1949. In addition to greatly reducing the number of stations, I would like to see the elimination of the class A stations, by reclassifying them to class B status. This would allow moving some of the remaining stations to the less congested channels, further reducing interference in the primary coverage area of many stations. A less densely populated band would also allow many of the complex and aggressive directional arrays to be replaced by simpler arrays. John From dav259@csiro.au Tue Feb 11 14:09:39 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 11 Feb 2003 22:09:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 99693 invoked from network); 11 Feb 2003 22:09:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Feb 2003 22:09:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Feb 2003 22:09:37 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1BM9aR02520 for ; Wed, 12 Feb 2003 09:09:36 +1100 (EST) Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 09:09:36 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Subject: Symphony Digital Radios In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=112635033 X-Yahoo-Profile: dav259 On Tue, 11 Feb 2003, Kevin T. wrote: > But there is no reason why digital technology cant be used to enhance > the *reception* of these analog AM & FM signals. This is what > Motorola is supporting with the "Symphony" receiver design, and this > is what *I* fully support. Me too 3XY! Has the NAB ever made any official comments (good or bad) about Symphony or Omega? Or have they just closed their minds to it as they appear to have jumped into bed with iBiquity and the IBOC debacle? You'd think 200 or so more independent AMS stations could form a loose alliance to request that manufacturers bring out Symphony AMS/FMS radios in 10 months time. Maybe some of us should lobby possibly interested stations in this direction. It would be much more positive than just talking about it. Ian From JH_Radio@GameBox.net Tue Feb 11 15:15:54 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: JH_Radio@GameBox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 11 Feb 2003 23:15:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 25649 invoked from network); 11 Feb 2003 23:15:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Feb 2003 23:15:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO babyruth.hotpop.com) (204.57.55.14) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Feb 2003 23:15:53 -0000 Received: from gamebox.net (kubrick.hotpop.com [204.57.55.16]) by babyruth.hotpop.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 8812B21085A for ; Tue, 11 Feb 2003 23:15:12 +0000 (UTC) Received: from -enduser.GameBox.net (pcp03184855pcs.benslm01.pa.comcast.net [68.80.77.117]) by smtp-1.hotpop.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 235F02F8118 for ; Tue, 11 Feb 2003 23:14:35 +0000 (UTC) Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030211181908.03ae6ec0@pop.GameBox.net> X-Sender: JH_Radio@pop.GameBox.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 18:19:32 -0500 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: filters, tuners, and degrataion in sound Mime-Version: 1.0 X-HotPOP: ----------------------------------------------- Sent By HotPOP.com FREE Email Get your FREE POP email at www.HotPOP.com ----------------------------------------------- From: John X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113800107 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Yes. It does cause sound degradation. (Especially in the mid range) It can cause distortion if you make it to narrow like that on some receivers. Personally what I recommend is getting a tuner like the Yamaha T-85, putting a 280 KHZ filter in letter A, for super wide mode to sound good, and the rest 150 K filters for adjacent DX. If you go to 110 KHZ filters, it sounds like crud in my opinion. Then defeat the stereo muting to make the tuner come in stereo, even on the weakest signals. See, without defeating the stereo mute, the station have to be very strong to stay in stereo. Like to strong. With the stereo muting defeated, you can switch the station to mono if you wish to listen that way. Also, if you have the tuner set for stereo, it is in stereo as long as there is a signal. At 11:57 PM 2/10/03 -0800, you wrote: >> Changing FM filters for DXing is simple as can be. The filters have three >> legs. Check where the red dot is. Snip the legs off the old one. With the >> dot in the same direction, solder the legs on to where the old stubs are >> sticking out. >> >> You are done. > >I once found an even cooler suggestion on the Web: Unsolder the filters >and replace them with 3 pin SIP sockets. This way, you can easily swap >out different filters until you find the ones that work best for you. The >nice thing about the FM filters is that every one that I've seen is made >to work with source and load impedances of 330 ohms, so they're >interchangeable with no circuit modifications. No such luck is to be had >with 450/455 kHz AM filters. :( > >Before I go, just one stupid question: does narrowing the bandwidth to 110 >kHz cause noticeable distortion in the audio? Does the stereo separation >suffer greatly? > >Alfredo > > >Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Love in Christ: John Bensalem, PA Send me an email Aim: RainAngelsRule MSN: RainAngelsRule@hotmail.com My website Welcome to Napster4TheBlind "Prayer does not change God; it changes you." - Authur unknown [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From groucho@skyweb.net Tue Feb 11 15:17:36 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 11 Feb 2003 23:17:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 84601 invoked from network); 11 Feb 2003 23:17:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Feb 2003 23:17:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Feb 2003 23:17:34 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (tc1-32.skyweb.net [66.6.130.160]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h1BNRatl075748 for ; Tue, 11 Feb 2003 18:27:38 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3E498213.7A8F991@skyweb.net> Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 18:06:59 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: DXing References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Yes the FCC has been Notified. and they have Been warned already. Neal-CE WTTM 1680am stereo "bradleyj923 " wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "jsgilst " > wrote: > > A couple of nights ago I pulled in what appeared to > > be a Travelers Information Service out of Florida > > on 1680 AM. The adds were about the movie studio > > associated with Disney. It came skipping across > > the Gulf of Mexico to South East Texas. I did not > > hear any call letters brfore it fadded out. Just > > curious what kind of power they are running. > > > > JSG > > I believe you were hearing WTIR. Maybe someone else here knows for > sure, but they almost *have* to be running full power day and night. > Nine times out of ten they overpower both WTTM (which I have picked > up twice here in Indianapolis) and Jamz 1680 from Grand Rapids, MI. > > Has anyone ever called them about their power levels at night? > > Brad Jackson > Susquehanna, Indianapolis > WGLD/WGRL/WFMS > http://www.indyradio.com > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From JH_Radio@GameBox.net Tue Feb 11 15:19:00 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: JH_Radio@GameBox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 11 Feb 2003 23:18:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 20441 invoked from network); 11 Feb 2003 23:18:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Feb 2003 23:18:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO snickers.hotpop.com) (204.57.55.49) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Feb 2003 23:18:57 -0000 Received: from gamebox.net (kubrick.hotpop.com [204.57.55.16]) by snickers.hotpop.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 1893D7140B for ; Tue, 11 Feb 2003 23:18:48 +0000 (UTC) Received: from -enduser.GameBox.net (pcp03184855pcs.benslm01.pa.comcast.net [68.80.77.117]) by smtp-1.hotpop.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4700B2F8118 for ; Tue, 11 Feb 2003 23:16:45 +0000 (UTC) Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030211182116.03b0b570@pop.GameBox.net> X-Sender: JH_Radio@pop.GameBox.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 18:21:38 -0500 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Filter replacements Mime-Version: 1.0 X-HotPOP: ----------------------------------------------- Sent By HotPOP.com FREE Email Get your FREE POP email at www.HotPOP.com ----------------------------------------------- From: John X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113800107 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit More like this: If you are going to experiment with filters, and want to save yourself de soldering and soldering alot, then put the sockets in. I've experimented with lots and lots of Combinations of filters. I'm darn glad I had the sockets. At 08:37 AM 2/11/03 -0700, you wrote: >>Before I go, just one stupid question: does narrowing the bandwidth to 110 >>kHz cause noticeable distortion in the audio? Does the stereo separation >>suffer greatly? > >This is a depends answer.... > >It really depends on the number of filters in the receiver. If you have 2 or >less, no. If you have 3 it gets iffy and if you have 5 then probably. > >I have a Hafler 330 receiver and its modified with 5 110 kHz filters. >Sometimes it receives in stereo, sometimes not. This is a DX only receiver >for me and I can hear adjacents next to 100 kW flame throwers with this >setup. If you want to keep stereo and also be able to DX a little I would >not get less than 130. If I wanted to have more stereo but DX a little, I >would run 150 kHz filters. For DX nothing wider than that. > >If I wanted audiophile stuff, I would run 230 kHz. > >And yes, I know people who have put in the sockets to change filters. If you >have the time, its a good idea. > >Kevin >Mesa, Arizona > >This message has been composed of recycled electrons. None of these >electrons has been harmed or injured in the creation and transmission of >this message but they have been shamelessly exploited for this use. > > >Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Love in Christ: John Bensalem, PA Send me an email Aim: RainAngelsRule MSN: RainAngelsRule@hotmail.com My website Welcome to Napster4TheBlind "Prayer does not change God; it changes you." - Authur unknown [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From possumhunter@netzero.net Tue Feb 11 16:09:41 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 12 Feb 2003 00:09:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 10872 invoked from network); 12 Feb 2003 00:09:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Feb 2003 00:09:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.116) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Feb 2003 00:09:38 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 11 Feb 2003 16:09:38 -0800 To: References: <20030210030710.92959.qmail@web14205.mail.yahoo.com> <020301c2d0d1$bf6a6b40$9b8d70d1@dtaylor> Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM Stereo Radios Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2003 21:11:54 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 12 Feb 2003 00:09:38.0566 (UTC) FILETIME=[085EEA60:01C2D22B] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.155.201.76] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Dave Taylor wrote: > The other one I have is a late '80's aftermarket unit made by Sherwood. It's the CRD 350 model AM Stereo/FM Stereo Cassette. I had a CRD-350 myself. It was a wonderful sounding radio, too bad it got killed in a fiery wreck, in my mint condition '83 Mustang GT Convertible :-( > > Unfortunately the final output amplifier is not working but I know what replacement IC it takes and it can be repaired. Forgive me if my numbers are wrong as it has been over 16 years since I was in the car audio business, but I *THINK* you can swap the output amp IC to a Delco DM-133 for better sound. Forgive me if my Delco number is wrong. Kevin From dnktaylor@yahoo.com Tue Feb 11 16:21:22 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dnktaylor@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 12 Feb 2003 00:21:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 16159 invoked from network); 12 Feb 2003 00:21:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Feb 2003 00:21:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO smtp018.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.174.115) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Feb 2003 00:21:22 -0000 Received: from 151-pm11.nwc.alaska.net (HELO dtaylor) (dnktaylor@209.112.140.151 with login) by smtp.mail.vip.sc5.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Feb 2003 00:21:20 -0000 Message-ID: <03d901c2d22c$adee8840$9b8d70d1@dtaylor> To: References: <20030210030710.92959.qmail@web14205.mail.yahoo.com> <020301c2d0d1$bf6a6b40$9b8d70d1@dtaylor> Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM Stereo Radios Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 15:21:20 -0900 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Dave Taylor" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=131000527 X-Yahoo-Profile: dnktaylor Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit The CRD-350 I have has two TDA2005 output IC's. According to a cross reference chart an NTE 1396 is the replacement for those IC's. When I've powered up the unit I can tell the Radio and Cassette are functioning normally; the seek functions work properly on the radio and everthing else seems to work except there isn't any audio output. I've ordered 2 NTE 1396's to try and get the audio again. It's too bad the AM stations here turned off the C-Quam exciters so, unless I build my own, all there is on AM is mono and most of it is Talk Radio. Dave ----- Original Message ----- From: Possum Hunter To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, February 10, 2003 5:11 PM Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM Stereo Radios Dave Taylor wrote: > The other one I have is a late '80's aftermarket unit made by Sherwood. It's the CRD 350 model AM Stereo/FM Stereo Cassette. I had a CRD-350 myself. It was a wonderful sounding radio, too bad it got killed in a fiery wreck, in my mint condition '83 Mustang GT Convertible :-( > > Unfortunately the final output amplifier is not working but I know what replacement IC it takes and it can be repaired. Forgive me if my numbers are wrong as it has been over 16 years since I was in the car audio business, but I *THINK* you can swap the output amp IC to a Delco DM-133 for better sound. Forgive me if my Delco number is wrong. Kevin Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From KC4QLP@aol.com Tue Feb 11 16:40:52 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 12 Feb 2003 00:40:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 48697 invoked from network); 12 Feb 2003 00:40:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Feb 2003 00:40:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r08.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.104) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Feb 2003 00:40:49 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.21.2b79b6d2 (4362) for ; Tue, 11 Feb 2003 19:40:41 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <21.2b79b6d2.2b7af208@aol.com> Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 19:40:40 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: DXing To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 2/11/03 6:22:05 PM Eastern Standard Time, groucho@skyweb.net writes: << Yes the FCC has been Notified. and they have Been warned already. Neal-CE WTTM 1680am stereo >> Does the state of Flordia own that high powered bag of wind waste of spectrum TIS? Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- Subscribe send an email to amstereo-subscribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net _______________________________________________________ From groucho@skyweb.net Tue Feb 11 16:50:50 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 12 Feb 2003 00:50:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 35429 invoked from network); 12 Feb 2003 00:50:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Feb 2003 00:50:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Feb 2003 00:50:49 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (tc1-32.skyweb.net [66.6.130.160]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h1C10stl008644 for ; Tue, 11 Feb 2003 20:00:54 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3E4997E9.1BB28D18@skyweb.net> Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 19:40:09 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: DXing References: <21.2b79b6d2.2b7af208@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 the florida department Of transportation but you see they can get away with it.. because its Jebb Bush's DOT.. all it takes is a phone call to his Brother George W down In washington DC and Or daddy... and a simple Hey FCC.. Leave that station alone.. Its a done Deal they can do what the Hell they want... 10kw or 20kw how about 50kw.... we want every state in the Nation to Hear I on the 4's......1 kw at night thats unheard of..... we are the State DOT station and we Need Full power to cover the state... please hand Me a puke bag.. Neal KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 2/11/03 6:22:05 PM Eastern Standard Time, > groucho@skyweb.net writes: > > << Yes the FCC has been Notified. and they have Been warned already. > Neal-CE > WTTM 1680am stereo > >> > Does the state of Flordia own that high powered bag of wind waste of spectrum > TIS? > > Bob Carter > Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group > > WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 > Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 > > Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering > services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. > e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net > Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC > WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC > WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC > Ray Communications Radio Network > > AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- > Subscribe send an email to amstereo-subscribe@topica.com > > KC4QLP Amateur Radio > Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va > www.kc4qlp.cjb.net > _______________________________________________________ > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From KC4QLP@aol.com Tue Feb 11 17:04:19 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 12 Feb 2003 01:04:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 14406 invoked from network); 12 Feb 2003 01:04:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Feb 2003 01:04:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r08.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.104) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Feb 2003 01:04:17 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.123.1e101173 (4362) for ; Tue, 11 Feb 2003 20:03:27 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <123.1e101173.2b7af75e@aol.com> Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 20:03:26 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: DXing To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 2/11/03 7:52:39 PM Eastern Standard Time, groucho@skyweb.net writes: << the florida department Of transportation but you see they can get away with it.. >> How long ago was the complaint filed? Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- Subscribe send an email to amstereo-subscribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net _______________________________________________________ From rwagoner1@mac.com Tue Feb 11 17:05:58 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner1@mac.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 12 Feb 2003 01:05:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 49346 invoked from network); 12 Feb 2003 01:05:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Feb 2003 01:05:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO fed1mtao05.cox.net) (68.6.19.126) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Feb 2003 01:05:55 -0000 Received: from mac.com ([68.4.33.253]) by fed1mtao05.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20030212010550.PGSN27824.fed1mtao05.cox.net@mac.com> for ; Tue, 11 Feb 2003 20:05:50 -0500 Message-ID: <3E499DF2.3010006@mac.com> Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 17:05:54 -0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20021120 Netscape/7.01 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Delco AMAX (vs. Chrysler AMAX) References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Richard Wagoner X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135738921 X-Yahoo-Profile: richardalanwagoner > > That's not the way mine worked. It gave full bandwidth even with > > mono. > > Then you probably have an older Delco (non-Expanded Band, non-AMAX). > These will give a fixed choice of Narrow or Wide bandwidth depending > on whether you push in the "AM ST" button or not. But AM Stereo > reception is still restricted to Wide mode only. You are right, sir. Mine did not have expanded band. I don't really understand the complaint re: AM stereo reception limited to wide mode only. I HATE narrow mode, and the only reason I'd listen is if interference required it. I'd rather have wideband mono than narrow band stereo any day. From groucho@skyweb.net Tue Feb 11 17:12:39 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 12 Feb 2003 01:12:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 11250 invoked from network); 12 Feb 2003 01:12:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Feb 2003 01:12:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Feb 2003 01:12:38 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (tc1-32.skyweb.net [66.6.130.160]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h1C1Mgtl016740 for ; Tue, 11 Feb 2003 20:22:42 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3E499D04.E32557E7@skyweb.net> Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 20:01:56 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: DXing References: <123.1e101173.2b7af75e@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 well Checking my Emails.. they were contacted in June, July. October, November,....of 2002 KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 2/11/03 7:52:39 PM Eastern Standard Time, > groucho@skyweb.net writes: > > << the florida department Of transportation but you see they can get away > with it.. >> > > How long ago was the complaint filed? > > Bob Carter > Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group > > WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 > Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 > > Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering > services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. > e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net > Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC > WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC > WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC > Ray Communications Radio Network > > AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- > Subscribe send an email to amstereo-subscribe@topica.com > > KC4QLP Amateur Radio > Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va > www.kc4qlp.cjb.net > _______________________________________________________ > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From rwagoner1@mac.com Tue Feb 11 17:17:31 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner1@mac.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 12 Feb 2003 01:17:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 24237 invoked from network); 12 Feb 2003 01:17:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Feb 2003 01:17:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO fed1mtao03.cox.net) (68.6.19.242) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Feb 2003 01:17:31 -0000 Received: from mac.com ([68.4.33.253]) by fed1mtao03.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20030212011727.PLMO23888.fed1mtao03.cox.net@mac.com> for ; Tue, 11 Feb 2003 20:17:27 -0500 Message-ID: <3E49A0AA.7080708@mac.com> Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 17:17:30 -0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20021120 Netscape/7.01 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Digital vs. Analog References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Richard Wagoner X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135738921 X-Yahoo-Profile: richardalanwagoner > ENIAC, the great computer built in the 1940's, was decimal- Base 10. Probably the computer Los Angeles Unified uses for its student information databases. Or else a Univac. Richard (LAUSD Math Teacher) From powell@conterra.com Tue Feb 11 17:25:10 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: powell@conterra.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 12 Feb 2003 01:25:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 53249 invoked from network); 12 Feb 2003 01:25:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Feb 2003 01:25:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO ziggy.conterra.com) (66.112.206.20) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Feb 2003 01:25:09 -0000 Received: from ziggy.conterra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ziggy.conterra.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h1C1P5Zn094667 for ; Tue, 11 Feb 2003 20:25:06 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from powell@conterra.com) Received: (from www@localhost) by ziggy.conterra.com (8.12.6/8.12.6/Submit) id h1C1P4tF094664 for amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com; Tue, 11 Feb 2003 20:25:04 -0500 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: ziggy.conterra.com: www set sender to powell@conterra.com using -f Received: from 66.112.193.113 ( [66.112.193.113]) as user powell@mail.conterra.com by ziggy.conterra.com with HTTP; Tue, 11 Feb 2003 20:25:04 -0500 Message-ID: <1045013104.3e49a2704ab8c@ziggy.conterra.com> Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 20:25:04 -0500 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: DIGIKull References: <1045008581.4042.10892.m9@yahoogroups.com> In-Reply-To: <1045008581.4042.10892.m9@yahoogroups.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) 3.1 From: powell@conterra.com X-Originating-IP: 66.112.193.113 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=8062869 X-Yahoo-Profile: W4OPW The dumb kids think digital even if it sounds horrrrrid is better than analog. And look at the stupid cheap devices on the market today to supposedly attempt to reproduce RF getting to them....ah....through a speaker. IBOC will NOT have ANY reasonable quality until analog goes. FM with NO analog is about 92 Kb. Somewhere in the mid 60's with analog. The MW is somewhere around 48KB... I may be wrong on this, but it won't sound acceptable without analog gone. If IBIQUITY had use the same ( I can't ever get right who owns AAC and PAC) one the DRM is using it would do skywave, as that's what it's intended to do. But they used the one Lucent came up with. Currently there are 4800 some AM stations. For IBOC to have a whisper of maybe working ....4000 of them need to go. And then there will be large areas of the US with no radio coverage. And you can mandate a very short end to analog and then make it illegal to own analog stuff and then you have TOTAL control over what the listener can hear. And in DTV you can put in a digital flag to prevent recording, or allow record once, play once or a couple times....and then auto delete. It's all about CONTROL and profits. Powell ------------------------------------------------- This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/ From florida_amstereo@hotmail.com Tue Feb 11 17:39:07 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: florida_amstereo@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 12 Feb 2003 01:39:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 86818 invoked from network); 12 Feb 2003 01:39:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Feb 2003 01:39:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.37.68) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Feb 2003 01:39:04 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 11 Feb 2003 17:39:04 -0800 Received: from 209.240.198.61 by pv2fd.pav2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Wed, 12 Feb 2003 01:39:03 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Digital Radios for sale? Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 01:39:03 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 12 Feb 2003 01:39:04.0442 (UTC) FILETIME=[86AE9DA0:01C2D237] From: "Donn Tillman" X-Originating-IP: [209.240.198.61] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83914824 I certainly like to keep up with the times and don't want to have any obsolete analogue radios around....... so if I take all of my radios and donate them to a museum tomorrow (or maybe Thursday or Friday!)-- as someone suggested; where would I purchase a digital radio? (short of going to Canada for a DAB radio from Radio Shack or BestBuy.Canada? (Then I would have a digital radio, but no stations to listen to, since I cannot pick up CHUM,Toronto from here, but at least I could brag, that I'm "with it" and have a digital radio! :) ) Then once I purchase it, hopefully right away, since I will have donated my radios to a museum, could you tell me what stations I could listen to?; I'm not aware of any stations in the U.S. closer than WOR broadcasting in the digital mode and thanks to WAQI- 710- Miami and 710 Radio Havana, I cannot pick up WOR here. Are there any radio stations in the Bahamas or Cuba that are broadcasting digitally at this time or will be before the end of February? Otherwise, I think it might be premature to say that the analogue radios only belong in museums..... maybe in 3 or 4 years, but now? donn st petersburg,fl _________________________________________________________________ Add photos to your e-mail with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail From KC4QLP@aol.com Tue Feb 11 17:53:16 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 12 Feb 2003 01:53:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 59615 invoked from network); 12 Feb 2003 01:53:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Feb 2003 01:53:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r02.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.98) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Feb 2003 01:53:14 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.57.17f84a39 (4362) for ; Tue, 11 Feb 2003 20:52:56 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <57.17f84a39.2b7b02f8@aol.com> Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 20:52:56 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: DXing To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 2/11/03 8:14:10 PM Eastern Standard Time, groucho@skyweb.net writes: << well Checking my Emails.. they were contacted in June, July. October, November,....of 2002 >> Hmmm ( ponders and drums fingers on desk ) Do you have anyone in that area that could file a complaint that is in that area? I've made complaints before concerning local issues and got an immediate response. It could be that the FCC isnt taking your complaint serious given your location and the location of the offending station. I know it shouldnt work like that but stranger things have happened I'm sure. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.qsl.net/kc4qlp Echolink node # 56704 -- 146.590 VHF,440.850 UHF (PL 131.8) _______________________________________________________ From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Feb 11 17:59:43 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 12 Feb 2003 01:59:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 79818 invoked from network); 12 Feb 2003 01:59:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Feb 2003 01:59:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Feb 2003 01:59:42 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.171] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 12 Feb 2003 01:59:42 -0000 Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 01:59:42 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Delco AMAX (vs. Chrysler AMAX) Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3E499DF2.3010006@mac.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 962 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 207.200.162.185 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > I don't really understand the complaint re: AM stereo reception > limited to wide mode only. I HATE narrow mode, and the only reason > I'd listen is if interference required it. I'd rather have wideband > mono than narrow band stereo any day. In wideband mode, the Delco just doesn't have the selectivity to receive a weak station located adjacent to a strong station. For example, in order to hear DX of 760 WJR against local 770 WABC, I have to switch it to Narrow mode -- and then I can't receive WJR in Stereo, as I would if it allowed use of narrow-band Stereo mode. I have found the early pre-AMAX/pre-Expanded Band Chrysler radios to have a very good compromise between selectivity and audio fidelity. I had mine set up the other night and I had no trouble receiving 720 WGN from Chicago in Stereo right next to local 710 WOR (at night with their IBOC off, of course). I believe these older Chrysler radios use a fixed 6 kHz ceramic filter. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Feb 11 18:04:27 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 12 Feb 2003 02:04:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 93995 invoked from network); 12 Feb 2003 02:04:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Feb 2003 02:04:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Feb 2003 02:04:27 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.158] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 12 Feb 2003 02:04:27 -0000 Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 02:04:25 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: DIGIKull Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <1045013104.3e49a2704ab8c@ziggy.conterra.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 639 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 207.200.162.185 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics Full implementation of digital broadcasting (through IBOC or otherwise) will also mean the end of truly LIVE radio. Hybrid digital/analog IBOC has an inherent delay of at least 8.5 seconds, which makes it unsuitable for sports play-by-play unless the analog signal is allowed to un-synch from the digital and be broadcast as quickly as the station's air-chain allows -- although, as compared to a fully analog station, the inherent delay of a digital air-chain can still be as much as half a second. Although rare these days, TV/radio simulcasts will also become a headache to synch up -- not to mention New Year's count-downs! From fanfare@globility.com Tue Feb 11 18:59:46 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 12 Feb 2003 02:59:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 75473 invoked from network); 12 Feb 2003 02:59:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Feb 2003 02:59:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Feb 2003 02:59:45 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.176] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 12 Feb 2003 02:59:45 -0000 Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 02:59:43 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: DIGIKull Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <1045013104.3e49a2704ab8c@ziggy.conterra.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 845 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Mr.M S " X-Originating-IP: 64.56.233.141 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, powell@c... wrote: > The dumb kids think digital even if it sounds horrrrrid is better than analog. > And look at the stupid cheap devices on the market today to supposedly attempt > to reproduce RF getting to them....ah....through a speaker. > > > > It's all about CONTROL and profits. > > > Powell My thoughts; Technical proficiency of the recordist notwithstanding; "Digital can be anything it wants to be ... except the original. Analog can't be anything else." However, the Reference direct-to-CD recordings of Richard Hyman playing Fats Waller and Duke Ellington give digital one helluva good name. Too bad radio isn't headed in that direction. Also, re your last comment Powell, seems the same sense was prevailing in 1998. "http://www.fanfare.com/dab-nws.html" M.S. From amymousie@yahoo.com Tue Feb 11 19:27:47 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 12 Feb 2003 03:27:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 75974 invoked from network); 12 Feb 2003 03:27:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Feb 2003 03:27:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.70) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Feb 2003 03:27:45 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.177] by n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 12 Feb 2003 03:27:45 -0000 Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 03:27:42 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: DIGIKull Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <1045013104.3e49a2704ab8c@ziggy.conterra.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2112 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 64.175.245.80 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, powell@c... wrote: =snip= > analog gone. If IBIQUITY had use the same ( I can't ever get right who owns > AAC and PAC) one the DRM is using it would do skywave, as that's what it's > intended to do. But they used the one Lucent came up with. AAC is owned by FHG of Germany, the same patent-holders of MP3. PAC is owned by Lucent. The codec issue is only half the problem, since there is also the matter of modulating the digital signal. DRM, like E147, uses COFDM carriers (DRM being more-or-less a subset of E147 in design), whereas IBOC uses a proprietary modulation scheme that is incompatible with COFDM, although DRM adopted it as an alternative. For IBOC, both the codec and modulation system are proprietary, and highly unlikely to be opened up publicly anytime soon, and once it does, iBiquity will lose all incentive to support it. Once the patent exclusivity clause expires, gone is iBiquity's ability to sell lisences at blackmail rates. (COFDM has long been the backbone of the European GSM cellphone system, and for all that GSM users outside of the USA have complained about, it's a better, more robust system than the non-GSM digital cellphone system we've had here in America.) In otrher words, planned obsolescence with no long-term foundations.....unlike the GE/Zenith FM stereo system, that upon introduction, was fully opened up publicly, and thousands of electronics hobbyists and tinkerers built their own receivers and transmitters right from the start. IBOC, as it stands now, is mediocre, causes interference, and has no alternatives made available. This makes IBOC a nightmare for - everyone-, and does not make allowance for any industrial collapse or similar catastrophe, of which out nation is now so vulnerable to. Digital has its place, and can be a good medium- I have -NEVER- said I'm anti-digital- All I see of IBOC is one big nightmare being imposed on everyone, and can be devastating to the public infrastructure if mandated. Stop the madness now: Just say "NO" to IBOC! ==PLEASE!!== Amy. <:3 )~~~ From dav259@csiro.au Tue Feb 11 20:32:21 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 12 Feb 2003 04:32:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 83115 invoked from network); 12 Feb 2003 04:32:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Feb 2003 04:32:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Feb 2003 04:32:18 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1C4WHR19075 for ; Wed, 12 Feb 2003 15:32:17 +1100 (EST) Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 15:32:17 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: DIGIKull In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=112635033 X-Yahoo-Profile: dav259 On Wed, 12 Feb 2003, Kevin T. wrote: > Although rare these days, TV/radio simulcasts will also become a > headache to synch up -- not to mention New Year's count-downs! Since we've had digital TV - the analog signal has been delayed waiting for the digital signal to catch up - so listening to the exciting radio coverage while watching (analog) TV is a thing of the past. You will see a player running towards the goal and the radio will yell out "he kicks for goal - and he's missed for just a point" and on the TV the football is yet to leave his boot. Damn annoying! From jsgil@hal-pc.org Tue Feb 11 20:47:53 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 12 Feb 2003 04:47:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 91139 invoked from network); 12 Feb 2003 04:47:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Feb 2003 04:47:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Feb 2003 04:47:53 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.146] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 12 Feb 2003 04:47:53 -0000 Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 04:47:53 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} End IBOC-DAB Now! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <006801c2d1cc$a0e08f00$0202a8c0@primary> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2686 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.214 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Don Johnson" wrote: > Well I agree with you, John :) > > My big problem with IBOC is the royalties issue. Broadcast standards > should be open, and government shouldn't adopt an official standard > where broadcasters have to pay a monopoly for the rights to use the > mandated standard. There is nothing wrong with Digital, there should be > concern with IBOC. > > This anti-digital nonsense sounds like people trying to preserve > mechanical television in the 30's. The beginning of the sound at the > microphone and the end of the sound at the ear may be analog, but > digital is clearly the most effective and most efficient way of > transmitting it. It is also the ONLY way we are going to get AM Stereo > and hi-fidelity sound for broadcast radio. I will agree with this for images and such when there are several information streams all funneled into one datastream like what is done for satellite TV. While one stream requiring a low bitrate to update a very static image the unused bandwidth and be allocated for a fast motion image. This trade off allows the digital spectrum to be used effeciently and TV type signals lend themselves very well to this. Audio on the other hand has a less dynamic bitstream where the most demanding audio may require 35% or so more bandwidth than a quiet passage and at the most a 10:1 compression may produce an acceptable signal but the available datarate for IBOC AM nowhere meets this need for an FM Stereo quality signal. As a result the signal suffers from overcompression and will sound like a bad MP3 when they first came out. With some the latest MP3 encoders using a good bitrate to produce a natural sounding signal you can get an FM Stereo quality signal but they are never going to do this. Both Satellite Radio and Eureka can take advantage of various signals sharing the datastream to get the maximum advantage out of it. Eureka with its 192kbps data rate sounds pretty good but Sirius and XM use use a much lower datarate with SBR. Digital does not always mean better if the proper bitrate is not used to faithfully reporduce the signal. From my experience the bandwidth needed to faithfully reproduce an audio signal may be slightly more effecient using 70% the bandwidth necessary for analog audio but may shrink to be slightly less effecient for a high demanding program material. If there was such an improvement in sound quality as seen when CDs came out to the records and tapes then I think it would be a good sell for digital radio but the background noise issues of analog are being traded for digital atrifacts and is not an improvement in my opinion. JSG From jbyrns@enteract.com Tue Feb 11 21:15:34 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 12 Feb 2003 05:15:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 16184 invoked from network); 12 Feb 2003 05:15:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Feb 2003 05:15:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.89) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Feb 2003 05:15:33 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.139] by n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 12 Feb 2003 05:15:33 -0000 Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 05:15:30 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: DIGIKull Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1233 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.30 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "amymousie " < amymousie@y...> wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, powell@c... wrote: > > If IBIQUITY had use the same ( I can't ever get right who owns > > AAC and PAC) one the DRM is using it would do skywave, as that's > > what it's intended to do. I'm not sure why anyone would need or want to "do skywave"? > The codec issue is only half the problem, since there is also the > matter of modulating the digital signal. DRM, like E147, uses COFDM > carriers (DRM being more-or-less a subset of E147 in design), > whereas IBOC uses a proprietary modulation scheme that is > incompatible with COFDM, although DRM adopted it as an alternative. As I understand it "HD radio" uses OFDM. I'm not sure exactly what the differences are between OFDM and COFDM, could you explain? > (COFDM has long been the backbone of the European GSM cellphone > system, and for all that GSM users outside of the USA have > complained about, it's a better, more robust system than the > non-GSM digital cellphone system we've had here in America.) I was not aware that the European GSM cellphone system used COFDM, could you provide a reference to back this claim up? John From jsgil@hal-pc.org Tue Feb 11 21:39:20 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 12 Feb 2003 05:39:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 2496 invoked from network); 12 Feb 2003 05:39:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Feb 2003 05:39:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Feb 2003 05:39:19 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.128] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 12 Feb 2003 05:39:19 -0000 Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 05:39:17 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} End IBOC-DAB Now! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2369 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.214 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " wrote: > > "driving the smaller broadcasters out of buisness" is perhaps the most > beneficial effect IBOC could have. The AM band has become way too > crowded over the last half century, and anything that can be done to > eliminate a large number of the existing stations can only be good. > In my view the number of stations needs to be cut back to level that > existed in 1949. In addition to greatly reducing the number of > stations, I would like to see the elimination of the class A stations, > by reclassifying them to class B status. This would allow moving some > of the remaining stations to the less congested channels, further > reducing interference in the primary coverage area of many stations. > A less densely populated band would also allow many of the complex and > aggressive directional arrays to be replaced by simpler arrays. > > John Well if the AM band is too crowded now then it is the FCC's own fault for giving out these licenses in the 1st place. Some of these smaller stations do survive well on their own and serve nicth markets. If the FCC wants to reduce the crowding of AM stations then they should do it in a manner that continues to allow them serve their community. Don't ask me how FCC can do this but the bigger broadcasters don't have the right to drive the smaller ones out of buisness by FCC edict. If this happens then it only goes to show that the big broadcasters have the best FCC money can buy. Are these stations going to be compensated for their loss so they can pay off any loans for their equipment and other things? I think not. They will be out of luck stuck with loans and no revenue stream to pay for them. This is the perfect example of why irrational decisions of allowing too many stations creates problems and all the more reason to be cautious of decisions like IBOC. Yea, IBOC can be used to thin out the number of AM stations but it will be jumping out of the frying pan and into the fire. I won't disagree that there are too many statios on AM but once the licenses are given out it's pretty hard to renig and take the licenses away unless they are guilty of gross violations. This was a stipid mistake the FCC made that we have to live with. Let's just hope they don't make another one with IBOC. JSG From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Feb 11 21:51:36 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 12 Feb 2003 05:51:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 29828 invoked from network); 12 Feb 2003 05:51:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Feb 2003 05:51:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Feb 2003 05:51:35 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.167] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 12 Feb 2003 05:51:35 -0000 Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 05:51:32 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: OT: More Magic Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3E49A0AA.7080708@mac.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3081 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.83.9 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Probably the computer Los Angeles Unified uses for its student > information databases. Or else a Univac. Speaking of really old computers, this is always one of my favorite stories: > > > > Some years ago I was snooping around in the cabinets that housed the MIT AI Lab's PDP-10, and noticed a little switch glued to the frame of one cabinet. It was obviously a homebrew job, added by one of the lab's hardware hackers (no one know who). You don't touch an unknown switch on a computer without knowing what it does, because you might crash the computer. The switch was labeled in a most unhelpful way. It had two positions, and scrawled in pencil on the metal switch body were the words "magic" and "more magic". The switch was in the "more magic" position. I called another hacker over to look at it. He had never seen the switch before either. Closer examination revealed that the switch only had one wire running to it! The other end of the wire did disappear into the maze of wires inside the computer, but it's a basic fact of electricity that a switch can't do anything unless there are two wires connected to it. This switch had a wire connected on one side and no wire on its other side. It was clear that this switch was someone's idea of a silly joke. Convinced by our reasoning that the switch was inoperative, we flipped it. The computer instantly crashed. Imagine our utter astonishment. We wrote it off as coincidence, but nevertheless restored the switch to the "more magic" position before reviving the computer. A year later, I told this story to yet another hacker, David Moon as I recall. He clearly doubted my sanity, or suspected me of a supernatural belief in the power of this switch, or perhaps thought I was fooling him with a bogus saga. To prove it to him, I showed him the very switch, still glued to the cabinet frame with only one wire connected to it, still in the "more magic" position. We scrutinized the switch and its lone connection, and found that the other end of the wire, though connected to the computer wiring, was connected to a ground pin. That clearly made the switch doubly useless: not only was it electrically nonoperative, but it was connected to a place that couldn't affect anything anyway. So we flipped the switch. The computer promptly crashed. This time we ran for Richard Greenblatt, a long-time MIT hacker, who was close at hand. He had never noticed the switch before, either. He inspected it, concluded it was useless, got some diagonal cutters and diked it out. We then revived the computer and it ran fine ever since. We still don't know how the switch crashed the machine. There is a theory that some circuit near the ground pin was marginal, and flipping the switch changed the electrical capacitance enough to upset the circuit as millionth-of-a-second pulses went through it. But we'll never know for sure; all we can really say is that the switch was MAGIC. I still have that switch in my basement. Maybe I'm silly, but I keep it set on "more magic." < < < < From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Feb 11 22:07:41 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 12 Feb 2003 06:07:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 37896 invoked from network); 12 Feb 2003 06:07:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Feb 2003 06:07:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Feb 2003 06:07:40 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.251] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 12 Feb 2003 06:07:40 -0000 Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 06:07:38 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: DIGIKull Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 805 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.83.9 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > For IBOC, both the codec and modulation system are proprietary, and > highly unlikely to be opened up publicly anytime soon The IBOC exciter is essentially based on a PC running Linux, whose remote control is a 300-baud modem hooked up to a phone line, so that it can be dialed up and sent commands (i.e. "turn off IBOC carriers now!"). So, all it would take is knowledge of the exciter's phone number, and a talented hacker could have a free IBOC exciter running at home on his own Linux PC. In any event is it very telling that iBiquity specifies use of the 300-baud modem in order to ensure maximum reliability. Hmmm... a digital data stream operating over a noise-prone analog medium, that needs to be run very conservatively in order to make it work... why does this sound familiar? From amymousie@yahoo.com Tue Feb 11 22:07:52 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 12 Feb 2003 06:07:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 15854 invoked from network); 12 Feb 2003 06:07:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Feb 2003 06:07:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Feb 2003 06:07:51 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.190] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 12 Feb 2003 06:07:51 -0000 Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 06:07:47 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: DIGIKull Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 608 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 64.175.245.80 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "amymousie " < > amymousie@y...> wrote: > > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, powell@c... wrote: > > > If IBIQUITY had use the same ( I can't ever get right who owns > > > AAC and PAC) one the DRM is using it would do skywave, as that's > > > what it's intended to do. > > I'm not sure why anyone would need or want to "do skywave"? Someone who doesn't "get" DX? No, no... I'm going to leave this alone... It'll be nothing more than a dead end. Amy. <:3 )~~~ From fredymcc@digitel.net Tue Feb 11 22:08:11 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: fredymcc@digitel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 12 Feb 2003 06:08:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 40714 invoked from network); 12 Feb 2003 06:08:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Feb 2003 06:08:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO grebe.mail.pas.earthlink.net) (207.217.120.46) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Feb 2003 06:08:10 -0000 Received: from 209-239-215-238.lax.jps.net ([209.239.215.238] helo=[209.239.215.136]) by grebe.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 18iq41-00076r-00 for amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com; Tue, 11 Feb 2003 22:08:09 -0800 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: fredymcc@digitel.net@mail.digitel.net Message-Id: Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2003 22:07:29 -0800 To: Subject: HD Radio Front End From: "Fred Y. McCutcheon" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=80587106 X-Yahoo-Profile: eighthmoon Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit A question re the internals of the HD radio. Does the HD receiver have 2 physical sections, an analog RF front end and then the TI chip which takes the output of the IF strip and does the HD magic? Or is the whole shebang in the TI chip, thereby standardizing the performance of all HD radios at that chip's level? An early schematic indicated a multipart construction but I have not seen anything definitive. Any information would be appreciated. Thanks, Fred McCutcheon [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From jsgil@hal-pc.org Tue Feb 11 22:18:47 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 12 Feb 2003 06:18:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 60662 invoked from network); 12 Feb 2003 06:18:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Feb 2003 06:18:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.78) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Feb 2003 06:18:46 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.128] by n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 12 Feb 2003 06:18:46 -0000 Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 06:18:46 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: DIGIKull Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 527 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.214 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "amymousie " wrote: > > (COFDM has long been the backbone of the European GSM cellphone > system, and for all that GSM users outside of the USA have complained > about, it's a better, more robust system than the non-GSM digital > cellphone system we've had here in America.) > I have to say that the codec used for CDMA has a crummy sound. I dropped my CDMA service and went GSM and it sounds much clearer, almost as good as Bell Labs Mu-Law. JSG From amymousie@yahoo.com Tue Feb 11 22:30:25 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 12 Feb 2003 06:30:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 94455 invoked from network); 12 Feb 2003 06:30:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Feb 2003 06:30:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.68) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Feb 2003 06:30:23 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.171] by n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 12 Feb 2003 06:30:23 -0000 Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 06:30:21 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: DIGIKull Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 529 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 64.175.245.80 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "jsgilst " wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "amymousie " > wrote: =snip= > I have to say that the codec used for CDMA has a crummy sound. > I dropped my CDMA service and went GSM and it sounds much clearer, > almost as good as Bell Labs Mu-Law. It -is- a good mono codec. I've played around with GSM 6.10 on PCs over the last, oh, 6 years or so. Too bad I have never heard of a stereo GSM codec. Amy. <:3 )~~~ From amstereo@optushome.com.au Wed Feb 12 00:21:50 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereo@optushome.com.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 12 Feb 2003 08:21:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 56382 invoked from network); 12 Feb 2003 08:21:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Feb 2003 08:21:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail016.syd.optusnet.com.au) (210.49.20.174) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Feb 2003 08:21:50 -0000 Received: from unit (c17190.ipswc1.qld.optusnet.com.au [210.49.44.50]) by mail016.syd.optusnet.com.au (8.11.1/8.11.1) with SMTP id h1C8LmX31164 for ; Wed, 12 Feb 2003 19:21:48 +1100 Message-ID: <000c01c2d26f$cbe54bc0$1b02a8c0@unit> To: References: <1044976264.300.54770.m12@yahoogroups.com> Subject: amstereo gone from 2BS Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 18:21:52 +1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1123 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1123 From: "amstereo - matt2" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=105920058 X-Yahoo-Profile: voltar_e My message Hi, my names Matt from queensland, i on occassion listen to your station via skywave and normally in stereo. it would appear to me that you have recently dropped the transmission of your stereo signal. this is unfortunate as i knew how passionate you are / were about your stereo signal. you run a very good station, but music on AM sounds so UN-convincing when it's in plain mono. i'm sorry to find out that you dropped it, Because the only music stations that broadcast Stereo on AM (that are semi-local to me) is 4GR, 4AK dropped theres last year due to noise that appered in there signal some times when stereo was in operation. Melbourn is now the only city in australia that fully supports stereo. Out of curiosity (alot of wishfull thinking) would you still have the old am stereo generator, and would you be willing to donate it to a community station in brisbane Queensland? the station is i1197 which is due to come back on air soon (after donating there transmitter site to Radio 4BH after there towers were cut down last year). They would be really interested in the donation of this i believe, I want to help them as much as possible, they are going to try and appeal to the younger teens, and because they are on AM they will need all the help they can get. anyone can provide music on AM but new music in mono just isn't right. I am apart of an am stereo movement board and we are in the process of developing an am stereo radio, just need a way to press the casing. Thank you for your time, and i hope you can help. cheers and thanks, Matt. ------------------------------------ Add-server blockout list www.angelfire.com/va/thecomputermaker/hosts.txt ----------------------------------- REPLY From: Jason Davis To: amstereo@optushome.com.au Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2003 11:18 AM Subject: AM Stereo Yes we have turned our AM stereo off (About May last year) You are about the 5th person to e-mail me about it. We turned it of when I installed a new 5Kw Blyth Solid State transmitter. I am looking at how I can get AM Stereo working on this new transmitter. Would like to know how you go with your AM Stereo receiver ! IF WE CAN help this guy, maybe it will return? From dav259@csiro.au Wed Feb 12 00:38:37 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 12 Feb 2003 08:38:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 3565 invoked from network); 12 Feb 2003 08:38:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Feb 2003 08:38:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Feb 2003 08:38:34 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1C8cXR29467 for ; Wed, 12 Feb 2003 19:38:33 +1100 (EST) Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 19:38:33 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Subject: New radio spectrum In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=112635033 X-Yahoo-Profile: dav259 On Wed, 12 Feb 2003, jsgilst wrote: > Well if the AM band is too crowded now then it is the FCC's own fault > for giving out these licenses in the 1st place. Some of these smaller > stations do survive well on their own and serve nicth markets. And salutations to them! They are serving their markets well. > Yea, IBOC can be used > to thin out the number of AM stations but it will be jumping out of > the frying pan and into the fire. I won't disagree that there are > too many stations on AM but once the licenses are given out it's > pretty hard to renig and take the licenses away unless they are guilty > of gross violations. This was a stipid mistake the FCC made that we > have to live with. Let's just hope they don't make another one with > IBOC. From what I can see from a distance - they already have. This intro of IBOC seems to me more stupid than the 'market driven' intro of multiple AM stereo systems. But at least all the AMS systems actually worked. The FCC is supposed to be the regulator. Then why doesn't it regulate? It must be seen by Clear Channel as a joke - or somewhere they can throw a bit of nebulous money at from several of its seemingly loss making endeavours. A bookkeepers can of worms. The FCC should be performing a public (regulating) service! I'm with Kevin R (I think - if I understand correctly). Give digital radio the spectrum of one TV channel eg. Channel 1. Let seven or eight new radio stations operate Eureka DAB on it in each market. Let the current AM and FM licencees compete with new entrants in an auction of these licences. If current licencees get any new stations - then their old stations should be put up for grabs. (They shouldn't own both!) Some would be bought - for all the right reasons! - and others may go quiet. But the net result would be more (certainly not fewer) radio stations. The elite band being digital. But digital that's been proven to work! It would probably (in 10 years time) be the big end of town - and maybe another TV channel would have to be "donated" to digital radio - as will happen when analog television is probably/possibly put to bed. There are many great reasons for maintaining AM radio. Security is the first thing that springs to mind. All I want is affordable progress. I want to keep hearing my favourite stations in AM stereo ... and given the above scenario even in FM stereo (which frankly sounds pretty much as good - sometimes even better). And I'd be one of the first (as most of us on this list) to put myself into hock to purchase a digital radio if I could - because pretty well all of us who bother to be here LOVE radio! Good grief! - I think I'm momentarily turning into a capitalist. But why shouldn't I if it suits my socialist agenda? Hmmmmm?? Ian VRN News Melbourne From amymousie@yahoo.com Wed Feb 12 00:42:42 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 12 Feb 2003 08:42:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 86511 invoked from network); 12 Feb 2003 08:42:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Feb 2003 08:42:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.90) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Feb 2003 08:42:41 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.129] by n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 12 Feb 2003 08:42:41 -0000 Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 08:42:40 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: amstereo gone from 2BS Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <000c01c2d26f$cbe54bc0$1b02a8c0@unit> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 422 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 64.175.245.80 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "amstereo - matt2" wrote: =snip= > IF WE CAN help this guy, maybe it will return? It's probably just me, but I would think that if the solid state transmitter has a crystsal socket, that's the place to plug in the exciter. I'm otherwise saddened by the devastation of AM stereo in Australia, which was going so good just a couple years ago? Amy. <:3 )~~~ From dav259@csiro.au Wed Feb 12 01:38:45 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 12 Feb 2003 09:38:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 53552 invoked from network); 12 Feb 2003 09:38:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Feb 2003 09:38:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Feb 2003 09:38:44 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1C9cgR01837 for ; Wed, 12 Feb 2003 20:38:42 +1100 (EST) Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 20:38:42 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: amstereoforum Subject: THANKS MATT2 - JOHNNY WHERE ARE YOU? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=112635033 X-Yahoo-Profile: dav259 On Wed, 12 Feb 2003, amymousie wrote: > I'm otherwise saddened by the devastation of AM stereo in Australia, > which was going so good just a couple years ago? > > Amy. <:3 )~~~ Well - my dear Amy - things are not too good now. Things are just holding up in Melbourne - and nothing too much more can be done here unless there is a general resurgence. *THANKS* Matt 2 for - not just your enthusiasm - but for DOING SOMETHING! We now have here on this list twice as many as were on the old iaaas list 12 months ago. But what are we achieving? Chris - your guidance would be valued. It seems to me all too many posts (and I'm guilty) are about IBOC or AMS chips. There are (thankfully) industry people here - both for and against - you know who you are. But what this list is about is (at least I hope) the success of AM stereo. Some of you must come out of your closets and DO SOMETHING! It's all very nice to discuss it (even with "the other side") but how can you AM stereo listeners expect things to improve when all you do is bitch on this list? And that's OK ... and fruitful. Butt!!! YOU'VE GOT TO DO SOMETHING! LIKE MATT 2 DID! It may not work - BUT ANYTHING IS BETTER THAN NOTHING! Johnny Electron - PLEASE! comment on this - YOU are one of the few (out of all of us on this list - plenty) who still seems actively publicly advocating AMS. I want to fight on! Ian Melbourne From jwelton@nautel.com Wed Feb 12 06:17:45 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jwelton@nautel.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 12 Feb 2003 14:17:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 840 invoked from network); 12 Feb 2003 14:17:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Feb 2003 14:17:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailserver.nautel.com) (24.222.25.85) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Feb 2003 14:17:43 -0000 Received: FROM jeff-welton BY mailserver.nautel.com ; Wed Feb 12 10:18:34 2003 -0400 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 10:14:44 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: DIGIKull Message-ID: <3E4A1E8D.9661.ADF439@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: References: X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.02a) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body From: "Jeff Welton" Reply-To: jwelton@nautel.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=26918678 > I was not aware that the European GSM cellphone system used COFDM, > could you provide a reference to back this claim up? According to the International Engineering Consortium (say that five times fast), GSM uses TDMA for access. The concept was to set general guidelines for mobile phone access, while allowing the freedom for manufactures to exploit and develop new technologies (what a concept). Therefore, a phone could be adapted to OFDM or COFDM and stay within the GSM guidelines - but all my research indicates that GSM phones currently use GPRS, and that for data only. TDMA is also used as the access system for other systems, such as PCS - which is why my GSM phone, which works so well in Canada and most of the rest of the world, detects a signal in most of the US, but works in only about 30-40 cities (although you guys are catching up fast!). I'm not sure why GSM works so well, but in my truck, with a noise cancelling headset, people I call on the GSM phone can't tell I'm not in the office (unless I use the turn signals). With my PCS phone, they know instantly. There are good tutorials on GSM, TDMA and other wireless options at the IEC website, http://www.iec.org/online/tutorials/ And yes, HD radio uses OFDM (see white paper from Ibiquity at: http://www.ibiquity.com/technology/pdf/Waveforms_FM.pdf ). The fundamental difference between OFDM and COFDM is the error correction coding (the C in COFDM), although it's a little more complex than that. There is an educational (and quite technical) discussion of the differences at: http://www.bbc.co.uk/rd/pubs/papers/paper_15/paper_15.html Regards, Jeff Welton Nautel Customer Service Dept. Tel.: 1-902-823-3900 ext. 127 Fax: 1-902-823-3183 email: jwelton@nautel.com From fanfare@globility.com Wed Feb 12 06:40:24 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 12 Feb 2003 14:40:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 19131 invoked from network); 12 Feb 2003 14:40:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Feb 2003 14:40:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.eol.ca) (205.189.151.1) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Feb 2003 14:40:20 -0000 Received: from FAN--MCS (dynamic-b2-243.highspeed.eol.ca [64.56.234.243]) by mail.eol.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id A78B544254 for ; Wed, 12 Feb 2003 09:43:04 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <200302120940160311.002AD4F7@mail.globility.com> In-Reply-To: References: X-Mailer: Calypso Version 3.30.00.00 (4) Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 09:40:16 -0500 To: "Kevin Tekel" Subject: Re: {AMSF} End IBOC-DAB Now! Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable From: "Marv Southcott" Reply-To: fanfare@globility.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy You sir, are a class act. When I saw John's challenge, I could see a lot of= keyboards beginning to smoke. Yours was very cool and dealt with the issue= in a very realistic and productive manner for the group. =20 I may be wrong, but I do get the impression he is a spoiler whose purpose i= s to 'rock' the AMSF group with technical and philosophical challenges to A= M stereo. The last one might easily be construed as coming straight from iB= iquity. I don't doubt Eric will see it that way. perhaps we'll see his resp= onse as well. But yours was the most meaningful. Cheers, Marv *********** REPLY SEPARATOR *********** On 2/12/2003 at 5:39 AM jsgilst wrote: >--- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " > wrote: > >>=20 >> "driving the smaller broadcasters out of buisness" is perhaps the >most=20 >> beneficial effect IBOC could have. The AM band has become way too=20 >> crowded over the last half century, and anything that can be done to=20 >> eliminate a large number of the existing stations can only be good.=20=20 >> In my view the number of stations needs to be cut back to level that=20 >> existed in 1949. In addition to greatly reducing the number of=20 >> stations, I would like to see the elimination of the class A >stations,=20 >> by reclassifying them to class B status. This would allow moving >some=20 >> of the remaining stations to the less congested channels, further=20 >> reducing interference in the primary coverage area of many >stations.=20=20 >> A less densely populated band would also allow many of the complex >and=20 >> aggressive directional arrays to be replaced by simpler arrays. >>=20 >> John > > > >Well if the AM band is too crowded now then it is the FCC's own fault >for giving out these licenses in the 1st place. Some of these smaller >stations do survive well on their own and serve nicth markets. >If the FCC wants to reduce the crowding of AM stations then they=20 >should do it in a manner that continues to allow them serve their >community. Don't ask me how FCC can do this but the bigger >broadcasters don't have the right to drive the smaller ones out of >buisness by FCC edict. If this happens then it only goes to show >that the big broadcasters have the best FCC money can buy. Are these >stations going to be compensated for their loss so they can pay off >any loans for their equipment and other things? I think not. They >will be out of luck stuck with loans and no revenue stream to pay >for them. This is the perfect example of why irrational decisions >of allowing too many stations creates problems and all the more >reason to be cautious of decisions like IBOC. Yea, IBOC can be used >to thin out the number of AM stations but it will be jumping out of=20 >the frying pan and into the fire. I won't disagree that there are >too many statios on AM but once the licenses are given out it's >pretty hard to renig and take the licenses away unless they are guilty >of gross violations. This was a stipid mistake the FCC made that we >have to live with. Let's just hope they don't make another one with >IBOC. > >JSG > > > > > > > >Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum=20 > >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From n0uiheric@aol.com Wed Feb 12 07:51:24 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 12 Feb 2003 15:51:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 86063 invoked from network); 12 Feb 2003 15:51:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Feb 2003 15:51:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r04.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.100) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Feb 2003 15:51:20 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-r04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.a4.33b4ac9f (26116) for ; Wed, 12 Feb 2003 10:51:14 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 10:51:13 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Abandon ship, shes going down...... To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih FM is going down in flames, too...because of lack of innovative programming. Had we only allowed those with the definitive ideas in program service (such as serving specified areas instead of trying to cover the whole market), program material (such as more local-specific talk programming and trying new talent instead of the same pre-packaged crap) and business ideas (such as affirmative action hiring policies for people who would otherwise not work in commercial radio, lower advertising and programming rates, and bringing the salaries of air talent under control so that there would be more money to invest), then AM and FM would have still had a chance. The thing that would be needed is to have the whole radio industry reregulated. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Wed Feb 12 07:51:40 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 12 Feb 2003 15:51:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 60946 invoked from network); 12 Feb 2003 15:51:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Feb 2003 15:51:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r07.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.103) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Feb 2003 15:51:40 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-r07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.19c.10dae2c4 (26116) for ; Wed, 12 Feb 2003 10:51:16 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <19c.10dae2c4.2b7bc774@aol.com> Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 10:51:16 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} End IBOC-DAB Now! To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih Sorry, Don...C-QUAM sounds MUCH BETTER than IBOCrap. AM Stereo is capable of near CD-like seperation without the unnecessary digital crap. IBOCrap sounds, at best, like an Internet connection using a dial-up modem. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From amymousie@yahoo.com Wed Feb 12 10:06:17 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 12 Feb 2003 18:06:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 2097 invoked from network); 12 Feb 2003 18:06:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Feb 2003 18:06:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Feb 2003 18:06:09 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.169] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 12 Feb 2003 18:06:08 -0000 Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 18:06:06 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: DIGIKull Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3E4A1E8D.9661.ADF439@localhost> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1822 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 64.175.245.80 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Jeff Welton" wrote: > > I was not aware that the European GSM cellphone system used COFDM, > > could you provide a reference to back this claim up? > > According to the International Engineering Consortium (say that five times > fast), GSM uses TDMA for access. The concept was to set general guidelines for > mobile phone access, while allowing the freedom for manufactures to exploit and > develop new technologies (what a concept). Therefore, a phone could be adapted > to OFDM or COFDM and stay within the GSM guidelines - but all my research > indicates that GSM phones currently use GPRS, and that for data only. TDMA is > also used as the access system for other systems, such as PCS - which is why my > GSM phone, which works so well in Canada and most of the rest of the world, > detects a signal in most of the US, but works in only about 30-40 cities > (although you guys are catching up fast!). > > I'm not sure why GSM works so well, but in my truck, with a noise cancelling > headset, people I call on the GSM phone can't tell I'm not in the office > (unless I use the turn signals). With my PCS phone, they know instantly. > There are good tutorials on GSM, TDMA and other wireless options at the IEC > website, http://www.iec.org/online/tutorials/ > > And yes, HD radio uses OFDM (see white paper from Ibiquity at: > http://www.ibiquity.com/technology/pdf/Waveforms_FM.pdf ). The fundamental > difference between OFDM and COFDM is the error correction coding (the C in > COFDM), although it's a little more complex than that. There is an educational > (and quite technical) discussion of the differences at: > http://www.bbc.co.uk/rd/pubs/papers/paper_15/paper_15.html I stand corrected. Amy. <:3 )~~~ From powell@conterra.com Wed Feb 12 11:02:22 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: powell@conterra.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 12 Feb 2003 19:02:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 38681 invoked from network); 12 Feb 2003 19:00:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Feb 2003 19:00:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mx.matrixconsulting.net) (65.199.24.6) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Feb 2003 19:00:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 15652 invoked from network); 12 Feb 2003 19:00:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO bsae-skqpk3w8p5) (66.112.193.86) by mx.matrixconsulting.net with SMTP; 12 Feb 2003 19:00:07 -0000 Organization: BEARly Organized To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 13:59:55 -0500 Subject: Skywave or NOTHING Message-ID: <3E4A535B.30948.1F403E@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: <1045038111.1339.56387.m13@yahoogroups.com> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.01) From: "Powell E. Way III" Reply-To: powell@conterra.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=8062869 X-Yahoo-Profile: W4OPW On 12 Feb 2003 at 8:21, amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com wrote: > Message: 17 > Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 05:15:30 -0000 > From: "John " > Subject: Re: DIGIKull > I'm not sure why anyone would need or want to "do skywave"? And where I'd like to live, and a friend lives...it's skywave or nothing And when IBOC comes along that's all it will be NOTHING. Where I live, I might not have ANY MW signals I can get on IBOC. IF everyone that could here in Columbia did, I am 6 miles from downtown, and I will have no one to listen to. If you say FM I'll be tempted to send you 500 gigbytes of bad language. There's nothing worth listening to. WVOC on 560 can not pass IBOC on the night 3 tower DA. It most likely will not pass daytimes. It was VERY shaky and unstable with the AM Stereo ( Harris system). The 4 tower 1320 array won't either. The day might. I doubt CC is going to spend upwards of $500,000 or more to try. Citadel won't on the 1320. They can sell the land and more condos go there. The FM's here are so horridly processed they aren't worth listening to. UP in NorthEast Georgia where my friends live, WSB is the only local signal I can hear at night. That's from 70 miles away. There's often selective fading. FM is fair, but there's often flutter and fading. And the quality of FM there is sinking fast. And it takes very little for a tropo, and IBOC won't stand anything that upsets the signal even a tiny bit. OH and your gratuitous slam on vinyl. I have LOTS of big band stuff that has yet to be released to CD. I do wish Capitol would release Harry James in HIFI volumes 1 and 2, They HAVE released a lot of his other stuff. At least the 2 albums are pristine! Not stereo being 1955, but one of the albums DOES have (!!!) variable grove spacing. How did they do that without computers? Powell From amstereorules@msn.com Wed Feb 12 12:03:31 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereorules@msn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 12 Feb 2003 20:03:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 93548 invoked from network); 12 Feb 2003 20:03:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Feb 2003 20:03:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.68) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Feb 2003 20:03:28 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.251] by n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 12 Feb 2003 20:03:24 -0000 Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 20:03:24 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: DIGIKull Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 930 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amstereorules " X-Originating-IP: 64.12.102.156 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=130870594 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereorules >I'm not sure why GSM works so well, but in my truck, with a noise >cancelling headset, people I call on the GSM phone can't tell I'm >not in the office (unless I use the turn signals). With my PCS >phone, they know instantly. GSM voice quality sounds sooo good due to the wide bandwidth (200 KC) due for each voice channel allocation. GSM is international standard, and indeed uses Time Division Multiple Access (TDMA) for voice calls. This means each call is assign one dedicated time slot. If you have a GSM account with one of the providers in the state's (T-Mobile, say) you can use your SIM card overseas in a rented GSM phone, and your billing catches up. U.S handsets can't be used in other countries- as the frequency plans are different. And this has absolutely nothing to do with AM stereo, but a nice discussion anyhoo . I am back at the dude ranch. Trying to catch up on things. Remember, AMStereoRules From davidcoons@webtv.net Wed Feb 12 12:40:51 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: davidcoons@webtv.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 12 Feb 2003 20:40:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 51566 invoked from network); 12 Feb 2003 20:40:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Feb 2003 20:40:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO smtpout-2001-2.public.lawson.webtv.net) (209.240.212.82) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Feb 2003 20:40:50 -0000 Received: from storefull-2315.public.lawson.webtv.net (lawson-public-ipmux-1-pip-3.public.lawson.webtv.net [209.240.212.23]) by smtpout-2001-2.public.lawson.webtv.net (WebTV_Postfix+sws) with ESMTP id D24C979C54 for ; Wed, 12 Feb 2003 12:40:49 -0800 (PST) Received: (from production@localhost) by storefull-2315.public.lawson.webtv.net (8.8.8-wtv-f/mt.gso.26Feb98) id MAA18223; Wed, 12 Feb 2003 12:40:50 -0800 (PST) X-WebTV-Signature: 1 ETAuAhUAjO5LLsoVIH336Yy/tIB3NfCVqEUCFQDLNtY20j+UzfffTuIYE2UAmISCQg== Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 15:40:49 -0500 (EST) To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: less am stations Message-ID: <1957-3E4AB151-292@storefull-2315.public.lawson.webtv.net> In-Reply-To: Ian Davidson 's message of Wed, 12 Feb 2003 19:38:33 +1100 (EST) Content-Disposition: Inline Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) X-eGroups-From: davidcoons@webtv.net (David Coons) From: davidcoons@webtv.net X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10533228 when the fcc realocated stations in 1940,they should have gone to 20k channels as hi-fi was already a reality even then..most of the present problems would not exist From jsgil@hal-pc.org Wed Feb 12 13:16:11 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 12 Feb 2003 21:16:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 24408 invoked from network); 12 Feb 2003 21:16:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Feb 2003 21:16:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.64) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Feb 2003 21:16:11 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.250] by n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 12 Feb 2003 21:16:10 -0000 Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 21:16:07 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: less am stations Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <1957-3E4AB151-292@storefull-2315.public.lawson.webtv.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 1785 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.211 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, davidcoons@w... wrote: > when the fcc realocated stations in 1940,they should have gone to 20k > channels as hi-fi was already a reality even then..most of the present > problems would not exist Maybe, maybe not. Spacing them 20KHz apart puts more stations on top of each other unless the AM band is doubled in width or eliminate half of the stations. It would mean that the FCC would have given out half as many licenses to maintain the protection ratio. Right now stations that are on top of each other have a 20:1 protection ratio and setting them 20KHz apart would probably cut this in half. One solution I thought of was to set them at 15KHz apart and go to vestigal sideband for the mono stations. The vestigal sideband would go to 2.5KHz and the other out to 12.5KHz. This is 25% less BW than than what is used for a DSB =B110.2KHz signal. A daytime stereo signal would go to =B112.5KHz and at night go to =B17.5KHz. The mono could go to 2.5KHz/7.5KHz at night. This would produce about the same=20 overlapping background radiation noise that exists at night that we have now. It would move the whistle to 15KHz which would be high enough in frequency and reduced enough by RF & IF filtering that notch filters would be unnessary. This could have been implemented very easy=20 before the advent of DTR unless the FCC mandated that all DTR sets=20 would have to tune in 5KHz steps. As an after thought this is pretty much impossible as it would break all DTR sets. This would also allow stations that wanted to transmitt low BW audio to maximize modulation=20 and coverage be set 5KHz apart and could operate in a 2.5/5KHz VSB mode. This would have improved the audio audio quality for stereo=20 and added more versatility to the AM band. JSG=20=20 From davidcoons@webtv.net Wed Feb 12 13:28:18 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: davidcoons@webtv.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 12 Feb 2003 21:28:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 57126 invoked from network); 12 Feb 2003 21:28:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Feb 2003 21:28:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO smtpout-2001-3.public.lawson.webtv.net) (209.240.212.83) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Feb 2003 21:28:16 -0000 Received: from storefull-2315.public.lawson.webtv.net (lawson-public-ipmux-1-pip-3.public.lawson.webtv.net [209.240.212.23]) by smtpout-2001-3.public.lawson.webtv.net (WebTV_Postfix+sws) with ESMTP id 302C8C145 for ; Wed, 12 Feb 2003 13:28:16 -0800 (PST) Received: (from production@localhost) by storefull-2315.public.lawson.webtv.net (8.8.8-wtv-f/mt.gso.26Feb98) id NAA19728; Wed, 12 Feb 2003 13:28:16 -0800 (PST) X-WebTV-Signature: 1 ETAsAhQxAnzL7Lwbb0KWoRs8aQ/av2B/TgIUGxht6qH5ArTotRAwHzRfsUda8ZM= Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 16:28:15 -0500 (EST) To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: less am stations Message-ID: <1952-3E4ABC6F-844@storefull-2315.public.lawson.webtv.net> In-Reply-To: "jsgilst " 's message of Wed, 12 Feb 2003 21:16:07 -0000 Content-Disposition: Inline Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) X-eGroups-From: davidcoons@webtv.net (David Coons) From: davidcoons@webtv.net X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10533228 well,if it were done in 1940 we simply wouldnt have added so many stations over the years.only 1,000 on the air at that time From kevtronics@yahoo.com Wed Feb 12 13:53:02 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 12 Feb 2003 21:53:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 23394 invoked from network); 12 Feb 2003 21:53:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Feb 2003 21:53:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.68) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Feb 2003 21:53:00 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.154] by n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 12 Feb 2003 21:52:59 -0000 Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 21:52:58 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: 1030 WBZ BACK IN STEREO!!!!! Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 902 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.72.141 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics Yes, it is true! For the first time in over a year, the 50,000-watt Class A powerhouse of the Northeast, 1030 WBZ from Boston, is once again transmitting in full AM Stereo! I heard the proof myself just a few minutes ago, literally right after I took my newly acquired MCS 3050 tuner out of the box and hooked it up. Upon tuning in 1030 kHz and locking in the signal with my Terk AM Advantage loop antenna, WBZ's signal popped into Stereo mode, and I thought I heard some Stereo separation during the commercials... but then, WBZ's fabulous traffic report sounder came on with unmistakable full Stereo sound! Please get in touch with WBZ now and thank them for resuming their fantastic AM Stereo broadcasts! You can e-mail them from this site: http://wbz1030.com/feedback/ Now let's hope this is the first in a trend of many other stations -- big and small -- returning to AM Stereo! From jbyrns@enteract.com Wed Feb 12 13:54:20 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 12 Feb 2003 21:54:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 67617 invoked from network); 12 Feb 2003 21:54:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Feb 2003 21:54:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.84) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Feb 2003 21:54:19 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.140] by n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 12 Feb 2003 21:54:16 -0000 Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 21:54:14 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Skywave or NOTHING Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3E4A535B.30948.1F403E@localhost> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2999 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.98.41 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Powell E. Way III" < powell@c...> wrote: > > And where I'd like to live, and a friend lives...it's skywave or > nothing And when IBOC comes along that's all it will be NOTHING. > > Where I live, I might not have ANY MW signals I can get on IBOC. IF > everyone that could here in Columbia did, I am 6 miles from downtown, > and I will have no one to listen to. If you say FM I'll be tempted > to send you 500 gigbytes of bad language. There's nothing worth > listening to. Why would one expect AM to have better things to listen to than FM? It my have more obscure programming, but that is just an artifact of its lack of popularity, FM was once in the same position. The answer to both problems, is to forget AM & FM, and get an XM receiver, which will give you coverage most everywhere in the US, and offers a wide selection of programming. I'm listening to the XM receiver now, as I type this. If you don't like XM there's always the competing company, and I understand that at least one of the satellite television providers also offers a "radio" package. This is the 21st century, skywave service on the MW band is an anachronism from the past century. > WVOC on 560 can not pass IBOC on the night 3 tower DA. It most > likely will not pass daytimes. It was VERY shaky and unstable with > the AM Stereo ( Harris system). > The 4 tower 1320 array won't either. The day might. I doubt CC is > going to spend upwards of $500,000 or more to try. Citadel won't > on the 1320. They can sell the land and more condos go there. That makes those stations candidates for the weeding out process that IBOC will hopefully accomplish. The remaining stations will be the foundation for a healthier MW band, once the weaker and poorly designed stations are weeded out. > The FM's here are so horridly processed they aren't worth listening > to. What makes this problem unique to FM? You could wake up tomorrow and find your favorite AM station is being "horridly processed". Even "digital" can't escape "horrid processing", it's a fact of life. > OH and your gratuitous slam on vinyl. I have LOTS of big band stuff > that has yet to be released to CD. I do wish Capitol would release > Harry James in HIFI volumes 1 and 2, They HAVE released a lot of his > other stuff. At least the 2 albums are pristine! Not stereo being > 1955, but one of the albums DOES have (!!!) variable grove spacing. > How did they do that without computers? What "gratuitous slam on vinyl", what did I say? I have a modest collection of vinyl myself. I probably have in excess of 1,000 LP's judging by sampling the number of LP's per inch of shelf space. Maybe some day I will get around to cataloging them. I will say this in favor of CD's, they are far more convenient than LP's, and the better ones have far better sound quality than the best LP's. But that's just a result of the physics of it, not a "gratuitous slam". John From jbyrns@enteract.com Wed Feb 12 13:57:10 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 12 Feb 2003 21:57:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 6695 invoked from network); 12 Feb 2003 21:57:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Feb 2003 21:57:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Feb 2003 21:57:08 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.249] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 12 Feb 2003 21:57:07 -0000 Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 21:57:06 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: less am stations Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <1957-3E4AB151-292@storefull-2315.public.lawson.webtv.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 941 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.98.41 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, davidcoons@w... wrote: > when the fcc realocated stations in 1940,they should have gone > to 20k channels as hi-fi was already a reality even then..most > of the present problems would not exist Didn't the FCC experiment with that in the 1930's, and then gave up on it? The 1500 kHz to 1600 kHz segement of the band had wide channel spacing for a while, it may have even been 39 kHz kHz, I can't remember for sure if it was 20 kHz, or 30 kHz spacing. Also, having a hi-fi MW AM service eventually became redundant with the introduction of FM in 1941, which provided the hi-fi service. One question, if they had gone to 20 kHz spacing in 1940, wouldn't that have doubled the number of stations on each channel, creating more co channel interference, and requiring a significant new investment in directional antenna arrays by the stations that were already in existence at that time? John From kevtronics@yahoo.com Wed Feb 12 14:10:06 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 12 Feb 2003 22:10:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 90092 invoked from network); 12 Feb 2003 22:10:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Feb 2003 22:10:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.89) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Feb 2003 22:10:05 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.141] by n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 12 Feb 2003 22:10:02 -0000 Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 22:10:02 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: The MCS-3050 wonder tuner Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2708 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.72.141 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics To accompany my report of 1030 WBZ returning to AM Stereo, I have to thank the J.C. Penney/Modular Component System MCS-3050 tuner that I used to receive their signal. For less than $30, I got it on eBay: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3000984910 ...and its performance is fantastic! It is an older tuner, quite popular in the 1980s, so it only tunes up to 1620 kHz on AM, but it is easily the most sensitive "consumer-grade" AM receiver that I have ever used. With a simple loop antenna (the kind that comes with most stereo systems these days), it is already very sensitive -- but couple that with a tuned loop antenna like a Select-A-Tenna or Terk AM Advantage, and Wow! With it, I can pick up signals across the AM dial better than even on my best car radios. It really has some great DXing abilities, and its fixed bandwidth is a very good compromise between selectivity and audio quality; it is very good at separating signals 10 kHz apart from each other on the dial, even when one is quite a bit stronger than the other -- and yet, it has surprisingly good treble response, similar to a Sony SRF-42. I haven't peeked inside yet, but I'd say it uses a 6 kHz ceramic filter, together with a whistle filter to deliver great sound from both local and DX signals. With its original MC13020 C-Quam decoder, it quickly locks onto AM Stereo signals, even very weak ones, and it has a handy 5-step signal strength meter, as well as lots of push button pre-sets. The digital display is an old-fashioned blue vacuum flourescent design; you can actually see it flicker a little -- but yet this doesn't seem to add any extra background noise to the reception. On the other hand, the FM band is somewhat disappointing in comparison; the selectivity is not that great, so reception of adjacent channel stations is usually not a possibility. Also, its audio on FM seems unusually LOUD, and a bit distorted, even from stations that normally use clean audio processing. In any event, this is one of those unexpected gems, the kind that you might find at a garage sale or flea market but pass up because it doesn't look like anything special. Keep your eyes out for one of these -- you will not be disappointed! They also seem to be sturdily constructed; my MCS-3050 is the first piece of consumer electronics that I have that actually has *rust* on the metal casing, as if it was left sitting in somebody's garage for a long time... but yet it works 100% perfect, with no problems at all. p.s. When I get a chance, I'll be sure to make a recording of WBZ in AM Stereo for all to hear -- I am just really thrilled that they're back in Stereo now! From groucho@skyweb.net Wed Feb 12 14:24:59 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 12 Feb 2003 22:24:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 19428 invoked from network); 12 Feb 2003 22:24:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Feb 2003 22:24:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Feb 2003 22:24:57 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (tc1-98.skyweb.net [66.6.130.226]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h1CMZ2WY035223 for ; Wed, 12 Feb 2003 17:35:02 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3E4AC744.A2AF166D@skyweb.net> Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 17:14:28 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} The MCS-3050 wonder tuner References: X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I too will Confirm this Heard them in Full am stereo here on my carver Tx-11b receiver. very cool. Neal CE WTTM 1680 am stereo "Kevin T. " wrote: > To accompany my report of 1030 WBZ returning to AM Stereo, I have to > thank the J.C. Penney/Modular Component System MCS-3050 tuner that I > used to receive their signal. For less than $30, I got it on eBay: > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3000984910 > > ...and its performance is fantastic! It is an older tuner, quite > popular in the 1980s, so it only tunes up to 1620 kHz on AM, but it > is easily the most sensitive "consumer-grade" AM receiver that I have > ever used. With a simple loop antenna (the kind that comes with most > stereo systems these days), it is already very sensitive -- but > couple that with a tuned loop antenna like a Select-A-Tenna or Terk > AM Advantage, and Wow! With it, I can pick up signals across the AM > dial better than even on my best car radios. > > It really has some great DXing abilities, and its fixed bandwidth is > a very good compromise between selectivity and audio quality; it is > very good at separating signals 10 kHz apart from each other on the > dial, even when one is quite a bit stronger than the other -- and > yet, it has surprisingly good treble response, similar to a Sony > SRF-42. I haven't peeked inside yet, but I'd say it uses a 6 kHz > ceramic filter, together with a whistle filter to deliver great sound > from both local and DX signals. > > With its original MC13020 C-Quam decoder, it quickly locks onto AM > Stereo signals, even very weak ones, and it has a handy 5-step signal > strength meter, as well as lots of push button pre-sets. The digital > display is an old-fashioned blue vacuum flourescent design; you can > actually see it flicker a little -- but yet this doesn't seem to add > any extra background noise to the reception. > > On the other hand, the FM band is somewhat disappointing in > comparison; the selectivity is not that great, so reception of > adjacent channel stations is usually not a possibility. Also, its > audio on FM seems unusually LOUD, and a bit distorted, even from > stations that normally use clean audio processing. > > In any event, this is one of those unexpected gems, the kind that you > might find at a garage sale or flea market but pass up because it > doesn't look like anything special. Keep your eyes out for one of > these -- you will not be disappointed! They also seem to be sturdily > constructed; my MCS-3050 is the first piece of consumer electronics > that I have that actually has *rust* on the metal casing, as if it > was left sitting in somebody's garage for a long time... but yet it > works 100% perfect, with no problems at all. > > p.s. When I get a chance, I'll be sure to make a recording of WBZ in > AM Stereo for all to hear -- I am just really thrilled that they're > back in Stereo now! > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From ccuff@in4web.com Wed Feb 12 15:06:48 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 12 Feb 2003 23:06:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 84302 invoked from network); 12 Feb 2003 23:06:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Feb 2003 23:06:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Feb 2003 23:06:37 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.76]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Wed, 12 Feb 2003 18:03:07 -0500 Message-ID: <00a601c2d2ea$20a723c0$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: <3E4A535B.30948.1F403E@localhost> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Skywave or NOTHING Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 17:57:32 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 Skywave is all I have where I live. One local FM, several "listenable" FM's, one local AM, barely audible. (Which is why I have XM now) CC ----- Original Message ----- From: Powell E. Way III To: Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2003 1:59 PM Subject: {AMSF} Skywave or NOTHING > On 12 Feb 2003 at 8:21, amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com From mwradio@gmx.net Wed Feb 12 15:19:46 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: mwradio@gmx.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 12 Feb 2003 23:19:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 47152 invoked from network); 12 Feb 2003 23:19:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Feb 2003 23:19:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO smtp.suscom.net) (64.78.119.248) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Feb 2003 23:19:45 -0000 Received: from localhost (userweb.suscom.net [64.78.119.248]) by smtp.suscom.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 28784112022 for ; Wed, 12 Feb 2003 18:19:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from f5p8c1 (ip74.64.susc.suscom.net [64.78.64.74]) by smtp.suscom.net (Postfix) with SMTP id B53FF111F3F for ; Wed, 12 Feb 2003 18:19:43 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <000c01c2d2ed$c144f840$6500a8c0@suscom.net> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} 1030 WBZ BACK IN STEREO!!!!! Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 18:23:28 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Virus-Scanned: by AMaViS new-20020517 From: "Joe Esposito" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=93604673 X-Yahoo-Profile: espositojm My STEREO light was also on when I tuned scanned past WBZ today. I often listen to KDKA during the day out here in Central, PA. I first thought it may have been a false stereo on my 1988 Plymouth radio, but I did hear some separation during WBZ's commercials. Reception was very good at 4:30 pm. Does KDKA still have their STEREO equipment? Joe Esposito ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2003 4:52 PM Subject: {AMSF} 1030 WBZ BACK IN STEREO!!!!! > Yes, it is true! For the first time in over a year, the 50,000-watt > Class A powerhouse of the Northeast, 1030 WBZ from Boston, is once > again transmitting in full AM Stereo! > > I heard the proof myself just a few minutes ago, literally right > after I took my newly acquired MCS 3050 tuner out of the box and > hooked it up. Upon tuning in 1030 kHz and locking in the signal with > my Terk AM Advantage loop antenna, WBZ's signal popped into Stereo > mode, and I thought I heard some Stereo separation during the > commercials... but then, WBZ's fabulous traffic report sounder came > on with unmistakable full Stereo sound! > > Please get in touch with WBZ now and thank them for resuming their > fantastic AM Stereo broadcasts! You can e-mail them from this site: > > http://wbz1030.com/feedback/ > > Now let's hope this is the first in a trend of many other stations -- > big and small -- returning to AM Stereo! > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > From KC4QLP@aol.com Wed Feb 12 15:39:39 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 12 Feb 2003 23:39:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 24690 invoked from network); 12 Feb 2003 23:39:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Feb 2003 23:39:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d08.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.40) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Feb 2003 23:39:37 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.1cc.27784f2 (3842) for ; Wed, 12 Feb 2003 18:39:32 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1cc.27784f2.2b7c3533@aol.com> Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 18:39:31 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Skywave or NOTHING To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 2/12/03 2:04:48 PM Eastern Standard Time, powell@conterra.com writes: << WVOC on 560 can not pass IBOC on the night 3 tower DA. It most likely will not pass daytimes. It was VERY shaky and unstable with the AM Stereo ( Harris system). The 4 tower 1320 array won't either. The day might. I doubt CC is going to spend upwards of $500,000 or more to try. Citadel won't on the 1320. They can sell the land and more condos go there. >> I thought they fixed that DA at WVOC a few summers back ...I remember it well when they would blast me out up this way. BTW...that problem seems to have been corrected..at least for now..even though they dont offer protection in this direction,I still notice when things are not kosher if you know what I mean. Now only if we can get that religious wind bag in KY to stop operating on day power at night we might be onto something. Anyhow...I dont see why WVOC's DA couldnt pass IBOC. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.qsl.net/kc4qlp Echolink node # 56704 -- 146.590 VHF,440.850 UHF (PL 131.8) _______________________________________________________ From amstereorules@msn.com Wed Feb 12 15:52:24 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereorules@msn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 12 Feb 2003 23:52:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 53929 invoked from network); 12 Feb 2003 23:52:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Feb 2003 23:52:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.75) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Feb 2003 23:52:22 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.144] by n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 12 Feb 2003 23:52:22 -0000 Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 23:52:22 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: less am stations Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <1957-3E4AB151-292@storefull-2315.public.lawson.webtv.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 337 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amstereorules " X-Originating-IP: 64.12.96.170 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=130870594 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereorules >when the fcc realocated stations in 1940,they should have gone to >20k channels as hi-fi was already a reality even then..most of the >present problems would not exist MW was like this in the 1940's- remember that the FCC approved stereo for the struggling FM band in 1961. MW was king then. Blame the FCC for killing the MW band. From amstereorules@msn.com Wed Feb 12 15:55:29 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereorules@msn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 12 Feb 2003 23:55:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 81305 invoked from network); 12 Feb 2003 23:55:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Feb 2003 23:55:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.75) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Feb 2003 23:55:28 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.152] by n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 12 Feb 2003 23:55:27 -0000 Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 23:55:27 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: 1030 WBZ BACK IN STEREO!!!!! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 305 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amstereorules " X-Originating-IP: 64.12.96.170 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=130870594 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereorules >Yes, it is true! For the first time in over a year, the 50,000-watt >Class A powerhouse of the Northeast, 1030 WBZ from Boston, is once >again transmitting in full AM Stereo! WBZ is exercising there back up xmitter. It will not stay on the air. Sorry to burst the bubble. Remember, AMStereoRules From mwdx@gentoo.net Wed Feb 12 16:10:52 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: mwdx@gentoo.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 13 Feb 2003 00:10:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 82941 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2003 00:10:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Feb 2003 00:10:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailrelay1.lanl.gov) (128.165.4.101) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Feb 2003 00:10:51 -0000 Received: from cic-mail.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailrelay1.lanl.gov (8.12.3/8.12.3/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id h1D0ApBU026560 for ; Wed, 12 Feb 2003 17:10:51 -0700 Received: from gentoo.net (romulus.lanl.gov [128.165.209.40]) by cic-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.3/8.12.3/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id h1D0AlNJ019134 for ; Wed, 12 Feb 2003 17:10:48 -0700 Message-ID: <3E4AE432.5010707@gentoo.net> Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 17:17:54 -0700 Organization: Pojoaque Medium Wave DXers Club User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020826 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Acura AM Stereo radio on eBay-- 2 hours left -- $9.99 References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Mike Westfall X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=118377141 X-Yahoo-Profile: n6kuy Bid now! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3006244448&category=3288 -- Mike Westfall, N6KUY, WDX6O Los Alamos, New Mexico (DM65uv) My online logbooks are at http://www.gentoo.net/dxlogbook/main.mv?account=mikew From amymousie@yahoo.com Wed Feb 12 16:52:34 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 13 Feb 2003 00:52:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 80096 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2003 00:52:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Feb 2003 00:52:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.69) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Feb 2003 00:52:31 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.165] by n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Feb 2003 00:52:31 -0000 Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 00:52:27 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Skywave or NOTHING Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1690 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 67.115.108.177 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " wrote: =snip= > The answer to both problems, is to forget AM & FM, and get an XM > receiver, which will give you coverage most everywhere in the US, and > offers a wide selection of programming. I'm listening to the XM > receiver now, as I type this. If you don't like XM there's always the > competing company, and I understand that at least one of the satellite > television providers also offers a "radio" package. This is the 21st > century, skywave service on the MW band is an anachronism from the > past century. And considering operational lifespans if satelklites (5-15 years), plus the proprietary subscription nature of these services, there is no guarantee for continual long-term operation of these services. (Anyone remember Iridium?) Thanks to solar magnetic storms, every few years a number of satellites get knocked out of service, and are expensive to replace. I would not hold my breath on the long-term feasability of these systems - Satellite telecommunications has been quietly reinventing itself every few years out of necessity. And if this economy collapses outright, or even worse, this nation (which seriously looks possible, now), I wouldn't count on any long-term terrestrial support. (Reminds me of banks. Remember them, back when you could count on your savings to still be at the same bank 50 years hence? And when banks were used to hold inheritable properties across generations? It's missing things like that that I don't trust conservative governments who make it easy to be transient- Business for today; who cares for tomorrow?) Amy. <:3 )~~~ From amymousie@yahoo.com Wed Feb 12 16:55:36 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 13 Feb 2003 00:55:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 48159 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2003 00:55:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Feb 2003 00:55:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Feb 2003 00:55:36 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.176] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Feb 2003 00:55:36 -0000 Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 00:55:36 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: less am stations Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1320 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 67.115.108.177 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, davidcoons@w... wrote: > > when the fcc realocated stations in 1940,they should have gone > > to 20k channels as hi-fi was already a reality even then..most > > of the present problems would not exist > > Didn't the FCC experiment with that in the 1930's, and then gave up on > it? The 1500 kHz to 1600 kHz segement of the band had wide channel > spacing for a while, it may have even been 39 kHz kHz, I can't > remember for sure if it was 20 kHz, or 30 kHz spacing. Also, having a > hi-fi MW AM service eventually became redundant with the introduction > of FM in 1941, which provided the hi-fi service. > > One question, if they had gone to 20 kHz spacing in 1940, wouldn't > that have doubled the number of stations on each channel, creating > more co channel interference, and requiring a significant new > investment in directional antenna arrays by the stations that were > already in existence at that time? You are thinking of the "Apex" band that was in use then, in the 26MHz band- Wideband AM. Today, the only remnants of the Apex band are STLs and remote feeds, some now using narrowband FM (like WLW, which I HAVE received from here in California). Amy. <:3 )~~~ From amymousie@yahoo.com Wed Feb 12 17:02:45 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 13 Feb 2003 01:02:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 60452 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2003 01:02:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Feb 2003 01:02:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Feb 2003 01:02:44 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.164] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Feb 2003 01:02:41 -0000 Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 01:02:39 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} 1030 WBZ BACK IN STEREO!!!!! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <000c01c2d2ed$c144f840$6500a8c0@suscom.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 594 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 67.115.108.177 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Joe Esposito" wrote: > Does KDKA still have their STEREO equipment? KDKA has been wired for stereo since 1959 when then-parent company Westinghouse used it for testing their AM stereo system. In the 1980s they were Kahn. I think they did go C-QUAM later. They may still be using the equipment, but probably with the pilot light off. I'm not sure in any case. (Westinghouse's radio and TV properties were bought up by CBS, which in tern were bought by Viacom. All so-called "Group W" broadcasters are now Viacom.) Amy. <:3 )~~~ From amymousie@yahoo.com Wed Feb 12 17:10:19 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 13 Feb 2003 01:10:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 62876 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2003 01:10:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Feb 2003 01:10:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.67) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Feb 2003 01:10:19 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.153] by n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Feb 2003 01:10:19 -0000 Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 01:10:18 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: less am stations Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 760 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 67.115.108.177 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "amymousie " wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " > wrote: > > Didn't the FCC experiment with that in the 1930's, and then gave up > on > > it? The 1500 kHz to 1600 kHz segement of the band had wide channel Just an addendum: This spectrum mentioned was for the police/service band. Above it was for fax and TV, until "high-definition" (300 lines or better) were forced up to the relatively unused portions of the spectrum between 20-30MHz, before moving to their present assignments. Oh, talk is now for "local" DRM services in the 26MHz international shortwave band with spacing to achieve stereo broadcasting. Amy. <:3 )~~~ From jbyrns@enteract.com Wed Feb 12 18:06:40 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 13 Feb 2003 02:06:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 48006 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2003 02:06:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Feb 2003 02:06:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.68) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Feb 2003 02:06:39 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.143] by n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Feb 2003 02:06:39 -0000 Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 02:06:39 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Skywave or NOTHING Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2605 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.237 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "amymousie " < amymousie@y...> wrote: > > And considering operational lifespans if satelklites (5-15 years), > plus the proprietary subscription nature of these services, there is > no guarantee for continual long-term operation of these services. > (Anyone remember Iridium?) I remember Iridium, and it is still operational, and you can still get an Iridium phone, and subscribe to the Iridium service. Iridium is not a good example of a system that is no longer operational, rather it is an example of a system whose original business plan was flawed, in that the demand for the Iridium service that had been anticipated, did not materialize. It's the same with AM stereo, nobody is interested. It's an interesting coincidence that both the Iridium, and AM stereo systems are the developments of the same company. You really have a hang-up on the long-term operation of various systems. You may be right, satellites may be doomed, but if they are, we are in for a lot of trouble. Unless things have changed in the last couple of years, both radio and television networking is totally dependent on satellites, and if the satellites go out, there are going to be some serious problems. Although I assume there is enough unused fiber in the ground that terrestrial networking could be put back into operation fairly quickly. Another problem is the GPS satellites that now play a crucial role in the operation of much earth bound infrastructure that you might not think was dependent on satellites, and that has nothing to do with position determination. > Thanks to solar magnetic storms, every few years a number of > satellites get knocked out of service, and are expensive to replace. > > I would not hold my breath on the long-term feasability of these > systems - Satellite telecommunications has been quietly reinventing > itself every few years out of necessity. And if this economy > collapses outright, or even worse, this nation (which seriously > looks possible, now), I wouldn't count on any long-term terrestrial > support. (Reminds me of banks. Remember them, back when you could > count on your savings to still be at the same bank 50 years hence? > And when banks were used to hold inheritable properties across > generations? It's missing things like that that I don't trust > conservative governments who make it easy to be transient- Business > for today; who cares for tomorrow?) I'm not at all sure that I follow what you are trying to say about Banks, or if it is even accurate? John From jbyrns@enteract.com Wed Feb 12 18:11:27 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 13 Feb 2003 02:11:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 57388 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2003 02:11:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Feb 2003 02:11:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Feb 2003 02:11:25 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.144] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Feb 2003 02:11:25 -0000 Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 02:11:24 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: less am stations Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1491 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.237 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "amymousie " < amymousie@y...> wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " > wrote: > > > > Didn't the FCC experiment with that in the 1930's, and then gave > > up on it? The 1500 kHz to 1600 kHz segement of the band had wide > > channel spacing for a while, it may have even been 39 kHz kHz, I > > can't remember for sure if it was 20 kHz, or 30 kHz spacing. > > Also, having a hi-fi MW AM service eventually became redundant > > with the introduction of FM in 1941, which provided the hi-fi > > service. > > > > One question, if they had gone to 20 kHz spacing in 1940, wouldn't > > that have doubled the number of stations on each channel, creating > > more co channel interference, and requiring a significant new > > investment in directional antenna arrays by the stations that were > > already in existence at that time? > > You are thinking of the "Apex" band that was in use then, in the > 26MHz band- Wideband AM. Today, the only remnants of the Apex band > are STLs and remote feeds, some now using narrowband FM (like WLW, > which I HAVE received from here in California). I assure you that I know what the "Apex band" band was, and that is not what I was talking about. When you said I was "thinking of the Apex band", were you referring to my comment on the 1500 kHz to 1600 kHz segment of the MW band, or my reference to the start of FM broadcasting in 1941? John From amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Wed Feb 12 18:41:48 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 37686 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2003 02:41:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Feb 2003 02:41:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.78) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Feb 2003 02:41:47 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: notify@yahoogroups.com Received: from [66.218.67.156] by n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Feb 2003 02:41:47 -0000 Date: 13 Feb 2003 02:41:43 -0000 Message-ID: <1045104103.286096.57305.w35@yahoogroups.com> X-eGroups-Application: files X-Yahoo-Group-Post: system From: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: New file uploaded to amstereoforum MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello, This email message is a notification to let you know that a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the amstereoforum group. File : /mp3-usa/wbz-st03.mp3 Uploaded by : kevtronics Description : A recording of 1030 WBZ from Boston, MA as heard in AM Stereo via skywave DX on February 12, 2003, using an MCS 3050 tuner (with audio response adjusted to suit DX conditions). This is the first time WBZ has been heard transmitting in Stereo since October 2001. You can access this file at the URL http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum/files/mp3-usa/wbz-st03.mp3 To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/files Regards, kevtronics From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Wed Feb 12 19:34:26 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 13 Feb 2003 03:34:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 59499 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2003 03:34:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Feb 2003 03:34:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14204.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.146) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Feb 2003 03:34:22 -0000 Message-ID: <20030213033422.75808.qmail@web14204.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.162.18.17] by web14204.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 12 Feb 2003 19:34:22 PST Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 19:34:22 -0800 (PST) Subject: We're here to talk about AM Stereo To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio John X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 13 Feb 2003 03:48:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 28144 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2003 03:48:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Feb 2003 03:48:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14204.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.146) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Feb 2003 03:48:47 -0000 Message-ID: <20030213034847.79661.qmail@web14204.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.162.18.17] by web14204.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 12 Feb 2003 19:48:47 PST Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 19:48:47 -0800 (PST) Subject: Please pass along compliments to WBZ To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio WBZ has some great sounding commercials and music tonight! Please leave them a message, or better yet MAIL THEM A LETTER, telling them how great they sound in stereo (they really do sound great)! http://wbz1030.com/feedback/ __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Shopping - Send Flowers for Valentine's Day http://shopping.yahoo.com From sub07@ridien.com Wed Feb 12 20:22:33 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: sub07@ridien.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 13 Feb 2003 04:22:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 61829 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2003 04:22:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Feb 2003 04:22:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Feb 2003 04:22:32 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.151] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Feb 2003 04:22:31 -0000 Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 04:22:31 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: KDKA - was {AMSF} 1030 WBZ BACK IN STEREO!!!!! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <000c01c2d2ed$c144f840$6500a8c0@suscom.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 653 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Robert Sillett " X-Originating-IP: 209.195.176.173 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=93468082 X-Yahoo-Profile: sillett --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Joe Esposito" wrote: > > Does KDKA still have their STEREO equipment? > I live 25 miles north of Pittsburgh. KDKA turned off stereo several years ago. They were in C-QUAM for many years. They used to call themselves KDKA AM Stereo, but now are KDKA News/Talk. KDKA still does it's self-propaganda about being the first commercial radio station; however, they never mention being the first AM Stereo station. Pittsburgh used to have several AM Stereo stations, but today the only station I can pick up is WLS Chicago. At least WBZ next door on 1030 is back in stereo! --- Bob Sillett From n0uiheric@aol.com Wed Feb 12 20:39:37 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 13 Feb 2003 04:39:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 94247 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2003 04:39:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Feb 2003 04:39:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r05.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.101) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Feb 2003 04:39:36 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-r05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.84.9eb21f7 (3924) for ; Wed, 12 Feb 2003 23:39:23 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <84.9eb21f7.2b7c7b7b@aol.com> Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 23:39:23 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} End IBOC-DAB Now! To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih AM and FM are generally not suited to digital broadcasting (just look at how incompatible digital TV is to analog TV). If we had eliminated analog radio, all our radios will sound like are fax machines. You should read the reports from the CBC and the Virginia Center for The Public Press; they should convince you (they certainly did for me) that AM and FM are not suited to digital broadcasting. This is why IBOC-DAB should be scrapped, once and for all. All IBOC-DAB will do is reduce the coverage areas of these radio stations to no more than a Class B1/C3 FM station (even a 50 kW AM like WGN would lose "super-coverage" status, as in a nighttime 750-mile radius), and make 500 million current radios obsolete. In other words, every one of our radios would have to be replaced (and most Americans cannot afford the thousands of dollars it would cost to buy IBOCrap receivers). The challenge here is to incorporate DSP technology into current analog receivers. This is REAL digital radio, not the IBOCrap that the industry wants to force on us. The marketplace approach was a dismal failure in the determination of an AM Stereo standard in the United States (which eventually went Motorola's way). IBOCrap receivers will be prohibitively expensive; the price won't come down for at least ten years if it is to ever be implemented (and IBOCrap shouldn't, under any circumstances). We would lose a lot of FM stations (including most of the non-commercial stations; the only ones providing any real radio anymore) and most of the independent AM stations. I see IBOCrap as nothing more than a power grab by big business to control the radio landscape. Scrapping IBOCrap now would save the industry lots of money, and keep the industry from sliding into financial bankruptcy (the radio industry in the United States is already morally bankrupt). 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From jbyrns@enteract.com Wed Feb 12 20:44:19 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 13 Feb 2003 04:44:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 6199 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2003 04:44:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Feb 2003 04:44:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Feb 2003 04:44:18 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.164] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Feb 2003 04:44:18 -0000 Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 04:44:17 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: We're here to talk about AM Stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20030213033422.75808.qmail@web14204.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2317 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.134 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John P." wrote: > > J.B.: I don't understand why you frequent our list when our interest > is in high-quality stereo AM broadcasting, and by reading your posts > it appears you have no love for stereo AM at all - so why ARE you > here? > An iBiquity spy? If I were an iBiquity spy I wouldn't be telling now would I? On the other hand this is an open forum, at least until Kevin gets a heavy handed again, so it is hardly necessary for iBiquity to send covert spies. The truth is that I came here because I am interested in the history of the MW AM broadcast band, and the history and technology of "AM stereo". But when I first arrived here, I found that the subject matter of the group wasn't really "AM stereo" but was instead negative "IBOC" bashing. Unlike most people here, who seem to be in denial, I recognize that analog AM stereo, which you seem to consider the only true "AM stereo", is a technology that didn't make it in the marketplace of public opinion, and is rapidly fading into the history books. I don't know if the iBiquity digital AM stereo system, known as "HD radio", will succeed where the analog systems before it failed, or if AM will remain a monophonic analog medium, but it is clear that the analog AM stereo systems had their chance, were not accepted by the public, and are unlikely to be accepted in the future for a litany of reasons. > Were here for positive updates to the AM band and receivers for > stereo reception. If you are "here for positive updates to the AM band and receivers for stereo reception", why did I find, when I first arrived, that the great majority of messages were negative ones about the "HD radio" "AM stereo" system? "HD radio" is "AM stereo", why not take a positive attitude, and work to help improve the technology, help make it all it can be? > FWIW: You were correct about the "original Expanded Band". When > the FCC tacked another 100KHz onto the AM band at 1500KHz, they > spaced the channels on 20KHz spacing for a 'hi-fi' band. I thought the only question was the details, like the actual channel spacing, and the dates the wide channel spacing was in effect? I believe WQXR was the New York's station in this "hi-fi" segment of the band. John From amymousie@yahoo.com Wed Feb 12 21:19:49 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 13 Feb 2003 05:19:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 44047 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2003 05:19:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Feb 2003 05:19:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.83) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Feb 2003 05:19:47 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.128] by n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Feb 2003 05:19:47 -0000 Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 05:19:47 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: We're here to talk about AM Stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20030213033422.75808.qmail@web14204.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1167 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 67.115.108.177 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John P." wrote: > John wrote: > "...It's the same with AM stereo, nobody is interested." > > J.B.: I don't understand why you frequent our list when our interest is in > high-quality stereo AM broadcasting, and by reading your posts (as the one > above) it appears you have no love for stereo AM at all - so why ARE you here? > An iBiquity spy? I begin to wonder, too, considering he did post this: http://www.enteract.com/~jbyrns/RCA-AM-Stereo.html As well as threads on rec.antiques.radio+phono about the RCA system. > Were here for positive updates to the AM band and receivers for stereo > reception. As much as I'm just as guilty of the anti-IBOC stuff, I agree with you-- This group, and the few other AM stereo groups/lists, are - supposed- to be a positive force in AM stereo, and not the host of vitriol towards anything else. Being that, we lose our focus on why we all gather on these lists: AM stereo. Me? I'm working on designing a recreation of RCA's AM stereo test receiver from 1959, with some modifications. I love AM stereo, and I love DX. Amy. <:3 )~~~ From powell@conterra.com Wed Feb 12 21:44:50 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: powell@conterra.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 13 Feb 2003 05:44:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 42629 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2003 05:44:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Feb 2003 05:44:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mx.matrixconsulting.net) (65.199.24.6) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Feb 2003 05:44:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 8035 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2003 05:44:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO bsae-skqpk3w8p5) (66.112.193.102) by mx.matrixconsulting.net with SMTP; 13 Feb 2003 05:44:47 -0000 Organization: BEARly Organized To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 00:44:35 -0500 Subject: more skywave or nothing.... Message-ID: <3E4AEA73.19888.5B4338@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: <1045102289.2442.57401.m13@yahoogroups.com> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.01) From: "Powell E. Way III" Reply-To: powell@conterra.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=8062869 X-Yahoo-Profile: W4OPW On 13 Feb 2003 at 2:11, wrote: > Message: 10 > Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2003 21:54:14 -0000 > From: "John " > Subject: Re: Skywave or NOTHING > > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Powell E. Way III" < > powell@c...> wrote: > > > > And where I'd like to live, and a friend lives...it's skywave or > > nothing And when IBOC comes along that's all it will be NOTHING. > > > > Where I live, I might not have ANY MW signals I can get on IBOC. IF > > everyone that could here in Columbia did, I am 6 miles from > > downtown, and I will have no one to listen to. If you say FM I'll be > > tempted to send you 500 gigbytes of bad language. There's nothing > > worth listening to. > > Why would one expect AM to have better things to listen to than FM? > It my have more obscure programming, but that is just an artifact of > its lack of popularity, FM was once in the same position. Some folks ( like WKDK where I work part time) actually try and do put out a popular locally produced product. > The answer to both problems, is to forget AM & FM, and get an XM > receiver, which will give you coverage most everywhere in the US, and > offers a wide selection of programming. I'm listening to the XM > receiver now, as I type this. If you don't like XM there's always the > competing company, and I understand that at least one of the satellite > television providers also offers a "radio" package. This is the 21st > century, skywave service on the MW band is an anachronism from the > past century. I just have a problem PAYING for a satellite service that may be not be around in a few years. Right now I can't afford it. > > WVOC on 560 can not pass IBOC on the night 3 tower DA. It most > > likely will not pass daytimes. It was VERY shaky and unstable with > > the AM Stereo ( Harris system). The 4 tower 1320 array won't either. > > The day might. I doubt CC is going to spend upwards of $500,000 or > > more to try. Citadel won't on the 1320. They can sell the land and > > more condos go there. > > That makes those stations candidates for the weeding out process that > IBOC will hopefully accomplish. The remaining stations will be the > foundation for a healthier MW band, once the weaker and poorly > designed stations are weeded out. WVOC was the first radio station in SC. If they can redo the system and get 5 /1 KW OK. > > The FM's here are so horridly processed they aren't worth listening > > to. > > What makes this problem unique to FM? You could wake up tomorrow and > find your favorite AM station is being "horridly processed". Even > "digital" can't escape "horrid processing", it's a fact of life. It is NOW. Most AM's arent anymore. > > OH and your gratuitous slam on vinyl. I have LOTS of big band stuff > > that has yet to be released to CD. I do wish Capitol would release > > Harry James in HIFI volumes 1 and 2, They HAVE released a lot of his > > other stuff. At least the 2 albums are pristine! Not stereo being > > 1955, but one of the albums DOES have (!!!) variable grove spacing. > > How did they do that without computers? > > What "gratuitous slam on vinyl", what did I say? I have a modest > collection of vinyl myself. I probably have in excess of 1,000 LP's > judging by sampling the number of LP's per inch of shelf space. Maybe > some day I will get around to cataloging them. I will say this in > favor of CD's, they are far more convenient than LP's, and the better > ones have far better sound quality than the best LP's. But that's > just a result of the physics of it, not a "gratuitous slam". > John Maybe it was an attempt at being funny. I just took it as a slam.' CD's do not inherently sound better. In fact a piece of vinyl can have better frequency response than a CD. The S/N ratio of a CD is better. And I wish the CD companies would stop all this wild compression they are using.... Prior to 1941 the 1500 to 1600 band was the experimental hifi band. OH....540 wasn't added until 1955. Powell From amstereorules@msn.com Wed Feb 12 21:51:00 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereorules@msn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 13 Feb 2003 05:50:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 45279 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2003 05:50:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Feb 2003 05:50:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Feb 2003 05:50:58 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.174] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Feb 2003 05:50:58 -0000 Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 05:50:58 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: We're here to talk about AM Stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 82 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amstereorules " X-Originating-IP: 205.188.209.76 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=130870594 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereorules Well jburns- it look like you've quickly became the whipping boy of this group. From amstereorules@msn.com Wed Feb 12 21:56:52 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereorules@msn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 13 Feb 2003 05:56:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 71172 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2003 05:56:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Feb 2003 05:56:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.83) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Feb 2003 05:56:51 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.253] by n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Feb 2003 05:56:51 -0000 Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 05:56:51 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: OT: Stereo Oldies Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 599 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amstereorules " X-Originating-IP: 205.188.209.76 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=130870594 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereorules >Wouldn't that be 3dB down? It would be 6dB down in the channel it >was originally on, but it would appear in both channels, for an >increase of 3dB, leaving a net of 3dB down, not 6dB. No jbyrns, it is 6Db's. Try this experiment: Run single channel audio )continuous tone is best, say 1KC)to your amplifier, watch it's level on a VU meter/ Now flip the switch from "stereo" to "mono" and it should drop 6Db's on the VU meter in both channels. We're talking a VU meter, which measures voltage, and not a power (wattage) meter for our little discussion here, okay?. Try it Johnnie! Ragnar From amymousie@yahoo.com Wed Feb 12 22:00:11 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 13 Feb 2003 06:00:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 55981 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2003 06:00:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Feb 2003 06:00:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.70) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Feb 2003 06:00:10 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.148] by n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Feb 2003 06:00:10 -0000 Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 06:00:09 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Skywave or NOTHING Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 6249 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 67.115.108.177 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "amymousie " < > amymousie@y...> wrote: > > > > And considering operational lifespans if satelklites (5-15 years), > > plus the proprietary subscription nature of these services, there is > > no guarantee for continual long-term operation of these services. > > (Anyone remember Iridium?) > > I remember Iridium, and it is still operational, and you can still get > an Iridium phone, and subscribe to the Iridium service. Iridium is > not a good example of a system that is no longer operational, rather > it is an example of a system whose original business plan was flawed, > in that the demand for the Iridium service that had been anticipated, > did not materialize. It's the same with AM stereo, nobody is > interested. It's an interesting coincidence that both the Iridium, > and AM stereo systems are the developments of the same company. The Iridium service went out of business several years back, but remains operational because some other company took over and presently maintains the service. These satellites were dormant for a couple years, though, while Iridium went through bankruptcy. The satellites will still have to be replaced as their fuel and batteries give out, satellites themselves falling out of orbit, or damaged from geomagnetic storms. My point being that there are alot of dead satellites up there, at least those that haven't burnt up on reentry, and others rendered useless by proprietary operators going out of business. Satellites are useful and reliable, but not in the long term. There simply is no guarantee they will be supported in the future, and it's a mistake to believe they will be indefinately. My "Alfredol Lite" transmitter- or even a simple 1-tube mono transmitter from a 1930s design- will outlast any satellite in orbit. Maybe outlast me. > You really have a hang-up on the long-term operation of various > systems. You may be right, satellites may be doomed, but if they are, > we are in for a lot of trouble. Unless things have changed in the > last couple of years, both radio and television networking is totally > dependent on satellites, and if the satellites go out, there are going > to be some serious problems. Although I assume there is enough unused > fiber in the ground that terrestrial networking could be put back into > operation fairly quickly. People tend to believe things last indefinately, especially things wioth complicated infrastructures. Conventional analog terrestrial broadcast radio requires no eleborate infrastructure to be self-maintaining- All it takes is one person to give enough of a damn to throw on a switch and make sure it works, and be willing to use it- ideally, constructively. AM and FM broadcasting can survive just about any catastrophe thrown at them, short of being mandated as illegal- and evben that is dependent on the ability of the government mandating it so to still be in control- No guarantees there. Just about anyone can build an AM or FM system (transmitter or receiver - or both!) from just about any surplus parts and a library card (or they have access to said library with 100 years' worth of knowledge and technology at their disposal). Digital is alot more difficult to do from scratch. As someone else today pointed out, the usefulness of these "obsolete" technologies, as you have referred to them as, is just as much a matter of national security- There is a readily-available infrastructure that is not dependent on any proprietary, corporate technology that has been thriving longer than any of us on this list have ever lived, and will continue to thrive and live on for the next hundred years, as long as there are people who care to know about this technology, and we don't revert back to a preindustrial stage where all such knowlege is wiped out, radio will go on for centuries, even millennia to come. But of AM stereo? Very little of AM stereo technology is original and proprietary, even in C-QUAM, and relies on technological concepts developed decades before they could be used practically. Even the simplest AM stereo system, the RCA AM/FM stereo system, will survive, even though it's almost completely unknown today, just because the concepts behind it are simple enough, even the most inexperienced electronics tinkerer could build it. Can't do that with digital, unless you buy their chips. > Another problem is the GPS satellites that now play a crucial role in > the operation of much earth bound infrastructure that you might not > think was dependent on satellites, and that has nothing to do with > position determination. Yes, we've gotten a bit too dependent on things like GPS, which could collapse just as easily, either by losing satellites (which has happened) or the collapse of the service that oversees the system. (ie: construction, launbch, maintainance.) > > Thanks to solar magnetic storms, every few years a number of > > satellites get knocked out of service, and are expensive to replace. > > > > I would not hold my breath on the long-term feasability of these > > systems - Satellite telecommunications has been quietly reinventing > > itself every few years out of necessity. And if this economy > > collapses outright, or even worse, this nation (which seriously > > looks possible, now), I wouldn't count on any long-term terrestrial > > support. (Reminds me of banks. Remember them, back when you could > > count on your savings to still be at the same bank 50 years hence? > > And when banks were used to hold inheritable properties across > > generations? It's missing things like that that I don't trust > > conservative governments who make it easy to be transient- Business > > for today; who cares for tomorrow?) > > I'm not at all sure that I follow what you are trying to say about > Banks, or if it is even accurate? I'm old enough to remember bank closures and mergers, where millions panicked when they thought they'd lose their savings, or important documents that are supposed to outlast their owners. Amy. <:3 )~~~ From amstereorules@msn.com Wed Feb 12 22:03:21 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereorules@msn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 13 Feb 2003 06:03:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 16212 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2003 06:03:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Feb 2003 06:03:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Feb 2003 06:03:20 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.164] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Feb 2003 06:03:20 -0000 Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 06:03:20 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: AM stereo Round up on ebay Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 721 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amstereorules " X-Originating-IP: 205.188.209.76 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=130870594 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereorules >I hadn't heard of the YAMAHA TX-492 FM/AM STEREO TUNER being >auctioned as eBay item 3005970004. Which AM stereo system(s) does >the TX-492 support? Is it C-QUAM? Is it a single system radio, or >a multi system radio? Johnnie, I beleive that TX-492 is a single-system MW AM stereo detector (for your favorite and mine... the Motorola system). They stopped making multi-mode (Kahn, cQUAM, Magnavox, Harris) stereo detectors long before 1992. You remember 1992, gas was $1 gallon and Bill Clinton mandated the cQUAM system for states. And hey speaking of Billy, isn't his wife great- who else would let him get some on the side at work, and then go on vacation with him? What a woman. Remember, AMStereoRules From amstereorules@msn.com Wed Feb 12 22:12:11 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereorules@msn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 13 Feb 2003 06:12:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 69928 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2003 06:12:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Feb 2003 06:12:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Feb 2003 06:12:11 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.184] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Feb 2003 06:12:10 -0000 Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 06:12:09 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: NEW AM BROADCAST FORMAT Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 844 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amstereorules " X-Originating-IP: 205.188.209.76 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=130870594 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereorules >I would not recomend completely removing the carrier because the >PLL won't have anything to lock onto. I think this new AMS (Advanced >Modulation System) that allows an effective 200% modulation with >a +125% & -100% of the envelope is a campatible solution. You could >even allow the envelope to exceed -100% modulation for higher >audio frequencies since both RF and IF filters greatly attenuate >them and it can be used as compensation for this. With both of these >mods the sidebands would be greatly enhanced in relation to the >carrier and would be much closer to a suppressed carrier system >tht is envelope compatible. Yes I agree Johnnie. I was saying we could use free running osc to zero beat the sudeband, and eliminate that power wasting MW AM carrier. It is daybreak in the land of Oz. Cheers. Remember, AMStereoRules From amymousie@yahoo.com Wed Feb 12 22:14:57 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 13 Feb 2003 06:14:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 36635 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2003 06:14:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Feb 2003 06:14:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Feb 2003 06:14:57 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.191] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Feb 2003 06:14:50 -0000 Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 06:13:45 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: less am stations Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2790 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 67.115.108.177 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "amymousie " < > amymousie@y...> wrote: > > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " > > wrote: > > > > > > Didn't the FCC experiment with that in the 1930's, and then gave > > > up on it? The 1500 kHz to 1600 kHz segement of the band had wide > > > channel spacing for a while, it may have even been 39 kHz kHz, I > > > can't remember for sure if it was 20 kHz, or 30 kHz spacing. > > > Also, having a hi-fi MW AM service eventually became redundant > > > with the introduction of FM in 1941, which provided the hi-fi > > > service. > > > > > > One question, if they had gone to 20 kHz spacing in 1940, wouldn't > > > that have doubled the number of stations on each channel, creating > > > more co channel interference, and requiring a significant new > > > investment in directional antenna arrays by the stations that were > > > already in existence at that time? > > > > You are thinking of the "Apex" band that was in use then, in the > > 26MHz band- Wideband AM. Today, the only remnants of the Apex band > > are STLs and remote feeds, some now using narrowband FM (like WLW, > > which I HAVE received from here in California). > > I assure you that I know what the "Apex band" band was, and that is > not what I was talking about. When you said I was "thinking of the > Apex band", were you referring to my comment on the 1500 kHz to 1600 > kHz segment of the MW band, or my reference to the start of FM > broadcasting in 1941? You mentioned about 20kHz spacings, which the Apex bands (plural) were. Taken from: http://members.aol.com/jeff560/jeff.html these show the distribution of Apex AM and FM stations between 1939- 1942: http://members.aol.com/jeff560/1939apex.html http://members.aol.com/jeff570/1940fm.html http://members.aol.com/jeff1070/1942fmra.html Just as an aside, these were the early TV station lineups in the 22MHz band- Mediumwave TV: http://members.aol.com/jeff570/1930tv.html http://members.aol.com/jeff560/1931tv.html A bit of history on the TV channel 1 issue, which also intersects with Apex services of the time: http://members.aol.com/jeff560/tvch1.html Just as an aside, here's a chronology of early TV, since the early TV systems used mediumwave (below 3MHz): http://members.aol.com/jeff560/chronotv.html And lastly, a couple pages about stations that were Apex and early FM broadcasters: http://www.ggninfo.com/yankee1.htm http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/ggninfo/17.htm Just as another aside, the company that apparantly invented quadrature AM, saw somewhere else on the 'net, particularly for television, was Philco. Amy. <:3 )~~~ From jsgil@hal-pc.org Thu Feb 13 00:13:32 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 13 Feb 2003 08:13:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 5633 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2003 08:13:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Feb 2003 08:13:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.89) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Feb 2003 08:13:29 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.154] by n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Feb 2003 08:13:29 -0000 Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 08:13:28 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Skywave or NOTHING Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1088 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.191 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " wrote: > > That makes those stations candidates for the weeding out process that > IBOC will hopefully accomplish. The remaining stations will be the > foundation for a healthier MW band, once the weaker and poorly > designed stations are weeded out. > You make it sound like that some stations are expendable and others not. Like saying that a person doesn't deserve to live because they don't have a college education and are not deserving of the basics like food & clothing. The ones to lose out are most likely the ones who offer the most back to the community and fullfil their community service 10 time over. The survivors will be the ones who abuse their privilidges offered to them by the FCC and have completely forgotten about public service. I have to say that the local Pacifica station provides the vast majority of public service that all the commercial broadcasters have abandoned. It definitely has a good connection with the local public that has kept the Spirit of Radio alive. JSG From ccuff@in4web.com Thu Feb 13 00:45:17 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 13 Feb 2003 08:45:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 26645 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2003 08:45:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Feb 2003 08:45:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Feb 2003 08:45:16 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.27]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 03:41:45 -0500 Message-ID: <004a01c2d33a$f538cee0$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: AM stereo Round up on ebay Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 03:36:08 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 I won that Yamaha- It uses the Toshiba TA2040 IC, and is CQUAM only. It was made in 1998. CC ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, February 13, 2003 1:03 AM Subject: {AMSF} Re: AM stereo Round up on ebay > >I hadn't heard of the YAMAHA TX-492 FM/AM STEREO TUNER being From n0uiheric@aol.com Thu Feb 13 01:23:47 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 13 Feb 2003 09:23:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 54657 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2003 09:23:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Feb 2003 09:23:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m03.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.6) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Feb 2003 09:23:46 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-m03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.1c9.5042f55 (2612) for ; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 04:23:39 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1c9.5042f55.2b7cbe1b@aol.com> Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 04:23:39 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Skywave or NOTHING To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih I opted for a shortwave converter instead of XM Satellite Radio...I get more programming for free on shortwave. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From jsgil@hal-pc.org Thu Feb 13 05:18:11 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 13 Feb 2003 13:18:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 69513 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2003 13:18:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Feb 2003 13:18:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.87) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Feb 2003 13:18:10 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.185] by n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Feb 2003 13:18:10 -0000 Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 13:18:09 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: AM stereo Round up on ebay Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <004a01c2d33a$f538cee0$0101a8c0@pavilion> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 298 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.111 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Christopher Cuff" wrote: > I won that Yamaha- It uses the Toshiba TA2040 IC, and is CQUAM only. It was > made in 1998. > CC Is this another C-QuAM chip? I thought that Toshiba made the TA8120 & TA8124 or have they brought out a 3rd chip. JSG From amstereoguy@hotmail.com Thu Feb 13 06:18:58 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereoguy@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 13 Feb 2003 14:18:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 49724 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2003 14:18:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Feb 2003 14:18:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (207.68.165.75) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Feb 2003 14:18:55 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 06:18:55 -0800 Received: from 208.228.96.20 by sea2fd.sea2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 14:18:55 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: AM stereo Round up on ebay Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 09:18:55 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 13 Feb 2003 14:18:55.0669 (UTC) FILETIME=[D7958650:01C2D36A] From: "Chris Cuff" X-Originating-IP: [208.228.96.20] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37866059 The TA2040 came out in 1994, as a digital only version of the TA8124- it lacks the LED drivers for the extra 2 "steering" LED's, and it has an output pin for the signal detect for stopping during auto scan. Otherwise, it is electronically the same. Aiwa and Yamaha are the only ones to use this IC, as far as Iknow. CC >From: "jsgilst " > _________________________________________________________________ Help STOP SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Feb 13 07:12:21 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 13 Feb 2003 15:12:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 40077 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2003 15:12:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Feb 2003 15:12:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web12808.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.174.43) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Feb 2003 15:12:13 -0000 Message-ID: <20030213151213.8598.qmail@web12808.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [66.200.203.66] by web12808.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 07:12:13 PST Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 07:12:13 -0800 (PST) Subject: Response from WBZ To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "Kevin T." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics Here's the reply I got today.... --- "Hess, Robert P" wrote: > From: "Hess, Robert P" > To: Kevin T. > Subject: WBZ > Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 09:48:32 -0500 > > Kevin, > > WBZ has discontinued broadcasting in the old AM stereo format some time > ago. We never got around to disconnecting the old stereo equipment on > the backup transmitter, which is rarely on the air. > > We will begin broadcasting in digital AM stereo in a few weeks. The > quality will be similar to FM quality. Unfortunately, the new digital > standard is not compatible with the AM stereo old standard. Our digital > broadcasts will, initially, only be in the day time. Digital receivers > will be on the market later this year. > > Bob Hess > Director of Engineering. __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Shopping - Send Flowers for Valentine's Day http://shopping.yahoo.com From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Feb 13 07:16:42 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 13 Feb 2003 15:16:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 79479 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2003 15:16:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Feb 2003 15:16:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.66) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Feb 2003 15:16:41 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.169] by n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Feb 2003 15:16:40 -0000 Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 15:16:40 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: AM stereo Round up on ebay Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 577 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics >> I won that Yamaha- It uses the Toshiba TA2040 IC > > Is this another C-QuAM chip? I thought that Toshiba made the > TA8120 & TA8124 or have they brought out a 3rd chip. Yes, the TA2040 is Toshiba's third C-Quam decoder chip. It was designed to work exclusively with digital-tuning radios, and as such, lacks the TA8124's manual tuning indicators. I have an Aiwa bookshelf stereo system from 1999, which according to Chris, was also designed to use the TA2040, but unfortunately the U.S. model was not equipped with the AM Stereo circuitry installed. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Feb 13 07:27:40 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 13 Feb 2003 15:27:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 99224 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2003 15:27:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Feb 2003 15:27:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Feb 2003 15:27:39 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.158] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Feb 2003 15:27:39 -0000 Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 15:27:39 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: www.amstereoradio.com not working? Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 372 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics Right now I am having trouble connecting to the http://www.amstereoradio.com server. Both the actual site content on my CompuServe OurWorld server as well as the backup link at http://amstereo.s5.com are working fine. This might just be a fluke, but in case the problem persists, which one of us actually owns the www.amstereoradio.com domain name registration? From jwelton@nautel.com Thu Feb 13 07:44:37 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jwelton@nautel.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 13 Feb 2003 15:44:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 51900 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2003 15:44:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Feb 2003 15:44:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailserver.nautel.com) (24.222.25.85) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Feb 2003 15:44:33 -0000 Received: FROM jeff-welton BY mailserver.nautel.com ; Thu Feb 13 11:45:22 2003 -0400 To: "Kevin T. " , amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 11:41:33 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: {AMSF} www.amstereoradio.com not working? Message-ID: <3E4B846E.31049.83829C@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.02a) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body From: "Jeff Welton" Reply-To: jwelton@nautel.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=26918678 > but in case the problem persists, which one of us actually owns the > www.amstereoradio.com domain name registration? From Network Solutions "whois": Registrant: Starvision Access PO Box 57 Browns Plains Logan, Qld 4118 AU +61 414 466 663 Domain Name: AMSTEREORADIO.COM Administrative Contact: Trim, Matthew matt@sv.net.au PO Box 57 Browns Plains Logan, Qld 4118 AU +61 414 466 663 Technical Contact: Trim, Matthew matt@sv.net.au PO Box 57 Browns Plains Logan, Qld 4118 AU +61 414 466 663 Record last updated 07-17-2002 10:20:43 AM Record expires on 11-14-2003 Record created on 11-14-2001 Domain servers in listed order: NS2.ZONEEDIT.COM 65.125.228.66 NS4.ZONEEDIT.COM 216.98.150.236 Regards, Jeff Welton Nautel Customer Service Dept. Tel.: 1-902-823-3900 ext. 127 Fax: 1-902-823-3183 email: jwelton@nautel.com From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Thu Feb 13 08:16:42 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 13 Feb 2003 16:16:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 48202 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2003 16:16:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Feb 2003 16:16:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14204.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.146) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Feb 2003 16:16:39 -0000 Message-ID: <20030213161639.20411.qmail@web14204.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.45.202.244] by web14204.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 08:16:39 PST Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 08:16:39 -0800 (PST) Subject: Enjoy WBZ while we can To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio As we had suspected, only temporary, unfortunately, so record while you can. WBZ wrote: "Hi, WBZ has discontinued broadcasting in the old AM stereo format some time ago. We never got around to disconnecting the old stereo equipment on the backup transmitter, which is rarely on the air, but is today. We will begin broadcasting in digital AM stereo in a few weeks. The quality will be similar to FM quality. Unfortunately, the new digital standard is not compatible with the AM stereo old standard. Our digital broadcasts will, initially, only be in the day time. Digital receivers will be on the market later this year. Bob Hess Director of Engineering." __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Shopping - Send Flowers for Valentine's Day http://shopping.yahoo.com From narkspud@hotmail.com Thu Feb 13 09:33:51 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: narkspud@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 13 Feb 2003 17:33:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 99415 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2003 17:33:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Feb 2003 17:33:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Feb 2003 17:33:50 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.179] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Feb 2003 17:33:50 -0000 Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 17:33:49 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Enjoy WBZ while we can Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20030213161639.20411.qmail@web14204.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 220 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "narkspud " X-Originating-IP: 67.89.146.146 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=81956306 X-Yahoo-Profile: narkspud --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John P." wrote: > As we had suspected, only temporary, unfortunately, so record while you can. . . .and what wonderful before/after examples those'll make! From amymousie@yahoo.com Thu Feb 13 09:49:36 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 13 Feb 2003 17:49:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 32062 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2003 17:49:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Feb 2003 17:49:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Feb 2003 17:49:35 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.145] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Feb 2003 17:49:35 -0000 Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 17:49:33 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Enjoy WBZ while we can Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 799 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 66.127.243.98 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "narkspud " wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John P." > wrote: > > As we had suspected, only temporary, unfortunately, so record > while you can. > > . . .and what wonderful before/after examples those'll make! All I can say is, WBZ is shooting itself in the foot- "A fool and his money are soon departed." "Let's all support a system that will be too expensive for most consumers, expensive to purchase and install (not to mention anual/periodic license renewal), iffy at best when it works, and ignore an already existing ~10% of the listener population that has AM stereo already!" (Just keep in mind MTS TV stereo is only in -15%- of the TVs and VCRs today!) Amy. <:3 )~~~ From amymousie@yahoo.com Thu Feb 13 10:01:46 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 13 Feb 2003 18:01:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 45156 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2003 18:01:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Feb 2003 18:01:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.68) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Feb 2003 18:01:45 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.143] by n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Feb 2003 18:01:44 -0000 Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 18:01:44 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Enjoy WBZ while we can Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1120 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 66.127.243.98 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "amymousie " wrote: > > "Let's all support a system that will be too expensive for most > consumers, expensive to purchase and install (not to mention > anual/periodic license renewal), iffy at best when it works, and > ignore an already existing ~10% of the listener population that has > AM stereo already!" (Just keep in mind MTS TV stereo is only in - 15%- > of the TVs and VCRs today!) "Yes, I -want- to broadcast in a system that's incompatible with most radios, generate interfering hash, and tell listeners that if they don't want the hash, to just go buy a very expensive radio with no likeliness the price will go down for for several years yet! Yes, I want to drive away listeners from my service with inferior sound and lots of noise!" (And yes, with E147 DAB having been available for over 6 years now, only just -now- are prices dropping to a more affordable price, ie: in the UK, 99 UKP was the barrier, and that's just been reached. At least E147 doesn't interfere with existing broadcast service.) Amy. <:3 )~~~ From philipr@irac.pe.ca Thu Feb 13 10:06:13 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 13 Feb 2003 18:06:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 97597 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2003 18:06:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Feb 2003 18:06:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Feb 2003 18:06:12 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.182] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Feb 2003 18:06:12 -0000 Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 18:06:12 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Enjoy WBZ while we can Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1959 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking As WBZ pounds into the Maritimes at night, and has a pretty good predusk and post dawn signal as well, this will give me my first real opportunity to "enjoy" hearing IBOC "Splattermatic" [no offense to Sparkomatic - I loved playing with their car audio speakers as a kid]. Sure, I did hear some possible IBOC type splatter months ago while traveling likely from WOR as I was listening to CHTN outside their 0.5 mv/m contour, but it could have been Chris tuning up a new "Alfredo-Megaton" transmitter ;) Of course, I wasn't that far from Hackett's Cove, so you never know - Jeff may have been experimenting, with a valid license from Industry Canada of course. [Just kidding] For the record, please note that I didn't say WOR was acting illegally. In fact, even without IBOC, its pretty easy for 710 to splatter onto 720, and vice versa, fully legally. WBZ had a nice solid pilot last night, great sound, and yes I emailed them and received the official response. Of course they were splattering a bit onto KDKA, but then again, I was listening on a wideband receiver, a Delco UX-1 and a Heath PT-1 - the splatter went away when I switched to narrow ;) As for my "typical radios", I don't own any - I like "atypical radios" I guess! Remaining an enthusiastic supporter of CQUAM AM Stereo [I've heard it, I like it, it sounds great , it doesn't trash the AM band, and when switched to mono on the receiver end doesn't limit coverage one iota] while I'm skeptical, yet intrigued by AM IBOC. Phil R. P.S. I miss hearing from Tom and Kerry - once the fireworks had died down, they had a lot to contribute. --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "narkspud " wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John P." > wrote: > > As we had suspected, only temporary, unfortunately, so record > while you can. > > . . .and what wonderful before/after examples those'll make! From amymousie@yahoo.com Thu Feb 13 10:26:52 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 13 Feb 2003 18:26:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 38844 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2003 18:26:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Feb 2003 18:26:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Feb 2003 18:26:42 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.251] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Feb 2003 18:26:41 -0000 Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 18:26:41 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Enjoy WBZ while we can Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1608 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 66.127.243.98 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Phil Rafuse " wrote: > > For the record, please note that I didn't say WOR was acting > illegally. In fact, even without IBOC, its pretty easy for 710 to > splatter onto 720, and vice versa, fully legally. This is normal behavior with most radios. Just think what happens when you add an extra-wide hash. It then sucks, bigtime. > Remaining an enthusiastic supporter of CQUAM AM Stereo [I've heard > it, I like it, it sounds great , it doesn't trash the AM band, and > when switched to mono on the receiver end doesn't limit coverage one > iota] while I'm skeptical, yet intrigued by AM IBOC. And that, my fellow radio enthusiasts, is the big difference between IBOC and C-QUAM AM stereo (or any of the AM stereo systems proposed over the decades): AM stereo is transparent to the liustener without degrading the listener's ability to enjoy radio- even on a mono radio. I will honestly say those who are signing up to broadcast in IBOC are real fools, wasting money on a system whose listenership will immediately notice-- negatively. That's not good business practice, toi drive customers away, and that's -exactly- what IBOC wiull do. IBOC is a stupid choice, and iBiquity certainly has followed P.T.Barnum's example, suckering stations to invest in money most don't have, for a system that is broken on arrival, and whose receivers won't be able to compete for many years with conventional radios. I don't want hash on my radio, and I can't afford a receiver for this new system anytime soon. Amy. <:3 )~~~ From philipr@irac.pe.ca Thu Feb 13 10:32:02 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 13 Feb 2003 18:31:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 54995 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2003 18:31:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Feb 2003 18:31:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Feb 2003 18:31:45 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.252] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Feb 2003 18:31:44 -0000 Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 18:31:42 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Enjoy WBZ while we can Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2122 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking Well, based on $300 CDN for Radio Shack's lowest priced DAB pocket radio [FM plus DAB, to be exact] I don't suspect that too many people or mice will be able to afford them. Amy, perhaps you should have a cheese-side chat with Micky and Minnie so that 1560 Radio Disney [are their official calls still WQEW?] will send Goofy flying back to WGFY [duck Bob, DUCK] where he belongs and fire up the CQUAM exiter, so all the pre-teens and teens from New York to Newfoundland can listen in stereo. Much as I hate to admit it, I have been known to tune in to 1560 on the Heath PT-1 and listen to Radio Disney and even enjoyed some of the music, well, sort of. Well, it isn't a "typical radio", so don't judge my taste in music on this fact alone. Mice have good ears - thus explaining our Amy's passion for nibbling at IBOC's shortcomings. Phil R. --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "amymousie " wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "amymousie " > wrote: > > > > "Let's all support a system that will be too expensive for most > > consumers, expensive to purchase and install (not to mention > > anual/periodic license renewal), iffy at best when it works, and > > ignore an already existing ~10% of the listener population that has > > AM stereo already!" (Just keep in mind MTS TV stereo is only in - > 15%- > > of the TVs and VCRs today!) > > "Yes, I -want- to broadcast in a system that's incompatible with most > radios, generate interfering hash, and tell listeners that if they > don't want the hash, to just go buy a very expensive radio with no > likeliness the price will go down for for several years yet! Yes, I > want to drive away listeners from my service with inferior sound and > lots of noise!" > > (And yes, with E147 DAB having been available for over 6 years now, > only just -now- are prices dropping to a more affordable price, ie: > in the UK, 99 UKP was the barrier, and that's just been reached. At > least E147 doesn't interfere with existing broadcast service.) > > Amy. <:3 )~~~ From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Feb 13 10:35:06 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 13 Feb 2003 18:35:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 40957 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2003 18:35:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Feb 2003 18:35:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.66) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Feb 2003 18:35:05 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.137] by n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Feb 2003 18:35:05 -0000 Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 18:35:03 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Enjoy WBZ while we can Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1191 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > (Just keep in mind MTS TV stereo is only in -15%- of the TVs and > VCRs today!) Never underestimate the cheapness of consumer electronics manufacturers. I believe Philips is selling 19 or 20-inch TV sets with so-called "Dual Speaker Sound". What this means is that you get a stereo audio amp for the external input (VCR, DVD, etc.), and built-in stereo speakers, but the TV tuner is MONO only -- it doesn't have the MTS decoder. Anyway, the coastline of Rhode Island is in the 0.5 mV/m protected coverage area for both 1030 WBZ from Boston and 1050 WEVD from NYC. This 0.5 mV/m contour is supposed to be free from interference from other AM stations -- but that all goes out the window when IBOC is used. If/when they turn the IBOC on, 1030 WBZ will have one of its primary digital sidebands placed nicely on top of the upper half of 1050 WEVD's audio range -- thus, anybody listening in this area with at least a medium-bandwidth radio will get an annoying squealing hiss in WEVD's audio, caused by WBZ's IBOC signal. I heard the same thing myself when Lucent had their IBOC test station transmitting on 1700 kHz within the protected contour of 1680 WTTM. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Feb 13 10:42:55 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 13 Feb 2003 18:42:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 64569 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2003 18:42:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Feb 2003 18:42:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.90) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Feb 2003 18:42:54 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.249] by n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Feb 2003 18:42:53 -0000 Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 18:42:53 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Enjoy WBZ while we can Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1144 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > IBOC is a stupid choice, and iBiquity certainly has followed > P.T.Barnum's example, suckering stations to invest in money most > don't have, for a system that is broken on arrival, and whose > receivers won't be able to compete for many years with conventional > radios. IBOC is an INHERENTLY FLAWED system, because it simply cannot be used on all stations all the time. There is no inherent reason why all of the AM stations in the country, or even in the whole world, couldn't broadcast in AM Stereo without causing any negative consequences. Same thing with FM Stereo, TV Stereo, color TV, ARI, RDS, FM SCA, etc. etc.... but yet, suddenly IBOC comes along and it can only be used on some of the stations some of the time, and even exaggerates this segregation by causing extra interference to stations that can't or don't want to use IBOC. Hello!? How did this ever get approved? I can admit that IBOC is an interesting approach, and the concept behind it does have some merit. But frankly, its implementation is completely worthless and has the potential to cause much more harm than it does good. From amymousie@yahoo.com Thu Feb 13 10:43:49 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 13 Feb 2003 18:43:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 56274 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2003 18:43:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Feb 2003 18:43:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.86) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Feb 2003 18:43:48 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.131] by n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Feb 2003 18:43:43 -0000 Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 18:43:43 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Enjoy WBZ while we can Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1734 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 66.127.243.98 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Phil Rafuse " wrote: > Well, based on $300 CDN for Radio Shack's lowest priced DAB pocket > radio [FM plus DAB, to be exact] I don't suspect that too many > people or mice will be able to afford them. Getting AM stereo radios- even new- have been cheaper than this. > Amy, perhaps you should have a cheese-side chat with Micky and > Minnie so that 1560 Radio Disney [are their official calls still > WQEW?] will send Goofy flying back to WGFY [duck Bob, DUCK] where he > belongs and fire up the CQUAM exiter, so all the pre-teens and teens > from New York to Newfoundland can listen in stereo. Heh. I'm a west coast mousie, so that may not help. Plus, I'm not on good terms with the Disney house, not with alot of the stunts they have pulled in recent years. (Except having many, if not most, of the AM Radio Disney outlets in AM stereo. The one good thing I can say for Disney- Accesable music on AM, in stereo no less!) > Much as I hate to admit it, I have been known to tune in to 1560 on > the Heath PT-1 and listen to Radio Disney and even enjoyed some of > the music, well, sort of. Well, it isn't a "typical radio", so > don't judge my taste in music on this fact alone. My taste in music is far broader than most, but I prefer oldies, classic rock/pop/R&B/disco, reggae/ska, and various ethnic musics. I can live with kiddie pop and even country, jazz, even classical. :) > Mice have good ears - thus explaining our Amy's passion for nibbling > at IBOC's shortcomings. Us mice have two nice, big ears to enjoy all the sounds of the world around us- In stereo, of course. :) *Amy blushes at the compliments.* :) Amy. <:3 )~~~ From mwradio@gmx.net Thu Feb 13 11:52:47 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: mwradio@gmx.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 13 Feb 2003 19:52:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 59969 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2003 19:52:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Feb 2003 19:52:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m1.ispmail.dnbsi.com) (198.136.194.44) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Feb 2003 19:52:46 -0000 Received: from espositojm2 (0-1pool196-150.nas11.philadelphia1.pa.us.da.qwest.net [65.128.196.150]) by m1.ispmail.dnbsi.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 96C198FC3F for ; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 11:52:44 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <024e01c2d399$68467460$06630780@espositojm2> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Enjoy WBZ while we can Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 14:52:12 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Joe Esposito" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=93604673 X-Yahoo-Profile: espositojm My hometown, Johnstown, PA, is maybe 70 miles west of Pittsburgh and after Sunset WBZ splatter is heard all over KDKA-AM. I don't want to think what would happen if night-time digital transmission is ever approved. Since KDKA and WBZ are owned by the same company, I bet KD is planning on going digital soon. I know out here in Central, PA I'll get plenty IBOC interference from both stations. I like listening to Pittsburgh Pirates games on the radio. KDKA still sounds great but I miss those Stereo baseball games in the late 80's to early 90's. I just can't listen to a 16k realaudio feed from mlb.com. Joe Esposito York, PA ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, February 13, 2003 1:35 PM Subject: {AMSF} Re: Enjoy WBZ while we can > If/when they turn the IBOC on, 1030 WBZ will have one of its primary > digital sidebands placed nicely on top of the upper half of 1050 > WEVD's audio range -- thus, anybody listening in this area with at > least a medium-bandwidth radio will get an annoying squealing hiss in > WEVD's audio, caused by WBZ's IBOC signal. I heard the same thing > myself when Lucent had their IBOC test station transmitting on 1700 > kHz within the protected contour of 1680 WTTM. > > From jbyrns@enteract.com Thu Feb 13 12:23:06 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 13 Feb 2003 20:23:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 25480 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2003 20:23:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Feb 2003 20:23:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Feb 2003 20:23:04 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.171] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Feb 2003 20:23:03 -0000 Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 20:23:02 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: OT: Stereo Oldies Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1741 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.175 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "amstereorules < amstereorules@m...>" wrote: > >Wouldn't that be 3dB down? It would be 6dB down in the channel it > >was originally on, but it would appear in both channels, for an > >increase of 3dB, leaving a net of 3dB down, not 6dB. > No jbyrns, it is 6Db's. Try this experiment: Run single channel > audio )continuous tone is best, say 1KC)to your amplifier, watch it's > level on a VU meter/ Now flip the switch from "stereo" to "mono" and > it should drop 6Db's on the VU meter in both channels. We're talking > a VU meter, which measures voltage, and not a power (wattage) meter > for our little discussion here, okay?. Try it Johnnie! Ragnar You are talking nonsense here, dB's represent a power ratio. In any case I tried your experiment, using a real antique VU meter. Just as you said, and as I also said, when I flipped the switch from stereo to mono, with a monophonic source feeding one channel only, the output from that channel dropped by 6 dB. But I noticed an interesting effect, with the VU meter connected to the quiet channel, it jumped up to the same level as the first channel when I flipped the switch to mono. What we hear in the room, or automobile, is the sum of the powers from all the sources, so we have to sum the outputs of all the speakers to see how much the level really drops when we switch from stereo to mono in this experiment. Adding two equal powers is an increase of 3 dB, which leaves us with a net drop of only 3 dB, not 6 dB as you claim, when we switch from stereo to mono with a single channel source. Come on man, don't let the general level of technical competence here turn your brain to mush. John From jbyrns@enteract.com Thu Feb 13 12:27:00 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 13 Feb 2003 20:27:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 67653 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2003 20:27:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Feb 2003 20:27:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Feb 2003 20:27:00 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.172] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Feb 2003 20:26:58 -0000 Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 20:26:58 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Skywave or NOTHING Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 566 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.175 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "amymousie " < amymousie@y...> wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " > wrote: > > I'm not at all sure that I follow what you are trying to say about > > Banks, or if it is even accurate? > > I'm old enough to remember bank closures and mergers, where millions > panicked when they thought they'd lose their savings, or important > documents that are supposed to outlast their owners. A certified Geezer huh? There are not too many of you around anymore. John From jbyrns@enteract.com Thu Feb 13 12:29:03 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 13 Feb 2003 20:29:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 40153 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2003 20:29:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Feb 2003 20:29:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Feb 2003 20:29:02 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.181] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Feb 2003 20:29:02 -0000 Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 20:29:02 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: We're here to talk about AM Stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1155 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.175 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "amymousie " < amymousie@y...> wrote: > > Me? I'm working on designing a recreation of RCA's AM stereo test > receiver from 1959, with some modifications. Are you planning on modifying an actual RCA Model XF-2, or building it from scratch, or on a different chassis? Do you plan of following the RCA schematic exactly, or modifying the design somewhat. It's too bad 455 kHz ratio detector transformers aren't as easy to find as 455 kHz discriminator transformers. If one used a ratio detector, with a linear driver stage, instead of the discriminator, then the "tracking" circuit could be dispensed with, as the output of a ratio detector is proportional to the average signal input level, as well as the modulation. A dynamic diode limiter would probably accomplish the same thing, but I suspect that the numbers would come out such that an additional IF stage would be needed between the dynamic diode limiter and the discriminator. A transmitter should be easy enough, just by adding a varactor to something like the Vectronics kit, to handle the FM for the L-R signal. John From jbyrns@enteract.com Thu Feb 13 12:32:56 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 13 Feb 2003 20:32:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 98305 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2003 20:32:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Feb 2003 20:32:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.88) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Feb 2003 20:32:55 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.179] by n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Feb 2003 20:32:54 -0000 Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 20:32:54 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: less am stations Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 752 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.175 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "amymousie " < amymousie@y...> wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " > wrote: > > I assure you that I know what the "Apex band" band was, and that > > is not what I was talking about. When you said I was "thinking > > of the Apex band", were you referring to my comment on the 1500 > > kHz to 1600 kHz segment of the MW band, or my reference to the > > start of FM broadcasting in 1941? > > You mentioned about 20kHz spacings, which the Apex bands (plural) > were. Yes, I am aware that there was more than one Apex band, but according the 1940 FCC hearings into FM, there was only one Apex station licensed outside of the "main" Apex band. John From jwelton@nautel.com Thu Feb 13 12:33:12 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jwelton@nautel.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 13 Feb 2003 20:33:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 12633 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2003 20:33:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Feb 2003 20:33:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailserver.nautel.com) (24.222.25.85) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Feb 2003 20:33:09 -0000 Received: FROM jeff-welton BY mailserver.nautel.com ; Thu Feb 13 16:33:59 2003 -0400 To: "John " , amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 16:30:21 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: OT: Stereo Oldies Message-ID: <3E4BC812.15271.18BC7BC@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: References: X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.02a) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body From: "Jeff Welton" Reply-To: jwelton@nautel.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=26918678 > You are talking nonsense here, dB's represent a power ratio. Not true. dB only represents a ratio. Could be power or voltage (or current). Otherwise, why would we have 20(log (Vout/Vin))? What it's a ratio of depends on whether you're dealing with dBm, dBu, dBr, etc. > stereo to mono in this experiment. Adding two equal powers is an > increase of 3 dB, which leaves us with a net drop of only 3 dB, not 6 > dB as you claim, when we switch from stereo to mono with a single > channel source. You're both right. 3dB power = 6dB voltage, assuming a constant resistance. It's called square law. > Come on man, don't let the general level of technical competence here turn your > brain to mush. Take a deep breath, relax, and reassess based on the above. Ragnar has not made any misstatements. Nor have you. You're agreeing in the most contentious manner I've ever seen. Regards, Jeff Welton Nautel Customer Service Dept. Tel.: 1-902-823-3900 ext. 127 Fax: 1-902-823-3183 email: jwelton@nautel.com From jbyrns@enteract.com Thu Feb 13 12:35:34 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 13 Feb 2003 20:35:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 42522 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2003 20:35:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Feb 2003 20:35:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.86) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Feb 2003 20:35:34 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.132] by n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Feb 2003 20:35:34 -0000 Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 20:35:32 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Response from WBZ Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20030213151213.8598.qmail@web12808.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1111 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.175 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T." wrote: > Here's the reply I got today.... > > --- "Hess, Robert P" wrote: > From: "Hess, Robert P" > To: Kevin T. > Subject: WBZ > Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 09:48:32 -0500 > > Kevin, > > WBZ has discontinued broadcasting in the old AM stereo format some time > ago. We never got around to disconnecting the old stereo equipment on > the backup transmitter, which is rarely on the air. > > We will begin broadcasting in digital AM stereo in a few weeks. The > quality will be similar to FM quality. Unfortunately, the new digital > standard is not compatible with the AM stereo old standard. Our digital > broadcasts will, initially, only be in the day time. Digital receivers > will be on the market later this year. > > Bob Hess > Director of Engineering. This is indeed positive news. It is good to hear of more stations adopting Digital AM stereo, or "HD radio". Hopefully I won't have to wait long before stations in my region of the country start broadcasting in Digital AM stereo. John From jbyrns@enteract.com Thu Feb 13 12:39:46 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 13 Feb 2003 20:39:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 17521 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2003 20:39:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Feb 2003 20:39:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.84) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Feb 2003 20:39:45 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.182] by n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Feb 2003 20:39:43 -0000 Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 20:39:43 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Enjoy WBZ while we can Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1343 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.175 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " < kevtronics@y...> wrote: > > Anyway, the coastline of Rhode Island is in the 0.5 mV/m protected > coverage area for both 1030 WBZ from Boston and 1050 WEVD from NYC. > This 0.5 mV/m contour is supposed to be free from interference from > other AM stations -- but that all goes out the window when IBOC is > used. > > If/when they turn the IBOC on, 1030 WBZ will have one of its primary > digital sidebands placed nicely on top of the upper half of 1050 > WEVD's audio range -- thus, anybody listening in this area with at > least a medium-bandwidth radio will get an annoying squealing hiss > in WEVD's audio, caused by WBZ's IBOC signal. I heard the same > thing myself when Lucent had their IBOC test station transmitting > on 1700 kHz within the protected contour of 1680 WTTM. I can't claim to understand the subtleties of how the FCC interprets their rules, but it isn't clear to me how this situation would cause the FCC's specific interference rules to be breached? There are general clauses that prohibit doing anything that causes interference, even if it is otherwise within the rules, but I don't see any specific rule that would be "out the window" in this situation. Can you cite the interference rules that would be "out the window"? John From amstereorules@msn.com Thu Feb 13 12:44:39 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereorules@msn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 13 Feb 2003 20:44:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 29918 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2003 20:44:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Feb 2003 20:44:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Feb 2003 20:44:38 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.248] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Feb 2003 20:44:35 -0000 Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 20:44:34 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: OT: Stereo Oldies Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1591 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amstereorules " X-Originating-IP: 205.188.209.76 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=130870594 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereorules >You are talking nonsense here, dB's represent a power ratio. Wait. It depends on what dB's you're talking about. 20log is voltage and 10log is power. You can have voltage without power. >In any case I tried your experiment, using a real antique VU meter. >Just as you said, and as I also said, when I flipped the switch from >stereo to mono, with a monophonic source feeding one channel only, >the output from that channel dropped by 6 dB. Precisely. This is the voltage ratio. You may remember the original discussion had to do with remixing mono oldies to stereo. And how it is not sonically the same sound- taking stereo back to mono, when compared to the original mono track. I am not going to quibble over 3db's with you. >But I noticed an interesting effect, with the VU meter connected to >the quiet channel, it jumped up to the same level as the first >channel when I flipped the switch to mono. What we hear in the >room, or automobile, is the sum of the powers from all the sources, >so we have to sum the outputs of all the speakers to see how much >the level really drops when we switch from stereo to mono in this >experiment. Adding two equal powers is an increase of 3 dB, which >leaves us with a net drop of only 3 dB, not 6 dB as you claim, when >we switch from stereo to mono with a single channel source. Whatever you say John Boy. Tell the rest of the engineering world- they reference half power(3db's) at 0.707 and voltage at -6db's >Come on man, don't let the general level of technical competence >here turn your brain to mush. > > John From narkspud@hotmail.com Thu Feb 13 13:01:48 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: narkspud@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 13 Feb 2003 21:01:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 23150 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2003 21:01:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Feb 2003 21:01:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.90) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Feb 2003 21:01:46 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.249] by n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Feb 2003 21:01:46 -0000 Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 21:01:45 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Response from WBZ Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 171 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "narkspud " X-Originating-IP: 67.89.146.146 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=81956306 X-Yahoo-Profile: narkspud > Hopefully I won't have to > wait long before stations in my region of the country start > broadcasting in Digital AM stereo. > > John Careful what you wish for. . . From mwdx@gentoo.net Thu Feb 13 13:04:01 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: mwdx@gentoo.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 13 Feb 2003 21:04:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 26976 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2003 21:03:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Feb 2003 21:03:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailrelay1.lanl.gov) (128.165.4.101) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Feb 2003 21:03:58 -0000 Received: from cic-mail.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailrelay1.lanl.gov (8.12.3/8.12.3/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id h1DL3vBU025727 for ; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 14:03:57 -0700 Received: from gentoo.net (romulus.lanl.gov [128.165.209.40]) by cic-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.3/8.12.3/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id h1DL3vNJ008726 for ; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 14:03:57 -0700 Message-ID: <3E4C09FA.60401@gentoo.net> Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 14:11:22 -0700 Organization: Pojoaque Medium Wave DXers Club User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020826 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Response from WBZ References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Mike Westfall X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=118377141 X-Yahoo-Profile: n6kuy John wrote: > This is indeed positive news. It is good to hear of more stations > adopting Digital AM stereo, or "HD radio". Hopefully I won't have to > wait long before stations in my region of the country start > broadcasting in Digital AM stereo. Yes, we're all waiting with bated breath. When, oh WHEN do the rest of us get the joy of reduced-bandwidth audio and digital trash on the adjacent channels? -- Mike Westfall, N6KUY, WDX6O Los Alamos, New Mexico (DM65uv) My online logbooks are at http://www.gentoo.net/dxlogbook/main.mv?account=mikew From amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk Thu Feb 13 13:22:38 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 13 Feb 2003 21:22:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 12219 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2003 21:22:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Feb 2003 21:22:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Feb 2003 21:22:37 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.253] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Feb 2003 21:22:37 -0000 Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 21:22:35 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: New file uploaded to amstereoforum Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <1045104103.286096.57305.w35@yahoogroups.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 916 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Dave " X-Originating-IP: 81.7.58.41 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113985069 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereofan What's the distance Kevin ? --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com wrote: > > Hello, > > This email message is a notification to let you know that > a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the amstereoforum > group. > > File : /mp3-usa/wbz-st03.mp3 > Uploaded by : kevtronics > Description : A recording of 1030 WBZ from Boston, MA as heard in AM Stereo via skywave DX on February 12, 2003, using an MCS 3050 tuner (with audio response adjusted to suit DX conditions). This is the first time WBZ has been heard transmitting in Stereo since October 2001. > > You can access this file at the URL > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum/files/mp3-usa/wbz- st03.mp3 > > To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit > > http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/files > > Regards, > > kevtronics From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Feb 13 14:14:06 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 13 Feb 2003 22:14:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 42536 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2003 22:14:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Feb 2003 22:14:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r08.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.104) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Feb 2003 22:14:05 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.14c.1bbffc61 (3850) for ; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 17:14:00 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <14c.1bbffc61.2b7d72a8@aol.com> Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 17:14:00 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Enjoy WBZ while we can To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp << As we had suspected, only temporary, unfortunately, so record while you can. WBZ wrote: "Hi, WBZ has discontinued broadcasting in the old AM stereo format some time ago. We never got around to disconnecting the old stereo equipment on the backup transmitter, which is rarely on the air, but is today. We will begin broadcasting in digital AM stereo in a few weeks. The quality will be similar to FM quality. Unfortunately, the new digital standard is not compatible with the AM stereo old standard. Our digital broadcasts will, initially, only be in the day time. Digital receivers will be on the market later this year. Bob Hess Director of Engineering." >> Folks..the writing is on the wall...just as well face reality. Programming on stations may stay the same throughout all of this digital hype,but the improvement of radio receivers will benefit all, regardless of whether or not IBOC is a hit or not. I'm hoping we will soon hear about the lastest results from the lastest upgrade of the IBOC software. Just as an added note..I received my lastest addition of Radio World today. Quite a write up on HD-R and the consumer convention and what have you. Even on one of the pages is a picture of a portable HD radio.( page 7 of Feb issue -Radio World ). By the looks of the picture..it wont quite fit in your shirt pocket....maybe an oversized coat pocket perhaps ( pictures of items can be hard to judge ) Anyhow,the notation stated that the radio can operate for about an hour on batteries.Not bad considering the radio is an HD radio and has an MP3 player built in as well. With todays advances in technology,I'm sure we will see a more compact radio that will operate longer on batteries. There is even a write up on C.Crane and his company. Its going to be an interesting time we live in. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- Subscribe send an email to amstereo-subscribe@topica.com _______________________________________________________ From matthew.trim@eds.com Thu Feb 13 15:54:51 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: matthew.trim@eds.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 13 Feb 2003 23:54:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 42705 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2003 23:54:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Feb 2003 23:54:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO ns5.eds.com) (207.169.189.136) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Feb 2003 23:54:48 -0000 Received: from nnsy.eds.com (nnsy-2.eds.com [192.85.216.198]) by ns5.eds.com (8.11.6/8.11.1) with ESMTP id h1DNskR05686 for ; Fri, 14 Feb 2003 10:54:47 +1100 (EST) Received: from nnsy.eds.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by nnsy.eds.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1DNsif07614 for ; Fri, 14 Feb 2003 10:54:45 +1100 (EST) Received: from ausym000.exau01.exch.eds.com ([134.251.177.117]) by nnsy.eds.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1DNsib07610 for ; Fri, 14 Feb 2003 10:54:44 +1100 (EST) Received: by AUSYM000 with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id <1RDW9H0Z>; Fri, 14 Feb 2003 10:54:25 +1100 Message-ID: <33CDDBD8CAEFEB4191ABF6F799032AF238D7AC@aubwm206> To: "'amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com'" Subject: RE: {AMSF} www.amstereoradio.com not working? Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 10:54:41 +1100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-Type: text/plain From: "Trim, Matthew L" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88615102 X-Yahoo-Profile: bofh2k2000 G'day Guys, Sorry I had a server glitch - it should be back up shortly! Cheers, Matt -----Original Message----- From: Jeff Welton [mailto:jwelton@nautel.com] Sent: Friday, 14 February 2003 1:42 AM To: Kevin T. ; amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} www.amstereoradio.com not working? > but in case the problem persists, which one of us actually owns the > www.amstereoradio.com domain name registration? From Network Solutions "whois": Registrant: Starvision Access PO Box 57 Browns Plains Logan, Qld 4118 AU +61 414 466 663 Domain Name: AMSTEREORADIO.COM Administrative Contact: Trim, Matthew matt@sv.net.au PO Box 57 Browns Plains Logan, Qld 4118 AU +61 414 466 663 Technical Contact: Trim, Matthew matt@sv.net.au PO Box 57 Browns Plains Logan, Qld 4118 AU +61 414 466 663 Record last updated 07-17-2002 10:20:43 AM Record expires on 11-14-2003 Record created on 11-14-2001 Domain servers in listed order: NS2.ZONEEDIT.COM 65.125.228.66 NS4.ZONEEDIT.COM 216.98.150.236 Regards, Jeff Welton Nautel Customer Service Dept. Tel.: 1-902-823-3900 ext. 127 Fax: 1-902-823-3183 email: jwelton@nautel.com Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From mwdx@gentoo.net Thu Feb 13 15:59:22 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: mwdx@gentoo.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 13 Feb 2003 23:59:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 30994 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2003 23:59:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Feb 2003 23:59:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailrelay2.lanl.gov) (128.165.4.103) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Feb 2003 23:59:21 -0000 Received: from cic-mail.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailrelay2.lanl.gov (8.12.3/8.12.3/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id h1DNxKRV002663 for ; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 16:59:20 -0700 Received: from gentoo.net (romulus.lanl.gov [128.165.209.40]) by cic-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.3/8.12.3/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id h1DNxKNJ020722 for ; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 16:59:20 -0700 Message-ID: <3E4C3315.7070207@gentoo.net> Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 17:06:45 -0700 Organization: Pojoaque Medium Wave DXers Club User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020826 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: UX-1 on eBay -- 2 hours lef t-- Still $14.95 References: <33CDDBD8CAEFEB4191ABF6F799032AF238D7AC@aubwm206> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Mike Westfall X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=118377141 X-Yahoo-Profile: n6kuy I think it's a UX-1, anyway... No bids yet, less than 2 hours to go. http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2403431939&category=6774 -- Mike Westfall, N6KUY, WDX6O Los Alamos, New Mexico (DM65uv) My online logbooks are at http://www.gentoo.net/dxlogbook/main.mv?account=mikew From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Feb 13 17:04:13 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 14 Feb 2003 01:04:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 85801 invoked from network); 14 Feb 2003 01:04:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Feb 2003 01:04:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Feb 2003 01:04:12 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.249] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Feb 2003 01:04:08 -0000 Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 01:04:04 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Enjoy WBZ while we can Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <14c.1bbffc61.2b7d72a8@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 256 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 207.200.166.17 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Anyhow,the notation stated that the radio can operate for about an > hour on batteries. "About an hour"? Sheeh, even vacuum tube radios can last longer than that on batteries! A GE Superadio can last for MONTHS of normal use on a set of D cells... From amymousie@yahoo.com Thu Feb 13 17:44:08 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 14 Feb 2003 01:44:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 85831 invoked from network); 14 Feb 2003 01:44:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Feb 2003 01:44:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Feb 2003 01:44:08 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.147] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Feb 2003 01:44:07 -0000 Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 01:44:04 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Response from WBZ Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 326 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 66.127.243.98 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "narkspud " wrote: > > Hopefully I won't have to > > wait long before stations in my region of the country start > > broadcasting in Digital AM stereo. > > > > John > > Careful what you wish for. . . *Amy just rolls her eyes....* 9.9 Amy. <:3 )~~~ From powell@conterra.com Thu Feb 13 18:05:32 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: powell@conterra.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 14 Feb 2003 02:05:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 27260 invoked from network); 14 Feb 2003 02:05:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Feb 2003 02:05:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mx.matrixconsulting.net) (65.199.24.6) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Feb 2003 02:05:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 3050 invoked from network); 14 Feb 2003 02:05:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO bsae-skqpk3w8p5) (66.112.193.87) by mx.matrixconsulting.net with SMTP; 14 Feb 2003 02:05:28 -0000 Organization: BEARly Organized To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 21:05:16 -0500 Subject: HD radio is NOT Digital AM Stereo Message-ID: <3E4C088C.16520.66DEF6@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: <1045174448.2128.42563.m11@yahoogroups.com> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.01) From: "Powell E. Way III" Reply-To: powell@conterra.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=8062869 X-Yahoo-Profile: W4OPW There is NO SUCH THING. The IBOC modulation is digital. It is NOT AM! And away we go...... Bob Hess of WBZ sez: ( and I snip) > We will begin broadcasting in digital AM stereo in a few weeks. No you won't. There is NO SUCH THING AS DIGITAL AM STEREO! And I thought the stereo part was a LONG way off. > The > quality will be similar to FM quality. Nope. Unfortunately, the new digital > standard is not compatible with the AM stereo old standard. Nor is it compatible with analog on the MW band. >Our > digital broadcasts will, initially, only be in the day time. Read until the right folks are paid off. > Digital > receivers will be on the market later this year. IF you can afford them. And you'd better be close to be able to listen. Start saving up, it WON'T be inexpensive. I originally said cheap, hmmm we'll see how cheap the receivers have been made. > Message: 10> > From: "Kevin T. " > Subject: Re: Enjoy WBZ while we can > > > (Just keep in mind MTS TV stereo is only in -15%- of the TVs and > > VCRs today!) > > > > > Never underestimate the cheapness of consumer electronics > manufacturers. I believe Philips is selling 19 or 20-inch TV sets > with so-called "Dual Speaker Sound". What this means is that you get > a stereo audio amp for the external input (VCR, DVD, etc.), and > built-in stereo speakers, but the TV tuner is MONO only -- it doesn't > have the MTS decoder. And the real cheapness is in the CRT. A friend of mine says that he's been in the TV repair and sales for decades, and until recently warranty replacements for CRT's were very rare. NOT anymore. > Anyway, the coastline of Rhode Island is in the 0.5 mV/m protected > coverage area for both 1030 WBZ from Boston and 1050 WEVD from NYC. > This 0.5 mV/m contour is supposed to be free from interference from > other AM stations -- but that all goes out the window when IBOC is > used. They don't care. > If/when they turn the IBOC on, 1030 WBZ will have one of its primary > digital sidebands placed nicely on top of the upper half of 1050 > WEVD's audio range -- thus, anybody listening in this area with at > least a medium-bandwidth radio will get an annoying squealing hiss in > WEVD's audio, caused by WBZ's IBOC signal. I heard the same thing > myself when Lucent had their IBOC test station transmitting on 1700 > kHz within the protected contour of 1680 WTTM. They don't care. Complainers will be ignored or...silenced. > Message: 13 > Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 14:52:12 -0500 > From: "Joe Esposito" > Subject: Re: Re: Enjoy WBZ while we can > > My hometown, Johnstown, PA, is maybe 70 miles west of Pittsburgh and > after Sunset WBZ splatter is heard all over KDKA-AM. I don't want to > think what would happen if night-time digital transmission is ever > approved. It will be. > Since KDKA and WBZ are owned by the same company, I bet KD is planning > on going digital soon. I know out here in Central, PA I'll get plenty > IBOC interference from both stations. Yesssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssss ( That's an IBOC yes) > I like listening to Pittsburgh Pirates games on the radio. KDKA still > sounds great but I miss those Stereo baseball games in the late 80's > to early 90's. I just can't listen to a 16k realaudio feed from > mlb.com. > Joe Esposito > York, PA With night use of IBOC just KISSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS listening to KDKA away! > Message: 19 > Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 20:35:32 -0000 > From: "John " > Subject: Re: Response from WBZ >> > This is indeed positive news. It is good to hear of more stations > adopting Digital AM stereo, or "HD radio". Hopefully I won't have to > wait long before stations in my region of the country start > broadcasting in Digital AM stereo. > > John And nothing to hear them on. You'd better be in the 5X city grade signal too, John. > Message: 20 > Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 20:39:43 -0000 > From: "John " > Subject: Re: Enjoy WBZ while we can > I can't claim to understand the subtleties of how the FCC interprets > their rules, but it isn't clear to me how this situation would cause > the FCC's specific interference rules to be breached? There are > general clauses that prohibit doing anything that causes interference, > even if it is otherwise within the rules, but I don't see any specific > rule that would be "out the window" in this situation. Can you cite > the interference rules that would be "out the window"? Interference will be ignored. Or as I said earlier silenced. > Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 17:14:00 EST > From: KC4QLP@aol.com > Subject: Re: Enjoy WBZ while we can >> Folks..the writing is on the wall...just as well face reality. > Programming on stations may stay the same throughout all of this > digital hype,but the improvement of radio receivers will benefit all, > regardless of whether or not IBOC is a hit or not. Good receivers haven't been made on the MW side in uh.....maybe 30 years. Bob, what magic do you expect manufacturers will find to do something they've forgotten or can't do...? > I'm hoping we will soon hear about the lastest results from the > lastest upgrade of the IBOC software. It ( the software) should have been ready WAY before implementation, but Lucent has tossed hardware and software out on the market that worked good in theory but NEVER worked in the real world. > Just as an added note..I received my lastest addition of Radio World > today. Quite a write up on HD-R and the consumer convention and what > have you. Even on one of the pages is a picture of a portable HD > radio.( page 7 of Feb issue -Radio World ). By the looks of the > picture..it wont quite fit in your shirt pocket....maybe an oversized > coat pocket perhaps ( pictures of items can be hard to judge ) > Anyhow,the notation stated that the radio can operate for about an > hour on batteries.Not bad considering the radio is an HD radio and has > an MP3 player built in as well. With todays advances in technology,I'm > sure we will see a more compact radio that will operate longer on > batteries. There is even a write up on C.Crane and his company. I got a laugh at the South Carolina Broadcasters Association meeting that I said battery life would be 30 minutes. Is that an hour on D cells ? ]:) > Its going to be an interesting time we live in. You are right. If you can afford the radio, then you can't afford to play it. That's if you live really close to the SSSSSSSSSSSSSStation. AM STEREO content------- I am playing 50's oldies on AM STEREO 1000 this evening. HAH! I sound better than WSAI, but don't tell anyone. Powell From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Thu Feb 13 19:36:36 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 14 Feb 2003 03:36:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 47027 invoked from network); 14 Feb 2003 03:36:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Feb 2003 03:36:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14203.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.145) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Feb 2003 03:36:33 -0000 Message-ID: <20030214033633.60371.qmail@web14203.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.164.240.225] by web14203.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 13 Feb 2003 19:36:33 PST Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2003 19:36:33 -0800 (PST) Subject: I Heard IBOC Interference this week, and it is unbelievable! To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio J.B. wrote: "...It is good to hear of more stations adopting Digital AM stereo, or "HD radio". I'll bet the 'nation's first station' will be real thrilled when WBZ's digital bitbucket spills over onto 1020. Case and point: I heard this IBOC spew first-hand in NW Ohio this week, and here's my take: In this corner, WOWO - 1190 AM , weighing in at a whopping 50,000 watts babycakes, the 'blowtorch of NE Indiana, in the other corner corner, another 50,000 watts of electrons, WCHB - 1200 AM Detroit, Michigan, one of the first AM IBOC/HD stations. *** Turn them both on - guess what - analog WOWO loses - with a constant, non-varying 'hiss' on 1190AM. I heard it Monday. I heard it yesterday, I heard it today - I wanted to verify that it wasn't a one-time deal. When you tune to 1190 you hear a very loud "hiss", and it sounds just like a 1970 K-Mart cassette recorder with a blank tape playing in it at full volume. You can barely make out the audio at all on WOWO - the audio signal is rendered useless. This is on a relatively narrow band car radio too. I thought maybe the 'hiss' was exaggerated by others, but this is at a higher level than the audio, and much, much stronger than what I thought was the worst case. WLW and WOR pale in comparison. Fred Vobbe reported the same thing at his location when I mentioned it. Fred has a tape recording of this disaster it if you're interested in the unbelievable high level of hiss. Totally unreal! I thought you guys out East were BS'ing me on how bad it is, but this is freakin' unbelievable. In addition, the audio on 1200 sounded like distorted crap, and I'm talking the analog version! IBOC SHOULD BE STOPPED BY THE FCC UNTIL iBIQUITY CAN ADDRESS THIS MALICIOUS INTERFERENCE PROBLEM ON ADJACENTS! __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Shopping - Send Flowers for Valentine's Day http://shopping.yahoo.com From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Feb 13 19:44:33 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 14 Feb 2003 03:44:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 70051 invoked from network); 14 Feb 2003 03:44:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Feb 2003 03:44:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Feb 2003 03:44:33 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.142] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Feb 2003 03:44:33 -0000 Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 03:44:31 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: New file uploaded to amstereoforum Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 978 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.94.145 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > What's the distance Kevin ? "What's the frequency, Kenneth?" Sorry, I couldn't resist. :-) Anyway, to answer your question, I'm in central NJ, about 240 miles away from WBZ's transmitter -- although DX conditions were rather lousy at the time I made the recording; many other skywave signals that usually come in well were nowhere to be found. Later in the night, conditions did improve, and I did get to hear WBZ's commercials, IDs, and bumper music in great-sounding Stereo, although I didn't get a chance to record much of it. I do, however, have some older recordings of 1030 WBZ in AM Stereo, including one of their fantastic Stereo traffic report sound effect, and I will upload them shortly for all to hear. Right now, sadly WBZ is back to mono -- but it sure was fun while it lasted, and I thank everybody who took the time to write to WBZ and let them know that people *are* listening to them who *do* enjoy the availability of an AM Stereo signal. From amymousie@yahoo.com Thu Feb 13 20:03:08 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 14 Feb 2003 04:03:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 26486 invoked from network); 14 Feb 2003 04:03:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Feb 2003 04:03:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Feb 2003 04:03:06 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.141] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Feb 2003 04:03:02 -0000 Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 04:03:02 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: We're here to talk about AM Stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 4485 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 66.127.243.98 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "amymousie " < > amymousie@y...> wrote: > > > > Me? I'm working on designing a recreation of RCA's AM stereo test > > receiver from 1959, with some modifications. > > Are you planning on modifying an actual RCA Model XF-2, or building it > from scratch, or on a different chassis? Do you plan of following the > RCA schematic exactly, or modifying the design somewhat. It's too bad > 455 kHz ratio detector transformers aren't as easy to find as 455 kHz > discriminator transformers. If one used a ratio detector, with a > linear driver stage, instead of the discriminator, then the "tracking" > circuit could be dispensed with, as the output of a ratio detector is > proportional to the average signal input level, as well as the > modulation. A dynamic diode limiter would probably accomplish the > same thing, but I suspect that the numbers would come out such that an > additional IF stage would be needed between the dynamic diode limiter > and the discriminator. I have yet to find a source for original XF-2 radios, and there were only 8 modified for AM stereo. So no, I'm not going to work off an original XF-2, but to use its design as a basis for my recreation. That's "recreation", not "replica". The XF-2's cabinet is plastic, typical of most late 1950s radios by that time, and smaller than I need. I'm working on a wooden design that resembles the XF-2, but a bit bigger, especially to accomodate a second speaker and what extra circuitry I need to accomplish what I want to do. Just as Scott noticed a while back, the SF-2 has a synchronous detector to receive quadrature AM, as well as the FM circuit, which is a good indication it's meant to handle more than one AM stereo system, perhaps all five, since all five proposed at the time had any combination of three elemernts: quadrature AM, narrowband FM, and a matrix circuit. The XF-2 test radio has all three. One modification I plan on is control access to all three for any combination of, and add an extra matrix for C-QUAM. Might need to rephase the Q output, though. Other mods I'm thinking of include wide bandwith (and selector), take out the tuner for expanding from MW to include bands for LW and SW all the way to 30 MHz; add "magic eyes" for tuning and stereo level, true line out, rather than being fed by the volume-controlled amps; and add a headphone jack. I havcen't decided on a tuning scale design, or just what I can do about frequency spectra per band. (I'm tossing between semi-circular dial or a slide-rule dial, like the XF- 2 had.) The FM detector, I hope, would be modified to be selectable between different deviations (or I think the tracking cuicuit handles that to some degree, to maintain the difference needed) between the RCA and Belar specs, direct NBFM output (for the STLs/remote feeds used in the 26MHz band and for the amateurs up in 29MHz), and true PM (for a Magnavox detector). (One thing I'd like to experiment is a reverse-RCA system, which wouldn't be mono-compatible, with the L+R in the FM, and L-R in the AM, and see what the results are like.) I do want to keep to the technology of the period- both tubes and transistors, but no ICs. The only thing I'd give in to might be LED indicators, but that I haven't decided yet. The reason why is that I want to recreate the quality of the receiver as intended in 1959, and not try to use anything really contemporary. The radios of the time, had a different sound and feel. The only thing contemporary I would do is for the wide bandwith mode, make it reasonable AMAX/NRSC compliant, ie: de-emphasis and drop off audio above 10kHz. And an appropriate limiter for the C-QUAM audio. But all this can be done with period technology. This mouse has a dream, and with any assistance offered, hopes to fulfill this dream. :) > A transmitter should be easy enough, just by adding a varactor to > something like the Vectronics kit, to handle the FM for the L-R > signal. There are simple tube TX designs out there that give good results, and a varactor tube is what I have in mind. I like modern technology, but I like tube radios, too. Most here, perhaps all, have no experience with RCA/Belar AM stereo, and I want to give hands-on results of the systems for any interested. I have my dreams. :) Amy. <:3 )~~~ From amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Thu Feb 13 20:42:05 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 60385 invoked from network); 14 Feb 2003 04:42:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Feb 2003 04:42:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Feb 2003 04:42:04 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: notify@yahoogroups.com Received: from [66.218.67.188] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Feb 2003 04:42:03 -0000 Date: 14 Feb 2003 04:42:02 -0000 Message-ID: <1045197722.172238.55556.w64@yahoogroups.com> X-eGroups-Application: files X-Yahoo-Group-Post: system From: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: New file uploaded to amstereoforum MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello, This email message is a notification to let you know that a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the amstereoforum group. File : /mp3-usa/Wbz.mp3 Uploaded by : kevtronics Description : A recording of 1030 WBZ from Boston, as received in AM Stereo via nighttime skywave DX over a distance of about 240 miles, on a Realistic TM-152 tuner. Features great-sounding bumper music from Steve LeVeille's show. You can access this file at the URL http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum/files/mp3-usa/Wbz.mp3 To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/files Regards, kevtronics From jsgil@hal-pc.org Thu Feb 13 23:02:12 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 14 Feb 2003 07:02:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 54851 invoked from network); 14 Feb 2003 07:02:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Feb 2003 07:02:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.64) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Feb 2003 07:02:09 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.142] by n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Feb 2003 07:02:09 -0000 Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 07:02:08 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: IBOC is a Major Broadcasters Conspiracy Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3017 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.10 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst When you look at the big picture the design of IBAC is full of alterior motives. Up front it is advertised that it will produce better sound which is questionable but this is the only reason why the public would adopt it. Underneath there are many design factors that accomplishes multiple goals to increase the major broadcasters stronghold. IBAC uses spectrum outside the normal range than what an analog signal would use. It carries additional information that is not harmonically related to the primary modulating signal. As a result they are using spectrum that would not normally be used by an anaolg receiver and would be removed by even the wider IF filters. An analog receiver would not miss this information so therefore its irrevelant if high levels of interference occured in this range such as IBAC sidebands. As a result of using this for IBAC it precludes anyone else from unsing it. On FM, technology exists to have analog stations transmitt with controlled spectrum to pack more channels into a given space, enough to have space for LPFM stations. It would mean that IBAC users are taking this spectrum free from additional licensing where a new station would have to apply for a license. In the crowded AM spectrum it means that they are using spectrum that is used by other stations in near by markets. The end result is the smaller stations will not have the protection and will be driven out of the band with no recourse. It will be interesting to see when two powerhouse stations owned by different monopolies severly distroy each other's signal with the legal battles that will ensue. I forsee a dark time for the MW band. When IBAC is fully deployed among the major broadsast monopolies the smaller independents will be driven off the air. Listenership will drop dramatically for the whole MW band until everybody has upgraded to an HD Radio. Until then advertising dollars will dwindle and the smaller stations will fold. The monopolies will ride it out and write off the losses. In the end the monopolies will shut off their weaker stations that interfere with their stronger ones using IBAC. The MW band will be culled and there will be no independents left. IBAC has nothing to do with vastly improved sound but eliminating competition from independents, maintaining and extending monopolies into other areas like data services for the major broadcasters. With all the complaints and objections filed with the FCC it is pretty clear that the FCC has been made aware of the issues. The FCC is there to be impartial to make decisions to regulate broadcasting that protects each licesnee from the other. The FCC needs to make an informed decision that addresses the issues that will not put egg on their face. If they do not address the issues and approve IBAC with flying colors it only proves that they are co-conspirators with the major broadcasters in destroying the small independent broadcasters. It wouldn't be the first time this happened. Just look at the Micro$oft fiasco. JSG From amymousie@yahoo.com Thu Feb 13 23:50:16 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 14 Feb 2003 07:50:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 44244 invoked from network); 14 Feb 2003 07:50:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Feb 2003 07:50:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.90) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Feb 2003 07:50:15 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.163] by n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Feb 2003 07:50:15 -0000 Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 07:50:13 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: IBOC/negativity timeout? Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 267 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 66.127.243.98 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie I'm just a mouse, but... Maybe we need to take down the negativity for a while, put the IBOC issue on the back burner, and step back a bit and breathe deeply, then get into something positive for AM stereo. This negativity gives me headaches. :( Amy. <:3 )~~~ From dav259@csiro.au Fri Feb 14 00:41:33 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 14 Feb 2003 08:41:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 28404 invoked from network); 14 Feb 2003 08:41:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Feb 2003 08:41:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Feb 2003 08:41:32 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1E8fVR01729 for ; Fri, 14 Feb 2003 19:41:31 +1100 (EST) Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 19:41:31 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Subject: Re: {AMSF} IBOC/negativity timeout? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=112635033 X-Yahoo-Profile: dav259 On Fri, 14 Feb 2003, amymousie wrote: > I'm just a mouse, but... Maybe we need to take down the negativity > for a while, put the IBOC issue on the back burner, and step back a > bit and breathe deeply, then get into something positive for AM > stereo. > > This negativity gives me headaches. :( Exactly. How many of you who can hear the effects of what IBOC is doing to the AM band have written to the press about it - or got onto talkback radio programs complaining about it? Let's stop griping about it here - and take it to those who aren't here. Let's promote and advance the cause of AM stereo radio!! Ian From dwtpa97@earthlink.net Fri Feb 14 03:51:33 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dwtpa97@earthlink.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 14 Feb 2003 11:51:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 27765 invoked from network); 14 Feb 2003 11:51:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Feb 2003 11:51:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO snipe.mail.pas.earthlink.net) (207.217.120.62) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Feb 2003 11:51:32 -0000 Received: from sdn-ap-013scfairp0252.dialsprint.net ([63.183.128.252] helo=earthlink.net) by snipe.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 18jeNP-00002p-00 for amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com; Fri, 14 Feb 2003 03:51:32 -0800 Message-ID: <3E4CD883.9F6DD12@earthlink.net> Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 06:52:35 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.79 [en]C-CCK-MCD NSCPCD472 (Windows NT 5.0; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} I Heard IBOC Interference this week, and it is unbelievable! References: <20030214033633.60371.qmail@web14203.mail.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: dwtpa97 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38076959 Not to disagree with John or take away from anything he said, but I read in the paper a year or two ago that the corporation that owns WOWO was lowering its power down to 10,000 watts in order to allow its New York City station to increase its power and coverage area. I certainly agree in principle with what John has said. Dick W. "John P." wrote: > J.B. wrote: "...It is good to hear of more stations adopting Digital AM stereo, > or "HD radio". > > I'll bet the 'nation's first station' will be real thrilled when WBZ's digital > bitbucket spills over onto 1020. Case and point: > > I heard this IBOC spew first-hand in NW Ohio this week, and here's my take: > In this corner, WOWO - 1190 AM , weighing in at a whopping 50,000 watts > babycakes, the 'blowtorch of NE Indiana, in the other corner corner, another > 50,000 watts of electrons, WCHB - 1200 AM Detroit, Michigan, one of the first > AM IBOC/HD stations. > *** Turn them both on - guess what - analog WOWO loses - with a constant, > non-varying 'hiss' on 1190AM. I heard it Monday. I heard it yesterday, I heard > it today - I wanted to verify that it wasn't a one-time deal. When you tune to > 1190 you hear a very loud "hiss", and it sounds just like a 1970 K-Mart > cassette recorder with a blank tape playing in it at full volume. You can > barely make out the audio at all on WOWO - the audio signal is rendered > useless. This is on a relatively narrow band car radio too. I thought maybe > the 'hiss' was exaggerated by others, but this is at a higher level than the > audio, and much, much stronger than what I thought was the worst case. WLW and > WOR pale in comparison. Fred Vobbe reported the same thing at his location > when I mentioned it. Fred has a tape recording of this disaster it if you're > interested in the unbelievable high level of hiss. Totally unreal! I thought > you guys out East were BS'ing me on how bad it is, but this is freakin' > unbelievable. In addition, the audio on 1200 sounded like distorted crap, and > I'm talking the analog version! IBOC SHOULD BE STOPPED BY THE FCC UNTIL > iBIQUITY CAN ADDRESS THIS MALICIOUS INTERFERENCE PROBLEM ON ADJACENTS! > > __________________________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Shopping - Send Flowers for Valentine's Day > http://shopping.yahoo.com > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From KC4QLP@aol.com Fri Feb 14 07:59:05 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 14 Feb 2003 15:59:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 658 invoked from network); 14 Feb 2003 15:59:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Feb 2003 15:59:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d02.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.34) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Feb 2003 15:59:04 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.a.2cd5b78f (4340) for ; Fri, 14 Feb 2003 10:58:33 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 10:58:33 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} IBOC/negativity timeout? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 7.0 for Windows sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit >>Maybe we need to take down the negativity for a while, put the IBOC issue on the back burner,<< I agree. All of these conspiracies and off the wall,unproven and some yet to be determined things that are being said about IBOC is really making things look bad here. True most of us have heard the analog result of IBOC....and we dont like it. But remember...all of this is still in the testing stage from what I'm gathering. I tell ya...from the comments and regular gibberish that I'm reading here....some comments would have folks bordering very close to legal hot water. I wouldnt want to be in some of your shoes. (back to lurking mode til something interesting pops on the list) Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net Echolink node # 56704 -- 146.590 VHF,440.850 UHF (PL 131.8) proposed repeater--145.250 _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Fri Feb 14 08:13:51 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 14 Feb 2003 16:13:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 62728 invoked from network); 14 Feb 2003 16:13:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Feb 2003 16:13:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14205.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.151) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Feb 2003 16:13:50 -0000 Message-ID: <20030214161350.71305.qmail@web14205.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.45.202.244] by web14205.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 14 Feb 2003 08:13:50 PST Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 08:13:50 -0800 (PST) Subject: WOWO still 50KW daytime To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio Dick W wrote: "... but I read in the paper a year or two ago that the corporation that owns WOWO was lowering its power down to 10,000 watts in order to allow its New York City station to increase its power and coverage area" You are correct for NIGHT only - when the IBOC is (supposed) to be off. They still have 50KW DAYS, and 9800 watts at night so their NYC area station can blast away. __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Shopping - Send Flowers for Valentine's Day http://shopping.yahoo.com From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Feb 14 08:49:16 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 14 Feb 2003 16:49:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 61854 invoked from network); 14 Feb 2003 16:49:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Feb 2003 16:49:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Feb 2003 16:49:13 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.134] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Feb 2003 16:49:13 -0000 Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 16:49:12 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: WOWO still 50KW daytime Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20030214161350.71305.qmail@web14205.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 827 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > You are correct for NIGHT only - when the IBOC is (supposed) to be > off. They still have 50KW DAYS, and 9800 watts at night so their > NYC area station can blast away. That is 1190 WLIB, with 10 kW daytime and 30 kW at night. People have complained about the death of WOWO's nighttime clear channel signal, but what's so great about having re-runs of Joey Reynolds' talk show covering dozens of states? I think anybody with an appreciation for quality radio programming would prefer WLIB's Caribbean music, with live, local DJs and some of the best AM sound quality (although mono) I have heard from a major market station -- their audio is crisp, clean, well-processed, and undistorted. I did contact WLIB a while back about the possibility of upgrading to AM Stereo, but never got a response back. From jsgil@hal-pc.org Fri Feb 14 09:48:36 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 14 Feb 2003 17:48:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 92713 invoked from network); 14 Feb 2003 17:48:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Feb 2003 17:48:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Feb 2003 17:48:34 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.147] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Feb 2003 17:48:34 -0000 Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 17:48:34 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: IBOC/negativity timeout? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 536 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.130.50 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "amymousie " wrote: > I'm just a mouse, but... Maybe we need to take down the negativity > for a while, put the IBOC issue on the back burner, and step back a > bit and breathe deeply, then get into something positive for AM > stereo. > > This negativity gives me headaches. :( > > Amy. <:3 )~~~ Perhaps I've been a bit harsh with a certain entity in my last post but sometimes these iBiquity moles get me worked up to the point that the sky is falling. JSG From penry@nortelnetworks.com Fri Feb 14 10:08:49 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: penry@nortelnetworks.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 14 Feb 2003 18:08:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 20746 invoked from network); 14 Feb 2003 18:08:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Feb 2003 18:08:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com) (47.103.122.112) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Feb 2003 18:08:47 -0000 Received: from zrc2c011.us.nortel.com (zrc2c011.us.nortel.com [47.103.120.51]) by zrc2s0jx.nortelnetworks.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id h1EI8gm03968; Fri, 14 Feb 2003 12:08:42 -0600 (CST) Received: by zrc2c011.us.nortel.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id <1LNXFA6Y>; Fri, 14 Feb 2003 12:08:43 -0600 Message-ID: <9596134A623ED511B7790002A56079740517AC96@zrc2c010.us.nortel.com> To: Subject: CC at War Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 12:08:42 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) From: "Charles Penry" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=376233 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa5vhu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Interesting war plans for some Clear Channel owned Sacramento radio stations: http://www.internalmemos.com/memos/memodetails.php?memo_id=1329 The original poster of this link said: "As soon as I read the part about "don't worry about having any local news" I knew that this must be a memo from Clear Channel - so "screw the local grade school leveled by a tornado, there's a war going on 5,000 miles away, so that must be more important" than anything affecting our local listeners!" I believe that the war will not initially be a local story, it is a world and US story. I think a local grade school being leveled by a tornado while students were in it would be a top story, even possibly over the war story. If the school was empty and no one was hurt, it would be a lesser story at the time of war. The memo does go on to say how to work local stories into the process. I think it is a good plan to give the listeners what they want and increase the ratings of the station. Charles [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From amymousie@yahoo.com Fri Feb 14 11:05:16 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 14 Feb 2003 19:05:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 104 invoked from network); 14 Feb 2003 19:05:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Feb 2003 19:05:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Feb 2003 19:05:14 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.128] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Feb 2003 19:05:14 -0000 Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 19:05:14 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} IBOC/negativity timeout? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1174 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 66.127.243.98 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, KC4QLP@a... wrote: > > > > >>Maybe we need to take down the negativity > for a while, put the IBOC issue on the back burner,<< > > I agree. All of these conspiracies and off the wall,unproven and some yet to > be determined things that are being said about IBOC is really making things > look bad here. > True most of us have heard the analog result of IBOC....and we dont like it. > But remember...all of this is still in the testing stage from what I'm > gathering. > > > I tell ya...from the comments and regular gibberish that I'm reading > here....some comments would have folks bordering very close to legal hot > water. > I wouldnt want to be in some of your shoes. > > (back to lurking mode til something interesting pops on the list) Just to let you all know, I put up a forum to shoot off about IBOC, and anyone here is welcome to join: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/no2iboc/ This way, those of us with strong dislikes regarding IBOC can mouth off (including myself), and hopefully draw THIS group back to AM stereo, which I assume is why we're all still here. Long live AM stereo! Amy. <:3 )~~~ From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Feb 14 11:16:04 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 14 Feb 2003 19:16:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 33997 invoked from network); 14 Feb 2003 19:16:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Feb 2003 19:16:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Feb 2003 19:16:00 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.148] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Feb 2003 19:16:00 -0000 Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 19:15:58 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Spectacular Stereo! Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1853 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics While going through my record collection, I re-discovered one of the best sounding Stereo demonstration LPs of all time: "Persuasive Percussion", by Command Records. The separation and sound quality are absolutely phenomenal! Then I looked at the copyright date on the LP cover... 1959! For a record that is 44 years old, the quality is astonishingly good; the best way to explain it is to simply let you hear it yourself. I made an MP3 of the first track on the disc, since it is one of the best, and you can download it here (about 5.8 megs, but it's well worth the wait): http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/1959stereo.mp3 This was played on an inexpensive ceramic-cartridge turntable, so it's not even as good as it could sound, but with some equalization to flatten it out to the RIAA standard, the results are surprisingly good; even at 256 kbps, some of the brilliance is lost in the MP3 encoding, but I still think anybody who listens to it will be impressed. I have several other Command LPs in my collection, and they are all stunning examples of Stereo sound at its best. Unfortunately, "Persuasive Percussion" is one of only two of these records that has made it to CD; the rest will have to be enjoyed from the original LPs, if you can find them... but that's part of the magic! You can view the complete Command Records discography here: http://easyweb.easynet.co.uk/~rcb/light/command.htm Needless to say music like this makes a great demonstration for AM Stereo -- and also would be an interesting test for IBOC's digital compression, as many of the songs contain very intricate percussion sounds such as hi-hats, tambourines, scratchers, and Chinese bell trees, which rely on detailed high-frequency harmonics that IBOC's "simulated" treble response would likely get extremely confused by. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Feb 14 11:22:39 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 14 Feb 2003 19:22:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 72699 invoked from network); 14 Feb 2003 19:22:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Feb 2003 19:22:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Feb 2003 19:22:37 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.250] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Feb 2003 19:22:34 -0000 Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 19:22:32 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: IBOC/negativity timeout? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1099 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Just to let you all know, I put up a forum to shoot off about IBOC, > and anyone here is welcome to join: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/no2iboc/ I have to respectfully disagree, and say that a group based entirely on a negative viewpoint won't be very constructive. I've had an idea for quite a while for some sort of group or organization called "The Analog Advantage" -- and, just as the name suggests, it would be dedicated to the preservation and promotion of analog AM and FM radio and analog TV. Of course, exposing the many flaws of IBOC and (H)DTV would be a significant part of this, but it wouldn't be the *entire* basis of the organization. It would be something that listeners, stations, and equipment manufacturers could join and support, without being immediately associated with radical "anti-IBOC" viewpoints. My only hesitation about this is that the AM part of it would mostly overlap with what we have been doing right here in the AM Stereo Forum. But still, I think a PRO-ANALOG presence would be much more beneficial than an ANTI-IBOC presence. From jbyrns@enteract.com Fri Feb 14 13:06:45 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 14 Feb 2003 21:06:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 15986 invoked from network); 14 Feb 2003 21:06:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Feb 2003 21:06:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Feb 2003 21:06:44 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.146] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Feb 2003 21:06:44 -0000 Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 21:06:43 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: OT: Stereo Oldies Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3E4BC812.15271.18BC7BC@localhost> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2751 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.98.103 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Jeff Welton" wrote: > > stereo to mono in this experiment. Adding two equal powers is > > an increase of 3 dB, which leaves us with a net drop of only > > 3 dB, not 6 dB as you claim, when we switch from stereo to mono > > with a single channel source. > > You're both right. No, Mr. "rules" is wrong about the change in level of a single channel source when you press the mono button on a stereo and he knows it, else he wouldn't have said "I am not going to quibble over 3db's with you." The 6 dB figure is correct only if you are looking at the output of just one of the two speakers that are implied by the presence of a mono/stereo button. For a sound coming from only one channel, there is a 6 dB decrease in output from the speaker of that channel when the mono button is depressed, but that decrease is partly made-up by the signal that will emanate from the second speaker when the mono button is depressed, increasing the total sound level by 3 dB, for a net loss of 3 dB, not the 6 dB that Mr. "rules" claims for a sound that appears full left, or full right. > 3dB power = 6dB voltage, assuming a constant resistance. > It's called square law. Come again? Could you explain that in a little more depth? In any case, Mr. "rules" problem is not voltage vs. power, it is simply that he is looking at the output of one channel only. Now realize that I am not contesting Mr. "rules" original contention that a stereo mix of a song that was originally issued in mono will not sound the same in mono as the original mono mix did. This is a different issue, and gets complicated, but I think it is correct to say that in a stereo mix, if you want the level of a source to remain constant as you pan from left to center to right, you must reduce the level 3 dB in the mix when the sound is centered. This 3 dB reduction in the level of centered sounds in a stereo mix compensates for 3 dB of the 6 dB loss that will be noted for left or right channel sounds when played through a single speaker monophonic system. Now of course if we are listening to an AMStereo broadcast, there is probably some heavy audio processing going on that will increase the L+R component of any sound, left, right, or center to a uniform level, whether it was intended to be that way or not. I believe FMStereo works differently, and the L+R component of left or right channel sounds can't be increased by processing to the same level that a centered sound can be. But all this processing in AMStereo makes my head swim, and makes me wish for the bygone days when audio processing didn't consist of much more than a peak limiter, and maybe an AGC amplifier. John From jbyrns@enteract.com Fri Feb 14 13:12:52 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 14 Feb 2003 21:12:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 18579 invoked from network); 14 Feb 2003 21:12:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Feb 2003 21:12:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Feb 2003 21:12:52 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.178] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Feb 2003 21:12:51 -0000 Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 21:12:50 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: We're here to talk about AM Stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2511 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.98.103 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "amymousie " < amymousie@y...> wrote: > > I have yet to find a source for original XF-2 radios, and there were > only 8 modified for AM stereo. So no, I'm not going to work off an > original XF-2, but to use its design as a basis for my recreation. > That's "recreation", not "replica". > > The XF-2's cabinet is plastic, typical of most late 1950s radios by > that time, and smaller than I need. I'm working on a wooden design > that resembles the XF-2, but a bit bigger, especially to accomodate > a second speaker and what extra circuitry I need to accomplish what > I want to do. > > Just as Scott noticed a while back, the SF-2 has a synchronous > detector to receive quadrature AM, as well as the FM circuit, which > is a good indication it's meant to handle more than one AM stereo > system, perhaps all five, since all five proposed at the time had > any combination of three elemernts: quadrature AM, narrowband FM, > and a matrix circuit. The XF-2 test radio has all three. One > modification I plan on is control access to all three for any > combination of, and add an extra matrix for C-QUAM. Might need to > rephase the Q output, though. What is the "SF-2" that you mention above, I am not familiar with that? > Other mods I'm thinking of include wide bandwith (and selector), > take out the tuner for expanding from MW to include bands for LW > and SW all the way to 30 MHz; add "magic eyes" for tuning and stereo > level, true line out, rather than being fed by the volume-controlled > amps; and add a headphone jack. I havcen't decided on a tuning scale > design, or just what I can do about frequency spectra per band. (I'm > tossing between semi-circular dial or a slide-rule dial, like the > XF-2 had.) > > The FM detector, I hope, would be modified to be selectable between > different deviations (or I think the tracking cuicuit handles that > to some degree, to maintain the difference needed) between the RCA > and Belar specs, direct NBFM output (for the STLs/remote feeds used > in the 26MHz band and for the amateurs up in 29MHz), and true PM > (for a Magnavox detector). The required audio bandwidth is probably going to be one of the main drivers of the discriminator design, with the deviation being less so. I would just design the discriminator for the max. deviation and audio bandwidth required by any of the systems, and make the matrix adjustable to handle the different system deviations. John From jbyrns@enteract.com Fri Feb 14 13:15:55 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 14 Feb 2003 21:15:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 74091 invoked from network); 14 Feb 2003 21:15:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Feb 2003 21:15:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.89) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Feb 2003 21:15:54 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.153] by n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Feb 2003 21:15:54 -0000 Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 21:15:50 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} I Heard IBOC Interference this week, and it is unbelievable! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3E4CD883.9F6DD12@earthlink.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1481 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.98.103 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, dwtpa97 wrote: > Not to disagree with John or take away from anything he said, but I > read in the paper a year or two ago that the corporation that owns > WOWO was lowering its power down to 10,000 watts in order to allow > its New York City station to increase its power and coverage area. > I certainly agree in principle with what John has said. I believe that WOWO was actually down graded to 9,800 Watts, not 10,000 Watts, which was necessary to get below the class A minimum of 10,000 Watts, and force the FCC to reclassify WOWO from a class A station to a class B station. As I understand it, it was more the reclassification to class B status, with its reduced protection requirements, rather than the actual reduction in power, that allowed WLIB to increase its nighttime facilities. If my AM band improvement plan was put into effect by the FCC, this subterfuge on the part of WLIB would have been unnecessary, because the first step in my plan is to reclassify all class A stations as class B stations. Reclassifying class A stations to class B would eliminate the need to protect the nighttime skywave signal of the former class A stations, allowing the other stations on the channel to both increase and simplify their facilities. It would also relax the required ground wave protection for the former class A stations. And yes, I know there are international implications to my scheme. John From KC4QLP@aol.com Fri Feb 14 13:34:00 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 14 Feb 2003 21:33:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 57270 invoked from network); 14 Feb 2003 21:33:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Feb 2003 21:33:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r05.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.101) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Feb 2003 21:33:59 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.131.1a9161c8 (3310) for ; Fri, 14 Feb 2003 16:33:54 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <131.1a9161c8.2b7ebac2@aol.com> Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 16:33:54 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: WOWO still 50KW daytime To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp << That is 1190 WLIB, with 10 kW daytime and 30 kW at night. People have complained about the death of WOWO's nighttime clear channel signal, but what's so great about having re-runs of Joey Reynolds' talk show covering dozens of states? I think anybody with an appreciation for quality radio programming would prefer WLIB's Caribbean music, with live, local DJs >> What is sad...even though 1190 in the nations northeast has a nice radio station to listen to.....most of the rest of the eastern seaboard now has a mix of both WOWO and WLIB.Without a good loop antenna,1190 is just another vast radio wasteland. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net Echolink node # 56704 -- 146.590 VHF,440.850 UHF (PL 131.8) _______________________________________________________ From powell@conterra.com Fri Feb 14 15:27:19 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: powell@conterra.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 14 Feb 2003 23:27:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 18695 invoked from network); 14 Feb 2003 23:27:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Feb 2003 23:27:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mx.matrixconsulting.net) (65.199.24.6) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Feb 2003 23:27:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 24388 invoked from network); 14 Feb 2003 23:27:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO bsae-skqpk3w8p5) (66.112.193.99) by mx.matrixconsulting.net with SMTP; 14 Feb 2003 23:27:18 -0000 Organization: BEARly Organized To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 18:27:05 -0500 Subject: This is not good. Message-ID: <3E4D34F9.1065.102A4E@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: <1045236312.521.63942.m12@yahoogroups.com> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.01) From: "Powell E. Way III" Reply-To: powell@conterra.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=8062869 X-Yahoo-Profile: W4OPW When I was transmitting with the Alfredo Lite on 1000 I noticed my TM- 152 did not show stereo, nor did it on any other source. I'm in Columbia SC and who still is I can receive on the east coast. I hope it is just a capacitor. Powell From amstereorules@msn.com Fri Feb 14 15:27:26 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereorules@msn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 14 Feb 2003 23:27:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 25589 invoked from network); 14 Feb 2003 23:27:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Feb 2003 23:27:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.69) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Feb 2003 23:27:25 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.152] by n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Feb 2003 23:27:25 -0000 Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 23:27:23 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: OT: Stereo Oldies Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1247 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amstereorules " X-Originating-IP: 205.188.209.76 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=130870594 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereorules >No, Mr. "rules" is wrong about the change in level of a single >channel source when you press the mono button on a stereo and he >knows it, else he wouldn't have said "I am not going to quibble over >3db's with you." Voltage is voltage. You don't magically get a 3dB INCREASE by feeding two channels; you are still 6dB down in both channels. >The 6 dB figure is correct only if you are looking at the >output of just one of the two speakers that are implied by the >presence of a mono/stereo button. For a sound coming from only one >channel, there is a 6 dB decrease in output from the speaker of that >channel when the mono button is depressed, but that decrease is >partly made-up by the signal that will emanate from the second >speaker when the mono button is depressed, increasing the total >sound level by 3 dB, for a net loss of 3 dB, not the 6 dB that >Mr. "rules" claims for a sound that appears full left, or full right. You aren't comparing apples to apples in your dissertation above. What engineering college did you go to? And Mr.Welton you are too qualified to be in customer service, and should be a diplomat. Ask those Nautel boys if there's an opening in design for y'all. Ragnar Remember, AMStereoRules From amstereorules@msn.com Fri Feb 14 15:34:00 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereorules@msn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 14 Feb 2003 23:34:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 79021 invoked from network); 14 Feb 2003 23:34:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Feb 2003 23:34:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.87) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Feb 2003 23:34:00 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.151] by n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Feb 2003 23:34:00 -0000 Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 23:33:57 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: I Heard IBOC Interference this week, and it is unbelievable! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 540 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amstereorules " X-Originating-IP: 205.188.209.76 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=130870594 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereorules Look guys this IBOC bashing is getting old. Remember that an IBOC Receiver must have a 30KC i.f. passband- does this ring a bell, the old Carvers had a 30KC passband, and MW stations were allowed to xmit 30KC or more from their trans-mitters. Were people complaining then about that great high fidelity MW band? C'mon, now get a grip. My prediction is that IBOC will be as popular as DAB is in Canada. Youg people don't care about radio. They are busy listening to their CDs and MP3 to care. Ragnar Remember, AMStereoRules From amymousie@yahoo.com Fri Feb 14 16:51:13 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 15 Feb 2003 00:51:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 10665 invoked from network); 15 Feb 2003 00:51:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Feb 2003 00:51:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Feb 2003 00:51:10 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.180] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Feb 2003 00:51:08 -0000 Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 00:51:06 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: We're here to talk about AM Stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 4093 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 66.127.243.98 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "amymousie " < > amymousie@y...> wrote: > > > > I have yet to find a source for original XF-2 radios, and there were > > only 8 modified for AM stereo. So no, I'm not going to work off an > > original XF-2, but to use its design as a basis for my recreation. > > That's "recreation", not "replica". > > > > The XF-2's cabinet is plastic, typical of most late 1950s radios by > > that time, and smaller than I need. I'm working on a wooden design > > that resembles the XF-2, but a bit bigger, especially to accomodate > > a second speaker and what extra circuitry I need to accomplish what > > I want to do. > > > > Just as Scott noticed a while back, the SF-2 has a synchronous > > detector to receive quadrature AM, as well as the FM circuit, which > > is a good indication it's meant to handle more than one AM stereo > > system, perhaps all five, since all five proposed at the time had > > any combination of three elemernts: quadrature AM, narrowband FM, > > and a matrix circuit. The XF-2 test radio has all three. One > > modification I plan on is control access to all three for any > > combination of, and add an extra matrix for C-QUAM. Might need to > > rephase the Q output, though. > > What is the "SF-2" that you mention above, I am not familiar with > that? Since I know you have a copy of the "RCA Review" of Sept. 1960, pp. 299-359, I would've assumed you actually READ the document. The XF-2 is the radio shown on p. 325, with the schematic on p. 324, all three images are shown or linked on your RCA page at: http://www.enteract.com/~jbyrns/RCA-AM-Stereo.html This is the radio whose specs are listed as "Radios A-H" in the table on p. 325. The text on surrounding pages refers to the radios used. Gee, I've actually been READING this document, even though the math goes a bit over my head, and I get every impression you really haven't, or you would have noticed the article goes beyond just the RCA system, goes into all five systems proposed at the time, explains in detail AM stereo theory that even with the math, still in a context that just about anyone of real intelligence could grasp, and even predict permutations of AM stereo that include the Motorola, Magnavox and Harris systems, making it the best single document I've seen on AM stereo, even better- MUCH better- than the Prentiss book. > > Other mods I'm thinking of include wide bandwith (and selector), > > take out the tuner for expanding from MW to include bands for LW > > and SW all the way to 30 MHz; add "magic eyes" for tuning and stereo > > level, true line out, rather than being fed by the volume- controlled > > amps; and add a headphone jack. I havcen't decided on a tuning scale > > design, or just what I can do about frequency spectra per band. (I'm > > tossing between semi-circular dial or a slide-rule dial, like the > > XF-2 had.) > > > > The FM detector, I hope, would be modified to be selectable between > > different deviations (or I think the tracking cuicuit handles that > > to some degree, to maintain the difference needed) between the RCA > > and Belar specs, direct NBFM output (for the STLs/remote feeds used > > in the 26MHz band and for the amateurs up in 29MHz), and true PM > > (for a Magnavox detector). > > The required audio bandwidth is probably going to be one of the main > drivers of the discriminator design, with the deviation being less so. > I would just design the discriminator for the max. deviation and audio > bandwidth required by any of the systems, and make the matrix > adjustable to handle the different system deviations. That I would've called a no-brainer-- Design for the widest needed, and build onwards from that. That never even needed to be brought up, since it was so obvious. That's where the tracking mechanism works in the scematic- To maintain a proper balance between the AM and FM signals for proper stereo detection. Amy. <:3 )~~~ From possumhunter@netzero.net Fri Feb 14 17:48:51 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 15 Feb 2003 01:48:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 93947 invoked from network); 15 Feb 2003 01:48:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Feb 2003 01:48:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.93) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Feb 2003 01:48:50 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 14 Feb 2003 17:48:50 -0800 To: References: <3E4AEA73.19888.5B4338@localhost> Subject: Re: {AMSF} more skywave or nothing.... Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 20:48:34 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 15 Feb 2003 01:48:50.0568 (UTC) FILETIME=[63479880:01C2D494] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.157.84.97] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Powell E. Way III wrote: > WVOC was the first radio station in SC. If they can redo the system and get 5 /1 KW OK. I beg to differ with you, WSPA 950 (Now WORD) was the first station in SC. It was on the air 3 months before WIS (Now WVOC). WSPA-FM was South Carolina's fist FM and was the first FM in South Carolina to broadcast in Stereo. Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Fri Feb 14 17:59:33 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 15 Feb 2003 01:59:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 54096 invoked from network); 15 Feb 2003 01:59:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Feb 2003 01:59:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.195) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Feb 2003 01:59:33 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 14 Feb 2003 17:59:33 -0800 To: References: <21.2b79b6d2.2b7af208@aol.com> Subject: WTIR Was:DXing Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 20:59:17 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 15 Feb 2003 01:59:33.0403 (UTC) FILETIME=[E2706EB0:01C2D495] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.157.84.97] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: > Does the state of Flordia own that high powered bag of wind waste of spectrum TIS? No, look at http://gullfoss2.fcc.gov/cgi-bin/ws.exe/prod/callsign/prod/query.hts?Call_Si gn=WTIR It is owned by Rama Communications, Inc. From jsgil@hal-pc.org Fri Feb 14 18:29:30 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 15 Feb 2003 02:29:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 49608 invoked from network); 15 Feb 2003 02:29:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Feb 2003 02:29:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Feb 2003 02:29:30 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.144] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Feb 2003 02:29:30 -0000 Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 02:29:28 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: This is not good. Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3E4D34F9.1065.102A4E@localhost> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 527 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.78 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Powell E. Way III" wrote: > When I was transmitting with the Alfredo Lite on 1000 I noticed my TM- > 152 did not show stereo, nor did it on any other source. I'm in > Columbia SC and who still is I can receive on the east coast. I hope > it is just a capacitor. > > > Powell The TM-152 has a pilot level adjustment that you could tweak. Just remember where it was set if that doesn't work. It's right next to the decoder chip in the corner near the transformer. JSG From dav259@csiro.au Fri Feb 14 18:53:50 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 15 Feb 2003 02:53:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 92880 invoked from network); 15 Feb 2003 02:53:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Feb 2003 02:53:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Feb 2003 02:53:49 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1F2rmR16580 for ; Sat, 15 Feb 2003 13:53:48 +1100 (EST) Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 13:53:48 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Spectacular Stereo! In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=112635033 X-Yahoo-Profile: dav259 On Fri, 14 Feb 2003, Kevin T. wrote: > http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/1959stereo.mp3 Kevin - this 1959 track is indeed spectaular. It's reminiscent of many of Bert Kaemfert's Polydore orchestral stereo experiments of the sixties. Frankly it makes you wonder actually how far we have progressed - at least stereowise. After all we only have two ears. With a combo of speakers of various sizes I'm sure we could have heard a variation of "surround sound" 40 years ago. When I listen to 3MP (currently mono) through the hi-fi, the PC speakers (connected to the Metrosound), and the Sony AMS boombox on the fridge - the sound as you walk around seems awesome. But nothing! will replace the feeling you get when you are listening to stereo through headphones. Then it's either stereo - or it isn't. That's why I love C-Quam AM stereo! Ian From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Feb 14 20:10:20 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 15 Feb 2003 04:10:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 57651 invoked from network); 15 Feb 2003 04:10:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Feb 2003 04:10:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Feb 2003 04:10:20 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-228.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.228]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h1F4AGe4000043 for ; Fri, 14 Feb 2003 22:10:17 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <00f201c2d4a8$78285aa0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: amstereo gone from 2BS Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 22:12:32 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude In the Gates series transmitters it was inserted at a BNC jack a stage or two past the osc. (internal xtal would not be required.) ST ----- Original Message ----- From: > =snip= > > > IF WE CAN help this guy, maybe it will return? > > It's probably just me, but I would think that if the solid state > transmitter has a crystsal socket, that's the place to plug in the > exciter. > > I'm otherwise saddened by the devastation of AM stereo in Australia, > which was going so good just a couple years ago? From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Feb 14 20:40:38 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 15 Feb 2003 04:40:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 4258 invoked from network); 15 Feb 2003 04:40:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Feb 2003 04:40:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Feb 2003 04:40:37 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.148] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Feb 2003 04:40:37 -0000 Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 04:40:36 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Spectacular Stereo! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1700 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.72.132 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Kevin - this 1959 track is indeed spectaular. > It's reminiscent of many of Bert Kaemfert's Polydor orchestral > stereo experiments of the sixties. > Frankly it makes you wonder actually how far we have progressed - > at least stereowise. It is interesting to note that Enoch Light, who produced the Command Records series, didn't believe in the use of a "phantom" center channel as part of the Stereo audio image. Everything in his music is either towards the left or towards the right; this is a very different approach than binaural stereo, which places the main focus on the center of the audio image, with stereo elements spreading out from it towards the sides. I just wish I had a matching late '50s stereo system to truly enjoy this music. I have had the pleasure of using one of the first "bookshelf" stereo systems -- an RCA Victor Audiola ALA-10S AM/Shortwave receiver with a matching Victrola stereo record player. The receiver features a "Hi-Fi" wide-bandwidth AM mode, a green Magic Tuning Eye tube, a graphic equalizer(!) that shows the resulting response curve of the Bass and Treble controls on a backlit display, an optional input for an external FM tuner, and a selectable 5 kHz audio filter to improve reception of closely spaced shortwave signals. A high school friend of mine had this kind of system set up in his basement and we had great fun listening to it, and we even got some pretty good DX on its shortwave tuner using a random-wire antenna strung up outdoors. Now I'm searching for one to have myself; I've come across a similar ALA-8 model on eBay, but that is a simpler AM-only model and it didn't come with the matching stereo turntable. From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Feb 14 21:03:51 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 15 Feb 2003 05:03:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 18443 invoked from network); 15 Feb 2003 05:03:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Feb 2003 05:03:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Feb 2003 05:03:50 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-228.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.228]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h1F53le4010881 for ; Fri, 14 Feb 2003 23:03:48 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <01e101c2d4af$f217b340$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <14c.1bbffc61.2b7d72a8@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Enjoy WBZ while we can Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 23:06:03 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude What improvements are you talking about? ST ----- Original Message ----- From: > Programming on > stations may stay the same throughout all of this digital hype,but the > improvement of radio receivers will benefit all, regardless of whether or not > IBOC is a hit or not. From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Feb 14 21:25:56 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 15 Feb 2003 05:25:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 66150 invoked from network); 15 Feb 2003 05:25:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Feb 2003 05:25:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Feb 2003 05:25:53 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-228.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.228]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h1F5Pne4015350 for ; Fri, 14 Feb 2003 23:25:50 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <021a01c2d4b3$06558e60$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} IBOC/negativity timeout? Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 23:28:06 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude If we can't build the receivers necessary to revive CQuAM, it's all over. We've talked enough, positive and negative. One of us has got to win a lottery or sweepstakes, or perhaps come up with a totally unrelated invention that will make them the necessary cash to build radios on contract. The lack of receivers is why stations aren't staying in stereo both here and down under when they replace their aging equipment. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ian Davidson" > Let's stop griping about it here - and take it to those who aren't here. > > Let's promote and advance the cause of AM stereo radio!! > From jbyrns@enteract.com Fri Feb 14 21:42:54 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 15 Feb 2003 05:42:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 65295 invoked from network); 15 Feb 2003 05:42:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Feb 2003 05:42:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Feb 2003 05:42:54 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.170] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Feb 2003 05:42:53 -0000 Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 05:42:52 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: We're here to talk about AM Stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3964 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.198 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "amymousie " < amymousie@y...> wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John " > wrote: > > > > What is the "SF-2" that you mention above, I am not familiar with > > that? > > Since I know you have a copy of the "RCA Review" of Sept. 1960, pp. > 299-359, I would've assumed you actually READ the document. I thought over a month ago in private email I said that, "I haven't read the whole thing for a couple of years"? As I indicated then I have only read selected parts recently, so I don't remember everything. But I suspected that the "SF-2", about which you said, "Just as Scott noticed a while back, the SF-2 has a synchronous detector to receive quadrature AM, as well as the FM circuit", was part of the paper I had forgotten about. Before asking what the SF-2 was, I quickly skimmed the paper, and didn't notice any reference to a "SF-2" that meets the above description. Obviously I missed it, can you give me the page number so I can look it up? I am embarrassed to say that while scanning the paper I did notice that RCA also suggested using a dynamic diode limiter, as I have been suggesting, to eliminate the need for the "tracking" circuit. They say they used it in one version of the AM stereo tuners they built for the field tests. I guess I am in good company, but I wish they would have included a schematic, so I don't have to go to the trouble of looking up how to design my own dynamic diode limiter. > The XF-2 is the radio shown on p. 325, with the schematic on p. 324, > all three images are shown or linked on your RCA page at: > http://www.enteract.com/~jbyrns/RCA-AM-Stereo.html > > This is the radio whose specs are listed as "Radios A-H" in the > table on p. 325. The text on surrounding pages refers to the > radios used. Oh, oh, was the "SF-2" mention just a typo? That doesn't really work though, because you said the "SF-2" had a "synchronous detector", while the modified XF-2 used in the field tests didn't have a synchronous detector? > Gee, I've actually been READING this document, even though the math > goes a bit over my head, and I get every impression you really > haven't, or you would have noticed the article goes beyond just the > RCA system, goes into all five systems proposed at the time, > explains in detail AM stereo theory that even with the math, still > in a context that just about anyone of real intelligence could > grasp, and even predict permutations of AM stereo that include the > Motorola, Magnavox and Harris systems, making it the best single > document I've seen on AM stereo, even better- MUCH better- than the > Prentiss book. I believe I also mentioned most of that in my private email of over a month ago. [snip] > That I would've called a no-brainer-- Design for the widest needed, > and build onwards from that. That never even needed to be brought > up, since it was so obvious. That's where the tracking mechanism > works in the scematic- To maintain a proper balance between the AM > and FM signals for proper stereo detection. The tracking circuit has nothing to do with adjusting to the amount of FM deviation being used, or the width of the discriminator response. The purpose of the "tracking" circuit is to compensate the L-R signal level for the fact that the radio does not use a brick wall AGC circuit, so the L+R level will vary with the RF signal strength, and the "tracking" circuit causes the L-R FM signal to follow the RF signal level related changes in the L+R signal. RCA does suggest that the "tracking" circuit could be modified to cause the radio to "blend to mono" at low signal levels. I like the dynamic diode limiter better as a solution to the tracking problem though. That would also leave the discriminator driver supply voltage free as a point to inject a cosine correction signal for C-Quam reception. John From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Feb 14 21:49:27 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 15 Feb 2003 05:49:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 34999 invoked from network); 15 Feb 2003 05:49:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Feb 2003 05:49:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Feb 2003 05:49:26 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-228.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.228]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h1F5nNe4020082 for ; Fri, 14 Feb 2003 23:49:24 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <029a01c2d4b6$50f27ac0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <20030213034847.79661.qmail@web14204.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Please pass along compliments to WBZ Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 23:51:39 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude I asked them how much they wanted for their AMS generator. Will let you know what, if any, response I get. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "John P." > WBZ has some great sounding commercials and music tonight! > > Please leave them a message, or better yet MAIL THEM A LETTER, telling them how > great they sound in stereo (they really do sound great)! From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Feb 14 22:01:27 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 15 Feb 2003 06:01:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 89693 invoked from network); 15 Feb 2003 06:01:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Feb 2003 06:01:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Feb 2003 06:01:26 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-228.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.228]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h1F61Ne4022297 for ; Sat, 15 Feb 2003 00:01:24 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <02a601c2d4b7$fe247120$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: We're here to talk about AM Stereo Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 00:03:39 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude John, it would be patently unfair to judge us merely because you came into the conversation at a bad time. Yes, there was some unnecessary IBOC bashing, but the WOR wars (intended to be a mild pun) did cool off (Eric being mostly the exception), much to the credit of many. Right now I see the current crop of comments as more borne of skepticism than outright bashing. It will be interesting to see what happens when the WBZ/KDKA hash-fest begins, especially during a period of daytime DX conditions. I think Leonard Kahn is (mostly) right, and hope to get a spare moment to chime in on the FCC comments site. Scott Todd ----- Original Message ----- From: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John P." > wrote: > > > > J.B.: I don't understand why you frequent our list when our interest > > is in high-quality stereo AM broadcasting, and by reading your posts > > it appears you have no love for stereo AM at all - so why ARE you > > here? > > An iBiquity spy? > > The truth is that I came here because I am interested in the history > of the MW AM broadcast band, and the history and technology of "AM > stereo". But when I first arrived here, I found that the subject > matter of the group wasn't really "AM stereo" but was instead negative > "IBOC" bashing. From amfmdx@fastq.com Fri Feb 14 22:56:35 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 15 Feb 2003 06:56:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 13894 invoked from network); 15 Feb 2003 06:56:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Feb 2003 06:56:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Feb 2003 06:56:35 -0000 Received: from fastq (d130-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.162]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id h1F6uXU87767 for ; Fri, 14 Feb 2003 23:56:34 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <002801c2d4bf$31ac1b40$a2f9bed8@com> To: Subject: Usage of the name Ragnar Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 23:55:13 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla Gents, I have used the name Ragnar Danneskjold for a long time as an alias. I would like to let you all know that I am not AMStereoRules and I really don't know who it is, nor do I care. I only want to make it known that the person using the nom-de-plume Ragnar is not me. Kevin Mesa, Arizona [ The Real Ragnar Danneskjold ] This message has been composed of recycled electrons. None of these electrons has been harmed or injured in the creation and transmission of this message but they have been shamelessly exploited for this use. From amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sat Feb 15 02:07:08 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 57930 invoked from network); 15 Feb 2003 10:07:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Feb 2003 10:07:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.78) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Feb 2003 10:07:06 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: notify@yahoogroups.com Received: from [66.218.67.252] by n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Feb 2003 10:07:06 -0000 Date: 15 Feb 2003 10:07:03 -0000 Message-ID: <1045303623.5589.97378.w73@yahoogroups.com> X-eGroups-Application: files X-Yahoo-Group-Post: system From: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: New file uploaded to amstereoforum MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello, This email message is a notification to let you know that a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the amstereoforum group. File : /stations/amst84.txt Uploaded by : kevtronics Description : A text document entitled "Second Generation Techniques for AM Stereo Exciter Design", by Broadcast Electronics, Inc., with a date of September 1984. You can access this file at the URL http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum/files/stations/amst84.txt To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/files Regards, kevtronics From powell@conterra.com Sat Feb 15 07:23:46 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: powell@conterra.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 15 Feb 2003 15:23:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 55257 invoked from network); 15 Feb 2003 15:23:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Feb 2003 15:23:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO ziggy.conterra.com) (66.112.206.20) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Feb 2003 15:23:46 -0000 Received: from ziggy.conterra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ziggy.conterra.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h1FFNjUq062679 for ; Sat, 15 Feb 2003 10:23:45 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from powell@conterra.com) Received: (from www@localhost) by ziggy.conterra.com (8.12.6/8.12.6/Submit) id h1FFNiKm062678 for amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com; Sat, 15 Feb 2003 10:23:44 -0500 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: ziggy.conterra.com: www set sender to powell@conterra.com using -f Received: from 209.213.26.22 ( [209.213.26.22]) as user powell@mail.conterra.com by ziggy.conterra.com with HTTP; Sat, 15 Feb 2003 10:23:44 -0500 Message-ID: <1045322624.3e4e5b80b3b66@ziggy.conterra.com> Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 10:23:44 -0500 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: more growlin and prowlin from the UN sunny south! References: <1045287776.1447.65300.m5@yahoogroups.com> In-Reply-To: <1045287776.1447.65300.m5@yahoogroups.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) 3.1 From: powell@conterra.com X-Originating-IP: 209.213.26.22 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=8062869 X-Yahoo-Profile: W4OPW > Message: 2 > Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 08:13:50 -0800 (PST) > From: "John P." > Subject: WOWO still 50KW daytime > > Dick W wrote: > "... but I read in the paper a year or two ago that the corporation that > owns > WOWO was lowering its power down to 10,000 watts in order to allow its New > York > City station to increase its power and coverage area" > > You are correct for NIGHT only - when the IBOC is (supposed) to be off. > They > still have 50KW DAYS, and 9800 watts at night so their NYC area station can > blast away. And SUBSTANTIALLY eroded the LOCAL area served by WOWO. Just remember their thransmitter site is some 20 miles SW of the city, and the new tighter null casts a shadow right over the city of license. IF it were not for the 15 ground conductivity, the signal would be useless in the COL if it were much lower. John Byrnes thinks destroying the night local coverage of the class I's would be the way to go. Well, in a lot of cases, you may as well just TURN OFF the station. In NYC and Atlanta, the ground conductivity is SO poor that the clear channel AM's are the ONLY AM's that mostly cover the city at night. In Nashville WSM is the ONLY AM that really covers the local area fairly well. The DA that WLAC has has LARGE areas that are nulled down to uselessness. It's true that WLAC is at the high end of the band, but it's the DA that kills the signal. Cutting night power really kills things. In at Atlanta ( with a 0.5 or less ground conductivity) WSB is the ONLY AM that mostly covers the metro area, but there are problems east, as at 40 miles selective fading is a problem. As you go north into slightly better conductivity this is not as much a problem. WCNN on 680 with 10KW with a highly directional signal covers only a very small part of the metro area. And for listeners in the city, you need a much higher signal level to overcome the ever increasing electrical noise level, that NOTHING but higher powers will take care of. It seems the FCC does not want to take care of the problems created by illegal electronic lighting ( ones that are getting on the market and don't follow or meet specifications for radiation) and noisy electrical lines. Power levels of 250,000 watts would be needed to solve this problem. IBOC or DRM can't address this noise problem. I don't care what modulation scheme you use, if it's covered up by noise, well, it isn't going to work. I am sure Tom Ray would not like WOR made more directional and 10,000 watts at night! I bet he'd like 250,000 watts though! Especially since NYC has bad ground conductivity, but not as bad as mine. ( Sand is WHAAAT ?) A couple of us tried our best to get Harris to demo IBOC at the South Carolina Broadcasters Association January meeting by offering to allow it to be done on either of the 2 relatively new DX-10's. There was allll this sputtering by the Harris rep who's a friend. He said it would take a long time, etc to get it set up. ( There was plenty of time). Oh well. We had fun twisting him in the wind over this. It WOULD have been nice to try it. As for that, the daytime 890 is going to 50K daytime with a new Harris 3DX-50 and in the set up, it's ready for BOTH IBOC ***A N D*** DRM. Interesting. I wonder if you can do DRM and IBOC at the same time, however. Stations... I forgot WSPA was the first. Now, Kevin, who was THE first FM station to go 24 hours. HINT, it was NOT WSPA-FM. They were the first COMMERCIAL FM to do this. I know the answer because I worked there when it was FIRST done ( ah DATE ME, will it!) !! As for the TM-152, I'll check caps first. If that doesn't cure it, well I'll check other things. Powell in SC where the forecast is freezing rain! ------------------------------------------------- This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/ From powell@conterra.com Sat Feb 15 07:38:36 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: powell@conterra.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 15 Feb 2003 15:38:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 79469 invoked from network); 15 Feb 2003 15:38:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Feb 2003 15:38:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO ziggy.conterra.com) (66.112.206.20) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Feb 2003 15:38:30 -0000 Received: from ziggy.conterra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ziggy.conterra.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h1FFcTUq063310 for ; Sat, 15 Feb 2003 10:38:29 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from powell@conterra.com) Received: (from www@localhost) by ziggy.conterra.com (8.12.6/8.12.6/Submit) id h1FFcTGq063309 for amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com; Sat, 15 Feb 2003 10:38:29 -0500 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: ziggy.conterra.com: www set sender to powell@conterra.com using -f Received: from 209.213.26.22 ( [209.213.26.22]) as user powell@mail.conterra.com by ziggy.conterra.com with HTTP; Sat, 15 Feb 2003 10:38:29 -0500 Message-ID: <1045323509.3e4e5ef523933@ziggy.conterra.com> Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 10:38:29 -0500 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Those WONDERFUL Command albums References: <1045287776.1447.65300.m5@yahoogroups.com> In-Reply-To: <1045287776.1447.65300.m5@yahoogroups.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) 3.1 From: powell@conterra.com X-Originating-IP: 209.213.26.22 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=8062869 X-Yahoo-Profile: W4OPW Quoting amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com: > Message: 7 > Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2003 19:15:58 -0000 > From: "Kevin T. " > Subject: Spectacular Stereo! > > While going through my record collection, I re-discovered one of the > best sounding Stereo demonstration LPs of all time: "Persuasive > Percussion", by Command Records. The separation and sound quality are > absolutely phenomenal! > > > Then I looked at the copyright date on the LP cover... 1959! For a > record that is 44 years old, the quality is astonishingly good; the > best way to explain it is to simply let you hear it yourself. I made > an MP3 of the first track on the disc, since it is one of the best, > and you can download it here (about 5.8 megs, but it's well worth the > wait): > > > http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/1959stereo.mp3 > > > > > This was played on an inexpensive ceramic-cartridge turntable, so it's > not even as good as it could sound, but with some equalization to > flatten it out to the RIAA standard, the results are surprisingly > good; even at 256 kbps, some of the brilliance is lost in the MP3 > encoding, but I still think anybody who listens to it will be > impressed. > > > I have several other Command LPs in my collection, and they are all > stunning examples of Stereo sound at its best. Unfortunately, > "Persuasive Percussion" is one of only two of these records that has > made it to CD; the rest will have to be enjoyed from the original LPs, > if you can find them... but that's part of the magic! OOOH !! It has? I have the above, and Warren Kime and Doc Severinsen and a few others. I thought those were later than 1959. That could be just a copyright though. > > You can view the complete Command Records discography here: > > > http://easyweb.easynet.co.uk/~rcb/light/command.htm DROOL !! > Needless to say music like this makes a great demonstration for AM > Stereo -- and also would be an interesting test for IBOC's digital > compression, as many of the songs contain very intricate percussion > sounds such as hi-hats, tambourines, scratchers, and Chinese bell > trees, which rely on detailed high-frequency harmonics that IBOC's > "simulated" treble response would likely get extremely confused by. Gunther Kallman's stuff ( I hope I spelled it right) was used in some of the Shure record for cartridge tracking demos. Orchestral bells and stuff, and cut at levels guaranteed to mistrack on cheaper cartridges. Powell ------------------------------------------------- This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/ From jbyrns@enteract.com Sat Feb 15 08:09:09 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 15 Feb 2003 16:09:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 29591 invoked from network); 15 Feb 2003 16:09:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Feb 2003 16:09:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Feb 2003 16:09:08 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.140] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Feb 2003 16:09:08 -0000 Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 16:09:08 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: OT: Stereo Oldies Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2451 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.243 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "amstereorules < amstereorules@m...>" wrote: > >No, Mr. "rules" is wrong about the change in level of a single > >channel source when you press the mono button on a stereo and he > >knows it, else he wouldn't have said "I am not going to quibble > > over 3db's with you." > Voltage is voltage. I can't argue with that, always has been, and probably always will be, unless they decide to rename it, and call it something else. > You don't magically get a 3dB INCREASE by feeding two channels; There's nothing magic about it, you pump say a Watt of power into a room or automobile interior out of each of two speakers, and the total power being feed into the room/automobile will be 3 dB greater than when only one speaker is being driven with a Watt. > you are still 6dB down in both channels. Yes, as I have said repeatedly, that is true for each channel considered individually, but the total for the two channels together is down only 3 dB, when you push in the mono button while listening to a single channel sound, that is my point. > >The 6 dB figure is correct only if you are looking at the > >output of just one of the two speakers that are implied by the > >presence of a mono/stereo button. For a sound coming from only > >one channel, there is a 6 dB decrease in output from the speaker > >of that channel when the mono button is depressed, but that > >decrease is partly made-up by the signal that will emanate from > >the second speaker when the mono button is depressed, increasing > >the total sound level by 3 dB, for a net loss of 3 dB, not the > >6 dB that Mr. "rules" claims for a sound that appears full left, > >or full right. > You aren't comparing apples to apples in your dissertation above. How so, sounds like apples to apples to me? Would you care to elaborate on why you say I am not "comparing apples to apples", and what it is I am comparing? > What engineering college did you go to? Oh my, I don't even remember saying I had attended "engineering college". This is the perennial interment question, that always seems eventually to be asked by the person on the losing side of a technical discussion, in an attempt to put the weight of the prestigious engineering college he attended behind his erroneous argument. Well I have news for you, all that counts is the facts, not what engineering college you attended. John From jbyrns@enteract.com Sat Feb 15 10:29:59 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 15 Feb 2003 18:29:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 1667 invoked from network); 15 Feb 2003 18:29:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Feb 2003 18:29:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Feb 2003 18:29:54 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.150] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Feb 2003 18:29:53 -0000 Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 18:29:53 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: more growlin and prowlin from the UN sunny south! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <1045322624.3e4e5b80b3b66@ziggy.conterra.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3611 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.157 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, powell@c... wrote: > > John Byrnes thinks destroying the night local coverage of the > class I's would be the way to go. I'm not sure if you are just taking advantage of my newly appointed status as the group whipping boy, to attribute this lie to me, or if you have just misinterpreted what I actually said? > Well, in a lot of cases, you may as well just TURN OFF the station. > In NYC and Atlanta, the ground conductivity is SO poor that the > clear channel AM's are the ONLY AM's that mostly cover the city at > night. In Nashville WSM is the ONLY AM that really covers the local > area fairly well. The DA that WLAC has has LARGE areas that are > nulled down to uselessness. It's true that WLAC is at the high end > of the band, but it's the DA that kills the signal. Cutting night > power really kills things. Who made the suggestion to cut night power? > In at Atlanta ( with a 0.5 or less ground conductivity) WSB is the > ONLY AM that mostly covers the metro area, but there are problems > east, as at 40 miles selective fading is a problem. Are you saying that WSB depends on their skywave to provide nighttime coverage to part of the city? > As you go north into slightly better conductivity this is not as > much a problem. WCNN on 680 with 10KW with a highly directional > signal covers only a very small part of the metro area. I'm not familiar with WCNN, I will have to investigate, but it is possible that WCNN would be one of the stations whose local coverage would benefit under my MW band plan. Let me explain again, I did not say that I think that "destroying the night local coverage of the class I's would be the way to go." What I actually said was that I thought that destroying the night skywave coverage of the class A's, by reclassifying them as class B's, would be the way to go. This would have little effect on the night local coverage of the former class A's, but it would allow for improvements in the night local coverage of many other class B's (former class II's) operating on the "clear channels". By eliminating the need for these stations to protect the skywave coverage areas of the former class A stations, they could let out their directional patterns in some directions, often greatly improving their local coverage. Fewer towers might also be required in the array, leading to reduced costs. > I am sure Tom Ray would not like WOR made more directional and > 10,000 watts at night! I bet he'd like 250,000 watts though! > Especially since NYC has bad ground conductivity, but not as > bad as mine. ( Sand is WHAAAT ?) Well it's the FCC that's requiring WOR's new array to be more directional, and I haven't heard anyone suggest that WOR be downgraded to 10,000 Watts at night, but let's hear from Tom Ray, or more properly, the owners of WOR. I suspect that the advertising revenue that WOR derives from the midsection of the country is next to zilch. Under my plan, the new directional array WOR is building would not be required to have such deep nulls, and could be more like the old (current) array, providing improved coverage to New Jersey, at least I think it would be New Jersey, I'm not too good the details of East coast geography. Speaking of downgrading the power of class A stations, I have heard of several class A stations, former class I-A stations, that would be required by the FCC to downgrade their power to about 35,000 Watts if they were forced to relocate their antenna system within the metropolitan area, even only a short distance, for any reason. John From amfmdx@fastq.com Sat Feb 15 13:38:16 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 15 Feb 2003 21:38:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 32680 invoked from network); 15 Feb 2003 21:38:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Feb 2003 21:38:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Feb 2003 21:38:16 -0000 Received: from fastq (d7-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.39]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id h1FLcFU12142 for ; Sat, 15 Feb 2003 14:38:15 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <000d01c2d53a$5caa9da0$27f9bed8@com> To: Subject: Another petition to kill IBOC Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 14:36:54 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla Some of you may remember Fred Vobbe, the man who let us have space on the National Radio Club server for the AM stereo list that Dennis [Amy] ran for a while. Well, Fred put a petition out to end IBOC. If I can have a place to post it since its a .pdf file, I will send it on. Kevin This message has been composed of recycled electrons. None of these electrons has been harmed or injured in the creation and transmission of this message but they have been shamelessly exploited for this use. From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sat Feb 15 17:17:18 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 16 Feb 2003 01:17:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 95946 invoked from network); 16 Feb 2003 01:17:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Feb 2003 01:17:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Feb 2003 01:17:18 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.182] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Feb 2003 01:17:17 -0000 Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 01:17:15 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Another petition to kill IBOC Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <000d01c2d53a$5caa9da0$27f9bed8@com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 715 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.179 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" wrote: > Some of you may remember Fred Vobbe, the man who let us have space on the > National Radio Club server for the AM stereo list that Dennis [Amy] ran for > a while. > > Well, Fred put a petition out to end IBOC. If I can have a place to post it > since its a .pdf file, I will send it on. > > Kevin > > This message has been composed of recycled electrons. None of these > electrons has been harmed or injured in the creation and transmission of > this message but they have been shamelessly exploited for this use. You could put it on the ftp site if there isn't enough space in the files section. ftp://209.193.86.116 JSG From possumhunter@netzero.net Sat Feb 15 17:40:53 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 16 Feb 2003 01:40:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 38439 invoked from network); 16 Feb 2003 01:40:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Feb 2003 01:40:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.115) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Feb 2003 01:40:51 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 15 Feb 2003 17:40:51 -0800 To: References: <1045287776.1447.65300.m5@yahoogroups.com> <1045322624.3e4e5b80b3b66@ziggy.conterra.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} more growlin and prowlin from the UN sunny south! Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 20:40:36 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 16 Feb 2003 01:40:51.0600 (UTC) FILETIME=[7034A100:01C2D55C] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.150.24.185] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 powell@conterra.com wrote: > Stations... I forgot WSPA was the first. Now, Kevin, who was THE first FM station to go 24 hours. HINT, it was NOT WSPA-FM. They were the first COMMERCIAL FM to do this. I know the answer because I worked there when it was FIRST done ( ah DATE ME, will it!) !! I am wanting to think it was WSCI-FM, I am not sure. I know the first AM Stereo station was WESC 660 and the first TV station to broadcast in MTS Stereo was WAXA-TV 40. WFIS is the first and only station in South Carolina with two cities of license! Kevin From di316@freenet.carleton.ca Sat Feb 15 18:51:37 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: paulc@ncf.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 16 Feb 2003 02:51:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 42622 invoked from network); 16 Feb 2003 02:51:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Feb 2003 02:51:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO tomts22-srv.bellnexxia.net) (209.226.175.184) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Feb 2003 02:51:36 -0000 Received: from ncf.ca ([64.230.22.209]) by tomts22-srv.bellnexxia.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.19 201-253-122-122-119-20020516) with ESMTP id <20030216025135.EZSB7091.tomts22-srv.bellnexxia.net@ncf.ca> for ; Sat, 15 Feb 2003 21:51:35 -0500 Message-ID: <3E4EFCBD.11550891@ncf.ca> Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 21:51:41 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.79 [en] (Windows NT 5.0; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Opening the TM-152 (was Re: This is not good.) References: <1045287776.1447.65300.m5@yahoogroups.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-eGroups-From: Paul Cumming From: Paul Cumming X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=43835445 X-Yahoo-Profile: rahoule104 "jsgilst " (jsgil@hal-pc.org) wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Powell E. Way III" > wrote: > > When I was transmitting with the Alfredo Lite on 1000 I noticed my > > TM-152 did not show stereo, nor did it on any other source. I'm in > > Columbia SC and who still is I can receive on the east coast. I > > hope it is just a capacitor. > The TM-152 has a pilot level adjustment that you could tweak. > Just remember where it was set if that doesn't work. It's right > next to the decoder chip in the corner near the transformer. Could someone tell me how to open the TM-152? I'm under the impression it consists of a wooden frame with a metal box inside containing the innards which slides out the back like a drawer (after I remove the tuning knob, I guess). It has four rubber feet on the bottom which have screws which appear to hold the metal box in place. After I removed the feet and their screws, the inside wouldn't slide out, so I tried removing the four screws on the back. The back screws were on really tightly, so I gave up. It doesn't seem to be obvious how to open the TM-152, and I don't want risk damaging it by, for example, pulling off the tuning knob when it's not supposed to be pulled off. Can someone tell me the correct procedure? -- Paul ---------------------- Paul Cumming paulc@ncf.ca From amstereorules@msn.com Sat Feb 15 19:28:25 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereorules@msn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 16 Feb 2003 03:28:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 45519 invoked from network); 16 Feb 2003 03:28:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Feb 2003 03:28:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Feb 2003 03:28:24 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.174] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Feb 2003 03:28:24 -0000 Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 03:28:24 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Opening the TM-152 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3E4EFCBD.11550891@ncf.ca> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1067 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amstereorules " X-Originating-IP: 152.163.201.194 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=130870594 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereorules >Could someone tell me how to open the TM-152? I'm under the >impression it consists of a wooden frame with a metal box inside >containing the innards which slides out the back like a drawer >(after I remove the tuning knob, I guess). It has four rubber feet >on the bottom which have screws which appear to hold the metal box >in place. After I removed the feet and their screws, the inside >wouldn't slide out, so I tried removing the four screws on the >back. The back screws were on really tightly, so I gave up. >It doesn't seem to be obvious how to open the TM-152, and I don't >want risk damaging it by, for example, pulling off the tuning knob >when it's not supposed to be pulled off. Can someone tell me the >correct procedure? Don't pull the tuning knob off and don't remove any screws in the back. You need to remove the four rubber feet, and then they're two other screws on the bottom with washers on them. Slide the frame thru the back of the wooden case. That's it. Chassis is built on metal frame. Ragnar Remember, AM Stereo Rules From amfmdx@fastq.com Sat Feb 15 21:53:38 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 16 Feb 2003 05:53:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 35367 invoked from network); 16 Feb 2003 05:53:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Feb 2003 05:53:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Feb 2003 05:53:36 -0000 Received: from fastq.com (d20-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.52]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with ESMTP id h1G5rVU18649; Sat, 15 Feb 2003 22:53:32 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <3E4EC522.C17BCD86@fastq.com> Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 22:54:29 +0000 Organization: what me worry? X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.79 (Macintosh; U; PPC) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ben@lennard.net, amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Fwd: [NRC-am] New Australian & NZ MW Guide] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; x-mac-type="54455854"; x-mac-creator="4D4F5353" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: "Kevin, Mesa, AZ" Reply-To: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla David Onley wrote: > The new Australian & New Zealand MW guide is now out via the Australian > Radio Dx Club. For those in Australia & NZ it is AUS$10-00. For those > overseas it is US $10-00 for Airmail. This includes the updater sheet in 8 > months. > > Contact: John Wright. dxer@fl.net.au > 15 Olive Cres, Peakhurst, NSW, 2210, Australia or phone +61 2 9533 6261 > > **************************************************************************** > Australian MW Group - For Australian & International Dxers > http://home.iprimus.com.au/onleydw/mwoz/ > To subscribe send blank email to: mwoz-subscribe@topica.com > **************************************************************************** From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sun Feb 16 00:35:58 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 16 Feb 2003 08:35:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 99797 invoked from network); 16 Feb 2003 08:35:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Feb 2003 08:35:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Feb 2003 08:35:57 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.139] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Feb 2003 08:35:57 -0000 Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 08:35:56 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: OT: Free Vioce Over IP FCC Petetion Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 285 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.213 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst Petition for declaratory ruling filed by pulver.com allowing Free World Dialup, an internet based world wide free long distance. http://www.pulver.com/fwd/ http://www.freeworldialup.com/ WC DOCKET NO. 03-45 http://pulver.com/fwd/fccfwd.html can now be publicly commented on. JSG From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Sun Feb 16 08:24:33 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 16 Feb 2003 16:24:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 21052 invoked from network); 16 Feb 2003 16:24:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Feb 2003 16:24:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web41003.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.93.2) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Feb 2003 16:24:33 -0000 Message-ID: <20030216162433.21571.qmail@web41003.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [68.99.152.25] by web41003.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 16 Feb 2003 08:24:32 PST Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 08:24:32 -0800 (PST) Subject: WWKB STA To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio Does anyone know what WWKB's STA is? It expires on the 22nd of the month. Maybe they'll be back in stereo then. Jay __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Shopping - Send Flowers for Valentine's Day http://shopping.yahoo.com From powell@conterra.com Sun Feb 16 08:31:29 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: powell@conterra.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 16 Feb 2003 16:31:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 44703 invoked from network); 16 Feb 2003 16:31:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Feb 2003 16:31:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO ziggy.conterra.com) (66.112.206.20) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Feb 2003 16:31:24 -0000 Received: from ziggy.conterra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ziggy.conterra.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h1GGVNUq029333 for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2003 11:31:24 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from powell@conterra.com) Received: (from www@localhost) by ziggy.conterra.com (8.12.6/8.12.6/Submit) id h1GGVNrM029332 for amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com; Sun, 16 Feb 2003 11:31:23 -0500 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: ziggy.conterra.com: www set sender to powell@conterra.com using -f Received: from 209.213.26.22 ( [209.213.26.22]) as user powell@mail.conterra.com by ziggy.conterra.com with HTTP; Sun, 16 Feb 2003 11:31:23 -0500 Message-ID: <1045413083.3e4fbcdb96291@ziggy.conterra.com> Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 11:31:23 -0500 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: And for our new whipping boy ]:) References: <1045407749.1726.27797.m12@yahoogroups.com> In-Reply-To: <1045407749.1726.27797.m12@yahoogroups.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) 3.1 From: powell@conterra.com X-Originating-IP: 209.213.26.22 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=8062869 X-Yahoo-Profile: W4OPW Quoting amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com: > Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 18:29:53 -0000 > From: "John " > Subject: Re: more growlin and prowlin from the UN sunny south! > > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, powell@c... wrote: > > > > John Byrnes thinks destroying the night local coverage of the > > class I's would be the way to go. > > I'm not sure if you are just taking advantage of my newly appointed > status as the group whipping boy, to attribute this lie to me, or if > you have just misinterpreted what I actually said? No dear I haven't. IF you downgrade a clear channel to a B and force a non DA night signal to go DA you most certainly DO severely DAMAGE it's night coverage. > > Well, in a lot of cases, you may as well just TURN OFF the station. > > In NYC and Atlanta, the ground conductivity is SO poor that the > > clear channel AM's are the ONLY AM's that mostly cover the city at > > night. In Nashville WSM is the ONLY AM that really covers the local > > area fairly well. The DA that WLAC has has LARGE areas that are > > nulled down to uselessness. It's true that WLAC is at the high end > > of the band, but it's the DA that kills the signal. Cutting night > > power really kills things. > > Who made the suggestion to cut night power? Going DA is defacto power cut in many directions. > > In at Atlanta ( with a 0.5 or less ground conductivity) WSB is the > > ONLY AM that mostly covers the metro area, but there are problems > > east, as at 40 miles selective fading is a problem. > > Are you saying that WSB depends on their skywave to provide nighttime > coverage to part of the city? NO, if they had anything less than what they have now it would be useless. And due to skywave groundwave cancellation east, it starts to be a problem. > > As you go north into slightly better conductivity this is not as > > much a problem. WCNN on 680 with 10KW with a highly directional > > signal covers only a very small part of the metro area. > > I'm not familiar with WCNN, I will have to investigate, but it is > possible that WCNN would be one of the stations whose local coverage > would benefit under my MW band plan. Nope. It was a daytimer and there's Raleigh, Sylva NC and Memphis among others.. > Let me explain again, I did not say that I think that "destroying the > night local coverage of the class I's would be the way to go." What I > actually said was that I thought that destroying the night skywave > coverage of the class A's, by reclassifying them as class B's, would > be the way to go. This would have little effect on the night local > coverage of the former class A's, but it would allow for improvements > in the night local coverage of many other class B's (former class > II's) operating on the "clear channels". By eliminating the need for > these stations to protect the skywave coverage areas of the former > class A stations, they could let out their directional patterns in > some directions, often greatly improving their local coverage. Fewer > towers might also be required in the array, leading to reduced costs. It would cause a major loss of local night groundwave coverage , and then there would be substantial interference from these other stations well within the local area...no matter what you say. Even the so called protection of the night signal is fraudulent. Too many stations just don't follow the rules and the FCC does NOTHING. > > I am sure Tom Ray would not like WOR made more directional and > > 10,000 watts at night! I bet he'd like 250,000 watts though! > > Especially since NYC has bad ground conductivity, but not as > > bad as mine. ( Sand is WHAAAT ?) > > Well it's the FCC that's requiring WOR's new array to be more > directional, and I haven't heard anyone suggest that WOR be downgraded > to 10,000 Watts at night, but let's hear from Tom Ray, or more > properly, the owners of WOR. I suspect that the advertising revenue > that WOR derives from the midsection of the country is next to zilch. > Under my plan, the new directional array WOR is building would not be > required to have such deep nulls, and could be more like the old > (current) array, providing improved coverage to New Jersey, at least I > think it would be New Jersey, I'm not too good the details of East > coast geography. No but if we jam in more stations with high power at night, I'm sure the interference he'd get would be a lot more. And where would his listeners be? Iboc will not handle that! Don't forget that the 2 adjacents will take a lot more interference when IBOC becomes commonplace. > Speaking of downgrading the power of class A stations, I have heard of > several class A stations, former class I-A stations, that would be > required by the FCC to downgrade their power to about 35,000 Watts if > they were forced to relocate their antenna system within the > metropolitan area, even only a short distance, for any reason. Then they may as well turn the station off. That certainly wouldn't begin to cover the area then. > John > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________ > ________________________________________________________________________ > > Message: 5 > Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 14:36:54 -0700 > From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" > Subject: Another petition to kill IBOC > > Some of you may remember Fred Vobbe, the man who let us have space on the > National Radio Club server for the AM stereo list that Dennis [Amy] ran for > a while. > > Well, Fred put a petition out to end IBOC. If I can have a place to post it > since its a .pdf file, I will send it on. > > Kevin > > This message has been composed of recycled electrons. None of these > electrons has been harmed or injured in the creation and transmission of > this message but they have been shamelessly exploited for this use. > > > > ________________________________________________________________________ > ________________________________________________________________________ > > Message: 6 > Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 01:17:15 -0000 > From: "jsgilst " > Subject: Re: Another petition to kill IBOC > > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" > wrote: > > Some of you may remember Fred Vobbe, the man who let us have space > on the > > National Radio Club server for the AM stereo list that Dennis [Amy] > ran for > > a while. > > > > Well, Fred put a petition out to end IBOC. If I can have a place to > post it > > since its a .pdf file, I will send it on. > > > > Kevin > > > > This message has been composed of recycled electrons. None of these > > electrons has been harmed or injured in the creation and > transmission of > > this message but they have been shamelessly exploited for this use. > > > You could put it on the ftp site if there isn't enough space > in the files section. > > ftp://209.193.86.116 > > JSG > > > > ________________________________________________________________________ > ________________________________________________________________________ > > Message: 7 > Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 20:40:36 -0500 > From: "Possum Hunter" > Subject: Re: more growlin and prowlin from the UN sunny south! > > powell@conterra.com wrote: > > Stations... I forgot WSPA was the first. Now, Kevin, who was THE first FM > station to go 24 hours. HINT, it was NOT WSPA-FM. They were the first > COMMERCIAL FM to do this. I know the answer because I worked there when it > was FIRST done ( ah DATE ME, will it!) !! > > I am wanting to think it was WSCI-FM, I am not sure. I know the first AM > Stereo station was WESC 660 and the first TV station to broadcast in MTS > Stereo was WAXA-TV 40. > > WFIS is the first and only station in South Carolina with two cities of > license! > > Kevin > > > ________________________________________________________________________ > ________________________________________________________________________ > > Message: 8 > Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 21:51:41 -0500 > From: Paul Cumming > Subject: Opening the TM-152 (was Re: This is not good.) > > "jsgilst " (jsgil@hal-pc.org) wrote: > > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Powell E. Way III" > > wrote: > > > When I was transmitting with the Alfredo Lite on 1000 I noticed my > > > TM-152 did not show stereo, nor did it on any other source. I'm in > > > Columbia SC and who still is I can receive on the east coast. I > > > hope it is just a capacitor. > > The TM-152 has a pilot level adjustment that you could tweak. > > Just remember where it was set if that doesn't work. It's right > > next to the decoder chip in the corner near the transformer. > > Could someone tell me how to open the TM-152? I'm under the > impression it consists of a wooden frame with a metal box inside > containing the innards which slides out the back like a drawer (after I > remove the tuning knob, I guess). It has four rubber feet on the bottom > which have screws which appear to hold the metal box in place. After I > removed the feet and their screws, the inside wouldn't slide out, so I > tried removing the four screws on the back. The back screws were on > really tightly, so I gave up. > It doesn't seem to be obvious how to open the TM-152, and I don't > want risk damaging it by, for example, pulling off the tuning knob when > it's not supposed to be pulled off. Can someone tell me the correct > procedure? > > -- Paul > > ---------------------- > Paul Cumming > paulc@ncf.ca > > > ________________________________________________________________________ > ________________________________________________________________________ > > Message: 9 > Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 03:28:24 -0000 > From: "amstereorules " > Subject: Opening the TM-152 > > >Could someone tell me how to open the TM-152? I'm under the > >impression it consists of a wooden frame with a metal box inside > >containing the innards which slides out the back like a drawer > >(after I remove the tuning knob, I guess). It has four rubber feet > >on the bottom which have screws which appear to hold the metal box > >in place. After I removed the feet and their screws, the inside > >wouldn't slide out, so I tried removing the four screws on the > >back. The back screws were on really tightly, so I gave up. > >It doesn't seem to be obvious how to open the TM-152, and I don't > >want risk damaging it by, for example, pulling off the tuning knob > >when it's not supposed to be pulled off. Can someone tell me the > >correct procedure? > Don't pull the tuning knob off and don't remove any screws in the > back. You need to remove the four rubber feet, and then they're > two other screws on the bottom with washers on them. Slide the > frame thru the back of the wooden case. That's it. Chassis is built > on metal frame. Ragnar > > Remember, > AM Stereo Rules > > > > ________________________________________________________________________ > ________________________________________________________________________ > > Message: 10 > Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 22:54:29 +0000 > From: "Kevin, Mesa, AZ" > Subject: [Fwd: [NRC-am] New Australian & NZ MW Guide] > > > > David Onley wrote: > > > The new Australian & New Zealand MW guide is now out via the Australian > > Radio Dx Club. For those in Australia & NZ it is AUS$10-00. For those > > overseas it is US $10-00 for Airmail. This includes the updater sheet in 8 > > months. > > > > Contact: John Wright. dxer@fl.net.au > > 15 Olive Cres, Peakhurst, NSW, 2210, Australia or phone +61 2 9533 6261 > > > > > **************************************************************************** > > Australian MW Group - For Australian & International Dxers > > http://home.iprimus.com.au/onleydw/mwoz/ > > To subscribe send blank email to: mwoz-subscribe@topica.com > > > **************************************************************************** > > > > ________________________________________________________________________ > ________________________________________________________________________ > > Message: 11 > Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 08:35:56 -0000 > From: "jsgilst " > Subject: OT: Free Vioce Over IP FCC Petetion > > Petition for declaratory ruling filed by pulver.com > allowing Free World Dialup, an internet based world > wide free long distance. > > http://www.pulver.com/fwd/ > http://www.freeworldialup.com/ > > > WC DOCKET NO. 03-45 > http://pulver.com/fwd/fccfwd.html > can now be publicly commented on. > > JSG > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________ > ________________________________________________________________________ > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > ------------------------------------------------- This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/ From powell@conterra.com Sun Feb 16 08:33:07 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: powell@conterra.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 16 Feb 2003 16:33:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 71204 invoked from network); 16 Feb 2003 16:33:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Feb 2003 16:33:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO ziggy.conterra.com) (66.112.206.20) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Feb 2003 16:33:07 -0000 Received: from ziggy.conterra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ziggy.conterra.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h1GGX6Uq029425 for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2003 11:33:06 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from powell@conterra.com) Received: (from www@localhost) by ziggy.conterra.com (8.12.6/8.12.6/Submit) id h1GGX6Yt029424 for amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com; Sun, 16 Feb 2003 11:33:06 -0500 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: ziggy.conterra.com: www set sender to powell@conterra.com using -f Received: from 209.213.26.22 ( [209.213.26.22]) as user powell@mail.conterra.com by ziggy.conterra.com with HTTP; Sun, 16 Feb 2003 11:33:05 -0500 Message-ID: <1045413185.3e4fbd41f3343@ziggy.conterra.com> Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 11:33:05 -0500 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: rats References: <1045407749.1726.27797.m12@yahoogroups.com> In-Reply-To: <1045407749.1726.27797.m12@yahoogroups.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) 3.1 From: powell@conterra.com X-Originating-IP: 209.213.26.22 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=8062869 X-Yahoo-Profile: W4OPW Durn computer sent message before I could hit delete and delete the bottom half of the digest. I am on the cranky webmailer. Sorry for the goof. Hit me with a ground radial. Powell ------------------------------------------------- This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/ From powell@conterra.com Sun Feb 16 08:36:36 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: powell@conterra.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 16 Feb 2003 16:36:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 28766 invoked from network); 16 Feb 2003 16:36:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Feb 2003 16:36:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO ziggy.conterra.com) (66.112.206.20) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Feb 2003 16:36:36 -0000 Received: from ziggy.conterra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ziggy.conterra.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h1GGaYUq029578 for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2003 11:36:35 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from powell@conterra.com) Received: (from www@localhost) by ziggy.conterra.com (8.12.6/8.12.6/Submit) id h1GGaW39029577 for amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com; Sun, 16 Feb 2003 11:36:32 -0500 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: ziggy.conterra.com: www set sender to powell@conterra.com using -f Received: from 209.213.26.22 ( [209.213.26.22]) as user powell@mail.conterra.com by ziggy.conterra.com with HTTP; Sun, 16 Feb 2003 11:36:32 -0500 Message-ID: <1045413392.3e4fbe106b086@ziggy.conterra.com> Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 11:36:32 -0500 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: 1st 24 hour FM station in SC References: <1045407749.1726.27797.m12@yahoogroups.com> In-Reply-To: <1045407749.1726.27797.m12@yahoogroups.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) 3.1 From: powell@conterra.com X-Originating-IP: 209.213.26.22 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=8062869 X-Yahoo-Profile: W4OPW The first COMMERCIAL FM station in SC WSPA-FM. The first FM is WSBF-FM. I was there in the mid 60's. 2 Crown reel to reel play backs @ 3.75 auto reverse ( with metal foil sense and a ITC for ID every 15minutes for overnite. Powell ------------------------------------------------- This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/ From powell@conterra.com Sun Feb 16 09:46:50 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: powell@conterra.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 16 Feb 2003 17:46:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 23086 invoked from network); 16 Feb 2003 17:46:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Feb 2003 17:46:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO ziggy.conterra.com) (66.112.206.20) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Feb 2003 17:46:47 -0000 Received: from ziggy.conterra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ziggy.conterra.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h1GHkkUq032939 for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2003 12:46:46 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from powell@conterra.com) Received: (from www@localhost) by ziggy.conterra.com (8.12.6/8.12.6/Submit) id h1GHkk2j032938 for amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com; Sun, 16 Feb 2003 12:46:46 -0500 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: ziggy.conterra.com: www set sender to powell@conterra.com using -f Received: from 209.213.26.22 ( [209.213.26.22]) as user powell@mail.conterra.com by ziggy.conterra.com with HTTP; Sun, 16 Feb 2003 12:46:46 -0500 Message-ID: <1045417606.3e4fce860aca1@ziggy.conterra.com> Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 12:46:46 -0500 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Smoke and mirrors ? References: <1045407749.1726.27797.m12@yahoogroups.com> In-Reply-To: <1045407749.1726.27797.m12@yahoogroups.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) 3.1 From: powell@conterra.com X-Originating-IP: 209.213.26.22 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=8062869 X-Yahoo-Profile: W4OPW Our well beloved John Byrns, our designated whipping boy, would like us to believe that reclassifying a non DA clear channel to a B with a DA would have no ramifications on a stations night local service. First of all, to do so would require moving a station, and in a major metropolitan area the move would most likely have to be substantial, and it might not even be possible to find real estate to do this with. Then what do you do? Turn the station off? In the case of WSB, the current tower has a shopping center around it. Most likely you'd have to move the transmitter site over 40 miles one way or at least 30 east. WBT in Charlotte has a very nasty null to the west to protect KFAB. Just going a teeeeny bit west and PFFFT! And there's another null to the east that cuts coverage. So the western half of the metro coverage area that's not in the biggest part of the null gets interference from the multiple cheaters the FCC has done nothing to stop. In quite a few cities the metro area has gotten so big that even the non DA's don't really do an adequate job in the very outlying areas...since the metro area stretches over 50 or more miles, such as Dallas- Fort Worth. Nashville's WLAC has very bad nulls very close in. True it's at 1510, but the ground conductivity is dismal, and even WSM suffers from signal degradation at 30 miles, and if they had to be directional, most likely would not cover the metro area there, either. A couple years ago the CE for WLAC Mike Gideon said he was getting a lot interference that was just tearing them up in the local area. I finally ID'd it as the Greensboro daytimer that was cheating. In fact they weren't even using critical hours 250 watts, but 1000 watts but 500 miles away the little KW was causing horrible interference. Paul Jellison who oversees the Cincinnati CC stuff had an Alabama station on 700 that decided they didn't need to sign off, and was causing terrible interference to WLW. Just recently another (unknown?) station on 1530 left their transmitter on and was off frequency enough to cause the STEREO light on AM Stereo RX's to light. This was finally corrected. Point made. I hope it wasn't a dagger through a heart. Powell ------------------------------------------------- This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/ From powell@conterra.com Sun Feb 16 10:10:55 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: powell@conterra.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 16 Feb 2003 18:10:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 7254 invoked from network); 16 Feb 2003 18:10:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Feb 2003 18:10:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO ziggy.conterra.com) (66.112.206.20) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Feb 2003 18:10:52 -0000 Received: from ziggy.conterra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ziggy.conterra.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h1GIApUq034045 for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2003 13:10:51 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from powell@conterra.com) Received: (from www@localhost) by ziggy.conterra.com (8.12.6/8.12.6/Submit) id h1GIAprj034044 for amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com; Sun, 16 Feb 2003 13:10:51 -0500 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: ziggy.conterra.com: www set sender to powell@conterra.com using -f Received: from 209.213.26.22 ( [209.213.26.22]) as user powell@mail.conterra.com by ziggy.conterra.com with HTTP; Sun, 16 Feb 2003 13:10:51 -0500 Message-ID: <1045419051.3e4fd42b3f73d@ziggy.conterra.com> Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 13:10:51 -0500 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Sony SRF-42A References: <1045407749.1726.27797.m12@yahoogroups.com> In-Reply-To: <1045407749.1726.27797.m12@yahoogroups.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) 3.1 From: powell@conterra.com X-Originating-IP: 209.213.26.22 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=8062869 X-Yahoo-Profile: W4OPW Does this radio ( I have 2 one as a spare) have sync detection? Does it do other than cquam? Now I have a piece of a Sangean SR-66. I took it apart to fix the dial cord and the case and stuff fell on the floor and I couldn't find the pieces to put it back. Any one need it? Powell ( with a REAL AM stereo post for once!) ------------------------------------------------- This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/ From KC4QLP@aol.com Sun Feb 16 10:25:49 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 16 Feb 2003 18:25:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 30725 invoked from network); 16 Feb 2003 18:25:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Feb 2003 18:25:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m06.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.161) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Feb 2003 18:25:48 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.1cf.2de470e (25305) for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2003 13:25:32 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1cf.2de470e.2b81319c@aol.com> Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 13:25:32 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Smoke and mirrors ? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 2/16/03 12:47:48 PM Eastern Standard Time, powell@conterra.com writes: << WBT in Charlotte has a very nasty null to the west to protect KFAB. Just going a teeeeny bit west and PFFFT! And there's another null to the east that cuts coverage. So the western half of the metro coverage area that's not in the biggest part of the null gets interference from the multiple cheaters the FCC has done nothing to stop. >> A chronic cheater on 1110 is religious broadcaster WCKO "The Power Company" Norfolk Va....always coming on way to early and leaving the air way to late. <> Any one you know have an idea where the offender was from? It really makes me sick that we live in a day of constant bickering,law breaking and self gratification. I suppose the world is becoming like one giant Roman empire...how long will it be before it all falls apart? Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net Echolink node # 56704 -- 146.590 VHF,440.850 UHF (PL 131.8) _______________________________________________________ From jbyrns@enteract.com Sun Feb 16 10:34:09 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 16 Feb 2003 18:34:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 88031 invoked from network); 16 Feb 2003 18:34:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Feb 2003 18:34:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Feb 2003 18:34:08 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.168] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Feb 2003 18:34:07 -0000 Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 18:34:03 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Smoke and mirrors ? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <1045417606.3e4fce860aca1@ziggy.conterra.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2843 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.70 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, powell@c... wrote: > Our well beloved John Byrns, our designated whipping boy, would > like us to believe that reclassifying a non DA clear channel to > a B with a DA would have no ramifications on a stations night local > service. Powell, you seem to be taking the tack, tell a big enough lie, and people will believe you. I am not sure where you came up with this lie about DA's that you are attributing to me? All I said was that if it was mine to do, I would reclassify the class A's, to class B's. I didn't say anything about requiring the former class A's to use directional antennas. What I said about DA's, is that reclassifying the class A's as class B's would allow some of the other class B's on the "clear" channels to let out their nighttime DA patterns, to improve their local nighttime coverage, which in many cases has problems due to the growth of their metropolitan area. The former class A's would retain their original facilities, why would reclassifying them as class B's require any change in their facilities? Granted the nighttime coverage of the former class A stations would be reduced by this proposal, mostly by the elimination of protected skywave coverage, but I seriously doubt that this would have a significant economic impact on the operation of these stations, it would mostly be a wound to their pride. In exchange for this loss of skywave coverage by a handful of stations, many more stations would be able to improve their nighttime coverage in their local area. > First of all, to do so would require moving a station, and in a > major metropolitan area the move would most likely have to be > substantial, and it might not even be possible to find real estate > to do this with. Then what do you do? Turn the station off? Huh, why would they have to move? The only thing the former class A stations would have to do is tack a new piece of paper up on the wall, hardly something that would require a move. But ignoring my plan, which doesn't require any move of the class A's, sooner or later some of the class A's are going to have to move for one reason or another, and face a potential downgrade to 35,000 Watts by the FCC. I don't understand why you think this would be reason to "Turn the station off"? I bet if that does happen, there will be a long line of applicants waiting to get those abandoned class A allocations, a 35,000 Watt omni directional clear channel station seems a like lot better than nothing. I assume, but don't know, that the stations that may face this dilemma in the future might be able to retain a power of 50,000 Watts if they installed a mild directional antenna, which might be to their advantage in serving their City of License anyway, if they are forced to move further out. John From KC4QLP@aol.com Sun Feb 16 10:34:16 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 16 Feb 2003 18:34:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 52690 invoked from network); 16 Feb 2003 18:34:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Feb 2003 18:34:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d08.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.40) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Feb 2003 18:34:15 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.1d9.2df1300 (25305) for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2003 13:34:04 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1d9.2df1300.2b81339c@aol.com> Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 13:34:04 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Sony SRF-42A To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 2/16/03 1:11:17 PM Eastern Standard Time, powell@conterra.com writes: << Does this radio ( I have 2 one as a spare) have sync detection? Does it do other than cquam?>> Dont know if it will cleanly decode anything other than C-QUAM....I know others that have experimented on here could give you a heads up there. <> A piece of a Sangean SR-66? ...oh me!..thats one good little radio. I had a problem with the dial cord as well...a soldering iron "fixed" mine. Seems like the plastic "wheel" becomes brittle. Where the tension spring fastens to a little nub,well that broke off ...so I had to do some improvising.All is well with it now. {knock on wood} Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net Echolink node # 56704 -- 146.590 VHF,440.850 UHF (PL 131.8) _______________________________________________________ From jbyrns@enteract.com Sun Feb 16 11:17:35 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 16 Feb 2003 19:17:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 39940 invoked from network); 16 Feb 2003 19:17:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Feb 2003 19:17:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.89) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Feb 2003 19:17:34 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.181] by n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Feb 2003 19:17:30 -0000 Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 19:17:27 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: 5 kHz AM audio (was: I Heard IBOC Interference this week) Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1485 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.243 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "amstereorules < amstereorules@m...>" wrote: > Look guys this IBOC bashing is getting old. Remember that an > IBOC Receiver must have a 30KC i.f. passband- does this ring a > bell, the old Carvers had a 30KC passband, and MW stations were > allowed to xmit 30KC or more from their trans-mitters. This is true, but the old Carvers were generally unplesent to listen to in the "30 kHz" mode. They would have been much better radios if they had limited themselves to 20 kHz, but then they wouldn't have had the bragging rights. > Were people complaining then about that great high fidelity MW > band? C'mon, now get a grip. Well actually someone must have been complaining, else why did the FCC reduce the AM channel width to 20 kHz, from 30 kHz, a few years back? WSM for one was complaining way back sometime around the early 1960's. They published a paper, I think it may have been in the Transactions of IRE/IEEE Professional Group on Broadcasting, although it could have been somewhere else, its been a long time. In the paper WSM advocated restricting the audio bandwidth of AM stations to 5 kHz, to reduce adjacent channel interference. The paper included a suggested design for a 5 kHz brick wall Low Pass Filter. If I remember correctly the paper also indicated that WSM had petitioned the FCC to institute a rule making to restrict the allowable audio bandwidth of AM stations to 5 kHz. John From n0uiheric@aol.com Sun Feb 16 13:38:55 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 16 Feb 2003 21:38:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 66237 invoked from network); 16 Feb 2003 21:38:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Feb 2003 21:38:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r03.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.99) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Feb 2003 21:38:54 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-r03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.a3.3a7c488d (4254) for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2003 16:38:48 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 16:38:48 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: I Heard IBOC Interference this week, and it is unbelievable! To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih Your prediction of IBOC being as popular as Eureka 147 will NEVER COME TO PASS. Here's why: -Reduced coverage -Incompatibility with current receivers (according to the Virginia Center for The Public Press, 500 million radios would have to be replaced) -Unaffordable receivers for the average Joe or Jane, along with the sky-high cost of converting stations to this unproven format AM and FM were created for ANALOG BROADCASTING ONLY...not digital. It's time for IBOCrap to go. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Sun Feb 16 13:38:55 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 16 Feb 2003 21:38:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 88533 invoked from network); 16 Feb 2003 21:38:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Feb 2003 21:38:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r03.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.99) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Feb 2003 21:38:53 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-r03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.c9.3022e0da (4254) for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2003 16:38:49 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 16:38:48 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: WOWO still 50KW daytime To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih My main problem in the St. Louis area on 1190 is not WLIB, but rather CFSL in Weyburn, SK. All-sports KRFT in nearby De Soto, MO (with it's transmitter in East St. Louis, IL) is looking at full-time; they're co-owned with ex-Stereo station KFNS 590 Wood River, IL. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Sun Feb 16 13:40:37 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 16 Feb 2003 21:40:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 72038 invoked from network); 16 Feb 2003 21:38:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Feb 2003 21:38:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d09.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.41) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Feb 2003 21:38:59 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-d09.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.11.a4d22f9 (4254) for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2003 16:38:47 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <11.a4d22f9.2b815ee6@aol.com> Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 16:38:46 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} IBOC/negativity timeout? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih Scott, what are you talking about? 24 million AM Stereo receivers in the U.S. marketplace alone? That makes dropping AM Stereo not only unnecessary, but also illogical. It's not over...we must keep up the fight to eliminate IBOCrap and keep C-QUAM. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Sun Feb 16 14:08:16 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 16 Feb 2003 22:08:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 97023 invoked from network); 16 Feb 2003 22:08:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Feb 2003 22:08:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf12bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.32) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Feb 2003 22:08:15 -0000 Received: from juan ([67.34.199.177]) by imf12bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.25 201-253-122-122-125-20020815) with SMTP id <20030216221013.UVPZ1248.imf12bis.bellsouth.net@juan> for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2003 17:10:13 -0500 Message-ID: <000801c2d607$e7fce160$af78fea9@juan> To: References: <1cf.2de470e.2b81319c@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Smoke and mirrors ? Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 17:08:16 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I agree Bob... btw, another offender is 1580 in Chatahoochie, FL Actually with programming at night, although they are a daytimer. I have always, when encountering the offenders, was to try to call, or write, to tell them. I don't believe in punishing someone for an ocassional mistake. But when it is done, as the FCC used to say, willfully and or repeated, it might mean contacting the FCC. So sad.... A local cluster close to me is guilty of what I mentioned above...willfull and repeated violations of the FCC rules. Juan ----- Original Message ----- From: KC4QLP@aol.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, February 16, 2003 1:25 PM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Smoke and mirrors ? In a message dated 2/16/03 12:47:48 PM Eastern Standard Time, powell@conterra.com writes: << WBT in Charlotte has a very nasty null to the west to protect KFAB. Just going a teeeeny bit west and PFFFT! And there's another null to the east that cuts coverage. So the western half of the metro coverage area that's not in the biggest part of the null gets interference from the multiple cheaters the FCC has done nothing to stop. >> A chronic cheater on 1110 is religious broadcaster WCKO "The Power Company" Norfolk Va....always coming on way to early and leaving the air way to late. <> Any one you know have an idea where the offender was from? It really makes me sick that we live in a day of constant bickering,law breaking and self gratification. I suppose the world is becoming like one giant Roman empire...how long will it be before it all falls apart? Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net Echolink node # 56704 -- 146.590 VHF,440.850 UHF (PL 131.8) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From stodd@sherbtel.net Sun Feb 16 15:00:22 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 16 Feb 2003 23:00:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 37030 invoked from network); 16 Feb 2003 23:00:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Feb 2003 23:00:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Feb 2003 23:00:21 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-85-94.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.85.94]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h1GN0He4029600 for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2003 17:00:19 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <00df01c2d60f$81adcde0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <11.a4d22f9.2b815ee6@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} IBOC/negativity timeout? Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 17:02:37 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude How many of those are still in regular use? How many are now in wrecked or worn out vehicles in salvage yards? I suppose if some AMS station got really creative and built itself a good sized audience, and really marketed its stereo status and also offered info on raiding said salvage yards and resurrecting these older AMS radios for the non-techie, it might get some press and keep some stations stereo that were tempted to turn it off. But to REALLY reverse the trend, it would have to be done in more than one major market. But even that alone wouldn't be enough- there would still have to be readily available radios that John and Jane Q. Public could at least order on the net, if not get at the local Where's Waldo Mart. Of course the manufacturer would have to purchase extra ad time if they were to be limited to net sales. We're getting to a point where some of the older AMS equipment is in need of replacing, and it isn't being done (to wit- what's happening in Australia.) Aside from the fancy (wish I could afford one) Fanfare tuners, there's nothing else out there for the home market, nothing in the way of stock ghetto blasters, and only a few premium auto sound systems that one can buy new. Believe me, I'm frustrated too- AMS sounds too good to sacrifice it to the bit-reduced digital gods, but unless someone somewhere can come up with the cash to build a barge load of affordable sets, I'm not sure what can be done to stop it from happening. Even if enough support for Leonard Kahn's, and now Fred Vobbe's, petitions came in, you still have the aforementioned equipment replacement factor working against us- we'll have the analog without the stereo. Scott ----- Original Message ----- From: > Scott, what are you talking about? 24 million AM Stereo receivers in the U.S. > marketplace alone? That makes dropping AM Stereo not only unnecessary, but > also illogical. From stodd@sherbtel.net Sun Feb 16 15:22:45 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 16 Feb 2003 23:22:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 77445 invoked from network); 16 Feb 2003 23:22:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Feb 2003 23:22:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Feb 2003 23:22:44 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-85-94.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.85.94]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h1GNMfe4004038 for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2003 17:22:42 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <011001c2d612$a25c2b60$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} "Stereo 2BS" (not anymore) Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 17:25:01 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Good to know a lot of you aussies are making your voices heard. If the stations don't know anyone cares about stereo, they won't keep stereo as part of their future plans. Let's hope enough write in to cause them to turn it back on again. Scott Todd ----- Original Message ----- From: > Stereo 2BS may have been the last station in Australia to > promote AM Stereo on their station up until several months > ago. > Here is an email I sent to them on their website at www.2bs.com.au From alfredot@inetarena.com Sun Feb 16 15:55:42 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: alfredot@inetarena.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 16 Feb 2003 23:55:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 64243 invoked from network); 16 Feb 2003 23:55:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Feb 2003 23:55:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.inetarena.com) (206.129.216.13) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Feb 2003 23:55:41 -0000 Received: from hendrie (1Cust152.tnt17.beaverton.or.da.uu.net [65.227.179.152]) by mail.inetarena.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h1GNqwe02807 for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2003 15:52:58 -0800 (PST) Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 15:55:32 -0800 (PST) X-Sender: alfredo@hendrie.1610am.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: The Mouse comes to Portland In-Reply-To: <1045174448.2128.42563.m11@yahoogroups.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: "Alfredo E. Torrejon" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=25132238 X-Yahoo-Profile: alfredotorrejon Both ears of The Mouse have made their appearance on the dial in Portland, OR. That is, 1640 AM changed its callsign from KPBC to KRDZ and the programming is now Radio Disney in AM Stereo. I'm listening to them right now, and dang--they sound gooood!! Alfredo From alfredot@inetarena.com Sun Feb 16 15:59:14 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: alfredot@inetarena.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 16 Feb 2003 23:59:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 18784 invoked from network); 16 Feb 2003 23:59:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Feb 2003 23:59:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.inetarena.com) (206.129.216.13) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Feb 2003 23:59:09 -0000 Received: from hendrie (1Cust152.tnt17.beaverton.or.da.uu.net [65.227.179.152]) by mail.inetarena.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h1GNuQe03336 for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2003 15:56:26 -0800 (PST) Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 15:59:01 -0800 (PST) X-Sender: alfredo@hendrie.1610am.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: A bit of an addendum to The Mouse story In-Reply-To: <1045174448.2128.42563.m11@yahoogroups.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: "Alfredo E. Torrejon" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=25132238 X-Yahoo-Profile: alfredotorrejon I goofed (no pun intended), the new call sign is KDZR. They are playing a loop of "Be Our Guest" and their station ID. I suppose that the actual Radio Disney programming will start Monday; hopefully, the feed will be in stereo. Alfredo From fanfare@globility.com Sun Feb 16 16:49:53 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 17 Feb 2003 00:49:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 13859 invoked from network); 17 Feb 2003 00:49:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Feb 2003 00:49:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.68) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Feb 2003 00:49:51 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.187] by n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Feb 2003 00:49:51 -0000 Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 00:49:49 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Apples and oranges in AM stereo listening Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2765 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Mr.M S " X-Originating-IP: 64.56.234.6 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy No long ago we had a go-round about HD-radio and how good one radio station said it sounded. Note that the instruments used already impressed their own limitations on the review sample. These were small radios, boomboxes, etc. Viewed in terms of fidelity, such a comparison would qualify as 2 tin cans and a string would with a typical telephone line. I suppose we could refer to that as the "boombox mentality" Before I go any further, I will qualify what I am saying as not to speak against what the majority of this group uses for review purposes. Some of them feel that a boombox is adequate. However, most AM stereo receivers owned within this group seem to be used within a larger context, such as a high fidelity home audio or car audio system. Recalling that my introduction to AM-stereo was in my car radio, I never really had the opportunity to hear true, stationary AM- stereo until I heard Denon's "AMAX" model at the NAB. Therefore, to those who have not discovered the true potential of AM stereo, properly reproduced, may I offer this parallel as an explanation of as to why. Using the computer color spectrum as a parallel example, I see most standard format broadcasters assuming the typical receiver used by the public to be comparable in effect to a 16 color setting. Therefore, if the broadcaster is able to put out a sound quality of, let's say, 256 colors. That, they may think, would suffice for all. Unfortunately, broadcasters are not aware of the advantage of getting to 16 bit, let alone 32 bit, primarily because they've never listened to their analog signal under such high resolution conditions. I think if they did, they might find there is less urgency for the move to another form of modulation strictly for purposes of sound quality. After all, if there is an analog reception technology in the wings that deals with reception quality as well as does digital,(referring to Omega) and demonstrably better, wouldn't that also auger well for the the reliability of the analog carrier carrying the digital modulation? Perhaps its time broadcasters were brought to realize they've been shortchanging themselves in the area of sound qulity for so long, they might've forgotten that acquiring a better sound is and has been within their grasp all along. I've no doubt that WOR sounded great on a good radio before it underwent the change. Now it seeks to sound good on a bad radio without thought as to how they will sound on a good radio. KABL has also succumbed to that philosophy. Therefore, you can see that, what was an appreciation high quality has since given way to expedience. Will we hear what the listeners think? Not directly, but future numbers will provide some insight. MS From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Sun Feb 16 16:52:30 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 17 Feb 2003 00:52:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 49445 invoked from network); 17 Feb 2003 00:52:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Feb 2003 00:52:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf20bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.80) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Feb 2003 00:52:29 -0000 Received: from juan ([67.34.199.177]) by imf20bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.25 201-253-122-122-125-20020815) with SMTP id <20030217005428.OYCG22681.imf20bis.bellsouth.net@juan> for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2003 19:54:28 -0500 Message-ID: <007901c2d61e$da0b45d0$af78fea9@juan> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Apples and oranges in AM stereo listening Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 19:52:31 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Well said Juan ----- Original Message ----- From: Mr.M S To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, February 16, 2003 7:49 PM Subject: {AMSF} Apples and oranges in AM stereo listening No long ago we had a go-round about HD-radio and how good one radio station said it sounded. Note that the instruments used already impressed their own limitations on the review sample. These were small radios, boomboxes, etc. Viewed in terms of fidelity, such a comparison would qualify as 2 tin cans and a string would with a typical telephone line. I suppose we could refer to that as the "boombox mentality" Before I go any further, I will qualify what I am saying as not to speak against what the majority of this group uses for review purposes. Some of them feel that a boombox is adequate. However, most AM stereo receivers owned within this group seem to be used within a larger context, such as a high fidelity home audio or car audio system. Recalling that my introduction to AM-stereo was in my car radio, I never really had the opportunity to hear true, stationary AM- stereo until I heard Denon's "AMAX" model at the NAB. Therefore, to those who have not discovered the true potential of AM stereo, properly reproduced, may I offer this parallel as an explanation of as to why. Using the computer color spectrum as a parallel example, I see most standard format broadcasters assuming the typical receiver used by the public to be comparable in effect to a 16 color setting. Therefore, if the broadcaster is able to put out a sound quality of, let's say, 256 colors. That, they may think, would suffice for all. Unfortunately, broadcasters are not aware of the advantage of getting to 16 bit, let alone 32 bit, primarily because they've never listened to their analog signal under such high resolution conditions. I think if they did, they might find there is less urgency for the move to another form of modulation strictly for purposes of sound quality. After all, if there is an analog reception technology in the wings that deals with reception quality as well as does digital,(referring to Omega) and demonstrably better, wouldn't that also auger well for the the reliability of the analog carrier carrying the digital modulation? Perhaps its time broadcasters were brought to realize they've been shortchanging themselves in the area of sound qulity for so long, they might've forgotten that acquiring a better sound is and has been within their grasp all along. I've no doubt that WOR sounded great on a good radio before it underwent the change. Now it seeks to sound good on a bad radio without thought as to how they will sound on a good radio. KABL has also succumbed to that philosophy. Therefore, you can see that, what was an appreciation high quality has since given way to expedience. Will we hear what the listeners think? Not directly, but future numbers will provide some insight. MS [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From possumhunter@netzero.net Sun Feb 16 17:39:30 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 17 Feb 2003 01:39:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 72001 invoked from network); 17 Feb 2003 01:39:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Feb 2003 01:39:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.116) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Feb 2003 01:39:29 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 16 Feb 2003 17:39:29 -0800 To: References: <1045407749.1726.27797.m12@yahoogroups.com> <1045413392.3e4fbe106b086@ziggy.conterra.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} 1st 24 hour FM station in SC Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 20:39:18 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 17 Feb 2003 01:39:29.0859 (UTC) FILETIME=[69E5B130:01C2D625] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.167.163.172] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 powell@conterra.com wrote: > The first FM is WSBF-FM. I was there in the mid 60's. 2 Crown reel to reel play backs @ 3.75 auto reverse ( with metal foil sense and a ITC for ID every 15minutes for overnight. I was thinking that WCAC 101.1 was Clemson's first FM station. WCAC then became WAIM-FM and moved to Anderson with WAIM 1230 on the old tower at Anderson College. The Anderson Independent Mail then moved WAIM AM & FM out Old on Williamston Road where WAIM 1230's tower and studios are now. WAIM-FM then Became WCKN then the combo was sold to ABS Communications. ABS changed the call letters from WCKN to WROQ. ABS Sold WAIM 1230 to Palmetto Broadcasting and sold WROQ-FM to Keymarket who sold it to Clear Channel who traded it to Barnstable. I stayed at WAIM-AM 1230 when ABS sold it off. I have a reel of the old WCAC and WAIM-FM Jingles, along with the WCKN "Cookin' 101" Jingles. Kevin From n0uiheric@aol.com Sun Feb 16 19:06:11 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 17 Feb 2003 03:05:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 21435 invoked from network); 17 Feb 2003 03:05:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Feb 2003 03:05:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m05.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.8) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Feb 2003 03:05:57 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-m05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.11a.1e9afbef (3956) for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2003 22:05:52 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <11a.1e9afbef.2b81ab90@aol.com> Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 22:05:52 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} more growlin and prowlin from the UN sunny south! To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih In Missouri, I don't know which one was the first to broadcast in AM Stereo (hard to tell if it was KSD 550 in St. Louis, now KTRS, or whether it was WDAF 610 in Kansas City; me thinks it's WDAF). In St. Louis, KSD went Stereo at the same time as WESL 1490 (in 1984). KXOK 630 began testing it's C-QUAM exciter in 1987 (although they didn't go full Stereo until Crawford acquired the station in 1994). KMOX 1120 went Stereo in 1988 (the light was lit until April 2000), followed by KEZK 590 (now KFNS) in 1990. KSTL 690 went Stereo in 1995, and KXEN 1010 added Stereo nighttime service in 1998. 550 went to "fake Stereo" after Dorsey acquired the station from CBS in 1998; the pilot light was blown out in February 2001. So, we're still left with 630, 690, 1010 (at night) and 1490. As for the first broadcast station in Missouri, that goes to WEW 770 in St. Louis, which has been on the air since 1921. KSD 550 was the first one to be authorized for nighttime service (from what I could figure); 550 went on the air in 1922. The first FM station in the state, as far as I know, is KFUO-FM 99.1 Clayton, MO. It has been in continuous operation since 1948 with only one owner: the Lutheran Church-Missouri Synod. KFUO shared time with KSD on 550 before KFUO's AM frequency moved to 850. I'm not sure about Missouri's first MTS Stereo station, but the first one in St. Louis was KPLR 11 (which was then an independent), which went Stereo in 1985. KDNL 30 (which was about to take the local Fox affiliation at the time) and KSDK 5 (the NBC affiliate since 1947) followed within two years. KTVI 2 went Stereo in 1995, after trading networks with KDNL (KTVI was an ABC affiliate before flipping to Fox) and KMOV 4 was the last, in 1998 (following it's sale from Viacom to cash-rich Belo; KMOV was the last non-UPN affiliate in the Viacom stable before they acquired CBS). WHSL 46, which is switching from Home Shopping Network to UPN, could be next to go Stereo. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Sun Feb 16 19:06:11 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 17 Feb 2003 03:06:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 6479 invoked from network); 17 Feb 2003 03:06:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Feb 2003 03:06:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m06.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.161) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Feb 2003 03:06:00 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-m06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.158.1bf1049c (3956) for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2003 22:05:54 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <158.1bf1049c.2b81ab92@aol.com> Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 22:05:54 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Smoke and mirrors ? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih I remember the one involving WIZB 700...I sent in a reception report to the station, and found that it was one of their engineers that forgot to turn the transmitter off at night (and this was on Thanksgiving Day). At night, most of the St. Louis AM stations either send their signals west, southwest or due south at night. KMOX is the only station that adequately covers the entire St. Louis metro area. Even with a ground conductivity value of 15, the other stations don't cover the entire metro. Here's how the stations stack up on their directional arrays: KTRS 550: Nulls to the east to protect WKRC Cincinnati, OH. KFNS 590: Nulls to the northwest to protect KOMJ Omaha, NE, to the southeast to protect WVLK Lexington, KY, and to the NNE to protect a Michigan station. KJSL 630: Beams primarily south, to protect WLAP Lexington, KY, KHOW Denver, CO and CFCO Chatham, ON. KSTL 690: 18 watts at night, non-directional. Covers St. Louis and immediate suburbs. KWRE 730: 120 watts at night, non-directional. Covers Warren and most of St. Charles, Franklin, Lincoln, Montgomery and the northwestern part of St. Louis County in Missouri, and parts of Calhoun and Jersey counties in Illinois. WGNU 920: Beams mainly northeast-southwest at night, protecting KARN Little Rock, AR, KDHL Faribault, MN and WOKY Milwaukee, WI. This little 500-watter has been heard in Pittsburgh, PA and Joplin, MO! KXEN 1010: Beams primarily southwest to protect WINS New York, NY, CFRB Toronto, ON and CBR Calgary, AB. KMOX 1120: 50 kW non-directional. Covers 45 states, several Canadian Provinces and Mexican Estados at night. Has even made it to the British Isles! WSDZ 1260: Beams north-south to protect WNDE Indianapolis, IN and KSGF Springfield, MO. KSIV 1320: Sends it's 270-watt signal west to protect stations in Kankakee, IL, Pittsburgh, PA and Lansing, MI, among others. KSLG 1380: Sends it's 1 kW night signal northeast at night from a site southeast of St. Louis! Good signal downtown, but hit-and-miss in the western suburbs. WRTH 1430: Goes primarily northwest at night to protect stations in Indianapolis, IN, Mayfield, KY and Tulsa, OK, among others. KIRL 1460: When they were on at night, their 500 watts covered primarily St. Charles and northern St. Louis county, protecting stations in Des Moines, IA, Carmi, IL and Baton Rouge, LA, among others. Their 5 kW daytime service, by contrast, can be heard in Rolla, MO (some 80 miles away). WESL 1490: 1 kW non-directional: covers St. Louis and immediate suburbs. WBGZ 1570: 74 watts at night: covers most of Alton, eastern St. Charles County and northern St. Louis County fairly well. Only other Illinois city they adequately cover is Godfrey. KATZ 1600: Sends their 5 kW night signal south to protect stations in Cedar Rapids, IA and the Dallas/Fort Worth metroplex. At my location, I can hear WCGO Chicago Heights, IL with KATZ nulled! Clear Channel hasn't taken good care of this property, which programs a format that CC should not program (Urban Gospel). 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Sun Feb 16 19:06:11 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 17 Feb 2003 03:06:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 21649 invoked from network); 17 Feb 2003 03:06:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Feb 2003 03:06:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m08.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.163) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Feb 2003 03:06:03 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-m08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.90.32863f51 (3956) for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2003 22:05:56 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <90.32863f51.2b81ab94@aol.com> Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 22:05:56 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Smoke and mirrors ? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih Now, for Atlanta's case: WDWD 590: Sends it's night signal due east from it's site in Austell, GA to protect Lexington, KY and Omaha, NE, as well as other stations in the Carolinas. Fair signal throughout metro Atlanta. WGST 640: Sends it's 1 kW night signal southwest and slightly east from it's site in northwest Atlanta to protect stations in North Carolina and Tennessee, not to mention KFI in Los Angeles. Hit and miss outside I-285. WCNN 680: Sends it's 10 kW night signal southwest to protect WPTF Raleigh, NC and WJCE Memphis, TN, not to mention KNBR San Francisco. Heard well in Alpharetta (transmitter site is in Norcross), but gone by the time you get to Woodstock (in far southern Cherokee County). WSB 750: 50 kW non-directional; covers 38 states at night. WQXI 790: "The Team" sends it's 1 kW night signal southwest (and a little power toward Marietta) to protect WNIS Norfolk, VA and WMC Memphis, TN. Cannot cover Roswell and Sandy Springs at night, but can be heard along I-75 up to State Road 5 in Cobb County. I used to listen to this station back in 1989, when they were doing a dual-Stereo simulcast with 94-Q (now Star 94). WAEC 860: Sends it's 500-watt night signal east-west to protect WDMG Douglas, GA and CJBC Toronto, ON. WAFS 920: 1 kW at night off a five-eighths-wave tower (670 feet in height!). Covers the Metro area fairly well for a ground conductivity value of 1! WGUN 1010: 300 watts at night; covers Atlanta and immediate suburbs inside I-285. WTJH 1260: 38 watts at night; covers areas surrounding Hartsfield International Airport. WALR 1340: 1 kW non-directional at night; covers most of Atlanta inside I-285. Rebroadcaster WFOM 1230 in Marietta covers parts of Cobb County and the city of Atlanta. WAOK 1380: Sends it's 5 kW night signal east-west to protect stations in St. Petersburg, FL and Fort Wayne, IN, among others. WYZE 1480: They were 44 watts at night when I lived down there (1988-92): covered Atlanta and immediate surrounding areas inside I-285. WAZX 1550: Beams southeast into Atlanta at night (500 watts). WSSA 1570: 50 watts at night; heard primarily in parts of Fulton, Clayton and Fayette Counties. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Sun Feb 16 19:06:11 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 17 Feb 2003 03:06:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 91160 invoked from network); 17 Feb 2003 03:06:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Feb 2003 03:06:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d03.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.35) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Feb 2003 03:06:04 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-d03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.50.18325e62 (3956) for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2003 22:05:59 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <50.18325e62.2b81ab97@aol.com> Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 22:05:59 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Smoke and mirrors ? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih What about getting these AMs and FMs who don't adequately cover the entire market to serve their main coverage areas? I've been looking at the situation in St. Louis as an example. The one mistake Bill White (the former National League president and the former major league infielder) is making in the operation of KIRL is attempting to serve the entire St. Louis market (his PD, by the way, is Columbus Gregory). In reality, KIRL's 5 kW daytime signal doesn't adequately cover East St. Louis and barely covers Edwardsville, IL. The signal's strongest areas are in northern and western St. Louis County (most of the African-American population in that area is centered around suburbs like Wellston, Moline Acres, and Berkeley, for example; hardly any African-Americans live in west St. Louis County) and in St. Charles County (which has a growing African-American population). It's 500-watt nighttime signal (when it was on), by contrast, served only St. Charles and northern St. Louis County. An Urban Gospel format serving the entire St. Louis metropolitan area would not be an appropriate format for that kind of a signal. What would be more appropriate for KIRL's service area would be a News/Talk format from 5:00 a.m. to Midnight, with hour-long blocks of news at 5:00 a.m. and 5:00 p.m., augmented with mainstream Jazz overnights, religous programming on Sundays from 2:00 to 11:00 a.m., and specialty talk and music shows in other weekend dayparts (and all in AM Stereo). If only more radio station owners would take this kind of approach, then maybe radio would be listenable. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Sun Feb 16 19:06:12 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 17 Feb 2003 03:06:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 6864 invoked from network); 17 Feb 2003 03:06:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Feb 2003 03:06:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d05.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Feb 2003 03:06:11 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-d05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.159.1bfa6662 (3956) for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2003 22:06:00 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <159.1bfa6662.2b81ab98@aol.com> Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 22:06:00 EST Subject: AM Radio: Not Created for Local Broadcasting To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih One point needs to be raised about AM radio. In Europe, AM radio is not used for local broadcasting, but for regional broadcasting. A number of AM stations run hundreds of thousands of watts, and use lower modulation to reduce or eliminate ACI. AM radio was basically not created for local broadcasting, but regional broadcasting. I think some of these powerful AMs could be used to relay foreign broadcasters which offer broadcasts in the English language (such as the BBC or Germany's DW Radio) instead of rebroadcasting the same corporate crap. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From possumhunter@netzero.net Sun Feb 16 19:22:26 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 17 Feb 2003 03:22:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 57819 invoked from network); 17 Feb 2003 03:22:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Feb 2003 03:22:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.206) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Feb 2003 03:22:26 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 16 Feb 2003 19:22:26 -0800 To: References: <1cf.2de470e.2b81319c@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Smoke and mirrors ? Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 22:22:15 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 17 Feb 2003 03:22:26.0311 (UTC) FILETIME=[CB597970:01C2D633] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.167.163.172] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: > A chronic cheater on 1110 is religious broadcaster WCKO "The Power Company" Norfolk Va Another way many AMs cheat is by running a ground strap to the Rail Road tracks or City Water supply lines. Once upon a time, there was a Class 4 "Graveyard" station running 5KW! It got ratted out to the FCC. Kevin From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Feb 16 19:39:03 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 17 Feb 2003 03:39:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 5507 invoked from network); 17 Feb 2003 03:39:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Feb 2003 03:39:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Feb 2003 03:39:00 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.138] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Feb 2003 03:39:00 -0000 Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 03:38:58 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Sony SRF-42 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <1d9.2df1300.2b81339c@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1340 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.90.4 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Dont know if it will cleanly decode anything other than C-QUAM.... > I know others that have experimented on here could give you a heads > up there. The SRF-42 uses Sony's "multi-system" AM Stereo decoder chip, except it's locked into the C-Quam/Harris/Magnavox mode and lacks the extra circuitry needed to enable proper Kahn ISB mode reception. This means it is a simple synchronous detector, which would work best with the Magnavox system. It lacks the "cosine compensation" needed for proper C-Quam decoding, so the distortion when receiving C-Quam signals can be up to 5.0% (the AMAX distortion spec for battery- powered radios was actually relaxed to 5.0%, as compared to 2.0% for home tuners, in order to allow the SRF-42 to receive the AMAX certification). This distortion is most noticeable when the bass line in a song is off to one side in the Stereo image, such as was fairly popular in the early 1960s. At its worst, this may make the whole stereo image "shudder" on strong bass notes, but otherwise it is generally acceptable. True C-Quam decoding does sound noticeably cleaner, though, and on the latest MC13028 decoder the distortion has been reduced significantly, to the point where even mono AM stations sound better, perhaps due to a more refined envelope detector and AGC design inside the chip. From n0uiheric@aol.com Sun Feb 16 20:10:53 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 17 Feb 2003 04:10:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 4135 invoked from network); 17 Feb 2003 04:10:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Feb 2003 04:10:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r06.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.102) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Feb 2003 04:10:52 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-r06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.a9.396e4a1d (4254) for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2003 23:10:47 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 23:10:47 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Smoke and mirrors ? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih Too bad they can't feed it on the Internet! When WRYT 1080 started with an Adult Standards format in 1987, they were able to broadcast 24 hours by using the audio portion of one channel on the cable systems in Edwardsville and Collinsville, IL (the video portion was a community bulletin board). 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Sun Feb 16 20:10:53 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 17 Feb 2003 04:10:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 98258 invoked from network); 17 Feb 2003 04:10:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Feb 2003 04:10:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r05.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.101) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Feb 2003 04:10:52 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-r05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.1f1.206d7fa (4254) for ; Sun, 16 Feb 2003 23:10:47 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1f1.206d7fa.2b81bac6@aol.com> Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 23:10:46 EST Subject: Designing a receiver? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih Maybe some of those stations could use these car radios (taken from old cars) as the basis for new AM Stereo receiver designs? I hope the FCC didn't throw out the receiver standards petition Scott put together because of their obsession with IBOCrap. If we have to get a second one together, these amendments could be added: 1) Requiring all receivers that are designed to receive AM or FM (mono or stereo) also be required to receive shortwave signals in the 16, 19, 22, 25, 31, 41 and 49 meter broadcast bands (17, 15, 13, 11, 9, 7 and 6 MHz). This would provide more programming than you would get on XM (which doesn't offer any foreign broadcasters) or Sirius Satellite Radio (which only offers the BBC). 2) Requiring all receivers with these same bands (AM/FM/SW, mono or Stereo) to receive the seven NOAA Weather Radio channels (162.400, 162.425, 162.450, 162.475, 162.500, 162.525 and 162.550 MHz). This would allow the listener to keep updated with severe weather conditions. Both of these won't require additional antennas (unlike with XM or Sirius). I chose the shortwave converter for my car over XM or Sirius because shortwave signals can be received on a standard car radio antenna. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sun Feb 16 20:34:47 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 17 Feb 2003 04:34:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 1874 invoked from network); 17 Feb 2003 04:34:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Feb 2003 04:34:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Feb 2003 04:34:46 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.249] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Feb 2003 04:34:45 -0000 Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 04:34:44 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Sony SRF-42 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 1201 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.133 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: True C-Quam decoding does sound noticeably cleaner,=20 > though, and on the latest MC13028 decoder the distortion has been=20 > reduced significantly, to the point where even mono AM stations sound=20 > better, perhaps due to a more refined envelope detector and AGC=20 > design inside the chip. That Envelope detector is much more refined than the the best pseudo synchronous detector found in the earlier chips. Recent testing I've done on the 13028 has shown that it handles sideband asymetry very well a.k.a mistuned. While adjusting the modulating frequency on my IF modulator I could offset it by 5KHz or more with a =B17.5KHz ceramic filter and produce little if any distortion. Since my modulator is only mono I can't really say what type of distortion it would have produced in stereo mode under these=20 conditions but with a regular envelope detector distortion would have been produced with this much offset. A 5KHz offset basically=20 uses this filter in vestigal sideband mode of 2.5KHz/12.5KHz. Usually you need a synchronous detector for minimum distortion but the 13028 handles it without issue. JSG From ai4i@hotmail.com Sun Feb 16 22:40:07 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ai4i@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 17 Feb 2003 06:40:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 96230 invoked from network); 17 Feb 2003 06:40:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Feb 2003 06:40:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (207.68.164.201) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Feb 2003 06:40:05 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 16 Feb 2003 22:40:04 -0800 To: References: <1045451172.14000.21440.m9@yahoogroups.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Digest Number 590 Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 01:39:59 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 17 Feb 2003 06:40:04.0997 (UTC) FILETIME=[67AD5B50:01C2D64F] From: "Joel Wilson" Reply-To: "Joel Wilson" X-Originating-IP: [216.77.208.167] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=127893550 X-Yahoo-Profile: ai4ijoel I just recently discovered this group; here is my first posting. As I read more and more about the problems of co-channel interference, it occurs to me that the biggest problem is not with the sidebands of an interfering station interacting with the recovered audio of an interfered station. Rather, it is the two station's carriers beating together. An AM station's carrier can do much more damage than its sidebands. Whether we are talking about monaural stations, C-QUAM, K-H, IBOC, DRM, or whatever, the solution to much of the QRM issue was remedied by the BBC in the UK, a half a century ago. Why has nobody ever suggested synchronizing all the AM radio stations in North America against a common frequency standard? Tuning across the dial, one would hear mixed audio on individual channels, but no heterodynes. I would take this one step farther and even go so far as to suggest phase locking and gen-locking all the TV stations in a like manor (no need for 10khz offsets which change the appearance of the QRM but do not eliminate it). The technology to achieve these remedies economically did not exist back then, but it certainly does today. BTW...Eureka-147 is far and away the best solution for TERRESTRIAL broadcasting. Joel Wilson Hello Taxi AI4I ======================================= Proud 2-B a pioneering satellite radio subscriber AI4I is always on the trailing edge of technology ======================================= From dav259@csiro.au Sun Feb 16 23:39:39 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 17 Feb 2003 07:39:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 65076 invoked from network); 17 Feb 2003 07:39:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Feb 2003 07:39:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Feb 2003 07:39:37 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1H7daR24033; Mon, 17 Feb 2003 18:39:36 +1100 (EST) Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 18:39:36 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: amstereoforum Cc: Subject: nice new tiny portable Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=112635033 X-Yahoo-Profile: dav259 I'm holidaying soon on the Oz Gold Coast and thought I should buy a new personal radio - to preserve the good old SRF-42 for ))) AMS ((( where available. There is no AMS in SE Queensland - and in fact not even ANY AM stations on the Gold Coast. All you get clearly are the Brisbane stations and 2MW Northern NSW. This radio is a little beauty! (except for the obvious). It's the Panasonic RF-NA030 and is only the size of one and a half Bic cigarette lighters - for the smoke challenged that's 39.7mm x 80 x 15.9. Actually I still think in feet and inches - so it's about 3" x 1.5" x 0.5". It works on one AAA battery. It retails here for A$75.00. In an ideal world I imagine if Matsushita (love that name) included an AMS chip it would be no more than A$80 - yet I'd pay $150 - probably more! Kids would love it. So ... momentarily Davo is defecting to FM. :( Ian Melbourne From ai4i@hotmail.com Mon Feb 17 00:01:29 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ai4i@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 17 Feb 2003 08:01:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 84937 invoked from network); 17 Feb 2003 08:01:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Feb 2003 08:01:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Feb 2003 08:01:28 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.186] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Feb 2003 08:01:28 -0000 Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 08:01:28 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Designing a receiver? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <1f1.206d7fa.2b81bac6@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 833 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Joel Wilson " X-Originating-IP: 216.77.208.167 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=127893550 X-Yahoo-Profile: ai4ijoel XM carries the BBC World Service. SIRIUS and Worldspace carry the Beeb as well as World Radio Net. XM is partnered with Worldspace which provides/shares some music channels including U-pop, Ngoma, and Worldzone. http://www.bbc.co.uk/worldservice http://www.wrn.org http://www.worldspace.com http://www.siriusradio.com http://ngoma.xmradio.com http://upop.xmradio.com http://worldzone.xmradio.com ================================================= Proud 2 B a pioneering satellite radio subscriber AI4I is always on the trailing edge of technology ================================================= --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, n0uiheric@a... wrote: This > would provide more programming than you would get on XM (which doesn't offer > any foreign broadcasters) or Sirius Satellite Radio (which only offers the > BBC) From amymousie@yahoo.com Mon Feb 17 00:08:27 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 17 Feb 2003 08:08:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 69025 invoked from network); 17 Feb 2003 08:08:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Feb 2003 08:08:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Feb 2003 08:08:26 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.151] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Feb 2003 08:08:26 -0000 Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 08:08:26 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Digest Number 590 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1642 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 67.115.110.170 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Joel Wilson" wrote: > I just recently discovered this group; here is my first posting. > As I read more and more about the problems of co-channel interference, it > occurs to me that the biggest problem is not with the sidebands of an > interfering station interacting with the recovered audio of an interfered > station. Rather, it is the two station's carriers beating together. An AM > station's carrier can do much more damage than its sidebands. > Whether we are talking about monaural stations, C-QUAM, K-H, IBOC, DRM, or > whatever, the solution to much of the QRM issue was remedied by the BBC in > the UK, a half a century ago. Why has nobody ever suggested synchronizing > all the AM radio stations in North America against a common frequency > standard? Tuning across the dial, one would hear mixed audio on individual > channels, but no heterodynes. I would take this one step farther and even go > so far as to suggest phase locking and gen-locking all the TV stations in a > like manor (no need for 10khz offsets which change the appearance of the QRM > but do not eliminate it). The technology to achieve these remedies > economically did not exist back then, but it certainly does today. > BTW...Eureka-147 is far and away the best solution for TERRESTRIAL > broadcasting. Broadcasters should. And it's not like the frequency standards aren't in place, ready to use- That's why WWV, WWVH, and WWVB exist here in America. (CHU in Canada.) Whether they can or not is debatable, depending on the transmitters and technical expertise available. Amy. <:3 )~~~ From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Feb 17 00:09:28 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 17 Feb 2003 08:09:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 70455 invoked from network); 17 Feb 2003 08:09:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Feb 2003 08:09:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Feb 2003 08:09:28 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.161] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Feb 2003 08:09:27 -0000 Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 08:09:26 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Digest Number 590 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1440 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.90.4 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Why has nobody ever suggested synchronizing all the AM radio > stations in North America against a common frequency standard? > Tuning across the dial, one would hear mixed audio on individual > channels, but no heterodynes. Broadcast Electronics, a popular manufacturer of AM transmitters and AM Stereo exciters, actually did suggest this back in 1984. They designed their transmitting equipment so that it used a 10 MHz frequency standard which could be synchronized to the WWV time signal as a universally accurate standard -- and they said that if *all* AM stations did this, AM Stereo "platform motion", as well as the off- frequency beat tones/flutters you mention, would be eliminated. Some stations have taken exactly the opposite approach, however. Crawford Broadcasting purposely adjust the carriers of their AM stations to be about 10 to 15 Hz off-center (while still within the FCC's +/- 20 Hz tolerance), so that for local groundwave listeners at night, any AM Stereo "platform motion" is changed into more of a high-beat-rate fluttering effect, rather than a slow left-to-right swooping. However, this greatly harms skywave DX reception of their stations at night, as the fluttering or warbling effect usually overpowers what would normally be clear reception of the signal. This practice continues on Crawford's 1540 WPTR even though this station has not broadcast in stereo for at least several months. From jsgil@hal-pc.org Mon Feb 17 00:10:05 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 17 Feb 2003 08:10:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 25763 invoked from network); 17 Feb 2003 08:10:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Feb 2003 08:10:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.84) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Feb 2003 08:10:01 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.131] by n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Feb 2003 08:10:01 -0000 Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 08:10:01 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: DXing Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 366 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.141 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst For reasons unknown to me our local blowtorch 740 KTRH is off the air. Their website was unrevealing if any scheduled maintenance is the cause. This is highly unusual as I have never heard them go off the air like this. Just hope they are not going IBAC. As a result I am able to get the Class A 50KW 750 WSB out of Atlanta, GA from SE Texas. Quite a distance. JSG From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Feb 17 01:53:52 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 17 Feb 2003 09:53:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 19755 invoked from network); 17 Feb 2003 09:53:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Feb 2003 09:53:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.68) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Feb 2003 09:53:51 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.178] by n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Feb 2003 09:53:50 -0000 Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 09:53:46 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: DXing Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 2216 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.90.4 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > For reasons unknown to me our local blowtorch 740 KTRH is off the > air. On Sunday evening, semi-local 790 WAEB (Allentown, PA) was off the=20 air for a few moments and during that time I heard a sweeper for some=20 Adult Contemporary station and an ID as "99.3 The River", just before=20 WAEB came back on. It turns out that I heard 790 CFAN from=20 Newcastle, NB, Canada, which supposedly uses 1000 watts at night and=20 is currently simulcasting its FM sister station with the intent of=20 the AM station going off the air within the next few months. This was on my J.C. Penney/MCS 3050 "wonder tuner", which is probably=20 the most sensitive AM receiver I have ever used. With a Terk "AM=20 Advantage" loop antenna directly connected to its antenna input, it=20 even blows away my GE Superadio III. It is the only radio on which I=20 can hear 600 WICC at *night* in AM Stereo -- and that's a 500-watt=20 (nighttime) signal from about 100 miles away! (Too close for=20 skywave, and usually too far for groundwave -- but not on the MCS.)=20=20 It also gives me clearer reception of local WCTC 1450 AM Stereo,=20 which normally suffers from moderate to high levels of "graveyard=20 channel" background chatter at night (the "lots of people talking in=20 a crowded room" effect), but with the MCS, reception is rock-solid,=20 day and night. Just one minor issue is that in AM Stereo, its audio tends to get a=20 bit "crackly". Since it is a run-of-the-mill MC13020-based design,=20 is there any standard way to reduce or eliminate this? I'd also like=20 to get a service manual for the MCS-3050, just to see if there is any=20 "secret" way of switching it into 9 kHz channel spacing mode, since=20 it was made in Japan, perhaps by NEC, since it uses a few NEC=20 "=B5"-series chips which you normally only find in NEC-made products. p.s. The MCS-3050 only tunes up to 1620 kHz, but I've found a neat=20 trick to enable reception of higher frequencies: with a tuned loop=20 antenna like a Select-A-Tenna or Terk AM Advantage directly=20 connected, tune in a frequency 900 kHz lower (2 x the IF) than the=20 desired frequency and then adjust the antenna for best reception.=20=20 With this set-up I can hear 1680 WTTM crystal clear and in full=20 Stereo on 780 kHz! From ccuff@in4web.com Mon Feb 17 02:28:01 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 17 Feb 2003 10:28:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 78633 invoked from network); 17 Feb 2003 10:28:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Feb 2003 10:28:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Feb 2003 10:28:00 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.25]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2003 05:24:37 -0500 Message-ID: <014b01c2d66d$f92c3b00$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: Subject: No stereo in Boston Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 05:18:52 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 Just got back from the Boston antique radio meet, and sadly, there are no am stereo sttations anymore- 740 is mono. Skywave tests at 4:30am showed only 760 in stereo. 1540 WPTR was coming in like a local, but mono, no pilot. One big curiosity was how very few people knew anything about the IBOC/HD situation. No one liked the idea, but no one thought anything could be done about it. Chris From amstereorules@msn.com Mon Feb 17 04:26:05 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereorules@msn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 17 Feb 2003 12:26:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 90302 invoked from network); 17 Feb 2003 12:26:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Feb 2003 12:26:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Feb 2003 12:26:02 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.249] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Feb 2003 12:26:02 -0000 Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 12:25:59 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: DXing Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 1382 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amstereorules " X-Originating-IP: 205.188.209.76 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=130870594 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereorules >This was on my J.C. Penney/MCS 3050 "wonder tuner", which is=20 >probably the most sensitive AM receiver I have ever used. With a >Terk "AM Advantage" loop antenna directly connected to its antenna >input, it even blows away my GE Superadio III.=20=20 Yes, that Terk also seem to overcome poor rejection of stations 900KC up from the "dial" position. >Just one minor issue is that in AM Stereo, its audio tends to get a >bit "crackly". Since it is a run-of-the-mill MC13020-based design, >is there any standard way to reduce or eliminate this?=20=20 Mr. Johny Gilstrap has some plans (look in the archives for his site) >I'd also like to get a service manual for the MCS-3050, just to see >if there is any "secret" way of switching it into 9 kHz channel=20 >spacing mode,=20 Yah, so would me. >since it was made in Japan, perhaps by NEC, since it uses a few NEC >"=B5"-series chips which you normally only find in NEC-made products. Really? NEC has arguably the best microprocessor ever made (Mr. Byrns might have something to say), and used in virtually all Japanese=20 products (dead giveaway is the way the "7" is shaped in the display). I remember MCS 3050 was made by Panasonic in the mid-80s.=20 >p.s. The MCS-3050 only tunes up to 1620 kHz,=20 Yah, but it can probably be changed by a few unknown keystrokes, unless the microP is burned differently. Ragnar Remember, AM Stereo Rules From dwtpa97@earthlink.net Mon Feb 17 04:38:45 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dwtpa97@earthlink.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 17 Feb 2003 12:38:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 54156 invoked from network); 17 Feb 2003 12:38:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Feb 2003 12:38:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO snipe.mail.pas.earthlink.net) (207.217.120.62) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Feb 2003 12:38:43 -0000 Received: from sdn-ap-013scfairp0165.dialsprint.net ([63.183.128.165] helo=earthlink.net) by snipe.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 18kkXh-0002iO-00 for amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com; Mon, 17 Feb 2003 04:38:42 -0800 Message-ID: <3E50D7F0.9742ABB8@earthlink.net> Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 07:39:12 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.79 [en]C-CCK-MCD NSCPCD472 (Windows NT 5.0; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: DXing References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit From: dwtpa97 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38076959 Something that we might want to consider as a group would be to encourage members who post to include their city/country/location after their name. There is a lot of DX and historical discussion as well as AMS discussion, and it would be both helpful and interesting to know where the member is posting from. (This should be optional, of course. People should not be required to include this info if they don't want to.) Dick W. "amstereorules " wrote: > >This was on my J.C. Penney/MCS 3050 "wonder tuner", which is > >probably the most sensitive AM receiver I have ever used. With a > >Terk "AM Advantage" loop antenna directly connected to its antenna > >input, it even blows away my GE Superadio III. > Yes, that Terk also seem to overcome poor rejection of stations > 900KC up from the "dial" position. > > >Just one minor issue is that in AM Stereo, its audio tends to get a > >bit "crackly". Since it is a run-of-the-mill MC13020-based design, > >is there any standard way to reduce or eliminate this? > Mr. Johny Gilstrap has some plans (look in the archives for his site) > > >I'd also like to get a service manual for the MCS-3050, just to see > >if there is any "secret" way of switching it into 9 kHz channel > >spacing mode, > Yah, so would me. > > >since it was made in Japan, perhaps by NEC, since it uses a few NEC > >"µ"-series chips which you normally only find in NEC-made products. > Really? NEC has arguably the best microprocessor ever made (Mr. Byrns > might have something to say), and used in virtually all Japanese > products (dead giveaway is the way the "7" is shaped in the display). > I remember MCS 3050 was made by Panasonic in the mid-80s. > > >p.s. The MCS-3050 only tunes up to 1620 kHz, > Yah, but it can probably be changed by a few unknown keystrokes, > unless the microP is burned differently. Ragnar > > Remember, > AM Stereo Rules > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From philipr@irac.pe.ca Mon Feb 17 06:10:34 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 17 Feb 2003 14:10:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 46328 invoked from network); 17 Feb 2003 14:10:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Feb 2003 14:10:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Feb 2003 14:10:26 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.142] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Feb 2003 14:10:26 -0000 Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 14:10:26 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: DXing Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 2795 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking That's quite a dx catch Kevin T! CFAN is not known for much of a=20 signal, especially to the SW. When I used to live in Frederticton=20 NB, a little south and a little west, their signal was pretty poor.=20=20 I must try 99.3 with the PT-1, as its FM DX capability is=20 phenominal. Miriamichi is perhaps 200 miles accross water and very=20 low land - should be an easy catch on the PT-1! Phil R. --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. "=20 wrote: > > For reasons unknown to me our local blowtorch 740 KTRH is off the > > air. >=20 > On Sunday evening, semi-local 790 WAEB (Allentown, PA) was off the=20 > air for a few moments and during that time I heard a sweeper for=20 some=20 > Adult Contemporary station and an ID as "99.3 The River", just=20 before=20 > WAEB came back on. It turns out that I heard 790 CFAN from=20 > Newcastle, NB, Canada, which supposedly uses 1000 watts at night=20 and=20 > is currently simulcasting its FM sister station with the intent of=20 > the AM station going off the air within the next few months. >=20 > This was on my J.C. Penney/MCS 3050 "wonder tuner", which is=20 probably=20 > the most sensitive AM receiver I have ever used. With a Terk "AM=20 > Advantage" loop antenna directly connected to its antenna input,=20 it=20 > even blows away my GE Superadio III. It is the only radio on=20 which I=20 > can hear 600 WICC at *night* in AM Stereo -- and that's a 500-watt=20 > (nighttime) signal from about 100 miles away! (Too close for=20 > skywave, and usually too far for groundwave -- but not on the=20 MCS.)=20=20 >=20 > It also gives me clearer reception of local WCTC 1450 AM Stereo,=20 > which normally suffers from moderate to high levels of "graveyard=20 > channel" background chatter at night (the "lots of people talking=20 in=20 > a crowded room" effect), but with the MCS, reception is rock- solid,=20 > day and night. >=20 > Just one minor issue is that in AM Stereo, its audio tends to get=20 a=20 > bit "crackly". Since it is a run-of-the-mill MC13020-based=20 design,=20 > is there any standard way to reduce or eliminate this? I'd also=20 like=20 > to get a service manual for the MCS-3050, just to see if there is=20 any=20 > "secret" way of switching it into 9 kHz channel spacing mode,=20 since=20 > it was made in Japan, perhaps by NEC, since it uses a few NEC=20 > "=B5"-series chips which you normally only find in NEC-made products. >=20 > p.s. The MCS-3050 only tunes up to 1620 kHz, but I've found a neat=20 > trick to enable reception of higher frequencies: with a tuned loop=20 > antenna like a Select-A-Tenna or Terk AM Advantage directly=20 > connected, tune in a frequency 900 kHz lower (2 x the IF) than the=20 > desired frequency and then adjust the antenna for best reception.=20=20 > With this set-up I can hear 1680 WTTM crystal clear and in full=20 > Stereo on 780 kHz! From philipr@irac.pe.ca Mon Feb 17 06:15:20 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 17 Feb 2003 14:15:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 60537 invoked from network); 17 Feb 2003 14:15:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Feb 2003 14:15:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.68) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Feb 2003 14:15:18 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.143] by n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Feb 2003 14:15:17 -0000 Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 14:15:14 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: OT - another new AM Stereo fanatic Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 239 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking I'm pleased to announce that we have a very young, new AM Stereo "fanatic" in the personage of Lauren Meg [short for Megahertz] who was born on Valentines's Day at 6:33 am, 7 lbs 9 ounces - baby's still haven't gone metric. Phil R. From jlehmann@attbi.com Mon Feb 17 06:36:41 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jlehmann@attbi.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 17 Feb 2003 14:36:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 98365 invoked from network); 17 Feb 2003 14:36:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Feb 2003 14:36:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sccrmhc02.attbi.com) (204.127.202.62) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Feb 2003 14:36:40 -0000 Received: from amd (h00045a211584.ne.client2.attbi.com[66.30.163.53]) by sccrmhc02.attbi.com (sccrmhc02) with SMTP id <200302171436390020089hc3e>; Mon, 17 Feb 2003 14:36:39 +0000 To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} No stereo in Boston Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 09:36:43 -0500 Message-ID: <000901c2d691$fdb03220$6501a8c0@AMD> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2616 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 In-Reply-To: <014b01c2d66d$f92c3b00$0101a8c0@pavilion> From: "Jeff Lehmann" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=98257848 X-Yahoo-Profile: n1zzn Actually, 740, 1090, and 1360 are in stereo during the day. I was able to verify that on that Delco radio I got. I was able to get enough power to it for the dial to light up, and show stations on it. I still haven't been able to get audio out of it. 740 switches to mono at night, but they only run a few watts, so nobody can really hear them anyway. Jeff Lehmann Hanson, MA -----Original Message----- From: Christopher Cuff [mailto:ccuff@in4web.com] Sent: Monday, February 17, 2003 5:19 AM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} No stereo in Boston Just got back from the Boston antique radio meet, and sadly, there are no am stereo sttations anymore- 740 is mono. Skywave tests at 4:30am showed only 760 in stereo. 1540 WPTR was coming in like a local, but mono, no pilot. One big curiosity was how very few people knew anything about the IBOC/HD situation. No one liked the idea, but no one thought anything could be done about it. Chris Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ADVERTISEMENT Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. From jbyrns@enteract.com Mon Feb 17 06:47:58 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 17 Feb 2003 14:47:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 8998 invoked from network); 17 Feb 2003 14:47:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Feb 2003 14:47:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.70) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Feb 2003 14:47:58 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.250] by n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Feb 2003 14:47:57 -0000 Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 14:47:53 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: co-channel beats (was Re: {AMSF} Digest Number 590) Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1493 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.137 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Joel Wilson" wrote: > I just recently discovered this group; here is my first posting. > As I read more and more about the problems of co-channel > interference, it occurs to me that the biggest problem is not with > the sidebands of an interfering station interacting with the > recovered audio of an interfered station. Rather, it is the two > station's carriers beating together. An AM station's carrier can > do much more damage than its sidebands. Whether we are talking > about monaural stations, C-QUAM, K-H, IBOC, DRM, or whatever, the > solution to much of the QRM issue was remedied by the BBC in the > UK, a half a century ago. Why has nobody ever suggested >synchronizing all the AM radio stations in North America against a > common frequency standard? This was tried in "North America" back in the 1930's, and dropped. I'm not sure why it was dropped, I would have to get out some of the old articles, but I suspect that it had to do with the development of better crystal oscillators that could hold the frequency difference between stations to a sub audible frequency, where it doesn't matter. Another reason may be the rise of the directional antenna system in "North America", which also reduces the co-channel interference problem. Don't forget the BBC didn't use many serious directional antenna arrays, so they had to look for other solutions. Of course directional antennas have their own problems. John From jbyrns@enteract.com Mon Feb 17 06:56:22 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 17 Feb 2003 14:56:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 10443 invoked from network); 17 Feb 2003 14:56:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Feb 2003 14:56:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.66) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Feb 2003 14:56:21 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.146] by n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Feb 2003 14:56:21 -0000 Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 14:56:21 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Digest Number 590 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 834 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.137 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " < kevtronics@y...> wrote: > > Some stations have taken exactly the opposite approach, however. > Crawford Broadcasting purposely adjust the carriers of their AM > stations to be about 10 to 15 Hz off-center (while still within the > FCC's +/- 20 Hz tolerance), so that for local groundwave listeners > at night, any AM Stereo "platform motion" is changed into more of a > high-beat-rate fluttering effect, rather than a slow left-to-right > swooping. However, this greatly harms skywave DX reception of their > stations at night, as the fluttering or warbling effect usually > overpowers what would normally be clear reception of the signal. Why would/should Crawford Broadcasting care about the "skywave DX reception of their stations at night"? John From michaelj@vcn.com Mon Feb 17 08:10:52 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 17 Feb 2003 16:10:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 66358 invoked from network); 17 Feb 2003 16:10:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Feb 2003 16:10:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m1-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.31) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Feb 2003 16:10:51 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m1-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2003 09:10:50 -0700 Message-ID: <009601c2d69f$248d9d80$0701010a@keva> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} DXing Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 09:10:50 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Ah, yes...reminds me of growing up in Louisiana where KTRH was common, as well as 560 KLVI in Beaumont. Almost 100 miles away, my folks used to listen to KLVI versus the local stations....this would be about 1980 or so. They had a much better country format than anything we could get close to us. I even remember people in town having KLVI bumper stickers. That low-end-of-the-dial signal used to boom all over the place during the daytime almost like local. JS...can you confirm whether KLVI is stereo or not? We had some discussion about it a little while back....both KTRH and KLVI are ClearChannel-owned. Seems like several people mentioned KLVI might be stereo. Can you pick them up where you are? Last time I was down there ( about 2 years ago) I don't remember KLVI being stereo...but I don't know for sure. I even wrote to KTRH...their engineer said they weren't and that he didn't know if KLVI was or not. MJR n WYO ----- Original Message ----- From: jsgilst To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, February 17, 2003 1:10 AM Subject: {AMSF} DXing For reasons unknown to me our local blowtorch 740 KTRH is off the air. Their website was unrevealing if any scheduled maintenance is the cause. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From powell@conterra.com Mon Feb 17 09:15:35 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: powell@conterra.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 17 Feb 2003 17:15:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 91158 invoked from network); 17 Feb 2003 17:15:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Feb 2003 17:15:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mx.matrixconsulting.net) (65.199.24.6) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Feb 2003 17:15:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 15837 invoked from network); 17 Feb 2003 17:15:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO bsae-skqpk3w8p5) (66.112.193.122) by mx.matrixconsulting.net with SMTP; 17 Feb 2003 17:15:04 -0000 Organization: BEARly Organized To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 12:14:50 -0500 Subject: I'm ill right now Message-ID: <3E50D23A.24396.142D38@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: <1045451172.14000.21440.m9@yahoogroups.com> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.01) From: "Powell E. Way III" Reply-To: powell@conterra.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=8062869 X-Yahoo-Profile: W4OPW I ate some dry roasted peanuts Saturday. WAAY too many. So at one time I may have been full of sh**, but NOT anymore. And since our delegated whipping boy called me a liar, once I get better I may have to dress up in full leather and give him a public flogging . If you don't understand humor... ]:) And I will be discussing some rules with the Atlanta bureau chief of the FCC. Powell ( eating Farina!) From ai4i@hotmail.com Mon Feb 17 09:38:37 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ai4i@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 17 Feb 2003 17:38:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 20220 invoked from network); 17 Feb 2003 17:38:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Feb 2003 17:38:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (207.68.164.117) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Feb 2003 17:38:37 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 17 Feb 2003 09:38:36 -0800 To: References: <1045499727.2236.49885.m12@yahoogroups.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Digest Number 591 Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 12:38:34 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 17 Feb 2003 17:38:36.0888 (UTC) FILETIME=[66997580:01C2D6AB] From: "Joel Wilson" Reply-To: "Joel Wilson" X-Originating-IP: [216.77.218.12] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=127893550 X-Yahoo-Profile: ai4ijoel I am delighted to have so many responses to my first posting, a simple solution I have believed in all my life. I guess this is more than just an AM stereo board. In the Beebs case, it was not for protection, but rather to blanket the country with single networks on single frequencies or pairs thereof. We need DA's, but there is not a doubt in my mind that synchronizing all US, Canadian, and Mexican stations would also help. In South Florida, we have a music station on 640, which has always been a "Cuban Clear" channel. When Cuba and the US abandoned their old NARBA treaty, the FCC assigned this high power 640 to Palm Beach (I really believe it was to f**k with Castro). Cuba (the old pre-Castro CMQ flagship station) and WJNA are always about 5-6hz off each other with very stable transmitters. WJNA has a HUGE but mostly useless signal throughout much of South Florida. The Cuban station must also be hurting. I would suggest that WJNA's CE get as close to the Cuban station's frequency as possible, but experience tells me where that suggestion would go. Crawford's ''solution" is not quite as bad as what some small Caribbean island stations have done: transmit on frequencies ending in 5khz. It was horrible back when Asia was on one AM bandplan while Australia and US protectorates were on another. Joel Wilson AI4I ======================================= Proud 2-B a pioneering satellite radio subscriber AI4I is always on the trailing edge of technology ======================================= Message: 20 Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 14:47:53 -0000 From: "John " Subject: co-channel beats (was Re: Digest Number 590) This was tried in "North America" back in the 1930's, and dropped. I'm not sure why it was dropped, I would have to get out some of the old articles, but I suspect that it had to do with the development of better crystal oscillators that could hold the frequency difference between stations to a sub audible frequency, where it doesn't matter. Another reason may be the rise of the directional antenna system in "North America", which also reduces the co-channel interference problem. Don't forget the BBC didn't use many serious directional antenna arrays, so they had to look for other solutions. Of course directional antennas have their own problems. John From amstereorules@msn.com Mon Feb 17 10:05:38 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereorules@msn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 17 Feb 2003 18:05:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 90864 invoked from network); 17 Feb 2003 18:05:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Feb 2003 18:05:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.64) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Feb 2003 18:05:38 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.248] by n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Feb 2003 18:05:37 -0000 Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 18:05:35 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: I'm ill right now Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3E50D23A.24396.142D38@localhost> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 253 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amstereorules " X-Originating-IP: 205.188.209.76 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=130870594 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereorules Are you gonna open a can of whoop ass on him? >And since our delegated whipping boy called me a liar, once I get >better I may have to dress up in full leather and give him a public >flogging . If you don't understand humor... ]:) From florida_amstereo@hotmail.com Mon Feb 17 10:23:49 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: florida_amstereo@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 17 Feb 2003 18:23:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 92664 invoked from network); 17 Feb 2003 18:23:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Feb 2003 18:23:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.37.81) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Feb 2003 18:23:48 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 17 Feb 2003 10:23:48 -0800 Received: from 209.240.198.61 by pv2fd.pav2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Mon, 17 Feb 2003 18:23:47 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Digest Number 591 Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 18:23:47 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 17 Feb 2003 18:23:48.0404 (UTC) FILETIME=[B6C9F740:01C2D6B1] From: "Donn Tillman" X-Originating-IP: [209.240.198.61] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83914824 640 out of Cuba still comes in like a local station here in s.e. St Petersburg; my car radio scans it as a local, and my radio shack dx-398 will stop on it about half the time. Is 640 - WJNA, the station that booms over most of the Everglades and Alligator Alley? About 100 miles north-north-east of here, in the Villages (extreme northern lake county) is also another U.S. 640- WVLG, but I cannot hear even a trace of them here, under Cuba's 640. Didn't 640 and 1040 switch formats several months ago? donn st petersburg currently listening to WBF - 1130 am-stereo out of Bartow. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Joel Wilson, in part wrote: "In South Florida, we have a music station on 640, which has always been a "Cuban Clear" channel. When Cuba and the US abandoned their old NARBA treaty, the FCC assigned this high power 640 to Palm Beach (I really believe it was to f**k with Castro). Cuba (the old pre-Castro CMQ flagship station) and WJNA are always about 5-6hz off each other with very stable transmitters. WJNA has a HUGE but mostly useless signal throughout much of South Florida. The Cuban station must also be hurting. I would suggest that WJNA's CE get as close to the Cuban station's frequency as possible, Joel Wilson AI4I _________________________________________________________________ Add photos to your e-mail with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail From JH_Radio@GameBox.net Mon Feb 17 10:40:47 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: JH_Radio@GameBox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 17 Feb 2003 18:40:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 54831 invoked from network); 17 Feb 2003 18:40:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Feb 2003 18:40:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO babyruth.hotpop.com) (204.57.55.14) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Feb 2003 18:40:46 -0000 Received: from gamebox.net (kubrick.hotpop.com [204.57.55.16]) by babyruth.hotpop.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 3BE1D210C75 for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2003 18:40:43 +0000 (UTC) Received: from -enduser.GameBox.net (pcp03184855pcs.benslm01.pa.comcast.net [68.80.77.117]) by smtp-1.hotpop.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 27AC52F81AD for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2003 18:40:20 +0000 (UTC) Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030217134501.02dcdb70@pop.GameBox.net> X-Sender: JH_Radio@pop.GameBox.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 13:46:04 -0500 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} OT - another new AM Stereo fanatic In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 X-HotPOP: ----------------------------------------------- Sent By HotPOP.com FREE Email Get your FREE POP email at www.HotPOP.com ----------------------------------------------- From: John X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113800107 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cuol man! Congrads! I'm an am stereo fanatic with out an AM Stereo yet. I ain't exactly old yet either.... *Grins* At 02:15 PM 2/17/03 +0000, you wrote: >I'm pleased to announce that we have a very young, new AM >Stereo "fanatic" in the personage of Lauren Meg [short for >Megahertz] who was born on Valentines's Day at 6:33 am, 7 lbs 9 >ounces - baby's still haven't gone metric. > >Phil R. > > > > >Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Love in Christ: John Bensalem, PA Send me an email Aim: RainAngelsRule MSN: RainAngelsRule@hotmail.com My website Welcome to Napster4TheBlind "Prayer does not change God; it changes you." - Authur unknown [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From stodd@sherbtel.net Mon Feb 17 11:04:42 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 17 Feb 2003 19:04:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 7279 invoked from network); 17 Feb 2003 19:04:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Feb 2003 19:04:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Feb 2003 19:04:41 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-233.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.233]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h1HJ4ce4016690 for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2003 13:04:39 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <005401c2d6b7$c14b6c20$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: DXing Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 13:07:00 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Have you tried www.servicemanuals.net to see if they have one? It'll probably be about $20 with postage. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: > I'd also like > to get a service manual for the MCS-3050, just to see if there is any > "secret" way of switching it into 9 kHz channel spacing mode, From stodd@sherbtel.net Mon Feb 17 11:17:21 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 17 Feb 2003 19:17:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 18214 invoked from network); 17 Feb 2003 19:17:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Feb 2003 19:17:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Feb 2003 19:17:20 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-233.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.233]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h1HJHHe4021287 for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2003 13:17:18 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <009001c2d6b9$85cd18e0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <1f1.206d7fa.2b81bac6@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Designing a receiver? Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 13:19:39 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude It's probably still there- just needs more folks to comment on it. As for your suggestions, they're nice, but would add a lot of extra cost to a radio if you expected decent performance. Just getting AM on par with FM is enough of a battle. Let's not complicate it further. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: > I hope the FCC didn't throw out the receiver standards petition Scott put > together because of their obsession with IBOCrap. If we have to get a second > one together, these amendments could be added: > > 1) Requiring all receivers that are designed to receive AM or FM (mono or > stereo) also be required to receive shortwave signals in the 16, 19, 22, 25, > 31, 41 and 49 meter broadcast bands > > 2) Requiring all receivers with these same bands (AM/FM/SW, mono or Stereo) > to receive the seven NOAA Weather Radio channels From stodd@sherbtel.net Mon Feb 17 11:20:02 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 17 Feb 2003 19:20:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 18153 invoked from network); 17 Feb 2003 18:59:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Feb 2003 18:59:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Feb 2003 18:59:29 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-233.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.233]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h1HIxPe4014853 for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2003 12:59:26 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <004301c2d6b7$06d24d00$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <1045451172.14000.21440.m9@yahoogroups.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Digest Number 590 Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 13:01:47 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude It's a whole different ballgame synchronizing a few dozen transmitters around a country the size of England, and several thousand radio stations around one the size of the US. Not that it probably couldn't be done now with GPS technology. Scott Todd PS- good to have another newcomer. Welcome! N0BST- also on the trailing edge of technology. :) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Joel Wilson" > the solution to much of the QRM issue was remedied by the BBC in > the UK, a half a century ago. Why has nobody ever suggested synchronizing > all the AM radio stations in North America against a common frequency > standard? From jsgil@hal-pc.org Mon Feb 17 11:20:10 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 17 Feb 2003 19:20:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 9479 invoked from network); 17 Feb 2003 19:20:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Feb 2003 19:20:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.64) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Feb 2003 19:20:09 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.186] by n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Feb 2003 19:20:08 -0000 Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 19:20:05 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} DXing Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <009601c2d69f$248d9d80$0701010a@keva> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1502 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.193 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Michael J. Richard" wrote: That low-end-of-the-dial signal used to boom all over the place during the daytime almost like local. JS...can you confirm whether KLVI is stereo or not? We had some discussion about it a little while back....both KTRH and KLVI are ClearChannel-owned. Seems like several people mentioned KLVI might be stereo. Can you pick them up where you are? Last time I was down there ( about 2 years ago) I don't remember KLVI being stereo...but I don't know for sure. I even wrote to KTRH...their engineer said they weren't and that he didn't know if KLVI was or not. > KLVI turned off their stereo quite awhile ago and I went to them last night for Coast 2 Coast when KTRH went off the air. About an hour after posted the message KTRH was back on the air. Maybe someone affilliated with the station reads this forum. I'm probably 50 miles away from the antenna and with our damp soil in this area their signal is crystal clear with little if any interference. I listen to it on a GE SuperRadio III in wideband mode with the treble turned all the way up. Their signal has a clean bright sound, well except for the processing is sometimes is driven too hard into clipping. KTRH is the only station in my area that is 50KW and it isn't even a Class A but a Class B DA and all the rest are in the 5KW range. I don't know how it happened but for a city this size we should have one Class A ND clear channel station. JSG From stodd@sherbtel.net Mon Feb 17 11:27:09 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 17 Feb 2003 19:27:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 59857 invoked from network); 17 Feb 2003 19:19:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Feb 2003 19:19:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Feb 2003 19:19:47 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-233.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.233]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h1HJJie4022153 for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2003 13:19:45 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <009e01c2d6b9$dd9330a0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} OT - another new AM Stereo fanatic Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 13:22:06 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Congratulations- your life (and wallet) will never be the same! ST ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Monday, February 17, 2003 8:15 AM Subject: {AMSF} OT - another new AM Stereo fanatic > I'm pleased to announce that we have a very young, new AM > Stereo "fanatic" in the personage of Lauren Meg [short for > Megahertz] who was born on Valentines's Day at 6:33 am, 7 lbs 9 > ounces - baby's still haven't gone metric. > > Phil R. > > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > From stodd@sherbtel.net Mon Feb 17 11:31:55 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 17 Feb 2003 19:31:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 74761 invoked from network); 17 Feb 2003 19:24:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Feb 2003 19:24:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Feb 2003 19:24:56 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-233.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.233]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h1HJOre4023708 for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2003 13:24:54 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <00c101c2d6ba$95b93800$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <20030210030710.92959.qmail@web14205.mail.yahoo.com> <020301c2d0d1$bf6a6b40$9b8d70d1@dtaylor> Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM Stereo Radios Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 13:27:15 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Dave- if you've got the time, set up your own part 15 AMS station. Or if the FCC isn't too aggressive in your area, buy or build a 10 or 20w transmitter and use the Alfredo Lite to drive it. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dave Taylor" We don't have any AM Stereo stations here anymore unfortunately. Let me know if you might be interested. > From jbyrns@enteract.com Mon Feb 17 11:35:52 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@enteract.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 17 Feb 2003 19:35:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 87506 invoked from network); 17 Feb 2003 19:29:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Feb 2003 19:29:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.84) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Feb 2003 19:29:23 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.163] by n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Feb 2003 19:29:17 -0000 Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 19:29:17 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: DXing Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 678 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.205 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87291616 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "amstereorules < amstereorules@m...>" wrote: >=20 > >since it was made in Japan, perhaps by NEC, since it uses a few NEC > >"=B5"-series chips which you normally only find in NEC-made products. > Really? NEC has arguably the best microprocessor ever made (Mr. Byrns > might have something to say) OK, I'll accept your invitation, OT though it may be. In my opinion,=20 "the best microprocessor ever made" is the Motorola M68K/Coldfire.=20=20 Well actually, that's the second best, but I disqualify the actual=20 best because it's architecture was abandoned by its originator, rather=20 than being updated with the times. John From dnktaylor@yahoo.com Mon Feb 17 11:52:59 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dnktaylor@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 17 Feb 2003 19:52:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 7926 invoked from network); 17 Feb 2003 19:52:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Feb 2003 19:52:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO smtp014.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.173.58) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Feb 2003 19:52:49 -0000 Received: from 5-pm5.nwc.alaska.net (HELO dtaylor) (dnktaylor@209.112.139.5 with login) by smtp.mail.vip.sc5.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Feb 2003 19:52:48 -0000 Message-ID: <003401c2d6be$27027d00$058b70d1@dtaylor> To: References: <20030210030710.92959.qmail@web14205.mail.yahoo.com> <020301c2d0d1$bf6a6b40$9b8d70d1@dtaylor> <00c101c2d6ba$95b93800$827dfea9@home1> Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM Stereo Radios Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 10:52:47 -0900 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Dave Taylor" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=131000527 X-Yahoo-Profile: dnktaylor Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit It's been my dream to do just that for quite a while but unfortunately finances have not permitted it. I was laid off my job as a broadcast engineer in mid-December and the job market has been pretty tough unless I want to flip burgers for a while. I've been wanting to buy an Alfredo Lite to experiment with and I did recently find a Sherwood CRD350 on Ebay but when it arrived the thing did not work; no audio on radio or cassette. Since I don't have my own test equipment I took it in to a local repair shop and they said the final audio output IC's were blown and that parts weren't available for it anymore. I did some checking on my own and found that the finals cross reference to the NTE 1396 which are available. We only have one music AM here in Anchorage right now and that's KHAR on 590. They still advertise themselves as "Stereo 590" but they turned off their C-Quam exciter about 3 years ago. I have know their engineer and he wouldn't mind putting it back on but there were some problems with the exciter that need to be repaired and the company would not allow funds to be spent for its repair. Very sad. Dave ----- Original Message ----- From: Scott Todd To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, February 17, 2003 10:27 AM Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM Stereo Radios Dave- if you've got the time, set up your own part 15 AMS station. Or if the FCC isn't too aggressive in your area, buy or build a 10 or 20w transmitter and use the Alfredo Lite to drive it. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dave Taylor" We don't have any AM Stereo stations here anymore unfortunately. Let me know if you might be interested. > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ADVERTISEMENT Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From possumhunter@netzero.net Mon Feb 17 12:29:26 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 17 Feb 2003 20:29:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 52496 invoked from network); 17 Feb 2003 20:29:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Feb 2003 20:29:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.122) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Feb 2003 20:29:25 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 17 Feb 2003 12:29:25 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} DXing Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 15:29:16 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 17 Feb 2003 20:29:25.0958 (UTC) FILETIME=[43856E60:01C2D6C3] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.161.180.180] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 jsgil@hal-pc.org wrote: > For reasons unknown to me our local blowtorch 740 KTRH is off the air. Good! Hopefully they are fixing the DA so I can hear CHWO 740 again. Kevin From n0uiheric@aol.com Mon Feb 17 12:55:59 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 17 Feb 2003 20:55:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 96169 invoked from network); 17 Feb 2003 20:55:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Feb 2003 20:55:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r05.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.101) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Feb 2003 20:55:56 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-r05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.1ef.217b8a4 (3956) for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2003 15:55:32 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1ef.217b8a4.2b82a644@aol.com> Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 15:55:32 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Designing a receiver? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih When I checked XM's offerings last fall, the Beeb wasn't listed. Only Sirius had the Beeb (as well as NPR) listed. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From jsgil@hal-pc.org Mon Feb 17 13:10:34 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 17 Feb 2003 21:10:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 14802 invoked from network); 17 Feb 2003 21:10:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Feb 2003 21:10:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Feb 2003 21:10:33 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.141] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Feb 2003 21:10:31 -0000 Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 21:10:28 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: DXing Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 590 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.236 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Possum Hunter" wrote: > jsgil@h... wrote: > > For reasons unknown to me our local blowtorch 740 KTRH is off the air. > > Good! Hopefully they are fixing the DA so I can hear CHWO 740 again. > > Kevin Is it that bad? According to radio locator their fringe coverage area doesn't extend outside Louisiana for their nighttime DA. Must be a persistent skywave beating into SC. The signal is mostly directed over ther Gulf of Mexico, mostly wasted since the population in the water is about zilch unless you count the fish. JSG From amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk Mon Feb 17 13:40:13 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 17 Feb 2003 21:40:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 36789 invoked from network); 17 Feb 2003 21:20:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Feb 2003 21:20:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Feb 2003 21:20:24 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.248] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Feb 2003 21:20:20 -0000 Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 21:20:18 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Sony ST-JX220A goes for AU $355.00 ! Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 99 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Dave " X-Originating-IP: 81.7.55.221 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113985069 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereofan I thought I paid a lot for mine but this must beat all records! Brought by someone in the UK btw From alfredot@inetarena.com Mon Feb 17 14:39:26 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: alfredot@inetarena.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 17 Feb 2003 22:39:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 33623 invoked from network); 17 Feb 2003 22:25:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Feb 2003 22:25:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.inetarena.com) (206.129.216.13) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Feb 2003 22:25:19 -0000 Received: from hendrie (1Cust90.tnt17.beaverton.or.da.uu.net [65.227.179.90]) by mail.inetarena.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h1HMMXe11406 for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2003 14:22:33 -0800 (PST) Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 14:24:34 -0800 (PST) X-Sender: alfredo@hendrie.1610am.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: AM Radio: Not Created for Local Broadcasting In-Reply-To: <1045499727.2236.49885.m12@yahoogroups.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: "Alfredo E. Torrejon" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=25132238 X-Yahoo-Profile: alfredotorrejon > One point needs to be raised about AM radio. In Europe, AM radio is not used > for local broadcasting, but for regional broadcasting. A number of AM > stations run hundreds of thousands of watts, and use lower modulation to > reduce or eliminate ACI. AM radio was basically not created for local > broadcasting, but regional broadcasting. > I think some of these powerful AMs could be used to relay foreign > broadcasters which offer broadcasts in the English language (such as the BBC > or Germany's DW Radio) instead of rebroadcasting the same corporate crap. Although I agree 100% with you that mediumwave is best suited to regional coverage rather than for local service, haven't a lot of European public broadcast networks been pulling the plug on their AM (MW, LW, SW) operations in recent years? I remember reading that in 1995, the public broadcasting network in one of the Scandinavian countries shut down the last of its MW and LW stations, leaving all the network programming to be carried exclusively on FM. One of my friends who visited Finland about a year ago reported that in Helsinki, only one AM station could be heard during the day. Sadly, even the BBC discontinued its North American shortwave service in 2001, and we all know that the CBC is phasing out AM broadcasts. My guess is that the managements of these radio networks are following what one religious broadcaster called a "station planting" distribution model. That is, instead of having a big central transmitter whose signal covers a large area, the programming is distributed via satellite to many FM transmitters placed near major population centers. In the minds of the managers of these networks, station planting is a good idea because by broadcasting locally on FM, programming is available to their listeners 24 hours a day, not subject to propagation conditions. The reality, however, is that listeners in rural areas and remote places cannot adequately be served by a network of FM stations. In one of the Scandinavian countries, there is even talk of bringing back LW service because people in rural areas and out at sea have complained that the FM signals don't reach them. Alfredo From amstereorules@msn.com Mon Feb 17 15:27:11 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereorules@msn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 17 Feb 2003 23:27:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 17718 invoked from network); 17 Feb 2003 23:27:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Feb 2003 23:27:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.75) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Feb 2003 23:27:11 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.184] by n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Feb 2003 23:27:10 -0000 Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 23:27:10 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: DXing Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 230 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amstereorules " X-Originating-IP: 152.163.207.54 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=130870594 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereorules >The signal is mostly >directed over ther Gulf of Mexico, mostly wasted since the population >in the water is about zilch unless you count the fish. Hey the fish are some of their best listeners. Ragnar Remember, AMStereoRules From amstereorules@msn.com Mon Feb 17 15:31:31 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereorules@msn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 17 Feb 2003 23:31:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 13685 invoked from network); 17 Feb 2003 23:31:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Feb 2003 23:31:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.84) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Feb 2003 23:31:28 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.141] by n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Feb 2003 23:31:27 -0000 Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 23:31:26 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: DXing Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3E50D7F0.9742ABB8@earthlink.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 478 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amstereorules " X-Originating-IP: 152.163.207.54 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=130870594 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereorules >Something that we might want to consider as a group would be to >encourage members who post to include their city/country/location >after their name. >There is a lot of DX and historical discussion as well as AMS >discussion, and it would be both helpful and interesting to know >where the member is posting from. That is funny Dick the W. You ask us to post our QTH, and then don't list yours. Ragnar Hung out in Rhode Island and Mesa, Arizona Remember, AMStereoRules From possumhunter@netzero.net Mon Feb 17 15:43:23 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 17 Feb 2003 23:43:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 40727 invoked from network); 17 Feb 2003 23:43:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Feb 2003 23:43:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.201) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Feb 2003 23:43:22 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 17 Feb 2003 15:43:22 -0800 To: References: <3E50D23A.24396.142D38@localhost> Subject: Re: {AMSF} I'm ill right now Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 18:43:06 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 17 Feb 2003 23:43:22.0537 (UTC) FILETIME=[5B767990:01C2D6DE] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.154.220.67] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Powell E. Way III wrote: > I ate some dry roasted peanuts Saturday. WAAY too many. So at one time I may have been full of sh**, but NOT anymore. Gee, I hope ya get feeling better soon. WHen you feel up to it, we will have to go get some boiled Peanuts and RC Cola together > > And I will be discussing some rules with the Atlanta bureau chief of the FCC. Who do you know down there? My complaints about WTZQ and all the "Talking House" transmitters on 1610 has fell upon deaf ears. Perhaps I should borrow a DX-50 and show WTZQ what QRM is Oh well, it is a nice thought! Kevin From n0uiheric@aol.com Mon Feb 17 15:52:36 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 17 Feb 2003 23:52:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 51657 invoked from network); 17 Feb 2003 23:52:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Feb 2003 23:52:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r06.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.102) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Feb 2003 23:52:35 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-r06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.1e.a67f5bc (17377) for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2003 18:52:22 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1e.a67f5bc.2b82cfb5@aol.com> Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 18:52:21 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Digest Number 591 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih Correction...640 is a UNITED STATES Clear Channel....Cuba is violating treaty stipulations. All stations on 640 have to protect KFI Los Angeles. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Mon Feb 17 15:52:46 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 17 Feb 2003 23:52:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 74083 invoked from network); 17 Feb 2003 23:52:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Feb 2003 23:52:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r07.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.103) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Feb 2003 23:52:44 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-r07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.f4.2945ca1b (17377) for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2003 18:52:23 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 18:52:22 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Designing a receiver? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih Shortwave and NOAA Weather Radio won't add much to the cost of a receiver. Besides, these are ONE TIME ONLY expenses; you could expect to spend upwards of $130 per year on satellite radio, when shortwave and NOAA Weather Radio allow additional programming without the exorbitant fees XM and Sirius charge. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From matthew.trim@eds.com Mon Feb 17 16:32:33 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: matthew.trim@eds.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 18 Feb 2003 00:32:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 9660 invoked from network); 18 Feb 2003 00:32:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Feb 2003 00:32:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO ns5.eds.com) (207.169.189.136) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Feb 2003 00:32:33 -0000 Received: from nnsy.eds.com (nnsy-2.eds.com [192.85.216.198]) by ns5.eds.com (8.11.6/8.11.1) with ESMTP id h1I0WVR14564 for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2003 11:32:31 +1100 (EST) Received: from nnsy.eds.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by nnsy.eds.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1I0WTf00181 for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2003 11:32:30 +1100 (EST) Received: from ausym000.exau01.exch.eds.com ([134.251.177.117]) by nnsy.eds.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1I0WTb00172 for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2003 11:32:29 +1100 (EST) Received: by AUSYM000 with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Tue, 18 Feb 2003 11:32:06 +1100 Message-ID: <33CDDBD8CAEFEB4191ABF6F799032AF238D7B6@aubwm206> To: "'amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com'" Subject: RE: {AMSF} Sony ST-JX220A goes for AU $355.00 ! Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2003 11:32:28 +1100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-Type: text/plain From: "Trim, Matthew L" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88615102 X-Yahoo-Profile: bofh2k2000 I've got a one of these sitting on my desk at work - I'm thinking perhaps I should Ebay it based on that price!!!!! :) -----Original Message----- From: Dave [mailto:amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk] Sent: Tuesday, 18 February 2003 7:20 AM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Sony ST-JX220A goes for AU $355.00 ! I thought I paid a lot for mine but this must beat all records! Brought by someone in the UK btw From possumhunter@netzero.net Mon Feb 17 16:33:51 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 18 Feb 2003 00:33:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 35616 invoked from network); 18 Feb 2003 00:33:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Feb 2003 00:33:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.18) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Feb 2003 00:33:50 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 17 Feb 2003 16:33:50 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: DXing Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 19:33:40 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 18 Feb 2003 00:33:50.0551 (UTC) FILETIME=[684CBE70:01C2D6E5] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.154.220.67] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 jsgil@hal-pc.org wrote: > Is it that bad? Yes, It is. Kevin From dav259@csiro.au Mon Feb 17 17:26:38 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 18 Feb 2003 01:26:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 24866 invoked from network); 18 Feb 2003 01:26:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Feb 2003 01:26:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Feb 2003 01:26:37 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1I1QaR08903 for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2003 12:26:36 +1100 (EST) Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2003 12:26:36 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: "'amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com'" Subject: RE: {AMSF} Sony ST-JX220A goes for AU $355.00 ! In-Reply-To: <33CDDBD8CAEFEB4191ABF6F799032AF238D7B6@aubwm206> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=112635033 X-Yahoo-Profile: dav259 On Tue, 18 Feb 2003, Trim, Matthew L wrote: > I've got a one of these sitting on my desk at work - I'm thinking perhaps I > should Ebay it based on that price!!!!! :) I wouldn't part with mine for a king's ransom. I had it completely reconditioned about eight years ago and besides the display light not working again it's in tip top condition. Even non-AMS stations sound so much better on it. I bought a Marantz amp/receiver to play the metrosound through. It's about the same vintage but the AM band is literally fuzzy and lifeless compared to the Sony ST-JX220A. (Pity the dog ate the original ferrite bar aerial though.) From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Feb 17 18:09:13 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 18 Feb 2003 02:09:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 50716 invoked from network); 18 Feb 2003 02:09:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Feb 2003 02:09:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.69) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Feb 2003 02:09:12 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.152] by n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Feb 2003 02:09:12 -0000 Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2003 02:09:12 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: No stereo in Boston Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <000901c2d691$fdb03220$6501a8c0@AMD> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1558 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.86.23 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Actually, 740, 1090, and 1360 are in stereo during the day. I was > able to verify that on that Delco radio I got. I was able to get > enough power to it for the dial to light up, and show stations on > it. I still haven't been able to get audio out of it. 740 switches > to mono at night, but they only run a few watts, so nobody can > really hear them anyway. When I visited Boston in August 2001, 740 WJIB was mono full-time. I contacted Bob Bittner and he said they had just installed a new Nautel transmitter and the Stereo had not been set up yet (and even mentioned that other people had inquired about WJIB's lack of Stereo as well). A few months later somebody here mentioned that WJIB was now back in full Stereo during the daytime, as usual. WJIB's 5-watt nighttime signal has always been mono, as even right in Boston it usually fights a losing battle with 50,000-watt 740 CHWO. 1090 WILD in Boston is a great Urban/R&B music station in full AM Stereo, but they are daytime-only. I made some local recordings of them which I will try to get on the web for people to hear. I assume you're referring to 1360 WLYN in nearby Lynn, MA, which is a new one to me, but it's not unexpected, as WLYN is owned by Multicultural Broadcasting, which is a big supporter of AM Stereo; in NJ they are using it on 930 WPAT, 1430 WNSW, and 1680 WTTM. They also own 1480 WZRC in New York City which mysteriously shut off their Stereo about a year ago, but perhaps Neal can ask around and see if there's any chance of WZRC returning to AM Stereo. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Feb 17 18:23:42 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 18 Feb 2003 02:23:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 76824 invoked from network); 18 Feb 2003 02:23:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Feb 2003 02:23:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.70) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Feb 2003 02:23:41 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.168] by n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Feb 2003 02:23:41 -0000 Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2003 02:23:41 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Digest Number 590 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <004301c2d6b7$06d24d00$827dfea9@home1> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1288 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.86.23 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > It's a whole different ballgame synchronizing a few dozen > transmitters around a country the size of England, and several > thousand radio stations around one the size of the US. Not that it > probably couldn't be done now with GPS technology. In their official specs, iBiquity recommends that all IBOC stations have their equipment locked to GPS. But, synchronized hash is still hash! With the delays incurred by digital broadcasting, it also makes me wonder if, at some point when all TV is digital, they'll drop the ball in Times Square a few seconds early, so that by the time it gets to viewers' screens on their HDTV sets, the New Years' countdown will be accurate? p.s. One of my family members is looking to buy a new TV. Despite my warnings that it may become useless 3 years from now, he has his heart set on one of those 24-inch flat screen standard TVs for $350. I also asked several electronics stores if they have any actual demonstrations of HDTV as received from an actual on-air signal. They all say "no, but we have our own in-store demo channel, and it'll look the same as real HDTV". Yeah, that must be why all of the wide-screen TVs in the store are simply showing regular analog narrow-screen TV stretched out to fit the 16:9 aspect ratio! From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Feb 17 18:34:14 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 18 Feb 2003 02:34:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 48766 invoked from network); 18 Feb 2003 02:34:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Feb 2003 02:34:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.86) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Feb 2003 02:34:10 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.136] by n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Feb 2003 02:34:10 -0000 Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2003 02:34:09 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: OT: microprocessors Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 889 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.86.23 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > OK, I'll accept your invitation, OT though it may be. In my > opinion, "the best microprocessor ever made" is the Motorola > M68K/Coldfire. The 68000 is good, but I'd vote for the 6502 and its more fully integrated 6510 twin, which made it possible for bazillions of Apple, Commodore, Atari, etc. computers to exist and introduce many people to home computing in the late '70s and early '80s. And these 8-bit processors really could do a lot; Apple and Atari were supporting their 8-bit machines as late as about 1993, and I bet there are still countless elementary schools which are still teaching kids Logo on Apple //e's. My second place vote would go to the Zilog Z80, which correspondingly revolutionized the business end of home/small business computing, with loads of CP/M computers, before the IBM PC and its clones started taking over everything in the mid-'80s. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Feb 17 19:03:58 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 18 Feb 2003 03:03:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 2502 invoked from network); 18 Feb 2003 03:03:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Feb 2003 03:03:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.86) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Feb 2003 03:03:58 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.142] by n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Feb 2003 03:03:57 -0000 Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2003 03:03:54 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Designing a receiver? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1151 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.86.23 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Shortwave and NOAA Weather Radio won't add much to the cost of a > receiver. NOAA Weather Radio is the modern-day outgrowth of a Cold War plan to allow all U.S. residents to receive "emergency" broadcasts, such as lovely things like information on when and where an incoming atomic bomb is going to hit. After the CONELRAD system on the AM band (with the triangle indicators on 640 and 1240 kHz) was retired, the government had plans to put emergency broadcasts on a network of high-power Longwave stations, and corresponding LW reception for these stations would be included in all radios and TV sets, with the capability to have a warning signal automatically turn on the receiver and deliver the broadcast at a "greater than normal" volume level to wake people up at night. Only one of these LW stations was built, WGU-20 on 179 kHz in Maryland, using the first all-solid-state 50,000-watt transmitter. It went on the air in 1973 and broadcast continuous time announcements, not unlike WWV. But before the rest of the network was built, the project was abandoned in favor of NOAA, with its current 162 MHz VHF weather service. From dav259@csiro.au Mon Feb 17 19:59:38 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 18 Feb 2003 03:59:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 92932 invoked from network); 18 Feb 2003 03:59:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Feb 2003 03:59:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Feb 2003 03:59:36 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1I3xYR15092 for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2003 14:59:34 +1100 (EST) Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2003 14:59:34 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: amstereoforum Subject: potential disaster for Sydney AM stations Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=112635033 X-Yahoo-Profile: dav259 What a debarticle! Possibly all major AM transmitters in Sydney may have to be moved due to a state government planning screwup. http://smh.com.au/articles/2003/02/16/1045330466812.html From amfmdx@fastq.com Mon Feb 17 22:49:52 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 18 Feb 2003 06:49:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 93069 invoked from network); 18 Feb 2003 06:49:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Feb 2003 06:49:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Feb 2003 06:49:52 -0000 Received: from fastq (d127-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.159]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id h1I6npU65928 for ; Mon, 17 Feb 2003 23:49:51 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <001a01c2d719$bd4eaf80$9ff9bed8@com> To: References: <1045528432.2149.35621.m15@yahoogroups.com> Subject: This is not me Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 23:48:25 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla Gents, I do not know who amstereorules@msn.com is. I can assure you that it is not me. I don't care for the game and wish the moderator would put an end to this. Kevin Message: 20 Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 23:31:26 -0000 From: "amstereorules " Subject: Re: DXing >Something that we might want to consider as a group would be to >encourage members who post to include their city/country/location >after their name. >There is a lot of DX and historical discussion as well as AMS >discussion, and it would be both helpful and interesting to know >where the member is posting from. That is funny Dick the W. You ask us to post our QTH, and then don't list yours. Ragnar Hung out in Rhode Island and Mesa, Arizona Remember, AMStereoRules From KC4QLP@aol.com Mon Feb 17 23:48:25 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 18 Feb 2003 07:48:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 79862 invoked from network); 18 Feb 2003 07:48:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Feb 2003 07:48:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d03.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.35) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Feb 2003 07:48:24 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.6.a6da3fa (16781) for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2003 02:48:07 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <6.a6da3fa.2b833f37@aol.com> Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2003 02:48:07 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} This is not me To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 7.0 for Windows sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 2/18/03 1:50:20 AM Eastern Standard Time, amfmdx@fastq.com writes: > Gents, > > I do not know who amstereorules@msn.com is. I can assure you that it is not > me. I don't care for the game and wish the moderator would put an end to > this. > > Kevin > This is one reason why my participation here has become almost null and void. Seems as if folks here have lots of time on their hands to play games and argue and what have you.Time to "entertain" peoples off the wall dumb ideas and having to explain everything to everyone has come and gone here as I dont have time for that anymore. Over half of the postings in my inbox get deleted...one,due to the person making the post..automatic deletion right there.Two,the subject matter or better yet...the lack of a subject. As much as we like the analog AM Stereo...seems like most just can not grab a hold of reality and understand that digital...like it or not is going to have an impact on AM radio. Finding ways to make it "user friendly" should be the game here instead of coming up with hair brained off the wall ideas and comments that just dont add up that make yourselves look foolish...but to each is own. Kevin R...hope your able to get to the bottom of the jokester here...considering the control here....I'm wishing you the best of luck.You'll need it. (back in the lurking and deleting mode) Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.qsl.net/kc4qlp Echolink node # 56704 -- 146.590 VHF,440.850 UHF (PL 131.8) _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Feb 18 01:24:19 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 18 Feb 2003 09:24:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 68769 invoked from network); 18 Feb 2003 09:24:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Feb 2003 09:24:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Feb 2003 09:24:18 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.137] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Feb 2003 09:24:18 -0000 Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2003 09:24:16 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: ABC AM Stereo Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 870 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.86.23 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics I discovered on their web site that the ABC (in Australia, not America!) specifically lists 612 4QR in Brisbane as being an AM Stereo station. The direct link is too long to post here, but if you go to: http://abc.net.au/reception/freq/qld.htm Then scroll down to "Local Radio" and click on "Brisbane 612 AM", it'll bring up the details on 4QR including a coverage map and a mention of "Sound Mode: Stereo". I haven't gone through the lists for every state, but in Queensland, 4QR is the only ABC-owned AM station which is listed as being Stereo. p.s. A quick check also shows 702 2BL in Sydney (NSW) and 936 7ZR in Hobart (Tasmania) as being AM Stereo; these are the three ABC stations I have on my list as being Stereo (or at least *were* Stereo in the past)... but it is unknown how up-to-date and accurate the information on ABC's own web site may be. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Feb 18 01:53:09 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 18 Feb 2003 09:53:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 30381 invoked from network); 18 Feb 2003 09:53:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Feb 2003 09:53:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.69) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Feb 2003 09:53:08 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.151] by n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Feb 2003 09:53:08 -0000 Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2003 09:53:04 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: This is not me Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <001a01c2d719$bd4eaf80$9ff9bed8@com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 779 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.86.23 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > I do not know who amstereorules@msn.com is. I can assure you that > it is not me. Whoever that was, he just unsubscribed himself. Hopefully he'll return using his real name, or at least a pseudonym which doesn't impersonate another member. > I don't care for the game and wish the moderator would put an end > to this. I hesistate to even mention this, as the last time when I recommended that "signatures" be kept to a certain length I got a lot of flack about it, but it would be nice if people could use their real names here -- or at least something which *sounds* like a real name. I do realise that this isn't an online service like CompuServe where real name usage is mandatory, but doing so does help to maintain a more professional atmosphere. Kevin T. From jbyrns@rcn.com Tue Feb 18 05:18:08 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@rcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 18 Feb 2003 13:18:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 3701 invoked from network); 18 Feb 2003 13:18:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Feb 2003 13:18:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.90) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Feb 2003 13:18:08 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.173] by n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Feb 2003 13:18:07 -0000 Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2003 13:18:04 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: This is not me Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <001a01c2d719$bd4eaf80$9ff9bed8@com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 959 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bta_50g " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.114 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=138635554 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g Me thinks you protest too much. John --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" < amfmdx@f...> wrote: > Gents, > > I do not know who amstereorules@m... is. I can assure you that it is not > me. I don't care for the game and wish the moderator would put an end to > this. > > Kevin > > Message: 20 > Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 23:31:26 -0000 > From: "amstereorules " > Subject: Re: DXing > > >Something that we might want to consider as a group would be to > >encourage members who post to include their city/country/location > >after their name. > >There is a lot of DX and historical discussion as well as AMS > >discussion, and it would be both helpful and interesting to know > >where the member is posting from. > That is funny Dick the W. You ask us to post our QTH, and then don't > list yours. > > Ragnar > Hung out in Rhode Island and Mesa, Arizona > > Remember, > AMStereoRules From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Feb 18 09:37:16 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 18 Feb 2003 17:37:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 75170 invoked from network); 18 Feb 2003 17:37:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Feb 2003 17:37:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Feb 2003 17:37:13 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.179] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Feb 2003 17:37:12 -0000 Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2003 17:37:12 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Realistic TM-152 on eBay Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 404 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics Here is a Realistic TM-152 AM Stereo tuner on eBay, with a starting bid of $24.99. It is shown tuned an AM Stereo station with full signal strength, which according to the dial position and the seller's location I assume is either 920 WOKY from Milwaukee, WI or perhaps 890 WLS from Chicago. It includes the original owner's manual. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3008747596 From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Feb 18 10:28:07 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 18 Feb 2003 18:28:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 61230 invoked from network); 18 Feb 2003 18:28:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Feb 2003 18:28:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Feb 2003 18:28:04 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.136] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Feb 2003 18:27:27 -0000 Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2003 18:27:24 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Kahn AM Stereo in VA Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 827 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics Here is a station in Virginia that makes it quite clear that they're broadcasting in Kahn AM Stereo. As they say right on the main page of their web site, "WBDH refuses to conform to this foolish 'standard' [C-Quam] set by the FCC in 1993. Instead we use the KAHN Independent Sideband System to broadcast stereo." http://www.wbdhradio.com/ However, dig deeper into their web site and you'll see: "WBDH is a low power Part 15 radio station which means our on the air coverage is poor." So, "WBDH" isn't an officially licensed station, so thus they can use any AM Stereo system they want to. So, they're an interesting set-up nonetheless, but not quite the same thing as a full-fledged station using Kahn AM Stereo (which I'm sure there *are* a few out there, but understandably they probably keep a low profile). From dwtpa97@earthlink.net Tue Feb 18 11:17:37 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dwtpa97@earthlink.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 18 Feb 2003 19:17:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 3087 invoked from network); 18 Feb 2003 19:17:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Feb 2003 19:17:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO grebe.mail.pas.earthlink.net) (207.217.120.46) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Feb 2003 19:17:36 -0000 Received: from sdn-ap-013scfairp0280.dialsprint.net ([63.183.129.26] helo=earthlink.net) by grebe.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 18lDFF-00079k-00 for amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com; Tue, 18 Feb 2003 11:17:34 -0800 Message-ID: <3E5286FE.81C479D0@earthlink.net> Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2003 14:18:22 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.79 [en]C-CCK-MCD NSCPCD472 (Windows NT 5.0; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: DXing References: From: dwtpa97 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38076959 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I am sorry. I did not mean to be hypocritical. I was waiting to see if the members had some thoughts on the suggestion one way or another. Dick Tampa "amstereorules " wrote: > >Something that we might want to consider as a group would be to > >encourage members who post to include their city/country/location > >after their name. > >There is a lot of DX and historical discussion as well as AMS > >discussion, and it would be both helpful and interesting to know > >where the member is posting from. > That is funny Dick the W. You ask us to post our QTH, and then don't > list yours. > > Ragnar > Hung out in Rhode Island and Mesa, Arizona > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From jbyrns@rcn.com Tue Feb 18 14:02:59 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@rcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 18 Feb 2003 22:02:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 21181 invoked from network); 18 Feb 2003 22:02:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Feb 2003 22:02:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.70) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Feb 2003 22:02:51 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.250] by n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Feb 2003 22:02:41 -0000 Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2003 22:02:37 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Kahn AM Stereo in VA Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1694 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bta_50g " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.65 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=138635554 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " < kevtronics@y...> wrote: > Here is a station in Virginia that makes it quite clear that they're > broadcasting in Kahn AM Stereo. As they say right on the main page > of their web site, "WBDH refuses to conform to this foolish > 'standard' [C-Quam] set by the FCC in 1993. Instead we use the KAHN > Independent Sideband System to broadcast stereo." > > http://www.wbdhradio.com/ That's an interesting web site, I think we may have located the mysterious Ragnar, A.K.A. "amstereorules", but more about that in a minute. Does anyone know what kind of AMStereo system WBDH actually uses for "broadcasting"? They claim it is Kahn, but reading between the lines, it sounds like they are really using a "pure ISB" AM stereo system, which is a fish of a different stripe than Kahn ISB AM stereo. If they are using the actual Kahn AM stereo system, it would be interesting if they would share the specifications with all of us, by posting the Kahn AM stereo specifications on their web pages, as the actual specifications of the Kahn AM stereo system are difficult to pin down. Among the technical errors on the WBDH page of "semi technical information on the basics of AM Stereo Transmission" is the following statement, "With normal 100% modulation the carrier of an AM transmitter varies between zero and 2X power at an audio frequency rate." This statement reminds me of the mysterious Ragnar, A.K.A. "amstereorules", and his technical opinions. I wonder if Ragnar is part of the WBDH team? I hope this sort of technical error isn't the result of the "Conservative education" WBDH espouses. John From KC4QLP@aol.com Tue Feb 18 15:26:47 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 18 Feb 2003 23:26:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 57410 invoked from network); 18 Feb 2003 23:26:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Feb 2003 23:26:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m04.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.7) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Feb 2003 23:26:45 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.10.2ce85b46 (25305) for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2003 18:26:29 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <10.2ce85b46.2b841b24@aol.com> Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2003 18:26:28 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Kahn AM Stereo in VA To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 2/18/03 1:30:29 PM Eastern Standard Time, kevtronics@yahoo.com writes: << Here is a station in Virginia that makes it quite clear that they're broadcasting in Kahn AM Stereo. As they say right on the main page of their web site, "WBDH refuses to conform to this foolish 'standard' [C-Quam] set by the FCC in 1993. Instead we use the KAHN Independent Sideband System to broadcast stereo." http://www.wbdhradio.com/ >> No news like old news as this was posted just a few months ago on here. I know this individual..and he is capable of speaking for himself without having to "hide" his identity as some have in round about ways accused that individual of doing. If you have questions about the in depth technical side of that part 15 station...go to the website and click on the "contact us" button. He doesnt bite nor does he send out viruses....well...maybe,hehehe ...ok,just kidding. Taking a close look at the website you will note that no where does it say "True Kahn ISB" anywhere. Also you'll note that nothing is stated about what commerical equipement is used...because the simple fact is the exciter is homebrew. (back to lurking and deleting mode) Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.qsl.net/kc4qlp Echolink node # 56704 -- 146.590 VHF,440.850 UHF (PL 131.8) _______________________________________________________ From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Feb 18 16:23:49 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 19 Feb 2003 00:23:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 7067 invoked from network); 19 Feb 2003 00:23:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Feb 2003 00:23:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Feb 2003 00:23:47 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.138] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 19 Feb 2003 00:23:46 -0000 Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2003 00:23:45 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Kahn AM Stereo in VA Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1486 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.72.152 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Among the technical errors on the WBDH page of "semi technical > information on the basics of AM Stereo Transmission" Another inaccurate statement on "WBDH"'s web site is that they claim C-Quam AM Stereo must be limited to 85% negative modulation. Although older MC13020-based radios do experience a small amount of distortion when -95% modulation is exceeded, there is no technical reason why C-Quam can't be modulated with the same +125% and -100% as a mono signal, and the newer MC13022 and MC13028 decoders can handle this amount very well with no added distortion. And on a grander scale, the real issue is that C-Quam has benefitted from over 20 years of development and refinement, and is now even in the digital age, with decoding possible through DSP computer code... meanwhile, the Kahn system is basically stuck in the mid-'80s, with most PowerSide stations still using the Kahn STR-84 exciter which was designed in 1984. So, while back then the Kahn system may have had some definite advantages over C-Quam, by now it is clearly C-Quam which has the advantage in sound quality, reception quality, and technical refinement. And if Mr. Kahn really wants the FCC to allow use of his AM Stereo system again (as his FCC petition mentions), he has a lot of catching up to do, as regardless of what your views are about IBOC, it is clear that today's AM band is not going to be "saved" by technology that has remained stagnant for the past fifteen years. From stodd@sherbtel.net Tue Feb 18 17:35:07 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 19 Feb 2003 01:35:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 70048 invoked from network); 19 Feb 2003 01:35:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Feb 2003 01:35:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Feb 2003 01:35:06 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-246.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.246]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h1J1Z2e4022880 for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2003 19:35:04 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <002b01c2d7b7$7769bac0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Designing a receiver? Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2003 19:37:27 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Never underestimate the general public's reluctance to shell out a lot in an initial investment, choosing rather to be nickle and dimed to death instead. Look at the tax code if you don't believe me. One unfortunate thing about SW is that unlike AM, FM and XM, you can't just punch up a channel and expect to hear a given program. Most folks aren't like you and me- they're just too busy or lazy (it's the instant gratification thing, you know) to hunt around to find out where Auntie Beeb or the CBC disappeared to. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: > Shortwave and NOAA Weather Radio won't add much to the cost of a receiver. > Besides, these are ONE TIME ONLY expenses; you could expect to spend upwards > of $130 per year on satellite radio, when shortwave and NOAA Weather Radio > allow additional programming without the exorbitant fees XM and Sirius charge. From rwagoner1@mac.com Tue Feb 18 18:52:28 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner1@mac.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 19 Feb 2003 02:52:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 72869 invoked from network); 19 Feb 2003 02:52:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Feb 2003 02:52:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO fed1mtao04.cox.net) (68.6.19.241) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Feb 2003 02:52:26 -0000 Received: from mac.com ([68.4.33.253]) by fed1mtao04.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20030219025226.XPTD6145.fed1mtao04.cox.net@mac.com> for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2003 21:52:26 -0500 Message-ID: <3E52F16A.8000407@mac.com> Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2003 18:52:26 -0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20021120 Netscape/7.01 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Kahn AM Stereo in VA References: From: Richard Wagoner X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135738921 X-Yahoo-Profile: richardalanwagoner Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit >www.wbdhradio.com< My favorite part from their web page is this, speaking of CQuam: > This system has time and time again proven itself not to work, or at > best, work poorly. So they are saying either that it has proven not to work, or proven not to work poorly, which of course would mean that it works well. You'd think web page designers would edit their pages better. Richard [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From stodd@sherbtel.net Tue Feb 18 19:25:23 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 19 Feb 2003 03:25:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 32743 invoked from network); 19 Feb 2003 02:02:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Feb 2003 02:02:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Feb 2003 02:02:37 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-246.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.246]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h1J22Xe4001636 for ; Tue, 18 Feb 2003 20:02:35 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <00ab01c2d7bb$4faeb0e0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} potential disaster for Sydney AM stations Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2003 20:04:58 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Government incompetence is universal. Too bad it might cost you what AMS you have in your area. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ian Davidson" To: "amstereoforum" Sent: Monday, February 17, 2003 9:59 PM Subject: {AMSF} potential disaster for Sydney AM stations > > What a debarticle! > > Possibly all major AM transmitters in Sydney may have to be moved due to a > state government planning screwup. > > http://smh.com.au/articles/2003/02/16/1045330466812.html > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > From ai4i@hotmail.com Tue Feb 18 19:41:18 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ai4i@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 19 Feb 2003 03:41:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 19182 invoked from network); 19 Feb 2003 03:38:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Feb 2003 03:38:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (207.68.164.191) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Feb 2003 03:38:59 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 18 Feb 2003 19:38:59 -0800 To: References: <1045528432.2149.35621.m15@yahoogroups.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Digest Number 592 Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2003 22:38:57 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Feb 2003 03:38:59.0222 (UTC) FILETIME=[6FFF2B60:01C2D7C8] From: "Joel Wilson" Reply-To: "Joel Wilson" X-Originating-IP: [216.77.218.86] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=127893550 X-Yahoo-Profile: ai4ijoel I disagree. It takes one engineer at one station, multiplied by 10 or 100 or 1,000 or 10,000. The number of stations is irrelevant. They are all locking to a reference signal independently. Message: 8 Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 13:01:47 -0600 From: "Scott Todd" Subject: Re: Digest Number 590 It's a whole different ballgame synchronizing a few dozen transmitters around a country the size of England, and several thousand radio stations around one the size of the US. Not that it probably couldn't be done now with GPS technology. From ai4i@hotmail.com Tue Feb 18 19:42:41 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ai4i@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 19 Feb 2003 03:42:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 24982 invoked from network); 19 Feb 2003 03:42:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Feb 2003 03:42:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (207.68.164.100) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Feb 2003 03:42:40 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 18 Feb 2003 19:42:40 -0800 To: References: <1045528432.2149.35621.m15@yahoogroups.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Digest Number 592 Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2003 22:42:28 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Feb 2003 03:42:40.0714 (UTC) FILETIME=[F4042AA0:01C2D7C8] From: "Joel Wilson" Reply-To: "Joel Wilson" X-Originating-IP: [216.77.218.86] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=127893550 X-Yahoo-Profile: ai4ijoel BBC World Service has been on XM channel 131 from day one. What SIRIUS has that I like is WRN. http://www.wrn.org Joel Wilson Hello Taxi AI4I ========================================= Proud 2-B a pioneering satellite radio subscriber AI4I is always on the trailing edge of technology ========================================= ________________________________________________________________________ Message: 15 Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 15:55:32 EST From: n0uiheric@aol.com Subject: Re: Re: Designing a receiver? When I checked XM's offerings last fall, the Beeb wasn't listed. Only Sirius had the Beeb (as well as NPR) listed. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From ai4i@hotmail.com Tue Feb 18 19:48:50 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ai4i@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 19 Feb 2003 03:48:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 96203 invoked from network); 19 Feb 2003 03:48:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Feb 2003 03:48:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (207.68.164.87) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Feb 2003 03:48:49 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 18 Feb 2003 19:48:49 -0800 To: References: <1045528432.2149.35621.m15@yahoogroups.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Digest Number 592 Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2003 22:48:46 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Feb 2003 03:48:49.0598 (UTC) FILETIME=[CFE365E0:01C2D7C9] From: "Joel Wilson" Reply-To: "Joel Wilson" X-Originating-IP: [216.77.218.86] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=127893550 X-Yahoo-Profile: ai4ijoel Correction on a correction, Timothy. Go check an early "Broadcasting" yearbook. CMQ was dominant. KFI might also be dominant, but I suspect they were/are something like a 1-B station. Joel Wilson Hello Taxi AI4I ========================================= Proud 2-B a pioneering satellite radio subscriber AI4I is always on the trailing edge of technology ========================================= Message: 22 Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 18:52:21 EST From: n0uiheric@aol.com Subject: Re: Digest Number 591 Correction...640 is a UNITED STATES Clear Channel....Cuba is violating treaty stipulations. All stations on 640 have to protect KFI Los Angeles. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From jsgil@hal-pc.org Tue Feb 18 21:57:26 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 19 Feb 2003 05:57:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 92563 invoked from network); 19 Feb 2003 05:57:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Feb 2003 05:57:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.90) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Feb 2003 05:57:26 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.181] by n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 19 Feb 2003 05:57:26 -0000 Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2003 05:57:23 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Kahn AM Stereo in VA Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2008 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.158 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "bta_50g " wrote: > > Does anyone know what kind of AMStereo system WBDH actually uses for > "broadcasting"? They claim it is Kahn, but reading between the lines, > it sounds like they are really using a "pure ISB" AM stereo system, > which is a fish of a different stripe than Kahn ISB AM stereo. If > they are using the actual Kahn AM stereo system, it would be > interesting if they would share the specifications with all of us, by > posting the Kahn AM stereo specifications on their web pages, as the > actual specifications of the Kahn AM stereo system are difficult to > pin down. > > > John I went and looked at it. Too bad they didn't show the whole schematic otherwise I could have figured out more about it. They may be able to readily build the audio phase shifters and employ linear phase modulation but I dout they have implemented the 2nd harmonic signal added to L-R the way a real Kahn exciter does. It wouldn't be too hard to implement a Magnavox AM/PM like system with L-R audio phase shifted though. If adjusted for 1 radian deviation when the envelope is 100% modulated it would place the fundamental modulating signal on only one side of the carrier. The Magnavox team discovered this and used a quadrature audio signal generator as an input for aligning their exciter. Since this is a mutliplicative system it still produces harmonics in relation to the modulating frequency on both sides of the carrier during single channel modulation. Pure or linear ISB wouldn't produce extra harmonics an would basically be a fixed 90deg Harris system with L-R audio phase shifted. The ARRL handbook also outlines a Harris style phase generated ISB for one method of generating ISB. The 2nd harmonic that Kahn adds only benefits those using the 2 radio approach otherwise a Magnavox receiver with the necessary audio phase shifters would decode it properly. I suspect that the Sony decoder does just this. JSG From dav259@csiro.au Wed Feb 19 00:20:35 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 19 Feb 2003 08:20:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 52830 invoked from network); 19 Feb 2003 08:20:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Feb 2003 08:20:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Feb 2003 08:20:34 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1J8KWR07578 for ; Wed, 19 Feb 2003 19:20:32 +1100 (EST) Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2003 19:20:32 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Subject: Re: {AMSF} ABC AM Stereo In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=112635033 X-Yahoo-Profile: dav259 On Tue, 18 Feb 2003, Kevin T. wrote: > I discovered on their web site that the ABC (in Australia, not > America!) specifically lists 612 4QR in Brisbane as being an > AM Stereo station. The direct link is too long to post here, but > if you go to: > > http://abc.net.au/reception/freq/qld.htm Thanks Kevin. You got my hopes up - and there is still some hope ... I rang 4QR and after being quizzed by the receptionist about AM stereo - she thought I must be talking about their internet stream - I convinced her that broadcast AM stereo does exist. Though she was still sceptical she put me through to a friendly engineer who was really nice. He became even friendlier when he realised that I was the Ian D who regularly posts on the Oz google ng. And he was good enough to even ring back with the ABC's central transmission phone number in Sydney. Basically his story is that he looks after the engineering side till it's sent on a microwave beam to the transmitter site. He said the studios are totally wired for stereo - but the signal that they pump out is mono. Apparently the transmitter site has been contracted out to private enterprise and he frankly has never seen the other end and admits the stereo exciter could still be turned on. He was very happy to talk about the "good old days" when AMS was alive and kicking and wasn't too happy about our ABC effectively privatising parts of its infrastructure. He agrees that the intro of AMS was badly mishandled by the US and then Oz - in that it seemed somewhat of a failure before it even arrived here - and the AM stations failed to promote it properly. I rang the Sydney people (Broadcast Aust) and expect that is a private enterprise thing as well. :( A guy there wasn't too helpful and said it would be best to put my question in an e-mail marked to NOC Operators. I'm still awaiting a reply. I then did a bit of exploring on the site you mentioned above and found amongst other things about our local 3LO: Frequency Information Transmitter Region Melbourne, VIC ABC Service ABC Local Radio Frequency 774 AM Callsign 3LO Sound Mode Stereo <<<<<----------------- Polarisation Vertical Broadcast Pattern Omnidirectional Transmitter Location MELBOURNE It's even in the 3LO 75th anniversary book that 3LO switched AMS off in 1995. So It sems to me any ABC station that has stereo capability is still listed as "Sound Mode Stereo". Most ABC AM stations are listed as mono. The fact that 4QR though for all intents and purposes does everything possible in the studio in stereo is a very good sign. Each capital city ABC metro station (though being AM) feeds some programs to each states local regional stations and about a third now are on the FM band. It would seem that parts of the ABC's huge network are still doing things in stereo - even though we can't hear it. So bring on the AMS Renaissance and the ABC might well be back in the game. I may find out more when I'm up in Queensland next week. Ian Melbourne From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Wed Feb 19 05:13:38 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 19 Feb 2003 13:13:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 74511 invoked from network); 19 Feb 2003 13:13:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Feb 2003 13:13:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web41005.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.93.4) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Feb 2003 13:13:37 -0000 Message-ID: <20030219131336.68551.qmail@web41005.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.37.44] by web41005.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 19 Feb 2003 05:13:36 PST Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2003 05:13:36 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Kahn AM Stereo in VA To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio "WBDH would rather see 100 stations convert to Cquam than one go to IBOC! That’s how much we dislike it." Well, you've heard them! We've gotta make these guys happy! 100 stations to C-QUAM. Got it. Working on two right now. 73, Jay,N1WVQ __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Shopping - Send Flowers for Valentine's Day http://shopping.yahoo.com From philipr@irac.pe.ca Wed Feb 19 05:43:13 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 19 Feb 2003 13:43:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 5436 invoked from network); 19 Feb 2003 13:43:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Feb 2003 13:43:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.86) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Feb 2003 13:43:12 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.159] by n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 19 Feb 2003 13:42:58 -0000 Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2003 13:42:55 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: potential disaster for Sydney AM stations Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 749 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse " X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking I emailed this news item around work, as we are involved in hearing land use planning appeals here on PEI. The Commissioners here could not believe that local planning authorities could miss something so obvious, especially with one part of the complex within one tower's drop zone! As well, the fact that the broadcasters had raised concerns had alerted the planning authority to these concerns adds a new dimension to this kind of blatant stupidity. Phil R. --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, Ian Davidson wrote: > > What a debarticle! > > Possibly all major AM transmitters in Sydney may have to be moved due to a > state government planning screwup. > > http://smh.com.au/articles/2003/02/16/1045330466812.html From florida_amstereo@hotmail.com Wed Feb 19 06:33:13 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: florida_amstereo@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 19 Feb 2003 14:33:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 38232 invoked from network); 19 Feb 2003 14:33:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Feb 2003 14:33:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.37.80) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Feb 2003 14:33:09 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 19 Feb 2003 06:33:09 -0800 Received: from 209.240.198.61 by pv2fd.pav2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Wed, 19 Feb 2003 14:33:09 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, amstereo@bellsouth.net Bcc: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: potential disaster for Sydney AM stations Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2003 14:33:09 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Feb 2003 14:33:09.0879 (UTC) FILETIME=[D3362070:01C2D823] From: "Donn Tillman" X-Originating-IP: [209.240.198.61] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83914824 This is incredible, makes you wonder if whatever commission or government agency approved this apartment complex in 1998, so close to the radio-transmitter farm, were either inept or on the take. In this area about 20 years ago, 4 of the 5 Hillsborough (county that Tampa is in) were convicted of accepting bribes to approve of residential developments that should have never been approved. I would hope some type of resolution can be made without the radio stations having to move their towers..... at the very least, the government and developer should assist the radio stations in moving their towers. donn st petersburg,fl Planning debacle forces radio towers to seek new home By Anne Davies, Urban Affairs Editor February 17 2003 Sydney's AM radio stations will be forced to move their transmitting towers from Homebush Bay - at a potential cost of $40 million - because of health and safety risks to residents in a 1200-unit development now being built. The two federal communications watchdogs have warned the NSW Government, which allowed the luxury unit complex in 1998, that electromagnetic radiation from the high-powered transmitters will be unacceptably high in units on the third floor and above............" ----Original Message Follows---- From: "Phil Rafuse " Reply-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: potential disaster for Sydney AM stations Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2003 13:42:55 -0000 I emailed this news item around work, as we are involved in hearing land use planning appeals here on PEI. The Commissioners here could not believe that local planning authorities could miss something so obvious, especially with one part of the complex within one tower's drop zone! As well, the fact that the broadcasters had raised concerns had alerted the planning authority to these concerns adds a new dimension to this kind of blatant stupidity. Phil R. --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, Ian Davidson wrote: > > What a debarticle! > > Possibly all major AM transmitters in Sydney may have to be moved due to a > state government planning screwup. _________________________________________________________________ STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail From jsgil@hal-pc.org Wed Feb 19 13:28:48 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 19 Feb 2003 21:28:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 31935 invoked from network); 19 Feb 2003 21:28:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Feb 2003 21:28:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Feb 2003 21:28:46 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.168] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 19 Feb 2003 21:28:36 -0000 Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2003 21:28:33 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: potential disaster for Sydney AM stations Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3997 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.200 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Donn Tillman" wrote: > > Here in America if a buisness is 1st to set up in an area with no objections because there is no one around it then it usually has proirity. For instance if a club or outside venu that produces a noise level that is bothersome the buisness will set up far enough away as not to disturb anyone. Those that move in later must accept the noise level or not move there in the first place. The buisness has a right to continue as they had and not have to be forced to close. The buisness planed ahead of time to allow for a continuing uninterupted prosperous operation otherwise why would someone set up a buisness that was doomed to failure from the start because of issues from neighbors. I don't think that the stations should have to move their antennas especially if they are located on wet ground. This is such a prime spot for antennas and having to move them with less ground conductivity will mean less coverage, smaller audience and reduced revenue stream. The housing builder and those associated with this SNAFU should accept all responsibility in the matter. Erect radiation shields if possible or move the people out and reimburse them and tear down the housing. If the antennas have to be moved the builder should have to absorb all costs and any projected loss in revenue stream over a sevral year period if a site with the ground condictivity where the antennas now sit cannot be found. JSG > > > This is incredible, makes you wonder if whatever commission or government > agency approved this apartment complex in 1998, so close to the > radio-transmitter farm, were either inept or on the take. > > In this area about 20 years ago, 4 of the 5 Hillsborough (county that Tampa > is in) were convicted of accepting bribes to approve of residential > developments that should have never been approved. > > I would hope some type of resolution can be made without the radio stations > having to move their towers..... at the very least, the government and > developer should assist the radio stations in moving their towers. > > donn > st petersburg,fl > > > > Planning debacle forces radio towers to seek new home > By Anne Davies, Urban Affairs Editor > February 17 2003 > > Sydney's AM radio stations will be forced to move their transmitting towers > from Homebush Bay - at a potential cost of $40 million - because of health > and safety risks to residents in a 1200-unit development now being built. > > The two federal communications watchdogs have warned the NSW Government, > which allowed the luxury unit complex in 1998, that electromagnetic > radiation from the high-powered transmitters will be unacceptably high in > units on the third floor and above............" > > > ----Original Message Follows---- > From: "Phil Rafuse " > Reply-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com > To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com > Subject: {AMSF} Re: potential disaster for Sydney AM stations > Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2003 13:42:55 -0000 > > I emailed this news item around work, as we are involved in hearing > land use planning appeals here on PEI. The Commissioners here could > not believe that local planning authorities could miss something so > obvious, especially with one part of the complex within one tower's > drop zone! As well, the fact that the broadcasters had raised > concerns had alerted the planning authority to these concerns adds a > new dimension to this kind of blatant stupidity. > > Phil R. > > > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, Ian Davidson > wrote: > > > > What a debarticle! > > > > Possibly all major AM transmitters in Sydney may have to be moved > due to a > > state government planning screwup. > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* > http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail From groucho@skyweb.net Wed Feb 19 14:47:33 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 19 Feb 2003 22:47:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 86342 invoked from network); 19 Feb 2003 22:47:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Feb 2003 22:47:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Feb 2003 22:47:31 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (tc1-84.skyweb.net [66.6.130.212]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h1JMvcFt005870; Wed, 19 Feb 2003 17:57:39 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3E540708.2D275538@skyweb.net> Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2003 17:36:56 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com" , "am@nrcdxas.org" Subject: WTTM Played American RockN Roll During snow storm Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 For those that missed it I was stuck alone at the station over the weekend snow storm manning the fort. the Battery died in my truck. I was really stuck there alone..Until Tuesday afternoon . Some Of My south asian Listeners asked me to play some American Rock.. on the South asian station Format Hey They requested It I played It.. that's the way all stations should be. I Played what they wanted to listen to Not what management or the DJ's want ?haveto play... Here are just some of the Requests that I played: The Eagles- Hotel california Joe Walsh- Life's been good James Gang Funk#49 Dire Straits- Sultans of Swing The Beatles- obladi oblada,here comes the Sun,Little help from my friends ( comment the theme was a triple play. I have no idea Of what Obladioblida means sounds like hindi to Me....here Comes the sun.. wishful thinking during the Blizzard. and So I would Not get in trouble playing this stuff it was all requests.. with a little help from my south asian friends LOL) Don McClean-American Pie Frank Sinatra- strangers In the night Lional richie-all Night Long "" "" Commodores- Night shift Led Zeppelin- Stairway to heaven,Kashmir IN FULL AM STEREO... It was Awesome... My slogan changed for the day from Where you are ,We Are...... to Classic Rock On the South Asian shores........ It was great.. I hope some of you caught it... If Not.... Until the Next Time Neal -CE WTTM 1680 am stereo Princeton,New Jersey From dav259@csiro.au Wed Feb 19 15:42:40 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 19 Feb 2003 23:42:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 663 invoked from network); 19 Feb 2003 23:42:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Feb 2003 23:42:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Feb 2003 23:42:36 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1JNgYR16260; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 10:42:34 +1100 (EST) Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 10:42:34 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: "John Kelliher " Cc: amstereoforum Subject: Re: {AMSF} ABC AM Stereo In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=112635033 X-Yahoo-Profile: dav259 Hi John Thanks for your reply (and your help yesterday). I didn't know you were on the AMS Forum - and expect that's where you've seen my name (as opposed to the google board). It looks as if for the time being both the ABC's AM and FM broadcasts will be in mono - even though most of the studios are stereo-capable. We can only hope that when the right time comes the government can throw some money the ABC's way so that listeners can hear it as God intended - with both ears. thanks again Ian AMS Cockeyed Optimist - Melbourne ________________________________________________________________________ On Wed, 19 Feb 2003, John Kelliher wrote: > Hi Ian and others in AMStereo. Firstly thank you for your kind > words re your call to Brisbane Radio Master Control. I have now > found that the stereo AM exciter at the Brisbane 4QR site has been > taken out and we are just in plain old mono again. I believe that > the majority of studios in the ABC (Australia) are stereo and it > would be the very old ones that are left that are still in mono. As > the ABC increases its transmitters for various services they are all > now FM transmitters since they are cheaper to run. Most are only > mono so any ideas of stereo in either AM or FM seems a lost cause. > For the info of the database 4QR is a Talk station with bits of music > to break it all up. Hope this is of help for you all. Best wishes > John K. > ---In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, Ian Davidson wrote: > > > > Thanks Kevin. > > > > You got my hopes up - and there is still some hope ... > > > > I rang 4QR and after being quizzed by the receptionist about AM > stereo - From kevtronics@yahoo.com Wed Feb 19 16:33:23 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 20 Feb 2003 00:33:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 88880 invoked from network); 20 Feb 2003 00:33:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Feb 2003 00:33:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Feb 2003 00:33:22 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.180] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 20 Feb 2003 00:33:04 -0000 Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 00:33:02 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: ABC AM Stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1497 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.89.133 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > It looks as if for the time being both the ABC's AM and FM > broadcasts will be in mono - even though most of the studios are > stereo-capable. Alas, even in the digital domain (whether it be local Eureka 147 DAB or satellite XM or Sirius), a lot of the talk stations are carried in mono -- because it conserves bandwidth. On Eureka 147 DAB, mono talk stations are transmitted with as little as a 48 kbps data stream, while 128 kbps is really the minimum for a stereo channel with acceptable quality. In the U.K., the BBC is pretty good at carrying Radio 4 (their "Spoken Word, Current Affairs, and Music Programmes" channel) in stereo on DAB whenever it's broadcasting music, but that isn't guaranteed, as the DAB system for each transmitter has a fixed total bandwidth, and over the years more channels have been added, thus each channel has less bandwidth available for its use. XM and Sirius work in the same basic way, and now as XM is adding new channels, that means the bandwidth available for each channel will have to be reduced, and it will become even less likely to hear their news/talk channels in stereo. Analog AM Stereo is really the most efficient system, as it doesn't inherently require any greater bandwidth than a mono signal; the only real drawback is the added cost and effort of installing and maintaining the equipment at the transmitter site (assuming the station's studios and STLs are already set up for Stereo, as most of ABC's seem to be). From jbyrns@rcn.com Wed Feb 19 17:07:54 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@rcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 20 Feb 2003 01:07:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 57732 invoked from network); 20 Feb 2003 00:35:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Feb 2003 00:35:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.87) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Feb 2003 00:35:41 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.185] by n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 20 Feb 2003 00:35:41 -0000 Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 00:35:38 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Kahn AM Stereo in VA Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2416 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bta_50g " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.50 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=138635554 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "jsgilst " < jsgil@h...> wrote: > > I went and looked at it. Too bad they didn't show the whole schematic > otherwise I could have figured out more about it. They may be able > to readily build the audio phase shifters and employ linear phase > modulation but I dout they have implemented the 2nd harmonic signal > added to L-R the way a real Kahn exciter does. The phase shift networks would be easy enough, but I wonder if WBDH might not have simply used quadrature modulation for the "L-R" signal component, rather than phase modulation? From the context of the web page I assume they didn't use the 2nd harmonic signal Kahn uses. What is "linear phase modulation", I was under the impression that phase modulation was "nonlinear" by definition? > It wouldn't be too > hard to implement a Magnavox AM/PM like system with L-R audio phase > shifted though. If adjusted for 1 radian deviation when the envelope > is 100% modulated it would place the fundamental modulating signal > on only one side of the carrier. The Magnavox team discovered this > and used a quadrature audio signal generator as an input for > aligning their exciter. Since this is a mutliplicative system it > still produces harmonics in relation to the modulating frequency on > both sides of the carrier during single channel modulation. Pure or > linear ISB wouldn't produce extra harmonics an would basically be a > fixed 90deg Harris system with L-R audio phase shifted. The ARRL > handbook also outlines a Harris style phase generated ISB for one > method of generating ISB. The 2nd harmonic that Kahn adds only > benefits those using the 2 radio approach otherwise a Magnavox > receiver with the necessary audio phase shifters would decode it > properly. I suspect that the Sony decoder does just this. Does Kahn say what the purpose of the "2nd harmonic signal" is? Seems from way back in the days of Kahn's compatible SSB system, I seem to remember that the "2nd harmonic signal" was added to make the signal more compatible with envelope detectors, this would be similar to the situation in the 2 radio approach to stereo that you mention. During the AM stereo wars of the 1980's I thought the story was that the "2nd harmonic signal" was added to reduce the bandwidth of the signal by canceling the second harmonic sidebands. Maybe it accomplishes both? John From johnkelliher@optusnet.com.au Wed Feb 19 17:22:06 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: johnkelliher@optusnet.com.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 20 Feb 2003 01:22:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 78481 invoked from network); 20 Feb 2003 01:22:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Feb 2003 01:22:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Feb 2003 01:22:05 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.182] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 20 Feb 2003 01:22:05 -0000 Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 01:22:01 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: 4QR is mono Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 601 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "John Kelliher " X-Originating-IP: 211.28.96.39 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=111392786 X-Yahoo-Profile: controler1949 Hi all, With regard to the 4QR transmitter in Brisbane Qld I can now confirm it is in "MONO" and there is no stereo exciter or anything connected to it. It took some calls and convincing the right people that it has been mono for some time and I finally got it from the tech at the the Tx this morning that we only broadcast in Mono. The ABC and Broadcast Australia (part of Macquarie Bank) have both changed their on line data bases. Also for Ian D I did see you on the other news group and have just joined this group to see what is happening around the place. Cheers, John K. From dav259@csiro.au Wed Feb 19 23:33:35 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 20 Feb 2003 07:33:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 32410 invoked from network); 20 Feb 2003 07:33:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Feb 2003 07:33:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Feb 2003 07:33:32 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1K7XVR19118 for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 18:33:31 +1100 (EST) Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 18:33:31 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: amstereoforum Subject: Re: ABC AM Stereo Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=112635033 X-Yahoo-Profile: dav259 Well - here is the bad news confirmed from Broadcast Australia. It seems all ABC stations in Australia are now mono - unless there are a few recalcitrant engineers in the outback somewhere. It's strange really because as far as TV goes the ABC is a trendsetter in digital TV here. (Sorry about the D word.) Whereas the free-to-air ("broadcast" to Americans) commercial channels are only allowed one digital channel to simulcast their analog equivalent in widescreen/digital - the ABC has added two additional channels that can only be received by digital receivers. Kids-TV (self explanatory) and Fly-TV - directed at the youth market - like it's Tripple J radio network. And there's already talk of it starting up a 24/7 News Channel on digital TV. Our ABC really puts out a great comprehensive service to all Australians and it gets respectable ratings all over. It's universally regarded as a treasured Aussie institution (losely based on the BBC). It's a shame it's dropped the ball on AM (and FM) stereo. Ian ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Barlow Paul Subject: FW: Transmission enquiry Hi Ian, I can confirm that the 4QR and 7ZR services are Mono , and confirmed with a Sydney Technician today that the 2BL service at Liverpool is also Mono. The confusion I believe is that the encoding of the signal is received in Stereo, whilst the Signal is transmitted out of the Transmitter in Mono. Please feel obliged to update your website! Regards, Paul -----Original Message----- From: Ian.Davidson@csiro.au [mailto:Ian.Davidson@csiro.au] Sent: Wednesday, 19 February 2003 11:09 To: noc@broadcastaustralia.com.au Subject: Transmission enquiry Attention: NOC Operators I briefly discussed this over the phone with Paul - and he advised me to ask in an e-mail. Can you please answer if any ABC AM radio stations are still transmitting in C-quam AM stereo? I spoke to John at 4QR and he said the feed to the transmitter was only mono but the stereo exciter may still be switched on there. Currently the ABC's website lists 4QR, 2BL, and 7ZR as being in "stereo mode" as below. http://www2b.abc.net.au/reception/frequencyfinder/asp/details.asp?transm issionid=225 Frequency Information Transmitter Region Brisbane, QLD ABC Service ABC Local Radio Frequency 612 AM Callsign 4QR Sound Mode Stereo Polarisation Vertical Broadcast Pattern Omnidirectional Transmitter Location 4QR Site BALD HILLS We like to keep a current listing of all AM stereo stations worldwide on our website. Thanks alot Ian http://www.amstereoradio.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Ian Davidson _--_|\ tel (H) 03 9534 8786 41 Smith Street / \ tel (W) 03 9545 8717 St. Kilda Beach Vic 3182 \_.--.*/ mobile: 0421 500 720 Australia v ian.davidson@csiro.au ----------------------------------------------------------------------- From jsgil@hal-pc.org Thu Feb 20 02:57:27 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 20 Feb 2003 10:57:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 82609 invoked from network); 20 Feb 2003 10:57:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Feb 2003 10:57:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.75) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Feb 2003 10:57:24 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.147] by n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 20 Feb 2003 10:57:24 -0000 Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 10:57:23 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Kahn AM Stereo in VA Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 4603 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.11 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "bta_50g " wrote: > > The phase shift networks would be easy enough, but I wonder if WBDH > might not have simply used quadrature modulation for the "L-R" signal > component, rather than phase modulation? From the context of the web > page I assume they didn't use the 2nd harmonic signal Kahn uses. They may be using what David Hershberger of Harris refered to as Linear Independent Sideband and is what is described as the phasing method in the ARRL Handbook > What > is "linear phase modulation", I was under the impression that phase > modulation was "nonlinear" by definition? > I thought that I had cleared up the context that I was using the term linear. For an example here are some quotes from the book "AM Stereo & TV Stereo New Sound Dimensions" by Stan Prentiss unsing the term 'linear'. Page 2 Magnavox | ~~~~~~~~ This is best described as an amplitude and phase (AM/PM) modulation system in which L-R becomes linearly phase modulated with a peak deviation of 1 radian. Page 47 Harris | ~~~~~~ The Harris system, of course, is a linear system where inputs applied together represent the sum of several individual inputs introduced separately. Harris claims that, in nonlinear systems, by distorting the in-phase and quadrature phase, AM stereo signal elements cand compensate for detection distortions. But AM radio filtering is usually narrowband, and nonlinear AM Stereo information will also generate distortion components in both mono & stereo receivers. As you can see they have used the term in 2 different contextes. The Harris sustem is called a linear system by the classic definition where the envelopes of both I & Q modulators are a linear representation of the modulating signals L+R & L-R respectivly and the spectrum of the modulating signals are reproduced in the sidebands with no additional harmonics. It would also be true to say that the phase modulation term of a QuAM signal is nonlinear since it is not solely related to either the I or Q vectors but is a combination of both defined by ArcTan((L-R)/(1+L+R)). Since ArcTan is a nonlinear function the phase deviation produced is nonlinear. For the Magnavox PM signal it is nonlinear by the classic definition and the spectrum of the I & Q vectors that are the byproducts of the direct phase modulation which contains additional harmonics than what is contained in the modulating signal. The phase deviation is directly and linearly related to the modulating signal L-R and the I & Q vectors are defined by I=Cos(L-R) & Q=Sin(L-R). Since both Cos & Sin are nonlinear functions it produces sidebands that contain additional harmonics that are not contained in the spectrum of the modulating signal L-R. Additional harmonics are produced when the PM carrier is amplitue modulated with 1+L+R redifining the I & Q vectors as I=(1+L+R)*Cos(L-R) and Q=(1+L+R)*Sin(L-R). In the classic definition Harris(QuAM) and Mono AM are considered linear while the Belar(FM), Magnavox(AM/PM), Kahn and to a lesser extent C-QuAM systems are considered nonlinear. But when describing the phase deviation in relation to the modulating signals both QuAM & C-QuAM signals are not linearly related to the modulating signals but for Magnavox(AM/PM) & Kahn the phase deviation is linearly related to L-R and for Belar(FM) the frequency deviation is linearly related. In the classic definition the terms linear and nonlinear refers to the spectrum that is generated by the modulating signals. A linear system produces a modulating spectrum that exactly reflects the spectrum of the modulating signal while a nonlinear system produces additional harmonics in the modulated spectrum that are not contained in the modulating signal. > Does Kahn say what the purpose of the "2nd harmonic signal" is? Seems > from way back in the days of Kahn's compatible SSB system, I seem to > remember that the "2nd harmonic signal" was added to make the signal > more compatible with envelope detectors, this would be similar to the > situation in the 2 radio approach to stereo that you mention. During > the AM stereo wars of the 1980's I thought the story was that the "2nd > harmonic signal" was added to reduce the bandwidth of the signal by > canceling the second harmonic sidebands. Maybe it accomplishes both? > > John I suspect it does 3 things. It helps to increase opposite sideband suppression while increasing compatibility and better separation for envelope detectors and reduces excessive spectrum spread. JSG From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Feb 20 08:13:41 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 20 Feb 2003 16:13:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 21104 invoked from network); 20 Feb 2003 16:13:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Feb 2003 16:13:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.69) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Feb 2003 16:13:37 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.188] by n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 20 Feb 2003 16:13:37 -0000 Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 16:13:36 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: 1190 WOWO to go IBOC (& more) Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1660 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics From www.RadioWorld.com.... Date posted: 2003-02-19 Harris Details Who Buys What For HD Radio Harris says 10 stations have recently purchased its Dexstar AM/FM HD Radio exciters for the transition to digital radio. Several of these stations have also committed to purchase Harris Z-HD transmitters or upgrade their transmitters to digital radio readiness. The stations are owned by companies such as Federated Media, Cleveland Classical and James Crystal Holdings, and they are in all-size markets. The Harris Dexstar has improved Audio I/O, RF I/O, re-engineered digital and RF upconverter, and new controller and user interfaces. The Dexstar also features an option that allows the unit to switch between analog and HD Radio signals. The stations that have recently purchased a Dexstar AM/FM exciter include: WCLV(FM), Cleveland, - Cleveland Classical; WNWV(FM), Cleveland, - Elyria-Lorain; WWFE(AM), Miami, - Fenix Broadcasting; WOWO(AM), Ft. Wayne, Ind. - Federated Media; WJNA(AM), West Palm Beach, Fla. - James Crystal Holdings; KZIA(FM), Cedar Rapids, Iowa - KZIA, Inc.; KMRY(AM), Cedar Rapids, Iowa - Sellers Broadcasting; WASE(FM), Elizabethtown, Ky. - W&B Broadcasting; WRHC(AM), Miami, - WRHC Management; WXGI(AM), Richmond, Va. - Gee Communications, Inc. Several stations have purchased HD Radio transmitters from Harris' Z-HD line, including WNWV(FM), KZIA(FM), WCLV(FM) and WASE(FM). Cleveland Classical station WRMR(AM) has upgraded its Gates 5 transmitter and WJNA(AM) has upgraded its Harris DX50 transmitter. KMRY(AM) and WXGI(AM) have each purchased a DAX transmitter from Harris' DAX 1-6kW line. From fredymcc@digitel.net Thu Feb 20 09:58:03 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: fredymcc@digitel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 20 Feb 2003 17:58:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 9322 invoked from network); 20 Feb 2003 17:58:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Feb 2003 17:58:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO grebe.mail.pas.earthlink.net) (207.217.120.46) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Feb 2003 17:58:01 -0000 Received: from 209-239-217-176.lax.jps.net ([209.239.217.176] helo=[209.239.215.221]) by grebe.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 18luxJ-00035d-00 for amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 09:57:57 -0800 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: fredymcc@digitel.net@mail.digitel.net Message-Id: Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 08:23:32 -0800 To: Subject: Corporate Radio Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" From: "Fred Y. McCutcheon" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=80587106 X-Yahoo-Profile: eighthmoon Even the New York Times is getting concerned over Big Radio. The Trouble With Corporate Radio: The Day the Protest Music Died By BRENT STAPLES [P] op music played a crucial role in the national debate over the Vietnam War. By the late 1960's, radio stations across the country were crackling with blatantly political songs that became mainstream hits. After the National Guard killed four antiwar demonstrators at Kent State University in Ohio in the spring of 1970, Crosby, Stills, Nash and Young recorded a song, simply titled "Ohio," about the horror of the event, criticizing President Richard Nixon by name. The song was rushed onto the air while sentiment was still high, and became both an antiwar anthem and a huge moneymaker. A comparable song about George W. Bush's rush to war in Iraq would have no chance at all today. There are plenty of angry people, many with prime music-buying demographics. But independent radio stations that once would have played edgy, political music have been gobbled up by corporations that control hundreds of stations and have no wish to rock the boat. Corporate ownership has changed what gets played - and who plays it. With a few exceptions, the disc jockeys who once existed to discover provocative new music have long since been put out to pasture. The new generation operates from play lists dictated by Corporate Central - lists that some D.J.'s describe as "wallpaper music." Recording artists were seen as hysterics when they complained during the 1990's that radio was killing popular music by playing too little of it. But musicians have turned out to be the canaries in the coal mine - the first group to be affected by a 1996 federal law that allowed corporations to gobble up hundreds of stations, limiting expression over airwaves that are merely licensed to broadcasters but owned by the American public. When a media giant swallows a station, it typically fires the staff and pipes in music along with something that resembles news via satellite. To make the local public think that things have remained the same, the voice track system sometimes includes references to local matters sprinkled into the broadcast. What my rock 'n' roll colleague William Safire describes as the "ruination of independent radio" started with corporatizing in the 1980's but took off dramatically when the Telecommunications Act of 1996 increased the number of stations that one entity could own in a single market and permitted companies to buy up as many stations nationally as their deep pockets would allow. The new rules were billed as an effort to increase radio diversity, but they appear to have had the opposite effect. Under the old rules, the top two owners had 115 stations between them. Today, the top two own more than 1,400 stations. In many major markets, a few corporations control 80 percent of the listenership or more. Liberal Democrats are horrified by the legion of conservative talk show hosts who dominate the airwaves. But the problem stretches across party lines. National Journal reported last month that Representative Mark Foley, Republican of Florida, was finding it difficult to reach his constituents over the air since national radio companies moved into his district, reducing the number of local stations from five to one. Senator Byron Dorgan, Democrat of North Dakota, had a potential disaster in his district when a freight train carrying anhydrous ammonia derailed, releasing a deadly cloud over the city of Minot. When the emergency alert system failed, the police called the town radio stations, six of which are owned by the corporate giant Clear Channel. According to news accounts, no one answered the phone at the stations for more than an hour and a half. Three hundred people were hospitalized, some partially blinded by the ammonia. Pets and livestock were killed. The perils of consolidation can be seen clearly in the music world. Different stations play formats labeled "adult contemporary," "active rock," "contemporary hit radio" and so on. But studies show that the formats are often different in name only - and that as many as 50 percent of the songs played in one format can be found in other formats as well. The point of these sterile play lists is to continually repeat songs that challenge nothing and no one, blending in large blocks of commercials. Senator Russell Feingold of Wisconsin has introduced a bill that would require close scrutiny of mergers that could potentially put the majority of the country's radio stations in a single corporation's hands. Lawmakers who missed last month's Senate hearings on this issue should get hold of the testimony offered by the singer and songwriter Don Henley, best known as a member of the Eagles, the rock band. Mr. Henley's Senate testimony recalled the Congressional payola hearings of 1959-60, which showed the public how disc jockeys were accepting bribes to spin records on the air. Now, Mr. Henley said, record companies must pay large sums to "independent promoters," who intercede with radio conglomerates to get songs on the air. Those fees, Mr. Henley said in a recent telephone interview, sometimes reach $400,000. Which brings us back to the hypothetical pop song attacking George Bush. The odds against such a song reaching the air are steep from the outset, given a conservative corporate structure that controls thousands of stations. Record executives who know the lay of land take the path of least resistance when deciding where to spend their promotional money. This flight to sameness and superficiality is narrowing the range of what Americans hear on the radio - and killing popular music. Fred McCutcheon -- "You see, wire telegraph is a kind of a very, very long cat (>^..^<). You pull his tail in New York and his head is meowing in Los Angeles. Do you understand this? And radio operates exactly the same way: you send signals here, they receive them there. The only difference is that there is no cat." Albert Einstein From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Feb 20 10:13:24 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 20 Feb 2003 18:13:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 55873 invoked from network); 20 Feb 2003 18:13:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Feb 2003 18:13:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d05.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Feb 2003 18:13:17 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.ca.183b3b07 (4362) for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 13:13:06 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 13:13:06 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} 1190 WOWO to go IBOC (& more) To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 7.0 for Windows sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > WXGI(AM) have each purchased a DAX transmitter from > Harris' DAX 1-6kW line. > Just a side note folks...WXGI used to be in recent years,AM Stereo. They may have the old AM stereo exciter and modulation monitor around...I'll have to check with my contact person. WXGI is quite a nice little station..has the small town sound in a big city setting.Studios are quite spacious as well.Had to fix a satellite dish problem 7 years ago there. The former owners of the stations that I work for now,her father used to own that station.Sadly though he has passed on. We have many old Drake reel to reels around WGAI with the WXGI calls stamped on the boxes.Most of the music is the old 50-80's soft rock variety. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net Echolink node # 56704 -- 146.590 VHF,440.850 UHF (PL 131.8) _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From n0uiheric@aol.com Thu Feb 20 10:51:56 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 20 Feb 2003 18:51:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 51041 invoked from network); 20 Feb 2003 18:51:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Feb 2003 18:51:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m05.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.8) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Feb 2003 18:51:54 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-m05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.103.27ac50b2 (3956) for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 13:51:48 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <103.27ac50b2.2b867dc4@aol.com> Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 13:51:48 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Designing a receiver? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih But, with a growing number of commercial radio stations refusing to air emergency broadcasts for their markets, the need for NOAA Weather Radio tuning capability in car radios, I think, is vital. One could plug in a scanner to an MP3 player jack (if your car radio has one), but it would be better if one had both NOAA Weather Radio and shortwave capabilities (which doesn't require an additional antenna; all these bands could be received with a typical car radio antenna) in a car radio (instead of the more expensive XM or Sirius satellite radio, which requires an additional antenna). Actually, it would be cheaper to have shortwave in the long run. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Thu Feb 20 10:51:57 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 20 Feb 2003 18:51:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 41661 invoked from network); 20 Feb 2003 18:51:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Feb 2003 18:51:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m03.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.6) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Feb 2003 18:51:56 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-m03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.2b.396e58c7 (3956) for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 13:51:48 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <2b.396e58c7.2b867dc3@aol.com> Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 13:51:47 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Designing a receiver? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih Sorry, but you're wrong. Most Americans cannot afford XM or Sirius. Shortwave radio's advantage is that it's FREE. I won't pay $120 per year for a year of radio programming, when I could get just as much from shortwave for no charge. American listeners should never accept being nickel-and-dimed to death. With all the money saved from subscription fees, they should have the maximum amount of programming available for free. That's why we need shortwave more than XM or Sirius (and Clear Channel owns a piece of XM; I won't do business with CC because of the way they treated me when I was searching for on-air work). 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Thu Feb 20 10:52:01 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 20 Feb 2003 18:52:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 41741 invoked from network); 20 Feb 2003 18:51:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Feb 2003 18:51:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r09.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.105) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Feb 2003 18:51:57 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-r09.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.105.283ba151 (3956) for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 13:51:47 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <105.283ba151.2b867dc2@aol.com> Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 13:51:46 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Digest Number 592 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih No, KFI has always been a I-A. CMQ, until Cuba started violating international treaties, had to protect KFI. 640 is internationally assigned as a United States Class I-A Clear Channel, with the primary station being KFI Los Angeles. CMQ was NEVER the primary on 640. U.S. stations on 640 east of the Mississippi don't have to protect CMQ...just each other and KFI. They also have to protect adjacent channel stations on 630 (like KJSL, CFCO and WMAL) and 650 (notably WSM). This is why WWLS Norman, OK is dominant on 640 in this area, with WOI Ames, IA and WCRV Collierville, TN a close second. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Thu Feb 20 10:52:49 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 20 Feb 2003 18:52:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 65489 invoked from network); 20 Feb 2003 18:52:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Feb 2003 18:52:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m09.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.164) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Feb 2003 18:52:42 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-m09.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.12e.23793fd5 (3956) for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 13:51:52 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <12e.23793fd5.2b867dc7@aol.com> Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 13:51:51 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: AM Radio: Not Created for Local Broadcasting To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih Not many are, however. Norway is looking at reactivating their 1314 kHz transmitter because FM cannot adequately cover the country. Some of the mountainous countries may not be able to be adequately covered by FM, so they would have to use AM. The BBC's discontinuation of shortwave to North America has been a major mistake. The North American media market is actually deteriorating, and isn't as well-developed as it used to be due to rampant consolidation in the radio business. The FCC's proposal to further deregulate the media could mean the further deterioration of the U.S. media market. Most stations will only carry the BBC overnights; the only way the BBC can penetrate North America without shortwave is if a public broadcaster can buy up some of Clear Channel's AM stations (like WHAM 1180, KFI 640, WHAS 840 or KEX 1190) to provide relay stations for these broadcasts. Last I heard, the BBC is still using the VOA relay station at Delano, CA (near Bakersfield) for a relay to Central America. The CBC might have to keep AM stations in the central and western provinces because you would need some 300 kW ERP on FM to cover the same amount of area an AM station (most are on lower channels, like CBW Winnipeg, MB on 990) can cover. The terrain in the Canadian Rockies is too irregular to support FM, therefore, it would be logical to keep AM stations in Edmonton and Calgary. It's the same way in the mountainous areas around Vancouver. I don't think the CBC would abandon shortwave. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Thu Feb 20 10:58:33 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 20 Feb 2003 18:58:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 57092 invoked from network); 20 Feb 2003 18:58:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Feb 2003 18:58:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r09.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.105) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Feb 2003 18:58:32 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-r09.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.9b.345b1118 (3956) for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 13:58:14 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <9b.345b1118.2b867f46@aol.com> Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 13:58:14 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} 1190 WOWO to go IBOC (& more) To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih Look out for more interference! 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From jsgil@hal-pc.org Thu Feb 20 12:55:20 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 20 Feb 2003 20:55:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 65873 invoked from network); 20 Feb 2003 20:55:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Feb 2003 20:55:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.67) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Feb 2003 20:55:14 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.133] by n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 20 Feb 2003 20:55:11 -0000 Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 20:55:11 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Corporate Radio Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 7365 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.242 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Fred Y. McCutcheon" wrote: Evry time a national publication publishes the issues of corporate monopilistic radio it shows that the concern is not going away and that it is also a matter of concern in Congress. Let's hope that this sentiment is contagous and snowballs to the point that it will become a major issue and dealt with before radio as we used to know it collapses in on itself. It used to be a privilidge to be a broadcaster and to serve the local community in times of need but remote control corporate radio does not have the capacity to do this and the spirit within has no desire and is entirely self serving. The older vision of radio at the local level in times of need was to provide a venu for the community to address issues, inform the people and orchestrate activities to address problems. IBOC couldn't have come at a worse time for the AM band when this band is the primary means of getting information to the public during an emergency. JSG > Even the New York Times is getting concerned over Big Radio. > > The Trouble With Corporate Radio: The Day the Protest Music Died > By BRENT STAPLES > > [P] op music played a crucial role in the national debate over the > Vietnam War. By the late 1960's, radio stations across the country > were crackling with blatantly political songs that became mainstream > hits. After the National Guard killed four antiwar demonstrators at > Kent State University in Ohio in the spring of 1970, Crosby, Stills, > Nash and Young recorded a song, simply titled "Ohio," about the > horror of the event, criticizing President Richard Nixon by name. The > song was rushed onto the air while sentiment was still high, and > became both an antiwar anthem and a huge moneymaker. > > A comparable song about George W. Bush's rush to war in Iraq would > have no chance at all today. There are plenty of angry people, many > with prime music-buying demographics. But independent radio stations > that once would have played edgy, political music have been gobbled > up by corporations that control hundreds of stations and have no wish > to rock the boat. Corporate ownership has changed what gets played - > and who plays it. With a few exceptions, the disc jockeys who once > existed to discover provocative new music have long since been put > out to pasture. The new generation operates from play lists dictated > by Corporate Central - lists that some D.J.'s describe as "wallpaper > music." > > Recording artists were seen as hysterics when they complained during > the 1990's that radio was killing popular music by playing too little > of it. But musicians have turned out to be the canaries in the coal > mine - the first group to be affected by a 1996 federal law that > allowed corporations to gobble up hundreds of stations, limiting > expression over airwaves that are merely licensed to broadcasters but > owned by the American public. > > When a media giant swallows a station, it typically fires the staff > and pipes in music along with something that resembles news via > satellite. To make the local public think that things have remained > the same, the voice track system sometimes includes references to > local matters sprinkled into the broadcast. > > What my rock 'n' roll colleague William Safire describes as the > "ruination of independent radio" started with corporatizing in the > 1980's but took off dramatically when the Telecommunications Act of > 1996 increased the number of stations that one entity could own in a > single market and permitted companies to buy up as many stations > nationally as their deep pockets would allow. > > The new rules were billed as an effort to increase radio diversity, > but they appear to have had the opposite effect. Under the old rules, > the top two owners had 115 stations between them. Today, the top two > own more than 1,400 stations. In many major markets, a few > corporations control 80 percent of the listenership or more. > > Liberal Democrats are horrified by the legion of conservative talk > show hosts who dominate the airwaves. But the problem stretches > across party lines. National Journal reported last month that > Representative Mark Foley, Republican of Florida, was finding it > difficult to reach his constituents over the air since national radio > companies moved into his district, reducing the number of local > stations from five to one. Senator Byron Dorgan, Democrat of North > Dakota, had a potential disaster in his district when a freight train > carrying anhydrous ammonia derailed, releasing a deadly cloud over > the city of Minot. When the emergency alert system failed, the police > called the town radio stations, six of which are owned by the > corporate giant Clear Channel. According to news accounts, no one > answered the phone at the stations for more than an hour and a half. > Three hundred people were hospitalized, some partially blinded by the > ammonia. Pets and livestock were killed. > > The perils of consolidation can be seen clearly in the music world. > Different stations play formats labeled "adult contemporary," "active > rock," "contemporary hit radio" and so on. But studies show that the > formats are often different in name only - and that as many as 50 > percent of the songs played in one format can be found in other > formats as well. The point of these sterile play lists is to > continually repeat songs that challenge nothing and no one, blending > in large blocks of commercials. > > Senator Russell Feingold of Wisconsin has introduced a bill that > would require close scrutiny of mergers that could potentially put > the majority of the country's radio stations in a single > corporation's hands. Lawmakers who missed last month's Senate > hearings on this issue should get hold of the testimony offered by > the singer and songwriter Don Henley, best known as a member of the > Eagles, the rock band. > > Mr. Henley's Senate testimony recalled the Congressional payola > hearings of 1959-60, which showed the public how disc jockeys were > accepting bribes to spin records on the air. Now, Mr. Henley said, > record companies must pay large sums to "independent promoters," who > intercede with radio conglomerates to get songs on the air. Those > fees, Mr. Henley said in a recent telephone interview, sometimes > reach $400,000. > > Which brings us back to the hypothetical pop song attacking George > Bush. The odds against such a song reaching the air are steep from > the outset, given a conservative corporate structure that controls > thousands of stations. Record executives who know the lay of land > take the path of least resistance when deciding where to spend their > promotional money. This flight to sameness and superficiality is > narrowing the range of what Americans hear on the radio - and killing > popular music. > > Fred McCutcheon > -- > "You see, wire telegraph is a kind of a very, very long cat (>^..^<). > You pull his tail in New York and his head is meowing in Los Angeles. > Do you understand this? And radio operates exactly the same way: you > send signals here, they receive them there. The only difference is > that there is no cat." > Albert Einstein From jbyrns@rcn.com Thu Feb 20 12:59:23 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@rcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 20 Feb 2003 20:59:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 55542 invoked from network); 20 Feb 2003 20:59:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Feb 2003 20:59:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Feb 2003 20:59:23 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.162] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 20 Feb 2003 20:59:22 -0000 Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 20:59:21 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: Designing a receiver? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <103.27ac50b2.2b867dc4@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 835 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bta_50g " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.27 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=138635554 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, n0uiheric@a... wrote: > but it would be better if one had both NOAA Weather Radio and > shortwave capabilities (which doesn't require an additional antenna; > all these bands could be received with a typical car radio antenna) > in a car radio (instead of the more expensive XM or Sirius satellite > radio, which requires an additional antenna). You may want short-wave capabilities in your car radio, but somehow I don't see the general public getting excited about this idea, if people really wanted it, it would be more widely available as an option now, and you wouldn't have to depend on the government to force it down peoples throats. > Actually, it would be cheaper to have shortwave in the long run. An extra cost that people don't want is never cheaper "in the long run." John From jbyrns@rcn.com Thu Feb 20 13:12:07 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@rcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 20 Feb 2003 21:12:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 40622 invoked from network); 20 Feb 2003 21:12:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Feb 2003 21:12:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Feb 2003 21:12:06 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.137] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 20 Feb 2003 21:12:06 -0000 Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 21:12:03 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: AM Radio: Not Created for Local Broadcasting Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <12e.23793fd5.2b867dc7@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 427 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bta_50g " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.27 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=138635554 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, n0uiheric@a... wrote: > Most stations will only carry the BBC overnights; the only way the > BBC can penetrate North America without shortwave is if a public > broadcaster can buy up some of Clear Channel's AM stations (like > WHAM 1180, KFI 640, WHAS 840 or KEX 1190) to provide relay stations > for these broadcasts. The BBC penetrates North America now via their channel on XM. John From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Feb 20 15:16:18 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 20 Feb 2003 23:16:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 62059 invoked from network); 20 Feb 2003 23:16:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Feb 2003 23:16:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r03.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.99) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Feb 2003 23:16:16 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.19f.111ac614 (30950) for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 18:16:07 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <19f.111ac614.2b86bbb7@aol.com> Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 18:16:07 EST Subject: WGXI--IBOC and analog stereo gear--the scoop! To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Well I talked with someone at WXGI this afternoon...here is the deal. Looks like all that is keeping WXGI-950 AM from going digital today is the wait on the arrival of a new transmitter.The new tranny is due in April..with the digital conversion to take place in mid April. The conversion will be done by a Harris rep. WXGI still holds in their possession the C-Quam gear....no prices were talked about,but they are interested in selling the C-Quam gear.For those interested contact: Howard Keller 804 233 7666 Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.kc4qlp.cjb.net Echolink node # 56704 -- 146.590 VHF,440.850 UHF (PL 131.8) Proposed Repeater 145.250 _______________________________________________________ From ai4i@hotmail.com Thu Feb 20 15:30:43 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ai4i@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 20 Feb 2003 23:30:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 27408 invoked from network); 20 Feb 2003 23:30:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Feb 2003 23:30:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (207.68.164.201) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Feb 2003 23:30:43 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 15:30:42 -0800 To: References: <1045769501.358.79642.m12@yahoogroups.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Digest Number 595 Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 18:30:37 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 20 Feb 2003 23:30:42.0931 (UTC) FILETIME=[15F10C30:01C2D938] From: "Joel Wilson" Reply-To: "Joel Wilson" X-Originating-IP: [216.77.209.188] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=127893550 X-Yahoo-Profile: ai4ijoel I will reply to both of Timothy's comments together. It really doesn't matter whether CMQ was exclusive dominant or shared dominant, CMQ has been on the air since before I can remember, while WJNA is a relatively new entity. As I had mentioned earlier, I think WJNA was our government's way of messing with Castro. As for XM & SI, both are absolutely wonderful services. Over the past year, I have learned a lot about music genres I had never been exposed to, and hearing them with near-CD quality 24/7 is just incredible. It is the realization of the feeling I had on that distant Sunday when The Beatles sang "All you need is love" to the first worldwide television audience over a passive aluminum reflector in the sky. To say that the majority of Americans can not afford a $10 monthly subscription is naive in a marketplace where people spend upwards of $100 for cable or satellite TV, the same for wireless telephony, and half that for high speed www connectivity, still five times the cost for the premium radio service. I do believe that there will always be a place for terrestrial broadcasting: Minority language and ethnic broadcasts Home shopping on radio Tourist Information Radio And of course, reactionary and racist televangelists. Joel Wilson Hello Taxi AI4I ========================================= Proud 2-B a pioneering satellite radio subscriber AI4I is always on the trailing edge of technology ========================================= > > Message: 13 > Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 13:51:47 EST > From: n0uiheric@aol.com > Subject: Re: Designing a receiver? > > Sorry, but you're wrong. Most Americans cannot afford XM or Sirius. Shortwave > radio's advantage is that it's FREE. I won't pay $120 per year for a year of > radio programming, when I could get just as much from shortwave for no > charge. American listeners should never accept being nickel-and-dimed to > death. With all the money saved from subscription fees, they should have the > maximum amount of programming available for free. That's why we need > shortwave more than XM or Sirius (and Clear Channel owns a piece of XM; I > won't do business with CC because of the way they treated me when I was > searching for on-air work). > > Message: 14 > Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 13:51:46 EST > From: n0uiheric@aol.com > Subject: Re: Digest Number 592 > > No, KFI has always been a I-A. CMQ, until Cuba started violating > international treaties, had to protect KFI. 640 is internationally assigned > as a United States Class I-A Clear Channel, with the primary station being > KFI Los Angeles. CMQ was NEVER the primary on 640. > U.S. stations on 640 east of the Mississippi don't have to protect CMQ...just > each other and KFI. They also have to protect adjacent channel stations on > 630 (like KJSL, CFCO and WMAL) and 650 (notably WSM). This is why WWLS > Norman, OK is dominant on 640 in this area, with WOI Ames, IA and WCRV > Collierville, TN a close second. From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Feb 20 15:37:16 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 20 Feb 2003 23:37:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 10888 invoked from network); 20 Feb 2003 23:37:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Feb 2003 23:37:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d06.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.38) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Feb 2003 23:37:15 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.32.34660a71 (30950) for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 18:36:50 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <32.34660a71.2b86c090@aol.com> Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 18:36:48 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Designing a receiver? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp << But, with a growing number of commercial radio stations refusing to air emergency broadcasts for their markets, the need for NOAA Weather Radio tuning capability in car radios, >> NOAA has one disadvantage..which is slowly fading,the sometimes hard to understand man in a box that NOAA uses on their stations. I've heard here in my area many names of localities get butchered up. Example ..Pasquotank County (pronounced Pass-quo-tank) pronounced by the man in the box as Pass-quote-tank) ..or Chowan County (pronounced as Ch-o-wan) pronounced incorrectly as Chow-wan. I could state many examples,but you get the drift. Seems like slowly the National weather service is "fixing" this little man in the box so he sounds more realistic and is able to pronounce the names of cities,towns and counties correctly. Thats way many stations refuse to air what comes from NOAA. Myself personally here everything goes when it comes to emergency information and communication. Spoke with one of the weather specialist from the Wakefield Va office of NOAA last spring during Skywarn training in regards to a problem the weather service is having with one of their transmitters during their weekly EAS test. The response I received was..I was the only one that had made mention of their little technical difficulty during EAS test..and that my group of stations must be the only ones around paying them any attention. Having done some listening around when time permits shows how sadly true this fact is. What is even more sad is when I can beat the primary and secondary EAS stations in my area to the "punch" when it comes to getting the information out there. Many time I'll find those guys to be as much as 2 to 5 minutes behind me.Not good when you have seconds and not minutes to get out of harms way. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.qsl.net/kc4qlp Echolink node # 56704 -- 146.590 VHF,440.850 UHF (PL 131.8) Proposed Repeater-145.250 _______________________________________________________ From powell@conterra.com Thu Feb 20 15:39:40 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: powell@conterra.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 20 Feb 2003 23:39:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 45857 invoked from network); 20 Feb 2003 23:39:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 20 Feb 2003 23:39:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mx.matrixconsulting.net) (65.199.24.6) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 20 Feb 2003 23:39:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 11285 invoked from network); 20 Feb 2003 23:39:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO bsae-skqpk3w8p5) (66.112.193.103) by mx.matrixconsulting.net with SMTP; 20 Feb 2003 23:39:37 -0000 Organization: BEARly Organized To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 18:39:36 -0500 Subject: More smoke and mirrors and burned up coverage... Message-ID: <3E5520E8.18771.6542BA@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: <1045451172.14000.21440.m9@yahoogroups.com> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.01) From: "Powell E. Way III" Reply-To: powell@conterra.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=8062869 X-Yahoo-Profile: W4OPW On 17 Feb 2003 at 3:06, amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com wrote: > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum> Message: 8 > Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 18:34:03 -0000 > From: "John " > Subject: Re: Smoke and mirrors ? > > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, powell@c... wrote: > > Our well beloved John Byrns, our designated whipping boy, would > > like us to believe that reclassifying a non DA clear channel to a B > > with a DA would have no ramifications on a stations night local > > service. > > Powell, you seem to be taking the tack, tell a big enough lie, and > people will believe you. I am not sure where you came up with this > lie about DA's that you are attributing to me? All I said was that if > it was mine to do, I would reclassify the class A's, to class B's. I'm not lying. IF you are going to reclassify to a B, then they are a B. No fudging. I > didn't say anything about requiring the former class A's to use > directional antennas. What I said about DA's, is that reclassifying > the class A's as class B's would allow some of the other class B's on > the "clear" channels to let out their nighttime DA patterns, to > improve their local nighttime coverage, which in many cases has > problems due to the growth of their metropolitan area. The former > class A's would retain their original facilities, why would > reclassifying them as class B's require any change in their > facilities? Because the rules may say so. But wait... Granted the nighttime coverage of the former class A > stations would be reduced by this proposal, mostly by the elimination > of protected skywave coverage, but I seriously doubt that this would > have a significant economic impact on the operation of these stations, > it would mostly be a wound to their pride. In exchange for this loss > of skywave coverage by a handful of stations, many more stations would > be able to improve their nighttime coverage in their local area. It would in many cases cut the local coverage to 30 to 40 miles or less. > > First of all, to do so would require moving a station, and in a > > major metropolitan area the move would most likely have to be > > substantial, and it might not even be possible to find real estate > > to do this with. Then what do you do? Turn the station off? > > Huh, why would they have to move? The only thing the former class A > stations would have to do is tack a new piece of paper up on the wall, > hardly something that would require a move. IF they were forced to bo DA, yes they would...that's IF > But ignoring my plan, which doesn't require any move of the class A's, > sooner or later some of the class A's are going to have to move for > one reason or another, and face a potential downgrade to 35,000 Watts > by the FCC. I don't understand why you think this would be reason to > "Turn the station off"? At that power level the signal would not be very good. I bet if that does happen, there will be a > long line of applicants waiting to get those abandoned class A > allocations, a 35,000 Watt omni directional clear channel station > seems a like lot better than nothing. Somewhat better than nothing. I assume, but don't know, that > the stations that may face this dilemma in the future might be able to > retain a power of 50,000 Watts if they installed a mild directional > antenna, which might be to their advantage in serving their City of > License anyway, if they are forced to move further out. It's been documented that VERY little skywave interference can wreak havoc to a 50 clear well in the local area. And IF you are going to reclassify eveyone as a B, those stations that are downgraded then need to follow the same rules, otherwise you are talking out of both sides of your mouth. Don't forget that a B also has to protect adjacents. When WOWO's forced downgrade to 9800 watts occurred, that wasn't the only thing. The then 3 tower pattern casts a VERY tight null to protect KEX. The minor null NE was made much more pronounced to protect WLIB, and also a null over a large part of Fort Wayne. IF the ground conductivity were not a 15 ( and the whole COL area is not) the night signal would be totally useless. We have a DA 840 here (WCEO) in Columbia. A lot of evenings WCEO at 50 K is unulistenable close to sunset due to WHAS. At 50,000 watts NON DA it would receive TERRIBLE interference and so would WHAS. When WCEO was doing tests one night, I called a friend of mine who used to live 25 miles from WHAS and WCEO was indeed causing substantial interference to the signal ( at 2 AM). And EVEN if the B rules which state you protect only to the 2mv/m groundwave contour, skywave is funny and often the interference will be FAR worse that projected, and some nights not. So, I just think John, you want to destroy ANY skywave reception and overlooking that it will destroy local coverage to a moderate to even a great extent. Let us not forget that some metro areas have grown so much that a low end 50 K non DA will have skywave on a major portion of the night signal, and this may not be desired if selective fading is a problem ( not everyone has a Sony ICF-2010....];) ) ! And that's what I have to say. Powell From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Thu Feb 20 16:46:06 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 21 Feb 2003 00:46:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 74016 invoked from network); 21 Feb 2003 00:46:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Feb 2003 00:46:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web41015.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.93.14) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Feb 2003 00:46:04 -0000 Message-ID: <20030221004604.81627.qmail@web41015.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.35.217] by web41015.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 16:46:04 PST Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 16:46:04 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: {AMSF} WGXI [sic]--IBOC and analog stereo gear--the scoop! To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: <19f.111ac614.2b86bbb7@aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio That sucks about WXGI but good luck on your repeater! Also, do you have IRLP capabilities? Not surprising about WXGI though because the only stereo pilot I saw while around Richmond was on 1240. I've forgotten the calls. 73, Jay,N1WVQ __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Feb 20 17:12:45 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 21 Feb 2003 01:12:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 35970 invoked from network); 21 Feb 2003 01:12:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Feb 2003 01:12:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m09.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.164) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Feb 2003 01:12:39 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m09.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.24.37f1baf9 (16781) for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 20:12:31 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <24.37f1baf9.2b86d6ff@aol.com> Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 20:12:31 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} WGXI [sic]--IBOC and analog stereo gear--the scoop! To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 2/20/03 7:47:08 PM Eastern Standard Time, a1asurfradio@yahoo.com writes: << That sucks about WXGI but good luck on your repeater! Also, do you have IRLP capabilities? Not surprising about WXGI though because the only stereo pilot I saw while around Richmond was on 1240. I've forgotten the calls. 73, Jay,N1WVQ >> I havent checked 1240 up there in a while...so who knows,Richmond's radio market is like a woman with serve PMS..constantly changing..with the attitude to boot! As far as WXGI is concerned..they havent been operating with the C-Quam gear for 2..maybe close to 3 years now. As far as the proposed repeater here....it wont have IRLP capabilities..only Echolink. when the repeater goes up..I'll move the Echolink node off of 2 meter simplex to the repeater and leave the simplex access to Echolink on 70cm. There is however a 70cm repeater on the Outer Banks that has IRLP access that is seldom used.....they radio group down there is going to add Echolink to that same 70cm repeater and tie the two together. Its becoming common place to see nodes linked to eQSO and IRLP on Echolink. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.qsl.net/kc4qlp Echolink node # 56704 -- 146.590 VHF,440.850 UHF (PL 131.8) Proposed Repeater-145.250 _______________________________________________________ From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Thu Feb 20 18:24:38 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 21 Feb 2003 02:24:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 75901 invoked from network); 21 Feb 2003 02:24:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Feb 2003 02:24:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web41010.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.93.9) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Feb 2003 02:24:37 -0000 Message-ID: <20030221022437.38727.qmail@web41010.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.35.217] by web41010.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 18:24:37 PST Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 18:24:37 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: {AMSF} WGXI [sic]--IBOC and analog stereo gear--the scoop! To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: <24.37f1baf9.2b86d6ff@aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio Yes, my friend Jed, N1JBC has an IRLP node on simplex 146.41, which will at some point get moved to his repeater on 447.025. Also, I learned of an Echolink microsimplexer on 146.595 in Dartmouth, Ma. which I doubt I can hit. Every market is getting like Richmond now. Providence has had 93.3 (WSNE-FM Taunton, Ma.) go from "93-3 WSNE" to all Christmas music in November to "The all new Star 93-3" in December only to get sued by Star 93-7 out of Boston. It then became "The All New 93-3" in January. OY! 73, Jay,N1WVQ __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ From KC4QLP@aol.com Thu Feb 20 20:49:45 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 21 Feb 2003 04:49:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 45929 invoked from network); 21 Feb 2003 04:49:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Feb 2003 04:49:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r03.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.99) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Feb 2003 04:49:44 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.ce.34a039c1 (3850) for ; Thu, 20 Feb 2003 23:49:33 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 23:49:33 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} WGXI [sic]--IBOC and analog stereo gear--the scoop! To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 7.0 for Windows sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 2/20/03 9:26:04 PM Eastern Standard Time, a1asurfradio@yahoo.com writes: <> Well according to www.echolinkmap.org, there is a 70 cm repeater on 444.950 in Coventry RI running Echolink..so that might be a possible hit for you. <> Nothing is safe anymore...even naming your station that is similar to an out of market station. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area. e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC Ray Communications Radio Network AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com KC4QLP Amateur Radio Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.qsl.net/kc4qlp Echolink node # 56704 -- 146.590 VHF,440.850 UHF (PL 131.8) Proposed Repeater--145.250 _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Thu Feb 20 21:38:11 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 63402 invoked from network); 21 Feb 2003 05:38:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Feb 2003 05:38:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.75) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Feb 2003 05:38:09 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: notify@yahoogroups.com Received: from [66.218.67.154] by n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 21 Feb 2003 05:38:08 -0000 Date: 21 Feb 2003 05:38:07 -0000 Message-ID: <1045805887.728.30497.w33@yahoogroups.com> X-eGroups-Application: files X-Yahoo-Group-Post: system From: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: New file uploaded to amstereoforum MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello, This email message is a notification to let you know that a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the amstereoforum group. File : /intro.txt Uploaded by : kevtronics Description : The introductory letter that is sent to new AM Stereo Forum members at time of subscription. This file is placed here for administrative purposes, although current Forum members are encouraged to read it as well. You can access this file at the URL http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum/files/intro.txt To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/files Regards, kevtronics From jsgil@hal-pc.org Thu Feb 20 22:48:43 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 21 Feb 2003 06:48:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 8930 invoked from network); 21 Feb 2003 06:48:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Feb 2003 06:48:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.69) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Feb 2003 06:48:41 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.168] by n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 21 Feb 2003 06:48:41 -0000 Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 06:48:39 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: KTRH off the Air again Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 348 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst Enjoy your DXing around 740KHz now for those who usually get pounded by the signal. I think it was last Friday they went down also so they must be doing some sort of scheduled maintenance. Their site is unrevealing to what is going on but I hope they aren't prepairing for IBOC. If it is then it may be the 1st for IBOC to be tested on a DA. JSG From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Feb 20 23:39:44 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 21 Feb 2003 07:39:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 83396 invoked from network); 21 Feb 2003 07:39:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Feb 2003 07:39:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Feb 2003 07:39:43 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.162] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 21 Feb 2003 07:39:43 -0000 Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 07:39:43 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: KTRH off the Air again Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1204 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.96.2 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > If it is then it may be the 1st for IBOC to be tested on a DA. 710 WOR is a directional signal using IBOC, with three towers aiming the signal mostly towards NYC, with a secondary "legacy" lobe aimed at Philadelphia but also covering central NJ. In the early stages of IBOC testing, I heard from Nassau Broadcasting's engineer that IBOC could not be used on a directional AM signal; that is why they tested it on 1680 WTTM, rather than on 1040 WJHR (now WCHR), despite the fact that both stations have Harris DX-10 transmitters, which was one of the first to be approved for IBOC broadcasts -- 1040 is directional through a 5-tower array, while 1680 is non-directional at all times. However, with the current variation of the IBOC system, it appears that any directional signal is fine, as long as it can cleanly transmit the +/-15 kHz bandwidth necessary for the digital sidebands. Obviously, reception conditions "in the field" may vary, and may be compromised by nulls and phasing effects -- just as analog AM is -- but at least theoretically, there is no reason why even 1190 KFXR in Dallas, TX, with *12 towers* at night and a separate 4-tower daytime array, couldn't use IBOC. From n0uiheric@aol.com Thu Feb 20 23:42:00 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 21 Feb 2003 07:42:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 28253 invoked from network); 21 Feb 2003 07:42:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Feb 2003 07:42:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d04.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.36) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Feb 2003 07:41:59 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-d04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.1cd.3534837 (4012) for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 02:41:52 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1cd.3534837.2b87323f@aol.com> Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 02:41:51 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: AM Radio: Not Created for Local Broadcasting To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih But, who has XM? Very few people can actually afford it. The BBC would better penetrate North America via AM radio for free than forcing people to pay $11 per month for XM. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Thu Feb 20 23:42:23 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 21 Feb 2003 07:42:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 83189 invoked from network); 21 Feb 2003 07:42:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Feb 2003 07:42:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r06.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.102) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Feb 2003 07:42:23 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-r06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.130.1b636e14 (4012) for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 02:42:18 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <130.1b636e14.2b87325a@aol.com> Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 02:42:18 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Designing a receiver? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih There, your logic is flawed. Marketplace-driven ideas are a FAILURE. Remember what happened when the FCC took the "hands off" approach with AM Stereo? The FCC should have taken a "hands on" approach to begin with. The so-called "extra cost" of shortwave is a ONE-TIME ONLY expense. Why pay $120 per year for XM when it only delivers, at best, FM-quality sound, and doesn't get through mountains and tall buildings like shortwave does? Who cares about the so-called "people" when it's the PROGRAMMING that matters. What alternatives are there when XM delivers the same low-quality programming (apart from the foreign broadcasters) that majority investor Clear Channel delivers? What alternatives are there when you can't stand what commercial radio offers? And when you don't have enough public radio stations serving you, what's the alternative? Answer: SHORTWAVE. Shortwave radio should not be optional on all radios for the home or car. It should be MANDATORY. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Feb 21 01:49:20 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 21 Feb 2003 09:49:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 52982 invoked from network); 21 Feb 2003 09:49:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Feb 2003 09:49:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.69) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Feb 2003 09:49:20 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.158] by n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 21 Feb 2003 09:49:19 -0000 Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 09:49:17 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: BBC World Service -- shortwave vs. XM vs. AM Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <1cd.3534837.2b87323f@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1094 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.96.2 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > But, who has XM? Very few people can actually afford it. The BBC > would better penetrate North America via AM radio for free than > forcing people to pay $11 per month for XM. I wouldn't get too antsy about demanding free access to the Beeb... remember, over in the U.K., you have to pay just to watch regular broadcast TV -- the infamous "Telly Tax". So, whether it is over shortwave, on a local radio station, or on the web, you should be thankful for the existing methods you have for accessing the BBC's high quality radio programming free of charge. And although certainly there are benefits to their inclusion, receivers for both the Shortwave and NOAA weather bands are generally available enough and at reasonable prices that a mandate to include these bands in all radios would *never* realistically be approved, no matter how emphatic of a FCC petition you might come up with. After all, the FCC doesn't even require the inclusion of *FM* in all radios, so you'd have to fight that battle first before trying to convince them to mandate other bands in all receivers. From amstereoguy@hotmail.com Fri Feb 21 05:19:40 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereoguy@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 21 Feb 2003 13:19:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 89596 invoked from network); 21 Feb 2003 13:19:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Feb 2003 13:19:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (207.68.165.97) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Feb 2003 13:19:38 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 05:19:38 -0800 Received: from 208.228.96.20 by sea2fd.sea2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 13:19:38 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Last call for Alfredo Lites Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 08:19:38 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 21 Feb 2003 13:19:38.0572 (UTC) FILETIME=[E2B198C0:01C2D9AB] From: "Chris Cuff" X-Originating-IP: [208.228.96.20] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37866059 I have just listed my last 4 transmitters on ebay. Due to family duties (my dad going in for major surgery, which will consume all of my "spare" time for the next few months) I will be unable to make any more for the forseeble future. They are listed now, but untill they update listings, you can only find them by "search" , then "search by seller" ccuff is the name they are listed under. Shipping is free to list members in the USA. Chris _________________________________________________________________ Tired of spam? Get advanced junk mail protection with MSN 8. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Feb 21 10:17:09 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 21 Feb 2003 18:17:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 73554 invoked from network); 21 Feb 2003 18:17:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Feb 2003 18:17:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Feb 2003 18:17:07 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.181] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 21 Feb 2003 18:17:06 -0000 Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 18:17:06 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Sony SRF-A100 on eBay Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 458 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics This one is in mint condition, with the original case and literature. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2160999513 The seller says "I can't check out the AM Stereo (no stations near by)", but eBay shows them as being in the Dallas/Ft. Worth, Texas area, so I e-mailed them a listing of all the AM Stereo stations in Texas and of course recommended that they include a link to http://www.AMStereoRadio.com on the auction page. From jbyrns@rcn.com Fri Feb 21 12:41:39 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@rcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 21 Feb 2003 20:41:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 15827 invoked from network); 21 Feb 2003 20:41:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Feb 2003 20:41:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.89) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Feb 2003 20:41:35 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.179] by n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 21 Feb 2003 20:41:35 -0000 Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 20:41:34 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: More smoke and mirrors and burned up coverage... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3E5520E8.18771.6542BA@localhost> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2759 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bta_50g " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.114 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=138635554 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Powell E. Way III" < powell@c...> wrote: > > Powell, you seem to be taking the tack, tell a big enough lie, and > > people will believe you. I am not sure where you came up with > > this lie about DA's that you are attributing to me? All I said > > was that if it was mine to do, I would reclassify the class A's, > > to class B's. > > I'm not lying. IF you are going to reclassify to a B, then they are > a B. No fudging. Why can't I "fudge" My AM improvement plan is my fantasy, so I can do what ever I want, including fudge as much as I like. But for purposes of this argument, I am trying not to fudge anymore than the FCC is fudging already. The first phase of my plan, reassigning all the current class A stations as class B stations doesn't involve any physical changes to the stations facilities, which would be grandfathered as they currently exist. As part of this first step I would tighten up the class B interference rules slightly for stations that are proposing new facilities. Step two is to move many of the class B stations, which were once class II's, operating on clear channels, to new frequencies which would be opened up by the down grading of the class A's. These two steps would allow many of the former class II stations to improve their coverage, and simplify their transmission plant. I don't understand why you insist this down grading of the existing class A stations would require them to go directional? The one reason you have given is that as class B's they would be required to protect adjacent channel stations, but as near as I can tell, the current rules also require class A stations to protect adjacent channels, so this argument doesn't seem to work. Now it would be true that if these stations built new facilities, either as class A stations as they currently are, or as class B's under my AM improvement plan, they might have to reduce their power, or go directional, simply because the rules have been tightened up since they built their current facilities. But there is no reason why they would be forced to go directional just because of my AM improvement plan being put into effect. As evidence of the fact that many, if not all of the current class A stations don't meet the current interference requirements, the engineers from two local class A stations, that are dominant on their frequencies, have told me that they had considered moving for various reasons, and in both cases they would have had to down grade their power into the 30 kW range. Also look at the new facilities WOR is building, the FCC is requiring them to pull the nulls of their directional array in quite a bit, and WOR is a class A station. John From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Feb 21 13:25:35 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 21 Feb 2003 21:25:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 64302 invoked from network); 21 Feb 2003 21:25:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Feb 2003 21:25:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Feb 2003 21:25:33 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-76.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.76]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h1LLP0nF000110; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 15:25:04 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <001901c2d9f0$0ef04140$827dfea9@home1> To: , Subject: OT- Saturday Night Cruise Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 15:27:32 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude If you're tired of the stale "Good Times and 8 Oldies" stations, this weekend Ugly Del will be playing a lot of banned and politically incorrect music on his Saturday Night Cruise on WWTC. If you'd like to listen, here's the link- www.pirateradionetwork.com It's on from 6-10PM central (0000-0400Z). Even a couple pieces from the group1910 Fruit Gum Co. (bet you old codgers can guess which ones!) :) ST From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Feb 21 13:39:08 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 21 Feb 2003 21:39:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 45725 invoked from network); 21 Feb 2003 21:39:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Feb 2003 21:39:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Feb 2003 21:39:06 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-76.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.76]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h1LLd2nF005033 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 15:39:04 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <004201c2d9f2$02f32f40$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <1045769501.358.79642.m12@yahoogroups.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Digest Number 595 Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 15:41:34 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude And just what are stations carrying in your part of the country? Up here Christian radio is quite sane and civilized. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Joel Wilson" > I do believe that there will always be a place for terrestrial broadcasting: > And of course, reactionary and racist televangelists. From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Feb 21 14:00:39 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 21 Feb 2003 22:00:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 49120 invoked from network); 21 Feb 2003 21:53:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Feb 2003 21:53:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Feb 2003 21:53:57 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-76.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.76]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h1LLrsnF010413 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 15:53:55 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <005401c2d9f4$167c7ce0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} WGXI [sic]--IBOC and analog stereo gear--the scoop! Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 15:56:26 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude It would be nice to see someone stand up to this corporate thuggery, much like the way old Simon Geller stood up to Outlet Broadcasting about 25 years ago*, but then the surly old coot owner types are all pretty much gone. ST *Geller owned WVCA, Glouster MA, a ramshackle, mono classical FM station out of an apartment. His license was challenged by Outlet Broadcasting which wanted to turn it into a rock station, but the outcry made the FCC reverse it's decision and let him keep the license. Station is still classical, now stereo, callsign WBOQ- W-Bach. ----- Original Message ----- From: > > < Providence has had 93.3 (WSNE-FM Taunton, Ma.) go > from "93-3 WSNE" to all Christmas music in > November to "The all new Star 93-3" in December > only to get sued by Star 93-7 out of Boston. It > then became "The All New 93-3" in January. OY!>> > > Nothing is safe anymore...even naming your station that is similar to an out > of market station. From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Feb 21 14:56:34 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 21 Feb 2003 22:56:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 50324 invoked from network); 21 Feb 2003 22:49:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Feb 2003 22:49:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Feb 2003 22:49:54 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-76.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.76]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h1LMnonF029250 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 2003 16:49:52 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <008001c2d9fb$e7149660$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <19f.111ac614.2b86bbb7@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} WGXI--IBOC and analog stereo gear--the scoop! Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 16:52:22 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude What do they have? A Motorola 1300 would be worth far less than a 1400 or some other late generation Delta or BE unit. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: > > WXGI still holds in their possession the C-Quam gear....no prices were talked > about,but they are interested in selling the C-Quam gear.For those interested > contact: > > Howard Keller 804 233 7666 From powell@conterra.com Fri Feb 21 15:17:52 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: powell@conterra.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 21 Feb 2003 23:17:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 70122 invoked from network); 21 Feb 2003 23:17:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 21 Feb 2003 23:17:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mx.matrixconsulting.net) (65.199.24.6) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Feb 2003 23:17:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 23890 invoked from network); 21 Feb 2003 23:17:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO bsae-skqpk3w8p5) (66.112.193.85) by mx.matrixconsulting.net with SMTP; 21 Feb 2003 23:17:49 -0000 Organization: BEARly Organized To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 18:17:48 -0500 Subject: more broken mirrors and carbon ( left over smoke) Message-ID: <3E566D4C.18929.372B89@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: <1045866550.2311.1548.m12@yahoogroups.com> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.01) From: "Powell E. Way III" Reply-To: powell@conterra.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=8062869 X-Yahoo-Profile: W4OPW On 21 Feb 2003 at 22:29 jbyrns@rcn.com, wrote: > Message: 21 > Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 20:41:34 -0000 > From: "bta_50g " > Subject: Re: More smoke and mirrors and burned up coverage... > > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Powell E. Way III" < > powell@c...> wrote: > > > Powell, you seem to be taking the tack, tell a big enough lie, and > > > people will believe you. I am not sure where you came up with > > > this lie about DA's that you are attributing to me? All I said > > > was that if it was mine to do, I would reclassify the class A's, > > > to class B's. > > > > I'm not lying. IF you are going to reclassify to a B, then they are > > a B. No fudging. > > Why can't I "fudge" My AM improvement plan is my fantasy, so I can do > what ever I want, including fudge as much as I like. But for purposes > of this argument, I am trying not to fudge anymore than the FCC is > fudging already. The first phase of my plan, reassigning all the > current class A stations as class B stations doesn't involve any > physical changes to the stations facilities, which would be > grandfathered as they currently exist. As part of this first step I > would tighten up the class B interference rules slightly for stations > that are proposing new facilities. Step two is to move many of the > class B stations, which were once class II's, operating on clear > channels, to new frequencies which would be opened up by the down > grading of the class A's. These two steps would allow many of the > former class II stations to improve their coverage, and simplify their > transmission plant. And this would in itself increase interference. And then we could have a nice round of lawsuits. > I don't understand why you insist this down grading of the existing > class A stations would require them to go directional? In many cases you'd have to do that or substantially cut night power to follow the new interference rules. > The one reason > you have given is that as class B's they would be required to protect > adjacent channel stations, but as near as I can tell, the current > rules also require class A stations to protect adjacent channels, so > this argument doesn't seem to work. It's more stringent for B's. > Now it would be true that if > these stations built new facilities, either as class A stations as > they currently are, or as class B's under my AM improvement plan, they > might have to reduce their power, or go directional, simply because > the rules have been tightened up since they built their current > facilities. But there is no reason why they would be forced to go > directional just because of my AM improvement plan being put into > effect. And IF they have to cut power or go directional, then at night expect a good bit of the COL to not have coverage, and that's only partly due to lower power and DA, but the increased inteference they'd get. > As evidence of the fact that many, if not all of the current class A > stations don't meet the current interference requirements, the > engineers from two local class A stations, that are dominant on their > frequencies, have told me that they had considered moving for various > reasons, and in both cases they would have had to down grade their > power into the 30 kW range. Also look at the new facilities WOR is > building, the FCC is requiring them to pull the nulls of their > directional array in quite a bit, and WOR is a class A station. Let us not also forget the widespread cheating. And when night IBOC is approved OOOOEEEE ! Powell From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Feb 21 17:52:58 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 22 Feb 2003 01:52:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 25727 invoked from network); 22 Feb 2003 01:52:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Feb 2003 01:52:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Feb 2003 01:52:58 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.142] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 22 Feb 2003 01:52:58 -0000 Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2003 01:52:58 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: OT: Christian radio Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <004201c2d9f2$02f32f40$827dfea9@home1> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1090 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.92.19 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > And just what are stations carrying in your part of the country? > Up here Christian radio is quite sane and civilized. Well, there is Family Radio's octegenarian Harold Camping, who claims that people should listen to his teachings on the radio in lieu of going to church. However, here in central NJ we have two new additions to the Christian radio genre, both locally owned and operated -- a big-signal FM station playing psuedo-Contemporary Christian music (it's more like a Christian version of Soft Rock), and a small daytime-only AM station playing mostly Gospel music mixed in with a wide variety of Christian and Christian-oriented music (for example, Amy Grant's version of "Big Yellow Taxi" is in their playlist, as well as her pop hit "House Of Love", and things like an instrumental version of Stevie Wonder's "Ribbon In The Sky"). Although I am not a personal fan of the genre, I have absolutely nothing against Christian radio stations, as long as they are on the air to serve their listeners -- instead of being there to have their listeners serve *them*! From jbyrns@rcn.com Fri Feb 21 18:26:53 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@rcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 22 Feb 2003 02:26:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 42339 invoked from network); 22 Feb 2003 02:26:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Feb 2003 02:26:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.84) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Feb 2003 02:26:52 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.190] by n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 22 Feb 2003 02:26:52 -0000 Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2003 02:26:52 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: OT: Christian radio Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 646 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bta_50g " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.82 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=138635554 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " < kevtronics@y...> wrote: > > Although I am not a personal fan of the genre, I have absolutely > nothing against Christian radio stations, as long as they are on > the air to serve their listeners -- instead of being there to have > their listeners serve *them*! The purpose of radio stations is not to serve their listeners, the listeners are just the product that the station sells to the advertisers in the case of a commercial station. In the case of a Christian radio station, the preachers are the equivalent of the advertisers, on a commercial station. John From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Feb 21 20:06:30 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 22 Feb 2003 04:06:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 33966 invoked from network); 22 Feb 2003 04:06:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Feb 2003 04:06:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.89) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Feb 2003 04:06:29 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.146] by n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 22 Feb 2003 04:06:29 -0000 Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2003 04:06:29 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: OT: Christian radio Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 354 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.92.19 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > The purpose of radio stations is not to serve their listeners, the > listeners are just the product that the station sells to the > advertisers in the case of a commercial station. That, my friend, is the Clear Channel (or, more generically, the "big corporate") mentality towards radio broadcasting, to which not all stations ascribe themselves. From n0uiheric@aol.com Fri Feb 21 21:08:29 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 22 Feb 2003 05:08:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 28199 invoked from network); 22 Feb 2003 05:08:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Feb 2003 05:08:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Feb 2003 05:08:28 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.170] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 22 Feb 2003 05:08:28 -0000 Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2003 05:08:24 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: OT: Censorship and Corporate Radio Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 5935 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "n0uih " X-Originating-IP: 146.163.6.154 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih You might find this interesting: this came from the New York Times. -------------------------------------------------- The Trouble With Corporate Radio: The Day the Protest Music Died By BRENT STAPLES Pop music played a crucial role in the national debate over the=20 Vietnam War. By the late 1960's, radio stations across the country=20 were crackling with blatantly political songs that became mainstream=20 hits. After the National Guard killed four antiwar demonstrators at=20 Kent State University in Ohio in the spring of 1970, Crosby, Stills,=20 Nash and Young recorded a song, simply titled "Ohio," about the=20 horror of the event, criticizing President Richard Nixon by name. The=20 song was rushed onto the air while sentiment was still high, and=20 became both an antiwar anthem and a huge moneymaker.=20 A comparable song about George W. Bush's rush to war in Iraq would=20 have no chance at all today. There are plenty of angry people, many=20 with prime music-buying demographics. But independent radio stations=20 that once would have played edgy, political music have been gobbled=20 up by corporations that control hundreds of stations and have no wish=20 to rock the boat. Corporate ownership has changed what gets played =97=20 and who plays it. With a few exceptions, the disc jockeys who once=20 existed to discover provocative new music have long since been put=20 out to pasture. The new generation operates from play lists dictated=20 by Corporate Central =97 lists that some D.J.'s describe as "wallpaper=20 music."=20 Recording artists were seen as hysterics when they complained during=20 the 1990's that radio was killing popular music by playing too little=20 of it. But musicians have turned out to be the canaries in the coal=20 mine =97 the first group to be affected by a 1996 federal law that=20 allowed corporations to gobble up hundreds of stations, limiting=20 expression over airwaves that are merely licensed to broadcasters but=20 owned by the American public.=20 When a media giant swallows a station, it typically fires the staff=20 and pipes in music along with something that resembles news via=20 satellite. To make the local public think that things have remained=20 the same, the voice track system sometimes includes references to=20 local matters sprinkled into the broadcast. What my rock 'n' roll colleague William Safire describes as=20 the "ruination of independent radio" started with corporatizing in=20 the 1980's but took off dramatically when the Telecommunications Act=20 of 1996 increased the number of stations that one entity could own in=20 a single market and permitted companies to buy up as many stations=20 nationally as their deep pockets would allow.=20 The new rules were billed as an effort to increase radio diversity,=20 but they appear to have had the opposite effect. Under the old rules,=20 the top two owners had 115 stations between them. Today, the top two=20 own more than 1,400 stations. In many major markets, a few=20 corporations control 80 percent of the listenership or more. Liberal Democrats are horrified by the legion of conservative talk=20 show hosts who dominate the airwaves. But the problem stretches=20 across party lines. National Journal reported last month that=20 Representative Mark Foley, Republican of Florida, was finding it=20 difficult to reach his constituents over the air since national radio=20 companies moved into his district, reducing the number of local=20 stations from five to one. Senator Byron Dorgan, Democrat of North=20 Dakota, had a potential disaster in his district when a freight train=20 carrying anhydrous ammonia derailed, releasing a deadly cloud over=20 the city of Minot. When the emergency alert system failed, the police=20 called the town radio stations, six of which are owned by the=20 corporate giant Clear Channel. According to news accounts, no one=20 answered the phone at the stations for more than an hour and a half.=20 Three hundred people were hospitalized, some partially blinded by the=20 ammonia. Pets and livestock were killed. The perils of consolidation can be seen clearly in the music world.=20 Different stations play formats labeled "adult contemporary," "active=20 rock," "contemporary hit radio" and so on. But studies show that the=20 formats are often different in name only =97 and that as many as 50=20 percent of the songs played in one format can be found in other=20 formats as well. The point of these sterile play lists is to=20 continually repeat songs that challenge nothing and no one, blending=20 in large blocks of commercials.=20 Senator Russell Feingold of Wisconsin has introduced a bill that=20 would require close scrutiny of mergers that could potentially put=20 the majority of the country's radio stations in a single=20 corporation's hands. Lawmakers who missed last month's Senate=20 hearings on this issue should get hold of the testimony offered by=20 the singer and songwriter Don Henley, best known as a member of the=20 Eagles, the rock band.=20 Mr. Henley's Senate testimony recalled the Congressional payola=20 hearings of 1959-60, which showed the public how disc jockeys were=20 accepting bribes to spin records on the air. Now, Mr. Henley said,=20 record companies must pay large sums to "independent promoters," who=20 intercede with radio conglomerates to get songs on the air. Those=20 fees, Mr. Henley said in a recent telephone interview, sometimes=20 reach $400,000. Which brings us back to the hypothetical pop song attacking George=20 Bush. The odds against such a song reaching the air are steep from=20 the outset, given a conservative corporate structure that controls=20 thousands of stations. Record executives who know the lay of land=20 take the path of least resistance when deciding where to spend their=20 promotional money. This flight to sameness and superficiality is=20 narrowing the range of what Americans hear on the radio =97 and killing=20 popular music. SOURCE: New York Times -------------------------------------------------- All right, people...ANY QUESTIONS? From n0uiheric@aol.com Fri Feb 21 21:14:27 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 22 Feb 2003 05:14:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 36779 invoked from network); 22 Feb 2003 05:14:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Feb 2003 05:14:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.89) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Feb 2003 05:14:26 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.163] by n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 22 Feb 2003 05:14:26 -0000 Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2003 05:14:23 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: OT: Christian radio Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1168 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "n0uih " X-Originating-IP: 146.163.6.154 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih Kevin, I don't think corporate entities like Clear Channel and Infinity should EVER be allowed to own Christian radio stations. Christian radio is a MINISTRY OUTREACH for the community, not an instrument for excessive profit. Deregulation brought about the illegal ownership of Christian radio stations by corporate entities like Clear Channel and Infinity. Christian radio should be owned by only two types of owners: not-for- profit organizations or committed Christian business men and women. Clear Channel and Infinity's ideals are based more on Darwin's Theory of Evolution than on anything the Holy Bible (both the Old and New Testaments) teaches (especially the evils of love of money). The Christian station I worked at in Atlanta, AM 1080 WFTD, was owned by Pneuma, Inc. ("Pneuma" is Greek for "spirit", in this case, the Holy Spirit), a ministry of Roswell Street Baptist Church. The organization owned the station from 1987 to 1998; when I was there, I helped lead a failed push for AM Stereo at WFTD. 73 and good DX from Eric PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sat Feb 22 02:06:35 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 22 Feb 2003 10:06:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 17884 invoked from network); 22 Feb 2003 10:06:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Feb 2003 10:06:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Feb 2003 10:06:33 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.189] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 22 Feb 2003 10:06:33 -0000 Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2003 10:06:33 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: DXing Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 839 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.78 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: > > Just one minor issue is that in AM Stereo, its audio tends to get a > bit "crackly". Since it is a run-of-the-mill MC13020-based design, > is there any standard way to reduce or eliminate this? Here ia a fairly simple solution to reduce the crackle in both L+R & L-R in the MC13020 chip. It allows for cosine correction in the lower frequencies where it is most needed but blends to QuAM in the higher frequencies. It requires 4 components added. Replacing the capacitor on the Err Amp with a larger one and using a buffer amp on the I Det to drive the Env Det with the cleaner signal. The buffer amp components can be tacked to the foil side of the circuit board. http://www.hal-pc.org/~jsgil/AM-Stereo/13020-CrackleFix.gif JSG From alfredot@inetarena.com Sat Feb 22 02:35:58 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: alfredot@inetarena.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 22 Feb 2003 10:35:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 33747 invoked from network); 22 Feb 2003 10:35:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Feb 2003 10:35:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.inetarena.com) (206.129.216.13) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Feb 2003 10:35:58 -0000 Received: from hendrie (1Cust14.tnt17.beaverton.or.da.uu.net [65.227.179.14]) by mail.inetarena.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h1MAX9e24098 for ; Sat, 22 Feb 2003 02:33:09 -0800 (PST) Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2003 02:34:58 -0800 (PST) X-Sender: alfredo@hendrie.1610am.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Direct Satellite vs. Terrestrial Broadcasting In-Reply-To: <1045866550.2311.1548.m12@yahoogroups.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: "Alfredo E. Torrejon" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=25132238 X-Yahoo-Profile: alfredotorrejon "Joel Wilson" writes: > To say that the majority of Americans can not afford a $10 monthly > subscription is naive in a marketplace where people spend upwards of $100 > for cable or satellite TV, the same for wireless telephony, and half that > for high speed www connectivity, still five times the cost for the premium > radio service. > > I do believe that there will always be a place for terrestrial broadcasting: > Minority language and ethnic broadcasts > Home shopping on radio > Tourist Information Radio > And of course, reactionary and racist televangelists. Pardon me while I put on my cynic's hat...I think that the writing has been on the wall from the middle of the 1990s, when the broadcast conglomerates started buying up large numbers of stations and the term "cookie-cutter radio" started to be widely used. If the public accepts direct-broadcast satellite as a means of receiving radio programs, then it makes a lot more sense for Clear Channel and other major operators to directly beam Rush Limbaugh and George Noori as well as "Star" and other music formats to a nationwide audience rather than to have to deal with the expense of running local radio stations in addition to having a satellite uplink. The direct broadcast satellite services might have innovative programming today, much like FM radio did during the early 70s...However, as public acceptance of this new technology grows, I strongly suspect that the programming will slowly morph from "eclectic" to "mass appeal." Alfredo From alfredot@inetarena.com Sat Feb 22 03:10:48 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: alfredot@inetarena.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 22 Feb 2003 11:10:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 87049 invoked from network); 22 Feb 2003 11:10:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Feb 2003 11:10:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.inetarena.com) (206.129.216.13) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Feb 2003 11:10:46 -0000 Received: from hendrie (1Cust14.tnt17.beaverton.or.da.uu.net [65.227.179.14]) by mail.inetarena.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h1MB7te28068 for ; Sat, 22 Feb 2003 03:07:56 -0800 (PST) Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2003 03:09:47 -0800 (PST) X-Sender: alfredo@hendrie.1610am.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Re: Designing a receiver? In-Reply-To: <1045866550.2311.1548.m12@yahoogroups.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: "Alfredo E. Torrejon" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=25132238 X-Yahoo-Profile: alfredotorrejon > There, your logic is flawed. Marketplace-driven ideas are a FAILURE. Remember > what happened when the FCC took the "hands off" approach with AM Stereo? The > FCC should have taken a "hands on" approach to begin with. > The so-called "extra cost" of shortwave is a ONE-TIME ONLY expense. Why pay > $120 per year for XM when it only delivers, at best, FM-quality sound, and > doesn't get through mountains and tall buildings like shortwave does? I have to respectfully disagree with you on one point: when the "average Joe" discovers XM or Sirius, what he is really going to like is that each channel has consistent programming 24 hours a day, in much the same way that cable and direct satellite TV do. Let's face it: our culture has changed over the last 20 years or so, and people today generally expect services to be available to them around the clock, whether it's a customer service phone number, home shopping, convenience stores, internet sites, or, of course, radio and TV programming. I'm only 29 years old, and I have noted this cultural shift during my lifetime. You might say, "but you can find news and cultural programs from around the world on shortwave, and there are many educational FMs run by colleges that program world music, salsa, classical, and other non-mainstream genres of music," and you'd be 100% correct. However, keeping up with your favorite shortwave broadcaster means that you have to keep track of their frequency schedules, and for many people, that's *work*. Also, chances are that the college station that's playing the world music, salsa, and classical only programs each of these styles for a few hours a week. Tune in at the wrong time, and instead of hearing music of the Andes, you'll hear straightedge hardcore records with chugga-chugga guitars and screamed lyrics about why the best lifestyle is one that is free from drugs, alcohol, and the consumption of animal products! > Shortwave radio should not be optional on all radios for the home or car. It > should be MANDATORY. Again, I disagree. I expect the FCC to act as an impartial judge when the industry must choose between competing broadcast standards; I really wish that they hadn't waffled on this role when the decision about AM Stereo was made. However, I don't think that it's appropriate to force the inclusion of shortwave coverage because a wide selection of shortwave radios is already on the market. If you want a low-cost starter radio to let you hear some of the action on shortwave, you can pick one up at Radio Shack. Nor do I think that this forced inclusion of shortwave will ever happen; unlike the forced inclusion of UHF tuners in TVs back in the 1960s, there is no major lobby of shortwave broadcasters influencing Congress or the FCC. As a matter of fact, unless the rules have changed in the last 10 years, the FCC will not license shortwave stations whose sole goal is to broadcast to a domestic audience. Alfredo From amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk Sat Feb 22 07:39:33 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 22 Feb 2003 15:39:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 29281 invoked from network); 22 Feb 2003 15:39:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Feb 2003 15:39:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.84) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Feb 2003 15:39:32 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.174] by n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 22 Feb 2003 15:39:32 -0000 Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2003 15:39:30 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: UK DTI AM Stereo Tests : Did they happen ? Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 166 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Dave " X-Originating-IP: 81.7.62.182 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113985069 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereofan Just found an old letter from 1994 saying there would be more am stereo tests in 1995. Anyone / Kevin T / Paul Rusting (IOM radio) know if they went ahead or not ? From powell@conterra.com Sat Feb 22 08:13:58 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: powell@conterra.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 22 Feb 2003 16:13:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 56667 invoked from network); 22 Feb 2003 16:13:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Feb 2003 16:13:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO ziggy.conterra.com) (66.112.206.20) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Feb 2003 16:13:53 -0000 Received: from ziggy.conterra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ziggy.conterra.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h1MGDri1039601 for ; Sat, 22 Feb 2003 11:13:53 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from powell@conterra.com) Received: (from www@localhost) by ziggy.conterra.com (8.12.6/8.12.6/Submit) id h1MGDqKR039598 for amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com; Sat, 22 Feb 2003 11:13:52 -0500 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: ziggy.conterra.com: www set sender to powell@conterra.com using -f Received: from 209.213.26.22 ( [209.213.26.22]) as user powell@mail.conterra.com by ziggy.conterra.com with HTTP; Sat, 22 Feb 2003 11:13:52 -0500 Message-ID: <1045930432.3e57a1c09a664@ziggy.conterra.com> Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2003 11:13:52 -0500 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Live and direct WKDK during storms References: <1045925948.2654.19989.m12@yahoogroups.com> In-Reply-To: <1045925948.2654.19989.m12@yahoogroups.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) 3.1 From: powell@conterra.com X-Originating-IP: 209.213.26.22 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=8062869 X-Yahoo-Profile: W4OPW 2 overlapping tornado watches...severe thunderstorms rolling through, systems moving at 60 MPH will show to be a busy day. I'm live with all the weather. I just wonder how many corporate stations are in "ignore" mode. Powell WKDK ( with static only in stereo!) ------------------------------------------------- This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/ From amfmdx@fastq.com Sat Feb 22 08:18:01 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 22 Feb 2003 16:18:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 55957 invoked from network); 22 Feb 2003 16:18:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Feb 2003 16:18:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Feb 2003 16:18:00 -0000 Received: from fastq.com ([208.187.57.35]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with ESMTP id h1MGHwT88334 for ; Sat, 22 Feb 2003 09:17:58 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <3E573FFC.D061C166@fastq.com> Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2003 09:16:51 +0000 Organization: what me worry? X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.79 (Macintosh; U; PPC) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com" Subject: Reckoning will come Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; x-mac-type="54455854"; x-mac-creator="4D4F5353" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: "Kevin, Mesa, AZ" Reply-To: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla John, All you guys who work for the big corporations, as it appears you do, forget that after you piss all of us listeners off, the advertisers will give you the extended middle finger. The bottom line is that the end user, WHO IS NOT THE ADVERTISER, is the one that makes this all work. All you iBiquity types and CCU et. al. types are all going to reap your rewards soon enough for your attitudes. You remind me of a guy named David [Eduardo] Gleason. Kevin Message: 4 Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2003 02:26:52 -0000 From: "bta_50g " Subject: Re: OT: Christian radio The purpose of radio stations is not to serve their listeners, the listeners are just the product that the station sells to the advertisers in the case of a commercial station. In the case of a Christian radio station, the preachers are the equivalent of the advertisers, on a commercial station. John From KC4QLP@aol.com Sat Feb 22 09:10:57 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 22 Feb 2003 17:10:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 58180 invoked from network); 22 Feb 2003 17:10:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Feb 2003 17:10:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d05.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Feb 2003 17:10:31 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-d05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.9f.342c6b2b (30950) for ; Sat, 22 Feb 2003 12:10:22 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <9f.342c6b2b.2b8908fd@aol.com> Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2003 12:10:21 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Live and direct WKDK during storms To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 7.0 for Windows sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 2/22/03 11:14:57 AM Eastern Standard Time, powell@conterra.com writes: > 2 overlapping tornado watches...severe thunderstorms rolling through, > systems > moving at 60 MPH will show to be a busy day. I'm live with all the weather. > I > just wonder how many corporate stations are in "ignore" mode. > Well Powell...looks like my turn is coming up in about 2-4 hours by the looks of the radar.Perhaps todays Busch race will be on a rain delay as well by the looks of things...will find out at 1245pm EST. I certainly feel for those that received the large snow fall last weekend,,,,only to have it melt quickly today. Hope you folks up north have your arks ready. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ --------------------------------- Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area.--Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC,WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC,WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC, Ray Communications Radio Network- e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net ------------------------------------------------------------------ --------------------------------------- AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com ------------------------KC4QLP Amateur Radio------------------------------------------ Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.qsl.net/kc4qlp Echolink node # 56704 -- 146.590 VHF,440.850 UHF (PL 131.8) Proposed Repeater-145.250 _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From florida_amstereo@hotmail.com Sat Feb 22 09:45:29 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: florida_amstereo@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 22 Feb 2003 17:45:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 54937 invoked from network); 22 Feb 2003 17:45:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Feb 2003 17:45:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.37.83) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Feb 2003 17:45:27 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 22 Feb 2003 09:45:27 -0800 Received: from 209.240.198.61 by pv2fd.pav2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Sat, 22 Feb 2003 17:45:26 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, amstereo@bellsouth.net Bcc: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Live and direct WKDK during storms Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2003 17:45:26 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 22 Feb 2003 17:45:27.0130 (UTC) FILETIME=[2F302BA0:01C2DA9A] From: "Donn Tillman" X-Originating-IP: [209.240.198.61] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83914824 Powell Way III wrote: >"2 overlapping tornado >watches...severe thunderstorms rolling >through, >systems >moving at 60 MPH will show to be a >busy day. I'm live with all the >weather. >I >just wonder how many corporate >stations are in "ignore" mode. Pinellas county,florida(which includes St. Petersburg) is at least pragmatic and knows that the public can no longer count on corporate radio(mainly ClearChannel in this area) to provide emergency info; so the county is in the process of establishing a network of low power am-stations around the county to pick up the slack. The broadcast segments live from NOAA weather radio and also have local segments on hurricane preparedness etc. As one member of the am-stereo forum is quoted as saying; corporate radio is not here to serve the public and although I don't agree with that statement; obviously the largest of the radio corporations certainly believe that. I guess they figure that people will get their local emergency weather and news from satellite. donn st petersburg, fl (sustained winds of 21 mph and gust up to 32 mph - will will get the heavy weather this evening) ----Original Message Follows---- From: powell@conterra.com Reply-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Live and direct WKDK during storms Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2003 11:13:52 -0500 c Powell WKDK ( with static only in stereo!) _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 helps eliminate e-mail viruses. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus From jbyrns@rcn.com Sat Feb 22 10:34:14 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@rcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 22 Feb 2003 18:34:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 40479 invoked from network); 22 Feb 2003 18:34:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Feb 2003 18:34:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Feb 2003 18:34:12 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.150] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 22 Feb 2003 18:34:11 -0000 Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2003 18:34:08 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Reckoning will come Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3E573FFC.D061C166@fastq.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1964 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bta_50g " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.98.208 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=138635554 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g Kevin, It is not in the best interest of broadcasters to "piss" their listeners off, otherwise they won't have any product (listeners) to sell to the advertisers. I suspect the problem in your case is that either you as a listener are not the product the advertisers are looking for, and hence the broadcasters aren't catering to your tastes, or if you are someone the advertisers would like to reach, your tastes are so specialized that if the broadcasters attempted to cater to them, in order to add you to their product offering, they would fail to attract large numbers of other listeners that the broadcasters customers, the advertisers, also want to reach. So how is it that the broadcasters are "pissing" you off? Is it that you don't like the programming that is being offered, or that you don't like IBOC, or is it that you don't like the fact that the broadcast industry failed to embrace AM stereo? John --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin, Mesa, AZ" wrote: > John, > > All you guys who work for the big corporations, as it appears you do, > forget that after you piss all of us listeners off, the advertisers will > give you the extended middle finger. The bottom line is that the end > user, WHO IS NOT THE ADVERTISER, is the one that makes this all work. > > All you iBiquity types and CCU et. al. types are all going to reap your > rewards soon enough for your attitudes. You remind me of a guy named > David [Eduardo] Gleason. > > Kevin > > Message: 4 > Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2003 02:26:52 -0000 > From: "bta_50g " > Subject: Re: OT: Christian radio > > The purpose of radio stations is not to serve their listeners, the > listeners are just the product that the station sells to the > advertisers in the case of a commercial station. In the case of a > Christian radio station, the preachers are the equivalent of the > advertisers, on a commercial station. > > John From KC4QLP@aol.com Sat Feb 22 10:36:23 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 22 Feb 2003 18:36:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 3392 invoked from network); 22 Feb 2003 18:36:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Feb 2003 18:36:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r08.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.104) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Feb 2003 18:36:22 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-r08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.136.1b037493 (18555) for ; Sat, 22 Feb 2003 13:36:20 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <136.1b037493.2b891d23@aol.com> Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2003 13:36:19 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Live and direct WKDK during storms To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp In a message dated 2/22/03 12:47:17 PM Eastern Standard Time, florida_amstereo@hotmail.com writes: << Pinellas county,florida(which includes St. Petersburg) is at least pragmatic and knows that the public can no longer count on corporate radio(mainly ClearChannel in this area) to provide emergency info; so the county is in the process of establishing a network of low power am-stations around the county to pick up the slack. The broadcast segments live from NOAA weather radio and also have local segments on hurricane preparedness etc.>> Thats sad that a local gov agency has to pick up the slack. Sounds like a neat network though.What frequency or frequencies will this be operating on? << As one member of the am-stereo forum is quoted as saying; corporate radio is not here to serve the public and although I don't agree with that statement; obviously the largest of the radio corporations certainly believe that. I guess they figure that people will get their local emergency weather and news from satellite.>> Well as a heavy hitter on radio here...I beleive this: If your listeners do not support your advertisers,then the advertisers will not be supporting the radio stations.After all its the advertising revenue in the long run that pays ALL the bills. If you dont give the listener a reason to "stick with you" for news/weather/sports/music and general entertainment,then those listeners will listen elsewhere. Advertisers generally measure how much they will speand with a station based on the results of the advertising they do. Small response...little or no ad dollars will be spent next time. Big response,the advertiser gets the impression that radio works and will spend money with you again.....all trickles back to the listeners when you get down to the bottom line. Ad agencies base to a degree,who they will spend money with based on ratings...generally represents who and how many people are listening at any given time. The other factor is of course a stations ad rate. << donn st petersburg, fl (sustained winds of 21 mph and gust up to 32 mph - will will get the heavy weather this evening) >> Well the race at Rockingham is in limbo do to weather...and I'll be getting this mess later today myself---late afternoon, early evening.The later in the day the better..give the atmosphere a chance to cool down and hopefully diminish the severity of these storms.( yours truely hates lightning damage ) Right now its a balmy 72 degrees F and a tornado watch is in effect for western NC ...looks like its time to "rock and roll" later. Gee you'd think it was spring time out there right now...ugh! :-P Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ --------------------------------- Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area.--Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC,WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC,WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC, Ray Communications Radio Network- e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ --------------------------- AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com ------------------------KC4QLP Amateur Radio------------------------------------------ Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.qsl.net/kc4qlp Echolink node # 56704 -- 146.590 VHF,440.850 UHF (PL 131.8) Proposed Repeater-145.250 _______________________________________________________ From n0uiheric@aol.com Sat Feb 22 11:40:49 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 22 Feb 2003 19:40:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 94786 invoked from network); 22 Feb 2003 19:40:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Feb 2003 19:40:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m03.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.6) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Feb 2003 19:40:47 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-m03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.f.aeac206 (17377) for ; Sat, 22 Feb 2003 14:40:31 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2003 14:40:31 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: BBC World Service -- shortwave vs. XM vs. AM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih Au contraire! FM is now REQUIRED on all radios receiving AM. It would be illogical not to allow for shortwave and NOAA Weather Radio coverage. The latter would benefit the public by providing severe weather warnings quicker than the broadcast stations. In some areas, NOAA Weather Radio is the ONLY local radio. The former would be logical for increase in programming choices. I, for one, refuse to pay $11 per month to access the BBC, when shortwave can provide their programming for no charge. Most Americans are NOT WILLING to pay for radio. XM cannot be heard in mountainous areas; repeaters are required in downtown areas in major cities. AM can effectively cover most of the continent, while shortwave covers an entire hemisphere with a strong signal. It's time for change. Shortwave should be pushed as an alternative to AM, FM and XM. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From JH_Radio@GameBox.net Sat Feb 22 12:11:09 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: JH_Radio@GameBox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 22 Feb 2003 20:11:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 59259 invoked from network); 22 Feb 2003 20:11:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Feb 2003 20:11:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO babyruth.hotpop.com) (204.57.55.14) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Feb 2003 20:11:08 -0000 Received: from gamebox.net (kubrick.hotpop.com [204.57.55.16]) by babyruth.hotpop.com (Postfix) with SMTP id B845A210407 for ; Sat, 22 Feb 2003 20:10:55 +0000 (UTC) Received: from -enduser.GameBox.net (pcp03184855pcs.benslm01.pa.comcast.net [68.80.77.117]) by smtp-1.hotpop.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B8F942F812E for ; Sat, 22 Feb 2003 20:09:53 +0000 (UTC) Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030222151414.01985ec0@pop.GameBox.net> X-Sender: JH_Radio@pop.GameBox.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2003 15:15:44 -0500 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Reckoning will come In-Reply-To: References: <3E573FFC.D061C166@fastq.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-HotPOP: ----------------------------------------------- Sent By HotPOP.com FREE Email Get your FREE POP email at www.HotPOP.com ----------------------------------------------- From: John X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113800107 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit All of the below. IBOC sucks, AM Stereo rules and no one uses it, and the broadcasters can't even advice the public of emergency. Especially with Voice tracking, phone set to ring busy, and no one even at the station in case an emergency does arrive. Plus it's the same ol' stale formats over and over. At 06:34 PM 2/22/03 +0000, you wrote: >Kevin, > >It is not in the best interest of broadcasters to "piss" their >listeners off, otherwise they won't have any product (listeners) to >sell to the advertisers. I suspect the problem in your case is that >either you as a listener are not the product the advertisers are >looking for, and hence the broadcasters aren't catering to your >tastes, or if you are someone the advertisers would like to reach, >your tastes are so specialized that if the broadcasters attempted to >cater to them, in order to add you to their product offering, they >would fail to attract large numbers of other listeners that the >broadcasters customers, the advertisers, also want to reach. > >So how is it that the broadcasters are "pissing" you off? Is it that >you don't like the programming that is being offered, or that you >don't like IBOC, or is it that you don't like the fact that the >broadcast industry failed to embrace AM stereo? > >John > >--- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin, Mesa, AZ" >wrote: >> John, >> >> All you guys who work for the big corporations, as it appears you do, >> forget that after you piss all of us listeners off, the advertisers will >> give you the extended middle finger. The bottom line is that the end >> user, WHO IS NOT THE ADVERTISER, is the one that makes this all work. >> >> All you iBiquity types and CCU et. al. types are all going to reap your >> rewards soon enough for your attitudes. You remind me of a guy named >> David [Eduardo] Gleason. >> >> Kevin >> >> Message: 4 >> Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2003 02:26:52 -0000 >> From: "bta_50g " >> Subject: Re: OT: Christian radio >> >> The purpose of radio stations is not to serve their listeners, the >> listeners are just the product that the station sells to the >> advertisers in the case of a commercial station. In the case of a >> Christian radio station, the preachers are the equivalent of the >> advertisers, on a commercial station. >> >> John > > > >Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Love in Christ: John Bensalem, PA Send me an email Aim: RainAngelsRule MSN: RainAngelsRule@hotmail.com My website Welcome to Napster4TheBlind "Prayer does not change God; it changes you." - Authur unknown [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From florida_amstereo@hotmail.com Sat Feb 22 12:36:38 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: florida_amstereo@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 22 Feb 2003 20:36:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 82592 invoked from network); 22 Feb 2003 20:36:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Feb 2003 20:36:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.37.35) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Feb 2003 20:36:37 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 22 Feb 2003 12:36:37 -0800 Received: from 209.240.198.61 by pv2fd.pav2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Sat, 22 Feb 2003 20:36:36 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Live and direct WKDK during storms Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2003 20:36:36 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 22 Feb 2003 20:36:37.0239 (UTC) FILETIME=[18A67070:01C2DAB2] From: "Donn Tillman" X-Originating-IP: [209.240.198.61] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83914824 Bob Carter, radio engineer extraordinaire wrote: >"Thats sad that a local gov agency has to pick up the slack. Sounds like a neat network though.What frequency or frequencies will this be operating on? ~~~~~~~~~~~ So far there are two stations, both at 940 khz, one in Largo(north central Pinellas county) and the other in St Petersburg(s.e. Pinellas county). Yesterday the local segments have been primarily on tornado preparedness, since February and March seem to be peak tornado months in this area. From what I understand there will be other stations on the air, hopefully by the start of hurricane season. ( 1 June 2003), since the two right now are only reaching about 1/4 of the county. When they came on the air several months ago, I won a S.A.M.E. weather radio from one of their on-the-air contest; and it was just the same model that I was getting ready to buy at Radio Shack, so that saved me about $70. The weather here has turned cloudy since 2pm and the winds are picking up. Most streets along the bayfront in downtown st petersburg are closed for the Grand Prix auto races this weekend. No rain to interrupt the races yet. donn st petersburg,fl _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 helps eliminate e-mail viruses. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus From ai4i@hotmail.com Sat Feb 22 13:01:38 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ai4i@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 22 Feb 2003 21:01:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 43364 invoked from network); 22 Feb 2003 21:01:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Feb 2003 21:01:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (207.68.164.98) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Feb 2003 21:01:30 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 22 Feb 2003 13:01:30 -0800 To: References: <1045925948.2654.19989.m12@yahoogroups.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Digest Number 597 Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2003 16:01:27 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 22 Feb 2003 21:01:30.0075 (UTC) FILETIME=[927322B0:01C2DAB5] From: "Joel Wilson" Reply-To: "Joel Wilson" X-Originating-IP: [216.77.209.6] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=127893550 X-Yahoo-Profile: ai4ijoel Actually that is the business model to which all entities ascribe to, profit making or not.. Joel Wilson Hello Taxi AI4I ========================================= Proud 2-B a pioneering satellite radio subscriber AI4I is always on the trailing edge of technology ========================================= > The purpose of radio stations is not to serve their listeners, the > listeners are just the product that the station sells to the > advertisers in the case of a commercial station. That, my friend, is the Clear Channel (or, more generically, the "big corporate") mentality towards radio broadcasting, to which not all stations ascribe themselves. From bharrisonb@yahoo.com Sat Feb 22 13:15:21 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: bharrisonb@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 22 Feb 2003 21:15:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 18114 invoked from network); 22 Feb 2003 21:15:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Feb 2003 21:15:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Feb 2003 21:15:19 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.130] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 22 Feb 2003 21:15:19 -0000 Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2003 21:15:19 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Best stereo song track ? Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 346 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bharrisonb " X-Originating-IP: 209.6.163.26 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=69885139 X-Yahoo-Profile: bharrisonb O.K. everyone ... here's a good question. WJIB (AM Stereo - 740 Camb. Mass) is having a call-in show next Friday 12/28/03 at noon. If you could ask any station to play a single track (the format is beautiful music / standards / oldies ), what would you request ? Maybe just to test and enjoy the C-QUAM stereo seperation. - Bob === === From ccuff@in4web.com Sat Feb 22 13:27:04 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 22 Feb 2003 21:27:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 7678 invoked from network); 22 Feb 2003 21:27:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Feb 2003 21:27:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Feb 2003 21:27:02 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.74]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Sat, 22 Feb 2003 16:23:48 -0500 Message-ID: <001f01c2dab7$d52f1c60$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Best stereo song track ? Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2003 16:17:39 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 My voyte would be "Sandy" by Dion & The Belmonts. Recorded in real stereo, in 1958 at Bell labs in NYC. It is on CD now. Another great song is Frank Sinatra's "Luck be a Lady" on Reprise. goosebump quality sound. Anything by Enoch Light on Command- 35mm stereo masters. I use all of these on demos and it blows away people that hear it. Chris ----- Original Message ----- From: From ai4i@hotmail.com Sat Feb 22 13:54:02 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ai4i@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 22 Feb 2003 21:54:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 71499 invoked from network); 22 Feb 2003 21:53:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Feb 2003 21:53:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (207.68.164.203) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Feb 2003 21:53:59 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 22 Feb 2003 13:53:59 -0800 To: References: <1045925948.2654.19989.m12@yahoogroups.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Digest Number 597 Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2003 16:53:57 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 22 Feb 2003 21:53:59.0499 (UTC) FILETIME=[E7A719B0:01C2DABC] From: "Joel Wilson" Reply-To: "Joel Wilson" X-Originating-IP: [216.77.209.6] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=127893550 X-Yahoo-Profile: ai4ijoel The solution is to have more than just two players. Some can program mass appeal material free to air such as what Worldspace is doing. Some can be more eclectic and charge higher premiums. Satellite radio, as all radio, is an evolving process. The next mode will be even grander. When my 35 year-old fantasy became a reality, I had to dream up with a new fantasy. You can experience the beginning of it right now from where you sit. Technology is going wireless. I can envision internet radios in the dashboards of every car on the road. The high rollers might have names such as Spinner, Live365, Real1, WMP mobile. This time, it will not take 35 years. Joel Wilson Hello Taxi AI4I ========================================= Proud 2-B a pioneering satellite radio subscriber AI4I is always on the trailing edge of technology ========================================= ________________________________________________________________________ ________________________________________________________________________ Message: 9 Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2003 02:34:58 -0800 (PST) From: "Alfredo E. Torrejon" Subject: Direct Satellite vs. Terrestrial Broadcasting "Joel Wilson" writes: > To say that the majority of Americans can not afford a $10 monthly > subscription is naive in a marketplace where people spend upwards of $100 > for cable or satellite TV, the same for wireless telephony, and half that > for high speed www connectivity, still five times the cost for the premium > radio service. > > I do believe that there will always be a place for terrestrial broadcasting: > Minority language and ethnic broadcasts > Home shopping on radio > Tourist Information Radio > And of course, reactionary and racist televangelists. Pardon me while I put on my cynic's hat...I think that the writing has been on the wall from the middle of the 1990s, when the broadcast conglomerates started buying up large numbers of stations and the term "cookie-cutter radio" started to be widely used. If the public accepts direct-broadcast satellite as a means of receiving radio programs, then it makes a lot more sense for Clear Channel and other major operators to directly beam Rush Limbaugh and George Noori as well as "Star" and other music formats to a nationwide audience rather than to have to deal with the expense of running local radio stations in addition to having a satellite uplink. The direct broadcast satellite services might have innovative programming today, much like FM radio did during the early 70s...However, as public acceptance of this new technology grows, I strongly suspect that the programming will slowly morph from "eclectic" to "mass appeal." Alfredo From stodd@sherbtel.net Sat Feb 22 15:50:31 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 22 Feb 2003 23:50:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 57230 invoked from network); 22 Feb 2003 23:50:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 22 Feb 2003 23:50:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 22 Feb 2003 23:50:30 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-125.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.125]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h1MNoQnF012988 for ; Sat, 22 Feb 2003 17:50:28 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <007501c2dacd$89cd9e20$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Best stereo song track ? Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2003 17:53:00 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Not their genre, but Autobahn by Kraftwerk. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: > O.K. everyone ... here's a good question. WJIB (AM Stereo - 740 Camb. > Mass) is having a call-in show next Friday 12/28/03 at noon. > > If you could ask any station to play a single track (the format is > beautiful music / standards / oldies ), what would you request ? > Maybe just to test and enjoy the C-QUAM stereo seperation. From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Sat Feb 22 16:48:50 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 23 Feb 2003 00:48:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 57865 invoked from network); 23 Feb 2003 00:48:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Feb 2003 00:48:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf40bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.63) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Feb 2003 00:48:50 -0000 Received: from juan ([67.34.63.53]) by imf40bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.25 201-253-122-122-125-20020815) with SMTP id <20030223005048.UKJX2831.imf40bis.bellsouth.net@juan> for ; Sat, 22 Feb 2003 19:50:48 -0500 Message-ID: <000a01c2dad5$548d22a0$af78fea9@juan> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Best stereo song track ? Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2003 19:48:49 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Something by Bert Kaempfert. Some of his stuff blows me away ! Sinatra's September Song is a good one too. Juan Fort Pierce, FL ----- Original Message ----- From: bharrisonb To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, February 22, 2003 4:15 PM Subject: {AMSF} Best stereo song track ? O.K. everyone ... here's a good question. WJIB (AM Stereo - 740 Camb. Mass) is having a call-in show next Friday 12/28/03 at noon. If you could ask any station to play a single track (the format is beautiful music / standards / oldies ), what would you request ? Maybe just to test and enjoy the C-QUAM stereo seperation. - Bob === === Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ADVERTISEMENT Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From dav259@csiro.au Sat Feb 22 17:18:18 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 23 Feb 2003 01:18:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 86803 invoked from network); 23 Feb 2003 01:18:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Feb 2003 01:18:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Feb 2003 01:18:15 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1N1IER02083 for ; Sun, 23 Feb 2003 12:18:14 +1100 (EST) Date: Sun, 23 Feb 2003 12:18:14 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Best stereo song track ? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=112635033 X-Yahoo-Profile: dav259 On Sat, 22 Feb 2003, bharrisonb wrote: > If you could ask any station to play a single track (the format is > beautiful music / standards / oldies ), what would you request ? > Maybe just to test and enjoy the C-QUAM stereo seperation. Bert Kaempfert - "That Happy Feeling" From dav259@csiro.au Sat Feb 22 17:34:39 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 23 Feb 2003 01:34:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 69730 invoked from network); 23 Feb 2003 01:34:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Feb 2003 01:34:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Feb 2003 01:34:21 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1N1YKR02656 for ; Sun, 23 Feb 2003 12:34:20 +1100 (EST) Date: Sun, 23 Feb 2003 12:34:20 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Live and direct WKDK during storms In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=112635033 X-Yahoo-Profile: dav259 On Sat, 22 Feb 2003, Donn Tillman wrote: > As one member of the am-stereo forum is quoted as saying; corporate radio is > not here to serve the public and although I don't agree with that statement; > obviously the largest of the radio corporations certainly believe that. I > guess they figure that people will get their local emergency weather and > news from satellite. Call me old fashioned, possums, but I think it should be mandatory for local stations to regularly give local weather reports. Just about everyone has access to a radio. It used to be mandatory for OZ TV and radio stations to tell the time. I guess that's not crucial now with clocks on so many things. But I wish the old rule was still there. The successful Nine Network here has made an art form out of running programs five minutes late so that you'll miss the start of a program on another channel. The trouble is that the other commercial channels copied them. Only the ABC and SBS bother to keep on time. Oh for the days of the GTV9 'Longines' Television City clock when you'd watch it countdown to the hour and programs did commence on time. At least most of Melbourne's AM stations still play the time pips (like the BBC World Service). They are very handy when resetting clocks and watches. From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Sat Feb 22 17:57:04 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 23 Feb 2003 01:57:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 44831 invoked from network); 23 Feb 2003 01:57:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Feb 2003 01:57:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14206.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.173.70) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Feb 2003 01:57:03 -0000 Message-ID: <20030223015703.23476.qmail@web14206.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.162.23.33] by web14206.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 22 Feb 2003 17:57:03 PST Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2003 17:57:03 -0800 (PST) Subject: Enough Bids already! To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio NEW Sony SRF-42 C-QUAM AM Stereo Walkman Item # 3009084989 Current bid US $70.00 # of bids 55 55 bids! - Haven't people ever heard of 'proxy bidding'? __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Sat Feb 22 18:01:18 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 23 Feb 2003 02:01:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 15653 invoked from network); 23 Feb 2003 02:01:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Feb 2003 02:01:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14201.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.143) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Feb 2003 02:01:14 -0000 Message-ID: <20030223020114.2458.qmail@web14201.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.162.23.33] by web14201.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 22 Feb 2003 18:01:14 PST Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2003 18:01:14 -0800 (PST) Subject: How do we get the FCC off their *ss and DO SOMETHING? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio Any suggestions on how we get the FCC to do something about the desecration of the AM broadcast band by continuing to ignore our request to stop and examine the faulty testing of only system tested for AM - IBOC? The more stations that buy this faulty equipment, the less likely the FCC will be to ever correct the errors of their ways, the same way they are ignoring Clear Channel's monopoly. How much money does it take to buy-off these guys anyhow? Does anybody in Washington care? __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ From dav259@csiro.au Sat Feb 22 18:32:25 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dav259@csiro.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 23 Feb 2003 02:32:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 59820 invoked from network); 23 Feb 2003 02:32:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Feb 2003 02:32:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mineng.minerals.csiro.au) (138.194.10.10) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Feb 2003 02:32:25 -0000 Received: from mineng.minerals.csiro.au (mineng.minerals.csiro.au [138.194.10.10]) by mineng.minerals.csiro.au (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h1N2WOR04994 for ; Sun, 23 Feb 2003 13:32:24 +1100 (EST) Date: Sun, 23 Feb 2003 13:32:24 +1100 (EST) X-X-Sender: To: Subject: Re: {AMSF} How do we get the FCC off their *ss and DO SOMETHING? In-Reply-To: <20030223020114.2458.qmail@web14201.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: Ian Davidson X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=112635033 X-Yahoo-Profile: dav259 On Sat, 22 Feb 2003, John P. wrote: > Any suggestions on how we get the FCC to do something about the desecration > of the AM broadcast band by continuing to ignore our request to stop and > examine the faulty testing of only system tested for AM - IBOC? Johnny - it's dead easy! All we have to do is win a fortune in the lotto and then "donate" heaps to both political parties - 55% to the party we'd like to win - and 45% to the party we'd rather lose. Then whichever party gets in it would be indebted to us. I wouldn't be at all surprised if this isn't already covered in Economics courses at universities. It should be. > The more stations that buy this faulty equipment, the less likely the FCC > will be to ever correct the errors of their ways, the same way they are > ignoring Clear Channel's monopoly. The FCC will not alter its ways until there is a public backlash - and what chance of that is there when truly there are so few "free" TV neworks in a country of 270 million? All the big boys seem to have their snouts in the trough. > How much money does it take to buy-off these guys anyhow? Heaps! And most media conglomerates will only spend it to get bigger. Thus the number of owners becomes fewer. > Does anybody in Washington care? I expect the bankers are having a field day. Hey - maybe this is a good argument for independently run government funded radio. It works in Canada, the UK, NZ, and Oz. And it "keeps the bastards honest". (The slogan of The Australian Democrats.) Ian From amymousie@yahoo.com Sat Feb 22 19:19:19 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 23 Feb 2003 03:19:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 59336 invoked from network); 23 Feb 2003 03:19:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Feb 2003 03:19:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Feb 2003 03:19:18 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.178] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 23 Feb 2003 03:19:18 -0000 Date: Sun, 23 Feb 2003 03:19:18 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Best stereo song track ? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 450 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 66.127.242.148 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "bharrisonb " wrote: > If you could ask any station to play a single track (the format is > beautiful music / standards / oldies ), what would you request ? > Maybe just to test and enjoy the C-QUAM stereo seperation. Anything from Paul Anka's "21 Golden Hits", any stereo Martin Denny recording.... Same thing with Esquivel... Hmm... *mousiebrainf*rt* Amy. <:3 )~~8~ From amymousie@yahoo.com Sat Feb 22 19:31:30 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 23 Feb 2003 03:31:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 58248 invoked from network); 23 Feb 2003 03:31:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Feb 2003 03:31:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Feb 2003 03:31:29 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.185] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 23 Feb 2003 03:31:29 -0000 Date: Sun, 23 Feb 2003 03:31:26 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} How do we get the FCC off their *ss and DO SOMETHING? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 579 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 66.127.242.148 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, Ian Davidson wrote: > Hey - maybe this is a good argument for independently run government > funded radio. It works in Canada, the UK, NZ, and Oz. And it "keeps the > bastards honest". (The slogan of The Australian Democrats.) Not really, Ian. The way it would work here is any government funded radiuo has a government funded viewpoint, and any government funded viewpoint is going to be of the party that controls the coffers for said government funding. Think about it. Amy. <:3 )~~8~ (A bow on the tail, yes.) From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Feb 22 20:41:41 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 23 Feb 2003 04:41:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 25159 invoked from network); 23 Feb 2003 04:41:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Feb 2003 04:41:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.84) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Feb 2003 04:41:40 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.144] by n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 23 Feb 2003 04:41:40 -0000 Date: Sun, 23 Feb 2003 04:41:39 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: BBC World Service -- shortwave vs. XM vs. AM Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 687 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.89.133 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Au contraire! FM is now REQUIRED on all radios receiving AM. Last time I checked, Radio Shack is still selling an AM-only transistor radio for $6.99 a pop -- the Optimus "Pocket-Size AM Radio", which is the latest (and probably final) iteration of their long-running "Flavoradio" series (and just like the Model T, it is now only available in black). > I, for one, refuse to pay $11 per month to access the BBC, Then *don't*! I refuse to pay for cable or satellite TV. Yes, I'm missing out on a lot of good (and a lot of bad) programming. But you know what? I can live without it, and what I get on regular broadcast TV seems fine to me, considering that it's 100% free. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Feb 22 20:56:11 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 23 Feb 2003 04:56:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 32560 invoked from network); 23 Feb 2003 04:56:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Feb 2003 04:56:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Feb 2003 04:56:10 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.169] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 23 Feb 2003 04:56:10 -0000 Date: Sun, 23 Feb 2003 04:56:09 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Best stereo song track ? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <001f01c2dab7$d52f1c60$0101a8c0@pavilion> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 981 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.89.133 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Anything by Enoch Light on Command- 35mm stereo masters. *Anything* on Command Records produced by Enoch Light would be my vote. This music was specifically created to provide the best possible demonstration of the then-new stereo LP medium. The first album they produced (in 1959), "Persuasive Percussion", is probably the best of them all, but despite being a #1 hit in terms of record sales, its tracks received little to no radio airplay, since the instant you play it in Mono, it loses all of its special magic. In terms of more mainstream popular music, there is just too much out there to really narrow it down to a select few, nevermind a single song, but another group to add to the list is the three STEREO songs that resulted from Buddy Holly's last recording session in October 1958 -- "True Love Ways", "It Doesn't Matter Anymore", and "Raining In My Heart". Compared to all his other mono songs, the quality of these tracks is really spectacular. From JH_Radio@GameBox.net Sat Feb 22 21:00:12 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: JH_Radio@GameBox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 23 Feb 2003 05:00:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 42737 invoked from network); 23 Feb 2003 05:00:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Feb 2003 05:00:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO babyruth.hotpop.com) (204.57.55.14) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Feb 2003 05:00:11 -0000 Received: from gamebox.net (kubrick.hotpop.com [204.57.55.16]) by babyruth.hotpop.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 364BB215DA3 for ; Sun, 23 Feb 2003 05:00:09 +0000 (UTC) Received: from -enduser.GameBox.net (pcp03184855pcs.benslm01.pa.comcast.net [68.80.77.117]) by smtp-2.hotpop.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E663D1B865D for ; Sun, 23 Feb 2003 05:00:08 +0000 (UTC) Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030223000402.01a22620@pop.GameBox.net> X-Sender: JH_Radio@pop.GameBox.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Sun, 23 Feb 2003 00:05:07 -0500 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: OT: Stereo stuff Mime-Version: 1.0 X-HotPOP: ----------------------------------------------- Sent By HotPOP.com FREE Email Get your FREE POP email at www.HotPOP.com ----------------------------------------------- From: John X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113800107 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hey.... I wish there was a place to fill all of my oldies true Stereo needs. Preferably on Vinyl. CD is a second choice. Any idea what is out there? Oldies in stereo is the best thing! Love in Christ: John Bensalem, PA Send me an email Aim: RainAngelsRule MSN: RainAngelsRule@hotmail.com My website Welcome to Napster4TheBlind "Prayer does not change God; it changes you." - Authur unknown [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From amymousie@yahoo.com Sat Feb 22 21:39:43 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 23 Feb 2003 05:39:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 60107 invoked from network); 23 Feb 2003 05:39:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Feb 2003 05:39:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Feb 2003 05:39:43 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.140] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 23 Feb 2003 05:39:43 -0000 Date: Sun, 23 Feb 2003 05:39:41 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Best stereo song track ? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1397 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 66.127.242.148 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: > > Anything by Enoch Light on Command- 35mm stereo masters. > > *Anything* on Command Records produced by Enoch Light would be my > vote. This music was specifically created to provide the best > possible demonstration of the then-new stereo LP medium. The first > album they produced (in 1959), "Persuasive Percussion", is probably > the best of them all, but despite being a #1 hit in terms of record > sales, its tracks received little to no radio airplay, since the > instant you play it in Mono, it loses all of its special magic. Now, if only they reissued the CD. > In terms of more mainstream popular music, there is just too much out > there to really narrow it down to a select few, nevermind a single > song, but another group to add to the list is the three STEREO songs > that resulted from Buddy Holly's last recording session in October > 1958 -- "True Love Ways", "It Doesn't Matter Anymore", and "Raining > In My Heart". Compared to all his other mono songs, the quality of > these tracks is really spectacular. There is a fourth song recorded in stereo in that same session- "Moondreams." The best version by far of "True Love Ways" is from the "From The Original Master Tapes" CD, with the studio cuing intro, in wide, hair- tingling stereo. Amy. <:3 )~~8~ From florida_amstereo@hotmail.com Sun Feb 23 08:40:38 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: florida_amstereo@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 23 Feb 2003 16:40:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 30688 invoked from network); 23 Feb 2003 16:40:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Feb 2003 16:40:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.37.24) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Feb 2003 16:40:37 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 23 Feb 2003 08:40:37 -0800 Received: from 209.240.198.61 by pv2fd.pav2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Sun, 23 Feb 2003 16:40:36 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Re: {AMSF} How do we get the FCC off their *ss and DO SOMETHING? Date: Sun, 23 Feb 2003 16:40:36 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 23 Feb 2003 16:40:37.0438 (UTC) FILETIME=[4B2A05E0:01C2DB5A] From: "Donn Tillman" X-Originating-IP: [209.240.198.61] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83914824 Q....How do we get the FCC to get off their ass and to do something?? A.....Political influence {translaccion en español: ¡ mucho dinero! } _________________________________________________________________ STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail From powell@conterra.com Sun Feb 23 09:44:14 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: powell@conterra.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 23 Feb 2003 17:44:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 3300 invoked from network); 23 Feb 2003 17:44:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Feb 2003 17:44:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO ziggy.conterra.com) (66.112.206.20) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Feb 2003 17:44:12 -0000 Received: from ziggy.conterra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ziggy.conterra.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h1NHiBi1005401 for ; Sun, 23 Feb 2003 12:44:11 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from powell@conterra.com) Received: (from www@localhost) by ziggy.conterra.com (8.12.6/8.12.6/Submit) id h1NHiAOn005400 for amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com; Sun, 23 Feb 2003 12:44:10 -0500 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: ziggy.conterra.com: www set sender to powell@conterra.com using -f Received: from 209.213.26.22 ( [209.213.26.22]) as user powell@mail.conterra.com by ziggy.conterra.com with HTTP; Sun, 23 Feb 2003 12:44:10 -0500 Message-ID: <1046022250.3e59086ac92f0@ziggy.conterra.com> Date: Sun, 23 Feb 2003 12:44:10 -0500 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Stereo on vinyl References: <1046021011.330.84867.m12@yahoogroups.com> In-Reply-To: <1046021011.330.84867.m12@yahoogroups.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) 3.1 From: powell@conterra.com X-Originating-IP: 209.213.26.22 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=8062869 X-Yahoo-Profile: W4OPW I have some of those Command albums, but I would like to have ALL of them and the later ones too! I have some Decca London pressings of ...er.....I forget!!! GRRR! Powell @ WKDK 45 miles from his recordings. Powell ------------------------------------------------- This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/ From JH_Radio@GameBox.net Sun Feb 23 10:52:09 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: JH_Radio@GameBox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 23 Feb 2003 18:52:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 24694 invoked from network); 23 Feb 2003 18:52:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Feb 2003 18:52:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO snickers.hotpop.com) (204.57.55.49) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Feb 2003 18:52:08 -0000 Received: from gamebox.net (kubrick.hotpop.com [204.57.55.16]) by snickers.hotpop.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 7D58D71C91 for ; Sun, 23 Feb 2003 18:52:03 +0000 (UTC) Received: from -enduser.GameBox.net (pcp03184855pcs.benslm01.pa.comcast.net [68.80.77.117]) by smtp-2.hotpop.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4C3701B863F for ; Sun, 23 Feb 2003 18:52:06 +0000 (UTC) Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030223135045.019eccd0@pop.GameBox.net> X-Sender: JH_Radio@pop.GameBox.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Sun, 23 Feb 2003 13:56:08 -0500 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: 1680 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-HotPOP: ----------------------------------------------- Sent By HotPOP.com FREE Email Get your FREE POP email at www.HotPOP.com ----------------------------------------------- From: John X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113800107 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi there. Living in Bensalem, PA. I know of a friend of mine named Preya that listens to 1680 AM. She is Indian. Would that possibly be WTTM in AM Stereo? I thought they were Asian. Neil? Anyone? This station apparently plays the kind of stuff that WPRB plays during the weekend show of Indian music. (I'd check but I can't get AM around here, and don't have an AM Stereo Radio yet. Thanks! Love in Christ: John Bensalem, PA Send me an email Aim: RainAngelsRule MSN: RainAngelsRule@hotmail.com My website Welcome to Napster4TheBlind "Prayer does not change God; it changes you." - Authur unknown [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From possumhunter@netzero.net Sun Feb 23 11:03:17 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 23 Feb 2003 19:03:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 83034 invoked from network); 23 Feb 2003 19:03:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Feb 2003 19:03:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.116) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Feb 2003 19:03:13 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 23 Feb 2003 11:03:13 -0800 To: References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030223135045.019eccd0@pop.GameBox.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} 1680 Date: Sun, 23 Feb 2003 14:03:00 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 23 Feb 2003 19:03:13.0852 (UTC) FILETIME=[372F2FC0:01C2DB6E] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.142.90.214] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 John wrote: > I know of a friend of mine named Preya that listens to 1680 AM. She is Indian. > Would that possibly be WTTM in AM Stereo? Yes > > I thought they were Asian. India IS part of Asia. You should hear it in CQUAM AM Stereo! WOW! What a good sounding radio station! Kevin From evergreenterrace@buzzle.com Sun Feb 23 11:21:23 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: evergreenterrace@buzzle.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 23 Feb 2003 19:21:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 57660 invoked from network); 23 Feb 2003 19:21:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Feb 2003 19:21:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.84) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Feb 2003 19:21:22 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.168] by n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 23 Feb 2003 19:21:22 -0000 Date: Sun, 23 Feb 2003 19:21:20 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Best stereo song track ? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 215 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgliradio " X-Originating-IP: 129.44.33.77 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=69711087 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgliradio The stereo mix of Johnny River's "Poor Side of Town" "I Only Have Eyes For You" Art Garfunkel... the first 15 seconds is really all you need. The REMASTERED STEREO MIX of "All You Need Is Love" by the Beatles. From n0uiheric@aol.com Sun Feb 23 12:33:11 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 23 Feb 2003 20:33:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 94775 invoked from network); 23 Feb 2003 20:33:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Feb 2003 20:33:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r09.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.105) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Feb 2003 20:33:11 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-r09.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.158.1c43494a (4254) for ; Sun, 23 Feb 2003 15:33:04 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <158.1c43494a.2b8a89ff@aol.com> Date: Sun, 23 Feb 2003 15:33:03 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} How do we get the FCC off their *ss and DO SOMETHING? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih A public backlash against the deregulation of the media in the United States has been brewing for the last several years. Look at all the negative press (and well-deserved negative press) the corporate media has been getting! You don't need a lot of money to do it...just flood them with your letters! Write your elected officials, too (that's what I did). IBOCrap will never come to pass...I saw the article on WOR's setup in the March edition of QST, the journal of the American Radio Relay League. Those black boxes won't do anything to save AM or FM radio. Only innovative programming and personalities will save AM and FM radio. And keep AM and FM ANALOG ONLY! These bands are not created for digital radio! 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From ai4i@hotmail.com Sun Feb 23 12:40:04 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ai4i@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 23 Feb 2003 20:40:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 94191 invoked from network); 23 Feb 2003 20:40:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Feb 2003 20:40:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (207.68.164.124) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Feb 2003 20:40:03 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 23 Feb 2003 12:40:03 -0800 To: References: <1046021011.330.84867.m12@yahoogroups.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Digest Number 599 Date: Sun, 23 Feb 2003 15:40:02 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 23 Feb 2003 20:40:03.0178 (UTC) FILETIME=[BDCFFCA0:01C2DB7B] From: "Joel Wilson" Reply-To: "Joel Wilson" X-Originating-IP: [216.77.218.33] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=127893550 X-Yahoo-Profile: ai4ijoel My choice for a test song will show how truly bad any station with modern processing equipment can sound. Roberta Flack, "The first time ever I saw your face". The pumping, the hiss, an audioman's worst nightmare (but a great song). Joel Wilson Hello Taxi AI4I ================================= Proud 2-B a pioneering satellite radio subscriber AI4I is always on the trailing edge of technology ================================= From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sun Feb 23 13:39:29 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 23 Feb 2003 21:39:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 68324 invoked from network); 23 Feb 2003 21:39:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Feb 2003 21:39:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.78) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Feb 2003 21:39:29 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.135] by n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 23 Feb 2003 21:39:29 -0000 Date: Sun, 23 Feb 2003 21:39:28 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: OT: The Year The Music Dies Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 311 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.212 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst Interesting article about the recording industry. This will have a direct impact on music radio in general. What kind of effect I don't know. Maybe it will be opportunity for independent broadcasters to fill the niche that will be left by this fiasco. http://www.wired.com/wired/archive/11.02/dirge.html JSG From possumhunter@netzero.net Sun Feb 23 16:19:08 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 24 Feb 2003 00:19:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 46594 invoked from network); 24 Feb 2003 00:19:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Feb 2003 00:19:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.121) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Feb 2003 00:19:08 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 23 Feb 2003 16:19:08 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} OT: The Year The Music Dies Date: Sun, 23 Feb 2003 19:18:52 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 24 Feb 2003 00:19:08.0408 (UTC) FILETIME=[58FAE780:01C2DB9A] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.159.115.187] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 jsgil@hal-pc.org wrote: > This will have a direct impact on music radio in general. What kind of effect I don't know. It will sure drive up music license fees. > > Maybe it will be opportunity for independent broadcasters to fill the niche that will be left by this fiasco. If an independent broadcaster or forward thinking corporation was to get a Class A clear channel AM and have a LIVE music show with a real LIVE band in the studio in the evenings, that station would get a large audience from all over the region and give that independent band LOTS of badly needed publicity. They could model it after the old WLS Barn Dance. That would sound GREAT in CQUAM without the over-processing, hiss, and multipath of FM. Kevin From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Sun Feb 23 16:23:41 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 24 Feb 2003 00:23:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 87146 invoked from network); 24 Feb 2003 00:23:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Feb 2003 00:23:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf31bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.211) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Feb 2003 00:23:39 -0000 Received: from juan ([67.34.188.146]) by imf31bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.25 201-253-122-122-125-20020815) with SMTP id <20030224002538.KRNY1258.imf31bis.bellsouth.net@juan>; Sun, 23 Feb 2003 19:25:38 -0500 Message-ID: <002901c2db9a$fab5a510$af78fea9@juan> To: , Subject: Our New GM...Jim Davis at Treasure and Space Coast Radio Date: Sun, 23 Feb 2003 19:23:39 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit We have a new GM. Jim Davis. This bio is a little old, as it has him at CC, but he is now with us, at Treasure and Space Coast Radio. It's not often that you have a GM with Programming expreience, and a Ham too... I must say, we are excited at the Radio Ranch Here we go....................................... Jim Davis, a native of Buffalo, New York is currently Vice President, Clear Channel Broadcasting of Sarasota Florida. Davis is a second generation and life long broadcaster. Following in the footsteps of his mother who was a singer on WKBW/Buffalo, Davis began his career as an air personality in the Western New York area. He had a successful run at some of the nation's biggest radio stations; including WOR/FM/New York; KHJ/Los Angeles; CKLW/Detroit; WLS-AM/Chicago. While employed by RKO General Broadcasting, Davis was twice nominated for Billboard Magazine's "Major Market Air Personality Of The Year." Davis entered radio management in the early 1970's as Operations Manager of American Broadcasting Corporation's owned and operated Chicago outlet, WDAI-FM. During the next decade, Davis's programming career encompassed several major market management positions including WPEZ/Pittsburgh; WXYZ (ABC O&O)/Detroit; KLIF/Dallas and the flagship station of Gene Autry's Golden West Broadcasters, KMPC/Los Angeles. In 1981, Davis entered senior management by becoming Vice President/General Manager of Radio Station WVAF/Charleston, West Virginia. He served the National Radio Broadcasters Association as State Director; He was on the Board of Directors of the West Virginia Broadcasters Association. Davis received a Federal Appointment as State Chairman of the Emergency Broadcast System. He functioned as President of the Kanawha Valley Amateur Radio Association. In 1982,Additionally, Davis served as coordinator and host of the annual March of Dimes telethons on WVAH TV-23/Charleston where he also hosted a Saturday night weekly broadcast of "The Movie Club." Next, Davis became a partner in radio station WNFI/Daytona Beach, Florida where he was VP/General Manager. Following the sale, Davis remained with the corporation, functioning as interim GM for WCOA/WJLQ/Pennsacola and WPAP/Panama City, both Florida. In 1988, Davis joined Regional Broadcasters of Michigan as General Manager of WGRD AM/FM in Grand Rapids, Michigan.WGRD was voted as "Station of the Year" by the Grand Rapids Radio Broadcasters Association. Davis served as Vice President of that organization during his last year in Grand Rapids. During this time, Davis was appointed by President Warren Potash to a blue ribbon panel of the Radio Advertising Bureau to serve on its New Business Development committee. In early 1991, Jim Davis was appointed Executive Vice President and General Manager of Radio Station WZVU (Oldies 107.1) in Monmouth/Ocean, New Jersey, the nations 44th radio market. Davis returned to Floida upon the sale of WZVU and became General Manager of WFKS in Daytona Beach, the same station he co-owned in the 1980's. Currently, Davis is General Manager of WYNF, WSPB and WSRZ in Sarasota Florida for Clear Channel Communications. Davis has authored a book entitled "The Sales Success Spectrum-A System Of Radio Sales" which is used as a teaching and training manual at WZVU. In his spare time, Davis is a licensed Multi Engine Commercial Instrument rated pilot and owner/operator of a twin engine Aero Commander. As a Civil Air Patrol member he participates and has been trained as a Search & Rescue pilot, looking for downed aircraft survivors. He has been an amateur radio operator since age twelve holding an "EXTRA" class license - His call letters are W2JKD.. He received a "designated examinor" status from the American Radio Relay League in 1985. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Sun Feb 23 16:39:32 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 24 Feb 2003 00:39:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 30841 invoked from network); 24 Feb 2003 00:39:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Feb 2003 00:39:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf21bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.191) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Feb 2003 00:39:30 -0000 Received: from juan ([67.34.188.146]) by imf21bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.25 201-253-122-122-125-20020815) with SMTP id <20030224004129.SNON1399.imf21bis.bellsouth.net@juan> for ; Sun, 23 Feb 2003 19:41:29 -0500 Message-ID: <003b01c2db9d$318cba90$af78fea9@juan> To: Subject: Chris Chubbuck Date: Sun, 23 Feb 2003 19:39:30 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Does anybody remember newscaster Chris Chubbuck, who killed herself while on the air at WXLT-Channel 40 in Sarasota, FL ? I barely remember this, and was looking on the internet for some information a few weeks ago, and there is very little about this. I have posted on some message boards and have received some info, but I am suprised nobody has written a book about it, as this is a haunting subject. Juan Ft. Pierce, FL [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Sun Feb 23 18:06:30 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 24 Feb 2003 02:06:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 49425 invoked from network); 24 Feb 2003 02:06:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Feb 2003 02:06:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web41009.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.93.8) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Feb 2003 02:06:23 -0000 Message-ID: <20030224020623.83403.qmail@web41009.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.35.217] by web41009.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 23 Feb 2003 18:06:23 PST Date: Sun, 23 Feb 2003 18:06:23 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: {AMSF} Chris Chubbuck To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: <003b01c2db9d$318cba90$af78fea9@juan> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio When did it happen? Was it live on air? I work with someone who was there 1982?-1984. Jay __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ From florida_amstereo@hotmail.com Sun Feb 23 18:24:17 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: florida_amstereo@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 24 Feb 2003 02:24:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 80731 invoked from network); 24 Feb 2003 02:24:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Feb 2003 02:24:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.37.95) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Feb 2003 02:24:10 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 23 Feb 2003 18:24:10 -0800 Received: from 209.240.198.61 by pv2fd.pav2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Mon, 24 Feb 2003 02:24:10 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Chris Chubbuck Date: Mon, 24 Feb 2003 02:24:10 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 24 Feb 2003 02:24:10.0902 (UTC) FILETIME=[D0D0A360:01C2DBAB] From: "Donn Tillman" X-Originating-IP: [209.240.198.61] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83914824 Jay, yes she committed suicide on the air, while doing a newscast; this was in July 1974. Before she pulled out the gun, she told the audience that she was going to show them something that had never been done ont eh air before. I wished I had a article from the St Petersburg Times that covered it. The St Pete Times at that point in time helping channel 40 (now call letters WWSB) produce their news. donn 21 miles from Channel 40's transmission tower in Parrish,FL ----Original Message Follows---- From: JNR Reply-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Chris Chubbuck Date: Sun, 23 Feb 2003 18:06:23 -0800 (PST) When did it happen? Was it live on air? I work with someone who was there 1982?-1984. Jay _________________________________________________________________ The new MSN 8: smart spam protection and 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail From JH_Radio@GameBox.net Sun Feb 23 19:24:50 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: JH_Radio@GameBox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 24 Feb 2003 03:24:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 5980 invoked from network); 24 Feb 2003 03:24:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Feb 2003 03:24:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO snickers.hotpop.com) (204.57.55.49) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Feb 2003 03:24:48 -0000 Received: from gamebox.net (kubrick.hotpop.com [204.57.55.16]) by snickers.hotpop.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 4584472067 for ; Mon, 24 Feb 2003 03:24:45 +0000 (UTC) Received: from -enduser.GameBox.net (pcp03184855pcs.benslm01.pa.comcast.net [68.80.77.117]) by smtp-2.hotpop.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 63A561B85AA for ; Mon, 24 Feb 2003 03:24:14 +0000 (UTC) Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030223222522.0292c2b0@pop.GameBox.net> X-Sender: JH_Radio@pop.GameBox.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Sun, 23 Feb 2003 22:26:50 -0500 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Chris Chubbuck In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 X-HotPOP: ----------------------------------------------- Sent By HotPOP.com FREE Email Get your FREE POP email at www.HotPOP.com ----------------------------------------------- From: John X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113800107 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Oh my gosh! Why why why? That's sad! Okay i'm going to stray off topic for a second here. But nothing in life is that bad. And before I go religious, I'll stop right here and now. Piece. At 02:24 AM 2/24/03 +0000, you wrote: >Jay, yes she committed suicide on the air, while doing a newscast; this was >in July 1974. > >Before she pulled out the gun, she told the audience that she was going to >show them something that had never been done ont eh air before. > >I wished I had a article from the St Petersburg Times that covered it. > >The St Pete Times at that point in time helping channel 40 (now call letters >WWSB) produce their news. > >donn >21 miles from Channel 40's transmission tower in Parrish,FL > >----Original Message Follows---- >From: JNR >Reply-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com >To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com >Subject: Re: {AMSF} Chris Chubbuck >Date: Sun, 23 Feb 2003 18:06:23 -0800 (PST) > >When did it happen? Was it live on air? I work >with someone who was there 1982?-1984. > >Jay > > > >_________________________________________________________________ >The new MSN 8: smart spam protection and 2 months FREE* >http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail > > >Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Love in Christ: John Bensalem, PA Send me an email Aim: RainAngelsRule MSN: RainAngelsRule@hotmail.com My website Welcome to Napster4TheBlind "Prayer does not change God; it changes you." - Authur unknown [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Sun Feb 23 21:40:07 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 24 Feb 2003 05:40:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 72660 invoked from network); 24 Feb 2003 05:40:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Feb 2003 05:40:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web41006.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.93.5) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Feb 2003 05:40:05 -0000 Message-ID: <20030224054005.26911.qmail@web41006.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.35.217] by web41006.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 23 Feb 2003 21:40:05 PST Date: Sun, 23 Feb 2003 21:40:05 -0800 (PST) Subject: Letter to WBZ To: AMSF MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio I wrote this letter just now. After 1½ years in mono and being within their groundwave, I have written this letter: To WBZ Engineering and Programming February 24, 2003 Gentlemen, I am writing you in hopes that you will resume broadcasting in C-QUAM Stereo on WBZ/1030. I first heard your stereo sound around 1994 and was blown away at how GREAT it sounded! In fact, one of the reasons why I bought an AM Stereo-capable radio for my car was so that I could hear your station in stereo. Even when I lived down in Florida, it was great to hear a voice from home, IN STEREO! I am dismayed that WBZ is now mono and have made it a point NOT to listen to WBZ. I have TWO ears, not one and wish mono AM broadcasters realized that. I have also heard that IBOC has too many inherent problems to work as well as C-QUAM does. From the March 2003 article in QST Magazine describing digital AM broadcasting, it says that the bitrate for AM is 96kB/s. That seems like any audio on IBOC AM will have the same harshness as a 96kB/s data stream. I do realize that the engineer quoted in there said it will sound better than an MP3 of the same data stream, but a computer stream doesn't go through the air either and would not encounter such problems as AM radio does like fading. Plus, there is the added problem of nighttime operation. From early reports it sounds like this would be all but impossible with IBOC because of skywave conditions. Where analog stations MAY be heard now, they wouldn't be with digital. Also, there is talk that AM would have to go digital day and back to analog at night. Two more problems are the fact that digital radios are incompatible with current analog radios which would render some 520 Million radios obsolete and the fact that broadcasters and receiver manufacturers have to pay a hefty sum to iBiquity which would result in the cost to the consumer going up. The engineer in the QST article said that while a normal car radio would cost $350, a digital one would cost $450. Why pay more for a product when a better one exists at a fraction of the cost. In fact, I only paid $100 TOTAL for my car radio that has C-QUAM. I hope you will reconsider your decision to stop broadcasting in C-QUAM Stereo and will resume very shortly. Thank you for your time, Jay Rogers, N1WVQ Anything I may have missed? Jay __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ From mwradio@gmx.net Sun Feb 23 22:39:53 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: mwradio@gmx.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 24 Feb 2003 06:39:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 87467 invoked from network); 24 Feb 2003 06:39:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Feb 2003 06:39:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO smtp.suscom.net) (64.78.119.248) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Feb 2003 06:39:52 -0000 Received: from localhost (userweb.suscom.net [64.78.119.248]) by smtp.suscom.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 435AA114F5A for ; Mon, 24 Feb 2003 01:33:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from winxphk4mvpe0a (ip74.64.susc.suscom.net [64.78.64.74]) by smtp.suscom.net (Postfix) with SMTP id B597611518E for ; Mon, 24 Feb 2003 01:33:41 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <011d01c2dbce$aa7efc70$0200a8c0@winxphk4mvpe0a> To: References: <003b01c2db9d$318cba90$af78fea9@juan> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Chris Chubbuck Date: Mon, 24 Feb 2003 01:33:38 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-Virus-Scanned: by AMaViS new-20020517 From: "Joseph Esposito" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=93604673 X-Yahoo-Profile: espositojm I never heard of that incident but I am old enough to remember PA Treasurer Bud Dwyer shooting himself at a Press Conference in Harrisburg. The Press Conference was held around 11 am that morning. I was home from school and watched the unedited replay of the press conference on Channel 11, WPXI in Pittsburgh. WPXI and another station in Philly were the only two that ran the uncut feed. I wonder why the lowest rated newcast in Pittsburgh decided that it was in the publics best interest to see a desperate politician shooting himself in the head.?? Joe Esposito ----- Original Message ----- From: "Juan / John Gualda" To: Sent: Sunday, February 23, 2003 7:39 PM Subject: {AMSF} Chris Chubbuck > Does anybody remember newscaster Chris Chubbuck, who killed herself while on the air at WXLT-Channel 40 in Sarasota, FL ? > I barely remember this, and was looking on the internet for some information a few weeks ago, and there is very little about this. I have posted on some message boards and have received some info, but I am suprised nobody has written a book about it, as this is a haunting subject. > > Juan > Ft. Pierce, FL > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Mon Feb 24 03:37:12 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 24 Feb 2003 11:37:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 77202 invoked from network); 24 Feb 2003 11:37:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Feb 2003 11:37:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf40bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.63) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Feb 2003 11:37:11 -0000 Received: from juan ([67.34.188.146]) by imf40bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.25 201-253-122-122-125-20020815) with SMTP id <20030224113910.IGGY2831.imf40bis.bellsouth.net@juan> for ; Mon, 24 Feb 2003 06:39:10 -0500 Message-ID: <000f01c2dbf9$1295ebf0$af78fea9@juan> To: References: <20030224020623.83403.qmail@web41009.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Chris Chubbuck Date: Mon, 24 Feb 2003 06:37:12 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Jay, It happened in July, 1974. Ask your co-worker what he/she knows about the event. Even though it was after it happened, they may have a story or two to tell passed on from employees who might have been there. A haunting and sad story indeed. Juan ----- Original Message ----- From: JNR To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, February 23, 2003 9:06 PM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Chris Chubbuck When did it happen? Was it live on air? I work with someone who was there 1982?-1984. Jay __________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Mon Feb 24 03:47:22 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 24 Feb 2003 11:47:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 66070 invoked from network); 24 Feb 2003 11:47:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Feb 2003 11:47:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf40bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.65) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Feb 2003 11:47:21 -0000 Received: from juan ([67.34.188.146]) by imf40bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.25 201-253-122-122-125-20020815) with SMTP id <20030224114920.IVKA2831.imf40bis.bellsouth.net@juan> for ; Mon, 24 Feb 2003 06:49:20 -0500 Message-ID: <001901c2dbfa$7df0df80$af78fea9@juan> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Chris Chubbuck Date: Mon, 24 Feb 2003 06:47:21 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit at 9:38 am on July 15th, 1974, about 8 minutes into Suncaost Digest, a variety show on WXLT-TV in Sarasota, Florida, anchorwoman Chris Chubbuck, 30, looked straight at the camera and said: "In keeping with Channel 40's policy of bringing you the latest in blood and guts and in living color, you're going to see another first..an attempt at suicide." Whereupon she pulled out a gun from a shopping bag and shot herself in the head. She died 14 hours later. This is about all I know. I can only imagine what demons would make a young woman kill herself on live TV. So sad. Juan ----- Original Message ----- From: Donn Tillman To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, February 23, 2003 9:24 PM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Chris Chubbuck Jay, yes she committed suicide on the air, while doing a newscast; this was in July 1974. Before she pulled out the gun, she told the audience that she was going to show them something that had never been done ont eh air before. I wished I had a article from the St Petersburg Times that covered it. The St Pete Times at that point in time helping channel 40 (now call letters WWSB) produce their news. donn 21 miles from Channel 40's transmission tower in Parrish,FL ----Original Message Follows---- From: JNR Reply-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Chris Chubbuck Date: Sun, 23 Feb 2003 18:06:23 -0800 (PST) When did it happen? Was it live on air? I work with someone who was there 1982?-1984. Jay [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From ai4i@hotmail.com Mon Feb 24 09:23:23 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ai4i@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 24 Feb 2003 17:23:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 43205 invoked from network); 24 Feb 2003 17:17:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Feb 2003 17:17:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (207.68.164.118) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Feb 2003 17:17:11 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 24 Feb 2003 09:17:11 -0800 To: References: <1046105859.852.68547.m12@yahoogroups.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Digest Number 600 Date: Mon, 24 Feb 2003 12:17:06 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 24 Feb 2003 17:17:11.0358 (UTC) FILETIME=[914165E0:01C2DC28] From: "Joel Wilson" Reply-To: "Joel Wilson" X-Originating-IP: [216.77.218.95] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=127893550 X-Yahoo-Profile: ai4ijoel She will always be remembered for her dedication to showmanship. We can only hope that the tape was not lost. Joel Wilson Hello Taxi AI4I ========================================= Proud 2-B a pioneering satellite radio subscriber AI4I is always on the trailing edge of technology ========================================= Message: 19 Date: Mon, 24 Feb 2003 06:47:21 -0500 From: "Juan / John Gualda" Subject: Re: Chris Chubbuck I can only imagine what demons would make a young woman kill herself on live TV. So sad. Juan ----- Original Message ----- From: Donn Tillman To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, February 23, 2003 9:24 PM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Chris Chubbuck From amfmdx@fastq.com Mon Feb 24 10:06:23 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 24 Feb 2003 18:06:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 71415 invoked from network); 24 Feb 2003 18:06:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Feb 2003 18:06:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Feb 2003 18:06:15 -0000 Received: from fastq (d38-osel-phx.fastq.com [216.190.249.70]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id h1OI6ET97820 for ; Mon, 24 Feb 2003 11:06:14 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <004701c2dc2f$3078ec40$b0d63fd1@com> To: Subject: Answering John's Question Date: Mon, 24 Feb 2003 11:04:33 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla John, Which of the big corporations do you work for? I am not so worried about AM stereo. Its a technology. All technologies get surpassed by something new. I am not worried about programming. Whether I like the programming or not, this too gets surpassed by something else. I only wish that the references to the baser things of life would not be broadcast so graphically. I am against any form of transmission scheme that will not support legacy systems currently in use. This is what I am against. I am against a system that INTENTIONALLY creates interference. Therefore I am against IBAC. I still think that the FCC should give channel 14 and 15 to digital radio and give each station a 100 kHz piece of bandwidth. This will open up 12 mHz for digital and open up 120 freqs for use. Let AM and FM die if they will. I personally believe that AM is just about dead as a transmission scheme and suspect that in 10 years if left alone would have about 25% of the stations that are on now. I am against the current implementation of digital radio in the USA. Now, who is it that you work for? Kevin Message: 6 Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2003 18:34:08 -0000 From: "bta_50g " Subject: Re: Reckoning will come Kevin, It is not in the best interest of broadcasters to "piss" their listeners off, otherwise they won't have any product (listeners) to sell to the advertisers. I suspect the problem in your case is that either you as a listener are not the product the advertisers are looking for, and hence the broadcasters aren't catering to your tastes, or if you are someone the advertisers would like to reach, your tastes are so specialized that if the broadcasters attempted to cater to them, in order to add you to their product offering, they would fail to attract large numbers of other listeners that the broadcasters customers, the advertisers, also want to reach. So how is it that the broadcasters are "pissing" you off? Is it that you don't like the programming that is being offered, or that you don't like IBOC, or is it that you don't like the fact that the broadcast industry failed to embrace AM stereo? John This message has been composed of recycled electrons. None of these electrons has been harmed or injured in the creation and transmission of this message but they have been shamelessly exploited for this use. From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Mon Feb 24 10:18:20 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 24 Feb 2003 18:18:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 83355 invoked from network); 24 Feb 2003 18:18:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Feb 2003 18:18:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web41015.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.93.14) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Feb 2003 18:18:15 -0000 Message-ID: <20030224181815.12053.qmail@web41015.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.35.217] by web41015.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 24 Feb 2003 10:18:15 PST Date: Mon, 24 Feb 2003 10:18:15 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: {AMSF} Answering John's Question To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: <004701c2dc2f$3078ec40$b0d63fd1@com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio No, let's go L-Band 1.452-1.492 GHz like the rest of the world and have three domestic broadcast bands. THEN let AM & FM wither on the vine. My hunch is that FM will go more quickly than AM if AM stays true to a community. Some AM trying to hit another town will probably go as fast as FM if not faster. 73, Jay,N1WVQ __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Feb 24 10:40:58 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 24 Feb 2003 18:40:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 64976 invoked from network); 24 Feb 2003 18:40:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Feb 2003 18:40:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Feb 2003 18:40:53 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.139] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 24 Feb 2003 18:40:53 -0000 Date: Mon, 24 Feb 2003 18:40:52 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Answering John's Question Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <004701c2dc2f$3078ec40$b0d63fd1@com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 997 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > I still think that the FCC should give channel 14 and 15 to digital > radio and give each station a 100 kHz piece of bandwidth. This will > open up 12 mHz for digital and open up 120 freqs for use. Let AM and > FM die if they will. In many parts of the USA, the spectrum space of the first few UHF TV channels are already being used for two-way radio communications (police, fire, etc.). For example, my town uses 500.4125 and 503.4125 MHz for its police communications and this is within what would normally be allocated to UHF TV channel 19 (500-506 MHz). The VHF-Low region (29-50 MHz) is quickly opening up as 2-way services move up to higher frequencies, but this frequency range is not favored because of its tendency to have unpredictable long-range DX, especially during summer months. Fire departments are amongst the last to use communications at 33 MHz and there are sporadic cases of fire calls being heard from over 1000 miles away, causing much confusion. From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Mon Feb 24 11:23:58 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 24 Feb 2003 19:23:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 35368 invoked from network); 24 Feb 2003 19:23:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Feb 2003 19:23:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web41015.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.93.14) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Feb 2003 19:23:57 -0000 Message-ID: <20030224192357.29462.qmail@web41015.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.35.217] by web41015.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 24 Feb 2003 11:23:57 PST Date: Mon, 24 Feb 2003 11:23:57 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Answering John's Question To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio I think WBFM should also have 42-50MHz returned to it with usage exclusively for schools and community radio stations. 73, Jay,N1WVQ __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ From bharrisonb@yahoo.com Mon Feb 24 11:59:33 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: bharrisonb@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 24 Feb 2003 19:59:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 49592 invoked from network); 24 Feb 2003 19:59:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Feb 2003 19:59:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Feb 2003 19:59:29 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.139] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 24 Feb 2003 19:59:15 -0000 Date: Mon, 24 Feb 2003 19:59:14 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: No stereo in Boston Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 562 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bharrisonb " X-Originating-IP: 64.215.218.2 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=69885139 X-Yahoo-Profile: bharrisonb > (and even mentioned that other people had inquired about WJIB's lack of Stereo as well). Yup ... I was one who kept asking Bob about turning the AM Stereo exciter back on. It's wonderful ! Almost every day I create a 7 hour or so .MP3 of the broadcast (in stereo) from 9:00 AM (when the music starts after re-broadcast of Radio France International). I then CR-ROM the files, and listen to them at my leasure ... car, office, etc. It's great to have commercial free music on demand, knowing my Carver TX-11a and PC did all the work ! - Bob === From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Mon Feb 24 18:59:49 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 25 Feb 2003 02:59:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 24880 invoked from network); 25 Feb 2003 02:59:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Feb 2003 02:59:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf23bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.195) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Feb 2003 02:59:45 -0000 Received: from juan ([68.158.180.22]) by imf23bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.25 201-253-122-122-125-20020815) with SMTP id <20030225030144.KLWX16068.imf23bis.bellsouth.net@juan> for ; Mon, 24 Feb 2003 22:01:44 -0500 Message-ID: <004301c2dc79$f3ffb410$af78fea9@juan> To: References: <004701c2dc2f$3078ec40$b0d63fd1@com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Answering John's Question Date: Mon, 24 Feb 2003 21:59:45 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Just my two cents here... Lately, I have stayed away from the IBOC discussion here because I am tired of talking about it on the AM Stereo group. There are some on this list who are passionate about it, and I respect that. But it does no good to hash and re-hash it here. The battle is "out there". We can talk until we are blue in the face. AND... For those who hide and make comments when it is neccesary. Do something good, and take it outside...If you are passionate about what you feel, and that is IBOC, Tell your friends, write the FCC, write your congressman in DC, Just do something. And for those on here who call us names on other lists.....get the hell off the list. Do something other with your time. Because of the heart of those here, Like Kevin and all the others who are not afraid of offending........ who want to keep what little we have on what's known as the AM Broadcast Band in the future......give us peace..and a little respect. I you have a passion for something, speak off like you have a pair.... Juan Ft. Pierce, FL, USA ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" To: Sent: Monday, February 24, 2003 1:04 PM Subject: {AMSF} Answering John's Question > John, > > Which of the big corporations do you work for? > > I am not so worried about AM stereo. Its a technology. All technologies get > surpassed by something new. I am not worried about programming. Whether I > like the programming or not, this too gets surpassed by something else. I > only wish that the references to the baser things of life would not be > broadcast so graphically. > > I am against any form of transmission scheme that will not support legacy > systems currently in use. This is what I am against. I am against a system > that INTENTIONALLY creates interference. Therefore I am against IBAC. I > still think that the FCC should give channel 14 and 15 to digital radio and > give each station a 100 kHz piece of bandwidth. This will open up 12 mHz for > digital and open up 120 freqs for use. Let AM and FM die if they will. > > I personally believe that AM is just about dead as a transmission scheme and > suspect that in 10 years if left alone would have about 25% of the stations > that are on now. > > I am against the current implementation of digital radio in the USA. > > Now, who is it that you work for? > > Kevin > > Message: 6 > Date: Sat, 22 Feb 2003 18:34:08 -0000 > From: "bta_50g " > Subject: Re: Reckoning will come > > > Kevin, > > It is not in the best interest of broadcasters to "piss" their > listeners off, otherwise they won't have any product (listeners) to > sell to the advertisers. I suspect the problem in your case is that > either you as a listener are not the product the advertisers are > looking for, and hence the broadcasters aren't catering to your > tastes, or if you are someone the advertisers would like to reach, > your tastes are so specialized that if the broadcasters attempted to > cater to them, in order to add you to their product offering, they > would fail to attract large numbers of other listeners that the > broadcasters customers, the advertisers, also want to reach. > > So how is it that the broadcasters are "pissing" you off? Is it that > you don't like the programming that is being offered, or that you > don't like IBOC, or is it that you don't like the fact that the > broadcast industry failed to embrace AM stereo? > > John > > This message has been composed of recycled electrons. None of these > electrons has been harmed or injured in the creation and transmission of > this message but they have been shamelessly exploited for this use. > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Feb 24 20:49:47 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 25 Feb 2003 04:49:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 83572 invoked from network); 25 Feb 2003 04:49:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Feb 2003 04:49:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Feb 2003 04:49:44 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.169] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 25 Feb 2003 04:49:44 -0000 Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 04:49:42 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Calling for Rationality in the IBOC Discussions Here Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <004301c2dc79$f3ffb410$af78fea9@juan> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1884 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.83.7 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Lately, I have stayed away from the IBOC discussion here because I > am tired of talking about it on the AM Stereo group. > There are some on this list who are passionate about it, and I > respect that. But it does no good to hash and re-hash it here. The > battle is "out there". We can talk until we are blue in the face. This is a very good point. By now, any attempts to point out the many drawbacks and flaws of the IBOC/"HD Radio" system here is merely "preaching to the choir". Unless you (and that's a general "you", not specific to any individuals here) have something NEW to report about IBOC, such as new reception reports or news of a new IBOC station going on the air, please... give it a rest, guys! All of the regulars here have heard it many times by now, and I fear it's even starting to estrange some people from being more active here. Even passionately written letters, petitions, etc. written to the FCC, radio magazines, or whoever else won't do much good unless they are backed up by FACTS, rather than by unproven conjecture. Saying that IBOC "will force X number of stations off the air" is merely conjecture at this point, and a very far-fetched conjecture at that. And constantly issuing these kinds of statements paints a picture of the members of this Forum has being radical and firmly entrenched in our opinions of IBOC, which most of us are not. Most of us here are simply reporting what we've experienced so far, and just waiting to see what will come next. For those who wish to more aggressively campaign against IBOC, I remind you that "Amy" has created an "anti-IBOC" group for this purpose: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/no2iboc So, please guys, let's just take a step back from our battle positions and keep it a bit more civil here -- and a bit more open- minded as well. Kevin T. Sysop of The AM Stereo Forum From amymousie@yahoo.com Mon Feb 24 21:23:23 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 25 Feb 2003 05:23:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 52693 invoked from network); 25 Feb 2003 05:23:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Feb 2003 05:23:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.69) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Feb 2003 05:23:22 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.150] by n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 25 Feb 2003 05:23:22 -0000 Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 05:23:22 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Calling for Rationality in the IBOC Discussions Here Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1107 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 67.115.110.236 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: > For those who wish to more aggressively campaign against IBOC, I > remind you that "Amy" has created an "anti-IBOC" group for this > purpose: > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/no2iboc Yes, that was -exactly- why I created "no2iboc"- To draw the IBOC discussions off here (so we all could get back to why we're all here in the first place- AM stereo) and let anyone who needs to discuss IBOC to do so there as much as they wish. I'm personally quite disenchanted with corporate/commercial broadcasting, but I love AM stereo, and I want to see AM stereo survive, no matter what, without resorting to hate tactics. I give you all a place for anti-IBOC discussions, and you're all welcome to use it for such. I, too, and quite bitter about this IBOC mess, or I wouldn't have bothered. But here, it's AM stereo. That's why I'm here, and I would imagine, so are most of you. I don't even care if it's C-QUAM, ISB, or any other form of analog AM stereo, I just care about AM stereo. Amy. <:3 )~~8~ From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Feb 24 21:32:34 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 25 Feb 2003 05:32:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 58502 invoked from network); 25 Feb 2003 05:32:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Feb 2003 05:32:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Feb 2003 05:32:33 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.165] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 25 Feb 2003 05:32:33 -0000 Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 05:32:32 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Calling for Rationality in the IBOC Discussions Here Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 769 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.83.7 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics p.s. Messages which use the term "IBOCrap" or similarly childish disparanging remarks will be deleted. If we want to be treated with respect, we have to act in a respectful manner, even towards the things that we most stongly disagree with. Those of us who have been around for a while will remember how overuse of the stupid mantra "Clear Channel Sucks" eventually led to a major setback in our cause. I don't want a similar thing to happen here in respect to IBOC or anything else. A lot of us have things that we feel strongly about, but if you are so strongly against IBOC that you have to resort to radical speculation and childish name-calling to make your arguments against it, then please do so elsewhere. Kevin T. Sysop of The AM Stereo Forum From KC4QLP@aol.com Mon Feb 24 21:33:44 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 25 Feb 2003 05:33:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 35668 invoked from network); 25 Feb 2003 05:33:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Feb 2003 05:33:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m07.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.162) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Feb 2003 05:33:44 -0000 Received: from KC4QLP@aol.com by imo-m07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.1d2.395baab (3310) for ; Tue, 25 Feb 2003 00:33:36 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1d2.395baab.2b8c5a2f@aol.com> Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 00:33:35 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} A Letter To The ARRL on WOR's IBOCrap Operation To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: 7.0 for Windows sub 10641 From: KC4QLP@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=1448135 X-Yahoo-Profile: kc4qlp Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 2/24/03 11:42:32 PM Eastern Standard Time, jbyrns@rcn.com writes: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, n0uiheric@a... wrote: > > Bob, this letter is to meant to make the ARRL membership aware of the > > desecration of the AM and FM broadcast bands by IBOCrap, and the > potential > > for interference from IBOCrap users to Amateur Radio operators in the > 1.8-2.0 > > MHz and 144-148 MHz range. > > Could you describe the mechanism by which IBOC could possibly cause > interference in the 1.8-2.0 MHz and 144-148 MHz range? This seems > more like the result of an overactive imagination than a real > possibility. > > John > > Those were my exact thoughts. There are not many amateur radio operators that do not know about any of the lastest technologies. ARRL represents a small portion of the amateurs in this country,the USA..and certainly have their own agendas and pork barrel projects that often do not focus on the good for ham radio.Sound like some other "agencies" and "groups"?Sure it does. What IBOC has to do with amateur radio exactly is beyond me and why would they care? IBOC is not moving to the ham radio bands. ARRL is a ham radio organization for hams NAB on the other hand is not ..its for broadcasters.The NAB, like the ARRL has their own agendas and pork barrel projects.Unless your a well paid member in politics..nothing will change..no matter how much noise you make,(phone calls,letters,emails..etc etc..). Sucks yeah...but preaching to the choir isnt going to make those "changes". I'm in the "choir" here and I'm tired of being "preached" to. It all boils down to senseless topics like this on here that questions my and others presence on this group. Bob Carter Operations/Engineering--Max Media Radio Group WGAI-NewsRadio 560 AM Stereo .., WCXL 104.1 Beach 104..., WQDK 99.3 Q-Country..., WWOC 94.5 WaterCountry 94.5 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ --------------------------------- Mid-Atlantic Engineering Services--providing radio stations with engineering services in the middle eastern Atlantic area.--Chief Engineer--WRCS-AM 970 Ahoskie NC,WBXB-FM 100.1 Edenton NC,WURB-FM 97.7 Windsor NC, Ray Communications Radio Network- e-mail:matlnenginerinsc@earthlink.net ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ --------------------------- AM Stereo Radio list moderator----- amstereo-subcribe@topica.com ------------------------KC4QLP Amateur Radio------------------------------------------ Skywarn monitor-AKQ-Wakefield Va www.qsl.net/kc4qlp Echolink node # 56704 -- 146.590 VHF,440.850 UHF (PL 131.8) Proposed Repeater-145.250 _______________________________________________________ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From amymousie@yahoo.com Mon Feb 24 22:07:46 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 25 Feb 2003 06:07:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 3270 invoked from network); 25 Feb 2003 06:07:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Feb 2003 06:07:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.83) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Feb 2003 06:07:46 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.148] by n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 25 Feb 2003 06:07:46 -0000 Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 06:07:45 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} A Letter To The ARRL on WOR's IBOCrap Operation Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <1d2.395baab.2b8c5a2f@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 394 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 67.115.110.236 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie > In a message dated 2/24/03 11:42:32 PM Eastern Standard Time, jbyrns@r... > writes: > > Could you describe the mechanism by which IBOC could possibly cause > > interference in the 1.8-2.0 MHz and 144-148 MHz range? This seems > > more like the result of an overactive imagination than a real > > possibility. > > > > John Harmonics and RF/IF mixes, I would think. Amy. <:3 )~~8~ From n0uiheric@aol.com Mon Feb 24 23:15:32 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 25 Feb 2003 07:15:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 79060 invoked from network); 25 Feb 2003 07:15:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Feb 2003 07:15:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m02.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.5) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Feb 2003 07:15:31 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-m02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.c6.18f16a71 (18707) for ; Tue, 25 Feb 2003 02:15:25 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 02:15:24 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} A Letter To The ARRL on WOR's IBOCrap Operation To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih Let me explain one thing: IBOCrap refers to the sound quality; it's a bunch of crap. Just listen to an Internet audio feed on a dial-up modem; that's what IBOCrap sounds like. It's time to switch this to the No2IBOC group...and continue on THE REAL DEAL: C-QUAM AM Stereo! 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Mon Feb 24 23:21:32 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 25 Feb 2003 07:21:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 3594 invoked from network); 25 Feb 2003 07:21:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Feb 2003 07:21:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d09.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.41) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Feb 2003 07:21:30 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-d09.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.60.2de2d791 (18707) for ; Tue, 25 Feb 2003 02:21:26 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <60.2de2d791.2b8c7376@aol.com> Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 02:21:26 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} A Letter To The ARRL on WOR's IBOCrap Operation To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih The 160 meter Amateur Radio band is the second harmonic of the 900-1000 kHz range; Hams close to IBOC transmitters may find interference to their signals from the IBOC signals. Some FM signals may bleed over to the two-meter band near transmitter sites; adding IBOC would make it difficult for Hams to work weak signal contacts on the same band. I'm not saying that it will happen, just that the potential is there. It is not speculation. AM Stereo never caused any problems for the 160 meter Hams...there's no logic in dropping this proven technology. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From g_keighron@yahoo.ie Mon Feb 24 23:38:42 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: g_keighron@yahoo.ie X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 25 Feb 2003 07:38:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 67383 invoked from network); 25 Feb 2003 07:38:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Feb 2003 07:38:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.78) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Feb 2003 07:38:41 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.133] by n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 25 Feb 2003 07:38:41 -0000 Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 07:38:40 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: IBOC Rap? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <1d2.395baab.2b8c5a2f@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 424 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Graham Keighron " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.83.7 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=138665970 X-Yahoo-Profile: g_keighron KC4QLP@aol.com wrote: > It all boils down to senseless topics like this on here that > questions my and others presence on this group. Speaking of questions, I have two on my mind: 1. what does IBOC have to do with rap music....? 2. what is the point of having a "signature" that is 50 pages long and includes your full r=E9sum=E9 and life story....? g.k. (who follows the K.I.S.S. rule when it comes to online .sigs) From n0uiheric@aol.com Tue Feb 25 00:05:28 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 25 Feb 2003 08:05:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 34048 invoked from network); 25 Feb 2003 08:05:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Feb 2003 08:05:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m04.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.7) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Feb 2003 08:05:28 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-m04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.149.b5c7667 (18707) for ; Tue, 25 Feb 2003 03:05:22 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <149.b5c7667.2b8c7dc2@aol.com> Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 03:05:22 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC Rap? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih It has nothing to do with rap music, it's the inferior sound quality of IBOC. AM Stereo is SUPERIOR to IBOC. And my signature is NOT 50 pages long...just nine lines, which is not even enough to fill a whole page! And my resume is not 50 pages, it was two pages at the most. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From amymousie@yahoo.com Tue Feb 25 00:43:39 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 25 Feb 2003 08:43:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 85074 invoked from network); 25 Feb 2003 08:43:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Feb 2003 08:43:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.90) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Feb 2003 08:43:38 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.136] by n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 25 Feb 2003 08:43:38 -0000 Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 08:43:34 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: IBOC Rap? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 314 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 67.115.110.236 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Graham Keighron " wrote: > 1. what does IBOC have to do with rap music....? *snerk* > g.k. > (who follows the K.I.S.S. rule when it comes to online .sigs) Ah, the KISS Principle... I miss seeing that in praqctice.... Amy. <:3 )~~8~ From amymousie@yahoo.com Tue Feb 25 00:48:54 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 25 Feb 2003 08:48:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 18081 invoked from network); 25 Feb 2003 08:48:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Feb 2003 08:48:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Feb 2003 08:48:53 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.163] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 25 Feb 2003 08:48:53 -0000 Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 08:48:52 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: IBOC Rap? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <149.b5c7667.2b8c7dc2@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 577 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 67.115.110.236 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, n0uiheric@a... wrote: > It has nothing to do with rap music, it's the inferior sound quality of IBOC. > AM Stereo is SUPERIOR to IBOC. AM stereo is both usable and transparent. (Transparent meaning no-one will notice it when in operation unless you actually HAVE a receiver able to use it.) > And my signature is NOT 50 pages long...just nine lines, which is not even > enough to fill a whole page! And my resume is not 50 pages, it was two pages > at the most. The Usenet .sig limit is traditionally 4 lines. Amy. <:3 )~~8~ From jbyrns@rcn.com Tue Feb 25 05:20:32 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@rcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 25 Feb 2003 13:20:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 80411 invoked from network); 25 Feb 2003 13:20:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Feb 2003 13:20:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.84) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Feb 2003 13:20:31 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.178] by n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 25 Feb 2003 13:20:14 -0000 Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 13:20:06 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} A Letter To The ARRL on WOR's IBOCrap Operation Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 690 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bta_50g " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=138635554 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "amymousie " < amymousie@y...> wrote: > > In a message dated 2/24/03 11:42:32 PM Eastern Standard Time, > jbyrns@r... > > writes: > > > Could you describe the mechanism by which IBOC could possibly > cause > > > interference in the 1.8-2.0 MHz and 144-148 MHz range? This > seems > > > more like the result of an overactive imagination than a real > > > possibility. > > > > > > John > > Harmonics and RF/IF mixes, I would think. If that is the case, it is a receiver design problem, not the fault of the IBOC stereo broadcasts. Hams who experience this problem should think about buying a better quality receiver. John From krichards@wor710.com Tue Feb 25 08:16:32 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 39685 invoked from network); 25 Feb 2003 16:16:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Feb 2003 16:16:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Feb 2003 16:16:31 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: krichards@wor710.com Received: from [66.218.66.142] by n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 25 Feb 2003 16:16:31 -0000 X-Sender: krichards@wor710.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 25 Feb 2003 15:46:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 25443 invoked from network); 25 Feb 2003 15:46:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Feb 2003 15:46:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO buckleyradio.com) (161.58.14.6) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Feb 2003 15:46:37 -0000 Received: from kerrydesk (pool-162-83-163-112.ny5030.east.verizon.net [162.83.163.112]) by buckleyradio.com (8.11.6) id h1PFkaL17392 for ; Tue, 25 Feb 2003 10:46:36 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <001501c2dce4$6b17eee0$2a01010a@kerrydesk> To: Subject: Thank You Kevin! Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 10:41:46 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Kerry Richards" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=136545831 X-Yahoo-Profile: kerryrichards710 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-eGroups-Approved-By: kevtronics via web; 25 Feb 2003 16:16:29 -0000 Thanks, Kevin, you hit it on the nose. This should not be the place to bitch and moan about IBOC. As a newer member of this forum and Chief Engineer at WOR, I think the HD radio scheme should be considered just another way to deliver stereo audio on AM. Once the HD radios are out there we will all get a chance to hear the difference between C-Quam and HD, but the bottom line being they will both be delivered via the same transmission means "In Band On Channel". At that point we can all have an intelligent conversation about how good or bad HD sounds compared to CQuam. We will also be able to see how much actual interference is caused by the new HD stations, both AM and FM coming on air each month now. As the industry and the FCC have embraced this new technology, we need to keep an open mind and see and hear the results. Sometimes change is a good thing, sometimes it is not. A little less hysteria, and more logical facts and observations seem far more appropriate. For those of you into CQuam, we just found out that the Visteon test radios we are using also have CQuam in them, but the CD player guts are removed. We expect another of these units here at WOR shortly for more testing. We will be installing a new version of the HD scheme into the test exciter shortly.This version has addressed most of our complaints, and will allow us to stream more data across the receiver screen, sounds better, and has addressed our stereo audio concerns. We hope to have WOR stereo audio on air this summer. Stay tuned for more details. Kerry Richards Chief Engineer WOR-AM Buckley Broadcasting Corporation [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From amfmdx@fastq.com Tue Feb 25 10:15:36 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amfmdx@fastq.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 25 Feb 2003 18:15:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 26548 invoked from network); 25 Feb 2003 18:15:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Feb 2003 18:15:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout.fastq.com) (204.62.193.66) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Feb 2003 18:15:33 -0000 Received: from fastq ([209.63.214.241]) by mailout.fastq.com (8.11.3/8.11.3.FastQ-MailOut) with SMTP id h1PIFWT33107 for ; Tue, 25 Feb 2003 11:15:33 -0700 (MST) (envelope-from amfmdx@fastq.com) Message-ID: <000b01c2dcf9$a0d3d5c0$f1d63fd1@com> To: Subject: It runs both ways.... Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 11:13:40 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 From: "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=99987623 X-Yahoo-Profile: big_h00pla As well as it should not be the place to support IBOC. Kevin Message: 25 Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 10:41:46 -0500 From: "Kerry Richards" Subject: Thank You Kevin! Thanks, Kevin, you hit it on the nose. This should not be the place to bitch and moan about IBOC. This message has been composed of recycled electrons. None of these electrons has been harmed or injured in the creation and transmission of this message but they have been shamelessly exploited for this use. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Feb 25 10:31:31 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 25 Feb 2003 18:31:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 38389 invoked from network); 25 Feb 2003 18:31:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Feb 2003 18:31:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.78) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Feb 2003 18:31:30 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.129] by n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 25 Feb 2003 18:31:29 -0000 Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 18:31:28 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: It runs both ways.... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <000b01c2dcf9$a0d3d5c0$f1d63fd1@com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 886 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > As well as it should not be the place to support IBOC. I support anything which has the goal of bringing some attention, from broadcasters, radio manufacturers, and consumers, back to the AM band. "HD Radio" (I don't call it "IBOC" because its digital sidebands are actually *Adjacent*-Channel, not On-Channel) has this goal, and that is one good thing I can say about it. However, the method by which it seeks to achieve this goal is highly questionable, in my mind and in the minds of many other people, and furthermore, its real-world performance and practicality are still largely unproven. Therefore, as it is about to reach its 21st anniversary of official use in the USA (on March 4th), analog AM Stereo remains the highest quality and most practical way to transmit Stereo sound with enhanced audio fidelity on the AM radio band. And that's why we're here! From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Tue Feb 25 11:14:53 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 25 Feb 2003 19:14:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 9706 invoked from network); 25 Feb 2003 19:14:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Feb 2003 19:14:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14205.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.151) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Feb 2003 19:14:51 -0000 Message-ID: <20030225191448.52974.qmail@web14205.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.45.202.244] by web14205.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 25 Feb 2003 11:14:48 PST Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 11:14:48 -0800 (PST) Subject: AM Stereo Stations in OHIO ! To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio Please update your AM Stereo station listings to include these TWO wonderful STEREO AM Stations in North/Central Ohio: WBCO-AM Stereo 1540 Bucyrus, Ohio with a "Local Talk/Original Rock" format - a full-service station with a local lady on the air to chat in the AM, local basketball games and lots of music from the 50's and 60's. They have installed a new transmitter, with AM Stereo, and it's on the air; AND they do have stereo audio out to the transmitter, AND the stereo pilot is on, BUT the superb engineer I spoke with indicated that he still has to adjust the "L-R" for the stereo separation - so please be patient for him to set-up the stereo separation, as they only get the engineer one day a week for their AM/FM combo. A great local station - locally owned for 40 years! WMNI-AM Stereo 920 Columbus, Ohio with an "Adult Standards" format. Great stereo music with a lot of recent stuff too! They have some absolutely kick-**s bass response from this station. Unfortunatley, you need to be South of Findlay to pick-up this station - but it's worth the trip just to listen to them. Anybody in Columbus that can put some of their audio on the files page? Ohio is sounding better on AM all the time - might as well have good radio as the weather has been so miserable this winter! __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ From jsgil@hal-pc.org Tue Feb 25 11:33:52 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 25 Feb 2003 19:33:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 92676 invoked from network); 25 Feb 2003 19:32:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Feb 2003 19:32:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Feb 2003 19:32:21 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.187] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 25 Feb 2003 19:32:12 -0000 Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 19:32:11 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} A Letter To The ARRL on WOR's IBOCrap Operation Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1330 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.17 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "bta_50g " wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "amymousie " < > amymousie@y...> wrote: > > > In a message dated 2/24/03 11:42:32 PM Eastern Standard Time, > > jbyrns@r... > > > writes: > > > > Could you describe the mechanism by which IBOC could possibly > > cause > > > > interference in the 1.8-2.0 MHz and 144-148 MHz range? This > > seems > > > > more like the result of an overactive imagination than a real > > > > possibility. > > > > > > > > John > > > > Harmonics and RF/IF mixes, I would think. > > If that is the case, it is a receiver design problem, not the fault of > the IBOC stereo broadcasts. Hams who experience this problem should > think about buying a better quality receiver. > > John If there are 2nd harmonics of digital hash from 900-1000KHz stations or 3rd harmonics from 600-660KHz stations falling in the 160M band then that is an emission problem with the transmitter and has nothing to do with receiver selectivity of the ham radio. If a station is putting out out of band harmonics at a level to cause harmful interference then they are in violation and will be required to suppress them. Even the best receiver cannot remove interference if it falls within its highly selective BW. JSG From fanfare@globility.com Tue Feb 25 12:13:48 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 25 Feb 2003 20:13:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 7992 invoked from network); 25 Feb 2003 20:13:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Feb 2003 20:13:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.86) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Feb 2003 20:13:33 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.173] by n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 25 Feb 2003 20:13:33 -0000 Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 20:13:31 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: 1050 CHUM Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 354 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Mr.M S " X-Originating-IP: 64.56.233.113 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy They're running a phone campaign to make everyone aware of the fact they're back with the "oldies" format. I was looking at whiling away some of my recovery time (knee surgery and a back injury) by listening to some good AM-stereo. Alas, no pilot. As I said earlier, they were facing some extensive repairs to bring the stereo chain back up. MS From jbyrns@rcn.com Tue Feb 25 13:33:15 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@rcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 25 Feb 2003 21:33:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 21653 invoked from network); 25 Feb 2003 21:33:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Feb 2003 21:33:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Feb 2003 21:33:14 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.158] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 25 Feb 2003 21:33:14 -0000 Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 21:33:14 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: It runs both ways.... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <000b01c2dcf9$a0d3d5c0$f1d63fd1@com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 250 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bta_50g " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.32 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=138635554 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" < amfmdx@f...> wrote: > As well as it should not be the place to support IBOC. Why not? This is after all the "AM stereo forum", and IBOC is the AM stereo system of the future. John From jbyrns@rcn.com Tue Feb 25 13:47:45 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@rcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 25 Feb 2003 21:47:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 61200 invoked from network); 25 Feb 2003 21:47:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 25 Feb 2003 21:47:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.90) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 25 Feb 2003 21:47:44 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.174] by n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 25 Feb 2003 21:47:44 -0000 Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 21:47:41 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} A Letter To The ARRL on WOR's IBOC Operation Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1936 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bta_50g " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.32 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=138635554 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "jsgilst " < jsgil@h...> wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "bta_50g " > wrote: > > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "amymousie " < > > amymousie@y...> wrote: > > > > In a message dated 2/24/03 11:42:32 PM Eastern Standard Time, > > > jbyrns@r... > > > > writes: > > > > > Could you describe the mechanism by which IBOC could possibly > > > cause > > > > > interference in the 1.8-2.0 MHz and 144-148 MHz range? This > > > seems > > > > > more like the result of an overactive imagination than a real > > > > > possibility. > > > > > > > > > > John > > > > > > Harmonics and RF/IF mixes, I would think. > > > > If that is the case, it is a receiver design problem, not the fault > of > > the IBOC stereo broadcasts. Hams who experience this problem should > > think about buying a better quality receiver. > > > > John > > > If there are 2nd harmonics of digital hash from 900-1000KHz stations > or 3rd harmonics from 600-660KHz stations falling in the 160M band > then that is an emission problem with the transmitter and has nothing > to do with receiver selectivity of the ham radio. If a station is > putting out out of band harmonics at a level to cause harmful > interference then they are in violation and will be required to > suppress them. Even the best receiver cannot remove interference > if it falls within its highly selective BW. True, but that is not an "IBOC" problem, if a station puts out too much second or third harmonic energy, that is going to be a problem and cause interference even if it is a C-Quam station, or even if it is broadcasting in plain old mono. You are just making a gratuitous attempt to pin the blame for a transmitter problem on IBOC, when it has nothing to do with IBOC. The FCC has regulations concerning the allowed level of harmonic radiation. John From amymousie@yahoo.com Tue Feb 25 19:38:29 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 26 Feb 2003 03:38:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 25411 invoked from network); 26 Feb 2003 03:38:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Feb 2003 03:38:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Feb 2003 03:38:28 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.145] by n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 26 Feb 2003 03:38:28 -0000 Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 03:38:27 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Call to abolish the C-QUAM standard? Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2503 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 67.115.110.236 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie (I'm gonna get alot of flack for this, i'm quite sure of it!) Perhaps it's time to call for the abolishment of the C-QUAM AM stereo standard.... ...and any OTHER modulation standard... ....for the AM and FM broadcast bands. Yes, I know this might bring back the so-called "marketplace" fiasco, but as long as any broadcast system works within internationally- accepted interference standards, broadcasters must be willing to accept the consequences that their chosen system may not have any receivers available for it, and would be up to manufacturers as to whether or not to support any ststem (or even bother, for the most part). So... WHY would I suggest this? Despite the present saturation of AM stereo receivers and stations (better than FM stereo was at 15 years, mind you- Even better than color TV at 20!), it's declared a failure with only 10% receiver saturation (MTS TV stereo only accounts for 15%) and just over 300 stations in the USA alone. AM stereo is, and was, no failure. But if C-QUAM is no longer treated as the stereo standard for the AM broadcast band, neither should IBOC, or any other system, and as long as no-one causes any interference with others and each other, all systems should be openly allowed to be used, and promoted as desired. (And as for FM, the GE/Zenith system that has been well in use for 40+ years is so ubiquitous no mandatory standard is necessary, just as long as no interference is caused by the system, any system should be allowed, but everyone knows the GE/Zenith system is the defacto standard, anyway.) I'm all for AM stereo. I don't care really WHAT system, as long as it doesn't cause interference (which the present IBO(A)C system does), and it works (which IBO(A)C doesn't), as a general, inexpensive broadcast medium (which IBO(A)C isn't). I don't care if the stereo system used is Magnavox, Motorola, or Kahn, or even the almost-mythical RCA/Belar systems. They work. They cause no interference. They can be built cheaply. And by the way- Just because I do advocate an alternative to C-QUAM (and I have nothing against C-QUAM-- I think it's an excellent system), I do take issue with some certain broadcasters and transmitter makers that are adamantly Kahn ISB and proud to be Conservative-- I am a liberal mouse, which puts me at odds with many here, but I would not deny any other system from being used by whomever. Like I said, I'm going to get some flack from this post, dearly. Amy. <:3 )~~8~ From jsgil@hal-pc.org Tue Feb 25 20:41:43 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 26 Feb 2003 04:41:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 31903 invoked from network); 26 Feb 2003 04:41:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Feb 2003 04:41:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Feb 2003 04:41:42 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.143] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 26 Feb 2003 04:41:42 -0000 Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 04:41:41 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} A Letter To The ARRL on WOR's IBOC Operation Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1802 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.111 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "bta_50g " wrote: > > True, but that is not an "IBOC" problem, if a station puts out too > much second or third harmonic energy, that is going to be a problem > and cause interference even if it is a C-Quam station, or even if it > is broadcasting in plain old mono. You are just making a gratuitous > attempt to pin the blame for a transmitter problem on IBOC, when it > has nothing to do with IBOC. The FCC has regulations concerning the > allowed level of harmonic radiation. > > John This is true but the characteristic of an IBAC signal, continous in nature and unnatural sounding to the ear, is much more likely to manifest itself as harmful interference even though the peak levels are the same as the noncontinous analog signal. What little of any interference from analog stations that bleeds into the ham bands is much more tolerable than an continous wave of digital hash. This is the big issue that will make or break nighttime use of IBAC if the FCC does its job and protects existing transmittions from this interference. It would take several analog stations to generate the same continous background radiation level of energy that one IBAC station prodoces. This is what has not been fully evaluated and the problem will only be appearent when several IBAC stations go online. I think the migration to IBAC for nighttime operation should take a slow approach and be cautuious about interference problems. The interference issues could be so bad that IBAC may not operate at reasonable distances from skywave interference from other IBAC stations. Remember that the skywave problem was bad enough that it behooved the reduction of BW to 10.2KHz and this was for a non- continous analog signal. JSG From jsgil@hal-pc.org Tue Feb 25 20:51:17 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 26 Feb 2003 04:51:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 51731 invoked from network); 26 Feb 2003 04:51:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Feb 2003 04:51:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.67) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Feb 2003 04:51:16 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.172] by n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 26 Feb 2003 04:51:16 -0000 Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 04:51:14 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: It runs both ways.... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 788 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.111 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "bta_50g " wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin - Mesa, Arizona" < > amfmdx@f...> wrote: > > > As well as it should not be the place to support IBOC. > > Why not? This is after all the "AM stereo forum", and IBOC is the AM > stereo system of the future. > > John This has yet to be seen. IBAC has a much steeper hill to climb than analog AM Stereo ever had. The IBOC receiver is priced in the range of a high end analog AMS receiver. Low cost AMS receivers sold for as low as $30 and had reasonable battery life. The kind of CPU that is required to process an IBAC signal uses many times the power that a analog AMS receiver uses. If the public doesn't buy it in mass then IBAC ain't gonna fly. JSG From n0uiheric@aol.com Wed Feb 26 00:02:30 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 26 Feb 2003 08:02:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 52058 invoked from network); 26 Feb 2003 08:02:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Feb 2003 08:02:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r06.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.102) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Feb 2003 08:02:28 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-r06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.79.b03e4b5 (3980) for ; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 03:02:25 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <79.b03e4b5.2b8dce91@aol.com> Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 03:02:25 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} A Letter To The ARRL on WOR's IBOCrap Operation To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih It is not a receiver design problem...just another reason to stick with C-QUAM (which has been proven to CAUSE NO INTERFERENCE to Amateur Radio signals). 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Wed Feb 26 00:05:33 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 26 Feb 2003 08:05:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 58727 invoked from network); 26 Feb 2003 08:05:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Feb 2003 08:05:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m06.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.161) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Feb 2003 08:05:32 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-m06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.3b.341769c9 (3980) for ; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 03:05:30 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <3b.341769c9.2b8dcf4a@aol.com> Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 03:05:30 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: It runs both ways.... To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih IBOC is NOT the "AM Stereo system of the future"...the only acceptable AM Stereo is C-QUAM (which is capable of CD-like seperation). 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From amymousie@yahoo.com Wed Feb 26 00:26:48 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 26 Feb 2003 08:26:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 41541 invoked from network); 26 Feb 2003 08:26:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Feb 2003 08:26:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Feb 2003 08:26:46 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.183] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 26 Feb 2003 08:26:46 -0000 Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 08:26:43 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: It runs both ways.... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3b.341769c9.2b8dcf4a@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1769 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 67.115.110.236 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, n0uiheric@a... wrote: > IBOC is NOT the "AM Stereo system of the future"...the only acceptable AM > Stereo is C-QUAM (which is capable of CD-like seperation). I'd put my money on the RCA/Belar AM stereo systems as the best AM stereo system ever. Had all the proposed AM stereo systems been tested independently, on independently-built equipment, AM stereol would've had a fairer chance as finding the right one. EVERY SYSTEM PROPOSED had its strengths and weaknesses, its pluses and minuses. Even if ISB had used C-QUAM's cosine correction and -100% modulation limiters (which prevents "pops", it would've fared just as well. In fact, the only REAL difference between ISB, Philco's QUAM and Motorola's C-QUAM is the matrixing technique- or lack of same in the case of ISB. All three use the SAME quadrature AM technique. (I was surprised to find that the RCA paper recommended both of these improvements employed in C-QUAM.) The Magnavox system used a PM variation of RCA/Belar's FM modulation method. Harris is based on the quadrature AM system that Philco invented (the patent was needed to improve RCA's color TV proposal, so guess how old QUAM is!), like ISB/QUAM/C-QUAM, but instead, varies the phased AM signal for different conditions. C-QUAM is the defeacto AM stereo standard, now, and it IS good. But I think the other systems were just as good. (Though I think Harris was the worst of the bunch, yet the converted-to-C-QUAM exciters made for amongst the best.) The 1MHz band we call "Mediumwave" or "the AM Broadcast Band" is not meant for decent digital reception. I don't care which AM stereo system is used, just as long as it's analog. Amy. <:3 )~~8~ (AM stereo's "most loved mouse"?) From jsgil@hal-pc.org Wed Feb 26 01:24:28 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 26 Feb 2003 09:24:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 41321 invoked from network); 26 Feb 2003 09:24:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Feb 2003 09:24:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Feb 2003 09:24:26 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.252] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 26 Feb 2003 09:24:23 -0000 Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 09:24:20 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: It runs both ways.... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 2607 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.61 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "amymousie " wrote: > Even if ISB had=20 > used C-QUAM's cosine correction and -100% modulation limiters (which=20 > prevents "pops", it would've fared just as well. In fact, the only=20 > REAL difference between ISB, Philco's QUAM and Motorola's C-QUAM is=20 > the matrixing technique- or lack of same in the case of ISB. All=20 > three use the SAME quadrature AM technique. (I was surprised to find=20 > that the RCA paper recommended both of these improvements employed in=20 > C-QUAM.) >=20 > Amy. <:3 )~~8~ > (AM stereo's "most loved mouse"?) The whole idea of cosine correction, modifing a signal to obtain envelope compatibility, produces minimal 2nd and 3rd harmonics as compaired to the other non-linear systems. It is the most natural approach to the problem. In transmittion it is the most envelope compatible because of the minimal=20 harmonics. Where C-QuAM falls short is the decoding uses both=20 envelope and phase for a reference. When interference occurs the L+R Env signal is corrupted and distortion is generated in the same way that a regular QuAM signal generates distortion for an Env Det. C-QuAM decoding falls short on negative modulation approaching -100% because during heavy single channel modulation the phase is at its maximum and cosine gain is large. When interference occurs on these negative peaks the phase can be pushed towards =B190=B0 or past it resulting in the cosine amp flattopped at its maximum gain. This modulated into L-R producing major distortion. The 13020 chip is bad about this but the later chips do a lot of processing of the cosine signal before applying it to minimize this but they are still not as robust as a synchronous QuAM system.=20 And ISB system based on C-QuAM naturally deals with the problem of phase being at its maximum during negative modulation because L-R is audio phase shifted by 90=B0 and the phase deviation is=20 returning to zero while the envelope approaches -100% modulation. ISB C-QuAM will handle -95% single channel modulation vs regular C-QuAM at 70% before these cosine correction problems occur. If you were to use the old 13020 chip to receive a Kahn signal it would produce less crackle distortion for the same level of interference than a C-QuAM signal would. While Linear ISB generated using the phasing method is a QuAM transmittion with its L-R audio phase shifted by 90=B0 Kahn used the Magnavox system with audio phase shifting and a 2nd harmonic added to L-R for increased compatibility for the 2 radio approach and for the reduction of spectrum spread. JSG From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Feb 26 05:49:00 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 26 Feb 2003 13:49:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 50583 invoked from network); 26 Feb 2003 13:48:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Feb 2003 13:48:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Feb 2003 13:48:59 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-203.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.203]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h1QDmtnF014930 for ; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 07:48:57 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <003401c2dd9e$305d7e40$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <003b01c2db9d$318cba90$af78fea9@juan> <011d01c2dbce$aa7efc70$0200a8c0@winxphk4mvpe0a> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Chris Chubbuck Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 07:51:37 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Ratings, dude, ratings. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Joseph Esposito" > > I wonder why the lowest rated newcast in Pittsburgh decided that it was in > the publics best interest to see a desperate politician shooting himself in > the head.?? From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Feb 26 06:25:56 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 26 Feb 2003 14:25:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 30670 invoked from network); 26 Feb 2003 14:25:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Feb 2003 14:25:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Feb 2003 14:25:56 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-203.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.203]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h1QEPonF025685 for ; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 08:25:51 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <00a201c2dda3$586643e0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <001501c2dce4$6b17eee0$2a01010a@kerrydesk> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Thank You Kevin! Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 08:28:31 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude This is a very real concern, not meant to be bashing in any way, but is having a lot of data move across a radio's display really all that desireable, especially in automobiles? It might be OK in NY and LA rush hours where you can be stopped for quite some time, but I think it would be a traffic hazard in most other areas, much as using cell phones is purported to be. Scott Todd PS- Welcome to the list. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kerry Richards" > We will be installing a new version of the HD scheme into the test exciter shortly.This version has addressed most of our complaints, and will allow us to stream more data across the receiver screen, sounds better, and has addressed our stereo audio concerns. From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Feb 26 06:46:30 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 26 Feb 2003 14:46:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 89826 invoked from network); 26 Feb 2003 14:46:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Feb 2003 14:46:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Feb 2003 14:46:28 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-203.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.203]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h1QEkMnF002379 for ; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 08:46:24 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <00f201c2dda6$377f6280$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} 1050 CHUM Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 08:49:04 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Marv, Sounds like you've been through the mill. Get well soon! Scott Todd ----- Original Message ----- From: > > I was looking at whiling away some of my recovery time (knee surgery > and a back injury) by listening to some good AM-stereo. Alas, no > pilot. From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Feb 26 06:49:25 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 26 Feb 2003 14:49:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 94782 invoked from network); 26 Feb 2003 14:49:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Feb 2003 14:49:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Feb 2003 14:49:21 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-203.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.203]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h1QEnHnF003259; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 08:49:18 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <010201c2dda6$9f373420$827dfea9@home1> To: , Subject: Table 1 Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 08:51:58 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I've got a Motorola 1310 mod monitor that I want to set to 540, but Table 1, which contains the dipswitch settings, is missing from my manual. Anyone out there have a copy they can scan and email me? Thanks, Scott Todd [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From michaelj@vcn.com Wed Feb 26 06:55:11 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 26 Feb 2003 14:55:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 34357 invoked from network); 26 Feb 2003 14:55:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Feb 2003 14:55:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m3-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.33) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Feb 2003 14:55:11 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m3-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 07:55:10 -0700 Message-ID: <005201c2dda7$0f8449c0$0701010a@keva> To: References: <010201c2dda6$9f373420$827dfea9@home1> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Table 1 Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 07:55:09 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hey Scott Got a fax number? I can do it for ya right now. I'm here at work at the station. Mine's the 1310. I can just fax the page to ya Michael n WYO ----- Original Message ----- From: Scott Todd To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com ; amstereo@topica.com Sent: Wednesday, February 26, 2003 7:51 AM Subject: {AMSF} Table 1 I've got a Motorola 1310 mod monitor that I want to set to 540, but Table 1, which contains the dipswitch settings, is missing from my manual. Anyone out there have a copy they can scan and email me? Thanks, Scott Todd [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ADVERTISEMENT Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From krichards@wor710.com Wed Feb 26 07:33:35 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 77633 invoked from network); 26 Feb 2003 15:33:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Feb 2003 15:33:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Feb 2003 15:33:34 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: krichards@wor710.com Received: from [66.218.67.164] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 26 Feb 2003 15:33:33 -0000 X-Sender: krichards@wor710.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 26 Feb 2003 14:19:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 16135 invoked from network); 26 Feb 2003 14:19:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Feb 2003 14:19:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO buckleyradio.com) (161.58.14.6) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Feb 2003 14:19:45 -0000 Received: from kerrydesk (pool-162-83-163-112.ny5030.east.verizon.net [162.83.163.112]) by buckleyradio.com (8.11.6) id h1QEJiL14757 for ; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 09:19:44 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <000a01c2dda1$7438d530$2a01010a@kerrydesk> To: Subject: The Analog Systems all worked well.... Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 09:14:57 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Kerry Richards" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=136545831 X-Yahoo-Profile: kerryrichards710 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-eGroups-Approved-By: kevtronics via web; 26 Feb 2003 15:33:32 -0000 It's fun to me seeing all the data here about C-Quam versus Kahn, Belar, and Magnavox. Who would have thought after almost 20 years we would still be discussing any of this? But having been there and done most of this, the problem was always that although each system had it's little drawbacks they all worked reasonably well on the bench in the lab, but never as good in practice or operation. I blame this on the antenna systems involved in the failed installations, also the issue of IPM in the transmitters in use in the early eighties and late seventies. I can tell numerous stories of failed attempts after an exciter arrived, and was attempted to be installed on a questionable array or transmitter. In most cases the situation was made worse. This never helped the state of AM Stereo because after some poor broadcaster spent thousands on the equipment, then had technical issues left unresolved, then changed all his logos to "WXXX AM Stereo" is still sounded like crap and turned listeners away. It never helped much that the receivers were crude by today's standards as well. If everyone had a nice non-directional quarter wave stick with a good ground system and good ground conductivity we might have a chance, but that is the ideal and unrealistic dream world which will never exist. Then there is the issue of noise, the spectrum has become increasingly noisy over each decade. (Even without IBOC!) None of the analog systems fix this issue very well, AMAX was a good attempt, but never caught on. HD Radio still has the same issues going for it too. No antenna that is not reasonably flat out 15KHZ on each sideband, will pass the digital sidebands properly. Then there is the issue of the transmitter itself, it has to pass all the components too. All of this sound familiar? What about nighttime? That is still unresolved. The good news for digital is it can cover a whole 5 millivolt contour with about 1/10th the power. Still it appears to be a tricky issue getting these carriers out to the radios but the HD systems does answer the noise problem very well. The digital artifacts are another problem, but that does seem to be getting better ever so slowly. So almost thirty years later, here we go with more attempts at AM Stereo. Will it catch on this time? I think that with the "Digital" moniker it might have a chance this time. But if I had to get stereo into the GM's car today it would have to be C-Quam, would n't it.....Can't get an HD Radio yet... Sound Familiar? Kerry Richards Chief Engineer WOR-AM Buckley Broadcasting Corporation [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Feb 26 08:01:20 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 26 Feb 2003 16:01:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 11773 invoked from network); 26 Feb 2003 16:01:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Feb 2003 16:01:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Feb 2003 16:01:18 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-203.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.203]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h1QG1EnF028785 for ; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 10:01:16 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <013401c2ddb0$ace3fb80$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <010201c2dda6$9f373420$827dfea9@home1> <005201c2dda7$0f8449c0$0701010a@keva> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Table 1 Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 10:03:57 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Don't have fax at home where I am now, but you can send it to my work fax at 651-405-8222. Thanks, Scott Todd ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael J. Richard" To: Sent: Wednesday, February 26, 2003 8:55 AM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Table 1 > Hey Scott > Got a fax number? I can do it for ya right now. I'm here at work at the station. Mine's the 1310. I can just fax the page to ya > > Michael n WYO > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Scott Todd > To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com ; amstereo@topica.com > Sent: Wednesday, February 26, 2003 7:51 AM > Subject: {AMSF} Table 1 > > > I've got a Motorola 1310 mod monitor that I want to set to 540, but Table 1, which contains the dipswitch settings, is missing from my manual. Anyone out there have a copy they can scan and email me? > > Thanks, > > Scott Todd > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor > ADVERTISEMENT > > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > From michaelj@vcn.com Wed Feb 26 08:03:22 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 26 Feb 2003 16:03:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 16012 invoked from network); 26 Feb 2003 16:03:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Feb 2003 16:03:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m1-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Feb 2003 16:03:16 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m1-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 09:03:16 -0700 Message-ID: <006601c2ddb0$928b9900$0701010a@keva> To: References: <010201c2dda6$9f373420$827dfea9@home1> <005201c2dda7$0f8449c0$0701010a@keva> <013401c2ddb0$ace3fb80$827dfea9@home1> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Table 1 Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 09:03:14 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit You got it Scott. Will send it right away! We don't have a scanner here, otherwise I'd be happy to scan it and email it to ya. I CAN fax it, though :) Michael n WYO ----- Original Message ----- From: Scott Todd To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, February 26, 2003 9:03 AM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Table 1 Don't have fax at home where I am now, but you can send it to my work fax at 651-405-8222. Thanks, Scott Todd ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael J. Richard" To: Sent: Wednesday, February 26, 2003 8:55 AM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Table 1 > Hey Scott > Got a fax number? I can do it for ya right now. I'm here at work at the station. Mine's the 1310. I can just fax the page to ya > > Michael n WYO > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Scott Todd > To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com ; amstereo@topica.com > Sent: Wednesday, February 26, 2003 7:51 AM > Subject: {AMSF} Table 1 > > > I've got a Motorola 1310 mod monitor that I want to set to 540, but Table 1, which contains the dipswitch settings, is missing from my manual. Anyone out there have a copy they can scan and email me? > > Thanks, > > Scott Todd > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor > ADVERTISEMENT > > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ADVERTISEMENT Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From michaelj@vcn.com Wed Feb 26 08:06:30 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 26 Feb 2003 16:06:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 4808 invoked from network); 26 Feb 2003 16:06:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Feb 2003 16:06:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m1-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Feb 2003 16:06:29 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m1-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 09:06:27 -0700 Message-ID: <006b01c2ddb1$04361bc0$0701010a@keva> To: References: <000a01c2dda1$7438d530$2a01010a@kerrydesk> Subject: Re: {AMSF} The Analog Systems all worked well.... Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 09:06:22 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I think a lot of this makes sense. I mean the groans and moans from engineers on how hard C-quam is to do, yet I've never seen any of it. Since last August when I installed our C-quam exciter and modulation monitor here, I've had zero problems and wonderful sound quality. But then again, we're just a little 1kw graveyard (1240) with ONE non-directional 150 foot stick. Period. As Kerry said....if everyone had this type of setup, I guess it would be a perfect world, but it's not :( I got to admit, I've really been extremely impressed with the sound quality that we have here. It's beautiful. And it's all coming out of a POS McMartin BA-1K transmitter. Our "real" engineer tells me that's because we're only running this McMartin at 880 watts...not a full thousand. 880 is all we're actually allotted. Just wish this old thing wouldn't eat these 4-400C tubes so quick. Michael n WYO KEVA 1240 AM Stereo Evanston, Wyoming ----- Original Message ----- From: Kerry Richards To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, February 26, 2003 7:14 AM Subject: {AMSF} The Analog Systems all worked well.... If everyone had a nice non-directional quarter wave stick with a good ground system and good ground conductivity we might have a chance, but that is the ideal and unrealistic dream world which will never exist. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Feb 26 08:14:28 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 26 Feb 2003 16:14:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 36539 invoked from network); 26 Feb 2003 16:14:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Feb 2003 16:14:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Feb 2003 16:14:28 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-203.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.203]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h1QGEOnF003468 for ; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 10:14:25 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <014501c2ddb2$837fc060$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <000a01c2dda1$7438d530$2a01010a@kerrydesk> Subject: Re: {AMSF} The Analog Systems all worked well.... Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 10:17:07 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Without some receiver standards, HD could very well suffer the same fate. AMAX had the potential to do much good, but died due to manufacturer apathy. Scott Todd ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kerry Richards" > None of the analog systems fix this issue very well, AMAX was a good attempt, but never caught on. > So almost thirty years later, here we go with more attempts at AM Stereo. Will it catch on this time? I think that with the "Digital" moniker it might have a chance this time. But if I had to get stereo into the GM's car today it would have to be C-Quam, would n't it.....Can't get an HD Radio yet... > > Sound Familiar? > > Kerry Richards From michaelj@vcn.com Wed Feb 26 08:26:49 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 26 Feb 2003 16:26:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 86381 invoked from network); 26 Feb 2003 16:26:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Feb 2003 16:26:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m3-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.33) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Feb 2003 16:26:48 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m3-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 09:26:48 -0700 Message-ID: <007f01c2ddb3$dc35e800$0701010a@keva> To: References: <010201c2dda6$9f373420$827dfea9@home1> <005201c2dda7$0f8449c0$0701010a@keva> <013401c2ddb0$ace3fb80$827dfea9@home1> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Table 1 Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 09:26:47 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hey Scott.....looks like that fax number isn't working. Check it out and let me know. I'll take the info with me when I leave here and I can fax it to you later from my shop or something. Or I can just type up the settings for you in a Word document or something and email it to ya. Michael ----- Original Message ----- From: Scott Todd To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, February 26, 2003 9:03 AM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Table 1 Don't have fax at home where I am now, but you can send it to my work fax at 651-405-8222. Thanks, Scott Todd ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael J. Richard" To: Sent: Wednesday, February 26, 2003 8:55 AM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Table 1 > Hey Scott > Got a fax number? I can do it for ya right now. I'm here at work at the station. Mine's the 1310. I can just fax the page to ya > > Michael n WYO > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Scott Todd > To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com ; amstereo@topica.com > Sent: Wednesday, February 26, 2003 7:51 AM > Subject: {AMSF} Table 1 > > > I've got a Motorola 1310 mod monitor that I want to set to 540, but Table 1, which contains the dipswitch settings, is missing from my manual. Anyone out there have a copy they can scan and email me? > > Thanks, > > Scott Todd > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor > ADVERTISEMENT > > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ADVERTISEMENT Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From michaelj@vcn.com Wed Feb 26 08:35:36 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 26 Feb 2003 16:35:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 54761 invoked from network); 26 Feb 2003 16:35:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Feb 2003 16:35:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m3-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.33) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Feb 2003 16:35:35 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m3-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 09:35:35 -0700 Message-ID: <008501c2ddb5$16554020$0701010a@keva> To: References: <010201c2dda6$9f373420$827dfea9@home1> <005201c2dda7$0f8449c0$0701010a@keva> <013401c2ddb0$ace3fb80$827dfea9@home1> <007f01c2ddb3$dc35e800$0701010a@keva> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Table 1 Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 09:35:34 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Welp, nevermind :) I guess it finally went through. It's over there waiting for ya. Michael ----- Original Message ----- From: Michael J. Richard To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, February 26, 2003 9:26 AM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Table 1 Hey Scott.....looks like that fax number isn't working. Check it out and let me know. I'll take the info with me when I leave here and I can fax it to you later from my shop or something. Or I can just type up the settings for you in a Word document or something and email it to ya. Michael ----- Original Message ----- From: Scott Todd To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, February 26, 2003 9:03 AM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Table 1 Don't have fax at home where I am now, but you can send it to my work fax at 651-405-8222. Thanks, Scott Todd ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael J. Richard" To: Sent: Wednesday, February 26, 2003 8:55 AM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Table 1 > Hey Scott > Got a fax number? I can do it for ya right now. I'm here at work at the station. Mine's the 1310. I can just fax the page to ya > > Michael n WYO > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Scott Todd > To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com ; amstereo@topica.com > Sent: Wednesday, February 26, 2003 7:51 AM > Subject: {AMSF} Table 1 > > > I've got a Motorola 1310 mod monitor that I want to set to 540, but Table 1, which contains the dipswitch settings, is missing from my manual. Anyone out there have a copy they can scan and email me? > > Thanks, > > Scott Todd > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor > ADVERTISEMENT > > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ADVERTISEMENT Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ADVERTISEMENT Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From fanfare@globility.com Wed Feb 26 09:17:14 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 26 Feb 2003 17:17:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 29313 invoked from network); 26 Feb 2003 17:17:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Feb 2003 17:17:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.83) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Feb 2003 17:17:13 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.158] by n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 26 Feb 2003 17:17:09 -0000 Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 17:17:07 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: The Analog Systems all worked well.... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <000a01c2dda1$7438d530$2a01010a@kerrydesk> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3181 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Mr.M S " X-Originating-IP: 64.56.233.117 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kerry Richards" wrote: > It's fun to me seeing all the data here about C-Quam versus Kahn, Belar, and Magnavox. Who would have thought after almost 20 years we would still be discussing any of this? The good news for digital is it can cover a whole 5 millivolt contour with about 1/10th the power. Still it appears to be a tricky issue getting these carriers out to the radios but the HD systems does answer the noise problem very well. The digital artifacts are another problem, but that does seem to be getting better ever so slowly. > > So almost thirty years later, here we go with more attempts at AM Stereo. Will it catch on this time? I think that with the "Digital" moniker it might have a chance this time. But if I had to get stereo into the GM's car today it would have to be C-Quam, would n't it.....Can't get an HD Radio yet... > > Sound Familiar? > > Kerry Richards Unfortunately, it all sounds familiar. The development of AM Stereo took the same tack as HD-radio is doing now. They too based their success on a "boombox mentality" which is the medium on which most broadcasters have pinned their hopes for success. What is missing from today's discussions is a benchmark of what the various modes of modualtions can actually produce at the receiver. Because a given radio station says it sounds good is only their opinion. With all due respect Kerry, most radio stations don't have a clue how good, or how bad they sound. Why, becasue they have never availed themselves of being able to listen on a fully transparent receiver. Our equipment prides itself on being able to reproduce as faithfully as possible what is being transmitted. While that does not provide a benchmark for the industry, it does provide the means to allow man's acute sense of hearing and his memeory for waht is sonically accurate to make that sort of judgement. However, the industry typically relies on samples from (as I've seen it stated) "several typical radios", none of which approach high fidelity, I reckon. As a result, we seem to have the broadcast industry making value judgements on the listener's behalf as to what is acceptable. If you recall the term used in the watch industry to establish a benchmark level, "quartz", or "quartz-controlled", meant that the watch would be accaurate, and that you didn't have to wind it. Whether it matters or not, an IBOC radio signal placed alongside a good analog FM or AM-stereo signal would have to provide more than just the term "digital" to establish and maintain its credibility. Again with due respect, I'd like to end this diatribe by playing the devil's advocate. Some people try to make themselves look better by making their opposition look worse. We see that in politics all the time. I wonder if dumbing down the analog AM signal to 5KHz is not just another way to make the digital signal sound better? But will it go as far? If not, those listeners who've bought an IBOC receiver and cannot demodulate the digital signal, but could hear the AM signal before, end up with truly substandard fare. M.S. From fredymcc@digitel.net Wed Feb 26 09:54:56 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: fredymcc@digitel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 26 Feb 2003 17:54:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 67063 invoked from network); 26 Feb 2003 17:54:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Feb 2003 17:54:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mallard.mail.pas.earthlink.net) (207.217.120.48) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Feb 2003 17:54:46 -0000 Received: from 209-239-217-235.lax.jps.net ([209.239.217.235] helo=[209.239.217.74]) by mallard.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 18o5lR-0001b8-00 for amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 09:54:42 -0800 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: fredymcc@digitel.net@mail.digitel.net Message-Id: Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 09:53:55 -0800 To: Subject: Media Ownership From: "Fred Y. McCutcheon" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=80587106 X-Yahoo-Profile: eighthmoon Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit While not directly on topic, the FCC's upcoming decision on ownership regulation will certainly affect how technology decisions in broadcasting will be made in the future. This article from Technology Review discusses the debate within the FCC The Diversity Divide Columnist Henry Jenkins says further FCC deregulation could result in a dangerous level of media concentration. http://www.technologyreview.com/articles/wo_jenkins022603.asp -- "You see, wire telegraph is a kind of a very, very long cat (>^..^<). You pull his tail in New York and his head is meowing in Los Angeles. Do you understand this? And radio operates exactly the same way: you send signals here, they receive them there. The only difference is that there is no cat." Albert Einstein [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Feb 26 09:58:23 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 26 Feb 2003 17:58:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 74640 invoked from network); 26 Feb 2003 17:58:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Feb 2003 17:58:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Feb 2003 17:58:23 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-203.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.203]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h1QHwFnF013879 for ; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 11:58:18 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <017001c2ddc1$06974a00$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <010201c2dda6$9f373420$827dfea9@home1> <005201c2dda7$0f8449c0$0701010a@keva> <013401c2ddb0$ace3fb80$827dfea9@home1> <007f01c2ddb3$dc35e800$0701010a@keva> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Table 1 Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 12:00:58 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude I'm not at work today, just recouping at home from a bit of a bug, so I don't know what might be wrong with the fax machine there. There are two things you could do- first just email me the 540kHz settings, then if you could photocopy and snail mail the entire thing, that would be OK. Otherwise when I'm back at work tomorrow, I can give you a holler and let you know if the fax machine is working or not. Scott ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael J. Richard" To: Sent: Wednesday, February 26, 2003 10:26 AM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Table 1 > Hey Scott.....looks like that fax number isn't working. Check it out and let me know. I'll take the info with me when I leave here and I can fax it to you later from my shop or something. Or I can just type up the settings for you in a Word document or something and email it to ya. > > Michael > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Scott Todd > To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com > Sent: Wednesday, February 26, 2003 9:03 AM > Subject: Re: {AMSF} Table 1 > > > Don't have fax at home where I am now, but you can send it to my work fax at > 651-405-8222. > > Thanks, > > Scott Todd > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Michael J. Richard" > To: > Sent: Wednesday, February 26, 2003 8:55 AM > Subject: Re: {AMSF} Table 1 > > > > Hey Scott > > Got a fax number? I can do it for ya right now. I'm here at work at the > station. Mine's the 1310. I can just fax the page to ya > > > > Michael n WYO > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: Scott Todd > > To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com ; amstereo@topica.com > > Sent: Wednesday, February 26, 2003 7:51 AM > > Subject: {AMSF} Table 1 > > > > > > I've got a Motorola 1310 mod monitor that I want to set to 540, but > Table 1, which contains the dipswitch settings, is missing from my manual. > Anyone out there have a copy they can scan and email me? > > > > Thanks, > > > > Scott Todd > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor > > ADVERTISEMENT > > > > > > > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor > ADVERTISEMENT > > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > From michaelj@vcn.com Wed Feb 26 10:08:26 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 26 Feb 2003 18:08:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 52502 invoked from network); 26 Feb 2003 18:08:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Feb 2003 18:08:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m1-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Feb 2003 18:08:25 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m1-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 11:08:25 -0700 Message-ID: <009501c2ddc2$0d64d0e0$0701010a@keva> To: References: <010201c2dda6$9f373420$827dfea9@home1> <005201c2dda7$0f8449c0$0701010a@keva> <013401c2ddb0$ace3fb80$827dfea9@home1> <007f01c2ddb3$dc35e800$0701010a@keva> <017001c2ddc1$06974a00$827dfea9@home1> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Table 1 Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 11:08:22 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Good luck on your recouping, Scott. It did finally go through. Sounds like you're playing with this thing at home, so you'd probably want the settings now. For 540 its: 01100010 those are switches 1-8 respectively Hope that helps ya. The page should be over at your work. Like I said, if ya want the whole thing I can get it to ya...er..uh..as soon as our photocopier gets fixed :(. Already tried using it today and it's got some problems. MJR n WYO ----- Original Message ----- From: Scott Todd To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, February 26, 2003 11:00 AM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Table 1 I'm not at work today, just recouping at home from a bit of a bug, so I don't know what might be wrong with the fax machine there. There are two things you could do- first just email me the 540kHz settings, then if you could photocopy and snail mail the entire thing, that would be OK. Otherwise when I'm back at work tomorrow, I can give you a holler and let you know if the fax machine is working or not. Scott ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael J. Richard" To: Sent: Wednesday, February 26, 2003 10:26 AM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Table 1 > Hey Scott.....looks like that fax number isn't working. Check it out and let me know. I'll take the info with me when I leave here and I can fax it to you later from my shop or something. Or I can just type up the settings for you in a Word document or something and email it to ya. > > Michael > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Scott Todd > To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com > Sent: Wednesday, February 26, 2003 9:03 AM > Subject: Re: {AMSF} Table 1 > > > Don't have fax at home where I am now, but you can send it to my work fax at > 651-405-8222. > > Thanks, > > Scott Todd > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Michael J. Richard" > To: > Sent: Wednesday, February 26, 2003 8:55 AM > Subject: Re: {AMSF} Table 1 > > > > Hey Scott > > Got a fax number? I can do it for ya right now. I'm here at work at the > station. Mine's the 1310. I can just fax the page to ya > > > > Michael n WYO > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: Scott Todd > > To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com ; amstereo@topica.com > > Sent: Wednesday, February 26, 2003 7:51 AM > > Subject: {AMSF} Table 1 > > > > > > I've got a Motorola 1310 mod monitor that I want to set to 540, but > Table 1, which contains the dipswitch settings, is missing from my manual. > Anyone out there have a copy they can scan and email me? > > > > Thanks, > > > > Scott Todd > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor > > ADVERTISEMENT > > > > > > > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor > ADVERTISEMENT > > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ADVERTISEMENT Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From michaelj@vcn.com Wed Feb 26 10:11:48 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 26 Feb 2003 18:11:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 12793 invoked from network); 26 Feb 2003 18:11:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Feb 2003 18:11:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m1-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Feb 2003 18:11:48 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m1-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 11:11:47 -0700 Message-ID: <009c01c2ddc2$871528e0$0701010a@keva> To: References: <010201c2dda6$9f373420$827dfea9@home1> <005201c2dda7$0f8449c0$0701010a@keva> <013401c2ddb0$ace3fb80$827dfea9@home1> <007f01c2ddb3$dc35e800$0701010a@keva> <017001c2ddc1$06974a00$827dfea9@home1> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Table 1 Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 11:11:46 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit By the way.....this one for the list.....as you can see I have the FULL MANUAL for the Motorola Model 1300 C-quam exciter and 1310 Modulation Monitor if any of you need anything. I seem to recall a while back when I was looking for a manual or for some info, it was pretty hard to come by. So if any of you need any info from these manuals, just let me know. Michael n WYO KEVA AM Stereo 1240 Evanston, Wyoming [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From krichards@wor710.com Wed Feb 26 10:20:29 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 45793 invoked from network); 26 Feb 2003 18:20:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Feb 2003 18:20:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.84) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Feb 2003 18:20:28 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: krichards@wor710.com Received: from [66.218.67.158] by n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 26 Feb 2003 18:20:28 -0000 X-Sender: krichards@wor710.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 26 Feb 2003 18:17:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 22231 invoked from network); 26 Feb 2003 18:17:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Feb 2003 18:17:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Feb 2003 18:17:34 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.156] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 26 Feb 2003 18:17:34 -0000 Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 18:17:34 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: The Analog Systems all worked well.... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 4102 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kerry Richards " X-Originating-IP: 162.83.163.112 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=136545831 X-Yahoo-Profile: kerryrichards710 X-eGroups-Approved-By: kevtronics via web; 26 Feb 2003 18:20:27 -0000 --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Mr.M S " > If you recall the term used in the watch industry to establish a > benchmark level, "quartz", or "quartz-controlled", meant that the > watch would be accaurate, and that you didn't have to wind it. > Whether it matters or not, an IBOC radio signal placed alongside a > good analog FM or AM-stereo signal would have to provide more than > just the term "digital" to establish and maintain its credibility. > > Again with due respect, I'd like to end this diatribe by playing the > devil's advocate. Some people try to make themselves look better by > making their opposition look worse. We see that in politics all the > time. I wonder if dumbing down the analog AM signal to 5KHz is not > just another way to make the digital signal sound better? But will it > go as far? If not, those listeners who've bought an IBOC receiver > and cannot demodulate the digital signal, but could hear the AM > signal before, end up with truly substandard fare. > Well although "we've heard all this before", true, as you indicate, this time the system is protected by Ibiquity's patents, anybody making a "knock-off" radio will be put out of business by their legal department. So I do not think this is a major concern. We did not have this advantage in the previous AM Stereo rollout. Yes, the remaining analog signal is less than currently available, and it is not stereo, but it is considered a "Legacy" signal since it is provided soley for those remaining analog radios and for the backup signal which is blended to digital in the HD mode. This is the HD radio platform in the hybrid mode. As far as whether we have a dumbed down system, just look at any airchain in stations today: You have an Optimod or equivalent which purposely distorts, equalizes, and compresses the audio to such a point you have to use an AM radio to listen to the produced output. (Or an NRSC filter.) Then looking at the actual exciters both C-Quam and the Kahn Powerside you have numerous adjustments for everything from group time delay, phase shift, and tilt correction. This does not even allow for the other problems that exist in any array where the produced output and bandwidth is a function of the output of the phasor and ATU and the actual antenna itself. These problems were always here when it comes to AM. We feed clean audio in then we distort it, to transmit it, so what we think is "good" is produced at the "average radio". All very subjective to begin with. This happens for all stations everywhere when they adjust their processing. There is no "benchmark" for this, just what sounds good to "them" when "they" are adjusting "it". Right??? The simple days of running unprocessed audio into your transmitter then to the antenna are long gone. Nobody who could even try this could remain competteive in today's radio environment, let alone operate legally. I well remember WNBC-AM operating the Kahn system ,it sounded great, when they put on the C-Quam it was still good. But was that a perfect signal from an Audiophile's point of view? Hardly...Was it commercially acceptable? Absolutely. And this is the issue, "Is it commercially acceptable?". What actually ran C-Quam down and what killed the Kahn system are complex issues, if HD Radio makes it or not, it will have to surpass many of these problems, plain and simple. But will HD Radio ever deliver an Audiophile quality audio stream in Stereo on AM? I do not think C-Quam ever did this, and can't possibly do it now with the NRSC curve. And if all of the 130 stations now installing HD equipment, start operating it, it may get a lot harder, to tell what is actually going to happen. We are going through a major change now, and must be prepared to compare and listen, and see how all of this works out in practice. Only then will we be able to make statements about what is sub- standard and what is OK, and what is "Commercially Acceptable". Kerry Richards Chief Engineer WOR-AM Buckley Broadcasting Corporation From amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Wed Feb 26 10:42:27 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 63408 invoked from network); 26 Feb 2003 18:42:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Feb 2003 18:42:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Feb 2003 18:42:24 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: notify@yahoogroups.com Received: from [66.218.67.128] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 26 Feb 2003 18:42:23 -0000 Date: 26 Feb 2003 18:42:22 -0000 Message-ID: <1046284942.354.83440.w1@yahoogroups.com> X-eGroups-Application: files X-Yahoo-Group-Post: system From: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: New file uploaded to amstereoforum MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello, This email message is a notification to let you know that a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the amstereoforum group. File : /motorola model1301 mod monitor dip switches.txt Uploaded by : michaeljwyo Description : This text file contains all DIP switch settings, including expanded band, for the Motorola C-Quam model 1310 modulation monitor. These DIP switches are used to select the frequency which the monitor is set to receive. You can access this file at the URL http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum/files/motorola%20model1301%20mod%20monitor%20dip%20switches.txt To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/files Regards, michaeljwyo From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Feb 26 10:52:08 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 26 Feb 2003 18:52:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 12118 invoked from network); 26 Feb 2003 18:52:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Feb 2003 18:52:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Feb 2003 18:52:01 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-203.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.203]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h1QIpsnF004146 for ; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 12:51:56 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <01b301c2ddc8$85578ba0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <010201c2dda6$9f373420$827dfea9@home1> <005201c2dda7$0f8449c0$0701010a@keva> <013401c2ddb0$ace3fb80$827dfea9@home1> <007f01c2ddb3$dc35e800$0701010a@keva> <017001c2ddc1$06974a00$827dfea9@home1> <009c01c2ddc2$871528e0$0701010a@keva> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Table 1 Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 12:54:36 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude I've got the complete manual (sans that one table til now) as well. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael J. Richard" To: Sent: Wednesday, February 26, 2003 12:11 PM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Table 1 > By the way.....this one for the list.....as you can see I have the FULL MANUAL for the Motorola Model 1300 C-quam exciter and 1310 Modulation Monitor if any of you need anything. I seem to recall a while back when I was looking for a manual or for some info, it was pretty hard to come by. So if any of you need any info from these manuals, just let me know. > > Michael n WYO > KEVA AM Stereo 1240 > Evanston, Wyoming > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > From amymousie@yahoo.com Wed Feb 26 11:42:56 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 26 Feb 2003 19:42:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 84641 invoked from network); 26 Feb 2003 19:42:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Feb 2003 19:42:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.75) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Feb 2003 19:42:55 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.156] by n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 26 Feb 2003 19:42:53 -0000 Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 19:42:51 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: The Analog Systems all worked well.... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1637 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 67.115.110.236 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kerry Richards " wrote: > Well although "we've heard all this before", true, as you indicate, > this time the system is protected by Ibiquity's patents, anybody > making a "knock-off" radio will be put out of business by their legal > department. So I do not think this is a major concern. We did not > have this advantage in the previous AM Stereo rollout. Actually, I must beg to differ! A key reason why hardly anyone bothered to make receivers for any of the systems EXCEPT C-QUAM was because of patents, particularly patent royalties. Motorola managed to "get away with it" by waiving royalties- Especially concerning the "C-QUAM" trademark. (Interestingly, Motorola pretty much backed off C-QUAM by the time the3 standard was set, as their patent exclusivity term ran out. At present -all- AM stereo systems (except IBOC) are public domain.) I think the fact IBOC has absolutely no competition, there is no incentive for improvement, or competitive licensing fees. Big mistake, in my opinion. And no, "digital" doesn't always sell... Remember laserdiscs with digital sound? Remember the Digital Compact Cassette (and Digital Audio Tape, for that matter)- Where are they now? And even tying IBOC to digital TV, calling it "HD Radio"-- High Definition it definitely isn't! Not to mention the public's lackluster enthusiasm for HDTV, which is proving umbersom to the plans to forcibly convert all TV broadcasting to digital in the next four years. You have a long, steep hill uphill. Amy. <:3 )~~8~ (Now back to AM stereo, please.) From ai4i@hotmail.com Wed Feb 26 12:19:32 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ai4i@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 26 Feb 2003 20:19:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 7521 invoked from network); 26 Feb 2003 20:19:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Feb 2003 20:19:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (207.68.164.201) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Feb 2003 20:19:31 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 12:19:31 -0800 To: References: <1046279867.34392.29323.m4@yahoogroups.com> Subject: NTSC-2 Colour TV Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 15:19:26 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 26 Feb 2003 20:19:31.0475 (UTC) FILETIME=[5EE64630:01C2DDD4] From: "Joel Wilson" Reply-To: "Joel Wilson" X-Originating-IP: [216.77.218.46] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=127893550 X-Yahoo-Profile: ai4ijoel Would anyone care to wind up the old way-back machine and debate the pros & cons of field sequential vs line sequential vs dot sequential...LOL?? Joel Wilson Hello Taxi AI4I ========================================= Proud 2-B a pioneering satellite radio subscriber AI4I is always on the trailing edge of technology ========================================= Message: 18 Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 09:14:57 -0500 From: "Kerry Richards" Subject: The Analog Systems all worked well.... It's fun to me seeing all the data here about C-Quam versus Kahn, Belar, and Magnavox. Who would have thought after almost 20 years we would still be discussing any of this? From jsgil@hal-pc.org Wed Feb 26 13:08:29 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 26 Feb 2003 21:08:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 35560 invoked from network); 26 Feb 2003 21:08:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Feb 2003 21:08:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Feb 2003 21:08:27 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.137] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 26 Feb 2003 21:08:25 -0000 Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 21:08:23 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: The Analog Systems all worked well.... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <000a01c2dda1$7438d530$2a01010a@kerrydesk> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 7505 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.196 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kerry Richards" wrote: > It's fun to me seeing all the data here about C-Quam versus Kahn,=20 Belar, and Magnavox. Who would have thought after almost 20 years we would still be discussing any of this? >=20 > But having been there and done most of this, the problem was always that although each system had it's little drawbacks they all worked reasonably well on the bench in the lab, but never as good in practice or operation. I blame this on the antenna systems involved in the failed installations, also the issue of IPM in the transmitters in use in the early eighties and late seventies. All of the systems had pluses that made them stand out in certain situations. Harris with its synchronous detection offered the best signal integrety during interference conditions and didn't produce distortion that was a byproduct of desired signal and the=20 interference while all of the envelope based non-linear systems could never remove this distortion. Kahn was the only to solve the platform motion issue because of the inherent structure of an ISB signal but since it was a non-linear envelope based system L+R contained distortion caused by interference. The Kahn system grew out of the best that could be done with older technology and its encoding vs decoding scheme was mathematically different so perfect separation and complete distortion cancellation could never be obtained. I understand that some of the later exciters did address this issue and greater exciter/receiver match was obtained. The=20 Harris system with its fixed 90=B0 offered little envelope=20 compatibility and robbed headroom from L+R while C-QuAM directly addressed this. The Belar system even for its non-linear=20 characteristics produced less higher ordered harmonics than the Magnavox system since FM has a natural de-emphasis compared to PM. With all this in mind and more I think the best solution for the FCC was to take the best ideas from all the proposed systems and come up with one composite system that offered the best possible transmittion system. A synchronously detected, ISB, and a partial cosine corrected signal for some envelope compatibility could have been the outcome. For all the proposed systems that a part of their system was used would become equal owners in royalties for the newly patented system. Whether you could get the inventors of the=20 originally proposed system to agree and actually work together in developing it would be another story. The FCC could have said "This is the system we want and if you want AM Stereo then take it or leave it" and the participants would have to cooperate if they wanted AM Stereo. >=20 > I can tell numerous stories of failed attempts after an exciter arrived, and was attempted to be installed on a questionable array or transmitter. In most cases the situation was made worse. This never helped the state of AM Stereo because after some poor broadcaster spent thousands on the equipment, then had technical issues left unresolved, then changed all his logos to "WXXX AM Stereo" is still sounded like crap and turned listeners away. It never helped much that the receivers were crude by today's standards as well. This is where Kahn probably had the most experience in adapting a transmitter to accept a phase modulated carrier and getting the whole thing tweaked right and Motorola had the least. C-QuAM was immature when it came on the scene but Motorola marketed it like it had the major kinks worked out of it. Motorola basically pulled a Micro$oft and flooded the market with inferior receivers so it could capture market share for receivers. Its standard would be eventually adopted and then it refined its system. >=20 > If everyone had a nice non-directional quarter wave stick with a good ground system and good ground conductivity we might have a chance, but that is the ideal and unrealistic dream world which will never exist. Then there is the issue of noise, the spectrum has become increasingly noisy over each decade. (Even without IBOC!) > None of the analog systems fix this issue very well, AMAX was a good attempt, but never caught on. >=20 > HD Radio still has the same issues going for it too. No antenna that is not reasonably flat out 15KHZ on each sideband, will pass the digital sidebands properly. Then there is the issue of the transmitter itself, it has to pass all the components too. All of this sound familiar? What about nighttime? That is still unresolved.=20 >=20 Of all the shortcomings of the MW band and the obstacles to overcome it seems like in the long run that a digital system would have a=20 better chance technically in a band of its own that didn't suffer from the interference problems. MW is best for regional sevice and if HD Radio is going to have some of the same reception issues that=20 analog has then it may suffer from coverage issues that make it less regional and more local. With that in mind it would be better to find a place in the spectrum that offers digital its best chance. > The good news for digital is it can cover a whole 5 millivolt contour with about 1/10th the power. Still it appears to be a tricky issue getting these carriers out to the radios but the HD systems does answer the noise problem very well. The digital artifacts are another problem, but that does seem to be getting better ever so slowly. >=20 > So almost thirty years later, here we go with more attempts at AM Stereo. Will it catch on this time? I think that with the "Digital" moniker it might have a chance this time. But if I had to get stereo into the GM's car today it would have to be C-Quam, would n't it.....Can't get an HD Radio yet... >=20 > Sound Familiar? >=20 > Kerry Richards > Chief Engineer > WOR-AM > Buckley Broadcasting Corporation >=20 >=20 >=20 > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] It's funny about technoloy and its capabitities. It may work in the laboratory but when applied in the field it is not quite ready sometimes and many bugs have to be worked out. This is readily appearent in the 1st go round for improving the MW band and C-QuAM was NOT Ready for Prime Time. But after 20 years it has overcome most of its problems with the newer decoder chips and works fairly well but still it has not been a success market wise. The MW band is mostly talk/sports and does a good job at this and most people are happy with it. "Digital" will have to offer a big improvement and have most of its bugs worked out for people to justify buying it. Making HD radios available in cars and some portables may not be enough to get it moving and it wsn't enough to get analog AMS=20 going the 1st time around. The public is not in a buying mood right now and it looks like the economy is still struggling to get back on its feet. Until things pick up steam I don't see the public investing in this technology in mass. XM, Sirius and HDTV has not taken off enough to get the ball rolling for it to maintain its momentum. For HDTV it is bad enough that their has been talk about adopting and tax rebate for buying a HDTV set. The FCC has auctioned off spectrum that is occupied by many analog TV stations and won't get paid until it is released for use. I don't want to sound like doom and gloom but our existing technology is antiquated and it does its job reliably and people are used to it. People don't like to=20 change if something works and especially if costs a lot more and=20 this was part of the problem for AMS and will be for HD radio. JSG From jbyrns@rcn.com Wed Feb 26 13:21:42 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@rcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 26 Feb 2003 21:21:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 33534 invoked from network); 26 Feb 2003 21:21:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Feb 2003 21:21:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Feb 2003 21:21:41 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.161] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 26 Feb 2003 21:21:41 -0000 Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 21:21:37 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: The Analog Systems all worked well.... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3720 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bta_50g " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.228 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=138635554 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Mr.M S " < fanfare@g...> wrote: > > Unfortunately, it all sounds familiar. The development of AM Stereo > took the same tack as HD-radio is doing now. They too based their > success on a "boombox mentality" which is the medium on which most > broadcasters have pinned their hopes for success. > > What is missing from today's discussions is a benchmark of what the > various modes of modualtions can actually produce at the receiver. > Because a given radio station says it sounds good is only their > opinion. With all due respect Kerry, most radio stations don't have > a clue how good, or how bad they sound. Why, becasue they have never > availed themselves of being able to listen on a fully transparent > receiver. OK, let's say they did avail themselves of the ability to "listen on a fully transparent receiver", what then? Virtually all of their listeners use radios of average quality. Are you proposing that they alienate virtually their entire listener base by processing their audio so it only sounds good on a "fully transparent receiver"? > Our equipment prides itself on being able to reproduce as faithfully > as possible what is being transmitted. While that does not provide a > benchmark for the industry, it does provide the means to allow man's > acute sense of hearing and his memeory for waht is sonically > accurate to make that sort of judgement. However, the industry > typically relies on samples from (as I've seen it stated) "several > typical radios", none of which approach high fidelity, I reckon. As > a result, we seem to have the broadcast industry making value > judgements on the listener's behalf as to what is acceptable. But those typical radios are exactly what their listeners are using, if you are going to make a value judgment about what your station sounds like to it's listeners, shouldn't you use equipment similar to what he/she is using? > If you recall the term used in the watch industry to establish a > benchmark level, "quartz", or "quartz-controlled", meant that the > watch would be accaurate, and that you didn't have to wind it. > Whether it matters or not, an IBOC radio signal placed alongside a > good analog FM or AM-stereo signal would have to provide more than > just the term "digital" to establish and maintain its credibility. In watches, the fact that some watch users have a more accurate type of watch, doesn't impact the accuracy of the less accurate watches being used by others. The same is not true of a radio system, if you process for a "fully transparent receiver", operated in a quiet environment, it will have an impact on how the signal sounds on a less accurate radio, or in an automobile. > Again with due respect, I'd like to end this diatribe by playing the > devil's advocate. Some people try to make themselves look better by > making their opposition look worse. We see that in politics all the > time. I wonder if dumbing down the analog AM signal to 5KHz is not > just another way to make the digital signal sound better? But will > it go as far? If not, those listeners who've bought an IBOC > receiver and cannot demodulate the digital signal, but could hear > the AM signal before, end up with truly substandard fare. I have to wonder what percentage of the analog AM radios out there actually reproduce anything above 5 kHz? I would be surprised if it is even as much as 1%. I wouldn't think many people are likely to notice the cutback to 5 kHz, and a clean 5 kHz signal is not all that bad. I am not however saying the 5 kHz analog signal used in the IBOC system will be "clean". With due respect, John From michaelj@vcn.com Wed Feb 26 13:30:57 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 26 Feb 2003 21:30:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 96019 invoked from network); 26 Feb 2003 21:30:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Feb 2003 21:30:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m2-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.32) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Feb 2003 21:30:54 -0000 Received: from michael (unverified [209.193.86.84]) by m2-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 14:30:54 -0700 To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} Re: The Analog Systems all worked well.... Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 14:30:49 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit KXNT 840 Las Vegas has still not opened up their bandwidth back to the normal 10khz ever since that convention that used them to test IBOC in Vegas a little while back. Even on crappy radios, they STILL sound like sh*t. Sorry...but they do. Heard it again last night. EVERYTHING sounds like it's on something slightly better than a telephone line. Yeah yeah yeah....I'm sure if I was to call them they'd say "well nobody's called in to complain." I think the reason is because people have had crappy-sounding AM radios for so long now, they're just used to it and think that there's nothing wrong because AM just sounds like crap. Respectfully, Michael n WYO -----Original Message----- From: bta_50g [mailto:jbyrns@rcn.com] Sent: Wednesday, February 26, 2003 2:22 PM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: The Analog Systems all worked well.... I have to wonder what percentage of the analog AM radios out there actually reproduce anything above 5 kHz? I would be surprised if it is even as much as 1%. I wouldn't think many people are likely to notice the cutback to 5 kHz, and a clean 5 kHz signal is not all that bad. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From jsgil@hal-pc.org Wed Feb 26 14:33:39 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 26 Feb 2003 22:33:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 40924 invoked from network); 26 Feb 2003 22:33:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Feb 2003 22:33:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.69) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Feb 2003 22:33:39 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.132] by n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 26 Feb 2003 22:33:36 -0000 Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 22:33:35 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: The Analog Systems all worked well.... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 698 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.22 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "bta_50g " wrote: > > I have to wonder what percentage of the analog AM radios out there > actually reproduce anything above 5 kHz? I would be surprised if it > is even as much as 1%. I wouldn't think many people are likely to > notice the cutback to 5 kHz, and a clean 5 kHz signal is not all that > bad. I am not however saying the 5 kHz analog signal used in the IBOC > system will be "clean". > > With due respect, > > John At one time I thought that the FCC required a minimum audio BW of 7.5KHz. Is this not a requirement now or if it still is does this make IBOC non-compliant for its analog audio response. JSG From michaelj@vcn.com Wed Feb 26 14:56:24 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 26 Feb 2003 22:56:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 13400 invoked from network); 26 Feb 2003 22:56:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Feb 2003 22:56:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m2-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.32) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Feb 2003 22:56:23 -0000 Received: from michael (unverified [209.193.86.84]) by m2-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 15:56:22 -0700 To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} Re: The Analog Systems all worked well.... Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 15:56:17 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I'll field this one.... NO..the FCC never had a minimum bandwidth requirement as far as radios. NRSC says that you must transmit no more than 10khz. AMAX when they set THEIR standard said that a receiver must have 7.5khz. So yeah, a radio could not be AMAX certified if it had less than 7.5khz. But as far as the FCC is concerned, I'm sure there are plenty of cheap AM radios out there that barely reach 3khz. They don't care. It was AMAX that required 7.5khz....not the good old FCC. Can you imagine how wonderful AM radios would sound these days if the FCC HAD INDEED instituted a mandatory 7.5khz of bandwidth? Man, THAT would be nice. I bet we'd still be playing music on AM. In stereo! MJR n WYO -----Original Message----- From: jsgilst [mailto:jsgil@hal-pc.org] Sent: Wednesday, February 26, 2003 3:34 PM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: The Analog Systems all worked well.... --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "bta_50g " wrote: > > I have to wonder what percentage of the analog AM radios out there > actually reproduce anything above 5 kHz? I would be surprised if it > is even as much as 1%. I wouldn't think many people are likely to > notice the cutback to 5 kHz, and a clean 5 kHz signal is not all that > bad. I am not however saying the 5 kHz analog signal used in the IBOC > system will be "clean". > > With due respect, > > John At one time I thought that the FCC required a minimum audio BW of 7.5KHz. Is this not a requirement now or if it still is does this make IBOC non-compliant for its analog audio response. JSG Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ADVERTISEMENT Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From n0uiheric@aol.com Wed Feb 26 16:21:10 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 27 Feb 2003 00:21:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 85679 invoked from network); 27 Feb 2003 00:21:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Feb 2003 00:21:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d09.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.41) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Feb 2003 00:21:09 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-d09.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.1c3.5b599e7 (3956) for ; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 19:20:35 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1c3.5b599e7.2b8eb3d3@aol.com> Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 19:20:35 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} The Analog Systems all worked well.... To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih I don't think most people will ever afford an "HD" radio...the cost would be too prohibitive for the average Joe or Jane. In addition, IBOC is incompatible with analog AM and FM. Don't spoil a good thing...keep C-QUAM and analog FM Stereo. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From jbyrns@rcn.com Wed Feb 26 17:17:53 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@rcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 27 Feb 2003 01:17:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 92271 invoked from network); 27 Feb 2003 01:17:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Feb 2003 01:17:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.70) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Feb 2003 01:17:48 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.156] by n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Feb 2003 01:17:47 -0000 Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2003 01:17:44 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: The Analog Systems all worked well.... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 631 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bta_50g " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.161 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=138635554 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "jsgilst " < jsgil@h...> wrote: > > At one time I thought that the FCC required a minimum audio BW > of 7.5KHz. Is this not a requirement now or if it still is does > this make IBOC non-compliant for its analog audio response. You didn't say when "one time" was, so as an example of past regulations, back around 1960, the requirements were as follows. "The audio frequency transmitting characteristics of the equipment from the microphone terminals to the antenna output does not depart more than 2 decibels from that at 1,000 cycles between 100 and 5,000 cycles." John From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Feb 26 18:13:37 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 27 Feb 2003 02:13:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 86957 invoked from network); 27 Feb 2003 02:13:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Feb 2003 02:13:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.125) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Feb 2003 02:13:12 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 18:13:12 -0800 To: References: <16c.1b293484.2b8c4a20@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} How do we get the FCC off their *ss and DO SOMETHING? Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 21:12:57 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 27 Feb 2003 02:13:12.0624 (UTC) FILETIME=[C7B0A300:01C2DE05] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.160.87.76] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 n0uiheric@aol.com wrote: > To answer your question about God, Kevin...most corporate broadcasters do not believe in a just and benevolent God. I honestly do not see what a broadcaster's religion has to do with this forum. I am NOT a member of the popular politically correct religion, yet I am a broadcaster who is VERY concerned about what is happening to the Medium Wave Broadcast band. (If anybody really cares, I am of the old religion and I am very secure in my faith and should be considered non-convertible.) > > And another thing...the corporate giants also want to take 88-92 MHz away from the public broadcasters; I am in the number 59 radio market in the US. Of all the stations on the Non-Com portion of the FM Broadcast band, only TWO have a broadcast school: WSBF and WNCW. The others are just NPR relays or religious broadcasters selling air time and spots just like commercial stations. The whole FM band should be opened up to all broadcasters, and when the VHF TV stations go silent, the FM band should be expanded down to 76Mhz. > > CC has succeeded in cutting NPR's funding! The death of NPR would not be a great loss! Kevin From JH_Radio@GameBox.net Wed Feb 26 18:18:38 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: JH_Radio@GameBox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 27 Feb 2003 02:18:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 91117 invoked from network); 27 Feb 2003 02:18:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Feb 2003 02:18:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO snickers.hotpop.com) (204.57.55.49) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Feb 2003 02:18:37 -0000 Received: from gamebox.net (kubrick.hotpop.com [204.57.55.16]) by snickers.hotpop.com (Postfix) with SMTP id B867F785CD for ; Thu, 27 Feb 2003 02:18:06 +0000 (UTC) Received: from -enduser.GameBox.net (pcp03184855pcs.benslm01.pa.comcast.net [68.80.77.117]) by smtp-1.hotpop.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A53551A01F1 for ; Thu, 27 Feb 2003 02:18:01 +0000 (UTC) Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030226212224.027ba020@pop.GameBox.net> X-Sender: JH_Radio@pop.GameBox.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 21:23:27 -0500 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: [ ABDX ] Low power AM web sites In-Reply-To: <3E222052.BE864093@skyweb.net> References: <2136109468-1463792126-1042404665@topica.com> <5.2.0.9.0.20030112210509.02df6120@pop.GameBox.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-HotPOP: ----------------------------------------------- Sent By HotPOP.com FREE Email Get your FREE POP email at www.HotPOP.com ----------------------------------------------- From: John X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113800107 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Ah, cuz both stations would cause interference to each other, and the people who paid for the licence would be angry, rightfully so. At 09:11 PM 1/12/03 -0500, you wrote: > Because the 107.9 is Interfering with the local high school station WWPH down in Plainsboro,NJ which is Licensed on 107.9 at >170 watts. besides It may also be the same group that just acquired 1070 am in Sterling.. a spanish church. that Just >happens to be located In Plainfield. Not good if its the same group to have a Licensed AM station and >Run a Pirated FM... It seem to have a really strong signal In the area.. Covers about 15 miles... > Neal > >John wrote: > >> Other then not being legal, if they are not interfering with anyone, what is the problem with having a pirate on the air? >> At 07:33 PM 1/12/03 -0500, you wrote: >> > speaking Of low Power >> > there seems to Be 2 New pirates on the air in New Jersey. I am trying to >> >Find them >> > both are spanish religious... Geee these guys come to this country with No >> >regard to federal regulations.... and put up radio stations where they Feel >> >like it.. one is in the Linden/Elizabeth area on 87.9Fm stereo. with a >> >signal sometimes On 1620 resonating >> > the Detuning stub of a local Cell tower talk about Clever.... >> > the other one is somewhere Near the WTTM studios around the PlainField >> >area On 107.9fm and 1620am >> > anyone else here in NJ hear these stations >> > >> > Neal >> >CE WTTM >> > >> >"Patrick Griffith, N0NNK / WPE9HVW" wrote: >> > >> >> Here are a couple of web sites that might be of interest. >> >> >> >> http://www.talkingsign.com/index.htm has information about the talking >> >> sign transmitters that have been poppng up in various areas. >> >> >> >> http://www.issinfosite.com/nps_stations.htm has a listing of some of the >> >> National Park Service TIS stations. ISS is a manufacturer of TIS >> >> equipment. I believe this list only includes stations with transmitters >> >> supplied by this company. >> >> >> >> Patrick Griffith, CBT, Westminster, CO, USA >> >> >> >> http://community.webtv.net/N0NNK/ >> >> http://community.webtv.net/AM-DXer/ >> >> >> >> ======================== >> >> American Broadcast DXers >> >> Greatest DX on earth! >> >> ======================== >> >> >> >> ==^================================================================ >> >> This email was sent to: groucho@skyweb.net >> >> >> >> EASY UNSUBSCRIBE click here: http://topica.com/u/?bUrKzU.bWeP3W.Z3JvdWNo >> >> Or send an email to: ABDX-unsubscribe@topica.com >> >> >> >> TOPICA - Start your own email discussion group. FREE! >> >> http://www.topica.com/partner/tag02/create/index2.html >> >> ==^================================================================ >> > >> > >> >Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: >> >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum >> > >> >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ >> >> >> >> Love in Christ: >> >> John >> >> Bensalem, PA >> >> Send me an email >> >> Aim: RainAngelsRule >> >> MSN: >> >> RainAngelsRule@hotmail.com >> >> My website >> >> Welcome to Napster4TheBlind >> >> "Prayer does not change God; it changes you." - Authur unknown >> >> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >> >> Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: >> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum >> >> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > >Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Love in Christ: John Bensalem, PA Send me an email Aim: RainAngelsRule MSN: RainAngelsRule@hotmail.com My website Welcome to Napster4TheBlind "Prayer does not change God; it changes you." - Authur unknown [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Feb 26 20:24:43 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 27 Feb 2003 04:24:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 61931 invoked from network); 27 Feb 2003 04:24:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Feb 2003 04:24:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.201) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Feb 2003 04:24:42 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 20:24:42 -0800 To: References: <60.2de2d791.2b8c7376@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} A Letter To The ARRL on WOR's IBOCrap Operation Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 23:24:28 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 27 Feb 2003 04:24:42.0279 (UTC) FILETIME=[264A7370:01C2DE18] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.137.165.37] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 n0uiheric@aol.com wrote: > Hams close to IBOC transmitters may find interference to their signals from the IBOC signals. Conversion to IBOC will require AM stations to replace their 50 year old + RF plants to modern design transmitters and antenna systems. The new transmitter put out much LESS harmonics, spurs, birdies, and other such RF trash. That means Hams will get much LESS interference from IBOC broadcast stations. Kevin From krichards@wor710.com Wed Feb 26 20:42:45 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 57643 invoked from network); 27 Feb 2003 04:42:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Feb 2003 04:42:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.69) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Feb 2003 04:42:44 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: krichards@wor710.com Received: from [66.218.67.163] by n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Feb 2003 04:42:44 -0000 X-Sender: krichards@wor710.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 26 Feb 2003 23:17:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 30419 invoked from network); 26 Feb 2003 23:17:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 26 Feb 2003 23:17:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 26 Feb 2003 23:17:17 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.131] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 26 Feb 2003 23:17:17 -0000 Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 23:17:17 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: The Analog Systems all worked well.... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1410 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kerry Richards " X-Originating-IP: 66.47.86.250 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=136545831 X-Yahoo-Profile: kerryrichards710 X-eGroups-Approved-By: kevtronics via web; 27 Feb 2003 04:42:39 -0000 > AMAX that required 7.5khz....not the good old FCC. Can you imagine how > wonderful AM radios would sound these days if the FCC HAD INDEED instituted > a mandatory 7.5khz of bandwidth? Man, THAT would be nice. I bet we'd still > be playing music on AM. In stereo! > I agree with you on this one. I think the FCC should have made any radio with FM stereo have AM stereo, period. But we all know what happened. The big problem here is at the time, if this had happened, smaller broadcasters would have been squeezed big time. They would have had to make major upgrades and repairs too numerous to mention, just to pass a signal through their plant. Even today, the prospect of changing any modulation mode at all, is a nightmare, even for the big boys. You are talking thousands of plants that need to be upgraded, and that's everything from the ground system to the console in the studio, and everything in between. Who will pay for this, and will HD radio justify this kind of expense, and produce results? There is no doubt HD Radio has a large hill to climb even to get a minor presence in the marketplace. But look at Sirius and XM they are really struggling. I do not think HD when it gets in the cars will have that much of a problem, but even that is two years away. What happens between now and then? Kerry Richards Chief Engineer WOR-AM Buckley Broadcasting Corporation From possumhunter@netzero.net Wed Feb 26 20:44:54 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 27 Feb 2003 04:44:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 47253 invoked from network); 27 Feb 2003 04:44:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Feb 2003 04:44:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.115) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Feb 2003 04:44:53 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 26 Feb 2003 20:44:53 -0800 To: References: <000a01c2dda1$7438d530$2a01010a@kerrydesk> <006b01c2ddb1$04361bc0$0701010a@keva> Subject: Re: {AMSF} The Analog Systems all worked well.... Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 23:44:45 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 27 Feb 2003 04:44:53.0750 (UTC) FILETIME=[F8624160:01C2DE1A] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.137.165.37] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Michael J. Richard wrote: >Just wish this old thing wouldn't eat these 4-400C tubes so quick. With the high price and poor quality of tubes you get now and the amount of electricity that old McMartin eats, a New BE AM1A transmitter ($12,500) would pay for itself in parts, labor, and power in less than the life of 5 sets of tubes! Kevin From amymousie@yahoo.com Wed Feb 26 21:22:47 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 27 Feb 2003 05:22:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 65231 invoked from network); 27 Feb 2003 05:22:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Feb 2003 05:22:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.90) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Feb 2003 05:22:46 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.184] by n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Feb 2003 05:22:46 -0000 Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2003 05:22:46 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} The Analog Systems all worked well.... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 584 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 67.118.18.217 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Possum Hunter" wrote: > Michael J. Richard wrote: > >Just wish this old thing wouldn't eat these 4-400C tubes so quick. > > With the high price and poor quality of tubes you get now and the amount of > electricity that old McMartin eats, a New BE AM1A transmitter ($12,500) > would pay for itself in parts, labor, and power in less than the life of 5 > sets of tubes! What happens to the dead tubes? Could anyone acquire one of these dead tubes for themselves, knowing full well they can't bew used? Amy. <:3 )~~8~ From kevtronics@yahoo.com Wed Feb 26 22:26:05 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 27 Feb 2003 06:26:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 27039 invoked from network); 27 Feb 2003 06:26:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Feb 2003 06:26:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.70) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Feb 2003 06:26:04 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.159] by n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Feb 2003 06:26:04 -0000 Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2003 06:26:03 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: The Analog Systems all worked well.... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3162 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.74.14 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > I have to wonder what percentage of the analog AM radios out there > actually reproduce anything above 5 kHz? I would be surprised if > it is even as much as 1%. I wouldn't think many people are likely > to notice the cutback to 5 kHz, and a clean 5 kHz signal is not all > that bad. Philips-Magnavox radios have been selling nicely for a number of years, and right out of the box they are rated for a 40 - 8000 Hz audio response on AM. In fact that even meets the AMAX specification which is 50 - 7500 Hz for AC-powered radios and 50 - 6500 Hz for battery-powered portable radios (basically a loophole so the Sony SRF-42 with its 6 kHz ceramic filter could meet the AMAX specs). Also, basically any AM radio that doesn't use a ceramic filter is going to have at least some response well above 5 kHz, and this includes millions upon millions of "legacy" receivers as well as a good number of radios even made today, such as the little $5.00 Soundesign AM/FM transistor radio sold at Wal-Mart. But even for newer digital-tuning radios which use ceramic filters on AM, there is still often a good amount of useable audio response above 5 kHz. Remember, if you can hear the 10 kHz inter-carrier whistle on an AM receiver, you know right away that it has at least *some* response at this point. My car radio uses a "3 kHz" ceramic filter and at night from time to time I can still hear the whistle. The "ringing" distortion caused by the Optimod's 5 kHz audio filter is another serious issue, which is not only annoyingly noticeable on wide-response AM receiver, but is noticeable even on narrow-bandwidth radios as well, as a constant sort of scratchy "tinge" to the sound, which sounds especially bad with music. Thus, unless they use some other audio processor, any AM station that transmits IBOC and uses an Optimod set to filter the analog audio to 5 kHz is going to have this problem -- like WOR does. Furthermore, what all this boils down to is that people who have made the investment in high-quality analog AM receivers are actually being punished by the IBAC/"HD Radio" system, since the better an AM radio sounds with analog signals, the *worse* it will sound with HD Radio, due to the effect of the reduced bandwidth combined with the constant digital carrier hissing/squealing in the background. This sets up the illogical scenario in which people have been used to the fact that engaging the "AM ST" mode on many car radios (especially Delcos) usually makes any AM station, mono or Stereo, sound better due to the wider bandwidth -- but instead, on an IBAC/HD Radio signal, it will actually sound WORSE after engaging wide bandwidth/"AM ST" mode! HD Radio does offer a transmission mode in which the analog audio bandwidth is extended to 8 kHz, but as far as I know, no tests have been conducted using this mode, and the official iBiquity documentation barely even mentions it and never shows what the occupied spectrum of the HD signal is like with 8 kHz analog audio, so as of yet, I'd call it a "Use at your own risk" mode that the vast majority of new IBAC/HD Radio stations will likely ignore. From jsgil@hal-pc.org Thu Feb 27 01:12:10 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 27 Feb 2003 09:12:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 45569 invoked from network); 27 Feb 2003 09:12:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Feb 2003 09:12:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Feb 2003 09:12:10 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.180] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Feb 2003 09:12:10 -0000 Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2003 09:12:09 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: The Analog Systems all worked well.... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1022 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.123 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "bta_50g " wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "jsgilst " < > jsgil@h...> wrote: > > > > At one time I thought that the FCC required a minimum audio BW > > of 7.5KHz. Is this not a requirement now or if it still is does > > this make IBOC non-compliant for its analog audio response. > > You didn't say when "one time" was, so as an example of past > regulations, back around 1960, the requirements were as follows. > > "The audio frequency transmitting characteristics of the equipment > from the microphone terminals to the antenna output does not depart > more than 2 decibels from that at 1,000 cycles between 100 and 5,000 > cycles." > > John Yes, I thought there were minimal quality standards that included distortion, minimum freq response i.e. 100Hz-7.5KHz with a specified amount of ripple like you have stated above as 100Hz-5KHz but I thought it went up to 7.5KHz at one time that a station had to meet. JSG From narkspud@hotmail.com Thu Feb 27 07:53:43 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: narkspud@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 27 Feb 2003 15:53:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 33022 invoked from network); 27 Feb 2003 15:53:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Feb 2003 15:53:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Feb 2003 15:53:40 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.141] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Feb 2003 15:53:39 -0000 Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2003 15:53:38 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Best stereo song track ? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 227 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "narkspud " X-Originating-IP: 67.89.146.146 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=81956306 X-Yahoo-Profile: narkspud Norman - Sue Thompson Do Re Mi - Lee Dorsey Madison Time Part 1 - Ray Bryant Combo Diamonds and Pearls - The Paradons The Inner Light - The Beatles Oh Happy Day - The Edwin Hawkins Singers America the Beautiful - The Chipmunks From michaelj@vcn.com Thu Feb 27 08:11:25 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 27 Feb 2003 16:11:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 2186 invoked from network); 27 Feb 2003 16:11:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Feb 2003 16:11:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m3-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.33) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Feb 2003 16:11:19 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m3-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Thu, 27 Feb 2003 09:11:19 -0700 Message-ID: <000d01c2de7a$dc4ceb00$0701010a@keva> To: References: <000a01c2dda1$7438d530$2a01010a@kerrydesk> <006b01c2ddb1$04361bc0$0701010a@keva> Subject: Re: {AMSF} The Analog Systems all worked well.... Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2003 09:11:14 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I agree Kevin! But then again, it's easier for them to come up with the money for the tubes than to come up with 12 grand for a new transmitter. That's just the way things work here. I imagine it is the same story at many MANY small town radio stations out there. Costing them about $450 (including my labor to put them in and tune the transmitter) for 2 new tubes about every 6 months.....it'd take about 12 or 13 years for it to pay for itself. Kinda like about 10 years ago when I asked the main engineer about converting to AM Stereo and he said "well basically a station should budget about 13,000 dollars to go stereo." And I said "Well forget THAT! They'll never spend it!" The ONLY reason we're stereo now is because the equipment didn't cost anything, and I didn't charge them any labor whatsoever to put it all in.....because this is a labor of love for me. Honestly, if there was another station in town that wanted to go stereo, I would help them or do it for them without charging labor to do it. I did the same thing for the station in Kemmerer Wyoming. They bought the exciter and I put it in and didn't charge them to put it in. Anyways....back to the main issue.....nah, they'll never spend that kind of money unless the McMartin were to totally DIE and be un-fixable. And even then, I think they'd probably shop around to find an old tube transmitter that's used that they can pick up for half or even 1/4 of the price of a new solid state. Michael n WYO ----- Original Message ----- From: Possum Hunter To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, February 26, 2003 9:44 PM Subject: Re: {AMSF} The Analog Systems all worked well.... With the high price and poor quality of tubes you get now and the amount of electricity that old McMartin eats, a New BE AM1A transmitter ($12,500) would pay for itself in parts, labor, and power in less than the life of 5 sets of tubes! Kevin [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From jbyrns@rcn.com Thu Feb 27 09:07:59 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@rcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 27 Feb 2003 17:07:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 63987 invoked from network); 27 Feb 2003 17:07:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Feb 2003 17:07:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Feb 2003 17:07:22 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.136] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Feb 2003 17:07:22 -0000 Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2003 17:07:19 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: The Analog Systems all worked well.... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 5201 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bta_50g " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.98.116 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=138635554 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " < kevtronics@y...> wrote: > > I have to wonder what percentage of the analog AM radios out there > > actually reproduce anything above 5 kHz? I would be surprised if > > it is even as much as 1%. I wouldn't think many people are likely > > to notice the cutback to 5 kHz, and a clean 5 kHz signal is not > > all that bad. > > Philips-Magnavox radios have been selling nicely for a number of > years, and right out of the box they are rated for a 40 - 8000 Hz > audio response on AM. In fact that even meets the AMAX > specification which is 50 - 7500 Hz for AC-powered radios and 50 - > 6500 Hz for battery-powered portable radios (basically a loophole so > the Sony SRF-42 with its 6 kHz ceramic filter could meet the AMAX > specs). The question is not if there are radios out there that will go past 5 kHz, I have several myself, rather the question is how common these radios are outside of the members of this group? > Also, basically any AM radio that doesn't use a ceramic filter is > going to have at least some response well above 5 kHz, and this > includes millions upon millions of "legacy" receivers as well as a > good number of radios even made today, such as the little $5.00 > Soundesign AM/FM transistor radio sold at Wal-Mart. I'm not sure why you imply radios without a "ceramic filter" won't have a narrow response, I have heard plenty of radios with only LC filters that sound very rolled off. In fact I have made measurements that suggest just a high Q ferrite bar antenna can cause severe audio roll off. > But even for newer digital-tuning radios which use ceramic filters > on AM, there is still often a good amount of useable audio response > above 5 kHz. Remember, if you can hear the 10 kHz inter-carrier > whistle on an AM receiver, you know right away that it has at least > *some* response at this point. My car radio uses a "3 kHz" ceramic > filter and at night from time to time I can still hear the whistle. I agree that if you can hear the 10 kHz adjacent channel beat, then you have some audio response above 5 kHz, but beyond that I think the criteria we are both talking about are rather subjective, the radios "sounding rolled off" to me, and "having usable audio response above 5 kHz" for you. > The "ringing" distortion caused by the Optimod's 5 kHz audio filter > is another serious issue, which is not only annoyingly noticeable on > wide-response AM receiver, but is noticeable even on narrow- > bandwidth radios as well, as a constant sort of scratchy "tinge" to > the sound, which sounds especially bad with music. Thus, unless > they use some other audio processor, any AM station that transmits > IBOC and uses an Optimod set to filter the analog audio to 5 kHz is > going to have this problem -- like WOR does. This is an interesting point, exactly what do you mean by "ringing" distortion caused by the Optimod's 5 kHz audio filter"? Are you saying you can hear the ripple in the filters frequency domain response, the over/under shoot of the filter in the time domain, or the effects of the Optimod's mysterious "overshoot compensated filters"? > Furthermore, what all this boils down to is that people who have > made the investment in high-quality analog AM receivers are actually > being punished by the IBAC/"HD Radio" system, since the better an AM > radio sounds with analog signals, the *worse* it will sound with HD > Radio, due to the effect of the reduced bandwidth combined with the > constant digital carrier hissing/squealing in the background. Yes, that is true, but how many people outside of this group are affected by this, or care about it? Life is not perfect, sometimes you have to give something up to make forward progress. > This sets up the illogical scenario in which people have been used > to the fact that engaging the "AM ST" mode on many car radios > (especially Delcos) usually makes any AM station, mono or Stereo, > sound better due to the wider bandwidth -- but instead, on an IBAC/ > HD Radio signal, it will actually sound WORSE after engaging wide > bandwidth/"AM ST" mode! I am not sure why you call this situation "illogical"? Also you seem to be implying that the wider bandwidth always sounds better, if that is true, I wonder why the radio manufacturers went to the extra expense of including the narrow bandwidth capability in the first place? If wider bandwidth always sounds better, why not just build the radio with only the wider bandwidth? > HD Radio does offer a transmission mode in which the analog audio > bandwidth is extended to 8 kHz, but as far as I know, no tests have > been conducted using this mode, and the official iBiquity > documentation barely even mentions it and never shows what the > occupied spectrum of the HD signal is like with 8 kHz analog audio, > so as of yet, I'd call it a "Use at your own risk" mode that the > vast majority of new IBAC/HD Radio stations will likely ignore. I thought I saw something recently that gave a fairly complete explanation of this mode, but I can't remember where I might have seen it. John From jbyrns@rcn.com Thu Feb 27 09:13:27 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@rcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 27 Feb 2003 17:13:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 75843 invoked from network); 27 Feb 2003 17:12:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Feb 2003 17:12:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Feb 2003 17:12:56 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.153] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Feb 2003 17:12:55 -0000 Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2003 17:12:55 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: The Analog Systems all worked well.... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2213 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bta_50g " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.98.116 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=138635554 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "jsgilst " < jsgil@h...> wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "bta_50g " > wrote: > > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "jsgilst " < > > jsgil@h...> wrote: > > > > > > At one time I thought that the FCC required a minimum audio BW > > > of 7.5KHz. Is this not a requirement now or if it still is does > > > this make IBOC non-compliant for its analog audio response. > > > > You didn't say when "one time" was, so as an example of past > > regulations, back around 1960, the requirements were as follows. > > > > "The audio frequency transmitting characteristics of the equipment > > from the microphone terminals to the antenna output does not depart > > more than 2 decibels from that at 1,000 cycles between 100 and 5,000 > > cycles." > > Yes, I thought there were minimal quality standards that included > distortion, minimum freq response i.e. 100Hz-7.5KHz with a specified > amount of ripple like you have stated above as 100Hz-5KHz but I > thought it went up to 7.5KHz at one time that a station had to meet. Yes, while audio response was only specified out to 5 kHz, the same 1960 era source says the distortion was specified out to 7.5 kHz, as follows. "The total audio frequency distortion from microphone terminals, including microphone amplifier, to antenna output does not exceed 5 percent harmonics when modulated from 0 to 84 percent, and not over 7.5 percent harmonics when modulating 85 to 95 percent (distortion shall be measured with modulating frequencies of 50, 100, 400, 1000, 5000 and 7500 cycles up to tenth harmonic or 16000 cycles , or any intermediate frequency that readings on these frequencies indicate is desirable)." And noise was specified to be as follows: "The carrier hum and extraneous noise level (unweighted r.s.s.) is at least 50 decibels below 100 percent modulation for the frequency band of 150 to 5000 cycles and at least 40 decibels down outside this range." It is interesting to note that the 120 Hz hum in low power transmitters operated from single phase electrical supplies was only required to be 40 dB below 100% modulation. John From ai4i@hotmail.com Thu Feb 27 09:48:24 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ai4i@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 27 Feb 2003 17:48:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 77916 invoked from network); 27 Feb 2003 17:48:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Feb 2003 17:48:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (207.68.164.98) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Feb 2003 17:48:23 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 27 Feb 2003 09:48:23 -0800 To: References: <1046361226.5557.33058.m13@yahoogroups.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Digest Number 604 Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2003 12:48:16 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 27 Feb 2003 17:48:23.0749 (UTC) FILETIME=[6C86D750:01C2DE88] From: "Joel Wilson" Reply-To: "Joel Wilson" X-Originating-IP: [216.77.212.220] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=127893550 X-Yahoo-Profile: ai4ijoel I remember taking a cheap but wide analogue AM tuner (forgot the make & Model, no filters) in an AM-FMstr receiver from the early seventies and retuning all 455khz RF & IF stages up to about 520khz, the highest it would go before I would start hearing the local oscillater on the low end of the band. This noticably increased the tuner's audio response. I remember having to carefully position the unit (with its directional ferrite rod antenna) in order to hear my local station without a strong 10khz whistle. Fortunately, the two stations were 90° apart. Where practical, raising the IF frequency above 455khz is a good way to increase an AM receiver's audio response. Lowering it will increase selectivity. Joel Wilson Hello Taxi AI4I ========================================= Proud 2-B a pioneering satellite radio subscriber AI4I is always on the trailing edge of technology ========================================= Message: 23 Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2003 06:26:03 -0000 From: "Kevin T. " Subject: Re: The Analog Systems all worked well.... Philips-Magnavox radios have been selling nicely for a number of years, and right out of the box they are rated for a 40 - 8000 Hz audio response on AM. In fact that even meets the AMAX specification which is 50 - 7500 Hz for AC-powered radios and 50 - 6500 Hz for battery-powered portable radios (basically a loophole so the Sony SRF-42 with its 6 kHz ceramic filter could meet the AMAX specs). From jsgil@hal-pc.org Thu Feb 27 12:26:38 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 27 Feb 2003 20:26:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 44457 invoked from network); 27 Feb 2003 20:26:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Feb 2003 20:26:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Feb 2003 20:26:37 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.175] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 27 Feb 2003 20:26:36 -0000 Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2003 20:26:36 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: The Analog Systems all worked well.... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2553 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.130.94 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "bta_50g " wrote: > > I'm not sure why you imply radios without a "ceramic filter" won't > have a narrow response, I have heard plenty of radios with only LC > filters that sound very rolled off. In fact I have made measurements > that suggest just a high Q ferrite bar antenna can cause severe audio > roll off. The Hi-Q ferrite antenna im my last AMS conversion was so narrow that it severly rolled off my otherwise fairly flat responding 9.5KHz decoder with a wide ceramic filter and gave it a telephone sound. I hade to put a small resistor in series with the antenna coil and tuning capacitor to De-Q it. Once I did the frequency response opened up. > I am not sure why you call this situation "illogical"? Also you seem > to be implying that the wider bandwidth always sounds better, if that > is true, I wonder why the radio manufacturers went to the extra > expense of including the narrow bandwidth capability in the first > place? If wider bandwidth always sounds better, why not just build > the radio with only the wider bandwidth? > > John Wideband sounds great when there is little interference but as the interference increases then the BW needs to decrease. DXing in most cases needs a narrow BW although under certain circumstances a medium BW will work on a strong DX signal. I think this narrowband issue in most radios came about for several reasons. A wideband receiver requires notch filters, lower distortion RF, mixer, IF, and AF since the human ear is most likely to notice distortion in the upper midrange and treble first, and a generally all over better design. This all adds up to additional costs for the manufacturer and unless the majority consumers want this the manufacturer is not going to do it. As more stations came on line the interference problem grew at night and the manufacturers narrowed the bandwidth to compensate. Broadcasters then boosted the HF to compensate which didn't help and the manufacturers made the BW narrower. When the interference problem was at its worst, before the 10.2KHz BW and a defined pre-emphasis, if manufacturers made their AM setction wide BW then consumers would evaluate it as being a poor receiver not being able to effectively remove the interference. Also at this time the majority of AM stations were/are news/talk/sports and didn't need a wide BW anyway to convey the information so the most logical and cheapest solution for manufacturers was to make all radios narrow BW. JSG From michaelj@vcn.com Thu Feb 27 12:57:37 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 27 Feb 2003 20:57:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 40923 invoked from network); 27 Feb 2003 20:57:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Feb 2003 20:57:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m3-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.33) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Feb 2003 20:57:36 -0000 Received: from michael (unverified [209.193.86.78]) by m3-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Thu, 27 Feb 2003 13:57:35 -0700 To: Subject: Help! Decoder problems Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2003 13:57:23 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Importance: Normal From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Hi all I know I asked this before and don't recall getting a response. Chris may have been busy at the time (Chris? Busy? NAHHH!!!!! :) ). But anyway, here's what's going on. This is the conversion that I did on my JVC home tuner. Does a decoder have something built in to it that filters out the pilot tone or something like that?? Right now I can tell even better since I've converted KEVA, my local, to AM Stereo. This is a digitally tuned receiver that used I think the LA1235 am tuner chip. In any case, I think I'm tapping the IF right off of there before the ceramic filter(s). Yes, barn-door bandwidth...I don't care. It sounds good. Anyways....here's what is going on. The decoder will sit there and flicker a little bit on an off....then it'll finally "lock in". Once it does I get the "rumbling" while it is locked in. The rumbling sounds very much like "25 hz". I know this because working in radio, we used to use a lot of reel to reels for music and commercials that all had 25hz EOM tones on them. So I recognize that 25hz rumble. Anyways, the decoder locks in....sits there for about....dunno..4 or 5 seconds rumbling with stereo audio and then pops out of stereo and starts to flicker again for a little while....then it'll try and pop in again and so forth. It's almost like the decoder is amplifying the 25hz pilot tone and letting it through into the audio outputs. Does that make sense? It's like the rumble is what's causing the decoder to pop back out of stereo. The only other thing that I can think of is that the line coming off of the positive (+) lead of the stereo indicator LED on the decoder board, goes over to the FM tuner chip of the receiver and connects to the normally "stereo indicator out" pin on the FM chip.....which in turn makes the stereo indicator light on the reciever. I had asked Chris about this when I first did it, and he said it should be fine. This has pretty much been the case since I put this decoder in here. I could probably make a cassette recording of what it sounds like, and then upload the file somewhere so you could hear what it sounds like and maybe tell me what is going on. Just imagine mono audio coming in and then all of a sudden audio getting a little louder and popping into stereo and having this rumble behind it. Any ideas? Is there something I can try with the decoder? Is the decoder getting too much IF?? Is it getting too little?? Should I try a different IF tap? Should I go ahead and go on the other side of the ceramic filter?? (which would be extremely low bandwidth....only about 4khz I'd have to guess) Should I just try another decoder? Should I disconnect that lead for the stereo indicator?? Is something oscillating?? Thanks Any thoughts would be appreciated Michael n WYO From ccuff@in4web.com Thu Feb 27 13:17:19 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 27 Feb 2003 21:17:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 3811 invoked from network); 27 Feb 2003 21:17:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Feb 2003 21:17:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Feb 2003 21:17:16 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.142]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Thu, 27 Feb 2003 16:14:10 -0500 Message-ID: <000901c2dea4$4b140040$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Help! Decoder problems Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2003 16:07:52 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 OK, here goes my method of trying decoders. First off, I always use a 9 volt transistor battery to power the decoder. No DC power from the tuner at all. I then attach a small 3.5mm stereo jack to the decoder output, and use a pair of headphones right at the decoder output. Yes, it will be very low level, but still audible. I then put a piece of shielded cable to the decoder input- shield to ground, of course, and use the hot side to probe for the best take off point. You need to see where the noise is coming from first, and you cant do that unless the decoder is isolated from the circuit. I also now add a .1 ufd cap from the on-board 78L05 regulator to ground- it helps. Chris ----- Original Message ----- From: Michael J. Richard From michaelj@vcn.com Thu Feb 27 13:43:33 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 27 Feb 2003 21:43:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 36918 invoked from network); 27 Feb 2003 21:43:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Feb 2003 21:43:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m1-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.31) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Feb 2003 21:43:32 -0000 Received: from michael (unverified [209.193.86.78]) by m1-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Thu, 27 Feb 2003 14:43:32 -0700 To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} Help! Decoder problems Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2003 14:43:19 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) In-Reply-To: <000901c2dea4$4b140040$0101a8c0@pavilion> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Importance: Normal From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Thanks Chris Yes, this is one of your first-generation decoders so I figured there may be some difference between there and what you do nowadays. I will try those methods. You're right...that's the only way to find the problem. I know right here at the shop now that I have my Alfredo Lite, I should be able to get a good test here too. This was the first conversion I ever attempted. You sold me the decoder a few years ago. I'll try to see what I can do to figure out what's going on and where the noise is coming from. Will keep ya posted. MJR [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From michaelj@vcn.com Thu Feb 27 15:27:12 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 27 Feb 2003 23:27:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 29486 invoked from network); 27 Feb 2003 23:27:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Feb 2003 23:27:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m2-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.32) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Feb 2003 23:27:11 -0000 Received: from michael (unverified [209.193.86.78]) by m2-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Thu, 27 Feb 2003 16:27:11 -0700 To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} Help! Decoder problems Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2003 16:26:57 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) In-Reply-To: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Importance: Normal From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Well I think I got the problem solved. It seems the voltage source I had it connected to was only about 7 volts and this thing is apparantly picky. Honestly, I connected it to a terminal that gives it about 12 volts and it's working great. I figured I may as well give it a shot.....what's the worst that could happen? I'd blow it and need another one. The on-board voltage regulator seems to be doing okay...not even the least bit warm. So I think it'll be allright. Pure clean stereo. sounds pretty good. Still a little muddy, though. And I hear it that muddy coming right off of the LA1245 chip.....so it must be that this chip doesn't have much bandwidth, period. It's okay, though. Not too bad. Michael n WYO [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Feb 27 16:14:11 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 28 Feb 2003 00:14:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 81313 invoked from network); 28 Feb 2003 00:13:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Feb 2003 00:13:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.79) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Feb 2003 00:13:51 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 27 Feb 2003 16:13:51 -0800 To: References: <000a01c2dda1$7438d530$2a01010a@kerrydesk> <006b01c2ddb1$04361bc0$0701010a@keva> <000d01c2de7a$dc4ceb00$0701010a@keva> Subject: Re: {AMSF} The Analog Systems all worked well.... Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2003 19:13:41 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 28 Feb 2003 00:13:51.0523 (UTC) FILETIME=[45C11730:01C2DEBE] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.130.226.204] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Michael J. Richard wrote: > I agree Kevin! But then again, it's easier for them to come up with the money for the tubes than to come up with 12 grand for a new transmitter. The way you sell them on the idea is get them to lease the BE transmitter. The McMartin tube budget is nearly $100 a month. It will cut you air conditioning bill in half getting rid of the heat. It will also cut the price of electricity to run the transmitter on a Class C by about $100 bucks per month. The cost of repairs will now be zero, and the BE comes with the CQUAM card installed. Leasing the BE is CHEAPER than running the old McMartin. Becuase the BE already has AM Stereo, you can donate the Stereo Exciter to me and I will put it on the air at WFIS! :-) Kevin From alfredot@inetarena.com Thu Feb 27 16:27:55 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: alfredot@inetarena.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 28 Feb 2003 00:27:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 25757 invoked from network); 28 Feb 2003 00:27:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Feb 2003 00:27:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.inetarena.com) (206.129.216.13) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Feb 2003 00:27:54 -0000 Received: from hendrie (1Cust132.tnt16.beaverton.or.da.uu.net [67.227.163.132]) by mail.inetarena.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h1S0Ove08442 for ; Thu, 27 Feb 2003 16:24:59 -0800 (PST) Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2003 16:27:08 -0800 (PST) X-Sender: alfredo@hendrie.1610am.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: The Analog Systems all worked well.... In-Reply-To: <1046361226.5557.33058.m13@yahoogroups.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: "Alfredo E. Torrejon" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=25132238 X-Yahoo-Profile: alfredotorrejon > > What is missing from today's discussions is a benchmark of what the > > various modes of modualtions can actually produce at the receiver. > > Because a given radio station says it sounds good is only their > > opinion. With all due respect Kerry, most radio stations don't have > > a clue how good, or how bad they sound. Why, becasue they have never > > availed themselves of being able to listen on a fully transparent > > receiver. > > OK, let's say they did avail themselves of the ability to "listen on a > fully transparent receiver", what then? Virtually all of their > listeners use radios of average quality. Are you proposing that they > alienate virtually their entire listener base by processing their > audio so it only sounds good on a "fully transparent receiver"? I've seen this issue come up before; some time ago, one of our AMs cut its audio bandwidth to about 5kHz as soon as a new chief engineer started working there. The Optimod artifacts that some have described could very clearly be heard. Anyway, the engineer used this same logic, on our local radio discussion board, to defend his actions. However, what I would like an answer to is a more simple question: do engineers know for certain that it's possible that audio processed to sound clean on a hi-fi receiver like the Fanfare tuner could sound unacceptable on a narroband AM tuner? Are there actual known technical issues that could cause this to happen? Alfredo From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Feb 27 17:00:31 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 28 Feb 2003 01:00:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 7390 invoked from network); 28 Feb 2003 01:00:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Feb 2003 01:00:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.206) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Feb 2003 01:00:30 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 27 Feb 2003 17:00:07 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} The Analog Systems all worked well.... Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2003 19:59:58 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 28 Feb 2003 01:00:07.0761 (UTC) FILETIME=[BC856410:01C2DEC4] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.130.226.204] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 amymousie@yahoo.com wrote: > What happens to the dead tubes? Could anyone acquire one of these dead tubes for themselves, knowing full well they can't bew used? Yes, Just ask around the local AMs. What is real cool is to put a small filiment transformer in a small wood box then mount a friedt 4-400 tube on it and hook it up to the transfomer. This makes a real cool looking desk lamp. Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Feb 27 17:12:57 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: possumhunter@netzero.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 28 Feb 2003 01:12:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 2166 invoked from network); 28 Feb 2003 01:12:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Feb 2003 01:12:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rly-ip04.mx.aol.com) (64.12.138.8) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Feb 2003 01:12:56 -0000 Received: from logs-wg.proxy.aol.com (logs-wg.proxy.aol.com [205.188.196.5]) by rly-ip04.mx.aol.com (v89.10) with ESMTP id RELAYIN2-0227200846; Thu, 27 Feb 2003 20:08:46 -0500 Received: from ibm (AC82E2CC.ipt.aol.com [172.130.226.204]) by logs-wg.proxy.aol.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with SMTP id h1S163O4090574 for ; Thu, 27 Feb 2003 20:06:06 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <01e001c2dec5$8de95d40$cce282ac@aoldsl.net> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: The Analog Systems all worked well.... Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2003 20:05:54 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Apparently-From: DodgeRamTrucker@aol.com From: "Possum Hunter" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 kevtronics@yahoo.com wrote: > The "ringing" distortion caused by the Optimod's 5 kHz audio filter is another serious issue, This ringing distortion seems to only be a problem with the Optimod 9200. The 5Khz filter for the 9100 series does not ring. I would assume the 5Khz filter for the Optimod 9000 would not ring. Kevin From amymousie@yahoo.com Thu Feb 27 17:20:00 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 28 Feb 2003 01:20:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 77582 invoked from network); 28 Feb 2003 01:20:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Feb 2003 01:20:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Feb 2003 01:20:00 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.179] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Feb 2003 01:19:59 -0000 Date: Fri, 28 Feb 2003 01:19:27 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} The Analog Systems all worked well.... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 640 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 67.118.18.217 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Possum Hunter" wrote: > amymousie@y... wrote: > > What happens to the dead tubes? Could anyone acquire one of these dead > tubes for themselves, knowing full well they can't bew used? > > Yes, Just ask around the local AMs. What is real cool is to put a small > filiment transformer in a small wood box then mount a friedt 4-400 tube on > it and hook it up to the transfomer. This makes a real cool looking desk > lamp. That actually sounds like a neat idea. :) Not to just find one that burns out tubes on a frequent basis- if any here still uses them. Amy. <:3 )~~8~ From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Feb 27 17:43:02 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 28 Feb 2003 01:43:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 82308 invoked from network); 28 Feb 2003 01:43:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Feb 2003 01:43:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.197) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Feb 2003 01:43:02 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 27 Feb 2003 17:43:02 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} The Analog Systems all worked well.... Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2003 20:42:52 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 28 Feb 2003 01:43:02.0022 (UTC) FILETIME=[BAE67260:01C2DECA] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.139.237.200] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 amymousie@yahoo.com wrote: >Not to just find one that burns out tubes on a frequent basis- if any here still uses them. Listen around on the AM dial at the 1000 Watt stations. The most muffled, distorted one is your target. OR Call up Goodrich Enterprises and ask them who in your area has one of their BA1K sh*t boxes on the air. That station will have several hundred blown tubes laying around! Kevin From stodd@sherbtel.net Thu Feb 27 17:46:40 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 28 Feb 2003 01:46:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 24811 invoked from network); 28 Feb 2003 01:46:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Feb 2003 01:46:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Feb 2003 01:46:39 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-150.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.150]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h1S1kanF012133 for ; Thu, 27 Feb 2003 19:46:37 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <008901c2decb$9eca9880$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: The Analog Systems all worked well.... Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2003 19:49:21 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude The answer is unfortunately yes- usually having to do with lack of low and/or high end. On a good tuner it might sound too bright or boomy, whereas on a cheap junk radio the extra boost is what it needs to sound better through its usually narrow IF passband and dinky speakers. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Alfredo E. Torrejon" However, > what I would like an answer to is a more simple question: do engineers > know for certain that it's possible that audio processed to sound clean on > a hi-fi receiver like the Fanfare tuner could sound unacceptable on a > narroband AM tuner? Are there actual known technical issues that could > cause this to happen? From stodd@sherbtel.net Thu Feb 27 17:50:57 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 28 Feb 2003 01:50:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 91657 invoked from network); 28 Feb 2003 01:50:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Feb 2003 01:50:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Feb 2003 01:50:57 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-150.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.150]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h1S1ornF013493 for ; Thu, 27 Feb 2003 19:50:55 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <009301c2decc$38986000$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} The Analog Systems all worked well.... Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2003 19:53:39 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude I've got some 833A duds I'd like to do the same. Puts out all kinds of light with that 100W filament. 4-400s also have 100W fils, but unfortunately the anodes shield them moreso than the 833. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Possum Hunter" > amymousie@yahoo.com wrote: > > What happens to the dead tubes? Could anyone acquire one of these dead > tubes for themselves, knowing full well they can't bew used? > > Yes, Just ask around the local AMs. What is real cool is to put a small > filiment transformer in a small wood box then mount a friedt 4-400 tube on > it and hook it up to the transfomer. This makes a real cool looking desk > lamp. > > Kevin From stodd@sherbtel.net Thu Feb 27 18:00:27 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 28 Feb 2003 02:00:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 25045 invoked from network); 28 Feb 2003 02:00:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Feb 2003 02:00:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Feb 2003 02:00:26 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-150.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.150]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h1S20NnF016227 for ; Thu, 27 Feb 2003 20:00:24 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <00cb01c2decd$8c0e3b00$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <009301c2decc$38986000$827dfea9@home1> Subject: Re: {AMSF} The Analog Systems all worked well.... Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2003 20:03:08 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude BTW- will send you a dud 833A for the cost of shipping if you're interested. Much bigger than the 4-400, but has a rather weird construction to it. Filament pins are on the bottom. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Scott Todd" > I've got some 833A duds I'd like to do the same. Puts out all kinds of > light with that 100W filament. From jsgil@hal-pc.org Thu Feb 27 18:01:23 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 28 Feb 2003 02:01:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 86730 invoked from network); 28 Feb 2003 02:01:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Feb 2003 02:01:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Feb 2003 02:01:22 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.138] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Feb 2003 02:01:22 -0000 Date: Fri, 28 Feb 2003 02:01:21 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Help! Decoder problems Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 404 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.143 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Michael J. Richard" wrote: > Still a little > muddy, though. And I hear it that muddy coming right off of the LA1245 > chip.....so it must be that this chip doesn't have much bandwidth, period. > It's okay, though. Not too bad. > > Michael n WYO > I wasn't impressed with the LA1245 in the TM-152 either. Muddiness is the perfect description. From fanfare@globility.com Thu Feb 27 18:04:47 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 28 Feb 2003 02:04:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 10769 invoked from network); 28 Feb 2003 02:04:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Feb 2003 02:04:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Feb 2003 02:04:47 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.145] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Feb 2003 02:04:46 -0000 Date: Fri, 28 Feb 2003 02:04:46 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: The Analog Systems all worked well.... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3236 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Mr.M S " X-Originating-IP: 64.56.234.21 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Alfredo E. Torrejon" wrote: > > > > OK, let's say they did avail themselves of the ability to "listen on a > > fully transparent receiver", what then? Virtually all of their > > listeners use radios of average quality. Are you proposing that they > > alienate virtually their entire listener base by processing their > > audio so it only sounds good on a "fully transparent receiver"? > > I've seen this issue come up before; some time ago, one of our AMs > cut its audio bandwidth to about 5kHz as soon as a new chief engineer > started working there. The Optimod artifacts that some have described > could very clearly be heard. Anyway, the engineer used this same logic, > on our local radio discussion board, to defend his actions. However, > what I would like an answer to is a more simple question: do engineers > know for certain that it's possible that audio processed to sound clean on > a hi-fi receiver like the Fanfare tuner could sound unacceptable on a > narrowband AM tuner? Are there actual known technical issues that could > cause this to happen? > > Alfredo Right on Alfredo! If you will allow me, I use the term "broadcaster" in its generic sense. I'd rather not appear to be singling out WOR. They are making a very important contribution to this forum. However, I have to say it is the broadcaster who has established the benchmark on receiver response to slide by allowing offshore receiver manufacturers to dictate the quality reception ... something they've been doing for years by flooding the market with their throwaway designs. Unfortunately, the broadcaster hasn't paid a lot of attention to that happening because he's too busy maintaining his market ... a noble cause at the worst of times and at the best of times. Tell me how, if a product declines steadily in quality, can it continue to attract the same level of positive attention? The problem is that, instead of attempting to maintain the bar on signal quality, broadcasters have been tuning to an inferior source. We all know what happens as a result. They get used to it and so must the listener. I've heard good quality AM that sounds mediocre on a mediocre receiver and glorious on a good receiver. I know this makes a case for the broadcaster trying to make his signal sound good on a mediocre receiver and not being concerned about the good receiver. From what I am able to gather, all that does is create listener fatigue. But, viewing the receiver as passive, and the fact that CEA and others want to drop any minimum receiver specifications, I assume to satisfy any shortcomings in broadcast signal quality, all there is left is the broadcaster's interest in providing quality fare. Will a digitally-modulated signal change all of that for the total audience. Sure, it will reduce generated noise, but what about the artifacts when the analog noise impedes the digital modulation? Also, won't the incessant pissing contest radio station seems to find themselves involved in cause the sliders to go to the wall anyways? My solution, build a receiver that does not have noise as a problem, and I don't mean digital. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Feb 27 18:23:50 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 28 Feb 2003 02:23:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 25640 invoked from network); 28 Feb 2003 02:23:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Feb 2003 02:23:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Feb 2003 02:23:49 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.142] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Feb 2003 02:23:49 -0000 Date: Fri, 28 Feb 2003 02:23:49 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: The Analog Systems all worked well.... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <01e001c2dec5$8de95d40$cce282ac@aoldsl.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1030 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.96.154 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > This ringing distortion seems to only be a problem with the Optimod > 9200. The 5Khz filter for the 9100 series does not ring. Nor does the 6 kHz filter in the Optimod 9200. WOR used that setting for a while and the audio was clean and undistorted -- but that's "cheating", since the official IBOC spec is a strict 5 kHz cut-off, so they had to switch back to the "ringy" distorted 5 kHz filter. I don't quite understand why the 5 kHz filter in the Optimod would sound so bad, even when the 6 kHz filter is fine, but I guess they didn't expect that many stations to use it. Aside from hybrid IBAC/HD Radio stations, 5 kHz audio is generally only used on Shortwave; U.K./Irish AM stations use a 6 kHz audio bandwidth, while continental European AM stations usually step down to a 4.5 kHz filter. In fact I'm pretty sure "France Bleu" on 864 kHz AM Stereo in Paris uses an Optimod 9100-B2 stereo processor and their 4.5 kHz audio filter doesn't have any distortion that I can hear in various recordings of them. From amymousie@yahoo.com Thu Feb 27 18:50:05 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 28 Feb 2003 02:50:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 75904 invoked from network); 28 Feb 2003 02:50:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Feb 2003 02:50:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Feb 2003 02:50:04 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.249] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Feb 2003 02:50:03 -0000 Date: Fri, 28 Feb 2003 02:50:02 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} The Analog Systems all worked well.... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <00cb01c2decd$8c0e3b00$827dfea9@home1> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 432 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 67.118.18.217 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Scott Todd" wrote: > BTW- will send you a dud 833A for the cost of shipping if you're interested. > Much bigger than the 4-400, but has a rather weird construction to it. > Filament pins are on the bottom. > ST I'll get back to you on that, and see how much I can squeeze out of what little I have- I still have to reply to you about the "magic eye" tubes. Amy. <:3 )~~8~ From rdienert@yahoo.com Thu Feb 27 19:08:42 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: rdienert@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 28 Feb 2003 03:08:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 86147 invoked from network); 28 Feb 2003 03:08:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Feb 2003 03:08:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.70) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Feb 2003 03:08:38 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.150] by n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Feb 2003 03:08:36 -0000 Date: Fri, 28 Feb 2003 03:08:36 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Sony making AM stereo walkmans again? Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 459 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "theruss70 " X-Originating-IP: 216.160.47.155 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=127867076 X-Yahoo-Profile: theruss70 Hello All, I noticed this on the sonystyle.com site when I clicked on the "Radio=20 Walkmans" link to show all of the radio only walkmans.=20 "Radio on the Run Sony's Radio Walkman=AE products feature an AM/FM=20 Stereo tuner that allows you to enjoy the increasing availability of=20 stereo broadcasts on both AM and FM bands." I'd post a URL, but I think the URL's their server dishes out are=20 session only.=20 Could it be true? Or are they pulling our chains?=20 From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Feb 27 19:52:37 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 28 Feb 2003 03:52:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 402 invoked from network); 28 Feb 2003 03:52:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Feb 2003 03:52:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.123) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Feb 2003 03:52:36 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 27 Feb 2003 19:52:36 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Sony making AM stereo walkmans again? Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2003 22:52:27 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 28 Feb 2003 03:52:36.0566 (UTC) FILETIME=[D4E3B760:01C2DEDC] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.200.193.53] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 rdienert@yahoo.com wrote: >Could it be true? Or are they pulling our chains? The Only AM Stereo Walkman that I know is still in production is the Sony SRF-AX51V. http://www.sony.jp/ProductsPark/Models/Current/SRF-AX51V_J_1/ It is an Asia / Pacific Market only product, but you can buy it from www.stereoam.com Please note the FM is not compatible with North American standards, but who cares about FM? It also does not have the X-Band. Kevin From amymousie@yahoo.com Thu Feb 27 20:12:53 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 28 Feb 2003 04:12:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 55185 invoked from network); 28 Feb 2003 04:12:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Feb 2003 04:12:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Feb 2003 04:12:53 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.171] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Feb 2003 04:12:53 -0000 Date: Fri, 28 Feb 2003 04:12:50 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Sony making AM stereo walkmans again? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 954 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 67.118.18.217 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Possum Hunter" wrote: > rdienert@y... wrote: > >Could it be true? Or are they pulling our chains? > > The Only AM Stereo Walkman that I know is still in production is the Sony > SRF-AX51V. > > http://www.sony.jp/ProductsPark/Models/Current/SRF-AX51V_J_1/ > > It is an Asia / Pacific Market only product, but you can buy it from > www.stereoam.com Please note the FM is not compatible with North American > standards, but who cares about FM? It also does not have the X-Band. First off, the Japanese use the same GE/Zenith FM stereo system we use- The whole planet uses it. Secondly, if you look closely at the picture, you'll see that the FM and lower TV band correspond to each other-- In other words, the FM should be usable up to 108MHz. As for AM, it does look like it _might_ be nudged to receive the expanded band, since it is a mechanically-tuned radio. Amy. <:3 )~~8~ From jsgil@hal-pc.org Thu Feb 27 20:32:20 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 28 Feb 2003 04:32:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 31565 invoked from network); 28 Feb 2003 04:32:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Feb 2003 04:32:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.86) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Feb 2003 04:32:18 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.148] by n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Feb 2003 04:32:18 -0000 Date: Fri, 28 Feb 2003 04:32:17 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Sony making AM stereo walkmans again? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 623 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.241 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "amymousie " wrote: > > First off, the Japanese use the same GE/Zenith FM stereo system we > use- The whole planet uses it. Secondly, if you look closely at the > picture, you'll see that the FM and lower TV band correspond to each > other-- In other words, the FM should be usable up to 108MHz. As for > AM, it does look like it _might_ be nudged to receive the expanded > band, since it is a mechanically-tuned radio. > > Amy. <:3 )~~8~ The only drawback is that it doesn't do true C-QuAM decoding but is based on the Magnavox system. JSG From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Feb 27 21:51:06 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: possumhunter@netzero.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 28 Feb 2003 05:51:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 83694 invoked from network); 28 Feb 2003 05:51:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Feb 2003 05:51:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rly-ip03.mx.aol.com) (64.12.138.7) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Feb 2003 05:51:05 -0000 Received: from logs-wa.proxy.aol.com (logs-wa.proxy.aol.com [205.188.192.14]) by rly-ip03.mx.aol.com (v89.10) with ESMTP id RELAYIN9-0228004925; Fri, 28 Feb 2003 00:49:25 1900 Received: from ibm (AC853353.ipt.aol.com [172.133.51.83]) by logs-wa.proxy.aol.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with SMTP id h1S5mJfk323361 for ; Fri, 28 Feb 2003 00:48:20 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <007101c2deec$fb368ea0$533385ac@aoldsl.net> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Sony making AM stereo walkmans again? Date: Fri, 28 Feb 2003 00:48:10 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Apparently-From: DodgeRamTrucker@aol.com From: "Possum Hunter" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 amymousie@yahoo.com wrote: > First off, the Japanese use the same GE/Zenith FM stereo system we use- The whole planet uses it. That is true, but Radio preemphasis is different in North America and Japan. One uses 50µs while the other uses 75µs. so it will sound way too tinny in the United States. The FM Bandwidth is more narrow in Japan, so it will be more distorted than an American market radio. > > Secondly, if you look closely at the picture, you'll see that the FM and lower TV band correspond to each other-- In other words, the FM should be usable up to 108MHz. For FM broadcasts, Japan uses the frequency band from 76 megahertz to 90 megahertz. In contrast, the US uses 87.5 megahertz to 108 megahertz. Japanese TV audio for Channel 1 is 95.75Mhz, Channel 2 is 101.75, and Channel 3 is 107.75, so yes it should be able to go to 107.9 Mhz. > >As for AM, it does look like it _might_ be nudged to receive the expanded band, since it is a mechanically-tuned radio. You may be able to fudge it up to 1640 Khz or so. Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Feb 27 21:51:54 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 28 Feb 2003 05:51:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 87151 invoked from network); 28 Feb 2003 05:51:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Feb 2003 05:51:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.190) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Feb 2003 05:51:54 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 27 Feb 2003 21:51:51 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Sony making AM stereo walkmans again? Date: Fri, 28 Feb 2003 00:50:19 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 28 Feb 2003 05:51:51.0322 (UTC) FILETIME=[7D74D7A0:01C2DEED] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.133.51.83] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 amymousie@yahoo.com wrote: > First off, the Japanese use the same GE/Zenith FM stereo system we use- The whole planet uses it. That is true, but Radio preemphasis is different in North America and Japan. One uses 50µs while the other uses 75µs. so it will sound way too tinny in the United States. The FM Bandwidth is more narrow in Japan, so it will be more distorted than an American market radio. > > Secondly, if you look closely at the picture, you'll see that the FM and lower TV band correspond to each other-- In other words, the FM should be usable up to 108MHz. For FM broadcasts, Japan uses the frequency band from 76 megahertz to 90 megahertz. In contrast, the US uses 87.5 megahertz to 108 megahertz. Japanese TV audio for Channel 1 is 95.75Mhz, Channel 2 is 101.75, and Channel 3 is 107.75, so yes it should be able to go to 107.9 Mhz. > >As for AM, it does look like it _might_ be nudged to receive the expanded band, since it is a mechanically-tuned radio. You may be able to fudge it up to 1640 Khz or so. Kevin From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Feb 27 22:21:46 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 28 Feb 2003 06:21:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 93542 invoked from network); 28 Feb 2003 06:21:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Feb 2003 06:21:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.89) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Feb 2003 06:21:46 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.140] by n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Feb 2003 06:21:46 -0000 Date: Fri, 28 Feb 2003 06:21:45 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Sony making AM stereo walkmans again? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 1051 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.96.154 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > That is true, but Radio preemphasis is different in North America > and Japan. One uses 50=B5s while the other uses 75=B5s. so it will > sound way too tinny in the United States. The FM Bandwidth is more > narrow in Japan, so it will be more distorted than an American > market radio. Many "world band" radios with switchable 9/10 kHz AM tuning steps=20 keep the FM de-emphasis at 50 uS even in the North American mode.=20=20 This will essentially provide an inherent treble boost, but the=20 difference really isn't that drastic. I'd say it would be comparable=20 to playing a Chrome or Metal cassette on the normal Type I tape mode=20 setting. The now-defunct "Dolby FM" system actually used *25* uS pre-emphasis;=20 some fancy receivers of the late '70s and early '80s with built-in=20 Dolby Noise Reduction decoding had a switch on the back to select=20 between 25, 50, or 75 uS FM de-emphasis. Speaking of which, does=20 anybody know if it is still legal for U.S. FM stations to broadcast=20 using Dolby FM, and if so, if there are any stations still using it? From amymousie@yahoo.com Thu Feb 27 22:30:37 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 28 Feb 2003 06:30:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 77506 invoked from network); 28 Feb 2003 06:30:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Feb 2003 06:30:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Feb 2003 06:30:36 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.133] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Feb 2003 06:30:36 -0000 Date: Fri, 28 Feb 2003 06:30:33 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: Sony making AM stereo walkmans again? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 1513 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 67.118.18.217 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Possum Hunter"=20 wrote: > amymousie@y... wrote: > > First off, the Japanese use the same GE/Zenith FM stereo system=20 we use- > The whole planet uses it. >=20 > That is true, but Radio preemphasis is different in North America=20 and Japan. > One uses 50=B5s while the other uses 75=B5s. so it will sound way too=20 tinny in > the United States. The FM Bandwidth is more narrow in Japan, so it=20 will be > more distorted than an American market radio. I own a Japanese-market radio-- Aiwa CR-DS805. The FM is quite fine,=20 no distortion or anything like what you describe. > > > > Secondly, if you look closely at the picture, you'll see that the=20 FM and > lower TV band correspond to each other-- In other words, the FM=20 should be > usable up to 108MHz. >=20 > For FM broadcasts, Japan uses the frequency band from 76 megahertz=20 to 90 > megahertz. In contrast, the US uses 87.5 megahertz to 108 megahertz. > Japanese TV audio for Channel 1 is 95.75Mhz, Channel 2 is 101.75,=20 and > Channel 3 is 107.75, so yes it should be able to go to 107.9 Mhz. Correct. This Sony looks like it will scan up to 108 without problem-=20 Just keep in mind it's in the lower TV band, as far as Japanese=20 radios go. :) > >As for AM, it does look like it _might_ be nudged to receive the=20 expanded > band, since it is a mechanically-tuned radio. >=20 > You may be able to fudge it up to 1640 Khz or so. Heh.. Well, my TM-152 has neen nudged to 1680, so.. Who knows? Amy. <:3 )~~8~ From amymousie@yahoo.com Thu Feb 27 22:36:41 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 28 Feb 2003 06:36:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 17137 invoked from network); 28 Feb 2003 06:36:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Feb 2003 06:36:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Feb 2003 06:36:40 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.155] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Feb 2003 06:36:40 -0000 Date: Fri, 28 Feb 2003 06:36:39 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Sony making AM stereo walkmans again? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 738 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 67.118.18.217 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: > > The now-defunct "Dolby FM" system actually used *25* uS pre- emphasis; > some fancy receivers of the late '70s and early '80s with built-in > Dolby Noise Reduction decoding had a switch on the back to select > between 25, 50, or 75 uS FM de-emphasis. Speaking of which, does > anybody know if it is still legal for U.S. FM stations to broadcast > using Dolby FM, and if so, if there are any stations still using it? Considering it's essentially similar to audio processing techniques, that is, compressing and EQ, I don't think it would matter if it was quietly employed. Amy. <:3 )~~8~ (Try Dolby de-emphasis on AM stereo. :) ) From rwagoner1@mac.com Thu Feb 27 22:46:29 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner1@mac.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 28 Feb 2003 06:46:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 19125 invoked from network); 28 Feb 2003 06:46:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Feb 2003 06:46:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO fed1mtao04.cox.net) (68.6.19.241) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Feb 2003 06:46:28 -0000 Received: from mac.com ([68.4.33.253]) by fed1mtao04.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20030228064630.ZLXY11616.fed1mtao04.cox.net@mac.com> for ; Fri, 28 Feb 2003 01:46:30 -0500 Message-ID: <3E5F05C4.3070705@mac.com> Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2003 22:46:28 -0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20021120 Netscape/7.01 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Sony making AM stereo walkmans again? References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Richard Wagoner X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135738921 X-Yahoo-Profile: richardalanwagoner What was Dolby FM? How did it differ? And how do I get enough money to buy an AM station in Los Angeles just to prove I can program it better than the morons out here? Richard From amymousie@yahoo.com Thu Feb 27 23:02:49 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 28 Feb 2003 07:02:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 98697 invoked from network); 28 Feb 2003 07:02:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Feb 2003 07:02:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.64) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Feb 2003 07:02:49 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.167] by n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Feb 2003 07:02:49 -0000 Date: Fri, 28 Feb 2003 07:02:47 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: Sony making AM stereo walkmans again? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3E5F05C4.3070705@mac.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 598 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 67.118.18.217 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, Richard Wagoner wrote: > What was Dolby FM? How did it differ? If I recall, it's applying Dolby NR to FM, both at the broadcaster and receiver ends. The idea, of course, was noise reduction, especially with the noise in the stereo difference signal. > And how do I get enough money to buy an AM station in Los Angeles just > to prove I can program it better than the morons out here? At least a couple million, I think-- As bad as radio has become, LA is still one of the most expensive radio markets to break into. Amy. <:3 )~~8~ From n0uiheric@aol.com Thu Feb 27 23:35:03 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 28 Feb 2003 07:35:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 27118 invoked from network); 28 Feb 2003 07:35:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Feb 2003 07:35:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m04.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.7) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Feb 2003 07:35:02 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-m04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.90.33351f2d (4539) for ; Fri, 28 Feb 2003 02:34:55 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <90.33351f2d.2b906b1f@aol.com> Date: Fri, 28 Feb 2003 02:34:55 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} A Letter To The ARRL on WOR's IBOCrap Operation To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih No...Hams will get MORE interference from IBOC stations because digital signals take up too much spectrum space. Actually, new analog transmitters cause less interference. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Thu Feb 27 23:35:06 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 28 Feb 2003 07:35:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 11378 invoked from network); 28 Feb 2003 07:35:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Feb 2003 07:35:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m05.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.8) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Feb 2003 07:35:06 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-m05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.19a.1180e7cd (4539) for ; Fri, 28 Feb 2003 02:34:57 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <19a.1180e7cd.2b906b20@aol.com> Date: Fri, 28 Feb 2003 02:34:56 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} How do we get the FCC off their *ss and DO SOMETHING? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih First, the 76 MHz band will continue to be used by television after the DTV conversion. Second, NPR's loss will be a major loss for radio. It's the only group that produces high-quality programming (other than independent broadcast producers, free from the illegal free speech restrictions of corporate radio). It is the only source for intelligent, listenable programming on the national level. The whole AM band should be open to only independent broadcasters, and the non-commercial reservation should be expanded UPWARD to 100 MHz, with the rest for independent radio stations. Eliminating corporate control of radio should be seriously considered. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From ccuff@in4web.com Fri Feb 28 03:19:23 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 28 Feb 2003 11:19:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 8234 invoked from network); 28 Feb 2003 11:19:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Feb 2003 11:19:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Feb 2003 11:19:13 -0000 Received: from Chris1 (unverified [208.228.96.20]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Fri, 28 Feb 2003 06:16:07 -0500 Message-ID: <000701c2df1b$38175740$0d01a8c0@Chris1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Sony making AM stereo walkmans again? Date: Fri, 28 Feb 2003 06:19:11 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Chris Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 There is a bit of confusion here:- The only model left, according to Koji in Japan, is the SRFAX15- I am really not certain, I will ask him. In any event, the 51 DOES tune our FM band. I have one- it is just that the dial scale is marked "TV" in the upper area. The 51 is a much nicer radio, sound wise. The SRFAX15 is quite low bandwidth. It has a built in speaker for mono listening. Both use forced stereo. Chris ----- Original Message ----- From: "Possum Hunter" To: From fanfare@globility.com Fri Feb 28 05:52:54 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 28 Feb 2003 13:52:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 89010 invoked from network); 28 Feb 2003 13:52:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Feb 2003 13:52:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.69) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Feb 2003 13:52:53 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.189] by n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Feb 2003 13:52:53 -0000 Date: Fri, 28 Feb 2003 13:52:53 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: First Public Station Flips HD-R Switch Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 452 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Mr.M S " X-Originating-IP: 64.56.233.162 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy I guess they're not listening Eric. From - Radio World NewsBytes - Date posted: 2003-02-20 "HD Radio is on the air in Tampa. WUSF(FM) believes it is the first public station to go HD-R. The station, at 89.7 MHz, is using Harris transmission gear. JoAnn Urofsky is general manager and Mike O'Shea is chief engineer. The station for the University of South Florida serves Tampa and west central Florida. It turned on the digital Feb. 13." MS From michaelj@vcn.com Fri Feb 28 06:32:54 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 28 Feb 2003 14:32:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 90866 invoked from network); 28 Feb 2003 14:32:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Feb 2003 14:32:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m2-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.32) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Feb 2003 14:32:52 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m2-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Fri, 28 Feb 2003 07:32:51 -0700 Message-ID: <001701c2df36$45f4e2e0$0701010a@keva> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} The Analog Systems all worked well.... Date: Fri, 28 Feb 2003 07:32:50 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit LOL! Yes they will! Take it from me! :) We've got at least 8 or 10 lying around. MJR n WYO ----- Original Message ----- From: Possum Hunter To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, February 27, 2003 6:42 PM Subject: Re: {AMSF} The Analog Systems all worked well.... amymousie@yahoo.com wrote: >Not to just find one that burns out tubes on a frequent basis- if any here still uses them. Listen around on the AM dial at the 1000 Watt stations. The most muffled, distorted one is your target. OR Call up Goodrich Enterprises and ask them who in your area has one of their BA1K sh*t boxes on the air. That station will have several hundred blown tubes laying around! Kevin Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ADVERTISEMENT Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From fanfare@globility.com Fri Feb 28 06:39:26 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 28 Feb 2003 14:39:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 7658 invoked from network); 28 Feb 2003 14:39:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Feb 2003 14:39:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Feb 2003 14:39:18 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.183] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Feb 2003 14:39:17 -0000 Date: Fri, 28 Feb 2003 14:39:16 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Local content Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 779 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Mr.M S " X-Originating-IP: 64.56.233.162 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy This is slightly OT, but I was listening to an interview on CBC this morning. Fellow by name of John Parikhal(a well-known media analyst) was being asked what his take was on the future of the music business, taking into consideration how popular Napster-like sites have become. He sees radio as part of the solution, but radio and the music industry don't really see eye to eye because of the royalties. However, he did make one very significant observation and it is one that, IMHO, AM radio should take note of. Apparently local newspapers are "exploding" to use his words. For radio that leads back to local content which means looking seriously at providing local coverage of of local happenings .... hopefully with the Stereo pilot on. Food for thought? MS From alfredot@inetarena.com Fri Feb 28 08:18:30 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: alfredot@inetarena.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 28 Feb 2003 16:18:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 5683 invoked from network); 28 Feb 2003 16:18:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Feb 2003 16:18:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.inetarena.com) (206.129.216.13) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Feb 2003 16:18:26 -0000 Received: from hendrie (1Cust81.tnt15.beaverton.or.da.uu.net [67.227.162.81]) by mail.inetarena.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h1SGFTN19177 for ; Fri, 28 Feb 2003 08:15:30 -0800 (PST) Date: Fri, 28 Feb 2003 08:18:12 -0800 (PST) X-Sender: alfredo@hendrie.1610am.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: The Analog Systems all worked well.... In-Reply-To: <1046406741.1745.31588.m5@yahoogroups.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: "Alfredo E. Torrejon" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=25132238 X-Yahoo-Profile: alfredotorrejon > This is an interesting point, exactly what do you mean by "ringing" > distortion caused by the Optimod's 5 kHz audio filter"? Are you > saying you can hear the ripple in the filters frequency domain > response, the over/under shoot of the filter in the time domain, or > the effects of the Optimod's mysterious "overshoot compensated > filters"? I don't know if I would have used the word "ringing." The artifacts that I've heard sound like a swishiness to the highs, similar to what you would hear on a Real Audio stream. I don't know much about DSP filtering algorithms, but to me this sounds like a form of aliasing--sibliants and other high frequency components end up producing output at lower frequencies, where it sounds unnatural. Alfredo From michaelj@vcn.com Fri Feb 28 08:57:45 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 28 Feb 2003 16:57:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 37775 invoked from network); 28 Feb 2003 16:57:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Feb 2003 16:57:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m2-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.32) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Feb 2003 16:57:41 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m2-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Fri, 28 Feb 2003 09:57:41 -0700 Message-ID: <00a701c2df4a$802e7f20$0701010a@keva> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Help! Decoder problems Date: Fri, 28 Feb 2003 09:57:38 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Interesting. There's been a lot of threads here on this list talking about the TM152 and how people have widened it to sound better. Is it possible to widen it to 6, 7...even 9khz?? I know a lot of people have listed things they've done. I kinda thought whatever the bandwidth of the CHIP (the LA1245) is is what you're stuck with and you won't get more. Is this true? I haven't looked at my LA1245 schematic in a while. Is there some sort of resistor or something that goes into one of the pins that causes it to do narrow or wide IF ? Now this has peaked my interest! MJR n WYO ----- Original Mesage ----- From: jsgilst To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, February 27, 2003 7:01 PM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Help! Decoder problems --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Michael J. Richard" wrote: I wasn't impressed with the LA1245 in the TM-152 either. Muddiness is the perfect description. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Feb 28 09:38:01 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 28 Feb 2003 17:38:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 98644 invoked from network); 28 Feb 2003 17:37:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Feb 2003 17:37:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.67) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Feb 2003 17:37:58 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.130] by n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Feb 2003 17:37:58 -0000 Date: Fri, 28 Feb 2003 17:37:58 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: The Analog Systems all worked well.... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 746 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > I don't know much about DSP filtering algorithms, but to me this > sounds like a form of aliasing--sibliants and other high frequency > components end up producing output at lower frequencies, where it > sounds unnatural. At least in WOR's case, the distortion of the 5 kHz filter manifests itself as a "sizzling" effect added to the audio that actually extends up to about 8 kHz. I.e., the analog audio is "brick wall" filtered to 5 kHz -- but in the process, a distortion effect is created (at a lower but still audible level) in the 5 to 8 kHz region. The distortion doesn't seem to extend *below* 5 kHz because on a receiver which sharply limits its own audio response to 5 kHz or less, the problem is not noticeable. From jsgil@hal-pc.org Fri Feb 28 09:57:26 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 28 Feb 2003 17:57:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 16642 invoked from network); 28 Feb 2003 17:57:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Feb 2003 17:57:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Feb 2003 17:57:25 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.147] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Feb 2003 17:57:24 -0000 Date: Fri, 28 Feb 2003 17:57:23 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Help! Decoder problems Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <00a701c2df4a$802e7f20$0701010a@keva> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 1779 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.141 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Michael J. Richard" wrote: > Interesting. There's been a lot of threads here on this list talking about the TM152 and how people have widened it to sound better. Is it possible to widen it to 6, 7...even 9khz?? I know a lot of people have listed things they've done. I kinda thought whatever the bandwidth of the CHIP (the LA1245) is is what you're stuck with and you won't get more. Is this true? I haven't looked at my LA1245 schematic in a while. Is there some sort of resistor or something that goes into one of the pins that causes it to do narrow or wide IF ? Now this has peaked my interest! >=20 > MJR n WYO >=20 As far as audio BW goes it is defined by 2 components, the ferrite antenna and the ceramic filter for the most part. You will need to get a wider ceramic filter than the =B14.5KHz one and you may need to De-Q the ferrite antenna. Ceramic filters are hard to come by especially at 450KHz but Chris has a trick to widen them by placing a ~5-10pf bypass cap from the input to output of the filter. To open the BW of the ferrite antenna place a resistor 10-20ohm in series with the antenna coil and tuning capacitor to De-Q the tank. If you open it up to much with too large a resistor you won't have good image rejection. As far as the muddiness in the LA-1245 I=20 probably should have refered to as mushiness in the highs that is. After I put a wider ceramic filter and opened up the antenna it brought out the highs but they were not crisp and distinct from one another were somewhat mushed together especially in Stereo as compared to a conversion I did on a DTR. This probably has to do with the phase noise in the LO which is bad enough that the co- channel pin can't ge used on the MC13020. JSG From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Feb 28 10:37:09 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 28 Feb 2003 18:37:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 44044 invoked from network); 28 Feb 2003 18:37:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Feb 2003 18:37:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.86) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Feb 2003 18:37:07 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.134] by n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Feb 2003 18:37:05 -0000 Date: Fri, 28 Feb 2003 18:37:02 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Help! Decoder problems Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1467 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > After I put a wider ceramic filter and opened up the antenna it > brought out the highs but they were not crisp and distinct from > one another were somewhat mushed together especially in Stereo > as compared to a conversion I did on a DTR. What you are probably referring to is a lack of high frequency stereo separation. The main content of the stereo effect is produced by frequencies below 5 kHz or so, but extending the separation (L-R) beyond that gives extra crispness, clarity, and detail to the sound. With C-Quam, the L-R response provided by the receiver is pretty much limited to whatever IF filtering you use. For example, with a TM-152 using the standard 4.5 kHz ceramic filter, you can easily use a simple treble boost to extend the main audio response to well beyond 10 kHz, but the stereo separation will still be effectively limited to 4.5 kHz, so you won't have that extra "sparkle" to the sound. This is part of what makes the Sony SRF-A100 sound so great in Wide bandwidth AM Stereo mode -- with its 12.5 kHz filter, the full response of the Stereo separation is reproduced, giving a sense of greater crispness, clarity, and "precision" to the Stereo sound. Add on an MC10328 decoder (which is small enough to fit completely within the SRF-A100's casing) and you really have it made, with true C-Quam decoding and advanced distortion reduction techniques, for the best sound this side of a Carver TX-11b. From jbyrns@rcn.com Fri Feb 28 11:45:05 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@rcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 28 Feb 2003 19:45:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 28441 invoked from network); 28 Feb 2003 19:45:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Feb 2003 19:45:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.68) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Feb 2003 19:45:04 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.131] by n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Feb 2003 19:45:03 -0000 Date: Fri, 28 Feb 2003 19:45:02 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: The Analog Systems all worked well.... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2563 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bta_50g " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.98.168 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=138635554 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Mr.M S " < fanfare@g...> wrote: > > However, I have to say it is the broadcaster who has established > the benchmark on receiver response to slide by allowing offshore > receiver manufacturers to dictate the quality reception ... > something they've been doing for years by flooding the market with > their throwaway designs. Unfortunately, the broadcaster hasn't paid > a lot of attention to that happening because he's too busy > maintaining his market ... a noble cause at the worst of times and > at the best of times. Tell me how, if a product declines steadily in > quality, can it continue to attract the same level of positive > attention? > > The problem is that, instead of attempting to maintain the bar on > signal quality, broadcasters have been tuning to an inferior source. > We all know what happens as a result. They get used to it and so > must the listener. This is an old complaint, even back in the 1930's complaints were being made that radios were designed with a bandwidth that was too narrow, and that radios were being built to a cost point that was too low. At that time it was the broadcasters, and the radio set dealers, that were making these complaints about the contemporary radios. The majority of AM radios have always been built not only with poor high frequency response, but also with poor low frequency response. I would guess that it wasn't until the 1970's that the broadcasters got into serious high frequency pre emphasis, and also low frequency equalization, in an attempt to mitigate these problems. Prior to that, in the 1940's, 1950's and 1960's, I believe most broadcasters transmitted a fairly flat signal, and the receivers didn't improve over that period, even with a flat signal being transmitted by most broadcasters. > Will a digitally-modulated signal change all of that for the total > audience. Sure, it will reduce generated noise, but what about the > artifacts when the analog noise impedes the digital modulation? > Also, won't the incessant pissing contest radio station seems to > find themselves involved in cause the sliders to go to the wall > anyways? > > My solution, build a receiver that does not have noise as a problem, > and I don't mean digital. Could you enlighten us as to how you are going to build a receiver that "does not have noise as a problem"? How do you prevent the "analog noise" from impeding analog modulation? It sounds like you are describing a digital receiver? John From fanfare@globility.com Fri Feb 28 12:20:21 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 28 Feb 2003 20:20:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 79024 invoked from network); 28 Feb 2003 20:20:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Feb 2003 20:20:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.88) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Feb 2003 20:20:20 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.151] by n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Feb 2003 20:20:20 -0000 Date: Fri, 28 Feb 2003 20:20:19 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: The Analog Systems all worked well.... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1173 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Mr.M S " X-Originating-IP: 64.56.234.159 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "bta_50g " wrote: > Could you enlighten us as to how you are going to build a receiver > that "does not have noise as a problem"? How do you prevent the > "analog noise" from impeding analog modulation? It sounds like you > are describing a digital receiver? > > John I know this is getting back to the IBOC thing, but noise presents itself in a number of different ways. Unlike an analog signal where the noise is heard in the audio, noise that bothers a digitally modulated signal is not heard as noise per se. It will manifest itself as impeding full resolution of the digital signal. Take a modem for example, noise impedes speed. Note the different modem speeds that appear when you are logging on to the internet. Even DSL or cable modems have their problems, and all can be traced to noise. How then can a digital receiver present itself as being impervious to noise, as your comment suggests? As for your request to have me explain how we would build a receiver like that; Sorry John, this is not something you're likely to see the plans for in Popular Electronics magazine. MS From jsgil@hal-pc.org Fri Feb 28 12:46:40 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 28 Feb 2003 20:46:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 42842 invoked from network); 28 Feb 2003 20:46:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 28 Feb 2003 20:46:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 28 Feb 2003 20:46:40 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.150] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 28 Feb 2003 20:46:39 -0000 Date: Fri, 28 Feb 2003 20:46:37 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Help! Decoder problems Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 2535 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.197 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: > What you are probably referring to is a lack of high frequency stereo=20 > separation. The main content of the stereo effect is produced by=20 > frequencies below 5 kHz or so, but extending the separation (L-R)=20 > beyond that gives extra crispness, clarity, and detail to the sound. >=20 > As far as complete and perfect separation at the skirts of the filter this will be affected and is made worse by not having the carrier in the center of the filter making the sidebands asymetrical. Motorola mentioned this in the MC13024 datasheet and was why the chip uses AFC on the LO. With this chip if the PLL freq is adjusted so the IF freq is in the exact center of the IF filter then the tuning knob can be trimmed so the antenna is tuned to the exact center of the RF signal. The result is close to perfect sideband symetry and the best separation possible. At the skirts of the filter there will still be information that shows up in the quadrature of the signal and will produce HF components in L-R but they may not be correctly phased and will not matrix out properly to produce the correct separation but will still add to the stereo effect. =20 >=20 >=20 > With C-Quam, the L-R response provided by the receiver is pretty much=20 > limited to whatever IF filtering you use. For example, with a TM-152=20 > using the standard 4.5 kHz ceramic filter, you can easily use a simple=20 > treble boost to extend the main audio response to well beyond 10 kHz,=20 > but the stereo separation will still be effectively limited to 4.5=20 > kHz, so you won't have that extra "sparkle" to the sound. >=20 >=20 I had replaced the muRata SFG450G =B14.5KHz with a SFG450E =B17.5KHz filter which is a 4 element and less roll off at 10KHz than the SFH450E =B17.5KHz 6 element that I put in my Pioneer. Even though the filter in my Pioneer has steeper skirts it still sounds cleaner than my TM-152. Even in mono The Pioneer has a cleaner top end than the TM-152. I came to the conclusion that the RF, Mixer & LO in the Pioneer is higher quality mainly due to the synthesized based LO. Any phase noise in the LO will quickly degrade the L-R signal since it is phase based but the envelope of the signal is effected much less. This phase noise is processed though the cosine correction circuit and is modulated into L-R in addition to existing phase noise. Excessive LO phase noise will quickly degrade a C-QuAM signal and this is one of the shortcomings of the TM-152. JSG From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sat Mar 01 00:18:35 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 1 Mar 2003 08:18:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 92271 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2003 08:18:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Mar 2003 08:18:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Mar 2003 08:18:27 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.176] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Mar 2003 08:18:26 -0000 Date: Sat, 01 Mar 2003 08:18:26 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Test Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 53 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.1 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst This is a test of the AMS Forum. This is only a test From amymousie@yahoo.com Sat Mar 01 00:42:05 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 1 Mar 2003 08:42:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 77149 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2003 08:41:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Mar 2003 08:41:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Mar 2003 08:41:58 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.137] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Mar 2003 08:41:58 -0000 Date: Sat, 01 Mar 2003 08:41:55 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Test Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 343 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 64.175.246.155 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "jsgilst " wrote: > This is a test of the AMS Forum. > This is only a test *squeeeeek* This is a test of the emergency radiomouse system. Had this been an actual emergency, you would have been instructed to hide any and all cheese and/or radio. *squeeeeeek* Amy. <:3 )~~8~ From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sat Mar 01 00:54:44 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 1 Mar 2003 08:54:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 25713 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2003 08:54:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Mar 2003 08:54:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.90) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Mar 2003 08:54:43 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.165] by n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Mar 2003 08:54:43 -0000 Date: Sat, 01 Mar 2003 08:54:43 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Test Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 563 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.1 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "amymousie " wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "jsgilst " > wrote: > > This is a test of the AMS Forum. > > This is only a test > > *squeeeeek* This is a test of the emergency radiomouse system. Had > this been an actual emergency, you would have been instructed to hide > any and all cheese and/or radio. *squeeeeeek* > > Amy. <:3 )~~8~ Just checking to see if our forum was still working since I hadn't seen any new messages for awhile. ;-) JSG From amymousie@yahoo.com Sat Mar 01 00:57:50 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 1 Mar 2003 08:57:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 59841 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2003 08:57:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Mar 2003 08:57:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Mar 2003 08:57:50 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.135] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Mar 2003 08:57:50 -0000 Date: Sat, 01 Mar 2003 08:57:48 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Test Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 728 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 64.175.246.155 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "jsgilst " wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "amymousie " > wrote: > > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "jsgilst " > > wrote: > > > This is a test of the AMS Forum. > > > This is only a test > > > > *squeeeeek* This is a test of the emergency radiomouse system. Had > > this been an actual emergency, you would have been instructed to > hide > > any and all cheese and/or radio. *squeeeeeek* > > > > Amy. <:3 )~~8~ > > Just checking to see if our forum was still working since > I hadn't seen any new messages for awhile. ;-) I, too, noticed it got quiet today. Amy. <:3 )~~8~ From rwagoner1@mac.com Sat Mar 01 01:05:32 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner1@mac.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 1 Mar 2003 09:05:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 9930 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2003 09:05:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Mar 2003 09:05:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO fed1mtao02.cox.net) (68.6.19.243) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Mar 2003 09:05:31 -0000 Received: from mac.com ([68.4.33.253]) by fed1mtao02.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20030301090530.JLQH2396.fed1mtao02.cox.net@mac.com> for ; Sat, 1 Mar 2003 04:05:30 -0500 Message-ID: <3E6077DB.5060109@mac.com> Date: Sat, 01 Mar 2003 01:05:31 -0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20021120 Netscape/7.01 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: San Diego References: From: Richard Wagoner X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135738921 X-Yahoo-Profile: richardalanwagoner Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From LARADIO.COM: > Fox Arrives in San Diego. Next Monday, the Fox arrives on San Diego > radio, according to Chris Carmichael of SDRadio.net. KFSD 1450 AM in > Escondido drops classical music for 70s music. Chris McKay told SDR: > "Remember that AM transistor you lost when you were a kid? We found > it...and the music it played. More Music....More Fun, The way AM radio > should be!" The lineup includes: Jon St. John from 6 to 10 in the > mornings. Chris tackles middays, and Art Michaels handles 2 to 6 p.m. > "The chair will be hot, the mics live and the request line answered," > Art tells SDR. "We are going to have fun." > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From possumhunter@netzero.net Sat Mar 01 07:11:08 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 1 Mar 2003 15:11:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 39893 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2003 15:11:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Mar 2003 15:11:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.63) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Mar 2003 15:11:06 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 1 Mar 2003 07:11:06 -0800 To: References: <90.33351f2d.2b906b1f@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} A Letter To The ARRL on WOR's IBOCrap Operation Date: Sat, 1 Mar 2003 09:24:55 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 01 Mar 2003 15:11:06.0778 (UTC) FILETIME=[C87AD7A0:01C2E004] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.134.189.210] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 n0uiheric@aol.com wrote: > No...Hams will get MORE interference from IBOC stations because digital signals take up too much spectrum space. Actually, new analog transmitters cause less interference. OK, Now I am as anti HD-Radio on AM as anybody in this group, but I would like you to explain how there would be more interference to Hams when a station replaced their 50 year+ old RF plant that puts out a signal 10Khz wide on 910Khz along with spurs and harmonics out all over the place with a NEW RF plant that puts out a 25Khz wide signal on 910Khz and almost NO spurs or harmonics. OR How a new RF plant on 1700Khz with a 25Khz wide signal will interfere with the 160 Meter HAM band? Kevin From jbyrns@rcn.com Sat Mar 01 07:35:49 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@rcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 1 Mar 2003 15:35:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 61252 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2003 15:35:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Mar 2003 15:35:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Mar 2003 15:35:48 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.184] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Mar 2003 15:35:48 -0000 Date: Sat, 01 Mar 2003 15:35:46 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} A Letter To The ARRL on WOR's IBOCrap Operation Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 932 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bta_50g " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.51 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=138635554 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Possum Hunter" < possumhunter@n...> wrote: > n0uiheric@a... wrote: > > No...Hams will get MORE interference from IBOC stations because digital > signals take up too much spectrum space. Actually, new analog transmitters > cause less interference. > > OK, Now I am as anti HD-Radio on AM as anybody in this group, but I would > like you to explain how there would be more interference to Hams when a > station replaced their 50 year+ old RF plant that puts out a signal 10Khz > wide on 910Khz along with spurs and harmonics out all over the place with a > NEW RF plant that puts out a 25Khz wide signal on 910Khz and almost NO spurs > or harmonics. > > OR > > How a new RF plant on 1700Khz with a 25Khz wide signal will interfere with > the 160 Meter HAM band? Eric is simply overzealous in his hatred for "HD radio", he can't explain it, and it is hopeless to try and educate him. John From jbyrns@rcn.com Sat Mar 01 11:23:37 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@rcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 1 Mar 2003 19:23:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 92643 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2003 19:23:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Mar 2003 19:23:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.64) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Mar 2003 19:23:34 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.190] by n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 01 Mar 2003 19:23:33 -0000 Date: Sat, 01 Mar 2003 19:23:32 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: The Analog Systems all worked well.... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2119 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bta_50g " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.62 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=138635554 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Mr.M S " < fanfare@g...> wrote: > > I know this is getting back to the IBOC thing, but noise presents > itself in a number of different ways. Unlike an analog signal where > the noise is heard in the audio, noise that bothers a digitally > modulated signal is not heard as noise per se. It will manifest > itself as impeding full resolution of the digital signal. Take a > modem for example, noise impedes speed. Note the different modem > speeds that appear when you are logging on to the internet. Even DSL > or cable modems have their problems, and all can be traced to noise. > How then can a digital receiver present itself as being impervious > to noise, as your comment suggests? Yes, I did mean to suggest that digital receivers were impervious to noise, at least as long as the noise is of the type which the digital system was designed to combat, and as long as the noise is below the threshold for which the digital system is designed. Of course once the noise exceeds the threshold, the digital system will fail completely, and it will also fail if the noise has a characteristic different from that for which the system was designed. Some digital systems may involve several thresholds so that the signal will degrade more gracefully. This is accomplished by using a more robust modulation scheme for some of the bits, or by employing more redundancy in the forward error correction for some of the bits, allowing these favored bits to get through even when the noise increases. > As for your request to have me explain how we would build a receiver > like that; Sorry John, this is not something you're likely to see > the plans for in Popular Electronics magazine. I take it you are saying that you have developed a solution to eliminate noise from analog receivers, and that it has not yet been made public for reasons related to patents and such? I congratulate you on this development, it could have far ranging application, and make you a very wealthy man, if its commercialization is handled correctly. John From n0uiheric@aol.com Sat Mar 01 12:19:29 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 1 Mar 2003 20:19:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 7763 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2003 20:19:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 1 Mar 2003 20:19:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d05.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 1 Mar 2003 20:19:25 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-d05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.199.1670b045 (17377) for ; Sat, 1 Mar 2003 15:19:19 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <199.1670b045.2b926fc6@aol.com> Date: Sat, 1 Mar 2003 15:19:18 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} A Letter To The ARRL on WOR's IBOCrap Operation To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih IBOC will have EVEN MORE SPURS AND HARMONICS than analog. 25 kHz is too much spectrum space for an AM signal...better sound quality can be achieved with a new analog transmitter and just 10 kHz of spectrum space, regardless of frequency. The idea is to use LESS spectrum space, not more. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From rwagoner1@mac.com Sat Mar 01 16:29:09 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner1@mac.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Mar 2003 00:29:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 85364 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2003 00:29:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Mar 2003 00:29:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO fed1mtao06.cox.net) (68.6.19.125) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Mar 2003 00:29:08 -0000 Received: from mac.com ([68.4.33.253]) by fed1mtao06.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20030302002904.OOEJ22048.fed1mtao06.cox.net@mac.com> for ; Sat, 1 Mar 2003 19:29:04 -0500 Message-ID: <3E615054.9080601@mac.com> Date: Sat, 01 Mar 2003 16:29:08 -0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20021120 Netscape/7.01 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} First Public Station Flips HD-R Switch References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Richard Wagoner X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135738921 X-Yahoo-Profile: richardalanwagoner I have been told that KROQ/Los Angeles (106.7 FM) is currently broadcasting HD. Don't know if its true ... but if it is, I don't hear the FM splatter. I have no problem still receiving 106.5 out of San Diego from my home in San Pedro (Southern Los Angeles near Long Beach). > That will drive a number of low-power FM stations off the air. > Remember when > WNEW-FM tested IBOC? The sidebands splattered out to 102.3 and 102.9! > With > WUSF now operating with MUCH LOWER QUALITY sound than in analog, look for > 89.3 and 90.1 to suffer the same interference. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Mar 01 17:53:18 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Mar 2003 01:53:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 41325 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2003 01:53:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Mar 2003 01:53:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.67) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Mar 2003 01:53:17 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.159] by n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Mar 2003 01:53:17 -0000 Date: Sun, 02 Mar 2003 01:53:17 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Sony SRF-42 sells for $150 on eBay Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 587 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.80.140 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics With a total of 62 bids, this Sony SRF-42 AM Stereo Walkman sold for $150.05 on eBay.... quite impressive/surprising for a radio that Radio Shack was selling for $29.99 a pop, as recently as two years ago: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3009084989 Whether it is indicative of increasing popularity or not, resale prices of used AM Stereo equipment *are* going up. There are still bargains to be found, if you know where to look (and, more importantly, know what to look *for*), but many receivers are now commonly selling for more than what they cost new. From possumhunter@netzero.net Sat Mar 01 18:26:31 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Mar 2003 02:26:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 73512 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2003 02:13:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Mar 2003 02:13:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.87) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Mar 2003 02:13:35 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sat, 1 Mar 2003 18:13:35 -0800 To: References: <199.1670b045.2b926fc6@aol.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} A Letter To The ARRL on WOR's IBOCrap Operation Date: Sat, 1 Mar 2003 21:13:26 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 02 Mar 2003 02:13:35.0679 (UTC) FILETIME=[54ABCCF0:01C2E061] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.136.87.186] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 n0uiheric@aol.com wrote: > IBOC will have EVEN MORE SPURS AND HARMONICS than analog. 25 kHz is too much spectrum space for an AM signal. The bandwidth used by a transmitter has nothing to do with the spurs and harmonics it produces, so just HOW will IBOC HD Radio create spurs and harmonics on an otherwise "clean" transmitter? > >..better sound quality can be achieved with a new analog transmitter and just 10 kHz of spectrum space, regardless of frequency. The idea is to use LESS spectrum space, not more. I agree that a new analog transmitter using CQUAM and 10Khz of spectrum will not only sound better, it will cause much less adjacent channel interference compared to HD Radio. I just want to know how on Earth it is going to interfere with the Ham radio bands. Possum From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Mar 01 18:31:31 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Mar 2003 02:31:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 85831 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2003 02:31:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Mar 2003 02:31:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Mar 2003 02:31:31 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.140] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Mar 2003 02:31:31 -0000 Date: Sun, 02 Mar 2003 02:31:27 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: AM Stereo Demo 2003 Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2754 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.80.140 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics A live demonstration of AM Stereo was conducted today by yours truly at the 2003 North Jersey Hamfest (amateur radio show) in Parsippany, NJ. It featured multiple AM Stereo receivers on display, all powered up and tuned to the low-power signal I was broadcasting on 1500 kHz in C-Quam AM Stereo, playing a wide variety of music from a laptop computer. Another laptop computer was also set up and pre-loaded with the content of the www.AMStereoRadio.com web site for people to browse around as if it were online. Of course, promotional flyers were also printed up, with highlights of AM Stereo's advantages, a listing of local AM Stereo stations in the area, and information on the www.AMStereoRadio.com web site as well as the AM Stereo Forum. I'd say interest was fairly good for a table that was primarily set up as a promotional display rather than to sell equipment (although I did manage to sell my Radio Shack "Superadio clone" for $16!). A good number of people mentioned WOR's use of "digital AM", probably because of the article about it in the ham radio magazine "QST" -- but none were genuinely supportive of it, and many expressed concern about the wider bandwidth of the IBOC signal and its associated "hash". WOR's engineers will be pleased to note, however, that I did not go out of my way to be negative about IBOC; I simply mentioned that as of yet, it is still experimental, with only daytime use allowed, and it will be subject to ultimate FCC approval or rejection. More importantly, of course, I promoted the fact that analog C-Quam AM Stereo is currently in use by hundreds of stations around the world and that it is still supported by many listeners and broadcasters and numerous equipment manufacturers. Another vendor on my aisle tuned one of his radios to my 1500 kHz signal and had it playing, so even though he wasn't receiving it in AM Stereo, it still sounded pretty good with my signal's hi-fi 15 kHz audio bandwidth, and was all the more exposure for it, with my frequent liners mentioning "1500 AM Stereo". Meanwhile, I have noticed that 710 WOR's digital sidebands have more of a "modulated" or "rushing" sound to them, as opposed to plain white noise-type sound, and in forced Stereo, more of a "rat-tat-tat" type of digital data noise is heard from the lower-frequency QUAM sidebands -- perhaps indicative of another new version of the "HD Radio" encoding now being in use. But, I guess we'll have to continue our wait to actually hear the supposed improvement in the digital audio quality that it will offer.... meanwhile, the AM dial continues to be dotted with stations broadcasting clean, clear, spectrum-efficient analog AM Stereo, with fidelity just as good as ever. From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sat Mar 01 21:28:30 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Mar 2003 05:28:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 74882 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2003 05:28:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Mar 2003 05:28:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Mar 2003 05:28:29 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.177] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Mar 2003 05:28:29 -0000 Date: Sun, 02 Mar 2003 05:28:26 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Sony SRF-42 sells for $150 on eBay Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 907 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.119 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T. " wrote: > With a total of 62 bids, this Sony SRF-42 AM Stereo Walkman sold for > $150.05 on eBay.... quite impressive/surprising for a radio that > Radio Shack was selling for $29.99 a pop, as recently as two years > ago: > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3009084989 > > Whether it is indicative of increasing popularity or not, resale > prices of used AM Stereo equipment *are* going up. There are still > bargains to be found, if you know where to look (and, more > importantly, know what to look *for*), but many receivers are now > commonly selling for more than what they cost new. That's awfully high. The bidder must want it really bad. I don't think I would pay that much though. The eBay title contains C-QuAM which is somewhat misleading since it isn't a true C-QuAM decoder. JSG From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sat Mar 01 21:59:29 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Mar 2003 05:59:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 18437 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2003 05:59:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Mar 2003 05:59:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.89) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Mar 2003 05:59:28 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.128] by n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Mar 2003 05:59:28 -0000 Date: Sun, 02 Mar 2003 05:59:25 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: KTRH Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1135 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.119 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst Well I contacted a KTRH egineer recently about the dead air and he said they were a victim of a lighting strike were doing maintenance at those times. I asked them about any IBOC upgrades in the future but he hadn't heard yet. They are owned by Clear Channel now and I don't know when they were purchased, if they were a part of one of the other media groups that CC swallowed up or they were an independent. Anyway of all the years I have listened to KTRH the stations personality hasn't changed much, being the News/Weather station that serves the Texas and part of Louisiana coastal areas. Typical of most CC operations it is minimally staffed as the studio is shared with 790 KBME & 950 KPRC. I called 2 different times in the middle of the afternoon got their answering machine saying they were closed. A third time on another day I got in and the person redirected my call to the egineer. He called me back later that day and was polite and gave me the info. I guess I have to give CC some credit as not being completely brain dead and screwing up KTRH's personality as it must be one of their better money makers. JSG From n0uiheric@aol.com Sun Mar 02 00:55:15 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Mar 2003 08:55:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 54961 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2003 08:55:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Mar 2003 08:55:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d02.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.34) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Mar 2003 08:55:13 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-d02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.114.1fab7aa9 (18707) for ; Sun, 2 Mar 2003 03:55:06 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <114.1fab7aa9.2b9320ea@aol.com> Date: Sun, 2 Mar 2003 03:55:06 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} First Public Station Flips HD-R Switch To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih KROQ's transmitter, as far as I know, is on Mount Wilson. You'll probably experience IBOC hash closer to their transmitter site. Infinity tested the IBOC system on it's WNEW 102.7 a couple of years back (before 9/11). No one in the immediate New York area could hear anything on 102.5 or 102.9, even with a top-of-the-line receiver. The closest 102.9s are in Philadelphia and Hartford (both less than 100 miles away). If you're still hearing San Diego on 106.5, then KROQ is not operating IBOC. You can tell if KROQ is operating IBOC when you cannot hear San Diego because of digital hash. No one in St. Louis is currently running IBOC (thank God!). 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From amymousie@yahoo.com Sun Mar 02 02:13:38 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Mar 2003 10:13:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 79635 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2003 10:13:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Mar 2003 10:13:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Mar 2003 10:13:37 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.150] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Mar 2003 10:13:37 -0000 Date: Sun, 02 Mar 2003 10:13:37 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} First Public Station Flips HD-R Switch Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <114.1fab7aa9.2b9320ea@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 935 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 66.127.240.105 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, n0uiheric@a... wrote: > KROQ's transmitter, as far as I know, is on Mount Wilson. You'll probably > experience IBOC hash closer to their transmitter site. Infinity tested the > IBOC system on it's WNEW 102.7 a couple of years back (before 9/11). No one > in the immediate New York area could hear anything on 102.5 or 102.9, even > with a top-of-the-line receiver. The closest 102.9s are in Philadelphia and > Hartford (both less than 100 miles away). If you're still hearing San Diego > on 106.5, then KROQ is not operating IBOC. You can tell if KROQ is operating > IBOC when you cannot hear San Diego because of digital hash. > No one in St. Louis is currently running IBOC (thank God!). Fred Vobbe of the NRC DX Audio Service posted this some 3 years ago, but to know how FM IBOC sounds, it's worth the 7-meg download. http://www.nrcdxas.org/mp3/iboc0400.mp3 Amy. <:3 )~~8~ From dwtpa97@earthlink.net Sun Mar 02 05:21:01 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dwtpa97@earthlink.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Mar 2003 13:21:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 10356 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2003 13:21:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Mar 2003 13:21:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO snipe.mail.pas.earthlink.net) (207.217.120.62) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Mar 2003 13:21:01 -0000 Received: from sdn-ap-013scfairp0484.dialsprint.net ([63.183.129.230] helo=earthlink.net) by snipe.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 18pTOm-0000fl-00 for amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com; Sun, 02 Mar 2003 05:21:00 -0800 Message-ID: <3E62053F.3DC8350A@earthlink.net> Date: Sun, 02 Mar 2003 08:21:03 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.79 [en]C-CCK-MCD NSCPCD472 (Windows NT 5.0; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} First Public Station Flips HD-R Switch References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: dwtpa97 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38076959 On Friday mid-morning, I drove from south Tampa (on the peninsular) to northeast Tampa, then to northwest Tampa, and then back to south Tampa, and WUSF-FM had underlying intermittant static "blips" similar to what you sometimes encounter when you are in the fringe area of an FM signal. I did not notice any problems on adjacent stations. WUSF is a 100,000-watt station that normally doesn't have any reception problems in the city. I believe that their tower is in Riverview, southeast of the bay. Since WUSF has a classical-music format which includes very soft moments, these "blips", although subtle, were very distracting. Dick W. n0uiheric@aol.com wrote: > That will drive a number of low-power FM stations off the air. Remember when > WNEW-FM tested IBOC? The sidebands splattered out to 102.3 and 102.9! With > WUSF now operating with MUCH LOWER QUALITY sound than in analog, look for > 89.3 and 90.1 to suffer the same interference. > > 73 and good DX from Eric > Amateur Radio Station N0UIH > Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN > Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 > DXing The World since 1981 > From powell@conterra.com Sun Mar 02 08:32:06 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: powell@conterra.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Mar 2003 16:32:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 55119 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2003 16:32:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Mar 2003 16:32:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO ziggy.conterra.com) (66.112.206.20) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Mar 2003 16:32:03 -0000 Received: from ziggy.conterra.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ziggy.conterra.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id h22GW1i1090059 for ; Sun, 2 Mar 2003 11:32:03 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from powell@conterra.com) Received: (from www@localhost) by ziggy.conterra.com (8.12.6/8.12.6/Submit) id h22GVxWb090058 for amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com; Sun, 2 Mar 2003 11:31:59 -0500 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: ziggy.conterra.com: www set sender to powell@conterra.com using -f Received: from 209.213.26.22 ( [209.213.26.22]) as user powell@mail.conterra.com by ziggy.conterra.com with HTTP; Sun, 2 Mar 2003 11:31:59 -0500 Message-ID: <1046622719.3e6231ffa5103@ziggy.conterra.com> Date: Sun, 2 Mar 2003 11:31:59 -0500 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: New AM stereo radios? References: <1046619478.381.93211.m12@yahoogroups.com> In-Reply-To: <1046619478.381.93211.m12@yahoogroups.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) 3.1 From: powell@conterra.com X-Originating-IP: 209.213.26.22 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=8062869 X-Yahoo-Profile: W4OPW Maybe I should sell my SRF 42A's on ebay and get something good, whatever that may be.... ]:) Right now there is a SRF A100 (?) up there. As of a few seconds ago it stood at $100, and I expect it will go for a lot more. Right now I use the CC Alfredo Lite to play music into other radios, but AM Stereo 1000 needs to get a field strength boost, which I shall attend to. Most of the time I play music into the Zenith High Fidelity or some other radio handy. What IS out there on a reasonable price and performance? Powell ------------------------------------------------- This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/ From groucho@skyweb.net Sun Mar 02 08:45:08 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Mar 2003 16:45:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 85192 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2003 16:45:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Mar 2003 16:45:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Mar 2003 16:45:07 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (tc1-50.skyweb.net [66.6.130.178]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h22GtPWk087870; Sun, 2 Mar 2003 11:55:25 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3E6232A1.31EC1E11@skyweb.net> Date: Sun, 02 Mar 2003 11:34:41 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com" , "am@nrcdxas.org" Subject: IBOC on 710 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 well Lets see here guys... I worked On Cleaning up the Audio a little bit on WTTM yesterday. to Me it sounded a bit off. I cannot explain what I was hearing.. but its fixed now. Back to IBOC for 1 moment.. I recently picked up a High Grade military receiver a Collins R-390a which has a very sharp mechanical tuning section. this receiver is so accurate the For many Years out Govt used them and they were Classified as top Secret. Now there are thousands of them out there.Everyone from the CIA to NSA to FCC and all branches of the military used them. this is no Cheap receiver and very well Build to withstand use in extremely High RF areas. and not to Be Overloaded.. with 6 bandwiths of mechanical filtering from .1kc,1kc,2,kc,4,kc,8kc,and 16kc bandwidth ok Now that I gave you the basics.. so I set the receiver with the 1kc bandwidth. and tuned down to 710 and found it Very sharp. on the upper IBOC sideband I found it cuts off very sharp at 726kc at 8 kc bandwidth It can be heard upto732kc on the lowersideband it Cuts Off Very sharp at 1kc bandwidth at 695kc and at 8kc bandwidth it can be heard as Low as 692kc. but Of course the audio of WOR on 710 at 1kc bandwidth Sounds like hell... so I switched to the 4kc bandwidth filter. WOR's audio sounded ok Of course it sounds fine in the 8kc Position. Ok back to the 4 kc position IBOC can be heard up at 727Kc at 727.5 its gone... Now the Other way It can Be heard at 694kc at 693 its gone. so what I have determined using this Military grade receiver that even the FCC has used for many years.. that a receiver with a sharp Filter at 4kc bandwidth the IBOC signal goes from 693 up 727.5 kc. and we are Not talking Receiver Front End overload this Time. this is still to wide 3 kc Protection to the 690kc station and 2.5kc protection to 730kc..I could Be off by just .25Kc and that's about as close as I can get without a Spectrum analyser.... so even if you balance it in the Middle its Only about 2kc Protection up and down the IBOC stations Center.. there is Not enough protection to the Second adjacent station. sorry I just had to post my findings using this Military grade receiver. Neal From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Sun Mar 02 09:43:14 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Mar 2003 17:43:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 69605 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2003 17:43:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Mar 2003 17:43:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web41006.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.93.5) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Mar 2003 17:43:13 -0000 Message-ID: <20030302174313.78377.qmail@web41006.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.37.211] by web41006.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 02 Mar 2003 09:43:13 PST Date: Sun, 2 Mar 2003 09:43:13 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM Stereo Demo 2003 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio What kind of equipment were you using? Did you have any audio processing? 73, Jay,N1WVQ __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ From jbyrns@rcn.com Sun Mar 02 10:26:35 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@rcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Mar 2003 18:26:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 53752 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2003 18:26:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Mar 2003 18:26:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.83) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Mar 2003 18:26:34 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.138] by n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Mar 2003 18:26:33 -0000 Date: Sun, 02 Mar 2003 18:26:33 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: IBOC on 710 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3E6232A1.31EC1E11@skyweb.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2117 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bta_50g " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.160 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=138635554 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, Neal Newman wrote: > well Lets see here guys... I worked On Cleaning up the Audio a > little bit on WTTM yesterday. to Me it sounded a bit off. I cannot > explain what I was hearing.. but its fixed now. Back to IBOC for 1 > moment.. I recently picked up a High Grade military receiver a > Collins R-390a which has a very sharp mechanical tuning section. [snip "IBOC test" results] > sorry I just had to post my findings using this Military grade > receiver. > Neal Hi Neal, Thanks for posting your test results. Even though your receiver has probably not been calibrated recently, and the shape and symmetry of the IF filters is unspecified, it appears that you have confirmed that the spectrum of the "IBOC" system is exactly what it's developers claim it to be. It is good to see unbiased independent confirmation of the "IBOC" spectral limits. I will take the liberty of reformatting your test results with the 710 kHz carrier in the form of a table, which is easier to read and interpret. IF Filter "Observed IBOC "Observed IBOC Band Width Lower Limit" Upper Limit" "IBOC" Spec. 695 kHz 725 kHz 1 kHz 695 kHz 726 kHz 4 kHz 694 kHz 727 kHz 8 kHz 692 kHz 732 kHz The "IBOC" specification of plus/minus 15 kHz around a 710 kHz carrier gives digital sidebands down 695 kHz, and up to 625 kHz. Even though your receiver was uncalibrated, and the actual response of the IF filters was unspecified, your results appear to closely confirm the specified "IBOC" bandwidth of plus/minus 15 kHz around the carrier. The fact that you say the "IBOC" signal is "gone" outside of these frequencies would also seem to support the view that the "IBOC" interference some people report hearing at 740 kHz, and above, is due to problems in the receivers they are using. I guess everyone ought to rush out and buy one of those "R-390a" receivers like you have. Do you know if there is an "AM stereo" mod for this receiver? John From jbyrns@rcn.com Sun Mar 02 10:31:14 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@rcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Mar 2003 18:31:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 56346 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2003 18:31:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Mar 2003 18:31:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.70) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Mar 2003 18:31:13 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.143] by n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Mar 2003 18:31:13 -0000 Date: Sun, 02 Mar 2003 18:31:12 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: IBOC on 710 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 745 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bta_50g " X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.160 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=138635554 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "bta_50g " < jbyrns@r...> wrote: > > I will take the liberty of reformatting your test results with the 710 > kHz carrier in the form of a table, which is easier to read and > interpret. > > IF Filter "Observed IBOC "Observed IBOC > Band Width Lower Limit" Upper Limit" > > "IBOC" Spec. 695 kHz 725 kHz > > 1 kHz 695 kHz 726 kHz > 4 kHz 694 kHz 727 kHz > 8 kHz 692 kHz 732 kHz Hmm, now I see why you didn't put your results in the form of an easy to read table, there is no such thing after Yahoo gets through with it, but strangely it looks OK in the reply window. John From amymousie@yahoo.com Sun Mar 02 12:08:14 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Mar 2003 20:08:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 97832 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2003 20:08:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Mar 2003 20:08:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.88) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Mar 2003 20:08:12 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.175] by n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Mar 2003 20:08:12 -0000 Date: Sun, 02 Mar 2003 20:08:12 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Tubes vs. solid-state Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1028 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 66.127.240.105 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie Lately, there has been several posts disparaging tube transmitters. Personally, I would have to disagree with the generalization towards tube TXes. I would have to say that, for both tube and solid-state, just as with radios, there are good ones and bad ones- It all depends on the design. I good design would be able to reduce harmonics, etc., and provide better performance. You CAN get good results with a tube TX, just as you can with a good solid-state TX. And of course, equally as bad, if badly designed. Bad design and bad alignment can produce very bad signals. I might say that alot of AM transmitters, tube AND solid-state, are so badly designed and/or aligned, that they're hell to listen to, regardless of radio. (I think the problem is the same as with receivers- Not much thought going into a quality product.) I have nothing against either; I think it's a matter of choice to go tube or solid-state, and both can be equally good, or equally bad. Just my penny-and-a-half's worth. Amy. <:3 )~~8~ From ccuff@in4web.com Sun Mar 02 12:25:04 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Mar 2003 20:25:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 72697 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2003 20:25:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Mar 2003 20:25:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Mar 2003 20:25:04 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [208.20.8.130]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Sun, 2 Mar 2003 15:22:02 -0500 Message-ID: <001701c2e0f8$7ebcaa40$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Tubes vs. solid-state Date: Sun, 2 Mar 2003 15:15:39 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 Another thought re: Tube life- Tubes fail because they are pushed too hard. A bit more negative bias on the grids will increase the tube life many times- at only a bit of a total power output loss. When I worked for Heathkit, many of their tube amps had output plates that would glow a dark red- way too excessive! Tubes failed quickly. Re-biasing the grids made them run cooler, last longer, less distortion. But at a sacrifice of a little power output. Chris ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Sunday, March 02, 2003 3:08 PM Subject: {AMSF} Tubes vs. solid-state > Lately, there has been several posts disparaging tube transmitters. From n0uiheric@aol.com Sun Mar 02 13:32:42 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Mar 2003 21:32:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 53030 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2003 21:32:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Mar 2003 21:32:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m07.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.162) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Mar 2003 21:32:39 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-m07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.55.3a188539 (3948) for ; Sun, 2 Mar 2003 16:32:33 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <55.3a188539.2b93d271@aol.com> Date: Sun, 2 Mar 2003 16:32:33 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} First Public Station Flips HD-R Switch To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih Dick, I think it's time to ban all digital broadcasts below 1 GHz (that's 1000 MHz). The bands below 1 GHz are not suited to digital audio broadcasting. AM and FM should remain analog, allowing to keep a near-perfect FM Stereo system and the more technologically advanced C-QUAM AM Stereo. Check out the Digital Disaster Web site. They tell the truth about IBOC. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From n0uiheric@aol.com Sun Mar 02 13:32:43 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Mar 2003 21:32:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 72044 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2003 21:32:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Mar 2003 21:32:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m08.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.163) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Mar 2003 21:32:43 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-m08.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.24.38ec3f34 (3948) for ; Sun, 2 Mar 2003 16:32:34 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <24.38ec3f34.2b93d271@aol.com> Date: Sun, 2 Mar 2003 16:32:33 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} IBOC on 710 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih Neal, Most Americans don't have military-grade receivers, unfortunately. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sun Mar 02 13:47:26 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Mar 2003 21:47:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 93319 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2003 21:47:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Mar 2003 21:47:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Mar 2003 21:47:24 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.137] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Mar 2003 21:47:24 -0000 Date: Sun, 02 Mar 2003 21:47:21 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: IBOC on 710 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 2572 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.198 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "bta_50g " wrote: >=20 > IF Filter "Observed IBOC "Observed IBOC > Band Width Lower Limit" Upper Limit" >=20 > "IBOC" Spec. 695 kHz 725 kHz >=20 > 1 kHz 695 kHz 726 kHz > 4 kHz 694 kHz 727 kHz > 8 kHz 692 kHz 732 kHz >=20 > The "IBOC" specification of plus/minus 15 kHz around a 710 kHz carrier=20 > gives digital sidebands down 695 kHz, and up to 625 kHz. Even though=20 > your receiver was uncalibrated, and the actual response of the IF=20 > filters was unspecified, your results appear to closely confirm the=20 > specified "IBOC" bandwidth of plus/minus 15 kHz around the carrier.=20=20 > The fact that you say the "IBOC" signal is "gone" outside of these=20 > frequencies would also seem to support the view that the "IBOC"=20 > interference some people report hearing at 740 kHz, and above, is due=20 > to problems in the receivers they are using. I guess everyone ought=20 > to rush out and buy one of those "R-390a" receivers like you have.=20 Do=20 > you know if there is an "AM stereo" mod for this receiver? >=20 > John This is what I expected too. Some of these bandscan tests that were done on some of these =B115KHz wideband Sony radios have some response above 15Khz so if you have it tuned to 740KHz then it will still pick up some hash just below 725KHz especially if the AGC is maxed out because of lack of carrier. In the March 2003 QST, the article about WOR, there is a graph of the IBOC spectrum. The primary side- bands are just below -30dBc. However this does exceed the more restrictive mask for the white noise splatter test. The sidebands would have to be below ~-37dBc. Now I am going by the mask that was posted on this forum awhile ago and was readable enough to see the dotted line cross at ~-37dBc at 15KHz. If anyone has a clearer one that is official please post it or verify the accuracy of this. Since the IBOC signal is very caracteristic of a white noise signal then I think it should be required to meet this greater restriction. And=20 if it doesn't then it could be considered in violation of this more restricted mask. Yes the tables do look good in the reply box that uses a fixed width font but Yahoo may specify a variable width font for the message display. Also of you have several spaces at the beginning of the line before any characters then Yahoo will usually delete most of them so you will need to start the line with a character to make the table=20 layout better. JSG From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sun Mar 02 14:08:29 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 2 Mar 2003 22:08:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 1553 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2003 22:08:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 2 Mar 2003 22:08:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 2 Mar 2003 22:08:28 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.168] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Mar 2003 22:08:28 -0000 Date: Sun, 02 Mar 2003 22:08:25 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} First Public Station Flips HD-R Switch Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <55.3a188539.2b93d271@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1320 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.198 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, n0uiheric@a... wrote: > Dick, I think it's time to ban all digital broadcasts below 1 GHz (that's > 1000 MHz). The bands below 1 GHz are not suited to digital audio > broadcasting. AM and FM should remain analog, allowing to keep a near-perfect > FM Stereo system and the more technologically advanced C-QUAM AM Stereo. > Check out the Digital Disaster Web site. They tell the truth about IBOC. > I don't think we need to ban it below 1GHz since HDTV is implementing the digital transmittions in a non interfering way. The problem is that for both AM & FM IBOC is not in-band but out of band that is causing the interfefence problem. For AM the potential to cause interference to 2nd adjacent is greater than a 1st adjacent because a 2nd adjacent is more likely to be closer to an IBOC station than a 1st adjacent. For FM this is also the problem in crowded markets but in markets that has sufficient space between channels these could have been licensed to LPFM. It is pretty obvious why LPFM was killed because it would have used the spectrum that IBOC will use. A LPFM would have to apply for a license to use this spectrum but it would be given freely to a station that wished to transmitt IBOC. What's wrong with this picture? Can you say corporate welfare. JSG From groucho@skyweb.net Sun Mar 02 18:19:49 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 3 Mar 2003 02:19:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 78426 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2003 02:19:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Mar 2003 02:19:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Mar 2003 02:19:46 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (tc1-50.skyweb.net [66.6.130.178]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h232U6Wk026247 for ; Sun, 2 Mar 2003 21:30:07 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3E62B955.11F0E2D@skyweb.net> Date: Sun, 02 Mar 2003 21:09:25 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC on 710 References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 LOL hello John actually the Figures I spec compared to what IBOC is supposed to Be would be Very close to Being Correct and not a problem If the station like WOR transmits 5kc audio and Every receiver out there was only 4kc wide this would work just fine. However Most am stations do transmit at 10kc of audio. and most 99% of the receivers out there in real Life have wider bandwidths from 6-8kc which proves the point that at 8kc where 99% of us Listen to AM stations the IBOC signal is heard at 692khz to 732khz It Does wipe out the 690,700,720 and 730 frequencies... which is Not Good... the only way I can See IBOC work is for EVERY station transmit at 5kc audio which is ok If every station was a talk station. for Music stations 5kc Sucks... anyway if Every station ran 5kc and Every radio was at least 4kc wide IBOC would work. in today's real world with all the existing AM receivers out there. IBOC will Not work without interference to the Second adjacent station as proven in the chart.. 690 and 730 are trashed...with only 2 khz protection. In the words of Kevin Meenie" THATS NOT RIGHT"...... BTW tonight with NO IBOC on 710.. I hear 700 and 720 Crystal clear.... IBOC belongs in only one place... ON Its Own Band.. Not on the Existing AM or FM Bands.. this receiver was just rebuilt and calibrated to factory specs... If its Off its Only by .25 Khz Close Enough for Me..... Collins R-390A SN#98 Neal "bta_50g " wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, Neal Newman > wrote: > > well Lets see here guys... I worked On Cleaning up the Audio a > > little bit on WTTM yesterday. to Me it sounded a bit off. I cannot > > explain what I was hearing.. but its fixed now. Back to IBOC for 1 > > moment.. I recently picked up a High Grade military receiver a > > Collins R-390a which has a very sharp mechanical tuning section. > > [snip "IBOC test" results] > > > sorry I just had to post my findings using this Military grade > > receiver. > > Neal > > Hi Neal, > > Thanks for posting your test results. Even though your receiver has > probably not been calibrated recently, and the shape and symmetry of > the IF filters is unspecified, it appears that you have confirmed that > the spectrum of the "IBOC" system is exactly what it's developers > claim it to be. It is good to see unbiased independent confirmation > of the "IBOC" spectral limits. > > I will take the liberty of reformatting your test results with the 710 > kHz carrier in the form of a table, which is easier to read and > interpret. > > IF Filter "Observed IBOC "Observed IBOC > Band Width Lower Limit" Upper Limit" > > "IBOC" Spec. 695 kHz 725 kHz > > 1 kHz 695 kHz 726 kHz > 4 kHz 694 kHz 727 kHz > 8 kHz 692 kHz 732 kHz > > The "IBOC" specification of plus/minus 15 kHz around a 710 kHz carrier > gives digital sidebands down 695 kHz, and up to 625 kHz. Even though > your receiver was uncalibrated, and the actual response of the IF > filters was unspecified, your results appear to closely confirm the > specified "IBOC" bandwidth of plus/minus 15 kHz around the carrier. > The fact that you say the "IBOC" signal is "gone" outside of these > frequencies would also seem to support the view that the "IBOC" > interference some people report hearing at 740 kHz, and above, is due > to problems in the receivers they are using. I guess everyone ought > to rush out and buy one of those "R-390a" receivers like you have. Do > you know if there is an "AM stereo" mod for this receiver? > > John > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From possumhunter@netzero.net Sun Mar 02 18:25:44 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 3 Mar 2003 02:25:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 90867 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2003 02:25:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Mar 2003 02:25:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.94) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Mar 2003 02:25:43 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 2 Mar 2003 18:25:43 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Tubes vs. solid-state Date: Sun, 2 Mar 2003 21:25:29 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 03 Mar 2003 02:25:43.0648 (UTC) FILETIME=[30FCCE00:01C2E12C] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.175.169.145] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 amymousie@yahoo.com wrote: > Lately, there has been several posts disparaging tube transmitters. Personally, I would have to disagree with the generalization towards tube TXes. Please don't think I am down on tube transmitters. There are some very nice sounding ones out there like the RCA BTA1R and BTA1S. The Gates /Harris BC1G, BC1H, BC5H, and MW series are all good sounding boxes *IF* you use high quality tubes and keep them maintained. Many are replaced only because of the high cost of tubes, high cost of electricity, lack of high quality tubes on the market, and tube transmitters lack the bandwidth needed to pass the HD-Radio signal. I have a couple of tube part 15 transmitters. My "baby" is a RCA BTA1R. Westinghouse, Collins, and Western Electric also made some great tube transmitters. The worst tube rigs were produced by McMartin and CCA. The amazing thing is the McMartin BA1K is STILL a current model!!! Why would ANYBODY buy one? CCA was still making the AM1000D until they went belly-up last fall. That had to have been the longest running transmitter model ever produced. I used to work at a station that had one made in the early '60s. Another station I worked for had a '70s vintage AM1000D. The only difference was the newer AM1000D used solid state rectifier stacks instead of mercury vapor tubes. Both could flatten a set of Amperex modulator tubes in less than a month! I have a modulator tube from WCKI 1300 that the glass melted and the tube collapsed. I think it was running a tad bit warm. Kevin From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Mar 02 19:23:14 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 3 Mar 2003 03:23:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 11497 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2003 03:23:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Mar 2003 03:23:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Mar 2003 03:23:14 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.150] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Mar 2003 03:23:14 -0000 Date: Mon, 03 Mar 2003 03:23:12 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: AM Stereo Demo 2003 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20030302174313.78377.qmail@web41006.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1764 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.90.16 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > What kind of equipment were you using? Did you have any audio > processing? Transmitter: Panasonic VP-8253P multi-system AM Stereo generator (circa 1984), set to 1500.00 kHz, C-Quam mode, 4.0% pilot tone level. RF output set to 126 dB EMF -- not sure how many mW that equates to. I could have switched it into Kahn/Hazeltine ISB mode if any Kahn fanatics showed up, but none did this time. It also supports Harris (CPM with fixed 25 Hz pilot) and Magnavox (AM-PM with 5 Hz pilot) modes. Antenna: Telescoping whip antenna, taken from an old set of TV "rabbit ears". Approximately matched with a loading coil. No ground (indoors). Signal coverage wasn't good at all, but was enough for my demonstration purposes. At home with a bigger, properly matched outdoor antenna, I can get a good 1/4 mile coverage radius, with traces heard up to 1/2 mile away. Audio Source: IBM ThinkPad 560E laptop playing MP3 and MPC (MusePack) files through MPXPLAY for DOS. The music playlist was randomized and automated by a little program I wrote myself in GW-BASIC! Audio Processing: Single-band volume compression/limiting and 140% L-R Stereo expansion, both built into MPXPLAY. A Technics receiver was used to provide treble pre-emphasis and to boost the audio to a level necessary for the transmitter's audio input -- just below the point at which its > +125% modulation peak flasher lights up. The transmitter also has a built-in negative peak clipper, probably set to limit it to -95% modulation. My main demo receiver was a GM/Delco radio-only unit (no cassette, no 5-band equalizer) with "AM ST/MONO" button, built in October 1984. I also jammed a paper clip into the Set button to keep "1500 AM STEREO" showing on the display full-time! From amymousie@yahoo.com Sun Mar 02 20:37:41 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 3 Mar 2003 04:37:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 18810 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2003 04:37:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Mar 2003 04:37:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.90) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Mar 2003 04:37:39 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.248] by n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Mar 2003 04:37:39 -0000 Date: Mon, 03 Mar 2003 04:37:39 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: IBOC on 710 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3E62B955.11F0E2D@skyweb.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1379 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 66.127.240.105 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, Neal Newman wrote: > LOL hello John > actually the Figures I spec compared to what IBOC is supposed to Be would > be Very close to Being Correct and not a problem If the station like WOR > transmits 5kc audio and Every receiver out there was only 4kc wide this would > work just fine. Having looked at WOR's raw WAV file with the IBOC carrier, the carrier appears to be 5kHz wide, from +/- 10kHz to +/- 15kHz. > However Most am stations do transmit at 10kc of audio. and most 99% of the > receivers out there in real Life have wider bandwidths from 6-8kc I'm not entirely sure about this. While some go out to, say, 5kHz @ - 6dB, still others have "brick wall" filters that cut off above 6kHz, leaving everything above that filtered out. Radios -used- to be out to 8kHz @ -6dB; very fewe are built to that, today. > BTW tonight with NO IBOC on 710.. > I hear 700 and 720 Crystal clear.... IBOC belongs in only one place... > ON Its Own Band.. Not on the Existing AM or FM Bands.. > this receiver was just rebuilt and calibrated to factory specs... > If its Off its Only by .25 Khz Close Enough for Me..... Collins R- 390A > SN#98 > Neal Interesting how certain people assume that a station engineer who cares about what he's doing would not have recalibrated high-grade radios.... Amy. <:3 )~~8~ From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Sun Mar 02 20:47:21 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 3 Mar 2003 04:47:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 17361 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2003 04:47:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Mar 2003 04:47:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web41001.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.93.0) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Mar 2003 04:47:20 -0000 Message-ID: <20030303044720.11889.qmail@web41001.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.37.211] by web41001.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 02 Mar 2003 20:47:20 PST Date: Sun, 2 Mar 2003 20:47:20 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: AM Stereo Demo 2003 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio How many responses did you get? How many people attended and how many picked up a copy of that station list. It must be nice being in an AM Stereo area. Here, unless you can pick up WINY there's nothing. Also, how do I upload a file? I want to upload a KDAY AM Stereo liner from their Rap days. Congratulations on the exhibit. I guess that guy from station KAHN (well, it was W-Something 1570) in Va. didn't show up, huh? 73, Jay,N1WVQ __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ From amymousie@yahoo.com Sun Mar 02 20:50:20 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 3 Mar 2003 04:50:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 1373 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2003 04:50:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Mar 2003 04:50:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.66) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Mar 2003 04:50:20 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.184] by n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Mar 2003 04:50:19 -0000 Date: Mon, 03 Mar 2003 04:50:18 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Tubes vs. solid-state Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1668 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 66.127.240.105 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Possum Hunter" wrote: > amymousie@y... wrote: > > Lately, there has been several posts disparaging tube transmitters. > Personally, I would have to disagree with the generalization towards tube > TXes. > > Please don't think I am down on tube transmitters. There are some very nice > sounding ones out there like the RCA BTA1R and BTA1S. The Gates /Harris > BC1G, BC1H, BC5H, and MW series are all good sounding boxes *IF* you use > high quality tubes and keep them maintained. Many are replaced only because > of the high cost of tubes, high cost of electricity, lack of high quality > tubes on the market, and tube transmitters lack the bandwidth needed to pass > the HD-Radio signal. I have a couple of tube part 15 transmitters. My "baby" > is a RCA BTA1R. Westinghouse, Collins, and Western Electric also made some > great tube transmitters. Recalling the days of the "Apex" wideband AM bands, I must respecfully disagree with you pertaining to wide bandwidth on tube TXes, since these bands were in use long before solid-state transmitters were in use. (Not to mention early FM, as well, were tube systems.) As for transmitters expiring tubes quickly, I would agree with Mr. Cuff's asse3ssment on modifying the negative bias. Another thing one could do is get tubes rated for a higher power than what you need, and run them cool, but not so low that they don't operate. I would think a good engineer worth his salt would tweak his or her TX to get the most out without running so hot that the tubes expire. Sounds a little too much like overclocking computers. Amy. <:3 )~~8~ From amymousie@yahoo.com Sun Mar 02 20:59:07 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 3 Mar 2003 04:59:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 11442 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2003 04:59:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Mar 2003 04:59:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Mar 2003 04:59:06 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.167] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Mar 2003 04:59:06 -0000 Date: Mon, 03 Mar 2003 04:59:06 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: AM Stereo Demo 2003 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20030303044720.11889.qmail@web41001.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 503 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 66.127.240.105 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, JNR wrote: > > Also, how do I upload a file? I want to upload a > KDAY AM Stereo liner from their Rap days. I hope is smaller than 98kb, since that's all the room that's left. (Mr. Moderator?) As for uploading a file, just click on "Add file", then click on the "browse" button, and a local window should pop up, then go to where you put the file, then selecvt it. Then write a short desription, then click on "Upload". Amy. <:3 )~~8~ From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sun Mar 02 22:45:08 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 3 Mar 2003 06:45:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 47922 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2003 06:45:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Mar 2003 06:45:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.78) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Mar 2003 06:45:08 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.190] by n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Mar 2003 06:45:07 -0000 Date: Mon, 03 Mar 2003 06:45:07 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: AM Stereo Demo 2003 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 674 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.24 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "amymousie " wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, JNR wrote: > > > > Also, how do I upload a file? I want to upload a > > KDAY AM Stereo liner from their Rap days. > > I hope is smaller than 98kb, since that's all the room that's left. > (Mr. Moderator?) As for uploading a file, just click on "Add file", > then click on the "browse" button, and a local window should pop up, > then go to where you put the file, then selecvt it. Then write a > short desription, then click on "Upload". > > Amy. <:3 )~~8~ Upload it to ftp://209.193.86.116 our AMS FTP site. JSG From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sun Mar 02 22:47:52 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 3 Mar 2003 06:47:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 32283 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2003 06:47:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Mar 2003 06:47:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Mar 2003 06:47:52 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.159] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 03 Mar 2003 06:47:51 -0000 Date: Mon, 03 Mar 2003 06:47:51 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: AM Stereo Demo 2003 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20030303044720.11889.qmail@web41001.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 403 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst " X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.24 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, JNR wrote: > How many responses did you get? How many people > attended and how many picked up a copy of that > station list. It must be nice being in an AM > Stereo area. Here, unless you can pick up WINY > there's nothing. > My area qualifies as the AM-Stereo Dead Zone. My closest receivable station is 820 WBAP at 250 miles away. JSG From stodd@sherbtel.net Mon Mar 03 10:26:00 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 3 Mar 2003 18:25:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 82552 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2003 18:25:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Mar 2003 18:25:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Mar 2003 18:25:57 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-71.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.71]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h23IPsle017194 for ; Mon, 3 Mar 2003 12:25:55 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <003901c2e1b2$bdd55be0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <3E5F05C4.3070705@mac.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Sony making AM stereo walkmans again? Date: Mon, 3 Mar 2003 12:28:49 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Megabucks. I suppose you could go through that Wade Cook program on buying and selling stocks, or maybe one of those real-estate things where you can learn to find fixer-up houses in otherwise fairly good neighborhoods to repair and resell at good profits, and see if you can get rich that way. Frankly I think you'd be better off trying to buy in a smaller major market like markets 10-20. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Richard Wagoner" To: Sent: Friday, February 28, 2003 12:46 AM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Sony making AM stereo walkmans again? > What was Dolby FM? How did it differ? > > And how do I get enough money to buy an AM station in Los Angeles just > to prove I can program it better than the morons out here? > > Richard > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > From alfredot@inetarena.com Mon Mar 03 14:07:05 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: alfredot@inetarena.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 3 Mar 2003 22:07:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 19079 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2003 22:07:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Mar 2003 22:07:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.inetarena.com) (206.129.216.13) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Mar 2003 22:07:03 -0000 Received: from hendrie (1Cust54.tnt17.beaverton.or.da.uu.net [65.227.179.54]) by mail.inetarena.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h23M46N22290 for ; Mon, 3 Mar 2003 14:04:06 -0800 (PST) Date: Mon, 3 Mar 2003 14:06:03 -0800 (PST) X-Sender: alfredo@hendrie.1610am.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: IBOC on 710 In-Reply-To: <1046714064.1821.27131.m12@yahoogroups.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: "Alfredo E. Torrejon" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=25132238 X-Yahoo-Profile: alfredotorrejon > Most Americans don't have military-grade receivers, unfortunately. So what is your point, Eric? This argument sounds a lot like what many of the people who do not support AM Stereo would say about our group: "Most Americans don't have receivers that will decode AM Stereo." I think that Neal explained very well what he was trying to do in his tests. Alfredo From n0uiheric@aol.com Mon Mar 03 15:25:35 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 3 Mar 2003 23:25:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 50350 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2003 23:25:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 3 Mar 2003 23:25:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d06.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.38) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 3 Mar 2003 23:25:34 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-d06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.192.16a0ec76 (26116) for ; Mon, 3 Mar 2003 18:25:18 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <192.16a0ec76.2b953e5e@aol.com> Date: Mon, 3 Mar 2003 18:25:18 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC on 710 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih That is because many Americans cannot afford the high cost of a military-grade receiver. On most receivers, IBOC is incompatible with analog radio. IBOC receiver costs would be high, and would REMAIN high. Most Americans don't even know that they own AM Stereo receivers (there are, after all, 24 million such receivers in the American marketplace). 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From amymousie@yahoo.com Mon Mar 03 16:27:10 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 4 Mar 2003 00:27:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 10478 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2003 00:27:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Mar 2003 00:27:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Mar 2003 00:27:10 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.142] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 04 Mar 2003 00:27:10 -0000 Date: Tue, 04 Mar 2003 00:27:08 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: IBOC on 710 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <192.16a0ec76.2b953e5e@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1652 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 66.127.240.105 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, n0uiheric@a... wrote: > That is because many Americans cannot afford the high cost of a > military-grade receiver. On most receivers, IBOC is incompatible with analog > radio. IBOC receiver costs would be high, and would REMAIN high. Most > Americans don't even know that they own AM Stereo receivers (there are, after > all, 24 million such receivers in the American marketplace). Both points I've made before, the high cost of IBOC for the consumer (royalty and license fees accounting for the extra cost- And don't forget that once the patents run out, Lucent/iBiquity's incentives to offer IBOC run out!), and the number of AM stereo receivers still out there (about 10%)- And you're also right- Most people who have it don't know they do, and if they do, they just take it for granted that it's there. ("I thought `AM' and `FM' are just names for the radio bands- You mean they actually MEAN something?" "Stereo? What's that? Just as long as I get my traffic news and weather, I don't give a damn.") IBOC has one thing going for it- No-one's going to really give a damn about the quality of the audio, just as long as they get news, traffic and weather, and maybe some backround noise as trhey endure 90+minute commutes to/from work. Most people don't really give much of a damn about radio, except for us die-hard radio freaks- And as far as the stations and radio makers are concerned, there are just a few "hundred" of us, nothing to be concerned about. God, I loath corporate/commercial radio so! Lo0st is the spirit of experimentalism and the tinkerer........ Amy. <:3 )~~8~ From JH_Radio@GameBox.net Mon Mar 03 18:47:58 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: JH_Radio@GameBox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 4 Mar 2003 02:47:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 13410 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2003 02:47:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Mar 2003 02:47:48 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO babyruth.hotpop.com) (204.57.55.14) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Mar 2003 02:47:49 -0000 Received: from gamebox.net (kubrick.hotpop.com [204.57.55.16]) by babyruth.hotpop.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 923D5211DE1 for ; Tue, 4 Mar 2003 02:47:40 +0000 (UTC) Received: from -enduser.GameBox.net (pcp03184855pcs.benslm01.pa.comcast.net [68.80.77.117]) by smtp-1.hotpop.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 122CA1A01BD for ; Tue, 4 Mar 2003 02:47:39 +0000 (UTC) Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030303214547.029d02b0@pop.GameBox.net> X-Sender: JH_Radio@pop.GameBox.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Mon, 03 Mar 2003 21:51:47 -0500 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC on 710 In-Reply-To: References: <192.16a0ec76.2b953e5e@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-HotPOP: ----------------------------------------------- Sent By HotPOP.com FREE Email Get your FREE POP email at www.HotPOP.com ----------------------------------------------- From: John X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113800107 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi. Just to inform you guys that my dad had no idea about his Crisler AM Stereo radio, with the CD/Cassette. Turned on WPEN and I go "Can you here the awesome stereo sound? Do you think it sounds better then FM Stereo?" He goes... "I don't no, I don't know any of the songs that they play on this station." For your info, it was WPEN, and WPHT was doing talk, and x dad doesn't know much Franky baby. If it wasn't for me, dad would never have a lesson in AM Stereo or radio in any way shape or form! Dad is most likely one of the public... Turn on WXPN for wide music selection, cuz Sunny (WSNI) plays the same stuff to much even for him. And he is more concentrated on the road! What does that say about CC stations? At 12:27 AM 3/4/03 +0000, you wrote: >--- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, n0uiheric@a... wrote: >> That is because many Americans cannot afford the high cost of a >> military-grade receiver. On most receivers, IBOC is incompatible >with analog >> radio. IBOC receiver costs would be high, and would REMAIN high. >Most >> Americans don't even know that they own AM Stereo receivers (there >are, after >> all, 24 million such receivers in the American marketplace). > >Both points I've made before, the high cost of IBOC for the consumer >(royalty and license fees accounting for the extra cost- And don't >forget that once the patents run out, Lucent/iBiquity's incentives to >offer IBOC run out!), and the number of AM stereo receivers still out >there (about 10%)- And you're also right- Most people who have it >don't know they do, and if they do, they just take it for granted >that it's there. ("I thought `AM' and `FM' are just names for the >radio bands- You mean they actually MEAN something?" "Stereo? What's >that? Just as long as I get my traffic news and weather, I don't give >a damn.") > >IBOC has one thing going for it- No-one's going to really give a damn >about the quality of the audio, just as long as they get news, >traffic and weather, and maybe some backround noise as trhey endure >90+minute commutes to/from work. Most people don't really give much >of a damn about radio, except for us die-hard radio freaks- And as >far as the stations and radio makers are concerned, there are just a >few "hundred" of us, nothing to be concerned about. > >God, I loath corporate/commercial radio so! Lo0st is the spirit of >experimentalism and the tinkerer........ > >Amy. <:3 )~~8~ > > > > >Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Love in Christ: John Bensalem, PA Send me an email Aim: RainAngelsRule MSN: RainAngelsRule@hotmail.com My website Welcome to Napster4TheBlind "Prayer does not change God; it changes you." - Authur unknown [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From amymousie@yahoo.com Mon Mar 03 19:36:59 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 4 Mar 2003 03:36:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 61269 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2003 03:36:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Mar 2003 03:36:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.69) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Mar 2003 03:36:57 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.190] by n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 04 Mar 2003 03:36:56 -0000 Date: Tue, 04 Mar 2003 03:36:55 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: IBOC on 710 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20030303214547.029d02b0@pop.GameBox.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1980 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie " X-Originating-IP: 66.127.240.105 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, John wrote: > Hi. > Just to inform you guys that my dad had no idea about his Crisler AM Stereo radio, with the CD/Cassette. I'm not surprised at all. "Eh, it's a radio." > Turned on WPEN and I go "Can you here the awesome stereo sound? Do you think it sounds better then FM Stereo?" > He goes... "I don't no, I don't know any of the songs that they play on this station." Again, not really all that surprising. > For your info, it was WPEN, and WPHT was doing talk, and x dad doesn't know much Franky baby. Sounds a bit like my mother- She never really cared WHO it was, or what the song was, just as long as she liked it. Great way to sell music, huh? (I never cared for Frank Sinatra, but even at my young age, I know Frankie when I hear him.) > If it wasn't for me, dad would never have a lesson in AM Stereo or radio in any way shape or form! Or could've cared less whether or not it was there. I know the kind. > Dad is most likely one of the public... Sad to say it, but yes. Very typical, very sad. (Is it any wonder that the music industry in America speaks of success in terms of millions, and phenomenal success in the low tens of millions, instead of much more? Many other countries do far better than that, proportionately. The UK, for example. About 70 million there, and the most successful CDs sell upwards to 5 million. Sounds like the US, except the US has nearly 300 million. And don't get me started on newspaper sales.) > Turn on WXPN for wide music selection, cuz Sunny (WSNI) plays the same stuff to much even for him. > And he is more concentrated on the road! > What does that say about CC stations? Or commercial radio in general, nowadays. (I have nothing really against the commercial nature of radio, per se; just what it has become, especially in the hands of corporates. "Community service? What's that?") Sorry, bitter mousie, here. :P Amy. <:3 )~~8~ From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Mar 03 20:50:53 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 4 Mar 2003 04:50:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 26755 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2003 04:50:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Mar 2003 04:50:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Mar 2003 04:50:51 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.146] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 04 Mar 2003 04:50:51 -0000 Date: Tue, 04 Mar 2003 04:50:48 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: WPEN Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20030303214547.029d02b0@pop.GameBox.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 939 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T. " X-Originating-IP: 216.192.79.19 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Turned on WPEN and I go "Can you here the awesome stereo sound? Do > you think it sounds better then FM Stereo?" Speaking of which, 950 WPEN in Philadelphia has not only recently reinstated use of full Stereo separation in their music (after some time of broadcasting only mono audio through their Stereo signal), but I noticed today that they are even taking phone calls in Stereo! When a caller comes on the air, they switch things around so that the DJ's voice is in the right channel only, and the caller's voice is in the left channel only. It's quite attention-catching the first time you hear it! Also, their DJs seem to be IDing the station as "Stereo 95 AM" more than before. Overall, it's nice to see and hear such support for AM Stereo from Greater Media -- a company, BTW, which claims to have plans to upgrade *all* of its stations -- even a 243-watt AM daytimer in NJ -- to IBOC. We'll see about that.... From n0uiheric@aol.com Mon Mar 03 21:51:00 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 4 Mar 2003 05:50:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 22124 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2003 05:50:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Mar 2003 05:50:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m03.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.6) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Mar 2003 05:50:58 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-m03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.1e9.34c576b (4539) for ; Tue, 4 Mar 2003 00:50:44 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1e9.34c576b.2b9598b4@aol.com> Date: Tue, 4 Mar 2003 00:50:44 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC on 710 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih I strongly disagree on one aspect, Amy...most Americans CARE about the sound quality of their programs. Most of the FM stations which maintain top-notch Stereo separation were the non-commercial stations. Why do we need IBOC (it's obvious we don't) when FM Stereo and AM Stereo can do a better job with Stereo separation that approaches CD-quality already? At times, Clear Channel FMs sound like they run pilot tone only, no separation. I took a listen to XM satellite radio, too...I was not impressed in the least. So, I avoided XM and opted for a shortwave converter. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Tue Mar 04 06:23:13 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 4 Mar 2003 14:23:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 25892 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2003 14:23:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Mar 2003 14:23:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14207.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.173.71) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Mar 2003 14:23:02 -0000 Message-ID: <20030304142302.20554.qmail@web14207.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.45.202.244] by web14207.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 04 Mar 2003 06:23:02 PST Date: Tue, 4 Mar 2003 06:23:02 -0800 (PST) Subject: Delco UX-1 Radio? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Cc: ABDX@topica.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio Anybody looking for a Delco UX-1 AM Stereo radio? The XYL has convinced me that if you have one that you don’t need two, so one is up on the block. Cadillac Delco UX-1 – EQ, AMSt PB, etc – it has the smaller GM connectors that they started using in 1989. Please contact me off-list for any other details. Thanks, John P. __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ From JH_Radio@GameBox.net Tue Mar 04 11:56:37 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: JH_Radio@GameBox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 4 Mar 2003 19:56:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 83910 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2003 19:56:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Mar 2003 19:56:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO babyruth.hotpop.com) (204.57.55.14) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Mar 2003 19:56:35 -0000 Received: from gamebox.net (kubrick.hotpop.com [204.57.55.16]) by babyruth.hotpop.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 9C147213539 for ; Tue, 4 Mar 2003 19:56:06 +0000 (UTC) Received: from -enduser.GameBox.net (pcp03184855pcs.benslm01.pa.comcast.net [68.80.77.117]) by smtp-1.hotpop.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BEAFB1A0199 for ; Tue, 4 Mar 2003 19:55:50 +0000 (UTC) Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030304145807.02b043d0@pop.GameBox.net> X-Sender: JH_Radio@pop.GameBox.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Tue, 04 Mar 2003 15:02:00 -0500 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: IBOC on 710 In-Reply-To: References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030303214547.029d02b0@pop.GameBox.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-HotPOP: ----------------------------------------------- Sent By HotPOP.com FREE Email Get your FREE POP email at www.HotPOP.com ----------------------------------------------- From: John X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113800107 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Ya know, the public has no idea. Okay, so Eric posts the articles and other stuff to Sound Off. But how many people do you think go around Reading up on radio articles? My dad surely doesn't, he could care less. And I'm sure that is what the corprit giants are taking advantage of. A. the public has no idea. B. They're of corse not going to do anything to inform t the p public. C. If the public really knew, would there be a change? Or is it really just us radio Geeks? At 03:36 AM 3/4/03 +0000, you wrote: >--- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, John wrote: >> Hi. >> Just to inform you guys that my dad had no idea about his Crisler >AM Stereo radio, with the CD/Cassette. > >I'm not surprised at all. "Eh, it's a radio." > >> Turned on WPEN and I go "Can you here the awesome stereo sound? Do >you think it sounds better then FM Stereo?" >> He goes... "I don't no, I don't know any of the songs that they >play on this station." > >Again, not really all that surprising. > >> For your info, it was WPEN, and WPHT was doing talk, and x dad >doesn't know much Franky baby. > >Sounds a bit like my mother- She never really cared WHO it was, or >what the song was, just as long as she liked it. Great way to sell >music, huh? > >(I never cared for Frank Sinatra, but even at my young age, I know >Frankie when I hear him.) > >> If it wasn't for me, dad would never have a lesson in AM Stereo or >radio in any way shape or form! > >Or could've cared less whether or not it was there. I know the kind. > >> Dad is most likely one of the public... > >Sad to say it, but yes. Very typical, very sad. (Is it any wonder >that the music industry in America speaks of success in terms of >millions, and phenomenal success in the low tens of millions, instead >of much more? Many other countries do far better than that, >proportionately. The UK, for example. About 70 million there, and the >most successful CDs sell upwards to 5 million. Sounds like the US, >except the US has nearly 300 million. And don't get me started on >newspaper sales.) > >> Turn on WXPN for wide music selection, cuz Sunny (WSNI) plays the >same stuff to much even for him. >> And he is more concentrated on the road! >> What does that say about CC stations? > >Or commercial radio in general, nowadays. (I have nothing really >against the commercial nature of radio, per se; just what it has >become, especially in the hands of corporates. "Community service? >What's that?") > >Sorry, bitter mousie, here. :P > >Amy. <:3 )~~8~ > > > > > >Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Love in Christ: John Bensalem, PA Send me an email Aim: RainAngelsRule MSN: RainAngelsRule@hotmail.com My website Welcome to Napster4TheBlind "Prayer does not change God; it changes you." - Authur unknown [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From ai4i@hotmail.com Tue Mar 04 13:19:32 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ai4i@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 4 Mar 2003 21:19:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 46571 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2003 21:19:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Mar 2003 21:19:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf35bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.219) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Mar 2003 21:19:30 -0000 Received: from ai4i ([216.77.218.95]) by imf35bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.25 201-253-122-122-125-20020815) with SMTP id <20030304212131.NQQA14398.imf35bis.bellsouth.net@ai4i> for ; Tue, 4 Mar 2003 16:21:31 -0500 Message-ID: <002001c2e293$bdf4c480$5fda4dd8@ai4i> To: References: <1046809684.1485.94512.m12@yahoogroups.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Digest Number 611 Date: Tue, 4 Mar 2003 16:19:28 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Joel Wilson" Reply-To: "Joel Wilson" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=127893550 X-Yahoo-Profile: ai4ijoel I listened to a new digital wireless phone, but it didn't sound perfect, so I got a huge horn from this guy in the Swiss Alps, in lieu! Joel Wilson Hello Taxi AI4I ========================================= Proud 2-B a pioneering satellite radio subscriber AI4I is always on the trailing edge of technology ========================================= Message: 8 Date: Tue, 4 Mar 2003 00:50:44 EST From: n0uiheric@aol.com Subject: Re: Re: IBOC on 710 I took a listen to XM satellite radio, too...I was not impressed in the least. So, I avoided XM and opted for a shortwave converter. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From alfredot@inetarena.com Tue Mar 04 15:07:40 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: alfredot@inetarena.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 4 Mar 2003 23:06:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 19362 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2003 23:06:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Mar 2003 23:06:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.inetarena.com) (206.129.216.13) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Mar 2003 23:06:49 -0000 Received: from hendrie (1Cust204.tnt15.beaverton.or.da.uu.net [67.227.162.204]) by mail.inetarena.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id h24N3RN09761 for ; Tue, 4 Mar 2003 15:03:38 -0800 (PST) Date: Tue, 4 Mar 2003 15:04:27 -0800 (PST) X-Sender: alfredo@hendrie.1610am.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: IBOC on 710 In-Reply-To: <1046809684.1485.94512.m12@yahoogroups.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII From: "Alfredo E. Torrejon" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=25132238 X-Yahoo-Profile: alfredotorrejon > Ya know, the public has no idea. > Okay, so Eric posts the articles and other stuff to Sound Off. > But how many people do you think go around Reading up on radio articles? > My dad surely doesn't, he could care less. > And I'm sure that is what the corprit giants are taking advantage of. > A. the public has no idea. > B. They're of corse not going to do anything to inform t the p public. > C. If the public really knew, would there be a change? > Or is it really just us radio Geeks? I don't see this as an appropriate forum to discuss programming, but I'll bite on this one. You are 100% right about the public having "no idea." However, I think that the answer to "C" is no. For most people, it doesn't matter what goes on behind the scenes, as long as they can find programming that makes them happy. Here's some anecdotal evidence: * My dad only listens to the NPR staion in his area because it plays classical music. He gets really pissed off when they play jazz, but he knows that there's nowhere else for him to go, so he puts on a tape or turns the radio off if he's listening in the car. He doesn't care for the other FM music stations in his area, since none of them play classical music, and he gave up on AM years ago, after moving away from Buffalo, NY (at the time he liked the news/weather coverage on WBEN-930 and the NPR news programming on WEBR-970). * My brother listens to the modern rock station in his area but complains that the DJs talk too much. He also likes to listen to Neal Boortz on WANI-1400. He once asked me about XM radio and said that he would be willing to pay if he could listen to his favorite music without inane DJ chatter or commercial interruptions. I talked him out of buying an XM unit by telling him that not all of the channels were commercial-free and that they didn't carry Neal Boortz. I'm all for working toward better receiver standards and more community accountability from broadcasters. By community accountability, I mean that since the spectrum space is a limited resource, the stations should "be there" for their communities in times of need (like natural disasters, severe accidents, etc). As far as the general programming goes, though, I think that if the stations don't give listeners what they want, that in itself is a disservice. Although there are certain things that I would like to hear on the radio (like more personality-driven full-service programming), I believe that the one aspect of radio that should be market driven is the programming. Regulating agencies should only step into programming over questions of decency standards, libel/slander, fraudulent advertising, and copyrights. Alfredo From ccuff@in4web.com Tue Mar 04 15:17:46 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 4 Mar 2003 23:17:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 75592 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2003 23:17:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 4 Mar 2003 23:17:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 4 Mar 2003 23:17:43 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [216.221.131.176]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Tue, 4 Mar 2003 18:14:45 -0500 Message-ID: <000501c2e2a2$f10f8260$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: Subject: Iowa again? Date: Tue, 4 Mar 2003 18:08:16 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 I just recieved a nice email from KJAN in Iowa wanting info on radios. It got me thinking about maybe doing one more road trip to Iowa- to both KCJJ and KJAN... how cool would that be? "Field of Dreams" all over again. There is another one in Grinnell, or was, not sure if they still are in stereo, but they sounded great. Can't remember the call letters. It might be worth a try- I did get a lot of positive response form the last trip, and that was only one station. If I take a full week, I could do all 3 stations. (This time, I would drive.... no more flying for me!) Food for thought. Chris From amymousie@yahoo.com Tue Mar 04 16:01:01 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 5 Mar 2003 00:00:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 72266 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2003 00:00:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Mar 2003 00:00:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Mar 2003 00:00:59 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.147] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 05 Mar 2003 00:00:58 -0000 Date: Wed, 05 Mar 2003 00:00:58 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: IBOC on 710 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 4732 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie" X-Originating-IP: 67.115.111.13 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Alfredo E. Torrejon" wrote: > > Ya know, the public has no idea. Of course it doesn't. Nothing to encourage them to find out, either. > > Okay, so Eric posts the articles and other stuff to Sound Off. > > But how many people do you think go around Reading up on radio articles? Not much. Anybody remember "Radio-Electronics"? Most of us here might, since most of us here give a damn about radio technology and elecvtronics. Wasn't enough for the magazine to survive, though. Even magazines like "Popular Communications" and "Monitoring Times" struggle along with circulations in the low tens of thousands-- In a nation of 300 million, that ain't much. Like I said, gone are the days of the hobbyist/tinkerer/experimentor. Even amateur radio has been having a hard time sustaining itself the last couple decades. (I seem to have misplaced my August, 1989 copy of "73" magazine, with the simple NGFM detector circuit, in the article titled "Need FM?" Yes, I did consider becoming a ham once.) > > My dad surely doesn't, he could care less. My experience, most don't. > > And I'm sure that is what the corprit giants are taking advantage of. Yup. > > A. the public has no idea. Correct. > > B. They're of corse not going to do anything to inform t the p public. Of course not! Why rock the boat? > > C. If the public really knew, would there be a change? Nope. It doesn't mean anything to them. > > Or is it really just us radio Geeks? That it is. Look, if people REALLY gave a damn about quality, people would be clamoring for digital TV, even for the price. If it strikes their fancy, they'll pay for ANYTHING, whether it's within their means or not. (Hint: Credit cards.) Instead, people have been rather lackluster about high-definition TV, since the net result of HDTV doesn't mean all that much to them- Just as long as they get their news and sports, and/or their favorite soap opera, they won't care if it's digital or analog, as long as it WORKS. This is why VHS won out over Beta and 8mm for home video- It works fine for what they need. Nothing more, nothing less. Even stereo audio for TV hasn't been as successful as one might think, with only a mere 15% of all TVs and VCRs in America having MTS stereo. My own mother could care less if it's stereo, since she can't even hear in stereo- She lost the use of one of her ears in a tragic car accident many years ago. Doesn't bother her one bit. > I don't see this as an appropriate forum to discuss programming, It is important, as I see it- What's the point of stereo if you don't have something in stereo to broadcast. > but I'll bite on this one. You are 100% right about the public having "no > idea." However, I think that the answer to "C" is no. For most people, > it doesn't matter what goes on behind the scenes, as long as they can find > programming that makes them happy. Here's some anecdotal evidence: Quite correct. That's all most people care about. > I'm all for working toward better receiver standards and more > community accountability from broadcasters. By community accountability, > I mean that since the spectrum space is a limited resource, the stations > should "be there" for their communities in times of need (like natural > disasters, severe accidents, etc). As far as the general programming > goes, though, I think that if the stations don't give listeners what they > want, that in itself is a disservice. Although there are certain things > that I would like to hear on the radio (like more personality-driven > full-service programming), I believe that the one aspect of radio that > should be market driven is the programming. Regulating agencies should > only step into programming over questions of decency standards, > libel/slander, fraudulent advertising, and copyrights. There isn't even any need for regulating agencies for the latter above, since the infrastructure of the legal system already covers these matters. As for community service, THAT does need to be a matter of one's license, but I think it needs to be a joint effort of the community government in the community of license, and the license-issuing agency, in this case, the FCC. Other than the matter of community service, anything pertsaining to the content of stations should NOT be a matter of a Congressional agency (the FCC), as that is a direct infringement on the First Amendment. The FCC should only concern itself with technical and ownership issues, and perhaps leave community responsibility to the community that oversees the station's broadcast area. *Amy falls off her soapbox* *squeek!* Amy. <:3 )~~8~ From stodd@sherbtel.net Tue Mar 04 17:54:22 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 5 Mar 2003 01:54:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 1165 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2003 01:54:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Mar 2003 01:54:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Mar 2003 01:54:19 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-107.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.107]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h251sDle009366 for ; Tue, 4 Mar 2003 19:54:17 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <005701c2e2ba$8c2c40a0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <000501c2e2a2$f10f8260$0101a8c0@pavilion> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Iowa again? Date: Tue, 4 Mar 2003 19:57:10 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude I'd love to join you for at least one station appearance. Please let me know what the schedule is when it materializes. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Christopher Cuff" To: Sent: Tuesday, March 04, 2003 5:08 PM Subject: {AMSF} Iowa again? > I just recieved a nice email from KJAN in Iowa wanting info on radios. It > got me thinking about maybe doing one more road trip to Iowa- to both KCJJ > and KJAN... how cool would that be? > "Field of Dreams" all over again. There is another one in Grinnell, or was, > not sure if they still are in stereo, but they sounded great. Can't remember > the call letters. > It might be worth a try- I did get a lot of positive response form the last > trip, and that was only one station. If I take a full week, I could do all 3 > stations. (This time, I would drive.... no more flying for me!) > Food for thought. > Chris > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Tue Mar 04 19:18:22 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 5 Mar 2003 03:18:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 41288 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2003 03:18:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Mar 2003 03:18:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf35bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.219) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Mar 2003 03:18:14 -0000 Received: from juan ([67.34.24.70]) by imf35bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.25 201-253-122-122-125-20020815) with SMTP id <20030305032016.UYEO14398.imf35bis.bellsouth.net@juan> for ; Tue, 4 Mar 2003 22:20:16 -0500 Message-ID: <002a01c2e2c5$dd230650$af78fea9@juan> To: References: <000501c2e2a2$f10f8260$0101a8c0@pavilion> <005701c2e2ba$8c2c40a0$827dfea9@home1> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Iowa again? Date: Tue, 4 Mar 2003 22:18:15 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Add me too, to an Iowa appearance....I love Iowa, lived there 11 years. Juan ----- Original Message ----- From: Scott Todd To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, March 04, 2003 8:57 PM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Iowa again? I'd love to join you for at least one station appearance. Please let me know what the schedule is when it materializes. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Christopher Cuff" To: Sent: Tuesday, March 04, 2003 5:08 PM Subject: {AMSF} Iowa again? > I just recieved a nice email from KJAN in Iowa wanting info on radios. It > got me thinking about maybe doing one more road trip to Iowa- to both KCJJ > and KJAN... how cool would that be? > "Field of Dreams" all over again. There is another one in Grinnell, or was, > not sure if they still are in stereo, but they sounded great. Can't remember > the call letters. > It might be worth a try- I did get a lot of positive response form the last > trip, and that was only one station. If I take a full week, I could do all 3 > stations. (This time, I would drive.... no more flying for me!) > Food for thought. > Chris [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Mar 04 21:24:17 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 5 Mar 2003 05:24:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 35445 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2003 05:22:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Mar 2003 05:22:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Mar 2003 05:22:35 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.188] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 05 Mar 2003 05:22:35 -0000 Date: Wed, 05 Mar 2003 05:22:32 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: WOR's audio / CC vs. IBOC hash Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1374 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.71.140 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics 710 WOR's audio is now sounding worse than ever, even at night with the IBOC signal off. The audio response they are transmitting has now dropped down to 4 kHz, and even within that constrained bandwidth, sounds significantly duller and more muffled before, apparently because they are now using little or no pre-emphasis. Also, the same "ringing" type of distortion remains in their audio, and doesn't seem to have been reduced, even with the narrower audio bandwidth. Meanwhile, I just discovered this document from our friends at Clear Channel, which illustrates a first-hand experience with the IBOC tests on 1500 WTOP in Washington, DC causing enough interference to wipe out reception of a nearby local station on 1490 kHz because of the digital "hash", even in areas where this station's signal is perfectly listenable when WTOP is transmitting in plain analog mode: http://www.diymedia.net/stuff/ccibocamrept.pdf Clear Channel's write-up basically agrees with what many of us have been saying for a long time -- that even when an IBOC signal is transmitted fully in compliance with the FCC / NRSC regulations, it still causes large amounts of interference to adjacent channels, because the existing rules regarding allocation and transmitted bandwidth of AM stations were only designed to accomodate analog signals, not digital transmissions. From jsgil@hal-pc.org Tue Mar 04 23:42:41 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 5 Mar 2003 07:42:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 49525 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2003 07:42:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Mar 2003 07:42:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.72) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Mar 2003 07:42:40 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.142] by n17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 05 Mar 2003 07:42:40 -0000 Date: Wed, 05 Mar 2003 07:42:39 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: WOR's audio / CC vs. IBOC hash Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1801 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.168 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T." > > Meanwhile, I just discovered this document from our friends at > Clear Channel, which illustrates a first-hand experience with the > IBOC tests on 1500 WTOP in Washington, DC causing enough interference > to wipe out reception of a nearby local station on 1490 kHz because > of the digital "hash", even in areas where this station's signal is > perfectly listenable when WTOP is transmitting in plain analog mode: > > http://www.diymedia.net/stuff/ccibocamrept.pdf > > Clear Channel's write-up basically agrees with what many of us have > been saying for a long time -- that even when an IBOC signal is > transmitted fully in compliance with the FCC / NRSC regulations, it > still causes large amounts of interference to adjacent channels, > because the existing rules regarding allocation and transmitted > bandwidth of AM stations were only designed to accomodate analog > signals, not digital transmissions. Pretty interesting article. It shows that the CC enineers are definitely concerned about the quality of the analog signal. For a corporation that has a many AM stations as they do I'm sure they see that their stations audience could be adversely affected by the IBOC hash. So much so that it could hurt their revenue stream for many of their stations from their other stations or stations owned by the other broadcasters. If further examination of the effects skywave has on an IBOC signal is not done and nighttime IBOC is implemented on a wide scale then I forsee the coming of the hsah wars and lawsuits between the major broadcasters. I don't think any of the major broadcasters want to go down this road. AM radio would not survive this. It would drive many listeners away, never to return. JSG From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Wed Mar 05 01:09:23 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 5 Mar 2003 09:09:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 36748 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2003 09:09:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Mar 2003 09:09:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web41012.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.93.11) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Mar 2003 09:09:21 -0000 Message-ID: <20030305090921.55374.qmail@web41012.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.37.244] by web41012.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 05 Mar 2003 01:09:21 PST Date: Wed, 5 Mar 2003 01:09:21 -0800 (PST) Subject: Upload/WWKB To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio How do I take something from CD and put it on the web. The audio is :19. Also, I noticed two things tonight: 1. WWKB lighting the pilot light and 2. 1680 Jamz clear as day over WTTM. 73, Jay,N1WVQ __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ From ccuff@in4web.com Wed Mar 05 02:04:19 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 5 Mar 2003 10:04:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 39335 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2003 10:04:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Mar 2003 10:04:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Mar 2003 10:04:17 -0000 Received: from Chris1 (unverified [208.228.96.20]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Wed, 5 Mar 2003 05:01:19 -0500 Message-ID: <000701c2e2fe$95cdac90$0d01a8c0@Chris1> To: References: <20030305090921.55374.qmail@web41012.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Upload/WWKB Date: Wed, 5 Mar 2003 05:04:17 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Chris Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 Thats OK- This morning, a station (Spanish type) on 880 completely obliterated WCBS for about 2 minutes. Quite rare given CBS's signal here. CC ----- Original Message ----- From: "JNR" To: Sent: Wednesday, March 05, 2003 4:09 AM > Also, I noticed two things tonight: 1. WWKB > lighting the pilot light and 2. 1680 Jamz clear > as day over WTTM. > > 73, > Jay,N1WVQ From amstereo@optushome.com.au Wed Mar 05 03:11:46 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereo@optushome.com.au X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 5 Mar 2003 11:11:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 60214 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2003 11:11:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Mar 2003 11:11:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail019.syd.optusnet.com.au) (210.49.20.160) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Mar 2003 11:11:13 -0000 Received: from d1200 (c17190.ipswc1.qld.optusnet.com.au [210.49.44.50]) by mail019.syd.optusnet.com.au (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id h25BBCU27717 for ; Wed, 5 Mar 2003 22:11:12 +1100 Message-ID: <000301c2e307$e93695a0$1a02a8c0@d1200> To: References: <1046809684.1485.94512.m12@yahoogroups.com> Subject: possible New digital in band digital method Date: Wed, 5 Mar 2003 21:11:03 +1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "voltare2 - amstereo" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=105920058 X-Yahoo-Profile: voltar_e I've been thinking about the world of digital radio technology. What people want is a system that supports current tecnologies, is cheap to impliment and use, causes minimal interuption with analog audio signals, is simple to operate and works. This is my implimentation (the way i want to see it happen and i belive it could easily be set up) What my method uses is straight out Mp3 128 kbit stereo. it is a system that functions along side C-Quam (because it utilises it as part of the design) and is in such a low latency to the regular audio that time shifting is not required. How it works (transmitter end) what happens here is the host (station) forwards the audio to the transmitter in the usual way, is fed to the stereo generator (standard C-quam exciter running full stereo mode) . what happens at this point is were the fun begins. the digital is picked up (split) just after the stereo processor and fed in both the standard way and in to an Mp3 encoder which outputs the bit-stream in a serial format. this bit stream is then injected in to the l-r audio stream at -6dB and fed over the air phase modulated of course. Radio end the radio tunes in to the station in the regular way. what happens here is what makes my system idea different. The radio starts off the regular way, that is Mono AM reception. It then sits there awaiting the 25Hz pilot tone, upon seeing the pilot it enables C-quam decoding and you have Analog Stereo sound (particuly when levels are clean enough to recieve it and just a tad un clear for the digital to work. After C-quam enables, the final stage begins to work, what occurs here is, the radio is awaiting the 'signature' digital bit stream (havn't worked out at which point this needs to be) How ever when this is seen the radio engages the Mp3 decoder and begins to decode the bitstream which is transformed back to a 18bit(eighteen) PCM stream . this is then fed to the DAC and amplified in the normal way. The changes? encoder at transmitter end injecting data stream to l-r channel -6dB Decoder & Dac at receiver. What is required. The transimmed audio will NEED to be C-QUAM enabled as phase modulation will be required, and C-quam will be the fall back. The digital bit-stream will be at 10kHz (9kHz in all other countries) because it still gets through the front end of the radio(needs to be a good front end) but is blocked by the 10kHz (9) Notch filter (required). this way the stream is not seen to the end user except in rarest circumstances. The end effect C-quam will be used extensivly as the fall back system when the bit stream is broken or not available (Mp3 is a streaming format so mp3 players wont care to much if sync is lost) (more am stereo) Radios will NEED to have High quality sections because ACinterference will cause sync loss and fall back to C-quam (or mono in servere cases). Better AM radios. thats all thats required more or less. the chips are fully available, run on less than 5V (3.6 for the decoder chip) and are easy as to impliment i reacon. in effect the bitstream is there but invisible to mono radios and only a problem with c-quam radios while close enough to the transmitter (in which case it should be in digital mode anyway.) Anyone with enough knowledge willing to test my theories out? I like this idea because it is all ready available chips and implimentation is fairly easy. think about it and tell me what you think. From krichards@wor710.com Wed Mar 05 07:20:41 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 96374 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2003 15:20:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Mar 2003 15:20:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.67) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Mar 2003 15:20:40 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: krichards@wor710.com Received: from [66.218.67.136] by n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 05 Mar 2003 15:20:40 -0000 X-Sender: krichards@wor710.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 5 Mar 2003 14:58:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 66474 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2003 14:58:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Mar 2003 14:58:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO buckleyradio.com) (161.58.14.6) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Mar 2003 14:58:23 -0000 Received: from kerrydesk (pool-162-83-160-52.ny5030.east.verizon.net [162.83.160.52]) by buckleyradio.com (8.12.6) id h25EwMrb010326 for ; Wed, 5 Mar 2003 09:58:23 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <000a01c2e327$0bf1f070$2a01010a@kerrydesk> To: Subject: HD Radio Date: Wed, 5 Mar 2003 09:53:50 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Kerry Richards" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=136545831 X-Yahoo-Profile: kerryrichards710 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-eGroups-Approved-By: kevtronics via web; 05 Mar 2003 15:20:39 -0000 I think Jeff Littlejohn's statements which were made early last year before major testing had been done, obviously point out some real world problems with IBOC. This is what we have been talking about here for months. Time will tell how these issues will be resolved, I think Neal Newman, in his recent measurements point out almost the same data. It is of definite concern, these issues are not settled yet. I am curious how many situations like this there really are out in the real world. I can think of a few, but this is a close one that Jeff mentions in his comments. (1490 KHZ and 1500 KHZ) The other part of the issue is how much protection do we really have to allow our neighbors? Does WLW have the right to blanket the eastern US with or without HD carriers? WLW cannot sell time in NYC, yet should WOR protect their signal at night in our 5 millivolt contour? Likewise should I expect clear coverage of WOR in Cincinnati? These are important questions. But the rules are already clear and established on this issue. That is precisely why we are testing the system for such a long time, and we have tested at various carrier levels, and modes. Nothing has changed on WOR's audio, it is still at 5K, and we are running the full IBOC carriers, during daytime hours. Each month now, more HD Radio systems are coming on line, we will see how all of this unfolds. It will be fun to get one of those new Visteon HD Radios and compare C-Quam to HD and see how the two systems compare. Then we will have some real issues and data to talk about. Kerry Richards Chief Engineer WOR Radio Buckley Broadcasting Corporation [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From kevtronics@yahoo.com Wed Mar 05 07:56:44 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 5 Mar 2003 15:56:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 7848 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2003 15:56:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Mar 2003 15:56:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Mar 2003 15:56:42 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.143] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 05 Mar 2003 15:56:41 -0000 Date: Wed, 05 Mar 2003 15:56:40 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: HD Radio Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <000a01c2e327$0bf1f070$2a01010a@kerrydesk> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1247 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Nothing has changed on WOR's audio, it is still at 5K, and we are > running the full IBOC carriers, during daytime hours. I did a spectrum analysis of WOR's current analog audio and it shows a sharp (although not quite brick-wall-like) drop-off starting at 4 kHz, followed by a strange "peak" of response going up to the 5 kHz "brick wall" -- followed then by the same region of "ringing" distortion up to about 7.5 kHz. Even on a highly selective car radio with a 3 kHz ceramic filter, the difference is noticeable -- the talk show hosts now barely sound any better than the callers, and the "crispness" (at least to the degree that can be achieved with < 5 kHz response) is just no longer there. So, something *has* changed with WOR's analog audio -- whether it be an adjustment of the audio processing, or something within the iBiquity exciter. It's now at the point that the previously used full 5 kHz response with proper pre-emphasis sounded significantly better in comparison -- and for listeners with high-quality AMAX-type radios, switching between what WOR currently sounds like and what the other NYC-area AM stations sound like (with full ~10 kHz response) is like switching from "telephone" to "FM"! From amymousie@yahoo.com Wed Mar 05 10:20:27 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 5 Mar 2003 18:20:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 88231 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2003 18:19:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Mar 2003 18:19:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Mar 2003 18:19:32 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.191] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 05 Mar 2003 18:19:32 -0000 Date: Wed, 05 Mar 2003 18:19:29 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: possible New digital in band digital method Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <000301c2e307$e93695a0$1a02a8c0@d1200> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1081 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie" X-Originating-IP: 67.115.111.13 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "voltare2 - amstereo" wrote: =snip= Thje problems with your system are -at least- twofold, here. First, the codec used. You'd still have to contend with royalty fees for the MP3 data format. A better choice would be OGG Vorbis, which is royalty- and patent-free, as well as being able to deliver better audio with a far tighter compression rate. Secondly, at least, is your assumption of the digital signal being a single frequency. In both DRM and IBOC, the digital carrier is spread across upwards to 64 carriers in parallel, not series, over a (relatively) wide bandwidth. (For IBOC, it's a 5kHz bandwidth carried at 10kHz to 15kHz, sometimes with differing data modulated on either sideband. A better idea would be to mudulate the digital signal -in- the audio in a way that is as unobtrusive as possible (like a slightly-raised background hiss). This way the digital signal wouldn't interfere with any other signal, and a detector could look for the telltail, er tale digital carriers. Amy. <:3 )~~8~ From wa2fnq@optonline.net Wed Mar 05 10:25:10 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: wa2fnq@optonline.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 5 Mar 2003 18:25:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 37881 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2003 18:25:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Mar 2003 18:25:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.78) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Mar 2003 18:25:09 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.179] by n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 05 Mar 2003 18:24:38 -0000 Date: Wed, 05 Mar 2003 18:24:38 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: HD Radio Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <000a01c2e327$0bf1f070$2a01010a@kerrydesk> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 503 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wa2fnq" X-Originating-IP: 24.47.74.230 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=60059615 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa2fnq > It will be fun to get one of those new Visteon HD Radios and compare C-Quam to HD and see how the two systems compare. Then we will have some real issues and data to talk about. Kerry, This will only be a fair test if the Visteon radio has full bandwidth C-Quam. I'd be curious to see if it does. If it doesn't then the real test would be to compare the HD digital against a true, AMax certified AM stereo receiver. You might be surprised. And this is what it's all about.... Jerry WA2FNQ From michaelj@vcn.com Wed Mar 05 11:07:42 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 5 Mar 2003 19:07:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 44354 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2003 19:07:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Mar 2003 19:07:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m3-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.33) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Mar 2003 19:07:40 -0000 Received: from michael (unverified [209.193.86.94]) by m3-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Wed, 5 Mar 2003 12:07:40 -0700 To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} Re: HD Radio Date: Wed, 5 Mar 2003 12:07:38 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Same exact situation with KXNT 840 in Las Vegas. Switching between them and any other AM on the dial sounds like the difference between telephone and FM......or at least telephone and AM. I also thought that I could hear some muddines to 750 KRPX Price, UT last night. They were another one of those mentioned in that article that listed some other markets slated to go HD. A friend of mine in Ogden, Utah says that KLO 1430 there is talking about doing it as well. That kinda comes with a grain of salt, but wouldn't surprise me. I guess we'll wait and see what happens. I can't pick up Price well enough during the day to hear if they're running IBOC or not.....but I recall that before sunset I picked them up pretty good and didn't hear any digital hash on either side of the signal. MJR n WYO [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From fanfare@globility.com Wed Mar 05 11:07:58 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 5 Mar 2003 19:07:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 60268 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2003 19:07:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Mar 2003 19:07:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.86) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Mar 2003 19:07:21 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.249] by n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 05 Mar 2003 19:07:07 -0000 Date: Wed, 05 Mar 2003 19:07:05 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: HD Radio Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 828 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Mr.M S" X-Originating-IP: 64.56.234.83 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "wa2fnq" wrote: > > It will be fun to get one of those new Visteon HD Radios and > compare C-Quam to HD and see how the two systems compare. Then we > will have some real issues and data to talk about. > > Kerry, > > This will only be a fair test if the Visteon radio has full bandwidth > C-Quam. I'd be curious to see if it does. If it doesn't then the real > test would be to compare the HD digital against a true, AMax > certified AM stereo receiver. You might be surprised. > > And this is what it's all about.... > > Jerry WA2FNQ Jerry: I don't think you'll have to go even that far. Just compare the Visteon audio with the MP3's John P. has of 630 CFCO's off-air. The audio, for AM-stereo, is superb. Too bad KABL is no longer in that category. M.S. From michaelj@vcn.com Wed Mar 05 11:11:42 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 5 Mar 2003 19:11:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 69886 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2003 19:11:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Mar 2003 19:11:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m3-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.33) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Mar 2003 19:11:42 -0000 Received: from michael (unverified [209.193.86.94]) by m3-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Wed, 5 Mar 2003 12:11:41 -0700 To: Subject: More stereo (possible) news! Date: Wed, 5 Mar 2003 12:11:39 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Importance: Normal From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo ABC/Disney has purchesed KALL-910 Salt Lake City from ClearChannel. ClearChannel's plan is to drop the classic country format on 700 KWLW and put the former talk programming from KALL on there. And ABC/Disney plans on moving the Radio Disney format from 860 KBEE (Citadel) over to KALL 910. Everyone in this are knows that KALL was one of the BIG TIME AM Stereo stations in Salt Lake. Their slogan for about 10 years was "Kall 910 AM Stereo". KALL's stereo was awesome! They were the 2nd to last station in Salt Lake to finally kill their stereo, and it was pretty much when they stopped having any kind of music content....I want to say it was about 1995 or so. So we KNOW the stereo equipment is available. We can hope and pray that when the disney folks move Radio Disney over to KALL that they'll flip that stereo exciter back on!! They are stereo in many many of the other markets they are in, and even in Los Angeles, when they moved the disney format over to 1110, they turned the stereo exciter back on! Even with the onset of IBOC, let's enjoy C-quam in the meantime! IBOC is still in early testing stages and still has many bugs to be worked out before every station picks it up and starts using it....not to mention there are over a million C-quam AM Stereo receivers out there, and ....well.....ARE there any IBOC receivers out there?? :) MJR n WYO From michaelj@vcn.com Wed Mar 05 11:13:30 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 5 Mar 2003 19:13:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 1998 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2003 19:13:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Mar 2003 19:13:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m3-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.33) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Mar 2003 19:13:16 -0000 Received: from michael (unverified [209.193.86.94]) by m3-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Wed, 5 Mar 2003 12:13:16 -0700 To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} Re: HD Radio Date: Wed, 5 Mar 2003 12:13:14 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit WHOA Marv! Did I miss something?? Is KABL now no longer AM stereo???? That would be a sad situation! MJR n WYO -----Original Message----- From: Mr.M S [mailto:fanfare@globility.com] Sent: Wednesday, March 05, 2003 12:07 PM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: HD Radio Too bad KABL is no longer in that category. M.S. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From philipr@irac.pe.ca Wed Mar 05 11:52:20 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 5 Mar 2003 19:52:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 75824 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2003 19:52:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Mar 2003 19:52:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Mar 2003 19:52:13 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.180] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 05 Mar 2003 19:52:12 -0000 Date: Wed, 05 Mar 2003 19:52:11 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Does the public really care about broadcast sound quality? Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 6345 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking I'll venture into this area: A small percentage of the public doesn't care whether the top end goes up to 2000 Hz or 20,000. Another small percentage can and will pick up on the difference between 14,000 Hz and 17,000 Hz. Based on my knowledge of average Joe and Jane - they do care about sound quality to the extent it is blatantly obvious - AM going up to 3000 Hz on a narrow band radio will be denounced as muddy, while FM, perhaps getting up to 12,000 Hz or so [we're not talking about a great FM section either!] will be greatly preferred. Thus, the mega- droves of Canadian AM stations flipping to FM. All it cost Joe and Jane is the physical effort to flip the bandswitch, and in some cases pull up the whip antenna. If Joe or Jane had to pay some real $ though, they would stay with 3000 Hz. They are not going to buy an expensive receiver, or put up an antenna to get the extra sound quality. Most assume AM is muddy across the board. A few have heard GE SR IIIs and know better. Others have heard it on a factory AM Stereo car radio, and do know better. But, not many. This is why I'm very skeptical about Eureka 147 L-Band DAB here in Canada. Joe and Jane are pretty pleased with FM sound, and really can't tell the difference between FM sound versus CD quality audio. Listening to an FM station that plays CDs direct - rare I acknowledge - and that uses sensible processing - on a top quality Hi-Fi tuner - I can't tell either. Of course, if CXYZ uses the same processor and signal source technology on DAB and FM, I won't be able to tell the difference - except for good old multipath. So, where is the incentive for Joe and Jane Canadian to drop $300 to buy a DAB/FM pocket radio at Radio Shack in order to listen to "so called" CD quality audio restricted to a 10 to 20 mile radius from the transmitter site? Radio needs a committment to quality programming and quality sound - be the best you can be. Mono, stereo, AM, FM, CQUAM, IBOC. Profit is important, but so is the public interest. In the long term, public interest is like a big feedback loop into the ratings book. AM Radio needs a big "Whammy" to shake the public out of its lethargy - a big cheap whammy. A lot of folks do perk up their ears a bit when you say digital - but does digital deliver - and at what cost? The same folks that think stereo just means two speakers also think digital means having a LCD display. In a world of multiple standards on so many things, we may have to resign ourselves to IBOC and Analogue trying to co-exist. IBOC by day, CQUAM by night? DX friendly IBOC? DX friendly IBOC? Does this make as much sense as a kind, peaceloving Saddam Huesin? Or, is it possible? Would it be possible to take IBOC "hash" received in an analogue mode, invert the phase and use the identical hash 180 degrees out of phase to cancel it out? I've heard of carrier current operations where the only way to fight hum was to broadcast a phase shifted replica of the hum, 180 degrees out of phase, thus cancelling the hum. For IBOC to get anywhere, its supporters have to "push the envelope" pardon the pun. Interference to analogue receivers has to be minimized, analogue bandwidth maximized, for the good of the AM band as a whole. CQUAM benefitted form a lot of enhancements over the years. When all is said and done, IBOC may have to be permanently daytime only - but, is that really so bad? A smart receiver, switching between IBOC by day, and DSP enhanced AMAX CQUAM by night, might just make a seemless transistion to Joe and Jane. As I understand it, IBOC does give an ability to help penetrate within the urban concrete jungle. Assuming this is true - when is this most important - daytime? IBOC fighting steel and flouescent lights by day, while DSP enhanced CQUAM contends with the joys and curses of nightime propagation. The smart radio doing all the "thinking", while Joe and Jane just listen, none the wiser. Step one - can a station do a day/night processor bandwidth shift? 5 khz analogue audio bandwidth day to allow IBOC, but 10 khz analogue audio bandwidth at night when IBOC is having a rest? Hmm, if you sound good at night, it shows you care - maybe there is a reason to buy an IBOC rig for the day. But, if you sound, well, sub par at night compared to the competition, who is to say you sound good enough during the day to justify the purchase of a new IBOC capable receiver? Be the best you can be. If you believe in IBOC but are only able to run it by day, be the best you can be and run NRSC 10.2 khz audio by night. If you're running stereo IBOC by day, run CQUAM at night. Be "quasi-hifi" - your best sound - day or night. Be stereo 24 hours a day. Don't think of this a a "dig" to those stations that do this - think of this as positive encouragement! When a station trys IBOC for the right reasons - to sound better, I respect that! But, while IBOC by day may be relatively benign, it has some serious nightime issues. Running wideband CQUAM audio [I'm assuming stereo IBOC by day, so stereo analogue at might just makes sense]at night demonstrates that a station is committed to sounding its best, whatever the limitations of interference or "the ether". Think of your nightime analogue sound as a PR tool to make it clear that you care. An attractive business card that gets passed around well outside your primary market. Given the nightime issue, CQUAM by night could save IBOC by presenting the best possible sound regardless of where the hands of the clock lie. Given receiver availability woes, IBOC could save CQUAM too by generating new interest in AM and getting new receivers out there. The Visteon IBOC/CQUAM car receiver Tom and Kerry have talked about could be the start of things to come. I would argue that most of the public does care about broadcast sound quality - just so long as it doesn't cost extra to them, and doesn't require any effort on their part. They'll pay $50 per month for satellite or cable TV, yet balk at paying $50 one time only for a good "just a radio". With the right persuasion, maybe we can encourage them to spend a little on a one time basis in order to enjoy years of noticeably better sound quality. My "rant" for this week! Phil R. From amymousie@yahoo.com Wed Mar 05 15:21:52 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 5 Mar 2003 23:21:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 5808 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2003 23:21:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 5 Mar 2003 23:21:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 5 Mar 2003 23:21:42 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.248] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 05 Mar 2003 23:21:41 -0000 Date: Wed, 05 Mar 2003 23:21:39 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Does the public really care about broadcast sound quality? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 9238 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie" X-Originating-IP: 67.115.111.13 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Phil Rafuse" wrote: > I'll venture into this area: > > A small percentage of the public doesn't care whether the top end > goes up to 2000 Hz or 20,000. Another small percentage can and will > pick up on the difference between 14,000 Hz and 17,000 Hz. On the former, if that were true, they never would have bought into tiny transistor radios 40 years ago, or be content, today, with worbly streaming audio online. It's only the fussy ones who do care, and are willing to put their money into it. > Based on my knowledge of average Joe and Jane - they do care about > sound quality to the extent it is blatantly obvious - AM going up to > 3000 Hz on a narrow band radio will be denounced as muddy, while FM, > perhaps getting up to 12,000 Hz or so [we're not talking about a > great FM section either!] will be greatly preferred. Thus, the mega- > droves of Canadian AM stations flipping to FM. All it cost Joe and > Jane is the physical effort to flip the bandswitch, and in some > cases pull up the whip antenna. If Joe or Jane had to pay some real > $ though, they would stay with 3000 Hz. They are not going to buy > an expensive receiver, or put up an antenna to get the extra sound > quality. Most assume AM is muddy across the board. A few have > heard GE SR IIIs and know better. Others have heard it on a factory > AM Stereo car radio, and do know better. But, not many. I must respecfully disagree. Had people cared about AM radio as you think they would, they would have raised hell about it 30+ years ago, and would've kept the pressure on manufacturers to build a better product. We all know they haven't, and the average radio listener never complains. And the manufacturers know that, so most radios sold these days are muddy, lackluster. And I rarely hear anybody mention stereo-- Hell, if people cared about stereophonics, there woulod've been much more effort to study or use stereophonics in music and presentations centuries ago. Instead, the first papers on stereophonics weren't even published or experimented on until the 1880s, long after studies on visual perception or other forms of sensory perception. > This is why I'm very skeptical about Eureka 147 L-Band DAB here in > Canada. Joe and Jane are pretty pleased with FM sound, and really > can't tell the difference between FM sound versus CD quality audio. That is quite true. > Listening to an FM station that plays CDs direct - rare I > acknowledge - and that uses sensible processing - on a top quality > Hi-Fi tuner - I can't tell either. Of course, if CXYZ uses the same > processor and signal source technology on DAB and FM, I won't be > able to tell the difference - except for good old multipath. So, > where is the incentive for Joe and Jane Canadian to drop $300 to buy > a DAB/FM pocket radio at Radio Shack in order to listen to "so > called" CD quality audio restricted to a 10 to 20 mile radius from > the transmitter site? 10-20 miles is not that small! Otherwise, no, there really isn't much incentive for the average public to go digital, but as I've said, the cost to the consumer isn't that much of a barrier- It all goes on credit cards. Basically, for most, if it works, why bother? And if it's mediocre, it's not important. Thnose that do care, will, and will spend the money to prove it. That's why there are always companies that make money off so- called "audiophiles". AM is imperfect and noisy, but that's no reason to be down about AM- We all know AM can sound great, and we all know it doesn't need to take any effort -to- make AM sound great. But for most, it isn'tr the sound quality that drives people to listen to radio- It's the programming. And radio, -regardless- of content, is poorly programmed. (Note: I will not get into music styles. That's actually irrelevant. However, regardless whether it's jazz or rap, if it's poorly programmed, it'll be poorly listened to. And I like most forms of music, but gee, whoever programs any of this stuff are doing a poor job of it!) > Radio needs a committment to quality programming and quality sound - > be the best you can be. Mono, stereo, AM, FM, CQUAM, IBOC. Profit > is important, but so is the public interest. In the long term, > public interest is like a big feedback loop into the ratings book. > AM Radio needs a big "Whammy" to shake the public out of its > lethargy - a big cheap whammy. A lot of folks do perk up their ears > a bit when you say digital - but does digital deliver - and at what > cost? The same folks that think stereo just means two speakers also > think digital means having a LCD display. Like I said, sound doesn't seem to have that much importance. But you're right about programming- If you want listeners, even to rap or alternative, improve your programming! Do that, and your listeners will think of your station as a class act! If I could hear Neal's WTTM here on the west coast, in glorious AM stereo, I would, since it sounds to me he and his stationj know what they're doing, and I would call them a "class act", based on what little I've heard, MP3-wise. > In a world of multiple standards on so many things, we may have to > resign ourselves to IBOC and Analogue trying to co-exist. IBOC by > day, CQUAM by night? DX friendly IBOC? It's like a bad apple in a barrel- If it starts getting rancid, it's going to take down the whoile bunch. With IBOC, if they made3 the system as inoffensive as possible, in terms of interference, at the very least, yes, I could see IBOC and C-QUAM co-existing. Unfortunately, IBOC will be like indigestion, and spoil the experience for the rest of us. Too bad the corporates speak with what they claim as our best interests in mind. Oh, and IBOC has been experimented and proposed and tested for nearly 7 years now. None of the AM stereo standards proposed in 1959/1979/1982 needed that long to "work the bugs out". > DX friendly IBOC? Does this make as much sense as a kind, > peaceloving Saddam Huesin? Or, is it possible? If they used what DRM uses, perhaps- It can be done, but.... Even DRM has its own digital-dropout problems, but it IS DXable. > Would it be possible to take IBOC "hash" received in an analogue > mode, invert the phase and use the identical hash 180 degrees out of > phase to cancel it out? I've heard of carrier current operations > where the only way to fight hum was to broadcast a phase shifted > replica of the hum, 180 degrees out of phase, thus cancelling the > hum. Probably not- You'd have to predict the hash (which is unpredictable, insofar as content), unlike hum which is predictable. Which reminds me: Anyone else remember having radios and recorders with hum control pots? I do, and have the radios and R2R machines to prove it. > For IBOC to get anywhere, its supporters have to "push the envelope" > pardon the pun. Interference to analogue receivers has to be > minimized, analogue bandwidth maximized, for the good of the AM band > as a whole. CQUAM benefitted form a lot of enhancements over the > years. When all is said and done, IBOC may have to be permanently > daytime only - but, is that really so bad? A smart receiver, > switching between IBOC by day, and DSP enhanced AMAX CQUAM by night, > might just make a seemless transistion to Joe and Jane. As I > understand it, IBOC does give an ability to help penetrate within > the urban concrete jungle. Assuming this is true - when is this > most important - daytime? IBOC fighting steel and flouescent lights > by day, while DSP enhanced CQUAM contends with the joys and curses > of nightime propagation. The smart radio doing all the "thinking", > while Joe and Jane just listen, none the wiser. DSP is a good idea, but the thinking tinkerer in me would want to build something that doesn't rely on non-generic ICs. As for IBOC in the day, C-QUAM at night, there have been several proposals to make multimode radios that can do just that, but it was deemed impractical. Trouble is, IBOC spoils the experience, and Joe and Jane Blow isn't going to think of the day/night thing. > I would argue that most of the public does care about broadcast > sound quality - just so long as it doesn't cost extra to them, and > doesn't require any effort on their part. They'll pay $50 per month > for satellite or cable TV, yet balk at paying $50 one time only for > a good "just a radio". With the right persuasion, maybe we can > encourage them to spend a little on a one time basis in order to > enjoy years of noticeably better sound quality. In that, I still must beg to differ. Right now, the most successful AM radio on the market is the "C.C. Radio" from C.Crane & Co., which sells for US$160. And it is crap-sounding. But people WILL pay for it, with the promise of good DX of their favorite regional stations. Especially talk radio- It's designed to work with voice broadcasts, not music. People like convenience, rather than quality, it seems. If it were otherwise, radio wouldn't be the mess that it is, now. And it is a mess. Amy. <:3 )~~8~ From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Mar 05 18:10:57 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 6 Mar 2003 02:10:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 35440 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2003 02:10:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Mar 2003 02:10:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Mar 2003 02:10:44 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-150.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.150]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h262Afle003503 for ; Wed, 5 Mar 2003 20:10:42 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <004001c2e386$03626ca0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Does the public really care about broadcast sound quality? Date: Wed, 5 Mar 2003 20:13:41 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Only one problem- the huge cost to the broadcaster to have each system in place. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Phil Rafuse" > > Given the nightime issue, CQUAM by night could save IBOC by > presenting the best possible sound regardless of where the hands of > the clock lie. Given receiver availability woes, IBOC could save > CQUAM too by generating new interest in AM and getting new receivers > out there. From amymousie@yahoo.com Wed Mar 05 19:04:17 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 6 Mar 2003 03:04:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 60419 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2003 03:04:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Mar 2003 03:04:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Mar 2003 03:04:17 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.190] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Mar 2003 03:03:57 -0000 Date: Thu, 06 Mar 2003 03:03:56 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Does the public really care about broadcast sound quality? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <004001c2e386$03626ca0$827dfea9@home1> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 209 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie" X-Originating-IP: 67.115.111.13 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Scott Todd" wrote: > Only one problem- the huge cost to the broadcaster to have each system in > place. Especially for the cost of IBOC. Amy. <:3 )~~8~ From kevtronics@yahoo.com Wed Mar 05 20:30:26 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 6 Mar 2003 04:30:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 31955 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2003 04:30:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Mar 2003 04:30:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Mar 2003 04:30:26 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.172] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Mar 2003 04:30:22 -0000 Date: Thu, 06 Mar 2003 04:30:18 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Does the public really care about broadcast sound quality? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <004001c2e386$03626ca0$827dfea9@home1> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 823 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.67.17 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Only one problem- the huge cost to the broadcaster to have each > system in place. At the heart of an IBOC exciter is a PC running Linux. This PC doesn't care whether it has been programmed to generate an IBOC signal, or a C-Quam signal, or Kahn PowerSide, or whatever. Once you get things down to an all-digital level, the only consideration is how the computer code is programmed. The added cost for using each system would be negligible, once the main infrastructure is in place. And more importantly, if IBOC turns out to be a flop, this gives stations somewhat of a safety net, in that at least *theoretically*, it would be very easy to reprogram existing IBOC exciters to start generating C-Quam AM Stereo, or whatever other system they want to use -- even future digital systems if they come along. From ai4i@hotmail.com Wed Mar 05 20:55:32 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ai4i@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 6 Mar 2003 04:55:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 34104 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2003 04:55:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Mar 2003 04:55:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (207.68.164.95) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Mar 2003 04:55:31 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 5 Mar 2003 20:55:31 -0800 To: References: <1046907728.1226.55672.m12@yahoogroups.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Digest Number 612 Date: Wed, 5 Mar 2003 23:55:25 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 06 Mar 2003 04:55:31.0347 (UTC) FILETIME=[9D501630:01C2E39C] From: "Joel Wilson" Reply-To: "Joel Wilson" X-Originating-IP: [216.77.209.153] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=127893550 X-Yahoo-Profile: ai4ijoel Let me set your bro straight! Joel Wilson Hello Taxi AI4I ================================= Proud 2-B a pioneering satellite radio subscriber AI4I is always on the trailing edge of technology ================================= > I talked him out of buying an XM > unit by telling him that not all of the channels were commercial-free and > that they didn't carry Neal Boortz. > > Alfredo From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Wed Mar 05 22:00:11 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 6 Mar 2003 06:00:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 83397 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2003 06:00:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Mar 2003 06:00:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web41003.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.93.2) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Mar 2003 06:00:10 -0000 Message-ID: <20030306060010.92460.qmail@web41003.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.37.244] by web41003.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 05 Mar 2003 22:00:10 PST Date: Wed, 5 Mar 2003 22:00:10 -0800 (PST) Subject: Change needed for AM Stereo website To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio WLWL/770 Rockingham, N.C. has a Beach Music format and goes by "77 Big Waves." 73, Jay,N1WVQ __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ From jsgil@hal-pc.org Thu Mar 06 01:26:08 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 6 Mar 2003 09:26:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 81116 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2003 09:26:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Mar 2003 09:26:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Mar 2003 09:26:07 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.188] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Mar 2003 09:26:07 -0000 Date: Thu, 06 Mar 2003 09:26:03 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Does the public really care about broadcast sound quality? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 949 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.1 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T." wrote: > > And more importantly, if IBOC turns out to be a flop, this gives > stations somewhat of a safety net, in that at least *theoretically*, > it would be very easy to reprogram existing IBOC exciters to start > generating C-Quam AM Stereo, or whatever other system they want to > use -- even future digital systems if they come along. For both computer based exciters and DSP receivers offer the best flexibility to adapt to any type of system. It could even be used to develop a 2nd generation C-QuAM system that would further improve reception quality while also reducing spectrum spread. Maximize modulation without clipping and asymetrical sideband control to help reduce interference to a 1st adjacent on only one side of the carrier. Once the signal is in digital form it can be mathematically manipulated to accomplish almost any type of processing. JSG From amymousie@yahoo.com Thu Mar 06 11:49:47 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 6 Mar 2003 19:49:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 99842 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2003 19:49:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 6 Mar 2003 19:49:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 6 Mar 2003 19:49:46 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.182] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 06 Mar 2003 19:49:46 -0000 Date: Thu, 06 Mar 2003 19:49:44 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: AM stereo stuff Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 110 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie" X-Originating-IP: 64.175.245.63 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie Hmm, someone's been busy uploading AM stereo related stuff. ftp://209.193.86.116/usa/misc/ Amy. <:3 )~~8~ From michaelj@vcn.com Thu Mar 06 16:09:07 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 7 Mar 2003 00:09:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 42255 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2003 00:09:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Mar 2003 00:09:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m3-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.33) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Mar 2003 00:09:05 -0000 Received: from michael (unverified [209.193.86.18]) by m3-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Thu, 6 Mar 2003 17:09:05 -0700 To: Subject: Conversion help Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2003 17:08:52 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello gents Got a technical question for some of ya....I know it's a simple one, but something I don't know a lot about and don't want to blow anything up. Have pretty much done a successful conversion on a Panasonic boombox that I have. This boombox has the Toshiba all-in-one combo AM/FM tuner chip ... the TA8127N chip. Everything is good. Well...almost. I found, that when I connect the decoder to a 12V source, it is wonderful and sounds great. But when I do that, the only 12V source is the main 12V in and it's "on" all the time....so you can always hear it...even when the radio is switched into FM mode. This is analog tuning by the way. Now then, with this chip, the radio will send +5V to pin 11 when the switch is in AM mode, and nothing when it's switched to FM mode. This is a great way to turn the decoder on and off. Except that this decoder does NOT like 5V. Yeah, it tries to work, but it warbles and grunts and shuts off and stuff....it's not happy. Here's what I would like to do. Can I use a transistor to listen for that 5V, and then when it hears that 5V, it'll turn itself on, and in turn I can have the 12V going into another pin on it, which will then provide the 12V my decoder needs. I wanna say a 2n222 type will work, but I'm not sure, and don't remember which are which as for cathode, emitter, base, and how to tell. It's been a while since I played with transistors. Can y'all help me out here?? :) Thanks Michael n WYO -----Original Message----- From: amymousie [mailto:amymousie@yahoo.com] Sent: Thursday, March 06, 2003 12:50 PM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} AM stereo stuff Hmm, someone's been busy uploading AM stereo related stuff. ftp://209.193.86.116/usa/misc/ Amy. <:3 )~~8~ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From matthew.trim@eds.com Thu Mar 06 17:06:02 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: matthew.trim@eds.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 7 Mar 2003 01:06:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 86817 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2003 01:06:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Mar 2003 01:06:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO ns5.eds.com) (207.169.189.136) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Mar 2003 01:06:00 -0000 Received: from nnsy.eds.com (nnsy.eds.com [192.85.216.78]) by ns5.eds.com (8.11.6/8.11.1) with ESMTP id h2715ww07803 for ; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 12:05:58 +1100 (EST) Received: from nnsy.eds.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by nnsy.eds.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2715pK21174 for ; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 12:05:51 +1100 (EST) Received: from ausym000.exau01.exch.eds.com ([134.251.177.117]) by nnsy.eds.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h2715nG21162 for ; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 12:05:50 +1100 (EST) Received: by AUSYM000 with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 12:05:10 +1100 Message-ID: <33CDDBD8CAEFEB4191ABF6F799032AF238D7E8@aubwm206> To: "'amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com'" Subject: Cheap Wideband AM Radio with Stereo Headphone Socket and 3V DC In put Jack!: PS-303 Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2003 12:05:46 +1100 Importance: high X-Priority: 1 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-Type: text/plain From: "Trim, Matthew L" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88615102 X-Yahoo-Profile: bofh2k2000 http://www.precison-radio.com/cgi-bin/ngen_details.pl?UCODE=394361&LANG=&LOO P=PROD I bought one at my local discount store - $12.95AUD - yes it appears to be very similar to a radio Sony sell. Plenty of room in the case for a decoder board. There is one IC inside, which I believe would just be an amplifier although I could be wrong - Part # CD1191CB - the other marking on the chip is GR1 DSF019 A lot of discrete electronics and coils and seems very wideband - I will make a few WAV files for Kevin to analyse. Cheers, Matt From stodd@sherbtel.net Thu Mar 06 17:52:46 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 7 Mar 2003 01:52:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 99853 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2003 01:52:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Mar 2003 01:52:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Mar 2003 01:52:44 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-97.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.97]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h271qfle003969 for ; Thu, 6 Mar 2003 19:52:42 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <006301c2e44c$ab256fc0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Conversion help Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2003 19:55:42 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Yep- depending upon how much current that switched 5v will allow, you might even be able to use a 5v DIP relay without a transistor. Otherwise use a PNP transistor with the emitter to Vcc, base to the switched 5v (might want to put a 500-1K resistor in the base circuit) and collector to the decoder. If a single transistor doesn't provide enough current, use a driver transistor where the driver Q: emitter to ground; base to switched 5v through about 1K; collector to the base of the first transistor through maybe 220 ohms or less. As for determining EBC- depends entirely upon the type used. Use a standard ohmmeter to check. B-C resistance will be ever so slightly less than B-E junction resistance, but still discernable even on an analog meter. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael J. Richard" > Can I use a transistor to listen for that > 5V, and then when it hears that 5V, it'll turn itself on, and in turn I can > have the 12V going into another pin on it, which will then provide the 12V > my decoder needs. From stodd@sherbtel.net Thu Mar 06 17:56:31 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 7 Mar 2003 01:56:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 88098 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2003 01:56:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Mar 2003 01:56:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Mar 2003 01:56:28 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-97.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.97]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h271uOle005080 for ; Thu, 6 Mar 2003 19:56:25 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <007901c2e44d$3039bc20$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <006301c2e44c$ab256fc0$827dfea9@home1> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Conversion help Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2003 19:59:26 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Forgot a detail- the driver transistor in the second example is NPN. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Scott Todd" > Yep- depending upon how much current that switched 5v will allow, you might > even be able to use a 5v DIP relay without a transistor. Otherwise use a > PNP transistor with the emitter to Vcc, base to the switched 5v (might want > to put a 500-1K resistor in the base circuit) and collector to the decoder. > If a single transistor doesn't provide enough current, use a driver > transistor where the driver Q: emitter to ground; base to switched 5v > through about 1K; collector to the base of the first transistor through > maybe 220 ohms or less. As for determining EBC- depends entirely upon the > type used. From rwagoner1@mac.com Thu Mar 06 23:20:54 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner1@mac.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 7 Mar 2003 07:20:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 26424 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2003 07:20:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Mar 2003 07:20:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO fed1mtao01.cox.net) (68.6.19.244) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Mar 2003 07:20:53 -0000 Received: from mac.com ([68.4.33.253]) by fed1mtao01.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20030307072050.KEPV23711.fed1mtao01.cox.net@mac.com> for ; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 02:20:50 -0500 Message-ID: <3E684856.3010805@mac.com> Date: Thu, 06 Mar 2003 23:20:54 -0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20021120 Netscape/7.01 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Cheap Wideband AM Radio with Stereo Headphone Socket and 3V DC In put Jack!: PS-303 References: <33CDDBD8CAEFEB4191ABF6F799032AF238D7E8@aubwm206> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Richard Wagoner X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135738921 X-Yahoo-Profile: richardalanwagoner > http://www.precison-radio.com/cgi-bin/ngen_details.pl?UCODE=394361&LANG=&LOO > > P=PROD Interesting. No expanded band. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Mar 06 23:32:24 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 7 Mar 2003 07:32:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 34372 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2003 07:32:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Mar 2003 07:32:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Mar 2003 07:32:24 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.154] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 07 Mar 2003 07:32:23 -0000 Date: Fri, 07 Mar 2003 07:32:21 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: 1380 in NYC sold to AM Stereo-friendly corp. Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1003 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.89.133 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics New York City's 1380 WLXE, best known for many years as WKDM and then briefly as WNNY, has been sold for $47 million from Mega Broadcasting back to its previous owner, Multicultural Media Broadcasting, which owns a number of AM Stereo stations in the area, including 930 WPAT, 1430 WNSW, and 1680 WTTM. During Multicultural's previous ownership of 1380, then known as WKDM, the station broadcast in full AM Stereo. Corresponding with its sale to Mega a few years ago, and a switch to an ill-fated Spanish all-news format as WNNY, the station ceased Stereo broadcasts. Today it continues to be in mono, despite a recent switch to a Mexican music format as WLXE "La X". Following the trend of other Multicultural-owned stations, here's hoping that 1380 in NYC returns to broadcasting in AM Stereo. As I understand it, the current "La X" music format is quite popular, so it will only be to their benefit to enable at least some of their listeners to hear it in high fidelity AM Stereo. From amymousie@yahoo.com Thu Mar 06 23:41:41 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 7 Mar 2003 07:41:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 37863 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2003 07:41:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Mar 2003 07:41:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Mar 2003 07:41:40 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.136] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 07 Mar 2003 07:41:40 -0000 Date: Fri, 07 Mar 2003 07:41:39 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: =?iso-8859-1?q?Re:_{AMSF}_Cheap_Wideband_AM_Radio_with_Stereo_Headphone_Socket_and_3V_DC_In=09put_Jack!:__PS-303?= Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3E684856.3010805@mac.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 346 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie" X-Originating-IP: 67.118.16.36 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, Richard Wagoner wrote: > > http://www.precison-radio.com/cgi-bin/ngen_details.pl? UCODE=394361&LANG=&LOO > > > > P=PROD > > > Interesting. No expanded band. No expanded band in Australia. Amy. <:3 )~~8~ From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Mar 07 00:41:25 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 7 Mar 2003 08:41:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 8301 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2003 08:41:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Mar 2003 08:41:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.66) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Mar 2003 08:41:25 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.187] by n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 07 Mar 2003 08:41:24 -0000 Date: Fri, 07 Mar 2003 08:41:21 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Cheap Wideband AM Radio with Stereo Headphone Socket and 3V DC Input Jack!: PS-303 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 859 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.89.133 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > No expanded band in Australia. ...Except for low-power (TIS-like) stations. I've heard of one transmitting on or near 1660 kHz. Also, I wonder if the U.S.'s Expanded Band regulation specifically requires manual-tuning radios to show some indication of 1700 or 1710 kHz at the top of the dial? I.e., can the dial markings stop at 1600 kHz, but the radio continues to tune past that point, just like many pre-E.B. radios? I also question whether or not use of IBOC on 1700 kHz is legal at all, since the upper digital sidebands would extend up to 1715 kHz, beyond the range allocated to U.S. AM broadcasting (1710 kHz is only used for TISes in the USA -- and only *one* of them in the entire country, to be exact -- which are allocated a +/- 3 kHz audio bandwidth, thus the official top end of the AM band in the USA is effectively 1713 kHz). From ccuff@in4web.com Fri Mar 07 00:41:28 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 7 Mar 2003 08:41:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 50300 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2003 08:41:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Mar 2003 08:41:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Mar 2003 08:41:27 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [216.221.137.216]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 03:38:33 -0500 Message-ID: <003901c2e484$0698fa20$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: <006301c2e44c$ab256fc0$827dfea9@home1> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Conversion help Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2003 03:32:00 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 Use a digital switching transistor- a DTA143 will work great. Hook it up as Scott said. CC ----- Original Message ----- From: Scott Todd To: Sent: Thursday, March 06, 2003 8:55 PM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Conversion help From groucho@skyweb.net Fri Mar 07 01:16:01 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 7 Mar 2003 09:16:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 17148 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2003 09:16:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Mar 2003 09:16:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Mar 2003 09:16:00 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (tc1-67.skyweb.net [66.6.130.195]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h279QOKV036471 for ; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 04:26:24 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3E6860E0.427B5499@skyweb.net> Date: Fri, 07 Mar 2003 04:05:36 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} 1380 in NYC sold to AM Stereo-friendly corp. References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 That May Be But If I know My Boss(HC) Kevin He didn't want me to Put WTTM back in Stereo, But I did It anyway... Now If he(HC) will be the one Engineering the station. I highly Doubt It will return to AM stereo.. If I was the Engineer I would ..... but that's the way it Goes.. Neal "Kevin T." wrote: > New York City's 1380 WLXE, best known for many years as WKDM and then > briefly as WNNY, has been sold for $47 million from Mega Broadcasting > back to its previous owner, Multicultural Media Broadcasting, which > owns a number of AM Stereo stations in the area, including 930 WPAT, > 1430 WNSW, and 1680 WTTM. > > During Multicultural's previous ownership of 1380, then known as > WKDM, the station broadcast in full AM Stereo. Corresponding with > its sale to Mega a few years ago, and a switch to an ill-fated > Spanish all-news format as WNNY, the station ceased Stereo > broadcasts. Today it continues to be in mono, despite a recent > switch to a Mexican music format as WLXE "La X". > > Following the trend of other Multicultural-owned stations, here's > hoping that 1380 in NYC returns to broadcasting in AM Stereo. As I > understand it, the current "La X" music format is quite popular, so > it will only be to their benefit to enable at least some of their > listeners to hear it in high fidelity AM Stereo. > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From jsgil@hal-pc.org Fri Mar 07 01:18:58 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 7 Mar 2003 09:18:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 41509 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2003 09:18:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Mar 2003 09:18:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Mar 2003 09:18:57 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.179] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 07 Mar 2003 09:18:57 -0000 Date: Fri, 07 Mar 2003 09:18:53 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Conversion help Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2553 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.20 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Michael J. Richard" wrote: I thought I heard that the mini decoders use a 5V reg. If this is the case then you might be able to eliminate the regulator and send the switched 5V directly to the decoder if it can supply ~15mA. You probably want to filter the 5V through a 33ohm resistor and then a large cap >=100uf to ground to remove any ripple. JSG > Hello gents > Got a technical question for some of ya....I know it's a simple one, but > something I don't know a lot about and don't want to blow anything up. > > Have pretty much done a successful conversion on a Panasonic boombox that I > have. This boombox has the Toshiba all-in-one combo AM/FM tuner chip ... > the TA8127N chip. Everything is good. Well...almost. I found, that when I > connect the decoder to a 12V source, it is wonderful and sounds great. But > when I do that, the only 12V source is the main 12V in and it's "on" all the > time....so you can always hear it...even when the radio is switched into FM > mode. This is analog tuning by the way. Now then, with this chip, the > radio will send +5V to pin 11 when the switch is in AM mode, and nothing > when it's switched to FM mode. This is a great way to turn the decoder on > and off. Except that this decoder does NOT like 5V. Yeah, it tries to > work, but it warbles and grunts and shuts off and stuff....it's not happy. > Here's what I would like to do. Can I use a transistor to listen for that > 5V, and then when it hears that 5V, it'll turn itself on, and in turn I can > have the 12V going into another pin on it, which will then provide the 12V > my decoder needs. I wanna say a 2n222 type will work, but I'm not sure, and > don't remember which are which as for cathode, emitter, base, and how to > tell. It's been a while since I played with transistors. Can y'all help me > out here?? :) > > Thanks > Michael n WYO > > -----Original Message----- > From: amymousie [mailto:amymousie@y...] > Sent: Thursday, March 06, 2003 12:50 PM > To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com > Subject: {AMSF} AM stereo stuff > > > Hmm, someone's been busy uploading AM stereo related stuff. > > ftp://209.193.86.116/usa/misc/ > > Amy. <:3 )~~8~ > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor > > > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From groucho@skyweb.net Fri Mar 07 01:19:25 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 7 Mar 2003 09:19:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 78274 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2003 09:19:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Mar 2003 09:19:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Mar 2003 09:19:24 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (tc1-67.skyweb.net [66.6.130.195]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h279TmKV037146 for ; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 04:29:48 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3E68619D.59C1354D@skyweb.net> Date: Fri, 07 Mar 2003 04:08:45 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Cheap Wideband AM Radio with Stereo Headphone Socket and 3V DC Input Jack!: PS-303 References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Well to answer that Question THis would Probably Be one of those many Stations that would only Be allowed to Run the IBOC on its Lower sideband.. therefore having No redundancy to the IBOC signal. Again why Even Bother with it.. Neal > > I also question whether or not use of IBOC on 1700 kHz is legal at > all, since the upper digital sidebands would extend up to 1715 kHz, > beyond the range allocated to U.S. AM broadcasting (1710 kHz is only > used for TISes in the USA -- and only *one* of them in the entire > country, to be exact -- which are allocated a +/- 3 kHz audio > bandwidth, thus the official top end of the AM band in the USA is > effectively 1713 kHz). > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Fri Mar 07 06:20:50 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 7 Mar 2003 14:20:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 24288 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2003 14:20:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Mar 2003 14:20:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14205.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.151) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Mar 2003 14:20:44 -0000 Message-ID: <20030307142043.3626.qmail@web14205.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.45.202.244] by web14205.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 07 Mar 2003 06:20:43 PST Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2003 06:20:43 -0800 (PST) Subject: AM Stereo radio available To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio If anybody is still looking for an AM Stereo Delco UX-1, it is still available. It does INCLUDE the Expanded Band up to 1710 KHz, as well as autoreverse cassette, 5-band EQ, etc... Will e-mail photos if requested. __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Fri Mar 07 06:24:47 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 7 Mar 2003 14:24:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 34021 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2003 14:24:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Mar 2003 14:24:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14207.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.173.71) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Mar 2003 14:24:45 -0000 Message-ID: <20030307142445.61702.qmail@web14207.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.45.202.244] by web14207.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 07 Mar 2003 06:24:45 PST Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2003 06:24:45 -0800 (PST) Subject: Buzz on 1210, 1690 - what is it? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio Thursday night I was getting a constant 'buzzing' sound on 1210 KHz over the stereo Big Talker, as well as on stereo 1690 KHz. Is anybody else in the Ohio Valley have the same to report or ideas as to what it's coming from? It doesn't sound like the same "hiss" as from daytime IBOC as it is more of a buzzing sound - but the buzzing isn't on any adjacents - so what is it? __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ From michaelj@vcn.com Fri Mar 07 06:36:30 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 7 Mar 2003 14:36:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 16609 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2003 14:36:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Mar 2003 14:36:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m3-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.33) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Mar 2003 14:36:29 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m3-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Fri, 7 Mar 2003 07:36:29 -0700 Message-ID: <001301c2e4b6$f0a01900$0701010a@keva> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Conversion help Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2003 07:36:28 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I would have thought so too. This is one of the earlier decoders the Chris built. The regulator on it looks like a transistor. This is the same decoder that I emailed the list about a while back. That receiver died, so I pulled out the decoder and decided to put it in my Panasonic Boombox. I'll have to check the output of that regulator and see what it's actually putting out. Maybe it needs a good 9V or 12V to actually put out a full steady 5V. On the other reciever the voltage to it was actually about 7V. Yet, it never worked right until I hooked it up to a 12V source. Chris, does any of this make sense for this decoder? Oh..on this conversion, it is MAJOR MAJOR sensitive. It is VERY flaky about locking in to stereo. This is the first analog tuning project I've done. Is this normal? I would have thought these decoders...using the newer chips...would be a lot less sensitive and just pop in when you're anywhere near the signal. MJR n WYO ----- Original Message ----- From: jsgilst To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 2:18 AM Subject: {AMSF} Re: Conversion help I thought I heard that the mini decoders use a 5V reg. If this is the case then you might be able to eliminate the regulator and send the switched 5V directly to the decoder if it can supply ~15mA. You probably want to filter the 5V through a 33ohm resistor and then a large cap >=100uf to ground to remove any ripple. JSG [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Fri Mar 07 10:18:26 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 7 Mar 2003 18:18:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 10477 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2003 18:17:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Mar 2003 18:17:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web41012.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.93.11) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Mar 2003 18:17:23 -0000 Message-ID: <20030307181723.24850.qmail@web41012.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.37.244] by web41012.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 07 Mar 2003 10:17:23 PST Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2003 10:17:23 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: {AMSF} 1380 in NYC sold to AM Stereo-friendly corp. To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: <3E6860E0.427B5499@skyweb.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio He didn't want WTTM in stereo? What's wrong with him? Was he dropped on his head as a baby? Was he brainwashed? This is a serious issue! I think we may be able to help him despite his obvious mental problems. 73, Jay,N1WVQ __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ From jsgil@hal-pc.org Fri Mar 07 12:14:53 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 7 Mar 2003 20:14:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 48132 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2003 20:14:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Mar 2003 20:14:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.75) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Mar 2003 20:14:15 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.143] by n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 07 Mar 2003 20:14:15 -0000 Date: Fri, 07 Mar 2003 20:14:14 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: Conversion help Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <001301c2e4b6$f0a01900$0701010a@keva> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2017 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.63 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Michael J. Richard" wrote: The decoder should run fine at 5V and the regulator is probably an electrical equivalent to a MC78L05 but in a SMD case. The whole point of using a regulator is to remove ripple but it costs you at least 3V headroom for the regulator to work properly. a good RC low pass ripple filter should work good like I pointed out earlier or even better an LC low pass with a 10mh inductor and 1000uf cap is better. Analog tuned radios IF is at 455KHz and the ceramic resonator is at 3.6MHz/8=450KHz. The higher Q ones may have trouble pulling to 455KHz while a lower Q with a wider BW will not. Chris had commented about this awhile back and tries to use the lower Q wider BW ones so they will work with 455KHz. I don't know about his earlier ones and maybe he can comment on this. I actually used an LC tank that was tuneable since I didn't have the resonators and I was using it at 455KHz. JSG > I would have thought so too. This is one of the earlier decoders the Chris built. The regulator on it looks like a transistor. This is the same decoder that I emailed the list about a while back. That receiver died, so I pulled out the decoder and decided to put it in my Panasonic Boombox. I'll have to check the output of that regulator and see what it's actually putting out. Maybe it needs a good 9V or 12V to actually put out a full steady 5V. On the other reciever the voltage to it was actually about 7V. Yet, it never worked right until I hooked it up to a 12V source. > Chris, does any of this make sense for this decoder? > > Oh..on this conversion, it is MAJOR MAJOR sensitive. It is VERY flaky about locking in to stereo. This is the first analog tuning project I've done. Is this normal? I would have thought these decoders...using the newer chips...would be a lot less sensitive and just pop in when you're anywhere near the signal. > > MJR n WYO > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From rjskadl@yahoo.com Fri Mar 07 19:45:17 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: rjskadl@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 8 Mar 2003 03:45:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 40060 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2003 03:45:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Mar 2003 03:45:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Mar 2003 03:45:16 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.179] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 08 Mar 2003 03:45:16 -0000 Date: Sat, 08 Mar 2003 03:45:14 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: 1380 in NYC sold to AM Stereo-friendly corp. Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20030307181723.24850.qmail@web41012.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1208 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "RJSKADL" X-Originating-IP: 24.187.99.188 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=29619919 X-Yahoo-Profile: rjskadl --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, JNR wrote: > He didn't want WTTM in stereo? ...we may be able to help him... I don't know if there is any helping. You see, WNYG had gotten a new BE AM1 complete with Stereo Exciter Card when they bought the place. But the promise of a working Optimod 9100 never materialized. Then the Kids got kicked out, and now there is a group with an LMA at WNYG, but Alas, when we got in there to do technical work for the LMA group the Stereo Card was gone. And they won't give it back. They would rather not bother with stereo anymore. Or HiFi for that matter, Just listen to 1240 WGBB some time. And even though WPAT is in stereo, most of the program audio comes through in mono, depending on which studio or feed they are using at the time. As for WNYG, Its days are numbered. The plan is to Shut off WNYG so they can boost power a little bit at the useless WNSW 1430. And that came right from the mouth of the infamous HC. It will be just like when WADO killed WGLI. History repeats. And in the SAME DAMN CITY OF LICENSE TOO DAMN IT!! Watch Liu try to buy WALK AM now so he can try to boost 1380. It wouldn't suprise me. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Mar 07 22:54:09 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 8 Mar 2003 06:54:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 68408 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2003 06:54:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Mar 2003 06:54:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.69) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Mar 2003 06:54:08 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.253] by n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 08 Mar 2003 06:54:07 -0000 Date: Sat, 08 Mar 2003 06:54:06 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Arthur Liu's AM Stereo stations Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1641 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.71.1 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > And even though WPAT is in stereo, most of the program audio comes > through in mono, depending on which studio or feed they are using > at the time. Actually 930 WPAT's programming is mostly in full Stereo, at least during the daytime. It's 1430 WNSW that's mostly mono, because of the Korean programming that occupies their weekday airtime. But on the weekends when a variety of programs are broadcast, such as Gospel music or even just random tracks played from a CD changer to fill up unsold airtime, WNSW does broadcast true Stereo sound and it sounds fantastic! During their days as Adult Standards station "Sunny 1430" (hence the WNSW call sign -- a recollection of the late and great 1130 WNEW, with a little "S"unny thrown in the middle) they had rather distorted audio, but now that seems to be pretty much fixed and they sound great. The Liu family also owned the fantastic "AM STEREO 1040, WJHR" -- a rare Top 40/CHR music station in full AM Stereo that was a real treat to listen to... the trouble is, WJHR's signal covered mostly rural areas, and had strong competition from several FM stations, so it never got much interest from advertisers. Liu sold the station in 1999 to Nassau, who flipped it to talk and of course dumped the Stereo. Now it's WCHR, with a religious format and a signal that still greatly overlaps with NYC's 1050 WEVD, especially at night -- just another case where use of IBOC on either station would most likely not be allowed (such as 1110 Radio Disney in L.A. wanted to use it, but was prohibited due to the interference it would cause to an adjacent Mexican station). From groucho@skyweb.net Sat Mar 08 00:44:40 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 8 Mar 2003 08:44:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 57983 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2003 08:44:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Mar 2003 08:44:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Mar 2003 08:44:38 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (tc1-68.skyweb.net [66.6.130.196]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h288t2m2058787 for ; Sat, 8 Mar 2003 03:55:03 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3E69AB07.347820D4@skyweb.net> Date: Sat, 08 Mar 2003 03:34:15 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Arthur Liu's AM Stereo stations References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Just For your Information Kevin I just helped build the New studios at WCHR 1040 ... they are Running a Harris DX-10. However Nassau Pulled the Optimod 9100B its sitting On top of the Phaser. and replaced it with a optimod9200 Mono POS... The Harris Stereo Exciter is still mounted In the Rack.. Once the New studios are On Line I will talk with Ron and see If he will Put the AMS-1 back online .... Neal "Kevin T." wrote: > > And even though WPAT is in stereo, most of the program audio comes > > through in mono, depending on which studio or feed they are using > > at the time. > > Actually 930 WPAT's programming is mostly in full Stereo, at least > during the daytime. It's 1430 WNSW that's mostly mono, because of > the Korean programming that occupies their weekday airtime. But on > the weekends when a variety of programs are broadcast, such as Gospel > music or even just random tracks played from a CD changer to fill up > unsold airtime, WNSW does broadcast true Stereo sound and it sounds > fantastic! During their days as Adult Standards station "Sunny 1430" > (hence the WNSW call sign -- a recollection of the late and great > 1130 WNEW, with a little "S"unny thrown in the middle) they had > rather distorted audio, but now that seems to be pretty much fixed > and they sound great. > > The Liu family also owned the fantastic "AM STEREO 1040, WJHR" -- a > rare Top 40/CHR music station in full AM Stereo that was a real treat > to listen to... the trouble is, WJHR's signal covered mostly rural > areas, and had strong competition from several FM stations, so it > never got much interest from advertisers. Liu sold the station in > 1999 to Nassau, who flipped it to talk and of course dumped the > Stereo. Now it's WCHR, with a religious format and a signal that > still greatly overlaps with NYC's 1050 WEVD, especially at night -- > just another case where use of IBOC on either station would most > likely not be allowed (such as 1110 Radio Disney in L.A. wanted to > use it, but was prohibited due to the interference it would cause to > an adjacent Mexican station). > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Mar 08 02:05:02 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 8 Mar 2003 10:05:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 36111 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2003 10:05:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Mar 2003 10:05:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.86) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Mar 2003 10:05:01 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.252] by n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 08 Mar 2003 10:05:01 -0000 Date: Sat, 08 Mar 2003 10:05:00 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Arthur Liu's AM Stereo stations Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3E69AB07.347820D4@skyweb.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1638 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.71.1 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Once the New studios are On Line I will talk with Ron and see If he > will Put the AMS-1 back online .... It's a shame, because when 1040 first officially went on the air in January 1998, I talked with their engineer, and he said it was the best-sounding AM station he had ever put together... everything was truly state-of-the-art and adjusted for top-notch quality. A month later, they got the stereo exciter set up and sounding great, and I like to think that it was my constant suggestions which got them to promote the station as "AM STEREO 1040" so much that it was included in virtually every on-air ID. As 1680 WTTM and many other Expanded Band stations prove, a Harris DX-10 transmitter with the Harris C-Quam Stereo exciter together with an Optimod 9100 is just about the best-sounding air-chain a station can possibly have... it can easily be set up to have very competitive loudness, but yet still be very hi-fi with spectacular sound for both mono and Stereo receivers. I don't see why any station would want to downgrade to the harsh, digital-tinged sound of the mono Optimod 9200, except maybe because it looks "cooler" in the equipment rack? Or maybe WCHR can work out a trade with 1450 WCTC... WCTC is still an excellent AM Stereo station, but I think they're let down by their Omnia processor... it just doesn't sound as "smooth" as an Optimod 9100, even for mono listeners, probably due to excessive use of clipping. Of course I think the CRL "Amigo AM" has the best sound of all the AM Stereo audio processors, as any listener of 850 WREF in Connecticut can hear, but they are quite rare. From stodd@sherbtel.net Sat Mar 08 08:08:42 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 8 Mar 2003 16:08:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 73217 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2003 16:08:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Mar 2003 16:08:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Mar 2003 16:08:41 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-200.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.200]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h28G8ale011289 for ; Sat, 8 Mar 2003 10:08:37 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <009801c2e58d$6a474400$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <3E69AB07.347820D4@skyweb.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Arthur Liu's AM Stereo stations Date: Sat, 8 Mar 2003 10:11:42 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Speaking of the infamous 9200, I finally figured out how to get that thing to sound LOUD. Unfortunately it is also very fatiguing to listen to, so I backed it off. We had a 9100 that had been sitting around fixed, finally, so I was able to pull the 9200 a few weeks later and put the 9100 back in the rack sounding every bit as loud as the 9200 had been. Now I've got 9100s on all three stations. Now if I can scrounge up a card 10 or three, some stereo generators and mod monitors, I might be able to make my stations stereo.... *sigh* Biggest problem would be the STL for two of our stations. I'd need someone with a quad of 10kHz Catlink cards willing to trade for a pair of 15 kHz cards. Scott Todd ----- Original Message ----- From: "Neal Newman" To: Sent: Saturday, March 08, 2003 2:34 AM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Arthur Liu's AM Stereo stations > Just For your Information Kevin > I just helped build the New studios at WCHR 1040 ... they are Running a > Harris DX-10. However Nassau Pulled the Optimod 9100B its sitting On top of > the Phaser. > and replaced it with a optimod9200 Mono POS... The Harris Stereo Exciter is > still > mounted In the Rack.. Once the New studios are On Line I will talk with Ron > and see If he will Put the AMS-1 back online .... > Neal > > "Kevin T." wrote: > > > > And even though WPAT is in stereo, most of the program audio comes > > > through in mono, depending on which studio or feed they are using > > > at the time. > > > > Actually 930 WPAT's programming is mostly in full Stereo, at least > > during the daytime. It's 1430 WNSW that's mostly mono, because of > > the Korean programming that occupies their weekday airtime. But on > > the weekends when a variety of programs are broadcast, such as Gospel > > music or even just random tracks played from a CD changer to fill up > > unsold airtime, WNSW does broadcast true Stereo sound and it sounds > > fantastic! During their days as Adult Standards station "Sunny 1430" > > (hence the WNSW call sign -- a recollection of the late and great > > 1130 WNEW, with a little "S"unny thrown in the middle) they had > > rather distorted audio, but now that seems to be pretty much fixed > > and they sound great. > > > > The Liu family also owned the fantastic "AM STEREO 1040, WJHR" -- a > > rare Top 40/CHR music station in full AM Stereo that was a real treat > > to listen to... the trouble is, WJHR's signal covered mostly rural > > areas, and had strong competition from several FM stations, so it > > never got much interest from advertisers. Liu sold the station in > > 1999 to Nassau, who flipped it to talk and of course dumped the > > Stereo. Now it's WCHR, with a religious format and a signal that > > still greatly overlaps with NYC's 1050 WEVD, especially at night -- > > just another case where use of IBOC on either station would most > > likely not be allowed (such as 1110 Radio Disney in L.A. wanted to > > use it, but was prohibited due to the interference it would cause to > > an adjacent Mexican station). > > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Sat Mar 08 12:55:03 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 8 Mar 2003 20:55:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 20928 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2003 20:55:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Mar 2003 20:55:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14203.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.145) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Mar 2003 20:55:02 -0000 Message-ID: <20030308205502.54082.qmail@web14203.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [205.162.223.75] by web14203.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 08 Mar 2003 12:55:01 PST Date: Sat, 8 Mar 2003 12:55:01 -0800 (PST) Subject: Anybody Care to Respond to this Guy? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio Randy Michaels" Subject: [RT] IBOC How many of your have heard an AM station encoded with IBOC audio? Has anyone actually heard an AM IBOC receiver? __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ From wa2fnq@optonline.net Sat Mar 08 14:33:09 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: wa2fnq@optonline.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 8 Mar 2003 22:33:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 77747 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2003 22:32:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 8 Mar 2003 22:32:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 8 Mar 2003 22:32:59 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.181] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 08 Mar 2003 22:32:59 -0000 Date: Sat, 08 Mar 2003 22:32:55 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Anybody Care to Respond to this Guy? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20030308205502.54082.qmail@web14203.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 725 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wa2fnq" X-Originating-IP: 24.47.74.230 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=60059615 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa2fnq I heard the one at the WOR transmitter site when we were at their open house. It sounds the same as the samples on their web site. Like crap in my opinion. And this is by no means any reflection on the WOR engineers. I have a lot of respect for them giving this a shot on a 50 KW NYC station. Jerry WA2FNQ --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John P." wrote: > Randy Michaels" > Subject: [RT] IBOC > > How many of your have heard an AM station encoded with IBOC audio? Has > anyone actually heard an AM IBOC receiver? > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more > http://taxes.yahoo.com/ From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Mar 08 16:22:30 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 9 Mar 2003 00:22:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 48202 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2003 00:22:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Mar 2003 00:22:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.64) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Mar 2003 00:22:28 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.163] by n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 09 Mar 2003 00:22:28 -0000 Date: Sun, 09 Mar 2003 00:22:25 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: 1520 WWKB: The light's on, but nobody's home Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 597 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.91.4 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics I can confirm with 99% certainty that Buffalo's 50,000-watt 1520 WWKB is indeed transmitting an AM Stereo signal once again, after being in mono since mid-January... but there is no true Stereo separation to be heard from them, even during their Oldies music programming. To be honest, I haven't heard any true Stereo from WWKB since the demise of their satellite-fed "Real Country" format in the late '90s, but evidently they have made the effort to bring the C-Quam exciter back in operation, so hopefully they'll put it to good use and start transmitting full Stereo sound once again. From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sat Mar 08 18:55:46 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 9 Mar 2003 02:55:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 79037 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2003 02:55:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Mar 2003 02:55:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Mar 2003 02:55:44 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.133] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 09 Mar 2003 02:55:44 -0000 Date: Sun, 09 Mar 2003 02:55:43 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Anybody Care to Respond to this Guy? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20030308205502.54082.qmail@web14203.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 423 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.7 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John P." wrote: > Randy Michaels" > Subject: [RT] IBOC > > How many of your have heard an AM station encoded with IBOC audio? Has > anyone actually heard an AM IBOC receiver? > > Is this THE Randy Michaels of CC? On our oldies station 107.5 KLDE we have a DJ who goes by that name. I wouldn't think he is the same guy but you never know. JSG From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Mar 08 19:09:19 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 9 Mar 2003 03:09:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 71317 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2003 03:09:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Mar 2003 03:09:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Mar 2003 03:09:19 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.134] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 09 Mar 2003 03:09:19 -0000 Date: Sun, 09 Mar 2003 03:09:18 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: OT: Roll To Stereo Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1905 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.91.4 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics As I'm sure others here are as well, I'm always on the lookout for hard-to-find superior Stereo versions of songs that are normally heard either in mono, awful "simulated stereo", or in a less widely- separated stereo mix. Normally, this focuses upon the musical genre of "Oldies", ranging from the late '50s through the 1960s, with rare true-stereo tracks such as "Good Vibrations" and "A Whiter Shade of Pale". However, I have just come across a rare wide-separation Stereo version of a Top 10 hit from *1995* -- "Roll To Me" by Del Amitri. I happened to encounter it by chance in an MP3 that I downloaded at random out of the many available on "Kazaa", and was shocked to hear fantastic Stereo sound, with the lead vocals in the left channel only, just like the Beatles made famous three decades earlier. I've never heard this version of "Roll To Me" on the radio, nor is it included in the "The Best of Del Amitri" CD compilation album; in these cases, you'll hear a more "normal"-sounding stereo mix of the song, with no such wide separation. And the wide-stereo version of it that I've discovered is legitimate -- it's not just a product of odd L+R/L-R matrixing, it's actual parts of the original multi-track master recording placed across the Stereo sound-stage. I have yet to check which version is included on the original 1995 "Twisted" album from which "Roll To Me" first appeared, but until then, I have uploaded the fantastic wide-stereo version of it for all to hear as an MP3 file -- so if you're a fan of superior Stereo music, it's definitely one to add to your collection: ftp://209.193.86.116/rolltome.mp3 p.s. It sounds best when put through C-Quam AM Stereo matrix processing... but, failing that, about a 40% L-R boost makes it sound really spectacular, with very distinct left-to-right separation that few songs from the past two decades can provide. From bjackson@indyradio.com Sat Mar 08 20:02:16 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 9 Mar 2003 04:02:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 50247 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2003 04:02:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Mar 2003 04:02:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.87) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Mar 2003 04:02:15 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.187] by n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 09 Mar 2003 04:02:15 -0000 Date: Sun, 09 Mar 2003 04:02:14 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: OT: Roll To Stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1701 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923" X-Originating-IP: 216.132.129.192 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T." wrote: > However, I have just come across a rare wide-separation Stereo > version of a Top 10 hit from *1995* -- "Roll To Me" by Del Amitri. > I happened to encounter it by chance in an MP3 that I downloaded at > random out of the many available on "Kazaa", and was shocked to hear > fantastic Stereo sound, with the lead vocals in the left channel > only, just like the Beatles made famous three decades earlier. > > I've never heard this version of "Roll To Me" on the radio, nor is it > included in the "The Best of Del Amitri" CD compilation album; in > these cases, you'll hear a more "normal"-sounding stereo mix of the > song, with no such wide separation. And the wide-stereo version of > it that I've discovered is legitimate -- it's not just a product of > odd L+R/L-R matrixing, it's actual parts of the original multi- track > master recording placed across the Stereo sound-stage. > > I have yet to check which version is included on the original 1995 > "Twisted" album from which "Roll To Me" first appeared, but until > then, I have uploaded the fantastic wide-stereo version of it for all > SNIP < Kevin, When I was PD at WFCI, we used to play that version...The Twisted CD has the wide stereo version. Any radio station that played it off of Broadcast Programming CD's also had the wide stereo mix (We did at WTTS as well). The "Best of" CD and TM Century CD's had the more "normal" mix :-) BTW - Please tell me you're not using the real Kazaa, are you? Nothing but spyware...try Kazaa Lite...Or for more rare stuff, WinMx. Brad Jackson Susquehanna, Indianapolis http://www.indyradio.com From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Sat Mar 08 20:20:07 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 9 Mar 2003 04:20:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 20328 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2003 04:20:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Mar 2003 04:20:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf19bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.179) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Mar 2003 04:20:07 -0000 Received: from juan ([67.34.30.53]) by imf19bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.25 201-253-122-122-125-20020815) with SMTP id <20030309042209.JJXK25286.imf19bis.bellsouth.net@juan> for ; Sat, 8 Mar 2003 23:22:09 -0500 Message-ID: <002501c2e5f3$2ac80380$af78fea9@juan> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: OT: Roll To Stereo Date: Sat, 8 Mar 2003 23:20:07 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit We play "full stereo" version at WGYL...probably because we get our tunes from BP...now Jones "Roll To Me" is a favourite, because it is short......and sometimes you need a short song to backtime. And by the way, it tests well. Juan Gualda PD/MD WGYL-FM KB0GXM Ft. Pierce, FL ----- Original Message ----- From: bradleyj923 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, March 08, 2003 11:02 PM Subject: {AMSF} Re: OT: Roll To Stereo --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T." wrote: > However, I have just come across a rare wide-separation Stereo > version of a Top 10 hit from *1995* -- "Roll To Me" by Del Amitri. > I happened to encounter it by chance in an MP3 that I downloaded at > random out of the many available on "Kazaa", and was shocked to hear > fantastic Stereo sound, with the lead vocals in the left channel > only, just like the Beatles made famous three decades earlier. > > I've never heard this version of "Roll To Me" on the radio, nor is it > included in the "The Best of Del Amitri" CD compilation album; in > these cases, you'll hear a more "normal"-sounding stereo mix of the > song, with no such wide separation. And the wide-stereo version of > it that I've discovered is legitimate -- it's not just a product of > odd L+R/L-R matrixing, it's actual parts of the original multi- track > master recording placed across the Stereo sound-stage. > > I have yet to check which version is included on the original 1995 > "Twisted" album from which "Roll To Me" first appeared, but until > then, I have uploaded the fantastic wide-stereo version of it for all > SNIP < Kevin, When I was PD at WFCI, we used to play that version...The Twisted CD has the wide stereo version. Any radio station that played it off of Broadcast Programming CD's also had the wide stereo mix (We did at WTTS as well). The "Best of" CD and TM Century CD's had the more "normal" mix :-) BTW - Please tell me you're not using the real Kazaa, are you? Nothing but spyware...try Kazaa Lite...Or for more rare stuff, WinMx. Brad Jackson Susquehanna, Indianapolis http://www.indyradio.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From amymousie@yahoo.com Sat Mar 08 20:51:16 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 9 Mar 2003 04:51:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 97179 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2003 04:51:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Mar 2003 04:51:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.67) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Mar 2003 04:51:16 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.143] by n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 09 Mar 2003 04:51:15 -0000 Date: Sun, 09 Mar 2003 04:51:14 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: OT: Roll To Stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <002501c2e5f3$2ac80380$af78fea9@juan> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 472 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie" X-Originating-IP: 67.115.109.109 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Juan / John Gualda" wrote: > We play "full stereo" version at WGYL...probably because we get our tunes from BP...now Jones > > "Roll To Me" is a favourite, because it is short......and sometimes you need a short song to backtime. And by the way, it tests well. Reminds me some of Bruse Springsteen's "I'm On Fire"... First time I ever heard THAT was on an AM stereo station a long time ago.... Amy. <:3 )~~8~ From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Mar 08 21:30:35 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 9 Mar 2003 05:30:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 35306 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2003 05:30:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Mar 2003 05:30:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Mar 2003 05:30:34 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.143] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 09 Mar 2003 05:30:34 -0000 Date: Sun, 09 Mar 2003 05:30:34 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: OT: Roll To Stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 946 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.91.4 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > BTW - Please tell me you're not using the real Kazaa, are you? > Nothing but spyware...try Kazaa Lite...Or for more rare stuff, > WinMx. Yes, I use Kazaa Lite, of course... I used to use AudioGalaxy too, until they were shut down. But, I've found the best way to add to my music collection is the Priceton Record Exchange in Princeton, NJ -- with thousands of used LPs, 45s, CDs, and tapes for as low as $1.00 each, you can get a lot of music in its original full-quality form for not much money... and without the aggravation of spending half an hour downloading an MP3 only to have it be the wrong song, or ridiculously poor quality... or spending almost as much time tearing all the shrinkwrap and labels off a new CD and then scrubbing off all the leftover adhesive goo. (Whoever designed that label that wraps over the top of the CD case and can never be removed in one piece should be dragged out into the street and shot!) From jim@burgan.net Sun Mar 09 02:24:34 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jim@burgan.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 9 Mar 2003 10:24:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 51564 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2003 10:24:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Mar 2003 10:24:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sccimhc02.insightbb.com) (63.240.76.164) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Mar 2003 10:24:32 -0000 Received: from jimspc ([12.221.244.84]) by sccimhc02.insightbb.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030309102432.EDBD25124.sccimhc02.insightbb.com@jimspc> for ; Sun, 9 Mar 2003 10:24:32 +0000 Message-ID: <001101c2e626$143d42a0$9802a8c0@jimspc> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} OT: Roll To Stereo [Del Amitri] Date: Sun, 9 Mar 2003 05:24:33 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Jim Burgan" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=36730433 X-Yahoo-Profile: jimbo700 I have Del Amitri's 1995 "Twisted" CD and the version of which you speak, (instrumentals from the right channel and vocals from the left, with no crossover) is the version on the CD. I heard/played the 'radio edit' before I bought the CD and I was really freaked out when I heard the "Twisted" CD version with it's wierd mix. I've always wondered why they did it that way. The liner notes offer no explanation. The version 99.999% of the radio stations play is on TM Century's Gold Disc, and it's the remix with vocals in the center and stereo accompaniment. The radio-station promo copy contains 3 different mixes: The albumn track (with separate vocals from left channel), the radio remix (center channel vocals) and another remix (I can't remember the characteristics... I'll have to look it up Monday morning), but nobody plays the original "Twisted" version on the radio. The "Twisted" version also has a prolonged ending that segues into the next cut, "Crashing Down" with no lead-in. As you said, they put the "radio edit" on the greatest hits CD so I'm beginning to think the version on "Twisted" may have been an accident... That's all I can think of since it makes no earthly sense.... >Kevin T. wrote: >I have just come across a rare wide-separation Stereo >version of a Top 10 hit from *1995* -- "Roll To Me" by Del Amitri. >I happened to encounter it by chance in an MP3 that I downloaded at >random out of the many available on "Kazaa", and was shocked to hear >fantastic Stereo sound, with the lead vocals in the left channel >only, just like the Beatles made famous three decades earlier. > >I've never heard this version of "Roll To Me" on the radio, nor is it >included in the "The Best of Del Amitri" CD compilation album; in >these cases, you'll hear a more "normal"-sounding stereo mix of the >song, with no such wide separation. And the wide-stereo version of >it that I've discovered is legitimate -- it's not just a product of >odd L+R/L-R matrixing, it's actual parts of the original multi-track >master recording placed across the Stereo sound-stage. > >I have yet to check which version is included on the original 1995 >"Twisted" album from which "Roll To Me" first appeared, but until >then, I have uploaded the fantastic wide-stereo version of it for all >to hear as an MP3 file -- so if you're a fan of superior Stereo >music, it's definitely one to add to your collection: From jim@burgan.net Sun Mar 09 02:27:25 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jim@burgan.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 9 Mar 2003 10:27:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 40569 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2003 10:27:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Mar 2003 10:27:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sccimhc02.insightbb.com) (63.240.76.164) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Mar 2003 10:27:24 -0000 Received: from jimspc ([12.221.244.84]) by sccimhc02.insightbb.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030309102724.EDEE25124.sccimhc02.insightbb.com@jimspc> for ; Sun, 9 Mar 2003 10:27:24 +0000 Message-ID: <001301c2e626$7ac71b90$9802a8c0@jimspc> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: OT: Roll To Stereo Date: Sun, 9 Mar 2003 05:27:26 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Jim Burgan" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=36730433 X-Yahoo-Profile: jimbo700 >Brad Jackson wrote: >BTW - Please tell me you're not using the real Kazaa, are you? >Nothing but spyware...try Kazaa Lite...Or for more rare stuff, WinMx. Durn Brad... Everywhere I go you keep turing up, although I'm not surprised to find you on this fourm :-) I agree on Kazaa Lite.... It's my #1 choice for file-sharing... From ccuff@in4web.com Sun Mar 09 06:44:38 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 9 Mar 2003 14:44:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 39589 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2003 14:44:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Mar 2003 14:44:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Mar 2003 14:44:36 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [216.221.137.139]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Sun, 9 Mar 2003 09:41:45 -0500 Message-ID: <001301c30a67$cdf99120$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: Subject: Aiwa CR-DS805 on ebay Date: Thu, 24 Apr 2003 09:45:41 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 I have put my Aiwa CRDS805 radio on ebay- it is the only one I have. Search "am stereo" to find it.. Chris From ccuff@in4web.com Sun Mar 09 07:07:26 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 9 Mar 2003 15:07:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 93253 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2003 15:07:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Mar 2003 15:07:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Mar 2003 15:07:25 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [216.221.137.139]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Sun, 9 Mar 2003 10:04:34 -0500 Message-ID: <009001c30a6a$fddf8040$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM stereo stuff Date: Thu, 24 Apr 2003 10:08:32 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 Nothing opens- just the main index showing "RCA***.gif" but when you click on them, you just get a red X in the corner..? Chris ----- Original Message ----- From: amymousie To: Sent: Thursday, March 06, 2003 3:49 PM Subject: {AMSF} AM stereo stuff > Hmm, someone's been busy uploading AM stereo related stuff. > > ftp://209.193.86.116/usa/misc/ > > Amy. <:3 )~~8~ From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sun Mar 09 10:04:55 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 9 Mar 2003 18:04:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 69176 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2003 18:04:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Mar 2003 18:04:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Mar 2003 18:04:54 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.135] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 09 Mar 2003 18:04:54 -0000 Date: Sun, 09 Mar 2003 18:04:53 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM stereo stuff Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <009001c30a6a$fddf8040$0101a8c0@pavilion> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 736 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.180 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Christopher Cuff" wrote: > Nothing opens- just the main index showing "RCA***.gif" but when you click > on them, you just get a red X in the corner..? > Chris > ----- Original Message ----- > From: amymousie > To: > Sent: Thursday, March 06, 2003 3:49 PM > Subject: {AMSF} AM stereo stuff > > > > Hmm, someone's been busy uploading AM stereo related stuff. > > > > ftp://209.193.86.116/usa/misc/ > > > > Amy. <:3 )~~8~ I downloaded all of them and they seemed fine. What kind of program are you using? I used a dedicated FTP program. You might try Leap FTP at http://www.leapware.com for windows but I used ncftp under linux. JSG From amymousie@yahoo.com Sun Mar 09 10:07:02 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 9 Mar 2003 18:07:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 69820 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2003 18:07:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Mar 2003 18:07:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.75) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Mar 2003 18:07:01 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.144] by n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 09 Mar 2003 18:07:01 -0000 Date: Sun, 09 Mar 2003 18:07:00 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM stereo stuff Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <009001c30a6a$fddf8040$0101a8c0@pavilion> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 493 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie" X-Originating-IP: 64.175.246.52 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Christopher Cuff" wrote: > Nothing opens- just the main index showing "RCA***.gif" but when you click > on them, you just get a red X in the corner..? > Chris I noticed IE doesn't like large 1-bit GIFs, so I suggest downloading them and view them locally. They were intended for print resolution (they still need to be cropped so they can be put into a PDF or DJVU, I believe), but yes- Don't try viewing them in IE. Amy. <:3 )~~8~ From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sun Mar 09 10:20:36 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 9 Mar 2003 18:20:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 61788 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2003 18:20:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Mar 2003 18:20:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Mar 2003 18:20:26 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.175] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 09 Mar 2003 18:20:26 -0000 Date: Sun, 09 Mar 2003 18:20:25 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Aiwa CR-DS805 on ebay Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <001301c30a67$cdf99120$0101a8c0@pavilion> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 309 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.180 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Christopher Cuff" wrote: > I have put my Aiwa CRDS805 radio on ebay- it is the only one I have. Search > "am stereo" to find it.. > Chris Someone else is selling an Aiwa HS-JX859 recording walkman and says it has AM Stereo. The price has climbe to $162.50 From di316@freenet.carleton.ca Sun Mar 09 11:54:54 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: paulc@ncf.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 9 Mar 2003 19:54:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 12573 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2003 19:54:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Mar 2003 19:54:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO tomts5-srv.bellnexxia.net) (209.226.175.25) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Mar 2003 19:54:53 -0000 Received: from ncf.ca ([64.230.62.164]) by tomts5-srv.bellnexxia.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.19 201-253-122-122-119-20020516) with ESMTP id <20030309195452.VAPM29897.tomts5-srv.bellnexxia.net@ncf.ca> for ; Sun, 9 Mar 2003 14:54:52 -0500 Message-ID: <3E6B9C16.7F58AB8B@ncf.ca> Date: Sun, 09 Mar 2003 14:55:02 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.79 [en] (Windows NT 5.0; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Roll To Stereo References: <1047219778.779.75319.m12@yahoogroups.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-eGroups-From: Paul Cumming From: Paul Cumming X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=43835445 X-Yahoo-Profile: rahoule104 Kevin T. (kevtronics@yahoo.com) wrote: > I'm always on the lookout for hard-to-find superior Stereo versions > of songs...Normally, this focuses upon the musical genre of > "Oldies", ranging from the late '50s through the 1960s, with rare > true-stereo tracks such as "Good Vibrations" and "A Whiter Shade of > Pale". > However, I have just come across a rare wide-separation Stereo > version of a Top 10 hit from *1995* -- "Roll To Me" by Del Amitri. Local Ottawa FM station KOOL-FM (CKKL-FM) used this version when they played "Roll To Me" back then. I remember thinking it was a pretty cool mix. However, KOOL-FM also carried (and still carries) a number of syndicated top 40 countdown shows, like Casey Kasem's American Top 40, Rick Dees, World Chart, etc. The countdown shows always used the more "normal" mix with the vocals in the centre. "Good Vibrations" by the Beach Boys has a stereo mix? Wow. I heard that Brian Wilson, who put that song together thru loads of short recording studio sessions and tape twiddling, was deaf in one ear, and that was part of the reason most '60s Beach Boys music was mono. I also heard, however, that some of these mono songs were later remixed for stereo. I'll have to look out for that one. -- Paul ---------------------- Paul Cumming paulc@ncf.ca From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Mar 09 13:57:24 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 9 Mar 2003 21:57:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 25637 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2003 21:57:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Mar 2003 21:57:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.88) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Mar 2003 21:57:23 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.134] by n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 09 Mar 2003 21:57:23 -0000 Date: Sun, 09 Mar 2003 21:57:20 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: OT: Roll To Stereo [Del Amitri] Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <001101c2e626$143d42a0$9802a8c0@jimspc> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 808 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.87.27 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > As you said, they put the "radio edit" on the greatest hits CD so > I'm beginning to think the version on "Twisted" may have been an > accident... That's all I can think of since it makes no earthly > sense.... Another "extreme stereo" song that almost sounds like a mistake is Billy Joel's "Where's The Orchestra?", the last track on his "Nylon Curtain" album from the early '80s. His voice is completely in one channel during the whole song, and as far as I know, it's the only song Billy ever recorded that way. In fact, I haven't listened to the CD version of this album, so it may even be an LP-only rarity. On my old computer I have an MP3 of this song that I recorded myself off the original LP, and once I get a chance, I'll post it on the FTP server for all Stereo enhusiasts to hear. From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Sun Mar 09 14:05:47 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 9 Mar 2003 22:05:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 94543 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2003 22:05:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Mar 2003 22:05:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf35bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.219) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Mar 2003 22:05:47 -0000 Received: from juan ([67.34.40.42]) by imf35bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.25 201-253-122-122-125-20020815) with SMTP id <20030309220749.EPBL14398.imf35bis.bellsouth.net@juan> for ; Sun, 9 Mar 2003 17:07:49 -0500 Message-ID: <000d01c2e688$0ac55340$af78fea9@juan> To: References: Subject: Stereo 101 Date: Sun, 9 Mar 2003 17:05:48 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Does anybody know if there is a CD release of the Dave Clark 5 in Stereo ? I got a copy awhile back and the songs are in glorious mono. The songs DO exist in stereo, on LPs that I have. And by the way, the stereo versions kick some serious butt. Juan [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From jim@burgan.net Sun Mar 09 14:17:07 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jim@burgan.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 9 Mar 2003 22:17:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 25254 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2003 22:17:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Mar 2003 22:17:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sccimhc02.insightbb.com) (63.240.76.164) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Mar 2003 22:17:06 -0000 Received: from jimspc ([12.221.244.84]) by sccimhc02.insightbb.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030309221706.HDWH25124.sccimhc02.insightbb.com@jimspc> for ; Sun, 9 Mar 2003 22:17:06 +0000 Message-ID: <001d01c2e689$9fa56580$9802a8c0@jimspc> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: OT: Roll To Stereo [Del Amitri] Date: Sun, 9 Mar 2003 17:17:07 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Jim Burgan" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=36730433 X-Yahoo-Profile: jimbo700 >> As you said, they put the "radio edit" on the greatest hits CD so >> I'm beginning to think the version on "Twisted" may have been an >> accident... That's all I can think of since it makes no earthly >> sense.... >Another "extreme stereo" song that almost sounds like a mistake is >Billy Joel's "Where's The Orchestra?", the last track on his "Nylon >Curtain" album from the early '80s. His voice is completely in one >channel during the whole song, and as far as I know, it's the only >song Billy ever recorded that way. In fact, I haven't listened to >the CD version of this album, so it may even be an LP-only rarity. Another voice-in-one channel oldie is thde Neon Philharmonic's "Morning Girl". Instruments in one side, vocal in the other... From ccuff@in4web.com Sun Mar 09 15:01:10 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 9 Mar 2003 23:01:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 48109 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2003 23:01:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Mar 2003 23:01:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Mar 2003 23:01:08 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [216.221.131.165]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Sun, 9 Mar 2003 17:58:18 -0500 Message-ID: <001101c30aad$2b670e60$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: <000d01c2e688$0ac55340$af78fea9@juan> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Stereo 101 Date: Thu, 24 Apr 2003 18:02:15 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 This one has always interested me as well- As a long time fan of the DC5, I do know he was very much opposed to his material being re-released. He also hated the American way of "Re-channelling for stereo" I honestly do not know if any of his stuff WAS originally recorded in stereo.. Narkspud- any ideas? CC ----- Original Message ----- From: Juan / John Gualda To: Sent: Sunday, March 09, 2003 6:05 PM Subject: {AMSF} Stereo 101 > > Does anybody know if there is a CD release of the Dave Clark 5 in Stereo ? I got a copy awhile back and the songs are in glorious mono. > > The songs DO exist in stereo, on LPs that I have. From gualdaj@bellsouth.net Sun Mar 09 15:28:52 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: gualdaj@bellsouth.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 9 Mar 2003 23:28:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 30286 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2003 23:28:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Mar 2003 23:28:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf45bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.148) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Mar 2003 23:28:52 -0000 Received: from juan ([67.34.40.42]) by imf45bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.25 201-253-122-122-125-20020815) with SMTP id <20030309232226.QDAI19360.imf45bis.bellsouth.net@juan> for ; Sun, 9 Mar 2003 18:22:26 -0500 Message-ID: <000901c2e693$a61721b0$af78fea9@juan> To: References: <000d01c2e688$0ac55340$af78fea9@juan> <001101c30aad$2b670e60$0101a8c0@pavilion> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Stereo 101 Date: Sun, 9 Mar 2003 18:28:53 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Juan / John Gualda" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=103495384 X-Yahoo-Profile: iowacane Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Chris, It was released in Stereo, on the LP's, and it sounds awesome. I never heard there stuff in "fake" stereo, and I don't blame him for not liking fake stereo, it stinks ! The real stereo DC 5 stuff is great. I am so dissapointed they didn't release it in stereo. ----- Original Message ----- From: Christopher Cuff To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, April 24, 2003 5:02 PM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Stereo 101 This one has always interested me as well- As a long time fan of the DC5, I do know he was very much opposed to his material being re-released. He also hated the American way of "Re-channelling for stereo" I honestly do not know if any of his stuff WAS originally recorded in stereo.. Narkspud- any ideas? CC ----- Original Message ----- From: Juan / John Gualda To: Sent: Sunday, March 09, 2003 6:05 PM Subject: {AMSF} Stereo 101 > > Does anybody know if there is a CD release of the Dave Clark 5 in Stereo ? I got a copy awhile back and the songs are in glorious mono. > > The songs DO exist in stereo, on LPs that I have. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From bjackson@indyradio.com Sun Mar 09 15:32:17 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 9 Mar 2003 23:32:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 84842 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2003 23:32:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Mar 2003 23:32:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.90) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Mar 2003 23:32:15 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.249] by n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 09 Mar 2003 23:32:15 -0000 Date: Sun, 09 Mar 2003 23:32:15 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: OT: Roll To Stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <001301c2e626$7ac71b90$9802a8c0@jimspc> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 840 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923" X-Originating-IP: 216.132.129.192 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Jim Burgan" wrote: > Durn Brad... Everywhere I go you keep turing up, although I'm not surprised > to find you on this fourm :-) > I agree on Kazaa Lite.... It's my #1 choice for file-sharing... Wow...Another Central Indiana radio guy on the list...Now I don't feel so out of place :-) BTW Jim...You're in Columbus so maybe you could verify this for me...Does WCSI sound as bad these days down there as they do here in Indy via dx? I remember when you worked there and Jerry (engineer) had a really nice stereo signal going on. Heck, when I was there after they killed the C-QuAM it still sounded decent. But now it sounds...well, almost like they are using a telephone instead of an STL...No bass and no treble. Brad Jackson Susquehanna, Indianapolis http://www.indyradio.com From bd6xray@lycos.com Sun Mar 09 17:02:39 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: bd6xray@lycos.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 10 Mar 2003 01:02:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 13009 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2003 01:02:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Mar 2003 01:02:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.90) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Mar 2003 01:02:38 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.179] by n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 10 Mar 2003 01:02:38 -0000 Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2003 01:02:35 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} AM stereo stuff Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 758 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bd6xray" X-Originating-IP: 64.12.96.170 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=83174981 X-Yahoo-Profile: bd6xray --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "amymousie" wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Christopher Cuff" > wrote: > > Nothing opens- just the main index showing "RCA***.gif" but when > you click > > on them, you just get a red X in the corner..? > > Chris > > I noticed IE doesn't like large 1-bit GIFs, so I suggest downloading > them and view them locally. They were intended for print resolution > (they still need to be cropped so they can be put into a PDF or DJVU, > I believe), but yes- Don't try viewing them in IE. > > Amy. <:3 )~~8~ I've seen this on other sites too. IE is unhappy with large GIF files. However, they work just fine in Netscape. I haven't tried Opera on them yet. Al Hajny From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Mar 09 19:41:13 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 10 Mar 2003 03:41:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 67950 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2003 03:41:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Mar 2003 03:41:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.89) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Mar 2003 03:41:13 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.252] by n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 10 Mar 2003 03:41:12 -0000 Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2003 03:41:10 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: OT: Roll To Stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 249 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.84.4 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics BTW... I feel silly asking about this, but does a Stereo version exist of the '60s novelty hit "Winchester Cathedral" by The New Vaudeville Band? I happen to like it, in a "Laugh-In" sort of way, but the version I have is in glorious monaural. From michaelj@vcn.com Mon Mar 10 06:59:02 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 10 Mar 2003 14:58:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 86053 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2003 14:58:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Mar 2003 14:58:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m3-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.33) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Mar 2003 14:58:55 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m3-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Mon, 10 Mar 2003 07:58:55 -0700 Message-ID: <006f01c2e715$98009660$0701010a@keva> To: References: <002501c2e5f3$2ac80380$af78fea9@juan> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: OT: Roll To Stereo Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2003 07:59:04 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit LOL!! Now I WOULD be a rich man if I had a quarter for every time I had to pull out "Roll To Me" to backtime to the top of the hour!! We also us BP music service....although ours is the "Chartbreakers MONTHLY" CD. Not the weekly. So the monthly AC CD that had that on it apparantly had the normal, not the wide. MJR n WYO ----- Original Message ----- From: Juan / John Gualda To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, March 08, 2003 9:20 PM Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: OT: Roll To Stereo We play "full stereo" version at WGYL...probably because we get our tunes from BP...now Jones "Roll To Me" is a favourite, because it is short......and sometimes you need a short song to backtime. And by the way, it tests well. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From michaelj@vcn.com Mon Mar 10 07:05:04 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 10 Mar 2003 15:05:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 92242 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2003 15:04:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Mar 2003 15:04:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m3-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.33) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Mar 2003 15:04:54 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m3-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Mon, 10 Mar 2003 08:04:54 -0700 Message-ID: <008701c2e716$6de1b340$0701010a@keva> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Aiwa CR-DS805 on ebay Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2003 08:05:02 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I have that Aiwa recording walkman. If there were a way to figure out how to widen the bandwidth on the thing, I would. Other than that it is a wonderful unit. AM Stereo on it works beautifully, although a little muddy. Bought mine directly from Chuck Simpson a few years ago. Anyone hear from Chuck here lately on the list? Last I heard he was looking for work and then he just kinda disappeared. Michael n WYO ----- Original Message ----- From: jsgilst To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, March 09, 2003 11:20 AM Subject: {AMSF} Re: Aiwa CR-DS805 on ebay --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Christopher Cuff" wrote: > I have put my Aiwa CRDS805 radio on ebay- it is the only one I have. Search > "am stereo" to find it.. > Chris Someone else is selling an Aiwa HS-JX859 recording walkman and says it has AM Stereo. The price has climbe to $162.50 [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From jsgil@hal-pc.org Mon Mar 10 07:42:47 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 10 Mar 2003 15:42:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 17042 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2003 15:42:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Mar 2003 15:42:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Mar 2003 15:42:26 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.250] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 10 Mar 2003 15:42:16 -0000 Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2003 15:42:13 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: Aiwa CR-DS805 on ebay Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <008701c2e716$6de1b340$0701010a@keva> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 918 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.166 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Michael J. Richard" wrote: > I have that Aiwa recording walkman. If there were a way to figure out how to widen the bandwidth on the thing, I would. Other than that it is a wonderful unit. AM Stereo on it works beautifully, although a little muddy. Bought mine directly from Chuck Simpson a few years ago. Anyone hear from Chuck here lately on the list? Last I heard he was looking for work and then he just kinda disappeared. >=20 > Michael n WYO >=20 Although I have not done this but you might try Chris's trick of placing a small cap ~5-10pf across the ceramic filter to open up the BW. Of course the best choice is to find a wider ceramic filter like a =B17.5KHz one. Since this is a DTR, that means that the IF is at 450KHz and these are hard to find but if it was mechanically tuned then the older 50MHz cordless phones is a good source for them. JSG From michaelj@vcn.com Mon Mar 10 07:54:06 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 10 Mar 2003 15:54:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 60818 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2003 15:54:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Mar 2003 15:54:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m3-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.33) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Mar 2003 15:54:05 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m3-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Mon, 10 Mar 2003 08:54:04 -0700 Message-ID: <00c701c2e71d$4cabf1c0$0701010a@keva> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Aiwa CR-DS805 on ebay Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2003 08:54:12 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Thanks JS....I opened it up once. This thing is SO tiny and SO cramped tha= t it's hard to see anything. All resistors, ICs and such are the smallest = of smallest versions. Teeny tiny little things. Resistors are these littl= e things that are about 1mm or 2mm in length. This is one of my raritys th= at I paid a lot of money for, so I don't want to blow anything up. That's = why I haven't torn into it very deep. Everything inside is SO small, thoug= h. Honestly, I may have not wanted to pull it further apart....may have be= en only the PCB side I was looking at, not the component side. Yet, when I= travel, THIS is the walkman that I take with me.....because it records! S= o I can get airchecks! In AM Stereo no less!! So yeah, some decent bandwid= th would be a wonderful thing. Even the IC's are SO small and hardly legib= le when it comes to numbers on them. So yeah, my one attempt to identify t= he ceramic filter was a failed one. I just put it back together and sighed= . May get brave and try again one day. If I knew someone that had one or = had looked inside and could tell me exactly what to look for, I'd feel safe= r. MJR n WYO ----- Original Message -----=20 From: jsgilst=20 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com=20 Sent: Monday, March 10, 2003 8:42 AM Subject: {AMSF} Re: Aiwa CR-DS805 on ebay Although I have not done this but you might try Chris's trick of placing a small cap ~5-10pf across the ceramic filter to open up the BW. Of course the best choice is to find a wider ceramic filter like a =B17.5KHz one.=20 [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From michaelj@vcn.com Mon Mar 10 09:06:23 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 10 Mar 2003 17:06:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 22372 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2003 17:06:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Mar 2003 17:06:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m3-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.33) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Mar 2003 17:06:22 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m3-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Mon, 10 Mar 2003 10:06:22 -0700 Message-ID: <003a01c2e727$65d69e20$0701010a@keva> To: References: <000d01c2e688$0ac55340$af78fea9@juan> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Stereo 101 Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2003 10:06:30 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Juan I did some pretty extensive searching a while back for stereo versions of DC5 stuff. They're out there. I've found a lot of stuff like this can be obtained, but the CDs are imports. Use your favorite MP3 sharing program and actually put "dave clark stereo" in the search box and see what comes up. Most people that have them know that they are rare, and they'll actually include in the title "Dave Clark 5 - Glad All Over (rare stereo mix)" or something similar. I found a bunch. There are things like "Over and Over" that I think there never was a stereo version of. But I've got "Bits & Pieces", "can't you see that she's mine" and others in awesome stereo! Once you can get good MP3's of them, then you can make your own "DC5's Stereo Greatest Hits" cd. Otherwise I'd say go to your favorite CD/Tape store and see if they can special-order an import for ya. Michael n WYO ----- Original Message ----- From: Juan / John Gualda To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, March 09, 2003 3:05 PM Subject: {AMSF} Stereo 101 Does anybody know if there is a CD release of the Dave Clark 5 in Stereo ? I got a copy awhile back and the songs are in glorious mono. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From JH_Radio@GameBox.net Mon Mar 10 12:45:09 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: JH_Radio@GameBox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 10 Mar 2003 20:45:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 12811 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2003 20:45:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Mar 2003 20:45:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO babyruth.hotpop.com) (204.57.55.14) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Mar 2003 20:45:08 -0000 Received: from gamebox.net (kubrick.hotpop.com [204.57.55.16]) by babyruth.hotpop.com (Postfix) with SMTP id C397221576B for ; Mon, 10 Mar 2003 20:44:31 +0000 (UTC) Received: from John Holcomb II.GameBox.net (pcp03184855pcs.benslm01.pa.comcast.net [68.80.77.117]) by smtp-1.hotpop.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C5DCD1A0182 for ; Mon, 10 Mar 2003 20:43:13 +0000 (UTC) Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030310154655.00a66840@pop.GameBox.net> X-Sender: JH_Radio@pop.GameBox.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2003 15:49:36 -0800 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Stereo 101 In-Reply-To: <003a01c2e727$65d69e20$0701010a@keva> References: <000d01c2e688$0ac55340$af78fea9@juan> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-HotPOP: ----------------------------------------------- Sent By HotPOP.com FREE Email Get your FREE POP email at www.HotPOP.com ----------------------------------------------- From: John X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113800107 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I once downloaded stuff from "TomStereo123" on Napster. I downloaded as much as I could grab my little hands on! On WinMX, I am JH_Radio9261982. I shall be putting all of the stereo oldies I have (this is true stereo), from the 30's on up for download. I first need to get my third 40 GB drive in this computer though. For a total of 120 GB of space. At 10:06 AM 3/10/03 -0700, you wrote: >Juan >I did some pretty extensive searching a while back for stereo versions of DC5 stuff. They're out there. I've found a lot of stuff like this can be obtained, but the CDs are imports. Use your favorite MP3 sharing program and actually put "dave clark stereo" in the search box and see what comes up. Most people that have them know that they are rare, and they'll actually include in the title "Dave Clark 5 - Glad All Over (rare stereo mix)" or something similar. I found a bunch. There are things like "Over and Over" that I think there never was a stereo version of. But I've got "Bits & Pieces", "can't you see that she's mine" and others in awesome stereo! Once you can get good MP3's of them, then you can make your own "DC5's Stereo Greatest Hits" cd. Otherwise I'd say go to your favorite CD/Tape store and see if they can special-order an import for ya. > >Michael n WYO > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Juan / John Gualda > To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com > Sent: Sunday, March 09, 2003 3:05 PM > Subject: {AMSF} Stereo 101 > > > > Does anybody know if there is a CD release of the Dave Clark 5 in Stereo ? I got a copy awhile back and the songs are in glorious mono. > > >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > >Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Love in Christ: John Bensalem, PA Send me an email Aim: RainAngelsRule MSN: RainAngelsRule@hotmail.com My website Welcome to Napster4TheBlind "Prayer does not change God; it changes you." - Authur unknown [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From jsgil@hal-pc.org Mon Mar 10 13:14:03 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 10 Mar 2003 21:14:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 35970 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2003 21:14:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Mar 2003 21:14:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Mar 2003 21:14:02 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.165] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 10 Mar 2003 21:13:58 -0000 Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2003 21:13:57 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Aiwa CR-DS805 on ebay Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <00c701c2e71d$4cabf1c0$0701010a@keva> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 2320 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.130.17 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Michael J. Richard" wrote: Download this PDF file from muRata. It has pictures of various ceramic filters including SMD ones. See if you can find a picture that looks similar. There are a couple of manufacturers of these, muRata being one of them. If it is a muRata then you might be able to match the part number and get the pinout if it isn't too old. muRata has changed a bunch of part numbers and discontinued many that were ideal for AMS. Pinouts are usually standard across the brands so if it is another brand then you still may be able to recognize it and find an appropriate pinout. http://www.murata.com/catalog/p10e5.pdf > Thanks JS....I opened it up once. This thing is SO tiny and SO cramped that it's hard to see anything. All resistors, ICs and such are the smallest of smallest versions. Teeny tiny little things.=20 Resistors are these little things that are about 1mm or 2mm in length. This is one of my raritys that I paid a lot of money for, so I don't want to blow anything up. That's why I haven't torn into it very deep. Everything inside is SO small, though. Honestly, I may have not wanted to pull it further apart....may have been only the PCB side I was looking at, not the component side. Yet, when I travel, THIS is the walkman that I take with me.....because it records! So I can get airchecks! In AM Stereo no less!! So yeah, some decent bandwidth would be a wonderful thing. Even the IC's are SO small and hardly legible when it comes to numbers on them. So yeah, my one attempt to identify the ceramic filter was a failed one. I just put it back together and sighed. May get brave and try again one day. If I knew someone that had one or had looked inside and could tell me exactly what to look for, I'd feel safer. >=20 > MJR n WYO >=20 > ----- Original Message -----=20 > From: jsgilst=20 > To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com=20 > Sent: Monday, March 10, 2003 8:42 AM > Subject: {AMSF} Re: Aiwa CR-DS805 on ebay >=20 >=20 > Although I have not done this but you might try Chris's trick > of placing a small cap ~5-10pf across the ceramic filter to > open up the BW. Of course the best choice is to find a wider > ceramic filter like a =B17.5KHz one.=20 >=20 > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From michaelj@vcn.com Mon Mar 10 14:25:18 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 10 Mar 2003 22:25:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 75906 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2003 22:25:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Mar 2003 22:25:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m2-cluster2.vcn.com) (209.193.72.41) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Mar 2003 22:25:16 -0000 Received: from michael (unverified [209.193.86.60]) by m2-cluster2.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Mon, 10 Mar 2003 15:25:15 -0700 To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} Re: OT: Roll To Stereo Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2003 15:24:28 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 In-Reply-To: From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit That's actually a good question Kevin. Anywhere and everywhere I've ever seen and/or heard Winchester Cathedral, it's always been the mono version. I'd be curious myself to know if there's a stereo version of it! :) MJR n WYO -----Original Message----- From: Kevin T. [mailto:kevtronics@yahoo.com] Sent: Sunday, March 09, 2003 8:41 PM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: OT: Roll To Stereo BTW... I feel silly asking about this, but does a Stereo version exist of the '60s novelty hit "Winchester Cathedral" by The New Vaudeville Band? I happen to like it, in a "Laugh-In" sort of way, but the version I have is in glorious monaural. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From ccuff@in4web.com Mon Mar 10 14:29:50 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 10 Mar 2003 22:29:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 40210 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2003 22:29:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 10 Mar 2003 22:29:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 10 Mar 2003 22:29:49 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [216.221.131.220]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Mon, 10 Mar 2003 17:27:01 -0500 Message-ID: <000601c2e754$b7f43820$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: OT: Roll To Stereo Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2003 17:30:55 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 This reminds me of a spoff that the late Alan Sherman did of this song- called "Westchester Haddasah" Alan was a hilarious Jewish comedian, and I still listen to his old albums- just as funny as ever. CC ----- Original Message ----- From: Michael J. Richard To: Sent: Monday, March 10, 2003 5:24 PM Subject: RE: {AMSF} Re: OT: Roll To Stereo > That's actually a good question Kevin. Anywhere and everywhere I've ever > seen and/or heard Winchester Cathedral, it's always been the mono version. > I'd be curious myself to know if there's a stereo version of it! :) > > MJR n WYO From stodd@sherbtel.net Mon Mar 10 17:39:54 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 11 Mar 2003 01:39:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 54274 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2003 01:39:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Mar 2003 01:39:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Mar 2003 01:39:53 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-245.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.245]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h2B1dole024058 for ; Mon, 10 Mar 2003 19:39:51 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <001101c2e76f$8e8ebb20$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: OT: Roll To Stereo Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2003 19:43:01 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude We've got a station up here that's using about 7-1/2 miles of dry pair to get the audio to the transmitter, and it sounds like it. TX is far enough off freq. to create falsing (KWOM 1600- Watertown MN.) I know a guy that does some part time engineering work for them and I think they're finally going to install a microwave STL, but they don't have direct line of sight to the towers. 1/4 wave at 1600 is none too tall. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "bradleyj923" But now it > sounds...well, almost like they are using a telephone instead of an > STL...No bass and no treble. From stodd@sherbtel.net Mon Mar 10 18:19:04 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 11 Mar 2003 02:18:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 6755 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2003 02:12:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Mar 2003 02:12:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Mar 2003 02:12:47 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-245.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.245]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h2B2Ccle003868; Mon, 10 Mar 2003 20:12:39 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <008c01c2e774$24062400$827dfea9@home1> To: , Subject: first HD Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2003 20:13:42 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Got my first "HD" station late Sunday afternoon. Heard WCHB 1200 out of Detroit. Heard them before and after they dropped the digital. Couldn't miss the hash with the HD; analog audio didn't sound too bad, but then I didn't have a strong enough signal to really do a good A/B. Also noticed the Princeton MN station (WQPM- 1300) might have a new BE transmitter. Got a definite stereo indication; audio in the left channel only. No idea if they're going full-fledged stereo or if it was just hooked up that way and the stereo generator accidentally left on. Hope to ask sometime later this week. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From kfornal@cox.net Mon Mar 10 18:26:43 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kfornal@cox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 11 Mar 2003 02:26:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 62337 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2003 02:07:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Mar 2003 02:07:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO lakemtao03.cox.net) (68.1.17.242) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Mar 2003 02:07:03 -0000 Received: from OMNIBOOK ([68.9.127.164]) by lakemtao03.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20030311020703.STUQ8666.lakemtao03.cox.net@OMNIBOOK> for ; Mon, 10 Mar 2003 21:07:03 -0500 To: Subject: RE: {AMSF} 1520 WWKB: The light's on, but nobody's home Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2003 21:06:26 -0500 Message-ID: <001301c2e772$d5e99be0$0301a8c0@OMNIBOOK> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2616 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal From: "Keith Fornal" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=128541479 X-Yahoo-Profile: theradboy Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From NorthEast Radio Watch by Scott Fybush (3/10) "Over in Buffalo, that's an AM stereo pilot light we've been seeing illuminated when we've been listening to WWKB (1520) the last few days - and it sounds like there's even some stereo music being played there now. It's nice to hear..." http://www.fybush.com/nerw.html Keith Fornal Treasurer Dutch Island Lighthouse Society www.dutchislandlighthouse.org -----Original Message----- From: Kevin T. [mailto:kevtronics@yahoo.com] Sent: Saturday, March 08, 2003 7:22 PM To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} 1520 WWKB: The light's on, but nobody's home I can confirm with 99% certainty that Buffalo's 50,000-watt 1520 WWKB is indeed transmitting an AM Stereo signal once again, after being in mono since mid-January... but there is no true Stereo separation to be heard from them, even during their Oldies music programming. To be honest, I haven't heard any true Stereo from WWKB since the demise of their satellite-fed "Real Country" format in the late '90s, but evidently they have made the effort to bring the C-Quam exciter back in operation, so hopefully they'll put it to good use and start transmitting full Stereo sound once again. Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ADVERTISEMENT Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From bjackson@indyradio.com Mon Mar 10 20:40:27 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 11 Mar 2003 04:40:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 59614 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2003 04:40:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Mar 2003 04:40:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Mar 2003 04:40:25 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.147] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Mar 2003 04:40:20 -0000 Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2003 04:40:19 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: OT: Roll To Stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <001101c2e76f$8e8ebb20$827dfea9@home1> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 987 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923" X-Originating-IP: 64.25.100.8 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Scott Todd" wrote: > We've got a station up here that's using about 7-1/2 miles of dry pair to > get the audio to the transmitter, and it sounds like it. TX is far enough > off freq. to create falsing (KWOM 1600- Watertown MN.) I know a guy that > does some part time engineering work for them and I think they're finally > going to install a microwave STL, but they don't have direct line of sight > to the towers. 1/4 wave at 1600 is none too tall. > > ST When I was growing up, WCSI was a great sounding AC station in C-Quam using eq'ed lines to the transmitter. However, these days they are a mono talk station using (from what I understand) an STL. And the STL sounds *worse* than the old Ameritech lines did! Using Cool Edit 2000, there is little to no response below 250hz, and above 3.5khz. And this is off both a Carver tx-11a and a Sony SRF-42. Brad Jackson Susquehanna, Indianapolis http://www.indyradio.com From jbyrns@rcn.com Mon Mar 10 20:48:50 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@rcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 11 Mar 2003 04:48:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 14555 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2003 04:48:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Mar 2003 04:48:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Mar 2003 04:48:49 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.180] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Mar 2003 04:48:49 -0000 Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2003 04:48:48 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: OT: Roll To Stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <001101c2e76f$8e8ebb20$827dfea9@home1> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1728 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bta_50g" X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.5 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=138635554 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g I'm not sure what this prejudice against telephone lines is all about? Sure they are now an obsolescent technology, but at one time they were the standard way to hook the studio up with the transmitter. The station I worked at while I was in college many years ago used a pair of telephone lines for the FM stereo STL. They were also probably about 7-1/2 miles in length, and they sounded just fine to me. They were equalized flat up to 15 kHz, and the bass was limited only by the quality of the repeating coils in the circuit, which were plenty good. The television video, and audio, went via a microwave STL, so a microwave STL for the FM should have been doable, but the phone lines worked just fine, and sounded great. I notice you used the term "dry pair", what do you mean when you say "dry pair"? I get the feeling that you are using the term to mean something different than what I assumed it means. I wish I had a dictionary of telephony terms, to see what the official definition is. John --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Scott Todd" wrote: > We've got a station up here that's using about 7-1/2 miles of dry > pair to get the audio to the transmitter, and it sounds like it. > TX is far enough off freq. to create falsing (KWOM 1600- Watertown > MN.) I know a guy that does some part time engineering work for > them and I think they're finally going to install a microwave STL, > but they don't have direct line of sight to the towers. 1/4 wave at > 1600 is none too tall. > > ST > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "bradleyj923" > > But now it sounds...well, almost like they are using a telephone > > instead of an STL...No bass and no treble. From jsgil@hal-pc.org Mon Mar 10 21:15:59 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 11 Mar 2003 05:15:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 50406 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2003 05:15:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Mar 2003 05:15:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Mar 2003 05:15:40 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.175] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Mar 2003 05:15:40 -0000 Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2003 05:15:39 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: OT: Roll To Stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 881 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.14 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "bta_50g" wrote: > > I notice you used the term "dry pair", what do you mean when you say > "dry pair"? I get the feeling that you are using the term to mean > something different than what I assumed it means. I wish I had a > dictionary of telephony terms, to see what the official definition is. > A dry pair is a direct physical connection from point A to point B that has no electrical connections to the switch. There is no way for a switch to disconnect it or to tap into it. It shouldn't have any repeating coils either so the bass should have a flat response and should pass a DC current. They were also used for alarm system monitoring. I have heard of people asking for a dry pair saying it is for some type of monitoring and then connecting ISDL modems at each end and getting 144kbps transfer rate. JSG From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Mar 10 23:06:57 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 11 Mar 2003 07:06:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 64599 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2003 07:06:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Mar 2003 07:06:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Mar 2003 07:06:56 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.146] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Mar 2003 07:06:56 -0000 Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2003 07:06:54 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: 1520 WWKB: The light's on, but nobody's home Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <001301c2e772$d5e99be0$0301a8c0@OMNIBOOK> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2614 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.94.135 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > From NorthEast Radio Watch by Scott Fybush (3/10) > > "Over in Buffalo, that's an AM stereo pilot light we've been seeing > illuminated when we've been listening to WWKB (1520) the last few > days - and it sounds like there's even some stereo music being > played there now. It's nice to hear..." More news from the NERW: "Out in Queens[, NY], a Long Island radio station has applied for a synchronous booster to bring its Korean programming to an area that doesn't get much signal right now. WGSM (740 Huntington) wants to run 250 watts day, 40 watts night from a very short (8-meter) antenna near the corner of Sanford Avenue (42nd Avenue) and Union Street in Flushing, just a block or so from the Flushing subway station. The application filed this week calls for the calls WG2XSM for what would be the first 'experimental' synchronous operation in New York state." Could this be a response to 740 WGSM's signal being trashed by splatter from 710 WOR's IBOC signal? I have personally tested over a dozen home, car, and portable radios in many different locations and they all pick up moderate to severe amounts of splatter from WOR's digital signal on 740 and 750 kHz. As we have discussed before, this *shouldn't* happen, because WOR's IBOC signal is strictly contained to the 695-725 kHz range when it comes out of the transmitter, but various receiver-based effects cause a much wider range of interference to be heard, even at distances up to 50+ miles away from the transmitter, where "front end overload" is not normally a problem with plain analog signals (including WOR's when they're not transmitting IBOC). Even though I live well outside of 740 WGSM's primary coverage area, it is my experience that when WOR isn't transmitting IBOC, my daytime reception of WGSM is perfectly clear, even on an average Panasonic stereo system using only the built-in antenna. But when WOR has their digital signal on, my reception of WGSM becomes nothing but the dreaded "hash" -- even on a GE Superadio III and on highly selective receivers including car radios with 3 kHz ceramic filters. And chances are, other WGSM listeners are hearing this as well -- hence the need for them to boost their signal in any way they can, as it doesn't appear that WOR will stop using IBOC anytime soon. And finally, in related news from the NERW: "Digital radio came to Syracuse this week as well; Radio Disney outlet WOLF (1490 Syracuse) is reportedly now running the Ibiquity digital system, the first station upstate (and only the second in the state, after New York's WOR) to do so." From jim@burgan.net Mon Mar 10 23:13:13 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jim@burgan.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 11 Mar 2003 07:13:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 4902 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2003 07:13:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Mar 2003 07:13:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO iquest2.iquest.net) (206.246.180.13) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Mar 2003 07:13:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 24660 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2003 07:13:02 -0000 Received: from mas.iquest.net (206.246.180.19) by iquest2.iquest.net with SMTP; 11 Mar 2003 07:13:02 -0000 Received: from jimspc (iq-col-as001-31.iquest.net [209.43.58.31]) by mas.iquest.net (Mirapoint Messaging Server MOS 3.3.2-CR) with SMTP id ABX00257; Tue, 11 Mar 2003 02:13:00 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <002401c2e79d$a7cb1060$9802a8c0@jimspc> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: OT: Audio over phone wires? Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2003 02:11:29 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Jim Burgan" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=36730433 X-Yahoo-Profile: jimbo700 < bta_50g wrote: > >I'm not sure what this prejudice against telephone lines is all about? >Sure they are now an obsolescent technology, but at one time they were >the standard way to hook the studio up with the transmitter. We have a single pair in use at our cluster, but we use it to send audio from the transmitter site to the studios. The line was originally installed when we put a Marti receiver at the transmitter site of one of our FM'S. The Marti antenna is at the 300' level on the tower and it allows us incredible range (but we do get occasional interference from Metro traffic from another market 70 miles away on one of our frequencies). The we became an affiliate of the Indianapolis Colts and this required another satellite dish. Our rooftop was maxed out with non-penetrating roof mounts and there is absolutely no real estate so our only option was to put the dish/receiver at the same transmitter site as our Marti receiver. I put a switch on the transmitter remote control so we can dial-in and switch from the Marti to the Colts. The audio from both is excellent quality and I used it to send mono-audio to the transmitter site for a few hours when our STL failed. It actually sounded pretty good. ========== As a follow-up to Brad's statement about WCSI in Columbus Indiana... 15 years ago it was a great sounding AM stereo AC broadcasting with 500 watts on 1010. The coverage for 500 watts was outstanding. I remember sitting in Dayton Ohio 120 miles away listening to them with minimal static. Their problems actually began when they built a new 500' stick for their FM. In doing so they cut the grounding radials, which were never repaired or replaced. Due to the increased height of the tower, they wee forced to cut their power to 330 watts days (13 watts night). Still they sounded decent and the C Quam stereo was slightly above average.. When they went News/Talk they shut down the C Quam stereo generator, and when they conformed to the FCC's AM "clean-up suggestions" (NRSC) in the early 90's, they began clipping all high-end audio and the rest is history. In addition, the original night-time authorization of 20 watts would cover the COL adequately since 1010 is a Candian Clear and there was nothing at all radiating our way. CFRB has a null to the south so they don't waste their signal. But another problem started in the late 80's when the owners of 1010 WINS (NY) purchased KLRA in Little Rock. KLRA had historical 'squatter's rights on 1010 so WINS had to protect them at night. They purchased KLRA for the purpose of taking it dark so they 'let out' the night-time pattern for WINS. As a result of the demise of KRLA, stations in St Louis and other markets got night-time status (becoming class B's) and the formerly quiet 1010 kHz developed a high noise platform. Today, WCSI's 13 watts are barely audible in Columbus (2 miles from the stick) on December and January nights. However, 20 miles to the south is a property owned by Susquehanna and they are without-a-doubt one of the best sounding AM Stereo stations in America! If any of you are ever driving up/down I-65 between Indianapolis and Louisville, check out WZZB on 1390. They are a 1KW daytimer with 70-something watts at night but it sounds as good as most FM's. They are a satellite-delivered AC and they sound incredible. Sorry for the lengthy (somewhat) off-topic post. I will go back into lurk mode.... From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Mar 10 23:18:52 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 11 Mar 2003 07:18:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 37387 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2003 07:18:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Mar 2003 07:18:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.75) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Mar 2003 07:18:51 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.135] by n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Mar 2003 07:18:51 -0000 Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2003 07:18:49 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: WOR audio improvement Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1481 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.94.135 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics After months of broadcasting extremely distorted audio with as little as 4 kHz of frequency response, I have noticed that 710 WOR is now back to transmitting a 6.2 kHz audio bandwidth, even during the daytime with the IBOC digital signal on -- therefore going against iBiquity's guidelines which call for a strict 5 kHz "brick wall" filter. However, experience on WOR has proven that their Optimod's 5 kHz filter provides a very harsh, distorted sound, while one step up at the 6.2 kHz filter, the sound is perfectly clear and undistorted -- and that is thankfully what WOR is now transmitting. Even on "normal" AM radios, the difference is immediately noticeable, and WOR sounds much more crisp and clean and more comparable in fidelity and loudness to the other 100% analog stations on the AM dial. It's still missing that top end of the treble response, but the 6.2 kHz setting seems to be a good compromise for both ordinary narrow-bandwidth radios and AMAX-type wide-bandwidth receivers. And since it will still be an indeterminate amount of time before we can actually walk into a store any buy an IBOC/"HD Radio" digital receiver, thus it becomes especially important for these IBOC stations to focus at least some of their effort on providing an analog signal of reasonably good quality -- as inferior audio will just end up driving listeners away and make them even more skeptical about purchasing an IBOC receiver if/when they do become available. From bjackson@indyradio.com Tue Mar 11 00:44:29 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 11 Mar 2003 08:44:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 30761 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2003 08:44:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Mar 2003 08:44:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.90) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Mar 2003 08:44:29 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.175] by n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Mar 2003 08:44:29 -0000 Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2003 08:44:28 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: OT: Audio over phone wires? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <002401c2e79d$a7cb1060$9802a8c0@jimspc> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1693 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923" X-Originating-IP: 64.25.100.2 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Jim Burgan" wrote: > However, 20 miles to the south is a property owned by Susquehanna and they > are without-a-doubt one of the best sounding AM Stereo stations in America! > If any of you are ever driving up/down I-65 between Indianapolis and > Louisville, check out WZZB on 1390. > They are a 1KW daytimer with 70-something watts at night but it sounds as > good as most FM's. They are a satellite-delivered AC and they sound > incredible. > Sorry for the lengthy (somewhat) off-topic post. > I will go back into lurk mode.... And Jim, you may have missed this from an older post, but I have a (large) MP3 of our very own wzzb at http://iw1.indyweb.net/~bjackson That's from an AMAX Sony receiver. I hope to get down that way soon with either my tx-11a or my Sansui AMAX tuner and get an even better aircheck...During either AM or PM drive when they are live. The signal here in Indy is a little too scratchy for me to put up a recording made from here...But then again I have 1260 WNDE's stick in my back yard, too. Even with only 1kw, I still get a decent signal in my car in downtown Indianapolis...Enough to light the pilot! Also, Jim, Have you noticed that ever since WKRP (now WNVI) killed the stereo, they only have one channel hooked up? Any time they play an oldie that has hard left/hard right audio, only one comes through. I've talked with Pete (the old owner now doing contract work for Radio One Louisville...BTW Chuckie-B says hello) and he said when he sold the station, all C-Quam equipment was taken out by White River (WCSI's owner). Brad Jackson Susquehanna, Indianapolis http://www.indyradio.com From jbyrns@rcn.com Tue Mar 11 08:27:02 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@rcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 11 Mar 2003 16:27:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 29707 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2003 16:27:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Mar 2003 16:27:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.88) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Mar 2003 16:27:00 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.140] by n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Mar 2003 16:27:00 -0000 Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2003 16:26:59 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: OT: Roll To Stereo Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2233 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bta_50g" X-Originating-IP: 216.80.98.51 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=138635554 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "jsgilst" wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "bta_50g" wrote: > > > I notice you used the term "dry pair", what do you mean when you > > say "dry pair"? I get the feeling that you are using the term to > > mean something different than what I assumed it means. I wish I > > had a dictionary of telephony terms, to see what the official > > definition is. > > A dry pair is a direct physical connection from point A to point B > that has no electrical connections to the switch. There is no way > for a switch to disconnect it or to tap into it. It shouldn't have > any repeating coils either so the bass should have a flat response > and should pass a DC current. They were also used for alarm system > monitoring. I have heard of people asking for a dry pair saying it > is for some type of monitoring and then connecting ISDL modems at > each end and getting 144kbps transfer rate. Hmm, I think we need that dictionary of "telephony" terms, anyone got one? What you are calling a "dry pair" is what I would call a "metallic pair". My understanding was that "dry pair" vs. "wet pair" referred to whether or not there was DC current passing through the pair, or a "sealing current" as I think it is sometimes called by the telephone company. As I understood it, a "dry pair" has no DC current, while a "wet pair" is one with a DC current flowing through it. As far as repeating coils go, they are absolutely essential in this type of circuit to minimize hum and other noise, which will be greatly increased if the pair is not perfectly balanced. The telco repeating coils are specifically designed to have the best possible balance on the line side. The input transformers in the radio station equipment are generally not designed to the same high standards as far as balance goes, and the input attenuators in the radio equipment were usually of the unbalanced type. In addition, the telco equalizers used at the transmitter site to equalize the line were and unbalanced design. Repeating coils are essential between the line and all this unbalanced equipment, to maximize the Signal to Noise Ratio of the line. John From jbyrns@rcn.com Tue Mar 11 08:38:04 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@rcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 11 Mar 2003 16:38:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 52161 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2003 16:38:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Mar 2003 16:38:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Mar 2003 16:38:04 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.162] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Mar 2003 16:38:04 -0000 Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2003 16:38:02 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: WOR audio improvement Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2190 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bta_50g" X-Originating-IP: 216.80.98.51 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=138635554 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g Maybe someone ought to just ask WOR why the change in audio band width was made, rather than speculating that it is a reaction to the poor audio performance of the 5 kHz filter in the Optimod 6200. If I were going to speculate like this I would think the switch from 5 kHz to 6.2 kHz audio was part of a predetermined test plan, designed to test all the modes and features of the "HD Radio" system. If I were iBiquity, that's certainly what I would be doing. I would want to know what the performance of my system was in the field, in each of its optional modes. John --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T." wrote: > After months of broadcasting extremely distorted audio with as > little as 4 kHz of frequency response, I have noticed that 710 WOR > is now back to transmitting a 6.2 kHz audio bandwidth, even during > the daytime with the IBOC digital signal on -- therefore going > against iBiquity's guidelines which call for a strict 5 kHz "brick > wall" filter. However, experience on WOR has proven that their > Optimod's 5 kHz filter provides a very harsh, distorted sound, while > one step up at the 6.2 kHz filter, the sound is perfectly clear and > undistorted -- and that is thankfully what WOR is now transmitting. > > Even on "normal" AM radios, the difference is immediately > noticeable, and WOR sounds much more crisp and clean and more > comparable in fidelity and loudness to the other 100% analog > stations on the AM dial. It's still missing that top end of the > treble response, but the 6.2 kHz setting seems to be a good > compromise for both ordinary narrow-bandwidth radios and AMAX-type > wide-bandwidth receivers. > > And since it will still be an indeterminate amount of time before we > can actually walk into a store any buy an IBOC/"HD Radio" digital > receiver, thus it becomes especially important for these IBOC > stations to focus at least some of their effort on providing an > analog signal of reasonably good quality -- as inferior audio will > just end up driving listeners away and make them even more skeptical > about purchasing an IBOC receiver if/when they do become available. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Mar 11 09:43:37 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 11 Mar 2003 17:43:36 -0000 Received: (qmail 73387 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2003 17:43:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Mar 2003 17:43:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Mar 2003 17:43:34 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.160] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Mar 2003 17:43:34 -0000 Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2003 17:43:32 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: WOR audio improvement Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1228 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Maybe someone ought to just ask WOR why the change in audio band > width was made, rather than speculating that it is a reaction to the > poor audio performance of the 5 kHz filter in the Optimod 6200. Frankly speaking, if I had a 50,000-watt station in the #1 market, I sure wouldn't want it to sound like crap. In order to attract listeners, any radio station has to have good programming, good reception, and good sound quality (generally in that order, with programming being most important). And in an area with direct competitors who are broadcasting full-quality analog audio (*cough*770 WABC*cough*), having noticeably poorer audio is a significant handicap, especially if the difference can be immediately noticed even on most "ordinary" low-fidelity AM radios. 6.2 kHz still ain't perfect compared to what AM radio is capable of delivering, but it's lightyears ahead of the Optimod's seriously flawed 5 kHz filter, and the improvement in loudness, fidelity, and clarity is tremendous -- not so much because of the extra 1.2 kHz of audio bandwidth, but because the 6.2 kHz filter manages to achieve its "brick wall" effect without any serious ringing, aliasing, or clipping distortion. From jbyrns@rcn.com Tue Mar 11 13:16:58 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@rcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 11 Mar 2003 21:16:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 30074 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2003 21:16:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Mar 2003 21:16:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Mar 2003 21:16:56 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.135] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Mar 2003 21:16:56 -0000 Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2003 21:16:55 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: WOR audio improvement Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2297 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bta_50g" X-Originating-IP: 216.80.98.209 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=138635554 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g But Kevin, you don't have a 50,000-watt station in the #1 market! Don't you think WOR's owners might not be in a better position than you to judge what might, or might not, be good for the station? I am also curious if anyone knows exactly what causes the alleged problem with the 5 kHz filter in the "Optimod" at WOR? I would think there are other possibilities that could be the cause of the problem besides the "Optimod". For instance could the problem be an artifact of the way the "analog" audio is combined with the "HD Radio" primary and secondary data sub carriers, before being feed to the AM input of the transmitter? It is conceivable that the details of the combining operation might differ between the two analog audio modes, causing the problem you have heard. I think we really need to hear from someone who knows what is going on before we blame the problem on the "Optimod", or any other individual part of the system. John --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T." wrote: > > Maybe someone ought to just ask WOR why the change in audio band > > width was made, rather than speculating that it is a reaction to > > the poor audio performance of the 5 kHz filter in the Optimod > > 6200. > > Frankly speaking, if I had a 50,000-watt station in the #1 market, I > sure wouldn't want it to sound like crap. In order to attract > listeners, any radio station has to have good programming, good > reception, and good sound quality (generally in that order, with > programming being most important). And in an area with direct > competitors who are broadcasting full-quality analog audio > (*cough*770 WABC*cough*), having noticeably poorer audio is a > significant handicap, especially if the difference can be > immediately noticed even on most "ordinary" low-fidelity AM radios. > > 6.2 kHz still ain't perfect compared to what AM radio is capable of > delivering, but it's lightyears ahead of the Optimod's seriously > flawed 5 kHz filter, and the improvement in loudness, fidelity, and > clarity is tremendous -- not so much because of the extra 1.2 kHz of > audio bandwidth, but because the 6.2 kHz filter manages to achieve > its "brick wall" effect without any serious ringing, aliasing, or > clipping distortion. From krichards@wor710.com Tue Mar 11 15:05:43 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 90037 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2003 23:05:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Mar 2003 23:05:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Mar 2003 23:05:29 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: krichards@wor710.com Received: from [66.218.67.157] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Mar 2003 23:05:29 -0000 X-Sender: krichards@wor710.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 11 Mar 2003 19:29:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 13864 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2003 19:29:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Mar 2003 19:29:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO buckleyradio.com) (161.58.14.6) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Mar 2003 19:29:04 -0000 Received: from kerrydesk (pool-162-83-160-52.ny5030.east.verizon.net [162.83.160.52]) by buckleyradio.com (8.12.6) id h2BJT3f1022140 for ; Tue, 11 Mar 2003 14:29:03 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <001701c2e803$e2a56030$2a01010a@kerrydesk> To: Subject: WOR HD Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2003 14:24:42 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Kerry Richards" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=136545831 X-Yahoo-Profile: kerryrichards710 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-eGroups-Edited-By: kevtronics X-eGroups-Approved-By: kevtronics via web; 11 Mar 2003 23:05:27 -0000 WOR is continuing testing for Ibiquity, and since Sunday we have been operating in the "8KHZ" mode so Ibiquity and others can complete testing required for this mode of operation. The legacy analog audio provided goes out only to about 6KHZ, and in this series of tests, we are evaluating the asymmetrical 125% positive peaks of the analog audio through the Ibiquity exciter, and a few other issues. We have been promised new software for our unit, which will bring us to the next level of the HD Radio stream, including better encoding, cleaner stereo operation, and a robust data stream for the radio display, we expect this shortly. When this happens we will also be upgrading both reference receivers, and expect more improvements to the system. The HD 8kKHZ mode is not as robust for the HD receivers, since in this mode both digital sidebands must be received for the unit to play in the HD mode. This mode may in fact be used by many AM broadcasters in the transition to HD. (With the 5KHZ HD mode, one or the other sidebands coupled with the tertiary digital carriers are enough to produce an HD signal at the receiver.) Once there is a proliferation of HD Radios in the marketplace we more than likely will see the 5KHZ HD mode which provides a more robust HD stream, put into use. Those broadcasters who do not require such a robust stream in their marketplace may be able to operate in the 8KHZ mode all the time. Here in NYC, I think we will need the more robust mode to make it into the canyons of Manhattan, this testing will help in that determination. This is why the testing is continuing, to collect more data. WOR has been an important part of this testing process. We are very pleased to be pioneers in testing out Ibiquity's HD Radio system, it's been very rewarding for us, and has generated lots of listener interest. Everybody wants to know where they can buy an HD Radio. Stay Tuned.... Kerry Richards Chief Engineer WOR-AM Buckley Broadcasting Corporation From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Mar 11 15:14:25 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 11 Mar 2003 23:14:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 48227 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2003 23:14:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 11 Mar 2003 23:14:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 11 Mar 2003 23:14:04 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.170] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Mar 2003 23:14:04 -0000 Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2003 23:14:04 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: WOR audio improvement Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 966 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 207.200.161.247 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > I am also curious if anyone knows exactly what causes the alleged > problem with the 5 kHz filter in the "Optimod" at WOR? I would > think there are other possibilities that could be the cause of the > problem besides the "Optimod". For instance could the problem be > an artifact of the way the "analog" audio is combined with the "HD > Radio" primary and secondary data sub carriers, before being feed > to the AM input of the transmitter? When operating in 5 kHz mode, this problem was observed on WOR even at night, with the IBOC off. Therefore, the generation of the IBOC digital sidebands is not the issue. Other non-IBOC AM stations have tested their Optimods with the 5 kHz filter enabled and noticed the same problem with audio distortion. Even WOR's engineer has stated that the Optimod's 5 kHz filter is the culprit, but claimed that the distortion generated by it is not noticeable on a typical narrowband receiver (to which I disagree). From fanfare@globility.com Tue Mar 11 16:35:14 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 12 Mar 2003 00:35:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 67805 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2003 00:35:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Mar 2003 00:35:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Mar 2003 00:35:10 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.129] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 12 Mar 2003 00:35:02 -0000 Date: Wed, 12 Mar 2003 00:34:09 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: WOR HD Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <001701c2e803$e2a56030$2a01010a@kerrydesk> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1243 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Mr.M S" X-Originating-IP: 64.56.235.98 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kerry Richards" wrote: > WOR is continuing testing for Ibiquity, and since Sunday we have been operating in the "8KHZ" mode so Ibiquity and others can complete > > This is why the testing is continuing, to collect more data. WOR has been an important part of this testing process. We are very pleased to be pioneers in testing out Ibiquity's HD Radio system, it's been very rewarding for us, and has generated lots of listener interest. Everybody wants to know where they can buy an HD Radio. > > Stay Tuned.... > > Kerry Richards I realize the term "everyone" is often used as a figure of speech. It's a lot like the word "demand", which was used by an iBiquity official in a 99-325 submission when describing the public's reaction to the introduction of IBOC. Both are definitive references and we both know that neither is an accurate description of public reaction to HD-radio ... although if it was and all things were equal, we'd all be very happy campers indeed. BTW, I can understand the how and why any big city AM would need a boost getting into its concrete canyons, but are able to get an AM HD radio signal into an office tower yet? M.S. From stodd@sherbtel.net Tue Mar 11 17:43:15 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 12 Mar 2003 01:43:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 67296 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2003 01:43:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Mar 2003 01:43:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Mar 2003 01:43:13 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-108.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.108]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h2C1h9le021808 for ; Tue, 11 Mar 2003 19:43:11 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <002801c2e839$31b635c0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: OT: Roll To Stereo Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2003 19:46:23 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Dry pair as in burglar alarm type- no amps, no EQ. Nothing against telco loops as long as they're done right. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "bta_50g" > I notice you used the term "dry pair", what do you mean when you say > "dry pair"? I get the feeling that you are using the term to mean > something different than what I assumed it means. I wish I had a > dictionary of telephony terms, to see what the official definition is. > > John > > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Scott Todd" wrote: > > We've got a station up here that's using about 7-1/2 miles of dry > > pair to get the audio to the transmitter, and it sounds like it. > > TX is far enough off freq. to create falsing (KWOM 1600- Watertown > > MN.) I know a guy that does some part time engineering work for > > them and I think they're finally going to install a microwave STL, From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Mar 11 19:54:09 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 12 Mar 2003 03:54:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 68758 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2003 03:54:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Mar 2003 03:54:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Mar 2003 03:54:09 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.189] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 12 Mar 2003 03:54:09 -0000 Date: Wed, 12 Mar 2003 03:54:09 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Panasonic AM Stereo generator Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 622 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.73.21 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics Here's a Panasonic VP-8254P AM Stereo signal generator on eBay. It is very similar to the one I have, except this one is C-Quam-only instead of multi-system. Nevertheless, it will produce a very high quality AM Stereo signal on any frequency you choose from 200 to 2000 kHz; use it on the workbench to test receivers, or hook it up to an antenna and use it as a low-power FCC Part 15-type transmitter. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2514922466 The starting (and likely final) bid price is $129.00; this is from the same seller as I got mine from (no complaints). This one needs a good home! From possumhunter@netzero.net Tue Mar 11 20:37:46 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 12 Mar 2003 04:37:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 48105 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2003 04:37:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Mar 2003 04:37:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.192) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Mar 2003 04:37:44 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 11 Mar 2003 20:37:44 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: WOR audio improvement Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2003 23:37:28 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 12 Mar 2003 04:37:44.0388 (UTC) FILETIME=[1FD59040:01C2E851] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.149.101.250] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 bta_50g wrote: > I am also curious if anyone knows exactly what causes the alleged problem with the 5 kHz filter in the "Optimod" at WOR? I *think* it is in the way the DSP works in the Optimod 9200. The 9200 that lives in the rack at WFIS has the same ringing distortion in the 5Khz filter, and I am not too impressed by the sound of it even in the NRSC mode. An Omnia 4.5 AM is on my wish list. Bob Orban dropped the ball on the 9200. The 9100s were better boxes. Too bad Dorrough Electronics isn't in the AM processor business anymore. Kevin From ai4i@hotmail.com Wed Mar 12 07:52:08 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ai4i@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 12 Mar 2003 15:51:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 38999 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2003 15:51:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Mar 2003 15:51:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.70) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Mar 2003 15:51:49 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.178] by n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 12 Mar 2003 15:51:46 -0000 Date: Wed, 12 Mar 2003 15:51:46 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: 1110khz Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 648 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Joel Wilson" X-Originating-IP: 216.77.209.44 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=127893550 X-Yahoo-Profile: ai4ijoel I had always thought that KFAB was dominant on 1110, and that WBT goes directional at night to protect them. I recently discovered http://www.radio-locator.com and in checking some signal patterns out, found that KFAB also has a null in the general direction toward Charlotte. Is there a third station between them that they mutually protect, or perhaps one increased its facility after the other came on, so they both protect each other? I am confused. I currently have no AM stereo equipment (The Sony SRF-1 Walkman is long dead), but I remember that WBT stuck with K-H longer than most stations. BTW...it is a great reference web site. From amymousie@yahoo.com Wed Mar 12 11:27:55 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 12 Mar 2003 19:27:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 4154 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2003 19:27:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Mar 2003 19:27:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Mar 2003 19:27:52 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.153] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 12 Mar 2003 19:27:52 -0000 Date: Wed, 12 Mar 2003 19:27:52 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: )))...In Living AM Stereo...((( Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 893 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie" X-Originating-IP: 66.127.243.157 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie Getting back to demonstration-grade stereo music, I think I would recommend any reissues of RCA's "Living Stereo" series recordings, released and/or recorded from 1953-1967, or at least just about any RCA stereo recording of that period. (Most were classical, jazz and pop recordings, with a few early rock & roll recordings along the way.) On a more modern tangent, Erasure's CD "Other People's Songs" has excellent stereo sound- Especially Erasure's cover of "Video Killed the Radio Star", which I think is the best of the tracks on the CD. :) I did find Neon Philharmonic's "Morning Girl" (1969) online- Get the full parts 1 & 2 MP3 at nearly 5 minutes total. Instrumentation is sharply left and right, with vocals centered. Really good song, too. Now, if I could just find that 4 Seasons song I heard somewhere that mentions being surrounded by sound....... Amy. <:3 )~~8~ From stodd@sherbtel.net Wed Mar 12 17:03:06 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 13 Mar 2003 01:03:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 49924 invoked from network); 13 Mar 2003 01:02:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Mar 2003 01:02:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Mar 2003 01:02:28 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-129.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.129]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h2D12Ple008539 for ; Wed, 12 Mar 2003 19:02:26 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <002301c2e8fc$ac173580$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} 1110khz Date: Wed, 12 Mar 2003 19:05:40 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude They protect each other. They're what used to be referred to as class 1-B stations. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Joel Wilson" > I had always thought that KFAB was dominant on 1110, and that WBT > goes directional at night to protect them. I recently discovered > http://www.radio-locator.com and in checking some signal patterns > out, found that KFAB also has a null in the general direction toward > Charlotte. From krichards@wor710.com Wed Mar 12 20:13:40 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 11783 invoked from network); 13 Mar 2003 04:13:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Mar 2003 04:13:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.64) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Mar 2003 04:13:38 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: krichards@wor710.com Received: from [66.218.67.130] by n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Mar 2003 04:13:38 -0000 X-Sender: krichards@wor710.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 12 Mar 2003 23:05:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 55291 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2003 23:04:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Mar 2003 23:04:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO buckleyradio.com) (161.58.14.6) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Mar 2003 23:04:08 -0000 Received: from kerrydesk (pool-162-83-160-52.ny5030.east.verizon.net [162.83.160.52]) by buckleyradio.com (8.12.6) id h2CN473D025556 for ; Wed, 12 Mar 2003 18:04:07 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <001001c2e8eb$19d9add0$2a01010a@kerrydesk> To: Subject: Whoa!!! Hold your Optimods! Date: Wed, 12 Mar 2003 17:59:50 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Kerry Richards" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=136545831 X-Yahoo-Profile: kerryrichards710 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-eGroups-Approved-By: kevtronics via web; 13 Mar 2003 04:13:37 -0000 Hey AM Stereo Buddies: I never said any ringing was coming from the WOR 9200 in any mode. This is merely an observation made on this forum, which has become a legend and blown out of proportion. First, the slight problem we had at 5khz was due to "double" filtering, in the IBOC airchain. We discovered a glitch in Ibiquity's software, which left us trying to roll of the audio too sharply, and was reducing our positive peaks somewhat. I have never reset any settings on the 9200, which has been in the 6KHZ mode since we turned on the HD Radio. I did not like the rolloff in the actual HD exciter so I have been using Orban's unit to roll off our audio. (Which sounds fine...) A replacement version of HD software turned out to be the problem. We have been serious about this HD testing, and there has been a lot of back and forth with Ibiquity. WOR is doing a lot of the "grunt" work. The glitch it turns out was doing something other than what we wanted, and took a few weeks to identify and correct. Plus, we were in the middle of some extensive testing, so we had to complete that before we could address the "legacy" audio issues. Sometimes you have to take a few steps back to get forward. This issue has now been completely identified and Ibiquity's lab is working on the issues of the 5KHZ HD mode while we operate in the 8KHZ HD mode. We are very pleased with the current analog signal, and hope to keep it this way from now on. We are mainly talk, and the analog signal sounds loud and healthy now. I think I mentioned this in my last post that we had a few other issues that needed to be addressed with the 5KHZ mode. This was one of them. What we have found is that currently you must use one filter or the other, but not both.This is slightly problematic for Ibiquity since they thought their exciter should do everything. But as most of you know we "broadcasters" prefer to process our audio in our special way, without any extra encumbrance. This is especially important if you have an auxiliary transmitter also driven off the 9200. We have such a setup, and we also have an analog backup input into the 9200 as well as the digital input from the HD Radio Easu unit. We can make either hot, and we can also switch from various modes and positive peak controls from the 9200 through our Burk system. Those of you with 9200's know how extensive and complete the 9200 menus are. It seems to me it's far easier to set up the airchain through the 9200 without worrying about some filter down the chain which is in the way between the 9200 and the magnitude input to the transmitter, as well as the standard input terminals to the auxiliary transmitter. Ibiquity has now addressed this issue for us. By the way, YES! the HD radios work well in office buildings, we have one here, inside the building in our conference room, it works fine. Where the analog signal is somewhat gritty and noisy, the HD is hard as a rock and sounds great. Keep in mind the digital carriers are only about 1500 watts out of the array, this is one of the major good points about the HD scheme. The van tests in Manhattan were very promising, and actually exciting, some places where the analog was crap, the digital shined. The majority of callers to this department at WOR want more info and data on HD radios etc. I had one guy call and complain we were ruining his enjoyment of our Joey Reynolds show, and that our digital HD system was ruining his ability to hear Joey on our internet feed. Go figure.....there are a lot of nuts out there, but by and large response has been positive. Digital is somewhat still confusing to the public. One of our announcers works at Sirius, and has "the" radio in his car. I think it had major problems, it was not what I expected. I was very disappointed, the audio was kinda "swishy" on the high end. I would not pay $12 a month for that. It now looks like we are in the final stages of completion of the HD system, before a "final" version of software from the HD folks, as well as some of the newer hardware from outside vendors like Harris and BE. Next will come Stereo for WOR, we have started the studio modifications, and will be removing those classic PR&E System One consoles which have served WOR so well for the past 35 years. AM Stereo of the future coming soon to WOR. Kerry Richards Chief Engineer WOR-AM Buckley Broadcasting Corporation. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From kevtronics@yahoo.com Wed Mar 12 20:35:52 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 13 Mar 2003 04:35:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 63097 invoked from network); 13 Mar 2003 04:35:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Mar 2003 04:35:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Mar 2003 04:35:51 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.136] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Mar 2003 04:35:50 -0000 Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2003 04:35:49 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: )))...In Living AM Stereo...((( Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1539 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.88.139 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Now, if I could just find that 4 Seasons song I heard somewhere > that mentions being surrounded by sound....... That's from "And That Reminds Me (My Heart Reminds Me)", a Number 45 "hit" for The 4 Seasons in 1969. It's on the "Half And Half" album, which was released on CD in 1996 by Ace Records in the UK. There are many excellent wide-separation songs on the album, but strangely, a few of the tracks were recorded in mono -- or at least they're presented in mono on the CD re-release (I don't have the original LP to compare). And don't forget: "Living In Stereo" - Chilliwack "Moving In Stereo" - The Cars "She Talks In Stereo" - Gary Myrick & The Figures There are surely others, but those are the ones that I remember. I also find it interesting that in one of her songs, Norah Jones uses the archaic term "hi-fi" to refer to what most people would call a "stereo (system)" these days. The '80s hit "Come On Eileen" also earns an honoroable mention for its lyric "Poor old Johnny Ray / Sounded sad upon the radio / Moved a million hearts in mono". Another song for the stereo-demo list is definitely Al Stewart's 1976 hit "Year Of The Cat", with a 35-second piano intro in the Left channel only -- perhaps the longest intentional instance of single- channel audio in a song commonly played on the radio. It commonly trips up stations who have a device in the audio chain which detects a certain length of single-channel audio and then flips it to Mono, thinking that one half of the stereo STL has failed. From amymousie@yahoo.com Wed Mar 12 23:29:25 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 13 Mar 2003 07:29:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 50991 invoked from network); 13 Mar 2003 07:29:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Mar 2003 07:29:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.89) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Mar 2003 07:29:23 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.155] by n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Mar 2003 07:29:22 -0000 Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2003 07:29:18 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: )))...In Living AM Stereo...((( Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2400 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie" X-Originating-IP: 66.127.243.157 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T." wrote: > > Now, if I could just find that 4 Seasons song I heard somewhere > > that mentions being surrounded by sound....... > > That's from "And That Reminds Me (My Heart Reminds Me)", a Number 45 > "hit" for The 4 Seasons in 1969. It's on the "Half And Half" album, > which was released on CD in 1996 by Ace Records in the UK. Arrg, can't find it on KaZaA (Lite)... If AudioGalaxy hadn't been shut down last year, I might have found it there, had I known. :P > And don't forget: > > "Living In Stereo" - Chilliwack > "Moving In Stereo" - The Cars Got that on CD- Longtime Cars fan. Haven't followed Ric Ocasik or Benn Orr as much since the first breakup. :P > "She Talks In Stereo" - Gary Myrick & The Figures Never ebven heard of the group. > Another song for the stereo-demo list is definitely Al Stewart's 1976 > hit "Year Of The Cat", with a 35-second piano intro in the Left > channel only -- perhaps the longest intentional instance of single- > channel audio in a song commonly played on the radio. It commonly > trips up stations who have a device in the audio chain which detects > a certain length of single-channel audio and then flips it to Mono, > thinking that one half of the stereo STL has failed. I have this on CD- Three of Mr. Stewart's hits are great long songs, "Year of the Cat being one. "Time Passages" and "Song on the Radio" are another, each around 6 1/2 minutes long. Of course, that brings up another favorite musical subject of mine- Two, actually: long songs and "radio" songs. New inductee to the Rock & Roll Hall of Fame, Elvis Costellow (with his Attractions) had a hit in 1978 with "Radio, Radio". Queen had "Radio Ga-Ga". Al Stewart had "Song on the Radio". Donna Summer's classic '79 hit "On the Radio" comes to mind. :) Then there's the Fabulous Poodles' "Mr. Mike", which isn't so much a "radio" song, but fits in the previously mentioned "stereo" song. :) And a favorite of mine, a song that no-one really seems to know who originally did this song, but in 1938, there was a song called "I Love You (Three Little Tones)", aka the "1938 NBC Love Song", which as far as I know, has only been done twice since- First on Saturday Night Live on October 7, 1978 as the opening skit, and secondly, for a promo NBC circulated in 1998. :) Amy. <:3 )~~8~ From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Thu Mar 13 01:01:33 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 13 Mar 2003 09:01:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 92135 invoked from network); 13 Mar 2003 09:01:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Mar 2003 09:01:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web41012.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.93.11) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Mar 2003 09:01:33 -0000 Message-ID: <20030313090133.59503.qmail@web41012.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.37.118] by web41012.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 13 Mar 2003 01:01:33 PST Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2003 01:01:33 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: )))...In Living AM Stereo...((( To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio The NBC Chime song is available somewhere on the internet. I know: what a shock. Anyway, I heard it through aN Iowa radio discussion (I'm from R.I., so I don't know how I got there). Anyway, just F.Y.I.. 73, Jay, N1WVQ __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Web Hosting - establish your business online http://webhosting.yahoo.com From amymousie@yahoo.com Thu Mar 13 01:29:13 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 13 Mar 2003 09:29:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 98156 invoked from network); 13 Mar 2003 09:29:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Mar 2003 09:29:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.70) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Mar 2003 09:29:10 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.141] by n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Mar 2003 09:29:10 -0000 Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2003 09:29:10 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: )))...In Living AM Stereo...((( Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20030313090133.59503.qmail@web41012.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 842 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie" X-Originating-IP: 66.127.243.157 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, JNR wrote: > The NBC Chime song is available somewhere on the > internet. I know: what a shock. Anyway, I heard > it through aN Iowa radio discussion (I'm from > R.I., so I don't know how I got there). Anyway, > just F.Y.I.. I know. It first cropped up in alt.binaries.sounds.78rpm-era back in '98, and has remained one of those great mysteries. :) Been one of my faves ever since I first heard it back then. :) There are several pages online that have it, including a page on the history of the NBC chimes: http://www.old-time.com/misc/chimes.html And this on the song itself: http://www.reelradio.com/mysteries/iloveyou.html And from the SNL transcripts site, for Oct. 8, 1978 (OK, I was a day off): http://snltranscripts.jt.org/78/78aloveyou.phtml Amy. <:3 )~~8~ From philipr@irac.pe.ca Thu Mar 13 07:20:55 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 13 Mar 2003 15:20:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 62059 invoked from network); 13 Mar 2003 15:20:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Mar 2003 15:20:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.87) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Mar 2003 15:20:52 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.117] by n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Mar 2003 15:20:48 -0000 Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2003 15:20:44 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: )))...In Living AM Stereo...(((Radio - The Movie))) Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3774 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking Another great Radio song is "Rush - Spirit of Radio". The lyrics basically are a Radio anthem. If I were to set up a Classic Rock station, it would be my official first song. Similarly, a movie about the radio business - it would be a definite for the soundtrack. I'm just imagining the opening scene for the new mega hit movie "Radio" - a spectacular view from high atop a very tall tower - with the intro from Aldo Nova's Fantasy [LP version] pumping from the theatre speakers, then two analogue VU meters [with blipping red peak LEDs] filling the movie screen and the pounding beat of Rush - Spirit of Radio - bringing up into the mix. I'm not sure whether I'd want the fictious radio station to be an AM station or an FM station - however the time period would likely be the 80s. I think I'm leaning toward a 50kw AM Stereo station, with a tight directional pattern at night giving "drifting in the parking lot" call sign - CILY and announcers who sound like the 70s to early 80s radio wars between CJCH and CHNS. Ah, the good old days!!! Phil R. FM could always be for the sequel - where is Steven Spielberg when you need him??? lol --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "amymousie" wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T." > wrote: > > > Now, if I could just find that 4 Seasons song I heard somewhere > > > that mentions being surrounded by sound....... > > > > That's from "And That Reminds Me (My Heart Reminds Me)", a Number > 45 > > "hit" for The 4 Seasons in 1969. It's on the "Half And Half" > album, > > which was released on CD in 1996 by Ace Records in the UK. > > Arrg, can't find it on KaZaA (Lite)... If AudioGalaxy hadn't been > shut down last year, I might have found it there, had I known. :P > > > And don't forget: > > > > "Living In Stereo" - Chilliwack > > "Moving In Stereo" - The Cars > > Got that on CD- Longtime Cars fan. Haven't followed Ric Ocasik or > Benn Orr as much since the first breakup. :P > > > "She Talks In Stereo" - Gary Myrick & The Figures > > Never ebven heard of the group. > > > Another song for the stereo-demo list is definitely Al Stewart's > 1976 > > hit "Year Of The Cat", with a 35-second piano intro in the Left > > channel only -- perhaps the longest intentional instance of single- > > channel audio in a song commonly played on the radio. It commonly > > trips up stations who have a device in the audio chain which > detects > > a certain length of single-channel audio and then flips it to Mono, > > thinking that one half of the stereo STL has failed. > > I have this on CD- Three of Mr. Stewart's hits are great long > songs, "Year of the Cat being one. "Time Passages" and "Song on the > Radio" are another, each around 6 1/2 minutes long. > > Of course, that brings up another favorite musical subject of mine- > Two, actually: long songs and "radio" songs. > > New inductee to the Rock & Roll Hall of Fame, Elvis Costellow (with > his Attractions) had a hit in 1978 with "Radio, Radio". > > Queen had "Radio Ga-Ga". > > Al Stewart had "Song on the Radio". > > Donna Summer's classic '79 hit "On the Radio" comes to mind. :) > > Then there's the Fabulous Poodles' "Mr. Mike", which isn't so much > a "radio" song, but fits in the previously mentioned "stereo" song. :) > > And a favorite of mine, a song that no-one really seems to know who > originally did this song, but in 1938, there was a song called "I > Love You (Three Little Tones)", aka the "1938 NBC Love Song", which > as far as I know, has only been done twice since- First on Saturday > Night Live on October 7, 1978 as the opening skit, and secondly, for > a promo NBC circulated in 1998. :) > > Amy. <:3 )~~8~ From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Thu Mar 13 08:08:05 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 13 Mar 2003 16:08:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 45623 invoked from network); 13 Mar 2003 16:08:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Mar 2003 16:08:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14203.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.145) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Mar 2003 16:08:02 -0000 Message-ID: <20030313160802.63925.qmail@web14203.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.45.202.244] by web14203.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 13 Mar 2003 08:08:02 PST Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2003 08:08:02 -0800 (PST) Subject: IBOC listen for real? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio Is it possible to modify an existing AM radio with a computer interface to make your own software IBOC receiver? How else can you hear the level of quality? I hope that it sounds better than the 'swirling internet sound' that I heard last year if IBOC is to go forward. I'm afraid that IBOC will be just like the Best Buy and Circuit City stores selling HDTV sets by using DVD's instead of a local real over-the air HDTV broadcast? __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Web Hosting - establish your business online http://webhosting.yahoo.com From michaelj@vcn.com Thu Mar 13 08:29:53 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 13 Mar 2003 16:29:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 43597 invoked from network); 13 Mar 2003 16:29:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Mar 2003 16:29:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m3-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.33) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Mar 2003 16:29:52 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m3-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Thu, 13 Mar 2003 09:29:51 -0700 Message-ID: <002201bbf94b$44f6a9a0$0701010a@keva> To: References: <20030313160802.63925.qmail@web14203.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} IBOC listen for real? Date: Fri, 3 Jan 1997 00:53:54 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Not that I have any IBOC stations in my area, but I've always wondered that meself! MJR n WYO ----- Original Message ----- From: John P. To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, March 13, 2003 9:08 AM Subject: {AMSF} IBOC listen for real? Is it possible to modify an existing AM radio with a computer interface to make your own software IBOC receiver? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From amymousie@yahoo.com Thu Mar 13 09:43:20 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 13 Mar 2003 17:43:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 97567 invoked from network); 13 Mar 2003 17:43:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Mar 2003 17:43:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.70) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Mar 2003 17:43:18 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.136] by n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Mar 2003 17:43:17 -0000 Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2003 17:43:17 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: )))...In Living AM Stereo...(((Radio - The Movie))) Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 678 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie" X-Originating-IP: 66.127.243.157 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Phil Rafuse" wrote: =snip= > I'm just imagining the opening scene for the new mega hit > movie "Radio" - a spectacular view from high atop a very tall tower - =snip= > FM could always be for the sequel - where is Steven Spielberg when > you need him??? lol There are already movies named "Radio" (about a mentally-challenged man who has stayed with his high school for 25 years, and is a very popular figure in his hometown in North Carolina, based on a true story), and "FM" (1979, not a big hit, but memorable for Steely Dan's bit hit of the day, titled of course, "FM (No Static At All)"). Amy. <:3 )~~8~ From amymousie@yahoo.com Thu Mar 13 09:47:41 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 13 Mar 2003 17:47:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 95933 invoked from network); 13 Mar 2003 17:47:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Mar 2003 17:47:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.67) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Mar 2003 17:47:27 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.148] by n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Mar 2003 17:47:27 -0000 Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2003 17:47:25 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: IBOC listen for real? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20030313160802.63925.qmail@web14203.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 813 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie" X-Originating-IP: 66.127.243.157 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John P." wrote: > Is it possible to modify an existing AM radio with a computer interface to make > your own software IBOC receiver? How else can you hear the level of quality? > I hope that it sounds better than the 'swirling internet sound' that I heard > last year if IBOC is to go forward. Possible, considering there are two DRM software receivers; however, a key problem is the Lucent codecs used for the IBOC audio- They're neither publicly available, nore expected to be for certain (royalty) reasons. > I'm afraid that IBOC will be just like the Best Buy and Circuit City stores > selling HDTV sets by using DVD's instead of a local real over-the air HDTV > broadcast? Play a CD and say "this is HD Radio?" Eh. Amy. <:3 )~~8~ From amymousie@yahoo.com Thu Mar 13 09:55:07 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 13 Mar 2003 17:55:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 86541 invoked from network); 13 Mar 2003 17:55:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Mar 2003 17:55:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.69) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Mar 2003 17:55:05 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.115] by n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Mar 2003 17:54:50 -0000 Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2003 17:54:50 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} IBOC listen for real? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <002201bbf94b$44f6a9a0$0701010a@keva> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 702 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie" X-Originating-IP: 66.127.243.157 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Michael J. Richard" wrote: > Not that I have any IBOC stations in my area, but I've always wondered that meself! Both FhG's software DRM receiver and the semi-open-source "DReaM" software receiver work on this principle, using a soundcard input. The DReaM receiver would be easier to modify to IBOC, since one could theoretically just take baseband audio between 10-15kHz (minimum 32kHz sample rate) and convert it. The only hiccup is that instead of MP4 AAC (which DRM uses, and is royalty-controlled, hence DReaM is onbly SEMI-open source), you have to get the Lucent codecs somehow, which are even more proprietary. Amy. <:3 )~~8~ From amymousie@yahoo.com Thu Mar 13 10:09:10 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 13 Mar 2003 18:09:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 88335 invoked from network); 13 Mar 2003 18:09:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Mar 2003 18:09:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.83) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Mar 2003 18:09:06 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.133] by n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Mar 2003 18:09:05 -0000 Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2003 18:09:03 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} IBOC listen for real? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 269 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie" X-Originating-IP: 66.127.243.157 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie Ah, forgot to post some URLs for the software DRM receivers.. :) FhG's receiver: http://www.drmrx.org/ DReaM: http://drm.sourceforge.net/ Oh, yes- And a third just entered in- WiNRADIO, although in hardware: http://www.winradio.com/home/g303i.htm Amy. <:3 )~~8~ From jbyrns@rcn.com Thu Mar 13 10:17:33 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@rcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 13 Mar 2003 18:17:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 89705 invoked from network); 13 Mar 2003 18:17:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Mar 2003 18:17:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.87) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Mar 2003 18:17:32 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.166] by n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Mar 2003 18:17:31 -0000 Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2003 18:17:30 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: IBOC listen for real? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20030313160802.63925.qmail@web14203.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 704 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bta_50g" X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.84 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=138635554 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "John P." wrote: > Is it possible to modify an existing AM radio with a computer interface to make > your own software IBOC receiver? How else can you hear the level of quality? > I hope that it sounds better than the 'swirling internet sound' that I heard > last year if IBOC is to go forward. > > I'm afraid that IBOC will be just like the Best Buy and Circuit City stores > selling HDTV sets by using DVD's instead of a local real over-the air HDTV > broadcast? I don't follow your meaning in this last paragraph, is if good or bad for Circuit City to sell HDTV's using DVD's, and why? I am familiar with DVD's, but not HDTV. John From philipr@irac.pe.ca Thu Mar 13 10:21:01 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 13 Mar 2003 18:21:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 89137 invoked from network); 13 Mar 2003 18:21:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Mar 2003 18:21:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Mar 2003 18:21:00 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.164] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Mar 2003 18:20:59 -0000 Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2003 18:20:59 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: )))...In Living AM Stereo...(((Radio - The Movie))) Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1053 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking We'll just bring Geddy Lee of Rush on board and title the movie, "The Spirit of Radio"! Phil R. P.S. Or, very simply, "AM" with the song, "No multipath at all" featured in the soundtrack. Alternate movie titles could be "Groundwave" and "Skywave". --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "amymousie" wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Phil Rafuse" > wrote: > > =snip= > > > I'm just imagining the opening scene for the new mega hit > > movie "Radio" - a spectacular view from high atop a very tall > tower - > > =snip= > > > FM could always be for the sequel - where is Steven Spielberg when > > you need him??? lol > > There are already movies named "Radio" (about a mentally- challenged > man who has stayed with his high school for 25 years, and is a very > popular figure in his hometown in North Carolina, based on a true > story), and "FM" (1979, not a big hit, but memorable for Steely Dan's > bit hit of the day, titled of course, "FM (No Static At All)"). > > Amy. <:3 )~~8~ From amymousie@yahoo.com Thu Mar 13 10:32:42 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 13 Mar 2003 18:32:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 56842 invoked from network); 13 Mar 2003 18:32:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Mar 2003 18:32:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.66) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Mar 2003 18:32:42 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.156] by n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Mar 2003 18:32:39 -0000 Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2003 18:32:39 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: )))...In Living AM Stereo...(((Radio - The Movie))) Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 426 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie" X-Originating-IP: 66.127.243.157 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Phil Rafuse" wrote: > We'll just bring Geddy Lee of Rush on board and title the > movie, "The Spirit of Radio"! Not too bad. > P.S. Or, very simply, "AM" with the song, "No multipath at all" > featured in the soundtrack. Alternate movie titles could > be "Groundwave" and "Skywave". LOL! :) Amy. <:3 )~~8~ (Squeeking in Living AM Stereo, where available. :) ) From kevtronics@yahoo.com Thu Mar 13 11:05:18 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 13 Mar 2003 19:05:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 35548 invoked from network); 13 Mar 2003 19:05:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Mar 2003 19:05:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.87) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Mar 2003 19:05:18 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.184] by n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Mar 2003 19:05:17 -0000 Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2003 19:05:14 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: )))...In Living AM Stereo...(((Radio - The Movie))) Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 331 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics Speaking of "radio" songs, how can we forget??? "AM Radio" by Everclear... it was a pretty big hit a year or two ago. The album version even starts off with a classic KHJ jingle. There's also a punk rock group named "AM Stereo", based in the Boston area. Here is their web site: http://users.erols.com/amstereo/ From amymousie@yahoo.com Thu Mar 13 11:20:21 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 13 Mar 2003 19:20:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 6934 invoked from network); 13 Mar 2003 19:20:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Mar 2003 19:20:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Mar 2003 19:20:18 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.165] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Mar 2003 19:20:18 -0000 Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2003 19:20:16 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: )))...In Living AM Stereo...(((Radio - The Movie))) Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 552 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie" X-Originating-IP: 66.127.243.157 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T." wrote: > Speaking of "radio" songs, how can we forget??? > > > > > "AM Radio" by Everclear... it was a pretty big hit a year or two ago. > The album version even starts off with a classic KHJ jingle. Ah, yes. Very good song. :) > There's also a punk rock group named "AM Stereo", based in the Boston > area. Here is their web site: > http://users.erols.com/amstereo/ One of the first sites I ever came across when searching for "am stereo" years ago. Amy. <:3 )~~8~ From jim@burgan.net Thu Mar 13 11:46:28 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jim@burgan.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 13 Mar 2003 19:46:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 58723 invoked from network); 13 Mar 2003 19:46:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Mar 2003 19:46:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sccimhc02.insightbb.com) (63.240.76.164) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Mar 2003 19:46:26 -0000 Received: from jimspc ([12.223.132.140]) by sccimhc02.insightbb.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030313194626.JLSP4400.sccimhc02.insightbb.com@jimspc> for ; Thu, 13 Mar 2003 19:46:26 +0000 Message-ID: <000f01c2e999$3c8989f0$9802a8c0@jimspc> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} )))...In Living AM Stereo...((( Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2003 14:46:27 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Jim Burgan" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=36730433 X-Yahoo-Profile: jimbo700 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Previously on AMSF: I did find Neon Philharmonic's "Morning Girl" (1969) online- Get the full parts 1 & 2 MP3 at nearly 5 minutes total. Instrumentation is sharply left and right, with vocals centered. Really good song, too. =========== After reading your post, I went off in search of a 'long' version of "Morning Girl" and found the one of which you speak on KaZaa lite. I had no idea this version ever existed. Notice the contrasts between part 1 and 2, instrumentally and vocally? The first half seems be dealing with "go take on the day" (sorry Dr. Laura) and the second part is about the break up of a relationship. I bought the single in 1969 and I bought a Dick Bartley compilation in the early 90's to get a stereo copy, yet I never knew this existed. The things we learn on the Internet... [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Thu Mar 13 11:57:14 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 13 Mar 2003 19:57:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 63212 invoked from network); 13 Mar 2003 19:57:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Mar 2003 19:57:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14203.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.145) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Mar 2003 19:57:14 -0000 Message-ID: <20030313195714.28243.qmail@web14203.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.45.202.244] by web14203.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 13 Mar 2003 11:57:14 PST Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2003 11:57:14 -0800 (PST) Subject: Real "RF" Over the Air signals, not 'piped-in' fakes To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio bta_50g wrote: "selling HDTV sets by using DVD's instead of a local real over-the air HDTV broadcast? I don't follow your meaning in this last paragraph, is if good or bad for Circuit City to sell HDTV's using DVD's, and why? The main reason (supposedly) that we're forced to abandon analog NTSC TV in 3 years is for all over the air stations to switch to HDTV broadcasting only. All 4 stations locally have HDTV RF over the air(and even show their call letters on air now as WTOL-HD / WTOL-TV) so my point is why don't the local electronic "superstores" have an antenna on the roof pointed at one of the local stations and show a real over the air RF HDTV signal instead of feeding all the sets thru their video input jacks? The analogy to radio would be using a digital 'aux input' jack on the IBOC radio and feeding digital audio into it instead of a realworld RF signal. Even using an "Alfredo Lite" transmitter is a more fair comparison of radio quality as it requires a real RF signal to be received and demodulated. I don't like phony. __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Web Hosting - establish your business online http://webhosting.yahoo.com From jbyrns@rcn.com Thu Mar 13 11:58:56 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@rcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 13 Mar 2003 19:58:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 55109 invoked from network); 13 Mar 2003 19:58:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Mar 2003 19:58:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.84) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Mar 2003 19:58:56 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.177] by n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Mar 2003 19:58:55 -0000 Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2003 19:58:55 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: )))...In Living AM Stereo...(((Radio - The Movie))) Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 483 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bta_50g" X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.63 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=138635554 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Phil Rafuse" wrote: > > P.S. Or, very simply, "AM" with the song, "No multipath at all" > featured in the soundtrack. Alternate movie titles could > be "Groundwave" and "Skywave". What do you mean "No multipath at all"? In the area where the ground wave and the skywave overlap the multipath is about as bad as you can imagine. The sky wave in the secondary coverage area is also plagued by multipath effects. John From amymousie@yahoo.com Thu Mar 13 11:59:55 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 13 Mar 2003 19:59:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 7753 invoked from network); 13 Mar 2003 19:59:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Mar 2003 19:59:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Mar 2003 19:59:55 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.121] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Mar 2003 19:59:55 -0000 Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2003 19:59:53 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} )))...In Living AM Stereo...((( Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <000f01c2e999$3c8989f0$9802a8c0@jimspc> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1550 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie" X-Originating-IP: 66.127.243.157 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Jim Burgan" wrote: > Previously on AMSF: > I did find Neon Philharmonic's "Morning Girl" (1969) online- Get the > full parts 1 & 2 MP3 at nearly 5 minutes total. Instrumentation is > sharply left and right, with vocals centered. Really good song, too. > =========== > > After reading your post, I went off in search of a 'long' version of "Morning Girl" and found the one of which you speak on KaZaa lite. > I had no idea this version ever existed. > Notice the contrasts between part 1 and 2, instrumentally and vocally? > The first half seems be dealing with "go take on the day" (sorry Dr. Laura) and the second part is about the break up of a relationship. > I bought the single in 1969 and I bought a Dick Bartley compilation in the early 90's to get a stereo copy, yet I never knew this existed. > The things we learn on the Internet... Looking at amazon.com (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/B000003GZA/qid% 3D1047585226/sr%3D11-1/ref%3Dsr%5F11%5F1/102-6055789-9376961), it might be a combination of "Morning Girl" and "Morning Girl Later", but this combined mix does well, I think. :) A similar period song that there is a "long version" to, that apparantly never got released as a single track until its release on CD was the Flowerpot Men's "Let's Go To San Francisco", which is the combined A and B sides, clocking in at about 6 minutes, in typical '60s stereo-- Though the start of "part 2" starts out mono, it quickly goes back to stereo. :) Amy. <:3 )~~8~ From amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk Thu Mar 13 12:26:48 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 13 Mar 2003 20:26:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 84375 invoked from network); 13 Mar 2003 20:26:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Mar 2003 20:26:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Mar 2003 20:26:46 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.131] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 13 Mar 2003 20:26:44 -0000 Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2003 20:26:42 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: OT: MP3 recorder ? Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 172 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Dave" X-Originating-IP: 213.121.71.199 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113985069 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereofan Some months ago someone mentioned about a portable MP3 recoder where you could record from line in and playback though your hi-fi etc. Anyone know which model etc ? TIA From ccuff@in4web.com Thu Mar 13 13:20:58 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 13 Mar 2003 21:20:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 34084 invoked from network); 13 Mar 2003 21:20:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Mar 2003 21:20:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Mar 2003 21:20:52 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [216.221.137.202]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Thu, 13 Mar 2003 16:18:09 -0500 Message-ID: <002a01c2e9a6$94930060$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} OT: MP3 recorder ? Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2003 16:21:57 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 That is called the "Ripflash" - I have one, and Andy L also has one. Nice item, and quite affordable on ebay. Make sure the seller is reputable.... ----- Original Message ----- From: Dave To: Sent: Thursday, March 13, 2003 3:26 PM Subject: {AMSF} OT: MP3 recorder ? > Some months ago someone mentioned about a portable MP3 recoder where > you could record from line in and playback though your hi-fi etc. > Anyone know which model etc ? TIA > From bjackson@indyradio.com Thu Mar 13 18:12:13 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: bjackson@indyradio.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 14 Mar 2003 02:12:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 23767 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2003 02:12:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Mar 2003 02:12:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Mar 2003 02:12:10 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.123] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Mar 2003 02:12:10 -0000 Date: Fri, 14 Mar 2003 02:12:09 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: )))...In Living AM Stereo...(((Radio - The Movie))) Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 729 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bradleyj923" X-Originating-IP: 64.25.100.20 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=97903887 X-Yahoo-Profile: bradleyj923 --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T." wrote: > Speaking of "radio" songs, how can we forget??? > > > > > "AM Radio" by Everclear... it was a pretty big hit a year or two ago. > The album version even starts off with a classic KHJ jingle. One of the few remaining AM Music stations (although in mono) here in central Indiana uses that song in several of their promos. While not stereo (never has been), WKWH is a great music station...Owned by one of the local electric power cooperatives (hence kwh, and the slogan Power Oldies)...An odd mix from the 60's thru the early 90's. http://www.wkwhradio.com/am/default.asp Brad Jackson Susquehanna, Indianapolis http://www.indyradio.com From jim@burgan.net Thu Mar 13 18:21:57 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jim@burgan.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 14 Mar 2003 02:21:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 44160 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2003 02:21:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Mar 2003 02:21:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sccimhc02.insightbb.com) (63.240.76.164) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Mar 2003 02:21:57 -0000 Received: from jimspc ([12.223.132.140]) by sccimhc02.insightbb.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030314022156.MSRO4400.sccimhc02.insightbb.com@jimspc> for ; Fri, 14 Mar 2003 02:21:56 +0000 Message-ID: <003601c2e9d0$7ceef660$9802a8c0@jimspc> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: )))...In Living AM Stereo...(((Radio - The Movie))) Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2003 21:12:24 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Jim Burgan" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=36730433 X-Yahoo-Profile: jimbo700 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit "AM Radio" by Everclear... it was a pretty big hit a year or two ago. The album version even starts off with a classic KHJ jingle. AM Radio by Everclear was a huge hit and the entire background was a sample of Andrea True's "More More More" from the late 70's. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From jim@burgan.net Thu Mar 13 18:21:58 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jim@burgan.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 14 Mar 2003 02:21:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 59307 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2003 02:21:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Mar 2003 02:21:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sccimhc02.insightbb.com) (63.240.76.164) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Mar 2003 02:21:55 -0000 Received: from jimspc ([12.223.132.140]) by sccimhc02.insightbb.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030314022155.MSRL4400.sccimhc02.insightbb.com@jimspc> for ; Fri, 14 Mar 2003 02:21:55 +0000 Message-ID: <003501c2e9d0$7c3c2120$9802a8c0@jimspc> To: References: <20030313090133.59503.qmail@web41012.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: )))...In Living AM Stereo...((( Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2003 21:08:50 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Jim Burgan" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=36730433 X-Yahoo-Profile: jimbo700 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I have the NBC chime as an MP3 and WAV file... If someone wants it, email me and I'll email it. The NBC Chime song is available somewhere on the internet. I know: what a shock. Anyway, I heard it through aN Iowa radio discussion (I'm from R.I., so I don't know how I got there). Anyway, just F.Y.I.. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From amymousie@yahoo.com Thu Mar 13 19:00:49 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 14 Mar 2003 03:00:46 -0000 Received: (qmail 8855 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2003 02:59:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Mar 2003 02:59:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Mar 2003 02:59:57 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.119] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Mar 2003 02:59:57 -0000 Date: Fri, 14 Mar 2003 02:59:57 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: )))...In Living AM Stereo...(((Radio - The Movie))) Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <003601c2e9d0$7ceef660$9802a8c0@jimspc> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 449 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie" X-Originating-IP: 66.127.243.157 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Jim Burgan" wrote: > > "AM Radio" by Everclear... it was a pretty big hit a year or two ago. > The album version even starts off with a classic KHJ jingle. > > > AM Radio by Everclear was a huge hit and the entire background was a sample of Andrea True's "More More More" from the late 70's. Are you sure? I know Len's "Steal My Sunshine" was based on "More, More, More". Amy. <:3 )~~8~ From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Thu Mar 13 19:09:27 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 14 Mar 2003 03:09:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 94565 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2003 03:09:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Mar 2003 03:09:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web41003.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.93.2) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Mar 2003 03:09:26 -0000 Message-ID: <20030314030926.93365.qmail@web41003.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.37.118] by web41003.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 13 Mar 2003 19:09:26 PST Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2003 19:09:26 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: {AMSF} Real "RF" Over the Air signals, not 'piped-in' fakes To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: <20030313195714.28243.qmail@web14203.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio A Boston electronics store uses an over-the-air signal for its HDTV, and to be honest, it didn't look all that great. Of course, it WAS a rear-projection set, not a tube. 73, Jay, N1WVQ __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Web Hosting - establish your business online http://webhosting.yahoo.com From amymousie@yahoo.com Thu Mar 13 19:29:27 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 14 Mar 2003 03:29:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 54182 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2003 03:29:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Mar 2003 03:29:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.89) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Mar 2003 03:29:25 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.156] by n5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Mar 2003 03:29:25 -0000 Date: Fri, 14 Mar 2003 03:29:25 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: )))...In Living AM Stereo...((( Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <003501c2e9d0$7c3c2120$9802a8c0@jimspc> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 407 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie" X-Originating-IP: 66.127.243.157 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Jim Burgan" wrote: > I have the NBC chime as an MP3 and WAV file... If someone wants it, email me and I'll email it. I have several versions of the NVC Chimes, again rather common online. I have even mixed a couple of them into stereo files. ftp://209.193.86.116/nbc_chimes%20(stereo).mp3 ftp://209.193.86.116/nbcchimes%20(stereo).mp3 Amy. <:3 )~~8~ From amymousie@yahoo.com Thu Mar 13 19:34:03 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 14 Mar 2003 03:34:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 29801 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2003 03:34:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Mar 2003 03:34:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.88) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Mar 2003 03:34:02 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.152] by n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Mar 2003 03:34:02 -0000 Date: Fri, 14 Mar 2003 03:34:02 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: )))...In Living AM Stereo...(((Radio - The Movie))) Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 629 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie" X-Originating-IP: 66.127.243.157 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "amymousie" wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Jim Burgan" wrote: > > > > "AM Radio" by Everclear... it was a pretty big hit a year or two > ago. > > The album version even starts off with a classic KHJ jingle. > > > > > > AM Radio by Everclear was a huge hit and the entire background was > a sample of Andrea True's "More More More" from the late 70's. > > Are you sure? I know Len's "Steal My Sunshine" was based on "More, > More, More". Checking further, I think it's "Mr. Big Stuff" by Jean Knight, early 1970's. Amy. <:3 )~~8~ From amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Thu Mar 13 21:23:18 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 86470 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2003 05:23:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Mar 2003 05:23:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.84) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Mar 2003 05:23:14 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: notify@yahoogroups.com Received: from [66.218.67.251] by n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Mar 2003 05:23:14 -0000 Date: 14 Mar 2003 05:23:11 -0000 Message-ID: <1047619391.667469.43870.w72@yahoogroups.com> X-eGroups-Application: files X-Yahoo-Group-Post: system From: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: New file uploaded to amstereoforum MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello, This email message is a notification to let you know that a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the amstereoforum group. File : /I Love You - NBC Jingle.mp3 Uploaded by : ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Description : "I Love You!" NBC Chime Jingle You can access this file at the URL http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum/files/I%20Love%20You%20-%20NBC%20Jingle.mp3 To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/files Regards, ICURAPossum_Hunter2 From possumhunter@netzero.net Thu Mar 13 21:27:40 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 14 Mar 2003 05:27:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 94075 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2003 05:27:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Mar 2003 05:27:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.115) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Mar 2003 05:27:37 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 13 Mar 2003 21:27:37 -0800 To: References: <20030313090133.59503.qmail@web41012.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: )))...In Living AM Stereo...((( Date: Fri, 14 Mar 2003 00:27:24 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 14 Mar 2003 05:27:37.0461 (UTC) FILETIME=[6CABC250:01C2E9EA] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.153.107.243] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 JNR wrote: > The NBC Chime song is available somewhere on the internet. I got the copyof "I Love You" The NBC Chime song I posted to the files section from a buddy at WestWood One. It is one of those CDs that everybody copies and passes around, so I am sure it is about 300 generations down! (Remember when all of us radio people did that with tape? LOL) Is it the Chime Song you are talking about? Kevin From amymousie@yahoo.com Thu Mar 13 22:36:45 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 14 Mar 2003 06:36:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 25612 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2003 06:36:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Mar 2003 06:36:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Mar 2003 06:36:43 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.146] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Mar 2003 06:36:43 -0000 Date: Fri, 14 Mar 2003 06:36:41 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: )))...In Living AM Stereo...((( Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 706 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie" X-Originating-IP: 67.118.16.90 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Possum Hunter" wrote: > JNR wrote: > > The NBC Chime song is available somewhere on the internet. > > I got the copyof "I Love You" The NBC Chime song I posted to the files > section from a buddy at WestWood One. It is one of those CDs that everybody > copies and passes around, so I am sure it is about 300 generations down! > (Remember when all of us radio people did that with tape? LOL) > > Is it the Chime Song you are talking about? Yep, that's the one. Good, clean copy, minus the skip, too.. Thanks! Probably would've been better put on the FTP site, but then... The file section here is near the max as-is.. :/ Amy. <:3 )~~8~ From possumhunter@netzero.net Fri Mar 14 03:37:51 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 14 Mar 2003 11:37:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 51003 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2003 11:37:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Mar 2003 11:37:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.196) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Mar 2003 11:37:50 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 14 Mar 2003 03:37:50 -0800 To: References: Subject: NBC Chime Song Was:: )))...In Living AM Stereo...((( Date: Fri, 14 Mar 2003 06:37:38 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 14 Mar 2003 11:37:50.0091 (UTC) FILETIME=[246E1DB0:01C2EA1E] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.131.122.110] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 amymousie wrote: > Yep, that's the one. Good, clean copy, minus the skip, too.. Thanks! > > Probably would've been better put on the FTP site, but then... The file section here is near the max as-is.. :/ Yes, but AOL wouldn't let me on the FTP site. On the "Cool Jingles Rating Scale" from 1 to 100, the NBC "I Love You" Jingle gets a rating of 99 or better. I should play it on the air this morning :-) Kevin From amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk Fri Mar 14 05:50:59 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 14 Mar 2003 13:50:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 96585 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2003 13:50:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Mar 2003 13:50:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Mar 2003 13:50:57 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.189] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Mar 2003 13:50:16 -0000 Date: Fri, 14 Mar 2003 13:50:12 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} OT: MP3 recorder ? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <002a01c2e9a6$94930060$0101a8c0@pavilion> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 694 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Dave" X-Originating-IP: 213.121.70.29 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113985069 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereofan Thanks Chris for info, I see there's a new version out now with WMA recording also btw --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Christopher Cuff" wrote: > That is called the "Ripflash" - I have one, and Andy L also has one. Nice > item, and quite affordable on ebay. Make sure the seller is reputable.... > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Dave > To: > Sent: Thursday, March 13, 2003 3:26 PM > Subject: {AMSF} OT: MP3 recorder ? > > > > Some months ago someone mentioned about a portable MP3 recoder where > > you could record from line in and playback though your hi-fi etc. > > Anyone know which model etc ? TIA > > From jim@burgan.net Fri Mar 14 05:52:54 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jim@burgan.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 14 Mar 2003 13:52:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 48422 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2003 13:52:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Mar 2003 13:52:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sccimhc02.insightbb.com) (63.240.76.164) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Mar 2003 13:52:54 -0000 Received: from jimspc ([12.223.132.140]) by sccimhc02.insightbb.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030314135253.QDWQ4400.sccimhc02.insightbb.com@jimspc> for ; Fri, 14 Mar 2003 13:52:53 +0000 Message-ID: <002601c2ea31$036fa260$9802a8c0@jimspc> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: )))...In Living AM Stereo...(((Radio - The Movie))) Date: Fri, 14 Mar 2003 08:52:54 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Jim Burgan" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=36730433 X-Yahoo-Profile: jimbo700 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit >> AM Radio by Everclear was a huge hit and the entire background was >>a sample of Andrea True's "More More More" from the late 70's. >Are you sure? I know Len's "Steal My Sunshine" was based on "More, >More, More". No, I'm not sure because you are right! I have confused two records.... AM Radio used Jean Knight's "Mr Big Stuff" as it's background. You're right about Len's "Steal My Sunshine" I've been doing this way to long, all music is one massive blur to me any more. You know what they say about old age, your memory is the second thing that goes... [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From jim@burgan.net Fri Mar 14 05:57:16 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jim@burgan.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 14 Mar 2003 13:57:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 79725 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2003 13:57:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Mar 2003 13:57:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sccimhc01.insightbb.com) (63.240.76.163) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Mar 2003 13:57:13 -0000 Received: from jimspc ([12.223.132.140]) by sccimhc01.insightbb.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030314135712.CCXZ5831.sccimhc01.insightbb.com@jimspc> for ; Fri, 14 Mar 2003 13:57:12 +0000 Message-ID: <003301c2ea31$9ddbccc0$9802a8c0@jimspc> To: References: <20030313090133.59503.qmail@web41012.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: )))...In Living AM Stereo...((( Date: Fri, 14 Mar 2003 08:57:13 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Jim Burgan" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=36730433 X-Yahoo-Profile: jimbo700 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Speaking of the NBC Chimes... Westwood One is relaunching NBC Radio News. Featuring Brokaw and the rest of the NBC dudes as anchors. Perhaps the NBC chimes will again radiate the airwaves. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Fri Mar 14 06:14:13 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 14 Mar 2003 14:13:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 15534 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2003 14:13:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Mar 2003 14:13:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14208.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.173.72) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Mar 2003 14:13:42 -0000 Message-ID: <20030314141342.39630.qmail@web14208.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [209.45.202.244] by web14208.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 14 Mar 2003 06:13:42 PST Date: Fri, 14 Mar 2003 06:13:42 -0800 (PST) Subject: Hamfest AM Stereo Awareness Campaign To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio This weekend I'll be distributing a color information sheet with the topic "AM Radio in Stereo?" at the local Hamfest. It features photos of the UX-1 display touting "630 AM STEREO" and photos of 1430 & 760 AM STEREO. Key to the text is that there are over 24 million AM stereo receivers already built, and I go on to describe the appearance of the Chrysler & Delco Stereo AM radios and include a photo (so that they can buy the same at the hamfest). I also give links to our AMS websites and mention of converters. Maybe only 25 more people will be informed about it, but if even 25 more know and even 2 more care, that's all the better. Let's continue to educate the public about CQuam AM Stereo, and the hamfests are definitely a willing audience. __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Web Hosting - establish your business online http://webhosting.yahoo.com From jim@burgan.net Fri Mar 14 06:16:14 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jim@burgan.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 14 Mar 2003 14:16:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 58561 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2003 14:16:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Mar 2003 14:16:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sccimhc02.insightbb.com) (63.240.76.164) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Mar 2003 14:16:13 -0000 Received: from jimspc ([12.223.132.140]) by sccimhc02.insightbb.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030314141613.QHJU4400.sccimhc02.insightbb.com@jimspc>; Fri, 14 Mar 2003 14:16:13 +0000 Message-ID: <003801c2ea34$45a18f10$9802a8c0@jimspc> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} NBC Chime Song Was:: )))...In Living AM Stereo...((( Date: Fri, 14 Mar 2003 09:16:14 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Jim Burgan" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=36730433 X-Yahoo-Profile: jimbo700 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Here's a good version of the NBC Chimes... a little hiss and background noise, but easy to clean up with cool Edit pro. Find it here: http://www.qmix.com/jim_audio.htm [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From fanfare@globility.com Fri Mar 14 07:00:33 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 14 Mar 2003 15:00:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 27613 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2003 15:00:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Mar 2003 15:00:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Mar 2003 15:00:32 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.153] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Mar 2003 15:00:32 -0000 Date: Fri, 14 Mar 2003 15:00:31 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: New file uploaded to amstereoforum Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <1047619391.667469.43870.w72@yahoogroups.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1356 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Mr.M S" X-Originating-IP: 64.56.245.206 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com wrote: > > Hello, > > This email message is a notification to let you know that > a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the amstereoforum > group. > > File : /I Love You - NBC Jingle.mp3 > Uploaded by : ICURAPossum_Hunter2 > Description : "I Love You!" NBC Chime Jingle > > ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Talk about nostalgia....... This is probably O.T. and a rant at best, but those of you who were not able to experience radio in the 50's and 60's missed out on truly what the essence of radio was all about. Much of it was familiarity, and not the kind that breeds contempt. The NBC tone was one of those things that heralded quality. And it was as warm as the theme music of your favorite radio program. That's what I see is missing from radio nowadays. And it's, unfortunately, due to the fact that no one knows what long term saleable quality is. Perhaps there has been too much time spent on giving the audience what the PD thinks its wants, instead of what it needs. I realize the latter takes an enlightened attitude to stay the course. But just think how Cine-Noire played out and it should help make the path a little easier to navigate. Practically everyone loves a happy ending, don't they? M.S. From wa2fnq@optonline.net Fri Mar 14 08:34:02 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: wa2fnq@optonline.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 14 Mar 2003 16:34:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 36795 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2003 16:33:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Mar 2003 16:33:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Mar 2003 16:33:58 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.164] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Mar 2003 16:26:13 -0000 Date: Fri, 14 Mar 2003 16:26:09 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Whoa!!! Hold your Optimods! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <001001c2e8eb$19d9add0$2a01010a@kerrydesk> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1302 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wa2fnq" X-Originating-IP: 64.236.235.240 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=60059615 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa2fnq Kerry, I agree. I had a chance to hear a Sirius satellite radio and the high end sounded like garbage to me. Definately not audophile material. But the iBiquity system has similar problems. We'll see what their new code sounds like. I think the DRM system sounds better and they're using an open platform not PAC. Unfortunately I don't think they have an IBOC model but I bet something could be done. I'd like to see all of the cards thrown on the table including AM stereo received by proper equipment. Compare good AM against digital and see where you are. Not like the comparisons I've heard on the iBiquity and WOR web sites. You can't take AM that's audio band limited at 5 KHz, compare it against digital and ask which sounds better. BTW, WOR sounds much better not that you're running in the 8 KHz mode. Jeeze, I can hear a world of difference on my stock radio that came with my Honda and I think that's a typical, real world radio. Jerry WA2FNQ --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kerry Richards" wrote: > One of our announcers works at Sirius, and has "the" radio in his car. I think it had major problems, it was not what I expected. I was very disappointed, the audio was kinda "swishy" on the high end. I would not pay $12 a month for that. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Mar 14 10:11:19 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 14 Mar 2003 18:11:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 48895 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2003 18:11:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Mar 2003 18:11:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Mar 2003 18:11:17 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.251] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Mar 2003 18:11:16 -0000 Date: Fri, 14 Mar 2003 18:11:16 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Whoa!!! Hold your Optimods! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2899 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Compare good AM against digital and see where you are. Not like the > comparisons I've heard on the iBiquity and WOR web sites. You can't > take AM that's audio band limited at 5 KHz, compare it against > digital and ask which sounds better. For years, the digital radio proponents have claimed that IBOC on FM will be "CD quality", and IBOC on AM will be "(analog) FM quality". Now, that's down to "near-CD quality" (whatever that means) on FM and "near-FM quality" on AM (again, a rather meaningless designation). The real truth is that due to the large amount of "lossy" digital audio compression used, even IBOC digital-FM won't be able to match the quality of existing analog FM Stereo. Obviously analog FM tends to have a less than perfect signal-to-noise ratio in Stereo mode, but with a good receiver and a properly positioned antenna, it is possible to get full-quieting audio (i.e. no background hiss) from even semi-distant (~30 - 50 miles) FM stations, and once that is achieved, the quality you hear is as good as can be, and is only limited by what kind of audio processing the station is using. With current MP3 encoding, you really need at least 256 kbps to fully capture the same amount of fidelity and detail that an analog FM broadcast can deliver. Even 192 kbps MP3 -- although commonly called "CD quality" -- can have immediately noticeable imperfections, especially when dealing with older recordings that might have a slight phase mismatch between the two channels. Now, generously assuming the digital encoding used by IBOC is *twice* as efficient as MP3, that means the 96 kbps bit rate used by IBOC on FM (at least with the current design) will still only match the quality of a 192 kbps MP3 file, and especially for Classical music, this can cause an annoying amount of "artifacts" in the sound, especially in the delicate high-end harmonics of various acoustic instruments. We've spent a good amount of time here trying to spread the word about how good AM Stereo can sound, but it also needs to be known that *FM* Stereo can also easily exceed the quality level that most people associate it with. Most people in North America probably never get to really hear what an FM station with little or no audio processing can truly deliver, so here is a recording of the U.K.'s BBC Radio 3 (Classical music), which uses only a very minimal amount of processing and is as close to "CD quality" as I've ever heard from analog FM: ftp://209.193.86.116/bbc-r3fm.mp3 This is a 256 kbps MP3 file, and although I would have preferred an uncompressed WAV file, it is competent enough at capturing FM's fidelity that I think it is worthy of demonstration. Even the USA's premiere Classical music station -- 96.3 WQXR-FM in New York City -- doesn't sound as good as this... and with IBOC, the quality wouldn't even be in the same league. From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Fri Mar 14 10:43:08 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 14 Mar 2003 18:43:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 51093 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2003 18:43:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Mar 2003 18:43:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web41001.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.93.0) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Mar 2003 18:43:07 -0000 Message-ID: <20030314184306.8150.qmail@web41001.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.34.75] by web41001.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 14 Mar 2003 10:43:06 PST Date: Fri, 14 Mar 2003 10:43:06 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: )))...In Living AM Stereo...((( To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: <003301c2ea31$9ddbccc0$9802a8c0@jimspc> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio The N.B.C. jingles already air on WBCQ-Monticello, Maine during their Top-of-Hour IDs, although I've only heard it on their 7.415 XMTR.. You'll hear usually "This is The Planet, here for you. WBCQ." That was that 66/WNBC jingle from the '80s. Sounds good. 73, Jay,N1WVQ __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Web Hosting - establish your business online http://webhosting.yahoo.com From jbyrns@rcn.com Fri Mar 14 11:06:18 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@rcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 14 Mar 2003 19:06:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 36181 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2003 19:06:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Mar 2003 19:06:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.68) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Mar 2003 19:06:17 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.167] by n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Mar 2003 19:06:17 -0000 Date: Fri, 14 Mar 2003 19:06:17 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: New file uploaded to amstereoforum Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1822 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bta_50g" X-Originating-IP: 216.80.98.129 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=138635554 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Mr.M S" wrote: > > Talk about nostalgia....... > > This is probably O.T. and a rant at best, but those of you who were > not able to experience radio in the 50's and 60's missed out on truly > what the essence of radio was all about. Much of it was familiarity, > and not the kind that breeds contempt. The NBC tone was one of those > things that heralded quality. And it was as warm as the theme music > of your favorite radio program. I'm not going to claim to know what the "essence of radio was all about", as you do with your claim that it is represented by radio of the "radio in the 50's and 60's", but I am curious how you know the radio experience of 50's and 60's represents the "essence of radio"? What rules out the radio experience of the 30's and 40's as representing what the "essence of radio was all about"? Or even today's post 1960's radio of the 21st Century, who is to say what we have today is not the true "essence of radio"? To me radio of the "50's and 60's" represents a transition period between the pre television radio form of the 30's and 40's, and radio as we know it today. By 1950, the handwriting was pretty much on the wall for radio as it existed in the era before television. I think radio in the late 1960's differed from the earlier years of the 50's and 60's in that by the late 60's, the die was pretty much cast that would define radio as we know it today. From a listener's viewpoint I don't see a major change in radio between the latter years of the 1960's and today, just a refining of what was already happening. But the "essence of radio", that probably has a different meaning for each individual, just as some say that the "essence of radio" can't be conveyed by digital means. John From krichards@wor710.com Fri Mar 14 11:54:40 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 95811 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2003 19:54:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Mar 2003 19:54:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.64) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Mar 2003 19:54:40 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: krichards@wor710.com Received: from [66.218.67.139] by n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Mar 2003 19:54:37 -0000 X-Sender: krichards@wor710.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 14 Mar 2003 19:25:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 64278 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2003 19:25:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Mar 2003 19:25:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO buckleyradio.com) (161.58.14.6) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Mar 2003 19:25:40 -0000 Received: from kerrydesk (pool-162-83-160-52.ny5030.east.verizon.net [162.83.160.52]) by buckleyradio.com (8.12.6) id h2EJPcEH014405 for ; Fri, 14 Mar 2003 14:25:39 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <000b01c2ea5e$ecc71290$2a01010a@kerrydesk> To: Subject: Audiophile Quality Date: Fri, 14 Mar 2003 14:21:28 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Kerry Richards" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=136545831 X-Yahoo-Profile: kerryrichards710 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-eGroups-Approved-By: kevtronics via web; 14 Mar 2003 19:54:36 -0000 I think we all agree that neither AM Stereo or FM Stereo in today's environment is audiophile quality. For that matter is XM, Sirius, DirectTV, or IBOC audiophile quality? How could they be? I do not think any well made analog recording (even with something like Dolby noise reduction) can compare to "broadcast audio". In WQXR's case the processing is horrible, try listening to the 1812 Overture on WQXR, or the opera on Saturday afternoon, the processing is obvious. In most FM Stereo cases, the radios are partially to blame with varying degrees of the .75msec. curve etc, plus multipath and those issues. In AM Stereo the issue in C-Quam is the NRSC curve, and platform shift, and again the poor use of the AMAX specs. In AM IBOC the problem is the low bit rate, and the associated effects of the PAC involved. For Sirius and XM as well as some of the TV systems the same problems exist, it's either the data compression or the bit rate involved. The bottom line here is not one of these systems will ever be truly a mirror image of the original source, in the case of AM and FM the effects are made mush worse by the commercially accepted standards when it comes to audio processing. It all boils down to which one of the above schemes sounds the best to the most listeners, and therefore is commercially acceptable. There will never be a case where we can deliver "audiophile" quality in a broadcast environment, it is an impossible situation. So we sit here and argue over things such as who sounds the best? and who is the loudest? and who has the most or least processing? and who has or which system delivers the best stereo separation? etc etc. All of it is very subjective, "broadcasters" are just that...folks who throw out audio in all directions trying to reach a target audience and make a buck. If we look at the #1 station in a market, is it because they have better audio that the other guys? Is it because they have stereo or not? Research has shown most of the times signal quality has little to do with it. It kind of boils down to "if you have something somebody wants to hear, they will listen". Many of the physcoacoustic studies done, even early on by Dolby and others all clearly demonstrated the effects of heavily encoded and bit "lossy" algorithims, on the human hearing experience. More and more of these kinds of studies have been performed as we get further into a world of how much data can we squeeze into as little space as possible. It's kinda like what MPEG is all about. Some of the studies are broken down so far as to sex, age, and income, just to find if there is some common modicum of a standard for compressed lossy audio. Depending on whom you believe, you could draw several conclusions and figure which bitrate is the best. I have always felt what is delivered to the masses by the media has not always been the best or "audiophile" quality, but which systems have become or will become commercially acceptable? Obviously MP3's with bitrates as low as 96 kbps are acceptable, what about the average FM station? Even WQXR is acceptable to a large number of listeners, but not me. IBOC and C-Quam have their detractors, so does Sirius and XM. The bottom line here is what is "commercially acceptable", and we, as AM Stereo supporters how will we deliver stereo on this noisy and crowded AM band of ours in the future? Some of us are convinced C-Quam is the way to do this, some think IBOC will work. But, both systems have their problems, one system has had it's day in the sunshine, and one is not there yet. Neither are commercially acceptable to the majority. Only time will tell. Kerry Richards Chief Engineer WOR-AM Buckley Broadcasting Corporation [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From jbyrns@rcn.com Fri Mar 14 12:44:42 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@rcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 14 Mar 2003 20:44:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 12219 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2003 20:44:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Mar 2003 20:44:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Mar 2003 20:44:41 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.186] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Mar 2003 20:44:40 -0000 Date: Fri, 14 Mar 2003 20:44:39 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Whoa!!! Hold your Optimods! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1377 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bta_50g" X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.2 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=138635554 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "wa2fnq" wrote: > I agree. I had a chance to hear a Sirius satellite radio and the > high end sounded like garbage to me. Definately not audophile > material. But the iBiquity system has similar problems. We'll see > what their new code sounds like. I think the DRM system sounds > better and they're using an open platform not PAC. Unfortunately I > don't think they have an IBOC model but I bet something could be > done. I'd like to see all of the cards thrown on the table including > AM stereo received by proper equipment. Compare good AM against > digital and see where you are. Not like the comparisons I've heard > on the iBiquity and WOR web sites. You can't take AM that's audio > band limited at 5 KHz, compare it against digital and ask which > sounds better. I don't think throwing all the cards on the table as you say would really settle anything. The problem is that before you can judge the systems against one another you have to agree what it is that you want to accomplish with the selected system? Right now the various parties to this discussion have different agendas and goals, and they would still differ even with the "cards thrown on the table". The only question is whose agenda is the one to be followed, not who likes which system of AM stereo broadcasting better. John From philipr@irac.pe.ca Fri Mar 14 12:52:27 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 14 Mar 2003 20:52:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 33012 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2003 20:52:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Mar 2003 20:52:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.68) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Mar 2003 20:52:22 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.114] by n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Mar 2003 20:52:22 -0000 Date: Fri, 14 Mar 2003 20:52:20 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Audiophile Quality Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <000b01c2ea5e$ecc71290$2a01010a@kerrydesk> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 7266 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking Most radio listening tends to be done in a relatively casual manner - driving, working in the office, eating breakfast etc. Under these circumstances, even full blown audiophiles tend to be a little less picky. Using a good FM tuner [probably the top line analogue rigs from the 70s were the best available in the under $700 category], good antenna and not moving around - e.g. the home environment, CBC Radio 2 [Classical and more] certainly gets very close to audiophile quality. But, the typical commercial FM station is far from near audiophile quality - the biggest evil I note is absurd levels of compression/limiting. No doubt heavy compression/limiting does tend to mask multipath distortion and shadowing less noticeable - one distortion masking another. An interesting comparison can be found in Halifax NS, between CHUM owned sisters stations CJCH 920 AM Stereo and CIOO 100.1 FM Stereo. Using the NRSC 10.2 khz AM limit which is the law in Canada, CIOO has the clear edge in top end. Yet, CIOO is heavily compressed, almost comically so. CJCH has wide dynamic range. Which is closer to audiophile quality? If one was to judge this contest on the only cheap readily available wideband radio - the GE SR III, the choice is obvious CJCH's dynamic range more than makes up for the small extra bit of musical information between 10 khz and 15 khz - assuming CIOO is even going up to 15 khz. Neither is audiophile quality - yet one is still more natural and closer to this standard than the other. Yet CIOO is not the worst - that honour goes to Big Dog [aka 100.9 CKTO in Truro NS] the worst sounding FM station I've ever heard. Yet Big Dog plays pretty good music, so people listen, in spite of 3db dynamic range. Back when FM was a money losing venture, FM had the wide dynamic range, and AM was compressed to the wall. Its in heavily built up areas where broadcast FM and AM suffers the most. CBC Radio 2 can deliver near audiophile quality sound as I drive down Grafton Street in Charlottetown, but just try that on Barrington Street in Halifax or much worse, Times Square in NYC. Of course, it would be tough picking up CBC Radio 2 in Times Square! lol The big push for DAB in Canada was the ability to give a noise free signal in built up urban cores. DAB is slowly spreading accross Canada - Halifax will get 7 DAB stations later this year - but receiver sales are, well, slow. Guess not too many folks want to spend $300 CDN on a pocket radio. Gee, for that amount of money, I could buy yet another nice old Zenith Trans-Oceanic, buy an AM Stereo car radio and take my wife to dinner - the first 2 on ebay and the 3rd at a nice restaurant! lol So, perhaps we should be talking about quasi-audiophile quality - which system is best and under what conditions. But its not just the technology - its how its used. With the exception of the public broadcasters, radio has to make a buck. Hat's off to those broadcasters who try to sound their best, in a real world of interference and often indifferent listeners. Phil R. Residing in a land where IBOC is illegal, AM is dissapearing, FM is overcompressed, and Eureka 147 L-Band DAB will likely make CQUAM AM Stereo look like a big success by comparison. --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kerry Richards" wrote: > I think we all agree that neither AM Stereo or FM Stereo in today's environment is audiophile quality. For that matter is XM, Sirius, DirectTV, or IBOC audiophile quality? > > How could they be? I do not think any well made analog recording (even with something like Dolby noise reduction) can compare to "broadcast audio". > In WQXR's case the processing is horrible, try listening to the 1812 Overture on WQXR, or the opera on Saturday afternoon, the processing is obvious. > > In most FM Stereo cases, the radios are partially to blame with varying degrees of the .75msec. curve etc, plus multipath and those issues. > > In AM Stereo the issue in C-Quam is the NRSC curve, and platform shift, and again the poor use of the AMAX specs. In AM IBOC the problem is the low bit rate, and the associated effects of the PAC involved. > > For Sirius and XM as well as some of the TV systems the same problems exist, it's either the data compression or the bit rate involved. > > The bottom line here is not one of these systems will ever be truly a mirror image of the original source, in the case of AM and FM the effects are made mush worse by the commercially accepted standards when it comes to audio processing. It all boils down to which one of the above schemes sounds the best to the most listeners, and therefore is commercially acceptable. > > There will never be a case where we can deliver "audiophile" quality in a broadcast environment, it is an impossible situation. So we sit here and argue over things such as who sounds the best? and who is the loudest? and who has the most or least processing? and who has or which system delivers the best stereo separation? etc etc. > > All of it is very subjective, "broadcasters" are just that...folks who throw out audio in all directions trying to reach a target audience and make a buck. If we look at the #1 station in a market, is it because they have better audio that the other guys? Is it because they have stereo or not? Research has shown most of the times signal quality has little to do with it. It kind of boils down to "if you have something somebody wants to hear, they will listen". > > Many of the physcoacoustic studies done, even early on by Dolby and others all clearly demonstrated the effects of heavily encoded and bit "lossy" algorithims, on the human hearing experience. More and more of these kinds of studies have been performed as we get further into a world of how much data can we squeeze into as little space as possible. It's kinda like what MPEG is all about. Some of the studies are broken down so far as to sex, age, and income, just to find if there is some common modicum of a standard for compressed lossy audio. Depending on whom you believe, you could draw several conclusions and figure which bitrate is the best. > > I have always felt what is delivered to the masses by the media has not always been the best or "audiophile" quality, but which systems have become or will become commercially acceptable? Obviously MP3's with bitrates as low as 96 kbps are acceptable, what about the average FM station? Even WQXR is acceptable to a large number of listeners, but not me. IBOC and C-Quam have their detractors, so does Sirius and XM. > > The bottom line here is what is "commercially acceptable", and we, as AM Stereo supporters how will we deliver stereo on this noisy and crowded AM band of ours in the future? Some of us are convinced C- Quam is the way to do this, some think IBOC will work. But, both systems have their problems, one system has had it's day in the sunshine, and one is not there yet. Neither are commercially acceptable to the majority. > > Only time will tell. > > > Kerry Richards > Chief Engineer > WOR-AM > Buckley Broadcasting Corporation > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From philipr@irac.pe.ca Fri Mar 14 12:54:10 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 14 Mar 2003 20:54:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 76966 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2003 20:54:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Mar 2003 20:54:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Mar 2003 20:54:09 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.162] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Mar 2003 20:54:07 -0000 Date: Fri, 14 Mar 2003 20:54:05 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: New file uploaded to amstereoforum Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2081 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking My favourite "essence of radio" was the 1970s, perhaps the 80s too. It IS very subjective! Phil R. --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "bta_50g" wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Mr.M S" wrote: > > > > Talk about nostalgia....... > > > > This is probably O.T. and a rant at best, but those of you who were > > not able to experience radio in the 50's and 60's missed out on truly > > what the essence of radio was all about. Much of it was familiarity, > > and not the kind that breeds contempt. The NBC tone was one of those > > things that heralded quality. And it was as warm as the theme music > > of your favorite radio program. > > I'm not going to claim to know what the "essence of radio was all > about", as you do with your claim that it is represented by radio of > the "radio in the 50's and 60's", but I am curious how you know the > radio experience of 50's and 60's represents the "essence of radio"? > What rules out the radio experience of the 30's and 40's as > representing what the "essence of radio was all about"? Or even > today's post 1960's radio of the 21st Century, who is to say what we > have today is not the true "essence of radio"? > > To me radio of the "50's and 60's" represents a transition period > between the pre television radio form of the 30's and 40's, and radio > as we know it today. By 1950, the handwriting was pretty much on the > wall for radio as it existed in the era before television. I think > radio in the late 1960's differed from the earlier years of the 50's > and 60's in that by the late 60's, the die was pretty much cast that > would define radio as we know it today. From a listener's viewpoint I > don't see a major change in radio between the latter years of the > 1960's and today, just a refining of what was already happening. > > But the "essence of radio", that probably has a different meaning for > each individual, just as some say that the "essence of radio" can't be > conveyed by digital means. > > John From JH_Radio@GameBox.net Fri Mar 14 14:37:38 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: JH_Radio@GameBox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 14 Mar 2003 22:37:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 5804 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2003 22:37:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Mar 2003 22:37:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO babyruth.hotpop.com) (204.57.55.14) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Mar 2003 22:37:18 -0000 Received: from gamebox.net (kubrick.hotpop.com [204.57.55.16]) by babyruth.hotpop.com (Postfix) with SMTP id AB0042120CE for ; Fri, 14 Mar 2003 22:36:37 +0000 (UTC) Received: from johnii.GameBox.net (pcp03184855pcs.benslm01.pa.comcast.net [68.80.77.117]) by smtp-1.hotpop.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D32881A01AE for ; Fri, 14 Mar 2003 22:36:32 +0000 (UTC) Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030314171750.00ab4030@pop.GameBox.net> X-Sender: JH_Radio@pop.GameBox.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Fri, 14 Mar 2003 17:43:09 -0800 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Stereo Oldies on the radio! Mime-Version: 1.0 X-HotPOP: ----------------------------------------------- Sent By HotPOP.com FREE Email Get your FREE POP email at www.HotPOP.com ----------------------------------------------- From: John X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113800107 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hey. Wouldn't it be cool to have a AM Stereo station playing nothing but True Stereo Oldies? This up to 10 KHZ with no compression. Played from the original form, vinyl 45's or LP's. Stereo oldies. If it ain't in stereo, then we don't play 'em! Or am I dreaming? Love in Christ: John Bensalem, PA Send me an email Aim: RainAngelsRule MSN: RainAngelsRule@hotmail.com My website Welcome to Napster4TheBlind "Prayer does not change God; it changes you." - Authur unknown [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From wa2fnq@optonline.net Fri Mar 14 14:48:24 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: wa2fnq@optonline.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 14 Mar 2003 22:48:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 94920 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2003 22:48:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Mar 2003 22:48:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Mar 2003 22:48:21 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.185] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Mar 2003 22:48:21 -0000 Date: Fri, 14 Mar 2003 22:48:19 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Audiophile Quality Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <000b01c2ea5e$ecc71290$2a01010a@kerrydesk> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2592 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wa2fnq" X-Originating-IP: 64.236.235.240 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=60059615 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa2fnq --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kerry Richards" wrote: > I think we all agree that neither AM Stereo or FM Stereo in today's environment is audiophile quality. For that matter is XM, Sirius, DirectTV, or IBOC audiophile quality? > Just a comment.... and I didn't mean to stir up a bees nest. If you have the proper equipment you should be able to recover pretty damn good audio from Echostar, DSS, etc. Here at HBO we transmit full 5.1 audio on some of our networks. Believe me, when we do a live concert they bust our butt over the quality of the audio (Sorry if Britney Spears can't lip sync her own songs). Audio quality is a BIG issue. And some of the competitions networks aren't bad either. Unfortunately we're in a world of digital compression and that hurts us here in the video department. Guess what.... analog looked better but we can get more signals on a transponder with compression. It's $$$$ and don't think that doesn't bother us when we're trying to deliver the best quality product we can so it makes us try harder. And in my opinion, as a broadcaster, you should be concerned with delivering the best quality product you can. The person at the receiving end is really who's putting the money in your paycheck, more directly in my case, and that's who you're working for. Your on the air signal is the product you're producing and you should be damn proud of it. Even if only a few people notice how good the quality is you've done your job. When people talked about radio going digital I had high hopes. I wanted to see AM get back on it's feet and FM with CD quality. Boy, have I been disappointed. You have a system that sounds pretty poor. As far as I know it has no chance of reproducing surround sound. You should have seen the backwatering I got on that one from the Harris rep. and the NYC Digital Road Show. People point at the IBOC system and say "Hey, this is the future of radio" and they can't or refuse to hear how bad it is. I'm sorry. It doesn't meet my expectations. It is a matter of perspective but why as a consumer should I listen to something that annoys the crap out of me? I'll go back to listening to my CD player. And that's what you should be afraid of. Not Sirius or XM radio. By the way, what am I missing here? Why does the iBiquity system take 8.5 seconds to process a simple stereo audio stream? Our compression systems take about 1/2 a second with multi channel, complex video and audio. I don't have the answer and would like to know. Jerry WA2FNQ Manager, RF Systems HBO From jbyrns@rcn.com Fri Mar 14 15:36:41 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@rcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 14 Mar 2003 23:36:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 12723 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2003 23:36:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Mar 2003 23:36:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Mar 2003 23:36:37 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.189] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Mar 2003 23:36:37 -0000 Date: Fri, 14 Mar 2003 23:36:36 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Stereo Oldies on the radio! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20030314171750.00ab4030@pop.GameBox.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 758 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bta_50g" X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.83 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=138635554 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, John wrote: > > Hey. > Wouldn't it be cool to have a AM Stereo station playing nothing but True Stereo Oldies? > This up to 10 KHZ with no compression. > Played from the original form, vinyl 45's or LP's. > Stereo oldies. If it ain't in stereo, then we don't play 'em! > Or am I dreaming? Yeah, you are dreaming, but while we are dreaming, even cooler would be to have an AM station, nothing but real monophonic audio, with no compression, an 8 kcps STL, and a dash of peak limiting at the transmitter. Music on DJ shows played direct from the original vinyl, with news, dramatic, and variety shows live from the studio microphones, or off a 5 kcps network line. Now that's real radio. John From jbyrns@rcn.com Fri Mar 14 15:40:17 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@rcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 14 Mar 2003 23:40:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 56567 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2003 23:40:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Mar 2003 23:40:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Mar 2003 23:40:13 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.186] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 14 Mar 2003 23:40:13 -0000 Date: Fri, 14 Mar 2003 23:40:10 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Audiophile Quality Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 813 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bta_50g" X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.83 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=138635554 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "wa2fnq" wrote: > > And in my opinion, as a broadcaster, you should be concerned with > delivering the best quality product you can. The person at the > receiving end is really who's putting the money in your paycheck, > more directly in my case, and that's who you're working for. Your on > the air signal is the product you're producing and you should be > damn proud of it. The listeners don't put the money in a broadcasters paycheck, except maybe in public radio, the advertisers put the money in a broadcasters paycheck. The broadcasters product is not the "air signal", it is the listeners he/she delivers to the advertisers that is a broadcasters product. The situation takes on a different perspective when viewed from this angle. John From wa2fnq@optonline.net Fri Mar 14 16:38:54 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: wa2fnq@optonline.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 15 Mar 2003 00:38:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 49533 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2003 00:38:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Mar 2003 00:38:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.88) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Mar 2003 00:38:51 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.165] by n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Mar 2003 00:38:49 -0000 Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2003 00:38:48 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Audiophile Quality Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1734 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wa2fnq" X-Originating-IP: 24.47.74.230 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=60059615 X-Yahoo-Profile: wa2fnq Wrong John. One example: Somebody advertises on the radio. You hear his ad. You buy his product. The advertiser is happy and buys more air time with the money he made because you were sold by his ad on the radio. It's not as obvious but that's how it works. Ever hear the phrase "Tell them you heard it on the radio"? The money flows from one pocket to the next. No listeners, no advertisers, no radio. It's a direct relationship. If you've ever worked at a small radio station you'd know. Or look at it this way: You have no listeners because your station sounds crappy. Not necessarily technical, maybe your programming stinks. Who's going to buy time on it? If you have listeners then you can sell air time. If you look at it that way, the listeners put the money in your pocket. You better keep the listener satisfied or you'll have nothing. In a lot of cases the advertiser doesn't even listen to the radio station. They're looking at a ratings book. Unfortunately you have the attitude that too many people in management have. I'm sorry. I'm old fashoned. I happen to think the people who are my audience come first. If I've done a good job and they're satisfied then my station will have ratings and I may make money. Jerry WA2FNQ --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "bta_50g" wrote: > The listeners don't put the money in a broadcasters paycheck, except > maybe in public radio, the advertisers put the money in a broadcasters > paycheck. The broadcasters product is not the "air signal", it is the > listeners he/she delivers to the advertisers that is a broadcasters > product. The situation takes on a different perspective when viewed > from this angle. > > John From amymousie@yahoo.com Fri Mar 14 17:12:35 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 15 Mar 2003 01:12:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 21161 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2003 01:12:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Mar 2003 01:12:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Mar 2003 01:12:32 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.120] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Mar 2003 01:12:32 -0000 Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2003 01:12:31 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Audiophile Quality Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 748 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie" X-Originating-IP: 67.115.108.49 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "wa2fnq" wrote: > Wrong John. One example: =snip= Thanks, Jerry- You said what I wanted to say, but you did miss one thing, I think: A station's advertising rates, and therefore income, are directly proportional to the number of listeners to a station. Both the advertiser -and- the listener are customers to the radio station-- All three are interdependent on each other. You want to make your advertisers happy and get better ad fees, you have to please your listeners. You want to make your listeners happy, provide programming that as many as possible will listen, listen to the ads, patronise the advertisers, and the advertisers get results. A nice trangle. :) Amy. <:3 )~~8~ From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Mar 14 17:58:10 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 15 Mar 2003 01:58:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 76104 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2003 01:58:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Mar 2003 01:58:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Mar 2003 01:58:08 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-83.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.83]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h2F1w5le021742 for ; Fri, 14 Mar 2003 19:58:06 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <007901c2ea96$ca92af80$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Audiophile Quality Date: Fri, 14 Mar 2003 20:01:25 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Net result seems pretty much the same to me. Worked both commercial and non-com. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "bta_50g" > The listeners don't put the money in a broadcasters paycheck, except > maybe in public radio, the advertisers put the money in a broadcasters > paycheck. The broadcasters product is not the "air signal", it is the > listeners he/she delivers to the advertisers that is a broadcasters > product. The situation takes on a different perspective when viewed > from this angle. From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Mar 14 18:00:42 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 15 Mar 2003 02:00:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 54529 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2003 02:00:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Mar 2003 02:00:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Mar 2003 02:00:40 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-83.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.83]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h2F20ble022443 for ; Fri, 14 Mar 2003 20:00:38 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <008701c2ea97$2553b7c0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <5.2.0.9.0.20030314171750.00ab4030@pop.GameBox.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Stereo Oldies on the radio! Date: Fri, 14 Mar 2003 20:03:57 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Unfortunately it would cut out a lot of well-liked and familiar oldies. Keep your thinking cap on, though, you're bound to come up with something good. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "John" > Hey. > Wouldn't it be cool to have a AM Stereo station playing nothing but True Stereo Oldies? From stodd@sherbtel.net Fri Mar 14 18:03:18 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 15 Mar 2003 02:03:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 63687 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2003 02:03:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Mar 2003 02:03:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Mar 2003 02:03:17 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-83.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.83]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h2F23Ele023076 for ; Fri, 14 Mar 2003 20:03:15 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <008f01c2ea97$82ec9820$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <20030314141342.39630.qmail@web14208.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Hamfest AM Stereo Awareness Campaign Date: Fri, 14 Mar 2003 20:06:34 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Good for you!! I think I'll try asking for a portable CD player for Fathers Day. I may want to do something like that myself, but I lack any portable audio gear. I spend most of what little hobby money I have on refurbishing classic and antique stuff. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "John P." > This weekend I'll be distributing a color information sheet with the topic "AM > Radio in Stereo?" at the local Hamfest. From krichards@wor710.com Fri Mar 14 18:11:25 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 68028 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2003 02:11:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Mar 2003 02:11:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Mar 2003 02:11:20 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: krichards@wor710.com Received: from [66.218.67.170] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Mar 2003 02:11:20 -0000 X-Sender: krichards@wor710.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 15 Mar 2003 01:05:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 55149 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2003 01:05:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Mar 2003 01:05:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hawk.mail.pas.earthlink.net) (207.217.120.22) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Mar 2003 01:05:56 -0000 Received: from user-112ulnq.biz.mindspring.com ([66.47.86.250] helo=studiok) by hawk.mail.pas.earthlink.net with smtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 18u07X-0005Ru-00 for amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com; Fri, 14 Mar 2003 17:05:55 -0800 Message-ID: <000b01c2ea8f$e24857d0$6601a8c0@studiok> To: Subject: Audio Quality...... Date: Fri, 14 Mar 2003 20:12:00 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 From: "Kerry Richards" Reply-To: "Kerry Richards" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=136545831 X-Yahoo-Profile: kerryrichards710 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-eGroups-Approved-By: kevtronics via web; 15 Mar 2003 02:10:27 -0000 I knew this subject would touch off a storm......I am well aware that HBO has good audio since I can see and hear it here at home with my DirectTV HDTV hookup, I think it is some of the best. After all it is a 5.1 feed, so it is good, but here in AM Radio land, I do not have that luxury. So is the PBS feed from WNET DT, even WCBS DT is good. First, and foremost, I am in a very competitive situation, not only from a business standpoint, but also a fight with the very medium itself, which is noisy and far more troublesome than a nice wide digital path from video server to home. Most AM Broadcasters process the audio to a point where the audio has no dynamic range, and then from there add asymmetrical positive peaks out to as close as you can get to 125%. Then we get to the clipping issue, so you find yourself in audio hell from the get go. Why??? Remember the words "Commercially Acceptable"...That's WHY. If WOR were to lower the processing to the point where what went in, is what went out, what do you think would happen? I'll tell you....first the owner would scream, because everybody else on the dial including the little Korean station would be louder than us. What about the audio? It would sound great on well produced spots, and studio material where the operator on duty was paying attention, but then we are automated in a lot of dayparts, the spots come in every which way now. The audio during these portions would be all over the place. We now get spots that come from major agencies via MP3 emails! Utter crap sometimes.... Getting back to the real world, we try to keep the audio as clean as possible before processing, things like making sure we use a good setting on the ISDN remotes which are frequent (L3 instead of G.722), then we take care to make sure the audio levels from each control room and server are in the realm of our plant operating level, and control the audio on it's way to the transmitter from Manhattan to Lyndhurst with an expensive Orban transmission limiter. We have an uncompressed Digital path on our main STL, which is stereo and clean as a whistle. Even our last resort backup, an 10KHZ grandfathered in old copper pair STL meets specs, I just had Ma Bell replace the line amp in Lyndhurst, what a fiasco. But it does sound good. So give us a few points for trying...... Once the audio hits the 9200 or even the 9100 we get into the realm of the current state of AM Radio.....we all know that story. I can say that it's digital counterpart, the Orban 6200, on the HD Radio feed is set for a very conservative level of processing. It's amazing to listen to sometimes, it's pretty clean, and is very FM like. Keep in mind WOR operates two Radio Networks out of our plant, we are feeding several thousand other stations 24/7, so we are very proud of the audio that goes up to the bird. It takes a lot of effort. Remember this is with a plant that is almost 35 years old. Those Jensen Transformers and 990 OP Amps really have a warm sound, get one of the WOR AKG condenser mikes in Studio 4, and one of our female announcers, the results in the monitors are really good. Even our RE20's in the other rooms have a great sound through this classic gear. As for the 8.2 second delay from the Ibiquity stuff, it is required for error correction, and acquisition. They want to get as much time as possible to work on the bitstream, before playing it back. This is an ongoing issue, we still lower the delay to zero during sporting events due to the delay. All of our listeners are using analog radios, but when HD radios start to proliferate we will stop this process. If you were listening to our HD signal when we ramped down the delay, you would not be able to have the blend function of the receiver work properly. For us the 8.2 second delay is not really an issue since we are always operating in delay 'cause we are basically a talk station. Our operators do not listen off air, but listen to the WOR 100% feed which is what goes to Lyndhurst, not what comes out of it. The WOR time tone transmitted at the top of the hour is sent to Lyndhurst 8.2 seconds early, so it is aired at the actual top of the hour. Currently, there is no FM station operating the HD scheme here in NYC, so even though I have the receivers to listen, I ain't got nuthing to listen to....Everybody says there is just not enough power up at Empire now, since 9/11...they say maybe this summer. Anybody want to visit and see my playground, just let me know......Its a lot of fun. Kerry Richards Chief Engineer WOR-AM Buckley Broadcasting Corporation [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From rwagoner1@mac.com Fri Mar 14 20:41:12 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner1@mac.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 15 Mar 2003 04:41:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 58625 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2003 04:41:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Mar 2003 04:41:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO fed1mtao07.cox.net) (68.6.19.124) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Mar 2003 04:41:12 -0000 Received: from mac.com ([68.4.0.44]) by fed1mtao07.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20030315044107.XJZW1451.fed1mtao07.cox.net@mac.com> for ; Fri, 14 Mar 2003 23:41:07 -0500 Date: Fri, 14 Mar 2003 20:41:16 -0800 Subject: Re: {AMSF} Stereo Oldies on the radio! Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: <008701c2ea97$2553b7c0$827dfea9@home1> Message-Id: <5BF6EA24-56A0-11D7-9148-0005021D3C76@mac.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) From: Richard Wagoner X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135738921 X-Yahoo-Profile: richardalanwagoner Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I'm of the old guard. Stereo when good or original, mono otherwise. Beatles in that crappy fake stereo? Forget it. (Of course as some of you know, I'm the one person in the US that doesn't really like the Beatles, so perhaps that's not the best example). Even jingles -- KHJ jingles in stereo? No way. On Friday, March 14, 2003, at 06:03 PM, Scott Todd wrote: > Unfortunately it would cut out a lot of well-liked and familiar oldies. > Keep your thinking cap on, though, you're bound to come up with > something > good. > > ST > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "John" > > > Hey. > > Wouldn't it be cool to have a AM Stereo station playing nothing but > True > Stereo Oldies? > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From n0uiheric@aol.com Fri Mar 14 21:03:34 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 15 Mar 2003 05:03:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 2079 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2003 05:03:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Mar 2003 05:03:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-m07.mx.aol.com) (64.12.136.162) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Mar 2003 05:03:33 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-m07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.a3.3ceed084 (3980) for ; Sat, 15 Mar 2003 00:03:29 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2003 00:03:28 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Audiophile Quality To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih IBOC is NOT audiophile quality sound...never has been, never will be. 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From JH_Radio@GameBox.net Fri Mar 14 21:15:41 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: JH_Radio@GameBox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 15 Mar 2003 05:15:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 97196 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2003 05:15:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Mar 2003 05:15:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO babyruth.hotpop.com) (204.57.55.14) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Mar 2003 05:15:16 -0000 Received: from gamebox.net (kubrick.hotpop.com [204.57.55.16]) by babyruth.hotpop.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 20E56210089 for ; Sat, 15 Mar 2003 05:14:55 +0000 (UTC) Received: from johnii.GameBox.net (pcp03184855pcs.benslm01.pa.comcast.net [68.80.77.117]) by smtp-1.hotpop.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 771E41A01CB for ; Sat, 15 Mar 2003 04:51:39 +0000 (UTC) Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030314235435.009f69c0@pop.GameBox.net> X-Sender: JH_Radio@pop.GameBox.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Fri, 14 Mar 2003 23:56:39 -0800 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Stereo Oldies on the radio! In-Reply-To: <5BF6EA24-56A0-11D7-9148-0005021D3C76@mac.com> References: <008701c2ea97$2553b7c0$827dfea9@home1> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-HotPOP: ----------------------------------------------- Sent By HotPOP.com FREE Email Get your FREE POP email at www.HotPOP.com ----------------------------------------------- From: John X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113800107 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I don't like the stereo that just puts different frequency ranges in the left and right channel. I'm talking the true stereo, or even wide stereo is good. But what is it about some of the stuff too that seem to have this kind of reverb in the files, and it sounds functified, and if I put it on mono it sounds totally different then the mono version? At 08:41 PM 3/14/03 -0800, you wrote: >I'm of the old guard. Stereo when good or original, mono otherwise. >Beatles in that crappy fake stereo? Forget it. (Of course as some of >you know, I'm the one person in the US that doesn't really like the >Beatles, so perhaps that's not the best example). Even jingles -- KHJ >jingles in stereo? No way. > >On Friday, March 14, 2003, at 06:03 PM, Scott Todd wrote: > >> Unfortunately it would cut out a lot of well-liked and familiar oldies. >> Keep your thinking cap on, though, you're bound to come up with >> something >> good. >> >> ST >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "John" >> >> > Hey. >> > Wouldn't it be cool to have a AM Stereo station playing nothing but >> True >> Stereo Oldies? >> >> > > >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > >Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Love in Christ: John Bensalem, PA Send me an email Aim: RainAngelsRule MSN: RainAngelsRule@hotmail.com My website Welcome to Napster4TheBlind "Prayer does not change God; it changes you." - Authur unknown [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From jsgil@hal-pc.org Fri Mar 14 22:24:54 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 15 Mar 2003 06:24:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 22177 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2003 06:24:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Mar 2003 06:24:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Mar 2003 06:24:53 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.182] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Mar 2003 06:24:53 -0000 Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2003 06:24:53 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Audiophile Quality Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <000b01c2ea5e$ecc71290$2a01010a@kerrydesk> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1506 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.103 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kerry Richards" wrote: > > The bottom line here is what is "commercially acceptable", and we, as AM Stereo supporters how will we deliver stereo on this noisy and crowded AM band of ours in the future? Some of us are convinced C-Quam is the way to do this, some think IBOC will work. But, both systems have their problems, one system has had it's day in the sunshine, and one is not there yet. Neither are commercially acceptable to the majority. > > Only time will tell. > > > Kerry Richards > Chief Engineer > WOR-AM > Buckley Broadcasting Corporation > > At least the IBOC exciter is programable. If AM-DAB fails to take off then for those stations who have invested in the equipment then 'Plan B' could be to have the exciter reprogramed to transmit C-QuAM, Kahn, Harris... or a different analog system that takes the best qualities from the 5 original proposed systems to come up with a robust analog stereo system. DSP receiver technology applied to analog signals has evolved to handle most of the noise issues that plague conventional analog receivers. I think it would be possible to recover a FM stereo quality signal under most conditions with a DSP radio. If the interference issue at night does not allow the use of IBOC then the exciter could be programed the switch to analog AM stereo. This would allow existing AMS radios to still be used and the IBOC receivers would decode DAB during the day and C-QuAM at night. JSG From kevtronics@yahoo.com Fri Mar 14 23:50:49 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 15 Mar 2003 07:50:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 74566 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2003 07:50:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Mar 2003 07:50:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Mar 2003 07:50:49 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.128] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Mar 2003 07:50:49 -0000 Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2003 07:50:48 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Stereo Oldies on the radio! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <5.2.0.9.0.20030314235435.009f69c0@pop.GameBox.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2685 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.73.130 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > I don't like the stereo that just puts different frequency ranges > in the left and right channel. > I'm talking the true stereo, or even wide stereo is good. > But what is it about some of the stuff too that seem to have this > kind of reverb in the files, and it sounds functified, and if I put > it on mono it sounds totally different then the mono version? Any kind of "simulated stereo" or stereo reverb effect added to a mono audio source should only be applied to the L-R (stereo difference) component. That way, the original mono audio can be restored simply by pushing the "Mono" button on one's receiver. A wide variety of "simulated stereo" effects were used in music production from the late '50s through even the early '70s; some are merely amusing, while others are downright horrible, and only a few are good. "Electronic Stereo", as used on some Sinatra records, produced an interesting effect for stereo listeners, but gave a "singing in the bathroom" effect for anybody listening in mono. Years before I got an actual AM Stereo receiver, I would produce my own simulated stereo from mono AM by using a graphical equalizer with individual left and right channel controls, putting the highs in one channel and the lows in the other. At night I would also tune two different AM receivers to the same station and use them as the Left and Right channels for stereo headphones; there was just enough difference in the reception characteristics between the two radios that during skywave fade-outs, somewhat of a stereo-like spatial effect was produced. Much more sophisticated than this is the effects that can be produced with Digital Signal Processing (DSP). Applied to mono AM signals, DSP can be designed to produce a tasteful and realistic-sounding simulated stereo effect. Here is an example of actual reception of a mono AM station, 1170 WWTR in Bridgewater, NJ (simulcasting sister station 1250 WMTR), as received on a Chrysler AMAX radio and then processed with DSP to enhance frequency response, reduce background noise, improve dynamic range, and create a stereo reverb effect. The end result is significantly more enjoyable than what you ordinarily would get from mono AM listening: ftp://209.193.86.116/usa/nj/wwtr-st.mp3 Like I mentioned above, the stereo effect is only applied to the L-R component, so summing the audio to mono cancels out the stereo reverb effect entirely. By the way, 1170 WWTR uses an Optimod 9100-B2 and a Broadcast Electronics AM-500 transmitter -- both of which are fully AM-Stereo-capable -- and this combination makes for one of the nicest sounding mono AM stations I have ever heard. From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sat Mar 15 02:53:26 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 15 Mar 2003 10:53:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 95380 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2003 10:53:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Mar 2003 10:53:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Mar 2003 10:53:23 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.164] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Mar 2003 10:53:22 -0000 Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2003 10:53:20 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Stereo Oldies on the radio! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1230 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.129.13 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T." wrote: > > A wide variety of "simulated stereo" effects were used in music > production from the late '50s through even the early '70s; some are > merely amusing, while others are downright horrible, and only a few > are good. "Electronic Stereo", as used on some Sinatra records, > produced an interesting effect for stereo listeners, but gave a > "singing in the bathroom" effect for anybody listening in mono. > On effect was created with a delay line of ~5ms using a bucket brigade device. The mono signal was delayed and mixed back with the undelayed signal. For one channel it was added and the other was subtracted. This was a comb filter that created a rapid peaks and nulls as you go across the frequency band. What didn't appear in one channel appeared in the other. A crude version could be created with a 12 band graphic eq that has separate controls for L & R. On the Left channel every other band is pushed all the way up while the others are pushed all the way down. On the Right channel the same thing is done but the bands that were pushed up on the Left channel are pushed down and the ones that are pushed down are pushed up. JSG From dwtpa97@earthlink.net Sat Mar 15 05:15:58 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dwtpa97@earthlink.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 15 Mar 2003 13:15:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 53887 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2003 13:15:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Mar 2003 13:15:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO harrier.mail.pas.earthlink.net) (207.217.120.12) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Mar 2003 13:15:55 -0000 Received: from sdn-ap-013scfairp0286.dialsprint.net ([63.183.129.32] helo=earthlink.net) by harrier.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 18uBVy-0004tL-00 for amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com; Sat, 15 Mar 2003 05:15:55 -0800 Message-ID: <3E7327C8.9C4BE0EC@earthlink.net> Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2003 08:16:56 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.79 [en]C-CCK-MCD NSCPCD472 (Windows NT 5.0; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: )))...In Living AM Stereo...(((Radio - The Movie))) References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: dwtpa97 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38076959 Another old radio song is "You Turn Me On, I'm a Radio" by Joni Mitchell. I think it reached around #24 in the charts back in the late 60s. Dick W. Phil Rafuse wrote: > Another great Radio song is "Rush - Spirit of Radio". The lyrics > basically are a Radio anthem. If I were to set up a Classic Rock > station, it would be my official first song. Similarly, a movie > about the radio business - it would be a definite for the soundtrack. > > I'm just imagining the opening scene for the new mega hit > movie "Radio" - a spectacular view from high atop a very tall tower - > with the intro from Aldo Nova's Fantasy [LP version] pumping from > the theatre speakers, then two analogue VU meters [with blipping red > peak LEDs] filling the movie screen and the pounding beat of Rush - > Spirit of Radio - bringing up into the mix. > > I'm not sure whether I'd want the fictious radio station to be an AM > station or an FM station - however the time period would likely be > the 80s. I think I'm leaning toward a 50kw AM Stereo station, with > a tight directional pattern at night giving "drifting in the parking > lot" call sign - CILY and announcers who sound like the 70s to > early 80s radio wars between CJCH and CHNS. Ah, the good old days!!! > > Phil R. > > FM could always be for the sequel - where is Steven Spielberg when > you need him??? lol From narkspud@hotmail.com Sat Mar 15 08:07:20 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: narkspud@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 15 Mar 2003 16:07:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 77066 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2003 16:07:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Mar 2003 16:07:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.78) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Mar 2003 16:07:18 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.143] by n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Mar 2003 16:07:14 -0000 Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2003 16:07:11 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Whoa! KHPY! AM Stereo Oldies Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 553 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "narkspud" X-Originating-IP: 66.159.192.39 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=81956306 X-Yahoo-Profile: narkspud Just stumbled over them this morning. . .KHPY, AM 1670, Moreno Valley, CA, "with the songs you haven't heard in awhile." They're playing a wonderful variety of oldies (read: nothing like K-EARTH), with a real live local DJ "Johnny Helm," in full AM Stereo! Signal is shaky here in my interference-infested Orange County apartment, but if this is their usual format, I definitely have a new station in the car. Song on the air right this second: The Searchers-"Don't Throw Your Love Away." This sounds like radio as I remember it! narkspud From narkspud@hotmail.com Sat Mar 15 08:20:04 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: narkspud@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 15 Mar 2003 16:20:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 51122 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2003 16:20:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Mar 2003 16:20:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Mar 2003 16:20:03 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.117] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Mar 2003 16:20:03 -0000 Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2003 16:20:02 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Real "RF" Over the Air signals, not 'piped-in' fakes Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20030314030926.93365.qmail@web41003.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 655 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "narkspud" X-Originating-IP: 66.159.192.39 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=81956306 X-Yahoo-Profile: narkspud Getting OT here, but here's an observation: Most programming on digital broadcast TV is not High Definition. Why risk blocky signal fades when you can throw in that DVD of "A Bug's Life," which has a better picture anyway because it has less MPEG compression? Those stores who are running a HD demo from a hard drive are using one specifically designed to show HD in its best light. . .IE entirely consisting of almost-still pictures and/or sports footage so fast that it's just a blur. HD and digital broadcast don't do as well with normal motion on broadcast programming . . .the artifacts become pretty obvious to discriminating viewers. From jim@burgan.net Sat Mar 15 08:27:54 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jim@burgan.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 15 Mar 2003 16:27:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 61070 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2003 16:27:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Mar 2003 16:27:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sccimhc02.insightbb.com) (63.240.76.164) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Mar 2003 16:27:51 -0000 Received: from jimspc ([12.223.132.140]) by sccimhc02.insightbb.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030315162751.XUWP4400.sccimhc02.insightbb.com@jimspc> for ; Sat, 15 Mar 2003 16:27:51 +0000 Message-ID: <000701c2eb0f$d3cb5470$9802a8c0@jimspc> To: References: <3E7327C8.9C4BE0EC@earthlink.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: )))...In Living AM Stereo...(((Radio - The Movie))) Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2003 11:27:52 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Jim Burgan" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=36730433 X-Yahoo-Profile: jimbo700 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit >Another old radio song is "You Turn Me On, I'm a Radio" by Joni Mitchell. I >think it reached around #24 in the charts back in the late 60s. >Dick W. It peaked at #25 in early 1973 (Released Dec. 1972) It was a good song.... [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From narkspud@hotmail.com Sat Mar 15 08:51:39 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: narkspud@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 15 Mar 2003 16:51:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 8978 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2003 16:51:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Mar 2003 16:51:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.83) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Mar 2003 16:51:30 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.139] by n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Mar 2003 16:51:30 -0000 Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2003 16:51:25 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: )))...In Living AM Stereo...((( Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 180 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "narkspud" X-Originating-IP: 66.159.192.39 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=81956306 X-Yahoo-Profile: narkspud --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "amymousie" wrote: > "radio" songs. "Pilot of the Airwaves" - Charlie Dore Doesn't ANYBODY remember this one-hit wonder? From jim@burgan.net Sat Mar 15 09:05:43 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jim@burgan.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 15 Mar 2003 17:05:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 12493 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2003 17:05:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Mar 2003 17:05:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO sccimhc02.insightbb.com) (63.240.76.164) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Mar 2003 17:05:38 -0000 Received: from jimspc ([12.223.132.140]) by sccimhc02.insightbb.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20030315170537.XZLG4400.sccimhc02.insightbb.com@jimspc> for ; Sat, 15 Mar 2003 17:05:37 +0000 Message-ID: <005301c2eb15$1a57afb0$9802a8c0@jimspc> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: )))...In Living AM Stereo...((( Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2003 12:05:38 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Jim Burgan" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=36730433 X-Yahoo-Profile: jimbo700 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Pilot of the airwaves.. Here is my request... You don't have to play it but I hope you'll do your best... I've been listening to your show on the radio... And you seem like a friend to me... I was one of 3 people who actually liked and bought the single. You'll find it on Rhino's "Pop Hits Of The 80's" Vol II or III (I don't have it handy to check). >"Pilot of the Airwaves" - Charlie Dore >Doesn't ANYBODY remember this one-hit wonder? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From michaelj@vcn.com Sat Mar 15 09:29:25 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 15 Mar 2003 17:29:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 18070 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2003 17:29:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Mar 2003 17:29:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m3-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.33) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Mar 2003 17:29:24 -0000 Received: from michaelj (unverified [209.193.86.62]) by m3-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Sat, 15 Mar 2003 10:29:24 -0700 Message-ID: <00b601c2eb18$ebd766e0$3e56c1d1@mshome.net> To: References: <000b01c2ea8f$e24857d0$6601a8c0@studiok> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Audio Quality...... Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2003 10:32:56 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Just a quick side note, Kerry...and all. Tell me something. Honestly now, who is it that REALLY cares if one station is louder than another. Is it the listener?? Is a listener REALLY gonna turn the dial to another station because they're louder??? To me, that has always been a MANAGEMENT thing. I truly believe that it's the PD or the GM that will complain if the station is not loud enough. Can you honestly say that a listener has ever called a radio station to complain that they're turning the dial because you're not LOUD enough???? I think Kerry said it all in his other post. If you play something they like, they're gonna listen. I don't think they give a rat's patout how LOUD it is. Now YES, if it's so low that they have to turn their radio WAY up, then yeah it could be a problem. But as far as the difference between modulating 100% and 125% I highly doubt that is a problem from the listener's standpoint. Another observation, I think there's a mis-understanding going on about compression. Please correct me if I'm wrong. But I remember, long before digital radio or using compressed audio (as in compressed audio files...mp3) came along, there WAS talk about research that proved it is fatiguing to the human ear to listen to compressed audio. But they were talking about audio that is squashed inside the processor! NOT where it's coming from. I agree with that. I'd much rather listen to a clean AM than a loud SQUASHED AM or FM that compresses the crap out of their audio. THAT is the kind of compression they're talking about. I think this has absolutely NOTHING to do with saying that the human ear gets tired of listening to audio in which the audio is from a compressed audio file (mp3, mp2, others) format. If that were the case, then why would Jones, ABC, CBS, Westwood One, and EVERYBODY have gone to using all these MPEG and Starguide II and Starguide III audio satellite receivers??? ALL of these compress the audio. It's at a nice bitrate, so it's CD quality, but it's still COMPRESSED. My point? I think it is incorrect to go around saying "well you have to play real CDs or WAV files made directly from the CDs with zero compression, otherwise if you compress it, people won't listen because they get tired of listening." Unfortunately I've heard that a lot. "You can't play compressed audio files because studies show that it fatiques the human ear." Honestly, I hate trying to listen to big-market radio....especially CHR stations. The compression is unreal and it IS tiring to listen to. Meanwhile in big markets, the AM's squash and push SO hard just so that they can be the LOUDEST. That's word from Randy Michaels himself. "Clearchannel stations will always be the LOUDEST on the dial! That's why we can't run AM Stereo. Because with AM Stereo, we can't be as loud." Anyways, that's a whole other story. Here, we modulate about 100% with c-quam. It sounds wonderful, and no, it may not be the loudest station on the dial, but it's clean. Our FM has only an Orban Optimod.....I forget the model number, but it's the one with the yellow front on it. Typical standard in most FM stations before all of these new fangle processors came out. It was bought in 1982 when it went on the air. That's it. No other processing. True, I notice we sound a little different than the big market guys......but we're relatively loud, and yet very clean and not "Compressed-sounding". My words-eye view. Off my soapbox and back into my hole. Michael n WYO ----- Original Message ----- From: Kerry Richards To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, March 14, 2003 6:12 PM Subject: {AMSF} Audio Quality...... [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From michaelj@vcn.com Sat Mar 15 09:32:09 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 15 Mar 2003 17:32:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 91838 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2003 17:32:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Mar 2003 17:32:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m3-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.33) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Mar 2003 17:32:08 -0000 Received: from michaelj (unverified [209.193.86.62]) by m3-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Sat, 15 Mar 2003 10:32:08 -0700 Message-ID: <00be01c2eb19$4e9cbdc0$3e56c1d1@mshome.net> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: )))...In Living AM Stereo...((( Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2003 10:35:42 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit You BET! I remember hearing it the first time! 1981 I believe! Used to get requests for it when I did my 80s at 8 show a few years ago. Michael n WYO ----- Original Message ----- From: narkspud To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2003 9:51 AM Subject: {AMSF} Re: )))...In Living AM Stereo...((( --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "amymousie" wrote: > "radio" songs. "Pilot of the Airwaves" - Charlie Dore Doesn't ANYBODY remember this one-hit wonder? Yahoo! Groups Sponsor Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From JH_Radio@GameBox.net Sat Mar 15 10:00:05 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: JH_Radio@GameBox.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 15 Mar 2003 18:00:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 43743 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2003 18:00:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Mar 2003 18:00:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO babyruth.hotpop.com) (204.57.55.14) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Mar 2003 18:00:04 -0000 Received: from gamebox.net (kubrick.hotpop.com [204.57.55.16]) by babyruth.hotpop.com (Postfix) with SMTP id C969F214D62 for ; Sat, 15 Mar 2003 18:00:00 +0000 (UTC) Received: from johnii.GameBox.net (pcp03184855pcs.benslm01.pa.comcast.net [68.80.77.117]) by smtp-2.hotpop.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 906021800D5 for ; Sat, 15 Mar 2003 18:00:00 +0000 (UTC) Message-Id: <5.2.0.9.0.20030315130509.009e99c0@pop.GameBox.net> X-Sender: JH_Radio@pop.GameBox.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.2.0.9 Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2003 13:06:30 -0800 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Delco Am Stereo or Panisonic Am Stereo Generater? Mime-Version: 1.0 X-HotPOP: ----------------------------------------------- Sent By HotPOP.com FREE Email Get your FREE POP email at www.HotPOP.com ----------------------------------------------- From: John X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113800107 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Okay, so what exactly does the genirator do that the Delco doesn't as far as Am performance? I'd need a reason to justify spending that much more money. Love in Christ: John Bensalem, PA Send me an email Aim: RainAngelsRule MSN: RainAngelsRule@hotmail.com My website Welcome to Napster4TheBlind "Prayer does not change God; it changes you." - Authur unknown [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From jbyrns@rcn.com Sat Mar 15 10:01:51 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@rcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 15 Mar 2003 18:01:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 11147 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2003 18:01:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Mar 2003 18:01:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Mar 2003 18:01:51 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.188] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Mar 2003 18:01:51 -0000 Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2003 18:01:49 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Audio Quality...... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <00b601c2eb18$ebd766e0$3e56c1d1@mshome.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 4422 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bta_50g" X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.53 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=138635554 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g No, of course a listener is not going to tune away from a station because it isn't the loudest one on the dial. But if she is scanning the dial for some other reason, looking for another station to listen to, she will more likely stop at a louder station, all other things being equal. This is not a conscious decision, the listener doesn't say to herself, I'm going to look for the loudest station to listen too, it's simply that a louder station is more likely to catch her attention as she is scanning for something she likes. John --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Michael J. Richard" < michaelj@v...> wrote: > Just a quick side note, Kerry...and all. Tell me something. Honestly now, who is it that REALLY cares if one station is louder than another. Is it the listener?? Is a listener REALLY gonna turn the dial to another station because they're louder??? To me, that has always been a MANAGEMENT thing. I truly believe that it's the PD or the GM that will complain if the station is not loud enough. Can you honestly say that a listener has ever called a radio station to complain that they're turning the dial because you're not LOUD enough???? > I think Kerry said it all in his other post. If you play something they like, they're gonna listen. I don't think they give a rat's patout how LOUD it is. Now YES, if it's so low that they have to turn their radio WAY up, then yeah it could be a problem. But as far as the difference between modulating 100% and 125% I highly doubt that is a problem from the listener's standpoint. > Another observation, I think there's a mis-understanding going on about compression. Please correct me if I'm wrong. But I remember, long before digital radio or using compressed audio (as in compressed audio files...mp3) came along, there WAS talk about research that proved it is fatiguing to the human ear to listen to compressed audio. But they were talking about audio that is squashed inside the processor! NOT where it's coming from. I agree with that. I'd much rather listen to a clean AM than a loud SQUASHED AM or FM that compresses the crap out of their audio. THAT is the kind of compression they're talking about. I think this has absolutely NOTHING to do with saying that the human ear gets tired of listening to audio in which the audio is from a compressed audio file (mp3, mp2, others) format. If that were the case, then why would Jones, ABC, CBS, Westwood One, and EVERYBODY have gone to using all these MPEG and Starguide II and Starguide III audio satellite receivers??? ALL of these compress the audio. It's at a nice bitrate, so it's CD quality, but it's still COMPRESSED. My point? I think it is incorrect to go around saying "well you have to play real CDs or WAV files made directly from the CDs with zero compression, otherwise if you compress it, people won't listen because they get tired of listening." Unfortunately I've heard that a lot. "You can't play compressed audio files because studies show that it fatiques the human ear." Honestly, I hate trying to listen to big-market radio....especially CHR stations. The compression is unreal and it IS tiring to listen to. Meanwhile in big markets, the AM's squash and push SO hard just so that they can be the LOUDEST. That's word from Randy Michaels himself. "Clearchannel stations will always be the LOUDEST on the dial! That's why we can't run AM Stereo. Because with AM Stereo, we can't be as loud." > Anyways, that's a whole other story. Here, we modulate about 100% with c-quam. It sounds wonderful, and no, it may not be the loudest station on the dial, but it's clean. Our FM has only an Orban Optimod.....I forget the model number, but it's the one with the yellow front on it. Typical standard in most FM stations before all of these new fangle processors came out. It was bought in 1982 when it went on the air. That's it. No other processing. True, I notice we sound a little different than the big market guys......but we're relatively loud, and yet very clean and not "Compressed-sounding". > > My words-eye view. Off my soapbox and back into my hole. > > Michael n WYO > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Kerry Richards > To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com > Sent: Friday, March 14, 2003 6:12 PM > Subject: {AMSF} Audio Quality...... > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From stodd@sherbtel.net Sat Mar 15 10:07:16 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 15 Mar 2003 18:07:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 85155 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2003 18:07:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Mar 2003 18:07:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Mar 2003 18:07:16 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-93.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.93]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h2FI7Cle011624 for ; Sat, 15 Mar 2003 12:07:13 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <003701c2eb1e$2df56b80$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <000b01c2ea8f$e24857d0$6601a8c0@studiok> <00b601c2eb18$ebd766e0$3e56c1d1@mshome.net> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Audio Quality...... Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2003 12:10:34 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude I think I can give that a qualified yes. On WWTC we're up against some 50kW competition with only 5000W. At night we have a null over the SE part of the metro, the areas just south of downtown St Paul being some of the hardest hit, we run the signal to the max because we have a lot of listeners that can't hear us otherwise. Frankly I wish I were in your position where your signal is enough to cover the market so I COULD back off. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael J. Richard" > Can you honestly say that a listener has ever called a radio station to complain that they're turning the dial because you're not LOUD enough???? From stodd@sherbtel.net Sat Mar 15 10:12:58 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 15 Mar 2003 18:12:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 96316 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2003 18:12:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Mar 2003 18:12:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Mar 2003 18:12:58 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-88-93.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.88.93]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h2FICsle013087 for ; Sat, 15 Mar 2003 12:12:56 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <004501c2eb1e$f9e250a0$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Whoa! KHPY! AM Stereo Oldies Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2003 12:16:16 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude I envy you, bro. We could use something like that around here. Maybe if I win the lotto or something; but then perhaps we need the receivers more than the stations at this moment. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "narkspud" > Just stumbled over them this morning. . .KHPY, AM 1670, > Moreno Valley, CA, "with the songs you haven't heard in awhile." > They're playing a wonderful variety of oldies (read: nothing like > K-EARTH), with a real live local DJ "Johnny Helm," in full AM > Stereo! Signal is shaky here in my interference-infested Orange > County apartment, but if this is their usual format, I definitely have > a new station in the car. From evergreenterrace@buzzle.com Sat Mar 15 10:24:52 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: evergreenterrace@buzzle.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 15 Mar 2003 18:24:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 43415 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2003 18:24:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Mar 2003 18:24:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.66) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Mar 2003 18:24:51 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.188] by n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Mar 2003 18:24:51 -0000 Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2003 18:24:50 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Blaupunkt DigiCeiver Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2819 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgliradio" X-Originating-IP: 151.204.159.202 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=69711087 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgliradio For all the talk of the Symphony Chipset, I just installed the Blaupunkt Digiceiver. While not Symphony, it is an all digital front end with adaptive bandwidth. For FM, it solves alot of sins, but takes a little getting used to. Selectivity and sensitivity are thru the roof. WLNG-FM on Long Island usually dies out (for typical listeners) in the Shirley/Patchogue area as you head west. The Blaupunkt takes it, very listenable, for another 15-20 miles west toward the Nassau County line and even further if you can stand a little hissing (the radio rejecting, with the adaptive bandwidth on, adjacent WSHU 91.9 and WXRK 92.3). With the adaptive bandwidth off, it performs just like a typical 2003 car stereo. In one test that really blew my mind, I was able to listen to WDRC- FM (102.9) AND GET RDS DATA FROM WDRC at the NY-111/Southern State Pkwy interchange (for those who don't know, the WBZO (103.1)/WLIE (540) stick is located just off this exit). Audio quality on locals approaches CD quality IMHO. There is low distortion, excellent seperation and multipath artifacts are greatly reduced. What takes getting used to is the adaptive bandwidth. Tuning around with the bandwidth on, you stop at a station and the audio on weaker stations can sound quite distorted for a second or two before the radio "adapts" to the signal and is able to correct it (in which case it sounds just fine). It just can be a little strange to hear at first until you realize what it's trying to do. One downside, the FM seems to be overly sensitive in high RF fields (multiple FM's from the same location). Driving around the immediate area of Bald Hill (WALK/WBLI) much of the dial sans locals took a hit. It did recover quickly as you moved out of the area, but it's overall performance in the immmediate area needs improving. The AM, sorry to say, is not wideband. HOWEVER, two major items... Sensitivity and selectivity are excellent. I was able to pick up the TIS station at 1640 kHz in Brentwood... some 12 miles from the small transmitter on the Southern State. My old radio couldn't get it 5 miles away. It's also great in high RF fields (unlike the FM section). Sitting at the same location I heard WDRC near the WLIE stick, I was able to hear WMCA (570) and WROW (590) with no interference from WLIE (540). Also, driving thru Patchougue on a stock radio, WQEW (1560) usually takes a beating from local WLIM (1580). This radio split them up just fine (probably the best I've ever seen... and I used to work at this station). Distortion is VERY low, while it is not wideband, the AM section is clean as can be on music and voice. You can also taylor the tone controls individually for AM/FM/CD.. which is a plus. I paid $189 for mine... I feel it is well worth it! From fanfare@globility.com Sat Mar 15 10:59:39 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 15 Mar 2003 18:59:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 73863 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2003 18:59:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Mar 2003 18:59:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.69) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Mar 2003 18:59:38 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.168] by n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Mar 2003 18:59:38 -0000 Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2003 18:59:34 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: New file uploaded to amstereoforum Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2736 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Mr.M S" X-Originating-IP: 64.56.244.233 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "bta_50g" wrote: > > I'm not going to claim to know what the "essence of radio was all > about", as you do with your claim that it is represented by radio of > the "radio in the 50's and 60's", but I am curious how you know the > radio experience of 50's and 60's represents the "essence of radio"? > > But the "essence of radio", that probably has a different meaning for > each individual, just as some say that the "essence of radio" can't be > conveyed by digital means. > > John Good argument John. The 30's and 40's also defined radio, but it was in its infancy. The latter 40's, the 50's and early 60's had to contend with the onslaught of TV. That was the last great battle in radio, and radio did very well. It maintained a lot of its entertainment value, and its credibility for reporting local and national events. During that time, the AM networks were still strong and, IMHO, it was the networks who kept it all together in terms of quality. When radio became group-oriented, programming competition started going downhill. "Shock-talk" became the thing and began to replace the Brad Crandalls of the world. Music became the province of those who knew how to compress, and modulation gurus (you know, the consultant with a thousand girlfriends, but loved no one) began telling PDs how to set up their audio so they'd sound 'different' than the competition. IMHO, those guys are a lot like a parking lot architect who doesn't own a car. In any event, I agree with Michael when he says that no one is likely to complain about the audio not being loud enough. If they like what is being played, and the level is adequate, they're not likely to complain or tune away. So what we have here, as Michael points out, is a contest between stations that hasn't any benefit whatsoever for the listener. As for the radio manufacturer, radio stations who subscribe to such signal management practices offer no incentive to try and build a radio that can make them sound good. All in all it makes one think some PDs must figure that success in pushing rope is all in the technique. Finally, I'd like to acknowledge wgli's report on the Blaupunkt digiceiver. All I can say is, there are some pretty good receivers out there. Perhaps radio should begin doing a little more listening to what makes them sound good, rather than lowering their standards to win a contest that's only prize is an entry form for the next contest. Hey John(bta-50g), what's this about you referring to the listener as being a "she"? I'm sure the distaff side will enjoy the recognition, but you don't seem to be always that charitable ;-)) M.S. From amymousie@yahoo.com Sat Mar 15 11:09:17 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 15 Mar 2003 19:09:16 -0000 Received: (qmail 70271 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2003 19:09:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Mar 2003 19:09:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.78) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Mar 2003 19:09:16 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.187] by n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Mar 2003 19:09:15 -0000 Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2003 19:09:14 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: )))...In Living AM Stereo...((( Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <005301c2eb15$1a57afb0$9802a8c0@jimspc> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 689 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie" X-Originating-IP: 67.115.108.49 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Jim Burgan" wrote: > Pilot of the airwaves.. > Here is my request... > You don't have to play it but I hope you'll do your best... > I've been listening to your show on the radio... > And you seem like a friend to me... > > I was one of 3 people who actually liked and bought the single. > > You'll find it on Rhino's "Pop Hits Of The 80's" Vol II or III (I don't have it handy to check). > > >"Pilot of the Airwaves" - Charlie Dore > >Doesn't ANYBODY remember this one-hit wonder? I certainly remember it. Also, there's Harry Chapin's "WOLD" (which I need a good, clean copy of the longer studio album version). Amy. <:3 )~~8~ From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sat Mar 15 12:13:42 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 15 Mar 2003 20:13:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 77964 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2003 20:13:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Mar 2003 20:13:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.92) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Mar 2003 20:13:42 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.250] by n8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Mar 2003 20:13:42 -0000 Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2003 20:13:38 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Audio Quality...... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 1375 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.130.26 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "bta_50g" wrote: >=20 > No, of course a listener is not going to tune away from a station=20 > because it isn't the loudest one on the dial. But if she is scanning=20 > the dial for some other reason, looking for another station to listen=20 > to, she will more likely stop at a louder station, all other things=20 > being equal. This is not a conscious decision, the listener doesn't=20 > say to herself, I'm going to look for the loudest station to listen=20 > too, it's simply that a louder station is more likely to catch her=20 > attention as she is scanning for something she likes. >=20 > John Sad to say but the loudness wars will make its way to digital radio. While compression was done mostly to fight poor S/N in distant areas especially for AM the compressor has become a tool primarily to increase a stations compeditiveness over the others. For FM there is no need to use this radical amount of compression and can still serve the majority of its audience with much less compression and still have good S/N for its distant listeners. There is no issue with S/N for DAB but every station will still want to be the loudest on the=20 dial and listeners will be accustomed to it. I guess if they compress the signal enough they could fit it into an 8-Bit word and do a =B5Law type compression and cut the bitstream in half. JSG From amymousie@yahoo.com Sat Mar 15 12:37:51 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 15 Mar 2003 20:37:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 7198 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2003 20:37:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Mar 2003 20:37:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.70) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Mar 2003 20:37:49 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.180] by n15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Mar 2003 20:37:49 -0000 Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2003 20:37:49 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Radio songs Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 291 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie" X-Originating-IP: 66.127.243.33 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie Speaking of "Pilot of the Airwaves", I looked around and found: "Airwaves" by Thomas Dolby "Airwaves" by Kraftwerk "We Want the Airwaves" by the Ramones "Open the Airwaves" by Lowgold (my copy is incomplete :P ) "On My Radio" by Selector Let's see what else pops up..... Amy. <:3 )~~8~ From rwagoner1@mac.com Sat Mar 15 13:06:53 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner1@mac.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 15 Mar 2003 21:06:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 14431 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2003 21:06:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Mar 2003 21:06:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO fed1mtao02.cox.net) (68.6.19.243) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Mar 2003 21:06:51 -0000 Received: from mac.com ([68.4.0.44]) by fed1mtao02.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20030315210651.BSFH11958.fed1mtao02.cox.net@mac.com> for ; Sat, 15 Mar 2003 16:06:51 -0500 Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2003 13:06:51 -0800 Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: )))...In Living AM Stereo...((( Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <0B40DA74-572A-11D7-8C13-0005021D3C76@mac.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) From: Richard Wagoner X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135738921 X-Yahoo-Profile: richardalanwagoner Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Saturday, March 15, 2003, at 08:51 AM, narkspud wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "amymousie" > wrote: > >=A0 "radio" songs. > > "Pilot of the Airwaves" - Charlie Dore > > Doesn't ANYBODY remember this one-hit wonder? > > > Trying to forget it ... Actually, I did download it through Napster/et.al. Richard [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From jbyrns@rcn.com Sat Mar 15 13:29:30 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@rcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 15 Mar 2003 21:29:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 90737 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2003 21:29:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Mar 2003 21:29:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.68) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Mar 2003 21:29:28 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.156] by n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Mar 2003 21:29:28 -0000 Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2003 21:29:28 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Audio Quality...... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <003701c2eb1e$2df56b80$827dfea9@home1> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1052 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bta_50g" X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.50 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=138635554 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g You are using "audio processing" to help compensate for a weak signal, which seems different issue than what I assume is the real issue being discussed, which is the use of "audio processing" to create a "louder", or "more noticeable", sound when all other things are equal. John --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Scott Todd" wrote: > I think I can give that a qualified yes. On WWTC we're up against some 50kW > competition with only 5000W. At night we have a null over the SE part of > the metro, the areas just south of downtown St Paul being some of the > hardest hit, we run the signal to the max because we have a lot of listeners > that can't hear us otherwise. Frankly I wish I were in your position where > your signal is enough to cover the market so I COULD back off. > > ST > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Michael J. Richard" > > > Can you honestly say that a listener has ever called a radio station to > complain that they're turning the dial because you're not LOUD enough???? From jbyrns@rcn.com Sat Mar 15 13:36:35 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@rcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 15 Mar 2003 21:36:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 86828 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2003 21:36:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Mar 2003 21:36:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Mar 2003 21:36:35 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.252] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Mar 2003 21:36:35 -0000 Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2003 21:36:34 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: New file uploaded to amstereoforum Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3305 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bta_50g" X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.50 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=138635554 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Mr.M S" wrote: > > Good argument John. The 30's and 40's also defined radio, but it was > in its infancy. I don't think the fact that radio was in its infancy in the 30's and 40's is what made it different from radio in later decades. Radio of the 30's and 40's filled an entertainment niche that television took over for the mass audience in the 50's and beyond, so radio had to find a new and different niche for itself. > The latter 40's, the 50's and early 60's had to > contend with the onslaught of TV. That was the last great battle in > radio, and radio did very well. It maintained a lot of its > entertainment value, and its credibility for reporting local and > national events. During that time, the AM networks were still strong > and, IMHO, it was the networks who kept it all together in terms of > quality. When radio became group-oriented, programming competition > started going downhill. "Shock-talk" became the thing and began to > replace the Brad Crandalls of the world. Music became the province > of those who knew how to compress, and modulation gurus (you know, > the consultant with a thousand girlfriends, but loved no one) began > telling PDs how to set up their audio so they'd sound 'different' > than the competition. IMHO, those guys are a lot like a parking lot > architect who doesn't own a car. > > In any event, I agree with Michael when he says that no one is > likely to complain about the audio not being loud enough. If they > like what is being played, and the level is adequate, they're not > likely to complain or tune away. I assume you mean they are not likely to tune away because of the level, they might tune away because a commercial comes on, or even a song they don't like. > So what we have here, as Michael points out, > is a contest between stations that hasn't any benefit whatsoever for > the listener. Benefiting the listener is only a secondary goal of a radio station. Listeners are the product that radio stations sell to advertisers, and they will do whatever they perceive is necessary to attract the most listeners of the type the advertisers want to buy. If the station has to do something to benefit the listeners to attract them, that is a secondary effect. The things that actually attract the listeners may be perceived by some listeners to be negative, and not a benefit at all. > As for the radio manufacturer, radio stations who > subscribe to such signal management practices offer no incentive to > try and build a radio that can make them sound good. The radio manufacturers are but bit players in the radio drama. > All in all it > makes one think some PDs must figure that success in pushing rope is > all in the technique. If it isn't technique, what is it? > Hey John(bta-50g), what's this about you referring to the listener > as being a "she"? I'm sure the distaff side will enjoy the > recognition, but you don't seem to be always that charitable ;-)) After 25 years, the control of the Governor's office, and Legislature, recently changed parties in the state where I live. I read in the paper that the one of the goals of the new party is to approve the ERA, so I thought I would get an early start. John From ccuff@in4web.com Sat Mar 15 13:43:03 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 15 Mar 2003 21:43:03 -0000 Received: (qmail 94762 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2003 21:43:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Mar 2003 21:43:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Mar 2003 21:43:02 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [216.221.139.104]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Sat, 15 Mar 2003 16:40:22 -0500 Message-ID: <003f01c2eb3c$0205e0e0$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: Pioneer am stereo tuner Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2003 16:44:07 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 I have a manual tuned Pioneer AM stereo/FM stereo tuner for cheap if anyone wants it. It was sold in Australia, and was part of a system, so you have to use a well regulated 12 volt power supply with it, and add audio jax (the board is well marked) I have no time to fool with it, price is $30.00 plus mail. It uses standard open loop antenna for am,(not included) and has a push-on "F" connector for FM. The tuner uses the MC13020 on a separate Pioneer-made board, has a stereo LED, and a "tuned" LED. Pic available if interested. Chris From rwagoner1@mac.com Sat Mar 15 17:07:12 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner1@mac.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 16 Mar 2003 01:07:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 43269 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2003 01:07:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Mar 2003 01:07:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO fed1mtao08.cox.net) (68.6.19.123) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Mar 2003 01:07:05 -0000 Received: from mac.com ([68.4.0.44]) by fed1mtao08.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20030316010703.ERFR29278.fed1mtao08.cox.net@mac.com> for ; Sat, 15 Mar 2003 20:07:03 -0500 Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2003 17:07:05 -0800 Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: New file uploaded to amstereoforum Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <9A659A70-574B-11D7-A190-0005021D3C76@mac.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) From: Richard Wagoner X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135738921 X-Yahoo-Profile: richardalanwagoner Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable That's the difference in the era of Clear Channel (Anyone who says CCU=20 is in the business of radio doesn't work for CCU, according to CEO=20 Mays). The old goal was to attract an audience as a primary goal, then=20 sell it to advertisers. Under the new operating plan, where listeners don't come first, it is=20 no wonder that potential listeners are actively finding more and more=20 alternatives to radio, and that radio listening is at an all-time low.=20 Among young people, the former majority for radio, listenership is=20 dangerously low ... so low that the future of radio as a mass appeal=20 marketing device is in serious jeopardy. That's the problem with IBOC, et. al ... since programming is a=20 secondary consideration, it won't make a bit of difference in the long=20 run. Crappy programming still sounds like crap even if it is "near CD=20 quality." Perhaps if owners started putting listeners first again KHJ,=20 KFRC 1977: "We want to be your radio station" and "We do it for you"),=20 then radio would be taken a bit more seriously by advertisers again. On Saturday, March 15, 2003, at 01:36 PM, bta_50g wrote: > Benefiting the listener is only a secondary goal of a radio station.=A0 > Listeners are the product that radio stations sell to advertisers, [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From rwagoner1@mac.com Sat Mar 15 17:08:50 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner1@mac.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 16 Mar 2003 01:08:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 59505 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2003 01:08:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Mar 2003 01:08:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO fed1mtao04.cox.net) (68.6.19.241) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Mar 2003 01:08:50 -0000 Received: from mac.com ([68.4.0.44]) by fed1mtao04.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20030316010850.DLDR20827.fed1mtao04.cox.net@mac.com> for ; Sat, 15 Mar 2003 20:08:50 -0500 Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2003 17:08:50 -0800 Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: New file uploaded to amstereoforum Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) From: Richard Wagoner X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135738921 X-Yahoo-Profile: richardalanwagoner Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit On Saturday, March 15, 2003, at 01:36 PM, bta_50g wrote: > > All in all it > > makes one think some PDs must figure that success in pushing rope is > > all in the technique. > > If it isn't technique, what is it? Stupidity. You can't push a rope, you pull it. An analogy to show that some PDs don't get it. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From krichards@wor710.com Sat Mar 15 18:48:23 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 6915 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2003 02:48:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Mar 2003 02:48:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.78) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Mar 2003 02:48:23 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: krichards@wor710.com Received: from [66.218.66.122] by n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Mar 2003 02:48:22 -0000 X-Sender: krichards@wor710.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 15 Mar 2003 12:23:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 4185 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2003 12:23:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Mar 2003 12:23:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Mar 2003 12:23:06 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.162] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Mar 2003 12:23:06 -0000 Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2003 12:23:05 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: Audiophile Quality/Reply to Eric Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 337 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kerry Richards" X-Originating-IP: 66.47.86.250 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=136545831 X-Yahoo-Profile: kerryrichards710 X-eGroups-Approved-By: kevtronics via web; 16 Mar 2003 02:48:21 -0000 --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, n0uiheric@a... wrote: > IBOC is NOT audiophile quality sound...never has been, never will be. > > 73 and good DX from Eric > I do no think I said it was Audiophile quality, what do you base you assumption on and your statement "never has been, never will"? Please enlighten us. Kerry....... From krichards@wor710.com Sat Mar 15 18:49:35 2003 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 22648 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2003 02:49:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Mar 2003 02:49:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Mar 2003 02:49:34 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: krichards@wor710.com Received: from [66.218.67.252] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Mar 2003 02:49:33 -0000 X-Sender: krichards@wor710.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 15 Mar 2003 12:47:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 5632 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2003 12:47:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Mar 2003 12:47:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.64) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Mar 2003 12:47:58 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.131] by n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Mar 2003 12:47:57 -0000 Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2003 12:47:56 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Audiophile/Reply to JSG Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1682 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kerry Richards" X-Originating-IP: 66.47.86.250 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=136545831 X-Yahoo-Profile: kerryrichards710 X-eGroups-Approved-By: kevtronics via web; 16 Mar 2003 02:49:33 -0000 --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "jsgilst" wrote: > At least the IBOC exciter is programable. If AM-DAB fails to take programed the switch to analog AM stereo. This would allow existing AMS radios to still be used and the IBOC receivers would decode DAB during the day and C-QuAM at > night. > > JSG The Visteon HD radios we have for testing already do both C-Quam and HD. Until such time as the FCC rules on nightime use of IBOC, I do not think Ibiquity is open to the idea, nor would they want an "A-B" test between C-Quam and HD. Reasons are obvious. But the idea is feasible, the easiest way would be to switch between exciters, phase and magnitude input at the transmitter. Two relays would do this. In my case If I had the AM Stereo boards for the DX50 I could do this with the present setup. Unfortunately, Harris no longer makes AM Stereo boards for the DX series. If IBOC takes off and there is no nightime service I'm sure some enterprising broadcaster will do this. The Ibiquity exciter could generate C-Quam if the software were written, but I kinda think that is light years away. Glen Clark and Associates has a good plan in front of the FCC for nightime IBOC, it takes the already in place FCC D/U ratios as a guideline, and several other factors in determining who can run IBOC at night without causing major problems. Until these issues are resolved, you could run one system by day and the other at night with the current set of rules. Somebody will be doing this in future, if they are not already, I'm sure, if they have C-Quam now, why would they shut it off at night? It would take some wiring though. Kerry..... From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Mar 15 19:11:10 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 16 Mar 2003 03:11:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 31800 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2003 03:11:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Mar 2003 03:11:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Mar 2003 03:11:08 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.148] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Mar 2003 03:11:08 -0000 Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2003 03:11:08 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Blaupunkt DigiCeiver Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2019 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.96.130 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > For all the talk of the Symphony Chipset, I just installed the > Blaupunkt Digiceiver. While not Symphony, it is an all digital > front end with adaptive bandwidth. Since the 2002 model year, Volkswagen has also been using DSP-based factory equipped car radios. I'm not sure who makes them; previous analog-based VW radios in recent years were made by Matsushita (a.k.a. Panasonic) and Clarion. Reception on AM and FM are very good, although not spectacular -- some of the better VW radios in the past did better on both bands. Oddities of this new digital design include the lack of any Stereo indicator for FM, and tuning that does not mute when changing channels, giving somewhat of an "analog tuning" feel to it. The AM tuner tends to make odd hissing and crackling noises when you first tune in a weaker signal, but then it quiets down, and even seems to have some RF noise blanking to cut down on power line buzz. More interesting are the digital sampling rates it uses for AM and FM. Its audio response drops off like a cliff at 6 kHz on AM and at 12 kHz on FM! As a result, the AM has surpisingly good mid-range clarity, but the high end is noticeably missing, compared to a more gradual "roll-off" of response. On FM, even on strong signals with the Treble knob turned all the way up, there is a noticeable lack of crispness with those last few kHz chopped off. And when the signal starts to get weak or multipath-plagued, its FM can sound downright dull and muddy, as if it's cutting the audio down to less than 8 or 9 kHz. These new VW radios also appear to feed the cassette audio through the DSP system, including what appears to be digital-based Dolby B Noise Reduction. For some reason, when playing non-Dolby tapes with the Dolby NR on, in order to cut down the hiss at the expense of treble response, it makes random and odd-sounding "blips" and "chirps" in the audio, that are not recorded on the tape itself. Turn the Dolby NR off, and it sounds fine. Odd! From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Mar 15 19:23:39 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 16 Mar 2003 03:23:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 75697 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2003 03:23:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Mar 2003 03:23:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.68) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Mar 2003 03:23:38 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.168] by n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Mar 2003 03:23:38 -0000 Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2003 03:23:38 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Pioneer am stereo tuner Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <003f01c2eb3c$0205e0e0$0101a8c0@pavilion> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 253 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.96.130 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > I have a manual tuned Pioneer AM stereo/FM stereo tuner for cheap > if anyone wants it. Pictures of this can be found on the AM Stereo web site on this page: http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/kevtronics/home2.htm It is the Pioneer F-X33ZA. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Mar 15 19:38:18 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 16 Mar 2003 03:38:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 60134 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2003 03:38:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Mar 2003 03:38:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.84) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Mar 2003 03:38:18 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.162] by n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Mar 2003 03:38:18 -0000 Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2003 03:38:17 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Whoa! KHPY! AM Stereo Oldies Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 748 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.96.130 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics Interestingly, it appears that 1670 KHPY is the first Expanded Band station with a full-time directional signal. 1660 WWRU in Jersey City, NJ (formerly WJDM/Elizabeth, the first E.B. station to go on the air back in 1995) apparently is using a 9 kW directional nighttime signal, but KHPY is licensed for 10 kW daytime and 9 kW nighttime signals, both using different 2-tower directional patterns. More info and estimated coverage maps can be found at: http://www.radio-locator.com/cgi-bin/info?call=KHPY&service=AM In general I don't favor use of directional signals in the Expanded Band (1610-1700 kHz), but at this point if the FCC wants to squeeze in more new stations they are going to become a necessary evil, especially at night. From jbyrns@rcn.com Sat Mar 15 19:42:57 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@rcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 16 Mar 2003 03:42:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 1186 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2003 03:42:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Mar 2003 03:42:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.64) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Mar 2003 03:42:56 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.254] by n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Mar 2003 03:42:56 -0000 Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2003 03:42:54 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Audio Quality...... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 454 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bta_50g" X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.145 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=138635554 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "jsgilst" wrote: >=20 > dial and listeners will be accustomed to it. I guess if they > compress the signal enough they could fit it into an 8-Bit word and > do a =B5Law type compression and cut the bitstream in half. I'm not sure that I understand what this reference to =B5Law coding is=20 all about? Modern perceptual coders crunch the data down much more,=20 how does =B5Law fit into the picture? John From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Mar 15 19:45:57 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 16 Mar 2003 03:45:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 64322 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2003 03:45:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Mar 2003 03:45:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.67) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Mar 2003 03:45:57 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.160] by n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Mar 2003 03:45:57 -0000 Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2003 03:45:53 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Whoa! KHPY! AM Stereo Oldies Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 345 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.96.130 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics One more note about 1670 KHPY... it is truly a locally-owned station, as it is licensed to "Delbert L. Van Voorhis". Also, the license was granted just two months ago, so it *is* a brand new station. I'm sure many of us wish we could afford to own our own licensed radio station, especially one broadcasting with 10,000 watts of AM Stereo! From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Mar 15 20:10:38 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 16 Mar 2003 04:10:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 92365 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2003 04:10:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Mar 2003 04:10:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Mar 2003 04:10:38 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.145] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Mar 2003 04:10:37 -0000 Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2003 04:10:34 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Audio Quality...... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 2207 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.96.130 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > I'm not sure that I understand what this reference to =B5Law coding > is all about? Modern perceptual coders crunch the data down much > more, how does =B5Law fit into the picture? The point is, the less dynamic range an audio source has, the more=20 efficiently it can be digitally reproduced without any apparent=20 quality loss. For example, compact discs use 16-bit digital audio, which provides=20 a useful dynamic range of 96 dB. 8-bit digital audio cuts this in=20 half to 48 dB, but also makes the resulting digital data take up half=20 as much storage space/bandwidth (and therefore is twice as=20 efficient). Most of today's popular music is pre-processed to have less than=20 about 30 dB of dynamic range. Even less than 20 dB is common for=20 pop, rock, and rap songs -- all in the interest in making the music=20 sound "louder" when played from the CD. Thus, with this kind of=20 limited dynamic range, you could use 8-bit audio and at least=20 theoretically there would be no difference in the sound. This same reasoning applies to digitally compressed audio, such as=20 MP3, XM/Sirius, Eureka-147 DAB, and IBOC. And proof of it is that=20 the BBC carries their Radio 3 classical music channel on DAB at 192 kbps, while their Radio 1 pop music channel is only 128 kbps --=20 because the greater dynamic range of the classical music cannot be=20 digitally compressed as efficiently, and if it were carried at a=20 lower bit-rate, the digital "artifacts" would become annoyingly=20 apparent. In the analog world, this is the same reason why tape hiss on a=20 cassette is less noticeable when playing pop/rock/etc. music than=20 when playing classical or other soft music -- because contemporary=20 music has a higher average loudness to help "drown out" the=20 background hiss. In fact, in the late '90s many of the major record=20 companies stopped using Dolby B NR on their pre-recorded cassette=20 albums, because modern pop music is so limited in dynamic range that=20 you really don't need Dolby NR at all. For an example of this, check=20 out Tal Bachman's self-titled 1999 album on cassette -- the first=20 track is recorded so "hot" that the level meters are absolutely=20 PEGGED in the "red zone" throughout the ENTIRE song! From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sat Mar 15 20:19:38 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 16 Mar 2003 04:19:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 74823 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2003 04:19:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Mar 2003 04:19:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Mar 2003 04:19:38 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.171] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Mar 2003 04:19:37 -0000 Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2003 04:19:37 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Audio Quality...... Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 1023 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.186 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "bta_50g" wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "jsgilst" wrote: > >=20 > > dial and listeners will be accustomed to it. I guess if they > > compress the signal enough they could fit it into an 8-Bit word and > > do a =B5Law type compression and cut the bitstream in half. >=20 > I'm not sure that I understand what this reference to =B5Law coding is=20 > all about? Modern perceptual coders crunch the data down much more,=20 > how does =B5Law fit into the picture? >=20 > John I can't say directly how the non-linear quantization of =B5Law would apply to these lossy compression schemes but =B5Law will cut the uncompressed datastream in half and works quite well for signals of average dynamic range. I don't know enough about these lossy compression schemes and whether dynamic range is that relavent in the encoding process but if reducing the dynamic range reduces bitrate then I think you will see the use of it in DAB for the obvious reasons. JSG From jsgil@hal-pc.org Sat Mar 15 20:44:14 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 16 Mar 2003 04:44:14 -0000 Received: (qmail 38214 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2003 04:44:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Mar 2003 04:44:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.91) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Mar 2003 04:44:14 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.171] by n7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Mar 2003 04:44:13 -0000 Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2003 04:44:10 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Audiophile/Reply to JSG Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1601 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.186 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kerry Richards" wrote: > > But the idea is feasible, the easiest way would be to switch between > exciters, phase and magnitude input at the transmitter. Two relays > would do this. In my case If I had the AM Stereo boards for the DX50 > I could do this with the present setup. Unfortunately, Harris no > longer makes AM Stereo boards for the DX series. > Kerry..... If someone within this forum were able to locate some AMS boards would there be funds available if the price was right for WOR to implement this? I can understand why iBiquity would not want to also do C-QuAM with their exciter but for those stations where their IBOC sidebands cause too much interference at night but could do IBOC during the day I think it could ease the transition while providing the best signal under both situations. It could be a good PR move for iBiquity and encourage stations that are reluctant to migrate to IBOC to jump in. It would be less of a risk to purchase equipment that could preform a dual function whatever happens in the market. Right now the biggest obstacle to HD Radio is receiver availibility and pricing. If market penetration of receivers does not reach critical mass in time for it to be adopted by the masses then both exciters and receivers could fall back to a analog state and still provide a higher quality signal than what most radios produce today. I just see it as covering all the bases. If iBiquity's exciters preform a dual function then they will still have a market for their hardware if IBOC fails. JSG From stodd@sherbtel.net Sat Mar 15 21:10:59 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 16 Mar 2003 05:10:50 -0000 Received: (qmail 86707 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2003 05:10:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Mar 2003 05:10:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Mar 2003 05:10:50 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-85-92.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.85.92]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h2G5Akle004172 for ; Sat, 15 Mar 2003 23:10:48 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <002101c2eb7a$e1bd1d00$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: New file uploaded to amstereoforum Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2003 23:14:08 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Speaking of the venerable BTA-50G, did you happen to ever work on one of those, John? We had one of those at KSTP for most of my time there. I was the last person to take a full set of readings on it. I think it sounded better than the MW-50. It went out the door in 84, bought by some broker who turned around and sold it to another station in around here that was upgrading. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mr.M S" > Hey John(bta-50g), From stodd@sherbtel.net Sat Mar 15 21:20:26 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 16 Mar 2003 05:20:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 62934 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2003 05:20:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Mar 2003 05:20:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Mar 2003 05:20:25 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-85-92.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.85.92]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h2G5KMle005987 for ; Sat, 15 Mar 2003 23:20:23 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <004c01c2eb7c$38b42f80$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <9A659A70-574B-11D7-A190-0005021D3C76@mac.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: New file uploaded to amstereoforum Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2003 23:23:45 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Richard- did you see that Arbitron report that concluded that radio listeners are actually more satisfied and don't think there's less variety than several years ago? Of course, if they're only surveying those that still listen to radio.... ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Richard Wagoner" > Under the new operating plan, where listeners don't come first, it is > no wonder that potential listeners are actively finding more and more > alternatives to radio, and that radio listening is at an all-time low. From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Sat Mar 15 21:35:35 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 16 Mar 2003 05:35:35 -0000 Received: (qmail 4325 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2003 05:35:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Mar 2003 05:35:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14201.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.172.143) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Mar 2003 05:35:34 -0000 Message-ID: <20030316053534.7429.qmail@web14201.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [63.162.23.14] by web14201.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 15 Mar 2003 21:35:34 PST Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2003 21:35:34 -0800 (PST) Subject: Charlie Dore, Pilot of The Airwaves, in stereo on CFCO To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio A few wrote: "Pilot of the Airwaves"...I was one of 3 people who actually liked and bought the single." I must have been the 5th person to buy the 45RPM Single - neat colorful label too IIRC from Island Records. You want chills - you should hear it in "living stereo" on CFCO - I did, and it rocks! A great song at the end of the POP Radio era :( __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Web Hosting - establish your business online http://webhosting.yahoo.com From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sat Mar 15 22:15:09 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 16 Mar 2003 06:15:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 91671 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2003 06:15:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Mar 2003 06:15:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.66) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Mar 2003 06:15:08 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.140] by n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Mar 2003 06:15:08 -0000 Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2003 06:15:07 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: WOR AM Stereo? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 899 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.96.130 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > In my case If I had the AM Stereo boards for the DX50 I could do > this with the present setup. Unfortunately, Harris no longer makes > AM Stereo boards for the DX series. If the C-Quam exciter board for the DX-50 is compatible with that of the DX-10, then you might consider talking to the folks at Nassau Broadcasting because they have one sitting unused at 1040 WCHR (formerly WJHR) in Flemington, NJ, whose Harris DX-10 transmitter had its AM Stereo shut off by them in 1999 shortly after switching to a Talk format. In fact just yesterday I drove past WCHR's transmitter site, but I'm not that skilled at breaking & entering. :-) But I don't think the phone line hum that sometimes plagues the audio of WOR's programming would sound any better in Stereo than in mono... but hopefully that is one of the issues that will be resolved by the time more new equipment gets installed. From jlehmann@attbi.com Sat Mar 15 23:45:25 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jlehmann@attbi.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 16 Mar 2003 07:45:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 60954 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2003 07:45:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Mar 2003 07:45:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO rwcrmhc53.attbi.com) (204.127.198.39) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Mar 2003 07:45:24 -0000 Received: from amd (h00045a211584.ne.client2.attbi.com[66.30.163.53]) by rwcrmhc53.attbi.com (rwcrmhc53) with SMTP id <20030316064916053003799ge>; Sun, 16 Mar 2003 06:49:16 +0000 To: Subject: Sony Tuners Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2003 01:49:30 -0500 Message-ID: <003901c2eb88$32812800$6401a8c0@AMD> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2616 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Jeff Lehmann" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=98257848 X-Yahoo-Profile: n1zzn I was at a flea market last weekend, and I saw a tuner that looked almost exactly like one of the ones on the AM stereo web page. It looked like the Sony STR-AV470 that is pictured there. The model # on the one I saw was STR-AV460. This isn't a stereo tuner, is it? If it is, the guy said he's at that flea market every week, so I could go and get it another time. Thanks for your help, Jeff Lehmann - N1ZZN Hanson, MA From rwagoner1@mac.com Sun Mar 16 00:13:03 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: rwagoner1@mac.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 16 Mar 2003 08:12:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 49087 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2003 08:12:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Mar 2003 08:12:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO fed1mtao03.cox.net) (68.6.19.242) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Mar 2003 08:12:56 -0000 Received: from mac.com ([68.4.0.44]) by fed1mtao03.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20030316081251.FVSR27689.fed1mtao03.cox.net@mac.com> for ; Sun, 16 Mar 2003 03:12:51 -0500 Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2003 00:12:51 -0800 Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: New file uploaded to amstereoforum Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v551) To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: <004c01c2eb7c$38b42f80$827dfea9@home1> Message-Id: <150BAAB1-5787-11D7-96AD-0005021D3C76@mac.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.551) From: Richard Wagoner X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135738921 X-Yahoo-Profile: richardalanwagoner Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Those that remain, especially in smaller markets, yes. But radio today=20 is like the railroads of 100 years ago: a declining industry ... fewer=20 and fewer listeners, even if the remaining ones state they are=20 satisfied. On Saturday, March 15, 2003, at 09:23 PM, Scott Todd wrote: > Richard- did you see that Arbitron report that concluded that radio > listeners are actually more satisfied and don't think there's less=20 > variety > than several years ago?=A0 Of course, if they're only surveying those=20 > that > still listen to radio.... > > ST > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Richard Wagoner" > > > Under the new operating plan, where listeners don't come first, it is > > no wonder that potential listeners are actively finding more and more > > alternatives to radio, and that radio listening is at an all-time=20 > low. > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From groucho@skyweb.net Sun Mar 16 00:42:11 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 16 Mar 2003 08:42:11 -0000 Received: (qmail 24086 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2003 08:42:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Mar 2003 08:42:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Mar 2003 08:42:10 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (tc1-81.skyweb.net [66.6.130.209]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h2G8sNIf042270 for ; Sun, 16 Mar 2003 03:54:23 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3E743901.6813C39A@skyweb.net> Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2003 03:42:41 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: WOR AM Stereo? References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Kevin and you didn't stop in to say hello????? I guess You didn't see My van in the parking Lot... Neal "Kevin T." wrote: > > In my case If I had the AM Stereo boards for the DX50 I could do > > this with the present setup. Unfortunately, Harris no longer makes > > AM Stereo boards for the DX series. > > If the C-Quam exciter board for the DX-50 is compatible with that of > the DX-10, then you might consider talking to the folks at Nassau > Broadcasting because they have one sitting unused at 1040 WCHR > (formerly WJHR) in Flemington, NJ, whose Harris DX-10 transmitter had > its AM Stereo shut off by them in 1999 shortly after switching to a > Talk format. In fact just yesterday I drove past WCHR's transmitter > site, but I'm not that skilled at breaking & entering. :-) > > But I don't think the phone line hum that sometimes plagues the audio > of WOR's programming would sound any better in Stereo than in mono... > but hopefully that is one of the issues that will be resolved by the > time more new equipment gets installed. > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Mar 16 01:11:12 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 16 Mar 2003 09:11:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 32303 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2003 09:11:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Mar 2003 09:11:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Mar 2003 09:11:11 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.138] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Mar 2003 09:11:11 -0000 Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2003 09:11:07 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: WOR AM Stereo? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3E743901.6813C39A@skyweb.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 283 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.96.130 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Kevin > and you didn't stop in to say hello????? I guess You didn't see My > van in the parking Lot... When I passed by, the lot was empty... and I noticed that they still have the "Chat Radio 1040" sign up, even though the station hasn't had that format since four years ago! From ccuff@in4web.com Sun Mar 16 01:12:38 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 16 Mar 2003 09:12:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 34459 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2003 09:12:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Mar 2003 09:12:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Mar 2003 09:12:37 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [216.221.139.138]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Sun, 16 Mar 2003 04:09:58 -0500 Message-ID: <002a01c2eb9c$572d3040$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Pioneer am stereo tuner Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2003 04:13:41 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 Yup- that's the one- If someone lets me know who has access to update this, I will send a JPG of the "guts" in a private email. CC ----- Original Message ----- From: Kevin T. To: Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2003 10:23 PM Subject: {AMSF} Re: Pioneer am stereo tuner > Pictures of this can be found on the AM Stereo web site on this page: > > http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/kevtronics/home2.htm > From ccuff@in4web.com Sun Mar 16 01:15:43 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ccuff@in4web.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 16 Mar 2003 09:15:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 93478 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2003 09:15:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Mar 2003 09:15:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail.in4web.com) (208.20.8.12) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Mar 2003 09:15:41 -0000 Received: from pavilion (unverified [216.221.139.138]) by mail.in4web.com (Vircom SMTPRS 1.4.232) with SMTP id for ; Sun, 16 Mar 2003 04:13:02 -0500 Message-ID: <003801c2eb9c$c4d1bb20$0101a8c0@pavilion> To: References: <003901c2eb88$32812800$6401a8c0@AMD> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Sony Tuners Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2003 04:16:45 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 From: "Christopher Cuff" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37862613 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereoguy2001 They made a Canadian and an American version of this. The Canadian version specifically says am stereo/fm stereo on the front panel. CC ----- Original Message ----- From: Jeff Lehmann To: Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2003 1:49 AM Subject: {AMSF} Sony Tuners > I was at a flea market last weekend, and I saw a tuner that looked > almost exactly like one of the ones on the AM stereo web page. It looked > like the Sony STR-AV470 From powell@conterra.com Sun Mar 16 05:55:51 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: powell@conterra.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 16 Mar 2003 13:55:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 39750 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2003 13:55:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Mar 2003 13:55:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Mar 2003 13:55:51 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.150] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Mar 2003 13:55:51 -0000 Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2003 13:55:50 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: WOR audio improvement Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 395 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "w4opw" X-Originating-IP: 209.213.26.22 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=8062869 X-Yahoo-Profile: W4OPW --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Possum Hunter" wrote: > > I *think* it is in the way the DSP works in the Optimod 9200. The 9200 that > lives in the rack at WFIS has the same ringing distortion in the 5Khz > filter, and I am not too impressed by the sound of it even in the NRSC mode. Have no fear, there should be updates to the software for the DSP. Powell From groucho@skyweb.net Sun Mar 16 09:09:16 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 16 Mar 2003 17:09:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 44822 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2003 17:09:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Mar 2003 17:09:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Mar 2003 17:09:05 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (tc1-109.skyweb.net [66.6.130.237]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h2GHLJIf045956 for ; Sun, 16 Mar 2003 12:21:19 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3E74AFD3.682E56D6@skyweb.net> Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2003 12:09:39 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: WOR AM Stereo? References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 OK I guess we were out for Lunch..... what day was it.. the only Times anyone is there is Tuesdays and thursdays... Building the new studios.. However we were also there this sunday. for a short time. after the cherryville hamfest. Usually its Mick and Gregg out there.. since I went back to working in NYC. this coming Saturday Going up to the Poconos To pick up My transmitters. will Need a few Hands From anyone that can Help. they are Big IRON.. Neal "Kevin T." wrote: > > Kevin > > and you didn't stop in to say hello????? I guess You didn't see My > > van in the parking Lot... > > When I passed by, the lot was empty... and I noticed that they still > have the "Chat Radio 1040" sign up, even though the station hasn't > had that format since four years ago! > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From amymousie@yahoo.com Sun Mar 16 09:50:54 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 16 Mar 2003 17:50:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 33321 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2003 17:50:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Mar 2003 17:50:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.68) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Mar 2003 17:50:52 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.129] by n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Mar 2003 17:50:52 -0000 Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2003 17:50:49 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: KABL 960 Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 117 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie" X-Originating-IP: 64.175.246.79 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie I can confirm as of last night, KABL 960 of San Francisco is still broadcasting C-QUAM AM stereo. Amy. <:3 )~~8~ From groucho@skyweb.net Sun Mar 16 10:20:18 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 16 Mar 2003 18:20:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 76855 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2003 18:20:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Mar 2003 18:20:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Mar 2003 18:20:17 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (tc1-109.skyweb.net [66.6.130.237]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h2GIWVIf064020 for ; Sun, 16 Mar 2003 13:32:31 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3E74C083.335A4D94@skyweb.net> Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2003 13:20:51 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com" Subject: New Pics added Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Hey Guys I just added a few Pics Of WCHR 1040 am to My website http://www.angelfire.com/nj4/wttm/wchr.html Neal From amymousie@yahoo.com Sun Mar 16 11:13:37 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 16 Mar 2003 19:13:37 -0000 Received: (qmail 63251 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2003 19:13:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Mar 2003 19:13:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Mar 2003 19:13:36 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.114] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Mar 2003 19:13:36 -0000 Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2003 19:13:36 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: AM stereo patents Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 629 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie" X-Originating-IP: 64.175.246.79 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie I was looking online for AM stereo links I might have not seen, I found this from the Patent Office: http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-Parser?Sect1=PTO2&p=1&u=% 2Fnetahtml%2Fsearch-bool.html&r=0&f=S&l=50&TERM1=381% 2F15&FIELD1=ORCL&d=pall Which, amongst other things, included THIS, the little-known Matsushita AM stereo system: http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-Parser? Sect1=PTO2&p=2&u=/netahtml/search-bool.html&r=74&f=G&l=50&d=pall&s1= (381/15.CIOR.+or+381/15.CIXR.+or+381/15.CIUX,CIDX.) &OS=CCL/381/15&RS=CCL/381/15 There are (AM) stereophonic broadcasting and reception patents going back to 1942 in this index! From amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk Sun Mar 16 11:29:21 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 16 Mar 2003 19:29:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 45823 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2003 19:29:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Mar 2003 19:29:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Mar 2003 19:29:19 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.254] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Mar 2003 19:29:13 -0000 Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2003 19:29:11 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Sony SRF-M48 RDS Personal - was it released in the US ? Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 229 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Dave" X-Originating-IP: 81.7.59.140 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113985069 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereofan Thsi is would be a great little radio to convert to am stereo. Nice=20 large backlit LCD display. Sony discontinued it a few years ago and=20 was only available for a year or 2. Was it sold in the USA ? Cost me=20 =A360 / $100 approx=20 From fanfare@globility.com Sun Mar 16 11:54:02 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 16 Mar 2003 19:53:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 1920 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2003 19:53:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Mar 2003 19:53:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.65) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Mar 2003 19:53:59 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.113] by n10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Mar 2003 19:53:50 -0000 Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2003 19:53:50 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: New file uploaded to amstereoforum Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <150BAAB1-5787-11D7-96AD-0005021D3C76@mac.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1664 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Mr.M S" X-Originating-IP: 64.56.234.230 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, Richard Wagoner wrote: > Those that remain, especially in smaller markets, yes. But radio today > is like the railroads of 100 years ago: a declining industry ... fewer > and fewer listeners, even if the remaining ones state they are > satisfied. > > On Saturday, March 15, 2003, at 09:23 PM, Scott Todd wrote: > > > Richard- did you see that Arbitron report that concluded that radio > > listeners are actually more satisfied and don't think there's less I'm sure the reference about listener satisfaction is probably true. The question that they, the listener, would not think to ask, and the Arbitron would not care offer is, "Compared to what?" The comparison of radio with railroads of years ago offers an interesting parallel. The railroads went out of favor because they took little note of the quality of service they were offering. To a railroad person, operating a railroad meant maintaining track and rolling stock so they could carry freight. I understand that passsenger service was better presented in the movies than in real life. Apparently, customer service was whatever the passenger was lucky enough to get. Then, the railroads having had their shortcomings brought light through various business studies on how not to run a business, began mending their ways. However, let's hope they have done it at the expense of maintenance. To see how much Europe and the Pacific rim countries are gravitating to high speed trains, tavel in the U.S. in Canada will have to look long and hard at how they treat their passengers to engender a feeling of satisfaction. M.S. From amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk Sun Mar 16 12:34:01 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 16 Mar 2003 20:34:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 49387 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2003 20:34:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Mar 2003 20:34:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Mar 2003 20:34:00 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.164] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Mar 2003 20:34:00 -0000 Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2003 20:34:00 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Pioneer am stereo tuner Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 421 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Dave" X-Originating-IP: 81.7.61.73 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113985069 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereofan --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T." wrote: > > I have a manual tuned Pioneer AM stereo/FM stereo tuner for cheap > > if anyone wants it. > > Pictures of this can be found on the AM Stereo web site on this page: > > http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/kevtronics/home2.htm > > It is the Pioneer F-X33ZA. Crafty! I seer you nicked the 220a pic off ebay from the auction I won :-) From evergreenterrace@buzzle.com Sun Mar 16 14:33:26 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: evergreenterrace@buzzle.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 16 Mar 2003 22:33:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 75950 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2003 22:33:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Mar 2003 22:33:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.84) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Mar 2003 22:33:26 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.160] by n28.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 16 Mar 2003 22:33:25 -0000 Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2003 22:33:23 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Blaupunkt DigiCeiver Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2522 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgliradio" X-Originating-IP: 170.20.11.59 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=69711087 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgliradio --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T." wrote: > > Reception on AM and FM are very good, although not spectacular -- > some of the better VW radios in the past did better on both bands. I have yet to see an analog AM car radio approach the reception of this radio. The FM is quite good to excellent (with the SHARX on) at selectivity... sensitivity is that of any other aftermarket Kenwood or Sony. > Oddities of this new digital design include the lack of any Stereo > indicator for FM, and tuning that does not mute when changing > channels, giving somewhat of an "analog tuning" feel to it. I actually like the unmuted FM. And there is no stereo indicator. The AM > tuner tends to make odd hissing and crackling noises when you first > tune in a weaker signal, but then it quiets down, and even seems to > have some RF noise blanking to cut down on power line buzz. > I figure it's the AGC sampling the signal and adjusting. > More interesting are the digital sampling rates it uses for AM and > FM. Its audio response drops off like a cliff at 6 kHz on AM and at > 12 kHz on FM! Not mine. The FM has more highs and is cleaner than any other FM I've ever heard. As a result, the AM has surpisingly good mid-range > clarity, but the high end is noticeably missing, compared to a more > gradual "roll-off" of response. On FM, even on strong signals with > the Treble knob turned all the way up, there is a noticeable lack of > crispness with those last few kHz chopped off. And when the signal > starts to get weak or multipath-plagued, its FM can sound downright > dull and muddy, as if it's cutting the audio down to less than 8 or > 9 kHz. My AM's audio performance is about what you make it to be. The FM does not blend the highs, there's actually a setting to adjust the high blend (from off to max). > > These new VW radios also appear to feed the cassette audio through > the DSP system, including what appears to be digital-based Dolby B > Noise Reduction. For some reason, when playing non-Dolby tapes with > the Dolby NR on, in order to cut down the hiss at the expense of > treble response, it makes random and odd-sounding "blips" and > "chirps" in the audio, that are not recorded on the tape itself. > Turn the Dolby NR off, and it sounds fine. Odd! Mine is a CD, so I don't know about that. The CD sounds great and is one of the best I've seen (it has yet to skip... playing a CD-R... even on the bumpiest rides). From e92fmjamz@yahoo.com Sun Mar 16 15:03:02 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: e92fmjamz@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 16 Mar 2003 23:02:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 11261 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2003 23:01:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Mar 2003 23:01:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14001.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.175.92) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Mar 2003 23:01:58 -0000 Message-ID: <20030316230158.12290.qmail@web14001.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [152.8.78.47] by web14001.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 16 Mar 2003 15:01:58 PST Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2003 15:01:58 -0800 (PST) Subject: WWDR Murfreesboro NC 1080 AM stereo To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: Ernest Jones X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=24963319 X-Yahoo-Profile: e92fmjamz Well, I haven't heard this personally, but from what I hear, WWDR 1080 AM in Murfreesboro NC is now running AM stereo.. a little backround info....they lost their tower last april due to a mobile home backing into a guy wire (long story)...and spent about 9 months off the air...they returned with a new transmitter, tower, ground system, new format (solid gold oldies off ABC satelite) and AM Stereo...maybe its still appreciated... WWDR is 1000 watts daytime only ===== Ernest, Gates NC, USA WRCS 970 AM Ahoskie NC, Announcer,webmaster http://wrcs.cjb.net WQDK 99.3 FM Ahoskie NC, Fill in ------contact me-------- AIM: e92fmjamz2000 ICQ: 33155469 Yahoo: e92fmjamz __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Web Hosting - establish your business online http://webhosting.yahoo.com From ai4i@hotmail.com Sun Mar 16 15:21:20 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ai4i@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 16 Mar 2003 23:21:19 -0000 Received: (qmail 38464 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2003 23:21:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 16 Mar 2003 23:21:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf62bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.108) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 16 Mar 2003 23:21:19 -0000 Received: from ai4i ([216.77.218.34]) by imf62bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.19 201-253-122-122-119-20020516) with SMTP id <20030316231452.NAHW5728.imf62bis.bellsouth.net@ai4i> for ; Sun, 16 Mar 2003 18:14:52 -0500 Message-ID: <002401c2ec12$c1194360$22da4dd8@ai4i> To: References: <1047826708.2527.79591.m12@yahoogroups.com> Subject: Extended Band Power Levels Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2003 18:21:10 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Joel Wilson" Reply-To: "Joel Wilson" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=127893550 X-Yahoo-Profile: ai4ijoel Originally, all (or most) class four stations were licensed for 250w full time, then they increased to 1kw days/250w nights, then the commission decided that if all the stations increased to 1kw at night, they could cover their ADIs better without increasing their mutual interference levels. Fast forward a few decades. All (or most) extended band stations have 10kw transmitters for daytime use. It makes no sense to me to require these broadcasters to cut back to 1kw at night. If they all run 10kw 24/7, their mutual interference levels would not change@all, but they would cover their ADIs with stronger signals. Only the low powered highway info stations would suffer. Comments, thoughts, opinions? Joel Wilson Hello Taxi AI4I ========================================= Proud 2-B a pioneering satellite radio subscriber AI4I is always on the trailing edge of technology ========================================= From toledohamradio@yahoo.com Sun Mar 16 16:25:44 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: toledohamradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 17 Mar 2003 00:25:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 91203 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2003 00:25:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Mar 2003 00:25:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14208.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.173.72) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Mar 2003 00:25:43 -0000 Message-ID: <20030317002542.37784.qmail@web14208.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [207.12.170.225] by web14208.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 16 Mar 2003 16:25:42 PST Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2003 16:25:42 -0800 (PST) Subject: Sony STR-AV470 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "John P." X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=38079419 X-Yahoo-Profile: toledohamradio wrote: "> I was at a flea market last weekend, and I saw a tuner that looked > almost exactly like one of the ones on the AM stereo web page. It looked > like the Sony STR-AV470" You must have one that ends in a "70" (ie: AV-470) and on the lower left hand front of the receiver it will specifically say: "FM STEREO / AM STEREO RECEVIER" and look for the stereo/mono pushbutton which also is for AM Stereo. __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Web Hosting - establish your business online http://webhosting.yahoo.com From w4opw@yahoo.com Sun Mar 16 17:19:26 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: w4opw@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 17 Mar 2003 01:19:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 9224 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2003 01:19:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Mar 2003 01:19:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Mar 2003 01:19:26 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.132] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Mar 2003 01:19:26 -0000 Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 01:19:24 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Extended Band Power Levels Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <002401c2ec12$c1194360$22da4dd8@ai4i> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1320 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "w4opw" X-Originating-IP: 66.112.193.86 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=104587625 X-Yahoo-Profile: W4OPW --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Joel Wilson" wrote: > Originally, all (or most) class four stations were licensed for 250w full > time, then they increased to 1kw days/250w nights, then the commission > decided that if all the stations increased to 1kw at night, they could cover > their ADIs better without increasing their mutual interference levels. And it was found this was NOT true. Their ADI's were NOT covered better as the noise levels went up substantially. > Fast forward a few decades. > All (or most) extended band stations have 10kw transmitters for daytime use. > It makes no sense to me to require these broadcasters to cut back to 1kw at > night. > If they all run 10kw 24/7, their mutual interference levels would not > change@all, but they would cover their ADIs with stronger signals. Only the > low powered highway info stations would suffer. > Comments, thoughts, opinions? 10,000 watts would ***SUBSTANTIALLY*** interfere with other expanded band stations via skywave well into the city grade of other stations, as remember, skywave is MUCH better on this end of the band (there's some bit of skywave often during the day ) but the groundwave is not so good. UGH! What a mess it would be! Powell W4OPW and WKDK 1240...the graveyarder BY the graveyard! From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Mar 16 17:27:53 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 17 Mar 2003 01:27:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 40152 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2003 01:27:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Mar 2003 01:27:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.83) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Mar 2003 01:27:52 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.141] by n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Mar 2003 01:27:51 -0000 Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 01:27:50 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: 1040 WCHR Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3E74AFD3.682E56D6@skyweb.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 853 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.87.147 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > the only Times anyone is there is Tuesdays and thursdays... > Building the new studios.. They're actually going to have studios for 1040 WCHR in the little shack at the transmitter site? I thought Nassau based everything at their main offices in Princeton. (Actually, it is quite a modern and lavishly equipped "shack", having been built all-new in the mid-'90s, but nonetheless it's a small building and is in the middle of one of the few true rural areas in NJ, right next to an active farm, in fact.) If there's any WJHR / "Jersey's Hometown Radio" paraphernalia left in the building, be sure to save it... it might be a collector's item some day, just like items from the similarly defunct WRAN/WMHQ, WERA, WBRW, WCRV, etc.... all "hometown" AM stations that have either been sold and changed formats, or gone off the air entirely. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Mar 16 17:52:52 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 17 Mar 2003 01:52:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 71669 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2003 01:52:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Mar 2003 01:52:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.88) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Mar 2003 01:52:51 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.189] by n4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Mar 2003 01:52:51 -0000 Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 01:52:51 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Blaupunkt DigiCeiver Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1337 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.87.147 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > The FM does not blend the highs, there's actually a setting to > adjust the high blend (from off to max). One thing I don't like about most car radios, in addition to the drop-off of treble response on weaker FM signals, the the overly aggressive FM "stereo blend" they use. I live and drive in an area with lots of hills and valleys, and as a result, all except the strongest FM signals are rarely ever heard with true stereo audio... and this happens even long before the signal weakens to the point where the background hiss with full Stereo reception would be annoying. One thing I liked about my Sparkomatic SR-430 car radio -- in addition to its excellent wideband AM Stereo -- was its crisp, clear FM reception with only a very minimal amount of Stereo blend, so even if there was some background hiss, I at least got to hear the weaker stations in STEREO. It also tuned up to *108.1* on FM, just in case there's ever a pirate station stupid enough to use that frequency (and I'm sure some have -- locally, I have one transmitting in full stereo on *87.5* MHz!). And isn't it ironic... the radios with the worst reception have the most presets, but the ones with the best reception only give you five or six per band, so you quickly end up with more good stations to listen to, than you have presets for. From groucho@skyweb.net Sun Mar 16 18:15:18 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 17 Mar 2003 02:15:18 -0000 Received: (qmail 18512 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2003 02:15:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Mar 2003 02:15:15 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Mar 2003 02:15:15 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (tc1-113.skyweb.net [66.6.130.241]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h2H2RSIf088434 for ; Sun, 16 Mar 2003 21:27:29 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3E752FCF.1926F71E@skyweb.net> Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2003 21:15:43 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: 1040 WCHR References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 I actually have a WERA bumper sticker... as for WCHR they have been using the studios at the Little transmitter building In Yardley.PA which is 920.. and STL'ing the signal back to the transmitter in Flemington for 1040.... But we have Been building New studio in Flemington which is Not a small Building... It actually has a Full Kitchen at least 7 large Offices 3 studios and 1 fairly large transmitter room and a Seperate equipment Room.. Its actually Quite large... the Shack your Thinking of is Just 920 which Originates in Princeton. "Kevin T." wrote: > > the only Times anyone is there is Tuesdays and thursdays... > > Building the new studios.. > > They're actually going to have studios for 1040 WCHR in the little > shack at the transmitter site? I thought Nassau based everything at > their main offices in Princeton. (Actually, it is quite a modern and > lavishly equipped "shack", having been built all-new in the mid-'90s, > but nonetheless it's a small building and is in the middle of one of > the few true rural areas in NJ, right next to an active farm, in > fact.) > > If there's any WJHR / "Jersey's Hometown Radio" paraphernalia left in > the building, be sure to save it... it might be a collector's item > some day, just like items from the similarly defunct WRAN/WMHQ, WERA, > WBRW, WCRV, etc.... all "hometown" AM stations that have either been > sold and changed formats, or gone off the air entirely. > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From evergreenterrace@buzzle.com Sun Mar 16 18:16:42 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: evergreenterrace@buzzle.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 17 Mar 2003 02:16:42 -0000 Received: (qmail 74454 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2003 02:16:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Mar 2003 02:16:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.87) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Mar 2003 02:16:41 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.175] by n30.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Mar 2003 02:16:41 -0000 Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 02:16:39 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Audio Processing and Radio Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1782 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgliradio" X-Originating-IP: 170.20.11.59 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=69711087 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgliradio Usually I love a good thread about audio processing, but I've been so busy that I totally missed the thread. Be that as it may I know many people who hate audio processing. It does distort the audio, it does add artifacts... it's all the bad things people who hate it say it is. I happen to like audio processing... IF used correctly. There are literally thousands of radio stations out there who do not employ their audio processing correctly. Many of them are using competent boxes and they really have no excuse for how bad the station sounds. Others have older gear that doesn't cut the mustard... or gear that is failing and nobody competent enough to get it out of there. For me, audio processing can create excitement with the music. Some stations' chains are set in the sweet spot and everything sounds great... cut to cut... voice to voice... spot to spot. Others will never get it right (stations I knew were terrible sound even worse when your radio is digital end to end). Less is more... but more... done the right way, can sound really great. We're not going for audiophile... we can't in this medium, there are too many limitations in broadcast. However, there is no excuse for over clipped, smeared or purposly distorted audio on the air. I will never be happy with the way my stations sound. One (an AM) right now is being programmed with less-than-idea source material which is a major issue. The other (an FM) has an airhcain made up of old pieces of almost every radio station in the area. The FM sounds pretty good (using CRL/Hnat Hindes 1980's gear for FM) and, IMHO, more than holds a candle to those hawking Orbans and Omnias on the air. The processor is a tool, those who know how to use it can build a great thing. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Mar 16 18:17:26 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 17 Mar 2003 02:17:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 72359 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2003 02:17:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Mar 2003 02:17:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.64) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Mar 2003 02:17:25 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.181] by n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Mar 2003 02:17:25 -0000 Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 02:17:25 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: New Pics added Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3E74C083.335A4D94@skyweb.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 674 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.87.147 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Hey Guys I just added a few Pics Of WCHR 1040 am to My website > http://www.angelfire.com/nj4/wttm/wchr.html > Neal Looks great... just one glitch: remove the extra period at the end of "towers.jpg" so the picture link will work. And hopefully that new studio equipment will be fully wired up for Stereo! I also found on your site pictures of the WPAT 930 AM Stereo towers... without a doubt I think it's the "classiest" AM tower array I've seen, with four equal-spaced "top-hatted" self-supporting towers, looking almost extraterrestrial, especially since they are right along the NJ Turnpike around Exit 153... http://www.angelfire.com/nj4/wttm/wpat.html From groucho@skyweb.net Sun Mar 16 18:34:38 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 17 Mar 2003 02:34:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 75892 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2003 02:34:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Mar 2003 02:34:37 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Mar 2003 02:34:37 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (tc1-113.skyweb.net [66.6.130.241]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h2H2kpIf093132 for ; Sun, 16 Mar 2003 21:46:51 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3E753459.7C016FAF@skyweb.net> Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2003 21:35:05 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: New Pics added References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Thanks Kevin Fixed the Link to the Towers Pic silly Me... I wanted to take More Pics but My battery died in the camera.. If You Notice. the New Console is a Radio systems Like I installed at WTTM. at WCHR its an 18 Channel Board at WTTM its a 12 channel.. I really Like the radio system Consoles... BTW an 18 Channel was also installed in the Production room. and at the New Y-107 studios in the Poconos... Even though there is a 9200 optimod in the Rack. there is a 9100B sitting On top of the Phasor unit as can Be seen in the Photos the Little brown box Next to the APC ups unit. Neal "Kevin T." wrote: > > Hey Guys I just added a few Pics Of WCHR 1040 am to My website > > http://www.angelfire.com/nj4/wttm/wchr.html > > Neal > > Looks great... just one glitch: remove the extra period at the end of > "towers.jpg" so the picture link will work. And hopefully that new > studio equipment will be fully wired up for Stereo! > > I also found on your site pictures of the WPAT 930 AM Stereo > towers... without a doubt I think it's the "classiest" AM tower array > I've seen, with four equal-spaced "top-hatted" self-supporting > towers, looking almost extraterrestrial, especially since they are > right along the NJ Turnpike around Exit 153... > > http://www.angelfire.com/nj4/wttm/wpat.html > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From groucho@skyweb.net Sun Mar 16 18:36:00 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 17 Mar 2003 02:36:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 12630 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2003 02:35:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Mar 2003 02:35:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Mar 2003 02:35:58 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (tc1-113.skyweb.net [66.6.130.241]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h2H2m9If093428 for ; Sun, 16 Mar 2003 21:48:09 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3E7534A6.EF7E8218@skyweb.net> Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2003 21:36:23 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: New Pics added References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Correction the WPAT Towers are along the garden state parkway Not the New Jersey turnpike Neal "Kevin T." wrote: > > Hey Guys I just added a few Pics Of WCHR 1040 am to My website > > http://www.angelfire.com/nj4/wttm/wchr.html > > Neal > > Looks great... just one glitch: remove the extra period at the end of > "towers.jpg" so the picture link will work. And hopefully that new > studio equipment will be fully wired up for Stereo! > > I also found on your site pictures of the WPAT 930 AM Stereo > towers... without a doubt I think it's the "classiest" AM tower array > I've seen, with four equal-spaced "top-hatted" self-supporting > towers, looking almost extraterrestrial, especially since they are > right along the NJ Turnpike around Exit 153... > > http://www.angelfire.com/nj4/wttm/wpat.html > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From amymousie@yahoo.com Sun Mar 16 19:43:00 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 17 Mar 2003 03:42:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 28003 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2003 03:42:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Mar 2003 03:42:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.67) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Mar 2003 03:42:59 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.141] by n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Mar 2003 03:42:58 -0000 Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 03:42:58 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: AM stereo patents Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 547 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie" X-Originating-IP: 64.175.246.79 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie Looking further yielded a few surprises. Not the least of which, there was a -second- Japanese AM stereo system, from Sansui, as well as that the early-1960s AM stereo scene had a 6th minor player: Zenith. I've found some of the Philco and Westinghouse patents, so I haqve something to go on. I still have yet to find the CBS system. I haven't yet explored the 1975-1982 AM stereo patents just yet. The oldest referenced patent I have been able to find, though I have yet to check it out, is 1937. Interesting stuff. :) Amy. <:3 )~~8~ From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Mar 16 20:10:53 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 17 Mar 2003 04:10:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 54411 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2003 04:10:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Mar 2003 04:10:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Mar 2003 04:10:52 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.142] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Mar 2003 04:10:52 -0000 Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 04:10:50 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Audio Processing and Radio Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1187 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.87.147 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > The processor is a tool, those who know how to use it can build a > great thing. Especially if you've designed and built that processor yourself! I'm quite pleased with the results of my "Kevtronimod", especially for it being a single-band, discrete stereo (non-matrix) processor. This isn't a new recording, but for those of you who haven't listened to this yet, here's an example of how the Kevtronimod sounds on my Alfredo-Lite-powered AM Stereo microbroadcast station, 1500 "KJFE": ftp://209.193.86.116/usa/nj/1500kjfe.mp3 For those with some time to download a 6.9 meg file (and who can cut and paste a wrapped URL together), this is an interesting recording of "France Bleu" on 864 kHz in AM Stereo from Paris, as caught transmitting with no bandwidth filtering (verus the strict 4.5 kHz cut-off they normally use) and virtually no audio processing either-- as heard via DX several hundreds of miles away in the U.K.! http://www.amstereo.audio-stream.net/amstereo/files/stations/Europe/ France/fr.bleu_04.mp3 And here's an example of how 710 WOR sounds with no processing at all, direct off the STL (in mono): http://www.wor710.com/Engineering/iboc/wor_stl.wav From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Mar 16 20:29:58 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 17 Mar 2003 04:29:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 5819 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2003 04:29:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Mar 2003 04:29:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Mar 2003 04:29:57 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.187] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Mar 2003 04:29:57 -0000 Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 04:29:57 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: New Pics added Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <3E7534A6.EF7E8218@skyweb.net> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 876 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.87.147 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Correction the WPAT Towers are along the garden state parkway Not > the New Jersey turnpike Same difference... als I know is that both highways are traffic hell anytime around rush hour! :-) One of the most impressive transmitter sites in New Jersey sadly no longer exists... in Somerset, NJ, on the western bank of the Raritan River, there was some sort of government-run transmitter site with 12 towers, over a mile from end to end. It was described as a "shortwave" station, and was operational as late as the early 1970s, judging by the HF detuning skirts that still exist on the tower of nearby 98.3 WMGQ-FM (built in 1971), but otherwise little is known about it, and the land has long since been taken over by housing developments (residents of which must've been wondering why they had huge concrete blocks and scraps of guy wire in their back yards!). From kevtronics@yahoo.com Sun Mar 16 20:42:59 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 17 Mar 2003 04:42:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 46275 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2003 04:42:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Mar 2003 04:42:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Mar 2003 04:42:58 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.142] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Mar 2003 04:42:58 -0000 Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 04:42:56 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: AM stereo patents Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 970 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.87.147 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Interesting stuff. :) It would be more interesting if I could actually understand what they're talking about... but one thing I have been able to decipher so far is a C-Quam receiver design by Leonard Kahn in 1987 which attempted to compensate for platform motion by switching into Kahn/ISB mode when an unstable signal is detected, and then switching back to correct C-Quam decoding when things clear up. That way when conditions are poor, you'd at least get pseudo-stereo from ISB reception of the C-Quam signal, rather than simply dropping to mono. The hidden truth is that Kahn/ISB AM Stereo still does have platform motion as well... it's just motion between the L+R and L-R components, rather than across the individual Left and Right audio channels, so it appears as a strange phasing effect when listening in stereo, and as *front-to-back* platform motion when listening on a matrixed Surround Sound system (with L-R fed to the rear speakers). From amymousie@yahoo.com Sun Mar 16 21:29:30 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 17 Mar 2003 05:29:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 94473 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2003 05:29:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Mar 2003 05:29:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Mar 2003 05:29:30 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.142] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Mar 2003 05:29:30 -0000 Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 05:29:30 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: AM stereo patents - 1925! Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 419 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie" X-Originating-IP: 64.175.246.79 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie Looking back even further, I think I have found the earliest single- channel, ISB AM stereo system! Filed in 1925, patented in 1928, we have Patent No. 1,666,158, as submitted by Herman A Affel, of AT&T. http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-Parser? Sect1=PTO1&Sect2=HITOFF&d=PALL&p=1&u=/netahtml/srchnum.htm&r=1&f=G&l=5 0&s1=1,666,158.WKU.&OS=PN/1,666,158&RS=PN/1,666,158 Eat that, Kahn! :) 1925! :) Amy. <:3 )~~8~ From groucho@skyweb.net Mon Mar 17 02:12:03 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: groucho@skyweb.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 17 Mar 2003 10:12:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 54084 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2003 10:12:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Mar 2003 10:12:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO pluto.skyweb.net) (205.216.244.31) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Mar 2003 10:12:01 -0000 Received: from skyweb.net (tc1-7.skyweb.net [66.6.130.135]) by pluto.skyweb.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h2HAOGIf094270 for ; Mon, 17 Mar 2003 05:24:16 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from groucho@skyweb.net) Message-ID: <3E759F91.F0C3AB64@skyweb.net> Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 05:12:33 -0500 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: New Pics added References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/) From: Neal Newman X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=88196145 X-Yahoo-Profile: cozy659 Yeah I know... Yep the old VOA site.... the skirts on the WMGQ tower are actually a Unipole. that is the Backup site for WCTC right there at the studios. at least that's what Keith Smeal the CE told me... But what do I know..... LOL Neal "Kevin T." wrote: > > Correction the WPAT Towers are along the garden state parkway Not > > the New Jersey turnpike > > Same difference... als I know is that both highways are traffic hell > anytime around rush hour! :-) > > One of the most impressive transmitter sites in New Jersey sadly no > longer exists... in Somerset, NJ, on the western bank of the Raritan > River, there was some sort of government-run transmitter site with > 12 towers, over a mile from end to end. It was described as a > "shortwave" station, and was operational as late as the early 1970s, > judging by the HF detuning skirts that still exist on the tower of > nearby 98.3 WMGQ-FM (built in 1971), but otherwise little is known > about it, and the land has long since been taken over by housing > developments (residents of which must've been wondering why they had > huge concrete blocks and scraps of guy wire in their back yards!). > > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ From ai4i@hotmail.com Mon Mar 17 02:37:14 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ai4i@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 17 Mar 2003 10:37:13 -0000 Received: (qmail 29675 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2003 10:37:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Mar 2003 10:37:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (207.68.164.63) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Mar 2003 10:37:13 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 17 Mar 2003 02:37:13 -0800 To: References: <1047895925.2879.54089.m8@yahoogroups.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Digest Number 626 Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 05:37:08 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 17 Mar 2003 10:37:13.0151 (UTC) FILETIME=[2BE25CF0:01C2EC71] From: "Joel Wilson" Reply-To: "Joel Wilson" X-Originating-IP: [216.77.218.47] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=127893550 X-Yahoo-Profile: ai4ijoel Now think about this: if all stations were to increase their night signals by 10dB, the coverage of any individual station at any level of QRM would remain identical. The QRM level would increase by no more than the power increase of any individual station, but all these stations would enjoy a 10dB advantage against bridges, and all forms of electrical interference. Joel Wilson Hello Taxi AI4I ========================================= Proud 2-B a pioneering satellite radio subscriber AI4I is always on the trailing edge of technology ========================================= Message: 12 Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 01:19:24 -0000 From: "w4opw" Subject: Re: Extended Band Power Levels And it was found this was NOT true. Their ADI's were NOT covered better as the noise levels went up substantially. 10,000 watts would ***SUBSTANTIALLY*** interfere with other expanded band stations via skywave well into the city grade of other stations, as remember, skywave is MUCH better on this end of the band (there's some bit of skywave often during the day ) but the groundwave is not so good. UGH! What a mess it would be! Powell W4OPW and WKDK 1240...the graveyarder BY the graveyard! From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Mar 17 08:10:34 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 17 Mar 2003 16:10:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 22908 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2003 16:10:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Mar 2003 16:10:33 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.66) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Mar 2003 16:10:33 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.120] by n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Mar 2003 16:10:16 -0000 Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 16:10:15 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Digest Number 626 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 929 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Now think about this: if all stations were to increase their night > signals by 10dB, the coverage of any individual station at any > level of QRM would remain identical. This was proven false by experience with the "Graveyard Channel" stations when they all upgraded from 250W to 1 kW at night, and is especially false for the Expanded Band, where the nighttime skywaves act more like the shortwave band. Even at 1 kW, the E.B. stations step onto each other a lot, and when you bump that up to 10 kW at night, it just gets worse -- such as 1680 WTIR from Florida (rumored to be running 10 kW at night) clobbering the local signal of 1680 WTTM in New Jersey, a good 900 miles away! If there are going to be any nighttime power increases in the Expanded Band, directional antenna arrays are going to be a must... and then that will cause additional headaches and require high expenditure with questionable results. From mark_608@hotmail.com Mon Mar 17 10:46:01 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: mark_608@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 17 Mar 2003 18:46:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 94990 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2003 18:46:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Mar 2003 18:46:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.17.120) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Mar 2003 18:46:00 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 17 Mar 2003 10:46:00 -0800 Received: from 136.1.1.101 by lw11fd.law11.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Mon, 17 Mar 2003 18:46:00 GMT To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: )))...In Living AM Stereo...((( Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 13:46:00 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 17 Mar 2003 18:46:00.0568 (UTC) FILETIME=[74630F80:01C2ECB5] From: "Mark Sundquist" X-Originating-IP: [136.1.1.101] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=3850332 X-Yahoo-Profile: mark_608 This song is in fairly regular rotation at 630 CFCO out of Chatham,ON...as well as the Joni Mitchell song... Mark Sterling Heights,MI >From: "Jim Burgan" >Reply-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com >To: >Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: )))...In Living AM Stereo...((( >Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2003 12:05:38 -0500 > >Pilot of the airwaves.. >Here is my request... >You don't have to play it but I hope you'll do your best... >I've been listening to your show on the radio... >And you seem like a friend to me... > >I was one of 3 people who actually liked and bought the single. > >You'll find it on Rhino's "Pop Hits Of The 80's" Vol II or III (I don't >have it handy to check). > > >"Pilot of the Airwaves" - Charlie Dore > >Doesn't ANYBODY remember this one-hit wonder? > >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > _________________________________________________________________ Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963 From jbyrns@rcn.com Mon Mar 17 11:26:02 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@rcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 17 Mar 2003 19:25:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 35602 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2003 19:25:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Mar 2003 19:25:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.85) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Mar 2003 19:25:43 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.189] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Mar 2003 19:25:43 -0000 Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 19:24:20 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: New file uploaded to amstereoforum Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <002101c2eb7a$e1bd1d00$827dfea9@home1> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3090 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bta_50g" X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.240 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=138635554 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Scott Todd" wrote: > Speaking of the venerable BTA-50G, did you happen to ever work on one of > those, John? We had one of those at KSTP for most of my time there. I was > the last person to take a full set of readings on it. I think it sounded > better than the MW-50. It went out the door in 84, bought by some broker who > turned around and sold it to another station in around here that was > upgrading. Hi Scott, No, I have never worked on a BTA-50G. I picked it as my old Yahoo "clubs" handle when I found that my first choice had already taken. The BTA-50G is my second favorite piece of antique broadcast equipment, after the BTS-1A which I have worked on. My fascination with the BTA-50G stems in an unexpected way from the "Book Man of High Fidelity", which was a biography of Edwin Armstrong that came out when I was an impressionable teenager. That book started my interest in radio and made Armstrong my idol, although that was later to be tempered when I realized the distortions in the story as told by books like "Man of High Fidelity", and "Empire of the Air". At any rate I became an FM fanatic, and when during college I worked for a radio station, AM/FM/TV, I tried to pretend that the AM transmitter didn't exist. The AM transmitter was a 5 kW Westinghouse, which was remote controlled, so my contact with it was mostly limited to the other end of a remote control circuit. I now wish I had paid more attention to that Westinghouse AM transmitter, and particularly what it's vintage was, which I am sure was either immediate pre WW2, or early post WW2, but I don't know which. One interesting thing about it was that part of the adaptation for remote control was a humongous motorized 3 phase Variac sitting on the floor in front of the transmitter, which was used to adjust the output power by varying the plate voltage to anything from zero to full voltage. At any rate I was fascinated by the television, and especially the FM, transmitters, and studied the function of every component in them, even the water pumps for the television transmitter, which I thought were rather funky at the time, although now my slogan might be "real transmitters have water pumps." Among the reading material at the TV/ FM transmitter house was a collection of RCA Broadcast News magazines, which I would often read to occupy time. Many of the articles were pushing RCA's 50 kW Ampliphase transmitters, I thought, now here is a really cool AM transmitter, none of those big crude class B modulators, just two FM transmitters coupled together to make an AM transmitter. As an FM fanatic it really appealed to me, and made a lasting impression on me. A few years later I encountered my first Ampliphase transmitter, a BTA-50H, when the first 50 kW station was built in the state where I resided at the time. These days, the RCA 50B, complete with water pumps, and as adapted for AM stereo in 1959, has somewhat superseded the BTA-50G as my favorite antique transmitter. John From jbyrns@rcn.com Mon Mar 17 11:28:24 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@rcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 17 Mar 2003 19:28:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 69828 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2003 19:28:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Mar 2003 19:28:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.69) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Mar 2003 19:28:23 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.177] by n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Mar 2003 19:28:21 -0000 Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 19:28:20 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Audio Processing and Radio Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 922 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bta_50g" X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.240 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=138635554 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g Hi Kevin, I get the feeling your "Kevtronimod" is really solving a different problem than the typical broadcaster is solving with his "Optimod". Could you give us a quick tour of the processing functions the "Kevtronimod" accomplishes, and what technology it uses to do it? John --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T." wrote: > > The processor is a tool, those who know how to use it can build a > > great thing. > > Especially if you've designed and built that processor yourself! > I'm quite pleased with the results of my "Kevtronimod", especially > for it being a single-band, discrete stereo (non-matrix) processor. > This isn't a new recording, but for those of you who haven't listened > to this yet, here's an example of how the Kevtronimod sounds on my > Alfredo-Lite-powered AM Stereo microbroadcast station, 1500 "KJFE": > > ftp://209.193.86.116/usa/nj/1500kjfe.mp3 From w4opw@yahoo.com Mon Mar 17 13:56:10 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: w4opw@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 17 Mar 2003 21:56:09 -0000 Received: (qmail 97473 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2003 21:56:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Mar 2003 21:56:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.86) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Mar 2003 21:56:08 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.135] by n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Mar 2003 21:56:02 -0000 Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 21:56:02 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Digest Number 626 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1287 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "w4opw" X-Originating-IP: 66.112.193.96 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=104587625 X-Yahoo-Profile: W4OPW --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T." wrote: >> This was proven false by experience with the "Graveyard Channel" > stations when they all upgraded from 250W to 1 kW at night, and is > especially false for the Expanded Band, where the nighttime skywaves > act more like the shortwave band. Even at 1 kW, the E.B. stations > step onto each other a lot, and when you bump that up to 10 kW at > night, it just gets worse -- such as 1680 WTIR from Florida (rumored > to be running 10 kW at night) clobbering the local signal of > 1680 WTTM in New Jersey, a good 900 miles away! When WKDK got the authority to go from 250 at night to 1000 watts there was no increased range. In some cases in the middle of the country range was DEcreased due to the higher level of skywave interference. The Orlando 1680 often comes in LOCAL strength here in Columbia SC some 500 miles south of me. 1000 watts....not very likely. > If there are going to be any nighttime power increases in the > Expanded Band, directional antenna arrays are going to be a must... > and then that will cause additional headaches and require high > expenditure with questionable results. That is true, and I hope it does not happen EXCEPT in very rare cases. Powell From w4opw@yahoo.com Mon Mar 17 14:06:17 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: w4opw@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 17 Mar 2003 22:06:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 47699 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2003 22:06:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Mar 2003 22:06:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.78) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Mar 2003 22:06:02 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.177] by n22.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Mar 2003 22:06:02 -0000 Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 22:06:00 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Audio Processing Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1466 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "w4opw" X-Originating-IP: 66.112.193.96 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=104587625 X-Yahoo-Profile: W4OPW Audio processing is a necessity of the broadcast industry. You can't get the audio to point A to B, and keep the levels perfect. Also, different audio sources have different levels. As for a live DJ ( geting to be VERRRY rare in a lot of cases) how many paid attention to levels? The problem occurs when PD's and GM's have to be the most absolute loudest no matter what. On AM it's not the problem it used to be. For all the complaints about the Optimod 9200, I expect software updates will take care of the problems. Kerry and Tom need to pester Bob Orban about this. AS for FM's the processing wars in some cities make a lot of FM's not a lot of fun to listen to. Nashville, TN is especially bad. When I went through last summer the 3 country FM's sounded SO bad I went SCREAMING back to WSM. I had listened to Scott Bailey's WMRO on 1560 with oldies, and though I don't particularly like the sound, I listened to it till I got closer in to Nashville. But the FM that sounded so bad was Tulsa's KVOO-FM ....a cheap muffly cassette sounded better. KVOO is now talk and they said they would migrate some of the traditional stuff over to KVOO-FM. Well, the AM was blasting the FM in ratings, and was most of the time breathing down the neck of the top rated country FM, and sometimes even beat them. After the change KVOO-FM gained virtually nothing, and with talk KVOO fell off a cliff. Smart. But that's the way corporations think. Powell From w4opw@yahoo.com Mon Mar 17 14:06:21 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: w4opw@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 17 Mar 2003 22:06:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 45090 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2003 22:06:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Mar 2003 22:06:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.83) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Mar 2003 22:06:21 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.143] by n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Mar 2003 22:06:21 -0000 Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 22:06:19 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Audio Processing Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1466 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "w4opw" X-Originating-IP: 66.112.193.96 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=104587625 X-Yahoo-Profile: W4OPW Audio processing is a necessity of the broadcast industry. You can't get the audio to point A to B, and keep the levels perfect. Also, different audio sources have different levels. As for a live DJ ( geting to be VERRRY rare in a lot of cases) how many paid attention to levels? The problem occurs when PD's and GM's have to be the most absolute loudest no matter what. On AM it's not the problem it used to be. For all the complaints about the Optimod 9200, I expect software updates will take care of the problems. Kerry and Tom need to pester Bob Orban about this. AS for FM's the processing wars in some cities make a lot of FM's not a lot of fun to listen to. Nashville, TN is especially bad. When I went through last summer the 3 country FM's sounded SO bad I went SCREAMING back to WSM. I had listened to Scott Bailey's WMRO on 1560 with oldies, and though I don't particularly like the sound, I listened to it till I got closer in to Nashville. But the FM that sounded so bad was Tulsa's KVOO-FM ....a cheap muffly cassette sounded better. KVOO is now talk and they said they would migrate some of the traditional stuff over to KVOO-FM. Well, the AM was blasting the FM in ratings, and was most of the time breathing down the neck of the top rated country FM, and sometimes even beat them. After the change KVOO-FM gained virtually nothing, and with talk KVOO fell off a cliff. Smart. But that's the way corporations think. Powell From w4opw@yahoo.com Mon Mar 17 14:13:01 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: w4opw@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 17 Mar 2003 22:13:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 82171 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2003 22:12:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 17 Mar 2003 22:12:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.68) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Mar 2003 22:12:58 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.254] by n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 17 Mar 2003 22:12:57 -0000 Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 22:12:56 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Audio Processing and Radio Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1188 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "w4opw" X-Originating-IP: 66.112.193.96 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=104587625 X-Yahoo-Profile: W4OPW --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "bta_50g" wrote: > > Hi Kevin, > > I get the feeling your "Kevtronimod" is really solving a different > problem than the typical broadcaster is solving with his "Optimod". > > Could you give us a quick tour of the processing functions the > "Kevtronimod" accomplishes, and what technology it uses to do it? > > > John The multiband processors allow a wide range of adjustments. I remember on the old single band stuff, song with DEEP pulsing bass would cause severe pumping. There's no way around it. So with multiband processing you can be louder,not overmodulate, and not be aggravating with audio pumping if you are not exceptionally aggressive. I have a Paul Weston album that if you were to play it on the air with the old single band processing would, pump and cause annoying variances in the levels of the audio. And how many AM stations have PROPERLY set up their Optimod with scope and test tones for certain functions as specified in the Optimod manual ? The 1230 uses brand X. They have VERY distorted audio, and are very irritating to listen to. And they have a solid state BE transmitter. Powell From ai4i@hotmail.com Mon Mar 17 16:05:35 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: ai4i@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 18 Mar 2003 00:05:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 74684 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2003 00:05:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Mar 2003 00:05:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imf47bis.bellsouth.net) (205.152.58.150) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Mar 2003 00:05:31 -0000 Received: from ai4i ([216.77.212.142]) by imf47bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.25 201-253-122-122-125-20020815) with SMTP id <20030318000744.PDMZ11648.imf47bis.bellsouth.net@ai4i> for ; Mon, 17 Mar 2003 19:07:44 -0500 Message-ID: <002101c2ece2$16cf65d0$8ed44dd8@ai4i> To: References: <1047914352.1878.6124.m12@yahoogroups.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Digest Number 627 Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 19:05:29 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Joel Wilson" Reply-To: "Joel Wilson" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=127893550 X-Yahoo-Profile: ai4ijoel I think you are saying that where we have 1mv/m of total co-channel noise at a point in space, X number of kilometers from our transmitter, and our station puts 10mv/m at that same point in space, we would have a 20dB s/n ratio, but if we all crank our signals up by 10dB, the noise floor goes up to 3.16mv/m at that same point in space and our station goes up to 31.6mv/m at that same point in space, the ratio of signal to noise somehow magically becomes less than 20dB. My calculation indicates that 31.6mv/m will cover a 3.16mv/m noise floor exactly, precisely, positively as well as 10mv/m will cover a 1mv/m noise floor, but will enjoy a 10dB advantage over all forms of broadband electrical noises as well as propagation fading. I believe that if all those graveyard channel stations went from 250w, to 1kw, 10kw, 100kw, or 1Mw at night, they would still have clean signals out to about 12-15 kilometers, that would not change at all. Joel Wilson AI4I ========================================= Proud 2-B a pioneering satellite radio subscriber AI4I is always on the trailing edge of technology ========================================= > Message: 12 > Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 01:19:24 -0000 > From: "w4opw" > Subject: Re: Extended Band Power Levels > > And it was found this was NOT true. Their ADI's were NOT covered > better as the noise levels went up substantially. > 10,000 watts would ***SUBSTANTIALLY*** interfere with other expanded > band stations via skywave well into the city grade of other > stations, as remember, skywave is MUCH better on this end of the > band (there's some bit of skywave often during the day ) but the > groundwave is not so good. UGH! What a mess it would be! > Powell W4OPW and WKDK 1240...the graveyarder BY the graveyard! From amymousie@yahoo.com Mon Mar 17 17:21:30 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 18 Mar 2003 01:21:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 53346 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2003 01:21:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Mar 2003 01:21:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.75) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Mar 2003 01:21:28 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.143] by n2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Mar 2003 01:21:28 -0000 Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 01:21:27 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} Digest Number 627 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <002101c2ece2$16cf65d0$8ed44dd8@ai4i> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1298 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie" X-Originating-IP: 64.175.244.129 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Joel Wilson" wrote: =snip= > I believe that if all those graveyard channel stations went from 250w, to > 1kw, 10kw, 100kw, or 1Mw at night, they would still have clean signals out > to about 12-15 kilometers, that would not change at all. And you would be absolutely correct, hence the problem with the AM band these days, the FCC's attitude towards co-channel interference, and yes, IBOC: To counter any interference from the interferor, it's not the interferor's responsibility to reduce interference, but the interferee's, hence to counter interference, the interferee's power levels are increased to decrease any effects of any incoming interference. And so, we have the mess we have today. The FCC has been pretty consistant with this concept for a number of years, and even the problem with IBOC seems consistant with this as well- It's not the interferor's responsibility, so the interferee must up the power to counter it. I think everyone should be knocked down to 1-5kW -maximum-, except for what we used to call "clear channel" stations (before a certain company that has given the term such a bad name). Maybe then, AM will become popular once more? Eh, don't hold your breath- This mouse isn't. Amy. <:3 )~~8~ From possumhunter@netzero.net Mon Mar 17 17:27:12 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 18 Mar 2003 01:27:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 48834 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2003 01:27:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Mar 2003 01:27:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.94) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Mar 2003 01:27:11 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 17 Mar 2003 17:27:11 -0800 To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Audio Processing and Radio Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 20:26:58 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 18 Mar 2003 01:27:11.0769 (UTC) FILETIME=[7FF0D890:01C2ECED] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.153.28.201] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 w4opw wrote: > The 1230 uses brand X. They have VERY distorted audio, and are very irritating to listen to. And they have a solid state BE transmitter. Go ahead and name names, Powell. WAIM 1230 has a CRL Audio Gain Controller driving a CRL Spectral Energy Compressor driving a CRL Peak Modulation Controller driving a CRL NRSC Filter. It sounds like sh*t, but the the "Worst Audio On The Air" winner is still 800 WPJM by a landslide. WPJM has a Harris SMP 90 driving a RDL "Stick-On" NRSC filter driving a Harris SX-1A transmitter. Second place goes to 1300 WCKI with a CRL Audio Gain Controller driving a CRL Spectral Energy Compressor driving a CRL Peak Modulation Controller driving a CCA AM1000D transmitter. Kevin From possumhunter@netzero.net Mon Mar 17 18:12:15 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: dodgeramtrucker@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 18 Mar 2003 02:12:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 29425 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2003 02:12:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Mar 2003 02:12:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (64.4.36.197) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Mar 2003 02:12:14 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 17 Mar 2003 18:12:14 -0800 To: Subject: OT: Heads Up on the Behringer Eurodesk MX9000 Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 21:12:07 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 18 Mar 2003 02:12:14.0870 (UTC) FILETIME=[CB1D5360:01C2ECF3] X-eGroups-From: "Possum Hunter" From: "Possum Hunter" Reply-To: "Possum Hunter" X-Originating-IP: [172.153.28.201] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=7882787 X-Yahoo-Profile: ICURAPossum_Hunter2 Warning to those with a Behringer Eurodesk MX9000 console: This is a great sounding mixing console that has a major design flaw: The power supply. The MX9000 at WFIS is now on the third power supply in 18 months! The first one caught fire when it was 8 months old. I caught it just before it caught on fire again Friday Morning! The problem is in the 17 Volt regulator section. Behringer uses a voltage regulator rated at 1.5 Amps while the console pulls nearly 3 amps of current. Behringer's first solution was to remove the silicone insulator pads between the heat sink the regulator chips and replace them with mica insulators and heat sink grease. Due to the high heat cracking the mica insulators, they now say to thicker mica insulators! The new power supply Behringer sent me over the weekend still has the 1.5 amp voltage regulators! Please note this puppy ain't UL listed (Gee, I wonder why) Behringer absolutely refuses to send ANY service information or parts to radio stations, or any other end user for their equipment. Behringer forces you to send your console off to have it repaired at an authorized service center, however if you raise enough hell, they will send you a replacement power supply! I am trying to talk the boss into getting a Radio Systems or Pacific Recorders console....I have never seen one catch fire. Kevin From evergreenterrace@buzzle.com Mon Mar 17 19:27:25 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: evergreenterrace@buzzle.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 18 Mar 2003 03:27:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 41963 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2003 03:27:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Mar 2003 03:27:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Mar 2003 03:27:23 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.148] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Mar 2003 03:27:23 -0000 Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 03:27:22 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Audio Processing and Radio Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 534 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "wgliradio" X-Originating-IP: 170.20.11.59 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=69711087 X-Yahoo-Profile: wgliradio --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Possum Hunter" wrote: > w4opw wrote: > > The 1230 uses brand X. They have VERY distorted audio, and are very > irritating to listen to. And they have a solid state BE transmitter. > > Go ahead and name names, Powell. WAIM 1230 has a CRL Audio Gain Controller > driving a CRL Spectral Energy Compressor driving a CRL Peak Modulation > Controller driving a CRL NRSC Filter. It sounds like sh*t, I an surprised. CRL AM gear can sound great! Too bad it's misused here. From jsgil@hal-pc.org Mon Mar 17 19:36:01 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 18 Mar 2003 03:35:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 86061 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2003 03:35:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Mar 2003 03:35:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Mar 2003 03:36:00 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.254] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Mar 2003 03:35:58 -0000 Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 03:35:57 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Audio Processing Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1078 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.246 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "w4opw" wrote: > But the FM that sounded so bad was Tulsa's > KVOO-FM ....a cheap muffly cassette sounded better. KVOO is now talk > and they said they would migrate some of the traditional stuff over > to KVOO-FM. Well, the AM was blasting the FM in ratings, and was > most of the time breathing down the neck of the top rated country > FM, and sometimes even beat them. After the change KVOO-FM gained > virtually nothing, and with talk KVOO fell off a cliff. Smart. But > that's the way corporations think. > > Powell KVOO had a unique thing going with their classic country on AM. I could pick them up in stereo somtimes in SE Texas. I don't understand why we need another talk station when the vast majority of AMs are talk already. I guess they had to jump on the bandwagon like everyone else. After 9/11 820 WBAP switched to all talk at night on the midnite truckers road show but I have to say the commercials got pretty bad with a max of 6 songs per hour during their pre 9/11 music playing days. JSG From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Mar 17 20:22:07 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 18 Mar 2003 04:22:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 52423 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2003 04:22:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Mar 2003 04:22:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.64) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Mar 2003 04:22:06 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.142] by n1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Mar 2003 04:22:06 -0000 Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 04:22:02 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Audio Processing and Radio Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 654 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.81.129 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > The multiband processors allow a wide range of adjustments. I > remember on the old single band stuff, song with DEEP pulsing bass > would cause severe pumping. With careful adjustment, this effect can be minimized. For example, there is one mono AM station in my area -- 1070 WKMB in Stirling, NJ -- that still uses home-brew single-band processing, and I think they sound very good, especially on a hi-fi receiver. You can hear WKMB for yourself at: http://rvcc2.raritanval.edu/ktek9053/wkmb/ There are many MP3 files to choose from, but I recommend "wkmbhifi.mp3" and "wkmb2003.mp3" first -- these two give a good feel for their sound. From n0uiheric@aol.com Mon Mar 17 21:19:20 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: N0UIHEric@aol.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 18 Mar 2003 05:19:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 90019 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2003 05:18:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Mar 2003 05:18:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-d03.mx.aol.com) (205.188.157.35) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Mar 2003 05:18:59 -0000 Received: from N0UIHEric@aol.com by imo-d03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v34.21.) id r.113.20689444 (3948) for ; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 00:18:55 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <113.20689444.2ba8063f@aol.com> Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 00:18:55 EST Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Audiophile Quality/Reply to Eric To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 138 From: n0uiheric@aol.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=21420410 X-Yahoo-Profile: n0uih Kerry, IBOC sounds like an Internet feed on a standard phone line. It will never be perfected because IBOC will always cause massive adjacent channel interference, too. The idea is to improve on analog, instead of forcibly converting to digital technology. The truth about IBOC can be found at http://www.digitaldisaster.org/ 73 and good DX from Eric Amateur Radio Station N0UIH Registered Monitor KDX0STL, KMO0CN Hazelwood, MO Grid Square EM48 DXing The World since 1981 Turn Off Clear Channel Communications! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/turnoffclearchannel PRAY FOR AN END TO COMMERCIAL RADIO DEREGULATION "For the love of money is the root of all evil"-1 Timothy 6:10 From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Mar 17 22:03:44 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 18 Mar 2003 06:03:43 -0000 Received: (qmail 14841 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2003 06:03:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Mar 2003 06:03:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.83) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Mar 2003 06:03:43 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.184] by n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Mar 2003 06:03:42 -0000 Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 06:03:42 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Audio Processing and Radio Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1249 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.81.129 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > I get the feeling your "Kevtronimod" is really solving a different > problem than the typical broadcaster is solving with his "Optimod". > > Could you give us a quick tour of the processing functions the > "Kevtronimod" accomplishes, and what technology it uses to do it? First off, here is an example of the "Kevtronimod" audio processor running at full tilt... it is quite a different type of sound than the last example I posted, which was done at a considerably more relaxed setting: ftp://209.193.86.116/usa/nj/1500top5.mp3 The main function of the Kevtronimod is pure wideband limiting with near-instantaneous attack and fast release times, with optional Stereo matrix expansion (basically a passive L-R boost applied before the limiting, to give a rudimentary matrix-processing-type effect). Also included are wideband AGC (to pick up whatever slack is left by the limiter) and pre-emphasis/equalization (set by a 10-band graphic equalizer). My Panasonic AM Stereo generator/transmitter also has a built-in negative peak clipper, although I really don't hear much difference with it turned on or off, at least with the C-Quam system. That's the basic layout... but the technology behind it remains a trade secret. :-) From kevtronics@yahoo.com Mon Mar 17 22:23:41 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 18 Mar 2003 06:23:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 70227 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2003 06:23:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Mar 2003 06:23:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Mar 2003 06:23:40 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.162] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Mar 2003 06:23:39 -0000 Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 06:23:37 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: RDS is dead? Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1306 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.81.129 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics I came across this message in another group and it's like deja vu... almost everything said here about RDS, I've heard said about AM Stereo... including the "reduces coverage area" argument. So, at least in the USA, is RDS "dead"? Today, only a few high-end car radios and shortwave receivers; the few consumer-grade receivers and stereo systems that had it now appear to be gone, and numerous FM stations across the country have stopped transmitting RDS. On the other hand, RDS is so commonplace in Europe that even the unlicensed 'pirate' stations are transmitting it... so why didn't it become successful on this side of the pond? ================================================================== Name: Bill Jacobs at WRDV E-Mail: billjacobs@radio.fm Date: 3/16/03 9:42 p.m. In Reply To: Re: Stations using RDS We had it, but turned it off. For the six people out there who owned an RDS-capable tuner, we were wasting about fifty watts to drive it, and when you've only got a thousand watts to start with, every little bit helps. In my opinion, it's an orphan technology. Using it to give song titles is a great idea, except that (a) no one does it any more, and (b) no one still makes RDS-capable tuners (or if they do, they don't brag). Stick a fork in it; RDS is dead. Bill From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Mon Mar 17 22:49:25 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 18 Mar 2003 06:49:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 86805 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2003 06:49:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Mar 2003 06:49:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web41013.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.93.12) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Mar 2003 06:49:24 -0000 Message-ID: <20030318064924.19435.qmail@web41013.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.34.75] by web41013.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 17 Mar 2003 22:49:24 PST Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2003 22:49:24 -0800 (PST) Subject: Favorite A.M. stereo transmission brand To: AMSF MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio Which one is it? C-QUAM, Kahn, Harris, Magnavox, RCA? My presonal preference is for Magnavox because of the audio. From what I heard when a sample of Magnavox was posted a couple of years back, it sounded the best. 73, Jay,N1WVQ __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! http://platinum.yahoo.com From amymousie@yahoo.com Mon Mar 17 23:11:56 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 18 Mar 2003 07:11:53 -0000 Received: (qmail 49393 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2003 07:11:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Mar 2003 07:11:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Mar 2003 07:11:54 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.161] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Mar 2003 07:11:54 -0000 Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 07:11:53 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: RDS is dead? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 654 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie" X-Originating-IP: 64.175.244.129 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T." wrote: > I came across this message in another group and it's like deja vu... > almost everything said here about RDS, I've heard said about > AM Stereo... including the "reduces coverage area" argument. In that particular case, ANY subcarrier added to an FM carrier reduces coverage by spreading total effective radiated power across the spectrum of the signal. Just having stereo reduces coverage area. Having SCA services further erode the total power. Every carrier eats a percentage of the power. (Apologies for the redundancy- I'm distracted right now.) Amy. <:3 )~~8~ From amymousie@yahoo.com Mon Mar 17 23:29:47 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 18 Mar 2003 07:29:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 32610 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2003 07:29:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Mar 2003 07:29:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.80) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Mar 2003 07:29:46 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.141] by n24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Mar 2003 07:29:46 -0000 Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 07:29:43 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Favorite A.M. stereo transmission brand Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20030318064924.19435.qmail@web41013.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1674 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie" X-Originating-IP: 64.175.244.129 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, JNR wrote: > Which one is it? C-QUAM, Kahn, Harris, Magnavox, > RCA? My presonal preference is for Magnavox > because of the audio. From what I heard when a > sample of Magnavox was posted a couple of years > back, it sounded the best. I'm leaning towards the RCA system, in that it can deliver quality audio and high stereo separation (as little as 17dB separation, - minimum-), which I hope to be able to test in a few months' time. The principle is much the same as the Magnavox system, except it's AM- FM, rather than AM-PM, and has a reduced phase distortion than Magnavox, and much reduced AM interference and crosstalk, due to the use of a limiter before the FM demodulation. (RCA rated it at -20dB crosstalk.) Add to that, that the RCA system is perhaps the easiest AM stereo system to build, as anyone could just use a PLL FM circuit, with a limiter, and balance matching ("tracking") of some form of the sum and difference signals. Add to that, the negative-mod limiting and cosine correction that have become hallmarks of C-QUAM, the RCA system would have been killer. (The Belar system modified the RCA system by reducing the nominal deviation from 1.2kHz to 320 Hz, and limit modulation to a max of 6.025kHz. The reduced deviation would, im my opinion, introduced greater influence of PM components into the FM, and highs would've been blended in, if the main audio remained to the NRSC curve.) Amy. <:3 )~~8~ (Let's see.... RCA, Kahn, Westinghouse, CBS, Philco, Zenith, NEC, Sansui, Matsushita, Fisher, Harris, Magnavox, Belar, Motorola, AT&T.... I'm sure I'm missing a few!) From amymousie@yahoo.com Tue Mar 18 00:11:02 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 18 Mar 2003 08:11:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 87460 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2003 08:11:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Mar 2003 08:11:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.77) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Mar 2003 08:11:01 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.159] by n21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Mar 2003 08:11:01 -0000 Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 08:10:59 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Favorite A.M. stereo transmission brand Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 625 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie" X-Originating-IP: 64.175.244.129 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "amymousie" wrote: =snip= > (Let's see.... RCA, Kahn, Westinghouse, CBS, Philco, Zenith, NEC, > Sansui, Matsushita, Fisher, Harris, Magnavox, Belar, Motorola, > AT&T.... I'm sure I'm missing a few!) Oh, just so you know, Kahn, RCA, AT&T, NEC, and a Dutchman named Boelens all filed patents for ISB stereo systems. Amy. <:3 )~~8~ (The Zenith system would've been what became the Magnavox system, had Zenith gone further in their development-- Their patent was for a receiver for an AM sterteo system that used either FM or PM for the difference component.) From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Mar 18 00:29:05 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 18 Mar 2003 08:29:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 43269 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2003 08:29:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Mar 2003 08:29:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.67) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Mar 2003 08:29:04 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.170] by n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Mar 2003 08:29:04 -0000 Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 08:29:03 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Favorite A.M. stereo transmission brand Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20030318064924.19435.qmail@web41013.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1370 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 216.192.81.129 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Which one is it? C-QUAM, Kahn, Harris, Magnavox, RCA? My presonal > preference is for Magnavox because of the audio. From what I heard > when a sample of Magnavox was posted a couple of years back, it > sounded the best. On a Sony-type multi-system radio, Magnavox AM Stereo definitely has the widest Stereo separation and lowest distortion. Kahn is pretty much the same, but in the real world, it couldn't achieve as wide of Stereo separation than the other systems. Many people say Harris is fantastic, but the problem is, no receivers were ever built that can properly decode it, so it actually sounds the worst on the multi- system radios -- the distortion is noticeably higher. But on a modern C-Quam receiver, such as using the MC13022 or MC13028 chips, the audio quality is probably the best AM Stereo has ever achieved. If you've never heard one of these newer receivers, the improvement is drastic. The distortion that you might have thought of as being an inherent limitation of the C-Quam AM Stereo format simply disappears, and you are treated to fantastic wide-separation, low-distortion audio... and even *mono* stations sound much better. So, 15 years ago I definitely would have said that Magnavox is my favorite AM Stereo system, but today, it's C-Quam -- and not just because it's the standard; because it just sounds better! From amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk Tue Mar 18 03:50:34 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amstereofan@v21mail.co.uk X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 18 Mar 2003 11:50:34 -0000 Received: (qmail 64643 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2003 11:50:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Mar 2003 11:50:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.86) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Mar 2003 11:50:32 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.149] by n3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Mar 2003 11:50:30 -0000 Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 11:50:27 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: OT: Aiwa Easphones - Where to buy ? Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 235 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Dave" X-Originating-IP: 81.7.54.208 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=113985069 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereofan What is the best Aiwa (online) supplier of Aiwa earphones (not headphones) ? I'm looking for a pair model no HP-V543 or HP-V165. Very dificut to find any shop I notice due to the Sony takeover I guess.. TIA (radio shack no go btw) From philipr@irac.pe.ca Tue Mar 18 05:22:01 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 18 Mar 2003 13:22:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 55327 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2003 13:22:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Mar 2003 13:22:01 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.66) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Mar 2003 13:22:00 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.153] by n11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Mar 2003 13:21:29 -0000 Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 13:21:11 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: OT: Heads Up on the Behringer Eurodesk MX9000 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2161 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking Guess a home brewed or kit 3+ amp variable regulated power supply, set at 17 volts for the 17 volt section, might be an economical "jerry-rigged" answer. If there are other voltages, the stock power supply could be used for them, and the kit or home brewed supply for the 17 volts. Of course, if there was a replacement voltage regulator with 3 amps available, that would be simpler. Check out Canakit's website - they may have something to lend a hand. Typically, the high current regulated supplies I've seen and played with use nice big TO-3 type power transistors - often two of them, rather than an all in one IC voltage regulator. Phil R. --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Possum Hunter" wrote: > Warning to those with a Behringer Eurodesk MX9000 console: > > This is a great sounding mixing console that has a major design flaw: The > power supply. > > The MX9000 at WFIS is now on the third power supply in 18 months! The first > one caught fire when it was 8 months old. I caught it just before it caught > on fire again Friday Morning! > > The problem is in the 17 Volt regulator section. Behringer uses a voltage > regulator rated at 1.5 Amps while the console pulls nearly 3 amps of > current. Behringer's first solution was to remove the silicone insulator > pads between the heat sink the regulator chips and replace them with mica > insulators and heat sink grease. Due to the high heat cracking the mica > insulators, they now say to thicker mica insulators! > > The new power supply Behringer sent me over the weekend still has the 1.5 > amp voltage regulators! Please note this puppy ain't UL listed (Gee, I > wonder why) Behringer absolutely refuses to send ANY service information or > parts to radio stations, or any other end user for their equipment. > Behringer forces you to send your console off to have it repaired at an > authorized service center, however if you raise enough hell, they will send > you a replacement power supply! > > I am trying to talk the boss into getting a Radio Systems or Pacific > Recorders console....I have never seen one catch fire. > > Kevin From philipr@irac.pe.ca Tue Mar 18 05:35:06 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 18 Mar 2003 13:35:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 80509 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2003 13:35:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Mar 2003 13:35:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.67) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Mar 2003 13:35:05 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.112] by n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Mar 2003 13:34:56 -0000 Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 13:34:53 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: OT: Heads Up on the Behringer Eurodesk MX9000 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2505 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking Would 2.5A do? The Canakit CK239A is variable from 0-30 volts, and 0-2.5 amps. www.canakit.com check under variable power supplies. Phil R. --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Phil Rafuse" wrote: > Guess a home brewed or kit 3+ amp variable regulated power supply, > set at 17 volts for the 17 volt section, might be an > economical "jerry-rigged" answer. If there are other voltages, the > stock power supply could be used for them, and the kit or home > brewed supply for the 17 volts. Of course, if there was a > replacement voltage regulator with 3 amps available, that would be > simpler. Check out Canakit's website - they may have something to > lend a hand. Typically, the high current regulated supplies I've > seen and played with use nice big TO-3 type power transistors - > often two of them, rather than an all in one IC voltage regulator. > > Phil R. > > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Possum Hunter" > wrote: > > Warning to those with a Behringer Eurodesk MX9000 console: > > > > This is a great sounding mixing console that has a major design > flaw: The > > power supply. > > > > The MX9000 at WFIS is now on the third power supply in 18 months! > The first > > one caught fire when it was 8 months old. I caught it just before > it caught > > on fire again Friday Morning! > > > > The problem is in the 17 Volt regulator section. Behringer uses a > voltage > > regulator rated at 1.5 Amps while the console pulls nearly 3 amps > of > > current. Behringer's first solution was to remove the silicone > insulator > > pads between the heat sink the regulator chips and replace them > with mica > > insulators and heat sink grease. Due to the high heat cracking the > mica > > insulators, they now say to thicker mica insulators! > > > > The new power supply Behringer sent me over the weekend still has > the 1.5 > > amp voltage regulators! Please note this puppy ain't UL listed > (Gee, I > > wonder why) Behringer absolutely refuses to send ANY service > information or > > parts to radio stations, or any other end user for their equipment. > > Behringer forces you to send your console off to have it repaired > at an > > authorized service center, however if you raise enough hell, they > will send > > you a replacement power supply! > > > > I am trying to talk the boss into getting a Radio Systems or > Pacific > > Recorders console....I have never seen one catch fire. > > > > Kevin From krichards@wor710.com Tue Mar 18 06:32:08 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: krichards@wor710.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 18 Mar 2003 14:32:06 -0000 Received: (qmail 68095 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2003 14:32:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Mar 2003 14:32:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.93) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Mar 2003 14:32:05 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.152] by n9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Mar 2003 14:32:04 -0000 Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 14:32:03 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: Audiophile Quality/Reply to Eric Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <113.20689444.2ba8063f@aol.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 993 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kerry Richards" X-Originating-IP: 162.83.161.63 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=136545831 X-Yahoo-Profile: kerryrichards710 --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, n0uiheric@a... wrote: > Kerry, IBOC sounds like an Internet feed on a standard phone line. It will > never be perfected because IBOC will always cause massive adjacent channel > interference, too. The idea is to improve on analog, instead of forcibly > converting to digital technology. > The truth about IBOC can be found at http://www.digitaldisaster.org/ > > 73 and good DX from Eric ERIC: Which HD radio did you hear this (internet feed audio) on? I have not heard this except in very early software versions, now, long gone. We have not found "massive" interference on any adjacent channel from the IBOC carriers, in the continuous testing that has been in progress. Where have you heard this interference, on what IBOC station? The HD signal is well within the NRSC mask. The HD system is an improvement to the analog technology, because it improves our ability to transmit a better signal to our listeners. Thanks, Kerry...... From e92fmjamz@yahoo.com Tue Mar 18 06:53:31 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: e92fmjamz@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 18 Mar 2003 14:53:29 -0000 Received: (qmail 32303 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2003 14:53:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Mar 2003 14:53:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web14008.mail.yahoo.com) (216.136.175.124) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Mar 2003 14:53:29 -0000 Message-ID: <20030318145329.32552.qmail@web14008.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [152.8.78.47] by web14008.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 06:53:29 PST Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 06:53:29 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: {AMSF} RDS is dead? To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: Ernest Jones X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=24963319 X-Yahoo-Profile: e92fmjamz ......guess what...RDS is ALIVE...AND WELL...RDS is here to stay and seems like stations are switching it on all the time...two more stations have switched it on here in Greensboro, NC...and also two in Norfolk VA, Raliegh NC has gained three...WTRG, WRDU, WDCG... The only drawback of RDS is that it needs a clean signal to get the data to the radio (even though I have logged a few stations through RDS during E-skip season) car radio's and consumer electronics are starting to come with RDS capable radio's, and since that, more stations has switched it on. --- "Kevin T." wrote: > I came across this message in another group and it's > like deja vu... > almost everything said here about RDS, I've heard > said about > AM Stereo... including the "reduces coverage area" > argument. > > So, at least in the USA, is RDS "dead"? Today, only > a few high-end > car radios and shortwave receivers; the few > consumer-grade receivers > and stereo systems that had it now appear to be > gone, and numerous > FM stations across the country have stopped > transmitting RDS. > > On the other hand, RDS is so commonplace in Europe > that even the > unlicensed 'pirate' stations are transmitting it... > so why didn't it > become successful on this side of the pond? > > ================================================================== > > Name: Bill Jacobs at WRDV > E-Mail: billjacobs@radio.fm > Date: 3/16/03 9:42 p.m. > In Reply To: Re: Stations using RDS > > We had it, but turned it off. For the six people out > there who owned > an RDS-capable tuner, we were wasting about fifty > watts to drive it, > and when you've only got a thousand watts to start > with, every little > bit helps. > > In my opinion, it's an orphan technology. Using it > to give song > titles is a great idea, except that (a) no one does > it any more, and > (b) no one still makes RDS-capable tuners (or if > they do, they don't > brag). > > Stick a fork in it; RDS is dead. > > Bill > > > > ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor > > Access The AM STEREO Forum on the web at: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amstereoforum > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > ===== Ernest, Gates NC, USA WRCS 970 AM Ahoskie NC, Announcer,webmaster http://wrcs.cjb.net WQDK 99.3 FM Ahoskie NC, Fill in ------contact me-------- AIM: e92fmjamz2000 ICQ: 33155469 Yahoo: e92fmjamz __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! http://platinum.yahoo.com From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Mar 18 07:13:26 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 18 Mar 2003 15:13:24 -0000 Received: (qmail 66946 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2003 15:13:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Mar 2003 15:13:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Mar 2003 15:13:24 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.153] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Mar 2003 15:13:23 -0000 Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 15:13:23 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Audiophile Quality/Reply to Eric Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1155 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > Which HD radio did you hear this (internet feed audio) on? I have > not heard this except in very early software versions, now, long > gone. As much as I thank you guys at WOR for being the only station to make actual recordings of IBOC digital audio available for us to download and listen to, the latest samples you have posted are from over two months ago and were made from a so-called "defective" receiver. If you think IBOC's audio quality has improved greatly since then, why not let us hear it? Otherwise we have nothing conclusive to go by -- but that's what iBiquity seems to want, so they can build up their hype without being challenged with any real-world listener experience. > The HD signal is well within the NRSC mask. Which is pretty much meaningless because the NRSC mask was never meant to accommodate digital signals. It's like trying to drive a Hummer down a foot-path in Central Park. You can say, "well, the trail is wide enough for me to drive on it, so what's the problem?" The problem is that a foot-path was only meant to accommodate pedestrians and possibly bicycles -- not humongous SUVs. From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Mar 18 08:26:04 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 18 Mar 2003 16:26:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 97086 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2003 16:26:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Mar 2003 16:26:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.69) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Mar 2003 16:26:03 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.169] by n14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Mar 2003 16:26:03 -0000 Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 16:26:02 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Optimod 9100-B2 on eBay Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 149 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics Give your station the best-sounding AM Stereo audio processing for only $2500! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2516739373 From philipr@irac.pe.ca Tue Mar 18 08:51:09 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 18 Mar 2003 16:51:08 -0000 Received: (qmail 26278 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2003 16:51:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Mar 2003 16:51:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.90) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Mar 2003 16:51:07 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.174] by n6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Mar 2003 16:51:00 -0000 Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 16:51:00 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: AM Stereo in my car - finally! Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2578 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.176.20.3 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking Well, as of last night, I finally have an AM Stereo radio in my car. It is a 1995 version of the Delco UX-1 - with extended band, 5 band EQ, the magic AM/ST button etc. It matched the 21 pin connectors and small antenna connector, so installation was easy - although now I have to fit the dash trim back - it was too dark last night for that! lol I also have a Delco UX-1 late 80s with the 12 pin connector - but I did not install it because the more modern radio cost less than the cost of the adapters. Also, the late 80s rig is rather intermittent on AM. I've been running it on a 13.8 volt regulated supply, and with more use it seems to be working better - possible bad electrolytic capacitor? So, I'll use it at home, while the 1995 UX- 1 variant performs happily in my car. The 1995 rig does not have as good top end as the late 80s rig, but it still sounds good. CJCH's signal was so poor last night and this morning that I couldn't get stereo reception on 920, but it sounded great on 580 CJFX and 1680 WTTM. WTTM was coming in very well last night as I was testing the radio, it was just getting dark here in PEI, and with the time zone difference, WTTM would still have been on daytime 10kw power. The 1995 AM Stereo Delco seems to have 3 bandwidths 1. - with AM/ST out, narrow up to about 3khz. 2. - with AM ST in, flat up to 6khz, then rolling off. 3. - with AM/ST in and a CQUAM pilot detected - increasing to flat up to about 9khz, then a steep rolloff. All of these are "guesstimates" not scientific measurements. My reference is the Heath PT-1 which is ruler flat to 6khz, and 6db down at 9khz - so before some of you start to pick, remember I'm up front that my observations of the Delco's apparent frequency response are subjective and are just my best guess. Decent mono signals - 720 CHTN, 1320 CKEC, 900 CKDH sound good - but are instantly recognizable as AM radio. Its on CJFX and WTTM where you briefly get the feeling - is this AM or FM? - until you drive under a noisy traffic light. Keep in mind that these are both fringe signals - one a 25Kwer 60 miles away in a deep null - the other a 10kw d/1kw n x-bander about 700 air miles away. CKEC, a 25kwer omni by day 50 air miles away delivers "noise free" reception - even with troublesome overhead power lines. My old narrow band Delco was noiser under such conditions. So, it looks like the AMAX noise reduction capabilities do help. Phil R. P.S. I did get 1520 WWKB last night with a steady pilot and great frequency response, but no separation. From jbyrns@rcn.com Tue Mar 18 08:55:40 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@rcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 18 Mar 2003 16:55:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 50930 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2003 16:55:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Mar 2003 16:55:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.83) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Mar 2003 16:55:39 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.178] by n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Mar 2003 16:55:38 -0000 Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 16:55:36 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Optimod 9100-B2 on eBay Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 404 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bta_50g" X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.103 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=138635554 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g How do you know you can have this in your station for $2,500.00? $2,000.00 is the opening bid, the reserve is probably higher, otherwise why have a reserve? John --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T." wrote: > Give your station the best-sounding AM Stereo audio processing for > only $2500! > > > > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2516739373 From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Mar 18 09:02:22 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 18 Mar 2003 17:02:12 -0000 Received: (qmail 21625 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2003 17:02:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Mar 2003 17:02:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Mar 2003 17:02:11 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.254] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Mar 2003 17:02:10 -0000 Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 17:02:08 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Optimod 9100-B2 on eBay Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 311 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > How do you know you can have this in your station for $2,500.00? > $2,000.00 is the opening bid, the reserve is probably higher, > otherwise why have a reserve? I was just being facetious about the price. $2500 is not something most of us here can afford, but I'm sure it's worth every penny. From michaelj@vcn.com Tue Mar 18 09:17:12 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: michaelj@vcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 18 Mar 2003 17:16:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 43838 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2003 17:15:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Mar 2003 17:15:08 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO m1-cluster1.vcn.com) (209.193.72.31) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Mar 2003 17:15:07 -0000 Received: from keva (unverified [63.175.110.110]) by m1-cluster1.vcn.com (Vircom SMTPRS 5.3.232) with SMTP id for ; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 10:15:07 -0700 Message-ID: <004401c2ed72$217eadc0$0701010a@keva> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Optimod 9100-B2 on eBay Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 10:16:34 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 From: "Michael J. Richard" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=10475663 X-Yahoo-Profile: michaeljwyo Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I sure wish OUR management here cared about AM Stereo. I'd want that 9100 for us. The only reason we're stereo here is because I cared. The boss had the old equipment at one of his other stations, and gave it to me and said "here ya go. Go ahead. Have a ball." So I did. But there's no way they'd spend any money for anything. The old CRL processors that we have are doing the job just fine. They were built for AM stereo in 1982 and they work just fine. The one processor (the AM Stereo Matrix Processor) was modified for the 10khz NRSC limit when that was instated, but I don't think the processors do anything as far as the pre-emphasis curve. I compare our signal to KMER in Kemmerer, Wyoming which I also converted and they just sound brighter than us. They have a 9100B over there. Seems like when I compare us to other AMs, they seem to be crisper than we are. Now granted, the audio here in the studio direct from the off-air Motorola C-quam modulation monitor is as clean as it gets!! I think the only drawback is that on most of the cheap narrow bandwidth radios out there, we probably sound a little muddier than other stations. In a small town like this, where IF people listen to AM the only one they'll listen to is us because there's no other local AM......well it probably doesn't matter. I'm proud of the clean sound and I am sure that Kerry and others can probably testify that when you're doing the proper pre-emphasis, your off-air audio will actually sound almost TOO tinny and seem to have almost too much high end....which is fine because out there, on most of the AM radios it sounds better. I have to say that the Innovonics mono processor that we had before actually did the job perfectly with the pre-emphasis. It DID INDEED make us sound good even on the cheap narrow-bandwidth radios. Alas, that processor went away with the other mono processing when I did the stereo conversion. I wonder if there is such a thing as a processor that does nothing but boost the pre-emphasis? I guess that Innovonics that we had would be the one! That's all it did. That, and limit the audio to 10khz. Anyways....back to radio MJR n WYO ----- Original Message ----- From: Kevin T. To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2003 10:02 AM Subject: {AMSF} Re: Optimod 9100-B2 on eBay > How do you know you can have this in your station for $2,500.00? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] From kevtronics@yahoo.com Tue Mar 18 10:05:48 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: kevtronics@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 18 Mar 2003 18:05:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 96447 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2003 18:05:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Mar 2003 18:05:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.83) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Mar 2003 18:05:47 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.153] by n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Mar 2003 18:05:45 -0000 Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 18:05:42 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Optimod 9100-B2 on eBay Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <004401c2ed72$217eadc0$0701010a@keva> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1644 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kevin T." X-Originating-IP: 66.200.203.66 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=47267257 X-Yahoo-Profile: kevtronics > I compare our signal to KMER in Kemmerer, Wyoming which I also > converted and they just sound brighter than us. They have a 9100B > over there. Seems like when I compare us to other AMs, they seem > to be crisper than we are. There's one mono AM music station in my area -- actually a 243-watt daytimer, the lowest-power AM station in NJ -- that uses a Stereo- capable Optimod 9100-B2, and they seem to be using very little pre- emphasis. Although on a "normal" radio they sound duller than the other AM stations, the quality of their processing more than makes up for it. Listening to them on a normal AM radio is just like listening to a tape or CD with the treble control turned down. They focus a lot of the processing on the mid-range, which really brings out the detail in the music that normally gets lost on stations whose processing focus too much on the bass and treble. And, of course, on a true hi-fi AM radio, they sound absolutely incredible. Unless you do a quick comparison to FM, you don't even notice the 10 kHz NRSC filter, because it still sounds very crisp and clear. And with the AMAX "Infinity Gold" sound system in our Jeep, you can even turn up the bass enough to feel the vibrations -- on AM!! This station I'm talking about is 1170 WWTR in Bridgewater, NJ. Their STL is Stereo, their processing is Stereo, and their BE AM-500 transmitter is Stereo-capable -- but they leave it in mono, because of the fear it would reduce the coverage of their already-limited signal (243 watts into a folded unipole antenna ain't much). But nevertheless they really are an excellent-sounding station. From amymousie@yahoo.com Tue Mar 18 10:52:58 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 18 Mar 2003 18:52:58 -0000 Received: (qmail 55013 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2003 18:52:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Mar 2003 18:52:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Mar 2003 18:52:58 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.162] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Mar 2003 18:52:55 -0000 Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 18:52:53 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: Audiophile Quality/Reply to Eric Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 905 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie" X-Originating-IP: 67.115.109.190 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kerry Richards" wrote: =snip= > The HD system is an improvement to the analog technology, because it > improves our ability to transmit a better signal to our listeners. Moderator excuse me for this, but-- Bullpuckey! The only reason you're doing this is because it's "digital", with the automatic assumption the "digital" = "better", and to be frank about it, unless you're using a high bitrate, or running uncompressed, you're not going to sound all that much better. And we're not talking about just frequency response3 here, but also distortion- Most low-bitrate (even medium-bitrate) compression schemes introduce an amount of rather noticable distortion. The only real advantage you have running IBOC when it is receivable, is a non-existant noise floor. I'm sorry, going "digital" just doesn't cut it for me. Amy. <:3 )~~8~ From jbyrns@rcn.com Tue Mar 18 11:04:22 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jbyrns@rcn.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 18 Mar 2003 19:04:22 -0000 Received: (qmail 53585 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2003 19:04:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Mar 2003 19:04:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Mar 2003 19:04:21 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.112] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Mar 2003 19:04:15 -0000 Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 19:04:13 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Audio Processing and Radio Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1313 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "bta_50g" X-Originating-IP: 216.80.74.125 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=138635554 X-Yahoo-Profile: bta_50g --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin T." wrote: > > The main function of the Kevtronimod is pure wideband limiting with > near-instantaneous attack and fast release times, with optional > Stereo matrix expansion (basically a passive L-R boost applied > before the limiting, to give a rudimentary matrix-processing-type > effect). > > Also included are wideband AGC (to pick up whatever slack is left by > the limiter) and pre-emphasis/equalization (set by a 10-band graphic > equalizer). My Panasonic AM Stereo generator/transmitter also has a > built-in negative peak clipper, although I really don't hear much > difference with it turned on or off, at least with the C-Quam > system. > > That's the basic layout... Hi Kevin, Thanks for explaining the "Kevtronimod", I have just one more question. If I followed your description, the "Kevtronimod" is comprised of four processing functions. 1. A fixed matrix stereo enhancer 2. A pre-emphasis/equalization circuit 3. A wideband AGC 4. A near-instantaneous wideband limiter It isn't clear from your description of the "Kevtronimod", in what order these elements are applied to the input signal. In what order are these elements connected between the audio inputs and the outputs to the AM stereo exciter? John From fanfare@globility.com Tue Mar 18 11:38:27 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 18 Mar 2003 19:38:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 34777 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2003 19:38:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Mar 2003 19:38:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.67) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Mar 2003 19:38:23 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.166] by n12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Mar 2003 19:38:22 -0000 Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 19:38:20 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Audiophile Quality/Reply to Eric Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 2501 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Mr.M S" X-Originating-IP: 64.56.246.235 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "amymousie" wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kerry Richards" > wrote: > > =snip= > > > The HD system is an improvement to the analog technology, because > it > > improves our ability to transmit a better signal to our listeners. > > Moderator excuse me for this, but-- Bullpuckey! The only reason > you're doing this is because it's "digital", with the automatic > assumption the "digital" = "better", and to be frank about it, unless > you're using a high bitrate, or running uncompressed, you're not > going to sound all that much better. > I'm sorry, going "digital" just doesn't cut it for me. I don't disagree, Amy. Unless the benefits are measurably better, and I mean with a public interest yardstick, it's a truly uphill battle. In a sense we, as a radio manufacturer have the same battle, only this time its with a large number of mainstream broadcasters who tell us no one is interested in listening to a pristine signal. No matter how good a quality it is, it's just not loud or exciting enough. I used to think that, if the sound coming out of the radio speakers gave people the impression they were listening to the CD, and that was often a comment at our CES exhibit, you'd think the broadcaster would be happy as hell to have that kind of sound. I mean sounding exactly like the original source is quite a compliment. No? Unfortunately, CD makers are adopting the same 'maximum loudness'approach that many radio station have adopted. My question is, how do you set up for that .... loud + louder = "?". No wonder we're getting comment on this forum that some stations sound, to use their words, "like crap". I remember having an engineer visit our booth who, after I asked him what his specialty was, he told me he designed compander circuitry. What blew me away was his apology for the destruction his work was likely to cause to otherwise excellent broadcast audio he was hearing from the Chicago stations I tuned for him. IMHO, with radio audiences opting for other sources and no other way to go, digital broadcasting looks like the proverbial ticket to new life for them. For their sake and mine, I hope it is. But the ways of radio content and signal processing have to be given a lot of thought as well. Otherwise, a number of radio stations will have just put alot of money on the "come" line with someone else throwing the dice. M.S. From a1asurfradio@yahoo.com Tue Mar 18 11:55:22 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: a1asurfradio@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 18 Mar 2003 19:55:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 7668 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2003 19:55:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Mar 2003 19:55:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO web41001.mail.yahoo.com) (66.218.93.0) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Mar 2003 19:55:20 -0000 Message-ID: <20030318195520.71766.qmail@web41001.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [64.222.37.218] by web41001.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 11:55:20 PST Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 11:55:20 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Favorite A.M. stereo transmission brand To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: JNR X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=63092835 X-Yahoo-Profile: a1asurfradio I have an SRF-42 and a Chrysler car radio. Which chps do they use? Jay __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! http://platinum.yahoo.com From jsgil@hal-pc.org Tue Mar 18 12:29:28 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 18 Mar 2003 20:29:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 40522 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2003 20:29:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Mar 2003 20:29:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.74) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Mar 2003 20:29:20 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.182] by n19.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Mar 2003 20:29:20 -0000 Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 20:29:19 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: OT: Heads Up on the Behringer Eurodesk MX9000 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1188 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.138 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Phil Rafuse" wrote: > Guess a home brewed or kit 3+ amp variable regulated power supply, > set at 17 volts for the 17 volt section, might be an > economical "jerry-rigged" answer. If there are other voltages, the > stock power supply could be used for them, and the kit or home > brewed supply for the 17 volts. Of course, if there was a > replacement voltage regulator with 3 amps available, that would be > simpler. Check out Canakit's website - they may have something to > lend a hand. Typically, the high current regulated supplies I've > seen and played with use nice big TO-3 type power transistors - > often two of them, rather than an all in one IC voltage regulator. > > Phil R. > A MC78T15 or MC78T18 could be used. They handle 5A max. It comes both TO-3 & TO-220. If the circuit can handle 1 more volt then use the 18V one, if not use the 15V with a 510ohm resistor in series with the leg to ground with a 100uf cap in parallel with the resistor. And by all means mount it on a large heatsink. For even tighter control for the 2V difference created with the resistor use 3 1N4001 diodes in series. JSG From jsgil@hal-pc.org Tue Mar 18 12:39:20 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: jsgil@hal-pc.org X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 18 Mar 2003 20:39:20 -0000 Received: (qmail 94572 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2003 20:39:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m14.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Mar 2003 20:39:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.71) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Mar 2003 20:39:19 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.173] by n16.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Mar 2003 20:39:19 -0000 Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 20:39:19 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Audiophile Quality/Reply to Eric Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1650 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "jsgilst" X-Originating-IP: 206.180.128.138 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=87956357 X-Yahoo-Profile: jsgilst --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Mr.M S" wrote: > > Unfortunately, CD makers are adopting the same 'maximum > loudness'approach that many radio station have adopted. My question > is, how do you set up for that .... loud + louder = "?". No wonder > we're getting comment on this forum that some stations sound, to use > their words, "like crap". > > I remember having an engineer visit our booth who, after I asked him > what his specialty was, he told me he designed compander circuitry. > What blew me away was his apology for the destruction his work was > likely to cause to otherwise excellent broadcast audio he was hearing > from the Chicago stations I tuned for him. > > IMHO, with radio audiences opting for other sources and no other way > to go, digital broadcasting looks like the proverbial ticket to new > life for them. For their sake and mine, I hope it is. But the ways of > radio content and signal processing have to be given a lot of thought > as well. Otherwise, a number of radio stations will have just put > alot of money on the "come" line with someone else throwing the dice. > > M.S. With all the variance in compression of the sources (CDs) it might be better to eliminate the on air compressors if the music source is from a MP3 file on computer. Do all the compression individually to each song with software so each song will have just the right compression. I think this is the only way to handle the vast differences in dynamic range between older recordings and the latest releases. On some of the really overcompressed CDs they could probably stand to be expanded. JSG From amymousie@yahoo.com Tue Mar 18 12:46:04 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 18 Mar 2003 20:46:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 29640 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2003 20:46:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Mar 2003 20:46:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.81) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Mar 2003 20:46:04 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.185] by n25.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Mar 2003 20:46:00 -0000 Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 20:46:00 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: Favorite A.M. stereo transmission brand Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20030318195520.71766.qmail@web41001.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 431 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie" X-Originating-IP: 67.115.109.190 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, JNR wrote: > I have an SRF-42 and a Chrysler car radio. Which > chps do they use? The SRF-42 uses Sony's multi-mode synchronous-detector chip, first used in the SRF-A1 and -A100, and is still used in their shortwave radios. The Chrysler uses, most likely, one of the Motorola C-QUAM chips, depending on the make and model of the car and radio used. Amy. <:3 )~~8~ From amymousie@yahoo.com Tue Mar 18 12:48:21 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 18 Mar 2003 20:48:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 58350 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2003 20:48:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m4.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Mar 2003 20:48:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.82) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Mar 2003 20:48:21 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.164] by n26.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Mar 2003 20:48:16 -0000 Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 20:48:16 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Audiophile Quality/Reply to Eric Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 442 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie" X-Originating-IP: 67.115.109.190 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Mr.M S" wrote: > --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "amymousie" > wrote: =snip= > I don't disagree, Amy. Unless the benefits are measurably better, and > I mean with a public interest yardstick, it's a truly uphill battle. Thanks for supporting me here. I'll reply a bit more when I have the time- Later this evening. :) I have much to say. Amy. <:3 )~~8~ From krichards@wor710.com Tue Mar 18 13:19:45 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: krichards@wor710.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_1); 18 Mar 2003 21:19:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 83684 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2003 21:19:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Mar 2003 21:19:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Mar 2003 21:19:44 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.190] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 18 Mar 2003 21:19:41 -0000 Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 21:19:38 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Audiophile Quality/Reply to Eric Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1746 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Kerry Richards" X-Originating-IP: 162.83.161.63 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=136545831 X-Yahoo-Profile: kerryrichards710 Hey Guys, I do not think any stream off the internet no matter what format it is, a fair test of any listening experience of any system either C- Quam or HD. In particular the WOR samples on our Industry Only pages are from previous software, now replaced. Basically those samples are just to give a rough idea, what it sounds like. You really need to be there to hear it in operation, and give it a fair test.I have no idea what you are listening to, when playing back a stream, the radio in person is the only accurate test. How do you think I arrived at my complaint about Sirius? It was not until I heard the actual radio in a car. The sample streams from Sirius never disclosed what I heard on an actual radio. (Which was very disappointing, in my estimation.) The same treatment should be given to those IBOC samples we have provided. We just presently do not have the time put new samples on those pages since we are so busy, with the day to day operations here at WOR. Also, remember Tom and myself are not employees of Ibiquity or do we completely agree on all the IBOC issues with Ibiquity. We are merely testing the system here at WOR to get data for all the interested parties. I think you guys can see this in our dealings, as well as our interest in the general state of the AM band, mono and stereo. My point to Eric is that he makes statements like, "Never can, never will" and goes off on a different tangent hashing the same old crap about IBOC's sidebands. We've all expressed our feelings about this issue. I want to know what he bases his observations on so we can get a firm understanding, and dialog going that is intelligent and useful. Anything else is a waste of time. Thanks, Kerry.......... From powell@conterra.com Tue Mar 18 16:40:05 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: powell@conterra.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_5); 19 Mar 2003 00:40:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 7147 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2003 00:40:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Mar 2003 00:40:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.76) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Mar 2003 00:40:04 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.118] by n20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 19 Mar 2003 00:40:03 -0000 Date: Wed, 19 Mar 2003 00:40:01 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: {AMSF} Re: Audio Processing and Radio Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 589 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "w4opw" X-Originating-IP: 66.112.193.74 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=8062869 X-Yahoo-Profile: W4OPW --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Possum Hunter" wrote: > w4opw wrote: > > The 1230 uses brand X. They have VERY distorted audio, and are very > irritating to listen to. And they have a solid state BE transmitter. > > Go ahead and name names, Powell. WOIC's processor is a Texar Buzzard, er Texar Eagle. And no one, of course has made an attempt to set it up. It sounded FAR worse when they were playing music. Sometimes the ESPN feed has some HF artifcacts, that, well interfere with WKDK to within 15 miles. It sounds like morse code on 1240. Powell From stodd@sherbtel.net Tue Mar 18 16:40:10 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_5); 19 Mar 2003 00:40:10 -0000 Received: (qmail 10750 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2003 00:40:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m15.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Mar 2003 00:40:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Mar 2003 00:40:09 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-246.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.246]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h2J0e6le001863 for ; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 18:40:07 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <001201c2edb0$950ed740$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} OT: Heads Up on the Behringer Eurodesk MX9000 Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 18:43:36 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude What do you expect from cheap Chinese junk? ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Possum Hunter" > Warning to those with a Behringer Eurodesk MX9000 console: > > This is a great sounding mixing console that has a major design flaw: The > power supply. > > The MX9000 at WFIS is now on the third power supply in 18 months! From amymousie@yahoo.com Tue Mar 18 16:41:02 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: amymousie@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_5); 19 Mar 2003 00:41:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 12024 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2003 00:41:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m12.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Mar 2003 00:41:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.83) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Mar 2003 00:41:01 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.152] by n27.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 19 Mar 2003 00:41:01 -0000 Date: Wed, 19 Mar 2003 00:40:59 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Audiophile Quality/Reply to Eric Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3182 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "amymousie" X-Originating-IP: 67.115.109.190 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=135026306 X-Yahoo-Profile: amymousie I think I can do my reply I intended to with this one. --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kerry Richards" wrote: > Hey Guys, > > I do not think any stream off the internet no matter what format it > is, a fair test of any listening experience of any system either C- > Quam or HD. In particular the WOR samples on our Industry Only pages > are from previous software, now replaced. Basically those samples are > just to give a rough idea, what it sounds like. You really need to be > there to hear it in operation, and give it a fair test.I have no idea > what you are listening to, when playing back a stream, the radio in > person is the only accurate test. Sure it is: You are using a compressed digital audio format, most likely lossy to maintain a low enough bitrate with a decent enough samplerate that can be streamed via a data carrier over the air. I'm used to internet radio, and I can attest that most of it sounds like crap. The few that don't really sound crappy are either mono with a well-developed codec and plenty of filters to mask a number of effects left in the low-bitrate stream; or that they're of a high- enough bitrate that the effects of the compression are minimised by the speed. At present no stream uses a lossless compression scheme, or uncompressed. Some are decent enough to enjoy, where the effects are minimum, while others, like Core (UK) (http://www.core.musicradio.com/), a DAB station, uses a dialup-bitrate stream at 22kb/s stereo, or Johannesburg's Highveld Stereo (www.highfeld.co.za), also using a dialup stream at 22kb/s, you can hear the wateryness quite badly, and it's often frustrating to listen to. So no, I don't listen to internet radio for the quality (unless it's an unconverted DAB stream relayed through the 'net, and even that can have its problems), nor do I expect to. (I'm on DSL.) But to compare low/medium-bitrate streaming audio (which, for all practical purposes, IBOC is, only the transport mechanism is different) to analog AM radio is to be expected, since both share the same medium, and to be honest, I can live with static, because I know it won't seriously interrupt what I'm listening to (unlike DRM and IBOC, which when something knocks out the immediate signal, it's pretty noticable with loss of audio or disrupted audio due to the digital/analog switchover), and that the audio, regardless of bandwidth, will have less distortion. (This is equally true of FM.) So, IBOC, AM or FM, has no significant net gains, compared to their analog counterparts, and in fact, have significant disadvantages- Not the least of which is, yes, interference, but certainly quality of service ranks (pun unintended) right up there, along with quality of audio. The only thing you've got to sell IBOC on, is that it's "digital", feeding on the misconception that if it's digital, it's better, which is not a real-world reality. There is no "perfect" audio. I'm not anti-digital, just realistic. =snip= > Anything else is a waste of time. Oh, cool! We just got brushed off! Amy. <:3 )~~8~ (Unconvinced, and would like to be proven wrong, without hype.) From stodd@sherbtel.net Tue Mar 18 17:03:27 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_5); 19 Mar 2003 01:03:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 51558 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2003 01:03:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Mar 2003 01:03:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Mar 2003 01:03:26 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-246.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.246]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h2J13Mle009203 for ; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 19:03:23 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <005201c2edb3$d57d9020$827dfea9@home1> To: References: Subject: Re: {AMSF} RDS is dead? Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 19:06:52 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude It seems to be on the rebound here. Just two years ago there was only one station running it, and then only displaying their calls. Now we've got three of them; not quite what it used to be, but certainly an upswing. RDS injection is only 2% or so; that guy didn't know what he was talking about. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kevin T." > I came across this message in another group and it's like deja vu... > almost everything said here about RDS, I've heard said about > AM Stereo... including the "reduces coverage area" argument. > > So, at least in the USA, is RDS "dead"? From fanfare@globility.com Tue Mar 18 17:03:41 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: fanfare@globility.com X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_5); 19 Mar 2003 01:03:41 -0000 Received: (qmail 74735 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2003 01:03:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Mar 2003 01:03:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.79) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Mar 2003 01:03:38 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.117] by n23.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 19 Mar 2003 01:03:38 -0000 Date: Wed, 19 Mar 2003 01:03:36 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Audiophile Quality/Reply to Eric Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 971 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Mr.M S" X-Originating-IP: 64.56.244.119 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=107089276 X-Yahoo-Profile: amfmguy --- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Kerry Richards" wrote: > Hey Guys, > >> My point to Eric is that he makes statements like, "Never can, never > will" and goes off on a different tangent hashing the same old crap > about IBOC's sidebands. We've all expressed our feelings about this > issue. I want to know what he bases his observations on so we can get > a firm understanding, and dialog going that is intelligent and useful. > > Anything else is a waste of time. > I hope I'm not speaking out of turn here because I know Eric does not need anyone speaking for him. You might want to look at the consistency of his messages, Kerry. He hasn't erred one hair off his opinion of IBOC, regardless of what anyone has said. I have to say that your commenting on the trials and tribulations of implimenting the system does cast a little more credibility on the fallibilty of the process. The hype from other places is nauseating. M.S. From stodd@sherbtel.net Tue Mar 18 17:30:06 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: stodd@sherbtel.net X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_5); 19 Mar 2003 01:30:04 -0000 Received: (qmail 21329 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2003 01:30:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Mar 2003 01:30:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO beast.sherbtel.net) (208.38.65.37) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Mar 2003 01:30:05 -0000 Received: from home1 (208-38-89-246.rev.sherbtel.net [208.38.89.246]) by beast.sherbtel.net (8.12.3/8.12.2) with SMTP id h2J1U2le016987 for ; Tue, 18 Mar 2003 19:30:03 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <00ad01c2edb7$8f059120$827dfea9@home1> To: References: <20030318195520.71766.qmail@web41001.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: {AMSF} Re: Favorite A.M. stereo transmission brand Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 19:33:32 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 From: "Scott Todd" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=71485615 X-Yahoo-Profile: amstereodude Chrysler used the MC13020 in pretty much everything up until 92, or early 93, then switched to the 13022. Don't know if they ever used the '028. If you've got a 92 or older radio, it's the '020, but it may have a house part number rather than the Motorola number, especially in later production runs. Not sure what Sony uses. ST ----- Original Message ----- From: "JNR" > I have an SRF-42 and a Chrysler car radio. Which > chps do they use? From philipr@irac.pe.ca Tue Mar 18 17:39:01 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: philipr@irac.pe.ca X-Apparently-To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_6_5); 19 Mar 2003 01:39:01 -0000 Received: (qmail 59707 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2003 01:38:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m10.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Mar 2003 01:38:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.73) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Mar 2003 01:38:59 -0000 Received: from [66.218.67.180] by n18.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 19 Mar 2003 01:38:59 -0000 Date: Wed, 19 Mar 2003 01:38:58 -0000 To: amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: {AMSF} OT: Heads Up on the Behringer Eurodesk MX9000 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <001201c2edb0$950ed740$827dfea9@home1> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 1968 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster From: "Phil Rafuse" X-Originating-IP: 142.166.158.129 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=95173723 X-Yahoo-Profile: tubesareking Some Chinese made products are pretty good - the GE SR III is one of many examples. The Grundig Satellitte 800 was initially pretty awful - but the latest generation is pretty darn good. There was a time when there was some pretty indifferent workmanship out of North America - I remember struggling with old Collins cart machines made for Collins by Automatic Tape Control. In fairness though, these rigs I struggled with were circa 1961 and 1962, and this was in 1980, so they were well past their prime. The electronics were fine - the mechanical problems were enough to make one go nuts. Later Collins cart machines were pretty darn good, the TwinTape for instance. But then, there is my old circa 1955 Magnicord reel-to-reel, designed to last 1000 years and sound good at the same time. What little electronics today these days still made in Canada, the USA, the UK, Australia etc. tends to be niche market stuff of the highest quality. What the Behringer needs is a quality power supply - small change compared to the cost of a new board. But knowing this, I'd be cautious about Behringer gear. LPB Boards used to be considered indestructible - if they are still good, that would be my first choice, although they are pretty pricey compared to Chinese stuff. The old addage - you get what you pay for, still makes sense. So the moral of the story is, if you buy cheap, you may succeed if you re-engineer the stuff. Otherwise, you just have some attractive paperweights. Phil R.--- In amstereoforum@yahoogroups.com, "Scott Todd" wrote: > What do you expect from cheap Chinese junk? > > ST > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Possum Hunter" > > > > Warning to those with a Behringer Eurodesk MX9000 console: > > > > This is a great sounding mixing console that has a major design flaw: The > > power supply. > > > > The MX9000 at WFIS is now on the third power supply in 18 months!